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Zorn List Digest        Tuesday, April 9 2002        Volume 03 : Number 878



In this issue:
-
       Acid Mothers Temple
       Odp: What Does DMG Know?
       Odp: What Does DMG Know?
       Odp: What Does DMG Know?
       RE: Wuorinen & Adams
       eugene chadbourne/cooper-moore 4/20
       New Music for strings in RealAudio, Mappings for the week beginning April 9, 2002
       Fwd: RE: Help for a translation
       new CD - and it looks good too!
       Han Bennink vs. The Ex on tv
       Berlin
       Melvins/Fantomas BB
       furthur

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 14:52:12 -0700
From: Chris Selvig <[e-mail]>
Subject: Acid Mothers Temple

"In C/In E" is a fine record, maybe AMT's best, but it's not representative
- - recorded output tends to hop around through various definitions of
"psychedelic," with forays into acoustic meandering, raging electric guitar
freakouts, and droning nodout sequences.  I think all of the other studio
records have good parts, but they tend to be a little long and
unfocused.  Live, however, they are a force to be reckoned with, sticking
to the raging freakout angle and doing it very well.  Did any Z-listers
catchthe show in England w/ "Legend of the Overfiend" screened behind 'em?

Chris Selvig


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2002 00:02:45 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: What Does DMG Know?

A scanner darkly, The man in the high castle, Flow my tears, diaries of a
crap artist are among my favourites.
- ----- Original Message -----
From: s~Z <[e-mail]>


> >>>Nope, only 'The Man in the High Castle' so far.<<<
>
> You have much better works awaiting you.
>
> The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch
> Galactic Pot-Healer
> Valis
> Ubik



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2002 00:04:00 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: What Does DMG Know?

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>

> "The Transmigration of Timothy Archer", then listening to Tod Machover's
> opera of "Valis".

I also liked 'transmigration quite a lot'; both other parts of the trilogy
are great, but hardly for PKD - beginners.
Marcin


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2002 00:06:04 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: What Does DMG Know?

From: Patrice L. Roussel <[e-mail]>

> > The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch
>
> Totally agree. This one is a true nightmare where Dick keeps of fooling
> the reader to believe that things have finally settled, and then again,
> another layer of the nightmare unravels. Frighteningly awesome.

I have to reread that book in english - the polish translation of that one
is a nightmare (entire  scenes and dialogues are ommitted)
Marcin




- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 18:37:19 -0500
From: Herb Levy <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Wuorinen & Adams

>That may well have been his interpretation. But the actual, verbatim
>question was: "Tell us a bit about the history of Western music since, oh,
>say, 1300." That does kind of throw things into another perspective, doesn't
>it?

After I sent that out I realized that I should have made a stronger
argument for this. I'm a lot more interested in what someone says
they like than in what they say they don't like. Not for any
Pollyanna kinds of reasons, but cause I think it's more often a
usefully defining category. & it's much more of a recommendation when
someone says "I really like this," then when someone says "I really
hate this." (That's one of the reasons I try to avoid getting into
the all-too-common online arguments that start when someone says they
don't like something.)

& I don't expect artists to have anything resembling an objective
sense of the history of their art. They have enough work finding the
precursors they want to work from. The more idiosyncratic an artist's
sense of history is, the more likely they know what they're doing.
Who does it hurt for Wuorinen or Reich or Boulez or whoever to have a
quirky list of historic composers? They aren't studying for their
master's degrees, if they want to ignore a big name or important
movement, what's the big deal?

>  >for what it's worth, similar lists by Steve
>>Reich have some of the same lapses though, of course, the most recent
>>composers Reich picks as important to him are quite different.
>
>Right, Reich skips from Perotin to Bach to Stravinsky. I'd have the same
>bone to pick with him, under the circumstances. Boulez, at least, includes
>Berlioz, Debussy, Mahler and Messaien.

But Boulez' work is more directly rooted in 19th century classical
music, so I'd expect those folks on his list. Reich and Wuorinen are
both more classicist in their approaches and if you got to limit your
list, why bother wasting spots by naming folks you really don't care
about? What's the advantage to having a "more balanced" list?

I remember an essay by John Barth, called the Literature of
Exhaustion, in which he makes claims that the 19th century novel was
an aberration from what he saw as a clear line from the early novels
of the 18th century (Sterne, Defoe, etc) and the wilder books of the
modern and post-modern period (Joyce, Woolf, Barth, Coover, etc). It
wasn't exactly a serious historical claim, but it was a very real map
of where he thought he was coming from.

>  >What you say about his frequent vociferous & public position as
>>apologist for serialist music in the face of "neo-Romantics,
>>minimalist and other assorted eclectics" is again true (though your
>>sense of history is somewhat skewed, he's had this attitude since the
>>mid-1970s)
>
>I'm aware of that, but what was he up against then that's so different from
>today, save for the mainstream minimalists and the post-minimalists? Cage,
>Crumb and Nancarrow weren't being performed, either.

I'm not sure I see your point, here. You seem to agree that
Wuorinen's attitude was similar and his position wasn't much
different. I was just pointing out that he'd been ranting in a
similar vein for a lot more than the ten years or so you cited
earlier.

There were a few conditions that changed in the 1970s, though, which
probably meant that Wuorinen wasn't so argumentative much earlier
than that. George Rochberg's 3rd String Quartet was written in 1971 &
soon thereafter recorded for Nonesuch. By the mid-70s there was
already a growing body of work that was getting heard and recorded
that wasn't post-serial, except in the chronological sense of the
term. Around this same time, Wuorinen was denied tenure at Columbia,
which got a LOT of publicity, and certainly added to his sense of how
to position himself vis a vis other styles of music.

Also, by 1979, composers like Phil Glass, Meredith Monk, Pauline
Oliveros, and Steve Reich were enough of a draw (in NY at least,
Wuroinen's home turf) that the Kitchen used them as the big-ticket
concert for the concert series New Music New York, a combination
conference/festival that was the seed for the New Music America
festivals that continued until 1992 or so. Few, if any, of the
"uptown" composers could be used as a cash cow in terms of attracting
paying audience (though they were more of a draw for funding from
various funding organizations).

>  >If, say, Dave Douglas were to make a similar argument about the lack
>>of downtown scene-sters on any of the countless jazz stations across
>>the US that basically follow the Wynton line of music history, I
>>doubt that you'd reduce his argument to "The station doesn't play MY
>>music."
>
>Okay, I concede the point. Both Wuorinen and Douglas would have a valid
>point regarding the conservatism and vapidity of most radio. But Douglas
>would not decry the lack of his own music and that of his models by
>demeaning that which came after him.

& if Douglas were talking about smooth jazz stations, would he be so
generous? From Wuorinen's point of view, contemporary music in
tradition keys, with or without harmonic motion, is simply schlock.

>  >I know the station's been supportive of "neo-Romantics"
>>but based on my limited sense of things from my increasingly scarce
>>visits to NY, the "other assorted eclectics" who were part of the
>>station's overall programming mix, and not simply heard on John
>  >Schaeffer's program, were few and far between.
>
>They played a huge role in David Garland's programming, as well. But you do
>have a point about the programming that occured outside those poles. Every
>radio station is guilty of catering to the audience it percieves will best
>support it, which is why most classical stations are going under and most
>NPR stations are abandoning classical music and jazz (including WNYC).

Yeah, I remembered David's show after I sent that off, but you're
right in your characterization of the radio scene in general.

>  >And finally, given the release of Wuorinen's disc on Tzadik, do you
>>really question whether he'd want his music to be heard in same
>>context as Zorn's? Isn't that exactly the situation of having a disc
>>released on Zorn's label? The CD can't be a surprise to Wuorinen, so
>>I'd be amazed if he were to have a problem with the recent concert.
>
>Here I have to disagree. Wuorinen's own personal taste regarding the other
>music with which he shares a concert program doesn't necessarily have to
>coincide whatsoever with his willingness to let that other composer release
>and support Wuorinen's own music by any means necessary. It wouldn't mean
>that he wasn't squirming anxiously through Zorn's piece on the concert
>program - and I'm not sayng that he was (it was too dark to tell, even
>though he was sitting directly in front of me). I'm just saying that I
>wondered, especially since Zorn certainly deviates from the serialist
>orthodoxy that Wuorinen has taken such pains to defend.

Perhaps Wuorinen sees the disc as some kind of guerilla move on his
part, getting his music into the last bin of the jazz section in
those chain stores around the US that keep their Tzadiks with the
Zorn discs. But it's quite difficult to see him feeling any more
comfortable in the context of what else has been released on Tzadik.
His position in the label's catalog is a lot more permanent and
widely visible than a one-time concert (even one in NYC).

Bests,

Herb
- --
Herb Levy
P O Box 9369
Fort Worth, TX  76147

[e-mail]

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 00:07:59 +0000
From: "Kurt Gottschalk" <[e-mail]>
Subject: eugene chadbourne/cooper-moore 4/20

>NEUES KABARETT AT THE BRECHT FORUM IS FUCKIN PSYCHED TO PRESENT:
>STRING THEORY -- EUGENE CHADBOURNE AND COOPER-MOORE
>
>Saturday, April 20
>9:00 pm
>THE BRECHT FORUM
>122 West 27th Street
>10th Floor
>New York, NY 10001
>[e-mail]
>Admission: $8
>
>PERFORMANCE
>
>Neues Kabarett
>
>Eugene Chadbourne & Cooper-Moore
>
>Virginia-born New Yorker Cooper-Moore, and Colorado
>native Eugene Chadbourne, now a resident of North
>Carolina, share a quality of uncatagorizability. Both
>are remarkable string players (Chadbourne on guitar,
>dobro and banjo, Cooper-Moore primarily on instruments
>of his own devise), whose inventiveness pits them in
>the catch-all world of jazz improvisation, borrowing
>from a number of rich traditions. A performance by
>either is likely to erupt in spontaneous outbursts of
>John Lee Hooker, Tammy Wynette or Albert Ayler. What
>happens when they share a stage is yet to be seen.
>
>Both have played the Neues Kabarett before. Dr.
>Chadbourne has presented a night of the songs of Phil
>Ochs, and performed his composition ôCommunication is
>Overratedö for solo guitar. Cooper-Moore has performed
>at the Brecht solo, with dancers Olase Freeman, in a
>trio with William Parker and Daniel Carter and with
>Bill ColeÆs Untempered Ensemble.
>
>Presented with the kind assistance of
>Downtown Music
>Gallery and Plummer Productions.
>
>The BRECHT FORUM is a place for people who are working
>for fundamental social change and a new culture that
>puts human needs first. Within our loft in central
>Manhattan, we offer a year-round program of classes,
>public lectures and seminars, art exhibitions,
>performances, popular education workshops, and
>language classes. Our classes and activities are
>developed in collaboration with the many political
>movements and the diverse communities of this most
>cosmopolitan of cities, and our programs bring
>together leading intellectuals and activists from New
>York, across the U.S., and internationally.
>

_________________________________________________________________
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- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2002 01:59:10 -0500
From: Herb Levy <[e-mail]>
Subject: New Music for strings in RealAudio, Mappings for the week beginning April 9, 2002

Hi y'all,

This week on Mappings
<http://www.antennaradio.com/mappings/show.htm>, you'll hear works
multiple strings by composers John Adams, George Benjamin, Pierre
Boulez, Kent Carter, Joseph Celli, Morton Feldman, Charlotte Hug, Jo
Kondo, Phill Niblock, Steve Reich, and Lois V Vierk.

The show went online Tueday morning around 6:00 AM (-0600 GMT) and
will remain online at the above URL for a week. Last week's program
(featuring music by Gordon Mumma) is still available in the Mappings
archive (click on the link to last week's show on the page noted
above), soon you will again find play lists for the program since it
began in March 1998.

Hope you tune in to the program.

Bests,

Herb

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2002 09:33:42 +0200 (CEST)
From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Efr=E9n=20del=20Valle?= <[e-mail]>
Subject: Fwd: RE: Help for a translation

Hi,

Thanks to all of you for your help with the "ad copy"
problem. This last message came four days after I sent
it for the first time, so I've got plenty of replies
to my re-sent message yet.

Again, thanks so much.

EfrΘn del Valle

>
> Did you not receive the answer I already sent the
> first time you asked,
> EfrΘn? Or is this second message some kind of
> strange computer error?
>
> Anyway, "ad copy" = writing the words for
> advertisements. But that's not all
> Lucas did at Columbia. He was responsible for Tim's
> signing.
>
> Steve Smith
> [e-mail]
> NP - Otomo/Rowe/Sugimoto, "The Room," 'Ajar'
> (Alcohol)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail]
> [mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf
> Of EfrΘn del Valle
> Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 10:31 AM
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Help for a translation
>
>
> HI,
>
> I'm currently translating a Tim Berne interview from
> Perfect Sound Forever and there's something I don't
> quite understand. Berne states that Gary Lucas was
> working as "ad copy" for Columbia (if I'm not
> wrong).
> If any English speakers could give me a description
> of
> what "ad copy" is, I'll probably be able to find a
> correspondance in Spanish.
>
> A million thanks in advance.
>
> BTW, check the interview! It's really good.
>
> Best,
>
> Efrin del Valle
>
>
_______________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Messenger
> Comunicacisn instantanea gratis con tu gente.
> http://messenger.yahoo.es
>
>
>
>
>
> -
>
>
> -
>

_______________________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Messenger
Comunicaci≤n instantßnea gratis con tu gente.
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- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 11:54:12 +0000
From: "Arthur Gadney" <[e-mail]>
Subject: new CD - and it looks good too!

>From: "Jonas Vognsen" <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail]
>Subject: Fwd: cd
>Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 11:51:40 +0000
>
>>From: "Jonas Vognsen" <[e-mail]>
>>To: [e-mail], [e-mail], [e-mail]
>>Subject: cd
>>Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 11:51:11 +0000
>>
in May:

v/a "156 Strings: Nineteen Totally Original Acoustic Guitarists" cd on
Cuneiform (curated by Henry Kaiser, featuring Richard Thompson, Jim O'
Rourke, Fred Frith, Eugene Chadbourne, Rod Poole, Tisziji Munoz, Nels Cline,
Peter Lang, etc)




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- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 14:26:50 +0000
From: "Arthur Gadney" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Han Bennink vs. The Ex on tv

Hello

I head that recently there was a documentary on Dutch tv following Han
Bennink & The Ex on the tour they did in Ethiopia back in January. Did
anybody hear manage to watch it? Sounds interesting, so I would love to hear
comments.

Cheers,

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- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 14:59:39 +0000
From: "Arthur Gadney" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Berlin

Hello guys,

Any good concerts in Berlin at the end of this month?

What are the good record shops and concert places?

Thanks!!!!!


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- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2002 17:54:45 +0200 (CEST)
From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Efr=E9n=20del=20Valle?= <[e-mail]>
Subject: Melvins/Fantomas BB

Hi,

I just listened to the Fant⌠mas/Melvins Big Band album
on Ipecac. Some days ago someone said it wasnÆt worth
the money and, although I wouldnÆt go so far, imho the
sound is not that good and my expectations of some new
material were not met. Most of the tracks are from the
two Fant⌠mas albums, including ôThe Omenö and ôCape
Fearö and a good representation of their first record.
The remaining tunes are by the Melvins but I couldnÆt
specify from which recordings (but IÆd swear from
their trilogy on Ipecac). I didnÆt have time for the
record to sink in but IÆd dare to say itÆs just
anecdotic, a mere transition to their new respective
albums. Moderately good. Probably the number of
players on stage hinders the natural strenght of the
songs, specially those from the first Fant⌠mas album.

Just a few impressions.

Greetings,

EfrΘn del Valle


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Yahoo! Messenger
Comunicaci≤n instantßnea gratis con tu gente.
http://messenger.yahoo.es

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 12:42:57 -0400
From: "Matt S" <[e-mail]>
Subject: furthur

is anyone out there using furthurnet (www.furthurnet.com)
to share live material? very fast and easy to use

it is legal, it says, and I believe it requires artist approval before their
materials are included...

unsurprisingly, most of the choices so far are jamband-ish -- grateful dead,
etc. MMW gets lumped in there

BUT, Bill frisell is there as is Sex Mob..

very fast downloads possible
feel free to contact me if you have questions.


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- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V3 #878
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