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Zorn List Digest       Monday, February 18 2002       Volume 03 : Number 788



In this issue:
-
       Re: dolphy weekend
       RE: Gil and Jimi
       RE: Gil and Jimi
       RE: dolphy weekend
       Re: dolphy weekend
       sanborn does hemphill
       RE: Gil and Jimi
       Loren Mazzacane Connors
       Re: dolphy weekend
       RE: Scheherazade and Shepp
       Brotzmann + Haino + Hano: Live in Wels
       RE: Scheherazade and Shepp
       RE: Braxton
       RE: Scheherazade and Shepp
       Across Threads
       Re: Scheherazade and Shepp
       RE: Scheherazade and Shepp
       FIMAV 2002 Schedule posted
       Re: dolphy weekend
       Re: Johnny Ray

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:02:36 -0800
From: "s~Z" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: dolphy weekend

>>>Sanborn held his own.<<<

Appropriate image for what Sanborn was doing when playing with
guests on Night Music.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:11:13 -0500
From: "Steve Smith" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Gil and Jimi

I'm still pretty fond of the version of "Up from the Skies" on Susie
Ibarra's 'Radiance' CD, personally... and wasn't violinist Charlie Burnham
also holding down the fiddle chair on the String Trio recording you
mentioned?

Steve Smith
[e-mail]

- -----Original Message-----
From: [e-mail]
[mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of James Hale
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 2:28 PM

I've heard passable covers by others, including String Trio of New York, and
I
still love the version of "Little Wing" by Duane Allman, Eric Clapton & co.
more than the original... though nowhere near as much as Hendrix's live
version
originally released on "In The West".


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 21:23:28 +0000
From: "thomas chatterton" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Gil and Jimi

>From: "Sean Westergaard" <[e-mail]>
>
I found this release infinitely more interesting than any
>rock-oriented tribute to Hendrix that I've heard.

Actually, there is a rock-oriented tribute to Jimi that is quite
interesting, It's called 'If 6 was 9' and it features people like Bob Weir
and Andy Partridge in pseudonomous(?) mode, doing loving but not necessarily
slavish covers, even a cool lounge version of 'You Got Me Floating'.

>More or less pointless than another take of 'Round Midnight'? or 'Lonely
>Woman' for that matter?

Exactly!

_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:23:18 -0500
From: "Steve Smith" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: dolphy weekend

I'm not entirely certain whether you're being serious or whether you're
suggesting that Sanborn was clutching "his own" something else... but I
thought he did a pretty nice job sitting in with the likes of Zorn on that
show (you couldn't really say the same for his bandmates, especially Hiram
Bullock, who couldn't hide his contemptuous amusement udirng "Snagglepuss"),
and could handle the funkier and poppier guests as well. Sanborn's also
quite good playing sopranino on Berne's 'Diminutive Mysteries.' Like Berne,
Sanborn was something of a Hemphill acolyte before he turned to more
populist fare. He's pretty incendiary with some of Gil's latter-day bands,
too, as James pointed out.

A few years back when I was working with Tim, he told me Sanborn realy
wanted to make a blowing disc with Marc Ducret and a Berne rhythm section
for Screwgun, but couldn't ever get permission to do so... 'Another Hand' is
likely to remain the closest he'll come until he's too old to be marketable
to the smooth crowd - not so energetic, but atmospheric and an interesting
departure from his norm. I think 'Night Music' music director Hal Willner
had a lot to do with that disc.

There's a lengthy discussion of great moments from 'Night Music' lurking
somewhere in the Zornlist archives.

Steve Smith
[e-mail]

- -----Original Message-----
From: [e-mail]
[mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of s~Z
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 4:03 PM
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: dolphy weekend


>>>Sanborn held his own.<<<

Appropriate image for what Sanborn was doing when playing with
guests on Night Music.


- -


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 22:32:32 +0100
From: "Remco Takken" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: dolphy weekend

> people's records)  Downside: Dolphy repeats himself a lot.  I
Completely true, but it might be because the rleatively little output that
he had, was mainly recorded in 1961, when he was sessioning like mad for
Prestige.

And the live shows that were released, had European rhythm sections: I
gather he played safe on those, I mean playing what he already knew.

remember
> transcribing stuff he played over blues and rhythm changes, and he was
prone
> to doing certain things over and over again (and in different keys -- the
> curse of the obsessive practicer).
Good one.
>
> Years ago, I had a Dolphy album on Everest where he played "Jitterbug
Waltz"
> on the flute, and I wouldn't mind having that again.
You might find it very cheap these days, on cd's with obscure titles like
'Music Matador', 'Conversations' or even 'Jitterbug Waltz'. It's one of
those sessions that don't belong to any major record company. In Europe,
you'll find these even in your local mall, or even at cd-stands of bigger
gas stations on the freeway.

So check every cheapo Dolphy on the back: it might have either the early
Hamilton sessions, or the 1963 sessions with Jitterbug Waltz.

good luck, Remco Takken


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:31:06 -0800
From: [e-mail]
Subject: sanborn does hemphill

is it time again to lament that fine jazz show sanborn had on TV? cat
always seemed to have open ears to me. and for a pop jazz guy, did a
helluva lot to give exposure to less mainstream greats.

and this, from msr. roussel's berne discography:

033 - DIMINUTIVE MYSTERIES (MOSTLY HEMPHILL): Tim Berne

    1/ Sounds In The Fog                        (Hemphill)
8:07
    2/ Serial Abstractions                      (Hemphill)
6:24
    3/ Out, The Regular                         (Hemphill)
5:49
    4/ The Unknown                              (Hemphill)
6:47
    5/ Writhing Love Lines                      (Hemphill)
7:16
    6/ Rites                                    (Hemphill)
3:26
    7/ The Maze (For Julius)                    (Berne)
21:18
    8/ Mystery To Me                            (Hemphill)
6:30

    Recorded at Power Station, NYC, September 1992

  Tim Berne: alto, baritone saxophone; David Sanborn: sopranino, alto; Marc
  Ducret: electric guitars; Hank Roberts: cello; Joey Baron: drums; Herb
  Robertson (7): trumpet, cornet, flugelhorn; Mark Dresser (7): bass.

    1993 - JMT, JMT 514 003-2 (CD)


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:21:23 -0500
From: "Sean Westergaard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Gil and Jimi

>Actually, there is a rock-oriented tribute to Jimi that is quite
>interesting, It's called 'If 6 was 9' and it features people like Bob Weir
>and Andy Partridge in pseudonomous(?) mode, doing loving but not
necessarily
>slavish covers, even a cool lounge version of 'You Got Me Floating'.


I'd say that's easily the best of the rock ones, redeemed totally by the
artists you mentioned:  XTC maquerading as "David Dreams" doing third Stone,
and Henry Kaiser, David Lindley, and (unfortunately) Bob Weir (as Obsequious
Cheesecake) doing If 6 was 9.  i thought the rest of it was rather lame, as
per usual, admitting that i don't recall the You got me Floating track.

sean


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:41:28 -0500
From: David Keffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Loren Mazzacane Connors

> [e-mail] wrote:
>I've heard lots of appraisal to Loren Mazzacane  Connors lately. Any
recommendations?

From my own experience, Mazzacane Connors has some good albums and some
dull albums.   He is one artist that you absolutely do not have any need to
be a completist in order to hear his repertoire of styles; there is a lot
of overlap from album to album.

Here for easy digestion, I classify many of the LMC records I have heard
into three colorfully named categories:  tops, fair-to-middlin', and avoid.

tops:
1)  Volume II with Keiji Haino (Menlo Park)  I have never heard anyone say
they didn't like this record.
2)  In Bern with Jim O'Rourke (Hat Hut)
3)  Long Nights (Table of the Elements)  This one has some fine distortion.
4)  Meme Compilation (only 1 track but that track is cool and in fact most
of the songs on the cd are very fine) (Meme)
5)  "George" on Derek Bailey's Playbacks, This is an album of songs remixed
by a number of artists, including the collaboration by Loren and Jim
O'Rourke.  (Bingo)

fair-to-middlin':
1)  Hell's Kitchen Park
2)  Live at DMG with Keiji Haino
3)  MMMR With Thurston Moore, Jean-Marc Montera, Lee Ranaldo
4)  A Possible Dawn (Hat Hut)

avoid:
1)  Avoid all 7 inch records.  I have three or four of these by Connors and
somehow he manages to fit about 30 minutes of music on a 7 inch record and
you would have been perfectly content with a breezy four minute single per
side.
2)  I second the comment of Matthew W Wirzbicki to avoid duets with Suzanne
Langille.  This includes the "Haunted House" ensemble.  She doesn't sing,
as some like to say, "in the traditional sense".
3)  Hoffman Estates (with Licht & O'Rourke et al.)

David K.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:41:05 -0800
From: "s~Z" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: dolphy weekend

>>>I'm not entirely certain whether you're being serious or
whether you're
suggesting that Sanborn was clutching "his own" something else...
but I
thought he did a pretty nice job sitting in with the likes of
Zorn<<<

Both of your readings are correct.

My heart always sank when he joined other guests. And, although
Tim Berne is among my favorite artists, I never cared much for
Hemphill, and DM is my least favorite Berne recording. I'm very
thankful that Sanborn had the taste to host such a great show, but
his playing, although technically proficient, lacks something that
I need to enjoy the sound of saxophone. Although I can't put words
to it, Sonny Rollins and Hemphill don't have it either. Berne has
it in spades. And Dolphy.....shit.....Dolphy was what ever it is,
incarnate.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:43:56 -0500
From: "Steve Smith" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Scheherazade and Shepp

It's pretty tough to say that any given version of a piece from classical
standard repertoire is "definitive," since orchestras and conductors can
vary so greatly - or not, as the case may be. Older recordings tend to be a
little more distinctive in their regional quirks - orchestras didn't travel
as much and recordings were't as widespread, so you didn't have the
homogeneity of sound that's prevalent today. Conductors, too, were a widely
varied lot - a Mengelberg 'Scheherazade' wouldn't sound much like a Reiner
'Scheherazade,' since the former tended to freely interpret the music as he
heard it while the other stuck closer to the notes and instructions on the
page. Today, most conductors seem to come from the fairly literal-minded
Reiner school.

Still, it's hard to go wrong with 'Scheherazade,' provided you've got a good
orchestra and violin soloist, and you'll find excellent recordings available
at every price point from super-budget to full price. Sir Thomas Beecham's
1957 recording on EMI is considered a milestone and sounds quite good, but
in the louder sections it shows its age. Reiner's Chicago recording for RCA,
of a similar vintage, is comparable. For a good super-cheap version, the
late Enrique Batiz and the Philharmonia on Naxos is more than just
adequate - his recordings are some of the best on the label. Loris
Tjeknavorian's full-price ASV recording is not as note-perfect as most of
the others, but it deserves mention for its genuine Russian accent, hard to
find in modern recordings. It's bawdy and hyper-emotional, like most of the
conductor's recordings.

But personally, I find the new recording by the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra
and Robert Spano on Telarc to be fairly unbeatable. The orchestra is
terrific, including the first violinist who plays the solo part, and the
recording is spectacular. When I had to turn in a "top ten of 2001" list for
one of the magazines I cover classical stuff for, that disc made the cut -
much to my surprise, actually, given that I didn't really expect a standard
rep recording to grab me quite so much.

What was the Shepp question again?

Steve Smith
[e-mail]


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:48:06 -0500
From: David Keffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Brotzmann + Haino + Hano: Live in Wels

>From: "serge dautricourt" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: brotzmann + Haino + Hano
>Shadows: Live in Wels (DIW)
>Has anybody heard this cd? any reviews?

There is a favorable review of the album in the reviews database at:

http://www.planetc.com/users/keffer/haino/index.html

My personal preference is toward the Haino/Hano duet ("A Strange Face" on
Ultra Hard Gel Records) or Haino/Brotzmann duet ("Evolving Blush or Driving
Original Sin" on PSF).  To me the trio seems sort of blurred and
directionless.  But this opinion seems to be in the minority...

David K.




- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:54:13 -0500
From: "Zachary Steiner" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Scheherazade and Shepp

>> What was the Shepp question again?

I had heard that he was a playwright before he turned to music.  I was
curious about his plays.  Did they have the angry free quality of his
music or were they relatively conventional?

Zach



- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:57:13 -0500
From: "Steve Smith" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Braxton

It's ironic, given all the larger projects they managed to release (like the
four-disc 'Trillium' opera!) that the one project Braxton House never
managed to issue before its current hiatus was the Skopje solo CD announced
at the very beginning. Ironic, and a shame - Braxton student Brandon Evans
said that it was his favorite of all Braxton solo releases. Maybe someday...

I still see the Wesleyan solo disc on Hat frequently enough, but the New
Albion disc '19 (Solo) Compositions 1988' might be even easier to find,
cheaper, and with comparable or even better sound.

Steve Smith
[e-mail]
(clearly a Braxton dilettante, with only about 50 discs under his name...)

- -----Original Message-----
From: [e-mail]
[mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of Brian Olewnick

I'd also suggest hearing some of the
solo recordings besides 'For Alto'. Some are rare (ones on Impetus, Ring and
Inner City), but you can probably still locate things like the Hat Wesleyan
set around.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 17:02:50 -0500
From: "Steve Smith" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Scheherazade and Shepp

That's a good question, and one I can't answer. But I think it would be safe
to guess that they did, given the texts he used in some of his earlier
recordings (like "Malcolm, Malcolm... Semper Malcolm"). I do know that at
least one of his plays, Junebug Graduates Tonight! was successfully staged
off-Broadway in 1967.

Steve Smith
[e-mail]

- -----Original Message-----
From: [e-mail]
[mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of Zachary Steiner
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 4:54 PM
To: [e-mail]; 'Patrice L. Roussel'; 'Zornlist'
Subject: RE: Scheherazade and Shepp


>> What was the Shepp question again?

I had heard that he was a playwright before he turned to music.  I was
curious about his plays.  Did they have the angry free quality of his
music or were they relatively conventional?

Zach



- -


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:17:42 -0800
From: "s~Z" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Across Threads

http://www.oliverlake.net/bag.html


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 17:21:31 -0500
From: Rick Lopez <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Scheherazade and Shepp

on 02.02.18 5:02 PM, Steve Smith at [e-mail] wrote:

> That's a good question, and one I can't answer.
Finally!

We discover your limits!!!

AHA!
RL
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k CRISPELL;  IBARRA; Wm. PARKER; RIVERS; SHIPP;
D.S. WARE; COURVOISIER; ENEIDI; MANERI; MORRIS; SPEARMAN; THREADGILL;
WORKMAN; Beckett Eulogy; Baseball & the 10,000 Things; Time Stops; LOVETORN;
HARD BOIL; LUCILLE, a Reverential Journal of the Care of the Beloved Hag...


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 17:26:30 -0500
From: "Steve Smith" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Scheherazade and Shepp

Touche... ;-)

Steve Smith
[e-mail]

- -----Original Message-----
From: Rick Lopez [mailto:[e-mail]]
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 5:22 PM

on 02.02.18 5:02 PM, Steve Smith at [e-mail] wrote:

> That's a good question, and one I can't answer.
Finally!

We discover your limits!!!

AHA!

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 18:02:04 -0500
From: James Hale <[e-mail]>
Subject: FIMAV 2002 Schedule posted

http://www.fimav.qc.ca/programa.html


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 00:45:13 +0100
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: dolphy weekend

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "skip heller" <[e-mail]>

> After listening to the Mingus stuff, OUT TO LUNCH actually sounds a little
> mannered and intentional to me.  But that could be do to not enough
> rehearsal (the tunes are hard), or the players just not yet being quite
> comfortable with a new idiom.  It's hard to say anything about records
that
> bring a lot of new devices to the table.

You may be right. It sounds mannred in a way. But i just like that
unrehearsed sound, where drums go ways louder then the vibraphone. You hear
the band trying hard to get something - they do not achieve the goal, but
the quest is incredibly exciting. The 'cool free' sound of flute, clarinet,
& vibraphone is exceptional. A kind of sweetness/agression mix that only
'filles de kilimajro' - the best jazz album ever - managed to achieve and go
further. tony william's drumming has somethinfg to do with that... and boy,
what a sound Richard Davis has on that album.
Marcin (who just got back from a very strong  norbert kubacz on bass/ macio
moretti on drums live show)


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 18:52:45 -0500 (EST)
From: Ken Waxman <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Johnny Ray

Skip:

I don't mind that --even if he's wrong. But you gotta
know what you're talking about before putting pen to
paper or finger to keyboard (flamers please note). At
one point in the book, if I remember correctly, he
tries to put down bop -- which to him seems to be the
pinnacle of modernism -- viz a viz Ray by knocking A
Love Supreme, not exactly bop, a saying Ray didn't
need the trappings of supreme love because he already
had love of his own.

It makes more -- or less-- sense when you read it.

Ken




- --- skip heller <[e-mail]> wrote:

> The author was Johnny Whiteside, who is not exactly
> hostile towards jazz but
> does not seem to put it at the pinnacle of American
> accomplishment.

=====
Ken Waxman
[e-mail]
www.jazzword.com - Jazz/improv news, CD reviews and photos

______________________________________________________________________
Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca

- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V3 #788
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