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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #731
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Thursday, January 31 2002 Volume 03 : Number 731
In this issue:
-
weather report
Re: hip hop
Miles, Bobby, and Remmy
anticon/etc.
Re: Miles, Bobby, and Remmy
RE: Bar KoKhba
RE: david bowie (slight return)
Re: Jazz punk
Re: French rap
Re: david bowie (slight return)
Re: French rap
Odp: Zorn List Digest V3 #726
Rowe/Muller/Sugimoto, 2/2 and 2/3
Re: Stockhausen (was spectral muzik.)
Re: Odp: Zorn List Digest V3 #726
Re: Stockhausen (was spectral muzik.)
Re: Butch Morris biz
anticon
d-mented R&B/hip hop
abstract hip hop
Re: abstract hip hop
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 14:32:51 -0800
From: mwisckol@ocregister.com
Subject: weather report
my ears were just opening when "talespinnin" came out, which is probably
why that is my favorite. one of those seminal listening experiences, where
you hear things a new way for the first time. so me, it has such a gorgeous
texture and sound, exotic and sunny and unfolding....
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 02:58:23 -0500
From: "Andrew" <ahorton@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: hip hop
> anything on ninja tune is great.
> a lot of hip-hop, trip-hop and so on...
> the ten year anniversary compilation 'xen cuts'
> is excellent.
Ninja Tune really puts out great records. I thought that the recent bonobo
was one of the weaker things they've released in a while, but Flanger's
"outer space/inner space" is SO DAMN GOOD! Has anyone heard it? It's
seriously funky...some compare it to Hancock's really out there stuff.
I'm not that impressed with the Big Dada stuff.....Roots Manuva's "run come
save me" was weak, and I've never been a fan of Mike Ladd or the
Infesticons.
The "Xen Cuts" 10th anniversary 3CD is very very excellent- I gave four
copies as gifts this past Christmas! :)
I'm also really interested in the latest trend- "Click Hop"- basically,
glitchy, crunchy hip hop. Prefuse 73 and the Tigerbeat 6 and Mille Plateaux
crowd have picked up on it.....MP recently put out a "click hop" compilation
called "electric ladyland" or something like that, and it was VERY
disappointing. It was mostly glitch-house and more drum-n-bass type
stuff....no real "click hop."
One GREAT record I recently picked up is Dabrye's "3/5"- it's out on Ghostly
international ( www.ghostly.com ) , and it's verrrrrrrrrry good clicky
downtempo type stuff. It has a super-synthetic vibe, but a very chilled vibe
as well. It's very melodic, and has occasoinal dub influences that
surface....I highly reccomend this one...i've been listening to it for about
a month straight.
andrew
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 18:46:14 -0400
From: mwoodwor <mwoodwor@is2.dal.ca>
Subject: Miles, Bobby, and Remmy
All this talk of Weather Reports - Live in Tokyo, reminded me of a question
I've been meaning to ask the zorn-list for some time. Does anyone know if
the recording of Miles Davis live somewhere in Japan that has Sam Rivers on
it, has ever been released on CD (I'm assuming it probably has in Japan?) and
if so, where someone could possibly obtain a copy of it.
Also, great to see the new Bobby Previte on Tzadik is finally out after the
mix up with the great booklet that accompanies it with Miro's paintings. My
friend
picked it up at DMG in New York for me a couple of days ago. I've got a
first time 'listening date' with it for later tonight. can't wait.........
wudz
NP Remmy Ongala - Songs For the Poor Man
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 07:04:31 -0500
From: "Andrew" <ahorton@vt.edu>
Subject: anticon/etc.
First of all, I just want to say that I'm so pleased to find so many like
minded people on this list! I hate to sound like a hot headed young
whippersnapper, but the first 4 months I was on this list, it seemed like a
bunch of "old fogies" (no offense, Skip...hehe) going on about the more
boring aspects of Bill Frisell's guitar loops. It's great to find other
people that love both hip hop and Zorn.
Also- thanks for clearing up the Anticon stuff. I knew that some of the core
Anticon members (Dose One, Sole, etc.) were from the Midwest, but had
relocated to the Bay Area...and that others were from the Bay Area
originially.
I think that Anticon gets a bunch of flack from both the hip hop community
and the regular music community, because nobody really knows where to put
them....while it's definitely hip hop, it's also definitely NOT. It seems
that most of the Anticon projects are very "un-hip hop" in some sense or
another, between Buck 65's spoken word approach, Dose One's sing-song
chanting, Odd Nosdam's "Loveless"-esque production, Sole's homosexuality and
hardcore approach...... the whole Anticon aesthetic feels very "un" hip hop,
more along the lines of indie rock and hardcore. At the same time, it's also
very "hip hop" in the sense that they're rappers, the music is
beat-oriented, etc....
But then records like the Clouddead album truly defy classification....
andrew
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 18:08:56 -0500
From: Rick Lopez <bb10k@velocity.net>
Subject: Re: Miles, Bobby, and Remmy
on 02.01.31 5:46 PM, mwoodwor at mwoodwor@is2.dal.ca wrote:
> All this talk of Weather Reports - Live in Tokyo, reminded me of a question
> I've been meaning to ask the zorn-list for some time. Does anyone know if
> the recording of Miles Davis live somewhere in Japan that has Sam Rivers on
> it, has ever been released on CD (I'm assuming it probably has in Japan?) and
> if so, where someone could possibly obtain a copy of it.
Here's the entry with all the issues I know of:
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/RIVERS.disc.html#64.07.14
Note also session info on the 12th and 15th.
The Rivers/Miles thang will be re-released "soon" as a Miles Live '64-'65
box set, isn't this right folks?
The other issues are all O.P as far as I know except for a Japanese import.
I regularly see various versions up on eBay.
Best,
RL
- ----------
[ All of the below and much more at: http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k ]
Sessionographies :
CRISPELL; IBARRA; Wm. PARKER; RIVERS; SHIPP; D.S. WARE.
Discographies :
COURVOISIER; ENEIDI; MANERI; MORRIS; SPEARMAN; THREADGILL; WORKMAN.
Samuel Beckett Eulogy; Baseball & the 10,000 Things; Time Stops; LOVETORN;
HARD BOIL; LUCILLE, a Reverential Journal of the Care of the Beloved Hag;
ETC.,
- ----------
*** THINGS 4 SALE *** [Updated: 01.12.01]
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/ChipsInCashing.html
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 18:29:19 -0500
From: "J Kan" <jim.kan@verizon.net>
Subject: RE: Bar KoKhba
> From: M. Rizzi
>
> >Can't remember who exactly was in the "West Coast" line-up of Masada
>
> I'm assuming folks are referring to the
> Zorn (sax, natch), Ben Goldberg (clarinet),
> Trevor Dunn (bass), and Kenny Wolleson (drums)
> incarnation of Masada. [...]
> Sadly, I've never heard any recordings of
> that line up.
I have a vague memory of that group being recorded for broadcast (on
KPFA, maybe?), but playing Herbie Nichols compositions. Anybody have a
copy? I think the show would have been at New Langton Arts in SF.
Jim
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 18:29:19 -0500
From: "J Kan" <jim.kan@verizon.net>
Subject: RE: david bowie (slight return)
> 1. Are there some essential glam records/documents
> that I need to check out?
Yes: _Velvet Goldmine_, Todd Haynes' unofficial david bowie anti-biopic.
Jim
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 15:26:49 -0800
From: "carlos torres" <nipomoone@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Jazz punk
>The Minutemen and the Birthday Party sound much jazzier to my
>ears, though I think both groups were too witty to call themselves
>"jazz-punk."
hmmm...the birthday party as jazz?? exactly which album or song even would
you say is "jazzy"? i just dont see it at all...
_________________________________________________________________
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 18:23:16 -0500
From: Rick Lopez <bb10k@velocity.net>
Subject: Re: French rap
on 04.01.08 2:30 PM, duncan youngerman at y-man@wanadoo.fr wrote:
> As for French rap, though, I happen to be allergic...
I'm allergic to the date setting on your computer.
What could it possibly *mean* ???
Best,
RL
- ----------
[ All of the below and much more at: http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k ]
Sessionographies :
CRISPELL; IBARRA; Wm. PARKER; RIVERS; SHIPP; D.S. WARE.
Discographies :
COURVOISIER; ENEIDI; MANERI; MORRIS; SPEARMAN; THREADGILL; WORKMAN.
Samuel Beckett Eulogy; Baseball & the 10,000 Things; Time Stops; LOVETORN;
HARD BOIL; LUCILLE, a Reverential Journal of the Care of the Beloved Hag;
ETC.,
- ----------
*** THINGS 4 SALE *** [Updated: 01.12.01]
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/ChipsInCashing.html
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 23:30:06
From: "Andrew Nairn" <moretap@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: david bowie (slight return)
The funny thing about glam rock is that it contains some of the best music
and some of the worst music. It seems like you like the more arty side of
Glam Rock. So steer clear of stuff like Sweet, Slade, Gary Glitter.
"1. Are there some essential glam records/documents
that I need to check out?"
T. Rex - "Electric Warrior" (I feel it's a lot better than Slider or Tanx)
The first 5 Roxy Music Albums (esp. the first, For your Pleasure, and
Stranded)
The first 3 Eno Albums (the first is the most glam rock)
Lou Reed - "Transformer"
Bowie - Space Oddity through Alladin Sane
"3. Is BOWIE AT THE BEEB (that 3cd set that came out
not long ago) worth having for a noncompletist who
loves te early Bowie?"
I would say it's pretty good as compilation, but it's different than his
studio albums. It has a lot of the earlier songs that are good and not on
any albums. But my recommendation is that you become a completist of Bowie's
work. This of course is do to my personal taste. Even the worst Bowie albums
have thier charm, and are in my stereo fairly often.
-Andrew Nairn
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1904 06:15:38 +0100
From: duncan youngerman <y-man@wanadoo.fr>
Subject: Re: French rap
Means I'm way behind the times=2E
Seriously, I'll get that fixed tomorrow, I promise=2E
D=2E
Rick Lopez a =E9crit :
> on 04=2E01=2E08 2:30 PM, duncan youngerman at y-man@wanadoo=2Efr wrote:
>
> > As for French rap, though, I happen to be allergic=2E=2E=2E
>
> I'm allergic to the date setting on your computer=2E
>
> What could it possibly *mean* ???
>
> Best,
> RL
>
>
> -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 01:50:41 +0100
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <marcingokieli@go2.pl>
Subject: Odp: Zorn List Digest V3 #726
> But then I have always been a sucker for a Fender Rhodes through a
> distortion pedal and ring modulator (see Chick Corea on the recent Live
> Miles).
Distorted keys is great, and Corea's playing with miles is as dangerous as
music gets (although MD is very clearly the star of the band). Any other
good keyboardists playing with distortion?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 19:50:01 -0500
From: "Brian Olewnick" <olewnick@gis.net>
Subject: Rowe/Muller/Sugimoto, 2/2 and 2/3
Since Jon's still in self-imposed exile, I figured I'd post a reminder of
these two shows. Saturday, 2/2 at Tonic and Sunday 2/3 at MassArt in Boston.
Not sure if the Boston show will be structured the same, but the Tonic sets
will be Rowe solo (probably interpreting a page from Cardew's 'Treatise'),
Muller/Sugimoto duo, then the trio performing together, I think, for the
first time since they recorded the wonderful 'World Turned Upside Down'.
Should be lotsa fun. Stop in and say hello (Jon and I will be at both). I'll
be the one likely manning the CD table between sets. I may require proper ID
before I point out Jon, though. ;-)
Brian Olewnick
NP: Barry Guy - Theoria
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 21:17:25 -0500
From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <cdeupree@erinet.com>
Subject: Re: Stockhausen (was spectral muzik.)
At 05:49 PM 1/31/02 +0100, Remco Takken wrote:
>
>Isn't it the LP album Ensemble that Stockhausen won't accept in his
>discography, because that was a joint collaboration/ improv? I have a
>cassette of the old vinyl, and since this 'work' never pops up in recent
>biographies, I assume it will be lost for future cd release.
This album was released on Wergo, not DGG. I haven't seen any non-DGG old
Stockhausen reissued by Stockhausen Verlag, and some of the Wergo stuff is
still in print on CD (Kontakte, anyway), so you might see it again. The
liner notes are all in German, so I've only had Maconie's description of
the work to figure out what's going on. Maconie talks about it like a
'compositional exercise', and the personnel is most of his group for the
intuitive albums. I haven't heard it in a long time though, I'll have to
dig it out again for another listen.
- --
Caleb Deupree
cdeupree@erinet.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 02:33:43 +0000
From: "thomas chatterton" <chatterton23@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Odp: Zorn List Digest V3 #726
>From: "Marcin Gokieli" <marcingokieli@go2.pl>
>Distorted keys is great, and Corea's playing with miles is as dangerous as
>music gets (although MD is very clearly the star of the band). Any other
>good keyboardists playing with distortion?
Mike Ratledge/Soft Machine
_________________________________________________________________
Join the worldÆs largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 02:39:21 +0000
From: "thomas chatterton" <chatterton23@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Stockhausen (was spectral muzik.)
>From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <cdeupree@erinet.com>
>This album was released on Wergo, not DGG. I haven't seen any non-DGG old
>Stockhausen reissued by Stockhausen Verlag, and some of the Wergo stuff is
>still in print on CD (Kontakte, anyway), so you might see it again.
Also: 'Aus den sieben Tagen' is still available on Wergo, one of my
favourite Stockhausen recordings, performed by Ensemble Musique Vivante
(includes Alos Kontarsky piano, Michel Portal clarinet, Jean-Francois
Jenny-Clark bass, with Stockhausen on filters & potentiometers)
_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 21:33:47 -0500
From: Rick Lopez <bb10k@velocity.net>
Subject: Re: Butch Morris biz
> In a message dated 1/26/02 8:30:22 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> bb10k@velocity.net writes:
>
> << Just received a Butch Morris "Conduction Collection" CD on the NEW WORLD
> label.
Just a quick thank you to all the kind folk who helped me solve this one.
You bet,
RL
- ----------
[ All of the below and much more at: http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k ]
Sessionographies :
CRISPELL; IBARRA; Wm. PARKER; RIVERS; SHIPP; D.S. WARE.
Discographies :
COURVOISIER; ENEIDI; MANERI; MORRIS; SPEARMAN; THREADGILL; WORKMAN.
Samuel Beckett Eulogy; Baseball & the 10,000 Things; Time Stops; LOVETORN;
HARD BOIL; LUCILLE, a Reverential Journal of the Care of the Beloved Hag;
ETC.,
- ----------
*** THINGS 4 SALE *** [Updated: 01.12.01]
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/ChipsInCashing.html
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 19:51:52 -0800 (PST)
From: aaron chua <aaronchua22@yahoo.com>
Subject: anticon
i haven't been keeping up w the list recently but just
wanted to chime in on this.
i don't really have any back ground in hiphop really
but discovered a couple of years ago at my local
record store.
i disagree w mr carey on this point.
i get inspired by some of this stuff. some of their
stuff to me seems like a logical progression of the
beat poets. with a sense of humour (humor?). maybe
similar in spirit to gregory corso?
anyway saw them live in melbourne where they were
great.
some personal faves:
cloudead.
them
boom bip and dose one _circle
josh martinez - made in china
sole - uckrt
also you should check out stuff w/ mikah 9 from the
free stylefellowship. a recent release - ''timetable''
is mostly archival stuff (radio spots parties etc)
but is still incredible.includes the amazing piece w/
daddy kev of the lost angels ep.
further also depending on yr taste antipop consortium.
aesop rock too.
rgrds
aaron
ps what do people think of the new saul williams.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions!
http://auctions.yahoo.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 23:07:48 -0600
From: parry@macconnect.com
Subject: d-mented R&B/hip hop
I sixth or seventh the motion on Dr. Octagon.
The Neptunes, of Ol' Dirty Bastard fame (or is it Dirty Ol', I never could
be bothered to get it straight), produced a brilliantly deranged hip-hop
infused album by R&B singer Kelis a couple years ago. Great beats, and all
kind of production and lyrical weirdness. The first time I heard the
single, "Caught Out There," I just stood in the aisle of the record store
and laughed. It's way past angry, the chorus is Kelis hollering "I hate you
so much right now" and all the little things going on in the production are
full of menace -- but then her voice on the verses is so gorgeous. It makes
for a really bizarre contrast. I love the album so much, I may eventually
actually make myself listen to a whole Ol' Dirty Bastard album. Of
course, I'm also semi-motivated because when Derek Bailey was in Orlando a
whole back, he mentioned he was quite taken w/ Mr. Bastard. He seemed
pleased to report that he had managed to appall and offend a friend of his
by expressing admiration for Ol' Dirty.
Somebody was dissing French hip hop, and for all I know, the rest of it
sucks, but I really like MC Solaar.
Parry
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 00:41:22 -0800
From: the muff <andreit@geocities.com>
Subject: abstract hip hop
well, since we're on the subject, i'll crawl out of my whole and put
down my $0.02
A great band to listen to is cLOUDDEAD. Abstract beats, with ambient
sounds. Hip hop nontheless.
the muff
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 01:15:44 -0500
From: "Andrew" <ahorton@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: abstract hip hop
> well, since we're on the subject, i'll crawl out of my whole and put
> down my $0.02
> A great band to listen to is cLOUDDEAD. Abstract beats, with ambient
> sounds. Hip hop nontheless.
I'm glad that everyone on here digs the Clouddead record....I love it.
Mush's distro is pretty poor, though....you can hardly order anything from
www.dirtyloop.com ......I wonder if they'll work out a better deal?
I'm also digging the Reaching Quiet Mp3's i've found.....it's 2/3 of
Clouddead (minus Dose One) and it's a little heavier and more melodic.
a
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V3 #731
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