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Zorn List Digest         Tuesday, May 29 2001         Volume 03 : Number 449



In this issue:
-
       Re: Toy instruments
       matchless
       re miles/trane box set vs. single discs
       4'33"
       Re: Lynne Tillman
       Re: 4'33"
       Re: 4'33"
       Re: re miles/trane box set vs. single discs
       Re: re miles/trane box set vs. single discs
       Jon Rose
       Re: 4'33"
       Re: 4'33"
       Re: ligeti edition Q + NY rec shops closing + moholo
       RE: ligeti edition Q (+ Teldec New Line + Scelsi)
       help required: music/art for modern cities. no *particular* zorn content.
       Re: Sabu Toyozumi
       New Music with roots in Asian traditions on Mappings week beginning May 29, 2001
       Re: Lynne Tillman
       Re: help required: music/art for modern cities. no *particular* zorn content.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 05:42:45 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Toy instruments

Further to my message dated 15/05/01 16:16:45 GMT Daylight Time,
<<< << not to mention Voice Crack >>
or Steve Beresford
or Richard Sanderson
or The Bohman Brothers
or that woman from LA whose name escapes me...

...seems there's a veritable plethora of the things!
Roger Parry>>>
that woman from LA whose name escaped me is, of course, Anna Homler
Best regards
Rog

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 11:41:40 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: matchless

<< They look like they have the best prices on Matchless CDs I've found so
far >>

downtown music gallery also has matchless below what ive seen elsewhere, tho
for my own [financial] safety, i havent looked at anomalous for a few months
:)
steve koenig
n.p.: verdi: jerusalem (opera recording premiere)

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 12:44:01 -0400
From: "&c." <[e-mail]>
Subject: re miles/trane box set vs. single discs

So would it be a good idea to hold off on buying the box set and buy the
discs separately?  I was looking  to buy the set in the next couple of days.

Zach

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 12:48:42 -0400
From: "&c." <[e-mail]>
Subject: 4'33"

I will be performing Cage's 4'33" this week at the prodding of my theater
director.  I've done research on the different manuscripts and performances
and I'm uncertain as to what to do now.  Should the Woodstock times or the
Tacet times be used?  What's the best way to signal the end of a movement?
If any one has seen it performed or has performed it, I would love some
insight.

Zach

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 10:33:55 -0700
From: Tosh <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Lynne Tillman

Generally Lynne Tillman is a wonderful writer.  I don't have any specific
titles on hand right now, but I would recommend anything by her.

Ciao,
Tosh


- --
Tosh Berman
TamTam Books
http://www.tamtambooks.com


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 12:30:34 -0500
From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: 4'33"

On Mon, May 28, 2001 at 12:48:42PM -0400, &c. wrote:
> I will be performing Cage's 4'33" this week at the prodding of my theater
> director.  I've done research on the different manuscripts and performances
> and I'm uncertain as to what to do now.  Should the Woodstock times or the
> Tacet times be used?  What's the best way to signal the end of a movement?
> If any one has seen it performed or has performed it, I would love some
> insight.
IMHO, either timing can be used; Cage had frequently noted that the piece
could even be done with different durations.

On what instrument are you playing the piece? (There is a common misperception
that, since the premiere was done on piano, it is a piano piece, but it can be
done with different instruments.)

To signal the end of a movement, I'd suggestion a clear transition between
"playing" and "not playing". Tudor closed the keyboard lid between movements.
On another instrument, you might, say, take the saxophone out of your mouth.
If performing without an instrument, a shift between performing and
non-performing stances could work.

<blatant plug>
It might be worth asking this on Silence: The John Cage Discussion List. See
http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt/Cage/ for information on subscribing and a
link to the searchable list archives.
</blatant plug>

- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| [e-mail]           http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Jerusaklyn                  http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music    Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 14:01:41 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: 4'33"

Zach,

Check out this web site.  I think it does a good job of answering your
questions.
I saw it a long time ago on TV and the description there of it's first
performance
is exactly as I remember it.  I wish I could remember if it was David Tudor
that I saw.
I have to admit, it was the first I had ever heard of it's existence at the
time so it
was interesting as I listened to the sound of the refrigerator, of cars
driving by, and
the whirrr of the locust outside of the house. If not interesting, at least
weird that I
remember what I listened to.

The only thing I think it misses on the web site is that the performer I
saw was
dressed like a stuffy classical guy.  I don't remember distinctly but it
may have
been a tux or something similar.  Wearing a t-shirt and jeans would
probably give
the wrong perception.

Some things I remember was his attention to the score and the subsequent
flipping
of the pages at what seemed liked distinct places. And, of course, the
opening and
closing of the keyboard lid to signal the beginning and end of the 3
movements, and the
clicking of the stop watch at the start and finish of  4:33.

The lowering and highering of your pants is not recommended.  :-)

Good luck on the reactions!

http://www.azstarnet.com/~solo/4min33se.htm


James



At 12:48 PM 5/28/01 -0400, you wrote:
>I will be performing Cage's 4'33" this week at the prodding of my theater
>director.  I've done research on the different manuscripts and performances
>and I'm uncertain as to what to do now.  Should the Woodstock times or the
>Tacet times be used?  What's the best way to signal the end of a movement?
>If any one has seen it performed or has performed it, I would love some
>insight.
>
>Zach
>
>-


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 16:20:36 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: re miles/trane box set vs. single discs

Ah yes, the box set vs. original album predicament.  Ultimately, of course,
it's your own personal preference.  If you want everything Miles and Trane
ever recorded on Columbia in chronological order and like all the liner notes
with discography/sessionography, then get the box.  If you prefer having the
music in the original track order it was released and with the original
covers, then get the single albums.  True that if you get the box, you can
program the music in the original track order (if your CD player has that
ability), but that's a bit of a hassle to do each and every time you listen
to a disc.  A couple other things to consider: the boxset takes up less space
on my shelf (which is good), but I'm more likely to grab for an individual CD
than the box (bad).  But you may be different.

In the case of a some of the boxsets I own (Ornette, Miles, Coltrane), I
still own the some of the original albums as well.  Usually, I'll put a disc
from the boxset on before I will the single disc, but there are certain
exceptions: 'Kind of Blue' and 'The Shape of Jazz to Come' in particular.

jeff caltabiano
n.p. elvin jones: dear john c. (1965, impulse)

[e-mail] writes:
> So would it be a good idea to hold off on buying the box set and buy the
>  discs separately?

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 14:29:14 -0500
From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: re miles/trane box set vs. single discs

On Mon, May 28, 2001 at 04:20:36PM -0400, [e-mail] wrote:
> Ah yes, the box set vs. original album predicament.  Ultimately, of course,
> it's your own personal preference.

Which reminds me: is there anything in Zorn's Parachute Box that isn't
also included in the recent individual reissues?

- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| [e-mail]           http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Jerusaklyn                  http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music    Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 13:47:58 -0700
From: "serge dautricourt" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Jon Rose

Could someone recommend a good starting place for Jon Rose's violin
improvising?

Thanks,
Serge
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 21:02:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: konrad <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: 4'33"

I want to know if anyone knows whether it's true that Zappa smoked a
cigarette during his performance of it for this Cage tribute CD?


konrad

^Z


On Mon, 28 May 2001, &c. wrote:

> I will be performing Cage's 4'33" this week at the prodding of my theater
> director.  I've done research on the different manuscripts and performances
> and I'm uncertain as to what to do now.  Should the Woodstock times or the
> Tacet times be used?  What's the best way to signal the end of a movement?
> If any one has seen it performed or has performed it, I would love some
> insight.
>
> Zach
>
> -
>
>


^Z


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 22:48:24 -0400
From: Lang Thompson <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: 4'33"

>director.  I've done research on the different manuscripts and performances
>and I'm uncertain as to what to do now.  Should the Woodstock times or the

There is a published score available (or at least was a few years back when
our bookstore stocked scores; we never sold the Cage).

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 22:51:21 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: ligeti edition Q + NY rec shops closing + moholo

In a message dated 5/28/01 12:07:14 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

>  Q1: what is on vol 5?

Mechanical Music:

- -- Adaptations for barrel organ of Continuum, Hungarian Rock, Invention,
Capricios No. 1 & 2, and Musica ricercata.  Barrel organ played by Pierre
Chardal (also a member of Sylvie Courvoisier's great Ocre Trio and Quintet).

- -- Adaptations for player piano of piano etudes no. 8-11, also etude no. 14a
in its "original version for player piano," also etude no. 7 and Continuum
adapted for two player pianos.  Jugen Hocker, player painos.

- -- Poeme Symphonique for 100 Metronomes.

I really love this CD.

>  Q2: are their volumes above 7?

Volume 8 is the 1997 version of Le Grande Macabre.  That's it.

>  Q3: how does my un-numbered sony sk58945 fit in with the series,
>  if indeed it does: etvos & ens modern: cto c, p, chamber cto

I always wondered about that myself - was this was going to be reissued as
part of the series or were the concertos going to be re-recorded for the
series.  Steve S?

David

nr: Josef Skvorecky, Two Murders in My Double Life
np: Irene Scweizer, chicago piano solo

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 23:32:09 -0400
From: "Steve Smith" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: ligeti edition Q (+ Teldec New Line + Scelsi)

The Eotvos recording preceded, and wasn't part of the Ligeti edition, all of
which was being recorded under the composer's supervision.  (Apparently it's
also becoming rare - I seldom see it at Academy, and when I do it's
invariably priced at $15 used.)  The concertos were going to be re-recorded,
and of course are now being re-recorded in the new Ligeti series in Teldec's
"New Line."  The Chamber Concerto and Piano Concerto are both on the first
volume, due out this month here in the States - the piano concerto features
Pierre-Laurant Aimard - and the Cello Concerto will be on a forthcoming
release (with Siegfried Palm, the musician for whom it was written).

Since we discussed that Teldec "New Line" series earlier, I'll just mention
that I've finally received, but haven't heard, the Bang on a Can release
'Lost Objects,' and also that I've learned of two more upcoming releases
from the line:

Xenakis/Cage/Miki: Percussion Works (Peter Sadlo)
Birtwistle: Pulse Shadows (Arditti Quartet)
Various: After Schubert (Kremerata Baltica/Gidon Kremer)

One last thing - just received a new Scelsi disc on the Kairos label, all
performed by members of the mighty fine Klangforum Wien.  Haven't heard it
yet, but here's what's on it:

String Quartet No. 4 (1964)
Elohim (1965/67)
Duo for Violin and Cello (1965)
Anagamin (1965)
Maknongan (1976)
Natura renovatur (1967)

Steve Smith
[e-mail]


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 19:03:50 +0100
From: dan hill <[e-mail]>
Subject: help required: music/art for modern cities. no *particular* zorn content.

[no real zorn content -pls excuse]

hi all

inevitably, i have a favour to ask. i'm helping put together content
for a new museum in manchester, uk - called 'urbis', the museum of
the modern city.

i'm contributing to an exhibit which addresses 'imagining the modern
city', and am responsible for suggesting relevant works of art
(paintings, music, films, writing etc.) which concern the modern city
in some way. so, how have artists, musicians, filmmakers, writers
etc. responded to the modern city (modern, for these purposes really
meaning cities post-1800 industrial revolution manchester and beyond,
to about 2000 - either relatively 'new' cities (e.g. manchester, los
angeles, sao paulo etc.), or old cities transformed (e.g. paris,
tokyo etc.). don't get me started on whether some cities are actually
'postmodern' - please!).

relevant areas might include visions of future cities, utopian,
dystopian or otherwise (ghost in the shell, blade runner, metropolis,
escape from new york); music works written for cities (heiner
goebbels' surrogate cities) or identified with particular cities
(bebop and new york? tropicalia and sao paulo?); works addressing the
sensory aspects of cities (e.g. walter ruttman's weekend, uri caine's
sidewalks of new york, patrick susskind's perfume, garry winogrand);
addressing emotional aspects or fantasy or play in the city (e.g.
araki's tokyo lucky hole, ben katchor, ballard); formal
investigations (mrs dalloway, ulysses) and so on. or just
particularly strong evocations of cities (whistler's nocturnes, man
with the golden arm, la haine, chandler, deighton, mean streets etc.)

you can see it's quite a large field!

i've got a biggish list already, but i'm looking to discover as many
relevant works as possible at this stage, so i thought i'd put it to
this extremely erudite, well-informed and charitable crowd, and
further hope that flattery will get me everywhere.

if anyone has thoughts on this matter - preferably examples of works
i can't miss (again, across all media, and across the whole high-art
<> popular culture spectrum - it's for a public museum remember) -
i'd hugely appreciate it if you could mail me on [e-mail]
... thanks.

please respond off-list, unless you think it's potentially
this-listy. obviously, there's gonna be whole bunch of new
york-related culture in there (possibly too much for my
co-curators!), and hopefully some zorn-oriented material.

thanks again,
dan.

- --

||| dan hill
||| cityofsound.com





- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 13:17:49 +0200
From: "Andreas Dietz" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Sabu Toyozumi

>>From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>

>>Coming back from tonight's DC Vision Fest gig, I was tempted to stop
>>by a large wall and spraypaint "Sabu is God". Just an utterly amazing
>>show, in which he was well matched with Joseph Jarman and, in the last
>>set, Vattel Cherry. Can anyone recommend any recordings of his?

there┤s a 3LP set of Braxton┤s Creative Music Orchestra entitled RBN-3K12 on
which Toyozumi appears. It was recorded in France 1972 and unfortunately
long out of print (I think).

Andreas
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 09:03:12 -0500
From: Herb Levy <[e-mail]>
Subject: New Music with roots in Asian traditions on Mappings week beginning May 29, 2001

Hi y'all,

This week Mappings, a weekly new music program on Antenna Internet
Radio <http://www.antennaradio.com/avant/mappings/index.htm> presents
new music with roots in Asian musical traditions by     Byron Au
Yong, Chen Yi, James Fei, Ge Gan-Ru, Jason Kao Hwang,    I.S.O., Jin
Hi Kim,    Bun-Ching Lam, Teizo Matsumura, Tadao Sawai, Min Xiao-Fen.

The RealAudio recording went online about 10-11 pm (Greenwich -0800)
on Monday night and will remain online for a week. I hope you have a
chance to check out the show.

Last week's program (featuring flute music by Kathryn Alexander,
Stuart Dempster, Robert Dick, David Dramm, Morton Feldman, John
Fonville, Janice Giteck, Hiroyuki Itoh, James Newton, Maggi Payne,
and Matthias Ziegler) is available in the archives:
<http://www.antennaradio.com/avant/mappings/index1.htm>

See you online.

Bests,

Herb

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 10:33:55 -0700
From: Tosh <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Lynne Tillman

Generally Lynne Tillman is a wonderful writer.  I don't have any specific
titles on hand right now, but I would recommend anything by her.

Ciao,
Tosh


- --
Tosh Berman
TamTam Books
http://www.tamtambooks.com


- -

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 10:48:41 -0400
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: help required: music/art for modern cities. no *particular* zorn content.

Perhaps a topic too broad to grasp easily but a few relevant things:

film

Walter Ruttman's 1927 Berlin: Symphony of a City inspired a whole slew of similar films, the most famous being Vigo's A Propos de Nice.
Castro Street (Bruce Baillie)
Breathless (Godard)
Fragments*Jerusalem (Ron Havilio)
Chungking Express (Wong Kar-Wai)
City of Sadness & Goodbye South Goodbye (Hou Hsiao-Hsien)
Ghost Dog (Jarmusch)
Streetwise
Taste of Cherry (Kiarostami)
Killer's Kiss (Kubrick)
Signal - Germany on the Air (Ernie Gehr)
Berlin Alexanderplatz (Fassbinder) - perhaps, I haven't seen it
Wings of Desire (Wenders)
The Third Man
Cairo trilogy (Youssef Chaine)
Bicycle Thief, Rome Open City & many other neo-realist films


writing

Doblin - Berlin Alexanderplatz (see above)
Bely - St Petersburg
Situationist texts
Auster - New York Trilogy (perhaps too abstract)
Dickens - most anything
Mike Davis - City of Quartz & Ecology of Fear
Apollinaire - Zone
Baudelaire - Paris Spleen
Orwell - Down and Out in Paris and London
Mark Bowden - Black Hawk Down
William Gibson - many
Proust
William Carlos Williams - Paterson
Ackroyd - Hawksmoor
Jacob Riis
Lewis Mumford
Balzac - many
Ruskin
Nathaniel West
Toole - Confederacy of Dunces




- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V3 #449
*******************************


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