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2000-11-07
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #157
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Wednesday, November 8 2000 Volume 03 : Number 157
In this issue:
-
Re: Fred Frith mailing list
Jim Black is a Rock Star
Re: New Variations ?
Milford Graves-Stories
new at Adventures In Sound
FOOTLOOSE
Dillinger Escape Plan (was Jim Black is a Rock Star)
Penguin guide...
Re: Drummers [reprise]
Re: Drummers [reprise]
Der Rote Bereich
Re: tWisT
Re: FOOTLOOSE
Re: Dillinger Escape Plan (was Jim Black is a Rock Star)
Re: New Variations ?
Re: Penguin guide...
special offer on Bobby Previte's web site...
Re: New Variations ?
Re: Re: New Variations ?
Now that she's unlurked (was Re: New Variations ?)
Re: Now that she's unlurked (was Re: New Variations ?)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 16:11:49 -0500
From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <cdeupree@erinet.com>
Subject: Re: Fred Frith mailing list
At 04:38 PM 11/7/00 GMT, Arthur Gadney wrote:
>Are any of you people alo on the Fred Frith mailing list? It seems totally
>dead! I can't post or do anything. Anybody know what's up?
They've been having a lot of spam problems, and one of the suggestions was
to configure the list so that only subscribers could post to it. Although
I don't *know* anything, I suspect that they're trying to get something
worked out to keep the spam away.
- --
Caleb Deupree
cdeupree@erinet.com
Work like you don't need the money. Love like you've never been hurt. Dance
like nobody's watching.
- -- Satchel Paige
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 15:44:12 -0600 (CST)
From: Tom Benton <rancor@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Jim Black is a Rock Star
Arthur was asking...
> Does he play in anything rock or harder? At one part of his solo he
> played a short *really* powerfull beat, almost punk. I'd like to hear
> him do more of that. Any recommendations?
Check out Alasnoaxis, Jim's freshly released debut recording as a leader
on Winter&Winter. The disc is all over the place, genre-wise, but there
are some portions that rock as hard as anything I'd care to listen to
(though Steve "Morbid Cannibal Angel Corpse" Smith might say differently
of course).
As visions of a metal band of downtown all-stars dance through my head...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 13:50:18 -0800
From: "Daryl Loomis" <DRL@valley-media.com>
Subject: Re: New Variations ?
From what I can tell, the numbered variations are fairly direct arrangement=
s of Bach. The others inspired by. Good album though. I like it more =
than I thought I would.
Daryl Loomis
>>> "Rob, the Belgian guy" <Rob@llaert.NU> 11/07 1:01 PM >>>
Zorn-agains,
Uri Caine's Goldberg Variations, ok, Bach's compositions. Are all the =
songs
based on Bach? Even the one called "Vivaldi" and "Nobody knows the trouble
I've seen"? I'm confused. Help me out ;)
Greetings,
Rob@llaert.NU ________________ www.rob.allaert.com=20
"The goal is to bring the same intensity to listening as the performer to
playing."
- -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 17:13:11 CST
From: "samuel yrui" <nonintention@hotmail.com>
Subject: Milford Graves-Stories
just bought Milford Graves' Stories.
wonderful.
tracklisting:
1. Optical Inversions
2. Speaking to the Spoken
3. Changeable Changes
4. Territorial Moods
5. Continuous Conversations
6. Evolving Pathways
Track Six is exceptionally enlightening.
-samuel
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.
Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at
http://profiles.msn.com.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 22:36:24 -0500
From: Lang Thompson <wlt4@mindspring.com>
Subject: new at Adventures In Sound
http://wlt4.home.mindspring.com/adventures.htm
Up since the last email are:
listening lists from Jon Abbey (Erstwhile Records) and Greg Kelley (Nmperign)
interview with Eugene Chadbourne by Will York
a piece on vallenato, a Columbian accordion music
some thrift store finds by Mimi Meyer
interview with Roscoe Mitchell
review of the Cambodian Rocks album
Also recently added are a section of interesting news and a discography of
documentary sound.
I'm always looking for writers (even previously published pieces are
acceptable). Email me directly if you're interested.
Thanks, Lang
- -------------------------------------------
Adventures In Sound
http://wlt4.home.mindspring.com/adventures.htm
Outsider Music Mailing List
http://wlt4.home.mindspring.com/outsider.htm
Documentary Sound
http://wlt4.home.mindspring.com/adventures/documentary.htm
Full Alert Film Review
http://wlt4.home.mindspring.com/fafr.htm
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 01:01:54 EST
From: Velaires@aol.com
Subject: FOOTLOOSE
Does anybody know if/where Paul Bley's FOOTLOOSE is in print?
skip h
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 10:37:01 GMT+0100
From: "Jeroen de Boer" <usva-th2@bureau.rug.nl>
Subject: Dillinger Escape Plan (was Jim Black is a Rock Star)
I went to a concert of the Dillinger Escape Plan last weekend, and I
think they would be a nice substitute for the 'downtown metal all-
stars. I have never witnessed a concert that was as intense and at
the same time musically amazing as what I witnessed there. More
metal than Prelapse, more jazz than metalbands like Cannibal Corpse
or Morbid Angel. Although I don't know why I make these
comparisons, because DES absolutely stands on it's own. The only
thing I can come up with is a musical thunderstorm that lasts 45
minutes and leaves you grasping for breath. Check these guys out,
because they will definitely change your ideas about extreme music..
(Mmmm, what about DES teaming up with someone like Merzbow..)
Jeroen
> As visions of a metal band of downtown all-stars dance through my head...
- ----------------------------------------
Jeroen de Boer
music director Open Electronic Festival/Cyberslag Foundation
Munnekeholm 10, 9711JA Groningen
The Netherlands
tel/fax: +31 (0)503634676/(0)503632209
gsm: +31 (0)624814506
usva-th2@bureau.rug.nl
http://www.cyberslag.com
- ----------------------------------------
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 10:05:15 +0000 (WET)
From: Ricardo Reis <l43384@alfa.ist.utl.pt>
Subject: Penguin guide...
When you get the 5th edition please tell me if they include Jonh
Lurie. They didn t on the 4th...
thanx,
Ricardo Reis
"NON SERVIAM"
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 05:47:10 EST
From: Jeffcalt@aol.com
Subject: Re: Drummers [reprise]
keith@pfmentum.com writes:
> After seeing Han Bennink last week, I feared seeing Jim Black with
> Eskelin/Parkins last night would prove anti-climactic.
>
> Unfounded fear.
This was only my second time seeing Black (saw him with Uri Caine's Mahler
ensemble a few months ago). He was much more impressive this time. What a
great show. I'd actually never heard Eskelin before, but was really
impressed with his intensity and style.
I was also pleased that the show sold out, particularly after being disgusted
that I was one of only two people to show up on Friday to see Hamiet Bluiett.
Maybe there's hope for L.A. after all.
jeff caltabiano
n.p. chico hamilton w/ eric dolphy: original ellington suite
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 05:48:11 EST
From: Jeffcalt@aol.com
Subject: Re: Drummers [reprise]
dan@state51.co.uk writes:
> btw, anybody heard the recent vandermark/drake/mcbride record:
> "spaceways incorporated: thirteen cosmic standards by sun ra &
> funkadelic" (atavistic)?
Great album. Has some really beautiful moments (the first and last tunes, in
particular) with a lot of heavy funk in between. One of my favorite albums
of the year. Vandermark is really onto something.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 14:41:28 +0100
From: Tim Blechmann <TimBlechmann@gmx.de>
Subject: Der Rote Bereich
Does anyone know the group "Der Rote Bereich"? On one of their CDs
("2"), Jim Black is the drummer. Any opinions about this CD? I don't
really know, what to make of it.
PEACE
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 14:27:14 +0100
From: Tim Blechmann <TimBlechmann@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: tWisT
Tuesday, November 07, 2000, 9:55:16 PM, you wrote:
the> Since we're talking 'bout Jim Black. I really like Carlos Bica's "Twist"
the> with Jim Black and Frank M÷bus on guitar. Carlos plays double bass (what's
the> the difference between contrabass/double bass/upright bass?). Anyone else
the> got this one? I think it's hard to find in the US?
I suppose there are no differences between the instruments. But
several years ago I saw an electric upright bass in a concert (But I
can't remember the musicians). Anyone knowing details about this
instrument?
PEACE
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 08:49:07 -0500
From: "George Scala" <gscala@carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Re: FOOTLOOSE
go to gemm.com and you will see over a dozen vendors selling this cd
George Scala
> Does anybody know if/where Paul Bley's FOOTLOOSE is in print?
>
> skip h
>
> -
>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 13:00:01 EST
From: Nudeants@aol.com
Subject: Re: Dillinger Escape Plan (was Jim Black is a Rock Star)
In a message dated 11/8/00 4:38:37 AM Eastern Standard Time,
usva-th2@bureau.rug.nl writes:
<< I went to a concert of the Dillinger Escape Plan last weekend, and I
think they would be a nice substitute for the 'downtown metal all-
stars. I have never witnessed a concert that was as intense and at
the same time musically amazing as what I witnessed there. More
metal than Prelapse, more jazz than metalbands like Cannibal Corpse
or Morbid Angel. Although I don't know why I make these
comparisons, because DES absolutely stands on it's own. The only
thing I can come up with is a musical thunderstorm that lasts 45
minutes and leaves you grasping for breath. Check these guys out,
because they will definitely change your ideas about extreme music..
(Mmmm, what about DES teaming up with someone like Merzbow..)
>>
Most agreed. Meshuggah is another similar tributary of that river. I
think they've been mentioned before here, actually.
- -matt mitchell
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 13:06:58 EST
From: Nudeants@aol.com
Subject: Re: New Variations ?
In a message dated 11/7/00 4:26:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, Rob@llaert.NU
writes:
<< Uri Caine's Goldberg Variations, ok, Bach's compositions. Are all the songs
based on Bach? Even the one called "Vivaldi" and "Nobody knows the trouble
I've seen"? I'm confused. Help me out ;) >>
Essentially, it seems to me that there are some that are relative
'straightforward' readings, but the link of pretty much the whole album to
the Goldberg Variations conceptually is tenuous at best, I'd say. Not to
mention the fact that he does not even touch some the variations, and most of
those that were 'inspired' actually seem to have nothing whatsoever linked to
the Goldberg; they actually seem more an attempt to show how 'broad-minded'
and 'versatile' he is, and they even fail at doing that.
Actually, I kind of feel that the album is embarrassing, and almost
insulting. A smart business move, though; he definitely does seem to be
cashing in, touring a 40-piece choir across Europe, etc.
- -matt mitchell
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 19:12:35 -0000
From: "Alastair Wilson" <wilsonah@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Penguin guide...
No John Lurie. Or David Torn or Mark Isham's Silent Way Project or Bill
Bruford's Earthworks. But big AMM, Derek Bailey sections and the Chicago
Underground Duo/Trio are in. "Jazz" gets harder and harder to define.
First spotted error: Two different reviews (with differing star ratings) of
"Towards The Margins" by the Evan Parker ElectroAcoustic Ensemble. Shall I
tell them?;-)
First time I've bought this after years of library consulting. Looking
forward to discovering more great music through it.
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Ricardo Reis <l43384@alfa.ist.utl.pt>
To: <zorn-list@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2000 10:05 AM
Subject: Penguin guide...
>
> When you get the 5th edition please tell me if they include Jonh
> Lurie. They didn t on the 4th...
>
> thanx,
>
> Ricardo Reis
>
> "NON SERVIAM"
>
>
> -
>
>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 11:47:07 -0800
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: special offer on Bobby Previte's web site...
Finally some activity on Bobby Previte's web site. Under the
name "chance", Bobby makes the following offer:
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"LIMITED EDITION CD OFFER
This is the first in a series of CD's which be sold only on the web. Each
CD is a highest quality recording by Bongo Dali and Key Command, collecti-
vely known as Swami Late Plate.
These recordings will be collectors items as quantities will be limited.
Each CD is hand signed by the artists.
CD number one, "CANTO I" is available now.
Click below to download a sample.
[buttons to select among three samples]
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Does anybody know about this "Swami Late Plate"?
Thanks,
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 15:20:06 -0500
From: "michelle mercer" <m.mercer@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: New Variations ?
I'm usually a list lurker, a passive beneficiary of your knowledgeable
discussions. But now the opportunity to play Mr. Caine's apologist has
finally seduced me into posting. In full disclosure I should probably
mention that I've reviewed Caine's Variations for publication a couple
times.
What it is: The original Goldberg Variations is a solo piano piece based on
a catchy 32-bar aria and composed of thirty inventive treatments of that
theme. Employing BachÆs own musical methods, Caine selected some of the
original thirty variations and interspersed them with over thirty more of
his own fabrication.
The way I hear it: Caine found sure footing in BachÆs theme and variations
model, which is not such a far cry from a jazz chartÆs format. CaineÆs
variations, no matter how far-flung, are almost always within reach of BachÆ
s original 32-bar harmonyùbut as a jazz musician Caine is accustomed to
improvising over a headÆs succession of prescribed chords. So the 32-bar
harmony is the link to the original. If Caine's dizzying genre shifts can
obscure this basic underlying pattern, repeated listenings might reveal how
Caine keeps his stylistic peculiarities under formal control.
Caine does sometimes seem to expect his listeners to be musicologists: some
knowledge of the source compositionùand of BachÆs entire oeuvreùis almost
requisite for really meaningful listening. I didn't get it until I'd
listened to Caine's variations while I followed along with Bach's score. But
Caine told me he hoped you might enjoy the parodies of Rachmaninoff and
Mozart Variations as individual tunes, even if you don't know what's being
sent up, or how those Variations conform to Bach's harmonic structure. No
matter how you hear the recording, I don't think there's anything
embarrassing about any one of the variations; he pulls off all styles pretty
capably. But maybe Matt means that Caine's display of his own broad
stylistic conversance amounts to a kind of embarrassment of riches?
Finally, mercenary motives would have necessarily figured into this
project's recording, and its release during a Big Bach anniversary year is
no coincidence. But that's as much Stefan Winter's business as it is
Caine's. And the performing choirs on tour are typically local pick-up
groups.
Michelle
- -----Original Message-----
From: Nudeants@aol.com <Nudeants@aol.com>
To: Rob@llaert.nu <Rob@llaert.nu>; zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
<zorn-list@lists.xmission.com>
Date: Wednesday, November 08, 2000 1:07 PM
Subject: Re: New Variations ?
>In a message dated 11/7/00 4:26:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, Rob@llaert.NU
>writes:
>
><< Uri Caine's Goldberg Variations, ok, Bach's compositions. Are all the
songs
> based on Bach? Even the one called "Vivaldi" and "Nobody knows the trouble
> I've seen"? I'm confused. Help me out ;) >>
>
>
>Essentially, it seems to me that there are some that are relative
>'straightforward' readings, but the link of pretty much the whole album to
>the Goldberg Variations conceptually is tenuous at best, I'd say. Not to
>mention the fact that he does not even touch some the variations, and most
of
>those that were 'inspired' actually seem to have nothing whatsoever linked
to
>the Goldberg; they actually seem more an attempt to show how 'broad-minded'
>and 'versatile' he is, and they even fail at doing that.
>
>Actually, I kind of feel that the album is embarrassing, and almost
>insulting. A smart business move, though; he definitely does seem to be
>cashing in, touring a 40-piece choir across Europe, etc.
>
>-matt mitchell
>
>-
>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 15:23:05 EST
From: Velaires@aol.com
Subject: Re: Re: New Variations ?
MIchelle --
That was extremely well-said. Matt in the past has expressed displeasure
about Uri's discs, a few bordering on attacks on his (Uri's) integrity. At
most, I think Uri should probably have indicated what the more far-flung
ideas were based on. It would have stopped a lot of people from saying he
wrote stuff that had no connection to Bach.
skip h
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 15:30:42 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Now that she's unlurked (was Re: New Variations ?)
michelle mercer wrote:
> I'm usually a list lurker, a passive beneficiary of your knowledgeable
> discussions.
I advise everyone to take a moment and read Michelle's lucid review of Cecil
Taylor and Tony Oxley in this week's Village Voice; she was at the same set as
me, Ken and Jon and was the journalist I mentioned who laughed out loud with me
at one point, as I mentioned in my own post.
Go here: http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0045/sotc.shtml
Scroll down past the Gary Lucas review to find Michelle's piece. Oh, wait,
this is the Zornlist. READ the Gary Lucas piece and then keep going.
Michelle's insightful New York Times feature on Uri Caine, for which I seem to
remember posting a link here when it was new, is still on the Times website.
But unfortunately, if you missed it, it's now in the archives and will cost you
$2.50 to retrieve. Go to your library and look up the September 17 issue
instead.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 15:41:28 -0500
From: "Jesse Kudler" <jkudler@mail.wesleyan.edu>
Subject: Re: Now that she's unlurked (was Re: New Variations ?)
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Smith" <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
> Michelle's insightful New York Times feature on Uri Caine, for which I
seem to
> remember posting a link here when it was new, is still on the Times
website.
> But unfortunately, if you missed it, it's now in the archives and will
cost you
> $2.50 to retrieve. Go to your library and look up the September 17 issue
> instead.
If anyone really wants a copy, I could e-mail it to you. I get free
lexis-nexus at school. Reply off-list, of course.
- -Jesse
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V3 #157
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