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Zorn List Digest       Saturday, October 7 2000       Volume 03 : Number 103



In this issue:
-
       drummers
       Resonance (actual Zorn content)
       Odp: cool your jets, fogies
       re: again, I disagree
       Re: Francisco Lopez
       Re: Francisco Lopez
       Great norwegian music(No Zorn content.... naturally)
       Re: Frederic Rzewski recomendations
       week of small miracles
       Odp: Mingus Slays Marxist
       Odp: Re[2]: violin,Feldman and Vandermark, Age
       Re: newie/feldman
       Re: Francisco Lopez
       instruments(not liking them)
       Goran Bregovic again / Re: List demographics

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 15:03:36 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: drummers

skip heller wrote:
<<Should you need to talk to a technically adept Ringo-worshipping drummer,
who
could probably better explain Ringo's contribution to the literature of
drumming, Joey Baron has a lot of praise to heap in that area.>>


For what it's worth, I understand kenny aronoff, johnny cougar mellancamps
longtime drummer has done technical analyses of Ringo's drumming in Modern
Drummer magazine on more than one occasion.

jb





- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2000 21:22:36 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Resonance (actual Zorn content)

the new issue of Resonance is out this week. it's a special double issue
commemorating the 25th anniversary of the LMC, including a double CD of
previously unissued archive material, including a Zorn/David Toop track. more
info at:

www.l-m-c.org.uk/resonance/vol.8.2.html

Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com





- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 08:59:40 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: cool your jets, fogies

- ----- Original Message -----
From: <[e-mail]>

> meanwhile, i'm now reading celine and spent last night and this morning

which one?
Marcin Gokieli
[e-mail] [e-mail]







- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 17:53:46 -0400
From: Richard Ladew <[e-mail]>
Subject: re: again, I disagree

Kurt:

I blurted out the Denardo thing, but I didn't really mean it as a huge
slam,
more to get some discussion going on about it.  His playing is
definitely
inspired and "in the right place" so to speak.  It was just that at the
time I
was thinking about this drumming thread, everybody was naming all the
"supergods" so to speak, and for some reason, the 12 year old Denardo
popped
into my head.  Not a fair comparison whatsoever.  I just mentioned it
for fun
and difference

NP:Kid A (still Radiohead, although I did dig out the Empty
Foxhole..I'll listen
to it next.)
NR: Hiphop america , Nelson George

From: [e-mail]
> Subject: again i disagree (perpetual drummer thread)
>
> who was it that said
> Perhaps Denardo Coleman (Empty Foxhole -Blue Note)
> though, I really like that album anyway...... (?)
>
> empty foxhole is one of my fave ornette albums, if only because it
stands
> out so
> much from the oovre. there's a genius naivete, a sorta savant quality
to it,
> wide-eyed discovery feeling due to 12-year-old or so denardo's playing
as
> well
> as ornette's first session on violin (trumpet as well? somebody help
me.).
> but i
> don't mean to say it's a novelty record. it's a strong record,
propelled by
> a
> competent and innovative drummer. so there.
>
> not sure how far beyond this prodigy status denardo propelled,
however. i'll
> acccept that apparently he's a genius engineer or something, but he
> continues to
> be a good-only, not that provocative drummer today. i guess.
>
> kg
> np: ma/meyer/o'connor - appalachian journey
>
- --
Rich Ladew: [e-mail]
www.home.earthlink.net/~ladewtangclan
PCP House Of Coffee: The best in modern, experimental and creative music

WUNH 91.3fm  Monday evenings 8-9 p.m.(EST)
Real Audio at www.wunh.unh.edu



- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 18:09:21 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Francisco Lopez

Don't  necessarily heed to that "it's all silence" response. People like
Lopez and Bernhard Gunter are much more sensual composers than someone who
"just made silence". It's not silence for silence's sake, it's part of the
composition, and their compositions include a considerable amount of subtlety
and thought that is not apparent in a lot of music these days. However, Caleb
brings up an interesting point, most of the time my house isn't quiet enough
for me to listen to those artists. My toilet will start making sounds or the
bugs outside will make too much noise. I really wonder how people who work in
the same field as Gunter expect you to block out all of the distractions.
from,
matt
http://www.mp3.com/mattwellins

- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 18:33:26 -0400
From: Brian Olewnick <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Francisco Lopez

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Don't  necessarily heed to that "it's all silence" response. People like
> Lopez and Bernhard Gunter are much more sensual composers than someone who
> "just made silence". It's not silence for silence's sake, it's part of the
> composition, and their compositions include a considerable amount of subtlety
> and thought that is not apparent in a lot of music these days. However, Caleb
> brings up an interesting point, most of the time my house isn't quiet enough
> for me to listen to those artists. My toilet will start making sounds or the
> bugs outside will make too much noise. I really wonder how people who work in
> the same field as Gunter expect you to block out all of the distractions.

I think I've mentioned this before, but though I tend to try and listen
to "quiet" composers late at night, the fact that I'm in a NYC apartment
always necessitates a certain amount of ambient noise. The fascinating
thing is when I'm unable to determine whether the noise is ambient or
from the disc. When I first played the Gunter/Duncan disc, "Home,
Unspeakable", I distinctly remember my shock upon realizing that sounds
I assumed to be ambient all of a sudden ended when the disc stopped.

Brian Olewnick

NP: Cornelius Cardew - The Great Learning (Superb!)

- -

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 07 Oct 2000 01:54:31 CEST
From: "Marius Ergo" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Great norwegian music(No Zorn content.... naturally)

Everyone should check out www.runegrammofon.com! It`s an amazing norwegian
label, with tons of even more amazing music. I`m not here to preach the
gospel of norwegian experimental music, but check out the audio-clips and
tell me what you think. Nils Aukland`s "Straum" is great, and Supersilent`s
"4" is probably my favourite record of all time. Check it out!

- -Marius
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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http://profiles.msn.com.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 19:58:00 -0400
From: Brian Olewnick <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Frederic Rzewski recomendations

Some Rzewski releases:

Coming Together/Attica/Les Moulons de Panurge (Opus One)

Only available on vinyl, AFAIK. Wonderful recording from 1973. I've seen
CT performed a couple of times, but the speaker's passion is key and
neither of the performances measured up to Steven ben Israel's work
here; the man positively trembles with conviction. 'Attica' is a
beautiful, ultimately chilling piece where a single spoken line is
additively pieced out word by word. 'Les Moutons...' is a lovely
gamelan/minimalist number. Performers include Karl Berger, Alvin Curran,
Garrett List and Jon Gibson. Needs to be issued to disc.

No Place to Go but Around (Finnadar). A fantastic solo piano recording
of one of Rzewski's best (though underperformed) pieces, something of a
predecessor to 'The People United...'. (It is being performed next
weekend in NYC by another pianist whose name escapes me). Also includes
pieces by Braxton and Hans Eisler. Again, I don't believe this has been
issued on disc.

The People United...Well, the hat ART recording by Rzewski himself (now,
very unfortunately, out of print) is possibly my single favorite release
ever, so I'm a bit prejudiced but....what a beautiful composition! Can't
say enough about it. Our own Steven Drury has recorded, imho, the next
best version which is very great in and of itself (on New Albion),
surpassing, I think, Ursula Oppens' original Vanguard recording. There
are also at least two or three other versions, including one by the
wonderful Aki Takahashi, that I've yet to hear.

Song and Dance--(Nonesuch, 1979) is an unusual piece, scored for flute,
clarinet/bass clarinet, contrabass and vibraphone. Very jazzy, plenty of
echoes of Dolphy and altogether enjoyable. On the vinyl issue, it shares
an album with a pretty nice John Harbison composition, "The Flower-Fed
Buffaloes".

Four Pieces/Ballad No. 3 (Vanguard, 1980) Solo Rzewski again, performing
post TPUWNBD pieces that begin to venture back into somewhat more
abstract territory while retaining his core romanticism. Ballad No. 3 is
one of his "Four North American Ballads", this one based on the song
"Which Side Are You On?", about which see more below.

Four North American Ballads - originally recorded by Paul Jacobs on a
1980 Nonesuch album (also containing nice work by Bolcom and Copland),
these are spectacularly beautiful compositions, all based on older
American themes generally associated with the labor movement. Again, for
my money the finest renditions are by Rzewski himself on the hat ART
recording "Four North American Ballads/Squares" but this is also out of
print. The final ballad, "Winnsboro Cotton Mill Blues" is an incredible
tour de force and has been recorded several times by other pianists.

Antigone-Legend (CRI, 1987). With this recording, for soprano and piano,
Rzewski made a decided shift back to more atonal, angular writing. It's
fairly severe and the vocal writing is a bit declamatory for my taste
but it retains some dramatic power.

Bumps (Newport Classic, 1995) includes three compositions, "Bumps",
"Andante con Moto" and "The Turtle and the Crane". The title piece is
dedicated to Steve Lacy and uses Lacy-like short phrases in an elaborate
pattern to construct a whole. The Andante is a sequence of variations on
a theme by Beethoven, both romantic and humorous.

De Profundis (hat NOW, 1993) is a powerful work for speaking pianist
(Rzewski), using jail-written text by Oscar Wilde. Anthony de Mare, who
has also recorded the piece, gave one of the most moving performances
I've ever seen on this at The Kitchen a few years back.  This recording
also includes Rzewski's lovely 'Sonata'.

A Decade (OO Discs, 1994) is a recording by the ensemble Zeitgeist of
four pices, "Wails", "Spots", "The Lost Melody" and "Crusoe". I'm
blanking on details from this--have to listen again!

New Works (Music & Arts, 1997) includes the beginning of his ongoing
composition, "The Road" (I think he's up to around Part 41 these days),
a lovely, loose wandering piece; "Whangdoodles", an appropriately wacky
number performed by the Abel-Steinberg-Winant trio; and "To the Earth",
an extremely beautiful work for a percussionist playing flower pots and
reciting Homer (!).

Night Crossing (Music & Arts, 1997) is, I think, his most recent
release. Teamed with Ursula Oppens on the title track and on a two-piano
rendition of "Winnsboro Cotton Mill Blues"--very strong. Also includes
his finely etched book of preludes, which he calls "Ludes".

There, that's the sum total of my Rzewski knowledge, meager though it
is. I'd only add that, in addition to being an extraordinary composer,
he's possibly the most jaw-droppingly astonishing pianist this side of
Cecil Taylor. Check him out.

Brian Olewnick

NP: Yankee/Oakland pre-game!

- -

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2000 06:48:49 +0200
From: "Francesco Martinelli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: week of small miracles

anyone interested in this music/sound experiment field should try to get the
new cd by (?) Peter Cusack which is part of a project dedicated to an
interestin area of London, out of Tottenham, the Lea River Valley. It's full
of great sounds, interviews, and a bit of playing/playback that includes a
tape of Thurston Moore played under a train arch. I can't stop listen to it,
it's really a great aural experience, slightly melancholy and wet.
more info at
www.smallmiracles.org.uk
or
www.l-m-c.org.uk



- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 09:45:50 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: Mingus Slays Marxist

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Scott Handley <[e-mail]>

> Don't die Kurt!  If you wait till 2002 to die, you can
> hear

Yeah. Kurt, DO NOT DIE :-)

> Miles Davis Juan Le Pins Sessions (Columbia) 2 CDs -
> 2002

What is that?

> - July 1969 concerts with Shorter, Corea, Holland, and
> DeJohnette. The second concert is unissued.

and where is the first one issued?
And what about the plans to release the full versions of at filmore west?

> Miles Davis Tribute To Jack Johnson Sessions
> (Columbia) box set - 200x

Will it include only the JJ sessions, or something more in the post- bitchec
brew period? I think there should be tons of material left, as many MD
albums from the 70s were hardly released.
Are there any plans for releasing the filles de killimanjaro - in a silent
way - etc boxed set (the period between the quintet and BB)?

Marcin Gokieli
[e-mail] [e-mail]



- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 09:46:04 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: Re[2]: violin,Feldman and Vandermark, Age

From: Tim Blechmann <[e-mail]>

> Does anyone know OPEN LAND by John Abercrombie? I just know one track
> from a promo cd.

Could i get some abercrombie - recommendation from you all zlisters? Thanks,
Marcin Gokieli
[e-mail] [e-mail]
Generally speaking, if a philosopher offers to 'dissolve' the problem you
are working on, tell him to go climb a tree - Jerry Fodor



- -

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 07 Oct 2000 00:51:34 -0700
From: Jim Flannery <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: newie/feldman

Marius Ergo wrote:
>
> Could someone reccomend me something by Morton Feldman? I haven`t heard much
> of his stuff, but the few pieces I`ve heard are amazing.

For starters, I'd go with _For Samuel Beckett_, which does the most
characteristic Feldmanesque things with dynamics, rhythm and repetition, but
with a larger ensemble ... I dunno, for me the flute's not my favorite
instrument so there're things to "get over" on the way to appreciating some of
his central works (yes, I know, it's a personal failing; we all have a couple).
I have a particular warm spot for the SF Contemporary Players recording on
Newport.

Not what I'd recommend as an intro because of the price, but I am devastated by
the John Tilbury recordings of the (nearly-) complete piano music, a 4-cd box on
LondonHALL; Tilbury is so far inside the later works (esp. _Bunita Marcus_) that
it's not as if he's playing them so much as he's breathing them (or, even,
*emanating* them).

- --
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Flannery                                        [e-mail]

         "My hair has grown thin thinking of music."
                                             -- I Wayan Lotring

- -

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2000 10:33:05 +0200 (CEST)
From: Oger <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Francisco Lopez

>From: Brian Olewnick <[e-mail]>
>
>Consistent with my usual habit of taking a few years to at last getting
>around to hearing someone, I finally picked up a disc by Francisco
>Lopez, his 'Untitled #89' on Touch (fortuitously thrust into my hands by
>Tom Pratt at OM). I like it a great deal--kind of like being in the
>center of a turbine engine for forty minutes, though the final 18 or so
>minutes of silence seems...extreme (or is it silence?; have to listen
>again more closely). Anyway, I'd appreciate hearing other Lopez
>recommendations. Thanks.
>
>Brian Olewnick
>


I don't know Lopez very well.
I know he had recorded in forests (Costa Rica, V2 label in Holland).
He has made records on different labels: Trente Oiseaux, Staalplaat,
Sonoris, Table of elements. You can buy them on mail order list Metamkine
(very comprehensive) : http://metamkine.free.fr/

BTW, maybe in the same kind of music, I recently listened to something I
like very much : "White-yellow-black" by Rolf JULIUS. He records animals
outside and adds some electronic treatment. He made 3 CDs on his own label
: Small Music (He is german). Available on Metamkine too.

Jacques Oger

np : Marginal Consort/Collective improvisation (PSF Records)




- -

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 07 Oct 2000 12:49:33 CEST
From: "Marius Ergo" <[e-mail]>
Subject: instruments(not liking them)

Jim Flannery wrote:

>I dunno, for me the flute's not my favorite
>instrument so there're things to "get over" on the way to appreciating some
>of
>his central works (yes, I know, it's a personal failing; we all have a
>couple).

Yes, I know exactly what you mean! Not that I don`t like the flute, I love
it, but I`ve always reaaaally HATED the friggin pan flute. I think this is
because of all the released double CD-sets with what`s-his-face-old
failed-musician playing "I Will Always Love You"- You know, so called "Pan
Pipe Moods" Total elevator muzak!
Anyway, I`ve found recently that maybe my prejudice towards this instrument
is a bit .....um prejudgemental(duh). Not long ago, I had the privelege to
attend a course by four Bolivian musicians. It was a real basic "this is our
music" kind of workshop, but man, these guys could play those awful
instruments. They even played some Morricone. It made me want to find out
more about the instrument.
I have friends who hate the clarinet and the trombone, but that`s probably
just `cause those instruments are "uncool".

- -Marius

_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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- -

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 07 Oct 2000 12:52:18 +0200
From: Fritz Feger <[e-mail]>
Subject: Goran Bregovic again / Re: List demographics

Some weeks ago there were some posts on Goran Bregovic. I'm gonna work with
him from november through january at Thalia Theater in Hamburg, so if
there's anything anyone wants me to ask him...

My demographics: 32, male (and, FWIW, back at like basic black jeans and
white T-shirts since I realized how an overly dramatic outfit takes
everyone's mind off my interesting and expressive face, not to speak of my
truly inspired playing).

By the way, nice to hear from Tom Pratt; I've been wondering where he's gone.

Fritz.

np: Richard Galliano & i solisti dell'orchestra della Toscana: passatori
(beautiful)
nr: Michel Houellebecq: Elementarteilchen (frustrating)


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V3 #103
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