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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #98
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Thursday, October 5 2000 Volume 03 : Number 098
In this issue:
-
cool your jets, fogies
Mingus Presents Mingus
a night of brecht, oct. 14
Re: new Random Acoustics releases
a cage so easily rattled requires rattling
next batch of Unheard Music Series releases
Re: a cage so easily rattled requires rattling
Bruce Eisenbeil Trio at the Old Office TONIGHT
Re: percussion + electronics (cf. Lytton) (sorry, long)
Re: next batch of Unheard Music Series releases
personal opinion
Re: a cage so easily rattled requires rattling
Quine/Maher/Prelapse
Philip Johnston's Transparent Quartet
Re: Quine/Maher/Prelapse
Re: Quine/Maher/Prelapse
Re: Quine/Maher/Prelapse
Re: Philip Johnston's Transparent Quartet
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2000 11:05:33 -0500
From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com
Subject: cool your jets, fogies
jon:
personally, I don't find you entertaining, just a waste of my time and
bandwidth. please stop sending cutesy, smarmy oneliners into hundreds of
other people's e-mail boxes.
matt:
Sigmund, no one wants you around here anymore.
No one here gets frustrated about differences of opinion.
We're all thornless roses around here you prick.
Kurt:
y'all, this ain' necessary. i imagine at other times you've noticed that silly
threads end and frequent posters tend to level off. i'm not sure if we have
etiquette rules here. i would say that genuinely offensive remarks (gender race
religion sexuality stuff) and spam are impolite, but i would hope that
loudmouthed goofiness could at least be tolerated. cripes, it don' really hurt
you, do it?
and even if it does, could i ask you, matt, not to speak for everyone. jon might
have just ignored the absurd bastard, but at least he made it clear that he was
only stating his opinion. i personally enjoyed the seamonster's banter and liked
playing along a little, and i assumed by today it would taper. and i imagine
some of the hundreds of us saw messages from me and said 'sheesh, shut the fuck
up, what's shelley berman got to do with anything.'
personally, i don't care who old everyone on this list is, for example, and i've
never even thought about it before. but so what? those are just the posts that i
scan past.
IT'S OK.
meanwhile, i'm now reading celine and spent last night and this morning
listening intently to morton feldman's 4cd 'for philip guston.' both of those
are pretty directly from things i've picked up here, and i'm enjoying both
immensely. goofy loudmouths will not ruin this list, nor will they destroy your
hard drive. i hope people new to the music and ideas we discuss here will
continue to feel free to post their questions and ideas, and if they gots
attitude, i hope they feel free to show it.
kg
np: return of the repressed: the john fahey anthology
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2000 11:51:45 -0500
From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com
Subject: Mingus Presents Mingus
MartinMentioned:
I believe this is currently available on Candid CCD 79005 "Charles Mingus
Presents Charles Mingus."
that plus information obtained from this useful website maintained, i believe,
by some zlister here:
http://home.att.net/~lankina/jazz/upcomingcds.html
that mingus presents mingus will be reissued by candid on 10/24, makes me wonder
if anyone knows anything about the reissue. this has been my favorite mingus
album for 15 years and will be till i breathe my last breath. the quartet is
kill! were it to come out with added material, i think surely i would die.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2000 15:44:09 -0500
From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com
Subject: a night of brecht, oct. 14
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 11:52:48 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: Re: new Random Acoustics releases
In a message dated 10/5/00 7:25:34 AM, cdeupree@erinet.com writes:
<< Not that we don't like buying cds from you, but Cadence distributed RA
before. Are they not on the distribution list for the label this time
around? >>
I'm sure you're right, North Country will probably stock all four titles.,
but Lehn owed me a bunch of CDs from our last trade. I'll be selling mine for
$10 plus $1 shipping in the US.
Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 05 Oct 2000 12:15:29 -0500
From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com
Subject: a cage so easily rattled requires rattling
in response to the suggestion made that jon abbey's opinions and use of
bandwidth are more valid because he's smart and started a label (and with no
offense meant toward jon, who is indeed smart and did start a label), bullshit!
innocuous (if abundunt) comments made by one sigmund have made this place start
to look ugly. no, there is absolutely no merit system of posting. sheezus! no,
we don't kick folks like s. off because we don't like their jokes or whatever.
often times there's things here that i find boring, ridiculous or even above my
head. i ignore them. it's pretty freakin easy. those that choose to evaluate the
worth of other list members (especially, might i add, someone who i'm pretty
sure is younger than his naysayers and seems genuinely interested in flexing
some opinions and seeing what happens) should keep their evaluations to their
own g-d selves.
who was it that quoted thumper earlier? here here.
kg
np: dominic duval/jason kao hwang - the experiment
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 12:19:18 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: next batch of Unheard Music Series releases
wow, these guys are really cranking them out. this bunch is due in early 2001:
HAL RUSSELL'S CHEMICAL FEAST: ELIXIR COLLECTION (Unheard Music 203CD)
PETER BROTZMANN: FUCK DE BOERE (Unheard Music 211CD)
JOE McPHEE: TRINITY REISSUE (Unheard Music 214CD)
LUTHER THOMAS: FUNKY DONKEY REISSUE (Unheard Music 215CD)
ROVA SAXOPHONE QUARTET: AS WAS REISSUE (Unheard Music 216CD)
Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 09:22:58 -0700
From: "s~Z" <keith@pfmentum.com>
Subject: Re: a cage so easily rattled requires rattling
>>>no, there is absolutely no merit system of posting.<<<
If there is no merit system for posting why are you giving people who
express opinions different from yours such a hard time?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 12:23:33 EDT
From: Eisenbeil@aol.com
Subject: Bruce Eisenbeil Trio at the Old Office TONIGHT
Hello Friends,
Just a brief note to remind you of tonights concert. The details are below.
I hope to see you.
Peace and best wishes,
Bruce
www.eisenbeil.com
- -------------------------------------
"Leading a trio, the young guitarist has an infectiously complicated style of
trampling chords and wiggy lines that dart like bats with an attitude. This
gig is made intriguing by his Ellington adaptation and the support of the
great
drummer Andrew Cyrille and bassist Jaribu Shahid."
- --- Gary Giddins, Village Voice October 10, 2000
Jaribu Shahid was called last week to begin a 3 week tour in Europe with David
Murray. Nice work if you can get it. The multi-talented Leon Dorsey is with
us tomorrow.
On Thursday, October 5th at 8:00 & 9:30 p.m., Bruce Eisenbeil's ON POINT jazz
trio will perform at the Knitting Factory in the Old Office which is located
at 74 Leonard St, New York City, telephone: 212-219-3006. The group
includes leader Bruce Eisenbeil on guitar, Leon Dorsey on bass and special
guest Andrew Cyrille on drums. Tickets are $8 plus a one drink minimum.
Convenient public transportation is available via C, E trains to Canal
Street; 1, 9 trains to Franklin Street; 4,5,6 trains to City Hall.
Ferocity, originality and subtlety describe this trio's music. Cutting edge
guitarist, Bruce Eisenbeil will feature his original compositions along with
unique renditions of tunes by Duke Ellington and Bud Powell. Eisenbeil has
released 2 critically acclaimed CD's and he has been called one of the most
unique jazz guitarists to emerge in decades. With a clear dark tone his
playing is a force of direct action. He has performed and recorded with
David Murray, William Parker, Bob Moses, Edgar Bateman, Mat Maneri and many
others.
Leon Dorsey has performed and recorded with Art Blakey, Lional Hampton, Muhal
Richard Abrams, Dizzy Gillespie, John Lewis, Cassandra Wilson, Wynton
Marsalis and others. He is a powerful bassist who can lay down a bouyant
groove one minute and then fly into virtuosic kinetics the next. His latest
CD as a leader is "Song of Songs".
From very early on drummer Andrew Cyrille contributed to some of the most
controversial, influential and ultimately important music of the second half
of the 20th century. His 11-year tenure with Cecil Taylor has proven to be
one of the most original collaborations in jazz. He has released over 25
recordings as a leader and has appeared on several dozen recordings as a
sideman.
HOPE TO SEE YOU ! ! !
For more info visit: www.eisenbeil.com
WHO:
Bruce Eisenbeil's ON POINT TRIO
Bruce Eisenbeil - guitar
Leon Dorsey - bass
special guest Andrew Cyrille - drums
WHEN:
Thursday, October 5
2 sets: 8 & 9:30 pm
WHERE:
Knitting Factory
- - Old Office -
74 Leonard Street, NYC
tel: 212-219-3006
cover: $8
TRANSPORTATION:
C, E trains to Canal Street
1, 9 trains to Franklin Street
4,5,6 trains to City Hall
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 18:33:55 +0200
From: "Francesco Martinelli" <f.martinelli@comune.pisa.it>
Subject: Re: percussion + electronics (cf. Lytton) (sorry, long)
The Fetch w/ Lovens. (PoTorch8) 1984. also free improv. also listed as
percussion and live-electronics. this one complete unedited performances
recorded at the Improv. Symposium in Pisa
Concert promoted by your truly, so you can guess age and dress style.
Francesco
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 05 Oct 2000 12:39:02 -0400
From: wlt4@mindspring.com
Subject: Re: next batch of Unheard Music Series releases
>PETER BROTZMANN: FUCK DE BOERE (Unheard Music 211CD)
I'm sure we'll know before long but who is/was De Boere and why would anybody want to copulate with him/her/it?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 13:11:52 EDT
From: Brennansf@aol.com
Subject: personal opinion
Well said.
> He's expressing
> his opinion as everyone else does, and I can't see why his
> one-liners are so much worse than the ongoing jokes about age and
> clothes etc ...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 10:48:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott Handley <thesubtlebody@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: a cage so easily rattled requires rattling
- --- kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote:
>no, there is absolutely no merit
> system of posting. sheezus! no,
> we don't kick folks like s. off because we don't
> like their jokes or whatever.
> often times there's things here that i find boring,
> ridiculous or even above my
> head. i ignore them.
This might be a worthwhile discussion to have once in
a while; getting "meta-list" might be a good way to
evaluate our priorities and hammer out things that
might otherwise flame up unproductively, and to
palatably test old parameters and negotiate some new
ones. Until the iron fist of Rizzi descends and
reduces us all to rubble and then we start again
post-apocalypse. (Kidding!) That said: lots of
people seem to subscribe to a peculiar brand of
politesse that comes to mind when I hear hear Thumper
talking about being "nice". What does "nice" mean?
Rather, "nice" isn't "mean" at all, but can't that
quote mean "go with the flow, eschew controversy," etc
etc ad anauseum? I'm sure that's not what Kurt means,
or the original quoter, but I'm a little uncertain why
anyone responded to Sigmund's inanities at all. When
I say something stupid on-list, usually I'm treated to
polite silence. The point is taken. I can't even
remember how this started, except that Sigmund had the
wrong idea and was sying some dumb things, and instead
of being treated to disregard, some of the brightest
and most insightful people on the list became flamey
and incite-ful. How much better would have been a
personal e.mail---at most---to the person in question,
saying, "I think your content belongs elsewhere.
Please stick to relevant topics." SOmeone too
bull-headed to _get it_ after a few such e.mails will
eventually be asked to leave by the authorities (who
are, in this case, probably healthfully anarchic---who
needs efficiency anyway? let the fascists have it!).
Anyway, I can't believe I'm writing this in such
painful goddamned detail. Ya'll are SHARP FOLKS! Why
on earth is such a swell bunch of adventurers spending
so much energy on a fluke? Hasn't anyone seen
percussions using live electronics?
I love you
- -----s, as in scott, not as in sigmund
, sometimes a cigar really is a....well...
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
http://photos.yahoo.com/
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 18:55:10 +0100
From: "Alastair Wilson" <wilsonah@hotmail.com>
Subject: Quine/Maher/Prelapse
Maurice Rickard said, re: Quine/Maher's "Basic"
> What's not to like about it? Sure, it's not bursting out all over
> the place with Quine solos (okay, that could be a source of your
> disappointment), and it's got that 80s up-front Linn drum thing
> (possibly another), but there's a great interplay between guitars
> (yup, Fred plays, too) and there _are_ some hot Quine solos <snip>
The drum sound really gets my goat - what was it with the early/mid eighties
and electronic drums? It was also the first time I'd heard Quine away from
Zorn (or Zorn-related stuff, "Painted Deserts" with Mori/Ribot I liked) and
I suppose I would have liked a bit more rock'n'roll soloing. It's all a
matter of opinion, and I was just saying it disappointed me. Still, I should
have known...name me a good rock oriented record that came out in 1984!
To come in on the Prelapse thread: I picked the CD up second hand and like
it a lot. But it raises a question in my mind - why was it released on
Avant? They're from Boston, as far as I know they're not especially big in
Japan, and if Zorn likes them so much why can't he give them a release on
Tzadik? Would the CD have cost more than $5000 to record? I can't see why.
Releasing a CD on Avant surely limits the amount of buyers outside Japan.
You have to be really certain you're gonna like it (or be a Zorn completist)
to pay the import price. Even second hand it was $16. I seem to remember
Alex from the band posting occasionally in the past - if you're still here,
can you shed any light on all this?
Alastair
NP: Richard Hell & The Voidoids - Destiny Street (with some kickass Quine
solos)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 13:02:23 -0500 (EST)
From: Adam Taylor Tierney <attierne@indiana.edu>
Subject: Philip Johnston's Transparent Quartet
Hey, I'm looking for information on Philip Johnston and the web
has failed me, so I thought I'd draw on the scarily inclusive reservoir of
music information that is this list. His quartet is playing near me in
Indiana and I hear that he's played at the Knitting Factory; I've never
heard of him, but I thought you guys might have some information since he
appears to come from the New York scene. Apparently his quartet is
accompanying seven short films by Georges Melies, which sounds intriguing.
Anyway, any information would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Adam Tierney
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 05 Oct 2000 18:04:58 GMT
From: "Alastair Wilson" <wilsonah@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Quine/Maher/Prelapse
I said, about ten minutes ago:
>..name me a good rock oriented record that came out in 1984!
Well, apart from Husker Du's "Zen Arcade", obviously...
Alastair (feeling a bit sheepish)
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.
Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at
http://profiles.msn.com.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 13:24:53 -0400
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
Subject: Re: Quine/Maher/Prelapse
On Thu, Oct 05, 2000 at 06:55:10PM +0100, Alastair Wilson wrote:
> The drum sound really gets my goat - what was it with the early/mid eighties
> and electronic drums? It was also the first time I'd heard Quine away from
> Zorn (or Zorn-related stuff, "Painted Deserts" with Mori/Ribot I liked) and
> I suppose I would have liked a bit more rock'n'roll soloing. It's all a
> matter of opinion, and I was just saying it disappointed me. Still, I should
> have known...name me a good rock oriented record that came out in 1984!
King Crimson: Three of a Perfect Pair
- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Jerusaklyn http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 14:09:03 -0400
From: Maurice Rickard <maurice@mac.com>
Subject: Re: Quine/Maher/Prelapse
At 6:55 PM +0100 10/5/00, Alastair Wilson wrote, re: Quine/Maher's "Basic"
>
>The drum sound really gets my goat - what was it with the early/mid eightie=
s
>and electronic drums?
Gotcha. Completely understandable, but I've managed to listen past
it. I really do wish they would have mixed them lower, but I'll take
what's there to dig.
>It was also the first time I'd heard Quine away from
>Zorn (or Zorn-related stuff, "Painted Deserts" with Mori/Ribot I liked) and
>I suppose I would have liked a bit more rock'n'roll soloing.
_Very_ good record. Have you heard the Corin Curschellas _Valdun:
Voices of Rumantsch_ record? Quine, Ribot, Greg Cohen, Ikue Mori,
Christian Marclay... I would have liked to have heard Quine on every
track, but there are some fine ones on there, notably "Violenza," "Al
Mar," "Da Not," "Crisa," and "Sainza S=F6n" (not all of which have
Quine on them).
>It's all a
>matter of opinion, and I was just saying it disappointed me. Still, I shoul=
d
>have known...name me a good rock oriented record that came out in 1984!
No flames here. Good rock record in 1984... uh, I'm sure there is
one, but I'm having a hard time thinking of it. FWIW, Tom Verlaine's
1984 album has a lot of drum machine on it as well, and I have to
listen past that one, too.
>NP: Richard Hell & The Voidoids - Destiny Street (with some kickass Quine
>solos)
That one's on my list, too. Haven't heard it yet, tho.
Regards,
Maurice
- --
Maurice Rickard
http://mauricerickard.com/
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2000 14:13:02 -0400
From: Peter Gannushkin <shkin@shkin.com>
Subject: Re: Philip Johnston's Transparent Quartet
Hello Adam,
His web page is http://home.earthlink.net/~philjohnston/.
I heard him twice: first time with Transparent Quartet and second time
with reunited The Microscopic Septet. Both gigs were great and very
joyful. Though I cannot say that it was really creative music. It
sounds and feels good but don't expect something exciting in
compositions and arrangements. Just lots of fun stuff.
Transparent Quartet is less energetic and theatrical I think but the
music is still good although it sounds like a music for a movie even
if it was not composed to it. Still interesting and relaxing.
Thursday, October 05, 2000, you wrote to me:
ATT> Hey, I'm looking for information on Philip Johnston and the web
ATT> has failed me, so I thought I'd draw on the scarily inclusive reservoir of
ATT> music information that is this list. His quartet is playing near me in
ATT> Indiana and I hear that he's played at the Knitting Factory; I've never
ATT> heard of him, but I thought you guys might have some information since he
ATT> appears to come from the New York scene. Apparently his quartet is
ATT> accompanying seven short films by Georges Melies, which sounds intriguing.
ATT> Anyway, any information would be greatly appreciated.
- --
Best regards,
Peter Gannushkin
e-mail: shkin@shkin.com
URL: http://www.downtownmusic.net/
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V3 #98
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