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Zorn List Digest       Tuesday, October 3 2000       Volume 03 : Number 090



In this issue:
-
       Re: Prepared piano suggestion
       Re:concussion stand
       Re: weird restaurants
       Re: zorn uptown manhattan show?
       Odp: L'Avventura
       Odp: Prepared piano suggestion
       preachers of resignation?
       Re: preachers of resignation?
       absurd bastard
       Bill Laswell's Reconstructions
       Re: graewe et. al.
       Odp: Re:violin
       Masada In Prague
       Re: Bill Laswell's Reconstructions
       Odp: Re:...and organs
       Odp: RE: drummers Ringo & "genius"
       Re: classic guide to strategy
       Re: Einstein was a drummer/Ringo Starr
       Re: prepared piano
       Re: certainly I'll do it [was]: sorry, jerzy, but listen again, fool

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 23:22:49 -0400
From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Prepared piano suggestion

On Mon, Oct 02, 2000 at 08:59:36PM -0700, A wrote:
> Hi
>
> I saw a Bravo Profile on John Cage yesterday (I taped it as well),
> and I was astonished by the few portions of prepared piano
> compositions they showed... any suggestions on such recordings???

Waitaminnit -- a Bravo Profile of John Cage? And I missed it? The
schedule at http://www.bravotv.com/ doesn't mention one, though there
was a profile of Yoko Ono scheduled... Could you have meant a mention
of Cage on the Yoko show, or did i really miss something?

- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| [e-mail]           http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Jerusaklyn                  http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music    Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |


- -

------------------------------

Date: 3 Oct 2000 04:03:38 -0000
From: "Tim Keenliside" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re:concussion stand

On Mon, 2 Oct 2000 20:45:57 -0700 (PDT) Sigmund Nonanima
<[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>okay, I'm only 22, but I know what you're saying about
>them being a conduit and such (I'm trying to think of
>who my conduit is...)
>I'll grant you this stuff, and I change my GOOD POP
>SONGS to GREAT POP SONGS,
>but I never said they were mediocre...
>
>Sigmund
>
As a postscript to my other post, and a much needed link
to this list, I would just like to take this opportunity
to say that I now see younger listeners who have come into
Zorn's music from Mr. Bungle, Faith No More, Boredoms,
Naked City etc. exploring diverse musics from all genres &
cultures, in pretty much the same way the Beatles led
their listeners into the garden of aural delights way back
when...so perhaps he's your conduit too...that's a

_____________________________________________________________
Email your boss can't read - sign up for free disinfo.net email
at http://www.disinfo.com, your gateway to the underground

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 00:24:45 -0400
From: Matt Laferty <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: weird restaurants

Ryan Novak wrote:

>  Now that I think about it, I really should have
> bought the King Tubby CD despite- that was pretty
> cool.  Anybody know this guy?  Blind Idiot God's dub
> stuff seems highly informed by him.  I do know that
> he's dead unfortunately.

Ahh, King Tubby.  He produced tons and tons of what I consider to be
great roots reggae and dub.  Especially dub.  I would've once said that
his importance to modern music can not be overstated, but sometimes it
is.  That isn't to say that his work isn't great and spiritual and
mind-expanding, it's just that the recent (last 3 years..) hyperbole
that surrounds dub's place in "electronica's" history seems really out
of whack to its actual public exposure.

But the King Tubby that I love and recommend to anyone interested in dub
technique and MOST IMPORTANTLY the successful transforming of a singles
artform to one of collections are the cds

King Tubby Meets Roots Radics: Dangerous Dub
&
Yah Congo meets King Tubby & Professor at dub table

I'm also enamored of Burning Spear's "Garvey's Ghost" and Ras Michael
and the Sons of Negus "Rastafari Dub"  Really, anything that the label
Blood and Fire have put out is essential, in my book.

and I have nothing to say about the Beatles except that I was
disappointed that there wasn't more footage of early Yoko stuff on that
Bravo thing.  Not enough discussion of those GREAT first four albums:
Plastic Ono Band, Life with the Lions, Wedding Album, and Two Virgins.
In my book, AND ONLY AN OPINION, better than anything the Beatles ever
did (except MAYBE "Act Naturally" and "Within You Without You."  Which
is not to say that I didn't listen to the white album over and over when
I was in high school...lord knows I don't want to set off another
onslaught of emails)

And speaking of sitars:  Is anyone else on this list obsessed with
Sitar/Pop crossovers besides the beatles?  I did a radio show of
all-sitar crossover stuff a couple of months ago that was well
recieved.  And delerium out of england is selling a six disc anthology
of Sitarized 60's pop and psychedelia....I drool...

matt



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 00:49:33 -0500
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: zorn uptown manhattan show?

Ian Farrell wrote:

> I got a flyer for a zorn chamber music concert uptown around lincoln center
> and now I have lost it and forgotten the name of the venue. Anyone know of
> the event here in manhattan in the next few months or early next year at a
> jewish focussed institution of somesort?

Monday, October 16, 8 p.m., Merkin Concert Hall, 129 West 67th St., a few
blocks north of Lincoln Center (or, for the discographically-minded, one block
north of the Lincoln Center Tower Records), as I recall...  Masada Quartet,
Chamber Ensemble, and String Trio.

Zorn's the new "Composer-in-Residence" at Merkin, or so I've heard, and, as
such, has the ability to book "last-minute" shows into any previously-unfilled
spaces in the schedule (same privilege he had at the Knitting Factory)...

Check out (frequently) http://www.ekcc.org/merkin.html for more details.

Steve Smith
[e-mail]
NP - Sir Michael Tippett, 'Ritual Dances from "The Midsummer Marriage,"' BBC
Scottish Sym / Hurst (Naxos)


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 06:49:44 +0200
From: "Jerzy Matysiakiewicz" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: L'Avventura

Sigmund wrote|
|
| I know I'm offending people, but that's what it's all
| about, to keep us on our toes and ready to defend or
| reevaluate (usually defend, I guess) our thinkings in
| the face of beligerent pricks like me! :)
|

KEEP OFFENDING SIGMUND !!


forgotten fellow lister

low-brow-Jerzy

np - Klaus Doldinger's Passport "Move"



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 06:50:48 +0200
From: "Jerzy Matysiakiewicz" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: Prepared piano suggestion

- ----- Wiadomosc oryginalna -----
Od: "A" <[e-mail]>
Do: <[e-mail]>
Wyslano: 3 pazdziernika 2000 05:59
Temat: Prepared piano suggestion


| Hi
|
| I saw a Bravo Profile on John Cage yesterday (I taped it as well),
| and I was astonished by the few portions of prepared piano
| compositions they showed... any suggestions on such recordings???
|
| np: Impaled/Trocar
|

Ferrante & Teicher "Blast OFF"


Jerzy

np - The Zombies - "Odessey and Oracle"



- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 22:03:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sigmund Nonanima <[e-mail]>
Subject: preachers of resignation?

Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]> wrote (in
reference to my admittedly ignorant & poor use of the
term Middle-Eastern):

>Not that I see why you find offending people
>something that you'd want to do anyway, unless there
>are still people out there trying out the extremely
>tired "shaking up the supposed boorzhwazee" meme,
>which one would hope had gone the way of the "Loser
>sneeze".

what's this? do I detect a hint of bitter resignation?

__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
http://photos.yahoo.com/

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 00:29:20 -0400
From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: preachers of resignation?

On Mon, Oct 02, 2000 at 10:03:13PM -0700, Sigmund Nonanima wrote:
> Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]> wrote (in
> reference to my admittedly ignorant & poor use of the
> term Middle-Eastern):
>
> >Not that I see why you find offending people
> >something that you'd want to do anyway, unless there
> >are still people out there trying out the extremely
> >tired "shaking up the supposed boorzhwazee" meme,
> >which one would hope had gone the way of the "Loser
> >sneeze".
>
> what's this? do I detect a hint of bitter resignation?

If so, it means the detector is broken. Which is not a surprise.

- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| [e-mail]           http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Jerusaklyn                  http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music    Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 06:00:59 GMT
From: "Bill Ashline" <[e-mail]>
Subject: absurd bastard

I'll jump to the defense of the absurd bastard and say that I too find the
Beatles tiring and overrated, though I must agree that as a cultural phenom
they are without parallel.  The issue about whether Ringo was a good or bad
drummer is moot though.  "Bad" musicians can still make "good" music since
musicianship is only one aspect of music.  Musical sense is another, though
for many that might in itself qualify one as a good musician despite
"technical limitations."

The word genius gets thrown around a bit too much as well, though we need
not become jazz snobs in rejecting its use.  If too many people are
geniuses, then as a description the word loses value.

But I'll disagree with the absurd bastard and say that L'Avventura stinks as
a film.  I find Antonioni to be the worst of the Italian auteurs.  Fellini
and Rossellini were much better in my opinion.  (But if you like Antonioni,
more power to your misrecognizing cathecting senses).

Let's keep the absurd bastard on the list with his delightful "nonanima"
title--So Aristotelian.  Besides, he makes me laugh.

NP: Don Cherry, Live Ankara, The Sonet Recordings (now that mutherfucka had
a real musical sense--rest in peace, sweet cherry)
NR: Philip Gourevitch, "We Wish to Inform You...Stories from Rwanda"
JF: Frantz Fanon, "Black Skin, White Masks" (must reading--best explanation
of colonial thinking and the psychology of racism around)

B. Ashline

"Intellectual alienation is a creation of middle class society.  What I call
middle-class society is any society that becomes rigidified in predetermined
forms, forbidding all evolution, all gains, all progress, all discovery.  I
call middle class a closed society in which life has no taste, in which the
air is tainted, in which ideas and men are corrupt....I am not a prisoner of
history.  I should not seek there for the meaning of my destiny. I should
constantly remind myself that the real "leap" consists of introducing
invention into existence.  In the world through which I travel, I am
endlessly creating myself."--Frantz Fanon


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- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 09:23:09 +0200 (DST)
From: Emmanouil Papagiannakis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Bill Laswell's Reconstructions

>>>What else reconstructions are out there?


HAVANA MOODS, double CD, one with "treated" pieces,
one with originals, if you liked IMAGINARY CUBA you
will probably like this (I do).

I also once listened to another ne with Algerian
(I think) music, and  that was real haunting. Sorry,
the title escapes me.


manolis

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 03:59:33 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: graewe et. al.

In a message dated 10/2/00 9:53:56 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< As is, for my money, one of the greatest free improv CDs I've heard yet,
'Spellings' by Frisque Concordance, released in 1995 on the Random Acoustics
label.  The rest of the group: John Butcher, Hans Schneider and Martin
Blume.  Breathtaking. >>

two somewhat related pieces of info here:

first, Random Acoustics (co-run by Grawe), after a long, long dry spell, has
just released four new CDs, including a Thomas Lehn solo disc. Georg told me
the other three, but they're not coming to mind right now. it's good to see
that one of the most interesting improv labels is back in business, though.

secondly, Meniscus, a Minneapolis based label run by Jon Morgan, has also
just released a Grawe trio CD, with Frank Gratkowski and Paul Lovens. I
haven't heard this one yet, but the other Meniscus release just out is a solo
Greg Kelley trumpet CD, which is one of my favorite releases of the year. if
you don't know Kelley, he's half of the Boston-based nmperign (along with
soprano sax Bhob Rainey), but this solo CD is by far the best thing I've
heard from either of them, alone or together. I'm looking forward to seeing
both Greg and Bhob live for the first time next weekend at the Autumn
Uprising festival, along with the rest of the burgeoning Boston scene.

Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 10:45:12 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: Re:violin

From: Jerzy Matysiakiewicz <[e-mail]>

> Urbaniak of course. I prefer Seifert and I doesn't to overload my list
with
> the guys from my homelnad.

Hi (Jerzy, milo spotkac rodaka),
I've heard that Seifert has recorded an album with Scofield, deJohnette, and
some famous bassist (maybe Eddie Gomez). Has anybody heard it? Is it
avialable?
Marcin Gokieli
[e-mail] [e-mail]
Generally speaking, if a philosopher offers to 'dissolve' the problem you
are working on, tell him to go climb a tree - Jerry Fodor


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 11:02:01 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Masada In Prague

AH!
They play in Prague the 27.11.2000!
Is there anybody who could help me with the tickets for the show? Please...
Marcin Gokieli
[e-mail] [e-mail]
Generally speaking, if a philosopher offers to 'dissolve' the problem you
are working on, tell him to go climb a tree - Jerry Fodor


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 09:20:38 GMT
From: "Bill Ashline" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Bill Laswell's Reconstructions

>From: Emmanouil Papagiannakis <[e-mail]>

> >>>What else reconstructions are out there?
>
>I also once listened to another ne with Algerian
>(I think) music, and  that was real haunting. Sorry,
>the title escapes me.


Forgot to mention that one too.  Lili Boniche, Alger Alger and the remix
Boniche Dub--both on APC.
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- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 11:07:47 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: Re:...and organs

From: Jerzy Matysiakiewicz <[e-mail]>

> | Dave Stewart (Egg)
> Oh, yeah, but don't foget 'bout great "Arzachel" LP with Steve Hillage

The same Dave Stewart that played in the first Bruford's band along with
Jeff Berlin And Allan Holdsworth? I did not like the kbds sound on those
albums
Marcin Gokieli
[e-mail] [e-mail]
Generally speaking, if a philosopher offers to 'dissolve' the problem you
are working on, tell him to go climb a tree - Jerry Fodor
- ----- Original Message -----


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 11:16:42 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: RE: drummers Ringo & "genius"

From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>
> > <<using my definition, who would you guys call a modern musical
> > "genius"?>>
> > Uri Caine, Don Byron, Joe Henderson, Terry Adams
> Brian Eno, Ornette Coleman, Robert Ashley, Alvin Lucier, John Lewis...

And there' s a guy from NYC who's really quite cool. His name is John Zorn
...;-)
Happy to see someone else mention Eno among geniuses. I don't have to do it
myself
Marcin Gokieli
[e-mail] [e-mail]
Generally speaking, if a philosopher offers to 'dissolve' the problem you
are working on, tell him to go climb a tree - Jerry Fodor


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 19:40:40 -0700
From: Rich Williams <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: classic guide to strategy

>
>Incidentally, did anyone on this list see Locus Solus
>live? I know it's a long shot, but...


    Which Locus Solus?  I saw the Zorn/Horvitz/Mori version twice, and the
Zorn/Lindsay/Fier version at least a dozen times, but I never caught
the one with Blegvad and the  DJ though.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 07:07:38 -0400
From: "Risser Family" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Einstein was a drummer/Ringo Starr

> THE BEATLES WERE OVERRATED (ARE OVERRATED)

I used to think this too, when I was a child.

Peter


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 07:09:35 -0400
From: stephen drury <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: prepared piano

At 09:59 PM 10/2/00 -0600, you wrote:
>Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 20:59:36 -0700 (PDT)
>From: =?iso-8859-1?q?A?= <[e-mail]>
>Subject: Prepared piano suggestion
>
>I saw a Bravo Profile on John Cage yesterday (I taped it as well),
>and I was astonished by the few portions of prepared piano
>compositions they showed... any suggestions on such recordings???
>
Louis Goldstein's performance of Cage's "Sonatas and Interludes"

- --steve

check out the cool new stuff on
http://www.stephendrury.com


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 07:22:11 -0400
From: "Risser Family" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: certainly I'll do it [was]: sorry, jerzy, but listen again, fool

> OK Kurt, I'm ready to change my opinion, but gimme, bitte, some tips for
> searching Ringo's genius.
> FWIW - I'm the fan of "The Beatles" from 1965.. It is /was/ greatest band
> ever /not The Shaggs :))/ but IMHO Ringo was the soft underbelly of group.


Okay, in the shortest sense possible: On the later stuff, listen to what he
doesn't play, in a Davis-silence kind of way.  No tom rolls, no cymbal
crashes, no polyrhythms or chinese water gongs; nothing that isn't
absolutely necessary.  On some of the songs of the white album, he plays
maybe two hits every measure, the picture of minimalism.  It may be that he
was just lazy, but as a drummer, I respect more the folks who convey the
maximum amount of beat with the minimum amount of effort, and he did that.
That's what I think anyway.

I really did think that the Beatles were overrated for a long time.
Shakespeare too.  Then I got wise.

Peter


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V3 #90
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