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Zorn List Digest      Friday, September 29 2000      Volume 03 : Number 077



In this issue:
-
       Roulette TV-NYC
       Re: Help with a Classical title/recording (No Zorn)
       Re: Drummers
       Re: Drummers
       Re: Best Zorn Albums
       Subject: Drummers
       Saxy Bass Wars, Mari/a/on/o, it ain't easy bein' GREEN
       we ain't all yanks, and an apology from a yank (pun intended)
       Odp: Drummers
       Re: Drummers
       Re: Drummers
       Re: Drummers
       Re: Elegy
       drummers
       Re: drummers
       Re: Drummers

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 22:25:54 -0400
From: Brian Olewnick <[e-mail]>
Subject: Roulette TV-NYC

NYC area z-listers with cable might like to know about the premiere
tomorrow evening of Roulette TV, on Channel 56 at 11:00. It'll be a
weekly event hosted by chanteuse and gadfly Phoebe Legere. The first
guest is composer Laetitia Sonami. Don't know who else is scheduled, but
if they're selected from Roulette's normal concert roster, it could be a
pretty interesting show.

Brian Olewnick

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 22:56:47 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Help with a Classical title/recording (No Zorn)

In a message dated 9/28/00 9:16:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Could it be Einojuhani Rautavaara's 1977 VIolin COncerto recorded by
 Elmar Oliveira?  >>


I believe it is....thanks!!!!

Grateful,
Tom (who knew this was the list to ask)



________________________________________________
The dignity of art appears to the greatest advantage
perhaps in music, because that art contains no material
to be deducted. It is wholly form and intrinsic value,
and it elevates and ennobles everything which it expresses.

               --Johann Wolfgang Von Goethe

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 23:03:28 -0500
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Drummers

> > [e-mail] wrote:
> > if you were to compile a list of the best drum/percussion related or
> > percussion dominated records, what would they be, and from what genres?

I can sense that this is potentially going to be a long thread.

Firstly, it seems that the few people who've posted so far have stuck to solo
percussion or percussion ensemble recordings.  Is this in fact what you had in
mind, ObviousEye?  If not, best step in and clarify.  And second, since Tom's
posted mystery this evening has me in a classical frame of mind, I'll just
recommend a couple of classical percussion records that I think are pretty
amazing - one of which is essential, the other just a load of fun.

If you can still find the album 'Percussion Music' on Nonesuch, that's the
essential one.  You get the one drop-dead classic of the genre ('Ionisation' by
Edgard Varese), interesting works by Henry Cowell, Michael Colgrass and David
Saperstein, plus for my money the best piece of music Charles Wuorinen has ever
written, his Percussion Symphony, a 40 minute piece featuring three long
movements for mostly untuned percussion instruments plus two "Entr'acte"
movements that are keyboard percussion transcriptions of a Petrarch setting by
Dufay, "Vergine Bella."

Another one I'll recommend, though it's less essential, is a collection on the
New World label by the Continuum Percussion Quartet, a group of then-Rice
University students released about eight years ago.  It's got a ripping version
of John Cage's 'Third Construction' and Christopher Rouse's tremendously fun
'Ku-Ka-Illimoku,' plus Lou Harrison's Concerto for the Violin with Percussion
Orchestra and pieces by Irwin Bazelon, Eugene Kurtz and J. Verplanck.  Rouse in
particular writes exceptionally well for percussion - in addition to
'Ku-Ka-Illimoku,' I'd recommend his 'Ogoun Badagris' and 'Bonham' (as in John
Bonham), though you'll have to look to other recordings to find these.

Of course, I studied classical percussion for something like 13 years, so I
guess I'm showing a certain prejudice here...

Steve Smith
[e-mail]
NP - Philip Glass, 'Akhnaten' (CBS Masterworks)


- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 23:25:57 -0400
From: Maurice Rickard <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Drummers

At 5:05 PM -0400 9/28/00, [e-mail] wrote:
>I am interested in the zornlist's opinion on drummers/drumming.  if you were
>to
>compile a list of the best drum/percussion related or percussion dominated
>records,
>what would they be, and from what genres?

Ben--

I'll branch out a bit from what people have been saying, to delve
into more, uh, rock and non-obscure choices.  When I think of great
drummers, or drummers I'd listen to anytime, I think of these:

Rock:
Damon Che, of Don Caballero.  Hard math rock, for lack of a better
term, the Don used to be a quarted from Our Steel City, but mostly
moved to Chicago when the cheap funky artists' apartments in the best
part of town were torn down.  (Don Caballero's not a person; it's the
name of the band.)  Haven't heard the new one, American Don (a trio,
now--except for Damon, almost the same band as Storm&Stress), but the
first three are _very_ good.   I've seen 'em live several times, and
Damon is in fact human.  He has the usual number of arms/legs--but he
attacks the kit like a young Elvin Jones--he nails his kit to the
stage before sets.  He plays _around_ the beat, surprisingly able to
leave spaces in some extremely dense playing.

Billy Ficca of Television, particularly on _Marquee Moon_.  Very
inventive, lively playing  You can definitely hear the guy thinking.

Michael Dahlquist of Silkworm.  He's been refining his stuff of late,
but the two CDs they put out in '94 (_In the West_ and _Libertine_)
have some amazing moments.  I'm blown away by the songwriting, too.

Okay, so not terribly avant garde.  How 'bout Elvin Jones on
_Coltrane Live at Birdland_?  The coda to "Afro Blue" gives me chills
every time.

That pretty much empties my head at the moment, but I may think of more...

- -Maurice

- --
Maurice Rickard
http://mauricerickard.com/

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 23:50:19 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Best Zorn Albums

Seems like SPY VS. SPY gets mentioned very infrequently on the list.  Tho for
pure visceral pleasure, it's one of my favorite albums period.

Jerry B.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 23:58:55 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Subject: Drummers

I don't have terribly broad experience in this area. But two drum albums I've
been listening to and enjoying quite a bit lately are the Hamid Drake/Michael
Zerang duo TOUCH THE SUN (I may not have the title exactly right) and Guenter
Sommer's SAECHISCHE SCHATHULLE.  Both are pure drums and extremely rhythmic
(almost to the point of being melodious) but adventurous nonetheless.  OKKA
announced a new Drake and Zerang collaboration a while back--anyone know the
status of that project??

Jerry B.


>  I am interested in the zornlist's opinion on drummers/drumming.  if you
were
>
>  to
>  compile a list of the best drum/percussion related or percussion dominated
>  records,

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 21:38:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sigmund Nonanima <[e-mail]>
Subject: Saxy Bass Wars, Mari/a/on/o, it ain't easy bein' GREEN

William Crump <[e-mail]> wrote:

> vs. Motorhead Sherwood/Roy Estrada!

beautiful! thank you!

how about:

vs. Coltrane/Garrison (no one thought of that yet?!)

vs. Eric Dolphy/Richard Davis

(for the latter, I'm only going on Alone
Together--1963, Jazz World, the album: Sound--but that
track alone is enough to put them in the...uh...wars.
can we just call it jam session or something? oh!
bleedin haht ovah heah! but seriously)


[e-mail] (Joseph Neff) wrote:

>Hello,

Hello!

>"Three For Shepp" on Impulse. Shepp doesn't play on
>this record, however, though he is pictured on the
>cover with Brown.

okay, NOW I remember--all my good music is in storage,
and I put the CD cases in there, too

>...to answer Sigmund's question about Nov. voting, I
>must say that I'll probably go with Nader and not
>ruin my track record of protest voting.

amen and stuff, brutha--and thanks for puttin it out
there.
Nader is definitely the only sane, original,
democratic,
free-from-corporate-fingerprints-in-the-rectum
candidate (although the press, and even some
self-proclaimed, so-called, actually centrist LIBERALS
would say he's crazy--???)
and I'm pretty sure music lovers wouldn't want Tipper
within 500 yards of the white house (I'm getting
queezy just thinkin about it...oh shit, wait a
minute!), and Bush/Cheney... okay, nevermind


oh! and Charlie Mariano is also on a Rabih Abou-Khalil
disc, although I can't remember the name of
it...anyone have any opinions on this guy? I
personally think he's great--Rabih I'm talking about
(although I love Mariano, of course)--even if he does
tend to repeat himself in his composition
He's also had Sonny Fortune, Milford Graves, Howard
Levy, and Steve Swallow on his albums.
anyway, ok.


Sigmund

np:pn:np:pn:np:pn
nr:rn:nr:rn:nr:rn
(Derrida: Spurs: Nietzsche's Styles...I'm trying)

__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
http://photos.yahoo.com/

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 21:59:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sigmund Nonanima <[e-mail]>
Subject: we ain't all yanks, and an apology from a yank (pun intended)

Sorry, WaxMan (affectionate, not satirical, because
neither would be particularly funny),

Oh man, I really gotta apologize for that one, the
whole U.S. November election thing--I don't know why I
didn't even consider those on the list fortunate
enough not to live...from where I'm typing

not that's it's much of an excuse, but I'm averaging
4.5 hours of sleep a night this week...

anyway, sorry for the one or two messages that already
got out about the u.s. elections,
and I understand that u.s. politics are shoved down
the throats of most people in the world (although it
makes me wonder who the american govt dispenses more
lies to, its own people or the foreign press
etc?--sorry!)

okay, I'm backing off

again, I apologize to those ineligible to vote in the
u.s. etc.
(please don't be mad   /.  \
                       \.  /   that's supposed to be
                                     a contrite face)


shitkickin sigmund

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
http://photos.yahoo.com/

- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 09:27:14 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: Drummers

From: <[e-mail]>

> I am interested in the zornlist's opinion on drummers/drumming.  if you
were
> to
> compile a list of the best drum/percussion related or percussion dominated
> records,
I'll put some classics of drumming, and two quite recent releases
Well, let's start with
Igor Stravinsky - 'L'histoire du soldat'
One of the most incredible pieces of music. The 'devil' part of the drum
(there are 2 drummers, if i remember correctly) is enldlessly fascinating.
Then let's move to
Miles Davis 'Filles de kilimajaro'
The most abstract of his recordings (?). Tony Williams is god - and that
explains his manner of drumming.
And let's add
Masada 3 gimmel.
Joey is also god. His drumming is really incrwedible: intense, intelligent,
avoids the abuse (the drummer's sin).
And
Filmowrks 2
The way drumming (both sampled and live) is used on that incredible record
is fascinating. Just listen.

Well, that's my top. I'll try to think about some other records later,
Marcin Gokieli




- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 18:39:21 +1000
From: "Julian" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Drummers

Jim Black is one of the most intelligent (as well as hugely creative)
drummers I have heard, check out any of Dave Douglas' Tiny Bell Trio
albums...


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 10:13:28 GMT+0100
From: "Jeroen de Boer" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Drummers

Here's a list of drummers I like (in no particular order):

Terry Bozzio:
Of course for what he did with Zappa (The Black Page), but his
current solowork is even more compelling. Especially his video with
ostinato-type soloing is breathtaking.

Elvin Jones:
Coltrane's live-albums... Amazing timing.

Sean Reinert (Cynic, Death, Aghora), Tomas Haake (Meshuggah):
Taking metaldrumming to a higher level.

Dennis Chambers:
I never listen to fusion anymore, but Chambers is reason enough
to do it again. One of the few drummers who combines amazing
technical skills with sheer power and intensity. His control of
doublebass-drumming is admirable. He also influenced a lot of
younger drummers: most notably Rodney Holmes, who played
among other with Wayne Shorter's group including David Gilmore
(once in Lost Tribe).

Gary Novak:
Brilliant on Allan Holdsworth's latest effort listen to 'The Drums
Were Yellow', an ode to Tony Williams), and making Alanis
Morrisette more a joy to listen to. I remember David Letterman
making the remark especially her drummer was very good when
they were quest artists.

Gene Lake/Jojo Mayer:
The drummers of Screaming Headless Torsos.

Jim Black:
His voicings on the drumset are beautiful. For me he's one of the
best musicians in general.

Jake Mandell:
Well he isn't a drummer, but the way he uses rhythm in his pieces
says, that if he had the skills to play (and maybe he has), he would
be an excellent drummer.


Jeroen



- ----------------------------------------
Jeroen de Boer
music director Open Electronic Festival/Cyberslag Foundation
Munnekeholm 10, 9711JA Groningen
The Netherlands
tel/fax: [phone]
gsm: [phone]
[e-mail]
http://www.cyberslag.com
- ----------------------------------------

- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 11:17:15 +0200
From: patRice <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Drummers

ben wrote:

>>and who are the best drummers, in the region of
innovation/technicality?
>>this is all opinion based of course...

when it comes to innovation/technique, i can only second jeroen de
boer's recommendation:

terry bozzio.

the things he pulls off on his (huge) drumkit are simply incredible. his
technique is from outer space.

terry has been pursuing his very unique way for years and years,
resulting in his own so-called "signature" drum heads, sticks, cymbals,
special drums and so-called sound enhancers. no to mention his unique
style! his four-way coordination is simply outstanding.

if you're looking for something mind-blowing, then i can recommend his
most recent solo cd:

- - drawing the circle

absolutely fantastic on a playing-level. it's hard to believe, but true
(!), that it's all recorded live with no over-dubs by one single
drummer. usually sounds as if there were at least two of them...

the only thing i don't like about bozzio's recent works is when he
actually plays in bands. somehow, i personally feel, his drumming just
doesn't fit in anywhere - it usually comes off as starting to give a bit
of a "wank-y / show-off" kind of impression. which, of course, it isn't!
it's simply terry's unique playing approach/style. but still, it just
somehow doesn't fit in in a band setting. (the exception *maybe* being
"the lonely bears"; though i must admit that their music never really
moved me emotionally.)

patRice

np: var=E8se, complete works
nr: duckworth, talking music / samuel, olivier messiaen



- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 09:59:14 GMT
From: "Arthur Gadney" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Elegy

Hello,

>I noticed recently that George Lucas AND David Lynch are thanked in >the
>liner notes of Elegy.  WHY?  The only connection between the two >I know is
>that Lynch was asked to direct The Empire Strikes Back.  But >he "didn't do
>sci-fi" (Dune?).  Any way, if any one knows the >connection to each other
>and to Elegy I would really like to know.  >Thanks

David Slusser has worked for both of them doing sound editing on their
films. I don't think they had anything directly to do with "Elegy".

ARTHUR_G

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- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 06:24:22 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: drummers

while I always try to avoid directly recommending Erstwhile titles (at least=
=20
on-list), no matter how good I think they are, in the context of the drummer=
s=20
thread, I feel compelled to mention my next release, G=FCnter M=FCller/L=EA=20=
Quan=20
Ninh-La Voyelle Liquide.

it's 75 minutes from two of the most interesting and subtle percussionists=20
the improv world currently has to offer, and has been on more or less=20
constant play here the last few months. it's not all percussion, there's=20
quite a bit of electronics also, but I still thought it was relevant. it'll=20
be out in about three weeks.

I could also suggest any number of other M=FCller and/or Ninh records=20
(especially Ninh's solo disc, Ustensiles (For 4 Ears), but I think this may=20
be their best work yet.

anyone heard Masahiko Togashi's Rings, a solo percussion CD from 1975, which=
=20
was just reissued? I've been hearing good things about that, but haven't=20
heard it yet myself.

Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 10:59:12 GMT
From: "Arthur Gadney" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: drummers

>anyone heard Masahiko Togashi's Rings, a solo percussion CD from 1975,
> >which was just reissued? I've been hearing good things about that, but
> >haven't heard it yet myself.

What about the Han bennink solo discs? I'm curious about them...

ARTHUR_G
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- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 08:07:36 -0300
From: "J.A.Bueno" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Drummers

My favorites

Susie ibarra :  wondefull and unique,she`s really something special
.Women sensitivity on a drum set

Hamid Drake : Powerfull and intense .Just experince any concert
specially with William Parker on bass

Jim Black: Just incredible,maybe the most creative of drummers i `ve
ever seen.

Also i wan`t to mention Fritz Hauser , incredible technique ,tuning  and
creativity

Jeroen de Boer wrote:

> Here's a list of drummers I like (in no particular order):
>
> Terry Bozzio:
> Of course for what he did with Zappa (The Black Page), but his
> current solowork is even more compelling. Especially his video with
> ostinato-type soloing is breathtaking.
>
What about Vinnie Colaiuta ,his work in Shut up and Play yer guitar is
astonishing.
Also i don`t want to forget Bill bruford .

Antonio


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V3 #77
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