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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #965
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Friday, June 16 2000 Volume 02 : Number 965
In this issue:
-
non-idio
RE: Mimeo at Vandoeuvre Musique Action Festival
Re: gunter muller
Re: Mimeo at Vandoeuvre Musique Action Festival
Re: Mimeo at Vandoeuvre Musique Action Festival
zornies for pho?
Comments (Johnson/Walrath)
Re: Pat Metheny's Aesthetic
Re: Pat Metheny's Aesthetic
Alan Licht recommendations (no Zorn content)
E.A.R. (on Atavistic) questions (no Zorn content)
Re: E.A.R. (on Atavistic) questions (no Zorn content)
Re: Alan Licht recommendations (no Zorn content)
susana baca (and a "p.s." for all you heavy metal fans)
RE: susana baca
Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #964
hip hop cobra
Re: hip hop cobra
any comments on Cage's ATLAS ECLIPTICALIS?
Re: any comments on Cage's ATLAS ECLIPTICALIS?
RE: hip hop cobra
RE: hip hop cobra
Re: Italian Instabile Orchestra
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 12:45:08 EDT
From: CuneiWay@aol.com
Subject: non-idio
>I find the term "non-idiomatic free-improv" curious. Would anyone doubt
>that the style of improvisation developed by AMM, Derek Bailey, et al
>over the past 30-some years is by now a pretty clearly identifiable
>idiom?
I absolutely agree with this.
But I call it that sometimes to differentiate it from "free jazz", which I
think has a very different sound/style.
If you have a better suggestion for what to call it, I'd be very happy to
hear it!
Steve
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 12:30:46 -0600
From: "Matthew W Wirzbicki (S) " <M_WIRZBICKI@ColoradoCollege.edu>
Subject: RE: Mimeo at Vandoeuvre Musique Action Festival
Jacques Oger wrote concerning Zach Settel:
>his live process
>treatment seems old style.
>But, nevertheless, in that festival, I liked the 1st piece played on the
>bass, and the 2nd one on the voice.
>Maybe because the complete lack of ego gave to this (their) performance
>a kind of freedom which is, after all, not so frequent. That's why I liked
>their show, for extra musical reasons, I agree, but sometimes human
>factors
>are important too.
Lack of ego was extra-musical, "human" factor? I'm confused.
- -Matt Wirzbicki
Jacques Oger
- -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 13:07:01 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: gunter muller
On Sun, 11 Jun 2000 13:25:19 -0500 Matthew Ross Davis wrote:
>
> Yes, but with a live performance you're seeing the artists "in the
> moment" and living in the music, rather than hearing a recording which
> may or may not have been edited and/or done several times until the
> performer(s) is satisfied with documenting it.
Bernhard Gunther being the extreme in the "no-sweat" direction since
during his show, he only played his records (some being not available)
and as you know, he is not really a DJ...
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 18:53:17 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: Re: Mimeo at Vandoeuvre Musique Action Festival
In a message dated 6/12/00 6:16:56 AM, oger@worldnet.fr writes:
<< one of my favorite group this
year was: Maxwells Damon (Ulrich Phillipp, Uwe Buhrdorf, Ulrich Bottcher) >>
I left the morning before this show, unfortunately. did they play acoustic
instruments only, as listed in the program, or electronics also, as on their
1996 record Nefastismaschine (Hybrid)?
Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 16:15:08 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: Mimeo at Vandoeuvre Musique Action Festival
On Sat, 10 Jun 2000 10:21:25 EDT JonAbbey2@aol.com wrote:
>
> <<Konk Pack (Tim Hodgkinson, Thomas Lehn, Roger Turner)>>
>
> I'm one of the world's larger Lehn fans, but this is not one of my favorite
> projects of his. Turner and Hodgkinson go full speed ahead, leaving him no
> space, and when he tries to change synth patches, Turner laughed at him
> because he was left behind. I enjoyed virtually all of Lehn's work during the
> MIMEO show more than I did this set, although that being said, it was
> probably the best thing I saw in Nancy after MIMEO.
That was not the case at all with their show in Victoriaville. I felt that
the performance was perfectly balanced between the three players. Lehn was
all over the place as much as Tim or Roger.
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 16:25:42 -0700
From: William Crump <william@steno.com>
Subject: zornies for pho?
I'm sure all the selfrespecting zornlisters on the west coast will be at
the Great American Music Hall next Tuesday. Who all wants to meet up for
food and drink beforehand? Mike Rizzi, that means you. As a stone freak
for Vietnamese food, I should mention that Larkin St. (aka Pho Avenue)
is right around the corner from the venue.
Wm. Crump
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 15:09:06 +1000
From: "Julian" <jcurwin@hartingdale.com.au>
Subject: Comments (Johnson/Walrath)
I am curious about these 2 CDs, can anyone offer comments?
The first is Marc Johnson's second release with Frisell and Scofield (I
believe it is called "Second Sight"). And the second is by trumpet player
Jack Walrath, I am unsure of the title, but there is a Mingus tune on there
and the word "Hang" is in the title...
Thanks,
Julian.
http://www.hartingdale.com.au/~jcurwin
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 22:23:11 -0700
From: "s~Z" <keith@pfmentum.com>
Subject: Re: Pat Metheny's Aesthetic
> >I think Metheny wastes too many words on Kenny G. < <
You say you want some more? Well here's some more:
http://www.patmethenygroup.com/af/index-qna.html
Click on 'Kenny G and Cultural Aggression' and 'The response to the
response.'
Kenny G provides wonderful fodder in any discussion of the hierarchial
nature of aesthetics. It puts the heat on the populists.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 09:02:05 GMT
From: "Bill Ashline" <bashline@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Pat Metheny's Aesthetic
>From: "s~Z"
>
>You say you want some more? Well here's some more:
>
>Kenny G provides wonderful fodder in any discussion of the hierarchial
>nature of aesthetics. It puts the heat on the populists.
Yup, burning up over here....
Kenny G isn't "bad." He's absolutely boring, which is far worse.
"it is a little alarming to me to see that my little rant on this topic
seems to have generated such a relatively huge response. it makes me feel
that in this day and age, even within the ôjazz communityö, controversy,
especially PUBLIC controversy, has the chance to ôwinö over musical
substance, even in terms of what gets discussed - people seem to absolutely
love it."--Pat Metheny
Well said Pat. Let's move on to another topic then and put this matter to
bed where it belongs.
I think Joseph Zitt has a blurb at the bottom of his messages from Duchamp
which says something like, "the only thing that isn't art is inattention,"
which is precisely the response one should have toward Kenny G. Incredulity
followed by silence...and lots of inattention.
BA
"...it is a source of great surprise and disappointment to me that after
more than twenty years of music-making on the New York scene...not one
single writer has ever come forward to champion or even to intelligently
analyze exactly what it is that we have been doing. Indeed, they hardly
seem able even to describe it."--John Zorn
"Improvising musicians create a genuine Deleuzian assemblage, a musical
machine of desire--not binary nor unitary but multiple."--John Corbett
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 21:30:47 +0400
From: "Edward Lutiy" <iron@orc.ru>
Subject: Alan Licht recommendations (no Zorn content)
Good day!
Can anybody please recommend an Alan Licht record.
I've never heard anything by him.
My ordering catalog lists these CDs:
- - Gerry Miles w/ Keiji Haino
- - Rabbi Sky
- - Two Nights w/ Loren Mazzacane Connors
I would be happy to know any thoughts/info on these records.
Also it would be great to know your opinion on Alan Licht related projects
(not under his name).
Thanks in advance
Edward.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 21:31:13 +0400
From: "Edward Lutiy" <iron@orc.ru>
Subject: E.A.R. (on Atavistic) questions (no Zorn content)
Good day!
Sorry for no-Zorn-content message but I need your help very much.
Have anybody heard the record "E.A.R. - Experimental Audio Research"
on Atavistic? As far as I know Eddie Prevost plays on this record
(and I like his work with AMM and solo on "Loci Of Change" very much)
but I know nothing about the other guys that appear on the record.
So the questions are:
- - does Eddie play on all the tracks (or only on part of the album) ?
- - does he play percussion ?
- - is this CD worth buying just for Eddie ?
- - is this music close to AMM ? (What the music is like, anyway ?)
Also I'd like to know your personal opinion about the record.
Thanks in advance
Edward.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 13:40:14 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: Re: E.A.R. (on Atavistic) questions (no Zorn content)
<<Have anybody heard the record "E.A.R. - Experimental Audio Research"
on Atavistic?>>
yes.
<<So the questions are:
- - does Eddie play on all the tracks (or only on part of the album) ?
- - does he play percussion ?
- - is this CD worth buying just for Eddie ?
- - is this music close to AMM ? (What the music is like, anyway ?)>>
definitely don't buy this for Prevost. I believe the consensus when it came
out was that he's not even really on it. and it's not like AMM at all; it's
aimless noodly guitar-based textural soundscapes, created primarily by Sonic
Boom (formerly of the Spacemen 3).
Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 16:07:22 -0500
From: Craig Rath <fripp@mn.mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: Alan Licht recommendations (no Zorn content)
At 09:30 PM 6/13/00 +0400, you wrote:
> Can anybody please recommend an Alan Licht record.
>I've never heard anything by him.
>My ordering catalog lists these CDs:
>
>- Gerry Miles w/ Keiji Haino
Great disc, with Haino doing mostly percussion and vocals, no guitar.
Licht plays organ for the most part with other people on various woodwinds.
>- Rabbi Sky
More noisy, less melodic than Gerry Miles - haven't listened to it a whole
lot.
>- Two Nights w/ Loren Mazzacane Connors
Probably my favorite of the three you've listed. The two of them play off
of each other rather well. If you like Connors, you'll like this disc.
Another one to look for would be his release "The Evan Dando of Noise?",
which has a collection of various styles and moods on it. Also his other
two collaborations with Connors are very good as well.
Craig M. Rath
H: fripp@mn.mediaone.net
W: rathc@questarweb.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 16:10:59 +0200
From: patRice <gda@datacomm.ch>
Subject: susana baca (and a "p.s." for all you heavy metal fans)
hi there.
a while ago somebody mentioned the release of a cd by a peruvian singer
that features some downtowners. (note: guest appearances only; none of
them appears on the whole cd.)
listened to some realaudio files on amazon and decided to buy it.
received it yesterday and had the chance to listen to it once.
it's called "eco de sombras", by susana baca. and is out on luaka bop.
the downtowners on it: marc ribot, greg cohen, john medeski, cyro
baptista.
the music is in a traditional south american vein. nothing spectacular
or groundbreaking. great for listening to on a sunday morning while
still in bed reading the paper. (and yes, another cd that wont scare any
of your friends...)
greg cohen's playing, as usual, is very solid. great sound. i love his
sound more and more!
ribot is also very solid. but not at his best. (personally, i feel, it's
our man zorn who gets the best playing out of marc.)
cyro baptista is also solid. though, i must admit, i've never been too
much a fan of his playing.
medeski. well - solid.
hope this was interesting to at least one person on the list...
yours,
patRice
p.s.: must admit that i was quite a bit of a fan of iron maiden ages
ago. so i was surprised to find out that bruce dickinson is back on
vocals - after eight years. and, i think, also one of the former
guitarists has joined again. might be reason (and excuse) enough for me
to go to the concert...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 13:20:15 -0400
From: "Jim McLoughlin" <jim@intelligenesis.net>
Subject: RE: susana baca
Hi there
I just caught Susan Baca last night at Joe's Pub in NYC. Greg Cohen didn't
play bass, her regular bass player did. She also had a guitar player, 2
percussion players (one on a wooden box the whole time), and a guitarist in
her core group.
I enjoyed the live sound more than the CD - not as smooth, and the
percussion is more up front. Medeski and Ribot sat in and added nice
background stuff, but the core group steals the show. For those interested,
they're playing 2 sets a night through Friday. A bit pricey at $30 a pop -
I'm sure many people are paying it to see David Byrne as advertised, but he
contributed minimally to the set I saw last night.
J
- -
------------------------------
Date: 16 Jun 2000 08:53:16 -0700
From: bobjectify yourself <galloway@www.com>
Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #964
Hey,
Was I kicked off the list or something?
bob
<pre>I know, appealing modern music is lacking, thats why
you should take me, Bob, for what it's worth and visit
www.webofmimicry.com and listen to everything you can
right now like a good little shopper! And...
HEY! AND PAY NO ATTENTION TO THESE GODDAMN ADS AT THE
BOTTOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
</pre>___________________________________________________________________
Get your free, permanent e-mail @www.com, the original Net address!
- - http://www.com/freemail
Listen to your favorite music while you work!
- - http://www.com/radio
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 12:10:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: "m. rizzi" <rizzi@netcom.com>
Subject: hip hop cobra
I just heard about this gig...sounds
cool...I'm in Boston until the 20th
that week, maybe I can extend my
travel plans for a NYC departure instead.
mike rizzi
Fri. JULY 21
Cibo Matto presents
John Zorn's HIP HOP Cobra
+ special guest performers & djs
Brooklyn Bridge Anchorage, Brooklyn, NY
$12 adv/ $15 at door; 10pm
(zorn will be prompter - he'll also be curating at Tonic that month)
- --
rizzi@netcom.com -------------------------------------- www.browbeat.com
"Another nerd with a soulpatch"
- -------- browbeat magazine, po box 11124, oakland, ca 94611-1124 -------
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 12:21:26 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: hip hop cobra
On Fri, 16 Jun 2000 12:10:29 -0700 (PDT) "m. rizzi" wrote:
>
> Fri. JULY 21
> Cibo Matto presents
> John Zorn's HIP HOP Cobra
> + special guest performers & djs
> Brooklyn Bridge Anchorage, Brooklyn, NY
> $12 adv/ $15 at door; 10pm
Still wondering what happened with Ned Sublette presenting Zorn's COUNTRY
Cobra...
> rizzi@netcom.com -------------------------------------- www.browbeat.com
> "Another nerd with a soulpatch"
> -------- browbeat magazine, po box 11124, oakland, ca 94611-1124 -------
Talking about BROWBEAT... any idea when #3 will come out?
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 12:33:25 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: any comments on Cage's ATLAS ECLIPTICALIS?
Does anybody have comments on the following record:
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*** - ATLAS ECLIPTICALIS & WINTER MUSIC: John Cage
SEM Ensemble; David Tudor: piano; Petr Kotik: conductor.
2000 - Asphodel (USA), ??? (CD)
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Also, is this record an exception or will Asphodel be more involved with
classical contemporary music?
Thanks,
Patrice.
NP: CHEAP IMITATION: John Cage (Ampersand)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 15:37:40 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: Re: any comments on Cage's ATLAS ECLIPTICALIS?
In a message dated 6/16/00 3:34:02 PM, proussel@ichips.intel.com writes:
<< *** - ATLAS ECLIPTICALIS & WINTER MUSIC: John Cage
SEM Ensemble; David Tudor: piano; Petr Kotik: conductor.
2000 - Asphodel (USA), ??? (CD) >>
well, I haven't seen it or heard it yet, but I did see that it's out, because
Aquarius is stocking it. the one piece of info I can add is that it's a 4 CD
set.
Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 16:04:54 -0400
From: "Ljova" <L@Ljova.com>
Subject: RE: hip hop cobra
Funny, I have pencilled in my book that Zorn is playing @Symphony Space that
night!
This is certainly cheaper.
Do you have a phone number for the venue, train directions?
Thanks,
Ljova
- --------
Lev "Ljova" Zhurbin
L@Ljova.com
http://Ljova.com/
Listen to my music:
http://mp3.com/Ljova/ (improvisations)
http://mp3.com/LevZhurbin/ (compositions)
http://mp3.com/FreeBach/ (Free Bach Project)
"Do not fear mistakes - there are none."
-Miles Davis
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
> [mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of m. rizzi
> Sent: Friday, June 16, 2000 3:10 PM
> To: Zorn Mailing List
> Subject: hip hop cobra
>
>
>
> I just heard about this gig...sounds
> cool...I'm in Boston until the 20th
> that week, maybe I can extend my
> travel plans for a NYC departure instead.
>
> mike rizzi
>
> Fri. JULY 21
> Cibo Matto presents
> John Zorn's HIP HOP Cobra
> + special guest performers & djs
> Brooklyn Bridge Anchorage, Brooklyn, NY
> $12 adv/ $15 at door; 10pm
>
> (zorn will be prompter - he'll also be curating at Tonic that month)
>
> --
> rizzi@netcom.com -------------------------------------- www.browbeat.com
> "Another nerd with a soulpatch"
> -------- browbeat magazine, po box 11124, oakland, ca 94611-1124 -------
>
> -
>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 16:29:01 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: RE: hip hop cobra
In a message dated 6/16/00 4:21:35 PM, L@Ljova.com writes:
<< Funny, I have pencilled in my book that Zorn is playing @Symphony Space
that
night! >>
that's next week, 6/21, not 7/21.
<<Do you have a phone number for the venue, train directions?>>
try www.creativetime.org, although this series of shows hasn't been posted
there yet. I believe that Glenn Branca will be performing his 12th Symphony
in this series also, which should be pretty wild in this space.
Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 17:37:50 -0400
From: Mike Chamberlain <mikec@rocler.qc.ca>
Subject: Re: Italian Instabile Orchestra
JonAbbey2@aol.com wrote:
>
> I see that they're scheduled to play the Chicago Jazz festival at the end of
> August/beginning of September. anyone know if they have more US dates,
> specifically NYC?
Don't know if it helps much, but they're playing Montreal on June 30.
- --Mike
- --
Mike Chamberlain
Teacher, Writer, Broadcaster, Father, Farmer, Baseball Fan, Jazz Nerd,
Sumo Nut, Bald Guy
"I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused."
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #965
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