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2000-01-06
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #824
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Thursday, January 6 2000 Volume 02 : Number 824
In this issue:
-
Masada in Europe
Re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects
Re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects
RE: Masada in Europe
re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects, & re: ruins review at apple.com
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: more Bailey Recs
Re: more Bailey Recs
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:37:32 +0100
From: otto.siegfried@t-online.de (otto)
Subject: Masada in Europe
Just found this:
London, Jan. 25, 2000
BARBICAN: John Zorn: Masada; Bar
Kokhba; Masada
String Trio.
7.30pm.
ú17.50/ú8.50.
Bergamo Jazz 2000
Teatro Donizetti
11 febbraio
Fabrizio Bosso - Paolo Di Sabatino duo
Kenny Barron - Regina Carter duo
Charlie Haden Quartet West
12 febbraio
Stefano Di Battista Quintet
John Zorn Masada
13 febbraio
Jim Hall - Dave Holland duo
Lew Soloff Food Group
info: 035.4160611
Is there any reliable source on the net for Masada tour dates?
Best,
Siegfried
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 17:46:31 +0100
From: 2L <laurent.levy@fnac.net>
Subject: Re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects
"Neil H. Enet" a =E9crit :
> Hello to all,
>
> I need recommendations for Trip Hop or Drum & Bass (or any elec=
tronic Dance
> genre)projects that any Jazz/Avant Garde artist has done. I know of th=
e
> Derek Bailey/Dj Ninj collaboration "Guitars, Drums and Bass", and I hav=
e the
> Medeski Martin & Wood Remix EP "Bubblehouse" where Zorn plays, but that=
's
> basically it. If anyone can help me, I'd be very glad.
>
> thanks
> Neil H. Enet
> ------------
>
> -
Bill Laswell - Oscillations
1996 - Sub Rosa, SR109 (CD)
more infos on
http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Underground/7093/laswell/oscillate.h=
tml
2L.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 09:36:28 -0800
From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel)
Subject: Re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects
At 11:52 AM 1/6/00, Neil H. Enet wrote:
>Hello to all,
>
> I need recommendations for Trip Hop or Drum & Bass (or any
>electronic Dance
>genre)projects that any Jazz/Avant Garde artist has done. I know of the
>Derek Bailey/Dj Ninj collaboration "Guitars, Drums and Bass", and I have the
>Medeski Martin & Wood Remix EP "Bubblehouse" where Zorn plays, but that's
>basically it. If anyone can help me, I'd be very glad.
>
I like the Grassy Knoll's "III" CD, released about 2 years ago. Sort of a
low-key '70's Miles meets trip hop, with appearances by Ellery Eskelin and
Jane Scarpantoni, as well as Thursaton Moore. Also, Toshinori Kondo's
collaboration with DJ krush is very nice, though a bit bouncy at times.
________________________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/
"...there will come a day when you won't have to use
gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in
your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper
type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em
together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em
together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire."
-Sun Ra
________________________________________________________
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 18:49:53 +0100
From: "Artur Nowak" <arno@emd.pl>
Subject: RE: Masada in Europe
> Is there any reliable source on the net for Masada tour dates?
The only reliable source of info for Europe is:
http://www.ejn.it/saudades/concerts.htm
Take care
__________________________________________________________________
Artur Nowak [arno AT emd.pl]
www.emd.pl - Discography of Bill Frisell
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 18:42:54 GMT
From: "pic nic" <lefauxhulot@hotmail.com>
Subject: re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects, & re: ruins review at apple.com
Neil H. Enet wrote:
>I need recommendations for Trip Hop or Drum & Bass (or any electronic
Dance
> genre)projects that any Jazz/Avant Garde artist has done. I know of the
>Derek Bailey/Dj Ninj collaboration "Guitars, Drums and Bass", and I have
the
> Medeski Martin & Wood Remix EP "Bubblehouse" where Zorn plays, but
that's
>basically it.
check
Liminal (Danny Blume & Ben Perowski as core members for live show... )
UV Ray (Yuval Gabay, Sebastian Steinberg, Tonny Maimone - live drum'n'bass..
but no recordings out yet - scheduled to perform @tonic on wed. jan. 12th)
yuval & sebastian are members of soul coughing, also played numerous
recordings/projects for tzadik artists, incl. zorn.
***********now, something completely different************
i received an e-mail from sasaki of ruins:
>dear friends,
>
>Ruins review on the apple web site!!!
>http://www.apple.com/creative/music/ruins/
>
>happy new year and all the best for year 2000
as an avid fan of mac, sasaki sounds extremely happy!
the site includes short interview w/ him. enjoy.
pic nic
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:10:37 -0500
From: "Dann-Brown" <DLB7@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
The Bailey albums I'm most fond of are the three volumes of Company 1991
(where he duets with Buckethead), The Last Wave (with Bill Laswell and Tony
Williams) and Tohjinbo (with Ruins).
- -dann
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 15:59:43 -0800
From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel)
Subject: Re: TripHop, Drum&Bass Projects
At 11:52 AM 1/6/00, Neil H. Enet wrote:
>Hello to all,
>
> I need recommendations for Trip Hop or Drum & Bass (or any
>electronic Dance
>genre)projects that any Jazz/Avant Garde artist has done. I know of the
>Derek Bailey/Dj Ninj collaboration "Guitars, Drums and Bass", and I have the
>Medeski Martin & Wood Remix EP "Bubblehouse" where Zorn plays, but that's
>basically it. If anyone can help me, I'd be very glad.
>
>thanks
>Neil H. Enet
>------------
Another record that comes to mind is the Innerzone Orchestra's "Programmed"
disc. It's actually a current favorite of mine, rather smooth and mellow on
the surface, but it gets more interesting the more you listen to it. IO is
Detroit techno pioneer Carl Craig, along with several jazz musicians,
keyboardist Craig Taborn, percussionist Francisco Mora, and a violinist
whose name escapes me at this moment, among others. The "jazz" on this disc
is not paticularly avant-garde, but it is a very nice disc.
________________________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/
"...there will come a day when you won't have to use
gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in
your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper
type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em
together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em
together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire."
-Sun Ra
________________________________________________________
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 21:34:08 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
eric ong wrote:
> a few years ago muir popped up on some psych piano label disc with some ppl
> (hmm, was it david cunningham and
> who else?).
Michael Giles, the original drummer with the 1969 lineup of King Crimson.
Wonderfully quirky disc. Album title is 'Ghost Dance.'
I don't find 'Dart Drug' so incredibly unusual for Bailey, lest anyone be scared
off. He does leave lots of space for Muir, playing fewer notes and letting them
ring out for longer periods of time. But then, Muir requires lots of space. If
you read the liner notes for any of King Crimson's recent archival releases of
music from the 'Larks' Tongues in Aspic' period, you'll note that Robert Fripp
states again and again how Muir dominated the stage and the spotlight when he was
in the band. Thankfully, he *is* so exceptional a player that it's worth giving
him his space. And he also brings out different sides of Bailey's playing -
indeed, as Eric says, there are points at which it becomes tricky to figure out
who's doing what (like six minutes into the second track, for instance).
But it's not as atypical of Bailey's overall ouerve as, say, comparing AMM III's
"It had been an ordinary enough day in Pueblo, Colorado" to the rest of Keith
Rowe's output.
Agreed with Jon Abbey that the John Stevens duos are special, the trio with Kent
Carter as well - they don't come to my mind as readily as many others because it
actually took me a long time to warm up to Stevens. The Incus video 'Gig' is
wonderful fun. (Speaking of Incus video, has anybody seen the Milo Fine tape
yet? I'm an Incus completist but this offering leaves me warier than most,
having only read and never having heard Mr. Fine...)
Would it be easier for we Bailey fans to make a list of things we DON'T
recommend? I'd be hard pressed to do so, but I know that 'The Sign of 4' would
be squarely atop that list... On the other hand, lots of people hate the
collaboration with DJ Ninj but I quite like it, even accounting for Ninj's
limitations.
A random closing note: as I type this I'm listening to "Dart Drug" on my computer
via WinAmp and, since I'm online, I noticed that the player accessed the CDCB
database for the disc's contents and, upon not finding them, asked me to fill in
the blanks. Maybe I should start listening to all of my Incus discs while I'm
online so they all end up in the CDCB database (for whatever that's worth). What
a mildly subversive thought...
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - Derek Bailey & Jamie Muir, "I soon learned to know this flower better,"
'Dart Drug' (Incus)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 21:45:21 -0500
From: Brian Olewnick <olewnik@idt.net>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
Steve Smith wrote:
> Would it be easier for we Bailey fans to make a list of things we DON'T
> recommend? I'd be hard pressed to do so, but I know that 'The Sign of 4' would
> be squarely atop that list... On the other hand, lots of people hate the
> collaboration with DJ Ninj but I quite like it, even accounting for Ninj's
> limitations.
I'd agree with the nay vote on 'The Sign of 4'; I find it borderline
unlistenable. However, I'm also not very fond of his d 'n' b
collaborations and, perhaps surprisingly as I otherwise love Min
Xiao-Fen's playing, thought that 'Viper' didn't work very well.
However, since no-one else has yet to mention it, I'll don protective
armor and venture the opinion that 'Wireforks', his duo with Henry
Kaiser on Shanachie is pretty fantastic. Yes, Kaiser's output is wildly
inconsistent and yes, he can be a bit of a dickhead but, damn it, I
think this one is often incendiary.
Brian Olewnick
NP: Howard Shore/Ornette--soundtrack to 'Naked Lunch'--Brilliant!!!
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 22:41:56 -0500
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
On Thu, Jan 06, 2000 at 09:34:08PM -0500, Steve Smith wrote:
> A random closing note: as I type this I'm listening to "Dart Drug" on my computer
> via WinAmp and, since I'm online, I noticed that the player accessed the CDCB
> database for the disc's contents and, upon not finding them, asked me to fill in
> the blanks. Maybe I should start listening to all of my Incus discs while I'm
> online so they all end up in the CDCB database (for whatever that's worth). What
> a mildly subversive thought...
I try doing so whenever I listen to an unlisted disc. Sorta giving
back to the database. It's amazing what turns out to be listed or
not...
- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 22:44:24 -0500
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
On Thu, Jan 06, 2000 at 09:45:21PM -0500, Brian Olewnick wrote:
> I'd agree with the nay vote on 'The Sign of 4'; I find it borderline
> unlistenable. However, I'm also not very fond of his d 'n' b
> collaborations and, perhaps surprisingly as I otherwise love Min
> Xiao-Fen's playing, thought that 'Viper' didn't work very well.
Hmm... I've never quite "gotten" Bailey, but I realize that most of my
listening to him has been that set, plus the record with Christine
Jeffrey that I hated and sold a decade ago but might like now. It's
unfortunately that his perhaps most widely known recording appears to
be an atypical turkey.
- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 22:51:16 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
Brian Olewnick wrote:
> Steve Smith wrote:
>
> > Would it be easier for we Bailey fans to make a list of things we DON'T
> > recommend? I'd be hard pressed to do so, but I know that 'The Sign of 4' would
> > be squarely atop that list... On the other hand, lots of people hate the
> > collaboration with DJ Ninj but I quite like it, even accounting for Ninj's
> > limitations.
>
> I'd agree with the nay vote on 'The Sign of 4'; I find it borderline
> unlistenable. However, I'm also not very fond of his d 'n' b
> collaborations and, perhaps surprisingly as I otherwise love Min
> Xiao-Fen's playing, thought that 'Viper' didn't work very well.
I love the *sound* of Derek and Min Xiao Fen's massed strings together, but agree
that they don't quite manage to communicate much. Beyond that and the Metheny
debacle (most of which I witnessed firsthand), I actually can't think of many Bailey
collaborations I dislike. They all have something I admire, even the admittedly
spotty Haino and Ruins collaborations. The discs with John Stevens used to fit into
that category for me, but since then I've finally come to appreciate Stevens and
those discs sound quite good to me. I've never heard the collaboration with vocalist
Christine Jeffreys that Joseph mentioned, though.
'Harras' doesn't do that much for me, but I heard another encounter between Bailey,
Parker and Zorn that also included Dougie Bowne at about the same time that this disc
was recorded, and while there wasn't much going on for much of the evening, Bailey
and Bowne sounded remarkably good together, especially when Bowne played on empty
plastic water cooler jugs.
> However, since no-one else has yet to mention it, I'll don protective
> armor and venture the opinion that 'Wireforks', his duo with Henry
> Kaiser on Shanachie is pretty fantastic.
I almost mentioned it... I like this, too. Henry responds nicely to Derek's idiom in
general and this is one of the warmest-sounding Bailey recordings out there (a bit of
trivia: this was originally recorded for the New Albion label, but then that label
decided to pull out of the jazz/improv area altogether, leading to the recording
being issued on Shanachie).
Okay, here's another hare-brained thread: If you could put Bailey into a
playing/recording situation with absolutely anybody, who would it be? For me, oddly
enough, it would be accordion player Ted Reichman and up-and-coming NYC musicians
Matt Moran and John Hollenbeck on vibraphone and percussion, respectively. I heard
them play a set of complete improv with Ellery Eskelin a couple of years ago and was
blown away by their taste and spontaneity, and even sent a fax to Derek recommending
that he check them out. I guess that never happened, but if I could record DB with
anyone, that's who I'd choose.
> NP: Howard Shore/Ornette--soundtrack to 'Naked Lunch'--Brilliant!!!
Agreed wholeheartedly.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - Wynton Marsalis at the Village Vanguard (live webcast)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 20:24:46 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Pratt <tpratt9@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
- --- Brian Olewnick <olewnik@idt.net> wrote:
>
> However, since no-one else has yet to mention it,
> I'll don protective armor and venture the opinion
> that 'Wireforks', his duo with Henry Kaiser on
> Shanachie is pretty fantastic. Yes, Kaiser's output
> is wildly inconsistent and yes, he can be a bit of a
> dickhead but, damn it, I think this one is often
> incendiary.
I don't think too highly of 'Wireforks' myself (it's
actually the only Bailey disc I've sold off - though,
I never bought 'Sign Of Four'). I just don't think
Bailey works well with other guitarists at all. He
doesn't alter his style too much when he collaborates,
and it seems to force the other guitarist to imitate
him. In my opinion, this makes for annoying music.
Re: Kaiser being a dickhead... From my admittedly
limited experience with him, he's actually been a very
nice and generous guy. He was very informative and
humble in talking with me about music and even sent me
a few hard-to-find LPs free of charge. I have heard
the stories, though...
-Tom Pratt
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://im.yahoo.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 20:35:04 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Pratt <tpratt9@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
- --- Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com> wrote:
>
> Okay, here's another hare-brained thread: If you
> could put Bailey into a playing/recording situation
> with absolutely anybody, who would it be?
Le Quan Ninh.
I think those two could make a record similar but
superior to 'Dart Drug'.
-Tom Pratt
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://im.yahoo.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 20:51:14 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Pratt <tpratt9@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: more Bailey Recs
- --- Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com> wrote:
>
> Hmm... I've never quite "gotten" Bailey, but I
> realize that most of my listening to him has been
> that set, plus the record with Christine Jeffrey
> that I hated and sold a decade ago but might like
> now.
Well, this Bailey fan thinks the Jeffrey duo is pretty
mediocre too - definitely amongst his weakest records.
I can easily understand why you haven't liked his
stuff much. Check out 'Aida' or 'Incus Taps', though,
and tell us what you think.
-Tom Pratt
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://im.yahoo.com
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #824
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