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Zorn List Digest       Friday, December 10 1999       Volume 02 : Number 812



In this issue:
-
       how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?
       Re: how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?
       Flux Quartet: The Dead Man & Sonic Youth
       lester picks
       Africa/Judaism
       The New Generation
       record bins binge
       Re: how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?
       RE: bowie
       Gismonti/Off topic
       RE: heads up -- more mp3s
       Re: Gismonti/Off topic
       Re: bowie
       Re: how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?
       Bartok Album
       RE: Bartok Album
       my first two AEC...
       Re: my first two AEC...
       Does anyone know where I can find Eda Wobu by AEC?
       Re: bailey-mengelberg
       RV: Gismonti/Off topic
       Zorn "game piece" premiere?/Erik Friedlander gig info

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 12:42:02 -0800
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?

    I lost track of what the Boredoms did recently and I was wondering
what people think of SUPER AR, compared to their early recordings.

    Thanks,

    Patrice.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1999 15:51:33 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?

In a message dated 12/8/99 3:42:41 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< I lost track of what the Boredoms did recently and I was wondering
what people think of SUPER AR, compared to their early recordings.  >>

it's very different from their earlier style, which I think was best
exemplified by Pop Tatari. their more recent work, beginning with Super Ar
(with Ar actually being a symbol, and spelled differently by everyone, we're
talking about Birdman 019 to avoid too much confusion. well, that's the
domestic version, anyway.), is more overtly Krautrock/psychedelic with three
drummers. the best record they've done in this style so far, I think, is the
just-released Vision/Creation/New Sun, currently available in an obscenely
expensive ($90-95) box, complete with a T-shirt (size M), a bonus CD of
mostly live material, and a chirping box. there's supposed to be a domestic
single CD version sometime next spring.

Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 16:04:42 -0500
From: Jeni Dahmus <[e-mail]>
Subject: Flux Quartet: The Dead Man & Sonic Youth

The Flux Quartet brilliantly performed Zorn's The Dead Man at the Miller
Theatre last Friday.  It was a delight to see how the various special
effects were produced.  There was much giggling in the audience,
especially when the performers waved their bows to create wind sounds.
The program notes neglected to mention that The Dead Man was intended as
a soundtrack to S/M scenes...

The rest of the program consisted of Conlon Nancarrow's String Quartet
No. 3, Ornette Coleman's Poets and Writers (this was not a world
premiere as rumored), Tom Chiu's Stock Series #1: Sonic Stock, Al
Giusto's Fear, Benjamin Franklin's String Quartet, and two encores.
All the pieces were fabulous, with the exception of Franklin's 18th
century work, which was nice but did not quench my thirst for
dissonance.

In light of the recent Sonic Youth thread, Chiu's Stock Series #1:
Sonic Stock may be of interest to the Zorn list.  Some of the
motives are based on, or inspired by, the work of Sonic Youth (hence the
second half of the title).  Throughout the piece, the players can
choose to interpret "stock" motives literally or freely.

The Flux Quartet's well programmed and finely executed performance was
one of my favorite concerts of the year.

Jeni

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Dec 99 16:16:08 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: lester picks

i'll agree with the sense of the list on lester's releases. the 'american gumbo'
double is a nice early set that shows his humor and has some harder playing than
you might find later. art ensemble on diw and ecm are generally the best. I
really dig the 2 ny organ ensemble discs. also, brass fantasy should get a
little due here. they were a great, powerful band whose shows were a lot of fun
and whose recordings were by and large disappointing. the one exception i'd
offer (and i haven't heard all of them) is "the fire this time," recorded during
the la riots and released about 5 years ago. stands to reason, it's a live
recording. later art ensemble discs can also be disappointing, but i think all
of his solo stuff is worthwhile.

pulled out david murray live at the ocean club the other night, with bowie, fred
hopkins and phillip wilson. all but the leader have left us.



- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Dec 99 16:23:27 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Africa/Judaism

Dr. Wilkie sez:   The big difference is that
"Africa" is not an African notion, but originally a European one:
Judaism is, on the contrary, a Jewish notion.

True enough, but then I'm the one being Eurocentric, not the performers. The
point remains the same about African American performers who adopt names,
clothing, instruments, philosophies, etc. from the African continent, whether
they be Egyptian, Swahili or South African.

And while some do gravitate toward a particular region or cultural tradition
(and of course some, like Abdullah Ibrahim, have genuine connections to those
cultures), others do adopt Africa as a whole. You could argue that they are
being Eurocentric as well, but it's a fact of history that most African
Americans aren't able to pinpoint their origin more closely than one huge
continent. The fact that they feel a connection to the land where people that
look like them come from, even if there's no specific records, is not in itself
a European construct.

kg



- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Dec 99 16:28:03 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: The New Generation

Jon mentioned: my problem with it
isn't only that the "New Generations" sublist contained within contains the
whole Tzadik roster

While the pamphlet's certainly prejudiced toward Avant/Tzadik releases, in
fairness those rosters are paired down a little. Melt Banana, for one, are
excised.



- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 17:10:00 -0500
From: "Bob Kowalski" <[e-mail]>
Subject: record bins binge

For a group that scoffs at the New Yorker interview pondering Zorn's =
recording collection, I find the ongoing "where do we put these avant =
things discussion" (itself an off shoot of numerous earlier discussions =
re: different arrangement schemes) amusing.  (maybe frustrating if I read =
all the nitty gritty...even in digest version)

I'm sure I miss the bigger scheme of discussion, what with the old and new =
guards and where do all things Zorn fit / not fit.  I find arrangements by =
size & color pleasing to the eye but plain old alphabetical tends to work =
when actually trying to find something among all the discs that these =
wonderfully prolific musicians are producing.  The shops that are =
splitting discs up into sub genres of sub genres are making browsing a bit =
of a pain in the ass. =20

Maybe if all music in the land were just arranged by sales, we'd end up =
finding this stuff on the far end anyways

; )

Peace from Somerville=20

Bob

ps: y'all like the group Big Ass Truck? Most cool band with two turntables =
and a Memphis take Zeppelin as a dance band...I think.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1999 15:25:36 -0800
From: [e-mail] (Dave Trenkel)
Subject: Re: how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?

At 12:42 PM 12/8/99, Patrice L. Roussel wrote:
>        I lost track of what the Boredoms did recently and I was wondering
>what people think of SUPER AR, compared to their early recordings.
>
>        Thanks,
>
>        Patrice.
>
>-

I don't like it as much as some of their earlier records, but when I saw
them last summer, they were playing material from Super AR and it was
fantastic live. One of the best psychedelic/hippie percussion jam band
shows ever, not exactly somthing I'd ever thought I'd say about the
Boredoms...

________________________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : [e-mail]  : www.peak.org/~improv/

"...there will come a day when you won't have to use
gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in
your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper
type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em
together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em
together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire."
                                            -Sun Ra
________________________________________________________



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 01:30:28 -0200
From: "Hugo Linares" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: bowie

>Ken Waxman
>(who never thought he was "angry" just "passionate")
>


Ok Ken, it was just only a joke. You have a good sense of humour (humor for
Americans), haven't you?
You wrote a pretty good article anyway!!

Hugo Linares (who didn't expect such a reaction from Mike or Ken himself)



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 01:40:25 -0200
From: "Hugo Linares" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Gismonti/Off topic

Hi Zornheads!

Do anyone know where to get information on Egberto Gismonti's label (Carmo)?


Thanks in advance,

Hugo







- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1999 21:04:56 -0800
From: "Benito Vergara" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: heads up -- more mp3s

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]]
> Sent: Monday, December 06, 1999 1:53 PM

> Is there something wrong with my mp3 player, or are all these Naked City
> clips roughly 15 seconds.
> how would I get the full songs?

Sorry for responding so long -- there must be something wrong with your mp3
player (or your newsreader). Maybe you grabbed only the first segment or
something? The shortest mp3 posted is less than a minute long.

Just to let you folks know, my/our intrepid benefactor has just posted live
boots from Living Colour and Carla Bley concerts. Latest one to be posted is
a Sonny Sharrock concert.

Later,
Ben

http://www.bigfoot.com/~bvergara/
ICQ# 12832406


- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 08:12:49 +0100
From: "Thomas Queins" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Gismonti/Off topic

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01BF421D.2E90F580
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    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

he was (still is?) on ECM and if I rememenber right I saw his Carmo =
stuff on an ECM catalogue. Suppose it's a kind of sub-ECM-label

Thomas----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Hugo Linares=20
  To: Zorn-list=20
  Sent: Thursday, December 09, 1999 4:40 AM
  Subject: Gismonti/Off topic


  Hi Zornheads!

  Do anyone know where to get information on Egberto Gismonti's label =
(Carmo)?


  Thanks in advance,

  Hugo







  -


- ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01BF421D.2E90F580
Content-Type: text/html;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>he was (still is?) on ECM and if I =
rememenber right=20
I saw his Carmo stuff on an ECM catalogue. Suppose it's a kind of=20
sub-ECM-label</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thomas</FONT>----- Original Message =
- ----- </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]" =
title=[e-mail]>Hugo=20
  Linares</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
  href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]"=20
  title=[e-mail]>Zorn-list</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, December 09, =
1999 4:40=20
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Gismonti/Off =
topic</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>Hi Zornheads!<BR><BR>Do anyone know where to get =
information on=20
  Egberto Gismonti's label (Carmo)?<BR><BR><BR>Thanks in=20
  =
advance,<BR><BR>Hugo<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>-<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></B=
ODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01BF421D.2E90F580--


- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 10:52:16 CET
From: "Andreas Dietz" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: bowie

>
> >any suggestions as to where to start in Lester Bowie's work?
>

I would recommend the following two:

LESTER BOWIE QUINTET / THE 5TH POWER (Black Saint)
recorded: MILANO, 4/78

LESTER BOWIE    TP
ARTHUR BLYTHE    AS
AMINA CLAUDINE MYERS    P VOC
MALACHI FAVORS    B
PHILLIP WILSON    DR

SARDEGNA AMORE
THREE IN ONE
BBB
GOD HAS SMILED ON ME
THE 5TH POWER


KAHIL EL'ZABAR THE RITUAL / SACRED LOVE
recorded: CHICAGO, 11/85

LESTER BOWIE    TP
RAPHAEL GARRETT    CL PER
MALACHI FAVORS    B
KAHIL EL'ZABAR    DR SAN VOC PER

DAY OF THE CELESTIALS
THE INNER SEARCH
EARTH SONG
THERE IS NO GREATER LOVE

Andreas Dietz

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 06:55:04 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: how is Boredoms's SUPER AR?

From: Andrew Marks@DSPT on 12/09/99 06:55 AM
This is a GREAT album! Again, quite a departure from the
older jump-cut type of stuff. I really like their new, trippy, jammy
direction that they're going in.
Another great album is Super Roots 8. It's basically
1 song, but there are 3 pretty different versions of it. I like the second
one the best,
where they lock into a groove and then just keep upping the intensity of it
every few minutes, then mellowing out at the end.



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 13:00:49 +0100
From: Stephen Fruitman <[e-mail]>
Subject: Bartok Album

Anyone have any comments on the Muszikas/Marta Sebastyn/Alexander Balanescu
CD _The Bartok Album_? I=B4d also like to know the label and catalogue
number, if possible. Thanks, Stephen





- --------------

Bj=F6rn Olsson,
Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia,
Ume=E5 universitet
901 87 Ume=E5
tel. [phone] fax 143374
e-post: [e-mail]



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 10:08:04 -0300
From: Linares Hugo <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Bartok Album

Seconded.
Also will be welcome any other Balanescu recommendation apart from the
Kraftwerk kind of tribute cd "Possessed".

Thank you,

Hugo Linartes



> -----Mensaje original-----
> De:    Stephen Fruitman [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Enviado el:    Jueves 9 de Diciembre de 1999 9:01 AM
> Para:    [e-mail]
> Asunto:    Bartok Album
>=20
> Anyone have any comments on the Muszikas/Marta Sebastyn/Alexander
> Balanescu
> CD _The Bartok Album_? I=B4d also like to know the label and =
catalogue
> number, if possible. Thanks, Stephen
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> --------------
>=20
> Bj=F6rn Olsson,
> Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia,
> Ume=E5 universitet
> 901 87 Ume=E5
> tel. [phone] fax 143374
> e-post: [e-mail]
>=20
>=20
>=20
> -

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 11:20:31 -0800
From: Jason Tors <[e-mail]>
Subject: my first two AEC...

how about....

Bap-Tizum
and
Live in 72

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 11:24:44 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: my first two AEC...

Jason wrote:

>how about....

>Bap-Tizum

Excellent choice; a very great record, imho.

>Live in 72

Not sure which one this is...Among readily available releases, the sister album
to 'Bap-Tizum', 'Fanfare for the Warriors', is equally great.

Brian Olewnick




- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 13:19:09 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Does anyone know where I can find Eda Wobu by AEC?

I think it's out of print, but I've been hoping it's somewhere, any help
would be greatly appreciated.
thank you
Nick McCormick

- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 08:30:42 +0100
From: "Stefan Verstraeten" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: bailey-mengelberg

>From: "Artur Nowak" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: Misha Mengelberg?
>
>Hi Philozorners,
>
>Who's Misha Mengelberg? I have his two DIW records, both trios with
>Joey Baron and Greg Cohen. I enjoy these records tremendously and
>would like to listen to some more. I also noticed that Groud-Zero
>"plays standard" by Misha (Where Is the Police?)
>
Not immediately relevant, but if you have the chance, listen to the
following albums:
- -derek bailey: solo guitar (incus records). Here he covers this tune.
- -henry kaiser & eugene chadbourne: guitar lesson, a tribute to derek bailey
(victo records). The last track on this album (15 minutes long) is a chat
between those two players, in the same style as the cassette letters that
derek sends to his friends and fans. Well, at a certain moment kaiser talks
about that tune and how he was influenced by this track, and even plays a
cover. Weird stuff: Michelberg composes it, bailey makes an interpretation
of this tune and kaiser covers it. Sound plunderphonic to me.

Best wishes,

Stefan Verstraeten.

NP Derek Bailey: The dungeon tapes, and when this is finished, Loren
Mazzacane Connors: the dagget years (weird shit if you ask me, thank god
loren doesn't sing along anymore on his recent albums)



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 18:44:20 -0300
From: "Carlos Murat" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RV: Gismonti/Off topic

http://www.fmi.uni-passau.de/~schneide/discogr/carmo.html
- -----Mensaje original-----
De: Hugo Linares <[e-mail]>
Para: Zorn-list <[e-mail]>
Fecha: jueves, 09 de diciembre de 1999 1:36
Asunto: Gismonti/Off topic


>Hi Zornheads!
>
>Do anyone know where to get information on Egberto Gismonti's label
(Carmo)?
>
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Hugo
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-
>
>


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 02:49:25 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Zorn "game piece" premiere?/Erik Friedlander gig info

I was recently looking at the gig information on Erik Friedlander's web page,
and noticed that he lists a premiere performance of a new Zorn "game piece"
for December 10th (tonight).  It sounds very exciting, because it includes 5
improvising musicians as well as dancers (under the direction of
choreographer Lynn Shapiro).  In addition to Friedlander, apparently Marc
Ribot and Zorn himself will partake in the improvisations!  The gig is listed
to be at the "Washington Square Church", but there is no further information
on the page, such as time(s), exact location, cost, etc.  If this piece is
anything like Cobra, or any of Zorn's other "game pieces", it should
definatly be worth seeing.  (Friedlander's website address is:
www.erikfriedlander.com)

I was wondering if anyone on the list had any further information on the
performance, location, etc.  It doesn't seem that widely publicized (it
wasn't listed on DMG gig list), so I was curious if it's even happening at
all.  What made me skeptical was that Friedlander listed a performance of
Marty Ehrlich's Dark Woods Ensemble as happening last night at the Knit.
Which, of course, didn't happen since Ehrlich was performing there with his
group "Traveler's Tales."  So could someone tell me what the fuck is going
on?!  I don't want to drive up to NYC and find out that it's not happening!
I also heard that the Masada sextet was performing at Anthology on the 12th.
Is this true, or is it on the 17th?  Thanks for your time, and sorry if I'm
bothering anyone with this message.

Evan

"I always wanted to be a lesbian"
- -John Waters

- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V2 #812
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