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Zorn List Digest       Wednesday, April 28 1999       Volume 02 : Number 654



In this issue:
-
       Re: fantomassss
       "insect"-improv +
       real audio
       Masada show on May 14?
       Re: Cobra 4/23 & film descriptions
       Re: "insect" improv, & more tetreault
       Re: real audio
       Masada in Chicago!!!!
       Re: Braxton's 'News from the 70s'
       Fred Frith: Guitar Solos
       Re: Braxton's 'News from the 70s'
       Re: tetreault
       feldman
       frisell question
       Re: frisell question
       Re: fantomassss

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:24:35 -0500
From: Diego Gruber <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: fantomassss

actually, i live in south america, but the information i get, yes, comes
from the us. i don't know about release dates in europe or australia,
better check out www.fantomas.net or www.cv.org. you can even download a
couple of real audios there which are pretty impressive. New Mr. Bungle
record was supposed to come out in may at first, so you probably got
confused with that. finally mr. bungle's "california" was finally put
for release on July 13th.


Diego

sonny shine wrote:
>
> YES! *has to go blow her wad($)*
>
> i've been waiting! but i was told it was due out in may? you are in the
> us, right?
>
> son
>
> --- Diego Gruber <[e-mail]> wrote:
> > check out mike patton's new band fantomas, their
> > debut album is already
> > out in stores. all comments so far say it's awesome.
> >
> >
> > DG
> >
> >
> >
> > -
> >
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
> -



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:26:16 -0400
From: David Keffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: "insect"-improv +

>From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: tetrault/lussier: bad-ass
>UNSOLICITED OPINION, FREE OF CHARGE
>No one asked, but I just got the Martin Tetrault / Rene Lussier duo
>record on Ambiances Magnetiques, and it rocks the house.  Free-
>improv, "insect"-improv, definitely noise...lots of stuff happening,
>really, really fast.  I myself don't care for much of the derek
>bailey I've heard (still working on that, though), so don't rely on
>the poverse descriptions I'm spewing.  Nonetheless---it's the kind of

Well now, "insect"-improv is a phrase with a nice ring to it.
If I knew what it meant, I would be using it in complete sentences
all the time.  Please define.  Also, be so kind as to cite some
common examples of classics in the "insect"-improv genre.  (I am
not familiar with the example given above.)

Also:  poverse is not in my dictionary.  Please define that too and,
along with the definition, please state whether this is a word of
your own creation or not.  Thanks.  (I have serious doubts as to
the legitimacy of the word since, after my unsuccessful
consultation with Mr. Noah Webster,  I searched the internet and
found, among the 18 billion web pages in existence, zero usages
of the word poverse.)  Perhaps you meant perverse?

David "trying to learn a new word every day" K.

p.s.
yesterday's word was emoticon.  ;}



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:41:56 -0400
From: David Keffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: real audio

>From: [e-mail]
>Subject: Re: Real Audio streaming
>Of course, the easiest way to record RA streaming audio is to *buy* the
>latest version of RA G3 and simply hit the "record" button...

That sort of defeats the whole purpose of
free music on the internet.
Not to mention, it would defeat the whole "internet outlaw"
image that I had been hoping to cultivate...

Also, not to mention the "latest version" of RA G3 will cease
to be the latest version in a few months.
I encourage you to resist the temptation to be lured
into the cycle of consumerism brought on
by endless software upgrades, and to instead opt for,
where-ever possible, usage of "out-dated" software,
which makes the "latest version" immediately obsolete,
and thus attempts to end, or at least slow, the cycle
(as was done by using notepad & netscape (freeware) to
download Real Audio source files.)

David "Wild Bill Gates" K.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:00:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: William York <[e-mail]>
Subject: Masada show on May 14?

I heard something about Masada playing on May 14 in NYC and was wondering
if anyone knew if this is happening and, if so, where?

Thanks,

WY


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 13:59:35 -0400
From: David Beardsley <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Cobra 4/23 & film descriptions

> More info about the films is on the Downtown
> Music Gallery's site: www.DTMGallery.com.

You might not find anything on the index.htm page.

Try here: http://www.dtmgallery.com/afa_zorn.htm

Too bad I missed the show, I wanted to see Flaming Creatures again,
plus the other films and Cobra.


- --
* D a v i d         B e a r d s l e y
*           [e-mail]
*
* J u x t a p o s i t i o n     E z i n e
* M E L A  v i r t u a l  d r e a m house monitor
*
* http://www.virtulink.com/immp/lookhere.htm

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 12:43:46 PDT
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: "insect" improv, & more tetreault

>Well now, "insect"-improv is a phrase with a nice ring to it.
>If I knew what it meant, I would be using it in complete sentences
>all the time.  Please define.

I wish I could say I made this up, but I didn't.  I believe I first
heard the phrase in an interview w/ Bailey or Parker, or in Corbett's
EXTENDED PLAY, or in liner notes to Gustaffson's PARROT FISH EYE,
maybe. I believe others have heard it, too, because if memory serves,
Gino Robair used the term in a capsule descrip. of a record by
Christian Munthe.

>Also, be so kind as to cite some
>common examples of classics in the "insect"-improv genre.  (I am
>not familiar with the example given above.)

Classics?  I dunno, but I think Derek Bailey fits
the bill sometimes.  Adjectives come to mind: "pointilistic" and
"quiet" come to mind.  Speed comes to mind.  The stuttering of Evan
Parker comes to mind, but the stuttering of Braxton does not.
Europe, mostly.  I've heard the new Gustafsson/Christmann duo on
Okkadisk is pretty extreme Generation Next insect, and I think
someone on this list or chi-improv described it as such.  I'm not
well-listened enough.  The early SME I've heard doesn't seem kinetic
enough.  I'd be interested to hear more experienced listeners'
comments of the e(n)t(y/o)mology of this tradition.

>Also:  poverse is not in my dictionary.  Please define that too and,
>along with the definition, please state whether this is a word of
>your own creation or not.  Thanks.  (I have serious doubts as to
>the legitimacy of the word since, after my unsuccessful
>consultation with Mr. Noah Webster,  I searched the internet and
>found, among the 18 billion web pages in existence, zero usages
>of the word poverse.)  Perhaps you meant perverse?
>
>David "trying to learn a new word every day" K.
>
>p.s.
>yesterday's word was emoticon.  ;}

I'm flattered you would run down the Web for a piece of portmanteau.
"Poverse" is me being swung all kinds of ways by my subconscious:
E.P. Thompson, Joe McPhee, scripture, and folk culture.  I suppose I
did make it up.  Wish I'd known it at the time. >:-o

BTW, in my fit of enthusiasm (enthousiasmos=demon possession) I
really didn't do the Lussier/Tetreault DUR NOYAU DUR justice.  A lot
of ambient moments, some gorgeous acoustic guitar by Lussier, and
some overdubbed material.  The "live" material is most impressive for
its sheer variety, though.  I'd be interested in some Lussier
suggestions, if there any "enthusiasts" out there.

- ------s, jocoserious




_______________________________________________________________
Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:06:47 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: real audio

In a message dated 4/27/99 1:39:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< >From: [e-mail]
 >Subject: Re: Real Audio streaming
 >Of course, the easiest way to record RA streaming audio is to *buy* the
 >latest version of RA G3 and simply hit the "record" button...

 That sort of defeats the whole purpose of
 free music on the internet.
 Not to mention, it would defeat the whole "internet outlaw"
 image that I had been hoping to cultivate...
  >>

Just color me old fashioned.

I don't know if you are just pulling my leg and i'm certainly not meaning to
start an arguement or to be accused of the off-topic posting...but where did
this "free music on the internet" assumption come from?  Never heard it
before your quote.  Sure, you can download free legit and not-so-legit files
such as MP3s and RAs, but how is it that the company who updates and sells a
product such as RealAudio all of a sudden become the bad guy for making money
for their hard work?

I guess I don't have to say what field i've chosen as an occupation...

=dgasque=

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 19:47:29 -0500
From: King Wilson <[e-mail]>
Subject: Masada in Chicago!!!!

According to the Tribune today, Masada is billed to play Jazz Fest this
year.  I don't remember the exact date, but the fest is in September.....
  finally, Zorn comes back to Chicago.....



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 23:07:04 -0400
From: Brian Lindsay <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Braxton's 'News from the 70s'

William York <[e-mail]> wrote
>Subject: Braxton's 'News from the 70s'
>
>I've been listening to this CD on New Tone which just came out - I
can't
>remember if it's been discussed here...Anyway, it's really excellent
and
>has some great quartet stuff w/ Dave Holland, Barry Altschul, Kenny
>Wheeler, George Lewis, etc.

Just curious....

- - This is live or studio? (and if live, what venue?)
- - What year was it recorded?
- - Where can this be ordered from? (the online places I checked didn't
list it)


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 21:57:10 -0700
From: "Christian Heslop" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Fred Frith: Guitar Solos

     A few weeks ago I requested recommendations on Fred Frith material from
the group. There were a lot of helpful responses so it was difficult to
sort through and settle on a single title. I'd like to say that I'm not as
obsessive about music purchases as the other members of the group seem to
be; rather let's say that I am not as passionate in my dedication to new
music as my revolutionary brothers and sisters on the zorn-list.(A phrase
inspired by many hours spent poring over North Korean propaganda.)
    I decided on Guitar Solos because I am a dabbler in the Classical guitar
and I am always on the lookout for serious music designed with
compositional purposes in mind rather than the typical guitar hero crap. My
previous exposure to Frith was very limited.
    One of the recommendations that I received said something like "...it
sounds like he has about six fingers." That statement and the title led me
to believe that it would be a display of conventional guitar method in a
musically original idiom. To more accurately reflect my expectations I will
say that I thought he would be "tearing up the fretboard" and making
interesting music at the same time.
    I think that the cover of the album, Frith's face in dark shadows looking
over the body of the guitar with a small mirror in his right hand and the
simple title evoking something like an Yngwie Malmsteen burnin' solos
collection, are absolute sneaky genius considering the content. I like to
imagine that some GI-tar hero bought it expecting to learn some new riffs.
    I'm not as experienced a listener as the other group members. Most of the
names and topics on this group are completely unknown to me, but I do have
a special folder where I keep all of these as purchasing references for the
future. In any case, what I heard amazed me.
    I don't know if he is the first to so completely redefine what guitar play
is-but it's the first I've heard it. Despite all these technical
variations, it never comes off as being gimmicky. It's merely an expansion
of the textural palette of the electric guitar. The audacity of this work
is truly inspiring. I lack the resources to seriously discuss the music
itself. Anything after Schoenberg I have to approach on a gut level of
understanding (which may be more reliable). I will say that these sounds
stayed with me long after the disc had stopped playing. I heard them in the
city, at school, and I allowed their memory to drown out the inanity and
mediocrity that surrounds me.
    Any one of these pieces would offend "the public", but he persisted. No
matter what one may think of the music, this album's contribution to the
voice of the guitar alone is worth the cumulative careers of every Best New
Artist winner since the inception of the Grammys.(That's just a toss
off-pay it no serious mind).
    My superlatives are more the result of my unfortunately persistent
ignorance of "avant-garde" music, than an informed conviction. I am not
trying to produce an invulnerable critique, I am merely attempting to
communicate the ecstasy of discovery and epiphany. As I am discovering
things that many of you may have long since begun to take for granted, my
enthusiasm might invite attack-but I might be feeling that way because I
have spent too much time in rec.music.classical.guitar. Thank you
Zorn-List.

                Christian


- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 07:41:02 +0200
From: "Francesco Martinelli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Braxton's 'News from the 70s'

> - This is live or studio? (and if live, what venue?)

both. Among the venues, NY Town Hall, and theaters in Europe: Nantes,
Groningen, unkown...

> - What year was it recorded?

between 1970 and 1976

> - Where can this be ordered from? (the online places I checked didn't
> list it)

cuneiform
Francesco


- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 03:04:11 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: tetreault

In a message dated 4/27/99 3:47:26 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< BTW, in my fit of enthusiasm (enthousiasmos=demon possession) I
really didn't do the Lussier/Tetreault DUR NOYAU DUR justice.  A lot
of ambient moments, some gorgeous acoustic guitar by Lussier, and
some overdubbed material.  The "live" material is most impressive for
its sheer variety, though.  I'd be interested in some Lussier
suggestions, if there any "enthusiasts" out there. >>

I'm a pretty big Tetreault fan, and I wanted to chime in here a little. while
the Lussier/Tetreault disc is superb (as I've mentioned here before, Art
Lange's favorite record of 1998), I'm pretty sure that it's almost entirely
live improv without overdubs. the liner notes are in French, which I don't
speak, but I'm guessing that's what "sans superposition" means. there are two
tracks with overdubs totaling two minutes, so maybe that's what you mean.

my intent here isn't to nitpick, as to point out the fact that Tetreault is
one of the few genuine improvisers on turntables, as he demonstrates once
again on his just-released duo CD with Otomo Yoshihide, 21 Situations
(Ambiances Magnetiques), and on the also just-released Four Focuses (Amoebic)
on which Tetreault, Otomo, Sachiko M, and Yasuhiro Otani all perform solo and
duet pieces. both of these are highly recommended, as is Otani's Brain-Wash,
which is on his P@LE BLUE label.

but if you really want to be impressed with Tetreault's improv skills on the
turntable, I'd have to point you towards the solo La Nuit Ou J'ai Dit Non
(Audioview).
there's no other musicians on this one, so you know it's all him, and it's
jawdropping at times, especially considering it was all done in one take (not
explicitly stated in the liner notes, but confirmed when I interviewed him in
Victoriaville last year.) a very good musician who's finally starting to
attract some attention, which is nice to see.

Jon


- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 10:55:52 GMT0BST
From: DR S WILKIE <[e-mail]>
Subject: feldman

has anyone got info. on a new release by Wolfgang Puschnig and Mark
Feldman "spaces"? I think it's o Polygram, but it is available
outside Germany?
also: does anyone have an opinion on Pharoah Sanders' impulse album
called something like Bunkum Funkum Hunkum (but more religious)?  It
has two long tracks, including let Us Go Into the House Of the Lord,
and looks like a more jazz line-up (Woody Shaw eg) than some of
Pharoah's percussion and chanting efforts.
hywel

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 21:50:40 +1000
From: "Julian" <[e-mail]>
Subject: frisell question

Does Bill Frisell use a tremolo bar?

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 08:34:08 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: frisell question

In a message dated 4/28/99 7:56:12 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

> Does Bill Frisell use a tremolo bar?

No, any vibrato effect he gets is from his own two hands.  Alot of times he
will apply pressure on the headstock of the guitar, so as to bend the neck
slightly to give that de-tuned vibrato effect.  He does this alot with open
chord voicings, because as he says "there's usually a note or two in there
thats out of tune anyways".
- -Jody

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 06:16:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: sonny shine <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: fantomassss

oh. perhaps you are right... thanks for the web locales... i'll be sure
and check them out!

son


- --- Diego Gruber <[e-mail]> wrote:
> actually, i live in south america, but the
> information i get, yes, comes
> from the us. i don't know about release dates in
> europe or australia,
> better check out www.fantomas.net or www.cv.org. you
> can even download a
> couple of real audios there which are pretty
> impressive. New Mr. Bungle
> record was supposed to come out in may at first, so
> you probably got
> confused with that. finally mr. bungle's
> "california" was finally put
> for release on July 13th.
>
>
> Diego
>
> sonny shine wrote:
> >
> > YES! *has to go blow her wad($)*
> >
> > i've been waiting! but i was told it was due out
> in may? you are in the
> > us, right?
> >
> > son
> >
> > --- Diego Gruber <[e-mail]> wrote:
> > > check out mike patton's new band fantomas, their
> > > debut album is already
> > > out in stores. all comments so far say it's
> awesome.
> > >
> > >
> > > DG
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> _________________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Get your free @yahoo.com address at
> http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> > -
>
>
>
> -
>
>

_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V2 #654
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