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Zorn List Digest        Thursday, April 1 1999        Volume 02 : Number 638



In this issue:
-
       Re: naked city black box art
       RE: naked city black box art
       Re: Lol Coxhill
       Re: cobra presence
       Re: naked city black box art
       Re: naked city black box art
       Okay Temiz & Turkish Fusion
       Re: Lol Coxhill
       Re: cobra presence
       Re: Okay Temiz & Turkish Fusion
       Re: Okay Temiz & Turkish Fusion
       Hakim Bey: wanted
       chris cutler book
       Re: naked city black box art
       Re: chris cutler book
       Re: Lol Coxhill
       Re: Lol Coxhill
       Re: faq

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 20:45:01 -0500
From: Rick Lopez <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: naked city black box art

Caleb T. Deupree wrote:
>
> At 05:30 PM 3/31/99 -0800, Jason Tors wrote:
> >I recently lent out the black box to a workmate of mine. Someone else was
> >looking at the inside cover art and became quite offended and wanted to
> >know what the meaning behind the artwork. She was particularly struck by
> >the torture garden photos of the woman getting delimbed and whatnot. Does
> >anyone know the meaning behind the artwork on this album?
>
> Although I don't have the black box, the 'woman getting delimbed and
> whatnot' sounds like the original cover for Leng T'che, which I think is
> one of the disks in BB.
>
> (Sidebar to Mike R.:  Can we put an answer to this question in the FAQ?  It
> is very frequently asked.)
>
> Around 1905, a criminal in China (male, I think), convicted of murdering a
> prince, had his sentence commuted to the Hundred Pieces, where he was given
> a large dose of opium (not for a painkiller, but to make him live longer),
> then slowly dismembered while still alive.  The execution was photographed
> by a couple of western photographers, and the pictures were an inspiration
> for many avant garde artists in various disciplines.  The French
> ex-surrealist Georges Bataille was one such inspired person.  Supposedly he
> had all of the pictures in his collection, and found inspiration not so
> much in the actual execution, but in the look of ecstasy on the face of the
> victim, which helped him in his ideas about death and the supreme moment,
> etc.  I gather that the pictures are reproduced in some of Bataille's
> books, and I've also seen them in periodicals like Re:Search.

Right. Leng T'che is the term for "Hundred Pieces; it is in fact a man; he was
originally sentenced to be buried alive, but this was considered "inhumane"
(!); and the Bataille book is TEARS OF EROS, available from City Lights. The
pictures appear at the very end.

My goodness,
Rrrrrr
- --
Marilyn Crispell, Susie Ibarra, Sam Rivers, Matthew Shipp, David S. Ware, and
Reggie Workman discographies--Samuel Beckett Eulogy--Baseball & the 10,000
Things--Time Stops--LOVETORN--HARD BOIL--etc.,  at:
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k

***Very Various Music For Sale:
***http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/4SALE.html

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:45:03 -0800
From: "Benito Vergara" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: naked city black box art

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail]
> [mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of Caleb T. Deupree
> Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 5:14 PM

> I gather that the pictures are reproduced in some of Bataille's
> books, and I've also seen them in periodicals like Re:Search.

Specifically, _The Tears of Eros_ (put out by City Lights Books, I believe)
in 1989.

Later,
Ben

np: herbie hancock, "maiden voyage"

http://www.bigfoot.com/~bvergara/
ICQ# 12832406



- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 20:43:31 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Lol Coxhill

In a message dated 3/31/99 6:31:37 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< I've never heard anything by Lol Coxhill and am looking to fix that.
What's his best stuff? >>

while I've never been completely blown away by Coxhill, I do like his duet
record with Pat Thomas on Scatter, One Night In Glasgow. there hasn't been
anything new on Scatter in a long time, though, so I wonder if they're still
around. I hope they are; they released some great records, including ones by
Dislocation and the XIII Ghosts.

Jon

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:25:23 +0900 (JST)
From: katsuhiro hayasaka <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: cobra presence

On Tue, 30 Mar 1999 22:46:30 EST
[e-mail] wrote:

> those of you around the country:
>
> are there any other groups besides the one here in cincinnati doing cobra
> regularly? i know cobra is rather played-out in nyc (and probably northern
> ca), but is this city as surprisingly-lucky as it seems???
>

Here in Tokyo, John Zorn's Cobra Tokyo Operations are doing regularly
for 5 years. You should see Koichi Makigami's web site.

http://www.st.rim.or.jp/~makigami/index-e.html

April 11
prompter: Naruyoshi Kikuchi
Toru Kawakami (cello), Masaaki Kikuchi (contrabass), Tatsunobu Goto
(violin), Satomi Kobayashi (harp), Jun Saito (contrabass), Udai Shika
(cello), Keiko Shiga (viola), Yoshihiko Maeda (cello), Jun Yamamoto
(viola), Takeshi Watanabe (violin)

May 29
prompter: Koichi Makigami
Yoshiyuki Kawaguchi (sax,etc), Masami Kurihara (recorder,etc), Yoshiki
Sakurai (guitar,etc), Takero Sekijima (tuba,etc), Genichi Tamura (pedal
steel guitar,etc), darie (voice,keyboard), Toshiaki Chiku (vocal,guitar),
Kasyu Tosyun (drums,etc), Kimitaka Matsumae (syn,sampler), Yokan Mizue
(tp,etc), Takashi Yasui (recorder), Tadahiko Yokokawa (violin)

June 27
prompter: Koichi Makigami
Hiromi Uekusa (cello), Dogen Kinowaki (flute), Michihiro Sato (shamisen),
"Keiji Haino"!!!  Kumiko Takara (percussion), Koichi Osamu (bass),
Sachiko Matsubara (sampler), Miki Maruta (koto), Michiyo Yagi (koto),
Mikako Mihashi (vocal), Yasuhiro Yoshigaki (drums)


- -----------------------
Katsuhiro Hayasaka
[e-mail]
- -----------------------

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 07:28:33 +0200
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: naked city black box art

Patrice asked:

> The pictures are perfect illustrations of the title. Which means that the
> question to ask is really:
>
>     Why Torture Garden?

Probably because it is one fine example of the "Terror = Beauty" aesthetics
that are favored by so many 20th century avant-gardists. Another often quoted
example from that same era is Comte de Lautreamont's "Maldoror", as would be
"L'Oeuil (The Eye)" by George Bataille.

Frankco.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 22:28:17 +6400 (PST)
From: "m. rizzi" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: naked city black box art

Caleb T. Deupree, demi-God and Icon sez:
>
>(Sidebar to Mike R.:  Can we put an answer to this question in the FAQ?  It
>is very frequently asked.)

    Sure thang. If someone could write the Question
    and Answer, then I'd be happy to include it in
    the FAQ (I'm kinda swamped at the moment...new
    job and all).

    Self-promoting reference: the uncredited photo
    on the Black Box obi was taken by yours truly.

    cheers,
    mike

- --
[e-mail] -------------------------------------- www.browbeat.com
                   "Another nerd with a soulpatch"
- -------- browbeat magazine, po box 11124, oakland, ca 94611-1124 -------

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:35:09 +0300
From: =?iso-8859-9?Q?"=DCM=DDT_BAYKARA"?= <[e-mail]>
Subject: Okay Temiz & Turkish Fusion

If you're into Okay Temiz, there are many albums that you can check out. My
personal favorite OT album is "Zikir" which he did with Aka Gunduz, a sufi
ney player. Another one may be "Green Wave". I don't like his latest stuff,
because he is getting away from experimental music towards a more
traditional one...There's another Turkish band called Asia Minor (there are
two groups with the same name and this one is completely Turkish) which
combines traditional Turkish music with jazz. Not much fusion but very
interesting and melodic. Also, there's a legendary Anatolian folk/rock
group Mogollar, which is a must for anyone who wants to hear some
interesting Turkish music...

Cheers,
Umit.






- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 02:47:41 -0500
From: eric ong <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Lol Coxhill

><< I've never heard anything by Lol Coxhill and am looking to fix that.
>What's his best stuff? >>
>
>while I've never been completely blown away by Coxhill, I do like his duet
>record with Pat Thomas on Scatter, One Night In Glasgow. there hasn't been
>anything new on Scatter in a long time, though, so I wonder if they're still
>around. I hope they are; they released some great records, including ones by
>Dislocation and the XIII Ghosts.

His "Digswell Duets" LP (Random Radar) from the late 70's is also quite
good.  Coxill plays with Veryan Weston (piano) on Side B, and Simon
Emmerson (electronics) on A.  I guess retrospectively, having heard Evan
Parker's (and others') work with electronics, the duet with Emmerson is not
mind-blowing, but I find myself listening to it often for the same reasons
I like the older electronic music from Xenakis, Behrman, Nordheim, etc.  I
haven't heard that "Three Blokes" disc off FMP yet, but I hear it's not
bad.  Honestly, I think most Coxhill is quite good.  The only stuff I'd
recommend not checking out is his Melody Four work.  Melody Four often gets
really cheesy, his kids singing on some tracks (I can faintly remember) --
just silly.

eric.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 03:11:13 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: cobra presence

In a message dated 3/31/99 10:27:34 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< You should see Koichi Makigami's web site. >>

speaking of Koichi, who's scheduled to make a rare NYC appearance in the Old
Office on 4/20, does anyone know how I could get a copy of his Koroshi No
Blues, a 1993 release on Toshiba EMI? I'm a big fan, and I've never been able
to find this.

Jon

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 09:58:23 +0200
From: "Francisco Fonz-GarcΘs" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Okay Temiz & Turkish Fusion

When were "Zikir" and "Green Wave" recorded? I only got his famous "Dervish"
and "Live in Europe"
I'm looking for some stuff from Mogollar and Asia Minor, but it's diffucult to
find Turkish music here (apart from Grup Baran, Baris Manτo, Grup Yorum, Askin
Nuryengi or Sezen Aksu, musicians like these)

Ciao
Paco Fonz
Huesca (Spain)

?M?T BAYKARA wrote:

> If you're into Okay Temiz, there are many albums that you can check out. My
> personal favorite OT album is "Zikir" which he did with Aka Gunduz, a sufi
> ney player. Another one may be "Green Wave". I don't like his latest stuff,
> because he is getting away from experimental music towards a more
> traditional one...There's another Turkish band called Asia Minor (there are
> two groups with the same name and this one is completely Turkish) which
> combines traditional Turkish music with jazz. Not much fusion but very
> interesting and melodic. Also, there's a legendary Anatolian folk/rock
> group Mogollar, which is a must for anyone who wants to hear some
> interesting Turkish music...
>
> Cheers,
> Umit.
>
> -





- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 13:17:26 +0300
From: =?iso-8859-9?Q?"=DCM=DDT_BAYKARA"?= <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Okay Temiz & Turkish Fusion

Green Wave was recorded in 1992 and  Zikir in 1979. You can find the fu=
ll
discography of Okay Temiz at :

http://www.goldenhorn.com/okaytemiz.html

I do not recommend the other musicians that you mentioned except the ea=
rly
works of Baris Manco . (The ones he did until 1990). It is usually pop
music mixed with some anatolian rock themes. Unfortunately, he passed a=
way
recently and he regained his popularity nowadays...A compilation named
'Mancoloji' is released after his death which may be the easiest one to=

find...

Besides if you see anything from Mogollar or Asia Minor, grab it...

Cheers,
Umit.



>When were "Zikir" and "Green Wave" recorded? I only got his famous
"Dervish"
>and "Live in Europe"
>I'm looking for some stuff from Mogollar and Asia Minor, but it's
diffucult to
>find Turkish music here (apart from Grup Baran, Baris Man=E7o, Grup Yo=
rum,
Askin
>Nuryengi or Sezen Aksu, musicians like these)

>Ciao
>Paco Fonz
>Huesca (Spain)


>> If you're into Okay Temiz, there are many albums that you can check =
out.
My
>> personal favorite OT album is "Zikir" which he did with Aka Gunduz, =
a
sufi
>> ney player. Another one may be "Green Wave". I don't like his latest=

stuff,
>> because he is getting away from experimental music towards a more
>> traditional one...There's another Turkish band called Asia Minor (th=
ere
are
>> two groups with the same name and this one is completely Turkish) wh=
ich
>> combines traditional Turkish music with jazz. Not much fusion but ve=
ry
>> interesting and melodic. Also, there's a legendary Anatolian folk/ro=
ck
>> group Mogollar, which is a must for anyone who wants to hear some
>> interesting Turkish music...
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Umit.




=



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 17:13:59 PST
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Hakim Bey: wanted

I'd very much like to own the Axiom CD featuring Hakim Bey reading some
of his own writings, from TAZ I think.  If anyone's willing to part with
theirs, I'm looking.

Thanks much,


- -----s
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 17:40:40 PST
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: chris cutler book

Has anyone read Chris Cutler's book FILE UNDER: POPULAR, published by
Semiotext(e)?  I ran across the description on the Autonomedia page.
Also saw a book by Richard Kostelantz, who's written a nice little book
on John Cage, from a rather personal point of view.

- -----s
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 20:54:54 -0500
From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: naked city black box art

At 10:28 PM 3/31/99 +6400, m. rizzi wrote:
>>
>>Can we put an answer to this question in the FAQ?  It
>>is very frequently asked.)
>
>    Sure thang. If someone could write the Question
>    and Answer, then I'd be happy to include it in
>    the FAQ (I'm kinda swamped at the moment...new
>    job and all).

Here's a proposal pulling together info from the different responses this
time around.  If someone on the list wants to add something corrective,
more definitive, etc., please do.  And FWIW, because of all this discussion
I listened to LT again, and find it much more interesting than I've
expressed in previous posts (I think I was so repelled by the cover art
that it infected my hearing of the music).

Q.  What's the story on the cover art for Leng T'che, repeated in the Black
Box?

A.  Around 1905, a criminal in China, convicted of murdering a prince, had
his sentence commuted from being buried alive to the more merciful (!)
Hundred Pieces (the Leng T'che of the title).   He was given a large dose
of opium (not for a painkiller, but to make him survive the execution),
then slowly dismembered while still alive.  The execution was photographed
by a couple of western photographers, and the pictures were an inspiration
for many avant garde artists in various disciplines.  The French
ex-surrealist Georges Bataille was one such inspired person.  He had all of
the pictures in his collection, and found inspiration not so much in the
actual execution, but in the look of ecstasy on the face of the victim in
the pictures.  The pictures are reproduced in Bataille's book The Tears of
Eros (City Lights).


- --
Caleb Deupree
[e-mail]

Computers are useless; they can only give you answers
- -- Pablo Picasso

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 21:06:07 -0500
From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: chris cutler book

At 05:40 PM 4/1/99 PST, Scott Handley wrote:
>Has anyone read Chris Cutler's book FILE UNDER: POPULAR, published by
>Semiotext(e)?

It's been a long time, but I remember this book favorably as one of the
earliest critical theory books on popular music dealing with any kind of
avant garde.  First published in 1985 based on articles as early as 1980,
it contains articles on What Is Popular Music, Sun Ra, the Residents, Phil
Ochs and Elvis, Progressive Music in the UK, Progressive Music and
Progressive Politics, and the central essay on Necessity and Choice in
Musical Forms, with specific examples drawn from his experience in Henry
Cow and RIO.

- --
Caleb Deupree
[e-mail]

Computers are useless; they can only give you answers
- -- Pablo Picasso

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:29:15 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Lol Coxhill

I have two Lol Coxhill albums that are quite good, but I have no idea if they
are in print or not.  The first is an album with a pianist named Steve Miller
called Coxhill/Miller Miller/Coxhill. on Virgin Records 1973  Mostly duets,
but a few tunes have Pip Pyl, percussion,  Richard Sinclair bass and Phil
Miller on guitar
    The second is a double album on Ampx Records 1971 entitled ear of
beholder.  I haven't heard it in years, but thank for reminding me I have it,
for now I can listen to it with an older, more mature ear.
    I wonder how many gems are sitting in our collections that just has
not made its way to the turntable or CD player in years?

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:32:39 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Lol Coxhill

Here is a bio I got from Music Blvd. P.S. Ear of the Beholder is still
available.

All Music Guide, Volume 1, # 1
by Ron Wynn

Famous for his unaccompanied, unorthodox concerts and albums, Lol Coxhill has
an immediately identifiable soprano and sopranino style. He's perhaps Steve
Lacy's prime rival in getting odd sounds out of the soprano with his
wrenching, twisting, quirky solos. While Coxhill's an accomplished
saxophonist and can play conventional bebop, it's his winding, flailing
soprano and sopranino lines that make him stand out. He actually started
playing more conservatively; Coxhill backed visiting American soul and blues
vocalists in the '60s, playing behind Rufus Thomas, Lowell Fulson and Champon
Jack Dupree. He worked with Steve Miller's group Delivery in 1969 and 1970,
and played with them at the Berlin Music Festival. But his debut album =Ear
of the Beholder= established a new direction for Coxhill. Since then, he's
worked with both bebop and free musicians, among them Chris McGregor, Trevor
Watts, Bobby Wellins and Company. Coxhill's also played with such groups as
the Recedents, Standard Conversions and the Melody Four. He currently has no
releases available on CD in America. ~ Ron Wynn



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:42:20 -0500
From: "wetboy" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: faq

here's my contribution to the faq:

q: what does the writing on the back of the painkiller cd buried secrets
mean? where is it from?

a: in the chicago area there was serial killer named william heirens who, at
the murder scene of frances brown, wrote on the wall in lipstick

For heAVens
SAke cAtch Me
BeFore I Kill More
I cannot control myselF

pictures like this one and the cover of the eponymous naked city record are
in a book by luc sante called evidence.


- -----Original Message-----
From: Caleb T. Deupree <[e-mail]>
To: m. rizzi <[e-mail]>
Cc: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Thursday, April 01, 1999 8:51 PM
Subject: Re: naked city black box art


>At 10:28 PM 3/31/99 +6400, m. rizzi wrote:
>>>
>>>Can we put an answer to this question in the FAQ?  It
>>>is very frequently asked.)
>>
>> Sure thang. If someone could write the Question
>> and Answer, then I'd be happy to include it in
>> the FAQ (I'm kinda swamped at the moment...new
>> job and all).
>
>Here's a proposal pulling together info from the different responses this
>time around.  If someone on the list wants to add something corrective,
>more definitive, etc., please do.  And FWIW, because of all this discussion
>I listened to LT again, and find it much more interesting than I've
>expressed in previous posts (I think I was so repelled by the cover art
>that it infected my hearing of the music).
>
>Q.  What's the story on the cover art for Leng T'che, repeated in the Black
>Box?
>
>A.  Around 1905, a criminal in China, convicted of murdering a prince, had
>his sentence commuted from being buried alive to the more merciful (!)
>Hundred Pieces (the Leng T'che of the title).   He was given a large dose
>of opium (not for a painkiller, but to make him survive the execution),
>then slowly dismembered while still alive.  The execution was photographed
>by a couple of western photographers, and the pictures were an inspiration
>for many avant garde artists in various disciplines.  The French
>ex-surrealist Georges Bataille was one such inspired person.  He had all of
>the pictures in his collection, and found inspiration not so much in the
>actual execution, but in the look of ecstasy on the face of the victim in
>the pictures.  The pictures are reproduced in Bataille's book The Tears of
>Eros (City Lights).
>
>
>--
>Caleb Deupree
>[e-mail]
>
>Computers are useless; they can only give you answers
>-- Pablo Picasso
>
>-
>
>


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V2 #638
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