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Zorn List Digest       Tuesday, October 20 1998       Volume 02 : Number 507



In this issue:
-
       Dumitrescu material online
       RE:  winter winter
       RE:  Eye Notation
       ackchote
       Re: tzadik site
       Re: interesting hip-hop ???
       Re: New Buckethead CD
       Re: interesting hip-hop ???
       Re: Spoken Word
       Re: Ill from music
       Re: Kristallnacht
       Braxton/Gillmor
       Re: Braxton/Gillmor
       Re: Braxton/Gillmor
       Re: Kristallnacht
       Re[2]: Kristallnacht
       Re: Re[2]: Locus Solus
       Re: interesting hip-hop ???

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 08:42:35 -0400
From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Dumitrescu material online

A while back, various people were asking about online material for the
Rumanian composer Iancu Dumitrescu.  Here's a URL to a review of one of his
CDs, along with a number of Scelsi CDs.  It's part of an online magazine,
LaFolia, serving the contemporary classical community.

http://www.lafolia.com/dumi.htm

- --
Caleb Deupree
[e-mail]

Computers are useless; they can only give you answers
- -- Pablo Picasso

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 08:43:24 -0400
From: "hijk" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE:  winter winter

The short version is that Winter & Winter formed out of the dust of JMT,
Stefan Winter's excellent but ill fated label based in Germany.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 08:50:03 -0400
From: "hijk" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE:  Eye Notation

The times that I've seen NC live, Zorn would point dramatically at Eye and
he would start "doing his thing."  Zorn would also cut him off at the
"proper" point.  It also sounds similar to the Book of Heads notation in
that Zorn was constantly checking on Eye and the notecards on his stand to
make sure he knew what was going on.

Jeff Kent
[e-mail]



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 98 9:26:45 EDT
From: "M.Ho" <[e-mail]>
Subject: ackchote

Can someone describe the Ackchote/Ribot/Chadbourne album Lust Corner
for me?
Thanks,
Mary

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 10:13:34 -0400
From: Jason Tors <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: tzadik site

constructive comments..

I think my problem has to do more with the hosting/maint end of the site.
Design-wise I think it is clean and great use of html text for graphical
supliments. On the homepage the arrangement of the main links could be
thought out a little better. A suggestion would be to include all areas in
two lines instead of two and a quarter, the frames should not be a problem
in this alteration. Get rid of the second generation bar at the bottom of
the homepage, a strip of black (or dark green) one pixel would be much more
elegant. On the sub pages the only thing I would suggest is try and work
out an anti-frame solution, it would make the site faster and better.

The artist search page was annoying at first because of all the names,
after looking at it for a while, and realizing the letter nav on the left,
I think it serves as a good html visual effect.  In the same breath, the
new and notes page does this same thing, but it does not help the viewer
with a left hand alpha category. Finding out what is going on in zorn land
should be a little easier.

Are there any unofficial JZ sites with pictures of the man from the past? I
like looking at pictures of JZ with short hair.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:10:38 +0200 (MET DST)
From: FJG_Lamerikx <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ???

In reply to Anish:

> entroducing is impressive perhaps in terms of the time commitment, but
> other than that the album just hits me as being overwhelmingly simple.
> Very simple beats and very, very simple song structures.  I just get bored
> listening to the album.  I liked Entroducing until I heard songs like what
> does your soul look like (part 2) and influx (an amazing song), both of
> which I find to be of far superior quality.  But, perhaps Shadow just
> doesn't impress me that much.  The only songs I really like are the two
> songs above, midnight in a perfect world, organ donor, and a few others.

The song structures may be simple, but I guess that wasn't what DJ Shadow
was after - I think he earns some credit for making completely new music
while STRICTLY using samples. Then again, maybe a lot of other people have
done it before him...
You're right about In Flux and What Does Your Soul... - those tracks ARE
superior to most of the material that made it onto the album. I haven't heard
his work with U.N.K.L.E., but it receives varying reviews. I know I didn't
like one bit of the 24-minute remix that Q-Bert did of Shadow's material.

> I've heard of Photek a lot.  any album that you can recommend in
> particular?  I'm looking for some drums n' bass that has a strong sense of
> a song structure in which crazy d n' b beats exist, but only to enhance the
> song...not as the sole purpose of the song.  If that makes any sense at
> all...I'm guessing that's what you meant when you said: " an extension of
> the comoposer's idiom with otherwise unplayable rhythms and beats."

Photek has made a transgression from "intelligent" jungle as it became known
(the style advocated by the likes of LTJ Bukem) to more and more sparse,
minimal, mathematical material. I would say his pinnacle is the U.F.O. 12"
released on his own Photek label. But, everything he has released starting
with the Seven Samurai 12" (which was the fifth on his Photek label) is
absolutely brilliant. This includes his much-acclaimed Modus Operandi album -
though that album is best where it strays away the furthest from drum'n'bass.
He has just released a sampler of early tracks, with some remixes and two
new tracks; haven't heard it yet, but I suggest you listen to it since it
may give a good overview of the development he has made. Plus, never neglect
any Photek 12"-es, since he puts as much effort into the B-sides as into the
main tracks (Photek is known to spend upwards of a month, 10 hours a day, on
each of his tracks).

> Squarepusher's Port Rhombus and Amon Tobin's Permuations both fit this
> category perfectly in my mind.  Squrepusher's vic acid does not.  Also, for
> some reason, I think Feed Me weird things is just OK.  Maybe I'm looking
> for something that isn't too electronic-ish or techno-ish and something not
> so bleak/sterile...

I am completely fed up with the drill'n'bass style advocated by the likes of
Squarepusher. Whereas he is probably the most out-there drum programmer on
the planet, his tracks tend to be the modern-day equivalent of the point where
jazz-fusion went all wrong in the seventies. He is a brilliant programmer,
but he lacks the style and the restraint that Photek is quickly becoming a
master of. What strikes me is that most people on the Zorn list (and most
people who write for The Wire) seem to be completely enamoured with this
drill'n'bass style, while largely neglecting other areas of drum'n'bass.

I was also told that the Dom & Roland album is very good. I know he has done
some extremely cool tracks in the past, such as his classic "Quadrant Six"
track which he did with Optical.

Frankco.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 07:26:54 -0700
From: Jeff Spirer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: New Buckethead CD

At 02:35 PM 10/20/98 +0100, Stefan Verstraeten wrote:
>Hi,
>
>I noticed the new cd by Buckethead (Cobra Strike)
>Does anyone know the recordlabel or -even better- does someone know how
>the album sounds like, who plays on it, ...

I just posted on this on the Laswell list.  I will put the information at
the web site in the next few days.

It will be on Ion.

Review coming soon, I hope.


Jeff Spirer
B&W Photos: http://www.pomegranates.com/frame/spirer/
Color and B&W Photos: http://www.hyperreal.org/~jeffs/gallery.html
Axiom/Material: http://www.hyperreal.org/axiom/

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:41:10 +0200
From: Yves Dewulf <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ???

> I was also told that the Dom & Roland album is very good. I know he has done
> some extremely cool tracks in the past, such as his classic "Quadrant Six"
> track which he did with Optical.

   Why not try the new "Mysteries of Funk" by Grooverider
   (also with Optical as engineer). Seventies Miles Davis-fusion
   (dark, no Squarepusher fender rhodes mellowness) with killer bass
   and twisted beats.

   Drum'n'Bass record of the year (I admit I haven't heard the new
   Photek yet)

   YVes

   -


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 11:50:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: Ken Waxman <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Spoken Word

It is (was) an LP on Bethlehem, later reissued with a more palatable
title "Scenes", I think on Charley/Affinity in the U.K. I've seen it
under the original title on CD. Basically it's the same band as on
Mingus' other Bethlehem session, "East Coasting", but with Horaco Parlan on
piano instead of Bill Evans. Only the title track is spoken word,
the rest is fine, swinging, rootsy Mingus music from his strongest period.

Ken Waxman
[e-mail]


On Fri, 16 Oct 1998, Jason Tors wrote:

>
> >"Scenes In The City" read by actor Melvin Stewart but written by Charles
> >Mingus for his Bethlehem session which was originally called something
> >like "An Exploration of Jazz and Poetry by Charles Mingus".
>
> I have never heard of this, was it a recording or a live performance?
>

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 14:37:47 -0400
From: Matthew Moffett <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Ill from music

i never know if
> this and recounts of japanese musicians working with tonal experiments to make
> the listeners loose certain bodily controls are true or just high brow urban
> myths.
>
> -
I don't know about japanese musicians, but I remember from my studio
classes in college watching a video about a professor at Harvard doing
studies of the effects of extreme high and low frequencies. I
specifically remember him saying extreme low end causes the loss of
bowel control, because I ended up stealing that tidbit for a short
story.  I also remember, though, that the average speaker system would
be incapable of reproducing the tones.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 15:37:45 +0100
From: nils <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Kristallnacht

> > a friend once told me that he first heard kristallnacht on public radio in
> > NYC, during which they interupted it, saying they could not play the track
> > that should follow as it was known to make people physically ill. now i know
> > the story about the broadcast is true, but is the statement?
>
> It's related to the fact that the sounds used in that particular section
> of Kristalnacht are extremely shrill frequencies, so shrill that they have
> the possibility of damaging a human eardrum; the physically ill part i'm
> not sure of, but it could be that people's equilibrium could be screwed
> up by such high frequencies. There is a warning in the CD liner notes to
> this effect as well.

There's a scientific term for this effect.  Horseshit.  If you want to visit the
archives, this topic has been covered already.  The basic skinny on ear damage is
that any frequency can be damaging to the ears if the levels are high enough.
Breaking glass is kind of annoying but it's not going to hurt anyone who didn't
read the liner notes unless the stereo's cranked.

On the subject of Torture Garden and noise-listening stamina, I think the harshest
listening I've done in a while was Derek Bailey's Sign of Four.  If you can get
through those three discs without ripping your head off, congratulations.

- -Nils


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 98 15:29:24 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Braxton/Gillmor

     Has anyone heard the Leo release by Braxton and Stewart Gillmor, '14
     Compositions (Traditional)'? As opposed to AB's usual 'Standards',
     these pieces are apparently older early jazz and blues songs. Any
     opinions? I'm not even sure what instrument Gillmor plays, though I'd
     assume it's piano given the nature of the tunes. AB plays, among his
     normal assortment, some tenor and bass sax herein.

     Brian Olewnick



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 98 15:57:14 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Braxton/Gillmor


     I wrote:

     >Any opinions? I'm not even sure what instrument Gillmor plays,
     >though I'd assume it's piano given the nature of the tunes.

     Shortly after posting, I found a web page listing Tri-Centric
     performers; Gillmor, a professor of History at Wesleyan, is listed as
     a "brass doubler" as well as founder of the Nutmeg Fox-Trot Jazz
     Orchestra (!). He's referred to as having "mediocre chops but a good
     attitude". That's what it says. I'm still intrigued.

     B.




- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 15:14:33 -0500
From: Dan Hewins <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Braxton/Gillmor

At 3:29 PM -0500 10/20/98, [e-mail] wrote:
>     AB plays, among his
>     normal assortment, some tenor and bass sax herein.

Ah, there's the tenor sax...

Dan Hewins



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:37:07 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Kristallnacht

In a message dated 98-10-20 15:44:20 EDT,  [e-mail]
writes:

<<
 On the subject of Torture Garden and noise-listening stamina, I think the
harshest
 listening I've done in a while was Derek Bailey's Sign of Four.   >>

I'd have to second this.....I couldn't make it through the first disc alone.

Dale.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 98 16:41:08 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re[2]: Kristallnacht

     nils wrote:
<<
 <On the subject of Torture Garden and noise-listening stamina, I think the
 <harshest
 <listening I've done in a while was Derek Bailey's Sign of Four.   >>

     Dale responded:

>I'd have to second this.....I couldn't make it through the first disc alone.

     Yeah, but is this because of the noise factor or Metheny's
     Look-Ma-I-can-play-as-abrasively-as-Derek-and-not-bother-to-listen
     grandstanding attitude? If it's the latter, I'm with you.

     Brian Olewnick





- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 14:16:15 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Locus Solus

On Mon, 19 Oct 98 13:11:02 -0500  [e-mail] wrote:
>
> >Still sounds fresh and innovative 14 years after. One of my top 20.
>
>      Curious. While, as Steve's fond of pointing out, your mileage may
>      vary, I find 'Locus Solus' to be of far greater historical value than
>      strictly musical. It was actually the first Zorn record I ever bought;

LOCUS SOLUS is the only document of Zorn's attempt to do free improv (at least
his form of) with some rock elements. I guess Zorn might have agreed with you
because it is not only the first, it is also the last. My feeling is that
LOCUS SOLUS was developping something new in Zorn's already extended palette.
I would have liked to hear more about that direction.

For me it is more than just history and documentation of some obscure corner
of an artist that I like a lot, it is a record that I put and put again on my
turntable (something I do not do with, for example, ARCHERY, POOL, etc). It
works in spite of its weaknesses. Why? Maybe simply because nothing like that
was done before and that the weaknesses that you cited are only, to me, a
problem with genres of music that have been played ad nauseum (something that
never happened with LOCUS SOLUS). Maybe LOCUS SOLUS was lucky to die without
filiation, and as such avoided the embarrassement of repeating itself. We will
never know.

Does it mean that it is perfect? I won't go so far and I think that I
understand some of your criticisms. This is maybe why I used "fresh" in my
description: the music was not jaded and was full of promisses.

The first lineup is maybe the one that I like the least. But I love the
other ones (I am a sucker for Arto).

    Patrice.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 17:58:24 -0400
From: Taylor McLaren <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ???

Der Francko wrote:
[on Photek]
>He has just released a sampler of early tracks, with some remixes and two
>new tracks; haven't heard it yet, but I suggest you listen to it since it
>may give a good overview of the development he has made.
_Form & Function_ serves nicely as an introduction to Parkes' style and
does give one a sense of how his work has changed over time by way of
including the original versions of "Rings Around Saturn", "UFO" and "The
Seven Samurai"; unfortunately, it also includes a bunch of recent (I think)
remixes of this same material at the beginning of the disc which make for a
good forty-five of same-sounding drudgery. While I absolutely love his
clinical approach to rhythm, this is definitely a release that I can't
listen to all the way through... I'd recommend that prospective listeners
start out with just about any 12" that he has released (I'm partial to "The
Hidden Camera", personally... conveniently and cheaply available on CD) and
maybe his more-diverse-than-usual _Modus Operandi_ before trying to slog
through almost eighty minutes of one set of drum sounds.

[on Squarepusher]
>Whereas he is probably the most out-there drum programmer on
>the planet, his tracks tend to be the modern-day equivalent of the point
where
>jazz-fusion went all wrong in the seventies.
...and here I haven't heard the album in question yet, but his latest
effort, _Music Is Rotted One Note_, is supposed to be two giant steps away
from the drill 'n' bass routine and a nice piece of work as far as real
instruments go. And heck, if somebody hasn't heard anything from the drill
crowd, they could do a whole lot worse than to spend five bucks on a used
copy of _Big Loada_...

Hip-hop-wise, I finally caved in to peer pressure and bought a pair of
Public Enemy albums this past weekend, and I can't recommend them enough.
Indeed, the opening of _It Takes a Nation of Millions..._ (their
introduction at the beginning of one of the Def Jam shows from '88 or so)
got me thinking about the rest of the folks who were on that tour, and I
think that it would be really neat to listen to follow-up releases from all
of those artists back-to-back. Just for fun, and in case anybody has some
money to burn this weekend, picking up copies of PE's _Fear of a Black
Planet_ (my favourite out of the two titles... it's held together really
nicely by some adept DJ fuckery in between tracks), Pop Will Eat Itself's
_Cure for Sanity_, and Run DMC's _Back from Hell_ would actually make for a
pretty damned neat afternoon of listening.

- -me


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V2 #507
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