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Zorn List Digest       Tuesday, October 20 1998       Volume 02 : Number 506



In this issue:
-
       Making music
       Re:  Re: Naked City style jumps
       Re: Naked City style jumps
       Re:  Re: Naked City style jumps
       Re: Glenn Branca at the Knit
       Re:  Re: Naked City style jumps
       Locus Solus/ Torture Garden
       re:eye notation
       Portsmouth Sinfonia
       re:eye notation
       Re: eye notation
       re:eye notation
       RE: David Grubbs
       Re: Re[2]: Naked City style jumps
       Why Does Zorn no longer play at the KF...
       Re: tzadik site
       Another Avant-Garde list
       V. Golia
       Re: Naked City stile jumps
       To all traders
       Scores/materials for performance
       Re: Re[2]: Naked City style jumps
       Re: Scores/materials for performance
       New Buckethead CD

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 18:07:32 -0500 (CDT)
From: [e-mail] (Theo Klaase)
Subject: Making music

I think Zorn has the ultimate ability to find out what a musician is
really about musically and build a composition that showcases and
high-lights that special ability that is usually unique to that
particular musician.

How's that for a run-on sentence?


}Theodorus--


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 20:10:34 -0400
From: Matthew Ross Davis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re:  Re: Naked City style jumps

>I wonder how many people (and I know many of them are here) can actually
>put on Torture Garden and listen to it all the way through after already
>hearing it once or more.........

Torture Garden was my first Zorn CD, though not the first Zorn I had heard.
And I have to admit, I used to listen to it quite a lot back then -
especially when staying up late in the computer lab at school (alone) doing
work for deadlines. In fact, I'd play it pretty loud.


| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | m - a - t - t - h - e - w | r - o - s - s | d - a - v - i - s | |
| | http://www.artswire.org/mrd | | | | | | | UMD school of music | |
| | m-e-t-a-t-r-o-n p-r-e-s-s | | | http://www.artswire.org/comma | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |



- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 20:55:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: [e-mail] (David J. Polak)
Subject: Re: Naked City style jumps

Reply to message from [e-mail] of Mon, 19 Oct
>
>Torture Garden was my first Zorn CD, though not the first Zorn I had heard.
>And I have to admit, I used to listen to it quite a lot back then -
>especially when staying up late in the computer lab at school (alone) doing
>work for deadlines. In fact, I'd play it pretty loud.
>
I will listen to TG on endless repeat when I'm in the mood. It is the
ultimate album to waken up a dead party. It never fails to shock and/or
nauseate somebody. Another fun way to listen to it is on vinyl at 33 1/3
RPMs. It was pressed at 45 RPM and you get a slightly slower, longer, but
still great album at 33 1/3. If you have it on vinyl, try it at least once.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 21:58:41 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re:  Re: Naked City style jumps

>David J. Polak wrote: It never fails to shock and/or nauseate >somebody.

a friend once told me that he first heard kristallnacht on public radio in
NYC, during which they interupted it, saying they could not play the track
that should follow as it was known to make people physically ill. now i know
the story about the broadcast is true, but is the statement? i never know if
this and recounts of japanese musicians working with tonal experiments to make
the listeners loose certain bodily controls are true or just high brow urban
myths.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 22:01:45 -0400
From: David Beardsley <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Glenn Branca at the Knit

Dan Kuehn <[e-mail]> writes:

>Glenn had some interesting comments before the first show.  Apparently
>in response to the Zorn incident (where he pulled the plug on the
camera
>after realizing it's ALWAYS on), there's now a sign in the Main Stage
>dressing room that sez something to the effect "performers are advised
>to refrain from personal conversation onstage" ...  I guess one might
>say music is a kind of personal conversation...
>
>He then addressed all the people squinting at that little picture on
the
>computer screen and putting up with the poor audio (that's me)--   He
>said, "Get a life!"

That wasn't Glenn. That was Zev.

- --
* D a v i d        B e a r d s l e y
*           [e-mail]
*
* J u x t a p o s i t i o n     E z i n e
* M E L A  v i r t u a l  d r e a m house monitor
*
* http://www.virtulink.com/immp/lookhere.htm



- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 22:19:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matthew Ross Davis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re:  Re: Naked City style jumps

> a friend once told me that he first heard kristallnacht on public radio in
> NYC, during which they interupted it, saying they could not play the track
> that should follow as it was known to make people physically ill. now i know
> the story about the broadcast is true, but is the statement?

It's related to the fact that the sounds used in that particular section
of Kristalnacht are extremely shrill frequencies, so shrill that they have
the possibility of damaging a human eardrum; the physically ill part i'm
not sure of, but it could be that people's equilibrium could be screwed
up by such high frequencies. There is a warning in the CD liner notes to
this effect as well.

| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | m - a - t - t - h - e - w | r - o - s - s | d - a - v - i - s | |
| | http://www.artswire.org/mrd | | | | | | | UMD school of music | |
| | m-e-t-a-t-r-o-n p-r-e-s-s | | | http://www.artswire.org/comma | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 22:52:06 -0400 (EDT)
From: William York <[e-mail]>
Subject: Locus Solus/ Torture Garden

I've listened to Torture Garden almost a hundred times and still counting.
Actually I think its easier to listen to than the S/T Naked City b/c the
sound is more consistent.  It does have the effect of making just about
every thing seem tame in comparison.

Locus Solus is also a favorite, although I don't listen to it quite as
much because it demands so much attention.  It is insane, like Patrice
said.  I especially like the ones w/ Horvitz/Zorn/Mori and
Blegvad/Marclay/Zorn.  I see this one used as much as any other Zorn CD so
you could probably get it that way...

To me it has a much higher enjoyability to historical significance ratio
than the Parachute Years, Classic Guide..., and Cobra.  Just another
opinion.

WY


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 23:04:26 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Geoff S Gersh)
Subject: re:eye notation

>Listening to Naked City's "Heretic" for the first time, I've gotten to
>wondering how Zorn notated parts for Y. Eye? Does he have a set of
>symbols worked out? Does it say "Taz-noises 8 beats, belch 3 beats,
>growl 22 seconds"? Does he just indicate for Eye to do whatever he wants
>at certain points?

i think what they do on that album is something called....improvising??
Zorn's been known to do that every now and then.....

;)

___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
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or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 23:05:09 -0400
From: Lang Thompson <[e-mail]>
Subject: Portsmouth Sinfonia

Does anybody know if any of their albums have been released on CD?
- ------------------------------------------------------
Lang Thompson
http://www.tcf.ua.edu/wlt4

New at the Funhouse website:  Did Elvis Steal Rock 'n'
Roll?, The X-Files Movie Bites!, music reviews

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 23:22:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matthew Ross Davis <[e-mail]>
Subject: re:eye notation

> i think what they do on that album is something called....improvising??
> Zorn's been known to do that every now and then.....

Yes, but a lot of what Zorn did with Naked City was highly structured - I
think that's what Joe is getting at - how Y. Eye's stuff was structured in
relation to everyone else. :)

| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | m - a - t - t - h - e - w | r - o - s - s | d - a - v - i - s | |
| | http://www.artswire.org/mrd | | | | | | | UMD school of music | |
| | m-e-t-a-t-r-o-n p-r-e-s-s | | | http://www.artswire.org/comma | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 23:36:11 -0400
From: Joseph Zitt <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: eye notation

Geoff S Gersh wrote:

> i think what they do on that album is something called....improvising??
> Zorn's been known to do that every now and then.....

*grin* Well, yes... but since Naked City was known to have some pretty
knotty charts, I would be surprised if one player only participated
on total-improv material. Come to think of it, he vocalizes on, at
least, the bootleg-video Leng T'che (I no longer have the CD -- must
get another), and I know that one's at least partially charted...

- --
- ---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1----------
|||/ Joseph Zitt ===== [e-mail] ===== Human Systems \|||
||/ Maryland? = <*> SILENCE: The John Cage Mailing List <*> = ecto \||
|/ http://www.realtime.net/~jzitt ====== Comma: Voices of New Music \|

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 21:28:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Subject: re:eye notation

On Mon, 19 Oct 1998, Matthew Ross Davis wrote:

> Yes, but a lot of what Zorn did with Naked City was highly structured - I
> think that's what Joe is getting at - how Y. Eye's stuff was structured in
> relation to everyone else. :)

in interviews, Eye has always maintained
he was improvising. Zorn confirms this
in an interview in Browbeat.

hasta.

Yes.  Beautiful, wonderful nature.  Hear it sing to us: *snap*  Yes.  natURE.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 00:51:05 -0500
From: "Landon Thorpe" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: David Grubbs

> Well, "The Thicket" is tepid, one notch up from bad, maybe two notches.
> The songs sound like rough drafts of songs that gastr
> del sol would have rejected.  The songs are truly pop-like;
> you hear the beginning of a slow, bad pop song and immediately
> you can predict the entire progress of the song and you know
> you just don't want to hear the whole laborious, plodding
> song to its agonizingly tedious conclusion.  That's my
> impression on this album.  Anybody else find something I am
> missing?
>

Another late post . . .

As a (and I guess the only other, on this list, at least)
Gastr-Grubbs-O'Rourkeophile, I can sympathize with your review of _The
Thicket_. It hasn't had much staying power with me, but this could be
because I just haven't listened to it enough.

Some of the song ideas are half-baked and half-executed, and it is a shame,
because the album has going for it quite a bit in the departments of
atmosphere and charm.

I might hesitate to call this pure, unadulterated pop. While pop music often
has a kind of pseudo-sensibility about it (maybe kind of an urban-smartness,
but I've been listening to a lot of Talking Heads lately), this release
seems to have its roots in something more along the lines of country and
folk, which lends to the aforementioned charm. Viewed from this frame of
reference, where expectations aren't exactly for pop, I like this album
though the above shortcomings still exist.

One special note, though. I'm not a Tony Conrad fan, and I'm not trying to
stir any Conrad controversy the likes of this list has seen. But on this
album, I really dig his playing. While it occasionally unearths some hoary
cliches (?, I'm pretty tired), Conrad has absolutely the thickest, fattest,
most tangible violin sound I've ever heard. It is as if Conrad's violin is
just bigger than anyone else's, and he scrapes out a sound that makes the
strings positively bleed. I know this is basically what he does on most of
his releases, but I've never felt such a connection to it. It has always
been a good deal more abstract (a la "Japanese Room at La Pagode" w/ Gastr
and _Slapping Pythagoras_).

Landon Thorpe (who was recently floored by Kaiser/O'Rourke's _Tomorrow knows
where you live_; how can two guitars and no overdubs make these kind of
sounds?)


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 08:44:44 +0200 (MET DST)
From: FJG_Lamerikx <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Naked City style jumps

Brian replied to Caleb:

> >(except for Leng T'che, which is just too difficult to get through).
>
>      Arrggh! My favorite NC piece! One of my very favorite JZ pieces,
>      too--aims for a particular, if none too pleasant, target, nails it to
>      the wall and sustains.

It has been my favorite piece for a while, although that title now goes to
the much underrated Grand Guignol. Leng Tch'e is monumental in its slowness
and heaviness. When Yamatsuka Eye finally starts screaming after 15 minutes,
you can almost feel the agony that the victim on the cover must have gone
through. Also, I think it is necessary that this song lasts 30 minutes - it
just needs that amount of time for its monstrous development.

Do any of you who are familiar with Faith No More's last album think that the
song Pristina sounds an awful lot like a miniature version of Leng Tch'e ?

Frankco.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 02:52:33 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Adam MacGregor)
Subject: Why Does Zorn no longer play at the KF...

: Since JZ does not play at the knit anymore, he should break away
: from knitmedia and have someone host/maintain who will do the job
: correctly.



well, the subject line sez it all...

why doesn't he play there anymore?  You New Yawkers oughta know about this
by virtue of proximity anyway...

off to drink scotch & v-8 and write about yough school board proceedings...

- --adam


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 23:53:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: "m. rizzi" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: tzadik site

Jason Tors, demi-God and Icon sez:
>I always find myself disappointed with the organization/functionality of
>this site.

    I'm curious, in your opinion what are the problems
    and how do you think they should be solved?

>Since JZ does not play at the knit anymore, he should break away
>from knitmedia and have someone host/maintain who will do the job
>correctly.

    I understand the hosting/maintenance will
    be changing soon.

    mike


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 14:45:38 PDT
From: "John Dikeman" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Another Avant-Garde list

Allright, I started an Avant-Garde jazz list, mainly for the guys on
Trane's list, were it isn't so free to talk about people other than the
actual subject.  However, i thought some of you might be interested in
being on another free jazz list. Plus, we need more people.  Here's the
URL:

http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/Avant-Garde

Thanks
john dikeman


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 23:11:19 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Geoff S Gersh)
Subject: V. Golia

Straylight Dialogues w/ Vinny Golia
Monday, October 26, 1998 - 9&11pm.  $8.00

Alterknit Theater, Knitting Factory, 74 Leonard Street
info 212.219.3006

The ambient, avant world trio Straylight gets a West Coast visit from the
internationally acclaimed composer/bandleader Vinny Golia (woodwinds),
whose improvisations reflect the rich heritage of jazz, contemporary classical,
and world music.  Accomplished on over twenty different woodwinds and ethnic
aerophones, Golia joins Straylight's members Jason Finkelman (berimbau,
riti, percussion), Geoff Gersh (guitar), and Charles Cohen (Buchla music easel)
alone and in collaboration.

Upcoming:
Monday, November 30  -  w/ Bill Cole
Monday, December 28 - w/ Steve Gorn & John Wieczorek


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 10:09:57 +0200
From: Cerato Marco <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Naked City stile jumps

>I wonder how many people (and I know many of them are here) can actually
>put on Torture Garden and listen to it all the way through after already
>hearing it once or more.........

Hey, man! You have to try COBRA or THE CLASSIC GUIDE TO STRATEGY!
THESE are very hard to listen all the way throught! :)

Bye,     Marco

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 11:09:09 +0200
From: [e-mail]
Subject: To all traders

> Hello all good traders,
> I've just started my WEB pages with many Zorn related live items at:
>
http://witkowski.tvp.com.pl

If you want to trade do not hesitate CONTACT ME.
Marcin

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 13:27:20 +0100
From: Mayke Nas <[e-mail]>
Subject: Scores/materials for performance

With a Dutch Ensemble for contemporary classical music we would like to do
a whole John Zorn-program next year. Could anyone tell me where to get
scores of Zorns chamber music (Carny, Music for Children etc.)?
And because we also like to improvise a lot, we want to play some masada-
and game-pieces as well. Does someone know how these pieces work exactly
and where to find the written materials used to perform them? In the FAQ
about Zorn, I read that the game-pieces are characterized by 'the complete
absence of any notated musical notes of any kind'. But since there are many
different Game-pieces, SOMETHING must be notated for the prompter to use as
direction, or isn't it?

Mayke Nas


- -



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 22:03:58 +1000
From: "Julian" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Naked City style jumps

> Do any of you who are familiar with Faith No More's last album think that
the
> song Pristina sounds an awful lot like a miniature version of Leng Tch'e
?

Yes, that's what I thought the first time I listened to that cd.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 22:10:34 +1000
From: "Julian" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Scores/materials for performance

> And because we also like to improvise a lot, we want to play some masada-
> and game-pieces as well. Does someone know how these pieces work exactly
> and where to find the written materials used to perform them?

I can tell you about Masada because I've played a couple of the tunes
myself. Basically most of them are like jazz standards (play the main tune
or "head" and then solo over that structure for a while, then play the head
again), but there's some that are a bit more complex, but it's easy enough
to figure out what's going on if you listen to them a couple of times. As
far as notation goes, they should be simple enough to transcribe yourself,
but maybe books are available...?


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 14:35:16 +0100
From: Stefan Verstraeten <[e-mail]>
Subject: New Buckethead CD

Hi,

I noticed the new cd by Buckethead (Cobra Strike)
Does anyone know the recordlabel or -even better- does someone know how
the album sounds like, who plays on it, ...
- --
Stefan Verstraeten
NP Ruins: Symphonica (imagine King Krimson on speed)

- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V2 #506
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