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1998-09-23
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #473
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Thursday, September 24 1998 Volume 02 : Number 473
In this issue:
-
Re: collecting music
RE:RAYMOND SCOTT
recent goodies & a thought on guilty relistening
Re: recent goodies & a thought on guilty relistening
Re: recent goodies & a thought on guilty relistening
Liliput
Re: a thought on guilty relistening
Re: a thought on guilty relistening
Re: a thought on guilty relistening
Re: collecting
4+1 horvitz
Masadas
Cynical Hysterie Hour
Re: Tyner's Bacharach
Re: a thought on guilty relistening
About Hank Mobley; also Charles Gayle
RE:freefall
Re: MatSonOnLine 11 - 1998 September (fwd)
Re: collecting music
Re: collecting music
Re: Raymond Scott
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 18:14:51 EDT
From: Dgasque@aol.com
Subject: Re: collecting music
In a message dated 9/23/98 2:29:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Tag Yr It writes:
I sed:
<< 7) Has their entire collection documented on 4 x 6 index cards.
>>
I'd venture to guess they're (we're?) at least up to a 5 1/4 floppy by now -
a used hand me down Atari most likely.....or maybe
even.....a......Commodore!!!!
>>
A computer? You've gotta be kidding! It took the re-mastering of the Beatles
catalog before he'd consider buying a CD player! As you can probably tell,
i'm referring to a close, yet un-named friend of mine...
=dgasque=
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 18:37:59 -0400
From: "hijk" <hijk@gateway.net>
Subject: RE:RAYMOND SCOTT
There was a collection on Stash, but I think it's out of pint.
If you like R.S. check out the two Carl Stalling Projects on WB.
Jeff Kent
hijk@gateway.net
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 19:41:17 -0400
From: "David J. Keffer" <keffer@shell.planetc.com>
Subject: recent goodies & a thought on guilty relistening
I picked up a couple records recently and not so recently that I haven't
seen reviewed on the list and I thought I would post my thoughts.
King Pawns - Uchihashi Kazuhisa (guitars and roland) and Hans Reichel
(daxophone and guitars) - Zenbei, ZEN 006, 1998.
This is sweet little disc that features Reichel mostly on his daxophone
accompanied by Kazuhisa playing heavily electronically manipulated guitar.
It's fundamentally improv but sounds like they prepared and planned before
recording. For Reichel fans, every daxophone cd is a delight and this duet
accompaniment gives the daxophone a new arena to play in. Nice.
(Still, the premiere daxophone recording is "Shanghaied on Tor Road" on FMP.)
I don't know too much about Kazuhisa except that he's all over--Ground Zero,
France, Altered States, all kinds of compilations...and a 1991 recording which
is a duet with Reichel called "Sundown" on FMP and which is an altogether
more
improv improv than this new disc.
China Collage - Liu Sola (voice) and Wu Man (pipa) - AVANT, AVAN 046, 1996
This cd is a couple years old but is worth mentioning. I think a lot of
people on the Zorn list are fans of the pipa player Min Xiao Fen based on
her disc on Asphodel. They were disappointed (that was the general tone
of the reviews) with her duet with Derek Bailey on Avant and the "Six
Composers"
cd, also on Avant. This pipa and voice cd should please them. The cd
features some exquisite pipa playing and adds female voice. Some of the songs
are just what you would want to hear from pipa and voice--very beautiful.
One thought on the idea of re-listening to records simply
because you feel guilty about owning them and not listening to them:
I like to think of a new cd as entertainment, like a new movie.
You pay about twice as much for a cd as to go to a movie but the
idea is the same: entertainment. Most people don't want to watch most
movies repeatedly, so why is there a compulsion to listen to cds
repeatedly? (Unless, of course, the cd is on "stranded on the desert
isle with 10 cds" list.)
David "one-listen-and-to-the-shelf" K.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 20:09:32 -0400
From: Brian Olewnick <olewnik@IDT.NET>
Subject: Re: recent goodies & a thought on guilty relistening
David J. Keffer wrote:
> China Collage - Liu Sola (voice) and Wu Man (pipa) - AVANT, AVAN 046,
Yes, a fine album, one of my favorites from last year.
>
> One thought on the idea of re-listening to records simply
> because you feel guilty about owning them and not listening to them:
> I like to think of a new cd as entertainment, like a new movie.
Here, though, I part company. While, unfortunately, the vast majority of
movie releases do fall under the rubric, "entertainment", a few manage
to climb into that other realm known as, dare I say it?, art. I recently
re-watched (yep, I do that with movies) Bergman's 'Cries and
Whispers'--Art? yes indeed; entertainment? Uh, it's not quite
'Face-Off'. When I buy a music recording it's, generally, with the hope
that I'm purchasing a reproduction of a work of art. Obviously, this
doesn't always turn out to be the case and, just as obviously, many
works straddle or blur the line between the two. If someone found an
unknown Vermeer in their attic, would I look at it just once and walk
away? Hell no, I'd examine it as many times and as thoroughly as
possible. Why on earth would I be any less respectful of Cecil Taylor?
Brian Olewnick
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 20:17:49 -0300
From: Rick Lopez <bb10k@velocity.net>
Subject: Re: recent goodies & a thought on guilty relistening
David J. Keffer wrote:
>
> I like to think of a new cd as entertainment, like a new movie.
I like to think of a new CD as something that might Transform My Ass, or
as something that I can return to like a great book-- as brain and
spirit food. I can't really say I care that much for entertainment, or
being entertained. Hmmmm... am I reading this too literally?
> Most people don't want to watch most movies repeatedly,
Yeah, but, but... *Some movies* I could watch every week for the rest of
my life. *Most* movies, no-- but many-many other movies-- yes.
Maybe you need access to better movies &CDs? ;-)
okay,
RL
- --
Marilyn Crispell, Sam Rivers, Matthew Shipp, David S. Ware, and Reggie
Workman discographies; Samuel Beckett Eulogy; Baseball & the 10,000
Things; Time Stops; etc., at--
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 22:57:36 -0400
From: Lang Thompson <wlt4@mindspring.com>
Subject: Liliput
A few years back there was a CD reissue of the complete output of Liliput.
Foolishly, I didn't buy it at the time so does anybody still have the
address of the label in Switzerland (?I think) or know of a US source?
- ------------------------------------------------------
Lang Thompson
http://www.tcf.ua.edu/wlt4
New at the Funhouse website: Did Elvis Steal Rock 'n'
Roll?, The X-Files Movie Bites!, music reviews
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 23:11:58 -0400
From: "David J. Keffer" <keffer@shell.planetc.com>
Subject: Re: a thought on guilty relistening
Brian Olewnick wrote:
>While, unfortunately, the vast majority of
>movie releases do fall under the rubric, "entertainment", a few manage
>to climb into that other realm known as, dare I say it?, art. ...
>When I buy a music recording it's, generally, with the hope
>that I'm purchasing a reproduction of a work of art.
Rick Lopez wrote:
>I like to think of a new CD as something that might Transform My Ass, or
>as something that I can return to like a great book-- as brain and
>spirit food.
I knew that I was opening myself up to these comments with my original post
and I posted it, without disclaimers, all the same. I will keep the response
brief. As I see it, the ideas in these responses are based
on the assumption that art and entertainment are mutually exclusive.
Or, that the Transformation Of Ass and entertainment are mutually exclusive.
Or, that intellectual stimulation and entertainment are mutually exclusive.
From the perspective that the distinction between art and entertainment is
arbitrary (and thus negligible) my original analogy and the statement I drew
from it regarding guilty relistenings is still sensible.
David "If you want entertainment, Transform Your Ass" K.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 23:06:23 -0400
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@humansystems.com>
Subject: Re: a thought on guilty relistening
David J. Keffer wrote:
> David "If you want entertainment, Transform Your Ass" K.
"Free your mind, and your ass will follow" -- George Clinton
- --
- ---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1----------
|||/ Joseph Zitt ===== jzitt@humansystems.com ===== Human Systems \|||
||/ Maryland? = <*> SILENCE: The John Cage Mailing List <*> = ecto \||
|/ http://www.realtime.net/~jzitt ====== Comma: Voices of New Music \|
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 00:50:41 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: Re: a thought on guilty relistening
my take on having a music collection, FWIW, is that you should have some sort
of reason for keeping CDs or records around. the main and obvious reason for
most of them is that you find them enjoyable, but sometimes I keep stuff
around for other reasons, i.e. maybe I'll like this someday, it's
"historically" important, or whatever. in general, though, I try to clear out
CDs that I think are just duds, or stuff I've outgrown.
for instance, when I was first getting into jazz, I had a bunch of Wynton CDs.
needless to say, I'm not so interested in them anymore, so I've dumped them.
also, a lot of the time, I'll give CDs to friends who I think will be way more
into something than me. my personal rule is that I need to listen to something
for at least a few minutes before I edit it out of my collection.
of course, even with my "stringent" standards, I have about 4500 CDs in my
collection.
Jon
NP: David Ware-Go See The World (Columbia). Ten minutes in, and I like it a
lot but, boy is the packaging bland. I don't think there will be too many
impulse purchases of this one, from people who haven't heard of him anyway.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 00:05:30 -0800
From: Lon Huber <buzzo@best.com>
Subject: Re: collecting
>brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu wrote:
> Long, long ago, probably when my record collection reached 200 or so,
> I actually felt guilty about the fact that there were records which I
> hadn't gotten around to (re)listening to in a long time. As I (like
> any good, anal record collector) filed my vinyl alphabetically by
> artist (and, bien sur, chronological within alphabetical) I started a
> tradition of simply listening through my collection, start to finish.
> As, in years since, I've pared and pruned the collection, winnowing
> out those items that had little or nothing of value, my current body
> of around 1600 items has a listen-cycle of 3 years or so (increasing
> all the time, of course).
Twice a month, I spend Sunday afternoon hosting an open-invitation
listening salon. Friends drop by, and we take turns playing tracks for each
other. Aside from the benefit of hearing a bunch of stuff I'd have to
otherwise risk $$$ to check out, I suddenly find myself appreciating my
collection (700 or so vinyl albums, 250+ CDs) a whole lot more. After
playing, say, The World of Harry Partch for a friend who's never heard his
music, I'll end up rediscovering my Partch records over the following week.
I'm spending less and enjoying music a whole lot more.
> Kinda fun listening to nothing but Braxton for two months.
Ain't it, though?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 17:41:16 +1000
From: "Julian" <jcurwin@hartingdale.com.au>
Subject: 4+1 horvitz
Any thoughts on Horvitz's 4 Plus 1 Ensemble?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 17:46:47 +1000
From: "Julian" <jcurwin@hartingdale.com.au>
Subject: Masadas
The ones I find myself listening to the most are 7 and 1. These two I find
are the most consistently good. After that it's a toss-up between 2, 5 and
9. These have some really fantastic tracks but some not so fantastic as
well...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 10:36:48 +0200
From: Cerato Marco <g5003725@uts.univ.trieste.it>
Subject: Cynical Hysterie Hour
I have just listened to FILMWORKS VII, and it's wonderful!!
The only defect is that its lenght is only 25 minutes!!
.....anyway I think it's a must have it...
Zorn rules!!
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 09:11:52 GMT0BST
From: DR S WILKIE <S.Wilkie@swansea.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Tyner's Bacharach
Hell, looks like I'm the only one on this list who's heard (or
will admit to having heard) McCoy Tyner Plays Bacharach. Actually,
it wasn't as bad as I feared: my stereotype of Tyner is rhythmic (and
dynamic) aggression good, lush romanticism bad. When I last saw him,
in duet with Bobby Hutcherson, I thought we had equal measures of
both. I also heard Nights of Ballads And Blues (early 60s) which I
found very lame, but was then pleasantly surprised to enjoy his
Ellington cover album from the same period. My favourites are his
late 60s Blue Notes, post Coltrane, but what I've heard of the
music he made in the 70s and early 80s holds up well ...
I eventually decided that the mixture of Tyner, Bacharach and
strings was pleasantly quirky in places and I taped the four or
five pieces I quite liked over what I considered the worst
pieces on the Bacharach album.
Sean Wilkie
On Bacharach covers, there's a version of Wives and Lovers by Grant
Green with Tyner and Jones as a bonus track on "Matador", which is
otherwise a fine album, but I prefer the Dave Douglas version of this
number.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 05:24:36 -0300
From: Rick Lopez <bb10k@velocity.net>
Subject: Re: a thought on guilty relistening
David J. Keffer wrote:
>
> Brian Olewnick wrote:
> >When I buy a music recording it's, generally, with the hope
> >that I'm purchasing a reproduction of a work of art.
>
> Rick Lopez wrote:
> >I like to think of a new CD as something that might Transform My Ass,
> I knew that I was opening myself up to these comments with my original post
> and I posted it, without disclaimers, all the same.
Aha! Trying to provoke me, eh?? :-)
> that the Transformation Of Ass and entertainment are mutually exclusive.
> Or, that intellectual stimulation and entertainment are mutually exclusive.
Like I said, perhaps I was taking this toooo literally-- but your
comment that you listened once and put it on the shelf made me wonder
how you could take all there is to take from these things in one listen.
And of course they're not exclusive, but to ignore the merged middle
ground for a minute-- I see entertainment as passive, art as more
involving. Being tickled versus a sweaty, blood-drenched wrestling
match. You know what I mean. I know what you mean. Okay.
> David "If you want entertainment, Transform Your Ass" K.
Rick "I'd pay $7.50 to be entertained but if I'm shelling out 15 bucks
it better Transform My Ass" Lopez.
- --
Marilyn Crispell, Sam Rivers, Matthew Shipp, David S. Ware, and Reggie
Workman discographies; Samuel Beckett Eulogy; Baseball & the 10,000
Things; Time Stops; etc., at--
http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 09:37:22 GMT0BST
From: DR S WILKIE <S.Wilkie@swansea.ac.uk>
Subject: About Hank Mobley; also Charles Gayle
I don't disagree with everything Scott Handley wrote (Monday 21st),
in fact I share his sentiment about relief when your friends buy
certain things so that you can hear them while still retaining that
option on yer wallet. But I do find strange the coment about a
similarity of form and approach applying more to Hank Mobley than to
Masada. Substitute Zorn for Masada, and I'd agree, but while I'd be
intrigued by an analysis of the differences between the Masada
albums, I'd have to say that, to my ears, there are greater
differences of form and approach between, say, Soul Station and A
Slice Of The Top, than between any two Masada albums.
The other point I found strange was the plural pronoun in "do we need
more Charles Gayle/Derek Bailey/etc. records?". I shouldn't pretend
I don't understand it - there was a Lou Reed song to this effect on
New York, I think - but from reading this list, I reckon it's a
question that people settle for themselves. In any case, I didn't
think that there were that many Gayle albums, and I was thinking
about buying one that retailed quite reasonably for these shores:
can't remember the title, but it has a bird, wings outstretched on
the cover, it's not on Black saint or Silkheart, and I was going to
say that it has a religious title, but then maybe they all do. Any
recommendations.
Sean Wilkie
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 08:17:10 -0400
From: "hijk" <hijk@gateway.net>
Subject: RE:freefall
The 5 extra tracks are all solo improvisations taken from the same sessions
and were previously unreleased. Hopefully we can look forward to new solo
recordings from Mr. Giuffre, he's considering an album of solos recorded at
his home.
Jeff Kent
hijk@gateway.net
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 09:58:48 +0000
From: "gschwend d. atelier" <gda@pingnet.li>
Subject: Re: MatSonOnLine 11 - 1998 September (fwd)
Paul Audino wrote:
>
> UPCOMING RELEASES
>
> JOHN ZORN . SONORA - book + cd - edited by Walter Rovere & Carla Chiti
> Also included are writings on cinema by John Zorn and his complete discography.
> Paul
> psaudino@interaccess.com
hi paul!
do you have more details about this book? publisher and isbn number,
e.g.
that would be excellent, and make it easier for me to get hold of it
over here in europe!
thanks for your help!
patRice
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 09:44:37 -0400
From: Mark Saleski <marks@foliage.com>
Subject: Re: collecting music
there's a great book i read a while back: High Fidelity by Nick Hornby.
i won't give away too much but there are these guys who work in a used
record
shop and are always making up top ten lists of various sorts, make
compilation tapes
for their friends, etc.
at one point one of them talks about how he reorganizes his collection
when something
upsets him greatly. imagine organizing by _date of purchase_!
mark
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 11:00:49 -0400
From: Sean Terwilliger <seanter@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: collecting music
At 09:44 AM 9/24/98 -0400, Mark Saleski wrote:
>at one point one of them talks about how he reorganizes his collection
>when something
>upsets him greatly. imagine organizing by _date of purchase_!
Of course there's that great scene in Diner, where the guy almost divorces
his wife for mis-filing his records. None of my girlfriends ever got that
scene...
- -Sean
- -Sean
Sean Terwilliger Deerfield Academy
terwilliger@deerfield.edu Network Administrator
413-774-1843
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 11:36:41 -0400
From: "Chris B{rrett" <cbarrett@neaq.org>
Subject: Re: Raymond Scott
I'm not sure where you're located, but I was at the Jazz Record Mart in
Chicago about 3 weeks ago and I found several Raymond Scott titles there
(but I don't recall the names). If you're not close to Chicago, I bet you
could call the Jazz Record MArt and have them check for the titles they
have...
- -Chris
At 9:06 PM 9/19/98, Joe Tait wrote:
>Sort of off-topic, but figured someone would know....
>
>I recently picked up the columbia reissue of Raymond Scott's "Reckless
>Nights and Turkish Twilights" as well as "Sounds for Baby Vol.1" and was
>wondering if there are any other releases of his in print (and what they
>sound like), as well as how the other Sounds for Baby compare to the
>first.
>
>Thanks,
>Joe
>
>
>-
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #473
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