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Zorn List Digest        Tuesday, June 16 1998        Volume 02 : Number 394



In this issue:
-
       Re: Phantamos
       Re: Another Downtown Question
       Re: Phantamos
       New Boredoms
       Re: Hancock's Sextant
       Dave Douglas' "Charm of Night Sky" is out
       RE: Horvitz, Zorn, E#, (drummer) quartet
       Audio on the net
       Re: Audio on the net
       Re: Audio on the net
       Re: Another Downtown Question
       Re: While we're on the subject of Int'l music...
       Re: Downtown stuff
       Re: Another Downtown Question
       Re: Marc Edwards and E#
       Re: Phantamos
       Peril "Multiverse" CD FS ...
       Re: Henry Threadgill/Butch Morris

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 08:10:51 +0200
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Phantamos


[Fantomas]

> yes, and I think they're doing some shows in NY and SF. If they record, it
> will be some time next year, when the next Mr Bungle record has been taken
> care of.

Where does that last piece of information come from? I know Fantomas are
about to play a show at Slim's, SF, on June 18, and then 5 shows in NYC, but
I haven't heard anything about a new Mr. Bungle album...

Frankco.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 02:25:37 -0400
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Another Downtown Question

Dave Trenkel wrote:

> About Hancock's Sextant, yeah, it is a great record, but I wonder if its
> "timelessness", as compared to Horvitz' records in an earlier message, is
> simply that the synthesizer sounds Hancock and Patrick Gleeson used are
> back in vogue, via the whole techno explosion and the renewed interest in
> analog synthesis.

I can see your point here, but must jump in with a rebuttal: I discovered
"Sextant" and the other two Hancock Sextet discs not when they were issued, and
not now when they've been reissued, but about ten years ago when they were
included as part of a MASSIVE donation of sealed jazz LPs received by the radio
station at which I worked in college.  There was no special vogue for those
analogue synth sounds that I was aware of at the time, nor was I at all interested
in the later Headhunters or Rockit band material (at that time, anyway)... all I
knew was that these albums snapped my head around in a really new way and I still
feel the same about them.

That's just me, and I'm not average or normal but a music junkie, but still I'd
like to think that this particular band's continued appeal is more than just an
interest in a synth patch...

Steve Smith
[e-mail]


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 16:32:25 +1000
From: "Julian" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Phantamos

> Where does that last piece of information come from? I know Fantomas are
> about to play a show at Slim's, SF, on June 18, and then 5 shows in NYC,
but
> I haven't heard anything about a new Mr. Bungle album...

Trey was interviewed a number of times here in Australia about what
Bungle's up to, and he said there were plans for a release very soon.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 11:15:08 +0200
From: Julien Quint <[e-mail]>
Subject: New Boredoms

Hi everyone,

Back from a week in Paris where a) I met our beloved list owner Mike Rizzi and
b) I found the latest Boredoms EP "Super Go". It looks like the new album is
also out but didn't manage to find it (although rumours were circulating that
someone had found a copy at the Virgin Megastore of the Champs Elyse'es)

The EP is only 2 songs, "Super Go" is 17+ long and sounds like an evolution of
the Super Roots 6 stuff... very psychedelic, very different from their
previous "normal" output; the second song "Super Punk" is about 4 minutes long
and is more of an ambien electronic piece. This new EP is really surprising
and I'd have to listen to it a few more times to get a real opinion of it.

So who has heard the new stuff (as I understand there's also another promo EP
called "Super Old" that you could get by sending the Super Roots obis) and can
comment on it?

bye, julien


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 08:46:35 -0400
From: philz <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Hancock's Sextant

>Steve Smith wrote:

>I agree with what Chris wrote about it.  Its two predecessors, "Mwandishi" and
>"Crossing," feature  the same band (minus the synth programmer and extra
>percussionist who came on board with "Sextant") and are also worth
>checking out by
>those into the deeper mysteries of UR-fusion, back when things were
>actually being
>"fused".....  The core of that band was a first rate jazz sextet, which
>may have a
>lot to do with why this experimental stuff still sounds good now...
>Hancock, Bennie
>Maupin, Eddie Henderson, Julian Priester, Buster Williams and Billy Hart.
>Both of
>the earlier albums are available in an inexpensive two-CD set of the complete
>Hancock recordings for Warner Brothers (which also includes an earlier
>album's worth
>of material from "Fat Albert" by a different Hancock band).


There are also solo records by Bennie Maupin and Eddie Henderson from that
same era that explore the whole "Sextant" sound... don't recall the titles
off-hand, but it's worth exploring their discographies for more material in
that vein.

philz

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 19:08:03 +0200
From: "Artur Nowak" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Dave Douglas' "Charm of Night Sky" is out

The german Winter & Winter label (JMT successor) is very active
realising lot of new records, one of the latest is Dave Douglas' "Charm
of Night Sky", very gentle, calm and tender music, mostly duos (Dave and
Guy) and waltzes. Highly recommended for all Dave fans, but also those
people who liked Frisells "Have a Litte Faith" - Guy Klucevsek's
accordion recalls the lyrical parts of this record. Please let me quote
Mr Zorn about Dave's music: "Dave has been touched by many kinds of
music, but what comes out is solely his - coherent, tasteful and never
self-indulgent. This music has a different story to tell each listener,
and yet always retains an integrity, an honesty and a clarity of
vision".

Here are the details:

- - "CHARM OF THE NIGHT SKY"
CD 'C56:07-13' WINTER & WINTER (910 015-2[G])     1998.
1. Charms of the Night Sky. (7:32)/ 2. Bal Masque. (3:48)/ 3. Sea
Change. (5:18)/ 4. Facing West. (4:23)/ 5. Dance in Thy Soul (for
Charlie Haden). (8:07)/ 6. Little One. (4:11)/ Mug Shots. (7 - 9): 7.
Wild Coffe. (1:14)/ 8. The Girl with the rose hips. (2:51)/ 9.
Decafinata. (2:27)/ 10. Poveri Fiori. (2:41)/ 11. Odyssey. (6:28)/ 12.
Twisted. (3:37)/ 13. Codetta. (2:53).
Dave DOUGLAS: trumpet./ Greg COHEN: acoustic bass./ Mark FELDMAN:
violin./ Guy KLUCEVSEK: accordion.
All compositions by Dave DOUGLAS (Noenmity Music) except 6 by Herbie
HANCOCK (Hancock Music Co.), 7 - 9 by Guy KLUCEVSEK (Guy Klucevsek
Music, BMI) and 10 by Francesco CILEA (Casa Mus. Sonzogono). Analog
recording September 18 & 19, 1997 at Avatar Studios, NYC, USA. Digitally
mixed November 30, 1997 at Avatar Studios, NYC, USA. Recording and
mixing engineer: Joe FERLA. 24 bit digital mastering with Super Bit
Mapping March 6, 1998 at Bauer Studios, Ludwigsburg, Germany. Mastering
engineer: Adrian von RIPKA. CD-SmartPac 19532321.1-53:Herzog+Index.
Photography: Robert LEWIS. Portrait of Dave: Maarit KYTOHARJU.
design&artstephenbyram. Produced by Dave DOUGLAS, Stefan WINTER and Joe
FERLA. [e-mail]. Made in Germany. A production of
Winter & Winter. Dave says thanks to Guy, Greg and Mark; Joe FERLA,
Nabila SCHWAB and Maarit KYTOHARJU. Artist Edition. [100%]

Regards


______________________________________________________________________
     Artur Nowak ([e-mail]) (spam filter in
use)
     www.silesia.top.pl/~arno/default.htm - Discography of Bill Frisell



- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 19:08:13 +0200
From: "Artur Nowak" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Horvitz, Zorn, E#, (drummer) quartet

> Anybody know what label this disc will be released on and
> when? And who is the drummer, Previte or Wollesen?

Yes, it's out. I bought this CD last Friday in Berlin.

John ZORN + Wayne HORVITZ + Elliot SHARP + Bobby PREVITE
- - "Downtown Lullaby"
CD 47:37, 7 tracks, label DEPTH OF FIELD (DOF-02)

"This record was played live"


______________________________________________________________________
     Artur Nowak ([e-mail]) (spam filter in
use)
     www.silesia.top.pl/~arno/default.htm - Discography of Bill Frisell



- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 18:29:55 -0400
From: Uncle Meat <[e-mail]>
Subject: Audio on the net

Because my budget is limited, and that sometimes a good review on this
list or elsewhere is not enough, i was wondering if you knew some good
sites on the net where you could hear some audio excerpts of the
musicians and composers that are mentionned here.  Apart from the
obvious (Tzadik), the only one i feel is worth mentioning is tunes.com.
Maybe the Wire ought to open an internet music store.

    Does anyone knows of a good site for music excepts?

                                                            Uncle Meat


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 18:52:08 -0400
From: Brian Olewnick <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Audio on the net

Uncle Meat wrote:
>
> Because my budget is limited, and that sometimes a good review on this
> list or elsewhere is not enough, i was wondering if you knew some good
> sites on the net where you could hear some audio excerpts of the
> musicians and composers that are mentionned here.  Apart from the
> obvious (Tzadik), the only one i feel is worth mentioning is tunes.com.
> Maybe the Wire ought to open an internet music store.
>
>     Does anyone knows of a good site for music excepts?
>
>                                                             Uncle Meat
>
> -

Z-lister Herb Levy posted it here a while back and I highly recommend it
also:

http://www.antennaradio.com

There're about 7 shows which change weekly, covering avant-jazz, new
classical, world, punk, Japanese, etc. A very fine site. Herb's
selection this week, for example includes Lois V. Vierk's 'Simoom' and
an Alvin Lucier cello piece (I forget the name). The jazz area has
tracks from 1988 including, Lazro, Threadgill, etc.

Check it out.

Brian Olewnick

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 98 19:32:32 PDT
From: Seth Gordon <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Audio on the net

Justin Broadrick's own site has feeds of tracks from all of his new
projects in gloriously crappy RealAudio sound.

http://www.avanlanche.demon.co.uk/

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 17:48:42 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Another Downtown Question

On Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:52:43 -0500  Rich Williams wrote:
>
> Douglas Tapia wrote:
>
> > I don't think it was commercial appeal that Bill or Wayne were after
> > either.  I think they are just gear heads who were playing with some new
> > toys and their judgment was perhaps a little clouded by the newness of it
> > all.
>
>     The live gigs I saw of The President bear this out. Same goes for The
> Golden Palomino's. That first album, with the DX Drums, and all the
> overdubbing realy pales in comparison to the live shows they put on.

Might be pale in comparison of the live shows, but for mere mortals like me
(who were not lucky to be there at the right time) that's the only thing that
I can put under my teeth. But you might assume from that that I am ready to
settle with anything (I don't have the choice, right)? But I am also conscious
that shows can be overated, specially when looking at them 15 years after
(with an handkerchief in one hand). I mean, the first Golden Palominos is
darn good. If the shows were really largely superior to the record (as few
people have implied), then I might have missed the best musical experience of
my whole life. Am I ready for a meaningless life? No, hence I will refuse
to acknowledge that the shows were better than the records :-).

Anyway, I find both the President and the first Golden Palominos amazing
records. I saw the President and I can say that the shows and the records
are very similar (which should not surprise anybody based on the "chamber
music" aspect of the President's music).

>     But the " Why cant I make a good album" award has got to go to Peter
> Blegvad, who despite being an excellent songwriter, singer, and stage
> performer, cant seem to translate what he does to disc.

Even KEW RHONE?

    Patrice.

- -

------------------------------

Date: 16 Jun 1998 02:49:40 +0200
From: Mans Engman <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: While we're on the subject of Int'l music...

"Silent Watcher" <[e-mail]> writes:

> I just obtained a ney (Egyptian flute) and a rhaita (Moroccan double
> reed instrument) and need some help.  Basically, with the Ney at least,
> I can't figure out how to play it.

The ney is an end-blown flute and the technique should be similar to
playing panpipes. I don't remember the exact design of the ney but
I'd first try blowing in the end with the least number of holes. :)
Good luck,

/mans

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 17:56:49 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Downtown stuff

On Sat, 13 Jun 1998 03:44:21 -0400 (EDT)  William York wrote:
>
> Thanks for the comments regarding my questions about The President and all
> that.  I should say that the I like the CD better than I first thought but
> I'm glad to know this isn't considered a major work.
            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

You are saying that as a conclusion on which the zorn list agreed. I doubt
that such agreement ever happened.

There were basically two camps: those who love the President's record, and
those who could live without.

    Patrice.

> Also, I may have made it sound like I was referring to the "scene" in the
> past tense.  Well maybe the scene is different but most of those folks
> seem to be developing their own ideas better as the scene has separated or
> maybe its just them getting a clearer perspective on their ideas.  Tim
> Berne, Arto, Zorn, Ribot, E#, etc. seem to be doing just as well or better
> than they were doing.

Be very careful with these "scenes". You have to realize that it is a
practical expression for terse communication. For example, you see a review
and the writer uses the expression "NY downtown scene". This should be a
clue that the music has little to do with Louis Armstrong or Johnny Cash.
But I doubt that you could infer more than that.

The "scene" (like all scenes and movements) has never been an homogenous
one. The artists who used to be moving in different artistic directions
still do.

    Patrice.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 20:58:39 -0500
From: Rich Williams <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Another Downtown Question

Patrice L. Roussel wrote:
>
> On Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:52:43 -0500  Rich Williams wrote:

> >       The live gigs I saw of The President bear this out. Same goes for The
> > Golden Palomino's. That first album, with the DX Drums, and all the
> > overdubbing realy pales in comparison to the live shows they put on.
>
> Might be pale in comparison of the live shows, but for mere mortals like me
> (who were not lucky to be there at the right time) that's the only thing that
> I can put under my teeth. But you might assume from that that I am ready to
> settle with anything (I don't have the choice, right)? But I am also conscious
> that shows can be overated, specially when looking at them 15 years after
> (with an handkerchief in one hand). I mean, the first Golden Palominos is
> darn good. If the shows were really largely superior to the record (as few
> people have implied), then I might have missed the best musical experience of
> my whole life. Am I ready for a meaningless life? No, hence I will refuse
> to acknowledge that the shows were better than the records :-).

    I feel the same way about Coltrane. :-)
    As far as the Palomino's; The live band was unrelentingly funky, in a
way that seemed to fuse P-Funk and Prime Time. The record seemed to
downplay that aspect. The fact that Tacuma  only appears on 2 tracks has
a lot to do with that I imagine. Also,  Zorn did some real nice
straight-ahead sax parts with the live group, but on the LP he seems to
have been limited to the Duck-call-in-the-bowl of water stuff.
    Rose colored glasses?  I dont think so, at least I hope not.  But I
guess if the LP had come first, I'd have raved about how much they
improved upon the album. :-)


> >       But the " Why cant I make a good album" award has got to go to Peter
> > Blegvad, who despite being an excellent songwriter, singer, and stage
> > performer, cant seem to translate what he does to disc.
>
> Even KEW RHONE?

EXCEPT for Kew Rhone
and Just Woke Up is certainly a step in the right direction.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 00:07:45 EDT
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Marc Edwards and E#

In a message dated 5/6/98 12:38:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

> Tom Pratt wrote:
>
>  > Marc Edwards is a drummer, eh??? Sounds like a reincarnation of Percy
>  > Jones' Scanners with E# and Previte from back in the day. I love hearing
>  > e# in a rock trio format - I hope they record something!
>
>  Marc Edwards is indeed a drummer, but I don't know how forthcoming the rock
> trio
>  content might be, unless Marc's got a side I've not heard.  The records
from
>  which I know his playing are Cecil Taylor's "Dark to Themselves" and David
S.
>
>  Ware's "Flight of i" ......... That, in a sense, makes it all the more
>  interesting to me, though I agree E# can be mighty compelling in a
straight-
> ish situation.

Okay, if this gig is still happening, then I urge everyone who can make it to
do so.  Percy Jones is one of the most inventive, not to mention scariest,
bassists Ive ever heard.   I dont think he's played with E# in 10 years, and
this gig should be a real treat.

Jody McAllister

PS- I dont think Previte played in Scanners...

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 21:12:16 PDT
From: "Jack Torrance" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Phantamos

>Received: (from flamerik)
>I know Fantomas are
>about to play a show at Slim's, SF, on June 18, and then 5 shows in
>NYC

What are the dates and locations of these NY shows?

Jack Torrance

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 02:54:16 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Patrick Carey)
Subject: Peril "Multiverse" CD FS ...

Hello all,

Pardon the intrusion ...

I have a copy of Peril's (Tony Buck, Otomo Yoshihide etc.)
now o/p "Multiverse" CD (Sound Factory - Hong Kong 1993) for
sale for $10 US ppd (within NA), if anyone is interested.

Email if you'd like it.


- -Patrick
[e-mail]



- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 02:57:04 -0400
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Henry Threadgill/Butch Morris

Brian Olewnick wrote:

> Butch Morris' Holy Ghost--Made up of about 15 musicians, playing a wide
> range of instruments. I neglected to pick up a program and didn't
> recognize several of the players, but among those I did were Blood
> Ulmer, Graham Haynes, Melvin Gibbs, Brandon Ross, JA Deane, JT Lewis and
> Charles Burnham.

All of those names are accurate.  The program was largely inaccurate so you
didn't miss much.  I've seen the names they printed and several are
definitely incorrect.

> I'm not overly familiar with Morris' conductions of the
> last decade, but I haven't been completely convinced by what I've heard;
> I remain unsure, though the show had its moments.

I've liked pretty much all of the conductions I've heard to some extent.
The box set on New World is cost prohibitive to most, but there's some
fantastic music in there.  The single disc "Homeing" is also a singular
statement of incredible lyricism and beauty, though I don't know that this
is part of the official "conductions" series.

> I've no idea what
> preparations go into these performances

The booklet that accompanies the box set goes into great detail, including a
description of each hand signal and what it is supposed to produce.

I fully understand everything you said in your reponse to the Morris
performance, but I have to say that I felt that the first piece was a
complete success... to me it sounded like the early '70s Miles band as
orchestrated by Luciano Berio... long static washes of dissonance with the
funk band bursting out, seemingly randomly (as in "Sinfonia"), only to
recede until its next outburst.  (Those who know Berio better than I do may
chafe, but that's my gut reaction.)  The second piece wasn't going anywhere,
and I assume that that's why Butch cut it off so abruptly and the alto
player left the stage as quickly as he could manage.  Still, it was a great
start to the evening, and Ulmer's hamming it up all night was most
enjoyable.

> But, maybe each show
> by this group differs from the last, and I just happened to catch it's
> electric-Miles/fusion version.

Actually, I don't think Holy Ghost is a group (someone corect me if I'm
wrong).  Most of the conductions in the New World box set have been given
titles after the fact, and perhaps "Holy Ghost" was the title of this
conduction.

> Henry Threadgill's Society Situation Dance Band--Now, here's a whole
> nuther kettle o' fish.

Agreed.  I enjoyed telling the guy now managing Columbia's A&R department
(no, not Branford) how incredibly cool Threadgill's set was, given that
they'd dropped Henry just before he was to bring them this project with no
less than Aster Aweke as vocalist.  Henry writes the most interesting bass
line progressions I've ever heard, and in this band there was a lot of
worthy content to be played over it.  The violin section was iconoclast
central, but sounded fine together.  Russell Gunn, the trumpeter hiding in
the back, was another fine soloist, but John Stubblefield was the MAN,
blasting away solos of depth, strength and melodicism all night.  Booker T.,
if that's indeed who the second tenor soloist was (as in the program guide,
chock full of misprints), was largely disappointing as a soloist, full of
gesture and squawk but no music at all.  (Was it really Booker T.?  All
night I was convinced that it was Ken McIntyre fallen upon a drought of
inspiration.)  Violinist Charles Burnham, on the other hand, was also a
wickedly impressive soloist.  Leroy Jenkins is always a pleasure.

For me this was without a doubt the artistic high point of the entire
festival.

Steve Smith
[e-mail]


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V2 #394
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