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Zorn List Digest        Friday, April 17 1998        Volume 02 : Number 333



In this issue:
-
       Re: Theatre of musical optics
       Re: Merzbow
       Bang on a Can and Thanks
       Re: Theatre of musical optics
       Crib @ AlterKnit
       Re: Theatre of musical optics
       re: merzbow
       re: merzbow
       Re: merzbow
       soviet/russian improv
       re: merzbow
       mantler/cecil taylor/jcoa
       re: merzbow
       Dave Douglas "Thoughts Around Mahfouz" [was Re: mori]
       Re: Cecil Taylor questions
       Re: Cecil Taylor reissues
       Re: mantler/cecil taylor/jcoa
       Recent goodies
       Re: Dave Douglas "Thoughts Around Mahfouz" [was Re: mori]

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 19:07:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: ia zha nah er vesen <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Theatre of musical optics

> I remember that during the Zorn month at the KF, he had a couple of late
> performances where he would just sit on the floor and spend the full time
> just moving little objects.

...deep......very deep....

:)

- -jascha


- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:35:25 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Merzbow

On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:40:38 -0400  "Simon Thibaudeau" wrote:
>
> Does anybody know where to start with Merzbow? There is so much and I =
> don't know where to start. Any suggestion

If I were you, I would wait for the 50xCD set :-).

    Patrice.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 19:44:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: [e-mail] (John D Schonewolf)
Subject: Bang on a Can and Thanks

Dear Listservers (Particularly the Philly ones),
I wanted to write and see what people thought about the whole Bang on a
Can Festival and their CDs. Any recommendations on where to start with
their catalogue? Tommorrow night down here at Penn at the Annenberg Center,
the Bang on Can players will be in concert, playing their interpretation of
Brian Eno's ambient Music for Airports. I will be unable to attend, I think,
as I will be participating in drunken festivities related to Spring Fling
here, but I am sure that others will wish to pursue more cerebral pursuits.

I also wish to thank everyone for their recommendations and whatnot, as
it is so great to read such informative posts everyday



Jack Schonewolf

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:47:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Theatre of musical optics

On Thu, 16 Apr 1998, Roger Langvik wrote:

> I would be happy if any of you goys and gals could answer these...:
                 ^^^^
a Freudian slip?

hasta.

Yes.  Beautiful, wonderful nature.  Hear it sing to us: *snap*  Yes.  natURE.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:32:46 EDT
From: WINRECORDS <[e-mail]>
Subject: Crib @ AlterKnit

An open invite to all fellow Zorn list members, my solo bass improv project
(Crib) will make its NY debut on Thurs. April 23rd @ Knitting Factory/Alter
Knit @ 9pm. It will be solo plus a duet w/ drummer Tom Surgal (of Thurston
Moore, Arthur Doyle, Charles Gayle etc.) **Plus, i think Zorn plays the same
night at the Knit's Old Office space at 8pm....so stop on by afterwards!
Thanks.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 19:40:17 PDT
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Theatre of musical optics

How did you get this information, even?  The only place I remember
reading about T.O.M.O. was somewhere in the nest of Zornfest 93 reviews
located somewhere on the net.  And I didn't remember anything like the
below stuff.

>
>I have some questions abaout Zorns Thetre of musical optics....
>
>I would be happy if any of you goys and gals could answer these...:
>
>1. How was the  objeckts highlighted on the grid....?
>(I have a theory abaout spotlights being used on each grid to light up
th=
>e
>objects in piece......)
>2. How did time get out of the music?
>3. How does "Fidel" and "Caf=E9 wha?" help to point towards the answer
of
>what remains after both time and sound is taken away from a musical
>performance?
>
>Anybody?
>
>Roger
>
>-
>
>


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- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:28:14 PDT
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: re: merzbow

>On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:40:38 -0400  "Simon Thibaudeau" wrote:
      >>
      >> Does anybody know where to start with Merzbow? There is so
      much and I
      =
      >> don't know where to start. Any suggestion
      >
      >If I were you, I would wait for the 50xCD set :-).
      >
      >       Patrice.

      Is it not true that Merzbow has a forthcoming Tzadik (Avant?)
      release?
      That makes it more than topical.  And where is this 50disc
      release
      coming from (label, release date, etc), or is this a joke?

      I, too, would be interested in som Merz-opinions, and maybe even
      descriptions and noise-ometer readings.





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- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:07:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Subject: re: merzbow

On Thu, 16 Apr 1998, Scott Handley wrote:

>       Is it not true that Merzbow has a forthcoming Tzadik (Avant?)
>       release?

that's what someone mentioned,
but the Tzadik web site has
no information to corroborate.
however, new Ruins (rubbing hands
together) and Death Praxis
discs are due this month.

>       That makes it more than topical.  And where is this 50disc
>       release
>       coming from (label, release date, etc), or is this a joke?

no joke. Extreme (Australia)
has been working on a 50 CD set
for almost two years now.
their website says it should
have been released this past
March, but last i had heard, it's
still not yet available.

http://www.xtr.com/extreme/

hasta.

Yes.  Beautiful, wonderful nature.  Hear it sing to us: *snap*  Yes.  natURE.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:53:35 -0400
From: Tom Pratt <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: merzbow

SUGAR in their vitamins? wrote:
>
> On Thu, 16 Apr 1998, Scott Handley wrote:
>
> >       Is it not true that Merzbow has a forthcoming Tzadik (Avant?)
> >       release?
>
> that's what someone mentioned,
> but the Tzadik web site has
> no information to corroborate.
> however, new Ruins (rubbing hands
> together) and Death Praxis
> discs are due this month.

I've seen it in ink in an upcoming release catalog at a music store my
friend works at. It had all the upcoming Tzadik releases (Merzbow,
Anthony Coleman & Selfhaters, non-western named electronic composer) but
with no mention of Ruins or Death Praxis... It's been a while since
tzadik.com has been updated though. That lunatic fringe disc by Dion
Mcgregor slated to go along with the Lurie/Circle Maker/Lucas batch
never came out either...

                -Tom Pratt

- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:25:07 PDT
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: soviet/russian improv

Something I can't remember seeing discussed on this list is the
apparently-fertile Russian/Soviet/Eastern-bloc music of the past, say
twenty-odd years.  Maybe it's because most of you know about as little
as I do about it all.  Leo Records had to SMUGGLE shit out and release
it with disclaimers (basically implying, for the sake of the artists,
that they had STOLEN the tapes).  Some records I'm interested in
investing-in include:
       *Anything by Ganelin/Ganelin Trio
       *8 CD Soviet Eighties box set
       *4 CD Sergey Kuryokhin box
       *4 CD Soviet Jazz Festival: CONSPIRACY box, 1989
       *etc. (I picked the famous stuff)

I'd appreciate suggestions and comments and new names, and info about
other releases, of course.  And feel free to e.mail me privately unless
you think it would be of interest to the list.

Thanks!

Scott


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- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 00:26:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: El Kabong <[e-mail]>
Subject: re: merzbow

merzbow has an album titled "1930" to be released on tzadik on may 19th.

also in may:  "Psycho Acoustic" by Tetsu Ionue and a new selfhaters disc.

in april there's going to be a disc called "self-indulgent music" by the
horse cock kids and (greg?) cohen.  anyone know what this is all about?

- -a.



- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:27:56 PDT
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: mantler/cecil taylor/jcoa

Zorn mentions this as one of the early releases which spurred his
interest in free improvisation, if I'm correct; that was fom his Webster
College days.

1.Is this record still available?  and
2. Even if it is, I'll buy anyone's copy who doesn't like it; or I'll
trade for it.

Thanks,

Scott

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- -

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:51:20 PDT
From: "Scott Handley" <[e-mail]>
Subject: re: merzbow

The box set....o my god

I'm tempted, I am tempted.....I---

Does anyone have the Merzbox sampler?  Would anyone be willing to send
me a sampler tape of his work?  I'll send blanks/post or trade tapes.

Scott

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- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:13:33 -0400
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Dave Douglas "Thoughts Around Mahfouz" [was Re: mori]

Yves Dewulf wrote:

> I think this is a big problem for electronic musicians doing live
> performances (especially the more compact electronic instruments like
> samplers and drum-machines): the audience only sees a person behind a
> table pushing buttons on a machine

Reminds me of Braxton's "myth of the sweaty brow" wherein he posits that =
in
order to be perceived as doing something meaningful and difficult one mus=
t
work up a sweat.  Also precisely the reason Eno took to dressing up in la=
m=E9
and huge feather boas with Roxy Music.

Ikue is an amazing artist, and I can't imagine wishing to hear her behind=
 a
conventional kit... that's not what she does.  But she's contributed in a
serious and beautiiful way to every instance in which I've heard her,
including last night at Roulette with the premiere of Dave Douglas's late=
st
concept, "Thoughts Around Mahfouz," featuring DD on occasional trumpet, t=
wo
cassette decks, CD player, effect pedals, antiquated beat box and melodic=
a,
Jamie Saft on vintage keyboards, sampler and lap slide guitar, Kenny
Wollesen on drums, percussion, pipes, plinks, planks and plonks, and Ikue
using her regular arsenal.  "We've decided to move into Roulette," said
Dave at the beginning.  "We've got more stuff here than at home.

The project was inspired by an Egyptian novelist.  During the three piece=
s
played (the first an hour, the second 30-plus minutes, the third about 10
minutes) the quartet touched on Egyptian modalities, noise, longs stretch=
es
of darkish ambiance, startling crashes, whirling percussion dervshes, Tin=
y
Bell-style tight unison passages with Jamie Saft's sampler or Fender Rhod=
es
subbing for Shepik's role (on a few occasions Saft played lines sampled
from Dave's sound but transposed down to tuba range, synched so tightly
that at first I'd thought Dave was just playing through a splitter of som=
e
sort , snatches of found music and voice, the occasional spectre of Miles
(perhaps inevitable when playing trumpet through effects pedals, but not
unwelcome), chance processes, and a lot of other things I'm forgetting
about probably -- it was a hell of a lot to absorb.

Dave played trumpet infrequently but was his reliably fine self when he
did.  Sometimes he would just play a note or two and then fool around wit=
h
the sound electronically.  One particularly interesting section found him
disassembling his trumpet literally and making noises blowing through
various holes and valves.  Jamie Saft is a terrific keyboardist who manag=
es
to sound very modern and at the same time nostalgic... the only thing
missing from his arsenal was his Clavinet.  Kenny Wollesen was everything
the music needed... very loud and thundrous sometimes, very soft and quie=
t
at others.  His playing had a welcome airiness; every note was picked and
placed deliberately and he would frequently stop on his way to playing a
note and choose to omit it for the effect of the interruption instead.  A=
nd
Ikue just did what she does, and added wonderful things to a bewildering
stew.

Frequently, given the random sounding drop-ins by voices and prerecorded
music, not to mention the presence of Mori and the sound of Saft's slide
guitar, I was often reminded of some of the more dense and transitional
music of Zorn's late '80s music... some things here reminded me of bits,
snippets, really, of "The Big Gundown," "Spillane" and "Godard."  This is
not to say that Dave was copying Zorn in specific, but rather that my ear=
s,
always seeking familar sounds as a base from which to absorb the unfamila=
r,
lit upon occasional musical textures that I had first heard in the Zorn
records mentioned.

Dave's bringing this group to the Knitting Factory's Old Office May 8-10.
I'll be there to see how it develops...   But damn, what a high point fro=
m
which to begin.  Were any other listers besides David Newgarden there?
Brian?

Sated,
Steve Smith
[e-mail]
[who was here making typing noises on other subjects last night but
couldn't begin to elaborate on the "Mahfouz" music well enough to post
anything...]


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:26:01 -0400
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Cecil Taylor questions

[e-mail] wrote:

>       Another glaring gap in my collection. When they came out, I figured
>      I'd get most of them eventually, but to date have only purchased two:
>      'The Hearth' with Evan Parker and Tristan Honsinger which is pretty
>      nice and 'Alms/Tiergarten/Spree' with the orchestra which is superb.I
>      understand the disc w/Bailey is fine (as might be expected) with Derek
>      being the musician in this series who most 'bent' CT towards his
>      style. Personally, I'm very curious about the duet with Louis Moholo.
>      Anyone?

The Moholo duo is disappointing in my opinion.  They just don't ever really
connect.  I, too, always thought I'd get around to buying all of these and
still may; a single CD sampler issued with a recent issue of the Italian jazz
magzine Musica Jazz included samples of many of the CT FMPs I hadn't heard and
they all sounded fine, but it's hard to tell with so little context.  I own and
endorse the Bailey and the Parker/Honsinger, as well as one I've not yet
purchased but have heard in its entirety, the Han Bennink.

Steve Smith
[e-mail]


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:46:07 -0400
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Cecil Taylor reissues

Tom Sedlak wrote:

> Furthermore, in the past year Black Lion has reissued the "Great Paris
> Concert."  Does this have any overlap?

No, the "Great Paris Concert" is a pretty fascinating session I've seen around
for years on a variety of labels.  It's also been called "Student Studies."  The
date is Nov. 30, 1966, the band is CT, Lyons, Cyrille and Alan Silva, and the
disc, like so much Black Lion product, is mastered from a not fabulous vinyl LP.
In addition, the recording is overly reverberant and tends to distort.  I
continue to hang on to it because much of the music is fascinating and quite
unique, especially the percussive poetry of "Amplitude," complete with tubular
bells and timpani.   It's worth a listen if you can get it cheap.

> Anyone know if this is an abridged disc of the
> original Freedom double LP and Revenant double CD or whether these are
> really alternate unissued takes?

"Trance" is one disc of the two that make up "Nefertiti," unscrupulously foisted
onto the U.S. market after Revenant was made to cough up major bucks for
licensing rights.  And  having seen but not heard it I'd be willing to bet that
it's made from the same cheap crappy DAT dub of a vinyl LP that was furnished
initially to Revenant, who happily wouldn't settle for it and demanded a better
source.  I'd bet further that there are no bonus tracks.

D.A. Music is a bad, nasty, slag-eared bunch when it comes to quality control,
and it's a shame they own so many great recordings of the Freedom era.

Steve Smith
[e-mail]
NP - Cecil Taylor, "Amplitude," _The Great Paris Concert_


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:59:17 -0400
From: Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: mantler/cecil taylor/jcoa

Scott Handley wrote:

> Zorn mentions this as one of the early releases which spurred his
> interest in free improvisation, if I'm correct; that was fom his Webster
> College days.
>
> 1.Is this record still available?  and
> 2. Even if it is, I'll buy anyone's copy who doesn't like it; or I'll
> trade for it.

It is available on a single CD on the JCOA label, released via ECM, catalog
number 78118-23401-2.   No, it's not an ECM recording, but the connection
runs from JCOA via Bley and Mantler to Watt Works and from there to ECM, who
got it issued.

I'll be keeping mine, thanks... :-)

Steve Smith
[e-mail]




- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 02:16:08 -0500
From: Paul Chavez <[e-mail]>
Subject: Recent goodies

Just bought two Miles Davis releases:

Dark Magus and Live Evil.

Both are stunning and beautiful releases... however, can't figure out
why Dark Magus was a Japanese only release for so long.  I am blown away
on the bands Miles uses for these releases as the music is heavy funk
with lots of freeblowing movements.  I think of prime Throbbing Gristle
when I have these on as possible points of influence.  Maybe?  Possibly?

Someone had mentioned buying Pangaea.  What's this one like?

Paul


- -

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 10:25:37 +0200
From: Yves Dewulf <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Dave Douglas "Thoughts Around Mahfouz" [was Re: mori]

>The project was inspired by an Egyptian novelist.  During the three pieces
>played (the first an hour, the second 30-plus minutes, the third about 10
>minutes) the quartet touched on Egyptian modalities, noise, longs stretches
>of darkish ambiance, startling crashes, whirling percussion dervshes, Tiny
>Bell-style tight unison passages with Jamie Saft's sampler or Fender Rhodes
>subbing for Shepik's role (on a few occasions Saft played lines sampled
>from Dave's sound but transposed down to tuba range, synched so tightly
>that at first I'd thought Dave was just playing through a splitter of some
>...

Are you sure this was not an effect by Dave ? I ask this because he was
doing the same thing (trumpet doubled by a pitched down version of it,
sounding like a tuba or a trombone) in a Douglas/Bennink -duo
performance some months ago, and there was no Jamie Saft there to
provide this effect.

I must say I was completely blown away by the electric Dave Douglas at
that gig, amazing !
I hope he will put out more of this electric stuff soon.


- -

------------------------------

End of Zorn List Digest V2 #333
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