home
***
CD-ROM
|
disk
|
FTP
|
other
***
search
/
ftp.xmission.com
/
2014.06.ftp.xmission.com.tar
/
ftp.xmission.com
/
pub
/
lists
/
zorn-list
/
archive
/
v02.n212
< prev
next >
Wrap
Internet Message Format
|
1998-01-22
|
22KB
From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #212
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Thursday, January 22 1998 Volume 02 : Number 212
In this issue:
-
Re: COLTRANE
Re: COLTRANE
Re: COLTRANE
Re: COLTRANE
Re: COLTRANE
Re: COLTRANE
More trainspotting of Evan Lurie...
films
Coltrane
Horror Story???
Re: Coltrane
Joey Baron's Down Home
Re: Joey Baron's Down Home
Re: COLTRANE
[none]
Oxymoron of the Year
Re: COLTRANE
Re: Horror Story???
Re: Peter Epstein
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 08:57:29 -0600 (CST)
From: Saidel Eric J <ejs4839@usl.edu>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
> > please people do not kill me for this question...those who answer
> > please
> > contact me privatly..
> > well in my 23 years that i live on this "planet full of music" now i
> > never got the chance to buy a Coltrane record...could anyone please
> > name
> > the ESSENTIAL Coltrane records????
> >
> > thanx
> >
> > BJOERN
> >
>
> I think the new Coltrane Village Vanguard 4CD set jumped right to the
> top of the list.
>
> Alan
>
out of lurk mode for a moment ...
The Vanguard set is, of course, fantastic, and well worth picking up,
but it might be a bit much for a starter. I would start with some earlier
'Trane, either _Blue Train_, some of the music closest to bop that you'll
hear recorded with Trane as a leader, and featuring some great playing
by Lee Morgan and Curtis Fuller, or _Giant Steps_ or _My Favorite Things_
for some seminal playing that shows Trane's evolving sound. If you can
get ahold of the original live at the Village Vanguard disc, that'll give
you a taste of what the 4CD set is like.
What a wonderful world you're about to enter!
Back into lurk mode ...
- - eric
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 08:59:20 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph S. Zitt" <jzitt@humansystems.com>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
On Thu, 22 Jan 1998, BJOERN wrote:
> well in my 23 years that i live on this "planet full of music" now i
> never got the chance to buy a Coltrane record...could anyone please name
> the ESSENTIAL Coltrane records????
I would say:
A Love Supreme
Giant Steps
My Favorite Things
(and possibly) Ascension
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 06:58:05 -0800
From: "Schwitterz" <mcmullenm@vcss.k12.ca.us>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
>On Thu, 22 Jan 1998, BJOERN wrote:
>
>> well in my 23 years that i live on this "planet full of music" now i
>> never got the chance to buy a Coltrane record...could anyone please name
>> the ESSENTIAL Coltrane records????
>Corey correctly answered:
>like....all of them?
The original A LOVE SUPREME plus the live version recorded in France are a
pair of importance in tracking the Coltrane evolution.
s~Z
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 07:47:52 -0800
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
On Thu, 22 Jan 1998 08:06:09 -0500 Alan E Kayser wrote:
>
> BJOERN wrote:
>
> > please people do not kill me for this question...those who answer
> > please
> > contact me privatly..
> > well in my 23 years that i live on this "planet full of music" now i
> > never got the chance to buy a Coltrane record...could anyone please
> > name
> > the ESSENTIAL Coltrane records????
> >
> > thanx
> >
> > BJOERN
> >
>
> I think the new Coltrane Village Vanguard 4CD set jumped right to the
> top of the list.
I would recommend to start with A LOVE SUPREME.
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 09:56:14 -0600
From: JRZ <zube@winternet.com>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
At 01:08 PM 1/22/98 +0100, you wrote:
>please people do not kill me for this question...those who answer please
>contact me privatly..
>well in my 23 years that i live on this "planet full of music" now i
>never got the chance to buy a Coltrane record...could anyone please name
>the ESSENTIAL Coltrane records????
To hear his ungodly playing at it's finest I'd recommend...
The Complete Village Vanguard Recordings (once again)
A Love Supreme
Miles and Coltrane (late 50's Miles combo lineup)
For the standard studio releases I'd recommend...
My Favorite Things
Giant Steps
Greatest hits (not a bad intro)
For his free jazz works I'd recommmend...
Meditations (my personal favorite)
The Major Works of John Coltrane (this has both versions of Ascension, OM
and another work I can't remember the name of)
my tapelist http://www.winternet.com/~zube/tapelist.htm
Nyquist was wrong.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 08:18:49 -0800
From: "Schwitterz" <mcmullenm@vcss.k12.ca.us>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
>I would recommend to start with A LOVE SUPREME.
>
> Patrice.
And finish with the 4 disc set, LIVE IN JAPAN.
After hearing the originals, you must hear what he does with AFRO BLUE
(38:49'), CRESCENT (54:34'), and MY FAVORITE THINGS (57:19) in 1966. We're
still cathcing up.
s~Z
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 13:09:37 -0500
From: Bob Kowalski <BKowalski@genetics.com>
Subject: More trainspotting of Evan Lurie...
I promise no more after this...
... via the IMDB (Internet Movie Database)
Evan Lurie as Composer
( * = soundtracks or songs on soundtracks)
(most others are shorts, tv & film, many Italian...)
1.Office Killer (1997) *
2.Layin' Low (1996)
3.Trees Lounge (1996) *
4.Phinehas (1995)
5.Mostro, Il (1994) *
... aka Monster, The (1994)
6.Salesman and Other Adventures, The (1994)
7.Night We Never Met, The (1993)
8.Johnny Stecchino (1991) *
... aka Johnny Toothpick (1991)
9.Kill-Off (1989)
10.Piccolo diavolo, Il (1988)
... aka Little Devil, The (1988)
- -=also=-filmography
as Associate Producer & Writer
1.Hologram Man (1995)
Writer filmography
1.Hologram Man (1995)
Miscellaneous crew (fight co-ordinator)
1.Cyborg 3: The Recycler (1995)
Phew - thanks to all the replys and suggestions I received...I'll start tracking
down the CDs I don't have and wait paitently for the Tzadik release.
- -=Bob=-
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 01:27:03 -0500
From: jtalbot@massart.edu
Subject: films
does anyone know where i can get a copy of any of the films that
zorn has done scores for? also possibly any of the japanese s&m films
that zorn has taken a lot of art from? thanks
jtalbot@massart.edu
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 14:44:19
From: "Doug McKay" <mckay003@maroon.tc.umn.edu>
Subject: Coltrane
A couple years ago I was trying to learn about jazz. I got some Parker and
Monk and liked those. They had an edge. I got a Joshua Redman (don't
remember what - completely forgetable) and Coltrane's "Favorite Things".
Well, the Redman and Coltrane are gone. No edge. I later discovered Zorn
and am now reaching Big Fan status. Even his quiet stuff has that edge.
I heard about Coltrane originally because the guitarist of Helmet said he
was incredible, the greatest. Then I get this CD "Favorite Things" (BMG
club pick) and it's this drippy sweet romantic stuff. Huh? Out the door. I
sang that song when I was in grade school. I figure this can't be
representative of Coltrane. No way. Tell me please it isn't. Because of
that experience he's not up there on my list anymore. Now he's sitting
below Ornette Coleman and Eric Dolphy because these names come up in
relation to Zorn. I haven't heard them either, and I'm hoping they're not
syrup and sweet nothings, which is what jazz too often sounds like, in my
opinion. Despite its "musical depth".
Look, I think Vivaldi's "Four Seasons" is damn close to bubble gum music. I
laughed once in music class during a Haydn string quartet record because it
sounded like all he did was transcribe a symphonie to four instruments and
it was really funny. (It was probably one of his first, when he was still
inventing the form.) I've been known to say that Beethoven's symphonies are
bombastic and overblown (this was years ago - don't hold me to it, I'm just
reminiscing). I like Mozart, but sometimes he should get a little angry,
don't you think? I like the edge of Bartok and Shostokovich, the intimacy
and aggressive compact power of their string quartets. I like Cowboy music.
I like guns and horses and pickups, for that matter, and you'd have to
fight mighty hard to get me in a suit. I like the screech and clatter of
Peking Opera. There is probably no logic to what I like or don't like.
Except I'm looking for that edge. I don't claim musical insight or
aesthetic clarity or socio-political awareness. But that Coleman CD was
like Sunday school put on your loafers (and don't forget the pennies) and
cut your damn hair for Pete's sake kind of stuff.
If Coltrane is incredible (and I'm sure he is - I just had a bad attitude
at the time or made a wrong first choice) tell me what his most on the edge
album is. When I've got a sizable number of Zorn and others, maybe I'll
check him out again. I've still got more Parker and Monk to buy.
Doug McKay
In Minnesota
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 15:30:37 -0500
From: Sean Terwilliger <seanter@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Horror Story???
So, I've got a PC tech from a local store replacing a power supply on a
broken PC in my office. I'm sitting at my desk across the room. "Hear No
Evil" from Asana is playing (kinda loud). It's about 7 or 8 minutes into
the piece, and he looks over at me and says:
"YANNI?"
"Wh-what???" I say.
"Is that Yanni?" he asks,
"No. Bill Laswell" I reply.
"Oh. Never heard of him"
Later, on his way out he comes over to my desk, picks up the CD case for
Asana, and starts to tell me all about the wonderful special on PBS he
saw over Chrstmas, and how it sounded "just like that stuff that was
on."
Man. Wouldn't it be great if the true innovator got the props that the
mainstream yahoos get. It ALWAYS pissed me off that Paul Simon was
credited with bring 'Afro-Pop' to the US.
Oh well...
- -Sean
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 14:44:28 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph S. Zitt" <jzitt@humansystems.com>
Subject: Re: Coltrane
On Thu, 22 Jan 1998, Doug McKay wrote:
> If Coltrane is incredible (and I'm sure he is - I just had a bad attitude
> at the time or made a wrong first choice) tell me what his most on the edge
> album is. When I've got a sizable number of Zorn and others, maybe I'll
> check him out again. I've still got more Parker and Monk to buy.
Try "Interstellar Space" or "Ascension". Definitely edgier than "My
Favorite Things".
I came in by way of "A Love Supreme", because I was told to listen to it
as minimalism (a lot of the music is derived from a four-note sequence).
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 14:51:50 -0800
From: Jennifer Roy <jennifer@gamh.com>
Subject: Joey Baron's Down Home
Did you know that Joey Baron has an amazing new album called Down Home on
Intuition Records On Down Home, Joey brings together one of the most
intriguing ensembles:he's brought together some of the best musicians in
jazz and improvised music: Bill Frisell, Arthur Blythe and Ron Carter.
Just recently available in the United States, Down Home is getting rave
reviews from the LA Times to Downbeat.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 17:08:16 -0600
From: "Glenn Astarita" <gastarit@comm.net>
Subject: Re: Joey Baron's Down Home
- ----------
> From: Jennifer Roy <jennifer@gamh.com>
> To: zorn-list@xmission.com
> Subject: Joey Baron's Down Home
> Date: Thursday, January 22, 1998 4:51 PM
>
> Did you know that Joey Baron has an amazing new album called Down Home
on
> Intuition Records On Down Home, Joey brings together one of the most
> intriguing ensembles:he's brought together some of the best musicians in
> jazz and improvised music: Bill Frisell, Arthur Blythe and Ron Carter.
> Just recently available in the United States, Down Home is getting rave
> reviews from the LA Times to Downbeat.
>
>
> I agree ! ......................Joey should hire you as a PR
person....(just kidding !)
glenn
> -
>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 20:23:51
From: Jesse Simon <umsimo10@cc.UManitoba.CA>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
At 01:08 PM 1/22/98 +0100, BJOERN wrote:
>well in my 23 years that i live on this "planet full of music" now i
>never got the chance to buy a Coltrane record...could anyone please name
>the ESSENTIAL Coltrane records????
A tough question.
My pick would probably be _A Love Supreme_ which is generally considered to
be his "classic" release. It's an album of astounding brilliance ... not as
far out as some of the albums which followed, but definitely a step or two
beyond the straight ahead hard bop of the late fifties.
The other essential album is _Ascention_. I'm hesitant to recommend it
because even though it is probably my favorite, it is also not really a
"Coltrane" album as much as a collective improvisation led by Coltrane. It
does, however feature the work of many great musicians, including Pharaoh
Sanders, Archie Shepp and Freddie Hubbard.
Of course, if more traditional jazz is what you're after, you could do much
worse than Blue Train.
off to dig out my copy of _ascention_,
Jesse
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 20:13:45 -0700 MST
From: sasanborn@micron.com
Subject: [none]
Hey All. I'm new on the list. Just saw the post about Coltrane. Yeah "A Love
Supreme" is excellent! You should also check out works by Ornette Coleman.
He
really makes the horn squeal. Great stuff. Bitches Brew by Miles Davis is
also
an intense listen. Just my 2 cents on that. Anybody into Praxis?
I'd love to trade tapes if anybody is interested. Oh yeah, also check out
John
McLaughlin and Carlos Santana's version of " A Love Supreme", it smokes.
Email me if you want to chat at
sasanborn@micron.com
I dig all sorts of musick, especially fusion,space-rock,prog,psych,etc etc
Peace......Steve
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 20:24:35 -0800
From: "Schwitterz" <mcmullenm@vcss.k12.ca.us>
Subject: Oxymoron of the Year
Coltrane...No edge.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 01:09:02 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: COLTRANE
BJOERN wrote:
> well in my 23 years that i live on this "planet full of music" now i
> never got the chance to buy a Coltrane record...could anyone please name
> the ESSENTIAL Coltrane records????
Bjoern, Bjoern, don't be so hard on yourself. I'm betting that there aren't
many folks around who got into Coltrane much before age 23, at least not
since Trane was among the living. I would guess that I was 20-21 myself.
Ain't no disgrace.
Essential Coltrane? Well, lots of people are going to recommend the new
Village Vanguard box set. I'm not one of them. Don't get me wrong, it's
mind altering and essential stuff to the serious fan not just of Coltrane
but of jazz in general. But four discs with a considerable amount of
repetition could be offputting to the beginner. Trust me, once you've
absorbed some other stuff you'll find yourself ready for this.
Start with "A Love Supreme." There exists no other record full of more
simple piety and humility. It's honest, direct, moving and powerful. I
just heard it playing in a Tower the other day and was transported all over
again.
You might want to check into earlier material if you're a jazz fan in
general. "Giant Steps" is typically considered one of those lynchpins of
any jazz collection, and rightfully so. "My Favorite Things" is notable for
the early emphasis on soprano sax and to triple time modal vamping, a style
to which Coltrane would return again and again ("Greensleeves," "Inchworm,"
"Chim-Chim-Cheree," "Afro-Blue"). "Coltrane Sound" has the early
experiments with multiphonics but these would be better exploited later.
"The Avant Garde" is basically an Ornette Coleman quartet album with
Coltrane filling in for Coleman. But there's really not a stinker in the
Atlantic batch.
Of other early one-offs (later than his fledgling Prestige dates but prior
to Impulse) there are two in particular to note: "Blue Train" and "Coltrane
Time." The first is a memorable but very straight-ahead affair with some
great players like Lee Morgan (and the new version comes with alternate
takes and some video clips for CD-ROM), while the second, which by all
rights ought to be fascinating since it's Coltrane's first and only meeting
with Cecil Taylor, is instead stiff and plodding - they don't speak the same
language and not even the great Kenny Dorham can save the day.
The greatest of the "classic quartet" recordings on Impulse (aside from "A
Love Supreme") are "Coltrane" and "Crescent."
And then there's the late period, where Coltrane moved inexorably into the
"New Thing." Of these, I most highly recommend "Meditations" as the
transitional step on the way out and the logical successor to "Supreme."
Then I'd take the unusual route of recommending "Live at the Village
Vanguard Again" as your intro to the late band, reason being that it's two
full-blown free renditions of two of the most beautiful and melodic tunes of
Coltrane's early days, "Naima" and "My Favorite Things." If you follow the
band here, then you're ready to follow them out to "Ascension" (only
available as part of a two-CD set with other, lesser material) and "Live in
Japan" (vital and bracing but four CDs long).
You can round off your education with the titanic Coltrane-Ali duets,
"Interstellar Space," and I will also go on the record as saying I think
Coltrane was once again on his way to something new with the recently
released discovery "Stellar Regions."
So, here's my own list:
1. A Love Supreme
2. Giant Steps or My Favorite Things
3. Coltrane or Crescent
4. Meditations
5. Live at the Village Vanguard Again
If you get through 1-3 you are probably right for the Village Vanguard 4 CD
set. If you get through all five you're probably ready for the entire
catalog. Whatever the case, I envy your days of discovery ahead.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:12:23 PST
From: "Silent Watcher" <silent_watcher@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Horror Story???
>Man. Wouldn't it be great if the true innovator got the props that the
>mainstream yahoos get. It ALWAYS pissed me off that Paul Simon was
>credited with bring 'Afro-Pop' to the US.
>
In a perfect world.....
It does say something about the world of music as seen through the
mainstream world, though, when someone thinks that the remix on Asana
sounds like Yawni.
SW
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 01:35:52 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Peter Epstein
Tom Benton wrote:
> My question is this: Has anyone heard anything of a recently released
> album by the Peter Epstein Quartet called 'Staring at the Sun'?
Yes. It's on the Japanese label M-A and I believe they've recently signed a
deal with Koch for distribution.
> the impression that the lineup is Epstein on various saxophones, Jamie
> Saft on accordion and organ, Chris Dahlgren on bass, and Jim Black on
> drums.
Saft plays only accordion but you're correct otherwise.
> I'm quite a fan of all of these guys individually (Saft plays with
> Bobby Previte pretty much nonstop and has released a lovely record on
> Avant with trumpet guy Cuong Vu, Dahlgren I haven't heard except his very
> nice Enja record 'Slow Commotion', and Jim "Mr. Ubiquitous" Black
> obviously needs no introduction to this list).
Jamie Saft can name any Bob Dylan tune in two notes (even from boots),
Dahlgren's record is not on Enja but Koch Jazz and its followup is due soon,
and Jim Black is not the Indian of the group.
> My interest in these players (as well as my newfound accordion
> fascination) has gotten me pretty curious about this record, if anyone
> has any impressions of it or so on, I would be delighted to hear them.
The disc is terrific. The tunes are great, and Bernstein is a very fine young
sax player who's not really outward bound, just a solid melodist in a pomo
world. He's at least as good on this as on that very fine Shepik record. Jim
plays with more restraint than usual but is still one of the most distinctive
drummers on the planet. Saft is a fine keyboardist and this extends to
whatever keyboard he's manning. Dahlgren is a terrific player who also wrote
the most amazing tune on the disc, "Per." The rest is catchy originals by
Epstein. It's catchy, quirky, not especially demanding but plenty rewarding.
And the recording is to DIE for. It is so crystalline that when I listen on
headphones I start to think that when Jim is playing with his hands I can
recognize each individual finger's sound... I don't normally sweat sound
quality but this is so good it's surreal... it's the label's trademark, but
sound by itself without good music ain't shit, and this is one of the more
distinguished releases from this extremely weird young label.
Steve Smith
ssmith362sprynet.com
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #212
*******************************
To unsubscribe from zorn-list-digest, send an email to
"majordomo@xmission.com"
with
"unsubscribe zorn-list-digest"
in the body of the message.
For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send
"help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to
subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "zorn-list-digest"
in the commands above with "zorn-list".
Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in
pub/lists/zorn-list/archive. These are organized by date.