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Subject:   zorn-list Digest V2 #30
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zorn-list Digest          Monday, 18 November 1996      Volume 02 : Number 030

In this issue:

    John Oswald
    Re: Zorn's Labels?
    Subject madness...
    Re: West coast Masada
    Re: West coast Masada
    Re: Ultra-hip super 90's wired cyber-Masada for the information age?
    Re: Adress
    Re: Zorn's Labels?
    re: SF Masada, 11/15/96
    re: avant classical
    Guitar Listservs/Kaiser Lyme
    Re: Cuneiform lives!
    Guitar lists/Kaiser lyme
    Re: Zorn's Labels?
    re: SF Masada, 11/15/96
    Re: Cuneiform lives!
    Re: Ultra-hip super 90's wired cyber-Masada for the information age?
    Re: post Masada in Boston
    Re: Zorn's Labels?
    Mr. Bungle Show in S.F.
    Re: _Live In China_ set
    Re:Guitar Listservs/Kaiser Lyme
    Trespass

See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the zorn-list
or zorn-list-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Yeah-shure, Nah...er...ve'-so'n" <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 16:04:07 -0500 (EST)
Subject: John Oswald

Has anybody heard John Oswald's plunderphonic versions of Naked City's
music?  They're probably brilliant, but i think they only came with some
new-music magazine which comes out once a year or so.  I'd like to hear
them, too, so if you have them and feel like being nice, i'll send you a
tape and postage...

- -jascha

------------------------------

From: john shiurba <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 13:27:29 -0700
Subject: Re: Zorn's Labels?

>  i read somewhere that
> "More News For Lulu" is now out of print.
...
> check the recent issue. does anyone know
> if Cadence still has copies of this disc?

it's not in the Nov 96 issue.
- --



[e-mail]

http://www.sfo.com/~shiurba

------------------------------

From: silver whale <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 23:38:49 +0200 (GMT+0200)
Subject: Subject madness...

Thanks for all of you for cheering my day... or night (it=ABs 23:30 here):

Oh joy!

(quoting from a recent message=ABs header)
- -----
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 15:45:56 -0500 (EST)
From: "Yeah-shure, Nah...er...ve'-so'n"
     <[e-mail]>
To: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Cc: a record swap meet full of stamp collectors <[e-mail]>
Subject: Ultra-hip super 90's wired cyber-Masada for the information age?
- -----

What are you guys/gals on? Just kiddin=AB...


 teemu


- -------------
e-mail: [e-mail]           "There was coffee. Life would go on."
Ruumen homepage:                      William Gibson:'The Winter Market'
http://www.siba.fi/~tkorpipa/ruumen.html


------------------------------

From: john shiurba <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 13:43:39 -0700
Subject: Re: West coast Masada

> > Who plays in the west coast Masada?
>
> Ben Goldberg (cl), Trevor Dunn (b), Kenny Wollesen (dr).
>
well, this is only partially accurate. Masada has played out here in several
incarnations, including the one above, but also including douglas/
wolleson/ dunn/ zorn  and the DIW line-up
- --

[e-mail]

http://www.sfo.com/~shiurba

------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 14:40:30 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: West coast Masada

I just saw them friday, and they had the lineup from albums 1-6.  Cohen,
Douglas, And Baron (happiest gut I've ever seen).  Is this just for the
tour?  I saw them a long time ago in San Francisco, and they had
goldberg, Dunn, and KEN.  Did it change at all?

On Mon, 18 Nov 1996, Patrice L. Roussel wrote:

>
> On Mon, 18 Nov 1996 20:11:50 +0100 (MET)  Torsten Nielsen wrote:
> >
> > Who plays in the west coast Masada?
>
> Ben Goldberg (cl), Trevor Dunn (b), Kenny Wollesen (dr).
>
>     Patrice.
>

------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 14:43:35 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Ultra-hip super 90's wired cyber-Masada for the information age?

it was more like a bunch of video clips from stray documentaries from
National Geographic fed through some video effects.  I'm guessing that
masada didn't bring them.  Especially when they started to poke fun at
them.  Joey Baron pulled out a conga beat to some wierd lady gyrating at
Stonehenge.  I think the visual display was compliments of the house.

On Mon, 18 Nov 1996, Yeah-shure, Nah...er...ve'-so'n wrote:

> >
> > anyway! the Masada show in SF (11/15) was
> > astounding. was the multimedia barrage
> > something that Zorn wanted or normal fare
> > for the Maritime Hall?
>
> eh?  What did the barrage consist of, i'm really curious.  The two shows
> i saw last year at the knit were just four guys playing some of the best
> music in the cosmos - very simple.  I'd have an extremmely hard time
> imagining a multimedia barrage that wasn't somehow annoying to music
> fans, although i'm willing to admit that it could happen.  Did it work?
>
> -jascha
>

------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 14:44:24 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Adress

that really sounds pointless.

On Mon, 18 Nov 1996, Yeah-shure, Nah...er...ve'-so'n wrote:

>
> Actualy, i remember hearing on this list that there's only going to be 2
> hours of music on the whole thing...
>
>
> On Fri, 15 Nov 1996 [e-mail] wrote:
>
> > it sounds like about 3 months of cd after cd without leaving the room.
> > If someone listens to it all in less than six months, I don't know
> > whether to be impressed, or feel really, REALLY bad for them.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, 15 Nov 1996, DANIEL BITTON wrote:
> >
> > > So there actually is such a thing as a 150 cd box set of Zorn and Eye?
> > > What's that sound like?
> > >
> > > On Fri, 15 Nov 1996, Torsten Nielsen wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Fri, 15 Nov 1996, DANIEL BITTON wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Is that for real? What the fuck is that? You're joking right? I don't get it.
> > > >
> > > > I'm not joking, I just didn't make my point very clear. I ordered "Live
> > > > In China" from Sound Factory, but lost their adress. So I was hoping that
> > > > somebody on the Zorn list might know what it is...
> > > >
> > > > Jonas
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (m. rizzi)
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 14:53:53 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Zorn's Labels?

>On Sun, 17 Nov 1996, m. rizzi wrote:
>
>>     I do know that every record label (even majors) have
>>     a limit on how many different recordings they can
>>     produce in a year. It's not like a record label
>>     has infinite resources.

SUGAR in their vitamins?, demi-God and Icon sez:
>
>on the other hand, there's Muslimguaze
>who has been putting out at least one
>CD a month lately... WUP.

    I'm not sure how that constitutes an
    "on the other hand." Tzadik alone has
    been releasing 30-40 CD's a year!

>anyway! the Masada show in SF (11/15) was
>astounding.

    It twas most awesome. The deep
    bass ambient piece (2nd song)
    and the high speed accelerating
    songs blew my freakin' head off.

>was the multimedia barrage
>something that Zorn wanted or normal fare
>for the Maritime Hall?

    I can't speak for da man, but the
    fact that zorn, douglas and baron
    were making fun of the visuals
    leads me to believe, it wasn't
    their idea.

    Maritime Hall is booked by Family
    Dog productions, who are loosely
    connected to the whole Haight-Ashbury
    Grateful Dead scene...hence the
    hideous colored oil and water
    light show.

    ug.

    mike

- ------------------------------------------------------- [e-mail]
                   "Another nerd with a soulpatch"              -=home=-

------------------------------

From: Leon Lee/SYBASE <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Nov 96 16:40:02 EDT
Subject: re: SF Masada, 11/15/96

>The multimedia barrage consisted of video images projected in four places on
>the walls surrounding the stage, but thankfully above stage level. There were
>also overhead projectors superimposing liquidy visuals better suited to
>progrock. The content ranged from very pedestrian psychedelics to belly
dancing
>to grass chewing plains animals. There were brief images of what might have
>been a hebrew ritual but otherwise it was horrible and nothing that Zorn could
>have wanted.
>
>What about this long hair?
>
>The music was astounding. Further evidence that Zorn can do close to no wrong.
>Hopefully, this Masada project, or some incarnation of it, will last. As a
>vehicle for displaying his skills as an arranger, as well as his melodic and
>harmonic ability, I think Masada is unparalleled.
>
>Forget happy. Joey Baron, the world's most dynamic drummer.
>
>Apologies for any formatting snafus, I'm new at all this.
>
>Sam Jenniches, via the above address.
>ps. thanks rizzi. typed a little too much.

------------------------------

From: Leon Lee/SYBASE <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Nov 96 16:50:24 EDT
Subject: re: avant classical

A couple of years back I talked to Zorn about classical influences on his
music.
I'm interested in what others might suggest along the lines of Kagel, Scelsi,
Stockhausen, etc. And the possibility of swapping tapes.

Sam Jenniches via Leon Lee

------------------------------

From: "Walter M. Young" <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 19:53:16 -0500
Subject: Guitar Listservs/Kaiser Lyme

I've been reveling in number of postings about some of my favorite =
guitarists, but I've reluctant to join in because I believe that this =
may be a bit of a digression from the purpose of this list.  Is/are =
there any other good source(s) for discussion on the likes of Kaiser, =
Frith, Frisell, Torn, Sharrock, Ulmer, etc...  After all, if it hadn't =
been for a healthy diet of guitar noise over the years I probably would =
have never developed an appreciation for Zorn's attack on aesthetics.

Continuing on the recent flurry of postings regarding Henry Kaiser, I've =
been unable to get any information regarding whether contracting Lyme =
Disease has affected his playing.  He failed to make a performance last =
January at Knitting Factory with Joe Gallant's Illumati.  He had sent a =
fax to the club stating that he was unable to play due to having =
contracted Lyme Disease.  Considering the possible neurological =
complications of this disease the impact on his playing could be =
profound.  I hope someone out there can assure me that things are going =
well.  I posted a request for info on the jazz guitar news group once =
and merely got responses of "Who's he?"


------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 20:08:23 -0500
Subject: Re: Cuneiform lives!

 Steve Smith <[e-mail]>

write re: Henry Kaiser:
>HOPE YOU LIKE OUR NEW DIRECTION is a good intro to his work but
>may be hard to find as the label is defunct.  LEMON FISH TWEEZER is
>also a fine intro but for a similarly defunct label.

Uhhh. Excuse me, but Lemon Fish Tweezer is on the Cuneiform label (Cuneiform
Rune 45) which I own & run & take out the garbage for. I would hasten to
assure all 449 of you that Cuneiform is alive & reasonably well [even if we
don't have ANYTHING by J.Z. on our label!  ;-)], & would beg Mr. Smith not to
spread rumors of our demise.

Thank you.

Steve Feigenbaum
Cuneiform Records


------------------------------

From: "Walter M. Young" <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 20:12:05 -0500
Subject: Guitar lists/Kaiser lyme

I've been reveling in number of postings about some of my favorite
guitarists, but I've reluctant to join in because I believe that this
may be a bit of a digression from the purpose of this list.  Is/are
there any other good source(s) for discussion on the likes of Kaiser,
Frith, Frisell, Torn, Sharrock, Ulmer, etc...  After all, if it hadn't
been for a healthy diet of guitar noise over the years I probably would
have never developed an appreciation for Zorn's attack on aesthetics.

Continuing on the recent flurry of postings regarding Henry Kaiser, I've
been unable to get any information regarding whether contracting Lyme
Disease has affected his playing.  He failed to make a performance last
January at Knitting Factory with Joe Gallant's Illumati.  He had sent a
fax to the club stating that he was unable to play due to having
contracted Lyme Disease.  Considering the possible neurological
complications of this disease the impact on his playing could be
profound.  I hope someone out there can assure me that things are going
well.  I posted a request for info on the jazz guitar news group once
and merely got responses of "Who's he?"



------------------------------

From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 17:31:00 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Zorn's Labels?

On Mon, 18 Nov 1996, m. rizzi wrote:

>     I'm not sure how that constitutes an
>     "on the other hand." Tzadik alone has
>     been releasing 30-40 CD's a year!

Tzadik is a label, releasing many
different artist's works. one would expect
as many releases in a year. on the
other hand... Muslimguaze is just one
guy, releasing many albums per year.
he originally wanted a contract to
release 30 CDs a year!

>     I can't speak for da man, but the
>    fact that zorn, douglas and baron
>     were making fun of the visuals
>     leads me to believe, it wasn't
>     their idea.

ah, well... up on the balcony, we
couldn't exactly make out what they
were doing to such detail.

hasta.

Yes.  Beautiful, wonderful nature.  Hear it sing to us: *snap*  Yes.  natURE.


------------------------------

From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 17:38:26 -0800 (PST)
Subject: re: SF Masada, 11/15/96

On 18 Nov 1996, Leon Lee/SYBASE wrote:

>There were brief images of what might have been a hebrew ritual

it was a clip of orthodox jews
praying at the wailing wall.

> but otherwise it was horrible and nothing that Zorn could
>have wanted.

i liked the clip of tribesman performing
a ke-chack ceremony. :)

hasta.

Yes.  Beautiful, wonderful nature.  Hear it sing to us: *snap*  Yes.  natURE.


------------------------------

From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 17:38:47 -0800
Subject: Re: Cuneiform lives!

    Steve,

On Mon, 18 Nov 1996 20:08:23 -0500  [e-mail] wrote:
>
>  Steve Smith <[e-mail]>
>
> write re: Henry Kaiser:
> >HOPE YOU LIKE OUR NEW DIRECTION is a good intro to his work but
> >may be hard to find as the label is defunct.  LEMON FISH TWEEZER is
> >also a fine intro but for a similarly defunct label.
>
> Uhhh. Excuse me, but Lemon Fish Tweezer is on the Cuneiform label (Cuneiform
> Rune 45) which I own & run & take out the garbage for. I would hasten to
> assure all 449 of you that Cuneiform is alive & reasonably well [even if we
> don't have ANYTHING by J.Z. on our label!  ;-)], & would beg Mr. Smith not to
> spread rumors of our demise.

Steve just made a mistake that he acknowledged. We *ALL* know that Cuneiform
is alive! And we all know the great job you are doing.

    Patrice.


------------------------------

From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 17:40:24 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Ultra-hip super 90's wired cyber-Masada for the information age?

On Mon, 18 Nov 1996, Yeah-shure, Nah...er...ve'-so'n wrote:

> Did it work?

overall, i found it too distracting
for me, but it had its moments - both
humorous and interesting.

hasta.

Yes.  Beautiful, wonderful nature.  Hear it sing to us: *snap*  Yes.  natURE.


------------------------------

From: "George Curran <GCURRAN.US.ORACLE.COM>" <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Nov 96 13:10:07 -0800
Subject: Re: post Masada in Boston

I realize this is the Zorn list.  While I went to the ICA to listen to Zorn
and Douglas, I think any discussion of Masada that does not start with the
rhythm section is inadequate misses the essence of this band.  I am, of
course, quite familiar with Baron's work, but Cohen is new to me.  Can anyone
fill me in on who else he has worked with, as I would like to hear other
examples of his work, especially in a small group context.  Thanks.

------------------------------

From: "George Curran <GCURRAN.US.ORACLE.COM>" <[e-mail]>
Date: 18 Nov 96 13:12:36 -0800
Subject: Re: Zorn's Labels?

<<well, i read somewhere that "More News For Lulu" is now out of print.>>

I think the story on that one is that hatArt is no longer pressing new copies
of their backlist, but there are enough copies of everything out there so that
availability should not be an issue.  I have not had any problem finding any
hatArt discs I really wanted; moreover I only recently bought "News for Lulu."


------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (m. rizzi)
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 18:08:35 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Mr. Bungle Show in S.F.

    For folks in the San Fransisco area, I just
    heard that Mr. Bungle are playing two gigs
    at Slims on Nov 25th and 26th. It will be
    great to see them in a smaller venue.

    rizzi

- ------------------------------------------------------- [e-mail]
                   "Another nerd with a soulpatch"              -=home=-
                      http://www.meer.net/~browbeat/
- ------ browbeat magazine, po box 11124, oakland, ca 94611-1124 ---------

------------------------------

From: Barry Gilbert <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 20:44:26 -0700
Subject: Re: _Live In China_ set

>>
>>>With regard to the Zorn / Eye CD set, i regret to inform you that this
>>>project has now been postponed until further notice; probably early next
>>>spring.  Anyway, i'll keep you posted on the progress.  Lastly, i would
>>>like to thank you for your interest and support on this project.
>>

I spoke with Zorn at last night's show in Boulder.  He said this set would
be delayed until probably the fall.  He also said that the shortest CD's
would be about one second long.

Alas, there was no interview.  He didn't have time.  However, the show was
terrific. There were many tune I recognized and a few I did not.  I was
surprised at how much he directs the playing of the group members.
Sometimes he would tell Joey what kind of sticks to use. One time, during a
bass solo, he seemed to be telling Joey to not play the cymbals, just drums.
After the show, he came out to sign autographs. (He signed my copy of the JZ
Radio Hour!) He was very nice and appreciative of the adulation.  He stayed
for about ten minutes and chatted with the few of us who remained.  Off to
Vermont!

Barry Gilbert
Boulder, Colorado


------------------------------

From: Mr R Teh <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 15:49:12 +1100 (EST)
Subject: Re:Guitar Listservs/Kaiser Lyme

>ssion from the purpose of this list.  Is/are there any other good
source(s) for
>discussion on the likes of Kaiser, Frith, Frisell, Torn, Sharrock,
Ulmer, etc...
There is a mailing list dedicated to David Torn. In fact David himself
contributes regularly to the list. Admin info as follow:

  To leave / join this mailing list or have your thoughts in the next issue,
    please send electronic mail to Door X at the following address:
      [e-mail]

    You can contact the editor (Pete Cole) directly at the following address:
      [e-mail], or through the SSEYO Koan website at
      http://www.sseyo.com ...


Take care
Regards,
Richie Teh
Maintainer of Drumnet
http://www.clearview.com.au/drumnet
Email: [e-mail] or [e-mail]

*Want to display an Advertisment Banner on DrumNet, email for more
 infor :-)
** New contest on DrumNet. All you have to do is fill in the
   survey and be in the running for 3 CDs!!! Yes, 3 CDs!!!
   Amazing! Starts 21st Oct 96




------------------------------

From: James Douglas Knox <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 16:41:58 +1100 (EDT)
Subject: Trespass

18 Nov 1996 07:37:01 -0800, Jeff Spirer writes:
>At 05:24 PM 11/18/96 +1100, James Douglas Knox wrote:
>>Oh, unnh, this one is a bit more embarassing; leastways for me. Mr Roussel
>>kindly thanks me in the new zorn discography for mailing re: Filmworks 2
>>(Zorn had been commissioned to do the score, but those inexorable
>>MCA studio execs baulked, and got Ry Cooder to come up with his own
>>perfectly competent but somewhat lesser alternative).
>
>"Lesser" in what sense?
>
>Or are we only allowed to pray to one god here?

Well, unnh, I'm less interested in "prayer" than in music (perhaps
you made a wrong choice of vocation). While Cooder and Zorn both recorded
effective scores for the film (perhaps), Zorn's piece is - to me at least
- - far more interesting than Cooder's as a piece of music per se. Like most
of Zorn's work - and almost none of Cooder's - there's a formal experiment
happening here. Zorn uses those hillbilly strings to reference Hill's
"Deliverance", and evoke the white trash millieu of "Trespass"'s protagonists.
He uses the world music elements to describe that 'Heart of Darkness'
that is the urban american ghetto. I could go on.

Ultimately; my understanding of Cooder's brief is that he was asked to
record a "lesser" (i.e "watered-down") version of Zorn's score.

go well, stay free...

Jim K

------------------------------

End of zorn-list Digest V2 #30
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