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mobility-digest      Saturday, November 13 1999      Volume 03 : Number 029



Re: (mobility) next AMP playlist (moby!)/JSBX remix info!
Re: (mobility) misogyny?
(mobility) misogyny? - WAR AGAINST INTELLIGENCE
Re: (mobility) 'letter from moby to mobililty'
Re: (mobility) misogyny? THE LONGISH POST
Re: (mobility) misogyny? LONGISH POST II
Re: (mobility) 'letter from moby to mobililty'
Re: (mobility) misogyny?
(mobility) nmr - apology and 2 cents (might as well)
RE: (mobility) misogyny?
(mobility) or those of you who don't care about the misogny thing or Limp Bizkit,  skip this email.
(mobility) Re: Hello new member
(mobility) [Fwd: misogyny? LONGISH POST II]

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:07:57 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (mobility) next AMP playlist (moby!)/JSBX remix info!

amp on at 3 not 2,is that eastern time, or central?

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 21:27:59 GMT
From: "alex" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) misogyny?

What does misogyny mean?


misogyny is treating a female like crap because she's a female...and he's
right, it's very prevalent in today's pop culture (always has been).  it
doesn't seem like bands like limp bizkit and god knows how many others are
going to go away anytime soon.  which sucks, because amidst all their fame
and popularity, with moby's inclusion into this popular mainstream only
means his subsequent inclusion in the said stereotype so many fall into.

- -alex

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 21:55:08 +0000
From: Mark Reed <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) misogyny? - WAR AGAINST INTELLIGENCE

This rise of Jerk Rock frightens me. It's cool to be dumb. The most
self-expression kids will grow up learning is muthafugga and a finger.
The War Against Intelligence is raging. Which side are you on? The
Inarticulate Ape or the Evolved man?
>
>misogyny is treating a female like crap because she's a female...and he's
>right, it's very prevalent in today's pop culture (always has been).  it
>doesn't seem like bands like limp bizkit and god knows how many others are
>going to go away anytime soon.  which sucks, because amidst all their fame
>and popularity, with moby's inclusion into this popular mainstream only
>means his subsequent inclusion in the said stereotype so many fall into.

- --
Mark Reed

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:37:23 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (mobility) 'letter from moby to mobililty'

In a message dated 11/13/99 1:56:06 PM Eastern Standard Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< speaking of which, is anyone else absolutely offended
 by all of the misogyny in contemporary music?
 all of these groups, limp bizkit, kid rock, eminem,
 korn, etc, all seem to have some sort of misogynistic
 component to their music and i find it to be truly
 awful and offensive.  misogyny is just as offensive
 as racism, homphobia, anti-semitism, etc. >>

yes, it is awful.. misogyny means hatred of women, btw..  it's just so odd
how all of these groups just seem to be sprouting up everywhere now..  the
weird thing is that their fans don't seem realize that misogynistic component
attached to the music... not to mention mtv who did a wonderful job of
exposing them to death.

later,
- -tina

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:43:41 -0700
From: kimbalina <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) misogyny? THE LONGISH POST

>
> >>speaking of which, is anyone else absolutely offended
> >>by all of the misogyny in contemporary music?
> >>all of these groups, limp bizkit, kid rock, eminem,
> >>korn, etc, all seem to have some sort of misogynistic
> >>component to their music and i find it to be
> truly                                                    >>awful and
> offensive.  misogyny is just as
> offensive                                                 >as racism,
> homphobia, anti-semitism, etc.

>
> >What does misogyny mean?  can anybody please
> >tell me what it means?
>

Misogyny is like, a hatred towards women or derogatory statments towards
women or of offense to women, right?  Well, I agree that some musicians
are mysoginistic but I don't think all those artists are that bad about
it.  A lot of music is disrespectful towards women and it's not exactly
right to disrespect women, ppl of color, different sexual orientation
etc but I don't totally agree that it's bad.

I mean, it's *bad* to have a negative attitude towards women, ppl of
color, gays etc however I think it's unhealthy and unrealistic for those
views to never be represented.  How boring would it be for every song to
be about love and cars and money and God only knows what but to not have
songs about rape or hatred?  They exist.  But it *is* the artists job to
say "OK, this is a song about gang raping a girl...burning crosses in
yards or gay bashing and it's wrong to do those things but it does
happen and you should know that it's wrong to do those things and I'm
not saying you should go out and do it.  It doesn't make you a hero in
my book or anyone else's but it is real." Or maybe to say "I've done
this and I'm not proud of it and I want you to know that it's a dark
thing and a shameful thing that I'm not proud of but it's real and maybe
knowing that it happens you can protect yourself from it happening to
you, you doing it or being harmed by it.  It's not right but it happens
so don't do it."

 And it's not only men to have disrespectful songs about women...one of
the weirdest songs I've ever heard was a punk song from a lesbian band
talking about raping a girl in the ladies bathroom.  Maybe if these ppl
get out all that rage and hatred they have, it will keep them from
acting on it and maybe show ppl that it's really not good to have those
kinds of attitudes and to not act on feelings of anger or violence on
women, ppl of color or gays.

There is a world of feelings, good and bad and actions good and bad.
Wouldn't it be wonderful if everything were safe and every one loved
each other?  It would be but it's not realistic.  Human's will make
descions that are wrong and right but they have to atone for their own
sins and it's important that ppl be made aware that these are real
things to not get involved in.  Does any one agree or am I just rambling
on and on?

- --kimby

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:51:45 -0700
From: kimbalina <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) misogyny? LONGISH POST II

> >misogyny is treating a female like crap because she's a female...and he's
> >right, it's very prevalent in today's pop culture (always has been).  it
> >doesn't seem like bands like limp bizkit and god knows how many others are
> >going to go away anytime soon.  which sucks, because amidst all their fame
> >and popularity, with moby's inclusion into this popular mainstream only
> >means his subsequent inclusion in the said stereotype so many fall into.
>

I don't condone the thoughts expressed by Kid Rock or Limp Bizkit (which I
can't stand) but ppl no matter who they are get treated like crap.  It's
wrong.  I don't think that it should be totally shouldered by these ppl
though.  They ARE responsible for what they say and do but it is also parents
responsibility to make sure they're kids either don't get ahold of music like
that or that they understand that homophobia is wrong, misongyny is wrong and
racism is wrong.  It's the media's responsibility to express to it's viewers
that those are unacceptable attitudes.  Ppl will write that crap but no body
has to play it or buy it.  So we can start by not buying it, not requesting it
and talking to other ppl about it.  It's everyone's responsibility to make
sure that the children who don't know better that those are unaceptable
attitudes to have.  And the ppl who wrote that stuff, they are as much a
product of our irresponsible society as the children who buy their music.  I'm
not saying to pity them because they had hard lives but to realize if we keep
letting children hear these things and not understand that it's wrong, we're
going to keep creating Limp Bizkit, year after year.  They were kids and our
society failed them by at some point saying "It's ok to rape, to hate and to
steal.  It's ok because ppl do it on tv, on the radio and adults do it on the
streets.  You can do it too."  No, that's not acceptable.  I would not allow
any child of mine to get away w/ murder so what makes other parents, friends
and adults do it?  We are all responsible.

Ok, I'm stepping off the soap box, I'm now returning you to your regular
email.

- --kimby

>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:47 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (mobility) 'letter from moby to mobililty'



------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 17:14:08 -0500
From: "nelson-family" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) misogyny?

- ----- Original Message -----
From: alex <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 1999 4:27 PM
Subject: Re: (mobility) misogyny?


> What does misogyny mean?
>
>
> misogyny is treating a female like crap because she's a female...and he's
> right, it's very prevalent in today's pop culture (always has been).  it
> doesn't seem like bands like limp bizkit and god knows how many others are
> going to go away anytime soon.  which sucks, because amidst all their fame
> and popularity, with moby's inclusion into this popular mainstream only
> means his subsequent inclusion in the said stereotype so many fall into.
>
> -alex
>
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
> Honestly i dont see any of this in korn, i am a fan, but am still trying
to look at it from a non fan view.  this is evident in Limp Bizkit, however,
Johnathan Davis(korn's lead singer) was abused as a child, it may be
slightly evident this is the bands way of expressing their rage.  It can be
offensive, however there are many things i find far more offensive, that
people can accept this as it being their one and only view on the matter,
because its all they have heard from them.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 17:23:50 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: (mobility) nmr - apology and 2 cents (might as well)

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Return-path: [e-mail]
From: [e-mail]
Full-name: Arcya
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 17:17:46 EST
Subject: nmr - apology and 2 cents (might as well)
To: [e-mail]
MIME-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 54

sorry for that empty email, i was spacing, thinking how cool it was to get a
moby email again, while trying to forward it to a friend and goofed terribly.
i think that misogyny in our culture is very much ingrained that it's hard to
make a change down to the roots because the roots are sometimes hard to find.
 maybe it's like when i look at another culture and i am appalled by what
they do to their women and the laws they put to oppress them, but if no one
from or affected by another culture said anything, maybe some of those laws
would just be taken in as how things just are.
and that's why i think we don't quite notice it so much, because we are
living in it.  it's hard to look at something objectively when you're in the
middle of it.  but then one day in the future (i am hoping we get better)
people will look back at us and think about how horrible we were to women.
i think we're still too affected by centuries, even recent decades past where
the woman was supposed to be weaker.  also in music, there's a certain
attraction and romanticism attached to artistic anger and destructive
violence.  and many of these musical genres are tied closely to sub-cultures
that like to behave very much like packs of animals.  and maybe they do it
just because it feels right instead of thinking intelligently about the
disease they keep passing down.
okay, i hope that made some sense.  i am still a bit embarrased.  continue
with the moby-talk!
malfunctiongirl
ps: i totally agree about the beautiful saturday morning depression thing.
i'd feel much happier in the middle of a foggy morning.

- --part1_0.2f7a3637.255f3ef6_boundary--

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 17:41:27 -0800
From: "Chris Hand" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (mobility) misogyny?

Maybe if anyone analzyed the music industry you would find there is a lot of
misandry (hatred for men)
Suddenly all these male bands come out calling women bitches and disliking
them for taking their money and so on...
Maybe because there were a bunch of female bands calling men assholes and
cheap and so on...
it is a battle of the sexes...
Do I get offended no..why should I
it is some artists view about the opposite sex...If females continually
screw you over, then you will have some kind of hatred towards them, and
these will be reflected in your songs...
same thing vice versa...when female arists react with male hatred..
I just don't really totally agree...I mean I love women and all...but if you
had even just one bad experience with one and it really pisses you off..what
can ya do heh..
heh...did you see tons of guys at Lilith Fair? maybe cause half of the
artists songs are about guys..
Sure Eminem is a real asshole, his mom is even suing him.  that sucks..
but like these other bands, Korn, Limp Bizkit...heh, it's music full of rage
and emotion..and if you don't dig that then fine.  Cause a lot of emotion
comes out of breakups and experiences that are related.  I mean stabbing
westward has made 3 albums of just songs being pissed off at women...
I just think it is normal emotion..
Rappers treat women more like shit than anyone else and have been for a
decade...but what is funny is that the women that like that kind of music
seem to agree with the stereotype..anyways
I think this may be blown out of proportion...
Chris

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:39:18 -0700
From: kimbalina <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) or those of you who don't care about the misogny thing or Limp Bizkit,  skip this email.

Ok, for those of you who don't care about the misogny thing or Limp
Bizkit, skip this email.

Ok, for those of you who do care, here is the Limp Bizkit email
address.  Forward the Limp Bizkit posts to them, express YOUR feelings
about their music etc.  If you have a problem w/ it, tell them!  Also,
email artists, record companies etc who publish music you feel depicts
unaceptable attitudes.  They have a right to speak freely and so do you
and your opinions may just have an influence on them.  Write MTV, VH1
and even your state congress ppl!  If you want to see artists take
responsibility for their attitudes then be a responsble member of
society and express yours!  No one hears your voice if you don't speak
up!  Be proud to have a voice.  BTW: I'm not saying we should get all
Tipper Gore on every one but really, if you say "Hey, this is how I feel
about what you're doing.  I'm not going to kill you or stalk you or
threaten you but I feel your music is....(insert here) and I would like
you to be aware that ppl feel that it is detrimental to children."

[e-mail]

Millennium with Kid Rock
PO Box 1366
Royal Oak, MI 48068

Psychopathic Records
P.O. Box 332
Royal Oak, MI, 48068-0332

Insane Clown Posse Infoline:
(734)-480-3910

[e-mail]

[e-mail]

Info on contacting your congressman:
http://www.visi.com/juan/congress/

The White House:
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Ave, N.W.
[phone] [phone]

Email MTV NEWS:
[e-mail]

Spin:
[e-mail].

Rolling Stone Editors:
[e-mail]

I think that covers it sort of for now.  Again, I'm not saying these ppl
should be killed or stalked or harassed but they should be made aware of
your opinions and if we want things to change, we have to say "Hey, I
think you're giving kids the wrong idea.  I'm not saying stop making
your music or even to change your lyrics but to tell kids that if they
do some of the things you depict in your songs, they might end up dead
or in jail."  That is where we can start.

love,

kimby

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 22:41:45 +0000
From: TOMB <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) Re: Hello new member

1- name: javi
2- age:18
3- moby collection: i only own play for now
4- first heard of moby at the spring HFStival in balitmore
5- i'm also a fan of silverchair
6- i'm looking forward to seeing moby with low-fidelity allstars at the
recher theater on thanksgiving day



I like Low -fidelity allstars, they are cool, a gig was on the radio
with Chandra doing violin, f**king amazing. Oh, and hello, welcome to
the wonderful world of dementadly obsessive moby
fans____________________

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:46:10 -0700
From: kimbalina <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) [Fwd: misogyny? LONGISH POST II]

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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This is email expressed my opionions and not those of the mailing list
it was oringinally sent to.  There are others who feel as I do, that
disrespect is disgraceful but that the artists mentioned and the artists
not mentioned are not the only ones to blame.  I think that expressing
this to persons in the music industry helps them to understand and to
consider the feelings of consumers of music products.

- --kimberly thomas

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> >misogyny is treating a female like crap because she's a female...and he's
> >right, it's very prevalent in today's pop culture (always has been).  it
> >doesn't seem like bands like limp bizkit and god knows how many others are
> >going to go away anytime soon.  which sucks, because amidst all their fame
> >and popularity, with moby's inclusion into this popular mainstream only
> >means his subsequent inclusion in the said stereotype so many fall into.
>

I don't condone the thoughts expressed by Kid Rock or Limp Bizkit (which I
can't stand) but ppl no matter who they are get treated like crap.  It's
wrong.  I don't think that it should be totally shouldered by these ppl
though.  They ARE responsible for what they say and do but it is also parents
responsibility to make sure they're kids either don't get ahold of music like
that or that they understand that homophobia is wrong, misongyny is wrong and
racism is wrong.  It's the media's responsibility to express to it's viewers
that those are unacceptable attitudes.  Ppl will write that crap but no body
has to play it or buy it.  So we can start by not buying it, not requesting it
and talking to other ppl about it.  It's everyone's responsibility to make
sure that the children who don't know better that those are unaceptable
attitudes to have.  And the ppl who wrote that stuff, they are as much a
product of our irresponsible society as the children who buy their music.  I'm
not saying to pity them because they had hard lives but to realize if we keep
letting children hear these things and not understand that it's wrong, we're
going to keep creating Limp Bizkit, year after year.  They were kids and our
society failed them by at some point saying "It's ok to rape, to hate and to
steal.  It's ok because ppl do it on tv, on the radio and adults do it on the
streets.  You can do it too."  No, that's not acceptable.  I would not allow
any child of mine to get away w/ murder so what makes other parents, friends
and adults do it?  We are all responsible.

Ok, I'm stepping off the soap box, I'm now returning you to your regular
email.

- --kimby

>
>




- --------------440379E0C60C46CEE826FC91--

------------------------------

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