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mobility-digest       Tuesday, November 9 1999       Volume 03 : Number 025



Re: (mobility) Mime-Version: 1.0
Re: (mobility) smoking (off the music topic)
(mobility) ATB, Opus III, & Moby
RE: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. off topic whatever
Re: (mobility) poll time!
Re: (mobility) poll time!
Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. (OT of music)
Re: (mobility) smoking (off the music topic)
Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. (OT of music)
Re: RE: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. off topic whatever
RE: (mobility) off topic.
Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. (OT of music)
Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. off topic whatever

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 17:11:48 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (mobility) Mime-Version: 1.0

tower records has techno but it depends on which store you go to...there is
one in georgetown

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 17:20:33 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (mobility) smoking (off the music topic)

In a message dated 11/09/1999 1:30:48 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< by "allowing" people to continue doing it, they are saying it is okay.
 if we, as a people, didn't think it was okay, alcoholic beverages would
 be illegal, or at least any negative behavior stemming from their use
 would be punished much more harshly.
  >>

No.  Alcohol is not illegal because there is some chance of control and
moderation (which can also be said about marijuana, but I won't go there).
Beyond creating liver disease, cancer, likelihood of diabetes in your golden
years, alcohol poses no immediate threat.  Neither do cigarettes, but it is
harder to moderate cigarettes than alcohol.  But cigarettes are endagering
more lives than alcohol, so why aren't they illegal.  Because of the
corporate powers that rule the world.  So drop it.  It's not changing.
Making alcohol illegal just made it more popular and led to a rise in crime
(do we have to go over the evils of Prohibition?).  The reason marijuana
isn't legal is because tobacco companies see it as a threat, even though it's
probably helped more people than hurt, but that's a matter of opinion.  Drop
it.  Alcohol and smoking will never be illegal. It's became a natural choice
for all human beings to make.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 14:20:54 PST
From: "Steve Giles" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) ATB, Opus III, & Moby

First if all, Bodyrock. I've seen an MRE 12" in yellow cardboard (cardboard
ripples on the outside, interesting) called Bodyrock, and the record store
had "Once In A Lifetime" written under it, does anybody know if this is a
Talking Heads remix? It was 13.99, which was too much for curiosity, but if
it is.... I must have it. I doubt it's Moby related because...

I've also seen (and bought) a CD single for Michie One & Louchie Lou (or
something to that effect) that is also called Bodyrock. Has absolutely
nothing to do with Moby. I only listened to it once and I think it was
clubby house. Wasn't impressed.

Also at the vinyl stop is a 12" that has ATB, Jason Nevins, & Jonathan
Peters remixes of "It's A Fine Day", by Opus III. Moby remixed this for the
official 12" for that title. The new one is club and trance mixes, 2 ATB, 1
each for the other two remixers. I like it.

*off topic ATB & Beck stuff*
I decided to buy some ATB since I like the mix they did for Moby, and I
scored a lmtd. "Don't Stop Remixes" that has  1 Quake &  1 Sash! remix on
it. The Sash! is great! I saw the 2x12" for this song and I'll probablt buy
it so I can hear ATB's original. I also picked up "Killer" by ATB, and I
think it's lame. Opinions? Please e-mail me privately.

I got the clear 12" for Sexx Laws from BECKdirect and the Malibu remix on
the b-side is Blue Monday meets Sexx Laws. You have to hear to beleive it,
it's even funnier than the song itself! Just in case you wanted that fyi...


- -Steve

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 17:20:04 -0800
From: "Chris Hand" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. off topic whatever

I already presented my practical solution.

Eat animals
Because in the food chain, we are on a higher level.
You can't make people give up their tastes and preferences in food..it won't
change heh, so there are other things that must be resolved first..
As for human rights...
no one ever talks about them..which is really kind of sad..if you are going
to use your voice for something, save humans heh
when looking for solutions to solve the world, the solution must be as easy
and readily available as it is right now.
Recycling is a bitch for me to do, maybe waste management should invent a
system to where it sorts and recycles trash itself and stop relying on
people to do it.  Electric cars are a stupid concept right now...we should
just be looking for an alternate fuel to burn.  You want to clear land to
plant stuff, I would rather have animals grazing on that land.  Also, do you
know how many jobs would be lost and how our economy would fall if the whole
world turned vegan and we just freed all the animals "animal liberation"
Clothing manafacturers, the meat industry, ranchers, cosmetics, and so many
other things, are just kicked out of our economy, it won't work.
Practicality is what I'm looking for.  We do what we do to survive.  Bitch
at animal testing labs if you want to talk about cruelty.  It really doesn't
matter if I am lazy..because I am just an example of a normal person. We are
too busy and have too many other problems to worry about all this extra
"stuff".  So you have to find solutions that cater to the bulk of society
and to the normal person.  Otherwise it won't work, that is just life.
Chris

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 14:25:00 -0800
From: Laura <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) poll time!

> first off, Laura, yr quotes are the bomb! i dont even
> read the content, just down to the quote! "nobody will
> remember me after i'm gone---some dead guy" genius!
> thats like a TMBG song!

*l* thanks, phizzo, it's good you don't read the actual posts, or you'd
probably hate me too ;)

> POLL TIME!
> ok this is about songs. singles, specifically. which
> song would you elect the perfect single? i'll break it
> down into sections:
>
> 1. Perfect Moby single

Why Does My Heart Feel So Bad? i think.

> 2. Perfect non-Moby single

Let Me Go by Cake.  I'm listening to it right now, and it's a perfect
single.  You can sing along with it after the first 8 measures, and you
gotta bop when it's playing.  Also Numb, by Portishead.  It's perfect,
single or not.

> 3. Perfect Moby single that isn't (as in, song from an
> album that hasnt been released as a single, including
> trax from play that are not yet scheduled to be
> released...)

The Sky is Broken or Inside.  They're both really dramatic and pretty,
and the videos I imagine for them are really cool.  The songs are like
little movies.

> 4. same, non-moby

Water, by PJ Harvey.  It's a lilbit abrasive, but when she starts
singing "waaaaaater!" you have to sing along.  And that's my definition
of a perfect single :)  Ooh, also, Western Eyes by Portishead.  Again,
it's just perfect.

> 1. eh... mmm... i dont know, why do you force me into
> this!?!? ;) ah actually NOT GO (sorry im a little
> bored of this song) but i think the perfect Moby
> single would be....Run On. for now. sorry, maybe i'll
> get back to this later.

Ooh ya, Run On.  Good choice. :)

laura!

- --
Anytime I see something screech across a room and latch onto someone's
neck, and
the guy screams and tries to get it off, I have to laugh, because what
is that thing.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 14:25:00 -0800
From: Laura <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) poll time!

> first off, Laura, yr quotes are the bomb! i dont even
> read the content, just down to the quote! "nobody will
> remember me after i'm gone---some dead guy" genius!
> thats like a TMBG song!

*l* thanks, phizzo, it's good you don't read the actual posts, or you'd
probably hate me too ;)

> POLL TIME!
> ok this is about songs. singles, specifically. which
> song would you elect the perfect single? i'll break it
> down into sections:
>
> 1. Perfect Moby single

Why Does My Heart Feel So Bad? i think.

> 2. Perfect non-Moby single

Let Me Go by Cake.  I'm listening to it right now, and it's a perfect
single.  You can sing along with it after the first 8 measures, and you
gotta bop when it's playing.  Also Numb, by Portishead.  It's perfect,
single or not.

> 3. Perfect Moby single that isn't (as in, song from an
> album that hasnt been released as a single, including
> trax from play that are not yet scheduled to be
> released...)

The Sky is Broken or Inside.  They're both really dramatic and pretty,
and the videos I imagine for them are really cool.  The songs are like
little movies.

> 4. same, non-moby

Water, by PJ Harvey.  It's a lilbit abrasive, but when she starts
singing "waaaaaater!" you have to sing along.  And that's my definition
of a perfect single :)  Ooh, also, Western Eyes by Portishead.  Again,
it's just perfect.

> 1. eh... mmm... i dont know, why do you force me into
> this!?!? ;) ah actually NOT GO (sorry im a little
> bored of this song) but i think the perfect Moby
> single would be....Run On. for now. sorry, maybe i'll
> get back to this later.

Ooh ya, Run On.  Good choice. :)

laura!

- --
Anytime I see something screech across a room and latch onto someone's
neck, and
the guy screams and tries to get it off, I have to laugh, because what
is that thing.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 17:34:51 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. (OT of music)

In a message dated 11/09/1999 1:56:42 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< MY views aren't practical for the world's population?  are you blind? or
 stupid?  can you not see that, besides the fact that people are eating
 themselves to death, the earth is being raped to make room for cows, and
other
 animal farming.  you can feed up to 21 times as many people with an acre of
 plants as you can with an acre of land where cows graze.  How is that
 impractical?  With all the starving people all over, as you were so wont to
 bring up, why can't we use that land to feed 21 times as many people?  do you
 really think they care whether they're eating vegetables or meat? >>

I know I promised, but damnit Laura, you're just begging for an argument
aren't you?  Yes it's lovely you have nice stats, I've read those two..  And
you're right, humans can survive without animal products, cept the fact that
we're OMNIVORES and we were created to eat both plants and animals.  You
state that you care about animals, but then you seperate us from the lion who
eats a zebra.  Why?  We're all animals right?  Do you think a lion goes, hmm
I shouldn't eat that zebra because 1~ it's a living creature and it deserves
the right to live, 2 ~ do you know how wasteful it is and how much better I
would be eating grain.  Please.  Yeah eating meat at this point in human
evolution is probably very very toxic considering that animals have high
levels of toxicity due to our lovely pollution.  But the rights of other
fellow animals?  Ever hear of Darwin?  Look him up.  We are what we are for a
reason.  We do what we do for a reason.  It's nice that you care about the
world and you want to save it.  But giving random stats, showing grotesque
pictures, and asking for drastic change is not the way, and hurts the cause.
Baby steps.  baby steps.  Get people to recycle cans, then they're paper, and
then if they're adventerous, try plastics.  Encourage those with a gardening
urge to have a composte (my grandmother did just for the fertiziler value,
before it was known to be eco-friendly.)  If electic cars became practical
for everyday life and could haul ass as fast as my car, then sure, I'd love
to save the gas money.  The cause is dandy, the method is stupid.  And I've
said enough and I'm very angry at you for dragging me back into this argument
cuz I'm stubborn and boistourious and have to speak my opinion.

Toodles
Dei

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 15:09:48 -0800
From: Laura <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) smoking (off the music topic)

> But cigarettes are endagering
> more lives than alcohol, so why aren't they illegal.  Because of the
> corporate powers that rule the world.

that is exactly what i said in one of my other messages.

> So drop it.  It's not changing.
> Making alcohol illegal just made it more popular and led to a rise in crime
> (do we have to go over the evils of Prohibition?). . . .  Alcohol and smoking
> will never be illegal. It's became a natural choice
> for all human beings to make.

i don't want alcohol to be outlawed. i don't want cigarettes to be outlawed.  i
want the rest of the drugs to be legalized.  and that's all i have to say about
that.

run laura run

- --
During the Middle Ages, probably one of the biggest mistakes was not putting on
your armor because you were 'just going down to the corner.'

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 15:20:35 -0800
From: Laura <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. (OT of music)

[e-mail] wrote:

>  And I've
> said enough and I'm very angry at you for dragging me back into this argument
> cuz I'm stubborn and boistourious and have to speak my opinion.

do you think my reasons for replying are any different than yours?  if you see
ignorance, you want to change it to knowledgeability don't you?  apparently you
do, or you wouldn't have responded, "correcting" me.  i'm the same way, but
because we believe different things, we are each other's bad guy.  but sincerely,
i am not going to respond anymore.  get in your last word, if you haven't.  sorry
for any arterial distress i may have caused you.

god gi good een.
laura zone

- --
Fear can sometimes be a useful emotion. For instance, let's say you're an
astronaught on the moon and you fear that your partner has been turned into
Dracula. The next time he goes out for the moon pieces, wham!, you just slam the
door behind him and blast off. He might call you on the radio and say he's not
Dracula, but you just say:  Think again, bat man.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 18:39:36 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: RE: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. off topic whatever

In a message dated 11/9/99 5:22:39 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< Also, do you know how many jobs would be lost and how our economy would
fall if the whole world turned vegan and we just freed all the animals
"animal liberation"

Clothing manafacturers, the meat industry, ranchers, cosmetics, and so many

other things, are just kicked out of our economy, it won't work. >>

Hello, getting defensive? They shouldn't be there anyway.
It is so much more efficient to eat lower on the food chain; economics
teaches us that the sellers respond to a change in demand. People will be
spending the same amount of money, except on things that do not include
animal products. Economic Darwinism: the company doesn't change, it doesn't
survive; they need to be responsive.
So sorry to be off topic, it was just so tough to resist!!!
- -Sarah

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 15:49:32 -0800 (PST)
From: morag doodikins <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (mobility) off topic.

does anyone remember that some chick created a whole
mailing list to talk about vegan/environmental issues.
i like to hear what other people think about this
stuff, but it's really fucking annoying recieving
multiple emails of two people's argument. just as all
the meat eaters are getting sick of hearing about
veganism, i am a vegan and am just as sick of this
debate. read some of the things moby writes. he says
he doesn't judge anyone on the decisions they choose
to make. yes, he has his convictions and we all have
our own. let it be.
*freyja*

- --- Chris Hand <[e-mail]> wrote:
> I already presented my practical solution.
>
> Eat animals
> Because in the food chain, we are on a higher level.
> You can't make people give up their tastes and
> preferences in food..it won't
> change heh, so there are other things that must be
> resolved first..
> As for human rights...
> no one ever talks about them..which is really kind
> of sad..if you are going
> to use your voice for something, save humans heh
> when looking for solutions to solve the world, the
> solution must be as easy
> and readily available as it is right now.
> Recycling is a bitch for me to do, maybe waste
> management should invent a
> system to where it sorts and recycles trash itself
> and stop relying on
> people to do it.  Electric cars are a stupid concept
> right now...we should
> just be looking for an alternate fuel to burn.  You
> want to clear land to
> plant stuff, I would rather have animals grazing on
> that land.  Also, do you
> know how many jobs would be lost and how our economy
> would fall if the whole
> world turned vegan and we just freed all the animals
> "animal liberation"
> Clothing manafacturers, the meat industry, ranchers,
> cosmetics, and so many
> other things, are just kicked out of our economy, it
> won't work.
> Practicality is what I'm looking for.  We do what we
> do to survive.  Bitch
> at animal testing labs if you want to talk about
> cruelty.  It really doesn't
> matter if I am lazy..because I am just an example of
> a normal person. We are
> too busy and have too many other problems to worry
> about all this extra
> "stuff".  So you have to find solutions that cater
> to the bulk of society
> and to the normal person.  Otherwise it won't work,
> that is just life.
> Chris
>
>
>
>
>
>

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 19:10:31 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. (OT of music)

In a message dated 11/09/1999 3:21:50 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< do you think my reasons for replying are any different than yours?  if you
see
 ignorance, you want to change it to knowledgeability don't you?  apparently
you
 do, or you wouldn't have responded, "correcting" me.  i'm the same way, but
 because we believe different things, we are each other's bad guy.  but
sincerely,
 i am not going to respond anymore.  get in your last word, if you haven't.
sorry
 for any arterial distress i may have caused you. >>

You're not my bad guy.  You have good points, but there's better ways to
acheive your goal.  You believe in what you preech and not hypocrite...  I
never meant to say that you were.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 18:54:39 -0600
From: "krwilson" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Animals.  Combustion. off topic whatever

> Recycling is a bitch for me to do, maybe waste management should invent a
> system to where it sorts and recycles trash itself and stop relying on
> people to do it.

Good point.  Maybe if we could put the responibility of everything on
someone else's shoulders, we can be lazy, disrespectful(to Mother Earth and
ourselves and every other living thing), and guilt-free since it's always
"Someone else's problem".  I like the way you avoid any responsibility.

> Electric cars are a stupid concept right now...we should
> just be looking for an alternate fuel to burn.

Yeah.  How 'bout human corpses?  Or maybe whale fat!  If people could get
any grants for research into Wind, hydro, and solar power- maybe Electric
cars would be a more attainable concept.  If the DEA were disbanded, and
drugs, prostitution, and gambling were all legalized- there would be a few
extra hundred billion dollars a year to spend on something more worthwhile
than a war on our own citizens.  Such as: alternate power sources that are
environmentally friendly, AIDs, cancer, MS, etc. research, hemp(the most
useful plant in the world which is "illegal" in many countries), Drug
education that isn't full of bias and propaganda, Recycling centers that are
easily accesable in EVERY town, buying up land in rainforests so they can't
be destroyed, and many, many, many others.

>You want to clear land to plant stuff, I would rather have animals grazing
on > that land.

Why don't you take a few minutes to read the liner notes for "Everything is
wrong"?  It gives ample reason to negate any concept of animals grazing as
being "beneficial".

> Also, do you know how many jobs would be lost and how our economy > would
fall if the whole world turned vegan and we just freed all the animals >
"animal liberation"

What a pity!  As before jobs would be much more plentiful if the DEA didn't
exist and drugs, prostitution, and gambling were legal.  Even if that idea
horrifies you, I have a more basic argument.  Animals have feelings.  They
have nerves and can feel pleasure and pain.  They have emotions, not as
complex as ours, but any two of the same kind of animal will have it's own
identifiable personality.  It may be easier to let things continue like
they're going, but the easy things in life are just easy, not fulfilling.
If the Nazis decided to keep killing Jews just because it kept alot of
Germans employed, I guess that would be ok in your book also?

> Clothing manafacturers, the meat industry, ranchers, cosmetics, and so
many
> other things, are just kicked out of our economy, it won't work.

Clothing manufacturers would love it if hemp were legal everywhere.  It is
excellent for clothing among many other things.  Leather is completely
unnecessary in this day and age.  Everything done with leather can be done
better and cheaper with something else.
     The meat industry disgusts me.  Read a book about the meat industry
written by someone other than the meat industry.  "Dead meat" is an
excellent albeit horrifying book that can't help but make you feel like a
shithead for eating meat.  I don't remember the author, but it should be
easy to find at Amazon.

     Ranchers, huh?  Yeah, that's a big percentage of jobs in America and
Europe.  How many ranchers do you know?  I've never met ONE.  Change is
necessary.  It is always better to change than suffer.  There are other jobs
that are much more humane.  If you like the outdoors, you can work for the
forest service.  If you like working with animals, you can work at a pet
shelter.

Absolutely no animals are needed for cosmetics.  There are way better
alternatives.  And we don't need to test on animals either.

> Practicality is what I'm looking for.

Maybe you're looking for the wrong thing.  Being able to look inside
yourself and see what you're doing wrong and make an effort to fix it is an
essential feature to have a happy life.  It takes effort, belief in
something, and taking action on the part of your beliefs to make a life
worthwhile.  You may disagree with this statement, but it's only because you
are unwilling to realize that there are other living beings out there that
are every bit as important and necessary as you.  In order to satisfy
yourself, you have to achieve a balance where you aren't hurting, but you
are helping.  I hope someday you will agree with me on this.

> We do what we do to survive.

This statement is patently false.  You and I and everyone one else living in
civilized places on the earth  are not subsistence living.  We don't live
day to day just trying to get enough food to survive.  That has become a
very small, but essential part of our lives.  It is our job to help people
who ARE in that situation by educating them on birth control, hygene, and
nutrition.  If they knew how much more food they could get out of the grain
we send them than through livestock production, they would be much better
off.  Refer to the part of the liner notes for "Everything is wrong"  about
the ratio of water used for tomatoes versus beef, or the part about grain
made into bread versus grain used for livestock.  It is very basic math and
the results are astounding.  There is no reason to waste so much on so very
little.


>  It really doesn't  matter if I am lazy..because I am just an example of a
normal > person.

There is no reason to think that there is such a thing as a "normal" person.
Everyone is different from everyone else in many different ways.  If you
have any respect for yourself, you will desire very badly to be much more
than a "normal" person who spends no effort on helping others.  Everyone
wants to think that they are special; different.  The difference between
animals and humans is that animals run mostly on instinct and have few
choices, whereas humans have many choices, and only a few basic instincts.
The thing that separates humans who are "people"  and humans who are
"animals"  is choices they make.  If you want to be no better than an
animal, even though you have been given so much more potential(as we all
have), then I am sorry.

> We are too busy and have too many other problems to worry about all this >
extra "stuff".  So you have to find solutions that cater to the bulk of
society
> and to the normal person.  Otherwise it won't work, that is just life.

 "All this extra 'stuff' " as you call it is actually the important thing.
Money, whether or not your girlfriend is cheating on you, politics, and
sports teams are the chaff.  Moral decisions, friends, beauty, charity,
compassion, and empathy are the real gold of life.  And nothing caters to
anyone.  Everyone works together, or we  achieve nothing.  Please consider
my words before discarding them out of hand as I once would have done.
Thanks.

MO

>

------------------------------

End of mobility-digest V3 #25
*****************************

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