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mobility-digest      Tuesday, September 28 1999      Volume 02 : Number 140



RE: (mobility) Chemical Bros. (NO MOBY)
Re: (mobility) values...
Re: (mobility) i have a question
Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...
RE: (mobility) Chemical Bros. (NO MOBY)
Re: (mobility) values...
Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...
(mobility) Chems at 9:30
Re: (mobility) values...
Re: (mobility) i have a question
Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...
Re: (mobility) Moby at Roxy
Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...
Re: (mobility) values...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:41:17 -0400
From: "Novotny, Joe" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (mobility) Chemical Bros. (NO MOBY)

The Chemicals said that they weren't too happy with the HFStival and that
they didn't really enjoy playing it, but that all in all it could have been
worse.  They genuinely seemed to enjoy the 9:30, though.  I think it was the
best concert I've seen all year long. I took some photos and I hope that
they turn out. It was so hard to take pictures since the lighting was so
bad, so I hope that I can at least use a copuole of photos for my web page.
Cheers!

Joe

- -----Original Message-----
From: Russell, Shera [mailto:[e-mail]]
Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 4:31 PM
To: '[e-mail]' <mailto:'[e-mail]'>
Subject: RE: (mobility) Chemical Bros. (NO MOBY)



Didn't catch the 9:30 show but saw them at the WHFestival this weekend.
They were excellent!!

- -----Original Message-----
From: Novotny, Joe [ mailto:[e-mail]
<mailto:[e-mail]> ]
Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 9:50 AM
To: '[e-mail]' <mailto:'[e-mail]'>
Subject: (mobility) Chemical Bros. (NO MOBY)


Just out of curiosity, were any of you at the 9:30 Club last night for the
absolutely mind-blowing set by the Chemical Brothers??? WOW...what a great
show!  They're on their way to St. Louis today, so strap on those dancing
shoes and go see them.  They were really, really brilliant.  Gotta
run...cheers!

Joe

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 15:47:08 -0500
From: Christopher Michael Bourke <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) values...

>>=me
>=DJ Pagan

<<snip... snip...>>

>>It doesn't mean that capitalism is in herently
>>evil.  It doesn't mean that the artist has sold
>>out.  It doesn't mean his company has screwed
>>him, and it doesn't mean the music industry is
>>a sham.  It's merely business as usual.
>
>I think Capitalism is inherently evil because it
>plays off of the normal greed in all of us.  That
>instinct for survival.  However, a person living
>in the system is not evil because he is forced to
>work in the system.
>

Ah, see how an on topic message can lead to a debate that is seemingly off
topic? This happened about six months ago and when another person and I
started a debate about it, many were confused, lost, pissed off etc....
FUCK THEM.  This is the point where the debate becomes relevent to the m/l;
however, since you designated it as your own opinions, and considering the
general attitude of the rest of the m/l over this, I'll let sleeping dogs
lie.

>>Are you telling me that instruments and
>>electronically produced sounds can convey
>>complex ideas?  Of course not.
>
>Yes they can.  Underworld is an example I cite
>most of all when this comes around.  All music
>can convey complex ideas... you just have to look
>for your own personal meaning (or non-meaning) in
>them.

What you are refering to is interpretation; subjective perspective.  A
random(though melodic) creation of notes and sounds CANNOT convey specific,
objective concepts.  For instance;  If I create an ambient track it can
affect one's emotions or moods, subjective things;  They can't convey that
I'm opposed to strip mining or some other issue;  only lyrics can do that.
The limitation of instrumental music is clear, it can only affect the heart,
not the mind.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 13:58:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Doogsidog <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) i have a question

im sorry but that is just plain absurd.
the likelihood of this actually being true is about a
million to one, IMHO.

- -adam

PS: if I, being a so-called "fan", happened to move to
a town where my alleged "techno god" once lived, i
think i would have thought of this a bit sooner.  that
is unless i moved to that town 10 years ago and didnt
become interested in such a musician until now.  in
that case, i think i would be completely obsessed with
finding out if i were right about my suspicions.
just a thought.
still very peculiar.
__________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:27:42 PDT
From: "jj fish" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...

And what's wrong with drinking occasionally?

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:29:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: DJ Pagan <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (mobility) Chemical Bros. (NO MOBY)

> From: Novotny, Joe
>
> Just out of curiosity, were any of you at the
> 9:30 Club last night for the absolutely
> mind-blowing set by the Chemical Brothers???

I wish I had clubs like that around here.
Anyway, I have seen the Chemical Brothers twice
in concert (once w/ Fatboy Slim!) and their sets
are just amazing.  If your booty ain't shaking,
you best quit the fakin'! ;)

=====
DJ Pagan
"Is it wrong that I sit in a dark
 closet and listen to Dead Cities?"
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:46:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: DJ Pagan <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) values...

- --- Christopher Michael Bourke
<[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> Ah, see how an on topic message can lead to a
> debate that is seemingly off topic? This
> happened about six months ago and when another
> person and I started a debate about it, many
> were confused, lost, pissed off etc....
> FUCK THEM.

Well put.  Why is it that just because something
appears on the mailing list, everyone must
approve of it, or it gets thrown off.  The topic
is relatively close to Moby (as close as the
out-of-hand t-shirt thing).

> however, since you designated it as your own
> opinions, and considering the general attitude
> of the rest of the m/l over this, I'll let
> sleeping dogs lie.

I say if that it's pertinent, and we can start
some genuine (not flaming) conversation on the
listserv, let's do it.  What dogs do you want to
sleep when it's so much more fun to play with
them? :)

> What you are refering to is interpretation;
> subjective perspective.  A random (though
> melodic) creation of notes and sounds CANNOT
> convey specific, objective concepts.

Too often humans rely on words to describe
something they believe.  We can create a visual
representation of something, advertisements do it
all the time, to convey a specific, objective
concept.  Why not an audible?

Here's and off-topic (off of the off-topic
discussion) thought.  Nothing really is
objective, everything is subject to whether we
believe it or not, no matter the scientific truth
of it.  Objective things seem to be what the
majority of people hold to be true, and the
others must accept.  Primary and secondary
characteristics if you know any Berkeley.

> The limitation of instrumental music is clear,
> it can only affect the heart, not the mind.

Taken out of context, this statement is wrong,
but I do see and accept your point about
instrumental music.  However, it can convey an
artist's personal thoughts about a subject, in
some cases.  Others, it does no such thing.

When I use Underworld as an example, the music
and the lyrics together can convey thoughts about
urban progress.  It does need the lyrics to make
it's point, BUT the music behind them emphasis,
and further defines that objective point in a
subjective manner.  If I am opposed to strip
mining, and make a song about this topic, the
sounds of smashing boulders and screaming people
would help emphasis the concept.  A more Moby
related example would be "The Blue Light of the
Underwater Sun".

Ball to your court. ;)

=====
DJ Pagan
"Is it wrong that I sit in a dark
 closet and listen to Dead Cities?"
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:50:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: DJ Pagan <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...

- --- jj fish <[e-mail]> wrote:
> And what's wrong with drinking occasionally?

Question: Are you purposely trying to start a
flame war?  I believe the comment was that Moby
admitted he drank every once in a while, even
though it's against conservative (and we know his
thoughts about this) Christain ethics.  I don't
think anyone said it was wrong.  However, I have
been wrong before.

I could use a Guinness right now, in fact. :)

=====
DJ Pagan
"Is it wrong that I sit in a dark
 closet and listen to Dead Cities?"
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:07:28 -0400
From: "Paul Vodra [Paradox]" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) Chems at 9:30

I was there!  Spent the whole time on the balcony stage-right side.
It was quite an excellent show.  I'm not into their music as much as
I am Orbital, Underworld, and Moby, but live they kicked major ass.
It's too bad those t-shirts were $25!  They were okay, but I didn't
think they were worth that damn much.

I was kind of surprised that everyone didn't stream out of the club
after the show.  They all kind of stood around and hung out.  As I
drove away I saw a massive crowd of people gathered right outside the
9:30 club door.  What was up with that?  Were they waiting to see Tom
& Ed?

Paul V.
psyched to see Afro-Celt Sound System at 9:30 tomorrow night!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 15:58:19 PDT
From: "jj fish" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) values...

>
> >>Are you telling me that instruments and
> >>electronically produced sounds can convey
> >>complex ideas?  Of course not.

I think the use of sampling is one of the greatest things to happen to
music.  Not only can you redefine and reinterpret instrumental themes, you
can also express abstract ideas or themes without blatantly singing it, but
by weaving it into the musical tapestry.

You can create thought by contrasting samples, themes, etc.

For instance, if I were to create an ambient track w/ Hitler talking on the
right side, Ghandhi quotes on the left track, that would be confusing and
interesting.  If not pretentious :]

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:08:46 -0700
From: kimbalina <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) i have a question

> hey, i moved to darien, ct, in 1987 and all i knew about the people who moved
> out of the house i moved into is that their name was hall and they went to
> one of the carolinas i think... now i find out that this techno god guy moby
> was born and raised in darien and his mom left here sometime in the late
> eighties... if anybody knows the street or adress that moby used to live at
> in darien, could you tell me cause i got a funny feeling i'm sleeping in his
> bedroom.
>
> Wow, for a MOBY fan, I would think that would be scary and cool.  Weird.  I
> would also think it would be kinda like living in someones underwear drawer.
> Think about it.  If you've lived and grown up some place, all your real
> memories are there.  Where you lost your virginity, where you were sick for the
> first time, where you played w/ your friends, where every thing important in
> your young life happened (mostly).  I know that I miss my old house so much,
> and I even dream about it a lot.  Thinking of other ppl living there is like
> picturing ppl living in my closet and wearing my clothes or ppl living in my
> kitchen, eathing my food.  It's so sad and personal for me.  I would be kinda
> freaked out to live in the house where someone I admired grew up.  Kinda
> freaky.  Hope you find out if it's the house! :-)

- --kimby

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:06:40 PDT
From: "jj fish" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...

I was half joking...

Who said it was against conservative and Christian ethics? Did Moby say
this? Did you? Just wondering, but as a quote Christian unquote
(I hate labels), I'd think that was kind of a hypocritical statement.

> > And what's wrong with drinking occasionally?
>
>Question: Are you purposely trying to start a
>flame war?  I believe the comment was that Moby
>admitted he drank every once in a while, even
>though it's against conservative (and we know his
>thoughts about this) Christain ethics.  I don't
>think anyone said it was wrong.  However, I have
>been wrong before.
>
>I could use a Guinness right now, in fact. :)
>
>=====
>DJ Pagan
>"Is it wrong that I sit in a dark
>  closet and listen to Dead Cities?"
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com
>

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 20:39:45 -0400
From: "Tikva Morowati" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Moby at Roxy

keith,
did you see moby perform at the bowery ballroom in late july?  cause it
DEFINATELY beat the irving shows!

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Keith Clancy <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, September 27, 1999 6:05 PM
Subject: (mobility) Moby at Roxy


> The Roxy is pretty nice but still not as intimate or cool as Irving
> Plaza where I saw 2 of the best Moby concerts there.  Actually the best
> Chemical Brothers and the most intense Underworld show (it was there US
> debut as Underworld mkII with a 3and 1/2 hour long show, fucking
> brillant).  Ok now i am rambling in other words the Roxy is ok.Bye Keith
>
> NP - Vapourspace - Gravatational Arch of 10
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:02:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: DJ Pagan <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) ANOTHER MOBY COMMERCIAL...

- --- jj fish <[e-mail]> wrote:
> Who said it was against conservative and
> Christian ethics? Did Moby say this? Did you?

There were two seperate statements.  Allow me to
clarify:

1) Moby said he had a beer every once in a while.
2) It is against conservative Christain ethics to
drink.

Someone else had stated the first statement.  I
stated the second statement.  I say this becaue I
grew up in a Methodist household, a denomination
that abhors drinking, smoking, and/or gambling.
Unless it's changed since I left the fold.

> Just wondering, but as a "Christian" (I hate
> labels), I'd think that was kind of a
> hypocritical statement.

No hypocrisy, I'm not Christian.

=====
DJ Pagan
"Is it wrong that I sit in a dark
 closet and listen to Dead Cities?"
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 21:07:57 -0500
From: "Jamie Baade" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) values...

I agree with almost everything said here...
MOBY makes some of the most beautiful music ever...we all agree on that
so for others to continue to see that and use it in commercials or on TV is
fine
let the world hear and understand what we have all known all along...that
MOBY's music is simply the greatest!!!!  and he is simply a genius!

love ya all
Jamie


- ----- Original Message -----
From: Danielle Logue <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 9:35 AM
Subject: RE: (mobility) values...


> Good point.  I think we need to get to the basic facts.  Moby
> makes amazing music.  His priority isn't being the background music for
> commercials and t.v. shows and the like.   People are just picking up on
> it and using it.  His music is just as wonderful as it always was,
> whether it's being commercialized or not.  That's why we're on this
> list, that's why we like him as a person. His drive is music, and not
> t.v.
> If his music was shitty, I could understand being upset but we
> have all agreed that Play is wonderful.  Others are picking up on it
> too. There's nothing wrong with that.  And I agree, the record company
> is probaby responsible for the commercials, not moby.
> As for personal beliefs and such, who cares? So moby drinks and
> you don't, or you meat and he doesn't.  We're all different.  I'm kinda
> glad he's so open about his beliefs.  I like to read his essays, whether
> I totally  agree with them or not.  It's nothing to get upset over (not
> that anyone really is), you tell me your opinion and I'll tell you mine,
> it's what makes this list flow.  Does anyone on the list remember the
> idea for WWMD bracelets?
> Reading over this, it sounds so crappy.  This was such a boring
> response.
> d
>
>
> >   First off, I'm sure
> > his record company is responsible for his tracks being used in
> > commercials,
> > aside from apossible royalty check or maybe some oral
> > authorization,I'm sure
> > he had no role in it whatsoever.  Moby's making a buck, but more
> > importantly
> > he's making music.
> > If his music didn't apeal to anyone, no record company would give him
> > a
> > contract, he woulnd't make any more music, he's flip burgers or use
> > his
> > degree for more constructive endeavors.  Just because your favorite
> > moby
> > song ends up on MTV(if you happen to hate MTV) or on a commercial
> > doesn't
> > mean anything beyond this:  the company needed a background song.  It
> > doesn't mean that capitalism is in herently evil.  It doesn't mean
> > that the
> > artist has sold out.  It doesn't mean his company has screwed him, and
> > it
> > doesn't mean the music industry is a sham.  It's merely business as
> > usual.
> > Just be happy that moby can make a living(which he has to do
> > regardless!)doing something he loves and that we can enjoy.
> >
> > I have noticed alot of people on this list doing this--projecting
> > their
> > values on moby(though this may not be the case in this instance, and I
> > appologize if it is, but moby is not a "straight edge")  People have
> > assumed
> > that he is "christian" or "vegan" or abstinate, or bi, or gay, or
> > whatever
> > they happen to be.  Everytime an instance comes up contridicting their
> > preconcieved notions, they always write something like, "I thought
> > moby
> > didn't drive cars because of pollution" or "I thought Moby didn't date
> > porn
> > stars because he's christian" or something equally mundane.
> >
> > First: I listen to moby for his music, not hsi politics or religion,
> > or
> > anything else.  I could be diametrically opposed to everything he
> > believes
> > and still enjoy his music.  Why?  Because his music has VERY LITTLE to
> > do
> > with his beliefs.  He may sample some gospel, or he may have the
> > occasional
> > lyrical part regarding how "everything is wrong"  but none of it
> > implies any
> > specific politics.  Only the occasional essay that he inserts into his
> > CD
> > covers are politically oriented.  90% of his tracks don't even have
> > any
> > lyrics.  Are you telling me that instruments and electronically
> > produced
> > sounds can convey complex ideas?  Of course not.  Moby's politics may
> > be a
> > topic of discussion and interest, but they certainly are extrinsic of
> > his
> > music.  Other than his essays and his personal writings or statements,
> > I
> > don't think anyone can or should draw conclusions regarding his
> > beliefs,
> > politics, or anything else.
> >
> > Moby writes and performs good music.  Try listening to it for what it
> > is,
> > good music.
> >
> > Chris Bourke.
> >
> >
> >
>

------------------------------

End of mobility-digest V2 #140
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