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mobility-digest          Sunday, June 6 1999          Volume 02 : Number 005



Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)
Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)
(mobility) Yeeeaaaaahhh!
(mobility) bodyrock remix!!!
Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)
Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)
Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)
(mobility) Job, overpopulation, & Kraftwerk
Re: (mobility) Job, overpopulation, & Kraftwerk
Re: (mobility) Job, overpopulation, & Kraftwerk
(mobility) Sagan, Moby, Earth, Problems, Solutions

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 08:34:36 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Aaron Conroy)
Subject: Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)

Getting to Zero Population growth is directly related to what stage of
development each country's economy is in.  Nations full of sustinance
farmers or nations that grow crops (agricultural) for export as a mainstay
for the economy always (throughtout history) have population growth rates
far in the positive because they either need large families for work or
because of lack of education and/or access to birth control.  If you look
at their population pyramids most of their people live in the "under 20"
group.  All nations have been like this at one time or another but many
nations around the world have evolved into more industrial and commercial
economies and with this comes increased education and less of a need or
want for many children, therefore a decreased population growth sometimes
reaching zero.  The problem with striving for Zero population growth is not
every nation can be industrial.  Someone needs to grow crops.  The major
obsticles are finding a way to get the agricultural nations to educate
thier people to a greater extent despite the fact most of the population is
destined to farm, give government funded access to birth control, and
somehow decrease the need for families to have many children.  The question
is: "How willing are these nation's governments to sink funds that they
probably don't have into trying to make their country a better member of
the world?"  Or do we have to do like AJ Brunstein says and have the 3rd
world nations taken over which probably wouldn't fly with the people in the
USA (veitnam made us gun shy).

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 14:36:45 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time)
From: Tim Beecher <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)

Uh, A.J. have you ever thought why people in third world
countries are in that position and countries like North
America and Japan aren't?

It's normally because these countries have aggressively
exploited third world countries so they have no resources
or finance left to educate themselves in sexual health and
population control, provide medical help and feed
themselves. They are under perpetual debt, paying back
interest on loans from industrialised countries that have
exploited them to get where they are today. They also don't
have much choice where they live either. It's not like you
can get millions of people to just uproot themselves and
get on a few airplanes and place themselves in the Garden
of Eden.

So why hasn't Sam Kenison taken them to where the food is?
Yeah, he is a fucking idiot!

TMB


On Mon, 07 Jun 1999 16:26:10 +0900 AJ Brustein
<[e-mail]> wrote:

> There don't seem to have a problem with zero population growth over here in
> Japan. In fact, it is negative I think. They are incouraging people to have
> babies. And it is not exactly 3rd world here where they are running out of
> resources. And as far as over population for the rest of the world - that
> isn't exactly a problem for North America either. Most if not all over
> population is in the 3rd world countries, not places where anyone on this list
> lives. I'm sure I will sound like a dick, but, it's my opinion that these
> countries should be taken over and laws should be put on having children. I
> don't know what purpose these people are serving to the good of the planet
> except keeping a few over the hill TV personalities with jobs fund raising.
> Overpopulation in a place that can't even handle half of the current
> population makes little sense to me. Sam Kenison may have been a drug selling
> idiot, but he was funny and smart sometimes. To these people he said:
> "You live in a fucking desert! Get your shit, we'll make one trip  and we'll
> take you to where the food is! We have Deserts in America, we're just not
> stupid enough to live in them; Assholes!" (or something like that).
>
> Anyway, as if anyone cared, I saw Bodyrock listed on eBay, so I guess it is
> coming out soon right? No one answered my question last time. Later.
> AJ
>

- ----------------------
Tim Beecher
Cranfield University
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 07:17:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: the happi monchichi <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) Yeeeaaaaahhh!

Hey! thanks to everyone who has or will respond to thr
essays. It has been reeeaaally cool to hear a little
of what all you fine people think about. Thanks Xaq
for hitting on something that people actually wanted
to talk about(i'll go get "cosmos" after work
today-the book). I won't say much on the population
growth issue except that i agree it is a HUGE problem.
and that zero populaion growth will never happen. see,
i may be deluded, but i really think(or hope)that we
will have advanced enough to find other places to
live. the ocean,the moon, mars..whatever. i know it
sounds silly!
and i don't know how much of the earth the way it
looks now will be left...but i hope it's possible.

also xaq. i don't "shed a tear" everytime i drive my
car. but i do carpool whenever possible, and in town i
walk when it's feasable. in my town, and the
surrounding area, recycling is VERY important. we are
supplied with bins and a seperate truck comes by and
picks it up. beyond that i(and my family and any
friends who will listen)recycle everything that the
truck won't take ourselves. i use borax to clean
basically everything because it's less harmful
enviromentally. i buy products that are made from
recycled material,or that can be recycled. i could
list 50 other things i do, but the point is that i
think these things DO help. and the more people that
do them, the more it helps. there certainly all easier
than asking people not to have kids.

lastly, i totally agree with you about voting. you
said "how can you vote when you know nothing about the
people involved, or even the issues that they stand
behind?" that's very important. voting for the sake of
voting may be just as bad as not voting. so again, i
agree, get educated!

now back to your regularly scheduled MOBY!
i really think the extended version on Run On is
better. especially the strings at the end. and does
ANYBODY know if theres really a 9:03 version of memory
gospel? did i miss the answer to that question?

plur-chrisitan

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 07:41:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Simpson <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) bodyrock remix!!!

hey kids, last nite on the elctro circus, dave the
wave played a remix of bodyrock!!!!1

is actually sounds a lot like the original, jsut sort
of with a different beat and stuff.  it kind of starts
with the guitar looped, and im like, now what rock
song has the remixer taken and added beats to, i know
ive heard this before.....
and when the spponie gee sample came on, holy shit
this is moby!!!!1

since it sounds a lot like the original, id say it was
remixed by Moby himself. but then again, considering
it sounds nothing like his earlier stuff, especially
his earlier remixes, who knows?

i dont know who did the remix obviously. see, the
elctro circus was supposed to go from 10pm to 6am,
this being its 2nd anniversary of being on 104, and
they were supposed to have a guest set by PAUL
OAKENFOLD. but they had this ROCKFEST special on, and
the show started after midnight, and OAKEY for some
reason couldnt do his set. so hell do it next week i
guess.
the bodyrockremix was the first thing he played (dave
the wave that is.) he played some interesting stuff,
like a jungle remix of beasties "Negotiation limerick
file." and he did play til 6am, but i fell asleep and
woke up at 5:15am.

ohnonotthepolitical/relijusessaysagain!NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....................

byesies!!

===
"MTV!? I HATE THE FRICKIN MTV!!!"-Mafia guy on S&O
SEND EMAIL TO MTV TELLING THEM TO PUT SIFL AND OLLY BACK ON!
ITS THE BEST SHOW ON TELEVISION AND MTV ISNT SHOWING IT!
[e-mail]
>>>>>>>>>>PAUL<<<<<<<<<<
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 08 Jun 1999 02:46:50 +0900
From: AJ Brustein <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)

Hey Tim, I guess you are gone and can't reply, but the reason that Sam Kenison
hasn't taken them to where the food is, is well, the simple fact that he has
been dead for a bit.
Anyway, here I go sounding like a dick again, but tell me, what purpose these
3rd world countries like Rwanda or whatever actually serve? I don't want to
hear human rights or any other crap, seriously, who are they helping, or are
they just a strain as I see them? I hope someone tells me I am wrong and
actually proves it. I hope I am.
Anyway, obviously no one is going to tell the date for Body Rock, so forget
Mobility as we continue to talk about something of little relevance as usual.
By the way, maybe someone could also tell me why everyone spells my name
"Brunstein" and pronounces it like that too? What the hell is the deal with
that? Anyway.
AJ


Tim Beecher wrote:
>
> Uh, A.J. have you ever thought why people in third world
> countries are in that position and countries like North
> America and Japan aren't?
>
> It's normally because these countries have aggressively
> exploited third world countries so they have no resources
> or finance left to educate themselves in sexual health and
> population control, provide medical help and feed
> themselves. They are under perpetual debt, paying back
> interest on loans from industrialised countries that have
> exploited them to get where they are today. They also don't
> have much choice where they live either. It's not like you
> can get millions of people to just uproot themselves and
> get on a few airplanes and place themselves in the Garden
> of Eden.
>
> So why hasn't Sam Kenison taken them to where the food is?
> Yeah, he is a fucking idiot!
>
> TMB

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 12:48:16 -0500
From: "Daniel Orion Davis" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)

> Hey Tim, I guess you are gone and can't reply, but the reason that Sam
Kenison
> hasn't taken them to where the food is, is well, the simple fact that he
has
> been dead for a bit.
> Anyway, here I go sounding like a dick again, but tell me, what purpose
these
> 3rd world countries like Rwanda or whatever actually serve? I don't want
to
> hear human rights or any other crap, seriously, who are they helping, or
are
> they just a strain as I see them? I hope someone tells me I am wrong and
> actually proves it. I hope I am.

What purpose they serve?  Purpose for whom?  Do you actually believe that
people/nations have to serve some purpose?  So if Rwanda doesn't contribute
to the world economy sufficiently, they should be conquered and exploited?
Let me guess...you'll also in favor of putting the elderly to sleep when
they retire?  Before you talk about "human rights or any other crap" again,
why dont you spend a few years in a country without human rights, then see
how you feel about them.  Human rights are not limited to the rich or the
powerful.

Buckoe

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 11:03:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: the happi monchichi <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) PLAY:THE ESSAYS (a response)

first, i agree with what buckoe just said. second, if
basic human rights don't exist for ALL human beings,
then what is the point. i'm no better than anyone
living in Rwanda. just different. the would'nt
understand my existance the same as i would
undoubtably DIE if i where transplanted to there
country.

plur-christian
- --- AJ Brustein <[e-mail]> wrote:
> Hey Tim, I guess you are gone and can't reply, but
> the reason that Sam Kenison
> hasn't taken them to where the food is, is well, the
> simple fact that he has
> been dead for a bit.
> Anyway, here I go sounding like a dick again, but
> tell me, what purpose these
> 3rd world countries like Rwanda or whatever actually
> serve? I don't want to
> hear human rights or any other crap
_________________________________________________________
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 06 Jun 1999 11:53:27 PDT
From: A.M. <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) Job, overpopulation, & Kraftwerk

>From: John Turpin <[e-mail]>

>Actually, the Bible itself asks a lot of questions like this: Lamentations,
>Job, a lot of the Psalms... A perfectly natural reaction that humans have
>when s*** happens.

For me, Job is one of the most interesting characters in the Bible.  The
evil of the world continually tried to break him of his devotion to God but
he refused to be swayed by it.

>From: theShackofXaq <[e-mail]>

>there is a terrible
>trend in america today where education is looked down upon as being
>"stupid," if you can believe that!

Do you mean that people often look down upon those few who question the
world around them?  If that's your meaning, I absolutely agree.

>ps. watch and more importantly READ carl sagan's "cosmos." if you do, i
>assure you it will change your life and your outlook on it. he, in my very
>limited opinion, was the most brilliant, thoughtfull, and compassionate
>man of our time.

Agreed.  He presents the material in a very non-pretentious, non-threatening
way which turns a lot of people on to new ideas.  And the music for his
films are cool too!  Brian Eno, etc.

>You're right that zero-population growth is wishful thinking...however
>over-population IS the biggest problem facing our society...Sound like an
>exaggeration?  Well try to think of a social problem that doesn't stem from
>and is not worsened by overpopulation.

I think the situation will get to the point where very extreme measures will
have to be taken which will make many people uncomfortable.  I've seen the
most f***ed up people have kids.  I wish people could be intelligent enough
to know if they should reproduce or not.  In fact, I'd venture to say that
the best thing we can do for the planet is to severely reduce the
population.  When you take your little bag of aluminum cans to be recycled,
it doesn't do much.  'Recycle' is a grossly overstated word. Many (ignorant)
people actually think that's all it takes!

>From: AJ Brustein <[e-mail]>

>There don't seem to have a problem with zero population growth over here in
>Japan. In fact, it is negative I think. They are incouraging people to have
>babies.

Yes, I've heard there's a negative growth trend in Japan.  Interesting, yes?
  These days, young japanese couples are career minded and, on average,
having one child at most.  The government is actually trying to think of
incentives for people to have more babies.  The largest segment of the
population in Japan is old people. Not enough babies, too many old people.

>it's my opinion that these
>countries should be taken over and laws should be put on having children. I
>don't know what purpose these people are serving to the good of the planet

Agreed.  One child per family, worldwide, until the situation is under
control.  We could drastically reduce large-scale poverty & overpopulation
in two generations if we implemented this.

Welcome to the list...
>Hans Lauring <[e-mail]>

>if it wasn't
>because I heard Kraftwerk that same summer, this would have been the years
>best concert.

You saw Kraftwerk live?  I'm very envious.  How were they?  Old?!

Andrew


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 12:12:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: the happi monchichi <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Job, overpopulation, & Kraftwerk

 When you take your little bag of
> aluminum cans to be recycled,
> it doesn't do much.  'Recycle' is a grossly
> overstated word. Many (ignorant)
> people actually think that's all it takes!

It's not "all it takes". It's not even a very good
start. But it helps, and it's easy to do. And that it
what most people in this fast food society want. EASY!
so while i agree that it's not much. it still needs to
be done by everyone. ALL THE TIME!!
otherwise, if we keep throwing EVERYTHING away, and
dumping an endless list of waist products into our
drinking water, and keep allowing gross industrial
polluters to continue to kill off our ozone and
destroy the air we breath(along with ALL automobile
drivers-myself included)..there will be no enviroment
left for ANYONE to be born into. so it's a rather
circular problem is'nt it? but even if every person
alive stopped having children, our everyday way of
life would still be destroying the planet.
_________________________________________________________
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 12:12:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: the happi monchichi <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Job, overpopulation, & Kraftwerk

 When you take your little bag of
> aluminum cans to be recycled,
> it doesn't do much.  'Recycle' is a grossly
> overstated word. Many (ignorant)
> people actually think that's all it takes!

It's not "all it takes". It's not even a very good
start. But it helps, and it's easy to do. And that it
what most people in this fast food society want. EASY!
so while i agree that it's not much. it still needs to
be done by everyone. ALL THE TIME!!
otherwise, if we keep throwing EVERYTHING away, and
dumping an endless list of waist products into our
drinking water, and keep allowing gross industrial
polluters to continue to kill off our ozone and
destroy the air we breath(along with ALL automobile
drivers-myself included)..there will be no enviroment
left for ANYONE to be born into. so it's a rather
circular problem is'nt it? but even if every person
alive stopped having children, our everyday way of
life would still be destroying the planet.
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 15:56:41 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: (mobility) Sagan, Moby, Earth, Problems, Solutions

I think Memory Gospel time thing is an error only. I asked this question
about a month ago and no reply.

I would also like to recommend "Pale Blue Dot" and "BIllions and Billions" by
Carl Sagan.
"Billions and Billions" goes into GREAT DEPTH on a great many topics and
solutions to overpopulation, greenhouse effect, and ozone depletion. I'm sure
Moby and Carl would have had some great conversations if they could have met.
It is a great loss to humanity that Carl Sagan is no longer with us.

If you are concerned about the environment, Carl recommends (to drivers) only
buying automobiles that use gas efficiently (30+ mpg) to force automakers to
invent new vehicles that use gas more efficiently. It is certainly within OUR
(the world) technology to solve a great many problems with the Earth (like 80
MPG autos!) and/or limit problems that we are creating for ourselves and our
children.

I wish the Earth was a better place to live.

BUT remember that the human race has created beautiful things like music &
graced us with MOBY's wonderful music.

- - Jayson

------------------------------

End of mobility-digest V2 #5
****************************

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