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mobility-digest        Wednesday, May 13 1998        Volume 01 : Number 159



(mobility) X-Sender: [e-mail]
Re: (mobility) mobility t-shirts
Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?
Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?
Re: (mobility) truth thru christianity
Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?
Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?
Re: (mobility) mobility t-shirts
Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?
RE: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?
Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 09:33:15 +0000
From: Victor Magnuson <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) X-Sender: [e-mail]

>which do you prefer? moby's instrumentals or his songs with lyrcial
>accompaniment?

i'd have to say instrumentals.  i think some of his best songs are of that
type: hymn, alone, dead sun, etc.  nonetheless, all of his songs rule and
it wouldn't be moby if he didn't try different stuff.

i wish he would print his lyrics, especially on AR.

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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 08:19:45 +0000
From: Your Name <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) mobility t-shirts

SORRY ABOUT MY CLOCK!!!

i've been needing a new battery for some time but haven't had the time
or money to change it

maybe today as i have the day off and maybe 20 dollars!!!


i had an idea
maybe corny but it would have like the golden arches for macdonald's as
this m design with little musical balls
at the ends as if it were sixteenth notes
and below that have *obility*
(over 200 served)

nah

aw well

and oh

> L,P&H,
>
> TiM B.
and dagnabbit tim!!!!!!!
how bout just a lil lovin anarchy!!!!!!?

yeah brothers and sisters

BTW i finnally got (uk version) end of everything (voodoo child)
from my trade with Jaden-X
and i think it is the moby cd i've always wanted from him.........
deep clean beautiful


clay

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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 10:11:15 PDT
From: "Robert Traylor" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

>no country can feel smug and throw stones at others. Even
>anarchists take the rights of others who want to live
>in peace. However, that doesn't mean that God doesn't

The rest of this sounded good, and I agree, but peace and anarchy are
not opposites.  Anarchy, in its original form, gave everyone the right
to do anything that made them happy, provided that it did not infringe
on anyone else's right to the same.  Anyone who did so was no longer
regarded as having that right.  Of course, in reality, any attempt at
such a society would result in social groups that emulate another social
system (capitalism, communism, religion, totalitarianism) and would
fight, disregarding each other's rights until one group took over and
enforced its will on everyone through the threat of violence.
 . . .
wait . . .
didn't I just describe how all human "civilizations" up to this point
have developed?

Bob
"take your hatred out on me . . ."
Marilyn Manson -- "Tourniquet"

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 15:36:57 EDT
From: Chilidiba9 <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

READ THE BIBLE.....ONE MUST NOT IGNORE ANYTHING FROM THE BIBLE...THE BIBLE IS
THE BASIS OF TRUTH AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH ONE THING, YOU ARE NOT A
CHRISTIAN....IF YOU TAKE SERIOUSLY THE NEW TESTAMENT BUT NOT THE OLD
TESTAMENT, YOU ARE NOT A TRUE CHRISTIAN...IT IS BASIC COMMON SENSE...I HATE
GETTING INTO RELIGIOUS DISCUSSIONS BECAUSE IT IS SO BROAD AND IS SO OPEN TO SO
MANY PEOPLE'S OPINIONS AND BELIEFS...THIS IS MINE..LOVE..ELIE

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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 14:36:19 +0000
From: Your Name <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) truth thru christianity

> .I HATE
> GETTING INTO RELIGIOUS DISCUSSIONS BECAUSE IT IS SO BROAD AND IS SO OPEN TO SO
> MANY PEOPLE'S OPINIONS AND BELIEFS...THIS IS MINE..LOVE..ELIE

yes kinda like opinions and notions of what is the truth>>>>>>
but if the book of revelations is the truth
then it's a truth that blows
cause what's the point?


i will always resist the notion that we must destroy what was created
here on earth>>>>>>>>>>>
i'm not certain that it's correct for any entity to destroy a house
just because he created it
if there are children in that house>>>>>>>>>>>>

that is MY truth sweetie


clay

ps
i guess you answered the question about moby being a true christian
then...
because well.....
actions speak louder than words
and moby is pretty active>

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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 18:49:35 -0700
From: "Michaela Gerstner" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

didn't we have this discussion a long time ago?  i remember ppl getting
pissed about this one.
Plovious
- -----Original Message-----
From: Your Name <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Tuesday, May 12, 1998 12:30 AM
Subject: Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?


>> I'm not particularly holy and spiritual myself, but if Moby
>> believes in God and 'basic Christianity' then you can't
>> really be selective about what you think feels right for
>> you. Isn't the wisdom of God supposed to tell you
>> what's right for you? Surely, if you claim to believe in
>> something like God and Christianity there has to be
>> boundaries - like murder (though an extreme example)has
>> always been wrong since time began.
>
>1) we are all spiritual in some way though maybe at various points in
>our realization.........we sometimes think we are more or less than
>others.
>2) believing in one thing does not always mean you can't also believe
>in another.......you can believe it is wrong to kill and also believe
>one must kill that which randomly or unjustly kills others.
>even the bible preaches eye for an i
>as well as turning one's cheek>
>it also suggests that god must destroy the earth to destroy the
>evil within it.>>>>>>>
>
>this is where me and christianity part ways as i believe this only
>fuels the fire of every KIND of evil from the right wing
>nuts who wanna clean up america from all it's cretin scum to those who
>figure shit
>we all gon die anyway
>why not create some mad sick chaos and just get away wit it while we
>can>>>>>>>
>
>i believe moby's take on christianity must be very
>multi-dimensional>>>>>>
>personally
>i
>(like the rest of us here) would love to hear his current observations
>and views on all this but i think he's wise to go about
>doing what he does best
>which is  make                       music
>
>it's like this:::::::
>
>you either know or you don't know
>and those of us who come into the world questioning the basic rules and
>regulations and codes
>of conduct
>morality
>right
>wrong .........well.............
>
>maybe we''ll never find it
>but just listening to some of this stuff the world has to offer
>certainly gets the mind to thinking that listening to
>foreigner
>or boston or whatever doesn't
>
>i wanna take you home tonight
>i wanna take you home tonight
>i wanna take you home tonight
>
>
>
>
>well blah blah blah
>
>does anybody believe moby quietly checks this list out
>on occasion?
>
>
>i would hope so..........
>
>maybe we can get a guest appearance from him exclusively
>in the form of a cool e-mail
>or something....
>one day?
>
>
>oh well
>sleep tight my fellow critters
>
>
>clay
>evolution2000
>
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>To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to [e-mail]
>with the line "unsubscribe mobility" in the body.


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 23:04:05 -0400
From: Ryu <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

i love this topic!  keep it going!

At 03:36 PM 5/12/98 EDT, you wrote:
>READ THE BIBLE.....ONE MUST NOT IGNORE ANYTHING FROM THE BIBLE...THE BIBLE IS
>THE BASIS OF TRUTH AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH ONE THING, YOU ARE NOT A
>CHRISTIAN....

i'm fairly certain that truth, like everything else, is relative.
meaning, what you consider the ultimate truth may not be what
an amish person would.  i don't think it's fair to say that the
bible is the basis of truth when it can be interpreted so many different
ways...and has.  the reason i'm unwilling to put all my faith in the bible
is because it was written by imperfect men, and translated many many times
by many many people with many many alterior motives in mind.

>IF YOU TAKE SERIOUSLY THE NEW TESTAMENT BUT NOT THE OLD
>TESTAMENT, YOU ARE NOT A TRUE CHRISTIAN...IT IS BASIC COMMON SENSE...

i suppose my sense isn't common, and perhaps that's what makes me happiest.
why should i have to have the same sense as the majority?
to me, that is NONsense.
but, i believe (i use the word "believe" because i don't think it's fair to
declare facts
on issues dealing with faith) that christ 'reset' alot of what was written
in the old
testament.  i believe that was one of his main purposes for being put here,
to get
the people to live differently, and better in the eyes of god.  so i think
it's entirely
possible to have a strong faith in the new testament, and little in the old.


thanks,
ryu

################################
     "POWER MADE FLESH"
   The new CD from Ryu now
  available on Shoryuken! Records.
  Go to Ryu's Dojo for more info:
http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/jwz109
################################
        Ryu
 1013 S. Allen St., Apt. 507
  State College, PA 16801
        USA
[phone]   [e-mail]
################################


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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 10:09:45 +0100 (British Summer Time)
From: Tim Beecher <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) mobility t-shirts

how bout just a lil lovin anarchy!!!!!!?

yeah brothers and sisters

Well, why not!?

As for using McDonald's 'M' on these t-shirts.... well it
might be a bit offensive to Moby and a few others. I mean
they're not the most ethical, environmentally friendly,
veggie, capitalist company are they? Just a thought, or
maybe I'm being too sensitive? Men - get in touch with your
feelings....

Love, peace, harmony and a touch of anarchy,

TiM B.

- ----------------------
Tim Beecher
Cranfield University
[e-mail]


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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 15:14:22 +0100 (British Summer Time)
From: Tim Beecher <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

Why should people get pissed off talking about life and the
world we live in? I mean as long as we can respect each
others opinions/points of view there's no need to let anger
and hate build up. We can disagree without having to
throw death threats at each other (not that it's got to
that stage or anything!)! Surely by communicating and
discussing things, we learn from each other and 'broaden
our horizons'?

Anarchy, in its original form, gave everyone the right
to do anything that made them happy, provided that it did not infringe
on anyone else's right to the same.  Anyone who did so was no longer
regarded as having that right.  Of course, in reality, any attempt at
such a society would result in social groups that emulate another social
system (capitalism, communism, religion, totalitarianism) and would

Yeah, I agree, I don't think the concept of anarchy and
it's origins was opposite to peace, but it's like communism
started off with good intentions - everybody should be
equal and work together as a community - nice idea.
However, as we all know, those who implement this idea
force it on the people and take away their free will and
we've got totalitarian regimes.

the reason i'm unwilling to put all my faith in the bible
is because it was written by imperfect men, and translated many many times

From what I understand about my limited investigation of
religions, is the Bible was written by imperfect man, but
inspired by God. Though it was written by different people
over the centuries it still all fits together quite well -
which is pretty amazing in itself. A lot of people appeared
to get 'revelations' that coincided, even though they were
quite far apart geographically. Though translated many
times, the basic message stays the same, which is more
important than spotting irregular details. I think the
interactions with a living God today, with the Bible as a
guide, is possibly more important than taking everything in
the Bible literally and living like they did several
millennia ago! Jesus seemed pretty radical for his
time and all of what he was about seems timeless to me.
Muslims, on the other hand, place more importance on the
Qur'an then a 'living relationship' with God and everything
it says they must obey or face hell.

 i believe (i use the word "believe" because i don't think it's fair to
declare facts
on issues dealing with faith)

- -good point!

that christ 'reset' alot of what was written
in the old
testament.  i believe that was one of his main purposes for being put here,
to get
the people to live differently, and better in the eyes of god.  so i think
it's entirely
possible to have a strong faith in the new testament, and little in the old.

I think I can relate to that in my own search for truth and
the meaning of life. I've had this discussion about
Judaeo-Christianity with many people recently. It was felt
that in the old testament God had to choose a race of
people to reveal Himself and spread the message about where
we've all come from and what this life is all about, etc.
He chose the Jews (I suppose he could've chosen anybody -
maybe it was a random choice, like in some scientific
experiment!?). I suppose the rigid laws and rules in the
old testament were there, like breaking in a horse, to get
rid of people's dark 'pagan ways'. Then Christ came to
create a new covenant, reinforce some old ones and clear up
religious dogma, hypocrisy and bigotry that had developed
and tell them to spread the word about God's love, wisdom
..... and not vengeance and fear.

i guess you answered the question about moby being a true christian
then...
because well.....
actions speak louder than words

Nice one!

L,P,H (& A, to keep Clay happy) brothers and sisters,

TiM B.











- ----------------------
Tim Beecher
Cranfield University
[e-mail]


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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 12:14:18 -0400
From: Steve Giles <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

>Then Christ came to
>create a new covenant, reinforce some old ones and clear up
>religious dogma, hypocrisy and bigotry that had developed
>and tell them to spread the word about God's love, wisdom
>..... and not vengeance and fear.
>
>i guess you answered the question about moby being a true christian
>then...
>because well.....
>actions speak louder than words

    Bringing this back to Moby, The first above paragraph states
what I believe to be the main goal of Christ: love & wisdom. Do unto
others... When someone tells me that gays are bad, should not be allowed
to marry, should not be allowed to join the general population because
they are abnormal....that's not compassion or love. That's judgement and
fear. (although the fear will not be readily admitted) When someone
tells me that condoms should not be distributed at schools because it
promotes casual sex, I understand. But after I see facts that show that
teenage sex is not greater where condoms are distibuted, simply the
same, then I think, why shouldn't we make these available? If this sex
is already occuring at least it can be safe with a little help. The way
to fight this problem is through encouragement of abstinence, not
discouragement against sex. That is typical SoCal baptist
thick-headedness that keeps the problem in existence. Heavy handed
tactics have not succeeded and will not, nor are they the method of
Christ. Education, and strong family relations may help a parent teach
their child abstinence.
    This is why I disagree that to be Christian you have to follow
the bible's rules to the letter. With conflicting statements in the
bible, the infinitely-sided interpretation, anyone who argues the bible
is the way and the only way can effectively play God by interpreting the
bible to suit his needs. (such as attempting to enforce a social agenda,
like the above stated) when in fact more love (re: gay issue) & wisdom
(re:condom issue) would be more effective. Without cooperation, they
accomplish little for themselves. YOU ARE WRONG!!! STOP THAT!!! Will
change nobody's mind about the view being expressed.
    So yes, Moby is a Christian, and a damn fine one. And I love his
essays.
I am agnostic, if you couldn't tell.
    -Steve Giles

Then Christ came to
create a NEW covenant, reinforce SOME OLD ONES and clear up
religious DOGMA, HYPOCRISY and BIGOTRY that had developed
and tell them to spread the word about God's love, wisdom
.... and not vengeance and fear.


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Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 12:34:48 -0400
From: Ryu <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Is Moby a Christian?

>Anarchy, in its original form, gave everyone the right
>to do anything that made them happy, provided that it did not infringe
>on anyone else's right to the same.

this is something i'd like to know more about...the history of the word
"anarchy".  is it a relatively new (last 200 years) concept?
my understanding of what anarchy means is that people can do whatever
they choose to do...EVEN IF it infringes on others rights.  it's a complete
and total free-for-all without moral, political, or personal obligations.
please reply to me privately if you don't want to keep this topic on this
list, it's just reall interesting to me....

>>From what I understand about my limited investigation of
>religions, is the Bible was written by imperfect man, but
>inspired by God.

yes, that is what it says IN THE BIBLE.  it says that it was written
by those inspired by god.  but remember...david koresh was inspired
by god.  jim jones was inspired by god.  adolf hitler was inspired by god
etc etc etc.  it is easy to
be inspired by god and to use that inspiration to do what you want with it.
the words in the bible have been used for personal greed too often to
be considered omnipotent.  i think the bible is an excellant guide to understand
humanity, creation, and to live a healthy and productive life, but should not
be considered a book of supreme fact.

this list is jumpin'!  i love it!!!!

happy,
ryu

################################
     "POWER MADE FLESH"
   The new CD from Ryu now
  available on Shoryuken! Records.
  Go to Ryu's Dojo for more info:
http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/jwz109
################################
        Ryu
 1013 S. Allen St., Apt. 507
  State College, PA 16801
        USA
[phone]   [e-mail]
################################


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End of mobility-digest V1 #159
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