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hist_text-digest      Wednesday, December 5 2001      Volume 01 : Number 897



In this issue:

-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt
-áááááá MtMan-List: Roaches
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Roaches
-áááááá MtMan-List: "Metis" ???
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls
-áááááá MtMan-List: Re Hunting Shirt Sewing
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Roaches
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt
-áááááá MtMan-List: Midwest Rendezvous web page
-áááááá MtMan-List: Kid's website: Exploration, the Fur Trade, & HBC
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from
-áááááá MtMan-List: Blanket Capotes
-áááááá MtMan-List:pigments

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Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2001 19:28:44 -0800
From: "rtlahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Clint Garrett" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2001 10:28 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls


>
> capt.,
>     i must correct you about BAKER'S video;

Clint,

You can sure try but at my age I don't correct too easy. <G> Well I do if
I'm wrong but this time I don't think so. If you watch the video again you
will see him mixing in some powder (not liquid dye) in to the linseed oil.
It's been a couple months since I watched the video but as I recall the
piece of linen he used had been dyed with walnut hulls prior to the painting
and I think he mentions that but perhaps not. In any case it's pretty hard
to mix a water dye like Walnut hull dye with an oil.

> the waxed canvas had to be used as it was most likely
> cheaper than beeswax; as for documentation as you said
> it may be difficult to find.

Well let's start with wax. What kind other than bee's wax was there? I
believe paraffin is a petroleum based wax and the period is a bit before
petroleum.

  but i'm sure some
> eastern pioneers waxed ponchos for rain as the east
> varies about 40-75% moisture.

And how can you be sure? Do you have some documentation or are you just
speculating because of your aversion to getting wet? Different times,
different standards of comfort and what is tolerable. That's a dangerous
mistake to make, assuming that because your common sense says to do it,
 you would do it today) that it was done then. Common knowledge back then
said blood letting was a good and sovereign treatment for most  everything.
Do we do it today? They thought different than we do.

 and all mountain men
> came from an eastern heritage for the most part.
> somebody had to wax a cloth since they moved so
> regularly in trapping;

And just where are they going to get wax in the Rockies? Remeber that the
european honey bee is where bee's wax comes from, it's not native to North
America and pretty much came west with civilization. And how many accounts
have you read of the Mt. Men treating their canvas shelters (if they had
any) with wax of any kind?

 fronzen and wet canvas is no
> fun. i know i hear those quote about they all slept
> under deadfalls, yet in their eastern homelands they
> would be vary wet; plus the damp gear.

Yup, that's the way it really was.


YMOS
Capt. Lahti'



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Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2001 19:43:15 -0800
From: "rtlahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt

Hawk,

Got back tonight empty handed and pooped. Not empty handed for not trying.
This morning I climbed a small mountain and circled around a big buck and a
couple does feeding in the middle of a 200 acre wheat stubble field to get
down wind and above. I got to where I needed to be, lost faith that I had
actually done it and that they would still be there and one doe spotted me
at about 150 yards. So much for that hike.

Last night was a howler in the canyon we hunted. I was about ready to take a
chance on a big doe when a sudden 70+ mph wind storm came through knocking
down dead trees and my composure. Missed. In fact I missed a lot this past
couple weeks! I either got to learn to get closer or  get better at shooting
farther. Anyway I am dead tired. Hope you have good hunting too pard.

YB&MOS
Capt. Lahti'


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Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2001 21:34:52 -0600
From: "Douglas Hepner" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Roaches

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Does anyone know when horse hair and porcupine roaches were first worn =
by Plains and mountain tribes?

- ------=_NextPart_000_02AE_01C17B79.2D7E5D80
Content-Type: text/html;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4134.600" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Does anyone know when =
horse hair and=20
porcupine roaches were first worn by Plains and mountain=20
tribes?</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_02AE_01C17B79.2D7E5D80--


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Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2001 06:36:03 -0500
From: Linda Holley <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Roaches

- --------------4B715F7AE9070513DA006D21
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

You might want to look at this problem too......roaches were made of
deer hair and turkey beards.

Linda Holley

Douglas Hepner wrote:

> Does anyone know when horse hair and porcupine roaches were first
> worn by Plains and mountain tribes?

- --------------4B715F7AE9070513DA006D21
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
<body bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
You might want to look at this problem too......roaches were made of deer
hair and turkey beards.
<p>Linda Holley
<p>Douglas Hepner wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE><style></style>
<font face="Arial"><font color="#000000"><font size=-1>Does
anyone know when horse hair and porcupine roaches were first worn by Plains
and mountain tribes?</font></font></font></blockquote>

</body>
</html>

- --------------4B715F7AE9070513DA006D21--


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Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 07:18:30 -0600
From: "Best, Dianne" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: "Metis" ???

If you happen to be Metis (especially French/Native), it is pronounced
Me-tiss, but if you say it that way up here, the response may well be in
FRENCH!

Jin-o-ta-ka (Dianne)


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Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 10:10:34 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls

I'm not the Capt. but walnut hull dye, bought through a trappers supply is a
powder.  The Hulls have been ground.

                                                 Joe

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Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 10:30:05 -0800
From: Pat Quilter <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re Hunting Shirt Sewing

Wynn asked:
Is it important to keep all the hides with the head in the same position
before cutting out or is it alright to rotate the leather?  How many strands
of lenin thread are best to sew with?  Or should I use artificial sinew?
(Sorry I just couldn't resist that one.)

Sorry to say but this wont be the last time you will here about this
project.

Dear Wynn
I have made several leather shirts using common sense and observation of
tailored cloth shirts, but read my note at the bottom before continuing.
I've posted these notes before so this is a rehash of stuff already in the
archives. My directions apply to a pullover, not an open-front hunting
shirt, so you will have to extract the points of use to you from this long
positing.
Good Luck
Pat Quilter

Randy Bublitz has explained some sewing tips as follows:
I tend to make a 'kit', then put it together.  For instance, I made a
punch out of an old fork.  I cut most of the handle off, then sharpened the
tines with a file.  I take a pre cut piece of leather and score a line along

the edge to be sewn .  I align my 4 prong punch along the line and strike (4

holes). Place fork in last hole, strike again (3 more holes), etc......
This leaves me a nice straight line of evenly punched holes.  I then take
two
dull pointed needles and thread with a piece of waxed linen thread.  I tie
the ends, so I have a loop with 2 needles on it.  I bring the needles
equidistant  from the knot.  held apart you have a needle in each hand, with

a double string in between with the knot in the middle.  To start a stitch
pass one needle through the first hole and pull knot up to the hole.  Now
you
have a needle on each side. pass each needle through the next hole from
opposite sides, repeat , etc....  This is called a saddle stitch.  It looks
good, and is very strong.  Don't do a run with one needle, and then catch up

with the other....  for a good lock stitch do each hole at a time.  Once you

get the rythm down it goes quick enough
Hardtack's sewing method is the way to do it, and works well with (real)
sinew too (the pieces being a foot or so long depending on your source, but
otherwise, handled the same).
Mostly, I lay the two leather pieces together, sewing inside out, so the
resulting seam will be to the inside, and punch my holes thru both pieces at
once, so they automatically align. A single awl instead of a fork also works
OK. A soft board or bed of cork for the awl to poke into is helpful. You can
punch a few inches worth of holes, sew them before you lose your place, and
continue punching.

The way I make a simple pullover shirt is as follows. I think the same
directions would work for a open-front hunting shirt, but you would allow
for a wider piece in the front for overlap. However I have NOT tried such a
shirt myself. :
- --Select two skins, one front and one back, and orient in the direction of
the original animal (shoulders matched to your shoulders). For brain tanned,
the flesh side traditionally goes in. The usual wedge shape should hopefully
cover your torso. This puts the thicker areas front and back with the
thinner areas along the sides. The head-end being up, usually matches the
skin's shape to your shoulders etc, for the best fit.
- --Examine a commercial shirt, and note how the seams from neck hole to
shoulders are placed somewhat forward of the center of the garment. Note
also, the slant, of the shoulders, taking account of your own shoulders.
- --After establishing where the skins seem to cover you best, using clamps,
staples, or an assistent, establish the shoulder seams, and where the neck
hole will fall. You will now have to start cutting, always a momentous step,
but this procedure minimizes risk. Turn the skins inside out (flesh side
out) and sew the two shoulders along the marked lines. It is not actually
necessary to cut yet, or at least, leave some margin in case of adjustments.
You probably will need to make a minimum cut in each skin for the neck hole,
keeping in mind you can always trim more off, but it's annoying to put
anything back.
- --Sew the two shoulder seams, about six inches each, on each side of the
neck hole. You should now have a poncho-like garment you can actually drape
over your head. Put it on, and assess the neck hole and shoulder seams. Trim
the neck opening reasonably well so the shirt lays on you. Clamp the leather
together under your arms, and start establishing the side seams. Go slowly
however, make sure the shoulder fit is good. It's a small amount of sewing
to re-do at this point.
- --Mark the side seams, leaving some slack for pulling it off, and don't make
the arm holes too tight. Here is where you will note that for most
comfortable fit the shoulder seam will be slightly front of center. In
particular, mark where the sides come together most naturally while wearing
the shirt, as it will not lie flat when you take it off to sew it.
- --Sew a few inches of side seam, and recheck the fit. NOTE: you are sewing
inside out, and it is not necessary to trim the leather all the way back to
the seams initially, in case you have to let it out some.
- --When confident of fit, sew the sides all the way past your belt line, but
you can leave the last few inches open below the waist.
- --You should now have a tunic with no arms. Check the fit again and make any
adjustments. Again, allow for slack under the arms.
- --You may apply a collar or cape now or later, using period patterns for
suggestions. When you do the collar, you will of course have to complete
establishing the neck opening.
- --Trim the leather back to within about 1/4-inch of your seams, ONLY AFTER
you are quite confident that it fits well. To attach the arms as noted
below, you will need to work right-side out.
- --The arms take more leather than you might think. Ideally, you will have a
large, thin skin with enough for two arms, or even two small skins. Put the
thin part inside the elbow. Wrap the skin around your arm and match the
upper diameter to the armholes of your tunic, keeping in mind you need to be
able to raise your arms overhead. Usually, sewing the arms so they poke out
at right angles is OK, Again, check how commercial shirts do it. The arms
should be quite tapered.
- --The arms will tend to bunch up lengthwise as you wear it, so make the
sleeves as long as you can. Fold back the excess into cuffs. Long cuffs can
be let down as partial gloves, to handle hot pans, etc.
- --As before, the seam along the arms is butt-seamed and sewed inside out.
Usually, you need only one seam, along the inside, unless having to piece
together smaller remnants.
- --To connect the arms to the tunic, I have had good results by lap-seaming
the arms inside the tunic. By putting the arms inside the tunic, and saddle
stitching the overlapped area, you get a smooth join, AND the excess
material left on the tunic that hangs over the shoulders can be trimmed into
a bit of decorative fringing.
- --I recommend against long fringe on sleeves and down the side, as it
catches on stuff, drags in your food, and bunches up underneath you when
sleeping. You can fringe the lower edge of the tunic for decoration if you
like.
- --I can offer no particular documentation for the resulting pullover shirt,
other than it uses basic European designs, was also seen in northern tribes
where wind proofing is an issue, and of course uses primitive materials. The
general pattern resembles what you would get if you duplicated a period
cloth shirt with available leather and the simplest construction. Most
references to "hunting shirts" describe a long open-front leather shirt,
worn over a cloth shirt, sort of like a leather capote (without the hood).
The pullover shirt described here is more of a primary shirt that you would
add outer layers to as required.
Good luck
Pat Quilter


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Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 15:35:13 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Roaches

In a message dated 12/3/1 4:32:00 AM, [e-mail] writes:

<<You might want to look at this problem too......roaches were made of
deer hair and turkey beards.>>

I've never seen a turkey beard version but have seen (and worn a few) large
numbers of the deer hair and porcupine guard hair variety.  Some people have
porcupines and some have turkeys . . .

Richard James

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Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2001 18:26:55 -0500
From: Ellen Gossett <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt

Sorry you didnt have any luck.I shot one doe with my flinter opening day of
muzzleloading season and got another Sat but I cheated on that one shot it from
the laundry room. Deer are taking us away in  Ga 8s the limit. Hope ya do better
next sojourn. JIM

rtlahti wrote:

> Hawk,
>
> Got back tonight empty handed and pooped. Not empty handed for not trying.
> This morning I climbed a small mountain and circled around a big buck and a
> couple does feeding in the middle of a 200 acre wheat stubble field to get
> down wind and above. I got to where I needed to be, lost faith that I had
> actually done it and that they would still be there and one doe spotted me
> at about 150 yards. So much for that hike.
>
> Last night was a howler in the canyon we hunted. I was about ready to take a
> chance on a big doe when a sudden 70+ mph wind storm came through knocking
> down dead trees and my composure. Missed. In fact I missed a lot this past
> couple weeks! I either got to learn to get closer or  get better at shooting
> farther. Anyway I am dead tired. Hope you have good hunting too pard.
>
> YB&MOS
> Capt. Lahti'
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html




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Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 17:38:26 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt

filled all 4 of my tags ===2 bucks and 2 does---one with my hawken and 3
with my new underhammers---robin had a good time i thank---got him 3
shots---no deer frank got 3 shots ---I got 4 shots and 4 deer steve got 3
shots and got 3 deer---his son saw lots of deer but was hunting big
hornd---he passed on a small 10 point ---told him he should have taken a
shot---the 10 came past me just out (125 yds thru the brush) of range and
went toward mat he saw it at abouy 30 yds but didnt shoot---biggest one i
got this season was a nice even (4 X 4) western count  8 point
eastern---weighed about 150 lbs have had a good season---saw lots of deer
mostly does---deer here just starting to go into rut---been too hot and
weather relly strange---saw lots of spike deer ---saw dirty point one
time at about 150 yds---didnt take a shot--hope to get him next
year---will be heading home in about a week---got a bunch of underhammers
to build---have 50 recievers in from the foundry---

best to you pard---

"HAWK"
Michael Pierce        Home of "Old Grizz Products"  & "the Arkansas Under
Hammers"
854 Glenfield Dr.
Palm Harbor Florida 34684  Phone:[phone]
e-mail:  [e-mail]  web site:
http://www.angelfire.com/fl2/mpierce

On Sun, 2 Dec 2001 19:43:15 -0800 "rtlahti" <[e-mail]> writes:
> Hawk,
>
> Got back tonight empty handed and pooped. Not empty handed for not
> trying.
> This morning I climbed a small mountain and circled around a big
> buck and a
> couple does feeding in the middle of a 200 acre wheat stubble field
> to get
> down wind and above. I got to where I needed to be, lost faith that
> I had
> actually done it and that they would still be there and one doe
> spotted me
> at about 150 yards. So much for that hike.
>
> Last night was a howler in the canyon we hunted. I was about ready
> to take a
> chance on a big doe when a sudden 70+ mph wind storm came through
> knocking
> down dead trees and my composure. Missed. In fact I missed a lot
> this past
> couple weeks! I either got to learn to get closer or  get better at
> shooting
> farther. Anyway I am dead tired. Hope you have good hunting too
> pard.
>
> YB&MOS
> Capt. Lahti'
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info:
> http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
________________________________________________________________
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Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 16:20:54 -0800
From: "rtlahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt

Thanks Jim. Probably won't go after deer again till next year. We're
thinking of going after elk one last time this month but haven't firmed up
our plans yet. At least they are bigger targets! <G>

Capt. Lahti'

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Ellen Gossett" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 03, 2001 3:26 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt


> Sorry you didnt have any luck.I shot one doe with my flinter opening day
of
> muzzleloading season and got another Sat but I cheated on that one shot it
from
> the laundry room. Deer are taking us away in  Ga 8s the limit. Hope ya do
better
> next sojourn. JIM
>
> rtlahti wrote:
>
> > Hawk,
> >
> > Got back tonight empty handed and pooped. Not empty handed for not
trying.
> > This morning I climbed a small mountain and circled around a big buck
and a
> > couple does feeding in the middle of a 200 acre wheat stubble field to
get
> > down wind and above. I got to where I needed to be, lost faith that I
had
> > actually done it and that they would still be there and one doe spotted
me
> > at about 150 yards. So much for that hike.
> >
> > Last night was a howler in the canyon we hunted. I was about ready to
take a
> > chance on a big doe when a sudden 70+ mph wind storm came through
knocking
> > down dead trees and my composure. Missed. In fact I missed a lot this
past
> > couple weeks! I either got to learn to get closer or  get better at
shooting
> > farther. Anyway I am dead tired. Hope you have good hunting too pard.
> >
> > YB&MOS
> > Capt. Lahti'
> >
> > ----------------------
> > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
>
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>


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Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 16:24:04 -0800
From: "rtlahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt

My congratulations Hawk. Maybe next year.

Capt. Lahti'


- ----- Original Message -----
From: <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Cc: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 03, 2001 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt


> filled all 4 of my tags ===2 bucks and 2 does---one with my hawken and 3



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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 00:38:24 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls

In a message dated 12/2/01 7:23:53 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< Well let's start with wax. What kind other than bee's wax was there? >>

Hmmmm.... seems to me there was a "bay berry" wax up in New England. Grew on
some brushy, evergreen like plant, and ya had to boil the berry to get the
wax off em. Sure makes a nice candle, don't think I'd do canvas wid it....

Ymos,
Magpie

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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 00:45:19 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt

In a message dated 12/2/01 7:37:36 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<< Last night was a howler in the canyon we hunted. I was about ready to take
a

chance on a big doe when a sudden 70+ mph wind storm came through knocking

down dead trees and my composure. Missed.  >>

Haaaaa.... if we didn't have bad luck, we'd have no luck at all! I managed to
poke a Blacktail, button buck, with my 50cal flinter, and it was the only
deer I saw in a couple days of rain on this side of the Cascades. The critter
was so small, I think it might have had milk marks on it's mouth......<G> It
sure does taste rather pleasant though.
I'll save a drum stick for the feast at Nisqually.....

Magpie

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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 08:41:52 -0500
From: "Addison Miller" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Midwest Rendezvous web page

For those of you that are interested, the web page for the NMLRA Midwest
Rendezvous 2002 is up and running at the following URL...
http://www.members.tripod.com/mwpr2002/   Take a gander at it, and I hope to
meet more of you there in June :)

Ad Miller
Alderson, WV


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Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 08:01:47 -0700
From: Angela Gottfred <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Kid's website: Exploration, the Fur Trade, & HBC

The fine folks who brought you www.canadiana.org (a great website for
reading all kinds of original documents, from Alexander Mackenzie's
published journal, to the private journal of Alexander Henry the Younger)
have now put up a website for kids entitled Exploration, the Fur Trade, &
HBC. It's well worth checking out. http://www.canadiana.org/hbc/intro_e.html

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred


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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 10:01:41 -0800
From: "rtlahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from

Sure makes a nice candle, don't think I'd do canvas wid it....
>
> Ymos,
> Magpie

Magpie,

That's what I always thought the wax was used for, giving candles a pleasant
scent. Did they make enough of this "bayberry" wax to make anything else?
BTW, how did you make your "oil cloth" and where did you get the recipe?

YMOS
Capt. Lahti'



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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 10:08:09 -0800
From: "rtlahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List:off to hunt

Magpie,

It's quite a drive for you but you would not have believed all the
opportunities over in the Palouse we had (if we could only have hit
something <G>). Sunday morning I bet we saw no less than 50 deer as we drove
out to the farm we were going to bird hunt on. Of course the deer were
across a valley, up in a wheat field and on land we couldn't easily or
legally hunt. But we had permission to hunt plenty of land that held plenty
of deer, the problem being they were so skittish that it was hard to get
anywhere near them. And you have to be careful what you shoot at or you'll
come home with drum sticks! <G>

Hope to see you at Nisqually. And congratulations on your Blacktail.

YMOS
Capt. Lahti'



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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 17:33:34 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from

In a message dated 12/4/01 9:55:26 AM, [e-mail] writes:

<< Did they make enough of this "bayberry" wax to make anything else? >>

Other than everyday use, I don't think so. From the note below, it sure took
a lot of berries to make a pound of wax....

Ymos
Magpie

Bayberry wax, also known as "bayberry tallow" or "myrtle wax," is the rarest
and most prized of all candle waxes.
 Bayberry wax that is 100% pure and natural, has a warm, earthy fragrance
reminiscent of newly mown hay, and dries to a lovely olive green color. It
takes about 15 pounds of bayberries to make just one pound of bayberry wax!

In the novel The Swiss Family Robinson, by Johann David Wyss, the shipwrecked
family made candles using the wax from wild bayberries. Early American
colonists also used the wax from bayberries to make candles. According to
tradition, a bayberry taper candle burned all the way down on Christmas Eve
or New Year's Eve brings good luck for the coming year. As the saying goes:
"A bayberry candle burned to the socket
brings food to the larder and gold to the pocket."


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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 17:43:48 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from

In a message dated 12/4/01 9:55:26 AM, [e-mail] writes:

<< BTW, how did you make your "oil cloth" and where did you get the recipe?

 >>

I'll repost my last on how I did the oil cloth below if you didn't get it. I
got the recipe from Glenn Richardson, Black River Party, and Baker does it
the same way with red iron oxide....


 <<The oil cloth I made was out of a queen size "Egyptian Cotton"
sheet...about 220 threads per inch. It squared up at 7.5'X7.5', and both
sides were painted with a mix of boiled linseed oil and yellow iron
oxide....about a half gallon and 1 lb of oxide was used. It took a couple
days to dry to the touch in the sun, and a week or two in the shade to loose
most of the oil smell. I hemmed the edges, and reinforced the corners with
the scraps to make the tarp a bit more tear resistant.

I'm pleased with the end result.....it's light, waterproof, fairly strong,
and didn't cost much to make. As far as flame proof....I took several scrap
samples and held a match to the edge, expecting an explosion. The edge would
burn, but if I turned it edge up, like a candle wick, the flame would go out.
My thinking is the iron oxide acts somewhat as a flame retardant...or at
least slows the burn rate way down. I've seen untreated canvas burn faster,
and with a bit of common sense, I'd use it for any camp.

I just picked up a pound of red iron oxide, a nice piece of 9X9, coarse "home
spun" looking cotton canvas, that I'll hand sew into my next tarp when the
rain stops....mebbe six months from now.>>

Ymos,
Magpie


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Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 15:59:45 -0800
From: "rtlahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from

Thanks Magpie. I got the original post.
I just wanted the comment about Baker's video and his recipe to come from
another source.

YMOS
Capt. Lahti'

 ----- Original Message -----
From: <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 2:43 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: back to walnut hulls/wax from


>
> In a message dated 12/4/01 9:55:26 AM, [e-mail] writes:
>
> << BTW, how did you make your "oil cloth" and where did you get the
recipe?
>
>  >>
>
> I'll repost my last on how I did the oil cloth below if you didn't get it.
I
> got the recipe from Glenn Richardson, Black River Party, and Baker does it
> the same way with red iron oxide....
>
>
>  <<The oil cloth I made was out of a queen size "Egyptian Cotton"
> sheet...about 220 threads per inch. It squared up at 7.5'X7.5', and both
> sides were painted with a mix of boiled linseed oil and yellow iron
> oxide....about a half gallon and 1 lb of oxide was used. It took a couple
> days to dry to the touch in the sun, and a week or two in the shade to
loose
> most of the oil smell. I hemmed the edges, and reinforced the corners with
> the scraps to make the tarp a bit more tear resistant.
>
> I'm pleased with the end result.....it's light, waterproof, fairly strong,
> and didn't cost much to make. As far as flame proof....I took several
scrap
> samples and held a match to the edge, expecting an explosion. The edge
would
> burn, but if I turned it edge up, like a candle wick, the flame would go
out.
> My thinking is the iron oxide acts somewhat as a flame retardant...or at
> least slows the burn rate way down. I've seen untreated canvas burn
faster,
> and with a bit of common sense, I'd use it for any camp.
>
> I just picked up a pound of red iron oxide, a nice piece of 9X9, coarse
"home
> spun" looking cotton canvas, that I'll hand sew into my next tarp when the
> rain stops....mebbe six months from now.>>
>
> Ymos,
> Magpie
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>


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Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2001 02:58:46 +0000
From: "darlene secondine" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Blanket Capotes

Howdy friends,
  I'm trying to upgrade my capote. What I have now is a capote cut on the
square and I understand that it is cut wrong for pre-1840 fur trade.
Anybody out there have any primary sources on the correct cut for a fur
trade era capote. Or is there an original in a collection somewhere that I
can look at so I can see how they were cut in the period in question. Oh
yeah, the one I've been wearing is made out of a Lachine 4pt.
Thanks ahead,
Don in the Ohio Country

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp


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Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2001 09:23:17 -0600
From: Monte Holder <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List:pigments

I have watched the Baker video several times and he does paint the oil cloth with
linseed oil and iron oxide pigment.  He is dying a shirt or something in a pot
with walnut hulls.  What I'd like to know is where you all get the red or yellow
iron oxide pigments.

Monte Holder


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