ftp.xmission.com

home *** CD-ROM | disk | FTP | other *** search

/ ftp.xmission.com / 2014.06.ftp.xmission.com.tar / ftp.xmission.com / pub / lists / hist_text / archive / v01.n730 < prev next >

Wrap

Internet Message Format | 2001-02-01 | 35KB

From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #730 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Thursday, February 1 2001 Volume 01 : Number 730 In this issue: -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: French bodice & other don'ts -áááááá MtMan-List: Pitfalls/Rendevous dilema -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey -áááááá MtMan-List: Stone pipes -áááááá MtMan-List: pitfalls -áááááá MtMan-List: Re: Year's Supply -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Whats correct or not correct -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey/French Bodice -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey/French Bodice -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls (was: French bodice & other don'ts) -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls (was: French bodice & other don'ts) -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls (was: French bodice & other don'ts) -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: pitfalls -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Pitfalls/Rendevous dilema -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: elastic suspenders in 1820's?? -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: elastic suspenders in 1820's?? -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: pitfalls ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 03:34:27 EST From: SWzypher@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey In a message dated 2/1/1 12:21:53 AM, rtlahti@email.msn.com writes: <> Roger. You're as bad as John. You need to go get a hobbie. And YOU NEE-ED TO GO-O-O-O TO BED! Good night! RJames - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 03:53:19 -0500 From: "D. Miles" <deforge1@bright.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey Rog' It is 3:50 a.m. and I am still waiting..<G> D - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 06:48:26 -0800 From: Linda Holley <tipis@mediaone.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: French bodice & other don'ts Oh...Oh.... So you were there at the right spot. I promise, no more green stuff or drink. Linda tom roberts wrote: > SO!! That strange green apparition wasn't a liquor-induced illusion > after all!! > > Linda Holley wrote: > > > > Gee, good thing you guys were not at the Alafia Rendezvous. > > ..... and those instant emergency green lights that you shake. > > Those I threw in the hooters to see the reactions of the other night time > > depositors when the green glow came through..... > > > > Linda Holley.....Oh lord I am heartily sorry for ......Oh lord I am heartily > > sorry for.......etc. > > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 07:33:35 -0500 From: "Tim Jewell" <tjewell@home.com> Subject: MtMan-List: Pitfalls/Rendevous dilema Hello the camp, I've been seriously contemplating the authenticity/period correct/documented line of thought and how it relates to "modern" rendezvous. Given the limitations of these events, can't cut standing wood, must keep fire bucket handy, can't hunt or trap for food, etc. etc. etc. Also taking comfort into consideration, how would I portray a circa 1835 trapper? I would like to have a camp setup as authentically as possible. I think I have my personal gear together fairly well (clothing, weapons, accruoments, etc.), but what about camp gear? I'm wondering about things like shelter, camp "furniture" and equipment, food and food storage. As always, any advise/comments are eagerly awaited. I remain your most humble servant, Tim Jewell tjewell@home.com back east in Baltimoretowne - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 05:49:52 -0700 From: "Buck Conner" <conner1@qwest.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey SWzypher@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/1/1 12:21:53 AM, rtlahti@email.msn.com writes: > > < for you............................ > > Capt. L > >> > > Roger. You're as bad as John. You need to go get a hobbie. And YOU NEE-ED > TO GO-O-O-O TO BED! > Good night! > RJames > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html Take off the dress and lipstick. B. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 08:07:15 -0500 From: "D. Miles" <deforge1@bright.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey " Take off the dress and lipstick." Buck, Arn't you at leat going to wait for the second date?<G> D - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 07:27:58 -0600 From: "Best, Dianne" <dbest@hydro.mb.ca> Subject: MtMan-List: Stone pipes This comes from Native oral history and I don't know if the Europeans documented it or not. Tobacco was grown extensively thru southwestern Ontario from way before contact (nobody knows when) - there was even a nation known as "the Tobacco Indians" who became extinct at about the time of first contact. Tobacco from the Tobacco Indians, the Neutrals, and the Iroquois was traded far and wide. Although my people (the Five Nations) made clay pipes, they were for "every day use". The most valued pipes were those made from the red stone obtained from the Indians of Minnesota in exchange for tobacco. Any trapper having interchange with any of the Indians around Lake Superior could easily have acquired a red stone pipe. Jin-o-ta-ka (Dianne) - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 07:34:36 -0600 From: "Frank Fusco" <frankf@centurytel.net> Subject: MtMan-List: pitfalls Angela Gottfred suggested that fringe on a capote might not be 'authentic'. I do not know where she got that idea but it does bear looking into. Perhaps visitors to museums can report what they have seen. I have been to a number of museums but must confess I did not take special note of this particular detail. What I do know is that many early garments had fringe and that, in most cases, it was not just for decorative purposes. Fringe has a tendency to gather water when the wearer is in the rain. The water then drips off instead of just soaking into the garment. Not a perfect system but it does work. Angela is the first person I have heard suggest that capote fringe is not correct. Now she may be the only person on this and other lists or at scores of rendezvous over a period of decades who is correct. Or for that matter, many reference books, catalogs, patterns and etc. That is possible. But I do have doubts that that is the case. Frank G. Fusco Mountain Home, Arkansas - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 08:47:59 -0600 From: "Henry B. Crawford" <mxhbc@TTACS.TTU.EDU> Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Year's Supply Larry looks like a lot, but he allowed for enough stuff that could be useful as trade goods and/or bribes. A year is a long time to be stuck without necessities. That's the difference betwixt a seasoned mountaineer and a greenhorn. I'd be proud to join his brigade. Hat's off. :-) HBC ********************************** Henry B. Crawford Curator of History Museum of Texas Tech University Box 43191 Lubbock, TX 79409-3191 henry.b.crawford@ttu.edu 806/742-2442 FAX 742-1136 Website: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum *** Living History . . . Because It's There *** - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 08:47:59 -0700 From: Angela Gottfred <agottfre@telusplanet.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls "Ole B. Jensen" <olebjensen@earthlink.net> wrote: >>The drawings by Miller are from the late 1830s and the ones from Catlin are from 1832, cast Iron was here even if it doesn't make good sence.<< Quite right. It doesn't belong on the list we're making, which is of completely undocumented items that should never be seen. Dave Kanger <ThisOldFox@aol.com> wrote: >> In the common vernacular of today, pipestone is most associated with Catlinite, which has unique properties and is only found in one place. ... Pipestone is really something totally different and is described by most references as, "a red, indurated (hardened) clay used by Native Americans to make tobacco pipes."... I believe Micmac pipes were made from soapstone, which is a variety of talc known as steatite (fat rock) because its greasy feel was associated with tallow. It is called soapstone for the same reason, because it feels like a bar of soap (made from tallow).<< I dug out my original information on Micmac-style stone tobacco pipe bowls in the fur trade. It says that they were made from different types of stone, "including catlinite, soapstone, siltstone, and pipestone". (Burley, Hamilton, & Fladmark, 121) There is also cool information on how they were made & decorated. *Almost* makes me wish I smoked! >>I didn't think you had anything beside granite in Canada. <G> << No, that's back East!! When I went to Quebec, 20 years ago, my jaw just dropped at my first sight of the awesome Canadian Shield. Here in Alberta, we've got all kinds of lovely sedimentary rock, just perfect for storing oil and gas, and making mountains. <vbg> Nothing more amazing than seeing a fossilized coral reef near a mountain top. Your very humble & most obedient servant, Angela Gottfred - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:36:32 EST From: CTOAKES@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Whats correct or not correct - --part1_67.f282844.27aaea90_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I SMOKE CIGARETTES !! Are you > Actually I have nothing against anyone who smokes anything the choose. The referance I made about smoking was to point out that every camp/event allows or does not allow some things. Modern eyewear, cigarettes, slat chairs, french bodices, chrome orange leather being sold by dealers, etc. And as long as everyone involved agrees to what is allowed then none of use needs to be the police. What I find offensive is just what you do, selectively picking out one item as incorrect and offensive, say a flat chair, and at the same time ignoring all the rest of the incorrect items. My families camp tries to show others, as close as possilbe, what a family moving north - northeast from Conn in the early 1700's would have had with them as they traveled with a wagon drawn by two oxen to new land we had purchased between Deerfield and Albany. But for me to make noises about someone else camp being incorrect for their personna and time period do to one or two items would be less then sincere on our part, I have a 10 year old daughter and it is hard to say she and her friends can not toast a marshmellow over the camp fire once in a while. And we know that marchmellows did not exist in the early 1700's. So no I do not mean to offend the smokers, just wanted to say we should all lead by example and not offend and drive off fellow travellers by being vocally critical of their camps and equipment, as long as they meet the requirement of the event we are attending. Y.H.O.S. C.T. Oakes - --part1_67.f282844.27aaea90_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <HTML> <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"> I SMOKE CIGARETTES !! Are you grouping me with those who go around criticizing everyone elses camp</BLOCKQUOTE> Actually I have nothing against anyone who smokes anything the choose. The referance I made about smoking was to point out that every camp/event allows or does not allow some things. Modern eyewear, cigarettes, slat chairs, french bodices, chrome orange leather being sold by dealers, etc. And as long as everyone involved agrees to what is allowed then none of use needs to be the police. What I find offensive is just what you do, selectively picking out one item as incorrect and offensive, say a flat chair, and at the same time ignoring all the rest of the incorrect items. My families camp tries to show others, as close as possilbe, what a family moving north - northeast from Conn in the early 1700's would have had with them as they traveled with a wagon drawn by two oxen to new land we had purchased between Deerfield and Albany. But for me to make noises about someone else camp being incorrect for their personna and time period do to one or two items would be less then sincere on our part, I have a 10 year old daughter and it is hard to say she and her friends can not toast a marshmellow over the camp fire once in a while. And we know that marchmellows did not exist in the early 1700's. So no I do not mean to offend the smokers, just wanted to say we should all lead by example and not offend and drive off fellow travellers by being vocally critical of their camps and equipment, as long as they meet the requirement of the event we are attending. Y.H.O.S. C.T. Oakes</HTML> - --part1_67.f282844.27aaea90_boundary-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:44:21 EST From: SWzypher@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls In a message dated 2/1/1 09:01:09 AM, agottfre@telusplanet.net writes: <<In the common vernacular of today, pipestone is most associated with Catlinite, which has unique properties and is only found in one place. ... >> Indians had their own words for the material they made their pipes from and many times the one word covered the several different types of materials from which the pipe was made. Remember, in many groups the entire vocabulary amounted to no more than 6,000 words compared to the 1 1/2 million in American/English, 180,000 and 160,000 in German and French (the difference is the acromyms and technical words generated in English but used universally) Indians did not invent new words but used the ones they had. Examples: "mystery dog" for "horse", "spotted buffalo" for "cow", "black white man" for York, etc.. Catlinite got its name from George Catlin so that word has only been around a century and a half. We banter these technicalities around today to suit ourselves but these discussions would have no meaning to the principle players during the time of the Fur Trade. As to what was available, Marie Sandoz points out in her book The Beaver Men that neutrality was declared among tribes so they could come together for great trade fairs long before there were rendezvous (well, they were rendezvous in the true French intent of the word so let's call ours "Rendezvous". These great, ancient trade fairs are the way Lakota got dentallium shells and ancient Freemont got olliva (not sure on the spelling, but I can show you some from my collection that came from the Pacific but found in pre-historic caves north of the Great Salt Lake). Obsidian, dried pumpkin, woven blankets, robes, weapons, caribou antlers, are just the tip of the trade items that traded at these intra-national (now - inter-tribal, then) fairs. And the stone to make pipes was there, too. Richard James - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:06:02 -0600 From: Victoria Pate <vapate@juno.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey/French Bodice > > > In a message dated 2/1/1 12:21:53 AM, rtlahti@email.msn.com > writes: > > > > < I'm coming > > for you............................ > > > > Capt. L > > >> >> > Take off the dress and lipstick. > > B. > Angela, I have it on highest authority that Capt. Lahti' wears one of those horrid Ubiquitous French Bodices (UFB) over his dress. Didn't you notice how interested he's been in your posts concerning women's PC clothing??? Perhaps you and I can persuade the good Capt. to join us on the 18 Century Woman's list where he can get the proper learnin'. And that lipstick has gotta go. Victoria > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: > http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:50:45 -0800 From: "Roger Lahti" <rtlahti@email.msn.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey/French Bodice > Perhaps you and I can persuade the good Capt. > to join us on the 18 Century Woman's list where he > can get the proper learnin'. And that lipstick has gotta > go. Victoria, Far be it from me to decline an invitation to gather with some of my favorite people..... And yes the lipstick is gone! I'm going back to inletting black for my gun work. The wife's reject lipstick tubs on the work bench just raises too many eyebrows. Capt. Laht' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:44:38 -0800 From: "Roger Lahti" <rtlahti@email.msn.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls (was: French bodice & other don'ts) > Yes, and I have previously cited evidence of cast iron fragments excavated > from Canadian fur forts. I think my personal problem with cast iron stuff, > like my cauldron, is that 1) it weighs a ton, and so it drives me crazy; Angela, I would never think to pack cast iron on anything other than a boat trip or drive and dump open Rendezvous but I do have a small three legged (legs are quite long) very rounded cauldron/pot such as was used and is still used in particularly Africa. It will hold a large chicken and a few vegetables and could be used with coals on top. So it isn't all that big and cumbersome. Big enough for a one pot meal for two to 4/5 people and no more. 2) > there's *lots* more evidence for tin/brass/copper pots than there is for > cast iron, so I feel that it was fairly rare. I too, much prefer to deal with my copper and tin pots. They are lighter, and probably more common though as you point out, brass would have been more common than copper. I think, though, that it's > fair to say that cast iron cookware should be struck off this list, which > is meant to be of stuff that is completely undocumented for the 1800-1850 > period. I agree that they should be struck off the list of things to avoid and be relegated to a list of things to be cautious about. For the newby, it's probably > safer to avoid it until you're more experienced and/or have done lots of > research (i.e. months of research, not days or even weeks). That way, you > won't find you've spent hours on beadwork that you later feel obliged to > keep in a drawer. Or remove it from your clothes or other stuff. (Yes, that > would be me again, on both counts.) Sage advice. But if someone wants to do bead work, loom or otherwise and does not expect to go where it's authenticity is important then have at it. This is all free advice and one can do with it as they wish. > >> Or crushed velvet skirts and vests?<< > *Shudder*. But, gut reaction aside, I'm not enough of a textile expert to > know whether or not crushed velvet was made before 1850. I rather doubt, > though, that the style of these skirts and vests is like the styles of the > 1800-1850 period. But they are so pretty on the ladies! <G> Crass commercial exploitation! <G> > > >>How about pioneer dresses?<< > I think we'd do well to advise our fictional newby to read Beth Gilgun, > Sharon Ann Burnston, et. al. before he or she buys or makes any clothing. Same as with the velvet skirts, etc. I'm sure they are fun things to wear and it can be very boring when you limit yourself to what is documented but that is a choice folks should make. Do you want to have all the fun toys or do it right? As I have said before, my wife's and most of her lady friends at Rendezvous favorite pastime is going to the "Mall". (Traders Row) > > >>Iron fire grates and grills.<< > Not totally undocumented (they were used back east during the RevWar, > according to Neumann & Kravic), but I haven't seen anything to suggest they > were used in the fur trade. I certainly wouldn't encourage anyone to get > them. I'll add iron trivets to this list. I have a beautiful iron trivet I > have never used-- while I waited several months for the blacksmith to > finish it, I did more research . More fun toys that we get and hate to leave behind. <G> Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:39:50 EST From: SWzypher@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls (was: French bodice & other don'ts) In a message dated 2/1/1 11:45:57 AM, rtlahti@email.msn.com writes: <> They are documented and lighter in weight and you probably will have no problems - but some are possible. In the 1700s Sweden set a precidence by having these vessels removed from their sailing ship because the oxidization was deemed a source of illness. Other countries followed. Realizing your personal sanitation "rituals" being of this century and of your nature are many levels above those of earlier times - no problem for you. For some . . . .? maybe a word of caution. Things to take and not to take: Do you have it? Will you use it? Do you want to document it? Is it just for your comfort "and want to take it anyway because who will see it and what if they do? and besides I have always taken it and . . . and . . . and - If the montain men would have had it, they would have taken it". Any of this sound familiar?? A good guide - realizing we have a full spectrum of "types" of gatherings with abundant variations on requirements - "What does the Bourgeois say is allowed?". Then watch to see if he has the character and backbone to enforce it. Then check your own motives for do you REALLY want to have an historic experience - or are you just camping out? There she floats. Have a shot at it. Richard James - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 16:08:39 -0500 From: "D. Miles" <deforge1@bright.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Newby pitfalls (was: French bodice & other don'ts) "I too, much prefer to deal with my copper and tin pots" >>>I only carry one.. A brass trade kettle by Goose Bay.. Fries good, boils, makes a handy water container, browns coffee beans and two grown men cannot drink it dry 7 times fulla Black Seal rum..<G> D - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 16:52:01 -0800 From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply Tom wrote: Larry, Don't forget the salt. <G> Tom Tom, How much salt was carried to rendezvous for trade ? In previous dicussions, it was brought out that they gathered a lot of salt in the mountains. Pendleton - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 17:29:40 -0800 From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pitfalls Frank wrote: Angela is the first person I have heard suggest that capote fringe is not correct. Now she may be the only person on this and other lists or at scores of rendezvous over a period of decades who is correct. Or for that matter, many reference books, catalogs, patterns and etc. That is possible. But I do have doubts that that is the case. Frank G. Fusco Mountain Home, Arkansas Frank, I don't recall any first person descriptions of capotes having fringe. Also, I don't recall Miller drawings showing any capotes with fringe, but I could be wrong. He did show large external pockets. Honestly, I think fringe and other fancy trim came from the reservation period. Just my thoughts. Pendleton - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 17:39:32 -0800 From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pitfalls/Rendevous dilema Tim wrote: I think I have my personal gear together fairly well (clothing, weapons, accruoments, etc.), but what about camp gear? I'm wondering about things like shelter, camp "furniture" and equipment, food and food storage. As always, any advise/comments are eagerly awaited. I remain your most humble servant, Tim Jewell Tim, What I suggest is go to some local rendezvous, in your area, and see what is and isn't accepted. Some are not much more than 'dress up camping' while others are much more serious. Not much way to know unless you can hook up with some local club members and ask some questions. Pendleton - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:11:31 -0800 From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply If anyone has any additions or disagree with some of this stuff, jump in and let's here it. Pendleton Should have said, 'let's hear it'. Ok. went brain dead. <GG> Pendleton - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 18:21:59 -0600 From: "Douglas Hepner" <dullhawk@texomaonline.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply I carry a smoothbore so I don't go anywhere without a shot pouch. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Allen Hall <allenhall@srv.net> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 8:50 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply > Larry, > > Great list, THANKS! Anyone else have additions or different ideas? I/we'd > love to hear them. > > YMOS, > > Allen > > At 05:25 PM 01/31/2001 -0800, you wrote: > > > >Allen, > > Your Free Trapper's list would go something like this: > >Rifle or Smoothbore (depending on preference) > >Pair of Pistols large bore (to settle disputes of the final kind) > >Shot Pouch or Shooting Bag containing all necessary accoutrements Including > >several tow worms > >Powder Horn (Large enough to hold a pound of powder) > >3 or 4 yards of cloth material for patching > >20 LB. gun powder > >40 LB. Galena > >4 doz.. English Gun Flints > >Fire Steel > >Tobacco ( not sure how much ?) > >2 or 3 clay pipes > >Pair of 3 point Blankets (maybe 2 pair) > >Large Knife possibly a butcher knife > >Trappers Axe or Half Axe (for used in actual trapping) > >Full sized Axe (for use in building shelters etc..) > >8 Beaver Traps (6 to 8 was typical) > >2 or 3 Files (for sharpening cutting tools) > >2 or 3 Awls > >Sewing Needles > >Linen Thread > >Kettle of some kind (tin or brass) > >1 or more Tin Cups > >2 or 3 shirts and a couple pairs of pants or breeches (tired of wearin them > >buckskins) > >Maybe a new Felt Hat > >He might have some coffee, tea, dried fruit, or other foods left from > >rendezvous. Most of it was consumed there. > >Trade Items (It's easier to trade for beaver than trap'em.) > >Beads > >Bells > >Tomahawks > >Ribbon > >As many butcher knives as he could afford. As many as a doz.. maybe. > >Fire Steels (several) > >Various other GeeGaws > > > >Allen, I'm sure I have left something off the list, but these items were > >typical. > >Your Boys trapping around Ft. Hall would carry most of the same stuff except > >less powder and lead, and probably more food items. > >If anyone has any additions or disagree with some of this stuff, jump in and > >let's here it. > > > >Pendleton > > > >---------------------- > >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > > > > >---------------------- > >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:28:38 EST From: SWcushing@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: elastic suspenders in 1820's?? In a message dated 1/31/01 10:33:32 AM, vapate@juno.com writes: << discovered petroleum, or naptha, was a solvent for rubber and therefore could be used to rubberize textiles. Fabronni made his discovery in 1779. Victoria >> Thanks Victoria! If we have another feast like we had at Fort Nisqually a few weeks back, Capt Lahti and I both are goin to need "rubberized" suspenders. :o( Ymos, Magpie - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:31:09 EST From: SWcushing@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: elastic suspenders in 1820's?? In a message dated 1/31/01 10:44:04 AM, Mtnman1449@aol.com writes: << Haven't been following this thread, but Bent's Fort sells period correct cloth suspenders which I've worn for years. Might give them a call in the gift shop, last time I was there they still carried them. Patrick Surrena AMM #1449 >> Pat, do you have a number for them? Magpie AMM #Pilgrim.... <G> - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 17:35:32 -0700 From: "Buck Conner" <conner1@qwest.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brass Monkey "D. Miles" wrote: > " Take off the dress and lipstick." > > Buck, > Arn't you at leat going to wait for the second date?<G> > D > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html Concho says to be nice and remember their are ladies on the list, he also send "hugs & kisses" for Valentine's Day to the friendly blacksmith. Need I say more. Buck. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:40:23 EST From: ThisOldFox@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Year's Supply > How much salt was carried to rendezvous for trade ? > In previous dicussions, it was brought out that they gathered a lot of salt > in the mountains. We had a rather extended discussion about salt a year or year and a half ago. Should be lots of info in the archives about it. I remember contributing a rather long posting on Gurdon Hubbard gathering salt at the Vermilion Salt Works, which still exist today, for the American Fur Co. Seems I recall that Buck did some extensive posting as well. Dave Kanger - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:55:39 EST From: GHickman@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pitfalls frankf@centurytel.net writes: << Angela is the first person I have heard suggest that capote fringe is not correct. >> I have been hearing this repeatedly for a number of years and from several sources. I have never seen fringe on Capote's in any reference books. The only place I see it is in Trader's catalogs, such as Northwest Traders, and on folks at Rendezvous. I also know that none of the Miller paintings show fringe, nor do any of the Sketchbooks on Mountain Men and Voyageurs, which are taken from museum specimens and other documents. Additionally it is not in Allen Chronister and Clay Landry's "Clothing of the Rocky Mountain Trapper, 1820-1840" in The Book of Buckskinning VII. Last fall, when I was at the Fur Trade Symposium, Allen Chronister and I talked about this briefly in discussing period clothing issues. Allen related that he had found no documentation for fringe on Capote's in the pre-1840 period. Clay was also there but I don't remember if he was part of that discussion. Just my .02 worth. YMOS Ghosting Wolf - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #730 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.