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Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2000 18:57:57 -0800
From: Randal J Bublitz <randybublitz@juno.com>
Subject: Re: Fw: MtMan-List: warmth of fur..lb. for lb.
My mother in law made my wife and I a rabbitt skin blanket. She got a
bunch of those Janis Joplin jackets at flea markets, etc.... took them
apart and stitched together a queen sized blanket. She then backed it
with some cozy flannel. This blanket is light, rolls up tight, and is
warm....not as warm as my brain tanned buffalo, but a lot easier to pack
and carry. I have an elk robe, but the hairs break of and itch....it is
also heavy. I didn't know that commercial tanned buffalo (never had one)
is heavier than brain tanned. My B.T. buff robe is'nt so heavy, as it
is bulky. I slept with it and a Whitney blanket at the western camp in
the sierras last nov.. It was down near 0 dg one night, and I was
perfectly warm and cozy....It was my first real test of my buff. robe,
I'm sure glad I have it. For this trip I also made a pair of centerseam
mocs. from a sheepskin (wool side in) and used them to sleep in. I
would recommend this also. If ya got's to go outside the bedroll , you
got mocs on, and they are cozy. hardtack
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Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2000 22:27:39 -0800
From: Linda Holley <tipis@mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: Fw: MtMan-List: warmth of fur..lb. for lb.
I have experience with all the areas you mention. I have commercial and brian tanned buffalo robes. Will take the brain tan any day. Have two woven rabbit pelt robes or blankets. They are very warm. The Whitney's I will take over the Pendletons. The choice of all is, spread out the Whitney's and then crawl into a brain tanned buffalo robe with a lining of rabbit fur. The buffalo robe can get prickly and the rabbit is to soft.
I am very comfortable in very cold weather.
Linda Holley
Ratcliff wrote:
> Marc
> That is a good question. Like you, my buffalo robe goes only where I have help carrying the heavy rascal, although it IS warm. I manage to be comfortable with two good wool blankets. To address your question, I would think that the best fur is one that is lightweight enough to carry comfortably, so a thick fur in relation to the thickness of the leather sounds like the ticket. I bet a robe made of a lot of rabbit skins would be a wonderful thing. Careful stitching would be necessary to make it work but I would wager that it would be warm as a box full of puppies. There are numerous references in the record of various Indians using rabbit skin robes. However, you would run the risk of appearing to be sleeping under Janis Joplin's old hippie jacket.
> Anybody have any experience with rabbit skin robes?
> YMOS
> Lanney Ratcliff
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Marc Stewart" <sardog1@att.net>
> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
> Sent: Monday, December 18, 2000 8:04 PM
> Subject: MtMan-List: warmth of fur..lb. for lb.
>
> > Hello group,
> > As one of the list lurkers, I have gained lots of much
> > appreciated info from all of you. Now, I ask a question that I've been
> > wondering about for a few weeks now....Pound for pound, what is the
> > warmest fur available. For years, I've slept under a buff hide at the
> > bigger events, but would never carry it more than a few hundred yards.
> > *bg* I had ideas at one time of sewing a nice beaver blanket for my
> > wife for when its chilly but not freezing. Any thoughts or ideas? Now,
> > we're not talking about whether or not wool is better for warmth( I
> > would never carry more than a wool blanket on a trek) I'm talking
> > specifically about furs...Thank you all in advance for any advice or
> > information you may offer to share.
> >
> >
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Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2000 22:52:58 -0500
From: tom roberts <troberts@gdi.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: warmth of fur..lb. for lb.
Mark,
Just a couple more bits of data, my BT buff robe weighs
only 17 lbs and it's nearly 50 ft2, more than enough to
make a very warm bed for all but the largest sleeper. It can
be rolled, along with an oilcloth ground cover/shelter, into
an easily managed carry for short distances, or could be
configured with a couple of shoulder straps for longer
distances. I used this robe at the same camp as hardtack
(he's better insulated than me) and I was as warm as
I care to be. Next time I'll pin the bottom shut so to keep
my toes out of the snow. Although light when dry, the
robe will become significantly heavier if it gets wet. Next time
I will wrap it in a couple large garbage bags before packing
it into my duffel bag for air travel since my stuff was left out on
some baggage cart in a thunderstorm.
I think the buff robe may be warmer than other furs/hides
since it has so much loft which is where the insulating takes
place.
BTW, I've never met a rabbit pelt that didn't shed, but they
are mighty warm and light
Tom
Roger Lahti wrote:
> Mark,
>
> Warmth of a given insulating material is measured in "R" factor by the
> modern world. I'm sure you are aware of this. Here are a couple things to
> think about when trying to decide the answer to your question.
>
> When you consider the weight of a pelt or hair on hide like your buff robe,
> part of what you are weighing is the leather the fur/hair is attached to. In
> the case of buffalo robes, commercial robes are much heavier than Indian
> dressed or brain tanned robes. A couple of fellas in my acquaintance have
> procured brain tanned buffalo robes and find them to be "carryable" when
> compared to the normal commercial tanned robe. They characterize them as
> being VERY LIGHT WEIGHT. The warmth is still all there but the hide weighs
> much less.
>
> As to how to determine which fur/pelt/natural material is going to be the
> warmest per pound, your gona need to take out the weight of the leather
> first. From what little I know about insulation values of natural materials
> nothing beats goose down. Some where up there will be hair from members of
> the deer family with their hollow hair. Also way up there are the furs of
> some of the smaller animals such as chinchillas. Great Basin Indians made
> very warm robes from strips of rabbit pelts. But it all boils down to how
> much loft you can get in a material that will hold together. Wool on a sheep
> skin would be warmer than the blanket you could make from it since the
> blanket is compressed to some degree but the sheep hide still has that
> danged hide on it.
>
> Don't really have a definitive answer for you but thought I would throw my
> two bits out.
>
> Capt. Lahti'
>
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 09:46:49 EST
From: NaugaMok@aol.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: warmth of fur..lb. for lb.
In a message dated 12/17/00 6:00:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, sardog1@att.net
writes:
<< I had ideas at one time of sewing a nice beaver blanket for my
wife for when its chilly but not freezing. Any thoughts or ideas? >>
When I visited Johnson Hall in October, they had an intresting bed covering.
It was made up of 9 beaver hides backed with a wool blanket. If any of you
have visited Sir William's house, you know it was his extensive records that
allowed them to restore the house authenticaly. This bed cover is
documentable to arround 1760 - 1770. It was recreated for the Hall by a
fellow reenactor. Granted, Sir William was very wealthy, so echonomicaly, I
doubt we can doccument one like this in the Rockies, but they definitely had
the main ingredients -- beaver hides & wool blankets. I do have a 2 hide
beaver cape & can attest to it's warmth.
NM
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 08:32:12 -0800
From: "Larry Huber" <shootsprairie@hotmail.com>
Subject: MtMan-List: fur for warmth
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I have no experience with fur specifically for warmth other than buffalo =
but I can supply some observations and research. Wolf fur has been =
often used for insulation in parkas in Alaska. B52 pilots used them on =
their overflights of the Russian coast. Those old planes had little =
heat on that route. The .45 cal. pistols would freeze into their =
holsters rendering them useless if ever needed. The parkas were warm =
and the trim of wolf fur allowed no build up of ice or snow. Works for =
those critters.
The warmest fur I have read about is Polar bear. Inuits wear suits of =
polar bear hide when staying overnight on the ice. They reject the =
niceties of down bags and quilted parkas relying only on this garment. =
They wear their sleeping gear. Obviously, it isn't the fat on the bear =
alone that allows it to swim in the frigid water of the Arctic. =20
You can bet that polar bear hide will be damn hard to come by in the =
United States and wolf fur isn't much easier. Replicating the life =
style of historical Mountain Men obviously isn't the point of the =
question asked. But Natives that live or work on the land to the north =
rely on the fur of the white bear.
Larry Huber
=20
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Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 21:57:29 -0700
From: Todd Glover <tetontodd@juno.com>
Subject: MtMan-List: Firearm Question
Anyone ever heard of a "Texas Tyler" Rifle or shotgun? A friend asked and
I told him I know some fellers that might help.
Thanks
"Teton" Todd D. Glover
#1784
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