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Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:44:11 -0600
From: "northwoods" <northwoods@ez-net.com>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: kinninik
- -----Original Message-----
From: Julia <sirovetz@proaxis.com>
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Date: March 30, 2000 7:20 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: kinninik
> But you are correct in
>the definition of kinnikinnick being a "smoking mixture" for that is
>what the name means in native tongue.
I believe the word is Algonquin in origin, what tribe specifically I do not
know.
northwoods
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Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:11:05 -0600
From: "northwoods" <northwoods@ez-net.com>
Subject: MtMan-List: fur trade book
Not much been going on here the last few days it seems, so I figure i'll
share a couple things I got put on to last week. One is
www.heritagebooks.com . This company is in the business of taking old out of
print books that have historical interest adn re-publishing them. A friend
gave me one of there catalogs and I found an several books that I added to
my library. One was vol. 19 of WI Histroical Collections that includes "the
Mackinac Register" which is a lsit of some of the marriges, births, and
deaths from 1695-1821 on the island. Another is "A WI Fur Traders Journal,
1804-05" which is a journal written by Francois Victor Malhiot, a French
Canadian. He was placed in charge of a post in northern Wi on Lac De
Flambeau (Northwest Co) and wintered there more than one winter. It details
the problems he encountered with a rival company (XY), drunkeness among
traders and natives, transportaiton opf goods, and a lot of information that
isn't contained in many journals like how he had tooth problems and other
illnesses, and how he felt about the isolation and lonliness. Following the
text are his records of invoices and other memoranda. It's all there,
everything he brought in, everything he traded for, everything he gave away
to natives, very interesting, a lot of info....
Last but not least the book includes letters pertaining to the great lakes
fur trade 1778-1815. Documents consist principally of business and friendly
letters, official manuscripts, liscences, territorial regulations, and the
like. They provide a lot of insight into how the great corporations were
organized and managed.
This is just a great book! I should mention that rather than order the
reprint I looked on a used book search and found an original copy for the
same money as the reprint (as I did with all of the titles that I found in
the catalog that I wanted).
Heritage books has many many other interesing books and CD roms on history,
hope someone else can find some usefull info....
northwoods
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Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 09:24:06 -0500
From: "John Hunt" <jhunt1@one.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Uncommon things that WERE common
Glenn, Most of the uncommon things that you listed are the common at most if
not all AMM camps. Search out some members of the AMM and make friends. Most
AMM members don`t go bragging about being members. Gotta corner`em, then ask
if members. then they will answer you. Most are very friendly types. After
getting yourself and camp correct to their acceptance then they will invite
you to spend time with them as a guest and the uncommon becomes quite the
common. Though I`m not an AMM member I have spent time in several of their
camps and was made to feel like one of them.
One mention, the meat cooking on a vertical stick, you have never had good
eat`in till you`ve par tak`in of hump ribs cooked in this way. You`s tongue
will beat yo brain out try`in to get mo.
I would also like to suggest to all that are SERIOUS students of the fur
trade to subscribe to the AMM publication "The Tomahawk and Longrifle"
Subscription info. is in muzzleloader mag. and others. If you can not find
info ask on this list and you will recieve many answers how to subscribe.
John (BIG JOHN) Hunt
Longhunter
Mountainman
southwest Ohio
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Glenn Darilek <llsi@texas.net>
To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2000 2:12 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: Uncommon things that WERE common
> A while ago there was a little discussion on these pages about the
> anachronisms found at modern rendezvous. The other side to this
> discussion is "What was common at the fur trade rendezvous, but is now
> uncommon at buckskinning rendezvous."
>
> Of course, there are things that are not practical at modern rendezvous
> such as hundreds of horses and mules, saddles, beaver pelts, buffalo
> robes, etc. But to enliven the discussion, here is my list of things
> that were common, at least at some rendezvous, but are uncommon at the
> rendezvous of today. I invite others to comment and add to this list:
>
> * Wood sapling tripods over fires with a camp kettle hanging
>
> * Meat cooking near a fire on sticks stuck vertically in the ground
>
> * Hunters sack caps - these have been discussed on these pages
>
> * People sitting/ reclining on the ground
>
> * People sitting around a blanket to eat
>
> * Meat racks for jerking meat
>
> * Feathers in hats
>
> * Teepees with the bottoms of the opening unattached, with the edges
> folded back for easy access
>
> * "Jumping and wrestling"
>
> YMOS
> Glenn Darilek
> Iron Burner
>
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> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
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Date: 31 Mar 2000 07:02:16 -0800
From: Buck Conner <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Uncommon things that WERE common
On Fri, 31 March 2000, "John Hunt" wrote:
>
> Glenn, Most of the uncommon things that you listed are the common at most if
> not all AMM camps.............
> > Of course, there are things that are not practical at modern rendezvous such as horses and mules, saddles, beaver pelts, buffalo robes, etc. But to enliven the discussion, here is my list of things
> > that were common, at least at some rendezvous, but are uncommon at the.............
> > Glenn Darilek
> > Iron Burner
> >
> > ----------------------
John,
What was listed as uncommon by Glen, sounds like our usual AMM party camp here in Colorado, your point about the AMM is true John, very few are left with the chip on their shoulder, all that I know are good men - willing to help if asked.
Later
Buck Conner
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~ http://pages.about.com/buckconner ~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"meat's not meat until it's in the pan"
Aux Aliments de Pays!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:06:34 -0700
From: Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: saddles/mecate
John Funk,
I don't know how far back the "macarthy" goes. I know the spaniards that first
inhabited the plains as half-man half-horse got their horse savvy from their
ancestors, the moors. Those moors were nothing more than conquering arabians
and they'd been around horses since the pyramids were nothin' but sand-dunes. I
guess you could search it out if you were really interested. As for it being
period, hell yes! You're over there in Californiy, hie ye to a local mission
and look at the library and pictures of the californios gear. Any kind of loop
thru a hosses mouth is period according to the native way of thinkin.
BTW I read about war bridles just this past week. Did you know that when the
war-bridle was passed between the upper lip and the gums and tightened aroudn
the poll it causes endorphines to release into the animals brain and calms him
down? That's why they were used on raids, bridle up wait til the internal drugs
kicks in and sneak outta enemy camp. Slick. Gotta give it to them old fellers,
they knew where all the hole cards were.
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Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:29:17 -0500
From: "John Hunt" <jhunt1@one.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Uncommon things that WERE common
Buck
It sounds as if the western camps and the eastern differ very little. The
biggest difference I think would be the number of horses. Most but not all
camps have some horses there. Their is one fellow "Ramrod" Who was in the
Doc Newell party who moved into the New England area. He still comes back to
this area to make camp, and trailers his horse "Blackie" back with him.
There are several animals in this area that are known as well or better than
their owner. Another is Hanna a mule from southeast Ohio, who`s owner is a
Doc Newell member.
Making camp with Dennis, Ramrod and many others is an education in each
camp. There is the usual BS. "Yeah I know no BS. in the west" (GGG) stories,
documentation advise on gear and questions all happen at the camps that I`ve
been a guest at.
AT NO TIME WAS ANY CRITICISM GIVEN WITHOUT MY ASKING. Advise was given upon
asking on how to get myself and gear closer to AMM acceptance standards. At
one camp a friend and myself were shown how to twist and make cordage by a
man named Tom "sorry I don`t remember his last name". Upon leaving each camp
I take with me a bit of new knowledge which was shared by an AMM member, and
much friendship.
At times there has been mention of an AMM member being "uppity" I have NEVER
seen this. To those who have seen the uppities maybe express the desire to
obtain more knowledge would make them less aloft to you. If someone gives
the impression of too much "know-it-all", That would distance you from them.
The above is my opinion and what I have seen with my own eyes and
experienced first hand. I`m sure some of you will disagree on opinions. It`s
your rite. Just respect mine.
Nuff sed
John (BIG JOHN) Hunt
Longhunter
Mountainman
southwest Ohio
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Buck Conner <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Friday, March 31, 2000 7:03 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Uncommon things that WERE common
> On Fri, 31 March 2000, "John Hunt" wrote:
>
> >
> > Glenn, Most of the uncommon things that you listed are the common at
most if
> > not all AMM camps.............
>
> > > Of course, there are things that are not practical at modern
rendezvous such as horses and mules, saddles, beaver pelts, buffalo robes,
etc. But to enliven the discussion, here is my list of things
> > > that were common, at least at some rendezvous, but are uncommon at
the.............
> > > Glenn Darilek
> > > Iron Burner
> > >
> > > ----------------------
> John,
>
> What was listed as uncommon by Glen, sounds like our usual AMM party camp
here in Colorado, your point about the AMM is true John, very few are left
with the chip on their shoulder, all that I know are good men - willing to
help if asked.
>
>
> Later
> Buck Conner
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> ~~ http://pages.about.com/buckconner ~~
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> "meat's not meat until it's in the pan"
> Aux Aliments de Pays!
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
>
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Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:10:32 -0500
From: hawknest4@juno.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: kinninik
On Thu, 30 Mar 2000 18:03:59 -0600 "Frank Fusco" <frankf@centurytel.net>
writes:
One day I was stopped by an Indiana State Trooper. He
> got a
> very puzzled look on his face and inquired about what kind of
> "tobacco" I
> was smoking.
Frank "Bearclaw" Fusco, Mountain Home, Arkansas
them troopers are funny like that---had the same thing happen in
arkansas---with a state trooper---and the mixture was laying on the dash
along with my pipe and bag----I was dressed in costume????-he got me out
of the car and had me sit in the back seat of his while he did his little
test on my pipe---and the mixture---then apoligized to me and sent me on
my way---I even invited him to the muzzel shoot and he did show
up------it was the saunders shoot in berryville---he forgot i was going
too fast and sent me on my way with a warning to keep my foot out of
it---
"HAWK"
Michael Pierce
854 Glenfield Dr. (Home of "Old Grizz" products) (C)
Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
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Date: 31 Mar 2000 08:53:37 -0800
From: Buck Conner <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Uncommon things that WERE common
On Fri, 31 March 2000, "John Hunt" wrote:
> It sounds as if the western camps and the eastern differ very little. The biggest difference I think would be the number of horses.............
I READ AN ARTICLE IN ONE OF THE HORSE MAGAZINES A YEAR AGO THAT THERE ARE MORE HORSES NOW (MAIL-IN SURVEY) THAN THERE WHERE IN THE 1850'S IN NORTH AMERICA. I KNOW OUT HERE IF THERES AVAILABLE GROUND, SEEMS TO BE SOME ANIMALS GRAZING ON IT, HORSES, CATTLE, BUFFALO.
> Making camp with Dennis, Ramrod and many others is an education in each camp......
DENNIS MILES IS A TREAT IN HIMSELF, ALWAYS HAS SOMETHING GOING ON.
> one camp a friend and myself were shown how to twist and make cordage by a man named Tom "sorry I don`t remember his last name". Upon leaving each camp I take with me a bit of new knowledge...........
THAT'S THE WAY IT SHOULD BE - A LEARNING EXPERIENCE FOR EVERYONE.
> If someone gives the impression of too much "know-it-all", That would distance you from them.....
THE BEST WAY TO HANDLE THEM, WALK AWAY.
> Nuff sed
>
> John (BIG JOHN) Hunt
THANKS FOR SHARING YOUR EXPERIENCES JOHN, THERE'S BAD AND GOOD IN ALL GROUPS - HOPEFULLY EVERYONE HAS THE KIND OF EXPERIENCES YOU HAVE HAD.
Later
Buck Conner
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~ http://pages.about.com/buckconner ~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"meat's not meat until it's in the pan"
Aux Aliments de Pays!
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