"Knowing how is just the beginning"<BR></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 08:02:56 -0600
From: "Frank Fusco" <frankf@centurytel.net>
Subject: MtMan-List: period correctness
Those who write that such and such probably was not present at pre-1840
Rvou's and, therefore, should not be at present day gatherings are often
missing the point, at least as I see it.
I believe that we, as present day imitators of the lifestyle, are
(usually) doing our best to preserve the best of that era of American
history.
If we were to exclude those who need and wear eyeglasses our numbers
would drop dramatically and probably be limited to those under 30 years of
age. My belief is that there were far more smooth bores in use by mountain
trappers than current lore would lead us to believe. After all, there were
no handy optometrist shops every half mile along the trails. Rifles would
have been almost impossible for many to use.
To be more 'authentic' we should probably exclude white women and
children from our gatherings. Of course, that would guarantee that
appreciation for our history would be denied future generations also.
How many take necessary medication daily while at r'vouz? To be
authentic one should leave all modern medicines at home. After all, disease
and early death were 'authentic' back then. As was infection, gangrene and
so on.
Most of us do our best to preserve the period and respectful debate
about correctness of the times we recreate is fine and necessary.
However, in my humble opinion, rude nit-pickers should please camp
downwind and downstream and stay away from my camp. Friendly debaters
welcome.
Frank "Bearclaw" Fusco, Mountain Home, Arkansas
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Date: 2 Mar 2000 06:28:51 -0800
From: Buck Conner <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: TEST
On Thu, 02 March 2000, "D Miles" wrote:
>
> Just checking
>
>
> "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
> DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
> Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
> http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
> "Knowing how is just the beginning"
Received your test brother, what's up, busy here - coming in to work at 3:30am getting out at 6pm all this week and last week.
Have you finished my folder yet ???
Later
Buck Conner
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~ http://pages.about.com/buckconner ~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"meat's not meat until it's in the pan"
Aux Aliments de Pays!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
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Date: 2 Mar 2000 06:47:26 -0800
From: Buck Conner <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: documentation for both flour, and blue willow ware.
On Thu, 02 March 2000, Lee Newbill wrote:
>
>
>
> On Thu, 2 Mar 2000, Lee Newbill wrote:
> > Did I not read that Henry the Younger gave his men heading into the
> > interior each a small bag of cornmeal?
>
> I stand corrected....
>
> May 1st, 1814...provisions for twelve days... beef,
> pork, flour, corn, peas, rum, etc.
>
> No corn meal.
>
Lee,
I'm at work and do not have acces to my edibles files on corn meal, etc.
While we're looking at foods again, how about "buckeyes" Aesculus (North American type), you know - the shiny brown nuts. Think we did the bit on leaching to remove acidy taste, was thinking on the lines of other uses for food than edible.
Example the "buckeye" nut, read that many of the native americans as well as some frontiersmen carried then as an alarm system. Grist or Boone would put them in a dirt bank, set a pair from 4-6 inches apart and do several sets. Then set up their camp some ways off, the idea was locals - friendly or not would take this arrangement for the eyes of deer and make noise shooting at their target alerting the one that set the alarm system.
Have read of using flour at night spread on the ground to track an animal that had been raiding a supply cache. I'm sure others on the list have similiar information to share.
Later
Buck Conner
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~ http://pages.about.com/buckconner ~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"meat's not meat until it's in the pan"
Aux Aliments de Pays!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
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Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 08:05:24 -0800
From: bcunningham@gwe.net (Bill Cunningham)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
In either 1986 or 1987, the museum of the fur trade quarterly had a
definitive article on tobacco and cigarettes. You can get a reprint by
contacting the museum. Just yesterday I ran across a letter I got from
Charles Hanson giving me permission to reprint that very article. I don't
think I ever did, but it was nice of him.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Poorboy <poorboy@ieway.com>
To: hist_text@xmission.com <hist_text@xmission.com>
Date: Wednesday, March 01, 2000 7:00 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
>As I explained in a previous post I have spent considerable time and am
>still researching all of the archived material from this list, however I
>have several questions that I have been unable to answer as of yet. If I
>have overlooked previously posted information on these topics please excuse
>my clumsiness.
>1. A recent posting indicated that fur hats were probably not correct for
>pre-1840 RMFT rendezvous. And a respondent indicated that this had been a
>topic of discussion before. I have been unable to locate that discussion.
>It has always been my understanding having been brought up by an AMM member
>that beaver fur was money and would only be used for something else in an
>emergency. However, since we accept that the mountaineers adopted Indian
>dress (whether of need or desire is another issue) and Indians used the
>natural furs available for head coverings, clothing, household utensils
etc.
>Isn't it a little difficult to make the statement that the Rocky Mountain
>trappers and traders did not utilize fur head coverings.....
>2. Eye glasses were definitely available in the settlements, and although
I
>will accept they may not have been common in the mountains, it is a reach
to
>assume that no one wore a pair west, nor took a spare pair or two, and
would
>have been so clumsy as to have lost or destroyed all of them. I will admit
>that a person needing glasses who either could not get them, or having lost
>possession of them would soon become victim to either enemies of animals
due
>to lack of accuracy in shooting or not seeing there enemies approach. I
>also believe that a person of only slight vision problems would attach
>himself to a group so as to compensate for this inadequacy.
>3. As there is a large contingent within the ranks that support the
>southwest influence within the RMFT I ask the following question. It was
>common practice to smoke cigarettes rolled in corn husks in the southwest.
>Can anyone provide me with information concerning the preparation and use
of
>the husk material, ie.. how to keep it rolled up once you have successfully
>rolled a cigarette. size of cigarettes, and appropriateness to the RMFT
>era.
>Thank you in advance for you time and knowledge. I could not read in a
>lifetime enough books to compile the gathered and documented knowledge of
>this lists members.
>
>
>
>----------------------
>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
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Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:07:34 -0500
From: "D Miles" <deforge1@bright.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: TEST
busy here - coming in to work at 3:30am getting out at 6pm all this week and
last week.
>>Keeps you off the streets....it's good for you..
Have you finished my folder yet ???
>>I put the tiwaneese one back together and I have the blade for the new one
done...You in a hurry?<G>
D
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Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 08:36:08 -0800
From: "DRB Hays" <bestrong@cmc.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: period correctness
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Fusco" <frankf@centurytel.net>
To: "MM" <hist_text@xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2000 6:02 AM
Subject: MtMan-List: period correctness
> about correctness of the times we recreate is fine and necessary.
> However, in my humble opinion, rude nit-pickers should please camp
> downwind and downstream and stay away from my camp. Friendly debaters
> welcome.
> Frank "Bearclaw" Fusco, Mountain Home, Arkansas
Amen, and aaaamen.
35 years of buckskins and blackpowder. the only people i have ever
grown to dislike are the "history police".
doc
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Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 08:36:08 -0800
From: "DRB Hays" <bestrong@cmc.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: period correctness
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Fusco" <frankf@centurytel.net>
To: "MM" <hist_text@xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2000 6:02 AM
Subject: MtMan-List: period correctness
> about correctness of the times we recreate is fine and necessary.
> However, in my humble opinion, rude nit-pickers should please camp
> downwind and downstream and stay away from my camp. Friendly debaters
> welcome.
> Frank "Bearclaw" Fusco, Mountain Home, Arkansas
Amen, and aaaamen.
35 years of buckskins and blackpowder. the only people i have ever
grown to dislike are the "history police".
doc
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:50:40 -0700
From: Joe Brandl <jbrandl@wyoming.com>
Subject: MtMan-List: shelters
I am going to construct with the local scouts some canvas shelters. I
want them to pitch them as a diamond shelter. What sizes do you
recomend. I have my ideas, but want to hear others. The holes will be
hand sewn for groments.
Thanks
Joe
ps bout enough on dutch oven, heh
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Date: 2 Mar 2000 08:55:13 -0800
From: Buck Conner <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
On Thu, 02 March 2000, Bill Cunningham wrote:
>
> In either 1986 or 1987, the museum of the fur trade quarterly had a definitive article on tobacco and cigarettes. You can get a reprint by contacting the museum. Just yesterday I ran across a letter I got from
> Charles Hanson giving me permission to reprint that very article. I don't
> think I ever did, but it was nice of him.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Bill,
Those that never talked to Charlie or had any dealings with him, will never know what a resource he was, his knowledge and Marie's is endless when it came to the Fur Trade in North America and Russia.
When I put together the tradegun information for for the internet, even in poor health - Charlie was available for his thoughts and comments.
The free information that was supplied over the years was endless, no one will ever know how much was spent on the postage alone in answering questions from these two. God Bless them.
Later
Buck Conner
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~ http://pages.about.com/buckconner ~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"meat's not meat until it's in the pan"
Aux Aliments de Pays!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
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Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:19:18 -0800
From: bcunningham@gwe.net (Bill Cunningham)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
Pardner, you got that exactly right - and when I see someone posting
something about Charlie that I take as a pejorative comment, I tend to get a
little cranky. Sure, none of us is infallible, but with his extensive
background, and his willingness to share it, he was less so than most.
Bill
- -----Original Message-----
From: Buck Conner <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Date: Thursday, March 02, 2000 8:55 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
>On Thu, 02 March 2000, Bill Cunningham wrote:
>
>>
>> In either 1986 or 1987, the museum of the fur trade quarterly had a
definitive article on tobacco and cigarettes. You can get a reprint by
contacting the museum. Just yesterday I ran across a letter I got from
>> Charles Hanson giving me permission to reprint that very article. I don't
>> think I ever did, but it was nice of him.
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>Bill,
>Those that never talked to Charlie or had any dealings with him, will never
know what a resource he was, his knowledge and Marie's is endless when it
came to the Fur Trade in North America and Russia.
>
>When I put together the tradegun information for for the internet, even in
poor health - Charlie was available for his thoughts and comments.
>
>The free information that was supplied over the years was endless, no one
will ever know how much was spent on the postage alone in answering
questions from these two. God Bless them.
>
>Later
>Buck Conner
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>~~ http://pages.about.com/buckconner ~~
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>"meat's not meat until it's in the pan"
> Aux Aliments de Pays!
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
>
>----------------------
>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:17:44 -0800
From: "John C. Funk, Jr." <J2Hearts@norcalis.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
>From "Museum of The Fur Trade Quarterly" index,1985-1988, Vol.'s. xxi
through xxiv.
Tobacco box, wood, photo xxiv 2, 7
Tobacco, carrot, photo xxiv 2, 4
Tobacco in the Fur Trade xxiv 2, 2-12
Tobacco, plug, photo xxiv 2, 6
Tobacco twist, photo xxiv 2, 5
John Funk
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Cunningham <bcunningham@gwe.net>
To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2000 8:05 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
> In either 1986 or 1987, the museum of the fur trade quarterly had a
> definitive article on tobacco and cigarettes. You can get a reprint by
> contacting the museum. Just yesterday I ran across a letter I got from
> Charles Hanson giving me permission to reprint that very article. I don't
> think I ever did, but it was nice of him.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Poorboy <poorboy@ieway.com>
> To: hist_text@xmission.com <hist_text@xmission.com>
> Date: Wednesday, March 01, 2000 7:00 PM
> Subject: MtMan-List: Period correctness questions
>
>
> >As I explained in a previous post I have spent considerable time and am
> >still researching all of the archived material from this list, however I
> >have several questions that I have been unable to answer as of yet. If I
> >have overlooked previously posted information on these topics please
excuse
> >my clumsiness.
> >1. A recent posting indicated that fur hats were probably not correct
for
> >pre-1840 RMFT rendezvous. And a respondent indicated that this had been
a
> >topic of discussion before. I have been unable to locate that
discussion.
> >It has always been my understanding having been brought up by an AMM
member
> >that beaver fur was money and would only be used for something else in an
> >emergency. However, since we accept that the mountaineers adopted Indian
> >dress (whether of need or desire is another issue) and Indians used the
> >natural furs available for head coverings, clothing, household utensils
> etc.
> >Isn't it a little difficult to make the statement that the Rocky Mountain
> >trappers and traders did not utilize fur head coverings.....
> >2. Eye glasses were definitely available in the settlements, and
although
> I
> >will accept they may not have been common in the mountains, it is a reach
> to
> >assume that no one wore a pair west, nor took a spare pair or two, and
> would
> >have been so clumsy as to have lost or destroyed all of them. I will
admit
> >that a person needing glasses who either could not get them, or having
lost
> >possession of them would soon become victim to either enemies of animals
> due
> >to lack of accuracy in shooting or not seeing there enemies approach. I
> >also believe that a person of only slight vision problems would attach
> >himself to a group so as to compensate for this inadequacy.
> >3. As there is a large contingent within the ranks that support the
> >southwest influence within the RMFT I ask the following question. It was
> >common practice to smoke cigarettes rolled in corn husks in the
southwest.
> >Can anyone provide me with information concerning the preparation and use
> of
> >the husk material, ie.. how to keep it rolled up once you have
successfully
> >rolled a cigarette. size of cigarettes, and appropriateness to the RMFT
> >era.
> >Thank you in advance for you time and knowledge. I could not read in a
> >lifetime enough books to compile the gathered and documented knowledge of
> >this lists members.
> >
> >
> >
> >----------------------
> >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
> >
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
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