This is no documentation, but I was once told by the Rep. for Comoy & Co., a
maker of pewter flasks, that the same things that will screw up your cast
iron (acidic foods and/or liquids) will also leach bad things out of both
copper and pewter. I guess this would include any tomato or alcohol based
products. A pewter flask comes with a warning not to leave alcoholic
contents in for more than 12 hours, and tomato sauce will kill the seasoning
in a cask iron piece of cookware. Personal experience has confirmed that
both of these are true. Barn
------------------------------
Date: 30 Sep 1999 10:49:16 -0700
From: Buck <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: amounts of food needed (while in camp).
On Wed, 29 September 1999, R Lahti wrote:
>
> > Cap,
> > I usually figure a cupped hand-full of:
> >
> > corn meal (per person)mixed with Hanava sugar,
> > wild rice (same measurement per person),
> > barley-pearled (same measurement per person),
> > split peas (same measurement per person),
> > fruit [dried apples or peaches](same measurement per person),
> > dried meat strips broken into 3" pieces (same measurement per person),
> > parched corn w/local nuts (same measurement per person),
> > tea (same measurement per person, lasts for 3-4 days) a little on the weak side last day.
> > _____________________________
> >
> > This has worked for a 5 day outing, moving around camp, scouting, etc. but only lasts about 3 hard days of paddling (hard work will use up your supplies very fast).
> > _____________________________
>
> Buck,
>
> That's a bit more varied a list of ingredients that I or my fellows
> carry. Might we impose on you as to how you utilize those items in meals
> over the course of a weekend or week's period of time, as in recipe's
> and for which meals and how many meals, etc.? I remain....
>
> YMOS
> Capt. Lahti'
______________________________________________
Cap.,
Lets start with the measurement for a "cupped hand-full"
= ( 1) measuring cup.
This doesn't sound like much, I agree, but remember most dried edibles do swell when water is added. Rice, barley and peas will double in size or amount prepared.
Most of us (not all) can go with less food from a few days to several weeks without any problem - doctors will tell you that the amount we eat regularly is a mind-set in most cases, we can do with less and would probably do better weight and health wise anyway.
We try to eat two small regular meals daily, gathering or foraging for edibles in our short trips around camp when scouting game or looking at the area. When you get in a mind-set of watching for edibles as you make your scouts, it's surprising what you find, even if not hunting for squirrel, rabbits or flying foul. Wild edibles are everwhere it's just the problem of figuring out what your looking at.
Working around water is always a good place for small plants that are edible, as well as the little crawl fish, fish and small animals getting a drink. I think you are getting the idea or already do this in your normal outing experiences.
I have a good friend that I wrote an article about a few years ago in the T&LR journal Dr. Jerry LaVelle, he's an expert at foraged edibles in the Rockies, takes a small frying pan, buffalo grease, period fishing kit and he's off for the weekend. His wife gets a little rattled about his limited resources, but he uses what is available at hand, cat-tail flour for bread (bannock), has different plant leaves for a salad and so on, she's good for about two weekends like this a year. But it can be done, so she goes to prove that she's a tough as he is !!!! I wish I had the mind-set, the ability or guts to believe enough in myself to do this as much as he has.
Morning meal:
corn meal w/Havana Brown sugar,(Havana Brown is an old sugar [less costly than white sugar in the colonial days] have switch to blue corn - better taste) 1/2 cup per person with water, a few small pieces of fruit and small amount of tea (save the tea leaves), (forgot to put down two hand-fulls of corn flour last night), use a 1/2 cup per person of flour to make "bannock" bread (will produce a loaf per say the size of a regular hot dog). Surprisingly this will satisfy you, no matter what your brain says.
Aftrenoon snack:
some parched corn, a little fruit and whatever you may find in your travels.
Evening meal:
with a little testing you will be able to judge the amount of rice or barley needed to make a small portion, and not waste anything. We have used mixed small amount of wild rice, barley-pearled, split peas and a little jerky (changing the meal of one or two items) to make a stew, make with a little more water than what your wife would use - fills you up with the broth. Use your used tea leaves for a mild tea flavor. Use any left overs and try and eat late in the evening (going to bed on a full belly).
Don't forget what you have foraged during the day that can be prepared to supplement your evening or morning meal. Our biggest problem seems to be mind-set that we are going to starve, hell you'll die from lack of water long before you'll starve.
An old friend (in his mid 70s') had a heart attack, had been very active all his farming life, he refused any medical care when he found it was possible he would not walk again, his doctor respected his wishes and had him taken home. I would visit him in the evenings, he refused food and liquids and it took him 14 days to die. The lack of liquid is what shut him down, he only lost a few pounds in that period.
So the chance of you doing great harm on a weekend or a week from the lack of food is really not a major problem according to most doctors, unless you have medical problems, special medication, etc. that may require you to use with food.
But do make sure you keep liquids in your system, plus a good drank of water is some what filling by it's self.
This all sounds great, right. Well it's easier to write or tell it - than when packing for that adventure, you'll find yourself cheating and adding this and that - just in case. You'll stop and think and remember that first hunting trip (a day long) and all the extra stuff you took that Dad told you wasn't needed, well just in case.
The big thing Cap. is do some testing the night the wife had to work late, make up a meal, simple - small in amount, bottom line is testing brother. With your experience you'll have know problem, it's just that mind-set that we all fight with. I'm always packing and unpacking different amounts, if you take just so much - small amount of food, and leave out "the just in case" factor. Then your options are get along with what you got and start foraging.
I wrote Bill Klesinger (web master) for the Jim Baker Party web site, and he will put that article on "Edibles of the Rockies" on the site this weekend if everything goes OK. This may give you some ideas about foraging and what the wild plants have to offer each and everyone of us.
Keep in touch friends.
Later,
Buck Conner
AMM Jim Baker Party Colorado
Aux Ailments de Pays!
_____________________________
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 13:56:34 EDT
From: BarneyPFife@aol.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bacon ? (and food at rendezvous)
In a message dated 9/30/1999 2:35:54 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
sabella3@earthlink.net writes:
> I think too it might depend on how large your hand it...mine is
small...even
> I'd starve to death if I had to use that as a measure..
sounds like time for the old rationing trick: 1 for me, 1 for you, 2 for me,
1 for you, 3 for me, 1 for you..... <ggg> Barn.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 14:02:59 EDT
From: ThisOldFox@aol.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On Copper Trade Pots
> There ought to be someone on this list who could tell us if it's the copper
> or the stuff it gets soldered together with that makes the difference eh?
Any time a base metal and an acid are combined, you will get water and the
salt of the metal.
Almost all copper salts are harmful to man. Remember, they put copper
sulphate in ponds to kill the fish. Same goes for any lead content in pewter.
The green buildup you get on copper, aka verdigris, is poisonous. Copper
water pipes don't form these salts unless an acid is run through them. The
lead you get from the solder is free lead, which is also harmful. Heavy
metals tend to accumulate in the body over time. Usually small intermittent
exposures won't cause any harm, but repeated exposure will.
Dave Kanger
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 14:17:50 -0500
From: "Texan" <texan@cowtown.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On Copper Trade Pots
I believe that I have mentioned once before
that I am a medical/biochemistry researcher.
I'm also a health consultant.
All my new clients get a screening for metal toxicity.
Metal toxicity is rampant nowdays. Unless
a person is fortunate to get the right kind of testing
and ACCURATE interpretation of those test results, they
can be diagnosed as being a hypochondriac, having
arthritis, or having many other common conditions such as
heart problems, and even psychological problems. (Metal
toxicity disrupts brain chemistry).
The question is..... with exposure to copper, lead, mercury,
chemicals etc.-"why aren't we all dead?" Some people are.
You can have two people exposed to the same environmemt,
one becomes ill with metal or chemical toxicity, the other one does fine.
The difference lies in the individual's ability to detoxify and
excrete the toxic substance. Diet, nutritional status, genetic inheritance,
stress, health of the liver and immune system-all are important
factors in how the body will deal with toxic exposures.
Along with this discussion on copper is the issue
of lead contamination with those of you all that "live" with your
guns, especially those who were/are in the military.
Lead, along with other heavy metals, is a cumulative posion
that is retained in the body. Even at low levels, lead that is
not excreted through the digestive system accumlates in the
body and is absorbed directly from the blood into other tissues,
there to do damage--sublty and insidiously.
Children are at especial risk. They absorb 25 to 40 percent more
lead per pound of body weight than adults. What would be a "safe"
exposure for adults would be dangerous for children. Also, the body
cannot distinguish between calcium and lead. Once lead enters the body,
it is assimilated in the same manner as calcium. Those with calcium
and iron deficiencies have been shown to be more suspceptible
in accumulating lead in their tissues. An iron deficiency can be
indicative of lead contamination.
I will waive my normal consulting fee ($75.00 an hour) for those
on the list who would like a heavy metal screening which includes
screening for toxic levels of minerals. There would only be the
lab charge. This is my contribution to my new "family".
Contact me off list at vapate@juno.com
Thanks,
Victoria
------------------------------
Date: 30 Sep 1999 12:32:27 -0700
From: Buck <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: screening for metal toxicity[OFF TOPIC]
> Along with this discussion on copper is the issue
> of lead contamination with those of you all that "live" with your guns, especially those who were/are in the military.
> Lead, along with other heavy metals, is a cumulative posion that is retained in the body. Even at low levels, lead that is not excreted through the digestive system accumlates in the body and is absorbed directly from the blood into other tissues, there to do damage--sublty and insidiously.
> I will waive my normal consulting fee ($75.00 an hour) for those on the list who would like a heavy metal screening which includes screening for toxic levels of minerals. There would only be the lab charge. This is my contribution to my new "family".
> Contact me off list at vapate@juno.com
>
> Thanks,
> Victoria
_______________________________________
This is probably considered OFF TOPIC, STOP right there. OUR lives - today are as important as the facts of history. AND we are involved in a sport that has allot to due with this subject, don't e-mail yet. LEAD BALLS friends, melting, casting and just plain handling, we are touching lead that is harmful to our systems. NOT CRYING WOLF.
But wouldn't it be useful to find more out about possible problems, preventives or possible tests to see where you, me or a friend is at as far as amounts we already have.
Victoria, what is involved in testing, what dangers are we possibly looking at, etc. How would someone half way around the world be tested that is not able to afford travel or has the time to do so. You got our attention, probably most have been aware of it, just didn't bother to really go any further than close the book the article was in.
Later,
Buck Conner
AMM Jim Baker Party Colorado
Aux Ailments de Pays!
_____________________________
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: 30 Sep 1999 12:57:09 -0700
From: turtle@uswestmail.net
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: screening for metal toxicity[OFF TOPIC]
Hey you got my attention, please tell us more Victoria.
Turtle.
- -------------------------------------
On Thu, 30 September 1999, Buck wrote:
>
> > Along with this discussion on copper is the issue
> > of lead contamination with those of you all that "live" with your guns, especially those who were/are in the military.
> > Lead, along with other heavy metals, is a cumulative posion that is retained in the body. Even at low levels, lead that is not excreted through the digestive system accumlates in the body and is absorbed directly from the blood into other tissues, there to do damage--sublty and insidiously.
> > I will waive my normal consulting fee ($75.00 an hour) for those on the list who would like a heavy metal screening which includes screening for toxic levels of minerals. There would only be the lab charge. This is my contribution to my new "family".
> > Contact me off list at vapate@juno.com
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Victoria
> _______________________________________
>
> This is probably considered OFF TOPIC, STOP right there. OUR lives - today are as important as the facts of history. AND we are involved in a sport that has allot to due with this subject, don't e-mail yet. LEAD BALLS friends, melting, casting and just plain handling, we are touching lead that is harmful to our systems. NOT CRYING WOLF.
>
> But wouldn't it be useful to find more out about possible problems, preventives or possible tests to see where you, me or a friend is at as far as amounts we already have.
>
> Victoria, what is involved in testing, what dangers are we possibly looking at, etc. How would someone half way around the world be tested that is not able to afford travel or has the time to do so. You got our attention, probably most have been aware of it, just didn't bother to really go any further than close the book the article was in.
>
>
> Later,
> Buck Conner
>
> AMM Jim Baker Party Colorado
> Aux Ailments de Pays!
> _____________________________
>
> Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
Take care - we leave as friends,
Lee "Turtle" Boyer
Historical Advisor - Parks & Rec.
State College, Pennsylvania
___________________________
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 14:21:02 -0600
From: agottfre@telusplanet.net (Angela Gottfred)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On Copper Trade Pots
IF I recall correctly, the problem with copper is that acetic acid (as in
vinegar, tomato juice, orange juice, etc.) reacts with the copper to form
verdigris, which is poisonous. It's the blue/green "rust" you see on pennies
from time to time. In fact, an interesting experiment is to soak a penny in
vinegar for a bit, drain the vinegar, and presto! Verdigris will form
overnight and possibly sooner.
If it's not tinned, why not just tin the darn thing and put an end to any
concerns? All that's needed is a propane torch, a bar of pure tin, and
Brasso to clean the outside with afterward (heat turns bright copper a dark
reddish color). I'm not speaking as an expert here, but I've watched my
husband do it, and if he can do it, it can't be too tough! ; -) As I
recall, he heats the outside with the propane torch, and rubs the end of the
tin bar around on the inside where it melts. Be careful not to overheat, or
seams may pop open (depends on the construction method, of course).
Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred
agottfre@telusplanet.net
It is startling how much someone who has handled an ax for years can learn
in a millisecond from mishandling an ax. --David Gidmark, _Birchbark Canoe_
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 13:46:23 +0000
From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On Copper Trade Pots
Glenn Darilek wrote:
>
> > Mill, Kirk wrote:
>
> > IF you have a copper cup that is not tinned, I believe there is little
> > danger if any from drinking beverages out of it.
>
> But check it for the blue/green corrosion, which I think is a baddy.
> Anyway, I had two unlined copper mugs and used them for beer and on two
> occasions got
> headaches so severe I didn't want to move.
Glenn,
It wasn't Kirk that said the above but me, but what ever, that isn't
important. Let me take the opportunity to clarify my ideas on this
subject.
Though I have a spun copper mug w/handle, that I have had for years and
have drunk out of for the first years I had it, it is not lined and I
would never cook out of it. I don't like drinking out of it because the
copper transmits heat to my lips too easily and I have to wait for hot
drinks to cool. (I prefer to use a horn cup to drink from.) Because
there are no signs of corrosion and because I am not cooking in it and
because I have never experienced any bad tastes or symptoms it probably
is safe to drink cold liquids from it. Not to cook with though. That is
just to be on the safe side.
I am under the impression that brass pots do not have to be tinned to be
safe to cook in. That may or may not be the case. I will tin mine if I
ever get around to making a pot of brass.
I now use copper pots to cook in and they are tinned. I would not cook
in them if they were not tinned and do not recommend that any cooking be
done in any brass or copper pots unless they are tinned or you know that
it is safe to do so. I don't know so, so I will not do it and will not
recommend it. I remain....
YMOS
Capt. Lahti'
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 14:02:11 +0000
From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: amounts of food needed (while in camp).
Buck wrote:
<snip>
>
> This doesn't sound like much, I agree, but remember most dried edibles do swell when water is added. Rice, barley and peas will double in size or amount prepared.
>
> Most of us (not all) can go with less food from a few days to several weeks without any problem - doctors will tell you that the amount we eat regularly is a mind-set in most cases, we can do with less and would probably do better weight and health wise anyway.<snip>
Buck,
Thanks for the little dissertation. Very useful and I will pass it
around to my Party (lots of guys that like to eat including me <G>). I
hear what you are saying. We do well but we can always learn. You
obviously are doing it better and so I am picking your brain cause it
may be years before we camp together. We all experiment and what I take
has evolved down quit a bit but I can see room for improvement.
What I read in your bill of lading and your recipe's is a list to give
variety but about a 1/2 cup ration per prepared meal, give or take. I'll
work with that and see what I end up with for myself. Thanks again and
know that I'll be back if I can think of any more questions.
I'm looking forward to the article on edibles in the Rockies. I
remain.....
YMOS
Capt. Lahti'
------------------------------
Date: 30 Sep 1999 14:03:56 -0700
From: "Concho" <concho@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: screening for metal toxicity[OFF TOPIC]
OK, it's off topic, casted lead whatevers for ever, now what do I due, not selling the front stuffers. Are there any signs that will tell me I need help ? Keep still Dennis, Buck, Turtle and the Capt.
Concho
____________________________________
> Hey you got my attention, please tell us more Victoria.
>
> Turtle.
> -------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Along with this discussion on copper is the issue
> > > of lead contamination with those of you all that "live" with your guns, especially those who were/are in the military.
> > > Lead, along with other heavy metals, is a cumulative posion that is retained in the body. Even at low levels, lead that is not excreted through the digestive system accumlates in the body and is absorbed directly from the blood into other tissues, there to do damage--sublty and insidiously.
> > > I will waive my normal consulting fee ($75.00 an hour) for those on the list who would like a heavy metal screening which includes screening for toxic levels of minerals. There would only be the lab charge. This is my contribution to my new "family".
> > > Contact me off list at vapate@juno.com
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Victoria
> > _______________________________________
> >
> > This is probably considered OFF TOPIC, STOP right there. OUR lives - today are as important as the facts of history. AND we are involved in a sport that has allot to due with this subject, don't e-mail yet. LEAD BALLS friends, melting, casting and just plain handling, we are touching lead that is harmful to our systems. NOT CRYING WOLF.
> >
> > But wouldn't it be useful to find more out about possible problems, preventives or possible tests to see where you, me or a friend is at as far as amounts we already have.
> >
> > Victoria, what is involved in testing, what dangers are we possibly looking at, etc. How would someone half way around the world be tested that is not able to afford travel or has the time to do so. You got our attention, probably most have been aware of it, just didn't bother to really go any further than close the book the article was in.
> >
> >
> > Later,
> > Buck Conner
__________________________________
"May the spirit be with you"
D.L."Concho" Smith
Livingston, MO.
Historical Coordinator - Missouri
___________________________________
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: 30 Sep 1999 14:17:20 -0700
From: "Concho" <concho@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: amounts of food needed (while in camp).
On Thu, 30 September 1999, R Lahti wrote:
>
> Buck wrote:
> <snip>
> >
> > This doesn't sound like much, I agree, but remember most dried edibles do swell when water is added. Rice, barley and peas will double in size or amount prepared.
> >
> > Most of us (not all) can go with less food from a few days to several weeks without any problem - doctors will tell you that the amount we eat regularly is a mind-set in most cases, we can do with less and would probably do better weight and health wise anyway.<snip>
>
> Buck,
>
> Thanks for the little dissertation. Very useful and I will pass it
> around to my Party (lots of guys that like to eat including me <G>). I
> hear what you are saying. We do well but we can always learn. You
> obviously are doing it better and so I am picking your brain cause it
> may be years before we camp together. We all experiment and what I take
> has evolved down quit a bit but I can see room for improvement.
>
> What I read in your bill of lading and your recipe's is a list to give........................
>
> Capt. Lahti'
Hey Capt.,
Buck is always changing what he takes, check with him in the spring and only a few of these items will remain. The gentleman he mentioned is very good and the Baker Party is lucky to have him around to pick his brain.
The problem I have always had with foraging is what is a good plant and what is one that will make me sick.
Mr. LaVelle was or is President of the Mushroom folks also, lots of knowledge on this subject as well as edibles, ran into him at "Rabbit Stick" last year, really into the Mesa Verta CO people (cliff dwellers), their life styles, etc.
So he's practicing earlier primitive skills than most of us, that's cool, he's building fires with wood drills, we're using flint and steel. reason for mentioning this is I proof read the article that will be on the Baker web site.
"May the spirit be with you"
D.L."Concho" Smith
Livingston, MO.
Historical Coordinator - Missouri
___________________________________
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:17:27 -0700
From: "John Hunt" <jhunt1@one.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bacon ? (and food at rendezvous)
No need to sleep at 1812. Just get out the shine, and put you to
sleepGGGGGGGGGGG
John (BIG JOHN) Hunt
Longhunter
Mountainman
southwest Ohio
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Dennis Miles <deforge1@wesnet.com>
To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 1999 4:06 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bacon ? (and food at rendezvous)
> You tried to kill me you bastard....<GG> You gotta sleep sometime at
1812..
> D
>
> John Hunt wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > CAN`T CHUG MOONSHINE EITHER says Big John
> > <VBGGGG>
> >
>
> --
>
> "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
> DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
> Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
> http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
>
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:39:37 -0700
From: "John Hunt" <jhunt1@one.net>
Subject: MtMan-List: illness from copper pot
In one of the back issues of T&LR as fellow got sick from his copper
pot. He remembered from his military training, took a bone and burned it in
the fire and chared deeply, then ground fine added water and drank it. In a
few hrs. he felt ok.
John (BIG JOHN) Hunt
Longhunter
Mountainman
southwest Ohio
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:58:55 -0400
From: deforge1@wesnet.com (Dennis Miles)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bacon ? (and food at rendezvous)
Fine, but we will sip it FIRST, not LAST....
D
John Hunt wrote:
> No need to sleep at 1812. Just get out the shine, and put you to
> sleepGGGGGGGGGGG
>
> John (BIG JOHN) Hunt
> Longhunter
> Mountainman
> southwest Ohio
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Dennis Miles <deforge1@wesnet.com>
> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 1999 4:06 PM
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bacon ? (and food at rendezvous)
>
> > You tried to kill me you bastard....<GG> You gotta sleep sometime at
> 1812..
> > D
> >
> > John Hunt wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > CAN`T CHUG MOONSHINE EITHER says Big John
> > > <VBGGGG>
> > >
> >
> > --
> >
> > "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
> > DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
> > Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
> > http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
> >
> >
> >
- --
"Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 18:39:46 EDT
From: ThisOldFox@aol.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: amounts of food needed (while in camp).
> I wrote Bill Klesinger (web master) for the Jim Baker Party web site, and
he
> will put that article on "Edibles of the Rockies" on the site this weekend
if
> everything goes OK. This may give you some ideas about foraging and what
the
> wild plants have to offer each and everyone of us.
Buck,
Would like that URL when he gets the info up. There seem to be tolerable few
edibles in the Rockies in the fall, but have never been out there in the
spring or summer. Lots of mast, but a guy would probably be bound up pretty
good from them. Plenty of rabbit and tree rat. Could never get any pine
nuts.....they always seem to beat me to them. Other than that and pine
needle tea, I didn't see much else in the way of plant life a guy could eat
this time of the year.
Your fellow AMM brother,Todd Daggett from back this way did his survival in
Alaska last year in October. A bush pilot dropped him off and he spent a
month with only his gun, blanket and possibles. He took no food with him. I
saw him at Ft. Deschartres in November, so he much have lived but I have'nt
had a chance to talk to him about what he ate. Should be interesting.
Dave Kanger
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 16:27:33 +0000
From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: amounts of food needed (while in camp).
Concho wrote:
>
> Hey Capt.,
>
> Buck is always changing what he takes, check with him in the spring and only a few of these items will remain. The gentleman he mentioned is very good and the Baker Party is lucky to have him around to pick his brain.
Concho,
I'm always looking to pick someone's brain when it comes to food. <G>
Got to remember our bunch lives and wanders in the part of the Rockies
where Lewis and Clark and the Wilson Price Hunt Party (our AMM Party
namesake) dang near starved to death! Finding and figuring out what to
eat out here is fun and a challenge. I'm awaiting further word! I
remain....
YMOS
Capt. Lahti'
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:37:17 -0700
From: "John C. Funk, Jr." <J2Hearts@norcalis.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On Copper Trade Pots
P.S.
Coffee is highly acidic !! As might be tea???
- ----- Original Message -----
From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net>
To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 30, 1999 2:26 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On Copper Trade Pots
> Mill, Kirk wrote:
> Later it was found that it was the copper pot
> > causing the problem. My 2 cents.
>
> Kirk,
>
> Your two cents are worth a million! Beat me to it.
>
> IF you have a copper cup that is not tinned, I believe there is little
> danger if any from drinking beverages out of it. Tomato juice might
> cause a problem but how often does someone drink that at a rendezvous.
> If you are going to cook in an untinned copper container just avoid
> acidic foods. If you experience any bad taste at all just don't do it
> any more. I believe that brass pots do not cause the same concern as a
> cooking vessel but I would want my brass pot tinned just to be safe
> until someone shows me it's ok. I remain........
>
> YMOS
> Capt. Lahti'
>
>
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Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:01:46 -0500
From: "Texan" <texan@cowtown.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: screening for metal toxicity[OFF TOPIC]
Hey guys,
The screening for heavy metals that I can provide for
you all and your families is what is called a hair analysis.
Hair analysis is also used for drug testing. It consists of
analyzing about a tablespoon of hair cut in a very specific way.
For you that don't have head hair, there is only one other
valid hair sample-and.... it's not beard hair.
For those who want the screening , I would send you a little packet
with a form to fill out and instructions for how to cut the hair.
The cutting has to be done just exactly right or the test results
will be skewed. The payment is to be sent directly to the lab
either with a check or credit card. You will be sent a report with
explanations of the tests results, along with nutritional
recommendations. It has been shown that increasing the nutritional
status of the individual causes the body to begin to excrete stored toxins
and change the chemistry so as to support detoxification. I receive what is
called the Doctor's Report (I am not a doctor). Then, we can get
together over the phone (your nickel if long distance) and I can make
further recommendations. I can work with anyone, anywhere.
I can be more specific in my support if I could have a general health
history before we have a consult. I'll go into that more for those who
are serious about this. If I see some red flags, biochemically
speaking, we'll talk about finding a specific kind doctor to do
further testing.
Remember the phrase "Mad as a Hatter?" That was a term that identified
the behaivor of hat makers (in the last century) who used mercury
in the making of hats.
Chronic low levels of toxic metal and chemical exposures are dangerous
because the damage that is being done to the body goes unrecognized
for the most part. Symptoms can be something as innocuous
as just feeling more fatigued or putting on weight and not being able
to get it off. Although I look at the big picture to get an idea of a
person's
health status, I focus on cellular processes. This is the reason.
Any metal or toxin negatively effects the chemistry in the most basic of
ways-that of disrupting protein, lipid (fatty acid), and carbohydrate
metabolism-the basic building blocks of everything else in the body.
You can see that just about any symptom or condition CAN be
caused by chronic low level exposure to a toxic substance.
If I were you all, I would take the most conservative
approach and do the basic screening and see what comes up.
Because the body is forced to deal with this low level toxic exposure, it
has
to get energy from somewhere to do it -so it "steals" biochemical energy
from
the daily "housekeeping" processes of digesting, making
new tissues, breaking down old tissues etc. This is not good!
I'll stop there on the biochemistry part. The whole subject is very complex
and has numerous peripheral issues. The older a person is,
the more important it is to deal with this as quickly as possible.
As far as the prevention, there are ways to reduce exposure to lead.
You might already know what is necessary. You want to err on the side of
being too conservative in your preventive measures. And it is important
to make sure that children are not nearby when you are doing your
lead "stuff".
I hope that answers some questions. I have some general data on lead
toxicity that will benefit all of you all, but I need specific clearance
from Buck
or Dean before I put it on the list. I don't want to get called down when
all I'm wanting to do is help ya'll the best I can.
Victoria
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Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:02:20 -0400
From: deforge1@wesnet.com (Dennis Miles)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: amounts of food needed (while in camp).
Hey Guys,
No-one else has brought it up, but I will Insects and such are a great protien source. And are abundent all but in the dead of Winter.....Don't forget our crawly friends..
D
"Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
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Date: 30 Sep 1999 18:25:46 -0700
From: Buck <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: screening for metal toxicity[OFF TOPIC]
Victoria,
I will contact Dean myself and ask for his permission for you to list the general information, then those interested can contact you off_list for personal needs. This way only those interested in going further will be in contact with you, saving you sometime with e-mail, etc.
Does this seem fair to those on this list, something to consider and a lesson our forefathers didn't know about - lead poisioning and other health problems in reenacting their life styles!!!!
I'll wait until Sunday to see how those interested feel, we'll try and keep this to a min. on the list. E-mail me at buck.conner@uswestmail.net and let me know if we should continue or to drop the subject, the results will be counted at 12 noon mst and I'll either contact Dean or we'll just drop the deal, that seems fair to everyone and keeps traffic down on a [OFF TOPIC] subject.
