> We have tried this method here in the rockies, seems to work fine, but we are dryer than some areas and this may have helped. I used small tin containers (originally had candy in them 30-40 years ago), removed the painted advertising with a small bead blaster and let them bare metal on the outside (have a nice grayish color) tinned the inside like Washington's.
>
> DON'T USE COPPER CONTAINERS - I have done this one and within a few months they turn a nice green and so do your spices. ALSO USE container with rounded corners - helps from cutting through a haversack or bedroll.
>
I believe Buck wrote an article years ago about this in the Buckskin Report, did as he has stated and have had good results Mad Jack, give it a whirl.
I talked to Crosby Brown (MO Historian) he said that small crock jars where used on early wagon trains and several journals state there use as part of the inventory when carried on "red river carts" on several trade routes. I personally like the tin ones Buck mentioned, they are light and don't break.
D. L. Smith
Washington, MO.
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 13:52:32 -0700
From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Storing salt and spices
Back to the original question, if they did cook salt, how did they carry
large amounts of it and keep it semi-dry and usable ?
Pendleton
- -----Original Message-----
From: larry pendleton <yrrw@airmail.net>
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Date: Sunday, August 01, 1999 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Storing salt and spices
>Buck,
> Your right, I seem to remember an artist's rendition of someone cooking
>salt, possibly in Utah. I also read that Lewis and Clark carried a large
>quanity of salt and if memory serves me correctly, they cooked a large
>amount of salt on the west coast. I'm not sure this was a common practice
>with The Rocky Mountain Fur Trappers. Did the traders carry salt to the
>mountains to be traded or sold ? Or did they cook it themselves or just
>made do without it ? I don't know. Me thinks we need more info.
>>On Sun, 01 August 1999, "larry pendleton" wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Bill,
>>> The trappers carried their salt for personal use in horn containers,
>since
>>> these were the only waterproof containers they had. A question I have,
>is
>>> how did the trappers carry larger quanities of salt, such as the amount
>>> needed to supply a whole party ? There are accounts of groups of
>trappers
>>> carrying " gallons " of salt to be used by parties. I am not sure this
>was
>>> a common practice of the mountain men, but it is well documented that
the
>>> longhunters of the 18th century certainly did. The reason I am not
>certain
>>> if the mountain men carried such quanities of salt is that in doing the
>>> reasearch for the sign language tape, I found that according to W. P.
>Clark
>>> the plains Indians did not use salt. In fact the sign for salt is "
>taste ,
>>> bad, white. " Does anyone have any further info ?
>>> Pendleton
>>
>>Larry & Bill,
>>
>>For large quanities I read some where of traders carrying "caked" salt in
>wooden buckets to settlements from the Mississippi River east.
>>
>>Didn't Clymer or another artist do research on the salt operation in
>southern Utah - painted a picture of such activity with whites and Indians,
>cooking salt and salt stored in wooden buckets.
>>
>>In one issue of Muzzleloader there was an article about the salt operation
>in Kent or Virgina, showed a couple of men each carrying wooden buckets on
a
>yoke, I guess they had salt ?
>>
>>
>>Later,
>>Buck Conner
>>dba / Clark & Sons Mercantile, Inc.
>>AMM Jim Baker Party / Colorado Territory
>>_____________________________________
>>Get a subscription to a journal of the fur trade
>>and early history of the times, the one the
>>American Mountain Men read and write:
>>
>>The Tomahawk & Long Rifle * 3483 Squires *
>>Conklin, MI 49403
>>ATTN: Jon Link
>>
>>The subscription for the journal is $20 for a
>>year or $35 for two years. You will receive
>>quarterly issues - Feb, May, Aug, Nov,.
>>_____________________________________
>>
>>
>>
>>Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
>>
>>
>
>
>
------------------------------
Date: 1 Aug 1999 11:48:03 -0700
From: "Concho" <concho@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Storing salt and spices
> Didn't Clymer or another artist do research on the salt operation in southern Utah - painted a picture of such activity with whites and Indians, cooking salt and salt stored in wooden buckets.
Yes, John Clymer's work "Salt Flats" or something close to that shows what is stated.
D. L. Smith
Washington, MO.
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 13:57:33 -0700
From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Storing salt and spices
Ok guys, looks like I'm lagging behind on this subject. Is Buck saying that
they carried large amounts of salt in tin containers ?
Pendleton
- -----Original Message-----
From: larry pendleton <yrrw@airmail.net>
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Date: Sunday, August 01, 1999 11:47 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Storing salt and spices
>Back to the original question, if they did cook salt, how did they carry
>large amounts of it and keep it semi-dry and usable ?
> Back to the original question, if they did cook salt, how did they carry
> large amounts of it and keep it semi-dry and usable ?
> Pendleton
> >>For large quanities I read some where of traders carrying "caked" salt in
> >wooden buckets to settlements from the Mississippi River east.
> >southern Utah - painted a picture of such activity with whites
>>and Indians, cooking salt and salt stored in wooden buckets.
> >in Kent or Virgina, showed a couple of men each carrying
>>wooden buckets on a yoke, I guess they had salt ?
> >>
Larry,
I think Buck answered it "WOODEN BUCKETS" and it would be "CAKED" - not sure how you would go about doing this operation, unless just adding moisture to the top layer with water ?
What do you think !
D. L. Smith
Washington, MO.
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------------------------------
Date: 1 Aug 1999 12:08:00 -0700
From: "Buck" <buck.conner@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
> On Sun, 01 August 1999, "larry pendleton" wrote:
>
> Dennis,
>
> You and I barefaced, that is a mental image I can do without. <G>
>
> Pendleton
>
> From: Dennis Miles <deforge1@wesnet.com>
> All this straight razor talk is almost enough to make me want to take up shaving again...
>
> Imagine me with no hair at all on my face.. A pretty sight to behold, one of near Angelic perfection, if I do say so myself..<G>
>
> D
Well boys,
Turtle just wrote me off_list, see his reply:
>
>Buck,
>These two are like the old joke about, "if my dog looked like that I'd
>shave his butt and making them walk backwards."
>
>Turtle.
Later,
Buck Conner
dba / Clark & Sons Mercantile, Inc.
AMM Jim Baker Party / Colorado Territory
_____________________________________
Get a subscription to a journal of the fur trade
and early history of the times, the one the
American Mountain Men read and write:
The Tomahawk & Long Rifle * 3483 Squires *
Conklin, MI 49403
ATTN: Jon Link
The subscription for the journal is $20 for a
year or $35 for two years. You will receive
quarterly issues - Feb, May, Aug, Nov,.
_____________________________________
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 15:18:44 -0400
From: deforge1@wesnet.com (Dennis Miles)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
> Well now, Ain't that some....Shaaame on you Turtle...For Shaaame...
> And behind our backs on top of that.....Tsk..Tsk...
D
> Well boys,
>
> Turtle just wrote me off_list, see his reply:
> >
> >Buck,
> >These two are like the old joke about, "if my dog looked like that I'd
> >shave his butt and making them walk backwards."
> >
> >Turtle.
>
> Later,
> Buck Conner
> dba / Clark & Sons Mercantile, Inc.
> AMM Jim Baker Party / Colorado Territory
> _____________________________________
> Get a subscription to a journal of the fur trade
> and early history of the times, the one the
> American Mountain Men read and write:
>
> The Tomahawk & Long Rifle * 3483 Squires *
> Conklin, MI 49403
> ATTN: Jon Link
>
> The subscription for the journal is $20 for a
> year or $35 for two years. You will receive
> quarterly issues - Feb, May, Aug, Nov,.
> _____________________________________
>
>
>
> Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
- --
"Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 13:23:58 -0600
From: jbrandl@wyoming.com (Joe Brandl)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: tanning recipes
Scott,
We offer a home tanning kit based on our 11 years of hair on tanning. Works
great. Cost is $39.95 plus shipping. will tan 2-3 deer skins or about 4-5
> > You will find that weekends are pretty slow and the volume of discussions during the week will fluctuate a lot, particularly in the summer months....too many things to do, presumably. Don't be shy, throw out something for discussion. A bone to the dogs, so to speak......the meatier the better.
______________________________________________
Are you happy Concho, now you have gone and woke all these guys up. I had a couple of e-mails about two hours ago and just checked and found 31 of which 29 where new and a bunch from you.
1. You have started a discussion on storing salt, containers, etc.
2. Insulted me, Buck and my dog.
3. And started a pissing contest between several others.
I told you guys about him, and you still left him stay on the list and he's only been on a few days, give him a few months and Dean will kick us all off. You should believe me, he got thrown out of the northwest territory, that's why he's back.
Turtle.
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 15:30:09 -0400
From: deforge1@wesnet.com (Dennis Miles)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
Y'know, anyone that can stir that much, that fast.. I like..
D
"Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 15:34:38 EDT
From: ThisOldFox@aol.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Storing salt and spices
I am doing this from memory, so bear with me. Just west of Danville,
Illinois, the Big Vermilion River forms at the confluence of three
tributaries, the North Fork, the Middle Fork, and the Salt Fork. The big
Vermilion continues into Indiana and dumps into the Wabash about 5 miles over
the IL/IN border.
This is an old mining area with coal and zinc deposits. The Vermilion part
came from the red shale deposits, and it is evident everywhere there are
strip mines and in heaps from deep shaft mines.
From earliest times, salt was obtained by the Indians from deposits on the
Salt Fork. Sometime before the permanent trading post in Chicago was
established, two men had a trading post at Danville. I don't remember their
names. Salt was one of the commodities which they traded. Slightly later, a
salt works was established on this sight. Large kettles were brought in for
the purpose of evaporating the briny water.
Since Gurdon Hubbard was the chief trader for the American Fur Co. during
this same time, and since his main outpost was in Danville, it is safe to
assume that he had his hands in this kettle. I can't remember the specifics,
but there is a monument there today with one of the original salt kettles.
This salt could have gone in several directions.......
By water to the Wabash, and upstream toward Northern Indiana and Western Ohio.
By water to the Wabash, and downstream to the Ohio, where it could have gone
upstream and back East, or it could have gone downstream to the Mississippi.
From there it could have gone North to Ft. DesChartres and St. Louis for use
in the western fur trade, or it could have gone South downstream toward New
Orleans and points in between.
Thirdly, and highly likely, it could have gone overland, North to Chicago.
As I mentioned in earlier postings, Hubbard often transported goods overland
both by foot and on horseback. From here, the salt could have gone down the
Illinois by boat, or back to the main factory at Ft. Mackinaw.
At some time, the operation ceased to be profitable and went under. I read
the documentation for this many years ago in papers written and stored in
Vermilion County and compiled into the "History of Vermilion Country." Had I
been as engrossed in history back then as I am now, I would have paid closer
attention to the details. My mother-in-law has a copy of the book, and next
time down, I will obtain and reread it. Sorry for all the assumptions, but
some of the facts may help clarify salt operations in the fur trade.
Dave Kanger
------------------------------
Date: 1 Aug 1999 12:38:49 -0700
From: "Concho" <concho@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Storing salt and spices
On Sun, 01 August 1999, ThisOldFox@aol.com wrote:
>
> I am doing this from memory, so bear with me. Just west of Danville,
> Illinois, the Big Vermilion River forms at the confluence of three
> tributaries, the North Fork, the Middle Fork, and the Salt Fork. The big
> Vermilion continues into Indiana and dumps into the Wabash about 5 miles over
> the IL/IN border.
>
> This is an old mining area with coal and zinc deposits. The Vermilion part
> came from the red shale deposits, and it is evident everywhere there are
> strip mines and in heaps from deep shaft mines.
>
> From earliest times, salt was obtained by the Indians from deposits on the
> Salt Fork. Sometime before the permanent trading post in Chicago was
> established, two men had a trading post at Danville. I don't remember their
> names. Salt was one of the commodities which they traded. Slightly later, a
> salt works was established on this sight. Large kettles were brought in for
> the purpose of evaporating the briny water.
>
> Since Gurdon Hubbard was the chief trader for the American Fur Co. during
> this same time, and since his main outpost was in Danville, it is safe to
> assume that he had his hands in this kettle. I can't remember the specifics,
> but there is a monument there today with one of the original salt kettles.
>
> This salt could have gone in several directions.......
> By water to the Wabash, and upstream toward Northern Indiana and Western Ohio.
>
> By water to the Wabash, and downstream to the Ohio, where it could have gone
> upstream and back East, or it could have gone downstream to the Mississippi.
> From there it could have gone North to Ft. DesChartres and St. Louis for use
> in the western fur trade, or it could have gone South downstream toward New
> Orleans and points in between.
>
> Thirdly, and highly likely, it could have gone overland, North to Chicago.
> As I mentioned in earlier postings, Hubbard often transported goods overland
> both by foot and on horseback. From here, the salt could have gone down the
> Illinois by boat, or back to the main factory at Ft. Mackinaw.
>
> At some time, the operation ceased to be profitable and went under. I read
> the documentation for this many years ago in papers written and stored in
> Vermilion County and compiled into the "History of Vermilion Country." Had I
> been as engrossed in history back then as I am now, I would have paid closer
> attention to the details. My mother-in-law has a copy of the book, and next
> time down, I will obtain and reread it. Sorry for all the assumptions, but
> some of the facts may help clarify salt operations in the fur trade.
>
> Dave Kanger
Hey,
Now we're cooking, thanks Dave that's the stuff we want.
D. L. Smith
Washington, MO.
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------------------------------
Date: 1 Aug 1999 12:40:08 -0700
From: "Concho" <concho@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
On Sun, 01 August 1999, Dennis Miles wrote:
>
> Y'know, anyone that can stir that much, that fast.. I like..
> D
>
>
> "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
> DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
> Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
> http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
WHY, THANK YOU DENNIS.
D. L. Smith
Washington, MO.
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------------------------------
Date: 1 Aug 1999 12:41:40 -0700
From: "Concho" <concho@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
On Sun, 01 August 1999, turtle@uswestmail.net wrote:
>
> > > On Sun, 01 August 1999, "Concho" wrote:
> > > DL
> > > You will find that weekends are pretty slow and the volume of discussions during the week will fluctuate a lot, particularly in the summer months....too many things to do, presumably. Don't be shy, throw out something for discussion. A bone to the dogs, so to speak......the meatier the better.
> ______________________________________________
>
> Are you happy Concho, now you have gone and woke all these guys up. I had a couple of e-mails about two hours ago and just checked and found 31 of which 29 where new and a bunch from you.
>
> 1. You have started a discussion on storing salt, containers, etc.
>
> 2. Insulted me, Buck and my dog.
>
> 3. And started a pissing contest between several others.
>
> I told you guys about him, and you still left him stay on the list and he's only been on a few days, give him a few months and Dean will kick us all off. You should believe me, he got thrown out of the northwest territory, that's why he's back.
>
> Turtle.
Cry baby, should have been Turtle Droppin's.
D. L. Smith
Washington, MO.
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: 1 Aug 1999 12:44:01 -0700
From: "Concho" <concho@uswestmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
> On Sun, 01 August 1999, Dennis Miles wrote:
>
> > Well now, Ain't that some....Shaaame on you Turtle...For Shaaame...
>
> > And behind our backs on top of that.....Tsk..Tsk...
>
> D
> > Well boys,
> >
> > Turtle just wrote me off_list, see his reply:
> > >
> > >Buck,
> > >These two are like the old joke about, "if my dog looked like that I'd
> > >shave his butt and making them walk backwards."
> > >
> > >Turtle.
Turtle I'm ashamed of such.
D. L. Smith
Washington, MO.
Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 14:45:30 -0500
From: "Ratcliff" <rat@htcomp.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: tanning recipes
For what it's worth,
I had the great pleasure to meet Jo Brandl and his wife this summer at =
their tannery and retail store in Wyoming and bought a buffalo robe =
while I was there. I don't know anything about the tanning kit, but I =
was very impressed with the Brandls, both as people and as experts on =
tanning hides. If he says that the kit works great
then my guess is that it works great, just like he says, and I wouldn't =
hesitate to buy one if I needed it.
YMOS
Lanney Ratcliff
=20
- ----- Original Message -----=20
From: Joe Brandl <jbrandl@wyoming.com>
To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 1999 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: tanning recipes
> Scott,
> We offer a home tanning kit based on our 11 years of hair on tanning. =
Works
> great. Cost is $39.95 plus shipping. will tan 2-3 deer skins or about =
I'm afraid Turtle is right Concho, your back a few days and got all these guys taking cheap shots at each other (I know it's only because they're bored).
Dave, Buck and Larry are the only ones that have given a straight answer that I can use, liked Lanney's information - don't shave like Dennis.
But Concho and Turtle, what can be said about you two, other than the last time we where in a camp together (about 8 years ago) I know it was one of you that loaded the camp pot with Exlax and I will get way past even one day.
Keep your powder dry
Powderhawk
Historian-Reenacter-Writer
Lake Mills, IA
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 15:11:38 -0700
From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
Yeah, I'm impressed ! Is this guy a fellow Texican ? If he ain't he ought
to be.
Pendleton
- -----Original Message-----
From: Dennis Miles <deforge1@wesnet.com>
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Date: Sunday, August 01, 1999 12:32 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
>Y'know, anyone that can stir that much, that fast.. I like..
>D
>
>
>"Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
> DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
> Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements
> http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
>
>
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 15:11:49 -0700
From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
You know, sometime back I suggested to Lanney that " in an effort to
beautify America, he ought to consider growing the beard back ."
Pendleton
- -----Original Message-----
From: Concho <concho@uswestmail.net>
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Date: Sunday, August 01, 1999 12:44 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Hello List
>> On Sun, 01 August 1999, Dennis Miles wrote:
>>
>> > Well now, Ain't that some....Shaaame on you Turtle...For Shaaame...
>>
>> > And behind our backs on top of that.....Tsk..Tsk...
>>
>> D
>> > Well boys,
>> >
>> > Turtle just wrote me off_list, see his reply:
>> > >
>> > >Buck,
>> > >These two are like the old joke about, "if my dog looked like that I'd
>> > >shave his butt and making them walk backwards."
>> > >
>> > >Turtle.
>
>Turtle I'm ashamed of such.
>
>D. L. Smith
>Washington, MO.
>Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net
>
>
------------------------------
End of hist_text-digest V1 #339
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