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From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #273 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Wednesday, March 31 1999 Volume 01 : Number 273 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:14:41 EST From: GHickman@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bear jerky bug In a message dated 3/29/99 5:22:40 PM Mountain Standard Time, aslandis@wa.freei.net writes: <> Maybe you haven't shown the symptoms yet. It can take time. It is usually not curable. A disease caused by eating undercooked meat, usually pork, that contains trichinae, which develop as adults in the intestines and as larvae in the muscles, causing intestinal disorders, fever, nausea, muscular pain, and edema of the face. It is nothing to mess with. Good Luck. Ghosting Wolf ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:36:14 EST From: RR1LA@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: cranberries. Kia, You can juice them for drinking or use the juice for dying fabrics. Also, you can dry them and use them like raisins or currants in rice dishes or in baked goods, or mix them with nuts 'n stuff in a 'trail mix'. As for growing seasons, propagation, etc, hopefully somebody else on the list will be able to help. YHS, Barney Fife ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 21:16:10 -0700 From: Don Taylor <rottyman45@lgcy.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On horse "wild" horse training. I'am no expert, but I had an occassion to work with some mustangs out of the BLM when I lived down to Yuma Az. a while back. Got together with a old man that had worked at breakin horses for the army prior to ww2. He had showed how they did it if he had been in a hurry aqnd he showed me how to do it if he had the time to spend on them. It all tended to be hard on the horse. I'am no horse trainer. I know some that are. Read Monte's book and talk to as many trainers as you can find and study everything you can on horses and training, then look to getting a mustang. I'll be lookin to doing it again in a few months and Iam still reading and talkin. At 07:25 PM 3/28/99 -0600, northwoods wrote: >>>>Hello the camp, > >Since the mode of travel, in those better days, was done mostly on horse >back and there seems to be little information regarding the capturing, >gentling and training of wild horses, I am wondering if anyone on the list >has had experience in training a wild horse; more specifically one of the >BLM wild mustang breeds. I've got a bee in my bonnet and want to take the >"bit", as it were, and "run with it." There can't be too many ways left to >replicate the horse culture of the plains as it related to the mountain men >and this is something I'm seriously considering. > >So, if any of you'll have trained one of these wild critters I'd sure like >to pick your brain(s). > >Yr Mst Humbl....... >John Funk<<< > >This reminds me of a time several years back I was driving to work,( I am in >the logging business and this particular job was a ways back in the bush, on >federal land, not near any habitations of any kind) anyway it was a November >morning with about 2" of fresh snowcover and I was the first one in, and I >came across the strangest set of tracks I have ever seen , so I pulled my >truck over and followed it into the woods a ways to see what it was. They >where moose sized and it looled like it was dragging something which >partially obliterated the tracks and made them hard to read. Really had me >scratchin my head there for a while. Well, to make a long story short, one >of the locals who lived a dozen or so miles off had decided he needed to get >a couple mustangs, which he did, then brought em' home and put em' in his >pasture figuring his regular fence would be adequate, except he left a lead >on them to make them easier to catch, boy was that a bad idea since they >where gone in no time. I know he caught one several months later, don't know >if he ever got the other one. I would spot one occasionally on my way in and >out of work, couldn't get close to it though, it was really nervous. > >If your familiar with breaking horses and have worked with horses in general >than a mustang isn't an impossible thing to get working for you. Your just >trying to teach an old dog new tricks, except this dog can do worse than >bite you if it has a mind to. >the last book I read on the subject was by Monty Roberts called "The Man Who >Listens to Horses" I think that is the title. The movie "The Horse >Whisperer" was based on this guys life. Really enjoyed this book. He breaks >a mustang IN THE WILD without ever having restrained the horse whatsoever. >Read the book and you'll find out how. > >From the northwoods, > >Tony Clark > > > Don Taylor "Life's tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:34:50 -0600 From: John Kramer <kramer@kramerize.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bear jerky bug I doubt every bear is infected. John... At 10:14 PM 3/29/99 -0500, you wrote: >In a message dated 3/29/99 5:22:40 PM Mountain Standard Time, >aslandis@wa.freei.net writes: > ><I'm just lucky! >> > >Maybe you haven't shown the symptoms yet. It can take time. It is usually not >curable. A disease caused by eating undercooked meat, usually pork, that >contains trichinae, which develop as adults in the intestines and as larvae in >the muscles, causing intestinal disorders, fever, nausea, muscular pain, and >edema of the face. > >It is nothing to mess with. Good Luck. > >Ghosting Wolf > Use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without. John Kramer <kramer@kramerize.com> ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 20:35:20 -0800 From: "Pat Laughlin" <pat1@pe.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: cranberries. http://www.oceanspray.com/cran_citrus/funfacts.htm This site and it's links can give you lots of info on cranberries. Enjoy. Pat - -----Original Message----- From: RR1LA@aol.com <RR1LA@aol.com> To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Date: Monday, March 29, 1999 7:50 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: cranberries. >Kia, You can juice them for drinking or use the juice for dying fabrics. Also, >you can dry them and use them like raisins or currants in rice dishes or in >baked goods, or mix them with nuts 'n stuff in a 'trail mix'. As for growing >seasons, propagation, etc, hopefully somebody else on the list will be able to >help. YHS, Barney Fife > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 21:10:16 -0800 From: Roger Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Newbe needs advice - --------------F37C9E14F070D18818B2C43C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob Keefe wrote: > Hello to all of the list I am just trying to put together > needs for my first season of rendezvous. I have run across an add in > the local classifieds for a civil war officers wall tent and fly. How > deferent would this be to fur trade? How much work would it be to > convert to period. I thank you for any and all help > > Bob, > > All the experts on this subject must be asleep or drunk today/tonight > so I will take a stab at your questions. > It is my understanding that wall tents really are not correct for the > Rendezvous era. I think you would find it too much work to get a > satisfactory shelter out of a wall tent by trying to modify it. It > would have to be made into a wedge tent and that may not be possible. > > Depending on what type of Rendezvous you want to use it at, many of > the big and little more open Rendezvous will not make much of a to-do > over wall tents as long as they are white and not olive drab. The more > historiclly oriented eastern incampments will require that you use > more period correct shelters and the wall tent would probably not be > allowed. > > Perhaps the real question should be, Where do you want to use this > tent at? Let me know. I remain..... > > YMOS > Capt. Lahti' > > > > > > > > > > > > > - --------------F37C9E14F070D18818B2C43C Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html> <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Bob Keefe wrote: <blockquote TYPE=CITE> Hello to all of the list I am just trying to put together needs for my first season of rendezvous. I have run across an add in the local classifieds for a civil war officers wall tent and fly. How deferent would this be to fur trade? How much work would it be to convert to period. I thank you for any and all help Bob, All the experts on this subject must be asleep or drunk today/tonight so I will take a stab at your questions. It is my understanding that wall tents really are not correct for the Rendezvous era. I think you would find it too much work to get a satisfactory shelter out of a wall tent by trying to modify it. It would have to be made into a wedge tent and that may not be possible. Depending on what type of Rendezvous you want to use it at, many of the big and little more open Rendezvous will not make much of a to-do over wall tents as long as they are white and not olive drab. The more historiclly oriented eastern incampments will require that you use more period correct shelters and the wall tent would probably not be allowed. Perhaps the real question should be, Where do you want to use this tent at? Let me know. I remain..... YMOS Capt. Lahti' <blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"> </blockquote> </blockquote> </body> </html> - --------------F37C9E14F070D18818B2C43C-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:05:27 EST From: GHickman@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bear jerky bug In a message dated 3/29/99 9:36:01 PM Mountain Standard Time, kramer@kramerize.com writes: <> You are right. In some areas a very high % may be infected. The older a bear the highter the probability of it being infected. Even bears back in the "wilderness" can have it. Bears have a tremendous home range and can carry it anywhere. I'll get the statistics on trichinosis from the office tomorrow. We did this about a year ago and info should be in the archives. Here in Montana trichinosis testing is free. Either way it is always recommended to cook bear and mountain lion meat well before eating. Ghosting Wolf ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 00:21:00 EST From: RR1LA@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Newbe needs advice contact tentsmiths <A HREF="http://www.tentsmiths.com/">Tentsmiths Home Page </A> or Panther Primitives <A HREF="http://www.catalogcity.com/ViewCover.cfm?VID=150674">Panther Primitives</A> they can provide you with all the info you could need about historical accuracy, etc etc. Hope this helps, YHs, Barney Fife ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 22:36:44 -0800 From: "john c. funk,jr" <j2hearts@shasta.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On horse "wild" horse training. Don Taylor, Many thanks for your input. I'm doing just as you suggest. Tomorrow I'm going to check Amazon for Monty's books and possibly tapes on training. Good luck in your efforts. John Funk - -----Original Message----- From: Don Taylor <rottyman45@lgcy.com> To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>; hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Date: Monday, March 29, 1999 9:09 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On horse "wild" horse training. >I'am no expert, but I had an occassion to work with some mustangs out of >the BLM when I lived down to Yuma Az. a while back. Got together with a old >man that had worked at breakin horses for the army prior to ww2. He had >showed how they did it if he had been in a hurry aqnd he showed me how to >do it if he had the time to spend on them. It all tended to be hard on the >horse. I'am no horse trainer. I know some that are. Read Monte's book and >talk to as many trainers as you can find and study everything you can on >horses and training, then look to getting a mustang. I'll be lookin to >doing it again in a few months and Iam still reading and talkin. > >At 07:25 PM 3/28/99 -0600, northwoods wrote: >>>>>Hello the camp, >> >>Since the mode of travel, in those better days, was done mostly on horse >>back and there seems to be little information regarding the capturing, >>gentling and training of wild horses, I am wondering if anyone on the list >>has had experience in training a wild horse; more specifically one of the >>BLM wild mustang breeds. I've got a bee in my bonnet and want to take the >>"bit", as it were, and "run with it." There can't be too many ways left to >>replicate the horse culture of the plains as it related to the mountain men >>and this is something I'm seriously considering. >> >>So, if any of you'll have trained one of these wild critters I'd sure like >>to pick your brain(s). >> >>Yr Mst Humbl....... >>John Funk<<< >> >>This reminds me of a time several years back I was driving to work,( I am in >>the logging business and this particular job was a ways back in the bush, on >>federal land, not near any habitations of any kind) anyway it was a November >>morning with about 2" of fresh snowcover and I was the first one in, and I >>came across the strangest set of tracks I have ever seen , so I pulled my >>truck over and followed it into the woods a ways to see what it was. They >>where moose sized and it looled like it was dragging something which >>partially obliterated the tracks and made them hard to read. Really had me >>scratchin my head there for a while. Well, to make a long story short, one >>of the locals who lived a dozen or so miles off had decided he needed to get >>a couple mustangs, which he did, then brought em' home and put em' in his >>pasture figuring his regular fence would be adequate, except he left a lead >>on them to make them easier to catch, boy was that a bad idea since they >>where gone in no time. I know he caught one several months later, don't know >>if he ever got the other one. I would spot one occasionally on my way in and >>out of work, couldn't get close to it though, it was really nervous. >> >>If your familiar with breaking horses and have worked with horses in general >>than a mustang isn't an impossible thing to get working for you. Your just >>trying to teach an old dog new tricks, except this dog can do worse than >>bite you if it has a mind to. >>the last book I read on the subject was by Monty Roberts called "The Man Who >>Listens to Horses" I think that is the title. The movie "The Horse >>Whisperer" was based on this guys life. Really enjoyed this book. He breaks >>a mustang IN THE WILD without ever having restrained the horse whatsoever. >>Read the book and you'll find out how. >> >>From the northwoods, >> >>Tony Clark >> >> >> >Don Taylor > >"Life's tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid" > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 07:08:15 -0700 From: David A Miller <dammiller@juno.com> Subject: MtMan-List: History Channel Documentary Friends, I just saw a copy of the film that was on the History channel last week. Overall, I thought it was entertaining, especially if you didn't know better. I agree with much of what has been said in the way of criticisms i.e.. Clean Sunday go-to-meeting buckskins, bogus trapping scenes, Thompson Center rifles etc. And what was with the Coyote hat? As though that was by any remote stretch of the imagination common headgear for trappers. Plains hardsole moccasins? Maybe during the reservation period. A pierced candle lantern in a trappers camp? Documentation...where's the documentation? On the issue of trade silver, I don't know of any references to much of it being imported from Germany. Why would it have been when there were dozens of expert French and English craftsmen right there in the colonies? And that sort of trade silver had largely passed out of vogue by the hey day of the Rocky Mountain Trapper. OK, perhaps some might have been found on a Shawnee or Delaware trapper who had found his way to the Rockies. "German Silver" is another name for Nickel Silver which has no actual silver in it. And it doesn't mean it necessarily came from Germany. The film certainly could have been much worse and I believe those reenactors involved probably did their best to make it right, but in the end Hollywood wanted a film for a certain price, and that's what they got. Accuracy be damned! ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:57:29 -0700 From: agottfre@telusplanet.net (Angela Gottfred) Subject: re: MtMan-List: On horse "wild" horse training. From David Thompson's _Narrative_, p. 275, a description of how they caught & broke wild horses in the western slopes of the Rockies c. 1808: "We now agreed to try and run them [wild horses] down. For this purpose we took two long-winded horses and started a herd of five. They soon left us, but as these hills are covered with short grass, with very little wood, we easily kept them in sight. It was a wild steeple-chase, down hills and up others. After a chase of about four hours they brought us to near the place we started them. Here we left them frightened, tired, and looking wildly about them. The next day we took swift horses, and instead of following them quietly, we dashed at them full speed with a hunting holloa, forcing them to their utmost speed; the consequence was, two of them fell dead, a fine iron gray stood still; we alighted and tied his forefeet together and there left him. Following, we came to another horse, tied his feet and left him, we returned to the first horse. I passed my hand over his nostrils, the smell of which was so disagreeable that his nostrils and the skin of his head became contorted, yet when tame, the doing of this appeared agreeable. The next day we went for them on two steady horses, with strong lines, which we tied round his neck, put a bit in his mouth with a short bridle through which the lines passed, untied his feet, brought him to the house, where he was broken to the bit and to the saddle. They [wild horses] lose all their fat and become lean, and it takes about full two months to recover them to a good condition. When in this last state they are made use of to hunt and ride down wild horses, for strange to say, a horse with a good rider will always overtake a horse without a rider, wild or tame." As for modern feral horses, five years ago there was a large (~50, IIRC) herd of wild horses at Canadian Forces Base Suffield here in southern Alberta. The army rounded them up and sold them (at first they wanted to slaughter them, but the outcry was too great). The folks who adopted them were all quite pleased with the horses, and they have established some sort of club for the promotion of the "Suffield Ponies". For all I know, they may have a web site! Your humble & obedient servant, Angela Gottfred agottfre@telusplanet.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:47:08 -0800 From: Roger Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bear jerky bug - --------------A5D5EF0999973E11B6745487 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ratcliff wrote: > AdamListen to that old Finn. He is pretty smart.Lanney Ratcliff > > -----Original Message----- > From: landis <aslandis@wa.freei.net> > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> > Date: Monday, March 29, 1999 8:08 PM > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bear jerky bug > thanks for the info i was just wonderin what they did if > anything.how about muskrat > jerky? > adam > > Adam, > > I don't know about muskrat but since it is not "omniverous" > (a critter that will eat anything that will hold still long > enough, like Lanney and me) it probably would be safe to > jerk it. I still think I would only do it in a servival mode > though, just to be safe. As you can deduce, the animals that > you have to be careful of are the ones that will scavenge on > anything edible. Strict plant eaters are probably not a > sorce of infection. Stick to beef, buffalo, deer, elk, > moose, turkey, etc. Thanks Lanney. I remain...... > YMOS Capt. Lahti' > > > > > > > > - --------------A5D5EF0999973E11B6745487 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html> <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Ratcliff wrote: <blockquote TYPE=CITE> AdamListen to that old Finn. He is pretty smart.Lanney Ratcliff <blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">-----Original Message----- From: landis <<a href="mailto:aslandis@wa.freei.net">aslandis@wa.freei.net</a>> To: <a href="mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com">hist_text@lists.xmission.com</a> <<a href="mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com">hist_text@lists.xmission.com</a>> Date: Monday, March 29, 1999 8:08 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bear jerky bug thanks for the info i was just wonderin what they did if anything.how about muskrat jerky? adam Adam, I don't know about muskrat but since it is not "omniverous" (a critter that will eat anything that will hold still long enough, like Lanney and me) it probably would be safe to jerk it. I still think I would only do it in a servival mode though, just to be safe. As you can deduce, the animals that you have to be careful of are the ones that will scavenge on anything edible. Strict plant eaters are probably not a sorce of infection. Stick to beef, buffalo, deer, elk, moose, turkey, etc. Thanks Lanney. I remain......</blockquote> </blockquote> YMOS Capt. Lahti' <blockquote TYPE=CITE> <blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"> <blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"> <blockquote TYPE = CITE> </blockquote> </blockquote> </blockquote> </blockquote> </body> </html> - --------------A5D5EF0999973E11B6745487-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:16:34 -0500 (EST) From: ikon@mindspring.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: History Channel Documentary I think I speak for alot of people that although there were mistakes overall it was very good. I have only been rendezvousing and buckskinning for about a year, still trying to get everything together and it was nice to see alot of the items and compare notes. I think that the nit pickers are forgetting one thing, it was a very interesting movie based on a growing way of life or hobby as some would call it. Rendezvousing and buckskinning is getting very popular because it's alot of fun and it gets you back to the basics. Maybe this show opened up some eyes and there will be some more greenhorns out there getting involved, so there were a few mistakes. I did pick up on the trapping and gun mistakes they were kind of obvious. The clothing always seem to give me a bit of a problem. As I understand that the clothing worn by mountain men varied, alot. Not all wore buckskins and when they were worn they were not all that pretty. Just take a look at my longhunter shirt after a day of shooting, talk about dirty if I had to live in it boy the mosquitoes probably would not come near me. I do remember when they talked about the hawken rifle as being the fav. of the mountain man. I did not think the hawken came out until after 1835 towards the end of the fur trade era. Since I own a lyman plains rifle and it is the only rifle I have right now I figure that my persona needs to be towards the end of the fur trade era. But to me it really does not matter because I make all of my gear, everything except the gun and that will be next. Well just my two cents. Frank V. Rago At 07:08 AM 3/30/99 -0700, you wrote: >Friends, > >I just saw a copy of the film that was on the History channel last week. >Overall, I thought it was entertaining, especially if you didn't know >better. > I agree with much of what has been said in the way of criticisms i.e.. >Clean >Sunday go-to-meeting buckskins, bogus trapping scenes, Thompson Center >rifles >etc. And what was with the Coyote hat? As though that was by any remote >stretch of the imagination common headgear for trappers. Plains hardsole >moccasins? Maybe during the reservation period. A pierced candle lantern >in a >trappers camp? Documentation...where's the documentation? On the issue of >trade silver, I don't know of any references to much of it being imported >from >Germany. Why would it have been when there were dozens of expert French >and >English craftsmen right there in the colonies? And that sort of trade >silver >had largely passed out of vogue by the hey day of the Rocky Mountain >Trapper. >OK, perhaps some might have been found on a Shawnee or Delaware trapper >who >had found his way to the Rockies. >"German Silver" is another name for Nickel Silver which has no actual >silver >in it. And it doesn't mean it necessarily came from Germany. > The film certainly could have been much worse and I believe those >reenactors involved probably did their best to make it right, but in the >end >Hollywood wanted a film for a certain price, and that's what they got. >Accuracy be damned! > >___________________________________________________________________ >You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. >Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html >or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 09:50:06 -0800 From: "john c. funk,jr" <j2hearts@shasta.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: On horse "wild" horse training. Angela, Great piece of history. Many thanks for transcribing it. Wish it were as easy and abbreviated as David Thompkins makes it sound. Will look for the Suffield information. John Funk - -----Original Message----- From: Angela Gottfred <agottfre@telusplanet.net> To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Date: Tuesday, March 30, 1999 8:50 AM Subject: re: MtMan-List: On horse "wild" horse training. >>From David Thompson's _Narrative_, p. 275, a description of how they caught >& broke wild horses in the western slopes of the Rockies c. 1808: > >"We now agreed to try and run them [wild horses] down. For this purpose we >took two long-winded horses and started a herd of five. They soon left us, >but as these hills are covered with short grass, with very little wood, we >easily kept them in sight. It was a wild steeple-chase, down hills and up >others. After a chase of about four hours they brought us to near the place >we started them. Here we left them frightened, tired, and looking wildly >about them. The next day we took swift horses, and instead of following them >quietly, we dashed at them full speed with a hunting holloa, forcing them to >their utmost speed; the consequence was, two of them fell dead, a fine iron >gray stood still; we alighted and tied his forefeet together and there left >him. Following, we came to another horse, tied his feet and left him, we >returned to the first horse. I passed my hand over his nostrils, the smell >of which was so disagreeable that his nostrils and the skin of his head >became contorted, yet when tame, the doing of this appeared agreeable. The >next day we went for them on two steady horses, with strong lines, which we >tied round his neck, put a bit in his mouth with a short bridle through >which the lines passed, untied his feet, brought him to the house, where he >was broken to the bit and to the saddle. They [wild horses] lose all their >fat and become lean, and it takes about full two months to recover them to a >good condition. When in this last state they are made use of to hunt and >ride down wild horses, for strange to say, a horse with a good rider will >always overtake a horse without a rider, wild or tame." > >As for modern feral horses, five years ago there was a large (~50, IIRC) >herd of wild horses at Canadian Forces Base Suffield here in southern >Alberta. The army rounded them up and sold them (at first they wanted to >slaughter them, but the outcry was too great). The folks who adopted them >were all quite pleased with the horses, and they have established some sort >of club for the promotion of the "Suffield Ponies". For all I know, they may >have a web site! > >Your humble & obedient servant, >Angela Gottfred >agottfre@telusplanet.net > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 15:50:51 -0800 From: terry l landis <tllandis@juno.com> Subject: MtMan-List: bear jerky ok here's the scoop on the jerk. 1. yes bears get the bug trich a whatever it is 2. i have read and please let me know if i'm wrong at 200 deg f. it dies 3. if you check your meat with a meat thremomater in your smoker it does get to that temp. if safe handleing procedures are followed you will get great jerk. ok, open target here come and get me! YMHS, Terry (muskrat) Landis ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 19:07:56 -0600 From: kestrel@ticon.net Subject: Re: MtMan-List: cranberries. Dave,I could be all screwed up(usually am!),but the first question that came to mind was,does river willow grow in New Zealand? But thanks for the post,here in Ouisconsin we have them and I'll try this this year. >Gather river willow saplings whenever the sap is running. Early >spring is best. Cut them into small pieces and crush them in a >washtub. Then cover with water and leach. You will get a soup. >Use this as your rooting medium. Willow is a "magic" growth Jeff Powers,A mind like a steel trap:Rusty and illegal in 37 states! "They make no scruple to break wind publickly" Fr.Louis Hennepin 1698 Net-Tamer V 1.08.1 - Test Drive ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 20:50:58 -0600 From: John Kramer <kramer@kramerize.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: river willow in NZ? Young dogwood saplings have a very similar composition to willow. You ca= n chew the inner bark of both to ease a headache or put a little in a glue pot t= o prevent souring. Most any willow should work -- though few have the rich red outer bark of= the river willow of the Rocky mountains. Makes pretty good stakes as well. = Stout spear hafts when cured. John... At 07:07 PM 3/30/99 -0600, you wrote: >Dave,I could be all screwed up(usually am!),but the first question that = came >to mind was,does river willow grow in New Zealand? >But thanks for the post,here in Ouisconsin we have them and I'll try thi= s >this year. >=A0=A0 >Gather river willow saplings whenever the sap is running.=A0 Ear= ly >=A0=A0 >spring is best.=A0 Cut them into small pieces and crush them in = a >=A0=A0 >washtub.=A0 Then cover with water and leach.=A0 You will get a s= oup. >=A0=A0 >Use this as your rooting medium. Willow is a "magic" growth >Jeff Powers,A mind like a steel trap:Rusty and illegal in 37 states! > >"They make no scruple to break wind publickly" Fr.Louis Hennepin 1698 > >Net-Tamer V 1.08.1 - Test Drive >=20 Use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without. John Kramer <kramer@kramerize.com> ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:41:27 EST From: Pulakabayo@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Bayonetting a bear? I just ran across the following passage on page 105 of "This Reckless Breed of Men" by Robert Glass Cleland (1950 Borzoi Books). It is regarding Jedediah S. Smith in 1827: " As Smith mildly remarked, the charging bear made "no pleasant noise"; and since his gun was empty, Jed dived headlong into a stream that ran beside the thicket. The bear knocked the next man down and rushed on to attack a hunter named La Point, who had a bayonet fixed to his rifle. La Point used his novel weapon so effectively that the bear ran off, badly wounded, and took refuge in a near-by clump of brush." OK, I have quite a few questions on this, the first being did this really happen? (The name La Point for the man using a bayonet makes me wonder) If it did, what rifle could he have used? I'd hazard a guess it had to military, as I cannot picture someone having a gunsmith fit his Hawkins out for one. And the plug bayonets I'm aware of were for the .75 cal Brown Bess. Now that I think of it, if I were hunting a Grizz with a muzzle loader a bayonet might not be too bad an idea.... Thanks, Jim ------------------------------ Date: 31 Mar 1999 08:05:47 -0800 From: <buck.conner@uswestmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bayonetting a bear? Museum of the Fur Trade Quarterly had an article by Charley many years ago that referred to many of the guns in the Fur Trade as being military, so your guess to being military is probably close to being correct. There were many "contract" rifles that used a bayonet attachment, if you had such a weapon and had the bayonet, why not use it. Buck ____________________________________ On Wed, 31 March 1999, Pulakabayo@aol.com wrote: > The bear knocked the next man down and rushed on to attack a hunter named > La Point, who had a bayonet fixed to his rifle. La Point used his novel > weapon so effectively that the bear ran off,............ > > If it did, what rifle could he have used? I'd hazard a guess it had to > military, ............ Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net ------------------------------ Date: 31 Mar 1999 08:05:47 -0800 From: <buck.conner@uswestmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bayonetting a bear? Museum of the Fur Trade Quarterly had an article by Charley many years ago that referred to many of the guns in the Fur Trade as being military, so your guess to being military is probably close to being correct. There were many "contract" rifles that used a bayonet attachment, if you had such a weapon and had the bayonet, why not use it. Buck ____________________________________ On Wed, 31 March 1999, Pulakabayo@aol.com wrote: > The bear knocked the next man down and rushed on to attack a hunter named > La Point, who had a bayonet fixed to his rifle. La Point used his novel > weapon so effectively that the bear ran off,............ > > If it did, what rifle could he have used? I'd hazard a guess it had to > military, ............ Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 12:42:43 EST From: PappyCton@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bayonetting a bear? During the mid 1800's, there was a group of men who hunted Griz in the cane brakes with hounds, and then would finish with knives that were about a couple feet long (if memory serves). It was not a stop gap: it was the preferred tool, for these men. There was an article in Blade Magazine 10 years ago; and several books on hounds and hunters mention it. Kinda like bayonets w/o the gun. Maybe the the Arkansas Toothpick really was a toothpick- for Griz. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 17:39:51 EST From: TetonTod@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Food Safe Oil Hey there John Kramer: Can you cast any light on what a good food safe oil for oiling wooden bowls might be? Todd Glover ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #273 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.