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hist_text-digest      Thursday, February 18 1999      Volume 01 : Number 242




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 02:40:58 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

In a message dated 99-02-16 22:38:38 EST, you write:

<< One of the guns I use on a fairly regular basis has a wrought-iron barrel

Wrought iron is somewhat corrosion resistant.  When it rusts, it seldom
develops the deep pits modern steels do, but it WILL rust.  Bill Large used
1010 (carbon & manganese) to make his barrels, & the most common steel used
now for barrels is L6 which only has .03% chromium & 1.4 - 2.6% nickle which
isn't enough to impart much corrosion resistance.  Occasionaly you'll see some
4140, (chrome-molly) but it'll rust too.


<     If you want a "stainless" barrel liner, cost breakdown is something like
 this:  stainless barrel blank ca. $150, turning it down to a liner ca $100,
 boring out and lining barrel ca. $175 (I called a gunsmith).  Looks to me
 like it would be easier to just take care of the barrel you have. >>

Amen!  Even if you don't, a replacement barrel is much cheaper than the liner
- -- much less having it installed.  Think the 42" long swamped Coleran for my
new rifle was only $180 -- been a while since I priced it.  If money's tight &
you realy have to have a barrel cheap, you can usualy get an Orion for around
$100.  They shoot well, but I don't like the uncentered bore.  There are many
barrel manufactures out there that fall somewhere in between price wise that
make GOOD barrels & you won't have to find a gunsmith or machine shop that
specializes in fitting liners.  Thanks for the $$ figures Longwalker!

NM

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 08:28:21 -0600
From: "Henry B. Crawford" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: "Soppin' Landis"

>> well there wernt no soppin goin on but there were a frightful few moments
>> of hopin and pullin and tugin after 2 hrs in the car and several Pepsi's.
>>
>> YMHS, Terry L Landis
>
>Terry,
>
>Well that helps a little but what are we talking here? What sounds more
>appropriate, "Groaper Landis" or "Short stroke Landis"? What I always found
>frustrating was Winter time when it was real cold and a guy's dressed warm.
>He finds he has 3 inches of cloths on and only 2 inches of reach! Perhaps
>this is a design flaw in the drop fronts? <G>

>YMOS
>CApt. Lahti'


I don't think the design flaw is with the pants but inside 'em!  :-)
(A little guy humor.  Pardon me, ladies)

Cheers,
HBC

****************************************
Henry B. Crawford    Box 43191
Curator of History    Museum of Texas Tech University
[e-mail]    Lubbock, TX  79409-3191
806/742-2442     FAX [phone]
              Website: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum
******  Living History . . . Because It's There  ******

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 08:28:51 -0600
From: "Henry B. Crawford" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Afr-Am trappers

>------------------------------
>
>Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:03:25 -0600
>From: "stitchinscot" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Responses to my (Henry's)post
>
>Could you document the trappers and traders of African decent for me please.
>It would be interesting to know.  Thank you in advance:  Long John

I can if I use my notes from Bill Gwaltney's (Rocky Mountain Nat'l  Park)
lecture on the subject at the Fur Trade Symposium in Pinedale back in Sept.
1997.  Bill is the expert.  I'll look over my notes.

Cheers,
HBC

****************************************
Henry B. Crawford    Box 43191
Curator of History    Museum of Texas Tech University
[e-mail]    Lubbock, TX  79409-3191
806/742-2442     FAX [phone]
              Website: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum
******  Living History . . . Because It's There  ******

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 10:31:39 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: SALT PETER

    Go to the library and get a series of books called "Foxfire." One of them
contains
detailed instructions on making saltpeter. Sorry I don't remember the number
of the book, but they are all worth reading.            Hunter

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 09:38:33 -0600
From: "Henry B. Crawford" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #241

>Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:30:34 -0500
>From: greg n bosen <[e-mail]>
>Subject: MtMan-List: Mikwa Trading Post??????????
>
>Does anyone have the current phone and address for Mikwa Trading Post?
>2402 92nd Lubbock, TX 79423 is wrong, they moved and i lost their new
>number and address!!!
>
>Thanks greg
>

Mikwa Trading Post??  Why have I never heard of them?  They must be pretty
low profile.  Are they fur trade era?  Geez, right in my own backyard
(literally, same zip code as my house).

HBC



****************************************
Henry B. Crawford    Box 43191
Curator of History    Museum of Texas Tech University
[e-mail]    Lubbock, TX  79409-3191
806/742-2442     FAX [phone]
              Website: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum
******  Living History . . . Because It's There  ******

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 08:53:30 +0000
From: Rick Williams <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: MtMan-List: SALT PETER

- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE5A52.FE54A1D0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

While I haven't done it, I understand that the small crystals that accumulate on old feces and outhouses can be gathered and used.

LOTS of luck
Rick


- -----Original Message-----
From:    larry pendleton [SMTP:[e-mail]]
Sent:    Tuesday, February 16, 1999 3:11 AM
To:    mountain lists
Subject:    MtMan-List: SALT PETER

Ok boys and girls.  How do you make salt peter ? A buddy of mine who
aspires to make his own black powder, wants to make it all from scratch. He
may be a half bubble off plumb, but it is a good question.  Does anybody
have any idea how to make the stuff ?
Pendleton



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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 09:37:41 -0800
From: Roger Lahti <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH

larry pendleton wrote:

> The discussion about making oil cloth went on for a while here sometime
> ago.  ?  I have used just
> straight linseed oil to waterproof a tarp and it worked great.  The only
> down side was the added weight.
> Pendleton

Pendelton,

This is not so much an answer to your question as it is an opportunity to pass
on some information that I promised a few days back and just found. I think it
will be of interest considering your last comment about weight.

I direct your attention to the book "Nesmuk, Woodcraft and camping" by George
Washington Sears. Sears wrote for the original "Field and Stream" back before
the turn of the Century. He was described as a latter day "Daniel Boone" in
that he as much reinvented camping for pleasure. In working towards that goal,
Sears explored the Adirondacks in a cedar canoe that weighed something like 17
lbs. or less. He was a very small man in stature and was a great advocate for
going light. In the above book he describes his refined camping methods and
there is a lot that can be used to help the present day reenactor get into the
18th Century quicker if one is careful to consider when things were appropriate
as to time frame.

In this book Sears talks of shelters that he built and used and of different
ways to make them weather tight. Some ideas that he practiced are not
appropriate to what the buckskinner wants to do, like using nails and tacks to
build his shelter with poles and canvas. But Sears does mention oil cloth in
such a way that gives hints as to what it was. He also gives aa simple recipe
for treating canvas so it will shed water and remain light in weight.

In talking of shelters in Chapter III, Sears mentions using oil cloth for a few
seasons but gave it up because the "glazing began to crack and peel off in a
short time". He went on to say that it made a good shelter "but was a trifle
heavy to pack". Then he mentions making another shelter "soaked in lime-water
and alum". This proved to be much better with regards to  weight and able to
withstand a heavy rain for many hrs.

The recipe for the lime-water and alum is as follows. Using a strong cotton
cloth: to 10 quarts of water add 10 oz of lime, and 4 oz of alum; let it stand
until clear; fold the cloth snugly and put in another vessel, pour the solution
on it, let it soak for 12 hrs.; then rinse in luke-warm rain water, stretch and
dry in the sun, and the tarp is ready to use. You can use what ever cotton
cloth you wish but the major portion of the weight will be in the material. I
would recommend a tightly woven cotton cloth in the less than 6 oz weight. Make
up the shelter before you treat if any sewing needs done.

I recommend the books by Sears whole heartedly. They are informative and full
of ideas on how it was done before the advent of so much of our modern camping
gear. I remain......

YMOS
Capt. Lahti'

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 11:32:15 -0700
From: "Sickler, Louis L" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: RE: Afr-Amer trappers

Long John, Henry & others,

Just yesterday I ran across this page:

http://www.coax.net/people/lwf/furtrade.htm

It is Bill Gwaltney's essay "Beyond the Pale   African Americans in the Fur
Trade West"

Excellent reading.

Is this the same info that you were looking up, Henry?

Red Coyote

> ----------
> From:     stitchinscot
> Reply To:     [e-mail]
> Sent:     Tuesday, February 16, 1999 17:03
> To:     [e-mail]
> Subject:     Re: MtMan-List: Responses to my (Henry's)post
>
> Could you document the trappers and traders of African decent for me
> please.
> It would be interesting to know.  Thank you in advance:  Long John
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Henry B. Crawford <[e-mail]>
> To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
> Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 8:27 AM
> Subject: MtMan-List: Responses to my (Henry's)post
>
>
> >
> >Yes, we all know that, TV notwithstanding.  Good historians do not use
> >fictionalized TV and cinematic drama as a basis for scholarly
> conclusions.
> >If we did, we would not know that there were also very many trappers and
> >traders African descent, like myself (I'm also 1/16 Cherokee on my
> father's
> >side)
> >
> >HBC
> >
> >
> >>    Many Indians trapped also. Not just the whites. The whites may have
> >>exploited that, but the facts are they trapped, and hunted for furs
> also.
> I
> >>have spent a lot of time researching the history of native Americans
> >>(particularly plains). They were just as profit minded as the rest. I
> >>beleive that Indians (as well as the trappers) used more of the animals
> >>they killed and waisted less out of necessity for life. I think a lot of
> >>this misconseption is T.V. related. I hope I don't offend anyone with
> this
> >>note but research this and you will come to the same conclusion.
> >>
> >>"Dull Hawk"
> >>
> >
> >****************************************
> >Henry B. Crawford Box 43191
> >Curator of History Museum of Texas Tech University
> >[e-mail] Lubbock, TX  79409-3191
> >806/742-2442 FAX [phone]
> >              Website: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum
> >******  Living History . . . Because It's There  ******
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 11:37:43 -0700
From: "Sickler, Louis L" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Nessmuk

I have to agree with Roger on this one. I have loved and used this book for
over 25 years for info on how to camp without all the modern plastic sh*#.
This began way before I ever heard of trekking, etc. I've always loved to
camp this way.

If anyone out there hasn't read it, run to the library, you won't be
disappointed.

Red Coyote

> ----------
> From:     Roger Lahti
> Reply To:     [e-mail]
> Sent:     Wednesday, February 17, 1999 10:37
> To:     [e-mail]
> Subject:     Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH
>
>
>
> larry pendleton wrote:
>
> > The discussion about making oil cloth went on for a while here sometime
> > ago.  ?  I have used just
> > straight linseed oil to waterproof a tarp and it worked great.  The only
> > down side was the added weight.
> > Pendleton
>
> Pendelton,
>
> This is not so much an answer to your question as it is an opportunity to
> pass
> on some information that I promised a few days back and just found. I
> think it
> will be of interest considering your last comment about weight.
>
> I direct your attention to the book "Nesmuk, Woodcraft and camping" by
> George
> Washington Sears. Sears wrote for the original "Field and Stream" back
> before
> the turn of the Century. He was described as a latter day "Daniel Boone"
> in
> that he as much reinvented camping for pleasure. In working towards that
> goal,
> Sears explored the Adirondacks in a cedar canoe that weighed something
> like 17
> lbs. or less. He was a very small man in stature and was a great advocate
> for
> going light. In the above book he describes his refined camping methods
> and
> there is a lot that can be used to help the present day reenactor get into
> the
> 18th Century quicker if one is careful to consider when things were
> appropriate
> as to time frame.
>
> In this book Sears talks of shelters that he built and used and of
> different
> ways to make them weather tight. Some ideas that he practiced are not
> appropriate to what the buckskinner wants to do, like using nails and
> tacks to
> build his shelter with poles and canvas. But Sears does mention oil cloth
> in
> such a way that gives hints as to what it was. He also gives aa simple
> recipe
> for treating canvas so it will shed water and remain light in weight.
>
> In talking of shelters in Chapter III, Sears mentions using oil cloth for
> a few
> seasons but gave it up because the "glazing began to crack and peel off in
> a
> short time". He went on to say that it made a good shelter "but was a
> trifle
> heavy to pack". Then he mentions making another shelter "soaked in
> lime-water
> and alum". This proved to be much better with regards to  weight and able
> to
> withstand a heavy rain for many hrs.
>
> The recipe for the lime-water and alum is as follows. Using a strong
> cotton
> cloth: to 10 quarts of water add 10 oz of lime, and 4 oz of alum; let it
> stand
> until clear; fold the cloth snugly and put in another vessel, pour the
> solution
> on it, let it soak for 12 hrs.; then rinse in luke-warm rain water,
> stretch and
> dry in the sun, and the tarp is ready to use. You can use what ever cotton
> cloth you wish but the major portion of the weight will be in the
> material. I
> would recommend a tightly woven cotton cloth in the less than 6 oz weight.
> Make
> up the shelter before you treat if any sewing needs done.
>
> I recommend the books by Sears whole heartedly. They are informative and
> full
> of ideas on how it was done before the advent of so much of our modern
> camping
> gear. I remain......
>
> YMOS
> Capt. Lahti'
>
>
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 16:26:38 -0500
From: greg n bosen <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #241

Mikwa Tading Post is a mt man / indian / highlander supplyer.  they moved
but i thought they are still in Lubbock.


Greg Bosen


On Wed, 17 Feb 1999 09:38:33 -0600 "Henry B. Crawford"
<[e-mail]> writes:
>
>>Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:30:34 -0500
>>From: greg n bosen <[e-mail]>
>>Subject: MtMan-List: Mikwa Trading Post??????????
>>
>>Does anyone have the current phone and address for Mikwa Trading
>Post?
>>2402 92nd Lubbock, TX 79423 is wrong, they moved and i lost their new
>>number and address!!!
>>
>>Thanks greg
>>
>
>Mikwa Trading Post??  Why have I never heard of them?  They must be
>pretty
>low profile.  Are they fur trade era?  Geez, right in my own backyard
>(literally, same zip code as my house).
>
>HBC
>
>
>
>****************************************
>Henry B. Crawford    Box 43191
>Curator of History    Museum of Texas Tech University
>[e-mail]    Lubbock, TX  79409-3191
>806/742-2442     FAX [phone]
>              Website: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum
>******  Living History . . . Because It's There  ******
>
>
>
>

___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 14:42:33 -0700
From: [e-mail] (Angela Gottfred)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Black fur traders (was: Responses to my (Henry's) post)

"stitchinscot" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Could you document the trappers and traders of African descent for me please.
>It would be interesting to know.  Thank you in advance:  Long John

Here are some Black voyageurs from the Canadian fur trade:

In 1800, "Pierre Bonza or Bonga, a negro" went to Red River with Alexander
Henry the Younger. By 1804, he was an interpreter for the North West
Company. His family had close Native ties. (Henry the Younger, Coues ed., 50)

In 1803, XY Company fur trader Michel Curot watches rival NWC wintering
partner John Sayer come & go. "About three o'clock Mr. Sayer arrived at the
fort in his canoe with only his Baggage, his wife, Two Children, a negro,
and another man." (Nov. 2, 1803) "At 10 o Clock this morning La Garde,
Girard, and the negro arrived at Mr. Sayer's fort." (1804) (Curot, 420, 439)

For the 1820-1821 season in the Athabasca, George Simpson (future head of
the HBC) had at least two people of African heritage working for him.
"Charlo the Guide and Grand Michel the Half Negro are to be my Bow and
Steersmen" in the spring of 1821. (Simpson, _Athabasca_, 188) Also, Crawford
Glasgow worked as a milieu (middle paddler) and cook in the Athabasca that
winter. He was clearly a valuable employee; Simpson wrote that he "speaks
English, French & Iroquois fluently". Although Simpson schemed to keep him
working for the HBC, Glasgow retired to Montreal in the spring of 1821.
(Simpson, _Athabasca_, 112, 290)

There was an incredible diversity in the backgrounds of the people involved
in the fur trade; I have founds records for the Canadian fur trade
(1774-1821) of lots of women (of both Native and European descent), as well
as Germans, Italians, Swiss, ex-soldiers, Norwegians, Hawaiians, Highland
Scots, Americans, Britons, even an East Indian. I haven't found any Chinese
or Japanese people yet, but I figure it's only a matter of spending enough
time on research.

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 17:35:50 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Mikwa

In a message dated 99-02-17 16:28:45 EST, you write:

> Mikwa Tading Post is a mt man / indian / highlander supplyer.  they moved
>  but i thought they are still in Lubbock.

I think his ad in Smoke and Fire News has his new address.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 18:22:00 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

please change my mail from woody4paw to [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 18:24:15 -0600
From: "Mike Rock" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #241

'The Adventures of the Negro Cowboys', by Durham and Jones.  Bantam books,
$1.25
"is a true history patterned after our longer and more scholarly book called
The Negro Cowboys.  There fore if one wants to check the sources and
references for this work, he should turn to the longer book.  There he will
find twenty-three pages of notes and fifteen panes of bibliography"  the
authors.

Beckwourth, real nice photo.  Some other mountain men included.  Good book,
shows real respect where due.

Mike Rock

I am the barrelmaker, and a metallurgical engineer by trade.  Clean your
barrels, whatever the material and they will last.  Don't, they won't.  SS
is subject to BP corrosion as is any ferrous bbl matl.  Actually worse in
some cases.  I have some neglected takeoff bbls that are a real eyeful.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 00:09:20 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Mikwa Trading Post??????????

Greg,
  Mikwa trading post moved to either Longview or Tyler TX.  As soon as my
roommate comes home I'll send you the new address.
Chases Hawks

greg n bosen wrote:

> Does anyone have the current phone and address for Mikwa Trading Post?
> 2402 92nd Lubbock, TX 79423 is wrong, they moved and i lost their new
> number and address!!!
>
> Thanks greg
>
> ___________________________________________________________________
> You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
> Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
> or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 19:34:23 -0600
From: "larry pendleton" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH

John,
  Good to hear from you.  I have a question, in the documents that show
where the AFC was ordering guns from the J.J. Henry Co. to be shipped to
the mountain rendezvous, they specify that all gun stocks are to be
varnished.  Was the varnish they used anything like what we have access t=
o
today?  I think probably not, but is there anything close ?
Pendleton

- ----------
> From: John Kramer <[e-mail]>
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH
> Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 11:51 PM
>=20
> I've been off list for a while with computer problems.
>=20
> Oil paint today (except sign painters paint) isn't remotely similar to
the
> barn
> paint you speak of.  Sign paint nearly takes an act of congress to
acquire and
> though artist oil paint would work the drying time could be easier
measured in
> months.  The pigment would be more helpful on cheap open weave (single
fill)
> canvas.  Pigment is nothing but specific high grade dirt, sift the stuf=
f
in
> your yard through a fine (geologists) screen and it will work dandy.
>=20
> Modern boiled linseed also isn't similar to the traditional product.  S=
ee
my
> postings back in late December '97 for detailed information on working
with
> linseed and making stock finish.  The archives also contain extensive
> discussions of waterproofing cloth.  I posted one taken from Rob Allen'=
s
1804
> sometime last year.
>=20
> Personally I prefer a top quality double fill fine woven canvas with no
> waterproofing added.  If you waterproof too much the condensation trapp=
ed
> within negates any benefit of waterproofing, it is best used to protect
goods
> not people.
>=20
> John...
>=20
>=20
>=20
> At 06:55 PM 2/16/99 -0600, you wrote:
> >The discussion about making oil cloth went on for a while here sometim=
e
> >ago.=A0 What is the difference between using the pigment and linseed o=
il
> >method versus just using plain oil-based paint?=A0 It is my understand=
ing
> >that it was common for barn-red paint to be used for such things.=A0 D=
oes
the
> >linseed and pigment produce a better more pliable tarp?=A0 I have used
just
> >straight linseed oil to waterproof a tarp and it worked great.=A0 The =
only
> >down side was the added weight.=A0=20
> >Pendleton
> >=20
> Use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without.
> John Kramer  <[e-mail]>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 20:01:39 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH

Horace Kephardt makes many references to Nesmuk in "Camping & =
Woodcraft", published before WWI and reprinted recently by the Univ. of =
Tennessee Press.  Horace was no slouch himself when it came to skillful =
camping.  Search out this book, too.  It is well worth the trouble.
Lanney Ratcliff
- -----Original Message-----
From: Roger Lahti <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Wednesday, February 17, 1999 11:39 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH


>
>
>larry pendleton wrote:
>
>> The discussion about making oil cloth went on for a while here =
sometime
>> ago.  ?  I have used just
>> straight linseed oil to waterproof a tarp and it worked great.  The =
only
>> down side was the added weight.
>> Pendleton
>
>Pendelton,
>
>This is not so much an answer to your question as it is an opportunity =
to pass
>on some information that I promised a few days back and just found. I =
think it
>will be of interest considering your last comment about weight.
>
>I direct your attention to the book "Nesmuk, Woodcraft and camping" by =
George
>Washington Sears. Sears wrote for the original "Field and Stream" back =
before
>the turn of the Century. He was described as a latter day "Daniel =
Boone" in
>that he as much reinvented camping for pleasure. In working towards =
that goal,
>Sears explored the Adirondacks in a cedar canoe that weighed something =
like 17
>lbs. or less. He was a very small man in stature and was a great =
advocate for
>going light. In the above book he describes his refined camping methods =
and
>there is a lot that can be used to help the present day reenactor get =
into the
>18th Century quicker if one is careful to consider when things were =
appropriate
>as to time frame.
>
>In this book Sears talks of shelters that he built and used and of =
different
>ways to make them weather tight. Some ideas that he practiced are not
>appropriate to what the buckskinner wants to do, like using nails and =
tacks to
>build his shelter with poles and canvas. But Sears does mention oil =
cloth in
>such a way that gives hints as to what it was. He also gives aa simple =
recipe
>for treating canvas so it will shed water and remain light in weight.
>
>In talking of shelters in Chapter III, Sears mentions using oil cloth =
for a few
>seasons but gave it up because the "glazing began to crack and peel off =
in a
>short time". He went on to say that it made a good shelter "but was a =
trifle
>heavy to pack". Then he mentions making another shelter "soaked in =
lime-water
>and alum". This proved to be much better with regards to  weight and =
able to
>withstand a heavy rain for many hrs.
>
>The recipe for the lime-water and alum is as follows. Using a strong =
cotton
>cloth: to 10 quarts of water add 10 oz of lime, and 4 oz of alum; let =
it stand
>until clear; fold the cloth snugly and put in another vessel, pour the =
solution
>on it, let it soak for 12 hrs.; then rinse in luke-warm rain water, =
stretch and
>dry in the sun, and the tarp is ready to use. You can use what ever =
cotton
>cloth you wish but the major portion of the weight will be in the =
material. I
>would recommend a tightly woven cotton cloth in the less than 6 oz =
weight. Make
>up the shelter before you treat if any sewing needs done.
>
>I recommend the books by Sears whole heartedly. They are informative =
and full
>of ideas on how it was done before the advent of so much of our modern =
camping
>gear. I remain......
>
>YMOS
>Capt. Lahti'
>
>
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 03:59:00 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Mikwa Trading Post??????????

Greg,
   The new address for Mikwa TP is as follows;
          Mikwa Trading Post
          4602 Inverness
          Tyler, TX.  75703
          (888)MIKWA-TP     Fax[phone]

    Chases Hawks

greg n bosen wrote:

> Does anyone have the current phone and address for Mikwa Trading Post?
> 2402 92nd Lubbock, TX 79423 is wrong, they moved and i lost their new
> number and address!!!
>
> Thanks greg
>
> ___________________________________________________________________
> You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
> Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
> or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 18:55:37 -0800
From: Dennis Fisher <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Barrel Liner?

My email seems to take a long time to get to the list so if this has already been
discussed hit the delete key now.

I have read many discussions about what was done when a barrel was "shot out" or for
whatever reason has lost it's accurracy.  The most common practice was to "fresh out"
the barrel.  This usually involved polishing the bore and recutting the riflings.
This would restore a worn out barrel.  In really bad cases the barrel was redrilled to
a larger caliber and new riflings cut.  I would do the same today with my rifle when
it reaches that point.

           Dennis

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:53:59 -0900
From: "Bob Aaron" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Mt.Man List - Straight Razors

Source for razor, sharpening stones and leather strops (& instructions on
how to do it) at Col.Ichabod Conk's site:
http://www.col-conk.com/straight.htm  Prices & pictures at site.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 01:01:29 -0600
From: John Kramer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH

Pendelton,

The short answer is no.

In early parlance the terms shellac, varnish or lacquer were interchangeable
and subject to individual as well as regional interpretation.

Today we've come to recognize shellac as a singular specific material, in=
 the
early nineteenth century it could refer to any spirit (alcohol) base finish;
many resins are spirit soluble. =20

It is more likely the stocks were finished with either oil or volatile oil
varnish.  Sometime back we had extensive discussions of varnish which
should be
in the archive.

Though the term lacquer was used the material was specific to the Orient;
today
it references a modified nitro cellulose product or in the case of water=
 base
lacquer -- synthetic latex or the even more mysterious water based=
 urethanes.

Today nearly every varnish available is wholly synthetic and not very good.=
=20
Look on the can if it states alkyd resins it means it is made of soybeans.=
=20
Traditional volatile oil and oil varnishes were made of tragacanth, hog,
damar,
copal and other tree resins.

By example; I ran an experiment with best grade modern exterior oil paint on
two buildings I own three years ago.  One I prepared with a traditional=
 primer
I made, the other with the paint manufacturers recommended primer.  Both=
 lost
several shades of the carefully chosen color the first year, as I
discovered on
touching up some additional work I did on one of the buildings. =20

The one I treated with the traditional primer is doing the best but the=
 paint
is chalky and needing replacement.  The one done with the manufacturers=
 primer
is peeling off in large sheets.  The paint manufacturer blames EPA=
 regulations
for the lousy quality of the paint.  We are still negotiating who pays to
repaint my sad looking buildings.

In terms of finishes there was a greater variety of better quality used in=
 the
early nineteenth century than today.  Many names of quality materials have
been
hijacked by modern products of inferior quality.  By example; Japan Drier
isn't
remotely similar to the original product, nor boiled linseed, nor barn=
 paint,
nor varnish.  Some have been changed or withdrawn for good reason many=
 simply
to produce a cheaper product.

Making varnish is nearly as hazardous as making black powder though each is
still possible.  Traditionally varnish was applied very thinly, not the=
 thick
heavy coatings popular today.  A proper hand rubbed oil finish wears better=
 on
gunstocks than the best varnish-- over the long term.

I have basically quit using varnish except for small quantities I make to
match
original work in restoration.  A few years back Albert Constantine and Sons=
 of
Bronx, NY offered three natural resin varnishes.  They were not the best=
 I've
used but better than the alternative.  I do not know if they are still
available.

John...



At 07:34 PM 2/17/99 -0600, you wrote:
>John,
>=A0 Good to hear from you.=A0 I have a question, in the documents that show
>where the AFC was ordering guns from the J.J. Henry Co. to be shipped to
>the mountain rendezvous, they specify that all gun stocks are to be
>varnished.=A0 Was the varnish they used anything like what we have access=
 to
>today?=A0 I think probably not, but is there anything close ?
>Pendleton
>
>----------
>> From: John Kramer <[e-mail]>
>> To: [e-mail]
>> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH
>> Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 11:51 PM
>>=20
>> I've been off list for a while with computer problems.
>>=20
>> Oil paint today (except sign painters paint) isn't remotely similar to
>the
>> barn
>> paint you speak of.=A0 Sign paint nearly takes an act of congress to
>acquire and
>> though artist oil paint would work the drying time could be easier
>measured in
>> months.=A0 The pigment would be more helpful on cheap open weave (single
>fill)
>> canvas.=A0 Pigment is nothing but specific high grade dirt, sift the=
 stuff
>in
>> your yard through a fine (geologists) screen and it will work dandy.
>>=20
>> Modern boiled linseed also isn't similar to the traditional product.=A0=
 See
>my
>> postings back in late December '97 for detailed information on working
>with
>> linseed and making stock finish.=A0 The archives also contain extensive
>> discussions of waterproofing cloth.=A0 I posted one taken from Rob=
 Allen's
>1804
>> sometime last year.
>>=20
>> Personally I prefer a top quality double fill fine woven canvas with no
>> waterproofing added.=A0 If you waterproof too much the condensation=
 trapped
>> within negates any benefit of waterproofing, it is best used to protect
>goods
>> not people.
>>=20
>> John...
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> At 06:55 PM 2/16/99 -0600, you wrote:
>> >The discussion about making oil cloth went on for a while here sometime
>> >ago.=A0 What is the difference between using the pigment and linseed oil
>> >method versus just using plain oil-based paint?=A0 It is my=
 understanding
>> >that it was common for barn-red paint to be used for such things.=A0=
 Does
>the
>> >linseed and pigment produce a better more pliable tarp?=A0 I have used
>just
>> >straight linseed oil to waterproof a tarp and it worked great.=A0 The=
 only
>> >down side was the added weight.=A0=20
>> >Pendleton
>> >=20
>> Use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without.
>> John Kramer=A0 <[e-mail]>
>=20
Use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without.
John Kramer  <[e-mail]>

------------------------------

End of hist_text-digest V1 #242
*******************************

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