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hist_text-digest      Tuesday, February 16 1999      Volume 01 : Number 241




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:55:21 -0600
From: "larry pendleton" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH

The discussion about making oil cloth went on for a while here sometime
ago.  What is the difference between using the pigment and linseed oil
method versus just using plain oil-based paint?  It is my understanding
that it was common for barn-red paint to be used for such things.  Does the
linseed and pigment produce a better more pliable tarp?  I have used just
straight linseed oil to waterproof a tarp and it worked great.  The only
down side was the added weight.
Pendleton

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:24:14 -0800
From: Tom Roberts <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

Well OldFox,  I certainly invited the lead but I hadn't expected quite such
velocity.  I'm bleeding but have not fallen. I'm only here to learn and won't hold
as much information if full of holes.  I did not intend to imply that alloy
substitution would constitute an excuse for poor maintenance.  I guess a possible
(but admittedly poor) analogy would be multiple carburetors versus fuel injection.
Both will do the job, both will fail if not properly cared for, one requires high
maintenance, and the other requires less.  My admitted lack of experience is
obvious, but I can envision circumstance where the best of care may not be
immediately possible and an alternate alloy, visually undistinguishable, might
offer some slight advantage.  Let me ask how you would prepare for/deal with, this
hypothetical situation:  drop gun in water from canoe (yes, I know it should be
tethered), lengthy delay in retrieval.   I concur that the cost of lining a barrel
could be prohibitively expensive rendering this whole dialogue moot.  Any barrel
machinists out there care to speculate on cost?

Holding hat on a stick - waiting nervously for next salvo

Tom

[e-mail] wrote:

> In a message dated 99-02-16 17:07:01 EST, you write:
>
> > Probably a dumb question
>
> There are no dumb questions; only dumb people who ask them.
>
> >  since reproduction barrels use modern
> >  metallurgy, and since BP residue is so corrosive, hasn't anyone
> >  considered using a barrel liner of some non-corroding alloy?
>
> Barrel liners are available.  They cost more than a new barrel, plus the added
> cost of having them installed.  What's the point?  Unless trying to salvage an
> old unreplaceable original, they serve no useful purpose.
>
> >  There are high
> >  strength alloys which are also highly corrosion resistant (and also
> >  rather expensive) that could insure a lifetime barrel with greatly
> >  reduced maintenance requirements.
>
> Lifetime barrels are, and always have been, available.  They are on the guns
> of people who practice routine maintenance.  Contrary to your statement about
> BP being so corrosive, it is only so in the guns of those who practice greatly
> reduced maintenance.  For a discussion of those people, kindly refer to part 2
> of statement 1 in reply to your first question.
>
> >  I'm going to duck now and enjoy the barrage from a safe vantage point.
>
> Thank you for the invitation for a little target practice.
>
> OldFox

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:02:06 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Bob Spencer)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

>Probably a dumb question, but since reproduction barrels use modern
>metallurgy, and since BP residue is so corrosive, hasn't anyone
>considered using a barrel liner of some non-corroding alloy?

It would probably be a good solution, Tom, but in my experience, it's a
solution to a problem which doesn't exist. I've never found corrosion to be
a problem in my guns. Yes, they are all made of different  modern alloys,
I'm sure, but none of them seems very susceptible to this corrosion problem
I hear so much about.

I have guns which have been shot a moderate amount for more than 30 years,
and the bores still look the same to me now as when I started. I am a
hunter, and I drag my guns through some pretty messy situations, so they
aren't pampered guns. I've used a variety of cleaning methods over that
time period, many different lubes, and they all seem to prevent the problem
completely if I do my part, which I always do. The only constant in my long
experience has been that I use only real black powder, have never fired a
single load of a BP substitute.

I wouldn't pay an extra nickle for a special corrosion resistant alloy or a
barrel liner, because I see absolutely no need for either.

Bob

Bob Spencer <[e-mail]>
non illegitimi carborundum est

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:25:00 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware

I have a custom made tinned copper pot shaped exactly as you describe.  =
I holds within an ounce or two of one gallon and is a good item for all =
the uses you mention.  I had a craftsman make it based on one being held =
by a man in AJ Miller's "Trappers at Breakfast"....at least that is what =
my memory tells me is the name of the work.  My old, much used and =
abused coffee pot stays home now.
Don't ask for the craftsman's name because the pot was such a pain in =
the arse to make that he said that mine would be unique as far as he was =
concerned,  because he wasn't making another one.    Find me at the =
national rdv in July and have a look.
Lanney Ratcliff

- -----Original Message-----
From: Laurel huber <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Monday, February 15, 1999 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware


>Dear Joe,
>    I doubt that any trapper or Fur Brigade brought a coffee POT along =
with 'em.
>I'm referring to a flared bottomed, pitcher-shaped boiler with a lid, =
handle and
>bail.  Like the kind cowboys use in all those movies. It was just too =
specific an
>item to pack along.  Coffee and tea kettles shaped like that did exist =
but stayed
>in the settlements indoors.  A coffee kettle(a tea kettle boils water, =
a tea pot
>brews tea in water)in the mountains would have been a straight-sided =
can-shape
>with a bail.  It could be used for coffee, tea, water, stew, or soup.  =
There are
>nice sketches of them by Miller in his works: "Indians Encamped on the =
Eau Sucre
>River" and "Our Camp".  If you buy one by catalog from Jarnigin, it's =
called an
>"1820 Period Coffee Pot" and is copied from a dig from a 6th US =
Infantry camp
>dated 1820.  Made of  heavy tin.  Works good for coffee and whatever.
>
>Larry "Shoots-the-Prairie" Huber
>
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>> Since they didn't have enamel ware and coffee and tea were drank.  =
What did
>> they use for coffee pots?  I have seen copper tea pots, but what =
about coffee
>> pots?
>>
>>                                                 TrapRJoe
>
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:28:10 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: SALT PETER

Larry (chair burner to some....ask him about it) lives very near Sulphur =
Springs, Texas where sulphur is mined.  I assume that his friend lives =
in the same area. Shouldn't be a problem for anyone in the area.
Lanney
- -----Original Message-----
From: Mill, Kirk <[e-mail]>
To: '[e-mail]' <[e-mail]>
Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 8:03 AM
Subject: RE: MtMan-List: SALT PETER


>
>>  Subject: MtMan-List: SALT PETER
>>=20
>> Ok boys and girls.  How do you make salt peter ? A buddy of mine who
>> aspires to make his own black powder, wants to make it all from =
scratch.
>> He
>> may be a half bubble off plumb, but it is a good question.  Does =
anybody
>> have any idea how to make the stuff ?
>> Pendleton
> [Mill, Kirk]  One of the Foxfire books has fairly detailed
>instructions on making salt petre. It looks pretty time consuming and =
of
>course the consensus of the list is homemade BP is a recipe for =
disaster. If
>your buddy is so intent on making powder from scratch, where does =
intend to
>find the sulphur? Does he have a volcano in his back yard?
> Kirk Mill
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:25:27 -0800
From: Chris Sega <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Buffalo extinction

On The Decline of buffalo, You don't have to shoot em all you just have to
affect calf mortality and the reproductive rate.  Large Herbivores are generally
slow to bring calves to breeding age.  If  you affect the reproductive rate a
population will go into decline, and become worse each year if you add habitat
loss, Disruption of migration routes and any natural causes such as bad weather
will put the population into a tailspin.  If you will recall, bison used to live
east of the mississippi, and they were hunted and farmed out in short order.
Your most onry' and disobdient hivernant
Sega

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:35:16 -0600
From: John Dearing <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #240

>
>
>
>
>
> > I expect that using a more corrosion
> >resistant alloy would not degrade our authenticity one bit. The only problem I
> >forsee, would be the inability to brown a barrel, if that was the desired finish,
> >if the whole barrel was corrosion resistant alloy and not just lined - thus, the
> >liner concept.   I knew this could be controversial, thanks for only using a small
> >charge!

The problem with so called corrosion resistant steels for ML gun barrels is that
while surface rust won't form on them, no steel will resist the corrosive effects of
BP for long. Even the best SS steel will readily pit if left in contact with BP
residue.

If I remember correctly, Ruger's early SS percussion revolver pitted so badly that
Ruger had to change the alloy of the SS  to one that will better resist the corrosive
effects of BP.

J.D.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:35:52 -0800
From: RANDAL J BUBLITZ <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Responses to my (Henry's)post

John,             James P. Beckworth, Edward Rose, Moses Harris had
decended from African bloodlines.  Check them out.  I recall reading of
others, but don't recollect names right now.  Hope all is well with you
on the prarie.  Hardtack

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:55:05 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: SALT PETER

Larry
FYI, our brother Bill A. from Flower Mound knows of a cave near Mason =
with large deposits of bat guano....in case your non plumb friend needs =
some.  However, he would have to risk jail to trespass on a bat preserve =
to get it.
Lanney
- -----Original Message-----
From: larry pendleton <[e-mail]>
To: mountain lists <[e-mail]>
Date: Monday, February 15, 1999 9:03 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: SALT PETER


>Ok boys and girls.  How do you make salt peter ? A buddy of mine who
>aspires to make his own black powder, wants to make it all from =
scratch. He
>may be a half bubble off plumb, but it is a good question.  Does =
anybody
>have any idea how to make the stuff ?
>Pendleton
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:50:10 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Dennis Miles)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware

Lanney,
 You are GOOD at one of a kind items from craftsmen, you are lucky there
isn't a warning flyer out about you.. If you weren't so damned cuddly, there
would be a bounty on your ass...
Love,
D

   "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
          DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
  Period Knives & Iron Accouterments
    http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
- -----Original Message-----
From: Lanney Ratcliff <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 9:43 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware


I have a custom made tinned copper pot shaped exactly as you describe.  I
holds within an ounce or two of one gallon and is a good item for all the
uses you mention.  I had a craftsman make it based on one being held by a
man in AJ Miller's "Trappers at Breakfast"....at least that is what my
memory tells me is the name of the work.  My old, much used and abused
coffee pot stays home now.
Don't ask for the craftsman's name because the pot was such a pain in the
arse to make that he said that mine would be unique as far as he was
concerned,  because he wasn't making another one.    Find me at the national
rdv in July and have a look.
Lanney Ratcliff

- ----

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:09:58 -0800
From: Tom Roberts <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

Thanks for the gentle reply.  I'm interested in learning what
cleaning/preservation method you have evolved to for multi-day field
maintenance. Do you grease the barrel at the end of each day and then solvent
wipe prior to first load next day?   I'm also thinking that perhaps current
barrel alloys may already offer substantial corrosion resistance, i.e.,
chromium content.

Tom

Bob Spencer wrote:

> >Probably a dumb question, but since reproduction barrels use modern
> >metallurgy, and since BP residue is so corrosive, hasn't anyone
> >considered using a barrel liner of some non-corroding alloy?
>
> It would probably be a good solution, Tom, but in my experience, it's a
> solution to a problem which doesn't exist. I've never found corrosion to be
> a problem in my guns. Yes, they are all made of different  modern alloys,
> I'm sure, but none of them seems very susceptible to this corrosion problem
> I hear so much about.
>
> I have guns which have been shot a moderate amount for more than 30 years,
> and the bores still look the same to me now as when I started. I am a
> hunter, and I drag my guns through some pretty messy situations, so they
> aren't pampered guns. I've used a variety of cleaning methods over that
> time period, many different lubes, and they all seem to prevent the problem
> completely if I do my part, which I always do. The only constant in my long
> experience has been that I use only real black powder, have never fired a
> single load of a BP substitute.
>
> I wouldn't pay an extra nickle for a special corrosion resistant alloy or a
> barrel liner, because I see absolutely no need for either.
>
> Bob
>
> Bob Spencer <[e-mail]>
> non illegitimi carborundum est

------------------------------

Date: 16 Feb 99 20:07:55 -0700
From: Phyllis and Don Keas <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware

Need one, so what would be the address, phone # or e-mail for Jarnigin?

DON AND PHYLLIS KEAS ---LIving History Consultants

Laurel huber wrote:
>Dear Joe,
>    I doubt that any trapper or Fur Brigade brought a coffee POT along
with 'em.
>I'm referring to a flared bottomed, pitcher-shaped boiler with a lid,
handle and
>bail.  Like the kind cowboys use in all those movies. It was just too
>specific an
>item to pack along.  Coffee and tea kettles shaped like that did exist
but
>stayed
>in the settlements indoors.  A coffee kettle(a tea kettle boils water, a
tea pot
>brews tea in water)in the mountains would have been a straight-sided
can-shape
>with a bail.  It could be used for coffee, tea, water, stew, or soup.
There are
>nice sketches of them by Miller in his works: "Indians Encamped on the
Eau Sucre
>River" and "Our Camp".  If you buy one by catalog from Jarnigin, it's
called an
>"1820 Period Coffee Pot" and is copied from a dig from a 6th US Infantry
camp
>dated 1820.  Made of  heavy tin.  Works good for coffee and whatever.
>
>Larry "Shoots-the-Prairie" Huber
>
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>> Since they didn't have enamel ware and coffee and tea were drank.
What did
>> they use for coffee pots?  I have seen copper tea pots, but what about
coffee
>> pots?
>>
>>                                                 TrapRJoe
>
>
>
>
>
>
>RFC822 header
>-----------------------------------
>
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:16:44 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware

...and a large bounty it would be, don't you know?!
L
- -----Original Message-----
From: Dennis Miles <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 8:49 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware


>Lanney,
> You are GOOD at one of a kind items from craftsmen, you are lucky =
there
>isn't a warning flyer out about you.. If you weren't so damned cuddly, =
there
>would be a bounty on your ass...
>Love,
>D
>
>   "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
>          DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
>  Period Knives & Iron Accouterments
>    http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Lanney Ratcliff <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
>Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 9:43 PM
>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware
>
>
>I have a custom made tinned copper pot shaped exactly as you describe.  =
I
>holds within an ounce or two of one gallon and is a good item for all =
the
>uses you mention.  I had a craftsman make it based on one being held by =
a
>man in AJ Miller's "Trappers at Breakfast"....at least that is what my
>memory tells me is the name of the work.  My old, much used and abused
>coffee pot stays home now.
>Don't ask for the craftsman's name because the pot was such a pain in =
the
>arse to make that he said that mine would be unique as far as he was
>concerned,  because he wasn't making another one.    Find me at the =
national
>rdv in July and have a look.
>Lanney Ratcliff
>
>----
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:14:06 -0800
From: RANDAL J BUBLITZ <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

Tom, I believe in the natural way to clean/ maintain my BP guns.  I read
a long time ago, and believe, that natural oils are best for these
firearms.  I use vegetable, or animal, oils for preserving my guns.  The
idea is likened to curing a cast iron skillet.  I use water to clean my
gun, and animal/vegetable grease to grease it.  It works for me.
Hardtack

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:13:56 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Dennis Miles)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware

Aye Lad, $5. American,    at least...
D

   "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
          DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
  Period Knives & Iron Accouterments
    http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
- -----Original Message-----
From: Lanney Ratcliff <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 10:34 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware


...and a large bounty it would be, don't you know?!
L
- -----Original Message-----
From: Dennis Miles <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 8:49 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware


>Lanney,
> You are GOOD at one of a kind items from craftsmen, you are lucky there
>isn't a warning flyer out about you.. If you weren't so damned cuddly,
there
>would be a bounty on your ass...
>Love,
>D
>
>   "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
>          DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
>  Period Knives & Iron Accouterments
>    http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Lanney Ratcliff <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
>Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 9:43 PM
>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware
>
>
>I have a custom made tinned copper pot shaped exactly as you describe.  I
>holds within an ounce or two of one gallon and is a good item for all the
>uses you mention.  I had a craftsman make it based on one being held by a
>man in AJ Miller's "Trappers at Breakfast"....at least that is what my
>memory tells me is the name of the work.  My old, much used and abused
>coffee pot stays home now.
>Don't ask for the craftsman's name because the pot was such a pain in the
>arse to make that he said that mine would be unique as far as he was
>concerned,  because he wasn't making another one.    Find me at the
national
>rdv in July and have a look.
>Lanney Ratcliff
>
>----
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:15:24 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Dennis Miles)
Subject: Fw: MtMan-List: Graniteware

Aye Lad, $5. American,    at least...
D

   "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e"
          DOUBLE EDGE FORGE
  Period Knives & Iron Accouterments
>    http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Lanney Ratcliff <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
>Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 10:34 PM
>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware
>
>
>...and a large bounty it would be, don't you know?!
>L
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Dennis Miles <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
>Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 8:49 PM
>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:30:34 -0500
From: greg n bosen <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Mikwa Trading Post??????????

Does anyone have the current phone and address for Mikwa Trading Post?
2402 92nd Lubbock, TX 79423 is wrong, they moved and i lost their new
number and address!!!

Thanks greg

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:29:51 -0600
From: Jim Colburn <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

Washtahay-
At 10:09 PM 2/16/99 -0800, you wrote:
>I'm interested in learning what
>cleaning/preservation method you have evolved to for multi-day field
>maintenance. Do you grease the barrel at the end of each day and then solvent
>wipe prior to first load next day?   I'm also thinking that perhaps current
>barrel alloys may already offer substantial corrosion resistance, i.e.,
>chromium content.
    One of the guns I use on a fairly regular basis has a wrought-iron barrel
(it used to be a wagon tire).  As best I can tell, it has no more corrosion
resistence than any other wrought iron, as was used back then.  Clean with
wet tow, dry with a couple more wads of tow.  Wipe the metal with an oiled
patch (usually neatsfoot oil or deer tallow).  No rust problems in the 10
or so years I've been using it.
    If you want a "stainless" barrel liner, cost breakdown is something like
this:  stainless barrel blank ca. $150, turning it down to a liner ca $100,
boring out and lining barrel ca. $175 (I called a gunsmith).  Looks to me
like it would be easier to just take care of the barrel you have.
LongWalker c. du B.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:32:19 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Bob Spencer)
Subject: MtMan-List: cleaning, was Barrel Liner?

>Thanks for the gentle reply.  I'm interested in learning what
>cleaning/preservation method you have evolved to for multi-day field
>maintenance. Do you grease the barrel at the end of each day and then solvent
>wipe prior to first load next day?   I'm also thinking that perhaps current
>barrel alloys may already offer substantial corrosion resistance, i.e.,
>chromium content.

Well, my way of doing it is very simple, but I use a couple of different
methods, depending upon whether I'm cleaning a rifle or a smoothbore. I've
become a flintlock smoothbore addict, and that's all I shoot, these days,
so I'll start with that. Remember, I'm describing my way of cleaning in
hunting camp, when little actual shooting is done, or on a trek, when 30
shots in a day is a lot.

I use a homebrew lube of 25% beeswax and 75% hog lard, and that's my patch
lube as well as lube for my bore and the outside of my gun, wood and all.
To clean, I just plug up the touch-hole, pour a half-cup of cold water down
the bore, put my thumb over the muzzle and tilt the gun back and forth 3-4
times while rotating it, to make certain all parts of the bore are being
washed. After doing this 3-4 times, the water comes out clear. I then swab
the bore 3-4-5 times,, using just a snug, soft wet patch on a gun worm,
making sure I rotate the patch all the time while running it up and down
the bore, and especially down in the breech. Then 2-3 dry patches done the
same. Then 1-2 lubricated patches, again paying particular attention to the
breech. Rub down the outside and I'm finished, takes about 10-15 minutes,
tops. Before loading the next morning, I just run a dry patch to remove any
excess lube and load as usual.

If in hunting camp, I don't hesitate to leave the gun loaded for 3-4-5
days, regardless of the weather. I have shot, reloaded and left the dirty
gun loaded overnight, many times, without any problem.

For a rifle, the method is the same with a couple of minor changes. I use a
tight patch on a jag, not a gun worm for the cleaning. I use Wonderlube or
Natural Lube 1000 (same stuff) for lubricating the cleaned bore and for
patch lube. Again, I don't hesitate to leave the gun loaded overnight if it
was loaded on a clean bore, and even for one night if it has been fired and
reloaded.

In the past, I have used hot soapy water, WD-40 and gun oil for a lot of
years. I've also used Number 13 and Number 13 Plus as the solvent, either
after the water cleaning or as the only liquid. Never had any problem with
any of these methods, so long as I was concientious in my cleaning.

Sorry to be so long winded. Takes longer to tell it than to do it.

Bob

Bob Spencer <[e-mail]>
non illegitimi carborundum est

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:02:08 -0800
From: Laurel huber <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Barrel Liner?

I agree with Randy on this.  Bear grease or whale oil are probably the
best...and a little bit goes a long ways.  Whale oil is damn near impossible
to get but bear grease can be used in states that allow bear to be taken
legally.  Petroleum based oils and Black Powder do not seem to do well
together.

Larry "Shoot-the-Prairie" Huber

RANDAL J BUBLITZ wrote:

> Tom, I believe in the natural way to clean/ maintain my BP guns.  I read
> a long time ago, and believe, that natural oils are best for these
> firearms.  I use vegetable, or animal, oils for preserving my guns.  The
> idea is likened to curing a cast iron skillet.  I use water to clean my
> gun, and animal/vegetable grease to grease it.  It works for me.
> Hardtack

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 23:51:13 -0600
From: John Kramer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: OIL CLOTH

I've been off list for a while with computer problems.

Oil paint today (except sign painters paint) isn't remotely similar to the
barn
paint you speak of.  Sign paint nearly takes an act of congress to acquire=
 and
though artist oil paint would work the drying time could be easier measured=
 in
months.  The pigment would be more helpful on cheap open weave (single fill)
canvas.  Pigment is nothing but specific high grade dirt, sift the stuff in
your yard through a fine (geologists) screen and it will work dandy.

Modern boiled linseed also isn't similar to the traditional product.  See my
postings back in late December '97 for detailed information on working with
linseed and making stock finish.  The archives also contain extensive
discussions of waterproofing cloth.  I posted one taken from Rob Allen's=
 1804
sometime last year.

Personally I prefer a top quality double fill fine woven canvas with no
waterproofing added.  If you waterproof too much the condensation trapped
within negates any benefit of waterproofing, it is best used to protect=
 goods
not people.

John...



At 06:55 PM 2/16/99 -0600, you wrote:
>The discussion about making oil cloth went on for a while here sometime
>ago.=A0 What is the difference between using the pigment and linseed oil
>method versus just using plain oil-based paint?=A0 It is my understanding
>that it was common for barn-red paint to be used for such things.=A0 Does=
 the
>linseed and pigment produce a better more pliable tarp?=A0 I have used just
>straight linseed oil to waterproof a tarp and it worked great.=A0 The only
>down side was the added weight.=A0=20
>Pendleton
>=20
Use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without.
John Kramer  <[e-mail]>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:11:08 -0800
From: Laurel huber <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Graniteware

Okay, Keas Duo, here you go:
    C & D Jarnagin Company
    PO Box 1860
    Corinth, MS 38835-1860
Phone: [phone] or...www.avsia.com/jarnagin/jarnagin.html
You want their 18th Century catalog(they do much Civil War stuff).  My issue is
from 1996 and cost $3.00.  Good luck.

Larry Huber
Shoots-the-Prairie

Phyllis and Don Keas wrote:

> Need one, so what would be the address, phone # or e-mail for Jarnigin?
>
> DON AND PHYLLIS KEAS ---LIving History Consultants
>
> Laurel huber wrote:
> >Dear Joe,
> >    I doubt that any trapper or Fur Brigade brought a coffee POT along
> with 'em.
> >I'm referring to a flared bottomed, pitcher-shaped boiler with a lid,
> handle and
> >bail.  Like the kind cowboys use in all those movies. It was just too
> >specific an
> >item to pack along.  Coffee and tea kettles shaped like that did exist
> but
> >stayed
> >in the settlements indoors.  A coffee kettle(a tea kettle boils water, a
> tea pot
> >brews tea in water)in the mountains would have been a straight-sided
> can-shape
> >with a bail.  It could be used for coffee, tea, water, stew, or soup.
> There are
> >nice sketches of them by Miller in his works: "Indians Encamped on the
> Eau Sucre
> >River" and "Our Camp".  If you buy one by catalog from Jarnigin, it's
> called an
> >"1820 Period Coffee Pot" and is copied from a dig from a 6th US Infantry
> camp
> >dated 1820.  Made of  heavy tin.  Works good for coffee and whatever.
> >
> >Larry "Shoots-the-Prairie" Huber
> >
> >[e-mail] wrote:
> >
> >> Since they didn't have enamel ware and coffee and tea were drank.
> What did
> >> they use for coffee pots?  I have seen copper tea pots, but what about
> coffee
> >> pots?
> >>
> >>                                                 TrapRJoe
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >RFC822 header
> >-----------------------------------
> >
> >Received: from lists.xmission.com [198.60.22.7] by mail.market1.com with
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> (PST)
> >Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
> >Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 19:44:44 -0800
> >From: Laurel huber <[e-mail]>
> >X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I)
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------------------------------

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