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From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #1264 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Monday, November 10 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1264 In this issue: -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Calling Frenchtown Sean -áááááá MtMan-List: Crass Commercial Announcement -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: bedding ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 20:31:31 -0500 From: "Addison Miller" <admiller@citynet.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Calling Frenchtown Sean Oops... wrong person... sorry.... Ad - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Addison Miller" <admiller@citynet.net> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 5:31 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Calling Frenchtown Sean > Sure... :)) email for the MLML is seanbear@charter.net .... > > Or... you can use my regular email aomiller@charter.net .... > > Regards, > > Ad Miller > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 20:44:02 -0500 From: "Addison Miller" <admiller@citynet.net> Subject: MtMan-List: Crass Commercial Announcement Speaking of "Commercial" announcements... I have a tent that I want to sell. It is a 13x13 Markee (one pole) with 7' walls, a 10x13 add-a-room, and a 10x16 fly. The tent and add-a-room were made by Al Levins, the Fly by Panther. The tent is about 3 years old, and the add-a-room was bought this year. They fly is about 7 years old, but literally does not show it, and is still very serviceable. Total cost of these items was about $2000. Asking price is $1400 plus shipping. If you come to Alderson, WV to pick it up, I'll include the poles. Not sure what shipping will be, but it will be in 3-4 boxes via UPS, and roughly 100 pounds. Anyone interested, go to www.ups.com and put in your zip code, my zip code (24910), and 100# weight. There will be pictures of it up on my web site in a couple of days. URL will be www.geocities.com/ronnyvous/tent. Regards, Ad Miller - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 21:26:33 EST From: SWcushing@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding - -------------------------------1068517593 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/10/2003 5:31:24 PM Pacific Standard Time, beaverboy@sofast.net writes: If bison is so great why is everyone wearing wool copotes and not bison robe coats? Because they use the robe to sleep under? <G> Naw, pretty hard to beat wool for most anything, but if things get ugly, I go with the robe. And, if I hadn't shot a buffalo and sold my kids into slavery to have it brain tanned, I'd be sleeping under a bunch of wool blankets too! Crazy has probably as much time fighting frost bite as any.... how do you stay warm, ya ole' Cyot? Magpie - -------------------------------1068517593 Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <HTML><HEAD> <META charset=3DUTF-8 http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charse= t=3Dutf-8"> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2730.1700" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffff= f"> <DIV> <DIV>In a message dated 11/10/2003 5:31:24 PM Pacific Standard Time, beaverb= oy@sofast.net writes:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue=20= 2px solid"><FONT face=3DArial>If bison is so great why is everyone wearing w= ool copotes and not bison<BR>robe coats?</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV> <DIV>Because they use the robe to sleep under? <G> N= aw, pretty hard to beat wool for most anything, but if things get ugly, I go= with the robe. And, if I hadn't shot a buffalo and sold my kids into slaver= y to have it brain tanned, I'd be sleeping under a bunch of wool blankets to= o!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Crazy has probably as much time fighting frost bite as any.... how do y= ou stay warm, ya ole' Cyot?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Magpie</DIV></BODY></HTML> - -------------------------------1068517593-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 19:47:21 -0700 (MST) From: beaverboy@sofast.net Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding Or maybe no one wants to be the first one to cut up a $600 dollar robe for a coat! I will, as soon as I win the lottery. bb > If bison is so great why is everyone wearing wool copotes and not bison > robe coats? > Because they use the robe to sleep under? <G> Naw, pretty hard to beat > wool for most anything, but if things get ugly, I go with the robe. And, > if I > hadn't shot a buffalo and sold my kids into slavery to have it brain > tanned, I'd > be sleeping under a bunch of wool blankets too! > > Crazy has probably as much time fighting frost bite as any.... how do you > stay warm, ya ole' Cyot? > > Magpie > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 19:50:44 -0700 From: James and Sue Stone <jandsstone@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding - --------------010809070305090706080309 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Beaverboy, I am impressed with your answer. I love wool myself, and still prefer wool layers in any nasty kind of weather for most things. Of course, Mrs. Stone, Knitting Woman, will also agree with your point of view. I have a hair-on commercial tanned elk skin that I shot off a Utah elk in late November a few years back. I think I'd rather carry wool than pack the elk skin around in the woods. I was an "exclusively natural fibers" guy--particularly wool, cotton and down--until recently. Now I add some manmade fibers for special uses...like for waterfowling/camo purposes and in-the-weather type kayaking gear (i.e. neoprenes). Of course, I'd never consider using the off-century fibers in a pre-1840 era reenactment. Sparks and Mrs. Stone beaverboy@sofast.net wrote: >>Hmmmm..... Beaver, your robe must be a summer kill, or at least not prime. >> >> > >Magpie, > My robe came from Yellowstone Park in the winter when they were in >there shooting them and selling the hides a few years back. > I was a furbuyer for 10 years, I could spot, smell or taste a summer >hide or flat pelt in the dark a 1/2 mile away. No, it's a winter hide >and from Yellowstone Park. It's the real thing. 6'x6' or 36' square >feet. > It is commercially tanned which makes it heavier than brain tanned but >only rich pilots and retired Colonel biologist can afford prime brain >tanned bison hides. (just kidding) Most people cannot afford a hide >tanned by Wes. > I know Larry is a poor trapper like beaverboy. > Any wet bison hide regardless of how it is tanned weighs a lot and does >not retain it's insulation like wool does when wet, nothing does. Plus >wool dries much faster than any type of wet hide ever will. I love wool >above all other fabrics on this earth!!!!!! But hey, thats just my >opinion. I don't care what anyone uses in their camp. > If bison is so great why is everyone wearing wool copotes and not bison >robe coats? > Capt., I use a canvas mantee cloth for wind and moisture protection no >matter which bedding I use. > If bison robes were so great, why did every Indian want wool >blankets??? It wasn't just all the pretty colors. > Larry, I suggest you just buy some white surplus English hospital >blankets (without the blue stripe if you can find them) Or some other >historically correct color blanket and buy five or six of them. You can >find them cheap all over. > Also, do you notice how many campers use a wool blanket with their >bison robes? Maybe thats why they seem so warm???? > Stay warm, > bb > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > - --------------010809070305090706080309 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1"> <title></title> </head> <body> Beaverboy,<br> I am impressed with your answer. I love wool myself, and still prefer wool layers in any nasty kind of weather for most things. Of course, Mrs. Stone, Knitting Woman, will also agree with your point of view. I have a hair-on commercial tanned elk skin that I shot off a Utah elk in late November a few years back. I think I'd rather carry wool than pack the elk skin around in the woods.<br> <br> I was an "exclusively natural fibers" guy--particularly wool, cotton and down--until recently. Now I add some manmade fibers for special uses...like for waterfowling/camo purposes and in-the-weather type kayaking gear (i.e. neoprenes). Of course, I'd never consider using the off-century fibers in a pre-1840 era reenactment.<br> <br> Sparks and Mrs. Stone<br> <br> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:beaverboy@sofast.net">beaverboy@sofast.net</a> wrote:<br> <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid3168.67.1.75.78.1068513711.squirrel@webmail.sofast.net"> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">Hmmmm..... Beaver, your robe must be a summer kill, or at least not prime. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> Magpie, My robe came from Yellowstone Park in the winter when they were in there shooting them and selling the hides a few years back. I was a furbuyer for 10 years, I could spot, smell or taste a summer hide or flat pelt in the dark a 1/2 mile away. No, it's a winter hide and from Yellowstone Park. It's the real thing. 6'x6' or 36' square feet. It is commercially tanned which makes it heavier than brain tanned but only rich pilots and retired Colonel biologist can afford prime brain tanned bison hides. (just kidding) Most people cannot afford a hide tanned by Wes. I know Larry is a poor trapper like beaverboy. Any wet bison hide regardless of how it is tanned weighs a lot and does not retain it's insulation like wool does when wet, nothing does. Plus wool dries much faster than any type of wet hide ever will. I love wool above all other fabrics on this earth!!!!!! But hey, thats just my opinion. I don't care what anyone uses in their camp. If bison is so great why is everyone wearing wool copotes and not bison robe coats? Capt., I use a canvas mantee cloth for wind and moisture protection no matter which bedding I use. If bison robes were so great, why did every Indian want wool blankets??? It wasn't just all the pretty colors. Larry, I suggest you just buy some white surplus English hospital blankets (without the blue stripe if you can find them) Or some other historically correct color blanket and buy five or six of them. You can find them cheap all over. Also, do you notice how many campers use a wool blanket with their bison robes? Maybe thats why they seem so warm???? Stay warm, bb - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> - --------------010809070305090706080309-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 19:53:29 -0700 From: James and Sue Stone <jandsstone@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding - --------------030207050508040606020908 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Actually, what I was using was NOT in a pre-1840 setting, and was in fact a wool fedora. The most important thing is to not wear it like a hat. It feels strange to have a hat parked like you're walking around, while you are laying down. What I do, is use it like my head's own little blanket. Mrs. Stone picked up some soft hats the other day so we could 'practice.' If I learn anything profound I'll let you know. Sparks roger lahti wrote: > Sparks, et.al., > > I've never had much success with a stocking cap but since I got me a > Scottish tam from Jas Townsend and sons, I've not had a problem > keeping it on all night. It may end up turned around a couple times > but it's always there where I left it. <G> > > Capt. Lahti > > > - --------------030207050508040606020908 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1"> <title></title> </head> <body> Actually, what I was using was NOT in a pre-1840 setting, and was in fact a wool fedora. The most important thing is to not wear it like a hat. It feels strange to have a hat parked like you're walking around, while you are laying down. What I do, is use it like my head's own little blanket. Mrs. Stone picked up some soft hats the other day so we could 'practice.' If I learn anything profound I'll let you know.<br> Sparks<br> <br> roger lahti wrote:<br> <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid00ce01c3a7ef$6e1d1d50$e9037444@x2d1a5"> <title></title> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1"> <meta content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1170" name="GENERATOR"> <style></style> <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Sparks, et.al., </font></div> <div> </div> <div><font face="Arial" size="2">I've never had much success with a stocking cap but since I got me a Scottish tam from Jas Townsend and sons, I've not had a problem keeping it on all night. It may end up turned around a couple times but it's always there where I left it. <G></font></div> <div> </div> <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Capt. Lahti</font></div> <div> </div> <div> </div> <div> </div> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> - --------------030207050508040606020908-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 19:57:08 -0700 From: James and Sue Stone <jandsstone@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding - --------------090507070100080703000703 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just out of curiosity, which side of the hide do ya'll sleep on--fleshy side or hair side? Sparks Randal Bublitz wrote: >Larry, I have a braintanned buffalo robe (winter kill cow, from Wes >Housler-New Mex.). I , too, swear by it. I have slept in near 0 temps >with it, a canvas tarp, and a wool blanket- and woke up warm and cozy. >Before the buff robe, I have used a sheep skin as padding, and ground >insulation, and highly recommend a sheep skin. I have used an elk robe, but >the hair is brittle and breaks off (making you feel like having had a fresh >hair cut- scratchy). I solved this by using the elk to lay on top of, with >a mexican saddle blanket over it. Half of the trick to beating the cold is >having insulation under you, as well as a cover over you. I agree that a >wool blanket works better when combined with a piece of tarp to keep the >air flow down. The best/ cheapest bed roll I have used is a 10 X 10' tarp, >a sheep skin and a good wool blanket or two. Lay the tarp down, put the >sheepskin wool side up on half the tarp. lay the blankets out flat on top >of the sheep skin. Lay down (with tarp, sheepskin, blankets under you) >fold blanket(s) over you with other half of tarp. This arrangement works >pretty good for me. The buffalo robe , tarp and maybe a blanket works >better for me. It was hard to spend so much money for a good brain tanned >buff robe, but I don't regret it now that I have one. Yfab, Randy > > > > >>[Original Message] >>From: Larry <L.Renney@bresnan.net> >>To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> >>Date: 11/9/03 9:09:32 PM >>Subject: MtMan-List: bedding >> >>for bedding, the best thing appears to be a buffalo robe. unfortunately >> >> >not > > >>all of us can afford a buffalo robe right off. (I am saving up my >> >> >pennies > > >>and dimes though). so how do the alternates measure up? >>deer hide >>elk >>moose >>bear >>caribou >>what's the next best thing? >>larry >> >> >> >> >>---------------------- >>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html >> >> > > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > - --------------090507070100080703000703 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1"> <title></title> </head> <body> Just out of curiosity, which side of the hide do ya'll sleep on--fleshy side or hair side?<br> Sparks<br> <br> Randal Bublitz wrote:<br> <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid410-220031121105911400@earthlink.net"> <pre wrap="">Larry, I have a braintanned buffalo robe (winter kill cow, from Wes Housler-New Mex.). I , too, swear by it. I have slept in near 0 temps with it, a canvas tarp, and a wool blanket- and woke up warm and cozy. Before the buff robe, I have used a sheep skin as padding, and ground insulation, and highly recommend a sheep skin. I have used an elk robe, but the hair is brittle and breaks off (making you feel like having had a fresh hair cut- scratchy). I solved this by using the elk to lay on top of, with a mexican saddle blanket over it. Half of the trick to beating the cold is having insulation under you, as well as a cover over you. I agree that a wool blanket works better when combined with a piece of tarp to keep the air flow down. The best/ cheapest bed roll I have used is a 10 X 10' tarp, a sheep skin and a good wool blanket or two. Lay the tarp down, put the sheepskin wool side up on half the tarp. lay the blankets out flat on top of the sheep skin. Lay down (with tarp, sheepskin, blankets under you) fold blanket(s) over you with other half of tarp. This arrangement works pretty good for me. The buffalo robe , tarp and maybe a blanket works better for me. It was hard to spend so much money for a good brain tanned buff robe, but I don't regret it now that I have one. Yfab, Randy </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">[Original Message] From: Larry <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:L.Renney@bresnan.net"><L.Renney@bresnan.net></a> To: <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com"><hist_text@lists.xmission.com></a> Date: 11/9/03 9:09:32 PM Subject: MtMan-List: bedding for bedding, the best thing appears to be a buffalo robe. unfortunately </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">not </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">all of us can afford a buffalo robe right off. (I am saving up my </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">pennies </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">and dimes though). so how do the alternates measure up? deer hide elk moose bear caribou what's the next best thing? larry - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> - --------------090507070100080703000703-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 19:54:42 -0800 From: "Randal Bublitz" <rjbublitz@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding - ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII ooops.... I lay the hide down with the hair up, so the hair is towards me underneath and over. Randy - ----- Original Message ----- From: James and Sue Stone To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Sent: 11/10/03 6:57:20 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding Just out of curiosity, which side of the hide do ya'll sleep on--fleshy side or hair side? Sparks Randal Bublitz wrote: Larry, I have a braintanned buffalo robe (winter kill cow, from Wes Housler-New Mex.). I , too, swear by it. I have slept in near 0 temps with it, a canvas tarp, and a wool blanket- and woke up warm and cozy. Before the buff robe, I have used a sheep skin as padding, and ground insulation, and highly recommend a sheep skin. I have used an elk robe, but the hair is brittle and breaks off (making you feel like having had a fresh hair cut- scratchy). I solved this by using the elk to lay on top of, with a mexican saddle blanket over it. Half of the trick to beating the cold is having insulation under you, as well as a cover over you. I agree that a wool blanket works better when combined with a piece of tarp to keep the air flow down. The best/ cheapest bed roll I have used is a 10 X 10' tarp, a sheep skin and a good wool blanket or two. Lay the tarp down, put the sheepskin wool side up on half the tarp. lay the blankets out flat on top of the sheep skin. Lay down (with tarp, sheepskin, blankets under you) fold blanket(s) over you with other half of tarp. This arrangement works pretty good for me. The buffalo robe , tarp and maybe a blanket works better for me. It was hard to spend so much money for a good brain tanned buff robe, but I don't regret it now that I have one. Yfab, Randy [Original Message] From: Larry <L.Renney@bresnan.net> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Date: 11/9/03 9:09:32 PM Subject: MtMan-List: bedding for bedding, the best thing appears to be a buffalo robe. unfortunately not all of us can afford a buffalo robe right off. (I am saving up my pennies and dimes though). so how do the alternates measure up? deer hide elk moose bear caribou what's the next best thing? larry - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII <HTML style="FONT-SIZE: x-small; FONT-FAMILY: MS Sans Serif"><HEAD><TITLE></TITLE> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content=text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1> <META content="MSHTML 5.50.4134.600" name=GENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY> <DIV>ooops.... I lay the hide down with the hair up, so the hair is towards me underneath and over. Randy</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=jandsstone@earthlink.net href="mailto:jandsstone@earthlink.net">James and Sue Stone</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To: </B><A title=hist_text@lists.xmission.com href="mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com">hist_text@lists.xmission.com</A></DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> 11/10/03 6:57:20 PM </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: MtMan-List: bedding</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT size=2>Just out of curiosity, which side of the hide do ya'll sleep on--fleshy side or hair side?<BR>Sparks<BR><BR>Randal Bublitz wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE cite="mid410-220031121105911400@earthlink.net" type="cite"><PRE wrap="">Larry, I have a braintanned buffalo robe (winter kill cow, from Wes Housler-New Mex.). I , too, swear by it. I have slept in near 0 temps with it, a canvas tarp, and a wool blanket- and woke up warm and cozy. Before the buff robe, I have used a sheep skin as padding, and ground insulation, and highly recommend a sheep skin. I have used an elk robe, but the hair is brittle and breaks off (making you feel like having had a fresh hair cut- scratchy). I solved this by using the elk to lay on top of, with a mexican saddle blanket over it. Half of the trick to beating the cold is having insulation under you, as well as a cover over you. I agree that a wool blanket works better when combined with a piece of tarp to keep the air flow down. The best/ cheapest bed roll I have used is a 10 X 10' tarp, a sheep skin and a good wool blanket or two. Lay the tarp down, put the sheepskin wool side up on half the tarp. lay the blankets out flat on top of the sheep skin. Lay down (with tarp, sheepskin, blankets under you) fold blanket(s) over you with other half of tarp. This arrangement works pretty good for me. The buffalo robe , tarp and maybe a blanket works better for me. It was hard to spend so much money for a good brain tanned buff robe, but I don't regret it now that I have one. Yfab, Randy </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">[Original Message] From: Larry <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:L.Renney@bresnan.net"><L.Renney@bresnan.net></A> To: <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com"><hist_text@lists.xmission.com></A> Date: 11/9/03 9:09:32 PM Subject: MtMan-List: bedding for bedding, the best thing appears to be a buffalo robe. unfortunately </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">not </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">all of us can afford a buffalo robe right off. (I am saving up my </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">pennies </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">and dimes though). so how do the alternates measure up? deer hide elk moose bear caribou what's the next best thing? larry - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <A class=moz-txt-link-freetext href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</A> </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap=""> - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <A class=moz-txt-link-freetext href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</A> </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><BR></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML> - ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 20:33:20 -0800 From: "roger lahti" <amm1719@charter.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding > It is commercially tanned which makes it heavier than brain tanned but > only rich pilots and retired Colonel biologist can afford prime brain > tanned bison hides. (just kidding) Most people cannot afford a hide > tanned by Wes. bb, Nail on the head, eh what?! Your right of course. Not many can afford a brain tanned buffalo robe and while they are warm, they are not perfect. I think it is more the "Having" than anything else. Kinda like any rightious piece of plunder. But it's limitations certainly include keeping it dry as you know. Be assured though, no one was deriding or belittleing anyones choice of blankets over a robe for whatever personal reasons. I use blankets. Magpie uses them. Wouldn't be without them. I had an opporunity to finally get a robe through Wes when we harvested that cow last Dec. and dug deep to do it. I'm not sorry but I surely could have gotten along famously without it. > If bison is so great why is everyone wearing wool copotes and not bison > robe coats? Expense no doubt. Capotes are cheap to build in comparison even if most are not cut and sewn with any great care to how they actually were made for the most part. No big deal either. > Capt., I use a canvas mantee cloth for wind and moisture protection no > matter which bedding I use. As do I. It just makes all the difference in the world on how well your "bedding" keeps you warm. Doesn't even really take a very heavy piece of cloth to do it, just enough that it will cut the air/wind movement past the wool. And it's advice I freely share with anyone looking for answers on how to sleep warm. Rolling up in nothing but a blanket back then had to be hard times in certain conditions. If all you had was one blanket and bison robes could be had for a knife or two then why not add one to your kit besides using bison robe for epishamore? Makes sense to me. > If bison robes were so great, why did every Indian want wool > blankets??? It wasn't just all the pretty colors. Well yes it was the pretty colors and more. The more part was that a blanket is something the white man had that worked well and was easily traded for along with the guns and pots and etc. that the Indian got along without for untold centuries. Modern technology. Got to have it. And pretty colors are thrown in almost as an afterthought but surely to catch the eye of people who live in anotherwise fairly drab world. They certainly craved color not only in the white mans blanket but in the beads and in their own decorations when they still used quills. If they had been available up north I am sure the N. American Native would have used the colorful feathers of his Central and South American cousin would he not? In many ways we are in love with the romance of "primitive" but most primitive societies seem to "jump" on the modern conveniences modern man can bring even if they later regret their "selling out". Not hard to understand why they liked and used wool blankets, not at all. > Larry, I suggest you just buy some white surplus English hospital > blankets (without the blue stripe if you can find them) Or some other > historically correct color blanket and buy five or six of them. Excellent advice. I'd caution that you can buy too cheap a "wool" blanket and get something that doesn't have much warmth left in it. Cavet Emptor. I don't even care for new Pendelton blankets much any more because of how they are made. Not as warm as a 100 % wool blanket and if your treking on foot you got to carry it. Shame to carry something less than the best. Just shoot for 100 % wool and as new as you can find. YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 20:40:48 -0800 From: "roger lahti" <amm1719@charter.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_011E_01C3A7CA.EC1753D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Even if I am sleeping in my sleeping bag and not blankets or the robe, I = wear that tam. It has a draw string to adjust the head fit and I make it = loose enough to pull down over my ears. I sleep on my side rather than = on my back as some do BTW. That tam was certainly one of Scotland's = better ideas. Capt. Lahti' - ------=_NextPart_000_011E_01C3A7CA.EC1753D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD><TITLE></TITLE> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type = content=3Dtext/html;charset=3DISO-8859-1> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1170" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Even if I am sleeping in my sleeping = bag and not=20 blankets or the robe, I wear that tam. It has a draw string to adjust = the head=20 fit and I make it loose enough to pull down over my ears. I sleep on my = side=20 rather than on my back as some do BTW. That tam was certainly one of = Scotland's=20 better ideas.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Capt. Lahti'</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML> - ------=_NextPart_000_011E_01C3A7CA.EC1753D0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2003 20:41:41 -0800 From: "roger lahti" <amm1719@charter.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0128_01C3A7CB.0C1135C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hair side next to you.=20 Capt. Lahti' ----- Original Message -----=20 From: James and Sue Stone=20 To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 6:57 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding Just out of curiosity, which side of the hide do ya'll sleep = on--fleshy side or hair side? Sparks - ------=_NextPart_000_0128_01C3A7CB.0C1135C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD><TITLE></TITLE> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type = content=3Dtext/html;charset=3DISO-8859-1> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1170" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hair side next to you. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Capt. Lahti'</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=20 style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV=20 style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black"><B>From:</B>=20 <A title=3Djandsstone@earthlink.net = href=3D"mailto:jandsstone@earthlink.net">James=20 and Sue Stone</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A = title=3Dhist_text@lists.xmission.com=20 = href=3D"mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com">hist_text@lists.xmission.com= </A>=20 </DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, November 10, 2003 = 6:57=20 PM</DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: MtMan-List: = bedding</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV>Just out of curiosity, which side of the hide do ya'll = sleep=20 on--fleshy side or hair = side?<BR>Sparks<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML> - ------=_NextPart_000_0128_01C3A7CB.0C1135C0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2003 00:30:37 EST From: GazeingCyot@cs.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: bedding - --part1_1ed.12ff50c3.2ce1cdfd_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello in the camp This has been an interesting line with a lot of good impute. Beaver Boy just to answer a few of your questions. As for Buffalo coats they are just to warm to ware is why I don't have or want one. They would be ideal to ware if you were just siting in the cold and not doing any thing. Once you stated to move around they are just to warm to ware. As for Indians wanting wool blankets, one they were like you and seen the value of wool when wet. Two was it was lighter weight and good for a summer or intermediate tempter wrap but when tempters get below zero nothing could beat buffalo. But I think the most important reason was the fact that it was something new to them that could not be gotten from nature there for a status symbol to them. As for the value of a buffalo robe I believe it was in the Lewis & Clark's journals while they were wintering at Fort Mandan. A couple of Indian hunters were out hunting and got caught out in a storm that was followed by bitter cold Lewis & Clark when the two returned alive made note of the only bedding they had was a Buffalo Robe that helped save their lives. The only reason I do not use two buffalo hides when out alone is they would be to warm to sleep in. I have used two when out with Jill one under us and one over us. With two blankets used the same way and some times an extra one on the real cold nights. An extra hide like sheep or elk or what ever under you can also make a lot of difference even with a buffalo hide granted this does make for a lot to carry on your back and that is why when the snow is too deep for horses I use a toboggan to get my camp in. As for Buffalo not being warm when wet that is true but that does not become a problem if ya don't get them wet and as a rule things stay dry when it is below freezing and that is when they are needed the most. But if one cannot afford a buffalo then by all means wool blankets are the way to go but still ya will want some sort of hair on hide to go under you to help insulate ya from the ground. The sheep hide rob sounds good also if ya got enough of them. As for army surplus blankets ya had better get a lot of them if that is the way ya go. Cause they are not near as warm as a good Whitney or Hudson Bay Blanket. But they need to be newer ones also cause old wool blankets lose there loft form all the washings as rule they have seen and they loose there ability to keep one as warm and do not hold up as well in wet condictiones from what I've seen. Oil cloth or canvas under and over ya is the way to go no matter what your bedding is and if it looks like a storm is coming one needs to make a shelter of some sort. As for head gear I have never been able to keep any of them on my head. ( This maybe due to the lack of hair to help hold hem on) so I just pull a wool blanket up over my head which I find to be warmer any way for you get to breath the warm air in your bed roll and do not have the cold air on your face. Hope to see ya all in winter camp some time. Crazy Cyot - --part1_1ed.12ff50c3.2ce1cdfd_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>Hello in the camp <BR>This has been an interesting line with a lot of good impute. <BR>Beaver Boy just to answer a few of your questions. <BR>As for Buffalo coats they are just to warm to ware is why I don't have o= r want one. <BR>They would be ideal to ware if you were just siting in the cold and not=20= doing any thing. Once you stated to move around they are just to warm to war= e.=20 <BR> <BR>As for Indians wanting wool blankets, one they were like you and seen th= e value of wool when wet. Two was it was lighter weight and good for a summe= r or intermediate tempter wrap but when tempters get below zero nothing coul= d beat buffalo. <BR>But I think the most important reason was the fact that it was something= new to them that could not be gotten from nature there for a status symbol=20= to them. <BR>As for the value of a buffalo robe I believe it was in the Lewis & C= lark's journals while they were wintering at Fort Mandan. A couple of Indian= hunters were out hunting and got caught out in a storm that was followed by= bitter cold Lewis & Clark when the two returned alive made note of the=20= only bedding they had was a Buffalo Robe that helped save their lives. <BR> <BR>The only reason I do not use two buffalo hides when out alone is they wo= uld be to warm to sleep in. <BR>I have used two when out with Jill one under us and one over us. With tw= o blankets used the same way and some times an extra one on the real cold ni= ghts. <BR>An extra hide like sheep or elk or what ever under you can also make a l= ot of difference even with a buffalo hide granted this does make for a lot t= o carry on your back and that is why when the snow is too deep for horses I=20= use a toboggan to get my camp in.=20 <BR> <BR> <BR>As for Buffalo not being warm when wet that is true but that does not be= come a problem if ya don't get them wet and as a rule things stay dry when i= t is below freezing and that is when they are needed the most. <BR> <BR>But if one cannot afford a buffalo then by all means wool blankets are t= he way to go but still ya will want some sort of hair on hide to go under yo= u to help insulate ya from the ground. The sheep hide rob sounds good=20= also if ya got enough of them. <BR> As for army surplus blankets ya had better get a lot of them if that is= the way ya go. Cause they are not near as warm as a good Whitney or Hudson=20= Bay Blanket. But they need to be newer ones also cause old wool blankets los= e there loft form all the washings as rule they have seen and they loose the= re ability to keep one as warm and do not hold up as well in wet condictione= s from what I've seen. <BR> <BR>Oil cloth or canvas under and over ya is the way to go no matter what yo= ur bedding is and if it looks like a storm is coming one needs to make a she= lter of some sort. <BR> <BR>As for head gear I have never been able to keep any of them on my head.=20= ( This maybe due to the lack of hair to help hold hem on) so I just pull a w= ool blanket up over my head which I find to be warmer any way for you get to= breath the warm air in your bed roll and do not have the cold air on your f= ace. <BR> <BR> Hope to see ya all in winter camp some time. <BR>Crazy Cyot <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR></FONT></HTML> - --part1_1ed.12ff50c3.2ce1cdfd_boundary-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #1264 ******************************** - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.