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From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #1244 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Saturday, September 20 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1244 In this issue: -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: The danger is over Jeremiah -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: The danger is over Jeremiah -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Fw: Saddle Bags -áááááá MtMan-List: Alfred Jacob Miller Paintings -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Alfred Jacob Miller Paintings -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: A J MILLER PAINTING -áááááá MtMan-List: Test ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 18:44:30 -0600 From: James and Sue Stone <jandsstone@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: The danger is over Jeremiah - --------------090307060604070401040502 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Maybe we'll even have a worthwhile waterfowl season this year. Sparks (closer to the lake) David A. Miller wrote: >It was snowing here, this morning, in the Southern end of the Cache >Valley (Willow Valley to you mountaineers)... been watching those long >necks heading south for the last month... might be an early winter... >maybe a hard one at that! > > > >On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:24:45 -0600 (MDT) beaverboy@sofast.net writes: > > >> It rained and snowed last Friday here in Montana. Up to 4" inches >>of >>snow in the mountains last night, too. The fires are finally out. >>Thank God. >> I drove by a huge firecamp last Friday morning and all the >>firefighters were wearing ponchos and rain gear in the rain! That >>was >>a nice sight. >> Fall has come to the Rockies. >> bb >> >> >>---------------------- >>hist_text list info: >>http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html >> >> >> >> > >________________________________________________________________ >The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! >Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! >Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > - --------------090307060604070401040502 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <title></title> </head> <body> Maybe we'll even have a worthwhile waterfowl season this year.<br> Sparks (closer to the lake)<br> <br> David A. Miller wrote:<br> <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid20030917.143110.3068.2.dammiller@juno.com"> <pre wrap="">It was snowing here, this morning, in the Southern end of the Cache Valley (Willow Valley to you mountaineers)... been watching those long necks heading south for the last month... might be an early winter... maybe a hard one at that! On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:24:45 -0600 (MDT) <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:beaverboy@sofast.net">beaverboy@sofast.net</a> writes: </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""> It rained and snowed last Friday here in Montana. Up to 4" inches of snow in the mountains last night, too. The fires are finally out. Thank God. I drove by a huge firecamp last Friday morning and all the firefighters were wearing ponchos and rain gear in the rain! That was a nice sight. Fall has come to the Rockies. bb - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.juno.com">www.juno.com</a> to sign up today! - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> - --------------090307060604070401040502-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 01:01:56 -0400 From: "Fred A. Miller" <fmiller@lightlink.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: The danger is over Jeremiah On Wednesday September 17 2003 4:31 pm, David A. Miller wrote: > It was snowing here, this morning, in the Southern end of the Cache > Valley (Willow Valley to you mountaineers)... been watching those > long necks heading south for the last month... might be an early > winter... maybe a hard one at that! So far, it looks like a mild winter here in Central NY. Fred - -- "...Linux, MS-DOS, and Windows XP (also known as the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly)." - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 05:07:53 -0700 From: Rick Guglielmi <rickg@oregontrail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Fw: Saddle Bags So many questions, so little time answers but that is the fun of it all. I have so many papers spread out in my room trying to unravel some of the saddle mysteries and the father I look the more questions I have. Keep the dialoge going. Rick At 07:52 AM 09/17/2003 -0700, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Rick Guglielmi" <rickg@oregontrail.net> >To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> >Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 5:39 AM >Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Fw: Saddle Bags > > > > Dale, > > Interesting piece on shaved tails and progression of bits on a California > > reining horse. I was always told that a shaved tail on a mule (shaved at > > the bace,not the belled) indicated a young mule, which is where the term > > came about for 2nd lieutenants in the army. A shaved tailed second > > Lieutenant was right out of the Acadamy or some other officer trainig >program. > >Rick, >Like I said, don't take anything I said about mule tails as the unvarnished >truth. I'm just repeating what I've been told in the distant past. I think >I'd tend to believe what you were told about the lieutenants being called >shave tails, and figure the bells were some sort of a code to keep the >critters sorted out and doing what they are supposed to. I suppose people >that hadn't been around mules, and there are lots of them in this day and >age, looking at Miller paintings would figure the critters were born with a >tail like that, which isn't true, and there was a reason for cutting the >hair off them. Maybe somebody in a journal somewhere wrote the reason why, >and then the finder of that information will share with us. >Dale > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 12:26:13 -0500 From: "Glenn Darilek" <glenn@leaklocationservices.com> Subject: MtMan-List: Alfred Jacob Miller Paintings Another art gallery that has Miller's paintings is the Walters Gallery in Baltimore. In 1996 I posted the following to these pages: The following is my informal study of Miller's paintings that the reader may find useful to while away a few idle minutes. LESSONS LEARNED FROM ALFRED JACOB MILLER by Iron Burner Artist Alfred Jacob Miller was born in Baltimore in 1810. Having shown some promise as an artist at an early age, he studied art in Baltimore. His family and friends sent him to Paris and Rome in 1833 to study art. He said he was the first American allowed to copy paintings in the Louvre. When he returned to Baltimore he evidently had a difficult time making a living, and had some family problems so in the fall of 1836 he went to New Orleans to establish a studio. His talents were discovered by Captain William Drummond Stewart from Scotland, who had spent the last four years in the West, and was preparing to go there again that summer. Stewart commissioned Miller to travel west with him to document the West in drawings. They attended the 1837 rendezvous on the Green River. Stewart took Miller to Scotland where he stayed in his employ from 1840 to 1841. Miller returned to Baltimore in 1842 where he established a farm he named Lorraine. He continued to paint western scenes based on his 1837 expedition, and he took in art students. In 1858, art connoisseur William Walters discovered that Miller was living near Baltimore, and commissioned him to paint pictures recreating his journey west. He painted 200 watercolors at $12.00 each. Miller continued to paint, but made most of his living from investments he made in his brother's business. He died in 1874. Bernard DeVoto in his book "Across the Wide Missouri" said that many of Miller's paintings were still in Baltimore, so I took the opportunity of my recent travel to that city to look at some of the paintings. The drawings are at the Walters Art Gallery. The Miller paintings occupied one room with one Remington sculpture. Actually the museum still has the 200 watercolors, but only six were exhibited with four other Miller oil paintings. The oils that were on exhibit were: (1) Trappers Bride (1841); (2) Rocky Mountain Scene; (3) Sioux Indians in the Mountains; and (4) Portrait of Antione. The water colors that were on exhibit were: (5) Camp Fire -Preparing an Evening Meal; (6) Moonlight Camp Scene; (7) Crossing the River Moonlight; (8) Pipe of Peace; (9) Noon Day Rest; and (10) Camp Receiving a Supply of Meat. I closely examined these paintings for more than an hour, taking notes in particular on mountain man details. Miller did not draw background figures in any detail, so in many cases, the viewer has to judge what was being depicted. For example, the presence of beards was hard to judge in some cases because Miller drew background faces with dark shadowing. I learned that the 200 Miller paintings had been published in a book is called "The West of Alfred Jacob Miller" with Miller's contemporary notes and an account of the artist by Marvin C. Ross. Fortunately I found a copy in the San Antonio public library and checked it out. I was amazed at this treasure trove. This book amounts to a photo album of mountain men and Indians drawn by someone whose job was to document the West in 1837. The book has reproductions of all 200 of the Walters watercolors and eight others. It has nine of the watercolors reproduced in color, but the rest of the paintings are black and white. Some of the paintings are mostly scenery, and a lot of the paintings are of Indians and the Indian's way of life. But a full 80 of the paintings have some details about mountain men. Almost as good as the paintings are Miller's written descriptions and amplifications of the scenes painted. He describes the scenes and adds interesting bits of information that are often very relevant to those of us who want to be more authentic. At first I had some reservations about the accuracy of the drawings. The 200 water colors were painted in 1858, 21 years after Miller had been to the West. Miller took a lot of notes along his way, but one wonders how much he drew from the notes, how much from memory, and how much from more contemporary times. Miller was chosen by Stewart to "sketch the remarkable scenery & incidents of the journey." The 200 water colors were painted for Walters from the rough sketches made on the spot. Miller kept a notebook on his journey, but this notebook has not been found. Another set of notes and sketches he called "Rough Draughts for Notes to Indian Sketches" was proven by DeVoto to have been written after Miller returned. However, Ross maintains that for the most part the Miller paintings are based on the artist's own observations and the lost notes made on the trip west. Ross says (Miller) "seems in almost all important instances to have remained faithful in these duplicates to his original notations . . ." Ross explains that the exceptions are that the more recent paintings show the Indians as being more noble. I think that to continue to sell paintings of the West, Miller had to keep them authentic. Just imagine how his reputation would have been ruined if he painted something that was refuted by some mountain man who had been there also. Ross does admit that there has been a lot of historical interest in the original sketches made in the West, which "may show slight details which were omitted in his studio versions." I have now dismissed my reservations about the accuracy of the paintings as being unduly skeptical. Historians must use the best information available at their time. In my opinion, Alfred Jacob Miller's paintings rank at the top of what is available. Miller was being paid to document the west, a duty he relished and took very seriously. The proverbial worth of a picture is confirmed in his paintings. I have made the following observations, which are concluded with some true mountain man words of wisdom. The words within quotation marks are Miller's. Headgear - Many of the trappers in the camps were painted with no headgear. But the trappers that were hunting or traveling had headgear without exception. The hats are of many descriptions. One common characteristic of the hats is that they have a shallow crown. The crowns were either domed or flat on top. Many of the hat blanks that are now commercially available have a deep crown needed for cowboy-style hats. The brims take all forms including bell-flared, upturned brims, and hillbilly-style floppy brims that droop downward. The brim of a felt hat exposed to repeated rains and worn until dried will tend to droop like this. One clearly-drawn hat had a small curled brim on the sides, with an upward curve in the back and a flatter brim in the front with the brim longer in the back than the front. At least eight drawings had a type of headgear that I have not seen at rendezvous. Miller says "The hunters form for themselves a peculiar kind of a cap: -it has two ears with a flap reaching to the shoulders." The cap is to disguise the hunter as a wolf so he can more easily approach the buffalos. The cap resembles an inverted square-bottom bag with one side removed. The back corners resemble a set of ears. Some of these appear to be made of short-hair fur, while others could have been made of leather or maybe blanket cloth. Several trappers have caps made of fur and typically ornamented heavily with feathers. However, none of the caps were of the fur type that has the animals head visible. Ornamentation of the hats is primarily feathers and plumes held in place with typically thin hat bands. Some hats had only hat bands and some hats had no hat bands or ornamentation of any kind. Two hats had a clay pipe stuck under the hat band. "He (Pierre) wears in his hat by way of ornament two turkey feathers, a fox-tail-brush, and his dear darling pipe, . . ." Cook Gear - The use of tripods made of sapling poles was almost universal for hanging a pot over the campfire. Only one drawing had some vertical sticks to the side of a fire to cook some snakes. Large kettles or tin pots are hung over many fires. An iron camp pot with three legs and a bail was prominent in one picture. Camp kettles with round bottoms are clearly evident in three views, kettles with flat sides like a tin pot are clearly evident in two scenes. Meat was being impaled on an inclined wood spit stuck in the ground in several pictures. "The plate service of the table is of capital tin ware, partout, and the etiquette rigid in some particulars; - for instance, nothing in the shape of a fork must be used." . . . "The usual mode of sitting is to sit cross-legged like a Turk." Shirts and Pants - The shirts had long tails. The edge of the shirts hung to typically a few inches above the knees. In the color paintings I viewed, the cloth shirts were red or blue. Some of the other shirts were white or natural with widely-spaced narrow dark stripes. Leather shirts and leather jackets were common. The leather as well as cloth shirts had an abundance of fringes. Beards - Most of the trappers had no beards. Of the others, goatees, chin beards, and mustaches were common. There were a few instances of cheek beards. The beards tend to be short and not bushy. The one exception is of a trapper that had been found starving with no ammunition. Wagons - Miller drew many wagons and carts. Some pictures of caravans show more than 15 wagons. The wagons were two-wheel charettes and four-wheel wagons. Most of the carts had a cover fashioned on hoops like a covered wagon. Lodging - In several drawings the Indian lodges had their door flaps folded open and propped open with sticks. "In the background is a lodge thrown open, -this is done on a fine day to admit the sun and give it an airing, . . " Many lodges had their edges raised a couple of feet for ventilation. Several pictures had wedge tents. The wedge tents had internal poles and several panels. The wedge tents appeared to be 6 or 7 feet long. One picture has what might be interpreted to be a pyramid tent. It may be a cone-shaped improvision but no poles stick through the apex. That drawing shows what might be a flap cover for the entrance. In several instances the Indians had blankets draped horizontally on some tree limbs. The blanket cloth had widely spaced narrow dark stripes. Foo-foraw - Of all the trappers portrayed in the paintings, maybe three had a hint of what might be interpreted to be beads. In contrast, the Indians tend to be profusely decorated with beads and bear claws. The bear claws are worn with the points towards the body. All seven of the references to beads in the text are about the Indians having beads. Fringes were abundant. In one drawing the trapper had what appeared to be brass buttons on the fringes of his leather pants. "Over his left shoulder and under his right arm hang his buffalo powder horn, a bullet pouch in which he carries balls, flint, and steel, with other knick-knacks." "Bound round his waist is a belt, in which is stuck his knife in a sheath of Buffalo hide, made fast to the belt by a chain or guard of some kind, and on his breast a pipe holder, usually a gage d'amour in the shape of a heart, worked in porcupine quills by some dusky charmer." Footwear - From what I could tell, all the trappers had moccasins. "Everybody here wears them in preference to either boot or shoe - they are verily the most comfortable covering for the feet that can be fashioned." In some, they appeared to have a seam between the top and sole on the top of the foot, but some distance from the edge of the foot. That seam sometimes had short fringes attached. Two trappers had spurs with one spike (no rowel). Indian Bows - "The bow . . . is remarkable; it is made of Elk-horn with sinew strongly cemented on the outer-side. Now if an Elk-horn was carried to the smartest Yankee we have, with a request to make a bow of it, the probability is, that for once, he would find it not convenient to attempt it." "With an Elk-horn bow, they sometimes drive an arrow completely through a Buffalo, its propelling power being greater than that of the Yew Bow." Drinking Water - "The time is near sunset, -squads are leaving the main band, and rushing for the water, -thirst is overpowering, and human nature can stand it no longer; -there is a general stampede among the horseman; -the team drivers being compelled to remain, headed by our Captain, who would not move a jot from his usual walk, although he had been smoking for the last 3 hours to relieve this inexorable craving;. . . The question may be asked, why we did not take water along with us? The answer is, that it would have been an innovation on established custom. Nobody did any such thing, -it was looked on as effeminate, to say nothing of the ridicule and rough jests with which the reformer would be pelted. Poncho - "It is 'raining cats and dogs,' whilst the wind is of the hurricane order, . . .Some of the men . . . are enveloped in ponchos; -we have found these coverings the most effectual of all in such unpropitious seasons, -they are simply made from a Mackinaw blanket, a straight incision is made in the centre to the length of about 14 inches, through this you thrust your head and behold your poncho falling as gracefully as a Roman Toga all round you. Absent - Many things commonly seen at modern rendezvous that were noticeably absent in the Miller paintings include wooden boxes (some bundles were present), calico patterns (may have been too difficult to draw), fire cross irons, bandanas, wall tents, marquee tents, coffee pots, dutch ovens, frying pans, and canteens. Ultimate truth - "Look ye hyar now! I've raised the ha'r of more than one Comanche, and hunted and trapped a heap, Waugh! from Red River way up among the Britishers to Heely (Gila) in the Spanish Country, and from old Mis- sou-rye to the sea of Californey; b'ar and beaver sign are as plain to me as Chimney Rock on Platte, but darn my old heart if this child ever could shine in making out the sign lodged in a woman's breast." Contentment - "One night while a violent storm was raging and the rain was pouring with a Niagara sluice, . . . was a man sitting . . . with his hands over the expiring ashes. . . the rain streaming from his nose & prominent chin, & his hunting shirt hanging about him in a flabby and soaking embrace; - spite of such a situation which was anything but cheering, he was rapping out at the top of his voice a ditty, the chorus or refrain of which was, & which he gave with particular emphasis;- How happy am I! Oh, why are not all Contented like me? Glenn Darilek - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 01:41:55 +0000 From: amm1616@comcast.net Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Alfred Jacob Miller Paintings This last week, I made another trip to the Denver Art Museum. They have on display three or four Millers, and I have seen about 8 different ones through the years there. A very unquie one that was uprecently, and I think Tom Roberts saw it when out here, was a pencil and water color wash that came from his sketch book. I think that it was these simple drawings that he based the works done in the studio on. Catlin and Bodmer did finished works while in the west. I don't think alot of Miller's were made here. So, if you are ever in the area, the seventh floor of the museum has some good pieces to excite you. Also the Building just next to it, the Denver Main library usually has a few very nice works there, including a few Millers! mike. > Another art gallery that has Miller's paintings is the Walters Gallery > in Baltimore. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:04:42 -0600 From: "Angela Gottfred" <agottfre@telusplanet.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: A J MILLER PAINTING >Anyone know of locations where Miller paintings can be viewed and which paintings.<...> Or other Artists? > Peter Rindisbacher 1806-1834 Rindisbacher's work is in the Amon Carter Museum and Calgary's Glenbow Museum. You will have to make arrangements to view the many Rindisbacher sketches in the Glenbow's collection (they're not on display, usually), but it shouldn't be too difficult. To try to find the other artists on your list, try http://www.artcyclopedia.com/ --it is very good, and mostly up to date. Your very humble & most obedient servant, Angela Gottfred - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 18:39:24 -0600 From: "Wynn Ormond" <cheyenne@pcu.net> Subject: MtMan-List: Test This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C37FA6.838472E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have had to redo a whole bunch of stuff on my puter and jus checking = to see if I can still send/recieve Wynn - ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C37FA6.838472E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1"> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1106" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I have had to redo a whole bunch of = stuff on my=20 puter and jus checking to see if I can still send/recieve</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Wynn</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML> - ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C37FA6.838472E0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #1244 ******************************** - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.