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hist_text-digest       Monday, December 9 2002       Volume 01 : Number 1121



In this issue:

-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Can You Explain This?
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 18:04:12 -0700
From: "Wynn Ormond" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors

 "scott mcmahon"  wrote in part:
> I don't remember  this being such an issue with so many members a few
years ago when I started
> down this trail. Has something happened to stir this up? I'd love to carry
> on this conversation off-list if you're interested and again, thanks for
> your reply.


Yes something did stir this up.  I expressed my opinion of what I have seen
and read, and Mr Kramer disagreed with my position.  I would hope that Mr
Kramer has not taken offense at this, I sure haven't.  He chewed me up years
ago on one of my first posts.  He has chewed up a few others since and I
would still be glad to get on the ground with him sometime.  I have quoted
him more than once in the stuff I have saved.

He has been around for a long time and he has forgotten more than I probably
know but even if I am pretty green, I still know things he doesn't.  Its the
nature of knowledge.  I am honored to have him keep me from getting to
upity, and he will likely throw things at his computer over some of the
things when I ask for documentation.

You see I have learned a few things about loading blocks from this.

And it seems that if you don't start a fight things get down right boring
around here.  So when Mr Kramer writes that Millers paintings mean NOTHING
don't let him get away with it, its more fun that way

Wynn Ormond
#1854





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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 20:31:42 -0500
From: "Double Edge Forge" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors

"I would still be glad to get on the ground with him sometime."

>>No, you wouldn't, he smells funny.. And I don't mean "ha ha"..<GG>
D
#1622


""Imagine my disappointment when I found out "Baby Back Ribs" weren't from
babies"
- -Me


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:17:49 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

Sir WindBreaker,

Not only are your interpretations of the constitutional law offensive, but
so is your behavior.  It's no wonder this great nation is handing over it's
freedom to a few tyrants.  Your insinuation that someone who creates typos
and who may have grammatical errors is somewhat less than intelligent is
nothing more than a good indication of your lack of understanding,
compassion, and commen sense.  Your posts are offensive to anyone who loves
freedom.

Blood
A.M.M. #1651

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Windwalker" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 12:07 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA


On Monday 09 December 2002 13:21, Alan Avery wrote:
> "...Where one believes it or not.. guns will not be owned in say 4
> decades.. Laws
> now are making it harder to own... little by little they will be phased
> out..
> Happened in Aussie land as well as England and Canada..."
>
>
>
> I would have to take exception to the last part of this statement. We
still
> have our guns in Canada, (most of them anyway.) What has happened here is
> that the federal government is requiring all Canadian to register all
their
> guns. (with the exception of First Nations people, who are exempt.) So
far,
> the government has spent in excess of 1 billion dollars to accomplish
this,
> with little or no meaningful results. Estimates of compliance range from
> 90% (the government's figure, widely ridiculed by everyone else) down to
> 25% (a generally accepted figure from the National Firearms Association.)
9
> of the 13 provinces and territories have declined to be a part of the
> system, or to even participate or help administer it.(In fact they are
> suing the federal government in the Canadian Supreme Court over the issue,
> as the
> provinces/territories maintain firearms have been and still are a
> provincial jurisdiction.) As of Dec 31 of this year, any Canadian with an
> unregistered gun is a criminal. The government is facing increasing
> pressure to dump the whole idea, but seem to be holding out so as to save
> face, as the whole stupid idea was theirs from the start. The RCMP
> (Mounties) estimate that of the guns registered at present, there are
> aprox. 25 - 35% registered incorrectly. If nothing else, Canada's efforts
> will serve as a wonderful example to the U.S. of what a dumb idea a gun
> registry is, and how impossible it is to make it work. Flintlocks by the
> way are exempt, as they are considered to "antiques" rather than firearms.
> (Not caplocks though) So, we Canadians still have our guns for now, what
> will happen in the future is open to debate.
>
>
> alan
>
>
>having them registraed is first step in knowing where they are
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

- --
Note: Anything that appears to be an error in spelling or grammar is
actually
the author's clever use of the vernacular, and thus is a carefully placed
literary device that demonstrates his writing prowess.


- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:11:35 -0600
From: Windwalker <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

On Monday 09 December 2002 19:17, kc16 wrote:
> Sir WindBreaker,
>
> Not only are your interpretations of the constitutional law offensive, =
but
> so is your behavior.  It's no wonder this great nation is handing over =
it's
> freedom to a few tyrants.  Your insinuation that someone who creates ty=
pos
> and who may have grammatical errors is somewhat less than intelligent i=
s
> nothing more than a good indication of your lack of understanding,
> compassion, and commen sense.  Your posts are offensive to anyone who l=
oves
> freedom.
>
> Blood
> A.M.M. #1651

You are offensive and apparently have no clue as to whats going on with r=
ecent=20
laws
and not like you with a  taken "name"
mine stands
Sam Windwalker
my advise to you is to attempt to flame someone else you are a good indic=
ation
of a common AMM member... I see

Note: Anything that appears to be an error in spelling or grammar is actu=
ally=20
the author's clever use of the vernacular, and thus is a carefully placed=
=20
literary device that demonstrates his writing prowess.

>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Windwalker" <[e-mail]>
> To: <[e-mail]>
> Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 12:07 PM
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
>
> On Monday 09 December 2002 13:21, Alan Avery wrote:
> > "...Where one believes it or not.. guns will not be owned in say 4
> > decades.. Laws
> > now are making it harder to own... little by little they will be phas=
ed
> > out..
> > Happened in Aussie land as well as England and Canada..."
> >
> >
> >
> > I would have to take exception to the last part of this statement. We
>
> still
>
> > have our guns in Canada, (most of them anyway.) What has happened her=
e is
> > that the federal government is requiring all Canadian to register all
>
> their
>
> > guns. (with the exception of First Nations people, who are exempt.) S=
o
>
> far,
>
> > the government has spent in excess of 1 billion dollars to accomplish
>
> this,
>
> > with little or no meaningful results. Estimates of compliance range f=
rom
> > 90% (the government's figure, widely ridiculed by everyone else) down=
 to
> > 25% (a generally accepted figure from the National Firearms Associati=
on.)
>
> 9
>
> > of the 13 provinces and territories have declined to be a part of the
> > system, or to even participate or help administer it.(In fact they ar=
e
> > suing the federal government in the Canadian Supreme Court over the
> > issue, as the
> > provinces/territories maintain firearms have been and still are a
> > provincial jurisdiction.) As of Dec 31 of this year, any Canadian wit=
h an
> > unregistered gun is a criminal. The government is facing increasing
> > pressure to dump the whole idea, but seem to be holding out so as to =
save
> > face, as the whole stupid idea was theirs from the start. The RCMP
> > (Mounties) estimate that of the guns registered at present, there are
> > aprox. 25 - 35% registered incorrectly. If nothing else, Canada's eff=
orts
> > will serve as a wonderful example to the U.S. of what a dumb idea a g=
un
> > registry is, and how impossible it is to make it work. Flintlocks by =
the
> > way are exempt, as they are considered to "antiques" rather than
> > firearms. (Not caplocks though) So, we Canadians still have our guns =
for
> > now, what will happen in the future is open to debate.
> >
> >
> > alan
> >
> >
> >having them registraed is first step in knowing where they are
> > ----------------------
> > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.ht=
ml

- --=20
Note: Anything that appears to be an error in spelling or grammar is actu=
ally=20
the author's clever use of the vernacular, and thus is a carefully placed=
=20
literary device that demonstrates his writing prowess.


- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 18:00:37 -0800
From: Alan Avery <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

"...having them registraed is first step in knowing where they are..."



No argument from me there, but the government is going to need lots of metal
detectors, sniffing dogs and enough psychics to clean out the late night TV
infomercials to find all the guns up here! In many parts of Canada right
now, you can see people watering their lawns with Hoppes # 9. Guess why that
is? <G>

Me? I'm with Charlton Heston: "From my cold, dead hands!"


Alan

Canada... a country that has spent 250 million dollars to combat world
terrorism, and over 1 billion dollars to harass law-abiding citizens, target
shooters and duck hunters.



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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:28:19 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Can You Explain This?

Scott,

As a member of the AMM for a good amount of years and a buckskinner before
that I can honestly tell you that the few people in either roles who rag on
reenactors are clanging gongs not worth the effort to understand or debate
with.  I have been to many....and let me reiterate....MANY AMM and other
rendezvous where I have seen plastic articles, cigarettes with filters, bic
lighters, cowboy boots, and other such articles that were clearly not of
period.

I would suggest that you don't let it bother you when someone points out
with a puffed out chest the deficiencies of reenactors.  They are more than
likely appeasing something in themselves that needs to be appeased.  These
very same are not "perfect" in their portrayal of the era they so dearly
love.  I know for a fact that in non-AMM rendezvous, you have all sorts who
are in various stages of perfecting or getting their personna correct.  If
there aren't, then you have stumbled upon a stagnant group of people who are
going to dwindle over time anyway, so who cares if they are critical.  The
same actually holds true in AMM encampments too.  If you don't see something
out of place, then there is either no learning going on, or you are
witnessing the slow death of a group.

I suggest that instead of trying to understand those type of people, you
just ignore them.  There are plenty of other people in both the AMM and
other groups that don't focus on being critical.  Those are the people you
should introduce yourself too and let the ones who criticize everyone share
a campfire on their own.

Blood
AMM #1651

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "scott mcmahon" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Sunday, December 08, 2002 7:41 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: Can You Explain This?


> Mr. Kramer,
> Maybe you(or someone else on the list) could explain the critical attitude
> expressed by many AMM and Buckskinners in regards to reenactors? I fail to
> see the hangup some have with that particular group. How can one
faithfully
> recreate the Rocky Mountain furtrapper while using equipment & clothing
that
> can't be documented? That applies to all historic personas be they F&I,
Rev
> War, RMFT, Tex Rev, Mex War or Civil War. Alot of people out there spend
> ALOT of time researching what was available and what was used by all the
> above mentioned time periods and yes, reenactors may spend more time
arguing
> about details but there are just as many who could care less if they used
a
> Zouave rifle at an 1830's event as there are who are concerned whether or
> not their clothes are the proper cut for their chosen period. I don't mean
> to go off on a rant here, just interested in the reasoning behind the mass
> criticism reenactors draw from Buckskinners and some AMM members. Enjoy
the
> discussions and comments, it's good to see the list active again!
>
> Dios, Libertad y Tejas
> Scott McMahon
> S.W. Frontiers Mntd. Ranging Co.
>
>
> "Hays's Rangers have come, their appearance never to be forgotten. Not any
> sort of uniforms, but well mounted and doubly well armed: each man has one
> or two Colt's revolvers besides ordinary pistols, a sword, and every man a
> rifle....The Mexicans are terribly afraid of them."
>
> General Ethan Allen Hitchcock
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:35:49 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

Sounds like Mr. Windwalker has already given over his sovereignty to the
federal government.  A fate, I'm sorry to say, that over 90% of all citizens
in this country are more than willing to do.

One can only live his life according to his own convictions and principles.
We know what yours are sir.

Blood
AMM#1651

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Windwalker" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA


On Monday 09 December 2002 02:20, traprjon wrote:
> Windwalker,
>     Apparently you missed my point, or perhaps I was not clear enough.
> This new "law" you talk about is Unconstitutional, therefore illegal!!!
> The government has NO right to legislate in the areas of the Bill of
Rights
> and no law supersedes or postpones our  Constitutional Rights!!!  The new
> "laws" are not legal because the government illegally took the power to
> enact them as has been done so many times in history.  They may really be
> doing these things, disguised under the color of law, but it is NOT
> legal!!!  The Founding Fathers did NOT want Martial law in this
> country-ever!!!  That's why we have civilian police.  That's why it is
> supposed to be a government of the People, by the People, for the People.
> The People need to supervise the government, which has not been done for a
> long time now.  That's why the government has gotten to the point it has.
> I bet NO veteran ever fought to defend this country to let the government
> become the super power it is superseding the Peoples rights!!!  I know I
> didn't!!!  The Founding Fathers sought to prevent this from happening by
> giving the People the tools to control it, namely the Bill of Rights!!!
> How many of us are willing to give all that our Founding Fathers and other
> Patriots gave to make us Free People in a Free Nation???  Some gave all,
> their families, their property and their lives because they believed in
> leaving Liberty to the next generation of Americans!!!
> *************************************************************
 1788- 2002.. alot of water over the dam and a lot of changes...
when one is now pulled over at the borders for a "search" and routine check
be sure to tell them all of the above.... see where it lands ya.
federal power supercedes civil authority and has recently


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:46:30 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors

Scott,

I don't think that this has been an issue that has come up just over the
last few years.  I'd have to say that it's been an issue as long as I've
been in the AMM, since around 92 or 93.  I found it to be a huge topic of
discussion even before then when I was doing NMLRA doins'.

I do have some aversion to strictly "reenactment" as I define it.  Which is,
dress up in costumes that don't get any use until an event.  Play as if you
lived during that time period.  Don't use the equipment or costumes at any
time other than events.  This would be my definition of reenactment.  It is
and has been a joy to get all my gear together and find out just exactly
what would never have worked in the mountains after a few days of period
living.  It's amazing what gear you throw away and start to do over again
because it obviously would never work for very long.  Or you've discovered a
much better way to do it.

One more thing.  I believe that you have to be "sponsored" into the AMM.
You won't be able to be a Texas Ranger in the 1840's as the cutoff date for
AMM is 1840.  I'm not aware of any method to "get papers sent through" in
order to join.  If you know of an AMM party who is willing to let you
"submit" your papers to get in....I'd be interested in knowing who they are.

YOS,
Blood
AMM #1651

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "scott mcmahon" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors


> Mr. Quilter,
> I appreciate your response! I myself started as a buckskinner evolved into
a
> reenactor and then evolved into a "experimental archeologist" as Mark
Baker
> calls it. I basically look at it as an extension of where I started at. I
> got tired of going to rendezvous and reenactments and seeing people
wearing
> masses of trinkets and oddly fashioned clothing that didn't any more
> resemble say a Miller sketch than  John wayne did in the Alamo! I wanted
to
> use the proper equipment under the same)or as close to same) conditions
our
> forefathers did. And so I have... I started doing short rides with period
> clothing, firearms and tack and it's progressed into a small company of
> dedicated living historians portraying Texas rangers of the 1840's.
> I understand that some folks outside of reenacting look down on those who
> chose that path but please take notice that not all of them are "ignorant
of
> old the ways". There are many excellent reenactors who would fit right
into
> your description of the AMM and not miss a beat. It's just been irritating
> to hear so many be so critical of the reenacting society based on their
lose
> understanding of what it is. In all reality it's the same as buckskinning
> and rendezvous- some get it and some don't.
> I guess I really wanted an answer to this(glad it was from an AMM member)
> becuase I'm working on getting my papers sent through again(after
> reconsidering joining) for membership into that very group. I don't
remember
> this being such an issue with so many members a few years ago when I
started
> down this trail. Has something happened to stir this up? I'd love to carry
> on this conversation off-list if you're interested and again, thanks for
> your reply.
>
> Dios, Libertad y Tejas
> Scott McMahon
> S.W. Frontiers Mntd. Ranging Co.
>
> "Hays's Rangers have come, their appearance never to be forgotten. Not any
> sort of uniforms, but well mounted and doubly well armed: each man has one
> or two Colt's revolvers besides ordinary pistols, a sword, and every man a
> rifle....The Mexicans are terribly afraid of them."
> General Ethan Allen Hitchcock
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:56:42 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

Mr. Windwalker,

I know all too well what is going on with the current laws.  You have no
idea what I have a clue about and what I don't have a clue about.  But, it
is all too obvious that you have decided or that you believe that
constitutional ammendments that contradict the original contistutional law
are more than legal.  They are only legal to those that allow them to be
legal.  Whether the executors, judicial system, or legislators all deem them
legal is of no consequence to the truth.  And the truth is that any
constitutional law that is ammended can not be upheld as legal or true if it
contridicts the original constitutional law.

As far as my name.....my name is Curtis Krouse....my given name is Blood.  I
could care less what you think about "typical" or "common" AMM members.  I
made no attempt to flame.  But, I will exercise my right to point out that I
don't like your viewpoints.  If you don't agree...that is fine.  If you
consider it a flame...so be it.

Curtis "Blood" Krouse
AMM #1651

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Windwalker" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 2:11 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA


On Monday 09 December 2002 19:17, kc16 wrote:
> Sir WindBreaker,
>
> Not only are your interpretations of the constitutional law offensive, but
> so is your behavior.  It's no wonder this great nation is handing over
it's
> freedom to a few tyrants.  Your insinuation that someone who creates typos
> and who may have grammatical errors is somewhat less than intelligent is
> nothing more than a good indication of your lack of understanding,
> compassion, and commen sense.  Your posts are offensive to anyone who
loves
> freedom.
>
> Blood
> A.M.M. #1651

You are offensive and apparently have no clue as to whats going on with
recent
laws
and not like you with a  taken "name"
mine stands
Sam Windwalker
my advise to you is to attempt to flame someone else you are a good
indication
of a common AMM member... I see

Note: Anything that appears to be an error in spelling or grammar is
actually
the author's clever use of the vernacular, and thus is a carefully placed
literary device that demonstrates his writing prowess.

>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Windwalker" <[e-mail]>
> To: <[e-mail]>
> Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 12:07 PM
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA
>
> On Monday 09 December 2002 13:21, Alan Avery wrote:
> > "...Where one believes it or not.. guns will not be owned in say 4
> > decades.. Laws
> > now are making it harder to own... little by little they will be phased
> > out..
> > Happened in Aussie land as well as England and Canada..."
> >
> >
> >
> > I would have to take exception to the last part of this statement. We
>
> still
>
> > have our guns in Canada, (most of them anyway.) What has happened here
is
> > that the federal government is requiring all Canadian to register all
>
> their
>
> > guns. (with the exception of First Nations people, who are exempt.) So
>
> far,
>
> > the government has spent in excess of 1 billion dollars to accomplish
>
> this,
>
> > with little or no meaningful results. Estimates of compliance range from
> > 90% (the government's figure, widely ridiculed by everyone else) down to
> > 25% (a generally accepted figure from the National Firearms
Association.)
>
> 9
>
> > of the 13 provinces and territories have declined to be a part of the
> > system, or to even participate or help administer it.(In fact they are
> > suing the federal government in the Canadian Supreme Court over the
> > issue, as the
> > provinces/territories maintain firearms have been and still are a
> > provincial jurisdiction.) As of Dec 31 of this year, any Canadian with
an
> > unregistered gun is a criminal. The government is facing increasing
> > pressure to dump the whole idea, but seem to be holding out so as to
save
> > face, as the whole stupid idea was theirs from the start. The RCMP
> > (Mounties) estimate that of the guns registered at present, there are
> > aprox. 25 - 35% registered incorrectly. If nothing else, Canada's
efforts
> > will serve as a wonderful example to the U.S. of what a dumb idea a gun
> > registry is, and how impossible it is to make it work. Flintlocks by the
> > way are exempt, as they are considered to "antiques" rather than
> > firearms. (Not caplocks though) So, we Canadians still have our guns for
> > now, what will happen in the future is open to debate.
> >
> >
> > alan
> >
> >
> >having them registraed is first step in knowing where they are
> > ----------------------
> > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

- --
Note: Anything that appears to be an error in spelling or grammar is
actually
the author's clever use of the vernacular, and thus is a carefully placed
literary device that demonstrates his writing prowess.


- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 02:36:26 +0000
From: "scott mcmahon" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors

Blood,
I'm fully aware of how to "get in" the AMM. I completed my requirements
already and have two sponsors and several others who have offered their
signature. I also have other interests aside from Texas rangers and
understand the rules governing the time frame for the AMM. Thanks for your
comments... like I said, I never heard any of this arguement until the last
few years

    Dios, Libertad y Tejas
    Scott McMahon
    S.W. Frontiers Mntd. Ranging Co.


    "Hays's Rangers have come, their appearance never to be forgotten. Not any
sort of uniforms, but well mounted and doubly well armed: each man has one
or two Colt's revolvers besides ordinary pistols, a sword, and every man a
rifle....The Mexicans are terribly afraid of them."

    General Ethan Allen Hitchcock



_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:49:38 -0600
From: Windwalker <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

On Monday 09 December 2002 20:00, Alan Avery wrote:
> "...having them registraed is first step in knowing where they are..."
>
>
>
> No argument from me there, but the government is going to need lots of
> metal detectors, sniffing dogs and enough psychics to clean out the lat=
e
> night TV infomercials to find all the guns up here! In many parts of Ca=
nada
> right now, you can see people watering their lawns with Hoppes # 9. Gue=
ss
> why that is? <G>
>
> Me? I'm with Charlton Heston: "From my cold, dead hands!"
>
>
> Alan
No not really.. think slowly they make new laws and are placed in effect =
like=20
now.. years form now.... more.. then more... slowly over time and genrati=
ons
its gone.
Ive never siad they "will take" arms.... But they will in time limit or m=
ake=20
it so rough to own one its pathetic. Minor suttle changes in law now will=
 add=20
up say 40 years from now. its a step by step process.. starting with the=20
brady bill {in effect}
Law suits against arms makers now have made it rough to manufactor... exp=
ect=20
more in future...


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:58:40 -0600
From: Windwalker <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

On Monday 09 December 2002 19:35, kc16 wrote:
> Sounds like Mr. Windwalker has already given over his sovereignty to th=
e
> federal government.  A fate, I'm sorry to say, that over 90% of all
> citizens in this country are more than willing to do.
>
> One can only live his life according to his own convictions and princip=
les.
> We know what yours are sir.
>
> Blood
> AMM#1651
You bet your bippy I have... as full blood NA it was took from us long ag=
o
Dont call me "sir"  If you must refer to me as something call me  your fu=
ture
Its a coming...
Just for your info not thats its of anys concern I did 3 tours in nam and=
 one=20
in gulf..
So I need not prive anything via black and white text......

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:02:15 -0600
From: Windwalker <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

On Monday 09 December 2002 19:56, kc16 wrote:
> Mr. Windwalker,
>
> I know all too well what is going on with the current laws.  You have n=
o
> idea what I have a clue about and what I don't have a clue about.  But,=
 it
> is all too obvious that you have decided or that you believe that
> constitutional ammendments that contradict the original contistutional =
law
> are more than legal.  They are only legal to those that allow them to b=
e
> legal.  Whether the executors, judicial system, or legislators all deem
> them legal is of no consequence to the truth.  And the truth is that an=
y
> constitutional law that is ammended can not be upheld as legal or true =
if
> it contridicts the original constitutional law.
>
> As far as my name.....my name is Curtis Krouse....my given name is Bloo=
d.=20
> I could care less what you think about "typical" or "common" AMM member=
s.=20
> I made no attempt to flame.  But, I will exercise my right to point out
> that I don't like your viewpoints.  If you don't agree...that is fine. =
 If
> you consider it a flame...so be it.
>
> Curtis "Blood" Krouse
> AMM #1651
 Move on this is boring..... tell your "rights " issues to the right=20
places.... it will still fall on deaf ears
you miss whole key point Federal Patriot Act and War powers act supercede=
s
civil rights.... geez now they dont even need cause to search a home or=20
car....
Now i call that "in effect'
this tread closed

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 18:25:40 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors

Scott,

That's cool....  I wish you luck in your pursuit.  The AMM is just like any
other organization.  It has it's good points and it's bad points.  Some are
real sticklers about things...other's aren't.

Blood

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "scott mcmahon" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: AMM and Re-enactors


> Blood,
> I'm fully aware of how to "get in" the AMM. I completed my requirements
> already and have two sponsors and several others who have offered their
> signature. I also have other interests aside from Texas rangers and
> understand the rules governing the time frame for the AMM. Thanks for your
> comments... like I said, I never heard any of this arguement until the
last
> few years
>
> Dios, Libertad y Tejas
> Scott McMahon
> S.W. Frontiers Mntd. Ranging Co.
>
>
> "Hays's Rangers have come, their appearance never to be forgotten. Not any
> sort of uniforms, but well mounted and doubly well armed: each man has one
> or two Colt's revolvers besides ordinary pistols, a sword, and every man a
> rifle....The Mexicans are terribly afraid of them."
>
> General Ethan Allen Hitchcock
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 18:36:08 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA

You will never be my future.  I would not live under tyranny such as you
speak of.  As Alan Avery spoke and quoted Charlton Heston.  "Fom my cold
dead hands!"  I have no desire to live in a country that deprives it's
citizens of the right to defend themselves.

And from someone who did 3 tours in Nam and the "who cares about the weekend
excursion called the Gulf", you shame every other veteran who fought in all
of this country's wars for the freedom which it stands for.  I don't know
what you mean by the term full blood NA, but the Native Indians that I know
would be ashamed of your readiness to continue to give away your freedom.

It would be interesting to know why you are so willing to give up your
individual freedom to this government.  It's a concept that is totally
foreign to me.  Care to explain?



- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Windwalker" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: 2nd Amendment??? & the NRA


On Monday 09 December 2002 19:35, kc16 wrote:
> Sounds like Mr. Windwalker has already given over his sovereignty to the
> federal government.  A fate, I'm sorry to say, that over 90% of all
> citizens in this country are more than willing to do.
>
> One can only live his life according to his own convictions and
principles.
> We know what yours are sir.
>
> Blood
> AMM#1651
You bet your bippy I have... as full blood NA it was took from us long ago
Dont call me "sir"  If you must refer to me as something call me  your
future
Its a coming...
Just for your info not thats its of anys concern I did 3 tours in nam and
one
in gulf..
So I need not prive anything via black and white text......

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hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html


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------------------------------

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