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From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #77 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Tuesday, June 2 1998 Volume 01 : Number 077 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 02:54:14 EDT From: <JSeminerio@aol.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Horsehair dye Hope this helps this is how I dye quills an deer tails - Find a large enough metal can ( that some one has thrown out) - Find a second metal can that will fit inside the first can - Punch some holes in the bottom of the second, smaller can - Use a metal coat hanger and make a bale for the second smaller can - Check Jean Heinbusch's quillworking book - Use her recipes for copying old time colors (using readily available commercial cloth dyes, like ritt) Use the 2 can set-up to first heat some water and wash the horse hair. Clean it with a little soap and water. I have heard of people using human shampoos, animal grooming shampoos, and yes even conditioners. Wash out the horse hair and the cans thoroughly. prepare your dye bath in the larger can. Use the smaller can with the handle to lower your horse hair into the dye bath. FOLLOW ALL DIRECTIONS ON THE LABEL OF THE DYE. Hey it's always worked for me. I always use a touch of white vinegar in my quill dye bath, thgis might help with the horse hair. I know you are not an idiot, but I did try to make the directions as clear as possible anyway. Also if you are dying a bunch of loose hair, do not use rubber bands. the hair will Tye dye. Use a good cotton cord to tie the bunches. The dye will soak through and the hair will dye evenly and of course feel free to send me some if it comes out particularly nice watch your topknot john ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 03:08:28 -0500 From: "Ken " <rebelfreehold@worldnet.att.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bow and Arrows Thanks for the compliment but I have friends who are better than I. I thought I stated out to 25 yards as my limit. As for deer I prefer to be no more than 20 feet which is not any real feat for someone who has stalking skills. Wolf Smither used to say my best skill was having the patience to sit in one spot for hours. At a rendezvous in Cache Valley in 1976 I laid down beside a hole and waited for hours for a large prairie dog to emerge so I could spear it. Wolf made the mistake of saying he would cook it for me! YMOS, Ken YellowFeather - ---------- > From: Glenn Darilek <llsi@texas.net> > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bow and Arrows > Date: Friday, May 29, 1998 8:01 PM > > Ken wrote: > > > > I am afraid I will have to disagree with you both on "force". > > Maybe it is just semantics, but it IS the increased force that makes the > atl-atl work. Otherwise you could throw the projectile with your arm > only, which would be more accurate. I must commend you on your atl-atl > skill. Hitting any game animal with any reliability at all at 25 yards > is a truly amazing feat! > > Iron Burner ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 07:16:53 -0500 From: Jeff Powers <kestrel@ticon.net> Subject: MtMan-List: Prairie Villa Rendezvous Is anyone on the list going to Prairie du Chien,Wi for this ronnyvoo? also is anyone in S.Wis? Net-Tamer V 1.08.1 - Test Drive ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 12:07:56 EDT From: <ITWHEELER@aol.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Egg Powder In a message dated 98-05-30 10:25:27 EDT, you write: << j2hearts@juno.com (john c funk,jr) >> yes to that john------- iron tounge ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 12:07:55 EDT From: <ITWHEELER@aol.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Indian Sign Language In a message dated 98-05-30 10:24:33 EDT, you write: << hist_text@lists.xmission.com >> arent we soposed to be old timy and use old terms excuse my termonalgy and my spelling deaf mute. iron tounge ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 12:07:53 EDT From: <ITWHEELER@aol.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bow and Arrows In a message dated 98-05-30 10:23:35 EDT, you write: << llsi@texas.net (Glenn Darilek) >> not an amaseing feet with practace you can stand on your hands if you have ever shot a gun or bow 25yds is not so bad your right about being acurate. i yas once good with my sling shot not as good as my fiend who could smash a marble with another at not 25yds butt far as in more than 15 paces. as for force the extention fo a lever your arm and another the atlatl you had more force it must have been like landing on the moon when you could take game down with less trama to you and the game let alone the time it took and the more you could gather. it was ysed on the ice cap in our time. or may i say your dads time. they were pritty acurate. i belong to a club that makes our own alute skin boats and part of our lor is to use the atlatl. some of these guys are pretty good . as good to kill game at 25yds +we are not talking more than 50. and there was more game then less spooky. iron toung ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 12:07:57 EDT From: <ITWHEELER@aol.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re Sign Language In a message dated 98-05-30 22:32:51 EDT, you write: << Jerry (Meriwether) Zaslow #1488 >> could you get back to me and give some more info indian sign its of intrest to me and apoligise for deaf mute coment. being i sad deaf mute . iron tounge ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 23:01:54 -0700 From: Chris Sega <chrissega1@powernet.net> Subject: MtMan-List: Tobacco There is a plant whose common name is Tobacco brush and grows in the Sierra Nevada Mountains and I assume throughout the intermountain west. I resembles common Manzanita but the branches are not red and the leaves are oval as opposed to manzanita which has round leaves. You should be able to find a reference to it in a book called Shrubs of the Great Basin. I cannot recall the family name of the plant but it is in the same family as Manzanita. I have never smoked it and I doubt if it can be palatably smoked as anything but an extender to a diminishing supply of tobacco. It could be rolled in corn husks (Hojas) but I imagine it would mostly be smoked in a pipe. If you want a tobacco alternative a company called Native Spirit has a blend of Willow bark, Yerba Buena and other stuff which you might be able to pick up at a tobbaco store. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 01:59:16 EDT From: <Htorr@aol.com> Subject: MtMan-List: more sign language As far as I know I am one of the few to learn Indian Sign Language (ISL) before learning American Sign Language (ASL). I learned ISL in the Scouting program and have been taking a class in ASL for a few years for business purposes. (I have occasional hearing-impared customers.) I have found only a few signs that are the same in both. These include love, winter, and the obvious ones such as I, you, they. Some signs are similar but have different meanings. For example the ISL for white man is made with the fore finger moving across the forehead (originally showing the white man's hat). This same sign in ASL means "black" (originally tracing the black eyebrow). Another interesting sign in ISL for "many times" or "often" is the forefinger touching the left arm and moving up. Almost the identical sign in ASL means "improving." With ASL facial expressions are an integral part of the language. ISL was less dependent on facial expressions. I agree that French sign language is closer to ASL than is British Sign Language (BSL). Finger spelling in ASL is done with one hand, in BSL you have to use both hands. Interesting enough I found that Irish Sign Language is different from British Sign Language. As for ISL differing between tribes, I think the differences were only minor. The whole purpose of ISL was to communicate when different tribes met and according to Tompkins' book it was almost universal from the Hudson Bay to the Gulf of Mexico. W.P Clark's book The Indian Sign Language was originally published about 1885 and is probably the most authentic. It has more words than Tompkins' book, including some "adult" words that Tompkins book does not include (the Boy Scouts found these in a hurry), but unfortunately does not include any illustrations. For this reason, Tompkins' book is preferable for first learning the language. Clark apparently also knew what he termed as "deaf- mute language" (this was before ASL) as he often compares the ISL word with the way the "deaf mutes" (I know the term is not used anymore) say the same word. I am still disappointed at how few Native Americans I have found that know ISL. As one Native American at a Powwow at Rapid City, South Dakota said to me, "I know this sign --- 'how' ---- I learned it from a John Wayne movie." Traditions such as costuming, Indian dance, etc. are kept up but Indian Sign has been neglected. Respectfully, Tom Orr ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Jun 1998 07:24:09 -0600 From: "Sickler, Louis L" <louis.l.sickler@lmco.com> Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: tobacco... Gail, I smoke kinnikinnick somewhat regularly and really enjoy it. But I do not mix it with tobacco, which is one substance my body has never learned to tolerate. I like to gather my own here in the Shining Mtns in the spring when they start to come out of plant hibernation. I use the dried, crumbled leaves in a somewhat sparse proportion with other herbs. The red berries are nice also. I dry them and remove the seeds, as they are large compared to the berry part and can be a bit harsh. One of my favorite mixtures is with red willow bark, angelica root and mullein leaves in about equal proprotions with a smaller amount of kinnikinnick. I can't give exact amounts as I just make a pile of each and mix together until it looks about right. There was an article in the November/December 1995 issue of Backwoodsman Magazine called 'Native American Smoking Mixes' that discussed several other herbs, as well. As with all plants, etc gathered in the wild, be careful of poisons, allergens,etc. Try small amounts at first. Hope this helps. Red Coyote > ---------- > From: Gail Carbiener > Reply To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Sent: Saturday, May 30, 1998 21:21 > To: American Mountain Men > Subject: MtMan-List: Re: tobacco... > > > >To all: > > This got lost in never never land. Has any one ever tried this > manzanita > >with tobacco mixture? > >Gail (learning to play a MM in living history) > >============== > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 14:30:55 -0400 From: "Mill, Kirk" <millk@aydin.com> Subject: MtMan-List: lodges I have a question for you folks. I am trying to get started in buckskinning and am assembling my outfit. My question is in regard to appropriate lodges. I have an old canvas wall tent that I believe would be period correct except that it is green. Every rendezvous picture that I have seen shows white lodges only. What do you think? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 18:52:13 -0500 From: "Ken " <rebelfreehold@worldnet.att.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bow and Arrows Thanks for the input on your group. Like I said before, there are those who can use one at a greater distance than I ever could. ( we all have our limitations) I happen to like the blowguns like the Cherokee use. I have a shorter one that I purchased at Qualla Boundry in North Carolina. Use hardwood darts with thistle down for the fluff. They are great on rabbits and birds. Yes, if I am hungry I will eat most any bird I can hit! In the middle ages they ate hawks and other non-game birds. NO, I don't shoot hawks. But sparrows, doves, quail, and such are not hard to hit at a watering hole. Maybe some of the folks on the list would like to do a 3 or 7 day run sometime and learn how to use these kind of tools and techniques. Contact me off line if you might be interested. NO modern tools will be allowed however! For comfort, you can have a canteen, blanket, and a small bag with medications, tooth brush, etc. NO you won't need a razor, because where I will take you, you won't be seeing any women! YellowFeather - ---------- > From: ITWHEELER@aol.com > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Bow and Arrows > Date: Sunday, May 31, 1998 11:07 AM > > In a message dated 98-05-30 10:23:35 EDT, you write: > > << llsi@texas.net (Glenn Darilek) >> > not an amaseing feet with practace you can stand on your hands if you have > ever shot a gun or bow 25yds is not so bad your right about being acurate. i > yas once good with my sling shot not as good as my fiend who could smash a > marble with another at not 25yds butt far as in more than 15 paces. as for > force the extention fo a lever your arm and another the atlatl you had more > force it must have been like landing on the moon when you could take game down > with less trama to you and the game let alone the time it took and the more > you could gather. it was ysed on the ice cap in our time. or may i say your > dads time. they were pritty acurate. i belong to a club that makes our own > alute skin boats and part of our lor is to use the atlatl. some of these guys > are pretty good . as good to kill game at 25yds +we are not talking more > than 50. and there was more game then less spooky. > > iron > toung ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 19:26:06 -0600 From: agottfre@telusplanet.net (Angela Gottfred) Subject: MtMan-List: Re Men of the Cloth It took a long time for formal religion to reach the Canadian Rockies. The first priest or minister in the Canadian Rockes was, I believe, Rev. Robert Terrill Rundle, a Methodist who conducted a service at Rocky Mountain House in the mid-1840's. A prominent mountain near Banff is named after him. He and his Catholic counterpart, Father Lacombe, operated out of Edmonton House. Lacombe arrived a few years after Rundle, but spent the rest of his life at his mission; Rundle returned to England in 1848. Catholic priests travelled as far west as Fort Dauphin, Manitoba before 1800, and accompanied voyageurs west of the Great Lakes quite intermittently thereafter. It took decades, however, for them to get further than Manitoba. Father Pierre Antoine Tabeau travelled to Rainy Lake & back in the summer of 1816. In 1818, Father (later Bishop) Joseph Norbert Provencher and Father Severe Dumoulin arrived at Red River (Winnipeg). Father Dumoulin travelled to Norway House, where he conducted a service on Aug 6, 1820. By 1823-1824, there were both Catholic and Anglican priests living at Red River. Some of the Protestants had a devastating impact on fur trade families; they refused to acknowledge marriages which had been established before their arrival.The Catholics were more pragmatic, and happily formalized existing unions. Your humble & obedient servant, Angela Gottfred agottfre@telusplanet.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 18:43:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Newbill <lnewbill@uidaho.edu> Subject: MtMan-List: Palouse River Regional Rendezvous (NE Washington) Palouse River Regional Rendezvous When: June 26-28 Where: Washington, North of Colfax (map on registration form) Details: All sorts of shoots and things to keep ya busy! Come join us for a weekend of of muzzleloading and oldtime fun! For More Info contact Whitey Eagen (509)397-9123, Carl Schluneger (509)-397-4956, or Tony Roberts (509) 397-4447 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 19:11:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Newbill <lnewbill@uidaho.edu> Subject: MtMan-List: Plant Lore Class in N. Idaho The Univ. of Idaho presents a field course in ethnobotany, the study of plant lore, on June 7 at the Clark Fork Field Campus. The course offers a hands-on exploration of the folklore of native plants and their traditional uses as medicine, food and fiber. The course will be taught by Steve Brunsfeld, associate professor in the Dept of Forest Resources, and by independent consultant Richard Old. Check in is from 8:30 to 9 a.m., followed immediately by an hour-long introduction. The field excursion by car caravan begins at 10 a.m. and includes identification of plants in a variety of habitats and discussion of their uses. Registration is $19. Overnight lodgin at the field campus is $10.70 per night, per person (there is also a very nice Natl Forest campground just down the road, at the site of the Northwest Company's Kullyspell House for about $5 a campsite/night). Participants are asked to bring sturdy walking shoes, a sack lunch, beverages and a hand lens. No Pets. For Registration and reservations, write to Edie Kinucan, Clark Fork Field Campus, Box 87, Clark Fork, Idaho, 83811, or call 'em at 208-266-1452. Newbill's note... these are super classes for the serious buckskinner if you're in the area. I'll be missing this one cause I'm working on a Rendezvous preparation. Regards Lee Newbill Viola, Idaho email at lnewbill@uidaho.edu Keeper of the "Buckskins & Blackpowder!" Webpage http://www.uidaho.edu/~lnewbill/bp.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 21:37:03 EDT From: <Traphand@aol.com> Subject: Fwd: MtMan-List: lodges This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --part0_896751424_boundary Content-ID: <0_896751424@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII canvas that is white would fit the era better. i do not think a green one would go over to good . a small wedge tent would be better. traphand - --part0_896751424_boundary Content-ID: <0_896751424@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: <owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Received: from relay25.mx.aol.com (relay25.mail.aol.com [172.31.109.25]) by air09.mail.aol.com (v43.20) with SMTP; Mon, 01 Jun 1998 15:25:25 -0400 Received: from lists.xmission.com (lists.xmission.com [198.60.22.7]) by relay25.mx.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with SMTP id PAA27961; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 15:25:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from domo by lists.xmission.com with local (Exim 1.82 #1) id 0ygaAU-0003Hn-00; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 13:22:50 -0600 Received: from (xmission.xmission.com) [198.60.22.2] (drudy) by lists.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #1) id 0ygaAO-0003HY-00; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 13:22:48 -0600 Received: (from drudy@localhost) by xmission.xmission.com (8.8.8/8.7.5) id NAA23518 for hist_text@lists.xmission.com; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 13:22:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (mail.xmission.com) [198.60.22.22] by lists.xmission.com with smtp (Exim 1.82 #1) id 0ygZLi-00071b-00; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 12:30:22 -0600 Received: from (aydin.com) [12.3.210.10] by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #2) id 0ygZLf-0001kK-00; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 12:30:19 -0600 Received: from acush02.aydin.com ([10.50.10.12]) by gateway.aydin.com with ESMTP id <26888>; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 14:35:01 -0400 Received: by exchange.aydin.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <MCJLRA6G>; Mon, 1 Jun 1998 14:25:03 -0400 Message-ID: <D131A1C9E7E3D011A6DE006097BA62D513DA8E@acusn01> From: "Mill, Kirk" <millk@aydin.com> To: ML MAILING LIST <mlml@vnet.net> Cc: history mailing list <hist_text@xmission.com> Subject: MtMan-List: lodges Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 14:30:55 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Sender: owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I have a question for you folks. I am trying to get started in buckskinning and am assembling my outfit. My question is in regard to appropriate lodges. I have an old canvas wall tent that I believe would be period correct except that it is green. Every rendezvous picture that I have seen shows white lodges only. What do you think? - --part0_896751424_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 05:50:19 -0700 From: "JON P TOWNS" <AMM944@prodigy.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: lodges This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_01BD8D21.29119FE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Your green wall tent will go real good next to someone's camper trailer in the tin Tipi camp. I am sure that they must have the same kind of doin's where your from like is held in Washington. Go camp in the non primitive area for a while and get a feel to see if you like it first then pour the money into it. Buckskinning is a form of the pit. You might not like the drunks and etc. But if you like to drink and party I am sure its like all over get down and dirty. Pick a rondy and find if they have a non primitive area to camp and go. For God sakes and try it first, before you spend a lot of money. Later Jon T - ---------- : From: Mill, Kirk <millk@aydin.com> : To: ML MAILING LIST <mlml@vnet.net> : Cc: history mailing list <hist_text@xmission.com> : Subject: MtMan-List: lodges : Date: Monday, June 01, 1998 11:30 AM : : I have a question for you folks. I am trying to get started in : buckskinning and am assembling my outfit. My question is in regard to : appropriate lodges. I have an old canvas wall tent that I believe would : be period correct except that it is green. Every rendezvous picture that : I have seen shows white lodges only. What do you think? - ------=_NextPart_000_01BD8D21.29119FE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF">Your green wall tent will go real good = next to someone's camper trailer in the tin Tipi camp. I am sure = that they must have the same kind of doin's where your from like is held = in Washington. Go camp in the non primitive area for a while and = get a feel to see if you like it first then pour the money into it. = Buckskinning is a form of the pit. You might not like the = drunks and etc. But if you like to drink and party I am sure its = like all over get down and dirty. Pick a rondy and find if they = have a non primitive area to camp and go. For God sakes and try it = first, before you spend a lot of money. Later Jon T = ---------- : From: Mill, Kirk <millk@aydin.com> : To: ML MAILING LIST <mlml@vnet.net> : = Cc: history mailing list <hist_text@xmission.com> : Subject: MtMan-List: lodges : Date: = Monday, June 01, 1998 11:30 AM : : I have a question for you = folks. I am trying to get started in : buckskinning and am assembling = my outfit. My question is in regard to : appropriate lodges. I have = an old canvas wall tent that I believe would : be period correct = except that it is green. Every rendezvous picture that : I have seen = shows white lodges only. What do you think? </body></html> - ------=_NextPart_000_01BD8D21.29119FE0-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Jun 1998 10:20:52 EDT From: <CTOAKES@aol.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Poison Ivy In a message dated 98-05-23 14:44:31 EDT, you write: <> I never got it until I was in my late 30's, used to pick it and chase my sister and all that. Now I am extremely careful around it as I get it easily now. I talked to a dermatologist (sp) and was told that the medical folks claim that the more often you come in contact with ivy or poison oak the more likely you are to break out and that everytime you break out you body develops more histamines (sp) faster to react to it so you break out worse and faster each time from then on. Last summer my wife and kids all got severe cases requiring shots and pills. My wife got it on her upper thighs when she went to the hooter as the hem of her skirt had dragged in it and when she lifted her skirt to go to the bathroom it passed the oil to her legs. There are several commercial "blocks" that you can apply prior to contact that really do work. Even Avon dealers now carry them. You put them on like a sun screen accept they prevent the oils from the ivy from bonding to your skin so you have time to wash it off. When you wash, either with good old fels napta or one of the new ivy cleansers wash with COLD water not hot. Hot water opens the pores and the reaction is worse. One thing you can also use is Jewel Weed to clean up in a pinch. Jewel Weed likes the same growing conditions as Ivy and is often found near by. It has a stem and leaf structure that is really juicy that when crushed acts like a soap and does clean off the ivy before it bonds to the skin. The best way to avoid it is to learn to spot it before you are in it. Out here in the northeast it can be short ground cover or like the vine we saw at Ft Frederic that was about 6" in diameter and went at least 40' up and around a tree. Just got back from a 10 day event (The Original North Eastern) in North Eastern Conn., and every transistion area from trail to woods, river to woods or field to woods was full of beautiful lush ivy so if you come to the NE and plan to walk into the woods be careful (we were) or you will itch a lot. By the way the Original North Eastern was once again wonderful, far more activities than you could possible do, good weather and wonderful friends both new and old. 750+ registered adults (16 years or older) and 10 days to get to meet them all. It will be in Conn. again next year on the west bank of the lake formed by the Thompson Lake Dam, hope to see you there over Memorial Day week next year. Your Humble Servant C.T. Oakes ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Jun 1998 08:31:01 -0700 From: Roger Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: lodges Kirk; You got some good answers to your question and you should concider taking that advise but I will offer another idea. You didn't say what you would use your shelter for and if it is just for you, you might do what I just did for my newest lonsome shelter. I went to Eagle Hardware and bought one of their 9' by 12' painters drop cloths for $20 and ran it through the wash to shrink and tighten it up. I then water proofed it with a comercial waterproofing agent and installed gromets in the corners and along the edge. It will make a fine shelter and can be set up in a couple of ways depending on the conditions. Niceset thing about it is that it is a nice light natural tan color like linen which it may be since it was made in India. I think there are bigger drop cloths available that could be turned into somewhat bigger shelters if needed and a couple of these dropcloths could be turned into a nice wedge tent with very little cuting and sewing. I too started out years ago with an old army wall tent in OD green. It had to be set up in the tin-teepee camp that first year but it gave me some time to decide if I really wanted to make the investment in a lodge or era correct tent. I did and the next year I had a lodge. I hope this was helpfull. YMOS Capt. Lahti Mill, Kirk wrote: > I have a question for you folks. I am trying to get started in > buckskinning and am assembling my outfit. My question is in regard to > appropriate lodges. I have an old canvas wall tent that I believe would > be period correct except that it is green. Every rendezvous picture that > I have seen shows white lodges only. What do you think? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Jun 1998 12:12:35 -0600 (CST) From: mxhbc@TTACS.TTU.EDU (Henry B. Crawford) Subject: Re: MtMan-List: lodges > . . . I have an old canvas wall tent that I believe would >be period correct except that it is green. Every rendezvous picture that >I have seen shows white lodges only. What do you think? Kirk, One solution, if the tent is not too big, is you can soak it in a mixture of chlorine bleech and water in a LARGE vat of some kind to fade the green. I did it with a green duffel bag and it came out kind of a sandy tan. It would take something the size of a large steel livestock water trough to soak it. Second solution is to sell the tent and apply the proceeds (however little) toward an affordable period tent. Keep the poles if you can, because you'll just have to buy more. Poles are usually sold sepatately from tents. The best prices I've seen on tents are from Panther Primitives (they also offer poles, btw, but your local lumber yard could have a better deal). I hope this helps, and it might be a better answer for you than camping among the alcoas. Sorry, but you really can't get a full rondy experience by camping among motor homes. Cheers, HBC ***************************************** Henry B. Crawford Curator of History mxhbc@ttacs.ttu.edu Museum of Texas Tech University 806/742-2442 Box 43191 FAX 742-1136 Lubbock, TX 79409-3191 WEBSITE: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum ****** Living History . . . Because it's there! ******* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Jun 1998 12:40:16 -0600 From: agottfre@telusplanet.net (Angela Gottfred) Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Men of the Cloth I mentioned that Protestant and Catholic missionaries were strikingly different in their attitudes. Here is what Sylvia Van Kirk has to say about another man of the cloth, whom I missed in my original message: "[Fort Vancouver's] first clergyman, the Reverend Herbert Beaver, was totally unsympathetic to the fur-trade custom [of marriage according to Native tradition], in spite of his appropriate name. Arriving in the fall of 1836 with his English wife, Jane, he denounced Fort Vancouver as a 'deplorable scene of vice and ignorance'. He refused to give any credence to 'the custom of the country', styling the traders' wives as concubines and chastising the men for indulging in fornication. This...understandably outraged fiery tempered Chief Factor John McLoughlin... To Beaver, good Mrs. McLoughlin was only a 'kept Mistress' who could not be allowed to associate with properly married females such as his own wife." (p154-155) In 1838, after Beaver left Ft. Vancouver, two Catholic priests, Francois N. Banchet and Modeste Demers arrived, via Fort Edmonton. Their attitude toward 'country marriages' was markedly different; their marriage ceremonies were intended to 'renew & ratify' these existing marriages, and for the couple to formally recognize the legitimacy of their children. For more information on the early Canadian men of the cloth, and the fur trade, I strongly recommend : Van Kirk, Sylvia. _Many Tender Ties : Women in Fur-Trade Society, 1670-1870_. Watson & Dwyer : Winnipeg, 1980. ISBN 0-920486-06-1 Your humble & obedient servant, Angela Gottfred agottfre@telusplanet.net ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #77 ****************************** - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.