Sunday, May 10, 1998 8:25 AM<br>: <br>: JON P TOWNS wrote:<br>: > =
<br>: > I have some canteen gourd seeds <br>: Dear Jon and the =
list:<br>: I have a canteen quality gourd that I haven't developed into =
a canteen <br>: as yet. It still contains the seeds. I got =
this gourd at rondyvoo <br>: maybe five years ago. Do you thinks =
the seeds will grow and if so, how <br>: do I use them? I don't =
have a green thumb. Most everything I try to <br>: grow, =
dies.<br>: <br>: Ken C (Carp)<br>: </p>
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 08:55:17 -0600 (CST)
From: mxhbc@TTACS.TTU.EDU (Henry B. Crawford)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: gourd seeds
Thanks, Jon, but I have a new crop in the ground now, looking nice and just
starting to climb. I should have a nice batch for canteens this fall. I
still have plenty o' seeds from the crop of 2 years ago.
>I have some canteen gourd seeds for anyone who wants them send me a self
>addressed envelope and I will stick them in a plastic bag in a damp paper
>towel and they should be ready to put in a starter pot.
*****************************************
Henry B. Crawford Curator of History
mxhbc@ttacs.ttu.edu Museum of Texas Tech University
806/742-2442 Box 43191
FAX 742-1136 Lubbock, TX 79409-3191
WEBSITE: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum
****** Living History . . . Because it's there! *******
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 10:07:29 -0600
From: agottfre@telusplanet.net (Angela Gottfred)
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Coping with a fire ban--thanks!
Thanks to everyone for the great suggestions! Yes, the fire ban is a PITA,
but it's a grim reality--I have a feeling we're beginning to learn what
it's been like in California the last few years. Everything is incredibly
dry & hot, and there is no rain in the forecast. Although the hot weather
means that spring is almost a month early here, everyone's hoping & praying
for heavy rain. In southern Alberta, we had a major grass fire in December;
it destroyed homes, killed cattle, and razed square miles of grazing land.
(It was started by someone who thought it was safe to burn his trash, and
then the wind began to blow...) In the Rockies, a forest fire is burning
near the Trans-Canada Highway in Banff National Park (set off by campers who
ignored the fire ban). In northern Alberta's boreal forest, the town of Swan
Hills has been evacuated once already (due to a fire started by sparks
thrown from the rails by a moving train), and everyone who has returned is
still on evacuation alert--and packing up their valuables just in case.
There are many other forest fires burning out of control as well--and this
is a month BEFORE the usual start of our fire season.
So, once again, thanks for all the ideas, and I'm hoping for several weeks
of steady rain (but no thunderstorms) so that I won't need to use any of
them. 'Cause, as someone already mentioned, fire bans suck.
Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred
agottfre@telusplanet.net
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Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 09:00:39 -0700
From: Gary Bell <micropt@gte.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Adhesives
Gum arabic is indeed found in all sorts of products today, acting as an adhesive or binder, including lots of foods and drug products. It is literally the concentrated sap from African acacia trees (a spectacularly
thorny tree common to African desert areas). It is unfortunately not related to hide/hoof glues (which are generally made from any animal sources of collagen protein) about which there have been several nice postings
lately. I particularly liked the recently posted notion of makin' some hide glue out of doggie chew rawhide, and the schoolteacher's posting today from Glenn Darilek. Cookin' down animal protein glue is indeed a smelly
process! You can buy the stuff already cooked into a powder at old style hardware stores and cabinet maker supply businesses. This stuff certainly did serve, and still can serve as a wonderful glue. The term glue pot
reefers to hide glue's need to be heated to melting and applied hot. Think Hot-Melt glue, old style and you will get the right idea. This collagen protein is used in the original animals as the chief glue, holding
things together, repairing damage (scar tissue) and making wonderfully strong and light composite structures like bone, hide, fur and hoofs from various fibers, kinda predating fiberglass and reinforced concrete but
along the same engineering lines.
I noted several submissions about the adhesive properties of traditional paint bases, egg white and milk proteins, basically. Casein glue, available still today is precipitated from milk by cooking with a mild acid,
and is both a fine water soluble paint base and glue. Paints have used the adhesive properties of the albumen protein in egg white and casein in milk for many centuries.
I have not spotted recent postings under this adhesive heading about various tree sap/resin adhesives, from the boiled pitch used in the illustrious birch bark canoes to the much discussed pine tar. I suppose that found
"geologic" sources of asphalt tar would fall into a similar category, in terms of its utility as a historic adhesive, ultimately derived from trees and plants.
I do not know whether the seaweed based adhesives we know as mucilage were in common use in the historic time and place of our concentration, perhaps somebody out there will know.
In some applications plaster like compounds serve as adhesives too, from mortaring brick and stone to again making paint bases.
I suppose that it takes only a little imagination and experience to judge how strong most of these adhesives are, and where they are each better suited. In my experience the hide glues are very strong and particularly
easy to use once you are set up with a heated glue pot. They are the choice adhesive for making guitars/violins, and fancy woodworking still today. The other adhesives are much less strong, and while well suited as a
paint base would not likely hold a broken rifle stock together long.
Worth noting here is the Native American's resourceful use of shrinking wraps of soaked rawhide to repair and sometimes simply to decorate rifles, tip arrows and lances, etc.. I am leading into the suggestion that if
strength is required of these adhesives sometimes a mechanical component like stitched sinew or rawhide wrap or a strategically placed metal rivet is needed to compliment the adhesive of choice.
I leave to the conscience of the reenacter the choice of using modern adhesives, epoxy, cyanoacrylate (Krazy Glue), and a plethora of others, in places where they would do the job the best and be hard to detect. I have
for example knife scales held on mostly by epoxy. Artful use of stitches and rivets serve to conceal my unorthodoxy.
kat wrote:
> Gum arabic is the basis for most glues. It is rabbit hide derived. Making most glue is a nasty smelly project in my experience. I hope someone can prove me wrong so I can finally make some to go with everything else!
Here is a good place to buy hide glue. It is easier to buy than make.
Woodworker Supply 1-800-645-9292
Moser's Hide glue
Pearl Hide glue is general all purpose glue-$5.95/lb
Ground Hide glue is more pure for applications requiring a higher tack and
a stronger bond-$7.55/lb
Some people mix this with liquid hide glue for a slower drying time, you
can buy this also from
Wordworker's Supply
Bowmakers like to mix the pure hide glue and liquid together
I use both and they work great, I also use pine pitch to make repairs
Once the hide glue drys, you can carry it in a bag and just rehydrate it
with water,
Joe
Absaroka Western Designs and Tannery
Call us about our professional home tanning kit-307-455-2440
Write for custom tanning prices
We produce rawhide lampshades and carry a large selection of leather and
hair on robes
Fine lodgepole furniture, pillows, Indian reproductions, paintings, baskets
check out our new web site: http://www.onpages.com/absaroka
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:38:47 -0600
From: "Sickler, Louis L" <louis.l.sickler@lmco.com>
Subject: MtMan-List: Adhesives
Ho the List:
In response to John Fleming's inquiry about animal hide glue, I found a
commercial source that might be of interest to those unable / not willing to
make their own. It is
Moscow Hide & Fur
208-882-0601
www.hideandfur.com
They sell 5 oz bags for $6.00 each, with instructions for use.
I haven't tried it, but my order goes in today.
YMHOS,
Red Coyote
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Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 11:20:03 -0700
From: Gary Bell <micropt@gte.net>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Adhesives
Rabbit hide is indeed specifically made into a hide glue, sometimes called rabbit sizing, used particularly for a coating before laying on gold leaf to "gild" things, like picture frames, statues, etc.. A gum
arabic adhesive would also serve this purpose, (although less well) and is sometimes used. Perhaps the confusion originated there....
Gary Bell
(still working on a 'Vous name, but just the same let's NOT use Sticky, OK?)
kat wrote:
> >From the info I have gotten from the list, the Art Instructer I had must have been mistaken. Perhaps there is another adhesive source that looks/sounds a lot like gum arabic that is from rabbit hide? Hmmmmm.
