I asked a few days back for recipes for the drink referred to as PIE. It's
hard to believe only one of you have a recipe. Surely there's more than one
recipe
TrapRJoe
'
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">I asked a few days back for recipes for the drink referred to as PIE. It's hard to believe only one of you have a recipe. Surely there's more than one recipe<BR>
<BR>
TrapRJoe<BR>
'<BR>
<BR>
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>I asked a few days back for recipes for the drink referred to as PIE. It's
hard to >believe only one of you have a recipe. Surely there's more than
one recipe
Joe,
How about a recipe for Christmas Cake instead?
Christmas Cake!!
Ingredients:
1 cup of water
1 tsp baking soda
1 cup of sugar
1 tsp salt
1 cup of brown sugar
lemon juice
4 large eggs
nuts
1 bottle of Vodka
2 cups of dried fruit
Instructions:
Sample the vodka to check quality. Take a large bowl, check the vodka again.
To be sure it is the highest quality, pour one level cup and drink.
Repeat.
Turn on the electric mixer. Beat one cup of butter in a large fluffy bowl.
Add one teaspoon of sugar. Beat again.
At this point it's best to make sure the vodka is shtill OK. Try another cup
.... just in case.....
Turn off the mixerer. Break 2 leggs and add to the bowl and chuck in the cup
of dried fruit. Pick fruit off floor. Mix on the turner.
If the fried druit gets stuck in the beaterers pry it loose with a
sdrewscriver.
Sample the vodka to check for tonsisticity.
Next, sift two cups of salt. Or something. Who gives a crap. Check the vodka.
Now shift the lemon juice and strain your nuts. Add one table.
Add a spoon of sugar, or somefink. Whatever you can find.
Greash the oven and p i ss in the fridge.
Turn the cake tin 360 degrees and try not to fall over.
Don't forget to beat off the turner.
Finally, throw the bowl through the window, finish the vodka and kick the
cat.
Fall into bed.
CHERRY MISTMAS!
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">>I asked a few days back for recipes for the drink referred to as PIE. It's hard to >believe only one of you have a recipe. Surely there's more than one recipe<BR>
<BR>
Joe,<BR>
How about a recipe for Christmas Cake instead?<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Sample the vodka to check quality. Take a large bowl, check the vodka</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> </FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">again. To be sure it is the highest quality, pour one level cup and drink.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> <BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Turn on the electric mixer. Beat one cup of butter in a large fluffy bowl.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> <BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Add one teaspoon of sugar. Beat again. <BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Now shift the lemon juice and strain your nuts. Add one table. <BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Add a spoon of sugar, or somefink. Whatever you can find.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> <BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Greash the oven and p i ss in the fridge.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> <BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Turn the cake tin 360 degrees and try not to fall over.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> <BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Don't forget to beat off the turner.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> <BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">Finally, throw the bowl through the window, finish the vodka and kick the</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> </FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">cat.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0"> <BR>
I voting for TOF's recipe as the winner! <GGG> Barney
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B>I voting for TOF's recipe as the winner! <GGG> Barney</B></FONT></HTML>
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As for which came first. The best I can tell, about the same time. With in
a day of each other.
TrapRJoe
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">As for which came first. The best I can tell, about the same time. With in a day of each other.<BR>
<BR>
TrapRJoe</FONT></HTML>
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concerning this issue of whether loading blocks were used in the fur trade days. I refer you to the Oct issue of American Hunter Magazine, 1975. Article entitled: "A Real Hunters Rifle." This particular rifle with hunting pouch and powder horn and all accoutrements is owned by a collector in Virginia. Attached to the strap of the bag in the accompanying photo is an original loading block that is obviously very old. It is a single piece of hardwood with 4 bullet sized holes bored into it in a single line. In the holes are patched round balls. Old patches and old oxidized lead balls. The pouch and horn, rifle and accoutrements all date from before 1842. The hunter died of old age in 1842. Excellent article with nice color photos of the powder horn with a repair on it, and all of the contents of the hunting pouch along with the rifle. The family kept the gun until the 1970s when it was sold to the collector who allowed it to be photographed for the magazine. There is no reason to doubt the authenticity of the articles because the whole article was put together before people sat around and nit picked such subjects. At least after close axamination of the photos I find them to be genuine in my humble opinion. Mike B
Wynn Ormond <oci@pcu.net> wrote:
> Thanks for your answer! I suspected as much even though having no
> set charges readly available seems counter intuitive given that they
> seem to have had loading blocks. BTW, an pouch horn is just similar
> to a powder horn but is flat and placed inside the huniting bag
> instead worn outside.
>
> Two Feathers
I will stand by my answer then that most of the art work shows a trapper
with a horn on the outside of the pouch.
I would like to see evidence of loading blocks. Other than carrying a few
rounds in their mouth I have not seen anything of that like either.
Wynn Ormond
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<P>concerning this issue of whether loading blocks were used in the fur trade days. I refer you to the Oct issue of American Hunter Magazine, 1975. Article entitled: "A Real Hunters Rifle." This particular rifle with hunting pouch and powder horn and all accoutrements is owned by a collector in Virginia. Attached to the strap of the bag in the accompanying photo is an original loading block that is obviously very old. It is a single piece of hardwood with 4 bullet sized holes bored into it in a single line. In the holes are patched round balls. Old patches and old oxidized lead balls. The pouch and horn, rifle and accoutrements all date from before 1842. The hunter died of old age in 1842. Excellent article with nice color photos of the powder horn with a repair on it, and all of the contents of the hunting pouch along with the rifle. The family kept the gun until the 1970s when it was sold to the collector who allowed it to be photographed for the magazine. There is no reason to doubt the authenticity of the articles because the whole article was put together before people sat around and nit picked such subjects. At least after close axamination of the photos I find them to be genuine in my humble opinion. Mike B
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"><BR>> Thanks for your answer! I suspected as much even though having no<BR>> set charges readly available seems counter intuitive given that they<BR>> seem to have had loading blocks. BTW, an pouch horn is just similar<BR>> to a powder horn but is flat and placed inside the huniting bag<BR>> instead worn outside.<BR>><BR>> Two Feathers<BR><BR>I will stand by my answer then that most of the art work shows a trapper<BR>with a horn on the outside of the pouch.<BR><BR>I would like to see evidence of loading blocks. Other than carrying a few<BR>rounds in their mouth I have not seen anything of that like either.<BR><BR>Wynn Ormond<BR><BR><BR><BR>----------------------<BR>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</BLOCKQUOTE><p><br><hr size=1>Do you Yahoo!?<br>
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<BR>I agree with some of what you said Coyotes are one of the most challenging to trap. As a rule is the one set that one is most likely to catch one of the neighbors dogs in too. The Native Americans held them in high regard that is why they had so many legends about Coyote. The Shoshonis claim they are the one animal that reflects man.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
Sorry about this, that last post got away from me before I was done with it.
Beaverboy
I agree with some of what you said Coyotes are one of the most challenging to
trap. And as a rule is the one set that one is most likely to catch one of
the neighbors dogs in too. The Native Americans held them in high regard that
is why they had so many legends about Coyote. The Shoshonis claim they are
the one animal that most reflects man.
you said:
The coyote can be solitary but prefers to hunt in groups as he can
take much larger game this way. They are a very sociable animal and have a
language in howls and barks <I say it seem man likes to hunt that way too>
they hunt in groups mostly at night under the cover of darkness (like most
sinister characters) <When I call them in it is at night and as a rule always
with one other person setting back to back so they can not come in from
behind.> (like most sinister characters)
They hunt the young of many animals, how noble! < DA! what's the best eaten
and easy to catch and is the game of choice of all predators>
They will kill for the fun of it and I don't mean just sheep either. <What
do you hunt and trap for? I do it mostly for the fun of it>
The one place I do differ from you is I do have sympathy for them and think
they get blamed for more then they actually do. From what I know of them the
young are still with their mother at this time of year learning to hunt and
as a rule don't get run off until about the end of this month That's what
I've seen around here any way.
The coyote pays it's part in the food change and helps to keep mother nature
in balance. So long as there number stay in balance with there food source.
Here in Idaho back in 1970 some of you my remember hearing of the game of
bunny base ball being played in the Arco Desert and Mud Lakes area. A big
part of the reason for the framers being over run by rabbits was the fact the
most of all the coyotes that kept them in check had been killed off, by Sheep
men and hunters and trappers.
So without them we can have troubles too. I respect them and as rule will not
hunt them until they become a problem by being to plentiful.
I have had them as pets and found that coyote will always be coyote and are a
hard animal to tame and keep for long.
See ya down the trail
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2> Sorry about this, that last post got away from me before I was done with it.
<BR>Beaverboy
<BR>I agree with some of what you said Coyotes are one of the most challenging to trap. And as a rule is the one set that one is most likely to catch one of the neighbors dogs in too. The Native Americans held them in high regard that is why they had so many legends about Coyote. The Shoshonis claim they are the one animal that most reflects man.
<BR>you said:
<BR>The coyote can be solitary but prefers to hunt in groups as he can
<BR>take much larger game this way. They are a very sociable animal and have a
<BR>language in howls and barks <I say it seem man likes to hunt that way too>
<BR> they hunt in groups mostly at night under the cover of darkness (like most sinister characters) <When I call them in it is at night and as a rule always with one other person setting back to back so they can not come in from behind.> (like most sinister characters)
<BR>They hunt the young of many animals, how noble! < DA! what's the best eaten and easy to catch and is the game of choice of all predators>
<BR>They will kill for the fun of it and I don't mean just sheep either. <What do you hunt and trap for? I do it mostly for the fun of it></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">The one place I do differ from you is I do have sympathy for them and think they get blamed for more then they actually do.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"> </FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">From what I know of them the young are still with their mother at this time of year learning to hunt and as a rule don't get run off until about the end of this month That's what I've seen around here any way.
<BR>
<BR>The coyote pays it's part in the food change and helps to keep mother nature in balance. So long as there number stay in balance with there food source. Here in Idaho back in 1970 some of you my remember hearing of the game of bunny base ball being played in the Arco Desert and Mud Lakes area. A big part of the reason for the framers being over run by rabbits was the fact the most of all the coyotes that kept them in check had been killed off, by Sheep men and hunters and trappers.
<BR>So without them we can have troubles too. I respect them and as rule will not hunt them until they become a problem by being to plentiful.
<BR>I have had them as pets and found that coyote will always be coyote and are a hard animal to tame and keep for long.
<BR>See ya down the trail
<BR>Crazy Cyot
<BR></FONT></HTML>
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I was reading a Indian Trade List that I got off the web. It is listed as
Detroit, September 1778, Haldimand papers. In the collection it list
100 N.West Fuzells (their spelling not mine!). Here's the question:
Are they referring to the NW Trade Gun? This is the first time I've heard
of a Fussil being NW Trade Gun. What's your input? Thanks!
Traphand
Rick Petzoldt
Traphand@aol.com
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">I was reading a Indian Trade List that I got off the web. It is listed as<BR>
Detroit, September 1778, Haldimand papers. In the collection it list<BR>
100 N.West Fuzells (their spelling not mine!). Here's the question:<BR>
Are they referring to the NW Trade Gun? This is the first time I've heard<BR>
of a Fussil being NW Trade Gun. What's your input? Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000ff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B>Traphand<BR>
Rick Petzoldt<BR>
Traphand@aol.com<BR>
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But or the n.west fuzzells mentioned on the list the same as the northwest trade gun .The northwest trade gun I know very well for I have owned one for over twenty years. What do you think, the trade list is from1778.<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000ff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B>Traphand<BR>
Rick Petzoldt<BR>
Traphand@aol.com<BR>
</B></FONT></HTML>
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Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Fall Beaver Trapping Campaign
Date: 07 Dec 2002 18:55:41 EST
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love hearing about you trapping.Did it years ago in missouri.Be careful on
the ice.
Traphand
Rick Petzoldt
Traphand@aol.com
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">love hearing about you trapping.Did it years ago in missouri.Be careful on the ice. <BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000ff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B>Traphand<BR>
Rick Petzoldt<BR>
Traphand@aol.com<BR>
</B></FONT></HTML>
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The rifle is a full stocked poor boy style flintlock rifle with a wooden patchbox lid and brass furniture and roman nosed stock. There isn't any carving. A nice rifle similiar to a poor boy I own with the difference being mine is percussion without a patch box and has a copper toe plate. If you I can I will photograph the article with my digital camera and then transmit it over the web on this site. M. B
beaverboy@sofast.net wrote:> Hey Mike,
What kind of rifle was it? A flinter or what? Real curious about it.
Beaverboy
> concerning this issue of whether loading blocks were used in the fur
> trade days. I refer you to the Oct issue of American Hunter Magazine,
> 1975. Article entitled: "A Real Hunters Rifle." This particular rifle
> with hunting pouch and powder horn and all accoutrements is owned by a
> collector in Virginia. Attached to the strap of the bag in the
> accompanying photo is an original loading block that is obviously very
> old. It is a single piece of hardwood with 4 bullet sized holes bored
> into it in a single line. In the holes are patched round balls. Old
> patches and old oxidized lead balls. The pouch and horn, rifle and
> accoutrements all date from before 1842. The hunter died of old age in
> 1842. Excellent article with nice color photos of the powder horn with
> a repair on it, and all of the contents of the hunting pouch along
> with the rifle. The family kept the gun until the 1970s when it was
> sold to the collector who allowed it to be photographed for the
> magazine. There is no reason to doubt the authenticity of the articles
> because the whole article was put together before people sat around and
> nit picked such subjects. At least after close axamination of the
> photos I find them to be genuine in my humble opinion. Mike B
> Wynn Ormond wrote:
>> Thanks for your answer! I suspected as much even though having no set
>> charges readly available seems counter intuitive given that they seem
>> to have had loading blocks. BTW, an pouch horn is just similar to a
>> powder horn but is flat and placed inside the huniting bag
>> instead worn outside.
>>
>> Two Feathers
>
> I will stand by my answer then that most of the art work shows a
> trapper with a horn on the outside of the pouch.
>
> I would like to see evidence of loading blocks. Other than carrying a
> few rounds in their mouth I have not seen anything of that like either.
>
> Wynn Ormond
>
>
>
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>
>
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<P>The rifle is a full stocked poor boy style flintlock rifle with a wooden patchbox lid and brass furniture and roman nosed stock. There isn't any carving. A nice rifle similiar to a poor boy I own with the difference being mine is percussion without a patch box and has a copper toe plate. If you I can I will photograph the article with my digital camera and then transmit it over the web on this site. M. B
<P> <B><I>beaverboy@sofast.net</I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">> Hey Mike,<BR>What kind of rifle was it? A flinter or what? Real curious about it.<BR>Beaverboy<BR>> concerning this issue of whether loading blocks were used in the fur<BR>> trade days. I refer you to the Oct issue of American Hunter Magazine,<BR>> 1975. Article entitled: "A Real Hunters Rifle." This particular rifle<BR>> with hunting pouch and powder horn and all accoutrements is owned by a<BR>> collector in Virginia. Attached to the strap of the bag in the<BR>> accompanying photo is an original loading block that is obviously very<BR>> old. It is a single piece of hardwood with 4 bullet sized holes bored<BR>> into it in a single line. In the holes are patched round balls. Old<BR>> patches and old oxidized lead balls. The pouch and horn, rifle and<BR>> accoutrements all date from before 1842. The hunter died of old age in<BR>> 1842. Excellent article with nice color photos of the powder horn with<BR>> a repair on it, and all of the contents of the hunting pouch along<BR>> with the rifle. The family kept the gun until the 1970s when it was<BR>> sold to the collector who allowed it to be photographed for the<BR>> magazine. There is no reason to doubt the authenticity of the articles<BR>> because the whole article was put together before people sat around and<BR>> nit picked such subjects. At least after close axamination of the<BR>> photos I find them to be genuine in my humble opinion. Mike B<BR>> Wynn Ormond <OCI@PCU.NET>wrote:<BR>>> Thanks for your answer! I suspected as much even though having no set<BR>>> charges readly available seems counter intuitive given that they seem<BR>>> to have had loading blocks. BTW, an pouch horn is just similar to a<BR>>> powder horn but is flat and placed inside the huniting bag<BR>>> instead worn outside.<BR>>><BR>>> Two Feathers<BR>><BR>> I will stand by my answer then that most of the art work shows a<BR>> trapper with a horn on the outside of the pouch.<BR>><BR>> I would like to see evidence of loading blocks. Other than carrying a<BR>> few rounds in their mouth I have not seen anything of that like either.<BR>><BR>> Wynn Ormond<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> ----------------------<BR>> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html<BR>><BR>><BR>> ---------------------------------<BR>> Do you Yahoo!?<BR>> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>----------------------<BR>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</BLOCKQUOTE><p><br><hr size=1>Do you Yahoo!?<br>
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I'm neither a re-enactor or a buckskinner or even a trapper but I am finding your conversation fascinating. This way when I get done obtaining my CMP Distinguished Rifleman badge I'll know what to do next.
Carry on!
Pete
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The question was asked, why do some members of the American Mountain Men
look down on "re-enactors"?
I am not in the AMM, but in my personal experience, after having known and
been on the ground with a number of their Brothers over the years, is that
the Brothers attitude is a direct response to the person they are dealing
with.
Far too many 'reenactors' think they have their chrome-tan based kit 'right',
and are quick to brag about it or criticize others.
When they do that with or in front of one of the Brothers, it sometimes gets
ugly.......
I've also found that most, if not all of the AMM guys have done more research
than most reenactors, and are willing to share the benefit of their
knowledge. The bottom line is, if one is willing to listen there is a LOT to
be learned.
Just my dos centavos. Barney
Barney
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">The question was asked, why do some members of the American Mountain Men<BR>
look down on "re-enactors"? </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B><BR>
I am not in the AMM, but in my personal experience, after having known and been on the ground with a number of their Brothers over the years, is that the Brothers attitude is a direct response to the person they are dealing with.<BR>
<BR>
Far too many 'reenactors' think they have their chrome-tan based kit 'right', and are quick to brag about it or criticize others.<BR>
<BR>
When they do that with or in front of one of the Brothers, it sometimes gets ugly.......<BR>
<BR>
I've also found that most, if not all of the AMM guys have done more research than most reenactors, and are willing to share the benefit of their knowledge. The bottom line is, if one is willing to listen there is a LOT to be learned.<BR>
<BR>
Just my dos centavos. Barney<BR>
<BR>
Barney</B></FONT></HTML>
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Dixie Gun Works sells wad punches, last time I ordered wads and overshot cards I noticed them. I also noticed that at some leather stores they have leather punches that may be the correct size. You may want to try Tandy.com
BTW I use Blue and Grey brand wads and overshot cards from Dixie, I have never patterned my double, but I like using just the wads split in half, one over the powder and one over the shot. I have taken many quail and dove with it.
Frank
Midland,Texas
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At this point and time my best advise to both of you and anyone else that is
getting heated up over this Subject line is to find the Delete Key and use it
and cool down.
This has degenerated far enough and is going no where.
Been there done that ain't worth it.
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>At this point and time my best advise to both of you and anyone else that is getting heated up over this Subject line is to find the Delete Key and use it and cool down.
<BR>This has degenerated far enough and is going no where.
<BR>Been there done that ain't worth it.
<BR>Crazy Cyot</FONT></HTML>
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<BR>As for your Question on how I carry my rifle I use all three of the methods you mention and rotate between them. The horn loop works OK for a while if the saddle fits the horse well and if ya got enough padding under the saddle the pressure on the withers has not bothered any of my horses. In fact it is better for the horse to have the weight up front then to much weight behind the saddle. Most people ten to put to much weigh behind the saddle from what I've seen. My bedding goes under the saddle oil cloth and my coat if I'm not wearing it and saddle bags is all that goes on the back of my saddle now. But when you get in the trees and brush that is not how you want to carry your Gun and that's when it comes out of the loop and is in my hand or if I have a pack horse in two I use the sling and rotate the gun so it is under my arm so it is no sticking straight up and down on my back getting snagged on things and trying to pull me off the horse. While doing long rides rotating it around using all three methods has worked the best for me and the horse. I have ridden with men that just lay it in there laps and ride but I have found it to be a pain after a while trying to keep it balanced and with a pack horse in two a real challenge. It seem that I am always ridding green stock that are on there first or second year under the saddle and so having both hands free can be a plus.
<BR>See on the trail
<BR>Crazy Cyot
<BR>
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What you are doing now is what I like best. I am a life member of National
Trappers Assn. and have fleshed many, many pelts. A rubber apron helps
preserve clothing or an old pair of chest waders
Ridge Pole
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">What you are doing now is what I like best. I am a life member of National Trappers Assn. and have fleshed many, many pelts. A rubber apron helps preserve clothing or an old pair of chest waders<BR>
<BR>
Ridge Pole</FONT></HTML>
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an open choked gun, is that you can vary the components to pattern at almost <BR>
any distance up to 70 yards. It's a science gained through experience and <BR>
experimentation.<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
Can't say that I've ever seen a cylinder bore (open choked?) shotgun "pattern" at 70 yards.... save for a few pellets getting there. What kinda load are you using???? <BR>
<BR>
Magpie</FONT></HTML>
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I like the waist beam, also. I feel I can get more ooomph! into each push if neccessary and have more control of the hide. And if not doing a PC hide, a lawn&leaf bag tied round the waist keep the pants clean! Seems to go faster with this beam for me, too.
-Chris B.
"Wynn Ormond" <oci@pcu.net> wrote:
>Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I rigged
>my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the ussual lean
>agianst the wall, chest high type. áI really like the way this works, except
>for the fact that your pants get more wet and smelly.
>
> I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones for
>different jobs etc. áInput?
>Wynn Ormond
>
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Maybe this topic has already been discussed, but I would like to ask everyone what type of rifle or smoothbore do you use? does anyone out there use a (dare I say) a percussion rifle.
I'll start off, for my RMFT persona, I use a lyman great plains rifel in .54 cal., all the metal furniture has been browned and a hawken sight has been installed. I also have a 12 ga. double percussion that I use, it is a great shoooting shotgun, have taken dove and quail with it. My third weapon is a North Star Trade Gun , a buddy has been letting me try it out and shoot on a "if you like it buy it basis", the only problem with it is I am a lefty and the trade gun a right handed. I have been fair shooting it but would rather have a leftie instead.
OK let the discussion start........
Happy Holidays and Merry Christmas
Frank Sablan
Midland,Texas
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In a message dated 12/18/2002 12:48:35 PM Pacific Standard Time,
JOAQUINQS@aol.com writes:
> what type of rifle or smoothbore do you use?
Frank, I shoot a TVM .54 flint Southern Rifle with browned barrel and brass
hardware, and also a matching TVM Kentucky pistol. My smoothie is a
Centremark Fusil de Grenadier .62 flint, very plain dark stock and natural
steel barrel, repro of a military issue weapon complete with tri-edge
pig-sticker. I've shot it with buckshot, round ball and buck & ball and it's
been a very consistent, reliable weapon. A great kit to build, too!
For those who were asking about TVM's, all I can say is BUY ONE! Great
workmanship, great people, great shooting guns. When I got my TVM rifle it
required a very slight sight adjustment, and a couple of days later, the
first time I used it in competition, it led me to 1st of 150+ shooters in a
trail walk. Had it for years and it's never let me down......
You asked about rifles and smoothies, but I also shoot a pair of Uberti
repros of the Colt Paterson, 1836 (1st model) & 1839 (loading lever) model.
Both are .36 cal rifled CAP GUNS. The early model is blued and the 1839 is
black. I got into these as my persona evolved into the Southwest in the later
part of the Period.
Barney
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B>In a message dated 12/18/2002 12:48:35 PM Pacific Standard Time, JOAQUINQS@aol.com writes:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">what type of rifle or smoothbore do you use?</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B><BR>
Frank, I shoot a TVM .54 flint Southern Rifle with browned barrel and brass hardware, and also a matching TVM Kentucky pistol. My smoothie is a Centremark Fusil de Grenadier .62 flint, very plain dark stock and natural steel barrel, repro of a military issue weapon complete with tri-edge pig-sticker. I've shot it with buckshot, round ball and buck & ball and it's been a very consistent, reliable weapon. A great kit to build, too!<BR>
<BR>
For those who were asking about TVM's, all I can say is BUY ONE! Great workmanship, great people, great shooting guns. When I got my TVM rifle it required a very slight sight adjustment, and a couple of days later, the first time I used it in competition, it led me to 1st of 150+ shooters in a trail walk. Had it for years and it's never let me down...... <BR>
<BR>
You asked about rifles and smoothies, but I also shoot a pair of Uberti repros of the Colt Paterson, 1836 (1st model) & 1839 (loading lever) model. Both are .36 cal rifled CAP GUNS. The early model is blued and the 1839 is black. I got into these as my persona evolved into the Southwest in the later part of the Period.<BR>
<BR>
Barney</B></FONT></HTML>
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this is not intended to start a heated discussion, but I truly want to know
why folks are always bashing "percussion" rifles with comments such as
persuction,nipple huggers,and a few others i wont mention here. I happen to
like mine and know for that some (not many were in use in the RMFT era,
maybe late in the era,). I just dont truly understand this. If anyone wants
to bash percussion rifles just email me personally off list.
thanks to all responses and Happy Holidays and Merry Christmas to all
Frank Sablan
Midland,Texas
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"> this is not intended to start a heated discussion, but I truly want to know why folks are always bashing "percussion" rifles with comments such as persuction,nipple huggers,and a few others i wont mention here. I happen to like mine and know for that some (not many were in use in the RMFT era, maybe late in the era,). I just dont truly understand this. If anyone wants to bash percussion rifles just email me personally off list.<BR>
<BR>
thanks to all responses and Happy Holidays and Merry Christmas to all<BR>
<BR>
Frank Sablan<BR>
Midland,Texas</FONT></HTML>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi Frank, I like all those other answers..... I agree, it's a prideful jibe.... I can shoot better with a caplock, but enjoy the challenge of the g*d <A href="mailto:da#@(!d">da#@(!d</A> F*c&X!$ flintch lock. I figger if one can make a flintlock work, he can shoot anything. In the early days the caps were not as reliable as they are today. Russel mentions in his journals about the caps going off in the heat, etc.... As has been mentioned, where would a guy get caps in the middle of the Rockies in mid 1830s? Flint (actually chirt) abounds all over the continent. I just picked up some nice nodules 2 weeks ago while camping in the nearby hills. As the old song goes..." You can always find a rock, to make that musket talk....." It's a flintlock, Lord God, It's a flintlock.... (PS...don't tell anyone but I have a couple of cartridge guns too....modern stuff.... 1894 winchester and a single action revolver)... Yfab, Randy</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT size=2><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=0 face=Arial size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"> this is not intended to start a heated discussion, but I truly want to know why folks are always bashing "percussion" rifles with comments such as persuction,nipple huggers,and a few others i wont mention here. I happen to like mine and know for that some (not many were in use in the RMFT era, maybe late in the era,). I just dont truly understand this. If anyone wants to bash percussion rifles just email me personally off list.<BR><BR>thanks to all responses and Happy Holidays and Merry Christmas to all<BR><BR>Frank Sablan<BR>Midland,Texas</FONT> </FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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<BR>My guess without seeing them if they are some type of trappers tool would be fleshing spoons. When fleshing rats and critters with thin hinds like rabbits, fox I have used a large table spoon to flesh them, much less of a chance of cut the hide. Using it much like a bell scrapper which I use on beaver hinds after clean skinning them, after they are whooped.
<BR>Just a thought
<BR>Crazy Cyot</FONT></HTML>
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<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">A long time ago I had to decide on just one, I had all kinds of plain and <BR>
I have several friends that agree with that idea, John, but those with the most toys, wins doncha know. The one gun idea DOES have merit. I did that for a few years & got to know that rifle intimately. No matter what range, I would swear I was holding dead on. I KNOW on a 200 yd shot it HAS to be held high, but at that time the hold over had become automatic and "mind's eye" saw it as dead on.<BR>
<BR>
For hunting, I carry an old Dixie poor boy I've rebarreled to .54 & relocked (L&R "drop in") to flint. For trail walks & target I have 2 customs. 1st is a little 1/2 stock .45 by Ralph Goodman that's convertible flint & percussion though it normally wears the flint version of the two Silers. 2nd is a reproduction of Fredric Sell's Pegasus by Steve Lodding in .50 cal -- 'course, it's a flinter too. My smoothie is one of those fairly popular amongst this bunch -- North Star West's trade gun in .62. Never could get the hang of flints on the short guns, so I fudge with my pistols & use those new fangled copper thingys. Just got a really new modern gun -- 1st model Dragoon -- 3rd generation Colt. While it's real purty to look at, haven't had time to figure out what kind of a diet it wants, so can't hit $hi+ with it yet. May never get it to shoot straight, but that's OK, it ain't for serious shootin' anyhow. Got 4 single shot pistols (all .45 cal) that shoot just fine. Of that 4, 1 is a Traditions, the rest are customs. One from Ralph Goodman is also convertable. I built one for my wife, but she's given up shooting. The 3rd is a Steve Lodding, also built for my wife. Since she doesn't use 'em anymore, I use hers now & then just to keep 'em warmed up in case she decides to come out of "retirement". Her rifle is so short (12 1/4" pull) I can't shoot the dang thing unless I try using it for another pistol! It's a Pedersoli I rebarreled & shortened for her. <BR>
I own and shoot all kinds of guns. I have hunted with all of them. Caplocks, flintlocks, In modern guns I prefer a browning model 78 single shot based on the old hi-wall winchester. I own one chambered for the 7mm rem. mag. Great gun. My flint is a rifle I built myself: 42" swamped Getz barrel .54 cal. with curly maple stock and brass furniture, siler lock. Great rifle. But all my guns are left-handed. I have built 26 long rifles over the last 30 years. Some cap some flint. I 'm also prejudiced about some rifles. I don't like factory made rifles from Spain. The main springs are usually too weak. The Italia flint guns don't spark too well. I spent a lot of time in the late 70s early 80s re-facing frizzens and changin out main springs for guys who wouldn't buy custom rifles. To each his own. The rifle I'm just finishing is for Davy Crockett. At least the new Davy Crockett in the new film coming out next year. It is a Jacob Dickert style with a nice L&R lock. It sparks like a raped ape. has to, Davy can't have a mis-fire in front of millions of people. He might get killed. Merry Christmas to all.
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<P>
<P> I own and shoot all kinds of guns. I have hunted with all of them. Caplocks, flintlocks, In modern guns I prefer a browning model 78 single shot based on the old hi-wall winchester. I own one chambered for the 7mm rem. mag. Great gun. My flint is a rifle I built myself: 42" swamped Getz barrel .54 cal. with curly maple stock and brass furniture, siler lock. Great rifle. But all my guns are left-handed. I have built 26 long rifles over the last 30 years. Some cap some flint. I 'm also prejudiced about some rifles. I don't like factory made rifles from Spain. The main springs are usually too weak. The Italia flint guns don't spark too well. I spent a lot of time in the late 70s early 80s re-facing frizzens and changin out main springs for guys who wouldn't buy custom rifles. To each his own. The rifle I'm just finishing is for Davy Crockett. At least the new Davy Crockett in the new film coming out next year. It is a Jacob Dickert style with a nice L&R lock. It sparks like a raped ape. has to, Davy can't have a mis-fire in front of millions of people. He might get killed. Merry Christmas to all. </P><p><br><hr size=1>Do you Yahoo!?<br>
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In a message dated 12/18/2002 11:24:04 PM Pacific Standard Time,
rjbublitz@earthlink.net writes:
> (PS...don't tell anyone but I have a couple of cartridge guns too....modern
> stuff.... 1894 winchester and a single action revolver)... Yfab, Randy
A BUTT-STUFFER!!!!!!!...... Randy, I'm shocked!
<G>
Magpie
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">In a message dated 12/18/2002 11:24:04 PM Pacific Standard Time, rjbublitz@earthlink.net writes:<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">(PS...don't tell anyone but I have a couple of cartridge guns too....modern stuff.... 1894 winchester and a single action revolver)... Yfab, Randy</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><BR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sheeesh...didn't I say ..."don't tell anyone..." <g> my reputatation is ruint..... oh well...won't be the first time. Magpie, I figured when the rag heads rebel, I'd beter have something that shoots quicker than my Trade Gun..... Randy (who is slowly aproaching the 19 century)</FONT></DIV>
Thought I'd get in on the discussion. I shoot a T/C renegade in .50, which I have de-modernized, and now shoots and looks good. Also have a .50 Kentucky pistol that also shoots good. On the percussion/flint survey, I would like to go to flint, but being left-handed and of limited funds, the percussion works well for me. Don't want all that fire going off in my face! Maybeso later I can sell a few more plews and get me a lefty flint.
<DIV><FONT size=2><FONT face=Arial size=2>Brothers, We were warned, first guns...then...? Check this out <s> <A href="http://www.banscrewdrivers.com/">http://www.banscrewdrivers.com/</A> Our freedoms are at risk (only half kidding) Randy</DIV>
If you still have some of last year's crop save IT for seed. The "Indian"
corns are straight breeds & will seed themselves, unlike modern hybred corns.
The modern hybreds are like mules.
Nauga Mok
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=1 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">If you still have some of last year's crop save IT for seed. The "Indian" corns are straight breeds & will seed themselves, unlike modern hybred corns. The modern hybreds are like mules.<BR>
It sounds like Clark done pretty good on the presents, but I think I'll pass
on the dinner didn't sound like it was up to much.
Beaverboy the verity of corn we had was the sweet dent corn. (orange in
color) This year we had two late frost that laid the garden flat so we did
not get a crop this year. If ya need seeds we got the corn seeds from the
museum of the fur trade.
To all on the list may you all have a Marry Christmas!
No matter the fare or the gifts it may bring
It's the spirit of giving that makes this thing.
So this the gift that give to you.
It's the gift of friendship, warm thoughts and good cheer.
If we could only make it last through out the New Year. (G)
Marry Christmas to all and to all a good night.
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>It sounds like Clark done pretty good on the presents, but I think I'll pass on the dinner didn't sound like it was up to much.
<BR>
<BR>Beaverboy the verity of corn we had was the sweet dent corn. (orange in color) This year we had two late frost that laid the garden flat so we did not get a crop this year. If ya need seeds we got the corn seeds from the museum of the fur trade.
<BR>
<BR>To all on the list may you all have a Marry Christmas!
<BR>No matter the fare or the gifts it may bring
<BR>It's the spirit of giving that makes this thing.
<BR>So this the gift that give to you.
<BR>It's the gift of friendship, warm thoughts and good cheer.
<BR>If we could only make it last through out the New Year. (G)
<BR>Marry Christmas to all and to all a good night.
<BR>Crazy Cyot </FONT></HTML>
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Beaverboy, we do have seeds that we can share. Nuetta[Mandan] sweet corn,
Omaha pumpkin, Mandan squash, Hidatsa beans, Hidatsa sunflower and Hopi black
dye sunflower. Maybe after this year we will have enough of the other types
of corn to share. Crazy
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>Beaverboy, we do have seeds that we can share. Nuetta[Mandan] sweet corn, Omaha pumpkin, Mandan squash, Hidatsa beans, Hidatsa sunflower and Hopi black dye sunflower. Maybe after this year we will have enough of the other types of corn to share. Crazy</FONT></HTML>
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The other letter writer is correct, you have what we commonly call carcass beetles. The feed on dead things. nature takes care of death in such a way so the world is not littered with dead carcasses from all those centuries. We have them. They like to eat my wife's rawhide. They will do a number on feathers and fur. Use borax, sealed boxes, mothballs, what ever you can. Good luck. We still occasionally find a few and we have been fighting it for over 15 years. Right when we think we have killed them all why a couple will show up in the oddest of places in our house.
ThisOldFox@aol.com wrote:>I've come back from college for semester break to find some
>short, brown oval bugs that look like larvae of some kind crawling in a few
>pieces of fur.
Mat,
While you have an immediate problem, you will also have a future problem this
probably will be worse. Sometime this spring, your house will be filled with
tiny little moths which will search out suitable materials to replicate the
process over again. I ended up getting rid of all my hide and horn material
and fumigating. Luckily it was confined to my garage, but some of the
critters did get into the house and re-appeared again for several years
before they were totally gone. I had some skullcaps with the antlers and
some fur still attached, so it was localized.
I believe that taxidermists rub borax into their mounts for this purpose.
Dave Kanger
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<P>Matt:
<P>The other letter writer is correct, you have what we commonly call carcass beetles. The feed on dead things. nature takes care of death in such a way so the world is not littered with dead carcasses from all those centuries. We have them. They like to eat my wife's rawhide. They will do a number on feathers and fur. Use borax, sealed boxes, mothballs, what ever you can. Good luck. We still occasionally find a few and we have been fighting it for over 15 years. Right when we think we have killed them all why a couple will show up in the oddest of places in our house.
<P> <B><I>ThisOldFox@aol.com</I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">>I've come back from college for semester break to find some <BR>>short, brown oval bugs that look like larvae of some kind crawling in a few <BR>>pieces of fur.<BR><BR>Mat,<BR><BR>While you have an immediate problem, you will also have a future problem this <BR>probably will be worse. Sometime this spring, your house will be filled with <BR>tiny little moths which will search out suitable materials to replicate the <BR>process over again. I ended up getting rid of all my hide and horn material <BR>and fumigating. Luckily it was confined to my garage, but some of the <BR>critters did get into the house and re-appeared again for several years <BR>before they were totally gone. I had some skullcaps with the antlers and <BR>some fur still attached, so it was localized.<BR><BR>I believe that taxidermists rub borax into their mounts for this purpose.<BR><BR>Dave Kanger<BR><BR>----------------------<BR>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</BLOCKQUOTE><p><br><hr size=1>Do you Yahoo!?<br>
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