<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">Ya forgot to mention they kick harder and aim better then horses and have a
<html><P>You boys that are gettin' kicked by them mules, just havn't learned to talk to them right!</P>
<P>I belive that Dick Patton wrote in his B.O.B article, that half of the non-indian equines in the mountains were mules. Even the indians were using mules early on.</P>
<P> </P>
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<html><P>I see that there is no reasoning with you mule haters....<G> Etienne Provost rode a mule, could have been his excessive weight, or maybe a good amount of mountain savy. Osborne Russell mentions mounting his "favorite mule." I aint saying their better, just that a good one is hard to beat. I own three, that I have been using regular for a long while, and I ain't been kicked nor thrown, by any of them. I figure things were much the same, then as now. If I was gonna buy a whole damn outfit of mules to pack trade plunder to the rockies, I would be taking what I could get. When you buy a remuda, you get some good and some bad. Good mules don't come cheap, most folks get that kicker, when they buy that bargain mule. Most folks want to ride a mule like a horse, and it just won't work. Treat a mule like your partner, instead of dominating him, and he'll treat you well. Now sure as the world, when I feed in the morning, I'll get kicked square in the head and die, and ya'll can say "I told you so."</P>
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<P>My mules and I thank you for them kind words!! Come up and ride with us this fall...</P>
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In a message dated 6/5/01 2:23:00 AM !!!First Boot!!!, HikingOnThru@cs.com
writes:
> Also, they are pretty good at keeping the coyotes out of the
> goats, sheep and calves.
One more reason for me not to like them.
To tell the truth this child ain't had much to do with them critters never
had the need nor the want for one. There voices are to much like finger nails
on a chock board for me to want to spend much time around one.
My ponies have served me well and I haven't had one of them run me through a
fence yet. Cores I know when it's time to get off too. If a horse spooks to
much its time to make meat. Spooky Horses and mountains don't go to gather.
Cliff
I'm sure mules are like horses there are bad ones and there are some good
ones.
Keep the good ones and make meat out of the bad ones is what I say.
See ya on the trail
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated 6/5/01 2:23:00 AM !!!First Boot!!!, HikingOnThru@cs.com
<BR>writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Also, they are pretty good at keeping the coyotes out of the
<BR>goats, sheep and calves. </FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<html><DIV></DIV>>I'm sure mules are like horses there are bad ones and there are some good
<DIV></DIV>>ones.
<DIV></DIV>>Keep the good ones and make meat out of the bad ones is what I say.
<DIV></DIV>>See ya on the trail
<DIV></DIV>>Crazy Cyot
<DIV>Crazy,</DIV>
<DIV>I couldn't agree with you more!! See you in Idaho.</DIV>
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> Capt. Lahti' and Tom are talk about is the one I use and for
> the money can't be beat. I have two of them one I have left the short
> handle on for horse trips when not using a pack horse. (it ties behind the
> saddle nicely) the other I have put a longer T handle on. (for packing and
> real digging)
The ones from Arrow Forge are not as good from what I've seen of them. They
have a tendency to bend at the blade. One of the members of our party had one
and while digging Camas it dam near folded over on him. He has since replaced
it with one of the Swiss Army Shovels. For a lot less money and they look
just as good.
my two cents.
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>The Shovel that <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Capt. Lahti' and Tom are talk about is the one I use and for
<BR>the money can't be beat. I have two of them one I have left the short
<BR>handle on for horse trips when not using a pack horse. (it ties behind the
<BR>saddle nicely) the other I have put a longer T handle on. (for packing and
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">The ones from Arrow Forge are not as good from what I've seen of them. They
<BR>have a tendency to bend at the blade. One of the members of our party had one
<BR>and while digging Camas it dam near folded over on him. He has since replaced
<BR>it with one of the Swiss Army Shovels. For a lot less money and they look
> I have a fry pan you could dig a pretty good cache with. A digging stick
> would do. A large knife could suffice.
I can tell it has been a while since you have done much digging John.
We are talking about a hole two feet in diameter carried down to a depth of
three feet, when it is gradually enlarged, and depend until it becomes
sufficiently capacious to contain whatever is destined to be stored in it.
This is how Ferris describes how a Cache was made.
This hole at a minimum would be six feet deep. From the lists of things that
were put in some of these Caches they were much deeper then that.
All done with a fry pan and not written about??
Done with a digging stick? I've dug Camas with a digging stick and was amazed
that the Indian woman were able to do so and feed their families and put
enough away for later use. But a hole this size in rocky ground and not
written about, No way.
Using a knife is totally out of the question. You would not abuse your knife
like that it would last you very long at all.
From what I've read a cache was made in a day or less time. Done with a fry
pan or digging stick or knife I think not.
All I can say is those six shovels sure did see a lot of use over that twenty
years. From all the caches that were dug during that time.
Larry
No I haven't seen one of Dave Conte's shovels. If your coming to Nationals
bring it along and we'll put it to use digging Camas.
See ya down the Trail
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>
<BR>John you said
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I have a fry pan you could dig a pretty good cache with. A digging stick
<BR>would do. A large knife could suffice.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR>well said I would add a few more uses for the shovel while out in the back
<BR>country.
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>I</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"> always dig a fire pit to help cut down on those unwanted fires and so when
<BR>I leave I can bury my fire pit. Camping without a trace, proper camping
<BR>skills for back country. That bring up another use to bury your business out
<BR>in the bushes with. Nothing is more disgusting to come across when your not
<BR>looking were you are stepping.
<BR>I'm sure the boys back then did not think about or care about these things.
<BR>But we live in the here and now and if you don't practice good camping
<BR>skills. Your just another one of those flat landers that has no business out
<BR>in the woods in my book.
<BR>I'm not saying this to you Mike cause I'm know you practice good camping
<BR>skills. This for those that haven't a clue what camping without a trace is.
<BR>You should all camp as though the Blackfeet are on your trail and you want to
<BR>leave as little sign as possible of your passing.
<BR>Another use for my shovel is when I'm out I am always keep an eye out for
<BR>eatable roots to add to my fair. Like I said before a digging stick just
<BR>don't cut it for me.
<BR>One more thing when having a fire in the forest it is the law you should have
<BR>a shovel and water container handy. So to tell you the truth John I hope
<BR>there is at one shovel in every camp weather it documented or not.
Subject: MtMan-List: The four wild herds of Spanish Barb.
Date: 10 Jun 2001 13:39:30 EDT
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Thought some of you might want to read up on the few wild herds that are
left, that have strong Spanish Barb blood lines.
NORTH AMERICAN COLONIAL SPANISH HORSE, Foundation Strains of the Present Breed
by D. Phillip Sponenberg, DVM, Ph
Feral Strains Some of the purely Spanish horses remained in isolated feral
herds. Such pure horses became rare fairly early in this century due to the
practice of shooting the Spanish stallions and replacing them with draft or
blooded stallions in an attempt to "improve" or "breed up" the feral herds as
sources of draft or remount stock. Bob Brislawn, founder of the Spanish
Mustang Registry in 1957, used many feral horses in his herd. Several of his
foundation horses were obtained from Utah, although isolated horses from
other herds contributed as well. The Brislawn horses contributed widely to
the present breed. Most of the feral herds that served as the original source
for the Spanish Mustang Registry were subsequently contaminated with other
breeds of horses, and are therefore no longer purely Spanish. The horses
within the SMR represent the only contribution that those once pure herds can
now make to the breeding of the Colonial Spanish Horse.
A later and major source of feral Spanish Colonial type horses were the herds
in the Bookcliffs of Utah. These horses also figure prominently in the
Brislawn as well as some other herds. In some herds these are still present
as a unique strain. In other remote parts of Utah there are still some
Spanish type wild horses.
One such area is the Sulphur herd management area in Southwest Utah. Many of
the horses from the northern end of this management area have very Spanish
type. The usual colors in these herds are dun, grullo, red dun, bay, black
and a few chestnuts. These horses show remarkable adaptation to their harsh
environment. These horses are currently attracting attention, as well as
dedicated breeders such as Ron Roubidoux and Darcey Duce. A group of these
horses was accepted into the SMR in 1994.
Feral horses of the Cerbat Mountains in Arizona contributed to the Colonial
Spanish Horse of today. The original group captured from this area was caught
by Ira Wakefield, who was a very accomplished mustanger. The Cerbat herds
have a known history of purity on their present range since 1862. While Ira
kept horses from a variety of sources throughout his long life the Cerbat
horses are the only ones of his that made an impact on the present Colonial
Spanish Horse. Today the Cerbat horses from the original capture have been
supplemented by more recent Bureau of Land Management captures from the same
ranges. The newer horses are identical in type to the older ones, giving
added credence to the history of isolation and purity. The Cerbat strain is
used by a variety of breeders of Colonial Spanish Horses, and is also kept as
a distinct strain by Marye Ann and Tom Thompson. The horses come from a very
restricted range, and are very uniformly conformed. They also have some
unique blood types, which is another indication of their value for
conservation. The feral Cerbat herds are still pure, and are being managed by
the Bureau of Land Management to remain pure within themselves. These feral
herds will hopefully continue to be a source of this unique genetic type
along with animals of the same strain being raised domestically. The Cerbat
horses are a classic old Spanish type and are roan, bay, or chestnut.
The feral horses from the Kiger region in Oregon are usually included in
discussions of Colonial Spanish Horses. These are feral horses that are
selected to be dun, grullo, or red dun. These are managed both in the feral
herds and in herds of private breeders. The excess horses from the range
herds are periodically rounded up and sold to interested buyers. The
conformation of horses in the herds is currently somewhat variable. Some are
still of Spanish type, but others are smoother and taller than the usual
Spanish type of conservation interest. Regardless of whether this
conformation is the result of crossbreeding in the past, or due to selection
from a Spanish base, it is less useful to Spanish horse conservation than is
the more distinctly Spanish type which also exists in the herds.
The Pryor Mountain mustangs range on high terrain between Wyoming and
Montana. Most of these horses have Spanish conformation, and the blood types
of the horses are also those expected of horses with Spanish ancestry. These
horses are found along a major Crow and Shoshone migration route, and they
probably have an origin in tribal horses. They are an interesting group since
colors include bay, black, roan, chestnut, dun, grullo, roans, and a few
buckskins and minimally expressed calico paints. This array of colors,
especially the relatively high proportion of black and black based colors, is
also consistent with a Spanish origin. The Pryor Mountain mustangs are an
important resource for Spanish Horse conservation in North America. The Pryor
Mountain mustangs are fortunate in inhabiting the first wild horse refuge
that is specifically set up to conserve mustangs. That they are Spanish is an
added bonus, and private individuals are now becoming interested in
conserving this type. The BLM has also recently been acknowledging the
uniqueness of this herd and is working to preserve the Spanish type on this
range. This herd is one of the most accessible feral horse herds, and seeing
these horses in their home environment is well worth the trip to this range.
Other feral horses that are included in the foundation horses of the
registries are usually individual horses with the correct Spanish appearance
rather than an entire group of horses such as the Cerbats or the Holbrook
group. These individual horses came from North Dakota, California, Utah,
Nevada, Arizona, and New Mexico. None of these represent a line of breeding
in the same way that the Holbrook/Brislawn horses or the
Wakefield/Thompson/Cerbat horses do since none have been bred within the
original group. They do, however, contribute importantly to the overall mix
of feral contribution to the Colonial Spanish Horses. Most feral herds
remaining today are crossbred with non-Spanish horses. Recent success,
especially with the Pryor, Cerbat, Sulphur, and Kiger horses, has stimulated
some investigation into the feral herds that are controlled by the Bureau of
Land Management for other herds of Spanish type. If other herds of the
correct type are found then the history of the feral horses in the area will
be considered, along with blood typing information, in order to determine if
any of these herds should be added to the list of Spanish type herds. These
can then be managed to guard against incursion of non-Spanish horses. Such a
program has several advantages. It keeps the feral Colonial Spanish horse in
the original environment so that selection pressures keep working to produce
environmentally resistant horses. The BLM also finds it easier to adopt out
this type of horse rather than the usual crossbred type. If any other feral
Spanish herds remain besides these four, they are probably very, very rare.
See ya on the trail
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#007d7d" SIZE=2>Thought some of you might want to read up on the few wild herds that are
<BR>left, that have strong Spanish Barb blood lines.
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#af0027" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><B>NORTH AMERICAN COLONIAL SPANISH HORSE, Foundation Strains of the Present Breed
<BR><B>Feral Strains</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></B> </FONT><FONT COLOR="#007d7d" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">Some of the purely Spanish horses remained in isolated feral
<BR>herds. Such pure horses became rare fairly early in this century due to the
<BR>practice of shooting the Spanish stallions and replacing them with draft or
<BR>blooded stallions in an attempt to "improve" or "breed up" the feral herds as
<BR>sources of draft or remount stock. Bob Brislawn, founder of the Spanish
<BR>Mustang Registry in 1957, used many feral horses in his herd. Several of his
<BR>foundation horses were obtained from Utah, although isolated horses from
<BR>other herds contributed as well. The Brislawn horses contributed widely to
<BR>the present breed. Most of the feral herds that served as the original source
<BR>for the Spanish Mustang Registry were subsequently contaminated with other
<BR>breeds of horses, and are therefore no longer purely Spanish. The horses
<BR>within the SMR represent the only contribution that those once pure herds can
<BR>now make to the breeding of the Colonial Spanish Horse.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#007d7d" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">A later and major source of feral Spanish Colonial type horses were the herds
<BR>in the Bookcliffs of Utah. These horses also figure prominently in the
<BR>Brislawn as well as some other herds. In some herds these are still present
<BR>as a unique strain. In other remote parts of Utah there are still some
<BR>Spanish type wild horses.
<BR> One such area is the Sulphur herd management area in Southwest Utah. Many of
<BR>the horses from the northern end of this management area have very Spanish
<BR>type. The usual colors in these herds are dun, grullo, red dun, bay, black
<BR>and a few chestnuts. These horses show remarkable adaptation to their harsh
<BR>environment. These horses are currently attracting attention, as well as
<BR>dedicated breeders such as Ron Roubidoux and Darcey Duce. A group of these
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#007d7d" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">Feral horses of the Cerbat Mountains in Arizona contributed to the Colonial
<BR>Spanish Horse of today. The original group captured from this area was caught
<BR>by Ira Wakefield, who was a very accomplished mustanger. The Cerbat herds
<BR>have a known history of purity on their present range since 1862. While Ira
<BR>kept horses from a variety of sources throughout his long life the Cerbat
<BR>horses are the only ones of his that made an impact on the present Colonial
<BR>Spanish Horse. Today the Cerbat horses from the original capture have been
<BR>supplemented by more recent Bureau of Land Management captures from the same
<BR>ranges. The newer horses are identical in type to the older ones, giving
<BR>added credence to the history of isolation and purity. The Cerbat strain is
<BR>used by a variety of breeders of Colonial Spanish Horses, and is also kept as
<BR>a distinct strain by Marye Ann and Tom Thompson. The horses come from a very
<BR>restricted range, and are very uniformly conformed. They also have some
<BR>unique blood types, which is another indication of their value for
<BR>conservation. The feral Cerbat herds are still pure, and are being managed by
<BR>the Bureau of Land Management to remain pure within themselves. These feral
<BR>herds will hopefully continue to be a source of this unique genetic type
<BR>along with animals of the same strain being raised domestically. The Cerbat
<BR>horses are a classic old Spanish type and are roan, bay, or chestnut.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#007d7d" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">The feral horses from the Kiger region in Oregon are usually included in
<BR>discussions of Colonial Spanish Horses. These are feral horses that are
<BR>selected to be dun, grullo, or red dun. These are managed both in the feral
<BR>herds and in herds of private breeders. The excess horses from the range
<BR>herds are periodically rounded up and sold to interested buyers. The
<BR>conformation of horses in the herds is currently somewhat variable. Some are
<BR>still of Spanish type, but others are smoother and taller than the usual
<BR>Spanish type of conservation interest. Regardless of whether this
<BR>conformation is the result of crossbreeding in the past, or due to selection
<BR>from a Spanish base, it is less useful to Spanish horse conservation than is
<BR>the more distinctly Spanish type which also exists in the herds.
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#007d7d" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">The Pryor Mountain mustangs range on high terrain between Wyoming and
<BR>Montana. Most of these horses have Spanish conformation, and the blood types
<BR>of the horses are also those expected of horses with Spanish ancestry. These
<BR>horses are found along a major Crow and Shoshone migration route, and they
<BR>probably have an origin in tribal horses. They are an interesting group since
<BR>colors include bay, black, roan, chestnut, dun, grullo, roans, and a few
<BR>buckskins and minimally expressed calico paints. This array of colors,
<BR>especially the relatively high proportion of black and black based colors, is
<BR>also consistent with a Spanish origin. The Pryor Mountain mustangs are an
<BR>important resource for Spanish Horse conservation in North America. The Pryor
<BR>Mountain mustangs are fortunate in inhabiting the first wild horse refuge
<BR>that is specifically set up to conserve mustangs. That they are Spanish is an
<BR>added bonus, and private individuals are now becoming interested in
<BR>conserving this type. The BLM has also recently been acknowledging the
<BR>uniqueness of this herd and is working to preserve the Spanish type on this
<BR>range. This herd is one of the most accessible feral horse herds, and seeing
<BR>these horses in their home environment is well worth the trip to this range.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"> </FONT><FONT COLOR="#007d7d" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>Other feral horses that are included in the foundation horses of the
<BR>registries are usually individual horses with the correct Spanish appearance
<BR>rather than an entire group of horses such as the Cerbats or the Holbrook
<BR>group. These individual horses came from North Dakota, California, Utah,
<BR>Nevada, Arizona, and New Mexico. None of these represent a line of breeding
<BR>in the same way that the Holbrook/Brislawn horses or the
<BR>Wakefield/Thompson/Cerbat horses do since none have been bred within the
<BR>original group. They do, however, contribute importantly to the overall mix
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=5 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><B>are giving to the land fund a pre 1840 horse pack trip, on August 8th for
<BR>five days, 2001. All proceeds will be given ta the AMM. Bidding will start at
<BR>$1000.00. Any Questions send me some E-smoke..........Richard Ashburn </FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></B>
<BR></FONT></HTML>
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Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Five Day 1840 Horse Ride in the Rocks up for Auction
Date: 10 Jun 2001 23:45:57 EDT
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I for got to tell ya the Hyper link is to he's web page so you can see some
of the Country he will be takin ya through. Waugh!<A HREF="http://home.earthlink.net/~elkantlerltd">
http://home.earthlink.net/~elkantlerltd</A>
Crazy Cyot
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>I for got to tell ya the Hyper link is to he's web page so you can see some
<BR>of the Country he will be takin ya through. Waugh!</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000ff" SIZE=5 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><B><A HREF="http://home.earthlink.net/~elkantlerltd">
Subject: MtMan-List: Mules north of the yellowstone.
Date: 12 Jun 2001 01:19:26
<html><DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>Clark wrote</DIV>
<DIV>"...one man met me with a mule and spanish saddle to ride, I gave him a westcoat a mule is considered of great value among these people..." August 19th 1805</DIV>
<DIV>I belive this would be a tad north of the yellowstone, and some what early.</DIV>
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Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Mules north of the yellowstone.
Date: 12 Jun 2001 23:43:10
<html><DIV>Walt,</DIV>
<DIV> I think Crazy provided the information for the source of the reference, if I can be of other assistance please let me know.</DIV>
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Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Mules north of the yellowstone.
Date: 12 Jun 2001 23:51:00
<html><DIV>Crazy,</DIV>
<DIV>It was such a fine mule, he was rentin' instead of sellin'. Charged Clark a fine westcoat just to ride it. Must of been one fine animal.....</DIV>
<DIV> I would give a jaw tooth for a look at that saddle. Oh well.</DIV>
<DIV>Sure wish I was bringing my mules to Idaho, I would camp right next to you. BG</DIV>
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Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Mules north of the yellowstone.
Date: 14 Jun 2001 01:46:30
<html><DIV>Walt,</DIV>
<DIV>I won't argue the location of Clark to the Yellowstone, I just might be wrong. I hope you enjoy your trip to Ft. Union, and enjoy finding out that Charles Larpenteur rode a mule named Simon.</DIV>
<DIV>Crazy,</DIV>
<DIV> I believe mule meat would be to rich for ya', and you would kill over from the squattin' trots....<BG></DIV>
<DIV>Cliff</DIV><br clear=all><hr>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at <a href="http://explorer.msn.com">http://explorer.msn.com</a><br></p></html>
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hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
Subject: MtMan-List: URGENT -- Fort St. Vrain endangered - HELP!!
Date: 18 Jun 2001 13:30:34 EDT
With Marcellin St. Vrain's descendents, I was just in Plattesville, CO where nasty plans are afoot to turn the property immediately adjacent to Fort St Vrain into one big gravel mine. The Fort St. Vrain site is on the Colorado Historic Register, but a full scale archaeological investigation has never been adequately done. We suspect there are graves onsite, not to mention numerous artifacts which can enlighten us all on the busy fur trade days. We would also like to investigate Chief Friday's claim that there was a massacre en site.
The Weld County Commission is meeting soon to decide on whether to allow S&H Gravel to strip the adjacent lot, which is not only a historical haven, but populated by bald eagles, mountain lions, etc.
The majority of Platteville residents are opposed to destroying the ecology of the site -- however the big money may rule the day. IF anyone out there can call or write the Weld County commission to sway them, it would be much appreciated.
I will post the pertinent addresses tomorrow as soon as I return from Platteville..
Also, the St. Vrain descendents are joining in the Rendezvous at Bent's Fort at the end of July...come on out! :) AJC Westwood
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hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
<DIV>Hi Lanney, etc...., I'm just about ready to roll to Montana. A bunch of us are canoeing the White Cliffs area of the Missouri next week. Afterwords, most of us are heading for National. See you there. Hardtack</DIV>
In a message dated 6/25/01 9:38:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time, cd252@ptd.net
writes:
> ... are there any "primitive" events here in the East? I live
> in Northeastern Pennsylvania.
>
> Regards to all,
> Big Dave
>
>
That all depends on how far you are willing to drive for your fun. We just
got back from a gathering of 1100 French and Indian War re-enactors up at Ft.
Ticondaroga and that was a 6.5 hour drive for us but well worth it. The
battles on Saturday and Sunday were great. So if you are willing to drive a
little you could be at a pre 1840 event of some type almost every weekend.
You really should subscribe to Smoke & Fire News for a comprehensive listing
of events, only $18 for 12 issues, send to PO Box 166, Grand Rapids, Oh
43522.
July 27-29 there is a Black Powder Shoot with Primative camp (and a modern
area) at the Land of the Senecas just east of Watkins Glen NY.
Aug 16-19th there is a Black Powder Shoot with Privative camp (and a modern
area) at Whispering Pines which if memory serves is off of Route 15 by Arnot
PA (N.E. Penn).
Sept 8-15th, is the 6th Great North American Rendezvous, Ft. Loundon State
Park (S.E. Penn), http//www.geocites.com/gnarnra/index.html
Or phone Sam Mumma at 302-674-0977, E-mail scmummavi@juno.com
500 or so participants.
Sept 21-30 is the NMLRA Eastern Primative Rendezvous in Doddridge County WV.
Just south of Pittsburg. Largest rendezvous in North America with over 3,500
attending. Write for info to NRLHF, PO Box 100, Auburn, WV 26326
You should also plan on attending the Market Fair at Ft. Frederick Maryland
next spring. Anything you need for your persona can be purchased at that
event. It is held the last weekend of April and my wife and I will not miss
it.
See you around the campfire.
Y.M.O.S.
C.T. Oakes
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated 6/25/01 9:38:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time, cd252@ptd.net
<BR>writes:
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">... are there any "primitive" events here in the East? I live
