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hats-digest           Monday, July 31 2000           Volume 02 : Number 207




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 17:37:19 -0500
From: Christopher Gegax <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) Re: MWH / Devo / Etc.

I enjoy Torch Song as well. I was originally turned on to William Orbit by a record
store employee in the early 90's. The kid was like, "check this out," and plays
"Water from a vine leaf" from Strange Cargo Vol. 3. That's all I needed. I bought the
CD.

Then I went on a tear, trying to find his other releases. I asked around at record
stores and came across the CD "Set The Controls For The Heart Of The Bass" in the
used bin. That's the album he did under the alias Bassomatic.

Checking his discography, I discovered his other alias: Torch Song. I've been
scooping up everything he's done since. Never thought I'd buy a Madonna album! Most
recently I picked up William Orbit, "Pieces in a modern style."

He has a terrific web-site. The URL is: http://www.williamorbit.com

[e-mail] wrote:

> I don't know if it was DDA but there was an LP a friend of mine had back
> in 1988 which was copyright 1984 that had stunning clarity such as that
> which blew me away as well... Torch Song featuring William Orbit, "Exhibit A".
> I think that's the right title anyway.  There were two Torch Song LPs he had
> and that's the only one the title of which I can remember right now.



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 17:39:55 -0500
From: Christopher Gegax <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) Re: MWH / Devo / Etc.

I enjoy Torch Song as well. I was originally turned on to William Orbit
by a record
store employee in the early 90's. The kid was like, "check this out,"
and plays
"Water from a vine leaf" from Strange Cargo Vol. 3. That's all I needed.
I bought the
CD.

Then I went on a tear, trying to find his other releases. I asked around
at record
stores and came across the CD "Set The Controls For The Heart Of The
Bass" in the
used bin. That's the album he did under the alias Bassomatic.

Checking his discography, I discovered his other alias: Torch Song. I've
been
scooping up everything he's done since. Never thought I'd buy a Madonna
album! Most
recently I picked up William Orbit, "Pieces in a modern style."

He has a terrific web-site. The URL is: http://www.williamorbit.com

[e-mail] wrote:

> I don't know if it was DDA but there was an LP a friend of mine had
back
> in 1988 which was copyright 1984 that had stunning clarity such as
that
> which blew me away as well... Torch Song featuring William Orbit,
"Exhibit A".
> I think that's the right title anyway.  There were two Torch Song LPs
he had
> and that's the only one the title of which I can remember right now.





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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 18:56:51 -0500
From: "Matt McCarthy" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) Covers, hats site, Tshirts.

The Men Without Hats site has some interesting info up, about the new
release AND the bootleg materials.

'Short term' is a teasing phrasology isn't it?

I am really looking forward to the new release.
Go here        http://menwithouthats.com/mwhnews.html   , see, and let them
know your opinion.

 I would also like to take this moment to applaud the covers that have been
created thus far. I like them all and thank you    -Steven Enz-   -707
Heaven, B.H.-     -Daffus X-     -Flat Stanley-      -Tony Reed-
I am pleased to have them all. They are wonderful tributes to my favorite
band. Also a thanks to Richard for the location I got them from.

 I look forward to the new Tshirts. BUT I am still EXTREMELY interested in
getting the ones that someone may still have. [   nudge nudge nudge  :^)   ]

You gotta walk before you crawl
Remember everybody's selling something
MMM



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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 01:33:47 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: (hats) hats off

i feel there are a lot of bands out there who have many fans and can release
cd after cd until they're dead and they'll still profit from each one.

but how many long time defunct relatively unknown canadian 80's groups do you
know who can release a CD 13 years after they last reached the Top 20? I find
it satisfying to know people still like their music and have stuck by them.
That must mean a lot to the Doroschuks i would think.

collin


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 01:38:26 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: (hats) article similarity

I was reading the February 1999 issue of Discoveries, a Canadian based music
magazine/newspaper which featured an article about men without hats...

In it, they discuss former members of the band. When getting to Jeremie
Arrobas, they mention he was in a band named "Isinglass"

I read that as "I SING LAST" . Do you think either Ivan brought jeremie's
band name into the song in rememberance of him or do you think arrobas used
the name of the group from the Hats song?   Chicken or Egg?

Or neither...i may just be wiggin'---

collin


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 01:39:47 EDT
From: [e-mail]
Subject: (hats) guitarist dead?

I remember when the internet first came out in '93 i went online to look for
info about the Hats b/c i wanted to see a picture of Ivan to put a face to
the voice. I remember reading something about the guitarist dying and that's
why they broke up. Now, i know that's not why they broke up...but what
guitarist was this??

Collin


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 08:59:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Heidi <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (hats) guitarist dead?

  From: [e-mail]
  I remember when the internet first came out in '93 i went online to
  look for info about the Hats b/c i wanted to see a picture of Ivan
  to put a face to the voice.

Internet in `93? I take it that's a typo since it was around Long
before that. Or do you just mean the web?

  I remember reading something about the guitarist dying and that's
  why they broke up. Now, i know that's not why they broke up...but what
  guitarist was this??

I didn't pay much attention to the last few albums but did they have
a guitarist other then Stephen? I know Allan McCarthy died a few years
ago, long after he left the band. (For the newer folks on the list if
you didn't know he had been on the list for awhile.) I remember the
last album I heard had more guitar then the others but I had just
figured it was still one guitarist. (I didn't keep the album long enough
to check the musicians) Does anyone remember how big the live band was
for the PGTW tour? I know there were a bunch of people on stage but
Ivan and Stephen are the only ones I remember at this point.

=}{=



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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:42:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Lord Hasenpfeffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) PGTW Tour Band

> Does anyone remember how big the live band was for the PGTW tour?

Yes.

> I know there were a bunch of people on stage but Ivan and Stephen are the only ones I remember at this point.

You'll have to pardon the fact that the thumbnails aren't coming in correctly right now as I've
been rearranging my site's directory structures lately, however, the regular images are working
just fine, so...

http://www.ymphony.com/ymphony/artists/mwh_01_fs.html

Myke


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 00 19:23:19 +0000
From: mike <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (hats) Covers, hats site, Tshirts.

>I am really looking forward to the new release.
>Go here        http://menwithouthats.com/mwhnews.html   , see, and let them
>know your opinion.
yuk - releasing a commercial album in MP3 only shouldnt even be
considered...  what about people who play proper CDs? what about people
who like to hear music as it was recorded and not compressed to death?
what about people with 2 vaguely tuned ears who can hear the difference
between MP3 and real 16-bit 44kHz stuff at about 1457ft??

I've given them my strong view on the subject...

Mike @ home



http://www.globald.demon.co.uk
http://www.citrusgrove.com

http://www.alaskahighway.co.uk
http://www.mishikawa.co.uk




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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 15:46:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: Lord Hasenpfeffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) yuk

No kidding!

I've got web access and MP3-playing capability but have not invested a
dime in a decent sound card or speakers for my computer since it's more
often used for software development than for music-listening pleasure.

On the other hand, I do own an awesome surround sound home theater
system equipped with DVD, CD and MiniDisc players.

While releasing an MP3-only album via the net might be a pioneering
and trendy thing to do, it would sound like crap as it plays in my
apartment.

Then again, if the fact that the music is to be released exclusively
in MP3 format is something centrally related to the concept of the
recording rather than being something related to the current state
of technology in the world and the human condition at this time,
I might soften my stance.  That would be very Fluxus of Ivan & Co..

I like Fluxus.

Myke


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 13:08:13 -0700
From: Don Stroud 2 <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) MP3s versus regular CD audio

I went to the website and weighed in with my opinion...

I think they should release the boots in *both* formats, to give
everyone a choice. Whereas I'd much rather have a regular CD, I'm
sure there are plenty of people out there who'd love to have
a ton of MP3s on one disc.

But if releasing both formats isn't feasible, then I'd opt
for regular CDs. I work in the software industry, but to this
day I haven't downloaded a single MP3. I listen to music in
my car and home a lot more than I do while sitting in front of
a computer at work. Hell, I don't even play my CDs in my PC
at the office... I've got a boombox propped on top of my
monitor that I use for music! (You should see what the electrical
field of the boombox does to the upper inch of my monitor
display... woke up this mornin' in a purple haze, indeed!)

So there you go. I would think that most people would want
them in a regular CD audio format, but you never know.

Don2
[e-mail]
- ----
Baypop 2000 is coming...
http://www.baypop.com


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 17:27:27 -0500
From: "Matt McCarthy" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) MP3s

I believe the mp3 question was ONLY for the bootleg material.

I read it as the new release will be a standard audio CD.

Did I misinterpret part of what the M W/O H site states?

MMM





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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 12:46:53 -0700
From: Aaron Gitlin <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) MP3 vs. CD

As much as I agree with the audio quality arguments of mp3 vs. CD, there is
also the other main argument...

Production.

It costs to put out a bunch of CDs for people, even if you only create
about 50 of them.  Plus, you have to ship them out all around the
world.  It would probably be easier, and most cost effective, to the band
if they were to just put up some mp3s on a private site for us.  True,
quality would diminish, but it also gives Stefan more time, energy, and
funds to throw at designing and selling t-shirts and putting together the
"Mountain 2000" CD.

Perhaps if there were centralized points where people could produce these
CDs all across the country they could more efficiently divy them out to
us.  It would be cheaper for us, the fan, and definately cheaper for the
band themselves.

Just my two cents.


Aaron



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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 23:46:52 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Johan Hindstrom INF <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (hats) Covers, hats site, Tshirts.

On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, mike wrote:

> yuk - releasing a commercial album in MP3 only shouldnt even be
> considered...  what about people who play proper CDs? what about people
> who like to hear music as it was recorded and not compressed to death?
> what about people with 2 vaguely tuned ears who can hear the difference
> between MP3 and real 16-bit 44kHz stuff at about 1457ft??
>

Right...
I DARE you to do a blindfolded (Pepsi/Coke) test between
CD and Mp3 at 128000 bps!
This is JUST a comment on quality...
I don't take any other stands right here and now!

> I've given them my strong view on the subject...
>

That's your right!

> Mike @ home
>

      - Johan

http://www.abo.fi/~jhindstr/dxdl/




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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 21:32:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: goreal <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) CD vs. MP3

You know, if it means more songs see the light-of-day because they're
released in mp3, isn't that a great thing?!

Maybe they'll offer both, and the @#*%! perfection snobs can wait for
the second go-round of CD releases.. while the rest of us crank it up
the mp3s and enjoy them.

J.Davis
[e-mail]

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
http://invites.yahoo.com/


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 30 Jul 00 11:02:20 +0000
From: mike <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (hats) CD vs. MP3

>Maybe they'll offer both, and the @#*%! perfection snobs can wait for
>the second go-round of CD releases.. while the rest of us crank it up
>the mp3s and enjoy them.
>
>J.Davis
jeez mate - calm down!!  if you think that wanting 'normal' CD quality
means that i'm a snob then you're too far into the MP3 world...  get a
life and a pair of ears.

they should offer a standard CD (ie 16-bit 44.1kHz disc) and then if
enough people want them an MP3 version as well.  you must remember that
quite a few of us have the bootlegs anyway, so why would we want to buy 2
copies (and an inferior version as well!).  i agree that MP3 means more
music to the masses but as someone who knows the audio difference i'd
rather have quality over quantity any day...

but what do i know, i'm just a digital musician...

}:-)



http://www.globald.demon.co.uk
http://www.citrusgrove.com

http://www.alaskahighway.co.uk
http://www.mishikawa.co.uk




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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 30 Jul 00 11:02:21 +0000
From: mike <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (hats) Covers, hats site, Tshirts.

>I DARE you to do a blindfolded (Pepsi/Coke) test between
>CD and Mp3 at 128000 bps!
>This is JUST a comment on quality...
>I don't take any other stands right here and now!
>      - Johan
>
>http://www.abo.fi/~jhindstr/dxdl/
OK, seems there's a slagging match starting!!  as a musician who owns a
_very_ expensive digital recording studio (ie more than a PC and a sound
card!!), i can tell the difference between mp3 and cd NO PROBLEM!!!  most
people cant tell the difference i know, but quite a few of us can.  if
you play music on your PC at work or at home on less than dynamic
speakers then even a nats fart would sound vagualy ok.  play a standard
computer's soundcard into a decent amp / speakers system and you'll hear
that even the newer mp3 doesn't quite sound as full as the uncompressed
stuff.  the bass lacks definition and the top end rolls off (if you know
how sampling & different rates effect the sound then you'll know what i'm
talking about).  i'm not dismissing mp3, its a good thing to have for
streaming and use over the net.

and yes, i can tell the difference between coke, diet coke, pepsi, diet
pepsi, pepsi max, virgin cola and the other one...

}:-S



http://www.globald.demon.co.uk
http://www.citrusgrove.com

http://www.alaskahighway.co.uk
http://www.mishikawa.co.uk




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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 13:07:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Lord Hasenpfeffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) MP3s and CDs

One thing that we always seem to forget is the fact that there are things
called *MINIDISCS* available which are very inexpensive, as easy to record
and duplicate as cassettes, and offer sound quality that's damn near equal
to the uncompressed data on CDs.  MP3s use a 1/11 compression ratio whereas
MiniDiscs use only 1/5.  I have a Nakamichi/Bose surround sound home theater
system and use it for listening to MDs made from CDs all the time.  I cannot
tell any difference at all between the two formats.

Myke


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 13:09:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: Lord Hasenpfeffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (hats) Covers, hats site, Tshirts.

> the bass lacks definition and the top end rolls off

Both of which do *not* occur with MiniDiscs, I might add...

Myke


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 17:24:34 -0400 (EDT)
From: Lord Hasenpfeffer <[e-mail]>
Subject: (hats) CDs, MDs, LPs, Paper Tapes (HAHA!), and MP3s...

> sony) and we digitally transfered stuff from a CD player to disc for use
> the last time we flew on the plane - i must admit that i can hear a
> slight difference when its played on my hifi, though in everyday use its
> pretty slight.

Then again, you're Mr. Moose who I think uses an oscilloscope to calibrate your
equipment there at Mooseland Studios, UK!  :-)

I cannot tell a difference at all between CDs and my MDs - but then I don't
use my Sony portable recorder to record my CDs - even digitally.  I use it for
playback of the discs made with my home deck or to record live on location art
things with open mic.

There is no doubt in my mind that MiniDisc is the best format for this kind of
material if CDs are out of the question or will be out of the question initially.
No expensive equipment or even a computer is required to record / copy them.
Blank MDs are very inexpensive - as are the players at long last as well.
They also sound incredibly good - and far better than MP3!!

I'm glad you put MD in 2nd place behind CDs.  MiniDiscs have never been promoted
as CD substitutes but rather as cassette tape *replacements* and for that purpose
they do a DAMN good job!

Myke


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 11:11:54 -0400
From: "Kerry Gordon" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (hats) MP3 vs. CD

With my current financial situation I'd prefer .mp3 files along with =
graphics available for purchase on a website or via a disc that I can =
download then decode (decompress to .wav) to cdr for playing on a cd =
player. I'm sure that the quality will be fine. I've downloaded mp3's and =
decoded to disc before and they sound great!
It all depends on the quality of the original.

Kerry Gordon

>>> Aaron Gitlin <[e-mail]> Saturday, July 29, 2000 3:46:53 PM >>>

As much as I agree with the audio quality arguments of mp3 vs. CD, there =
is=20
also the other main argument...

Production.

It costs to put out a bunch of CDs for people, even if you only create=20
about 50 of them.  Plus, you have to ship them out all around the=20
world.  It would probably be easier, and most cost effective, to the =
band=20
if they were to just put up some mp3s on a private site for us.  True,=20
quality would diminish, but it also gives Stefan more time, energy, and=20
funds to throw at designing and selling t-shirts and putting together =
the=20
"Mountain 2000" CD.

Perhaps if there were centralized points where people could produce =
these=20
CDs all across the country they could more efficiently divy them out to=20
us.  It would be cheaper for us, the fan, and definately cheaper for =
the=20
band themselves.

Just my two cents.


Aaron



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------------------------------

End of hats-digest V2 #207
**************************