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From: owner-glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com (glencook-fans-digest)
To: glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: glencook-fans-digest V1 #250
Reply-To: glencook-fans-digest
Sender: owner-glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
glencook-fans-digest Wednesday, March 19 2003 Volume 01 : Number 250
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 19:50:25 -0500 (EST)
From: Yuri Gorlinski <ygorl@mojo.calyx.net>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Discworld
On Mon, 17 Mar 2003, Steve Chew wrote:
>
> Any recommendations on where to start with Discworld? I read one
> a long time ago and wasn't that enamoured so I haven't picked up another
> since. I can't remember the title of the one I read, unfortunatley.
Not sure how it would read as an introduction to the series, but my
favorite was always _Sourcery_. Very funny book. Most of the others
ranged from fair to mediocre IMO, and I sort of lost interest in the
series once Pratchett got away from a few of the characters that I
enjoyed reading about early on...
If you're serious about it then the first two books (_The Colour of
Magic_ and _The Light Fantastic_) are probably the place to start.
Yg
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 22:28:12 -0500
From: dmeyer@jhereg.dmeyer.net
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Discworld
In article <20030318000026.DD8A037406B@valhalla.interzone.com> you write:
> > BTW any Pratchett fans in the group. I like the Garrett series so much that
> >I was telling a friend about it a few years ago and she said I should try
> >the Discworld series. There are 27 of them now and I've read them all in
> >the last 2 years. Not only are they drop dead hilarious but they are really
> >good stories with strong characters and a fairly consisistent point of veiw.
> >
> Any recommendations on where to start with Discworld? I read one
> a long time ago and wasn't that enamoured so I haven't picked up another
> since. I can't remember the title of the one I read, unfortunatley.
The tricky thing is that there's a huge differences among the books,
not so much in quality (though there's some of that) but in tone. The
first two, _Color of Magic_ and _The Light Fantastic_, are light,
funny, sarcastic adventure stories. I liked them (_CoM_ in
particular), but I know plenty of people who just didn't.
The ones involving Death tend to be more philosophical and less
whacky, and they are my favorites. _Mort_ and _Reaper Man_ in
particular.
The witches books are my least favorite - too much slapstick for my
taste.
The guards books I didn't like so much earlier, but the more recent
ones (_Feet of Clay_, _Night Watch_) I've liked much better.
The more-or-less standalone ones are a mixed bag: _Eric_ I'm not fond
of, _Pyramids_ I quite liked, _Moving Pictures_ was absolute garbage.
_Small Gods_ IMHO is the best work Pratchett has ever done - I loved
it.
My two cents, but you'll find a huge variety of opinions. I've talked
to people you thought _Moving Pictures_ was hilarious and that _Small
Gods_ never grabbed their interest. Go figure.
- --
Dave Meyer
dmeyer@dmeyer.net
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 00:13:23 -0600
From: "Jordan Raney" <jrraney@attbi.com>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) Dread Empire - Prequels first, or no?
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2ECE3.3039C960
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
MessageI would hold off with the prequels until after the 3 main books
(starting with "A Shadow..."). You will understand the significance of
things better that way.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com
[mailto:owner-glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Bill Acuff
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 1:06 PM
To: glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com
Subject: (glencook-fans) Dread Empire - Prequels first, or no?
Greetings,
Long time lurker, very infrequent poster ... need some advice from y'all.
I'm about to start reading the Dread Empire series. I have the prequels
(in total I have "The Fire in His Hands", "With Mercy Towards None", "A
Shadow of All Night Falling", "October's Baby", "All Darkness Met", "Reap
the East Wind", and "An Ill Fate Marshalling" ... took me some time to get
them all--not as long as it took to get "Doomstalker", but that's another
story <grin>).
Here's the question: do I first read "The Fire in His Hands" or "A Shadow
of All Night Falling" (and then come back and pick up the prequels later,
I.e., to read them in the order as they were written and published) ... or,
does it really matter?
L8r,
Bill
- ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2ECE3.3039C960
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Message</TITLE>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1126" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D258501106-18032003><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I =
would hold off=20
with the prequels until after the 3 main books (starting with "A=20
Shadow..."). You will understand the significance of things better =
that=20
way.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D258501106-18032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D258501106-18032003></SPAN> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>=20
owner-glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com=20
[mailto:owner-glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com]<B>On Behalf Of =
</B>Bill=20
Acuff<BR><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 15, 2003 1:06 PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> (glencook-fans) =
Dread=20
Empire - Prequels first, or no?<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>Greetings,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Long =
time lurker,=20
very infrequent poster ... need some advice from y'all. =
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm =
about to start=20
reading the Dread Empire series. </FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I have the =
prequels (in total=20
I have "The Fire in His Hands", "With Mercy Towards None", "A Shadow =
of All=20
Night Falling", "October's Baby", "All Darkness Met", "Reap the East =
Wind",=20
and "An Ill Fate Marshalling" ... took me some time to get them =
all--not as=20
long as it took to get "Doomstalker", but that's another story=20
<grin>).</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>Here's the=20
question: do I first read "The Fire in His Hands" or "A Shadow of All =
Night=20
Falling" (and then come back and pick up the prequels later, I.e., to =
read=20
them in the order as they were written and published) ... or, does it =
really=20
matter?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003></SPAN><SPAN=20
class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>L8r,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D751595718-15032003><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>Bill</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></SPAN></BODY></HTML>
- ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2ECE3.3039C960--
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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 22:18:52 -0800
From: Matt Patterson <matt@ooze.com>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Discworld
On 3/17/03 7:28 PM, "dmeyer@jhereg.dmeyer.net" <dmeyer@jhereg.dmeyer.net>
wrote:
> My two cents, but you'll find a huge variety of opinions. I've talked
> to people you thought _Moving Pictures_ was hilarious and that _Small
> Gods_ never grabbed their interest. Go figure.
I'll second the vote for Small Gods as the best pratchett novel. Tone is a
tricky thing, especially in books with comedy. I'm not a huge fan of overtly
wacky, hence my appreciation of the Garett books - with the exception of
Angry lead Skies.
That, without being a comedy novel, was just plain wacky.
- -matt
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:57:50 -0600
From: "Horky, Roger" <rhorky@trinity.edu>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) Discworld
I remember writing an essay back in the early '80s about comedic fantasy =
(never published), in which my main focus was on the garrett series, =
discworld, asprin's myth series, and xanth.
Why I thought Garrett was "comedy" escapes me. They have their funny =
moments, but they're not written for laughs. I don't think I was alone =
in considering them comedy back then, but as I re-read them, all I can =
think of was that nobody knew how to categorise them. They're still hard =
to describe to people, especially those who aren't into fantasy much. =
But I keep trying!
The discworld series remain wickedly funny but as Pratchett's writing =
style has matured, i realise that he has some significant things to say =
about the human condition. Nowadays I tell people he's the modern Mark =
Twain. He is especially adept at commenting on religion (which is why I =
think Pyramids, Small Gods, and Feet of Clay are his best works).
The myth- series and the xanth series started out as funny stories that =
were also good fantasy but ended up being xanth books and myth =
books--they have evolved so far away from their fantasy roots they stand =
alone, and only the hard-core fans still keep up with them. I gave up =
on xanth about ten books into the series and although i still read the =
myth books i'm not sure why. I recently re-read the first three xanth =
books--the ones i remember as being good fantasy as well as funny--and =
wondered why i remembered them so fondly. but i do respect that there =
are a lot of people who like them a lot--who am i to begrudge them their =
fun? I like Asprin's Phule books, but they're sci-fi.
If i were to rewrite that essay, i would add a reference to Esther =
Freisner, Lawrence Watt-Evans, Barry Hughart (an underrated genius), =
John Morressy, craig shaw gardner (whom I can't stand, as halfway =
through his first book he used 'imply' when he wanted 'infer') and L. =
Sprague deCamp. I would also definitely also mention Ron Miller's =
Brownwyn books, which are surreally funny. I've proabbly missed some but =
it's early on a workday.
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:07:34 -0600
From: Steve Harris <harrissg@SLU.EDU>
Subject: (glencook-fans) What is Garrett?
Roger,
"Why I thought Garrett was "comedy" escapes me. They have their funny
moments, but they're not written for laughs ... nobody knew how to
categorise them."
They are comedies, but of an unusual sort: They're hard-boiled
detective fiction (with a thoroughly mundane detective) set in a milieu
completely unsuited to that genre, and that's where a lot of the comedy
comes from--the humorous contrast between Garrett's attitudes, suitable
for the real-world Tenderloin, set in a context where magic and outre
creatures are the norm. It's almost Magical Realism.
They're not even truly good fantasy (as opposed to BC, Dread Empire, and
so on), since there's no concistent set of altered-reality rules in
evidence, but just anything being allowed so long as it hooks up with
the plot need du jour--but that works, precisely because we're not
supposed to take it seriously, but as light humor.
In that regard, check out http://www.ansible.co.uk/Ansible/plotdev.html
And may the Plot be with you.
Steve
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:13:51 -0600 (CST)
From: Changeling <chnglng@FreeQ.com>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) What is Garrett?
Pulp-fantasy-detective.
A brand new classification.
*nod*nod*nod*
- -Matthew
On Tue, 18 Mar 2003, Steve Harris wrote:
> Roger,
>
> "Why I thought Garrett was "comedy" escapes me. They have their funny
> moments, but they're not written for laughs ... nobody knew how to
> categorise them."
>
> They are comedies, but of an unusual sort: They're hard-boiled
> detective fiction (with a thoroughly mundane detective) set in a milieu
> completely unsuited to that genre, and that's where a lot of the comedy
> comes from--the humorous contrast between Garrett's attitudes, suitable
> for the real-world Tenderloin, set in a context where magic and outre
> creatures are the norm. It's almost Magical Realism.
>
> They're not even truly good fantasy (as opposed to BC, Dread Empire, and
> so on), since there's no concistent set of altered-reality rules in
> evidence, but just anything being allowed so long as it hooks up with
> the plot need du jour--but that works, precisely because we're not
> supposed to take it seriously, but as light humor.
>
> In that regard, check out http://www.ansible.co.uk/Ansible/plotdev.html
>
> And may the Plot be with you.
>
> Steve
>
> =======================================================================
> To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
> visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
>
**************************************************************************
* *
* "It is good to find that one is in agreement with the gods." *
* "Howso?" *
* "It shows that the gods are wise." *
* *
**************************************************************************
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 20:30:39 -0400
From: Richard Chilton <rchilton@auracom.com>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) What is Garrett?
Changeling wrote:
>
> Pulp-fantasy-detective.
>
> A brand new classification.
> *nod*nod*nod*
>
I'm not sure about the "brand new" bit... The Dark World Detective
predates him.
Richard
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End of glencook-fans-digest V1 #250
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