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- Newsgroups: sci.astro
- Path: sparky!uunet!haven.umd.edu!ames!news.hawaii.edu!montebello!joe
- From: joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu (Joe Dellinger)
- Subject: Re: the moon
- Message-ID: <1992Aug22.005613.24712@news.Hawaii.Edu>
- Sender: root@news.Hawaii.Edu (News Service)
- Nntp-Posting-Host: montebello.soest.hawaii.edu
- Reply-To: joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu
- Organization: School of Ocean and Earth Science Technology
- References: <1992Aug16.094059.830@sfu.ca> <Bt3EsB.6q2@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <1992Aug17.144110.9725@mcc.com> <25636@dog.ee.lbl.gov> <20AUG199216314609@msr.triumf.ca>
- Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1992 00:56:13 GMT
- Lines: 58
-
- |> >[Richard.Mathews@West.Sun.COM's] argument seems to suggest that the moon
- |> >would deccelerate, move closer to the earth and violate conservation of
- |> > angular momentum.
- |> >-Scott
-
- Sometimes its useful to remember that you can DERIVE conservation
- of momentum from the relevant physical laws (like F=MA, Newton's law of
- Gravity, etc). Once you've done that, working out what will happen in
- certain problems using conservation of angular momentum is an extremely
- convenient short cut. BUT... you could, in theory, just work out the whole
- thing by following all the myriads of interactions between the particles making
- up the Moon and the Earth!
-
- In this case, if the Earth rotated retrograde the tidal bulge would
- always precede the Moon in it's orbit, decelerating it, and thus bringing
- the moon closer and closer in. [I suspect you were thinking of running
- the scenario in reverse. There are two problems with that: 1) then the
- moon would be retrograde too; 2) the tidal friction dissipated as heat
- in the forward scenario becomes heat miraculously being used up maintaining
- a bulge in the Earth in the wrong place in the reverse scenario.]
-
-
- |> As the moon moves into a closer orbit, the tidal forces increase (inverse
- |> cube of distance?), rapidly increasing the deceleration until CRASH!
- |> Donald Arseneau asnd@reg.triumf.ca
-
- In fact, the Earth wouldn't have to go retrograde. Just as long
- as it turned forward on its axis slower than the moon orbits it would be
- enough. Mars' moon Phobos is in just this situation now. It will continue to
- spiral IN to Mars because of tidal effects, and must eventually crash.
- Mars seems to have an excess of low-angle impact craters around its equator;
- it has been suggested that perhaps Phobos is merely the last survivor of a
- number of former Martian moons left in low orbits as the result of some
- improbable near-Mars asteroid collision / breakup. All the others have
- already crashed, each leaving behind an equatorial low-angle impact
- crater as a sort of tombstone.
-
- In fact, if the Sun let the Earth survive that long, the Earth's
- moon would eventually crash too. Here are the stages on the way:
- 1) Today: Moon relatively close, tidal forces moving Moon away from Earth.
- 2) Moon moved away. Length of day very close to length of month.
- 3) Tidal forces of SUN slow the Moon down some more. Length of day becomes
- LONGER than length of month. EARTH-MOON tidal forces start pulling
- the moon in again.
- 4) Moon moves in and in, month gets shorter and shorter; day gets shorter
- and shorter too, but always longer than month. Eventually moon gets
- too close and breaks up due to tidal disruption. Earth has a ring.
-
- Supposedly stages 2, 3, and 4 will never happen though because
- we all get fried by the sun long before.
-
- /\ /\ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\.-.-.-.-.......___________
- / \ / \ /Hawaii Institute of Geophysics, Honolulu\/\/\.-.-....__
- ___/ \/ \/Joe Dellinger, Internet: joe@montebello.soest.hawaii.edu\/\.-.__
- ____________________________________________________
- Objectivity is not an unobtainable emptying of mind |
- but a willingness to abandon a set of preferences |----> Stephen J. Gould
- when the world seems to work in a contrary way. |
-