World of Ham Radio 1997/WOHR97_AmSoft_(1997-02-01).iso/usenets/1996_12/_miscela.txt

Text File | 1997-02-01 | 5MB | 117,249 lines

The World of Ham Radio CD-ROM



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!news1.mpcs.com!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 96 03:06:45 EST
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: [e-mail] (Diogenes)
Comments: This message did not originate from the address above.  It was remailed by an anonymous remailing service.  If you have questions or complaints, please direct them to <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.stupidity,alt.flame,alt.usenet.kooks
Subject: "All 51 States" (was: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE)
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]> <01bbe0c3$61b1afe0$8a7074cf@default>
Mail-To-News-Contact: [e-mail]
Organization: [e-mail]
Lines: 24
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119517 alt.stupidity:86437 alt.flame:351192 alt.usenet.kooks:53575

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Wow,
>         With experts such as you and your elite ranking in the 'amateur'
> world
> I am surprised that God also gets advice from you.

At least he can count to 50 and can read a map.

> Are you really serious, someone makes a mistake and all you have to
> do is sit around and try to put people down.

"Someone makes a mistake"?  I don't think that the arrogant pager
peddler (you!) who has consistently defended his assertion that the
USA has "51 states" has ever admitted to being in error.

> What next, your a
> racist too?  Stay in Guam with the rest of the radioactive waste
> from the US.

"Racist"?  What race of people inhabits your planet?  You sure do
hate HUMANS for some reason.  Besides, those folks in Guam might be
living in the future "52nd state". <g>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!newsvr.cyberway.com.sg!ftpsvr.cyberway.com.sg![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Edwin Teh, 9V1ZY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ### What is amateur radio?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 12:18:46 GMT
Organization: Network 65, Singapore
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d7053.ppp7.cyberway.com.sg
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

I'm sure this topic has been beaten to death already, but I need
something to say to people who ask me the above question.

How would you best answer the question "What is Amateur Radio?".

I'm stumped. I always end up just saying 'the bottom line is, it's a
hobby...'.

Ed, 9V1ZY
--
[e-mail]          -[ Standard Disclaimers Apply ]-

          Now Faith is a substance of things hoped for,
           the evidence of things not seen. [Heb 11:1]

             As Email can be altered electronically,
     the integrity of this communication is not guaranteed.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.97.248.3!news.ime.net!not-for-mail
From: "David Lawson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ### What is amateur radio?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 01:28:04 GMT
Organization: Digital Designs
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbe3dd$7d5635a0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port-111.ime.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



Edwin Teh, 9V1ZY <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> I'm sure this topic has been beaten to death already, but I need
> something to say to people who ask me the above question.
>
> How would you best answer the question "What is Amateur Radio?".
>
> I'm stumped. I always end up just saying 'the bottom line is, it's a
> hobby...'.
>
> Ed, 9V1ZY
bull's eye, right on the mark, double out!, etc.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:16 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: ### What is amateur radio?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 05:46:37 GMT
Lines: 23

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Edw
in Teh, 9V1ZY) writes:
>
>I'm sure this topic has been beaten to death already, but I need
>something to say to people who ask me the above question.
>
>How would you best answer the question "What is Amateur Radio?".
>
>I'm stumped. I always end up just saying 'the bottom line is, it's a
>hobby...'.

The ITU defines amateur radio succinctly this way, "a service of
self-training, intercommunications, and technical investigations
carried on by amateurs".  It is the only radio service where private
persons can experiment with radio technology solely for their own
enlightenment and to satisfy their curiosity about how the invisible
world works.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: #HNX1n+,nTnJa+?G++<[e-mail]> wrote:
Date: Sat,  7 Dec 1996 17:35:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <58af4m$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <19961203234100.
Lines: 21


>What in the name of God is this and how is the average user suppose to
>read it?

JEFF>>That was a chain letter written in Chinese.

No it wasn't. It was a request for a mod to the Standard C558a...which I
Emailed to him already.












<just kidding, Jeff>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Anthony S. Pelliccio)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: $4.00 / MONTH BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 1 Dec 1996 21:48:09 -0500
Organization: Ideamation, Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <57tg19$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdefa$58b27020$d47174cf@default> <57qvt3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <57qvt3$[e-mail]>,
Michael P. Deignan <[e-mail]> wrote:

>My pager is free. Since I'm already starting out at Zero, you'll have
>to send me a check to "save me money". I'm current in the callbook.

Let's start another pissing war here - mine is free also. In fact it's
one of those alpha units. Cool huh? He can send my refund cheque to
the address in the callbook.

Tony




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: $4.00 / MONTH BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:12:57 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <01bbe0be$b03cc000$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdefa$58b27020$d47174cf@default> <57qvt3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

HOW BOUT THAT. WHO SAID YOU CAN'T TYPR WITH YOUR CAP KEYS LOCKED AND
LOADED?


YOUR PAGER IS FREE BECAUSE NO ONE WANTS TO CALL YOU.

I'M SURE YOUR AMATEUR RADIO EQUIPMENT WAS FREE ALSO.


NOW I KNOW WHY THE FCC NAMED IT AMATEUR RADIO. BUT THEY FORGOT THE COMEDIAN
WORD OUT OF THE TITLE.

Michael P. Deignan <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57qvt3$[e-mail]>...
> In article <01bbdefa$58b27020$d47174cf@default>,
>       1 <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >Beeper service available in all FIFTY (50) states including and not
limited
>
> Hey, how about that. Who sez you can't learn anything from reading
> rec.radio.amateur.misc? Our friend here learned:
>
>       1. There are only 50 states
>       2. Where his caps-lock key is
>
>
> >KB2TIU, Helping Amateurs save money, EVERYWHERE
>
> My pager is free. Since I'm already starting out at Zero, you'll have
> to send me a check to "save me money". I'm current in the callbook.
>
> MD
> --
> --
> --  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
> --
> --  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: $4.00 / MONTH BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:13:48 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <01bbe0be$cd147a60$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdefa$58b27020$d47174cf@default> <57qc6r$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Pleasing critics worldwide!!!

Howard Watson <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57qc6r$[e-mail]>...
> "1" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >Beeper service available in all FIFTY (50) states including and not
limited
> >to the following places, refered to as Puerto Rico, US Virgin Islands,
> >Bahamas, Hawaii, Alaska and Canada.
>
> >For details see:(enter the URL exactly as you see it)
>
> > www.angelfire.com/biz/BEEPER/index.html
>
> >or E mail me for details
>
>
> >KB2TIU, Helping Amateurs save money, EVERYWHERE
>
> >Mike
>
> ALRIGHT MIKE!  Now, THAT is an improvement!  I don't know about other
> people, but I am a lot more likely to respond to an ad that takes the
> time to get it right.  :>
>
> 73 de N3TNQ  -  Howard  -  Springfield, OH
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!southwind.net!symbios.com!csn!nntp-xfer-2.csn.net!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: $4.00 / MONTH BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 2 Dec 1996 23:53:30 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <580boa$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdefa$58b27020$d47174cf@default> <57qvt3$[e-mail]> <01bbe0be$b03cc000$8a7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <01bbe0be$b03cc000$8a7074cf@default>,
        1 <[e-mail]> wrote:

>HOW BOUT THAT. WHO SAID YOU CAN'T TYPR WITH YOUR CAP KEYS LOCKED AND
>LOADED?

Looks like we need to buy you a spell-checker too.


Now that you've managed to alienate your entire customer base with
useless posts to this newsgroup, what trick are you going to pull
for an encore?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!dciteleport.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: $4.00 per month pager service
Date: 4 Dec 1996 06:21:27 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbe1aa$8b54c8e0$fce092cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.224.252
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Please visit our new and improved web site:

www.angelfire.com/biz/pager/index.html


or


www.acabams.com    (coming soon)


Service is available in all 50 states and all US territories.  Canada and
some Foreign islands also available.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:23 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: 'Nother Pro-code Luddite
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <575f1m$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57kdi5$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 12:47:06 GMT
Lines: 29

In article <57kdi5$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (M
ichael P. Deignan) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>       Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>>That's your definition of "homebrew"? Buying a big bag of parts, sorting
>>>them out, and soldering them to a pre-fabricated, pre-drilled circuit
>>>board?
>>
>>No, I call that electronic assembly. You said people would only buy
>>appliances.  That's not true. The number doing their own original
>>designs may be relatively small, but the number of people building
>>equipment is still large. And that's considerably more than appliance
>>ownership.
>
>Every ham I know solders PL259's on to their coax. Thus, by your
>definition, the entire ham population homebrews. I stand corrected.

I suppose that if your definition of "equipment" is so broad as
to include a simple connector, you might say that. I'd call that
electrical work, however, and not electronic assembly, since the
connector has no active devices and ideally does not modify the
signal in any way.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: *** AEA DSP-232 only $ 379.00 ***
Date: 4 Dec 1996 01:32:17 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <582kb1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57nfph$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm1-02.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 03  5:32:17 PM PST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20492 rec.radio.swap:97991 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119575 rec.radio.amateur.space:9002 rec.radio.scanner:72258 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43808

In <57nfph$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
writes:
>
>In article <[e-mail]>, Bob <chainsaw.at.tfs.net>
wrote:
>>Wouldn't it have been a little more fair of you to caveat your ad
here
>>with the note that they who buy AEA products now do so with little to
>>no possibility of product support, since AEA is about to go belly up?
>>Oh well, bidness is bidness!!!
>
>Ah, "product support" - the cry of the appliance operator. Maybe you
>should invest in a soldering gun and test equipment, Bob.
>
>KH2PZ

And how exactly will the soldering iron panacea help with the lack of
promised firmware? Please restrict your answer to one (1) Blue Book.

                                Jerry



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:25 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!newshost.convex.com!bcm.tmc.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: *** AEA DSP-232 only $ 379.00 ***
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57nfph$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 17:05:51 GMT
Lines: 29
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20507 rec.radio.swap:98064 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119625 rec.radio.amateur.space:9012 rec.radio.scanner:72293 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43833

In article <57nfph$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:
>In article <[e-mail]>, Bob <chainsaw.at.tfs.net> wrote:
>>Wouldn't it have been a little more fair of you to caveat your ad here
>>with the note that they who buy AEA products now do so with little to
>>no possibility of product support, since AEA is about to go belly up?
>>Oh well, bidness is bidness!!!
>
>Ah, "product support" - the cry of the appliance operator. Maybe you
>should invest in a soldering gun and test equipment, Bob.
>
>KH2PZ

And an ICE, a good disassembler, a logic analyzer with a *deep* FIFO,
an EPROM burner and a PLA programmer, etc. Just be sure to keep that
soldering *gun* well away from the unit. There's nothing inside that
can tolerate that kind of abuse.

You *can* reverse engineer the unit if it isn't too badly fried,
but it'll be a lot easier to do it now while it is working rather
than waiting for a custom ASIC or EPROM to fail. Of course if AEA
releases source, you won't need any of that, other than the burner
and PLA programmer.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.ac.net!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 147.435 in LA to get new call
Date: 2 Dec 1996 19:18:51 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <57va2r$[e-mail]>
References: <56fpbu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5737gh$[e-mail]> <57l394$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]



The only problem is that sissies like YOU can't stand to HEAR certain
words...What a mature adult..


:
: Why not attack the core of the problem rather than pushing it into a
: dark corner?
:
: Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!ames!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 147.435 in LA to get new call
Date: 5 Dec 1996 07:32:12 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <585tps$[e-mail]>
References: <56fpbu$[e-mail]> <5737gh$[e-mail]> <57l394$[e-mail]> <57va2r$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <57va2r$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>I wrote:

>The only problem is that sissies like YOU can't stand to HEAR certain
>words...What a mature adult..

>: Why not attack the core of the problem rather than pushing it into a
>: dark corner?

Don't be foolish, Bark. What goes on there is giving SoCal hams
a black eye. Everytime someone with a scanner comes across that
rptr their opinion of amateur radio sinks. Our greatest ally, the
news media, have scanners, too, you know.

We'd keep a scanner on at the fire station. The PD would have one
running in their offices upstairs. The newspaper office always had
one on. Scanners are everywhere, and they're all capable of monitoring
2m. And many of the listeners are the ones who decide what role hams
play within a city or county communication plan.  Remember that next
time you hold your mouth up to your 2m pacifier.

Having problems with antenna restrictions? Maybe one of the folks who
drafted the regs owns a scanner and didn't like what he heard.

Why don't your ever sign your posts or give your call? Are you on the
outside looking in?

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!visi.com!dimensional.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Bryan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 2 M amp help
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 21:13:34 GMT
Organization: Dimensional Communications
Lines: 15
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Hi,
I am having a problem with a rfc 2-23 amp that i
would welcome some input on.
I am using it with a kenwood th-22at and a mfj 2 meter
hansheld SWR meter and a ringo ranger 2m antenna.
The SWR at full power between the ht and the antenna
is about 1.5. When the amp is hooked up to
the radio the swr is slightly higher but still below
2.  But when I turn the amp on the reading goes off scale.
I was wondering if anyone could tell me want is going
on here and if this is a valid reading and how to correct it.

Thanks
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:29 1996
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From: Ron Myers <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 2 M amp help
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 07:41:25 -0500
Organization: Info Avenue INTERNET Access
Lines: 30
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References: <584t1l$[e-mail]>
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Bryan wrote:
>
> Hi,
> I am having a problem with a rfc 2-23 amp that i
> would welcome some input on.
> I am using it with a kenwood th-22at and a mfj 2 meter
> hansheld SWR meter and a ringo ranger 2m antenna.
> The SWR at full power between the ht and the antenna
> is about 1.5. When the amp is hooked up to
> the radio the swr is slightly higher but still below
> 2.  But when I turn the amp on the reading goes off scale.
> I was wondering if anyone could tell me want is going
> on here and if this is a valid reading and how to correct it.
>
> Thanks
> [e-mail]
It would seem that you have hit on a classic example of which to tune
first.  Put your SWR meter as close to the antenna as possible, and with
as little power as you can get by with, tune the antenna.  Increase the
power some, and do it again.  After you have ALL the reflected power
minimized, you should have a reasonably resonant system with best
performance.  What happens is, the antenna is reflecting some power, and
the bridge (being dumb) is detecting a power level.  whin you engage the
amplifier, the level of the reflected power is raised.  Most of the
inexpensive SWR bridges are really back-to-back rf volt meters, and the
diodes used to detect the power are non-linear; hence the readings are
only good if the load (antenna/dummy load) is equal to the resonant
impedence of the line (coax) and the final of the radio (don't touch it)
A reading of 1.5 - 2 isn't really that good.  It should be below 1:1.2
to be effective.   ... KB4EG


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:30 1996
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From: <[e-mail]> (JerryD)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 2 Meter handie Talkie information
Date: 5 Dec 1996 14:48:30 GMT
Organization: test
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <586nbu$[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: jerryd-pc.ods.com
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I would like to know which handie talkies can be modified for 800 Mhz.
If you know of one that does just drop me a line stating the model # and
make. I would really appreciate it.  If you have a chance and know where
I can get the modification, please include it too.

Thanks in advance
Jerry D.
Senior Hardware engineer


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:30 1996
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From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 2 Meter handie Talkie information
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 10:24:02 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 15
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References: <586nbu$[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]

(JerryD) wrote:
>
> I would like to know which handie talkies can be modified for 800 Mhz.
> If you know of one that does just drop me a line stating the model # and
> make. I would really appreciate it.  If you have a chance and know where
> I can get the modification, please include it too.
>
> Thanks in advance
> Jerry D.
> Senior Hardware engineer

I've seen some Alinco's (dj-160) stretch the RX that far but scratchy at best.
. I'd doubt that any could be
modded to TX.

Good luck..


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:31 1996
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From: Mike <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: 2300 to 2450 MHz GEAR
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 01:03:03 -0800
Organization: FNS
Lines: 8
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Can anyone point me in the right direction for gear for use
in the ham band covering 2300 to 2450 Mhz, rcvr, tx, antenna.
I would like to explore that band, but have not seen much info
about it. The only thing I saw was a post about the loss of some
segments.
Thanks for any help.

73 Mike K6YPB


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:32 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Overfelt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on, Big Al is the Good Guy
Date: 9 Dec 1996 16:39:04 GMT
Organization: Your Organization
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <58hfb8$[e-mail]>
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You people are playing DUMB.   If you know half as much as YOU have written is
 the previous
POSTINGS, then you Read THE MAIL often on 3.8945 mhz.


The real outlaw there is Rich Whiten, WB2OTK now residing in SC.
 He is 50 years old, unemployed, has been fined  $10500 by the
FCC for exactly the same illegal radio practices he is presently
doing!  He plays tapes, uses filthy langauge.  Since he has no job,
 he has ALL day and night to Raise Hell on 3.8945 an 14.313 mhz.
  He has been doing this for ten years.

He has provoked several, including K4OKA into cussing him
and then Rich Whiten taped the conversation and now he plays
the tapes over and over.

Stop by 3.8945 and 14.313 and tell Rich Whiten
what a rotten, low life gutter snipe he is.


Adios, Jim WD4JYZ








>Dave Burr wrote:
>>
>> It's really amazing how all the little lemmings, who have no real
>> knowledge of what is actually going on on this freq, are talking about
>> "paying visits" to these so-called "offenders".
>>
>
>Probably true, this won't end in the "cleaning up" of the frequency, but
>it will at least increase the public awareness among hams (little
>lemmings, I think you said...) who are unaware, or unable to catch up on
>the situation.  Furthermore, as I mentioned before, do you have anything
>CONTRUCTIVE or HELPFUL to say, or are YOU satisfied to sit on YOUR "pink
>plump rump" (which is probably neither "little" nor "puritan[ical]" and
>hide behind your keyboard passing useless criticism.
>
>> Dave
>> K9XK
>
>Enough said.
>
>Pete -- KA2YDY



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:34 1996
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on, Big Al is the Good Guy
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 16:51:02 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58hfb8$[e-mail]>
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Jim Overfelt wrote:
>
> You people are playing DUMB.   If you know half as much as YOU have written
is the previous
> POSTINGS, then you Read THE MAIL often on 3.8945 mhz.
>
> The real outlaw there is Rich Whiten, WB2OTK now residing in SC.
>  He is 50 years old, unemployed, has been fined  $10500 by the
> FCC for exactly the same illegal radio practices he is presently
> doing!  He plays tapes, uses filthy langauge.  Since he has no job,
>  he has ALL day and night to Raise Hell on 3.8945 an 14.313 mhz.
>   He has been doing this for ten years.
>
> He has provoked several, including K4OKA into cussing him
> and then Rich Whiten taped the conversation and now he plays
> the tapes over and over.
>
> Stop by 3.8945 and 14.313 and tell Rich Whiten
> what a rotten, low life gutter snipe he is.
>
> Adios, Jim WD4JYZ


I have to agree there. I used the word "lemmings" quite appropriately in
describing people who, without listening to the freq and understanding
what is going on, are ready to go marauding about the countryside with
torches to "clean up" the frequency.

The guys that hang out there seem generally to be some of the nicest
guys on 75. Sure, they like a little action when people like WB2OTK
bring it to them. Who is going to let themselves be run off the
frequency?

I can't even bring myself to repeat some of the WB2OTK stuff, but this
guys is truly nasty and it is enough to drive some people to the brink
of violence. You just gotta listen to the guy and then form your
opinion. Guys like Big Al are just reacting to this assault like many of
the rest of us would....although lots of us are just afraid to admit it.
He seems like an okay guy if you just do a little listening.

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:36 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on, Big Al is the Good Guy
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 10:58:51 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58jfm1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58hfb8$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Overfelt) wrote:

>You people are playing DUMB.   If you know half as much as YOU have written i
s the previous
>POSTINGS, then you Read THE MAIL often on 3.8945 mhz.

>The real outlaw there is Rich Whiten, WB2OTK now residing in SC.
> He is 50 years old, unemployed, has been fined  $10500 by the
>FCC for exactly the same illegal radio practices he is presently
>doing!  He plays tapes, uses filthy langauge.  Since he has no job,
> he has ALL day and night to Raise Hell on 3.8945 an 14.313 mhz.
>  He has been doing this for ten years.

No, he has been doing it for longer than 10 years. I left the United States 13
years ago, and he was doing it for years before I left.   Unfortunatly we can'
t
hear 3.895 out here in the middle of the Pacific (time difference, not a power
output problem I'm sure).   Could somebody send me some tapes ?

>Stop by 3.8945 and 14.313 and tell Rich Whiten
>what a rotten, low life gutter snipe he is.

That sounds like a great idea. I am sure that will get him to clean up his act
.
How about WA4Dooooooooooog, is he still around too ?

>Adios, Jim WD4JYZ

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:38 1996
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on, Big Al is the Good Guy
Date: 10 Dec 1996 15:34:32 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <58jvu8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58hfb8$[e-mail]>
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In article <58hfb8$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>You people are playing DUMB.   If you know half as much as YOU have written i
s
the previous
>POSTINGS, then you Read THE MAIL often on 3.8945 mhz.
>
>
>The real outlaw there is Rich Whiten, WB2OTK now residing in SC.
> He is 50 years old, unemployed, has been fined  $10500 by the
>FCC for exactly the same illegal radio practices he is presently
>doing!  He plays tapes, uses filthy langauge.  Since he has no job,
> he has ALL day and night to Raise Hell on 3.8945 an 14.313 mhz.
>  He has been doing this for ten years.
>
>He has provoked several, including K4OKA into cussing him
>and then Rich Whiten taped the conversation and now he plays
>the tapes over and over.

He provoked Mike Galego, KA4MUJ into an on-the-air threat. He played that tape

until it wore out. Of course, Mike is no saint either. A couple of years ago
Mike played a tape by Fred, (I can't remember Fred's callsign) In which Fred
offered a $5000 reward to anyone who could prove that WB2OTK had lied on the
air. Mike played this tape every day for about a month straight.

>Stop by 3.8945 and 14.313 and tell Rich Whiten
>what a rotten, low life gutter snipe he is.

Knowing Rich, he'd probably take it as a complement. Besides, why add to an
already deteriorating situation?



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:39 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Henrik Rasmussen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 22:56:25 -0500
Organization: Direct Call, Inc.
Lines: 20
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In article <[e-mail]>, Peter and Colleen McGreevy
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Greetings,
>
>This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
>is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
>clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
>Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
>there, and why nobody has stopped it?


Who do you suggest shoulld stop it? How?

Rik

--
Rik Rasmussen    Raleigh NC USA
[e-mail]     http://users.vnet.net/rik/
amateur radio    WA4BAN


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:40 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Mike D'Alto)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 11:56:28 GMT
Organization: Warwick Online
Lines: 16
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On Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:15:30 -0800, Peter and Colleen McGreevy
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Greetings,
>
>This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
>is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
>clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
>Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
>there, and why nobody has stopped it?
>
>Thanks, Pete - KA2YDY

If you can figure out a way to stop it. . . go for it.
73 es DX,
C. "Mike" D'Alto, K2CD   http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1641


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:41 1996
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From: Peter and Colleen McGreevy <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:15:30 -0800
Organization: IDT
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Greetings,

This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
there, and why nobody has stopped it?

Thanks, Pete - KA2YDY


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:42 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 01:14:19 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <587rtn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

>In article <[e-mail]>, Peter and Colleen McGreevy
><[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Greetings,
>>
>>This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
>>is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
>>clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
>>Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
>>there, and why nobody has stopped it?

Looks like 14.313 has slipped in freq a bit.

   jim,wk1v



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:43 1996
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From: "Peter Gottlieb" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 02:22:44 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <01bbe31c$51b61ee0$77102399@peter-s>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

>. I know this doesn't sound helpful but
> I have no idea how to force enforcement.

Maybe we should go over and "talk" to them?



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Mark Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 03:08:33 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587rtn$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Fri, 06 Dec 1996 01:14:19 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
wrote:

>>In article <[e-mail]>, Peter and Colleen McGreevy
>><[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>>Greetings,
>>>
>>>This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
>>>is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
>>>clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
>>>Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
>>>there, and why nobody has stopped it?
>
>Looks like 14.313 has slipped in freq a bit.
>
>   jim,wk1v
>

It's nothing new folks......


I've been inactive for 5 years, and it was going on the last time I
switched off the rig before I sold.


***************************************************************
* [e-mail]                                     *

*                                                             *
* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
*    Manchester, NH                                           *
***************************************************************
.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:45 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!NEWS!not-for-mail
From: Steve Eklund <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Message-ID: <c57cc$919b.388@NEWS>
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 14:25:11 GMT
Lines: 38

[e-mail] (Mike D'Alto) writes: > On Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:15:30 -0800,
Peter and Colleen McGreevy
> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >Greetings,
> >
> >This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
> >is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
> >clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
> >Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
> >there, and why nobody has stopped it?
> >
> >Thanks, Pete - KA2YDY
>
> If you can figure out a way to stop it. . . go for it.
> 73 es DX,
> C. "Mike" D'Alto, K2CD   http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1641
>


Hmmmm, let's see....75 meter phone is sounding worse than CB
on a bad day, the FCC has been down-sized and do not care,
self-policing is a joke, (what are you going to do, spank
him?) and commercial services are circling our frequencies
like vultures. Sounds like a plan to me, what do you think?
It won't be long now before Congress sells all of the frequency
spectrum to pay for their blunders! Funny, isn't it? They
think they own and can sell something they can't see or touch!
Do they own the radio spectrum, or do we? I wish I could
come up with answers to address the problem, but I can't.
I know one thing, we better do something before it is too late.
One day we will have to pay ATT, MCI, Sprint, or some other
communications giant for every time we key a microphone or
punch on a keyboard.

Just food for thought. What do you think?

Steve, WA3RVT




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:46 1996
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From: Gary Watts <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 11:36:47 -0600
Organization: Suba Communications
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]> <01bbe31c$51b61ee0$77102399@peter-s>
NNTP-Posting-Host: qni.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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To: Peter Gottlieb <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <01bbe31c$51b61ee0$77102399@peter-s>

Oh Peter what are you going to do ?

Talk with them ?

what would you say?

Hit him/her and you go to jail!

threaten him/her and you go to jail and you dont collect 200.00 for
passing go

oh Peter what are you going to do ?

Yep your really going to talk to them.

On 6 Dec 1996, Peter Gottlieb wrote:

> >. I know this doesn't sound helpful but
> > I have no idea how to force enforcement.
>
> Maybe we should go over and "talk" to them?
>
>
>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:47 1996
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 12:40:10 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 39
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Dear "Peter and Colleen":

You do not need to "hunt" for these guys. If you think that, you have
not listened enough to really understand what's going on there. Maybe
you should. All of the participants are well-known, we all know what
their calls are, where they live, etc.

A couple of them HAVE been fined by the FCC in the past. It is likey to
happen again, but it will take a while.

There is a group of people who hang out on the freq every night, and a
roving band of antagonists who drop in virtually every night to make
some trouble. While it sounds like a war, everyone enjoys it. Otherwise,
they would stop. In observing this for a long time, (and being slightly
amused by it, despite the fact that I would never want a potential ham
to hear it), I can tell you that:

1) outside of *perhaps* one person (K4OKA), the group that normally
occupies the frq. does NOT use profanity any more than the rest of the
ham population. The same person does intentionally QRM the "antagonists"
when they are on 3894.5 or other freqs.

2) the antagonists, led by WB2OTK and W4NTI, are extremely nasty and
will say just about anything, so keep your kids away from the radio.
This same group routinely jams the frequency with recordings. WB2OTK
uses the digital recorder on his '850 to repeatedly play very nasty
messages.

I believe that WB2OTK has an outstanding Notice of Apparent Liability
from the FCC with a proposed $10,500 fine. K4OKA has been fined before
and has toned it down some.

If it were not for K4OKA, WB2OTK, and W4NTI, you may hear a bunch of
crazy stuff (which is okay), but rarely would you hear any truly
disgusting dialog, unless you are a puritanical little weenie, intent on
stifling any free communication. I know that there are *plenty* of those
in our ranks. They are just as bad.

73 de Dave K9XK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:48 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 18:43:32 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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References: <[e-mail]>
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X-Admin: [e-mail]

On Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:15:30 -0800, Peter and Colleen McGreevy
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Greetings,
>
>This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL

>is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
>clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
>Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
>there, and why nobody has stopped it?

Just another great example of how well the Morse Code requirement works as
a lid filter.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.dp.beckman.com!inet.dp.beckman.com!newsmaster
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: Don Labriola <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 14:30:57 -0800
Reply-To: [e-mail]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Distribution: world
Organization: DDC, Beckman Instruments, Inc.
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Peter and Colleen McGreevy wrote:
>
> OK,
>
>         I actually just wanted some information outof this original
> posting. Basically, I was looking for answers as to 1-who are these
> people, 2-how long has this been going on, and 3-is anything being done
> about it.  Unfortunately I got some (not all, but some, I also got a lot
> of "any suggestions Pete" replies) replies saying basically "what the
> hell are YOU doing about it."  -I- am doing nothing, but -I- wanted some
> information.  Not sarcasm. As for my suggestions, here you go.
>
...
> I know that the FCC has given up on us, but perhaps we can do a
> little more than we are doing.  We have been doing "fox hunts" for
> decades now, so finding these people is not what I consider "hard."  As
> for people to actually do the work, lets put it this way, a LOT of hams
> are retired.  No insult meant, but they may have time, and they remember
> the "old," more orderly days.  So I dont think that getting "hunters" is
> a terribly large problem.

How about we have the ARRL have a special fox hunt contest with a *real*
fox. Make up a special award for the most stations located or most
accurate
headings for finding them. And give a special AWARD plaque for the top
20
hounds. We can call it a "Save Our Bands" Hunt award => a "SOB Hunt"
award
for short!  ;o)

Seriously, how many of our paper chasers would like to get a special,
limited
issue award for actually helping the hobby and protecting the bands?

With the filing fees for the awards, the next problem could be solved
also!

Only partly jesting... 73's de W6QS - Don Labriola


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: "Peter Gottlieb" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 00:00:10 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

>
> I'm just a little bit pissed. You know.
>


How about getting started by posting signal reports from various locations.
Might be a good way to at least get an idea.

And, those with beams, let's try triangulation.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: John Siegel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 01:03:19 +0000
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; I)

Peter Gottlieb wrote:
>
> >
> > I'm just a little bit pissed. You know.
> >
>
> How about getting started by posting signal reports from various locations.
> Might be a good way to at least get an idea.
>
> And, those with beams, let's try triangulation.Probably good ideas but not n
eeded in my opinion. The major players on this frequency
are not bootleggers. They give their calls and announce they are jamming; henc
e there
is no need to find them. Several of them have been fined in the past but the F
CC has
either reduced the amounts or failed to collect. I know this doesn't sound hel
pful but
I have no idea how to force enforcement.
73 John K4BNC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!207.17.118.2!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: "Peter Gottlieb" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 00:54:36 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <01bbe310$023db140$65102399@peter-s>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

>
> Only partly jesting... 73's de W6QS - Don Labriola
>


Two observations:

        This freq sounds like an urban CB channel with drunk participants

        Based on what I've heard on 3894.5, if the FCC eliminates the ham bands
and
        sells them off, I wouldn't blame them.  A tape of 3894.5 vs. billions of $
??
        A no-brainer!!!  Go for the money!!!




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:31 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58acp0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Peter Gottlieb" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>
>> I'm just a little bit pissed. You know.
>>

Well, you know the old saying, 'Better to be pissed off than pissed on'.

>How about getting started by posting signal reports from various locations.
>Might be a good way to at least get an idea.

>And, those with beams, let's try triangulation.

Wow, you guys got 75 meter beams ???

If the guys on 3.985 are the same guys that use to be on 3.895, you don't have
to triangluate them.  Just look them up in the call book.  But before you jump
in the car to go get them, make sure you buckle up your flack jacket and kiss
Mom and the kids goodbye.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:54 1996
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From: [e-mail] (David Moisan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 04:14:00 GMT
Organization: DM Productions
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]> <01bbe31c$51b61ee0$77102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]>
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Gary Watts <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Oh Peter what are you going to do ?
>
>Talk with them ?
>
>what would you say?
>
>Hit him/her and you go to jail!
>
I can think of lots of things.  No, I don't care if I go to jail.
Why?

Lots of these a**hole hams are, shall we say, "conservative".  They
preach Family Values and Personal Responsibility, even as they
flagrantly flout both of those.  I think I speak for many when I say
I'd like to call them on it.  Extremely.

Starting from confrontation, "You're being an a**hole.  Stop it.
NOW." all the way through physical violence and crashing their towers
through the roofs of their houses.  That just may activate a little
voice in the back of their heads, "you _are_ an asshole, stop it!".
Or was that from their spouse?

Yes, I'd be taken away.  But it'd be worth it, believe me.

Dave

| David Moisan, N1KGH                        Email: [e-mail]  |
| WWW: http://www.shore.net/~dmoisan                [e-mail]    |
| Invisible Disabilities Page:                                         |
| http://www.shore.net/~dmoisan/invisible_disability.html              |




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:55 1996
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From: George Baker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:03:04 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 25
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]>
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Peter and Colleen McGreevy wrote:
>
> Peter Gottlieb wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > I'm just a little bit pissed. You know.
> > >
> >
> > How about getting started by posting signal reports from various locations
.
> > Might be a good way to at least get an idea.
> >
> > And, those with beams, let's try triangulation.
>
> Hey, I'll do it from here, and I'll even call a few friends around the
> states with beams....although somebody said that they already know who
> these folks are.  Anyone else game...er....hunter?

Really now, folks, how many hams do you know with rotary beams on 80
meters with enough gain (read narrow beamwidth) to make triangulation
even possible, much less feasible?

--
73, George
W5YR
Fairview, TX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:56 1996
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From: Timothy Haller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 09:35:34 -0500
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]> <01bbe31c$51b61ee0$77102399@peter-s> <19961207003718336650@[10.0.2.15]>
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In-Reply-To: <19961207003718336650@[10.0.2.15]>

On Sat, 7 Dec 1996, Eric Bear Albrecht wrote:

> Peter Gottlieb <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> > >. I know this doesn't sound helpful but
> > > I have no idea how to force enforcement.
> >
> > Maybe we should go over and "talk" to them?
> >
>
> The legal tool with which a judge orders a sherrif or bureaucrat or
> whatever to do his job is called a "Writ of Mandamus".
>
> ;B
If you think 3894.5 is bad try to listen to 3950 now that is some realy
wonderful stuff to listen to.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: "Peter Gottlieb" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 18:06:03 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <01bbe469$434f7380$27102399@peter-s>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]> <01bbe31c$51b61ee0$77102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

David Moisan <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> Gary Watts <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >what would you say?
> >
> I can think of lots of things.  No, I don't care if I go to jail.
> Why?
>
> Lots of these a**hole hams are, shall we say, "conservative".  They
> preach Family Values and Personal Responsibility, even as they
> flagrantly flout both of those.  I think I speak for many when I say
> I'd like to call them on it.  Extremely.
>
> Starting from confrontation, "You're being an a**hole.  Stop it.
> NOW." all the way through physical violence and crashing their towers
> through the roofs of their houses.  That just may activate a little
> voice in the back of their heads, "you _are_ an asshole, stop it!".
> Or was that from their spouse?
>
> Yes, I'd be taken away.  But it'd be worth it, believe me.
>
> Dave

I like this guy.  If there were more of him this country wouldn't be in
such a mess as it is.
He is right when he notes that so many so-called "conservatives" are
hypocritical, that is,
the values that they preach apply only to others and not themselves.  Lead
by example,
not by empty words!!  If we want to keep the PRIVELEDGE of the amateur
service we
must be willing to stand up for its responsible usage.

Now, I do not profess to know exactly what's going on on these freqs, but
it is obvious that
there are those who are abusing their priveledges.  This needs to be
addressed.

...Peter


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!news.io.com!usenet
From: "Matthew A. Erickson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 08:09:07 -0800
Organization: The-Q-continum
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Mike D'Alto wrote:
>
> On Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:15:30 -0800, Peter and Colleen McGreevy
> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >Greetings,
> >
> >This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
> >is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
> >clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
> >Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
> >there, and why nobody has stopped it?
> >
> >Thanks, Pete - KA2YDY
>
> If you can figure out a way to stop it. . . go for it.
> 73 es DX,
> C. "Mike" D'Alto, K2CD   http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1641
It's the same kind of crazyiness that goes on all day on 14.313mhz, it
just move to 80mtrs after 20mtrs closes for the day.
It's happening everywhere on the ham bands.
A BUNCH OF JERKS !!!!



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:14:59 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Eric Bear Albrecht)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 00:37:18 -0800
Organization: Presto Computers
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <19961207003718336650@[10.0.2.15]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: laplaza.org
X-Newsreader: MacSOUP 2.2b5

Peter Gottlieb <[e-mail]> wrote:

> >. I know this doesn't sound helpful but
> > I have no idea how to force enforcement.
>
> Maybe we should go over and "talk" to them?
>

The legal tool with which a judge orders a sherrif or bureaucrat or
whatever to do his job is called a "Writ of Mandamus".

;B

--
"I'm not a member of any organized political group --
 I'm a Democrat."          -- Will Rogers

Eric Bear Albrecht   W5VZB   [e-mail] / [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:00 1996
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From: Lambda <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 17:21:00 -0500
Organization: Lambda Technologies
Lines: 60
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References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Peter and Colleen McGreevy wrote:
>
> Greetings,
>
> This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
> is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
> clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
> Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
> there, and why nobody has stopped it?
>
> Thanks, Pete - KA2YDY

Well Pete, K4OKA is Big Al Abernethy.  He really is a nice old guy, I
think he is about 73 years old now.  The present crap started a few
years ago when Rich (Pork Butt), WB2OTK had a major falling out with the
guys on 94.5, and all hell broke loose.  The group has decisivly broken
into two groups, the Porkletts and the ARGers (the Abernethy Radio
Group).  Rich decided to jam the hell out of the ARGers and tries to egg
on some of the old timers (including Al) to blow their stacks, causing
them to give him and his cohorts a "radio whipping".  Here's where the
rubber meets the road.

You should know that Rich still has two outstanding Notice of Apparent
Liabilities (NALs) with the FCC for a total of $10,500.  This is from
crap he pulled from his 14.313 days.  Rich doesn't work, and spends
about 18 hours a day on the radio, 7 days a week.  I guess you get a
little looney when all you hear is static 18 hours a day.  He even took
his radio with him on a "safari vacation" trip out west - he just
couldn't let it go.  The bigger question is why doesn't the FCC collect
on the outstanding NAL?  Why aren't the Federal Marshalls stopping by 2
Notch Trail, Anderson, SC and collecting his equipment for auction?

Now, the ARGers aren't exactly angels either.  NALs have been issued to
a couple of the others which were paid in full.  People from Rich's
group (as well as some other loonies) can't seem to pay for thier
mistakes.  Some famous (er - infamous) associates include Walter the
Wino, a W2 out of Edison, NJ who puts out a fabulous musical signal - on
sideband - a really tough engineering feat, but Walter cranks out those
mean Sousa marching band tunes about the first week of every month, and
watch out if there is a full moon during this same time period!

Another loony would inlude Raincoat Charlie of Ocala, FL, the legendary
jammer who not only had to pay $500 of a $2,000 NAL (he didn't have the
money!) but who is also spending some time in the Florida State Pen for
taking indecent liberties with a minor - he was doing naughty things
with Boy Scouts.  It is just shameful that these guys continue to  bring
the level of the service downward.

Some of us have become very good friends.  We have organized, have about
58 members who stay in contact via e-mail lists, we have a homepage, and
we have a new suborganization of 28 elite "Stump Jumpers" who try to
stay above the fray.  So yes, what IS going on there on 94.5...we'd like
to see it cleaned up!  Get rid of Pork Butt and his crew and I think you
will see a major change.

Oh...and by the way.  Are you sure it was K4OKA you heard?  Al received
an OO report dated while he was on vacation out of state.  Pork Butt
made a recording indentifying himself as Al and said a lot of
incriminating stuff.  What a jerk.  ALl I can say is LOOK BEFORE YA
LEAP!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:01 1996
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 19:52:48 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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It's really amazing how all the little lemmings, who have no real
knowledge of what is actually going on on this freq, are talking about
"paying visits" to these so-called "offenders".

If they did an ounce of research on the situation, they would find that
it is exactly as described....one band of people continually coming
around looking for trouble and some guys who occupy that area who won't
back down.

My guess is that all this rubbish about "cleaning up" 3894.5 will go
about as far as the pink plump rumps of these little puritans ever
venture from their keyboards.....not too far.

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:02 1996
From: [e-mail] (Eric Bear Albrecht)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 23:47:50 -0800
Organization: Presto Computers
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <19961207234750218746@[10.0.2.15]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe308$67b24340$0e102399@peter-s> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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George Baker <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> Really now, folks, how many hams do you know with rotary beams on 80
> meters with enough gain (read narrow beamwidth) to make triangulation
> even possible, much less feasible?

I knew of one, years ago, in Ohio -- but it wasn't a "rotary beam"
per se -- it was all made with wire, I think he said 17 miles of it,
and a million feet of wire in the ground system.  All the "rotating"
was done with phasing.  It was awesome.  If he felt like talking
to Australia, he did.  Way too long ago to remember his callsign.

--
"I'm not a member of any organized political group --
 I'm a Democrat."          -- Will Rogers

Eric Bear Albrecht   W5VZB   [e-mail] / [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:03 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 02:20:43 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58ft1r$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

[e-mail] wrote:
: On Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:15:30 -0800, Peter and Colleen McGreevy

: >is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
: >clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
: >Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
: >there, and why nobody has stopped it?

: Just another great example of how well the Morse Code requirement works as
: a lid filter.

No, just a great example that higher class Ham licenses are not a lid filter.
Seems that the passing the advanced theory tests just gives the idiots more
spectrum in which to play.

Do you think such nonsense would go on, if they were limited to CW?  No way!

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:04 1996
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From: "Peter Gottlieb" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 8 Dec 1996 17:16:24 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <01bbe52b$7d51fc20$a00f2399@peter-s>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Dave Burr <[e-mail]> wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
> It's really amazing how all the little lemmings, who have no real
> knowledge of what is actually going on on this freq, are talking about
> "paying visits" to these so-called "offenders".

Ok, since you seem to imply you know the scoop, please let us in on it.
I've been around long enough to know that these kinds of things are seldom
simple or black and white.  I certainly haven't even yet considered putting
the blame on any party.

> My guess is that all this rubbish about "cleaning up" 3894.5 will go
> about as far as the pink plump rumps of these little puritans ever
> venture from their keyboards.....not too far.

Well, I'm certainly no puritan and also no wimp.  I've been doing physical
training and weights for a long time now, BUT, I also know that physical
intimidation will never solve any problem of this sort and I certainly do
NOT
advocate such action.  However, newsgroup discussions and brainstorming
may yet turn up a solution that is acceptable to ALL parties involved.
Grabbing
a few of the combatants and dragging them out for a few beers and having a
heart to heart could be immensely useful, though.

I would not like to see commercial interests grab our bands and diminish
our
freedoms simply because they could make the valid argument that they would
make more productive use than as presently evidenced.  Remember, in
politics
it takes only a few well documented examples to swing attitudes.  I would
really
like it if my kids had the opportunity to become hams, and I fear this is
in
jepardy at the present.

If, as you imply, we should perhaps just throw up our arms and give up,
well, then
of course nothing will ever be accomplished.

...Peter


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:05 1996
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From: Peter and Colleen McGreevy <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 20:24:28 -0800
Organization: IDT
Lines: 13
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Now THAT was what I call an informational posting.  Thanks for the
"scoop" on who's who down there.  I printed your posting out, and
listened in on the freq again, and it all makes sooooo much more sense
now.  And yes, that was the call I heard, at least, I can confirm that
those were the letters used, and used in that sequencee, but as to who
the hell was using them, I haven't a clue.  Hell, I heard some guy up on
the top band about 3 weeks ago identifying (consistantly, in QSO's, and
to people he was talking to, it was hysterical) as WWV.  People were
coming back to him saying "What, A2WWV ???" and he would reply "No, this
is WWV, do you know what time it is?"  Anyways...listening to those folks
I would believe that they just pull calls out of the air.

Pete


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:06 1996
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From: Peter and Colleen McGreevy <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 20:17:50 -0800
Organization: IDT
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Dave Burr wrote:
>
> It's really amazing how all the little lemmings, who have no real
> knowledge of what is actually going on on this freq, are talking about
> "paying visits" to these so-called "offenders".
>


"Little Lemmings," yeah, really awesome constructive commenting on your
part.  Anything MEANINGFUL to add to the thread?


> If they did an ounce of research on the situation, they would find that
> it is exactly as described....one band of people continually coming
> around looking for trouble and some guys who occupy that area who won't
> back down.
>


The whole POINT of this thread was to do a little research on "the
situation" . . . or perhaps that point was missed.



> My guess is that all this rubbish about "cleaning up" 3894.5 will go
> about as far as the pink plump rumps of these little puritans ever
> venture from their keyboards.....not too far.
>


Probably true, this won't end in the "cleaning up" of the frequency, but
it will at least increase the public awareness among hams (little
lemmings, I think you said...) who are unaware, or unable to catch up on
the situation.  Furthermore, as I mentioned before, do you have anything
CONTRUCTIVE or HELPFUL to say, or are YOU satisfied to sit on YOUR "pink
plump rump" (which is probably neither "little" nor "puritan[ical]" and
hide behind your keyboard passing useless criticism.

> Dave
> K9XK

Enough said.

Pete -- KA2YDY


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:07 1996
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 8 Dec 1996 21:25:35 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58fbof$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>It's really amazing how all the little lemmings, who have no real
>knowledge of what is actually going on on this freq, are talking about
>"paying visits" to these so-called "offenders".
>
>If they did an ounce of research on the situation, they would find that
>it is exactly as described....one band of people continually coming
>around looking for trouble and some guys who occupy that area who won't
>back down.
>
>My guess is that all this rubbish about "cleaning up" 3894.5 will go
>about as far as the pink plump rumps of these little puritans ever
>venture from their keyboards.....not too far.
>
>Dave
>K9XK

3894.5 has been a hotspot for about 15 years. I happened on to it when I was
first licensed in '81. At that time it was entertaining, and nothing more.
since then it has gone downhill drastically

Tom
N8ECW



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:08 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:38:34 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58fn2a$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Peter and Colleen McGreevy  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL
>is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
>clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
>Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
>there, and why nobody has stopped it?

If you can only find one (or one dozen) "bad" HF freq'ys out of the
3.75 megaHertz of HF spectrum I'd say we're doing very good.

Now try to find a "bad" freq'y in any of the CW segments.

Jeff KH2PZ (watchdog for J.Mackey's anonymous posts)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:09 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Overfelt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 20:32:38 GMT
Organization: Your Organization
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <58ht16$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58hbav$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: jimo.mine.vt.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

You can't JOIN, membership is closed. ho ho  Unless one might be a Tech Plus!


Doctor Jim


>
>I can't resist.  Jealous cuz you get in there and join 'em?
>
>    jim. wk1v
>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.azstarnet.com!in1.nntp.cais.net!van-bc!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!usenet
From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 17:04:51 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

Peter and Colleen McGreevy wrote:
>
> Dave Burr wrote:
> >
> > It's really amazing how all the little lemmings, who have no real
> > knowledge of what is actually going on on this freq, are talking about
> > "paying visits" to these so-called "offenders".
> >
>
> "Little Lemmings," yeah, really awesome constructive commenting on your
> part.  Anything MEANINGFUL to add to the thread?
>
> > If they did an ounce of research on the situation, they would find that
> > it is exactly as described....one band of people continually coming
> > around looking for trouble and some guys who occupy that area who won't
> > back down.
> >
>
> The whole POINT of this thread was to do a little research on "the
> situation" . . . or perhaps that point was missed.
>
> > My guess is that all this rubbish about "cleaning up" 3894.5 will go
> > about as far as the pink plump rumps of these little puritans ever
> > venture from their keyboards.....not too far.
> >
>
> Probably true, this won't end in the "cleaning up" of the frequency, but
> it will at least increase the public awareness among hams (little
> lemmings, I think you said...) who are unaware, or unable to catch up on
> the situation.  Furthermore, as I mentioned before, do you have anything
> CONTRUCTIVE or HELPFUL to say, or are YOU satisfied to sit on YOUR "pink
> plump rump" (which is probably neither "little" nor "puritan[ical]" and
> hide behind your keyboard passing useless criticism.
>
> > Dave
> > K9XK
>
> Enough said.
>
> Pete -- KA2YDY

Pete:

I am sorry that you view my reply as unconstructive. After all, the
point is to "find out what is going on on 3894.5 and to do something
about it", right?

Well, some of us have *some* idea what is going on and judge somewhat
harshly those uninformed stone-throwers that love to jump on any
seemingly politically-correct bandwagon. Just look at the responses
to your post! These reactionaries are far more dangerous than a bunch of
guys hanging around on the radio having fun.

You are right about my rump....I do NOT see myself as some puritan out
to save the world from anyone who, in my infinite wisdom (read:20
seconds of listening) is a danger to amateur radio. Never have....never
will.

Dave


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.152.0.23!news.atl.bellsouth.net!usenet
From: james o'brien <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 21:19:04 -0800
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe52b$7d51fc20$a00f2399@peter-s>
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To: Peter Gottlieb <[e-mail]>

If you want to blame someone for this mess try the fcc. The main jerk
whipping all this up is richard whiten,wb2otk. This individual skipped
out on a 10,500$ nal that was issued for guess what? That's right,qrming.
He is representative of the downfall of ham radio right into the gutter.
You can either stand by or try to get this idiot in conformance with part
97. Our court system can't even get this idiot to pay his fine much less
conform to arule or regulation. And believe me, the fcc will point to
this mess and use it to justify the sale of your spectrum. So everyone
should try to blame who is responsible. In order 1.wb2otk,2.fcc,3.
uninformed people who add to the qrm and don't give a callsign,which is
about 90% of the people on this frequency. KD4CDB


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.152.0.23!news.atl.bellsouth.net!usenet
From: james o'brien <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 22:00:29 -0800
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d01356.atl.bellsouth.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-BSNET  (Win16; U)

james o'brien wrote:
>
> well put! 73 Jim stumpjumper 27After weighing the pros and cons I think its
time as amateurs we act to
straighten out this frequency. Here is the track I am on. WB2OTK, Rich
Whiten,is still under investigation by the commission. Therefore,I urge
fellow amateurs to make tapes,submit petitions,provide evidence and do
anything in their power to have Richs liscense revoked. I,personally,have
contacted my local congressman and he was VERY interested in this case.
Obvious violations of the law,such as a terroristic threat, can be
submitted immediately to your local US attorney for prosecution. The
league is also an outlet,official observers can augment the fcc
monitoring that is already taking place. If we all pull together we can
get this qrmer off the air. He uses his equipment for jamming only,20
hours a day. It is high time for us to try to get this stain off us ham
radio. It will take some time, but with vigilance,it can be fixed. Thanks
for your time. KD4CDB


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: Larry or David Gibbs <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 3894.5 Conspiracy Theory
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 20:44:33 -0800
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-234-170.pa.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Maybe the commercial interests are the ones doing their thing om
75 meters so as to set up a scenario whereby they can grab the
frequencies.

Consumer Reports has the opinion that frequency bands belong to
the public -- like AIR.

Larry, W3UIO


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](au)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3894.5 Conspiracy Theory
Date: 7 Dec 1996 19:46:53 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <58chjd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: eug-or3-38.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 07 11:46:53 AM PST 1996

In <[e-mail]> Larry or David Gibbs <[e-mail]>
writes:
>
>Maybe the commercial interests are the ones doing their thing om
>75 meters so as to set up a scenario whereby they can grab the
>frequencies.
>
>Consumer Reports has the opinion that frequency bands belong to
>the public -- like AIR.
>
>Larry, W3UIO

Thats a conspriacy theory?  How about something more in the line of the
commercial interests operating there and attempting to get squatters
rights in the future? They might just get grandfathered in!




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!sonysjc!sonybc!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3CX800 Tubes - Best Place to buy?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:14:49 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <58jgjv$[e-mail]>
References: <58hqdg$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-170.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Ron Grandmaison <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Who has the cheapest price on new 3CX800s??

Nobody. You didn't blow them puppies up did you ????





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: ko4qc <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 5/8" UHF or 'N' connectors needed
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 13:02:21 -0500
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc083039.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32543 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43971 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120133

I have some 5/8" Times Fiber/Mirror 50ohm hard line.Model T10-50.I need
some connectors for this,preferably UHF but can make 'N' type work.If
you have any of these or can suggest a source please reply.
                                   Thanks,
                                   Joel(KO4QC)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 51 STATES  DISPUTE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:55:00 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbe0c4$9074b4c0$8a7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Good thing I wrote that page, otherwise this newsgroup page would be empty.


Sorry, to all the real hams for having to put up with the critics.

By the time the pro-amateur hams get done complaining about the 51 states
'OPINION'
the FCC should have given away the rest of the bands left.  Then we will
all be internet
amateurs.  Or maybe they can use their writing skills and E-mail the FCC
instead.





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!uwm.edu!news.he.net!flesh.fly.net!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 96 01:44:20 EST
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: [e-mail] (Diogenes)
Comments: This message did not originate from the address above.  It was remailed by an anonymous remailing service.  If you have questions or complaints, please direct them to <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.stupidity,alt.flame,alt.usenet.kooks
Subject: Re: 51 STATES  DISPUTE
References: <01bbe0c4$9074b4c0$8a7074cf@default>
Mail-To-News-Contact: [e-mail]
Organization: [e-mail]
Lines: 30
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119511 alt.stupidity:86432 alt.flame:351174 alt.usenet.kooks:53566

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Good thing I wrote that page, otherwise this newsgroup page would be empty.
>
> Sorry, to all the real hams for having to put up with the critics.
>
> By the time the pro-amateur hams get done complaining about the 51 states
> 'OPINION'
> the FCC should have given away the rest of the bands left.  Then we will
> all be internet
> amateurs.  Or maybe they can use their writing skills and E-mail the FCC
> instead.

Why bother with ham radio when you can peddle pagers, exhibit your
ignorance of geography (by claiming that your pagers "work in all
*51* states") globally, flame those who good-naturedly attempted to
point out your mistake, and flame all of your fellow hams in Guam in
the process by saying "Guam sucks" and "flush twice, it's a long way
to Guam".  I doubt that any of those activities will do much to
"save the bands" which you profess to be concerned about.

I'm sure your continuing tirades are much easier for you to post
than to simply admit that you were *WRONG* about the number of
states in the USA.  <g> (If you're in doubt, visit your nearest
school or post office and COUNT THE STARS on the flag!)

Sorry you don't like "critics".  Maybe you'd be happier living in a
dictatorship somewhere.  If you don't want criticism, don't make
outlandish claims on a forum with WORLDWIDE distribution.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!demos!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!mr.net!winternet.com!n1ott.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.stupidity,alt.flame,alt.usenet.kooks
Subject: Re: 51 STATES  DISPUTE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:10:46 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <581ja6$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c4$9074b4c0$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119535 alt.stupidity:86448 alt.flame:351255 alt.usenet.kooks:53602

[e-mail] (Diogenes) wrote:


>I'm sure your continuing tirades are much easier for you to post
>than to simply admit that you were *WRONG* about the number of
>states in the USA.  <g> (If you're in doubt, visit your nearest
>school or post office and COUNT THE STARS on the flag!)

I doubt he can count to 50. That's probably why he's in the beeper business.
He probably can't count much higher than his pen name.

73, Jim KH2D







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.124.68.65!news1.gte.net!usenet
From: Clyde Young <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 51 STATES  DISPUTE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 04:32:38 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c4$9074b4c0$8a7074cf@default>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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> By the time the pro-amateur hams get done complaining about the 51 states
> 'OPINION'
> the FCC should have given away the rest of the bands left.

Excuse me, but when did we add a 51st state and what is it?

Clyde
KF5QU


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 51 STATES  DISPUTE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:08:00 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <581j51$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c4$9074b4c0$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Good thing I wrote that page, otherwise this newsgroup page would be empty.


>Sorry, to all the real hams for having to put up with the critics.

>By the time the pro-amateur hams get done complaining about the 51 states
>'OPINION'
>the FCC should have given away the rest of the bands left.  Then we will
>all be internet
>amateurs.  Or maybe they can use their writing skills and E-mail the FCC
>instead.

Make that $52.50.







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!142.92.36.86!crc-news.doc.ca!usenet
From: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 51 STATES  DISPUTE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 13:00:24 -0800
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c4$9074b4c0$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cummings.jim.dgrb004.ic.gc.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

Clyde Young wrote:
>
> > By the time the pro-amateur hams get done complaining about the 51 states
> > 'OPINION'
> > the FCC should have given away the rest of the bands left.
>
> Excuse me, but when did we add a 51st state and what is it?
>
> Clyde
> KF5QU

I think it is Guam...  but I am not sure...

73 and live better digitally
Jim, VE3XJ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!enews.sgi.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Roland R. McCormick III" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 6 meters questions
Date: 4 Dec 1996 06:07:58 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbe1a9$616a4e20$4f08b8cd@RMcorm656>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sav-ga2-15.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 04 12:07:58 AM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

        There aren't many operators here in my QTH that operate six meters, but a
few friends of mine are planning on trying to start some activity.  What
kind of range can I expect out of well tuned 6 meter mobile rig.   I plan
on getting a Standard C5900 that will have max output of 45 watts (FM) on 6
meters.  Eventually I would like to branch out into SSB and CW on 6 meters?

        Thanks in advance for your advice.  They are appreciated and perhaps
someday I will be able to answer someone else's question.


--
Roland R. McCormick III
KF4LMT
Savannah, Georgia


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:23 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: 6 meters questions
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <5847b7$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 20:00:27 GMT
Lines: 39

In article <5847b7$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Dave
 Finley) writes:
>DON'T get an FM-only rig for six meters -- you'll miss out on all the
>real fun of this band.  With SSB and CW, you can work across the U.S.
>during Sporadic-E openings and around the world when the sunspots
>hit their peak in a few years.  Sporadic-E openings occur frequently
>in June and July and also around the end of December every year,
>regardless of the sunspot cycle.  Just listen on the calling frequency
>of 50.125 and wait for the DX to come rolling in.

Don't just listen, put out a call from time to time too. Band openings
are frequently totally missed because everyone is just listening and
no one is calling.

>Depending on where you live, you might get some Auroral propagation.
>If you want to invest in power and antennas, you can try meteor-scatter
>or even EME on six.  But none of this fun comes on FM.

And if analog modes aren't your cup of tea, try meteor scatter with
data modes. Use GMSK or PSK, use high speed (9.6 kb or 19.2 kb), and
set retries to infinity. If you can implement memory ARQ, do that.
An FM transmitter can suffice (Manchester Code), but you'll need a SSB
receiver. A microsat ground station should offer most of what you need.
The ordinary sporadic meteors that fall to Earth every hour of every
day are sufficient for a 100 watt station with a 3-el beam to do
consistent contacts out to about 1500 miles. You don't have to wait
for one of the showers required for analog modes. Government hydrographic
stations do it every day just outside our 6m band. We can do it too.

Obviously you'll want to make schedules for this sort of activity
since it isn't yet common on the amateur bands. Here's a chance to
do some amateur pioneering at little cost. And it can be a worthwhile
alternative to HF Skipnet activity for data forwarding.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-15.sprintlink.net!news.whidbey.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Dave Schertzer)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 900mhz + Dummy load?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 21:35:15 GMT
Organization: WhidbeyNet
Lines: 11
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <58kl2j$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: asn136.whidbey.net
X-Newsreader: News for Windows NT X1.0-92
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32589 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120256

Have a Motorola Moster mobile 800/900mhz rig but, No ant?
Will a normal "dummy load" work to test them fer TX/RX?
Has a connection fer a PL259 on the back.
Or, does anyone have a CHEAP ant  ($5.00)
Plse any info reguarding this subj.    dave

Oak Harbor,WA
98277
[e-mail]
de VE7-LFA/W7



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (John R. Cunliffe)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 01:15:10 GMT
Organization: Frontier Internet Rochester N.Y. (716)-777-SURF
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <587ro1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr0-17.dial.roc.frontiernet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119733 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43881

[e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow) wrote:


<junk sniped away>

>It is obvious that some compromise needs to be made on the issue. This
>is my proposal. Before the current generals start raising can about
>losing 125 kHz of spectrum, please consider that there will be plenty
>of time to upgrade before a plan like this goes into effect. Also the
>international regulations would first need to be modified to permit a
>no-code HF ticket.

>73 de n4jvp
>Fritz

Hmmm, I wonder how that proposal would have lookt if Fritz would be a
Tech or would not studdy for his Advance license?




>To reply to this message, please remove the
>underscore from the beginning of the reply to
>address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 6 Dec 1996 04:43:12 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
(A.G. von Luternow) writes:

>Before the current generals start raising can about
>losing 125 kHz of spectrum, please consider that there will be plenty
>of time to upgrade before a plan like this goes into effect.

I have monitored this thread and continued to stay out of the mess.  But
now my toes are being steped on under your proposal.  Why should I have to
upgrade to keep spectrum from being taken away? I worked VERY hard for the
GENERAL ticket and HF phone  privaledges that it carries. If you want
themasses to HF phone privaledges let them do as I did and WORK for it.

L. B. Lockhart   KC5NVY  Houston, Tx.  USA


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.94.215.18!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 22:40:08 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga13-01.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 05  4:41:07 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119799 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43904


1 - scrap the current general class theory exam and replace it with
the advanced class theory. Replace the current advanced class exam
with a more difficult exam.  As it stands now I think both the general
and advanced class exams are too easy. (I am studying for the
advanced)
2 - the no-code HF ticket would not be entry level. A minimum of one
years operation holding a lesser class license would be a requirement
whether it be a novice, a no-code tech or a tech plus.
3 - the current HF band plan be modified such that each of the
advanced class phone segments shall be expanded by  25 kHz. If the
segments of the bands currently reserved for CW, RTTY and digital
modes are to be reduced and those portions of the spectrum are to be
added to the phone segments, the extra, advanced and general (no-code)
segments would increase in size by 50/30/20% respectively. If 100 kHz
of a CW segment is to be change to phone, then the extra class
sub-band would get 50 more kHz etc.
4 - current general class ticket holders will not be grand-fathered
into advanced class licenses.
5 - no licensee will be grandfathered into a no-code HF license
6 - the novice class license returns to a non-renewable state
7 - the no-code tech exam will be increased in difficulty but will not
be the same as the new no-code general class exam.
8 - the tech plus exam will be the same as no-code tech exam with the
addition of the 5 wpm test
9 - the licensing authority (FCC) will take a more active role in
maintaining proper conduct on the bands either through general
monitoring or else following up on complaints filed with the FCC by
OOs. (Does the ARRL still have the Official Observer program?)
Some sort of valid policing needs to be done now!

novice ticket - 5 wpm, current novice exam, non-renewable, good for 1
or 2 years, no change in spectrum or modes
no-code tech - 0 wpm, current general exam w/slight increase of
difficulty, no change in spectrum or modes
tech-plus - 5 wpm, current general exam w/slight increase of
difficulty, combination of novice and no-tech privileges
general - 0 wpm, current advanced class license exam, all legal modes,
spectrum allocation as modified by #3 above, not entry level
advanced - 13 wpm, difficulty of current exam increased, all legal
modes, spectrum allocation as modified by #3 above
extra - no changes from current status

It is obvious that some compromise needs to be made on the issue. This
is my proposal. Before the current generals start raising can about
losing 125 kHz of spectrum, please consider that there will be plenty
of time to upgrade before a plan like this goes into effect. Also the
international regulations would first need to be modified to permit a
no-code HF ticket.

73 de n4jvp
Fritz






To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:30 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:13 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 68
Message-ID: <58acof$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119823 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43916

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>Several proposals for no-code licenses have been made ... most have been
>summarily rejected by the rabid pro-coders ...

Puuuuuleeeze, Squiggie.  Translation: Rabid pro-coders = anyone who doesn't
agree with Squiggie.

>Some were far to condescending to the pro-coders for my tastes ...

Puuuuuleeeze, Squiggie.

>I don't mean to sound "radical" ...

Then stop typing and cancel your internet account.

> ... but I'm sick and tired
>of people coming in and trying to be the "peacemaker" with the "Well, we
>have to figure out a compromise that everyone can agree to ..."  shpiel.

Translation:  All for nothing, or nothing for all. The cry of the Squiggie.

>This actually *is* a war ... it's been shaping up for a LONG time ...
>I've been licensed for over 20 years and I've argued that whole time for
>the elimination of the CW *test* requirement ... I am not alone,

You made it a war.   To the rest of us, it's just a hobby.  It's a war to you
because you are interested in war more than you are interested in ham radio.
You've already told us you have forgotten more theory in one day than the rest

of us will ever know.  You've already told us that at one time your code speed

was up to 20 wpm.  What you haven't told us is why you didn't put those two
things together and get an HF ticket.   So we can only assume that you are
having more fun whining about not having one than you would have had you
gotten one when you could.

>there are many, many of us no-code *test* advocates ...  and I've said
>the entire time that "I'll defend to the death *your* right to pound
>brass if you'lll defend my right to choose not to ..."

That's a compromise.  You already said you don't want compromise.
Translation: I will defend to the death your right to your opinion, as long as
it is the same as my opinion.

>Anyway, any compromise that satisfies the rabid pro-coders will not go
>far enough in modernizing the ARS to bring in the technical folks we so
>desperately need to develop new, more spectrally efficient technologies,
>will not bring in enough of the "new blood" we need to help grow our
>numbers for political clout, will not modernize the rules and eliminate
>the unnecesssary barriers to new technologies, and will not assure our
>future survival in the face of ever-increasing pressures on spectrum
>resources by the rapidly growing demand for a wide variety of commercial
>communications services and systems ...  so SCREW the pro-coders!!! ...

Translation:  All for nothing or nothing for all.

>nobody is telling them they can't beep ...  but they've had their way
>far too long and ham radio has suffered greatly from it ...  ham radio's
>very future survival is in danger and we HAVE to make the necessary
>changes NOW *before* it's too late ...

Translation: The end is near (or at least that's what we want you to believe)
.
We can save you = We want to get on HF to see what it's like before it's too
late.   Please feel sorry for us and grant us this death wish.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 01:06:10 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58afpr$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-121.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>I have monitored this thread and continued to stay out of the mess.  But
>now my toes are being steped on under your proposal.  Why should I have to
>upgrade to keep spectrum from being taken away? I worked VERY hard for the
>GENERAL ticket and HF phone  privaledges that it carries. If you want
>themasses to HF phone privaledges let them do as I did and WORK for it.

>L. B. Lockhart   KC5NVY  Houston, Tx.  USA

I'm with you, Mr. Lockhart. I think Squiggy and Lenny should both get off thie
r
non-beeping butts and WORK for something for a change.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:33 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 01:39:22 GMT
Lines: 13
Sender: [e-mail]

[e-mail] wrote:

: I have monitored this thread and continued to stay out of the mess.  But
: now my toes are being steped on under your proposal.  Why should I have to
: upgrade to keep spectrum from being taken away? I worked VERY hard for the
: GENERAL ticket and HF phone  privaledges that it carries. If you want
: themasses to HF phone privaledges let them do as I did and WORK for it.

Exactly the same thing happened the last time that incentive licensing came
around.  I'm still taking tests to recover spectrum that was rightfully mine
in 1966.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:35 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 01:56:27 GMT
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Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119846 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43924

John ([e-mail]) wrote:

: anyone can memorize the test questions give enough time and trys.. you
: need to change the method its given... get rid of exact question pools
: to study for starters...

Even if the question pools remained public, better answers could be
designed.  Even on the Extra exam, usually two of the four answers to a
given question are way out in left field, if one has tried to study the
theory at all.

: > 6 - the novice class license returns to a non-renewable state

: what would that gain? Some operator are happy with its privileges. Are
: you going to make them go back to Xtal control too? (I used Xtal control
: when I started in 1970)

The Novice ticket never should have been made renewable, if there was to be
an *incentive* to incentive licensing.  By the same token, the no-code
Technician ticket should be good for no more than five years; also
non-renewable.  Both are *entry-level* licenses for HF and VHF,
respectively.

In practicality, how many hams are there who are Novices?  Out of 183 in our
club, only one is a Novice.  After working with our VE team for the past 18
months, I have yet to see anyone test for only the Novice ticket.

73 de Jim - KF6CR





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:37 1996
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From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 6 Dec 1996 06:36:32 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <588etg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-25.dialup.ais.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119857 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43928

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (A.G. von Luter
now) writes:
>On Fri, 06 Dec 1996 01:15:10 GMT, [e-mail] (John R.
>Cunliffe) wrote:
>>
>>Hmmm, I wonder how that proposal would have lookt if Fritz would be a
>>Tech or would not studdy for his Advance license?
>>
>I don't know but I have yet to see anyone else make any sort of
>proposal that attempts to resolve the on-going feud. I would most
>certainly like to see any proposal that you or anyone else might have
>that attempts to bring both sides to  a common ground that is not a
>battlefield.

Several proposals for no-code licenses have been made ... most have been
summarily rejected by the rabid pro-coders ...

Some were far to condescending to the pro-coders for my tastes ...

I don't mean to sound "radical" ... I'm actually a political
conservative and a responsible professional ...  and I don't mean to
be personally insulting to you in response to your commments above
(really, *please* don't take this that way) ... but I'm sick and tired
of people coming in and trying to be the "peacemaker" with the "Well, we
have to figure out a compromise that everyone can agree to ..."  shpiel.

This actually *is* a war ... it's been shaping up for a LONG time ...
I've been licensed for over 20 years and I've argued that whole time for
the elimination of the CW *test* requirement ... I am not alone,
there are many, many of us no-code *test* advocates ...  and I've said
the entire time that "I'll defend to the death *your* right to pound
brass if you'lll defend my right to choose not to ..."

This newsgroup was (primarily) started to provide a place for the
code/no-code debate (and other subjects considered to "flame-prone" for
the other groups ...) ... lots of articles/threads on this subject end
up getting posted or cross-posted to .misc, too ... and that doesn't
bother me one bit ... 'cause .misc seems to be carried more widely than
policy and I don't approve of "burying" this topic in some second-class
rathole just to stifle the debate ... (sort of like the way QST never
provides any real space for any idea that doesn't fit with Sumner &
Co.'s world view ...)

Anyway, any compromise that satisfies the rabid pro-coders will not go
far enough in modernizing the ARS to bring in the technical folks we so
desperately need to develop new, more spectrally efficient technologies,
will not bring in enough of the "new blood" we need to help grow our
numbers for political clout, will not modernize the rules and eliminate
the unnecesssary barriers to new technologies, and will not assure our
future survival in the face of ever-increasing pressures on spectrum
resources by the rapidly growing demand for a wide variety of commercial
communications services and systems ...  so SCREW the pro-coders!!! ...
nobody is telling them they can't beep ...  but they've had their way
far too long and ham radio has suffered greatly from it ...  ham radio's
very future survival is in danger and we HAVE to make the necessary
changes NOW *before* it's too late ...

I hope that you will come to understand that there will be a battle over
this, that it is necessary and unavoidable, and that you will be on the
side of modernization and securing the future survival of ham radio.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:38 1996
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From: [e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 96 05:39:57 GMT
Organization: InterNex Information Services 1-800-595-3333
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Message-ID: <58avqg$[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>,
   [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) wrote:
>The Novice ticket never should have been made renewable, if there was to be
>an *incentive* to incentive licensing.  By the same token, the no-code
>Technician ticket should be good for no more than five years; also
>non-renewable.

Well that would effectively keep anyone not interested in the code from
getting into ham radio in the first place.  Is that what you want?

For those who could not develop the necessary code speed in the appointed
time, it would mean being kicked out of the hobby after having invested
several years in it.  I cannot understand why you would want to do that.

Andy Nourse - KC1IP


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:39 1996
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From: The Bakers <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:55:59 -0500
Organization: Monmouth Internet
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

Jim Lowman wrote:
>
> Exactly the same thing happened the last time that incentive licensing came
> around.  I'm still taking tests to recover spectrum that was rightfully mine
> in 1966.
>
> 73 de Jim - KF6CR

I thought that the lawful ability to transmit upon, thereby utilizing
the radio spectrum, was a *privilege* not a *right*.  Much like a
driver's license & driving on public roads.

I will agree that we may have earned the privilege by virtue of
demonstrating Morse Code proficiency, passing technical exams, etc.
But a right ?  Sorry, don't think so.......

Can you indicate where transmitting on amateur radio frequencies is
protected in the Bill of Rights ?

Just curious,
M. Baker, WA3ZXO
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:40 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58avqg$[e-mail]>
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Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119922 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43948

The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force ([e-mail]) wrote:
: In article <[e-mail]>,
:    [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) wrote:
: >The Novice ticket never should have been made renewable, if there was to be
: >an *incentive* to incentive licensing.  By the same token, the no-code
: >Technician ticket should be good for no more than five years; also
: >non-renewable.

: Well that would effectively keep anyone not interested in the code from
: getting into ham radio in the first place.  Is that what you want?

I'd like to see more upgrading.  If someone *really* wants to remain a
Technician and have a renewable ticket, perhaps what we need is either to:

a) continue to require a 5-wpm code test, making the Tech+ the only
renewable Technician license, or

b) require passing the General theory, or a reworked exam specific to the
modes above 50 MHz of equivalent difficulty, with no code requirement

: For those who could not develop the necessary code speed in the appointed
: time, it would mean being kicked out of the hobby after having invested
: several years in it.  I cannot understand why you would want to do that.

Suppose that a) above became the norm, with the no-code ticket having a
lifetime of five years and being non-renewable.  Are you saying that there
would be hams who couldn't learn a lousy 5-wpm over a five-year term?
Or upgrade otherwise under plan b?

Sorry, I don't buy your argument.  When I was a Novice in 1966, I knew that
I had one year to upgrade, or go off the air.  I know that if I don't pass
my 20-wpm code exam by next September, I lose credit for passing my Extra
written element.  The ball is in my court.  The situation is entirely in my
own hands, and losing credit would be no one's fault but my own.

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:41 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 22:57:29 GMT
Lines: 19
Sender: [e-mail]

The Bakers ([e-mail]) wrote:

: I thought that the lawful ability to transmit upon, thereby utilizing
: the radio spectrum, was a *privilege* not a *right*.  Much like a
: driver's license & driving on public roads.

: I will agree that we may have earned the privilege by virtue of
: demonstrating Morse Code proficiency, passing technical exams, etc.
: But a right ?  Sorry, don't think so.......

: Can you indicate where transmitting on amateur radio frequencies is
: protected in the Bill of Rights ?

OK, ya got me...poor choice of words.  :-)

I had earned the *privilege* of transmitting on certain frequencies, and that
privilege was denied to me in part, through no wrongdoing of my own.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:42 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 9 Dec 1996 02:39:24 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <58fu4s$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120029 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43974

Carl Stevenson ([e-mail]) wrote:

: This actually *is* a war ... it's been shaping up for a LONG time ...
: I've been licensed for over 20 years and I've argued that whole time for
: the elimination of the CW *test* requirement ... I am not alone,
: there are many, many of us no-code *test* advocates ...  and I've said
: the entire time that "I'll defend to the death *your* right to pound
: brass if you'lll defend my right to choose not to ..."

But, apparently still in the minority. A sizeable majority of ARRL members
are in favor of continuing the code requirements - even though the ARRL
board itself appears to be in favor of getting rid of the requirement.

Even when the non-ARRL hams are factored in, it is still about 55%-40% in
favor of the code requirement. The other 5% are undecided, or don't care
to express an opinion.

Just because you have to pass the CW requirement, does not mean that you
have to use it.

: Anyway, any compromise that satisfies the rabid pro-coders will not go
: far enough in modernizing the ARS to bring in the technical folks we so
: desperately need to develop new, more spectrally efficient technologies,
: will not bring in enough of the "new blood" we need to help grow our
: numbers for political clout, will not modernize the rules and eliminate
: the unnecesssary barriers to new technologies, and will not assure our
: future survival in the face of ever-increasing pressures on spectrum
: resources by the rapidly growing demand for a wide variety of commercial
: communications services and systems ...  so SCREW the pro-coders!!! ...
: nobody is telling them they can't beep ...  but they've had their way
: far too long and ham radio has suffered greatly from it ...  ham radio's
: very future survival is in danger and we HAVE to make the necessary
: changes NOW *before* it's too late ...

That is a silly argument. The new technologies can be developed above
30 MHz. As such, you already have a no-code license. No more is needed
for research into new technologies/techniques.

I haven't seen a flood of new blood doing research. All I have seen is a
bunch of no-code Hams who use 2 meters like the CB band.

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 9 Dec 1996 07:56:03 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
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In article <58fu4s$[e-mail]>, Bill Nelson <[e-mail]> wrote:

>But, apparently still in the minority. A sizeable majority of ARRL members
>are in favor of continuing the code requirements - even though the ARRL
>board itself appears to be in favor of getting rid of the requirement.

I predict that the ARRL will eventually support the elimination of CW
testing for HF access for the '99 conference.

In the mid-80's, a similar poll was taken of ARRL members, and an
overwhelming majority of ARRL members supported retention of the CW
licensing requirement for all ham bands. Nonetheless, the ARRL
supported the VHF codeless license (albeit in a different form than
it is today) despite the wishes of the membership.

The people running the ARRL are not stupid. They know where the
gravy train is. They don't want to have to go out in the real world
and get a real job (hi Ed!) after having that nice comfy job in
Newington. If that means they can increase sales of study materials
and other book sales (how many pages in the latest issue of QST?)
than they will support it.

Remember the addage: "Follow the money".


>I haven't seen a flood of new blood doing research. All I have seen is a
>bunch of no-code Hams who use 2 meters like the CB band.

Yup. And soon they'll all be on HF calling for elimination of those
"hard" theory examinations that restrict their access to certain power
limits and segments of the bands.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:44 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 13:47:23 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
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Jim Kehler wrote:
> Please feel sorry for us and grant us this death wish...

... before next March when the giant comet arrives.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 04:50:34 GMT
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In a post to r.r.a.policy titled "Re: Code and Part 97
On 30 Nov 1996 18:50:01 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>is a "journeyman" ... neither class hinges ANY privs on CW proficiency
>.. though CW continues to be permitted ANYWHERE in the ham bands ...
>and perhaps the bottom 25kHz of each band is made CW exclusive ... with
>a review every 10 years to see if that continues to be justified ... no
>sense in blocking out the bottom 25 kHz of every band 50 years from now
>if there are only a dozen people left who have any interest in CW,
>

What is "CW exclusive" intended to mean?
        1 - CW-only sub-band
        2 - CW, RTTY and digital mode sub-band
If the intended meaning is number one, why is it necessary to
eliminate RTTY and digital modes from this 25 kHz?
If the intended meaning is number two, what does the following mean?

On 6 Dec 1996 00:25:55 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>Nobody has proposed reducing the digital (CW/RTTY/PACKET/etc.)
>segments, not increasing the phone (SSB) segments ...  I imagine that,
>with desirable rules changes, there will be digital systems carrying a
>mix of voice and data traffic operating where digital systems are
>permitted (the entire band) ... SSB would continue to be restricted to
>the (current) "phone" bands ...
>

To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:46 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Michael P. Deignan ([e-mail]) wrote:

: In the mid-80's, a similar poll was taken of ARRL members, and an
: overwhelming majority of ARRL members supported retention of the CW
: licensing requirement for all ham bands. Nonetheless, the ARRL
: supported the VHF codeless license (albeit in a different form than
: it is today) despite the wishes of the membership.

And I wonder if they have come to regret that position?  If our club (~185
members) is a representative sample, the no-coders are *not* joining ARRL in
any significant number.  They are also dying on that class of license.  If
the no-code Technician license was intended to be entry level, and the term
"incentive licensing" still holds any meaning, then ARRL's view to the
future is not very accurate.

Obviously, if more no-coders were ARRL members, the results of the vote
might well be different.

: The people running the ARRL are not stupid. They know where the
: gravy train is. They don't want to have to go out in the real world
: and get a real job (hi Ed!) after having that nice comfy job in
: Newington. If that means they can increase sales of study materials
: and other book sales (how many pages in the latest issue of QST?)
: than they will support it.

: Remember the addage: "Follow the money".

Again, they may be selling more "Now You're Talking" books, but aren't
getting members in any number.

: >I haven't seen a flood of new blood doing research. All I have seen is a
: >bunch of no-code Hams who use 2 meters like the CB band.

One of the arguments that is often heard on these newsgroups, is that the
code requirement is "keeping brilliant people who will enhance the state of
the art" out of ham radio.  I haven't noticed this among our club's
no-coders, or those who get their license through our VE team.

: Yup. And soon they'll all be on HF calling for elimination of those
: "hard" theory examinations that restrict their access to certain power
: limits and segments of the bands.

That's just human nature, especially in these "I want it all, and I want it
now" times.  How long do you suppose it would be, once no-code Generals
overwhelmed the voice subbands, that they would want the CW/digital subbands
for phone, "because CW is outdated?"

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:48 1996
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From: [e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 96 03:50:43 GMT
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In article <58i3le$[e-mail]>,
   [e-mail](Glenn Sparks) wrote:
>I think the code should be required if you plan to use it or not.
>No, learning the code isn't easy,

You don't know the half of it!

>but if something is important to you, you will expend the effort.

I did, and I have an Advanced license just as you have.  And because ham
radio is important to me, I am expending further effort to see that the
hobby survives, which it won't if we are seen as the Archaic Radio Service.

>Learning theory to build a transmitter wasn't easy either, not
>copy ARRL plans but to build one with existing componants, but I wanted
>to do it, so I learned.

You did it because YOU WANTED TO!  That's different.

>Learning organic chemistry wasn't easy either, but the degree was important,
so I learned it, haven't used it, but I learned it.

Wouldn't your education have been more useful to you if you could have
taken a more relevent course in its place?

>It took me over 50 hours of concentrated effort to pass the 13 wpm

That's NOTHING compared to what many of us had to do to pass it.

>If it is important to you to get the license then quit complaining and
>learn the code,  you can if you want to

I did, to what appears to be the full extent of my ability to do so.
In my case that was enough to just pass the 13 wpm (once the solid-copy
requirement had been done away with).  It was so nearly impossible for
me that it might actually BE impossible for someone else is believable.

>The more you have to work for something the more you will value it.

But for those who have an aptitude for it and enjoy it, Morse Code is not
work at all.

For those who don't enjoy it, it is hazing.
"Work" generally implies that the effort generates something useful,
failing that it acquires modifiers, e.g.: "make-work" and "busy-work".
If they also lack the aptitude for it, they will merely struggle with it
and fail.

Then there are those of us who enjoy it, but have little aptitude for it.
We do it every day, but our speed never increases.  Most other CW operators
shun us, and got the League and the FCC to kick us off the DX frequencies
to give us "incentives" to do what we have been struggling to do anyway.

>I don't care if CW is outdated.

You should.

>I want people on the air that wanted a license enough to WORK for it.

So to make sure everybody has to WORK at it, you want to keep a requirement
around for a skill that is so archaic as to have no use anywhere else.

BTW, the problem on 75m and 14.313 is that there isn't anybody around to
cause their license to be TAKEN AWAY if they flaunt the rules, or to make
sure they don't keep on operating even in the (extremely unlikely) event
that they actually do manange to lose their licenses.

Andy Nourse             KC1IP


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:50 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 17:09:27 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions
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Jim Lowman wrote:

> : > 6 - the novice class license returns to a non-renewable state
>
> : what would that gain? Some operator are happy with its privileges. Are
> : you going to make them go back to Xtal control too? (I used Xtal control
> : when I started in 1970)

> The Novice ticket never should have been made renewable, if there was to be
> an *incentive* to incentive licensing.  By the same token, the no-code
> Technician ticket should be good for no more than five years; also
> non-renewable.  Both are *entry-level* licenses for HF and VHF,
> respectively.

Why should the no-code tech license be non renewable?  The current
no-code tech is no more "entry level" than a tech plus.  And I don't
understand the reasoning behind having a limited term on the novice.

I liked the idea floated by the FCC a while back of lifetime operator
licenses (not to be confused with station licneses).  I don't know what
we gain by making people retest if they don't renew within two years of
expiration.  If there is compelling need to retest, then we should be
retesting everyone for renewal.

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 9 Dec 1996 23:40:09 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 56
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In article <[e-mail]>,
        Jim Lowman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>And I wonder if they have come to regret that position?

I doubt it. Most new hams that I know today have little idea what
transpired in the mid-80's. They really don't care.

In this section of the country (primarily blue-collar state) most
new hams have a tough time scraping together a couple hundred bux
to buy a 2 meter radio, let alone spend $35 to join the ARRL each
year.

The cost of supporting the League is over-pricing the membership.
I suggest the League look at converting some of its "free" services
to a "pay if you use" service, and reduce the membership fee. (Doubt
it will ever happen though, someone has to pay K1ZZ's salary and
business "trips" all over the place).


>Obviously, if more no-coders were ARRL members, the results of the vote
>might well be different.

Maybe. But the number of no-code hams didn't significantly change the
overall numbers either, when factoring in non-members, so your
premise here is questionable.



>One of the arguments that is often heard on these newsgroups, is that the
>code requirement is "keeping brilliant people who will enhance the state of
>the art" out of ham radio.  I haven't noticed this among our club's
>no-coders, or those who get their license through our VE team.

You're not alone. Most of the new hams that I have seen the codeless
tech license bring in are merely CBers looking to "get away" from the
garbage on CB radio. Of course, that's just this section of the country.
In Silicon Valley I'm sure things are different.

However, what it does show is that the codeless license doesn't
appeal to engineers, it merely appeals to a cross-section of Americana
that is interested in getting into amateur radio.


>How long do you suppose it would be, once no-code Generals
>overwhelmed the voice subbands, that they would want the CW/digital subbands
>for phone, "because CW is outdated?"

I give it less than a year from the creation of a codeless HF license.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:52 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 22:43:08 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions (A Standard Disclaimer)
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Glenn Sparks wrote:

[snip]

> If it is important to you to get the license then quit complaining and
> learn the code, you can if you want to, quit fighting it and as Nike
> says just do it.  The more you have to work for something the more you
> will value it.  Our society has proven just how well people respond and
> how much respect something gets when it is just given away.  Look at CB
> during sunspot highs.  I don't care if CW is outdated, I don't care if
> you will never use it, I don't care what your excuse is, I want people
> on the air that wanted a license enough to WORK for it. Many argue they
> will work on learning more technical issues and want a more technical
> test, I agree, however look at the background of these people, they
> already know the technical part, that is why they want it, they don't
> want to have to learn anything else different, or remotely challenging
> to get the license.  I think hams should be required to retake the test
> every 5 years, both code and theory, after all the theory is constantly
> changing, and they should remember how much they want that license to
> continously work for it.  I think this is the problem on 14.313 and 75
> meters, they have forgotten how important the license is.  No, learning
> the code doesn't make you a better ham, but it at least shows that you
> want to be a ham enough to expend some effort to learn.
>
> If the FCC decides I need to learn to program a PAL to get my license,
> guess what, I will learn how to program a PAL, if they want me to learn
> to print backwards, I will do that, the license is important to me, and
> I will do whatever it takes to get the license.  Quit trying to get it
> free, and work for it, you will be more proud of it, and treat the
> service with some respect.

Halelujah, Brother Glenn!!   ;-)

You'd think someone was attacking the church by suggesting a no-code HF
license.

I have grown so tired of the "you have to WORK for it" and "you should
earn it" arguments.  As if the purpose of morse code testing is to
evaluate the applicant's character.  No - it's to evalulate (somewhat)
the applicant's ability to communicate with morse code.  With that, the
simple question is: Is it necessary, in 1996, to require applicant to
demonstrate the ability to use morse code in order to be granted an
amateur license with HF privleges?

If you think it is necessary to evaluate an applicants character, do it
like the government does when they are doing a background check for
someone seeking a security clearance.  Interview him.  Then we can send
the VEs to the applicants neighborhood to interview people that know
him, talk to his family, his co-workers.

If morse code wasn't a unique skill would you still require it?  What if
morse code was required to graduate from high school just like math,
science, language, etc.?  If that were the case, most people would pass
an average morse code test without much "work".  Would we have to come
up with some other kind of flaming hoop for people to jump through?

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (August Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 10 Dec 1996 00:38:44 GMT
Organization: Silicon Valley Public Access Link
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: Jim Lowman ([e-mail]) wrote:
: The Bakers ([e-mail]) wrote:

: : I thought that the lawful ability to transmit upon, thereby utilizing
: : the radio spectrum, was a *privilege* not a *right*.  Much like a
: : driver's license & driving on public roads.

Then, why not scrap all technical requirements for a HAM license if
you're comparing it to a driver's license. You don't need to know how a
car works to drive one.
Just have test on how to operate your rig, and a few no brainer questions.
The "CODE" can be an option, but knowing it shouldn't bring with it any
special privileges, except perhaps the status that you earned something that
others are too lazy to try for.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:54 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 10:24:02 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
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Cecil Moore <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Jim Kehler wrote:
>> Please feel sorry for us and grant us this death wish...

>... before next March when the giant comet arrives.

Well, at least maybe the gigasquirts will get to work a little UHF meteor
scatter before the meteor scatters them, huh Cecil.......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:56 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Michael P. Deignan ([e-mail]) wrote:

: The cost of supporting the League is over-pricing the membership.
: I suggest the League look at converting some of its "free" services
: to a "pay if you use" service, and reduce the membership fee. (Doubt
: it will ever happen though, someone has to pay K1ZZ's salary and
: business "trips" all over the place).

They've done that too, to an extent.  Take the latest Sweepstakes contest.
By working a prescribed number of stations, one could qualify for an award
of either a pin or a coffee mug.  Plan on paying $5/$10 respectively,
though, for these "awards."  Plus, in order to get the *full* contest rules,
which used to be printed in QST, plan on buying a $5 book on ARRL contests.

It would be interesting to see what the cost would be, just to subscribe to
QST.  Allow simply a magazine subscription, with everything else available
at a prescribed cost.

: >Obviously, if more no-coders were ARRL members, the results of the vote
: >might well be different.

: Maybe. But the number of no-code hams didn't significantly change the
: overall numbers either, when factoring in non-members, so your
: premise here is questionable.

You're saying that if ARRL had polled all no-coders, member or not, that
wouldn't have changed the results?  Please, a few more details.

: >One of the arguments that is often heard on these newsgroups, is that the
: >code requirement is "keeping brilliant people who will enhance the state of
: >the art" out of ham radio.  I haven't noticed this among our club's
: >no-coders, or those who get their license through our VE team.

: You're not alone. Most of the new hams that I have seen the codeless
: tech license bring in are merely CBers looking to "get away" from the
: garbage on CB radio. Of course, that's just this section of the country.
: In Silicon Valley I'm sure things are different.

Well, I'm quite a bit south of Silicon Valley.  But we certainly have our
share of problems in SoCal.  The .435 repeater.  The mess on 70 cm with
private repeaters.  And our share of CBers->no-coders.

: However, what it does show is that the codeless license doesn't
: appeal to engineers, it merely appeals to a cross-section of Americana
: that is interested in getting into amateur radio.

Good point.

: >How long do you suppose it would be, once no-code Generals
: >overwhelmed the voice subbands, that they would want the CW/digital subband
s
: >for phone, "because CW is outdated?"

: I give it less than a year from the creation of a codeless HF license.

Probably.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 03:17:49 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <58l931$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sjx-ca85-13.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 10  7:16:49 PM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120303 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44085

[e-mail] (Jim Lowman) wrote:




>Yeah, when I got into the game, there were four classes: Novice, Technician,
>General and Extra.  Novice expired in one year.  Others were renewable.
>The Extra required two or more years as a General and was mostly honorary,
>as it conveyed no extra privileges.

Had the Conditional Class license come into being yet?  If I recall,
it was basically a general class license reserved for those who
couldn't make it to the FCC field office to take the exam (either
through handicap or living in the middle of nowhere).

Dick WD0ANB



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!dsm6.dsmnet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Dean T. Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 11 Dec 1996 09:29:32 GMT
Organization: Miller and Associates
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slppp03.dsmnet.com
X-Newsreader: OUI TE 1.5

Hi Glenn,
 > Glenn Sparks  KI5GY

Good name for a radio operator.<g>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:15:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!demos!news1.relcom.ru!sovam!petronet
From: [e-mail] (Petronet Networks)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: About chip AM7911
Date: 3 Dec 1996 19:36:43 GMT
Organization: Sovam Teleport
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <581vgb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: scylla.sovam.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]


The dear colleagues!
I want to have the information on a volume where it is possible to purchase
the microcircuit chip AM7911.
What its price?
I shall be grateful for the answer on my E mail.
73! Konstantin, RK1 NA ex UN1 CD






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!143.183.87.86!scnews.sc.intel.com!ilnews.iil.intel.com!pauls
From: "Richard B. Harel" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AEA - Closing it's doors
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 15:25:55 -0800
Organization: Intel Corp.
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: f8pc0375.jer.intel.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

I was very sadenned to hear of the news that AEA closed it's doors on
Nov. 15. I own 2 great AEA products which are the heart of my station
(HamLink and PK-900) and now wonder who I can turn to for customer
support in the future.
AEA made some really great products and it just makes me wonder why
they couldn't succeed ? It was very strange paging through the December
QST and not seeing any AEA product advertised.
I'm now 37 and have been a ham since I'm 16. During that time I've seen
so many US manufacturers go the same way as AEA.
Collins, Hallicrafters, Hammerlund, Clegg, Drake, Wilson, SBE, Heath,
KLM, GLB, Tempo to name a few. Yes, some of these companies still are in
business but they are long out of the Amateur Radio market.
In 1976 when I would used my Wilson 1405 with optional DTMF TT pad
to make a 1/2 duplex call through the local repeater's autopatch, it
was the neatest thing. Non-hams would look on in awe/amazement.
There isn't much technology in my shack these days that would impress
a cell-phone/internet user. Or someone using a Nokia 9000 Cell-Phone
with built in PC ! (They ARE still impressed that our fraternity
in much closer knit than theirs).
So if I can get my Amateur Radio wish answered - what would I wish for ?
Well besides some state-of-the-art gear and a few acres of antenna farm,
I would wish for a breath of new life into Amateur Radio. Like SSB
was in the 1950's - solid state and IC's in the 60's, repeaters in the
70's and Packet Radio/PC in the 80's. We need technology that will be
one step ahead of what Joe-cellular-telephone-net-surfer is using.
It's not impossible either. With our bandwidth on 1.2 Ghz and above,
wireless Internet surfing is possible at very high speeds.
Perhaps Phase 3-D will do it. Maybe ICOM, Kenwood and Yaesu will join
in putting up a string of geostationary satellites with a preprietary
code that will only work with their radios !

73,
Rich
4X1DA/WB2JBS

[e-mail]





-----------------------------------------------------------------------
E-Mail:[e-mail]
Voice :[phone]

Disclaimer
=================
My thoughts, writings, any previous writings, spelling,
opinions and other mental noise are in no way reflective
or related to my employer or any organization that might
appear in an "address header".
I assume complete responsibility for my actions.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:01 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!uucp4.uu.net!world!johnl
From: [e-mail] (John Langner WB2OSZ)
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 1996 16:28:31 GMT
Lines: 56

In article <[e-mail]>,
Richard B. Harel <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I was very sadenned to hear of the news that AEA closed it's doors on
>Nov. 15.  ...

>AEA made some really great products and it just makes me wonder why
>they couldn't succeed ?

This shouldn't have come as a surprise.  It was well known that AEA
was hurting along with the rest of the ham radio industry.

Ham radio is a wonderful hobby, a chance to experiment with
communications technology, meet people from around the world,
provide public service, emergency communications, etc.  I'm
still very enthusiastic about ham radio.

However, the *business* of supplying equipment to ham radio
enthusiasts has been steadily - and probably irreversibly
dying.

There are several reasons for this:

* No code tech license - Although the total number of US hams is
        growing, most are now no code techs.  Most tend to spend
        a couple hundred $ on an HT instead of an HT *and* thousands
        more on an HF transceiver, antennas, accessories, etc.

* Sun Spot Cycle - We are near the bottom.

* Computers - Most hams have computers.  These are constantly being
        upgraded/replaced because the technology changes so quickly.
        A few people must have the latest transceiver with all the
        bells and whistles but most are probably quite content with
        a 10 or 15 year old HF transceiver.

* The Internet - 12 years ago Packet Radio was new, exciting, and
        impressive.
        Try demonstrating a 1200 bps connection to a text-only BBS
        to anyone now.  They'll laugh all the home where they can
        access information around the world at 28.8k bps by pointing
        and clicking with a mouse.

HF propagation will improve in a few years but that's the only good
news.  Hams will probably continue to spend more time and money on
computers and Internet access and less on ham radio equipment.

With less revenue there will be less new product development and
less advertising.  With less advertising the magazines won't be
able to survive.   Take a look at the list of advertisers in a
recent magazine and the same magazine from a few years ago.

Does anyone have any ideas on how to reverse the trend?


73, John WB2OSZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!cc.iu.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim M.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Date: 6 Dec 1996 18:16:34 GMT
Organization: InternetU
Lines: 68
Message-ID: <589nu2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: netport-58.iu.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.4

All that needs to happen is the first major crash of a large number of
Internet routers or nodes, so that the fun and free access gets cramped, or
maybe the major universities and businesses who allow the net to transit their

mainframes start charging some big bucks for all the play toy affectionadoes
on the net.  Your radio will still work when the phone systems crash, or when
the net starts getting expensive.  Just sit a while, it'll be back.

Jim

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>Richard B. Harel <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>I was very sadenned to hear of the news that AEA closed it's doors on
>>Nov. 15.  ...
>
>>AEA made some really great products and it just makes me wonder why
>>they couldn't succeed ?
>
>This shouldn't have come as a surprise.  It was well known that AEA
>was hurting along with the rest of the ham radio industry.
>
>Ham radio is a wonderful hobby, a chance to experiment with
>communications technology, meet people from around the world,
>provide public service, emergency communications, etc.  I'm
>still very enthusiastic about ham radio.
>
>However, the *business* of supplying equipment to ham radio
>enthusiasts has been steadily - and probably irreversibly
>dying.
>
>There are several reasons for this:
>
>* No code tech license - Although the total number of US hams is
>        growing, most are now no code techs.  Most tend to spend
>        a couple hundred $ on an HT instead of an HT *and* thousands
>        more on an HF transceiver, antennas, accessories, etc.
>
>* Sun Spot Cycle - We are near the bottom.
>
>* Computers - Most hams have computers.  These are constantly being
>        upgraded/replaced because the technology changes so quickly.
>        A few people must have the latest transceiver with all the
>        bells and whistles but most are probably quite content with
>        a 10 or 15 year old HF transceiver.
>
>* The Internet - 12 years ago Packet Radio was new, exciting, and
>        impressive.
>        Try demonstrating a 1200 bps connection to a text-only BBS
>        to anyone now.  They'll laugh all the home where they can
>        access information around the world at 28.8k bps by pointing
>        and clicking with a mouse.
>
>HF propagation will improve in a few years but that's the only good
>news.  Hams will probably continue to spend more time and money on
>computers and Internet access and less on ham radio equipment.
>
>With less revenue there will be less new product development and
>less advertising.  With less advertising the magazines won't be
>able to survive.   Take a look at the list of advertisers in a
>recent magazine and the same magazine from a few years ago.
>
>Does anyone have any ideas on how to reverse the trend?
>
>
>73, John WB2OSZ



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: MakeMyDay <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Date: 7 Dec 1996 01:26:43 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58ah4j$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <589nu2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.129.166
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.22ATT (Windows; U; 16bit)

[e-mail] (Gary) wrote:
>> Your radio will still work when the phone systems crash, or when
>>the net starts getting expensive.  Just sit a while, it'll be back.
>>
>>Jim
>>
>Kind of like horses came back after the first gridlock/gas-shortage eh
>????
>
>Gary K8IQ

Bicycles sure *did* come back...

<MakeMyDay>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 06:34:50 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <589nu2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ah4j$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc042049.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.326

On 7 Dec 1996 01:26:43 GMT, MakeMyDay <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>[e-mail] (Gary) wrote:
>>> Your radio will still work when the phone systems crash, or when
>>>the net starts getting expensive.  Just sit a while, it'll be back.
>>>
>>>Jim
>>>
>>Kind of like horses came back after the first gridlock/gas-shortage eh
>>????
>>
>>Gary K8IQ
>
>Bicycles sure *did* come back...
>
><MakeMyDay>

Great, then buy up all the $2000.00+ ham rigs and save em , you'll
have a *gold mine* when the net crashes. ;)



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:51:12 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: camoore-desk.ch.intel.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)

Gary Coffman wrote:
> There is a strong undercurrent of anti-technology, anti-progress
> attitudes among some entrenched segments of the amateur community.

Hi Gary, I vote that the anti-technology/progress folk give up their
electronics entirely and go back to whistling and smoke signals. They
would be doing ham radio an immense favor.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!clay.se.highway1.com!baker.se.highway1.com![e-mail]
From: Daniel Clark <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 05:11:10 -0800
Organization: FLorida Coastal School of Law
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.120.69.111
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; I; 16bit)
To: Gary Coffman <[e-mail]>

Gary Coffman wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (John Langner WB2O
SZ) writes:

> If you want one answer why AEA folded, it could be their reluctance
> to bring out faster equipment. They were offered a non-exclusive
> license to produce 56 kb equipment *10 years ago*, but refused.
> They wanted to milk the low speed market for all it was worth first.
> In retrospect, that was a serious error because it let the landline
> modems hams also use far outstrip what they could buy from AEA for
> use in amateur radio.

A case-book example for an MBA couse in stategic marketing I suspect.
Could it be that AEA hung its hat on the aged PK-232 product line for
too long?  Quite honesly, there hasn't been a single product of their
that I have ever considered purchasing.  All their multimode TNC are
far too large for my desktop.  I've never been able to get past that
barrier.

Since this subject has surfaced on this and other threads, yours is
the first to possibly place the fault squarely in the lap of AEA.
Could it be that rather than economic conditions in the amateur
market, AEA has failed to meet and exceed customer expectations?

In the aftermath of AEA, consider a company like MFJ with its mediocre
reputation for quality and service. Quality nothwithstanding, they have
a wide product line, good value and even some unique products that I
would like to own.

PacComm is a good example of a company that is known for
innovation and high quality.  Are they in financial
dire straits because of the so-called "declining amateur market?"
Thank God they've had the foresight to start working on a product
that addresses the high demand for network speed.  I'll be the first
in line to make a purchase.

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sgi.com!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-2.sprintlink.net!coopnews.coop.net!news.den.mmc.com!mac8100_6.atl.lmco.com!user
From: [e-mail] (Robert J Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AEA Going out of biz.
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 18:08:30 -0500
Organization: ATL
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <rjones-0412961808300001@mac8100_6.atl.lmco.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.20.228.186

I just heard that AEA is looking to get out of the ham radio busness has
any noe else herd this?
boB
N3WDG

--
[e-mail]
N3DWG


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-paris.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!rain.fr!jussieu.fr!univ-angers.fr!univ-rennes1.fr!u-bordeaux.fr!usenet
From: antalick <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AILTECH synthesizer manual
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 10:18:43 -0800
Organization: CRIBX1 , Universite de Bordeaux I , France
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tremouille.ixl.u-bordeaux.fr
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

Bonjour from Bordeaux France.
To repare an AILTECH Synthesized Signal Generator reference 380KII,
I am looking for either a mauual or a copy (schematics) , for the main
frame (Power supply
problem).
I have the manual for the plug in, ref  P3602 OE1 183, but I also need
the manual for the fm
modulator option.
Many thanks if you can help me.
Roland, F6ANF.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.ac.net!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Alinco DJ-560 repeater turn-on
Date: 3 Dec 1996 23:24:47 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <582crv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

: How do you activate the cross band repeater mode?

On the 560.....you dont it is a piece of SHIT! If it is the 580 you are
talking about then say so.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:11 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: ALINCO POOR SERVICE
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 15:39:31 GMT
Lines: 67

In article <[e-mail]> hershman <[e-mail]> wri
tes:
>I tried to order a replacement microphone for my Alinco DR-570T Radio
>directy from Alinco. I was told that I had to order thru a dealer even
>though the radio is an older model. I tried Ham Radio Outlet in New
>Hampshire and the salesman didn't want to look up the part # and order
>it for me. I then Tried Amatuer Electronic Supply in Milwaukee. The
>salesperson took the order and three weeks go by. I call today to check
>on it and find out that the order never was put in and that I now have
>to send in $63 in advance before the order goes thru to Alinco in
>California. I am disapointed in ALINCO ,HAM RADIO OUTLET, AMATUER
>ELECTRONIC SUPPLY. First, I will never order Alinco again. second I will
>never order from the two dealers in the future. I will post several
>identical messages to Alinco, ALL AMATUER RADIO NEWSGROUPS,PACKER RADIO
>Sincerely, Steven Hershman "NS1R"  E MAIL "[e-mail]


You shouldn't be mad at Alinco. Like most manufacturers, they don't
sell direct to the public. They sell wholesale-only to distributors
or dealers. Try the same trick with most other manufacturers, call
Georgia Pacific and ask to buy a 2x4, and see how far you get. Now
GP'll sell you a *train load* of 2x4's, but not just one. Not only
are most manufacturers not setup to do retail sales, it usually would
be a violation of the agreements that they have with their dealers
if they did so.

You do have a gripe with the salemen at HRO and AES. It's their
*job* to take your order for quantity one items. It often is
standard practice to require pre-payment for special order items,
so that isn't a legitimate gripe, but failure to *tell* you that
at the time of accepting the order certainly constitutes a legitimate
gripe.  And refusing to even offer to take the order is also a
legitimate gripe.

Now good counter help is hard to find, and some of the salesmen
answering the phones at these places are sleazoids. The management
of these companies would like to know about that so that they can
*do* something about it. A missed sale is a missed sale, and no
company manager likes that. So instead of boycotting these companies
(where else are you going to go anyway?), call or write the *managers*
of the companies with your specific complaints. Name names, give dates,
etc. Let them know that *they* have a problem, and then *they* can
solve it. If you just walk away, they won't know that there is a
problem. These people *want* your business, and they will follow
up on reasonable complaints.

Both HRO and AES are responsible and responsive companies. They
are both generally among the best amateur radio dealers in the
US (probably the world). But that doesn't mean every one of their
employees is perfect, and even good employees sometimes have a
bad day. Give their managements a chance to deal with the problem
you had. (Be firm but be nice, consider how *you'd* like to receive
a complaint about poor service from *your* company.)

There are a few people working for those companies who read these
newsgroups, but just posting a gripe here isn't nearly as effective
as writing or calling the right person at those companies with your
complaint. You have a responsibility as a customer to do this, both
to make your own future purchases more trouble free, and so that other
customers can also have better service. Retail requires two active
parties working together, and you're one of them.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ALINCO POOR SERVICE
Date: 2 Dec 1996 14:34:54 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <57vb0u$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>You shouldn't be mad at Alinco. Like most manufacturers, they don't
>sell direct to the public. They sell wholesale-only to distributors
>or dealers.

I dunno. Last time I had to order parts from Yaesu and ICOM they
were more than receptive to taking my VISA card number and fedexing
the item to me.

I would hardly qualify a microphone, especially a disposable mobile
microphone, a "component" like an HF desk mic.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!europa.chnt.gtegsc.com!news.umbc.edu!haven.umd.edu!cs.umd.edu!news.abs.net!news.bconnex.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ALINCO POOR SERVICE
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 15:15:45 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

Douglas Gavilanes wrote:
>
> hershman wrote:
> >
> > I tried to order a replacement microphone for my Alinco DR-570T Radio
> > directy from Alinco. I was told that I had to order thru a dealer even
> > though the radio is an older model. I tried Ham Radio Outlet in New
<snip>
> Since it wouldn't be appropriate  In the first place, unless an Alinco mic (
or any mic,
> for that matter) suffered some rare individual component failure (not
> likely), or suffered physical abuse, like spilling coffee on it, crushing
> it under foot on your car's floorboard, etc. (more likely), the
> microphone provided with your radio should have lasted as long as the
> radio.  OK, so maybe someone stole it.
>
<snip>
>
> packet radio. Finally, Alinco has a web site and an E-mail address.  I
> would hope that you afforded them the courtesy of sending them a copy of
> your message, but the header information shows that you didn't.
>
> 73s ,
>
> Doug Gavilanes, N6XQY
> Garden Grove, California


God, Doug, did you forget to take your geriatric medicine?

That last bit was also particularly good, who died and left you
the arbiter of courtesy (or anything else)? Miss Manners?

"the microphone provided with your radio should have lasted as long as
the radio.  OK, so maybe someone stole it'
What planet did you come from?
Thanks for the humor anyway.

--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!nntp.crl.com!news.pbi.net!netport.com!usenet
From: "Ginsberg Family (Ed Ginsberg KE6BNL)" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ALINCO POOR SERVICE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 14:33:05 -0800
Organization: "Netport Internet Access [phone]"
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qjh7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p10.cts-palm-1.netport.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

Clint Bradford wrote:
>
> >>I have always had great help from Alinco...
>
> I have, too. The original writer is a whiner, and lacks basic
> communications skills. I have also had good service from the Alinco people.
 When I was not sure
of the procedure for installing the decode board for the 600 they were very
helpful and called back with better details. And also offer to send and
somewhat more straight forward operation manual.  Ed KE6BNL-
1╛


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ALINCO POOR SERVICE!
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 15:25:35 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57s9qm$[e-mail]> <01bbdfc2$041bc980$105292cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)
To: Dave <[e-mail]>

Dave wrote:
>
> My Alinco mike works great because I use a mike holder, and don't use it
> for a foot rest OR stool. Seems like a problem caused by OPERATOR ERROR,

Incredible, I never actually talked to a psychic before, where did Steve
say why his mike quit ?

--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:17 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:23:06 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58jr8h$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Richard Kendrick) wrote:

>Behold brothers and sisters, I bring you the profound story
>of how King Mackey the Great became so. It is an exciting

I still love this!

Again, GREAT JOB!




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 11 Dec 1996 00:21:54 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <58kur2$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max8-so-ca-42.earthlink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: [e-mail]
X-URL: news:58ikpa$[e-mail]

Works for me!

K5VP




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.172.16.9!news.LASER.NET!usenet
From: [e-mail] (sean hall)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 07:13:13 GMT
Organization: LaserNet
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ffx75.laser.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On 9 Dec 1996 20:18:02 -0700, [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
wrote:

>Behold brothers and sisters, I bring you the profound story
>of how King Mackey the Great became so. It is an exciting
>tale filled with wonder, awe, and heroic deeds. Come closer,
>as I relate this grand history.
>
>In the land of Scannerdom, the county of Power Supply was
>plagued with a terrible injustice. The evil mercenary force
>from Capacitor held the people of Smoke prisoner. Repeater,
>the ruler in exile of Power Supply, offered a rare and unused
>Radio Shack battery card to anyone who could free the people
>of Smoke from their Capacitor prison. A young and fearless
>warrior stepped forward to take up the gauntlet. Repeater
>told him of the dangers but the young man was undaunted and
>resolutely set off to free them.
>
>When he arrived at the gate, Mackey was challenged by the
>fearsome guardians, Positive and Negative. So terrible were
>these mighty sentinels that even the renowned guardian Cerebus
>trembled when faced with Positive and Negative. Armed with
>his trusty screwdriver he didst battle with them. In the hands
>of a true warrior the screwdriver is no common weapon. Our
>hero, battle tested and proven in the labs and urinals of
>Technical School, was much more than a professional. He was
>a Grand Master of the Number Two Phillips Blade.
>
>The guards fired spinning hex nuts and sliced with the dreaded
>razor sharp quartertwenty threads. Again and again, using

etcetera.

Way too much RF exposure.   Way too much.







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:20 1996
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From: J B Youles <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english,sci.lang,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Alpha Bravo phonetics: alternative version
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 11:50:56 +0000
Organization: UUNet PIPEX server (post doesn't reflect views of UUNet PIPEX)
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <589o38$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ai022.du.pipex.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net alt.usage.english:132164 sci.lang:65188 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120010

Here's an alternative version.


'ay for 'orses
beef sandwiches
see for miles
deaf as a post
'eave a brick
effervescent
chief of staff
hedge for garden
I've an idea
jaffa oranges
cafeteria
'ell for leather
emphasis
envious
oaf or moron
pee for relief
queue for a bus
'alf a crown
esther rantzen
teeth for chewing
you for me
viva espana
double your money
eggs for breakfast
wife or mistress
zeppelin


--
John Youles
-------------------------------------------------------------
"If the recent weather is a result of the greenhouse effect,
 then someone must have taken out all the glass."
-------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-penn.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!hookup!visi.com!mr.net!news.sgi.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.onr.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Victor Engel)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english,sci.lang,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Alpha Bravo phonetics: alternative version
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 05:54:29 GMT
Organization: Onramp Access, Inc. 512-322-9200
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <589o38$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: onramp7-15.onr.com
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Xref: news1.epix.net alt.usage.english:132198 sci.lang:65210 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120056

J B Youles <[e-mail]> wrote:

>eggs for breakfast


This reminds me of something my dad showed me when I was young.
Recognizing he has a German accent helps understand it:

FUNEX?
SIFX.
FUNEM?
SIFM.
O.K. MNX.

(punctuation added for clarity)
-----------------------------------------------------------
Victor Engel                                   Vector Angle
[e-mail]                           [e-mail]
http://the-light.com         http://www.onr.com/user/lights


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:22 1996
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From: J B Youles <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english,sci.lang,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Alpha Bravo phonetics: alternative version
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 10:37:09 +0000
Organization: UUNet PIPEX server (post doesn't reflect views of UUNet PIPEX)
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <589o38$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net alt.usage.english:132206 sci.lang:65224 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120100

Victor Engel wrote:
>
> This reminds me of something my dad showed me when I was young.
> Recognizing he has a German accent helps understand it:
>
> FUNEX?
> SIFX.
> FUNEM?
> SIFM.
> O.K. MNX.
>
> (punctuation added for clarity)

"The Two Ronnies" (Barker and Corbett) had this dialogue in a sketch in
one of their shows in the '70s.

--
John Youles
-------------------------------------------------------------
"If the recent weather is a result of the greenhouse effect,
 then someone must have taken out all the glass."
-------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!news.mel.connect.com.au!news.mel.aone.net.au!usenet
From: [e-mail] (John Nurick)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english,sci.lang,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Alpha Bravo phonetics: alternative version
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 10:25:54 GMT
Organization: Customer of Access One Pty Ltd, Melbourne, Australia
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <589o38$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: jrc.net.au
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.usage.english:132207 sci.lang:65225 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120101

On Sun, 08 Dec 1996 11:50:56 +0000, J B Youles
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Here's an alternative version.

This is an older one (pre-Rantzen):

A for 'orses
B for mutton
C for th' highlanders
D for ential
E for brick
F for vescence
G for police
H before beauty
I for Novello
J for oranges
K for teria
L for leather
M for Sis
N for mation
O for the wings of a dove
P for relief
Q for tickets
R for mo
S for me
T for two
U for me and me for you
V for la France
W for quits
Y for heaven's sake
Z for breezes

TTFN
Juliet November


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mathworks.com!news.pbi.net!news1.rcsntx.swbell.net!usenet
From: George Baker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english,sci.lang,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Alpha Bravo phonetics: the quickie version
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:18:42 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <589o38$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-151-164-41-184.rcsntx.swbell.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Xref: news1.epix.net alt.usage.english:132052 sci.lang:65141 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119892

[e-mail] wrote:
>
>
> That famous alphabet:
>
>    Alpha Bravo Charlie . . .
>
> It dates from about 1955 . . .
> Actually, the US Air Force adopted this alphabet sometime from the Fall of 1
951 to the
Spring of 1952. I was teaching electronics, radar, communications and code for
 the Air
Force when the alphabet change came along - can't remember the exact month. We
 tried it
out in code class with some French cadets with extremely heavy accents. Their
rendition
of the former Able Baker Charlie, etc. was virtually unrecognizable. But, ever
y single
word of the "new" alphabet was recognizable.

--
73, George
W5YR
Fairview, TX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!207.79.120.3!news.mc.net!usenet
From: "jack beltz" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: amateur radio live chat lines??
Date: 8 Dec 1996 17:09:22 GMT
Organization: McHenryCom
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <01bbe52b$0a51ad60$d1774fcf@jwbeltzp>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vmmodem80.mc.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

any one know if it is possibble to get on the amateur internet chat like
you do over 2 meters?? gateways??like going thru detroit ottawa? thanks in
advaced n9iif jack



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!128.2.120.57!myriad!mail
From: [e-mail] (Diogenes)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.flame,alt.usenet.kooks,alt.stupidity
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 2 Dec 1996 00:17:05 -0500
Organization: Mail to Usenet Gateway
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Comments: This message did not originate from the address above.  It was remailed by an anonymous remailing service.  If you have questions or complaints, please direct them to <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119376 alt.flame:350955 alt.usenet.kooks:53484 alt.stupidity:86350

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

> SERVICE AVAILABLE IN ALL 51 STATES INCLUDING ALASKA, HAWAII, PUERTO RICO,
                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> THE VIRGIN ISLANDS, AND THE BAHAMAS. LIMITED AVAIL. IN CANADA. EMAIL FOR
> DETAILS.

That ought to really stump the folks on Jeopardy -- naming the 51st
state.  "I'll take 'The 51 States' for $200, Alex".  Obviously a
knowledge of geography is not required to peddle pagers!

So which of the localities listed is the "51st state"?  Maybe it's
the state that Mike lives in -- "Confusion".

> SINCERELY,
>
> KB2TIU
> MIKE

Apparently knowledge of geography is not a prequisite to get a ham
radio license, either.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:27 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Diogenes)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.flame,alt.usenet.kooks,alt.stupidity,news.admin.net-abuse.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 2 Dec 1996 00:17:22 -0500
Organization: Mail to Usenet Gateway
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119377 alt.flame:350956 alt.usenet.kooks:53485 alt.stupidity:86351 news.admin.net-abuse.misc:153539

[e-mail] (Evan Platt) wrote:

> Our friend just replied to me via e-mail:
>
> > From: "1" <[e-mail]>
> > To: <[e-mail]>
> > Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
> > Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 18:12:44 -0500
> > X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
> >
> > PUERTO RICO IS CONSIDERED A STATE, THATS WHY THEY CAN VOTE.

And so are certain idiot pager peddlers, apparently.  Not only does
this guy not know his geography, but his public relations skills are
piss-poor, too!  If he's not self-employed, I hope his boss sees his
rude attitude in dealing with the public.  And if he is
self-employed, I can safely say he has an IDIOT for a boss!

> > BUT CRITICS ARE ALWAYS UNINFORMED

Um, let me guess.  That's a quote from Jim Jones, right?

But, I gotta admit that he's right in one sense.  He's a critic and
he's certainly uninformed.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!news.rmii.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 18:35:37 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <57v7e3$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-146.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Mark Schneider) wrote:

>Gee, so this what ham radio is all about. Sounds just like the bands.
>No wonder I sold the shack and took up rock climbing, there's real
>humans in the sport. It's really too bad we couldn't sell off the ham
>bands to commercial interests and put the money in part towards the
>National Parks.

>Mark

Having sellers remorse, or just hanging around here because your rocks all hav
e
snow on them ?

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!199.232.56.18!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Mark Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 01:18:52 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57v7e3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d9.mnh.nh.ultra.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Mon, 02 Dec 1996 18:35:37 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Mark Schneider) wrote:
>
>>Gee, so this what ham radio is all about. Sounds just like the bands.
>>No wonder I sold the shack and took up rock climbing, there's real
>>humans in the sport. It's really too bad we couldn't sell off the ham
>>bands to commercial interests and put the money in part towards the
>>National Parks.
>
>>Mark
>
>Having sellers remorse, or just hanging around here because your rocks all ha
ve
>snow on them ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
>
Well, it's a big, big Usenet. And rocks with "snow" on them is
something that's welcome, it's called ice climbing. Actually, I like
to keep touch with the digital newsgroup. The digital stuff is the one
thing I still find interesting in ham radio. Who knows, someday maybe
the ham stuff will be up to snuff with the internet. Could you
imagine, you use your palmtop to access a database service thru your
high-speed TNC and up pops a hyperlinked map depicting the number of
states in the country.

Mark -- **will work on your pitiful little tower problem cheap**


***************************************************************
* [e-mail]                                     *

*                                                             *
* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
*    Manchester, NH                                           *
***************************************************************
.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:17:28 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <01bbe0bf$508528e0$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <57ks88$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

send the check, I'll buy a new keyboard.

Michael P. Deignan <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57ks88$[e-mail]>...
> In article <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default>,
>       <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >FOR YOUR DEDICATION TO THE AMATUER SERVICE, YOU CAN OBTAIN $4.00
> >PER MONTH BEEPER SERVICE.
>
> I'd rather chip in $4 and buy you a functional caps-lock key.
>
> MD
> --
> --
> --  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
> --
> --  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!panix!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:16:26 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <01bbe0bf$2abe23a0$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Ok. Free pager costs you $10 a month plus $26 setup fee.  Sorry hams can
add!

Dave Sparks <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> In article <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default>,
> "1" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >SERVICE AVAILABLE IN ALL 51 STATES INCLUDING ALASKA, HAWAII, PUERTO
RICO,
>                           ^^^^^^^^^
> >THE VIRGIN ISLANDS, AND THE BAHAMAS. LIMITED AVAIL. IN CANADA. EMAIL FOR
> >DETAILS.
>
> "All 51 states"?  I must have missed one somewhere along the line. <g>
>
> --
> Dave Sparks <[e-mail]> Home Page: http://www.pobox.com/~dsparks/
> For info on receiving a FREE pager (or getting PAID to give away free
> pagers), a FREE 16.0 cpm calling card (non-prepaid), or earning money
> at home, visit:
>                 http://www.pobox.com/~dsparks/mmsm.html
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:19:49 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <01bbe0bf$a642ed80$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default><[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

FOR INFO ON PAYING FOR A PAGER THAT COSTS YOU LESS THAN A FREE
PAGER:    www.angelfire.com/biz/BEEPER/index.html

Dave Sparks <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
wrote:
>
> >Our friend just replied to me via e-mail:
> >
> >From: "1" <[e-mail]>
> >To: <[e-mail]>
> >Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
> >Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 18:12:44 -0500
> >X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
> >
> >PUERTO RICO IS CONSIDERED A STATE, THATS WHY THEY CAN VOTE.
>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >
> >BUT CRITICS ARE ALWAYS UNINFORMED
>
> I wonder when Puerto Rico was admitted as a "state"?  (I must have
> missed the news about THAT event!)  Why do all the Federal offices
> still fly flags that only contain 50 stars?  <g>
>
> BTW, the e-mail I received from him was even less complimentary
> about "critics".  Of course, comments that are *CRITICAL* of all
> "critics" are self-referential, by definition.
>
> --
> Dave Sparks <[e-mail]> Home Page: http://www.pobox.com/~dsparks/
> For info on receiving a FREE pager (or getting PAID to give away free
> pagers), a FREE 16.0 cpm calling card (non-prepaid), or earning money
> at home, visit:
>                 http://www.pobox.com/~dsparks/mmsm.html
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:21:39 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <01bbe0bf$e1e0c4c0$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57obq5$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

evan replied to me that he was ga_

Evan Platt <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> Our beeper friend replied to me again...
>
> From: "1" <[e-mail]>
> To: "Evan Platt (IN3501)" <[e-mail]>
> Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
> Date: Sun, 1 Dec 1996 16:52:31 -0500
> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
>
> WELL SINCE THEY CAN VOTE FOR PRESIDENT, COLLECT WELFARE, UNEMPLOYMENT
> ETC.
> AND YOUR TAXES GO TOWARD THE PLACE CALLED PUERTO RICO, MAYBE IT'S JUST
> THE
> LAND OF MAKE BELIEVE.
>
> WHEN DID THE FLAG DETERMINE GOVERNMENT POLICY.
>
> ISN'T EVAN A GIRLS NAME, GUESS I GOT TO THROW AWAY MY WEBTERS
> DICK-TIONARY.
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:46:32 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 63
Message-ID: <01bbe0c3$61b1afe0$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Wow,
        With experts such as you and your elite ranking in the 'amateur'
world
I am surprised that God also gets advice from you.

Are you really serious, someone makes a mistake and all you have to do is
sit around and try to put people down.  What next, your a racist too?  Stay
in Guam
with the rest of the radioactive waste from the US.

Oh I almost forgot, when you jam repeaters does your finger get tired?

KB2FCC


Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57ql37$[e-mail]>...
> In a private email, "1" <[e-mail]> the beeper businessman
wrote:
> >Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
> >From: "1" <[e-mail]>
> >To: <[e-mail]>
> >Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
> >Date: Sat, 30 Nov 1996 15:00:57 -0500
> >X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
>
> >PUERTO RICO HAS EVERY RIGHT THAT EVERY OTHER STATE HAS. SO THATS WHY
MOST
> >PEOPLE CONSIDER IT A STATE.
>
> Most ignorant people maybe....
>
> >YOU DON'T NEED A BEEPER BECAUSE I'M SURE NOONE WANTS YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY.

>
> We have Motorola. We don't need you.  But thanks anyway.  When we get to
be a
> state, I'll beep you.
>
> >GUAM SUCKS
>
> What a line.  What can I say. How about SO'S YOUR MAMA.   With your
writing
> talent, and your no code tech license, since you obviously aren't going
to make
> your first million in the beeper business, you should look up Squggie.
He's
> always looking for some more sterling examples for dropping CW testing,
and
> you'd sure be a good one.  You could be Squiggies first no code tech that

> BEEPS !
>
> Oh, and you need to reconfigure your newsreader software too - change
your
> name from "1" to "0", it fits you much better.
>
> 73, Jim KH2D
>
>
>
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:14:58 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <01bbe0be$f852bac0$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

who ever said we bought canada?

Evan Platt <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> "1" <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >SERVICE AVAILABLE IN ALL 51 STATES INCLUDING ALASKA, HAWAII, PUERTO
RICO,
> >THE VIRGIN ISLANDS, AND THE BAHAMAS. LIMITED AVAIL. IN CANADA. EMAIL FOR
> >DETAILS.
>
> We bought Canada? No shit. Cool. Is the national anthem gonna now be
> "Oh, Say, Can you see, eh?
> By da dawns early light
> Whats so proudly we hailed, eh?
> By the twilights last gleaming.
> Hey, who got the broad stripes and bright stars, eh? I got a kegger!.
>
> Sorry, couldn't resist.
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!hunter.premier.net!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:18:36 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <01bbe0bf$75ad7d20$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57ntql$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

SEE MSNBC.COM. THEY CAN VOTE

Ed Gallup <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57ntql$[e-mail]>...
> >
> >PUERTO RICO IS CONSIDERED A STATE, THATS WHY THEY CAN VOTE.
> >
> >BUT CRITICS ARE ALWAYS UNINFORMED
> >
> >
>
>    Interesting.  I don't recall seeing any voter tabulations on the last
> presidential election from Puerto Rico.  The TV Networks must not know
that
> Puerto Rico is a state, yet.
>
>   Ed
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!nuhou.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 15:28:19 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <581gqk$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]> <01bbe0c3$61b1afe0$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Wow,
>        With experts such as you and your elite ranking in the 'amateur'
>world

Another no code tech suffering from class envy, are we ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Mark Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 01:18:24 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]> <01bbe0c3$61b1afe0$8a7074cf@default> <581gqk$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d12.mnh.nh.ultra.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Tue, 03 Dec 1996 15:28:19 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) wrote:

>"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Wow,
>>        With experts such as you and your elite ranking in the 'amateur'
>>world
>
>Another no code tech suffering from class envy, are we ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>

Wow! Such an original flame. Your mastery of code definitly sets you
apart from the peon no-coders. After 4 years out of the hobby, I can
still head-copy 30 WPM, but in my eyes, you don't look any different
than the no-coders. Wow, watch out no-coders, the bad-ass Extra has
just put you in your places. Wonder how he'd be a thousand feet up on
holds that protrude 1/4" away from the rock face.


***************************************************************
* [e-mail]                                     *

*                                                             *
* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
*    Manchester, NH                                           *
***************************************************************
.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 03:34:52 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default><[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe0bf$a642ed80$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans44.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

He needs to learn to add too. It'll cost me less than free? You mean
you'll give ME money??

You must be from the new sperm bank.
The one from the 53rd state.

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>FOR INFO ON PAYING FOR A PAGER THAT COSTS YOU LESS THAN A FREE
>PAGER:    www.angelfire.com/biz/BEEPER/index.html


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 03:35:23 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe0be$f852bac0$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans44.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

I'm sorry, we bought Puerto RIco. Stupid me.

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>who ever said we bought canada?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!208.195.156.10!news.walltech.com!hsnx.wco.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 20:55:57 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <57ks88$[e-mail]> <01bbe0bf$508528e0$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

And the joy goes on. When our friend "0" err.. "1" (sorry) posted a
few messages which had no meaning "DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?, I
responded with the following:

> No I don't. Does it matter? Even if I don't hold a ticket, I know how
> many states our country has. I don't need a license to tell me that.
> Now the question: Do YOU? I wouldn't know. You hide behind a number.
> Perhaps you chose it based on your IQ? Your business skills leave
> something to be desired as I assume you will gain no users from your
> actions on this newsgroups.
> Grow up and/or (preferably and) leave this group unless you have
> something ON TOPIC to post, not some damn pager crap.

He responded with: (my comments in <brackets>

I WILL AT NO EXPENSE TO ME, FILE A FEDERAL CIVIL LAW SUIT AGAINST YOU
AND ANY OTHER PERSON WHO EMAILS ME, OR POSTS DAMAGING COMMENTS AND OR,
MAKES ALLEGATIONS AGAINST MY CHARACTER. I WILL SEEK PUNITIVE DAMAGES
FOR THE INJURY TO MY PERSON FROM YOUR REMARKS THAT HAVE CAUSED INJURY
TO MY REPUTATION.

<I think he damaged his reputation enough bragging about his service
available in all 51 states. Which of our 51 states wil he take me to
court in?? And being a paralegal, see below, he OBVIOUSLY knows that
slander and libel are civil matters, held in civil court.>


YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO DISCRIMINATE OR COMMIT A FEDERAL BIAS OFFENSE
AGAINST AN INDIVIDUAL BECAUSE OF THEIR RELIGION OR 'BELIEFS'.

<Umm.. the only 'belief' I discriminated against was your belief that
there are 51 states. So, I believe you are a moron with crappy
business practices. So, that's my belief, and you have no right to do
anything, because my belief. You're the one saying "Flush twice, it's
a long way to Guam, the 54th state.">

THANK GOD FOR THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA'S COURT SYSTEM.

<And all of her 51 states.>

POST THIS COMMENT ON THE NEWSGROUP, SO I MAY COLLECT NAMES FOR A
FEDERAL CIVIL CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT.

<Umm.. I'm offending YOU, and you are going to make it a class action?
Um.. do you even know what a class action IS?>

MICHAEL  KLEIN
PARALEGAL - ABA CERTIFIED
STATE OF NEW JERSEY

Oh, you must, if you are a certifiable ... err. certified Paralegal.
If what you state above is your idea of how our justise system works,
maybe you are on one of our 12th planets.
I posted this to the newsgroup, subpeona me with a class action.

Didn't think so.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!208.195.156.10!news.walltech.com!hsnx.wco.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 03:46:06 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <57ks88$[e-mail]> <01bbe0bf$508528e0$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe380$0fc35840$54ef1fcc@david-spillett>
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"David Spillett" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I hate to continue this tiresome thread but now that I have been
>threatened.......

You have? By him?? hahah.. lemme guess.

WARNING      WARNING           WARNING               WARNING

DO NOT EMAIL ME AGAIN.

DO NOT E MAIL ME AGAIN OR I WILL SIGN A RESTRAINING ORDER AGAINST

YOU.

Sure. OKEY.

>1.  Keep working on your "You can be a paralegal too!" at-home course.
>     Someday you are LIABLE to complete it.

We need him as a paralegal like we need OJ simpson as a spokesman for
Ginsu.

>2.  Read the section in your "How to get rich quick on the internet" manual
>about
>     how to use a mailer WITH a spell checker and actually USING the spell
>checker.

Add to that: A caps lock KEY SO ALL HIS MESSAGES AREN'T LIKE THIS AND
USE RUN ON SENTENCES.

>3.  I advise you to fully disclose what happens to your customer's pager
>service after the money they paid runs out.  You did do that, didn't you?

Of course, what being a paralegal and a pager provider, he knows the
law..

FWIW, I have notified his postmaster and advise anyone else to do the
same, to stop posting his Pager messages and FOR SALE: COMPUTER
messages which have nothing to do with amateur radio. Forward his
messages to [e-mail] ...



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:44 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!panix!netaxs.com!news.pond.com!kd3bj!kd3bj.ampr.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (Robert E. Garland)
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Sender: [e-mail] (news)
Organization: The KD3BJ Usenet BBS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]> <01bbe0c3$61b1afe0$8a7074cf@default> <581gqk$[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: jupiter.jtan.com
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 23:22:41 GMT
Lines: 13


Hmmm.  I wonder if the originator of this thread used to watch a news
program called "The 51st State"?  I believe it ran on the PBS affiliate
in New York City.  Of course, to some folks, the 51st state is Washington DC.




--
     Robert Garland                            NX3S @ N3ACL.PA.USA.NOAM
     Hilltown Township Bucks County               [e-mail]
     Pennsylvania USA                                       Grid FN20ii
                         "Ham Radio is a calling"


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:45 1996
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From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 10 Dec 1996 00:35:54 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <01bbe631$25f4b240$6b7074cf@default>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <57ks88$[e-mail]> <01bbe0bf$508528e0$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe380$0fc35840$54ef1fcc@david-spillett> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.107
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

NOTICE THAT OKAY IS SPELT WRONG.


AND I'M A MORON?




Evan Platt <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> "David Spillett" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >I hate to continue this tiresome thread but now that I have been
> >threatened.......
>
> You have? By him?? hahah.. lemme guess.
>
> WARNING      WARNING           WARNING               WARNING
>
> DO NOT EMAIL ME AGAIN.
>
> DO NOT E MAIL ME AGAIN OR I WILL SIGN A RESTRAINING ORDER AGAINST
>
> YOU.
>
> Sure. OKEY.
>
> >1.  Keep working on your "You can be a paralegal too!" at-home course.
> >     Someday you are LIABLE to complete it.
>
> We need him as a paralegal like we need OJ simpson as a spokesman for
> Ginsu.
>
> >2.  Read the section in your "How to get rich quick on the internet"
manual
> >about
> >     how to use a mailer WITH a spell checker and actually USING the
spell
> >checker.
>
> Add to that: A caps lock KEY SO ALL HIS MESSAGES AREN'T LIKE THIS AND
> USE RUN ON SENTENCES.
>
> >3.  I advise you to fully disclose what happens to your customer's pager
> >service after the money they paid runs out.  You did do that, didn't
you?
>
> Of course, what being a paralegal and a pager provider, he knows the
> law..
>
> FWIW, I have notified his postmaster and advise anyone else to do the
> same, to stop posting his Pager messages and FOR SALE: COMPUTER
> messages which have nothing to do with amateur radio. Forward his
> messages to [e-mail] ...
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!208.195.156.10!news.walltech.com!hsnx.wco.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (E.S. Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 04:43:24 GMT
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <57ks88$[e-mail]> <01bbe0bf$508528e0$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe380$0fc35840$54ef1fcc@david-spillett> <[e-mail]> <01bbe631$25f4b240$6b7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Notice you don't have a question mark at the end of... Never mind. It
was meant to be OKEY. Say it, that's how it I meant to type it,
sarcasticaly. I also am interested in how you've never answered to any
of the questions multiple people bring up of your lack of knoweldge on
the law, claiming to be a paralegal? You said you are going to start a
class action suit against me, yet I have yet to see a subpeona.
You wrote to me:

>2 or more people alledging the same CIVIL charge, in any state you pick, may
file a
>class action lawsuit against any individual, and or company.

Obviously, you are a paralegal, and know the law better than my
dictionary, which says class action is "a legal preceeding against a
single partyfiled on behalf of all people having a common complaint.

Yes, I know I misspelled a lot of words, I typed while reading it. But
what I want to know is who are all the parties who have the common
complaint? Us. We are complaining against you. Maybe we should all
file a class action against YOU.
Go away kid, you're bothering me.

haha. Paralegal my doorstop!
Oh and in response to your last question, in the immortal words of Ed
McMahon: "Yes, sir, you are correct sir!"


"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>NOTICE THAT OKAY IS SPELT WRONG.
>
>
>AND I'M A MORON?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Robert A. Klahn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 10 Dec 1996 13:40:14 GMT
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <58jp7u$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <57ks88$[e-mail]> <01bbe0bf$508528e0$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe380$0fc35840$54ef1fcc@david-spillett> <[e-mail]> <01bbe631$25f4b240$6b7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spg-as18s12.erols.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]


Some people should not be in the habit of correcting others spelling. :)

Bob.

1 ([e-mail]) wrote:
: NOTICE THAT OKAY IS SPELT WRONG.
:
:
: AND I'M A MORON?
:
:
:
:
: Evan Platt <[e-mail]> wrote in article
: <[e-mail]>...
: > "David Spillett" <[e-mail]> wrote:
: >
: > >I hate to continue this tiresome thread but now that I have been
: > >threatened.......
: >
: > You have? By him?? hahah.. lemme guess.
: >
: > WARNING      WARNING           WARNING               WARNING
: >
: > DO NOT EMAIL ME AGAIN.
: >
: > DO NOT E MAIL ME AGAIN OR I WILL SIGN A RESTRAINING ORDER AGAINST
: >
: > YOU.
: >
: > Sure. OKEY.
: >
: > >1.  Keep working on your "You can be a paralegal too!" at-home course.
: > >     Someday you are LIABLE to complete it.
: >
: > We need him as a paralegal like we need OJ simpson as a spokesman for
: > Ginsu.
: >
: > >2.  Read the section in your "How to get rich quick on the internet"
: manual
: > >about
: > >     how to use a mailer WITH a spell checker and actually USING the
: spell
: > >checker.
: >
: > Add to that: A caps lock KEY SO ALL HIS MESSAGES AREN'T LIKE THIS AND
: > USE RUN ON SENTENCES.
: >
: > >3.  I advise you to fully disclose what happens to your customer's pager
: > >service after the money they paid runs out.  You did do that, didn't
: you?
: >
: > Of course, what being a paralegal and a pager provider, he knows the
: > law..
: >
: > FWIW, I have notified his postmaster and advise anyone else to do the
: > same, to stop posting his Pager messages and FOR SALE: COMPUTER
: > messages which have nothing to do with amateur radio. Forward his
: > messages to [e-mail] ...
: >
: >


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!myth.vianet.on.ca!newsfeed.vivanet.com!imci5!newsfeed.internetmci.com!hunter.premier.net!news.uoregon.edu!news.gwi.net!harborside.com!news.rain.net!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: 10 Dec 1996 20:51:34 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58kigm$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd59$790ddc80$457174cf@default> <57ks88$[e-mail]> <01bbe0bf$508528e0$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe380$0fc35840$54ef1fcc@david-spillett> <[e-mail]> <01bbe631$25f4b240$6b7074
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

cf@default>:
Distribution:

1 ([e-mail]) spewed forth:
: NOTICE THAT OKAY IS SPELT WRONG.
:
:
: AND I'M A MORON?
:

Yes.

----


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!news.mcn.net!blpm01-192
From: [e-mail] (Vince Fiscus, KB7ADL)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.scanner,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space,rec.radio.scanner,sci.space.policy,sci.space.shuttle
Subject: Re: Amsat Phase 3D scheduled to be launched April 1997.
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 96 20:02:34 GMT
Organization: Montana Communications Network
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <584ld7$[e-mail]>
References: <58001s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: blpm01-192.mcn.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #3
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.scanner:42598 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119616 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43829 rec.radio.amateur.space:9009 rec.radio.scanner:72284 sci.space.policy:58647 sci.space.shuttle:51884



You can be a part of this history making event by becoming a member of the
Radio Amateur Satellite Corporation(Amsat).

For more information about Amsat and Phase 3D
Write:

AMSAT-NA
850 Sligo Ave.
Silver Spring, MD. 20910-4703

or

http://www.amsat.org/amsat/AmsatHome.html


73 de KB7ADL

1997 Countdown to Phase 3D !




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (kim campbell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AN/TRC77(A)
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 06:05:00 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <582j3b$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-213-238.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 4 Dec 1996 01:11:07 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I was wondering whether anyone used these radios in actual service. It
kind of looks like they were replaced almost as soon as they were
placed in sevice. I would be curious to know there history in the
field. I'm also looking for the battery box for  TRC77A. 73.

                                           Reguards
                                           Kim WB4LZQ

email to: wb4lzq @ mindspring.com



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.ac.net!pacifier!mvb.saic.com!eskimo!news.pixi.com!news.hula.net!spartacus.hula.net!jfenn
From: Joesph Fenn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ant Tuners (which one)
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 11:52:37 -1000
Organization: Hula Net, Inc.  Hawaii's Newest Internet Provider
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spartacus.hula.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="0-611750273-849736357=:29819"

  This message is in MIME format.  The first part should be readable text,
  while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.
  Send mail to [e-mail] for more info.

--0-611750273-849736357=:29819
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I am sitting here with the MFJ 97 catalog in lap and trying figure out
which tuner to buy, the MFJ949E, the MFJ969, or mFJ986.   I kinda lean
towards the latter, not because of the 3kw power handling, but the
differential capacitor and roller inductor (thus requiring only one
knob to crank the coil and one knob to tune with.  I know its quite
a bit more money than the 949e but what the hell.   What are your
recommendations (you Ant tuner buffs?)
(I need it primarily to reach fqcys up around 3353 and/or 2220 MARS
fqcys) as my big DRKE 2kw tuner     2000 just goes to 80 and cant
handle an 80 meter ant tuned to 160 meter fqcys.   Thanks for
any guidance.
                Joe/KH6JF




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From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ant Tuners (which one)
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 15:11:27 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <586oja$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-152.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Joesph Fenn <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I am sitting here with the MFJ 97 catalog in lap and trying figure out
>which tuner to buy, the MFJ949E, the MFJ969, or mFJ986.   I kinda lean
>towards the latter, not because of the 3kw power handling, but the
>differential capacitor and roller inductor (thus requiring only one
>knob to crank the coil and one knob to tune with.  I know its quite
>a bit more money than the 949e but what the hell.   What are your
>recommendations (you Ant tuner buffs?)

Aloha Joe,
First, lets do some number conversion. MFJ's 3KW = about 500 watts.
On 3.795 mhz, I melted the roller inductor in about 15 minutes with 800
watts on SSB.  The lower in frequency you go, the less power the tuner
seems to be capable of handling.  Why, I dunno. Gary can probably explain
it.  I recently gave it a try on 160.  At about 300 watts, a loud zitting nois
e
was heard and more smoke.  Internal investigation revealed that that
littly crappy piece of 'insulating' material on the roller inductor had a very
large black carbon track across it.  I managed to fix that by replacing the
burned up insulator with plexiglass.   I have used the tuner on 20 meters
at 1KW with no noticable smoke,  but I really would have to say that it's
a great 100 watt tuner.  Yes, the differential T design makes less knobs to
tune.  About once a week, you can take the top off an recalabrate the turns
counter on the roller inductor by removing the rubber band that drives it
and reseting everything back to zero, then reinstall the rubber band.  The
tuner was appantle designed to be installed 8 feet about the operators head,
as the numbers on the turns counter veiwed from straight on don't line up
very well with the hole in the case.  The metering circuit, according to my
Kenwood meter and several others is only off by about 40 percent in the power
range, and when the Kenwood meter says the SWR is flat (and the meter in the
Icom does too) the MFJ meter reads about 1.5:1 SWR.   All in all, I'd say it's
 a
Mighty Fine piece of Junk.

Now if you wanna buy a used one, I bet I know where you can get one.
No, it's not in perfect condition. It has scratches on the case, some of the
screws are missing, I don't have the original box, and I smoke like a house
on fire so the whole damn thing is yellow.  Two of the little rubber feet are
missing, so it leans a bit to one side. Make me an offer I can't resist.

I really don't know what else to recommend, Joe.  I think the only tuner I
have seen that I would consider buying is the Nye Viking, and it's a bit more
expensive than the MFJ.  Since money is not object, why don't you go ahead
and buy the Nye Viking, and if you like it I'll buy one too. I have never boug
ht
one as I would like to see one in person and we don't have a ham store here.
Ten Tec also has a 2KW tuner, you might want to look into that one.

73, Jim KH2D
P.S. Sometime when you aren't busy, you might want to drop me an email and
explain this MIME stuff to me.

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From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 09:41:05 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Antenna Tower Installation?
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
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I want to put up a 30 ft. tower on top of my 22. floor apartment. The reason f
or that is that there are many parabolic dishes and a metal forest of other an
tennas...

Does anyone have experience in tower installation? I know where I can get
the tower segments, but unfortunately the guys at the store don┤t know
how to install it.

I don┤t know what type of guy wire I need, nor how to attach the guy wire
to the roof. Should I screw the bottom of the tower down or should I mix
some
concrete?

I┤m really getting desperate, I hope someone can help a fellow ham :)

73, Patrick
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!winternet.com!visi.com!mr.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Antenna Tower Installation?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 10:24:06 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58jdkt$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32572 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120221

[e-mail] wrote:

>I want to put up a 30 ft. tower on top of my 22. floor apartment. The reason
for that is that there are many parabolic dishes and a metal forest of other a
ntennas...

>Does anyone have experience in tower installation? I know where I can get
>the tower segments, but unfortunately the guys at the store don┤t know
>how to install it.

>I don┤t know what type of guy wire I need, nor how to attach the guy wire
>to the roof. Should I screw the bottom of the tower down or should I mix
>some
>concrete?

>I┤m really getting desperate, I hope someone can help a fellow ham :)

>73, Patrick
>-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet

Patrick, most tower companies will be glad to supply you with the necessary
engineering data to install their towers.  Skip the guy in the store.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!132.205.106.4!newsflash.concordia.ca!sunqbc.risq.net!athena.ulaval.ca!ragueneau.gel.ulaval.ca!simard01
From: [e-mail] (Vincent Simard)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Any comments on the HTX-242???
Date: 6 Dec 1996 01:28:51 GMT
Organization: Departement de genie electrique, Universite Laval
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <587ssj$6q9$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ragueneau.gel.ulaval.ca
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Is it a good radio?  Experiences with it?  Thanks for any info...

73's
VE2VSB




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:56 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Scott E. Parker)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Anyone acquainted with the Midland 77-117?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 9 Dec 96 16:23:19 MDT
Organization: Utah State University
Lines: 20
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.cb:38991 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120145 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43984


I would like to get in touch with anyone well acquainted with the Midland
77-117.  This is a CB transceiver that also receives VHF weather channels.
Specific questions I am seeking answers to are:

1. Do the CB and WX receivers share a common IF?  Just how much circuitry
   do the two have in common?

2. Does anyone have a schematic handy?  Is one included with the manual?

3. How well does the receiver perform, both at HF and VHF?  Specs?

TIA, -SEP

=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
                         Scott E. Parker    K7LU
                Center for Atmospheric and Space Sciences
             Utah State University      Logan, UT 84322-4405
   Internet: [e-mail]   [e-mail]
Twisted pair: 801-797-2975 (USU)  801-225-9353 (FAX)  801-375-4136 (home)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!galileo.cris.com!Insight
From: INSIGHT Services <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Anyone in Knoxville, TN area ?
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 12:04:24 -0500
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: galileo.cris.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

I am looking for someone in the local area to help answer a few questions.
Like , why when the bands are open for everyone else am I not able to even
get a tone much less copy ? Are the mountains that much of a factor ? IF
you have a sec and care to answer these and maybe a few more questions it
would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

---
Susan Driggers
Spam Killer !
In the Mountains of Eastern Tennessee, USA
DX-394 with 35 foot Random Wire
Kenwood TS-520S with 35 foot Random Wire
Real radios glow in the dark !




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:16:59 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB088 McNamara to leave FCC
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 10 Dec 1996 16:52:05 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 40
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
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SB QST @ ARL $ARLB088
ARLB088 McNamara to leave FCC

ZCZC AG68
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 88  ARLB088
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 10, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB088
ARLB088 McNamara to leave FCC

FCC Private Wireless Division Chief Robert McNamara, N1KHF, says
he'll be leaving the FCC December 13 to take a position with Nextel
Communications Inc, a major telecommunications service supplier.
McNamara, 51, has been with the FCC for 21 years.

Deputy Private Wireless Division Chief David Horowitz will become
acting chief of the Private Wireless Division upon McNamara's
departure.

The Private Wireless Division is the part of the Wireless
Telecommunications Bureau that regulates Amateur Radio as well as
matters concerning public safety, industrial, transportation and
other private radio services, aviation, marine, IVDS, broadcast
auxiliary service, personal radio services, point-to-point
microwave, antenna tower clearance, and the radio operator
examination program.

ARRL Executive Vice President David Sumner, K1ZZ, said the League is
disappointed to see McNamara leave the FCC.  ''Ever since Ralph
Haller left the FCC, Bob McNamara has been our primary contact on
policy matters,'' he said.  ''We're sorry the FCC is losing him.''

McNamara attended the ARRL National Convention in Peoria earlier
this year and met with ARRL Board members there.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:00 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB089 Vanity call update
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 10 Dec 1996 16:55:06 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 41
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12390 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120275


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB089
ARLB089 Vanity call update

ZCZC AG69
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 89  ARLB089
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 10, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB089
ARLB089 Vanity call update

As FCC personnel in Gettysburg work their way through the vanity
applications that arrived after the September 23 opening day for
Gate 2, more new call signs have begun to show up on the airwaves.
As of this week, vanity applications received in mid to late October
were being processed and another 1700 or so new call signs issued as
of December 4. The FCC is still working through several hundred
applications set aside in the WIPS (''works in process'') stack for
special handling, although Gettysburg reports WIPS have been
processed for applications received up through September 27. WIPS
includes applications containing inconsistencies as well as those
for which the FCC was unable to issue any of the applicants'
choices. An FCC spokesman in Gettysburg said he didn't know how long
it would take to process the current WIPS stack.

The FCC received another 955 vanity applications between November 8
and November 25. It appears that slightly more vanity applicants now
file electronically than on paper.

Club station trustees who recently received a new call sign might
have noticed that FCC records for their club stations are not
automatically updated to reflect the change in the trustee's call
sign. This will not happen until the club files a Form 610 for
change of address or renewal (within 90 days of club license
expiration).  The FCC does not intend to replace club station
license documents that show a non current trustee call sign.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB090 ARRL Instructor of the Year Nominations Open
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 11 Dec 1996 15:19:04 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 34
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Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12392 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120316


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB090
ARLB090 ARRL Instructor of the Year Nominations Open

ZCZC AG70
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 90  ARLB090
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 11, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB090
ARLB090 ARRL Instructor of the Year Nominations Open

Nominations are due to ARRL Section Managers by January 31, 1997 for
the ARRL Instructor of the Year awards.  Each year, the ARRL Board
of Directors selects recipients for each of four award categories.

The ARRL Herb S. Brier (W9AD) Instructor of the Year Award is
presented to a nonpaid volunteer instructor.  The Herb S. Brier
award is cosponsored by the Lake County (Indiana), Amateur Radio
Club.  The ARRL Professional Educator of the Year Award is presented
to a paid, professional teacher.  The ARRL Professional Instructor
of the Year Award is presented to a paid, but not certified,
instructor.  The ARRL Excellence in Recruiting Award is presented to
someone who recruits more than teaches.  The ARRL Excellence in
Recruiting Award is cosponsored by Lambda Amateur Radio Club (USA).

Section Managers forward nominations to the Educational Activities
Department at ARRL, and EAD will send details to nominees about how
to compete for the awards.  See QST (page 12) for your section
manager's name and address.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.rio.com!news
From: "FUman" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Re: ARRL lawyer to sue member
Date: 2 Dec 1996 07:21:47 GMT
Organization: kg7fu
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <01bbe021$c538d7c0$[e-mail]>
References: <01bb739f.8e9f00c0$[e-mail]> <57ac8a$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57qr02$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Jim Hutchings <[e-mail]> wrote in article =
<[e-mail]>...

> second, I have been in the unfortunate position where a qualified =
capable=20
> lawyer was required.  To my great relief, we won our case and I vowed =
to=20
> never again tell another lawyer joke...I no longer get the humor
> Jim Hutchings  VE5HM

Gee, good for you Jim! How much did he charge you?

Don't you ever wonder about the screwball laws being written everyday
to restrict and regulate our laws? Do you think they're written by
Joe Concerned Citizen?

How about the financial impact lawyers have on our everyday lives?
Every time they win some humongous settlement in some pea brained
case it ends up costing the taxpayers and consumers.

Ever look up justice in the dictionary? How about all those crooks and
murders that get off every year due to some "technicality"? Ever hear
of the case of the divorce where the mom was suicidal and mentally
unable to cope without anti-psychotic medication and the father was
"normal"...mom got custody.

The responses you see here are direct reflections of our own experiences
and disdain for lawyers. When one threatedned to sue me, I posted it
so the world could see what they are really like.

Sorry you don't agree that the world would be a safer and cheaper place
without them.

de kg7fu


















From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!198.161.84.3!scanner.worldgate.com!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!mongol.sasknet.sk.ca![e-mail]
From: Jim Hutchings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Re: ARRL lawyer to sue member
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 19:39:38 -0800
Organization: SaskNet News Distribution
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bb739f.8e9f00c0$[e-mail]> <57ac8a$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57qr02$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe021$c538d7c0$[e-mail]>
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>
> Sorry you don't agree that the world would be a safer and cheaper place
> without them.
>
> de kg7fu
>
> The anti-gun control groups have a snappy slogan that basically says,
"guns don't cause crime any more than flys cause garbage".  Without
debating the validity of that particular statement, I think that it's
unfair to blame lawyers for the state of our society.  I'm not suggesting
that I agree with the strange things that go on in the "legal system"
(anyone collecting oxymorons??).
On the positive side of this topic, you might note that the Feds have now
decreed that aircraft manufacturers will only be liable for 18 years
after their product has been sold instead of eternity.  Common sense does
prevail eventually.
Another point to consider is that many of these unbelievable judgements
have been rendered by juries!!  Has the point been reached where we can
no longer trust the juries??
Our society has serious problems and sleazy lawyers are a symptom, not
the problem itself.
Honest, hardworking lawyers do exist and are a valuable commodity when
someone decides to rain on your parade.  And yes, they're not
necessarily cheap, but most will try to keep costs down when they know
you're not well-off.
73 de Jim Hutchings VE5HM


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:06 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Re: ARRL lawyer to sue member
Date: 3 Dec 1996 13:37:31 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <581s1b$[e-mail]>
References: <01bb739f.8e9f00c0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe021$c538d7c0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>,
        Jim Hutchings  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>> The anti-gun control groups have a snappy slogan that basically says,
>"guns don't cause crime any more than flys cause garbage".  Without
>debating the validity of that particular statement, I think that it's
>unfair to blame lawyers for the state of our society.

You are, to some degree, correct.

The proliferation of lawsuits really isn't the fault of the Trial
Lawyers Association. In a sense, they are merely providing a service
to accomodate a demand for legal services in our country.

It is the desire to "get rich quick" (and sueing someone seems to
be a way of doing that with little to no risk if you can get a
lawyer to take your case on a percentage basis, which most will)
that the American people have today [inherently lazy bastards
they are -- the Japanese were right -- they want to lay around
with the good life, no work, have everything paid for them by
someone else -- basically an extension of the welfare-state
mentality that permeates this country today].

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.74.141.7!news.callamer.com!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: Roy Keeley <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Re: ARRL lawyer to sue member
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 11:14:10 -0600
Organization: Railway Express, Inc.
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Jim Hutchings wrote:
>
> Anthony S. Pelliccio wrote:
> >
> > In article <[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
> > >There are only 3 laywer jokes...
> > >
> > >all the rest are true stories!
> >
> > I can pretty much believe that. After reading those it makes me wish
> > I had a daughter so I could forbid her to marry a lawyer. :)
> >
> > >>Why is it that when you tell a 'joke' about an Irishman it is called
> > >>tasteless; when you tell a joke about a black it is called racist, and
> > >>when you tell a joke about a lawyer it is called funny?
> >
> > Even though you didn't post this, I missed the original response so here
> > goes:
> >
> > The reason it's funny is because by and large most lawyers are lower
> > than slime.
> >
> > Tony
>
> first of all, I doubt that this is a reasonable place to be posting this
> stuff.
> second, I have been in the unfortunate position where a qualified capable
> lawyer was required.  To my great relief, we won our case and I vowed to
> never again tell another lawyer joke...I no longer get the humor
> Jim Hutchings  VE5HM

I too once needed a lawyer, and he came thru for me. I think the problem
is the
bottom half of the class. This lower 50% has contemp for the law, and
they are
who the lawyer joke are for. Basically, it is the Judges who have my
contemp, but
then they are lawyers also. And if you say, "What about the judge in my
case, where
I won", I will just say, at one point, the Judge fell asleep, and I won
in spite of him, mainly because of the strength of my lawyer.
--
73's

Roy KC4IMC

[e-mail]
[e-mail]
[e-mail]
Snail Mail = 10675 Salt Aire Rd, E., Theodore, AL 36582, USA


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:10 1996
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Subject: Re: ARRL lawyer to sue member
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: Don Labriola <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 12:10:35 -0800
Reply-To: [e-mail]
References: <01bb739f.8e9f00c0$[e-mail]>
 <57ac8a$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]> <57qr02$[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]> <01bbe021$c538d7c0$[e-mail]>
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FUman wrote:
...
> Don't you ever wonder about the screwball laws being written everyday
> to restrict and regulate our laws? Do you think they're written by
> Joe Concerned Citizen?
>
I personally think that the best thing we could do was to give congress,
(etc.) 5  years to re-touch all of the laws to make them understandable
by the average product of our school system. It would be their choice as
to modifying the laws or improving the education system! ;o)

If it has been so poorly written that only a lawyer can read it, and two
lawyers come to different opinions of what it means, then it should not
be binding! (Think what that would do the the tax structure).

$.02 from W6QS -- Don


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:11 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Ken Durham)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: ARRL lawyer to sue member
Date: 6 Dec 1996 16:54:38 GMT
Organization: Texas Instruments
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <589j4e$[e-mail]>
References: <01bb739f.8e9f00c0$[e-mail]> <57ac8a$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57qr02$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe021$c538d7c0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>>
>> Sorry you don't agree that the world would be a safer and cheaper place
>> without them.
>>
>> de kg7fu
>>
>> The anti-gun control groups have a snappy slogan that basically says,
>"guns don't cause crime any more than flys cause garbage".  Without
>debating the validity of that particular statement, I think that it's
>unfair to blame lawyers for the state of our society.  I'm not suggesting
>that I agree with the strange things that go on in the "legal system"
>(anyone collecting oxymorons??).
>On the positive side of this topic, you might note that the Feds have now
>decreed that aircraft manufacturers will only be liable for 18 years
>after their product has been sold instead of eternity.  Common sense does
>prevail eventually.
>Another point to consider is that many of these unbelievable judgements
>have been rendered by juries!!  Has the point been reached where we can
>no longer trust the juries??
>Our society has serious problems and sleazy lawyers are a symptom, not
>the problem itself.
>Honest, hardworking lawyers do exist and are a valuable commodity when
>someone decides to rain on your parade.  And yes, they're not
>necessarily cheap, but most will try to keep costs down when they know
>you're not well-off.
>73 de Jim Hutchings VE5HM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
header edited



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:11 1996
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From: franky B <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AT 930 problem
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:25:55 -0800
Organization: GLOBE
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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I have some problems with my TS-930, the antenna tuner doesn't work
properly. After 2 tunings he doesn't want to tune anymore, it's just
like the tuner is not reseted after a few tunings.

And when I push the PTT, the led AT-tune isn't lighted anymore, so
he even don't check the SWR anymore..

Did anyone had the same problem, of if you could give me some
advice please mail me.

Franky
ON4CEL


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:12 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ATTN: Florida Hams
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 96 22:45:14 EDT
Lines: 11
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My girlfriend and I was hoping to go to Key West this year for Xmas
but as it seems all the State Parks are booked up
for the hoildays. We was wondering if anyone out there could suggest
a campsite for about 4 days somewhere in warm florida.
On the Gulf of Mexico or Atlantic is fine. Guess next best thing
would be Mobile, AL or Gulf Port,MS areas. Or is a little to
cold to camp in those areas ?
Thanks for any help,
73 Kyle



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Back on 10M!
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 08:52:37 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
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Back on the subject of 10 Meters, just last night I was building a power suppl
y on the bench and had
forgotten that I had left my rig left on and tuned to 29.68. I was just about
to solder the last couple
of wires when all of a sudden I hear calls from all over the mid-west!  This w
as at 11:30 pm pacific!

I couldn't believe how open the band was at that hour!

73's  Jim.. KB6ZOP


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!144.212.100.12!news.mathworks.com!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!uknet!lyra.csx.cam.ac.uk!news.ox.ac.uk!sable.ox.ac.uk!quee0363
From: Ronan Bellabarba <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: sci.chem.organomet,sci.engr.chem,sci.chem,comp.os.ms-windows.networking.misc,comp.infosystems.gopher,131,rec.sport.football.australian,alt.asian-movies,rec.skiing.snowboard,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.invest,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,[e-mail],rec.autos.vw,[e-mail],alt.2600,k12.lang.deutsch-eng,k12.lang.francais,aus.ads.forsale,aus.ads.forsale.computers
Subject: Re: BAN/INTERNET
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 1996 11:31:00 +0000
Organization: Oxford University
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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>
> ILLEGAL INTERNET CENSORSHIP/BAN: AN AUSTRALIAN FIRST (SEE BELOW).
> SMUGGLING BOOK BACK ON MARKET - CALL FOR ROYAL COMMISSION.
>
[........bla bla ......}

what the hell has THIS got to do with organometallic chemistry???

Ronan.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:16 1996
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From: Dettol <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: sci.chem.organomet,sci.engr.chem,sci.chem,comp.os.ms-windows.networking.misc,comp.infosystems.gopher,131,rec.sport.football.australian,alt.asian-movies,rec.skiing.snowboard,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.invest,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,[e-mail],rec.autos.vw,[e-mail],alt.2600,k12.lang.deutsch-eng,k12.lang.francais,aus.ads.forsale,aus.ads.forsale.computers
Subject: Re: BAN/INTERNET
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:42:07 -1000
Organization: university of hawaii
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Ronan Bellabarba wrote:
>
> >
> > ILLEGAL INTERNET CENSORSHIP/BAN: AN AUSTRALIAN FIRST (SEE BELOW).
> > SMUGGLING BOOK BACK ON MARKET - CALL FOR ROYAL COMMISSION.
> >
> [........bla bla ......}
>
> what the hell has THIS got to do with organometallic chemistry???
>
> Ronan.

FUCK ALL!!!   ...Actually less than fuck all, FUCK NOTHING!!


MIKE


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!xara.net!emerald.xara.net!xara.net!agate.xara.net!news
From: "Kevin A Young" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap
Subject: battery box
Date: 7 Dec 96 19:20:16 GMT
Organization: Bear Graphics Ltd.
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <01bbe473$a4731cc0$281ae0c3@radioman>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan.stargate.co.uk
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I am looking for information on building a battery box with an old ice
chest.  The article was published in 73 magazine about 1 year ago maybe
april through august 1995.  Any good leads in this direction would be
helpful.  Thanks KC7FPF return Email to [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!sn.no!usenet
From: Tore Stabell Kuloe <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: best buy: reciver for aviation-listening
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 03:11:17 +0100
Organization: SN Internett
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: nesodden2-5.ppp.sn.no
Mime-Version: 1.0
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I bet one of you gurus out there can answer this simple (?) question:
I am listening to aviation traffic on SSB with my lousy Sangean ATS818.
Now it`s time to buy a decent reciever. So I thought: Why not ask you?
SSB - memories - price around 600USD, 400UKP.

I`d be happy if someone would reply on this request.

Yours...
--

Tore Stabell Kuloe  (Kul°)
[e-mail]
Bjoernemyr terrasse 20
N-1453 Bjoernemyr
NORGE - NORWAY


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:19 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Black helicopters/Preserving ham radio
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 10:40:19 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E-NC250  (Win16; U)

To all concerned:
        I'm Not a "chicken little" cowering in fear looking for black
helicopters , X-file type conspirices in all aspects of daily life, nor
do I intend to off myself from the Brooklyn bridge to prevent the
sinister powers that be from snatching our frequencies. All I want to do
is prevent COMMERCIAL interests from eating us for breakfast. And just
a word of note here. Iv'e noticed that most of the people telling me to
shut up are those who work for Bell labs, MCI, Lucent, and so on. Just
the very self same groops that Want us to shut up and die.
                                        Dave/KB2ZYO


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!ns2.mainstreet.net!newsfeeder.netgate.net!rtm
From: [e-mail] (Bob Martin N6MZV)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: California Ham License Plates
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 10:32:36 -0800
Organization: NetGate Communications
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <587c5e$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d47.netgate.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.5

In article <587c5e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jerry Gardner) wrote
:

> Anyone know the name of the CA DMV form to apply for or change the
> call on ham license plates? I changed my call and want to change my
> plates as well. The people behind the counter at the local DMV are clueless.

It used to be DMV form 441 -

The vanity plate computer system will reject anything that looks like a ham
call - just its way of being friendly. Ham plates are done using a different
form.  (Besides, vanity plates cost you $$ every year where ham plates are a
one time charge.) You'll need a copy of your license with you.

Remember to be patient - you can't push a piece of string.

73-

--

Bob Martin N6MZV          * [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!ccnet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Jerry Gardner)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: California Ham License Plates
Date: 5 Dec 1996 12:43:26 -0800
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <587c5e$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ccnet3

Anyone know the name of the CA DMV form to apply for or change the
call on ham license plates? I changed my call and want to change my
plates as well. The people behind the counter at the local DMV are clueless.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!EU.net!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!not-for-mail
From: Steve Sorn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Callsign-to-email gateway
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 11:42:58 -0800
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 5
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cq0-21.dxnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Just interesting. There is callsign-to-email gateway.
http://www.callsign.net
Every email to [e-mail] is forwarded to your
real email address. So your friends don't need to remember your
actual email address. It's free service.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CARL WHERE OUR YOU,OUR YOU MAD AT ME
Date: 8 Dec 1996 04:02:31 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

CARL I have sent a Bunch of Email to you in regards to CW our you Mad at
me or will you respond, Iam waiting for your response Please dont
disapoint me Carl


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!swrinde!news.sgi.com!newshub.sdsu.edu!gondor!rohan!sheckler
From: [e-mail] (don)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CB antenna for 2M?
Date: 4 Dec 1996 22:15:58 GMT
Organization: San Diego State University Computing Services
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <584t6u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 130.191.143.100
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL0]


I have a Jeep Cherokee with a CB installed.  I was wondering if I
could install a 2M radio and use the CB antenna.

Also, does anyone know if there are problems with the Cherokee when
a 2M radio is installed?

Thanks,

Don


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Dennis Breeden <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CB antenna for 2M?
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:58:50 -0600
Organization: Reuter
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <584t6u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.221.72
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win95; I)

don wrote:
>
> I have a Jeep Cherokee with a CB installed.  I was wondering if I
> could install a 2M radio and use the CB antenna.
>
> Also, does anyone know if there are problems with the Cherokee when
> a 2M radio is installed?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Don

A full 8 1/2 foot whip is about 5/4 wavelenghts.  I have done this and
gotten a good match in a pinch.  MFJ also sell a 2 meter tuner.
D. Pat Breeden  73's    WB3KUM/9


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.infi.net!usenet
From: Tim Otty <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Christmas Computer Shows
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 10:53:24 -0500
Organization: PC Fest
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pa6dsp2.orf.infi.net
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PC Fest Computer Shows for the Christmas Season

Saturday        Dec 14th        Norfolk, Virginia

        "Scope Convention Center"

Sunday          Dec 15th        Richmond, Virginia

        "Virginia State Fairgrounds, at Strawberry Hill"

Saturday        Dec 21st        Gaithersburg, Maryland

        "Montogomery County Fairgrounds"

Sunday          Dec 22nd        Timonium, Maryland

        "Maryland State Fairgrounds"

FOUR GREAT SHOWS, FOUR GREAT SHOW LOCATIONS !!!

Toshiba, IBM, NEC, Hewlett Packard, Okidata, Sony, Texas Instruments,
Iomega, Syquest, 3M, Western Digital, Seagate, TEAC, Fujitsu,
Microsoft, Key Tronic, Epson, Intel,
and many other NAME BRAND products to choose from.

Local and National distributors

Memory, Upgrades, Systems, Software, Hardware, Accessories, and MORE!

Show hours 10AM - 4PM

Admission is $6 (A $1 off coupon is available on our website)

Children under 12 FREE (With paid adult admission)

For more information, Show directions, and Coupon;

http://www.infi.net/~pcshows




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!uhog.mit.edu!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news1.rcsntx.swbell.net!usenet
From: George Baker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Circuit Simulator
Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 23:50:37 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-151-164-41-186.rcsntx.swbell.net
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Dean T. Miller wrote:
>
> Hi George,
>
> Circuitmaker uses industry standard input/output for it's SPICE, PCB
> layout and other files (from what I can tell).  IOW, CircuitMaker can
> use the SPICE data from manufacturers while Electronic Workbench cannot.

Thanks, Dean - this is exceptionally good input. I was not aware of that short
coming of
EWB. Still looking and considering, but CircuitMaker is looking better all the
 time.

--
73, George
W5YR
Fairview, TX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:28 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Circuit Simulator
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57qfb2$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 13:54:35 GMT
Lines: 29

In article <57qfb2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) shared these priceless pearls of
>wisdom:
>->Just pull a copy of Spice down from the net and use that. It is probably
>->the best simulator available for analog circuits, and you can't beat the
>->price. All the component manufacturers supply Spice models for their
>->components. It is a great tool.
>
>Gary --
>
>I found a demo routine that claims to provide spice models.  The trouble
>with the damn thing for RF is that there has to be a resistive path to
>ground from every node.  Trying to do a simple tapped-capacitor filter has
>totally glommed the thing up with 100 Megohm resistors from every port just
>to dummy up that which doesn't exist.
>
>Do you know if this is a fundamental limitation of Spice or this particular
>programmer's implementation of it.

Most implementations make this transparent to the user. They'll add
a teraohm resistor automatically.

Gary

--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.tamu.edu!news.utdallas.edu!nrchh45.rich.nt.com!bcarh189.bnr.ca!nott!nntp.igs.net!nntp.igs.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Gordon Dey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Circuit Simulator
Date: 6 Dec 1996 22:43:16 -0500
Organization: IGS - Information Gateway Services
Lines: 19
Distribution: na
Message-ID: <58ap4k$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57qfb2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: host.ott.igs.net
Summary: virtual "grounds"
Keywords: spice convergance teraohm

Regarding needing the teraohm resisters at every node...

My humble guess:
The simulator algorithm needs to "converge" to an operating point before
it can start simulating. The problem is, capacitive elements look like they
have open or "floating" nodes with respect to an arbitrary "ground" node. If
a DC voltage or DC current cannot be computed from every element's (remember
that for a capacitor z=1/(wC)) equasions, then an operating point for the
whole "circuit" can't be found. You can't pass go, you can't collect $200.

But in real-life, you say, the answer is obvious, "With a constant V source,
the capacitor voltage is V and the current is 0." Well, sort of. Every
real component has losses, leakages, and parasitic elements. So sticking
a teraohm resister in parallel with the capacitor (or from any node to the
reference, for that matter) is probably less realistic than all of the
parasitics and leakages that usually aren't put in by the modeller, and it
means the simulator can guarantee it can find an operating point.

Summary: IMHO, don't sweat it. It's a necessary DC simulation artifact.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 2 Dec 1996 15:16:44 GMT
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <57urss$7eu$[e-mail]>
References: <57ptbd$lag$[e-mail]> <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <57 <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-66.ca.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Clint Bradford) w
rites:
>
>>>Roger J. Buffington
>>>USC Law School, Class of '97
>
>Hey - were you at the game yesterday???

No, alas.  Great game though.  About time we kicked Notre Dame's butt.

Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV
[e-mail]

USC Law School, Class of '97

--------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather."
"Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers."
--------------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:31 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 19:09:34 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <57v9do$[e-mail]>
References: <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <575og5$[e-mail]> <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57tgan$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-146.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Kevin Potter <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Why would one person own/operate 5 repeaters?

I give up. Because he couldn't afford 6 repeaters ?






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:32 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 12:51:00 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <575og5$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Greg Bullough wrote:

> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
> >Greg, you are a fool.
>
> I'd as soon not be called names by yourself, if it weren't for the
> honor.

I would imagine that fool is the most honorable you have been called.



> >                      You are trying to shift the focus of this
>
> Which would be?

If you have to ask then forget it as you wouldn't understand.



> Straight to the issues again, jmackey.

yepper


> >So what's YOUR investiment here, GREG?
>
> Just a real neat hobby which seems to be moving towards 'Old Boys'
> clubs and 'Members Only' club-houses on erected on public property,
> until all the public property is gone.

Actually, I would have to agree with you here.  I think
the good old boys mentality is a bunch of crap.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:33 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 13:03:02 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <575og5$[e-mail]> <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57n6u7$20he$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57otq1$tm0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] wrote:

> In <[e-mail]>, John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> writes:
> >For being a Law Student & licensed ham, you sure don't know much.

> Golly, John, with a lead in like that, I just can't wait to be enlightened b
y
> your wisdom.

Sure Roger, anything to help.


> >The first system on the air will always have first dibs on the
> >frequency. That is the way the fcc does things.
>
> Gee.  Too bad the above statement by Wiseman John reveals an utter
> lack of understanding of how coordination works.

You have no idea what you are talking about.  I have been involved
in coordination starting in 1990 at the national level & locally before
that.

Funny, I don't remember ever seeing or hearing your name at any of the
national repeater coordination meetings, I guess you have either no
experience or limited local experience.



> Ever notice that people like John, who begin their statements with some
> condescending put-down of others, usually turn out not to know much about
> what they are talking about?

I was just thinking the same of you.  So far you have claimed to be an
expert
at coordination but have only shown that you do not kow what you are
talking
about.


> Thanks for the "wisdom," John.

NO prob, any time.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!demos!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 13:11:41 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <575og5$[e-mail]> <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57p3h8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] wrote:
> I can affirm that statement, because I am one of the cheap ass users that
> refused to pay any money to this dick, i instead bought a cell phone....

True, & because of dicks like you I also bought a cellphone & cancelled
the autopatch.  :)

But, at least you did help in other ways, like the time I needed help
sawing that 2x4 to support that shelf at the site.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 12:33:22 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57ll7c$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Greg Bullough wrote:

> What a class act.

Thanks Greg, perhaps you are not as bad as we thought.  :)


> Tell, us, John. Are you trying to show us why some repeaters are
> closed, and is the reason people who behave like yourself?


No, actually it is because of people who behave like you.  I have
several
repeaters, some closed, some open.

If you have to ask, then you probably are the problem.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 2 Dec 1996 17:54:11 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <57vmmj$[e-mail]>
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]> <56ofc3$[e-mail]> <57h581$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Anthony R. Gold <[e-mail]> wrote:

>It sounds like an abomination if the prior presence of closed
>repeaters can prevent the commissioning of a new open machine from
>gaining immediate frequency-coordinated approval.

Why is that? Should two people holding a private conversation on
HF be forced off-frequency because an "open" net wants to start up
on the same frequency?


>Here's a suggestion: Why not continue to allow closed machines, but
>with the risk and liability for pre-emption of their channel by an
>applicant for an open repeater. Then the closed machine's owners
>could choose between yielding the channel to the public open machine,
>or themselves deciding to open up their machine and therby retaining
>their coordinated allocation?

Two reasons offhand:

1. Frequency coordinators are not empowered by the FCC under Part 97
to make value judgements regarding the acceptability of one repeater's
"openness" versus anothers. A frequency coordinator's job is purely
to reduce inter-repeater interference, as defined in 97.3.

2. What objective criteria is used to determine what is "open" and
"closed". It is my privilege, under 97.205(e), to restrict access
to anyone I so desire. What do you do if I coordinate my machine as
an "open" repeater, and then tell everyone I do not want on it to
stay off? My repeater is "open", and I am merely exercising my
FCC-granted privileges. A frequency coordinator cannot usurp
federal regulations.


>Clearly and properly, in bands and in locations where there is no
>shortage of coordinated frequencies, the ownership of closed
>repeaters would be unaffected by such a system.  But in other
>areas this rule would also ahve the tendency to cause a migration of
>closed machines upwards in frequency and into bands which are less
>used and more open to assault on account of non-use by other
>frequency-starved services.

The flip-side is also appropriate. If a band is "full", why not
ask those seeking frequency coordination to move up to a higher
band where there is an abundance of open frequencies?

The reason why, despite what the "I want all repeaters to be open"
crowd tells you, is their real reason is motivated by class
envy. Its akin to the "tax the rich". They merely can't stand the
thought of someone having something that they personally cannot
access for free. It infuriates them.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 2 Dec 1996 14:22:57 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <57vaah$[e-mail]>
References: <57ll40$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57qtsh$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>, Greg Bullough <[e-mail]> wrote:

>No, it is not. Many of us have endorsed the notion of your being
>welcome to your private machine. On a band which in your region
>is free from crowding.

Right. I prefer the "I was here first, you QSY" approach to
frequency management.

Why don't >YOU< go to those "less crowded" bands?


Oh. I know. You want someone else to build the infrastructure,
create demand for radios at that band, and lower the cost for you.
Just like people in So. Cal. did on 440mhz decades ago. Then you
can kick them off in the name of "open repeaters for ALL!"

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 15:59:36 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <575og5$[e-mail]> <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57tgan$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Kevin Potter wrote:
> Why would one person own/operate 5 repeaters?

It was my donation to the community.  :)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 12:17:08 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]> <56vgj3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <575og5$[e-mail]> <57io32$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57ou05$tm0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

[e-mail] wrote:

> You know, John, the above strikes me as an excellent description of your
> own behavior.
>
> Roger J. Buffington
> USC Law School, Class of '97

Actually, I would have expected a little more intellect from a
Law student.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:40 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 12:35:47 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

> In <[e-mail]>, John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> writes:
> >Sounds like Greg had a case of alligator mouth/canary bird ass.

> Another self-description
> Roger J. Buffington
> W6VZV

Yea, I notice you just had to respond Roger.  It does resemble you.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:41 1996
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From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 96 19:59:23 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <56ntsh$[e-mail]> <56o9u0$[e-mail]> <56ofc3$[e-mail]> <57h581$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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In article <57h581$[e-mail]> [e-mail] "Bill Nelson" writes:

> [e-mail] wrote:

> : Correct me if I am wrong.  Still, I DO think that closed repeaters
> : are, like KC7GNM said, not in the amateur spirit.
>
> Agreed, but the FCC apparently feels otherwise.

I'm glad to say that closed repeaters are unknown in the UK.  Maybe
that's true throughout Europe.

It sounds like an abomination if the prior presence of closed
repeaters can prevent the commissioning of a new open machine from
gaining immediate frequency-coordinated approval.

Here's a suggestion: Why not continue to allow closed machines, but
with the risk and liability for pre-emption of their channel by an
applicant for an open repeater. Then the closed machine's owners
could choose between yielding the channel to the public open machine,
or themselves deciding to open up their machine and therby retaining
their coordinated allocation?

Clearly and properly, in bands and in locations where there is no
shortage of coordinated frequencies, the ownership of closed
repeaters would be unaffected by such a system.  But in other
areas this rule would also ahve the tendency to cause a migration of
closed machines upwards in frequency and into bands which are less
used and more open to assault on account of non-use by other
frequency-starved services.

This proposal must be worth at least 1 cent.  Checks and coins
welcome.

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:42 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 13:23:35 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Greg Bullough wrote:

> >I operate about 5 repeaters & OFTEN find people who regularly use
> >my repeaters & will not help support them.

> 1. How have you asked?

Any way I can.


> 2. What do you know of the circumstance?

What?


> 3. What is the proportion of their use?

Varies.


> 4. Where else in the hobby (and outside) are their
>    funds committed?

I don't balance their check books so I don't know.  But as
[e-mail] said, he bought a cellphone, that's a
good example.


> 5. Are you running a machine on a band which has no unused
>    pairs in your region?

Yes, on 2 meters, 440, & 6 meters.  Autopatch was active on
all bands.


> 6. Have they overtly argued that they are not responsible to
>    help?

Usually


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:42 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 16:00:29 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <575og5$[e-mail]> <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57tgan$[e-mail]> <57v9do$[e-mail]>
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Jim Kehler wrote:

> >Why would one person own/operate 5 repeaters?
>
> I give up. Because he couldn't afford 6 repeaters ?

hehehehehe, I like your way of thinking.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 3 Dec 1996 04:37:11 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <580apn$[e-mail]>
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]> <575og5$[e-mail]> <57io32$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

John "I own the Portland 147.435 repeater" Mackey--KA0SSF  wrote:

>Maybe it is just because you are so new to ham radio.  Hang around
>a while & learn something, then maybe you won't have the urge
>to constantly bitch.

Oh, it's John "I see by your callsign that you're a newbie" Mackey!
You were the anonymous poster that got caught calling Burt nasty names
from a phoney address a couple of months ago.

I see you're still talking down to people instead of talking at them.
One would have thought you'd have improved your communication skills by
now.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Tue,  3 Dec 1996 03:25:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <57urss$7eu$[e-mail]> <57ptbd$lag$[e-mail]> <57
Lines: 20


>>>Roger J. Buffington
>>>USC Law School, Class of '97

CLINT>>Hey - were you at the game yesterday???

ROGER>>No, alas.  Great game though.  About time we kicked Notre Dame's
ROGER>>butt.

Yessir!

 - S. C. Bradford (Seriously...my father was a track and football star
                   back in the 50s...all three sons are "S.C.
                   Bradfords...."


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 96 07:41:31 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]> <56ofc3$[e-mail]> <57h581$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vmmj$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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In article <57vmmj$[e-mail]>
           [e-mail] "Michael P. Deignan" writes:

> In article <[e-mail]>,
>         Anthony R. Gold <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >It sounds like an abomination if the prior presence of closed
> >repeaters can prevent the commissioning of a new open machine from
> >gaining immediate frequency-coordinated approval.
>
> Why is that? Should two people holding a private conversation on
> HF be forced off-frequency because an "open" net wants to start up
> on the same frequency?

Of the five points made in 97.1 as the Basis and Purpose of Amateur
Radio, I don't see where the use of a closed repeater scores
anywhere. I can see that designing and commissioning one could have
excellent value in training and in art advancement if the machine is
not an off-the-shelf rice box.  But when it's up and working, that's
where I see it stoping.  Indeed I'd score the Little Leo's ahead of
them for providing a better resource for emergency communications, if
I was a judge in any coming spectrum war.

> The reason why, despite what the "I want all repeaters to be open"
> crowd tells you, is their real reason is motivated by class
> envy. Its akin to the "tax the rich". They merely can't stand the
> thought of someone having something that they personally cannot
> access for free. It infuriates them.

Are you perhaps the missing child of Roy Tucker who was stolen by
gypsies long long ago?

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 3 Dec 1996 04:52:37 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <580bml$[e-mail]>
References: <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

John "I own the Portland 147.435 repeater" Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:

>Greg Bullough wrote:
>> Never, once, have I heard or seen anyone on the 'open repeater' side of
>> the argument that they have no responsibility to assist in the support
>> of machines which they regularly (and I say *regularly*) use.

>BULLSHIT.
>
>I operate about 5 repeaters ....

"About" five? You don't know exactly how many?

Why is it every few months you feel the need to tell everyone you operate
a repeater? It really doesn't elevate you above anyone. In fact, I have
a lower opinion of you because of it. You apparently feel the need to
fill a deflated ego. *Anyone* can put up rptr. And a working machine can
be made from practically any old xtal transceiver (with added shielding,
a COR, et cetera). It's no big deal, got it?

>....& OFTEN find people who regularly use
>my repeaters & will not help support them.
 ^^

Then take 'em down. They only duplicate the coverage of already-existing
machines and as such waste spectrum.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:47 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bradley Granger)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 3 Dec 1996 21:28:29 +1100
Organization: DIALix Services, Sydney, Australia.
Lines: 31
Sender: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <580vcd$2tu$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57lsf6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: [e-mail]

Jeffrey Herman ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Greg Bullough <[e-mail]> wrote:
: >Cecil Moore <[e-mail]> writes:
:
: >>Egotistical selfishness? Delusions of grandeur? Sadism? IMO,
: >>discrimination with publicly-owned property such as amateur
: >>radio frequencies should be forbidden by law. It reminds me
: >>of the White-only drinking fountains that I grew up with in
: >>Texas.
:
: >I disagree. It should be forbidden by PRACTICE! It shouldn't take
: >a law to get hams to treat each other cordially, on the simple basis
: >of having the hobby in common.
:
: Consider this, Greg: When you drive your privately-owned vehicle
: on publicly-owned roads, no one can use that portion of the pavement
: you're driving on. When you park your POV on a publicly-owned street,
: no one else can park their vehicle in that same spot. You're certainly
: not claiming ownership of a portion of the road but that's pretty much
: what it amounts to. It's something that we all accept.


OK, lets follow this line of reasoning: No-one can use the portion of
pavement I am driving on, just as no-one can transmit at the same time as
me, but we are all sharing the same highway, just as we share a repeater.
Different frequencies would be the same as different highways, but WE ALL
SHARE.

Your illustration should instead be about Private Roads. Different story.

Brad VK2QQ where the repeaters are all open.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:48 1996
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Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: Don Labriola <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 09:51:14 -0800
Reply-To: [e-mail]
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]>
 <56ofc3$[e-mail]> <57h581$[e-mail]>
 <[e-mail]> <57vmmj$[e-mail]>
Distribution: world
Organization: DDC, Beckman Instruments, Inc.
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Michael P. Deignan wrote:
...
> The flip-side is also appropriate. If a band is "full", why not
> ask those seeking frequency coordination to move up to a higher
> band where there is an abundance of open frequencies?
>
> The reason why, despite what the "I want all repeaters to be open"
> crowd tells you, is their real reason is motivated by class
> envy. Its akin to the "tax the rich". They merely can't stand the
> thought of someone having something that they personally cannot
> access for free. It infuriates them.
>
If the band was full of activity, I think that few would be complaining.
The fact that it has been privitized to quasi-commerical uses or
personally "owned" frequencies is the cause of the complaining.


> Why is that? Should two people holding a private conversation on
> HF be forced off-frequency because an "open" net wants to start up
> on the same frequency?

I 100% agree. So why should a private repeater be give the ownership of
the frequency just because they have sometimes used it in the past (as
is the case of low usage private machines). Let another share the
channel just as you noted in the HF case. Wait until the others have
finished with the frequency and then use the private machine. Sounds
good to me!


Don Labriola - W6QS - my opinions only!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:49 1996
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From: Blaster <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 12:23:33 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57lsf6$[e-mail]> <580vcd$2tu$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Hey Bradley,

Just ignore Jeffery Herman, he is an idiot & a fool.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:50 1996
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From: Don Labriola <#[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 06:12:56 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <gregE1A1L <580vcd$2tu$[e-mail]> <582kje$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: #[e-mail]
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Fred White wrote:
>
> But we are SHARING the frequencies with other repeaters. There are an
> average of 6 machines on each of the 198 repeater pairs on 440 MHz in
> Southern Calif. Besides that we have 300+ machines on two meters. The
> highway is pretty full.
>
Does this mean we really have more like Twelve Hundred 440 repeaters?
And still only the few open ones. That would mean the prior 90% closed
calculation is really more like 97%. If it really is that high -- six
per pair-- would seven make that much difference? That could open up 190
new open machines! ;o>

73's de W6QS -- Don Labriola


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Fred White)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 4 Dec 1996 01:36:46 GMT
Organization: CSUSM
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <582kje$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <gregE1A1L <580vcd$2tu$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ciscots2_3.csusm.edu

In article <580vcd$2tu$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (B
radley Granger) says:
>
>Jeffrey Herman ([e-mail]) wrote:
>: Greg Bullough <[e-mail]> wrote:
>: >Cecil Moore <[e-mail]> writes:
>:
>: >>Egotistical selfishness? Delusions of grandeur? Sadism? IMO,
>: >>discrimination with publicly-owned property such as amateur
>: >>radio frequencies should be forbidden by law. It reminds me
>: >>of the White-only drinking fountains that I grew up with in
>: >>Texas.
>:
>: >I disagree. It should be forbidden by PRACTICE! It shouldn't take
>: >a law to get hams to treat each other cordially, on the simple basis
>: >of having the hobby in common.
>:
>: Consider this, Greg: When you drive your privately-owned vehicle
>: on publicly-owned roads, no one can use that portion of the pavement
>: you're driving on. When you park your POV on a publicly-owned street,
>: no one else can park their vehicle in that same spot. You're certainly
>: not claiming ownership of a portion of the road but that's pretty much
>: what it amounts to. It's something that we all accept.
>
>
>OK, lets follow this line of reasoning: No-one can use the portion of
>pavement I am driving on, just as no-one can transmit at the same time as
>me, but we are all sharing the same highway, just as we share a repeater.
>Different frequencies would be the same as different highways, but WE ALL
>SHARE.
>
>Your illustration should instead be about Private Roads. Different story.


But we are SHARING the frequencies with other repeaters. There are an
average of 6 machines on each of the 198 repeater pairs on 440 MHz in
Southern Calif. Besides that we have 300+ machines on two meters. The
highway is pretty full.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:52 1996
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 13:20:25 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <573a6r$fkc$[e-mail]> <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580bml$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Jeffrey Herman wrote:

> John "I own the Portland 147.435 repeater" Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
> >I operate about 5 repeaters ....
>
> "About" five? You don't know exactly how many?


Jeffery "The Indredible Fool" Herman, if you want an exact list then
fine.
The repeaters I either own, sponsor, or operate are:

443.575 (4) Sioux City/Portland (2)/Seattle
443.575  portable used when/where needed, including Dayton Hamvention
147.435 Portland
53.29  Portland

That actually makes 7, but I usually don't count the second Portland
UHF repeater or the portable so that makes 5.


> Why is it every few months you feel the need to tell everyone you operate
> a repeater? It really doesn't elevate you above anyone. In fact, I have

I have only mentioned it when it is appropriate.  I don't have it in
my signature file like many repeater owners do, so shut up fool.


Why is it that every few months you feel the need to run your mouth &
make a fool of yourself on topics you know nothing about?


> a COR, et cetera). It's no big deal, got it?

Then *WHY* are you making a big deal of it?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Fred White)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 5 Dec 1996 02:42:49 GMT
Organization: CSUSM
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <585cr9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <gregE1A1L <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, Don Labriola <#[e-mail]
> says:
>
>Fred White wrote:
>>
>> But we are SHARING the frequencies with other repeaters. There are an
>> average of 6 machines on each of the 198 repeater pairs on 440 MHz in
>> Southern Calif. Besides that we have 300+ machines on two meters. The
>> highway is pretty full.
>>
>Does this mean we really have more like Twelve Hundred 440 repeaters?
>And still only the few open ones. That would mean the prior 90% closed
>calculation is really more like 97%. If it really is that high -- six
>per pair-- would seven make that much difference? That could open up 190
>new open machines! ;o>
>
>73's de W6QS -- Don Labriola

Thats because most of the open machines are listed as "private" a
policy of SCRRBA and others to keep the band from becoming utilized
like two meters. Also there many more machines than actually listed
in the repeater guides. If one looks around, they will find plenty
of available machines for use in So. Calif.







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:55 1996
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From: Don Labriola <#[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 20:11:02 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 42
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References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <gregE1A1L <[e-mail]> <585cr9$[e-mail]>
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Fred White wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]>, Don Labriola <#[e-mail].c
om> says:
> >
> >Fred White wrote:
> >>
> >> But we are SHARING the frequencies with other repeaters. There are an
> >> average of 6 machines on each of the 198 repeater pairs on 440 MHz in
> >> Southern Calif. Besides that we have 300+ machines on two meters. The
> >> highway is pretty full.
> >>
> >Does this mean we really have more like Twelve Hundred 440 repeaters?
> >And still only the few open ones. That would mean the prior 90% closed
> >calculation is really more like 97%. If it really is that high -- six
> >per pair-- would seven make that much difference? That could open up 190
> >new open machines! ;o>
> >
> >73's de W6QS -- Don Labriola
>
> Thats because most of the open machines are listed as "private" a
> policy of SCRRBA and others to keep the band from becoming utilized
> like two meters. Also there many more machines than actually listed
> in the repeater guides. If one looks around, they will find plenty
> of available machines for use in So. Calif.
>
>
Nice to know! Any good places with more "accurate" listings? I prefer
not
to be notified that the machine *really* is closed by having the machine
shut off or getting rude responses - or no responses. My commute is
between
the Glendora area and Brea area - know of any friendly machines that
make it
through the hills and canyons? The SCRUBBA listings indicating "Covers
the whole
Southern California area" are about as accurate as the other items in
their
released database. A little more info could well squelch a lot of the
ill feeling
that has been streaming through this news group of late!

73's de W6QS - Don Labriola


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:55 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 05:41:36 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <585fri$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>John "I own the Portland 147.435 repeater" Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:


>>
>>I operate about 5 repeaters ....

>"About" five? You don't know exactly how many?

Chuckle.....

No, it just varies, as John has proved himself to be very adept at
blowing up repeaters!

I will send you some interesting E-Mail, copies of john's posts when
he was blowing up repeaters.  Great for a laugh!




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:56 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 11:38:07 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57ll40$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Greg Bullough wrote:


> In rhetoric, as in ham radio, your mother was right: 'it is better to
> play with your friends than to play with yourself.'

You are an immature fool, Greg.  What rubbish.


> Let me help you: the premise at hand is that, on crowded bands (i.e.,
> those where an unassigned pair is not available), open repeaters take
> precedence over (even pre-existing) closed machines. That is all.

Really, please tell us the law or rule that supports this.

You won't be able to because there is no such rule.  Who ever
was on the freq first takes precedence regardless of wether or not
they are a closed or open repeater.  (Remember, the fcc does not
define a difference between closed or open)


> >Your language betrays your true intentions. What you're really
> >upset about is not a private repeater, but the fact that someone
> >might not let you play on their playground.

That sounds like an accurate description of Greg's problem.


> No, I just don't care for people who erect private clubs on scarce public
> property, then claim that, by virtue of their having built a club-house,
> they now own the land underneath.

See above.


> You know, we hear a lot about the 'rights' of repeater owners, but
> they forget that they are mere squatters, who remain at the pleasure
> of the public.

Actually this if the first sensible thing you have said.  You are
absolutely correct, as ANY amateur radio operator or station is really
a mere squatter.  However, the fcc does recognize non-frequency agile
relay stations as having protected input frequencies, and does not
recognize a difference between closed or open repeaters.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:57 1996
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From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 6 Dec 1996 05:24:23 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <588am7$[e-mail]>
References: <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57ll40$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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John--

What gives?  Are you trying to get people bent like you did on the
scanner newsgroup?

State your opinions without all the name calling that you've brought
with you.

KP

K5VP




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:17:58 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 6 Dec 1996 00:15:20 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <588a58$[e-mail]>
References: <c57cc$11e1f.22c@NEWS>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <c57cc$11e1f.22c@NEWS>,
        Steve Eklund  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>This is not true. It depends on which repeater has coordination
>and which does not. The FCC only says that in situations
>involving repeaters, an uncoordinated repeater has the primary
>responsibility of correcting a problem and the coordinated
>repeater has secondary responsibility.

This isn't 100% true either.

Prior to receiving coordination, most repeaters have to go through
a "construction" phase where you are tenatively assigned a frequency
and you set your machine up and operate for a period of time (3-6
months). During that time, if you do not interfere with anyone else,
you should receive your primary coordination papers.

Now. Let's assume I am operating an "uncoordinated" repeater on
Frequency A. The local frequency coordinator assigns you Frequency
A on your construction permit. You set up, and interfere with me.
Is the onus on me to clear up the problem? Absolutely not. I
occupied the frequency first, and was in operation prior to your
"tenative coordination". Therefore, it is your responsibility at
that point to ask for another frequency assignment from the FC.


>I played by the rules and
>he did not! I continue to have the coordination for the frequency
>and he does not.

There is a generally accepted timeframe for repeater downtime that
constitutes "vacating" the frequency. If this guy's machine was down
for two years before you put your machine up, I would say that he
had vacated the frequency. If he was in operation when you received
your construction permit, I would agree with him that the onus is
upon you to clear up the interference by moving to another frequency.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:00 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57lsf6$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 11:49:03 GMT
Lines: 58

In article <57lsf6$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:
>Greg Bullough <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>Cecil Moore <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>>>Egotistical selfishness? Delusions of grandeur? Sadism? IMO,
>>>discrimination with publicly-owned property such as amateur
>>>radio frequencies should be forbidden by law. It reminds me
>>>of the White-only drinking fountains that I grew up with in
>>>Texas.
>
>>I disagree. It should be forbidden by PRACTICE! It shouldn't take
>>a law to get hams to treat each other cordially, on the simple basis
>>of having the hobby in common.
>
>Consider this, Greg: When you drive your privately-owned vehicle
>on publicly-owned roads, no one can use that portion of the pavement
>you're driving on. When you park your POV on a publicly-owned street,
>no one else can park their vehicle in that same spot. You're certainly
>not claiming ownership of a portion of the road but that's pretty much
>what it amounts to. It's something that we all accept.

Bad analogy. A repeater claims right of way on an entire lane, end to
end, of the highway when it it driving down it, not just the little patch
immediately under its wheels. What the coordinated repeater does is claim
exclusive use of an entire traffic lane. It is as if I were to claim that
one lane of the expressway could not be used by anyone else because I might
want to drive down it some day, and since I'm coordinated I always have the
right of way on that lane.

Lets try a more apt analogy. Consider a potential repeater pair as a
public staircase. Anyone is free to climb the staircase under his own
power.  He must not trample others, and he must not bar use of the
staircase to others. It is public property. But he can use it as long
as there are treads vacant. Now suppose someone puts a repeater on the
pair. This is equivalent to converting the staircase to an escalator.
Now people can get up the staircase with the assistance of escalator
power. The staircase has become more usable. This is a Good Thing(tm)
for the community.

But suppose the person installing the escalator now says that only his
friends can use it, or charges a toll to others to use it. He has usurped
public property, the staircase, for his own private use. The staircase
is no longer available to the public which owns it because of the presence
of the escalator. Yet the public is not allowed to use the escalator
either. Their way has been barred by a private taking of public property.

This is the problem with closed and private repeaters. They represent
a defacto taking of public property, the spectrum on which they sit and
claim exclusive right of way, without any compensation to the public
for that loss. OTOH, an open repeater represents no such taking since
the public still has right of passage.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:01 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]> <56ofc3$[e-mail]> <57h581$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vmmj$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 12:08:48 GMT
Lines: 30

In article <57vmmj$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (M
ichael P. Deignan) writes:
>
>Why is that? Should two people holding a private conversation on
>HF be forced off-frequency because an "open" net wants to start up
>on the same frequency?

That *does* appear to be the accepted "amateur practice". After
all W1AW fires up without even checking to see if the frequency is
clear when the scheduled time for its broadcast occurs. And nets
do start up on schedule regardless of other activity on the channel,
reference the 3995 kHz net and K1MAN.

But I would tend to say that both are using poor operating practices,
no different than if your closed repeater should fire up without
checking first for other activity on its transmitting channel. If a
couple of amateurs are holding a private conversation on the output
frequency, because they aren't *allowed* to use the repeater, you
shouldn't just fire up your repeater on top of them. It is exactly
the same sort of practice you're claiming to condemn on HF.

If you claim a repeater has special privileges different from ordinary
amateur operation, then it also has special obligations to the amateur
public for unilaterally usurping public spectrum.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 7 Dec 1996 10:33:12 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <58c2no$[e-mail]>
References: <56jpm2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vmmj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>That *does* appear to be the accepted "amateur practice".

The "accepted" amateur practice is that two people engaged in a
conversation will usually QSY to another frequency to make room
for the net, in order to be polite. There is, however, no requirement
that they do so.

>After
>all W1AW fires up without even checking to see if the frequency is
>clear when the scheduled time for its broadcast occurs. And nets
>do start up on schedule regardless of other activity on the channel,
>reference the 3995 kHz net and K1MAN.

The last I knew K1MAN and W1AW were broadcast stations, not nets.


>if a couple of amateurs are holding a private conversation on the output
>frequency, because they aren't *allowed* to use the repeater, you
>shouldn't just fire up your repeater on top of them. It is exactly
>the same sort of practice you're claiming to condemn on HF.

Its akin to W1AW or K1MAN starting a broadcast. Just as the FCC has
stated it is perfectly fine for them to start a broadcast (because
their schedules are 'well known') if you're parked on a repeater
output (also 'well known") then you must accept the fact that a
"broadcast" may start.

>If you claim a repeater has special privileges different from ordinary
>amateur operation,

I don't claim, the FCC does, and I merely operate within the circle of
regulation that they dictate. Fortunately, that includes the ability
to eradicate swine from my machine.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 7 Dec 1996 10:19:46 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <58c1ui$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57lsf6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:

> What the coordinated repeater does is claim
> exclusive use of an entire traffic lane.

This is *not* what coordination grants you, and is a total misrepresentation
of the status of closed/private repeaters.


>But suppose the person installing the escalator now says that only his
>friends can use it, or charges a toll to others to use it. He has usurped
>public property, the staircase, for his own private use.

No, the frequency is still available for use by other people, as long
as they do not interfere with the repeater.

This is true regardless of whether or not a repeater is "open" or
"closed". Although not considered "good amateur practice", you can
still operate simplex on the input or output frequency of ANY repeater
system, as long as you do not interfere with the repeater.

A better analogy would be a public building with slots for elevators.
You obtain permission to install your own private elevator in one of
the slots (something accepted as perfectly legal to do). There are
other slots available. If you don't like to rules of using my private
(and privately-owned) elevator, make your own, or take the stairs.

The fact that my private elevator is on "public property" is irrelevant.
My vehicle parked in the parking lot of a park is also on public
property, but that doesn't extend you the right of using it anytime you
want to.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:04 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 17:08:02 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <c57cc$11e1f.22c@NEWS>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Steve Eklund wrote:

> This is not true. It depends on which repeater has coordination
> and which does not. The FCC only says that in situations
> involving repeaters, an uncoordinated repeater has the primary
> responsibility of correcting a problem and the coordinated

Ummmm, but I'll bet a good attorney could raise a lot of hell
over that.  If a coordination group assigns you a frequency
on one that is known to already be active then they are
encouraging an interference problem & they are at fault.  The
first operator has done nothing wrong because the law does not
require coordination



> filed for coordination, I was told about the guy, and was also
> told that his repeater has been down more than it has been
> up for over five years, and it has not been heard at all for
> at least 2 years.

If you could STRONGLY   **PROVE**  that he was not active for
2 years then you win.  IF not, you loose.

We had a very similar situation almost exactly like your
description here in Oregon.  The original guy raised a lot
of hell & the Coord council hired an Attorney who was also
a ham to atbitrate & make a decision.  The coord council lost!!!!!!
The original had some real hokey proof that he had been
operational, which as far as I am concerned
was all lies but that was not my decision to make.


> me off the frequency. Why should I? I played by the rules and
> he did not!

That depends, he was there first & he played by the rules too.
(no rule says you must be coorinated)

-Sticky situation.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:06 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 16:30:58 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57ll40$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588am7$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Kevin Potter wrote:

> What gives?  Are you trying to get people bent like you did on the
> scanner newsgroup?
>
> State your opinions without all the name calling that you've brought
> with you.


Go away child you are bothering me.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!admaix.sunydutchess.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!newstand.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 16:28:08 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Gary Coffman wrote:

> This is the problem with closed and private repeaters. They represent
> a defacto taking of public property, the spectrum on which they sit and
> claim exclusive right of way, without any compensation to the public
> for that loss. OTOH, an open repeater represents no such taking since
> the public still has right of passage.

That is not exactly correct.  A closed or private repeater means that
others are requested NOT to use that frequency(s).  But, it is only a
request.  You still have the legal right if you desire.

It's sorta like when you go to a park & a shelter area is roped off for
a particular group or function.  You could still go there if you wanted,
but
it is obvious that you are not invited or desired.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!dciteleport.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 04:06:11 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58g35p$[e-mail]>
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John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Gary Coffman wrote:

>> This is the problem with closed and private repeaters. They represent
>> a defacto taking of public property, the spectrum on which they sit and
>> claim exclusive right of way, without any compensation to the public
>> for that loss. OTOH, an open repeater represents no such taking since
>> the public still has right of passage.

>That is not exactly correct.  A closed or private repeater means that
>others are requested NOT to use that frequency(s).  But, it is only a
>request.  You still have the legal right if you desire.

>It's sorta like when you go to a park & a shelter area is roped off for
>a particular group or function.  You could still go there if you wanted,
>but it is obvious that you are not invited or desired.

Actually, your analogy is not exactly correct.   It's more like if you
were to hog the shelter for your family every day of the year.

And if, by chance, someone came by to use the shelter while you
were away, you come over and physically remove them without
saying a word.     The only way someone outside your family gets to
use the shelter is if you're out of town and don't notice.  *That's*
the proper analogy.

Dick WD0ANB



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.dp.beckman.com!inet.dp.beckman.com!newsmaster
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: Don Labriola <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 11:33:22 -0800
Reply-To: [e-mail]
References: <c97cc$a3716.3cb@NEWS>
Distribution: world
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Steve Eklund wrote:
...
>
> Don't forget that a lot of users of the repeater, and especially
> those using handhelds, may not hear the weaker simplex stations
> who are operating on the output frequency. This is why repeaters
> are coordinated to use a particular frequency pair, and the
> users of the repeater should not have to worry about somebody
> using the output frequency when they make a call. The users of
> the output frequency of a repeater have to accept the fact
> that the repeater is coordinated to use the frequency, and they
> are not. According to the rules, the uncoordinated station has
> the primary responsibility of correcting an interference
> problem, so it is the users on the repeater output who should
> have sense enough to move.
>
I am involved with putting up a repeater also, but it is the
uncoordinated *REPEATER*
that must take care of interference. The individual operators (simplex
or repeater users) do not get coordinated, thus there is not a
coordinated versus uncoordinated standing there. They are operating
under the FCC band limits, and not under other band plans. I try to
operate as a gentleman under gentleman's agreements, but I'm not so sure
that these can be dependably applied to those who want to play lawyer.

The burden is still not on the users to move (legally), although
(un)common courtesey would indicate this as the normal procedure. If
they were using the input frequency, but a different ctcss tone, then
the machine would not step on them, although the machine might not
capture the normal users either. I have found that the polite
explanation route usually works, but the repeater users no more right
transmit on the repeater input than anyone else does (the users are not
coordinated, and it is they that would be generating the intensional
interference to the existing QSO). Th repeater users, also, should wait
for the frequency to clear (if they KNOW that it is busy, or else they
are causing INTENSIONAL interference). Again, hopefully most of the hams
without an axe to grind will understand - if asked to move and not
told!  As for the others, all hobbies have some of them!
...
> Anybody who disagrees with closed repeaters
> should put one up, operate it, maintain it, pay for it and leave
> it open to the public. You will not understand what it is like
> until you have done it yourself.
>
I think that the major following of this thread agree to this - they
just want access to the spectrum to do it! (This is something that is
probably more difficult to do in Southern California than in almost any
other part of the country!)
>
>  73 de WA3RVT, Steve
73's de W6QS - Don


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 03:18:56 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <58idaj$[e-mail]>
References: <579iee$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57ll40$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588am7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i213$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Kevin Potter <[e-mail]> wrote:



>Better to be a child than an old grump.

Or as in John's case, just a young punk!



>From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>


>Go away child you are bothering me.





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.west.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 9 Dec 1996 21:57:55 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58i213$[e-mail]>
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---------------------------------27779263822864
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Better to be a child than an old grump.


---------------------------------27779263822864
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 16:30:58 -0800
Organization: Just myself
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ll40$[e-mail]> <gregE1pCq7.Jyu@netcom=
com> <[e-mail]> <588am7$[e-mail]>

Kevin Potter wrote:

> What gives?  Are you trying to get people bent like you did on the
> scanner newsgroup?
>
> State your opinions without all the name calling that you've brought
> with you.


Go away child you are bothering me.

---------------------------------27779263822864--


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!pacbell.com!decwrl!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Bob Dengler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 11 Dec 1996 20:56:48 GMT
Organization: JPL
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58n76g$6ua$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57lsf6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 128.149.10.55
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.02

In <58g35p$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Gary Coffman wrote:
>
>>> This is the problem with closed and private repeaters. They represent
>>> a defacto taking of public property, the spectrum on which they sit and
>>> claim exclusive right of way, without any compensation to the public
>>> for that loss. OTOH, an open repeater represents no such taking since
>>> the public still has right of passage.
>
>>That is not exactly correct.  A closed or private repeater means that
>>others are requested NOT to use that frequency(s).  But, it is only a
>>request.  You still have the legal right if you desire.
>
>>It's sorta like when you go to a park & a shelter area is roped off for
>>a particular group or function.  You could still go there if you wanted,
>>but it is obvious that you are not invited or desired.
>
>Actually, your analogy is not exactly correct.   It's more like if you
>were to hog the shelter for your family every day of the year.
>
>And if, by chance, someone came by to use the shelter while you
>were away, you come over and physically remove them without
>saying a word.     The only way someone outside your family gets to
>use the shelter is if you're out of town and don't notice.  *That's*
>the proper analogy.
>
>Dick WD0ANB
>

..and in So. California, 95% of the park is roped off.

Bob NO6B



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code and elmers....
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 01:02:40 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 63
Message-ID: <58afjc$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-121.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

ACE <[e-mail]> wrote:

>With all the debate about code versus no-code, I just have one comment.

>How many of you old-timers were elmered into amateur radio?  Out of this
>group, how many of you have taken the time to get to know some of the
>newer hams and help them with advancing to a higher class of license.

Well, I am not as old as Cecil, Ace, but I was. And I have.

>Think about it, I have heard plenty of the older amateurs on the bands,
>both HF and FM talking about the good old days when they were elmered
>into the hobby.  But I know of only a few that have stated they are now
>elmering new hams.

Could be a reflection on the new hams that are entering the hobby ?
The 'good ole days' are over, according to Squiggy.  Nobody is interested in
this DX stuff or contesting anymore.  All we are interested in now is digital
networks at 15.2 gadzillion baud.  Yackers and DX'ers and contesters and
'beepers' are dying off, and the new breed is ready to take over.  Ever see an
y
of those silly stories about the QRP'er who goes up the hill ? Nobody readys
that stuff anymore, we are all too busy soldering our ones and zeros together
to
connect to the network.  Right Squiggy ?

Elmering is really not something you do on a street corner.   But after you ha
ve
been a ham for a while, you meet someone who is really interested in the hobby
,
and you help them out.   I met a few 'new hams' a while back.  They stopped by
my house on the recommendation of another ham to see if I had any old HF
radios I wanted to sell.   I dug one out of the closet, showed it to them, and
the very FIRST question was 'Does it work on 11 meters ?'.  Which really didn'
t
encourage me to run for my Elmer hat.

Over the years I have seen a lot of people come into ham radio for all the wro
ng

reasons.  One ham here did 4,000 autopatch demonstrations a week.  When he
finally did recruit somebody, they were very disappointed to find out that the
y
couldn't call the office on their new HT.  We had one knuckle head here a few
years back that tried to recruit anybody and everybody he could find.  He use
to
give novice tests on the hood of his car (literally).  We met one guy in a
restaurant one time when we had to move the club meeting on the spur of the
moment. He asked if we were hams. When we said yes, he said he was too. I ask
his call and got 'I don't remember, let me see if I still have that card in my
wallet'.   He took a novice test on the hood of a car.  Everyone who comes int
o
ham radio is not 'elmering' material.  Some came for 2 meters only, some came
for a new CB radio, some don't know why them came at all.

Overall, I think anyone who enters ham radio and is really interested in ham
radio gets all the help they need, at least they do around here.  Somebody, I
don't recall who, posts a 2 mile long elmer list in one of the newsgroups ever
y
month or so, so I imagine there are a bunch of hams around willling to help ne
w
people that need help.

The other thing you have to remember is that judging the state of ham radio by
what you read on here is like taking a code/no code survey of fourty people on

a radio show - not very conclusive to the overall situation.

But the main thing you have to remember about elmering, Ace, is that before yo
u
elmer anyone, you have to find somebody who wants to be elmered.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:15 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Code and elmers....
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 23:09:19 GMT
Lines: 29
Sender: [e-mail]

ACE ([e-mail]) wrote:
: With all the debate about code versus no-code, I just have one comment.

: How many of you old-timers were elmered into amateur radio?  Out of this
: group, how many of you have taken the time to get to know some of the
: newer hams and help them with advancing to a higher class of license.

I was.  I'm currently teaching an Advanced-class course at our club, will
follow that with an Extra, then General.  This is for two reasons:

a)  to put something back into the hobby, in return for the help I received
getting on the air as a Novice, and encouragement to get a higher-class
license

b)  if an Extra course were available at any time since 1968 when I became
an Advanced-class licensee, I would have had the Extra ticket long ago.

: Think about it, I have heard plenty of the older amateurs on the bands,
: both HF and FM talking about the good old days when they were elmered
: into the hobby.  But I know of only a few that have stated they are now
: elmering new hams.

: We can all contribute in some way if we really try.  I have helped quite
: a few of the older hams with computer problems and in return they are
: now helping me with my code practice.  Learning is a two way street.

A good philosophy, Ace; the true spirit of amateur radio.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code and elmers....
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 13:32:44 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58afjc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: camoore-desk.ch.intel.com
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)

Jim Kehler wrote:
> Well, I am not as old as Cecil, ...

And here's a defeatist attitude for you - contrary to a common pro-code
argument, no matter how hard you try, how much energy you invest, how
brilliant and educated you become, you will never catch up with me, you
young whipper snapper. (Are all whipper snappers young?)

> But the main thing you have to remember about elmering, Ace, is that before
you
> elmer anyone, you have to find somebody who wants to be elmered.

I have begged tons of my tech friends to permit me to Elmer them into
learning and becoming proficient at Morse code. Most common response:
"I may be crazy, but I ain't stupid". OTOH, my boss's boss's boss's
wife loves Morse code and hates ham radio. She wants to learn Morse
code but not get her ham license. Go figger.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:18 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Code and elmers....
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <58afjc$[e-mail]> <58hh6i$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 21:50:28 GMT
Lines: 63
Sender: [e-mail]

Paul W. Schleck K3FU ([e-mail]) wrote:

: - Not only seeks out quality candidates (surprisingly, the Internet is a
: quality forum for recruiting technology hobbyists, at least relative to
: society as a whole), but also works tirelessly towards also making our
: existing members into model amateurs (Novice exams are now under the VE
: program, so the "car-hood" example is no longer valid.  The fact that
: someone got a bad introduction to amateur radio means that we should do
: *more* work to make them feel welcome, not less).

Why do you say "surprisingly?"  Before Internet access became available to
the masses, unwashed and otherwise, via AOL, Prodigy and local ISPs engaging
in price wars, just getting on the 'Net was something of a technological
accomplishment.  Many of us 'Net OTs began our experience with a shell
account on a Unix box, an experience not for the faint of heart.  When you
consider that 'Net access used to be through universities and high-tech
industries for the most part, it doesn't surprise me in the least.


: My "2 mile long" Elmers List has only 250 names (probably 150 names
: after March 1997).  That's a scant 1/20th of 1% of all U.S. Amateurs.
: That's nowhere near enough, especially when you consider that amateurs,
: and potential amateurs, in *15* U.S. States (and quite a few Canadian
: Provinces and foreign countries) have no one local to turn to on my
: list.  Since someone has commented on its length, this might be a good
: time to bring up a concern of mine.  Specifically, that while the Elmers
: List originated on Usenet, it's getting a bit too big to be practically
: posted to Usenet News every month in its entirety.  The WWW version is
: getting increasingly popular and is much more convenient to use, with
: its keyword searching and hyperlinked indexes.  Furthermore, this thread
: has also brought up the interesting argument that its sheer size (at
: least by Usenet standards) may be giving the false impression that
: "enough is being done" with regard to Elmering.

Feel free to drop some e-mail in my mailbox, and I'll add myself to your
list of volunteers.  For that matter, our club, as well.  We have classes in
code and theory that, recently, covers all the territory through Extra
Class.

: Perhaps it's time to pare down the Usenet posting to just a pointer
: article and continue to make the full list available via FTP,
: mail-server, and WWW.

Don't forget, there are still a number of hams who have no WWW access.  For
example, we have advocated that all club members who have a computer and
modem get connected with the e-mail-only Juno service.  Considering the
value of your documents versus the 80-90% of pure crap that's out there, I
wouldn't feel guilty about using the bandwidth.

: The obvious cons have been mentioned above.  However, there still are a
: few pros to continuing the list on Usenet News:

: - Not everyone can FTP or WWW.  An FAQ-type posting that seeks to help
: those on Usenet News should have some sort of presence in that medium
: This is becoming less of a concern with the growth of the WWW (and the
: fact that most new users on the Internet are using the Web versus
: Usenet News), but I'd like to get some more feedback on this one.

The Web is fine for looking up information or downloading, but the usenet
newsgroups still show high activity.  I'm probably reading and posting to
usenet 80% of the time, versus 20% on the Web.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code and elmers....
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 10:48:53 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <58jf3d$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58afjc$[e-mail]> <58hh6i$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-170.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Paul W. Schleck K3FU) wrote:

>Jim says that he's found most of the potential Elmering candidates
>un-Elmerable. That's a shame, but it may also be a matter of perception
>and attitude.

Well, last nite I got another candidate.  A friend (another ham) called me and

asked if I could look up somebodys callsign on the internet if he told me the
persons name.  Seems the person had taken the test and not received his
license yet.  So he gave me the name and I looked it up, and found the call.
'We have a new ham in Guam and his call is .......' I told my friend on the
phone.   He replied, 'Well, no, not really.  This guy is into hang gliding, an
d
he has been using a pair of UHF HT's on the ham bands for years, with no
license, because he knows nobody is going to go after him.  But he is going on
 a

trip to Austrailia for hang gliding, and somebody told him in Australia if you
get caught on the ham bands with no license, it's a big fine.  So he figured h
e
better get a license.'  Another great reason to become a ham . Too bad nobody
told him about GMRS or those little 49 mhz HT's from Rat Shack.

>I'd be willing to entertain pros and cons and act on the net's overall
>consensus over the next few months.

Paul, I think it's great that you maintain the list. But it is getting a bit
large. I think a monthly or biweekly posting to tell people where and how
they can get the list would be a better idea than posting it regularly.
As many ham radio web sites as there are, I am sure you wouldn't have
any trouble getting a bunch of people to put the list on for you.   Anyway,
keep up the good work.  I'll keep looking for a new ham that doesn't hang
glide and doesn't need an HF rig with 11 meters on it.

>73, Paul W. Schleck, K3FU
>[e-mail]

>Maintainer, Amateur Radio Elmers Resource Directory

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:20 1996
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From: "RLove" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code does save lives (was: HAM RADIO/CB)
Date: 4 Dec 1996 00:59:19 GMT
Organization: Preferred Company
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <01bbe17e$4f09ecc0$46b6aec7@IWLD002416>
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Bravo, Jeff!!! Bravo....

-.. .   .-- ..-. ..... -..-   --... ...--  ...-.-   ..

Randy, WF5X


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!winternet.com!news3.mr.net!mr.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code does save lives (was: HAM RADIO/CB)
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 10:24:04 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58jdkq$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>BTW, the USCG dropped CW from their roster several years ago. So did
>several international shore stations around the world this year. MARS
>also dropped CW this year and they not only save lives they brigthen
>them up as well :)

Most Catholic Priests have given up having sex.  Does that mean all
hams should too ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code does save lives (was: HAM RADIO/CB)
Date: 11 Dec 1996 02:20:55 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <58l5q7$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57m0sr$[e-mail]> <58c0l9$[e-mail]> <58jdkq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>BTW, the USCG dropped CW from their roster several years ago. So did
>several international shore stations around the world this year. MARS
>also dropped CW this year and they not only save lives they brigthen
>them up as well :)

I was on the receiving end of many a distress and lessor priority calls
while working as a USCG CW op. The distress system that has replaced
CW is plagued with problems, including countless false distress calls.
But the new system is easier on the budget (computers rather than
manpower). Keep that in mind: CW was replaced due to government down-
sizing.

The person who made the decision to drop MARS CW happens to be a
no-code tech. Guess he felt a bit embarrassed not being able to
copy MARS traffic, so instead of learning the code, he used his
power to forbid its use.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:22 1996
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From: Tim Otty <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Computer Show & Sale
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 01:55:51 -0500
Organization: PC Fest
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pa4dsp16.orf.infi.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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PC Fest is proud to announce the following upcoming shows !!!

Sat     Dec 7th         "Doswell, VA"

        Doswell Sports Arena

Sun     Dec 8th         "Lynchburg, VA"

        Holiday Inn Select

Sat     Dec 14th        "Norfolk, VA"

        Scope Convention Center

Sun     Dec 15th        "Richmond, VA"

        Virginia State Fairgrounds (Strawberry Hill)

Sat     Dec 21st        "Gaithersburg, MD"

        Montgomery County Fairgrounds

Sun     Dec 22nd        "Timonium, MD"

        Maryland State Fairgrounds

The LAST chance to buy TOYS for Christmas !!!

Show hours are 10AM-4PM

Discount coupon for $1 off available at our Web Site. Complete show
directions and other shows scheduled are just some of the things you'll
find at

http://www.infi.net/~pcshows

Suggestions Invited !




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:24 1996
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From: Tim Otty <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Computer Shows
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 23:50:32 -0500
Organization: PC Fest
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pa5dsp16.orf.infi.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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PC Fest Computer Show & Sale

DOOR PRIZES - FREE GIFTS - DOOR PRIZES - FREE GIFTS - DOOR PRIZES - FREE
GIFTS

Saturday        7 DEC   "Doswell, VA"

        "Doswell Sports Arena"

Located near Kings Dominion Amusement park !!!

Sunday          8 DEC   "Lynchburg, VA"

        "Holiday Inn Select"

Located at 601 Main Street Lynchburg !!!

Door Prizes every HALF HOUR !!!

Free Gifts to the FIRST 100 customers...... COME EARLY & STAY LATE

Show Hours 10AM - 4PM

Admission $6, "Special $1 off coupon available"

Children under 12 admitted FREE with paid adult

BRAVE the COLD for some HOT deals....!!!

Hardware, Software, Accessories, Memory, Printers, Upgrades, and MORE
!!!!

Get that CD-ROM stocking stuffer's NOW !!!!!

For show directions and DISCOUNT COUPON

http://www.infi.net/~pcshows

For more information

mailto:[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:26 1996
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From: "Jim Reid" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Computers/Rigs: On and Off Daily?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 01:21:55 GMT
Organization: At Home
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <01bbe24a$b2c60600$a9070ccf@jim-reid-1>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kauai-169.u.aloha.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Of those or you  using computers with their rig operation,
and the Internet for keeping up with Amateur Radio news,
do you turn the computer on/off each day;  the rig each day,
or leave them running all the time (monitor powered down
at night, or perhaps it goes into a sleep mode?)

I've been told computer warranties are for the time period of
a year or whatever,  whether the machine is on or off cycled
or on forever.  About a year ago this topic was discussed,  and
many felt the computer should be left on ALL the time for
component long life.  Power consumption is relatively low
as long as the monitor is down.

Old days,  DX'ers never turned the rig off,  but that was a
temperature/frequency drift issue.  Wonder about my "new"
1000D with the temperature oven about the crystal:  should
the D be left ON all the time?

I have had to replace the hard drive in two computers during
the machine's first 11 to 24 months out of the box.  Not related
to drive bearings,  but too many disk errors;  defrag would not
even run without running scan disk,  and then that would not
run.  Gateway replaced one still within the warranty,  the other
I had to pay for,  as it was just out of warranty!  These
computers were turned off late  each day,  and back on the
following AM,  7 days a week;  probably should be just
left running.

Any thoughts?

73,  Jim, KH7M



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:27 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Computers/Rigs: On and Off Daily?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 18:14:49 GMT
Lines: 60
Message-ID: <5873ep$2038$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe24a$b2c60600$a9070ccf@jim-reid-1>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-205-243.in.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <01bbe24a$b2c60600$a9070ccf@jim-reid-1>, "Jim Reid" <[e-mail]> write
s:
>Of those or you  using computers with their rig operation,
>and the Internet for keeping up with Amateur Radio news,
>do you turn the computer on/off each day;  the rig each day,
>or leave them running all the time (monitor powered down
>at night, or perhaps it goes into a sleep mode?)
>
>I've been told computer warranties are for the time period of
>a year or whatever,  whether the machine is on or off cycled
>or on forever.  About a year ago this topic was discussed,  and
>many felt the computer should be left on ALL the time for
>component long life.  Power consumption is relatively low
>as long as the monitor is down.
>
>Old days,  DX'ers never turned the rig off,  but that was a
>temperature/frequency drift issue.  Wonder about my "new"
>1000D with the temperature oven about the crystal:  should
>the D be left ON all the time?
>
>I have had to replace the hard drive in two computers during
>the machine's first 11 to 24 months out of the box.  Not related
>to drive bearings,  but too many disk errors;  defrag would not
>even run without running scan disk,  and then that would not
>run.  Gateway replaced one still within the warranty,  the other
>I had to pay for,  as it was just out of warranty!  These
>computers were turned off late  each day,  and back on the
>following AM,  7 days a week;  probably should be just
>left running.
>
>Any thoughts?
>
>73,  Jim, KH7M
>

  Jim,

   I've been in the computer field for 30+ years (don't laugh), and more often
 than not, a piece of hardware would fail at 'startup'. I spent many an hour
 scoping failures in control circuitry, motors, power supplies, and circuit bo
ard
 connections because of power down / power up.

  Granted, most of the PC's or intelligent workstations we use today, don't
 require water cooled processors, or room wide emergency power down circuits,
 but, we do still have the 'mechanical' failures. How often have you heard of
 somebody having a hard drive fly apart while they were computing? On the
 other hand, how many times to hear of a drive 'being dead' while the rest of
 the PC powered up OK. Quite often. Contaminents can settle on the disk
 surface when it's not in motion. They're not necessarily 'air tight'. The
 combination of particles, moisture in the room, etc, can be pretty brutal on
a
 micropower motor that really only wants to maintain a speed, not haul trash.
 Anyway, I'm rambling. Leave the PC on, turn off the monitor.

                                                 Jim

OS/2 Version 4 - Merlin
Computer? - Ready!
Command Voice Recognition

P.S. adapter cards don't like the heating, cooling effect at their connection
to
the motherboard.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:28 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Computers/Rigs: On and Off Daily?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 14:26:55 GMT
Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, [e-mail], (931)3186277
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <589a7q$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe24a$b2c60600$a9070ccf@jim-reid-1>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ccclxxxi.dyn.sci.fi
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Jim Reid" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Of those or you  using computers with their rig operation,
>and the Internet for keeping up with Amateur Radio news,
>do you turn the computer on/off each day;  the rig each day,
>or leave them running all the time (monitor powered down
>at night, or perhaps it goes into a sleep mode?)

I would not leave monitor on unattended due to the risk of spectacular
failures (fire and smoke), but I let the rest of the system run
continuously. When using stable operating systems such as Windows NT
or Linux, it is nice to be able to leave applications on and continue
with the applications exactly where you left it the previous day.
These operating systems also have quite long boot and shutdown times.
However, less stable operating systems (such as Windows 3.x/95) work
much better if they are regularly rebooted, so there is not much
advantage of leaving the computer on for the night.


>Old days,  DX'ers never turned the rig off,  but that was a
>temperature/frequency drift issue.  Wonder about my "new"
>1000D with the temperature oven about the crystal:  should
>the D be left ON all the time?

I do not know about the FT? 1000D, but all test equipment with oven
that I have seen did not have an ON/OFF switch but rather an
ON/STANDBY switch. The oven is powered as long as the equipment is
plugget into the mains socket. If this is not the case with your
1000D, then your rig will drift a long time after it on until the oven
temperature is stabilized.

Paul OH3LWR




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.89.123.24!nntp.inet.fi!news.sci.fi!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Computers/Rigs: On and Off Daily?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 14:26:57 GMT
Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, [e-mail], (931)3186277
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <589a7s$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe24a$b2c60600$a9070ccf@jim-reid-1> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ccclxxxi.dyn.sci.fi
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Mark Pettigrew <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Worth noting that the power supplies in computers are generally rated at
>somewhere in the 150W to 250W mark - a bit expensive to leave on
>permanently!

The actual consumption is usually quite less than the rated output
power. 150 W would mean about 20-30 A from the +5 V rail (depending of
the efficiency of the switching mode power supply and the consumption
of the +12 V rail). The consumption of the CPU card and drives is
usually much less. The consumption from the +12 V rail is quite low,
since there is no need to start the floppies or the CD-ROMs during
idle time.

Note that if you are using electric heating, the heat generated by the
PC will reduce the consumption of the main heating elements, so the
total consumption (and your electric bill) remains constant regardless
if you turn your PC on or not.

However, in counties where air conditioning is used to keep the rooms
cool, the cost of not turning off the PC when not in use is much
greater.

Paul OH3LWR





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Carl Steckler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: contact in Rhode Island wanted, 2M SSB , 6M SSB or 10M SSB
Date: 2 Dec 1996 18:30:30 GMT
Organization: Cornell University
Lines: 10
Sender: [e-mail] (Verified)
Message-ID: <57v786$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 132
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (beta 2)

Trying to get that last New England contact. If interested in setting
up a schedual on one of those bands email me at [e-mail]
Thanks, 73.
--
Carl (Ex-Jarhead) Semper-Fi
KB2SGX -.-  -...  ..---  ...  --.  -..-
"For those who fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will
 never know"
Unknown Marine, Khe Sahn, Viet Nam



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!dsinc!news.enter.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: contact in Rhode Island wanted, 2M SSB , 6M SSB or 10M SSB
Date: 3 Dec 1996 01:16:19 GMT
Organization: ENTER.NET
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <57vv13$[e-mail]>
References: <57v786$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm5-2.enter.net
X-Newsreader: SPRY News 3.03 (SPRY, Inc.)

>   [e-mail] (Carl Steckler) writes:
>  Trying to get that last New England contact. If interested in setting
>  up a schedual on one of those bands email me at [e-mail]
>  Thanks, 73.
>  --
>  Carl (Ex-Jarhead) Semper-Fi
>  KB2SGX -.-  -...  ..---  ...  --.  -..-
>  "For those who fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will
>   never know"
>  Unknown Marine, Khe Sahn, Viet Nam
>
>
>>>>
Carl,

What is this Ex- BS???

1st Mar Div, 1961 to 1966

[e-mail]
*******************************************
John E. Mansfield         Only you can make
1032 Montgomery Avenue    it a great day!
Pennsburg, PA 18073
                          Semper Fidelis
KB3PC

To err is human,
to forgive is divine,
neither of which is USMC policy!




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!posts.execpc.com!usenet
From: Chuck Hallett <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CQ Mormon Hams de W7LDS
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 10:59:50 -0600
Organization: Exec-PC BBS Internet - Milwaukee, WI
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: marvinmartian.execpc.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Would like to hear from LDS amateurs who are internet active.  Reply by
email if possible.

Object is to distribute the list to all who respond.

73s,

Chuck Hallett W7LDS (ex-AI3O)
Kenosha Wisconsin


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news.webspan.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ctcss decoder wanted 12VDC dipswitch programable
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 05:16:39 GMT
Organization: WebSpan Inc., New Jersey
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <58lg3l$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr1-02.nwk.nj.webspan.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I am looking for a ctcss decoder. I live in northern new jersey.
Please give best price. 73 Bll




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:33 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Cu-Seeme Video conferencing
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 16:32:12 GMT
Organization: CMDS News machine
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.44.241.22
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230



Does anyone know of anyone using Video Conferencing on
computer/internet in conjunction with amateur redio? I have been in
contact with hundreds of people from around the world on Cu-Seeme and
have run into only one ham. Is there a freq. HF or VHF where hams may
hang out that use both modes..computer and radio. I believe this would
be a natural progression  from Slow Scan.  We now can SEE the people
we are in QSO with.

If you are interested in setting up a sched. and have Video
COnferencing capabilities or are just interested drop me an e-mail,


73's
Charlie

[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!world1.bellatlantic.net!out2.nntp.cais.net!in1.nntp.cais.net!mr.net!visi.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Jim Smith <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Cushcraft A3S Tri-band Beam
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 16:55:05 -0800
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.88.122
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E (Win16; I)

I am considering purchasing a A3S Cushcraft Beam but I would like to know
if the antenna's bandwidth for the 10 meter portion covers the entire
band (28m through 29.7) at a reasonable 2 to 1 SWR.  Thanks.

Jim
KI4BU


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!interaccess!usenet
From: Bart Dolega <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: cw & ICOM 706
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 13:30:45 -0600
Organization: :-)
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: d194.cloud.interaccess.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Does anybody have some experience with IC 706 & CW ?
(with or without cw filter)
vy 73! de Bart


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:36 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: cw & ICOM 706
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 03:49:45 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
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Bart Dolega <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Does anybody have some experience with IC 706 & CW ?
>(with or without cw filter)
>vy 73! de Bart

Yes. I used one at field day without a CW filter, and I would highly
not recommend it.  The receiver in the 706 also has the same image
problem that the 745 did, i.e., you can hear the same CW signal on
two different frequencies.  With a CW filter, I imagine it would be
as good as any other radio for CW use.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:37 1996
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From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is *not* outdated
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 23:46:07 -0800
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
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Michael P. Deignan wrote:
> An excellent argument. Why should I be forced to learn about RTTY
> for FM voice privs? Why force me to learn about HF packet when all
> I want to do is yack on HF SSB? The list is endless.

Yeah, that's right.  Let's apply a relevent analogy:

I've heard the whining in academia over the years: why should I be forced
to learn philosophy when I want to become cardiologist?  Why I am forced
to learn calculus when I want to practice law?  Why I am forced to study
the French Revolution when I want to become an engineer?

Want more?  Why am I forced to learn the elements of a stall, when I take
my private pilot's test, even though I'll never operate my aircraft at
minimum controllable airspeeds?  Why am I forced to take criminal law
when my ambitions are in corporate law?  That's right...this list seems
to be endless too. Hmmmm.

It all boils down to education and the understanding of basic concepts; a
need to expose one's self to a broad array disciplines fosters a desire
to learn more about other subjects.

Now, back to amateur radio.  If you don't want to learn Morse, then
don't.  You have two options:

1) Take the no-code exam.  If you pass, you'll have many new and exciting
technologies at your disposal above 30 Mhz, and best of all you won't be
forced to learn that trite, passe' and dreadful code.

2) Avoid the hobby all together. Analogy:  If you don't like guns, don't
get into a gun collecting hobby.

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:38 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 6 Dec 1996 15:49:08 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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Typical elitist ham attitudes displayed all over this newsgroup.  Sorry,
but the code IS outdated.  There is no longer any legal justification for
requiring knowledge of a 19th-century communications mode to obtain an
amateur radio license.  If you still want to start your car by use of a
hand crank, fine...but you have no right to force it on the rest of us.

The code requirement will be abolished soon.  Either the ARRL and the FCC
will get with the times, or else it will be challenged in court.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:39 1996
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 10:08:56 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Typical elitist ham attitudes displayed all over this newsgroup.  Sorry,
> but the code IS outdated.  There is no longer any legal justification for
> requiring knowledge of a 19th-century communications mode to obtain an
> amateur radio license.  If you still want to start your car by use of a
> hand crank, fine...but you have no right to force it on the rest of us.
>
> The code requirement will be abolished soon.  Either the ARRL and the FCC
> will get with the times, or else it will be challenged in court.

Can't learn the code either, huh?
Just 'cuz you want it doesn't mean you're going to get it.
This diatribe sounds like a typical '90s welfare mentality.
I doubt engineers in college want or need poetry, but they damn
well have to study it.

Make a real effort to learn and put yourself above much of the crowd.
NOT because code is eliteist, but because you were willing to try.

--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:40 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 01:16:34 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
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[e-mail] wrote:

>Typical elitist ham attitudes displayed all over this newsgroup.  Sorry,
>but the code IS outdated.  There is no longer any legal justification for
>requiring knowledge of a 19th-century communications mode to obtain an
>amateur radio license.  If you still want to start your car by use of a
>hand crank, fine...but you have no right to force it on the rest of us.

Typical wannabe attitude, displayed all over this newsgroup. Cashed your
welfare check this month yet ? Don't worry, Mnmaniac, we won't force Morse cod
e
on you. I PROMISE that the radio police will never come to your house and drag
you away kicking and screaming to take a Morse code test.   Cross my fingers a
nd
hope to die.  There, now you can sleep tonite.

>The code requirement will be abolished soon.  Either the ARRL and the FCC
>will get with the times, or else it will be challenged in court.

Oh no !  Yet another class action lawsuit !
Don't hold your breath, Mnmaniac, you might turn blue........

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:42 1996
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From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 15:42:06 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 27
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> There is no longer any legal justification for
> requiring knowledge of a 19th-century communications mode to obtain an
> amateur radio license.  If you still want to start your car by use of
> a hand crank, fine...but you have no right to force it

First of all, it's an early 20th-century invention, not 19th. Second,
the car analogy isn't quite right:

CW is to modern radio communications what a '65 Mustang is to
automobiles. It gets lousy mileage, isn't that comfortable, has no
airbags/ABS, and doesn't shift that smoothly. But... it smells of steel
and oil and grease and goes real fast. On any sunny day in the hills
you'd rather drive one than even sit in that Camry or Accord. And that's
why we love 'em. And you'll never get them off the modern roads despite
the electric cars, over-priced luxo-sedans, and generic "for the people"
econoboxes.

And yes, you might just be stuck having to drive one, and then you'd be
up the creek. So that's why we love CW, and the kicker is that it
doesn't pollute the air - or the airwaves. So get a life and learn it. I
am so sick of all the B.S. on rec.radio.amateur.* about this topic.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:51:39 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 68
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[e-mail] wrote:

>Typical elitist ham attitudes displayed all over this newsgroup.  Sorry,
>but the code IS outdated.

Okay. I'm over it. What's your point?

> There is no longer any legal justification for requiring knowledge of a
                                         ^^^^^^^^^^^^  I'd really
                                         like to see you elaborate on
                                         that one.  Where was there
                                         ever a 'legal justification"

                                         to begin with?

> 19th-century communications mode to obtain an
>amateur radio license.  If you still want to start your car by use of a
>hand crank, fine...but you have no right
> to force it on the rest of us.
       ^^^^
Who is forcing anything on anyone?  Who is "you" that you speak of?
Were you coerced into the hobby? Someone hold a gun to your head?  If
it is no fun for you, you need to look for another pasttime my friend.

Just who are all of you code abolitionists preaching to/bitching at
anyway?  Better yet, what would you have ME and other coded licensees
do about it?  Your answer should be reasonable and appropriate.
Anything else would be emotional drivel.

No one in here, (deja vu) has any authority to change the rules as
they are so why does this thread keep up?

>The code requirement will be abolished soon.  Either the ARRL and the FCC
>will get with the times, or else it will be challenged in court.

If only roughly 1/5th of the hams are not coded, at this time, what
makes you think the minority will get their way sooner?

You have an obsession with this thing.  Your plane is going down in
flames and you are firing your guns all the way to the ground even
though they don't work.  Hmmmm.

I have seen very few, and I mean very few, postings from any of the
"code is dead" crowd that made any sense.  Everyone else, like you,
let's their emotions talk via their keyboard.  When that happens all
objectivity goes out the window and people start mixing apples and
oranges in their arguments and make no sense.  I mean, what does a
hand crank have to do with starting cars now-a-days let alone amateur
radio?

I am not in favor of seeing the code go by the wayside but I can
appreciate the idea that it just may one day...but to the detriment of
amateur radio-in my opinion.  We are taking this hobby for granted now
and treating it as a "right" and not the "privilege" that it is.  "We
have a right to use the HF bands and not have to learn code to do it!
Code is too hard to learn.  It is a barrier that keeps many out of ham
radio."  Wah wah wah...you get the point.   That attitude is going to
be the demise of ham radio and not really the code, no-code debate.
When something is obtained for nothing, like this, it will probably be
taken for granted.  The 27 MHz band-case in point.  That is where you
need to go if you are looking for instant gratification.

I look forward to yours and anyone else's un-emotional and adult-like
response.  I don't mind reading them when they are written thusly.
It's the whinining and crying most of us abhor.





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:43 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:18:45 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
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Roger D. Placer wrote:
> First of all, it's an early 20th-century invention, not 19th.

Hi Roger, that would mean that Samuel Morse invented the code
after his death in 1872, quite a feat.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:44 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 9 Dec 1996 01:47:09 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 18
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References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>CW is to modern radio communications what a '65 Mustang is to
>automobiles. It gets lousy mileage, isn't that comfortable, has no
>airbags/ABS, and doesn't shift that smoothly. But... it smells of steel
>and oil and grease and goes real fast. On any sunny day in the hills
>you'd rather drive one than even sit in that Camry or Accord. And that's
>why we love 'em. And you'll never get them off the modern roads despite
>the electric cars, over-priced luxo-sedans, and generic "for the people"
>econoboxes.

Nobody is trying to force your '65 Mustang off the road.  You are welcome
to drive it all you want on the modern highways.  But wouldn't it be
absurd if the government mandated that we successfully pass a driving test
in a '65 Mustang before being allowed to drive a Camry, Accord, or other
modern automobile?

I think you get the point.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 10 Dec 1996 07:49:54 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58j4n2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Cecil Moore  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Roger D. Placer wrote:

>> First of all, it's an early 20th-century invention, not 19th.

>Hi Roger, that would mean that Samuel Morse invented the code
>after his death in 1872, quite a feat.

Hi Cec, Shame on you for believing Samuel had anything to do with CW, which
came into being in the early 1920s (just a few years before voice). You
know better than to confuse Morse code with Continuous Wave emission.
That's like telling those who yack into microphones that they're using
a form of communication that is millions of years old.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:46 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 20:35:44 GMT
Lines: 47

In article <[e-mail]> "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]> wr
ites:
>
>> There is no longer any legal justification for
>> requiring knowledge of a 19th-century communications mode to obtain an
>> amateur radio license.  If you still want to start your car by use of
>> a hand crank, fine...but you have no right to force it
>
>First of all, it's an early 20th-century invention, not 19th.

American Morse, 1838, the Continental Code (what we call Morse
today), mid-19th century. Now *Continous Waves* are a early 20th
century invention, but Element 1 doesn't test CW, it tests Morse
Code decoding speed.

>Second,
>the car analogy isn't quite right:
>
>CW is to modern radio communications what a '65 Mustang is to
>automobiles. It gets lousy mileage, isn't that comfortable, has no
>airbags/ABS, and doesn't shift that smoothly. But... it smells of steel
>and oil and grease and goes real fast.

Goes real fast? ROTFL

If you want a car analogy, consider Morse the Citroen CV-2 of radio.
It is crude, slow, ugly, and has very little cargo capacity (throughput),
but it runs on most any rotgut gasoline and can sometimes be repaired
by the village blacksmith, or at least be converted into a covered
ox cart.

I'd prefer to stick with that favorite of third world nations
everywhere, the armored Chevy Suburban, or Jeep Cherokee, or maybe
a fancy Mercedes SUV if I'm rich as a Saudi sheik. (IE PACTOR,
Clover, or PACTOR II). Or if the roads are at least gravelled,
then I'll take a Chevy pickup (gunrack optional), IE SSB. And
for the interstate, I'll take that Camry, IE FM via repeater.

I wouldn't be too embarrassed to have an old Chevy up on blocks
in the front yard (it is a southern status symbol), but I'd certainly
be ashamed to be seen pushing a CV-2 down to Billy Bob's garage.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:47 1996
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From: [e-mail](Wes Printz )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!! --- NOT !!!!!!
Date: 8 Dec 1996 18:18:44 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58f0q4$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lbx-ca9-01.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 08 10:18:44 AM PST 1996



>
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>>Typical elitist ham attitudes displayed all over this newsgroup.
Sorry,
>>but the code IS outdated.
>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

You may think it is outdated, but this morning The Discovery Channel
was having Technical Difficulties. The Pix was scrambled, and the audio
feed was a CW identifier that went like this :

DE EVI030203956371 WCI1234045/

If CW is so outdated, could someone explain why a Sattellite based
programmer such as The Discovery Channel with shows like Next Step,
Beyond 2000, and Cyberlife, choose to indentify their transponder with
CW?? :)

Long Live CW. I use it and it is my mode of preference. Even up in the
VHF/UHF bands.

73, Wes KA3DSE



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:48 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 01 Dec 96 15:20:00
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Lines: 19


CB>Then why require any technical knowlege at all?  After all, as long as
  >one doesn't broadcast out of band or with too much power (problems
  >solved by the radio manufacturer), who needs to know what a resistor is
  >or what a transistor does?  Let's just get rid of all the technical
  >requirements, make the radios such that they can't transmit out of band,
  >require government approval before using any homemade TX and reduce the
  >tests to covering little more than rules and regs?

CB>If you can make an argument for removing the code requirement, I can
  >make a similar argument for doing the above.  Will we all be better off
  >then?  I think not.

Well said, excellent.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:49 1996
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From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 3 Dec 1996 01:24:39 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <57vvgn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: dyn-max02-185.chi.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Rol
and Stiner) writes:
>
>CB>Then why require any technical knowlege at all?  After all, as long as
>  >one doesn't broadcast out of band or with too much power (problems
>  >solved by the radio manufacturer), who needs to know what a resistor is
>  >or what a transistor does?  Let's just get rid of all the technical
>  >requirements, make the radios such that they can't transmit out of band,
>  >require government approval before using any homemade TX and reduce the
>  >tests to covering little more than rules and regs?
>
>CB>If you can make an argument for removing the code requirement, I can
>  >make a similar argument for doing the above.  Will we all be better off
>  >then?  I think not.
>
>Well said, excellent.
>

NO, NO, NO ... VERY POORLY SAID ... the argument above advocates CB ...
while we now have lots of "CBers who beep" (those who "just want to yack
and play games" and "don't give a damn about how the radio works
inside"), that is NOT what ham radio is FOR ...

Theory will ALWAYS be necessary and justified, because a MAJOR part of
ham radio is RADIO (theory, how it works, experimenting, etc.) ... the
fact that some people who are currently licensed have "fallen away from
the gospel" does NOT change the reality of what ham radio is FOR in a
regulatory/justification sense ...

The technology (and therefore, theory) will ALWAYS advance (though very
slowly according to the majority of current amateur practice) ...
therefore the theory tests will always be relevant ... (they are a
significant part of what ham radio is FOR) ...

Morse code, however is a 150+ year old mode ... older, in fact, than
radio ... it no longer holds its position as the ONLY way for hams to
communicate, but it still (unfairly and unreasonably) holds the position
as the SOLE mode with its own pass/fail element in the testing process.

THAT is backward, and it must cease for the sake of the future of ham
radio ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 3 Dec 1996 09:05:43 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <580qh7$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vvgn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Carl Stevenson ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Theory will ALWAYS be necessary and justified, because a MAJOR part of
: ham radio is RADIO (theory, how it works, experimenting, etc.) ... the
: fact that some people who are currently licensed have "fallen away from
: the gospel" does NOT change the reality of what ham radio is FOR in a
: regulatory/justification sense ...

In an ideal world, maybe.

: The technology (and therefore, theory) will ALWAYS advance (though very
: slowly according to the majority of current amateur practice) ...
: therefore the theory tests will always be relevant ... (they are a
: significant part of what ham radio is FOR) ...

If this were really true, then the question pool would NOT be published.
Also, the questions would be more rigorous. I don't think the Extra exam
is any harder than the Tech/General test was about 30 years ago.

: Morse code, however is a 150+ year old mode ... older, in fact, than
: radio ... it no longer holds its position as the ONLY way for hams to
: communicate, but it still (unfairly and unreasonably) holds the position
: as the SOLE mode with its own pass/fail element in the testing process.

True. That is why I have advocated CW as an ADDITIONAL endorsement on
on any license. Passing the code allows usage of some small band segments
that are not available otherwise.

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 5 Dec 1996 08:33:56 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <5861dk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vvgn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <57vvgn$[e-mail]>, Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>NO, NO, NO ... VERY POORLY SAID ... the argument above advocates CB ...
>while we now have lots of "CBers who beep" (those who "just want to yack
>and play games" and "don't give a damn about how the radio works
>inside"), that is NOT what ham radio is FOR ...

You're really out of touch, Gargoyle. A very large number of the builders
today fall in the pro-code catagory. For proof, send an email to
[e-mail] and only write   subscribe qrp-l  then sit back and
enjoy the 100+ articles per day written by builders who beep.

You scold those of us who beep as not knowing how our radios work, but
you've never answered my question from long ago: What radios are you
using on the air that you've actually built? All my transmitters are
home built.

>Morse code, however is a 150+ year old mode ... older, in fact, than
>radio ... it no longer holds its position as the ONLY way for hams to

Yes, and vocal communication goes back millions of years. Yet you still
own a mic, yes? And how old is the telephone? Still using that old thing?

The time-tested methods will always stay with us.

>THAT is backward, and it must cease for the sake of the future of ham
>radio ...

Too bad you don't have HF privileges to use the  WARC bands we
were given. There's a proposal aboard for us to be given more new
HF frequencies, too. Now what were you saying about code hindering
our future?

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:46 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <58acpf$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vvgn$[e-mail]> <5861dk$[e-mail]> <587pui$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>Nobody has said "you guys have to stop beeping" ... all we've said is
>"beeping is antiquated and *we* don't want to do it ... we want to do
>more modern things ..."

Yeah. Like getting on SSB on 20 meters......

>I honestly believe you beepers are simply afraid that nobody else will
>learn to beep, the other beepers will die off, and you'll be the *last*
>beeper left alive and have nobody to beep with ... is *that* it?

Nope. That's not it. Guess again.

>And YES code continues to hinder our future ... and will as long as it's
>mandatory ...

Might be hindering YOUR future, but the rest of us are already on HF.

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:54 1996
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From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 02:09:58 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vvgn$[e-mail]> <5861dk$[e-mail]> <587pui$[e-mail]> <58acpf$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>
>>Nobody has said "you guys have to stop beeping" ... all we've said is
>>"beeping is antiquated and *we* don't want to do it ... we want to do
>>more modern things ..."
>
>Yeah. Like getting on SSB on 20 meters......
>
>>I honestly believe you beepers are simply afraid that nobody else will
>>learn to beep, the other beepers will die off, and you'll be the *last*
>>beeper left alive and have nobody to beep with ... is *that* it?
>
>Nope. That's not it. Guess again.
>
>>And YES code continues to hinder our future ... and will as long as it's
>>mandatory ...
>
>Might be hindering YOUR future, but the rest of us are already on HF.
>


Considering the state of human communications, perhaps voice should be
made verboten (a little Germanic lingo) and replaced by keyboard modes
ONLY.  The test would deal with placement of the damm caps key
(something all too many people that post on this newzgrup are unaware
of), the need for new keyboard styles, the ever-popular type-ahead
buffer and ergonometric styling!

Now of course, since a keyboard can be used to send CW, both sides of
this problem can be satisfied.



               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
            e-mail to [e-mail]
      This is radio station K7NO coming to you
       from the beautiful Men's room at Sears.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:56 1996
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From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 22:03:00 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]

> I disagree.  It's not keeping any more people away than it ever
> has.
>
> Dick WD0ANB

I agree Dick. The Testing of CW is not what's holding back the hobby. It
appears that most everyone in this news group has forgotten that we have
a no-code license as an option.  Everything that's available on HF (
plus much more) is available above 30 MHz.  Nobody trying to get into
the hobby is saying "Eliminate the CW requirement so that I may use 300
baud packet."

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:56 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 7 Dec 1996 00:26:05 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

Carl I think you our Antiquated, so I guess thats a Great Reason to get
rid of you. Whats the Problem with CW Carl, just to lazy, or not Mentally
capable of Meeting the Challenge.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:57 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 7 Dec 1996 15:00:51 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <588fui$[e-mail]>
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X-Admin: [e-mail]
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Carl I guess we can also Call you a Beeper since most of your Digital
Modes Beep also.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.80.63.252!delphi.com!usenet
From: "Cecil A. Moore" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 06:11:07 -0700
Organization: Delphi Internet Services Corporation
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]>
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T E I X E I R A wrote:
> When all else fails you can use wire and a battery for a CW transmitter.
> Don W6IQ

Hi Don, I question your ability to communicate with a battery and a wire.
The RF generated by shorting the battery out cannot be heard very far
away and the battery will not last long. Assuming the EMP knocked out
all the transistors, who is going to hear you? Someone with a crystal
set? Your statement makes me tend to believe the last 3 characters of
your call. :-)

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:18:59 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Robert Moldenhauer)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 2 Dec 1996 15:53:21 GMT
Organization: Sheltering Sky Publications
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <57uu1h$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
>
>
>CB>Then why require any technical knowlege at all?

Morse code is not the same as technical knowledge, it is an encoding
scheme, like ASCII.

If you enjoy using it there is nothing wrong with that, but doesn't it
smack of the old days of excessive government regulations to force
hobbyists who just want to run HF packet or SSTV to learn Morse Code?

I thought the trend was for less government interference in private
lives, why are people arguing for more?



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 17:17:32 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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On 2 Dec 1996 15:53:21 GMT, [e-mail] (Robert Moldenhauer)
wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>[e-mail] says...
>>
>>
>>CB>Then why require any technical knowlege at all?
>
>Morse code is not the same as technical knowledge, it is an encoding
>scheme, like ASCII.
>
>If you enjoy using it there is nothing wrong with that, but doesn't it
>smack of the old days of excessive government regulations to force
>hobbyists who just want to run HF packet or SSTV to learn Morse Code?
>
>I thought the trend was for less government interference in private
>lives, why are people arguing for more?
>

I know several (3) people who have ham tickets solely to be able to
fly RC aircraft using 6 mtr frequencies. Why did they have to take a
test covering material that they do not need to know and will never
use?

73 de n4jvp
Fritz


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:01 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 10:49:54 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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A.G. von Luternow wrote:
> Why did they have to take a test covering material that they
> do not need to know and will never use? 73 de n4jvp Fritz

Because the covered material is very relevant to amateur radio.
A stand-along Morse code test is only barely relevant anymore.
All modes should be treated equally.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:02 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 2 Dec 1996 17:31:15 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <57vlbj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <57uu1h$[e-mail]>,
        Robert Moldenhauer <[e-mail]> wrote:

>If you enjoy using it there is nothing wrong with that, but doesn't it
>smack of the old days of excessive government regulations to force
>hobbyists who just want to run HF packet or SSTV to learn Morse Code?

An excellent argument. Why should I be forced to learn about RTTY
for FM voice privs? Why force me to learn about HF packet when all
I want to do is yack on HF SSB? The list is endless.


>I thought the trend was for less government interference in private
>lives, why are people arguing for more?

Spectrum management is not interference in private lives, unless you
want to count those people who believe it is their right to set up
and operate micro-transmitter FM stations everywhere.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:03 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 16:11:26 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]>
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Michael P. Deignan wrote:
> An excellent argument. Why should I be forced to learn about RTTY
> for FM voice privs? Why force me to learn about HF packet when all
> I want to do is yack on HF SSB? The list is endless.

Hi Michael, the key word above is "about". No one would object to
having to learn about Morse code. When one learns about RTTY, one
is not subjected to threat of force from the feds to be able to
decode it "by ear".

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:05 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 9 Dec 1996 01:50:06 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <58fr8e$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
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Cecil Moore ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Michael P. Deignan wrote:
: > An excellent argument. Why should I be forced to learn about RTTY
: > for FM voice privs? Why force me to learn about HF packet when all
: > I want to do is yack on HF SSB? The list is endless.

: Hi Michael, the key word above is "about". No one would object to
: having to learn about Morse code. When one learns about RTTY, one
: is not subjected to threat of force from the feds to be able to
: decode it "by ear".

Cecil, you are "picking nits" again.

Why should a person have to learn electronic theory, when all they want to
do is buy a rig and start yacking?  A more appropriate course would be in
learning how to read and understand a user's manual.

Why should a person have to learn about SSB, RTTY, FM etc, when all he wants
to do is operate CW?

Why should a person have to take an advanced theory test, just so they can
operate at the maximum legal power? Why is a Novice only allowed voice
privileges on 10 meters (the band where they are most likely to cause TVI)?

Why any sort of testing at all? If a person wants to experiment with new
modes, theory testing is not going to prove his/her capability of doing so.

In other words, your argument is silly.

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:07 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 10 Dec 1996 04:03:48 GMT
Organization: Real/Time Communications Internet customer posting
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <58inf4$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2

In <[e-mail]>, Cecil Moore <[e-mail].c
om> writes:
>Chris Broadbent wrote:
>> If you can avoid CW testing because it isn't relevant to you, then I
>> want to avoid all the components of the tests that I consider not
>> relevant to me.
>
>Hi Chris, I have an advanced class license and CW is my favorite mode.
>
>IMO, people who take your above attitude simply want something for
>nothing. They would rather take the easy way out and learn an easy,
>relatively useless skill like CW than to do the slightly more difficult
>task of learning something that will do them some good, like detailed
>knowledge of electronics. Too lazy to learn electronics? Substitute Morse
>code and give the government a perfect reason to do away with ham radio.
>
>73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC

I take it you haven't been reading this thread all the way through.  I am for
not just keeping the CW requirement but for increasing the difficulty of the
technical components.

IMO, it is quite contrary to what you say.  If people are making all this fuss
over what you admit is an easy skill, imagine what they'll cry when you
increase the technical difficulty, especially if they have no intention of
designing or building anything.

I believe you'll simply throw out the baby with the bathwater, so to speak.

For the record, my only transmitter is a CW TX in recently completed -
completely homebrew.  I say this, not to brag, but simply to counter your
implication that people who hold my view might be looking for the easy
way out.

Likewise, of all the hams in my circle, most of the no-code techs simply
buy their radios (usually handi's) and have no intention of designing or
building anything.  By contrast, within my circle, most CW'ers build their
own transmitters and some their own receivers as well.  My experience
contradicts your assertion.

BTW, it also contradicts Carl Stevenson's harping on about "CB'ers who
beep".  I find it quite ironic that the very people he supports are the
ones who, in my experience, are most like CB'ers.

Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:08 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 13:52:27 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: camoore-desk.ch.intel.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)

Chris Broadbent wrote:
> If you can avoid CW testing because it isn't relevant to you, then I
> want to avoid all the components of the tests that I consider not
> relevant to me.

Hi Chris, I have an advanced class license and CW is my favorite mode.

IMO, people who take your above attitude simply want something for
nothing. They would rather take the easy way out and learn an easy,
relatively useless skill like CW than to do the slightly more difficult
task of learning something that will do them some good, like detailed
knowledge of electronics. Too lazy to learn electronics? Substitute Morse
code and give the government a perfect reason to do away with ham radio.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!news.udel.edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Robert Penneys)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CW on hold on ham store phone?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 19:58:31 -0500
Organization: University of Delaware
Lines: 2
Distribution: usa
Message-ID: <58icjn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: copland.udel.edu

A friend told me of a ham store that gives you CW instead of music,
weather or such on hold. Anybody know who it might be? Tnx.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.255.24.253!news.WARWICK.NET!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Mike D'Alto)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 12:12:32 GMT
Organization: Warwick Online
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: m252-04.warwick.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

On Wed, 04 Dec 1996 23:54:43 GMT, [e-mail] (david
l. thompson) wrote:

>FROM An E-mail
>Reflector....................................................Dave
>K4JRB.
>
>Gang I am going to use a little of your bandwidth with a desperate
>plea for help.
>
>My local Ham Radio Club the Delaware Lehigh ARC is holding it's annual
>special event for Christmas time on the weekend of Dec 14 - 15 using
>the call sign WX3MAS.
>
>Well this ARRL affiliated club whose president is a No Code tech has
>FORBIDDEN the use of CW for this officially sanctioned event.
>
>You read that correctly those were there EXACT words CW was to be
>FORBIDDEN.
>I guess the influx of the codeless crowd has gone that far, the local
>voice of the ARRL would speak those words.
>Mind you they gave me some drivel that CW was not a popular mode and
>few people would make contact with them in that mode and that the
>Techs would not be able to enjoy the station.
>
With all due respect I think it's time to think seriously about
quitting that club.  Sounds like a Communist organization to me.
Sheesh. . .  Perhaps if all the members who are serious CW operators
got together and walked out, the leadership would get the message.

73 es DX,
C. "Mike" D'Alto, K2CD   http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1641


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (david l. thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 23:54:43 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <58526d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-41-202.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 4 Dec 1996 23:41:01 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

FROM An E-mail
Reflector....................................................Dave
K4JRB.

Gang I am going to use a little of your bandwidth with a desperate
plea for help.

My local Ham Radio Club the Delaware Lehigh ARC is holding it's annual
special event for Christmas time on the weekend of Dec 14 - 15 using
the call sign WX3MAS.

Well this ARRL affiliated club whose president is a No Code tech has
FORBIDDEN the use of CW for this officially sanctioned event.

You read that correctly those were there EXACT words CW was to be
FORBIDDEN.
I guess the influx of the codeless crowd has gone that far, the local
voice of the ARRL would speak those words.
Mind you they gave me some drivel that CW was not a popular mode and
few people would make contact with them in that mode and that the
Techs would not be able to enjoy the station.

I have managed to convice one of the old timers to let me and a friend
set up a classic home brew CW station seperate from the main station.
It will be on from 00:00 z to 02:00z on Sun Dec 15.
(Thats 7 to 9 pm eastern time Sat)  And this is where you come in.

I need all of my brother and sister contesters to listen for us on
7.047 + or - durring that time I NEED your pile up! Listen closely as
the signal will be weak only about 35 watts or so.

Lets show these fellows that we who struggled so hard to learn this
mode will never allow it to be FORBIDDEN for any reason.  Lets let
them know that what happened to the MARS frequencys will not happen on
the amateur frequencys.

Please don't let this turn into a huge battle over code / No code
requirments now it seems we are fighting for our very survival.

Please help.

If you hear WX3MAS on SSB ask for a CW qso
And please work this station on 7.047 12/15/96 00:00 to 02:00z

God bless you and happy holidays.

George
*********************************************
*George Cook.....AA3JU.....

End ...Revised slightly by K4JRB for this post.

Please remember this is a local decision not one from ARRL HQ!!!!!!!



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.233.85.167!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 02:36:31 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <585cbv$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-18.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (david l. thompson) wrote:

>Well this ARRL affiliated club whose president is a No Code tech has
>FORBIDDEN the use of CW for this officially sanctioned event.

Does this president carry ALL the power in the club?  If so he is not
a president but a dictator.  I never plan to join that club.

>You read that correctly those were there EXACT words CW was to be
>FORBIDDEN.

Pure baloney!  No mode should be forbidden.  That is not amateur
radio.

>I guess the influx of the codeless crowd has gone that far, the local
>voice of the ARRL would speak those words.
>Mind you they gave me some drivel that CW was not a popular mode and
>few people would make contact with them in that mode and that the
>Techs would not be able to enjoy the station.

The Techs would not be able to enjoy the station, hehe.  Are they
planning to operate HF?  What are the techs doing there if they are?
They plan to operate only 10 meters and up?

>I have managed to convice one of the old timers to let me and a friend
>set up a classic home brew CW station seperate from the main station.

Pray tell, what is the main station?  I hope we don't hear your club
president anywhere on HF especially if there is no control op present
for him to "participate" on hf.

>It will be on from 00:00 z to 02:00z on Sun Dec 15.
>(Thats 7 to 9 pm eastern time Sat)  And this is where you come in.

>I need all of my brother and sister contesters to listen for us on
>7.047 + or - durring that time I NEED your pile up! Listen closely as
>the signal will be weak only about 35 watts or so.

Will be there good Lord willin and the creek don't rise.

      jim, wk1v



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.233.85.167!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 01:12:55 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <587rr4$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-17.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>Is the station going to be operated in a public place like a mall or
>something?  Maybe the leadership is concerned about the PR aspects of
>portraying ham radio as a user of backward technology (a bunch of
>beepers) to the public ... maybe the leadership wants to "put our best
>foot forward" by fielding a modern station using more modern,
>"user-friendly" technologies so that the public will be impressed,
>rather than snickering at "the old fools that still use such backward
>techniques." THAT's THE WAY MOST PEOPLE IN TODAY'S WORLD VIEW CW AND
>THOSE WHO CLING TO IT!!!

>Think about it ...  at least half (probably far more)the people in the
>mall are carrying pagers, cellphones, etc.  ...  they're technologically
>astute enough to recognize that CW is antiquated ...  and the *hams* are
>*supposed* to be the "radio wizards" ...  THIS DOES *NOT* COMPUTE ...

Carl, it's all in your mind.

   jim, wk1v





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!news.ysu.edu!odin.oar.net!malgudi.oar.net!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 5 Dec 1996 21:37:45 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <587fb9$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn04.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <58526d$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>FROM An E-mail
>Reflector....................................................Dave
>K4JRB.
>
>Gang I am going to use a little of your bandwidth with a desperate
>plea for help.
>
>My local Ham Radio Club the Delaware Lehigh ARC is holding it's annual
>special event for Christmas time on the weekend of Dec 14 - 15 using
>the call sign WX3MAS.
>
>Well this ARRL affiliated club whose president is a No Code tech has
>FORBIDDEN the use of CW for this officially sanctioned event.
>
>You read that correctly those were there EXACT words CW was to be
>FORBIDDEN.
>I guess the influx of the codeless crowd has gone that far, the local
>voice of the ARRL would speak those words.
>Mind you they gave me some drivel that CW was not a popular mode and
>few people would make contact with them in that mode and that the
>Techs would not be able to enjoy the station.

Did anyone at your club speak up and ask that the matter be put to a vote? A
club should be a democracy, not a dictatorship.

73s

Tom
N8ECW



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 6 Dec 1996 00:45:49 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <587qbt$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-13.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <585cbv$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V) writes:
>[e-mail] (david l. thompson) wrote:
>
>>Well this ARRL affiliated club whose president is a No Code tech has
>>FORBIDDEN the use of CW for this officially sanctioned event.

Is the station going to be operated in a public place like a mall or
something?  Maybe the leadership is concerned about the PR aspects of
portraying ham radio as a user of backward technology (a bunch of
beepers) to the public ... maybe the leadership wants to "put our best
foot forward" by fielding a modern station using more modern,
"user-friendly" technologies so that the public will be impressed,
rather than snickering at "the old fools that still use such backward
techniques." THAT's THE WAY MOST PEOPLE IN TODAY'S WORLD VIEW CW AND
THOSE WHO CLING TO IT!!!

Think about it ...  at least half (probably far more)the people in the
mall are carrying pagers, cellphones, etc.  ...  they're technologically
astute enough to recognize that CW is antiquated ...  and the *hams* are
*supposed* to be the "radio wizards" ...  THIS DOES *NOT* COMPUTE ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:26 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <58acor$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-172.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>Is the station going to be operated in a public place like a mall or
>something?  Maybe the leadership is concerned about the PR aspects of
>portraying ham radio as a user of backward technology (a bunch of
>beepers) to the public ... maybe the leadership wants to "put our best
>foot forward" by fielding a modern station using more modern,
>"user-friendly" technologies so that the public will be impressed,
>rather than snickering at "the old fools that still use such backward
>techniques." THAT's THE WAY MOST PEOPLE IN TODAY'S WORLD VIEW CW AND
>THOSE WHO CLING TO IT!!!

>Think about it ...  at least half (probably far more)the people in the
>mall are carrying pagers, cellphones, etc.  ...  they're technologically
>astute enough to recognize that CW is antiquated ...  and the *hams* are
>*supposed* to be the "radio wizards" ...  THIS DOES *NOT* COMPUTE ...

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

You don't get out enuff, Squiggie.  Most people in the 'mall' view ham radio
as  'Oh, you mean CB ?'  Another poor attempt, Squiggie.  Very poor.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:19 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <58526d$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 00:08:15 GMT
Lines: 15
Sender: [e-mail]

The real problem lies in understanding that amateur radio is really many
hobbies within one hobby.  It goes beyond CW versus phone.  There is room
in amateur radio, and should be in most clubs, to promote everyone's
favorite mode of communication.

Having seen the Internet before packet radio, I am amazed that so many
fellow club members are so taken by this mode.

It sounds like this club's president needs some understanding of the overall
aspects of the hobby.

Where is this club's Board of Directors while all this is happening?

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (david l. thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 17:39:33 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <589kvc$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-41-202.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 6 Dec 1996 17:26:04 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

The message came from AA3JU.  Other than post for him I have nothing
to do with the club.  I do hear the flack has hit the club and they
plan on expanding the Cw operation along with the classic Cw station.

Dave K4JRB



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!hunter.premier.net!news.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 9 Dec 1996 02:16:25 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58fspp$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>Think about it ...  at least half (probably far more)the people in the
>mall are carrying pagers, cellphones, etc.  ...  they're technologically
>astute enough to recognize that CW is antiquated ...  and the *hams* are
>*supposed* to be the "radio wizards" ...  THIS DOES *NOT* COMPUTE ...

Right!

"Look, Mom! A bunch of CBers!. I didn't know that they used Morse Code.
I thought they were too stupid and lazy."

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!realtime.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 10 Dec 1996 04:23:07 GMT
Organization: Real/Time Communications Internet customer posting
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <58iojb$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: maria-4a.ip.realtime.net
X-RTcode: 51f3f9c132ab77bc04ace5b0
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2

Despite this obvious troll, I felt obliged to respond (and I'm sure
I'm going to regret it).

In <587qbt$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) writes:
>In <585cbv$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V) writes
:
>>[e-mail] (david l. thompson) wrote:
>>
>>>Well this ARRL affiliated club whose president is a No Code tech has
>>>FORBIDDEN the use of CW for this officially sanctioned event.
>
> ...<SNIP>
>
>...  Maybe the leadership is concerned about the PR aspects of
>portraying ham radio as a user of backward technology (a bunch of
>beepers) to the public ...
>

Maybe the leadership is so ashamed to show they're too damned
lazy or impatient to sit down for 15 minutes a night for a month
to learn the code that they'd rather ban it.  I find it as ghastly
as banning a language because someone can't understand it
(except that it's a damn site easier to learn CW than another
language).

> ...<SNIP>
>
>rather than snickering at "the old fools that still use such backward
>techniques." THAT's THE WAY MOST PEOPLE IN TODAY'S WORLD VIEW CW AND
>THOSE WHO CLING TO IT!!!
>

Gee, I use the telephone sometimes.  When was that invented?  I fly on
airplanes sometimes.  When were they invented?  I drive in a car more or
less daily.  When was that invented?  I wear glasses.  When were they
invented?

All the above (and CW radios, too) have had implementation
improvements, but all employ the same basic principles (IC engine, rudder,
3KHz bandwidth handset, refractive material, etc.).  There are many
things we use that were invented long ago, but are still just as useful
today.  Arguing against CW on that basis is a non-starter.

>Think about it ...  at least half (probably far more)the people in the
>mall are carrying pagers, cellphones, etc.  ...  they're technologically
>astute enough to recognize that CW is antiquated ...  and the *hams* are
>*supposed* to be the "radio wizards" ...  THIS DOES *NOT* COMPUTE ...
>

I doubt many in the mall would even recognise what a Ham radio is.
The latest soap opera star, perhaps.  A pair of Porsche sunglasses,
maybe.  But a Ham radio?  I doubt it.  I believe you'd be wasting your
time if you thought any mode would help out there.

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]
>
>

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:24 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 12:55:27 GMT
Lines: 20
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119970 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43955

In article <57qfj6$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:
>The following is a summary of QSO totals from the XZ1N DXpedition
>to Burma/Myanmar. Note the ratio of CW to Total QSOs. Unusual?
>Not at all. *Every* DXpedition returns with such a high CW ratio.
>That CW continues to be the common mode amongst the world's HF
>hams is reason enough for the US code tests to be kept.
>Jeff KH2PZ

Sorry, that does not compute. It may be a reason for *Dxers* to
learn and use Morse, but it is not a reason for every amateur
wishing HF access to learn Morse. Contrary to the opinions of
some, running up high Dx scores is not the overriding goal of
amateur radio or of most radio amateurs.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-11.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 13:51:49 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Gary Coffman wrote:
> Contrary to the opinions of some, running up high Dx scores is
> not the overriding goal of amateur radio or of most radio amateurs.

Yup Gary, if CW is such a superior mode, why are CW contacts given
an unfair point advantage on field day? We have a serious case of
discriminatory mode-ism in amateur radio.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 04:25:02 GMT
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-240-231.nc.us.ibm.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120176 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44024

On Sun, 08 Dec 1996 13:51:49 -0800, Cecil Moore
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Gary Coffman wrote:
>> Contrary to the opinions of some, running up high Dx scores is
>> not the overriding goal of amateur radio or of most radio amateurs.
>
>Yup Gary, if CW is such a superior mode, why are CW contacts given
>an unfair point advantage on field day? We have a serious case of
>discriminatory mode-ism in amateur radio.
>
Cecil, not another 'ism'!  That is just plain Ism-ism.

73

KR4AJ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!realtime.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: 10 Dec 1996 04:51:11 GMT
Organization: Real/Time Communications Internet customer posting
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <58iq7v$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
 writes:
>>
>> ...<SNIP>
>>
>>That CW continues to be the common mode amongst the world's HF
>>hams is reason enough for the US code tests to be kept.
>>Jeff KH2PZ

>Sorry, that does not compute. It may be a reason for *Dxers* to
>learn and use Morse, but it is not a reason for every amateur
>wishing HF access to learn Morse. Contrary to the opinions of
>some, running up high Dx scores is not the overriding goal of
>amateur radio or of most radio amateurs.
>
>Gary

Gary, if not for long distance communication, why would you
want to use HF?  And it is much inferior to VHF/UHF for short
range or wide bandwidth apps.

His point about CW being the common mode in the world
stands.  It is a fact that many cannot afford the digital
equipment required to do the fancy digital modes.  Phone
doesn't cut it so well for long distance, so they are left with
CW.  The USA is quite unusual in the world with its extremely
favourable computer price/income ratio, compared even to
Western Europe, let alone poorer parts of the world.

Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!surfnet.nl!swidir.switch.ch!news.rccn.net!news.ist.utl.pt!alfa.ist.utl.pt!l38217
From: [e-mail] (Pedro Pedroso)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CW-N Filter Adaption ??
Date: 9 Dec 1996 13:09:01 GMT
Organization: Instituto Superior Tecnico
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58h31d$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: alfa.ist.utl.pt
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

        Hello !

        I just bought a CW-N filter for my Icom IC-725.
        The problem is that the filter recomended is the FL-101 and the
        one I got is the FL-63 (used on the 735).
        They both are for the same IF and have the same caracteristics
        (250Hz/-6dB).
        The socket to put the filter is different so the FL-63 doesn't fit
        in the FL-101 place, anyway I have already made an adpator so the
        big question is WILL THE FL-63 WORK AS THE FL-101 ?????

        Thanks !
                                73 de CT1ELP
--


 | Pedro Pedroso                        |                            |
 | [e-mail]               |  CT1ELP                    |
 | Eng. Electrotecnica e Computadores   |  Founder member of GPDX    |
 | (Telecomunicacoes e electronica)     |                            |
 ---------------------------------------------------------------------
 | Address: P.O.Box 116 , 2806 Almada Codex , PORTUGAL               |
 ---------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:30 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Don Murray AE4BR)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: DF Systems are they still in business??
Date: 4 Dec 1996 02:37:58 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <582o66$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sav-ga6-02.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 03  6:37:58 PM PST 1996
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:97936 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43559 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119543

Hello and thanks for reading this..

Does anyone know if DF Systems is still in businness??

I went to their Web Site and placed and order over a week ago for their Handy
Finder Kit.  As of today, No kit and nothing heard from DF Systems period.

I have left them two pieces of mail and haven't heard a thing from them.

I am curious if they are still in business or if this is simply the way they
normally handle their business affairs??

Thanks
Don




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Don Murray AE4BR)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DF Systems are they still in business??
Date: 4 Dec 1996 19:29:39 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <584jf3$[e-mail]>
References: <582o66$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sav-ga1-19.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 04 11:29:39 AM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (beta 2)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:98036 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43590 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119609

Well finally heard from DF Systems, it seems that not answering mail nor
bothering with orders for weeks at a time is the way that DF Systems normally
does things.

I was informed by the owner that he doesn't own a watch, nor a calendar, and
that he answers his mail when he checks it, and that DF Systems was a hobby
with him.

This is all well and good, I only wished that he had let me know this when I
logged on his Web site, I wouldn't have wasted my time with his outfit if he
had..

Don



In article <582o66$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>Hello and thanks for reading this..
>
>Does anyone know if DF Systems is still in businness??
>
>I went to their Web Site and placed and order over a week ago for their Handy

>Finder Kit.  As of today, No kit and nothing heard from DF Systems period.
>
>I have left them two pieces of mail and haven't heard a thing from them.
>
>I am curious if they are still in business or if this is simply the way they
>normally handle their business affairs??
>
>Thanks
>Don
>
>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.232.240.5!news.ziplink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (J. Holt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Diesel Generators:  A few questions...
Date: 8 Dec 1996 22:40:35 GMT
Organization: J. Holt Associates
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <58fg53$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip54-max4-bos.ziplink.net
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (x86 32bit)

Good day.

Having just suffered through most of a weekend without power (due to a nasty
November snowstorm), I suddenly found motivation to look into getting a diesel

generator.

Follow my thoughts:  Gasoline is dangerous, spoils, gums up carbs.  A diesel
engine can burn oil from my oil tank, is pretty safe, and is pretty reliable.

I figure that I can put a valve on my oil line from the 200 gallon oil tank, a
nd attach
fifty feet of fuel line hose.  I can mount a 20 or 30 kw genset on a small tra
iler, and
when an outage hits, I can pull the genset out of the warm garage with the gar
den
tractor, and crank it up in the driveway.

I saw a 30 kw genset with a Detroit Diesel engine (rebuilt engine, new genset)
 for
$5000 delivered (Harbor Freight Tools).

Is this a good idea?

Is this a good deal?

Who makes commercial quality gen sets?  Cat?  Kohler?  Detroit?  Can you get o
ne
of these makes for not a lot of money?  Are there any catalog outlets that sel
l these
things?

How many gallons per hour do these things burn?

If you calculate the total load on a genset (120 V * total amps), how much
overcapacity do you need to handle start up surges, and keep the genset runnin
g in
a reliable fashion?  I don't want to tax the genset.  I'd rather keep the set
loafing
along under load.  We just want to run two fridges, a freezer, two furnaces, a
 water
pump, and a couple of lamps.

Currently relishing hot, running water, and heat.

N1AUP



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: "Ed lawrence" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Diesel Generators:  A few questions...
Date: 11 Dec 1996 02:37:23 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <01bbe70d$23215a00$62f92399@wa5swd>
References: <58fg53$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cust98.max9.portland.or.ms.uu.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



J. Holt <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<58fg53$[e-mail]>...
 Clip
>  A diesel
> engine can burn oil from my oil tank, is pretty safe, and is pretty
reliable.
clip
> I saw a 30 kw genset with a Detroit Diesel engine (rebuilt engine, new
genset) for
> $5000 delivered (Harbor Freight Tools).
> Who makes commercial quality gen sets?  Cat?  Kohler?  Detroit?  Can you
get one
> of these makes for not a lot of money?  Are there any catalog outlets
that sell these
> things?
> How many gallons per hour do these things burn?
> , how much
> overcapacity do you need to handle start up surges,
> We just want to run two fridges, a freezer, two furnaces, a water
> pump, and a couple of lamps.
> N1AUP

To: N1AUP. and others.

I have a military surplus 30 KVA 3 phase 60 Hz. diesel Generator, still
needing some repair on the
electronic speed regulator.  It is NOT small!  It is NOT quiet!  I have no
idea how much it burns at idle,
but  I'll bet it is a bunch.  It is mounted on a 2 wheel trailer, stands
about 8 feet high, is about 8 feet wide
and is about 8 feet long.  I have no idea how much it weighs, but it
probably is in the range of 4000 lb.

I had a 10 KVA Ww 2 AC gen that ran very well, but got rid of it. (I
moved).  It would not come off idle
when I used it to excite an AC welder at 10 KVA.  If you have a military
surplus Gen, don't worry about
allowing for overcapacity.  The military already did that.  I was told they
would deliver 3X the mil rating.
Generally the surge rating is mentioned on the unit.  50% over should be an
overkill.

I expect that you would be far happier with a well muffeled 3.5 KVA
120/240 12 VDC output Generator.
Also remember that you might be able to investigate carbs that can handle
natural gas or propane/butane.

Also remember that a diesel gen is hard to start in cold weather.  You may
need ether.
Good luck.  Hope this helps.  Ed  WA5SWD




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!chi-news.cic.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:31:02 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

WHAT IS HIS CALLSIGN?




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.178.176.27!hunter.premier.net!hammer.uoregon.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:06:55 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <581j30$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>WHAT IS HIS CALLSIGN?

Beeper business is so slow you are starting an Evan Platt fan club ?






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:37 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 03:15:06 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans44.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

No I don't. Does it matter? Even if I don't hold a ticket, I know how
many states our country has. I don't need a license to tell me that.
Now the question: Do YOU? I wouldn't know. You hide behind a number.
Perhaps you chose it based on your IQ? Your business skills leave
something to be desired as I assume you will gain no users from your
actions on this newsgroups.
Grow up and/or (preferably and) leave this group unless you have
something ON TOPIC to post, not some damn pager crap.

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>WHAT IS HIS CALLSIGN?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 19:20:49 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.105
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I asked a valid questions, and I am continually attacked by you and other
users of the group.  Why am I discriminated against? And who are you to
tell me not to check into this site?  Your actions are illegal and outright
liable.

You are entitled to express your opinions against someone's views, but you
cross that thin line when you make remarks against a persons character and
make those remarks to a person or group.

When you make remarks against a person character such as you have, you are
then liable for the damages to my business, and my character.



Michael Klein
ABA Certified PARALEGAL
State of NJ



Evan Platt <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> No I don't. Does it matter? Even if I don't hold a ticket, I know how
> many states our country has. I don't need a license to tell me that.
> Now the question: Do YOU? I wouldn't know. You hide behind a number.
> Perhaps you chose it based on your IQ? Your business skills leave
> something to be desired as I assume you will gain no users from your
> actions on this newsgroups.
> Grow up and/or (preferably and) leave this group unless you have
> something ON TOPIC to post, not some damn pager crap.
>
> "1" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >WHAT IS HIS CALLSIGN?
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 15:03:25 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <5879qd$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default>,
        1 <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I asked a valid questions, and I am continually attacked by you and other
>users of the group.  Why am I discriminated against?

Because you're a moron.


>And who are you to
>tell me not to check into this site?  Your actions are illegal and outright
>liable.

Freedom of speech does not mean you are entitled to an audience.


>When you make remarks against a person character such as you have, you are
>then liable for the damages to my business, and my character.

Opinions, labeled as such, are not libelous/slanderous. I suggest you
research the case law surrounding the circumstances of a major morning
television show commentator who gave a poor opinion of a company's
product and was later sued by the company.

Of course, if you were such a good paralegal, you'd already have done
that.

M "Just Me And My Opinions" D
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:41 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 20:34:13 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default>
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On 5 Dec 1996 19:20:49 GMT, "1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I asked a valid questions, and I am continually attacked by you and other
         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>users of the group.  Why am I discriminated against? And who are you to
>tell me not to check into this site?  Your actions are illegal and outright
>liable.
>
>You are entitled to express your opinions against someone's views, but you
>cross that thin line when you make remarks against a persons character and
>make those remarks to a person or group.
>
>When you make remarks against a person character such as you have, you are
                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>then liable for the damages to my business, and my character.
>
>
>
>Michael Klein
>ABA Certified PARALEGAL
>State of NJ
>
>
 You might want to tidy up your usage of singular and plural before
you go off filing lawsuits Mr. Michael Klein - ABA Certified PARALEGAL
- State of NJ. Those pesky S's can be real troublesome at times.

Gary K8IQ
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!207.17.118.2!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 03:31:27 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <587sjg$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I asked a valid questions, and I am continually attacked by you and other
>users of the group.  Why am I discriminated against? And who are you to
Because you are stupid?

>tell me not to check into this site?  Your actions are illegal and outright
>liable.
Excuse me?  How was his actions illegal?

>You are entitled to express your opinions against someone's views, but you
>cross that thin line when you make remarks against a persons character and
>make those remarks to a person or group.

Ah, heck, he did not say anything about your character.  Now I, on the
other hand, feel you are a moron.

Sue me.

>Michael Klein
>ABA Certified PARALEGAL
>State of NJ

Now, I am impressed.  With that, I could print this message off, and
use it to light my grill!






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:37 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <58acp8$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-172.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I asked a valid questions, and I am continually attacked by you and other
>users of the group.  Why am I discriminated against? And who are you to
>tell me not to check into this site?  Your actions are illegal and outright
>liable.

Well first of all, One, you wouldn't ask 'A valid questionS', you would either
ask 'SOME valid questionS' or 'A valid QUESTION'.   You aren't being
discriminated against.  You came along a posted a rediculous add, and a bunch
of
people responded to it.  Same thing would happen to ANYBODY who posted what yo
u
did.  When some people responded to your '51 States' announcement, you
responded by being a smartass, which in turn got you more attention.  I haven'
t
seen anything anybody said to YOU that was any worse than what you said to
the people who replied to your rediculous add.  You added fuel to the fire by
pestering people with private email. For example, in a private email to me you
said:

"PUERTO RICO HAS EVERY RIGHT THAT EVERY OTHER STATE HAS. SO THATS WHY MOST
PEOPLE CONSIDER IT A STATE.

YOU DON'T NEED A BEEPER BECAUSE I'M SURE NOONE WANTS YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY.

GUAM SUCKS"

>You are entitled to express your opinions against someone's views, but you
>cross that thin line when you make remarks against a persons character and
>make those remarks to a person or group.

Exactly.  For example, when you publicly call somebody a 'BOOB from GUAM' and
suggest that everyone 'flush twice, it's a long way to Guam' you may have
crossed that thin line.   You are obviously unaware that Usenet postings are
archived in several different locations, so everything YOU typed  is also
available for future reference should it be necessary.

>When you make remarks against a person character such as you have, you are
>then liable for the damages to my business, and my character.

I think you meant 'remarks against a personS character' ?
Yes, you might be.  But we are all (most of us, anyway) adults here, and we ar
e
use to seeing the personal insults fly, as that is all part of the Usenet game
,
so we probably won't waste any time or resources taking you to court.  Maybe y
ou
did enuff harm with your 'GUAM SUCKS' posting that the Guam Visitors Bureau
would feel you damaged their tourist business to the point litigation was
required, but I doubt it.  We in RRAP settle our differences like real hams.
Once a year we all get together in the parking lot at the Dayton hamfest and
beat each other up.

You made a fool of yourself with your '51 States' advertisment.  I would sugge
st
that you are continuing to make a fool of yourself with your public persecutio
n
of Evan Platt.

Usenet has a very short memory.  If you stop making a fool of yourself, you wi
ll
find that you can join any discussion that is ongoing here and your discrimati
on
complex will hopefully disappear.  If you continue to draw attention to yourse
lf

by persecuting Evan Platt and making threats, you might as well get use to not
fitting in with the rest of the gang.  Lighten up a little, One, and your
problems will all disappear. They are all between your ears.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:44 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 02:06:51 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <58fs7r$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default> <58acp8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

 "1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

 >I asked a valid questions, and I am continually attacked by you and other
 >users of the group.  Why am I discriminated against? And who are you to
 >tell me not to check into this site?  Your actions are illegal and outright
 >liable.

You are not being "discriminated against". People are responding to your
post just like they would for anyone who made such a stupid piece of
junk mail.

What is "illegal" or "liable" about their responses?  Are they any more illega
l
than your "Guam" references, or your calling people "dickheads"?

 >"PUERTO RICO HAS EVERY RIGHT THAT EVERY OTHER STATE HAS. SO THATS WHY MOST
 >PEOPLE CONSIDER IT A STATE.

I doubt if even a majority of the people in Puerto Rico consider PR to be a
state. Last survey that I heard about, the population did NOT want the island
to be granted statehood.

As far as people in the 50 states go - it is unfortunate, but a good share
don't even know Puerto Rico exists, much less where it is and that it is a
US protectorate.

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:45 1996
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Date: Sat, 7 Dec 96 12:55:44 EST
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: All 51 States <[e-mail]>
Comments: This message did not originate from the address above.  It was remailed by an anonymous remailing service.  If you have questions or complaints, please direct them to <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.usenet.kooks,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.correct,alt.fan.steve-winter,alt.whine,alt.stupidity
Subject: Does Michael Klein Possess a Brain? (was: Re: DOES EVAN PLATT HOLD A TICKET?)
Organization: Michael Klein for Governor of Puerto Rico Committee
References: <01bbe0c1$36958860$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]> <01bbe2e0$8f45f960$697174cf@default>
Mail-To-News-Contact: [e-mail]
Lines: 36
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119962 alt.usenet.kooks:53998 alt.discrimination:81714 alt.politics.correct:202991 alt.fan.steve-winter:2241 alt.stupidity:86763

"1" <[e-mail]> whined:

> I asked a valid questions, and I am continually attacked by you and other
> users of the group.  Why am I discriminated against? And who are you to
> tell me not to check into this site?  Your actions are illegal and outright
> liable.
>
> You are entitled to express your opinions against someone's views, but you
> cross that thin line when you make remarks against a persons character and
> make those remarks to a person or group.
>
> When you make remarks against a person character such as you have, you are
> then liable for the damages to my business, and my character.
>
> Michael Klein
> ABA Certified PARALEGAL
> State of NJ

And you don't think that any of the ALLEGED "damages to [your]
business" are due to the fact that you made a silly mistake in your
original post (claiming that your pagers worked in "all 51 states"),
then went ballistic when anyone tried to point it out?

As for "discrimination", what are you suggesting?  "Affirmative
action" for morons?  (Or is the correct term "mentally challenged"?)
This "politically correct" bullsh*t realy does get tiresome!

Maybe the people from Guam should file a "class action counter-suit"
against you for your disparaging and hateful remarks toward that
territory.

On second thought, folks, I'm wondering if Michael Klein is not a
relative (or close disciple) of the "Rev."  Steve Winter.  His "call
'em names and threaten to sue" tactics are certainly similar!




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: Steven Stark <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equiptment
Subject: DSP-232 and APRS
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 14:21:35 -0500
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-37kb9di.dialup.mindspring.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20637 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120315

Hello,
 Does anyone have any suggestions on getting APRS 7.7 to Recognize and
communicate with a DSP-232. I tried going to the comm screen to get the
command prompt and then tried to Initialize. I was never able to get a
command prompt at the comm screen. Any help would be greatly
appreciated!  73's
--

Steve Stark N4YOG ([e-mail])
.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (dslosty)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equiptment
Subject: Re: DSP-232 and APRS
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 20:26:03 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <58n5d6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip56.new-haven.ct.interramp.com
X-Server-Date: 11 Dec 1996 20:26:14 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20638 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120317

Steven Stark <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Hello,
> Does anyone have any suggestions on getting APRS 7.7 to Recognize and
>communicate with a DSP-232. I tried going to the comm screen to get the
>command prompt and then tried to Initialize. I was never able to get a
>command prompt at the comm screen. Any help would be greatly
>appreciated!  73's
>--

>Steve Stark N4YOG ([e-mail])

Can't comment on the APRS specifics but I do know that
about half of the DSP-232's firmware modes have bugs in them.

In in original V1.0 firmware, the unit isn't CCIR compatible, won't
properly maintain phase-lock in AMTOR/SITOR mode B,
can't maintain phase-lock in Navtext, has only mediocre copy
in PACTOR, not all modems are implemented, etc, etc.

I recently talked with the ARRL about their recent review
of the DSP-232. They admit that they didn't have the unit
long enough to discover all of the software bugs which have
now come to light.

AEA recognized this and has shipped revised frimware chips.
Did you send in your coupon packed with the DSP-232???

I got the new firmware chips about two weeks ago.
Haven't installed them yet so don't know how much they will
help although reports are that some of the bugs have been eliminated.

If you haven't received the new chips by now it's is probably too late
- with AEA shutting down.

Hopefully, someone will pick up the firmware support for their TNC
product line. There's probably a good business in upgrading PK-232,
DSP-232 and other model's firmware.

Doug/WA1TUT

nnnn




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!maw.montana.com!news
From: Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Dummy Load?
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 15:38:02 -0700
Organization: Internet Connect Services
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ham1-53.montana.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
of about 100 watts HF?

                                                -Mike McGinnis


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Anthony S. Pelliccio)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: 3 Dec 1996 20:47:59 -0500
Organization: Ideamation, Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <582l8f$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]>,
Michael McGinnis  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
>of about 100 watts HF?

Just ask KD1HZ - just plug the coax in and key up.

I hear he makes a great dummy load.

(For those that are wondering - I still owe Mike for the time he keyed
down at 25W CW and gave me a lovely RF burn.)

Tony




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: 3 Dec 1996 21:45:27 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <582ok7$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582l8f$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <582l8f$[e-mail]>,
        Anthony S. Pelliccio <[e-mail]> wrote:

>(For those that are wondering - I still owe Mike for the time he keyed
>down at 25W CW and gave me a lovely RF burn.)

Actually, it was 200 watts.

It also explains why you occasionally walk into the wall when walking
out a door.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!wcnews01.ops.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 11:18:48 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <586av2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-173.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
>of about 100 watts HF?

>                                               -Mike McGinnis

First you get a 100 watt 50 ohm resistor. Then you get a metal box.....
It don't get no more simple than that......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!visi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Anthony S. Pelliccio)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: 4 Dec 1996 19:58:58 -0500
Organization: Ideamation, Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5856oi$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582l8f$[e-mail]> <582ok7$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <582ok7$[e-mail]>,
Michael P. Deignan <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Actually, it was 200 watts.
>
>It also explains why you occasionally walk into the wall when walking
>out a door.

You're thinking of my cat who used to sit near the antenna on the bookshelf
while I was running 1500W on 23cm. To this day she still glows in the dark. :)


Tony




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:52 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 15:23:47 GMT
Lines: 25

In article <586av2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writ
es:
>Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
>>of about 100 watts HF?
>
>First you get a 100 watt 50 ohm resistor. Then you get a metal box.....
>It don't get no more simple than that......
>
>73, Jim KH2D

Yeah, but that had better be a darn special resistor. Most 100 watt
resistors will have far too much inductance at HF to be a good dummy
load. As far as I know, there are only two companies making power
resistors in that range which have low enough inductance. Used to
be you could use a bunch of paralleled 2 watt carbon resistors to
make up a low inductance dummy load, but carbon composition resistors
are disappearing. The carbon film resistors replacing them have, you
guessed it, too much inductance.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!panix!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:13:56 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58acnt$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-172.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (CDN) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>>>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
>>>of about 100 watts HF?
>>
>>>                                             -Mike McGinnis
>>
>>First you get a 100 watt 50 ohm resistor. Then you get a metal box.....
>>It don't get no more simple than that......
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D


>Negatory... First you get a 50 ohm non-reactive load and HEAT SINK it
>to handle 100 watts!

>I used to work in a lab where we made 50 ohm dummy loads about the
>size of a pencil eraser.  They would handle as much power as you could
>safely and properly dissipate through sinking.


>               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
>            e-mail to [e-mail]
>    Quality - Price - Service ... Pick 2 of 3

OH. OK. Well, that sounds like the hitek way. I was referring to the MFJ way,
least thats the way they built the one I have.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!news.syspac.com!news
From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 22:43:27 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58acnt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dnorris.syspac.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.339

>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
>>Negatory... First you get a 50 ohm non-reactive load and HEAT SINK it
>>to handle 100 watts!
>
>>I used to work in a lab where we made 50 ohm dummy loads about the
>>size of a pencil eraser.  They would handle as much power as you could
>>safely and properly dissipate through sinking.
>
>
>>               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
>>            e-mail to [e-mail]
>>    Quality - Price - Service ... Pick 2 of 3
>
>OH. OK. Well, that sounds like the hitek way. I was referring to the MFJ way,
>least thats the way they built the one I have.
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>


Hi Jim,


Hitek not= MJF <G>

MJF way would be to put a 2W wire wound in an aluminum box and rate it
for 1KW ICAS  (Instantaneous Cloud Amateur Smoke).


cdn


               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
            e-mail to [e-mail]
      This is radio station K7NO coming to you
       from the beautiful Men's room at Sears.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 16:35:07 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <58eqjn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-162.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>In article <586av2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] wri
tes:
>>Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
>>>of about 100 watts HF?
>>
>>First you get a 100 watt 50 ohm resistor. Then you get a metal box.....
>>It don't get no more simple than that......
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D

>Yeah, but that had better be a darn special resistor. Most 100 watt

My resistor is Special, Gary. It came from MFJ.  So it's probably 10 watts,
rated at 100 watts, and 75 ohms.......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!cc.iu.net!news
From: "Steve Iezzi" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 18:10:47 GMT
Organization: Aeronix, Inc.
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <01bbe6c4$f3608c70$495fe5ce@stevei>
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58eqjn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: siezzi.aeronix.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



> >>Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >>>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a
load
> >>>of about 100 watts HF?


You can build a good 50 ohm dummy load with a bunch of 2 watt carbon
composition (not wirewound) resistors.

Start with a quantity 48 2400 ohm 2 watt resistors.  You need to scrounge
these at a surplu store to make it cost effective.  Cut the leads to about
25" long.

Get two pieces of fiberglass copper clad board and drill holes through both
boards at the same time in a pattern  to accomodate all of the 2 watt
resistors.  8 rows of 6 each should work.  Space the holes about .5" apart
to allow room for airflow.  Solder each of the resistors into one board.
Then put the second board on the other side of the resistors.  Solder
these.  Now all of the resistors are in parallel.  Solder the braid of a
short piece of coax to one board and the shield to the other board. Attach
to a PL-259 and put it in a box with ventilation holes.

This load should be good through the HF bands and maybe all the way to 2
meters and run at 100 watts for about 10 minutes which means it's
equivalent to a commercially available dry dummy load with a 1.5KW rating.
The commercial loads are typically only good at their rating for 10
seconds.

If this sounds like a lot of work, Ham Radio Outlet in Sunnyvale had a demo
Tucker 1.5KW load for $39.

Good Luck

Steve KT4FY



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: DXER.COM Ham Resource Site
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 05:42:58 GMT
Organization: A customer of Pacific Bell Internet Services
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-220-48.anhm01.pacbell.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Stop by and check out - http://www.dxer.com
A new amateur radio website, with a on line BBS,
links to DX Clubs, Contest Clubs, On line Magazines,
Packet Clusters, 6 meter links, Maritime, Scanners,
Radio Mods,  VHF/HF Packet Cluster and more.

DXER.COM offers unique e-mail and webspace for personal
pages and more..

CHECK IT OUT

"http://www.dxer.com"


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:19:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.igc.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Dymek ? Does Anyone Know Where They Ran Off To ?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 00:59:12 GMT
Organization: Internet Gateway Connections
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <58a1ag$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpb-fl-1-14.igc.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I need a user manual for the Dymek DR22 All Wave Receiver, but the
numbers listed in the service manual are no longer operable. Anyone
have an idea ?

Alot of the boards inside are made by Texas Instruments, this isn't a
subsidiary is it ?

Jennifer.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!206.114.192.132!news.dmnd.net!news.cu-online.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Mike Donaldson)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap
Subject: E-mail
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 21:54:26 GMT
Organization: CU Online -- Your one stop Internet provider!
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-217.monticello.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

Need a new home for e-mail? It has come to my attention that alot of
brother and sister operators are having trouble with e-mail.
Thunderhead.com offers e-mail services starting at 5.00 per month and
for Hams a 1 time charge of 30.00.  Beats the regular price by half.
For more information e-mail [e-mail].

Mike
KB9OXE,


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.68.191.16!news.accessone.com!news
From: "Jon P. Brazelton" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap
Subject: Re: E-mail
Date: 4 Dec 1996 04:28:53 GMT
Organization: AccessOne
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <01bbe19a$ddbbb4a0$893840ce@braz>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.64.56.137
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Or, if you just want e-mail, try Juno ... it's 100% free.  Just e-mail your
name and address to [e-mail], or phone them at 1-800-654-5866.

Even though I have a "paying" account, I keep an account at Juno as a
backup.  You never know when a server is going to go down....

73
N4VRN


Mike Donaldson <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> Need a new home for e-mail? It has come to my attention that alot of
> brother and sister operators are having trouble with e-mail.
> Thunderhead.com offers e-mail services starting at 5.00 per month and
> for Hams a 1 time charge of 30.00.  Beats the regular price by half.
> For more information e-mail [e-mail].
>
> Mike
> KB9OXE,
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!service-2.agate.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (John Wilcox)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap
Subject: Re: E-mail
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 21:41:15 GMT
Organization: ARRL TC Maine section
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <584r5l$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ns1z.sdi.agate.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Hmmmm? Why would anyone pay for "just" e-mail when it can be had for
free? Contact the folks at JUNO where "E-mail was meant to be free!"


[e-mail] (Mike Donaldson) posted this in
rec.radio.amateur.swap:

*Need a new home for e-mail? It has come to my attention that alot of
*brother and sister operators are having trouble with e-mail.
*Thunderhead.com offers e-mail services starting at 5.00 per month and
*for Hams a 1 time charge of 30.00.  Beats the regular price by half.
*For more information e-mail [e-mail].

*Mike
*KB9OXE,

73 de John/NS1Z in Rumford, Maine
Baby-bell     : 207-364-2246
Free Mail     : [e-mail]
Work Mail     : [e-mail]
Home Mail     : [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!dciteleport.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: EVAN PLATTS 1995  '1040'
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:32:00 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <01bbe0c1$59e04300$8a7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155




UHHH   10W40?



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: EVANS MISSPELLED ESSAY
Date: 10 Dec 1996 20:05:17 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <01bbe6d4$7cf35e40$867174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.134
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

DOUBLE CLICK THE PAPER CLIP BOYS.
begin 600 (fwd) MOTOROLA PAGERS.txt
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F;&P@87-U;64@;F\@86-T:6]N(&ES('1A:V5N+@T*#0I%=F%N#0IM
`
end



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!news.eunet.fi!jjo
From: [e-mail] (Jari Jokiniemi)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FAKE JAPAN HAMS
Date: 03 Dec 1996 05:47:13 GMT
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ds10.tekla.fi
In-reply-to: [e-mail]'s message of 01 Dec 96 15:20:00


In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail].c
om (Roland Stiner) writes:
   That's a new kind of "inflation" they've got over there.  Ham Radio

The funny part being, that these "inflated" operators practically own
the radio business. Makes one wonder.
--
Jari Jokiniemi, [e-mail], OH2MPO, OH3BU
Tekla Oy, Koronakatu 1, 02210 Espoo, [phone]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:06 1996
From: [e-mail] (mac  )
Subject: FCC gone in 1997
Date: 5 Dec 96 05:13:30 -0800
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-2.sprintlink.net!news.msn.com!msn.com
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Organization: The Microsoft Network (msn.com)
Lines: 11

    The House Telecommunications sub-committee will hold hearings in
early 1997 in preparation for closing down the FCC.  The hearings
will begin with an examination of each job classificaion in the FCC
and why it is necessary.  FCC Chairman Reed Hundt will be grilled on
his gross mismanagement of the agency, and the hearings will
conclude with an endorsement of Progress Freedoms Foundation's
proposal to abolish the FCC.  Net result will be an Office of
Telecommunications Policy in the Executive Office of the President
which will employ about 150 people, mostly lawyers.  Rumors are
already appearing in some trade publications about just how soon
the agency can be closed down.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:08 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!NEWS!not-for-mail
From: Steve Eklund <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: FCC gone in 1997
Message-ID: <c57cc$93529.35f@NEWS>
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 14:53:41 GMT
Lines: 59

[e-mail] (mac  ) writes: >     The House Telecommunications sub-committee
 will hold hearings in
> early 1997 in preparation for closing down the FCC.  The hearings
> will begin with an examination of each job classificaion in the FCC
> and why it is necessary.  FCC Chairman Reed Hundt will be grilled on
> his gross mismanagement of the agency, and the hearings will
> conclude with an endorsement of Progress Freedoms Foundation's
> proposal to abolish the FCC.  Net result will be an Office of
> Telecommunications Policy in the Executive Office of the President
> which will employ about 150 people, mostly lawyers.  Rumors are
> already appearing in some trade publications about just how soon
> the agency can be closed down.
>

Sounds like the final step necessary before Congress can sell
all of the frequency spectrum to pay for their blunders. Without
the FCC, the already over-sized telecommunications industry
will be free to do whatever they want with the radio spectrum.
Gone will be ham radio, GMRS, CB and other services. You will
no longer be able to own and use your own repeater free of charge.
You will have to pay ATT, MCI, Sprint, or dozens of other companies
for your air time. Why? Because they bought and OWN the frequencies!!
You will no longer have anything to say about it!

Let's think about it. The name of the game is money. The board
of directors of these companies have the responsibility of making
as much money as possible for their company and their stockholders.
They will try to charge for air-time on every device that uses
a radio transmitter. Want a cordless phone? Just fill out the
application that comes with the phone, and they will give you the
access code to make the phone work. They will also bill you ten
or more dollars each month for the privilege of using the radio
spectrum that they own! The same goes for wireless microphones,
baby monitors, or wireless anything. Ham radio? CB? GMRS? FRS?
HA-HA-HA!! Got ya sucka! You bought the equipment, so now if
you want it to work you have to pay them!

How about commercial radio and TV? They have been pushing for
digital broadcasts for years. Do you think that they are just
doing it so you can watch Jeopardy or hear the Rolling Stones
with new realism and clarity? Not in my opinion. They want
to be able to charge you every time you turn on your radio
and TV! With the digital technology, they will be able to do it
because your radio will not work until the unlock code is received.
If you think that it will never happen, just take a look at
satelite TV. What can you get for free on the old C-band?
The Home Shopping Network maybe? Do you think that they went
DSS so you can get better pictures?

Office of Telecommunications Policy? 150 lawyers? HA! I seriously
doubt that this office will be established to watch out for the
public! Quite the contrary! Don't believe me? Just ask these
lawyers how many hold stock in ATT, MCI, Sprint, USSB or any
of hundreds of other telecommunications giants.

This post is just my opinion, but I am seriously concerned that
it may come to this more sooner than later. What do you think?

Steve, WA3RVT




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:09 1996
From: [e-mail] (mac  )
Subject: FCC Mismanagement
Date: 9 Dec 96 15:02:19 -0800
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-8.sprintlink.net!news.msn.com!msn.com
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Organization: The Microsoft Network (msn.com)
Lines: 17

     FCC Chairman Reed Hundt fires 120 enforcement personnel
earlier this year and closes 28 field offices.  Then he hires
100 lawyers with the money saved.  NOW he tells Congress and the
public that he doesn't have enough enforcement personnel or
field offices to carry out the FCC mission!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      Hundt obviously has fried eggs for brains or he is as some
say, the worst manager ever to sit in the chair of the Chairman
of the FCC!
       The sad part is that long after Hundt is replaced, the new
FCC Chairman (if there still is an FCC) will be faced with
cleaning up the monumental mess in the high-frequency portion of
the spectrum.  A mess which grows worse every day and is a direct
result of Hundt's closing the FCC's monitoring stations and firing
120 enforcement personnel!





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (david l. thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Mismanagement
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 04:50:04 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <58ip9s$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-41-202.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 10 Dec 1996 04:35:08 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (mac  ) wrote:

>     FCC Chairman Reed Hundt fires 120 enforcement personnel
>earlier this year and closes 28 field offices.  Then he hires
>100 lawyers with the money saved.  NOW he tells Congress and the
>public that he doesn't have enough enforcement personnel or
>field offices to carry out the FCC mission!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mac,

Why do you keep repeating this garbage.  Please stop and go away!

Dave K4JRB



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!snunews.snu.ac.kr!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!newsfeed.internetmci.com!dciteleport.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!psinntp!psinntp!news.columbia.edu!news.cs.columbia.edu!news.cs.columbia.edu!news-not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Jerry B. Altzman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: FLAME!!!!! No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 10 Dec 1996 00:34:02 -0500
Organization: double ionizers association
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58isoa$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]> <5859ep$[e-mail]> <58ina2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: play.cs.columbia.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120198 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44031

I'm probably not doing the right thing by responding to such an obvious
troll, but...

In article <58ina2$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>On 5 Dec 1996 01:44:57 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

Carl wrote *none* of what follows, I'm sure.

>  WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF NO-CODE PEOPLE ARE ON THE HF VOICE BAND AND
>HEARS *** --- *** (IT'S SOS) FOR NO CODERS. IT'S A SHIP THAT CAN NOT
>REACH ANYONE!!! IT GOES DOWN WITH NO ONE KNOWING WHERE IT IS!!!!

In a few years, when GMDSS becomes mandatory, it won't matter. No one else
will be listening either.

>DURING ANY TYPE OF EMERGENCY, EITHER NUCLEAR OR OTHER, MORSE CODE WILL
>BE ONE MODE THAT CAN GET THRU!!! IT'S BEEN PROVEN!! ALSO MORSE CODE
>CAN BE RECIEVED WHILE PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO JAM AND OUTSIDE NOISE
>TOO!!!!

Yeah, that's why NASA has banks of Morse operators receiving data from
deep-space probes.

>MILITARY INTELLAGENCE  MORSE CODE INTERCEPTER

No comment.

//jbaltz
--
jerry b. altzman   There is no universe   --   P. Halmos      [phone]
[e-mail]   [e-mail]                KE3ML


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!hookup!swrinde!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: FLAME!!!!! No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 23:28:57 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions (A Standard Disclaimer)
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]> <5859ep$[e-mail]> <58ina2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: mg131-177.ricochet.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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To: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120211 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44035

[e-mail] wrote:

> WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  WE ARE NOT THE ONLY PEOPLE ON THE AIR WAVES!!!!

NO WAAAYYY!!  Get outta here!!  Really?

>   WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF NO-CODE PEOPLE ARE ON THE HF VOICE BAND AND
> HEARS *** --- *** (IT'S SOS) FOR NO CODERS. IT'S A SHIP THAT CAN NOT
> REACH ANYONE!!! IT GOES DOWN WITH NO ONE KNOWING WHERE IT IS!!!!

Oh... so you're saying that if the no-coder was not there someone else
would hear the call?  What if... nobody was listening?

Who is sending the *** --- *** (that's SOS for us no-coders)?  The radio
officer that is not required to be there anymore?

>    THIS IS WHY CODE IS HERE AND SHOULD STAY!!!!

Funny... seems if morse code was required to save sinking ships the
Coast Guard would be listening for such calls on designated distress
frequencies.  Perhaps we should suggest such a program to the USCG.

> DURING ANY TYPE OF EMERGENCY, EITHER NUCLEAR OR OTHER, MORSE CODE WILL
> BE ONE MODE THAT CAN GET THRU!!! IT'S BEEN PROVEN!! ALSO MORSE CODE
> CAN BE RECIEVED WHILE PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO JAM AND OUTSIDE NOISE
> TOO!!!!

Proven?  How many times DID you see "Independence Day"?

> UNLIKE VOICE OR DIGITAL SIGNALS. TRY PACKET WHEN SOMEONE IS RUNNING A
> LAWNMOWER OR TRACTOR RIGHT OUT SIDE YOUR ANTENNA !!

>    THE MILITARY STILL USES MORSE CODE AND USE IT TO SEND CRYPTIC
> MESSAGES AND SO DOES THE WORLD TOO!!!

"THE" military?  Which military would that be?

> SO WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  THE INSTANT SOCIATY PEOPLE GO HOME AND STOP
> YELLING ABOUT SOMETHING YOU WANT AND JUST EARN IT!!!!!!!!!!

> KA3FFY

> 05H30
> MILITARY INTELLAGENCE  MORSE CODE INTERCEPTER
           ^^^^^^^^^^^^ [you be the judge]

Really?  Did you get a Buzz Lightyear decoder ring and learn the secret
handshake?  Good thing you have that anonymous e-mail address.  If we
knew who you really are you'd probably have to kill us!

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-stock.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-hk.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!hammer.uoregon.edu!csulb.edu!drivel.ics.uci.edu!news.service.uci.edu!e4e.oac.uci.edu!jwkelley
From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: FLAME!!!!! No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 17:11:25 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <58k5jt$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]> <5859ep$[e-mail]> <58ina2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: e4e.oac.uci.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120226 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44044

In article <58ina2$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> shouted:

>  WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF NO-CODE PEOPLE ARE ON THE HF VOICE BAND AND
>HEARS *** --- *** (IT'S SOS) FOR NO CODERS. IT'S A SHIP THAT CAN NOT
>REACH ANYONE!!! IT GOES DOWN WITH NO ONE KNOWING WHERE IT IS!!!!

If he was on 75 meters, somebody would probably come on and tell him "the
frequency is in use."

Besides, if the ship sent that, it would probably illicit a ..__..
Recalling my Super Morse program, I think * is ASCII for SK...or was it AR?
:-)

>   THIS IS WHY CODE IS HERE AND SHOULD STAY!!!!

If for no other reason than to save the last remaining commercial maritime
CW operator!

>DURING ANY TYPE OF EMERGENCY, EITHER NUCLEAR OR OTHER, MORSE CODE WILL
>BE ONE MODE THAT CAN GET THRU!!! IT'S BEEN PROVEN!! ALSO MORSE CODE
>CAN BE RECIEVED WHILE PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO JAM AND OUTSIDE NOISE
>TOO!!!!

I haven't seen Independence Day yet, but I hear it's pretty good.  Prolly
rent it this weekend.

>UNLIKE VOICE OR DIGITAL SIGNALS. TRY PACKET WHEN SOMEONE IS RUNNING A
>LAWNMOWER OR TRACTOR RIGHT OUT SIDE YOUR ANTENNA !!

Or go out and mow the lawn like everybody else instead of sitting
on your butt by the radio all day complaining about the lawn mowers.

>   THE MILITARY STILL USES MORSE CODE AND USE IT TO SEND CRYPTIC
>MESSAGES AND SO DOES THE WORLD TOO!!!

The World does?  What kind of rig does it run?  Bet he's got a good
ground plane - har har.

>SO WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  THE INSTANT SOCIATY PEOPLE GO HOME AND STOP
>YELLING ABOUT SOMETHING YOU WANT AND JUST EARN IT!!!!!!!!!!
>KA3FFY
>05H30
>MILITARY INTELLAGENCE  MORSE CODE INTERCEPTER

I'll bet that cryptography stuff is hard to shake.  One of the techniques
must be to substitute one letter in place of another.  Pretty sneaky.

73

AC6XG



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: FLAME!!!!! No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 08:50:24 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]> <5859ep$[e-mail]> <58ina2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 143.182.122.64
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120246 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44061

[e-mail] wrote:
> KA3FFY
> MILITARY INTELLAGENCE  MORSE CODE INTERCEPTER                 ^
ROTFL


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.lobo.net!news
From: Mark Fossum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: FLAME!!!!! No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:05:50 -0600
Organization: Lobo Net
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]> <5859ep$[e-mail]> <58ina2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 134.129.253.19
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120250 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44063

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> On 5 Dec 1996 01:44:57 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>
> WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  WE ARE NOT THE ONLY PEOPLE ON THE AIR WAVES!!!!
>
>   WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF NO-CODE PEOPLE ARE ON THE HF VOICE BAND AND
> HEARS *** --- *** (IT'S SOS) FOR NO CODERS. IT'S A SHIP THAT CAN NOT
> REACH ANYONE!!! IT GOES DOWN WITH NO ONE KNOWING WHERE IT IS!!!!
>
>    THIS IS WHY CODE IS HERE AND SHOULD STAY!!!!
>
> DURING ANY TYPE OF EMERGENCY, EITHER NUCLEAR OR OTHER, MORSE CODE WILL
> BE ONE MODE THAT CAN GET THRU!!! IT'S BEEN PROVEN!! ALSO MORSE CODE
> CAN BE RECIEVED WHILE PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO JAM AND OUTSIDE NOISE
> TOO!!!!
>
> UNLIKE VOICE OR DIGITAL SIGNALS. TRY PACKET WHEN SOMEONE IS RUNNING A
> LAWNMOWER OR TRACTOR RIGHT OUT SIDE YOUR ANTENNA !!
>
>    THE MILITARY STILL USES MORSE CODE AND USE IT TO SEND CRYPTIC
> MESSAGES AND SO DOES THE WORLD TOO!!!
>
> SO WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  THE INSTANT SOCIATY PEOPLE GO HOME AND STOP
> YELLING ABOUT SOMETHING YOU WANT AND JUST EARN IT!!!!!!!!!!
>
> KA3FFY
>
> 05H30
> MILITARY INTELLAGENCE  MORSE CODE INTERCEPTER

Just a little hint Carl... If you want to make an argument, at least you
could use a spell-checker and get "Intelligence" correct. Mistakes like
that don't lend much your cause.

Mark Fossum - N0NSV  (Former No-Coder)

I think the spelling of "Intelligence" says everything for this message.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.voicenet.com!netaxs.com!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: "Dan Marsh" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rpi.union.ham-radio
Subject: FOR SALE 2 meter handheld, kpc-3 paket terminal, power supply, beam antenna, and rotor
Date: 5 Dec 1996 00:10:17 GMT
Organization: Dell Computer Corporation
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <01bbe240$730c7080$2aa1adce@holden>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc096042.concentric.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32393 rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:888 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43650 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119669

I have a radio shack htx 202 2 meter handheld, a kpc-3 paket terminal, a
12v 2 amp power supply, a 2 meter beam, and a rotor for sale. I am asking
$260 or best offer for the whole thing, or you can haggle for any of the
items individually. They are all in good working order with a minimum of
wear and tear. The handheld's keys are worn and the case has some
scratches, but everything works well. I have all the original packaging and
manuals as well.

Thanx :~)

Dan Marsh --- KB7TAU

Email me at [e-mail] if you are interested.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:18 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,su.org.ham-radio
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!gvs
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Subject: ForSale: Kwd TS450SAT, Astron RS-20A P/S, Timewave DSP-59+, Multibd invtd-V/telescpg-mast/coax Ant.
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Lines: 29
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32411 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43696 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119742 su.org.ham-radio:370

Sale In Silicon Valley Area:

For Sale:(All equipment almost new, asking $1500
for all, but will sell individually).  Hate to
sale HF ham shack, but between jobs :-{

    *Kenwood TS450SAT: ($1100)
    (Including addition accessories installed)
      -High Stability Osc.,TCXO UNIT,Model SO-2
      -SSB narrow filter, YK88SN-1, 1.8kHz

    *Astron RS-20A Power Supply ($75)
    (perfect match for TS450SAT)

    *Timewave DSP-59+ ($200)

    *Multi-band Inv-V/Dipole Ant. System ($250)
      -Alpha Delta DX-CC, a no trap 10 thru 80
       meter, Dipole Antenna
      -37 foot Telescoping Mast, material is
       schedule 80 PVC Tubing, in 4 sections,
       with O.D's: 3.50", 2.75", 2.25", and 1.75".
       Complete with all clamps, eye-bolt
       (guy points), hardware and marine nylon
       rope.  More durable than Steel Masts in
       a wind storm when guyed properly.  Also,
       much better ground isolation.
      -100 feet of RG-213/U coax.
      -Bencher YA-1 Low Pass Filter, 50/52 ohm


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.sgi.com!mr.net!visi.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Edward Addy)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FREE Military Family Message Service For The Holidays!
Date: 9 Dec 1996 03:04:03 GMT
Organization: N. American Cntr. for Emerg. Comms.
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58fvj3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-154.dynamic.visi.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.5

To: All U.S. & Canadian - Active Duty Military & Their Families.

NACEC hopes to brighten the Holiday Season for as many military
families as possible this year.

We are doing our best to get the word out about our free
"Digi-Gram" worldwide military family message service, that can
be access on the Internet.

If you or anyone you know is a military family member, please
pass this information along so that they may have the opportunity
to access and use this service to keep their families closer during
this Holiday Season.

The URL to our web site is:       http://www.nacec.org

Once at our main page just proceed to the Military Family Support
Area where you can access the message service and message forms.

           HAPPY HOLIDAY from all of us at NACEC.

Edward Addy, Executive Director
NACEC Center
Minneapolis, MN



-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-=-=-=-=
     Serving Military Families & Disaster Relief Operation

 The North American Center For               E-mail: [e-mail]
 Emergency Communications Inc., (NACEC)      Phone: [phone]
 P.O. Box 23057, Minneapolis, MN 55423

            WWW Area (Main): http://www.nacec.org/


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.co.za!osprey.global.co.za!news
From: [e-mail] (Phil)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.uk,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS.  Portable Antenna Analyzer,   7MHz to  510MHz SWR direct
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 19:48:47 GMT
Organization: Global Internet Access
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <57vq7c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mdm-po206.jhb168-anx3.net.global.co.za
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent v0.55
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.uk:9432 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32305 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43489 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119430

I have a portable Antenna Analyzer for sale.
It is a portable unit run from NiCad batteries with charger. It uses a LCD 4
digit frequency counter, an analogue SWR / %reflected power scales read direct
.
No radio Transmitter needed. It sees exactly what the radio sees.
Only R2495-00. New, under guarantee.
Ideal for the antenna experimenter.

Call Rob @ [phone]              [phone]   South Africa
(Johannesburg)
or Email [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.he.net!nntp.iccom.com!news.rain.net!hevanet.com!usenet
From: miker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.radio.uk,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FS.  Portable Antenna Analyzer,   7MHz to  510MHz SWR direct
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 14:21:57 -0800
Organization: Hevanet Communications
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57vq7c$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: st-ppp23.hevanet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.uk:9446 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32353 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43564 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119548

Phil wrote:
>
> I have a portable Antenna Analyzer for sale.
> It is a portable unit run from NiCad batteries with charger. It uses a LCD 4
> digit frequency counter, an analogue SWR / %reflected power scales read dire
ct.
> No radio Transmitter needed. It sees exactly what the radio sees.
> Only R2495-00. New, under guarantee.
> Ideal for the antenna experimenter.
>
> Call Rob @ [phone]              [phone]   South Africa
> (Johannesburg)
> or Email [e-mail]


What's that in US$?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!news.cs.utah.edu!cc.usu.edu!slmzc
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FS.  Portable Antenna Analyzer,   7MHz to  510MHz SWR direct
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: 6 Dec 96 14:03:47 MDT
References: <57vq7c$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: Utah State University
Lines: 21
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32440 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43757 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119831

In article <[e-mail]>, miker <[e-mail]> writes:
> Phil wrote:
>>
>> I have a portable Antenna Analyzer for sale.
>> It is a portable unit run from NiCad batteries with charger. It uses a LCD
4
>> digit frequency counter, an analogue SWR / %reflected power scales read dir
ect.
>> No radio Transmitter needed. It sees exactly what the radio sees.
>> Only R2495-00. New, under guarantee.
>> Ideal for the antenna experimenter.
>>
>> Call Rob @ [phone]              [phone]   South Africa
>> (Johannesburg)
>> or Email [e-mail]
>
>
> What's that in US$?

Should be about $625.00   Current exchange is typically around R4.00/$

Paul, KB7VML
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!swrinde!news-relay.us.dell.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 11:21:05 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: FS:  6 Meter Radios
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Mon Dec 09 17:16:36 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 208.140.5.95 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.02Gold (Win95; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 25

Estate Sale:

Kenwood TS-60S all-mode 6 meter transceiver.  New.  Has never had power
applied or antenna connected.  Warranty card still in box.  $895 plus shipping
.

Mirage A-1015G 6 meter amplifier.  New.  Still in original sealed shipping
container.  $325 plus shipping.

Cushcraft A-50-3S 6 meter beam.  New.  Never assembled.  $75 plus shipping.

ICOM IC-551  6 meter all-mode transceiver.  Has FM board and is in very
good condition.  $475 plus shipping.

KDK FM-6033 6 meter transceiver in good condition.  Make offer.

MFJ 906  6 meter tuner.  $45 plus shipping.

Reply to Tim, K7HF via e-mail.
[e-mail]




-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:25 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
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From: "Rick Lapp" <[e-mail]>
Subject: FS:  IC-728 HF transceiver
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
X-Nntp-Posting-User: (Unauthenticated)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Date: Tue, 3 Dec 1996 11:31:41 GMT
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43545 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119522 rec.radio.swap:97913

For sale:
Icom IC-728 HF 160-10 w/ general coverage receive.
100W out, triple conversion receiver.
26 memories, dual VFO, RIT, processor, QSK or semi
QSK.  10 Hz readout.  Outperforms IC-735 on receive
sensitivity, phase noise, ease of operation and
readout visibility and resolution.
Rig is in excellent condition.
Sell for $600 and will ship.  Have original boxes, mic, power cord
and manual.
Call evenings or leave message 516-473-7884

--
Rick Lapp kc2fd
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!super.zippo.com!zdc-e!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spool.mu.edu!torn!news.unb.ca!agate.nbnet.nb.ca!news
From: [e-mail] (Paul Richardson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Baycom Packet & Freq Counter
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 01:42:40 GMT
Organization: NBNet.nb.ca
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: mctnts02c41.nbnet.nb.ca
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Got this for sale.

Baycom Packet Modem
Optoelectronics freq minicounter model 3300

Make a offer...



Paul Richardson (VE9VW)
[e-mail]
http://geocities.com/siliconvalley/4353


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-hk.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!agate!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!132.175.109.6!news.sandia.gov!tesuque.cs.sandia.gov!lynx.unm.edu!bubba.NMSU.Edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (beard)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Collins R-390
Date: 6 Dec 1996 04:14:06 GMT
Organization: New Mexico State University
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <5886ie$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950621BETA PL0]

I have a Collins R-390 for sale.
Needs the old grease cleaned from the tuning drive train and it
looks like the meters are not original.
$250.00 plus shipping.
WA4QGA
David Beard



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-13.sprintlink.net!zebra2.zebra.net![e-mail]
From: Ira & Julie Betts <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap,rec.radio.swap
Subject: FS: FT50R/41B - 5w 2m/440 HT
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:40:40 -0800
Organization: Rexnord Corp.
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.ham-radio:6 rec.radio.amateur:14 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43905 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120038 rec.radio.amateur.swap:3 rec.radio.swap:98711

Selling FT 50R/41B 5w 2m/440 HT along with,

             ADMS-1C Software/cable
             FBA -15 AA battery holder

    Only 2-3 months old and seldom used. Asking $325.

  If interested e-mail Ira/N4ZUN: [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-13.sprintlink.net!zebra2.zebra.net![e-mail]
From: Ira & Julie Betts <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap,rec.radio.swap
Subject: FS: FT8000R
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:47:20 -0800
Organization: Rexnord Corp.
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Selling seldom used FT8000R Dual band mobile radio. Only 2-3 months old.
Extremely little use. Needs a good home where it will be used.

If interested e-mail me :[e-mail]

Asking $500.

Ira/N4ZUN in Mobile, AL


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: "Samuel S. Yates" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap
Subject: FS: ICOM 706
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 20:24:50 +0000
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe473$a4731cc0$281ae0c3@radioman>
NNTP-Posting-Host: war-as1s40.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; name="ic706.txt"
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.ham-radio:2 rec.radio.amateur:8 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32464 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43809 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21822 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119927 rec.radio.amateur.swap:1

ICOM 706 Station including:
        IC-706 (Purchased new 16AUG96, never mobile)
        AT-180 Antenna Tuner 160m thru 6m
        FL-100 500Hz CW Crystal Filter
        OPC-581 Seperation Cable
        MB-62 Mobile Mount
        MB-63 Faceplate Mount
Total AES Price $1901.85. My price $1520.00 plus shipping.

Also have  AEA 6 Meter Halo Antenna, about one month old. AES cost
was $69.00, my price $55.00 plus shipping.

All equipment is in mint condition. E-mail me if interested. I am
located in Culpeper, Virginia (about 70 miles SW of Washington, DC).

Sam Yates, AB4N



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!167.152.149.11!news.emi.com!usenet
From: Knighted Computers <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: ICOM IC-736
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 15:13:33 -0500
Organization: EMI Communications
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: demo.knighted.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

For Sale:
                ICOM IC-736 HF/6 Meter Tranciever
                        RX: 30 kc - 33 Mhz
                        TX: 1.6 - 33 Mhz @ 100 watts output.

                Includes:
                          Comspec TE-32 Sub-Tone Encoder
                          Service Manual

Asking $1400.00 (or best offer)
Or possibly a swap. (I'm looking for new toys)

If interested please call me at [phone]

73's
Harry - N6VUJ
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.243.60.3!news.megalink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Dave)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: KAM PLUS
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 05:54:24 GMT
Organization: Megalink Internet
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <58amai$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: wilton-15.megalink.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

KAM PLUS for sale in mint condition with cables for FT530 and FT890
and manuals. Rarely used. Best reasonable offer plus shipping.

Thanks,

Dr. David F. Lemire
N1RPM
Livermore Falls, Maine



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!demos!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!386
From: [e-mail] (Ed Gallup)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: KAM PLUS complete
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 96 09:42:55 GMT
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58klqf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: m24.mlode.com
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #0

   10 DEC 1996


   FOR SALE:   Kantronics  KAM PLUS v 6.1  complete with VHF & HF interface
cables, AC power supply, manuals, in original box.  Very clean and no
problems.  (Factory box is a bit worn on outside).

  $175  Firm   and I will ship at my expense  COD.

  Ed   W7DXZ  (Formerly  WB6SAT).

         [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!news.gate.net!news
From: [e-mail] (bradly)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Realistic HTX-202.
Date: 8 Dec 1996 23:08:22 GMT
Organization: Your Organization
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58fhp6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpbfl3-20.gate.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

4 SALE:

Realistic HTX-202 2 meter handheld.

Excellent condtion. $200.00 and i will pay shipping.

call me at 561-791-0137 or e-mail me at [e-mail]. Im located in
south florida.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!news.gate.net!news
From: [e-mail] (bradly)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Realistic PRO-39 Scanner
Date: 8 Dec 1996 23:09:44 GMT
Organization: Your Organization
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58fhro$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpbfl3-20.gate.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

4 sale:

Realistic PRO-39 handheld scanner.

Excellent condition. $200.00 and i will pay shipping.

call me at 561-791-0137 or e-mail me at [e-mail]. Im located in
south florida.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.campus.mci.net!news.telis.org!s12-pm06-ontro-t.telis.org!user
From: [e-mail] (wb6siv)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Tubes and Manuals
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:18:43 -0800
Organization: Raymond Sarrio Co.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s12-pm06-ontro-t.telis.org

I have for sale a large quantity of tubes and vintage manuals all listed
on my web site at http://www.sarrio.com. 73's Ray
--
The Raymond Sarrio Co. a full feature Ham Radio Storefront and web site develo
per. Located at http://www.sarrio.com.

In association with Brillar Enterprises http://win-win.com/brillar provider of
 discount CD-Roms!



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!data.ramona.vix.com!news1.digital.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.campus.mci.net!news.telis.org!s06-pm04-ontro-t.telis.org!user
From: [e-mail] (wb6siv)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Tubes and Manuals
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 22:34:24 -0800
Organization: Raymond Sarrio Co.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s06-pm04-ontro-t.telis.org

I have for sale a large quantity of tubes and vintage manuals all listed
on my web site at http://www.sarrio.com. 73's Ray
--
The Raymond Sarrio Co. a full feature Ham Radio Storefront and web site develo
per. Located at http://www.sarrio.com.

In association with Brillar Enterprises http://win-win.com/brillar provider of
 discount CD-Roms!



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!jutt
From: [e-mail] (Justin M. Bodie)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Yaesu FT-50R HT, 5 Watt, Dual Band
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 96 23:12:23 GMT
Organization: Outfitters North
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58nf56$5uq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip166-72-151-122.nd.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44121 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120319

For sale..

Yaesu FT-50R Handheld, dual band transceiver.  I would like to buy
a mobile; that's why I'm selling the HT.  Works excellent, only a few
months old.

$300 including UPS 2-day shipping (in the US) once payment is received.

Includes:           - 5 watt battery (FNB-41)
                        - manual, box, and warranty card
                        - wall charger (NC-60B)
                        - rubber duck
                        - Wide band receive (gets just about everything!)
                        - DC battery voltage display
                        - DC direct input capability (great in the car.)

Email me for more information or if you're interested!

Justin

....................................................................
Justin M. Bodie
E-mail Address:  [e-mail]
Website:  http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/2062/


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-13.sprintlink.net!zebra2.zebra.net![e-mail]
From: Ira & Julie Betts <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: FS:Kenwood TR-2500 2m HT
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 22:51:35 -0800
Organization: Rexnord Corp.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.5.19.109
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43943 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120092 rec.radio.swap:98791

Selling Kenwood TR-2500 2m HT w/ desk charger.

Oldie but goodie. Well used, but works good. Asking $100.

Interested? E-mail me at [e-mail] for more information.

73, Ira/N4ZUN


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.74.114.90!news.genuity.net!news.lafn.org!usenet
From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 19:23:39 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.168.18.33
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=big5
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-38  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.74.114.90!news.genuity.net!news.lafn.org!usenet
From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 23:45:17 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.168.18.30
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=big5
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-38  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.74.114.90!news.genuity.net!news.lafn.org!usenet
From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 07:52:48 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.168.18.22
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=big5
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-38  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.74.114.90!news.genuity.net!news.lafn.org!usenet
From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 17:35:28 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.168.18.21
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-38  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:43 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!panix!news.columbia.edu!news.new-york.net!markbond
From: [e-mail] (Mark S. Bond)
Subject: FS:Yaesu FNB-41 Battery for FT10/40/50
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.4
X-Nntp-Posting-User: (Unauthenticated)
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Trace: 849499549/12598
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: i123.183.world2u.com
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 04:07:21 GMT
Lines: 14

I have a Yaesu brand FNB-41 9.6v 600mah (5watt) Ni-Cd battery pack for
sale. I will ship it priority mail to anywhere in the US for $40. The
battery has been recharged 3 times. I prefer and use the smaller FNB-40.

Please reply via Email: [e-mail]

--
   .-.                                                         .-.
  /   \           .-.                           .-.           /   \
 /     \         /   \       .-.     .-.       /   \         /     \
/------Mark S. Bond W2MB ---/---\---/---\-----/[e-mail]-\
         \     /       \   /     `-'     \   /       \     /
          \   /         `-'               `-'         \   /
           `-'                                         `-'


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:44 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.254.2.53!nonexistent.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Mark S. Bond)
Subject: FS:Yaesu FNB41 Hi-Power HT Battery $29 Delivered
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.4
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Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 20:07:48 GMT
Lines: 16

I've got an Extra FNB-41 (HiPower) HT battery for a FT10/40/50 that I don't
need. It's been charged twice. I will ship it US priority mail anywhere in
the US for $29.00

reply via Email

73 de Mark

--
   .-.                                                         .-.
  /   \           .-.                           .-.           /   \
 /     \         /   \       .-.     .-.       /   \         /     \
/------Mark S. Bond  W2MB---/---\---/---\-----/[e-mail]-\
         \     /       \   /     `-'     \   /       \     /
          \   /         `-'               `-'         \   /
           `-'                                         `-'


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!paladin.american.edu!02-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!01-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!voskovec.radio.cz!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: AC6V <"ac6v@ac6v"@popd.ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FYI: OP Aids & Software
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 09:04:29 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <58c80m$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: "ac6v@ac6v"@popd.ix.netcom.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: esc-ca2-04.ix.netcom.com
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X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 07  9:03:18 AM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)

The DX Reference Page Now Include Info and Links To:

OP AIDS
Propagation
Master Clock
Time & Freq Stations
Phonetic Alphabets
CW Trainers
CW Abbreviations
Prosigns
RST System
Q-Signals
3rd Party Agreements
Find Grey Line
Distance/Bearing
World &Local Maps
Ham Frequency Allocations
Considerate Operator's Frequency Guide
Mega List Of Frequencies - DC to Daylight!
DXCC Country List
Mega-Prefix List
CQ and ITU Zones
Country Facts Lookup
Emergency Frequencies

SOFTWARE LINKS
Great Circle Map
Logging
GeoClock
SSTV, RTTY
Build 4 element 2 meter quad
Build 2 meter "J" pole antenna
ECG Semiconductor Cross Reference
Motorola Semiconductor Cross Reference
Electrical Calculator Program
Part 97 FCC Rules and Regulations
Print Form 610
Super Morse 4.10 Code Practice
Yagi Computer Aided Design 4.1

FUN STUFF
Ham Clip Art
Notable Hams
Humor
And Much More
--
AC6V DX Reference Page at:  http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html

Hark for I have hurled my words to the far reaches of the earth!
What King of old could do thus??
..... AC6V


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!informer.alliance.net!news
From: "Charles Lemarbre N8LDY" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Great Lakes Award
Date: 3 Dec 1996 18:52:23 GMT
Organization: Alliance Network, Inc. (GRR MI) (616-774-3010)
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <01bbe14a$35427d40$3ce96ec6@cqdxer>
NNTP-Posting-Host: gr40.ppp.alliance.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155




GREAT LAKES AWARD MANAGER
MICHIGAN AMATEUR RADIO ALLIANCE
CHARLES "CHUCK" LEMAR  -=N8LDY=-
WAS DXCC WAC GLA SM

The Michigan Amateur Radio Alliance *MARA* is proud to present
"The Great Lakes Award"  Set your sails and join us on a voyage
through the great lakes chain. All amateurs and short wave listeners
are welcome to apply. You may use any amateur band or mode
except repeaters. Contacts must be on or after August 31..1991
There are 8 states and Canada to confirm. For your application,
please send us an SASE To: MARA/GLA P.O. Box 670 Comstock
Park,MI  49321-0670   This is not one of those Cheap computer
generated awards that we have been seeing,it is Beautiful! and hangs
on the walls of Hamshacks all around the world,it would be a Great
addition to your shack as well. Look for us in CQ and World Radio.......

MARA is a registered Non-Profit organization and affiliated with the ARRL



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Steven Olson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: grid square
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 23:27:35 -0500
Organization: Dell Computer Corporation
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: eat-nj1-25.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 09 10:29:20 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

I live in Manasquan, New Jersey.  zip:  08736.  Have calculated, as best
as I can, my Grid Square as FN20xc.  Would someone with GRIDLOC or some
other program check my calculations?  Would appreciate it.  Please
respond via email.  Thanks, Steve.  [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:48 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!eanews1!trsvr!news
From: Anthony Steen <[e-mail]>
Subject: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Sender: [e-mail] (cnews news id.)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 20:51:28 GMT
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I have a ICOM IC-706 and want to install it on board my 30' sailboat.
Instead of installing a ground plate, can I run the chassis ground from
the radio to the YANMAR diesel engine to provide the necessary safety of
not being shocked?  What are the pros & cons of such an arrangement.  My
Marine VHF radio is "grounded" through the + & - 12VDC.  So it's
confusing when I hear I need to have a separate ground plate.  I
currently have a no-code license, studying for my General license in
preparation for cruising southern waters.  All responses appreciated.
Thanks in advance.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Joe D. Reed)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 22:34:42 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <58kopm$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-222-130.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 10 Dec 1996 22:38:46 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Anthony Steen <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have a ICOM IC-706 and want to install it on board my 30' sailboat.
>Instead of installing a ground plate, can I run the chassis ground from
>the radio to the YANMAR diesel engine to provide the necessary safety of
>not being shocked?  What are the pros & cons of such an arrangement.  My
>Marine VHF radio is "grounded" through the + & - 12VDC.  So it's
>confusing when I hear I need to have a separate ground plate.  I
>currently have a no-code license, studying for my General license in
>preparation for cruising southern waters.  All responses appreciated.
>Thanks in advance.

The ideal ground is a ground plate but this is not always practical.
I have found that grounding to the engine block ground works fine.
The driveshaft and prop provide a pretty good ground. I have never
had a problem with this type of ground.

Joe Reed



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Date: 11 Dec 1996 02:44:15 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58l75v$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Hi Anthony, I highly recommend you ground your rig via the keel bolts
in the bilge. Your keel makes a *much* better ground plane than
attaching copper plates to the hull. I used this arrangement on a
Hawaii-to-San Francisco crossing (22 days) and had solid comms on
20m the entire trip. The phone patches to the weather service and
to family members sure were comforting when I was 1000 miles from
any piece of land! (The trip was done on a WestSail 43.)

Good luck and happy voyaging!
Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.belnet.be!swsbe6.switch.ch!swidir.switch.ch!in2p3.fr!oleane!pasteur.fr!jussieu.fr!univ-lyon1.fr!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 17:02:20 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <58mpb9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58m1j8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-145.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail](-=Tony=-) wrote:

>In <[e-mail]> Anthony Steen <[e-mail]>
>writes:
>>
>>I have a ICOM IC-706 and want to install it on board my 30' sailboat.

>>Instead of installing a ground plate, can I run the chassis ground
>from
>>the radio to the YANMAR diesel engine to provide the necessary safety
>of
>>not being shocked?  What are the pros & cons of such an arrangement.
>My
>>Marine VHF radio is "grounded" through the + & - 12VDC.  So it's
>>confusing when I hear I need to have a separate ground plate.  I
>>currently have a no-code license, studying for my General license in
>>preparation for cruising southern waters.  All responses appreciated.
>>Thanks in advance.


>    YOU seem to have a FALSE return mailing address!  Nice long private
>message from a pro wasted!  Gud Luk.

I'll second that. My reply bounced back too.

Jim, KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-hk.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!news.glink.net.hk!uunet!in2.uu.net!207.17.188.30!info.htcomp.net!NewsWatcher!user
From: [e-mail] (W T Shaw)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 8 Dec 1996 00:50:43 GMT
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <wtshaw-0712961957440001@207.17.188.148>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.17.188.148
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32465 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119937 alt.engineering.electrical:9981

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrot
e:

> I live on the 23 floor of a residential building and I┤m just starting
to set up an amateur radio station. I can┤t seem to find any information
on how to properly ground my equipment at that height. I know that the
grounding cable shouldn┤t be at the resonant frequency of the amateur
bands.
>
> What I did for now is I connected everything to the cold water pipe
> system. (It┤s grounded, I checked that). Is that ok? Or can "hot spots"
> develop?
>
> The other thing are the antennas. I connected a wire (AWG 4) between the
> mast of the antenna and the wires from the lightning protection system is
> that OK?
>
> I really don┤t know how I should solve the problem wot my station
> ground....
>
> I hope someone can help me out here :)

While it may sound like grounding is all important, you can choose a
totally ungrounded system through some sort of link coupling.  It's one of
the oldest techniques available to get rid of a DC path from your antenna
to your rig.  Broadcast people commonly use what is called an ISOCOUPLER
for the same purpose.  Torroids can do the job for low power if wound
correctly.  Feed line stubs can be configured to a multitude of these
chores too. You have lots of alternatives.  If you have an artificial
ground array on the roof, you can work an antenna that requires a ground
against that, and let it float at what ever potential it finds, but best
find a non-electrical wiring path to a ground.  Be careful in your design
so you can tell us in a while what you did.

Bill, k5pcw



Anything you can do to make lightning find a path other than through you
rig is the ticket.  Spark gaps also can help shunt the flow.  Best thing
is physically unplug the antenna from the rig when you are not using it.
>
>
> 73, Patrick
> -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>       http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet
--
WTShaw--MacCrypto Programmer--The Following is in FUDGE
Vxdpq qcqva gdocd pokch hx-wd ll/,i ?-wry vegee n/wvm rt/tb bh/nd xdtlv ..mi.
fzngq hj,zf dzvrb uy/xq njdzc ?=uGo me/gg gu??g /?wen --ueo een-g -p,ym ohvfg
njrjb ,=/nl kk?zi ky.-m po,cg omufg koy.m kkmyi po,dg db,lb /,plz nn=mu d.awq


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 10:01:08 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Grounding system?
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Sat Dec 07 15:56:41 1996 GMT
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X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 19
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32473 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119954 alt.engineering.electrical:9984

I live on the 23 floor of a residential building and I┤m just starting to set
up an amateur radio station. I can┤t seem to find any information on how to pr
operly ground my equipment at that height. I know that the grounding cable sho
uldn┤t be at the resonant frequency of the amateur bands.

What I did for now is I connected everything to the cold water pipe
system. (It┤s grounded, I checked that). Is that ok? Or can "hot spots"
develop?

The other thing are the antennas. I connected a wire (AWG 4) between the
mast of the antenna and the wires from the lightning protection system is
that OK?

I really don┤t know how I should solve the problem wot my station
ground....

I hope someone can help me out here :)


73, Patrick
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsbuffer.myriad.net!news.myriad.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 02:05:39 GMT
Organization: DigiPhone Corporation, Bryan/College Station Texas 409-693-8885
Lines: 68
Message-ID: <58fs5j$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <wtshaw-0712961957440001@207.17.188.148>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr13s1.myriad.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32519 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120066 alt.engineering.electrical:10008

In <wtshaw-0712961957440001@207.17.188.148>, [e-mail] (W T Shaw) writ
es:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wro
te:
>
>> I live on the 23 floor of a residential building and I┤m just starting
>to set up an amateur radio station. I can┤t seem to find any information
>on how to properly ground my equipment at that height. I know that the
>grounding cable shouldn┤t be at the resonant frequency of the amateur
>bands.
>>
>> What I did for now is I connected everything to the cold water pipe
>> system. (It┤s grounded, I checked that). Is that ok? Or can "hot spots"
>> develop?
>>
>> The other thing are the antennas. I connected a wire (AWG 4) between the
>> mast of the antenna and the wires from the lightning protection system is
>> that OK?
>>
>> I really don┤t know how I should solve the problem wot my station
>> ground....
>>
>> I hope someone can help me out here :)
>
>While it may sound like grounding is all important, you can choose a
>totally ungrounded system through some sort of link coupling.  It's one of
>the oldest techniques available to get rid of a DC path from your antenna
>to your rig.  Broadcast people commonly use what is called an ISOCOUPLER
>for the same purpose.  Torroids can do the job for low power if wound
>correctly.  Feed line stubs can be configured to a multitude of these
>chores too. You have lots of alternatives.  If you have an artificial
>ground array on the roof, you can work an antenna that requires a ground
>against that, and let it float at what ever potential it finds, but best
>find a non-electrical wiring path to a ground.  Be careful in your design
>so you can tell us in a while what you did.
>
>Bill, k5pcw
>
>
>
>Anything you can do to make lightning find a path other than through you
>rig is the ticket.  Spark gaps also can help shunt the flow.  Best thing
>is physically unplug the antenna from the rig when you are not using it.
>>
>>
>> 73, Patrick
>> -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>>       http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet
>--
>WTShaw--MacCrypto Programmer--The Following is in FUDGE
>Vxdpq qcqva gdocd pokch hx-wd ll/,i ?-wry vegee n/wvm rt/tb bh/nd xdtlv ..mi.
 fzngq hj,zf dzvrb uy/xq njdzc ?=uGo me/gg gu??g /?wen --ueo een-g -p,ym ohvfg
 njrjb ,=/nl kk?zi ky.-m po,cg omufg koy.m kkmyi po,dg db,lb /,plz nn=mu d.awq

The toroid deal is a fact..  However, if you ARE going to disconnect, get that

free end grounded!  Otherwise, you may have the distinct honor of one who
has seen ball lightning inside your shack!  Heck you can have it happen even
if it is grounded, just makes the possibility of a plasma induced fire a
little less likely...

    :)

Ask KC5DNE, Paul Sittler what it looks like.  Magnificent glowing orb that
blew into the room out at the Vet Department at A&M, hung there glowing
for a brief while, then exploded in front of him and scarred the &^%&^&
out of the poor feller....

//-----------------------------
Mike - W5WQN
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: "Peter Gottlieb" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 01:56:16 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <01bbe574$1d2ee440$f50f2399@peter-s>
References: <[e-mail]> <wtshaw-0712961957440001@207.17.188.148> <58fs5j$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32520 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120070 alt.engineering.electrical:10009

> The toroid deal is a fact..  However, if you ARE going to disconnect, get
that
> free end grounded!  Otherwise, you may have the distinct honor of one who

> has seen ball lightning inside your shack!

Too bad you can't capture it.  A small ball lightning has about 25 kWh of
energy.

On the other hand, this is probably not something to play games with...




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.62.36.3!trellis.wwnet.com!news2.netdtw.com!newsserv.freeway.net!not-for-mail
From: Chuck Scott <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 23:55:05 -0400
Organization: Freeway, Inc.
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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To: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32528 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120096 alt.engineering.electrical:10011

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> I live on the 23 floor of a residential building and I┤m just starting to se
t up an amateur radio station. I can┤t seem to find any information on how to
properly ground my equipment at that height. I know that the grounding cable s
houldn┤t be at the resonant frequency of the amateur bands.
> What I did for now is I connected everything to the cold water pipe
> system. (It┤s grounded, I checked that). Is that ok? Or can "hot spots"
> develop?
>
> The other thing are the antennas. I connected a wire (AWG 4) between the
> mast of the antenna and the wires from the lightning protection system is
> that OK?
>
> I really don┤t know how I should solve the problem wot my station
> ground....
>
> I hope someone can help me out here :)
>
> 73, Patrick
> -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>       http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet

Patrick:
  Despite all the good information you're getting, I suggest that you
not walk, but run to your phone and call PolyPhaser and ask them for
some of their information on lightning protection and grounding.  You
can also find them at www.polyphaser.com.  Even if you don't shell out
the bucks for their relatively expensive solutions, you owe it to
yourself, you family, your neighbors, your landlord and your insurance
company to get the information and read it.
  The reason I suggest this is because lightning protection and
grounding is not a 5 minute solution, it's something thats going to take
some effort to learn and impliment.  If you do it wrong, you might as
well not do it at all.
  A friend of mine learned the hard way.  He had a repeater antenna on
top of a 50' tower behind his house.  He had the tower "grounded" but
still lost every piece of electronics in the house and his entire
heating and cooling system. Fortunately there was no fire and nobody was
home.

Chuck


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.ismi.net!usenet
From: Lou Calkins <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 12:14:48 +0000
Organization: Tamarack Engineering
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm2-00.ismi.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> I live on the 23 floor of a residential building
 [snip]
>
> What I did for now is I connected everything to the cold water pipe
> system. (It┤s grounded, I checked that). Is that ok? Or can "hot spots"
> develop?
>
 Patrick -

RF equipment wants to see "real" ground as close to it as possible.  You
will have to develop an "artificial ground" because at the frequencies
of Amateur Radio RF, your equipment will see the cold water pipe as an
open circuit.  I had this problem once with just 30 feet of wire to 3
actual ground rods.

You can get a box that does the artificial ground for you from MFJ (look
in QST magazine), but I have never tried one.  You probably should post
a question like this in a news group like rec.radio.amateur.misc.  Good
luck.

--- Lou  WA8YRH


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsbuffer.myriad.net!news.myriad.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 23:09:03 GMT
Organization: DigiPhone Corporation, Bryan/College Station Texas 409-693-8885
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <58i66f$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr22s8.myriad.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32566 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120195 alt.engineering.electrical:10034

In <[e-mail]>, Chuck Scott <[e-mail]> writes:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>>
>> I live on the 23 floor of a residential building and I┤m just starting to s
et up an amateur radio station. I can┤t seem to find any information on how to
 properly ground my equipment at that height. I know that the grounding cable
shouldn┤t be at the resonant frequency of the amateur bands.
>> What I did for now is I connected everything to the cold water pipe
>> system. (It┤s grounded, I checked that). Is that ok? Or can "hot spots"
>> develop?
>>
>> The other thing are the antennas. I connected a wire (AWG 4) between the
>> mast of the antenna and the wires from the lightning protection system is
>> that OK?
>>
>> I really don┤t know how I should solve the problem wot my station
>> ground....
>>
>> I hope someone can help me out here :)
>>
>> 73, Patrick
>> -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>>       http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet
>
>Patrick:
>  Despite all the good information you're getting, I suggest that you
>not walk, but run to your phone and call PolyPhaser and ask them for
>some of their information on lightning protection and grounding.  You
>can also find them at www.polyphaser.com.  Even if you don't shell out
>the bucks for their relatively expensive solutions, you owe it to
>yourself, you family, your neighbors, your landlord and your insurance
>company to get the information and read it.

      Amen.

>  The reason I suggest this is because lightning protection and
>grounding is not a 5 minute solution, it's something thats going to take
>some effort to learn and impliment.  If you do it wrong, you might as
>well not do it at all.

      Amen.

>Chuck

      Amen.  (chorus here...)


//-----------------------------
Mike - W5WQN
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:20:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsbuffer.myriad.net!news.myriad.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 17:52:20 GMT
Organization: DigiPhone Corporation, Bryan/College Station Texas 409-693-8885
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58k80k$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <wtshaw-0712961957440001@207.17.188.148> <58fs5j$[e-mail]> <01bbe574$1d2ee440$f50f2399@peter-s>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr14s4.myriad.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32592 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120263 alt.engineering.electrical:10057

In <01bbe574$1d2ee440$f50f2399@peter-s>, "Peter Gottlieb" <peter_gottlieb@msn.
com> writes:
>> The toroid deal is a fact..  However, if you ARE going to disconnect, get
>that
>> free end grounded!  Otherwise, you may have the distinct honor of one who
>
>> has seen ball lightning inside your shack!
>
>Too bad you can't capture it.  A small ball lightning has about 25 kWh of
>energy.
>
>On the other hand, this is probably not something to play games with...
>

Paul Michael Sittler told me he was DEFINITELY not inclined to play games
with it.  He said in the split seconds that it all happened, he was like,
more wishing it would go away and scared to death it was going to move
toward him.  He really didn't have time to contemplate anything like his naval

over the event.

Said his ears rang for a while after it exploded in front of him.

   :)


//-----------------------------
Mike - W5WQN
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!gatech!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!128.255.40.11!news.uiowa.edu!news
From: "William E. Sabin" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 22:48:21 -0800
Organization: none
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-114.cedar-rapids.lib.ia.us
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32593 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120264 alt.engineering.electrical:10058

Gary Coffman wrote:
>
> Connecting your antenna mast directly to the building lightning downleads
> with #4 was a very good step. This *should* divert the majority of a direct
> strike's currents into the building lightning mitigation system and frame.
> Your ground window will protect you from the rest. One caution, however,
> large currents can flow between this bond point and your station ground
> window. To avoid damage to coax and control wiring, run a heavy grounding
> lead between these two points. (Yeah, that'll cause a ground loop, but
> don't worry about that, the coax shields already did, and the ground
> window will short out the loop for the equipment on the inside of the
> window.)
>

I wonder if, instead of *bonding* the roof top environment to the station
environment, it would be better to *isolate* the two. If the antenna is
tied to the building structure using heavy, low inductance straps, then
if all cables to the radio are loaded with large ferrite beads that
present a high longitudinal impedance to the impulse, then the protection
at the equipment location could be less draconian (gas tubes, spark gaps,
isolation transformers etc.). The idea of introducing a ground loop does
not fly too well.

Bill W0IYH


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!interpath!news.interpath.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham band == Radio National Park
Date: 7 Dec 1996 06:37:41 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

I though o' this idea while eating dinner.  That closing a ham band is
like closing a national park -- in that a resource that was previously
available to private citizens is now open to business or government only.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Mark Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham band == Radio National Park
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 01:38:46 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d3.mnh.nh.ultra.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On 7 Dec 1996 06:37:41 GMT, [e-mail]
(cathryn) wrote:

>I though o' this idea while eating dinner.  That closing a ham band is
>like closing a national park -- in that a resource that was previously
>available to private citizens is now open to business or government only.
>


Hmmm, a National Park? Can someone direct me to where the climbing is?


***************************************************************
* [e-mail]                                     *

*                                                             *
* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
*    Manchester, NH                                           *
***************************************************************
.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!natinst.com!news-relay.us.dell.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 22:01:04 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Ham Chat On the 'Web!
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,rec.radio.swap,su.org.ham-radio
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: INET Network Consultants
X-Article-Creation-Date: Tue Dec 10 03:51:20 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 208.6.235.26 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/3.01 (WinNT; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 5
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120216 rec.radio.cb:39042 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44038 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44023 rec.radio.scanner:72828 rec.radio.shortwave:90120 rec.radio.swap:98964 su.org.ham-radio:372

Howdy.  Just stopping in to announce a new 'web based Ham area called "Ham
Crossroads".  It can be found at http://www.inetnc.com/hamchat/.  Stop on
in, it's a whole lot of fun.
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!usc!news.cerf.net!hacgate2.hac.com!news.delcoelect.com!cwalthal
From: [e-mail] (Carl Walthall)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham equip FS
Date: 7 Dec 1996 12:23:34 -0500
Organization: Delco Electronics Corp.
Lines: 34
Distribution: usa
Message-ID: <58c96m$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: koinsw08.delcoelect.com


Sorry to post this again, but I what to let people
Know whats I still have. This way they what waste
phone call.

I have the fellowing Ham EQuipment forsale...

Kantronics UTU Tnc Cw,Amtor,Rtty       $30.00

Kenwood TS430s HF Allmode Gen. Recv.   $450.00
       includes      Power Suppy 20 amp

Heil Desk Mic.                         $60.00

Kenwood TM221A @ meter Mobile 40 watts  no mic. $40.00 SOLD

Kenwood TS700A 2 meter Allmode 10 watts $200.00

Icom 48A 440mhz  25 watt mobile         $250.00

Commador 128 with Pakratt TNC and Manual

Disk drive and monitor                   $170.00

Amiga 1000 and monitor floppy drive
was used for packet                      $150.00

2 meter amp. 10 in 80 out                $90.00

I can be reached at 317-451-5284 work
or 219-626-2955 home

Carl Walthall
Walton In. N3QOM


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!super.zippo.com!zdc-e!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham gear at Fry's
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 06:17:47 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <580gko$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sjx-ca51-07.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 02 10:16:56 PM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>Fry's Electronics is now carrying the full line of Kenwood gear. The only
>store in Ca. that i know of at this time to carry it is on Brokaw Road in
>San Jose. I have heard that they are very reasonable on the pricing. Look
>out HRO!!
>73...Dan...KE6RRU

I saw their big HF boxes and some 2m/70cm FM gear, but I didn't
see the VHF or UHF SSB gear.  I also didn't see the TS-60.  Also
absent were any station accessories.

My guess is that they carry only the most ordinary and in-demand of
Kenwood gear.   It's the same reason that you won't find a single
variable capacitor in the 6 aisles of electronic "parts".     HRO need
not fear; Fry's is, and always will be, a glorified Circuit City with
candy bars and Playboy Magazines.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham gear at Fry's
Date: 4 Dec 1996 15:08:36 GMT
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <58445k$1d2u$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <580gko$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-228.ca.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <580gko$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>My guess is that they carry only the most ordinary and in-demand of
>Kenwood gear.   It's the same reason that you won't find a single
>variable capacitor in the 6 aisles of electronic "parts".     HRO need
>not fear; Fry's is, and always will be, a glorified Circuit City with
>candy bars and Playboy Magazines.

Yeah, but still... if Fry's starts carrying amateur radio gear, we might see
a couple of desireable things happen.  Firstly, prices may drop, just like
they did with computer gear when the big stores like Fry's and Compusa
got rolling.  Secondly, for this reason, and simply because of the visibility
of Fry's, we might see more people become interested in amateur radio.

I see these as good things.

Does anyone know if any of the LA Fry's are carrying ham gear?

Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV
[e-mail]

USC Law School, Class of '97

--------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather."
"Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers."
--------------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham gear at Fry's
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 01:45:40 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <582vjm$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <580gko$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip66.los-angeles4.ca.interramp.com
X-Server-Date: 4 Dec 1996 04:44:38 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>[e-mail] wrote:

>>Fry's Electronics is now carrying the full line of Kenwood gear. The only
>>store in Ca. that i know of at this time to carry it is on Brokaw Road in
>>San Jose. I have heard that they are very reasonable on the pricing. Look
>>out HRO!!
>>73...Dan...KE6RRU

The store in Woodland Hills, CA is also going to start carrying HAM
Radio equiptment soon.  Not sure how soon, though.

Scott, KF6FCN
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!cbgw2.lucent.com!cbgw3.lucent.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Robert Dale Piedfort KB7UB)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham gear at Fry's
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 05:21:31 GMT
Organization: Pacific Bell Internet Services
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <580gko$[e-mail]> <582vjm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-67-80.anhm01.pacbell.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

[e-mail] wrote:

>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>>>Fry's Electronics is now carrying the full line of Kenwood gear. The only
>>>store in Ca. that i know of at this time to carry it is on Brokaw Road in
>>>San Jose. I have heard that they are very reasonable on the pricing. Look
>>>out HRO!!
>>>73...Dan...KE6RRU
>
>The store in Woodland Hills, CA is also going to start carrying HAM
>Radio equiptment soon.  Not sure how soon, though.
>
>Scott, KF6FCN
>[e-mail]
>
I can see it now, all the tech support and help you will get from Frys'
Just imagine all the 800 lines at AES, HRO, JUN's, TEXAS TOWER
and the rest of the real dealers when some newbie buys a rig and cant
figure out how to turn it on or has to return it, YEP  you will sure get a lot
of support from that group. LET THE BUYER BEWARE..............


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!southwind.net!symbios.com!kthompso.ks.symbios.com!ken.thompson_at_symbios.com
From: [e-mail] (stop junk e-mail)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham gear at Fry's
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 14:48:07
Organization: Symbios Logic
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <580gko$[e-mail]> <58445k$1d2u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kthompso.ks.symbios.com
X-Newsreader: Trumpet for Windows [Version 1.0 Rev A]

We will have more fox hunting opportunities too....  :-)



In article
<58445k$1d2u$[e-mail]> [e-mail]
writes:>From: [e-mail]>Subject: Re: Ham gear at Fry's
>Date: 4 Dec 1996 15:08:36 GMT

>In <580gko$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>>My guess is that they carry only the most ordinary and in-demand of
>>Kenwood gear.   It's the same reason that you won't find a single
>>variable capacitor in the 6 aisles of electronic "parts".     HRO need
>>not fear; Fry's is, and always will be, a glorified Circuit City with
>>candy bars and Playboy Magazines.

>Yeah, but still... if Fry's starts carrying amateur radio gear, we might see
>a couple of desireable things happen.  Firstly, prices may drop, just like
>they did with computer gear when the big stores like Fry's and Compusa
>got rolling.  Secondly, for this reason, and simply because of the visibility
>of Fry's, we might see more people become interested in amateur radio.

>I see these as good things.

>Does anyone know if any of the LA Fry's are carrying ham gear?

>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV
>[e-mail]

>USC Law School, Class of '97

>--------------------------------------------------
>"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather."
>"Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers."
>--------------------------------------------------




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!EU.net!sun4nl!iwg!ej1bbs!evert.jan.van.ramselaar
From: [e-mail] (Evert Jan van Ramselaar)
Date: 10 Dec 96 22:25:01
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAM links on WWW
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: EJ1BBS Internet Services
Lines: 20



Greetings earthlings,

Check out our HAM-WWW link at our homepage
http://dronten.flnet.nl/~0vramselaar01     with 100s of interesting links for
radioamateurs/HAMs.

And while you're at our website, please fill out our guestbook...   =-)

--
          +-------------------------+-------------------------+
          | C U in court!           |  -=<  E J 1 B B S  >=-  |
          | Evert Jan van Ramselaar |  Dronten, Flevoland NL  |
          | [e-mail]      |    [phone]    |
          +-------------------------+-------------------------+
          |      http://dronten.flnet.nl/~0vramselaar01       |
          +---------------------------------------------------+

... <* BOEM! *> Intel Outside.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:12 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!mv!wd1v.mv.com!user
From: [e-mail] (John D. Seney, WD1V,   LeCroy T&M   800.553.2769)
Subject: Ham Radio FAQ on WWW or TEXT File
Organization: MV Communications, Inc.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: wd1v.mv.com
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 13:44:17 GMT
Lines: 26

                  Announcing NEW Ham Radio.FAQ

This file started as a regular USENET posting called "rec.radio.amateur
.misc Frequently Asked Questions".

Ham Radio.FAQ contains 3 chapters and many, many LINKS to radio
related sites!

1 - Introduction to the Ham Radio.FAQ
2 - Amateur Radio Organizations, Services, and Data Sources
3 - Amateur Radio Advanced and Technical Questions

Please provide a copy of the Ham Radio.FAQ to any new or soon-to-be Hams
that you know or share with them the URL to this site:

              http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v

Send me an EMAIL <or packet with your Email address> if you want the
FAQ text file sent to you as an attached <120 K> file with the words
"HAM FAQ" on the subject line.


73,

John D. Seney
http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:13 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!hammer.uoregon.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 22:26:25 GMT
Lines: 38
Sender: [e-mail]

Jim Weir ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Presumption -- that we don't want a total overhaul of the current system,
: but a better way of doing what we are doing now.  Keep the current band and
: subband divisions that we have today.

OK, I'll wait to hear further proposals before commenting on this one...

: Modify the current structure to eliminate the Technician class.  Keep
: Novice, General, Advanced, and Extra (don't worry, you'll hopefully see the
: logic later on).  Grandfather today's Technicians into the General class.

I'm concerned about your proposal to grandfather those who took only an
entry-level theory exam; an exam designed to (hopefully) ensure that they
had a basic understanding of regulations, operating procedures and didn't
harm themselves or any other person.

After all, no one seemed to agree that Generals, who had earned full
privileges under the existing system, should have been grandfathered to
Extra back in the late '60s.  This has stuck in my craw since then.


: Consider the technonerdy that couldn't care less about CW.  He aces the
: phone and other part of the exam.  He passes.

Labeling someone as "technonerdy" may not be taken as a compliment by all,
and will just deteriorate the S/N on responses to your proposal.  Shall we
say simply "for those who are not interested in CW..."

My view so far:  it's going to take proposals such as yours, and a *lot* of
negotiating and give-and-take on both sides of the CW issue, to come up with
something that will be palatable to all concerned.  Overall, we'd all come
out of this dilemma feeling a lot better than if one side or the other got
"their way" without giving something up.

Looking forward to part#2,

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:14 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:25:21 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dhcpcp176-485.sr.chevron.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)
To: Jim Lowman <[e-mail]>

Jim Lowman wrote:

> Jim Weir ([e-mail]) wrote:

> : Modify the current structure to eliminate the Technician class.  Keep
> : Novice, General, Advanced, and Extra (don't worry, you'll hopefully see th
e
> : logic later on).  Grandfather today's Technicians into the General class.

> I'm concerned about your proposal to grandfather those who took only an
> entry-level theory exam; an exam designed to (hopefully) ensure that they
> had a basic understanding of regulations, operating procedures and didn't
> harm themselves or any other person.

I disagree.  The technician is not an entry level license class (even
though its the entry point for many new hams)  A technician, whether a
no-code tech or tech+, has to pass a second written exam element (3A) in
addition the novice element (2).

In consideration of the privleges given a technician above 30 MHz (the
same as general, advanced and extra) the test adequately covers the
three areas of you mention; regulation, operation, and safety.  Then the
question becomes "how do we allocate frequency privleges under a new
system?" If we make a new system.

> After all, no one seemed to agree that Generals, who had earned full
> privileges under the existing system, should have been grandfathered to
> Extra back in the late '60s.  This has stuck in my craw since then.

If that was as such an injustice then, why do it again if the license
structure is changed?  I probably doesn't matter if you grandfather a
tech forward to general, or backward to novice, there wil be a group
crying about the system being unfair.

Regards

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!usenet.kornet.nm.kr!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!sonysjc!sonybc!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:13:04 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <58jggn$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <01bbe650$1d442d00$8fe96ec6@cqdxer>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-170.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Charles Lemarbre N8LDY" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I can see how your proposal will benifit the Techs and thats good! but in
>what way >does it benifit Generals like myself?  I busted my tail to get the
13 wpm!
>if I knew >that an *automatic* upgrade to General was just a few years down t
he road I
>would have waited! I was thinking about upgrading to Advanced but with all  n
eat
>Ideas out there,I might do better to wait and see what happens <grin> I can d
o theory
>in my sleep and never had to work at it but the Code took time.

Better hurry and grab a chair, Chuck, the waiting room is filling up fast.....
.

> Code is a skill that with work and time can be mastered
>and is one of the few skills left in the Amateur service,

That's a secret Chuck, we don't want everyone to know about that.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!demos!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 02:07:32 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58l4t2$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-3.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I disagree.  The technician is not an entry level license class (even
>though its the entry point for many new hams)
               ^it's
Huh?!?

The front door is not really at the front of the house.  But you have
to enter it to pass through the house to get to the back door.    ????

Yours doesn't make any sense either.

Anal, ain't I?

   ;)

  jim, wk1v



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:17 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 14:59:44 -0500
From: "Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ" <[e-mail]>
Organization: T.J. Alessi & Associates, Stamford, Connecticut
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
CC: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.16.238.238
Lines: 51
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news.paonline.com!news3.paonline.com!207.16.238.238

Jim Weir wrote:
>
> I've been thinking for a while about this ham radio licensing scheme we've
> concocted in this country and have come to some conclusions and some
> opinions that are mine and mine alone.  This is the first of those
> thoughts, and I certainly don't think I've got the only key to the ultimate
> answer.  Thoughtful comments gratefully acknowledged and encouraged.

----> *SNIP* <----

I have an even better Idea (and Don't Laugh!)...

Split ALL licenses in half.  Written and CW.  Have 2 ladders.

1.  Technician, General and Extra, for Passing
    only written exams.  Give these people "Phone & Digital"
    privilages.

2.  Technician+, General+ and Extra+ for passing
    Written with CW.  Give these people "Phone, Digital & CW"
    privillages.

Here is how testing could be without changing much:

CLASS   Elements        PRIVILLAGES
-----   --------      --------------------------------------------
Tech.    2 & 3A       (Current Novice + Tech Phone & Digital)
Gen.    3B & 4A       (All Current Phone, Digital EXCEPT Extra Area)
Extra   4B            (All Phone & Digital)


Tech.+   2 & 3A & 1A  (Current Novice + Tech Phone, Digital & CW)
Gen.+   3B & 4A & 1B  (All Current Phone, Digital & CW EXCEPT Extra Areas)
Extra+  4B & 1C       (All Phone & Digital + All CW segments)

Sounds a bit crazy, but, with some refinement it could work.  I love CW
and I can't see why a very simple 2 ladder system can't work.  Make CW
a privillage not a penalty.  (I'M A DIEHARD CW OPR.)  If someone wants
to talk into a mic or send data, just make sure that he can pass a
descent written test. Rules & Regs, and some good old theory.  Then, if
you want to get on CW, earn that privillage.

Just my $0.02 worth.

Seasons Greetings,
Tom - K1TJ
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
 T.J. Alessi - K1TJ,  147 Joffre Avenue,  Stamford, CT 06905-2933
 mailto:[e-mail]     http://www.Alessi.Com     203.977.5200
------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.ptd.net!newsmaster
From: [e-mail] (Pete)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAM RADIO STATION FOR SALE
Date: 4 Dec 1996 01:42:54 GMT
Organization: None
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <582kuu$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs2-14.blo.ptd.net
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (16bit)

I have a Kenwood TS-140 HF rig with Kenwood PS-50 power supply, and
Kenwood SP-430 speaker, and Kenwood MC-60 desk mike, also hand mike and
all manuals and boxes.
This station is in like new shape. I am selling for mony for Christmas.
I would like to get $700 plus postage.
I also have a chrome Bencher with an acrlic cover, I would like $40 for
it.


        Tnx for reading [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: Rob Bellville <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham Radio WWWBoards...
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 17:05:15 -0500
Organization: http://rob.acol.com/
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial241.acol.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:922 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119958

FYI...

Newsgroups style Interactive Web pages:

VHF-AM WWWBoard
New England Ham Radio Info WWWBoard

Go to:    http://rob.acol.com/radio/ham/


-- Rob, N1NTE



==============================================================
  Rob Bellville
  [e-mail]                                   PO Box 515
  http://rob.acol.com/                   Millbury, MA 01527

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
  ||||||||  Blackstone Valley Community Website:  ||||||||
              http://www.blackstonevalley.com/
==============================================================


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham Radio?  Why Bother?
Date: 8 Dec 1996 02:07:53 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>Most hams are former CBer's.  Well I'm a ham who has converted to CB.
The snobby attitude >on the ham bands is sometimes too hard to listen to,
so I go over to CB and chill out.

Ditto here.  I've been active in CB since I was 12 years old (1976)  After
listening to hams preach to me for years about the virtues of ham radio
("get your ham ticket", "get legal", "work the world", etc.), I finally
succumbed last year and got my license.

What have I heard since becoming a ham?  Endless conversations about the
operator's equipment, antennas, the weather, and health ailments (older
hams, which seems to comprise 90+% of the total here in Florida.)  Also an
unfair amount of criticism directed towards Technicians...can someone
please explain to me how one is not a "real ham", simply because they
choose not to waste a bunch of time learning a 19th-century communications
mode which nobody outside of the amateur service even uses anymore?
Arguing, fighting, and indecent language on 75-meters every night that
makes CB Channel 19 look like Sunday School by comparison.  Constant
complaining about the latest proposal by the FCC to share the bands with
commercial interests, etc.

Bottom line: my 2-meter HT hasn't been turned on in months and my 10-meter
radio has a thick layer of dust on top.  But the CB gets used every day to
communicate with friends, obtain traffic and road information, etc.
Practical, useful stuff in the game of life.

Is it any wonder the amateur bands are being sought by commercial
interests?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Ham Radio?  Why Bother?
Date: Sun,  8 Dec 1996 11:05:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 8


>>...my 2-meter HT hasn't been turned on in months...

Quite unfortunate, indeed.

Out here in Southern California, over 5,000 public assistance calls are
handled annually on a single 2-meter repeater system that I am involved
with...


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.west.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio?  Why Bother?
Date: 8 Dec 1996 15:19:30 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <58ema2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: term1-9.vta.west.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:[e-mail]

So, how much do you want for the 10 meter radio?




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!netport.com!usenet
From: "Ginsberg Family (Ed Ginsberg KE6BNL)" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio?  Why Bother?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 07:32:55 -0800
Organization: "Netport Internet Access [phone]"
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p04.cts-palm-1.netport.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> >Most hams are former CBer's.  Well I'm a ham who has converted to CB.
> The snobby attitude >on the ham bands is sometimes too hard to listen to,
> so I go over to CB and chill out.
>
> Ditto here.  I've been active in CB since I was 12 years old (1976)  After
> listening to hams preach to me for years about the virtues of ham radio
> ("get your ham ticket", "get legal", "work the world", etc.), I finally
> succumbed last year and got my license.
>
> What have I heard since becoming a ham?  Endless conversations about the
> operator's equipment, antennas, the weather, and health ailments (older
> hams, which seems to comprise 90+% of the total here in Florida.)  Also an
> unfair amount of criticism directed towards Technicians...can someone
> please explain to me how one is not a "real ham", simply because they
> choose not to waste a bunch of time learning a 19th-century communications
> mode which nobody outside of the amateur service even uses anymore?
> Arguing, fighting, and indecent language on 75-meters every night that
> makes CB Channel 19 look like Sunday School by comparison.  Constant
> complaining about the latest proposal by the FCC to share the bands with
> commercial interests, etc.
>
> Bottom line: my 2-meter HT hasn't been turned on in months and my 10-meter
> radio has a thick layer of dust on top.  But the CB gets used every day to
> communicate with friends, obtain traffic and road information, etc.
> Practical, useful stuff in the game of life.
>
> Is it any wonder the amateur bands are being sought by commercial
> interests?Feel free to ship your old useless equipment to me I will pay ship
ping
Ed KE6BNL
--
1╛


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!hermes.is.co.za!iafrica.com!psgrain!charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu!newshub.csu.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAMMARLUND HQ-140-X receiver for sale
Date: 9 Dec 1996 18:51:30 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

For sale- HAMMARLUND HQ-140-X receiver.   Very good condition all around.
They don't build em' like this anymore!

Also have a DRAKE T-4XB transmitter for sale. Like new, hardly used. with
power supply.

Either or both will go for reasonable price.

If interested, please e-mail your offer to [e-mail].

Thank you.

-ron


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!newsfeed1.aimnet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sgi.com!news.spies.com!matra.meer.net!not-for-mail
From: Ken Harris <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Hams in "Silicon Valley"?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 21:03:34 -0800
Organization: Shoreline Studios
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.14.117.25
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02S (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120200 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44009

What are the ham resources in the silicon valley?
Clubs?  Web pages?  Swap meets?

        I'm in the market for my first 2m HT.

---
Ken J. Harris
voice:  415/969-7896 x 15, 800/477-9008 x 15,   fax:    [phone]
mailto:[e-mail]        http://www.shoreline-studios.com
smail:  1804 N. Shoreline Blvd, Mountain View, CA 94043-1320
ICBM:   37 25.10' N, 122 04.67' W


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!news.iwvisp.com![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Dr Pepper)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Hams in "Silicon Valley"?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:57:04 GMT
Organization: The Scannerist
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: a1-l1-c24.iwvisp.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/16.299
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120280 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44086

Whoops!!! sorry, wrong NG, , , MY fault, I was
looking at the one above it.

On Mon, 09 Dec 1996 21:03:34 -0800, Ken Harris
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>What are the ham resources in the silicon valley?
>Clubs?  Web pages?  Swap meets?
>
>       I'm in the market for my first 2m HT.
>
>---
>Ken J. Harris
>voice: 415/969-7896 x 15, 800/477-9008 x 15,   fax:    [phone]
>mailto:[e-mail]       http://www.shoreline-studios.com
>smail: 1804 N. Shoreline Blvd, Mountain View, CA 94043-1320
>ICBM:  37 25.10' N, 122 04.67' W

Dr.Pepper
Good ALL the time


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!news.iwvisp.com![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Dr Pepper)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Hams in "Silicon Valley"?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:55:50 GMT
Organization: The Scannerist
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Now THIS is a good one!!!!! nyuk,nyuk,nyuk
He means HAM RADIO, not the kind you eat on Easter.
Good try Ken, but this just ain't the right NG for you,
but if you like good food, stick around :-}
Try rec.radio.scanner.

On Mon, 09 Dec 1996 21:03:34 -0800, Ken Harris
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>What are the ham resources in the silicon valley?
>Clubs?  Web pages?  Swap meets?
>
>       I'm in the market for my first 2m HT.
>
>---
>Ken J. Harris
>voice: 415/969-7896 x 15, 800/477-9008 x 15,   fax:    [phone]
>mailto:[e-mail]       http://www.shoreline-studios.com
>smail: 1804 N. Shoreline Blvd, Mountain View, CA 94043-1320
>ICBM:  37 25.10' N, 122 04.67' W

Dr.Pepper
Good ALL the time


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 13:30:40 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <58bv5s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp18.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I though everyone would appreciate seeing this post to a list server.
Proof once again that CW as a requirement for HF privelege does not
prevent morons from getting HF. Nor does it prevent technically
ignorant HAMS from endangering our HF bands by taunting government
operators who are protecting our very way of life.

____________________________________________
December 7, 1996

3821.0    Local Ham operators trying to find
Andrews AFB on the map after Andrews (female
operator) walked on them bigtime with a series
signal checks with SAM 300. Andrews did not
acknowledge the Hams repeated attempts to break
into the comms and the Hams soon assumed that
Andrews could not hear them...
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
Standard procedure
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
(This is getting verrry wierd now!) As soon as SAM 300
shutdown for the night Andrews came up on freq for
a one-on-one with the Hams, "This is a *published* USAF
frequency."
    One of the Hams replies, Sooo!!, you could hear
us all this time!...Andrews you are in the middle of the
Ham band" (etc., etc., etc...)
    Andrews scolds them once more and is gone.

The part that really caught my ear was the "published"
freq thing!  The Andrews op made it sound like these
[dumb] Hams should have gone down the the local libary
and looked up the "published" Mystic Star freqs!

Loud-and clear at  0523z
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------
My comments:

A big round of aplause to the hams who not only insulted the airforce
op, but the dignatary or government offcial on-board the SAM(Special
Air Mission) SAM's are often ferrying important decission makers.

No wonder they want OUR bands!

Just for the record. The next time you are on a freq and a military op
comes up to use the freq, remember that we are borrowing the freq from
them to begin with. I know, we debated this subject at a local meeting
with many persons attending. All the ancient older hams seem to
remember that the government lends us these freqs so that we may play
and experiment. Remember who gets these freqs back when war is
declared?

Yeah yeah, we the people are the government and all the excuses you
all can come up with. But just remember, the military not only
protects you, but quite often flys around the guys who decide where
you can talk. It may not be right or even correct, but it is reality.

Show some consideration for the people who protect your lives and the
people who protect your privelege. Please.

KC5WCP
Eric

A tech and proud of it.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:29 1996
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 14:50:36 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

KC5WCP wrote:
>
> I though everyone would appreciate seeing this post to a list server.
> Proof once again that CW as a requirement for HF privelege does not

<snip>

-----------------------------------
> My comments:
>
> A big round of aplause to the hams who not only insulted the airforce
> op, but the dignatary or government offcial on-board the SAM(Special
> Air Mission) SAM's are often ferrying important decission makers.
>
> No wonder they want OUR bands!
>
> Just for the record. The next time you are on a freq and a military op
> comes up to use the freq, remember that we are borrowing the freq from

<snip>

> Yeah yeah, we the people are the government and all the excuses you
> all can come up with. But just remember, the military not only
> protects you, but quite often flys around the guys who decide where
> you can talk. It may not be right or even correct, but it is reality.
>
> Show some consideration for the people who protect your lives and the
> people who protect your privelege. Please.
>
> KC5WCP
> Eric
>
> A tech and proud of it.

--
Remarkable. By your reasoning, I can fire up anywhere I want. Just like
that arrogant Andrews operator.

Drivel!

The military is often arrogant and will do anything that you can't
prevent. I know, spent a fair amount of time in the military (Navy if it
matters) and there is no end to the stupid and arrogant things they will
do.

At the very least, the various stations monitoring the transmission
should have sent in letters of protest.

Pantywaists like you who won't defend their privilege are the real
reason
we as a citizenry are losing various rights."Don't do anything to them
or they might do something back" or you might offend them...
This nation wouldn't have gotten past 1777 with that attitude.

Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:31 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 9 Dec 1996 21:48:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <58iq22$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.51 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:


>Remarkable. By your reasoning, I can fire up anywhere I want. Just like
>that arrogant Andrews operator.

>Drivel!

>The military is often arrogant and will do anything that you can't
>prevent. I know, spent a fair amount of time in the military (Navy if it
>matters) and there is no end to the stupid and arrogant things they will
>do.

>At the very least, the various stations monitoring the transmission
>should have sent in letters of protest.

>Pantywaists like you who won't defend their privilege are the real
>reason
>we as a citizenry are losing various rights."Don't do anything to them
>or they might do something back" or you might offend them...
>This nation wouldn't have gotten past 1777 with that attitude.
>
>Stan KF0NC
>"90% of all statistics are made up"

I agree with you 100%. I am currently in the Army and we had a problem
with them using spread spectrum on the 430-440mhz band. We approached
them with the problem and found out there was nothing we could do
about it seeing that that part of the band is primarly for military
and we are secondary users of it. Still it did not stop us. We got the
local law enforcement to step in as it was also interfearing with
their communications. Once that happened they turned down their power
and we haven't seen them since. We also had a problem with one of our
repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that
this is the same case and the Andrews operator should be fined to the
max to show them that the ham bands are not a place to be. The
military has tons of spectrum so I don't think they should have been
there in the first place. In time of war that is understandable but
not in peace time.

73




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!super.zippo.com!zdc-e!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 11 Dec 1996 02:33:58 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <58l6im$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>:  We also had a problem with one of our
>: repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>: repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>: members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>: military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>: that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>: ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that

It's really annoying when people attempt to pass opinion as fact. Greg
is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
often, but it is within their power.

At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.monmouth.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 06:42:31 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58ldjh$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:


>and we haven't seen them since. We also had a problem with one of our
>repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club

I sure would not be proud of having a spur providing interference from
one of my repeaters!


>members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that
>this is the same case and the Andrews operator should be fined to the
>max to show them that the ham bands are not a place to be. The

Uh, yeah.  The military can come up where they want, when they want,
how they want.  We just look at it as the sound of freedom.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!warwick!lyra.csx.cam.ac.uk!news
From: Edward WJ Lipman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help -- batteries and  chargers
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 13:04:16 +0000
Organization: University of Cambridge
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spt10.pet.cam.ac.uk
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I)

Does anyone know of good (cheap!) sources for nicads and lead acid
batteries, and especially of smart chargers for both?

Any help much appreciated -- please e-mail me if you can as I don't have
access to Usenet on a regular basis.

Thanks,

Edward


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:35 1996
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From: "FUman" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap
Subject: Re: Help Identifying Heliax Cable
Date: 2 Dec 1996 07:31:53 GMT
Organization: kg7fu
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <01bbe023$2eaeb7a0$[e-mail]>
References: <57gb1c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p52.t0.rio.com
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32297 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43466 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119384



Douglas Berry <[e-mail]> wrote in article =
<57gb1c$[e-mail]>...
> Hello to all and thanks for reading this message
>=20
> I recently acquired some surplus cable TV trunk line. I suspect the =
cable is 75 ohm but=20
> not sure. The cable is 11/16 inch in diameter with black plastic =
coating over an=20
> aluminum jacket there is a white dialectric and a thick center =
condutor. the numbers=20
> written on the wire are T10  J. On the reel there is a Type No =
T10625JBFV1 and below=20
> that the number GN7GN. I would appreciate any help at identifying this =
wire what it's=20
> approxmatly worth and were I would be able to fine connector that =
would fit it.
>=20
> Thanks Again
> 73's  Doug  VA3DMB

The ratio between the inner and outer counductors will yield you the Zo =
of the line.

Check the ARRL or RSGB handbooks (or other engineering texts) to find =
the formulae.

de kg7fu




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.rns.net!maggie.ionsys.com!newspeak.ultratech.net!!news1.bellglobal.com!torn!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!worldnet.att.net!anchor.cis.att.com!cbgw1.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HELP Using Ant Tuner w/Linear
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 10:00:53 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: esoterica.pez.bell-labs.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

Hi all,

I've been a ham for 15 years but I've never owned an HF amplifier! I
will be getting one shortly (Ameritron AL-811, 600W), and I have a
question about my revised antenna tuner needs with the amp in line.

I currently use an external MFJ-949D tuner with my Kenwood TS450S. I
have been accustomed to outboard tuners for a long time. Here's my
specific question:

What are the relative merits of:  A) a 3kw external tuner, such as the
MFJ top-of-the-line model; or  B) installing the optional auto-tuner in
my TS450S.  My confusion stems from a so-so understanding of the load
matching situation introduced by an amplifier. The two choices above
represent two different chains:

A)  Rig --> Amp --> Tuner --> Feedline
B)  Rig --> Tuner --> Amp --> Feedline

Please offer any thoughts on this matter - I appreciate them all.

73 DE KG2IV
Roger
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:37 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!in1.nntp.cais.net!NEWS1!not-for-mail
From: Bob Lewis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: HELP Using Ant Tuner w/Linear
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 16:19:35 -0500
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: AA4PB
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 39

Roger D. Placer wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I've been a ham for 15 years but I've never owned an HF amplifier! I
> will be getting one shortly (Ameritron AL-811, 600W), and I have a
> question about my revised antenna tuner needs with the amp in line.
>
> I currently use an external MFJ-949D tuner with my Kenwood TS450S. I
> have been accustomed to outboard tuners for a long time. Here's my
> specific question:
>
> What are the relative merits of:  A) a 3kw external tuner, such as the
> MFJ top-of-the-line model; or  B) installing the optional auto-tuner in
> my TS450S.  My confusion stems from a so-so understanding of the load
> matching situation introduced by an amplifier. The two choices above
> represent two different chains:
>
> A)  Rig --> Amp --> Tuner --> Feedline
> B)  Rig --> Tuner --> Amp --> Feedline
>
> Please offer any thoughts on this matter - I appreciate them all.
>
> 73 DE KG2IV
> Roger
> --
> ==========================================================
> Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
> Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
> FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
> ==========================================================

You can't match the antenna to the amp with the tuner positioned between
the rig and the amp. The rig should match the amp's 50 ohm input without
a tuner. Put a tuner suitable to handle the power level between the amp
and the antenna. By the way, if the amp has "tune" and "load" controls
and the antenna is near 50 ohms (resonant dipole, beam, etc) then you
probably won't need a tuner at all- the range of the tuning controls on
the amp will match an antenna that is not too far off.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:39 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: HELP Using Ant Tuner w/Linear
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 20:56:28 GMT
Lines: 58

In article <[e-mail]> Bob Lewis <[e-mail]> writes
:
>Roger D. Placer wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I've been a ham for 15 years but I've never owned an HF amplifier! I
>> will be getting one shortly (Ameritron AL-811, 600W), and I have a
>> question about my revised antenna tuner needs with the amp in line.
>>
>> I currently use an external MFJ-949D tuner with my Kenwood TS450S. I
>> have been accustomed to outboard tuners for a long time. Here's my
>> specific question:
>>
>> What are the relative merits of:  A) a 3kw external tuner, such as the
>> MFJ top-of-the-line model; or  B) installing the optional auto-tuner in
>> my TS450S.  My confusion stems from a so-so understanding of the load
>> matching situation introduced by an amplifier. The two choices above
>> represent two different chains:
>>
>> A)  Rig --> Amp --> Tuner --> Feedline
>> B)  Rig --> Tuner --> Amp --> Feedline
>>
>> Please offer any thoughts on this matter - I appreciate them all.
>
>You can't match the antenna to the amp with the tuner positioned between
>the rig and the amp. The rig should match the amp's 50 ohm input without
>a tuner.

It *might*, if the amp input looked anywhere close to 50 ohms. It
often doesn't though. I've found it necessary to use a tuner between
a "no tune" exciter and a linear on many occasions. So it isn't
unreasonable to consider this option.

>Put a tuner suitable to handle the power level between the amp
>and the antenna. By the way, if the amp has "tune" and "load" controls
>and the antenna is near 50 ohms (resonant dipole, beam, etc) then you
>probably won't need a tuner at all- the range of the tuning controls on
>the amp will match an antenna that is not too far off.

Yeah, most amps *do* still have the "tuner" built in, unlike exciters
which have had it removed so you have to buy it separately as an option.

And if you really need a tuner, I'd note that the MFJ "3 kW" tuner
*isn't* really capable of handling 3 kW. It may even give trouble
at 600 watts into difficult loads. And BTW, most people probably
won't notice the 1 S-unit boost that amp will give your signal, but
they may notice the splatter up and down the band.

Now that I've rained on everyone's parade, here's my advice for what
it is worth. Try the lashup without a tuner first. You may not need
one at all. And go ask Tom how to tune up that amp properly so it'll
be as clean as it can be. Everyone else on the band will thank you.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!bunyip.cc.uq.oz.au!news.design.net.au!gateway1.newsnet.brisnet.org.au!usenet
From: [e-mail] (G. North)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HELP WTD: Cophasing two Yagi UHF: Anyone has the calculations, theory and practice?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 04:40:14 GMT
Organization: General Research
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58ipje$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: aufempen.brisnet.org.au
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

Help WTD:Cophasing two Yagi 477 Mhz: Any one has the calculations,
theory and practice.

Hello

I am trying to Co-Phase two yagi 16 elements.

Both yagi are folded dipole (300 ohms each dipole) attached to 660
millimeters of 75 ohm cable RG 59. This N plug goes straight in my 50
ohms antenna socket transceiver.

This allows me to  and finish at 50 ohm.

I am trying to co-phase both Yagi to increase reception by a couple of
dB.

Would anyone knows of a reception pre-amplifier for 477 MHZ. This is
really very similar to 432 MHZ. It behave very much the same.

Please E-mail me directly to: [e-mail]

The matter is for serious application and urgent.

Thanks

Cheers  Guy North



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news1.mnsinc.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Brian Carling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HELP!
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 14:16:09 GMT
Organization: Monumental Network Systems
Lines: 17
Distribution: inet
Message-ID: <57v2lr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: bry.mnsinc.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Sorry to ask such a dumb question here, but can someone tell me how to
delete the MEMORY CACHE in Netscape? I am using 3.0 if that makes any
difference.

I know there is some place that lets you delete the DISK CACHE and MEMORY
CACHE but it sure is hard to find where they put them and the DOCs are
useless! Please e-mail me if you know the answer -thanks, and I apologize
for being off-topic.

Bry
[e-mail]

73 from Bry  (((Amateur Radio G3XLQ / AF4K)))
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry
E-mail:  [e-mail]
Home of MEGALIST ham radio files, SWL info. etc. etc.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Dale Holloway)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HELP!
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 17:55:07 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v2lr$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: roa-va1-25.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 02 11:54:58 AM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/16.299

Bry,

Go to (1) Options, (2) Network Preferences, (3) Cache.

Dale, NJ8X

On Mon, 02 Dec 1996 14:16:09 GMT, [e-mail] (Brian Carling)
wrote:

>Sorry to ask such a dumb question here, but can someone tell me how to
>delete the MEMORY CACHE in Netscape? I am using 3.0 if that makes any
>difference.
>
>I know there is some place that lets you delete the DISK CACHE and MEMORY
>CACHE but it sure is hard to find where they put them and the DOCs are
>useless! Please e-mail me if you know the answer -thanks, and I apologize
>for being off-topic.
>
>Bry
>[e-mail]
>
>73 from Bry  (((Amateur Radio G3XLQ / AF4K)))
>http://www.mnsinc.com/bry
>E-mail:  [e-mail]
>Home of MEGALIST ham radio files, SWL info. etc. etc.
>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!198.80.1.4!interaccess!usenet
From: Bart Dolega <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HELP! IC3220H service manual
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 18:04:20 -0600
Organization: :-)
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: d188.cloud.interaccess.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

I need IC3220H service manual ..
I called ICOM and They want 46$ for it !
I think it's too much !

If U can help me pse e-mail me !

Vy 73! de Bart kb9mla


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!usc!sdd.hp.com!col.hp.com!markf
From: [e-mail] (Mark Foster)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help: 1975/76 Callbook adr
Date: 10 Dec 1996 14:36:07 GMT
Organization: HP Colorado Springs Division
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <58jsgn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tcld143.col.hp.com

Would someone help me with a 1975/76 Callbook address for:

     James ______
     WN4KCQ
     Florence  AL

I certainly would appreciate it!

-Mark
reply to:  [e-mail]  DIRECTLY




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.cntfl.com!usenet
From: Joe Leikhim <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: HELP: Looking for AZ-EL rotator
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 23:58:17 -0500
Organization: CMDS News machine
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdc0c$32ba2980$5a7eabcc@tower>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp070.nettally.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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CC: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43542 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119518 rec.radio.swap:97905

Hey! Clever tag line there Timmy Z!

There is another AZ-EL rotor made by E-Moto. looks much more powerful
and is more expensive than the 5400B. I bought mine used for $425. I
have seen them as low as $350. There is also an elevation only model
that you can use with an existing AZ rotor. The 5400B has an optional
RS232 module that can interface directly. Otherwise, a DIN plug on back
brings out analog voltage cooresponding to position and accepts external
relay closures to run motors. The 5400B is probably your best bet unless
you wish to home brew, that way you can buy some more F.Z CD's with the
money saved and listen to them while soldering your little poots away!


Timothy S. Zibrat wrote:
>
> Is the Yeasu G5400 the only az-el rotator on the market??  I'm looking to
> purchase a rotator, but the 5400 seems very expensive on my tight budget.
> I'm looking to eventually do automated tracking so it would be nice to find
> a rotator with the 0-5V output.  Any help is surely appreciated!
>
> 73,
> tz
>
> --
> ****************************************************
> * [e-mail]   * *   ...no way to delay  *
> * K3TZ                    *    that trouble coming *
> * TRA# 3348               *    everyday... -FZ     *
> * NAR# 64753 level 1     * *                       *
> * AMSAT# 22105            *                        *
> ****************************************************

--
Joe Leikhim
[e-mail]

"tv dinner by the pool,
i'm so glad i finished school" -F.Zappa 1967

"The Revolution will NOT be televised" -Gil Scott Heron



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news2.digex.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Barry Anderson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: HELP: Looking for AZ-EL rotator
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 18:19:21 -0500
Organization: Anderson Desktop Publishing
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdc0c$32ba2980$5a7eabcc@tower>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dcc02685.slip.digex.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43641 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119661 rec.radio.swap:98132

In article <01bbdc0c$32ba2980$5a7eabcc@tower>, [e-mail]
says...
> Is the Yeasu G5400 the only az-el rotator on the market??  I'm looking to
> purchase a rotator, but the 5400 seems very expensive on my tight budget.
> I'm looking to eventually do automated tracking so it would be nice to find
> a rotator with the 0-5V output.  Any help is surely appreciated!
Tim ...

     What I used at my QTH was 2 Alliance antenna rotors, which I got
from individuals for FREE. These rotors are the ones where the pipe can
go entirely through the rotating cuff. I mounted one vertically with an
"L" shaped pipe in it, and mounted the other, mounted horizontally on the
horizontal section of the "L", with  a pipe exending horizontally through
it to mount my antennae on. I calibrated the horizontal rotors scale in
degrees elevation. The whole thing was mounted on a 6' tripod I
constructed of pipe from a junk yard. Total cost for me was about $10 and
I've been using it for 14 years.
--
Barry Anderson K3SUI
Frederick, MD. 21702
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsfeeder.servtech.com!post.servtech.com!news
From: N2KBK <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help??fuel pump noise in radio
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 01:00:48 -0800
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cb1.bgm.servtech.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I; 16bit)

hello . I have a nissan pathfinder and an icom ic-706.i am getting alot
of pump noise about s7 most times. It affects me on all bands 160-2m.Is
there a GOOD filter that i can put on the wires that go to the fuel
pump.i have a filter on the power leads to the radio.

                                        thanks chris N2KBK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HF net listings on the Web???
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 06:28:02 GMT
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 5
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <58ivem$2et$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp6.respool1.medina.ohio.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Does anyone know of a website that has a listing of HF nets. I have
not been able to find any good sources.

73 de KC8BQP - Sam



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: AC6V <"ac6v@ac6v"@popd.ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HF net listings on the Web???
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 07:18:14 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58jutg$[e-mail]>
References: <58ivem$2et$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: "ac6v@ac6v"@popd.ix.netcom.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: esc-ca3-01.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 10  9:17:04 AM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)
To: "Samuel R. DiSalvo" <[e-mail]>

Samuel R. DiSalvo wrote:
>
> Does anyone know of a website that has a listing of HF nets. I have
> not been able to find any good sources.
>
> 73 de KC8BQP - Sam


Hi Sam I have found some HF Nets on the WWW. Take a look at the
clickable "On The Bands" in the DX Reference Guide below:
--
AC6V DX Reference Page at:  http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html


73 Rod in San Diego
Hark for I have hurled my words to the far reaches of the earth!
What King of old could do thus??
..... AC6V


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!newshost.convex.com!bcm.tmc.edu!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!cyberstation.net!news.walltech.com!hsnx.wco.com!news.west.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: History of this Call
Date: 5 Dec 1996 17:43:03 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5871j7$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: term1-18.simi.west.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:rec.radio.amateur.misc

I would like to know if my new callsign was issued previously &, if it
was, the info about it. The call is K5VP.

Thanks,

KP




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mel.aone.net.au!news.nlc.net.au!news
From: "Spiro Evagelakos" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.scanner,rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Hlp:YAESU Transceiver FT-101Z
Date: 10 Dec 1996 09:16:12 GMT
Organization: NHJ NORTHLINK COMMUNICATIONS
Lines: 14
Distribution: aus
Message-ID: <01bbe67a$b8876460$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialine17.nlc.net.au
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
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X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1617 aus.radio.scanner:194 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44055 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21933 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120255 rec.radio.scanner:72864

Hi,
My 20 watt transceiver has a burned out transformer . To purchase one new
it will cost me quite a few dollars.
Is there anyone in the Sydney area that could fix it for me......or is
willing to sell me a second hand cheap unit (as spares).

Please mail me at

[e-mail]

Thanks in advance
--




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!info.ucla.edu!news.bc.net!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.agtac.net!news.cadvision.com!usenet
From: Allan Dobler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: How to tune Duplexors and Multi-couplers?
Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 21:16:16 -0800
Organization: CADVision Development Corp.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: (▓n <57se5s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: agte163.cadvision.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)
To: Tedd Doda <[e-mail]>

Tedd Doda wrote:
>
> Greetings:
>
> Would anyone have any suggestions on good reading material on how
> to tune Multi-couplers and repeater Duplexors? I'm just starting this
> interesting field (with the help of an IFR 1500), and am having problems
> on getting any kind of information.
>
> Any help would be appriciated!
>
> 73, de Tedd Doda, CET
>
> packet va3sed@va3sed ******* Running FBB  under Warp Connect!
> e-mail [e-mail]** Running the IAK in Warp Connect!
> [Team OS/2 in Canada]

Some of the best tech info I have found, is in the catalogs from
Sinclair and the like.
--
73

Allan

VE6AQK@VE6YYC.#SAB.AB.CA

[e-mail]


You should always be aware that statistics can be manipulated...
84% of people already know that!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.net66.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-8.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.0.65.182!news-in.tiac.net!posterchild!spock
From: [e-mail] (Scott Babb)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: How Would You Set Up A Cheap Station?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 96 03:41:03 GMT
Organization: Littlefield Publishing Group
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <58aou3$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: p16.ts2.nashu.nh.tiac.com
Keywords: equipment, hf, vhf, cheap
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2

People tell me that it takes a small fortune to get started in our hobby.
I'm looking for solid ways to rebut this.

How would you build a cheap station?  I'll take suggestions on anything:
transceivers, power supplies, amplifiers, receivers, transmitters, antennas,
ground system, antenna supports, station layout, homebrew, whatever.

Thanks de wa1vht
(who remembers starting out cheap as wn1vht with a HQ-110 and a Ranger)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!admaix.sunydutchess.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!dsinc!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steven Umbach)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: How Would You Set Up A Cheap Station?
Date: 8 Dec 1996 01:29:18 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 6
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <58d5le$[e-mail]>
References: <58aou3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap7-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

   I have seen lots of nice Kenwood 520S in the $275 range or Drake TR4C
for as little as $175. Then one could get a used Hustler multiband
vertical for around $30 - $50 with coax. I have talked to lots of hams
who have a setup like this who have very nice signals and good audio for
less money than the price of a fancy new HT! Good luck.  --- Steve N9ROU



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!usenet
From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: How Would You Set Up A Cheap Station?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 21:23:19 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58aou3$[e-mail]> <58d5le$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dtburr.pr.mcs.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

Steven Umbach wrote:
>
>    I have seen lots of nice Kenwood 520S in the $275 range or Drake TR4C
> for as little as $175. Then one could get a used Hustler multiband
> vertical for around $30 - $50 with coax. I have talked to lots of hams
> who have a setup like this who have very nice signals and good audio for
> less money than the price of a fancy new HT! Good luck.  --- Steve N9ROU

Steve is right. Either of these rigs would be great choices for a first
station. I've owned both in my ham career. Don't even bother with the
vertical...put up a dipole and you'll do even better!

Anyone that says that you MUST spend a bunch more on a radio is wrong.
Yeah, a bunch of us spend more, but it's just because at this particular
time we can afford it and like bells and whistles. The real difference
in performance is 1) antenna, and 2) maybe a little power. I started
with a $150 station like a lot of guys.

Get yourself a TR4C, a TS-520 or similar and throw a dipole as high as
possible and you'll be right in the ballgame,ready to have fun.

Dave K9XK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.194.12.17!news2.ixa.net!ixa.net!news.aa.net!ratty.wolfe.net!usenet
From: "J. Andy Thompson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: How Would You Set Up A Cheap Station?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 22:18:25 -0800
Organization: Thompson Realtors
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58aou3$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: yak2-ts1-p33.wolfenet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)

Scott Babb wrote:
>
> People tell me that it takes a small fortune to get started in our hobby.
> I'm looking for solid ways to rebut this.
>
> How would you build a cheap station?  I'll take suggestions on anything:
> transceivers, power supplies, amplifiers, receivers, transmitters, antennas,
> ground system, antenna supports, station layout, homebrew, whatever.
>
> Thanks de wa1vht
> (who remembers starting out cheap as wn1vht with a HQ-110 and a Ranger)


I started out March, 1956 as WN7CXA with a Heathkit AT-1, (29.50) and a
Hallicrafters S-38D (49.95).  Oh yeah, and a J-38 key. (1.98)

i STILL have them!

Andy W7CXA


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:58 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: How Would You Set Up A Cheap Station?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Keywords: equipment, hf, vhf, cheap
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <58aou3$[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 07:49:22 GMT
Lines: 60

In article <58aou3$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>People tell me that it takes a small fortune to get started in our hobby.
>I'm looking for solid ways to rebut this.
>
>How would you build a cheap station?  I'll take suggestions on anything:
>transceivers, power supplies, amplifiers, receivers, transmitters, antennas,
>ground system, antenna supports, station layout, homebrew, whatever.

Well, back when I was a pup, Haliburton Well Services was updating
the two way radios in their fleet of oil field service trucks to
40Ds and donated their old radios to our local ham club. For the
price of a few gallons of degreaser and a pair of crystals, I had
a mighty Motorola 5V riding in my trunk crystaled for the first
2m repeater in Kentucky.

A few months ago, the TV station finished converting from 2 way radios
to cellphones, and I got 5 110 watt UHF GE Mastr IIs dumped in my lap.
They went to good homes for free too.

Now everyone isn't going to be so lucky as to have free radios dumped
in their laps, but commercial 2 way radios are plentiful on the surplus
market. And they're very cheap, usually under $50. Add $20 for crystals,
a buck or two for the parts to make a 1/4-wave antenna, and you're in
business with a radio that's much better than anything made by the
amateur manufacturers.

Now it is a wee bit harder to find surplus gear that works down near
DC, but I did pick up a couple of 1 kW SSB rigs at the Eastern Airlines
bankruptcy sale for $20 each. Fortunately I was able to borrow a forklift
to get them in the truck. Nice big CCS linears, but the transceivers
weren't much to write home about (12 fixed channels). I sold the
transceivers for $25 each, so now I've got two nice big linears and
$10 in my pocket. Not bad.

While they had the forklift out, they twisted my arm and made me
take two 1 kW plate modulated VHF AM transmitters too. I don't know
exactly what I'm going to do with them, but they should make dandy
Class C 2m FM amps. :-)

I've still got those 8 PE HTs sitting over there in the gang charger
that I got for $15 *total*. One of these days I might buy some crystals
to put them in the ham band.

And then there was the chain of stereo shops who went bust. I
bought 30 Astron 20 amp power supplies (used to run their auto
radio displays) from them for $300 total. Those all sold in a
couple of hours to the local hams for $20 a pop after I put the
word out on the repeater during the drive home. (Hey, making
$150 an hour ain't bad.)

There's no lack of cheap equipment available, as long as you don't
insist it be made in Japan, be 2/3 Gameboy, 1/3 scanner, and almost
useless as a 2 way radio.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:21:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-12.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: How Would You Set Up A Cheap Station?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:31:27 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58aou3$[e-mail]> <58d5le$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: camoore-desk.ch.intel.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)

Dave Burr wrote:
> Get yourself a TR4C, a TS-520 or similar and throw a dipole as high as
> possible and you'll be right in the ballgame,ready to have fun.

Or get an old TV and ask Jeff in Hawaii how to modify it into a free
ham station. It definitely can be done. W5OLV (SK) gave me enough stuff
from the junkbox at his radio/TV repair store to get me on the air for
absolutely zero cost in 1952 and I only lacked a couple of states for
WAS one year later, all done at one frequency on 40m.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gene G.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HTX202 External Power
Date: 3 Dec 1996 04:17:25 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5809kl$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga11-12.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 02  8:17:25 PM PST 1996

I'm newly licensed and bought an HTX202 as a first Radio. I want to use
AC power when indoors. Is a 12 volt AC adapter sufficient or for an
extra $20 should I spring for a regulated 13.8V power supply. Both of
These are possibilities according to the manual. Also, what is a good
outside 2 meter antenna, or should I just make one?
Advice and opinions appreciated.
73
Gene Gach (KF4NOG)Lilburn, GA


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:02 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.254.2.53!nonexistent.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Mark S. Bond)
Subject: Re: HTX202 External Power
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.4
X-Nntp-Posting-User: (Unauthenticated)
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5809kl$[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Trace: 849620278/12639
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: i123.196.world2u.com
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 1996 13:39:32 GMT
Lines: 27

In article <5809kl$[e-mail]>, [e-mail](Gene G.)
wrote:

> I'm newly licensed and bought an HTX202 as a first Radio. I want to use
> AC power when indoors. Is a 12 volt AC adapter sufficient or for an
> extra $20 should I spring for a regulated 13.8V power supply. Both of
> These are possibilities according to the manual. Also, what is a good
> outside 2 meter antenna, or should I just make one?

Gene, I'd opt for the power supply. Consider one with 20amp or greater
capacity. You might need the extra capacity down the road. There are a
multitude of commercially made 2 meter antennas available. The majority of
which I feel cost much more than they are worth. I'd suggest putting the
money you save by making your own antenna towards the power supply. A
J-Pole seems to work quite well. QST described how to build one using PVC
pipe a year or so ago. You might want to look up the article.

Welcome to Ham Radio, 73 de Mark

--
   .-.                                                         .-.
  /   \           .-.                           .-.           /   \
 /     \         /   \       .-.     .-.       /   \         /     \
/------Mark S. Bond  W2MB---/---\---/---\-----/[e-mail]-\
         \     /       \   /     `-'     \   /       \     /
          \   /         `-'               `-'         \   /
           `-'                                         `-'


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: I'm better than Burt!
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 02:32:06 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga32-03.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 09  8:33:09 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201

Hey Burt,

I started two threads that are making folks think and exchange ideas
(and a few epithets as well HI HI). I haven't taken too many flames
either! I won't have to repost the articles that started the threads,
these threads will run through WARC-99 at least! I bet you wish you
could do the same.

73 and happy holidays to you and all the others in our great although
sometimes disfunctional fraternity with special regards for our
guamese friends...:)

de n4jvp
Fritz


To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Michael Ward)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: IC32at parts and accessories wanted
Date: 8 Dec 1996 20:31:38 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 21
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <58f8ja$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap4-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

SUBJECT: ICOM IC32at parts and accessories wanted

I recently bought an IC32at and just got the bare radio and antenna. I am
interested in finding a belt clip, wrist strap, soft case, or any other
accessories you might have for this radio.

I would also like to get an original manual/box/packaging or other stuff
for this model.

Please email me at [e-mail] with any information you might
have.

Thanks.



-
  Mike Ward - WD4SGU  -  [e-mail]





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.he.net!news.qnet.com!usenet
From: "Will, KN6DV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ICOM 706 and amplifier switching
Date: 3 Dec 1996 01:47:48 GMT
Organization: KN6DV
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <01bbe0bb$f9a3fa40$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lanc02-00.ca.qnet.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Thanks for reading this.
I have a Icom 775-DSP and a ICOM 706 and both have the same acc. socket
with pin 3 as switch to control a amplifier.
I need some sort of a interface disign to switch the amp.
(the input current is less than 20mA on pin3)
Thanks 73 Will,  KN6DV
[e-mail]
--
http://www.av.qnet.com/~kn6dv

REFORM
Unless the reformer can invent something which substisutes attractive
virtues for atractive vices, he will fail.
(Walter Lippmann)



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.cmc.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Gary Fiber)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM 706 and amplifier switching
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 03:49:13 GMT
Organization: Chambers Multimedia Connection
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <582sf1$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0bb$f9a3fa40$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm2-2.edmonds.cmc.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Will, KN6DV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Thanks for reading this.
>I have a Icom 775-DSP and a ICOM 706 and both have the same acc. socket
>with pin 3 as switch to control a amplifier.
>I need some sort of a interface disign to switch the amp.
>(the input current is less than 20mA on pin3)
>Thanks 73 Will,  KN6DV
>[e-mail]
>--
>http://www.av.qnet.com/~kn6dv

>REFORM
>Unless the reformer can invent something which substisutes attractive
>virtues for atractive vices, he will fail.
>(Walter Lippmann)

MFJ has a nice switch ARB-700 sells for $ 29.95.  It was designed for switchin
g
external amplifiers with the IC-706 in mind.

Gary



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!wits.uni.net.za!ru.uni.net.za!uct.uni.net.za!iafrica.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Gustav Kⁿhn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ICOM 706 mods.
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 96 18:42:16 GMT
Organization: Private
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 196-7-124-194.iafrica.com
X-Newsreader: Quarterdeck Message Center [2.00]

Hi all fellow Hams and "i can improve the design" ers
I would like to know if much has been done to improve the pathetic sensitivity
 of
this rig above 110Mhz (2m is ok). I had a look at the service manual and it
appears that the so called "yellow wire" mod only results in the 2 m filter be
ing
connected in parallel with the other 60 to 200(ha ha ) Mhz filter.
I have seen some work done by Gary Coffman and also modelled this filter using

Puff and that gave me the same results as Gary's. The mods to this filter he
suggests also models the same, but I'm not brave enough to start fiddling in t
he
rig yet.
Regards,
Gustav Kⁿhn ZS1NZ



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!EU.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.157.12.253!oxy.rust.net!not-for-mail
From: "Bill Crocker" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM R-8500
Date: 2 Dec 1996 04:26:03 GMT
Organization: Rust Net - High Speed Internet in Detroit  810-642-2276
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <01bbe011$2e4e2640$8e50c7cd@billc>
References: <[e-mail]> <57rpog$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mh-42.rust.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Jim:

I believe it is still legal for a user to modify his equipment...just not a
dealer or repair shop.

Bill Crocker

Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57rpog$[e-mail]>...
> [e-mail] wrote:
>
> >I JUST PURCHASED AN ICOM R8500 RECEIVER AND WAS WONDERING IF ANYONE HAS
> >THE MOD TO OPEN UP THE 800. YOUR HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED. THKS.
>
> No. That's illegal. Sorry, we can't help you with that.
>
> 73,  Jim KH2D
>
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM R-8500
Date: 5 Dec 1996 19:12:41 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <01bbe2df$6c4b9e20$697174cf@default>
References: <[e-mail]> <57rpog$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.105
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

If you are an authorized commercial business, or employed with a government
agency, you can obtain that information from Icom America Service Dept.,
Bellevue, Washington.

Yes the radio can receive now blocked 800 Mhz freq's.


Mike Klein
KB2TIU


Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57rpog$[e-mail]>...
> [e-mail] wrote:
>
> >I JUST PURCHASED AN ICOM R8500 RECEIVER AND WAS WONDERING IF ANYONE HAS
> >THE MOD TO OPEN UP THE 800. YOUR HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED. THKS.
>
> No. That's illegal. Sorry, we can't help you with that.
>
> 73,  Jim KH2D
>
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!compuserve.com!news.production.compuserve.com!news
From: Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM R-8500
Date: 5 Dec 1996 06:05:57 GMT
Organization: CompuServe, Inc. (1-800-689-0736)
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <585oo5$ii3$[e-mail]>

 >>> still legal for a user to unblock cellular reception...

Actually, the idea of buying a "general coverage" receiver that has
been deliberately crippled ticks me off so much that I asked Icom
exactly what the law was on this. They referred me to a paragraph
of the CFR, which referred me to a paragraph of the US Code, which
says that if you "manufacture, assemble, possess, or sell any electronic,
    mechanical, or other device, knowing or having reason to know that
    the design of such device renders it primarily useful for the
    purpose of the surreptitious interception of wire, oral, or
    electronic communications, and that such device or any component
    thereof has been or will be sent through the mail or transported in
    interstate or foreign commerce," then you can be fined or imprisoned
or both. So modify your radio at will, just do it with homemade parts
and never sell it out of state.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:09 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!hookup!visi.com!mr.net!news.idt.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!source
From: [e-mail] (David Harmon)
Subject: Re: ICOM R-8500
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
References: <585oo5$ii3$[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 20:24:06 GMT
Lines: 12
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <585oo5$ii3$[e-mail]>,
Peter Coffee AC6EN  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Actually, the idea of buying a "general coverage" receiver that has
>been deliberately crippled ticks me off so much that I asked Icom

I figure Icom and others are running a hell of a scam here.  They get
this law passed, then they sell two versions of the receiver.  They still
have to be very competetive on the price of the regular "civilian" model
that's availible everywhere, but the sky's the limit on the "government"
model.  Anybody know what the price differential turns out to be?  I'll
bet very few government agencies ever buy the blocked model, even if they
are never going to use the 800 Mhz band.  Your tax money at work.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!hunter.premier.net!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: 3 Dec 1996 03:24:13 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <01bbe0c8$a5534740$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Listen man,
                Don't get offended by the dick heads on this news page.

Your right, those other guys who made fun of you are losers.

1 <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>...
> Evan Platt and others started a thread, let me tie the knot.
>
>
>
> First Count:   Puerto Ricans CAN VOTE.
>
> Second Count: I never said Puerto Rico was a state, only that they have
> every benefit
>                       as a state.
>
> Third Count: What field is Evan Platt in?  Post it here and I send you
> $50.00.
>
> Fourth Count: Since all you Flag holders believe some much in what it
> means, what
>                about Freedom of expression and beliefs.  Since the United
States
>                      lends practically every country in the world money,
> hell they might as
>                      well all be states. How about a Flag with 500 stars
on
> it?  Think of the
>                      tax ratables?
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:29:40 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Evan Platt and others started a thread, let me tie the knot.



First Count:   Puerto Ricans CAN VOTE.

Second Count: I never said Puerto Rico was a state, only that they have
every benefit
                      as a state.

Third Count: What field is Evan Platt in?  Post it here and I send you
$50.00.

Fourth Count: Since all you Flag holders believe some much in what it
means, what
                 about Freedom of expression and beliefs.  Since the United States
                     lends practically every country in the world money,
hell they might as
                     well all be states. How about a Flag with 500 stars on
it?  Think of the
                     tax ratables?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!news.he.net!flesh.fly.net!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 96 02:26:47 EST
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: [e-mail] (Diogenes)
Comments: This message did not originate from the address above.  It was remailed by an anonymous remailing service.  If you have questions or complaints, please direct them to <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.stupidity,alt.flame,alt.usenet.kooks
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default> <01bbe0c8$a5534740$8a7074cf@default>
Mail-To-News-Contact: [e-mail]
Organization: [e-mail]
Lines: 31
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119514 alt.stupidity:86434 alt.flame:351182 alt.usenet.kooks:53572

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Listen man,
>                Don't get offended by the dick heads on this news page.
>
> Your right, those other guys who made fun of you are losers.

Cute!  (Changing your return address from

    "1" <[e-mail]>

to

    "1" <[e-mail]>

so that you would APPEAR to be someone else.)  You forgot to change
the host-id in your message ID, though.  The "@default" sticks out
like a sore thumb.  So in addition to a woeful ignorance of
geography and an antisocial demeanor, you also have schizophrenia?
How many separate personalities can you manifest in order to
outnumber your "critics"?

Yep, let's keep 20m available for people like you (who believe the
USA has 51 states!) to call people "dick heads".  Now hurry up or
you'll be late for your "Flat Earth Society" meeting...

BTW, even if service is "AVAILABLE IN ALL 51 STATES", do they work
on YOUR PLANET?  Next time you're conversing with hams on earth,
find out how many of them needed contacts "IN ALL 51 STATES" to
qualify for their W.A.S. (Worked All States) certificate.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:02:38 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <581iqv$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Evan Platt and others started a thread, let me tie the knot.

No, you started it with your rediculous beeper add.  Remember, the one
about all 51 states ?

>First Count:   Puerto Ricans CAN VOTE.

So can people in Bosnia. Does that mean we have 52 states ?

>Second Count: I never said Puerto Rico was a state, only that they have
>every benefit as a state.

Short term memory loss, huh ?

>Third Count: What field is Evan Platt in?  Post it here and I send you
>$50.00.

I have no idea what field Evan Platt is in.  Ask Evan Platt.  But if someone a
sk
me what field you are in, I would have to say Left.  How about I send you $ 51
to stop posting here.

>Fourth Count: Since all you Flag holders believe some much in what it
>means, what
>                about Freedom of expression and beliefs.  Since the United States
>                     lends practically every country in the world money,
>hell they might as
>                     well all be states. How about a Flag with 500 stars on
>it?  Think of the
>                     tax ratables?

Maybe the air polution in New Jersey is starting to affect your thought proces
s.
And it also looks as if you TAB key isn't working too well either.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:26:17 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <581k7a$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default> <01bbe0c8$a5534740$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Listen man,
>                Don't get offended by the dick heads on this news page.

>Your right, those other guys who made fun of you are losers.


Do you beep yourself too, One, or do you just reply to your own messages ?




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.eznet.net!node2.frontiernet.net!mulveyr
From: [e-mail] (Rich & Katy Mulvey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: 4 Dec 1996 12:55:51 GMT
Organization: Mulvey Home Node
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default> <01bbe0c8$a5534740$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr7-206.dial.roc.frontiernet.net
X-Newsreader: slrn (0.8.8.4 (BETA) UNIX)

On 3 Dec 1996 03:24:13 GMT, [e-mail] <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Listen man,
>                Don't get offended by the dick heads on this news page.
>
>Your right, those other guys who made fun of you are losers.
>
>1 <[e-mail]> wrote in article
><01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>...


Just out of curiousity - do you often respond to your own posts with a
forged ReplyTo address?  Or are you just to embarassed to admit that nobody
supports you?

- Rich

--
Rich Mulvey
[e-mail]                                  Rochester, NY USA
http://www.frontiernet.net/~mulveyr
Amateur Radio: [e-mail], aa2ys@wb2wxq.#wny.ny.usa





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 03:23:19 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans44.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Evan Platt and others started a thread, let me tie the knot.

Find a woman to tie the knot with, we are not interested.

>First Count:   Puerto Ricans CAN VOTE.

AAAAAAND? You have a point to the above?

>Second Count: I never said Puerto Rico was a state, only that they have
>every benefit as a state.

If you are going to lie, cover your ass. You DID say Puerto rico was a
state:

SERVICE AVAILABLE IN ALL 51 STATES INCLUDING ALASKA, HAWAII, PUERTO
RICO, THE VIRGIN ISLANDS, AND THE BAHAMAS. LIMITED AVAIL. IN CANADA.
EMAIL FOR DETAILS.

Ok, either Alaska Hawaii, or Canada.. But you did say there were 51
states. Nice try.

>Third Count: What field is Evan Platt in?  Post it here and I send you
>$50.00.

Send me $50.00. I am a public safety photographer and communications
specialist. I have photographed breaking news events for major
newspapers throughout California, and have also done presidential
coverage before. You specialize in US Government, I presume?

>Fourth Count: Since all you Flag holders believe some much in what it
>means, what about Freedom of expression and beliefs.  Since the United States
>                     lends practically every country in the world money,
>hell they might as well all be states. How about a Flag with 500 stars on
>it?  Think of the tax ratables?

Sheet, if you ran for presidency, we'd be in DEEEP doo-doo.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!208.195.156.10!news.walltech.com!hsnx.wco.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 20:58:49 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 55
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default> <01bbe0c8$a5534740$8a7074cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans31.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

If you are going to play mr. skizo, change your headers from
"1@...com", and change the organization (or lack thereof) on your
header, and Message ID from @default. But your NNTP-Posting-Host will
stay with you always.
hehe, replying to his own messages. wow..

Path:
news.wco.com!hsnx.wco.com!miwok!news1.best.com!noos.hooked.net!news.clark.net!
news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-2.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.spr
intlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!new
sfeed.internetmci.com!hunter.premier.net!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: 3 Dec 1996 03:24:13 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <01bbe0c8$a5534740$8a7074cf@default>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.112.138
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Listen man,
>                Don't get offended by the dick heads on this news page.
>
>Your right, those other guys who made fun of you are losers.
>
>1 <[e-mail]> wrote in article
><01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default>...
>> Evan Platt and others started a thread, let me tie the knot.
>>
>>
>>
>> First Count:   Puerto Ricans CAN VOTE.
>>
>> Second Count: I never said Puerto Rico was a state, only that they have
>> every benefit
>>                       as a state.
>>
>> Third Count: What field is Evan Platt in?  Post it here and I send you
>> $50.00.
>>
>> Fourth Count: Since all you Flag holders believe some much in what it
>> means, what
>>               about Freedom of expression and beliefs.  Since the United
>States
>>                      lends practically every country in the world money,
>> hell they might as
>>                      well all be states. How about a Flag with 500 stars
>on
>> it?  Think of the
>>                      tax ratables?
>>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]--- (R. A. Green)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IGNORANCE- STOP AND THINK
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 19:42:45 GMT
Organization: .
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe0c1$06c05ac0$8a7074cf@default> <01bbe0c8$a5534740$8a7074cf@default> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-2-170.sntc01.pacbell.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299
X-No-Archive: yes

Hey...I recommend you tell him what field you're in and collect that
$50!

--ron


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!ts191.vcr.wis.net!les
From: [e-mail] (les)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Info requested on bytek S10 eprom prog. burner
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 22:18:43
Organization: Online at Wimsey
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts191.vcr.wis.net
Keywords: eprom
X-Newsreader: Trumpet for Windows [Version 1.0 Rev A]

Can anyone help me out there who may also have a bytek s10 eprom burner.
Bytek, doesnt seem any longer to have info on how and what this eprom
programmer does.

If anyone can help, please email [e-mail].

tnx
les


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.ime.net!not-for-mail
From: "The Paquette's" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Intermod and my IC-2000 ?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 22:14:42 GMT
Organization: Otta be Clean
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <01bbe6e7$636ad440$27816ace@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: saco-30.ime.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Hi all,
Was wondering if there was anyone out there that could help me?  I have
a Icom IC-2000 ser # : 17156,  I purchased it about a year ago for packet.
I haven't used it for packet because of intermod.  So, I decided to use
it as a base rig.  I wasn't on 2 Mtr voice often till recently and now
find the intermod is extremely tiring to listen to and I feel it
may be a design flaw.  (I'm told that the earlier models of the 2000 had
this problem.)
  The way it's connected is, through a Diamond duplexer to a Diamond 510. I
originally used a Kenwood with this same configuration and had NO intermod!
This Intermod forced me to use the kenwood for packet.  Now if I remove the
2000 and replace it with the kenwood, I get no intermod.
(Ya ya ya!  put the kenwood back,  well all fine and good, but now the
 problem is with my packet station which I use often.)

 One might be asking, how close are you to a commercial xmitter?  Well as
the crow flies, approx. 1 to 1 1/2  miles.

Well, thanks in advance for any assistance,
Dave ( KA1JWM )


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!van-bc!news.rmii.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: J.Mackey posting anonymously again (was: Closed Repeaters)
Date: 6 Dec 1996 17:46:26 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <589m5i$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, Blaster  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Hey Bradley,
>Just ignore Jeffery Herman, he is an idiot & a fool.


How do I know "Blaster" is John ``I operate about 5 repeaters'' Mackey?
Easy! The header of this "anonyomous" article contains exactly the same
data as in the headers of his usual stuff, including the big give-away:
"NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw" (but excluding the phoney comm.net
address he's snuck in there this time). Let's take a closer look:

-------------------Begin Mackey's anonymous post-----------------------
From [e-mail] Thu Dec  5 19:20:24 HST 1996
Article: 113628 of rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news.Hawaii.Edu!news.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader
.seed.net.tw!news
From: Blaster <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 12:23:33 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Hey Bradley,
Just ignore Jeffery Herman, he is an idiot & a fool.
----------------------end-----------------------------------------

The above header is identical to his usual headers, he has a history
of posting anonymously, he loves to call people a "fool", and no one
else on here has ksts.seed.net.tw as a posting host. I rest my case.

(Hey John, before you were even licensed I took a Heath HW-202 (old
2m xtal rig) and made it into a rptr - it was a bit crude but it
worked. Really easy. I guess that makes me a "repeater operator" too,
just like you!)

Jeff KH2PZ



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!paladin.american.edu!hookup!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Japanese callbook on line?
Date: 4 Dec 1996 05:11:27 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58315v$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57q59h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Yes. telnet to   fj.#&R=BU*+}!#XB~H.jp  and you'll be hooked up.


In article <[e-mail]>, Sandy Lynch <[e-mail]> wrote:
>It IS true that >90% of all Japanese amateur radio licensees are of
>the "no-code" (with HF privileges) type.

Output restricted to 10W. Not much of a privilege. Less than what our
CB'ers running SSB are allowed.

Jeff KH2PZ




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:25 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Japanese callbook on line?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57q59h$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 13:56:31 GMT
Lines: 22

In article <57q59h$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (M
ichael P. Deignan) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, Sandy Lynch <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>The hardcopy "callbooks" in Japan, as far as I recall, list ONLY those
>>stations that are members of the Japan Amateur Radio League (JARL).
>>There are over one million operator licenses issued - and about 500,000
>>station licenses. The JARL membership is somewhere on the order of
>>135,000.
>
>Good thing too, considering that Japan refers to their "CB radio"
>license as an "amateur radio" license.

Really? As far as I know, they call their CB radio license a CB
radio license, and there are over 10 million of them.

Gary

--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:26 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!news.he.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Japanese callbook on line?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57q59h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58315v$[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 01:48:09 GMT
Lines: 19

In article <58315v$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:
>In article <[e-mail]>, Sandy Lynch <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>It IS true that >90% of all Japanese amateur radio licensees are of
>>the "no-code" (with HF privileges) type.
>
>Output restricted to 10W. Not much of a privilege. Less than what our
>CB'ers running SSB are allowed.
>
>Jeff KH2PZ

Ah, this happy thought needs to be reposted to QRP-L.

Gary

--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:27 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 15:01:52 GMT
Lines: 22
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (John G. Kammlad
e) writes:
>>Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
>>RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
>
>Is this a real company?

You bet they are. Their foundation was one of the great services to
private and sport pilots in the last couple decades. They build
reasonably-priced avionic equipment for use in private aviation.

Until they (and another company, Terra) were around, private pilots
had to buy radio gear from companies who seemed to conspire to keep
prices stratospheric.

I mean, how about $4000 for a 30-watt, frequcncy-synthesized AM transceiver
(albeit with a dual receiver deck) which was, in practice, less reliable
than a lot of $100 CB radios?

RST did what the said couldn't be done.

Greg



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!198.68.62.43!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 18:57:32 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <57v8uk$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rst-engr.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Greg Bullough) shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->>>RST Engineering

->>Is this a real company?

->You bet they are. Their foundation was one of the great services to
->private and sport pilots in the last couple decades. They build
->reasonably-priced avionic equipment for use in private aviation.
->RST did what they said couldn't be done.

Gawrsh *blush* thank you.  We actually chose the company initials from my
old CW days on 40 meters and then named the company Radio Systems
Technology and nicknamed it RST.  When Radio... wouldn't fit on anybody's
computer, we renamed it RST Engineering which also reflected the emphasis
on "engineering" and a downplay of "radio" since we were more into audio
switching and intercomery.  When we bring out the new 760 channel next
year, we'll have to think about going back to the old name...   {:-)

Jim

Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-5.sprintlink.net!voskovec.radio.cz!news.apfel.de!nntp.zit.th-darmstadt.de!fu-berlin.de!news.belwue.de!swidir.switch.ch!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!198.68.62.43!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 18:57:11 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <57v8tv$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rst-engr.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (John G. Kammlade) shared these priceless pearls of
wisdom:

->You failed to mention an alternative organization. Is there one?

I thought I made it fairly clear that there was not.  If there was, I would
have done a comparison rather than a lamentation.  I also would not have
mentioned that Greene has failed to produce what he has promised for lo
these many years -- an alternative organization.


->Is this a real company?

Has been for 25 years.  Where the hell have YOU been?



->^^^^^^Oh come on surely you aren't bragging...Are you??--^^^^^^^^

I'm getting a little tired of having a battle of wits with an unarmed
man...

Jim

Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!198.68.62.43!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 01:16:22 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <57vv52$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rst-engr.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) shared these priceless pearls of
wisdom:

->The ARRL has serious leadership problems, and because of the ARRL's
->power and influence, that means amateur radio has serious leadership
->problems. Again, you can't change that from the outside. If you care,
->you have to get inside and fight to make things better.

Gary --

I am a member of TWO hobby/professions, an engineer who is a ham, and a
professional pilot who is into the homebuilt airplane field.  I thought I
could change one of the alphabet soup airplane groups for the better by
getting inside and fighting for what I thought was change for the better.
What I got for my trouble was a figurative bloody nose of the first
magnitude and second order.

The insiders of any of these groups have a strangle hold on the sources of
power, whether by a bank of proxy votes that can be used at opportune times
or by other methods of rigging the elections to make it seem like an
outsider really has a chance.  My opinion, jaded though it may be, is that
the only chance that an outsider has to change an entrenched power group is
by forming a rival organization.

I refer you to the good old days of AFL and NFL football.  The stodgy old
NFL "three yards and a cloud of dust" style of play was totally taken by
surprise by the AFL with their razzledazzle offenses, to the point where
the merger of the two leagues was inevitable.  I also refer you to the five
or six abortive attempts by underfunded organizations to "take on" the NFL
prior to the well-organized, well-funded AFL success.  Victory don't come
cheap OR easy.

Given my understanding of how the system is stacked against ANY serious
threat from the outside, or from an outsider becoming an insider without
losing the very core of why (s)he wanted to effect the change in the first
place, I'm loath to believe that anything can be done UNLESS it is a
charismatically-led and Rockefeller-funded rival organization.

Jim

Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.245.3.50!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: Bob Doyle <[e-mail]-FOR-EMAIL>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 2 Dec 1996 21:03:06 -0700
Organization: Primenet Services for the Internet
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]-FOR-EMAIL>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]>
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.53 (doyle)
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i486)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Jim Weir wrote:

[much snipped]

My feelings exactly... except about the piffing part.  I haven't
been a member in years because I'm not benevolent enought to send
them hard-earned cash in return for what I get -- which isn't much.
I'd be happy to support an alternative, if anybody is keeping a list.

Bob.
WA3TGF


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:32 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 00:38:30 GMT
Lines: 43
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary
Coffman) writes:
>In article <57sii3$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>2.  League publications are stodgy, poorly edited, and in some cases,
>>technically incorrect.  Yes, I've got a Handbook in my library, and I think
>>I used it once last year to look up some pilot lamp data.  I also note that
>>roughly 75% of any given QST is given up to contesting/awards listings,
>>ads, and other league administrative trivia.  The articles that appear are
>>by and large of the "How to use a twin triode as your AM AGC amplifier"
>>variety.
>>
>>I'll give you that in the last five years, there has been an excellent
>>series on DSP and a couple of decent antenna articles.  These exceptions do
>>not convince me to part with my money for literal pounds of paper to the
>>recycle bin.  I've written for Greene.  I've written for the League.
>>Between the two of them, if editorial competence was gunpowder, they
>>wouldn't have enough to blow each other's nose.
>
>Hmmph, that sounds a lot like me talking. I'm also very dissatisfied
>with the content, quality, and editorial direction of QST. But as long
>as people like you stay outside, they're going to produce articles for
>those who are members, IE their core contester and Dxer audience, and
>leave any scraps of technical meat to QEX and Communications Quarterly.
>(Neither of which have been very good lately either.)

Huzzah! I remember when I used to stand by the mailbox *waiting* for
each QST. Every issue inspired me to do something new, get on the
air, or whatever. Even if to just dream about what *could* be done
technically.

Now it's the 'ARRL Lobby and Contest Journal.' Plus a re-hash of
'Now You're Talking' and a serialization of stuff that used to be in
a really neat pub called 'Understanding Amateur Radio.' Not to mention
excessive ads.

Ugh. In many ways '73' is more like what QST used to be.

Bring back Lew McCoy and Doug DeMaw.

Yeah, yeah. Subscribe to 'QEX'

And pay extra for what used to be part of the deal.

Greg


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:34 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jmaxwell
From: [e-mail] (james a maxwell)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 04:15:17 GMT
Lines: 63
Sender: [e-mail]

Perhaps it would interest those of you who are into this discussion to
hear directly from one of the "OFWMs" involved in "running the ARRL."
I'm the ARRL Vice Director in the Pacific Division.

The topic of this thread isn't new - we've all seen it before, many
times.  Unfortunately, these discussions never seem to come to any
conclusion,  They consist of a bundle of vague complaints, a bag or two
of unsubstantiated rumors and innuendo, a few defenders usually show up
to stand behind the League, there's a lot of wringing of hands, and
then - nothing.  Nothing at all.  A few months later someone resurrects
the thred and the cycle starts again.

A few people undoubtedly feel better for having let off steam, a few others
may wind up being better informed (although often they will be MISinformed),
but in general the problems or perceived problems are no closer to solution
by the time the thread peters out than they were when it began.  Nothing
much of any permanence is accomplished.

Why does it always happen this way?  Shouldn't these discussions lead to
something really constructive?

One of the reasons this happens (or, rather, that nothing happens) is
that there seems to be a reluctance for anyone to actually DO anything.
Is that so hard?

For example, if you have a complaint that somehow involves the ARRL,
instead of just running to your computer and hammering out a posting to
.misc or .policy, why not take just one more step?  Write to your
Director (or even your Vice Director!) or Section Manager, lodge your
complaint, but then *help them find a solution to the problem* if
a problem actually exists.

Or if you see a niche that isn't being filled, *fill it*.  Don't expect
the League to do *everything.*  Take a little initiative yourself!

We've all heard about hams who've tried to offer some comment or complaint
to the local ARRL rep and have gotten nowhere.  If you feel that your
local League rep is doing a lousy job, don't just complain and then walk
away - *do something about it.*  Find out who the individual's boss is
and tell the boss.  If nothing else works, throw the rascal out!  Don't
just come on .misc or .policy and complain, run for office yourself and
show the world how the job *should* be done.  If you don't have the time
to hold office yourself, find and actively support someone who does.

There are an awful lot of serious problems facing Amateur Radio today,
probably more today than at any other time in our history.  If you
*really* want to make a difference, you can't make that difference by
sitting in a comfortable chair at home, tapping out complaint after
complaint, pot-shot after pot-shot on a keyboard, proud in your non-
membership in the League.  Gary Coffman, who by no means is a League
apologist, wrote recently "If you care, you have to get inside and
fight to make things better."  I believe that's sound advice.

73.

Jim, W6CF

[e-mail]
--

______________________________________________________________________________
_
james a maxwell                                             [e-mail]
m



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!admaix.sunydutchess.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!news.uoregon.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!EU.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 01:25:30 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <5858aa$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-08.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) writ
es:
>Perhaps it would interest those of you who are into this discussion to
>hear directly from one of the "OFWMs" involved in "running the ARRL."
>I'm the ARRL Vice Director in the Pacific Division.
>
[snipped a bit]

>For example, if you have a complaint that somehow involves the ARRL,
>instead of just running to your computer and hammering out a posting to
>..misc or .policy, why not take just one more step?  Write to your
>Director (or even your Vice Director!) or Section Manager, lodge your
>complaint, but then *help them find a solution to the problem* if
>a problem actually exists.

I wrote to all of the ARRL directors recently regarding the league's
miserable record of stagnation and backward thinking (I *am* a
"member" ... I paid my money to get QST, but have not felt that the
league has represented my views at any time in the 20+ years I've
been licensed ...  I got exactly five answers ...  two from people I
personally know ...  the others were very much like the quote from the
jerk in MO, who wrote:  "Get your code speed up to 30-35 WPM, then
perhaps we'll chat!"

The point is you people (collectively, perhaps *you're* and exception)
ARE the problem in large part ... not a part of the solution.  I
strongly believe that another national organization needs to be formed
to break the ARRL's stranglehold on ham radio, particularly in
regulatory matters, where the league outright lies to the FCC by
claiming to represent the interests of *all* US hams ...

>We've all heard about hams who've tried to offer some comment or complaint
>to the local ARRL rep and have gotten nowhere.  If you feel that your
>local League rep is doing a lousy job, don't just complain and then walk
>away - *do something about it.*  Find out who the individual's boss is
>and tell the boss.  If nothing else works, throw the rascal out!  Don't
>just come on .misc or .policy and complain, run for office yourself and
>show the world how the job *should* be done.  If you don't have the time
>to hold office yourself, find and actively support someone who does.

I don't believe that the ARRL can be turned around from within ... there
are too many entrenched bureaucrats and politics as ususal good old boys
for that ... the league simply must be bypassed by an organization that
will represent the future of ham radio, rather than it's nostalgic past
..

>There are an awful lot of serious problems facing Amateur Radio today,
>probably more today than at any other time in our history.  If you
>*really* want to make a difference, you can't make that difference by
>sitting in a comfortable chair at home, tapping out complaint after
>complaint, pot-shot after pot-shot on a keyboard, proud in your non-
>membership in the League.  Gary Coffman, who by no means is a League
>apologist, wrote recently "If you care, you have to get inside and
>fight to make things better."  I believe that's sound advice.

I think Gary's wrong there ... like I said above, I don't think it can
be "fixed" ... I am convinced it must be replaced with something new and
uncorrupted.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 4 Dec 1996 19:35:37 GMT
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <584jq9$1f16$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-186.ca.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) writ
es:
>
>For example, if you have a complaint that somehow involves the ARRL,
>instead of just running to your computer and hammering out a posting to
>..misc or .policy, why not take just one more step?  Write to your
>Director (or even your Vice Director!) or Section Manager, lodge your
>complaint, but then *help them find a solution to the problem* if
>a problem actually exists.

Although I agree with what you say to some extent, James, I think you are
ignoring some very important points.

Firstly, QST ignores alternative points of view in a systematic way.  When you
read QST, you would never know that ham radio has a lively dialog and lots of
healthy disagreements and intelligently thought-out points of view.  QST
glosses over points of view that are opposed to the ones promulgated by
the League.

Secondly, most hams are only faintly aware of the League's bizarre
organizational structure, and have no idea who or what a section manager
or a division manager is.  They do not feel that these people represent them.
This can be seen by the small numbers, typically a few thousand, that vote
in any given ARRL divisional election. (Based on the recent elections).

An organization like ARRL should encourage open discussion, and QST should
serve as an open forum for such.  It does not.  Until it does, the internet,
not QST or ARRL, will be the forum in which the average ham expresses
himself.

Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV
[e-mail]

USC Law School, Class of '97

--------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather."
"Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers."
--------------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:37 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!jmaxwell
From: [e-mail] (james a maxwell)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 1996 01:27:58 GMT
Lines: 39
Sender: [e-mail]

Greg Bullough ([e-mail]) wrote:
: In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (james a maxw
ell) writes:
: >Perhaps it would interest those of you who are into this discussion to
: >hear directly from one of the "OFWMs" involved in "running the ARRL."
: >I'm the ARRL Vice Director in the Pacific Division.

: Then you should listen more, and talk less.

This posting from Greg was interesting and made some useful points.
However, it unfortunately contains a defect right up front, a defect that
is representative of one of the reasons I finally felt compelled to ship
off the "motherhood" posting I did.  His statement that I should "listen
more, and talk less" completely ignores the fact that he has no idea
whatever how I spend my time in service to the League and to Amateur
Radio, whether that service is good, bad, or indifferent, whether I have
in fact acted on ideas that I have read here in .misc and in .policy, or
how much time I spend listening and how much time I spend talking.  He
started off, in fact, with one of those gratuitous pot-shots I mentioned,
and later even claimed that I denied that a problem exists!

YES I understand that many of the League's constituents believe that the
ARRL is unresponsive, is organized to protect its own unresponsiveness,
and is designed to resist effective change.

But the suggestions I made in my "motherhood" posting still stand.  If you
have a complaint or a suggestion, by all means post away.  I'll read it,
others connected with the Board and at HQ will read it, and sometimes action
will be taken.  But if you want to make a difference, a *real* difference,
get involved yourself!  If you're rebuffed - and I know that happens, -
don't just sit at your keyboard and complain, GET INVOLVED AND DO SOMETHING
ABOUT IT!

73.  Jim, W6CF

--

______________________________________________________________________________
_
james a maxwell                                             [e-mail]
m



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 15:12:24 GMT
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-183.ca.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) writ
es:
>
>YES I understand that many of the League's constituents believe that the
>ARRL is unresponsive, is organized to protect its own unresponsiveness,
>and is designed to resist effective change.

As a League member for many years, a few comments.

I believe that the League's biggest flaw is its deliberate de-emphasis, and
downright denial, of viewpoints other than those of K1ZZ and his crew.

When reading QST, one would never know that ham radio contains a lively
array of opinions, which are hotly debated.  QST systematically excludes such
debate from its pages, and reading it, one would think that all hams are
marching happily in lockstep behind the League.  Not true.

You are wrong to belittle the internet as a forum for hams to express themselv
es
on ham issues.  It wouldn't be nearly as necessary if QST didn't deny
others a forum.  What other forum do we have.

Most hams have no understanding, and no interest, in the League's poorly-
understood field organization.  This is the League's fault.  By excluding
dissent, it has sent a clear message that it doesn't want to hear, or to deal
with, opinions other than those of K1ZZ.

By the way, when the hell does his term end?  It seems like lifetime tenure.
Is it?

Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV
[e-mail]

USC Law School, Class of '97

--------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather."
"Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers."
--------------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 15:22:40 GMT
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-183.ca.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) writ
es:
>His statement that I should "listen
>more, and talk less" completely ignores the fact that he has no idea
>whatever how I spend my time in service to the League and to Amateur
>Radio, whether that service is good, bad, or indifferent, whether I have
>in fact acted on ideas that I have read here in .misc and in .policy, or
>how much time I spend listening and how much time I spend talking.

OK James, some questions:

1)  A LOT of people lately, both on the net and on the air, have discussed
the desireability of getting rid of the CW requirement, first thru WARC and
then the FCC.  Why almost no discussion of this in QST?  One would never
know it is a hot issue from reading "our" official journal.  Even CQ has
discussed this.

2)  What are YOU PERSONALLY doing about the above issue?  What is your
position?  What is K1ZZ's position?  How can we feel that people like you
represent us when we don't even know your positions on issues?  Since
QST systematically refuses to act as a forum for healthy, vital, debate, it
is small wonder that many hams don't feel ARRL represents them.

3)  Do you support, or not support, K1ZZ?  What are his views and how
do they square with yours?  I read his editorials every month.  They rarely
deal with the issues that I hear hams talking about.

4)  Example: contesting.  Lots of hams think that contests fill up too much
of the bands, and should be limited in some way.  Other hams don't.  I NEVER
see this discussed in QST, although it is a frequent topic of discussion on th
e
air.  What is your position?  What is K1ZZ's?  Are we doing anything about thi
s
one way or the other, or do we care?

If you don't let us know your positions on things, how can we know or care
what you do?  My Congressman wouldn't dare skirt issues like this, but you
guys do it systematically.  And yet you claim, essentially, to represent us
per ham radio much the same way a Congressman does governmentally.

Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV
[e-mail]

USC Law School, Class of '97

--------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather."
"Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers."
--------------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.68.62.43!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 18:32:32 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <5874k9$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rst-engr.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (james a maxwell) shared these priceless pearls of
wisdom:

->I'm the ARRL Vice Director in the Pacific Division.

->The topic of this thread isn't new - we've all seen it before
[snips] and
->then - nothing.  Nothing at all.  A few months later someone resurrects
->the thred and the cycle starts again.
      ^^?^^

Jim Maxwell --

Your response is archtypical of the responses most of us get when we
discuss controversial topics with "you-all" or write letters to our
"representatives" in the ARRL.  "Tut-tut, little whiner, we know what's
best."

Go back to my original post.  Answer the specifics point by point.  Don't
shine me on by saying that they are "vague" or "innuendo".   I write for a
living.  I can do vague and innuendo when I mean to do it, and this ain't
it.  I spent 8 years in elected California politics, and my busslhit
detector has been finely honed to the point where I can smell it in your
first sentence.

"ARRL supports CW licensing requirements and subbands".  Boy, isn't THAT
built on air?

"QST articles are poorly edited and technically lacking."  There's an
ethereal for you.

... and the beat goes on, and the beat goes on...

Go back, Maxwell, and READ the damn thing.  Answer it if you can or will.

Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!ns2.mainstreet.net!sloth.swcp.com!laplaza.org!ebear
From: [e-mail] (Eric Bear Albrecht)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 23:05:47 -0800
Organization: Presto Computers
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <1996120423054746806@[10.0.2.15]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57v8tv$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: laplaza.org
X-Newsreader: MacSOUP 2.2b5

Jim Weir <[e-mail]> wrote:

> I thought I made it fairly clear that there was not.  If there was, I would
> have done a comparison rather than a lamentation.  I also would not have
> mentioned that Greene has failed to produce what he has promised for lo
> these many years -- an alternative organization.

Now it can be done.  I suppose.  Where do we start?

1.  The magazine -- we can do all that on the net / web / newsgroups.
2.  On-air stuff -- you got a PPP connection available?  simultaneous
                    transmissions from all over.  Technically trivial.
3.  Paid staff?? -- who needs 'em?
4.  Lobbying ??? -- discuss amongst yourselves.

An alternative organization?  How about an alternative to organizations!

--

Eric Bear Albrecht, OFWM  W5VZB  [e-mail] / [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:45 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]> <584jq9$1f16$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 04:43:39 GMT
Lines: 38
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (james a maxwel
l) writes:
>seems that nobody is completely satisfied.  Suppose QST were to suddenly
>(or gradually) to be more of a forum.  (That would be an interesting
>experiment!) Where is the money going to come from to pay for the extra
>pages?  Or, what is going to be left out of QST in order to make room?

<insert tongue firmly in cheek>

Oh. Okay. I understand now. It's just a question of space. It's not that
QST *wants* to be one-sided or to present the ARRL position as
as faites accomplis. It's just that there isn't *room* to provide all
sides of important questions. It's not bias, it's just space problems.

After all, it's *ever* so much more important to print the QTC of every
archaic CW net transmitting useless 'Greetings by amateur radio' -grams
in great circles than it is to present the case for elimination of the
CW requirement (where I personally agree with the ARRL stance, lest you
think I'm beating *that* drum). Show me an SCM with something more
interesting to say, and I'll show you a mighty rare bird.

Or how about publishing the National Contest Journal but *still*
loading the pages of QST down with every damn score in every log
sent in. Can you say 'boring?' Packet networks, the internet, and
the journal, but no, we have to foist these pages off on everyone.

Don't even get me started on the 'beginner' section. Can you say
redundant? Can you say 'done to death?' Can you say 'go out and
buy any Ham Radio 1-A book?' Can you say 'who the f*** would want
to build an antenna out of PVC pipe when there is copper, anyway?'

In short, Jim, and with all due respect, and to quote our friend
at RST, 'bullshit.' Space is not the problem. Lack of openness to
alternative view points IS. The fact that too many of those who
control the pages believe that their purpose is to tell their
constituents what to think IS.

Greg



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:46 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 04:50:31 GMT
Lines: 37
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (james a maxwel
l) writes:
>
>Roger, I'm not going to get into any sort of discussion such as the above
>in this forum.  I am a Vice Director in the Pacific Division, not in the
>Southwestern Division or the Northwestern Division or the Dakota
>Division.

So let's get it straight. As a second-level official of the official
organization, you won't make your views public in a national forum.

Okay, fine.

>My views on many subjects related to amateur radio, including some of
>those you mention above, are well known to many hams in the Pacific
>Division, both ARRL members and non-members.  I have spoken at every
>Pacific Division Convention in one capacity or another for many years,
>have participated in every ARRL Forum at the Pacific Division Convention
>since I was elected Vice Director in 1993, am available on the floor
>at every Pacific Division Convention, and appear and both speak and listen
>at dozens of club meetings every year in the Division.

Ah, so people have come to you to get an 'audience,' at a place
of your choosing.

And to think I once voted for you, when I lived in your Division.

Well, at least I admit my mistakes. Oops.

>If you want to know what personal stands I take on issues such as
>those you mention above, come to the Pacific Division and I'll be happy
>to talk with you.

Once again; you're an officer at the National level, second in line
to the National Board. If you aren't willing to respond to simple
questions on key issues, you have no business so-serving.

Greg


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.68.62.43!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 17:42:40 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <589m2s$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584jq9$1f16$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rst-engr.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Greg Bullough) shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:


->In short, Jim, and with all due respect, and to quote our friend
->at RST, 'bullshit.'


Ummm...not to be argumentative, but it was 'busslhit', and on purpose.

Jim {;-)
Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 08:14:26 -0500
Organization: ibm.net
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

james a maxwell wrote:
>
> Roger, I'm not going to get into any sort of discussion such as the
above
> in this forum.  I am a Vice Director in the Pacific Division, not
in the
> Southwestern Division or the Northwestern Division or the Dakota
> Division.
>
> My views on many subjects related to amateur radio, including some
of
> those you mention above, are well known to many hams in the
Pacific
> Division, both ARRL members and non-members.  I have spoken at
every
> Pacific Division Convention in one capacity or another for many
years,
> have participated in every ARRL Forum at the Pacific Division
Convention
> since I was elected Vice Director in 1993, am available on the
floor
> at every Pacific Division Convention, and appear and both speak and
listen
> at dozens of club meetings every year in the Division.

James, forgive me, but I am dumbstruck.  Let me get this straight.
You refuse to discuss your views on this forum on a couple of pretty
straightforward issues.  You are OK with criticizing those of us who do,
as you did in your last couple of posts, but you won't tell us where
you stand.  I'm supposed to get a plane ticket and fly to the Pacific
Division, wherever that is.  (I'm sitting in my shack looking out at
the Pacific Ocean, does that help?  Forgive the sarcasm.)

I would say, offhand, that Jim is afraid to speak his mind on any
substantive issues, because he fears that it would create political
problems for him back in Newington.  If there is anything more symptomatic
than this of what is wrong with the League, I'm hard pressed to think
of it.

Incidentally, Jim, before you get off criticizing me, I vote in my
League elections, and I have published both an article and a number of
letters in QST.  So don't get off saying **I** haven't done anything
about this situation.  It is **you** who are failing to be
straightforward.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I
want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Surfing
with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!southwind.net!symbios.com!msjohnso.ks.symbios.com!msjohnso
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 10:24:55
Organization: Symbios Logic
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: msjohnso.ks.symbios.com
X-Newsreader: Trumpet for Windows [Version 1.0 Rev A]

In article <57sii3$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Weir) writes:

>1.  The ARRL does NOT represent my opinions in the political arena.  So
>long as the League supports separate subbands for Morse Code, a
>concentration on contesting and awards, and a VERY ineffective lobbying
>effort, it does NOT represent me.

Point of order, albeit a very small one: An organization that makes "lobbying"

one of its primary purposes is in grave danger of losing its non-profit status

with the IRS. I've been in those shoes with another national non-profit
(albeit a small one). The original articles of incorporation, written in 1957,

prohibited lobbying altogether. The early 1970's revision allows it, but only
on a strictly limited basis, on advice of counsel.

Maybe ARRL isn't too effective now...I've not followed things too closely for
a while...but if they lost non-profit status, operating costs for what
services there *are* would go a whole lot higher!

Mark Johnson
WB9QLR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:51 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jmaxwell
From: [e-mail] (james a maxwell)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <584jq9$1f16$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 03:31:11 GMT
Lines: 60
Sender: [e-mail]

Greg Bullough ([e-mail]) wrote:
: In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (james a maxw
ell) writes:
: >seems that nobody is completely satisfied.  Suppose QST were to suddenly
: >(or gradually) to be more of a forum.  (That would be an interesting
: >experiment!) Where is the money going to come from to pay for the extra
: >pages?  Or, what is going to be left out of QST in order to make room?

: <insert tongue firmly in cheek>

: Oh. Okay. I understand now. It's just a question of space. It's not that
: QST *wants* to be one-sided or to present the ARRL position as
: as faites accomplis. It's just that there isn't *room* to provide all
: sides of important questions. It's not bias, it's just space problems.

That was a "what if" kind of statement, Greg.  The policy issue is
obvious and I didn't think it was worth mentioning.  I brought up the space
problem because many people have the misguided notion that all one has
to do is sign a piece of paper and wonderful new things happen.  It
doesn't work that way.  The ARRL has members with MANY points of view,
some of which aren't the same as yours.  They are members, they deserve
to be heard to, and their needs deserve to be considered too.

: After all, it's *ever* so much more important to print the QTC of every
: archaic CW net transmitting useless 'Greetings by amateur radio' -grams
: in great circles than it is to present the case for elimination of the
: CW requirement (where I personally agree with the ARRL stance, lest you
: think I'm beating *that* drum). Show me an SCM with something more
: interesting to say, and I'll show you a mighty rare bird.

: Or how about publishing the National Contest Journal but *still*
: loading the pages of QST down with every damn score in every log
: sent in. Can you say 'boring?' Packet networks, the internet, and
: the journal, but no, we have to foist these pages off on everyone.

: Don't even get me started on the 'beginner' section. Can you say
: redundant? Can you say 'done to death?' Can you say 'go out and
: buy any Ham Radio 1-A book?' Can you say 'who the f*** would want
: to build an antenna out of PVC pipe when there is copper, anyway?'

: In short, Jim, and with all due respect, and to quote our friend
: at RST, 'bullshit.' Space is not the problem. Lack of openness to
: alternative view points IS. The fact that too many of those who
: control the pages believe that their purpose is to tell their
: constituents what to think IS.

: Greg

You're right, Greg, space isn't THE problem.  Space and many other
considerations make it a much more complex problem that you seem to
think it is.  Personally, I'd like to see more lively discussion in
QST.  But that's my personal opinion, and I, as an individual can't
change it.  But I certainly can express my opinion and work toward
that goal.

73.  Jim, W6CF
--

______________________________________________________________________________
_
james a maxwell                                             [e-mail]
m



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:52 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 12:39:48 GMT
Lines: 59

In article <57vv52$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) shared these priceless pearls of
>wisdom:
>->The ARRL has serious leadership problems, and because of the ARRL's
>->power and influence, that means amateur radio has serious leadership
>->problems. Again, you can't change that from the outside. If you care,
>->you have to get inside and fight to make things better.
>
>Gary --
>
>I am a member of TWO hobby/professions, an engineer who is a ham, and a
>professional pilot who is into the homebuilt airplane field.  I thought I
>could change one of the alphabet soup airplane groups for the better by
>getting inside and fighting for what I thought was change for the better.
>What I got for my trouble was a figurative bloody nose of the first
>magnitude and second order.

No one said it is easy. Politics is almost always a dirty fight.

>The insiders of any of these groups have a strangle hold on the sources of
>power, whether by a bank of proxy votes that can be used at opportune times
>or by other methods of rigging the elections to make it seem like an
>outsider really has a chance.  My opinion, jaded though it may be, is that
>the only chance that an outsider has to change an entrenched power group is
>by forming a rival organization.

Experience has shown that to be wrong. It is very difficult to setup an
effective rival organization on the national level. It is almost always
easier to infiltrate the original organization and take it over. The
mechanisms of power are already in place, all you have to do is be clever
enough to sieze the levers for your own purposes. Think of it like judo.
You can use the strengths of the organization for your own purposes if
you practice the correct techniques.

I would give as examples the takeover of the NRA by concerned members,
and the capture of the Republican Party by the Goldwater Republicans.
The problem with most failed revolutions is that the revolutionaries
concentrate on striking off the head of the opposing party, assuming
that will give them effective control. It never works that way. You
have to infiltrate from the bottom up, seizing the real levers of
power from below until the leadership at the top is left helpless
and with no effective control of the organization. Then you can
strike at the top and replace the leadership.

True political power always flows upward in an organization. When
you short circuit that flow down near the bottom, by subverting or
replacing the minions charged with executing leadership commands,
the leadership at the top is left holding useless handle nubs which
don't work anymore. No colonel can command when his sargents won't
obey, and no general can command when his colonels won't obey. But
if you strike only at the general, both his loyal colonels and his
sargents will lead the troops against you, and you cannot stand.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:53 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!jmaxwell
From: [e-mail] (james a maxwell)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 05:25:26 GMT
Lines: 35
Sender: [e-mail]

After reading and replying to a number of postings on this thread this
evening, I've decided to draw my participation in this discussion to a
close.

I've learned a lot over the past few days.  I've learned more about the
modus operandi of this group that I hadn't learned from lurking in the
background over the past years, and that's a real plus.  Most (perhaps
all - I haven't really kept count) of the postings were interesting and
helpful, even those that I thought were off-base.  I've also received quite
a bit of private mail in the last few days, some of which was supportive,
some not, all was helpful.  Some was thoughtful with some real gems of
ideas, while others (only two, actually) were abusive.  Even the abusive
mail made an impression (and by saying that, don't think I'm condoning
that kind of stuff!) because, although I knew of the feelings some hams
hold toward the League, I hadn't realized how really deeply upset and
bitter some of you are.  I don't get those kinds of comments and vibrations
from face-to-face meetings.

What next?  Based on the new insights I've gotten, I have several new
projects to work on that I hope will help.  What are they?  No comment,
except that I hope I can make a difference with them.

Meanwhile, once more sounding like a bumpy record, I do wish more of you
would become more directly involved than you now are.  Criticism is good,
constructive criticism is better, but those willing to take time out of
their lives, roll up their sleeves, and show the rest of us how to do
things right, are golden.

73.  Jim Maxwell, W6CF

--

______________________________________________________________________________
_
james a maxwell                                             [e-mail]
m



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!compuserve.com!newsgate.compuserve.com!newsmaster
From: [e-mail] (Tom, K4NR)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 20:49:26 GMT
Organization: CompuServe Incorporated
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dd52-224.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: OUI PRO 1.5.0.1

In article <[e-mail]>, From [e-mail]
(james a maxwell), the following was written:
> If you
> *really* want to make a difference, you can't make that difference by
> sitting in a comfortable chair at home, tapping out complaint after
> complaint, pot-shot after pot-shot on a keyboard, proud in your non-
> membership in the League.


James,

Well said!!  This apathy runs everywhere, not just amateur radio...

73 de Tom, K4NR

--
Thomas Branch, K4NR
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!mackrel.fishnet.net!usenet
From: Mike <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 14:21:12 -0800
Organization: FNS
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]>
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Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have polle
d their members
and what do you know, they found they all what to retain CW as a filter for ac
cess of HF
freqs....Could it be they only speak for those who are generals and above. Loo
k at any issue
of QST. Ever notice who most articles are written for. The fact is that the so
 called no code
tech out number all other class license combined. I guess amateur radios "red
headed step
children", us no coders, need to find a new outlet for recognition. One that w
hen address the
real voice of amateurs. There is already a magazine dedicated to operations of
 VHF.
Hey CQ VHF magazine, are you up for the task as the voice for the majority of
amateur
operators.


            THE IS THE LATEST PROUD ARRL CRY OF VICTORY
        **************************************************
   "In a recent survey conducted by the American Radio Relay League,
amateurs have made their feelings known.  In over rousing fashion, amateurs
have said yes to the retention of morse code. Sixty two percent of ARRL
members polled said yes to keeping the code.  While thirty percent said no.
Of all amateurs polled, members and non-members alike, Fifty four percent
said yes to keeping the code, while thirty seven percent said no".

   "In this era of the popular no code tech license, amateurs say no to the
total no code licensing".


   "The bottom line.  In months passed some high ranking officials have
publicly hinted that the ARRL might not be opposed to expansion of
privileges for no code hams.  As a result of this survey, when the League
goes to WRC '99, it will have to stand its ground.  It will be forced to
say no to those administrations whose telecommunications leaders say that
its time to delete the Morse code as a testing requirement for getting ham
radio voice operating privileges on bands below 30 MHZ".
       ****************************************************

The ARRL can expect no renewal from me.
73 Mike K6YPB


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:57 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 23:51:40 GMT
Lines: 39
Sender: [e-mail]

Mike ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have pol
led their members
: and what do you know, they found they all what to retain CW as a filter for
access of HF
: freqs....Could it be they only speak for those who are generals and above. L
ook at any issue
: of QST. Ever notice who most articles are written for. The fact is that the
so called no code
: tech out number all other class license combined. I guess amateur radios "re
d headed step
: children", us no coders, need to find a new outlet for recognition. One that
 when address the
: real voice of amateurs. There is already a magazine dedicated to operations
of VHF.
: Hey CQ VHF magazine, are you up for the task as the voice for the majority o
f amateur
: operators.

I don't know how many no-coders are also ARRL members, but if our club is
representative, I'd have to say a very low percentage.

If that's the case, then it's a supply-and-demand situation.  If the core of
ARRL membership is General and above, and I suspect that's the case, they
would get a lot of heat for publishing articles that didn't address their
readership.

I do have to give the publishers of CQ Magazine credit for filling a need
with CQ VHF Magazine.  Although my main operating interests are on HF, I am
a subscriber to CQ VHF, and it's one of the first ham magazines that I read
each month.

If you look at CQ, 73 and World Radio, you'll find that there are very few
articles aimed at the VHF frequencies and above; it isn't just QST.

Where do you get the statistics to support your assertion that Technicians
outnumber all other classes of operator, combined?  I'd give you that they
are the fastest-growing segment of the ham population, but c'mon...

I'm not a staunch ARRL supporter, but I will say that quitting is not the
answer.  It doesn't matter how many Technicians there are out there, if they
aren't ARRL members, they're not going to influence League policy.  As a
member, at least you have a voice, for whatever that may be worth.

73 de Jim - KF6CR




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:58 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 14:30:11 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 16
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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>Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have
>polled their members and what do you know, they found they all what to
>retain CW as a filter for access of HF freqs.
> [...]
>The ARRL can expect no renewal from me.

Of course, if they hadn't conducted the poll, they would have been faulted
for living in some "ivory tower."

If they had ignored the results of the poll, they would have been faulted
for maintaining some "hidden agenda."

But because they did conduct a poll and are abiding by it, they are being
faulted by those who simply disagree with it.  ::sigh::
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:22:59 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 17:36:24 GMT
Lines: 42
Sender: [e-mail]

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:

: No doubt.  A couple of points:

: 1.  I respectfully disagree re: the ARRL having to abide by the
: results of its poll.  If the response rate was low, and it was not valid
: and random, it has no validity (as defined by the science of statistics:
: validity = whether a poll measures what it purports to measure) and
: should not be the basis for decision making.  A six pack of beer says
: that they mailed the things to QST subscribers and a bunch of old
: timers are the ones who responded.  For that matter, I'm an ARRL member
: (and a certified old timer: licensed in 1967) ... I didn't get polled!

OK, I'll agree with your point on statistical validity.  If the poll is
statistically valid, then ARRL would certainly invite criticism by not
following the results.

Not sure how you got missed.  I have one year on you as on OT (1966) but my
wife also received a survey, and she's been licensed only about one year.
Wasn't there one in QST that you could send in?

Sure, some of us (apparently a lot) feel that we have a lot to lose if the
code requirement is dropped.  Since I mainly operate CW except for some
contests, I wouldn't feel the crowding.  The problem is, giving someone a
vote doesn't mean that he will vote rationally versus emotionally.  If you
don't believe that, spend some time on news.groups.

: 2.  No argument about keeping incentive licensing going.  It is quite
: logical that the cw portions of the band should be retained as
: cw-only, and that only hams who have passed a cw test should operate there
: (although we should continue to have a novice bands in order to let
: newcomers work on their proficiency).  Maybe we let current generals and
: above, who have passed 13WPM or greater, have unlimited CW privileges?
:  I dunno.  I'm an Extra, so don't accuse me of being self-serving.
: :-)

Didn't plan to accuse you of anything.

I won't complain either way, because I just need to pass my 20-wpm now for
Extra.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!ais.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 07:15:23 -0500
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Jim Lowman wrote:
> Face it, although some will always end up disgruntled, working out
a
> compromise that is accepteble to both sides of the issue and
presenting it
> to ARRL and FCC is going to accomplish more that the "I want it
all, and I
> want it now" attitude.
>
> 73 de Jim - KF6CR

No doubt.  A couple of points:

1.  I respectfully disagree re: the ARRL having to abide by the
results of its poll.  If the response rate was low, and it was not valid
and random, it has no validity (as defined by the science of statistics:
validity = whether a poll measures what it purports to measure) and
should not be the basis for decision making.  A six pack of beer says
that they mailed the things to QST subscribers and a bunch of old
timers are the ones who responded.  For that matter, I'm an ARRL member
(and a certified old timer: licensed in 1967) ... I didn't get polled!

2.  No argument about keeping incentive licensing going.  It is quite
logical that the cw portions of the band should be retained as
cw-only, and that only hams who have passed a cw test should operate there
(although we should continue to have a novice bands in order to let
newcomers work on their proficiency).  Maybe we let current generals and
above, who have passed 13WPM or greater, have unlimited CW privileges?
 I dunno.  I'm an Extra, so don't accuse me of being self-serving.
:-)

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!psinntp!psinntp!linux.liant.com!usenet
From: Robert Barron <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:38:35 -0600
Organization: Liant Software
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Mike wrote:
>
> Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have pol
led their members
> and what do you know, they found they all what to retain CW as a filter for
access of HF
> freqs....Could it be they only speak for those who are generals and above. L
ook at any issue
> of QST. Ever notice who most articles are written for. The fact is that the
so called no code
> tech out number all other class license combined. I guess amateur radios "re
d headed step
> children", us no coders, need to find a new outlet for recognition. One that
 when address the
> real voice of amateurs. There is already a magazine dedicated to operations
of VHF.

The fact is,  you are wrong to state the no-code Technicians outnumber
all other license
classes.  On what do you base that fact?  According to the W5YI web page
there are a total
of 705,995 Amateurs and 149,745 Technicians (not counting 139,738
Techicians with the code
endorsement).  That comes out to 21.2% of all licensed Hams.  How is
this the most, or a
majority?

Curiously the W5YI page headline claims that most US Amateurs have a
no-code license.
Sounds like the headline gets spread around but the real numbers do not.

> Hey CQ VHF magazine, are you up for the task as the voice for the majority o
f amateur
> operators.

As far as taking a code test goes that means the 556,249 (78.8%) Hams
who have taken a
code test and passed it?

And mind you,  I won't mind when a no-code HF license comes around.  I
think it will.  But
in the meantime,  let's get the facts straight.

73,

Robert KA5WSS
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!news
From: Ed Hare <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 18:07:44 GMT
Organization: American Radio Relay League, Inc.
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <58k8tg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Dick Flanagan) wrote:

>>Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to >>have p
olled their members and what do you know, they found t=
hey all >>what to retain CW as a filter for access of HF freqs.
>> [...]
>>The ARRL can expect no renewal from me.

>Of course, if they hadn't conducted the poll, they would have been >faulted f
or living in some "ivory tower."

>If they had ignored the results of the poll, they would have been >faulted fo
r maintaining some "hidden agenda."

>But because they did conduct a poll and are abiding by it, they are >being fa
ulted by those who simply disagree with it.  ::sigh::

>Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada

The best analogy I can think of is having someone set up a board game in
which they never had to make a single move, their opponent had to play
every turn and if their opponent made any move that they deemed to be
incorrect, they could declare themselves the winner.

In actuality, at this juncture, the ARRL has not "abided" by the results
of the poll; they have simply conducted it.  (I say "they" because is has
little to do with the Technical Department). They are well aware of the
limitations of any poll, self-selection, non responses, etc.  The poll
information will be forwared to the ARRL policy makers (the elected Board
of Directors), who will consider it, direct input from hams and apply
their own judgement as well, to come up with an ARRL policy and course of
action.

I urge hams to make thier views on this, or any other topic, known to
their Division Directors.  The Directors can be reached by mail, email,
telephone or in person at hamfests and club meetings. See QST or the ARRL
WWW page for address information.)

73 from ARRL HQ,
Ed Hare, KA1CV, ARRL Laboratory Supervisor





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:03 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL...Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 21:05:25 GMT
Lines: 36

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>Incredible.  Is everyone reading this?  This guy K1ZZ has something
>approximating life tenure.  I never knew that he didn't stand for
>election by the membership.  This explains a lot, alas.  Talk about a
>prescription for organizational arteriosclerosis.

The Executive Vice President job is a paid staff position.
The EVP serves at the pleasure of the BOD, like any other
employee. Are you really suggesting that employees be required
to stand for election? I guess you want Ed Hare out on the
campaign trail instead of back in the lab too.

In a manner of speaking, the EVP stands for election every time
the BOD meets since his continued employment is dependent on their
approval of his job performance.

Membership organizations with unpaid part time elected officers
require a paid professional staff to handle the day to day affairs
of the organization. And that staff needs a leader. The leader has
to be another paid professional, in this case Sumner.

If the membership at large wants him gone, they can elect a BOD who
won't approve of his job performance. Think of this like a city
manager form of governance. The city council hires the city manager
to handle the day to day affairs of the city, and can fire him any
time they don't like the job he is doing. If the people don't like
the job he is doing, they can complain to the city council, or
elect a new city council.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Joining the ARRL...Why?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 08:08:18 -0500
Organization: ibm.net
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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james a maxwell wrote:
Speaking of K1ZZ, who apparently has something approaching Life
Tenure:
>
> 73.  Jim, W6CF
>

Incredible.  Is everyone reading this?  This guy K1ZZ has something
approximating life tenure.  I never knew that he didn't stand for
election by the membership.  This explains a lot, alas.  Talk about a
prescription for organizational arteriosclerosis.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I
want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Surfing
with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:06 1996
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From: "Roger J. Buffington" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL...Why?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 03:11:44 -0500
Organization: ibm.net
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Gary Coffman wrote:
>
> Membership organizations with unpaid part time elected officers
> require a paid professional staff to handle the day to day affairs
> of the organization. And that staff needs a leader. The leader has
> to be another paid professional, in this case Sumner.
>
> If the membership at large wants him gone, they can elect a BOD
> who
> won't approve of his job performance. Think of this like a city
> manager form of governance. The city council hires the city
>manager
> to handle the day to day affairs of the city, and can fire him any
> time they don't like the job he is doing. If the people don't like
> the job he is doing, they can complain to the city council, or
> elect a new city council.
>

I am quite familiar with this form of organizational governance,
Gary, and you explain its principles well.

It is very common in such situations for the part-time elected
officials to dance to the tune of the full-time "professionals" even though
on paper it is supposed to be the other way around.  One wonders if
that is perhaps what is going on in ARRL.  (Don't ask me.)  The most
notorious example of this in recent memory was the United Way situation
awhile back with that chap Arimoney.  (which I would not compare the
ARRL to; so flamers please flame off!)

One way of preventing it is to have the chief executive stand for
election in the context of member-run non-profit organization like the
ARRL.  This can prevent this sort of "capture" of an organization by the
full-time professionals, who have the time, unlike the part-timers,
to really focus on dominating an organization's agenda.

I got nothing against Sumner.  Like most League officials, including
our Vice Director here, I haven't a clue what his positions are on ham
issues, since he doesn't share his views with the members he
nominally serves.  (Yes, I do read his editorials.  Pretty bland).

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.zeitgeist.net!news.greatbasin.net!dick
From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL...Why?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 18:56:21 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 28
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

>It is very common in such situations for the part-time elected
>officials to dance to the tune of the full-time "professionals" even though
>on paper it is supposed to be the other way around.  One wonders if
>that is perhaps what is going on in ARRL.  (Don't ask me.)  The most
>notorious example of this in recent memory was the United Way situation
>awhile back with that chap Arimoney.  (which I would not compare the
>ARRL to; so flamers please flame off!)
>
>One way of preventing it is to have the chief executive stand for
>election in the context of member-run non-profit organization like the
>ARRL.  This can prevent this sort of "capture" of an organization by the
>full-time professionals, who have the time, unlike the part-timers,
>to really focus on dominating an organization's agenda.
>
>I got nothing against Sumner.  Like most League officials, including
>our Vice Director here, I haven't a clue what his positions are on ham
>issues, since he doesn't share his views with the members he
>nominally serves.  (Yes, I do read his editorials.  Pretty bland).

Roger, I sware to goodness you will make a =great= attorney.  In fact, you
are almost qualified for political office!  In the above three paragraphs,
you have profusely implied everything and said absoluely nothing.  Amazing.
. . .
--
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:08 1996
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From: "Stan Huntting" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: KaWin News
Date: 11 Dec 1996 17:16:13 GMT
Organization: SRHuntting. Inc.
Lines: 55
Message-ID: <01bbe787$02036a00$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20630 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44096 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120291 rec.radio.swap:99104

KAWIN NEWS - Announcing KaWin 6.47

KaWin 6.47 is ready for download from the KaWin Home Page:

http://www.mutadv.com/kawin

Enhancements include:

Support for the Radio Amateur Callbook ("Flying Horse") Call
Sign Database, including automatic lookup on connect.

Distance, heading to station and reciprocal heading from
station is now included in the result of a call sign
database lookup.

New "p" and "l" macros to insert your geographic position
coordinates and locator grid.

Any macro may now be forced to uppercase.

A "Print Selection" command joins the Pop-Up menu.

The first edition of the KaWin "Frequently Asked Questions"
(FAQ) is now a part of both the KaWin Help file and the
KaWin Home Page. I am still compiling "Tips" for a separate
topic and your contributions are needed. Input is solicited
from tire-kickers as well as new and old registered users.

Please send all contributions to: [e-mail]

The KaWin News mailing list has been purged of all problem
email addresses. If your address was inadvertently removed
please accept my apologies and re-subscribe. Please pay
close attention to the email address you provide and/or the
"reply to" address set in your email client.

To subscribe to the KaWin News mailing list, send email to
[e-mail] with the word SUBSCRIBE in the subject line,
or use the handy subscription link on the KaWin Home Page.
To be removed from the list, send email to [e-mail]
with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the subject line and be sure to
include the email address this message was sent to in the
body. I cannot remove you if I don't know your address!

73, Igottago... Stan ..

KaWin News is published by Stan Huntting, KF0IA.
----------------------------------------------
Stan Huntting,    KF0IA
Email:            [e-mail]
Fax:              303 444 2314
KaWin home page:  http://www.mutadv.com/kawin/
Postal address:   4655 Pleasant Ridge Rd.,
                  Boulder, CO 80301-1731, USA



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-2.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Dennis Breeden <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Kenwood TS520/R599 Mod
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 19:25:53 -0600
Organization: Reuter
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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CC: rec.radio.amateur.equipment

I am looking for a mod from the late 1970's on the Kenwood TS-520
receiver and the R-599 (A/D).  I believe it was called W6TOG.  It
replaced the FETs in the peselector, 1st mixer and 1st LO with
MOSFETs to lower the receivers noise.  If anyone has the information to
this most, please E-Mail me this.  Many Thanks in advanced
73's   D. Pat Breeden  WB3KUM/9


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Laptop For Sale or Trade
Date: 3 Dec 1996 21:17:24 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Toshiba T1200 Laptop with OEM 2400 Baud Modem built in, 20Meg HD stac'd to
38+Meg (loaded with software or blank, your choice), AC Adaptor. Excellent
condition but needs new battery for non-AC use.

Will trade for HF Gear, Guns, Outboard Motor, etc. May even take cash!

Jim, Chuluota, FL


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:11 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Larger capicty battery for HTX- 202
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57nuj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 17:01:36 GMT
Lines: 37

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>Gary Fiber wrote:
>>
>> ICOM HAD NOTHING to do with the HTX-202.  Its a Tandy and Maxon desogn all
the
>> way.  There was NO license as there is nothing to license..  The rumors of
a
>> ICOM license are totally false.  Tandy sent a letter to all managers of Rad
io
>> Shack stores stating just that and told the managers to cease and desist
>> spreading the rumor after ICOM took issue with the rumor being told by the
>> Radio Shack store chain.
>
>I just spoke with a gentleman at Tandy National Parts last week to order
>a new memory backup battery for my HTX-202... We got to talking and he
>said Icom sold the licensing of the IC2AT to tandy, tandy only used bits
>and pieces of it, but the major electronics were designed from the
>ground up by Maxxon to have no ability to be modified so they could
>enhance intermod rejection etc...  I have also seen this in several
>files (Including a text file from ftp.arrl.org) published about HTX-202
>mods.
>Be interesting to get the story from Icom to see if infact they sold the
>rights of the IC2AT to tandy or not.
>Later,
>Dave

Dave, Gary Fiber *is* Icom USA. Believe him. Besides, the HTX202
isn't modeled on the IC2AT. It is more a copy of the look and feel
of the IC02AT. And internally it isn't really even a copy of that
rig (in some ways it is better). It's a Maxon design dressed up to
take Icom accessories. That was a smart marketing decision because
it guaranteed a ready aftermarket of accessories for the rig.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:12 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Larger capicty battery for HTX- 202
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 18:18:15 GMT
Lines: 34

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>Gary Coffman wrote:
>
>> The HTX202 can use the same accessories as the old Icom IC2 and IC02
>> series (which were extremely popular and developed a large aftermarket).
>> You can use the speaker/mics, headsets, and *batteries* made for those
>> radios on your HTX202. The big BP-8 battery will work, and can be bottom
>> charged in the BC-35 drop in charger. Note however that this charger
>> can cook your batteries if you aren't somewhat careful. It depends on
>> the thermistor in the battery to tell it when it is overcharging, and
>> that's already too late (though it is better than the straight timed
>> chargers used by Yaesu and Kenwood in that era). Some of the more modern
>> aftermarket chargers for these batteries use the superior pulse charging
>> technique.
>
>Hi Gary,
>Radioshack recomends that bottom charging be done with the battery
>removed from the radio.  They state there are a couple Zener diodes that
>can be destroyed in the radio if you leave the batt on the HT... they
>also suggest only using the external 12V power to the jack on top with
>the batt off so the zeners don't get destroyed as well.
>
>Take care,
>Dave

Dave, what are the part numbers of these zeners? I don't see anything
that could be them in the service manual.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!demos!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!cs.utexas.edu!news.ti.com!newsfeed.mc.ti.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Flanders)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Larger capicty battery for HTX- 202
Date: 3 Dec 1996 20:50:33 GMT
Organization: Texas Instruments @ Sherman
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <5823qp$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: shtip114.dseg.ti.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

HTX-202 Owners:
   Open up 73, QST and/or CQ and look for adds offerring NiMHD
batteries.  Then look for the ICOM replacement for BP8.  Then
doublecheck with that vendor that it works with the HTX202.  This
has worked for me all but one time.  I got one battery at a convention
that had to be reworked a little to make a good connection with the
buttons on the bottom of the radio.
Jim W0oog/5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>[e-mail] wrote:
>>
>> To any Elmer that can help me:
>>         Can you advise me on a good subsitute on the stock Ni-cad
pack
>> and charger that comes with the HTX-202? I would prefer something
that
>> could be Bottom charged, and somthing with more life than an hour or
two.
>> Also, would like to know if there is a better quality of hand
<external>
>> mike that woukd work as well,as the two I got from Radio Shack fell
apart
>> after only Two weeks of use!~!@#$%^&*+!!!
>>                             Thanks,and 73's,
>>                              Dave/KB2ZYO AT:[e-mail]
>
>
>As I understand it, The HTX-202 was built by Maxxon under license with
Icom. Ergo, ICOM batteries slide right
>on...  There should be a few aftermarket suppliers for large capacity
batteries.
>
>
>Jim..



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!138.220.4.24!news.worldbank.org!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Darrell Earnshaw)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LOG BOOK PROGRAM
Date: 2 Dec 1996 17:41:20 GMT
Organization: World Bank
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <57v4c0$[e-mail]>
References: <579r2f$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dearnsha.worldbank.org
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.6+

In article <579r2f$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says:
>
>I am looking for recommendations for a good log book program.
>
>Tnx,
>
>73s
>
>
If you're running Windows (3.1 or 95), you may want to check out DX4WIN.
The web page is: www.erols.com/pvander, from which you can download a
demo copy.

- Darrell (NR3Y)
>[e-mail]
>*******************************************
>John E. Mansfield         Only you can make
>1032 Montgomery Avenue    it a great day!
>Pennsburg, PA 18073
>                          Semper Fidelis
>KB3PC
>
>To err is human,
>to forgive is divine,
>neither of which is USMC policy!
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!nntp-hub.idt.net!nntp.farm.idt.net!news
From: Larry Deering <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LOG BOOK PROGRAM
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:41:09 -0800
Organization: IDT
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <579r2f$[e-mail]> <57v4c0$[e-mail]> <01bbe13f$e8307660$[e-mail]>
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Borovikov wrote:
>
> Darrell Earnshaw <[e-mail]> wrote in article
> > >I am looking for recommendations for a good log book program.
>
> Look up to http://www.balti-n.estpak.ee/hamshack

        Well, I looked it up, and found that if you:

"Click here for Download HAMshack 1.0 - 2.9 MB (this version expires in 1
 mount arter install)" (sic)

        Then you can:

"Click here for Register Online ($98 US)"

        And that "Borovikov"
<[e-mail]>
        did not exactly provide the usual disclaimers when suggesting
http://www.balti-n.estpak.ee/hamshack

        Unlike many, I don't mind shopping on Usenet. I do think Borovikov
should mention that the software is for sale, and that he is doing the
selling!

Larry, w2gl


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wwa.com!airwaves!rrb
From: [e-mail] (Gene Marshall)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.broadcasting
Subject: Looking for time setting program for HeathKit's Most-Accurate Clock GC1000
Followup-To: rec.radio.broadcasting
Date: 7 Dec 1996 18:51:38 -0600
Organization: Hewlett Packard
Lines: 11
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20571 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43853 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119972 rec.radio.broadcasting:30398

Subjects just about says it all.  I'm trying to locate a PC program (DOS based
is fine) which will take serial port input from the GC1000 clock and set the
PC time.

Does anyone have such a program or, perhaps, the program HeathKit (R.I.P.)
used to supply?

Many thanks,
Gene
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wwa.com!airwaves!rrb
From: [e-mail] (Bill Cohn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.broadcasting
Subject: Re: Looking for time setting program for HeathKit's Most-Accurate Clock GC1000
Followup-To: rec.radio.broadcasting
Date: 10 Dec 1996 19:38:53 -0600
Organization: Tektronix, Inc.
Lines: 28
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Distribution: world
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20633 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44101 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120305 rec.radio.broadcasting:30624

In article <58d3eq$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gene Marshall) writes:
>From: [e-mail] (Gene Marshall)
>Subject: Looking for time setting program for HeathKit's Most-Accurate Clock
GC1000
>Date: 7 Dec 1996 18:51:38 -0600

>Subjects just about says it all.  I'm trying to locate a PC program (DOS base
d
>is fine) which will take serial port input from the GC1000 clock and set the
>PC time.

>Does anyone have such a program or, perhaps, the program HeathKit (R.I.P.)
>used to supply?

>Many thanks,
>Gene

The clock was not set by an external program from the PC port. It would set
itself by listening to WWV on either 5, 10, or 15MHz. The  clock contains a
scanning receiver. The display would stay black until it had received WWV long

enough to be confidant the time was correct. This could take many hours at
first. You did need to set the dip switch inside to tell the clock the time
zone you were in.

By the way Heathkit is still in Benton Harbor, MI. You might want to look them

up.

Bill Cohn
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!cc.iu.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: [e-mail]   Privacy violation ?
Date: 2 Dec 1996 05:01:57 GMT
Organization: InternetU, Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <57tns5$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbda5a$81da4da0$e4edbdcc@rsmith> <Pine.SUN.3.95.961123204750.19152E-100000@v <[e-mail]> <57f8n9$[e-mail]> <57fbsm$[e-mail]> <57ka5e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: netport-37.iu.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, Rolfe Tessem <[e-mail]> writes:
>It makes you wonder what the FCC would do should they actually want
>to conduct a station inspection or investigate an interference
>complaint.
>Rolfe, W1VC

well, the FCC said something along the lines of "we always have to track the
signal down anyway. bootleggers aren't on file and most times there's no
identification or wrong identification. therefore, knowing where a station is
located doesn't mean a whole lot.", back when they stopped asking for a
station location address.

Bill Newkirk WB9IVR                  The Space Coast Amateur Technical Group
Melbourne, FL                       duty now for the future of amateur radio
Lombardi's 1st Law of Business:
   Companies succeed in spite of their best effort.  If they succeed at all.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!cbgw3.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Loss of 70 cm. Amatuer band in Guyana
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 10:35:34 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Dave/KB2ZYO exclaimed:
> I heard a bit of Terrifying news last night on the Amauter [sic] Radio
> Newsline last night; The Guyanan goverment has kicked It's amatuers
> off 70 cm.
                          [followed by]
>  I will give up my ticket when they pull it out of my cold, dead
>  hands.

Umm...Dave, I think you'd better lay off the espresso for a bit. I don't
think that an action in a small South American country is going to
result in a drastic, sweeping ban on your U.S. operating privileges.
Remember, there are quite a few countries where you essentially CANNOT
use a radio AT ALL.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Loss of 70 cm. Amatuer band in Guyana
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 09:34:17 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nyc-ny44-24.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Dec 06  6:33:16 AM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E-NC250  (Win16; U)

To whom it may concern:
        I heard a bit of Terrifying news last night on the Amauter Radio
Newsline last night; The Guyanan goverment has kicked It's amatuers off
 70 cm. In favor of a sattelite service with the blessings of the ITU!
  This does not bode well for the future. What's next? Will we lose 2m.?
   HF? The camel's nose is no longer in our tent; It's gone way beyond
it. We've got to seriously push it out before we lose the ENTIRE tent.
       I did NOT work 20 years to get my ticket just so I could lose It a
 few years down the line to some money grubbing comglomerate. Also,
I would remind theese Alpha Hotels that WITHOUT Amatuer Radio, your
bloodsucking comglomerates would not exsist in the first place.I'm sorry
if I ruffule a few feathers with this, but The time for coddling the FCC
 and the Itu in this matter has passed. ALL Amatuers, coders and
no-coders alike should declare in one voice that we will Not go silently
 into the night,nor give up WITHOUT a fight. I will give up my ticket
when they pull it out of my cold, dead hands.
                           Dave/ KB2ZYO AT:refinley@ix. netcom.com


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.accessone.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Loss of 70 cm. Amatuer band in Guyana
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:58:39 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58fo7v$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vbook.accessone.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>To whom it may concern:
>        I heard a bit of Terrifying news last night on the Amauter Radio
>Newsline last night; The Guyanan goverment has kicked It's amatuers off
> 70 cm. In favor of a sattelite service with the blessings of the ITU!
>  This does not bode well for the future. What's next? Will we lose 2m.?
>   HF? The camel's nose is no longer in our tent; It's gone way beyond
>it. We've got to seriously push it out before we lose the ENTIRE tent.
>       I did NOT work 20 years to get my ticket just so I could lose It a
> few years down the line to some money grubbing comglomerate. Also,
>I would remind theese Alpha Hotels that WITHOUT Amatuer Radio, your
>bloodsucking comglomerates would not exsist in the first place.I'm sorry
>if I ruffule a few feathers with this, but The time for coddling the FCC
> and the Itu in this matter has passed. ALL Amatuers, coders and
>no-coders alike should declare in one voice that we will Not go silently
> into the night,nor give up WITHOUT a fight. I will give up my ticket
>when they pull it out of my cold, dead hands.
>                           Dave/ KB2ZYO AT:refinley@ix. netcom.com

I haven't heard about this  issue in Guyana. This is true, apparently, in
Guatamala (see story at www.hamradio-online.com, via Spacenews). The concern i
s
that this encompasses the amateur satellite uplink passbands between 430-440
MHz and commercial mobile ops on these freqs in South America would cause
potentially severe interference to the satellite covering a footprint from
North America to South America. This problem has occurred already in Lebanon
where I'm told landmobile users jam OSCAR satellites in parts of Europe.
--
------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!hunter.premier.net!hammer.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Loss of 70 cm. Amatuer band in Guyana
Date: 9 Dec 1996 03:11:01 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58g005$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Roger D. Placer ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Dave/KB2ZYO exclaimed:
: > I heard a bit of Terrifying news last night on the Amauter [sic] Radio
: > Newsline last night; The Guyanan goverment has kicked It's amatuers
: > off 70 cm.

: Umm...Dave, I think you'd better lay off the espresso for a bit. I don't
: think that an action in a small South American country is going to
: result in a drastic, sweeping ban on your U.S. operating privileges.
: Remember, there are quite a few countries where you essentially CANNOT
: use a radio AT ALL.

The problem is not the ban in Guyana. The problem is that the band will
be reassigned to commercial users.  Guess what that will do to the dozen
or so Amateur Satellites, that use 70 cm as the uplink band. Can you
imagine that it just might make the satellites unusable in Zone 2?

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.lobo.net!news
From: Mark Fossum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Make money fast
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 18:51:05 -0600
Organization: Lobo Net
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <582e5u$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 134.129.253.23
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

Another Email chain letter dirtbag. Let's see, if I send a message to 5
of my friends to spam "Nick Laurinas'" mail account and they tell 5 of
their friends etc, etc, etc.... Nick should have about 600,000 message
by morning! Perfect!

Nick Laurinas <[e-mail]>

Nick Laurinas wrote:
> Invest your $5 by writing your name and address on 5 pieces of paper
> along w/ the words "Please add me to you mailing list".



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.lobo.net!news
From: Jerry Campbell <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: microwave tx/rx
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 00:17:10 -0800
Organization: home
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: s3.lobo.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; I)

For Sale: One pair of Racom microwave dishs model 5005E. operational
freq. 23.125 ghz. Good working condition. Asking $2500. for pair

Jerry...


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!192.35.48.11!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!alison.sbc.edu!alison.sbc.edu!nntp
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mobile HF Webpage
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: grimm <@sbc.edu>
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 18:12:08 -0500
Reply-To: @sbc.edu
References: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Sweet Briar College
Nntp-Posting-Host: ppp72.sbc.edu
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: [e-mail]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 20
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32361 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43575 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119558

Jerry Decker wrote:
>
> Greetings,
>
>    I am setting up a webpage dedicated to Mobile HF'ing. If anyone would
> like to provide input or graphics that are on this subject, please send
> them to [e-mail]. I will give you the credit on the webpage.
>
> Thanks
> Jerry WR5V [e-mail]
> http://www.metronet.com/~jdecker


What a good idea for a web page!  I don't have anything to contribute
yet, but I will be a regular "viewer" of your page!  Good luck on your
project.

73,

Ken, K4XL    [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: Blue Wave Technology <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mod for TH-28A, pse hlp!
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 10:56:40 -0600
Organization: Web Design & Support
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pas-ca5-13.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 08 12:56:34 PM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Hello;

I have a Kenwood TH-28A, and found a mod for it. Has anyone performed
this modification for the radio? It says to remove a diode, and replace
it in another place. If I am looking in the right place, the diodes are
VERY small. Do I need to un-solder them? I would really appreciate it if
someone could mail me another mod (perhaps easier), or some insight on
how to do this modification.

Thanks alot!
73,
Rod
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!csn!nntp-xfer-2.csn.net!yuma!usenet
From: fiz <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mods and mod-less
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 12:04:43 -0800
Organization: Me
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rollers.physics.colostate.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

Hi,

I'm just curious, ie bored, and gotsta know...

(1) Why is it everyone immediately wants to open up their radio and
'modify' it for some worthless cause, like transmitting out of band, but
are terrified to 'modify' it (ala VHF radios) for 9600 baud packet?

(2) Why do people think advertising a radio as having had all possible
mods done, is a selling point?

ttfn fiz (KG0YG)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: "Rodney Isom" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mods for Alinco DJ-G1T
Date: 7 Dec 1996 04:30:36 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <01bbe3f7$482c2320$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-155-226.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Anyone know of any mods to open up the UHF receive on the Alinco DJ-G1T?

Also, is this an unpopular radio?  I have one & like it a lot, but I hardly
see any for sale on newsgroups or in magazines.  I don't know if very few
people have them or if everyone likes them so much nobody want to get rid
of them.


---------------------------
Rodney Isom
[e-mail]
Birmingham, AL


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!uhog.mit.edu!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!samba.rahul.net!rahul.net!a2i!bug.rahul.net!rahul.net!a2i!ns2.mainstreet.net!ns1.aplatform.com!pagesat.net!news.cyberhighway.net!not-for-mail
From: "bert foosher" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: moronic,bored,burt
Date: 2 Dec 1996 05:34:26 GMT
Organization: CyberHighway Internet Services
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <01bbe013$c5b9a8e0$23e91ace@hob>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-00.mcl.cyberhighway.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

     Burt, if you can't offer something constructive, interesting, or at
least funny, go pester your wife (poor gal) or write a sit-com or
something. I think I speak for a HUGE number of people who are REALLY tired
of you. You may have had something worthwile to offer once, (not recently)
but your attitude stinks, and your posts are worse than useless, since they
reflect your dreary outlook.  Get out of the house more (don't take your
laptop, please).  You might as well remove your call from your sig as well
since you despise what it stands for.


                                                       Hob Quimby


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!uwm.edu!news.he.net!night.primate.wisc.edu!ames!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse code
Date: 2 Dec 1996 09:35:18 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <57u7sm$[e-mail]>
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Edward Oros  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>[e-mail] wrote:

>> Does anybody have any CW frequencies for the novice to practice on.
>> Or any for that matter.

>Why not just practice with Morse code software or on-line at
>http://www.qth.com/antenna

Does anyone else see this response as extremely unusual?

What's the fun of listening to computer-generated code when you can instead
get on the Novice frequencies and actually carry on a (CW) conversation
with a live human being hundreds or thousands of miles away?

Novice Class HF CW frequencies:
80m: 3700-3750 kHz
40m: 7100-7150 kHz
15m: 21.1-21.2 MHz
10m: 28.1-28.5 MHz

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:35 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-7.sprintlink.net!news.lightlink.com!mv!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Joel B Levin)
Subject: Re: Morse code
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/16.335
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Organization: At home.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: levin.mv.com
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 13:06:44 GMT
Lines: 28

In <57u7sm$[e-mail]>,
   [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:
|What's the fun of listening to computer-generated code when you can instead
|get on the Novice frequencies and actually carry on a (CW) conversation
|with a live human being hundreds or thousands of miles away?

Also, somehow, I found using CW on the air improved my code much more
quickly than using tapes or computer programs, both of which seemed
extremely boring and hard to stick to for five minutes straight.  (ARRL CW
practice broadcasts were an exception, maybe because it meant sitting by the
radio and listening.)

|Novice Class HF CW frequencies:
|80m: 3700-3750 kHz
|40m: 7100-7150 kHz
|15m: 21.1-21.2 MHz
|10m: 28.1-28.5 MHz

Technically (i.e. legally) true, but CW is usually confined to 28.1 - 28.3.
Novices and tech+ are permitted to use 28.3 - 28.5 for SSB also, so CW is
generally kept below 28.3.

                /JBL  KD1ON

--
Nets:   [e-mail] | Public keys available at
 or  [e-mail] |        http://www.mv.com/ipusers/levin/pgpkeys.txt
* If you send me abusive or threatening e-mail, I will probably post it. *


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!cedar.liii.com!phydeaux
From: [e-mail] (riot nrrrd)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse code
Date: 2 Dec 1996 20:37:49 GMT
Organization: Long Island Information, Inc.  516-INTERNET
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <57vemt$[e-mail]>
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rowan.liii.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

if nothing else, doing code live also means bettering operating
practices...and being a better ham

--
73 de Dave Weingart  KB2CWF                 "Can you find the Valium?
mailto:[e-mail]                     Can you bring it soon?
mailto:[e-mail]        Lost Johnny's out there
http://www.liii.com/~phydeaux                Baying at the Moon"
                                                   -- Hawkwind

BY SENDING UNSOLICTED, COMMERCIAL SPAM EMAIL TO THIS ADDRESS, YOU HEREBY
AGREE TO RECEIVE UP TO 20 MEGABYTES OF RANDOM CORE DUMP INFORMATION.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.intercomm.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Julian Maccassey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse code
Date: 2 Dec 1996 16:32:33 -0800
Organization: The Plastic Jesus Factory
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <57vsf1$[e-mail]>
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vemt$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: limerock.intercomm.com

In article <57vemt$[e-mail]>,
riot nrrrd <[e-mail]> wrote:
>if nothing else, doing code live also means bettering operating
>practices...and being a better ham

        I remind myself of this piece of wisdom and truth EVERY
time I listen to the HF bands. Especially 80M.

--
Chunkstyle - The way you like your road pizza


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:38 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!psinntp!psinntp!sunsrvr6!djw
From: [e-mail] (David Wright)
Subject: Re: Morse code
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Operator)
Organization: Northern Telecom, Network Application Systems
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 1996 20:09:06 GMT
Lines: 11

In article <57u7sm$[e-mail]>,
Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Edward Oros  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>Novice Class HF CW frequencies:
>80m: 3700-3750 kHz

Better make that 80m: 3675 - 3725!

Dave


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:39 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.94.215.18!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Morse code
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 10:56:16 GMT
Lines: 46

In article <57u7sm$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:
>Edward Oros  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Why not just practice with Morse code software or on-line at
>>http://www.qth.com/antenna
>
>Does anyone else see this response as extremely unusual?

No. It seems like very practical advice to me. Since the tests are now
computer generated, it simulates the receiving test environment quite
accurately. Thus it makes a good wetware conditioning drill. As long as
the Morse hazing ritual exists, it might as well be gotten over as quickly
and efficiently as possible.

>What's the fun of listening to computer-generated code when you can instead
>get on the Novice frequencies and actually carry on a (CW) conversation
>with a live human being hundreds or thousands of miles away?

The purpose to be achieved by the Novice Class is to get the Morse hazing
out of the way as quickly and efficiently as possible so you can move on
to more interesting and useful communications methods. Exchanging a few
acronyms and abbreviations with someone with a shaky fist on a noisy band
is no longer the most efficient way to reach that goal. It is a poor
simulation of current testing conditions. The computer drill routines
are better.

Nor is the exchange of a few abbreviations considered "fun" by many people.
If it were "fun", everyone would do it voluntarily, and there would be no
further excuse for the forced recruitment of the Morse receiving speed tests.
No other amateur communications method requires a government mandate to get
people to use it. That's a good indication that many don't find it "fun".
(If they did, everyone would be using Morse, and would hold an Extra Class
license.)

>Novice Class HF CW frequencies:
>80m: 3700-3750 kHz

You might want to get a current copy of Part 97. That hasn't been the
80m Novice band for quite some time.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!panix!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.60.229.7!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.insinc.net!news.cadvision.com!usenet
From: Raj Singh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse code - a simple request
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 12:44:58 -0800
Organization: CADVision Development Corp.
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: agte124.cadvision.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I)

Hi
Check in to AC6V's home page. There are all sorts of links to CW sites
with lots of shareware and freeware CW software to tak eyou from 0 to
60.
http://pw2.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
73
Raj VE6RAJ


> I could REALLY use some help here - would some kind hams please email me
> some
> text files containing example QSO's? Best to send as attachments so I
> don't see
> the contents. I can feed them into my code practice program and get used
> to
> copying words as opposed to random text.
>
> Thanks in advance for anyone who helps.
>
> Bob Lyons, KC8FGZ
> [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.id.net!news.cic.net!news.itd.umich.edu!usenet
From: Robert Lyons <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse code - a simple request
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 09:07:19 -0400
Organization: University of Michigan
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5784au$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: seqdir.brcf.med.umich.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>
> Edward Oros  <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >[e-mail] wrote:
>
> >> Does anybody have any CW frequencies for the novice to practice on.
> >> Or any for that matter.
>
> >Why not just practice with Morse code software or on-line at
> >http://www.qth.com/antenna
>
> Does anyone else see this response as extremely unusual?
>
> What's the fun of listening to computer-generated code when you can instead
> get on the Novice frequencies and actually carry on a (CW) conversation
> with a live human being hundreds or thousands of miles away?
>

That's all very well, Jeff, but I have no HF rig. With my newly-minted
first
license (tech+ three weeks ago), I bought a 2M HT and a few accessories.
I
have no money to buy anything like an HF receiver. I'm studying for my
General
and Advanced (the tests are easy - it's the code that's a bitch). All I
have
for practicing is computer-generated code and the ARRL tapes. Once
through
the tapes and I know them too well to use them again - a couple letters
into
each sentence and I can anticipate most of the rest. I'm OK at the
computer-
generated random letters, but when I start getting real words, I
automatically
try to interpret the words as they come in, which takes my attention off
the
primary task - translating the code! My speed drops from 13 wpm to below
10.

I could REALLY use some help here - would some kind hams please email me
some
text files containing example QSO's? Best to send as attachments so I
don't see
the contents. I can feed them into my code practice program and get used
to
copying words as opposed to random text.

Thanks in advance for anyone who helps.

Bob Lyons, KC8FGZ
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!dsm6.dsmnet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Dean T. Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse code - a simple request
Date: 7 Dec 1996 20:39:20 GMT
Organization: Miller and Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slppp05.dsmnet.com
X-Newsreader: OUI TE 1.5

In article <[e-mail]>, From Robert Lyons
<[e-mail]>, the following was written:
> I could REALLY use some help here - would some kind hams please email
> me some
> text files containing example QSO's? Best to send as attachments so I
> don't see
> the contents

There's at least one of the computer Morse trainers that generates
random QSOs and then builds FCC-type test questions from them.  I don't
recall which one, but it might be Morse Academy.

Other than that, either spring for $20 and get the Ziliak tapes (from
beginner to Expert -- 714-990-8442) or about $30 for a Ten-Tec direct
conversion receiver kit or $25 for the regen receiver kit
(800-833-7373).



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!compuserve.com!news.compuserve.co.uk!newsgate.compuserve.com!newsmaster
From: [e-mail] (Tom, K4NR)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse code - a simple request
Date: 10 Dec 1996 04:28:48 GMT
Organization: CompuServe Incorporated
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57u7sm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dd74-188.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: OUI PRO 1.5.0.1

In article <[e-mail]>, From Robert Lyons
<[e-mail]>, the following was written:
> I
> automatically
> try to interpret the words as they come in, which takes my attention
> off the
> primary task - translating the code! My speed drops from 13 wpm to
> below 10.


Bob,

You hit the nail on the head--don't worry about missed letters or try to
guess the word.  Clear the mind and copy what you hear.  Eventually,
you'll copy it in your head and understand what it means.  It like
learning a new language--first you translate, later you learn to
understand and think in the new language.  It just takes practice.

Try 15 minutes a couple of times a day--any longer and the mind
wanders...

GL es 73 de Tom

--
Thomas Branch, K4NR
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: MOTOROLA PAGERS
Date: 10 Dec 1996 03:25:23 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.187
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155




Motorola Bravo Pagers  $55.00


$4.00 per month service available, just prepay 1 year, all states
available.


Email me or see my web page:


www.angelfire.com/biz/pager/index.html


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MOTOROLA PAGERS
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:23:59 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <58jra6$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:




>Motorola Bravo Pagers  $55.00


New?  I will take 50 at that price.  Email me a address.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Anthony S. Pelliccio)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MOTOROLA PAGERS
Date: 10 Dec 1996 09:53:55 -0500
Organization: Ideamation, Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58jti3$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>,
1 <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Motorola Bravo Pagers  $55.00

Hmmmm.. around these parts you can get Bravo pagers for free.

>$4.00 per month service available, just prepay 1 year, all states
>available.

And the service is only $3.95 a month. Do you think all hams are stupid?

Tony




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: My original posting
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 10:37:16 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nyc-ny7-12.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 07  7:36:15 AM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E-NC250  (Win16; U)

To all concerned:
       My original posting was never meant as a personal attack on
anyone, although some people took it as such. It was meant to Inform
people that contrary to what some othrrs may not want us to hear, our
amatuer bands Are in DANGER. Just imagine for a moment, that the Fcc
was'nt here anymore. Now, a lot of us hate the Fcc, Myself included. But,
if not for them, Bell Labs, Lucent, MCI ,and ahost of other preadators
would have eatrn us alive ages ago. Why should we worry about 70cm. In
Gautemala? Because 2m.Is next on the Itu's menu. So, let's do what Mr.
Bell labs says,and lay off the java...
                    Dave/KB2ZYO


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: My original posting, part two
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 08:56:08 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nyc-ny7-16.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 10  7:55:07 AM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E-NC250  (Win16; U)

Roger:
      As I said, my original posting was Not meant as A personal attack
on ANYONE. It was meant to stir the pot. People keep on saying that if we
just lay back and ignore a problem, it will just go away. My point is
that if We (hams) ignore This paticular problem, Albiet it ocourring In a
so called "bannana republic" , How long before it could occour here?
 As to my inproficincey at e- mail, yes, I freely admit I have a spelling
problem, it's called DYSLEXIA.
                         Dave/ KB2ZYO


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!psinntp!psinntp!news.intercon.com!news5.digex.net!haven.umd.edu!dailyplanet.wam.umd.edu!ham
From: [e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need a Form 610 for upgrading?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 14:10:00 GMT
Organization: I need to put my ORGANIZATION here.
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <5899fo$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: w3eax.umd.edu

So W5YI is doing it for a fee, huh?

I saw an offer for someone withg a big stack of 610s.

I also have a good stack of Form 610s and will gladly
send one, two, five, etc. with an SASE.
--
* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.124.68.65!newsfeed.gte.net!usenet
From: Clyde Young <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need a Form 610 for upgrading?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 04:01:45 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5899fo$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dfw70186.gte.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E-GTE  (Win95; I; 16bit)

Scott Rosenfeld NF3I wrote:
>
> So W5YI is doing it for a fee, huh?
>


I downloaded mine from a webpage and the FCC accepted it as valid.


KF5QU


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need a Form 610 for upgrading?
Date: 8 Dec 1996 01:12:44 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5899fo$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <5899fo$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Scott
Rosenfeld NF3I) writes:

>Subject:       Need a Form 610 for upgrading?
>From:  [e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I)
>Date:  6 Dec 1996 14:10:00 GMT
>
>So W5YI is doing it for a fee, huh?
>
>I saw an offer for someone withg a big stack of 610s.
>
>I also have a good stack of Form 610s and will gladly
>send one, two, five, etc. with an SASE.
>--
>* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
>*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
>** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
>* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *

I might point out that the FCC will also accept copies that are
photocopied, printed and the like.   The FCC has a lousy image of its 610
on its web page that it will also accept.  I also know that a 610 produced
by KC6TYF in a pattern to be loaded by Microsoft Excel works even if the
form is produced Quattro Pro.  In other words, if the form has all of the
info required, and is signed, the FCC takes it now, unlike the first time
I sent in a photocopy of a 610 in the early 80's, and some member of the
staff took the time to type in the info I had put on the photocopy onto a
610 and send it back with a little note that I had to sign and date it,
and send it back in the enclosed envelope as the FCC couldn't presently
accept photocopies.  -art clemons-


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.nidlink.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bad  Dog)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need a Relay & a Place 2 Get 1 !
Date: 11 Dec 1996 01:47:54 GMT
Organization: Radiowave Connection
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58l3sa$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm5-1.nidlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

Help I need a Relay !!!   I own this older 10 meter/6 meter amplifier
(AfterBurner  Model# 403) and it has been in the closet for a few years so I
took it apart and thought I should clean the relay (it looked kinda dirty)
Well, after the file treatment things don't seem to be as flat as they
should and now the realy shoots sparks when you key up. So know I went on
this search in the net and can't find nothing about a Relay. I even check
all the parts catalogs I have and nobody has a simple Relay. Can Anybody out
there help me find the right parts people? If so please help me I need a
Relay and I need a new parts catalog  Thanx :)



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-penn.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.belnet.be!swsbe6.switch.ch!swidir.switch.ch!01-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!Austria.EU.net!EU.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need a Relay & a Place 2 Get 1 !
Date: 11 Dec 1996 07:29:59 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58lntn$[e-mail]>
References: <58l3sa$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Bad  Dog <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Help I need a Relay !!!   I own this older 10 meter/6 meter amplifier
>(AfterBurner  Model# 403) and it has been in the closet for a few years so I

Could "Bad Dog" actually be an 11m bad boy?

Contact the manufacturer of the "AfterBurner" and request a new relay
from them.

KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.66.12.35!news-in.iadfw.net!dal04-02.ppp.iadfw.net!user
From: [e-mail] (Gerald Crenshaw)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.packet
Subject: Need and article for your club newsletter???
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 07:34:58 -0600
Organization: INTERNET AMERICA
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dal04-02.ppp.iadfw.net
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119924 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32461 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43808 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21821

Hi,
  Name here is Gerry (WD4BIS) and I have been writing a column for our
club newsletter called "New Ham Partner". With the influx of No Code
Technicians on the repeater, asking the same kinds of questions I asked 20
years ago, I have been trying to answer them.
   Some of the articles are technical, some of them are general
information, but they all address subjects that our new friends are
struggling with.

I have set up a web page for these articles. On this page, I will place
the columns I have already published in past issues of our newsletter.
Doing this on a web page has advantages, the big one being that the
articles wont expire in a newsgroup, I can edit old ones or add new
columns as write them, and I wont have to send re-posts.

The Cost... I will ask that you do not edit the articles, and use my
by-line. If you use them, send me an E-mail and let me know when and
where. If you have a spare stamp mail me a copy of your newsletter to the
address on the page.

Where...  http://web2.airmail.net/gerryc/newham.html

Please bear in mind this site is still under construction and not all of
them are there yet, but they soon will be. Some of the URL's arent
resolving yet and some in reformating the text are doing funny things. But
I am still working on it


73's

Gerry Crenshaw


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!iag.net!news.utelfla.com!news.CT.NET!usenet
From: [e-mail] (eon Wiltsey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: need help bad
Date: 8 Dec 1996 19:03:24 GMT
Organization: CT.NET
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <58f3ds$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm03_21.ct.net
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.6

I need a copy of a rca tube manual, 1946 thru 1970's
Will pay any reasonable price plus shipping.
I am a disabled senior in central fl
call 941 471 37 39 collect or Email leeboo@ ct.net.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: need help bad
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 21:25:01 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58f3ds$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 73.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

eon Wiltsey wrote:
>
> I need a copy of a rca tube manual, 1946 thru 1970's
> Will pay any reasonable price plus shipping.
> I am a disabled senior in central fl
> call 941 471 37 39 collect or Email leeboo@ ct.net.

I have one

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |  If you sit on the fence, it is a pain in the butt|
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:23:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!admaix.sunydutchess.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!dsinc!spool.mu.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Help with your credit problems i could help
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 03:07:16 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans44.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

need help with your credit problem he can help but need help with
grammar he not the person.

[e-mail] (Webmasters) wrote:

>http://www.infoxxxxx.com/spam



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.dp.beckman.com!inet.dp.beckman.com!newsmaster
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need info on Micro-tel
Message-ID: <589obv$[e-mail]>
From: [e-mail]
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 18:23:50 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: DDC, Beckman Instruments, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: 134.217.88.33
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Lines: 9

Hi,

  I bought a Micro-tel "wide range receiver" type wr200 at a swap meet
some time ago and was wondering if anyone had a manual for it.

                                Thanks,
                                     Ed




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.inforamp.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Geoff Geduld)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need info on old Polish oscilloscope
Date: 5 Dec 1996 19:45:52 GMT
Organization: iSTAR Internet Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <5878pg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-08.tor.istar.ca
Keywords: osciloscope info. schematic
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4

Need information or schematic drawings for a recently aquired Polish made
oscilloscope. Markings say ZAE RADIOTECHNIKA, Wroclaw, Model ST-315 11.
Well built in  20 year old style but no EHT or +12V/-12v supply, which appears

to be generated by an internal switching inverter.
Anyone know where I am likely to get required info.

Geoff, VA3GEG
[e-mail]

This is my attempt at generating/maintaining a Frequently Asked Questions
document for the usenet newsgroup reader, "News Xpress."

DISCLAIMER: The information contained within this document was mostly
extracted from public posts made to alt.usenet.offline-reader, alt.winsock,
news.software.readers, and alt.winsock.trumpet and thus has only the
credibility of the original poster (although I will try to verify and
correct all information included).  I will try to give proper credit where
credit is due.

     THIS DOCUMENT IS PROVIDED "AS-IS" AND ANY USE OF IT IS AT YOUR
     OWN RISK.  I MAKE NO CLAIM THAT THIS DOCUMENT IS COMPLETE,
     ACCURATE, TRUTHFUL, USABLE, OR ANYTHING ELSE THAT WOULD MAKE ME
     LIABLE FOR YOUR SCREW-UP.  FURTHER, I MAKE NO CLAIM TO THE
     OWNERSHIP OF ANY RIGHTS TO ANY OF THE INFORMATION IN THIS DOCUMENT.

Having said that, please consider affording me the courtesy of allowing
me to be the sole person to maintain this FAQ simply to prevent 267
different versions floating around in cyberspace.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!interpath!news.interpath.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.inforamp.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Geoff Geduld)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need info on old Polish oscilloscope
Date: 5 Dec 1996 18:59:30 GMT
Organization: iSTAR Internet Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58762i$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts17-08.tor.istar.ca
Keywords: osciloscope info. schematic
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4

Need information or schematic drawings for a recently aquired Polish made
oscilloscope. Markings say ZAE RADIOTECHNIKA, Wroclaw, Model ST-315 11.
Well built in  20 year old style but no EHT or +12V/-12v supply, which appears

to be generated by an internal switching inverter.
Anyone know where I am likely to get required info.

Geoff, VA3GEG
[e-mail]

This is my attempt at generating/maintaining a Frequently Asked Questions
document for the usenet newsgroup reader, "News Xpress."

DISCLAIMER: The information contained within this document was mostly
extracted from public posts made to alt.usenet.offline-reader, alt.winsock,
news.software.readers, and alt.winsock.trumpet and thus has only the
credibility of the original poster (although I will try to verify and
correct all information included).  I will try to give proper credit where
credit is due.

     THIS DOCUMENT IS PROVIDED "AS-IS" AND ANY USE OF IT IS AT YOUR
     OWN RISK.  I MAKE NO CLAIM THAT THIS DOCUMENT IS COMPLETE,
     ACCURATE, TRUTHFUL, USABLE, OR ANYTHING ELSE THAT WOULD MAKE ME
     LIABLE FOR YOUR SCREW-UP.  FURTHER, I MAKE NO CLAIM TO THE
     OWNERSHIP OF ANY RIGHTS TO ANY OF THE INFORMATION IN THIS DOCUMENT.

Having said that, please consider affording me the courtesy of allowing
me to be the sole person to maintain this FAQ simply to prevent 267
different versions floating around in cyberspace.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need info on old Polish oscilloscope
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:34 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58acp3$[e-mail]>
References: <587ge8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-172.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold") wrote:

>In article <587ge8$[e-mail]>
>           [e-mail] "Geoff Geduld" writes:

>> Need information or schematic drawings for a recently aquired Polish made
>> oscilloscope.

>Question:

>      How many postings does it take to ask about a Polish 'scope?

>[ :-) for my Polish friends. ]
>--
>   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
>                                                [e-mail]
>                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na

Four, obviously.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need info on old Polish oscilloscope
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 96 10:55:52 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <587ge8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <587ge8$[e-mail]>
           [e-mail] "Geoff Geduld" writes:

> Need information or schematic drawings for a recently aquired Polish made
> oscilloscope.

Question:

      How many postings does it take to ask about a Polish 'scope?

[ :-) for my Polish friends. ]
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need Info:  Milcom International 220 Amplifier
Date: 4 Dec 1996 17:45:15 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Hi,

Our club is trading for a Milcom International 220 MHz amplifier.  Model
number
P15-05F2-C1-M.  Runs on 28 Volts

This is a robust unit that takes a 200 mw signal and has an output of 150
watts.
the unit is nicely packaged and should be a great repeater amplifier.

My problem, no documentation.  Any one ever heard of this thing?

73


Mike, WB8VBW
The Mid-Atlantic DX & Repeater Associaiton


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need Knwd Filter Advice
Date: 5 Dec 1996 00:26:14 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

I have a Kenwood TS-690SAT that has only the stock filters.  I'm looking
for advice on which filters to get and where to get them.  I'd like to
know which ones you find most useful, and also if there are high-quality
filters from other sources at a more reasonable price than the Kenwood
units.
Thanks!
David, N8DO


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!pacbell.com!pb2esac!jaminge
From: [e-mail] (John Minger)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need text based call sign lookup (not web)
Date: 4 Dec 1996 18:10:14 GMT
Organization: Pacific Bell, ESAC
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <584eq6$[e-mail]>
References: <5842ed$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pb2esac.esac.pacbell.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In article <5842ed$[e-mail]>,
Darvell D. Hunt <[e-mail]> wrote:
>I may have a new callsign but cannot check any of the
>web sites right now because I do not have web access
>for two weeks!  I'm going crazy!  Can someone please
>direct me to a text-based callsign database so I can
>check to see if I got my new vanity call sign?!
>
>Thanks!
>Darvell (KE7GW)
>[e-mail]

Below is a copy of the QRZ e-mail information, taken from URL:

http://www.qrz.com/email_if.html

It requires a callsign as input, but since you already have one,
I'd bet it would be able to find your new call.

--------------------------------------

How to access the QRZ Callsign Database via Email:

To search and retrieve callsign data by e-mail, send a message to lookup@qrz.c
om
as shown below:


To: [e-mail]
Subject:

lookup aa7bq
lookup w1aw

---------------------------------------------------------

>(Please email because I will not have news access for
>two weeks as well!)

Done.

73 de John, AC6VV


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.es.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Darvell D. Hunt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need text based call sign lookup (not web)
Date: 4 Dec 1996 14:39:09 GMT
Organization: Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp., SLC, Utah
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5842ed$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cessna.corp.es.com
X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #1 (NOV)

I may have a new callsign but cannot check any of the
web sites right now because I do not have web access
for two weeks!  I'm going crazy!  Can someone please
direct me to a text-based callsign database so I can
check to see if I got my new vanity call sign?!

Thanks!
Darvell (KE7GW)
[e-mail]

(Please email because I will not have news access for
two weeks as well!)

--
Darvell D. Hunt    [e-mail]
Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp.
     Salt Lake City, Utah


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:10 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.254.2.53!nonexistent.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Mark S. Bond)
Subject: Re: Need text based call sign lookup (not web)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.4
X-Nntp-Posting-User: (Unauthenticated)
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5842ed$[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Trace: 849729655/25496
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: i123.192.world2u.com
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 20:02:32 GMT
Lines: 22

In article <5842ed$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Darvell D. Hunt)
wrote:

> I may have a new callsign but cannot check any of the
> web sites right now because I do not have web access
> for two weeks!  I'm going crazy!  Can someone please
> direct me to a text-based callsign database so I can
> check to see if I got my new vanity call sign?!

Darvell, I checked the ARRL and WM7D servers which are pretty much up to
the minute. Your vanity call has NOT been processed yet...

--mark

--
   .-.                                                         .-.
  /   \           .-.                           .-.           /   \
 /     \         /   \       .-.     .-.       /   \         /     \
/------Mark S. Bond  W2MB---/---\---/---\-----/[e-mail]-\
         \     /       \   /     `-'     \   /       \     /
          \   /         `-'               `-'         \   /
           `-'                                         `-'


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!ratty.wolfe.net!usenet
From: "J. Andy Thompson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need text based call sign lookup (not web)
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 08:16:24 -0800
Organization: Thompson Realtors
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5842ed$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: yak2-ts1-p05.wolfenet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)
To: "Darvell D. Hunt" <[e-mail]>

Darvell D. Hunt wrote:
>
> I may have a new callsign but cannot check any of the
> web sites right now because I do not have web access
> for two weeks!  I'm going crazy!  Can someone please
> direct me to a text-based callsign database so I can
> check to see if I got my new vanity call sign?!
>
> Thanks!
> Darvell (KE7GW)
> [e-mail]
>
> (Please email because I will not have news access for
> two weeks as well!)
>
> --
> Darvell D. Hunt    [e-mail]
> Evans & Sutherland Computer Corp.
>      Salt Lake City, Utah



Congratulations!  You are N7LN,...issued December 4th.

Andy


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sgi.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!bcm.tmc.edu!newshost.convex.com!newsgate.duke.edu!interpath!news.interpath.net!news.interpath.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Curt Phillips)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need text based call sign lookup (not web)
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 06:40:23 GMT
Organization: Mystic Knights of the Sea
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58if83$[e-mail]>
References: <5842ed$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cphillips.pdial.interpath.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Darvell D. Hunt) wrote:
>I may have a new callsign but cannot check any of the
>web sites right now because I do not have web access
>for two weeks!  I'm going crazy!  Can someone please
>direct me to a text-based callsign database so I can
>check to see if I got my new vanity call sign?!

  For those with Telnet access, the excellent U.Arkansas at Little Rock
database is available at
callsign.ualr.edu    Port 2000

=========== Opinions expressed are solely those of the author ==========
Curt Phillips, CEM K4CP exKD4YU;WB4LHI| They that can give up essential
Engineer/ Writer/ Gadgeteer/ Raconteur| liberty to obtain a little
Chairman, Tar Heel Scanner/SWL Group  | temporary safety deserve neither
ARRL Life; QCWA; Raleigh ARS; NRA; AEE|liberty nor safety. -Ben Franklin
==== [e-mail] ====== [Copyright 1996 All rights reserved]====



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!osshe.edu!engr.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need to know coax length
Date: 1 Dec 1996 11:26:26 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <57rq12$[e-mail]>
References: <56r01p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57o9pb$[e-mail]> <57oicv$[e-mail]> <57pctt$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Jim Kehler ([e-mail]) wrote:
: >Enough to go from the radio to the antenna.

: >If you are worried about coax losses, use the lowest loss coax you can
: >afford. Just don't have a lot of excess length - as length does equal
: >loss.

: >Bill

: I'd suggest a couple feet extra, in case you ever want to move the radio to
: dust under it.  And don't use RG58 on 2 meters unless you really have to....
....

Heh, heh! I intentionally used RG58 on a 900 MHz installation. I wanted the
high loss. It was cheaper than using a varilator.

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!osshe.edu!engr.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need to know coax length
Date: 1 Dec 1996 11:29:07 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <57rq63$[e-mail]>
References: <56r01p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57o9pb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

[e-mail] wrote:
: Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> writes:
:
: >The answer remains the same. Every foot of extra feedline beyond
:
: Hmmmmm, how much loss in two more feet?

3 dB more, if the shortest possible length is 2 feet.

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.indy.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!btnet!netcom.net.uk!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need to know coax length
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 96 21:08:36 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <56r01p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57o9pb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57rq63$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.dircon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <57rq63$[e-mail]> [e-mail] "Bill Nelson" writes:

> [e-mail] wrote:
> : Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> writes:
> :
> : >The answer remains the same. Every foot of extra feedline beyond
> :
> : Hmmmmm, how much loss in two more feet?
>
> 3 dB more, if the shortest possible length is 2 feet.

Yikes, if your experience is to expect 1.5dB loss per foot of coax,
Bill, you really should try to choose a better brand :-)

Regards.
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.80.63.252!delphi.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need to know coax length
Date: Tue, 3 DEC 96 01:31:35 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <56r01p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57o9pb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57rq63$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.93.4.2
X-To: Bill Nelson <[e-mail]>

Bill Nelson <[e-mail]> writes:

>3 dB more, if the shortest possible length is 2 feet.

Better check the books!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!wetware!wsrcc.com!newsfeed.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need to know coax length
Date: 3 Dec 1996 08:59:07 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <580q4r$[e-mail]>
References: <56r01p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57o9pb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57rq63$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

[e-mail] wrote:
: Bill Nelson <[e-mail]> writes:
:
: >3 dB more, if the shortest possible length is 2 feet.
:
: Better check the books!

Oh?  If the needed length is 2 feet, and the person adds 2 spare feet,
the loss in the cable is going to be twice as much - 3 dB more.

Now, that does not mean that there will be 3 dB loss, only that the
loss is doubled.

Confused yet?  It is because dB is being used in two different contexts,
so provides two different results.

Bill


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:18 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Need to know coax length
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <56r01p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57o9pb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57rq63$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 14:20:43 GMT
Lines: 25

In article <57rq63$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>: Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> writes:
>: >The answer remains the same. Every foot of extra feedline beyond
>:
>: Hmmmmm, how much loss in two more feet?
>
>3 dB more, if the shortest possible length is 2 feet.

Hmmm, that's mighty lossy coax you're using there, Bill.

Doubling the length does double the loss, but that doesn't mean
3 db. 3 db means you've lost *half* your power. If the cable only
has a loss of 0.02 db per foot, then going from 2 feet to 4 feet
increases loss from 0.04 db to 0.08 db, not 3 db.

BTW, 0.02 db per foot is typical of high grade coax like 9913 at
a frequency of 400 MHz.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: New E-net Adress
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:28 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58acou$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-172.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Ronparks) wrote:

>Hello all you Island bound snow covered people, I just got another modem
>and have joined up with a local BBS just so I can use E-mail, my new
>adress should show up on the top of this message but just in case it
>doesnt here it is....."[e-mail]"
> I hope you get this as you didnt say if you were back on the internet
>or not.    I had my catarac surgery yesterday, I went in at 8:300am and
>I was out again at 10:00am hows that for speed?  I went in and got the
>dressing off and the Doc says I am only one point off of 20-20 with that
>eye, and that its is very good for only one day. Mom is feeling a lot
>better these days she still has a bit of a cough but its getting better
>all the time. LET ME KNOW IF YOU DONT GET THIS..Mmmmmmmm ! !
>bye for now lots of love Mom & Dad.

Hi Dad,
    Yep, we got it. Matter of fact, the whole world got it.  Glad to hear the
cataract surgery went OK.  Very speedy. Too bad the doctor doesn't charge
by the hour instead of by the eye.
    No snow on our island, although it did get pretty chilly here tonite, it w
as

down to 79 degrees.  Winters in the Pacific get colder every year.
    Glad to hear Mom is feeling better.  Give Mom a kiss for me.  You two
have a Merry Christmas. Keep in touch.  Let me know if you don't get this.

Bye for Now,
Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.i2020.net!root
From: "Pat Wilson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: New Wed Site
Date: 12 Dec 1996 00:14:48 GMT
Organization: Pat's Place
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <01bbe7c0$af421020$2a01e8cc@home>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: onramp3-9.i2020.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

There is a bug in your subject area here.


(smile)

N5PW

Roger A. McCarty <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> New Web Site at;
>
> http://www.geocities.com/~kd6cc
>
> Bug reports welcome
>
> Thanks
>
> Roger KD6CC
>
> --
> Accurate!
>    Electronics
>
> Roger A. McCarty
> Riverside, CA  USA
> http://www.accurate-electronics.com
> http://www.geocities.com/~kd6cc
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Newsgroup proposal(Was: Steve has REALLY lost his F-ing mind!)
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 17:59:40 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <57v5an$[e-mail]>
References: <578ig4$[e-mail]> <01bbda32$7b672d80$[e-mail]> <57dcr8$[e-mail]> <57ja82$[e-mail]> <01bbdf91$eb4a7d00$5801e8cc@home> <57skjh$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-147.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119414 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43749

[e-mail] (Porky) wrote:

>Carl! Stop! You're bringing tears to our eyes. I really think you
>should seek psychiatric care, perhaps with the correct medication,
>these paranoid delusions will go away. It seems as if anything anyone
>says is subject to you jacking them up over some code issue. Give it a
>rest, already. Anything you say or feel isn't going to mean SHIT to
>the FCC, so why do you waste your time and our bandwidth with your
>incessant whining about this subject? You have stated your opinion,
>and everyone is aware of what it is. And nobody gives a damn, just as
>they don't give a damn about my opinion either--so find something else
>to do with your time, will you? I'm finally taking this opportunity to
>add you to my killfile, for the rest of existance--I don't know why
>I've taken so long to do it!

Well, Squiggie, I guess we can't add Porky to your fan club, huh.....

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Newsgroup proposal(Was: Steve has REALLY lost his F-ing mind!)
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 17:57:32 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <57v56q$[e-mail]>
References: <578ig4$[e-mail]> <01bbda32$7b672d80$[e-mail]> <57dcr8$[e-mail]> <57ja82$[e-mail]> <01bbdf91$eb4a7d00$5801e8cc@home> <57skjh$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-147.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119416 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43751

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>In <01bbdf91$eb4a7d00$5801e8cc@home>, "Pat Wilson" <[e-mail]> writes:
>>This is a misc group, so what's your problem?  skip the friggin" messages
>>if you don't wanna read em.
>>
>>So what do you have to say that's so important, Jim?
>>
>>N5PW

>Pat,

>Jim (and other pro-coders) have an agenda ... it's obvious, so I won't
>call it a hidden agenda ... they want to squelch any and all debate on
>the issue of elminating CW testing as a licensing requirement for HF
>access.

>They throw up all sorts of strawmen, designed to evoke flames and
>unreasonable fears of the "terrible calamity that will befall ham radio
>if we eliminate CW testing" ... they also try at every possible
>opportunity to equate "eliminate CW testing" with "eliminate the use of
>CW", which is a toatally bogus assertion ... not one single no-code
>advocate has ever to my knowledge said "ban the code" ... we have all
>CONSISTENTLY said that is NOT our goal in any way ...

>Anyway ... they like to bitch and complain and call anything they don't
>want OTHERS to hear "flaming" and suggest that those ideas and opinions
>should be banished from the newsgroups ... as you said, they could
>simply choose not to read messages, but it's more than that ... they
>want to SUPRESS the ideas that those messages voice ... because they're
>afraid that those ideas will catch on and become "the way things are"
>and they want things to stay "the way things WERE" ... stagnated in the
>past.

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

Horse Pucky, Squiggie. I am here for the sole purpose of getting on your nerve
s.
No hidden agendas.  No strawpeople.  And if I do say so myself, it seems to be
working.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!panix!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Newsgroup proposal(Was: Steve has REALLY lost his F-ing mind!)
Date: 3 Dec 1996 01:50:44 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58011k$[e-mail]>
References: <578ig4$[e-mail]> <01bbda32$7b672d80$[e-mail]> <57dcr8$[e-mail]> <57ja82$[e-mail]> <01bbdf91$eb4a7d00$5801e8cc@home> <57skjh$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57v5an$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: dyn-max02-217.chi.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119473 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43773

In <57v5an$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler
) writes:
>[e-mail] (Porky) wrote:
>
>>Carl! Stop! You're bringing tears to our eyes. I really think you
>>should seek psychiatric care, perhaps with the correct medication,
>>these paranoid delusions will go away. It seems as if anything anyone
>>says is subject to you jacking them up over some code issue. Give it a
>>rest, already. Anything you say or feel isn't going to mean SHIT to
>>the FCC, so why do you waste your time and our bandwidth with your
>>incessant whining about this subject? You have stated your opinion,
>>and everyone is aware of what it is. And nobody gives a damn, just as
>>they don't give a damn about my opinion either--so find something else
>>to do with your time, will you? I'm finally taking this opportunity to
>>add you to my killfile, for the rest of existance--I don't know why
>>I've taken so long to do it!
>
>Well, Squiggie, I guess we can't add Porky to your fan club, huh.....
>
>73, Jim KH2D

Breaks my heart! ... I was REALLY counting on having *at least one*
"Porky" in there! How WILL I live?  How WILL I live?

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!news.missouri.edu!newshub.more.net!nntp.newsfirst.com!nntp.crosslink.net!munnari.OZ.AU!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!163.181.251.1!news2.amd.com!txnntp.amd.com!usenet
From: Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 11:47:19 -0600
Organization: AMD
Lines: 60
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ramulale.amd.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119598 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43819

Carl Stevenson wrote:
>
> ...<Much edited to save bandwidth>
>
> Learning CW in today's world IS hazing ... it's a ridiculous "busy-work"
> exercise which wastes the time and effort of the many who have NO
> interest in or intention of using CW EVER ... it turns off the
> technically inclined inn droves, and makes ham radio look like a purely
> nostalgia activity for a bunch of doddering old men who wish it was
> still 1920-1940 ...
>

In which case, for the majority of Hams I know, all the component theory
and oddball modulation theory and AC Network theory is just as much
hazing.  None of these gentlemen had or have any intention of building
anything.  They go down to the radio shop, buy their little handheld
radios and start transmitting.  They are glorified CB users.

Why should they have to learn all that 'technical' stuff when all they
need to know are the rules and regulations?  Of what relevance to them
is the operating theory of a transistor or a Pi filter or a triode?
They have no intention of ever using that 'complicated' stuff.

> ...<Much more snipped>

> Times change, progress is necessary ... please learn to accept some
> change so we can catch up with the times ... otherwise, we'll soon not
> have ham radio in any form ... our bands are too valuable to devote to a
> nostalgia clique ...
>

If progress is having to learn less, then you can keep it.  If fewer
people today can cope with the tests ("...math class is sooooo
hard..."), do you think dumbing down the requirements is going to make
things better?

I'm all for minimisation of government interference.  However, I have a
hard time with the idea of removing elements of the tests.  Mark my
words, once the code requirement is gone, the next thing will be the
remaining technical elements ("...why should I have to learn this?  It's
hard and I'll never use it...").

I believe the tests are too easy.  They should be made more difficult
AND keep the Morse requirement.  Before you say, "it's OK for you, you
have your license", check on Deja News and check my call sign below on
the various databases, you'll see that I held that opinion before I
wrote my tests.  I mention this just to stem any cries of "hypocrite".

> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]

--
Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!EU.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 01:44:57 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5859ep$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-08.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119648 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43842

In <584p4d$[e-mail]>, Jim Kelley <[e-mail]> wr
ites:
>The argument centers around how essential the
>CW mode is as it pertains to operator qualifications.  As it has been
>stated many times over, it is by far the simplest of all modes to
>operate.

Only for those who are intested enough in that mode to become proficient
(if they are physically/neurologically capable of doing that) ... for
all others, it's just so much noise and voice modes or keyboard modes
are "much simpler."

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 01:38:01 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <58591p$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-08.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119678 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43861

In <[e-mail]>, Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>In which case, for the majority of Hams I know, all the component theory
>and oddball modulation theory and AC Network theory is just as much
>hazing.  None of these gentlemen had or have any intention of building
>anything.  They go down to the radio shop, buy their little handheld
>radios and start transmitting.  They are glorified CB users.

That's part of my point ... they *are* "glorified CBers who beep" ...
that's NOT what ham RADIO is supposed to be ...

>Why should they have to learn all that 'technical' stuff when all they
>need to know are the rules and regulations?  Of what relevance to them
>is the operating theory of a transistor or a Pi filter or a triode?
>They have no intention of ever using that 'complicated' stuff.

That "complicated stuff" is what ham radio is *supposed* to be (very
significantly) about ... not just beeing a Cber who beeps ...

>
>> ...<Much more snipped>
>
>> Times change, progress is necessary ... please learn to accept some
>> change so we can catch up with the times ... otherwise, we'll soon not
>> have ham radio in any form ... our bands are too valuable to devote to a
>> nostalgia clique ...
>>
>
>If progress is having to learn less, then you can keep it.  If fewer
>people today can cope with the tests ("...math class is sooooo
>hard..."), do you think dumbing down the requirements is going to make
>things better?

Most of us no-code *test* advocates support a restructuring of the
testing (and some of us favor restructuring of license classes) ...

>I'm all for minimisation of government interference.  However, I have a
>hard time with the idea of removing elements of the tests.  Mark my
>words, once the code requirement is gone, the next thing will be the
>remaining technical elements ("...why should I have to learn this?  It's
>hard and I'll never use it...").

The FCC will NEVER go for that in the ham service where we are permitted
to build ... remember, as Gary has said "the value of the license is in
what it allows you to do, not in what you did to get it ..."


>I believe the tests are too easy.  They should be made more difficult
>AND keep the Morse requirement.

I also believe that the written tests are too easy ... but the code is
an outdated requirement that can no longer be justified as a license
requirement ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 04:48:59 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <585k6a$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sjx-ca41-01.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 04 10:48:10 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119701 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43870

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>It matters a LOT ... because we USED to lead the way ...

Beginning with the invention of the transistor, followed by the
integrated circuit, followed by the explosion of VLSI,
ham radio has ceased "leading the way".    In order to be
pioneering today, you either need a strong background in solid state
physics, information theory, or communications.    There's
no other way to really understand how a transistor fundamentally
works, how E and H fields interact, or how bandwidth is related to
channel capacity.

For quite a while now, technology in Amateur Radio has been
advanced by professional engineers who happen to be Hams.   Not since
the early days (and possibly not ever) have advances been
made by true "amateurs" (i.e. who aren't professionally
employed in a communications/electronics/scientific profession).

So I would argue that CW is not keeping smart people out of
ham radio.  The advances have really always been made, and
will continue to be made, by "professionals" who happen to be
Hams on their time off.

>>Morse code is as basic to amateur radio as knowing the Windows API is
>>to writing Windows apps.

>This is NOT a good analogy ... Morse code is NOT as crucial a foundation
>of ham radio in today's world as is the sort of knowledge you refer to
>in programming WinDoze apps ... though why one would *want* to write
>apps for such an swful "operating system" is beyond me ...

Something to do with money, I believe :)

>There is NO reason to deny phone privs to no-coders ... if they are
>qualified to operate AMTOR, RTTY, and new modes that are being/to be
>developed, they are equally qualified to operate SSB ... NONE of those
>modes has one damned thing to do with Morse code ...

Likewise, there is no reason to deny privs to Hams whose wrong answer
to the question about the silver tolerance band on a resistor put them
over the failure percentage.

If your argument is that we should only have tests on things we "need"
to operate radios, then the test questions should only be related to
operator practice and rules.

--
Dick wd0anb



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 03:44:09 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <5884oi$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587tnl$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sjx-ca52-10.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 05  9:43:14 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119745 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43886

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>Hams are NOT corporate managers ... we can choose to experiment with the
>esoteric ideas at home

Possibly experimentation for self gratification.   Experimentation
at home in the sense of doing something that has never been done
before is highly unlikely these days.   Even for professional
researchers, the old joke about 99% of all research being the
"dragging of old bones from one graveyard to another" is
highly accurate.   Advances in science aren't done by amateurs
at home anymore.  Once the advances are made, then people like
you and me can apply them at home to do self-gratifying things (like
programming DSP chips).

>ONE guy ... and I suspect that the concern is that a special event
>station in a public place with a bunch of "beepers" would only promote
>the public image of ham radio as a bunch of geezers using backward
>technology ... a large percentage of the people in the mall, or
>whereever, will be carrying pagers, cellphones, etc. and are technically
>astute enough to think "how backward ... and these guys are *supposed*
>to be the "radio wizards"???

Bad analogy.  Starting with landing on the moon and ending with the
Personal Communications Network (or is it System?) , most people are
quite ho hum about communications these days.  On the other hand,
last time I decoded the Morse transmission for a friend as we were
watching some TV show, he thought I was an absolute genius :)

If you're trying to impress people at the mall, you'll find that
people are impressed more by things that virtually no one can
do, as opposed to things that everyone is doing.

I actually have to chuckle a little bit when I picture the image
of two Techs hanging around at a hamfest when a repeater
is keyed up: "Hey Joe,....do you know what that beeping means?"
"Heck if I know...".

Dick wd0anb





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 00:58:10 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <587r32$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <585k6a$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
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In <585k6a$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>
>>It matters a LOT ... because we USED to lead the way ...
>
>Beginning with the invention of the transistor, followed by the
>integrated circuit, followed by the explosion of VLSI,
>ham radio has ceased "leading the way".    In order to be
>pioneering today, you either need a strong background in solid state
>physics, information theory, or communications.    There's
>no other way to really understand how a transistor fundamentally
>works, how E and H fields interact, or how bandwidth is related to
>channel capacity.

TRY READING BOOKS ... or talking to those more knowledgeable in those
matters ... learning is a large part of what ham radio is supposed to be
about ...

>For quite a while now, technology in Amateur Radio has been
>advanced by professional engineers who happen to be Hams.   Not since
>the early days (and possibly not ever) have advances been
>made by true "amateurs" (i.e. who aren't professionally
>employed in a communications/electronics/scientific profession).

One does not have to be employed professionally in the field to become
knoledgeable enough to contribute ... though, of those who are employed
in the field, many find CW backward and boring and refuse to get
involved (and contribute) because of it ... I've worked with *dozens* of
very talented engineers and technicians over the years who would have
become hams were it not for the fraternity hazing rituals ...

>So I would argue that CW is not keeping smart people out of
>ham radio.  The advances have really always been made, and
>will continue to be made, by "professionals" who happen to be
>Hams on their time off.

There would be MANY more, were CW not maintained as an artifical barrier
to entry ...

Car - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!paladin.american.edu!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 07:09:50 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <588gru$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587tnl$[e-mail]> <5884oi$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
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In <5884oi$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>
>>Hams are NOT corporate managers ... we can choose to experiment with the
>>esoteric ideas at home
>
>Possibly experimentation for self gratification.   Experimentation
>at home in the sense of doing something that has never been done
>before is highly unlikely these days.

Why? ... I think that's a pretty pessimistic assertion ... and I don't
think it's true ... the only reason I can see it being unlikely is that
the current rules drive away most of the technically competent folks who
might become hams (I've got 5 or 6 in my own department at work right
now who say "Morse code? Give me a break!") and the majority of the
remaining beepers wouldn't know what to do or where to start if you put
a gun to their heads ...

>Once the advances are made, then people like
>you and me can apply them at home to do self-gratifying things (like
>programming DSP chips).

I can develop new algorithms at home that do new and wonderful things
.. I don't have to design and fab the DSP chip to make advances ...

>If you're trying to impress people at the mall, you'll find that
>people are impressed more by things that virtually no one can
>do, as opposed to things that everyone is doing.

Cellphones can't talk (directly, without toll charges) to distant states
and foreign countries ... packet radio computer networks would dazzle
folks if we could drag enough critical mass of beepers off of their
damned "DX clusters" and get them to spend a couple of bucks to upgrade
from 1200 baud AFSK to something decent ... we could easily field stuff
at ISDN rates TODAY ... if there were enough people willing to adopt it
instead of thrashing the channels at 1200 baud and bitching "a new TNC?
Hell no, I just spent $129 on this one in '92 ... and it doesn't even
have any tubes in it!"

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:35 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 01:27:21 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]>
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Carl I still cant understand why you cant do all this Super Duper Great
Digital Technology on VHF and UHF, is there some reason this Great Digital
Technology wont work there, or is it  Because you cant Pick up a Mic and
talk on HF.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:37 1996
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From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 21:13:05 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587tnl$[e-mail]> <5884oi$[e-mail]> <588gru$[e-mail]>
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To: Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119849 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43925

Carl Stevenson wrote:

> we could easily field stuff
> at ISDN rates TODAY ... if there were enough people willing to adopt it
> instead of thrashing the channels at 1200 baud and bitching "a new TNC?
> Hell no, I just spent $129 on this one in '92 ... and it doesn't even
> have any tubes in it!"
>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]

Yes!  But it's not CW that's holding the hobby back.  The upper UHF
spectrum is a natural for the development and use of these ideas, not
HF.

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.he.net!night.primate.wisc.edu!aplcen.apl.jhu.edu!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!clay.se.highway1.com!baker.se.highway1.com![e-mail]
From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 21:09:10 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 20
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References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Carl I still cant understand why you cant do all this Super Duper Great
> Digital Technology on VHF and UHF, is there some reason this Great Digital
> Technology wont work there, or is it  Because you cant Pick up a Mic and
> talk on HF.


Exactly.  Does anyone really think that all these "young and brilliant"
minds are going to come into the hobby in droves without an HF CW
requirement.  What's impetus?  That whopping fast 300 baud packet?  SSB?
Slow AMTOR/PACTOR speeds?

The technology and future of the hobby is not being thwarted by an HF CW
requirement.  The focus should be on upper UHF spectrum and above where
we can apply LAN speed and spread spectrum technologies.  Several years
ago, we opened up these frequencies to a no-code group.  What progress
have we made since?  Anyone?......

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:38 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:27:27 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <58adh8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587tnl$[e-mail]> <5884oi$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119866 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43933

[e-mail] wrote:

>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>>Hams are NOT corporate managers ... we can choose to experiment with the
>>esoteric ideas at home

>Possibly experimentation for self gratification.

So THAT'S what Squiggy does in his spare time.........

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:40 1996
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From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 21:19:29 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Chris Broadbent wrote:

> Why should they have to learn all that 'technical' stuff when all they
> need to know are the rules and regulations?  Of what relevance to them
> is the operating theory of a transistor or a Pi filter or a triode?
> They have no intention of ever using that 'complicated' stuff.

True.  For the very reasons the no-code faction wants to eliminate CW
testing, then by analogy, we can eliminate the theory portion too.

If all I want to do is communicate, why should someone force "all that
theory" down my throat?

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:40 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 15:52:37 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

I think what we have going on here is a Bunch of Very Lazy People, who
dont want to put out any Effort. First they Complain about CW,if they got
there way with this the next step would be do away the Theory, and im sure
there would be just as many Excuses why the Theory was outdated and has no
real Meaning for someone to Pick up a Mic and talk to some Good Buddy.

  What is strange is that when I listen to 2 Meters here, I hear alot of
No-Coders studying for there CW test, I dont think Carl and his Group
represent the Views of alot of No-Coders, I think Carl is reprensenting
himself, and instead of putting out a little Effort on his part he would
rather Whine about his Inabilties, and ask for another free ride.

 Carl and his Group our Constantly Whining about Hazing, I guess ,as far
as that Group is Concerned anything other than what they think should be
Required is Hazing


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:42 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 09:29:48 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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To: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120234 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44055

Paul Christensen wrote:
>
> Chris Broadbent wrote:
>
> > Why should they have to learn all that 'technical' stuff when all they
> > need to know are the rules and regulations?  Of what relevance to them
> > is the operating theory of a transistor or a Pi filter or a triode?
> > They have no intention of ever using that 'complicated' stuff.
>
> True.  For the very reasons the no-code faction wants to eliminate CW
> testing, then by analogy, we can eliminate the theory portion too.
>
> If all I want to do is communicate, why should someone force "all that
> theory" down my throat?

In the U.S. there are other radio services where that is actaully the
case.  Take the aviation and marine services as examples.  Pilots and
boaters that use HF or communicate with foreign stations must have a
operator license or permit.

The restricted permit allows the operator to use specific types of HF
radios and they are not allowed to make any internal adjustments or
repairs to the equipment.  It is essentially an "appliance operator
license".  There is no code test.  There is no test at all since the
operator is not allowed to do anything other than operate.

A general radiotelephone operator *license* holder can make internal
adjustments and repairs to, and operate an aviation or marine
radiotelephone station.  There is a written exam for the GROL since the
license authorizes the holder to do things to the station.

Some might find it interesting that, in the aviation and marine
services, restricted operator permits and the GROL do not authorize the
use of telegrahy.  A GROL holder can not operate or service an aviation
or marine radioTELEGRAPH station.

If written testing of rules and regs for an amateur license applicant
was dropped then the privleges should be changed.  A "no-theory" amateur
operator should not be able to use anything other than type accepted
equipment and be prohibited from building, repairing, modifying, or
internally adjusting any station.  THAT sounds like a kind of CB license
to me. (To my knowledge, CBers were never required to have an operator
license.  And telegraphy is prohibited on CB.)

The analogy between dropping (or in some way changing) the code
requirement and dropping written testing is a poor one.  The resulting
qualifications of operators would be much different if "theory" was
dropped.

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:43 1996
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From: Jim Conn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 12:41:00 -0800
Organization: GTE Advanced Intelligent Network
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Curtis Wheeler wrote:
>
>
> The analogy between dropping (or in some way changing) the code
> requirement and dropping written testing is a poor one.  The resulting
> qualifications of operators would be much different if "theory" was
> dropped.
>
> --
> Curtis

Dropping theory testing may not be as far-fetched as you think. In 1984,
the FCC dropped all license requirements for Private Land Mobile Radio
Service, Private Operational Fixed Microwave Service, General Mobile
Radio Service, and Radio Control Services. This meant that anyone can
install, maintain and repair transmitting equipment in any of the private
two-way radio services, with no license required at all. If the
station license holder's equipment is found to be operating improperly,
the station license holder is held responsible. The same process could be
used with amateurs - if the equipment is operated improperly, fine and/or
revoke the license of the station license holder.

Licenses were retained for Aviation and Maritime Radio Services because
of the requirements of international law.

I opposed the changes in '84, but they have not turned out to be a bad
thing, in spite of all the dire predictions by myself and others. Now I
likewise oppose dropping the Morse code and theory tests. But if the
dropping of either Morse or theory testing (or both) comes to pass, it
may not turn out to be a bad thing for ham radio, either. One can only
hope that will be the case.

73,
Jim - AD4VL




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:44 1996
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From: Jim Conn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 00:45:57 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Curtis Wheeler wrote:
>
> Back to amateur radio... Morse code testing does not evaluate technical
> competence.  Therefore, the competence level of the amateur community
> should be effected by eliminating the code requirement.  But even with
> that fact in mind, I do not endorse the elimination of morse code
> testing of amateurs.  I do support ideas that will restructure the code
> requirements and take code speed increases out of the incentive system.
>
> Happy Holidays
>
> --
> Curtis

Hi Curtis,

Yes, you're correct, of course Morse testing does not evaluate technical
competence. However, I'm not sure the written portions of the amateur
exams do either! It depends on your definition of competence!

73
and the very best in 97!

Jim - AD4VL



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:45 1996
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From: "3" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: OK YOU WIN....this just in.....evan platt news wire
Date: 7 Dec 1996 20:31:41 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <01bbe47c$bf74c880$b3de92cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.222.179
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

You guys are too serious.

I made a posting and made a  mistake with the state numbers.

I will not post anything here without being proofed.

I will never e mail evan (male or female?) again. It's Pat.

Even people who respond to my postings make error's in spellling or
grammer.  And because I am a paralegal, I never implied I was an expert in
anything.


By the way does anyone own the new Kenwood TM-V7A?


Have a Merry Christmas, see ya

Mike
KB2TIU


'Shoot first questions later'


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: OK YOU WIN....this just in.....evan platt news wire
Date: Sun,  8 Dec 1996 02:37:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <01bbe47c$bf74c880$b3de92cf@default>
Lines: 16


>>Even people who respond to my postings make error's in spellling or
>>grammer.

I see three at least...<g>

>>And because I am a paralegal, I never implied I was an expert in
>>anything.

Not even in your chosen profession's specialty?


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:47 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: OK YOU WIN....this just in.....evan platt news wire
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 14:08:53 -0700
Organization: Goddnet (telesoft)
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe47c$bf74c880$b3de92cf@default> <[e-mail]>
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Evan Platt wrote:
>
>
> Show me ONE statement I made where I was racist (flush twice, it's a
> long way to Guam, our 55th state) biased, or ignorant view. And even
> though you're a waste of sperm, I might as well tell you: I didn't
> vote. So shutup and leave our newsgroup.
>
> If I'm going to keep up a discussion with you, I need a barf bag and a
> chair, you make me laugh so much I nearly fell down.

Why don't you and the other party take it to private e-mail?

The rest of us don't need to put up with this crap!

This is an amateur related newsgroup, not a domestic dispute chat room.

Eric. (n7zzt)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (E.S. Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: OK YOU WIN....this just in.....evan platt news wire
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 15:25:59 GMT
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe47c$bf74c880$b3de92cf@default> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans53.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

I would, but whenever I e-mail him, he tells me if I e-mail him again,
he'll file a restraining order against me in a federal civil class
action lawsuit in the state of Puerto Rico... sorry, couldn't resist.
But he did say he would file a restraining order against me. Yah,
rite-e-o.

Eric Oyen <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Why don't you and the other party take it to private e-mail?
>
>The rest of us don't need to put up with this crap!
>
>This is an amateur related newsgroup, not a domestic dispute chat room.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.insinc.net!scanner.worldgate.com!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!mongol.sasknet.sk.ca![e-mail]
From: Clint Smith <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Old ameteur radio magizines.
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 21:43:44 -0800
Organization: SaskNet News Distribution
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vultee43.sk.sympatico.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-SYMPA  (Win95; I; 16bit)

I recently came across an opportunity to recieive sevral boxes of older
electronics equipment and liturature on the subject. I would like to get
started in electronics and thought this would be a good chance.

Anyway I have two boxes full of old Radio Craft magazines. This is what I
have found so far:

1937 - aug. sept. oct
1938 - feb. mar.(50th yr of radio) apr. may. jun. jul. aug. dec.
1939 - jan. feb. mar. apr. may. jun. jul. nov.
1940 - may. oct. dec.
1941 - jan. feb. mar. may. jun. jul. oct.
1942 - oct. dec.
1943 - jan. mar. apr. may. jun. jul. aug. sept. nov.
1944 - jan. feb sept. oct.
1945 - feb. aug.
1946 - oct. nov.
1947 - jan. mar. apr. may. jun. oct. dec.
1948 - aug.
1950 - oct.

I don't know if ayone can help me but if any ones interested mabey you
can use them more than me. I also have alot of mid-70's to mid-80's
electronic magizines and post WW11 Popular Science, Mechanix Illistrated,
and Science and Mechanics. I have Old books on repairing appliances too.
I dunno what to do with them.


  [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!151.99.250.2!server-b.cs.interbusiness.it!usenet
From: "SERGIO NASI" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Old QST issues
Date: 8 Dec 1996 13:09:58 GMT
Organization: Centro Servizi Interbusiness
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <01bbe49d$654771c0$LocalHost@sna>
NNTP-Posting-Host: world18.mediacom.it
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Hy everybody,
I'm looking for Internet Archives of old QST review issues and the one I'm
interested in is QST oct.1981, pag.18, about a directional bridge
construction scheme.
I'm from Italy and it should be difficult for me to order it.
I know that the ARRL site shows selected articles from QST but it doesn't
seem to have an archive of former issues.
Any help about this will be most appreciated. Thank you.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Old QST issues
Date: Sun,  8 Dec 1996 22:03:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <01bbe49d$654771c0$LocalHost@sna>
Lines: 15


>>...QST oct.1981, pag.18...

The ARRL will send it to you!!!

Contact them via Email, phone, or fax, and their Research Department
will find it, and ship it to you.

I asked for an old article last year, and I believe it only cost $5.00
for the service.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: "Christopher (Chris) W. Boone" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Old QST issues
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 07:53:38 -0800
Organization: ABC Radio Network Engineering - Dallas
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe49d$654771c0$LocalHost@sna>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cust59.max10.dallas.tx.ms.uu.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; U)
To: SERGIO NASI <[e-mail]>

SERGIO NASI wrote:
>
> Hy everybody,
> I'm looking for Internet Archives of old QST review issues and the one I'm
> interested in is QST oct.1981, pag.18, about a directional bridge
> construction scheme.
> I'm from Italy and it should be difficult for me to order it.
> I know that the ARRL site shows selected articles from QST but it doesn't
> seem to have an archive of former issues.
> Any help about this will be most appreciated. Thank you.

I may have that issue still (been throwing a lot out lately..)
I'll look it up and if I still have it, will let you know

Chris
WB5ITT


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.0.65.182!news-in.tiac.net!posterchild!n1btq
From: [e-mail] (Tim Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Operating in Panama?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 96 03:23:21 GMT
Organization: From the home front
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <58ar0i$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: n1btq.tiac.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119912 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43947

Planning a week long business trip in Panama and would like to take my IC706
and a roll of wire along.  Does anyone know of reciprocal arrangements between

Panama and the US?  Who do I have to contact or what documentation do I take
other than passport and copy of ticket?

Thanks,

Tim N1BTQ (hopefully /HP)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!uwm.edu!homer.alpha.net!news
From: scott <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: OUCH! Hot Code Key Here!!! HELP!
Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 16:50:05 -0800
Organization: Aero Head Aviation
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp21.westby.mwt.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; U)
To: Peter and Colleen McGreevy <[e-mail]>

Peter and Colleen McGreevy wrote:
>
> Hi y'all...
>
> I have a BURNING question...
> SN
>   IP
> Any suggestions are deeply appreciated.
>
> PS-The system is grounded.
>
> Thanx -- Pete -- KA2YDYYes, it definitely sounds like RF in the shack.  I go
t RF'ed on my TS-520
once and I remembered it!  Most likely it is a combination of 2 things.
Close proximity to the antenna and I'll assume the antenna may be being
used through a tuner and is non-resonant.  You say it's grounded...well
maybe grounded to DC, but remember, at RF frequencies, the wire
connecting to ground may be a 1/4 wavelength long, presenting a high
impedance at your operating frequency, causing the RF to become "trapped"
at your keyer.  And you know what that feels like!  Try taking the
antenna out of the attic if possible or run QRP (< 5 Watts) and see if
that's better.  Good luck...73, Scott, N0EDV.

--
Gotta FLY or gonna Die !
    Ask me about my
 Aeronca Super Chief !


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: Dave Maciorowski <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: PACKET
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 05:28:31 -0700
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: den-co12-14.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 08  6:29:12 AM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> I WOULD LIKE INFORMATION FOR MY GRANDFATHER CONCERNING SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS
> AND SETUP OF "PACKET" FOR HIS HAM RADIO.
>                                             THANKS,
>
>                  CHARLES

You might start with the Packet FAQ at:

        http://www.acs.ncsu.edu/HamRadio/FAQ/FAQ_Packet.html

-----
Dave Maciorowski, WA1JHK
Colorado Repeater Association, Inc.
  Serving Colorado with Voice and Data, 6-Meters to 1.2 Gig

Internet: [e-mail] or [e-mail]
CRA:      http://www.rmsd.com/hamradio/cra/


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!138.95.18.2!wilbur.sequent.com!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Dana Drexlerova)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Packet radio and ICOM T7
Date: 3 Dec 96 09:38:34 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Hallo all!

Do you know somebody, how work via ICOM T7 with speed 9600 Kbd?

Thank you for all answer.


E-mail : [e-mail]






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Paralegal Pagers in all 52 states.. (Was Re: MOTOROLA PAGERS)
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 20:42:38 GMT
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans31.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

Upon forwarding a complaint to this (l)osers postmaster/admin, I
recieved a reply from "0" errr. "1" with the following:

>evan, why are you still whining like a bitch?
>Keep up the bullsh*t.
>A pager is a radio receiver, the catagory says radio.

I'd like to know the opinion of everyone else here. This yahoo has
been posting his pager ads, with "Didn't buy service from me? Contact
me, you can get money from my (cl)ass action suit!!" and his Computers
for sale. and he justifies it by a pager is a radio reciever. What do
other people think?
Opinions happily accepted, flames to /dev/null


"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Motorola Bravo Pagers  $55.00
>
>
>$4.00 per month service available, just prepay 1 year, all states
>available.
>
>
>Email me or see my web page:



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!138.95.18.2!wilbur.sequent.com!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Dana Drexlerova)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: PC and ICOM T7
Date: 3 Dec 96 09:41:38 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Hallo all!

Do you know, how connect ICOM T7 to PC (example : to programmer memory)?

Than you for all answer.


E-mail: [e-mail]





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:24:59 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!howland.erols.net!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Personal Phone Patches
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 18:15:14 GMT
Lines: 26

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>Hey everyone,
>   I'm looking for information about personal phone patches for simplex
>frequencies. Does the FCC have any major restrictions on them? I know that
>they are controversial, and I'm looking for opinions. Any recommendations
>or ideas? Thanks a bunch
>
>   73, Eric N9VDC

Like any phone patch, they are considered third party operation, and
must always have a control operator present at a control point. That
control point can be local or remote, but if it is the latter, the
control must be exercised on 222 MHz or above. So if you are going
to act as the control operator, you're going to need more than a
2m radio. For that and other reasons, I'd suggest 2m would be an
inappropriate place to operate a simpatch. Note too that an FCC
employee has issued an opinion (incorrectly I think), that the
simpatch cannot send telemetry that the phone is ringing, so you
are effectively limited to outgoing calls only.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!mr.net!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: "Christopher (Chris) W. Boone" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Personal Phone Patches
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 21:06:06 -0600
Organization: ABC Radio Network Engineering - Dallas
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cust94.max10.dallas.tx.ms.uu.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; U)

Gary Coffman wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
> >Hey everyone,
> >   I'm looking for information about personal phone patches for simplex
> >frequencies. Does the FCC have any major restrictions on them? I know that
> >they are controversial, and I'm looking for opinions. Any recommendations
> >or ideas? Thanks a bunch
> >
> >   73, Eric N9VDC
>
> Like any phone patch, they are considered third party operation, and
> must always have a control operator present at a control point. That
> control point can be local or remote, but if it is the latter, the
> control must be exercised on 222 MHz or above. So if you are going
> to act as the control operator, you're going to need more than a
> 2m radio. For that and other reasons, I'd suggest 2m would be an
> inappropriate place to operate a simpatch. Note too that an FCC
> employee has issued an opinion (incorrectly I think), that the
> simpatch cannot send telemetry that the phone is ringing, so you
> are effectively limited to outgoing calls only.
>

The opinion was that of the FCC issued in the late 1970s and HAS NOT
CHANGED SINCE..it is NOT just an employee.....read the rules!

And read ALL the FCC interpretations.....NOT just the ones which meet
YOUR expectations...

Chris
WB5ITT
EX WR5AOK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Plan to ABOLISH FCC
Date: Fri,  6 Dec 1996 18:19:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 8


>>We support this plan...

Who is "we?" Who are you? Who do you represent?

>>...and urge the new Congress to adopt it as soon as possible!

Newt loves downsizing. He'll listen to you.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:02 1996
From: [e-mail] (mac  )
Subject: Plan to ABOLISH FCC
Date: 5 Dec 96 21:17:25 -0800
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!news.msn.com!msn.com
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Organization: The Microsoft Network (msn.com)
Lines: 7

   The PFF plan to abolish the FCC can be viewed at:

      http://www.pff.org/pff/abolish_fcc.html


   We support this plan and urge the new Congress to adopt it
as soon as possible!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:03 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!rll
From: [e-mail] (Richard L. Lamb)
Subject: Re: Plan to ABOLISH FCC
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 16:28:00 GMT
Lines: 14
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (mac  ) writes:
>   The PFF plan to abolish the FCC can be viewed at:
>
>      http://www.pff.org/pff/abolish_fcc.html
>
>
>   We support this plan and urge the new Congress to adopt it
>as soon as possible!


Why aren't you identifying yourself anymore, George Asics Jr.?

Richard Lamb
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:04 1996
From: [e-mail] (mac  )
Subject: Re: Plan to ABOLISH FCC
Date: 6 Dec 96 19:41:44 -0800
References: <[e-mail]> <587thn$[e-mail]>
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-9.sprintlink.net!news.msn.com!msn.com
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Organization: The Microsoft Network (msn.com)
Lines: 10

   FCC Chairman Reed Hundt REDUCED the enforcement teeth of the
FCC when he closed all 15 of the FCC's monitoring stations.
    Checked out the HF portion of spectrum lately?   Intruders are
on the rise, technical standards are being observed less & less by
licensed stations, marine stations unable to communicate due to
interference, aeronautical freqs. full on intruders & interference,
etc. etc.
     Closing the monitoring stations is already becoming the legacy
which Reed Hundt will have stand in testimony to his incompetence!
      The question now is who will have to clean up his mess?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Plan to ABOLISH FCC
Date: 6 Dec 1996 06:33:09 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <588en5$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, mac   <[e-mail]> wrote:
>   We support this plan

Why?

>and urge the new Congress to adopt it as soon as possible!

Why?

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.accessone.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Plan to ABOLISH FCC
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:54:58 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58fo12$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vbook.accessone.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>   The PFF plan to abolish the FCC can be viewed at:
>
>      http://www.pff.org/pff/abolish_fcc.html
>
>
>   We support this plan and urge the new Congress to adopt it
>as soon as possible!

This is very old news. PFF put forth this plan, I think, about a year and half

or maybe two years ago and it got lots of press at the time. You throw this ou
t
as if this is some new, done deal. Its not a done deal. Its a report from a
think tank that does policy analysis and which is affiliated with Rep. Newt
Gingrich. This is hardly a done deal at all. Obviously there are many issues
about which ham radio operators should be concerned and this one falls
somewhere down the list.

------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (david l. thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Plan to ABOLISH FCC
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 02:52:11 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58fu0s$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-41-202.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 9 Dec 1996 02:37:16 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (mac  ) wrote:

>   The PFF plan to abolish the FCC can be viewed at:

>      http://www.pff.org/pff/abolish_fcc.html

All you get is the overview.  The mail address does not work any
longer.  Far as my Washington collegues can tell PFF disappeared
some time ago.  The plan as stated is 2 years old and was the work of
some conservative think tankers.  The FCC implemented much of the
plan over the past months.

Newt's Atlanta office tells me not to worry...the FCC is not in
danger!    ARRL's Regulatory desk echos the same.

mac has fallen prey to the same thing that hit TWA Flight 800...OLD
News, Bad news, NO news!

Dave K4JRB.







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (CloughG)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Police Hams - Cert Hunters - IPA Radio Club Net Info
Date: 11 Dec 1996 14:49:39 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

The US Section International Police Association Radio Club meets Wednesday
and Sunday at 1700Z on 21.410 (secondary freq 14.240 when propagation is
poor) and later on the same days at 0030Z and 0300Z on 14.240 for ZL and
VK.    Tuesday 1700Z on 28.355 for Novice and Tech licensees.

IPARC offers an attractive awards program and has regular check-in's from
Guernsey, Northern Ireland, Belgium, Netherlands, & more.      Members,
non-members, cops, & non-cops are always welcome.     Membership in IPARC
is open to hams and SWL's who want to recieve the newletter, The NATIONAL
MONITOR.

For addtional information, applications, and questions about IPARC and the
International Police Association, and other Europe, Africa, and Far East
IPA Radio Club nets, contact:   IPARC Pres. WIll Dennis WIWA
[e-mail] or reply to this posting.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.co.za!osprey.global.co.za!news
From: [e-mail] (Steven)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.uk,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Portable Antenna Analyzer,   7MHz to  510MHz SWR direct
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 19:28:48 GMT
Organization: Global Internet Access
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <582dem$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mdm-po10.jhba-anx3.net.global.co.za
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent v0.55
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.uk:9448 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32358 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43573 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119555

I have a portable Antenna Analyzer for sale.
It is a portable unit run from NiCad batteries
with charger. It uses a LCD 4 digit frequency
counter, an analogue SWR / %reflected power scales
read direct. No radio Transmitter needed. It sees
exactly what the radio sees.
Only R2495-00. New, 1 year guarantee.
Ideal for the antenna experimenter.

Call Rob @ [phone]  Fax [phone]
[phone]
Fax  (011)  882-1122          South Africa
(Johannesburg)
or Email [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (larry wolken)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.uk,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Portable Antenna Analyzer,   7MHz to  510MHz SWR direct
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 10:40:01 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <58drhj$[e-mail]>
References: <582dem$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vie-va9-13.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 08  1:42:43 AM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.uk:9513 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32500 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43873 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120007

[e-mail] (Steven) wrote:

>I have a portable Antenna Analyzer for sale.
>It is a portable unit run from NiCad batteries
>with charger. It uses a LCD 4 digit frequency
>counter, an analogue SWR / %reflected power scales
>read direct. No radio Transmitter needed. It sees
>exactly what the radio sees.
>Only R2495-00. New, 1 year guarantee.
>Ideal for the antenna experimenter.

>Call Rob @ [phone]  Fax [phone]
>[phone]
>Fax  (011)  882-1122          South Africa
>(Johannesburg)
>or Email [e-mail]
==========================================
Yes Rob but how many zloty would that be?




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!news.azstarnet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!news.rain.net!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: PROPOSAL: no coders can rent my gun for 5 minutes
Date: 10 Dec 1996 16:30:04 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <58k36c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

I will rent my glock to any of you no-coders that realize you are so
worthless and decide to kill yourself.........



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:12 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!mv!wd1v.mv.com!user
From: [e-mail] (John D. Seney, WD1V,   LeCroy T&M   800.553.2769)
Subject: QST Hams Using Macintosh Computers
Organization: MV Communications, Inc.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: wd1v.mv.com
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 10:26:15 GMT
Lines: 58

Did you know there is an informal group of hams that use Macs called
"Macnet"?

We stay in touch with each other via packet and Internet and we have
a database that tells the story of each of us called "Macnet Roster".

"Macnet Roster" (ver. 783) is our HyperCard stack that lists:

    o CALL SIGN @ HOME PBBS
    o FULL NAME
    o ADDRESS
    o CITY, STATE, ZIP
    o INTERNET ADDRESS
    o MACS USED
    o RADIOS USED
    o SOFTWARE USED
    o PASSIONS
    o COMMENTS

You can use "Macnet Roster" to find other Mac users that you can then
communicate with directly. Compare notes on software, applications, ideas,
hints and kinks, and make new ham friends that use the same computer you do.
(You already know how cool you are - imagine accessing "the rest of us"!)

"Macnet Roster" also gives a list of all Internet addresses so you can send a
"bulletin" to all of us on the Internet.

"Macnet Roster" also gives details on how you can obtain our 10 disk Macnet
Software Collection of public domain software collection that includes:

Macnet 1    Logs + Demos
Macnet 2    DX  + Contest + CW
Macnet 3    Educ + Rem Ctrl
Macnet 4    Astro + FAX
Macnet 5    Pkt Terminals +
Macnet 6    Net/Mac TCP/IP + FAQ
Macnet 7    Novice Test + (Or the Ham Test of Your Choice)
Macnet 8    Sat Trackers + Dove
Macnet 9    C/C++ Programming Tutors
Macnet 10   Latest Macnet Roster + Morse

      If you'd like the latest "Macnet Roster":

    Send me a formatted disk in a self addressed and stamped disk mailer
    that is in a large envelope clearly marked "ROSTER".

Or connect to my home page via the WWW

http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v

Put YOUR INFO (via EMAIL or disk using TEACH TEXT) if you'd like to be include
d
in the "Macnet Roster" or send an update to your stats to me via pkt or email
anytime.

73,

John D. Seney
http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!mackrel.fishnet.net!usenet
From: Mike <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Query: Weather Station w Computer Software
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 00:18:22 -0800
Organization: FNS
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe721$16424740$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port005.scv.fishnet.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U)
To: Wendell - W5FL <[e-mail]>

Wendell - W5FL wrote:
>
> I would like to buy a weather station that I can mount at about the 30 foot
> point on my tower.  Principle measurement desired is windspeed (average and
> gusts) and wind direction.  Would also like to have barometric pressure,
> outside temperature, dewpoint, and possibly humidity.  Cables will have to
> be 150 feet and would like to have a local readout as well as to hook it up
> to the serial port on my computer and keep the wx info continously for
> later recall.
>
> The data would be valuable for RACES in real time (yes, I am a member) as
> well as general wx info (is it going to freeze tonight and kill the
> garden).
>
> Radio Shack has been promising such a station, but has now slipped promised
> sales date from November to February 1997.  Davis and Peet Bros make a
> station, but when you add their software costs, the cost is easily over
> $500 for a basic system.
>
> I need to find a way to mount it to a ROHN 45 Tower very ridgidly if it is
> going to measure wind speeds to 110 mph or higher.  I live on a hilltop
> location and good weather is *not* one of the benefits.  Lightning
> protection for the sensors and inside wiring is a very real problem as the
> tower is one of the highest structures in the area.  It will also set about
Hello Wendell,
You might try to find someone will to part with the Heathkit Weather
station, model # ida 5001-1. I build mine in 1989 for a kit and it is
still going strong. I have even seen it in EOCC operation vehicles. It
is a very accurate and reliable system. Has a 4 x 10 incnh back lit LCD
display. Features wind direction, speed both high and low, date and
time, pressure High and low temp high and low, humidity, rain amounts
and an user selectable alert system. It does have a rs232 port option,
though like an idiot I did not install it. While Heathkit is out the kit
business, as of a year ago, they still had a few kits left. The last
number I had for them was 616 925-4924 or 616 925 6000. In kit form I
paid a little over$600. new build and tested it was onver $1200. U might
find a reasonal unit out here some place.
Good Luck
73 Mike K6YPB








> 35 foot below a 1500 watt hf antenna, so rf shielding in the wx station is
> necessary.
>
> I would like to hear from any hams that have a system that they intensely
> like (or dislike) and any suggestions as to how to proceed would be
> helpful.
>
> Thanks for any information you can share with me on this subject.  Also if
> there is another newsgroup that might have an input, please let me know
> what it is.
> --
> Wendell Wyly - W5FL          [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news9.agis.net!agis!newspeer1.agis.net!agis!excalibur.flash.net!not-for-mail
From: "Wendell - W5FL" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Query: Weather Station w Computer Software
Date: 11 Dec 1996 05:07:28 GMT
Organization: Wyly Enterprises
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <01bbe721$16424740$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 223-68.flash.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I would like to buy a weather station that I can mount at about the 30 foot
point on my tower.  Principle measurement desired is windspeed (average and
gusts) and wind direction.  Would also like to have barometric pressure,
outside temperature, dewpoint, and possibly humidity.  Cables will have to
be 150 feet and would like to have a local readout as well as to hook it up
to the serial port on my computer and keep the wx info continously for
later recall.

The data would be valuable for RACES in real time (yes, I am a member) as
well as general wx info (is it going to freeze tonight and kill the
garden).

Radio Shack has been promising such a station, but has now slipped promised
sales date from November to February 1997.  Davis and Peet Bros make a
station, but when you add their software costs, the cost is easily over
$500 for a basic system.

I need to find a way to mount it to a ROHN 45 Tower very ridgidly if it is
going to measure wind speeds to 110 mph or higher.  I live on a hilltop
location and good weather is *not* one of the benefits.  Lightning
protection for the sensors and inside wiring is a very real problem as the
tower is one of the highest structures in the area.  It will also set about
35 foot below a 1500 watt hf antenna, so rf shielding in the wx station is
necessary.

I would like to hear from any hams that have a system that they intensely
like (or dislike) and any suggestions as to how to proceed would be
helpful.

Thanks for any information you can share with me on this subject.  Also if
there is another newsgroup that might have an input, please let me know
what it is.
--
Wendell Wyly - W5FL          [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!EU.net!howland.erols.net!news3.cac.psu.edu!news.cse.psu.edu!news.cc.swarthmore.edu!netnews.upenn.edu!red.seas.upenn.edu!quon
From: [e-mail] (Roger A. Quon)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Radio Clubs in Philadelphia
Date: 10 Dec 1996 17:45:32 GMT
Organization: University of Pennsylvania
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <58k7js$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: red.seas.upenn.edu
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2-upenn1.3]

Hi All

I was wondering if there were any Amateur Radio Clubs in Philadelphia
that I could contact. Please let me know by contacting me by e-mail
directly:

                [e-mail]

Thanks,

Roger


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!snunews.snu.ac.kr!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sgi.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.243.60.3!news.megalink.net!megalink
From: [e-mail] (Dave Hilton)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Radio repair
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 96 01:24:48 GMT
Organization: KB1AUP
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58fta0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mega-42.megalink.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2

Norway Electronics
Located in Norway Maine
Will service all brands of amateur radios.
Estimates are always free ( except for return shipping ).
Call [phone]
Norway Electronics
260 main st.
Norway Me.
04268
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!homer.alpha.net!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.mathworks.com!news.pbi.net!ns2.mainstreet.net!news.walltech.com!hsnx.wco.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail]* (mark wolfe)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics.repair
Subject: Re: Radio Shack Soldering Iron Replacement????
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 03:24:27 GMT
Organization: http://www.wco.com/~mwolfe
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58co34$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: volans106.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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On 7 Dec 1996 21:37:40 GMT, [e-mail] (Ron Harshbarger) wrote:

> For years I have been using the soldering iron that I bought from RS which h
as
> screw in base heating elements in various wattages from 10 to 30 etc. Now of

> course they no longer handle the screw in base elements. Does anyone know wh
at
> brand the original was ( Weller, Wahl, etc) and if the replacement elements
are
> available anywhere? The base is about the same as a 110 VAC Christmas tree
> bulb.
>
> Thanks & 73
> --
> Ron Harshbarger
> K3PID
> [e-mail]
>

I ended up replacing my RS iron with a hakco solder station. :)   Of
course my RS iron was usally the 6 dollar type. :)   Know the one your
talking about, haven't seen one in years.   I'd pickup a weller or
something.   They'll last for years.
Cul,
Mark Wolfe



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!visi.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Ron Harshbarger)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics.repair
Subject: Radio Shack Soldering Iron Replacement????
Date: 7 Dec 1996 21:37:40 GMT
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58co34$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-116.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (x86 32bit)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43834 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21832 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119956 sci.electronics.misc:18343 sci.electronics.repair:45518

For years I have been using the soldering iron that I bought from RS which has

screw in base heating elements in various wattages from 10 to 30 etc. Now of
course they no longer handle the screw in base elements. Does anyone know what

brand the original was ( Weller, Wahl, etc) and if the replacement elements ar
e
available anywhere? The base is about the same as a 110 VAC Christmas tree
bulb.

Thanks & 73
--
Ron Harshbarger
K3PID
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:20 1996
From: clawson(change to at symbol)iea.com (Chris Lawson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics.repair
Subject: Re: Radio Shack Soldering Iron Replacement????
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 01:36:06 GMT
Reply-To: clawson(change to at symbol)iea.com
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58co34$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
NNTP-Posting-Host: cda0-24.iea.com
Lines: 24
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.iea.net!cda0-24.iea.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43856 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21846 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119979 sci.electronics.misc:18350 sci.electronics.repair:45542

[e-mail] (Ron Harshbarger) wrote:

>For years I have been using the soldering iron that I bought from RS which ha
s
>screw in base heating elements in various wattages from 10 to 30 etc. Now of
>course they no longer handle the screw in base elements. Does anyone know wha
t
>brand the original was ( Weller, Wahl, etc) and if the replacement elements a
re
>available anywhere? The base is about the same as a 110 VAC Christmas tree
>bulb.
>
>Thanks & 73
>--
>Ron Harshbarger
>K3PID
>[e-mail]
>

I believe Ungar made the RS soldering irons.  The base of the heating
element is in fact the same as a 110v xmas bulb.  Makes a handy drop
light in a pinch.  The tip I believe was a 1/4"-20 thread.

Check Mouser, MCM, etc.  I known I've seen replacement tips that would
work.

-Chris


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!samba.rahul.net!rahul.net!a2i!bug.rahul.net!rahul.net!a2i!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!usenet
From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics.repair
Subject: Re: Radio Shack Soldering Iron Replacement????
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 21:12:32 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58co34$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dtburr.pr.mcs.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43859 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21848 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119986 sci.electronics.misc:18352 sci.electronics.repair:45548

Ron Harshbarger wrote:
>
> For years I have been using the soldering iron that I bought from RS which h
as
> screw in base heating elements in various wattages from 10 to 30 etc. Now of
> course they no longer handle the screw in base elements. Does anyone know wh
at
> brand the original was ( Weller, Wahl, etc) and if the replacement elements
are
> available anywhere? The base is about the same as a 110 VAC Christmas tree
> bulb.
>
> Thanks & 73
> --
> Ron Harshbarger
> K3PID
> [e-mail]


Yeah...I feel your pain. I'd much rather spend hours and hours finding a
replacement tip than buying a whole new soldering iron for $6.99. When I
had the same problem I sent messages to several newsgroups and contacted
many manufacturers in writing and via telephone.

But I do offer words of encouragment. After several days of effort and
several e-mails, phone calls, and letters, I was able to find a
replacement element, shipped by Acme, for $12 plus $3 S&H. I figure that
if you count the value of my time, plus my expenses, I spent about 650
bucks but it's a hell of a lot better than letting "big business" take
advantage of me!

Hang in there!

Dave K9XK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Joe Landis)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack Soldering Iron Replacement????
Message-ID: <1996Dec8.150447.662@main03>
Date: 8 Dec 96 15:04:47 EST
References: <58co34$[e-mail]>
Distribution: world
Organization: North American Drager - Telford, PA
Lines: 22
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43914 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21875 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120042 sci.electronics.repair:45605 sci.electronics.misc:18368

In article <58co34$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Ron Harshbarger) wri
tes:
> For years I have been using the soldering iron that I bought from RS which h
as
> screw in base heating elements in various wattages from 10 to 30 etc. Now of

> course they no longer handle the screw in base elements. Does anyone know wh
at
> brand the original was ( Weller, Wahl, etc) and if the replacement elements
are
> available anywhere? The base is about the same as a 110 VAC Christmas tree
> bulb.
>
> Thanks & 73
> --
> Ron Harshbarger
> K3PID
> [e-mail]
>
Hi Ron,
Sounds like the old Ungar irons. I've noticed that Mouser carries Ungar.
You might try them. [phone].

Joe - AA3GN
--
[e-mail] - speaking only for myself, of course
No, this is not a sig.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:24 1996
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From: Nicholas Bodley <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics.repair
Subject: Re: Radio Shack Soldering Iron Replacement????
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 04:13:18 -0500
Organization: The Internet Access Company, Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58co34$[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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To: Ron Harshbarger <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <58co34$[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43929 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21882 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120065 sci.electronics.misc:18384 sci.electronics.repair:45625

On 7 Dec 1996, Ron Harshbarger wrote:

{Snips}

}brand the original was ( Weller, Wahl, etc) and if the replacement elements a
re
}available anywhere? The base is about the same as a 110 VAC Christmas tree

 The originals were Ungar; Cooper bought Weller, and Weller bought Ungar,
although maybe not in that order. I used the handle as a trouble light
once, but the bulbs (Xmas tree = standard candelabra screw, I believe) are
fragile!!

|*  Nicholas Bodley   *|*  Electronic Technician {*} Autodidact & Polymath
|*   Waltham, Mass.   *|*  -----------------------------------------------
|*  [e-mail]  *|*    When the year 2000 begins, we'll celebrate
|*  Amateur musician  *|*    the 2000th anniversary of the year 1 B.C.E.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:25 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Radio Shack...as usual
Date: 3 Dec 1996 19:18:04 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Went to my local Radio Shack to buy some GMRS radios that they have just
advertised on sale for $199 each.  Want to use these for camping.  As
usual, they did not have the advertised merchandise...but he could order
them.

Because he did not have them, he questioned why I wanted those radios.
Probably wanted to sell me some useless CB instead.

I get so sick and tired of going into RS and they don't have the
advertised merchandise and the salespeople lack knowledge of their
products.  How many times have all of us been in an RS store where the
salespeople have to sell you the floor model (which I won't buy) because
they do not have enough stock; or, they have to order it.

The only reason I considered buying the radios is because they are
manufactured by Motorola and not by some Korean/Chinese sweat shop
manufacturing plant.  When will Tandy's management learn?  Since I was
going to buy three radios, there out $600 in sales.

I just walked out and commented that this was typical for RS...advertise
but no stock.

__________________________________________________________________________
"If the government bans individual possession of guns and only the government
owns guns, are we still a free people?"

"It's the Second Amendment Stupid!"

J. D. Beischel - Life Member - NRA
Amateur Radio WB8NUT & Member of the ARRL
__________________________________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:26 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Radio Shack...as usual
Date: Wed,  4 Dec 1996 19:51:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 15


>>I just walked out and commented that this was typical for
>>RS...advertise but no stock.

You are better off without them. AT 200 bucks each, they're worthless
for any serious/long distance communications, as they have no CTCSS
capability.

For forty bucks less each, grab a pair of Maxon 210+3 GMRS HTs.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:27 1996
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From: [e-mail]--- (R. A. Green)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack...as usual
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 19:53:18 GMT
Organization: .
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On 3 Dec 1996 19:18:04 GMT, [e-mail] wrote:

>Went to my local Radio Shack to buy some GMRS radios that they have just
>advertised on sale for $199 each.  Want to use these for camping.  As
>usual, they did not have the advertised merchandise...but he could order
<snip....>

I recommend next time that you call a couple places first.
--ron


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:27 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack...as usual
Date: 6 Dec 1996 16:33:45 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Where can you find the Maxon's for $160 each?  I would really like to
know!

__________________________________________________________________________
"If the government bans individual possession of guns and only the government
owns guns, are we still a free people?"

"It's the Second Amendment Stupid!"

J. D. Beischel - Life Member - NRA
Amateur Radio WB8NUT & Member of the ARRL
__________________________________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:29 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Eric Bear Albrecht)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack...as usual
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 10:25:10 -0800
Organization: Presto Computers
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <1996120710251024346@[10.0.2.15]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: laplaza.org
X-Newsreader: MacSOUP 2.2b5

R. A. Green <[e-mail]---> wrote:

> On 3 Dec 1996 19:18:04 GMT, [e-mail] wrote:
>
> >Went to my local Radio Shack to buy some GMRS radios that they have just
> >advertised on sale for $199 each.  Want to use these for camping.  As
> >usual, they did not have the advertised merchandise...but he could order
> <snip....>
>
> I recommend next time that you call a couple places first.
> --ron

Have a big bag of quarters.
And keep the questions explicit and direct.
D0 YOU HAVE IT IN STOCK NOW?

--
"I'm not a member of any organized political group --
 I'm a Democrat."          -- Will Rogers

Eric Bear Albrecht       [e-mail] / [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:30 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack...as usual
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:07:07 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <1996120710251024346@[10.0.2.15]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]


>Have a big bag of quarters.
>And keep the questions explicit and direct.
>D0 YOU HAVE IT IN STOCK NOW?

Well I have already stopped at five stores.  None of them had it.  I fact
none of them ever did have it.  I believe that's called false advertising.


_____________________________________________________________________
"If the government bans individual possession of guns and only the government
owns guns, are we still a free people?"

"It's the Second Amendment Stupid!"

J. D. Beischel - Life Member - NRA
Amateur Radio WB8NUT & Member of the ARRL
_____________________________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:30 1996
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From: "Russ Ramirez" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RCA Radiotron Designers Handbook
Date: 5 Dec 1996 03:11:20 GMT
Organization: Preferred Company
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <01bbe25a$2a2dcfc0$21c092cf@austintown>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.192.33
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Does anyone know where I can get a copy of it? Thanks.

Russ Ramirez


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:32 1996
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From: Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RCA Radiotron Designers Handbook
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 11:13:52 -0600
Organization: AMD
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe25a$2a2dcfc0$21c092cf@austintown>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Russ Ramirez wrote:
>
> Does anyone know where I can get a copy of it? Thanks.
>
> Russ Ramirez

Antique Electronic Supply has copies on CD-ROM for $69.95.  They don't
have hard copies.  I have seen original copies of the book go for up to
$150 recently in private sales.

AES's phone number is [phone].

BTW, I've no affiliation with AES, other than being a customer on a
couple of occasions.

--
Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:32 1996
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From: hershman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE ALINCO POOR SERVICE
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 16:57:31 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)

JIM at HRO in Salem,NH responded to my postings and contacted Alinco. I
called him and put in the order for the mic. Jim has got my business
back at HRO in Salem, New Hampshire. If I can get my wife to hold off on
purchasing the new dining room set I will be ordering the new Icom 756.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:33 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RE ALINCO POOR SERVICE
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 15:45:07 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <581hq5$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

hershman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>JIM at HRO in Salem,NH responded to my postings and contacted Alinco. I
>called him and put in the order for the mic. Jim has got my business
>back at HRO in Salem, New Hampshire. If I can get my wife to hold off on
>purchasing the new dining room set I will be ordering the new Icom 756.

We are all very happy you solved your microphone problem. Now if you could
get over the PW problem, you'd be good to go......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:35 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Remember, ham radio is V O L U N T A R Y
Date: 6 Dec 1996 17:29:00 GMT
Organization: I need to put my ORGANIZATION here.
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <589l4s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: w3eax.umd.edu

Nobody is ramming ham radio down your throat.

Period.

It's TOTALLY voluntary.  For people that don't want to
make the commitment, there is still:

  E-mail
  Web surfing
  GMRS
  Family radio
  Citizen's band
  THE TELEPHONE

Ham radio: hands-on communications with many purposes.

Licensing requirements: strict.  I don't see anyone
  handing out engineering degrees for free either.

Morse Code: an effective, easy-to-code-and-decode-without-
  hardware, means of getting a message through.

6 meters: A band that is 4 MHz wide, containing MORE
  spectrum than ALL of the amateur HF allocations
  combined, yet goes almost completely unsed by the
  no-code (and other) licensees who are completely
  able to use it.

Basically, regarding HF access without CW...

  6m opens to Europe from the East Coast, and often.
  There's not much activity on this immense band!
  Many people find CW to be useful for operating,
    even those who DIDN'T take a CW exam...
  CW as requirement for HF?  It's a MOOT POINT, my friends.
    I'll continue to use it even after they don't
    require it anymore.
--
* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!forge.sbt.net!news.ia.net!zeus.ia.net!kovar
From: [e-mail] (Jack Kovar  KE0AX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Repair manuals wanted for:
Date: 4 Dec 1996 00:24:16 GMT
Organization: InterAccess Networking
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <582gbg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: zeus.ia.net
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

        I need repair manuals for:

         Yeasu FT-290r mk2

         Yeasu FT-890

         Yeasu FT-50

         Kenwood 733a


        Please state cost and if copy is possible?

                        Thanks for interest in helping,

                                        Jack Kovar
                                          K0VAR






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.he.net!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!indirect
From: [e-mail] (Len Winkler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 96 19:07:03 GMT
Organization: Ham Radio & More Show
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <57v9cn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts20-29.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119425 rec.radio.amateur.policy:43758

The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & More

Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a no

code General License"?, was:
21 FOR
19 AGAINST
40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.

Again, just a totally unscientific poll.
73, Len

Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
P.O. Box 9219                              [e-mail]
Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219

Ham Radio & More Show (host); info at:
http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/hrm.htm
http://www.tapr.org/hrm  (RealAudio site to hear past shows) (Thanks TAPR)

The Ham Radio & More Show airs LIVE each Sunday at 6:00pm ET,
(2300utc), on many local commercial stations throughout the country.
ALSO: LIVE on WWCR Shortwave, 5.070mhz. 100,000 watts.(Thanks WWCR)
ALSO: LIVE on RealAudio at: http://www.audionet.com/radio/business/kbnp

Also:  Tape delayed via WWCR Shortwave on Mondays, at 1000utc on 3.210mhz
       and on Sundays, at 0600utc on 5.070mhz.

Support "WOG", the Written Only General!
WOG info at http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/wog.htm


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 3 Dec 1996 01:53:45 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <580179$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: dyn-max02-217.chi.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:
>[e-mail] (Len Winkler) wrote:
>
>>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & Mo
re
>>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a
no
>>code General License"?, was:
>>21 FOR
>>19 AGAINST
>>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.
>>
>>Again, just a totally unscientific poll.
>>73, Len
>>
>If it has no meaning or scientific value, why bother posting it?

It shows, in this case a slight majority in favor of some modernization
of the rules ... it's encouraging!  That's why! (and it's sure to piss
off all the rabid pro-coders ... that's worth something, too! <grin>)

>Code is fun!

Not when you shove it down MY throat, it's not ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-15.sprintlink.net!news.syspac.com!news
From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 00:08:59 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dnorris.syspac.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

[e-mail] (Len Winkler) wrote:

>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & Mor
e
>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a n
o
>code General License"?, was:
>21 FOR
>19 AGAINST
>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.
>
>Again, just a totally unscientific poll.
>73, Len
>
If it has no meaning or scientific value, why bother posting it?

Code is fun!


               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
            e-mail to [e-mail]
 The first half of a project takes 90% of the time...
 The second half of the project takes the other 90%.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 2 Dec 1996 23:52:14 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <580blu$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <580179$[e-mail]>, Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]> wrote:

>It shows, in this case a slight majority in favor of some modernization
>of the rules ... it's encouraging!  That's why! (and it's sure to piss
>off all the rabid pro-coders ... that's worth something, too! <grin>)

Yet more lies and useless rhetoric from Zeus.

Zeus knows what the meaning of "unscientific poll" is. Yet, he
tries to conclude facts about the amateur population as a whole
from this "poll" -- a no-no in the research industry.

Hopefully Zeus' RF research isn't as faulty.

Then again, Zeus probably uses the same logic to explain his
hi-tek super-duper whizz-bang rf modes' thruputs and how good
they are.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 00:51:47 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <582hrl$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-12.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:
>>[e-mail] (Len Winkler) wrote:
>>
>>>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & M
ore
>>>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a
 no
>>>code General License"?, was:
>>>21 FOR
>>>19 AGAINST
>>>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.
>>>
>>>Again, just a totally unscientific poll.
>>>73, Len
>>>
>>If it has no meaning or scientific value, why bother posting it?

>It shows, in this case a slight majority in favor of some modernization
>of the rules ... it's encouraging!

Oh brother!

>That's why! (and it's sure to piss
>off all the rabid pro-coders ... that's worth something, too! <grin>)

OH BROTHER!

>>Code is fun!

>Not when you shove it down MY throat, it's not ...

Oh for Pete's sake!  You can't have what YOU want right now and it's
eating you alive ain't it Carl?

  jjm







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 4 Dec 1996 03:05:20 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <582ppg$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <580blu$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-10.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <580blu$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Michael
P. Deignan) writes:
>In article <580179$[e-mail]>, Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>It shows, in this case a slight majority in favor of some modernization
>>of the rules ... it's encouraging!  That's why! (and it's sure to piss
>>off all the rabid pro-coders ... that's worth something, too! <grin>)
>
>Yet more lies and useless rhetoric from Zeus.
>
>Zeus knows what the meaning of "unscientific poll" is. Yet, he
>tries to conclude facts about the amateur population as a whole
>from this "poll" -- a no-no in the research industry.

How the heck does "in this case" say that I'm "concluding facts about
the amateur population as a whole" ???  I specifically stated that it
was a limited "result" ... you just seem to have developed a real
compulsive "need" to try to refute *anything* I say ...

>Hopefully Zeus' RF research isn't as faulty.
>Then again, Zeus probably uses the same logic to explain his
>hi-tek super-duper whizz-bang rf modes' thruputs and how good
>they are.

I didn't know that Zeus was into RF ... I don't think I've seen any of
his papers in the industry magazines or IEEE journals ... could you
provide a reference to his work?

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 4 Dec 1996 03:09:16 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <582q0s$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-10.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:
>Based on your logic, since I don't enjoy theory when it is "shoved
>down my throat", it should be eliminated also.  Then, why do we not
>give everyone a license as a right of birth?

Because theory (unlike code) is NECESSARY to meet government's
legitimate purpose of maximizing safety and minimizing the potential for
harmful interference ... and also because our "charter" is to be a
technical service of self-education in the radio art and to maintain a
pool of technicians and electronics experts ... code accomplishes
NOTHING useful in today's world ... neither commercial services nor the
military require any number of CW operators any more ... that past
justification has become moot ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 4 Dec 1996 03:11:42 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <582q5e$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <582hrl$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-10.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <582hrl$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V) writes:
>
>Oh for Pete's sake!  You can't have what YOU want right now and it's
>eating you alive ain't it Carl?
>
>  jjm

No, it's NOT "eating me alive" ... I'm just committed to working for
the modernization of our rules and regulations that are so important to
secure the future of ham radio into the 21st century ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!163.181.251.1!news2.amd.com!txnntp.amd.com!usenet
From: Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 13:11:10 -0600
Organization: AMD
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ramulale.amd.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I)

Carl Stevenson wrote:
>
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:
> >Based on your logic, since I don't enjoy theory when it is "shoved
> >down my throat", it should be eliminated also.  Then, why do we not
> >give everyone a license as a right of birth?
>
> Because theory (unlike code) is NECESSARY to meet government's
> legitimate purpose of maximizing safety and minimizing the potential for
> harmful interference ...

Nonsense.  Very little of the theory is to do with safety.  If you can
claim that code is useless to you, I can claim that knowledge of phase
modulation is useless to me.

In my experience, for most of the Hams I know, much of the technical
knowledge is useless to them - they buy their little radios and start
talking.  Just a few rules and regulations is all they require.  After
all, Icoeaswood has done all the hard work for them.  So why do you want
to shove all that useless (to them) theory down their throat?

WRT the charter of Ham radio, the "pool of technicians and electronics
experts" is rapidly becoming a farce, IMO, precisely because of this
mentality of stripping out stuff that is perceived as too hard or too
antiquated.

What is so sad to me is all this noise over a silly little test,
regardless of the rights and/or wrongs of mandating it.  Just do it,
it's easy if you spend fifteen minutes a night on it for about a month.
I'll bet most of the people complaining about having to do the code test
spend much, much more time watching the glowing box that sits in the
corner of their living rooms.

Heck, for those of you who read this newsgroup regularly, you spend more
time doing that than the time required to exercise your Morse.  Stop
reading it for a month and study the Morse.  If the HF bands are so
valuable to you, that little test will prove to be no barrier.  If you
have no physical handicap and you consider the test to be too difficult,
then maybe those bands are not as valuable to you as you might claim.

Apologies for perhaps coming across as strident, but for goodness' sake,
the test is not that big a deal.  Have we, as a so-called technical,
educated, can-do, no obstacle is too high, we choose to go to the Moon
society really fallen so far?

>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]

--
Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 5 Dec 1996 08:40:22 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <5861pm$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <580blu$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

>In article <580179$[e-mail]>, Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]> wrote:

>It shows, in this case a slight majority in favor of some modernization
>of the rules ... it's encouraging!  That's why! (and it's sure to piss
>off all the rabid pro-coders ... that's worth something, too! <grin>)

I knew about the poll and didn't bother to make the phone call, Gargoyle.
I suspect you called that number 21 times.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!EU.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 5 Dec 1996 02:17:14 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <585bba$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-08.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]> writes
:
>
>Nonsense.  Very little of the theory is to do with safety.  If you can
>claim that code is useless to you, I can claim that knowledge of phase
>modulation is useless to me.
>
>In my experience, for most of the Hams I know, much of the technical
>knowledge is useless to them - they buy their little radios and start
>talking.  Just a few rules and regulations is all they require.  After
>all, Icoeaswood has done all the hard work for them.  So why do you want
>to shove all that useless (to them) theory down their throat?


You're talking about "CBers who beep" ... not HAMS ... at least not hams
as they are *supposed* to be ...

>WRT the charter of Ham radio, the "pool of technicians and electronics
>experts" is rapidly becoming a farce, IMO, precisely because of this
>mentality of stripping out stuff that is perceived as too hard or too
>antiquated.

NO ... it's becoming a farce because too damned many "CBers who go beep"
just buy radios as "tools", don't know shit about radio, and
"just want to yack and play comeptitive games" ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!ames!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 5 Dec 1996 07:42:20 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <585ucs$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & Mor
e
>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a n
o
>code General License"?, was:
>21 FOR
>19 AGAINST
>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.

You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
called? Not much of a listenership.

>Support "WOG", the Written Only General!

Maybe that's the reason why...

Jeff KH2PZ

Support "TWPMCOT", the Thirteen WPM Code-Only Tech!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.mr.net!dawn.mmm.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary Hosler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 20:39:52 GMT
Organization: 3M - St. Paul, MN  55144-1000 US
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <587c1f$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <585ucs$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & Mo
re
>>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a
no
>>code General License"?, was:
>>21 FOR
>>19 AGAINST
>>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.

>You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
>called? Not much of a listenership.

>>Support "WOG", the Written Only General!

>Maybe that's the reason why...

>Jeff KH2PZ

>Support "TWPMCOT", the Thirteen WPM Code-Only Tech!

Jeff, you mean that you don't feel that 40 calls represent the
concensus of the Hams in the USA?  Me either!  This sort of BULL is
meaningless.  How bout it Len, you want to share with your
Internet/Usenet audience what percentage of the total US Ham
population, a count of 40 represents?  This is hardly what one could
consider informative.  Even the surveys that Ray Sarrio runs seldom
have more than a couple hundred Hams providing input.  Why not put
together a more meaningful survey that would cover a (statistically)
significant population of the US Hams, across all license classes and
age groups.  Now that would be a bit more interesting and far more
worthy of the bandwidth.

de KN0Z  Gary



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 6 Dec 1996 01:49:35 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <587u3f$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <585ucs$[e-mail]> <586q7d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-13.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <586q7d$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Len Winkler) w
rites:
>>Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & M
ore
>>
>>>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a
 no
>>
>>>code General License"?, was:
>>>21 FOR
>>>19 AGAINST
>>>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.
>>
[Jeffery Herman wrote:]
>>You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
>>called? Not much of a listenership.

>I'll take that as a sarcastic remark since if you knew anything about talk
>radio, or time for that matter, that's less than 15 seconds per caller on the

>air. I challenge you to find a station that takes that amount of callers.
>Complain as you will about the code requirement, pro or con, but don't insult
>your intelligence by saying nobody listens cause of 40 callers in less than
>9 minutes.

Len,

Don't feel picked on ... Jeff insults his own intelligence regularly
here with his rabid pro-code dogma ...  "things that go beep" seem to be
all he understands ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 6 Dec 1996 01:45:15 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <587trb$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <580blu$[e-mail]> <5861pm$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-13.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <5861pm$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>>In article <580179$[e-mail]>, Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>It shows, in this case a slight majority in favor of some modernization
>>of the rules ... it's encouraging!  That's why! (and it's sure to piss
>>off all the rabid pro-coders ... that's worth something, too! <grin>)
>
>I knew about the poll and didn't bother to make the phone call, Gargoyle.
>I suspect you called that number 21 times.
>
>Jeff KH2PZ

Actually, I was busy at the time and couldn't call ... so please
increment the "drop the code" vote by 1 ... Buffoon.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:55 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Len Winkler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 96 21:36:16 GMT
Organization: Ham Radio & More Show
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <587f8g$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <585ucs$[e-mail]> <587c1f$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts15-4.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2

>>Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio &
> More
>>>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a
> no
>>>code General License"?, was:
>>>21 FOR
>>>19 AGAINST
>>>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.
>
>>You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
>>called? Not much of a listenership.
>>Jeff KH2PZ
"snipped"
>How bout it Len, you want to share with your
>Internet/Usenet audience what percentage of the total US Ham
>population, a count of 40 represents?  This is hardly what one could
>consider informative  Why not put
>together a more meaningful survey that would cover a (statistically)
>significant population of the US Hams, across all license classes and
>age groups.
>
>de KN0Z  Gary
Gary: I agree completely that it is NOT representative or scientific in any wa
y!
I made that clear in my opening statement. You're right that a meaningful
survey would be helpful, but as far as I know, the only "real" surveys ever
done are by the ARRL to it's members, and, is that representative?
Len

Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
P.O. Box 9219                              [e-mail]
Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219

Ham Radio & More Show (host); info at:
http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/hrm.htm
http://www.tapr.org/hrm  (RealAudio site to hear past shows) (Thanks TAPR)

The Ham Radio & More Show airs LIVE each Sunday at 6:00pm ET,
(2300utc), on many local commercial stations throughout the country.
ALSO: LIVE on WWCR Shortwave, 5.070mhz. 100,000 watts.(Thanks WWCR)
ALSO: LIVE on RealAudio at: http://www.audionet.com/radio/business/kbnp

Also:  Tape delayed via WWCR Shortwave on Mondays, at 1000utc on 3.210mhz
       and on Sundays, at 0600utc on 5.070mhz.

Support "WOG", the Written Only General!
WOG info at http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/wog.htm


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:56 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Len Winkler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 96 15:37:17 GMT
Organization: Ham Radio & More Show
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <586q7d$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <585ucs$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts3-29.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2

>Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio & Mo
re
>
>>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of a
no
>
>>code General License"?, was:
>>21 FOR
>>19 AGAINST
>>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.
>
>You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
>called? Not much of a listenership.
I'll take that as a sarcastic remark since if you knew anything about talk
radio, or time for that matter, that's less than 15 seconds per caller on the
air. I challenge you to find a station that takes that amount of callers.
Complain as you will about the code requirement, pro or con, but don't insult
your intelligence by saying nobody listens cause of 40 callers in less than
9 minutes.

Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
P.O. Box 9219                              [e-mail]
Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219

Ham Radio & More Show (host); info at:
http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/hrm.htm
http://www.tapr.org/hrm  (RealAudio site to hear past shows) (Thanks TAPR)

The Ham Radio & More Show airs LIVE each Sunday at 6:00pm ET,
(2300utc), on many local commercial stations throughout the country.
ALSO: LIVE on WWCR Shortwave, 5.070mhz. 100,000 watts.(Thanks WWCR)
ALSO: LIVE on RealAudio at: http://www.audionet.com/radio/business/kbnp

Also:  Tape delayed via WWCR Shortwave on Mondays, at 1000utc on 3.210mhz
       and on Sundays, at 0600utc on 5.070mhz.

Support "WOG", the Written Only General!
WOG info at http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/wog.htm


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:25:59 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Hosler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 17:56:55 GMT
Organization: 3M - St. Paul, MN  55144-1000 US
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <589ms3$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <585ucs$[e-mail]> <587c1f$[e-mail]> <587f8g$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Len Winkler) wrote:

>>>Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>>The results of the totally unscientific, 9 minute poll on the Ham Radio &
>> More
>>>>Show on 12-1-96, asking the question, "Are you in favor, in principle, of
a
>> no
>>>>code General License"?, was:
>>>>21 FOR
>>>>19 AGAINST
>>>>40 Total calls taken from many different states in 9 minutes.
>>
>>>You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
>>>called? Not much of a listenership.
>>>Jeff KH2PZ
>"snipped"
>>How bout it Len, you want to share with your
>>Internet/Usenet audience what percentage of the total US Ham
>>population, a count of 40 represents?  This is hardly what one could
>>consider informative  Why not put
>>together a more meaningful survey that would cover a (statistically)
>>significant population of the US Hams, across all license classes and
>>age groups.
>>
>>de KN0Z  Gary
>Gary: I agree completely that it is NOT representative or scientific in any w
ay!
>I made that clear in my opening statement. You're right that a meaningful
>survey would be helpful, but as far as I know, the only "real" surveys ever
>done are by the ARRL to it's members, and, is that representative?
>Len

>Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
>P.O. Box 9219                              [e-mail]
>Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219

If you check with the ARRL you will find that they are currently
involved in two surveys, one to their members, and the second to non
members.  Give the League a call for details regarding criteria.

de KN0Z  Gary



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:01 1996
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From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 14:44:45 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <585ucs$[e-mail]> <586q7d$[e-mail]> <587u3f$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:


>[Jeffery Herman wrote:]
>>>You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
>>>called? Not much of a listenership.
>
>>I'll take that as a sarcastic remark since if you knew anything about talk
>>radio, or time for that matter, that's less than 15 seconds per caller on th
e
>>air. I challenge you to find a station that takes that amount of callers.
>>Complain as you will about the code requirement, pro or con, but don't insul
t
>>your intelligence by saying nobody listens cause of 40 callers in less than
>>9 minutes.
>
>Len,
>
>Don't feel picked on ... Jeff insults his own intelligence regularly
>here with his rabid pro-code dogma ...  "things that go beep" seem to be
>all he understands ...
>
>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

Isn't it interesting that if someone agrees passionately with MY
position he is an intelligent individual but if he disagrees with
equal passion he is 'rabid'.  Those with no ability to defend their
position always resort to ad hominem attacks.



               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
            e-mail to [e-mail]
    Quality - Price - Service ... Pick 2 of 3


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:02 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:42 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58acpa$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <585ucs$[e-mail]> <586q7d$[e-mail]> <587u3f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-172.kuentos.guam.net
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[e-mail] (CDN) wrote:

>>Don't feel picked on ... Jeff insults his own intelligence regularly
>>here with his rabid pro-code dogma ...  "things that go beep" seem to be
>>all he understands ...
>>
>>Carl - wa6vse
>>[e-mail]

>Isn't it interesting that if someone agrees passionately with MY
>position he is an intelligent individual but if he disagrees with
>equal passion he is 'rabid'.  Those with no ability to defend their
>position always resort to ad hominem attacks.

>               C. Dean Norris, K7NO

As Squiggie often says, he will fight to the death to defend your right to voi
ce
your opinion, as long as your opinion is the same as his opinion.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:03 1996
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From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 22:24:05 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>

Jim Cummings wrote:

> No, Christensen is incorrect in his deduction.  The reason for eliminating
> the CW examination is that it can no longer be expected that amateurs will
> have to respond to the orders of an official station to cease transmission
> due to interfering with a commercial station (See the RAC response to the
> FASC with respect to the need for the continuance of the international
> requirement for Morse code testing.)  It can hardly be deduced that theory
> testing could be likewise eliminated.

Based on what Jim?  You've failed to state a cause in the preceding
paragraph
for keeping the theory.  By the way Jim, I'm playing Devil's Advocate
with you on
this one only to make a point with regard to the elimination of CW.

> This goes to the heart of the matter of the role of the FCC in the United
> States, or Industry Canada in the True North Strong and Free, or any other
> administration that regulates the amateur service.  The role of these
> organizations is indeed to mitigate interference among the users of the radi
o
> frequency spectrum.  The testing of Morse code does not nor can it be
> modified to do so.  Yet, testing on electronic theory, unlike Morse code
> testing, is the only means, at the present time, in which these regulatory
> agency has assessing the merits of an individual to operate an amateur
> station.

No Jim, your deduction is incorrect.  Why does one need theory in order
to
understand where his band edges are?  If a station causes interference,
it's not likely to be detected and solved by passage of today's amateur
theory.  Perhaps you have a much different written exam in "The Great
White North?"

> Indeed, due to this lack of infringement characteristic, one must applaud th
e
> current theory examination because it would seem that amateur's lack of
> operational incapacity is in the effortless application of their abilities.
> In other words, our duties and responsibilities to other users of the
> spectrum are so ingrained as to be second nature.  Thus, the FCC would be
> foolish to remove theoretical testing when indeed compliance by amateurs, du
e
> to that testing, is unconscious.

How naive Jim.  The cold must be affecting the blood flow.  One doesn't
need
an understanding of theory in order to read and understand a frequency
chart.
Furthermore, all modern radios employ out-of-band transmit protection to
other
services in addition to very high accuracy frequency displays. I suspect
these
are the *real* reasons for interference avoidance.

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:04 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 6 Dec 1996 22:07:29 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <58a5f1$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <586q7d$[e-mail]> <587u3f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>[Jeffery Herman wrote:]

>>>You mean to say that even with a toll-free phone number only 40 folks
>>>called? Not much of a listenership.

>>I'll take that as a sarcastic remark since if you knew anything about talk
>>radio,or time for that matter, that's less than 15 seconds per caller on the

>>air. I challenge you to find a station that takes that amount of callers.
>>Complain as you will about the code requirement, pro or con, but don't insul
t
>>your intelligence by saying nobody listens cause of 40 callers in less than
>>9 minutes.

Hi Len, seems as if I stepped on your wanna-be-a-broadcaster toes.
As I recall, your earlier ad said that you wanted calls to be brief,
in the yes/no catagory. Thirteen seconds is a long time for just that
kind of response. I realize you're against the code requirements so
I should have expected you to resort to a personal attack.

I must say "thank-you" to you for keeping your broadcasts off the ham
bands, unlike K1MAN.

>Don't feel picked on ... Jeff insults his own intelligence regularly
>here with his rabid pro-code dogma ...  "things that go beep" seem to be
>all he understands ...
>Carl - wa6vse
(21 year Tech+)

Hi Carl,
"Rabid"? I guess the truth of my statements really stings, huh? But
you still haven't answer my long-standing question: You accuse CW
ops of not knowing how their radios work, yet CW ops are probably
the largest catagory of builders these days. So how many of the
radios that you operate are ones that you've built yourself?

73 friends,
Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:06 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 03:43:23 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <58ap32$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Dec 06  7:42:26 PM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Jim Cummings <[e-mail]> wrote:
>This goes to the heart of the matter of the role of the FCC in the United
>States, or Industry Canada in the True North Strong and Free, or any other
>administration that regulates the amateur service.  The role of these
>organizations is indeed to mitigate interference among the users of the radio

>frequency spectrum.  The testing of Morse code does not nor can it be
>modified to do so.  Yet, testing on electronic theory, unlike Morse code
>testing, is the only means, at the present time, in which these regulatory
>agency has assessing the merits of an individual to operate an amateur
>station.

Cummings is incorrect in this matter.   Passing a multiple guess exam
in which the answers and the questions are known in advance does not
demonstrate the above.   A written test on theory, administered by
VECs, and not published in advance, would accomplish the task
at minimal extra expense.

>If the current national programmes were insufficient, we would notice a
>significant number of infractions issued to amateurs for out of band
>operation and other such infringements.

We're discussing exams relating to electrical theory, not rules and
practice.

>There is no such indication that
>amateurs are a significant burden with respect to interference to other users

>of the spectrum.  Indeed, due to this lack of infringement characteristic, on
e must applaud the
>current theory examination because it would seem that amateur's lack of
>operational incapacity is in the effortless application of their abilities.

This is all related to practice, and rules, not theory.
We could accomplish the same thing by turning the exam into a "Drivers
License Exam for Radio Operators"

>73 and live better digitally
>Jim, VE3XJ

73, and Analog Transducers Forever...

Dick WD0anb



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:06 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 7 Dec 1996 15:00:47 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

Carl is grasping for anything that will get him on HF without CW. I guess
40 peoples Ideas our all that Carl needs to say thats the way it should
Be.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:07 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Len Winkler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 96 14:42:16 GMT
Organization: Ham Radio & More Show
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <58bvo8$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <586q7d$[e-mail]> <587u3f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58a5f1$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2


>Hi Len, seems as if I stepped on your wanna-be-a-broadcaster toes.
>As I recall, your earlier ad said that you wanted calls to be brief,
>in the yes/no catagory. Thirteen seconds is a long time for just that
>kind of response. I realize you're against the code requirements so
>I should have expected you to resort to a personal attack.
There was absolutely no personal attack, but I can understand ur feeling
that way. However, in 13 seconds, I must welcome a caller to the show,
get their vote, their name or call, their location, and give out the phone
number. Again, in 13 seconds. I certainly invite you to call in December
22, when ONLY PRO-CODE calls will be taken for the entire show and each
caller has up to 90 seconds without interruption to voice their opinion.

>I must say "thank-you" to you for keeping your broadcasts off the ham
>bands, unlike K1MAN.
Your welcome.
73, Len

Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
P.O. Box 9219                              [e-mail]
Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219

Ham Radio & More Show (host); info at:
http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/hrm.htm
http://www.tapr.org/hrm  (RealAudio site to hear past shows) (Thanks TAPR)

The Ham Radio & More Show airs LIVE each Sunday at 6:00pm ET,
(2300utc), on many local commercial stations throughout the country.
ALSO: LIVE on WWCR Shortwave, 5.070mhz. 100,000 watts.(Thanks WWCR)
ALSO: LIVE on RealAudio at: http://www.audionet.com/radio/business/kbnp

Also:  Tape delayed via WWCR Shortwave on Mondays, at 1000utc on 3.210mhz
       and on Sundays, at 0600utc on 5.070mhz.

Support "WOG", the Written Only General!
WOG info at http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/wog.htm


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:09 1996
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From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 14:18:01 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:
>>Based on your logic, since I don't enjoy theory when it is "shoved
>>down my throat", it should be eliminated also.  Then, why do we not
>>give everyone a license as a right of birth?
>
>Because theory (unlike code) is NECESSARY to meet government's
>legitimate purpose of maximizing safety and minimizing the potential for
>harmful interference ...

And a quick listen on 14.313, 3895? and just listening in general can
show just how effective this practice has been!

This is a subjective practice, just as the code requirement is a
subjective req't to show, not only code receiving capability, but to
show that the person requesting the PRIVILEGE of getting the license
has put forth some effort to master some (but certainly not all) of
the techniques.

>and also because our "charter" is to be a

"charter"... in which FCC document where is this charter spelled out?

>technical service of self-education in the radio art and to maintain a
>pool of technicians and electronics experts ... code accomplishes
>NOTHING useful in today's world ... neither commercial services nor the
>military require any number of CW operators any more ... that past
>justification has become moot ...

The fact that the military does not require CW proves nothing.  I can
and do communicate using CW and that, Sir, is useful!  Your arguments
are, therefore, invalid!


I will concede that CW proficiency is not the only method available to
demonstrate the skills necessary to obtain a license.  I would accept
some strong demonstration of electronic knowledge, operating skills,
or some other method.  BUT, until some well crafted change in
licensing requirements is offered, I opt for the current standards.

My concern is that we live in a society of "instant gratification" and
many of out citizens want-want-want without any give-give-give.  This
practice has led us down a path that is not only expensive but
destructive as well.
>



               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
            e-mail to [e-mail]
 The first half of a project takes 90% of the time...
 The second half of the project takes the other 90%.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:10 1996
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From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 14:20:54 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <582hrl$[e-mail]> <582q5e$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>In <582hrl$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V) writes
:
>>
>>Oh for Pete's sake!  You can't have what YOU want right now and it's
>>eating you alive ain't it Carl?
>>
>>  jjm
>
>No, it's NOT "eating me alive" ... I'm just committed to working for
>the modernization of our rules and regulations that are so important to
>secure the future of ham radio into the 21st century ...



Carl, can you show anyone just HOW you would "modernize" the rules or
is your purpose to only complain until someone else does your bidding?
Your committment seems to lack any substance.


               C. Dean Norris, K7NO
            e-mail to [e-mail]
 The first half of a project takes 90% of the time...
 The second half of the project takes the other 90%.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:11 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:42:07 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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CDN wrote:
> This practice has led us down a path that is not only expensive but
> destructive as well. C. Dean Norris, K7NO

Hey Dean, you stole my argument against Morse code testing. Morse code
testing is expensive (lots of wasted time for people who are not going
to use it) and destructive (keeping the brightest potential hams out
of ham radio). My home town still has a law that says one must call
the sheriff before driving to town in a horseless carriage. It sure
reminds me of the Morse code testing requirement - something just left
over from a past (now irrelevent) good idea at the time.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:19:20 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58flu8$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <582hrl$[e-mail]> <582q5e$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <582q5e$[e-mail]>, Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In <582hrl$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V) writes
:

>>Oh for Pete's sake!  You can't have what YOU want right now and it's
>>eating you alive ain't it Carl?

>No, it's NOT "eating me alive" ... I'm just committed to working for
>the modernization of our rules and regulations that are so important to
>secure the future of ham radio into the 21st century ...
>Carl - wa6vse
(tech+ for 21 years)

The future looks very bright for HF, Carl. We lost a band (11m) back in
the late 50s, but since then we've gained *so* much (full 160m, 12m, 17m,
and 30m), and there's a proposal onboard to give us even more MF/HF
spectrum. So don't worry yourself about code and HF in regards to the
coming century. It's such a pity, though - you'll be on the outside looking
in.

73 from Hawaii,
Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:11:22 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58flfa$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <580179$[e-mail]>, Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:

>>Code is fun!

>Not when you shove it down MY throat, it's not ...
>Carl - wa6vse
(tech+ for 21 years)

As if you're not shoving your fad modes down our throats?

Jeff KH2PZ



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 03:53:14 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <58impg$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ap32$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sjx-ca12-12.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 09  7:52:16 PM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Jim Cummings <[e-mail]> wrote:

>[e-mail] wrote:
>>
>> Jim Cummings <[e-mail]> wrote:

>> >  The testing of Morse code does not nor can it be
>> >modified to do so.  Yet, testing on electronic theory, unlike Morse code
>> >testing, is the only means, at the present time, in which these regulatory
>> >agency has assessing the merits of an individual to operate an amateur
>> >station.
>>
>> Cummings is incorrect in this matter.   Passing a multiple guess exam
>> in which the answers and the questions are known in advance does not
>> demonstrate the above.   A written test on theory, administered by
>> VECs, and not published in advance, would accomplish the task
>> at minimal extra expense.
>>

>It would be refreshing if Wallingford took the time to read my posting and
>then reacted.  Obviously we agree that there should be written examinations.
> But I fail to understand how I can be incorrect with respect to an opinion
>that I have not tendered at all - i.e. the issue of prior publication of
>examination questions.

Had I known that Cummings becomes "refreshed" after reading posts
with which he agrees, I would have taken undertaken the extra effort
to better explain his faulty logic.   With hopes of due reward, I will
do so now:

You state that  "electronic theory [testing], unlike Morse code
testing, is the only means, at the present time, in which
these regulatory agency has assessing the merits of an
individual to operate an amateur station.".

I claim that electronic theory testing makes no such assessment, and
therefore, it is not only not "the only means", it is in fact "no
means".

The reasons that most amateur stations exhibit good practice are
threefold:

a) See and do.
b) Studying rules, regulations and operator practice questions to pass

    the test.
c) Appliances are relatively easy to hook up and operate.

Operators don't avoid splatter and stay in band because they know that
there's no such thing as a "Taft" oscillator, or because they can
compute the resonant frequency of an RLC circuit.

Given that neither theory, nor CW testing prove anything about  the
"merits of an individual to operate an amateur station" (especially
when you define "merit" as staying within band and not interfering
with anyone).  I see no reason to single out CW as the testing element
which must be eliminated.   If anything, I would argue that (all else
being equal)  a ham who uses CW is more likely to be the more
well-rounded operator, using your definition.


Dick WD0ANB






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:16 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Rodger D.Placer
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 12:44:20 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nyc-ny17-20.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Rodger:
        Gee... Ididdn't know that someone could flame someone by just
reading 2 sentances of an entire page. Well, what can one expect from
someone who works for The very type of company that's just chomping at
the bit to get our spectrum. and you yourself just made a good point. Why
shoud any of us worry about what happens in a so called two- bit bannana
republic? Because of a little something you guys made back in 1986 called
the ECPA. How convinent that that sort of thing gets quietly swept under
the rug. The point of my letter was That if the Itu can approve such a
thing in Guatemala, they shure as Hell can do the same thing to us,as the
Itu is Vastly more powerful than the Fcc, And certinly more powerful than
ahandfull of lowly hams.
                  Dave/KB2ZYO


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:17 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!news.he.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Rodger D.Placer
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 15:35:47 GMT
Lines: 48

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>Rodger:
>        Gee... Ididdn't know that someone could flame someone by just
>reading 2 sentances of an entire page. Well, what can one expect from
>someone who works for The very type of company that's just chomping at
>the bit to get our spectrum. and you yourself just made a good point. Why
>shoud any of us worry about what happens in a so called two- bit bannana
>republic? Because of a little something you guys made back in 1986 called
>the ECPA. How convinent that that sort of thing gets quietly swept under
>the rug. The point of my letter was That if the Itu can approve such a
>thing in Guatemala, they shure as Hell can do the same thing to us,as the
>Itu is Vastly more powerful than the Fcc, And certinly more powerful than
>ahandfull of lowly hams.
>                  Dave/KB2ZYO

Huh? How many divisions can the ITU field?

The ITU is toothless and depends on the good will of its member
nations for cooperation. The FCC on the other hand has the power
of the US government behind it. And while not the power it once
was, the US government can still field a formidable force.

As I understand the situation in Guatamala, the decision to remove
70cm from amateur use was made by the local government, not the ITU.
The Guatamalan goverment had allowed amateurs secondary status on
parts of 70cm in the past, just as US amateurs have secondary status
on parts of 70cm (in the US the military is primary), but is now
intending to remove that secondary authority and auction the band to
its primary users (in their case commercial telecommunications).

They can certainly do this. It is within their sovereign power.
There is some question about amateur satellite allocations in
this band, however. It is uncertain whether Guatamala is a
signatory to the treaties regarding the amateur satellite
service. If they are, they have indicated that they will respect
those treaty obligations and keep the 435-438 MHz segment of
70cm available for the amateur satellite service. (Reportedly,
the Guatamalan authorities expressed astonishment when informed
that amateur satellites even exist, another fine job by the ARRL
and their IARU puppet of educating governments about the amateur
radio service. NOT!)

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!newshost.convex.com!bcm.tmc.edu!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 07:18:52 -0700
Organization: Network Service
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: den-co7-20.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Steve Forcht wrote:
>
> Howdy:
>  Has anyone seen any circuits around for a Roger Beep. I have not been
> able to find any.

Very Funny!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!hookup!visi.com!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.myna.com!usenet
From: Steve Forcht <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Roger Beep
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 02:33:49 -0800
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dh-2.rn1.myna.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Howdy:
 Has anyone seen any circuits around for a Roger Beep. I have not been
able to find any.

                                        Thanks Steve VA3SF
--

                                       """""
                                       (@ @)
        ---------------------------oOOo-(_)-oOOo-----------------------
         http://www.myna.com/~stevef <<< <<< <<< <<< <<<--click here


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-6.sprintlink.net!demos!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!torn!news.unb.ca!fan1!aa469
From: [e-mail] (Jean Letourneau)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 11 Dec 1996 01:03:19 GMT
Organization: Fredericton Area Network
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <58l18n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: fan1.fan.nb.ca
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Steve Forcht ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Howdy:
:  Has anyone seen any circuits around for a Roger Beep. I have not been
: able to find any.

Check in the OLD radio electronic magazine, or 101 electronics project, I
remember seen one there when CB was really popular, ie: early 80`

:                                       Thanks Steve VA3SF

---
Jean Letourneau  --  Fredericton Area Network


       \    \    \
        \    \    \                    Best 73's
      [][][][][][][][][]      ....Read you very soon...!!!
           \   :\    \
            \  : \    \        Internet E-mail: [e-mail]
              /[\           AMPRNET E-Mail:  [e-mail]
              :X:       Packet Address: ve9pt@ve9pt.#fred.nb.ca.noam
              :X:
                                    Lincoln, (Fredericton)
  145.03 & 145.09 MHZ @1200Bps         ** CANADA **
          IP Gateway                DE: VE9PT (Jean)







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 21:12:26 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions (A Standard Disclaimer)
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: mg132-002.ricochet.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Steve Forcht wrote:
>
> Howdy:
>  Has anyone seen any circuits around for a Roger Beep. I have not been
> able to find any.

Roger who?

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: Michael Beck <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 08:01:08 +0000
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc50085.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Steve Forcht wrote:
>
> Howdy:
>  Has anyone seen any circuits around for a Roger Beep. I have not been
> able to find any.
>
>                                         Thanks Steve VA3SF
> --
>
>                                        """""
>                                        (@ @)
>         ---------------------------oOOo-(_)-oOOo-----------------------
>          http://www.myna.com/~stevef <<< <<< <<< <<< <<<--click here

What? Making your Kenwood rig complete?




--
                    ///// \\\\\
                    (  o   o  )
-------------------oOO--(_)--OOo------------------
==================================================
Michael Beck / KE6JNO
[e-mail] / [e-mail]
Montara, California U.S.A.
==================================================


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!feed1.news.innet.be!INbe.net!news.nl.innet.net!INnl.net!hunter.premier.net!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: David Solomon <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RTTY decode via Soundcard
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 20:45:44 -0800
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.33.148
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win16; I)

Does anyone know if there is any software that will decode (maybe encode)
RTTY via a Sound Blaster?

Thanks in advance,
David - AB2CI


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.161.84.3!scanner.worldgate.com!news.insinc.net!news.cadvision.com!usenet
From: Raj Singh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RTTY decode via Soundcard
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 20:46:01 -0800
Organization: CADVision Development Corp.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: agtd235.cadvision.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I)

David Solomon wrote:
>
> Does anyone know if there is any software that will decode (maybe encode)
> RTTY via a Sound Blaster?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> David - AB2CI

Check out Brian Beasley's ad in QST etc. I don't know his email or www
addresses but it is the one you want. His call I believe is K6STI.

73
Raj VE6RAJ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!demos!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!mr.net!winternet.com!n1ott.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RTTY decode via Soundcard
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 16:18:41 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <581jp2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-120.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Raj Singh <[e-mail]> wrote:

>David Solomon wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone know if there is any software that will decode (maybe encode)
>> RTTY via a Sound Blaster?
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> David - AB2CI

>Check out Brian Beasley's ad in QST etc. I don't know his email or www
>addresses but it is the one you want. His call I believe is K6STI.

>73
>Raj VE6RAJ

Or email '[e-mail]' and ask him about a Hamcomm adapter. Plug it
into a serial port and you can receive RTTY, FAX, SSTV, etc.  You can make a
simple circuit which allows xmit.  He supplies the Hamcomm and two shareware
programs for $20.   I use one for HF weather fax pictures, works great, and al
so

copies SSTV pictures nicely on HF.  He also has a web page, but I can't find t
he

address.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Michael P. 'Jug' Jogoleff, WA6MBZ" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: SAmsung 2417 printer help
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 22:07:46 +0000
Organization: SBARC - - - WA6MBZ
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: sba-ca1-11.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 04  2:09:03 PM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Recently I purchased a Samsung 2417 dot matrix printer that I thought
I might use with my packet station.  It turns out I did not get a copy
of the driver disk and would appreciate someone pointing me in the right
direction for finding one.
73 de 'Jug' WA6MBZ
--
Michael P. 'Jug' Jogoleff, WA6MBZ; DM04DK; 34.431514 N., 119.698060 W.
[e-mail]; [e-mail]
http://www.netcom.com/~mike_j/wa6mbz.html
SBARC, ARRL LM, ARRL VE, CMRA; Tel: [phone] Msg. or Fax.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!EU.net!Austria.EU.net!01-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!swidir.switch.ch!surfnet.nl!news.nic.utwente.nl!news.cs.utwente.nl!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Bob Coret)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Searching for online phonebooks !?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 15:36:26 GMT
Organization: University of Twente, Dept. of Computer Science
Lines: 7
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <586q5q$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: utip062.cs.utwente.nl
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

I am collecting on-line phonebooks. If you have any URL's that I miss please
mail them to me, so that I can make the list complete!

The URL:  http://phonebooks.home.ml.org/

Bob Coret



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "3" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: SHARP PC3030 NOTEBOOK
Date: 5 Dec 1996 22:52:15 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <01bbe2fe$18cd5120$56dc92cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.220.86
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

P100, 8MB RAM, 540 MB HD 11.3" DUAL SCAN COLOR

$1050 FIRM   $1150 W /28.8 MODEM



MIKE


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.nacamar.de!fu-berlin.de!unlisys!news.maz.net!news2.isys.net!flux.isys.net!news
From: Thomas Krull <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Signing in the US (Foreign Call)
Date: 08 Dec 1996 10:13:25 +0000
Organization: DF1HX - Amateur Radio Station
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost
X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.2.25/XEmacs 19.14

Hi !

On Tuesday next week (12/10) i'll come to Florida to spend my vacations.
My reciprocal permit to operate in the US was send to a friend in Ft.
Lauderdale, where i'll pick it up upon arrival.
My friend, who isn't involved in ham radio at all, checked the permit
while i was on the phone with him and told me, that my home call (DF1HX)
is stated there.
So i am wondering about how to sign, while operating in FLA, i guess
i'll have to add a 'prefix' or 'suffix' to my home call, but what ?

I am going to bring my HT (144/440) but no HF equipment since i am not
on a DXpedition but on vacations :-). BTW would be nice to get access
to a club-station or soemthing like that since i'd like to call a 'CQ DL'
in CW (my favourite mode on HF), while being in your country.

Preps are done, my HT is equipped with CTCSS and i have a big list with
repeaters in FLA retrieved from WWW.
I am going to set up my 'headquartes' in a rental Appt. in Ft. Lauderdale,
however i plan to travel to the Keys and Orlando Area as well...

thanks ahead and looking fwd to meeting you on the bands !
73 es gl, de Thomas [DF1HX]
--
                --------------------------------------------
                Thomas Krull   [e-mail]     DF1HX
                               PGP Key: 0xC9E74329
                --------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Signing in the US (Foreign Call)
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 96 16:35:30 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <[e-mail]>
           [e-mail] "Thomas Krull" writes:

> On Tuesday next week (12/10) i'll come to Florida to spend my vacations.
> My reciprocal permit to operate in the US was send to a friend in Ft.
> Lauderdale, where i'll pick it up upon arrival.
> My friend, who isn't involved in ham radio at all, checked the permit
> while i was on the phone with him and told me, that my home call (DF1HX)
> is stated there.
> So i am wondering about how to sign, while operating in FLA, i guess
> i'll have to add a 'prefix' or 'suffix' to my home call, but what ?

Thomas, you really should get a copy of the FCC regulations as you
are required to comply with them.  These are some particular rules
for operating with a reciprocal permit, together with their location
in the regulations:

1) You must identify your station with an appropriate US prefix
followed by your home call, e.g. W4/DF1HX. [S 97.119(f)]
(Canadians should note that they have a different rule here.)

2) You must identify your location (City and State) no less
frequently that once during each contact. [S 97.119(f)]

3) You must operate within the rules of your home licence privileges
as well as within US Extra privileges.  This means that you may only
transmit in the Region 1 part of 2m (144 to 146 MHz), so you will
find useful repeaters on 2m very scarce if any. [S 97.107(b)(2)&(3)]

I'll email you a copy of all the FCC regulations for amateur radio
if you wish.  Have a great vacation.

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!208.201.33.3!news.csw.net!news
From: "lisa lowell" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: SMIRK HOMEPAGE
Date: 10 Dec 1996 04:57:27 GMT
Organization: CSW Net, Inc.
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <01bbe689$605f7fc0$2e23c9d0@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: csdan2-14.cswnet.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1549 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44000 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120180 rec.radio.swap:98912

TO ALL SIX METER SMIRK MEMBERS AND NON-MEMBERS,

THE SMIRK HOMEPAGE AND SMIRK TECH LIST HAS BEEN UPDATED AT THIS TIME. WE
HAVE ALSO ADDED THE SMIRK SIX SHOOTER NEWSLETTER TO THE WEB SITE WHICH IS
STILL UNDER CONSTRUCTION. FEEL FREE TO VISIT OUR WEB SITE AND ANY COMMENTS
AND SUGESTIONS WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.

http://www.cswnet.com/~ka0nno

73's
GEORGE AND LISA
N0EOQ      KA0NNO


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-dc.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!hookup!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Jack Reed <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Smithsonian 150th
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 22:08:40 -0800
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spg-as11s26.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Join NN3SI, the Smithsonian National Museum of American History's Amateur
Radio Station to continue celebrating the 150th anniversary, Saturday, 14
December, 1500-2100, on 10, 20, and 40. Frequencies in the vicinity of
28400, 14250, 7250, and Novice CW, as conditions permit. Certificate.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!swrinde!news-relay.us.dell.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 11:41:03 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Solicito informacion....
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Tue Dec 03 17:35:42 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 198.139.9.91 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/3.01 (Win95; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 16

Si hay alguien que me pueda ofrecer informacion sobre:

 ...La posible perdida de segmentos en las bandas de radioaficionados,
especificamente en 2 mts. y 70 cms., se habla que con motivo del programa
de satelites LEOS, su uso de estos segmentos se revisara en la Conferencia
Mundial de Radio de 1997, en fin, si hay alguien que nos pueda ampliar la
informacion sobre el riesgo que para los radioaficionados del mundo
representa este hecho.

Gracias....

Honorio Lopez
Guasave, Sinaloa, Mexico.

-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!134.222.90.2!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!visual.demon.co.uk!ianc
From: Ian Curington <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Source routines for Yagi response graphs
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 1996 09:46:53 +0000
Organization: Advanced Visual Systems
Lines: 23
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <WCbeIAANc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: visual.demon.co.uk
X-NNTP-Posting-Host: visual.demon.co.uk
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Newsreader: Turnpike Version 3.00 <eDGWFZNqaS1cLnTQElCqFUDgsX>


Request for help:
  I am designing a teaching / demo software system to explain
  antenna design concepts.

  I am looking for some C source code routines that compute the angular
  gain distribution given the position, lengths and test freq. of a YAGI
  style beam antenna. It can assume lots of things like material types,
  this is only for experiments/teaching, not for winning prizes for
  a new design!

  It needs to be source code, because I need to wrap it up with my own
  graphics and user interface.

  I have seen "yo" for DOS, and I am sure such routines exist inside it,
  but I need the source.

  I am very greatful for any ideas!
--
--- Ian Curington --------------------------
--- http://www.avs.com/~ianc/ --------------
--- Nephew of W6PAD ------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Southfield Michigan -- SWAP
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 19:50:45 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <586kti$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc042036.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.326

On 5 Dec 1996 14:06:42 GMT, [e-mail] (Chris Oesterling)
wrote:

>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Southfield High School's Technology Department 31st. Annual Swap & Shop
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Amateur Radio Equipment
>Computers & Sotware
>Electronic Parts & Equipment
>Door Prizes
>
>Ticket $5.00
>
>8:00 AM to 3:00 PM
>
>Southfield High School
>24675 Lahser Road
>Southfield, MI  48034
>
>Call [phone] anytime form more information
>

I plan on attending .... but the *DATE* would be awful handy to know
and it would save me long distance phone call ;)

Gary K8IQ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!148.59.1.26!pravda.aa.msen.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Chris Oesterling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Southfield Michigan -- SWAP
Date: 5 Dec 1996 14:06:42 GMT
Organization: Msen
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <586kti$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: conch.aa.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Southfield High School's Technology Department 31st. Annual Swap & Shop
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Amateur Radio Equipment
Computers & Sotware
Electronic Parts & Equipment
Door Prizes

Ticket $5.00

8:00 AM to 3:00 PM

Southfield High School
24675 Lahser Road
Southfield, MI  48034

Call [phone] anytime form more information



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!paladin.american.edu!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!news.ysu.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!pravda.aa.msen.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Chris Oesterling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Southfield Michigan -- SWAP
Date: 5 Dec 1996 19:13:43 GMT
Organization: Msen
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <5876t8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: conch.aa.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Southfield High School's Technology Department 31st. Annual Swap & Shop
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Sunday, January 19, 1997

Amateur Radio Equipment
Computers & Sotware
Electronic Parts & Equipment
Door Prizes

Ticket $5.00

8:00 AM to 3:00 PM

Southfield High School
24675 Lahser Road
Southfield, MI  48034

Call [phone] anytime for more information



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!cbgw3.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!alice!allegra!ulysses!newshub.netnews.att.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Spell my name right!!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 15:29:16 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 135.3.90.*
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

My name is 'Roger'. I *hate* when people put a 'D' in my name.
Especially when it's spelled correctly in several places, and in plain
view to the reader.

Let's just step back for a moment. I am not saying "who the hell cares
about what happens in Guyana; it's of no consequence to REAL people." I
am simply saying that ONE band, - 440 MHz at that - being taken away
from amateurs in ONE country, doesn't signal the coming of the Grim
Reaper to all hams in the civilized world. 30 bazillion people in China
can't have licenses AT ALL. Or Albania, Mongolia, Burma, Vietnam, Laos,
lots of African countries where they need food rather than radios, Iraq,
Iran, Syria, Yemen, blah blah blah.

So, no, I really don't fret about Guyanan hams losing 70cm. I'm sorry
for them, but "stuff happens."

However, I was mainly remarking on your tone, which was rather dramatic:
"Take away my license..over my dead body," for example.

I am deeply concerned with the trend towards making radio spectrum into
a commodity. I think it is yet another straw on the back of the camel
that is our increasingly shallow, greedy, 10-minute attention span
society. However, only through quiet and dignified determination are we
going to hold on to our privileges. The bottom line is that amateur
radio must continue to provide value to the general public, both in the
form of service and of R&D, for it to mean anything to the bodies that
make the rules.

So rather than dragging your equipment to the Brooklyn Bridge and
getting ready to jump with it to save your license, consider doing
something productive instead.

As for your references to my company, I have nothing to say. I'm a
software engineer, not a radio spectrum kidnapper.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:38 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!n1ist
From: [e-mail] (Michael L. Ardai)
Subject: Tektronix 491 question
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Utopia Planetia Shipyards - Mars
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 18:38:53 GMT
Lines: 17
Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21786 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119786


I recently picked up a Tek 491 spectrum analyzer at a flea.  It seems
to be working fine, but I have one question:  How do you calibrate the
vertical (signal strength) scale?  Short of having a signal generator
of known amplitude at the desired frequency, I haven't figured out
how.  Right now, I'm using it to measure 860 MHz signal strength around
the apartment to see how much is coming in from a new SMR site being
installed 25' above us...

Also, any recommendations for who to get a user and service manual from?
Thanks and 73.
/mike

--
\|/      Michael L. Ardai        N1IST       [e-mail]       \|/
-*- ===  Boston Amateur Radio Club:  http://www.barc.org/barc   === -*-
/|\    or send "info barc-list" to [e-mail]     /|\


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.ultranet.com!NewsWatcher!user
From: [e-mail] (Jon Goguen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tektronix 491 question
Date: 7 Dec 1996 01:15:49 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <acj-0612962023460001@205.246.8.86>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: amber1.ultranet.com
X-Newsreader: Value-Added NewsWatcher 2.0b22.0+
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21812 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119884

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Michael L.
Ardai) wrote:

> I recently picked up a Tek 491 spectrum analyzer
>How do you calibrate the vertical (signal strength) scale?

The amplitude scale is strictly relative, unless you do use a calibrated
source as reference.  That's the downside of the 491 as compared to the
old HP141T systems.  On the other hand, the 491 is smaller and lighter.

> Also, any recommendations for who to get a user and service manual from?

Buy one from Ed Matsuda (619-479-0225).  He may or may not have an
original, but his copies are of good quality and his prices are
reasonable.

> Thanks and 73.
> /mike
>
> --
> \|/      Michael L. Ardai        N1IST       [e-mail]       \|/
> -*- ===  Boston Amateur Radio Club:  http://www.barc.org/barc   === -*-
> /|\    or send "info barc-list" to [e-mail]     /|\


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news1.rcsntx.swbell.net!usenet
From: George Baker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tektronix 491 question
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:21:14 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <acj-0612962023460001@205.246.8.86>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-151-164-41-184.rcsntx.swbell.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21823 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119934

Jon Goguen wrote:
>

> > Also, any recommendations for who to get a user and service manual from?
> Look up Tucker Electronics on Yahoo or whatever. They are a very large used
test
equipment outfit in Dallas, TX and have extensive files of Tektronix docs. Wil
l cost
some $$$ but I would bet that they have it.

--
73, George
W5YR
Fairview, TX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!usc!news.cerf.net!hacgate2.hac.com!news.delcoelect.com!usenet
From: Chris Nicholson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tektronix 491 question
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 09:43:39 -0500
Organization: Delco Electronics
Lines: 22
Distribution: usa
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: koicpc26.delcoelect.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21844 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119974

Michael L. Ardai wrote:
>
> I recently picked up a Tek 491 spectrum analyzer at a flea.  It seems
> to be working fine, but I have one question:  How do you calibrate the
> vertical (signal strength) scale?  Short of having a signal generator
> of known amplitude at the desired frequency, I haven't figured out
> how.  Right now, I'm using it to measure 860 MHz signal strength around
> the apartment to see how much is coming in from a new SMR site being
> installed 25' above us...
>
> Also, any recommendations for who to get a user and service manual from?
> Thanks and 73.
> /mike
>
> --
> \|/      Michael L. Ardai        N1IST       [e-mail]       \|/
> -*- ===  Boston Amateur Radio Club:  http://www.barc.org/barc   === -*-
> /|\    or send "info barc-list" to [e-mail]     /|\
        Mike, I also have a tek 491. It's OK but as you say, it's only
good for relative measurements. so you'll need that generator for
absolute measurements.
                                73 Chris


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!super.zippo.com!zdc!szdc!szdc-e!news
From: [e-mail] (Ian Rivlin)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tektronix C12 oscilloscope camera for sale
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 01:41:42 GMT
Organization: Zip News
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <58d6gd$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Tektronix C12 Oscilloscope camera for sale - all complete. Mint
condition. Optics perfect - has Polaroid back (works perfectly).
Reasonable offers please




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bconnex.net!clicnet!news.clic.net!wesley.videotron.net!wagner.spc.videotron.ca!news
From: james brunelle <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: TEST EQUIPMENT FOR
Date: 8 Dec 1996 21:02:07 GMT
Organization: Multi-Medias Quebec
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58facf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: modem21-annex01.multi-medias.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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DECADE RESISTANCE BOX'S 0-9999 Ohms .1% Manginim Wire, Gold platted
switch contacts, Black 6"x6" box, Lab quality, 4-dial, $29.00
stock overrun. Qty 24 NEW

Regulated Bench Power Supplies Model 1030 0-18v 0-3a Dual Meter.
Made by Instek $189.00 NEW

PULSE GENERATOR Model 3060 mfg by Instek $159.00 NEW


                                 Thank You

                                   Jim

for more info specs etc. <[e-mail]>
                            Tel:[phone]
                            Fax:[phone]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: THANK-YOU
Date: 5 Dec 1996 19:25:25 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <01bbe2e1$336cade0$697174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.105
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

To the real amateurs who have obtained pager service from me.  Currently as
of 12/5/96 the count is up to 214.


Thanks again and Happy Holidays to all 50 States.


"www.angelfire.com/biz/pager/index.html"


Michael Klein
KB2TIU

If you did not obtain service from me, because of comments you have read on
this server, email me and let me know, you may be entitled to compensation
resulting from a class action law suit.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THANK-YOU
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 20:34:06 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe2e1$336cade0$697174cf@default> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans15.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

Flush twice, it's a long way to his house. He thinks he's a paralegal
who is going to sue me in federal court for slander in a class action
suit. UHhh. Rite.

[e-mail] (Joel B Levin) wrote:
>Hey, I never even read the original ad, or even ever heard of this luser
>before, so of course I didn't obtain service from him.  I want a piece of
>that lawsuit!  Free money!  (Oops, that's a different spam)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!134.222.90.2!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THANK-YOU
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 96 10:53:42 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe2e1$336cade0$697174cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <01bbe2e1$336cade0$697174cf@default>
           [e-mail] "1" writes:

> To the real amateurs who have obtained pager service from me.  Currently as
> of 12/5/96 the count is up to 214.

I am sure that we all read this number as having all the veracity
to be expected from someone who repeatedly denies that the Number
States in the Union is 50 and who forges news postings to pretend
that he has at least one supporter.

Me and my size 9 foot!  Have I just earned my very own Class Action
Complaint?

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:46 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <57n4ld$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57rer9$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 16:43:16 GMT
Lines: 61

In article <57rer9$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Daniel
Wee, 9V1ZV) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>   John <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>If it is between the Standard and the Yaesu, go with the standard. Yaesu
>>is cutting a lot of corners to get the size to a minimum.
>>
>>John / W8JX
>
>Thanks John. How about between Standard, ICOM and Kenwood? Personally
>I rather avoid Kenwood because their basic performance seems to be
>rather poor although they are feature rich. I am not sure if this is
>the case with the TH-79A(D)? Also, I have little experience with ICOM
>HT's so I don't know about their performance. I do know that STANDARD
>makes excellent radios. Ergonomically it could use some work but the
>electronics is good.
>
>73 de 9V1ZV Daniel

Let me jump in with my opinions.

Standard is an up and comer in this market. Their radios are pretty
good, but could use some human interface work. Icom was *the* amateur
standard of excellence for a number of years, making such classic
HTs as the IC2AT. They're still good, but lately I don't think that
they quite measure up to their previous reputation. Yaesu HTs are
also good, with probably the best human interface. Like the others,
their IMD performance suffers because they try to be wideband scanners
as well as communications radios. No one does that well because the
demands are diametrically opposite. But I don't think that they've
cut any quality corners, it's just the nature of the beast.

So basically, I like all three manufacturers' products (and I like
the Radio Shack HTX202, which is modeled after a classic Icom design,
and unlike the current offerings from the others, doesn't compromise
performance by trying to be a wideband scanner too).

Now Kenwood, that's a different matter. IMHO they're bottom feeders.
They haven't produced a VHF+ radio that I consider suitable for amateur
use since the TS-700 (and that radio wasn't so great, it's just that
no one else had anything better at the time). Their radios are stuffed
with Gameboy features, but lack the solid RF performance you need in
a communications radio. Their radios have bad thermal design, IE they
overheat much too easily, they rarely meet their published specs for
output power or distortion, they have severe IMD problems (aggravated
by too much front end RF gain), and their user interfaces are baroque
at best. Quality control on the newer models also appears to be spotty.

I keep hoping that they'll wake up and produce a decent VHF+ radio
(they've demonstrated they can make a good HF radio), but each new
model keeps proving to be a disappointment. Perhaps if they invested
in some good solid RF engineering, instead of color magazine inserts
and Gameboy frills, they might be able to do something good. But as
long as the suckers (er customers) keep ooohing and aaahing over the
frills, and don't demand good performance, they probably won't.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Date: Mon,  2 Dec 1996 22:36:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]> <57n4ld$[e-mail]> <32A053
Lines: 11


>>Standard is an up and comer in this market.

Pardon me? They've been producing solid Amateur equipment for about two
decades now. Award-winning products. Wouldn't trade my C288a HTs or my
C558A HT for any other manufacturer's comparable units.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newspump.sol.net!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!van-bc!news.rmii.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lantana.singnet.com.sg!ts900-6720
From: [e-mail] (Daniel Wee, 9V1ZV)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 96 03:57:09 GMT
Organization: Singapore Telecom Internet Service
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <582sql$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57n4ld$[e-mail]> <32A053 <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts900-6720.singnet.com.sg
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4

In article <[e-mail]>,
   [e-mail] (Clint Bradford) wrote:
>
>>>Standard is an up and comer in this market.
>
>Pardon me? They've been producing solid Amateur equipment for about two
>decades now. Award-winning products. Wouldn't trade my C288a HTs or my
>C558A HT for any other manufacturer's comparable units.
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
>ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
>------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Clint,

        I wonder if you have the LAB results on the 558A handy? This
would be from the March 94 QST. In particular I am interested in the
3rd order IMD at 20kHz and at 10MHz. I like STANDARD but it seems that
the TH-79A(D) has better figures than the C568A in this regard. I wonder
if the 558A is better? My primary concern is intermod rejection. I also
observe that on the STANDARD www page, the 558 does not have the
"unsurpassed intermod rejection" as one of its "features" while some
other models do. Can you help?

73 de 9V1ZV Daniel

*------------+-------------------------------------+
| Daniel Wee | [e-mail]          |
| 9V1ZV      | [e-mail]               |
| QRP-L #667 | [e-mail] |
+------------+-------------------------------------+


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!usc!newshub.csu.net!csun.edu!hbcsc274
From: [e-mail] (jerry wang)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Date: 4 Dec 1996 23:45:31 GMT
Organization: California State University, Northridge
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5852er$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57n4ld$[e-mail]> <32A053 <[e-mail]> <582sql$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: csun2.csun.edu


Just wanted to add my 2 cents.
The only two HT's I've owned were a Radio Shack HTX202 & Yaesu FT530.
The HTX202 was kind of big, and clumsy to carry around.  The FT530 was a
little bit smaller, had good features, and not much problems with
intermod.  I've sold these radios now, and I will be getting a Yaesu FT50R
next week (it's being shipped with UPS right now).
I am looking forward to the 50R because it was wide band receive, Mil Std
rating I guess it's tough, although I really haven't heard anyone say
anything about it, and it's a small enough dualbander to put in your
pocket.  One thing I did hear are some complaints about the stock antenna.
People have to going to other mfgrs or 3rd party antennas.
But that's another thread.
Good luck with your search.


--
Jerry H. Wang
California State University Northridge
School of Engineering and Computer Science
Email: [e-mail]
Web: http://www.csun.edu/~hbcsc274
AX.25: ke6uux @ wb6wfh.#soca.ca.usa.noam



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsrelay.netins.net!news.cic.net!news.itd.umich.edu!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Rob Kling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 23:24:21 GMT
Organization: University of Michigan
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58cub5$[e-mail]>
References: <57n4ld$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm095-16.dialip.mich.net
X-Newsreader: News Version 5.0 from Hummingbird Communications Ltd.

John,
   All the "I am my radio!" defensive responses tell you that people are not
being objective. You need to listen to the fact that most hams hunt for the be
st
radio before they buy one. Each one has their own tastes. The best thing
that can happen out of this Q&A is that you widdle your canidate list to a
minimum.  I own a Standard 528A, I receive good signal reports and I am able
to use it on packet. Do not be swayed by individual test results, I mean how g
ood
is good enough. There is a balance between Intermod, Sensitivity and Selectivi
ty that
can only be evaluated by using the radio. For instance I hate Intermod but not
 so much
that I will sacrifice Sensitivity. I hope this helps you make the best decisio
n for you.

Rob Kling


>If it is between the Standard and the Yaesu, go with the standard. Yaesu
>is cutting a lot of corners to get the size to a minimum.
>
>John / W8JX


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 16:31:44 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <58eqii$[e-mail]>
References: <57n4ld$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kd1gg.raddev.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Daniel Wee, 9V1ZV) wrote:

>Hi,

>       Can anyone offer their opinions to what might be the best
>2m/70cm handheld on the market? IMD handling is a special requirement
>here. I have in mind some of the Standard HT's, the C178, C558A, C568A
>and the YAESU FT-50R and the FT-51R. Is there something else I should
>also be considering? Thanks.

>73 de 9V1ZV Daniel

>*------------+-------------------------------------+
>| Daniel Wee | [e-mail]          |
>| 9V1ZV      | [e-mail]               |
>| QRP-L #667 | [e-mail] |
>+------------+-------------------------------------

My first non-Icom HT was the Yaesu FT530.  It had many innovative
features like the voltmeter (which despite some rumors) was quite
accurate and let you know the relative state of the battery.  Also,
backlit keypad (rare then), and the easiset programming interface I've
ever seen.

Recently I purchased a FT51.  Same comments, several innovative
features such as the spectascope which i like when looking for freqs
to listen to at the airport.  Also, the voltmeter is still there and
the programming intercase is virtually identical. (The programmers
equivalent of an API).  Anothe VERY innovative thing is the ADMS
programming software.  You connect the HT to the computer and you have
a Windows interface to program almost all features.  You can save
infinite "templates" or complete setups.  If you mess up your
settings, it is easy to restore.  I like keeping the memories sorted
by city or club name.  Easy to sort them any way you want with the
computer interface.  (the display has alphanumerics along with the
freq display.  Imagine adding a freq and alphanumeric to a Kenwood for
example, and then wanting to re-sort them alphabetically so you can
QSY quickly.

The FT51 DOES NOT receive 800mhz, so maybe the problems mentioned in
some of the above posts doesnt apply.  You can select 800 mhz on the
display, but no rx.

Bob

**************************************************************
***        Ham Radio Callsign AE1M, VK2GYN, 7J1AIS         ***
***                 Formerly KD1GG, KA1JFP                 ***
***            Licensee of Club Callsign KB1BRM            ***
***                    [e-mail]                    ***
*** Visit my WWW Page: http://www.ultranet.com/~bob        ***
**************************************************************




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Date: Sun,  8 Dec 1996 22:07:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <58eqii$[e-mail]> <57n4ld$[e-mail]>
Lines: 15


>I have in mind some of the Standard HTs...C558A...

The Standard C558a is an excellent performer. It was my first 2M/440 HT
selection, and I have never regretted it. I also own their C288a
220-only HTs.

Standard is also there when you need them - via telephone or fax. I
had some off-the-wall questions for them, and they were gracious with
their time spent making me happy.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!news.hscsyr.edu!newsadm
From: [e-mail] (Stan Swizdor)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The 2m/70cm HT? Which?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 12:36:27 GMT
Organization: SUNY Health Science Center @ Syracuse
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58h1f1$[e-mail]>
References: <57n4ld$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.155.1.163
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Daniel Wee, 9V1ZV) wrote:

>Hi,

>       Can anyone offer their opinions to what might be the best
>2m/70cm handheld on the market? IMD handling is a special requirement
>here. I have in mind some of the Standard HT's, the C178, C558A, C568A
>and the YAESU FT-50R and the FT-51R. Is there something else I should
>also be considering? Thanks.

>73 de 9V1ZV Daniel

>*------------+-------------------------------------+
>| Daniel Wee | [e-mail]          |
>| 9V1ZV      | [e-mail]               |
>| QRP-L #667 | [e-mail] |
>+------------+-------------------------------------+

don't forget the ICOM W32A HT. I own one and it's GREAT.
Great sensitivity, easy keyboard mods, etc. About 399.00 at Ham radio
outlet. It's the newest one, replaces the W31A HT.  73's  Stan KC2ADC



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.ro.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:54:44 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts4p12.ro.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Sat, 30 Nov 1996 07:52:05 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>get QSL cards that say "A.R.S. K1OIK", why would anyone write that?
>The post office has  N O   idea what A.R.S. means.
>
>I hear hams say "clear and listening." Why would anybody say that?
>Clear means you are leaving the air, listening means you are staying.
>Which is it?
>
>On repeaters I hear a station call another but when there is no reply,
>the calling station comes back and says "nothing heard." Does the caller
>think we are all deaf and feels a requirement to state the obvious?
>
>
>After I sent the above I did get this response ON PACKET:
>
>To: K1OIK
>Subject: Re:A.R.S.
>Path: KQ1K
>
>Shame on you Burt - you rambunctious little devil!! Did you not realize
>that
>ars means "always ready for sex!!"
>stay frosty and keep blowing on the coals!
>
>
>--
Hey Burt, did the guys in the white coats let you out of your rubber
room again? Go take your medicine and shut your hole.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Glenn Sparks)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 9 Dec 1996 16:11:52 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <58hdo8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58agr1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hou-tx8-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 09  8:11:52 AM PST 1996

In <58agr1$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jerry Gardner) writes:

>
>John G. Kammlade ([e-mail]) wrote:
>: >On repeaters I hear a station call another but when there is no
reply,
>: >the calling station comes back and says "nothing heard." Does the
caller
>: >think we are all deaf and feels a requirement to state the obvious?
>
>: In case someone had called, this indicates that they were not heard.
>: A change in position, power level, antenna or another try might be
>: needed.
>
>Well maybe the called party would get the idea that he wasn't being
heard
>when the caller doesn't respond to him. I still think "nothing heard"
is
>stating the obvious.
>
>There are lots of others:
>
>1. Saying "w1xyz for ID". Is there any time you use your call on the
air
>   when it doesn't count for "ID"?
>
>2. CW abbreviations on phone. My favorite are the guys who laugh on
phone
>   by saying "hi hi".
>
>

I agree on the cw abbreviations on the repeater, but it doesn't bother
me.

I am probably not on agreement with the Nothing heard, xxxxx clear.  I
read the rules as stating you must id at the end of your conversation
or every 10 minutes, I'm not sure calling for someone constitutes an id
at the end of your session if you call, don't hear, and turn off the
radio, is that following the rules, I'm not sure, so I error on the
redundant side.

BTW just because you don't hear them come back, does not mean I can't,
more than once I have called and talked to someone who was actually
running simplex on a repeater output or in reverse and didn't realize
it, I usually mention it to them because they have been doing some
testing and haven't set the radio back to normal offset.

We have one ham on the local repeater who when someone says xxxx for ID
replies xxxxx for ID any other purpose, either implied or stated is not
to be construed as a binding agreement, this id is for legal
requirements only and is not to be used otherwise.  It usually does the
trick.

Glenn Sparks  KI5GY



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:56 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jerry Gardner)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 6 Dec 1996 17:21:37 -0800
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58agr1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ccnet3

John G. Kammlade ([e-mail]) wrote:
: >On repeaters I hear a station call another but when there is no reply,
: >the calling station comes back and says "nothing heard." Does the caller
: >think we are all deaf and feels a requirement to state the obvious?

: In case someone had called, this indicates that they were not heard.
: A change in position, power level, antenna or another try might be
: needed.

Well maybe the called party would get the idea that he wasn't being heard
when the caller doesn't respond to him. I still think "nothing heard" is
stating the obvious.

There are lots of others:

1. Saying "w1xyz for ID". Is there any time you use your call on the air
   when it doesn't count for "ID"?

2. CW abbreviations on phone. My favorite are the guys who laugh on phone
   by saying "hi hi".




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:57 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 21:56:51 GMT
Lines: 13
Sender: [e-mail]

Casey ([e-mail]) wrote:

: >I hear hams say "clear and listening." Why would anybody say that?
: >Clear means you are leaving the air, listening means you are staying.
: >Which is it?

Actually, "clear" means that one has finished using that frequency for the
purpose of the prior conversation, and doesn't preclude staying around to
monitor the frequency.

The term "out" indicates that one is leaving the air.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:58 1996
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 19:35:16 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58agr1$[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

On the subject of bizarre ham habits:
I agree about the CW abbevs and "W2XYZ for ID", but saying "nothing
heard" is just another (maybe strange)way of saying "I give up. If
someone else is waiting to make a call, go for it"  I think that is a
courteous way to operate. Otherwise, others waiting to make a call don't
know for sure when the calling party is done and just have to wait for
some arbitrary period.

My personal habit is to say, after a couple of unsuccessful calls, "K9XK
clear", but there are a zillion ways to do it.

How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when you
really mean "I", and saying "73s" instead of "73". These are probably
the two most popular weird ham habits.

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:26:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 06:21:21 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 67.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Casey wrote:

> Hey Burt, did the guys in the white coats let you out of your rubber
> room again? Go take your medicine and shut your hole.

HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!mr.net!news.mr.net!dawn.mmm.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary Hosler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 18:51:08 GMT
Organization: 3M - St. Paul, MN  55144-1000 US
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58kbid$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Lowman) wrote:

>Casey ([e-mail]) wrote:

>: >I hear hams say "clear and listening." Why would anybody say that?
>: >Clear means you are leaving the air, listening means you are staying.
>: >Which is it?

>Actually, "clear" means that one has finished using that frequency for the
>purpose of the prior conversation, and doesn't preclude staying around to
>monitor the frequency.

>The term "out" indicates that one is leaving the air.

>73 de Jim - KF6CR

Thanks for the explaination Jim - "Over - Over" (any idea why ya have
to say "Over - Over" when one "Over" would suffice? <GRIN>

de KN0Z  Gary

Opinions expressed herein are my own and may not represent those of my employe
r.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:01 1996
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From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 13:59:46 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58agr1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Dave Burr <[e-mail]> wrote:

>On the subject of bizarre ham habits:
>I agree about the CW abbevs and "W2XYZ for ID", but saying "nothing
>heard" is just another (maybe strange)way of saying "I give up. If
>someone else is waiting to make a call, go for it"  I think that is a
>courteous way to operate. Otherwise, others waiting to make a call don't
>know for sure when the calling party is done and just have to wait for
>some arbitrary period.
>
>My personal habit is to say, after a couple of unsuccessful calls, "K9XK
>clear", but there are a zillion ways to do it.
>
>How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when you
>really mean "I", and saying "73s" instead of "73". These are probably
>the two most popular weird ham habits.
>
>Dave
>K9XK


My favorite is listening on the local Repeater Ass'n machine to two
neophites discussing the relative merits of different 2M rigs.

Neo --- "This is the Comwoodyea .4 running 2 watts ... give me a
report"
Phite - "Rodyer 10-4, you are six LED segments"
Neo --- "Thanks..."    silence
Neo --- "Now this is the Yeawoodcom 20000 with the 500 watt brick, How
does it sound?"
Phite - "Hmmm...I can't tell any difference.  That's strange, with all
that power you should be stronger than that!"
Neo --- "10-4, the Yawoodcom goes back to the dealer!"





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:02 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 10 Dec 1996 23:17:33 GMT
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58agr1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-205-228.in.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:
>Dave Burr <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>On the subject of bizarre ham habits:
>>I agree about the CW abbevs and "W2XYZ for ID", but saying "nothing
>>heard" is just another (maybe strange)way of saying "I give up. If
>>someone else is waiting to make a call, go for it"  I think that is a
>>courteous way to operate. Otherwise, others waiting to make a call don't
>>know for sure when the calling party is done and just have to wait for
>>some arbitrary period.
>>
>>My personal habit is to say, after a couple of unsuccessful calls, "K9XK
>>clear", but there are a zillion ways to do it.
>>
>>How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when you
>>really mean "I", and saying "73s" instead of "73". These are probably
>>the two most popular weird ham habits.
>>
>>Dave
>>K9XK
>
>
>My favorite is listening on the local Repeater Ass'n machine to two
>neophites discussing the relative merits of different 2M rigs.
>
>Neo --- "This is the Comwoodyea .4 running 2 watts ... give me a
>report"
>Phite - "Rodyer 10-4, you are six LED segments"
>Neo --- "Thanks..."    silence
>Neo --- "Now this is the Yeawoodcom 20000 with the 500 watt brick, How
>does it sound?"
>Phite - "Hmmm...I can't tell any difference.  That's strange, with all
>that power you should be stronger than that!"
>Neo --- "10-4, the Yawoodcom goes back to the dealer!"
>
>
>
   Why even say 73 OR 73's, why try to talk code?  'Good bye' would be
 more appropriate on phone. Sorry, the devil made me do it.

                                                       Jim


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:03 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 11 Dec 1996 03:03:09 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58l89d$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

>How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when you
>really mean "I",

Because then we'd be scolded by Burp for using too many I's. (Recall
Burp's IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII posting.) Besides, continually
saying "I..." begins to sound self-centered and arrogant (sort of like
J.Mackey, as in "I operate about five repeaters").

Jeff KH2PZ



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](-=Tony=-)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 11 Dec 1996 10:00:10 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <58m0na$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58agr1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfo-ca26-28.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 11  4:00:10 AM CST 1996

In <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (CDN) writes:
>>Dave Burr <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>>>On the subject of bizarre ham habits:
>>>I agree about the CW abbevs and "W2XYZ for ID", but saying "nothing
>>>heard" is just another (maybe strange)way of saying "I give up. If
>>>someone else is waiting to make a call, go for it"  I think that is
a
>>>courteous way to operate. Otherwise, others waiting to make a call
don't
>>>know for sure when the calling party is done and just have to wait
for
>>>some arbitrary period.
>>>
>>>My personal habit is to say, after a couple of unsuccessful calls,
"K9XK
>>>clear", but there are a zillion ways to do it.
>>>
>>>How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when
you
>>>really mean "I", and saying "73s" instead of "73". These are
probably
>>>the two most popular weird ham habits.
>>>
>>>Dave
>>>K9XK
>>
>>
>>My favorite is listening on the local Repeater Ass'n machine to two
>>neophites discussing the relative merits of different 2M rigs.
>>
>>Neo --- "This is the Comwoodyea .4 running 2 watts ... give me a
>>report"
>>Phite - "Rodyer 10-4, you are six LED segments"
>>Neo --- "Thanks..."    silence
>>Neo --- "Now this is the Yeawoodcom 20000 with the 500 watt brick,
How
>>does it sound?"
>>Phite - "Hmmm...I can't tell any difference.  That's strange, with
all
>>that power you should be stronger than that!"
>>Neo --- "10-4, the Yawoodcom goes back to the dealer!"
>>
>>
>>
>   Why even say 73 OR 73's, why try to talk code?  'Good bye' would be
> more appropriate on phone. Sorry, the devil made me do it.
>
>                                                       Jim

    VERY SIMPLE!  73 conveys "best wishes for you" in a lot let
jabber or code.  Eh?   BTW, 73s is a basterdized extension.  It is
already plural!

    W6ANV


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!cedar.liii.com!phydeaux
From: [e-mail] (riot nrrrd)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: THIS is why I got my ticket.
Date: 3 Dec 1996 06:09:34 GMT
Organization: Long Island Information, Inc.  516-INTERNET
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <580g6u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: oak.liii.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Despite the baby waking up.

Despite the sudden burst of QRM.

One CW QSO coming in loud and clear...

--
73 de Dave Weingart  KB2CWF                 "Can you find the Valium?
mailto:[e-mail]                     Can you bring it soon?
mailto:[e-mail]        Lost Johnny's out there
http://www.liii.com/~phydeaux                Baying at the Moon"
                                                   -- Hawkwind

BY SENDING UNSOLICTED, COMMERCIAL SPAM EMAIL TO THIS ADDRESS, YOU HEREBY
AGREE TO RECEIVE UP TO 20 MEGABYTES OF RANDOM CORE DUMP INFORMATION.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:06 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THIS is why I got my ticket.
Date: 5 Dec 1996 01:20:33 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <580g6u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Hi.  You gotta use headphones when the baby's asleep.  Waking up the XYL
is next!  Be careful.
73
Jonathan KC7FYS/7J1AWL


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news-feed.iguide.com!delphi.com!usenet
From: Stephan M. Anderman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: This Week in Amateur Radio #193 (for air through 12/13/96)
Date: Sat, 7 DEC 96 01:19:41 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1b.delphi.com

 _/_/_/_/_/     _/     _/     _/_/_/     _/_/_/         _/_/_/
    _/         _/     _/       _/      _/    _/        _/    _/
   _/ his     _/ _/  _/ eek   _/ n    _/_/_/_/ mateur _/_/_/_/ adio
  _/         _/_/ _/_/       _/      _/    _/        _/   _/
 _/         _/     _/     _/_/_/    _/    _/        _/     _/
-
Here is a summary of news items covered on edition #193 of
"This Week in Amateur Radio", North America's satellite-delivered
audio bulletin service, for the week ending 13-Dec:
-
1.   Amateurs in Vermont to Decide on Recall of ARRL Section Manager
2.   Re-entry of OSCAR-13 Not Confirmed by NORAD or Other Sources
3.   Phase 3-D Tests Progressing, IHU Installed and Operational
4.   ARRL Announces W1AW Schedule Changes after First of the Year
5.   Italian Amateur Starts Mir Fan Club, Offers Packet Info
6.   FCC Continues Pouring Through Gate 2 Vanity Applications
7.   "Gateway 160 Meter Net Report" with Vern Jackson, WA0RCR
8.   Special Event to Activate DC for Upcoming 10 Meter Contest
9.   "This Week" Seeking Special Feature Producers/Commentators
10.  Special Event Station Calendar
11.  TV and Computer Manufacturers Reach Digital Hi-Def TV Accord
12.  FCC Approves Third Party Agreement for American Ham on MIR
13.  Weekly Propagation Forecast
14.  "The RAIN Dial-up" from Chicago
15.  AMSAT and SETI League Announce Plans to Affiliate
16.  New ATV Altitude Record Set in Nevada Desert on 2417 MHz
-
Funding for the program's transmission and production expense was
provided this week by a grant from the AREC Repeater Group of West
Palm Beach, Florida, where "This Week in Amateur Radio" is heard on
the KF4ATQ repeater, on 146.67 MHz, serving West Palm Beach,
Ft. Lauderdale, Lake Worth, Lighthouse Point, and Delray Beach.
Presentation of "The RAIN Dial-up" was been made possible by a grant
from Dan Swee, N0FKM, of Columbia Heights, Minnesota.
-
"This Week in Amateur Radio" is a weekly amateur voice bulletin
service, produced by Community Video Associates, Inc., a New York
State not-for-profit corporation based in Albany, NY.  The program
is heard on the "W0KIE Satellite Network" each Saturday at 9:00 PM
(EST) on the Hughes Communications SBS-6 commercial communications
satellite, transponder 13B upper, located at 74 degrees west
longitude in equatorial geosynchronous orbit.  The transponder
center frequency is 12.019 GHz; tune up in frequency to 12.031 GHz.
Program audio is on the 6.2 MHz analog subcarrier and carried on
VHF/UHF repeaters throughout North America and on 160 meters at 1860
kHz.  Contact your local amateur radio club or repeater operator if
"This Week in Amateur Radio" is not being heard in your area.
-
Production and transmission expenses are underwritten by donations
from repeater operators, amateur radio clubs, and individuals.
Further information is available from George Bowen, N2LQS, at
518/283-3665 (email [e-mail]) or Stephan Anderman, WA3RKB,
at 518/664-6809 (email [e-mail]).  You may also reach
them @ WA2UMX.FN32AW.ENY.NY.USA.NA via amateur packet.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:09 1996
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From: [e-mail].([e-mail] ([e-mail] (joe)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Touch Lamp noise
Date: 1 Dec 96 21:37:47
Organization: DCANet - Delaware Common Access Network
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dol.net

Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 03:37:47 GMT
Reply-To: [e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Joe Buch)
Subject: Re: Touch Lamp noise
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent v0.55
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
References: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 36


[e-mail] wrote:



>My XYL bought a pair of touch lamps last week, and they generate an S8
>noise level, even when they are turned off.  They turn off and on when
>I transmit.

QST has run several articles on modifications to these lamps
to eliminate RFI and reduce susceptibility to RF.

My recommendation is to return the lamps to where you bought
them with an explanation as to why you cannot use them.
That is the only way retailers will get the message that
they should not sell this junk.


                                         _____________________
Real radios weigh 85 pounds             |  _               _  |
                                        | |_| @ @  @  @ @ |_| |
~*-.,_,.-*~'^'~*-.,_,.-*~'^'~*-.,_,.-*~ |      @ _____ @      |
Joe Buch N2JB                           |  @  @ |     |  @    |
Editor, NASWA Journal Technical Topics  |       |_____|       |
[e-mail]                     |    @  @ /-\ @   /-\ |
-*~'^'~*-.,_,.-*~'^'~*-.,_,.-*~'^'~*-.,_|        |   |   |   ||
                                        |     @   \__/ @  \__/|
Nostalgia isn't what it use to be.      |_____________________|









From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:09 1996
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From: "Paul E. Traufler" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: TRAKSAT 4.00
Date: 4 Dec 1996 20:03:52 GMT
Organization: TBE
Lines: 8
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NNTP-Posting-Host: 140.165.23.13
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

TRAKSAT 4.00 is in BETA test now. This version is a fully protected mode
with great new graphics and features. Take a look for your self!

Home Page
http://www.hsv.tis.net/~wintrak

Paul Traufler



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:10 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 14:40:06 -0800
From: G÷sta Bengtsson <[e-mail]>
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MIME-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Transistor
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Hallo everybody.

Does anyone know how I can get hold of a transistor to a Kenwood TS770E?
It is a 3SK76 but guess also a 3SK92 will do. Perhaps somebody knows of
a European substitute?
Would appreciate an E-mail if possible.
73 de SM6CYZ/Gus
http:\\www.sverige.net/usr/gosta.bengtsson/



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:11 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tucker Family strikes again!
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 15:50:24 -0800
Organization: myself
Lines: 6
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                <[e-mail]> <57e45b$[e-mail]>
                <57fna5$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Doug Faunt N6TQS [phone] wrote:
> I believe there was a recent change to make four the minimum number in
> a club.  Still not a problem.

Just a few weeks ago I got a club call & it only required 2
signatures.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:12 1996
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Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 11:21:12 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Tucker Family strikes again!
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: Disorganization
References: <57e45b$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5755f3$[e-mail]> <578qgm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Randolph Kielich) wrote:

> Check with the State of California and see if the clubs
> are registered with the Secretary of the State.

The FCC does not require registration with any state agency in
order to form a radio club, or to issue a callsign to a radio club.

73, de Hans, K0HB

---
-- Beware of the man who works hard to learn something,
-- learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before.
--
-- He is full of murderous resentment of people who
-- are ignorant without having come by their ignorance
-- the hard way.
---
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:13 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Date: 2 Dec 1996 05:11:25 GMT
Organization: InternetU, Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <57todt$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: netport-37.iu.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>A good first step in cleaning up the image of amateur radio operators would
>be for them to learn to spell A-M-A-T-E-U-R. The previous message makes us
>look like dolts.

just makes the poster look like a dolt....although there are a lot of folks th
at need
to learn to spell in the amateur service...(maybe that's what CW was good for?
)

Bill Newkirk WB9IVR                  The Space Coast Amateur Technical Group
Melbourne, FL                       duty now for the future of amateur radio
Lombardi's 1st Law of Business:
   Companies succeed in spite of their best effort.  If they succeed at all.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:14 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!165.254.2.53!nonexistent.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Mark S. Bond)
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (cathryn) wrote:

> or smoke mariajuana and blab on the ham radio.  I think the rudeness, the
> whining and rules lawyering are really part of a larger picture of the
> decline of civility in America more than a decline with ham radio itself.
> Welcome to the 90's -- it's not just ham radio that sucks nowadays.

I think you've found the answer....

> I wonder if the internet is sucking off a lot of the people who would
otherwise
> be involved with ham radio.

I doubt it will continue. I'd bet that the internet is in for more drastic
change than we've seen on radio. Commercialization can kill a good thing!

--
   .-.                                                         .-.
  /   \           .-.                           .-.           /   \
 /     \         /   \       .-.     .-.       /   \         /     \
/------Mark S. Bond  W2MB---/---\---/---\-----/[e-mail]-\
         \     /       \   /     `-'     \   /       \     /
          \   /         `-'               `-'         \   /
           `-'                                         `-'


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:16 1996
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From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Date: 4 Dec 1996 03:23:12 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <582qr0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-10.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, cathryn@junglevisio
n.junglevision.com (cathryn) writes:
>>>Are we witnessing the "twilight of amatuer radio" ? Is amatuer radio slowly

>>>dieing from its "bloated" buracrecy, poor operators, and choking on it's a
>>>own excesses ?
>
>I think we're in the dual slump of the end of Oscar 13, and poor sunspots.
>I don't see where the 'bloated ham radio' bureacracy is?  Why would that
>affect the hobby, anyway?

Because it's in "Oldington" and it's caused staganation and decay in the
level of technical ability/knowledge of the average ham over the past 40
years or so ... we've fallen far behind and the "leadership" is so
rooted in the past that they don't even realize it ...

>I wonder if the internet is sucking off a lot of the people who would otherwi
se
>be involved with ham radio.

Parts of what ham radio COULD be would really appeal to the internet wiz
kids ... like, "How'd you like to have a WIRELESS T-1 (1.544Mbps)
connection to the net??? ... We could and should be doing things like
that, but the average ham can't even see the benefits ...  also, when
you tell the computer wiz kid, "Oh, yea, by the way, before you can be a
"real" ham (rather than a "second-class citizen ham"), you have to learn
Morse code." and they'll say "Get real!"


>I think the issue for the future really, is
>what kind of fun thing can ham radio provide that you can't do, say, on
>the internet.  The kind of thing I'm thinking of is the Shuttle ham radio
>stuff, or the guys doing the ham radio GPS.  Maybe fast scan TV.

The issue for the future is: How do we grow our numbers and increase our
efficiency in the use of our spectrum  in order to survive in the face
of increasing demands for spectrum by an ever-increasing demand for
wireless communications by business, industry, local/state government,
and "Joe consumer"??? ...  if we don't do A LOT to gain political clout
and justify our existence, we will cease to exist in less than 20 years
(probably MUCH less) ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!nntp.farm.idt.net!news
From: Larry Deering <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 09:23:33 -0800
Organization: IDT
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]>
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To: Carl Stevenson <[e-mail]>

Carl Stevenson wrote:
>
><Back and forth text snipped out>
> Parts of what ham radio COULD be would really appeal to the internet wiz
> kids ... like, "How'd you like to have a WIRELESS T-1 (1.544Mbps)
> connection to the net??? ... We could and should be doing things like
> that, but the average ham can't even see the benefits ...  also, when
> you tell the computer wiz kid, "Oh, yea, by the way, before you can be a
> "real" ham (rather than a "second-class citizen ham"), you have to learn
> Morse code." and they'll say "Get real!"
>
> >I think the issue for the future really, is
> >what kind of fun thing can ham radio provide that you can't do, say, on
> >the internet.  The kind of thing I'm thinking of is the Shuttle ham radio
> >stuff, or the guys doing the ham radio GPS.  Maybe fast scan TV.

Carl,

        I'd love to have a wireless T-1 connection, and fast scan TV to boot!
The bandwidth required for these modes precludes use on the low bands. These
are projects for UHF and microwave frequencies that codeless hams already can
use. The computer wiz kid doesn't have to learn a dit of code to get a
licence! The bands in danger of being confiscated and sold are VHF and up.
This is the future of amatuer radio. Why load up the crowded HF bands with
more phone ops, and mindless computer driven QRM machines? There's lots of
headroom and bandwidth available above 10 meters, no code needed!

73 and Good Luck!
Larry


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:19 1996
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From: Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 13:20:49 -0600
Organization: AMD
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Carl Stevenson wrote:
>
> ...<SNIP>
>
> "real" ham (rather than a "second-class citizen ham"), you have to learn
> Morse code." and they'll say "Get real!"
>

If the wiz kid wants to play with wireless ethernet, etc. he doesn't
need to do the Morse test.

> ...<SNIP>
>
> and "Joe consumer"??? ...  if we don't do A LOT to gain political clout
> and justify our existence, we will cease to exist in less than 20 years
> (probably MUCH less) ...
>

I've an idea, let's open up all the Ham bands, just as CB is today.
Think of all the political clout we'll get with all those extra people
using the bands!

> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]

--
Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!qualcomm.com!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Date: 5 Dec 1996 02:25:15 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <585bqb$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-08.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

In <[e-mail]>, Larry Deering <[e-mail]> write
s:
>       I'd love to have a wireless T-1 connection, and fast scan TV to boot!
>The bandwidth required for these modes precludes use on the low bands. These
>are projects for UHF and microwave frequencies that codeless hams already can

>use.

Agreed ... the really high-speed LAN stuff will happen at UHF and up ...
but HF is needed to provide interties (albeit at a lower rate ... but
still quite usable rates ...) with appropriate rules changes to remove
archaic restrictions of bandwith and modulation and coding schemes.

>Computer wiz kid doesn't have to learn a dit of code to get a
>licence!

No, but people don't like to be treated like second-class citizens
either ... HF is attractive and necessary for many aspects of
communications ...  access to HF is also necessary for  the technically
inclined who could care less about Morse code, but will develop the
modes of the future ...


>The bands in danger of being confiscated and sold are VHF and up.

The HF bands will come under threat, too ... we use them rather
inefficiently ...

>This is the future of amatuer radio. Why load up the crowded HF bands with
>more phone ops, and mindless computer driven QRM machines?

The HF bands are NOT crowded by any standard ... the commercial bands
are far more heavily used than any ham band ...

>There's lots of
>headroom and bandwidth available above 10 meters, no code needed!

And no skywave propagation or international communications ... the privs
"earned" by passing high speed code tests have NOTHING to do with code
.. it's just a hazing ritual ..

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:21 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newspump.sol.net!news.mindspring.com!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 13:25:37 GMT
Lines: 21

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>I've an idea, let's open up all the Ham bands, just as CB is today.
>Think of all the political clout we'll get with all those extra people
>using the bands!

Not that I'd support such a course other than as a last resort, but you
must admit that if there is one chunk of spectrum safe from reallocation
it is 11m. Politicians may be stupid, but they can count. I would support
this idea as a last resort, because I'd rather have access to spectrum
where I can experiment, interference ridden though it might be, than no
access to spectrum at all. (In fact, the interference would add to the
challenge. It would serve as a great showcase for SS and other advanced
techniques.)

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer radio
Date: 7 Dec 1996 06:29:11 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>The issue for the future is: How do we grow our numbers and increase our
>efficiency in the use of our spectrum  in order to survive in the face
>of increasing demands for spectrum by an ever-increasing demand for
>wireless communications by business, industry, local/state government,
>and "Joe consumer"??? ...  if we don't do A LOT to gain political clout
>and justify our existence, we will cease to exist in less than 20 years
>(probably MUCH less) ...


You know, my thinking is that the technical competence of your Joe ham
radio operator doesn't really matter that much in terms of advancing the
hobby.  That's because technical advance comes primarily from a tiny elite
who has the skill, time and money to design, construct, advertise and
sell new equipment.  The technical competence of Joe Ham does come into
play when he has to figure out how to hook up all this stuff.  But, really,
I think the hardest part for the user of any 'cool new thing' that'll be
developed will be climbing up the tower to put up the antena.  Most hams,
I think, can follow well written instructions, I think.  And if they don't
have enough remaining brain cells to pull that off -- well I don't want to
talk to 'em anyway!

Maybe what is really the issue here is how to motivate the technically
advanced folk to work their magic.  In spite of complaining of the absense
of technical advance, my quick impression is that there are some folk
working on hard problems.  Like the Phase IIId.  And the TAPR guys always
seem coming up with some new gadget here or there.  I wonder how these
things work?  Are the TAPR products able to pay any money to people
working on them?  How does this work anyway?  I don't know about you guys,
but I think my limit to being able to slave over a project for no pay
ends somewhere in the 30 hrs a month range.  You know?

Maybe part of the issue is that a good hunk of the ham radio budget seems
to end up in Japanese transceivers with limited bandwidth.  It seems to me
that a radio with the ability to transmit at UHF at the legal bandwidth
limit could be the basis for all kinds of interesting projects.  The ARRL
does seem weirdly obssessed with squeezing the bandwidth of voice and
CW down for HF band -- though I think the chances of building a gadget that
cleans your sinuses in terms of new and amazingness is more likely to do
with higher bandwidth, now lower.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.micron.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!194.159.102.1!news.fido.net!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!g8eap.demon.co.uk!keith
From: [e-mail] (keith rothwell)
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: UK: Bury Rally - 20th April 1997
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 96 16:15:54 GMT
Organization: Bury Radio Society
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net uk.radio.amateur:23495 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120019

BURY RADIO SOCIETY - ANNUAL RALLY 1997

Bury Radio Society are holding their Annual Rally 1997 on Sunday, the 20th
April, 1997. Doors open at 11.00 am, or 10.30 am for the Disabled.

The Venue is the ever popular Castle Leisure Centre in Bolton Street, Bury,
Lancashire which is in the Town Centre, close to the Bus and Metro Link
(Tram) Interchange.

Visitors coming by Road will find the Route signposted from Junction 2 of
the M66 Motorway as well as from the A56 and A58. Talk In will be on Two
Metres (S22 - 145.550 MHZ). The Castle Leisure Centre has a Car Park
adjacent to the Centre, although priority on this Car Park will be given to
the Disabled and Traders, as well as ample Public Car Parking within a
couple of minutes walk of the Centre.

There will be the usual mix of Traders representing all aspects of the
Hobby (Amateur Radio, Electronics, and Computing) as well as a Bring and
Buy Sale.

The Centre has a Licenced Bar with a comfortable Lounge and a Cafeteria,
both on the First Floor with easy access by Stairs and Lift close to the
Ground Floor Exhibition Halls.

Why not bring all the Family? Whilst you visit the Exhibition, they can
enjoy the Sports Facilities of the Centre, including two Swimming Pools, or
ride on the East Lancashire Railway whose Bolton Street Station, which has
a Cafeteria and many interesting Displays, is next to the Centre and the
Services often operate under Steam at Weekends.

Past and New Traders are always welcome. Stand Prices are amongst the most
competitive in the Country. For further Information and a Booking Form,
please ring Lawrence Jones G4KLT, Exhibitions Manager for Bury Radio
Society, on 0161 762 9308 or write to him c/o the Mosses Centre, Cecil
Street, Bury, Lancashire BL9 0SB.

73 de Keith G8EAP and G0WQD

PS: Why not visit Bury Radio Society? They meet every Tuesday Evening at
the Mosses Centre, Cecil Street, Bury, Lancashire BL9 0SB, close to the
Town Centre, from 7.45 pm onwards and Visitors are always welcome. The Main
Meeting is on the Second Tuesday of each month with Informal Meetings on
intervening Tuesdays. (For information about Bury Radio Society please ring
Lawrence Jones G4KLT, Chairman, on 0161 762 9308 or to find out more about
the Mosses Centre and how to get there ring 0161 761 2079 during Office
Hours and on Weekday Evenings.)

--
Keith Rothwell
Bury, Lancashire, United Kingdom
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: [e-mail] (Chuck Bland)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: US Ham Call Zone Map
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 09:25:27 GMT
Organization: Entropy Reduction, Inc
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <58duou$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.238.244
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I am looking for an electronic copy of the Ham Call Zone Map for the
US. Anyone have such a thing?

Chuck Bland
n6dbt




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news.sgi.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: VANITY CALL CHECK?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 04:39:53 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pool022.max2.canoga-park.ca.us.dynip.earthlink.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230


 Gentlemen of Ham Newsgroup...

 Is there a way to check if any of your 610V selections made it?? I
have checked QRZ database..no luck.. Call Gettysburg..no luck..

 Do they inform you if no selections available? Return your $30.00
 Any info appreciated.. Rick.. AC6QQ

 [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.monmouth.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!dnaco.net!root
From: Phil Sussman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALL CHECK?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 05:33:56 -0500
Organization: The Dayton Network Access Company (DNACo)
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: @uhura-4.dnaco.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
>  Gentlemen of Ham Newsgroup...
>
>  Is there a way to check if any of your 610V selections made it?? I
> have checked QRZ database..no luck.. Call Gettysburg..no luck..
>
>  Do they inform you if no selections available? Return your $30.00
>  Any info appreciated.. Rick.. AC6QQ
>
>  [e-mail]

Very easy way to check:

Go to http://www.arrl.org/fcc/fccld.html

Type in your last name and all recent transactions for
will appear. Very fast, very efficient, and updated daily.

73 de Phil - N8PS


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALL CHECK?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 13:05:33 GMT
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58jn6t$ooc$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-205-154.in.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>
> Gentlemen of Ham Newsgroup...
>
> Is there a way to check if any of your 610V selections made it?? I
>have checked QRZ database..no luck.. Call Gettysburg..no luck..
>
> Do they inform you if no selections available? Return your $30.00
> Any info appreciated.. Rick.. AC6QQ
>
> [e-mail]
>

 Rick,
  The first step after the letter gets to Pittsburgh is that Mellon Bank takes
 the
 money, and cnacels your check. If you have your 'check number', the great
 ladies at the FCC 1-800-322-1117 option 2, option 4, can look up the app by
 that number. If they can't find it, I'd resubmit one via the 'online' method
and
 after you get the printout that shoots out, send a check within 48 hours. Tha
t's
 how I got mine. I'd also put a brick on that original check, if Mellon hasn't
 cashed
 it. They seem to have the same computing system as the Anesthesiologists have
.
 You know, the one that has their bill in your mail box before you wake up!

                                                        Good Luck
                                                          Jim


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!uunet!in1.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Vanity Calls "R" Us!
Date: 3 Dec 1996 04:11:37 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58099p$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57f7rd$[e-mail]> <57g9mf$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
> A minimum membership
>of two is required. The ARRL has put forward a RM to increase that to 4.

Yes, I recall seeing that. But with regard to Tucker, this just means
the same four family members' names can keep reappearing on any new
clubs he invents.

I'm afraid the old boy has a few screws loose. If I lived in LA I'd
send Drew a round trip ticket in order to have him fire a missile
at Tucker's Saddle Peak 147.435 rptr.

I shudder to think what folks with scanners, such as the news media,
think of amateur radio when they come across that rptr.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:29 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Vanity Calls "R" Us!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <57f7rd$[e-mail]> <57g9mf$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58099p$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 16:44:51 GMT
Lines: 22

In article <58099p$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:
>I'm afraid the old boy has a few screws loose. If I lived in LA I'd
>send Drew a round trip ticket in order to have him fire a missile
>at Tucker's Saddle Peak 147.435 rptr.
>
>I shudder to think what folks with scanners, such as the news media,
>think of amateur radio when they come across that rptr.

It's unlikely that they would. Since most public safety comms have
moved to trunked systems, regular scanners have disappeared from
newsrooms. In most cases, they have an arrangement with the departments
that they monitor and have a proper trunked receiver programmed to
follow the various group assignments for that department. Thus they
no longer have any use for scanners. We haven't bothered to have
scanners in our newsrooms for about 5 years now.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.138.116.24!dobie.loop.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Vanity Calls "R" Us!
Date: 4 Dec 1996 17:48:16 GMT
Organization: The Loop
Lines: 15
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <584dh0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57f7rd$[e-mail]> <57g9mf$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58099p$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pma2_185.loop.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:58099p$[e-mail]

Like everything in L.A. it will probably become a news 'highlight'
segment.

Though I don't use that repeater, Drew does try to put on a good,
organized net each week, with ham news, etc.

It's been said before, most of us glad it's there so the regular users
stay there & keep their operating methods there.

To each hios/her own.

KP
AA6KV




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Vanity Calls "R" Us!
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:29:16 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58fmgs$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58099p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:

>>I'm afraid the old boy has a few screws loose. If I lived in LA I'd
>>send Drew a round trip ticket in order to have him fire a missile
>>at Tucker's Saddle Peak 147.435 rptr.
>>
>>I shudder to think what folks with scanners, such as the news media,
>>think of amateur radio when they come across that rptr.

>It's unlikely that they would. Since most public safety comms have
>moved to trunked systems, regular scanners have disappeared from
>newsrooms. ...

Well, here in the nation's 11th largest city, all our services are still
living on VHF/Hi. And apparently some California agencies will remain
on that band for some time to come, such as the very large
California Department of Foresty and Fire Protection, who provides
fire services to a good number of rural Cal counties.

Jeff KH2PZ (former firefighter for the CDF)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.0.65.182!news-in.tiac.net!posterchild![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Jim Reisert)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: VE7TCP Internet DX Reflector is back on-line
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.dx
Date: 5 Dec 1996 04:55:37 GMT
Organization: The Internet Access Company, Inc.
Lines: 32
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <585kk9$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ad1c.tiac.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Newsreader: NeoLogic News for OS/2 [version: 4.5d]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1493 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119641

I'm not sure if I posted this or not, but...

The VE7TCP Internet DX Reflector (mailing list) is back on-line after a long
absence.  It came back up just before the CQWW CW contest.

If you are already subscribed, you probably have seen many messages come
through.

If you are NOT subscribed but want to be, send a message to:

        [e-mail]

and in the body of the message put only the word

        SUBSCRIBE

You will get a message back with instructions on how to "authorize" your
subscription.  Please follow the instructions, and make sure to send the
"auth" string back on a SINGLE line (some E-mail programs wrap long lines, you
must disable this feature on your program).

If you want information about the list, but don't want to subscribe just yet,
just send a message to the same address above but put the word

        INFO

in the body of the mail message.

--
Jim Reisert <[e-mail]>
http://www.tiac.net/users/ad1c/



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.he.net!night.primate.wisc.edu!sdd.hp.com!hp-pcd!hpcvsnz.cv.hp.com!news
From: Marty Gulseth <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Voice Synthesizer for Ten Tec Omni
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 13:08:35 -0800
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Spokane Division
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpspkwt.spk.hp.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)
To: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119438 rec.radio.swap:97794 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43495

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> I am looking for the Voice Synthesizer for a good Friend of mine (W4EQE)

Hi Jerry,

Did you try posting this on the TenTec reflector? Let me know if you are
not aware of
how to access this group.

Best 73,

Marty - W7LEJ

(std. disclaimers, etc.)


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:34 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Voice Synthesizer for Ten Tec Omni
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 00:53:00 GMT
Lines: 22
Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119623 rec.radio.swap:98063 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43600

In article <[e-mail]> Marty Gulseth <[e-mail]> writes:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>>
>> I am looking for the Voice Synthesizer for a good Friend of mine (W4EQE)
>
>Hi Jerry,
>
>Did you try posting this on the TenTec reflector? Let me know if you are
>not aware of
>how to access this group.

Just a thought: how about using the a PC-based control program (assuming
this is one of the Omni's which support it) and coupling that to a
voice-synthesizer program connected to the sound card?

I've got this feeling that there is a shareware solution out there
somewhere, too.

Anybody know of one?

Greg



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.he.net!night.primate.wisc.edu!aplcen.apl.jhu.edu!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!clay.se.highway1.com![e-mail]
From: "Paul Christensen" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W4DX Vanity call
Date: 2 Dec 1996 14:19:58 GMT
Organization: Continental Cablevision
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbe05b$e51ab880$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe046$90df33a0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.129.202.42
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

> What could be the reason for the change?
>
> Paul, W2CW

Yes.  I placed a posting on this several weeks ago.  Before the opening of
Gate 2, I noticed (by accident) that WB4QNP was reissued on October 11.  I
have heard from the local clubs here that several letters were sent to the
FCC's Gettysburg office and Legal Affairs.

Noting that he only held the call for several weeks, I guess we can each
come to our own conclusion!  ;-)

-Paul



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!usenet.logical.net!news
From: "Reynolds" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: W4DX Vanity call
Date: 2 Dec 1996 11:44:13 GMT
Organization:
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <01bbe046$90df33a0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup047.qnsbny1.capital.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Did anyone note that W4DX was assigned just prior to Sept 23
Gate 2 opening and has been assigned to another under Gate
2 on Nov 26.

What could be the reason for the change?

Paul, W2CW



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news-stock.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W4DX Vanity call
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 96 13:33:05 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe046$90df33a0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <01bbe046$90df33a0$[e-mail]>
           [e-mail] "Reynolds" writes:

> Did anyone note that W4DX was assigned just prior to Sept 23
> Gate 2 opening and has been assigned to another under Gate
> 2 on Nov 26.
>
> What could be the reason for the change?

Perhaps an FCC error that will leave the second recipient in tears
from losing both this call and perhaps also his chance for all the
other calls in his Gate 2 list?

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!phase2.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "Doug Robbins" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W4DX Vanity call
Date: 2 Dec 1996 17:12:09 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <01bbe074$0a181840$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe046$90df33a0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.1.107
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

     It seems clear that the Commission revoked the "earlier"
issuance of W4DX  (rumors of an "incorrect" 610V....)

     What is of real interest regarding W4DX is the actual time
of assignment by the FCC computer.  Is this issuance on 11-26
a result of clearing the Day 1 WIPS?  Or, has this call suddenly
become available with Day 2 or later applications?

     What EXACTLY was the process by which W4DX was assigned?

     The answers regarding the procedures followed in the assignment of
this single callsign would go far in helping to clarify this whole sorry
situation.

73 de W2DR




Reynolds <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<01bbe046$90df33a0$[e-mail]>...
> Did anyone note that W4DX was assigned just prior to Sept 23
> Gate 2 opening and has been assigned to another under Gate
> 2 on Nov 26.
>
> What could be the reason for the change?
>
> Paul, W2CW
>
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!news.socketis.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: W5YI at it again!
Date: 6 Dec 1996 13:50:57 GMT
Organization: SOCKET Internet Services INN Site
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <5898c1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: jc018.socketis.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.2.5

A friend of mine whose license is expiring soon just got a letter in the
mail from W5YI, that included a 610, a return envelope (to W5YI!) and
an offer to renew his license for him in exchange for $6!  There was an
uproar a few years ago when Fred was doing the same thing for $5, which
led to the FCC starting to send out renewal reminders.  Unfortunately the
FCC has recently quit doing that, so along comes good-ol' Fred ready to
scam his fellow amateurs again, charging them $6 for something they
could do themselves for free.

This sort of opportunism really aggravates me.  This seemed like the best
forum for letting a lot of people know about it quickly.

BTW, I have bunches of 610's and will be happy to send one to anyone
who needs it in return for an SASE.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* Alan Braun MD, NS0B/V31EV *Internet: [e-mail]       *
* Jefferson City, MO        *Packet: NS0B@N0LBA.#cemo.mo.usa.noam *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.fibr.net!news.txdirect.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary Harmon)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 14:23:39 GMT
Organization: Internet Direct, Incorporated
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <589bmi$[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dtm01-02.txdirect.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99.82

Opportunism?  Service to the ham community?  What if Fred only charged
$2 or $3?  Would that be acceptable?  Remember, Fred is in business to
make a profit, not just to make friends and influence people.
Perhaps Fred has determined that it costs him $6 to research, prepare
the notification, process the form back to FCC, etc.  It's kind of
like folks to overprice boat anchor radios only to hear the hollaring
about the crazy price.  If you don't want to pay the price, don't let
it bother you.  In reality, there are probably lots of folks who
appreciate Fred's offer to help.  They either are unaware or when
their license expires, don't know how to renew, or don't have the
time.  Opportunism?  Service to the ham community?  Probably a little
of both.

73,
gary/K5JWK

======================
[e-mail] wrote:

>A friend of mine whose license is expiring soon just got a letter in the
>mail from W5YI, that included a 610, a return envelope (to W5YI!) and
>an offer to renew his license for him in exchange for $6!  There was an
>uproar a few years ago when Fred was doing the same thing for $5, which
>led to the FCC starting to send out renewal reminders.  Unfortunately the
>FCC has recently quit doing that, so along comes good-ol' Fred ready to
>scam his fellow amateurs again, charging them $6 for something they
>could do themselves for free.

>This sort of opportunism really aggravates me.  This seemed like the best
>forum for letting a lot of people know about it quickly.

>BTW, I have bunches of 610's and will be happy to send one to anyone
>who needs it in return for an SASE.

>* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>* Alan Braun MD, NS0B/V31EV *Internet: [e-mail]       *
>* Jefferson City, MO        *Packet: NS0B@N0LBA.#cemo.mo.usa.noam *
>* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *


%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
%% TOO MANY PROJECTS, NOT ENOUGH TIME %%
%%                                    %%
%%    Gary H. Harmon, Jr., K5JWK      %%
%%        6302 Robin Forest           %%
%%    San Antonio, TX 78239-3218      %%
%%          [phone]            %%
%%       [e-mail]         %%
%%                                    %%
%% PACK UNTO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE %%
%%         THEM PACK UNTO YOU         %%
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!usenet
From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 12:20:58 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dtburr.pr.mcs.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

What a silly, non-thought-out, response! The W5YI thing is nothing more
than a solicitation to provide a service. There is nothing at all wrong
with it. They will price it at a point that the market will
bear(read:people are willing to pay), and given their costs. Worst case,
you get a reminder that your license is about to expire....for free.
Maybe you'll even avail yourself of the service. That's your decision,
regardless of the asking price.

I think that what the original poster was worried about is that some of
the more ignorant among us will not know how to renew their licenses any
other way and be "forced" to pay the $6.00. That kind of paternalistic
attitude is why business in the U.S. does not thrive and why nobody
wants to take personal responsibility these days.

If you are that worried about it, YOU send out the reminder to all the
hams whose licenses are expiring, along with a 610, and offer to process
it for them. See how long it takes for you to figure out that such a
"reminder" service takes resources.

Dave

K9XK


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:42 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 15:47:40 GMT
Lines: 52
Sender: [e-mail]

I don't see what's so awful.

If someone doesn't want to use the service, then they should not.

If someone doesn't recall the fee structure, or doesn't know the
procedure, or forgot that they needed to renew after years of
inactivity, then the service (reminder and mailng to the right
P.O. Box and zip in Gettysburg) might be worth 6 bucks.

In fact, it might take me 15 minutes to locate a 610, and come up
with the right address. 15 minutes of my time goes for a lot more than
6 bucks, these days.

And the preparation and mailing of a business letter on your
behalf (two if you count the reminder) is a bargain at $6.

Just because I prefer to walk from 57th and Lex to 49th and
Third doesn't mean I resent the cabbies who will drive me there
for a fee. In fact, I might pay them if it happens to be raining.

So W5YI tenders an offer of service (and even gives some in advance,
via the reminder the advert brings). It's up to you if you use it
or not.

If his activity *did* cause the FCC to mail reminders that's good
and bad. He did a service by causing it to happen, but did the
tax-paying public a dis-service by causing us to pay for the
extra mail to remind people about what they should have taken
care of anyway.

Hooray for W5YI for picking up where the FCC left off. I think that
if you *had* forgotten, and would have lapsed, you may just morally
owe him the $6.00.

Greg

In article <5898c1$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>A friend of mine whose license is expiring soon just got a letter in the
>mail from W5YI, that included a 610, a return envelope (to W5YI!) and
>an offer to renew his license for him in exchange for $6!  There was an
>uproar a few years ago when Fred was doing the same thing for $5, which
>led to the FCC starting to send out renewal reminders.  Unfortunately the
>FCC has recently quit doing that, so along comes good-ol' Fred ready to
>scam his fellow amateurs again, charging them $6 for something they
>could do themselves for free.
>
>This sort of opportunism really aggravates me.  This seemed like the best
>forum for letting a lot of people know about it quickly.
>
>BTW, I have bunches of 610's and will be happy to send one to anyone
>who needs it in return for an SASE.
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!usenet.logical.net!news
From: "Reynolds" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 6 Dec 1996 20:53:29 GMT
Lines: 68
Message-ID: <01bbe3b7$f807c640$[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup042.qnsbny1.capital.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Greg,

I agree with your response.  It is appropriate for W5YI to offer
this service.  There seems to be a large  a portion of the amateur
community that is not what one would call "thinkers".

Perhaps exposure to R.F. does something to the brain cells.
73

Paul, W2CW

Greg Bullough <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> I don't see what's so awful.
>
> If someone doesn't want to use the service, then they should not.
>
> If someone doesn't recall the fee structure, or doesn't know the
> procedure, or forgot that they needed to renew after years of
> inactivity, then the service (reminder and mailng to the right
> P.O. Box and zip in Gettysburg) might be worth 6 bucks.
>
> In fact, it might take me 15 minutes to locate a 610, and come up
> with the right address. 15 minutes of my time goes for a lot more than
> 6 bucks, these days.
>
> And the preparation and mailing of a business letter on your
> behalf (two if you count the reminder) is a bargain at $6.
>
> Just because I prefer to walk from 57th and Lex to 49th and
> Third doesn't mean I resent the cabbies who will drive me there
> for a fee. In fact, I might pay them if it happens to be raining.
>
> So W5YI tenders an offer of service (and even gives some in advance,
> via the reminder the advert brings). It's up to you if you use it
> or not.
>
> If his activity *did* cause the FCC to mail reminders that's good
> and bad. He did a service by causing it to happen, but did the
> tax-paying public a dis-service by causing us to pay for the
> extra mail to remind people about what they should have taken
> care of anyway.
>
> Hooray for W5YI for picking up where the FCC left off. I think that
> if you *had* forgotten, and would have lapsed, you may just morally
> owe him the $6.00.
>
> Greg
>
> In article <5898c1$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
> >A friend of mine whose license is expiring soon just got a letter in the
> >mail from W5YI, that included a 610, a return envelope (to W5YI!) and
> >an offer to renew his license for him in exchange for $6!  There was an
> >uproar a few years ago when Fred was doing the same thing for $5, which
> >led to the FCC starting to send out renewal reminders.  Unfortunately
the
> >FCC has recently quit doing that, so along comes good-ol' Fred ready to
> >scam his fellow amateurs again, charging them $6 for something they
> >could do themselves for free.
> >
> >This sort of opportunism really aggravates me.  This seemed like the
best
> >forum for letting a lot of people know about it quickly.
> >
> >BTW, I have bunches of 610's and will be happy to send one to anyone
> >who needs it in return for an SASE.
> >
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news2.acs.oakland.edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (prvalko)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 6 Dec 1996 19:48:21 GMT
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester, Michigan, U.S.A.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <589ta5$[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: saturn.acs.oakland.edu
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 unoff BETA release 960901]

[e-mail] wrote:
: FCC has recently quit doing that, so along comes good-ol' Fred ready to
: scam his fellow amateurs again, charging them $6 for something they
: could do themselves for free.
: This sort of opportunism really aggravates me.  This seemed like the best
: forum for letting a lot of people know about it quickly.

I can think of one ham that would have actually liked this!  His license
lapsed and he did not find out about it until it was too late, he
actually was "bootlegging" his own call!  The FCC made him start
completely over from Novice, and he lost his 2x1 callsign.

I think what was worse is some clown sent me a note after I'd changed my
callsign under the vanity system and wanted $14.95 to mail me an
official looking certificate he'd printed up in some certificate-making
program.  Big Fat Deal.

73! =paul= w8kc



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.233.85.167!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (David Moisan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 04:25:59 GMT
Organization: DM Productions
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm2-82.lynnma.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

[e-mail] (Greg Bullough) wrote:

>Hooray for W5YI for picking up where the FCC left off. I think that
>if you *had* forgotten, and would have lapsed, you may just morally
>owe him the $6.00.

Only $6?  I've heard of commercial firms doing the same "service" for
commercial licensees charging considerably more, like $45-$100 and up.
$6 seems to cover expenses.  (My license expires in 2002, but I'm not
sure there'll still be an ARS then.)

Dave

| David Moisan, N1KGH                        Email: [e-mail]  |
| WWW: http://www.shore.net/~dmoisan                [e-mail]    |
| Invisible Disabilities Page:                                         |
| http://www.shore.net/~dmoisan/invisible_disability.html              |




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: John <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 20:45:16 -0800
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]> <589bmi$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.52.94
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; U)

Gary Harmon wrote:
>
> Opportunism?  Service to the ham community?  What if Fred only charged
> $2 or $3?  Would that be acceptable?  Remember, Fred is in business to
> make a profit, not just to make friends and influence people.
> Perhaps Fred has determined that it costs him $6 to research, prepare
> the notification, process the form back to FCC, etc.  It's kind of
> like folks to overprice boat anchor radios only to hear the hollaring
> about the crazy price.  If you don't want to pay the price, don't let
> it bother you.  In reality, there are probably lots of folks who
> appreciate Fred's offer to help.  They either are unaware or when
> their license expires, don't know how to renew, or don't have the
> time.  Opportunism?  Service to the ham community?  Probably a little
> of both.
>
> 73,
> gary/K5JWK


Opportunism? Yes!!!!  Service to the Ham community?  get real!!

In todays' computer world it would cost pennies to automatically track
and produce mailings and applications. Postage (which would be at a bulk
rate for him) would mostly be his greatest expense...

John / W8JX

> ======================
> [e-mail] wrote:
>
> >A friend of mine whose license is expiring soon just got a letter in the
> >mail from W5YI, that included a 610, a return envelope (to W5YI!) and
> >an offer to renew his license for him in exchange for $6!  There was an
> >uproar a few years ago when Fred was doing the same thing for $5, which
> >led to the FCC starting to send out renewal reminders.  Unfortunately the
> >FCC has recently quit doing that, so along comes good-ol' Fred ready to
> >scam his fellow amateurs again, charging them $6 for something they
> >could do themselves for free.
>
> >This sort of opportunism really aggravates me.  This seemed like the best
> >forum for letting a lot of people know about it quickly.
>
> >BTW, I have bunches of 610's and will be happy to send one to anyone
> >who needs it in return for an SASE.
>
> >* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
> >* Alan Braun MD, NS0B/V31EV *Internet: [e-mail]       *
> >* Jefferson City, MO        *Packet: NS0B@N0LBA.#cemo.mo.usa.noam *
> >* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> %% TOO MANY PROJECTS, NOT ENOUGH TIME %%
> %%                                    %%
> %%    Gary H. Harmon, Jr., K5JWK      %%
> %%        6302 Robin Forest           %%
> %%    San Antonio, TX 78239-3218      %%
> %%          [phone]            %%
> %%       [e-mail]         %%
> %%                                    %%
> %% PACK UNTO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE %%
> %%         THEM PACK UNTO YOU         %%
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.80.63.252!delphi.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: Sat, 7 DEC 96 01:44:53 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]> <589ta5$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1e.delphi.com
X-To: prvalko <[e-mail]>

prvalko <[e-mail]> writes:

>I can think of one ham that would have actually liked this!  His license
>lapsed and he did not find out about it until it was too late, he
>actually was "bootlegging" his own call!  The FCC made him start

Let's see, he never thought to look at his license, even past the two-year
grace period........he deserves to have to start over again.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 7 Dec 1996 15:00:43 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

Who cares if he wants to this if you dont want to send the $6 dont its not
that Big of a Deal and no one is getting Scamed. I just wish I had though
of it first, maybe thats what your upset about.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 8 Dec 1996 01:12:48 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>, John <[e-mail]>
writes:

>Opportunism? Yes!!!!  Service to the Ham community?  get real!!
>
>In todays' computer world it would cost pennies to automatically track
>and produce mailings and applications. Postage (which would be at a bulk
>rate for him) would mostly be his greatest expense...
>
>John / W8JX
>
>

I'm not a a particularly big W5YI fan, I remember for example his attempt
to get K1MAN off the air by banning one way broadcasts entirely.  However,
I can also do some basic math.  Probably at best, one in 10 hams will send
in the requested fee, and get their license renewed that way.  Even at
bulk rates, he has to spend at least 15 cents per letter, and I suspect
it's more for him, so let's say it's 20 cents postage per letter.  Plus,
he has to somehow get a database that he can use commercially, so that's
another expense, let's say one cent per letter mailed out per year.  At
least $2 of that horrible fee is gone before he even begins.  If he
employs someone to check each application for renewal before sending it
in, the cost goes up even more, even if as a VEC, he can electronically
send in the information.  The rate of return might be high, but somehow, I
suspect it's not quite as high as most people think.  Incidentally,
there's nothing stopping anyone from taking the form, filling it out, and
mailing to Gettysburg, total cost, one first class postage stamp.
Incidentally, I suspect the figures will be more like one in 15 to 30, but
that lowers the rate of return even more, and makes what he's doing even
more of a service than I assumed with one in ten.  73,  -art clemons-
n8blk/3


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 7 Dec 1996 22:02:18 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58db3q$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Even at
>bulk rates, he has to spend at least 15 cents per letter, and I suspect
>it's more for him, so let's say it's 20 cents postage per letter.  Plus,
>he has to somehow get a database that he can use commercially, so that's
>another expense, let's say one cent per letter mailed out per year.  At
>least $2 of that horrible fee is gone before he even begins.

Do you use MCI math? How do you arrive at $2 from 21 cents?

First off, the database is free (just FTP it from the FCC). Second,
in bulk it probably does cost him 15 cents each piece of mail. Tack
on another 5 cents for the envelope and the letter in bulk, and you've
got 20 cents. The cost of production is neglible (computer spits them
out at night, underpaid secretary folds and stuffs and labels).

For sake of argument, let's say we're off by a factor of 100%. That
still means they cost him less than 50 cents to produce. That's a far
cry from $2.


Nothing Fred Maia has ever done has been for the "benefit of the
hobby". The same applies to the ARRL. As the old saying goes:
"follow the money". You can bet there is a profit in it, otherwise
Maia wouldn't be doing it.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 17:38:42 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <58emup$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58db3q$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:


>First off, the database is free (just FTP it from the FCC). Second,
But you still got to take the time to do it, and then you have to
cruch that database down to the information you need.  It does not
happen by itself.


>on another 5 cents for the envelope and the letter in bulk, and you've
>got 20 cents. The cost of production is neglible (computer spits them
>out at night, underpaid secretary folds and stuffs and labels).
No offense, but obviously you have never done it, nor paid someone to
do this.

On a normal day of billing, for our little business, our secretary
will end up working all day on getting our billing printed, stuffed,
SORTED (yep, one of the requirements for bulk rates is it must be
sorted by area code) run through the postage meter, and taken to the
post office.

And I can guarantee that Fred's mail is much larger than mine.


>For sake of argument, let's say we're off by a factor of 100%. That
>still means they cost him less than 50 cents to produce. That's a far
>cry from $2.

Ok, let's say $.50 to produce.  Now, out of 10 letters, how many do
you think will actually return it to him?

1 out of 10?   Fred get's $6.00 back, from a $5.00 dollar expenditure,
maybe?

And these figures are BEFORE LABOR is figured in!

And I think your cost estimates are low!




This would point out to the two conclusions...

1.  Fred is doing it, just to provide a service, and hopes to break
even.

2.  Fred is a bad businessman.  (It is obvious that this is not true)

>Nothing Fred Maia has ever done has been for the "benefit of the
>hobby". The same applies to the ARRL. As the old saying goes:
>"follow the money". You can bet there is a profit in it, otherwise
>Maia wouldn't be doing it.

And what in the devil is wrong with that?  I am not going to work all
day without making a profit!




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!chaos.crhc.uiuc.edu!news2.acs.oakland.edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (prvalko)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 8 Dec 1996 22:34:06 GMT
Organization: Oakland University, Rochester MI
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <58ffou$[e-mail]>
References: <5898c1$[e-mail]> <589ta5$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vela.acs.oakland.edu
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 unoff BETA release 960901]

[e-mail] wrote:
: prvalko <[e-mail]> writes:
:
: >I can think of one ham that would have actually liked this!  His license
: >lapsed and he did not find out about it until it was too late, he
: >actually was "bootlegging" his own call!  The FCC made him start
:
: Let's see, he never thought to look at his license, even past the two-year
: grace period........he deserves to have to start over again.

Perhaps.  His licence was issued as one of the very last with a five
year term.  He simply forgot that his ticket was not good for ten years
like all the new ones.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 8 Dec 1996 12:31:23 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <58eu1b$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58db3q$[e-mail]> <58emup$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <58emup$[e-mail]>, Blake Bowers <[e-mail]> wrote
:

>No offense, but obviously you have never done it, nor paid someone to
>do this.

Umm, actually, no offense, but I use pre-sort bulk mail labelling software
all the time. No work necessary. Feed it a .dbf file, out comes pre-sorted
labels with postal bar code on the nice laser forms.


>On a normal day of billing, for our little business, our secretary
>will end up working all day on getting our billing printed, stuffed,
>SORTED (yep, one of the requirements for bulk rates is it must be
>sorted by area code) run through the postage meter, and taken to the
>post office.

How many of these do you think Maia is doing a day?

A ham license is good for 10 years. There are 700,000 hams. How many
renewals are there, on average, each day?

Well, there are 365 days per year (not counting leaps). Over 10 years
that is 3650 days. That calculates to about 200 renewals mailed each
day.

At $5/hr for someone to stuff envelopes, they can easily do 2 a minute.
That's 120 per hour, or about 4 cents to the cost of each mailing.
Slap on the stickers, and away you go.

I believe my original estimate is more than accurate.


>And what in the devil is wrong with that?  I am not going to work all
>day without making a profit!

If Fred is doing it for a service, he shouldn't be making a "profit".

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!newshost.convex.com!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 9 Dec 1996 21:12:14 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58db3q$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <58db3q$[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) writes:

>
>Do you use MCI math? How do you arrive at $2 from 21 cents?
>
>First off, the database is free (just FTP it from the FCC). Second,
>in bulk it probably does cost him 15 cents each piece of mail. Tack
>on another 5 cents for the envelope and the letter in bulk, and you've
>got 20 cents. The cost of production is neglible (computer spits them
>out at night, underpaid secretary folds and stuffs and labels).
>
>For sake of argument, let's say we're off by a factor of 100%. That
>still means they cost him less than 50 cents to produce. That's a far
>cry from $2.
>
>
>Nothing Fred Maia has ever done has been for the "benefit of the
>hobby". The same applies to the ARRL. As the old saying goes:
>"follow the money". You can bet there is a profit in it, otherwise
>Maia wouldn't be doing it.
>
>

Quoting snippets and attacking based on the snippets does produce unfair
results,   note that I stated I suspected that he got less than one in ten
to respond at best.  To figure out his true costs, you have to include the
numbers of hams who won't or don't bother to respond.  In other words, ten
times 20 cents or so produces $2.00 as a true cost, and personally I
suspect that is operating costs are slightly more than $2 per ham who
sends in a response, but hey.  Note also, there is no legal or moral
obligation to send the 610 back to W5YI, one could just mail it to
Gettysburg, and have spent exactly 32 cents plus envelope cost.

If there is a profit, so what, I'm no Maia fan, but the FCC found it too
expensive to do for free.  Of course, I also wish that the FCC would go
back to its old system of updating the expiration date based on the last
action carried out, which made sense.  I have never had to renew an
expired license, because I moved regularly and sent in a change of address
form.  Oh well!  -art clemons-  nb8lk/3


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.74.114.90!news.genuity.net!news.lafn.org!usenet
From: Ken Yu <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: want ceramic ISM Bandpass Filter
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 16:57:57 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.168.18.46
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

I'm looking for a 902-928mhz ceramic band pass filter. Any info is
greatly appreciated. Thank You


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:27:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!super.zippo.com!zdc!zippo!drn
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WANTED: Videocipher II modules
Date: 9 Dec 1996 11:41:17 -0800
Organization: Zippo
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <58hq0t$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 148.216.1.169

I need Videocipher II decoder modules (Satellite TV), if You have one or
more, contact me:
email: [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:00 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 15:44:12 -0500
From: "T.J. Alessi - K1TJ" <[e-mail]>
Organization: Master of my Domain.
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Web help.
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.16.238.246
Lines: 15
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sgi.com!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news.paonline.com!news3.paonline.com!207.16.238.246

Hi,
        I need some people to try and access my web site.  I think
I am having routing problems.  If any of you can try my home page
and E-Mail me with whether or not you get it I would appreciate it.
I am trying to figure out is it is net wide or here and there.

Thanks in advance.
Tom - K1TJ

http://www.alessi.com
--
----------------------------------------------------------------
 T.J. Alessi - K1TJ, 147 Joffre Avenue, Stamford, CT 06905-2933
 mailto:[e-mail]  * http://www.alessi.com *  203.977.5200
----------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!usenet2.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!usenet1.news.uk.psi.net!uknet!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!pacsat.demon.co.uk!slewis
From: Simon Lewis <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Welcome To The European Microwave News
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 13:30:07 +0000
Organization: European Microwave News
Lines: 46
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <jrsZ5FAf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacsat.demon.co.uk
X-NNTP-Posting-Host: pacsat.demon.co.uk
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Newsreader: Turnpike Version 3.00 <aiRv2JsjYB9abcz0EsH4PwXgjR>

Interested in microwaves and hilltopping?

Need more info on equipment, operating and techniques for bands > 1 Ghz

The European Microwave News is a dedicated news source for all microwave
operators interested in any band/mode above 1 GHZ.

We publish a regular newsletter available by simple email subscription
or you can download a copy from our web site.

The newsletter is FREE to anyone and all that is asked for in return is
a small item for inclusion in the newsletter, outlining your operating
plans, reports of contacts made and any news items of interest to
others.

The web page is a mine of information and even includes on-line
catalogues from some of the top manufactures. Also included is
a wide range of links to other pages of microwave interest too.

Interested?

Then either:

Simply send an email to: [e-mail]
including the first word of the text as 'subscribe' and I will
do the rest!


or

The latest issue of the EMN is also available via the web at:

www.pacsat.demon.co.uk



Look forward to hearing from you


+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|          ***   THE EUROPEAN MICROWAVE NEWSLETTER   ***            |
|           Supporting Microwave Operators Across Europe            |
|                   Editor - Simon Lewis GM4PLM                     |
|     Email: [e-mail]     Packet: GM4PLM @ GB7SAN     |
| Web Homepage & Microwave Resource Center - www.pacsat.demon.co.uk |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.interserv.com!news
From: "RLove" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: What is MARS / CAP ?
Date: 4 Dec 1996 00:39:30 GMT
Organization: Preferred Company
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <01bbe17b$87effe60$46b6aec7@IWLD002416>
References: <[e-mail]> <57jl9d$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dd25-070.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<57jl9d$[e-mail]>...
> [e-mail] (Torkel Mathias Jodalen) wrote:
>
> >What exactly is MARS / CAP?
>
> >73 de Torkel, LA6VJA
> >[e-mail]
>
> MARS and CAP are the two primary justifications that U.S. hams use when
> modifiying radios to work outside the U.S. ham bands.
>
> 73, Jim KH2D
>

What Jim, KH2D, didn't tell you is what they ARE, Torkel..

MARS stands for Military Afiliated Radio Station... a service that provides
American Armed Forces personnel to send/receive messages to/from home..
there are allocations just outside the ham bands for these operations in
the HF and VHF spectrum...

CAP stands for Civil Air Patrol.. a civillian organization that mainly
concerns itself, to the best of my knowledge, with aircraft search and
rescue operations.. CAP has allocations immediate outside the 2 mtr band..

Hope that answers the question better.. Torkel

73 de WF5X
Randy
wf5x @ interserv.com



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.63.63.70!nwnews.wa.com!news
From: "Bob (Parker) Calkins" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: What is MARS / CAP ?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 18:22:37 -0800
Organization: ParkerMedia
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57jl9d$[e-mail]> <01bbe17b$87effe60$46b6aec7@IWLD002416>
NNTP-Posting-Host: blv-pm103-ip18.halcyon.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win95; U)

> What Jim, KH2D, didn't tell you is what they ARE, Torkel..
>
> MARS stands for Military Afiliated Radio Station... a service that provides

That's the problem with the Internet/Usenet. Anybody with $19.95 in
their pocket can be an expert for a month.

Try Military Affiliate Radio System. You are pretty close on the MARS
mission, however.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!EU.net!Norway.EU.net!nntp.uio.no!news.apfel.de!nntp.zit.th-darmstadt.de!fu-berlin.de!unlisys!cs.tu-berlin.de!uni-duisburg.de!sun3.hrz.uni-essen.de!news
From: "Dr. Detlef Bunk" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: What is MARS / CAP ?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 22:40:40 +0100
Organization: University of Essen
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57jl9d$[e-mail]> <01bbe17b$87effe60$46b6aec7@IWLD002416> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ascend2.extern.uni-essen.de
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

> That's the problem with the Internet/Usenet. Anybody with $19.95 in
> their pocket can be an expert for a month.
That is completely wright!

> Try Military Affiliate Radio System. You are pretty close on the MARS
> mission, however.

Look for *Corewar* in the web, there you find more about the redcode
MARS-System.

Regards
D. Bunk


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:05 1996
Message-ID: <32A2E4EE.4DCF@204.71.8.10>
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 08:17:18 -0600
From: Frank <fel034@204.71.8.10>
Reply-To: fel034@204.71.8.10
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
To: Larry or David Gibbs <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: When is the Orlando Hamcation?
References: <[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.18.68.56
Lines: 4
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!204.71.8.22!207.18.68.56

Larry or David Gibbs wrote:
 Orlando Hamfest is Feb 14-16, 1997
Frank



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: Larry or David Gibbs <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: When is the Orlando Hamcation? Feb. 14, 15, 16
Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 22:12:55 -0800
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-234-154.pa.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

Larry or David Gibbs wrote:
>
> I know it's sometime in February 1997, I believe during the first
> half of the month.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Larry, W3UIOAnswering my own question: It's Feb. 14, 15, and 16 at the
Central Florida Fairgrounds.

Larry


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!cc.iu.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Where are all the HAM's?
Date: 2 Dec 1996 05:18:36 GMT
Organization: InternetU, Inc.
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <57torc$[e-mail]>
References: <57ic19$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: netport-37.iu.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, steve <[e-mail]> writes:
>August Miller wrote:
>> Every month there are dozens of new technican no-code licenses granted by
>> the FCC, but 2 meters and 440 MHz continues to be nearly dead, with only
>> about 3 QSO's going on at any givin time. In my area (S.F BAY), there are

sp: given.

>> thousands of possible ham's to talk to, but where are they? I scanned

sp: hams (no apostrophe)

>> everything above 50 MHz, but I couldn't find any of them. No wonder we
>> might loose these 2 ham bands if there's not much useage.

sp: lose (loose means "let go"), usage (no e)

>
>august,listen on 5.19 5.11 7.27 6.73 6.91 5.35 7.06 etc and you will
>hear hundreds of kd ke kf 6 calls.

actually, i'd have to wonder if August has a working antenna...and he didn't s
ay
when he'd been looking..if he could look during prime drive times, i'd be surp
rised
if he still said he couldn't hear anything...

>73 steve 50.125/1296.1   control opp 440.775/441.025/51.80/1283.2
>                         repeater owner 1286.7


Bill Newkirk WB9IVR                  The Space Coast Amateur Technical Group
Melbourne, FL                       duty now for the future of amateur radio
Lombardi's 1st Law of Business:
   Companies succeed in spite of their best effort.  If they succeed at all.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:08 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Where are all the HAM's?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <57ic19$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 14:48:39 GMT
Lines: 41

In article <57ic19$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (August Miller
) writes:
>Every month there are dozens of new technican no-code licenses granted by
>the FCC, but 2 meters and 440 MHz continues to be nearly dead, with only
>about 3 QSO's going on at any givin time. In my area (S.F BAY), there are
>thousands of possible ham's to talk to, but where are they? I scanned
>everything above 50 MHz, but I couldn't find any of them. No wonder we
>might loose these 2 ham bands if there's not much useage.

Actually, every month we are gaining about 4,000 new Techs. That's
significantly more than "dozens", though it may break down to only
dozens per local area. In this area (Atlanta Metro), it is unusual
to find a repeater idle during drive time. Many have more than a dozen
stations per repeater participating in a roundtable or free for all
during these periods.

Now at other times of the day, activity is much lower. So it does
matter when you listen. And I might add that if everyone is listening
to their handheld scanner and isn't using the transmitter that happens
to be included with it, then all any of them is likely to hear is silence.
If you want to stir up activity, you've got to transmit to let people
know you are there.

At most any time of the day or night, I can stir someone out of the
woodwork by announcing my call on one of the more active repeaters,
usually the open 70cm machine with my call sign on it. Often 2 or 3
or more will answer. Everyone was listening, but no one would push the
PTT until I came along and started the ball rolling. Now much as I'd
like to think it is because I'm such a sparkling fellow, the truth
is that they would have talked to *anyone* brave enough to push the
PTT.

That's the trouble with these scanners masquerading as amateur radios,
too many people just use them to scan, and too few take the trouble to
transmit. *Somebody* has to transmit first, it might as well be *you*.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:10 1996
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From: [e-mail] (August Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Where are all the HAM's?
Date: 2 Dec 1996 21:32:57 GMT
Organization: Silicon Valley Public Access Link
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <57vhu9$[e-mail]>
References: <57ic19$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: svpal.svpal.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

: In article <57ic19$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (August Mill
er) writes:
: >Every month there are dozens of new technican no-code licenses granted by
: >the FCC, but 2 meters and 440 MHz continues to be nearly dead, with only
: >about 3 QSO's going on at any given time. In my area (S.F BAY), there are
: >thousands of possible hams to talk to, but where are they? I scanned
: >everything above 50 MHz, but I couldn't find any of them. No wonder we
: >might lose these 2 ham bands if there's not much useage.

OK, I corrected my SP mistakes.

: Now at other times of the day, activity is much lower. So it does
: matter when you listen. And I might add that if everyone is listening
: to their handheld scanner and isn't using the transmitter that happe

I usually listen/chat in the late evenings, so I'm must be missing out.

: to be included with it, then all any of them is likely to hear is silence.
: If you want to stir up activity, you've got to transmit to let people
: know you are there.

: At most any time of the day or night, I can stir someone out of the
: woodwork by announcing my call on one of the more active repeaters,

That's one reason! I tried several "dead sounding" repeaters, announcing
that I was monitoring, and people actually came back to me and we started
up a QSO. Another reason is there are a lot of people who do not care to
chat with the gereral HAM public, and use their rigs only when needed.



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:12 1996
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From: "David Lawson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Where should a new ham start?
Date: 5 Dec 1996 02:47:27 GMT
Organization: Digital Designs
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <01bbe256$4834b820$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port-26.ime.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



Mike <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
>       Hello. I am a new ham and am looking to buy my first radio. I
> was hoping that I could get some suggestions.
>
>       This message isn't going to be written gramatically well. I'm
> just spitting out all the questions I have in one big mouthful.
>
>       First, I'm wondering what kind of radio I should get. Should I
> get a mobile station so I can have more power than a handheld? (I'm
> interested in 2 meters). Or should I get a handheld so I can take it
> around? What kind of antenna should I set up? One that is inside the
> house is ideal, but I don't want to fry my head with all the energy.
> Thats also another reason I was thinking about NOT getting a handheld
> for my primary radio. Can I put an antenna in the attic? Will I get
> poor reception? What kind of antenna could I put up there? What kind
> of features should I look for on a radio? If I get a mobile station,
> how much should the power supply cost me?
>
>       Well, thats about it. I really appreciate any help you can
> offer.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Mike
> [e-mail]
>
1st answer: how much money do you have to spend?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:12 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Mike)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Where should a new ham start?
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 00:00:10 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: bin-ny1-23.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 04  6:01:04 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

        Hello. I am a new ham and am looking to buy my first radio. I
was hoping that I could get some suggestions.

        This message isn't going to be written gramatically well. I'm
just spitting out all the questions I have in one big mouthful.

        First, I'm wondering what kind of radio I should get. Should I
get a mobile station so I can have more power than a handheld? (I'm
interested in 2 meters). Or should I get a handheld so I can take it
around? What kind of antenna should I set up? One that is inside the
house is ideal, but I don't want to fry my head with all the energy.
Thats also another reason I was thinking about NOT getting a handheld
for my primary radio. Can I put an antenna in the attic? Will I get
poor reception? What kind of antenna could I put up there? What kind
of features should I look for on a radio? If I get a mobile station,
how much should the power supply cost me?

        Well, thats about it. I really appreciate any help you can
offer.

Thanks in advance,

Mike
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:13 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Which radio to buy?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 15:27:58 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
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As a newbie I am I am lost as to which radio to buy.  The only thing I
am sure of is that I will buy a handheld.  I am leaning towards a
tri-band because I do not know what's on what band, here in Chicago.

1.  Do I buy a tri-band radio or do I pick a band and live with it, or
end up with multiple radios?
2.  Is there some reason never to buy a multi-band radio?
3.  What is a CTCSS encode and decoder?
4.  What is sub-audable tone scan feature?
5.  What is DTMF paging?
6.  What is PL encoding?
7.  Do I buy Alinco, ICOM, YAESU, Standard, Kenwood?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:15 1996
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From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 20:36:36 -0700
Organization: Network Service
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> Apparently you didn't really study for your test but memorized the
> questions instead. If you did study you would know what ctcss was and
> sub-audable, DTMF, and PL.

Judge not lest ye be judged. Let he who has not sinned throw the first
stone.
Pick on new amateurs so they will think everyone in the hobby is an
asshole like you.

Just my opinion

Jim/KI0BB  By the way, I memorized the questions and have no idea the
difference
between a watt and a volt. The requirements say I have to pass the
test...Not
know the material.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:15 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: 6 Dec 1996 20:10:07 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58an6f$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119877 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43778

[e-mail] wrote:

>As a newbie I am I am lost as to which radio to buy.  The only thing I
>am sure of is that I will buy a handheld.  I am leaning towards a
>tri-band because I do not know what's on what band, here in Chicago.

>1.  Do I buy a tri-band radio or do I pick a band and live with it, or
>end up with multiple radios?
>2.  Is there some reason never to buy a multi-band radio?
>3.  What is a CTCSS encode and decoder?
>4.  What is sub-audable tone scan feature?
>5.  What is DTMF paging?
>6.  What is PL encoding?
>7.  Do I buy Alinco, ICOM, YAESU, Standard, Kenwood?

Apparently you didn't really study for your test but memorized the
questions instead. If you did study you would know what ctcss was and
sub-audable, DTMF, and PL.





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:17 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 07:38:44 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 43
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References: <[e-mail]> <58an6f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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On Fri, 06 Dec 1996 20:36:36 -0700, jim daneke <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>> Apparently you didn't really study for your test but memorized the
>> questions instead. If you did study you would know what ctcss was and
>> sub-audable, DTMF, and PL.
>
>Judge not lest ye be judged. Let he who has not sinned throw the first
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>stone.
^^^^^^^
>Pick on new amateurs so they will think everyone in the hobby is an
                                                                  ^^
>asshole like you.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Your logic is *ASTOUNDING* , You quote the bible *TWICE* in reference
to the previous poster making judgements , then *YOU* pass judgement
on him. Your ignorance gave me my belly laugh for the night ;)


>
>Just my opinion
>
>Jim/KI0BB  By the way, I memorized the questions and have no idea the
>difference
>between a watt and a volt. The requirements say I have to pass the
>test...Not
>know the material.

*YAWN* If you think your admission is *NEWS* you're more stupid than I
suspect. There's been untold thousands if not hundreds of thousands of
people that have turned an interest in amateur radio into a career as
a tech/engineer/etc. , if not just a satisfying hobby/service/pastime,
but it's *SHMUCKS* like you that appear to have no interest in
*LEARNING* anything other than how to turn it into a glorified CB band
that tends to *frost* people that enjoy/respect amateur radio.

"Any dumb bastard can know, the point is to *UNDERSTAND*" <- Unknown

Gary K8IQ




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Kirk James Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 00:07:47 -0800
Organization: Biological Sciences Department, Cal Poly SLO
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58b8kj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58an6f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: violin.aix.calpoly.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:119907 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:43797

I don't remember anything on the Tech or Novice exams which covered CTCSS
or DTMF signalling.  I doubt the other exams (General/Advanced/Extra)
cover them either.

I really hate it when people "welcome" new hams like this...

CTCSS (Continuous Tone Coded Squelch System) aka PL (Private Line) aka CG
(Channel Guard) aka TSQ (tone squelch) and aka a few others I can't
remembe, is a system in which subaudiable tones are sent/received by
radios to access repeaters, or to keep things quiet(er) when using
simplex coms.  Enough repeaters require CTCSS that you shouldn't consider
a radio without it.  Decode is a nice option that many hams don't bother
with, but if you've got repeaters in your area that pass (or regenerate)
PL, it makes listening more enjoyable (less noise, squelch tail
elimination, etc).

Sub-audible tone scan is a function of radios with a PL decoder that is
capable of scanning for the appropriate tone.

DTMF paging is just that, a paging system that employs DTMF (touch tone)
to open the squelch.

Multi-band vs. single band...  depends on your area and desires.  In my
area (Central Coast of California), there are almost as many open 440
machines as there are 2m machines.  I couldn't live without it.  In other
areas, you'd likely be better off with 2m/220, or maybe 2m/1.2GHz...

Welcome to the hobby!


--
 Kirk J. Smith, KD6RCT, EMT-P    |  Biological Sciences Dept, Microbiology
 [e-mail]    |  California Polytechnic State University
 http://www.calpoly.edu/~kjsmith |  San Luis Obispo, California, USA


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:19 1996
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From: Dennis Breeden <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 10:54:00 -0600
Organization: Reuter
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> As a newbie I am I am lost as to which radio to buy.  The only thing I
> am sure of is that I will buy a handheld.  I am leaning towards a
> tri-band because I do not know what's on what band, here in Chicago.
>
> 1.  Do I buy a tri-band radio or do I pick a band and live with it, or
> end up with multiple radios?
> 2.  Is there some reason never to buy a multi-band radio?
> 3.  What is a CTCSS encode and decoder?
> 4.  What is sub-audable tone scan feature?
> 5.  What is DTMF paging?
> 6.  What is PL encoding?
> 7.  Do I buy Alinco, ICOM, YAESU, Standard, Kenwood?

I don't care if you know the material or not.  I don't know transistor
theroy very well but I still could design a tube circuit in a pinch.
In time you will learn what you need as you need it.

I am new to Chicago and have found CTCSS encoder is mandatory.  Most
of the repeater are open but due to interferance are using "PL"
(Motorola term for this)(See the ARRL repeater guide as which PL are
being used on which repeater).  Most new radios this is standard
feature.  Some older radios are set up for it but you neew to buy of
build the encoder.  Communication Specialist make several.

As for which radio to buy, several things will determine this.  Budget,
ah yes, the almighty dollar.  Single band radios run new between $300
and $600 dollars.  Dual band between $450 and $850.  It use to be
cheaer to buy a dual band radio instead of two single band radios.
Space, cars are smaller, but they were never that big.  Multi-band
radios are more space efficient.  Features, I like the new Standard
tri-band because it is more afforeable and it has 6-meters.  The
Kenwood 642, 742, and 942 are moe flexable but slightly expensive
with options.  Brand?  Your guess is good as mine.  My station is
divided among three primary manufactures.  Kenwood, TenTec, and Ameco
(yes Ameco).

Pick a radio that has the features you want, a price you can afford
and then be flexable in case a good deal shows up on returned or
used equipment.  I recommend bands in the following order base on
popularity.  2M, 440MHz, 220MHz, 1296 or 6M.

Good luck and 73's  D. Pat Breeden  WB3KUM/9  Zion, Ill.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:20 1996
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From: "David B. Holtkamp (K5KH)" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: 7 Dec 1996 17:20:24 GMT
Organization: The Santa Fe Institute
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <01bbe460$ce539c80$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
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These are all good questions, but I'm afraid from the replies below you may
get more noise than signal here...The internet seems to encourage bad
behaviour, unfortunately.

My recommendation is to find the local ham radio club and go to a few
meetings and get acquainted with some local folks. You will make some new
friends and learn a lot! I know that I have over the years. I'm sure you
will meet many who will give you better advice than what you will likely
receive here.

73's

David (K5KH)


> 1.  Do I buy a tri-band radio or do I pick a band and live with it, or
> end up with multiple radios?
> 2.  Is there some reason never to buy a multi-band radio?
> 3.  What is a CTCSS encode and decoder?
> 4.  What is sub-audable tone scan feature?
> 5.  What is DTMF paging?
> 6.  What is PL encoding?
> 7.  Do I buy Alinco, ICOM, YAESU, Standard, Kenwood?
>


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Paul Zander)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Date: 10 Dec 1996 01:24:00 GMT
Organization: Hewlett Packard
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <58ie3g$[e-mail]>
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Welcome to a wonderful hobby.

I suggest you buy a 2 meter HT that has features YOU can understand.
Every brand of radio has its own concept of how a radio should work.
Only you can determine which one operates most like you think.  Then
get on the air.  Also as someone else said, look for local ham clubs.
Don't be surprized if you find that at one club many members are
enthusiastic about brand X; and at club two the members are equally
passionate about brand Y.

You will now get a lot of suggestions.  After a while, you may have
enough info to give you a valid reason to spend more $$ one more features.

Ham radios tend to hold their value very well.  So if you spend, say $300
on an HT, you should be able to get at least $200 back a year later.  [I
am sure the net readers will have a lot of varying ideas on the exact
percentage.]

BTW, don't over look Radio Shack for a radio as a possible first HT.
They don't have all the features of some others, but that makes them
easier to use.  Furthermore, virtually all the big brands design one radio
for hams, police, public service, etc, etc. then program them to tune
different frequency ranges.  This is great if you like to use the radio
as a scanner and pick up the weather forecasts.  However in a metropolitan
area, like Chicago, some HTs are prone to overload from transmitters not
in the ham band.  RS HTs are tuned for the ham band only, which might be
a good thing.

Disclaimer:  I don't own a Radio Shack HT, but 2 Kenwoods, a Yaesu, and a
Standard; all one band models.  Sometimes I wish I had made my most
recent purchase an ICOM because the buttons are easier to read, but
there are conveneinces in working closely with some locals you also
have the same model I have.

Remember this is a hobby so make learning about the models and features
fun.

73, Paul
[e-mail]

        _/           _/         _/_/     _/_/_/_/    _/_/_/_/_/
     _/  _/       _/  _/     _/         _/     _/           _/
   _/_/_/_/     _/_/_/_/    _/_/_/_/   _/_/_/_/          _/
  _/     _/    _/     _/    _/   _/   _/              _/
 _/     _/    _/     _/     _/_/     _/           _/_/_/_/_/



[e-mail] wrote:
: As a newbie I am I am lost as to which radio to buy.  The only thing I
: am sure of is that I will buy a handheld.  I am leaning towards a
: tri-band because I do not know what's on what band, here in Chicago.

: 1.  Do I buy a tri-band radio or do I pick a band and live with it, or
: end up with multiple radios?
: 2.  Is there some reason never to buy a multi-band radio?
: 3.  What is a CTCSS encode and decoder?
: 4.  What is sub-audable tone scan feature?
: 5.  What is DTMF paging?
: 6.  What is PL encoding?
: 7.  Do I buy Alinco, ICOM, YAESU, Standard, Kenwood?


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:22 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 16:12:14 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58ie3g$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Paul Zander) wrote:

<snip>
Sometimes I wish I had made my most
>recent purchase an ICOM because the buttons are easier to read, but
>there are conveneinces in working closely with some locals you also
>have the same model I have.
<snip>

That is exactly the type of info that is useful to beginners.  Usually
we buy something only to find out it has some annoying "feature" that
you can only find out by talking to others.

Thank you for taking the time to respond!

richard
[e-mail]
kb9nzt



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!sn.no!usenet
From: Tore Stabell Kuloe <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Which receiver is the best.....?
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 19:27:09 +0100
Organization: SN Internett
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: nesodden-8.ppp.sn.no
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Hi!
I`m a norwegian dedicated air-traffic shortwave listener who have a
simple Sangean ATS 818, and would like a new (second hand?) and better
receiver. So I thought why not ask a guru. If you can find time to reply
on these questions, I`d be  happy. If not, I understand...
 Now the questions:

If I buy a receiver e.g. Yaesu FRG-100, Drake R8(A) or Lowe HF 215/225,
will I notice any difference? The problem now is that, during daytime,
the noise is dominating any possible signal. That is the case most of
the year.
Do you know if there is a scanning device integrated in any model?
And is it poosible to buy a second hand from anywhere?

Thank you in advice!
--

Tore Stabell Kuloe  (Kul°)
[e-mail]
Bjoernemyr terrasse 20
N-1453 Bjoernemyr
NORGE - NORWAY


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WHINER R US ......HERES EVAN
Date: 10 Dec 1996 20:02:12 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <01bbe6d4$0e8568e0$867174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.134
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

EVAN CAN NOT SPELL EITHER,  LOOK AT HIS 'BUREAU' IN THIS LETTER.

NOTICE ALL THE OTHER ERRORS?


EVAN TRY WHITEHOUSE.GOV,  YOU WHINE LIKE THE YL WHO WON'T LET HER HUSBAND
BUY A RADIO.


ALSO A PAGER IS A RADIO DEVICE, UNLESS YOU DECIDED MOTOROLA NAMED IT WRONG.



JACK  MEHOFF  1996
begin 600 (fwd) MOTOROLA PAGERS.txt
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%=F%N#0HL
`
end



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WHINER R US.......HERES EVAN
Date: 10 Dec 1996 19:59:29 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <01bbe6d3$ad5a8820$867174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.134
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

EVAN PLATT TELLS ME I'M A MORON FOR NOT SPELLING CORRECT. WELL READ HIS
LETTER BELOW.

EVAN TRY WHITEHOUSE.GOV, AND BY THE WAY, I ALSO EMAILED YOUR WEB PROVIDER
AND THE CHEIF OF THIS NEWSGROUP.



begin 600 (fwd) MOTOROLA PAGERS.txt
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%=F%N#0HL
`
end



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!super.zippo.com!zdc-e!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!in1.nntp.cais.net!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: WHINER R US.......HERES EVAN
Date: 11 Dec 1996 02:55:49 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58l7rl$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe6d3$ad5a8820$867174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

<[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>EVAN TRY WHITEHOUSE.GOV, AND BY THE WAY, I ALSO EMAILED YOUR WEB PROVIDER
>AND THE CHEIF OF THIS NEWSGROUP.

Well just who is the "cheif" of this newsgroup? I bet you pissed him
off by misspelling his title! ("chief")

And why do you keep advertising on here? You haven't read the rec.radio
charter, have you! Go to rec.radio.swap and place a say, twice per
month notice on there pointing to your web page.  (But that would even
be a violation of the rec.radio charter since you'd be posting a
commercial ad.)

I'm surprised someone hasn't complained to [e-mail] and
[e-mail] for your continuing commercial ads on here,
repeatedly violating our charter. This is a recreational not a biz ng.

Anyway, good luck on your business (as long as the advertising is conducted
elsewhere).

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WHo in the hell is Samantha Fisher? WAS:Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 1996 09:07:26 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mercury27.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02Gold (Win95; I)

So who is/was she?




Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
> Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (david l. thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Who is PFF who want to abolish the FCC
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 18:48:43 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <589oug$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-41-202.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 6 Dec 1996 18:33:52 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Who is this PFF who want to abolish the FCC?  Any Why have the blocked
feedback at [e-mail]?  Do the fear feedback from hams that upset
their little apple cart (Another Little LEO with much wider impact on
amateur radio?

And who is [e-mail] who would support this effort?

Dave K4JRB



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in1.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Who is PFF who want to abolish the FCC
Date: Sat,  7 Dec 1996 01:14:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <589oug$[e-mail]>
Lines: 13


>>Who is this PFF who want to abolish the FCC?

A bunch of ultra-right-wing morons, apparently led by Ariana Huffington.
We in California are quite aware of the Huffingtons...and Mr.
Huffington's millions of dollars couldn't buy himself a Senate Seat out
here.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Who is PFF who want to abolish the FCC
Date: 7 Dec 1996 13:34:31 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58cdbn$[e-mail]>
References: <589oug$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Clint Bradford <[e-mail]> wrote:

>We in California are quite aware of the Huffingtons...and Mr.
>Huffington's millions of dollars couldn't buy himself a Senate Seat out
>here.

Nah, instead Diane Feinstein's millions bought her one.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.accessone.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Who is PFF who want to abolish the FCC
Date: 9 Dec 1996 01:01:15 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58focr$[e-mail]>
References: <589oug$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vbook.accessone.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <589oug$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>Who is this PFF who want to abolish the FCC?  Any Why have the blocked
>feedback at [e-mail]?  Do the fear feedback from hams that upset
>their little apple cart (Another Little LEO with much wider impact on
>amateur radio?
>
>And who is [e-mail] who would support this effort?
>
>Dave K4JRB
>

Folks, this an old proposal. It didn't just come up now. PFF put this out a
year or two ago. PFF is a "think tank" that does policy analysis from its poin
t
of view (which is generally "pro-business" under the guise of being
libertarian, which it isn't). There are lots of policy analysts and viewpoints

out in the world. Don't get stressed out on this one just yet. There's plenty
of other stuff to get stressed on right now without wasting emotional energy o
n
this. Wait and see if this bubbles back.

------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (david l. thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Who is PFF who want to abolish the FCC
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 02:56:37 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58fu96$[e-mail]>
References: <589oug$[e-mail]> <58focr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-168-121-41-202.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 9 Dec 1996 02:41:42 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82


>Folks, this an old proposal. It didn't just come up now. PFF put this out a
>year or two ago. PFF is a "think tank" that does policy analysis from its poi
nt
>of view (which is generally "pro-business" under the guise of being
>libertarian, which it isn't). There are lots of policy analysts and viewpoint
s
>out in the world. Don't get stressed out on this one just yet. There's plenty

>of other stuff to get stressed on right now without wasting emotional energy
on
>this. Wait and see if this bubbles back.

>------------------------
>Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
>email to [e-mail]

Got this same answer from Newt's Atlanta office and the ARRL
Regulatory desk.   Forget it the FCC is safe!

Dave K4JRB



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-e2a.gnn.com!pop.gnn.com!JOHNWHITE
From: [e-mail] (William White)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Who was the father of television
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 23:39:48
Organization: GNN
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <58as13$[e-mail]>
References: <56q62f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 16-184.client.gnn.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
X-GNN-NewsServer-Posting-Date: 7 Dec 1996 04:32:35 GMT
X-Mailer: GNNmessenger 1.3

        Don't forget about Farnsworth's Lantern Test (FALANT)
for testing color vision.  It's the one with the two dots
of light (red, green, or white).  Know it well because it is
the only test that will pick up my slight color vision problem.


John
KD4YRB



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.cntfl.com!usenet
From: Joe Foor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why hams di "it."
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 19:23:56 -0600
Organization: CMDS News machine
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.49.137.57
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; U)

Burt Fisher wrote:
> Hams cannot stand to be personal. Thus they do not want to know THE
> name, the log wants to know THE name. Thus it is impossible for a ham to
> say "I would like to know YOUR name." A ham says, "What is THE name for
> the log?"

Aha!  Just as I've always suspected... Most of us are socially
handicapped. If we weren't, we would be socialising face-to-face like
normal people :-)

regards,
Joe kf4dys




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 01 Dec 96 15:20:00
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Why haven't I joined the
Lines: 12


 >paying them.  Case in point:  I worked for Wayne Green some years ago
 >and his employees could not use Wayne's personal ham station -- since
 >their jobs had to do with ham radio, one branch of the government said
 >that they had to be paid for their time if they operated his rig; the
 >FCC rules said thay could not be paid.  It's horseshit, pardon my

Wayne Green represents himself...
---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (William L. Fuqua III)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Why haven't I joined the ARRL?
Date: 2 Dec 96 14:34:45 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

  Now that people have been asked the above question. Now ask "Why I joined th
e
ARRL".

73
Bill wa4lav

  William L. Fuqua III  P.E.  E-mail [e-mail]  Phone [phone]
5
  Department of Physics and Astronomy      CP-177 Chem. Phys. Bldg.
  University of Kentucky ,                 Lexington, Ky 40506-0055





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.webspan.net!news1.exit109.com!news.westnet.com!mhv.net!Randall
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why haven't I joined the ARRL?
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 96 21:49:39 GMT
Organization: MHVNet, the Mid Hudson Valley's Internet connection
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <57viv1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port120.mhv.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #0

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail].
EDU (William L. Fuqua III) wrote:
>  Now that people have been asked the above question. Now ask "Why I joined t
he
>ARRL".
>
>73
>Bill wa4lav


    What other organization is there to lobby for amateur radio operators? I
joined because they seem to be the only help we have and I happen to like QST.

Jeez, I hope I don't get flamed now....

Tom


   Tom Randall            Amateur Radio - KB2SMS
   [e-mail]       Mt. Beacon Amateur Radio Club / ARRL / 10-10
                          Member: AAVSO Solar Division

   Opinions herein are mine and may not be that of MHV.NET!


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:37 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why haven't I joined the ARRL?
Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 15:36:26 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <581h9r$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (William L. Fuqua III) wrote:

>  Now that people have been asked the above question. Now ask "Why I joined t
he
>ARRL".

>73
>Bill wa4lav

OK, Bill, why did you join the ARRL ?

I can tell why I joined.  Years ago, when I decided I wanted to be ham, I went
to a local radio club and signed up for a Novice class.  I was told that in
order to get a ham license, I had to be an ARRL member, so I gave $25 to the
club and they signed me up for ARRL membership.  How's that for a con job ?
Some time I'll tell you why I unjoined.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:39 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bob Levine)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why haven't I joined the ARRL?
Date: 3 Dec 1996 20:56:37 GMT
Organization: Mercury Computer System
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <582465$[e-mail]>
References: <581jo8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: fugu.mc.com

In article <581jo8$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (prvalko) w
rites:
-->William L. Fuqua III <[e-mail]> wrote:
-->:   Now that people have been asked the above question. Now ask "Why I join
ed the
-->: ARRL".
-->
-->
-->Yes.  And have the same type of stupid "loaded" answers as the only possibl
e
-->responses.
-->
-->Q:  Why I joined the ARRL...
-->
-->1)  GREAT organization, ham radio's only national voice.
-->2)  Excellent Value and outstanding membership benefits.
-->3)  Desired to do my part and become a VE, OO, ORS, ...etc...
-->4)  Best monthly journal.
5) Great insurance through Wohlers for ham gear (paid off twice for me)
6) Outgoing QSL Service
7) Sponsor the best contests (I like SS & ARRl RTTY best, Field Day)
8) Legal Services
9) Field Organization (although OO program is a joke, here anyway)
10) Helpful bulletins and code practice




--
/*********************************************************************
 *                Bob Levine                                         *
 *                AE1M/VK2GYN/7J1AIS  (formerly KA1JFP/KD1GG)        *
 *                KB1BRM: Anti-Algonquin Amateur Radio League        *
 *                Manager of Application Engineering                 *
 *                Mercury Computer Systems                           *
 * ------------------------------------------------------------------*
 * Job Opportunities at Mercury can be found on my Personal WWW Page *
 * ------------------------------------------------------------------*
 *          Personal Web Page http://www.ultranet.com/~bob/          *
 *********************************************************************/




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:40 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Why haven't I joined the ARRL?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <581h9r$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 17:07:22 GMT
Lines: 26
Sender: [e-mail]

Jim Kehler ([e-mail]) wrote:
: [e-mail] (William L. Fuqua III) wrote:

: I can tell why I joined.  Years ago, when I decided I wanted to be ham, I we
nt
: to a local radio club and signed up for a Novice class.  I was told that in
: order to get a ham license, I had to be an ARRL member, so I gave $25 to the
: club and they signed me up for ARRL membership.  How's that for a con job ?
: Some time I'll tell you why I unjoined.

Sounds like their motivation could have been preserving the "Special Service
Club" status quo.

In 1997, our local club will be recognized for 50 continuous years as an
ARRL Special Service Club.  In order to maintain that distinction, 51% of
the club members must also be ARRL members.  These days, it isn't that easy.
I know that our membership barely hovers above that level, because most of
the newer hams who join the club, don't join ARRL.

I can see where some clubs who want to retain this distiction might have to
redefine
what constitutes a "member."

73 de Jim - KF6CR





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:41 1996
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why haven't I joined the ARRL?
Date: 4 Dec 1996 03:28:58 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <582r5q$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <581h9r$[e-mail]>
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In article <581h9r$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>[e-mail] (William L. Fuqua III) wrote:
>
>>  Now that people have been asked the above question. Now ask "Why I joined
the
>>ARRL".
>
>>73
>>Bill wa4lav
>
>OK, Bill, why did you join the ARRL ?
>
>I can tell why I joined.  Years ago, when I decided I wanted to be ham, I wen
t
>to a local radio club and signed up for a Novice class.  I was told that in
>order to get a ham license, I had to be an ARRL member, so I gave $25 to the
>club and they signed me up for ARRL membership.  How's that for a con job ?
>Some time I'll tell you why I unjoined.
>
>73, Jim KH2D

I was a ham for about five years before I finally joined. The *only* reason I
joined was because a local bookstore that carried QST went out of business. Th
e
*only* way I could get QST with running all over town to find another bookstor
e
that carried it was to be an ARRL member.

Tom
N8ECW



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:42 1996
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From: Mike <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL?
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 14:24:09 -0800
Organization: FNS
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have polle
d their
members and what do you know, they found they all what to retain CW as a filte
r for
access of HF freqs....Could it be they only speak for those who are generals a
nd
above. Look at any issue of QST. Ever notice who most articles are written for
. The
fact is that the so called no code tech out number all other class license com
bined. I
guess amateur radios "red headed step children", us no coders, need to find a
new
outlet for recognition. One that when address the real voice of amateurs. Ther
e is
already a magazine dedicated to operations of VHF.
Hey CQ VHF magazine, are you up for the task as the voice for the majority of
amateur
operators.


            THE IS THE LATEST PROUD ARRL CRY OF VICTORY
        **************************************************
   "In a recent survey conducted by the American Radio Relay League,
amateurs have made their feelings known.  In over rousing fashion, amateurs
have said yes to the retention of morse code. Sixty two percent of ARRL
members polled said yes to keeping the code.  While thirty percent said no.
Of all amateurs polled, members and non-members alike, Fifty four percent
said yes to keeping the code, while thirty seven percent said no".

   "In this era of the popular no code tech license, amateurs say no to the
total no code licensing".


   "The bottom line.  In months passed some high ranking officials have
publicly hinted that the ARRL might not be opposed to expansion of
privileges for no code hams.  As a result of this survey, when the League
goes to WRC '99, it will have to stand its ground.  It will be forced to
say no to those administrations whose telecommunications leaders say that
its time to delete the Morse code as a testing requirement for getting ham
radio voice operating privileges on bands below 30 MHZ".
       ****************************************************

The ARRL can expect no renewal from me.
73 Mike K6YPB


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (CDN)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 00:54:00 GMT
Organization: Systems Solutions Inc. (Arizona's Internet Provider)
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585cdm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Mike <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have poll
ed their
>members and what do you know, they found they all what to retain CW as a filt
er for
>access of HF freqs....Could it be they only speak for those who are generals
and
>above. Look at any issue of QST. Ever notice who most articles are written fo
r.

Why shouldn't an organization cater to the median and higher technical
ranking members. Why shouldn't an organization support those members
that support it!  The League and I have had many disagreements in the
41+ years I have belonged but agree or disagree, the only way I have
an input is to belong and fight for my position.

>The
>fact is that the so called no code tech out number all other class license co
mbined.

Why do I doubt this statistic?



>   "In a recent survey conducted by the American Radio Relay League,
>amateurs have made their feelings known.  In over rousing fashion, amateurs
>have said yes to the retention of morse code. Sixty two percent of ARRL
>members polled said yes to keeping the code.  While thirty percent said no.
>Of all amateurs polled, members and non-members alike, Fifty four percent
>said yes to keeping the code, while thirty seven percent said no".
>
>   "In this era of the popular no code tech license, amateurs say no to the
>total no code licensing".
>
>
>   "The bottom line.  In months passed some high ranking officials have
>publicly hinted that the ARRL might not be opposed to expansion of
>privileges for no code hams.  As a result of this survey, when the League
>goes to WRC '99, it will have to stand its ground.  It will be forced to
>say no to those administrations whose telecommunications leaders say that
>its time to delete the Morse code as a testing requirement for getting ham
>radio voice operating privileges on bands below 30 MHZ".


Let's see.....you will only support an organization wherein the
membership agrees with your position.  If what you state above is
correct it would seem to me to be an easy task for you and your fellow
no-coders to take control of the ARRL.

Many no-code types upgrade and do so in order that they may utilize
the enhanced features that upgrading allows.

You refuse to admit that many hams use code regularly and while I
agree that code is not the ONLY way of testing a future ham's
abilities relating to radio knowledge, it is one way that is proven to
have worked successfully for 50+ years.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 07:10:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <58h6jq$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585cdm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (CDN) wrote:

>Mike <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have pol
led their
>>members and what do you know, they found they all what to retain CW as a fil
ter for
>>access of HF freqs....Could it be they only speak for those who are generals
 and
>>above. Look at any issue of QST. Ever notice who most articles are written f
or.

>Why shouldn't an organization cater to the median and higher technical
>ranking members. Why shouldn't an organization support those members
>that support it!  The League and I have had many disagreements in the
>41+ years I have belonged but agree or disagree, the only way I have
>an input is to belong and fight for my position.

>>The
>>fact is that the so called no code tech out number all other class license c
ombined.

>Why do I doubt this statistic?


>
>>   "In a recent survey conducted by the American Radio Relay League,
>>amateurs have made their feelings known.  In over rousing fashion, amateurs
>>have said yes to the retention of morse code. Sixty two percent of ARRL
>>members polled said yes to keeping the code.  While thirty percent said no.
>>Of all amateurs polled, members and non-members alike, Fifty four percent
>>said yes to keeping the code, while thirty seven percent said no".
>>
>>   "In this era of the popular no code tech license, amateurs say no to the
>>total no code licensing".
>>
>>
>>   "The bottom line.  In months passed some high ranking officials have
>>publicly hinted that the ARRL might not be opposed to expansion of
>>privileges for no code hams.  As a result of this survey, when the League
>>goes to WRC '99, it will have to stand its ground.  It will be forced to
>>say no to those administrations whose telecommunications leaders say that
>>its time to delete the Morse code as a testing requirement for getting ham
>>radio voice operating privileges on bands below 30 MHZ".


>Let's see.....you will only support an organization wherein the
>membership agrees with your position.  If what you state above is
>correct it would seem to me to be an easy task for you and your fellow
>no-coders to take control of the ARRL.

>Many no-code types upgrade and do so in order that they may utilize
>the enhanced features that upgrading allows.

>You refuse to admit that many hams use code regularly and while I
>agree that code is not the ONLY way of testing a future ham's
>abilities relating to radio knowledge, it is one way that is proven to
>have worked successfully for 50+ years.


I agree with you totally. I myself don't like code but I think it
should be kept. I passed my 5 wpm after taking the test twice and I am
studing for 13 now. I don't use code on the air as I don't like it but
will learn it because it is in the rules. CW is a great filter for all
those that think ham radio is nothing but a family service.

73




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 09:37:41 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <58h87l$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44016 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120160

In article <[e-mail]>, CDN <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>The
>>fact is that the so called no code tech out number all other class license
>>combined.
>
>Why do I doubt this statistic?

Because the person who uttered it is obviously totally clueless?


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:47 1996
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From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL?
Date: 10 Dec 1996 18:41:44 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58kat8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <585cdm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44034 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120210

In article <[e-mail]>, Mike  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Hear is another example of why NOT to join the ARRL. They seemed to have poll
ed their
>members and what do you know, they found they all what to retain CW as a filt
er for
>access of HF freqs....

Actually, the poll asked questions with respect to the upcoming WRC-99.
Question 1. related directly to Morse code as it pertains to international
regulations.  It gave the respondent two options: one to agree with the
assertion that code is no longer relevant, or soon won't be, in
international regulations.  Or two, to agree that it is important for the
forseeable future to retain code testing in the international regulations.
Question 2 would actually be more enlightening about the details of the
respondents sentiments.

The posting you included was not written by the ARRL, but instead by
Bill Pasternak and his crew at Newsline.  The text has the watermark of
Mr. Pasternak's personal vendetta against no-code techs.  The ARRL has
to my knowlege not yet posted the results of their survey.  The ARRL has
merely performed the necessary service of a poll in this case.  That the
respondents appear to favor retaining code by some margin in the
international regulations is not the fault of the messenger delivering this
finding.

I find it amusing that some of the same folks who previously called
the survey a complete sham are now bragging about it's results.

73

Jim AC6XG

ps I hope you don't take too bad a beating about the techs being the most
numerous class of license thing.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:48 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 15:16:10 GMT
Lines: 16
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> cathryn@jung
levision.junglevision.com (cathryn) writes:
>Btw, does ARRL offer lifetime memberships?  I got a lifetime membership
>for someother thing I joined, and I figure I'm saving money now that I
>paid it off.

Yes, they do. For some wierd reason they don't say how much in the
front pages of QST. I checked a couple of years ago, and it wasn't
cheap. You can e-mail the ARRL for today's answer.

I decided against it, as I kind of think the option of terminating
my membership as a last resort has some value.

Greg





From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:49 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 2 Dec 1996 14:28:02 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <57vak2$[e-mail]>
References: <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>
        [e-mail] (cathryn) writes:

>Btw, does ARRL offer lifetime memberships?  I got a lifetime membership
>for someother thing I joined, and I figure I'm saving money now that I
>paid it off.

The last I knew the lifetime membership for the ARRL is set at 25x the
annual dues. Thus, when the dues increase, the lifetime membership fee
increases as well.

The League has convenient payment plans as well for lifetime memberships.
They have one-time, semi-annual, and quarterly payment plans from what
I understand.


MD
ARRL Life Member
Paid-In-Full
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:51 1996
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From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 3 Dec 1996 02:01:55 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <5801mj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writes:
>Bill Sohl ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: I find this rather amusing.  Why, 1/3 of those that responded
>: feel that the $30 a year is too expensive.  I can only assume
>: that these same individuals are not members of any other
>: organizations, either nationally or locally, as I find that the
>: annual dues is extremely reasonable in today's value
>: of money.
>
>Right.  Check out the dues of any professional society; check the dues of
>fraternal organizations such as the Elks, Moose, VFW, etc.  Plus, we get
>one of the better ham publications on the market, as well as other services
>provided by ARRL.

The quality of QST is questionable (at best)to many. due to the fact
that, as the "mouthpiece" for what's *supposed to be* a largely
technical activity, it's a technical wasteland for the most part ...

I suspect that most of the people who said "the dues are too high"
didn't mean that they couldn't afford 30-odd dollars per year, but
rather that the "value" received was not WORTH the sum asked ...


Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:52 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!news.missouri.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
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References: <[e-mail]> <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]>
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Carl Stevenson ([e-mail]) wrote:

: The quality of QST is questionable (at best)to many. due to the fact
: that, as the "mouthpiece" for what's *supposed to be* a largely
: technical activity, it's a technical wasteland for the most part ...

As someone else already pointed out, we have to pay an additional fee to get
QEX, in order to get the technical articles that used to be in QST.  For
those of us who enjoy contesting, yet another fee for NCJ, plus $5 for a
contest handbook with the full rules for each contest.

: I suspect that most of the people who said "the dues are too high"
: didn't mean that they couldn't afford 30-odd dollars per year, but
: rather that the "value" received was not WORTH the sum asked ...

Good point.

Maybe the question that tells all might be worded:

"Do you consider yourself:

a)  a member of ARRL

b)  a subscriber to a magazine about amateur radio

c)  both

73 de Jim - KF6CR









From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 4 Dec 1996 17:59:53 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <584vp9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:43849 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119656

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Greg Bullough <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I think that the ARRL *could* if it wanted to, allow one to join the
>League without receiving QST.

If they did this, they would lose 90% of their membership, who are
members for the subscription only.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:54 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 20:32:49 GMT
Lines: 33
Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:43858 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119674

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writ
es:
>Carl Stevenson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: didn't mean that they couldn't afford 30-odd dollars per year, but
>: rather that the "value" received was not WORTH the sum asked ...
>
>Good point.

I think that the ARRL *could* if it wanted to, allow one to join the
League without receiving QST. If the argument is to be 'but we need
to have an official organ' (some said that a certain President was
the biggest 'organ' the League ever had, but I digress), then I
reply 'put the things you really want me to know on your Web
page. I choose to read them there!'

If they really want to make it 30 bucks, then give me a choice of
QST, QEX and a repeater directory, or NCD and a repeater directory,
or whatever.

Or maybe offer me the CD-ROM of all of the above at the end of the
year, and mean-while, I'll read the DC news and the League Lines
on the Web.

I note that they charge the same for a library to subscribe to QST
as they do for a membership with QST. Now, that isn't fair, as a
library doesn't get membership benefits.

The current situation, with the ARRL doing all its official business
in QST (which they charge for) and then charging more for most of the
interesting stuff is sort of a no-win.

Greg



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 5 Dec 1996 02:32:34 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <585c82$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57qfqr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:43864 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119684

In <57qfqr$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>wb6siv <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>Less than 1/3 of all ham radio operators are members of the ARRL. ...
>                                ^^^^^^^^^
>We know how many licensed hams there are in the US, but please tell
>us how many of those licensees are operators. I know of too many who
>are licensed but do not operate at all, so your claim is invalid.
>
>Let's suppose that half of those licensed are actual operators. Now
>you can say that 2/3 of all current operators are ARRL members.

No, you can't say that with such blatant "certainty"...  unless you
assume (unduely gratuitously) that 100% of all ARRL "members" are active
..

Maybe the of the 1/3 that are ARRL "members" 2/3 have become inactive
(or died) ...  then the percentage of active hams who are ARRL "members"
would be even less than 1/3 of those licensed ...

>In the future do show more care in how you write your poll questions.
>
>Jeff KH2PZ
>

In the future, do show more care in how you try to distort things to
seem the way you'd like them to seem ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:57 1996
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From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 5 Dec 1996 02:35:34 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <585cdm$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:43869 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119696

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writes:
>
>Good point.
>
>Maybe the question that tells all might be worded:
>
>"Do you consider yourself:
>
>a)  a member of ARRL
>
>b)  a subscriber to a magazine about amateur radio
>
>c)  both
>
>73 de Jim - KF6CR

My point ... I maintain (from having talked to LOTs of ARRL "members")
that the answer in a VERY large percentage of cases is "b" ... most
people I know who are "members" ... myself included ... are really
"subscribers to QST" because we DO NOT feel that the ARRL "represents"
us.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:28:58 1996
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From: [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 5 Dec 1996 02:39:58 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <585clu$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl Stevenson)
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:43871 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119704

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Greg Bullough) writes:
>
>I note that they charge the same for a library to subscribe to QST
>as they do for a membership with QST. Now, that isn't fair, as a
>library doesn't get membership benefits.

WHAT "membership benefits"???? ... many of us "QST subscribers" (as
opposed to feeing like "members") feel that there *are* no
benefits for us ...  and we resent the way our dues money is used to
promote policies that are in direct conflict with our views ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Mark Little)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: re: why havn't you joined the arrl? results as of 11/24
Date: 06 Dec 96 07:56:41
Organization: Microtronics Information Systems
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfqr$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp28a.mtx.net.au
X-Newsreader: mNews 1.0 (release 20.08.96)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:43883 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119737


>
>
> wb6siv <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >Less than 1/3 of all ham radio operators are members of the ARRL. ...
>                                 ^^^^^^^^^
> We know how many licensed hams there are in the US, but please tell
> us how many of those licensees are operators. I know of too many who
> are licensed but do not operate at all, so your claim is invalid.
>
> Let's suppose that half of those licensed are actual operators. Now
> you can say that 2/3 of all current operators are ARRL members.
>
> In the future do show more care in how you write your poll questions.
>
> Jeff KH2PZ
>
> .

Jeff seems to have forgotten that there will also be members of the ARRL
who are not operators.

While it may seem silly that people would remain in the ARRL while they
are not active, there is some basis for this point of view. In Australia
where there is a yearly fee for an Amateur Licence, a recent jump in the
licence fee from $A34 to $A50 caused a significant drop in the number of
amateurs. The general view is that the decrease in numbers was caused by
inactive amateurs dropping their licence - about 9% BTW.

I imagine membership to the ARRL may have the same nostalgic value.


Regards,
Mark.




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 17:42:38 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <589m2q$[e-mail]>
References: <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vak2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rst-engr.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (cathryn) shared these priceless
pearls of wisdom:

->>The last I knew the lifetime membership for the ARRL

The question one must ask is...yours?  or theirs?


Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:01 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: why havn't you joined the arrl? results as of 11/24
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 00:14:44 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58acpc$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfqr$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Mark Little) wrote:

>Jeff seems to have forgotten that there will also be members of the ARRL
>who are not operators.

And everybody seems to constantly forget there are ARRL members who
are not U.S. hams, but hams in other countries who have joined to particapate
in the DXCC program.

It would be nice to see the ARRL publish some membership facts.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:03 1996
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From: Tom Hogevoll <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 22:27:57 -0500
Organization: COMPUHEALTH Systems
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585cdm$[e-mail]>
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Carl Stevenson wrote:
>
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writes:
> >
> >Good point.
> >
> >Maybe the question that tells all might be worded:
> >
> >"Do you consider yourself:
> >
> >a)  a member of ARRL
> >
> >b)  a subscriber to a magazine about amateur radio
> >
> >c)  both
> >
> >73 de Jim - KF6CR
>
> My point ... I maintain (from having talked to LOTs of ARRL "members")
> that the answer in a VERY large percentage of cases is "b" ... most
> people I know who are "members" ... myself included ... are really
> "subscribers to QST" because we DO NOT feel that the ARRL "represents"
> us.
>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]

Don't forget that by subscribing to QST when the ARRL rattles its saber
that it uses your name in support of its position reguardles of you
views.
So if you do not agree with the ARRL you should cancel your subscription
and
pick it up at the library instead.

73 -Tom  N3NDM


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:05 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
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References: <[e-mail]> <57g2ov$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5801mj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585cdm$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 23:48:21 GMT
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:43932 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119864

Carl Stevenson ([e-mail]) wrote:
: >b)  a subscriber to a magazine about amateur radio

: My point ... I maintain (from having talked to LOTs of ARRL "members")
: that the answer in a VERY large percentage of cases is "b" ... most
: people I know who are "members" ... myself included ... are really
: "subscribers to QST" because we DO NOT feel that the ARRL "represents"
: us.

I will admit to being one of that crowd.

My days of being a ham date back to 1966.  When ARRL pushed Incentive
Licensing back then, I quit, and didn't "rejoin" until thiry years had
passed.  Since no one saw fit to "grandfather" General-class hams at that
time, I still have one more element to pass before I regain all the
frequencies for which I had rightfully qualified to use, and was using.

I have always enjoyed the magazine.  One reason that so many of us are, in
reality, just subscribers, is that:

a)  it isn't easy to find QST on the newsstand

b)  even if it were, it makes no sense financially to pay the higher cost
    at the newsstand versus the cost of "membership"

73 de Jim - KF6CR










From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:07 1996
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From: Mike <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 01:20:32 -0800
Organization: FNS
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Tom Hogevoll wrote:
>
> Carl Stevenson wrote:
> >
> > In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writes:
> > >
> > >Good point.
> > >
> > >Maybe the question that tells all might be worded:
> > >
> > >"Do you consider yourself:
> > >
> > >a)  a member of ARRL
> > >
> > >b)  a subscriber to a magazine about amateur radio
> > >
> > >c)  both
> > >
> > >73 de Jim - KF6CR
> >
> > My point ... I maintain (from having talked to LOTs of ARRL "members")
> > that the answer in a VERY large percentage of cases is "b" ... most
> > people I know who are "members" ... myself included ... are really
> > "subscribers to QST" because we DO NOT feel that the ARRL "represents"
> > us.
> >
> > Carl - wa6vse
> > [e-mail]
>
> Don't forget that by subscribing to QST when the ARRL rattles its saber
> that it uses your name in support of its position reguardles of you
> views.
> So if you do not agree with the ARRL you should cancel your subscription
> and
> pick it up at the library instead.
>
> 73 -Tom  N3NDM


You need to include answer option "D", It is a good buyers guide. Seems
more that half of the issue is nother but ads for gear. Lets us compare
prices between retailers. I considers it a yearly source book
subscription.

73 Mike K6YPB


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:09 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 9 Dec 1996 00:56:03 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Greg Bullough) writes:
>I note that they charge the same for a library to subscribe to QST
>as they do for a membership with QST. Now, that isn't fair, as a
>library doesn't get membership benefits.

Library subscriptions to journals are usually *much* higher than
for individual subscriptions. For example, four issues (a one year
subscription) to the American Mathematical Society's research journal
BULLETIN is $217; for a library to receive those same four issues they'd
have to pay over $400. Why? The readership is higher at a library, so
a journal's publisher would lose money; thus they offset that loss a bit.
Hence, the ARRL is losing money by charging libaries the same rate as
individuals. I think that's awfully kind of the ARRL to absorb the loss.
They'll also provide a library discount for the purchase of the complete
collection of ARRL books.

Those that feel the need to critize the ARRL need to read of the history
of ham radio and how the ARRL has fought for its survival the last 80
years.

The ARRL has never placed a muzzle on its members - I recall reading *many*
critical letters from disgruntled QST readers over the decades.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!usenet
From: T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: 8 Dec 1996 05:51:00 GMT
Organization: o00o  <0>(_)<0>   o00o
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <58dl04$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44082 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120294

I joined the ARRL around 1981 and never renewed.  Last week I sent in a check
to
rejoin.....and for my son KE6VWF.  The reason I joined again is because I don'
t like the
direction Ham radio is starting  lean towards.  I also think our Congress woul
d sell off all
the Ham bands if they had a chance to.  It's time to dig in!

My Opinion,
Don W6IQ




From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!demos!news.uni-stuttgart.de!news.belwue.de!fu-berlin.de!informatik.tu-muenchen.de!main.Germany.EU.net!Germany.EU.net!news.mira.net.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!mail_gw.fwall.telecom.com.au!cdn_news.telecom.com.au!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Terry Dawson)
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: WIA (NSW Division) web page updated & moved
Followup-To: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 3 Dec 1996 05:39:18 GMT
Organization: Telstra
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <580ee6$o64@cdn_news.telecom.com.au>
References: <57qp2v$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: baldric.no.itg.telecom.com.au
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]
Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1560 aus.radio.amateur.wicen:258 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119503

Richard P. Murnane ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Also, because of sudden and unexpected change in pricing policy, which would
: have seen the page costing the WIA over $100 per week, I have moved the page
 to
: my own account, while I look for a permanent home for it.

If the WIA NSW division had supported the proposal to interconnect Dural
with the Macquarie gateway instead of engaging in its typically backward
behaviour the Macquarie gateway people might have hosted it for nothing and
had it available to both amateur and non-amateur IP hosts.

Terry



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!hammer.uoregon.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.probe.net!coopnews.coop.net!news.fan.net.au!nsw.news.telstra.net!nsw1.news.telstra.net!news02.magna.com.au!news.magna.com.au!trash
From: [e-mail] (Trash)
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: WIA (NSW Division) web page updated & moved
Date: Wed, 04 Dec 96 12:38:29 GMT
Organization: Bastards Inc
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <583k8r$[e-mail]>
References: <57qp2v$[e-mail]> <580ee6$o64@cdn_news.telecom.com.au> <583igo$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: trash.magna.com.au
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2
Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1563 aus.radio.amateur.wicen:259 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119561


>Well, Terry, if you had bothered to join the WIA, instead of waiting until it
>*after* bankrolled *your* particular special interest, you could have got
>yourself and and some like-minded friends elected onto Council, where you cou
ld
>have taken an active role in that decision.

 Fat chance.... we already know what happens to *those* people, don't we !


- Trash



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!news.mel.connect.com.au!news.syd.connect.com.au!phaedrus.kralizec.net.au!root
From: [e-mail] (Richard P. Murnane)
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: WIA (NSW Division) web page updated & moved
Date: 4 Dec 1996 10:07:20 GMT
Organization: Platinum Pig Productions Pty
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <583igo$[e-mail]>
References: <57qp2v$[e-mail]> <580ee6$o64@cdn_news.telecom.com.au>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup3f.syd1.zeta.org.au
X-Newsreader: Cyberjack News 7.00
Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1566 aus.radio.amateur.wicen:260 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119630

In article <580ee6$o64@cdn_news.telecom.com.au>, [e-mail].
co
m.au (Terry Dawson) wrote:
> If the WIA NSW division had supported the proposal to interconnect Dural
> with the Macquarie gateway instead of engaging in its typically backward
> behaviour the Macquarie gateway people might have hosted it for nothing and
> had it available to both amateur and non-amateur IP hosts.

Well, Terry, if you had bothered to join the WIA, instead of waiting until it
*after* bankrolled *your* particular special interest, you could have got
yourself and and some like-minded friends elected onto Council, where you coul
d
have taken an active role in that decision.

Fortunately, our friends at MacUni are not preoccupied with old grudges of
the past (like some people I could mention), and have offered to host the VK2
Web
page, an offer for which I am very grateful. Thanks Tony VK2TJF!

I'll notify everyone when the Web page has settled in to its new home.

73 Richard VK2SKY




--
Richard Murnane VK2SKY
Email: [e-mail]
Web: http://www.zeta.org.au/~richardm
Bonus Fool On the Hill Web page: http://www.zeta.org.au/...
   ...~richardm/psychology/case-studies/fool/index.html
Packet: [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!spool.mu.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!mail_gw.fwall.telecom.com.au!cdn_news.telecom.com.au!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Terry Dawson)
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: WIA (NSW Division) web page updated & moved
Followup-To: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 5 Dec 1996 00:05:25 GMT
Organization: Telstra
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <5853k5$e3q@cdn_news.telecom.com.au>
References: <57qp2v$[e-mail]> <580ee6$o64@cdn_news.telecom.com.au> <583igo$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: baldric.no.itg.telecom.com.au
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]
Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1569 aus.radio.amateur.wicen:261 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119665

Richard P. Murnane ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Well, Terry, if you had bothered to join the WIA, instead of waiting until i
t
: *after* bankrolled *your* particular special interest, you could have got
: yourself and and some like-minded friends elected onto Council, where you co
uld
: have taken an active role in that decision.

Richard, you should get your facts straight before offering any attack on
my stand on this matter. Dave will confirm my view.

I was a member of the WIA for many years during which time it progressively
moved further and further away from supporting me. I had no intention of
joining even if it did bankroll a project for which I had no personal
interest other than a purely technical one in _assisting_. I had no
intention of using the facility, I manage my own gateway. The WIA effectively
snubbed my volunteer support of a project which was in their interest, if
you expect me to join them for that you are seriously mistaken. As it was,
very little bankrolling was required in the modified proposal, we only wanted
frequencies and space on the tower, everything else was going to be funded
elsewhere. If you are talking about the original proposal then it might
interest you to know that I supported John XY's decision regarding the risk
of investment in a PackeTen.

: Fortunately, our friends at MacUni are not preoccupied with old grudges of
: the past (like some people I could mention), and have offered to host the VK
2 Web
: page, an offer for which I am very grateful. Thanks Tony VK2TJF!

They aren't past grudges, they are current reasons that I hold for my
dislike of the VK2 division of the WIA. You're lucky Tony still sees value in
the WIA. I commend Tony and Macquarie Uni for their committment.

: I'll notify everyone when the Web page has settled in to its new home.

Terry



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!demos!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!quagga.ru.ac.za!munnari.OZ.AU!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!mail_gw.fwall.telecom.com.au!cdn_news.telecom.com.au!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Terry Dawson)
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: WIA (NSW Division) web page updated & moved
Followup-To: aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.wicen,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 5 Dec 1996 00:07:48 GMT
Organization: Telstra
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5853ok$e3q@cdn_news.telecom.com.au>
References: <57qp2v$[e-mail]> <580ee6$o64@cdn_news.telecom.com.au> <583igo$[e-mail]> <583k8r$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: baldric.no.itg.telecom.com.au
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Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1570 aus.radio.amateur.wicen:262 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119671

Trash ([e-mail]) wrote:
:
:>Well, Terry, if you had bothered to join the WIA, instead of waiting until i
t
:>*after* bankrolled *your* particular special interest, you could have got
:>yourself and and some like-minded friends elected onto Council, where you co
uld
:>have taken an active role in that decision.
:
:  Fat chance.... we already know what happens to *those* people, don't we !

Heh, yes, "like-mindedness" and getting a group of interested, dare I say
interesting, people elected to council is apparently only ok if the direction
you want to go down is the same pathetic path council was going before.

Terry



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!spool.mu.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!news.mel.connect.com.au!news.syd.connect.com.au!phaedrus.kralizec.net.au!root
From: [e-mail] (Richard P. Murnane)
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Wireless Institute of Australia (VK2 Division) has moved
Date: 6 Dec 1996 22:36:20 GMT
Organization: Platinum Pig Productions Pty
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58a754$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup3f.syd1.zeta.org.au
X-Newsreader: Cyberjack News 7.00
Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1587 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119848

Hi all,

I have now finished moving the WIA (NSW) home page, which now lives at the
Mathematics, Physics, Computing & Electronics Department of Macquarie Universi
ty
here in Sydney. Many thanks to Tony Farrow VK2TJF and Craig Pattison VK2BTQ
at MacUni for making it happen!

The URL of the page is now http://marconi.mpce.mq.edu.au/wia/, though the old
URL will still work for the time being, directing you to the new location.

The WIA (NSW) email address remains unchanged ([e-mail])

I still have to set up the hit counters, and to inform the search engines abou
t
the new location; I'll also attempt to send email to those pages that I can
determine have links to the page at its former location.

73 Richard VK2SKY

--
Richard Murnane VK2SKY
Email: [e-mail]
Web: http://www.zeta.org.au/~richardm
Bonus Fool On the Hill Web page: http://www.zeta.org.au/~richardm/psychology/c
ase-studies/fool/index.html
Packet: [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!mail_gw.fwall.telecom.com.au!cdn_news.telecom.com.au!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Terry Dawson)
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Wireless Institute of Australia (VK2 Division) has moved
Followup-To: aus.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 7 Dec 1996 07:42:44 GMT
Organization: Telstra
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58b75k$k5b@cdn_news.telecom.com.au>
References: <58a754$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: baldric.no.itg.telecom.com.au
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]
Xref: news1.epix.net aus.radio.amateur.misc:1594 rec.radio.amateur.misc:119904

Richard P. Murnane ([e-mail]) wrote:

: The URL of the page is now http://marconi.mpce.mq.edu.au/wia/, though the ol
d
: URL will still work for the time being, directing you to the new location.

What is the amprnet URL ? It would make sense to also make it
available to the amateur radio operators.

Terry



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!usc!news.service.uci.edu!newsfeed.intelenet.net!rdatasys.com!amberjack!mdowning
From: [e-mail] (Mark Downing)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WM7D's Amateur Radio Callsign Database
Date: 6 Dec 1996 17:12:38 GMT
Organization: Relational Data Systems
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <589k66$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: amberjack.rdatasys.com

M7D's FCC Amateur Radio Callsign Database is now accessable
via email.

Send an email to '[e-mail]' with 'lookup callsign'
in the text of the message. Replace callsign with the call
you wish to retrieve. If you want only mailing address info,
you can request a lookup with the keyword 'label callsign'.
Again, replace callsign with the call you wish to retrieve.

For more information about this service, send a blank message
to [e-mail], which will return an automated response.

You can also access the database via...

http://www.rdatasys.com/~wm7d/fcc/callsign.html

73 de WM7D
--Mark

Mark A. Downing                       Relational Data Systems
Reply to: [e-mail]              Irvine, CA 92714
http://www.rdatasys.com/~mdowning


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WTB: 10 meter Rig
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 1996 12:08:29 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <57urbh$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip246.los-angeles4.ca.interramp.com
X-Server-Date: 2 Dec 1996 15:07:29 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I'm looking for a Ranger or Uniden 10 meter rig for under $200.

Please e-mail me.

Thanks,
Scott, KF6FCN
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WTB: 20 meter rig
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 17:45:24 GMT
Organization: N/A
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <58f9b3$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip86.los-angeles4.ca.interramp.com
X-Server-Date: 8 Dec 1996 20:44:19 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I'm looking for a good 20 meter rig for under $350.

E-mail me.

Scott, KF6FCN



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!paladin.american.edu!hookup!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!phase2.worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.173.251.8!news1.iamerica.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Wayne Day N5WD)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WTB: FL-44A SSB Filter or equiv.
Date: 4 Dec 1996 05:56:54 GMT
Organization: The Day Organization
Lines: 9
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5833r6$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.81.56.115
X-Newsreader: News for Windows NT X1.0-92

WTB: Icom FL-44A ssb filter or after-market equivalent.  Used/New OK.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------
Wayne Day   N5WD  [e-mail]            Fort Worth, Texas, USA    |
   CompuServe:  [e-mail]                                   |
'__o
       EMT/Paramedic @ MedStar Fort Worth  My Work Phone? 9-1-1  |--\  <
    Member:Bicycle Mobile Hams of America, ARRL, LM-QCWA, LAB   (*)/'(*)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!dsm6.dsmnet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Dean T. Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: www.hamradio-online.com:
Date: 9 Dec 1996 16:10:18 GMT
Organization: Miller and Associates
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58g5k8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slppp24.dsmnet.com
X-Newsreader: OUI TE 1.5

Hi Ed, Kim,

In article <58g5k8$[e-mail]>, From [e-mail] (Ed
Mitchell), the following was written:
> Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
> email to [e-mail]
> Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
> http://www.hamradio-online.com

I'd just like to thank you and your site for renewing my interest in ham
radio.  I got my first license in 1953 and was last on the air in 1970
-- and let my ticket lapse.

I happened onto hamradio-online for the combined weather/hurricane and
earthquake maps and realized that I wasn't prepared for weather
emergencies (in communications).

Last Saturday I passed my General test(s) for the first time in over 40
years.

Again, a big thanks.<grin>



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Jay Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Xmas Special Event Announcement
Date: 10 Dec 1996 16:28:46 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <58k33u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: alb-nm3-08.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 10  8:28:46 AM PST 1996

Special Event Announcement

The TriCity Amateur Radio Club will operate as N0EL on 14DEC96 in
celebration of the Christmas season.  Operations will take place from
Christmas, Arizona, 1500-2100Z, on 7.225 and 14.240.

PLEASE QSL, with SASE, to KI7MN (good in callbook) - please DO NOT use
the
N0EL address as it is not current.

Special bonus for the QRP afficionados - QRP CW operations will take
place
from 0100-0300Z, 14DEC, on 7.040 and 7.110 +/-.

73 de N0EL and the TriCity ARC







From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!katbert.ipa.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Dave Whiteis)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Yaesu FT8000R Mods needed
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 17:10:05 GMT
Organization: Internet Partners of America
Lines: 10
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pool-187.ftsm.ipa.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

I am looking for mods to the Yaesu FT-8000R Dualbander.  Need to be
able to Tx/Rx up into the commercial range for public service use.
Also need MARS/CAP mods for same.

If you would like to assist, plz contact  KC5YAF.

73's

[e-mail]
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: YEASU FT2500 2M MOBILE
Date: 10 Dec 1996 03:23:21 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <01bbe648$88f964a0$bb7174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.187
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

MINT CONDITION IN BOX


MAKE OFFER



THANKS,

MIKE


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!fnnews.fnal.gov!nntp-server.caltech.edu!waldorf.csc.calpoly.edu!isnews.csc.calpoly.edu!violin.aix.calpoly.edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Kirk James Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Yosemite Freqs Wanted
Date: 4 Dec 1996 08:49:57 -0800
Organization: Biological Sciences Department, Cal Poly SLO
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <584a3l$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: violin.aix.calpoly.edu

I'll be heading to Yosemite National Park for the holiday break.  I'm
looking for 2m/440 repeaters in the Fresno, Madera County and Yosemite
Park areas.  Any help would be appreciated.

Non-ham listening freqs (NPS, concessions, etc) would also be helpful.


--
 Kirk J. Smith, KD6RCT, EMT-P    |  Biological Sciences Dept, Microbiology
 [e-mail]    |  California Polytechnic State University
 http://www.calpoly.edu/~kjsmith |  San Luis Obispo, California, USA


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:27 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!169.132.11.200!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!wlbr!llyene!news
From: [e-mail] (Bob Dengler)
Subject: Re: Yosemite Freqs Wanted
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 11
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: JPL
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.02
References: <584a3l$[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 1996 20:43:17 GMT

In <584a3l$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Kirk J
ames Smith) writes:
>I'll be heading to Yosemite National Park for the holiday break.  I'm
>looking for 2m/440 repeaters in the Fresno, Madera County and Yosemite
>Park areas.  Any help would be appreciated.
>

Try 147.030 (+) on Mt. Bullion, above Mariposa.  They were installing a remote

receiver in Yosemite the last time I was up there.  Also has a 440 rptr. at th
e
same site linked, but I don't remember the freq.

Bob NO6B (KE6TZF)



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: "Charles P. Hobbs" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJ|╩¿Γ╗╚
Date: 6 Dec 1996 21:32:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet Services for the Internet
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Posted-By: @204.212.59.83 (transit)
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; 68K)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]>, Jimmy Chu
> <[e-mail]> writes:
>
> >Subject:       ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJ|╩¿Γ╗╚
> >From:  Jimmy Chu <[e-mail]>
> >Date:  Tue, 03 Dec 1996 18:27:15 +0800
> >
> >º┌3╠¬±¼▌¿∞ñ@½╩e-mail,ñ╢2╨|p|≤|b▒HÑX5ñ╕┐·½ß,|bñ@¡╙ñδñ║|¼¿∞5╕Uñ╕.
> >
[...]]
> > |bñ¡▒i½H»╚ñWñ└ºO╝gñU|█ñv¬║⌐m|W, |aº}, ⌐M3oñ@Ñy╕▄:"PLEASE ADD ME TO
> >YOUR
> >MAILING LIST", ╡M¼q, |bñ¡¡╙½H½╩ñWñ└ºO╝g▒H╡1ñU|Cñ¡¡╙|aº}
> >
> >1.     JOSE TAN c/o TAN Lui (chen lei)
> >       946 CLARO M RECTO AVE
> >       BINODO MANILA PHLIPPINES
> >
> >2.     Fei Jie Yun
> >       Flat 302, Block 4,
> >       #12 Qi Shang Cun,Bei Men Wai,
> >       Province Culture Beureau Residence
> >       Fu ZHou 350003,
> >       FuJian Province,P.R.China
[...]

> >»¼|U|∞|n1B! »¼ºA|¿Ñ\, |}░]╖╜║u║u¿╙!!
> >
> What in the name of God is this and how is the average user suppose to
> read it?
>

It's designed to be read with a Chinese or Japanese font installed in
your computer.

But look at the message carefully . .. .

You don't need to know Chinese, to determine that this is Yet Another
Make Money Fast message!

Spam is spam in *any* language . . .


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.152.0.23!news.atl.bellsouth.net!news.clt.bellsouth.net!news.mem.bellsouth.net!news.sdf.bellsouth.net!news.bna.bellsouth.net!news.rdu.bellsouth.net!news.jax.bellsouth.net!news.msy.bellsouth.net!usenet
From: Ralph - W5FK <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJ|╩¿Γ╗╚
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 22:06:09 -0600
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: d00216.msy.bellsouth.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Charles P. Hobbs wrote:
>
> [e-mail] wrote:
> >
> > In article <[e-mail]>, Jimmy Chu
> > <[e-mail]> writes:
> >
> > >Subject:       ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJ|╩¿Γ╗╚
> > >From:  Jimmy Chu <[e-mail]>
> > >Date:  Tue, 03 Dec 1996 18:27:15 +0800
> > >
> > >º┌3╠¬±¼▌¿∞ñ@½╩e-mail,ñ╢2╨|p|≤|b▒HÑX5ñ╕┐·½ß,|bñ@¡╙ñδñ║|¼¿∞5╕Uñ╕.
> > >
> [...]]
> > > |bñ¡▒i½H»╚ñWñ└ºO╝gñU|█ñv¬║⌐m|W, |aº}, ⌐M3oñ@Ñy╕▄:"PLEASE ADD ME TO
> > >YOUR
> > >MAILING LIST", ╡M¼q, |bñ¡¡╙½H½╩ñWñ└ºO╝g▒H╡1ñU|Cñ¡¡╙|aº}
> > >
> > >1.     JOSE TAN c/o TAN Lui (chen lei)
> > >       946 CLARO M RECTO AVE
> > >       BINODO MANILA PHLIPPINES
> > >
> > >2.     Fei Jie Yun
> > >       Flat 302, Block 4,
> > >       #12 Qi Shang Cun,Bei Men Wai,
> > >       Province Culture Beureau Residence
> > >       Fu ZHou 350003,
> > >       FuJian Province,P.R.China
> [...]
>
> > >»¼|U|∞|n1B! »¼ºA|¿Ñ\, |}░]╖╜║u║u¿╙!!
> > >
> > What in the name of God is this and how is the average user suppose to
> > read it?
 Spam is spam in *any* language . . .

I think it says something about     "Amateurs $4.00 a month beeper
service."
But I'm not sure.


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!van-bc!news.rmii.com!rainbow.rmi.net!rainbow!jonz
From: [e-mail] (Bea and Marvin Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJª╩¿Γ╗╚
Date: 4 Dec 1996 18:36:36 GMT
Organization: Rocky Mountain Internet - (800) 900-RMII
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <584gbk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rainbow.rmii.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

[e-mail] wrote:
: In article <[e-mail]>, Jimmy Chu
: <[e-mail]> writes:

: >Subject:     ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJª╩¿Γ╗╚
: >From:        Jimmy Chu <[e-mail]>
: >Date:        Tue, 03 Dec 1996 18:27:15 +0800
: >
: >º┌│╠¬±¼▌¿∞ñ@½╩e-mail,ñ╢▓╨ªpª≤ªb▒HÑX5ñ╕┐·½ß,ªbñ@¡╙ñδñ║ª¼¿∞5╕Uñ╕.
: >
: >
<-snip->
<-hack->
<-chop->
: What in the name of God is this and how is the average user suppose to
: read it?

: Charles A. Wimer
: Amateur Radio Call: KC8EHA

You mean this is the first  "$$$ MAKE MONEY FAST!! $$$" posting you've
ever seen?

This crap is easily recognized in ANY language...

73
--
Jonesy  W3DHJ
Gunnison, Colorado


From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!surfnet.nl!news.unisource.nl!news.worldonline.nl!usenet
From: Leo Potjewijd <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJª╩¿Γ╗╚
Date: 6 Dec 1996 06:51:06 GMT
Organization: Lazy Lion
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <588foq$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <584gbk$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: asd3-p16.worldonline.nl
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.22KIT (Windows; I; 16bit)

try installing a chinese or japanese font instead.....



From [e-mail] Wed Dec 11 21:29:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ▒HÑX1ñ╕,ñΘñJª╩¿Γ╗╚
Date: 7 Dec 1996 00:52:38 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <58af4m$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix5.its.hawaii.edu

 <[e-mail]> wrote:

>What in the name of God is this and how is the average user suppose to
>read it?

That was a chain letter written in Chinese.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!nntp.coast.net!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!news.cs.su.oz.au!metro!metro!news
From: [e-mail] (Paul Titze, VK2THN/HACK.AU.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.space,aus.radio.packet,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: -= VK2THN HTTP URL update =-
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 11:12:48 GMT
Organization: Sydney University
Lines: 20
Distribution: inet
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: modem-a-201.mp.usyd.edu.au
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.space:9171 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121093

Citizens of the planet Earth,

As of the 1st of January 1997, my old HTTP URL will be invalid.
The new URL to my homepage, which is now effective is as follows:

http://www-personal.usyd.edu.au/~ptitze/vk2thn.htm

Please update your links.

Paul, VK2THN/HACK.AU.

Quote of the Day,
Picard: Space, the final frontier. These are the voyages of the
Starship Enterprise. Its continuing mission: to explore strange new
worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly go where
no one has gone before.
 --"Encounter At Farpoint", Stardate 41456.8

http://www-personal.usyd.edu.au/~ptitze/sig.txt



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!demos!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (David Moisan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 1 5/8 inch Hardline For Sale
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 21:13:37 GMT
Organization: DM Productions
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58n29q$[e-mail]> <58nq8r$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm4-120.lynnma.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>>We have an excess spool of 1 5/8 inch gas heliax which we wish to sell.
>
>Gas-filled heliax? Do you use hydrogen? Is this that new "Hindenburg
>Hardline" I've been reading so much about?

Mike, you should know better.  The gas used is nitrogen and the heliax
is pressurized with various fittings to keep out moisture.  Important
if said heliax is to carry lots of power without heating up the cable,
as is the case in broadcasting where it is used.

Dave

| David Moisan, N1KGH                        Email: [e-mail]  |
| WWW: http://www.shore.net/~dmoisan                [e-mail]    |
| Invisible Disabilities Page:                                         |
| http://www.shore.net/~dmoisan/invisible_disability.html              |
| GE Superradio FAQ:                                                   |
| http://www1.shore.net/~dmoisan/faqs/superradio/gesr_faq.html         |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.73.178.14!visi.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Edward Addy)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 1 5/8 inch Hardline For Sale
Date: 11 Dec 1996 19:33:14 GMT
Organization: N. American Cntr. for Emerg. Comms.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58n29q$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-153.dynamic.visi.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.5

We have an excess spool of 1 5/8 inch gas heliax which we wish to sell.

This spool is new and 230 foot in length.

This cable is very low loss.  We will be selling the entire spool
in one piece, on a first come basis.  We are asking $7.00 per Ft.

If you or your club can use this cable, please contact us.

Regards,

Edward Addy
Director
NACEC Center


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-=-=-=-=
     Serving Military Families & Disaster Relief Operation

 The North American Center For               E-mail: [e-mail]
 Emergency Communications Inc., (NACEC)      Phone: [phone]
 P.O. Box 23057, Minneapolis, MN 55423

            WWW Area (Main): http://www.nacec.org/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 1 5/8 inch Hardline For Sale
Date: 13 Dec 1996 04:44:10 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58qmuq$[e-mail]>
References: <58n29q$[e-mail]> <58nq8r$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm1-23.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 12 10:44:10 PM CST 1996

In <58nq8r$[e-mail]> [e-mail]
(Michael P. Deignan) writes:
>
>In article <58n29q$[e-mail]>, Edward Addy <[e-mail]>
wrote:
>
>>We have an excess spool of 1 5/8 inch gas heliax which we wish to
sell.
>
>Gas-filled heliax? Do you use hydrogen? Is this that new "Hindenburg
>Hardline" I've been reading so much about?

No Mike, it is an air dielectric. The center conductor is held in place
by a spiral of poly but most of the dialectric constant is air. It is a
very low loss high frequency cable.

Perhaps you should restrict your sarcastic retorts to the code/nocode
debate. If you tread into the technical arena so no code type may just
clean your clock.

                                    Jerry
>
>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:10 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 10:43:19 -0500
From: "Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ" <[e-mail]>
Organization: T.J. Alessi & Associates, Stamford, Connecticut
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
References: <[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.16.238.208
Lines: 24
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news.paonline.com!news3.paonline.com!207.16.238.208

Demetre Koumanakos wrote:
>
> CQ Netters,
>
> Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
> the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??
>
> 73

"200, 221 whatever it takes." - Micheal Keetan in Mr. Mom.

Double the voltage, reduces current by half.

Half the voltage, double the current required.

All consumes the same amount of power in the end.

Tom - K1TJ
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
 T.J. Alessi - K1TJ,  147 Joffre Avenue,  Stamford, CT-USA  06905-2933
 mailto:[e-mail]   powwow:[e-mail]   http://www.Alessi.Com
 Home: 203.363.0319        Work: 203.977.5200        FAX: [phone]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!surfnet.nl!news.unisource.nl!news.worldonline.nl!usenet
From: Leo Potjewijd <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 17 Dec 1996 20:28:35 GMT
Organization: Lazy Lion
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <596vpj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: asd2-p47.worldonline.nl
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.22KIT (Windows; I; 16bit)

"Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Demetre Koumanakos wrote:
>> Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
>> the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??
>Double the voltage, reduces current by half.

That's precisely the advantage. Less current for the same power results
in lower losses in transformers and wires.

>Half the voltage, double the current required.
. and quadruple the losses ....

>All consumes the same amount of power in the end.
>
>Tom - K1TJ
>

Leo - PE1RHX

Hey, I only live here.....



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!surfnet.nl!swidir.switch.ch!news.grnet.gr!news.ntua.gr!www.intranet.gr!helios.intranet.gr!usenet
From: Demetre Koumanakos <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 15:12:46 +0200
Organization: Intracom SA
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dpd_deme.intranet.gr
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

CQ Netters,

Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??

73

-- .- -.-. . -.. --- -. .. .-  .. ... .... . .-.. .-.. . -. .. -.-.
 +-----------------------------+--------------------------------+
 |     DEMETRE KOUMANAKOS      | "If it ain't broke leave it !" |
 |  PROJECT COORDINATOR D.P.D. +--------------------------------+
 |                             |                                |
 |        INTRACOM S.A.        |      I may be reached at:      |
 | HELLENIC TELECOMMUNICATIONS |                                |
 |  AND  ELECTRONICS INDUSTRY  | e-mail: [e-mail]    |
 |                             | phone:  [phone] ext. 4345 |
 |   P.O.BOX 68, PEANIA 19002  | fax:    [phone]           |
 |            HELLAS           | cell:   [phone]           |
 +-----------------------------+--------------------------------+


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.229.48.18!news.fdt.net!newsfeed.telalink.net!telalink!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Doug Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 00:54:48 GMT
Organization: Telalink Corporation, Nashville, TN, USA
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59784s$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.181.132.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Demetre Koumanakos <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
>the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??

110V is slightly safer, but I think the real reason we use it in the
USA is habit.  We started with 110V long ago (it's actually closer to
120V in most places) and it was too expensive to change.

220V is a little more dangerous; it's a little more likely to cause
injury or death if you're shocked, and a little more likely to cause a
fire if something else happens.  The difference is minimal.

The bigger advantage to 220V is that less power is lost in the wiring.
At 220V, the same appliance requires half the current.  Power loss in
wiring is proportional to the square of the current.

Incidentially, in most U.S. homes and businesses, 220V power is
available for large appliances.  (air conditioners, ovens, etc.)  Most
U.S. hams who use external amplifiers for more than 100W power use
220V to power those amplifiers.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:13 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Wed, 18 DEC 96 01:12:15 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1d.delphi.com
X-To: TJ) Alessi - K1TJ" <[e-mail] <"Tom>

The advantage of 220 is that with less current flow there is less loss for
the same distance travelled down the wires. The advantage of 110 is that if
you come across it you can survive, 220 is more likely to zang you.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:17 1996
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From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 13:56:47 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: JWP <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

> > > Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
> > > the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??

Contrary to common belief, every house in the USA has 220 Volts coming
into the house. Three wires actually, dubbed Hot-1, Neutral and Hot-2.
The voltage between each of the two hot wire and neutral is 110 Volts,
the voltage between the two hot ones is 220 Volts ...

> One advantage to the higher distribution voltage is in building
> construction - the wires for distribution circuits could be smaller, yet
> deliver the same energy. There would be savings in copper costs.

In Europe, there are central transformers that transform the high voltage
from the overland lines down to 220 ... And it is often miles, that these
220 V have to travel before they reach the consuming unit.

In the USA nearly each house has its own transformer on some pole on the
street, transforming several kilovolts (was it 38,500 or 58,500 Volts?)
down to the consumption voltage. The 110/220 Volts then travel maybe some
100 or 200 feet (30 or 60 meters)  ... Basically, the North American
system makes more sense, as the line losses for the consumption voltage
power distances are magnitudes below those distances the consumption
voltage power has to travel on European lines...




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:17 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dave Martindale)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 20 Dec 1996 09:43:59 -0800
Organization: Computer Science, University of B.C., Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59ej8v$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: harpo.cs.ubc.ca

[e-mail] (Doug Smith) writes:
>220V is a little more dangerous; it's a little more likely to cause
>injury or death if you're shocked, and a little more likely to cause a
>fire if something else happens.  The difference is minimal.

I've heard it argued that 220-240 V at 50 Hz is no more, and perhaps less,
dangerous to humans than 120 V 60 Hz.  Apparently 60 Hz is a bad choice
of frequency because it easily causes fibrillation in the heart muscle,
while 50 Hz is less likely to.  So even though your body draws twice
the current at 240 V than 120 V, it's less likely to kill you.  But this
was someone from Britain arguing this.  Does anyone know for sure?

        Dave


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:19 1996
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From: "Tom V. Pfaffenbach" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 15:43:53 -0500
Organization: Delco Electronice Corporation
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: komtpc34.delcoelect.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I)
To: [e-mail]

Demetre Koumanakos wrote:
>
> CQ Netters,
>
> Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
> the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??
>
> 73
>
> -- .- -.-. . -.. --- -. .. .-  .. ... .... . .-.. .-.. . -. .. -.-.
>  +-----------------------------+--------------------------------+
>  |     DEMETRE KOUMANAKOS      | "If it ain't broke leave it !" |
>  |  PROJECT COORDINATOR D.P.D. +--------------------------------+
>  |                             |                                |
>  |        INTRACOM S.A.        |      I may be reached at:      |
>  | HELLENIC TELECOMMUNICATIONS |                                |
>  |  AND  ELECTRONICS INDUSTRY  | e-mail: [e-mail]    |
>  |                             | phone:  [phone] ext. 4345 |
>  |   P.O.BOX 68, PEANIA 19002  | fax:    [phone]           |
>  |            HELLAS           | cell:   [phone]           |
>  +-----------------------------+--------------------------------+
Thomas Edison originally developed and marketed direct current for
distribution in thickly settled areas because it was more reliable than
any of the then existing AC systems.  For safety and to reduce neutral
currents, it was distributed as a 3 wire +, -, and  grounded neutral
system. Because of the higher efficiency and lower cost of an AC system,
it became desireable to develop one that would compare in reliability to
the DC system. It was thru the efforts of Dr's Tesla and Steinmetz and
Westinghouse that the AC network that we have today resulted.
The macro network is a 3 phase, four wire, grounded neutral system with
power typically generated at 13,200 volts,  transformed up for
transmission and down for local distribution.  Where the end consumer
application does not include large polyphase induction motor
requirements, single phase transmission with system balance maintained
at the substation is a distinct economy.  The U.S. grounded
neutral/center tapped secondary approach has been maintained for economy
and safety, and is in-fact a carry-over from Edison's original marketing
plan for electrical energy.

73 de K9JDU


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:20 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!news.mag-net.com!freenet.unbc.edu!news.scn.org!scn.org!bb840
From: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Organization: Seattle Community Network
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 04:58:06 GMT
Lines: 24


In a previous article, [e-mail] (Dave Martindale) says:

>[e-mail] (Doug Smith) writes:
>>220V is a little more dangerous; it's a little more likely to cause
>>injury or death if you're shocked, and a little more likely to cause a
>>fire if something else happens.  The difference is minimal.
>
>I've heard it argued that 220-240 V at 50 Hz is no more, and perhaps less,
>dangerous to humans than 120 V 60 Hz.  Apparently 60 Hz is a bad choice
>of frequency because it easily causes fibrillation in the heart muscle,
>while 50 Hz is less likely to.  So even though your body draws twice
>the current at 240 V than 120 V, it's less likely to kill you.  But this
>was someone from Britain arguing this.  Does anyone know for sure?
>
>       Dave
>
I've heard this too, but I read it in an article.  It's probably correct.
But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current is
less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
the current that kills, not the voltage.
--
Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:21 1996
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From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 11:32:49 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: [e-mail]
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

On Wed, 18 Dec 1996 [e-mail] wrote:

> The advantage of 220 is that with less current flow there is less loss for
> the same distance travelled down the wires. The advantage of 110 is that if
> you come across it you can survive, 220 is more likely to zang you.

*WRONG* ... You forgot to figure in the muscular reaction to electrictiy.
With voltages above 80 Volts (some literature says, the threshold was 100
Volts), a kind of jerk back reaction (muscle contraction) results from the
touch. At 220 the jerk back reaction is much more pronounced and comes
swifter than at 110. It thus is safer to come into contact with 220 Volts
than with 110 Volts. Actually, with some people 110 Volts do not trigger
any reaction. But 220 will never fail in doing so.

The body is just another power consumer. Voltage is one thing, the body
resistance another, but veeeeeeery important is the time of exposure. A
few millisecond at 220 Volts are less harmful than three seconds at 110.
Time of exposure is a pivotal factor in all that, too.

As a kid I got zapped a few times by 220 Volts. I wonder if I had lived
another 40 years to tell about it, if those wires had carried 110 Volts.

But I nevertheless would not recommend to anyone to try it out.
Everything above 45 Volts can be potentially fatal when coming with the
capability to pump enough amperes through you. Actually it does not
take that much amperes to add-on a halo on you ...



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (derek hutter)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 21 Dec 1996 18:50:05 GMT
Organization: Pacifier Internet Server [phone]
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <59hbgt$[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.2


>I've heard this too, but I read it in an article.  It's probably
correct.
>But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current
is
>less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
>the current that kills, not the voltage.
>--
>Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
>Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK


Actually it would be pretty hard to get into 240v as we are talking about
2 120v circuts out of phase to make 240v (not that it couldnt be done).

Higher voltages find "ground" better, thats the differance.

Derek K7XD




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:23 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
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From: [e-mail] (Doug Faunt N6TQS [phone])
Subject: Re: 1928 test? (was Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!)
In-Reply-To: [e-mail]'s message of 17 Dec 1996 23:13:30 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: at home, in Oakland, California
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]>
        <5979eq$[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:31:00 GMT
Lines: 36
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120957 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44328 rec.radio.shortwave:90627


   From: [e-mail] (Dana Myers)
   Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.short
wave
   Date: 17 Dec 1996 23:13:30 GMT

   In article <595ndm$[e-mail]>,
   Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]> wrote:
   >
   >Okay, how about just a two-question exam:
   >1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station; label
   >all component values.
   >2. Explain the purpose of each component.
   >(Taken from the 1928 exam.)

   Well, I suppose we could ask applicants to draw a schematic of
   a complete 1928 amateur station, but I'm not sure just how useful
   that would be in 1996 (or even 1946).  The technical standards
   and expectations were different then; a simple one-tube MOPA
   transmitter and a one-tube (or maybe two) super-regen receiver
   and power supply was common.

It wouldn't be that hard to draw the circuit and explain the purpose
of each component for a complete, current technology station.  Take a
look at some of the QRP rigs, such as the 49er, 38 Special or such
like.  And these can make contacts as well as the 1928 rig can, at
least.  The same could be easily done for a SSB rig.  But Jeff would
probably claim that you'd have to do it with tubes or discrete
transistors.

Many people would MUCH rather learn do that rather than acquire the
reflexes to use CW.  They probably could do it faster, too.

BTW, making it work in the real world or coming up with a new design
would be more of a challenge.  And grading grey areas or innovative
designs would be a real problem.
73, doug


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:24 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dana Myers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: 1928 test? (was Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!)
Date: 17 Dec 1996 23:13:30 GMT
Organization: SunSoft South, Los Angeles, CA
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <5979eq$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120966 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44334 rec.radio.shortwave:90636

In article <595ndm$[e-mail]>,
Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>Okay, how about just a two-question exam:
>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station; label
>all component values.
>2. Explain the purpose of each component.
>(Taken from the 1928 exam.)

Well, I suppose we could ask applicants to draw a schematic of
a complete 1928 amateur station, but I'm not sure just how useful
that would be in 1996 (or even 1946).  The technical standards
and expectations were different then; a simple one-tube MOPA
transmitter and a one-tube (or maybe two) super-regen receiver
and power supply was common.

It would be hopeless to operate such a station today as anything
more than a novelty. Though the transmitter might be OK, the
receiver would radiate enough signal to work transcontinental
DX and be illegal.


--
 * Dana H. Myers K6JQ, DoD#: j  | Views expressed here are mine and should *
 * [phone]               | not be interpreted or represented as     *
 * [e-mail]      | those of Sun Microsystems, Inc.          *



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:26 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Overfelt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 17:57:31 GMT
Organization: Your Organization
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58ph2b$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587rtn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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        Yep, and probably will be going on after you sell out again.

        One can learn a lot by listening to this Frekency!  ho ho




>
>It's nothing new folks......
>
>
>I've been inactive for 5 years, and it was going on the last time I
>switched off the rig before I sold.
>
>
>***************************************************************
>* [e-mail]                                     *

>*                                                             *
>* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
>*    Manchester, NH                                           *
>***************************************************************
>.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:27 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 3,894.50 Khz, What is going on?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:32:39 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58hbav$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-15.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>On Wed, 04 Dec 1996 19:15:30 -0800, Peter and Colleen McGreevy
><[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Greetings,
>>
>>This may be an "already answered" question around here, but what the HELL

>>is going on down on 80 meters at 3,894.50 Khz in the evening??? Some
>>clown identifying someone as K4OKA, etc etc. Profanity, insanity, etc.
>>Total waste of bandwidth.  So, does anyone know what the deal is down
>>there, and why nobody has stopped it?

>Just another great example of how well the Morse Code requirement works as
>a lid filter.

I can't resist.  Jealous cuz you get in there and join 'em?

    jim. wk1v



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:28 1996
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From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: 35% of the curriculum?
Date: 19 Dec 1996 18:25:41 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <59c1b5$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]> <58sbd8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121151 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44418

In article <[e-mail]>, Dave Hockaday  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>James W. KELLEY wrote:
>>
>> It's not a bad analogy, and I would actually like to see code become a
>> closer analog to the foreign language requirement in school.  The big
>> difference here is that foreign language does not constitute 35% of the
>> high school curriculum!  As a requirement, Morse code should be at most a
>> breadth course, not a double major.

>What do you mean by 35%? I guess I view it as a much smaller percentage, sinc
e there
>is more spectrum available on 6 meters than all the HF bands combined.

Actually it's 37.5%, my memory is going.  There are I believe a total of 8
FCC amateur radio elements.  3 of them are code elements, and 5 are
written elements.  To obtain the percentage of the "curriculum" that Morse
code represents, simply divide 3 elements by 8 elements, and multiply by
100%.

>> >The beauty of ham radio is that there is
>> >plenty of room for everyone with all varieties of skill sets.

>> Yes, room at the back of the bus (Cec) for those who are not native CWans.

>How is that the back of the bus? A tech has privs on almost all of the spectr
um...
>clearly HF access is just a drop in the bucket in terms of spectrum access. I
f
>anything, HF ops are in the back of the bus.

Then you would of course be willing to trade seats?  From the above, one
might conclude that we should open up the entire amateur spectrum below 30
MHz for Novice and above, but only Extra Class operators would be allowed
to use the spectrum above 420 MHz!  Something is askew in this picture
Dave.  Obviously the value in amateur radio communications does not simply
scale linearly with bandwidth.

Jim AC6XG



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:32 1996
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From: [e-mail] (ALLVIP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: <YOUR Exclusive Ad "ALONE" - $19.95>
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From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:33 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Doug Wittich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:47:31 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
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And yet another event which TOTALLY excludes the Tech+ and Novice
class licensees, based on "suggested" frequencies.   And then people
bitch and moan that the new guys are not upgrading.


Doug


[e-mail] (Robert Penneys) wrote:

>
>                   Finally - the Delaware QSO Party!!
>
>               Sponsored by the First State Amateur Radio Club
>
>Who -       All radio amateurs in and out of Delaware
>
>When -      First full weekend in February (1997: Feb 1 & 2)
>            Saturday: 1700Z (1200 EST) until 0500Z Sunday (2400 EST Sat.)
>            Sunday:   1300Z (0800 EST) until 0100Z (2000 EST Sun.)
>
>Where -     Suggested frequencies are:
>
>            Phone        CW
>             1.860      1.825
>             3.960      3.550
>             7.260      7.050
>            14.260     14.050
>            21.360     21.050
>            28.360     28.050
>
>           Novice and Technician freqs: 25 kHz above sub-band edge
>
>How -     Work stations once per band and mode.
>          Exchange signal report and QTH (county for Delaware stations;
>          state/province/DXCC country for others)
>
> Scoring - There is ONE CLASS for all stations.
>           Count ONE POINT per PHONE QSO.
>           Count TWO POINTS per CW/RTTY/Digital QSO.
>           Multipliers/special event stations: NONE.
>
>Awards -  Certificates will be awarded in the following categories:
>          Within Delaware: first, second and third highest score.
>          Within each Delaware county: highest score.
>          Others: first, second and third highest scores.
>          Further prizes and certificates may be awarded, depending
>          upon participation and merit.
>          Certificates and prizes courtesy of Ham Radio Outlet, Delaware.
>
>          Mail entries within 30 days to:   Contest Chairman
>                                            FSARC, Inc.
>                                            P.O. Box 1050
>                                            Newark, DE 19715
>
>          Include SASE for results.
>
>          E-mail inquiries to [e-mail].
>
>
>Thanks and LET'S GO DELAWARE!!
>



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:34 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 08:11:38 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 63
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[e-mail] (Robert Penneys) wrote:

>
>                   Finally - the Delaware QSO Party!!

>               Sponsored by the First State Amateur Radio Club

>Who -       All radio amateurs in and out of Delaware

>When -      First full weekend in February (1997: Feb 1 & 2)
>            Saturday: 1700Z (1200 EST) until 0500Z Sunday (2400 EST Sat.)
>            Sunday:   1300Z (0800 EST) until 0100Z (2000 EST Sun.)

>Where -     Suggested frequencies are:
>
>            Phone        CW
>             1.860      1.825
>             3.960      3.550
>             7.260      7.050
>            14.260     14.050
>            21.360     21.050
>            28.360     28.050

>           Novice and Technician freqs: 25 kHz above sub-band edge

>How -     Work stations once per band and mode.
>          Exchange signal report and QTH (county for Delaware stations;
>          state/province/DXCC country for others)

> Scoring - There is ONE CLASS for all stations.
>           Count ONE POINT per PHONE QSO.
>           Count TWO POINTS per CW/RTTY/Digital QSO.
>           Multipliers/special event stations: NONE.

>Awards -  Certificates will be awarded in the following categories:
>          Within Delaware: first, second and third highest score.
>          Within each Delaware county: highest score.
>          Others: first, second and third highest scores.
>          Further prizes and certificates may be awarded, depending
>          upon participation and merit.
>          Certificates and prizes courtesy of Ham Radio Outlet, Delaware.

>          Mail entries within 30 days to:   Contest Chairman
>                                            FSARC, Inc.
>                                            P.O. Box 1050
>                                            Newark, DE 19715

>          Include SASE for results.

>          E-mail inquiries to [e-mail].


>Thanks and LET'S GO DELAWARE!!

I hope you guys have a blast! Just one thing...Why no VHF/UHF/SHF
operating?
You are excluding a great many hams in your state from participating.
Was this intentional elitism or just a sloppy oversight?







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:36 1996
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 11:11:54 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
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Doug Wittich spewed:
>
> And yet another event which TOTALLY excludes the Tech+ and Novice
> class licensees, based on "suggested" frequencies.   And then people
> bitch and moan that the new guys are not upgrading.
>
> Doug
>
>
Get a life Doug! You weren't allowed to compete in the Miss America
Pagent either.
The "it's toooooooo haaard' doesn't work either, We don't need any of
90's welfare attitude here...I can't do it so I should be given it
anyway....
It's a shame that you can't learn the code or are unwilling to make the
effort, in the second case no one can help but you, in the first,
well there are classes, on the air practices and doctors. depends on
what
the disability is...

--
Stan Aughenbaugh II
[e-mail]
[e-mail]
Amateur Radio KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:36 1996
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Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 13:01:18 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
References: <59bjng$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Doug Wittich wrote:
>
> And yet another event which TOTALLY excludes the Tech+ and Novice
> class licensees, based on "suggested" frequencies.   And then people
> bitch and moan that the new guys are not upgrading.

--- snip ---

I agree Doug, it's terrible to exclude those hams.

Oh, but wait a minute!

> >
> >           Novice and Technician freqs: 25 kHz above sub-band edge
> >

That line looks like "inclusion", not "exclusion".

73, de Hans, K0HB
Have fun in the QSO party.
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:39 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Doug Wittich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 18:54:15 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
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>Get a life Doug! You weren't allowed to compete in the Miss America
>Pagent either.
>The "it's toooooooo haaard' doesn't work either, We don't need any of

What the hell planet are you on?

>90's welfare attitude here...I can't do it so I should be given it
>anyway....
>It's a shame that you can't learn the code or are unwilling to make the
>effort, in the second case no one can help but you, in the first,
>well there are classes, on the air practices and doctors. depends on
>what
>the disability is...

I'm not asking for a free ride.  I'm NOT asking for welfare.

I don't want to be Miss America, my plumbing ain't right.

I DO want my EARNED RIGHT to work CW to be respected by special event
promoters who continually recommend the use of general class sub
bands.   I don't see why the novice bands are excluded from these
events.

After being flamed for this and for saying what I think a forsale
message should contain, I'm beginning to think that many people are
here only because they want to pick fights.    YOU GET A LIFE!!!!


doug


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:40 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:46:11 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <58nv63$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>Halelujah, Brother Glenn!!   ;-)
>
>You'd think someone was attacking the church by suggesting a no-code HF
>license.

We ARE ... the Morseodists are a bonified cult religion ...

>
>I have grown so tired of the "you have to WORK for it" and "you should
>earn it" arguments.  As if the purpose of morse code testing is to
>evaluate the applicant's character.  No - it's to evalulate (somewhat)
>the applicant's ability to communicate with morse code.  With that, the
>simple question is: Is it necessary, in 1996, to require applicant to
>demonstrate the ability to use morse code in order to be granted an
>amateur license with HF privleges?

Of course not ...

>If you think it is necessary to evaluate an applicants character, do it
>like the government does when they are doing a background check for
>someone seeking a security clearance.  Interview him.  Then we can send
>the VEs to the applicants neighborhood to interview people that know
>him, talk to his family, his co-workers.

Neat idea ... I *like* it ... but it probably violates some liberal
"equal rights" law ... how ironic that forcing archaic technology down
everyone's throats doesn't ...

>If morse code wasn't a unique skill would you still require it?  What if
>morse code was required to graduate from high school just like math,
>science, language, etc.?  If that were the case, most people would pass
>an average morse code test without much "work".  Would we have to come
>up with some other kind of flaming hoop for people to jump through?

Right ... you've got a clear understanding of the program, Curtis ...
the idea, as voiced by Jim Conn and others, is to keep people out of the
"clubhouse" ... nothing more

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:41 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:09:04 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58nt0g$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587p6j$[e-mail]> <58hmah$[e-mail]>
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In <58hmah$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>
>Why is it that in all these lines of text no one mentions the ITU,
>which requires CW for operation below 30 Mhz?
>
>Or have we forgotten that HF signals travel outside the US?
>
>Quit wasting your time......
>
Try reading the threads ... the ITU has been mentioned numberous times ...
we can satisfy the ITU with a 1 word per day test ... but the real goal
is to get the ITU treaties revised at the updoing WARCs ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:42 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:01:49 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 63
Message-ID: <58nsit$[e-mail]>
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In <58fu4s$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
>Carl Stevenson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: This actually *is* a war ... it's been shaping up for a LONG time ...
>: I've been licensed for over 20 years and I've argued that whole time for
>: the elimination of the CW *test* requirement ... I am not alone,
>: there are many, many of us no-code *test* advocates ...  and I've said
>: the entire time that "I'll defend to the death *your* right to pound
>: brass if you'lll defend my right to choose not to ..."
>
>But, apparently still in the minority. A sizeable majority of ARRL members
>are in favor of continuing the code requirements - even though the ARRL
>board itself appears to be in favor of getting rid of the requirement.

I'm not sure where the support for this claim comes from ... have I missed
the results of the latest "survey" from Oldington?

>
>Even when the non-ARRL hams are factored in, it is still about 55%-40% in
>favor of the code requirement. The other 5% are undecided, or don't care
>to express an opinion.

Again ... just asking ... where do you get these numbers? (honest question)

>
>Just because you have to pass the CW requirement, does not mean that you
>have to use it.
>
>: Anyway, any compromise that satisfies the rabid pro-coders will not go
>: far enough in modernizing the ARS to bring in the technical folks we so
>: desperately need to develop new, more spectrally efficient technologies,
>: will not bring in enough of the "new blood" we need to help grow our
>: numbers for political clout, will not modernize the rules and eliminate
>: the unnecesssary barriers to new technologies, and will not assure our
>: future survival in the face of ever-increasing pressures on spectrum
>: resources by the rapidly growing demand for a wide variety of commercial
>: communications services and systems ...  so SCREW the pro-coders!!! ...
>: nobody is telling them they can't beep ...  but they've had their way
>: far too long and ham radio has suffered greatly from it ...  ham radio's
>: very future survival is in danger and we HAVE to make the necessary
>: changes NOW *before* it's too late ...
>
>That is a silly argument. The new technologies can be developed above
>30 MHz. As such, you already have a no-code license. No more is needed
>for research into new technologies/techniques.

Actually, I have a coded license, not a no-code license ... and many of the
things I want to do are HF-oriented and require access to the HF bands
with their unique progagation characteristics and impairments ... the VHF
channel will NOT do for testing purposes ...

>
>I haven't seen a flood of new blood doing research. All I have seen is a
>bunch of no-code Hams who use 2 meters like the CB band.

Many of the more technical folks that I work with still feel seriously
disinclined to be looked down upon as "second class citizens" by folks
who don't know nearly as much about radio as they do ... particularly if
the ONLY reason is that they choose not to go beep ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:44 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 22:42:45 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
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In article <58nuaf$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> This is forcing *your* idea of a "work ethic" on everyone ... many of us
> have worked hard to learn *far* more theory than the average ham will
> ever learn ... we like the radio science that's *supposed* to be the
> major part of ham *radio* ... the "yackers" and "gamers" don't
> understand what ham radio was intended for when it was established.

Sorry, but forcing theory on those who have no interest is just as bad.
Maybe it's time to bring amateur radio in the 1990's and recognize that
the ARS is not cutting edge, not the playground of the techoelite.  It's
time to recognize that it is now a HOBBY plain and simple

>
> >The more you have to work for something the more you
> >will value it.
>
> NO, the more I'm forced to swallow something that tastes bad, the more I
> hate it ... many people are that way ... we're not the "it's always been
> that way, so it *must* always be that way" sort of folks who just
> passively accept being crapped on ...


well than, maybe this hobby isn't for you and those like you.  Maybe
stamp collecting or knitting.  Neither require code or much effort.

>
>
>
> The theory is the MOST important part of ham radio, followed by the
> operating practice part (which can be absorbed by osmosis in about a day
> of hanging around with someone whose behavior is acceptable) ... beyond
> that it's just fraternity hazing ...


Theory not anymore..old hat  operating practices, now more than ever



> First, I respect the service ... I'm trying to save it from the
> backward-thinking folks who insist on staying in the 1940s instead of
> keeping up with the times ...

By mandating testing of old technology, by forcing those who would
appreciate the hobby as such as not be forced to learn what seems so easy
for techoids like you and might be very hard for others.

Don't force you to learn??? well don't force me.  Sword cuts both ways
Carl, don;t forget that



>
> carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:45 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:54:18 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <58nvla$[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writes:
>Curtis Wheeler ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: But first -   I don't believe that theory tests are too easy.  How hard
>: do they need to be?  They cover relevant material in consideration of
>: the privleges the license class allows.  If the code testing requirement
>: is deleted I don't there is a automatic need to change the difficulty if
>: another test to take it's place.
>
>My comment on easy tests:  the so-called "distractors" are not at all
>distracting.  Two of the four possible responses are usually ridiculous, if
>one even bothered to skim the theory.

You're right, Jim ... the tests are a joke ...

>If the exam doesn't verify that one knows the material, what good is it?

It's a joke ... like now ...

>I would have expected more difficulty at the highest level of written exam.

What? You actually think that the "beepers, yackers, and gamers" should
actually have to *know something* about radio???  What a quaint idea!
(not)

>In a theoretical sense, I don't disagree.  But, if 5 wpm is the best that
>one can do, then don't count on working too many others.  Many of us OTs
>don't mind slowing down to help a Novice, but a General or above with a slow
>fist is often shunned.

Not to worry ... most of us would NEVER think of trying to work you on
CW ... some other mode, fine ... we're NOT unsociable ... just don't
like the code ...

>Yeah, when I got into the game, there were four classes: Novice, Technician,
>General and Extra.  Novice expired in one year.  Others were renewable.
>The Extra required two or more years as a General and was mostly honorary,
>as it conveyed no extra privileges.

License classes should not (need not) exist for the ego gratification of
the holder ... licenses are simply a grant of privledges, based on the
applicant's proof that the minimum necessary requirements have been met.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:46 1996
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From: John Wolford <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 21:16:57 -0800
Organization: CDS Internet
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]>
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Forgot to mention:

   When I originally received my 'ticket', mentioning to anyone that you
were a 'ham' inspired awe, now all you get is a plain "oh", or they
start talking about their 'rig' and you discover later in the
conversation they thought you were a CB operator.
   I got my first job as a technician testing and troubleshooting
finished PC boards just because I was a HAM
73's KA7DZI .... John ....


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:48 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:05:08 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (A.G. von Luter
now) writes:
>In a post to r.r.a.policy titled "Re: Code and Part 97
>On 30 Nov 1996 18:50:01 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>>is a "journeyman" ... neither class hinges ANY privs on CW proficiency
>>.. though CW continues to be permitted ANYWHERE in the ham bands ...
>>and perhaps the bottom 25kHz of each band is made CW exclusive ... with
>>a review every 10 years to see if that continues to be justified ... no
>>sense in blocking out the bottom 25 kHz of every band 50 years from now
>>if there are only a dozen people left who have any interest in CW,
>>
>
>What is "CW exclusive" intended to mean?
>       1 - CW-only sub-band
>       2 - CW, RTTY and digital mode sub-band
>If the intended meaning is number one, why is it necessary to
>eliminate RTTY and digital modes from this 25 kHz?

#1 ... just trying to "throw a bone" to the rabid pro-coders to
give them something "special" (to them) ...

>On 6 Dec 1996 00:25:55 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>>Nobody has proposed reducing the digital (CW/RTTY/PACKET/etc.)
>>segments, not increasing the phone (SSB) segments ...  I imagine that,
>>with desirable rules changes, there will be digital systems carrying a
>>mix of voice and data traffic operating where digital systems are
>>permitted (the entire band) ... SSB would continue to be restricted to
>>the (current) "phone" bands ...
>

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:49 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:35:52 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58nuio$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ibek$[e-mail]>
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In <58ibek$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (August Miller) write
s:
>: Jim Lowman ([e-mail]) wrote:
>: The Bakers ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: : I thought that the lawful ability to transmit upon, thereby utilizing
>: : the radio spectrum, was a *privilege* not a *right*.  Much like a
>: : driver's license & driving on public roads.
>
>Then, why not scrap all technical requirements for a HAM license if
>you're comparing it to a driver's license. You don't need to know how a
>car works to drive one.

Because the technical tests are *important* ... CW is NOT ... and in the
car analogy, the driver is not building the car (and usually not doing
safety-related maintenance ...)

>Just have test on how to operate your rig, and a few no brainer questions.

More that "no brainer" questions are necessary to demonstrate adequate
knowledge of the theory to meet the government's obligations and
interests.

>The "CODE" can be an option, but knowing it shouldn't bring with it any
>special privileges, except perhaps the status that you earned something that
>others are too lazy to try for.


Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:50 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Tom, K4NR)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 11 Dec 1996 16:13:08 GMT
Organization: CompuServe Incorporated
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In article <[e-mail]>, From [e-mail] (Jim
Lowman), the following was written:
> How long do you suppose it would be, once no-code Generals
> overwhelmed the voice subbands, that they would want the CW/digital
> subbands > for phone, "because CW is outdated?"

Probably very quick--there will be a push to do away with the classes
altogether.  (A classless society....I know I've seen this somewhere)

--
Thomas Branch, K4NR
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 13:07:51 GMT
Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, [e-mail], (931)3186277
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Message-ID: <58ovs8$[e-mail]>
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John Wolford <[e-mail]> wrote:

>       Query ...

>   let's say a ham just happens to be scanning across the band late some
>night and happens to pick up a CW transmission.
>   Now, let's say the person sending the transmission happens to be a
>ship, plane, or what-ever in dire need of help.

I have seen this argument dozens of times and the only way it makes
any sense at all is if the aeronautical, maritime mobile and the
amateur radio service share the same frequency bands in the US :-).

As far as I know, this is not the case. A ship or a plane in danger
would try to attract attention using emergency frequencies assigned to
maritime mobile and aeronautical services respectively. Even if the
transmitter would be capable of transmitting on amateur frequencies,
would the operator know which frequencies to select.

Requiring CW profiency for such extremely unlikely situations is just
like requiring that all pedestrians wear a helmet, since some people
have fallen and died from head injuries.

Paul OH3LWR






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:52 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 05:23:26 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
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[e-mail] wrote:

>#1 ... just trying to "throw a bone" to the rabid pro-coders to
>give them something "special" (to them) ...

You don't need to throw us any bones, Squiggy. We already have access to ALL
the HF bands and can use CW where ever we like......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:53 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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[e-mail] wrote:

: Had the Conditional Class license come into being yet?  If I recall,
: it was basically a general class license reserved for those who
: couldn't make it to the FCC field office to take the exam (either
: through handicap or living in the middle of nowhere).

Yes, it was already there.  As I recall, one had to live more than 150 miles
from the closest location where the FCC conducted exams on a regular basis.
In some cases, the FCC conducted those exams only *quarterly* at some
locations.  In my case, Detroit was about a 60-mile trip, one way.  We had a
bit more than a $6 examination fee at stake then.  Seems like it was $8,
even in 1966.  Also, failing the General code test meant that one didn't get
to stay for the written test.

Strangely, I understand that some of the Generals and up, looked down on
those who held the Conditional Class license; sort of like the way some look
at those who have a waiver for code today.

73 de Jim - KF6CR








From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:55 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
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[e-mail] wrote:

: I was once (for two years) Managing and Technical Editor for a national,
: BPA-audited trade magazine (mobile radio industry) with a circulation of
: about 35,000 ... we had a much lower ratio of advertising to editorial
: than QST, and it was FREE to "qualified subscribers" (people likely to
: purchase the products of the advertisers) ... what does that say to you
: about the "cost" of QST???

Right, Carl, but someone has to pay the piper.  As you say, such magazines
target likely buyers.  I'm getting a few trade journals on that basis, too.
But the advertisers have to subsidize the cost of publication, so what would
the equivalent rate of a subscription be?  [advertising revenue /
subscribers]

73 de Jim - KF6CR




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:02:56 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 23:15:50 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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In article <58nuio$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> In <58ibek$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (August Miller) wri
tes:
> >: Jim Lowman ([e-mail]) wrote:
> >: The Bakers ([e-mail]) wrote:
> >
> >: : I thought that the lawful ability to transmit upon, thereby utilizing
> >: : the radio spectrum, was a *privilege* not a *right*.  Much like a
> >: : driver's license & driving on public roads.
> >
> >Then, why not scrap all technical requirements for a HAM license if
> >you're comparing it to a driver's license. You don't need to know how a
> >car works to drive one.
>
> Because the technical tests are *important* ... CW is NOT ... and in the
> car analogy, the driver is not building the car (and usually not doing
> safety-related maintenance ...)

Only to technoids like yourself.  Look at the majority of nocode techs...

>
> >Just have test on how to operate your rig, and a few no brainer questions.
>
> More that "no brainer" questions are necessary to demonstrate adequate
> knowledge of the theory to meet the government's obligations and
> interests.

Then maybe it's time to chamge those rules as well.  Why learn ohm's law
if you're never going to use it???  Why learn the formula for cutting a
dipole when you can buy one from a catalog??



> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member
Carl's opinions would be funny except he really believes what he writes


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 06:44:26 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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In article <58nsit$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...

> >
> >That is a silly argument. The new technologies can be developed above
> >30 MHz. As such, you already have a no-code license. No more is needed
> >for research into new technologies/techniques.
>
> Actually, I have a coded license, not a no-code license ... and many of the
> things I want to do are HF-oriented and require access to the HF bands
> with their unique progagation characteristics and impairments ... the VHF
> channel will NOT do for testing purposes ...
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
Gee Carl, for someone so allfired smart, you're really quite dumb.  With
your tech + license (20 proud proud years of underutilization) you have
access to HF. To help you, that would be 10 meters.   Last time I looked
10 meters was concerned part of the HF band.
Where better to take existing technology and reinvent the wheel than 10
meters.  The whole world is watching Carl,  start producing


Looks like you really don't know that much about amateur radio as you
profess, hmmm???


--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member
The upcoming amateur license - the WELFARE CLASS. All the privledges,
none of the work.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:02 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 14:24:04 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]>
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In article <58o04q$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writes:
> >
> >It would be interesting to see what the cost would be, just to subscribe to
> >QST.
>
> I was once (for two years) Managing and Technical Editor for a national,
> BPA-audited trade magazine (mobile radio industry) with a circulation of
> about 35,000 ... we had a much lower ratio of advertising to editorial
> than QST, and it was FREE to "qualified subscribers" (people likely to
> purchase the products of the advertisers) ... what does that say to you
> about the "cost" of QST???
>

It says nothing, just like you Carl.  There are many trade magazines,
subsidized by the industries they represent, by the advertisers that pay
for a particular segment of the market.  And it was free to a select few,
therefore, the advertising dollars were higher.  Sta in the elecytronic
field where at least you know what you talk about.  For you to venture
outside into the marketing area perpetuates the notion that you are an
opiniated fool.


>
> Correction ... it shows that the codeless license without HF (and with
> the serious "second-class citizen" stigma attached to it) doesn't appeal
> to a higher proportion of engineers than exist in the general population
> .. it is unreasonble to expect that you'll get far more engineers than
> than exist, proportionally, in society ... but you're getting far fewer
> with a code test than you would without a code test ...

and you point is????  The is a license without a code test, so where are
these people??  Are you suggesting that the only reason they aren't
licensed is because they can't yack on HF??  What foolishness, even from
you...someone who has been able to get on HF for 20+ years and has
nothing to show for it.  Is this what you are advocating?? A group of do
nothings on HF.  Gee Carl, I thought that was already the problem, at
least according to the book of Carl


>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:03 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 01:47:11 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <58qciv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]> <58nuaf$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>Sorry, but forcing theory on those who have no interest is just as bad.
>Maybe it's time to bring amateur radio in the 1990's and recognize that
>the ARS is not cutting edge, not the playground of the techoelite.  It's
>time to recognize that it is now a HOBBY plain and simple

So you *DO* want to kill ham radio completely? ... I can't think of a
more certain way in today's climate of spectrum auctions and intense
competition for spectral resources than to try to justify ham radio's
frequency allocations on the basis that It's only a hobby and we just
want to yack and play games, so please give us control of a few billion
dollars worth of spectrum so we can have fun."

I find it hard to believe that *even you, Steve* are *really* stupid
enough to believe that would result in anything short of death for ham
radio.

>>
>> >The more you have to work for something the more you
>> >will value it.
>>
>> NO, the more I'm forced to swallow something that tastes bad, the more I
>> hate it ... many people are that way ... we're not the "it's always been
>> that way, so it *must* always be that way" sort of folks who just
>> passively accept being crapped on ...
>
>
>well than, maybe this hobby isn't for you and those like you.  Maybe
>stamp collecting or knitting.  Neither require code or much effort.

Unlike you (who seem to simply want to yack and play games) I am
interested in the radio *technology* and the parts that are the *real*
justification for our existence ...

>> The theory is the MOST important part of ham radio, followed by the
>> operating practice part (which can be absorbed by osmosis in about a day
>> of hanging around with someone whose behavior is acceptable) ... beyond
>> that it's just fraternity hazing ...
>
>
>Theory not anymore..old hat  operating practices, now more than ever

For idiots like you, maybe, Steve ...

>> First, I respect the service ... I'm trying to save it from the
>> backward-thinking folks who insist on staying in the 1940s instead of
>> keeping up with the times ...
>
>By mandating testing of old technology, by forcing those who would
>appreciate the hobby as such as not be forced to learn what seems so easy
>for techoids like you and might be very hard for others.
>
>Don't force you to learn??? well don't force me.  Sword cuts both ways
>Carl, don;t forget that

NO, Steve, what you're simply too stupid and pig-headed to realize or
accept is that the theory and the radio technology and the learning of
those aspects are WHY ham radio EXISTS ... not so you can play games.

>Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
              ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Which shows that the written tests *must* be far to easy ...


Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:05 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 01:58:23 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58qd7v$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nvla$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>In article <58nvla$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>>
>> What? You actually think that the "beepers, yackers, and gamers" should
>> actually have to *know something* about radio???  What a quaint idea!
>> (not)
>
>I'm sure all the yackers beepers and gamers are thrilled you think so.
>Don't forget the majority of new amateurs (the technican class).  What
>would they be??  cb'ers who don;t beep??  Gee Carl, still the snob, too
>bad

No, Steve ... not a snob ... just someone who knows what ham radio is
supposed to be about ... something that obviously excaped *you* ...

>Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
>ARRL LIFE Member
>If Carl is for it I'm against it

Steve ... I think you should remain a ham ... (please follow your credo
above)


Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:08 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:02:34 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58qdfq$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Lowman) writes:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>: I was once (for two years) Managing and Technical Editor for a national,
>: BPA-audited trade magazine (mobile radio industry) with a circulation of
>: about 35,000 ... we had a much lower ratio of advertising to editorial
>: than QST, and it was FREE to "qualified subscribers" (people likely to
>: purchase the products of the advertisers) ... what does that say to you
>: about the "cost" of QST???
>
>Right, Carl, but someone has to pay the piper.  As you say, such magazines
>target likely buyers.  I'm getting a few trade journals on that basis, too.
>But the advertisers have to subsidize the cost of publication, so what would
>the equivalent rate of a subscription be?  [advertising revenue /
>subscribers]
>
>73 de Jim - KF6CR

My point is tha QST targets the likely buyers of Kenwood/Icom/etc. and
rakes in BIG$$$ for that advertising ... then they gouge the subscriber,
as well ... all in the name of "membership," of course, so they can
claim to "represent" all those "members" ... what crap!

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:09 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:07:00 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58qdo4$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>and you point is????  The is a license without a code test, so where are
>these people??  Are you suggesting that the only reason they aren't
>licensed is because they can't yack on HF??  What foolishness, even from
>you...someone who has been able to get on HF for 20+ years and has
>nothing to show for it.  Is this what you are advocating?? A group of do
>nothings on HF.  Gee Carl, I thought that was already the problem, at
>least according to the book of Carl

Steve ... Morse code in the novice segements (and a small slice on 10m,
which is practically unusable for most of the sunspot cycle for anything
beyond ground wave) does not, in any FAIR interpretation, constitute
"being able to 'get on HF'" ...

As I've said before, Steve, you're an idiot ... please go away and stop
being so damned obnoxious ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:10 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 03:56:33 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58qk5h$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]>
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In <58qija$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>
>The beauty of ham radio is that there is
>plenty of room for everyone with all varieties of skill sets.

As loong as the all suck up to the pro-coders and learn the codee first
..

>There's room for hams who are cutting edge researchers in
>communications; there's room for electronics technicians; there's room
>for people who can do arithmetic but could never get the hang
>of algebra very well.   There's room for people who don't want to pass
>the CW test. There's room for people who don't know what a z-transform
>is and who therefore cannot design digital filters.   There's  room
>for the EEs who took the VLSI route in college, and therefore couldn't
>design the matching network for a 3 element vertical phased array from
>scratch if their life depended on it.    And there's even room for
>people who can't explain (using Maxwells Equations) why AM broadcast
>band reception is lousy under bridges.
>
>I just don't think that it is useful to degrade and demean people who
>don't fit into your pronouncements of the definition of Amateur Radio,
>or don't measure up to *your* technical standards as a professional in
>the electronics/communications industry.

I have said repeatedly that I do not feel the theory requirements should
be so stringent as to exclude non-EEs ... but the code makes no sense at
all as a requirement ... unless you want a hazing ritual or to
discourage the technical types ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:12 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 23:11:11 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nvla$[e-mail]>
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In article <58nvla$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> What? You actually think that the "beepers, yackers, and gamers" should
> actually have to *know something* about radio???  What a quaint idea!
> (not)

I'm sure all the yackers beepers and gamers are thrilled you think so.
Don't forget the majority of new amateurs (the technican class).  What
would they be??  cb'ers who don;t beep??  Gee Carl, still the snob, too
bad


>
> >In a theoretical sense, I don't disagree.  But, if 5 wpm is the best that
> >one can do, then don't count on working too many others.  Many of us OTs
> >don't mind slowing down to help a Novice, but a General or above with a slo
w
> >fist is often shunned.
>
> Not to worry ... most of us would NEVER think of trying to work you on
> CW ... some other mode, fine ... we're NOT unsociable ... just don't
> like the code ...


Then again, most of them would probably not work YOU.  We're not
unsocialble..just don't like YOU  (read effette snob)


>
> License classes should not (need not) exist for the ego gratification of
> the holder ... licenses are simply a grant of privledges, based on the
> applicant's proof that the minimum necessary requirements have been met.

Yep, Carl's new world order license..the WELFARE CLASS.  get something
for nothing.  Gee Carl, if Rush finds out, he'll pull you membership in
the Dittoheads of Amerika Club

>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]


--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member
Id Carl is for it I'm against it


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:13 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 01:53:52 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <58qcvg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, John Wolford <[e-mail]> writes:
>       Query ...
>
>   let's say a ham just happens to be scanning across the band late some
>night and happens to pick up a CW transmission.
>   Now, let's say the person sending the transmission happens to be a
>ship, plane, or what-ever in dire need of help.

       Response:

Wake up and smell the coffee ... virtually EVERY other service has
long-since abandoned the use of Morse code (and the remaining few are in
the process at this time ...)  There's virtually NOBODY to send this
imaginary, what-if distress message ... as has been pointed out several
times, if you want hams to save lives, mandate CPR certification to
get/keep a ham license ... that will save at least 4 orders of magnitude
more lives than Morse code ever could, no matter how fanciful your
imagination ...

>  Isn't that what ham radio's all about?  Helping people in emergencies
>during assorted disasters?
>   I don't think it's right that someone might not live through an
>ordeal just because the 'ham' didn't understand what was being sent.
>   Some of you might think.... Well, they could have sent it vocally ...
>   Think on this one, what if their mic was damaged, it would be easier
>to 'pound out' an SOS then to just throw their hands in the air, hoping
>the friendly 'ham' happens to hear their plea.

What if the "little green men" caused the straight key contacts to
corrode? ... Give it a rest ... it's SO far-fetched as to be lost in the
noise ...

>   One of the MAJOR reasons amateur radio was created was to help during
>disasters, but how can they help when they can't understand what's being
>sent?

But, ONE MORE TIME ... NOBODY IS SENDING MORSE CODE ANY MORE ... except
hams ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:14 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:00:13 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58qdbd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ovs8$[e-mail]>
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In <58ovs8$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen) writes:
>John Wolford <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>      Query ...
>
>>   let's say a ham just happens to be scanning across the band late some
>>night and happens to pick up a CW transmission.
>>   Now, let's say the person sending the transmission happens to be a
>>ship, plane, or what-ever in dire need of help.
>
>I have seen this argument dozens of times and the only way it makes
>any sense at all is if the aeronautical, maritime mobile and the
>amateur radio service share the same frequency bands in the US :-).

Even more to the point ... planes and ships would NOT use Morse code any
more ... that's been phased out in favor of modern techniques that
simply work FAR better ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:15 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 22:07:43 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdo4$[e-mail]>
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In article <58qdo4$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF
2TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
> >
> >and you point is????  The is a license without a code test, so where are
> >these people??  Are you suggesting that the only reason they aren't
> >licensed is because they can't yack on HF??  What foolishness, even from
> >you...someone who has been able to get on HF for 20+ years and has
> >nothing to show for it.  Is this what you are advocating?? A group of do
> >nothings on HF.  Gee Carl, I thought that was already the problem, at
> >least according to the book of Carl
>
> Steve ... Morse code in the novice segements (and a small slice on 10m,
> which is practically unusable for most of the sunspot cycle for anything
> beyond ground wave) does not, in any FAIR interpretation, constitute
> "being able to 'get on HF'" ...

According to you maybe Carl.  But then again, according to you it would
be a challenge.  But, correct me if I am wrong, the peaks of the solar
cycles should allow you all the experiemnting you could want.

Interesting that you consider 10m not part of the HF band.  I'm sure many
will contest your FAIR INTERPRETATION


>
> As I've said before, Steve, you're an idiot ... please go away and stop
> being so damned obnoxious ...

Sticks and stones Carl.  I'll go away. if you will   ooopps, I forgot,
you think I'm a liar.  Guess I here to stay.

Ding Ding

>
> Carl - wa6vse King of all thats right
> I have my opinion, screw yours
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:16 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 03:30:52 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <58qija$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
>Correction ... it shows that the codeless license without HF (and with
>the serious "second-class citizen" stigma attached to it) doesn't appeal
>to a higher proportion of engineers than exist in the general population
>.. it is unreasonble to expect that you'll get far more engineers than
>than exist, proportionally, in society ... but you're getting far fewer
>with a code test than you would without a code test ...

Carl,

I prefer to think of the code as the "Foreign Language Requirement
of Amateur Radio".   The only semi-flaw in the analogy is that,
after satisying the foreign language requirements for most bachellors
degrees and high school diplomas, most people promptly forget the
skill, never to use it again.   At least in ham radio, a large
fraction of people communicate using CW.

This "second class citizen" stigma you speak of is no different
than any number of real world situations.  Some people envy
Ph.D.s,  some people envy people with B.S.s.    Conversely,
some people intentionally degrade others who don't measure up
to their "standards".

The beauty of ham radio is that there is
plenty of room for everyone with all varieties of skill sets.
There's room for hams who are cutting edge researchers in
communications; there's room for electronics technicians; there's room
for people who can do arithmetic but could never get the hang
of algebra very well.   There's room for people who don't want to pass
the CW test. There's room for people who don't know what a z-transform

is and who therefore cannot design digital filters.   There's  room
for the EEs who took the VLSI route in college, and therefore couldn't

design the matching network for a 3 element vertical phased array from
scratch if their life depended on it.    And there's even room for
people who can't explain (using Maxwells Equations) why AM broadcast
band reception is lousy under bridges.

I just don't think that it is useful to degrade and demean people who
don't fit into your pronouncements of the definition of Amateur Radio,
or don't measure up to *your* technical standards as a professional in
the electronics/communications industry.

Dick WD0ANB



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:17 1996
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From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 19:39:20 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 67
Message-ID: <58sbd8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120586 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44171

In article <58qija$[e-mail]>,
 <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Carl,

>I prefer to think of the code as the "Foreign Language Requirement
>of Amateur Radio".   The only semi-flaw in the analogy is that,
>after satisying the foreign language requirements for most bachellors
>degrees and high school diplomas, most people promptly forget the
>skill, never to use it again.   At least in ham radio, a large
>fraction of people communicate using CW.

It's not a bad analogy, and I would actually like to see code become a
closer analog to the foreign language requirement in school.  The big
difference here is that foreign language does not constitute 35% of the
high school curriculum!  As a requirement, Morse code should be at most a
breadth course, not a double major.

>The beauty of ham radio is that there is
>plenty of room for everyone with all varieties of skill sets.
>There's room for hams who are cutting edge researchers in
>communications; there's room for electronics technicians; there's room
>for people who can do arithmetic but could never get the hang
>of algebra very well.   There's room for people who don't want to pass
>the CW test.

Yes, room at the back of the bus (Cec) for those who are not native CWans.
Agreed about the beauty in diversity.  The irony in amateur radio lies in
the fact that an operator can have passed all the written elements thru 4B
and be denied even the minimal privileges afforded to an operator who has
only been able to pass lowly written element 2.  This is a tremendous
inequity, and does not make sense.  The relative importance to CW in
qualifying operators is weighted far too heavily toward the non-technical
operator, and against the technical types.

There could just as easily be two optional routes.  If the intent is allow
non-technical types in by letting them pass something THEY can do without
having to know all that "theory stuff", it seems reasonable to allow the
technical types in by letting them demonstrate the things they excell
at.  This would effectively balance the current bias toward the
non-technical aptitudes.

Say you've got to assemble a small team of 5 to put up the club 3C Field
Day station.  The guys and YLs are all lined up.  You've got some 35 WPM
Novices and you've got some real antenna experts who can build a
transmitter out of sticky tape and paper clips but haven't worked CW
since the exam (or perhaps never at all).  Who ya gonna pick?  What skills
are really most important to getting the station on the air?

Unfortunately this is an unfair way to make judgements about people and
their qualifications, but it's not totally unlike our code requirement.

>There's room for people who don't know what a z-transform
>is and who therefore cannot design digital filters.

This is an outrage!!  ;-)

>And there's even room for
>people who can't explain (using Maxwells Equations) why AM broadcast
>band reception is lousy under bridges.

Thank God.  The boundary conditions are horrendous!

73 and Happy Holidays

AC6XG




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 14 Dec 1996 10:28:43 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58tvgr$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ibek$[e-mail]> <58nuio$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
: >
: >Then, why not scrap all technical requirements for a HAM license if
: >you're comparing it to a driver's license. You don't need to know how a
: >car works to drive one.

: Because the technical tests are *important* ... CW is NOT ... and in the
: car analogy, the driver is not building the car (and usually not doing
: safety-related maintenance ...)

Bah! The "technical tests" are a joke. You do not need to understand a bit
of theory to pass the Extra written test - just a good memory. If the theory
is important, then make the bloody tests make sure the person actually
understands those theories.

: >Just have test on how to operate your rig, and a few no brainer questions.

: More that "no brainer" questions are necessary to demonstrate adequate
: knowledge of the theory to meet the government's obligations and
: interests.

See above.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:20 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 14 Dec 1996 10:40:14 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
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[e-mail] wrote:

: My point is tha QST targets the likely buyers of Kenwood/Icom/etc. and
: rakes in BIG$$$ for that advertising ... then they gouge the subscriber,
: as well ... all in the name of "membership," of course, so they can
: claim to "represent" all those "members" ... what crap!

I suspect that, if you check the advertising space costs, you would find
that the trade journal space is orders of magnitude more expensive than
the equivalent space in QST and CQ.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 14 Dec 1996 09:45:53 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58tt0h$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Curtis Wheeler ([e-mail]) wrote:

: I have grown so tired of the "you have to WORK for it" and "you should
: earn it" arguments.  As if the purpose of morse code testing is to
: evaluate the applicant's character.  No - it's to evalulate (somewhat)
: the applicant's ability to communicate with morse code.  With that, the
: simple question is: Is it necessary, in 1996, to require applicant to
: demonstrate the ability to use morse code in order to be granted an
: amateur license with HF privleges?

Given the way rigs are these days, the question could be extended to:
"Further, is it necessary, in 1996, to require the applicant to demonstrate
any knowledge of electronics in order to be granted an Amateur license with
HF privileges?".

I submit that the answer, in both cases, is NO. It used to be that the
average amateur built much of his equipment. These days, it seems that most
just know how to operate a checkbook or credit card. In most cases, the
commercial gear is far better than anything a Ham could design and build.

So, if there is no need for code, then there is no need for theory either.
That leaves rules/regulations, and possibly a test in operating an average
Amateur transceiver.

... deleted ...

: If morse code wasn't a unique skill would you still require it?  What if
: morse code was required to graduate from high school just like math,
: science, language, etc.?  If that were the case, most people would pass
: an average morse code test without much "work".  Would we have to come
: up with some other kind of flaming hoop for people to jump through?

See above.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 14 Dec 1996 10:20:57 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <58tv29$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58nsit$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
: In <58fu4s$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
: >: This actually *is* a war ... it's been shaping up for a LONG time ...
: >: I've been licensed for over 20 years and I've argued that whole time for
: >: the elimination of the CW *test* requirement ... I am not alone,
: >: there are many, many of us no-code *test* advocates ...  and I've said
: >: the entire time that "I'll defend to the death *your* right to pound
: >: brass if you'lll defend my right to choose not to ..."
: >
: >But, apparently still in the minority. A sizeable majority of ARRL members
: >are in favor of continuing the code requirements - even though the ARRL
: >board itself appears to be in favor of getting rid of the requirement.

: I'm not sure where the support for this claim comes from ... have I missed
: the results of the latest "survey" from Oldington?

It was in the amateur newsline - I forget the name, but I am subscribed.
It is a digest of the news that is broadcast by satellite,  and carried
on some radio stations.

: >Even when the non-ARRL hams are factored in, it is still about 55%-40% in
: >favor of the code requirement. The other 5% are undecided, or don't care
: >to express an opinion.

: Again ... just asking ... where do you get these numbers? (honest question)

Same place.

: >: resources by the rapidly growing demand for a wide variety of commercial
: >: communications services and systems ...  so SCREW the pro-coders!!! ...
: >: nobody is telling them they can't beep ...  but they've had their way
: >: far too long and ham radio has suffered greatly from it ...  ham radio's
: >: very future survival is in danger and we HAVE to make the necessary
: >: changes NOW *before* it's too late ...
: >
: >That is a silly argument. The new technologies can be developed above
: >30 MHz. As such, you already have a no-code license. No more is needed
: >for research into new technologies/techniques.

: Actually, I have a coded license, not a no-code license ... and many of the

I meant that there is a non-code license available, not that that is what
you have. My apologies for the confusion.

: things I want to do are HF-oriented and require access to the HF bands
: with their unique progagation characteristics and impairments ... the VHF
: channel will NOT do for testing purposes ...

That just means that you cannot figure out some way to emulate HF
propagation/impairments. I would think that would be rather trivial,
compared to some of the other problems a person is faced with when
working on a new technology.

: >I haven't seen a flood of new blood doing research. All I have seen is a
: >bunch of no-code Hams who use 2 meters like the CB band.

: Many of the more technical folks that I work with still feel seriously
: disinclined to be looked down upon as "second class citizens" by folks
: who don't know nearly as much about radio as they do ... particularly if
: the ONLY reason is that they choose not to go beep ...

What does this have to do with my statement? Either the "flood" is there,
or it isn't.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:23 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 17:44:34 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58up2e$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdfq$[e-mail]> <58u06e$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->I suspect that, if you check the advertising space costs, you would find
->that the trade journal space is orders of magnitude more expensive than
->the equivalent space in QST and CQ.

Having bought advertising in most media for the past 25 years, I can tell
you that this just isn't so.  The space $ per-reader (i.e. the number of
readers per ad $) is roughly the same no matter where you go.  The absolute
$ for these two mags is very comparable to others of the same size and
market.

Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:24 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 14 Dec 1996 09:55:01 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58tthl$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Jim Lowman ([e-mail]) wrote:

: : I don't support going to the trouble of having international agreements
: : changed to eliminate code requirements.  I like the idea of having three
: : license classes in the U.S.

: : Class I  = A written test that is equivalant to combining the current
: : novice and tech written.  No morse code test.  No HF privleges.  All
: : privleges above 30 MHz.

: : Class II = Class I prerequisite.  A written test equivalant to the
: : current general class written.  5 wpm code test.  Current General HF
: : privleges.

Why a Class I prerequisite? How about those that have no interest at all
in frequencies above 30 MHz, such as myself?  It is immaterial that the
questions are trivial.

: : Class III= Class II prerequisite.  A written test that is equivalant to
: : combining the current advanced and extra exams.  No additional code
: : test.  All current extra privleges.

Why not 10 wpm? That is about where many Hams get stuck - those that learned
each character by its elements (dits/dahs) - rather than the overall sound of
the character.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:25 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 14 Dec 1996 10:11:39 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58tugr$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

: >Yeah, when I got into the game, there were four classes: Novice, Technician
,
: >General and Extra.  Novice expired in one year.  Others were renewable.
: >The Extra required two or more years as a General and was mostly honorary,
: >as it conveyed no extra privileges.

: Had the Conditional Class license come into being yet?  If I recall,
: it was basically a general class license reserved for those who
: couldn't make it to the FCC field office to take the exam (either
: through handicap or living in the middle of nowhere).

In the 1940s, and before, there was only one class of license. The frequencies
were, 1.75-2.05 MHz, 3.5-4.0 MHz, 7.0-7.3 MHz, 14.0-14.4 MHz, 28.0-30.0 MHz,
56-60 MHz, 112-116 MHz, 224-230 MHz and all above 300 MHz.

Note that there was no 15 meters, that there was not 27-28 MHz allocation, tha
t
there was a 5 meter band (instead of 6 meters) and 2.5 meters (instead of 2
meters) - the 2xx Mhz band is only moved a bit. Of course, most of the space
above 300 MHz has been taken away.

For such a small group of users, I think the Amateur's have faired rather well
over better than half a century.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:27 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 14 Dec 1996 20:51:26 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58v40e$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58nsit$[e-mail]> <58tv29$[e-mail]>
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In <58tv29$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
(Carl said:)
>: things I want to do are HF-oriented and require access to the HF bands
>: with their unique progagation characteristics and impairments ... the VHF
>: channel will NOT do for testing purposes ...
>
>That just means that you cannot figure out some way to emulate HF
>propagation/impairments. I would think that would be rather trivial,
>compared to some of the other problems a person is faced with when
>working on a new technology.

No .. I know how to build a hardware/software channel simulator ... Ive
done it before in the course of my employment on a couple of occasions
.. it turns out to be a very non-trivial investment of time, effort,
and money ... I don't have $50-100k to invest in building a channel
simulator just to support my home ham projects, do you?

>: >I haven't seen a flood of new blood doing research. All I have seen is a
>: >bunch of no-code Hams who use 2 meters like the CB band.
>
>: Many of the more technical folks that I work with still feel seriously
>: disinclined to be looked down upon as "second class citizens" by folks
>: who don't know nearly as much about radio as they do ... particularly if
>: the ONLY reason is that they choose not to go beep ...
>
>What does this have to do with my statement? Either the "flood" is there,
>or it isn't.

What I'm saying (to carry on in your analogy) is that "the damned dam is
still holding the water back."

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:28 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 14 Dec 1996 20:57:04 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <58v4b0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ibek$[e-mail]> <58nuio$[e-mail]> <58tvgr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-27.dialup.ais.net
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In <58tvgr$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>: >
>: >Then, why not scrap all technical requirements for a HAM license if
>: >you're comparing it to a driver's license. You don't need to know how a
>: >car works to drive one.
>
>: Because the technical tests are *important* ... CW is NOT ... and in the
>: car analogy, the driver is not building the car (and usually not doing
>: safety-related maintenance ...)
>
>Bah! The "technical tests" are a joke. You do not need to understand a bit
>of theory to pass the Extra written test - just a good memory. If the theory
>is important, then make the bloody tests make sure the person actually
>understands those theories.

I agree 100% with the preceeding paragraph ... if you care to check
DejaNews, you'll find I've said the same thing over and over again.

The pro-coders keep throwing up the ridiculous "if the code test goes,
then so can the theory test" red herring in one breath, then in the next
breath, they say "the tests are *already* too easy ... to which I say I
agree ...

I would favor restructuring the tests to make them meaningful (not
necessarily "harder" to someone *who knows the material* ... just make
sure the material is current and relevant, don't publish the Q&As, and
computer generate the tests with lots of random variables and eliminate
most of the "multiple guess" questions ... anyone who truly knows what
they *should* know will have NO trouble passing the test ... anyone else
is not qualified and needs to "crack the books" a bit ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:29 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 14 Dec 1996 20:58:41 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58v4e1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdfq$[e-mail]> <58u06e$[e-mail]>
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In <58u06e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>: My point is tha QST targets the likely buyers of Kenwood/Icom/etc. and
>: rakes in BIG$$$ for that advertising ... then they gouge the subscriber,
>: as well ... all in the name of "membership," of course, so they can
>: claim to "represent" all those "members" ... what crap!
>
>I suspect that, if you check the advertising space costs, you would find
>that the trade journal space is orders of magnitude more expensive than
>the equivalent space in QST and CQ.
>
>Bill

I will check current rates ... when I was at the helm of
"Communications" circa 1982, my impression was that the rate structures
were pretty close ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:30 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 16:21:08 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58vodf$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tt0h$[e-mail]> <58uq1i$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>Unfortunately, over the past few decades, the ARS has sort of
>been taken over by the "gamers" and "yackers".  This is a VERY dangerous
>trend and does not bode well for the survival of the ARS because it
>flies in the face of what the ARS is FOR in the minds of the regulators
>who allocate the frequencies.

Squggie, Squiggie, Squiggie.  You just can't see the forest for the trees,
can you.  Us yakers and gamers have not taken over anything, we've owned
it all along.  And I must say we have done an outstanding job of keeping you
out of the game. Twenty plus years you've been licensed, and twenty plus
years HF has survived just fine without you, not to mention the sixty plus yea
rs
we have survived without your Grandpa.  If anybody is coming to take anything
away, it's the men in the white coats coming to take you away Squiggie......

Reason Number 469 for No Code HF:

Ham Radio is going to hell in a handcart, but look - up in the sky - it's a bi
rd
- it's a plane - NO !  It's  SUPER TECH SQUIGGIE,  here to save the day !!!!!

Just give him a nocode HF ticket and a microphone, and he'll get on 20 meters
and save Ham Radio !!!

Only one thing good about you Squiggie, you're always good for a laugh.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:31 1996
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From: [e-mail] (T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 13 Dec 1996 16:41:10 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58s0v6$[e-mail]>
References: <Ü╖≡>
NNTP-Posting-Host: h80-32-116.ccnet.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120726 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44222

Carl,

Why don't you redirect all the energy you are using to put down code and use i
t
to learn your code and upgrade.

I keep hearing how CW is obsolete.....yesterday a freind here in the US woked
China on 40 meter CW at 8 am.  Try and do that with phone. Hams have learned
code for years and no problems. The real problem is "Lazyness".

Don W6IQ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:32 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 16:21:14 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58vodk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tt0h$[e-mail]> <58uq1i$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>BZZZZZZTTTTTT ... WRONG ANSWER! The RADIO is what ham RADIO is about ...
>and the THEORY *IS* the "RADIO"

Well, Squiggy, most of my radio's aren't THEORY, they are ICOM.  ICOM is THE
radio.  I think what you meant to say is the only part of radio (ham) you know
about is THEORY.

That's obvious. If you knew code, you'd have upgraded years ago.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:33 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 16:25:59 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <58vomi$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ibek$[e-mail]> <58nuio$[e-mail]> <58tvgr$[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>The pro-coders keep throwing up the ridiculous "if the code test goes,
>then so can the theory test" red herring in one breath, then in the next
>breath, they say "the tests are *already* too easy ... to which I say I
>agree ...

And you keep throwing up the ridiculous 'We need gadzillions of new
hams if we want to keep the ham bands'.  And then you tell us you want
to make the tests 'more meaningful', which contradicts your recruiting
statements.  Face it Squiggie, we already figured out the only thing you
find meaningful is figuring out how to con your way onto HF with taking
a test.......

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:34 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 14 Dec 1996 21:04:45 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58v4pd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdfq$[e-mail]> <58u06e$[e-mail]> <58up2e$[e-mail]>
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In <58up2e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Weir) writes:
>[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:
>
>->I suspect that, if you check the advertising space costs, you would find
>->that the trade journal space is orders of magnitude more expensive than
>->the equivalent space in QST and CQ.
>
>Having bought advertising in most media for the past 25 years, I can tell
>you that this just isn't so.  The space $ per-reader (i.e. the number of
>readers per ad $) is roughly the same no matter where you go.  The absolute
>$ for these two mags is very comparable to others of the same size and
>market.
>
>Jim


Jim,

Thanks for your observations ... what you state is exactly what I
recalled and what I suspected would still be the case.

This implies that Oldington is doing some fairly serious
"double-dipping" or "burning the candle at both ends" when it comes to
advertiser revenue and subscription revenue ...

When I, as a "member" can write to all of the directors and vice
directors and get a total of 5 responses (two of the people I have known
personally for many years) ... that tells me that it's a "take their
money and ignore them" operation and the concept of "membership" is a
farce ... let's face it, the ARRL has lots of "subscribers to QST"
and not much more.

QST is NOT worth $30+ /year ... so we're getting totally ripped off on
"membership".

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:35 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 15 Dec 1996 09:37:21 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <590gsh$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>Unfortunately, over the past few decades, the ARS has sort of
>been taken over by the "gamers" and "yackers".  This is a VERY dangerous
>trend and does not bode well for the survival of the ARS because it
>flies in the face of what the ARS is FOR in the minds of the regulators
>who allocate the frequencies.

I suggest you peruse the early issues of QST and see what hams were
doing back then. They were yacking and gaming on wavelengths others
felt were useless. The hams proved them wrong. As a result, at
every international radio conference, special measures were taken
to ensure the protection of hams, with the US fighting the hardest
for the preservation of ham radio.*

Lots of radio history books at your local university library will
explain the early days of amateur radio to you, and why we're still
here today (Thank-you, ARRL!!).

* From Schroeder: "By 1927 a number of new services were demanding
consideration for their needs. Most conspicuous among these were
broadcasting and aeronautical, with fixed servies and amateur also
requesting frequency bands. That amateurs were not excluded completely
from the short waves they had been instrumental in opening up was due
to the energetic support of their position by the American delegation,
as a result of which the allocation table specified amateur frequencies
at 160, 80, 40, and 20 meters." (It's truly amazing we still exist
when you realize intense demands for the limited spectrum at that time.)

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:37 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <587p6j$[e-mail]> <58hmah$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 23:55:52 GMT
Lines: 17
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120776 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44247

In article <58hmah$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>Why is it that in all these lines of text no one mentions the ITU,
>which requires CW for operation below 30 Mhz?

Perhaps you've been living under a rock. S25.5 is on the table
for WRC99. Preparatory working groups will define national positions
during 97 (WRC procedure requires circulation of working positions
among member nations two years prior to a conference). That's why
there is all this political positioning going on now.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:38 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 23:49:50 GMT
Lines: 14
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120778 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44248

In article <58fu4s$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
>Just because you have to pass the CW requirement, does not mean that you
>have to use it.

Now there's a telling point. If you were actually required to use
Morse, there might be some relevance to a Morse exam.

Gary

--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:39 1996
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From: T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 6 Dec 1996 17:45:45 GMT
Organization: o00o  <0>(_)<0>   o00o
Lines: 12
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I agree that all the Ham tests are too easy.  The Advanced test is not bad but
 the Extra
although it covers a lot of material, the actual test is too easy.

As far as the License classes.........I do not see the benefit of changing the
m.  As far as code
goes...... the multiple choice question test is much too easy.  You can guess
and pass.

What ever you call the license.........."No Code........No HF"

My Opinion
Don W6IQ




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:40 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tthl$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120784 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44252

Bill Nelson ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Jim Lowman ([e-mail]) wrote:

: : : I don't support going to the trouble of having international agreements
: : : changed to eliminate code requirements.  I like the idea of having three
: : : license classes in the U.S.

: : : Class I  = A written test that is equivalant to combining the current
: : : novice and tech written.  No morse code test.  No HF privleges.  All
: : : privleges above 30 MHz.

: : : Class II = Class I prerequisite.  A written test equivalant to the
: : : current general class written.  5 wpm code test.  Current General HF
: : : privleges.

: Why a Class I prerequisite? How about those that have no interest at all
: in frequencies above 30 MHz, such as myself?  It is immaterial that the
: questions are trivial.

: : : Class III= Class II prerequisite.  A written test that is equivalant to
: : : combining the current advanced and extra exams.  No additional code
: : : test.  All current extra privleges.

: Why not 10 wpm? That is about where many Hams get stuck - those that learned
: each character by its elements (dits/dahs) - rather than the overall sound o
f
: the character.

: Bill

Someone really messed the quoting up on this one.  Nothing in here is mine.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:41 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 07:50:28 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <591es1$[e-mail]>
References: <Ü╖≡> <58s0v6$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A) wrote:


>I keep hearing how CW is obsolete.....yesterday a freind here in the US woked

>China

Damn, Don, that musta been one heluva big wok.

>Don W6IQ

K2NG was 599+ here in Guam this morning on 7.002 at 7:00 am our time.
So you're right, 40 meters is poppin'. JA's were loud here ALL DAY. CW isn't
obsolete. I just worked XV7SW on 160 on CW a little while ago.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:42 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 04:43:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <592jvd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nvla$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qd7v$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2
TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>>In article <58nvla$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>>>
>>> What? You actually think that the "beepers, yackers, and gamers" should
>>> actually have to *know something* about radio???  What a quaint idea!
>>> (not)
>>
>>I'm sure all the yackers beepers and gamers are thrilled you think so.
>>Don't forget the majority of new amateurs (the technican class).  What
>>would they be??  cb'ers who don;t beep??  Gee Carl, still the snob, too
>>bad

>No, Steve ... not a snob ... just someone who knows what ham radio is
>supposed to be about ... something that obviously excaped *you* ...

Part 97 states that, among other things, the basis and purpose of
Amateur Radio is

   (a) Recognition and enhancement of the value of the amateur service
to the public as a voluntary noncommercial communication service,
particularly with respect to providing emergency communications.

   (c) Encouragement and improvement of the amateur service through
rules which provide for advancing skills in both the communications
and technical phases of the art.

   (d) Expansion of the existing reservoir within the amateur radio
service of trained operators, technicians, and electronics experts.

   (e) Continuation and extension of the amateur's unique ability to
enhance international goodwill.

Items (a) and (e) have virtually no correlation with one's technical
ability.  Items (c) and (d) could apply to those operators who have
proven superior/competent operating ability, either through DXing or
contesting.

As much as you may dislike the concept, the "yackers, beepers,
and gamers" are fulfilling the *official* definition of  "what ham
radio is supposed to be about", just as much as you are.

As you and I both know (being technical professionals), there
are many pompous individuals out there who will always
feel that whatever they're doing is the only worthwhile thing, and
that everyone else is incompetent or inferior.  I have a feeling
that you're not really like that, so let's not be so presumptuous
as to label and judge other amateur's activities as "not worthwhile".

73
Dick WD0ANB



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:45 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 00:04:13 -0800
Organization: A.R.S. KD6ELA
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tt0h$[e-mail]>
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Bill Nelson wrote:
>
> Curtis Wheeler ([e-mail]) wrote:
[snip]

> : simple question is: Is it necessary, in 1996, to require applicant to
> : demonstrate the ability to use morse code in order to be granted an
> : amateur license with HF privleges?

> Given the way rigs are these days, the question could be extended to:
> "Further, is it necessary, in 1996, to require the applicant to demonstrate
> any knowledge of electronics in order to be granted an Amateur license with
> HF privileges?".

> I submit that the answer, in both cases, is NO. It used to be that the
> average amateur built much of his equipment. These days, it seems that most
> just know how to operate a checkbook or credit card. In most cases, the
> commercial gear is far better than anything a Ham could design and build.
>
> So, if there is no need for code, then there is no need for theory either.
> That leaves rules/regulations, and possibly a test in operating an average
> Amateur transceiver.

I asked a simple question.  Still haven't seen an answer from anyone
from either side.

The theory content of the written exams is still quite relevant and
necessary because privleges the amateur license extends.  A U.S. amateur
license permits one to build, modify, and experiment with equipment that
can be put on the air in an international radios service.

So if we just test for rules and regs - OK.  Then manufacturers can
start building ype accpeted equipment for those who possess a new
"no-theory" license.  They would not be able to perform any internal
repairs, adjustments, or modifications to their type accepted
equipment.
Why not?  I understand that Canada has a license class with similar
restrictions.  Though I don't have first hand knowledge of Canada's
licnese structure or the content of their tests.

But written testing and code testing are separate issues.  They are
separate tests.  A change in the code testing requirement does not
necessarily mean that we have to change the written exams a bit.  But we
can talk about that too - if thats' what you really want.

The pro-code rhetoric about eliminating the theory tests may turn out to
be a lesson in being careful what you wish for.

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:46 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 00:34:46 -0800
Organization: A.R.S. KD6ELA
Lines: 50
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tthl$[e-mail]>
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Bill Nelson wrote:

> Jim Lowman ([e-mail]) wrote:
[Actually - I wrote all of the text Bill quotes below with ">::".  Sorry
Jim - I am not going to let you take credit for my great idea ;-) ]

> : : I don't support going to the trouble of having international agreements
> : : changed to eliminate code requirements.  I like the idea of having three
> : : license classes in the U.S.
>
> : : Class I  = A written test that is equivalant to combining the current
> : : novice and tech written.  No morse code test.  No HF privleges.  All
> : : privleges above 30 MHz.
>
> : : Class II = Class I prerequisite.  A written test equivalant to the
> : : current general class written.  5 wpm code test.  Current General HF
> : : privleges.
>
> Why a Class I prerequisite? How about those that have no interest at all
> in frequencies above 30 MHz, such as myself?  It is immaterial that the
> questions are trivial.

Never said it was perfect idea.  Some fine tuning could change the Class
I (or whatever you want to call it) to allow some HF privleges.  Perhaps
the system could be changed so that a code test is an "endorsement" that
you could add to any class of license.

It is probably a good idea to have HF available to the first license
class.  I'll fic that before I write my petition.

> : : Class III= Class II prerequisite.  A written test that is equivalant to
> : : combining the current advanced and extra exams.  No additional code
> : : test.  All current extra privleges.

> Why not 10 wpm? That is about where many Hams get stuck - those that learned
> each character by its elements (dits/dahs) - rather than the overall sound o
f
> the character.

The idea here was simply to retain a code test.  I intentionally
proposed it at 5 wpm so that nobody would get "stuck" trying to increase
code speed to gain privleges.  Increasing code proficiency is not part
of the incentive in this porposal.

Right now them minimum speed for access to HF is considered 5 wpm in the
U.S. so I used that as the minimum as well.



--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:47 1996
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 12:08:54 GMT
Organization: -
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References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58nsit$[e-mail]> <58tv29$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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On Mon, 16 DEC 96 00:55:05 -0500, [e-mail] wrote:

>Bill Nelson <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>>: Many of the more technical folks that I work with still feel seriously
>>: disinclined to be looked down upon as "second class citizens" by folks
>>: who don't know nearly as much about radio as they do ... particularly if
>>: the ONLY reason is that they choose not to go beep ...
>
>How do the technical folks that are hams (are there any) that you work with
>feel about it?

How do the "technical folks" know that they will be "looked down
upon"? Whose words are those really?
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:48 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 16 DEC 96 00:55:05 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58nsit$[e-mail]> <58tv29$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1d.delphi.com
X-To: Bill Nelson <[e-mail]>

Bill Nelson <[e-mail]> writes:

>: Many of the more technical folks that I work with still feel seriously
>: disinclined to be looked down upon as "second class citizens" by folks
>: who don't know nearly as much about radio as they do ... particularly if
>: the ONLY reason is that they choose not to go beep ...

How do the technical folks that are hams (are there any) that you work with
feel about it?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:49 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dean T. Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 14 Dec 1996 17:18:44 GMT
Organization: Miller and Associates
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdfq$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slppp23.dsmnet.com
X-Newsreader: OUI TE 1.5

Hi Carl,

In article <58qdfq$[e-mail]>, From [e-mail], the following
was written:
> My point is tha QST targets the likely buyers of Kenwood/Icom/etc. and
  >
> rakes in BIG$$$ for that advertising ... then they gouge the
> subscriber, as well ... all in the name of "membership," of course, so
  > they can claim to "represent" all those "members" ... what crap!> !

Do you have the publication figures for QST?  The advertising rate card?

I'd like to see the numbers you used to make your statement.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 11:05:27 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdfq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv7.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
> Hi Carl,
>
> In article <58qdfq$[e-mail]>, From [e-mail], the following
> was written:
> > My point is tha QST targets the likely buyers of Kenwood/Icom/etc. and
>   >
> > rakes in BIG$$$ for that advertising ... then they gouge the
> > subscriber, as well ... all in the name of "membership," of course, so
>   > they can claim to "represent" all those "members" ... what crap!> !
>
> Do you have the publication figures for QST?  The advertising rate card?
>
> I'd like to see the numbers you used to make your statement.
>
>
Don't hold your breath.  Carl is very big on fabricating..numbers, lies,
falsehoods and untruths.  The only real numbers he holds dear are the
$$$$ signs he will see when he and his types turn the Amateur radio
service into a play for pay service..IE: wireless T-1 lines to surf the
internet.  There is one of the great ideas of all times.  I suppose Mr.
moneybags will allow free access to his computer so that all can surf at
no charge.

Actually, the ARRL is required by law to publish on a regular basis,
their publication figures (usually in one of the issues)  It will show
total copies printed, subscriptions figures, over the counter figures,
etc.

As to advertsing rates, call, write fax.  I am sure someone will help you

Don't rely on Carl for much of anything except insults and his constant
wimpering that he is SO superior to all and that he is a second class
citizen (in fact, probably the only truth in most of his postings)

Amateur radio is about people..all types of people. It's a great hiobby
that affords many the opportunity to do what they want.  It's this
premise that upsets Carl the most.  He feels that unless you play his
techno reindeer games, you have NO business being licensed..hence his
many cb'ers who beep comments.

Hang in there.  Have fun
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:52 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 09:44:09 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58nsit$[e-mail]> <58tv29$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv21.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
> How do the "technical folks" know that they will be "looked down

3 guesses...CARL CARL and possibly CARL???  Funny, a technoroid that
looks down on those who have supposedly less technobrains, complaining
that "cb'ers who beep" look down on his fellow technoroids.  Quite the
humorous turn of events
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member

All opinions concerning this subject are my own, but you are welco0me to
use them.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:53 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!207.155.38.10!news.qnet.com!ibbs!js
From: [e-mail] (Jeff Stillinger)
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
Organization: Coffee Radio Difference Committee
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58i3le$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tt0h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 13:31:34 GMT
Lines: 38
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120881 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44300

Curtis Wheeler ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Bill Nelson wrote:
: >
: > Curtis Wheeler ([e-mail]) wrote:
: [snip]

: > : simple question is: Is it necessary, in 1996, to require applicant to
: > : demonstrate the ability to use morse code in order to be granted an
: > : amateur license with HF privleges?
:
: > Given the way rigs are these days, the question could be extended to:
: > "Further, is it necessary, in 1996, to require the applicant to demonstrat
e
: > any knowledge of electronics in order to be granted an Amateur license wit
h
: > HF privileges?".
:
: > I submit that the answer, in both cases, is NO. It used to be that the
: > average amateur built much of his equipment. These days, it seems that mos
t
: > just know how to operate a checkbook or credit card. In most cases, the
: > commercial gear is far better than anything a Ham could design and build.
: >
: > So, if there is no need for code, then there is no need for theory either.
: > That leaves rules/regulations, and possibly a test in operating an average
: > Amateur transceiver.

<snip>

I would submit that the answer is YES.  Understanding how to build and
operate ham radio equipment is a MUST.  More so for HF than any other
band.  Ground loops and other poor installation problems will lead to
increased RFI.  This will lead to more complaints to the FCC.  More
complaints will result in rule changes.  Many changes for the worst.

In either case the exam needs to show how well any one person
understands what is going on.

--js




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:55 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Carl R. Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 18 Dec 1996 01:08:22 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <597g66$[e-mail]>
References: <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdfq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl R. Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-05.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>>
>Don't hold your breath.  Carl is very big on fabricating..numbers, lies,
>falsehoods and untruths.  The only real numbers he holds dear are the
>$$$$ signs he will see when he and his types turn the Amateur radio
>service into a play for pay service..IE: wireless T-1 lines to surf the
>internet.  There is one of the great ideas of all times.  I suppose Mr.
>moneybags will allow free access to his computer so that all can surf at
>no charge.

As usual, Steve has nothing to offer but lies and distortions.  I have
NEVER once advocated ANYTHING remotely resembling "play for pay"
commercialization of ham radio ... I have said that our present packet
system has become a joke, with the majority of people stagnated at a
crummy 1200 baud AFSK and that we *should* be using minumum user speeds
of 64kbps, perhaps even T-1 rates.  That Steve equates to "Carl wants to
commercialize the ARS" is indicative of his total lack of contact with
reality.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:56 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 06:26:41 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <58h293$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ipj9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qdfq$[e-mail]> <58u06e$[e-mail]> <58up2e$[e-mail]> <58v4pd$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121025 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44350

In article <58v4pd$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> Jim,
>
> Thanks for your observations ... what you state is exactly what I
> recalled and what I suspected would still be the case.
>
> This implies that Oldington is doing some fairly serious
> "double-dipping" or "burning the candle at both ends" when it comes to
> advertiser revenue and subscription revenue ...
>
> When I, as a "member" can write to all of the directors and vice
> directors and get a total of 5 responses (two of the people I have known
> personally for many years) ... that tells me that it's a "take their
> money and ignore them" operation and the concept of "membership" is a
> farce ... let's face it, the ARRL has lots of "subscribers to QST"
> and not much more.
>
> QST is NOT worth $30+ /year ... so we're getting totally ripped off on
> "membership".
>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]


TO QUOTE A FOOL..."so we're getting totally ripped off on membership".

OK then Carl, take the gun from your head, and cancel your subscription.
BUT PUT A SOCK IN IT for cripes sakes.  I've never seen someone who
complains about so much do so little about anything.  IF THE ARRL ISN"T
FOR YOU, why do you still belong.  IF QST SUCKS SO MUCH, why do still
subscribe?

There is nothing stopping you from WASTING your precious $30 bucks EXCEPT
YOU.  IF all is actually as bad as you make it out to be (again, look at
the source code), why do you still do it.??  You're like the guy who hits
himself in the head with a 2x4 constantly.  When asked why he does it,
his reply..."WELLL GOLLYYYY..IT FEELS SO GOOD WHEN I STOPS!!!"

YOU AND BURT...trolling for comments.  Come to think of it..has anyone
ever seen Burt and Carl in the same place???  makes you wonder



--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:58 1996
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From: Robert Lyons <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 12:34:11 -0400
Organization: University of Michigan
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: seqdir.brcf.med.umich.edu
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A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.

  So - I got my tech+ 4 weeks ago, just upgraded to Advanced, and
figured I'd go for Extra fairly soon (passed the written already).
Unfortunately, I have no HF rig and have never conducted a CW
QSO. I'd sure like to, though. While I can *receive* code fast
enough to pass the 13 wpm test, I'm sure that, when I first touch
a key, I'll be totally "ham-fisted". Does this mean I'll be
ignored by the upper ranks simply because I advanced before I'd
worked code?

I'd like to suggest to you more experienced CW operators that
there are many paths to competence, but all of 'em start at slow
CW speeds. I may have more than the usual electronics theory
under my belt than the typical beginner, and maybe I whacked my
way through the tapes to pass the 13 wpm code, but cut me some
slack. I'll still need patience when I first try my hand at CW.

(Of course, I plan to start on the novice bands with the usual
novice power limitations. When I find the cash for an HF rig.)

Bob Lyons
KC8FGZ/AA


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:03:59 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: 17 Dec 1996 08:51:41 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <595mut$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Robert Lyons  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:

>> But to answer you question..other than those here, how
>> would the average ham know you advanced by your first CW contact??

>Well, they'd probably recognize the 2x2 callsign I hope to have in a
>few days as coming from an Advanced licensee. That'll seem rather odd

2x2 calls aren't reserved for Advanced folks. I'm a General, and I'm
KH2PZ. In fact, Pacific area Technicians even get 2x2 calls, too.
It's all because of that mandatory "H" in the prefix.

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: 17 Dec 1996 02:23:42 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>>   So - I got my tech+ 4 weeks ago, just upgraded to Advanced, and
>> figured I'd go for Extra fairly soon (passed the written already).
>> Unfortunately, I have no HF rig and have never conducted a CW
>> QSO. I'd sure like to, though. While I can *receive* code fast
>> enough to pass the 13 wpm test, I'm sure that, when I first touch
>> a key, I'll be totally "ham-fisted". Does this mean I'll be
>> ignored by the upper ranks simply because I advanced before I'd
>> worked code?

My experience been as this guy who says he ignores those with 'bad fist'
is a small minority.  I find raising another live human on CW consistently
easier than I do on VHF or UHF FM in the SF area or on SSB.  Though Santa
is sending me a new amplifier, so maybe when I go up to 600 watts I'll have
better luck on SSB.

I've seen this written down anywhere, but it seems to me that 100 W output
just doesn't cut it on 80/40/20 meter SSB.

Also, lately, I've actually
found some groups on 80M where I wasn't either ignored or verbally abused.
Has HF been toning down a bit lately?   It doesn't seem all as bad as I
remember or as people complain here.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:01 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 00:49:36 GMT
Lines: 24
Sender: [e-mail]

Robert Lyons ([e-mail]) wrote:
: A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
: novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
: general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.

:   So - I got my tech+ 4 weeks ago, just upgraded to Advanced, and
: figured I'd go for Extra fairly soon (passed the written already).
: Unfortunately, I have no HF rig and have never conducted a CW
: QSO. I'd sure like to, though. While I can *receive* code fast
: enough to pass the 13 wpm test, I'm sure that, when I first touch
: a key, I'll be totally "ham-fisted". Does this mean I'll be
: ignored by the upper ranks simply because I advanced before I'd
: worked code?

Unless you get a vanity callsign, your place in the sequential callsign
system is a pretty good clue to your longevity in the hobby.  My KF6 prefix
dates back to 1988; today's Advanced-class callsigns in California are KQ6s.

If I had requested a callsign change when we first moved to California in
1975, it would have been a WB6 prefix.  Similarly, if I had kept up with
things and requested the change in (1978, I think??) I would have a KB6
prefix.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:01 1996
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From: Dana Yeomans <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 20:21:49 -0500
Organization: Intergate, Inc.
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: intergate.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

i tell you what i would do, i would start in the novice bands, until you
get comtufbolue can't spell. with your key and have a good fist. take care
from n4pge in griffin georgia.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 14:09:37 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv14.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
> novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
> general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.
>
>   So - I got my tech+ 4 weeks ago, just upgraded to Advanced, and
> figured I'd go for Extra fairly soon (passed the written already).
> Unfortunately, I have no HF rig and have never conducted a CW
> QSO. I'd sure like to, though. While I can *receive* code fast
> enough to pass the 13 wpm test, I'm sure that, when I first touch
> a key, I'll be totally "ham-fisted". Does this mean I'll be
> ignored by the upper ranks simply because I advanced before I'd
> worked code?
>
> I'd like to suggest to you more experienced CW operators that
> there are many paths to competence, but all of 'em start at slow
> CW speeds. I may have more than the usual electronics theory
> under my belt than the typical beginner, and maybe I whacked my
> way through the tapes to pass the 13 wpm code, but cut me some
> slack. I'll still need patience when I first try my hand at CW.
>
> (Of course, I plan to start on the novice bands with the usual
> novice power limitations. When I find the cash for an HF rig.)
>
> Bob Lyons
> KC8FGZ/AA
>
1st Congrats for your dedication and hard work.  Enjpy all that your
license holds.  But to answer you question..other than those here, how
would the average ham know you advanced by your first CW contact??
Spelling mistakes??? speed??  There are quite a few operators, as has
been mentioned, that use their key for nothing other than a paperweight
after passing the test.  If you're nervous about your first contact, let
me know and I'll be happy to sked with you.  I am sure that there are
many many others willing to do the honors as well.

Good luck Bob Lyons and WELL DONE

BTW as to your subject..NEVER EVER EVER is advancement (in anything) a
mistake if hard work and effort is put into it.  (excluding illegal
activities of course)
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:03 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Robert Lyons ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Sure, I'll be nervous on my first contact, but I recognize how helpful
: most people in amateur radio really are. My posting really was directed
: at the original poster (the unknown guy who disdained CW-illiterate
: Advanced licensees), to remind him that he needs to encourage us, not
: avoid us.

Oops!  That may have been me; sorry!  I meant no insult, and certainly don't
want to discourage you.

And, BTW, congratulations on the upgrade.  Be happy to work you if I hear
you on the bands.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:05 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
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cathryn ([e-mail]) wrote:

: My experience been as this guy who says he ignores those with 'bad fist'
: is a small minority.  I find raising another live human on CW consistently
: easier than I do on VHF or UHF FM in the SF area or on SSB.  Though Santa
: is sending me a new amplifier, so maybe when I go up to 600 watts I'll have
: better luck on SSB.

That surprises me; I would think there would be all sorts of hams on VHF
SSB, at least, in the Bay Area.  I know how active it is here in the LA
area.

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:06 1996
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From: Bill Wyatt <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:13:39 +0000
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Robert Lyons wrote:
>
> A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
> novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
> general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.
>
Stuff cut out.......
>
> Bob Lyons
> KC8FGZ/AA

Bob,

I think the many postings you have seen to you message reflects the
feelings of most of the ham world.

Congrats...on the upgrade and don't be afraid to get on the cw bands.  I
can assure you there will be many many hams to talk with........

73's

"Ham-fisted_extra"

Bill  N5WO  (yes it's a vanity)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:06 1996
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From: "Kevin C. Potter" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: 17 Dec 1996 18:14:25 GMT
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Robert,

This is a 'mistake' that a lot of the posters here would like to have!

As an advanced or an extra you'll have access to do just about any ham
priviledge you want.  Just do what you're comfortable doing.

BTW, most novices would be thrilled with you progression, if you told
them.

KP




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:07 1996
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From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: 19 Dec 1996 04:50:32 GMT
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>That surprises me; I would think there would be all sorts of hams on VHF
>SSB, at least, in the Bay Area.  I know how active it is here in the LA
>area.

Ooops.  My message wasn't clear.  I meant SSB on 80/40 meters with 100 watts.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:08 1996
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From: Robert Lyons <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 15:21:50 -0400
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Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
>
> >
> 1st Congrats for your dedication and hard work.

Thanks, Steve. :)

> But to answer you question..other than those here, how
> would the average ham know you advanced by your first CW contact??

Well, they'd probably recognize the 2x2 callsign I hope to have in a
few days as coming from an Advanced licensee. That'll seem rather odd
in conjunction with the keying and spelling mistakes. :)

> If you're nervous about your first contact, let
> me know and I'll be happy to sked with you.  I am sure that there are
> many many others willing to do the honors as well.

Sure, I'll be nervous on my first contact, but I recognize how helpful
most people in amateur radio really are. My posting really was directed
at the original poster (the unknown guy who disdained CW-illiterate
Advanced licensees), to remind him that he needs to encourage us, not
avoid us.

Bob Lyons
KC8FGZ (for now, at least. :)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:09 1996
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From: Jim Conn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 19:36:29 -0800
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Bill Wyatt wrote:
>
> Robert Lyons wrote:
> >
> > A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
> > novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
> > general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.
> >
> Stuff cut out.......
> >
> > Bob Lyons
> > KC8FGZ/AA
>
> Bob,
>
> I think the many postings you have seen to you message reflects the
> feelings of most of the ham world.
>
> Congrats...on the upgrade and don't be afraid to get on the cw bands.  I
> can assure you there will be many many hams to talk with........
>
> 73's
>
> "Ham-fisted_extra"
>
> Bill  N5WO  (yes it's a vanity)

Hi Bob,

CW ops are the most polite hams around, always willing to lend a hand, or
work other ops. If someone sends too fast for you, tell them to QRS.
Congrats on the upgrade, OM.

73,

Jim - AD4VL




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:11 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 15:31:06 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> > But to answer you question..other than those here, how
> > would the average ham know you advanced by your first CW contact??
>
> Well, they'd probably recognize the 2x2 callsign I hope to have in a
> few days as coming from an Advanced licensee. That'll seem rather odd
> in conjunction with the keying and spelling mistakes. :)

Ah see...the call only shows your license class, not the fact you've
never made any CW contacts.  And spelling misteaks?? goes with the
territory.


>
> > If you're nervous about your first contact, let
> > me know and I'll be happy to sked with you.  I am sure that there are
> > many many others willing to do the honors as well.
>
> Sure, I'll be nervous on my first contact, but I recognize how helpful
> most people in amateur radio really are. My posting really was directed
> at the original poster (the unknown guy who disdained CW-illiterate
> Advanced licensees), to remind him that he needs to encourage us, not
> avoid us.

Well, if that's the case, just ignore him/her/it.   As you said, there
are plenty of others.  Try this...go to the novice bands (although
someone has stated that they are not HF) and beep away there.  Get your
confidence.  learn to walk, then progress upward

Most of all, despite all thats posted here (and I do and get my share of
charbroiling..have fun..it;s a great HOBBY.  something for everyone, even
WA6VSE

Have a happy
>
> Bob Lyons
> KC8FGZ (for now, at least. :)


--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:12 1996
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From: Bill Parrish <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 10:02:12 -0800
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Robert Lyons wrote:
>
> A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
> novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
> general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.
>
>   So - I got my tech+ 4 weeks ago, just upgraded to Advanced, and
> figured I'd go for Extra fairly soon (passed the written already).
> Unfortunately, I have no HF rig and have never conducted a CW
> QSO. I'd sure like to, though. While I can *receive* code fast
> enough to pass the 13 wpm test, I'm sure that, when I first touch
> a key, I'll be totally "ham-fisted". Does this mean I'll be
> ignored by the upper ranks simply because I advanced before I'd
> worked code?
>
> I'd like to suggest to you more experienced CW operators that
> there are many paths to competence, but all of 'em start at slow
> CW speeds. I may have more than the usual electronics theory
> under my belt than the typical beginner, and maybe I whacked my
> way through the tapes to pass the 13 wpm code, but cut me some
> slack. I'll still need patience when I first try my hand at CW.
>
> (Of course, I plan to start on the novice bands with the usual
> novice power limitations. When I find the cash for an HF rig.)
>
> Bob Lyons
> KC8FGZ/AA

Something you might try is to get with someone local (if you've got a
club or
something...) that you can talk to maybe
on VHF at the same time... and just practice on the air... maybe when
the HF
band is closed down so that you don't have too much interference.  I was
remembering my wife's first CW qso with one of the guys in the club (I
heard
him calling CQ rather hesitently on 10M, and suggested my wife answer
him)... they
fumbled around on CW for a while, and then got onto the local repeater
("PSE QSY to 145.43") and talked/laughed about the whole thing...
I think it was his first CW also.  Also, do a lot of listening... it
helps
to learn the current jargon and shortcuts being used.

Cheers, and have fun.  If you can build up some CW skill by field day,
you can really have some fun there.

Bill Parrish/KM6KV


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:13 1996
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From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: 21 Dec 1996 06:52:55 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 10
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>CW ops are the most polite hams around, always willing to lend a hand, or
>work other ops. If someone sends too fast for you, tell them to QRS.
>Congrats on the upgrade, OM.
>

If you transmit at a really slow speed on the extra portion of the CW
bands, most people will just figure you're working JA.  I've had a bunch
of these QSO's where the JA sends really fast.  I get nothing back until
I slow down my code speed to like 5wpm or something.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:15 1996
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From: Megan Quattrocchi <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 01:20:30 -0800
Organization: CGS Testing.com
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> A case-book example for an MBA couse in stategic marketing I suspect.
> Could it be that AEA hung its hat on the aged PK-232 product line for
> too long?  Quite honesly, there hasn't been a single product of their
> that I have ever considered purchasing.  All their multimode TNC are
> far too large for my desktop.  I've never been able to get past that
> barrier.

My impression is that most of the problem is with the DSP-2232 and it's
relatives.
That it seems from what I hear is that AEA never really pulled together
the
software for these boxes.   Personally, I think going to a DSP based
system
was the right move -- and would support all the high speed modes that
people
need.  The problem is that the software quality just didn't come
together.  And the reason for that?  Well, only those over there can
really say.  AEA never came out with any other high speed packet boxes
since the DSP box would supposedly support those modes.  But since the
DSP boxes were always screwy customers went to other products.

It's a sofware project from hell situation.  These are pretty common in
the computer business.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:18 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: AEA - Closing it's doors
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 17:15:26 GMT
Lines: 68

In article <[e-mail]> Daniel Clark <[e-mail]> writes:
>Gary Coffman wrote:
>> If you want one answer why AEA folded, it could be their reluctance
>> to bring out faster equipment. They were offered a non-exclusive
>> license to produce 56 kb equipment *10 years ago*, but refused.
>> They wanted to milk the low speed market for all it was worth first.
>> In retrospect, that was a serious error because it let the landline
>> modems hams also use far outstrip what they could buy from AEA for
>> use in amateur radio.
>
>A case-book example for an MBA couse in stategic marketing I suspect.
>Could it be that AEA hung its hat on the aged PK-232 product line for
>too long?  Quite honesly, there hasn't been a single product of their
>that I have ever considered purchasing.  All their multimode TNC are
>far too large for my desktop.  I've never been able to get past that
>barrier.

Too large? Mighty small desktop there I'd say. No room for a radio
either I guess. Seriously, I don't think the size of the product is
a major issue for most users. When I had one, I just stuck it under
the radio. It had some problems, and it is behind the times now, but
it was a good product in its time.

>Since this subject has surfaced on this and other threads, yours is
>the first to possibly place the fault squarely in the lap of AEA.
>Could it be that rather than economic conditions in the amateur
>market, AEA has failed to meet and exceed customer expectations?

That's what I think. For a company with "Advanced" in their name,
they failed to retain advanced technology leadership. And they didn't
aggressively price their products, a must in the amateur market.

>In the aftermath of AEA, consider a company like MFJ with its mediocre
>reputation for quality and service. Quality nothwithstanding, they have
>a wide product line, good value and even some unique products that I
>would like to own.

Their broad product line, and their very aggressive bottom line
pricing, has kept them a strong competitor in the marketplace.

>PacComm is a good example of a company that is known for
>innovation and high quality.  Are they in financial
>dire straits because of the so-called "declining amateur market?"

If anything, PacComm has been too aggressive. They're actually
overwhelmed with business, much of it non-amateur. That has tended
to result in long lags between an amateur product announcement
and actual shipping product because they haven't been able to
free up production lines quickly to make the new products.

>Thank God they've had the foresight to start working on a product
>that addresses the high demand for network speed.  I'll be the first
>in line to make a purchase.

Well get out the plastic and give them a call. They are shipping.
You don't need to get in a line. This is the WA4DSY (aka GRAPES)
RF modem that AEA was offered 10 years ago, and which GRAPES has
been selling in kit form since. WA4DSY recently repackaged it for
easier mass production and licensed it to PacComm, and they are
churning them out. You don't have to know how to solder to get
on 56 kb anymore.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (David A. Yanke)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AEA product repairs?
Date: 19 Dec 96 09:46:13 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

With the recent events at AEA, has anyone heard an update? Where can
we send products for repair?

Originally, AEA said we were to call the ARRL. They did this without
the ARRL's knowledge and now the ARRL does not answer any questions
regarding this.

I'm interested in out of warranty work, but I'm sure the people with
warranty product are in the same boat.

Dave
mailto:[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:19 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AEA2232 help needed
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 20:52:15 GMT
Organization: Unisource Espana NEWS SERVER
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59c9rt$3gv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: info514.jet.es
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Dear friends,

My AEA DSP 2232 doesn┤t   work right.
I┤m getting on the LCD of the TNC the following,
Packet
Packet
and both lights DCD and CMD are on.

On the screen of the computer appears the following message when i
communicate with the TNC,

cmd: 3d: DSP failed load software and sometimes cmd: 2d: DSP failed
load software.

I dont know if the Microchip Motorola 56001zl20 is doing wrong or some
statics on it or other.
How can I solve this problem..
AEA they say is in processof closing, so they can not help me.
Please some one do it.
Awaiting your kind comments, have my best.
E-mail me [e-mail]
Christian-Pedro EA2AFI
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Christian M. Hondeville Urrutibeheity

Particular de club 2                                  Phone:  [phone]
Las Arenas-48930                                      Fax:    [phone]
Spain-Espa±a                                          E-mail: [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:20 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AEA2232 help needed
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 19:08:03 GMT
Organization: Unisource Espana NEWS SERVER
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59eo40$hfu$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: info160.jet.es
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Dear friends,

My AEA DSP 2232 doesn┤t   work right.
I┤m getting on the LCD of the TNC the following,
Packet
Packet
and both lights DCD and CMD are on.

On the screen of the computer appears the following message when i
communicate with the TNC,

cmd: 3d: DSP failed load software and sometimes cmd: 2d: DSP failed
load software.

I dont know if the Microchip Motorola 56001zl20 is doing wrong or some
statics on it or other.
How can I solve this problem..
AEA they say is in processof closing, so they can not help me.
Please some one do it.
Awaiting your kind comments, have my best.
E-mail me [e-mail]
Christian-Pedro EA2AFI
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Christian M. Hondeville Urrutibeheity

Particular de club 2                                  Phone:  [phone]
Las Arenas-48930                                      Fax:    [phone]
Spain-Espa±a                                          E-mail: [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!feed1.news.erols.com!chi-news.cic.net!news.sba.com!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 12 Dec 1996 12:45:21 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58oup1$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]


Well, richard, or may I call him...DICK has obvioulsy been exposed to
something. He has probably exposed himself to one too many small woodland
creatures..........................
I wounder if this GEEK masturbates to QST.
Jeff
K7OP




:
:
: Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
: Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
: QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
: Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |
:


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 12 Dec 1996 22:17:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58qose$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.22.43 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Richard "DICK" Kendrick likes to stir up trouble where ever
>he can.  Just ignore him.

Gee, Johhny boy, just like you tried to do for six months in
alt.radio.scanner and rec.radio.scanner with your inane and
malicious attacks against Bill Cheek. Yeah, right. Just more
of your hypocritical bombast. Yawn.

Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 19:25:04 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

sean hall wrote:
> etcetera.
> Way too much RF exposure.   Way too much.


Richard "DICK" Kendrick likes to stir up trouble where ever
he can.  Just ignore him.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 11:37:47 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qose$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Richard Kendrick wrote:

> Gee, Johhny boy, just like you tried to do for six months in

Hey **DICK**, it was only three months. (only half as long as you said,
started July 20, ended in October)


> alt.radio.scanner and rec.radio.scanner with your inane and
> malicious attacks against Bill Cheek. Yeah, right. Just more

You know nothing of what you are talking (again, sigh)

DICK, you always like to get in on burning issues & make them
confrontational & keep the flames burning. I asked Cheek *FOUR* times
to take a truce until he finally agreed.  Then you jumped in trying
to stir things up again.

Go back to your fury animals.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 13 Dec 1996 19:26:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58t37q$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qose$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.144 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>You know nothing of what you are talking (again, sigh)

Oh yes, that's right your loathsomeness, I forgot, you are omniscient
and know everything.

>DICK, you always like to get in on burning issues & make them
>confrontational & keep the flames burning.

Got a match?

>I asked Cheek *FOUR* times to take a truce until he finally agreed.

He never agreed to anything. As usual, prevarications fall from your
lips like rain from the sky. You're still taking outdated Ritalin, eh
Johhny boy?

>Then you jumped in trying to stir things up again.

Actually, shaken, not stirred.

>Go back to your fury animals.

You would know better than I.


Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.74.114.90!news.genuity.net!news.silcom.com!news.west.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 14 Dec 1996 15:30:42 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58uh72$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: term1-14.vta.west.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; PPC)
To: [e-mail]
X-URL: news:58oup1$[e-mail]

I think a trip down Deja News is in order.  Look under John Mackey,
rec.radio.scanner.

Also, look under any other name you'd like.

It's a real eye opener.

KP




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!homer.alpha.net!uwm.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.rain.net!nntp0.teleport.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Larry R. Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 15 Dec 1996 01:28:03 GMT
Organization: Teleport - Portland's Public Access [phone]
Lines: 27
Distribution: na
Message-ID: <58vk73$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: linda.teleport.com


Richard Kendrick <[e-mail]) wrote:

AND WROTE AND WROTE AND WROTE
> Oh yes, tha'ts right your loathsomeness, I forgot, you are omniscient and
know everything.


Blake Bowers <[e-mail]> wrote:

MORE OF THE SAME KIND OF DRIVEL  (again.)
----------------------------------------------------------------------

John - what do you do to get such an avid bunch of fans? Where they'll write
stories and poetry about you, spend hours dreaming all this stuff up and
sitting in front of the keyboard for hours expounding on your virtues?
If I only had their free time, maybe I could learn to worship too, like
they do.

ALL HAIL!   ALL HAIL!    ALL HAIL!

Now we just need to get the buffoon and Bert to join in. You could start
your own Church!

--
Larry Johnson - Portland, OR - [phone] home, [phone] work
Ham Radio: K7LJ - 145.39 K7LJ/RPT, 443.400 , 29.6 FM


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.94.215.18!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 08:44:09 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58thpv$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qose$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Richard Kendrick wrote:

>> Gee, Johhny boy, just like you tried to do for six months in

>Hey **DICK**, it was only three months. (only half as long as you said,
>started July 20, ended in October)

Add that to the time on FIDO that you harrassed people.  Your history
is clear.  Even now, when you are making false claims about me being
booted from a echo.  Your bullshit shines through.


>> alt.radio.scanner and rec.radio.scanner with your inane and
>> malicious attacks against Bill Cheek. Yeah, right. Just more

>You know nothing of what you are talking (again, sigh)

Actually, he has a pretty good handle on it.

>DICK, you always like to get in on burning issues & make them
>confrontational & keep the flames burning. I asked Cheek *FOUR* times
>to take a truce until he finally agreed.  Then you jumped in trying
>to stir things up again.

No, you lie again.  The only reason you ended it, is you finally
realized you were outclassed, outmatched, and to sum it up, a Moron.

Your "credentials" were uncovered as crap, your history was pulled to
the forefront, and you did what you did best, you ran with your tail
tucked between your legs, like the yellow dog that you are.

Now, you come over to this newsgroup, to try to spread hate and
discontent here.  Hopefully enough people know you now, to stop it
before you destroy this group.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 15 Dec 1996 21:08:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <592hv1$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.22.54 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Kevin Potter <[e-mail]> wrote:

>He's already got his own club.  Look at the callsign kc7tae on qrz.com.

Actually, he's involved with two "clubs." This information comes from
qrz.com. Interesting choice of club names.


KC7TAE        JOHN MACKEY RADIO CLUB       LIC ISU 17-OCT-1996
CLUB            P. O. BOX 1586                              LIC EXP17-OCT-2006
                     BEAVERTON OR  97075-1586       LST UPD 17-OCT-1996
KA0SSF       MACKEY JR, JOHN E                        IS RESPONSIBLE


KC7SWS      PHANTOMS AMATEUR RADIO GROUP      LIC ISU  8-OCT-1996
CLUB           3315 SE 39TH                                    LIC EXP8-OCT-20
06
                    PORTLAND OR  97202                       LST UPD  8-OCT-19
96
KA0SSF      MACKEY JR, JOHN E                          IS RESPONSIBLE



Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 07:38:01 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv26.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58vk73$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> ALL HAIL!   ALL HAIL!    ALL HAIL!
>
> Now we just need to get the buffoon and Bert to join in. You could start
> your own Church!

Well there's the 1st church of the gooey death and discount house of
worship in the belt buckle of the bible belt..Delreo, TX

There's the 3rd church of Lennie and Carl..no tithing neede, no morse
code needed..just an overly upstanding opinion of ones accomplishments


>
> --
> Larry Johnson - Portland, OR - [phone] home, [phone] work
> Ham Radio: K7LJ - 145.39 K7LJ/RPT, 443.400 , 29.6 FM
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 12:01:34 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Kevin Potter wrote:
> He's already got his own club.  Look at the callsign kc7tae on qrz.com.

My next plan is that when the FCC opens up the VEC program again
I will become a VEC like W5YI is now!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:32:21 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qose$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t37q$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Richard Kendrick wrote:

> Oh yes, that's right your loathsomeness, I forgot, you are omniscient
> and know everything.

That's right, & don't you forget it.


> >DICK, you always keep the flames burning.
> Got a match?

I would think you have your own supply given the flamming & spamming you
do across the web.


> >I asked Cheek *FOUR* times to take a truce until he finally agreed.
> He never agreed to anything. As usual, prevarications fall from your
> lips like rain from the sky.

As typical you don't know what you are talking about & are preaching
from
your pathetically distorted view of the world.  Bill *DID* upon the
fourth offering finally accept a truce & that is how the situation
was resolved.



> >Go back to your fury animals.
> You would know better than I.

I am only referring to the ALREADY ESTABLISHED FACT of YOUR PREFERENCE
for FURY ANIMALS.


> Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
> Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
> QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
> Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |

How ridiculous to put all this EGO CRAP about yourself on EVERY
message.  Do you really feel that bad about yourself that on every
tagline you must tell prople this about yourself every time.
Actually, it is bullshit because most of us have all the
stuff you are listing above.

You almost sound like Blake Bowers, the biggest spammer on FIdonet.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!207.17.118.2!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:14:46 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <597cem$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:


>> I think a trip down Deja News is in order.  Look under John Mackey,
>> rec.radio.scanner.
>> Also, look under any other name you'd like.
>> It's a real eye opener.

>Yes Kevin, & thank you.  I have often been proud of the way that
>situation turned out in Rec.radio.scanner.  We had a situation
>there where an individual was getting quite out of hand on that
>NG & had already ruined another NG (actually Echo) on Fidonet.

>SEVERAL of us finally took action to convince this individual
>to change.  While a few of the originals dropped out, a hand full
>of us remained at task to flush this troubled individual of our
>midsts.  Fortunately, the individual stopped his harassing style
>& now (after nearly 3 months) the NG is again a pleasant place
>to be.


Many of us are proud of how it has turned out.  You are no longer
posting there.  We do appreciate it!

(At least, you don't post under your real name)




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.u.washington.edu!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:29:15 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <597d9q$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:



>my equal (hahaahahhaahha).  As you list above, Blake Bowers is a good
>example of that.  He has already been kicked off of one Fido echo
>(temporarily)
>for attempting to harass me during a moderator election (I still ended
>up
>becoming a member of the moderator staff regardless of Blake).  Only a
>week
>ago, he was warned on another echo for the same type of thing.
John, what echo?

For that matter, what echo are you the e-listed moderator, or
co-moderator for?

You stated that Marge booted me off the echo, she disagrees.

She has asked for copies of your posts that make that claim, as she
does not like being accused of things that she did not do.

>>I think I like the term "Father Mackey" or "Reverand Mackey",
>"Vicar Mackey" even has a cool European sound to it!!

But Johnboy, you already have the title of MORON!





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!news.webIT.eds.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:55:12 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Kevin Potter wrote:

> I think a trip down Deja News is in order.  Look under John Mackey,
> rec.radio.scanner.
> Also, look under any other name you'd like.
> It's a real eye opener.

Yes Kevin, & thank you.  I have often been proud of the way that
situation turned out in Rec.radio.scanner.  We had a situation
there where an individual was getting quite out of hand on that
NG & had already ruined another NG (actually Echo) on Fidonet.

SEVERAL of us finally took action to convince this individual
to change.  While a few of the originals dropped out, a hand full
of us remained at task to flush this troubled individual of our
midsts.  Fortunately, the individual stopped his harassing style
& now (after nearly 3 months) the NG is again a pleasant place
to be.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!psinntp!psinntp!atlas.jcpenney.com![e-mail]
From: Joe Hansen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 14:20:54 -0800
Organization: Hansen Family
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
>
> In article <58vk73$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> >
> > ALL HAIL!   ALL HAIL!    ALL HAIL!
> >
> > Now we just need to get the buffoon and Bert to join in. You could start
> > your own Church!
>
> Well there's the 1st church of the gooey death and discount house of
> worship in the belt buckle of the bible belt..Delreo, TX
>
> There's the 3rd church of Lennie and Carl..no tithing neede, no morse
> code needed..just an overly upstanding opinion of ones accomplishments
>
> >
> > --
> > Larry Johnson - Portland, OR - [phone] home, [phone] work
> > Ham Radio: K7LJ - 145.39 K7LJ/RPT, 443.400 , 29.6 FM
> >
>
> --
> Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
> ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:38 1996
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From: Joe Hansen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 14:20:27 -0800
Organization: Hansen Family
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Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:

> In article <58vk73$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> >
> > ALL HAIL!   ALL HAIL!    ALL HAIL!
> >
> There's the 3rd church of Lennie and Carl..no tithing neede, no morse
> code needed..just an overly upstanding opinion of ones accomplishments


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:39 1996
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 13:01:48 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Larry R. Johnson wrote:

> > Blake Bowers <[e-mail]> wrote:
> > MORE OF THE SAME KIND OF DRIVEL  (again.)
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------

> John - what do you do to get such an avid bunch of fans? Where they'll write
> stories and poetry about you, spend hours dreaming all this stuff up and
> sitting in front of the keyboard for hours expounding on your virtues?

With all the virtues I have, it would take hours!!!

Hi Larry.  Yea, where ever I go I always have a following that is VERY
anxious to be with me & follow me, try to be like me, & want to please
me.
But there is always one or two bad apples in every barrel.  :(   I get
people
who follow (like all the others) but, apparently due to jealousy, want
to
do unpleasant acts in a desperate & feeble attempt to make them
selves look better.  They some how think they are going to make
themselves
my equal (hahaahahhaahha).  As you list above, Blake Bowers is a good
example of that.  He has already been kicked off of one Fido echo
(temporarily)
for attempting to harass me during a moderator election (I still ended
up
becoming a member of the moderator staff regardless of Blake).  Only a
week
ago, he was warned on another echo for the same type of thing.

But actually, there has been many *FUNNY* instances come up from my
dedicated bunch of fans & followers.  Specifically, the stories &
poetry that my followers make about me has been of great amusement to
myself & many others.  Dick Kendrick has written a couple of funny
stories which we plan to list on the PARG ham radio club web page, if
Dick gives his preferences.

(I guess it depends on how much of a DICK he is, hahahaahahhahaahaha)


> If I only had their free time, maybe I could learn to worship too, like
> they do.

Unfortunately, I am FAR to busy to do those types of things just like
you are.  Apparently, people like Blake & Dick Kendrick have bunches &
bunches of time available to do these types of things!!!!



> ALL HAIL!   ALL HAIL!    ALL HAIL!
>
> Now we just need to get the buffoon and Bert to join in. You could start
> your own Church!

HEY!!!!!  That's a good idea!!!!  I could get a MASSIVE tax break
provided to me by my loyal followers!!

I think I like the term "Father Mackey" or "Reverand Mackey",
"Vicar Mackey" even has a cool European sound to it!!

I could perform wedding ceremonies & blessed sacraments!


Bless you and may Peace be with you, My Son.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:16:53 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <597cik$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Richard Kendrick wrote:

>> Oh yes, that's right your loathsomeness, I forgot, you are omniscient
>> and know everything.

>That's right, & don't you forget it.

I think this, and your very own HAM club, sort of explains it all.


>> >I asked Cheek *FOUR* times to take a truce until he finally agreed.
>> He never agreed to anything. As usual, prevarications fall from your
>> lips like rain from the sky.

>As typical you don't know what you are talking about & are preaching
>from
>your pathetically distorted view of the world.  Bill *DID* upon the
>fourth offering finally accept a truce & that is how the situation
>was resolved.

No, the situation was finally resolved when you shut up.  Your so
called credentials were exposed, and you finally laid down, and shut
up.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:43 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 23:25:11 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 5
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
> My next plan is that when the FCC opens up the VEC program again
> I will become a VEC like W5YI is now!
not if we can help it!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:45 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 23:23:42 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
>
> Yes Kevin, & thank you.  I have often been proud of the way that
> situation turned out in Rec.radio.scanner.  We had a situation
> there where an individual was getting quite out of hand on that
> NG & had already ruined another NG (actually Echo) on Fidonet.
>
> SEVERAL of us finally took action to convince this individual
> to change.  While a few of the originals dropped out, a hand full
> of us remained at task to flush this troubled individual of our
> midsts.  Fortunately, the individual stopped his harassing style
> & now (after nearly 3 months) the NG is again a pleasant place
> to be.
Talking about yourself, again?!?!?!

Yes, it was you that was disrupting that newsgroup. it was YOU that got
banned from a fidonet echo AND it was you that finally shut up and let
things rest a bit. the problems went away when you did, John-boy. So, go
away!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:47 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 14:28:38 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <598ne9$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Eric Oyen <[e-mail]> wrote:


>> Yes Kevin, & thank you.  I have often been proud of the way that
>> situation turned out in Rec.radio.scanner.  We had a situation
>> there where an individual was getting quite out of hand on that
>> NG & had already ruined another NG (actually Echo) on Fidonet.
>>
>> SEVERAL of us finally took action to convince this individual
>> to change.  While a few of the originals dropped out, a hand full
>> of us remained at task to flush this troubled individual of our
>> midsts.  Fortunately, the individual stopped his harassing style
>> & now (after nearly 3 months) the NG is again a pleasant place
>> to be.
>Talking about yourself, again?!?!?!

>Yes, it was you that was disrupting that newsgroup. it was YOU that got
>banned from a fidonet echo AND it was you that finally shut up and let
>things rest a bit. the problems went away when you did, John-boy. So, go
>away!

Hi Eric.  Long time no type.

It is amazing how his memory is, SEVERAL people took action to get rid
of him, and somehow he thinks he was part of the side getting rid of
him?

I wonder if he slaps himself when he is being stupid?  Of course, that
would be a continous thing....

Amazing.

As you know, all anyone has to do to see what really happened, and
what a ass Johnboy is, is to take a trip to DEJANEWS.

Amazing!




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:48 1996
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 12:39:14 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
> > My next plan is that when the FCC opens up the VEC program again
> > I will become a VEC like W5YI is now!

> not if we can help it!

hahahahahahahahahaheheheehhehohohohohoho

oh GOD that was FUNNY.

Do you really have such an INFLATED view of yourself that you
really think a little technician- wet behind the ears ham- could
block a VEC program?

You are not even eligable to be a VE, not even close!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:49 1996
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From: "Kevin C. Potter" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 18 Dec 1996 22:39:04 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <599rq8$[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]
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Oh now, John,  you were more civil yesterday.  I don't believe Eric has
a problem with his license.  I don't.  I don't think you should, either.

I have not seen any postings by Eric complaining that he is 'only a
tech'.  His license obviously suits his needs.

Just like your 7 repeaters & your multiple licenses suit you.

To each their own.

KP




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:50 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 18 Dec 1996 21:15:04 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <59afg8$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.236 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>With all the virtues I have, it would take hours!!!

More like milliseconds.

>Hi Larry.  Yea, where ever I go I always have a following that is VERY
>anxious to be with me & follow me, try to be like me, & want to please
>me.

Yeah, King Mackey and his court of sycophants.

>But there is always one or two bad apples in every barrel.  :(   I get
>people
>who follow (like all the others) but, apparently due to jealousy, want
>to
>do unpleasant acts in a desperate & feeble attempt to make them
>selves look better.  They some how think they are going to make
>themselves

If one wants to shine, all he has to do is stand next to you Johnnie boy.

>But actually, there has been many *FUNNY* instances come up from my
>dedicated bunch of fans & followers.  Specifically, the stories &
>poetry that my followers make about me has been of great amusement to
>myself & many others.

Your schizophrenia is showing again.

>> If I only had their free time, maybe I could learn to worship too, like
>> they do.

Delusions of grandeur are side effects of exipred ritalin Johnnie boy.
How many times do I have to caution you about your medication.
You're such a bratty child.

>Unfortunately, I am FAR to busy to do those types of things just like
>you are.  Apparently, people like Blake & Dick Kendrick have bunches &
>bunches of time available to do these types of things!!!!

No, just superior and creative minds.

>> ALL HAIL!   ALL HAIL!    ALL HAIL!
>>
>> Now we just need to get the buffoon and Bert to join in. You could start
>> your own Church!

>HEY!!!!!  That's a good idea!!!!  I could get a MASSIVE tax break
>provided to me by my loyal followers!!

>I think I like the term "Father Mackey" or "Reverand Mackey",
>"Vicar Mackey" even has a cool European sound to it!!

>I could perform wedding ceremonies & blessed sacraments!


>Bless you and may Peace be with you, My Son.

Yes, the papal blessing really applies to you Johnnie boy,
"This boy reeks."

Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:51 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 01:28:32 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Kevin C. Potter wrote:
>
> Oh now, John,  you were more civil yesterday.  I don't believe Eric has
> a problem with his license.  I don't.  I don't think you should, either.
>
> I have not seen any postings by Eric complaining that he is 'only a
> tech'.  His license obviously suits his needs.
>
> Just like your 7 repeaters & your multiple licenses suit you.
>
> To each their own.
>
> KP
Good point. I hadn't thought of that one... :)
Besides, who needs all those fancy pieces of paper (all they do is
clutter
up the wall).  :)

However, for those of you who would like to see me advance...

I will be attempting to get the code out of the way in January.

I am keeping my fingers crossed.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:52 1996
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 11:21:58 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> Yes, it was you that was disrupting that newsgroup. it was YOU that got
> banned from a fidonet echo AND it was you that finally shut up and let
> things rest a bit. the problems went away when you did,

Hardly.

If you remember (you seem to never want to look at the facts) there were
*SEVERAL* of us that took the individual to task for his behavior.

Regarding the banning from the Fidonet echo, I am PROUD to be one of the
people who was banned from that echo as the moderator kicked out
anyone who was not an ass kisser.  I understand that this was before
your time, but in those days we were getting about 40-50 messages a day
on that ehco.  After that moderator took over & kicked off everyone
of quality because they wouldn't kiss ass.  Now that echo gets about
5-10 messages a day - and every time I review that echo the quality
is crap.  So I never bother to read or post there anymore (under my
assumed name I acquired).


BTW- Since the individual backed off, we then backed off too
for the NG.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 18 Dec 1996 21:16:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <59afi1$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597d9q$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.236 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Blake Bowers) wrote:

>John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>I think I like the term "Father Mackey" or "Reverand Mackey",
>>"Vicar Mackey" even has a cool European sound to it!!

>But Johnboy, you already have the title of MORON!

He's already Supreme Grandmaster Fool of the Universe.



Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:55 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 01:25:52 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
>
> > John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
> > > My next plan is that when the FCC opens up the VEC program again
> > > I will become a VEC like W5YI is now!
>
> > not if we can help it!
>
> hahahahahahahahahaheheheehhehohohohohoho
>
> oh GOD that was FUNNY.
>
> Do you really have such an INFLATED view of yourself that you
> really think a little technician- wet behind the ears ham- could
> block a VEC program?
>
> You are not even eligable to be a VE, not even close!
You have no real idea of what I can (or can't) do, John.
Perhaps you should look in the fcc.gov website under
their newsletter. Look up NAL's issued and NOV's issued
and key that to Phoenix. you will see what I can
do! Read the part about Tim Hoffman getting caught using my
call and the fact he got issued a %6000.00 notice of
apparent liability. Then, think on your statement.

There are plenty of others in here who are aware of what
happened and how is was taken care of. I think a few well placed
comments to the right people will keep a dangerous idiot
like you out of the VEC.

Basically, the smartest thing you can do right now is close your
mouth and start listening. I don't post much in here, and usually,
I have no reason to (unless I am asking a question).  So, why
don't you take your drvel and go somewhere else?

Rgds,

Eric J. Oyen, Esquire.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 18 Dec 1996 21:04:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59aeri$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.236 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>My next plan is that when the FCC opens up the VEC program again
>I will become a VEC like W5YI is now!

Amateur radio licenses for sale! Contact John Mackey for details
and prices!

Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 10:57:56 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> You have no real idea of what I can (or can't) do, John.

Apparently you don't either.


> Perhaps you should look in the fcc.gov website under
> their newsletter. Look up NAL's issued and NOV's issued
> and key that to Phoenix. you will see what I can
> do! Read the part about Tim Hoffman getting caught using my
> call and the fact he got issued a %6000.00 notice of

Yea right I'll remember that "%6000.00" thing the next time
I am in Phoenix.  Funny, the last time I was in Phoenix
I didn't hear anything of you.  The only thing I heard was
a lot of guys working the 10 meter FM remote on the 146.96
repeater & some cactus activity on UHF.  HRO was a cool place to
visit though.


> There are plenty of others in here who are aware of what
> happened and how is was taken care of. I think a few well placed
> comments to the right people will keep a dangerous idiot
> like you out of the VEC.

Really!!!!  I have BAD news for you, I AM ALREADY A MEMBER OF *TWO*
VEC PROGRAMS for 6 years!!!!!!!!!!  I am one of the most ACTIVE VE's in
the Northwest United States!!!  So what could you possible use
to keep a "dangerous" person like out of the VEC program when I
have already proven myself with a six year spotless track record
of VE experience.  What "danger" has there been?


> Basically, the smartest thing you can do right now is close your
> mouth and start listening. I don't post much in here, and usually,

Then please go back to your usual mode of operations.

I notice you signed your name as "esquire".  Personally I
don't care wether you own land, are an attorney, or are a homeless
bum.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:04:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 11:16:14 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> You have no real idea of what I can (or can't) do, John.
> Perhaps you should look in the fcc.gov website under
> their newsletter. Look up NAL's issued and NOV's issued
> and key that to Phoenix. you will see what I can
> do! Read the part about Tim Hoffman getting caught using my
> call and the fact he got issued a %6000.00 notice of
> apparent liability. Then, think on your statement.

You should talk!  You have no idea either.  I, as a member
of the Phantom's Amateur Radio Group, was involved in
Bobby Aguero getting caught causing interference to
a local police department.  The situation is now in court
process.  Perhaps you should review The ARRL Letter or
Amateur Radio Newsline to see more about this.

My involvement does not give me any more powers, as
neither does yours.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!homer.alpha.net!uwm.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 12:01:03 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen ([e-mail]) wrote:
> :
> :
> : However, for those of you who would like to see me advance...
>
> Advance to another newsgroup... Don't pass Go, don't collect $200.
>
> :
> : I will be attempting to get the code out of the way in January.
> :
> Out of the way? No wonder you're still a tech with an attitude like that.
>
> : I am keeping my fingers crossed.
>
> You and everyone else... advance please, and take the flames with you.
>
> --
> ----
Whats the matter? You have nothing nice to say about me endeavors?

Perhaps you should look in the mirror before making such stupid
comments.

It wasn't my idea to have a flame war. however, since you seem so keen
on the point, why don't you check into the on-line archive of newsgroups
and see what mackey did to rec.radio.scanner for almost 8 months!

You might find that John Mackey is more of a problem than the rest of us
put together. If you get rid of him, all else falls into place.

ALso, I have been posting here (off and on) for 6 months now, and
nothing
I have done has caused any problems (until mackey showed up with his
assitude). When he is gone, I'll go back to reading postings and getting
questions answered.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.245.210.2!gasco!news.rain.net!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 19 Dec 1996 15:28:09 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <59bmu9$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

Eric Oyen ([e-mail]) wrote:
:
:
: However, for those of you who would like to see me advance...

Advance to another newsgroup... Don't pass Go, don't collect $200.

:
: I will be attempting to get the code out of the way in January.
:
Out of the way? No wonder you're still a tech with an attitude like that.

: I am keeping my fingers crossed.

You and everyone else... advance please, and take the flames with you.


--
----


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:02 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 10:33:18 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597d9q$[e-mail]> <59afi1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Richard Kendrick wrote:

> He's already Supreme Grandmaster of the Universe.

And don't you forget it DICK!!

BTW - we would like to list your little stories you made up
about my march thru scannerdom on our ham radio club web
page.  We have found them to be extremely funny & interesting.

Would you grant us this request?

The name of the Club is Phantom's Amateur Radio Group &
if we use your stories we will acknowledge you as the
author.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 11:07:03 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59afg8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Richard Kendrick wrote:

> If one wants to shine, all he has to do is stand next to you Johnnie boy.

Yea but you are so troubled that even all of greatness that rubs off
on you is not enough.


> Your schizophrenia is showing again.

I doubt you know the definition of schizophrenia without looking in a
book, you just like using big words.


> Delusions of grandeur are side effects of exipred ritalin Johnnie boy.
> How many times do I have to caution you about your medication.

You better go read your PDR or ask a nurse because you are wrong.
Perhaps
you Lithium should be checked?


> >Unfortunately, I am FAR to busy to do those types of things just like
> >you are.  Apparently, people like Blake & Dick Kendrick have bunches &
> >bunches of time available to do these types of things!!!!
>
> No, just superior and creative minds.

haahahahhahahahaha, only you in the area of comedy, as indicated by your
above statement.


> Yes, the papal blessing really applies to you Johnnie

Thanks Dick.

Son, you are troubled.
Bless you and may peace be with you, My son.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 11:10:26 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

> John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
> > Do you really have such an INFLATED view of yourself that you
> > really think a little technician- wet behind the ears ham-

My apologies Eric.  I thought you were a Technician class
operator.  Upon closer review of you license data I see that I
was in error.  You are only a CODELESS-TECHNICIAN!!!!!

You are still a wet behind the ears ham with an inflated view
of yourself.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 19:47:52 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Eric Oyen wrote:
> Yes, it was you that was disrupting that newsgroup.

Eric, I have the PERFECT solution for you. Create a kill file
for YOUR browser & put ME in it.

I did this with blake bowers in early October & it works GREAT!!!!!
(did it for both fidonet & internet)  Now Blake is the ONLY person
I have ever put in my "twit" filter, but it works quite well.

I never see an entry from the "twit". Tthe only thing that
occasionally violates the spirit of that action I set up is
when the "twit" make a big fuss (fool of himself) & other
users start to complain about the "twit" & forward messages
from said "twit" in their discussions.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!uhog.mit.edu!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 18:12:43 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59c2pu$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Kevin C. Potter wrote:
> So 'Joe',
> What is your callsign?  I don't see any 'Joe Hansen'!
> Thank you,
>   John, a, er, I mean 'Joe'.

Hey Kevvy,

If that is some pissy little attempt at me then you better
try again.  There are at least 2 Joseph Hansens with
FCC licenses.  Besides who says they need *ANY* license
to post, internet posting does not require a license.

IDIOT.

(that posting came from a different server than me too)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!uhog.mit.edu!news.sgi.com!enews.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 18:16:50 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:
> Besides, who needs all those fancy pieces of paper (all they do is
> clutter up the wall).

How would you know, YOU don't have fancy pieces of paper!

hahahahahahahahahahahaha


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:08 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 01:19:36 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
>
> > Yes, it was you that was disrupting that newsgroup. it was YOU that got
> > banned from a fidonet echo AND it was you that finally shut up and let
> > things rest a bit. the problems went away when you did,
>
> Hardly.
>
> If you remember (you seem to never want to look at the facts) there were
> *SEVERAL* of us that took the individual to task for his behavior.
Facts?!?!?!, How dare you use that word. You have no idea what facts
are.
I can dredge up all the postings that YOU did on rec.radio.scanner,
john.
there were a lot of them.It isn't that hard when someone out there on
the
web maintanes a very complete archive or postings for the last year!
I still say that you are in denial. so, I'll point out a few "facts" for
you:
1. the problems on rec.radio.scanner disappeared when YOU did.
2. you used derisive commentary and insulted others intellectual
capabilities
3. Your postings wer childish and arrogant
4. your memory (as often observed) is very selective
5. a lot of people posted extreme displeasure at having to read YOUR
drivel.

Are those enough for you?

>
> Regarding the banning from the Fidonet echo, I am PROUD to be one of the
> people who was banned from that echo as the moderator kicked out
> anyone who was not an ass kisser.  I understand that this was before
> your time, but in those days we were getting about 40-50 messages a day
> on that ehco.  After that moderator took over & kicked off everyone
> of quality because they wouldn't kiss ass.  Now that echo gets about
> 5-10 messages a day - and every time I review that echo the quality
> is crap.  So I never bother to read or post there anymore (under my
> assumed name I acquired).
You failed to mention that you disobeyed directives from the moderator
after several warnings (some of which were public). I was there,
remeber?
also, you must have been on a slow node, the number of messages did not
decrease.
AND, not that many people got kicked (as you claim). In point of fact,
you
failed to prove yopur case then, and you give no facts to back it up
now.

My point is: Go Away Mackey. you are a disruption that we neddn't have
to deal with.

>
> BTW- Since the individual backed off, we then backed off too
> for the NG.
WE?!?!? who is we (and don't tell me that YOU are royalty)?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 17:28:19 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <59eibj$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59c2pu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]
X-URL: news:[e-mail]

John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Kevin C. Potter wrote:
>> So 'Joe',
>> What is your callsign?  I don't see any 'Joe Hansen'!
>> Thank you,
>>   John, a, er, I mean 'Joe'.
>
>Hey Kevvy,
 Besides who says they need *ANY* license
>to post, internet posting does not require a license.
>
>IDIOT.
>
>(that posting came from a different server than me too)


Well, John, you can sure read a lot more into my post than I wrote.

First of all, where did I say a person couldn't post??

Second, I tried the QRZ database, there are no 'Joe Hansen's.

Third, all e-mail to "joe" comes back undeliverable.

Fourth, Anyone can get an email address from usa.net or any other
servers & have it forwarded to them.

Fifth, you last name was not in my post.  Why would you think I was
talking to you?






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:09 1996
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From: <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 18:07:39 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <59eklb$[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]
X-URL: news:[e-mail]

They just don't understand us, do they, Johnny?




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:10 1996
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From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 15:11:30 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
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It's time for some more investigating!

It's hard to believe any VE would talk or e-mail another ham in this
way:


>My apologies Eric.  I thought you were a Technician class
>operator.  Upon closer review of you license data I see that I
>was in error.  You are only a CODELESS-TECHNICIAN!!!!!
>
>You are still a wet behind the ears ham with an inflated view
>of yourself.

This is another example of the 'ugly American' viewpoint that most hams
out of the USA have of US hams.

Come on, John!  Read your own posts, both here & from
'rec.radio.scanner'.

Let's have a kinder, gentler John Mackey.

Happy Holidays John,

KP





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:12 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 12:41:15 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 34
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> Whats the matter? You have nothing nice to say about me endeavors?
> Perhaps you should look in the mirror before making such stupid
> comments.

Talk about not having anything nice to say!!!!


> It wasn't my idea to have a flame war. however, since you seem so keen

The why do you keep chasing me from newsgroup to newsgroup trying to
start
one?


> and see what mackey did to rec.radio.scanner for almost 8 months!

Actually, it was 2 months & 3 weeks, hardly 8 months.


> You might find that John Mackey is more of a problem than the rest of us
> put together. If you get rid of him, all else falls into place.

Then why is it tha YOU keep popping up where ever there are problems?


> ALso, I have been posting here (off and on) for 6 months now, and
> nothing I have done has caused any problems (until mackey showed up with his
> assitude).

You can't even spell attitude correctly hahahahahahaha.

YOU seem to be the one with the attitude as reed@pacifier indicates.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:12 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 12:46:08 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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To: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>

Kevin Potter wrote:

> Let's have a kinder, gentler John Mackey.

If you want kind & gentle then go to the dog pound & buy
yourself a puppy.


> Happy Holidays John,

Holiday wishes to you also.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:14 1996
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 14:34:46 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 65
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> Facts?!?!?!, How dare you use that word. You have no idea what facts are.

You certainly are not one to show what facts either, the only fact you
know
is keeping your nose up Bill's ass.


> I can dredge up all the postings that YOU did on rec.radio.scanner, john.
> there were a lot of them. It isn't that hard when someone out there on
> the web maintanes a very complete archive or postings for the last year!

Yea, like Dejanews which everyone can access.  Besides, I also kept my
own
archive of postings on that NG, would you like me to dredge up a bunch
of the postings where you were running your mouth trying to defend Bill
while several the people there were taking him to task for his behavior?


> I still say that you are in denial. so, I'll point out a few "facts" for
> you:

No I am not in denial, absolutely not, there is no way I could be in
denial.  That simply is not possible.  Infact, I deny that!


But, here are a few facts for you:

A. The problems on rec.radio.scanner disappeared when Bill did.
B. You used condescending remarks towards others and tried to
  appear as some sort of authority or knowledgable contact.
C. You made immature, shallow, & attacking types of entries
D. Your recall of facts is distorted where they are not in your
  favor.
E. Numberous people stated their dislike for your (& a few others)
  spammish type of entries.

If these are not adequite for you please let me know as there is
an abundunance of the type of facts as listed above.


> You failed to mention that you disobeyed directives from the moderator
> after several warnings (some of which were public). I was there, remeber?

Then you should remember that I was kicked out during the time that
the moderator had just done a very hostile take over of that echo.  He
then started kicking out 2-4 people every week, primarily those who
did not bow to his every immature desire & whim (remember the
ZERO TOLORENCE rule he made?) Would you like copies from some of the
protesters of that time?


> also, you must have been on a slow node, the number of messages did not
> decrease.

I may have been on a slow node.  That node JUST shut down yesterday!


> failed to prove yopur case then, and you give no facts to back it up
> now.

Then why did the moderator contact my sysop onlyu a few weeks ago
begging
him to help mediate the situation?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:15 1996
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From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 19:01:53 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
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I like this!

KP

<[e-mail]>
>




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:16 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 19:19:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59fhem$[e-mail]>
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John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Eric Oyen wrote:
>> Besides, who needs all those fancy pieces of paper (all they do is
>> clutter up the wall).

>How would you know, YOU don't have fancy pieces of paper!

Neither do you.


Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:17 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 19:25:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <59fhpt$[e-mail]>
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John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Eric Oyen wrote:

>> Whats the matter? You have nothing nice to say about me endeavors?
>> Perhaps you should look in the mirror before making such stupid
>> comments.

>Talk about not having anything nice to say!!!!

You're projecting again, Johnnie boy.
>
>> It wasn't my idea to have a flame war. however, since you seem so keen

>The why do you keep chasing me from newsgroup to newsgroup trying to
>start one?

Just like killing cockroaches, the little buggers are everywhere.

>> and see what mackey did to rec.radio.scanner for almost 8 months!

>Actually, it was 2 months & 3 weeks, hardly 8 months.

Either you're a liar, or your drugs have skewed your perception of time.
Probably both.

>> You might find that John Mackey is more of a problem than the rest of us
>> put together. If you get rid of him, all else falls into place.

>Then why is it tha YOU keep popping up where ever there are problems?
>

Where ever a cockroach pops up, the exterminators follow. You're the
little cockroach of the hour Johnnie boy.

>> ALso, I have been posting here (off and on) for 6 months now, and
>> nothing I have done has caused any problems (until mackey showed up with hi
s
>> assitude).

>You can't even spell attitude correctly hahahahahahaha.

I think he spelled it correctly. It's your limited intellect the confuses you.

>YOU seem to be the one with the attitude as reed@pacifier indicates.

Toady drones always parrot their smarmy King Mackey.


Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Howard B. Watson Jr.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 03:38:17 GMT
Organization: EriNet Online 513 436-1700 (Voice)
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>> Delusions of grandeur are side effects of exipred ritalin Johnnie boy.
>> How many times do I have to caution you about your medication.
>
>You better go read your PDR or ask a nurse because you are wrong.
>Perhaps
>you Lithium should be checked?

Totally irrelevant to the flaming going on, John <G>  BUT, they are
occasionally using Ritalin for that now.  Actually Depakote would be a
more appropriate drug to try first, Lithium has a very narrow
therapeutic index and the side effects can be extreme.  (I know,
nothing to do with Ham Radio, but its the area I know more about <G> )
73 de N3TNQ Howard - Springfield, OH


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:19 1996
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From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 05:29:43 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
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To: [e-mail]
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Funny, my e-mail to 'Joe' bounced back like a rubber ball,
undeliverable.






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:20 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 21 Dec 1996 10:16:06 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
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NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
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John Mackey--KA0SSF ([e-mail]) wrote:

: But, here are a few facts for you:

: A. The problems on rec.radio.scanner disappeared when Bill did.

Here is a further fact.

The problems on rec.radio.scanner disappeared when EITHER you or Bill Cheek
disappeared.  Neither one of you alone appears to be a problem, but the two
of you on the same forum is.

Personally, I don't care who started the mud slinging, or where. I just think
that you are both asses to continue it every time you encounter a post made
by the other party.

Bill Nelson


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (John Minger)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Amateur Radio Poem - hamxmas.txt (1/1)
Date: 13 Dec 1996 22:24:49 GMT
Organization: Pacific Bell
Lines: 66
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Here's Juan's post in regular text format:


         A HAM'S CHRISTMAS EVE


'Twas the night before Christmas and in the ham shack,
Was the warm glow of tubes in the transmitting rack.

The log book was brought up to date with great care,
In case the FCC might some day be there.

XYL and Harmonics were snug in their beds,
My strong RF waves safely from their heads.

I plugged in the mike and adjusted the VFO,
Getting all set for a late night QSO.

When up from the F layer there arose such a clatter,
I looked to the window to see what was the matter.

Then up on the roof by the forty meter beam,
There came QRM like a heterodyne scream.

On Icom, on Kenwood, on Yaesu and Ten-Tec,
On Alinco, on Collins, on Astron and Cushcraft.

Bias to the grid and volts to the plate,
Just watch the S-Meter while we all modulate.

As I turned to the rig and reached for the dial,
From the twin lead antenna Santa slid with a smile.

An RF choke he held tight in his teeth,
And coax encircling his head like a wreath.

A bundle of ham gear hung from his hand,
Was that MY name on a new dual band?

He had a snub nose like an egg insulator,
And his cheeks glowed bright red like a hot oscillator.

He spoke not a word but went straight to his work,
Laying out all the gear, then turned with a jerk.

And laying a wave meter along side of his nose,
Said, "Please QSL." and up the feeders he 'rose.

He climbed up the dipole, to his team gave a whistle,
And away they all flew like a jet propelled missile.

But I heard his last signal from the ionosphere,
Seventy Three, Eighty Eight, and Merry Christmas...I'm clear.

By Robert Shafer W9SVL (A Silent Key)
Retold by WA9UXP
Modifications to this version by Bruce, N6TFS (December 1992)

Enjoy, I found it last Christmas (1995) and thought I'd share it this year.

73 to all,  N7RCM...Juan in Las Vegas

[Best wishes also from AC6VV, John in Los Angeles]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:22 1996
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From: wayne <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Amateur Swap and Shops
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 12:06:39 -0500
Organization: MGL Systems Internet
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tornado29.mgl.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Does anyone know of the dates for the Lavonia ARC Swap and Shop held at
the Dearborn Mich. Conference Centre.
[e-mail]
VE3JET


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:24 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Old Salt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: AMATUERS $4.00/MO BEEPER SERVICE
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 03:42:37 GMT
Organization: Don't belive in them
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbdd58$737aaa60$457174cf@default> <57ou4f$[e-mail]> <01bbdef9$89137f80$d47174cf@default> <57ql37$[e-mail]> <01bbe0c3$61b1afe0$8a7074cf@default> <581gqk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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On 10 Dec 1996 03:25:23 GMT, in rec.radio.amateur.misc you wrote:
Path: wn3!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: MOTOROLA PAGERS
Date: 10 Dec 1996 03:25:23 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.187
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

        <snip ad>

        WorldNet TOC

(vii) Members may not post or transmit charity requests, petitions for
signatures, chain letters or letters relating to pyramid schemes.
Members may not post or transmit any advertising, promotional
materials or any other solicitation of other Members to use goods or
services except in those areas (e.g., a classified bulletin board)
that are designated for such purpose.


If you are anti- SPAM, Velveeta, Jello, and have 'had your
fill' of usolicited, bulk, junk e-mail, point your browser to
URL: http://knet.flemingc.on.ca/~surly/junkmail.html
URL: http://www.vix.com/spam/
-- a very informative site.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:25 1996
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From: marku <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ant configuration for rocketry uplink
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:00:07 GMT
Organization: netINS, Inc.
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <58nsfn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: desm-10-06.dialup.netins.net

To anyone willing to help,
I need to be able to send a digital command signal to a high power rocket
that will reach an altitude of 10,000 to 15,000 ft. I plan to use a rat
shack wireless paging system to do this. It operates at 27.225 MHz
producing 6.5 W  I need to know what anttenna configuration will allow me
to be near the launch site and have the rocket some what overhead and
allow the signal to reach the reciever to deploye the recovery system.
The only other requirements is portablity and cost. Any help with this
would be appreciated.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:26 1996
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From: George Baker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ant configuration for rocketry uplink
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 00:25:13 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58nsfn$[e-mail]>
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marku wrote:
>
> To anyone willing to help,
> I need to be able to send a digital command signal to a high power rocket
> that will reach an altitude of 10,000 to 15,000 ft. I plan to use a rat
> shack wireless paging system to do this. It operates at 27.225 MHz
> producing 6.5 W  . . .

Couple of quick comments: operation at 27.225 with 6.5 watts output would appe
ar to
violate FCC regs for CB operation. Second, any command radio operating in the
CB band is
wide open to all mannner of interference which could be of some danger with ro
cket
control.

--
73, George
W5YR
Fairview, TX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:27 1996
From: [e-mail] (Francis Taillon)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Antenna help wanted
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 22:41:19 GMT
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-0302.infobahnos.com
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: TotalNet Inc.
Lines: 25
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.insinc.net!news.total.net!ppp-0302.infobahnos.com

Hi!

        I'm currently using a VHF satellite network (Orbcomm) in remote
monitoring application. My main problem is the size of the antenna
which make it too visible to vandalism and thieft. The antenna I
currently use is about 45 inch long and has 4 32 inch long radials.
I'm looking for a small/compact antenna that could be hidden easily.
Here are some specs:

Frequency range: 138-150 Mhz
Transmitter power: 5 watts
The gain can be unity or more
For some reason, in my application, the antenna need a ground plane
(work ok without it anywhere else!!). I might be able to find a way to
make it work without it so a built in ground plane is not important.

If anybody knows a manufacturer who has that kind of antenna, or a
place where i could find some information about antennas, please
E-mail me!

Thanks
Francis Taillon
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Any YL's with homepages ?
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 00:02:30 GMT
Organization: Texas Networking, Inc.
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max-2-126.nash.voyageronline.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.227

If you have a homepage, post your URL here, or drop a line to
[e-mail].  I am trying to put together a YL page for the
Stones River ARC but haven't found any YL's to link to yet.

Thanks and look forward to hearing from ya.

Linda
KF4GKN

Visit me at:  http://www.voyageronline.net/~rfi/linda2.html



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB091 New on the ARRLWeb page
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 13 Dec 1996 15:58:25 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 32
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12397 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120595


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB091
ARLB091 New on the ARRLWeb page

ZCZC AG71
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 91  ARLB091
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 13, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB091
ARLB091 New on the ARRLWeb page

Now you can use the ARRLWeb page to search for clubs and examination
sites.

The ARRL Affiliated Clubs page lets you search for affiliated clubs
based on state, ZIP Code (you can search within 20, 50 or 100 miles
of the ZIP Code you select) or ARRL section.

The ARRL Exam Session Search lets you find exam sessions by state or
ZIP Code (you can search within 20, 50 or 100 miles of the ZIP Code
you select).  You can even find US ham radio test sessions in other
countries.

Click on Clubs or Exams on the ARRLWeb page, or, to get right to the
club search, set your browser to
http://www.arrl.org/field/club/clubsearch.phtml.  The exam search
engine is at http://www.arrl.org/arrlvec/examsearch.phtml.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB092 ARRL Colvin grant to Heard Island DXpedition
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 13 Dec 1996 15:58:25 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 43
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12398 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120596


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB092
ARLB092 ARRL Colvin grant to Heard Island DXpedition

ZCZC AG72
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 92  ARLB092
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 13, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB092
ARLB092 ARRL Colvin grant to Heard Island DXpedition

The ARRL Colvin Award Grants Committee has authorized a grant of
5000 dollar(s) to the 1997 Heard Island DXpedition.  The DXpedition team,
operating as VK0IR, hopes to activate this rarely visited, remote
location during January and February 1997.  Heard Island, a
territory of Australia, is located in the South Indian Ocean.  The
team says its activities will involve natural science research
(specifically, a study of cryptofauna) as well as ham radio
operations and ''radio science.''  The cost of the entire expedition
has been estimated at 320,000 dollar(s).

The DXpedition will cover five weeks in January and February.  The
team is scheduled to depart Reunion Island on January 3, 1997, and
return on February 5.  Approximately two weeks will be spent on
Heard Island, and brief visits to Crozet and Kerguelen Islands also
are planned.  A team of 20 hams, supported by about a dozen others,
has been assembled for the expedition.

The Colvin Award is conferred by the League in the form of grants in
support of Amateur Radio projects that promote international
goodwill in the field of DX. It is funded by income from an
endowment established by the late Lloyd Colvin, W6KG.

The Heard Island grant is the second Colvin Award to be bestowed by
the ARRL.  The first was made earlier in 1996 to the organizers of
the World Radiosport Team Championship (WRTC).  For more information
on the Heard Island DXpedition, set your browser to
http://www.ccnet.com/~cordell/HI/ on the World Wide Web.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.he.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB093 Vanity call sign update
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 13 Dec 1996 18:26:34 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 41
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12399 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120611


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB093
ARLB093 Vanity call sign update

ZCZC AG73
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 93  ARLB093
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 13, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB093
ARLB093 Vanity call sign update

From the time it began issuing Gate 2 vanity call signs on November
4, 1996, and through December 11, the FCC in Gettysburg cranked out
an estimated 5700 new vanity call signs. That number includes all
Gate 1, Gate 1a, and Gate 2 applications it received on or after
September 23, the opening day for Gate 2. As of December 11, the FCC
had processed all applications received through the end of October.
Approximately 175 of the applications processed still require special
handling, in some cases because the FCC was unable to grant any of
the applicant*s call sign requests.

The ARRL estimates that as many as 2000 applications remained in the
processing queue as of December 11.

Gettysburg received another 405 vanity call sign applications between
November 26 and December 4, 226 of them filed electronically. No date
has been announced for the opening of Gate 3.

To avoid surprises--especially when filing via the electronic on-line
Form 610V--the ARRL advises all vanity applicants to confirm that the
application fee has been received and deposited by Mellon Bank, the
FCC's fiscal agent, or that your credit card account has been
debited.

The FCC reminds hams filing for modifications and renewals to include
a ZIP code to avoid delays.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB094 ARRL again asks for primary allocation at 2300-2305 MHz
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 13 Dec 1996 18:26:35 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 62
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12402 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120641


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB094
ARLB094 ARRL again asks for primary allocation at 2300-2305 MHz

ZCZC AG74
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 94  ARLB094
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 13, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB094
ARLB094 ARRL again asks for primary allocation at 2300-2305 MHz


In comments filed in response to the FCC's plans to reallocate and
auction off parts of the 2.3-GHz band for a new Wireless
Communications Service (WCS), the ARRL has asked the Commission to
create a primary amateur allocation in the 2300 to 2305-MHz segment
and to maintain a secondary ham allocation in the 2305 to 2310-MHz
band. Just before adjourning, the 104th Congress directed the FCC to
reallocate 2305 to 2320 MHz and 2345 to 2360 MHz to wireless services
and to assign new licenses by competitive bidding by April 15 in
order to help balance the budget.

''This legislation is, in the League's experience, the first time that
Congress has substituted its judgment for the expertise of the
Commission with respect to the allocation of specific frequency
bands,'' the ARRL commented, later calling the congressional action
''discouraging.'' The FCC issued a Notice of Proposed Rulemaking (GN
Docket 96-228) in November, proposing to create the WCS to occupy the
affected 2.3-GHz segments.

The League said that part of the FCC's task now is ''protecting
incumbent users in the band,'' and suggested the FCC was obliged to
accommodate continued amateur use in the 2305 to 2310-MHz band and to
accommodate displaced amateur operations in the 2300 to 2305-MHz
segment. ''These actions, taken together, will compensate for the
diminution in availability of the 2305-2310-MHz band for amateur
operation,'' the League declared in its filing. The 2300 to 2310-MHz
segment now is allocated to the amateur service on a secondary basis.
Weak-signal work centers around 2304 MHz. The League called sharing
of the 2305 to 2310 MHz segment with other services ''distinctly
problematic.''

''As a practical matter, it would tend to relegate amateur operation
to non-metropolitan areas, away from customers of mobile service
providers,'' the League said in its comments.

The League already had petitioned the FCC (under Docket 94-32) to
upgrade the 2300 to 2305 MHz band to primary status, but the ARRL
suggested in its comments on GN Docket 96-228 that the FCC upgrade
the status as part of the current proceeding instead.

Noting that the amateur allocation at 2.3 GHz had been ''arbitrarily
winnowed down during the past ten years,'' the League urged the
Commission to take ''an affirmative step to protect what remains of
the Amateur Service allocation and the important and varied amateur
uses at 2300-2310 MHz, especially those centered at and near 2304
MHz.''
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB095 TAPR Digital Directory
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 16 Dec 1996 16:58:42 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 69
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12418 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120895


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB095
ARLB095 TAPR Digital Directory

ZCZC AG75
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 95  ARLB095
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 16, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB095
ARLB095 TAPR Digital Directory

With the support of the ARRL, the Tucson Amateur Packet Radio
Corporation (TAPR) will begin providing at the TAPR Internet site
the information on digital systems that formerly appeared in the
annual ARRL Repeater Directory. The digital directory information
will be available at http://www.tapr.org/directory. Information on
digital systems will not be published in the 1997-98 edition of the
Repeater Directory, permitting the publication to better focus on
its primary use as a guide to voice repeaters for traveling
amateurs.

In planning the 1997-98 edition, the ARRL concluded that the
Repeater Directory was no longer the most effective medium for this
information. Discussions involving various regional digital groups
that provide data to the digital section of the Repeater Directory
led to the conclusion that TAPR was the logical group to take on the
task of a new North American Digital System Directory.

This new database system will describe systems used by Amateur Radio
stations involved in digital communications in United States,
Canada, and Mexico. The Digital System Directory will be based on
information provided by regional, state, and local organizations as
well as individuals, in a nearly real-time format. This should allow
information to be maintained and updated more frequently than in a
yearly publication. TAPR will also work with participating
organizations to make this information available on TAPR's yearly
CD-ROM as well as some future publication for local/regional groups
to distribute.

The purpose of the Digital System Directory is not to manage,
coordinate, or regulate the usage of digital systems, but to provide
the most up-to-date and accurate listing of digital systems that can
be provided. Neither is it a formal organization, but a mechanism to
allow regional groups to provide and share information regarding
digital systems.

The Digital System Directory is intended for use by individuals to
further their enjoyment of the hobby, and by organizations to help
plan and develop digital networks.

Regional/Local groups have already begun to participate in the
process. These groups include TwinsLAN, Texas Packet Radio Society,
Miami Valley FM Association, Ohio Area Repeater Council, Puget Sound
AR TCP/IP Group, Northern California Packet Association, Northern
Illinois Packet Radio Frequency Council, Indiana Digital
Experimenters Association, Central Lakeshore Experimenter's Digital
Organization, HogNet Packet Radio Association, YCCC Sysops
Association and the Missouri Amateur Packet Radio Society. TAPR
encourages other regional groups to support this project by
contributing data from their respective areas.

For further information on the project and how to get involved,
regional groups should check http://www.tapr.org/directory or send
e-mail to Carl Estey at [e-mail].
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB096 League "heartily supports" FCC proposal to ease
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 16 Dec 1996 19:26:13 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 55
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12419 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120924


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB096
ARLB096 League "heartily supports" FCC proposal to ease
international operating

ZCZC AG76
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 96  ARLB096
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 16, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB096
ARLB096 League ''heartily supports'' FCC proposal to ease
international operating

In comments filed in response to an FCC proposal that would make it
easier for visiting foreign hams to temporarily operate in the US,
the ARRL ''heartily supports'' the plan, but suggests some changes.
Earlier this year, the FCC proposed amending the Amateur Radio rules
to make it easier for hams holding a European Conference of Postal
and Telecommunications Administrations (CEPT) radio-amateur license
or an International Amateur Radio Permit (IARP) from certain
countries in the Americas to operate during short visits to the US.

If finally approved, hams would be able to operate for short periods
in participating countries without first obtaining another license or
permit from the host country. The arrangement would make it easier
for US hams to operate stations temporarily in several countries in
Europe, Central and South America. Likewise, hams from those
countries would be allowed to operate in stations in places where the
FCC regulates ham radio.

The principal change recommended by the ARRL involved the length of
time CEPT or IARP holders would be allowed to operate in the US. The
FCC had proposed extending operating authority for ''up to 180 days
within the preceding five years.'' In its comments, the League called
the limitation ''unnecessarily restrictive,'' and suggested a CEPT
license or an IARP ''be valid for use by the holder for a period up to
one year'' from the date of arrival in the US but not beyond the
expiration date of the ham license issued by the visitor's home
country.

The two classes of CEPT licenses would correspond either to Amateur
Extra or Technician class. Resident aliens or US citizens could not
operate in the US under a CEPT license or IARP.

In 1995, the ARRL petitioned the FCC to implement the CITEL/Amateur
Convention. The League also asked the Commission to acknowledge
arrangements to be made between the ARRL and the Department of State
to issue IARP documents to US citizens for use in other CITEL
countries. The FCC also has asked the State Department to apply for
participation in the CEPT Agreement as a non-CEPT country.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.wildstar.net!news.wildstar.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Peter Laws)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: 17 Dec 1996 16:40:59 -0600
Organization: Wildstar Internet Services
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5977hr$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cherokee.wildstar.net
X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 CURRENT #2

[e-mail] writes:


>The report cites a potential 900 kHz or so of expanded or upgraded
>allocations for Amateur Radio in the HF spectrum, including:

Whooo-hoo!!  Another 900 kHz of HF!!  Whoohoo!!

Meanwhile, hundreds of *MEGA*Hertz of VHF and up spectrum are threatened
...  While new HF bands are A Good Thing(tm), let's keep our priorities
straight.

Peter
Mostly satisfied ARRL member

--
Peter Laws / [e-mail] / N5UWY



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.233.85.167!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 15:30:19 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <5992i8$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]> <5977hr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-21.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Peter Laws) wrote:

>[e-mail] writes:


>>The report cites a potential 900 kHz or so of expanded or upgraded
>>allocations for Amateur Radio in the HF spectrum, including:

>Whooo-hoo!!  Another 900 kHz of HF!!  Whoohoo!!

>Meanwhile, hundreds of *MEGA*Hertz of VHF and up spectrum are threatened
>...  While new HF bands are A Good Thing(tm), let's keep our priorities
>straight.

>Peter
>Mostly satisfied ARRL member
   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Me too.

Woohoo! Yeah!

You have to realize Peter that the priorities are straight.  At least
it appears to me (on the Internet--and elsewhere) that HF is the most
important part of the Amateur Radio spectrum.  Instead of taking a
stand for "their" current privileges in the VHF and up regions 'they"
(the HF no-code proponents) would rather engage in pissing contests
such as the perpetual code -- no-code debate we are subjected to
endure here and in some of the other radio.amateur newsgroups.

It's like, "let's fortify the front while the rear is being blown to
smithereens."  Uhhhh..something like that...yeah..something like that.

Cheers!   jim, wk1v






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 06:50:04 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <59as80$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]> <5977hr$[e-mail]> <597o5t$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp24.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>Peter Laws <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>[e-mail] writes:

>>>The report cites a potential 900 kHz or so of expanded or upgraded
>>>allocations for Amateur Radio in the HF spectrum, including:

>>Whooo-hoo!!  Another 900 kHz of HF!!  Whoohoo!!

>That's almost a 25% increase over the current 3.75 MHz we have on H/MF.
>You'd better believe "whoohoo!!"

>>Meanwhile, hundreds of *MEGA*Hertz of VHF and up spectrum are threatened
>>...  While new HF bands are A Good Thing(tm), let's keep our priorities
>>straight.

>No grave loss. Those V/UHF folks can always use 11m as a substitute for
>the short-range comms they seems to be happy with.

You know I often wonder why I get these urges to simply throttle the
living daylights out of some people,
Nope no one ever uses VHF/UHF for long range comms. Nope No one ever
DXs there. Nope I never talked to a small town 20 miles south of
Tampa, FL from Biloxi, MS.
Why do these ignorant HIGH CLASS HAMS always relate us Techs to CBers?
It's not like you never hear idiots on 80/40/20 on a regular basis.
Nope never happens.
>Jeff KH2PZ




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 05:08:26 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <59bmt0$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]> <5977hr$[e-mail]> <597o5t$[e-mail]> <59as80$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>You know I often wonder why I get these urges to simply throttle the
>living daylights out of some people,
>Nope no one ever uses VHF/UHF for long range comms. Nope No one ever
>DXs there. Nope I never talked to a small town 20 miles south of
>Tampa, FL from Biloxi, MS.
>Why do these ignorant HIGH CLASS HAMS always relate us Techs to CBers?
>It's not like you never hear idiots on 80/40/20 on a regular basis.
>Nope never happens.

There are idots everywhere. God loves stupid people. That's why he makes
so many of them.

You should be able to talk from Biloxi, Ms. to Tampa, Fla. with two bean cans
and a string.

Two meters is basically a short range band.  We know about the openings,
but we don't sit around and wait for them.  I have been listening to 2 meters
for 13 years and have never heard anything that was farther than 15 miles away
.

(With the exception of satellites).

Giga hertz is for giga squirts.

Real hams do it on the low bands.....

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:43 1996
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From: Ed Hare <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: 18 Dec 1996 22:25:26 GMT
Organization: American Radio Relay League, Inc.
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <599r0m$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]> <5977hr$[e-mail]> <5992i8$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V) wrote:


>You have to realize Peter that the priorities are straight.  At least
>it appears to me (on the Internet--and elsewhere) that HF is the most
>important part of the Amateur Radio spectrum.  Instead of taking a
>stand for "their" current privileges in the VHF and up regions 'they"
>(the HF no-code proponents) would rather engage in pissing contests
>such as the perpetual code -- no-code debate we are subjected to
>endure here and in some of the other radio.amateur newsgroups.

What is the most important part of the amateur spectrum seems to vary
from ham to ham.  I will point out the obvious -- HF is NOT the part
of the spectrum that is under pressure.  The frequencies above
1 GHz are those that are under the closest scrutiny.  Now, I will
point out that when I was a lad, 2 meters was of little interest to
most hams; we considered ham radio to be HF dxing. Relate that as you
will to your own feelings about the potential loss of frequencies above
1 GHz.

I offer to all hams that we need to learn to separate our areas of
disagreement (the Great Code Debate will continue unabated, I am sure)
from those areas where we need to find common ground.  It is the VHF, UHF
and microwave operator whose needs must be met here. To quote somebody or
another from US history, we will all hang separately if we don't all hang
together.

--

73 from ARRL HQ,
Ed Hare, KA1CV
ARRL Laboratory Supervisor




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:44 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Peter Laws)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: 20 Dec 1996 11:13:41 -0600
Organization: Wildstar Internet Services
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59ehg5$[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: cherokee.wildstar.net
X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 CURRENT #2

[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:

>That's almost a 25% increase over the current 3.75 MHz we have on H/MF.
>You'd better believe "whoohoo!!"

>No grave loss. Those V/UHF folks can always use 11m as a substitute for
>the short-range comms they seems to be happy with.

Assuming the above is not sarcasm ...

I'm not sure what you mean by short-range.  I've worked into repeaters
>100 miles away on my 2m HT connected to a discone.  With some good
antennas, I've been able to work close to 1000 mi on 2m SSB.  When AO-13
was up, I was able to work Japan and some European countries.  Considering
that at apogee, the path length was over 46,000 km, I'm at a loss to
explain what "short-range" means in your world.

Currently, my interest in amateur radio is severe weather spotting.
This requires reliable, county-wide communications with spotters that are
sometimes mobile.  Care to explain how this would be done at HF?  I'm
not aware of any spotter groups using 11m on a regular basis, but their
reports would be welcome if we can work out the details of liason with the
EOC.

--
Peter Laws / [e-mail] / N5UWY


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Peter Laws)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: 20 Dec 1996 11:22:01 -0600
Organization: Wildstar Internet Services
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59ehvp$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]> <5977hr$[e-mail]> <597o5t$[e-mail]> <59as80$[e-mail]> <59bmt0$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writes:

>There are idots everywhere. God loves stupid people. That's why he makes
>so many of them.

And many of those idots [sic] post to Usenet.

>but we don't sit around and wait for them.  I have been listening to 2 meters
>for 13 years and have never heard anything that was farther than 15 miles awa
y.

Unhook your 2m radio from your HF antenna and take a listen.  See my
other post.

>Real hams do it on the low bands.....

Which, with the help of fine folks like yourself, will be all we have by
the turn of the century.  By then, we'll be confined to the "useless bands
below 50 MHz", to paraphrase an old quote.

--
Peter Laws / [e-mail] / N5UWY


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Peter Laws)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: 20 Dec 1996 12:13:35 -0600
Organization: Wildstar Internet Services
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <59el0f$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 CURRENT #2

Ed Hare <[e-mail]> writes:

>from ham to ham.  I will point out the obvious -- HF is NOT the part
>of the spectrum that is under pressure.  The frequencies above

Exactly.  Any gains we make there are fine, but not nearly as important
as what is under threat elsewhere.

>and microwave operator whose needs must be met here. To quote somebody or
>another from US history, we will all hang separately if we don't all hang
>together.

I can't imagine which commercial interests would want HF.  They didn't
want HF in the 'teens and '20s and they don't seem to want it now.  The
oscar foxtrots polluting the low bands now are safe.  Of course, the FCC
may decide (once they've auctioned off everything above 50 MHz) that the
few folks left on HF aren't worth the trouble and they'll just
deregulate the Amateur Service, like they did with CB.  CB *was* a
useful service before the FCC abandoned it.


>73 from ARRL HQ,
>Ed Hare, KA1CV
>ARRL Laboratory Supervisor

This is why I am mostly satisfied with the ARRL.  Good posts like this
one.  And you can call them and ask them about just about anything and
get the right answer.  And they are the ONLY ones in Warshinton fighting
to keep what we already have.

I don't like the ARRL because 1) it's biased towards HF (because surveys
of members say that HF is most important)  2) younger members subsidize
older members.  The older members who go on about CW and HF) and who are
making up a larger and larger percentage of the membership, leading to (1).
3) They would have lost money in the last 2 years had it not been
for generous donations from the estates of Silent Keys and nobody has
taken that fact seriously until very recently.

Like I said, mostly satisfied.

--
Peter Laws / [e-mail] / N5UWY


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:49 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: 21 Dec 1996 01:39:03 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 50
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References: <597o5t$[e-mail]>
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X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <597o5t$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey
Herman) writes:

>>Meanwhile, hundreds of *MEGA*Hertz of VHF and up spectrum are threatened
>>...  While new HF bands are A Good Thing(tm), let's keep our priorities
>>straight.
>
>No grave loss. Those V/UHF folks can always use 11m as a substitute for
>the short-range comms they seems to be happy with.
>
>Jeff KH2PZ
>
>

Why is it not a grave loss.  Incidentally, it's possible to work much of
the U.S. on 2 meters, and all of it on 6 meters, a feat which some can't
duplicate on 80/75 meters either.  Amateur radio with a modicum of sense
and proper positioning could easily set up a set of microwave relays for
passing NTS traffic faster, and voice and packet traffic as a side
measure.  Just imagine instead of the internet, using a 440 or higher rig
to pass your traffic digitally encoded.  If you think that the people
capable of doing that aren't as technically competent as someone who can
build a tube transmitter for 80 & 40, you're wrong.  In some ways, they're
even  more into experimentation than the people who built gear on the
useless frequencies above 200 meters earlier in the century.  The most
used band in this country, 2 meters, was thought of as a junk band 40
years ago, and even .9 MHz on HF can't handle as many amateur QSO's as
let's say 440 MHz can.  Aren't you ignoring the future because you LIKE HF
more than other bands?  I don't see a lot of experimentation on HF
anymore.  A few hams will try pactor II, then it's a commercial product
that most hams can't duplicate if just because there's intellectual
property law involved in creating the method of communicating.

I also wonder how many people could take a television with only a damaged
picture tube and get on 80 meters?  I could, and I wouldn't even worry
about being out of band either.  Many of the people working CW and
bemoaning the lack of technical knowledge of no-code hams can't do so.
It's so simple, it's not funny, but they can't do it.  Amateur radio is
supposed to be for experimentation, and frankly HF isn't producing a lot
of experimentation presently.  There are a few hams with propagation
beacons running around the world, but note how few there really are.  CW,
AM and SSB are really now old tech, and digital HF communications is
rapidly becoming something that you have to pay money to use the new
method of, not something you can scrounge together.  You can't scrounge
GTOR or PACTOR.

I'm also aware of the coherent CW experiments that were going on, but as
far as I can tell there were not all that many amateurs interested.
Where's the technical envelope that you're advocating, or are you just
advocating more of the same stuff that hams were doing 40 years ago?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:50 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB098 Vice Director Thernes, W4ZN, resigns
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 19 Dec 1996 13:33:46 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
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SB QST @ ARL $ARLB098
ARLB098 Vice Director Thernes, W4ZN, resigns

ZCZC AG78
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 98  ARLB098
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 19, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB098
ARLB098 Vice Director Thernes, W4ZN, resigns

Great Lakes Division Vice Director John Thernes, W4ZN, of Covington,
Kentucky, has announced his resignation, effective December 17.  In
a letter to ARRL Secretary David Sumner, K1ZZ, Thernes, 48, said he
was stepping down in order to attend graduate school.

''This is a decision that has been very difficult for me, but one I
must make,'' Thernes said in his letter.  He plans to pursue a
full-time graduate program to obtain his MBA.  Thernes said he'd
like to set up an international consulting business eventually and
believes the MBA and his skill in Japanese will turn out to be a
successful combination.

''Amateur radio is a great public servant and a wonderful hobby,''
wrote Thernes in wishing his former Board colleagues Godspeed.  ARRL
President Rod Stafford, KB6ZV, will appoint a successor.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:51 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB099 Maxim Award nominations
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 20 Dec 1996 09:00:17 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 61
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Approved: [e-mail]
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SB QST @ ARL $ARLB099
ARLB099 Maxim Award nominations

ZCZC AG79
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 99  ARLB099
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 19, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB099
ARLB099 Maxim Award nominations

Headquarters is in the receive mode for nominations for the Hiram
Percy Maxim Memorial Award. The award is given annually to the
licensed radio amateur under age 21 whose accomplishments and
contributions are of the most exemplary nature within the framework
of Amateur Radio activities, including, but not limited to:

Participation or leadership in organizational affairs at the local
or national level.

Technical achievement.

Operating record.

Recruitment and training of new amateurs.

Public relations activities.

In keeping with the tradition of the award when it was first
established in 1936, formal nominations are made by section
managers.  Supporting information, including the endorsement of
ARRL-affiliated clubs and elected or appointed League leadership
officials, should be submitted with the nomination. An award panel
will review the nominations received and select the winner. The
prize is a cash award of 1000 dollars, a suitably engraved plaque,
and travel and accommodation expenses to enable the winner to attend
an ARRL convention for a formal award presentation.

Nominations should document as thoroughly as possible the Amateur
Radio achievements and contributions of the nominee during the
previous calendar year. Additional information concerning the
character of the nominee should be as complete as possible.

The award is intended to provide a tangible reward to those
deserving young amateurs who contribute their time, skills and
energies daily through their commitment to Amateur Radio. As models
for their peers, and inspirations to us all, these fine young people
are highly visible boosters of Amateur Radio awareness. We must
continue to recognize and encourage their hard work and
contributions at every opportunity.

Nominations must be sent to the section manager. Nominations must be
received at Headquarters from section managers by March 31, 1997.
There is no limit to the number of nominations one may make. For
more information or an application form, contact Rick Palm, K1CE,
Field Services Manager, at ARRL Headquarters.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:52 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB100 WRC99 Committee Supports HF CW Requirement
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 20 Dec 1996 16:00:29 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 55
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Approved: [e-mail]
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SB QST @ ARL $ARLB100
ARLB100 WRC99 Committee Supports HF CW Requirement

ZCZC AG80
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 100  ARLB100
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 20, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB100
ARLB100 WRC99 Committee Supports HF CW Requirement

The special committee created by the ARRL to study issues relating
to the 1999 World Radiocommunication Conference (WRC-99) has
recommended that the ARRL Board of Directors not support changing
the treaty requirement for Morse code testing to operate below 30
MHz.  The committee submitted its final report to the ARRL Board
this week.

The committee report contains recommended ARRL positions regarding
possible changes in Article S25 of the international radio
regulations.  Consistent with the results of a survey of ARRL
members, the committee recommended no change in the existing treaty
obligation that administrations test prospective amateur licensees
on their Morse code ability before authorizing them to operate below
30 MHz.  The committee did support changes to Article S25 that
would:

Eliminate the so-called ''banned countries'' list

Establish that providing communications in the event of natural
disasters is a normal and desirable part of the international
service provided by radio amateurs

Reduce restrictions on international communications
on behalf of third parties

Aid in the establishment of an ''International Amateur Permit.''

The committee report also responded to the Board's request that it
study possible changes to the amateur licensing structure in the
United States.  The committee offered some proposals for change, but
recommended that the Board take no action on this part of its report
until the committee's proposals are shared with the membership and
there is an opportunity for member comment.

The Board will consider the committee's report and recommendations
at its next regular meeting, January 17-18, 1997.  If the Board
accepts the report, it will be available for public release.  An
article giving the results of the survey will appear in February
1997 QST.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:53 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLP052 Propagation de KT7H
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 13 Dec 1996 18:26:36 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 57
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
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SB PROP @ ARL $ARLP052
ARLP052 Propagation de KT7H

ZCZC AP72
QST de W1AW
Propagation Forecast Bulletin 52  ARLP052
From Tad Cook, KT7H
Seattle, WA  December 13, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB PROP ARL ARLP052
ARLP052 Propagation de KT7H

Solar flux has still been moving off of the recent flurry of
activity caused by region 7999.  More activity wasn't expected until
this region returned and solar flux rose after December 17, but it
looks as if we are seeing increased activity a bit early as the flux
rises in the past couple of days.

Average sunspot numbers were down about 8 points compared to last
week, solar flux was down over 11 points, and the average A index
was up about 1.7 points.

The projection from NOAA SESC from a few days ago says the flux
should rise again and peak around 94 right around Christmas, and
geomagnetic conditions are expected to remain quiet.

Paul 5X4F/5Z4FO writes this week about 10 meter openings from Arua
in the northwest corner of Uganda.

''I have had two 10 meter openings into the US from here since July
1995.  The first was 30 Oct. 1995 when 24 East Coast stations were
worked between 1744 and 1832 UTC.  The second one was during the
CQWW CW contest on 24 Nov. 1996 when 17 East Coast stations were
worked between 1447 and 1535 UTC.  The last opening corresponds to
the high solar activity on that day.''

Paul mentions the ARRL 10 meter contest coming this weekend, and
says that he made 53 contacts in the 1994 contest and 95 in 1995.

NS0B wrote this week that he believes the solar minimum as already
occurred, based upon his analysis of moving averages of solar flux
and sunspot number.  He does a smoothed 365 day running average and
says that the solar flux bottomed out between May 15 and 23, and has
been rising since, while the bottom for sunspot numbers is during
the same period around May 19.  Based on this observation he says
that the recent solar cycle has been one of the shorter ones at 9
years, 8 months.

Sunspot Numbers for December 5 through 11 were 0, 0, 12, 13, 20, 17
and 31, with a mean of 13.3.  10.7 cm flux was 69.6, 69.7, 69.2,
68.6, 73.7, 72.4 and 77.6, with a mean of 71.5.  Planetary A indices
for the same period were 2, 1, 4, 3, 7, 18, and 10, with a mean of
6.4.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:54 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLP053 Propagation de KT7H
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 20 Dec 1996 16:39:54 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 56
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
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SB PROP @ ARL $ARLP053
ARLP053 Propagation de KT7H

ZCZC AP73
QST de W1AW
Propagation Forecast Bulletin 53  ARLP053
From Tad Cook, KT7H
Seattle, WA  December 20, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB PROP ARL ARLP053
ARLP053 Propagation de KT7H

Solar activity is up again with the return of region 7999.  Average
flux was up this week by 13 points, the sunspot numbers up over 17
points, and A index up 1 point.

Flux is expected to rise up to around 96 on December 23, then drop
below 80 on December 31, then up to the mid-eighties again around
January 5 and 6.  Expect the A and K indices to be up again around
January 6, 11 and 12.

Sometimes there are questions about the effect of a solar or lunar
eclipse on propagation.  I'll include here some notes from Dave
Palmer which present some interesting thoughts about eclipses:

''Solar and Lunar eclipses do not represent anything special in
terms of planetary positions.  They're really just a matter of
perspective.

Solar eclipses occur only at the New Moon, when the Moon is between
the Earth and Sun. Lunar eclipses happen only at Full Moon, when
the Earth is between the Moon and Sun.

But Full/New Moon happens about every 28 days. The reason we don't
get eclipses (on Earth, at least) twice a month is that the Moon's
''orbit about the Earth'' is tilted, and the coincidence of an exact
line-up of the Sun-Moon-Earth (as seen from some spot on Earth)
happens only a couple times per year.

However, every New Moon, there IS a solar eclipse out in space
either north or south of the Earth, and every Full Moon, there's a
Lunar eclipse north or south of the Moon (OK, really, there's a
solar eclipse SOMEWHERE in space for as long as the Moon is not
obscured by the Earth, and a Lunar eclipse for as long as the Moon
is totally obscured by the Earth). The point is that the eclipse's
shadow usually just misses hitting the Earth (or the Moon)''.

Sunspot Numbers for December 12 through 18 were 32, 31, 30, 25, 27,
38 and 33, with a mean of 30.9.  10.7 cm flux was 81.1, 81.7, 82.5,
85, 86.2, 86.4 and 88.4, with a mean of 84.5.  Planetary A indices
for the same period were 8, 6, 5, 10, 10, 8, and 5, with a mean of
7.4.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLX019 Transatlantic anniversary
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 13 Dec 1996 18:41:38 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 32
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12404 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120643


SB SPCL @ ARL $ARLX019
ARLX019 Transatlantic anniversary

ZCZC AX65
QST de W1AW
Special Bulletin 19  ARLX019
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 13, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB SPCL ARL ARLX019
ARLX019 Transatlantic anniversary

December 11 marked the 75th anniversary of the first shortwave
transatlantic radio transmission, sent from Greenwich, Connecticut,
to an American amateur in Ardrossan, Scotland, in 1921 (see QST, Dec
1996, page 30, for details).The US station, 1BCG, was owned by Minton
Cronkhite. In Scotland, Paul Godley, 2ZE, copied a message sent by
1BCG.

A commemorative W1BCG operation, using a replica of the 1921
transmitter, continues through December 15 in the vicinity of 1815
kHz in the 160-meter band (as close as practical to the original
frequency, which was 1350 kHz--in the present-day standard broadcast
band).

The RSGB reports that, on the other side of the Atlantic, members of
the Yeovil Amateur Radio Club used restored and replica 1920s
receivers this week to pick up the signal from W1BCG.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.94.215.18!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: ARRL amateur training videos...
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 11:30:04 -0600
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.217.254
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:100554 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121305 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44786

Hi all,

My nephew has been trying to learn enough electronics and code for over
a year to get his license - without any luck.  Seems he's one of the few
people who has trouble with the theory, rather than the code.  He just
can't seem to grasp it the principals of electronics...

Was wondering if anyone has had any experience with the video training
courses for an amateur radio license offered by the ARRL?

I would like to purchase the courses from someone who has used them and
wants to re-coup some of their investment. I would like to get him
(both) the tech and general license courses - in good condition of
course.

Any help/information is appreciated.  E-mail please.

John


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ATTN: Alabama Hams (Mobile area)
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 18:58:56 EDT
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lunacb.moonstar.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: NEWTNews & Chameleon -- TCP/IP for MS Windows from NetManage


I will be camping at Gulf SP, AL any hams in the area,
suggest anything to do or see around this part of the state.
We will be biking,hiking, and sea kayaking while there if any
of you would like to join in, I hope to have 2 meters with me
and will be tuning around band.
73 Kyle




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!snunews.snu.ac.kr!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!arclight.uoregon.edu!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Ronald D. Lucier" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ATV Thread
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 21:05:11 -0800
Organization: Optical Hybrids, Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: wor-ma1-08.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Dec 20  8:06:11 PM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; U; 16bit)

ADatGHC wrote:
>
> I am interested in an ongoing discussion of ATV.  The forum can range from
> down converters and transmitters to antennas and repeaters.  We are
> currently working on a ATV repeater in South Central New York State.  A
> discussion on the topic will hopefully not only be of value to us. but
> also encourage enthusiasm in this area of ATV.
>
> Andrew
> KB3APR

Know of anyone out there doing stereo atv - interlaced left/right video?
 I have the capability (multiplexer, monitors, software, etc) and was
wondering if this has been attempted yet.  Hams seem to lead the way in
many cases.  Info on stereovideo at http://www.3doptics.com

73 de WA1UWZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:05:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.94.215.18!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Back on 10M!
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 11:36:03 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mercury30.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02Gold (Win95; I)

Once again, last night at 18:40 Pacific,  Made a contact on 28.4 to southern C
A.

Lots of late night activity on 10 lately!

Jim..


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!in1.nntp.cais.net!news.hkt.net!news.asiaonline.net!news
From: Francis Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Baycom official WWW page
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 03:13:57 +0800
Organization: Asia On-Line Limited, Hong Kong.
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 202.85.19.98
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Anyone know the BAYCOM official WWW address ? The www.baycom.de no
longer work for a long time .

Rgds

Lee


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.mathworks.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Tony)
Newsgroups: alt.retromod,alt.binaries.nude.celebrities,alt.binaries.pictures.celebrities,alt.binaries.pictures.nude.celebrities,alt.binaries.pictures.supermodels,alt.celebrities,alt.magazines.pornographic,alt.sex,alt.sex.pictures,alt.sex.toons,misc.invest.real-estate,news.newusers.questions,rec.autos.sport.nascar,rec.games.playing-cards,rec.music.reggae,rec.nude,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.sport.hockey,t-netz.sex
Subject: Re: bincancel:13 large binaries:AR767:@@NCM
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 19:09:31 GMT
Organization: Tired of this asshole, anyone else?
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-2-142.sntc01.pacbell.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299
X-No-Archive: yes
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.binaries.nude.celebrities:192041 alt.binaries.pictures.celebrities:143603 alt.binaries.pictures.nude.celebrities:73446 alt.binaries.pictures.supermodels:215081 alt.celebrities:23191 alt.magazines.pornographic:18556 alt.sex:437520 alt.sex.pictures:258435 alt.sex.toons:3145 misc.invest.real-estate:41295 news.newusers.questions:429136 rec.autos.sport.nascar:99193 rec.games.playing-cards:3858 rec.music.reggae:42489 rec.nude:111184 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120652 rec.sport.hockey:205832 t-netz.sex:10920

On Fri, 13 Dec 1996 18:41:14 GMT, [e-mail] (Richard E.
Depew) wrote:

>Large binary posts do not belong in unmoderated discussion groups.
>
>As a service to, and with the cooperation of, other news administrators,
>I run a program that searches for, and issues advisory cancels for,
<a lot of self-important net-nazi attempts at justification
deleted...>

Do you suppose this guy sits in front of his computer and jacks off
when he reads his own self-important posts, in some bizarre attempt at
self-gratification?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.178.176.27!hunter.premier.net!worldnet.att.net!cbgw2.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Black helicopters/Preserving ham radio
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 13:51:29 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: esoterica.pez.bell-labs.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

Dave/KB2ZYO wrote:
> most of the people telling me to shut up are those who work for Bell
> labs, MCI, Lucent, and so on. Just the very self same groops that Want
> us to shut up and die.

That is so ridiculous! Gee, where did you get TWO of those company names
from, I wonder? 8v{}

Lucent/Bell Labs have several amateur radio stations at their various
facilities, and employees who run clubs and repeaters. Many of the
people who work here are about the most technically knowledgeable,
eccentric, and non-establishment as you can get!

I personally distrust almost every word out of the government's
collective mouth, including "It was just a weather balloon" and "There
is no secret base in the desert" and "No missles were fired in the area"
and "None of our troops were exposed to biological warfare." I doubt all
of these assertions with every fiber of my being.

It's really the Feds who you should be pissed off at: They're the ones
who organize the radio spectrum auctions, and they'll gladly take
anyone's money as long as it's to the highest bidder! The so-called
commercial interests can't buy something that't not FOR SALE. So go
bitch at your government, pal.

Nobody wants you to shut up and die, but we'd like you to regroup a bit.
How are you going to bring about positive change so that your bands
don't go away? That's the question. Once again, I implore of you: Do
something constructive. Don't ramble like a paranoid. Makes us look bad.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: BOSTON AREA HAMS
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 19:01:18 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pool010.max2.canoga-park.ca.us.dynip.earthlink.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230


North Shore area Hams....Moving soon to Saugus, MA. and need to find a
LOCAL phone number ISP from Saugus.. I am currently with Earthlink,
but their nearest number is DANVERS, a definite toll call from
Saugus.. Any info appreciated....Thanks..
AC6QQ     [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!shore!northshore.shore.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael Crestohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BOSTON AREA HAMS
Date: 18 Dec 1996 22:56:51 -0500
Organization: Shore.Net; a service of Eco Software, Inc. ([e-mail])
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <59aee3$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: shell1.shore.net

In article <[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>North Shore area Hams....Moving soon to Saugus, MA. and need to find a
>LOCAL phone number ISP from Saugus.. I am currently with Earthlink,
>but their nearest number is DANVERS, a definite toll call from
>Saugus.. Any info appreciated....Thanks..
>AC6QQ     [e-mail]
>


I highly recommend Northshore Access in Lynn MA.  They are a local call
from Saugus.  Tell 'em "mc" sent ya!

73,



  \     __/\__    /      73 de H Michael Crestohl, W1RC, (also VE2XZ)
   *   /      \  *
    \  | |  | | /        Caretaker of "Boatanchors", Military, Gov't and
       | |||| |          "Spy" Radio Receiving and Transmitting Equipment.
- * -  | |||| | - * -    Trade offers always entertained!
       | |||| |          Internet: [e-mail], [e-mail], [e-mail]
    /  | |||| | \        AX,25:    none at the present
   *   |------|  *       QTH: Cambridge Village, Vermont, 05444, U S A
  /    \______/   \      at the foot of Mount Mansfield, highest elevation
         ||||            in Vermont; 225 miles from Boston, 90 from Montreal.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news.duq.edu!newsfeed.pitt.edu!portc02.blue.aol.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.interserv.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CA License Plate Problems
Date: 15 Dec 1996 20:45:14 GMT
Organization: InterServ News Service
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <591o0q$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.30.146.204
X-Newsreader: SPRY News 3.10 (SPRY, Inc.)

Fellow Amateurs:

Sorry for using the bandwidth, and for posting to this newsgroup, but
I'm not sure how else to get this done (I don't have packet capabilities).
If you are not a ham living in California, go ahead & delete this note &
read your other postings -:)

We here in CA are allowed to have our call letters on our license plates.
That's the good news. The bad news is that DMV will not allow us to have
anything other than the plain old red, white, & blue plate format. Sure,
not all of us want our call letters on our license plate. Further, not all
of us that do are interested in paying the extra for a specialized plate,
like the Lake Tahoe plate, the Yosemite plate, etc. But... some of us are
willing to pay a bit extra for a spiffy looking plate with our call on it.

I applied for a Tahoe plate by mail and the application was denied. Went
to a local DMV office and the clerk tried to force it into the system but
was unable to do so. She asked her supervisor and was told that they
can't ensure that our call isn't already being used by someone else on
a plate. What a lame excuse. Joe Nonham can walk in and get a Lake
Tahoe plate with JCBER99 - no problem. The computer programming
checks this combination and if valid, allows it. Why not for us?? I know
several other local hams that have also tried and failed. I don't give up
very easily----->

I've written a letter (snail mail) to the new director of the DMV,
explaining the situation and asking for her to look into getting this
changed. One ham requesting a change probably isn't going to have
much effect. However, if we can get the CA ham community to ask for
a change en mass, we might have a chance. Even if you aren't interested
in plunking down the $$ for a special plate, think about helping the cause.

What can you do? Below is the name and address of the DMV Director.
Please get out your word processor or pen & paper and write a short note
to her asking for the rule to be changed. A big hearty THANKS in
advance for your taking the time and using a 32 cent stamp to help take
on the DMV about this bone-headed restriction!!! Pleeeze write to:

Ms. Sally Reid
Director, CA Dept. of Motor Vehicles
P.O. Box 942869
Sacramento, CA  94269-0001


73 & Happy Holidays,
Jim Bennett / W6JHB ([e-mail])



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.138.116.24!dobie.loop.net!news
From: [e-mail] (WB6HRO)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CA License Plate Problems
Date: 18 Dec 1996 03:58:02 GMT
Organization: The Loop
Lines: 56
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <597q4a$[e-mail]>
References: <591o0q$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p02.hwts14.loop.net
X-Newsreader: SPRY News 3.03 (SPRY, Inc.)

>   [e-mail] writes:
>  Fellow Amateurs:
>
>  Sorry for using the bandwidth, and for posting to this newsgroup, but
>  I'm not sure how else to get this done (I don't have packet capabilities).
>  If you are not a ham living in California, go ahead & delete this note &
>  read your other postings -:)
>
>  We here in CA are allowed to have our call letters on our license plates.
>  That's the good news. The bad news is that DMV will not allow us to have
>  anything other than the plain old red, white, & blue plate format. Sure,
>  not all of us want our call letters on our license plate. Further, not all
>  of us that do are interested in paying the extra for a specialized plate,
>  like the Lake Tahoe plate, the Yosemite plate, etc. But... some of us are
>  willing to pay a bit extra for a spiffy looking plate with our call on it.
>
>  I applied for a Tahoe plate by mail and the application was denied. Went
>  to a local DMV office and the clerk tried to force it into the system but
>  was unable to do so. She asked her supervisor and was told that they
>  can't ensure that our call isn't already being used by someone else on
>  a plate. What a lame excuse. Joe Nonham can walk in and get a Lake
>  Tahoe plate with JCBER99 - no problem. The computer programming
>  checks this combination and if valid, allows it. Why not for us?? I know
>  several other local hams that have also tried and failed. I don't give up
>  very easily----->
>
>  I've written a letter (snail mail) to the new director of the DMV,
>  explaining the situation and asking for her to look into getting this
>  changed. One ham requesting a change probably isn't going to have
>  much effect. However, if we can get the CA ham community to ask for
>  a change en mass, we might have a chance. Even if you aren't interested
>  in plunking down the $$ for a special plate, think about helping the cause.
>
>  What can you do? Below is the name and address of the DMV Director.
>  Please get out your word processor or pen & paper and write a short note
>  to her asking for the rule to be changed. A big hearty THANKS in
>  advance for your taking the time and using a 32 cent stamp to help take
>  on the DMV about this bone-headed restriction!!! Pleeeze write to:
>
>  Ms. Sally Reid
>  Director, CA Dept. of Motor Vehicles
>  P.O. Box 942869
>  Sacramento, CA  94269-0001
>
>
>  73 & Happy Holidays,
>  Jim Bennett / W6JHB ([e-mail])
>
>
>>>>
I've been very sucessful with inquires to the director of the DMV, it was Fran
k Zolin then but they are
very responsive to individual request and are trying to do a good job. It take
s about 6 weeks to get a
response but if it makes sense they actually use good logic.

de Joe Orrico WB6HRO



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.138.116.24!dobie.loop.net!news
From: [e-mail] (WB6HRO)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CA License Plate Problems
Date: 19 Dec 1996 01:38:44 GMT
Organization: The Loop
Lines: 64
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59a6b4$[e-mail]>
References: <597q4a$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p05.hwts11.loop.net
X-Newsreader: SPRY News 3.03 (SPRY, Inc.)

>   [e-mail] (WB6HRO) writes:
>  >   [e-mail] writes:
>  >  Fellow Amateurs:
>  >
>  >  Sorry for using the bandwidth, and for posting to this newsgroup, but
>  >  I'm not sure how else to get this done (I don't have packet capabilities
).
>  >  If you are not a ham living in California, go ahead & delete this note &

>  >  read your other postings -:)
>  >
>  >  We here in CA are allowed to have our call letters on our license plates
.
>  >  That's the good news. The bad news is that DMV will not allow us to have

>  >  anything other than the plain old red, white, & blue plate format. Sure,

>  >  not all of us want our call letters on our license plate. Further, not a
ll
>  >  of us that do are interested in paying the extra for a specialized plate
,
>  >  like the Lake Tahoe plate, the Yosemite plate, etc. But... some of us ar
e
>  >  willing to pay a bit extra for a spiffy looking plate with our call on i
t.
>  >
>  >  I applied for a Tahoe plate by mail and the application was denied. Went
>  >  to a local DMV office and the clerk tried to force it into the system bu
t
>  >  was unable to do so. She asked her supervisor and was told that they
>  >  can't ensure that our call isn't already being used by someone else on
>  >  a plate. What a lame excuse. Joe Nonham can walk in and get a Lake
>  >  Tahoe plate with JCBER99 - no problem. The computer programming
>  >  checks this combination and if valid, allows it. Why not for us?? I know

>  >  several other local hams that have also tried and failed. I don't give u
p
>  >  very easily----->
>  >
>  >  I've written a letter (snail mail) to the new director of the DMV,
>  >  explaining the situation and asking for her to look into getting this
>  >  changed. One ham requesting a change probably isn't going to have
>  >  much effect. However, if we can get the CA ham community to ask for
>  >  a change en mass, we might have a chance. Even if you aren't interested
>  >  in plunking down the $$ for a special plate, think about helping the cau
se.
>  >
>  >  What can you do? Below is the name and address of the DMV Director.
>  >  Please get out your word processor or pen & paper and write a short note
>  >  to her asking for the rule to be changed. A big hearty THANKS in
>  >  advance for your taking the time and using a 32 cent stamp to help take
>  >  on the DMV about this bone-headed restriction!!! Pleeeze write to:
>  >
>  >  Ms. Sally Reid
>  >  Director, CA Dept. of Motor Vehicles
>  >  P.O. Box 942869
>  >  Sacramento, CA  94269-0001
>  >
>  >
>  >  73 & Happy Holidays,
>  >  Jim Bennett / W6JHB ([e-mail])
>  >
>  >
>  >>>>
>  I've been very sucessful with inquires to the director of the DMV, it was F
rank Zolin then but they are
>  very responsive to individual request and are trying to do a good job. It t
akes about 6 weeks to get a
>  response but if it makes sense they actually use good logic.
>
>  de Joe Orrico WB6HRO
>
>
>>>>
For anyones information the plates are authorized under section 5005 of the Ca
lif. Vehicle since no one
at the DMV will know what you are talking about it's nice to have it for refer
ence.

de Joe Orrico WB6HRO



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!super.zippo.com!zdc-e!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!not-for-mail
From: Steve Sherman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Callsign gateway
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 00:25:33 -0800
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 6
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cq0-28.dxnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

There is callsign-to-email gateway. http://www.callsign.net
It helps your friend to remember your real email address.
Your firends just send email to [e-mail] and
callsign.net forwards your email to your real email address.
Registration is free!
I think it's quite a nice way to do with callsign and email.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Canadian allocations
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 10:31:48 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs229.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I)

Bill Evans wrote:

> Fair comment Scott.  I apologize for my fellow Canadian hams who venture
> below 7050 KHz.. There is no need to do so.  If I heard a VE below 7050 on
> phone, I'd likely say something to him.  The 40m CW band is a precious
> resource.
> I operate on 40 above 7150KHz about half of the time.
> 73
> Bill VE4UD

Hi Bill. What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band? There wa
s a VE
something phone op on 3.720 about a week ago raising all sorts of noise about
US
novices operating in "his" phone segment.

--
Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!hunter.premier.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.58.0.35!news.structured.net!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: 21 Dec 1996 08:56:19 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59g8nj$[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Dave Hockaday ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Hi Bill. What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band? There
was a VE
: something phone op on 3.720 about a week ago raising all sorts of noise abou
t US
: novices operating in "his" phone segment.

Hm. You would think the VE would be a bit more knowledgeable. CW is allowed on
ALL Amateur frequencies (at least, on HF). I don't know if that is true for
Canada as well, but suspect it is.

The Canadian allocations used to be identical to those in the US, but may not
be any longer.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Carl is not a joiner, that's a fact
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 15:39:40 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5858aa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58oakr$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv22.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...

> [e-mail] wrote:
> > We need to throw ALL of the rascals out ... but that isn't likely to
> > happen because the rascals control the system ... the fox is literally
> > the gatekeeper to the henhouse ... clearly an untenable situation.
>
> I believe that it takes only 10 signatures to get on the ballot and run
> for division director.  Then you'll be given an equal amount of space on
> the ballot to state your platform against your challenger(s).  What
> could
> be easier.  What sort of control on the system will prevent you from
> being elected?  It's the requirement that one have access to a lot of
> money
> (like running for national government office).  So what is it?
>
> Robert KA5WSS
> [e-mail]

Robert, you have to understand Carl.  He's not a doer.  He's a talker.
He's you're typical Dilbert type manager.  He's a brains??? man.  He's a
monday morning quarterback, an armchair general.  Over a year ago he
advocated the start of another lobbying organization.  Even offered 100
bucks (whoopdee doo) to get it started.  Have you heard anything about
this new organization?? Nope..just Carl blowing smoke up everyone's
drawers.  He professes he needs HF access for all these great
technologies that will save the ARS, yet forgets that for the past 20
years, he's had HF access.  He saya that passing an upgrade test is NO
SWEAT, yet never has, but still he pisses and moans about needing to be
on HF.

He cries about the ARRL not representing HIM, yet when elections come
around he proudly boasts, I DON"T VOTE.  He probably has a bumper sticker
on his boat the proclaims..DON'T BLAME ME, I DIDN'T EVEN VOTE.

If you want to see a do'er, look to Bill (K2UNK).  Bill and I don't see
eye to eye on everything (he is shorter than me), but Bill is a do'er.
He's hands on and get involved.  I'd put more faith in 1 Bill, than
dozens of crybabys like either TweedleDumb or TweedleDumber (Carl and
Len, or Len and Carl).

Don't waste time on Carl.  Invest it wisely.  Look for someone other than
an old geezer Carl/Len type who can make a difference.

Besides, Carl wants the ATS to dissappear.  His buzz words..increased
market share.  Internet access on the air all point ot his true agenda,
a play for pay program, sponsered by his engineering types and the
commercial communications entities they represent.

Enuf for now.  Remember Carl, there are eyes watching you wherever you
go......BOOOO  made you look    BRUHAHAHAHAHA
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Carl is not a joiner, that's a fact
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 23:05:31 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5858aa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58oakr$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qe88$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv17.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58qe88$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF
2TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
> >
> >Robert, you have to understand Carl.  He's not a doer.  He's a talker.
> >He's you're typical Dilbert type manager.  He's a brains??? man.  He's a
> >monday morning quarterback, an armchair general.  Over a year ago he
> >advocated the start of another lobbying organization.
>
> OVER A YEAR AGO??? I guess you're not taking your medication again,
> Steve ... the time warp phenomenon seems to be hitting you again ...
> TRY "in October" ... I had my neck surgery on Oct. 7th and it was
> *after* I got out of the hospital that I said that ... and the $100
> "offer" was for an annual FCC license fee, if we could get some decent
> inforcement action in the bands ... you can't seem to get anything
> straight ...
>

Ya got me pardner. Looks like I fell into a Chrono Synclastic
Infidibulium.  Tyme sure flies when you're having fun.  Guess the surgury
worked, you're spelting misteaks are getting better.  TRY Enforcement

> >Besides, Carl wants the ARS to dissappear.  His buzz words..increased
> >market share.  Internet access on the air all point ot his true agenda,
> >a play for pay program, sponsered by his engineering types and the
> >commercial communications entities they represent.
>
> Obviously the paranoid ramblings of a psychotic mind, Steve ... you
> *really* need some professional mental health help ...

what happened to delusional???  Seeing as you didn't pick apart the rest
of the posting, then you must agree with my assessment of you.
Thanks..it took alot of investigative work to get it JUST right.  Keep up
the good work.  You're really helping your cause

>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Carl is not a joiner, that's a fact
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:15:36 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58qe88$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5858aa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58oakr$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-28.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>Robert, you have to understand Carl.  He's not a doer.  He's a talker.
>He's you're typical Dilbert type manager.  He's a brains??? man.  He's a
>monday morning quarterback, an armchair general.  Over a year ago he
>advocated the start of another lobbying organization.

OVER A YEAR AGO??? I guess you're not taking your medication again,
Steve ... the time warp phenomenon seems to be hitting you again ...
TRY "in October" ... I had my neck surgery on Oct. 7th and it was
*after* I got out of the hospital that I said that ... and the $100
"offer" was for an annual FCC license fee, if we could get some decent
inforcement action in the bands ... you can't seem to get anything
straight ...

>Besides, Carl wants the ATS to dissappear.  His buzz words..increased
>market share.  Internet access on the air all point ot his true agenda,
>a play for pay program, sponsered by his engineering types and the
>commercial communications entities they represent.

Obviously the paranoid ramblings of a psychotic mind, Steve ... you
*really* need some professional mental health help ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Carl's double standard exposed
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 16:43:35 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t5ei$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv11.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

> [e-mail] wrote:
> >
>
> > >Your "many of us feel..." comment about Dave Sumner is uncalled for.
> > Why? It's true ... many do feel that way ...
>
> > >Have you ever met him?
> >
> > Irrelevant ... I've read his party line crap and seen how any sign of
> > dissent in hamdom is systematically purged from QST and other league
> > communications ...  I've seen how any opposing comment is outright
> > ignored.  That's all I need to know ... he's a political slime in a
> > political position, and he's simply out to maintain his power base and
> > cushy do-nothing job at our expense ... he's a major detriment to ham
> > radio IMNSHO.
> > Because it needs saying ... more people should start saying "We're mad
> > as hell and we're not going to take it any more!"
>
>
> > ... I've talked to LOTs of folks who think he's long overdue for
> > replacement ... he's built a
> > good-ole-boy club and it's time to knock down his clubhouse and clean
> > things up ...

Hey CARL.. you've defamed the character and intgreity of someonew with
your lies and innuendo.  Maybe a sleezie lawyer type will file suit
against your fat geezer keester for all your worth.  Of course, we'll
discount you actually owning outright ALL the equipment you profess to
own.


Why is you can spread lies about someone and if someone supposedly tells
an untruth (according to you) you threaten legal action??? tsk tsk, very
poor form OLD chap

What's good for the goose and all that jazz...

BTW, IMNSHO you're the deteriment that will befall amateur radio.  You
and the companies you represent.  PLAY FOR PAY..it's coming to a
frequency near you.
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!super.zippo.com!zdc!yama.mcc.ac.uk!warwick!lyra.csx.cam.ac.uk!hole.news.pipex.net!pipex!bowl.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.ukpats.org.uk!lade.news.pipex.net!pipex!dish.news.pipex.net!pipex!dsbc.icl.co.uk!oasis.icl.co.uk!prs
From: [e-mail] (Peter Swynford)
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CEPT operation in the UK
Date: 19 Dec 1996 11:10:57 GMT
Organization: ICL, Bracknell, UK
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59b7s1$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
Xref: news1.epix.net uk.radio.amateur:23654 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121111


Overseas amateurs operating in the UK under the terms
of the CEPT licence should use 'M0' or 'M1' as the prefix
before their own callsign. It appears that some are
unaware of this and are still using 'G' prefixes. UK
amateurs hearing an overseas amateur operating in this
country and using 'G' prefixes should politely inform them
of the correct prefix to be used.

[source GB2RS, RSGB]

73
Peter
G0PUB

*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
| Peter Swynford, Networks Business,          Telephone: [phone] |
| Fujitsu ICL Computers Ltd,                  Facsimile: [phone] |
| Lovelace Road, Bracknell, RG12 8SN, U.K.    PubLine:   [phone] |
| http://www.iclnpbg.co.uk                    Mobile:    [phone]  |
| E-mail: [e-mail]                 Qrv: 433.275MHz 73 de g0pub |
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Vartan Narinian)
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CEPT operation in the UK
Date: 19 Dec 1996 14:51:12 -0000
Organization: Imperial College of Science, Technology and Medicine, London
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <59bkp0$[e-mail]>
References: <59b7s1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: deimos.ee.ic.ac.uk (155.198.136.3)
X-Access: 16 1015 1016
Xref: news1.epix.net uk.radio.amateur:23655 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121134

[e-mail] (Peter Swynford) writes:
>
>Overseas amateurs operating in the UK under the terms
>of the CEPT licence should use 'M0' or 'M1' as the prefix
>before their own callsign.

Strange, I recently got the relevant leaflet from the Radiocommunications
Agency and it says:

        "You should use your home call sign after the UK prefix 'M'
        and secondary locator if any. Thus a Dutch amateur holding
        the call sign PA2MIL would identify in England as M/PA2MIL
        and an Austrian amateur holding the call sign OE7PBK would
        identify in Wales as MW/OE7PBK. A full list of secondary
        locators is given in note (w) of the UK Licence Booklet."

(I have the booklet and it doesn't say anything about M0 and M1.)

Source:

        Radio Amateur Information Sheet
        Operation Under Cept
        RA 247 (Rev 4)
        June 1996
        ISBN 1855691701

--
Vartan


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:19 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Walt Davidson)
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CEPT operation in the UK
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 18:53:28 GMT
Organization: home in Tewkesbury
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59b7s1$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Peter Swynford) wrote:

> UK
>amateurs hearing an overseas amateur operating in this
>country and using 'G' prefixes should politely inform them
>of the correct prefix to be used.

Does it *matter*?

Merry Christmas de G3NYY

--
Walt Davidson               E-mail: [e-mail]
                                    [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: China on 40 CW
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 09:12:41 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <Ü╖≡> <58s0v6$[e-mail]>
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T E I X E I R A wrote:

> I keep hearing how CW is obsolete.....yesterday a freind here in the US woke
d
> China on 40 meter CW at 8 am.  Try and do that with phone. Hams have learned
> code for years and no problems. The real problem is "Lazyness".
> Don W6IQ

Dude, China, Taiwan, Japan, and Indonesia were rockin' on 40 CW this past
wednesday morning around daybreak! Most cool..

--
Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.94.215.18!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: China on 40 CW
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 16:29:26 GMT
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <Ü╖≡> <58s0v6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121204 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44442

On Thu, 19 Dec 1996 09:12:41 -0800, Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>T E I X E I R A wrote:
>
>> I keep hearing how CW is obsolete.....yesterday a freind here in the US wok
ed
>> China on 40 meter CW at 8 am.  Try and do that with phone. Hams have learne
d
>> code for years and no problems. The real problem is "Lazyness".
>> Don W6IQ
>
>Dude, China, Taiwan, Japan, and Indonesia were rockin' on 40 CW this past
>wednesday morning around daybreak! Most cool..

I hear Europe on 40m CW during the evenings here in NC and recently
worked France. Does anybody know what happened to the 40m DX group
(SSB only)?  I haven't heard them for a long time. I guess it's the
propagation conditions. CW 40m DX coming in loud and clear in NC,
however.

73

KR4AJ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (JDuffy)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Cincinnati GMRS Repeaters
Date: 21 Dec 1996 16:27:44 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Is anyone aware of any GMRS repeaters in the Eastern Cincinnati area?  I
would like to contact the owner about usage.

Thanks & Merry Christmas!

_____________________________________________________________________
"If the government bans individual possession of guns and only the government
owns guns, are we still a free people?"

"It's the Second Amendment Stupid!"

J. D. Beischel - Life Member - NRA
Amateur Radio WB8NUT & Member of the ARRL
_____________________________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news1.noc.netcom.net!noc.netcom.net!gate.actel.com!usenet
From: John McGowan <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: ba.forsale,fj.rec.radio,rec.antiques.radio+phono,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap,ba.marketplace
Subject: Classic Vacuum Tube / Radio Books
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 14:56:27 -0800
Organization: Actel Inc.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pix45.actel.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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CC: jem
Xref: news1.epix.net fj.rec.radio:3338 rec.antiques.radio+phono:33365 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44146 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21972 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120352 rec.radio.swap:99218

I have three classic texts, all in excellent condition,
which I am looking to unload as I will have no need for them.
I hope to find them a good home.

        1. RCA, _Receiving Tube Manual_, 1947.

        2. RCA, _Radiotron Designer's Handbook, 3d Ed._, 1942.

        3. Reich, _Theory and Application of Electron Tubes_, 1939.


        I request at a minimum that one pay postage, if
applicable. I live in the San Francisco Bay Area. What are these
worth? Please contact me if interested.



        Happy Holidays,


        John

        [e-mail]
        [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!news.cse.psu.edu!news.math.psu.edu!feeder.chicago.cic.net!news.uiowa.edu!blue.weeg.uiowa.edu!rawiley
From: [e-mail] (R. Wiley)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 14 Dec 96 17:00:26 GMT
Organization: The University of Iowa
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <c97cc$a3716.3cb@NEWS>
NNTP-Posting-Host: red.weeg.uiowa.edu

.

Offer one more proof that the FCC often behave like
the pinhead bureaucrats that they are.


NE0R


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:25 1996
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From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Closed Repeaters
Date: 15 Dec 1996 23:49:26 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <5922q6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <56u021$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57lsf6$[e-mail]> <580vcd$2tu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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kc7tae




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:26 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Coast to coast 2m.?
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 12:46:51 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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I don't know if this has ever been tried, but has any groop of hams tried
 to link enough repeaters together to attempt a coast to coast Qso on 2
meters? I don't know If such a thing would even be permissable under Fcc
 guidelines, but it would be interesting to try, wouldn't it? Such a
joint peoject might once again prove that hams can STILL work together
and innovate ideas that are just too risky for others to try. (but, then
again , if hams develop it, more than likely, some corperation would
probably steal it...NEVER MIND.)
                         Dave/ KB2ZYO
                          I Want To Belive...


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:27 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!hunter.premier.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!pineapp
From: [e-mail] (Daniel Curry)
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom-Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 05:49:32 GMT
Lines: 20
Sender: [e-mail]

 Dave, something that was close to this was done back in the early or
mid eighties. Not coast to coast, but I do recalled something
west coast to the mid-west.

[e-mail] wrote:
: I don't know if this has ever been tried, but has any groop of hams tried
:  to link enough repeaters together to attempt a coast to coast Qso on 2
: meters? I don't know If such a thing would even be permissable under Fcc
:  guidelines, but it would be interesting to try, wouldn't it? Such a
: joint peoject might once again prove that hams can STILL work together
: and innovate ideas that are just too risky for others to try. (but, then
: again , if hams develop it, more than likely, some corperation would
: probably steal it...NEVER MIND.)
:                          Dave/ KB2ZYO
:                           I Want To Belive...
--
.----------------------------------------------+--------------------------.
| INTERNET: [e-mail]     (DC436)     | Daniel Curry             |
| AMPRNET : [e-mail]  [44.4.20.144] | WB6STW                   |
| AX.25   : wb6stw@n0ary.#NOCAL.CA.USA.NOAM    | DoD # 1450   SOHC4 # 136 |
'----------------------------------------------+--------------------------'


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:29 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 11:55:11 GMT
Lines: 38

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>I don't know if this has ever been tried, but has any groop of hams tried
> to link enough repeaters together to attempt a coast to coast Qso on 2
>meters? I don't know If such a thing would even be permissable under Fcc
> guidelines, but it would be interesting to try, wouldn't it? Such a
>joint peoject might once again prove that hams can STILL work together
>and innovate ideas that are just too risky for others to try. (but, then
>again , if hams develop it, more than likely, some corperation would
>probably steal it...NEVER MIND.)
>                         Dave/ KB2ZYO
>                          I Want To Belive...

It would be legal. It wouldn't be much of a technical challenge.
But it would be a hell of organizational and political challenges
to make it happen. AT&T had such a radio network over 50 years
ago, microwave relay sites every 30 miles, but has abandoned it
now in favor of fiber and satellite links. I doubt any corporation
would be interested in amateur duplication of that.

Note, however, that there are a few interesting things which
could be done to accomplish this that would have useful side
effects. If the linking were done via medium speed packet
switched links, feasible with the 56kb modem, then a useful
side effect would be a continental terrestrial packet relay
network. Latency would be a bear, however.

Of course coast to coast links have been done before, using
10m linking. 10m propagation is currently in the doldrums,
but that'll change in a couple of years. Repeater sites which
have linked 2m and 10m repeaters will once again be able to
span the continent.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!swrinde!news-relay.us.dell.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com!not-for-mail
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 12:51:08 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: None
References: <[e-mail]>
X-Article-Creation-Date: Fri Dec 20 18:46:19 1996 GMT
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X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 35

In article <[e-mail]>,
  [e-mail] wrote:
>
> I don't know if this has ever been tried, but has any groop of hams tried
>  to link enough repeaters together to attempt a coast to coast Qso on 2
> meters? I don't know If such a thing would even be permissable under Fcc
>  guidelines, but it would be interesting to try, wouldn't it? Such a
> joint peoject might once again prove that hams can STILL work together
> and innovate ideas that are just too risky for others to try. (but, then
> again , if hams develop it, more than likely, some corperation would
> probably steal it...NEVER MIND.)
>                          Dave/ KB2ZYO
>                           I Want To Belive...

Hi Dave,

Certainly is possible, and maybe even has been done (but I
don't know for sure.)

Here in the middle of the country we have something called the
"superlink" which links repeaters across several states (4 or 5
last time I looked).  The link is "on call" in the sense that each
repeater normally only repeats it's own input, but the link to a
distant repeater can be established by entering a 3-digit
DTMF code which then activates the link to that distant
repeater (and any in the chain between.)

We have occasionally linked this network into other networks
and I recall one session where we had hams in Ohio talking to
hams on a Boeing sponsored repeater in the Seattle-Tacoma
area, all via UHF/VHF links.

73, de Hans, K0HB
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:31 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Date: Sat, 21 DEC 96 01:03:06 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1d.delphi.com
X-To: Gary Coffman <[e-mail]>

Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> writes:

>> to link enough repeaters together to attempt a coast to coast Qso on 2
>>meters? I don't know If such a thing would even be permissable under Fcc

The real challenge would be coast-to-coast WITHOUT repeaters on 2M.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:32 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code does save lives (was: HAM RADIO/CB)
Date: 12 Dec 1996 04:21:50 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <58o18u$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57m0sr$[e-mail]> <58c0l9$[e-mail]> <58jdkq$[e-mail]> <58l5q7$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58l5q7$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>I was on the receiving end of many a distress and lessor priority calls
>while working as a USCG CW op. The distress system that has replaced
>CW is plagued with problems, including countless false distress calls.

If you're talking about false/accidental EPRIB activations, that's a
problem, but better signal processing algorithms and the new 406 EPIRB's
*digitally* modulated signal with embedded ID not only minimizes the
effects of any false alarms, but also significantly improves acuracy fo
the fix and, even more importantly, allows the satellites to "store and
forward" the distress signal and fix information, allowing full coverage
of the world's oceans, not just in the areas where there is mutual
visibility between a vessel in distress and a shore-based satellite
earth station (the previous system left considerable areas of the
world's oceans without coverage) ...

BOTTOM LINE: the new digital system is *worlds* better than anything
previously available ... and it doesn't use CW at all ...

>But the new system is easier on the budget (computers rather than
>manpower). Keep that in mind: CW was replaced due to government down-
>sizing.

Translation: The new system is easier on the budget BECAUSE IT WORKS
BETTER AND MORE EFFICIENTLY ...

>The person who made the decision to drop MARS CW happens to be a
>no-code tech. Guess he felt a bit embarrassed not being able to
>copy MARS traffic, so instead of learning the code, he used his
>power to forbid its use.

No ... guess he accepts the technological reality of today'w world and
decided to spare MARS any further embarrasment in the world's
communications circles ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:33 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Code does save lives (was: HAM RADIO/CB)
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 03:31:39 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58qii1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <56pmat$[e-mail]> <575eib$[e-mail]> <57m0sr$[e-mail]> <58c0l9$[e-mail]> <58jdkq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan8.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>BTW, the USCG dropped CW from their roster several years ago. So did
>>several international shore stations around the world this year. MARS
>>also dropped CW this year and they not only save lives they brigthen
>>them up as well :)

>Most Catholic Priests have given up having sex.  Does that mean all
>hams should too ?

No ONE has suggested hams GIVE UP CW!!!

The issue is giving up CW testing.



Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:34 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Garry P. Adkins)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Subject: Computer Power Supply for 12v mobile?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 23:04:20 -0500
Organization: Ichthus Access Networking Inc., [phone]
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58vtc4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: piranha.ianet.net
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.cb:39350 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120732 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22066

Hi.

I have an older 286 computer that doesn't work anymore.  It's
a non-standard case, so I can't put a new motherboard in it.

Since the power supply puts out many amps at 12v on this
particular one...  Could I use it to power a mobile radio?

I realize I would have to apply the "power-good" signal (either
ground it or raise it, don't remember which) to get the supply
to work.. (at least that's how I remember it working, haven't
played with computer power supply in a while)

Would it be stable with no load on the 5v side?  Could I hook a
big transistor to the 5v size (to ground) to let it see a little
load?

If anyone has done this, I'd appreciate any pointers!

Thanks,
Garry


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:35 1996
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From: "Andreas Bahr" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Subject: Re: Computer Power Supply for 12v mobile?
Date: 17 Dec 1996 12:01:11 GMT
Organization: OCS AG
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <01bbec12$6a8e55a0$[e-mail]>
References: <58vtc4$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.cb:39520 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120900 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22108



Garry P. Adkins <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<58vtc4$[e-mail]>...
> Hi.
>
> I have an older 286 computer that doesn't work anymore.  It's
> a non-standard case, so I can't put a new motherboard in it.
>
> Since the power supply puts out many amps at 12v on this
> particular one...  Could I use it to power a mobile radio?
>
> I realize I would have to apply the "power-good" signal (either
> ground it or raise it, don't remember which) to get the supply
> to work.. (at least that's how I remember it working, haven't
> played with computer power supply in a while)
>
> Would it be stable with no load on the 5v side?  Could I hook a
> big transistor to the 5v size (to ground) to let it see a little
> load?
>
> If anyone has done this, I'd appreciate any pointers!
>
> Thanks,
> Garry
>

hi gary
i am using an old pwr-supply for driving lamps, motors, etc.
the 'power-good'-signal is an output i think; he tell's the watchdog of the
computer to protect the memory from writing if power fail's. this is 'cause
the cpu makes bullshit when power is not stable.
i never had problem's with unused power-lines, even if you have, don't use
a transistor, use a simple resistor (try a 50R, 1W).

BUT: The output of a computer-power-supply (a switching-power-supply) is
extremly noisy!!!
this is why i use it for lamps etc, remember that computer work's digital;
if you use the supply for analog gear, you will have problem's.

on the other side, there exist's switching-power-supply's for ham-radio
too. they work with frequencies higher than you can hear and they have much
filtering-parts.

so - if you want use your power-supply - no problem, but don't be surprised
about the 'side-effects'...

have fun...

andreas
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Phil M." <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Subject: Re: Computer Power Supply for 12v mobile?
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 16:41:48 -0500
Organization: Somewhere in the Listening Room
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vtc4$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.cb:39561 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120956 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22124

Garry P. Adkins wrote:
>
> Hi.
>
> I have an older 286 computer that doesn't work anymore.  It's
> a non-standard case, so I can't put a new motherboard in it.
>
> Since the power supply puts out many amps at 12v on this
> particular one...  Could I use it to power a mobile radio?
>
> I realize I would have to apply the "power-good" signal (either
> ground it or raise it, don't remember which) to get the supply
> to work.. (at least that's how I remember it working, haven't
> played with computer power supply in a while)
>
> Would it be stable with no load on the 5v side?  Could I hook a
> big transistor to the 5v size (to ground) to let it see a little
> load?
>
> If anyone has done this, I'd appreciate any pointers!
>
> Thanks,
> Garry

You can do this, but it can get noisy.
The power good is an output to the motherboard, not an input.
You will probably have to build some type of 'filter' board to feed the
output thru,
in order to clean it up a bit, maybe a big cap and a couple chokes.
Also, most supplies will not work unless there is a load on them.
Usually any line will
work, but you can smoke the switching transistors if there's no load on
it.

Enjoy,
Phil


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:38 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Computer Power Supply for 12v mobile?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <58vtc4$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 10:16:48 GMT
Lines: 45
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.cb:39683 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121188 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22213

In article <58vtc4$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Garry P.
Adkins) writes:
>I have an older 286 computer that doesn't work anymore.  It's
>a non-standard case, so I can't put a new motherboard in it.
>
>Since the power supply puts out many amps at 12v on this
>particular one...  Could I use it to power a mobile radio?
>
>I realize I would have to apply the "power-good" signal (either
>ground it or raise it, don't remember which) to get the supply
>to work.. (at least that's how I remember it working, haven't
>played with computer power supply in a while)
>
>Would it be stable with no load on the 5v side?  Could I hook a
>big transistor to the 5v size (to ground) to let it see a little
>load?

All of the PC supplies I've seen require a load on the 5 volt
bus to operate correctly. Usually a couple of amps draw is
enough to allow them to maintain regulation. A pair of 10
watt 4.7 ohm power resistors in parallel forms a good load.
They're switchers, of course, and need a load to operate
correctly. Usually the regulation is done on the 5 volt bus,
and the other voltages just follow this.

Most PC supplies only have about 2 amps capacity on the +12 volt
bus, and that isn't enough to power much of an amateur radio. The
bulk of the current capacity is on the 5 volt bus, which may be able
to source 20 amps. Newer supplies also often have a 2 amp capacity on
the -12 volt bus, but older supplies could only source a few hundred
milliamps on the -12 volt bus.

Mostly, I consider PC supplies merely as a source of parts for
amateur radio work. They aren't of much use as power supplies
except in computers and other things which need lots of 5 volt
current. They also often generate a lot of RF noise, and RF
ingress can cause them to lose regulation and allow the output
voltage to soar to very high values. That's a recipe for fried
radio.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:41 1996
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From: Sid Boyce <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Computer Power Supply for 12v mobile?
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Gary Coffman wrote:
>
> In article <58vtc4$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Garry P
. Adkins) writes:
> >I have an older 286 computer that doesn't work anymore.  It's
> >a non-standard case, so I can't put a new motherboard in it.
> >
> >Since the power supply puts out many amps at 12v on this
> >particular one...  Could I use it to power a mobile radio?
> >
> >I realize I would have to apply the "power-good" signal (either
> >ground it or raise it, don't remember which) to get the supply
> >to work.. (at least that's how I remember it working, haven't
> >played with computer power supply in a while)
> >
> >Would it be stable with no load on the 5v side?  Could I hook a
> >big transistor to the 5v size (to ground) to let it see a little
> >load?
>
> All of the PC supplies I've seen require a load on the 5 volt
> bus to operate correctly. Usually a couple of amps draw is
> enough to allow them to maintain regulation. A pair of 10
> watt 4.7 ohm power resistors in parallel forms a good load.
> They're switchers, of course, and need a load to operate
> correctly. Usually the regulation is done on the 5 volt bus,
> and the other voltages just follow this.
>
> Most PC supplies only have about 2 amps capacity on the +12 volt
> bus, and that isn't enough to power much of an amateur radio. The
> bulk of the current capacity is on the 5 volt bus, which may be able
> to source 20 amps. Newer supplies also often have a 2 amp capacity on
> the -12 volt bus, but older supplies could only source a few hundred
> milliamps on the -12 volt bus.
>
> Mostly, I consider PC supplies merely as a source of parts for
> amateur radio work. They aren't of much use as power supplies
> except in computers and other things which need lots of 5 volt
> current. They also often generate a lot of RF noise, and RF
> ingress can cause them to lose regulation and allow the output
> voltage to soar to very high values. That's a recipe for fried
> radio.
>
> Gary
> --
        Don't remember where I saw it, but some time ago I saw an article with
details of converting the +5 Volt to +13.8 Volt for use with a
transceiver, can't remember if it was a UK or a USA mag, I'll have a dig
around.
Regards

--
... Sid Boyce...Amdahl(UK)[e-mail]
                   -----------------------------------
Any opinions expressed above are mine and do not necessarily represent
 the opinions or policies of Amdahl Corporation.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:41 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Brian Kantor)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Subject: Re: Computer Power Supply for 12v mobile?
Date: 20 Dec 1996 22:21:19 GMT
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My test-bench 12 volt supply is three 5-volt 120-amp switching power
supplies wired in series.  I've turned each one of them down to 4.5
volts giving me a very nice clean 13.5 volt supply.  The ones I have
seem to regulate properly even with no load.
        - Brian


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:43 1996
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From: woody white <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Subject: Re: Computer Power Supply for 12v mobile?
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 01:53:05 -0800
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Hi Brian,

Glad to hear of someone doing that.  Is my plan also if my h'brew linear
13.6v, 100amp supply ever hopelessly blows up...(has been >19 yrs so far,
no failure).  I'll bet yours is lighter! :-)
_Woody_

Brian Kantor wrote:
>
> My test-bench 12 volt supply is three 5-volt 120-amp switching power
> supplies wired in series.  I've turned each one of them down to 4.5
> volts giving me a very nice clean 13.5 volt supply.  The ones I have
> seem to regulate properly even with no load.
>         - Brian

--
de  Woody (WB4QXE) -  [e-mail]
Electron Microscopist/Microanalysist,
Ham radio "homebrewer", shade tree mechanic,
'90 Nissan 240SX, wish still had my Mcycle too!
http://www.geocities.com/capecanaveral/3722
.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:43 1996
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From: "Samuel S. Yates" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Conn radio pop
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 21:05:04 +0000
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Timothy Haller wrote:
>
> --
>    Could somebody tell me which county in connhas the biggest ham pop.
>     thanks.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Timothy Haller
> [e-mail]
> I am a stranger in
> a really really str-
> -ange land

When I lived in Norwich, Conn, there was a ham there that weighed 525
lbs.  That was Norwich County (I think), so that may qualify for the
county with the "biggest ham" pop. ;-)
Happy holidays de AB4N


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:44 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Timothy Haller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Conn radio pop
Date: 13 Dec 1996 16:37:10 GMT
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--
   Could somebody tell me which county in connhas the biggest ham pop.
    thanks.










Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
I am a stranger in
a really really str-
-ange land


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] (dslosty)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Conn radio pop
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 08:02:26 GMT
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"Samuel S. Yates" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Timothy Haller wrote:
>>
>> --
>>    Could somebody tell me which county in connhas the biggest ham pop.
>>     thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Timothy Haller
>> [e-mail]
>> I am a stranger in
>> a really really str-
>> -ange land

>When I lived in Norwich, Conn, there was a ham there that weighed 525
>lbs.  That was Norwich County (I think), so that may qualify for the
>county with the "biggest ham" pop. ;-)
>Happy holidays de AB4N

T'ain't no "Norwich" county in Connecticut.
Norwich is in New London County.

Methinks that Fairfield county in Connecticut might have
the most, if not the biggest hams.

Doug





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:46 1996
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Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Cross band packet on Kenwood 733??
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: Don Labriola <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 13:37:51 -0800
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Would anyone know of a setup mode or procedure to allow the Kenwood 733a
to receive packet on one of the halves (UHF) and transmit on the other
(VHF) via the packet connector. What I'm really doing is trying to use
the packet connector to connect into an AEA radiolink controller for use
as a remote, and the packet connector provides 1) a shielded audio input
with PTT (the normal mic is hard to shield), 2) Audio out, and 3)Squelch
detect (COR) output. I can get any two by other methods. The packet, as
far as I can tell, will only direct the received audio from the side
that is selected as transmit (PTT), not from the selected "control"
channel.

Any suggestions or help is appreciated. (Please also E-mail - I don't
always get to read all of the news groups before they go stale - our
local news server tends to have a fairly short memory span!)

73's de W6QS


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:48 1996
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From: tnic <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Cross band packet on Kenwood 733??
Date: 12 Dec 1996 23:03:12 GMT
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The instructions for cross band repeat can be found on the Kenwood web page

http://www.kenwood.net

They dont put the instructions for cross band repeat or wireless memory
programing (to a like rig) and wireless remote control

because many of those features are not leagle in certain cournties.

Go to the web bage and look for the tech notes.

Enjoy.


In rec.radio.amateur.equipment Don Labriola <[e-mail]>
 wrote:
: Would anyone know of a setup mode or procedure to allow the Kenwood 733a
: to receive packet on one of the halves (UHF) and transmit on the other
: (VHF) via the packet connector. What I'm really doing is trying to use
: the packet connector to connect into an AEA radiolink controller for use
: as a remote, and the packet connector provides 1) a shielded audio input
: with PTT (the normal mic is hard to shield), 2) Audio out, and 3)Squelch
: detect (COR) output. I can get any two by other methods. The packet, as
: far as I can tell, will only direct the received audio from the side
: that is selected as transmit (PTT), not from the selected "control"
: channel.

: Any suggestions or help is appreciated. (Please also E-mail - I don't
: always get to read all of the news groups before they go stale - our
: local news server tends to have a fairly short memory span!)

: 73's de W6QS


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:50 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Doug Wittich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Cross band packet on Kenwood 733??
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:09:33 GMT
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Don Labriola <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Would anyone know of a setup mode or procedure to allow the Kenwood 733a
>to receive packet on one of the halves (UHF) and transmit on the other
>(VHF) via the packet connector. What I'm really doing is trying to use
>the packet connector to connect into an AEA radiolink controller for use
>as a remote, and the packet connector provides 1) a shielded audio input
>with PTT (the normal mic is hard to shield), 2) Audio out, and 3)Squelch
>detect (COR) output. I can get any two by other methods. The packet, as
>far as I can tell, will only direct the received audio from the side

My understanding, though I have not tested it, is that the transmit
side as selected by the bandsel will take whatever is coming in on the
pkt connector.  You can feed the speaker of the passive side receive
in on the mic line in the packet connecter, perhaps.

I'm trying to receive packet on one side for APRS while using the
other side for a phone QSO, and my info is that I must feed the audio
out of the speaker to the TNC, and not use the output of the pkt
connector, as that will have the audio from the active side on it.  OF
course, I will not be able to transmit pkt in this configuration.


Doug in Baltimore


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:50 1996
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From: "David Lawson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ctcss decoder wanted 12VDC dipswitch programable
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:30:28 GMT
Organization: Digital Designs
Lines: 21
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Mike <[e-mail]> wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
> Bill wrote:
> >
> > I am looking for a ctcss decoder. I live in northern new jersey.
> > Please give best price. 73 Bll   Hell Bill,
> I just saw what you are looking for be advertised in CQ VHF. It is DIP
> switch programmable, ctcss encoder, 67 to 203.5 hzdim are .9"x1.3"x.4".
> the model number is ss-32pa and the asking price is $28.95. the company
> address is COMMUNICATION SPECIALISTS, INC.
>            426 WEST TAFT AV.
>            ORANGE, CALIF. 92665-3420
> PH# 714 998-3021 OR FAX [phone]
>     800 854-0574
>
> THEY ALSO HAVE A FRONT DIAL SELECTABLE UNIT FOR $49.95
> hOPE IT HELPS YOU.
> 73 Mike K6YPB
>
hell mike, he's looking for a DEcoder!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:51 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ctcss decoder wanted 12VDC dipswitch programable
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 03:27:14 GMT
Organization: XMission Internet (801 539 0900)
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"David Lawson" <[e-mail]> wrote:



>Mike <[e-mail]> wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
>> Bill wrote:
>> >
>> > I am looking for a ctcss decoder. I live in northern new jersey.
>> > Please give best price. 73 Bll   Hell Bill,
>> I just saw what you are looking for be advertised in CQ VHF. It is DIP
>> switch programmable, ctcss encoder, 67 to 203.5 hzdim are .9"x1.3"x.4".
>> the model number is ss-32pa and the asking price is $28.95. the company
>> address is COMMUNICATION SPECIALISTS, INC.
>>            426 WEST TAFT AV.
>>            ORANGE, CALIF. 92665-3420
>> PH# 714 998-3021 OR FAX [phone]
>>     800 854-0574
>>
>> THEY ALSO HAVE A FRONT DIAL SELECTABLE UNIT FOR $49.95
>> hOPE IT HELPS YOU.
>> 73 Mike K6YPB
>>
>hell mike, he's looking for a DEcoder!

Call Communication Specialist, Inc. anyway.  They make a
encoder/decoder.  Model TS-32P.  Price is  $57.95.

Ross
N7VWX



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:52 1996
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From: [e-mail] (RIlowite)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Cu-Seeme Video conferencing
Date: 19 Dec 1996 21:39:42 GMT
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Dear OM;; I am interested in cu-seeme,  but how is it accomplished? Could
you E'Mail me with info on this subject. What software is neccessary, What
hardware?
Thanks, Ralph (W2GKG)   E'Mail== [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:53 1996
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From: Jim Smith <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Cushcraft Triband Beam
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 14:19:26 -0800
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Can anyone tell me how broad is the 10 meter bandwidth for the A3S
triband antenna.  Does it cover the entire way from 28 through 29.7 MHZ
with a reasonable SWR.  Thanks.

Jim
KI4BU


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:55 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Len Winkler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.info,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: CW Fans ONLY!
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Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <58p9os$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120445 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44134 rec.radio.info:12396 rec.radio.shortwave:90257

On Sunday, 12-22-96, on the Ham Radio & More Show,
listeners will be asked to call in on the toll-free line,
1-800-293-5366, and they will have up to 90 seconds
 to say their piece on why CW is important to keep as a
requirement. The host will not interrupt. So prepare
your statements in advance and be ready, you will be
cut off for the next caller at 90 seconds.
12-22-96 is ONLY for PRO-CODE callers.
The following week, 12-29-96, is for the other view.
Same rules apply.
Show info below and on the home page.
Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
P.O. Box 9219                                         [e-mail]
Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219                  ARIZONA ARRL PIC

Ham Radio & More Show info at:
http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/hrm.htm
http://www.tapr.org/hrm  (RealAudio site to hear past shows) (Thanks TAPR)

The Ham Radio & More Show airs LIVE each Sunday at 6:00pm ET,
(2300utc), on many local commercial stations throughout the country.
ALSO: LIVE on WWCR Shortwave, 5.070mhz.
ALSO: LIVE on RealAudio at: http://www.AudioNet.com/radio/business/kbnp (Thank
s KBNP)

Also available tape delayed via WWCR Shortwave on Mondays,
at 1000utc on 3.210mhz, and Sundays at 0600utc on 5.070mhz.

Support "WOG", the Written Only General!
WOG info at http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/wog.htm



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:56 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 17:14:16 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58j4n2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: camoore-desk.ch.intel.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)

Jeffrey Herman wrote:
> Hi Cec, Shame on you for believing Samuel had anything to do with CW, which
> came into being in the early 1920s (just a few years before voice).

Hi Jeff, that's true but we don't test potential hams for CW. We
test them for Morse code, a code invented in the 19th century.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:58 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 04:15:32 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <58o0r6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sjx-ca83-21.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 11  8:14:30 PM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>If you want a car analogy, consider Morse the Citroen CV-2 of radio.
>It is crude, slow, ugly, and has very little cargo capacity (throughput),
>but it runs on most any rotgut gasoline and can sometimes be repaired
>by the village blacksmith, or at least be converted into a covered
>ox cart.

>I'd prefer to stick with that favorite of third world nations
>everywhere, the armored Chevy Suburban, or Jeep Cherokee, or maybe
>a fancy Mercedes SUV if I'm rich as a Saudi sheik. (IE PACTOR,
>Clover, or PACTOR II). Or if the roads are at least gravelled,
>then I'll take a Chevy pickup (gunrack optional), IE SSB. And
>for the interstate, I'll take that Camry, IE FM via repeater.

I'm not sure if this analogy is exactly true either.  After all,
as late as 1994, CW was used to set world records for long distance
communications by amateurs on several bands.    Some of the over land
records are under 1000 miles.  Perhaps newer modes, with their
superior reliability, will extend these records in the near future.

All of the EME distance records are CW, which leads to the natural
question of "why?".    Which mode would *you* use if you wanted
to communicate DX via EME, and why?

Dick WD0ANB






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:06:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 17:07:44 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58pe50$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o239$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <58o239$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In <[e-mail]>, "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]> writes:
>>> There is no longer any legal justification for
>>> requiring knowledge of a 19th-century communications mode to obtain an
>>> amateur radio license.  If you still want to start your car by use of
>>> a hand crank, fine...but you have no right to force it

>>First of all, it's an early 20th-century invention, not 19th. Second,
>>the car analogy isn't quite right:

>Guess again ... Morse code was invented in the 1840's ... 1847, if I
>recall correctly ... that's the 19th Century, NOT the 20th ...

When one speaks of CW (Continuous Waves as opposed to Damped Waves)
they are speaking of a 1920 invention, Carl. How one decides to
impose intelligence upon CW (in our case, Morse code) is entirely
a different story.

But really, it's age is irrelevant. Typing on a keyboard is pretty old
stuff, and communicating by voice is millions of years old; the older,
proven things will be with us for a long, long time.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:01 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 17:28:07 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <58pfb7$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o0r6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>If you want a car analogy, consider Morse the Citroen CV-2 of radio.
>It is crude, slow, ugly, and has very little cargo capacity (throughput),
>but it runs on most any rotgut gasoline and can sometimes be repaired
>by the village blacksmith, or at least be converted into a covered
>ox cart.

CW is crude? How so? We're communicating here by tapping on a keyboard -
that's rather crude (an 1875 invention). Communicating by voice is
rather crude, too - been doing that for millions of years. On the
air hams probably talk at a rate of around 100wpm, type at about
50wpm, and do code, on the average, around 15 to 20, but as high
50wpm. Given the usual topics we discuss on the air, I don't see
any one mode as being more crude than another.

>I'd prefer to stick with that favorite of third world nations
>everywhere, the armored Chevy Suburban, or Jeep Cherokee, or maybe
>a fancy Mercedes SUV if I'm rich as a Saudi sheik. (IE PACTOR,
>Clover, or PACTOR II). Or if the roads are at least gravelled,
>then I'll take a Chevy pickup (gunrack optional), IE SSB. And
>for the interstate, I'll take that Camry, IE FM via repeater.

You must visit the 3rd world drug production countries. None
of that exists in Viet Nam or Cambodia, or a hundred other
countries.

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!news.eunet.fi!jjo
From: [e-mail] (Jari Jokiniemi)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 13:16:07 GMT
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
        <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ds10.tekla.fi
In-reply-to: [e-mail]'s message of 12 Dec 1996 04:48:55 GMT


In article <58o2rn$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
   Right now, the government is forcing the code on anyone who wants to get

One should note that it is not really the government which is to blame.
It is the majority of the amateurs themselves. At least in
Finland it has been that THK (our equivalent of FCC) would have
permitted a change but the amateurs themselves have told that the old
system should be kept.

Right now I am eagerly waiting what will happen to our call areas. So
far we have had 10 call areas which roughly follow the province
lines. Yesterday the parliament decided to combine several
provinces into larger ones. I hope, against the general opinion of OH
hams, that the call area system would be abandoned totally. USA is
much larger than Finland and if USA does not need a call area system,
why should we? It is not the THK which is the cause for this
unfortunate state of still having call areas in here. It is ourselves,
the local hams, who have insisted on keeping the old system.

Much of the problems you may have might be of similar self-developed
origin.


--
Jari Jokiniemi, [e-mail], OH2MPO, OH3BU
Tekla Oy, Koronakatu 1, 02210 Espoo, [phone]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:03 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 18:14:56 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58q3lg$[e-mail]>
References: <58o2rn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

[e-mail] wrote:

   Right now, the government is forcing RF theory on anyone who wants to get
   into ham radio, even if all they want is to talk on the radio with other
   stations with modes that have nothing to do with the theory they are
   forced to learn ... it is backward. However, the techno-crats bitch
   and whine at the thought that someone non-technical might actually get
   into ham radio and promote the use of a mode that has absolutely nothing
   to do with technologically-advanced modes and yet at the same time still
   have fun doing it. Amateur radio isn't about having fun, dammit all!
   We are trying to use these fora to raise the consciousness of those who
   don't particularly care one way or the other, so that they begin to see
   just how important it is to abolish theory testing and drag ham radio,
   kicking and screaming into the 21st Century before it's too late and
   there is no ham radio any more.


Absolutely 100% correct Carl. I couldn't agree with you more.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:04 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 22:59:49 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58p1dl$[e-mail]> <58qf73$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv17.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58qf73$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> However, there are a lot of things going on ... there are two STAs
> allowing SS testing ... it's ridiculous that the use of SS is limited to
> STAs, though ... hell, I'm building comsumer products with 900MHz spread
> spectrum systems in them at work ...

Wowsers, cordless telephones and baby monitors.  But, it's a living



>
> We need to "Elmer" them and "show them the way" ... unfortunately, there
> are too many "yackers and gamers" and they are perverting ham radio into
> what they want it to be and what it's *supposed* to be is falling by the
> wayside ... that HAS to stop, or we will lose the bands ... NO WAY will
> the FCC continue to allow us to control billions of dollars worth of
> spectrum if they realize that all we're doing is playing games ...
>
>
> >They just want to talk on the radio.  They
> >could care less how it works and they depend on others to tell them or
> >hold their hand to show them how their new HT or mobile rig works.
>
> They're not acting like hams ... more CBers (some beep, some don't) ...

Good one Carl.. Another quote for the mailing lists.  Keep em coming.  I
am sure you're helping your cause by insulting the very people you wish
to reach.


>
> >Modernization of ham radio...hmmmm.  You don't want it to be an
> >evolutionary thing.  You want to go from the amoeba to upright talking
> >homosapien in one step.
>
> NO .. it USED to be the leader ... it's fallen behind and it's time to
> play catch-up ... fast and deadly serious, or we'll lose it ...
>

Not according to Len it isn't.  Didn't you read what he wrote.  The ARS
is a follower and user of other technologies, not a leader.


>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:05 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:54:38 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <58qqv0$[e-mail]>
References: <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58q3lg$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-23.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan

Gums don't kill people...well...unless they have periodontal disease.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 20:30:18 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58qu8o$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-131.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>Nobody is looking for instant gratification ... we want to work for the
>future of ham radio by building, experimenting, and improving our
>technology ... by meeting the purposes and goals that ham radio is
>*supposed* to be about ...

>Morse code /= ham radio ...

>radio technology, experimentation, learning, self-improvement = ham
>radio.

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

Let me borrow a phrase from you, Squiggie. 'Bullshit'.  How stupid do you thin
k
the readers of RRAP are ?  How many times have you said you have been licensed
for 20+ years ? Long time, right ?  In those 20+ years, what have YOU done
'for the future of ham radio by building, experimenting, and improving our
technology'.  Nuttin. Nada. Zip. Zero.  But now you want us to believe that if
you talk us into letting you onto HF without taking a code test, you will all
of
a sudden get off your butt and start doing things 'for the future of ham radio
by building, experimenting, and improving our technology' ?  In a pigs eye.  I
f
we let you on HF tommorrow, you'd be on 20 meter SSB yaking with Lenny.
You aren't looking for 'instant gratification', you are grasping for reasons t
o
justify something for nothing.   HF access won't make you a better person, so
write that idea off the list.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 02:00:32 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58t1o0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58qu8o$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-03.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58qu8o$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writ
es:
>
>Let me borrow a phrase from you, Squiggie. 'Bullshit'.  How stupid do you thi
nk
>the readers of RRAP are ?  How many times have you said you have been license
d
>for 20+ years ? Long time, right ?  In those 20+ years, what have YOU done
>'for the future of ham radio by building, experimenting, and improving our
>technology'.  Nuttin. Nada. Zip. Zero.

Jim ... you have no idea of the numerous things I've done to improve
radio technology ... things that are *directly*  applicable to ham
radio.  It' not *my* fault that you and some others are too techically
backward to recognize the value of more advanced technology ... you guys
who simply want to remain stagnant in past decades' technology *are*
simply CBers who beep ...

So get off my case, lid ... *you* are the one who's done nothing to make
ham radio better ... and you actually seem *proud* of it ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 13:32:08 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58t1o0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Carl I dont know about the rest of the Guys but I would like to know what
you have done in the Past to Make Ham Radio Better?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 10:12:04 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58qu8o$[e-mail]> <58t1o0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga6-24.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14  4:13:25 AM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201

On 14 Dec 1996 02:00:32 GMT, [e-mail] wrote:

>In <58qu8o$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wri
tes:
>>
>>Let me borrow a phrase from you, Squiggie. 'Bullshit'.  How stupid do you th
ink
>>the readers of RRAP are ?  How many times have you said you have been licens
ed
>>for 20+ years ? Long time, right ?  In those 20+ years, what have YOU done
>>'for the future of ham radio by building, experimenting, and improving our
>>technology'.  Nuttin. Nada. Zip. Zero.
>
>Jim ... you have no idea of the numerous things I've done to improve
>radio technology ... things that are *directly*  applicable to ham
>radio.
The list starts here:
#1 -
>It' not *my* fault that you and some others are too techically
>backward to recognize the value of more advanced technology ... you guys
>who simply want to remain stagnant in past decades' technology *are*
>simply CBers who beep ...
>
>So get off my case, lid ... *you* are the one who's done nothing to make
>ham radio better ... and you actually seem *proud* of it ...
>
Isn't *lid* a CW term? Tell us Carl what have you done in 20+ years to
advance technology as a member of the ARS.
>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]
>
>

To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:12 1996
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 02:03:30 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58t1ti$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58p1dl$[e-mail]> <58qf73$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn19.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <58qf73$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...

>First, there are many regulatory barriers to the use of advanced modes
>like spread spectrum, better modulation techniques, error correction
>coding schemes, and other things ... we need quite a few other changes
>in addition to the removal of the code test ...
>
>However, there are a lot of things going on ... there are two STAs
>allowing SS testing ... it's ridiculous that the use of SS is limited to
>STAs, though ... hell, I'm building comsumer products with 900MHz spread
>spectrum systems in them at work ...

Carl, you say you have no commercial interest in amateur radio, yet you inform

everyone in the newsgroup of what you're working on and what needs to be done.

You should be more careful. People tend to call things as they see them.


>We need to "Elmer" them and "show them the way" ... unfortunately, there
>are too many "yackers and gamers" and they are perverting ham radio into
>what they want it to be and what it's *supposed* to be is falling by the
>wayside ... that HAS to stop, or we will lose the bands ... NO WAY will
>the FCC continue to allow us to control billions of dollars worth of
>spectrum if they realize that all we're doing is playing games ...

Could you be a bit more specific as to what you mean by "yackers and gamers?"
I became a ham because it was fun, now you're saying that by my having fun in
my chosen hobby, I'm wasting billions of dollars of spectrum. It's really too
bad that so many people see things only in terms of dollar signs nowadays.

Tom,
N8ECW



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:13 1996
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From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!!
Date: 16 Dec 1996 16:28:51 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Because Carl has no Contibutions to make. All he has is reason why he
should be able to Play with the Big Boys without doing anything. Amd I
dont think we will ever see any great Contributions to Ham Radio unless it
would be some kind of New Mic Switch that operates His HF rig. Carl you
our so full of it, why dont you just come Clean and tell everyone your
real Motivation, and I dont mean this Techno Crap that you have no
Intentions of Doing.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-9.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!! or Carl found a penny
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 22:03:16 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58p1dl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qfkn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv27.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58qfkn$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF
2TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
> Steve ... you're an idiot ... your claims are TOTALLY false ... TOTALLY.
> I have repeatedly stated that, so it's clear that you're just trying to
> piss me off ... but guess what? ... the rantings of idiots like you
> don't really piss me off, they actually make me ROFL ...

TSK TSK, such names and from someone as pious as yourself.  How can you
say they're false Carl??  They're just my opinions.  Are you now stating
that I am not entitled to an opinion or is that something only you are
allows to express??  By the way ROFL?? and you claim that people who say
QSL and QRM are fools...tsk tsk

Take a pill Carl and relax, it's just a hobby.

>
> >--
> >Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
> >ARRL LIFE Member
> >PLEASE DEPOSIT 10 DOLLARS FOR THE NEXT 3 QSO'S PLEASE....THIS HAS BEEN A
> >RECORDING OF THE CARL/LEN PROFESSIONAL RADIO SERVICE
> >
> >PROUDLY PROFITING OFF THOSE WHO WANT TO HAVE FUN BY YACKING CONTESTING
> >GAMING AND DX'ING SINCE 1999.
>
> Pathetic, Steve, simply pathetic ... please get yourself some
> much-needed psychiatric help ...

Gee Carl, just parroting your words, Have you a problem??

ding ding


>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:15 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW Is Dead...Get Over It!! or Carl found a penny
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:39:19 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58qfkn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58p1dl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-28.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>> [e-mail] wrote:
>
>
>> >radio technology, experimentation, learning, self-improvement = ham
>> >radio.
>
>Actually equals play for pay.  The wholesale leasing of amateur bands to
>amateurs by 2 billion dollar a year communications entities.

Steve ... you're an idiot ... your claims are TOTALLY false ... TOTALLY.
I have repeatedly stated that, so it's clear that you're just trying to
piss me off ... but guess what? ... the rantings of idiots like you
don't really piss me off, they actually make me ROFL ...

>--
>Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
>ARRL LIFE Member
>PLEASE DEPOSIT 10 DOLLARS FOR THE NEXT 3 QSO'S PLEASE....THIS HAS BEEN A
>RECORDING OF THE CARL/LEN PROFESSIONAL RADIO SERVICE
>
>PROUDLY PROFITING OFF THOSE WHO WANT TO HAVE FUN BY YACKING CONTESTING
>GAMING AND DX'ING SINCE 1999.

Pathetic, Steve, simply pathetic ... please get yourself some
much-needed psychiatric help ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:01:55 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <58o3k3$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <589lhv$[e-mail]>, T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A <teixeira@ccnet
.com> writes:
>Those who think code is outdated just don't know what they are talking about.
  Most have
>never used code and those who did  only used it to get their license.
>
>There is a movie out called Independence Day. Yes it's sci-fi fiction but in
the movie there
>is a national disaster and the only communication that worked was CW.

Yea, right ... REALLY realistic ... the advanced alien culture that came
here to destroy us all and could jam every other form of communications
was defeated by some brass pounders ... jeezzzz ... give me a freaking
break ...

>If a nuclear device ever went off,  the
>EMP would take out all the computers and much of the radio gear.

That is a pouplar misconception ... properly designed, reasonably
protected equipment stands a pretty good chance of surviving an EMP
event ... any gear kept in standby (not connected to AC lines or
antennae) stands an even better chance ...

>A battery and some wire may be your only transmitter.

Excuse me ... are you talking 12V spark here or what????

>Reqiring all Hams to at least have a basic idea of code is a
>great resource in such an emergency.

If CW were such a great resource, the military, Coast Guard, MARS, the
worldwide maritime industry, and all the other dozens of services who
*used* to use Morse would *still* use Morse ... they don't ... they've
dropped it like a hot rock in favor of more modern, efficient modes.

These pro-code arguments are simply a bunch of emotional drivel with NO
basis in fact or reality ... wake up ... Morse code IS (virtually) dead
.. ONLY in ham radio (where it's on artificial life support) is it even
breathing ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.233.85.167!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:21:46 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <58qp1b$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]> <58o3k3$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-23.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

> Morse code IS (virtually) dead
>.. ONLY in ham radio (where it's on artificial life support) is it even
>breathing ...

I suggest you tune around the HF spectrum some and if you can tell me
that you hear no cw outside the ham bands I will tell you that your
antenna is too low, too short or non-existant.







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:18 1996
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From: Ron Whitney <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 17:06:08 -0500
Organization: Compumatics, Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: comp3.compumatics.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

T E I X E I R A wrote:
>
> Most have never used code and those who did  only used it to get their licen
se.

Could it be that there is a reason for that?

> There is a movie out called Independence Day. Yes it's sci-fi fiction but in
 the movie there
> is a national disaster and the only communication that worked was CW.  When
all else fails
> you can use wire and a battery for a CW transmitter.  If a nuclear device ev
er went off,  the
> EMP would take out all the computers and much of the radio gear.

And how many hams do you know who actually have enough knowledge to
_construct_ a CW transceiver?
(remember, you need both sides)  My opinion is that if the EMP were
strong enough to destroy
electronic equipment, the people around them wouldn't be in much better
shape.  Considering all the _modern_ means of communicating, I doubt
that CW would play a major role today.

> Reqiring all Hams to at least have a basic idea of code is a great resource
in such an
> emergency.

If being of service in an emergency is really what you want hams to be,
I think it would be
more prudent to train them in First Aid, CPR, storm spotting, etc.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:19 1996
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From: T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 6 Dec 1996 17:35:59 GMT
Organization: o00o  <0>(_)<0>   o00o
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <589lhv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: h80-32-138.ccnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-URL: news:[e-mail]

Those who think code is outdated just don't know what they are talking about.
 Most have
never used code and those who did  only used it to get their license.

There is a movie out called Independence Day. Yes it's sci-fi fiction but in t
he movie there
is a national disaster and the only communication that worked was CW.  When al
l else fails
you can use wire and a battery for a CW transmitter.  If a nuclear device ever
 went off,  the
EMP would take out all the computers and much of the radio gear.  A battery an
d some
wire may be your only transmitter.   But if there was no one on the other end
who could
copy code?????   Oh well.....Reqiring all Hams to at least have a basic idea o
f code is a
great resource in such an emergency.  If it were not "required" most would not
 bother
learning CW.

My Opinion,
Don W6IQ




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is not outdated
Date: 14 Dec 1996 09:15:53 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58tr89$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Ron Whitney ([e-mail]) wrote:

: And how many hams do you know who actually have enough knowledge to
: _construct_ a CW transceiver?

Well, I could - although it would be an awfully simple receiver.

: (remember, you need both sides)  My opinion is that if the EMP were
: strong enough to destroy
: electronic equipment, the people around them wouldn't be in much better
: shape.  Considering all the _modern_ means of communicating, I doubt
: that CW would play a major role today.

On the contrary, an EMP will not really affect people, but it will do
a good job of destroying most unprotected transistor circuitry. Old
tube technology is pretty much immune.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!129.34.139.15!newsgate.watson.ibm.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CW is Older Than Grandpa Lenny
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 05:39:38 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58pa2l$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]> <58o3k3$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-159.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:


>If CW were such a great resource, the military, Coast Guard, MARS, the
>worldwide maritime industry, and all the other dozens of services who
>*used* to use Morse would *still* use Morse ... they don't ... they've
>dropped it like a hot rock in favor of more modern, efficient modes.

Go join the Coast Guard or better yet, move to MARS.
Next time I hear OK1DX/MM on CW, I'll tell him you said he isn't supposed
to do that any more.

>These pro-code arguments are simply a bunch of emotional drivel with NO
>basis in fact or reality ... wake up ... Morse code IS (virtually) dead
>.. ONLY in ham radio (where it's on artificial life support) is it even
>breathing ...

The King of Emotional Drivel has Spoken.  No, Grandpa Lenny is on artificial
life support, CW is alive and well on the ham bands.  You just WISH it was
virtually dead.   Wish in one hand, Squiggy in the other. See which one fills
up
the fastest.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:23 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:05:59 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <58o3rn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, Cecil Moore <[e-mail].c
om> writes:
>Bill Nelson wrote:
>> Why should a person have to learn electronic theory, when all they want to
>> do is buy a rig and start yacking?
>
>Hi Bill, because until the rigs are all type-accepted, learning electronic
>theory is relevant to amateur radio. CW skill is no longer relevant. It is
>a very old artifact that needs to be removed from the testing requirement.

Yes, Cecil ... but you don't even want to think about imposing a
type-acceptance requirement ... that will drive the remaining few ham
manufacturers out of business (or at least out of the ham market)

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:14:17 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58o4b9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58inf4$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58inf4$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>
>IMO, it is quite contrary to what you say.  If people are making all this fus
s
>over what you admit is an easy skill, imagine what they'll cry when you
>increase the technical difficulty, especially if they have no intention of
>designing or building anything.

Au contrair ... most of us no-code-test advocates are technical types
who freely state that we think the theory tests are a damned joke ...
and we *do* want to design and build ... many of us do it
provfessionally and want to bring those skills to the ARS ... but lack
of HF access is a barrier to testing things for that environment ... and
many of the engineers I have worked with over my 25+year career simply
refuse to stick their noses up the backside of some "higher class"
beeper who knows less than they do and still looks down on them because
they don't beep ...

>BTW, it also contradicts Carl Stevenson's harping on about "CB'ers who
>beep".  I find it quite ironic that the very people he supports are the
>ones who, in my experience, are most like CB'ers.

Au contrair ... I've referred many times to the dozens and dozens of
highly competent RF professionals I've worked with over the years who
have not become hams PURELY because of the code requirment ...

AND I have also voiced my distaste for those who merely "yack and beep"
like "CBers with an attitude" ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.80.63.252!delphi.com!usenet
From: "Cecil A. Moore" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 07:17:09 -0700
Organization: Delphi Internet Services Corporation
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58inf4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip64.phoenix.az.interramp.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; U)

[e-mail] wrote:
> If people are making all this fuss over what you admit is an easy  skill,
> imagine what they'll cry when you increase the technical difficulty...
> Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

Hi Chris, I should have put a smiley on that posting. I simply used exactly
the same logic as the pro-code-testers use but mine was tongue-in-cheek.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:26 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 06:54:31 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58inf4$[e-mail]> <58o4b9$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv25.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58o4b9$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> Au contrair ... most of us no-code-test advocates are technical types
> who freely state that we think the theory tests are a damned joke ...
> and we *do* want to design and build ... many of us do it
> provfessionally and want to bring those skills to the ARS


Ah yes, Carl's true agenda.  The commercialization of the ARS.  Also
known as play of for pay.


> ... but lack
> of HF access is a barrier to testing things for that environment

Gee Carl, YOU'VE had access of over 20 years, what have you to show for
it??

> ... and
> many of the engineers I have worked with over my 25+year career simply
> refuse to stick their noses up the backside of some "higher class"
> beeper who knows less than they do and still looks down on them because
> they don't beep ...

Then obviously, this hobby is not for them, maybe something like
needlepoint or knitting would be more their speed.


>
> >BTW, it also contradicts Carl Stevenson's harping on about "CB'ers who
> >beep".  I find it quite ironic that the very people he supports are the
> >ones who, in my experience, are most like CB'ers.
>
> Au contrair ... I've referred many times to the dozens and dozens of
> highly competent RF professionals I've worked with over the years who
> have not become hams PURELY because of the code requirment ...

see above.

>
> AND I have also voiced my distaste for those who merely "yack and beep"
> like "CBers with an attitude" ...
>

Maybe YOU should find a new hobby.  Seems that the reason the ARS is
using what it does is because of the beepers who wnat to beep further and
yackers who want to yack further.

BTW, the BEEPER and YACKER reflectors LOVE your posting.  You've been
voted amateur of the year!!!


> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 05:44:38 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58pac1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58inf4$[e-mail]> <58o4b9$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-159.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>Au contrair ... most of us no-code-test advocates are technical types
>who freely state that we think the theory tests are a damned joke ...
>and we *do* want to design and build ... many of us do it
>provfessionally and want to bring those skills to the ARS ... but lack
>of HF access is a barrier to testing things for that environment ... and

Uh huh. Sure. Spread Spectrum ONLY works on 20 meters.....

>many of the engineers I have worked with over my 25+year career simply
>refuse to stick their noses up the backside of some "higher class"
>beeper who knows less than they do and still looks down on them because
>they don't beep ...

Which railroad do these engineers with an attitude work for Squiggy ?

>Au contrair ... I've referred many times to the dozens and dozens of
>highly competent RF professionals I've worked with over the years who
>have not become hams PURELY because of the code requirment ...

It's 'below' them.  We really miss them on HF Squiggy, nobody to talk to
since all those RF pro-fessionals aren't there.

>AND I have also voiced my distaste for those who merely "yack and beep"
>like "CBers with an attitude" ...

You have voiced your distaste for about every facet of amateur radio that has
anything to do with HF.  CW, contesting, DX'ing, ragchewing, they all suck
according to you.  Which makes me wonder WHY you wanna get on HF SOOOO
bad if it sucks.....

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 12 Dec 1996 16:49:52 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58pd3g$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o3rn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <58o3rn$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Yes, Cecil ... but you don't even want to think about imposing a
>type-acceptance requirement ... that will drive the remaining few ham
>manufacturers out of business (or at least out of the ham market)

One wonders why you would immediately think of the manufacturers
instead of the homebrewers? Given your (empty?) concern that not
enough folks are building gear today, one would expect your worries
to be centered upon the home builders - the manufactuers could and
would adapt to type-acceptance (and reward us with higher prices in
return).

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:58:33 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 55
Message-ID: <58ovhp$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58inf4$[e-mail]> <58o4b9$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <58o4b9$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Au contrair ... most of us no-code-test advocates are technical types
>who freely state that we think the theory tests are a damned joke ...
>and we *do* want to design and build ... many of us do it
>provfessionally and want to bring those skills to the ARS ... but lack
>of HF access is a barrier to testing things for that environment

Yada Yada Yada... Blah Blah Blah.

Hey Carl, your record is stuck again.

[Carl forgets that everything above 30mhz has been available for half
a decade with no code examination.

To think... All this effort to get on "HF" where the primary activities
are two-fold: contesting and DXing... Two activities that Carl admits he
despises...

Oh, woe is Carl. Maybe someone should write a play. This could rank
right up there with some of those Greek tragedies I had to read in
high-school.


>many of the engineers I have worked with over my 25+year career simply
>refuse to stick their noses up the backside of some "higher class"
>beeper who knows less than they do and still looks down on them because
>they don't beep ...

As opposed to what? Your '25+year career' buddies who look down on everyone
else in amateur radio because they have "forgotten more RF theory while
eating breakfast that the combined knowledge of the entire universe's
ham population put together" will ever know? (Your words, Carl.)

Despite the lack of good theoretical examinations, I'll take what we
have today: a cross-section of Americana, where I can pick up the
microphone and talk to a cardiovascular surgeon, security guard, and
housewife in a roundtable, rather than a bunch of bigoted techno-snobs
who work for some commercial venture.



>Au contrair ... I've referred many times to the dozens and dozens of
>highly competent RF professionals I've worked with over the years who
>have not become hams PURELY because of the code requirment ...

And to think they don't know how to read... Otherwise they would have
discovered that Tech license half-a-decade ago.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:48:05 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <58qg55$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o3rn$[e-mail]> <58pd3g$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-28.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58pd3g$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>In article <58o3rn$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>Yes, Cecil ... but you don't even want to think about imposing a
>>type-acceptance requirement ... that will drive the remaining few ham
>>manufacturers out of business (or at least out of the ham market)
>
>One wonders why you would immediately think of the manufacturers
>instead of the homebrewers?

Unfortunately, if there were no Yaesu/Kenwood/Icom/TenTec, damned few
people would become hams ... (yes, we need to convert the appliance
operators to builders and tinkerers, but most will buy their first rig,
and probably a lot of their gear ...)

>Given your (empty?) concern that not
>enough folks are building gear today, one would expect your worries
>to be centered upon the home builders -

There is no practical way for homebrew to be type accepted ... the
testing is rigorous, requires LOTS of expensive, calibrated test
equipment, a real open field testing site, screen rooms, etc.  The cost
of testing for a "one-off" would be prohibitive ... plus the FCC would
never agree to divert the resources necessary just to process the
paperwork ...

>the manufactuers could and
>would adapt to type-acceptance (and reward us with higher prices in
>return).

Hams are too freaking cheap ... they would piss and moan and refuse to
buy gear at prices that would support all the additional testing,
paperwork, better designs, etc. Thus the ham gear companies would go
belly up, or get out of the market ...  most of them do a much better
business in the commercial markets anyway ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-12.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW is outdated
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 07:33:11 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57uu1h$[e-mail]> <57vlbj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58fr8e$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: camoore-desk.ch.intel.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)

Bill Nelson wrote:
> Why should a person have to learn electronic theory, when all they want to
> do is buy a rig and start yacking?

Hi Bill, because until the rigs are all type-accepted, learning electronic
theory is relevant to amateur radio. CW skill is no longer relevant. It is
a very old artifact that needs to be removed from the testing requirement.

> Why should a person have to learn about SSB, RTTY, FM etc, when all he wants
> to do is operate CW?

Knowledge of modes is relevant to present-day amateur radio. Knowledge of the
CW mode is relevant. CW skill is not.

> Why should a person have to take an advanced theory test, just so they can
> operate at the maximum legal power?

Knowledge of high-power RF safety is relevant to amateur radio. CW skill
is not.

> Why is a Novice only allowed voice privileges on 10 meters?

Because the guys making the rules are not novices? I'll bet an advanced class
ham had a hand in the SSB rules for 40m (his favorite band?). Why no extra
privileges on 40m voice?

> Why any sort of testing at all?

Because some things are relevant to present-day amateur radio. CW skill is
not one of them.

> In other words, your argument is silly. Bill

More than 100,000 (and growing) hams would disagree with you.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.xensei.com!news.miracle.net!wariat.org!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 6 Dec 1996 21:15:26 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58a2df$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <587rr4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn05.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <587rr4$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>
>>Is the station going to be operated in a public place like a mall or
>>something?  Maybe the leadership is concerned about the PR aspects of
>>portraying ham radio as a user of backward technology (a bunch of
>>beepers) to the public ... maybe the leadership wants to "put our best
>>foot forward" by fielding a modern station using more modern,
>>"user-friendly" technologies so that the public will be impressed,
>>rather than snickering at "the old fools that still use such backward
>>techniques." THAT's THE WAY MOST PEOPLE IN TODAY'S WORLD VIEW CW AND
>>THOSE WHO CLING TO IT!!!
>
>>Think about it ...  at least half (probably far more)the people in the
>>mall are carrying pagers, cellphones, etc.  ...  they're technologically
>>astute enough to recognize that CW is antiquated ...  and the *hams* are
>>*supposed* to be the "radio wizards" ...  THIS DOES *NOT* COMPUTE ...
>
>Carl, it's all in your mind.
>
>   jim, wk1v

Carl is missing the point completely. The point is that *one* person, has
decided what the club is to do in regard to the special event station. It
should have been brought up as new business and put to a vote. Carl seems to
think that it's OK because the president is acting in the club's best interest
.
He thinks that a majority vote on the matter might result in something that
wouldn't be in the best interest of amateur radio. Be that as it may, the
matter shouldn't be left to one person to decide.

Tom, N8ECW




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 20:27:06 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv11.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58a2df$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> Carl is missing the point completely. The point is that *one* person, has
> decided what the club is to do in regard to the special event station. It
> should have been brought up as new business and put to a vote. Carl seems to

> think that it's OK because the president is acting in the club's best intere
st.
> He thinks that a majority vote on the matter might result in something that
> wouldn't be in the best interest of amateur radio. Be that as it may, the
> matter shouldn't be left to one person to decide.

Carls' problem is that he thinks, period, end of sentence.  I belong to a
club, the president is a nocode tech, more than 70% of the dues paying
members are no code techs.  We are going to set up a special event
station celebrating our 25th anniversary.  2 radios..one SSB, the other
CW.  It was decided by the prez to do the cw as SHE wanted people to see
what it's all about. It was brought up and voted on, and passed very
handily. Plus (my idea), we are letting anyone who wants to try, the
chance to transmit, either SSB or CW, their choice.

I realize Carl will disagree, seeing that we are perpetuating an
antiquated mode, but then again, I don't really think we'll be hearing
him on the air  (10 meters still isn't that reliable into the midwest
yet)



>
> Tom, N8ECW
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:20:45 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <58o4nd$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58acor$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler
) writes:
>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>
>>Is the station going to be operated in a public place like a mall or
>>something?  Maybe the leadership is concerned about the PR aspects of
>>portraying ham radio as a user of backward technology (a bunch of
>>beepers) to the public ... maybe the leadership wants to "put our best
>>foot forward" by fielding a modern station using more modern,
>>"user-friendly" technologies so that the public will be impressed,
>>rather than snickering at "the old fools that still use such backward
>>techniques." THAT's THE WAY MOST PEOPLE IN TODAY'S WORLD VIEW CW AND
>>THOSE WHO CLING TO IT!!!
>
>>Think about it ...  at least half (probably far more)the people in the
>>mall are carrying pagers, cellphones, etc.  ...  they're technologically
>>astute enough to recognize that CW is antiquated ...  and the *hams* are
>>*supposed* to be the "radio wizards" ...  THIS DOES *NOT* COMPUTE ...
>
>>Carl - wa6vse
>>[e-mail]
>
>You don't get out enuff, Squiggie.  Most people in the 'mall' view ham radio
>as  'Oh, you mean CB ?'  Another poor attempt, Squiggie.  Very poor.
>
>73, Jim KH2D

Of course, Jim ... because all they see are another bunch of "yackers"
with a bunch of "secret codes" like QRM, QTH?, etc ... HELL, YES it's
just like CB ... only with an attitude ...

What the mall station *should* be showing is the use of advanced modes
(surfing the web via a wireless T-1 link would get some "wow, that's
NEAT!!!" attention ... instead of "Ho, hum ... another CBer ... yea, OK,
10-4 good buddy ... now can I go buy my gormet coffee and get the hell
out of here?"

My point is, not only is ham radio so technologically backward (for the
most part) as to look *just like* CB to the average citizen, but the
average ham has no idea of how to improve the image and the appeal ...
because he's just a "yacker, gamer, beeper" who doesn't know squat about
the REAL current state of the art in technology ...

This is what we have to change to "gain market share" in the public
appeal sense and also to survive into the next century ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:28:52 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <58o56k$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <587rr4$[e-mail]> <58a2df$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58a2df$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant) writes:
>
>Carl is missing the point completely. The point is that *one* person, has
>decided what the club is to do in regard to the special event station. It
>should have been brought up as new business and put to a vote.

If I appeared to be advocating a dictatorial stance by one person I
appolgize ... that was *not* my point ...

>Carl seems to
>think that it's OK because the president is acting in the club's best interes
t.

I was not so much supporting the president's action (if it was, in fact,
a one-man, dictatorial decision that goes against the majority view) as
I was saying that leaving a CW station out of a public display activity
might be better in a PR sense so as not to protray ham radio as
backward.

>He thinks that a majority vote on the matter might result in something that
>wouldn't be in the best interest of amateur radio. Be that as it may, the
>matter shouldn't be left to one person to decide.

It was not at all clear in the original "help the meanie has banned CW"
post that the majority opinion was opposed to the ban ... only that the
writer (and perhaps a few of his CW cronies) were upset at the decision.

I am NOT advocating tyranical dictatorship ... simply pointing out the
potential negative PR value of CW in a public display station ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:34:34 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58o5ha$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI
 (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>I realize Carl will disagree, seeing that we are perpetuating an
>antiquated mode, but then again, I don't really think we'll be hearing
>him on the air  (10 meters still isn't that reliable into the midwest
>yet)

I don't disagree with your choice to practice the mode ... and I've said
over and over "beep all you want ... just don't insist on forcing
everyone to beep, just because you want to ..."

I question the PR benefit of a CW position vs. the negative PR of
showing such backward practices in what's supposed to be a technically
progressive activity ...  and even just in light of the level of
technology that's commonplace to the average Joe today ...  nationwide
paging, cellphones, PCS, even satellite communications ...  even though
they may not know how all that stuff works, they're clearly smart enough
to realize the benefits and that it's FAR more advanced than Morse code
.. why can't so many hams realize that????

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 07:00:43 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv25.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58o4nd$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> What the mall station *should* be showing is the use of advanced modes
> (surfing the web via a wireless T-1 link would get some "wow, that's
> NEAT!!!" attention ... instead of "Ho, hum ... another CBer ... yea, OK,
> 10-4 good buddy ... now can I go buy my gormet coffee and get the hell
> out of here?"

But Carl, how would download your smutty pictures???  All those kids
looking on, tsk tsk.  And surfing the net??  Linking into your ISP??
Sounds like something commercial, and that's illegal.  You're an amateur
(and not just in the radio sense) and should know that utilizing the ARS
for commercial purposes is illegal.  I guess your true agenda finally
shows through.


>
> My point is, not only is ham radio so technologically backward (for the
> most part) as to look *just like* CB to the average citizen, but the
> average ham has no idea of how to improve the image and the appeal ...
> because he's just a "yacker, gamer, beeper" who doesn't know squat about
> the REAL current state of the art in technology ...


Most citizens could care less about the ARS.  And as, you life partner
Len has pointed out, the ARS has never been really SOTA, merely a user
and adapter of existing technology.  Or are saying that Len was lying
when he made those statements??

>
> This is what we have to change to "gain market share" in the public
> appeal sense and also to survive into the next century ...

BINGO..market share--a commercial phrase YOUR SLIP IS SHOWING CARL.  Play
for pay..ask Carl, he knows EXACTLY where the commercial communication
industries are headed.


>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
> Internet access for a fee

>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 17:35:51 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58pfpn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58o5ha$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <58o5ha$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>I question the PR benefit of a CW position vs. the negative PR of
>showing such backward practices in what's supposed to be a technically
>progressive activity ...  and even just in light of the level of
>technology that's commonplace to the average Joe today ...  nationwide
>paging, cellphones, PCS, even satellite communications ...  even though
>they may not know how all that stuff works, they're clearly smart enough
>to realize the benefits and that it's FAR more advanced than Morse code
>.. why can't so many hams realize that????

Turn off your pro-code kill file, Carl. We've read of CW positions
in multimode mall and Field Day stations as attracting the most
public attention time and time again. How can you ignore these
testimonials?

Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 13 Dec 1996 03:08:27 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58qhbb$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58o5ha$[e-mail]> <58pfpn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-28.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58pfpn$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>In article <58o5ha$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>I question the PR benefit of a CW position vs. the negative PR of
>>showing such backward practices in what's supposed to be a technically
>>progressive activity ...  and even just in light of the level of
>>technology that's commonplace to the average Joe today ...  nationwide
>>paging, cellphones, PCS, even satellite communications ...  even though
>>they may not know how all that stuff works, they're clearly smart enough
>>to realize the benefits and that it's FAR more advanced than Morse code
>>.. why can't so many hams realize that????
>
>Turn off your pro-code kill file, Carl. We've read of CW positions
>in multimode mall and Field Day stations as attracting the most
>public attention time and time again. How can you ignore these
>testimonials?

"testimonials" are something that people get up and give in church
meetings (or at the other end of the moral/amoral spectrum, political
events) ... what you describe is not the rule, but may occasionally
happen (IMHO) ... lots of people go to the zoo and get a kick out of
watching the monkeys, too ... their curiosity (and the entertainment
value they receive from the experience) do not mean they thing the
monkeys are brilliant, or that they want to join them or emulate them.

check out the parallel ...

(Gee George, look at the monkeys ... how cute!)
(Gee Harold, look at those geezers using Morse code ... how quaint!)

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 03:35:43 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58qipl$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <587rr4$[e-mail]> <58a2df$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan8.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82


>In article <58a2df$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>> Carl is missing the point completely. The point is that *one* person, has
>> decided what the club is to do in regard to the special event station. It
>> should have been brought up as new business and put to a vote. Carl seems t
o
>> think that it's OK because the president is acting in the club's best inter
est.
>> He thinks that a majority vote on the matter might result in something that

>> wouldn't be in the best interest of amateur radio. Be that as it may, the
>> matter shouldn't be left to one person to decide.

The matter can be decided anyway the club wants based on the
organization structure and bylaws of that club.  That is the
beauty of PRIVATE organizations.  If the bylaws
allow that the president can make that decision, then
members can:
1. Quit
2. Vote in someone else when elections are held
3. Vote to change the bylaws.

Seems pretty simple and basic to me.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!tir.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 07:26:12 GMT
Organization: The Internet Ramp
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <58r0em$i1a$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <587rr4$[e-mail]> <58a2df$[e-mail]> <58o56k$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: fli127.tir.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82


>I am NOT advocating tyranical dictatorship ... simply pointing out the
>potential negative PR value of CW in a public display station ...

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]


Thats the idea... hide morse code from the public, like it some kind
of shameful skeleton in our closet.  Then show public how neat and
cool it is to conduct communication over long distances on the HF
bands, using SSB.  I just hope you don't end up being asked how to
become licensed!  Will you tell John or Jane Public of the necessity
to learn and demonstrate morse code proficiency?  Will you portray CW
as a relic of the past?  Will you explain that it is something that
you can forget forever once the golden ticket is in hand?

-THIS IS SAD-

Go ahead...  Pass your prejudices on to those uninformed people.
Go ahead...  do your best to crush this fantastically fun element of a

                     great hobby.

I feel bad for all those youngsters out there who will never get the
chance of seeing and hearing the "magic and mystery" of CW.  That is
how I got hooked on this hobby over 23 years ago (got my novice at 14.
I am now 37 with my extra)...  and I hate to think that other young
boys and girls will never experience this thrill!

-NO, I AM NOT A CW FREAK-

I also love SSB...  and I will admit to talking to friends on the CB
frequencies...  I just love radio in general!

I think that instead of hiding CW from the public, maybe we should
point out that many enjoy it... weak signal DX'ing is fantastic on
CW...  the equipment can be cheaper for the beginner... it is great
for many handicapped people...  and it is relaxing... a step out of
these crazy techno-times.
And maybe they could display, and sell, a few of those neat mystery
books that preteens like that revolve around ham radio! In those
books, CW plays a big role...The excitement and mystery!  The ability
to conjure up equipment out of a handful of parts, and save everyone
(only on CW!)!

Chuck, N8DRF



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:56:51 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <58qglj$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-28.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>But Carl, how would download your smutty pictures???  All those kids
>looking on, tsk tsk.

Steve ... you don't want to go there ... at some point, even an idiot
like you will piss me off and I'll sic some sleaze lawyer on you for all
it's worth ... stop insinuating that I'm a pervert or something, or that
I have some "hidden agenda to commercialize ham radio" ... they're
false.

If you want to say you think I'm stupid, fine ... heaven knows I've made
no bones about saying I think you're a twit ... but stop insulting my
character and integrity ... you've gone entirely far enough in that
direction ...

>> This is what we have to change to "gain market share" in the public
>> appeal sense and also to survive into the next century ...
>
>BINGO..market share--a commercial phrase YOUR SLIP IS SHOWING CARL.  Play
>for pay..ask Carl, he knows EXACTLY where the commercial communication
>industries are headed.

Again, Steve, the insinuation of commercial agenda to "destroy and take
over the ARS" ... you're a fool ... note the quotes around "gain market
share" and the fact that analogy is contiguous with the phrase "in the
public appeal sense" ... everyone knows damned well I was talking about
"PR" for making ham radio look interesting and appealing to the younger
generation and technical types ... stop generating outright lies about
my character and integrity or I *will* take legal action against you ...

>
>
>>
>> Carl - wa6vse
>> [e-mail]
>> Internet access for a fee
>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

AND STOP ALTERING THINGS TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE I WROTE THINGS I DIDN'T
WRITE, you asshole!

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 13 Dec 1996 03:01:38 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58qgui$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <58p7g1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-28.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58p7g1$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writ
es:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>
>>>You don't get out enuff, Squiggie.  Most people in the 'mall' view ham radi
o
>>>as  'Oh, you mean CB ?'  Another poor attempt, Squiggie.  Very poor.
>>>
>>>73, Jim KH2D
>
>>Of course, Jim ... because all they see are another bunch of "yackers"
>>with a bunch of "secret codes" like QRM, QTH?, etc ... HELL, YES it's
>>just like CB ... only with an attitude ...
>
>If you feel that way, I suggest you tear up your license and let it expire.

No thanks, I'd rather work and persuade folks to change it so that it's
like it's *supposed* to be instead of the way it's been perverted to be.

>>What the mall station *should* be showing is the use of advanced modes
>>(surfing the web via a wireless T-1 link would get some "wow, that's
>>NEAT!!!" attention ... instead of "Ho, hum ... another CBer ... yea, OK,
>>10-4 good buddy ... now can I go buy my gormet coffee and get the hell
>>out of here?"
>
>Excuse me, but what the hell has 'surfing the web' got to do with ham radio ?
>Why would anyone bother to use a T-1 wireless link to 'surf the web' when
>they can do it with a $39 modem ?

Because it's wireless, twit ... and it's more "survivable" than the
stupid twisted-pair telephone system when there's an earthquake,
tornado, hurricane, major snowstorm, etc., etc. ... and the ampr.org
domain is *theoretically* a part of the world-wide internet ... with a
few enlightened rules alterations, it could be a vibrant, vital thing.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-9.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 22:14:12 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <58p7g1$[e-mail]> <58qgui$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv27.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58qgui$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> Because it's wireless, twit ... and it's more "survivable" than the
> stupid twisted-pair telephone system when there's an earthquake,
> tornado, hurricane, major snowstorm, etc., etc. ... and the ampr.org
> domain is *theoretically* a part of the world-wide internet ... with a
> few enlightened rules alterations, it could be a vibrant, vital thing.


Not to mention VERY PROFITABLE  Right Carl????

Wait a minute...more survivable?? as in antenna being blown down?? power
disrupted???  TORNADO??? CARL, have you ever seen a house after a tornado
is done with it??  And you call me an idiot.  Try looking in a mirror.
Obviously you got hit one time too many with the boom of your sailboat as
you hobnobbed with the 3 worlders.


Sorry there OM, my house blew away in the storm, but I need my radio to
download e-mail. I'll take your emergency traffic after I download some
smutty pictures of Carl and his boat... what a riot you are Carl.  No
wonder your the king of amateur radio..you're a scream..an old one at
that, but a scream

>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 04:55:35 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58p7g1$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-155.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:


>>You don't get out enuff, Squiggie.  Most people in the 'mall' view ham radio
>>as  'Oh, you mean CB ?'  Another poor attempt, Squiggie.  Very poor.
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D

>Of course, Jim ... because all they see are another bunch of "yackers"
>with a bunch of "secret codes" like QRM, QTH?, etc ... HELL, YES it's
>just like CB ... only with an attitude ...

If you feel that way, I suggest you tear up your license and let it expire.

>What the mall station *should* be showing is the use of advanced modes
>(surfing the web via a wireless T-1 link would get some "wow, that's
>NEAT!!!" attention ... instead of "Ho, hum ... another CBer ... yea, OK,
>10-4 good buddy ... now can I go buy my gormet coffee and get the hell
>out of here?"

Excuse me, but what the hell has 'surfing the web' got to do with ham radio ?
Why would anyone bother to use a T-1 wireless link to 'surf the web' when
they can do it with a $39 modem ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!mindspring!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-out.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 12:41:29 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF
2TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
> >
> >But Carl, how would download your smutty pictures???  All those kids
> >looking on, tsk tsk

<SNIP>

stop generating outright lies about
> my character and integrity or I *will* take legal action against you ...
>
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Carl - wa6vse
> >> [e-mail]
> >> Internet access for a fee
> >  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> AND STOP ALTERING THINGS TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE I WROTE THINGS I DIDN'T
> WRITE, you asshole!
>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]

--
Looks to me like Carl's dyslexia with code extends to law also...
That really isn't fair tho' I've known several dyslexics that were able
to learn the code and get their general (or higher) licenses. It
probably really IS the 90's welfare mentality.

Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 20:19:56 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <58qtl9$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <58p7g1$[e-mail]> <58qgui$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-131.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>>Excuse me, but what the hell has 'surfing the web' got to do with ham radio
?
>>Why would anyone bother to use a T-1 wireless link to 'surf the web' when
>>they can do it with a $39 modem ?

>Because it's wireless, twit ... and it's more "survivable" than the

Oh, OK. Anything that is wireless is ham radio. I C.  And I thought that
internet would be classified as a computer hobby. But internet is now ham radi
o,
according to the Rules of Squiggie.

>stupid twisted-pair telephone system when there's an earthquake,
>tornado, hurricane, major snowstorm, etc., etc. ... and the ampr.org
>domain is *theoretically* a part of the world-wide internet ... with a
>few enlightened rules alterations, it could be a vibrant, vital thing.

Nothing I'd rather do during an earthquake, tornado, hurricane, or major
storm than 'surf the net'.  Never mind the roof blew off, the house is on fire
,
and the kids are all missing - LET'S GO NET SURFING !!!  WHOOOOPPIE !!!

Did your mother have any normal children Squiggie ?

73,  Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 02:11:32 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58t2ck$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-03.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>In article <58qglj$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - K
F2TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>> >
>> >But Carl, how would download your smutty pictures???  All those kids
>> >looking on, tsk tsk.
>>
>> Steve ... you don't want to go there ... at some point, even an idiot
>> like you will piss me off and I'll sic some sleaze lawyer on you for all
>> it's worth ... stop insinuating that I'm a pervert or something, or that
>> I have some "hidden agenda to commercialize ham radio" ... they're
>> false.
>>
>
>Please, by all means, be my guest. I'm not insinuating anything Carl, if
>you read something into it, I can't help that.  As far as your hidden
>agenda, again, my opinion of you and all your postings.  Don't like it
>TOUGH!!!

Steve ... You're not *insinuating* anything ... you *accuse* me of
things that are patently false ... you defame my character and integrity
.. as I said, if you simply said you thought I was an idiot, I wouldn't
care ... nobody (who matters) would believe that ... but you accuse me
of other things, and *some* people might be deluded into believing your
slander ... that I will not tolerate ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 22:38:18 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t2ck$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv25.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <58t2ck$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
.>
> Steve ... You're not *insinuating* anything ... you *accuse* me of
> things that are patently false ... you defame my character and integrity
> .. as I said, if you simply said you thought I was an idiot, I wouldn't
> care ... nobody (who matters) would believe that ... but you accuse me
> of other things, and *some* people might be deluded into believing your
> slander ... that I will not tolerate ...
>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
> I believed half of what I write, I'd believe all of it



For the last time Carl

(1) you can't defame something that it never existed, IE: your character
or integrity

(2) it's no slander, as slander is spoken words, not typed as we have
here.  If anything it would be libel (or liable as one paralegal puts it)

(3) as far as your tolerating anything..as you say  who cares

(4) check the definiton of the word "opinion".
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member

NUFF SAID..Carl you're a bore and a boob
get a life
BTW, 10M was open the other day, heard many digital signals
Many people I talked to thought you're definiton of 10 meters not being
HF was very funny.  Most thought you were a bit touched


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:57 1996
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 10:01:05 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <58p7g1$[e-mail]> <58qgui$[e-mail]>
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On 13 Dec 1996 03:01:38 GMT, [e-mail] wrote:
>KH2D>>If you feel that way, I suggest you tear up your license and let it exp
ire.
>
>No thanks, I'd rather work and persuade folks to change it so that it's
>like it's *supposed* to be instead of the way it's been perverted to be.
>
"it's been perverted to be." Would/could you explain
that?
>>>What the mall station *should* be showing is the use of advanced modes
>>>(surfing the web via a wireless T-1 link would get some "wow, that's
>>>NEAT!!!" attention ... instead of "Ho, hum ... another CBer ... yea, OK,
>>>10-4 good buddy ... now can I go buy my gormet coffee and get the hell
>>>out of here?"
>>
>>Excuse me, but what the hell has 'surfing the web' got to do with ham radio
?
>>Why would anyone bother to use a T-1 wireless link to 'surf the web' when
>>they can do it with a $39 modem ?
>
>Because it's wireless, twit ... and it's more "survivable" than the
>stupid twisted-pair telephone system when there's an earthquake,
>tornado, hurricane, major snowstorm, etc., etc. ... and the ampr.org
>domain is *theoretically* a part of the world-wide internet ... with a
>few enlightened rules alterations, it could be a vibrant, vital thing.
Perhaps that should be "Mr Twit, Sir!" to you. Just picture a home
brew CW station drawing attention to itself and a companion satellite
station or a TOR station or a station operating under the STA
experimenting with spread spectrum communications or maybe all.

Yeah wireless is cool, wireless is an _OUTDATED_ term. $2K for a 166
P5 with 32 M EDO RAM, 2.9 gig HDD, and 33.6 modem or $2k for a
transceiver and then get ready to spead the bucks before that
techn-guru spreads the spectrum. Jeez is "wireless" free or $19.95 a
month?
>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]
>

To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:58 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:21:58 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <595vjq$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58o5ha$[e-mail]> <58pfpn$[e-mail]> <58qhbb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan9.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

>In <58pfpn$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>>In article <58o5ha$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>I question the PR benefit of a CW position vs. the negative PR of
>>>showing such backward practices in what's supposed to be a technically
>>>progressive activity ...  and even just in light of the level of
>>>technology that's commonplace to the average Joe today ...  nationwide
>>>paging, cellphones, PCS, even satellite communications ...  even though
>>>they may not know how all that stuff works, they're clearly smart enough
>>>to realize the benefits and that it's FAR more advanced than Morse code
>>>.. why can't so many hams realize that????
>>
>>Turn off your pro-code kill file, Carl. We've read of CW positions
>>in multimode mall and Field Day stations as attracting the most
>>public attention time and time again. How can you ignore these
>>testimonials?

I have some understanding of the value and methods of PR
and I have no doubt that some (perhaps many) non hams
might be totally fasinated with a CW set-up on field day
or at some other set-up.  Having said that, I still see no
relationship between the PR value at such events and the
NEED to continue CW testing.

Once again, that is the issue.  If CW has value in some
repsects for PR work, then fine.  Use it in any way
you want...BUT doing so in no way enhances or
otherwise justifies the continued need to test all HF
hams for CW proficiency.

And, once again, if CW testing ended today, it would not
foreclose anyone using CW for any purpose...PR,
DX, contacting poor foriegn hams or any other
reason.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:07:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-11.sprintlink.net!news.lightlink.com!light.lightlink.com!siram
From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CW phonetics
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 13:44:24 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

A German ham (DL1FAE) once told me, that there are CW phonetic phrases for
each and every character of the Morse alphabet.

For instance, the phonetic phrase for the letter L in German is
                       Ich liebe Dich (I love you)
              which when pronounced correctly, has the didadidit melody.

(1) I wonder if any DL/OE/HB-ham could supply me with the full list

(2) and wether or not something alike exists for the English language

Curious in W2-land
  Siegfried
    KB2YVC



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:00 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:40:35 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <58o5sj$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120378 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44111

In <58iq7v$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman
) writes:
>>>
>>> ...<SNIP>
>>>
>>>That CW continues to be the common mode amongst the world's HF
>>>hams is reason enough for the US code tests to be kept.
>>>Jeff KH2PZ
>
>>Sorry, that does not compute. It may be a reason for *Dxers* to
>>learn and use Morse, but it is not a reason for every amateur
>>wishing HF access to learn Morse. Contrary to the opinions of
>>some, running up high Dx scores is not the overriding goal of
>>amateur radio or of most radio amateurs.
>>
>>Gary
>
>Gary, if not for long distance communication, why would you
>want to use HF?  And it is much inferior to VHF/UHF for short
>range or wide bandwidth apps.

Gary didn't say he had no interest in long-range communications ... jsut
that he had no interest in racking up huge scores in some conpetitive
gaming situation ...

>His point about CW being the common mode in the world
>stands.  It is a fact that many cannot afford the digital
>equipment required to do the fancy digital modes.

Please stop with the world poverty rubbish ... as I've stated before,
even in the poorest countries of Latin America, the hams are people of
means and their stations outstrip many American ham stations in quality
(and modernness) of equipment ... they use the same genre of "rice box"
as US hams ... and tend to be "early adopters" of new technology, rather
than the high-R circuits that huge numbers of US hams represent ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:02 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 04:57:41 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58qnjg$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>In article <58o5sj$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>>Please stop with the world poverty rubbish ... as I've stated before,
>>even in the poorest countries of Latin America, the hams are people of
>>means and their stations outstrip many American ham stations in quality
>>(and modernness) of equipment ... they use the same genre of "rice box"
>>as US hams ... and tend to be "early adopters" of new technology, rather
>>than the high-R circuits that huge numbers of US hams represent ...

>So you've traveled to a few Latin American countries and visited the
>wealthier hams in those countries, and have walked away with the opinion
>that all hams in all third-world countries run first-class stations.

>Why do you waste our time with this garbage, Carl?

>After you've visited all the African nations, all the Asian nations,
>all South Pacific island-nations, et al, and all the hams within those
>nations, then come back and tell us what you've seen. But please, stop
>telling lies.

Then perhaps you might also ask the same thing of those that make the
poverty claims for nonUSA hams.  If Carl must go to EVERY
country to assert his opinion, then so should those that allege the
poverty conditions of non-USA hams.



Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:02 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 12:05:41 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]>
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Bill Sohl wrote:
> Then perhaps you might also ask the same thing of those that make the
> poverty claims for nonUSA hams.

Hi Bill, I would like to see a picture of one of the starving,
third-world hams. Why would a poor person waste his money on a
ham radio? If I were hungry, I would sell my ham radio and buy
food. (I have noticed that the poor people paying for food
with food stamps eat better and are fatter than I).

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:04 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: 13 Dec 1996 00:08:59 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58q6qr$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix5.its.hawaii.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120607 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44180

In article <58o5sj$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>Please stop with the world poverty rubbish ... as I've stated before,
>even in the poorest countries of Latin America, the hams are people of
>means and their stations outstrip many American ham stations in quality
>(and modernness) of equipment ... they use the same genre of "rice box"
>as US hams ... and tend to be "early adopters" of new technology, rather
>than the high-R circuits that huge numbers of US hams represent ...

So you've traveled to a few Latin American countries and visited the
wealthier hams in those countries, and have walked away with the opinion
that all hams in all third-world countries run first-class stations.

Why do you waste our time with this garbage, Carl?

After you've visited all the African nations, all the Asian nations,
all South Pacific island-nations, et al, and all the hams within those
nations, then come back and tell us what you've seen. But please, stop
telling lies.

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:05 1996
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From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 11:34:25 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Dan Finn wrote:
> They couldn't even
> follow Cecil's humanitarian suggestion to sell their handmade
> equipment since those who could afford to but them would buy something
> professionally made.

Hi Dan, I don't think you're living in the real world. Ham radio is not
a necessity. It is actually a luxury and a person would have to be mentally
ill to starve himself in order to have a ham radio. Ham radios follow behind
the necessities of life. If someone has to choose between buying food and
buying the parts for a CW transceiver, food will always come first. Of
course, there are third-world hams who are relatively poor compared to
us. But I'll bet they are not poor compared to other citizens of their own
country. Ham radio is one of their riches. Would you please post the call of
a single third-world ham who is starving rather than giving up his ham radio?

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:06 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 16:31:43 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <58vp1a$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Cecil Moore <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Dan Finn wrote:
>> They couldn't even
>> follow Cecil's humanitarian suggestion to sell their handmade
>> equipment since those who could afford to but them would buy something
>> professionally made.

>Hi Dan, I don't think you're living in the real world. Ham radio is not
>a necessity. It is actually a luxury and a person would have to be mentally
>ill to starve himself in order to have a ham radio. Ham radios follow behind
>the necessities of life. If someone has to choose between buying food and
>buying the parts for a CW transceiver, food will always come first. Of
>course, there are third-world hams who are relatively poor compared to
>us. But I'll bet they are not poor compared to other citizens of their own
>country. Ham radio is one of their riches. Would you please post the call of
>a single third-world ham who is starving rather than giving up his ham radio?

>73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC

SQU1GGIE.  Chicago is a third world country, isn't it Cecil ?

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:07 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: 16 Dec 1996 06:45:27 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <592r67$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120845 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44277

Bill Sohl <[e-mail]> wrote:
>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:
>>In article <58o5sj$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>Please stop with the world poverty rubbish ... as I've stated before,
>>>even in the poorest countries of Latin America, the hams are people of
>>>means and their stations outstrip many American ham stations in quality
>>>(and modernness) of equipment ... they use the same genre of "rice box"
>>>as US hams ... and tend to be "early adopters" of new technology, rather
>>>than the high-R circuits that huge numbers of US hams represent ...

>>So you've traveled to a few Latin American countries and visited the
>>wealthier hams in those countries, and have walked away with the opinion
>>that all hams in all third-world countries run first-class stations.
>
>>Why do you waste our time with this garbage, Carl?
>
>>After you've visited all the African nations, all the Asian nations,
>>all South Pacific island-nations, et al, and all the hams within those
>>nations, then come back and tell us what you've seen. But please, stop
>>telling lies.

>Then perhaps you might also ask the same thing of those that make the
>poverty claims for nonUSA hams.  If Carl must go to EVERY
>country to assert his opinion, then so should those that allege the
>poverty conditions of non-USA hams.

Sorry Bill, but to prove a claim is false, all one needs do is provide
a single counterexample. Carl claimed hams of Latin American countries
are folks of means. That a pretty sweeping generalization. When 10m
finally opens up I'll get the name and call of a poor Latin American
ham who only has a homebrew CW station. Stay tuned.

>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

Are you speaking as the ARRL Local Gov't Liaison for Mt. Olive Township
in your anti-code testing articles? If so, is Mt. Olive Township aware
of that?

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:09 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 16:05:22 GMT
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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On Sat, 14 Dec 1996 11:34:25 -0800, Cecil Moore
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Dan Finn wrote:
>> They couldn't even
>> follow Cecil's humanitarian suggestion to sell their handmade
>> equipment since those who could afford to but them would buy something
>> professionally made.
>
>Hi Dan, I don't think you're living in the real world. Ham radio is not
>a necessity. It is actually a luxury and a person would have to be mentally
>ill to starve himself in order to have a ham radio. Ham radios follow behind
>the necessities of life. If someone has to choose between buying food and
>buying the parts for a CW transceiver, food will always come first. Of
>course, there are third-world hams who are relatively poor compared to
>us. But I'll bet they are not poor compared to other citizens of their own
>country. Ham radio is one of their riches. Would you please post the call of
>a single third-world ham who is starving rather than giving up his ham radio?
>

Cecil, this is exceptionally wierd. I never said that anyone was
starving instead of giving up their ham radio. I'm sure that the
people in these countries I have worked simply assembled the CW
transmitters and receivers from loose parts they had on hand. Please
learn how to read.

73

KR4AJ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.80.63.252!delphi.com!usenet
From: "Cecil A. Moore" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 06:28:32 -0700
Organization: Delphi Internet Services Corporation
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Dan Finn wrote:
> Cecil, this is exceptionally wierd. I never said that anyone was
> starving instead of giving up their ham radio.

Hi Dan, You replied to my posting that said I would like to see a
photo of a starving active ham so I assumed you knew some. I'm
glad you don't know any.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:12 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:22:08 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <595vk4$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>On Fri, 13 Dec 1996 12:05:41 -0800, Cecil Moore
><[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Bill Sohl wrote:
>>> Then perhaps you might also ask the same thing of those that make the
>>> poverty claims for nonUSA hams.
>>
>>Hi Bill, I would like to see a picture of one of the starving,
>>third-world hams. Why would a poor person waste his money on a
>>ham radio? If I were hungry, I would sell my ham radio and buy
>>food. (I have noticed that the poor people paying for food
>>with food stamps eat better and are fatter than I).
>>

>From this thread, I can see who REALLY uses CW. Yes, there are a few
>apparently well furnished third world stations on SSB. But you will
>find some very interesting low power stations on CW (with obvious
>problems of frequency drift etc. that tells you it ain't a n expensive
>rice box).

>It simply is not true that ham radio is a hobby for the rich in these
>countries. I worked them from Cuba to Siberia and I know you would not
>want to trade paychecks with any one of them. They couldn't even
>follow Cecil's humanitarian suggestion to sell their handmade
>equipment since those who could afford to but them would buy something
>professionally made. Sorry but you really have to get on the CW bands
>to understand the CW environment, and you said you work a lot of CW
>Cecil...perhaps the propagation in California is a lot different than
>it is here in North Carolina..

And, therefore, if such low power, poor stations exist in any numbers
than many will VOLUNTARILY continue to use CW to contact
them.  Seems to me that many people should be happy to see
fewer CW knowledgable people on HF which would lower the
number of people who pile-up for those "rare" CW contacts.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:13 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: 17 Dec 1996 17:52:09 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <596mk9$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595vk4$[e-mail]>
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Bill Sohl <[e-mail]> wrote:
>And, therefore, if such low power, poor stations exist in any numbers
>than many will VOLUNTARILY continue to use CW to contact
>them.  Seems to me that many people should be happy to see
>fewer CW knowledgable people on HF which would lower the
>number of people who pile-up for those "rare" CW contacts.

Pile-ups are part of the fun, Bill. Without them, there'd be no challenge.

>Bill Sohl  K2UNK

speaking as the

>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

Jeff KH2PZ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:15 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:30:33 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <597krd$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595vk4$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121003 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44343

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>>them.  Seems to me that many people should be happy to see
>>fewer CW knowledgable people on HF which would lower the
>>number of people who pile-up for those "rare" CW contacts.

>>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

>Bill,

>    When you make statements like that, your HT with a belt clip is showing.

I suppose there's some method to this statemt, it does, however,
elude me.

>The fun of making rare CW contacts in a pileup IS the pileup and getting
>thru it.  Haven't spent much time on HF, huh ?
>73, Jim KH2D

Right...everyone just Loves pileups. Jim again speaks for
all of hamdom.

and talk about being inconsistent, whch is it procoders?
  You don't want more hams on HF or you do want more hams?
  or is it that the current ham poulation is "just right?"

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:17 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:12:51 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <597jq7$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <592r67$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

>Are you speaking as the ARRL Local Gov't Liaison for Mt. Olive Township
>in your anti-code testing articles? If so, is Mt. Olive Township aware
>of that?

I speak for myself.  If ARRL doesn't like me identifying myself
to other people as an ARRL Local Gov't Liason, then they
can ask me to stop.  Frankly, I don't see anything
I post as even suggesting that I or it represents an
ARRL officiial position.  If, as an ARRL volunteer I can't
mention that I have a particular opinion on a subject, even if that
is counter to an official ARRL position I that would be a
form of censorship that I couldn't agree with.

As to Mt. Olive Township, it is my
choice to serve as a local gov't rep for hams in my township.
The township fathers need not give me permission nor do I
need to ask.  No different than if I signed a post
in the rec.autos newsgroup stating I was Licensed NJ Driver.
The state of NJ has nothing to say about my using such
a signature.

Now back to the original issue: CW testing for HF access
in case anyone forgot.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: 19 Dec 1996 19:36:13 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <59c5fd$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595vk4$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121142 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44409

In article <5966q3$[e-mail]>,
Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in response to Bill Sohl:
>Bill,

>    When you make statements like that, your HT with a belt clip is showing.
>The fun of making rare CW contacts in a pileup IS the pileup and getting
>thru it.  Haven't spent much time on HF, huh ?

>73, Jim KH2D

Jim,
I'll refrain from saying what is showing when you make statements like
the one above.

Bill,
Certainly you're aware that the ultimate achievement in ham radio is
to key down on as many other stations as possible so as to be heard above
them all!  You can hear the guys practicing this technique in Los Angeles
on 147.435 Saddle Peak.  The strongest station captures the repeater.
Pretty much the same thing.  In either case, it's an embarassing display
of behavior.  Amazing the DX stations still want to point their beams our
way.

Jim AC6XG


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:19 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 16:16:11 GMT
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595vk4$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]> <59c5fd$[e-mail]>
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On 19 Dec 1996 19:36:13 GMT, [e-mail] (James W.
KELLEY) wrote:

>In article <5966q3$[e-mail]>,
>Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in response to Bill Sohl:
>>Bill,
>
>>    When you make statements like that, your HT with a belt clip is showing.
>>The fun of making rare CW contacts in a pileup IS the pileup and getting
>>thru it.  Haven't spent much time on HF, huh ?
>
>>73, Jim KH2D
>
>Jim,
>I'll refrain from saying what is showing when you make statements like
>the one above.
>
>Bill,
>Certainly you're aware that the ultimate achievement in ham radio is
>to key down on as many other stations as possible so as to be heard above
>them all!  You can hear the guys practicing this technique in Los Angeles
>on 147.435 Saddle Peak.  The strongest station captures the repeater.
>Pretty much the same thing.  In either case, it's an embarassing display
>of behavior.  Amazing the DX stations still want to point their beams our
>way.


The point being....(?)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:20 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: CW ratios high on DXpeditions
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 14:43:56 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <59fd09$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595vk4$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]> <59c5fd$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (James W. KELLEY) wrote:

>In article <5966q3$[e-mail]>,
>Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in response to Bill Sohl:
>>Bill,

>>    When you make statements like that, your HT with a belt clip is showing.
>>The fun of making rare CW contacts in a pileup IS the pileup and getting
>>thru it.  Haven't spent much time on HF, huh ?

>>73, Jim KH2D

>Jim,
>I'll refrain from saying what is showing when you make statements like
>the one above.

>Bill,
>Certainly you're aware that the ultimate achievement in ham radio is
>to key down on as many other stations as possible so as to be heard above
>them all!  You can hear the guys practicing this technique in Los Angeles
>on 147.435 Saddle Peak.  The strongest station captures the repeater.
>Pretty much the same thing.  In either case, it's an embarassing display
>of behavior.  Amazing the DX stations still want to point their beams our
>way.

>Jim AC6XG

No, Jimbo, sorry, it ain't the 'same thing'.  Working DX in a pileup on CW has
nothing to do with 'keying down on as many other stations as possible'.   That
may be how you do it on the repeater, but that's not how it's done on CW on
HF.  It requires operator skill, good timing, experience in figuring out how t
he
DX is picking people up, etc.   Not quite the same as putting the radio on you
r
favorite channel and pushing the mic button.........

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Doug Wittich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: DE QSO party
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 19:08:15 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc300043.concentric.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

To Hans Brakob & the other gent:

Thank you for pointing out the  25khz novice recommendation for the
contest, I did miss it because it was not up with the big headlines.
I admit, I didn't read far enough.


Doug


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Definitions that even Carl can Understand
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 22:53:18 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Source: Webster's New World Dictionary
     HEY CARL--look a dictionary for your new world order of Amateur
Radio for pay

ass - noun  any of a genus (Equus) of animals resembling horses but
having longer ears and a shorter mane.  A silly or stupid person

hole - noun a hollow or hollowed out plave, cavity

asshole - noun  see QRZ database under WA6VSE

egoistic - adjective self centered or selfish   egotisical, conceited
see QRZ database under WA6VSE

opinion - noun  a belief not based on absolute certainty or positive
knowledge but on what seems true, valid or probable to one's own mind

opinionated - adjective holding unreasonably or obstinately to one's own
opinion   see QRZ database under WA6VSE

intellect - noun  the ability to reason or understand or to perceive
relationships, differences, etc.  DO NOT see QRZ database under WA6VSE

singleminded - adjective with only one aim or purpose   see QRZ database
under WA6VSE

postulate - to assume without proof to be true, real or necessary,
especially as a basis for argument   see QRZ database under WA6VSE


more to follow


Hey CARL..you started this 9 months ago by insulting me for asking a
question.  DEAL WITH THE CONSEQUENCES OF YOUR FOOLISHNESS.




--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member

If Carl is for it..I'm against it

LEGAL DISCLAIMER
all rights reserved
the preceding has been based upon my opinion
any similarities between WA6VSE and a real person are unintentional,
however no apology is made.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:23 1996
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From: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Definitions that even Carl can Understand
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 10:15:37 -0800
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
>
> Source: Webster's New World Dictionary

(snip)

>
> Hey CARL..you started this 9 months ago by insulting me for asking a
> question.  DEAL WITH THE CONSEQUENCES OF YOUR FOOLISHNESS.
>
> --
> Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
> ARRL LIFE Member
>
> If Carl is for it..I'm against it
>

I think that about sums up the Steve/Carl debate - it doesn't matter what is
said or discussed, regardless of merits of the points made, these two
continue their vile, personal vendettas to the detriment of others.

Carl's responses have been atrocious and there is no doubt that they need to
be taken to task.  His profane and outrageous responses have been remarkable
in masking his viewpoint.  But it is even more remarkable at how easily he
has been able to bait others in such a manner that they are all sucked into
the morass.  But I, and others, have no hope whatsoever that they will reform
- we will continue to subjected to the ceaseless smear campaigns, as this
posting is just an example.  I suppose that the only expectation that we have
is to observe who can dig themselves deeper into the gutter.

Shame on all of you, because none of you haven't the guts, let alone the
intellectual capacity, to continue your useless sniping via e-mail.

73 and live better digitally
Jim, VE3XJ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:24 1996
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From: Christopher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Definitions that even Carl can Understand
Date: 16 Dec 1996 00:08:14 GMT
Organization: CrossLink Internet Services
Lines: 3
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remember the phrase 'amateur PRIVILEGES'.i am a novice ticket and feel
strongly that privileges are EARNED.kd4unc



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:25 1996
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From: Christopher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Definitions that even Carl can Understand
Date: 16 Dec 1996 00:08:33 GMT
Organization: CrossLink Internet Services
Lines: 4
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ug5n$[e-mail]>
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as a novice ticket,while i would love to have phone on all bands, i think
one really ought to earn one's way. rremember  the phrase 'amateur
PRIVILEGES'. kd4 unc



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:26 1996
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From: T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Definitions that even Carl can Understand
Date: 14 Dec 1996 15:12:55 GMT
Organization: http://www.ccnet.com/~teixeira/
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58ug5n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Carl should find a new hobby like golf.  But then he would want the golf balls
 to be made
larger.  Those little golfballs are obsolete and it is unfair that he should h
ave to learn how
to hit those little golfballs.

This no code issue has turned into a joke.........Leave it all alone. I see no
thing but problems
ahead by changing the code requirements or license.  All the tests up through
Extra are
already too easy.  What good would come from a no code general?  More hams,  m
ore over
crowded HF bands.  The no code thing is about selling radios and advertising.
 With the no
code tech  license they are selling thousands of uhf vhf radios. With a no cod
e general they
will be selling many hf rigs.  QST and 73 magazine will be selling more advert
ising.

My opinion,
Don W6IQ




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!math.ohio-state.edu!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!sdd.hp.com!col.hp.com!news.dtc.hp.com!hplntx!hplb!hpwin055.uksr!dstock
From: [e-mail] (David Stockton)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Diesel Generators:  A few questions...
Date: 20 Dec 1996 13:25:08 GMT
Organization: Hwelett Packard
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58fg53$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpqmdoa.sqf.hp.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2.9]
Cache-Post-Path: hpqmdoa.sqf.hp.com![e-mail]

Gary Coffman ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Yes. They aren't maintenance free, however. You need to run them at least
: once a month and change the oil frequently.


        This is true for any internal combustion engine!   In continuous
duty or frequent operation, the Diesel will be spec'd to have oil changes
more often than a petrol(gasoline) or lpg engine. In fairly infrequent
use, it's water absorption that's the problem, more than soot, so all the
types of engine need equally frequent changes.


: Yeah, but don't try to draw directly off the oil tank. Use your fuel
: hose and a transfer pump to keep the genset's onboard tank full. The
: worst thing that can happen to a diesel is to get a gulp of air in the
: fuel lines. Use a high quality filter in the transfer system too. Diesels
: don't like dirt, grit, or dead bugs in their fuel either.


        You need to check that the viscosity of the heating oil you use
is compatible with your engine, and maybe also check the sulphur content.


: That depends. If you're loading a 30 kW unit heavily, it'll drink
: between 4 and 6 gallons an hour. If you are loading it lightly,
: it'll drink much less, 2 gallons an hour or so. (Note, fuel consumption
: doesn't scale linearly with generator size, a smaller generator may not
: get correspondingly better fuel economy.)


  This is the chief justification of the Diesel engine. Running at full
power it is more efficient than an equivalent petrol/gasoline/lpg engine,
but running at reduced power the Diesel is a LOT more efficient than the
spark-ignition engines. Um let me rephrase that, at part-throttle, spark
ignition engined become dramatically inefficient, the Diesel just isn't
so bad. For light running, the Diesel can yield a 2-fold saving in
fuelconsumption compared to a petrol engined generator of comparable peak
power rating.

  A hefty Diesel running a 4-pole alternator direct-drive at 1500/1800
rpm for 50/60 Hz use has a decent life expectancy. Spark ignition engines
have less low-revs torque and so you need either an extra-large engine to
compensate, or else you run a 2-pole alternator at 3000/3600 rpm this
latter does not militate for a long and happy life


   Cheers
          David


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!pivot.net!adp
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: DR-150T power adjustment MODS???
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 05:58:08 GMT
Organization: Pivot.Net
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120673 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44320

Anyone know how to adjust the RF output power of the low/med/high
settings on the DR-150T?
Please reply via email:
Chuck WA1IIE
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!pivot.net!adp
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: DR-150T power adjustment MODS???
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 14:27:50 GMT
Organization: Pivot.Net
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: chin-7.pivot.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.339
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120878 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44504

Anyone know how to adjust the RF output power of the low/med/high
settings on the DR-150T?
Please reply via email:
Chuck WA1IIE
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Drake T-4XB transmitter for sale
Date: 9 Dec 1996 18:47:32 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

For sale-DRAKE T-4XB transmitter.  Like new. Hardly used. With power
supply.

Also have a HAMMARLUND HQ-140-X receiver for sale. Very good condition all
around.  They don't build em' like this anymore!

Either or both will go for reasonable price.

If interested, please e-mail your offer to [e-mail].

Thank you.

-ron


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:32 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 15:32:32 -0800
From: Tim Johnston - KF4FTP <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: Hapco, Division of Kearney Nat'l
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: Dreaming I won the lottery
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Lines: 16
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!netaccess.naxs.com

> All of you dreamers are thinking about the day when you will see a
> no-code ticket. You plan to get on the air and work dx to China. The
> only way you are going to work dx is to learn 13 wpm code. And if you
> want a piece of peace on the bands,( ie:advanced and extra bands ) you
> will have to learn 20 wpm.

Jim,

While I can detect your bitterness against non-CW beleivers, I think you
have one thing incorrect.  Both advanced and extra does not require 20
WPM.  Only one does.
--
Tim Johnston, KF4FTP
E-mail:  mailto:[e-mail] -or- mailto:[e-mail]
Web: http://www.hapcopoles.com


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!delphi.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dreaming I won the lottery
Date: Thu, 19 DEC 96 00:46:43 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1d.delphi.com
X-To: jim daneke <[e-mail]>

jim daneke <[e-mail]> writes:

>When I am stupid enough to buy a lottery ticket, I dream about quitting
>my job, buying a house on a mountain, putting up a beam and putting out
>1500 watts. Then the next day, I read the paper and find I am stuck with

Jim: When Iwin the lottery, I'll invite you to my station on a mountain, with
the 250 ft.tower, and you can operate during the contest. That's when I win th
e
lottery.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!cbgw2.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!alice!allegra!ulysses!newshub.netnews.att.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dreaming I won the lottery
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 10:04:31 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 135.3.90.*
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

> All of you dreamers are thinking about the day when you will see a
> no-code ticket. You plan to get on the air and work dx to China. The
> only way you are going to work dx is to learn 13 wpm code...That's
> just the way it is.

And right he is. If indeed it's DX that you're after on HF, you'll often
find the rarest of it down around the "dot zero" part of any given band.
CW gives you a real edge when you're DXing in compromise conditions. The
barefoot power and wire antennas that many of us run WILL not break
through the 20m SSB pileups, and in all likelihood you won't even HEAR
the DX station. Plus, you need a General ticket to get on 17m, the only
other "reasonable antenna size" phone band that's regularly open for DX
these days.

Now, wait 'til the sunspots return and the above isn't EXACTLY valid...
8v)
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dreaming I won the lottery
Date: 21 Dec 1996 07:51:50 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59g4um$[e-mail]>
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

jim daneke ([e-mail]) wrote:

: All of you dreamers are thinking about the day when you will see a
: no-code ticket. You plan to get on the air and work dx to China. The
: only way you are going to work dx is to learn 13 wpm code. And if you

This is false. It is easily possible to work DX to China, or any other
country, using 5 wpm CW on the Novice segments of the bands.

Of course, you cannot use SSB, except for the segment on 10 meters, but
I have found CW conversations to be much more interesting than the gabbing
that happens with voice.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!spool.mu.edu!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!csulb.edu!drivel.ics.uci.edu!news.service.uci.edu!e4e.oac.uci.edu!jwkelley
From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: 11 Dec 1996 23:42:29 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58ngt5$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: e4e.oac.uci.edu

In article <[e-mail]>,
Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In article <586av2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] wri
tes:
>>Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
>>>of about 100 watts HF?
>>
>>First you get a 100 watt 50 ohm resistor. Then you get a metal box.....
>>It don't get no more simple than that......
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D

>Yeah, but that had better be a darn special resistor. Most 100 watt
>resistors will have far too much inductance at HF to be a good dummy
>load.

I wonder if an antenna tuner could provide enough capacitive reactance to
cancel out the inductance from the typical power wirewound?  Its difficult
to get the wirewounds to resonate in a tank circuit in order to get a
feel for their inductance.  (kind of a low Q inductor, they are.)

If you could offset the phase shift from the inductance, the rig should
feel just fine about working into a resistor of this type.  I suppose
once the value of capacitance in determined, one could include a capacitor
in series with the resistor.  You'd be stuck with a fixed test frequency
with a fixed value of capacitance though.

Any reason the load has to be a DC load?

Jim AC6XG



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.89.123.24!nntp.inet.fi!news.sci.fi!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 08:45:05 GMT
Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, [e-mail], (931)3186277
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <58ogfj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ngt5$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ccxxviii.adyn.sci.fi
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (James W. KELLEY) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>In article <586av2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] wr
ites:
>>>Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>>Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
>>>>of about 100 watts HF?
>>>
>>>First you get a 100 watt 50 ohm resistor. Then you get a metal box.....
>>>It don't get no more simple than that......
>>>
>>>73, Jim KH2D

>>Yeah, but that had better be a darn special resistor. Most 100 watt
>>resistors will have far too much inductance at HF to be a good dummy
>>load.

>I wonder if an antenna tuner could provide enough capacitive reactance to
>cancel out the inductance from the typical power wirewound?  Its difficult
>to get the wirewounds to resonate in a tank circuit in order to get a
>feel for their inductance.  (kind of a low Q inductor, they are.)

>If you could offset the phase shift from the inductance, the rig should
>feel just fine about working into a resistor of this type.  I suppose
>once the value of capacitance in determined, one could include a capacitor
>in series with the resistor.  You'd be stuck with a fixed test frequency
>with a fixed value of capacitance though.

Such arrangements have been used for decades on VHF and UHF.

>Any reason the load has to be a DC load?

It depends what you are using the dummy load for. If you are tunning a
transmitter and measuring spurious emissions from it, it would be very
nice to have a known load (such as 50 ohms) also on the spurious
frequencies. Also when calibrating the SWR bridge, it would be nice to
know that the harmonics would not upset the calibration due to some
impedance peaks in the dummy load at the harmonics. Response down to
DC is hardly required and if you are certain that the signal source
does not contain spurious signals, a narrow band could be used.

Paul OH3LWR







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.pixi.com!news.hula.net!spartacus.hula.net!jfenn
From: Joesph Fenn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dummy Load?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 04:16:01 -1000
Organization: Hula Net, Inc.  Hawaii's Newest Internet Provider
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586av2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ngt5$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spartacus.hula.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: "James W. KELLEY" <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <58ngt5$[e-mail]>

On 11 Dec 1996, James W. KELLEY wrote:

 In article <[e-mail]>,
 Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
In article <586av2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writ
es:
Michael McGinnis <[e-mail]> wrote:
Can anyone tell me how to make a simple dummy load that can take a load
of about 100 watts HF?
First you get a 100 watt 50 ohm resistor. Then you get a metal box.....
It don't get no more simple than that......
73, Jim KH2D

Yeah, but that had better be a darn special resistor. Most 100 watt
resistors will have far too much inductance at HF to be a good dummy
load.

 I wonder if an antenna tuner could provide enough capacitive reactance to
 cancel out the inductance from the typical power wirewound?  Its difficult
 to get the wirewounds to resonate in a tank circuit in order to get a
 feel for their inductance.  (kind of a low Q inductor, they are.)

 If you could offset the phase shift from the inductance, the rig should
 feel just fine about working into a resistor of this type.  I suppose
 once the value of capacitance in determined, one could include a capacitor
 in series with the resistor.  You'd be stuck with a fixed test frequency
 with a fixed value of capacitance though.

 Any reason the load has to be a DC load?

 Jim AC6XG


Hey I gotta a better idea for ya.  Get a 150W light bulb, connect it
to the dummy load output on your tuner and your all set.  It might
not come out to exactly a 50 ohm resistance, but who cares.  It will
keep your rig dry while your tuneing up.
                       Joe KH6JF







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "Victor D. Mete" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: 19 Dec 1996 18:54:47 GMT
Organization: PMT
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <01bbedde$17db6f00$2c5592cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.85.44
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44666 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121131 rec.radio.swap:100286

Hello everyone,

        My name is Vic and I am looking for some information. Being new to HF I
know very little ... about the whole scene. Looking at rigs however, I have
decided I'd like to buy either an Alinco DX-70T or an Icom IC-706.
        Does anyone have an actual comparison of the two rigs side by side so as
to comment on performance? How about features on HF & 6M between the two? I
know the DX-70T comes with CW & SSB narrow filters built in and they are an
option on the Icom, but how about actual performance between the two?
        I have seen MANY mods for the IC-706 but NONE for the DX-70T. Are there
mods available for the DX-70T?
         I have heard the 706 sounds lousy on HF with a stock mic. A friend said
he talked with a DX-70 owner and it sounded like the "big rigs"! Is this
true?
        How about this ... ya know the typical finger indent on the tuning knob?
Well, the 706 has it and I've tried it. Very comfortable, works well. The
DX-70 doesn't have it! How is it to tune??? I don't have anywhere to local
to try one. In fact in SE Florida here, don't know of a single person with
a DX-70. Don't see them for sale either!

        Awaiting your comments (and tips to mods)!
--
Victor
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!mindspring!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: DXER.COM Website Update
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 06:01:41 GMT
Organization: A customer of Pacific Bell Internet Services
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-67-199.anhm01.pacbell.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Stop by and check out the additions to "dxer.com"
30 pages,over 400 links. Mew additions to 12 of the
indexes..Check out the BBS and leave your comments
or suggestions to improve the site to better serve the
amateur community..

CallBooks         (4)
Contest Calendar  (2)
DX Clubs          (3)
Ham Radio Clubs   (3)
Ham Radio Info    (3)
Logging Software  (3)
Manufacturers     (4)
Packet Radio      (5)
QRP               (6)
Propagation       (3)
Radio Mods        (2)
Satellites        (4)
SoCal Rptrs      (New)





If you have a site you would like to see added or a
subject covered, send us the URL and we will create a
new index. Radio related sites only

"http://www.dxer.com"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (David A. Yanke)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Encoded files
Date: 12 Dec 96 15:20:12 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Why do people feel the need to make me download encoded files
when I DL my email.

kd4cdb decided the world needed some wave file. Please if you have
these mention them in your message and people who want them will
write you direct. I find it ironic that this file was a complaint in
regards to "jamming".




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: 19 Dec 1996 13:11:56 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) writes:

>JC>Why?
>
>Because, the people have spoken!
>
>

Actually, the people haven't spoken, people motivated enough to vote in a
poll which was announced and described in QST were the ones who voted.  If
you had asked most people who might be interested in amateur radio, you
might get different results.  If you asked active hams, you might once
again get different results.  I note that the ARRL doesn't claim it's a
random poll of amateurs, just that it's a poll.  You might want to
consider what would happen if you based your predictions of the 1996
presidential elections on a poll of attendees at the republican
convention, and how accurate that poll would be.

Whether or not hams who enjoy code want to admit it or not, the majority
of amateur radio doesn't involve or need international morse code.  I've
also been a ham long enough to remember that there are lots of Dick Bash
hams, who memorized not only the questions and answers likely to appear on
the exam, but answers to code tests too.  I know at least two extra class
hams from that era, who don't realize that they're being called on cw if I
send at 4 wpm.  I don't even like cw, and I guarantee that if you send my
callsign at 25 wpm, I'll recognize it, I might not copy 25 wpm reliably,
but my call I do.  I'm never going to love code, and most hams don't use
it either.  I don't favor banning it, but neither do I think that because
I passed a code test in 1979, that newer hams should have to do the same
thing.  If you enjoy code, fine, but it's no longer state of the art, and
almost every other service has found other ways to communicate reliably.
73 de n8blk/3  -art clemons-


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!142.92.36.86!crc-news.doc.ca!usenet
From: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 10:31:14 -0800
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

Roland Stiner wrote:
>
> JC>Why?
>
> Because, the people have spoken!
>

No that is incorrect.  Only those who bothered to answer the poll have
spoken.  In any case, so what?  Retaining Morse code is no longer
justifiable in order to satisfy the government's legitimate interest to
mitigating interference among its users, what difference would a poll
among amateurs make?

73 and live better digitally
Jim, VE3XJ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!142.92.36.86!crc-news.doc.ca!usenet
From: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 09:04:36 -0800
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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Roland Stiner wrote:
>
>  >In over rousing fashion, amateurs
>  >have said yes to the retention of morse code. Sixty two percent of ARRL
>  >members polled said yes to keeping the code.  While thirty percent said no
.
>  >Of all amateurs polled, members and non-members alike, Fifty four percent
>  >said yes to keeping the code, while thirty seven percent said no.
>
> This should end the debate for the next decade at least!

Why?


73 and live better digitally
Jim, VE3XJ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 04:09:50 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <597ufd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp28.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Jim Cummings <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Roland Stiner wrote:
>>
>>  >In over rousing fashion, amateurs
>>  >have said yes to the retention of morse code. Sixty two percent of ARRL
>>  >members polled said yes to keeping the code.  While thirty percent said n
o.
>>  >Of all amateurs polled, members and non-members alike, Fifty four percent
>>  >said yes to keeping the code, while thirty seven percent said no.
>>
>> This should end the debate for the next decade at least!

>Why?

Because Roland and his ilke believe that if you're not a Life member
of the ARRL your opinio does not matter. Even when they accept your
opnion, it usually had better agree with theirs. Sure the ARRL wants
to see code retained. The whole organization is rife with pro-coders.
No-coders are shunned and looked down upon. Still hasn't stopped me
from being a member.
The only way the organization will change is by changing the
membership. And that is done by joining and adding your voice to the
unwashed masses, until we become the majority. That is one of the many
reasons i was selected as the President of my local ARC. They know I
despise code, would never use it, yet I do not consider coders the
unwashed heathens that I am considered by some of the older members.
I just smile an keep in mind that these dinosaurs will die eventually
and hopefully won't infect too many young hams with their vile and
annimosity to their fellow unwashed no-code hams.

>73 and live better digitally
>Jim, VE3XJ
73's and live better digitally an anologously  :)



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!viking.cris.com!Insight
From: INSIGHT Services <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Enough of the stupid bickering
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 16:12:12 -0500
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: viking.cris.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
X-Sender: [e-mail]

I for one am tired of seeing all the "CW is outdated" , "No phone, etc."
posts. While I agree that this is of course an issue that lots of people
are interested in, perhaps it would be better for those involved to email
each other personally instead of just extensively quoting the last 20 or
so posts. Then they could make a digest of it and post the relevent parts
to the newsgroup.
Simply stated if you are going to continue calling each other names and
saying this one is stupid for this reason or that one is stupid for this
reason then please do so in individual email. Not in the newsgroup.
Any flames should be directed to my email address :
[e-mail]
Thanks.

---
Susan Driggers
QTH EM85
In the Mountains of Eastern Tennessee, USA
HTX-202
Kenwood TS-520S with 100 foot Random Wire
Real radios glow in the dark !




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:48 1996
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From: Dave Adams <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Extended Receive on Kenwood TM-241
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 10:29:20 -0800
Organization: New Foundation Inc
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: d81.netgate.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; I)

Greetings!  I have a TM-241A in my car.  I purchased it used and the
receive has already been extended from 118mhz to 148mhz.  I know that it
will receive up to 170-some-odd.  I wanna be able to pull in weather
info from 162.  However, I do not know the mod to do so.  Any pointers?

73 de dave, n9uxu


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.onramp.net!usenet
From: Clif <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Extended Receive on Kenwood TM-241
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 16:04:33 -0600
Organization: OnRamp Technologies; ISP;  Dallas/Ft Worth/Houston, TX USA
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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To: [e-mail]

Dave Adams wrote:
>
> Greetings!  I have a TM-241A in my car.  I purchased it used and the
> receive has already been extended from 118mhz to 148mhz.  I know that it
> will receive up to 170-some-odd.  I wanna be able to pull in weather
> info from 162.  However, I do not know the mod to do so.  Any pointers?
>
> 73 de dave, n9uxu

Sounds like it weas improperly modified because out of the box it
receives from 118-174 mhz..

Clif
AVVid is an Authorized Kenwood and Icom Service Center
http:/rampages.onramp.net/~avvid


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!129.34.139.15!newsgate.watson.ibm.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Extended Receive on Kenwood TM-241
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 23:35:43 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <58ttg9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-121.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Clif <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Dave Adams wrote:
>>
>> Greetings!  I have a TM-241A in my car.  I purchased it used and the
>> receive has already been extended from 118mhz to 148mhz.  I know that it
>> will receive up to 170-some-odd.  I wanna be able to pull in weather
>> info from 162.  However, I do not know the mod to do so.  Any pointers?
>>
>> 73 de dave, n9uxu

>Sounds like it weas improperly modified because out of the box it
>receives from 118-174 mhz..

DAMN !!  I HATE it when somebody cuts the wrong diode..........

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC gone in 1997
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:54:37 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <c57cc$93529.35f@NEWS>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts4p12.ro.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Thu, 05 Dec 1996 14:53:41 GMT, Steve Eklund
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>[e-mail] (mac  ) writes: >     The House Telecommunications sub-committe
e will hold hearings in
>> early 1997 in preparation for closing down the FCC.  The hearings
>> will begin with an examination of each job classificaion in the FCC
>> and why it is necessary.  FCC Chairman Reed Hundt will be grilled on
>> his gross mismanagement of the agency, and the hearings will
>> conclude with an endorsement of Progress Freedoms Foundation's
>> proposal to abolish the FCC.  Net result will be an Office of
>> Telecommunications Policy in the Executive Office of the President
>> which will employ about 150 people, mostly lawyers.  Rumors are
>> already appearing in some trade publications about just how soon
>> the agency can be closed down.
>>
>
>Sounds like the final step necessary before Congress can sell
>all of the frequency spectrum to pay for their blunders. Without
>the FCC, the already over-sized telecommunications industry
>will be free to do whatever they want with the radio spectrum.
>Gone will be ham radio, GMRS, CB and other services. You will
>no longer be able to own and use your own repeater free of charge.
>You will have to pay ATT, MCI, Sprint, or dozens of other companies
>for your air time. Why? Because they bought and OWN the frequencies!!
>You will no longer have anything to say about it!
>
>Let's think about it. The name of the game is money. The board
>of directors of these companies have the responsibility of making
>as much money as possible for their company and their stockholders.
>They will try to charge for air-time on every device that uses
>a radio transmitter. Want a cordless phone? Just fill out the
>application that comes with the phone, and they will give you the
>access code to make the phone work. They will also bill you ten
>or more dollars each month for the privilege of using the radio
>spectrum that they own! The same goes for wireless microphones,
>baby monitors, or wireless anything. Ham radio? CB? GMRS? FRS?
>HA-HA-HA!! Got ya sucka! You bought the equipment, so now if
>you want it to work you have to pay them!
>
>How about commercial radio and TV? They have been pushing for
>digital broadcasts for years. Do you think that they are just
>doing it so you can watch Jeopardy or hear the Rolling Stones
>with new realism and clarity? Not in my opinion. They want
>to be able to charge you every time you turn on your radio
>and TV! With the digital technology, they will be able to do it
>because your radio will not work until the unlock code is received.
>If you think that it will never happen, just take a look at
>satelite TV. What can you get for free on the old C-band?
>The Home Shopping Network maybe? Do you think that they went
>DSS so you can get better pictures?
>
>Office of Telecommunications Policy? 150 lawyers? HA! I seriously
>doubt that this office will be established to watch out for the
>public! Quite the contrary! Don't believe me? Just ask these
>lawyers how many hold stock in ATT, MCI, Sprint, USSB or any
>of hundreds of other telecommunications giants.
>
>This post is just my opinion, but I am seriously concerned that
>it may come to this more sooner than later. What do you think?
>
>Steve, WA3RVT

Your so full of crap you squeak when you walk. Baby monitors???
What an idiot.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:52 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!paladin.american.edu!hookup!visi.com!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!rll
From: [e-mail] (Richard L. Lamb)
Subject: Re: FCC Mismanagement
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 19:40:56 GMT
Lines: 25
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (mac  ) writes:
>     FCC Chairman Reed Hundt fires 120 enforcement personnel
>earlier this year and closes 28 field offices.  Then he hires
>100 lawyers with the money saved.  NOW he tells Congress and the
>public that he doesn't have enough enforcement personnel or
>field offices to carry out the FCC mission!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>      Hundt obviously has fried eggs for brains or he is as some
>say, the worst manager ever to sit in the chair of the Chairman
>of the FCC!
>       The sad part is that long after Hundt is replaced, the new
>FCC Chairman (if there still is an FCC) will be faced with
>cleaning up the monumental mess in the high-frequency portion of
>the spectrum.  A mess which grows worse every day and is a direct
>result of Hundt's closing the FCC's monitoring stations and firing
>120 enforcement personnel!
>
>
>

I liked it better when you were George Asics Jr.  Are you going to
be [e-mail] permanently?  Time to update my killfile, I suppose.

Richard Lamb
N6UDD
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!ralph.vnet.net!rik
From: [e-mail] (Henrik Rasmussen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FCC never sent license
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 09:21:07 -0500
Organization: Direct Call, Inc.
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: accs-as18-dp04.atln.grid.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.4



I upgraded to Extra a couple of months ago. Never got my new license in the
mail. The upgrade is in the FCC database. Does anyone know if this is part
of the recent problems or do you think I should contact FCC?

Rik

--
Rik Rasmussen    Raleigh NC USA
[e-mail]     http://users.vnet.net/rik/
amateur radio    WA4BAN


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!mhv.net!Randall
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC never sent license
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 02:03:17 GMT
Organization: MHVNet, the Mid Hudson Valley's Internet Connection
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59850q$694$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port109.mhv.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #0

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Henri
k Rasmussen) wrote:
>
>
>I upgraded to Extra a couple of months ago. Never got my new license in the
>mail. The upgrade is in the FCC database. Does anyone know if this is part
>of the recent problems or do you think I should contact FCC?
>
>Rik
>
>--
>Rik Rasmussen    Raleigh NC USA
>[e-mail]     http://users.vnet.net/rik/
>amateur radio    WA4BAN


 Contact the FCC. I would have contacted them after 1 1/2 months. Tickets are
coming with 5 weeks or less.

Tom


   Tom Randall            Amateur Radio - KB2SMS
   [e-mail]       Mt. Beacon Amateur Radio Club / ARRL / 10-10
                          Member: AAVSO Solar Division

   Opinions herein are mine and may not be that of MHV.NET!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: FLAME!!!!! No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 05:46:13 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <58paeu$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]> <5859ep$[e-mail]> <58ina2$[e-mail]> <58o688$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-159.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120389 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44121

[e-mail] wrote:

>In <58ina2$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>>On 5 Dec 1996 01:44:57 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>the HELL I did ... I did not write a single word of the crap below ...

Sorry, Squiggy, you are so well know for your crap, we thought you did it ....
..

>>WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  WE ARE NOT THE ONLY PEOPLE ON THE AIR WAVES!!!!
>>
>>  WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF NO-CODE PEOPLE ARE ON THE HF VOICE BAND AND
>>HEARS *** --- *** (IT'S SOS) FOR NO CODERS. IT'S A SHIP THAT CAN NOT
>>REACH ANYONE!!! IT GOES DOWN WITH NO ONE KNOWING WHERE IT IS!!!!
>>
>>
>>   THIS IS WHY CODE IS HERE AND SHOULD STAY!!!!
>>
>>
>>
>>DURING ANY TYPE OF EMERGENCY, EITHER NUCLEAR OR OTHER, MORSE CODE WILL
>>BE ONE MODE THAT CAN GET THRU!!! IT'S BEEN PROVEN!! ALSO MORSE CODE
>>CAN BE RECIEVED WHILE PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO JAM AND OUTSIDE NOISE
>>TOO!!!!
>>
>>
>>UNLIKE VOICE OR DIGITAL SIGNALS. TRY PACKET WHEN SOMEONE IS RUNNING A
>>LAWNMOWER OR TRACTOR RIGHT OUT SIDE YOUR ANTENNA !!
>>
>>
>>
>>   THE MILITARY STILL USES MORSE CODE AND USE IT TO SEND CRYPTIC
>>MESSAGES AND SO DOES THE WORLD TOO!!!
>>
>>
>>SO WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  THE INSTANT SOCIATY PEOPLE GO HOME AND STOP
>>YELLING ABOUT SOMETHING YOU WANT AND JUST EARN IT!!!!!!!!!!
>>
>>
>>
>>KA3FFY
>>
>>05H30
>>MILITARY INTELLAGENCE  MORSE CODE INTERCEPTER
>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>well-known oxymoron (and apparently a regular moron, too ... 'cause he
>can't even spell his job description ...)

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!newsfeed1.aimnet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: FLAME!!!!! No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 05:46:48 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <58o688$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <584p4d$[e-mail]> <5859ep$[e-mail]> <58ina2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120405 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44126

In <58ina2$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>On 5 Dec 1996 01:44:57 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

the HELL I did ... I did not write a single word of the crap below ...

>WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  WE ARE NOT THE ONLY PEOPLE ON THE AIR WAVES!!!!
>
>  WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF NO-CODE PEOPLE ARE ON THE HF VOICE BAND AND
>HEARS *** --- *** (IT'S SOS) FOR NO CODERS. IT'S A SHIP THAT CAN NOT
>REACH ANYONE!!! IT GOES DOWN WITH NO ONE KNOWING WHERE IT IS!!!!
>
>
>   THIS IS WHY CODE IS HERE AND SHOULD STAY!!!!
>
>
>
>DURING ANY TYPE OF EMERGENCY, EITHER NUCLEAR OR OTHER, MORSE CODE WILL
>BE ONE MODE THAT CAN GET THRU!!! IT'S BEEN PROVEN!! ALSO MORSE CODE
>CAN BE RECIEVED WHILE PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO JAM AND OUTSIDE NOISE
>TOO!!!!
>
>
>UNLIKE VOICE OR DIGITAL SIGNALS. TRY PACKET WHEN SOMEONE IS RUNNING A
>LAWNMOWER OR TRACTOR RIGHT OUT SIDE YOUR ANTENNA !!
>
>
>
>   THE MILITARY STILL USES MORSE CODE AND USE IT TO SEND CRYPTIC
>MESSAGES AND SO DOES THE WORLD TOO!!!
>
>
>SO WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!  THE INSTANT SOCIATY PEOPLE GO HOME AND STOP
>YELLING ABOUT SOMETHING YOU WANT AND JUST EARN IT!!!!!!!!!!
>
>
>
>KA3FFY
>
>05H30
>MILITARY INTELLAGENCE  MORSE CODE INTERCEPTER
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
well-known oxymoron (and apparently a regular moron, too ... 'cause he
can't even spell his job description ...)

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.netins.net!usenet
From: Todd Peterson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: For Sale: Inexpensive PC Interface IC
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 23:44:14 -0600
Organization: netINS, Inc.
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: desm-06-46.dialup.netins.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; name="hobby.txt"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="hobby.txt"

Been looking for an easy, inexpensive ($13.90 single quantity) way to connect
your hobby to your

PC?  Then please read on!



E-LAB Digital Engineering, Inc. announces the release of their new

EDE300 Interface IC.  It allows for convenient flow of data either from a

PC ot too a PC via the serial port.  Our datasheet even provides

software examples for use with a PC.  NOW IS THE PERFECT OPPORTUNITY TO
INTEGRATE YOUR PC INTO YOUR ELECTRONICS PROJECTS!



Our datasheet is available in electronic format via our webpage at

http://www.netins.net/showcase/elab   or contact us directly at

[e-mail] and include your postal mailing address.



In addition, we will do our best to get you up and running when using

the EDE300, even if your electronics experience is limited.



Todd Peterson

E-LAB Digital Engineering, Inc.

[phone]



Serious dealer inquiries are welcomed as well.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:08:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!nntp.crl.com!news.pbi.net!ns2.mainstreet.net!ablecom!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: ForSale: Kenwood TS450S/AT - SOLD
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 02:30:58 GMT
Organization: Able Technical Services
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.75.38.67
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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On Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:56:23 GMT, [e-mail] (Gary) wrote:

Kenwood TS450S/AT has been sold.  Thanks everyone for responding...

-gary
ke6byu

>Sale in San Jose, CA.
>
>*Kenwood TS450SAT: ($900 or best offer)
>    (Including addition accessories installed)
>      -High Stability Osc.,TCXO UNIT,Model SO-2 (paid $170)
>      -SSB narrow filter, YK88SN-1, 1.8kHz (paid $100)
>
>*Bencher YA-1 Low Pass Filter, 50/52 ohm ($25 or best offer)
> handles 1.5 KW continuous. (paid $60)
>
>*foneFilter, F-1, Telephone filter ($5)
>
>*Multi-band Inv-V/Dipole Ant. System ($100 or best offer)
>    -Alpha Delta DX-CC, a no trap 10 thru 80 meter, Dipole Antenna
>    -37 foot Telescoping Mast, material is schedule 80 PVC Tubing,
>     in 4 sections, with O.D's: 3.50", 2.75", 2.25", and 1.75".
>     Mast is more durable and can withstand higher wind speeds than
>     a steel mast, when guyed properly.  Also, doesn't interact with
>     antenna like a steel mast would.
>
>73,
>-gary
>ke6byu



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!nntp.crl.com!news.pbi.net!ns2.mainstreet.net!ablecom!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: ForSale: Kenwood TS450S/AT - SOLD
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 02:33:39 GMT
Organization: Able Technical Services
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.75.38.67
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44637 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121102 rec.radio.swap:100246

Kenwood TS450S/AT, Astron 20A P/S and  Timewave DSP-59+ have been
sold.  Thanks everyone for responding...

-gary
ke6byu

>Sale in San Jose, CA.
>
>*Kenwood TS450SAT: ($900 or best offer)
>    (Including addition accessories installed)
>      -High Stability Osc.,TCXO UNIT,Model SO-2 (paid $170)
>      -SSB narrow filter, YK88SN-1, 1.8kHz (paid $100)
>
>*Bencher YA-1 Low Pass Filter, 50/52 ohm ($25 or best offer)
> handles 1.5 KW continuous. (paid $60)
>
>*foneFilter, F-1, Telephone filter ($5)
>
>*Multi-band Inv-V/Dipole Ant. System ($100 or best offer)
>    -Alpha Delta DX-CC, a no trap 10 thru 80 meter, Dipole Antenna
>    -37 foot Telescoping Mast, material is schedule 80 PVC Tubing,
>     in 4 sections, with O.D's: 3.50", 2.75", 2.25", and 1.75".
>     Mast is more durable and can withstand higher wind speeds than
>     a steel mast, when guyed properly.  Also, doesn't interact with
>     antenna like a steel mast would.
>
>73,
>-gary
>ke6byu



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!ns2.mainstreet.net!ablecom!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: ForSale: Kenwood TS450S/AT, Filters & Antenna
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:56:23 GMT
Organization: Able Technical Services
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.75.38.67
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44592 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121018 rec.radio.swap:100101

Sale in San Jose, CA.

*Kenwood TS450SAT: ($900 or best offer)
    (Including addition accessories installed)
      -High Stability Osc.,TCXO UNIT,Model SO-2 (paid $170)
      -SSB narrow filter, YK88SN-1, 1.8kHz (paid $100)

*Bencher YA-1 Low Pass Filter, 50/52 ohm ($25 or best offer)
 handles 1.5 KW continuous. (paid $60)

*foneFilter, F-1, Telephone filter ($5)

*Multi-band Inv-V/Dipole Ant. System ($100 or best offer)
    -Alpha Delta DX-CC, a no trap 10 thru 80 meter, Dipole Antenna
    -37 foot Telescoping Mast, material is schedule 80 PVC Tubing,
     in 4 sections, with O.D's: 3.50", 2.75", 2.25", and 1.75".
     Mast is more durable and can withstand higher wind speeds than
     a steel mast, when guyed properly.  Also, doesn't interact with
     antenna like a steel mast would.

73,
-gary
ke6byu


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Albert Schwartz)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: ForSale: Kenwood TS450S/AT, Filters & Antenna
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:00:13 GMT
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-250-122.pa.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230
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On Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:56:23 GMT, [e-mail] (Gary) wrote:

>Sale in San Jose, CA.
>
>*Kenwood TS450SAT: ($900 or best offer)
>    (Including addition accessories installed)
>      -High Stability Osc.,TCXO UNIT,Model SO-2 (paid $170)
>      -SSB narrow filter, YK88SN-1, 1.8kHz (paid $100)
>
>*Bencher YA-1 Low Pass Filter, 50/52 ohm ($25 or best offer)
> handles 1.5 KW continuous. (paid $60)
>
>*foneFilter, F-1, Telephone filter ($5)
>
>*Multi-band Inv-V/Dipole Ant. System ($100 or best offer)
>    -Alpha Delta DX-CC, a no trap 10 thru 80 meter, Dipole Antenna
>    -37 foot Telescoping Mast, material is schedule 80 PVC Tubing,
>     in 4 sections, with O.D's: 3.50", 2.75", 2.25", and 1.75".
>     Mast is more durable and can withstand higher wind speeds than
>     a steel mast, when guyed properly.  Also, doesn't interact with
>     antenna like a steel mast would.
>
>73,
>-gary
>ke6byu
********************************************
Gary: Interested in ur 450at. Pse E-mail me ur
Phone No.
Albert <[e-mail]>
*********************************************



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!198.82.160.249!solaris.cc.vt.edu!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Ben E. Cline)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FR5HR/F5RRH Address????
Date: 16 Dec 1996 14:08:22 GMT
Organization: Virginia Tech, Blacksburg, Virginia
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <593l4m$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: benjy.cc.vt.edu
X-Newsreader: knews 0.9.6

I worked FR5HR on 12M in late November.  Several sources indicated
his QSL route to be via F5RRH.  The French post office returned
the card I sent to the callbook address for F5RRH.  My french is
not that good, but I think the words stamped on the evelope could
be translated, a la Elvis, to

        Return to sender.
        Address unknown.
        No such number.
        No such zone.

The address I used is the same one in the new RAC CD-ROM and on one
of the European web sites.  Anyone have a good address for F5RRH?  Please
e-mail moi.

Thanks,
Benjy AC4XO

--
Benjy Cline, AC4XO, Ph.D.
Virginia Tech Computing Center
[e-mail]
http://benjy.cc.vt.edu:1951/~benjy/



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!158.250.39.26!Gamma.RU!srcc!news.odyssey.com.au!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: From FCC, Mult club calls
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 14:38:47 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.5.147.156
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; name="arrcllt.txt"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44432 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121178

           December 13, 1996
       The ARRL Letter Online

 MULTIPLE CLUB STATION CALL SIGNS ALL LEGAL

The assignment of multiple club station call signs
to the same clubs--some of which may exist only on
paper--is perfectly legal according to a staff
member in the FCC's Private Wireless Division. However,
the practice--which has become more prevalent and
obvious during the issuance of Gate 2 vanity call signs
in November--has raised the hackles of some hams. A
California ham wrote the ARRL expressing his concern that
the multiple applications were "clearly in violation of
the spirit" of the vanity call sign program, and a New York
ham asserted that "club calls should be for real clubs, not
imaginary ones." Both hams decried the issuance of 23 club
station callsigns issued to members of one family in
California.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!sloc223.cds.sloc.net!usenet
From: boyd <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS  DSP-9+
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 12:23:45 -0800
Organization: SPRINTLink On Campus
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p10-as2.humbol1.csu.sloc.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02Gold (Win95; U)
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="DSP-9.txt"

For Sale:

     Timewave  DSP-9+, very dood cond. With 3.03 Upgrade.
     Book and shipping box.

     $125.00    includes shipping.
    -------------------------------

   Boyd
   N6DMF
   [e-mail]
   Phone: [phone]





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!homer.alpha.net!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!sloc223.cds.sloc.net!usenet
From: boyd <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS Icom IC-736
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 06:39:12 -0800
Organization: SPRINTLink On Campus
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p7-as1.humbol1.csu.sloc.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Content-Disposition: inline; filename="IC-736.txt"



  For Sale:

         I have a Icom IC-736 for sale. I bought it in the end
         of October 1996. This rig is as new, has maby 2 hrs use.

         The IC-736 is a general coverage transceiver from 30 KC
         to 30 MHz, Also has 6 meters. Has built-in Antenna Tunner
         and 110 Power Supply. It is All-Mode, SSB, AM, FM, & CW.
         I have shipping box, power cord, hand mic and book.

         I paid $1700.00 for it but will sell for $1450.00
                                                 __________
         Thanks,
         Boyd
         N6DMF
         [e-mail]
         Phone: [phone]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sover.net!news-out.internetmci.com!pull-feed.internetmci.com!news-out.internetmci.com!uwm.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!nntp.crl.com!news.pbi.net!ns2.mainstreet.net!ablecom!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: FS: Bencher YA-1 Low Pass Filter, foneFilter & Multi-band Inv-V Ant. System ($100 for all)
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 02:40:43 GMT
Organization: Able Technical Services
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.75.38.67
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44644 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121108 rec.radio.swap:100259

Sale in San Jose, CA.

-------------------For Sale-------------------------
($100 for all)

*Bencher YA-1 Low Pass Filter, 50/52 ohm ($25 or best offer)
 handles 1.5 KW continuous.

*foneFilter, F-1, Telephone filter ($5)

*Multi-band Inv-V/Dipole Ant. System ($85 or best offer)
    -Alpha Delta DX-CC, a no trap 10 thru 80 meter, Dipole Antenna
    -37 foot Telescoping Mast, material is schedule 80 PVC Tubing,
     in 4 sections, with O.D's: 3.50", 2.75", 2.25", and 1.75".
     Mast is more durable and can withstand higher wind speeds than
     a steel mast, when guyed properly.  Also, doesn't interact with
     antenna like a steel mast would.

73,
-gary
ke6byu


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Johnathon Whale)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: FS: CB Service Manuals (Tram)
Date: 15 Dec 1996 03:43:32 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58vs54$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: viking.cris.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20709 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44357 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22059 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120712 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44213 rec.radio.amateur.space:9143

Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Summary:
Keywords:

For Sale:
*RARE* Tram Factory Service Manuals (Gone out of business now) for Tram
 Citizen Band Radios  (CB   SSB/AM)
These manuals include:
o  Tune Up Procedures
o  Schematics
o  Photos of the PC Boards
o  Alignment procedures
o  Testing
The manuals are 10 to 20 pages long. In SUPERB condition!
No soiled, roughed, or dogeared pages. The booklet is stapled.
        Model             Price
          XL               $25
          XL5              $30
          DIAMOND 40       $40
          DIAMOND 60       $50
    D201 (Base unit)       $10
Please respond via email to [e-mail] or call my machine
at [phone] and leave a message or fax (since these groups tend to
get cluttered) Thank you.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!lll-winken.llnl.gov!hookup!nova.thezone.net!p
From: [e-mail] (Paul J. Piercey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Icom IC-706
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 96 20:43:50 GMT
Organization: HookUp Communication Corporation, St. John's, Newfoundland, CANADA
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58v3eq$cd5$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: gnat.thezone.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2

For Sale:

        1 Icom IC-706 Multi-band All-mode Transceiver
        1 Comet Multi-band Mobile Antenna (40M to 2M)
        1 25A Homebrew Power Supply

        Complete for $1900.00 CDN

        For info, contact only:

                Jim Harding  VO1JLH
                [phone]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!world6.bellatlantic.net!IConNet!world4.bellatlantic.net!news
From: Bill Bosler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FS: KAM PLUS
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 14:33:27 -0800
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58amai$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.159.80.14
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win16; U)

Dave wrote:
>
> KAM PLUS for sale in mint condition with cables for FT530 and FT890
> and manuals. Rarely used. Best reasonable offer plus shipping.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Dr. David F. Lemire
> N1RPM
> Livermore Falls, MaineDave: Give me a land line call and I'll get together w
ith you on the KAM
plus.  Bill Bosler - WF3M    [phone] Eve. [phone] Days


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!n2tor.istar!news3.idirect.com!grtfled
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
From: [e-mail] (Ed Luskey)
Subject: FS: Realistic DX-392
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b13
X-Newsmaster: Laszlo Herczeg ([e-mail])
Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Organization: wish I was at a Dead show club
X-Client-Port: 1033
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: zauber.idirect.com
Date: 18 Dec 96 04:09:14 UTC
Lines: 21


For sale:  1 Realistic DX-392

It has:
cassette
FM
FM stereo
LW
MW
Short Wave

comes with:
AC adapter & instruction manual,
still has warranty until 7-25-97
It has been used 3 times, brand spanking new in other words.

Was bought for $300 would like to sell for  $250.00 or best offer.

The only stipulation being that you must live in Toronto or surrounding
areas for hand to hand exchange.
Ed


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.48.96.24!not-for-mail
From: "mttly1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Realistic HTX 100
Date: 11 Dec 1996 14:58:09 GMT
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <01bbe774$1b1368a0$20a84dcf@133mhz>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup32.clinton.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I have for sale a Realistic HTX 100 10mtr mobile  like new $100.00 firm.
will ship at no charge to you



                                                              Curt
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.campus.mci.net!news.telis.org!s02-pm04-ontro-t.telis.org!user
From: [e-mail] (wb6siv)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Tubes and Manuals
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 18:13:00 -0800
Organization: Raymond Sarrio Co.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s02-pm04-ontro-t.telis.org

I have for sale a large quantity of tubes and vintage manuals all listed
on my web site at http://www.sarrio.com. 73's Ray
--
The Raymond Sarrio Co. a full feature Ham Radio Storefront and web site develo
per. Located at http://www.sarrio.com.

In association with Brillar Enterprises http://win-win.com/brillar provider of
 discount CD-Roms!



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:13 1996
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From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 10:06:58 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 7
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FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:14 1996
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From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 20:23:25 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 7
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FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:15 1996
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From: [e-mail] (stop junk e-mail)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 08:40:50
Organization: Symbios Logic
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kthompso.ks.symbios.com
X-Newsreader: Trumpet for Windows [Version 1.0 Rev A]

stop with the ads already...


In article <[e-mail]> John Lee
<awlafn.org> writes:>From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
>Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
>Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 20:23:25 -0800

>FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
>ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

>FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
>FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
>FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
>FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:16 1996
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From: David Anderson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FT-50R Mods
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 14:14:26 -0700
Organization: Nyx.net, free public access to the Internet
Lines: 4
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        What are the mods for this radio??




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:17 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FT-570D
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 06:44:53 -0600
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44266 rec.radio.swap:99410 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120571

I'm thinking about buying this rig, and would appreciate any input from
people who are actually using it...

I work only cw, and enjoy chasing dx when I can hear it...Is the
receiver in this rig any good for weak signal reception?

I understand the DSP is in the audio circuit...what's your opinion of
its performance?

Would you recommend either of the optional cw filters (I do a lot of 40
mtr and 80 mtr work with nearby carriers and noise).

I've read this months QST review, and came away still wondering...

I guess bottom line is:  How do you like this rig?

Any help is appreciated.  Here or E-mail as you prefer.

Thanks.

John


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:18 1996
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From: "Samuel S. Yates" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FT-570D
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 20:58:33 +0000
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 26
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> I'm thinking about buying this rig, and would appreciate any input from
> people who are actually using it...
>
> I work only cw, and enjoy chasing dx when I can hear it...Is the
> receiver in this rig any good for weak signal reception?
>
> I understand the DSP is in the audio circuit...what's your opinion of
> its performance?
>
> Would you recommend either of the optional cw filters (I do a lot of 40
> mtr and 80 mtr work with nearby carriers and noise).
>
> I've read this months QST review, and came away still wondering...
>
> I guess bottom line is:  How do you like this rig?
>
> Any help is appreciated.  Here or E-mail as you prefer.
>
> Thanks.
>
> John

Go out and read the ARRL review in January 1997 QST.  Basically, it was
a very favorable review, with the DSP working quite well.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:20 1996
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From: hershman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FT-570D
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 09:03:05 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 33
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Samuel S. Yates wrote:
>
> [e-mail] wrote:
> >
> > I'm thinking about buying this rig, and would appreciate any input from
> > people who are actually using it...
> >
> > I work only cw, and enjoy chasing dx when I can hear it...Is the
> > receiver in this rig any good for weak signal reception?
> >
> > I understand the DSP is in the audio circuit...what's your opinion of
> > its performance?
> >
> > Would you recommend either of the optional cw filters (I do a lot of 40
> > mtr and 80 mtr work with nearby carriers and noise).
> >
> > I've read this months QST review, and came away still wondering...
> >
> > I guess bottom line is:  How do you like this rig?
> >
> > Any help is appreciated.  Here or E-mail as you prefer.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > John
>
> Go out and read the ARRL review in January 1997 QST.  Basically, it was
> a very favorable review, with the DSP working quite well.
I think the price of the radio will come down. Presently, it is $1575
at HRO. The Kenwood TS-870 dropped in price from $2600 when it was
released, to $2200 present. Kenwood says that the TS-570D is replacing
the TS-450. The Ts-570D should be about the same price $1350. Expect
to see the price drop at least $150.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:20 1996
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From: [e-mail] (ve7gsf)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ft2500m
Date: 12 Dec 1996 23:01:13 GMT
Organization: Cyberstore Systems Inc.
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <58q2rp$[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.93.10

        hi to all !! looking for mods for mt ft2500m. where do i look??
thans for any assistance !!



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Gustav Kⁿhn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Fw: ICOM 706 mods.
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 96 18:55:11 GMT
Organization: Private
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 196-31-64-8.iafrica.com
X-Newsreader: Quarterdeck Message Center [2.00]



----------------------------Forwarded Message--------------------------------

> Hi all fellow Hams and "i can improve the design" ers
> I would like to know if much has been done to improve the pathetic sensitivi
ty
> of
> this rig above 110Mhz (2m is ok). I had a look at the service manual and it
> appears that the so called "yellow wire" mod only results in the 2 m filter
> being
> connected in parallel with the other 60 to 200(ha ha ) Mhz filter.
> I have seen some work done by Gary Coffman and also modelled this filter usi
ng
> Puff and that gave me the same results as Gary's. The mods to this filter he

> suggests also models the same, but I'm not brave enough to start fiddling in
 the
> rig yet.
> Regards,
> Gustav Kⁿhn ZS1NZ




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:24 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Fw: ICOM 706 mods.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 20:26:19 GMT
Lines: 28

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gus
tav Kⁿhn) writes:
>> Hi all fellow Hams and "i can improve the design" ers
>> I would like to know if much has been done to improve the pathetic sensitiv
ity
>> of
>> this rig above 110Mhz (2m is ok). I had a look at the service manual and it

>> appears that the so called "yellow wire" mod only results in the 2 m filter

>> being
>> connected in parallel with the other 60 to 200(ha ha ) Mhz filter.
>> I have seen some work done by Gary Coffman and also modelled this filter us
ing
>> Puff and that gave me the same results as Gary's. The mods to this filter h
e
>> suggests also models the same, but I'm not brave enough to start fiddling i
n the
>> rig yet.

I was. It works about the way the modeling indicates. The filter area
is cramped, the parts SMD, so if you don't have the proper tools and
techniques, acquire the tools and practice on something cheaper first.
(See my posts in homebrew about SMD rework for some tips on technique
and tooling. It needn't be expensive, but you do have to approach the
job a different way than with thru-hole parts on open boards. Once you
learn how, working with SMD is actually easier than working with leaded
parts.)

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:25 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Gary Coughman SUPPORTS HAZING !!!
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 15:59:05 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <59fhd5$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>Now my tower has almost a full section buried. In other words the
>hole is 10 feet deep and has 2 feet of aggregate in the bottom. I
>dug it by hand with a posthole digger. Not with an auger, with a
>real posthole digger. I started the hole with the regular handles,
>and changed to longer handles as the hole got deeper. It took two
>leisurely mornings to finish (too hot to dig in the afternoon).

>Gary
>--
>Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
>Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp addres
ses
>534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
>Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |

Gee, Gary, you just blew your image. We all thought you were Hi Tek.

'Real hams do it on the giga hertz at 56k baud, and real hams dig tower holes
with a post hole digger'.  I don't know, something just doesn't seem to fit.

Personally I think post hole diggers are an obsolete, antiquated way to dig a
hole that should be banned.   Why should today's modern digital hams be
forced to have a post hole digger jambed down their throat just because they
want to have a tower ?  No commercial outfit uses post hole diggers anymore.
They all have gas powered augers, and big trucks with giant drill bits.  Why
should hams be subject to using silly, outdated, antiquated tools for digging
holes when nobody else is using them ?  To suggest a ham dig a tower hole
with a post hole digger is nothing but HAZING ! Just because YOU like having
blisters on YOUR hands doesn't mean ALL of us have to like it.  How about peop
le
with disabilities ?  Do you expect disabled people to spend two days in the ya
rd
with a post hole digger just because YOU did it ? What about people who live i
n
places where the dirt is REALLY HARD ?  Should they be kept out of ham radio
just because of your silly post hole digger hazing ritual ?

I think not.  I think people should be able to just pick up the phone, call on
e
of those guys with the big trucks with the giant drill bits, and let THEM come
over and dig the hole for the tower.   Post hole diggers are keeping a lot of
quality, qualified people out of ham radio, and it's time this hazing ritual
come to an END !!!  I am going to write to the ARRL and WARC 99 and tell them
I
think it's about time to get rid of post hole diggers for ever !!!

73, Jim KH2D








From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:27 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: George Wise, W7MB, SK
Date: 13 Dec 1996 05:55:21 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58qr49$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1569 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120536

Subject:  W7MB, GEORGE WISE  SK

W7MB was an Icon in Amateur Radio.  George's first love was chasing DX.
He sat on top of the Honor Roll for decades.  He achieved the first
5BDXCC and 160M DXCC awards in W7 land.

He was not a serious contester but he could a always be counted on
for a Q. George did all of this from a postage stamp size lot in an older
suburban area of Pdx.

Most importantly though, George was a friend and a mentor to many of
us beginners.  George, you will be missed but never forgotten!!!!!!

73 OT, de W7GG    ex Ai7b
----------

Subject: W7MB
Date: Wednesday, December 11, 1996 12:03 AM

Fellow WVDXers,

As many of you may have heard, our Charter Club Member, and #1 7-land
DXer George Wise, W7MB, became a Silent Key today.  George's wisdom,
enthusiasm and love of ham radio and the Willamette Valley DX Club will be
missed, but will remain a source of strength and inspiration to us all.

A memorial service for George will be held at 2pm, Saturday, December 14
at Kern Park Christian Church
   6828 SE Holgate Blvd
   Portland OR

Please pass the word to the ham community.

73,
Bob W7YAQ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:28 1996
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From: Dave Earnest <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: George Wise, W7MB, SK
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 17:54:07 -0800
Organization: Lost in the Silicon Valley
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58qr49$[e-mail]>
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To: Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1586 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120768

I, too, will always remember George.  What a gentleman!  I can remember
George and El, W7QK, counting out my 103 DX cards when I became a
member of the WVDXC.  I remember George waiting for me at the Portland
Airport at 0200 hours one morning about 1980 or so.  I had handcarried a
3-1000Z all the way from HZ, so he could get that 160 meter amp flying
again.

I know he will be up there working a pileup.  God Speed, George.

73, Dave K7JJ (ex-W7KJJ)

J


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:29 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!slay
From: [e-mail] (Sandy Lynch)
Subject: Re: George Wise, W7MB, SK
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
References: <58qr49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 01:05:57 GMT
Lines: 58
Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1589 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120812

For those who may be interested, here's a little info on the
funeral for George/W7MB held this past Saturday.

---------
Subject:W7MB's funeral - very nice

The funeral was very, very nice and well attended.
About half the people (maybemore) there were Hams
including some fellows who had travelled a few hundred
kilometers to get there.

Stan/W7NI was the "master of ceremonies" and did a great job ... although
it was very difficult job not to become emotional.  Nels/W7EYE read a
poem he had written in George's honor .... also very emotional.
No dry eyes anywhere.

At the front/center of the church, was kind of a table with a large
bouquet of flowers from Helen together with three items:

    1)  A photograph of a very smiling George seated in the red T-bird
        car of Stan/W7NI which was taken at the NW DX Convention last July.
        It is truly a great photo.

    2)  George's original 5BDXCC plaque.

    3)  George's #1 Honor Roll plaque.

To each side of the front/center table were the various flower arrangements.

Much of the ceremony included info about George's Ham career including:
first 160M DXCC from W7; first 5BDXCC from W7; very top of the Honor Roll
with 383 countries ... only two other hams in the world have that many
countries.  All of George's achievements were done from a small city lot
with a modest station.

There were also several slide/photographs of George as a child, young man,
father, grandfather ... and as a ham.  George selected many of the photos
to be shown.  Not surprisingly there were at least 10 photos of the various
yagi antennas that he has had over the years.   One kind of surprising
thing was the music that was played.  George had selected a very old
"jazz" style recording to play ... it was called "CQ Serenade" and was
obviously, about ham radio.  That made most of us smile, and even laugh.

There were probably 70 or 80 hams or so in attendance.  Although I never
really did count. It really was very nice and Helen was obviously very,
very happy that so many of George's friends were able to come and/or to
show their respect for him by sending flowers, letters, phone calls, etc.

Afterwards, there was a very nice "reception" which included lots and lots
of very delicious food prepared by his family. Lots of stories about George
and, of course, not a few stories about DXing in general.  George would
have loved that, you know.


Warmest 73,
Sandy W7BX  (ex-WA6BXH)
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.he.net!news.dra.com!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!sonysjc!sonybc!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Grandpa Lenny and Ball Lightning
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 14:55:31 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58vjcv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <wtshaw-0712961957440001@207.17.188.148> <58fs5j$[e-mail]> <01bbe574$1d2ee440$f50f2399@peter-s> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Graham Seale) wrote:

>In message <01bbe574$1d2ee440$f50f2399@peter-s> "Peter Gottlieb" wrote:

>> Too bad you can't capture it.  A small ball lightning has about 25 kWh of
>> energy.

>I'm impressed! Don't get me wrong, but I have just *got* to ask..
>How do we know? How would such a thing be estimated?

>G4WNT
>--
>Graham

Grandpa Lenny caught one, back during The Big War.  It carterized his hemoroid
s,
but scientists were able to determine the electrical value of the ball lightni
ng
by plugging him into a wall socket and measuring how much current it took to
make his hair stand up the same distance as it did after he caught the ball
lightning.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:31 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Date: 11 Dec 1996 18:07:07 GMT
Organization: I-Link Inc
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58mt8b$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58m1j8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: houston-1-13.i-link.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.09

>>I have a ICOM IC-706 and want to install it on board my 30' sailboat.
>
>>Instead of installing a ground plate, can I run the chassis ground
>from
>>the radio to the YANMAR diesel engine to provide the necessary safety
>of
>>not being shocked?  What are the pros & cons of such an arrangement.

The ground plate you refer to is probably for an RF ground.
the RF ground acts as a counter poise to your antenna, and enables
the antenna to radiate.  There are a few do's and do not's on RF grounding,
but just keep in mind that SHORT wires going to you ground are better.  Some s
ay
that a wire overboard in the salt water helps make a great ground. I think if
you
can build an artificial RF ground on board you would be better off.
A WORD OF CAUTION.  I have heard of people who have developed expensive
electrolisis problems by grounding to the boat keel.  It may be worth getting
some advice from a pro.

Sounds like a great trip good luck.

BTW, I am looking for Modifications to Yeasu 440 Handhelds.  Please let me kno
w
I can find this info.

73 Harry WT5D


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:33 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Date: 12 Dec 1996 06:03:35 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <58o77n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58kopm$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58kopm$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Joe D. Reed)
 writes:
>Anthony Steen <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>I have a ICOM IC-706 and want to install it on board my 30' sailboat.
>>Instead of installing a ground plate, can I run the chassis ground from
>>the radio to the YANMAR diesel engine to provide the necessary safety of
>>not being shocked?  What are the pros & cons of such an arrangement.  My
>>Marine VHF radio is "grounded" through the + & - 12VDC.  So it's
>>confusing when I hear I need to have a separate ground plate.  I
>>currently have a no-code license, studying for my General license in
>>preparation for cruising southern waters.  All responses appreciated.
>>Thanks in advance.
>
>The ideal ground is a ground plate but this is not always practical.
>I have found that grounding to the engine block ground works fine.
>The driveshaft and prop provide a pretty good ground. I have never
>had a problem with this type of ground.
>
>Joe Reed
>

I lived and operated for 5 years on a 42' Tayana cutter-rigged sailboat
while crusing from SoCal to Florida via Mexico, Central America, Panama
Canal, Western Carribean, (more) Mexico, to Florida ...

Make sure you have two solid jumpers around any "drive-saver" coupling
with a rubber shock plate ... also tie the keel, all metal tankage,
engine, etc. and antenna tuner/radio together with LOTS of 4" wide
heavy copper foil tape ...   if you can get a good bond to a metal keel,
you'll get a huge improvement in "grounding" via capacitive couling to
the ocean ...

Good luck cruising ... I've "swallowed the anchor" for a few years to
finish building retirement, then it's buy another boat and sail off into
the sunset again ...

73,
Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:35 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!eanews1!trsvr!news
From: Anthony Steen <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Sender: [e-mail] (cnews news id.)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 17:04:48 GMT
To: [e-mail]
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: ajs1.tr.unisys.com
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Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> [e-mail](-=Tony=-) wrote:
>
> >In <[e-mail]> Anthony Steen <[e-mail]>
> >writes:
> >>
> >>I have a ICOM IC-706 and want to install it on board my 30' sailboat.
>
> >>Instead of installing a ground plate, can I run the chassis ground
> >from
> >>the radio to the YANMAR diesel engine to provide the necessary safety
> >of
> >>not being shocked?  What are the pros & cons of such an arrangement.
> >My
> >>Marine VHF radio is "grounded" through the + & - 12VDC.  So it's
> >>confusing when I hear I need to have a separate ground plate.  I
> >>currently have a no-code license, studying for my General license in
> >>preparation for cruising southern waters.  All responses appreciated.
> >>Thanks in advance.
>
> >    YOU seem to have a FALSE return mailing address!  Nice long private
> >message from a pro wasted!  Gud Luk.
>
> I'll second that. My reply bounced back too.
>
> Jim, KH2DJim,
My E-Mail address is [e-mail].  I read your reply which
was similar to another responder.  It seems that for whatever the reason,
you seem to have received my address as [e-mail],
which is in error.  Sorry about that. I don't know how that happened.
However, thank you for your response.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:36 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Matti A Jokinen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Date: 16 Dec 1996 16:16:48 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <593slg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58kopm$[e-mail]> <58o77n$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

: Make sure you have two solid jumpers around any "drive-saver" coupling
: with a rubber shock plate ... also tie the keel, all metal tankage,
: engine, etc. and antenna tuner/radio together with LOTS of 4" wide
: heavy copper foil tape ...   if you can get a good bond to a metal keel,
: you'll get a huge improvement in "grounding" via capacitive couling to
: the ocean ...

I had made all the couplings mentioned with my IC-735 - SG230 coupler -
Backstay antenna  system, but did not get a qood SWR value on all bands
until I connected the RF ground of the coupler to the nearby rudder
shaft. The expensive ground plate (just thrown overboard to test it) was
not of any help. Did not have any trouble with electrolysis after
wintering in the salty Mediterranian Sea. May be the tropics...
Matti.Jokinen
@Helsinki.Fi



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:37 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Graham Seale)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 00:09:19 GMT
Organization: Southline Electrolab
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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In message <01bbe574$1d2ee440$f50f2399@peter-s> "Peter Gottlieb" wrote:

> Too bad you can't capture it.  A small ball lightning has about 25 kWh of
> energy.

I'm impressed! Don't get me wrong, but I have just *got* to ask..
How do we know? How would such a thing be estimated?

G4WNT
--
Graham


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:38 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 17:06:09 GMT
Lines: 55
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32754 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120803 alt.engineering.electrical:10200

In article <[e-mail]> "William E. Sabin" <sab
[e-mail]> writes:
>Gary Coffman wrote:
>>
>> Connecting your antenna mast directly to the building lightning downleads
>> with #4 was a very good step. This *should* divert the majority of a direct
>> strike's currents into the building lightning mitigation system and frame.
>> Your ground window will protect you from the rest. One caution, however,
>> large currents can flow between this bond point and your station ground
>> window. To avoid damage to coax and control wiring, run a heavy grounding
>> lead between these two points. (Yeah, that'll cause a ground loop, but
>> don't worry about that, the coax shields already did, and the ground
>> window will short out the loop for the equipment on the inside of the
>> window.)
>>
>
>I wonder if, instead of *bonding* the roof top environment to the station
>environment, it would be better to *isolate* the two. If the antenna is
>tied to the building structure using heavy, low inductance straps, then
>if all cables to the radio are loaded with large ferrite beads that
>present a high longitudinal impedance to the impulse, then the protection
>at the equipment location could be less draconian (gas tubes, spark gaps,
>isolation transformers etc.). The idea of introducing a ground loop does
>not fly too well.
>
>Bill W0IYH

The bulk of the energy in a lightning surge is below 2 MHz. While there
are components all the way up into UHF, most of the energy is concentrated
at low frequencies. This makes trying to stop it with ferrite beads more
than slightly problematic. And the problem with coax becomes aggravated
by decoupling the outside of the braid. The inner conductor then becomes
a lower impedance path for the surge than the outer, and the differential
voltage between inner and outer becomes much larger. This is almost certain
to arc the insulation and ruin the coax. It may do more than that.

I'd note that there is a differential mode voltage problem anyway
for a long coax run. The velocity factor *inside* the coax is different
from the velocity factor on the *outside* of the coax, so at certain
lengths large differential voltages can exist. The length of run needed
for maximum differential voltage varies with the dielectric constant
of the insulation. With airline, there is virtually no effect. But with
foam insulation the effect is quite pronounced.

It is a good practice to have a coax suppressor at the tower base
to snub differential mode voltages as much as possible before the
coax heads on over to the entrance bulkhead at the shack. This also
has the added benefit of shorting the single turn transformer formed
by the coax and the tower.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:39 1996
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From: "John H. Alderman III" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:42:14 -0500
Organization: Alderman HVAC/Alderhood/ MI
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <wtshaw-0712961957440001@207.17.188.148> <58fs5j$[e-mail]> <01bbe574$1d2ee440$f50f2399@peter-s> <[e-mail]>
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Question for you guys..
It is related to your traffic which brings back memories of me DX in
from my shack off my room as a boy on all kind of home brew receivers.
Have you ever charged batteries with a crystal Radio?
John Alderman
[e-mail]
http://www.randomc.com/~mountain/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:42 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 16 Dec 1996 18:04:05 GMT
Organization: DigiPhone Corporation, Bryan/College Station Texas 409-693-8885
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <5942ul$[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, "William E. Sabin" <sabinw@crp
l.cedar-rapids.lib.ia.us> writes:
>Gary Coffman wrote:
>>
>> In article <[e-mail]> "William E. Sabin" <
[e-mail]> writes:
>> >
>> >I wonder if, instead of *bonding* the roof top environment to the station
>> >environment, it would be better to *isolate* the two. If the antenna is
>>> tied to the building structure using heavy, low inductance straps,  then
>>> if all cables to the radio are loaded with large ferrite beads that
>>> present a high longitudinal impedance to the impulse, then the  protection
>>> at the equipment location could be less draconian.
>
>
>>
>> The inner conductor then becomes
>> a lower impedance path for the surge than the outer, and the differential
>> voltage between inner and outer becomes much larger.
>
>Ferrite loading on a coax also creates a large *longitudinal* lumped
>impedance for the center lead that is almost identical to that on the
>braid. This basic principle is used in coaxial baluns and is easy to
>demonstrate. The center lead is not "isolated" from longitudinal things
>that are happening on the braid, not even on the "outside" of the braid.
>This longitudinal loading can be effective down to very low frequencies
>with the right kind of ferrite. For lightning protection the ferrites
>would be "bodacious" for sure, but not extremely so.
>
>I understand that PolyPhaser sells coax "absorbers" and I think also
>isolation transformer devices, do they not?
>
>The idea of *bonding* the antenna system to the operating environment and
>creating a ground loop scares the hell out of me. Do we really want to do
>that? Isn't *isolation* a lot better if we can do it?
>
>I don't mean to be merely argumentative, but some of the things I am
>seeing about this lightning protection problem bother me. I have copied
>and read PolyPhaser's web site material, but questions remain.
>
>Bill W0IYH

It bothers Polyphasor folks also, done the wrong way and for the wrong
reasons as I read their material.   When you consider that the ground loop
problem has an average quarter wave length of about 150-175 feet or
so during the heaviest inital phase of the strike, you begin to see why
current and voltage nodes are also in the puzzle!  As I believe what I have
read of their book, that is one reason you do NOT bond coax to the tower
in the down run, unless the run exceeds 150-175 feet in length.

Ground loops take on a completely different view when they are viewed as
part of a 175 foot wavelength mechanism with tens of thousands of amperes
of RF current.   Recall also that the wavelength decreases as the strike
progresses in time.  If part of the circuit is blown away during the initial
hit, what happens then?

Right?


//-----------------------------
Mike - W5WQN
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:43 1996
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From: [e-mail] (W T Shaw)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 18 Dec 1996 06:41:13 GMT
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <wtshaw-1812960149220001@207.17.188.151>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]>
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In article <5942d3$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:
>
> To my view, it isn't just a case of, ahem, strike and mash bondage here.  :)
>
> It's selective torture for the unitiated and unprotected..
>
> More a case of stand and deliver instead of just lay down and be quiet!
>
> The secret, as you rightly say, I think, is still never let-em in the door!
>
If you look at the roof of any hospital and those of many old houses, you
will likely see a forest of groud rods.  These are not to attract
lightening.  In fact they have an opposite effect, they are to discharge
the surrounding air, reduce the build up of static electricity.  About
whether they should be sharp or not on the end, I think it is more  that
it induces people to believe subliminally that that is more likely to
work.

Functionally, a good antenna ground may have a similiar effect.  Often,
lightening does not pick what you would consider the best path, but
selectively seeks out something that might present a bit poorer path.

I once lived in a good place to study such effects and had a series of
antenna structures.  The results, involving lots of toasted coax, include
these, given two choices a grounded beam and an pointy stucture of the
same height, the beam was seldom hit because a greater pocket of
discharged atmosphere tends to steer lightening away from itself.

Even without a cloud in the sky, the static that can build up is often
enough to cause sparks in open connectors where the dielectric is
missing.  Some days, when I forgot to ground all the antennas, I would see
quite a show at the connectors.  The poping was sometimes loud enough to
wake me up at night, and in the dark, if the fireplace had burned low
enough, it was an unforgetable sight.

Bill, k5pcw
--
WTShaw--MacCrypto Programmer--The Following is in FUDGE
Vxdpq qcqva gdocd pokch hx-wd ll/,i ?-wry vegee n/wvm rt/tb bh/nd xdtlv ..mi.
fzngq hj,zf dzvrb uy/xq njdzc ?=uGo me/gg gu??g /?wen --ueo een-g -p,ym ohvfg
njrjb ,=/nl kk?zi ky.-m po,cg omufg koy.m kkmyi po,dg db,lb /,plz nn=mu d.awq


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:44 1996
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From: Jim Hutchings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 09:50:53 -0800
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> >
> If you look at the roof of any hospital and those of many old houses, you
> will likely see a forest of groud rods.  These are not to attract
> lightening.  In fact they have an opposite effect, they are to discharge
> the surrounding air, reduce the build up of static electricity.  About
> whether they should be sharp or not on the end, I think it is more  that
> it induces people to believe subliminally that that is more likely to
> work.
> It seems to me that I remember an old high school physics experiment in
which a sharp point was connected to a source of static electricity (a
Wimshurst machine, I think...likely misspelled).  When a charge was
placed on the sharp point, a noticible current of air was produced as a
result of the electrostatic charge being released from the sharp point.
A company which used to manufacture lightning protection systems took
advantage of this property of sharp points by building an array which
would, when connected to a good ground, reduce the cloud to ground
potential and prevent lightning strokes.   In one installation, a Windsor
radio station measured the static disappation current and fired up
standby power ahead of impending storms thus avoiding the outages
involved with bad weather.  These systems can get pretty elaborate.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!chi-news.cic.net!feeder.chicago.cic.net!news.uiowa.edu!news
From: "William E. Sabin" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 15:58:24 -0800
Organization: none
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]> <wtshaw-1812960149220001@207.17.188.151> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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J. Fred Riley wrote:
>
> As a point of interest, whether it exists or not, we seldom see damage
> at either AM or FM radio stations from direct strikes to towers.  The
> damage is usually caused by strikes in proximity to the power lines
> feeding the station which induce spikes into the power line.  Where
> this has been a problem we can ususally eliminate problems entirely by
> using an isolation transformer that has a good faraday shield between
> the windings.
>
> One more piece of information for which interest may not exist:
> Putting a nice big hunk of ferrite around the feedline won't prevent
> the strike from eating your equipment.  If you look at the energy
> distribution you find a big blob of energy at 5KHz that'll get around
> lightening loops, lightening chokes, etc, etc.  You have to short it
> to ground--or, as in networks built by those who know, you put a
> series pass capacitor in the feedline center conductor path to keep
> that nasty return current off your center conductor.
>

A "coordinated" system that *isolates* the equipment from lightning
damage all across the frequency spectrum must be the right approach. No
one single "fix" is enough. The things that work at low frequency are no
good at the higher frequencies, and vice versa.

Bill W0IYH


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (J. Fred Riley)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 22:41:04 GMT
Organization: INTERNET AMERICA
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]> <wtshaw-1812960149220001@207.17.188.151> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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"William E. Sabin" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>A "coordinated" system  must be the right approach.

Exactly!  But with a limited budget, one must prioritize.  And the
power line is the starting point after one finishes the grounding.



Fred, W8OY

[e-mail]  [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:48 1996
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From: [e-mail] (J. Fred Riley)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 20:41:28 GMT
Organization: INTERNET AMERICA
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]> <wtshaw-1812960149220001@207.17.188.151> <[e-mail]>
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Jim Hutchings <[e-mail]> wrote about:
>A company which used to manufacture lightning protection systems

Contact is Roy Carpenter at:
Lightning Elimination Associates, then
Lightning Elimination Consultants, now

>advantage of this property of sharp points by building an array

Called a dissipation array

>a Windsor radio station

CKLW, installed in 1975

>measured the static disappation current and fired up
>standby power ahead of impending storms
> These systems can get pretty elaborate.
which, unfortunately, detuned the AM towers they're on---

As a point of interest, whether it exists or not, we seldom see damage
at either AM or FM radio stations from direct strikes to towers.  The
damage is usually caused by strikes in proximity to the power lines
feeding the station which induce spikes into the power line.  Where
this has been a problem we can ususally eliminate problems entirely by
using an isolation transformer that has a good faraday shield between
the windings.

One more piece of information for which interest may not exist:
Putting a nice big hunk of ferrite around the feedline won't prevent
the strike from eating your equipment.  If you look at the energy
distribution you find a big blob of energy at 5KHz that'll get around
lightening loops, lightening chokes, etc, etc.  You have to short it
to ground--or, as in networks built by those who know, you put a
series pass capacitor in the feedline center conductor path to keep
that nasty return current off your center conductor.



Fred, W8OY

[e-mail]  [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!chi-news.cic.net!news.uiowa.edu!news
From: "William E. Sabin" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 04:36:34 -0800
Organization: none
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]> <wtshaw-1812960149220001@207.17.188.151> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59g623$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
>
>    Amen, and if you are fortunate enough to live in the country,
>        a seven fold chorus of amen...

Hallelujah, brothers and sisters. Here in eastern Iowa there are some
beautiful hilltop locations that I would like to move to.

Bill W0IYH


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:49 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 21 Dec 1996 08:10:43 GMT
Organization: DigiPhone Corporation, Bryan/College Station Texas 409-693-8885
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59g623$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]> <wtshaw-1812960149220001@207.17.188.151> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33016 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121290 alt.engineering.electrical:10394

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (J. Fred Riley) wri
tes:
>"William E. Sabin" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>A "coordinated" system  must be the right approach.
>
>Exactly!  But with a limited budget, one must prioritize.  And the
>power line is the starting point after one finishes the grounding.
>
>
>
>Fred, W8OY
>
>[e-mail]  [e-mail]

   Amen, and if you are fortunate enough to live in the country,
       a seven fold chorus of amen...

//-----------------------------
Mike - W5WQN
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham band == Radio National Park
Date: 17 Dec 1996 02:06:51 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>Hmmm, a National Park? Can someone direct me to where the climbing is?
>

I experienced climbing last time I was on my roof installing my Butternut vert
ical.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:52 1996
From: [e-mail] (mark morgan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAM EQUIPMENT 4 SALE(sory about the last article)
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 18:55:01 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.76.206.99
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 28
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sorry about the last article of 4 sale stuff i sent. had local
problem.
the list of stuff must go asap.  the prices can be adjusted.  you can
make me an offer but don't insult my ham experience please.
all equipment is in very good or ment condition with documentation.  i
will pay for shipping if you take the listed price.  if you want to
talk about the price then we must talk about the shipping.  payment
will be agreed upon on the phone or email.  thank you.

*icom 751 with filters for cw,rtty,voice.  voice module, direct key
entry, desk mic, internal power supply.             800.00
*kenwood 700sp vhf all mode with mic.           300.00
*midland 2m radio.                                              50.00
*mfj 3kw delux versatuner.                               295.00
*drake L7 amplifer 10-160 2kw                        800.00
*mfj 1270 tnc.                                                   25.00
*kam all mode tnc. up to paktor.                      100.00
*pac-com handi packet.                                   100.00
*cushcraft R5 hf vertical antenna.                      75.00
*diamond 2m base antenna.                               50.00
*cushcraft 2m base antenna.                              50.00
*drake 2m portable radio (neet)                           25.00
*th-6 hf beam antenna.                                      200.00
*ham 4 rotor with controler                                 100.00
********and thats all******************************************
please email me at [e-mail]
serious people may leave me their phone number or ask for mine and ill
give it to you via email.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:53 1996
From: [e-mail] (mark morgan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAM EQUIPMENT 4 SALE(sory about the last article)
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:32:34 GMT
References: <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.76.206.108
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 33
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[e-mail] (mark morgan) wrote:
NO MORE REPLYS IS REQUIRED. THANKS.

>sorry about the last article of 4 sale stuff i sent. had local
>problem.
>the list of stuff must go asap.  the prices can be adjusted.  you can
>make me an offer but don't insult my ham experience please.
>all equipment is in very good or ment condition with documentation.  i
>will pay for shipping if you take the listed price.  if you want to
>talk about the price then we must talk about the shipping.  payment
>will be agreed upon on the phone or email.  thank you.
NO MORE REPLYS IS REQUIRED. THANKS.
>*icom 751 with filters for cw,rtty,voice.  voice module, direct key
>entry, desk mic, internal power supply.             800.00
>*kenwood 700sp vhf all mode with mic.           300.00
>*midland 2m radio.                                              50.00
>*mfj 3kw delux versatuner.                               295.00
>*drake L7 amplifer 10-160 2kw                        800.00
>*mfj 1270 tnc.                                                   25.00
>*kam all mode tnc. up to paktor.                      100.00
>*pac-com handi packet.                                   100.00
>*cushcraft R5 hf vertical antenna.                      75.00
>*diamond 2m base antenna.                               50.00
>*cushcraft 2m base antenna.                              50.00
>*drake 2m portable radio (neet)                           25.00
>*th-6 hf beam antenna.                                      200.00
>*ham 4 rotor with controler                                 100.00
>********and thats all******************************************
>please email me at [e-mail]
>serious people may leave me their phone number or ask for mine and ill
>give it to you via email.
NO MORE REPLYS IS REQUIRED. THANKS.






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!worldnet.att.net!anchor.cis.att.com!cbgw1.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 14:13:23 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: esoterica.pez.bell-labs.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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> 1.  Technician, General and Extra, for Passing
>     only written exams.  Give these people "Phone & Digital"
>     privilages.
>
> 2.  Technician+, General+ and Extra+ for passing
>     Written with CW.  Give these people "Phone, Digital & CW"
>     privillages.

This only makes sense under one condition: IF and ONLY IF there are
separate, *regulated* sub-bands for CW operation.

Otherwise, the licenses are essentially the same, with no particular
reason for anyone to pass a CW exam if they want to use CW. See what I
mean? If you want to use CW, presumably you already *know* CW, so just
go ahead and use it. CW is its own filter - you can't B.S. your way
through it! Either you know it or you don't as far as making contact
with other hams is concerned.

Once again, the above is not bad if passing a code exam gives you access
to additional frequencies in the HF bands. Otherwise, the "+" classes
will cease to be relevant.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:56 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!decwrl!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!cs2.dfrc.nasa.gov!xfedyn28.dfrc.nasa.gov!user
From: [e-mail] (Keith Martin)
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: NASA - Dryden Flight Research Center
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 17:51:20 GMT
Lines: 38

In article <[e-mail]>, "Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ"
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>
> I have an even better Idea (and Don't Laugh!)...
>
> Split ALL licenses in half.  Written and CW.  Have 2 ladders.
>
> 1.  Technician, General and Extra, for Passing
>     only written exams.  Give these people "Phone & Digital"
>     privilages.
>
> 2.  Technician+, General+ and Extra+ for passing
>     Written with CW.  Give these people "Phone, Digital & CW"
>     privillages.
>
> Here is how testing could be without changing much:
>
> CLASS   Elements        PRIVILLAGES
> -----   --------      --------------------------------------------
> Tech.    2 & 3A       (Current Novice + Tech Phone & Digital)
> Gen.    3B & 4A       (All Current Phone, Digital EXCEPT Extra Area)
> Extra   4B            (All Phone & Digital)
>
>
> Tech.+   2 & 3A & 1A  (Current Novice + Tech Phone, Digital & CW)
> Gen.+   3B & 4A & 1B  (All Current Phone, Digital & CW EXCEPT Extra Areas)
> Extra+  4B & 1C       (All Phone & Digital + All CW segments)
>
<snip>

I like this one,  It makes a lot of sense.

Keith Martin - KF6DEE

--
Keith Martin
Flight Controls Engineer, NASA - Dryden FRC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:57 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 23:08:13 GMT
Lines: 37
Sender: [e-mail]

Keith Martin ([e-mail]) wrote:
: In article <[e-mail]>, "Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ"
: <[e-mail]> wrote:

: > Here is how testing could be without changing much:
: >
: > CLASS   Elements        PRIVILLAGES
: > -----   --------      --------------------------------------------
: > Tech.    2 & 3A       (Current Novice + Tech Phone & Digital)
: > Gen.    3B & 4A       (All Current Phone, Digital EXCEPT Extra Area)
: > Extra   4B            (All Phone & Digital)
: >
: >
: > Tech.+   2 & 3A & 1A  (Current Novice + Tech Phone, Digital & CW)
: > Gen.+   3B & 4A & 1B  (All Current Phone, Digital & CW EXCEPT Extra Areas)

: > Extra+  4B & 1C       (All Phone & Digital + All CW segments)
: >
: <snip>

: I like this one,  It makes a lot of sense.

: Keith Martin - KF6DEE

Second the motion.  This proposal has a lot in its favor:

It gives those who could care less about CW, phone privileges consistent
with their ability to pass only written tests.

It also preserves a place for those who still use CW, or would be interested
in doing so.

I like the dual-ladder approach.

This is about the best compromise I've seen so far.  Can't complain about
this one, but I'm sure someone else will be able to.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!gatech!csulb.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 96 01:08:04 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.dircon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <[e-mail]>
           [e-mail] "Keith Martin" writes:

> In article <[e-mail]>, "Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ"
> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >
> > I have an even better Idea (and Don't Laugh!)...
> >
> > Split ALL licenses in half.  Written and CW.  Have 2 ladders.
> >
> > 1.  Technician, General and Extra, for Passing
> >     only written exams.  Give these people "Phone & Digital"
> >     privilages.
> >
> > 2.  Technician+, General+ and Extra+ for passing
> >     Written with CW.  Give these people "Phone, Digital & CW"
> >     privillages.
> >
> > Here is how testing could be without changing much:
> >
> > CLASS   Elements        PRIVILLAGES
> > -----   --------      --------------------------------------------
> > Tech.    2 & 3A       (Current Novice + Tech Phone & Digital)
> > Gen.    3B & 4A       (All Current Phone, Digital EXCEPT Extra Area)
> > Extra   4B            (All Phone & Digital)
> >
> >
> > Tech.+   2 & 3A & 1A  (Current Novice + Tech Phone, Digital & CW)
> > Gen.+   3B & 4A & 1B  (All Current Phone, Digital & CW EXCEPT Extra Areas)

> > Extra+  4B & 1C       (All Phone & Digital + All CW segments)
> >
> <snip>
>
> I like this one,  It makes a lot of sense.

Did I misunderstand it?  It seems to me that it FORBIDS the use of CW
to those without morse code qualifications.  If I'm wrong please
correct me.  But if I'm right, please justify this.

At present Tech's have full access to CW both in the exclusive CW sub-
bands on 6m and 2m, and indeed everywhere else above 30 MHz.  Why now
start to exclude them from this mode?  What's the point?

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:09:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 15 Dec 1996 22:14:35 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <592eqr$[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>,
        Jim Lowman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>This is about the best compromise I've seen so far.  Can't complain about
>this one, but I'm sure someone else will be able to.

Yeah, its just what amateur radio needs... 27 different license
levels to keep track of rather than 5.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:02 1996
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From: "Charles Lemarbre N8LDY" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 16 Dec 1996 04:19:19 GMT
Organization: Alliance Network, Inc. (GRR MI) (616-774-3010)
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <01bbeaf6$6436fbc0$28e96ec6@chuckster>
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Got my vote as well   Chuck  N8LDY  Gen.

Jim Lowman <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> Keith Martin ([e-mail]) wrote:
> : In article <[e-mail]>, "Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ"
> : <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> : > Here is how testing could be without changing much:
> : >
> : > CLASS   Elements        PRIVILLAGES
> : > -----   --------      --------------------------------------------
> : > Tech.    2 & 3A       (Current Novice + Tech Phone & Digital)
> : > Gen.    3B & 4A       (All Current Phone, Digital EXCEPT Extra Area)
> : > Extra   4B            (All Phone & Digital)
> : >
> : >
> : > Tech.+   2 & 3A & 1A  (Current Novice + Tech Phone, Digital & CW)
> : > Gen.+   3B & 4A & 1B  (All Current Phone, Digital & CW EXCEPT Extra
Areas)
> : > Extra+  4B & 1C       (All Phone & Digital + All CW segments)
> : >
> : <snip>
>
> : I like this one,  It makes a lot of sense.
>
> : Keith Martin - KF6DEE
>
> Second the motion.  This proposal has a lot in its favor:
>
> It gives those who could care less about CW, phone privileges consistent
> with their ability to pass only written tests.
>
> It also preserves a place for those who still use CW, or would be
interested
> in doing so.
>
> I like the dual-ladder approach.
>
> This is about the best compromise I've seen so far.  Can't complain about
> this one, but I'm sure someone else will be able to.
>
> 73 de Jim - KF6CR
>


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:03 1996
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From: T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 16 Dec 1996 16:41:36 GMT
Organization: http://www.ccnet.com/~teixeira/
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>>
>> I have an even better Idea (and Don't Laugh!)...
>>
>> Split ALL licenses in half.  Written and CW.  Have 2 ladders.
>>
>> 1.  Technician, General and Extra, for Passing
>>     only written exams.  Give these people "Phone & Digital"
>>     privilages.
>>
>> 2.  Technician+, General+ and Extra+ for passing
>>     Written with CW.  Give these people "Phone, Digital & CW"
>>     privillages.

Keith,

One problem......there are valid reasons that have been discussed for having a
 cw
requirement. So.....I would still say call the license anything you want but
"No CW,  No
HF".

My opinion,
Don W6IQ




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:04 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 16 Dec 1996 23:33:46 GMT
Organization: University of New Brunswick, Fredericton, NB, Canada
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <594m8q$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sol.sun.csd.unb.ca
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Ummm, I think the Canadian way is the way to go (just like healthcare ;)

no code license: bands above 50 Mhz all modes
5 wpm qual+ no code license: for certain bands below 50 Mhz
12 wpm qual+ no code license: for all bands

advanced license: bands above 50 Mhz all modes, priviledge to build transmitte
r, and greater permissible power
                  output
5 wpm qual+ advanced license: for certain bands below 50 Mhz
12 wpm qual+ advanced license: for all bands

everybody seems happy up here ;)

Emile.

-------------------------------------
nick:Imreil
email: [e-mail]
aka :Emile Thimot
-------------------------------------
Be different: conform.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:05 1996
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 07:36:17 -0500
Lines: 52
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T E I X E I R A wrote:
>
> One problem......there are valid reasons that have been discussed for having
 a cw
> requirement. So.....I would still say call the license anything you want but
  "No CW,  No
> HF".
>
> My opinion,
> Don W6IQ

I haven't seen any valid reasons for a cw requirement for HF.  Not
one, except maybe: "I had to do it, so let's make others do it to."

Here are some reasons for not having one:

1.  CW is just about never used for disaster communications, or
indeed any non-recreational communication.  Ships have abandoned
it, the Coast Guard has abandoned it, MARS has actually BANNED CW.
CW is strictly a recreational mode.  It's a quaint skill, but of
no more intrinsic value than smoke signals and other low-tech
communications methods.  Hey, why not require hams to know flag
signals?  After all, some ships still may use those, unlike CW.

Someone posted a pathetic defense of CW by citing the movie
Independence Day.  Yeah, we hams are right in there with the drunken
crop dusters.

2.  The CW requirement is starving our hobby of new HF hams.  The
statistics are out.  The CW requirement is preventing people from
upgrading to General and above.  This causes ham radio companies
like AEA to go out of business for lack of customers.  This same
lack of new blood has and will result in our hobby loosing clout
in Washington.

3.  The quality of the no-code Techs is high.  These people by and
large are FB ops, who add to our hobby.  There is no rational basis
for a CW requirement on HF. I'm an extra class ham, but I freely
admit that I know many no-code Techs who contribute more to the
hobby, via their participation in disaster communications, civic
events, etc., than I do.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:07 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 13:03:08 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> I haven't seen any valid reasons for a cw requirement for HF.  Not
> one, except maybe: "I had to do it, so let's make others do it to."
>

How about  It's an International requirement.  The ITU requires a
proficiency with morse code, granted 5wpm would probably satify the
requirement, but still  it's one reason..in fact, it's the main reason

> Here are some reasons for not having one:
>
> 1.  CW is just about never used for disaster communications, or
> indeed any non-recreational communication.  Ships have abandoned
> it, the Coast Guard has abandoned it, MARS has actually BANNED CW.
> CW is strictly a recreational mode.  It's a quaint skill, but of
> no more intrinsic value than smoke signals and other low-tech
> communications methods.  Hey, why not require hams to know flag
> signals?  After all, some ships still may use those, unlike CW.

Amateur radio is strictly a recreational hobby..so what's the point
you're trying to make??


>
> Someone posted a pathetic defense of CW by citing the movie
> Independence Day.  Yeah, we hams are right in there with the drunken
> crop dusters.

Don't forget the goober in Phenomem (sic) who could translate RTTY in his
head and his equally goofy friend who called CQ (voice) on 30 meters

>
> 2.  The CW requirement is starving our hobby of new HF hams.  The
> statistics are out.  The CW requirement is preventing people from
> upgrading to General and above.  This causes ham radio companies
> like AEA to go out of business for lack of customers.  This same
> lack of new blood has and will result in our hobby loosing clout
> in Washington.

EXCUSE ME????  Can to share where you got this piece of pie??? AEA went
out of business cause they failed to market their products and
themselves, period.  The majority of their equipment was packet.  Since
whne is HF packet that big a deal??  Seems to me that packet systems
spend most of their operational lives on the VHF+ frequencies (home of
the NOCODE TECHS).

>
> 3.  The quality of the no-code Techs is high.  These people by and
> large are FB ops, who add to our hobby.  There is no rational basis
> for a CW requirement on HF. I'm an extra class ham, but I freely
> admit that I know many no-code Techs who contribute more to the
> hobby, via their participation in disaster communications, civic
> events, etc., than I do.

Again, the rational in realtime is that morse code is required by the
ITU.  Besides, most of what you mention above is usually carried on the
VHF+ bands (NOCODE TECH).  And they do a wonderful job, but they are
mainly appliance operators and therefore do not fit into the New World
Order of the ARS as per WA6VSE.
>
> --
> Roger J. Buffington
> W6VZV
>
> USC Law, Class of '97

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:08 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 17:34:42 GMT
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Sender: [e-mail]

[e-mail] wrote:
[political witicism snipped]
: no code license: bands above 50 Mhz all modes
: 5 wpm qual+ no code license: for certain bands below 50 Mhz
: 12 wpm qual+ no code license: for all bands

: advanced license: bands above 50 Mhz all modes, priviledge to build transmit
ter, and greater permissible power
:                   output
: 5 wpm qual+ advanced license: for certain bands below 50 Mhz
: 12 wpm qual+ advanced license: for all bands

: everybody seems happy up here ;)

Prior to the late 60s, we were happy down here, too, with that arrangement.
Just 13 wpm, and an exam roughly the equivalent of today's Advanced Class
exam (my opinion only) bought us all privileges.  It wasn't until the
dreaded Incentive Licensing that things changed.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:10 1996
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From: "B. Hildebrand" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 18 Dec 1996 05:40:42 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
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Name here is mike.  Wx wrm, running big japanese radio with 75 watts into
inv v at 30 ft.  cu l8r 73 sk

Yeah, quality communications
Brent, KH2Z

jim daneke <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> > 3.  The quality of the no-code Techs is high.  These people by and
> > large are FB ops, who add to our hobby.  There is no rational basis
> > for a CW requirement on HF. I'm an extra class ham, but I freely
> > admit that I know many no-code Techs who contribute more to the
> > hobby, via their participation in disaster communications, civic
> > events, etc., than I do.
> >
>
> I agree. The quality of no coders is the highest. When I hear the couple
> spending all the repeater time talking about their kids, their house,
> their relatives and using the autopatch to say they will be home in 5
> minutes, I can't help but think...These are quality hams.
>
> Jim AB0DK
>
> "Wasted a year to get to 20 wpm. Why? Because it was there!"
>


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:11 1996
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From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:10:45 -0700
Organization: Network Service
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> 3.  The quality of the no-code Techs is high.  These people by and
> large are FB ops, who add to our hobby.  There is no rational basis
> for a CW requirement on HF. I'm an extra class ham, but I freely
> admit that I know many no-code Techs who contribute more to the
> hobby, via their participation in disaster communications, civic
> events, etc., than I do.
>

I agree. The quality of no coders is the highest. When I hear the couple
spending all the repeater time talking about their kids, their house,
their relatives and using the autopatch to say they will be home in 5
minutes, I can't help but think...These are quality hams.

Jim AB0DK

"Wasted a year to get to 20 wpm. Why? Because it was there!"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:13 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 09:35:42 -0500
From: "Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ" <[e-mail]>
Organization: T.J. Alessi & Associates, Stamford, Connecticut
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jim daneke wrote:
>
> > >
> > > Keith,
> > >
> > > One problem......there are valid reasons that have been discussed for ha
ving a cw
> > > requirement. So.....I would still say call the license anything you want
 but  "No CW,  No
> > > HF".
> > >
> > > My opinion,
> > > Don W6IQ
> >
> > Mark my words, that will change at the next Conference.
> >
> > Tom - K1TJ
> > (CW forever!)
>
> Wanna bet?!
>
> Jim AB0DK

I hope you are correct!  I just see the Military getting away from it
and the Maritime Service has too, who is next?  Amateur Radio.  I
personally think if you treat it as a privillage and not a penalty,
everyone will be better off.

Tom - K1TJ
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
 T.J. Alessi - K1TJ,  147 Joffre Avenue,  Stamford, CT-USA  06905-2933
 mailto:[e-mail]   powwow:[e-mail]   http://www.Alessi.Com
 Home: 203.363.0319        Work: 203.977.5200        FAX: [phone]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:14 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 18:39:57 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
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I've been thinking for a while about this ham radio licensing scheme we've
concocted in this country and have come to some conclusions and some
opinions that are mine and mine alone.  This is the first of those
thoughts, and I certainly don't think I've got the only key to the ultimate
answer.  Thoughtful comments gratefully acknowledged and encouraged.

Presumption -- that we don't want a total overhaul of the current system,
but a better way of doing what we are doing now.  Keep the current band and
subband divisions that we have today.

Divide the amateur examination universe into four distinct regions:  rules,
phone, cw, and "other".  "Other" can be the total potpourri of amateur
radio -- SSTV, digital, Oscar, RTTY, mobile, and just about any other
catchall subject you wish.

Modify the current structure to eliminate the Technician class.  Keep
Novice, General, Advanced, and Extra (don't worry, you'll hopefully see the
logic later on).  Grandfather today's Technicians into the General class.

The question pool can be very similar to today's pool, and I'll take care
of the "rote memory" problem in Proposal #2, but for now, just follow
along.  There are three question pool areas: rules, phone, and other.

Each question is rated as a certain number of "points".  Easy questions
have a low number of points.  Hard questions have a high number of points.
The point system is set out on a national level, so that the
question-makers do the point assignment.

Passing any one class requires that you take the exam in the three areas,
and you must achieve a certain minimum score in the rules area to pass.
You CAN pass the exam by doing very well in all of the three areas.  You
can also add to your score, if necessary, by taking a CW exam, a certain
number of points for each WPM.

Consider a diehard brass man that could care less about phone.  He rips
along at 25 wpm and totally blows off the phone part of the exam.  He
passes.

Consider the technonerdy that couldn't care less about CW.  He aces the
phone and other part of the exam.  He passes.

There are holes in this idea that I'll try and patch in Proposal #2.  One
of them is how to keep the goofballs and garbage mouths out of the system.

Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:15 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 06:16:22 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
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jim daneke <[e-mail]> wrote:

>> 3.  The quality of the no-code Techs is high.  These people by and
>> large are FB ops, who add to our hobby.  There is no rational basis
>> for a CW requirement on HF. I'm an extra class ham, but I freely
>> admit that I know many no-code Techs who contribute more to the
>> hobby, via their participation in disaster communications, civic
>> events, etc., than I do.
>>

>I agree. The quality of no coders is the highest. When I hear the couple
>spending all the repeater time talking about their kids, their house,
>their relatives and using the autopatch to say they will be home in 5
>minutes, I can't help but think...These are quality hams.

And most of them can be counted on in time of need. Unlike the
ADVANCED CLASS HAMS contesting on 14.325 during a hurricane last year.

Just one of the things I noticed while listening for traffic and
waiting for the ball to drop.
Sure, some Techs are ignorant of proper practice. Mostly because there
is so little mention of practices on the test. Not to mention the fact
that no self respecting ADVANCED CLASS HAM would lowwer theirself to
elmer, much less talk with, a TECHie.
I have met only one or two amateurs with higher grade licenses than
myself who waste their time talking technical or operating practice
topics with us lowwer classes. And that is how we are perceived by the
vast majority of HIGHER CLASS hams.
Me? I am ARES/RACES, President of the local club, active in 2m 70cm
dx, propogation studies, experimentation(on antennas), SKYWARN and a
host of leser activities aimed at improving the image of not only NO
CODE TECHies, but our HIGHER CLASS counter parts who look down on us.
The hobby is for ALL. regardless of class and regardless of how
predjudiced the other guy may be.

KC5WCP
73's
>Jim AB0DK

>"Wasted a year to get to 20 wpm. Why? Because it was there!"




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:16 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 19 Dec 1996 07:31:42 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <59bcje$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59aq8s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59aq8s$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>And most of them can be counted on in time of need. Unlike the
>ADVANCED CLASS HAMS contesting on 14.325 during a hurricane last year.

During a hurricane, hams should stay home. They are not trained in
emergency services. They cause more problems for local emergency service
coordinators than they are worth.

As for those pesky hams on 14.325 contesting during a hurricane, why
shouldn't someone in California use 14.325 when there is a hurricane in
Florida?


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 08:03:11 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59dkt2$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59aq8s$[e-mail]> <59bcje$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp3.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <59aq8s$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>And most of them can be counted on in time of need. Unlike the
>>ADVANCED CLASS HAMS contesting on 14.325 during a hurricane last year.

>During a hurricane, hams should stay home. They are not trained in
>emergency services. They cause more problems for local emergency service
>coordinators than they are worth.

>As for those pesky hams on 14.325 contesting during a hurricane, why
>shouldn't someone in California use 14.325 when there is a hurricane in
>Florida?

I guess that says it all. Anyone else see whats wrong with the above
statement? Or is everyone in here ignorant of their spectrum?
>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:19 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:20:19 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <59e1dr$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59aq8s$[e-mail]> <59bcje$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <59aq8s$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>And most of them can be counted on in time of need. Unlike the
>>ADVANCED CLASS HAMS contesting on 14.325 during a hurricane last year.

>During a hurricane, hams should stay home. They are not trained in
>emergency services. They cause more problems for local emergency service
>coordinators than they are worth.

>As for those pesky hams on 14.325 contesting during a hurricane, why
>shouldn't someone in California use 14.325 when there is a hurricane in
>Florida?

Thing I was wondering about, Mike, is what do they do on 14.325 during a
hurricane ?  If enuff hams get on 14.325 during a hurricane, does the hurrican
e
get scared and go away ?  Or if the traffic count reaches a certain point, doe
s
the windspeed decrease ?  Just wondering, I never saw a hurricane before.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 20 Dec 1996 08:05:12 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <59e2u8$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <59aq8s$[e-mail]> <59bcje$[e-mail]> <59dkt2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59dkt2$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>During a hurricane, hams should stay home. They are not trained in
>>emergency services. They cause more problems for local emergency service
>>coordinators than they are worth.
>
>>As for those pesky hams on 14.325 contesting during a hurricane, why
>>shouldn't someone in California use 14.325 when there is a hurricane in
>>Florida?
>
>I guess that says it all. Anyone else see whats wrong with the above
>statement? Or is everyone in here ignorant of their spectrum?

Ignorant of their spectrum? Hmmm. You must have a different Part 97
than everyone else. Mine sez that 20 meters extends to 14.350. I don't
see anything anywhere about 14.325.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: 20 Dec 1996 12:58:34 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <59ek4a$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <59aq8s$[e-mail]> <59bcje$[e-mail]> <59e1dr$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59e1dr$[e-mail]>,
        Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Thing I was wondering about, Mike, is what do they do on 14.325 during a
>hurricane ?  If enuff hams get on 14.325 during a hurricane, does the hurrica
ne
>get scared and go away ?  Or if the traffic count reaches a certain point, do
es
>the windspeed decrease ?  Just wondering, I never saw a hurricane before.

I've never worked a hurricane on 14.325 before, so maybe it does get
scared and go away. Maybe if enough hams get on 14.325 during a hurricane
(typhoon to you guys in the Pacific Rim) somehow all the electromagnetic
radiation somehow polarizes the Earth's magnetic field and causes the
weather to change hence causing the hurricane (typhoon) to veer away.

Funny I didn't read anything in QST about this. Maybe QEX has an
interesting article.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #2
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 06:01:21 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58qrl3$[e-mail]>
References: <58huge$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rst-engr.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->Gaaaaaaaaaaaah!

Another calm, logical voice of reason is heard from.

Jim



Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:24 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAMCOM CONVERTER PROBLEMS
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:58:27 GMT
Organization: Uniplus Internet Access
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58gdd6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.uddeholm.se
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Hello

Im trying to get my hamcom converter to operate proparly. I have a
Kenwood TS9130 transiver and a 686 pentium computer.
im trying to get my converter to work with the morse function
but my transiver is very high impendance on the cw key input
and when i put in the plug in the transmitter it directly starts to
send.
I have try to couple the collector of the transistor to a 10kohm
resistor and to my radio power but without results

pse need ideas or help

73 de SM4WDQ

pse mailto:[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:25 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 11 Dec 1996 17:38:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58nk5a$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <58ldjh$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.144 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Blake Bowers) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:


>>and we haven't seen them since. We also had a problem with one of our
>>repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>>repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club

>I sure would not be proud of having a spur providing interference from
>one of my repeaters!

As I said in a previous post we didn't know it was there and we fixed
it.

>>members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>>military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>>that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>>ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that
>>this is the same case and the Andrews operator should be fined to the
>>max to show them that the ham bands are not a place to be. The

>Uh, yeah.  The military can come up where they want, when they want,
>how they want.  We just look at it as the sound of freedom.

Sure and who told you that?





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:26 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 11 Dec 1996 17:36:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58nk1i$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58l6im$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.144 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>>:  We also had a problem with one of our
>>: repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>>: repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>>: members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>>: military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>>: that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>>: ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that

>It's really annoying when people attempt to pass opinion as fact. Greg
>is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
>the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
>to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
>often, but it is within their power.

Who told you that? Mickey Mouse? They are too bound by the law to stay
within their bands. The military may not come up on any freq they
desire. Don't know where you got your info from but it is totally
bogus. Imagine the military if they could come up on, let's say, your
TV while the superbowl was on or some other one of your favorite
shows. That is the same thing.

>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

Don't think so. I think you just got lucky that no one reported it.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:27 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 12 Dec 1996 06:23:51 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58o8dn$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> writes
:
>
>At the very least, the various stations monitoring the transmission
>should have sent in letters of protest.

Right ... that's EXACTLY what we need to do ... piss off the military
who have been one of our biggest protectors ansupporters ... I'll bet
you bite the hand that feeds you, too ...


 >
>Pantywaists like you who won't defend their privilege are the real
>reason
>we as a citizenry are losing various rights."Don't do anything to them
>or they might do something back" or you might offend them...

Right ... "real men" ignore the fact that they're outgunned and "kick
ass" anyway .. (right ... and PeeWee Herman is macho, too)

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:28 1996
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From: [e-mail] (D. Holford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 12 Dec 1996 17:15:50 GMT
Organization: IGS - Information Gateway Services
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <58pek6$8k8$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58l6im$[e-mail]> <58nk1i$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.6

In article <58nk1i$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]ô says...
>
>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:
>
>>>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>>>:  We also had a problem with one of our
>>>: repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>>>: repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>>>: members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>>>: military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>>>: that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>>>: ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that
>
>>It's really annoying when people attempt to pass opinion as fact. Greg
>>is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
>>the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
>>to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
>>often, but it is within their power.
>
>Who told you that? Mickey Mouse? They are too bound by the law to stay
>within their bands. The military may not come up on any freq they
>desire. Don't know where you got your info from but it is totally
>bogus. Imagine the military if they could come up on, let's say, your
>TV while the superbowl was on or some other one of your favorite
>shows. That is the same thing.
>
>>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.
>
>Don't think so. I think you just got lucky that no one reported it.
>
>
I don't know about you Greg, but I very seldom operate 20m yet I have heard
USCG stations conducting emergency communications there several times over the

years. Other than the odd paranoid idiot no one seemed to be upset

73
Dave



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!pandora.digitaladvantage.net!news.upo.com!news4.noc.netcom.net!noc.netcom.net!ix.netcom.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 11 Dec 1996 17:33:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <58njru$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.144 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jeff Stillinger) wrote:

>Yes, the military can be stupid.  I should know, I am currently active
>duty Air Force.  The fact still remains that if it was not for the
>military and even military stupid.  There would be no ham bands to talk
>on.

Agreed but they have plenty of room in peacetime to stay within there
bands without stepping on hams toes.

>I also own a repeater on the 440 MHz band.  You want to talk about
>arrogant, who told the hams in the first place they where primary
>service on the 440 band?  Ham radio is a secondary service offered to us
>in a partnership.  In the beginging the military said, we will operate
>radar on the band.  Hams are welcome to use this band, however, they
>work around us.  So what is the problem.  Just work around them.

We did work around the problem but when we found out they were
interfearing with the local and state police then that was different.
They are primary users on their bands unlike us on 440.

>The example of the "spur".  Well sir, spurs are NOT legal.  Your spurs
>better be 40 db down or you deserve to have your operating privilage
>revoked.  Just fix it.  Circulators prevent spurs from getting carried
>away and in California they are required in many cases.

Yes I know and when we found it we fixed it.

>I would strongly agree with you Stan when you talked about writting
>letters.  That is how things get done.  It is very important that people
>these days learn and use communications of all forms.  If military
>personel got carried away and offended anyone, that should be reported.
>If we break the law that should be reported.  With the type of people
>that are entering military service these days, I would be willing to bet
>that person really did not know what they where doing.

Yes I agree with you.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:31 1996
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From: Ed Hare <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 12 Dec 1996 18:58:53 GMT
Organization: American Radio Relay League, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <58pkld$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <58ldjh$[e-mail]> <58nk5a$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
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To: [e-mail]

<Thread history of military interference to hams deleted>

Our news feed missed the first parts of this thread, so I don't know the
frequencies involved.

I must point out, however, that Amateur Radio shares many of the UHF and
higher bands with the military and that our status is secondary in most
(or all) of these cases.

We need to be very careful about trying to kick the military off of "our"
frequencies because they probably have more right to be there than we do.

--

73 from ARRL HQ,
Ed Hare, KA1CV
ARRL Laboratory Supervisor




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:32 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:12:28 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <58qs86$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58njru$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jeff Stillinger) wrote:

>>Yes, the military can be stupid.  I should know, I am currently active
>>duty Air Force.  The fact still remains that if it was not for the
>>military and even military stupid.  There would be no ham bands to talk
>>on.

>Agreed but they have plenty of room in peacetime to stay within there
>bands without stepping on hams toes.
Does that include whne a vessel is in distress, an important person is
up in the air and comms must be established, or just when you say so?
>>I also own a repeater on the 440 MHz band.  You want to talk about
>>arrogant, who told the hams in the first place they where primary
>>service on the 440 band?  Ham radio is a secondary service offered to us
>>in a partnership.  In the beginging the military said, we will operate
>>radar on the band.  Hams are welcome to use this band, however, they
>>work around us.  So what is the problem.  Just work around them.

>We did work around the problem but when we found out they were
>interfearing with the local and state police then that was different.
>They are primary users on their bands unlike us on 440.

>>The example of the "spur".  Well sir, spurs are NOT legal.  Your spurs
>>better be 40 db down or you deserve to have your operating privilage
>>revoked.  Just fix it.  Circulators prevent spurs from getting carried
>>away and in California they are required in many cases.

>Yes I know and when we found it we fixed it.

>>I would strongly agree with you Stan when you talked about writting
>>letters.  That is how things get done.  It is very important that people
>>these days learn and use communications of all forms.  If military
>>personel got carried away and offended anyone, that should be reported.
>>If we break the law that should be reported.  With the type of people
>>that are entering military service these days, I would be willing to bet
>>that person really did not know what they where doing.

>Yes I agree with you.







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:33 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:09:40 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <58qs2u$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>>>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>>>:  We also had a problem with one of our
>>>: repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>>>: repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>>>: members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>>>: military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>>>: that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>>>: ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that

>>It's really annoying when people attempt to pass opinion as fact. Greg
Ok got that?
>>is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
>>the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
>>to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
>>often, but it is within their power.

>Who told you that? Mickey Mouse? They are too bound by the law to stay
Ok who told you otherwise? Care to document the statement.

>within their bands. The military may not come up on any freq they
>desire. Don't know where you got your info from but it is totally
>bogus. Imagine the military if they could come up on, let's say, your
>TV while the superbowl was on or some other one of your favorite
>shows. That is the same thing.
The government can prempt TV programming. The President does it all
the time to address the public. Or did you think they paid for the air
time?
>>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

>Don't think so. I think you just got lucky that no one reported it.
Or someone did and they were ignored.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:35 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:05:04 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <58qrqa$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:


>>Remarkable. By your reasoning, I can fire up anywhere I want. Just like
>>that arrogant Andrews operator.

>>Drivel!

>>The military is often arrogant and will do anything that you can't
>>prevent. I know, spent a fair amount of time in the military (Navy if it
>>matters) and there is no end to the stupid and arrogant things they will
>>do.
Ok got that?
>>At the very least, the various stations monitoring the transmission
>>should have sent in letters of protest.

>>Pantywaists like you who won't defend their privilege are the real
>>reason
>>we as a citizenry are losing various rights."Don't do anything to them
>>or they might do something back" or you might offend them...
>>This nation wouldn't have gotten past 1777 with that attitude.
>>
>>Stan KF0NC
>>"90% of all statistics are made up"

>I agree with you 100%. I am currently in the Army and we had a problem
Ok got that?
>with them using spread spectrum on the 430-440mhz band. We approached
>them with the problem and found out there was nothing we could do
>about it seeing that that part of the band is primarly for military
>and we are secondary users of it. Still it did not stop us. We got the
                                                        ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ok got that?
>local law enforcement to step in as it was also interfearing with
>their communications. Once that happened they turned down their power
>and we haven't seen them since. We also had a problem with one of our
>repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that
>this is the same case and the Andrews operator should be fined to the
>max to show them that the ham bands are not a place to be. The
>military has tons of spectrum so I don't think they should have been
>there in the first place. In time of war that is understandable but
>not in peace time.

Living proof that military personel are arrogant. I agree 100%
>73


Got that?



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:37 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 06:08:41 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58qvhm$[e-mail]>
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Ed Hare <[e-mail]> wrote:

><Thread history of military interference to hams deleted>

>Our news feed missed the first parts of this thread, so I don't know the
>frequencies involved.

>I must point out, however, that Amateur Radio shares many of the UHF and
>higher bands with the military and that our status is secondary in most
>(or all) of these cases.
Happened on HF
>We need to be very careful about trying to kick the military off of "our"
>frequencies because they probably have more right to be there than we do.
Exactly. Why hassle the boys in blue(or green)when they are so darn
helpful and agreeable to our community. All they ask is the
occassional usage of a freq to stay in contact with a vitally
important person or mission.
Heck, I live awfully close to a major AFB and if I even thought for a
second that I was causing interference I would work day and night to
correct the problem. And quite honestly I know for a fact they would
do the same if I were receiving interference.
Problem is, folks who go around with attitude problems attacking their
ops like children make it hard for us adults to find cooperative
people outside the hobby. They just remember the idiot who told off
the USAF like he was smarter than the thousands of proffesional ops in
the military.
Anyway....

73's
>--

>73 from ARRL HQ,
>Ed Hare, KA1CV
>ARRL Laboratory Supervisor






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:38 1996
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From: Tim Miller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 00:30:55 +0000
Organization: Corporate Communications
Lines: 55
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Hello all,

Just my $.02 on the subject.  I was stationed in Guantanamo Bay for 14
years, and have many stories regarding just how arrogant the military
can
be when dealing with amateur radio and frequency management.

During the last sunspot peak, my ham neighbor set up a six meter
station.
His problems began when the local Marine GDF started using 50.100 (FM)
for
comms.  My friend would hear a ham station on 50.110, make a call, and
then
be clobbered by ten GDF stations asking for a comm check when they heard
his SSB signal.

My friend was not a low ranking officer - In fact he was XO of a major
command, and he took his complaint up the chain to Norfolk.  After much
frustration on his part, he managed to get them to QSY from 50.100.  A
week
after he left, the GDF returned to 50.100!

During the second refugee operation, the JTF had literally hundreds of
H/T's on many different frequencies.  One busy net was on 145.550 MHz.
Of
course, there was a major SAREX mission running, not to mention MIR.  A
local ham asked if they would _please_ QSY to a new frequency.  They did
QSY - to 145.000!  I was not too pleased, as I had a local packet net up
on
145.010, but I think that I caused them more QRM then they did to me.

(BTW, I was under the impression that 144-146 was for exclusive Amateur
use
world wide.  Believe it or not, the local military freq coordinators had
never hear of such a rule. . .  And no, I did not argue the point as
they
could have easily pull my license if they had wanted).

My all time favorite incident happened soon after I first arrived on
base.
KG4 licenses are issued locally under authority of the CO.  A few days
after filling out the paperwork, I was issued a large certificate type
license.  It was a "Citizens Band" license, and had "Extra Class"
stamped
in the upper corner.  I don't know?. . .  I may have been the worlds
first
"Extra Class CB'er"?! :-)

Happy holidays to one and all.

73 de Tim

--
Tim Miller WB0RXX  Email: [e-mail]
/* Real Radio Amateurs use Linux 2.0.26 */


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:39 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:10:36 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <58qocf$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>>:  We also had a problem with one of our
>>: repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>>: repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>>: members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>>: military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>>: that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>>: ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that

>It's really annoying when people attempt to pass opinion as fact. Greg
>is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
>the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
>to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
>often, but it is within their power.

>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

>Jeff KH2PZ

The Coast Guard is not DOD it is DOT and has different regs than the
Department of the Army, Department of the Air Force, and Department of
the Navy.  I have spoken to Coast Guard stations on 20 meters before
but they had amateur callsigns; Coast Guard Auxilliary stations.  If
you brought up 10kW transmitters on 20m Jeff, you were more than
likely violating international treaty.  I find that hard to believe
unless you had some type of bonafide emergency operation going.

The military does have their own rules and regulations they have to
abide by.  They have their own frequency assignments and they have
frequency managers  to ensure they do not interfere with or duplicate
other operations. And they do not normally fall under the auspices of
the FCC.  They do not have authorization to spin a dial and land where
ever they might and begin operating there.  It doesn't work that way.
At least not in the Air Force...at least not during the 20 years I was
in Air Force communications.

There ARE some amateur bands that are shared with the military that
the military can use when they want.  Hams are normally secondary
users and have to refrain from interfering with them but none of these
bands are in the HF spectrum to my knowledge.






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:41 1996
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From: Tom Hogerty <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 15:36:34 -0800
Organization: ARRL
Lines: 14
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You can find the rules regarding military use of amateur and other non
government frequencies in the NTIA Manual of Regulations & Procedures
for Federal Radio Frequency Management. The pertinent section is 7.15.3
"Military Communications in non-Government Bands Above 25 MHz for
Tactical and Training Operations".

The contents of the NTIA Red Book can be found on the web at this
address:
http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/redbook/redbook.html

Happy reading.

Tom Hogerty, KC1J
ARRL Regulatory Information


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:44 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Robert E. Garland)
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Sender: [e-mail] (news)
Organization: The KD3BJ Usenet BBS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58l6im$[e-mail]> <58nk1i$[e-mail]> <58qs2u$[e-mail]>
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Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 17:37:54 GMT
Lines: 35

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) writes:

>[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>>>>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>>>is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
>>>the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
>>>to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
>>>often, but it is within their power.

>>>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>>>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>>>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

>>Don't think so. I think you just got lucky that no one reported it.
>Or someone did and they were ignored.

Actually, most instances of USCG stations coming up on amateur
frequencies involve SAR cases.  The international regs kick in here.
Bringing the USCG transmitters up on the amateur bands just for the fun
of it and operating under USCG call signs would be a definite Coast Guard
No-No!






--
     Robert Garland                            NX3S @ N3ACL.PA.USA.NOAM
     Hilltown Township Bucks County               [e-mail]
     Pennsylvania USA                                       Grid FN20ii
                         "Ham Radio is a calling"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:44 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 13 Dec 1996 16:00:04 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58sn5k$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58njru$[e-mail]> <58qs86$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.198 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>Agreed but they have plenty of room in peacetime to stay within there
>>bands without stepping on hams toes.

>Does that include whne a vessel is in distress, an important person is
>up in the air and comms must be established, or just when you say so?

Nope. Read what you just wrote. Vessel in distress. FCC rules say that
in time of life and death you may use any freq at your disposal. What
I have been saying all along is that they may not key up just for the
hell of it on the ham bands.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 23:18:58 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58srtc$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>>Uh, yeah.  The military can come up where they want, when they want,
>>>>how they want.  We just look at it as the sound of freedom.

>>>Sure and who told you that?

>>Who told you otherwise?

>Uh the miltary did. Been in the Army for 12 years now and half of that
>spent as a signal soldier.

>SFC Thompson
>United States Army

According to my ARRL feild rep we share ALL freqs with the US
military. He could be wrong. I'll call Gettysburg Monday to clarify
the question and post their response.

merry x-mas

>Now I ask again. Who told you that?










From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:47 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 23:17:13 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58srq3$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58njru$[e-mail]> <58qs86$[e-mail]> <58sn5k$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>Agreed but they have plenty of room in peacetime to stay within there
>>>bands without stepping on hams toes.

>>Does that include whne a vessel is in distress, an important person is
>>up in the air and comms must be established, or just when you say so?

>Nope. Read what you just wrote. Vessel in distress. FCC rules say that
>in time of life and death you may use any freq at your disposal. What
>I have been saying all along is that they may not key up just for the
>hell of it on the ham bands.

No one said they did this for the hell of it. I never heard the comms,
but we can assume that since there was a SAM mission involved the op
considered the situation important enough to warrant intrusion. Maybe
even for national security. who knows. But why do we have to assume
they were just foolin around and start barking at the op like she
didn't know her ass from her elbow?
The plane could have been in distress, lost, or in need of immediate
comms for national security.The bozos that were getting the way could
have started a war, killed an important military officer, or jammed
seriously need comms for that flight. How do they know the op was just
dicking with them?

Merry X-mas






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:48 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 13 Dec 1996 15:57:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <58smvt$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58l6im$[e-mail]> <58qocf$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.198 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V) wrote:



>>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

>>Jeff KH2PZ

>The Coast Guard is not DOD it is DOT and has different regs than the
>Department of the Army, Department of the Air Force, and Department of
>the Navy.  I have spoken to Coast Guard stations on 20 meters before
>but they had amateur callsigns; Coast Guard Auxilliary stations.  If
>you brought up 10kW transmitters on 20m Jeff, you were more than
>likely violating international treaty.  I find that hard to believe
>unless you had some type of bonafide emergency operation going.

>The military does have their own rules and regulations they have to
>abide by.  They have their own frequency assignments and they have
>frequency managers  to ensure they do not interfere with or duplicate
>other operations. And they do not normally fall under the auspices of
>the FCC.  They do not have authorization to spin a dial and land where
>ever they might and begin operating there.  It doesn't work that way.
>At least not in the Air Force...at least not during the 20 years I was
>in Air Force communications.

>There ARE some amateur bands that are shared with the military that
>the military can use when they want.  Hams are normally secondary
>users and have to refrain from interfering with them but none of these
>bands are in the HF spectrum to my knowledge.

Been trying to tell these guys that the military just can't spin the
dial and decide to start talking there. Has to be almost wartime to do
that. As far as the coast guard on 20 if it was an emergency then I
don't have a problem with that but if they did it just to do it then I
have a problem with that. The military has specific freqs that is uses
and has to abide by them. For instance the 6m band is inside the
military's vhf band radio and I have seen sometimes where we had a
freq or two in there but that is only temporary as you know. As far as
hf radios I worked on many that would cover from 160-10 meters and
never did I see someone transmitting where they felt like it. We had
frequency assignments and stuck to them.

73







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 13 Dec 1996 16:05:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58snet$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <58ldjh$[e-mail]> <58nk5a$[e-mail]> <58qsag$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.198 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>Uh, yeah.  The military can come up where they want, when they want,
>>>how they want.  We just look at it as the sound of freedom.

>>Sure and who told you that?

>Who told you otherwise?

Uh the miltary did. Been in the Army for 12 years now and half of that
spent as a signal soldier.

SFC Thompson
United States Army

Now I ask again. Who told you that?








From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 13 Dec 1996 16:14:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58snvq$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qrfh$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.198 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:


>I sir am not a panty waist. I defend my rights everyday. I get
>disgusted with people, who abuse their privilege, and thus risk all of
>ouur rights. The nation may not get past 2000 with the attitude that
>your privilege is more important than someone else's rights.
>How you determine that I am a panty waist by my statements eludes me.
>Perhaps you could elaborate on my panty waistdom and why you feel that
>way about a person you have never met.
>If I felt that the military was violating my rights I'd be the first
>one to respond with judcious force. In fact it is often the persons
>who holler loudly withh childish words like PANTY WAIST who are the
>first to volunteer for kitchen duty and let the real men fightthe war.
>If you ever care to test your mettle and manhood with me I will be
>glad to accomodate you sir.
>Otherwise try to debate the subject at hand with a semblance of
>intelligence and try using a tad bit of adult restraint.

>>Stan KF0NC
>Who believes that we should thumb our noses at people who are doing a
>serious job protecting our way of life.

Jesus christ man! Do you think that the military owns every damn
frequency? No they do not  and they can only operate where they are
supposed to operate. They cannot operate wherever they feel like.
Maybe you should go into the military and find out for yourself. Jez





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:52 1996
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 16:05:48 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58rn7m$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Tom Hogerty wrote:
>
> You can find the rules regarding military use of amateur and other non
> government frequencies in the NTIA Manual of Regulations & Procedures
> for Federal Radio Frequency Management. The pertinent section is 7.15.3
> "Military Communications in non-Government Bands Above 25 MHz for
> Tactical and Training Operations".
>
> The contents of the NTIA Red Book can be found on the web at this
> address:
> http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/redbook/redbook.html
>
> Happy reading.
>
> Tom Hogerty, KC1J
> ARRL Regulatory Information

Thanks Tom, for the reference, actually 7.15.1-7.15.3 seem to apply to
this thread. I printed it out and read it several times.
I would like to suggest that Eric (KC5WCP) actually read( and
understand)
it although it's unlikely, 'technician and proud of it' indeed! if his
code ability has any relationship to his reading ability, there may be
too many big words.
However, the meaning and the intent of the law are pretty clear for
anyone that is willing to expend the effort.

--
Stan Aughenbaugh II
[e-mail]
Amateur Radio KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 23:24:13 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <58ss77$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58rn7m$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp136.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Tom Hogerty wrote:
>>
>> You can find the rules regarding military use of amateur and other non
>> government frequencies in the NTIA Manual of Regulations & Procedures
>> for Federal Radio Frequency Management. The pertinent section is 7.15.3
>> "Military Communications in non-Government Bands Above 25 MHz for
>> Tactical and Training Operations".
>>
The frequency in question was below 25MHz. Or does 7.15.3 apply below
25MHz as well. The tittle would indicte not.
>> The contents of the NTIA Red Book can be found on the web at this
>> address:
>> http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/redbook/redbook.html
>>
>> Happy reading.
>>
>> Tom Hogerty, KC1J
>> ARRL Regulatory Information

>Thanks Tom, for the reference, actually 7.15.1-7.15.3 seem to apply to
>this thread. I printed it out and read it several times.
>I would like to suggest that Eric (KC5WCP) actually read( and
>understand)
>it although it's unlikely, 'technician and proud of it' indeed! if his
>code ability has any relationship to his reading ability, there may be
>too many big words.
>However, the meaning and the intent of the law are pretty clear for
>anyone that is willing to expend the effort.
>
I generally don't defend myself against childish attacks...BUT...
Being an accomplished author and technical writer means I cannot read.

I shall read the mentioned material and offer my opinion on the
subject, but as I said up note: The tittle would seem to indicate that
the paragraphs do not apply. anyway i will read them.


meryy x-mas



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:55 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Greg Thompson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 14 Dec 1996 10:18:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <58ung9$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58njru$[e-mail]> <58qs86$[e-mail]> <58sn5k$[e-mail]> <58srq3$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @198.68.41.180 (kc7gnm)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>No one said they did this for the hell of it. I never heard the comms,
>but we can assume that since there was a SAM mission involved the op
>considered the situation important enough to warrant intrusion. Maybe
>even for national security. who knows. But why do we have to assume
>they were just foolin around and start barking at the op like she
>didn't know her ass from her elbow?
>The plane could have been in distress, lost, or in need of immediate
>comms for national security.The bozos that were getting the way could
>have started a war, killed an important military officer, or jammed
>seriously need comms for that flight. How do they know the op was just
>dicking with them?

>Merry X-mas

Do you even know what a sam mission is? SAM stands for Surface to Air
Missle. If it was important enough then they would have used their
assigned freqs. National security would not be in the open. It would
have been encrypted. If the plane was in distress then it should have
been on the guard freq not the ham bands. Bet ya didn't know there was
a bunch of freqs set aside for airplanes in emergencies and they don't
reside in the ham bands. Don't think that it could have started a war
or killed anyone or jammed seriously needed comms for flight. Do you
even know how many different radios a military plane has? Guess you
don't. The one I used to fly in had 5 different voice radios and that
is not including the transponder and radar altimeter. When you learn
about how the military operates then you can make assumptions. Until
you do keep your mouth shut.

Merry X-mas







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:56 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 08:44:01 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58tt16$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58rn7m$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp11.datasync.com
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[e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I) wrote:

>It's really quite interesting; a few months ago, there were
>reports of military ops occurring on 6 meters, FM in the middle
>of the weak-signal band during a big opening.

>They were coming from a military exercise in Arkansas; a few
>letters to the C.O. gained a reply that basically said

>"We apologize for any interference we may have caused.  We were
>unaware of potential interference we were causing, and assure
>you that in the future we will do our best to not cause such
>interference."
>--
Well that is called being polite. That still does not prove that the
military does not have the right to use a freq and have precedence
over amateur activity. Darn nice of the unit commander.
>* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
>*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
>** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
>* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:57 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 08:47:47 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58tt87$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58rn7m$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp11.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Tom Hogerty <[e-mail]> wrote:

>You can find the rules regarding military use of amateur and other non
>government frequencies in the NTIA Manual of Regulations & Procedures
>for Federal Radio Frequency Management. The pertinent section is 7.15.3
>"Military Communications in non-Government Bands Above 25 MHz for
>Tactical and Training Operations".

>The contents of the NTIA Red Book can be found on the web at this
>address:
>http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/redbook/redbook.html

Once again, and I am not trying to be argumentative, but the tittle
suggest ABOVE 25MHz. Is that to say 25-1000 or so MHz? Or below 25 MHZ
as in 3.xxxMHz?
If this section deals with the world above 25MHz like in the 2m range,
then this document does not/may not regulate HF usage below 25MHz.
I'll read the document when the 2m opening is over with tomorrow
morning,

KC5WCP
with 6 new grid squares in two hours on 2m USB...do dah do dah



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:10:59 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 15 Dec 1996 06:05:58 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <5904g6$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58l6im$[e-mail]> <58nk1i$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Greg Thompson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:
>>>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:

>>>:  We also had a problem with one of our
>>>: repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>>>: repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>>>: members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>>>: military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>>>: that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>>>: ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that

>>It's really annoying when people attempt to pass opinion as fact. Greg
>>is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
>>the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
>>to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
>>often, but it is within their power.

>Who told you that? Mickey Mouse? They are too bound by the law to stay
>within their bands. The military may not come up on any freq they
>desire. Don't know where you got your info from but it is totally
>bogus.

By posing such a question you advertise to everyone that you're not
a person who knows how to research the answers to important questions.
As a teacher, I should reply "Look it up" but it's apparent you wouldn't
know where to look, so I'll give you a hint as to how to begin your
search: Telecommunication Convention and Final Protocol, Geneva,
Artical 50, Paragraph 290. (Because you're comments are mean, I'll
leave it to you to determine the year of said conference. Heehee!)

>Imagine the military if they could come up on, let's say, your
>TV while the superbowl was on or some other one of your favorite
>shows. That is the same thing.

As I said, they choose to be good spectral neighbors; it would not be
in their best interest to offend other users of the spectrum.

>>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

>Don't think so. I think you just got lucky that no one reported it.

Heehee. To whom? The FCC? Military comms do not fall under control of
of the FCC nor the CFRs. They answer to the DoD.

You seem to believe the amateur bands are sacred and off limits to others.
Try listening to the international broadcasters on 40m in the evenings;
you'll even hear our own Voice of America buried in there.

Watch your blood pressure, Greg,
Jeff KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (D. Holford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 16 Dec 1996 04:09:35 GMT
Organization: IGS - Information Gateway Services
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <592i20$b8b$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58njru$[e-mail]> <58qs86$[e-mail]> <58sn5k$[e-mail]> <58srq3$[e-mail]> <58ung9$[e-mail]>
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In article <58ung9$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]ô says...
>
>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>
>>No one said they did this for the hell of it. I never heard the comms,
>>but we can assume that since there was a SAM mission involved the op
>>considered the situation important enough to warrant intrusion.
>
>Do you even know what a sam mission is? SAM stands for Surface to Air
>Missle.

I imagine I will only be one of many to explain that SAM in this context
stands for Special Air Mission and has *nothing* to do with missiles.


If we could get rid of some of the turkeys for Christmas there would be more
room for the hams.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:01 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: 16 Dec 1996 06:32:50 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <592qei$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58l6im$[e-mail]> <58qocf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Jim Martin, WK1V <[e-mail]> wrote:

>The Coast Guard is not DOD it is DOT and has different regs than the
>Department of the Army, Department of the Air Force, and Department of
>the Navy.

The Coast Guard is one of the armed forces. Day-to-day comms
fall under the DoT, but when ordered by the President, the USCG
becomes a branch of the US Navy (DoD). Thus, CG comm regs must parallel
those of the Navy.

>I have spoken to Coast Guard stations on 20 meters before
>but they had amateur callsigns; Coast Guard Auxilliary stations.  If
>you brought up 10kW transmitters on 20m Jeff, you were more than
>likely violating international treaty.

See, for example, Telecommunication Convention and Final Protocol,
Geneva, Article 47, paragraph 290. The ITU does not want to have
anything to do with regulating member nations' military comms. The
above specifically allows member nations to regulate their own military
comms: "Members ... retain their entire freedom with regard to
military installations of their army, naval, and air forces."

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:02 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:22:01 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <595vjt$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq22$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58l6im$[e-mail]> <58nk1i$[e-mail]> <58qs2u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan9.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wrote:

>>>>Greg Thompson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>>>>:  We also had a problem with one of our
>>>>: repeaters in that it had a spur that was getting into the military
>>>>: repeater that was co-located on the same hilltop. One of the club
>>>>: members that works with the army said don't be suprised if you hear a
>>>>: military person on their saying that we are interfearing. For one if
>>>>: that person is not a licensed ham then he or she should not be on the
>>>>: ham bands and they are violating federal law by doing so. I think that

>>>It's really annoying when people attempt to pass opinion as fact. Greg
>Ok got that?
>>>is a perfect example of this. The military is not bound by the FCC nor
>>>the CFRs. They may come up on *any* freq'y they so desire. They choose
>>>to be good spectral neighbors and not carry out that privilege very
>>>often, but it is within their power.

>>Who told you that? Mickey Mouse? They are too bound by the law to stay
>Ok who told you otherwise? Care to document the statement.

>>within their bands. The military may not come up on any freq they
>>desire. Don't know where you got your info from but it is totally
>>bogus. Imagine the military if they could come up on, let's say, your
>>TV while the superbowl was on or some other one of your favorite
>>shows. That is the same thing.
>The government can prempt TV programming. The President does it all
>the time to address the public. Or did you think they paid for the air
>time?
>>>At Coast Guard Radio Honolulu we brought our 10kW transmitters up on
>>>20m many times in various situations. We were well within our power to
>>>do so. Don't lose sleep over it, Greg.

>>Don't think so. I think you just got lucky that no one reported it.
>Or someone did and they were ignored.

I'll add my personal experience to this also.  As a US Navy
Electronic Tech I saw 40m frequencies used many times
while I was on board the USS Huntington DD-781 from
1966 to Jan 1970.  Frequencies were used as directed by
upper echelon Naval operations.



Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:04 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HAMS tell off military op on HF
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 03:58:50 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <597tqn$[e-mail]>
References: <58bv5s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qrfh$[e-mail]> <58snvq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp28.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Greg Thompson) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:


>>I sir am not a panty waist. I defend my rights everyday. I get
>>disgusted with people, who abuse their privilege, and thus risk all of
>>ouur rights. The nation may not get past 2000 with the attitude that
>>your privilege is more important than someone else's rights.
>>How you determine that I am a panty waist by my statements eludes me.
>>Perhaps you could elaborate on my panty waistdom and why you feel that
>>way about a person you have never met.
>>If I felt that the military was violating my rights I'd be the first
>>one to respond with judcious force. In fact it is often the persons
>>who holler loudly withh childish words like PANTY WAIST who are the
>>first to volunteer for kitchen duty and let the real men fightthe war.
>>If you ever care to test your mettle and manhood with me I will be
>>glad to accomodate you sir.
>>Otherwise try to debate the subject at hand with a semblance of
>>intelligence and try using a tad bit of adult restraint.

>>>Stan KF0NC
>>Who believes that we should thumb our noses at people who are doing a
>>serious job protecting our way of life.

>Jesus christ man! Do you think that the military owns every damn
>frequency? No they do not  and they can only operate where they are
>supposed to operate. They cannot operate wherever they feel like.
>Maybe you should go into the military and find out for yourself. Jez

Apparantly they do.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!qualcomm.com!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: having fun on cw
Date: 12 Dec 96 00:42:49 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Hey I'm having a blast on cw talking all over the world, and it is a kick.
Quit crying and trying to change the rules, spend the time learning
something!! If your to LAZY--please shut up and quit wasting time on the
reflector !! FLAME DIRECT DON'T BUG EVERYONE ELSE !!
73 Alex KR6G


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!usc!newshub.cts.com!nuhou.aloha.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!news.callamer.com!news.west.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: having fun on cw
Date: 12 Dec 1996 04:55:13 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <58o37h$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: term1-20.vta.west.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; PPC)
To: [e-mail]
X-URL: news:[e-mail]

Can it be??  It's hard to believe.  Someone who not only doesn't mind CW
but likes it.

Hmmm...I didn't like it at first, either.

KP




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bconnex.net!news.abs.net!aplcen.apl.jhu.edu!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.mountain.net!usenet
From: ken coleman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: having fun on cw
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 17:47:37 -0500
Organization: MountainNet, Inc. Morgantown WV 800.444.1458
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58o37h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 198.77.21.36
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
To: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>

Kevin Potter wrote:
>
> Can it be??  It's hard to believe.  Someone who not only doesn't mind CW
> but likes it.
>
> Hmmm...I didn't like it at first, either.
>
> KP

Hey I love cw -- very civilized.  I hated learning about bauds and
ASCII and stuff to get a ham radio license.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: having fun on cw
Date: 13 Dec 1996 04:35:11 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <58qmdv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm1-23.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 12  8:35:11 PM PST 1996

In <[e-mail]>
[e-mail] writes:
>
>Hey I'm having a blast on cw talking all over the world, and it is a
kick.
>Quit crying and trying to change the rules, spend the time learning
>something!! If your to LAZY--please shut up and quit wasting time on
the
>reflector !! FLAME DIRECT DON'T BUG EVERYONE ELSE !!
>73 Alex KR6G

I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
since you're a code robot.

                        Jerry



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Dale Harper)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: having fun on cw
Date: 13 Dec 1996 14:22:58 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <58ros2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: clv-oh23-18.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Dec 13  6:22:58 AM PST 1996

In <58qmdv$[e-mail]> [e-mail](Gerald
Schmitt ) writes:
>
>In <[e-mail]>
>[e-mail] writes:
>>
>>Hey I'm having a blast on cw talking all over the world, and it is a
>kick.
>>Quit crying and trying to change the rules, spend the time learning
>>something!! If your to LAZY--please shut up and quit wasting time on
>the
>>reflector !! FLAME DIRECT DON'T BUG EVERYONE ELSE !!
>>73 Alex KR6G
>
>I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
>the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
>since you're a code robot.
>
>                        Jerry
>

...and of course Jerry, you have never once had a spelling error in
your scintillating posts.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: having fun on cw
Date: 14 Dec 1996 16:54:51 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58um4r$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58ros2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm4-11.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14 10:54:51 AM CST 1996

In <58ros2$[e-mail]> [e-mail](Dale Harper)
writes:
>

>
>...and of course Jerry, you have never once had a spelling error in
>your scintillating posts.

I have made many but not being a Code Robot I am held to a much lower
standard. From time to time I get a bit tired of hearing that anyone
who doesn't share an interest and dedication to the great god Morse is
lazy, unmotivated blah blah and my temper gets the best of me. I don't
require others to share my interests and rain contempt on them when
they don't. Why is it that the procode folks must do so. Give that a
bit of thought or just insult me, your choice.

                                    73 Jerry



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: having fun on cw
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 03:53:51 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <59110e$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58ros2$[e-mail]> <58um4r$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-149.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>In <58ros2$[e-mail]> [e-mail](Dale Harper)
>writes:
>>
>>...and of course Jerry, you have never once had a spelling error in
>>your scintillating posts.

>I have made many but not being a Code Robot I am held to a much lower
>standard.

Yes, you have become THE standard for low. See references to squid manure
elsewhere.

>From time to time I get a bit tired of hearing that anyone
>who doesn't share an interest and dedication to the great god Morse is
>lazy, unmotivated blah blah and my temper gets the best of me. I don't
>require others to share my interests and rain contempt on them when
>they don't. Why is it that the procode folks must do so.

End sentences that present a question with a question mark (?) McPoP.
Boy, you are getting around here, McPoP.  TWO threads at the same time
you have starting the spelling wars again. Wow.

>Give that a bit of thought or just insult me, your choice.

>                                    73 Jerry

Come on Gerald.  Bait people when you want to be whipped. Don't beg.
It make you look like such a whimp.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: having fun on cw
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 02:36:14 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <596577$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58ros2$[e-mail]> <58um4r$[e-mail]> <59110e$[e-mail]> <591365$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-1.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>In <59110e$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim
>Kehler) writes:

>Nothing worth reposting.

Gee, that's original Gerald.

>You sure get worked up when I make a little post Jim. What happened did

Not really, McPoP.  You are wishing again.

>it hit a nerve? Don't break a blood vessel we would hate to lose your
>relevant mature thoughtful posts.

From the Human Spelling Checker, Gerald McPoP, who visits us once every
few months for no particular reason, other than to get his whipping, we now
get the definition of relevant, mature, thouoghful posts.

>                        I forgot my nick name so just, Jerry

If you are OK in the callbook, maybe we could take up a collection and buy
you a leather whip.  Then, you could beat yourself and you wouldn't have to
come around here looking for whippings.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.255.144.8!bcs3.bccom.com!news
From: "Richard M. Corrigan" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 11:18:04 +0900
Organization: BenchMark Communications Systems
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max1-069.sunnynet.or.jp
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U)

Just found out that the News Server I currently use will no longer
be accessible.  Can anyone tell me what the Listserver address is
so I could get all these letters via E-Mail?

                Thanks,


                Rich


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:14 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Help
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <01bbea99$167ff100$33f833cf@default>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 11:36:35 GMT
Lines: 29

In article <01bbea99$167ff100$33f833cf@default> "Gayle Hebb" <[e-mail]>
writes:
>Hi! to everyone
>This group sounds like all male.  I'm a little old senior citizen (female)
>who is studying to take the test.
>Do any of you know of a good book on the subject? One that can
>help me with the math part mostly.  Also would like some advise
>on using the air waves correctly, some does and don'ts.  The only
>part of Morse code I know is S.O.S. so guess I have a long way to go.
>Happy Holidays

A good starting point is the book, "Now You're Talking" which is
available from your local Radio Shack. The ARRL has a number of
other publications, operating guides and study guides, as well
as the Handbook and other more advanced resources, which can be
used to take you further than that first book will.

You should, eventually, read them all, but more important right
now is to hook up with some local club which offers classes or
other tutoring. It can be difficult to start from zero with only
books as your study aids. Contact the ARRL (www.arrl.org) for
their "Prospective Amateur Package" which includes pointers to
local groups.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!cbgw2.lucent.com!news.bu.edu!dartvax.dartmouth.edu!usenet
From: Mike McAmis
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help - PC/Rig interfaces
Date: 13 Dec 1996 15:49:14 GMT
Organization: W1ECT
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58rttq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: v2-p-138.valley.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

I'm adding a new feature to my Windows logging/packet system
XMLog.  If you double click on a frequency displayed in the
packet window (e.g. a PacketCluster DX spot) I set the
appropriate mode/frequency for the rig.

I've got it working for my Kenwood 950 but I want to add
support for other radios.  Can anyone give me the commands
and the port setup for other radios?  For example, the 950
wants the serial port set to 4800 baud, 8 data bits, 1 stop
bit, even parity.  Commands to set the radio to 14.350 USB
would be:

FA00014350000;    and
MD2;

I assume (hope) that Kenwood radios other than the 950 use
these same commands.

XMLog is freeware available at http://franklin.ptgi.com

Mike McAmis - W1ECT (ex-WA3ECT)

[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.171.190.20!news.deltanet.com!usenet
From: "Roger A. McCarty" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: help debug  web page pse
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 21:59:22 -0800
Organization: Accurate! Electronics
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: anx-arl0047.deltanet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Still need a couple of folks to help me debug a ham radio web page prior
to making it public.

If you can help, please tell me what your system is and what browser you
are using. I need someone with Netscape and someone with Explorer. In
either case you need to be running a 32 bit os ie win95, win nt, etc.

I appreciate any time you can lend.

Roger KD6CC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.rns.net!maggie.ionsys.com!newspeak.ultratech.net!!news1.bellglobal.com!freenet-news.carleton.ca!cunews!nott!torn!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.171.190.20!news.deltanet.com!usenet
From: "Roger A. McCarty" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: help debug web page
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 08:45:15 -0800
Organization: Accurate! Electronics
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: anx-arl0036.deltanet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

I am looking for a couple of folks to visit my not yet public Ham Radio
web page to report problems.

I find it amazing how many times you can test off-line and find no
problems, yet once on-line the bugs infest the place. (arghhh!)

Anyway, I need at least two people, one with explorer and one with
netscape, who would not mind helping me with this. I need you to be
running win95 or other 32 bit os as there are jave routines on the
pages. I don't need you to check all of the links, just the individual
pages within my site.

If you are willing and able, please drop me a line at;
[e-mail]

THANK YOU very much

Roger KD6CC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wildstar.net!news.localnet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Raymond Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help Locating A Book Re: Blizzard Of '77
Date: 21 Dec 1996 20:38:10 GMT
Organization: LocalNet Corporation
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <59hhri$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.198.83.35
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.2

First, sincere apology for what may be an inappropriate topic. I post
 here out of two reasons. 1. desperation and as some know, many hams
have a sincere interest in weather & climate sometimes and some.
hams are the guys who work at the NWS in places. So, if you can,
bear with me a bit. I think there was a book published about 10 years ago
or so dealing with pictures and personal narratives of individuals who
endured this weather situation. The name of the book escapes me!
I (now retired) was a police officer during the blizzard and have to
say that some of my most memorable
thoughts when looking back on my career are from things during that
situation. I got to do things such as deliver medicine to stormbound
people, answer burglar alarms that required riding over 15 ft. drifts
to get near the site, even get things like milk & bread & eggs for
people who got caught short (there was not much real warning before
this one hit)
Anyhow, If anyone can get the name of this book for me, I would very
much appreciate it.
Thanks and best wishes to all for a great holiday season
Ray Miller N2NJK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!coopnews.coop.net!news.frontier.net!en.com!usenet
From: Donald R Jacobs <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help on Kenwood 450 AT
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 20:58:10 -0800
Organization: Exchange Network Services
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-19.ncweb.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

Can someone tell me the ajustments to peek the power on a Kenwood 450
AT.
You can E-Mail me at [e-mail]. Thank You . Don


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (RClark2004)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HELP re 10 meter from KB5UGX
Date: 20 Dec 1996 02:05:19 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

After having tech + license for several years, finally had time to try HF.
 Expected to be able to hear some activity and make some contacts on 10 M
during the December 14-15 ARRL contest.  Tried about five times at various
times during the two-day contest period and did not hear any activity on
the novice phone (28.350 - 28.400) or the phone (28.550 - 28.650)
frequencies.  No response to CQ's on the novice phone frequencies.  On 20
meter phone frequencies, could pick up lot of conservations.

Radio is a Kenwood TS-450S with auto antenna tuner.  Antenna is a
Cushcraft R5 vertical.

Questions:   Did others participate in or hear activity on 10 M during
this time?  Any suggestions as to why I didn't hear any activity?

Please respond via E-mail.

Thanks.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!151.196.0.36!world2.bellatlantic.net!IConNet!world4.bellatlantic.net!news
From: Bill Bosler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HELP Using Ant Tuner w/Linear
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 10:08:32 -0800
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2071598012.bellatlantic.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win16; U)

Roger D. Placer wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I've been a ham for 15 years but I've never owned an HF amplifier! I
> will be getting one shortly (Ameritron AL-811, 600W), and I have a
> question about my revised antenna tuner needs with the amp in line.
>
> I currently use an external MFJ-949D tuner with my Kenwood TS450S. I
> have been accustomed to outboard tuners for a long time. Here's my
> specific question:
>
> What are the relative merits of:  A) a 3kw external tuner, such as the
> MFJ top-of-the-line model; or  B) installing the optional auto-tuner in
> my TS450S.  My confusion stems from a so-so understanding of the load
> matching situation introduced by an amplifier. The two choices above
> represent two different chains:
>
> A)  Rig --> Amp --> Tuner --> Feedline
> B)  Rig --> Tuner --> Amp --> Feedline
>
> Please offer any thoughts on this matter - I appreciate them all.
>
> 73 DE KG2IV
> Roger
> --
> ==========================================================
> Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
> Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
> FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
> ==========================================================Good morning, Roge
r;  You definitely want option "A". you want the amp to
see as good a match as possible. If you have an amp with tuned inputs you
will not need a tuner between the rig and the amp. I have a Ten-Tec #238
tuner and I can run flat out into it with no trouble at all. It's the
best tuner on the market as far as I'm concerned. Hope this helps.
73 & GL  Bill Bosler - WF3M


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:21 1996
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From: Jim Conn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HELP Using Ant Tuner w/Linear
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 15:41:05 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
Lines: 54
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Bill Bosler wrote:
>
> Roger D. Placer wrote:
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I've been a ham for 15 years but I've never owned an HF amplifier! I
> > will be getting one shortly (Ameritron AL-811, 600W), and I have a
> > question about my revised antenna tuner needs with the amp in line.
> >
> > I currently use an external MFJ-949D tuner with my Kenwood TS450S. I
> > have been accustomed to outboard tuners for a long time. Here's my
> > specific question:
> >
> > What are the relative merits of:  A) a 3kw external tuner, such as the
> > MFJ top-of-the-line model; or  B) installing the optional auto-tuner in
> > my TS450S.  My confusion stems from a so-so understanding of the load
> > matching situation introduced by an amplifier. The two choices above
> > represent two different chains:
> >
> > A)  Rig --> Amp --> Tuner --> Feedline
> > B)  Rig --> Tuner --> Amp --> Feedline
> >
> > Please offer any thoughts on this matter - I appreciate them all.
> >
> > 73 DE KG2IV
> > Roger
> > --
> > ==========================================================
> > Roger D. Placer, KG2IV     Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
> > Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
> > FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
> > ==========================================================Good morning, Ro
ger;  You definitely want option "A". you want the amp to
> see as good a match as possible. If you have an amp with tuned inputs you
> will not need a tuner between the rig and the amp. I have a Ten-Tec #238
> tuner and I can run flat out into it with no trouble at all. It's the
> best tuner on the market as far as I'm concerned. Hope this helps.
> 73 & GL  Bill Bosler - WF3M


Hi Roger,

I'll add my two cents worth; I suggest you get the internal tuner, and
you'll need the hi-power tuner too. You'll like the internal tuner when
you aren't using the amp, which will likely be most of the time. When not
using the amp, you can have the big MFJ tuner switched to "direct". When
the amp is in line, you can use the internal tuner to fine tune into the
amp input. It should reduce IMD and may give you more power out on some
bands, like 17 or 12 meters.

73,
Jim - AD4VL




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:23 1996
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From: Clif <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: HELP Wiring Kenwd remote plug --> amp
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 10:53:04 -0600
Organization: OnRamp Technologies; ISP;  Dallas/Ft Worth/Houston, TX USA
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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To: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120404 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44167

Roger D. Placer wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Thanks for the replies to my query about the tuner/linear amp
> relationship. I have a specific question now:
>
> Can anyone help with a wiring diagram for the Kenwood 9/8/450S Remote
> plug? This gets wired to the twin phono plugs required at the linear's
> ALC and Relay jacks. Unfortunately, the Kenwood manual only shows a neat
> cable running between the two locations, but gives no pin information.
> The Remote plug comes unwired, so I need the details!
>
> Thanks in advance...
>
> 73 de KA2Z  <--- finally!
> --
> ==========================================================
> Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
> Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
> FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
> ==========================================================


Page 21 of the owners manual gives the pin out.

Pin 2 and Pin 4 key the amp, pin 6 is the alc and the shell is ground.

Clif
AVVid is an Authorized Kenwood and Icom Service Center
http:/rampages.onramp.net/~avvid


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:24 1996
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From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: HELP Wiring Kenwd remote plug --> amp
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 09:54:17 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: esoterica.pez.bell-labs.com
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120418 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44177

Hi all,

Thanks for the replies to my query about the tuner/linear amp
relationship. I have a specific question now:

Can anyone help with a wiring diagram for the Kenwood 9/8/450S Remote
plug? This gets wired to the twin phono plugs required at the linear's
ALC and Relay jacks. Unfortunately, the Kenwood manual only shows a neat
cable running between the two locations, but gives no pin information.
The Remote plug comes unwired, so I need the details!

Thanks in advance...

73 de KA2Z  <--- finally!
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:25 1996
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From: Sheldon Darack <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: HELP Wiring Kenwd remote plug --> amp
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 12:51:07 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies, Columbus, Ohio
Lines: 8
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: Clif <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120465 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44218

Be certain you understand the levels before you connect your Kenwood alc
to a linear alc line.  If they are not compatible, you will damage your
transceiver.
WA2UBK


=
> Pin 2 and Pin 4 key the amp, pin 6 is the alc and the shell is ground.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:26 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help!  Phone ops on 7.025 from VE-land!
Date: 11 Dec 1996 15:30:24 GMT
Organization: I need to put my ORGANIZATION here.
Lines: 27
Distribution: usa,na,canada
Message-ID: <58mk2g$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: w3eax.umd.edu

I know that one can often hear SSB on the low end of 40

1) during SSB contests, such as CQ WW, and
2) during natural disasters

WHY were these people camped out today at 1200z from the Canadian
Maritime provinces (Dartmouth, N.S.) running a LSB net on 7.025???

Do they not realize that there's LOTS of bandwidth above 7.050???  Just
because you CAN transmit somewhere does not mean you should - especially
when there's no emergency of any kind afoot.

Anyone want to go and ask them (politely) to move up the band???

I know there's no bandplan in Canada, but my experience has been
that the phone ops generally stay above 7.050 unless completely
squeezed out.

* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *
--
* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:27 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Help!  Phone ops on 7.025 from VE-land!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 00:23:28 GMT
Organization: PacRim Golf Accessories
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58nj69$[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-155.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I) wrote:

>I know that one can often hear SSB on the low end of 40

>1) during SSB contests, such as CQ WW, and
>2) during natural disasters

>WHY were these people camped out today at 1200z from the Canadian
>Maritime provinces (Dartmouth, N.S.) running a LSB net on 7.025???

>Do they not realize that there's LOTS of bandwidth above 7.050???  Just
>because you CAN transmit somewhere does not mean you should - especially
>when there's no emergency of any kind afoot.

Maybe there isn't 'lots' of bandwidth in thier neighborhood. We have the same
problem here with Japanese stations who get down near the bottom of 40 meters,
but it's perfectly understandable because their phone band stops at 7.100 (lik
e
ours in Guam does) and 40 meters is VERY crowded in Japan.  Biggest problem
we have on 40 here in this part of the world is not with hams, it's with
Chinese, Indonesian, and Philippine slims who have made 40 meters part of thie
r
GMRS bands.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:28 1996
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From: "Bill Evans" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Help!  Phone ops on 7.025 from VE-land!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 16:55:22 GMT
Organization: E B Systems Limited
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Fair comment Scott.  I apologize for my fellow Canadian hams who venture
below 7050 KHz.. There is no need to do so.  If I heard a VE below 7050 on
phone, I'd likely say something to him.  The 40m CW band is a precious
resource.
I operate on 40 above 7150KHz about half of the time.

73
Bill VE4UD

Scott Rosenfeld NF3I <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<58mk2g$[e-mail]>...
> I know that one can often hear SSB on the low end of 40
>
> 1) during SSB contests, such as CQ WW, and
> 2) during natural disasters
>
> WHY were these people camped out today at 1200z from the Canadian
> Maritime provinces (Dartmouth, N.S.) running a LSB net on 7.025???
>
> Do they not realize that there's LOTS of bandwidth above 7.050???  Just
> because you CAN transmit somewhere does not mean you should - especially
> when there's no emergency of any kind afoot.
>
> Anyone want to go and ask them (politely) to move up the band???
>
> I know there's no bandplan in Canada, but my experience has been
> that the phone ops generally stay above 7.050 unless completely
> squeezed out.
>



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:29 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Help!!!!!
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 03:02:11 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <598r3v$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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"Richard M. Corrigan" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I just moved to a High Rise Apartment building and have very little
>area to set up in.  I have my computer about 5' away from my Kenwood
>R1000.  Cant run both at the same time because the computer just about
>blanks out the receiver.  What can I do?  I have grounded both the
>radio and computer. Seems to have narrowed down the interferance to the
>computers power supply and fans I think.  When I put my radio out in the
>kitchen about 30' away still get the interferance.  Any Ideas?  I would
>really like to run both at the same time since I just ordered a TNC.

>          THanks

>             Rich

Rich, usually computer noise in the radio isn't caused by the computer
being too close to the radio, it's radiated noise from the computer that
gets into the radio thru the antenna.  If you are using an inside antenna,
that could be the problem. If it's outside, try moving it as far away from
the shack as you can.  Just disconnect the antenna from the radio and
you should see your computer noise go away.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:29 1996
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From: "Richard M. Corrigan" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help!!!!!
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 21:45:14 +0900
Organization: BenchMark Communications Systems
Lines: 13
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I just moved to a High Rise Apartment building and have very little
area to set up in.  I have my computer about 5' away from my Kenwood
R1000.  Cant run both at the same time because the computer just about
blanks out the receiver.  What can I do?  I have grounded both the
radio and computer. Seems to have narrowed down the interferance to the
computers power supply and fans I think.  When I put my radio out in the
kitchen about 30' away still get the interferance.  Any Ideas?  I would
really like to run both at the same time since I just ordered a TNC.

          THanks

             Rich



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:31 1996
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Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 13:31:16 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: hf antenna setup advice?
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
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Lines: 69

Hello! I'm wondering if anyone can give me some advice on a
station
I'm planning on setting up in my townhouse next month. I don't
want to
cause all sorts of TVI and RFI problems with my neighbors, but as
an
old HF junkie who's been out of it for about 5 years, I can't say
no
to my favorite hobby anymore! Here goes:

I'm going to be purchasing a Kenwood TS-570D and using it with an
Astron RS-20A power supply in my shack in an upstairs bedroom.
I'll be
wrapping the power lead around a few chokes as it comes out of the
back of the 570. My ground wire will run about 25 feet (quite
long, I
know ...) down to a rod in the back yard. I am going to attempt
operation on as many bands as possible (with the 570's built-in
tuner) on an 80-meter dipole fed with about 75 feet of RG-8X. Due
to
the layout of my townhouse complex, I'll have to limit the
antenna's
height to a REAL LOW 15 to 20 feet or so above ground. The antenna
will run basically parallel to the back of a line of 10
townhouses,
at a distance of about 25 feet or so. I plan to form a choke in
the
coax where it meets the antenna's center insulator, to minimize
feedline radiation.

Our townhouse complex somehow (unbelievably) left rules against
outside antennas out of their lease, so I'm not breaking any
rules.
However, I don't want to start any new ones! So I'm planning on
making this installation as invisible as possible. The antenna
will
be hidden in trees, and the coax run from the townhouse to the
trees
will only be laid out when I'm operating. I am very concerned
about
the possibility of TVI and RFI, and I want to do everything
possible
UP FRONT to limit it. The complex has underground electric, phone
and
CATV lines, but the cable coax for all the units in my row enters
at
the far end and runs through all our attics, parallel to and about
30
feet from my planned antenna.

I think I've included all the facts. Please critique my
arrangement
and let me know if there is anything I should do to modify it.
Please
keep in mind that I plan to use the tuner in the rig with a
coaxial
feedline. And I would rather not run QRP all the time, although I
can
make myself happy with less than 100 watts. Whaddaya think?

Thanks in advance and happy holidays,

Meade Daffron KA4RQB
Richmond, Virginia

e-mail: [e-mail]

-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:32 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HF BANDS ARE ALL UNUSABLE (EXCEPT 20 Meters)
Date: 14 Dec 1996 02:23:47 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58t33j$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qiaq$[e-mail]> <58ru3t$[e-mail]>
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In <58ru3t$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writ
es:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>>Steve ... one last time on this issue ... the 80/40/15/10m Novice
>>segments that a tech+ can use are the worst trash of all of the ham
>>bands ... that spectrum is largely unusable much of the time ... and
>>when it is usable, most of it is CW-only for techs ...
>
>80, 40, 15, and 10 meters are 'unusable much of the time' ?

You left out the "novice segments" part ... that's an important
qualifier ... those segments *are* trash much of the time ...

>Doesn't matter if we put you in the CW
>band or the phone band, you still can't play with your SS box on the ham band
s
>anywhere...... Wait a minute, now that I think about it, 80, 40, and 15 meter
s
>WOULD be unusable for you, you can't copy code and don't have a phone license
,
>is that what you meant ?

Jim, Jim, Jim ... you just never can get your facts straight ... I *can*
copy code ... I passed the test long ago ... but I don't *LIKE* code and
have no interest in operating code, which is all I'm allowed in
virtually all of the extremely limited HF spectrum I'm allowed to
access, so in that sense it *IS* unuseable ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:34 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HF BANDS ARE ALL UNUSABLE (EXCEPT 20 Meters)
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:33:47 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58ru3t$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qiaq$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] wrote:

>Steve ... one last time on this issue ... the 80/40/15/10m Novice
>segments that a tech+ can use are the worst trash of all of the ham
>bands ... that spectrum is largely unusable much of the time ... and
>when it is usable, most of it is CW-only for techs ...

80, 40, 15, and 10 meters are 'unusable much of the time' ?  Jeez, Squiggie,
you sure could have fooled me.  Why don't you try hooking an ANTENNA (long
piece of wire) to your radio once in a while.  But as I said B4, keep grasping
for those reasons to get on 20 meters, you never know, you might come up
with a good one sooner or later ....... Doesn't matter if we put you in the CW

band or the phone band, you still can't play with your SS box on the ham bands
anywhere...... Wait a minute, now that I think about it, 80, 40, and 15 meters

WOULD be unusable for you, you can't copy code and don't have a phone license,
is that what you meant ?

>I respond here not in hopes of reaching Steve ... only to clarify his
>distortions, garbage, and slander for other readers ...

Me too, either.

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!homer.alpha.net!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HF BANDS ARE ALL UNUSABLE (EXCEPT 20 Meters)
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 23:30:35 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58t33j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga16-06.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14  5:31:55 PM CST 1996
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On 14 Dec 1996 13:43:36 GMT, [e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Carl you our so full of Shit it isnt Funny. Why dont you just come clean
>and tell the truth about wanting on HF without CW, we all know you have no
>more interest in new Technology Design then I do. All you really want to
>do is Pickup Mic and start working DX. And Carl these Crazy Post of yours
>our not going to get you on HF any Faster, try learning CW or Bring your
>Points up to the FCC maybe they can help, or Better yet if you have all
>these New Techno things that you want to unleash on us. Maybe the FCC will
>grant you some Special HF Frequencies for your Testing purposes, good luck
>all above Points.

Carl doesn't want to work HF as it is today. Carl wants to lead the
way with spread spectrum testing on HF. He doesn't need the stupid
rules and regulations concerning modeling work and simulations being
run before actual testing is implemented. Is that what high-tech
engineering is?

de n4jvp
Fritz
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:36 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: HF BANDS ARE ALL UNUSABLE (EXCEPT 20 Meters)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <58t33j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597gvu$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 13:23:25 GMT
Lines: 36

In article <597gvu$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Carl R. Stevenson) writes:
>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (A.G. von Luter
now) writes:
>>
>>Carl doesn't want to work HF as it is today. Carl wants to lead the
>>way with spread spectrum testing on HF. He doesn't need the stupid
>>rules and regulations concerning modeling work and simulations being
>>run before actual testing is implemented. Is that what high-tech
>>engineering is?
>
>What the hell are you talking about, Fritz???
>
>Yes, there are some technical rules that are totally outdated and stupid
>in today's world ...  but what "rules and regulations concerning
>modeling work and simulations being run before actual testing is
>implemented" are you talking about?  I have NEVER seen anything in Part
>97 requiring any such thing ... but, while it is reasonable to do some
>modeling and simulation before going on the air, it is impractical to
>require a ham to build and maintain a hardware/software channel
>simulator capable of "full-fidelity" modeling of the HF channel and its
>impairments ...

Some hams are trying, see the TAPR HF-SIG.

Having a realistic channel simulator is very useful. It allows
repeated testing against the exact same conditions. But channel
simulators have limitations, and don't accurately duplicate all
real world conditions. You still need to be able to test live on
the air.

Gary

--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HF BANDS ARE ALL UNUSABLE (EXCEPT 20 Meters)
Date: 21 Dec 1996 03:25:26 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59flb6$[e-mail]>
References: <58t33j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597gvu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-16.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman
) writes:
>
>Having a realistic channel simulator is very useful. It allows
>repeated testing against the exact same conditions. But channel
>simulators have limitations, and don't accurately duplicate all
>real world conditions. You still need to be able to test live on
>the air.
>
>Gary
>
I agree 100000% that having a realistic channel simulator is very useful
.. I've built them in the course of employment and can attest to that
usefulness from first hand experience ...

What I said was that I can't justify the time, effort, and (mostly) the
_expense_ of building one just for my ham projects at home.

If you know of a group that would like to fund the construction of a
simulator for my home project use, please put them in touch with me ASAP
so that I can graciously accept their generous offer ... <grin>

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.zeitgeist.net!wizard.pn.com!news.gte.com!news-in.tiac.net!posterchild!n1btq
From: [e-mail] (Tim Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: HF/VHF Net Directory?
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 96 18:14:00 GMT
Organization: From the home front
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <58n0l3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: n1btq.tiac.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120336 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44099

Are there any net listings on the internet for www or ftp access?

Thanks,

Tim N1BTQ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!homer.alpha.net!pacifier!gatech!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!math.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!news-2.csn.net!usenet
From: "Stan Huntting" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: How to send umlauts with AEA Log Windows?
Date: 19 Dec 1996 01:28:32 GMT
Organization: SRHuntting. Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <01bbed4c$01972280$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.133.96.3
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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I'm posting this for Mark, W0BG (ex-WK0V), who has no access to this
newsgroup. The reply-To address is Mark's.

Mark has an AEA PK-232 and uses AEA Log Windows in Windows 95. Mark has
installed the ability to change keyboards in Windows 95 and has immediate
access to umlauts and other accented characters, but they don't seem to
work with his Log Windows/PK-232.

The umlaut will appear on his Log Windows screen, but is always translated
to some other character before it reaches its destination - even when he
just sends a test message to himself. Messages from his packet radio
correspondents in Europe with special characters come through and are
displayed in Log Windows without a hitch.

In the absence of any tech support from AEA I am posting this appeal for
help for Mark here. Can you shed any light on what is happening here and/or
how to send the umlauts?

Thanks es vy 73,

Stan
----------------------------------------------
Stan Huntting,    KF0IA
Email:            [e-mail]
Fax:              303 444 2314
KaWin home page:  http://www.mutadv.com/kawin/
Postal address:   4655 Pleasant Ridge Rd.,
                  Boulder, CO 80301-1731, USA



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:42 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!in1.nntp.cais.net!NEWS1!not-for-mail
From: Bob Lewis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: How to send umlauts with AEA Log Windows?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 07:28:23 -0500
References: <01bbed4c$01972280$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: AA4PB
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: [e-mail]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20759 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121080

Stan Huntting wrote:
>
> I'm posting this for Mark, W0BG (ex-WK0V), who has no access to this
> newsgroup. The reply-To address is Mark's.
>
> Mark has an AEA PK-232 and uses AEA Log Windows in Windows 95. Mark has
> installed the ability to change keyboards in Windows 95 and has immediate
> access to umlauts and other accented characters, but they don't seem to
> work with his Log Windows/PK-232.
>
> The umlaut will appear on his Log Windows screen, but is always translated
> to some other character before it reaches its destination - even when he
> just sends a test message to himself. Messages from his packet radio
> correspondents in Europe with special characters come through and are
> displayed in Log Windows without a hitch.
>
> In the absence of any tech support from AEA I am posting this appeal for
> help for Mark here. Can you shed any light on what is happening here and/or
> how to send the umlauts?
>
> Thanks es vy 73,
>
> Stan
> ----------------------------------------------
> Stan Huntting,    KF0IA
> Email:            [e-mail]
> Fax:              303 444 2314
> KaWin home page:  http://www.mutadv.com/kawin/
> Postal address:   4655 Pleasant Ridge Rd.,
>                   Boulder, CO 80301-1731, USA

I don't know how AEA implements umlauts, but you might try turning off
huffman compression since the umlauts (in IBM) are above ascii 127. Also
make sure your serial interface is 8-bit.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:44 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: How Would You Set Up A Cheap Station?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Keywords: equipment, hf, vhf, cheap
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <58aou3$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 01:16:38 GMT
Lines: 50
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <58aou3$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>People tell me that it takes a small fortune to get started in our hobby.
>I'm looking for solid ways to rebut this.

The most solid way is to do it :-)

>How would you build a cheap station?  I'll take suggestions on anything:
>transceivers, power supplies, amplifiers, receivers, transmitters, antennas,
>ground system, antenna supports, station layout, homebrew, whatever.

First, get an Elmer. They can help with things that cost money.

There are 5-band HF transceivers which work fine for around $100. Things
like HW-101's, SB100's and 101's, TR3 and TR4s... For a few more dollars
there is a TS520, or FT101.

I'm fond of the HW8 for which I paid $20.00.

Old HT's run $100 or thereabouts. Or you can get new for $199 on sale
at Radio Shack this month. Nothing wrong with the HTX-boxes. And very
much right!

Wire antennas are cheap; there is a trade-off between the cost of a
transmatch (need a good ground) for an end-fed wire to a tree and
coax and three 10' sections of TV mast for a dipole. The latter is
probably more satisfactory in most ways. In fact, I'd do the
latter, and put up inverted vees for 80, 40, 30, 20, (15 shares the
40) and 10. All fed by the same RG58.

Home-brew is nice, but it winds up costing more per watt than an
older transceiver. We're assuming a beginner, here, and 'air time'
is really useful to a beginner.

I like the TenTec and MFJ kits a lot, though.

A few MFJ accessories (like a DSP unit and ESPECIALLY an SWR
Analyzer if it is a system with a transmatch) complete the
picture.

For the no-code tech, guy that 30' of mast and crown it with
a J-pole, or one of those multi-J-pole arrangements. An old
TV-rotor will turn a VHF/UHF beam.

There is no reason why someone shouldn't be on the air on either
HF or VHF or UHF for between $200 and $500.

I've done it, several times over. Most hams actually have, whether
on vacation or camping or just playing with old gear.

Greg


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!netcom.net.uk!news
From: Geoff Brown <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,uk.radio.amateur
Subject: IC756
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 18:22:33 -0800
Organization: NETCOM Internet Ltd.
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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The initial "feel" of the New IC756 is good TX/RX audio is gud with nice
reports being rxd.
You cannot monitor dual watch out of band, it has to be the same band.
DSP is nice with the NR cct, and TX audio can be tailored.
another great seller?.....quite so!
de Geoff GJ4ICD


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!194.159.102.1!news.fido.net!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,uk.radio.amateur
Subject: Re: IC756
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 96 20:22:10 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120816 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44446 uk.radio.amateur:23607

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] "Geoff Brown" writes:

> The initial "feel" of the New IC756 is good TX/RX audio is gud with nice
> reports being rxd.
> You cannot monitor dual watch out of band, it has to be the same band.
> DSP is nice with the NR cct, and TX audio can be tailored.
> another great seller?.....quite so!

Is this a production release at last or just the prototype that was
floating around the UK about 6 weeks ago?

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:46 1996
Newsgroups: ba.market.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-feed.inet.tele.dk!cph-1.news.DK.net!dkuug!dknet!news.winet.dk!not-for-mail
From: "Ron Curry" <[e-mail]>
Subject: IC900/901 modules/radio wanted esp 1.2ghz
Message-ID: <01bbe9f7$865daaa0$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 19:50:57 GMT
Organization: Insight Technology
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Lines: 9
Xref: news1.epix.net ba.market.misc:86211 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44401 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120760 rec.radio.swap:99694

I need some modules for these radios especially 1.2ghz but am willing to
buy whole radio if necessary. Please reply via emal.

Thanks,
--
Ron Curry
KE6WED
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: P J <"[e-mail]"@postoffice.worldnet.att.net>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Icom - IC725 Modifications
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 21:00:25 -0500
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <58np0c$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe7cd$7a9c5bc0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.65.16
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E (Win95; U)

Leith Marshall wrote:
>
> I am a keen boater and have heard that the IC-725 rig can be made to Tx out
> of Ham Bands.  If this could be done, it would save me the trouble of
> having to by a Marine HF SSB Rig specifically for Marine use.
>
> Any ideas greatly accepted.  Please e-mail [e-mail]
>
> regards
> Leith Marshall
> ZL2UCHtry     ftp://ftp.qrz.com/mods/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!spool.mu.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!comp.vuw.ac.nz!news.hn.netlink.co.nz!manawatu.planet.co.nz!manawatu.gen.nz!news
From: "Leith Marshall" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Icom - IC725 Modifications
Date: 12 Dec 1996 01:40:36 GMT
Organization: ComputerLand Central
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <01bbe7cd$7a9c5bc0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 22.clandcen.co.nz
Mime-Version: 1.0
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I am a keen boater and have heard that the IC-725 rig can be made to Tx out
of Ham Bands.  If this could be done, it would save me the trouble of
having to by a Marine HF SSB Rig specifically for Marine use.

Any ideas greatly accepted.  Please e-mail [e-mail]

regards
Leith Marshall
ZL2UCH


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Icom - IC725 Modifications
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 05:19:44 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58p8t8$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe7cd$7a9c5bc0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-159.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Leith Marshall" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I am a keen boater and have heard that the IC-725 rig can be made to Tx out
>of Ham Bands.  If this could be done, it would save me the trouble of
>having to by a Marine HF SSB Rig specifically for Marine use.

>Any ideas greatly accepted.  Please e-mail [e-mail]

>regards
>Leith Marshall
>ZL2UCH

On the main board, cut diode D16, D21, and D22.  Remove resistors R11, and
R23.  Have a nice float on your boat.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!142.77.1.4!news.uunet.ca!news
From: [e-mail] (Bernard Scott Hale)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ICOM CI-V Software
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 04:31:30 GMT
Organization: UUNET Canada News Transport
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s12.pmaster2.nsis.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

I'm looking for software to support my IC-761's CI-V port. Tried an
old program by N5MHZ but it appears to be buggy. Doesn't appear to be
anything available on the 'net but I may be looking in wrong places.
Thanks ...Scott  VE1AFN .>


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Edgar Brown N6OU" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM CI-V Software
Date: 14 Dec 1996 17:07:55 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <01bbe9e1$43260860$35731fcc@ed-s-confuser>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: whx-ca1-21.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14 11:07:55 AM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



Bernard Scott Hale <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> I'm looking for software to support my IC-761's CI-V port. Tried an
> old program by N5MHZ but it appears to be buggy. Doesn't appear to be
> anything available on the 'net but I may be looking in wrong places.
> Thanks ...Scott  VE1AFN .>
>
CT Contest Software by K!EA supports the IC-761


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!wizard.pn.com!news.gte.com!news-in.tiac.net!posterchild!n1btq
From: [e-mail] (Tim Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 96 18:42:13 GMT
Organization: From the home front
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <58uvdg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58ubp6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: n1btq.tiac.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Greg Bullough) wrote:
>In article <58ubp6$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Tim Smith)
writes:
>>Great!  The only downside is that you can only install 1 filter...CW or SSB,

>>not both.  The mounting bracket ($25) is not a speed bracket, rather a
>>conventional "U" bracket and hex nuts.  The universal brackets at Radio
Shack
>>for $6 is almost as good and perhaps a little more versatile.
>>
>>As far as the rig's performance...I love it.  I traded off a Drake C line,
>>Icom R71 receiver and a Yaesu FT620 six meter rig for the one I have.
>
>Now wonder Tim loves it... ...for the first time in years,
>he can actually SIT in his car!

HOW TRUE, HOW TRUE!  Alot of rig in a little box!

73,

Tim N1BTQ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:52 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]> <58ubp6$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:33:25 GMT
Lines: 14
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <58ubp6$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Tim Smith) write
s:
>Great!  The only downside is that you can only install 1 filter...CW or SSB,
>not both.  The mounting bracket ($25) is not a speed bracket, rather a
>conventional "U" bracket and hex nuts.  The universal brackets at Radio Shack

>for $6 is almost as good and perhaps a little more versatile.
>
>As far as the rig's performance...I love it.  I traded off a Drake C line,
>Icom R71 receiver and a Yaesu FT620 six meter rig for the one I have.

Now wonder Tim loves it... ...for the first time in years,
he can actually SIT in his car!

Greg



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ICOM IC-706
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 05:56:22 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pool040.max2.canoga-park.ca.us.dynip.earthlink.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230


I would like any input on the ICOM IC-706 for a base low band rig. I
realize for such a wide coverage radio, I cannot expect superior
results..So how acceptable is it?  Thanks... AC6QQ

[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:54 1996
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From: hershman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 18:56:17 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Gary Coffman wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
> >
> >I would like any input on the ICOM IC-706 for a base low band rig. I
> >realize for such a wide coverage radio, I cannot expect superior
> >results..So how acceptable is it?  Thanks... AC6QQ
>
> I've owned one for quite a while. It's a great little radio,
> I use it mobile and portable, but it hasn't displaced my regular
> home station rig. The thing that makes it so attractive is its
> size. That makes it excellent for mobile and portable use, and
> you learn to adapt to its deficiencies accordingly.
>
> Now my home station rig is a IC-735, and an early one of those
> at that. So I'm not comparing the IC-706 to one of the new
> wonder rigs (mostly I wonder who'd pay that much). My main
> complaint with the IC-706 for use at home is receiver overloading.
> It happens a lot with a good antenna. The IC-735 doesn't have
> the problem. Otherwise the little radio is acceptable for most
> of what I do. And when used mobile or portable with the typical
> inefficient antenna, the overloading isn't much of a bother
> either. I'm keeping it.
>
> Gary
> --
> Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
> Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp addre
sses
> 534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
> Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |
Also the Icom 706 has lost its 2 meter "AM MODE" for some reason.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:55 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:11:34 GMT
Lines: 28

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>I would like any input on the ICOM IC-706 for a base low band rig. I
>realize for such a wide coverage radio, I cannot expect superior
>results..So how acceptable is it?  Thanks... AC6QQ

I've owned one for quite a while. It's a great little radio,
I use it mobile and portable, but it hasn't displaced my regular
home station rig. The thing that makes it so attractive is its
size. That makes it excellent for mobile and portable use, and
you learn to adapt to its deficiencies accordingly.

Now my home station rig is a IC-735, and an early one of those
at that. So I'm not comparing the IC-706 to one of the new
wonder rigs (mostly I wonder who'd pay that much). My main
complaint with the IC-706 for use at home is receiver overloading.
It happens a lot with a good antenna. The IC-735 doesn't have
the problem. Otherwise the little radio is acceptable for most
of what I do. And when used mobile or portable with the typical
inefficient antenna, the overloading isn't much of a bother
either. I'm keeping it.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newspump.sol.net!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.0.65.182!news-in.tiac.net!posterchild!n1btq
From: [e-mail] (Tim Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 96 04:04:13 GMT
Organization: From the home front
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <592kmq$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: n1btq.tiac.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4

In article <[e-mail]>,        |
>Also the Icom 706 has lost its 2 meter "AM MODE" for some reason.

Not here...mine appears to work on AM fine...

73,

Tim N1BTQ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:57 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Fiber)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 04:21:39 GMT
Organization: Chambers Multimedia Connection
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <59ag2e$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm2-24.edmonds.cmc.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

hershman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Gary Coffman wrote:
>>
>> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>> >
>> >I would like any input on the ICOM IC-706 for a base low band rig. I
>> >realize for such a wide coverage radio, I cannot expect superior
>> >results..So how acceptable is it?  Thanks... AC6QQ
>>
>> I've owned one for quite a while. It's a great little radio,
>> I use it mobile and portable, but it hasn't displaced my regular
>> home station rig. The thing that makes it so attractive is its
>> size. That makes it excellent for mobile and portable use, and
>> you learn to adapt to its deficiencies accordingly.
>>
>> Now my home station rig is a IC-735, and an early one of those
>> at that. So I'm not comparing the IC-706 to one of the new
>> wonder rigs (mostly I wonder who'd pay that much). My main
>> complaint with the IC-706 for use at home is receiver overloading.
>> It happens a lot with a good antenna. The IC-735 doesn't have
>> the problem. Otherwise the little radio is acceptable for most
>> of what I do. And when used mobile or portable with the typical
>> inefficient antenna, the overloading isn't much of a bother
>> either. I'm keeping it.
>>
>> Gary
>> --
>> Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problem
s
>> Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp addr
esses
>> 534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
g
>> Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |
>Also the Icom 706 has lost its 2 meter "AM MODE" for some reason.


No Gary its still there, just an advertising mistake.

gary



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.94.215.18!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.cmc.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Gary Fiber)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 13:34:36 GMT
Organization: Chambers Multimedia Connection
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <59e4ri$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ag2e$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm2-1.edmonds.cmc.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Fiber) wrote:

>hershman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Gary Coffman wrote:
>>>
>>> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>> >
>>> >I would like any input on the ICOM IC-706 for a base low band rig. I
>>> >realize for such a wide coverage radio, I cannot expect superior
>>> >results..So how acceptable is it?  Thanks... AC6QQ
>>>
>>> I've owned one for quite a while. It's a great little radio,
>>> I use it mobile and portable, but it hasn't displaced my regular
>>> home station rig. The thing that makes it so attractive is its
>>> size. That makes it excellent for mobile and portable use, and
>>> you learn to adapt to its deficiencies accordingly.
>>>
>>> Now my home station rig is a IC-735, and an early one of those
>>> at that. So I'm not comparing the IC-706 to one of the new
>>> wonder rigs (mostly I wonder who'd pay that much). My main
>>> complaint with the IC-706 for use at home is receiver overloading.
>>> It happens a lot with a good antenna. The IC-735 doesn't have
>>> the problem. Otherwise the little radio is acceptable for most
>>> of what I do. And when used mobile or portable with the typical
>>> inefficient antenna, the overloading isn't much of a bother
>>> either. I'm keeping it.
>>>
>>> Gary
>>> --
>>> Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider proble
ms
>>> Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp add
resses
>>> 534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to ke4zv@radio.o
rg
>>> Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |
>>Also the Icom 706 has lost its 2 meter "AM MODE" for some reason.


>No Gary its still there, just an advertising mistake.
Boy I blew this,  Sorry Gary I did not relaize the above statement about the
706 loosing 2 meters was a tagged on comment to your post.

Gary





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:11:59 1996
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From: hershman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM IC-706
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 16:15:47 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ag2e$[e-mail]> <59e4ri$[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)
To: [e-mail]

Gary Fiber wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Gary Fiber) wrote:
>
> >hershman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >>Gary Coffman wrote:
> >>>
> >>> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] write
s:
> >>> >
> >>> >I would like any input on the ICOM IC-706 for a base low band rig. I
> >>> >realize for such a wide coverage radio, I cannot expect superior
> >>> >results..So how acceptable is it?  Thanks... AC6QQ
> >>>
> >>> I've owned one for quite a while. It's a great little radio,
> >>> I use it mobile and portable, but it hasn't displaced my regular
> >>> home station rig. The thing that makes it so attractive is its
> >>> size. That makes it excellent for mobile and portable use, and
> >>> you learn to adapt to its deficiencies accordingly.
> >>>
> >>> Now my home station rig is a IC-735, and an early one of those
> >>> at that. So I'm not comparing the IC-706 to one of the new
> >>> wonder rigs (mostly I wonder who'd pay that much). My main
> >>> complaint with the IC-706 for use at home is receiver overloading.
> >>> It happens a lot with a good antenna. The IC-735 doesn't have
> >>> the problem. Otherwise the little radio is acceptable for most
> >>> of what I do. And when used mobile or portable with the typical
> >>> inefficient antenna, the overloading isn't much of a bother
> >>> either. I'm keeping it.
> >>>
> >>> Gary
> >>> --
> >>> Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider prob
lems
> >>> Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp a
ddresses
> >>> 534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to ke4zv@radio
.org
> >>> Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |
> >>Also the Icom 706 has lost its 2 meter "AM MODE" for some reason.
>
> >No Gary its still there, just an advertising mistake.
> Boy I blew this,  Sorry Gary I did not relaize the above statement about the
> 706 loosing 2 meters was a tagged on comment to your post.
>
> Gary
GARY < SINCE YOU WORK FOR ICOM USA I WOULD APPRECIATE ANY COMMENTS ON
THE NEW IC-710 HF/MARINE RADIO.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 14:22:38 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Independence Day (was Re: CW is not outdated)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]>
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X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 45

In article <589lhv$[e-mail]>,
  T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> Those who think code is outdated just don't know what they are talking about
.
Most have
> never used code and those who did  only used it to get their license.
>
> There is a movie out called Independence Day. Yes it's sci-fi fiction but in
the movie there
> is a national disaster and the only communication that worked was CW.  When
all else fails
> you can use wire and a battery for a CW transmitter.

Well, Morse Code was just one of several things important to the ID4
plot.  Several other things were important to saving Earth, such as:

* A captured alien space ship from Roswell.

* A fighter pilot that learns how to fly a captured alien space ship
in about 30 seconds.

* A completely drunken crop-duster pilot that figures out how to fly
an F/A-18 in 30 seconds and operate the sophisticated weapon systems, too.

* A cable TV technician that cracks the communications and computer
technology of the aliens and writes a bug-free virus, all in a few hours.

* It was amusing that the gate sentries at Area 51 would let anyone in
that just happened to have an alien in their pickup truck, particularly
with a hundred RVs full of rednecks in tow.


In other words, Independence Day was a fictional movie.  It was made up.
It has as much to do with Morse code as Star Trek: Generations has to do
with the current space shuttle.

I don't think it makes a good statement to cite a ridiculously contrived
fictional movie as an example of the utility of Morse code.

Dana  K6JQ
[e-mail]


-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Independence Day (was Re: CW is not outdated)
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 06:07:42 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5955o0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <589lhv$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:


>Well, Morse Code was just one of several things important to the ID4
>plot.  Several other things were important to saving Earth, such as:

>* A captured alien space ship from Roswell.

>* A fighter pilot that learns how to fly a captured alien space ship
>in about 30 seconds.

>* A completely drunken crop-duster pilot that figures out how to fly
>an F/A-18 in 30 seconds and operate the sophisticated weapon systems, too.

>* A cable TV technician that cracks the communications and computer
>technology of the aliens and writes a bug-free virus, all in a few hours.

>* It was amusing that the gate sentries at Area 51 would let anyone in
>that just happened to have an alien in their pickup truck, particularly
>with a hundred RVs full of rednecks in tow.


Maybe we should require all of the above for Extra!




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:03 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Paul Milawski)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.tech,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info on zener diode HZ-22-2l ?
Followup-To: rec.audio.tech,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 11 Dec 1996 21:49:04 GMT
Organization: Hamilton-Wentworth FreeNet, Ontario, Canada.
Lines: 21
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.audio.tech:44123 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120348

R.J.M. Soulier ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Hello all,

: I got a burned out zener diode in an audio-amplifier. After placing some
: telephone calls I found out the type: a HZ-22-2L, japanese making.
: I want to replace it with a type that allows higher currents, but
: I need to know the zenering voltage. Has anyone info on this diode?
: Detail: it is diode number D-112 in a Luxman L-230 amplifier.
: Thanks in advance.
: -- Rob

    That Zener is a 1/2 watt, 22 volt diode. The equivalent replacement
sold by Philips ECG is  ECG5030A.  They also sell 1W-ECG5080A,
5W-ECG5136A, 10W-ECG5197A, and a 50W-ECG5263A.  You can also use
Zeners of different voltages in series as long as their total voltage
equals 22V.

    Good luck...

    Paul, VE3CSY



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:04 1996
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From: "R.J.M. Soulier" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.audio.tech,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Info on zener diode HZ-22-2l ?
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 15:18:02 -0800
Organization: Strictly Private
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.audio.tech:44129 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120364

Hello all,

I got a burned out zener diode in an audio-amplifier. After placing some
telephone calls I found out the type: a HZ-22-2L, japanese making.
I want to replace it with a type that allows higher currents, but
I need to know the zenering voltage. Has anyone info on this diode?
Detail: it is diode number D-112 in a Luxman L-230 amplifier.
Thanks in advance.
-- Rob
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Rob Soulier               | Way of life:
[e-mail]| Science did a lot to make our life more
miserable,
[e-mail]                 | so that we may live longer. While failing to
realize
tel. [phone]  | the latter, they quite succeeded doing the
first.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!netcom.net.uk!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Joseph E. Fealkovich)
Newsgroups: rec.audio.tech,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info on zener diode HZ-22-2l ?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:22:32 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <58obro$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: clv-oh14-25.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 11 11:22:32 PM PST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.audio.tech:44140 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120424

In <[e-mail]> "R.J.M. Soulier"
<[e-mail]> writes:
>
>Hello all,
>
>I got a burned out zener diode in an audio-amplifier. After placing
some
>telephone calls I found out the type: a HZ-22-2L, japanese making.
>I want to replace it with a type that allows higher currents, but
>I need to know the zenering voltage. Has anyone info on this diode?
>Detail: it is diode number D-112 in a Luxman L-230 amplifier.
>Thanks in advance.
>-- Rob
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
--------
>Rob Soulier               | Way of life:
>[e-mail]| Science did a lot to make our life more
>miserable,
>[e-mail]                 | so that we may live longer. While failing
to
>realize
>tel. [phone]  | the latter, they quite succeeded doing the

>first.

Hi Rob, your zener diode crosses to an ECG5030A, it is a 22 volt 1/2
watt zener diode. Hope this helps!:)

Joe at [e-mail]

P.S. You don't have to use the original number of your diode or the ECG
number, any 22 volt 1/2 watt diode will do. You can even use higher
than a half watt diode, as long as the voltage is the same.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:06 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info-Hams Digest V96 #1540
Date: 21 Dec 96 03:33:54 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Peter Laws asked how Skywarn could perform county-wide comms on HF if
all of V/UHF was lost to auction:

Peter, local mobile comms have been performed on HF since the 30s.
If you don't mind the antennas on your bumper, 160 and 80m both
work fine for local groundwave comms; and you don't need to depend
on someone else's radio (i.e., a repeater) to work the other fellow(s).
Very efficient county- and state-wide civil defense nets were in operation
on HF for many many decades.

Please, study some of the history of amateur radio; you'll surely be
fascinated by what has transpired in its 80-year duration.

73 from Nevada,
Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:07 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info-Hams Digest V96 #1544
Date: 21 Dec 96 18:54:02 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

I'm reduced to reading the newsgroup via an email digest for a few weeks
so replies to all your thoughtful comments will be a bit awkward; one
receives a 20kb email with all articles attached. You have to page down
many many times to get past the loooong articles that you'd normally
skip (Dave Horsfall: Why not send your bulletins to rec.radio.info?).

It pains me to do this but I must thank Brian Kantor @ UCSD for setting
up this digest for us folks without full internet access.

Now, to James Kelley who says a 1928 amateur radio station only has
4-5 components, I suggest you scurry off to your closest university
library and peruse the radio books collection. By '28, there were
fairly sophisticated circuits folks were building; they contained
as many components as the designer wished to include. By '28, radio-
telephone (AM phone) was in use (and broadcast stations were transmitting
to an ever growing audience). I've never seen any AM transmitter-receiver
with 4-5 components from any era!

Re: 3894.5 kHz Nut Control - I received several unwelcome and unsolicited
emails from that kook so I had not way of knowing "... it was a joke."
But a followup mentioned "CW is supposed to be a lid filter."  No, I've
never made such a claim; in fact, that we've even got lids on HF who've
passed the code exams just shows anyone with normal capacities can learn
code.

Re: NTIA's recommendation of awarding 900kHz to HF hams:
Someone's followup falsely claimed that as little as 40 years ago
2m was thought of as useless. Oh, you couldn't be more wrong! Just
pick up the 1956 or 57 ARRL Handbooks and look all the VHF circuits.
Or glance through issues of QST covering that era. There was a wealth
of 6 and 2m work being done. And of course, Art Gentry (W6MEP, SK) had
just erected the K6MYK 2m AM repeater atop Mount Lee in the Hollywood
Hills. My 1950 ARRL Handbook shows *commercially made* transmitters and
receivers for 6 and 2m being advertised. Besides the 6 and 2m circuits
in that edition, there is even circuits for 220 MHz. That's 47 years
ago.

And to Gary, yes, Continental Morse is International Morse; I did mean
Landline (or American) Morse. (That's actually the first mistake I've
ever made!)

73 from snow-covered Lake Tahoe,
Jeff KH2PZ / 7

P.S. I promise never again to give a winter Hawaii WX report in order
to tease you folks - this is miserable.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:08 1996
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From: "T.M. Seymour" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Information Please
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 22:27:55 -0800
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port185.iwaynet.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; U)

I am interested in obtaining my ham license.  Is there anyone who is
willing to answer a few questions I have?  If so please e-mail me.

Thanks,

Tom


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:09 1996
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From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Information Please
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 08:59:26 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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To: "T.M. Seymour" <[e-mail]>

T.M. Seymour wrote:
>
> I am interested in obtaining my ham license.  Is there anyone who is
> willing to answer a few questions I have?  If so please e-mail me.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tom

Sure! I'll try and answer whatever HAM related questions you have...

Jim..


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:10 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Information Please
Date: 14 Dec 1996 03:26:04 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <58t6oc$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vbook.accessone.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>I am interested in obtaining my ham license.  Is there anyone who is
>willing to answer a few questions I have?  If so please e-mail me.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Tom

Start by visiting http://www.hamradio-online.com and reading our "Start Here -

Welcome to Ham Radio" section and follow the links on that page to lots of
introductory information. We also have well over 100 feature stories in our
library and lots of other resources available on our web site.

------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:11 1996
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From: Lambda Technologies <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Intermod and my IC-2000 ?
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 07:28:42 -0500
Organization: Lambda Technologies
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe6e7$636ad440$27816ace@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp12.ntwrks.com
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The Paquette's wrote:
>
> Hi all,
> Was wondering if there was anyone out there that could help me?  I have
> a Icom IC-2000 ser # : 17156,  I purchased it about a year ago for packet.
> I haven't used it for packet because of intermod.  So, I decided to use
> it as a base rig.  I wasn't on 2 Mtr voice often till recently and now
> find the intermod is extremely tiring to listen to and I feel it
> may be a design flaw.  (I'm told that the earlier models of the 2000 had
> this problem.)
>   The way it's connected is, through a Diamond duplexer to a Diamond 510. I
> originally used a Kenwood with this same configuration and had NO intermod!
> This Intermod forced me to use the kenwood for packet.  Now if I remove the
> 2000 and replace it with the kenwood, I get no intermod.
> (Ya ya ya!  put the kenwood back,  well all fine and good, but now the
>  problem is with my packet station which I use often.)
>
>  One might be asking, how close are you to a commercial xmitter?  Well as
> the crow flies, approx. 1 to 1 1/2  miles.
>
> Well, thanks in advance for any assistance,
> Dave ( KA1JWM )

Dave:  One common (read VERY INCREDIBLY COMMON) mistake is that any junk
you hear on your receiver which you cannot explain must be intermod.
Well, it isn't.  In my article in Mobile Radio Technology in 1995, I
explain the differences between receiver overload, images, and
intermodulation.  You my friend, probably have an image problem.  No,
don't run out and hire a publicist; just look at some of the frequencies
being used nearby and start writing them down.  1 1/2 miles is frankly
too far away to have any real intermodulation problems.  I have designed
transmitter sites with 12+ high power transmitters/repeaters within
close proximity of each other on the same tower, and THEN you really
have to use some skill and thought before turning things on.  Antenna
distances, operating frequencies, and power output all are contributors
to intermod.  By separating two 50 Watt base stations with gain antennas
by only 50 vertical feet I was able to end a problem which had plagued
the user terribly for years.  They claimed they were being interfered
with by outside users when in fact they were interfering with
themselves.  1 1/2 miles is a little too far then unless the
transmitters are honking out 1 KW or more...

Now, image rejection in a little IC-2000 might be a bigger problem.
Image creation occurs when you have a strong signal which presents an
image, often mathmatically offset by the receiver's IF frequency.  I
believe your widebanded ICOM uses a 21.4 MHz IF.  Therefore, if you were
listening on say 147.00 and someone nearby was transmitting on 168.40,
you probably will hear them or at least a signal artifact.  One problem
here in the Raleigh area involved folks using the 146.64 repeater, and
everryone with lousy Bearcat scanners with 21.4 MHz IFs were getting
trashed by low flying planes calling into the approach tower at RDU at
an offset of 21.45 MHz below the repeater's transmitter frequency.  The
FM demodulators in the scanners had a hard time with an off-frequency AM
signal, but the result was the same - trash in the receiver.  This is
what can happen!

What can you do about it?  Nothing, really.  Move or buy a better radio
with significantly better image rejection specs (gee, notice how ICOM
never lists some of these specs in their ads???).  You might also try
not using a gain antenna since this will only 'amplify' the problem you
now have.

I tried to get QST to publish my already-published article since I
thought it would be very helpful, but they disagreed.  I also told them
I really took exception to the fact they let ICOM brag about "intermod
rejection"...


Todd Ellis, N2XL


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:12 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Inventions R'nt Us
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:15:49 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58vkj1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58eo2m$[e-mail]> <58o2rn$[e-mail]> <58qu8o$[e-mail]> <58t1o0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-158.kuentos.guam.net

[e-mail] wrote:

>In <58qu8o$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wri
tes:
>>
>>Let me borrow a phrase from you, Squiggie. 'Bullshit'.  How stupid do you th
ink
>>the readers of RRAP are ?  How many times have you said you have been licens
ed
>>for 20+ years ? Long time, right ?  In those 20+ years, what have YOU done
>>'for the future of ham radio by building, experimenting, and improving our
>>technology'.  Nuttin. Nada. Zip. Zero.

>Jim ... you have no idea of the numerous things I've done to improve
>radio technology ... things that are *directly*  applicable to ham
>radio.  It' not *my* fault that you and some others are too techically
>backward to recognize the value of more advanced technology ... you guys
>who simply want to remain stagnant in past decades' technology *are*
>simply CBers who beep ...

I must have missed the list, Squiggie. Did you post that elsewhere ?
I can't seem to find any Boxes By Squiggie in my AES catalog......
Don't tell me, your middle name is AX25, right ? Anyway, thanks for
the compliment. I would much rather be a CB'er who beeps than an
EE who whines.

>So get off my case, lid ... *you* are the one who's done nothing to make
>ham radio better ... and you actually seem *proud* of it ...

Watch it Squiggie, remember, CW makes you vomit and 'LID' is a CW term.
I've done LOTS for ham radio, Squiggie. Just last nite I stayed on 160 and
followed the greyline across North America.  Matter of fact, one more entry in
the log and I'll have 50,000 happy customers.  I'm the perfect example of
'international goodwill' on HF.  Everybody smiles when they work a new one.
But that's something I wouldn't expect you to understand.  Some people never
get to experience the magic of ham radio because they are too busy trying to
fix it.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:14 1996
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From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: IQ / Hz ratios
Date: 18 Dec 1996 23:05:20 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <599tbg$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]> <597krd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: e4e.oac.uci.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121073 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44376

In article <[e-mail]>,
Larry Deering  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>       Most pro-code hams would like to see a higher IQ/Hz bandwidth ratio
>in HF bands. Importing a large quantity of new hams without commitment to the

>service would be detrimental. To put them all on phone would be a
>catastrophe! At least nitwits on CW use little of a precious resource, while
>the blowhards on sideband buy linears to be heard.
>
>Larry, W2GL

Here, here!!  All in favor of imposing a nitwit filter say aye. {AYE!}
Opposed? {silence}  Then it's unanymous - motion carried.  I believe we
have finally found something on which we can all agree!  But the code test
doesn't work keep nitwits out of the service, so now what?  Somebody yells
from the back of the room:
"Let's not let new hams on the air 'till they have at least 2 years on the
air experience."  I look back, and there sits Jim Kehler next to
Advanced Class Steve both covering their mounths, giggling.

Meeting adjourned.  Merry Christmas, Happy New Year  See you on SKN



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:15 1996
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From: Larry Deering <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: IQ / Hz ratios
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 16:16:06 -0800
Organization: IDT
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58iq7v$[e-mail]> <58o5sj$[e-mail]> <58q6qr$[e-mail]> <58qnjg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595vk4$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]> <597krd$[e-mail]>
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To: Bill Sohl <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121104 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44396

Bill Sohl wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:
>
> >[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:<snip!>

> whch is it procoders?
>   You don't want more hams on HF or you do want more hams?
>   or is it that the current ham poulation is "just right?"
>
> Bill Sohl  K2UNK
> ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

        Most pro-code hams would like to see a higher IQ/Hz bandwidth ratio
in HF bands. Importing a large quantity of new hams without commitment to the
service would be detrimental. To put them all on phone would be a
catastrophe! At least nitwits on CW use little of a precious resource, while
the blowhards on sideband buy linears to be heard.

Larry, W2GL


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:16 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: IQ / Hz ratios
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 09:42:24 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]> <597krd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599tbg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv17.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121308 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44482

In article <599tbg$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
> In article <[e-mail]>,
> Larry Deering  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >     Most pro-code hams would like to see a higher IQ/Hz bandwidth ratio
> >in HF bands. Importing a large quantity of new hams without commitment to t
he
> >service would be detrimental. To put them all on phone would be a
> >catastrophe! At least nitwits on CW use little of a precious resource, whil
e
> >the blowhards on sideband buy linears to be heard.
> >
> >Larry, W2GL
>
> Here, here!!  All in favor of imposing a nitwit filter say aye. {AYE!}
> Opposed? {silence}  Then it's unanymous - motion carried.  I believe we
> have finally found something on which we can all agree!  But the code test
> doesn't work keep nitwits out of the service, so now what?  Somebody yells
> from the back of the room:
> "Let's not let new hams on the air 'till they have at least 2 years on the
> air experience."  I look back, and there sits Jim Kehler next to
> Advanced Class Steve both covering their mounths, giggling.
>
> Meeting adjourned.  Merry Christmas, Happy New Year  See you on SKN
>
>
I'm sorry, but according to Robert's rules, there was no motion to
adjourn, therefore the meeting is still in session.  But then again, when
I open my mounth, peoples listens  Besides, I think 2 years, and have to
submit a QSL cards for DXCC 2 meters HF.  It would have been 10m or 40m
or maybe 80m, but Carl sez those aren't HF bands anymore.  And WA6VSE is
a boneheaded...oopps bonafide RF engineer, and he NO's everythink

SKN - Silent Key Night  get points for qso's with marconi, anderson and
sarnoff.  Extra points for WA6VSE and Lennart

AND TOO ALL A GOOD NIGHT
--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:18 1996
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From: Timothy Haller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 11:21:20 -0500
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: freenet4.afn.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
NNTP-Posting-User: afn53940
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:

> I've read and followed Dave Sumner's work for several years. I think he's a
fair and
> hard working guy, just like the rest of the ARRL staff I've been in contact
with. I
> think that the negative comments I've read on this newsgroup have been ill f
ounded and
> in bad taste.
>
> I think the ARRL serves the Amateur community well, and better than any "gra
ss-roots"
> groups could. They are professionals and are our voice to the FCC. I've alwa
ys found
> them to be helpful when I had questions.
>
> Like any organization, they can't always give you the answer you want to hea
r.
> Occasionally I've been unhappy with a rules change, etc. that they've made,
but I
> realize that they are working for the good of all amateurs, not just me.
>
> I enjoy QST (although I wish it had fewer advertisements and more technical
stuff, or
> just more technical stuff), and I use their QSL buro a lot. The buro saves m
e a lot of
> $$. I participate in their operating events (can't wait for the January VHF
contest!),
> and utilize their bulletim service all the time.
>
> I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the ARRL. The
y need our
> support, and we need theirs.
>
Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?












Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
He pushes his his
fists and still in-
sists he sees the
ghosts.
 from stephen king`s
book It



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:20 1996
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From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Join the ARRL!
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 10:21:35 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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I've read and followed Dave Sumner's work for several years. I think he's a fa
ir and
hard working guy, just like the rest of the ARRL staff I've been in contact wi
th. I
think that the negative comments I've read on this newsgroup have been ill fou
nded and
in bad taste.

I think the ARRL serves the Amateur community well, and better than any "grass
-roots"
groups could. They are professionals and are our voice to the FCC. I've always
 found
them to be helpful when I had questions.

Like any organization, they can't always give you the answer you want to hear.

Occasionally I've been unhappy with a rules change, etc. that they've made, bu
t I
realize that they are working for the good of all amateurs, not just me.

I enjoy QST (although I wish it had fewer advertisements and more technical st
uff, or
just more technical stuff), and I use their QSL buro a lot. The buro saves me
a lot of
$$. I participate in their operating events (can't wait for the January VHF co
ntest!),
and utilize their bulletim service all the time.

I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the ARRL. They
need our
support, and we need theirs.


--
Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:21 1996
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From: "Kevin C. Potter" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 19 Dec 1996 19:12:37 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59c435$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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In the last few months I have used the ARRL services via the net.  I get
the W1AW bulletins, callsign, propogation updates & other news via
e-mail & their pages.

Though, I find QST pretty dry, someone else may find it as their first
exposure to ham radio.

I am, therefore, going to start a subscription of QST to my local
library.

It only seems right.

KP




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:22 1996
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From: "Alan Schoberg" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 20 Dec 1996 06:49:13 GMT
Organization: WQ0J
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <01bbee41$dcba4360$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Timothy Haller <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
>
> > I've read and followed Dave Sumner's work for several years. I think
he's a fair and
> > hard working guy, just like the rest of the ARRL staff I've been in
contact with. I
> > think that the negative comments I've read on this newsgroup have been
ill founded and
> > in bad taste.
> >
> > I think the ARRL serves the Amateur community well, and better than any
"grass-roots"
> > groups could. They are professionals and are our voice to the FCC. I've
always found
> > them to be helpful when I had questions.
> >
> > Like any organization, they can't always give you the answer you want
to hear.
> > Occasionally I've been unhappy with a rules change, etc. that they've
made, but I
> > realize that they are working for the good of all amateurs, not just
me.
> >
> > I enjoy QST (although I wish it had fewer advertisements and more
technical stuff, or
> > just more technical stuff), and I use their QSL buro a lot. The buro
saves me a lot of
> > $$. I participate in their operating events (can't wait for the January
VHF contest!),
> > and utilize their bulletim service all the time.
> >
> > I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the
ARRL. They need our
> > support, and we need theirs.
> >
> Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?
>

Your argument (an unsupported claim of "crap") doesn't sway me in the least
Timothy.  Based on the ideas presented I declare Dave the WINNER of this
debate.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:22 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Timothy Haller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 20 Dec 1996 14:21:20 GMT
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59e7d0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbee41$dcba4360$[e-mail]>
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Alan Schoberg ([e-mail]) wrote:

> Your argument (an unsupported claim of "crap") doesn't sway me in the least
> Timothy.  Based on the ideas presented I declare Dave the WINNER of this
> debate.
>

--
Fine alan you win i don`t really feel like getting into a pissing contest
with you .











Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
He pushes his his
fists and still in-
sists he sees the
ghosts.
 from stephen king`s
book It


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:24 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 06:37:43 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 55
Message-ID: <58o97n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

>
>1) Join the ARRL. You won't make a difference on the outside.

Pisses me off that they use my money to lobby to maintian a status quo
that I despise ...

>   Others have tried that, but the chance of successfully forming
>   a second viable national amateur political organization is
>   essentially nil.

I don't think that's necessarily true ...


>   (And even if it were possible, it would dilute
>   amateur strength, and that's not good at a time when amateur
>   radio faces severe threats from the outside.)

The ARRL LOVES to hear people spread that fallacy ... actually, getting
representation for/by the 2/3 or more of US hams who are NOT ARRL
"members" (not to mention representation for those of us who are/have
been "members" for 20+ years without representation) would ONLY serve to
strengthen ham radio's political clout and lobbying ability on important
issues ... only on areas where the ARRL is behind the times and
non-representative would there be any "competition" in the regulatory
sense ... in many areas, the .alt.org and the ARRL would present
essentially the same views (e.g. "more, larger ham bands are good,
smaller, fewer ham bands are bad) ...

>
>2) Learn how the ARRL *really* operates. Most of the people flaming
>   the ARRL here on the net don't really understand how the League
>   works. (Or how any political organization works for that matter.)
>   Make no mistake, the ARRL is primarily a political organization.

And like the political process and government in general (to quote the
Liberterian party line) "It doesn't work!"

>   Nor is it primarily a publishing business,
>   though that is its most visible face.

The HELL it isn't ...

>3) Use your knowledge of the levers of political power to *change* the
>   way the ARRL operates to something more to your liking. This is not
>   an impossible task. But it is also not a quick or easy task. However,
>   it is the *only* way you can realistically hope to reshape policy.

That's like telling a black man to join the KKK and change it from the
inside so that it's not so racist ...


Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:25 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 07:06:09 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]>
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In article <58ob1e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) wr
ites:
> >
> >Let me give you an example.  One of the questions is "Do you support, or
> >not support, K1ZZ?"  What in the world does that question *mean*?
>
> I see it as a simple question ... many of us feel that K1ZZ is a grossly
> overpaid, incompetent boob who should be summarily discharged at the
> next board meeting, if not sooner ...
>
> Do you support him, or not?  (can I make my view any clearer?)
> (do you understand the "bottom line" intent of the question?)
>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>
Well maybe you should vote him out.  OOPPPS, I'm sorry, you donlt vote.
You'd rather piss and moan that actually do something constructive.

I know, you're the brains behind the no code debate.  Would that mean
that Len is the muscle??


--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member
Hope about an OLD GEEZER class License


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:26 1996
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From: Robert Barron <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 13:13:07 -0600
Organization: Liant Software
Lines: 67
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5858aa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58oakr$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
> We need to throw ALL of the rascals out ... but that isn't likely to
> happen because the rascals control the system ... the fox is literally
> the gatekeeper to the henhouse ... clearly an untenable situation.

I believe that it takes only 10 signatures to get on the ballot and run
for division director.  Then you'll be given an equal amount of space on
the ballot to state your platform against your challenger(s).  What
could
be easier.  What sort of control on the system will prevent you from
being elected?  It's the requirement that one have access to a lot of
money
(like running for national government office).  So what is it?

> >>>just come on .misc or .policy and complain, run for office yourself and
> >>>show the world how the job *should* be done.  If you don't have the time
> >>>to hold office yourself, find and actively support someone who does.
>
> To what end?  The deck is stacked against outsiders ... if you don't see
> that, you're not being realistic, and that's uncharacteristic for you
> from my previous experience with your posts ...

Who's being unrealistic here?  I've outlined what I believe to be very
simple requirements needed to run for office that helps set all League
policy.
I'm sure that you can get the required number of signatures to run in
your
area.  I'm equally sure that a number of like-minded associates can do
the
same in their divisions.  This group could "take over" the ARRL for a
fraction of the effort it would take to try and create a new
organization.

> The key is the 2/3 or more of hams who are NOT league members and those
> "members" who are really only "subscribers to QST" ... that's where the
> real political power in ham radio lies and we need to harness it ...

The big question is,  how many of those Hams (ARRL members or not) are
really active Hams?  How many are dead?  How many have a license but
don't
have a radio or haven't turned on their radio in years?  I'd bet that
a pretty good number of those 2/3rd's are not active Amateurs at all.
Of course neither I nor anyone else has some real numbers to back up
anyone's claims to that effect.

> If an organization can be structured to be more responsive and
> representative and provide a source of news, information, and political
> input, I think the currently UNrepresented 2/3+ (majority) of US hams
> would jump on the bandwagon ...

I don't think that would be the case at all.  I'm not saying that there
might not be more members of the ARRL if they changed their tune but I
think we disagree on why more people do not join the ARRL.  Even the
much mentioned on-line survey that has posted about showed that the
number one reason for not joining the ARRL was price,  not the politics
of the ARRL (though that was second).

Amateur Radio is not alone in facing the new demagraphics.  Specifically
people today are much less likely to join or be a member of anything
than they used to in the past.  Almost every organization is facing a
similar problem.  So I don't think that the ARRL can realistically do
much to double the number of members.

73,

Robert KA5WSS
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:27 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 07:08:35 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58obcn$[e-mail]>
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In article <58obcn$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> I agree that we need *AN* "arrl" ... just not *THE ARRL* ... in other
> words, we *do* need a national organization, but the one we have doesn't
> cut it ... my only conclusion is that another, better organization
> should be formed to do the job(s) that need doing ...

Go right ahead Carl.. Those with the biggest mouths (or fattest fingers)
should lead the way.

>
> The league has never been "open" in the 20+ years that I've been a ham
> and a "member" ...

Let's kill em all.  One person out of thousands disagrees.  String em up,
the stupid bastards.

>
> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:28 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:08:30 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58ob1e$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) writ
es:
>
>Let me give you an example.  One of the questions is "Do you support, or
>not support, K1ZZ?"  What in the world does that question *mean*?

I see it as a simple question ... many of us feel that K1ZZ is a grossly
overpaid, incompetent boob who should be summarily discharged at the
next board meeting, if not sooner ...

Do you support him, or not?  (can I make my view any clearer?)
(do you understand the "bottom line" intent of the question?)

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:29 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:14:31 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58obcn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <586ooo$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, "Roger J. Buffington" <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>This is my point exactly.  I believe that we need an ARRL, and it is
>a mistake for serious members of our hobby not to join.  On the other
>hand, the organization is far too oriented towards closed-door
>deliberation than it should be.

I agree that we need *AN* "arrl" ... just not *THE ARRL* ... in other
words, we *do* need a national organization, but the one we have doesn't
cut it ... my only conclusion is that another, better organization
should be formed to do the job(s) that need doing ...

>I happen to agree with many League positions on issues.  What is
>striking, however, is the degree to which the League avoids discussing
>controversy.  Our friend the Vice Director here on this thread was
>uncomfortable discussing his positions even on the most banal of issues: the
>CW requirement, limiting contests, etc.  I had to keep looking at
>that American flag over on my wall to remember that I lived in a free
>country.  Since when are we Americans afraid to let our thoughts be
>known?

The league has never been "open" in the 20+ years that I've been a ham
and a "member" ...

>Like many or perhaps most hams, I do not find ham clubs or hamfests
>to be an effective place to discuss issues.  Club meetings take up too
>much time, and hamfests are few and far between.  That pretty much
>leaves on-the-air QSOs, the internet, and QST as potential forums.  QST
>has opted out, and this is unfortunate.  CQ also avoids controversy,
>although to a lesser degree than QST.  73, well, they long ago lost
>touch with reality, if they're still around (I haven't checked lately.)

Yea ... we could use a really good ham magazine, too ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:30 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:23:32 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <58qp4l$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <57vv52$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5858aa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58oakr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Carl, me thinks thou doest protest too much about everything.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:31 1996
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 01:43:10 -0500
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
> Well maybe you should vote him out.  OOPPPS, I'm sorry, you donlt
vote.
> You'd rather piss and moan that actually do something
constructive.
> --
> Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
> ARRL LIFE Member
> Hope about an OLD GEEZER class License

Well, ARRL Life Member, get your facts right.  The membership does
not vote for K1ZZ.  The BOD does.  Since we only get to vote for one
director, its pretty hard to vote out K1ZZ.  He effectively seems to have
life tenure.

Term limits, anyone?

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:32 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 07:13:09 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv8.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
> > Well maybe you should vote him out.  OOPPPS, I'm sorry, you donlt
> vote.
> > You'd rather piss and moan that actually do something
> constructive.
> > --
> > Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
> > ARRL LIFE Member
> > Hope about an OLD GEEZER class License
>
> Well, ARRL Life Member, get your facts right.  The membership does
> not vote for K1ZZ.  The BOD does.  Since we only get to vote for one
> director, its pretty hard to vote out K1ZZ.  He effectively seems to have
> life tenure.
>
> Term limits, anyone?
>
> --
> Roger J. Buffington
> W6VZV
>
> USC Law, Class of '97

No offense Roger, but Carl is very proud of the fact that he doesn't vote
in any ARRL election.  There was bo specific mention of K1ZZ in my
posting.  Just the fact that Carl, who rather gripe repeatedly that the
ARRL doesn't represent him for the past 20+ years.  Which in it self
amazes most as anyone with any common sense at all would have done
something about long ago (quit, refused renewal, etc).  But then again,
we're talking about Carl..which sez it all.

And dor your information, they is a way to remove any non elected person
in the ARRL...as you stated vote for a slate of divisional directors that
best meets the need.  Again, noting that Carl would rather cry and whine
than actually do it.

BTW Roger, I didn't like you tone of typing.  I suggest you cgange it or
I will hire some "slezzie lawyer type" and sue your butt off!!!  (HEY
CARL??? DID I GET IT RIGHT???"  HA HA HA Roger, just kidding.  Love to
pal around with my good friend Carl.  This month's spoods are to
intimidate someone into stop posting by threatening to sue them.  Hope
you weren't intimidated....
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:33 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.89.123.24!nntp.inet.fi!news.funet.fi!news.cs.hut.fi!news.clinet.fi!usenet
From: Dave Heil <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 22:12:21 +0000
Organization: Clinet, Espoo, Finland.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
>

> I see it as a simple question ... many of us feel that K1ZZ is a grossly
> overpaid, incompetent boob who should be summarily discharged at the
> next board meeting, if not sooner ...

> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]


Carl,

With all of your manners and tact, you strike me as the type who gets
punched often in neighborhood pubs.  Your "many of us feel..."
comment about Dave Sumner is uncalled for.  Have you ever met him?
Whether or not you have, why make such a rude comment if not simply to
fan the flames?

I also notice that when I pulled up 150 posts on the group, yours
accounted for 32 of 'em.

Dave Heil OH2/K8MN

P.S.  Have you been lurking on alt.Dave.Sumner?  Where do you get the
"many of us" line?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:35 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!greg
From: [e-mail] (Greg Bullough)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest)
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 00:37:35 GMT
Lines: 33
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <58ob1e$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) wri
tes:
>>
>>Let me give you an example.  One of the questions is "Do you support, or
>>not support, K1ZZ?"  What in the world does that question *mean*?
>
>I see it as a simple question ... many of us feel that K1ZZ is a grossly
>overpaid, incompetent boob who should be summarily discharged at the
>next board meeting, if not sooner ...
>
>Do you support him, or not?  (can I make my view any clearer?)
>(do you understand the "bottom line" intent of the question?)
>

Now, now, Carl.

You've just risen to the bait. The politician who doesn't want to
step up to the issues just *loves* to first, seem not to understand
a rather obvious question. To second, continue to ignore the clarification
of said question (or to claim that his is somehow 'neither the time
nor the place to answer *those* sorts of question). Then, when the
asker becomes exasperated and resorts to sarcasm, or hyperbole, or
begins to holler, the politician informs him that he is surely not
going to conduct a discussion in *those* terms, and stalks off, feeling
victorious in a finely tailored suit of Teflon[TM].

But you really should watch those 'pot shots' and 'sarcasm.' And
immediately run to you SM, begging for a field appointment, which
will result in the opening of the Board of Directors' minds, as
if by magic. Don't you agree?


Greg


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 02:54:28 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58t4t4$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-03.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>No offense Roger, but Carl is very proud of the fact that he doesn't vote
>in any ARRL election.  There was bo specific mention of K1ZZ in my
>posting.  Just the fact that Carl, who rather gripe repeatedly that the
>ARRL doesn't represent him for the past 20+ years.  Which in it self
>amazes most as anyone with any common sense at all would have done
>something about long ago (quit, refused renewal, etc).  But then again,
>we're talking about Carl..which sez it all.

Steve, once again your "facts" are false ... I voted in the recent
ARRL election ... I actually picked one of the candidates on the ballot
.. we'll see if he suits me after he's had a chance to do something.

What you're referring to (distorting) is the fact that I said I once
wrote in "neither of the establishment lackeys is acceptable" on an ARRL
ballot ... BFD ...

>And dor your information, they is a way to remove any non elected person
>in the ARRL...as you stated vote for a slate of divisional directors that
>best meets the need.

Roger's point was that any individual can only vote for ONE ARRL
director ... only a nationally-organized effort to elect an entire board
of directors (well, at least a majority thereof) could unseat K1ZZ ...
as Roger points out, some other mechanism should be in place to allow
his tenure to be passed on by the membership ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:37 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 03:03:46 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <58t5ei$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-03.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, Dave Heil <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>With all of your manners and tact, you strike me as the type who gets
>punched often in neighborhood pubs.

Not at all ... I'm 6'4", 240# ... think again ... (just kidding, only
6', 180#, but I still don't get punched ...)

>Your "many of us feel..." comment about Dave Sumner is uncalled for.

Why? It's true ... many do feel that way ...

>Have you ever met him?

Irrelevant ... I've read his party line crap and seen how any sign of
dissent in hamdom is systematically purged from QST and other league
communications ...  I've seen how any opposing comment is outright
ignored.  That's all I need to know ... he's a political slime in a
political position, and he's simply out to maintain his power base and
cushy do-nothing job at our expense ... he's a major detriment to ham
radio IMNSHO.

>Whether or not you have, why make such a rude comment if not simply to
>fan the flames?

Because it needs saying ... more people should start saying "We're mad
as hell and we're not going to take it any more!"

>I also notice that when I pulled up 150 posts on the group, yours
>accounted for 32 of 'em.

I comment back and forth with folks, so what?  Are you one of those
people who tries to sweep any controversy under the rug?

>P.S.  Have you been lurking on alt.Dave.Sumner?  Where do you get the
>"many of us" line?

No, on alt.Dave.Sumner.should.be.fired ... and I've talked to LOTs of
folks who think he's long overdue for replacement ... he's built a
good-ole-boy club and it's time to knock down his clubhouse and clean
things up ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!169.207.30.10!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 03:10:00 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58t5q8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-03.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Greg Bullough) writes:
>
>You've just risen to the bait. The politician who doesn't want to
>step up to the issues just *loves* to first, seem not to understand
>a rather obvious question. To second, continue to ignore the clarification
>of said question (or to claim that his is somehow 'neither the time
>nor the place to answer *those* sorts of question). Then, when the
>asker becomes exasperated and resorts to sarcasm, or hyperbole, or
>begins to holler, the politician informs him that he is surely not
>going to conduct a discussion in *those* terms, and stalks off, feeling
>victorious in a finely tailored suit of Teflon[TM].

I stated my views and asked a direct question ... if a ployitican (not a
misspelling ... I meant it that way) tries to slip out of a direct
question like that, it's not teflon than imparts the slipperyness ...
it's something with a whole lot more odor, if you get my meaning.


>But you really should watch those 'pot shots' and 'sarcasm.' And
>immediately run to you SM, begging for a field appointment,

I wouldn't "beg" my SM for anything ...

>will result in the opening of the Board of Directors' minds, as
>if by magic. Don't you agree?

I don't thing the "jaws of life" could open the minds of most of the
ARRL board ... there are a couple of exceptions, but most are just too
stoddgy and dense to figure out the realities ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:41 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 02:12:36 GMT
Lines: 22

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>2.  No argument about keeping incentive licensing going.  It is quite
>logical that the cw portions of the band should be retained as
>cw-only, and that only hams who have passed a cw test should operate there

This would be amusing if it weren't so common. The only two OOK Morse
exclusive band segments in US amateur radio are 50.0-50.1 MHz and
144.0-144.1 MHz, neither of which require a Morse test to use. Those
band segments you're so happy to make OOK Morse only are actually the
*data* segments of HF. Those of us operating data modes there would
not be amused if we were kicked off of *our* band segments (which we
graciously share with Morse users). You can go beep at the phone guys
if you like (OOK Morse is allowed everywhere), we can't, we aren't
allowed outside the data segments with our twitters and chirps.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:42 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.sgi.com!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 20:22:11 GMT
Lines: 27

In article <58ob1e$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (james a maxwell) wri
tes:
>>Let me give you an example.  One of the questions is "Do you support, or
>>not support, K1ZZ?"  What in the world does that question *mean*?
>
>I see it as a simple question ... many of us feel that K1ZZ is a grossly
>overpaid, incompetent boob who should be summarily discharged at the
>next board meeting, if not sooner ...
>
>Do you support him, or not?  (can I make my view any clearer?)
>(do you understand the "bottom line" intent of the question?)
>
>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

Gee, Carl, do you even know what Dave Sumner's salary is?
Or what any of the HQ staff's salaries are for that matter?
Have you spoken with Dave Sumner?
What leads you to believe he is incompetent?
Generalizations don't hack it. Give specific examples.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:43 1996
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From: Dave Heil <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 18:25:21 +0000
Organization: Clinet, Espoo, Finland.
Lines: 67
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <586pc0$1sve$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ob1e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t5ei$[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>

> >Your "many of us feel..." comment about Dave Sumner is uncalled for.
> Why? It's true ... many do feel that way ...

Carl, Why not just say "I feel" rather than implying that you speak for
someone other than yourself?


> >Have you ever met him?
>
> Irrelevant ... I've read his party line crap and seen how any sign of
> dissent in hamdom is systematically purged from QST and other league
> communications ...  I've seen how any opposing comment is outright
> ignored.  That's all I need to know ... he's a political slime in a
> political position, and he's simply out to maintain his power base and
> cushy do-nothing job at our expense ... he's a major detriment to ham
> radio IMNSHO.

Now Carl, I feel it's relevant.  You don't know the man and yet you sit
behind the relative anonymity of your keyboard and bray on about K1ZZ as
if he was another Jimmy Hoffa.  I don't recall him saying anything
similar about you.  Dave doesn't work in a political position anymore
than a plant manager does.  If higher-ups don't think he's doing the job,
he can be booted.  Most of us have a boss or bosses and have to report to
them and be responsible for the actions we take at work.  Dave does too.

> >Whether or not you have, why make such a rude comment if not simply to
> >fan the flames?
>
> Because it needs saying ... more people should start saying "We're mad
> as hell and we're not going to take it any more!"

Carl, you're making a quote from an old movie.  The character who
uttered the lines had gone insane in the film.  You're not going to take
what anymore?
>
> >I also notice that when I pulled up 150 posts on the group, yours
> >accounted for 32 of 'em.
>
> I comment back and forth with folks, so what?  Are you one of those
> people who tries to sweep any controversy under the rug?

Nope.  I'm one of those who tries to discard the hysterics and theatrics
in order to find the actual agenda.  Then I like to discuss the matter in
a fairly reasonable manner.  You've not come up with an actual example
of an irresponsible action by Dave Sumner--not one concrete instance.

> ... I've talked to LOTs of folks who think he's long overdue for
> replacement ... he's built a
> good-ole-boy club and it's time to knock down his clubhouse and clean
> things up ...


Dave didn't build a club house. He's worked hard for the ARRL for many
years.  I've talked with LOTS of folks who think his work is
consciencious.  That doesn't mean I'm always in agreement with anything
the ARRL does.  There's always room for healthy dissent.  I don't see any
good-ole-boys in evidence and haven't the vaguest idea of what you're
talking about when you say it's time to knock down his club house.  The
ARRL is open for full membership to any licensed U.S. radio amateur and
open for associate membership to anyone with an interest in amateur
radio.


Dave Heil OH2/K8MN


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 05:38:55 -0500
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-140.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

Gary Coffman wrote:
>
>
> This would be amusing if it weren't so common. The only two OOK Morse
> exclusive band segments in US amateur radio are 50.0-50.1 MHz and
> 144.0-144.1 MHz, neither of which require a Morse test to use. Those
> band segments you're so happy to make OOK Morse only are actually the
> *data* segments of HF. Those of us operating data modes there would
> not be amused if we were kicked off of *our* band segments (which we
> graciously share with Morse users). You can go beep at the phone guys
> if you like (OOK Morse is allowed everywhere), we can't, we aren't
> allowed outside the data segments with our twitters and chirps.

Well, speaking as one who has operated primarily RTTY, AMTOR, and
PACTOR for the past ten years, let me say that I don't care for your
patronizing tone.  However, if it makes you feel good to nit-pick
others, go right ahead.

Incidentally, if you are going to nit pick, at least do it
intelligently.  Where does it say that we can't operate RTTY,
for example, on 14.250?

What I meant, and what anyone but an idiot would have known that
I meant, is that band segments such as 14.000 to 14.060, where
no one (no one Gary, not even you) runs anything but CW, can
stay that way until hell freezes over, as far as I'm concerned.
Even if we do dump the CW requirement soon, as now seems likely.

By all means, let's keep the CW ops off our 14.065-and up
digital frequencies.  Pisses me off when they come up there during
these too-frequent contests.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:22:05 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <595vk1$[e-mail]>
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan9.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] wr
ites:
>>In article <57sii3$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Weir) writes:
>>
>>>1.  The ARRL does NOT represent my opinions in the political arena.  So
>>>long as the League supports separate subbands for Morse Code, a
>>>concentration on contesting and awards, and a VERY ineffective lobbying
>>>effort, it does NOT represent me.
>>
>>Point of order, albeit a very small one: An organization that makes "lobbyin
g"
>>one of its primary purposes is in grave danger of losing its non-profit stat
us
>>with the IRS.

I would stongly believe that the lobbying
efforts of ARRL constitute a relatively small
percentage of ARRL activities.

>>Maybe ARRL isn't too effective now...I've not followed things too closely fo
r
>>a while...but if they lost non-profit status, operating costs for what
>>services there *are* would go a whole lot higher!

True enough...if that happened.

>There is a simple (and legal) way around this problem. It is called
>a PAC. The NRA, a non-profit, has the NRA-ILA, a very vocal lobbying
>group which spends heavy money influencing political matters. There
>is nothing to stop the ARRL from forming an ARRL-ILA. The ARRL already
>has experience with the sorts of requirements this brings since they
>have to operate a firewall between their VEC activities and their
>publishing empire, and they already have the ARRL Foundation as another
>separate entity.

I suspect that a PAC isn't so much needed when lobbying
for regulatory changes as opposed to either legislative action
and/or endorsments of actual candidates.  The PAC is
usually focused on supporting candidtaes as opposed to endorsing
legislation.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:46 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <57sii3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595vk1$[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 19:56:45 GMT
Lines: 35

In article <595vk1$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wri
tes:
>[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:
>>There is a simple (and legal) way around this problem. It is called
>>a PAC. The NRA, a non-profit, has the NRA-ILA, a very vocal lobbying
>>group which spends heavy money influencing political matters. There
>>is nothing to stop the ARRL from forming an ARRL-ILA. The ARRL already
>>has experience with the sorts of requirements this brings since they
>>have to operate a firewall between their VEC activities and their
>>publishing empire, and they already have the ARRL Foundation as another
>>separate entity.
>
>I suspect that a PAC isn't so much needed when lobbying
>for regulatory changes as opposed to either legislative action
>and/or endorsments of actual candidates.  The PAC is
>usually focused on supporting candidtaes as opposed to endorsing
>legislation.

Who do you suppose introduces legislation authorizing regulation,
sponsors it, votes for it, and authorizes the funding of regulators?
It is always advantageous to have a block of Congressmen in your pocket.
The regulators, whose budgets depend on the goodwill of those Congressmen,
listen. The number one (two, three, and four) rule of influencing government
is *follow the money*. Having a President in your pocket can be useful,
but not nearly as useful as having a majority of the House committee
deciding the budget of the agency you want to influence.

Congressmen are cheaper to buy than Presidents too, and they usually
stay bought because they want their job for the long pull.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:48 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!gryphon.phoenix.net!insync!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 19:36:34 GMT
Lines: 62

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>Gary Coffman wrote:
>>
>> This would be amusing if it weren't so common. The only two OOK Morse
>> exclusive band segments in US amateur radio are 50.0-50.1 MHz and
>> 144.0-144.1 MHz, neither of which require a Morse test to use. Those
>> band segments you're so happy to make OOK Morse only are actually the
>> *data* segments of HF. Those of us operating data modes there would
>> not be amused if we were kicked off of *our* band segments (which we
>> graciously share with Morse users). You can go beep at the phone guys
>> if you like (OOK Morse is allowed everywhere), we can't, we aren't
>> allowed outside the data segments with our twitters and chirps.
>
>Well, speaking as one who has operated primarily RTTY, AMTOR, and
>PACTOR for the past ten years, let me say that I don't care for your
>patronizing tone.  However, if it makes you feel good to nit-pick
>others, go right ahead.
>
>Incidentally, if you are going to nit pick, at least do it
>intelligently.  Where does it say that we can't operate RTTY,
>for example, on 14.250?

Try 97.305(c). Says right there in black and white that the RTTY/data
segment of 20m only extends from 14.000 to 14.150 MHz. Above 14.150 MHz
is the phone/image segment, and RTTY/data is not authorized there.
I'd expect this from others, but I'm really disappointed in you,
Roger.

>What I meant, and what anyone but an idiot would have known that
>I meant, is that band segments such as 14.000 to 14.060, where
>no one (no one Gary, not even you) runs anything but CW, can
>stay that way until hell freezes over, as far as I'm concerned.
>Even if we do dump the CW requirement soon, as now seems likely.

Well, maybe *you* never run data down there, but I've done it, and
am doing it now. Three of us are doing weak signal coherent experiments
down there below 14.060 MHz with my DSP I/Q receiver. And it is legal
to do so. The CW boys don't seem to notice us, not surprising since
we're running very QRP and very slow (currently 0.1 baud at 100
microwatts, a MAR-4 feeding an attenuator is the PA, modulation is from
a PC sound card, same as my earlier bench test setup). Basically what
we're doing at the moment is the old Lowfer integrate and dump routine,
with a couple of novel, I hope, twists. CW signals don't bother us much,
we're not running any AGC, the A/D just limits, and their dits are lots
shorter than our bits, but RTTY tears us up if it is anywhere within about
3 kHz of us (ADC stays in limiting, not enough dynamic range in the current
version).

>By all means, let's keep the CW ops off our 14.065-and up
>digital frequencies.  Pisses me off when they come up there during
>these too-frequent contests.

Doesn't bother me. They have no specified segment. They can go where
they please, and accept the interference they get there too. Switch to
a good error correcting protocol and they won't bother you either.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:50 1996
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 08:27:13 -0500
Organization: ibm.net
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Although I normally am in favor of majority rule, a couple of
comments to the rumor (I will not accept it as fact, because I don't know it
to be) that a recent ARRL poll showed that most members want the CW
requirement for HF privileges retained.

1.  Self selected polls are notoriously inaccurate, and no one who
has a working knowledge of statistics would accept a poll in which the
respondents are those who must affirmatively phone or mail in their
responses.  "Dewey defeats Truman," remember?

2.  Sometimes an organization must lead, rather than follow, public
opinion.  The CW requirement is killing our hobby by starving it of new
members, and diverting young people (potential hams) away from
amateur radio to the internet.  This is not desireable.  ARRL should act in
the best interests of amateur radio and work to eliminate the CW
requirement.  It has no rational basis, now that CW is essentially a thing
of the past everywhere but for recreational amateurs.  The "service"
component of our hobby, i.e. nets, mars, etc., has long since abandoned
CW.  It is just about never used in disaster communications.


--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:51 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: 18 Dec 1996 05:11:21 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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In article <[e-mail]>, "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV"
<[e-mail]> writes:

>ncidentally, if you are going to nit pick, at least do it
>intelligently.  Where does it say that we can't operate RTTY,
>for example, on 14.250?
>
>

Try U.S.C.F.R Part 97.305 & 97.307 for the answer to your question.  It's
not even tricky.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:53 1996
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 07:43:53 -0500
Lines: 36
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Gary Coffman wrote:
>
>
> Try 97.305(c). Says right there in black and white that the RTTY/data
> segment of 20m only extends from 14.000 to 14.150 MHz. Above 14.150 MHz
> is the phone/image segment, and RTTY/data is not authorized there.
> I'd expect this from others, but I'm really disappointed in you,
> Roger.

Not at all.  I rarely clutter my brain with useless facts like the
above.  Useless because only a lid would run data in the fone band
anyway.

> Well, maybe *you* never run data down there, but I've done it, and
> am doing it now.

Sounds like a waste of time to me, and poor operating procedure as
well.  Very poor.  I'm quite disappointed in you.  The informal
digital band plan is pretty clear about where data is supposed to
be operated.  You are in violation of this plan, which is not likely
to endear you to your fellow hams.  Of course, if you run under
100 milliwatts, I guess you can operate wherever you want, and who
will care?

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:54 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Sender: [e-mail]

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Although I normally am in favor of majority rule, a couple of
: comments to the rumor (I will not accept it as fact, because I don't know it
: to be) that a recent ARRL poll showed that most members want the CW
: requirement for HF privileges retained.

: 1.  Self selected polls are notoriously inaccurate, and no one who
: has a working knowledge of statistics would accept a poll in which the
: respondents are those who must affirmatively phone or mail in their
: responses.  "Dewey defeats Truman," remember?

Also, I'd like to see the raw numbers, rather than just the percentages.
For the most part, it is difficult to get people to respond to surveys, so
I'd want to see the number of surveys returned, versus those sent.

And, although ARRL attempted to solicit the opinion of non-members, I can't
see how they could effectively reach prospective hams, who would probably
vote against the continuation of the code requirement.  Do we know how many
surveys were sent to this population, and how they were targeted?

: 2.  Sometimes an organization must lead, rather than follow, public
: opinion.  The CW requirement is killing our hobby by starving it of new
: members, and diverting young people (potential hams) away from
: amateur radio to the internet.  This is not desireable.  ARRL should act in
: the best interests of amateur radio and work to eliminate the CW
: requirement.  It has no rational basis, now that CW is essentially a thing
: of the past everywhere but for recreational amateurs.  The "service"
: component of our hobby, i.e. nets, mars, etc., has long since abandoned
: CW.  It is just about never used in disaster communications.

If that were the case, ARRL should not have done the survey at all.  Since
they did the survey, they are somewhat obliged to abide by the results.  We
had a similar situation in another organization that I belonged to, where a
survey was taken and the Board decided to take their own direction, contrary
to the recommendations of the membership at large.  This led to large
numbers of members terminating their memberships, and a near recall of the
entire Board of Directors.  I don't think ARRL wants to invite *that* sort
of criticism.

I'd be agreeable to dropping the code requirement in place of a rigorous
written exam, perhaps the level of the current Advanced Class exam.  Give
those who qualify the General and Advanced phone portions of the band.
Continue the code requirement for those who want CW privileges, preserving,
or perhaps expanding the Extra portion of the CW band, and requiring the
current level of theory and code proficiency.

Face it, although some will always end up disgruntled, working out a
compromise that is accepteble to both sides of the issue and presenting it
to ARRL and FCC is going to accomplish more that the "I want it all, and I
want it now" attitude.

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:56 1996
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From: Robert Barron <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL -- Why?
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 11:29:11 -0600
Organization: Liant Software
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Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV wrote:
>
> Gary Coffman wrote:
> >
> > This would be amusing if it weren't so common. The only two OOK Morse
> > exclusive band segments in US amateur radio are 50.0-50.1 MHz and
> > 144.0-144.1 MHz, neither of which require a Morse test to use. Those
> > band segments you're so happy to make OOK Morse only are actually the
> > *data* segments of HF. Those of us operating data modes there would
> > not be amused if we were kicked off of *our* band segments (which we
> > graciously share with Morse users). You can go beep at the phone guys
> > if you like (OOK Morse is allowed everywhere), we can't, we aren't
> > allowed outside the data segments with our twitters and chirps.
>
> Well, speaking as one who has operated primarily RTTY, AMTOR, and
> PACTOR for the past ten years, let me say that I don't care for your
> patronizing tone.  However, if it makes you feel good to nit-pick
> others, go right ahead.
>
> Incidentally, if you are going to nit pick, at least do it
> intelligently.  Where does it say that we can't operate RTTY,
> for example, on 14.250?

Part 97 rules I think (S 97.305).  It states that CW is allowed on ALL
frequencies then goes on to state these allowed emissions:

20 m        14.00-14.15 MHz       RTTY, data
-do-        14.15-14.35 MHz       Phone, image

So it appears that the FCC rules specifically prohibit RTTY operation
in the "phone" bands of HF.  And it appears that Gary is right.

73,

Robert, KA5WSS


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:56 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL...Why?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:33:40 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
 writes:
>
>In a manner of speaking, the EVP stands for election every time
>the BOD meets since his continued employment is dependent on their
>approval of his job performance.

So, you're saying that K1ZZ'z continued employment simply an additional
example of convincing evidence of the board's poor job performance???
<grin> (playing on your words but totally serious about both K1ZZ's and
the board's incompetence)

>Membership organizations with unpaid part time elected officers
>require a paid professional staff to handle the day to day affairs
>of the organization. And that staff needs a leader. The leader has
>to be another paid professional, in this case Sumner.

In this case, a piss-poor excuse for a leader ...

>If the membership at large wants him gone, they can elect a BOD who
>won't approve of his job performance.

Yea ... right ... and why don't you seek the Republican nomination for
president next time?

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:57 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Joining the ARRL...Why?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 07:10:43 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
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In article <58ocgk$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> >If the membership at large wants him gone, they can elect a BOD who
> >won't approve of his job performance.
>
> Yea ... right ... and why don't you seek the Republican nomination for
> president next time?
>

Spoken like a true monday morning quarterback.  Spoken like a true
armchair general.


> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
> opinions are me
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:58 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Thomas E. Fink)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Kantronics Kam Plus FS
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 17:13:17 -0500
Organization: Harbor Communications
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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For Sale:

Kantronics Kam Plus
Price: $225.00
Condition: Mint--Includes Manual and box

I can be reached at the following,

[phone]
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:12:59 1996
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Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 18:11:04 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: kantronics kpc9612 gps
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
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Looking for anyone who has interfaced the kpc9612 with gps firmware and a
gps rx.Also the make and model of gps rx.
tnx dale
73 ve4drc

-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:00 1996
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From: "Al Woodward" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Kenwood TM-V7A vs Yaesu FT-8000 VHF/UHF radios
Date: 19 Dec 1996 04:13:09 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 8
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Does anyone out there have an opinion they would like share about these two
radios. I am about to buy, and would like any commnets about them

Of high concern is their susceptiblility to Inter-mod.

Al Woodward, WB6ZLM

[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:01 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 06:31:41 -0800
From: "Mark L. Bary" <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: This is my Organization Line
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Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Kenwood TR-7730 Manual(s)
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:99184 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44137 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120337

Hello!

I just picked up a couple of Kenwood 2m FM transcievers, TR-7730, and am
looking for an owner's manual and a service manual.  One of the units
needs some work, as they say....!

If you have either of the above manuals, or know where they may be
found, please contact me and let's talk!

Thanks very much for your assistance!

73,
Mark
N4EOC
Germantown, MD

[e-mail]   -or-  [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!blackbush.xlink.net!ka.sub.net!book7.ms.sub.org!raudi.ms.sub.org!Edgar
Date: 11 Dec 1996 23:40:00 +0100
From: [e-mail] (Edgar Neuhaeuser)
Sender: [e-mail] (Edgar Neuhaeuser)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Subject: Keplerian Elements
X-Newsreader: CrossPoint v3.11 R/C19022
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Lines: 18

Muenster, Mi 11.12.96, 23:36 Uhr

Hi,
I'm looking for some FTP- Sites where I can download the Keplerian
Elements for my PCT 3.1

TNX for help ;)))

Greetings


EDGAR
---
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>>Fileserver: [e-mail]; Betreff:PSERVER:HELP<<


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:02 1996
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From: Lawrence Davis <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Keplerian Elements
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 19:27:40 -0500
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.62.39
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

Edgar Neuhaeuser wrote:
>
> Muenster, Mi 11.12.96, 23:36 Uhr
>
> Hi,
> I'm looking for some FTP- Sites where I can download the Keplerian
> Elements for my PCT 3.1
>
> TNX for help ;)))

Try the URL:
                        http://user.itl.net/~equinox/

And browse down the screen to Satellite Kepplers!

73's and happy DX  DE WB8VPC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:03 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-9.sprintlink.net!eskimo!news
From: Tom Valenti <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Keplerian Elements
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: tia1.eskimo.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News User Id)
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 06:19:18 GMT
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Lines: 8

The default location would probably have to be :

        http://www.amsat.org/       and get the latest there!


73     TOM
KB7RSK



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:04 1996
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From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 05:13:20 -0700
Organization: Network Service
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: den-co7-03.ix.netcom.com
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This goofball is over on another newsgroup telling people off and
basically showing what a bunch of high minded, arrogant #$@@# we can be.
I thought we were supposed to elmer people and help out? Some people in
the hobby, especially the ones in this newsgroup need to have a piece of
humble pie.

AB0DK/jim


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: ko4qc <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 12:31:15 -0500
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc083038.concentric.net
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MN Maniac wrote:
>
> Due to the actions of your good buddy K04QC and a few other "holier than
> thou" HAM OPERATORS on the CB newsgroup, don't be surprised if a few of
> the regulars over there now begin showing up over here to return the fire.
  That should generate a few laughs!!!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: ko4qc <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 12:07:07 -0500
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58ueik$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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To: [e-mail]

Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> jim daneke <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >This goofball is over on another newsgroup telling people off and
> >basically showing what a bunch of high minded, arrogant #$@@# we can be.
> >I thought we were supposed to elmer people and help out? Some people in
> >the hobby, especially the ones in this newsgroup need to have a piece of
> >humble pie.
>
> >AB0DK/jim
>
> Sorry, Jimbo, but it's not our turn to watch KO4QC.  But if you think you ar
e
> the pie man, open up your bakery and go for the gold.
>
> 73, Jim KH2D
  Thanks Jim!This CBer with a(probably CW waivered,because his toe
hurts)Ham ticket has appointed himself 'guardian angel'of the CB group.
   I started out trying to give some friendly advise to a few of them
who were asking reasonable questions but several others who think it
'works this way because Big Buck says so' just couldnt handle the idea
that they could be wrong!
   Only reason I went back was to generate a chuckle!
                                   Ko4qC/Joel


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 16 Dec 1996 15:02:59 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Due to the actions of your good buddy K04QC and a few other "holier than
thou" HAM OPERATORS on the CB newsgroup, don't be surprised if a few of
the regulars over there now begin showing up over here to return the fire.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:08 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 02:36:21 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <59657d$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58ueik$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-1.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

jim daneke <[e-mail]> wrote:

>ko4qc wrote:


>>   Thanks Jim!This CBer with a(probably CW waivered,because his toe
>                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> hurts)Ham ticket has appointed himself 'guardian angel'of the CB group.
>>    I started out trying to give some friendly advise to a few of them
>> who were asking reasonable questions but several others who think it
>> 'works this way because Big Buck says so' just couldnt handle the idea
>> that they could be wrong!
>>    Only reason I went back was to generate a chuckle!
>>


>Nope...20 wpm...unlike you!

Well, Mr. Daneke, if you don't mind, I'd like to ask you a question.  Why are
you not on 7.002 working some DEEEX instead of patroling the CB newsgroups on
the lookout for stray hams ?   Are you an OO (Official Oddball) or are you an
undercover officer for the International Internet Radio Police ?

Raise you 15 and call.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!ss2.cs.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 01:41:22 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <596209$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-1.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>Due to the actions of your good buddy K04QC and a few other "holier than
>thou" HAM OPERATORS on the CB newsgroup, don't be surprised if a few of
>the regulars over there now begin showing up over here to return the fire.

We are worried, MN Maniac. If they are all like you, we'll probably cancel our

internet account.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!usenet.logical.net!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 17:18:53 -0700
Organization: Network Service
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58ueik$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59657d$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: den-co24-15.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 17  7:20:03 PM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Jim Kehler wrote:

>
> Well, Mr. Daneke, if you don't mind, I'd like to ask you a question.  Why ar
e
> you not on 7.002 working some DEEEX instead of patroling the CB newsgroups o
n
> the lookout for stray hams ?   Are you an OO (Official Oddball) or are you a
n
> undercover officer for the International Internet Radio Police ?
>
> Raise you 15 and call.
>
Well, Good Buddy...I'm a CBer too! 10-4? I'm not patrolling...just
reading and responding. By the way, I am an OO (official Oddball).
aren't we all?

See your 15 and 20 more!

AB0DK/Jim  Soon to be N0JD
Hamstick

73...Back at you


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!homer.alpha.net!uwm.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!netaxs.com!usenet
From: Jim Kelly <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Lambda ARC Public Listserv
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 09:35:38 -0500
Organization: Net Access - Philadelphia's Original ISP
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: chestnut1-8.slip.netaxs.com
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CC: Nick Altenbernd <[e-mail]>,
        don b <[e-mail]>, donny <[e-mail]>,
        Dan Lagerman <[e-mail]>, Kari <[e-mail]>

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

December 13, 1996

CONTACT: Nick Altenbernd, KA1MQX ([e-mail])
         Don Bledsoe, WB6LYI ([e-mail])

         LAMBDA AMATEUR RADIO CLUB ANNOUNCES NEW PUBLIC MAILING LIST --

         [e-mail]

        ===========================================================

The Lambda Amateur Radio Club (LARC) announces a public mailing list for
gay/lesbian/bisexual/transgendered ham radio operators, persons
interested in amateur ("ham") radio, electronics, and shortwave
listening, computer enthusiasts, and alll of LARC's friends and
supporters.

The mailing list is moderated and a wide variety of subjects of interest
to gay people everywhere are discussed, as well as technical topics
related to radio and computer operation.

TO SUBSCRIBE:
Send an E-Mail to:  [e-mail]
Leave the "Subject:" line of the message blank.
Message text must be: subscribe larc your_name [call]
<your_email_address>
Here's an example:

subscribe larc Joe Smith WB6LYI <[e-mail]>

If you are a licensed ham, you can add your callsign after your name. Be
sure to include the "<" and ">" before and after your E-Mail address as
in the example. An acknowledgment will be sent to you automatically.

        ===========================================================

FOR LARC MEMBERSHIP INFORMATION, visit our web site or request our
electronic brochure by sending an E-Mail to:

[e-mail]

Do not include any text in the message as the mail list software has not
yet learned to read.

VISIT LARC's WEB SITES:
                 http://www.netaxs.com/people/skeptic/larc/

http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywood/1686/
http://www.net-quest.com/larc/

(end)

--
Jim Kelly, Amateur Radio Licensee KK3K ([e-mail])  \
Member: Lambda Amateur Radio Club - Openly Gay and Proud!     \
Home Page URL: http://www.netaxs.com/~skeptic                / \
The closet relies on secrecy, not the right of privacy.     /   \


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: "Ken Reed" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Licensing
Date: 12 Dec 1996 11:01:01 -0700
Organization: Primenet Services for the Internet
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <01bbe856$55108c80$cf2a44c6@default>
References: <[e-mail]> <58an6f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Posted-By: @198.68.42.207 (gumdr)
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120578 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44274

> >Jim/KI0BB  By the way, I memorized the questions and have no idea the
> >difference
> >between a watt and a volt. The requirements say I have to pass the
> >test...Not
> >know the material.
>
> Gee, I hope the pilot of the next airliner I fly on didn't pass the
> FAA test the same way you passed the amateur tests...

That is truer than you think. The exam pool for a pilot's license is fully
available just as are the amateur radio questions. It is possible to
memorize every possible question and answer. Of course, the written exam
alone is but a small part of a pilot's training - it seemed to me to almost
be an after thought where it is the only exam given for a ham radio
license.

--
Ken Reed
KC7NPV
http://www.gumdr.com/gumdr

"Never look for bargains in
 health care or parachutes"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!super.zippo.com!zdc!zippo!drn
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: listserv  of  this
Date: 13 Dec 1996 05:40:26 -0800
Organization: Zip News
Lines: 6
Sender: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <58rmca$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 161.27.93.20

I am looking for listserv of this newsgroup.

Thanks

73 de IK1VCF
Fabrizio [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:14 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!mr.net!news.sgi.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!surfnet.nl!news.unisource.nl!news.worldonline.nl!usenet
From: "Dick Schuurs" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Loggingprogram
Date: 15 Dec 1996 08:59:46 GMT
Organization: World Online
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <01bbea63$cd5ce620$LocalHost@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dlft1-p55.worldonline.nl
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I am looking for a very good PC Logging-program for the HF bands. At this
moment i just started with a unregistered version of Log-EQF. I consider to
register to this program, to use al the facillities of this program, such
as the WAS, Prefix and DXCC modules, but a friend-amateur attended me to
the
DXbase logprogram (Scientific Solutions) as a very good and comprhensive
logging and DX-logging program.

Before i start to enter the logs of the qso's i already made into a
logprogram in my PC, i want to make the right choice for a good program,
otherwise i have to re-enter my logs  into another programs. So who can
give me some advise and tips about good and priceworthy loggingprograms and
about DXBase ?

73 de Dick , PA3GWL (the Netherlands)

[e-mail]
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!129.34.139.15!newsgate.watson.ibm.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!tbsnews.turner.com!usenet
From: Steve Bramham <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Loggingprogram
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 14:07:45 -0500
Organization: Turner Broadcasting Company
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbea63$cd5ce620$LocalHost@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: engpc12450.turner.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I)

Dick Schuurs wrote:
>
> I am looking for a very good PC Logging-program for the HF bands. At this
> moment i just started with a unregistered version of Log-EQF.
> 73 de Dick , PA3GWL (the Netherlands)
>
> I can highly recommend Prolog from Datamatrix. It is an excellent program wi
th outstanding tech support. No I do not work for the company.  Check the ARRL
 web page and look under software. The info to obtain a demo program is there.


I purchased the program and could not get the data interface to my Yaesu
FT-757GX2 to function.  I was called at home, they had me download some
new software for the Yaesu, and talked me in over the phone to make sure
everything was up running.

Check out Prolog, it works and you want find any better tech support.

Steve Bramham, WA4MPD


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:15 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!n1ist
From: [e-mail] (Michael L. Ardai)
Subject: Looking for Motorola Pageboy info
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Utopia Planetia Shipyards - Mars
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 18:39:59 GMT
Lines: 13
Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121040 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44604


I'd like to use Motorola Pageboy 2 voice pager as a remote-control receiver
for a system that I am working on.  Anyone have a schematic of the beast
or any idea on how to disable the beeping that signals an incoming page
and where to find a COR output?

Thanks very much for your help.
/mike

--
\|/      Michael L. Ardai        N1IST       [e-mail]       \|/
-*- ===  Boston Amateur Radio Club:  http://www.barc.org/barc   === -*-
/|\    or send "info barc-list" to [e-mail]     /|\


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:16 1996
From: [e-mail] (mark morgan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: LOTS OF HAM STUFF 4 SALE - 4salelis (1/1)
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 10:53:55 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.76.206.101
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 34
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!news.eagnet.com!

begin 644 4salelis
M=&\@=VAO;2!I="!M87D@8V]N8V5R;BP-"@T*=&AE<V4@:71E;7,@87)E(&9O
M<B!S86QE+@T*#0II8V]M(#<U,2!W:71H(&9I;'1E<G,L(&1I<F5C="!K97D@
M96YT<GDL(&1E<VL@;6EC+"!V;VEC92!M;V0L(&5X=&5N9&5D('AM:70N("`@
M("`X,#`N,#`-"F1R86ME($PW(&%M<&QI9FEE<B`Q-C`M,3!M+"`R:W<@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M(#@P,"XP,`T*;69J(#-K=R!V97)S871U;F5R(&%N=&5N;F$@='5N97(@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M,CDU+C`P#0IK86T@=&YC('=I=&@@<&%C=&]R(&)U="!N;W0@9RUT;W(@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`Q
M,#`N,#`-"FUF:B`Q,C<P('1N8R`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`U
M,"XP,`T*<&%C+6-O;2!H86YD:2!P86-K970@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@,3`P
M+C`P("`-"F-U<VAC<F%F="!2-2!H9B!V97)T:6-A;"!A;G1E;FYA(#$P+3(P
M;2`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`W
M-2XP,`T*:V5N=V]O9"!S<#<P,"`R;2!A;&P@;6]D92X@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@,S`P
M+C`P#0ID<F%K92`R;2!P;W)T86)L92P@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@,C4N
M,#`-"F-U<VAC<F%F="`R;2!B87-E(&%N=&5N;F$@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`U,"XP
M,`T*9&EA;6]N9"`R;2!B87-E(&%N=&5N;F$@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@(#4P+C`P
M#0IT:"TV(&AF(&)E96T@86YT96YN82!I;B!G;V]D(&-O;F1I=&EO;BX@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`R,#`N,#`-
M"FAA;2!)5B!R;W1O<B!W:71H(&-O;G1R;VQE<B`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@
M("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@("`@(#$P,"XP,`T*
M#0IA;F0@=&AA=',@86QL(&9O<B!N;W<N("!A;GEO;F4@8V%N(&-O;G1A8W0@
M;64@870@:&]M92`Y,3(M-S(Y+3,X-C<@;W(@96UA:6P@=W<Y>D!E86=N970N
M8V]M+"!B=70@;F]T(&)Y('!A8VME="!B96-A=7-E(&ET)W,@;F]T('5P+@T*
/#0IT:&%N:W,L#0H-"@T*
`
end


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Major Networks Drop CW !!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 06:11:18 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58s0a8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <56pmat$[e-mail]> <575eib$[e-mail]> <57m0sr$[e-mail]> <58c0l9$[e-mail]> <58jdkq$[e-mail]> <58qii1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-149.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>BTW, the USCG dropped CW from their roster several years ago. So did
>>>several international shore stations around the world this year. MARS
>>>also dropped CW this year and they not only save lives they brigthen
>>>them up as well :)

>>Most Catholic Priests have given up having sex.  Does that mean all
>>hams should too ?

>No ONE has suggested hams GIVE UP CW!!!

>The issue is giving up CW testing.

>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

I don't know what we'd do without you over there in Mt. Olive Township, NJ,
Bill.  You are just a clarification looking for a place to happen.  But, in
reference to your reference to what I said,  I was referring to what was
originally said regarding the Coast Guard, MARS, and international coastal
stations, none of which, I believe, ever had 'CW testing' in the first place,
so
I think you would be hard pressed to explain that KC5WCP was referring to
CW 'testing'.

But now that you mention it, I think you have an excellent idea. When the Coas
t
Guard, MARS, and international coastal stations give up CW testing, then we
should too.  After all, NBC, CBS, ABC, the PGA of America, the NFL and the
United Nations don't have CW testing, so why the hell should ham radio have it
,
right Bill ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!151.99.250.2!server-b.cs.interbusiness.it!usenet
From: Ferrari Maurizio <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: MANUAL RA137 need
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 17:17:01 -0800
Organization: C.S.E.L.T. spa
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: drogo.cselt.stet.it
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

Hello I am in need of a manual for a RA137 Racal VLF converter.   I will
pay all copying and
postage.  If anyone can help I'd really appreciate it!
Maurizio Ferrari
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.249.160.130!news.csranet.com!usenet
From: Hal Rosser W4PMJ <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: MFJ259 antenna analyzer
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 14:27:08 -0800
Organization: CSRA Internet Services
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: line048.csranet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32929 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121141

I just bought one of these jewels.
I'm sure there are folks out there with
helpful hints on using this to full advantage.
  If you are one of those with helpful tidbits
on using this MFJ 259, I would appreciate the info.
 (Yes, I do have the manual, but looking for
creative uses and applications)
Thanks and 73'S de W4PMJ
HAL
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!agate!usenet
From: Costas Spanos <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MFJ259 antenna analyzer
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 14:04:22 -0800
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: samos.eecs.berkeley.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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To: Hal Rosser W4PMJ <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32939 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121150

The 259 is great, but I did find out one thing using it: Try to do so
when the band is quiet. The 259 sends a small signal to the antenna and
is looking for reflected power. This signal level is very small, and
easily comparable with strong signals that your antenna might be
receiving at the time. Since the front end of the 259 is not very
selective, strong signals in nearby frequencies might also influence
the measurements.

I found out the hard way that measuring the 10m resonance on my antenna
is impossible when the CBers in my area are running serious power, for
example. When that happens, the SWR appears much greater than it is.

regards

Costas


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.253.4.5!news.bridge.net!news.magg.net!news
From: "Dale R. Parfitt" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MFJ259 antenna analyzer
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 18:57:47 -0500
Organization: PAR Electronics
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: wpb-102.magg.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win95; I)
To: Hal Rosser W4PMJ <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32951 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121170

Hal Rosser W4PMJ wrote:
>
> I just bought one of these jewels.
> I'm sure there are folks out there with
> helpful hints on using this to full advantage.
>   If you are one of those with helpful tidbits
> on using this MFJ 259, I would appreciate the info.
>  (Yes, I do have the manual, but looking for
> creative uses and applications)
> Thanks and 73'S de W4PMJ
> HAL
> [e-mail] in QST a couple of months back for just such an art
icle.

Dale W4OP


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-penn.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!wesley.videotron.net!wagner.spc.videotron.ca!news
From: [e-mail] (Eric Vincent)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Micor VHF Help!!!
Date: 18 Dec 1996 04:51:56 GMT
Organization: Personnel
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <597t9c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.96.136.38
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (beta 2)

Anybody can help me with this serial# (xmt43rtn-1100b), I know it's a Motorola

Micor VHF radio and no more.

If you can help me with that e-mail me at
Thank's...

[e-mail]
73'S  From VE2VXT, Quebec City.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.mathworks.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Max <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: MicroStrip Design WebPage
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 17:32:30 -0500
Organization: MF Enterprises
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.129.231
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net sci.electronics.design:28106 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120723

Hi,
You can now design your microstrip lines right on the web.
I have written a web page utilizing Microsoft VisualBasic Script
Language. You must use MS Internet Explorer 3.01 for it to work.
press to "Mstrip Calc" button at the bottom of the page and you will be
prompt for the Dielectric Constants, width and height of the
material,and the Impedance will be given.
Let me know what you think.
Thanks,
Max
http://members.aol.com/maxfro/private/mstrip.html


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!natinst.com!news-relay.us.dell.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 11:01:09 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Mizuho MX-15 15M HT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Sun Dec 15 15:43:54 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 199.176.228.139 (quest11.newaygo.mi.us)
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.0 (Win16; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 10
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:99715 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44413 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120773

Its a 15 meter HT ssb/cw w/built in RIT,vfo,key & signal/rf
meter.Has SP/mic,9v dc pwr & ext. key connections.300mw covers
21.1-21.150 & 21.35-21.4 mhz.Works great,looks very good.
Comes with ant.& manual in Japanese.
Whould like to trade towards one of the followibg:
Yaesu FT-690R II,Ten-Tec argonaut,MFJ 9406x,a Mizuho MX-6z
or a Icom IC-502 or 202.Thanks,Lew WD8AQS

-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (John Noker)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mods and mod-less
Date: 13 Dec 1996 06:13:32 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 5
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <58qs6c$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap5-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

Its human nature to modify (hopefully make better) anything we can.
Just curious: Is your car exactly as you bought it?   (no aftermarket
rims, windo tinting, stereos, etc.)  By the way, installation of a mobile
rig is a modification to your car.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsout1.alt.net!news1.alt.net!news.aa.net!ran.zipcon.net!usenet
From: "Program / Case Manager" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.radio.amateur,alt.radio.amateur.club,alt.radio.amateur.club.clarc,rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mods to the Yaesu FT-50R
Date: 18 Dec 1996 18:28:45 GMT
Organization: Winners of Washington
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <01bbed10$e0380d10$d787c7cd@sci>
NNTP-Posting-Host: smeg.zipcon.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1157
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44619 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22159 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121066

Anyone know of mods to the Yaesu FT-50R?



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.177.71.9!viper.shadow.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (cRiTTa66)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.amateur,alt.radio.amateur.club,alt.radio.amateur.club.clarc,rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mods to the Yaesu FT-50R
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 00:33:08 GMT
Organization: iNdependent
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <32b88d2d.1592327@news>
References: <01bbed10$e0380d10$d787c7cd@sci>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-mia-92.shadow.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44626 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22170 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121081

On 18 Dec 1996 18:28:45 GMT, "Program / Case Manager"
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Anyone know of mods to the Yaesu FT-50R?
>
www.shadow.net/~critta66/ft50.html


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!newshub.tc.umn.edu!newsstand.tc.umn.edu!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.radio.amateur,alt.radio.amateur.club,alt.radio.amateur.club.clarc,rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mods to the Yaesu FT-50R
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 07:06:21 GMT
Organization: University of Minnesota
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbed10$e0380d10$d787c7cd@sci>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pub-19-a-190.dialup.umn.edu
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Mods and more at http://members.gnn.com/hca/ft50


"Program / Case Manager" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Anyone know of mods to the Yaesu FT-50R?
>



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.mr.net!dawn.mmm.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary Hosler)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.amateur,alt.radio.amateur.club,alt.radio.amateur.club.clarc,rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mods to the Yaesu FT-50R
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 15:08:32 GMT
Organization: 3M - St. Paul, MN  55144-1000 US
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <59bluu$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbed10$e0380d10$d787c7cd@sci>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44652 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22182 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121112

"Program / Case Manager" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Anyone know of mods to the Yaesu FT-50R?

What is it that you are trying to modify?  Something not working
properly?  Could you be a bit more specific?

de KN0Z  Gary

Opinions expressed herein are my own and may not represent those of my employe
r.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!venus.sun.com!news2me.EBay.Sun.COM!newsworthy.West.Sun.COM!news70.West.Sun.COM!myers
From: [e-mail] (Dana Myers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: More 1928 radio stuff (was: Pro CW? ...)
Date: 21 Dec 1996 00:18:19 GMT
Organization: SunSoft South, Los Angeles, CA
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <59facb$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <59a11k$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sunspot.west.sun.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121253 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44457 rec.radio.shortwave:90846

In article <59a11k$[e-mail]>,
James W. KELLEY <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In article <595ndm$[e-mail]>,
>Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Okay, how about just a two-question exam:
>>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station; label
>>all component values.
>>2. Explain the purpose of each component.
>>(Taken from the 1928 exam.)
>>
>>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
>>
>
>Ever take a look at the schematic of a 1928 radio Jeff?  Has about 4 parts.

Jeff has not only looked at the schematics of a 1928 radio, he's
posted such a schematic in ASCII art once or twice...  I'll bet
he's in Lake Tahoe without net.access right now

;-)


--
 * Dana H. Myers K6JQ, DoD#: j  | Views expressed here are mine and should *
 * [phone]               | not be interpreted or represented as     *
 * [e-mail]      | those of Sun Microsystems, Inc.          *



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.58.0.35!news.structured.net!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: More 1928 radio stuff (was: Pro CW? ...)
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Date: 21 Dec 1996 09:16:07 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <59g9sn$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <59a11k$[e-mail]> <59facb$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121286 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44472 rec.radio.shortwave:90870

 James W. KELLEY <[e-mail]> wrote:
 >Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]> wrote:
 >
 >>Okay, how about just a two-question exam:
 >>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station; label
 >>all component values.
 >>2. Explain the purpose of each component.
 >>(Taken from the 1928 exam.)
 >>
 >>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
 >>
 >
Ever take a look at the schematic of a 1928 radio Jeff?  Has about 4 parts.

4 parts? Even a simple crystal set has that many. A complete amateur
station has a lot more than that.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](michael silva)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: More 1928 radio stuff (was: Pro CW? ...)
Date: 21 Dec 1996 15:40:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <59h0dp$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <59a11k$[e-mail]> <59facb$[e-mail]> <59g9sn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: val-ca1-02.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 21  7:40:41 AM PST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121316 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44485 rec.radio.shortwave:90882

In <59g9sn$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
>
> James W. KELLEY <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >
> >>Okay, how about just a two-question exam:
> >>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station; label
> >>all component values.
> >>2. Explain the purpose of each component.
> >>(Taken from the 1928 exam.)
> >>
> >>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
> >>
> >
>Ever take a look at the schematic of a 1928 radio Jeff?  Has about 4
parts.
>
>4 parts? Even a simple crystal set has that many. A complete amateur
>station has a lot more than that.

As one with clearly too much time on my hands I pulled out my treasured
1931 Handbook (close enough?) and counted 15 parts in the basic 2-tube
regen, and 26 in the MOPA transmitter.  Add a handful for RX batteries
and TX power supply and you're at 50 or more.

(I'm just glad Jim didn't claim there were only 4 parts in a '50s
vintage color TV...that would have shot my whole holiday!)

73,
Mike, KK6GM



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: More amateur related definitions
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 20:10:31 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv15.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

Due to the tremendous amount of e-mail on this topic, I am pleased to
provide further examples of amateur related definitions.

DISCLAIMER

these definitions represent my personal opinion of those they resemble.
Any similarity between actual amateurs living or dead, OR dead and too
stupid to realize it is purely on purpose.  IN OTHER WORDS..if the shoe
fits....

Narcissism  noun  self-love, excessive interest in one's own appearance,
comfort, importance, abilities, etc.  EXAMPLE:  I have the following
technological marvels in my house/apartment/sailboat

meglomania noun  a mental disorder characterized by delusions of
grandeur, wealth and power.  see Buckmaster database under WA6VSE

well that covers tonights topic

10 meter contest went fairly well.  17000+ points for 6 hours fun.  Some
interesting opening directly to LU land and the W6 area.

2 new states and 1 new country.  Lat at night ragchewed alot.  Actually
qso'd with someone in Midwest who knows Carl personally.  Actually works
with him.  Not what you would call a flattering recommendation for
someone who's so technological advanced as my pal and friend .

73, keep dx'ing, contesting, ragchewing.  Just remember, the only reason
the ARS ever developed this great techotoys was just so that someone
could talk farther and to more people longer
--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:35 1996
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From: Erich <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: More Bad Publicity
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 20:44:30 -0800
Organization: Wombatech
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: annex167.ridgecrest.ca.us
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

I just saw that Richard A. Burton (ex KG6GKS...) just made the front
page of the Metro section in the LA Times.  According to the report,
he has the distinction of being the only ham ever jailed for
broadcasting
without a license.  The FCC issued him a callsign in error after he
came off his latest probation and then revoked the license when it
realized what it had done (typical bureaucratic response).

My main complaint is:  Why is it that stuff like this makes the
headlines?  We have enough problems in ham radio without getting
another black eye from the mainline media.  We need to make sure
our other contributions get recognized.

73, Erich   KA6AMD


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.68.191.16!news.accessone.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: More Bad Publicity
Date: 14 Dec 1996 03:28:11 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58t6sb$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vbook.accessone.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>I just saw that Richard A. Burton (ex KG6GKS...) just made the front
>page of the Metro section in the LA Times.  According to the report,
>he has the distinction of being the only ham ever jailed for
>broadcasting
>without a license.  The FCC issued him a callsign in error after he
>came off his latest probation and then revoked the license when it
>realized what it had done (typical bureaucratic response).
>
>My main complaint is:  Why is it that stuff like this makes the
>headlines?  We have enough problems in ham radio without getting
>another black eye from the mainline media.  We need to make sure
>our other contributions get recognized.
>
>73, Erich   KA6AMD

Probably the FCC issued a press release. The news editor saw the press release

and possibly assigned a reporter or just copied the release mostly verbatim.

The moral to the story: When you see positive news, be sure to publicize it.
Write press releases and send them to your media outlets. Talk to your local
news editor. They are hungry for news.

Ed, http://www.hamradio-online.com
------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!wcnews01.ops.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: More Lawsuits....
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:35:06 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <58vln4$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t2ck$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-158.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120738 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44230

[e-mail] wrote:

> ... you defame my character and integrity

You don't have any.   Nothing there to defame.  And don't start whining about
class action lawsuits, you don't have any class either, and action obviously
isn't one of your finer points.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: More Lawsuits....
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 03:46:56 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <5910jf$[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t2ck$[e-mail]> <58vln4$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-149.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120746 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44234

[e-mail] (Mark Schneider) wrote:

>On Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:35:06 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
>wrote:

>>[e-mail] wrote:
>>
>>> ... you defame my character and integrity
>>
>>You don't have any.   Nothing there to defame.  And don't start whining abou
t
>>class action lawsuits, you don't have any class either, and action obviously
>>isn't one of your finer points.
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D
>>

>What a fucking Dork.

>***************************************************************
>* [e-mail]                                     *

>*                                                             *
>* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
>*    Manchester, NH                                           *
>***************************************************************

You know, Mark, I have often thought that about Squiggie myself, but I am real
ly
glad that you typed it instead of me.  Intelligent comments like yours are wha
t
we need to keep these discussions lively and to help maintain the high image o
f
amateur radio that we present here in the newsgroups.  We appreciate your
participation.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: More Lawsuits....
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:25:59 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t2ck$[e-mail]> <58vln4$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 67.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120817 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44268

Mark Schneider wrote:
>
> On Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:35:06 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
> wrote:
>
> >[e-mail] wrote:
>
> What a fucking Dork.
>
> ***************************************************************
> * [e-mail]                                     *
> *                                                             *
> * Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
> *    Manchester, NH                                           *
> ***************************************************************

A dork can have sex?
More than I can say for hams.

--
#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:43 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: More Lawsuits....
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 00:12:15 -0700
Organization: Goddnet (telesoft)
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t2ck$[e-mail]> <58vln4$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5910jf$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <591dqa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120834 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44271

Mark Schneider wrote:
>
> On Sun, 15 Dec 1996 07:32:24 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
> wrote:
>
> >[e-mail] (Mark Schneider) wrote:
> >
> >First Mark Said:
> >>
> >>
> >>>What a fucking Dork.
> >>
[SNIP]
You know, we have a group of hams to do this on the air here in Phoenix,
Az. They are called "the loose cannon's". They spout all kinds of foul
language, talk about taboo subjects (like sexual acts, etc) on the air!
These guys even blame someone else when they interfered with! I wonder
why? I come on here expecting a more mature crowd, and its C.B. radio
and "loose cannon's" all over again.

I know I might be belaboring the point a bit, but I have found that
those who use excessively foul laguage are often intellectually
immature, and quite often inept. So, I'll let you children play.

Mery Christmas....


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.232.56.18!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Mark Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: More Lawsuits....
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 12:33:58 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58526d$[e-mail]> <585cbv$[e-mail]> <587qbt$[e-mail]> <58acor$[e-mail]> <58o4nd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qglj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t2ck$[e-mail]> <58vln4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d7.mnh.nh.ultra.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120839 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44275

On Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:35:06 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
wrote:

>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>> ... you defame my character and integrity
>
>You don't have any.   Nothing there to defame.  And don't start whining about
>class action lawsuits, you don't have any class either, and action obviously
>isn't one of your finer points.
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
>

What a fucking Dork.


***************************************************************
* [e-mail]                                     *

*                                                             *
* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
*    Manchester, NH                                           *
***************************************************************
.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.228.128.20!jaring.my!news2.jaring.my!usenet
From: [e-mail] (TEO ZEE VON)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: MORSE CODE SOFTWARE
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 18:12:53 GMT
Organization: Unconfigured
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <59c0os$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: j6.srg4.jaring.my
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

DO ANAYONE HAVE MORSE CODE SOFTWARE, PLEASE ATTACH THE SOFTWARE TO ME
THROUGH E-MAIL.email address= [e-mail]
thank you



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MOTOROLA PAGERS
Date: 12 Dec 1996 04:41:19 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <58o2df$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

<[e-mail]> wrote:
>Motorola Bravo Pagers  $155.00
>$44.00 per month service available, just prepay 10 years, all 55 states
>available.
>Email me or pee on my web page:
>wwww.angelfart.comehere/bizzaro/bugger/indexfinger.hmo

Could you please try to limit your ads to say, twice per month, instead
of daily? (Even that would violate our group's charter, though.)

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!van-bc!news.rmii.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MOTOROLA PAGERS
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 14:54:26 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58suuo$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default> <01bbe85e$df862160$8b7174cf@default>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-168.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I recieved the following from Evan,


>He said he really loves me and wanted to meet me.  But he refused when he
>found out I was over 18 years old.


>HOW DO I STOP THIS GUY FROM EMAILING AND CONTACTING ME?

Easy, One. Just call AT&T and cancel your internet account.  That should do it
.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!admaix.sunydutchess.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!newstand.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!mr.net!visi.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mount suggestions needed
Date: 14 Dec 1996 23:36:20 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <58vv84$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

Well, I just traded in my old Explorer for a new Expedition.
Now, however, I need suggestions on a mount for my HF antenna.
Before I merely had a SS ball mount on the side of the truck.
However, I can't bring myself to drill a hole in this new toy.

Does anyone have a recommendation for a hamstick mount, as in
a bumper mount?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news1.bellglobal.com!thunder.mgl.ca!usenet
From: wayne <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mount suggestions needed
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 14:29:23 -0500
Organization: MGL Systems Internet
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vv84$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tornado25.mgl.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

Michael P. Deignan wrote:
>
> Well, I just traded in my old Explorer for a new Expedition.
> Now, however, I need suggestions on a mount for my HF antenna.
> Before I merely had a SS ball mount on the side of the truck.
> However, I can't bring myself to drill a hole in this new toy.
>
> Does anyone have a recommendation for a hamstick mount, as in
> a bumper mount?
>
> MD
> --
> --
> --  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
> --
> --  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.
Mike

I have the same problem and I have 2 solutions.

1) Get a Hustler Bumper mount and use it but be sure to ground the mount
to the frame.

2) If you have a trailer hitch weld a piece of galvanized flat metal to
it and put a Radio Shack 3/8" Ant. mount to it and that provides a good
ground and sturdy one also. This can also be welded to the frame and
have a person who works on Iron Railings bend it so that it goes up and
molds to your bmper shape.

[e-mail]
(VE3JET)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:50 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!ais.net!noc.van.hookup.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!freenet.unbc.edu!news.scn.org!scn.org!bb840
From: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Subject: Re: Mount suggestions needed
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Organization: Seattle Community Network
References: <58vv84$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 19:48:52 GMT
Lines: 16


In a previous article, [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) says:

>
>Well, I just traded in my old Explorer for a new Expedition.
>Now, however, I need suggestions on a mount for my HF antenna.
>Before I merely had a SS ball mount on the side of the truck.
>However, I can't bring myself to drill a hole in this new toy.
>
>Does anyone have a recommendation for a hamstick mount, as in
>a bumper mount?
>
You might consider something that will mount or bolt to a trailer hitch.
--
Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:51 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mount suggestions needed
Date: 18 Dec 1996 05:11:26 GMT
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In article <58vv84$[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) writes:

>Well, I just traded in my old Explorer for a new Expedition.
>Now, however, I need suggestions on a mount for my HF antenna.
>Before I merely had a SS ball mount on the side of the truck.
>However, I can't bring myself to drill a hole in this new toy.
>
>Does anyone have a recommendation for a hamstick mount, as in
>a bumper mount?
>
>

I have three basic suggestions.  First is the Tenna Hitch, which attaches
to the type of ball hitch used for towing a trailer or boat.  They aren't
usable while towing usually, but most people aren't constantly towing.
They advertise semi-regularly in CQ & QST.

2nd, is the Dream whip magnet mount, which if you have a metallic roof,
works rather well.  The down side is that if you aren't careful, you will
scratch the roof.  Additionally on some vehicles, the body isn't bonded
together well enough, so grounding straps have to be added to get an
effective and consistent ground.

Third, the people who produce hamsticks, (Lakeview), used to have a mount
which went off to the side of vehicles, preferably on the driver's side,
on the underside.  You take out bolts on the frame, and put in bolts which
were slightly longer for it to work.  Finding the bolts is/was the most
difficult part, and usually, the dealer has or can order them in the
proper length.  You can also use a properly shaped piece of stainless
steel in the same way, which is drilled to accept the normal 3/8 inch
hardware, and drilled so that bolts can pass through and attach it to the
frame.  I even knew a silent key, who welded on a mount to the underframe
in the same way.  73 de n8blk/3  -art clemons-


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:52 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mount suggestions needed
Date: 17 Dec 1996 00:50:38 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <595cbe$[e-mail]>
References: <58vv84$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>, James Aeschliman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>You might consider something that will mount or bolt to a trailer hitch.

I thought of that, but am afraid it would interfere with me towing
around my boat.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:53 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Mount suggestions needed
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <58vv84$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 11:24:22 GMT
Lines: 40

In article <58vv84$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (M
ichael P. Deignan) writes:
>Well, I just traded in my old Explorer for a new Expedition.
>Now, however, I need suggestions on a mount for my HF antenna.
>Before I merely had a SS ball mount on the side of the truck.
>However, I can't bring myself to drill a hole in this new toy.
>
>Does anyone have a recommendation for a hamstick mount, as in
>a bumper mount?

I don't recomend bumper mounts on a SUV body. The radiation center
of the antenna will be below the body line, and performance will be
poor. As you drive, wind whipping of the antenna will grossly detune
it as the distance between its radiation center and the adjacent
vertical body panel changes, causing wild SWR variations to the rig.
(And of course you can't open the rear hatch without removing the
antenna.)

You need to either get the radiation center well above the body
(preferred), or well away from the body. One way to do the latter
is with an extended trailer hitch mount. This interferes with
hatch opening too, but it works better than a bumper mount. If
you have a Class III hitch, you can use a quick disconnect trailer
tongue so you can easily remove the antenna when you want to
open the hatch.

Better though is one of the three magnet HF antenna mounts placed
on the roof. (They don't offer enough body groundplane coupling
capacitively, however, so be sure to use a ground strap from the
antenna base to the nearest attachment point, a roof rack mount
point will do.)

I just went through this with my Cherokee. Bumper mounts are
definitely *not* the way to go on a SUV or van.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:54 1996
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Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 18:49:08 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Mount suggestions needed
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: None today, thank you
References: <58vv84$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595cbe$[e-mail]>
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In article <595cbe$[e-mail]>,
  [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

 James Aeschliman wrote:
>
> >You might consider something that will mount or bolt to a trailer hitch.
>

KD1HZ wrote:

>
> I thought of that, but am afraid it would interfere with me towing
> around my boat.
>

I've seen a model which doesn't interfere with the normal use of
the trailer hitch.  Essentially it is a "plate" which places the
antenna off to the side of the trailer ball, and is held in place
by the bolt which holds the hitch-ball.

73, de Hans, K0HB
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:55 1996
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From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: My "paranoia"
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 13:15:51 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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> P.S.: Why not be bold , and use my ENTIRE statement?

I wasn't trying to obfuscate anything. I just hate scrolling through
reams of quoted posts to get to the (typically) one or two pithy
comments at the end. So I try not to do that myself.

I really don't have any quarrel with you, so let's not drag this on.
Maybe I'm the one who's disillusioned into thinking that ham radio is
not *really* in danger. Be assured that, if I felt it truly was, I would
be on the SAME side as you, Dave. And I even have paranoid fantasies of
being stopped by a State Trooper on my evening commute who says "Excuse
me sir, but what kind of radio is that in your truck?" I then proudly
whip out my FCC-approved U.S. Amateur Radio Operator's license (Extra
Class), which he is thoroughly unimpressed with, and then he takes me in
and confiscates my radio (Icom 706). I am then forced to sue the State
Police for possession of my rightfully owned equipment, which by that
time has disappeared somewhere in the bureaucratic maze and probably
lies in fragments in a closet somewhere.

So I'm not totally naive, either.

==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:57 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: My "paranoia"
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 21:07:23 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58r0e8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-150.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>To all:
>         Yes, I do have a few problems. A: I am dislexic. B: I'm as dumb
>as a post. In fact, If you put my brain up against that of the post, the
>post would run rings around me. C: yes, I do get passionate about certian
>things. D: That does Not make me paranoid, unless several million other
>hams are as well. I have a big problem. I love this hobby with every
>fiber of my being, and Never would do anything to harm it. Yes, i am also
>aware that 20 gazillion people worldwide do not have access to it. Wich
>has been my point all along. I do not want to see the U.S. join those
>masses. Certian people will say that I make the hobby look bad. Was the
>ECPA of 1986 just a figment of my imagination? Was the arrest of that
>young ham in Kentucky for carrying a HT wich some cop mistook for a
>scanner just another paranoid delusion? But I ramble. Maybe ishould just
>shut up, and forget about such things...Not on your life, Roger! I love
>this hobby too much to see it die. I will not stand idly by and watch it
>go down the tubes in passive silence. If this is acting paranoid, I revel
>in it!
>                                 73's,
>                             Dave/ KB2ZYO
>              P.S.: Why not be bold , and use my ENTIRE statement? Cut
>and Paste Is a wonderful tool ,don't you know...Like all things it can be
>used...And abused.

No need to apolgize Dave.  Look at Carl.  He's A) disGUSTING and B) DUMBER
than a post.  So don't be paranoid, be HAPPIE !!

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:58 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: My "paranoia"
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 10:17:57 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 22
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To all:
         Yes, I do have a few problems. A: I am dislexic. B: I'm as dumb
as a post. In fact, If you put my brain up against that of the post, the
post would run rings around me. C: yes, I do get passionate about certian
things. D: That does Not make me paranoid, unless several million other
hams are as well. I have a big problem. I love this hobby with every
fiber of my being, and Never would do anything to harm it. Yes, i am also
aware that 20 gazillion people worldwide do not have access to it. Wich
has been my point all along. I do not want to see the U.S. join those
masses. Certian people will say that I make the hobby look bad. Was the
ECPA of 1986 just a figment of my imagination? Was the arrest of that
young ham in Kentucky for carrying a HT wich some cop mistook for a
scanner just another paranoid delusion? But I ramble. Maybe ishould just
shut up, and forget about such things...Not on your life, Roger! I love
this hobby too much to see it die. I will not stand idly by and watch it
go down the tubes in passive silence. If this is acting paranoid, I revel
in it!
                                 73's,
                             Dave/ KB2ZYO
              P.S.: Why not be bold , and use my ENTIRE statement? Cut
and Paste Is a wonderful tool ,don't you know...Like all things it can be
used...And abused.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:58 1996
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From: "David Lawson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need a Relay & a Place 2 Get 1 !
Date: 13 Dec 1996 02:26:02 GMT
Organization: Digital Designs
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <01bbe89c$9654c260$[e-mail]>
References: <58l3sa$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port-113.ime.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



Bad  Dog <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<58l3sa$[e-mail]>...
> Help I need a Relay !!!   I own this older 10 meter/6 meter amplifier
> (AfterBurner  Model# 403) and it has been in the closet for a few years
so I
> took it apart and thought I should clean the relay (it looked kinda
dirty)
> Well, after the file treatment things don't seem to be as flat as they
> should and now the realy shoots sparks when you key up. So know I went on

> this search in the net and can't find nothing about a Relay. I even check

> all the parts catalogs I have and nobody has a simple Relay. Can Anybody
out
> there help me find the right parts people? If so please help me I need a
> Relay and I need a new parts catalog  Thanx :)
>
try PEP BOYS, if they don't have a "Relay", try www.digikey.com


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:13:59 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need advice on best HT for ARES work
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 09:26:24 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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To Any Elmer:
          I am an ARES voulenteer out of Manhattan; And I need some
advice. I have an htx- 202, but I use it as my Base station, as my living
situation will not allow me certian luxuries at this time.I need to know
what would be the BEST 2m. or Dual band type of ht I could invest in for
under $400 wich would hold up under the most severe stress and weather
conditions one could imagine, and one that would hold a charge longer
than the attention of Bevis and Butthead. Any and all advice would be
greatly accepted and appreciated.
                         73's,and Merry Xmas to one and all,
                                Dave/ KB2ZYO AT:[e-mail]
            I WANT TO BELIVE.......


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (HamMan67)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need advice on best HT for ARES work
Date: 16 Dec 1996 06:36:24 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

I would seriously consider a FT-530...used slightly you can find plenty
for 250-350$ and they take a lickin and keep on ticking. THey also have
just about any option you might need for emergency comms.

Rich


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:01 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Mustang Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Help Identifying This HF Antenna
Date: 12 Dec 1996 13:56:07 GMT
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58p2tn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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From your GIF image, I'd say it's a HyGain 18-AVT five-band vertical.
I can't help with a manual, but at least you know what it is now.  :)

--
Dean W. Hemphill                      Email: [e-mail]
211 Addison Place
PO Box 328                            Home:  [phone]
Lake Dallas, Texas 75065-0328         Work:  [phone]
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Amateur radio operator K5DH, avid QRPer and CW op, VE (ARRL and W5YI)
Ford Mustang enthusiast ('66 coupe, '69 GT-350, '72 conv, '95 GT conv)
Die-cast model car collector (mainly Ford products, in all scales)
Plastic model car builder (mainly Ford products, 1:24 / 1:25 scale)
Glass insulator collector (specializing in "oddball" pieces)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:02 1996
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Help Identifying This HF Antenna
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 18:14:20 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58p2tn$[e-mail]>
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I concur...it looks like an 18 AVT/WB from the graphic, although your
description is a little confusing. I don't know about extra sections for
"phone" use.

Contact Telex/Hy-Gain. They are good about providing manuals free or for
just a few bucks.

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:04 1996
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From: Dave Earnest <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Help Identifying This HF Antenna
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 11:29:04 -0800
Organization: Lost in the Silicon Valley
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: noc2.arc.nasa.gov
Mime-Version: 1.0
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To: Douglas Gavilanes <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32662 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44243 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120503

Douglas Gavilanes wrote:
>
Looks like a Hustler 4 or 5-BTV? (Newtronics)


> I installed this HF multiband vertical at my QTH about 8 years ago, and
> it was about 8 years old (though new in the box) back then, and now I
> can't find the paperwork on the antenna.  I put it up anticipating an
> upgrade to General eventually, but never found the time to upgrade, so
> it has gone without use all this time.  It stands about 30 feet tall or
> so, and required radials for each band, in the configuration that I
> assembled it in.  I seem to remember assembling it for CW use, but now
> wish to operate phone on 10M. Does anyone out there recognize it?
> Better yet, does anyone have a copy of the assembly instructions that I
> could obtain a copy of?  I still have the additional two tubing segments
> required for phone use, which were never installed.  Help!
>
> An eyeballed GIF image is attached for your entertainment (hi-hi).  >:)
>
> TNX es 73s,
>
> Doug Gavilanes, N6XQY
> Garden Grove, California
>
>     ---------------------------------------------------------------
>  [Image]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.172.16.9!news.LASER.NET!usenet
From: [e-mail] (sean hall)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Help Identifying This HF Antenna
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 10:47:03 GMT
Organization: LaserNet
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ffx67.laser.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
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On Wed, 11 Dec 1996 23:38:42 -0800, Douglas Gavilanes
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
>--------------164F2A015918
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>I installed this HF multiband vertical at my QTH about 8 years ago, and
>it was about 8 years old (though new in the box) back then, and now I
>can't find the paperwork on the antenna.  I put it up anticipating an
>upgrade to General eventually, but never found the time to upgrade, so
>it has gone without use all this time.  It stands about 30 feet tall or
>so, and required radials for each band, in the configuration that I
>assembled it in.  I seem to remember assembling it for CW use, but now
>wish to operate phone on 10M. Does anyone out there recognize it?
>Better yet, does anyone have a copy of the assembly instructions that I
>could obtain a copy of?  I still have the additional two tubing segments
>required for phone use, which were never installed.  Help!
>
>An eyeballed GIF image is attached for your entertainment (hi-hi).  >:)
>
>TNX es 73s,
>
>Doug Gavilanes, N6XQY
>Garden Grove, California



It's a HUSTLER 4BTV (maybe a 5BTV).   It might work fairly well on
10-40 meters, but it's worthless on 75-80.  They're about $139 new
now.

73/sean hall
W1SWH



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newshub.csu.net!alpha.sky.net!news
From: Mike Watson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Help Identifying This HF Antenna
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 15:39:48 -0600
Organization: SkyNET Corporation
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip62.sky.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32947 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44690 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121164

Douglas Gavilanes wrote:
>
> I installed this HF multiband vertical at my QTH about 8 years ago, and
> it was about 8 years old (though new in the box) back then, and now I
> can't find the paperwork on the antenna.  I put it up anticipating an
> upgrade to General eventually, but never found the time to upgrade, so
> it has gone without use all this time.  It stands about 30 feet tall or
> so, and required radials for each band, in the configuration that I
> assembled it in.  I seem to remember assembling it for CW use, but now
> wish to operate phone on 10M. Does anyone out there recognize it?
> Better yet, does anyone have a copy of the assembly instructions that I
> could obtain a copy of?  I still have the additional two tubing segments
> required for phone use, which were never installed.  Help!
>
> An eyeballed GIF image is attached for your entertainment (hi-hi).  >:)
>
> TNX es 73s,
>
> Doug Gavilanes, N6XQY
> Garden Grove, California
>
>
Your antenna is a Hy-Gain 18AVT-WB.  I had two of 'em.  They're still be
sold by Hy-Gain.

Mike Watson
WB0IKT


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!38.8.16.2!psinntp!psinntp!news.intercon.com!news.ssnet.com!news.pcnet.com!newsin.iconnet.net!world5.bellatlantic.net!markbond
From: [e-mail] (Mark S. Bond)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Opinions on AZDEN 6m Handheld
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 02:20:13 -0500
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58s6ao$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: client-127-14.bellatlantic.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.6

In article <58s6ao$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
(Scott Sidener) wrote:

> I am thinking about buying Azden's 6m handheld radio.
>
> I was wondering if anyone had any experiance with this radio and had
> any comments they could provide (both bad and good).

Scott, a friend had one and had much difficulty programming it. From what I
can remember the sequence is confusing and awkward. By the time you
read/follow the directions the thing times out. It did work well though...

73 de Mark

--
   .-.                                                         .-.
  /   \           .-.                           .-.           /   \
 /     \         /   \       .-.     .-.       /   \         /     \
/_______Mark_S_Bond__W2MB___/___\___/___\[e-mail]_\
         \     /       \   /     `-'     \   /       \     /
          \   /         `-'               `-'         \   /
           `-'                                         `-'


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Opinions on AZDEN 6m Handheld
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 09:40:23 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58s6ao$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs229.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I)

Scott Sidener wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I am thinking about buying Azden's 6m handheld radio.
>
> I was wondering if anyone had any experiance with this radio and had
> any comments they could provide (both bad and good).
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott Sidener
> N0WFL
> [e-mail]

Hi Scott.
I'll second Mark's comments on programming. It programs a bit differently, but
 works
well. Once you learn their programming methods, it's not too hard to do. I als
o have
their PCS-7500H 50 6 meter mobile. Again, programming is strange, but it works
 well.

--
Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:11 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!news.rain.org!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Leigh)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need Opinions on AZDEN 6m Handheld
Date: 21 Dec 1996 01:25:56 GMT
Organization: Regional Alliance for Information Networking (RAIN)
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <59feb4$ao2$[e-mail]>
References: <58s6ao$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: coyote.rain.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

Another minor negative aspect of the Azden 6m handheld is that it has no
low battery warning, unlike almost all other modern HTs.

I bought my AZ-61 HT for a mere 100 bucks from someone who got tired of
its battery going dead and dumping all the memories.  In the two years
that I've owned it, I've only had one memory dump, however.

Yes, its programming is indeed strange, but there are no other 6 meter HTs
on the market.

--Leigh Marrin/KM6JE in Santa Barbara/DM04.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!compuserve.com!news.production.compuserve.com!news
From: viny Coppola <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,sci.electronics.design
Subject: Need Yig Oscillator, Xband
Date: 11 Dec 1996 17:35:53 GMT
Organization: CompuServe, Inc. (1-800-689-0736)
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <58mrdp$4hs$[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:21964 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120329 sci.electronics.design:27824


Looking for a Yig Oscillator to cover around 9 to 12 ghz, for
building a homebrew sweeper.

Thanks,
VINY N1VC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.he.net!calweb!news.campus.mci.net!news.telis.org!s21-pm05-ontro-t.telis.org!user
From: [e-mail] (wb6siv)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: New Concept! Cybersched Your Next DX and Satellite Contact!
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:15:14 -0800
Organization: Raymond Sarrio Co.
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s21-pm05-ontro-t.telis.org

This is a new use of the WWW that can benefit ham radio operators
throughout the world.

You can now schedule contacts with hams all over the world simply and
easily by using the WWW and e-mail.I have set aside a section of my web
site http://www.sarrio.com for hams to post their request for over-the-air
schedules. Included in each posting is a place to list the posters
specific ham radio contact needs (countries, zones,IOTA, grid squares
ect...). The postings will also include an e-mail link that will allow
hams that read the posts, to easily request an over-the-air schedule.

How Can Cyberscheds work for me?

Do you need a certain state to complete a WAS award? Are you just a few
countries away from a DXCC? Are you a QRP operator looking to make
contacts with hams all over the world? Are you a DX station that has grown
tired of the stateside pile-ups on 20 meters? Or are you going mobile into
a hard to work county?

In all the above examples you could have prearranged cyberscheds with
those hams that you want to work. If band conditions are poor just e-mail
the hams you could not work and set up a new schedule.

Cyberscheds are a simple way to have the internet work to the benefit of
hams all over the world.

All posting will stay on-line for 6 months, or until the posting is asked
to be deleted. Below is an example of one cyberpost visit the cyberpost
page and view them all. Below is an example of one of the postings:

Station: BV/N0IAT


Name: Joe Fitter
QTH: Taipei, TAIWAN Republic of China
Bands: 40/20/17/15/10
Mode: CW (occasional SSB, but not much)
Comments: Looking for South America, Central America, and Carribean QSO's.
I QRV from a
neighbors shack (local law), so operating times are limited to station
availability. QSL via my CBA --
I DO NOT accept IRC's or Greenbacks, just please send me your QSL card and
a route for returning
the favor.
Post Date: Sept. 6, 1996
--
The Raymond Sarrio Co. a full feature Ham Radio Storefront and web site develo
per. Located at http://www.sarrio.com.

In association with Brillar Enterprises http://win-win.com/brillar provider of
 discount CD-Roms!



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.233.85.167!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: New E-net Adress
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:32:38 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <58hbau$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58acou$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-15.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>Hi Dad,
>    Yep, we got it. Matter of fact, the whole world got it.  Glad to hear the

>cataract surgery went OK.  Very speedy. Too bad the doctor doesn't charge
>by the hour instead of by the eye.
>    No snow on our island, although it did get pretty chilly here tonite, it
was

>down to 79 degrees.  Winters in the Pacific get colder every year.
>    Glad to hear Mom is feeling better.  Give Mom a kiss for me.  You two
>have a Merry Christmas. Keep in touch.  Let me know if you don't get this.

>Bye for Now,
>Jim KH2D

Hahahah! Rolling on the floor laughing my keester off!

     jim, wk1v





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:15 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: new ham questions
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 18:14:47 GMT
Lines: 38
Sender: [e-mail]

Will White ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Hi--

:    I just bought my first 2/70cm HT(Yaesu FT-50R) and am excited about
: the hobby. I am studying for the Tech-Plus exam, and am looking for
: info on ham activities in the centrral Arizona area. Are there BBS,
: newsgroup, or IRC resources here? Also, I would like to know if there
: are retailers other than Ham Radio Outlet in the area, especially
: offering used equipment. I would like to get on 6m soon, and wonder if
: 2/6m gear is made, other than ICOM's IC-706, which is a great rig, but
: out of my price range. Thanks.

Hi, Will.  We were just in the Phoenix area for the ARRL Southwestern
Division Convention a couple of months ago.  There seemed to be quite a lot
of activity in the area.

You might check out AES; they sell used gear via mailorder.  Or subscribe to
the newsgroup rec.radio.swap; all sorts of equipment is sold there.
AES has a Web page, and I believe the used gear is listed there.

As far as I recall, the IC-706 (I have one, BTW; great radio!) is the first
*all-mode* rig to have 6/2m in the same box; someone will undoubtedly
correct me if that's incorrect.  Well, there's the Yaesu FT-736R that has
2m/70cm standard, and you can buy a 6m module, but you're talking > $2,000.

Icom's IC-275 is a nice rig, but pricey even if used (2m only) and they used
to make a 6/10m model; the IC-575, I believe; also not cheap.

Good luck, and let me know if you have other questions.

73 de Jim -KF6CR









From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.89.123.24!nntp.inet.fi!news.funet.fi!news.kbfi.ee!news
From: "Borovikov" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: New program for amateur radio - HAMshack for Windows.
Date: 12 Dec 1996 17:34:32 GMT
Organization: Balti-N
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <01bbe852$be97c3c0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: balti-n.estpak.ee
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

HAMshack for windows on html://www.balti-n.estpak.ee/hamshack
Log, Rig control (only KENWOOD now), TNC, Awards, Contests, full Prefix
database, QSL  print.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!194.87.0.28!demos!demos2!dnews-server
From: "Borovikov" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: New program for amateur radio - HAMshack for Windows.
Date: 12 Dec 1996 17:59:32 GMT
Organization: Balti-N
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <01bbe856$3b9877e0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: balti-n.estpak.ee
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

HAMshack for Windows on html://www.balti-n.estpak.ee/hamshack
Log, Rig control (only KENWOOD now), TNC, Awards, Contests, full Prefix
database, QSL  print.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:18 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.heurikon.com!loops.cs.wisc.edu!frankensun.altair.com!newshost.comco.com!news.tamu.edu!bcm.tmc.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!199.171.190.20!news.deltanet.com!usenet
From: "Roger A. McCarty" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: New Wed Site
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 14:08:05 -0800
Organization: Accurate! Electronics
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: anx-arl0041.deltanet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

New Web Site at;

http://www.geocities.com/~kd6cc

Bug reports welcome

Thanks

Roger KD6CC

--
Accurate!
   Electronics

Roger A. McCarty
Riverside, CA  USA
http://www.accurate-electronics.com
http://www.geocities.com/~kd6cc


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:40:59 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <58ocub$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587tnl$[e-mail]> <5884oi$[e-mail]> <588gru$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120393 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44123

In <[e-mail]>, Paul Christensen <[e-mail]> writes:
>Carl Stevenson wrote:
>
>> we could easily field stuff
>> at ISDN rates TODAY ... if there were enough people willing to adopt it
>> instead of thrashing the channels at 1200 baud and bitching "a new TNC?
>> Hell no, I just spent $129 on this one in '92 ... and it doesn't even
>> have any tubes in it!"
>>
>> Carl - wa6vse
>> [e-mail]
>
>Yes!  But it's not CW that's holding the hobby back.  The upper UHF
>spectrum is a natural for the development and use of these ideas, not
>HF.


NO, Paul ... NOT for modes designed for HF, where the propagation
characteristics and channel impairments are VERY different than at
VHF/UHF ...  to develop and test things for HF, access to HF is
required.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:20 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:55:27 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <58odpf$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120394 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44124

In <[e-mail]>, Jim Conn <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>Dropping theory testing may not be as far-fetched as you think. In 1984,
>the FCC dropped all license requirements for Private Land Mobile Radio
>Service, Private Operational Fixed Microwave Service, General Mobile
>Radio Service, and Radio Control Services. This meant that anyone can
>install, maintain and repair transmitting equipment in any of the private
>two-way radio services, with no license required at all. If the
>station license holder's equipment is found to be operating improperly,
>the station license holder is held responsible. The same process could be
>used with amateurs - if the equipment is operated improperly, fine and/or
>revoke the license of the station license holder.

As usual, Jim's arguments are absurd ... in the PLMRS, radio is simply a
"tool" the 2-way radio in a taxi, for example ... the operator has
virtually NO control over the radio, other than PTT ... and the owner of
the fleet PAYS a PROFESSIONAL to service, adjust, and maintain the
radios.  ALL of the radios are "type accepted" ... if they're not, they
are illegal to use in the PLMRS ... this, plus the "marketplace forces"
(if you don't fix my radios, right, I'll not hire you again), PLUS
technician certification by industry organizations, keeps the level of
competence reasonably decent ...

Hams, on the other hand, are allowed to build and tewak and twiddle and
do all manned of things to their radios ... there are no "marketplace
forces" and no economic incentives (the taxi company loses LOTS of money
if their radios don't work) to tend to assure compliance ... PLUS the
ARS is *supposed* to be a *technical* activity of operation,
experimentation, and self-education in radio and electronics technology.

All of these factors bode heavily in favor of the idea that the FCC is
unlikely to EVER consider dropping theory tests for ham licenses,
despite Jim Conn's desire to raise that spectre in  order to generate
irrational fears in hopes of promoting  his pro-code agenda.

>Licenses were retained for Aviation and Maritime Radio Services because
>of the requirements of international law.
>
>I opposed the changes in '84, but they have not turned out to be a bad
>thing, in spite of all the dire predictions by myself and others. Now I
>likewise oppose dropping the Morse code and theory tests. But if the
>dropping of either Morse or theory testing (or both) comes to pass, it
>may not turn out to be a bad thing for ham radio, either. One can only
>hope that will be the case.

See, the sky did *not* fall when the traditional licensing structure was
modified in 1984 ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



>
>73,
>Jim - AD4VL
>
>



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:44:19 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58od4j$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, Paul Christensen <[e-mail]> writes:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>>
>> Carl I still cant understand why you cant do all this Super Duper Great
>> Digital Technology on VHF and UHF, is there some reason this Great Digital
>> Technology wont work there, or is it  Because you cant Pick up a Mic and
>> talk on HF.
>
>
>Exactly.  Does anyone really think that all these "young and brilliant"
>minds are going to come into the hobby in droves without an HF CW
>requirement.  What's impetus?  That whopping fast 300 baud packet?

NO, I'm talking about new things that will blow away all of that stuff
in terms of performance ... something like 2 orders of magnitude or more
improvement ...

>The technology and future of the hobby is not being thwarted by an HF CW
>requirement.  The focus should be on upper UHF spectrum and above where
>we can apply LAN speed and spread spectrum technologies.

HF is a natural for spread spectrum and other digital techniques which
can combat the channel impairments FAR better than something as stupid
as OOK Morse and a crappy wetware modem ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:23 1996
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From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 10:28:19 -0800
Organization: Florida Coastal School of Law
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Curtis Wheeler wrote:

> I would disagree that the technical knowledge requirements for
> broadcasting have been reduced to zero.  I don't believe that a
> broadcast station could stay in compliance with the required technical
> standards without competent personnel.  There is still a defacto
> knowledge requirement.

In the licensing sense, yes they have Curtis.  As a result of this, many
broadcast stations, primarily AM  *are* out of compliance.  My point is
that in an area where the public interest, convenience and necessity is
at stake, the FCC has decided that the operator licensing requirement for
these relatively high-power operations is no longer necessary.  Don't
argue with fact Curtis.

Where in Part 73 do you see any mention of a "de facto" knowledge
standard for broadcasting.  I recently finished with more than 25 years
in AM/FM/TV broadcasting, and nothing could be further from the truth
with regard to the competancy of the station's staff.  In fact, it varies
from market to market, ranging from excellent to atrocious, to absolutely
no technical staff whatsoever in the case of small market AM stations.  I
persoanally know of *several* directional AM stations in this market
alone that are non-compliant, and only employ the use of a contract
engineer for emergency, "off-the-air" purposes.

> But licensing the professionals at a broadcast station did help the
> station licensees.  The station owners knew that when they hired a
> licensed individual they were getting someone that had something at
> stake - The idividuals license (and "employability") was on the line if
> he was incompetent.

Absolutely.  But with the elimination of the licensing requirement, the
onus for regulatory compliance now rests solely with the station owner.
This is nothing new, by the way. The rules pertaining to this were
adopted several years ago.  As a result, many engineers (my self
included) have decided to find ancillary careers elsewhere.

> Eliminating most of these op license requirements was a "business" move
> by the FCC.  The benefits of the FCC administering licenses for
> idviduals were not worth the hassle.

True.  So for the sake of public interest, convenience and necessity, the
Commission eliminated the licensing requirement.  Perhaps the FCC should
adopt a new phrase: "In the business interest, convenience and
necessity."

> "Theory" testing is needed since amateurs are permitted to do a lot of
> unsupervised technical work and experimentation in an international
> service.  We need to know that operators meet a minimum knowledge
> standard - The only practical way to do that is through written tests.
> I am not prepared to support any significant relaxation of the written
> exam standards.
Neither am I, nor do I advocate the elimination of CW testing if the
preponderance of amateurs elect to retain it.

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:24 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 07:12:52 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]>
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In article <58od4j$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> NO, I'm talking about new things that will blow away all of that stuff
> in terms of performance ... something like 2 orders of magnitude or more
> improvement ...
>
>
>
> HF is a natural for spread spectrum and other digital techniques which
> can combat the channel impairments FAR better than something as stupid
> as OOK Morse and a crappy wetware modem ...
>

And YOU have had access to HF for 20+ years..so WHERE"S THE STUFF??
Or are you letting other people do the work and you'll take credit for
it??  That would fit the profile

> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
>
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:25 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 19:32:21 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120517 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44153

Paul Christensen wrote:
>
> Curtis Wheeler wrote:
>
> > I would disagree that the technical knowledge requirements for
> > broadcasting have been reduced to zero.  I don't believe that a
> > broadcast station could stay in compliance with the required technical
> > standards without competent personnel.  There is still a defacto
> > knowledge requirement.
>
> In the licensing sense, yes they have Curtis.  As a result of this, many
> broadcast stations, primarily AM  *are* out of compliance.  My point is
> that in an area where the public interest, convenience and necessity is
> at stake, the FCC has decided that the operator licensing requirement for
> these relatively high-power operations is no longer necessary.  Don't
> argue with fact Curtis.

Some of this is probably indeed fact.  I don't evaluate the technical
compliance of radio or TV stations.  But if "many broadcast stations"
are out of compliance it sounds like the FCC has an
monitoring/enforcement problem.  But I will agree that not requiring
indivduals to be licensed (or in some way setting a standard) may
contribute to the problem.  But let's face it, it would not matter if
someone was licensed or not if there was no threat of enforcement
action.  There are licensed hams that knowingly violate technical
standards but there is no fear of enforcement of minor stuff.

So I am not arguing with your facts but I would question where you lie
the blame.

> Where in Part 73 do you see any mention of a "de facto" knowledge
> standard for broadcasting.

There is no mention of "de facto" standards in part 73.  If the
requirements were actaully there in the regs I wouldn't have used that
term.

I think you are unwittingly supporting my point of view...  I said that
a broadcast station would find it difficult to comply with technical
standards if they didn't have competent personnel.  You are supporting
that view when you say that many broadcast stations are out of
compliance and blame it on incompetent personnel.  In other words - if
you want to be compliant, it "requires" qualified people.

Regards

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:27 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 13 Dec 1996 03:25:14 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <58qiaq$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>In article <58od4j$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>>
>> NO, I'm talking about new things that will blow away all of that stuff
>> in terms of performance ... something like 2 orders of magnitude or more
>> improvement ...
>> HF is a natural for spread spectrum and other digital techniques which
>> can combat the channel impairments FAR better than something as stupid
>> as OOK Morse and a crappy wetware modem ...
>>
>
>And YOU have had access to HF for 20+ years..so WHERE"S THE STUFF??
>Or are you letting other people do the work and you'll take credit for
>it??  That would fit the profile

Steve ... one last time on this issue ... the 80/40/15/10m Novice
segments that a tech+ can use are the worst trash of all of the ham
bands ... that spectrum is largely unusable much of the time ... and
when it is usable, most of it is CW-only for techs ...

That's not "having access to HF for 20+ years" ...

I respond here not in hopes of reaching Steve ... only to clarify his
distortions, garbage, and slander for other readers ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:28 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 00:45:11 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qiaq$[e-mail]>
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In article <58qiaq$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>
> Steve ... one last time on this issue ... the 80/40/15/10m Novice
> segments that a tech+ can use are the worst trash of all of the ham
> bands ... that spectrum is largely unusable much of the time ... and
> when it is usable, most of it is CW-only for techs ...
>
> That's not "having access to HF for 20+ years" ...

HMMMM lemme see.  The bands you reference are not HF??  You'd know,
you're the whizzie bang electronics RF engineer with patent (singular,
not plural).  But what about the HF access you have through work???  Or
do you need a secret hamshake to get to use those allocations??

You're a fraud..face it Carl.


>
> I respond here not in hopes of reaching Steve ... only to clarify his
> distortions, garbage, and slander for other readers ...
>

Please don;t clarify on my behalf.  Oh Carl, if anything it would
probably be libel, as slander is something vocal (as in talking) and
libel as in written.  Just my opinion, but I think you speak out your
arse again.


> Carl - wa6vse
> [e-mail]
> When is 10M not HF??
> When I says so, that's when
>

--
Steve KF2TI (Advanced Class Licensee)
ARRL LIFE Member


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:30 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 03:16:49 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <58t671$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qiaq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2T
I (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>HMMMM lemme see.  The bands you reference are not HF??

I said I did not consider the piddly, mostly useless, trashed with
foreign broadcast, CW only (for tech+) novice segments to constitute "HF
access" ... sort of like a "light beer" doesn't quite cut it ...

>You'd know, you're the whizzie bang electronics RF engineer with
>patent (singular, not plural).

No,Steve patentS, plural ... it doesn't matter what you think, I just
like to point out that you don't know what the hell you're blabbering
about ... as usual.

>But what about the HF access you have through work???  Or
>do you need a secret hamshake to get to use those allocations??

I don't have "HF acces through work" ...  like I said ...  you don't
know what the hell you're blabbering about ...  as usual.

>You're a fraud..face it Carl.

No, Steve, I'm an accomplished RF engineer, and a ham ... you're just an
idiot ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:32 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 03:22:04 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <58t6gs$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <588gru$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ocub$[e-mail]> <58r6p9$[e-mail]>
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In <58r6p9$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>In article <58ocub$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>NO, Paul ... NOT for modes designed for HF, where the propagation
>>characteristics and channel impairments are VERY different than at
>>VHF/UHF ...  to develop and test things for HF, access to HF is
>>required.
>
>Right. Just like those who design aircraft must also be licensed pilots?
>I suppose you believe the Yaesu, Kenwood, and Icom engineers are all
>licensed hams?
>
>Anyone who desires to do research into new HF modes certainly does not
>need a license to do so.
>

Wrong ... the sorts of DSP algorithms that would be used must be tested
under real propagation conditions ... channel characteristics at VHF/UHF
are NOTHING like those at HF ... or do you propose that I be required to
invest $50-100k or so to build a hardware/software channel simulator?  I
am technically capable of doing that ...  I've built them before in
the course of employment, but they took a LOT of time and money to
build ...  no way could I justify that investment to develop ham radio
gear as a home project ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:33 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 05:25:18 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58rtjv$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:


>HF is a natural for spread spectrum and other digital techniques which
>can combat the channel impairments FAR better than something as stupid
>as OOK Morse and a crappy wetware modem ...

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

So THAT's you problem, Squiggie. A crappy wetware modem.  I thought so.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:34 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 04:12:08 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58t9ci$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qiaq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58t671$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Steve - KF2
TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>>
>>HMMMM lemme see.  The bands you reference are not HF??

>I said I did not consider the piddly, mostly useless, trashed with
>foreign broadcast, CW only (for tech+) novice segments to constitute "HF
>access" ... sort of like a "light beer" doesn't quite cut it ...

I can say from personal experience that this is untrue.
When I was a novice (and rockbound to about 7 frequencies
on 40 meters and 15 meters) I worked all states and
over 80 countries CW.   It wasn't easy; after all, I was
using a 50 watt Ten-Tec TX-100 crystal CW transmitter
and a Hammarlund HQ-110 receiever with a BFO to do it.

Perhaps your definition of "useless" is anything that fails to
come over your CRT with 100% copy, like internet email and usenet?

Dick WD0ANB





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:35 1996
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 09:32:47 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <587tnl$[e-mail]> <5884oi$[e-mail]> <588gru$[e-mail]>
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On 6 Dec 1996 07:09:50 GMT, [e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:

>In <5884oi$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>>
>>>Hams are NOT corporate managers ... we can choose to experiment with the
>>>esoteric ideas at home
>>
>>Possibly experimentation for self gratification.   Experimentation
>>at home in the sense of doing something that has never been done
>>before is highly unlikely these days.
>
>Why? ... I think that's a pretty pessimistic assertion ... and I don't
>think it's true ... the only reason I can see it being unlikely is that
>the current rules drive away most of the technically competent folks who
>might become hams (I've got 5 or 6 in my own department at work right
>now who say "Morse code? Give me a break!") and the majority of the
>remaining beepers wouldn't know what to do or where to start if you put
>a gun to their heads ...
>
>>Once the advances are made, then people like
>>you and me can apply them at home to do self-gratifying things (like
>>programming DSP chips).
>
>I can develop new algorithms at home that do new and wonderful things
>.. I don't have to design and fab the DSP chip to make advances ...
>
>>If you're trying to impress people at the mall, you'll find that
>>people are impressed more by things that virtually no one can
>>do, as opposed to things that everyone is doing.
>
>Cellphones can't talk (directly, without toll charges) to distant states
>and foreign countries ... packet radio computer networks would dazzle
>folks if we could drag enough critical mass of beepers off of their
>damned "DX clusters" and get them to spend a couple of bucks to upgrade
>from 1200 baud AFSK to something decent ... we could easily field stuff
>at ISDN rates TODAY ... if there were enough people willing to adopt it
>instead of thrashing the channels at 1200 baud and bitching "a new TNC?
>Hell no, I just spent $129 on this one in '92 ... and it doesn't even
>have any tubes in it!"
>
>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]
>
>
Pac-Sats have been around for a while or do you mean a very expensive
land-based WAN?  The guamese guy sez his Gandpa Lenny could have built
a vacuum state TNC in 1952 if there wasn't a code requirement.


To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:36 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 21:13:45 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <58v5a9$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <58rtjv$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-27.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58rtjv$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writ
es:
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>
>>HF is a natural for spread spectrum and other digital techniques which
>>can combat the channel impairments FAR better than something as stupid
>>as OOK Morse and a crappy wetware modem ...
>
>>Carl - wa6vse
>>[e-mail]
>
>So THAT's you problem, Squiggie. A crappy wetware modem.  I thought so.

Jim,

The point is tha ANY wetware modem is, by definition, crappy ...
compared to a decent hardware/software implementation, that is.

It's simply fact that we can devise modulation methods and modems
therefore that run rings around CW and can provide reliable
communications in conditions where CW signals cannot even begin to be
heard at all, let alone copied by ear.

That you choose to continue to ignore these facts does not these facts
change or invalidate.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 14 Dec 1996 21:24:36 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <58v5uk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <588gru$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ocub$[e-mail]> <58r6p9$[e-mail]> <58t6gs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120716 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44216

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (A.G. von Luterno
w) writes:
Carl, not everyone is like you or the folks (HI Burt!) you
>know, many of us work for chump change compared to you.

Maybe if you learned something about modern technology you could get a
decent job, rather than "working for chump change" as *you* put it.
Having learned something of use in today's increasingly technical world,
you *might* even cease to be such a chump.

>You babble upon how the no-code licensees are looked upon as second
>class hams but you look down on everyone who is not as technically
>skilled as you.

No ... I don't expect everyone to be a preofessional with 25+years of
experience designing state-of-the-art military and commercial RF gear.
I have said that those with *no* interest in radio (other than as a
device to "yack and play games on") are not real hams and belong in one
of the non-technical personal communications services (like CB or GMRS).

Carl there is room in the ARS for all kinds of people,
>many of which are not professional EEs. Its a mix, some contest, some
>DX, some experiment, some just want to chew the rag and some wll drop
>their lives for 6/8 weeks to provide their skills for humanity in
>times of need. If ham radio became the domain of just one of those
>groups, how boring would it be? You wouldn't know, you just admitted
>you, with a big toy box, cannot do what you claim all hams should be
>able to do.

I guess I don't get what you're saying in the last sentence above ...

>Steve cancels your vote, the guamese guy cancels Grandpa  Lenny's
>vote.  Myself? I'll be an extra by WARC-99. No vanity call and no way
>I want my novice call (it ended in KN which sucks on CW), it's for
>personal satisfaction. I'll put forth the effort and do it, not wait
>until I get it all without working for it! No-code HF yes, all HF
>no-code, I vote no, its three to two.

Fortunately for the future of ham radio, you are not the deciding vote
.. that will lie with the FCC ... I hope they have the wisdom to do
what's right for the future of ham radio, rather than what may be
popular with a large group of backward, stagnant incumbents ...
they're *supposed* to ... we'll see if they actually do ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.72.128.98!news.icix.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 16 Dec 1996 07:13:10 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <592sq6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58ocub$[e-mail]> <58r6p9$[e-mail]> <58t6gs$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120835 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44272

In article <58t6gs$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In <58r6p9$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>>In article <58ocub$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>NO, Paul ... NOT for modes designed for HF, where the propagation
>>>characteristics and channel impairments are VERY different than at
>>>VHF/UHF ...  to develop and test things for HF, access to HF is
>>>required.

>>Right. Just like those who design aircraft must also be licensed pilots?
>>I suppose you believe the Yaesu, Kenwood, and Icom engineers are all
>>licensed hams?
>>
>>Anyone who desires to do research into new HF modes certainly does not
>>need a license to do so.

>Wrong ... the sorts of DSP algorithms that would be used must be tested
>under real propagation conditions ... channel characteristics at VHF/UHF
>are NOTHING like those at HF ... or do you propose that I be required to
>invest $50-100k or so to build a hardware/software channel simulator?  I
>am technically capable of doing that ...  I've built them before in
>the course of employment, but they took a LOT of time and money to
>build ...  no way could I justify that investment to develop ham radio
>gear as a home project ...

If someone is altruistic enough to devote their life to conducting
said research for the benefit of amateur radio, lack of a license
shouldn't stop them. They could go to any radio club and find a
licensed volunteer to be present during such on the air tests.

Besides, I don't believe that all propagation studies in the history
of radio were conducted *only* on the amateur HF bands, Carl.

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mci.com!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 16 Dec 1996 05:53:41 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <592o55$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <58od4j$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> NO, I'm talking about new things that will blow away all of that stuff
> in terms of performance ... something like 2 orders of magnitude or more
> improvement ...
>
> HF is a natural for spread spectrum and other digital techniques which
> can combat the channel impairments FAR better than something as stupid
> as OOK Morse and a crappy wetware modem ...

You can only communication in real time as fast as your typing speed.
On the average, that's about twice what one can do on code. So what's
the big deal? Can someone build rigs using these new modes from scratch
on their bench? If not, why are you advocating use of equipment that's
out of reach of the homebrewers? You scold the amateur community for
not being technical enough, yet by wanting "new things that will blow
away all of that stuff..." you're removing the lower rungs of that
homebrew ladder. Bad boy.

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news1.best.com!newshub1.home.com!newshub.internex.net!masters0.news.internex.net!205
From: [e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 96 00:25:03 GMT
Organization: InterNex Information Services 1-800-595-3333
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <594pml$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pythagoras.org
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120916 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44314

In article <[e-mail]>,
   Tony <[e-mail]> wrote:
>When your backs against the wall, with a wire, transistor and crystal,
>as slow as I am I can send a message around the world in an emergency.

I think you'd set a new QRPP record with that.


Have they ever had a contest that attempts to simulate this sort of situation?

Each contestant would start out with a specified box of parts to make a
minimal transmitter, big multipliers for distance your signal is heard, and
even bigger for getting on the air quickly.

I suppose it could be a special category at Field Day.

Logistics of running such a contest would be horrendous, but this vision of
whipping together a transmitter out of spare parts and getting the message
through with it is so pervasive here, that I am sure such a contest would
be very popular.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 17 Dec 1996 22:42:57 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <594pml$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120965 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44333

>Have they ever had a contest that attempts to simulate this sort of situation
?
>Each contestant would start out with a specified box of parts to make a
>minimal transmitter, big multipliers for distance your signal is heard, and
>even bigger for getting on the air quickly.

I think this would be kind of cool.  I think we need more 'building stuff'
contests than we have now.  Maybe just a simple homebrew gadget contest
with various categories where we could build stuff, and have it judged
for appearance, reliability, innovation, usefulness, etc.

Maybe that's how you get hams into construction. Make it a contest.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Carl R. Stevenson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 18 Dec 1996 01:54:26 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <597isi$[e-mail]>
References: <587tnl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58od4j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <592o55$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Carl R. Stevenson)
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-05.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <592o55$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>
>You can only communication in real time as fast as your typing speed.
>On the average, that's about twice what one can do on code. So what's
>the big deal?

The point is that, if I can transmit my data in a high-speed burst that
takes 1/10 the time and the other side of the QSO transmits the same
way, then we've used 2/10 of the available channel capacity ... that
means that 8/10 of the channel capacity is available for other QSOs ...
which would support 4 additional QSOs in the same spectrum ...

In practice, OOK Morse has such a low data rate (and the rate can be
further reduced by a great deal by using more effective coding schemes
than Morse) that, as has been discussed, it would be possible to support
many thousands of simultaneous "CW-equivalent" QSOs in only 200kHz of HF
spectrum. (The user interface could have the same "look and feel" as
today's OOK Morse ... i.e. a key/keyer and a speaker/headphones that go
beep)

>Can someone build rigs using these new modes from scratch
>on their bench?

Certainly ... why not?  THe myth that only simple Morse transmitters and
receivers are possibly built at home is just that ... a myth ... and it
does ham radio a GREAT disservice ...

>If not, why are you advocating use of equipment that's
>out of reach of the homebrewers?

I'm not ... just set your sights a tiny bit higher ... you can do it ...
try learning something new for a change ... I promise it won't kill you
..

>You scold the amateur community for
>not being technical enough, yet by wanting "new things that will blow
>away all of that stuff..." you're removing the lower rungs of that
>homebrew ladder. Bad boy.

Not so ... I didn't say that you can't build OOK Morse gear ... just
refuted your claim that anything else is "too hard" ... I get accused of
"whining" about the code ...  I never said "it's too HARD ..."  I just
said it's a total waste of time ... stop whining and build something
better than simple CW gear <grin>

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!netcom.net.uk!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 12:06:47 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga10-08.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 18  6:06:46 AM CST 1996
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121005 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44344

On 18 Dec 1996 03:07:33 GMT, [e-mail]
(cathryn) wrote:

>>>8, 1996). Greg WD5IVD and Dewayne WA8DZP are the STA holders. There
>>>are about two dozen stations currently under the STA but more can be
>>>added. Dewayne is also the area coordinator in California so if you
>>>really want to get involved with this new technology contact him.
>
>SS in California?  Does any one have an email or web page for wa8dzp?
>Where are these guys?  I'm in Berkeley.
>
>
Hi Cathryn

The TAPR web site is at the URL
        http://www.tapr.org/
and the spread spectrum index is at
        http://www.tapr.org/ss/index.html
E-mail for WA8DZP
        [e-mail]

73 de n4jvp
Fritz
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Date: 18 Dec 1996 03:16:07 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <582pgb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121008 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44346

>>>The bandwidths available on the HF bands are based on the idea that
>>>"narrower is *always* "better" ... that is a false premise and the rules
>>>should be changed to permit wider band modes that would allow many new
>>>modes and systems to be implemented ...  Gary and I have each proposed

Here, here.  I don't know who said this, but I agree.  Would it work to allow
wider bandwidth signals on HF below something like 250 mw?



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:46 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!cbgw2.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No quarrels
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 10:00:57 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: esoterica.pez.bell-labs.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

> If you were to shove my brain up a gnat's ass, it would
> rattle around like a b.b. in a fifty gallon drum.

You made me laugh with that one!

> I humbly ask that we declare peace

Of course! It's the Holiday Season... :)
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!world1.bellatlantic.net!out2.nntp.cais.net!in1.nntp.cais.net!van-bc!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!usenet
From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 17:52:07 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dtburr.pr.mcs.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>
> Just received a kooky email from some nut claiming to be net control of
> the 3894.5 kc mess. Forget the code debate - we need to implement a
> personality test to keep those with defective social skills off the air.
> Jeff KH2PZ
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> From [e-mail] Tue Dec 17 16:26:28 1996
> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:32:08 -1000
> From: "Martin, Sr. A Chittum" <[e-mail]>
> Subject: 3894.5 Information Base
> Dear Radio Amateurs,
> Thank you for your enquiry concerning 3894.5 KHz.  I am pleased to hear
> that you have taken an interest in the nightly happenings on the Mother
> of All Freakin' Seas.  Everything occurring there happens by my decree or
> through my permission.  Please feel free to ask any questions that you
> may have concerning the current state of affairs on that frequency.  I
> have added your names and call signs to our list of interested stations.
> I would enjoy hearing from each one of you.  Thanks again and have a
> pleasant holiday season.
> Best Wishes,
> Martin


Uhhhhh....my guess is that his response was tongue-in-cheek. What on
earth has happened to our sense of humor?

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.152.0.23!news.atl.bellsouth.net!usenet
From: james o'brien <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 22:56:56 -0800
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d01005.atl.bellsouth.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-BSNET  (Win16; U)

Dave Burr wrote:
>
> Jeffrey Herman wrote:
> >
> > Just received a kooky email from some nut claiming to be net control of
> > the 3894.5 kc mess. Forget the code debate - we need to implement a
> > personality test to keep those with defective social skills off the air.
> > Jeff KH2PZ
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> > From [e-mail] Tue Dec 17 16:26:28 1996
> > Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:32:08 -1000
> > From: "Martin, Sr. A Chittum" <[e-mail]>
> > Subject: 3894.5 Information Base
> > Dear Radio Amateurs,
> > Thank you for your enquiry concerning 3894.5 KHz.  I am pleased to hear
> > that you have taken an interest in the nightly happenings on the Mother
> > of All Freakin' Seas.  Everything occurring there happens by my decree or
> > through my permission.  Please feel free to ask any questions that you
> > may have concerning the current state of affairs on that frequency.  I
> > have added your names and call signs to our list of interested stations.
> > I would enjoy hearing from each one of you.  Thanks again and have a
> > pleasant holiday season.
> > Best Wishes,
> > Martin
>
> Uhhhhh....my guess is that his response was tongue-in-cheek. What on
> earth has happened to our sense of humor?
>
> Dave
> K9XK


For real! He's on the west coast and can't even hear the 3894.5 mess.
It's hilarious to see someone mention social skills that does'nt have a
personality OR a sense of humour! Amazing!! Merry Christmas Dave Jim


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:49 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!141.211.63.150!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: 20 Dec 1996 15:30:24 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>
> Just received a kooky email from some nut claiming to be net control of
> the 3894.5 kc mess. Forget the code debate - we need to implement a
> personality test to keep those with defective social skills off the air.
> Jeff KH2PZ

Gee, Jeff, I thought CW was supposed to be such an effective lid filter
(?)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:50 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!afn53940
From: [e-mail] (Timothy Haller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: 20 Dec 1996 14:18:36 GMT
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <59e77s$[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: freenet4.afn.org
NNTP-Posting-User: afn53940
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

> Dear Radio Amateurs,
> Thank you for your enquiry concerning 3894.5 KHz.  I am pleased to hear
> that you have taken an interest in the nightly happenings on the Mother
> of All Freakin' Seas.  Everything occurring there happens by my decree or
> through my permission.  Please feel free to ask any questions that you
> may have concerning the current state of affairs on that frequency.  I
> have added your names and call signs to our list of interested stations.
> I would enjoy hearing from each one of you.  Thanks again and have a
> pleasant holiday season.
> Best Wishes,
> Martin

--
Has anyone besides me got unwanted e mail from this jerk? i have sent a
couple of e mails to his postmaster who is not doing a thing about it.











Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
He pushes his his
fists and still in-
sists he sees the
ghosts.
 from stephen king`s
book It


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:51 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!newshost.convex.com!newsgate.duke.edu!solaris.cc.vt.edu!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Overfelt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: 20 Dec 1996 17:56:29 GMT
Organization: Your Organization
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <59ek0d$[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]> <59e77s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: jimo.mine.vt.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

Dear Tim, do you have an Amateur Radio license? I checked one database and
found nothing on your name.  Anytime you POST your opinions then YOU ARE ASKIN
G
for replies and comments.  Don't get upset by someone sending you opinions,
just delete them, the email that is.

Have a Safe and wonderful Holiday Season,

Kemo Sabie



>--
>Has anyone besides me got unwanted e mail from this jerk? i have sent a
>couple of e mails to his postmaster who is not doing a thing about it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Timothy Haller
>[e-mail]
>He pushes his his
>fists and still in-
>sists he sees the
>ghosts.
> from stephen king`s
>book It



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-server.ncren.net!ntwrks.com!usenet
From: Lambda <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 19:11:31 -0500
Organization: Lambda Technologies
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]> <59e77s$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp46.ntwrks.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

Tim:  Funny, but we all are getting unwanted e-mail from YOU.  I think
you and all of us are being spamed, so pretend it was a 2 meter jammer
and ignore it...and don't air it here, please.  Todd ELlis, N2XL

PS.  see my response to Jeffery Herman, please.

Timothy Haller wrote:
>
> > Dear Radio Amateurs,
> > Thank you for your enquiry concerning 3894.5 KHz.  I am pleased to hear
> > that you have taken an interest in the nightly happenings on the Mother
> > of All Freakin' Seas.  Everything occurring there happens by my decree or
> > through my permission.  Please feel free to ask any questions that you
> > may have concerning the current state of affairs on that frequency.  I
> > have added your names and call signs to our list of interested stations.
> > I would enjoy hearing from each one of you.  Thanks again and have a
> > pleasant holiday season.
> > Best Wishes,
> > Martin
>
> --
> Has anyone besides me got unwanted e mail from this jerk? i have sent a
> couple of e mails to his postmaster who is not doing a thing about it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Timothy Haller
> [e-mail]
> He pushes his his
> fists and still in-
> sists he sees the
> ghosts.
>  from stephen king`s
> book It


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-server.ncren.net!ntwrks.com!usenet
From: Lambda <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 19:14:14 -0500
Organization: Lambda Technologies
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp46.ntwrks.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>
> Just received a kooky email from some nut claiming to be net control of
> the 3894.5 kc mess. Forget the code debate - we need to implement a
> personality test to keep those with defective social skills off the air.
> Jeff KH2PZ


Hi Jeff.  You fell for it; that was a practical joke made by Marty
Chittum, NJ9G.  You HAVE to be kidding if you took this one
seriously...happy holidays to you and your family.  Todd Ellis, N2XL

> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> From [e-mail] Tue Dec 17 16:26:28 1996
> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:32:08 -1000
> From: "Martin, Sr. A Chittum" <[e-mail]>
> Subject: 3894.5 Information Base
> Dear Radio Amateurs,
> Thank you for your enquiry concerning 3894.5 KHz.  I am pleased to hear
> that you have taken an interest in the nightly happenings on the Mother
> of All Freakin' Seas.  Everything occurring there happens by my decree or
> through my permission.  Please feel free to ask any questions that you
> may have concerning the current state of affairs on that frequency.  I
> have added your names and call signs to our list of interested stations.
> I would enjoy hearing from each one of you.  Thanks again and have a
> pleasant holiday season.
> Best Wishes,
> Martin


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!news.ysu.edu!odin.oar.net!malgudi.oar.net!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: 20 Dec 1996 21:16:00 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <59evmg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn04.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>>
>> Just received a kooky email from some nut claiming to be net control of
>> the 3894.5 kc mess. Forget the code debate - we need to implement a
>> personality test to keep those with defective social skills off the air.
>> Jeff KH2PZ
>
>Gee, Jeff, I thought CW was supposed to be such an effective lid filter
>(?)

Nobody ever said it was.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.94.215.18!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!freenet4.afn.org!afn53940
From: Timothy Haller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 09:42:53 -0500
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: freenet4.afn.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
NNTP-Posting-User: afn53940
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

On Fri, 20 Dec 1996, Lambda wrote:

> Jeffrey Herman wrote:
> >
> > Just received a kooky email from some nut claiming to be net control of
> > the 3894.5 kc mess. Forget the code debate - we need to implement a
> > personality test to keep those with defective social skills off the air.
> > Jeff KH2PZ
>
>
> Hi Jeff.  You fell for it; that was a practical joke made by Marty
> Chittum, NJ9G.  You HAVE to be kidding if you took this one
> seriously...happy holidays to you and your family.  Todd Ellis, N2XL
>
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
 Todd marty really needs to get a life












Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
He pushes his his
fists and still in-
sists he sees the
ghosts.
 from stephen king`s
book It



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:58 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: 21 Dec 1996 16:10:20 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59evmg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>Gee, Jeff, I thought CW was supposed to be such an effective lid filter
>>(?)

>Nobody ever said it was.

You need to read this newsgroup more carefully.  Many HAM OPERATORS seem
to swear by the outdated Morse requirements as a way to "keep the
riff-raff out."




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:14:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: 21 Dec 1996 14:18:06 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <59hd5e$[e-mail]>
References: <59evmg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        MN Maniac <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>Gee, Jeff, I thought CW was supposed to be such an effective lid filter
>>>(?)
>
>>Nobody ever said it was.
>
>You need to read this newsgroup more carefully.  Many HAM OPERATORS seem
>to swear by the outdated Morse requirements as a way to "keep the
>riff-raff out."

It does. We only have perhaps a couple hundred idiots on the HF bands
as opposed to the thousands that inhabit 11 meters. Plus, for instance,
we don't have Carl on HF. We can thank the CW requirement for that, if
nothing else.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!malgudi.oar.net!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: 21 Dec 1996 15:29:02 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59gvnu$[e-mail]>
References: <597lac$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn09.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
>
>On Fri, 20 Dec 1996, Lambda wrote:
>
>> Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>> >
>> > Just received a kooky email from some nut claiming to be net control of
>> > the 3894.5 kc mess. Forget the code debate - we need to implement a
>> > personality test to keep those with defective social skills off the air.
>> > Jeff KH2PZ
>>
>>
>> Hi Jeff.  You fell for it; that was a practical joke made by Marty
>> Chittum, NJ9G.  You HAVE to be kidding if you took this one
>> seriously...happy holidays to you and your family.  Todd Ellis, N2XL
>>
>> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> Todd marty really needs to get a life

I got this spam in me e-mail as well. The "To:" field listed 22 other e-mail
addresses.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!newsfeed1.aimnet.com!news1.aplatform.com!ns2.mainstreet.net!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]-- (R. A. Green)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: OK YOU WIN....this just in.....evan platt news wire
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 04:48:20 GMT
Organization: .
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe47c$bf74c880$b3de92cf@default> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-2-33.sntc01.pacbell.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299
X-No-Archive: yes

On Tue, 10 Dec 1996 15:25:59 GMT, [e-mail] (E.S. Platt)
wrote:

>I would, but whenever I e-mail him, he tells me if I e-mail him again,
>he'll file a restraining order against me in a federal civil class
>action lawsuit in the state of Puerto Rico... sorry, couldn't resist.
>But he did say he would file a restraining order against me. Yah,
>rite-e-o.
>
Why don't you let him file against you? Perhaps they would lock him up
for a few days for psychiatric examination.
Don't you love people that read ALL your posts, and then bitch about
what a waste of time they are?? It's as if someone were holding a gun
on them or something....
--ron


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Edward Oros <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: On-line Resistor Color Chart...
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 10:56:41 -0500
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.41.212
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Lost your resistor color chart? Try the
one at the Elmer HAMlet...

http://www.qth.com/antenna


There are lots of Amateur Radio related pages
to see there. Stop on by.



Ed--AC3L


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Steven Olson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: packet connect
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 08:06:27 -0500
Organization: Dell Computer Corporation
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: eat-nj1-03.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 21  5:08:40 AM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

My computer has two serial ports with 9 pin D-subminiature connectors on
rear panel.  Is there a cable that connects the 9 pin connector serial
port on my computer to the standard 25 pin connector on tnc??  Am getting
back into packet. . . .Please respond here or by email.  Thanks, Steve
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-13.sprintlink.net!express.ior.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Digna E. Eads)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Packet software
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 21:43:08 GMT
Organization: iti2
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <50dcf3$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: gj1-27.iti2.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.227

JKlop <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Is there any good packet software that works with Win 3.1 or Windows 95.
>
>Many thanks,
>John Klop
>VK7KCC
>Devonport,
>Tasmania,
>Australia.
John,
You have PaKet v6.1 and WinPack v6.1 available to you in Australia.
They both work well in all versions of Windows.
Merry Christmas


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Paralegal Pagers in all 52 states.. (Was Re: MOTOROLA PAGERS)
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 18:13:48 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc042045.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.326

On Tue, 10 Dec 1996 20:42:38 GMT, [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
wrote:

>Upon forwarding a complaint to this (l)osers postmaster/admin, I
>recieved a reply from "0" errr. "1" with the following:
>
>>evan, why are you still whining like a bitch?
>>Keep up the bullsh*t.
>>A pager is a radio receiver, the catagory says radio.
>
>I'd like to know the opinion of everyone else here. This yahoo has
>been posting his pager ads, with "Didn't buy service from me? Contact
>me, you can get money from my (cl)ass action suit!!" and his Computers
>for sale. and he justifies it by a pager is a radio reciever. What do
>other people think?
>Opinions happily accepted, flames to /dev/null
>
>
>"1" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Motorola Bravo Pagers  $55.00
>>
>>
>>$4.00 per month service available, just prepay 1 year, all states
>>available.
>>
>>
>>Email me or see my web page:
>

I've lost track of who said what, but I do *KNOW* the header
"Paralegal Pagers in all 52 States" gave me an uproarious belly laugh
for the day !!!!!  Pity the poor paralegal , he's likely knee deep in
'briefs' by now ;)

Gary K8IQ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Pase 3D Launched !!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 06:11:13 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58s0a2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ogea$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qjp2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-149.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:

>In article <58qjp2$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>>
>> I didn't say anything about using "and FM HT through a pase 3D
>> satellite" ... analog FM is NOT an efficient use of bandwidth or power
>> ... especially in the case of power-limited channels like satellite
>> systems ...
>>

>Even if that satellite is designed for power anlog FM??  BTW what's a
>pase 3D??

Pase 3D is the code name for Squiggie Sat.  It's a spread spectrum FM satellit
e
that flys around Squiggies head (lower gravity field in a vacuum, you know), a
nd

he wears 3D glasses (those paper ones) because it looks neato when the satelli
te
is in the part of the orbit where he can see it.  Who said Squiggie ain't hi
tech ?

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!paladin.american.edu!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pase 3D Launched !!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 17:06:42 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <58umr2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ogea$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qjp2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58s0a2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm4-11.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14 11:06:42 AM CST 1996

In <58s0a2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:
>
>[e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:
>
>>In article <58qjp2$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>>>
>>> I didn't say anything about using "and FM HT through a pase 3D
>>> satellite" ... analog FM is NOT an efficient use of bandwidth or
power
>>> ... especially in the case of power-limited channels like satellite

>>> systems ...
>>>
>
>>Even if that satellite is designed for power anlog FM??  BTW what's a

>>pase 3D??
>
>Pase 3D is the code name for Squiggie Sat.  It's a spread spectrum FM
satellite
>that flys around Squiggies head (lower gravity field in a vacuum, you
know), and
>
>he wears 3D glasses (those paper ones) because it looks neato when the
satellite
>is in the part of the orbit where he can see it.  Who said Squiggie
ain't hi
>tech ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
>
Nice post Jim we will have to send those oceanographers over to plumb
the depths of your ignorance. I think the whale manure is at risk.

BTW you will be able to use CW on P3D but not FM. Feel better now?


                                    Jerry


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!news.rmii.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pase 3D Launched !!
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 16:21:11 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <58vodh$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ogea$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qjp2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58s0a2$[e-mail]> <58umr2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-172.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>Nice post Jim we will have to send those oceanographers over to plumb
>the depths of your ignorance. I think the whale manure is at risk.
>BTW you will be able to use CW on P3D but not FM. Feel better now?

>                                    Jerry

POP goes the Weasel. It's Christmas Time, Jerry. Remember how heartbroken
you were last Christmas when your buddy Spew got all beat up ?  That's why I'm
trying my best to ignore you. I don't want to ruin your holiday season.  I kno
w
you popped out from under your rock to see what Sandy Claws was going to
bring you, so I am going to excuse you until after Christmas.

I won't be able to use anything on P3D, I took my antennas down. My satellite
career is over.  AMSAT reminds me of the NRA.  Wanna buy some antennas
and some satellite modems ?  How about a Trakbox ? Wouldn't want you to
miss the action on P3D......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: "Ken Reed" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: pilots
Date: 14 Dec 1996 12:42:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet Services for the Internet
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <01bbe9f6$b63565c0$a12a44c6@default>
References: <[e-mail]> <58an6f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ts8d$[e-mail]>
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> There are study guide that provide
> question "pools" that are very close to the actual questions
> used on the tests.

Actually, they are the 'exact' questions, just like ham radio.

> The hardest part is getting the several thousand hours of flight time
> in as PIC. That is expensive.

A friend of mine that had been flying for many years once told me, "you
know the great thing about flying is that is still costs the same today as
it did 30 years ago - all the money you have."

--
Ken Reed

http://www.gumdr.com/gumdr

"Never look for bargains in
 health care or parachutes"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:11 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: pilots
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 10:39:33 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 11
Distribution: world
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In article <01bbe9f6$b63565c0$a12a44c6@default>, "Ken Reed"
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>> The hardest part is getting the several thousand hours of flight time
>> in as PIC. That is expensive.

Well, the requirement for the highest level FAA license is still "only"
1500 hours and not all that has to be PIC (Pilot in Command) time, but that
can still take all the money you have and then some.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:12 1996
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From: "Ken Reed" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: pilots
Date: 15 Dec 1996 21:21:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet Services for the Internet
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <01bbeb08$69a976c0$072ba5ce@default>
References: <[e-mail]> <58an6f$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ts8d$[e-mail]> <01bbe9f6$b63565c0$a12a44c6@default> <[e-mail]>
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"Ken Reed"
> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >> The hardest part is getting the several thousand hours of flight time
> >> in as PIC. That is expensive.
>
> Well, the requirement for the highest level FAA license is still "only"
> 1500 hours and not all that has to be PIC (Pilot in Command) time, but
that
> can still take all the money you have and then some.

I don't disagree with you - you attributed someone else's quote to me,
though. Those words are not mine. My post followed that one.

Trying to set the record straight.

--
Ken Reed

http://www.gumdr.com/gumdr

"Never look for bargains in
 health care or parachutes"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:13 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Please Add To This List
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 15:30:19 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <58vle6$[e-mail]>
References: <58t1o0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120737 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44229

[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Carl I dont know about the rest of the Guys but I would like to know what
>you have done in the Past to Make Ham Radio Better?

Me too.  But I don't think Squiggie is going to tell us.  If he did, he'd have
to kill us.  So we will have to figure it out ourselves.   Let's make a list.


== The List of What Carl (aka Squiggie) Has Done For Ham Radio ==

1. He has never passed a code test and upgraded. That has made HF a better
place because of his absence.

2. He has groaned and moaned and whined so much about Morse code, and
insulted so many other aspects of ham radio (DXing, contesting, rag chewing,
the ARRL, etc.) , that he has probably turned numerous people against no code
licensing merely because of his wonderful attitude.

3. He has given Grandpa Lenny HOPE.   And if Grandpa Lenny stays here on
internet and keeps up the HOPE, then we don't have to worry about ever seeing
him on the ham bands either.


Please feel free to add to the list.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:15 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!207.98.128.66!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Len Winkler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 17:34:52 GMT
Organization: Ham Radio & More SHow
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <59419d$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts6-12.goodnet.com
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120905 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44307 rec.radio.shortwave:90601

This sunday, 12-22-96, on the nationally syndicated
Ham Radio & More Show, it's your chance to call in,
toll-free, and voice your reasons why CW needs to
remain a requirement for a General and above ham
license. You'll have up to 90 UNINTERRUPTED seconds
to tell the world why you believe what you do. Even
the host will not comment. So many of the posts here are
about the code and are written and thought out so well,
now is your chance to tell the world. Prepare in advance,
and be ready to say it all within 90 seconds.
The toll-free number is 1-800-293-5366, and that line will
be available 10 minutes before the show starts this sunday.
Below is more information about the show.
Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
P.O. Box 9219                                         [e-mail]
Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219                  ARIZONA ARRL PIC

Ham Radio & More Show info at:
http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/hrm.htm
http://www.tapr.org/hrm  (RealAudio site to hear past shows) (Thanks TAPR)

The Ham Radio & More Show airs LIVE each Sunday at 6:00pm ET,
(2300utc), on many local commercial stations throughout the country.
ALSO: LIVE on WWCR Shortwave, 5.070mhz.
ALSO: LIVE on RealAudio at: http://www.AudioNet.com/radio/business/kbnp (Thank
s KBNP)

Also available tape delayed via WWCR Shortwave on Mondays,
at 1000utc on 3.210mhz, and Sundays at 0600utc on 5.070mhz.

Support "WOG", the Written Only General!
WOG info at http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/wog.htm



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:16 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!sdd.hp.com!night.primate.wisc.edu!ames!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 17 Dec 1996 08:59:34 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <595ndm$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120938 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44323 rec.radio.shortwave:90618

Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>This sunday, 12-22-96, on the nationally syndicated
>Ham Radio & More Show, it's your chance to call in,
>toll-free, and voice your reasons why CW needs to
>remain a requirement for a General and above ham
>license. You'll have up to 90 UNINTERRUPTED seconds
>to tell the world why you believe what you do. Even
>the host will not comment. So many of the posts here are
>about the code and are written and thought out so well,
>now is your chance to tell the world. Prepare in advance,
>and be ready to say it all within 90 seconds.

Checking the number of listeners again?

>Support "WOG", the Written Only General!

Okay, how about just a two-question exam:
1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station; label
all component values.
2. Explain the purpose of each component.
(Taken from the 1928 exam.)

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:17 1996
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From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 19:04:04 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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PHONE in?

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:18 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 00:06:38 -0800
Organization: Berbee Information Networks Corporation
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: msn-5-6.binc.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121032 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44351 rec.radio.shortwave:90682

I think of Ham Radio as a club. Compair it to other clubs. You want to
join a motorcycle club you have to do something to get in, to sort of
"pay your dues" like ride through town with no pants on or something.

To be on the track team you have to work out everyday. Football players
have rules they have to follow to get on the team. Name a quality group
and they all have something you need to do in order to get into it.

Why should Ham Radio be any different? Ham Radio is a hobby, a club, not
a right. Want to be part of the club? Then you got to pay your dues.
Learning the Morse code is a tradition of the Ham Radio fraternity, it
is a common bond that makes Hams different from other people on the
street.

No code Hams have turned the two meter band into nothing more than a
family intercom system, "honey, would you bring a loaf of bread home?"
The same thing would happen to the HF bands. Every CB operator would get
on the ham bands and soon that is what you would have, the same thing
you hear now on a CB radio.

> Len Winkler <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >This sunday, 12-22-96, on the nationally syndicated
> >Ham Radio & More Show, it's your chance to call in,
> >toll-free, and voice your reasons why CW needs to
> >remain a requirement for a General and above ham
> >license. You'll have up to 90 UNINTERRUPTED seconds
> >to tell the world why you believe what you do. Even
> >the host will not comment. So many of the posts here are
> >about the code and are written and thought out so well,
> >now is your chance to tell the world. Prepare in advance,
> >and be ready to say it all within 90 seconds.
> >Support "WOG", the Written Only General!



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:19 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!shore!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 15:43:01 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5993a2$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-21.slip.shore.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121045 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44360 rec.radio.shortwave:90694

Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>PHONE in?

Yeah, you push those little buttons on the telephone instrument.  They
beep and make tones, dual tones as a matter of fact, and it interfaces
into a worldwide network of like instruments.

You can always find out what time it is during the wee hours of the
morning.  All you have to do is press a series of at least seven
numbers.  Someone will pick up on the other end and say, "Do you know
what time it is? IT'S 3:30 in the BLEEPING MORNING!"   Amazing little
things aren't they?

I know they don't come with instructions so hopefully this helps.

Cheers!  jim, wk1v



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:20 1996
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From: [e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 18:20:13 GMT
Organization: InterNex Information Services 1-800-595-3333
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <599ck9$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pythagoras.org
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121079 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44382 rec.radio.shortwave:90721

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:
>I think of Ham Radio as a club. Compair it to other clubs. You want to
>join a motorcycle club you have to do something to get in, to sort of
>"pay your dues" like ride through town with no pants on or something.

That is known as "hazing".

..
>Why should Ham Radio be any different?

We are discussing the requirements for a US Amateur Radio License,
issued by the Federal government.  The Federal government does not
and should not maintain private clubs.  Amateur Radio is not a private
club!  If it becomes perceived as such by the general public, it will die.

Andy Nourse - KC1IP  -  KEEP THE CODE, DUMP THE CODE *TESTS*



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:21 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!csulb.edu!drivel.ics.uci.edu!news.service.uci.edu!e4e.oac.uci.edu!jwkelley
From: [e-mail] (James W. KELLEY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 19 Dec 1996 00:08:20 GMT
Organization: University of California, Irvine
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59a11k$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: e4e.oac.uci.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121082 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44386 rec.radio.shortwave:90722

In article <595ndm$[e-mail]>,
Jeffrey Herman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Okay, how about just a two-question exam:
>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station; label
>all component values.
>2. Explain the purpose of each component.
>(Taken from the 1928 exam.)
>
>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
>

Ever take a look at the schematic of a 1928 radio Jeff?  Has about 4 parts.




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:22 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 19:34:19 -0800
Organization: Berbee Information Networks Corporation
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: msn-3-1.binc.net
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The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force wrote:
>
> The Federal government does not and should not maintain private clubs. > Ama
teur Radio is not a private club!  If it becomes perceived as such  > by the g
eneral public, it will die.
>
> Andy Nourse - KC1IP  -  KEEP THE CODE, DUMP THE CODE *TESTS*

You are right, Amateur Radio is not a private club, any person that
takes the test and passes it can become a license holder. Most of the
general public does not even take the time to vote in government
elections, I doubt they could give a hoot about Ham Radio.

There are lots of government sponsored clubs, the first one that pops to
mind are sport teams. The Green Bay packers are owned by the City of
Green Bay, look at all the baseball teams that get big new ball parks
from the government. I am sure the list goes on and on if one were to
sit down and think about all the "clubs" that get money from the
government. Ham Radio does not really get money from the government like
other groups do, the only cost for the government is for record keeping
and such.

If a person is not interested enough in the radio arts to put forth the
small amount of effort it takes to get a license these days, then they
do not deserve the privilege of using the Ham bands.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!van-bc!news.rmii.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lahabra.chevron.com!usenet
From: Curtis Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 18:35:05 -0800
Organization: Just Me and My Own Opinions
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dhcpcp176-485.sr.chevron.com
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To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> I think of Ham Radio as a club.

[snip]

> Why should Ham Radio be any different? Ham Radio is a hobby, a club, not
> a right. Want to be part of the club? Then you got to pay your dues.
> Learning the Morse code is a tradition of the Ham Radio fraternity, it
> is a common bond that makes Hams different from other people on the
> street.

The amateur radio service is not club.  The FCC is not in the business
of issuing club memberships.  You appear to consider learning CW as a
type of hazing.  This concept goes right to the top of my list of
cottonheaded reasons to keep code testing.  It beats out the previous
number one reason - "People will perish on sinking ships if hams aren't
required to learn code".

Like all other radio services, amateur radio serves the public
interest.  It is not a private playground.  I don't believe that the
morse code requirements of the current U.S. license structure are best
serving the public interest anymore and should be changed.

> No code Hams have turned the two meter band into nothing more than a
> family intercom system, "honey, would you bring a loaf of bread home?"
> The same thing would happen to the HF bands. Every CB operator would get
> on the ham bands and soon that is what you would have, the same thing
> you hear now on a CB radio.

No-code hams have not wrecked anything.  Pro-coders and old timers
regularly conduct the same type of unimportant communications with other
hams and even use the auto patch to call home. (Personally, I despise
the routine use of autopatches.)  The bands may be more crowded but I
challenge you to come up with any proof that the "lid per capita" is any
higher now than it was before 1991.

--
Curtis


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:24 1996
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From: Rich McAllister <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 18 Dec 1996 14:50:28 -0800
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 19
Sender: rfm@urth
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]>
        <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] writes:

> I think of Ham Radio as a club. Compair it to other clubs. You want to
> join a motorcycle club you have to do something to get in, to sort of
> "pay your dues" like ride through town with no pants on or something.
....
>
> Why should Ham Radio be any different?

Because entrance to amateur radio is controlled by a government enforced
regulation with the force of law.  If I don't like your club, I can start my
own.  If I don't like the laws, I can't just make my own.

(Pants-free riding wasn't on the Cal DMV motorcycle test last I checked.)

(Followups set to r.r.a.p; I'm crossposting this followup because
I don't know if tvdon reads r.r.a.p.)
--
Rich McAllister ([e-mail])


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:25 1996
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 06:38:27 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <59ari8$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>I think of Ham Radio as a club. Compair it to other clubs. You want to
>join a motorcycle club you have to do something to get in, to sort of
>"pay your dues" like ride through town with no pants on or something.
Now there's a vision
>To be on the track team you have to work out everyday. Football players
>have rules they have to follow to get on the team. Name a quality group
>and they all have something you need to do in order to get into it.
What would be wrong with a stringent written test?
>Why should Ham Radio be any different? Ham Radio is a hobby, a club, not
>a right. Want to be part of the club? Then you got to pay your dues.
>Learning the Morse code is a tradition of the Ham Radio fraternity, it
>is a common bond that makes Hams different from other people on the
>street.
I do pay dues. To my club, to the ARRL, to keep the repeater going. By
volunteering my time. By being technically efficient and knowlegable.
Not to mention courteous and kind to other hams.
>No code Hams have turned the two meter band into nothing more than a
>family intercom system, "honey, would you bring a loaf of bread home?"
>The same thing would happen to the HF bands. Every CB operator would get
>on the ham bands and soon that is what you would have, the same thing
>you hear now on a CB radio.
Not to mention 80/40/20 meters. :) Yeah that code sure defeats the
ignorance doesn't it! Sure there is lots of family oriented activity
on 2m. WHY NOT!?! 2m is mostly localized comms, or would you prefer to
see them us 160? Let's not forget that HAM radio is also FAMILY
oriented, or do those pesky kids sprouting up bother you like the
CBers do?
And you never hear anyone ever using two for dxing. Nope I never
talked 11 grid squares last week when the band was open. You never
hear those guys with DXCC(thats right DXCC not VUCC) working other
countries on two. Now where are those pesky downlinks for the
satellites??????? Duh.....two!
Yeah us TWOers sure are plug dumb and annoying and never contribute to
the hobby. Nope. And as soon as code is dropped and some advanced
class idiot jams my QSO on 80 I'm gunna hunt his dumb ass down and
show the FCC and ARRL what needs to be done with CW.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.45.32.37!world1.bellatlantic.net!news
From: Rush Johnson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 21:48:48 -0500
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Curtis Wheeler wrote:

> The amateur radio service is not club.  The FCC is not in the business
> of issuing club memberships.  You appear to consider learning CW as a
> type of hazing.  This concept goes right to the top of my list of
> cottonheaded reasons to keep code testing.  It beats out the previous
> number one reason - "People will perish on sinking ships if hams aren't
> required to learn code".
>

Of course this argument will never be resolved...there are strong points
on either side of the issue, and you appear to approach the situation as
alot of folks do, without looking at what has made Amateur Radio work
besides part 97.

Unfortunately, the rules and regulations the FCC set up regarding the
Amateur Radio Service do not really address what keeps the service
working, what keeps people coming back to the hobby.  That's where
things depart from the neat world of rules and regulations or even pure
logic.

People like to belong to something special.  We like to identify with
groups. We are attracted to the notion of community.  And what is
particularly interesting is that people who share a common background
that may have involved some hardship, some fun, some challenge etc. tend
to be proud of their "heritage".  You see this all over the place in
Alumni organizations, VFW groups, etc.  It is that collection of
experience that helps glue the Amateur Radio Service together and make
it something special....not just a collection of rules and regulations
that we can use to stake our claim to spectrum space with.  It is
community.

As we slowly take away the significant things from Amateur Radio that
create a sense of shared identity, a sense of community  (like the CW
requirement, or homebrewing equipment), we start to lose those things
that keep us "bonded", that keep us comiserating (!), that keep us
mutually  respectful of each others' committment to the hobby.

Replace that experience with a 610 form, a few bucks, and the published
answers to a simple quiz and your community goes away forever and is
replaced with a reasonable facsimile of CB in the 70's.  I for one
loathe a future like that for amateur radio.  Make room for tradition;
value is there, intended or not.


73.

Rush Johnson
NR4M (ex WD4AEI)
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.Stanford.EDU!newshub.internex.net!masters0.news.internex.net!205
From: [e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 96 04:42:35 GMT
Organization: InterNex Information Services 1-800-595-3333
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59fpqe$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>,
   Rush Johnson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>As we slowly take away the significant things from Amateur Radio that
>create a sense of shared identity, a sense of community  (like the CW
>requirement, or homebrewing equipment), we start to lose those things
>that keep us "bonded", that keep us comiserating (!), that keep us
>mutually  respectful of each others' committment to the hobby.

We don't have a sense of community about the CW requirement.  Far from it.
It is a source of division instead.  Ever since "incentive" licensing
came into effect ham radio in the USA has been divided in this way.
Do away with the tests and we'll do away with a lot of division.
Plenty of new hams and not-so-new ones will still discover CW,
and they may like it better for not being force-fed it.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!multipro.com!usenet
From: "Shane Higgenbotham" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Programming Regency XL-2000 Radio, Help
Date: 15 Dec 1996 23:34:22 GMT
Organization: HTS/PCSD
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <01bbeae0$cb609920$[e-mail]>
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Need to know how to program Rx / Tx freq's into a Regency XL-2000 Radio.

Send information to the e-mail address below!

Thanks in Advance!!!
--
Shane H.
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:29 1996
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From: "Phil Cuellar" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: PROPOSAL: no coders can rent my gun for 5 minutes
Date: 13 Dec 1996 05:13:08 GMT
Organization: BrightNet Ohio
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <01bbe8b4$2a199ea0$ea73d4cd@pcuellar>
References: <58k36c$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote in article <58k36c$[e-mail]>...
> I will rent my glock to any of you no-coders that realize you are so
> worthless and decide to kill yourself.........
>
>
Hope you plan to get the money up front....might be kinda hard to collect
from the estate...



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:30 1996
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: PROPOSAL: no coders can rent my gun for 5 minutes
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 11:39:44 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58k36c$[e-mail]> <01bbe8b4$2a199ea0$ea73d4cd@pcuellar>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Phil Cuellar wrote:
> Hope you plan to get the money up front....might be kinda hard to collect
> from the estate...

good point


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Q: The ARRL Survey
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 12:03:29 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga11-20.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 12  4:04:31 AM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201

The ARRL survey concerning the Morse code requirement has been
mentioned several times in this newsgroup. Could someone post a copy
of the survey?

I think that there are many hams who would favor some sort of a
no-code HF ticket but do not wish to open our entire HF spectrum to
no-code operators. Did the survey provide a choice for an answer like
that or was it more of a *Do you still beat your wife?* yes/no survey?

73 de n4jvp
Fritz
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:31 1996
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From: George Baker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Query: Weather Station w Computer Software
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 23:49:52 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbe721$16424740$[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win95; I)

Wendell - W5FL wrote:
>
> I would like to buy a weather station that I can mount at about the 30 foot
> point on my tower. . . . .

For what it is worth, I seem to recall that Weather Bureau instrument stations
 for
temperature, humidity, etc. are only five feet above ground level in a little
ventilated
house designed to prevent any local wind effects. So, maybe there is a conflic
t between
wanting to gather wind data along with all the other types in a single install
ation up
30'.

--
73, George
W5YR
Fairview, TX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:32 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!uniserve!n2van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Quiz
Date: 18 Dec 1996 00:57:19 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <597fhf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix5.its.hawaii.edu

Here's a quiz with an unexpected answer: What was the year spark transmissions
were finally outlawed on the maritime calling/distress freq'y of 500 kHz?

You'll have to wait 3 weeks for the correct answer - I'll be on the Mainland.
Got to get off this island periodically.

73 and Happy Holidays to all (even my enemies on here!),
Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:33 1996
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From: Julian Hensey <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.radio.pirate,alt.radio.uk,rec.radio.broadcasting,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.shortwave,uk.media.radio.misc,uk.media,uk.music.makers.dj,uk.local.southwest
Subject: Radio Caroline talk on the net.
Followup-To: rec.radio.broadcasting
Date: 15 Dec 1996 00:09:42 -0600
Organization: Edinburgh University
Lines: 26
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5904n6$[e-mail]>
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On Monday the 16th December, Radio Caroline celebrate the completion of
their one month broadcast from Bristol, United Kingdom.  The one month
broadcast featured some of the old crew as well as a lot of new faces.

On Monday evening everyone is gathering together to party, and as part of
the celebrations they are going to speak live over Internet Relay Chat,
and hopefully, answer questions from around the world via the Internet.

We hope to have a channel on IRC up and running on Monday evening, the
final details have not yet been completed, but if you are interested in
joining in the chat, then please mail us at

[e-mail]

and full details will be emailed out on Monday as to what channel we will
be on IRC and what network (eg Undernet, EFnet)

I hope that we will be able to run some interesting discussions, exactly
who will be there will be a mystery!  If you want to ask a question via
email that can be answered in Mondays discussion then please feel free to
email the question in advance!

Hope to see you there,

Radio Caroline, Bristol, UK



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:34 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!netaxs.com!news.pond.com!kd3bj!kd3bj.ampr.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (Robert E. Garland)
Subject: Re: Radio Clubs in Philadelphia
Sender: [e-mail] (news)
Organization: The KD3BJ Usenet BBS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58k7js$[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: jupiter.jtan.com
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 02:43:19 GMT
Lines: 28

[e-mail] (Roger A. Quon) writes:

>Hi All

>I was wondering if there were any Amateur Radio Clubs in Philadelphia
>that I could contact. Please let me know by contacting me by e-mail
>directly:

>               [e-mail]

>Thanks,

>Roger


There are many radio clubs in Philadelphia.  One is at Penn.  Another is
at Temple.  Another meets at the Franklin Institute.  Another is a MAJOR
contest club.  Several are essentially "neighborhood" clubs.  Some are
regional in nature.

What is your interest?  General purpose?  Contest?  Mobile operation?  VHF?


--
     Robert Garland                            NX3S @ N3ACL.PA.USA.NOAM
     Hilltown Township Bucks County               [e-mail]
     Pennsylvania USA                                       Grid FN20ii
                         "Ham Radio is a calling"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:35 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!netaxs.com!news.pond.com!kd3bj!kd3bj.ampr.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (Robert E. Garland)
Subject: Re: Radio Clubs in Philadelphia
Sender: [e-mail] (news)
Organization: The KD3BJ Usenet BBS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58k7js$[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: jupiter.jtan.com
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 02:45:43 GMT
Lines: 28

[e-mail] (Roger A. Quon) writes:

>Hi All

>I was wondering if there were any Amateur Radio Clubs in Philadelphia
>that I could contact. Please let me know by contacting me by e-mail
>directly:

>               [e-mail]

>Thanks,

>Roger

Roger:  go read my follow-up posting to your query.  There are about 30
radio clubs in the greater Philadelphia area.  One is at Penn.  If you
have 2-meter access, ask around on 146.76 (repeater output; transmit on
146.16).  This is the machine with regional coverage.  Try also repeaters
with outputs on 147.03, 147.06, 147.00, 145.31, 146.88, 146.82.  Some
clubs do not operate repeaters.  The Penn club has an extensive linking
system that covers a good piece of Pennsylvania.


--
     Robert Garland                            NX3S @ N3ACL.PA.USA.NOAM
     Hilltown Township Bucks County               [e-mail]
     Pennsylvania USA                                       Grid FN20ii
                         "Ham Radio is a calling"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!ratty.wolfe.net!usenet
From: Ed Koeppel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: radio for sale
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 16:02:53 -0800
Organization: Wolfe Internet Access, L.L.C.
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sea-ts3-p53.wolfenet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02Gold (Win95; I)

I have an alinco DR 600 with books and is in good condition.  2 meter 440 radi
o.  Iam
really interested in selling it.  I only want 395.00 for it obo.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:37 1996
From: Clif <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Radio Service and Used Equipment
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 16:25:59 -0600
Organization: OnRamp Technologies; ISP;  Dallas/Ft Worth/Houston, TX USA
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: central14.onramp.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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For the finest in service on your Kenwood and Icom amateur radio gear
check out our web page at:

http://rampages.onramp.net/~avvid

We also carry used equipment that we warranty

Thanks, Clif  KA5IPF

AVVid is an Authorized Kenwood and Icom Service Center


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:38 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.equiptment,rec.radio.swap
Subject: RADIO SHACK MODS PRO 51]
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 13:38:20 -0600
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip166-72-206-154.tx.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121044 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22144 rec.radio.swap:100167

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> I am interested in getting a scanner thast has the best bang for the
> buck.  A few people have recommended the RS Pro-51.  Presently it is
> under $200.  I was wondering what other people think.  Is this a bargin.
>  Are there any mods for this item.  Can you recomend another scanner our
> source for scanners?  Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Nick Yatko
> [e-mail];


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.246.124.37!nntp.newsfirst.com!nntp.crosslink.net!not-for-mail
From: Christopher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Rare books
Date: 15 Dec 1996 23:58:54 GMT
Organization: CrossLink Internet Services
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <5923bu$ite$[e-mail]>
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Anyone out there into rare (old) radio books? kd4unc



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:40 1996
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From: terry murphy nn4nn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Rare books
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 20:35:41 -0500
Organization: Gametek
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5923bu$ite$[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U)

Christopher wrote:
>
> Anyone out there into rare (old) radio books? kd4unc
I have about 50 here  Are you looking or selling?
de nn4nn
--
Terry Murphy    Amateur Radio Call NN4NN  email: [e-mail]
Proud Member of Franklin County ARC-ARES  http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
"Too many people...view poetry as a luxury,not a necessity like petrol.
 But to me it's the oil of life" --John Betjeman (1906-84)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!tezcat!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-8.sprintlink.net!news.fuse.net!NewsWatcher!user
From: [e-mail] (Joe Petrocy)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Realistic WX alert radio mods??
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 15:52:55 -0500
Organization: University of Cincinnati
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <petrocjw-1812961553150001@192.168.1.2>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.16.146.25
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b4
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44611 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22151 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121051

   Just wondering if anyone has a good idea on how to mod a Realistic WX
alert radio model 12-140. It seems to use one crystal as a reference for
the 3 WX service frequencies. I would like to know if I could drop a
crystal in there to reference something in the 147.00MHz range so I could
tune it to rx 147.060 and others in the area. I am also curious what the
tones are that actually set off the alarm. I would like to set it to go
off if someone does a long-tone zero on our repeater. If I knew what the
tones were that set it off, I could program our repeater controler to emit
those tones after a LTZ.

Anyone ever try this? Does this make sense. Please reply via email and
posting if at all possible.

Thanks,
JWP

--
Joe. That would be me...
----------------------
http://ucunix.san.uc.edu/~petrocjw
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-9.sprintlink.net!news.connect.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Phil Clements)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Realistic WX alert radio mods??
Date: 19 Dec 1996 00:10:34 GMT
Organization: Your Organization
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <59a15q$[e-mail]>
References: <petrocjw-1812961553150001@192.168.1.2>
NNTP-Posting-Host: a1p44.connect.net
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.1
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44627 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22173 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121085

In article <petrocjw-1812961553150001@192.168.1.2>, [e-mail]
 (Joe Petrocy) says:
>
>   Just wondering if anyone has a good idea on how to mod a Realistic WX
>alert radio model 12-140. It seems to use one crystal as a reference for
>the 3 WX service frequencies. I would like to know if I could drop a
>crystal in there to reference something in the 147.00MHz range so I could
>tune it to rx 147.060 and others in the area. I am also curious what the
>tones are that actually set off the alarm. I would like to set it to go
>off if someone does a long-tone zero on our repeater. If I knew what the
>tones were that set it off, I could program our repeater controler to emit
>those tones after a LTZ.
>
> The tone is 1050 hz. Sorry, can't help you on the crystal freq.

Season's Greetings

Phil, K5PC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:44 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Glenn Sparks)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Realistic WX alert radio mods??
Date: 19 Dec 1996 15:32:11 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <59bn5r$[e-mail]>
References: <petrocjw-1812961553150001@192.168.1.2>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hou-tx6-11.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 19  7:32:11 AM PST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44669 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22191 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121144

I haven't opened up this version of the radio, but I converted several
of the weather cubes that RS used to sell.  All that was required on
them was changing the resistance of the reostat on the tuning circuit,
I don't remember the exact values, but they used a variactor which had
enough range to get down to the 2 meter band.

Glenn Sparks

In <petrocjw-1812961553150001@192.168.1.2> [e-mail]
(Joe Petrocy) writes:
>
>   Just wondering if anyone has a good idea on how to mod a Realistic
WX
>alert radio model 12-140. It seems to use one crystal as a reference
for
>the 3 WX service frequencies. I would like to know if I could drop a
>crystal in there to reference something in the 147.00MHz range so I
could
>tune it to rx 147.060 and others in the area. I am also curious what
the
>tones are that actually set off the alarm. I would like to set it to
go
>off if someone does a long-tone zero on our repeater. If I knew what
the
>tones were that set it off, I could program our repeater controler to
emit
>those tones after a LTZ.
>
>Anyone ever try this? Does this make sense. Please reply via email and
>posting if at all possible.
>
>Thanks,
>JWP
>
>--
>Joe. That would be me...
>----------------------
>http://ucunix.san.uc.edu/~petrocjw
>[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:45 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!hunter.premier.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Repeater Atlas -- useless maps
Date: 17 Dec 1996 12:34:28 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2


I haven't heard anyone else mention this.  Here I am looking at the
SF Bay repeater map on page 146.  It shows a map of the SF Bay, and
a list of repeaters.  Unfortunately, there's nothing to indicate where
on the map the repeaters are located.  What's the point?  Seems to me
this would be really useful if there were little dots and lines showing
where the repeaters were.  But the way it is in the 95/96 directory, I
have a list of repeaters that's already in the No. California section
and a lores map of the SF Bay.

I'd reccomend, for the next atlas, to show where the repeaters are.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Anthony S. Pelliccio)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Repeater Atlas -- useless maps
Date: 17 Dec 1996 20:26:36 -0500
Organization: Ideamation, Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <597h8c$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
cathryn <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I'd reccomend, for the next atlas, to show where the repeaters are.

Oh sure - I'm sure every repeater trustee would just LOVE to have
every weirdo know just where their repeater is.

I think that's probably the main reason why it was left out.

Tony





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:47 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.idt.net!mr.net!news.clark.net!usenet
From: "Steve Siegel" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Repeater Atlas -- useless maps
Date: 18 Dec 1996 22:03:57 GMT
Organization: National Education Association
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <01bbed2f$2bd4e900$0ebddfc7@s_siegel>
References: <[e-mail]> <597h8c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vanguard.nea.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Gee, ya think maybe Cathryn meant general location?  I agree with her
completely!
--
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
mail to: [e-mail]

Anthony S. Pelliccio <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<597h8c$[e-mail]>...
> In article <[e-mail]>,
> cathryn <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >I'd reccomend, for the next atlas, to show where the repeaters are.
>
> Oh sure - I'm sure every repeater trustee would just LOVE to have
> every weirdo know just where their repeater is.
>
> I think that's probably the main reason why it was left out.
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:48 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.89.123.24!nntp.inet.fi!news.sci.fi!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 08:45:03 GMT
Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, [e-mail], (931)3186277
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <58ogfi$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ccxxviii.adyn.sci.fi
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Paul Christensen <[e-mail]> wrote:


>If the concern is one of interference, then let us propose the testing only f
or those
>who wish to deviate from type-accepted equipment.  The so-called "appliance o
perators"
>would be free of the learning burden and those who wish to experiment can do
so through
>testing.

Even if an appliance operator class would be created, the operators
would have to know the regulations (Part 97 in the US), safety
precautions, EMC and bio-effect (ANSI/IEEE in the US) regulations.
In order to understand these regulations, you have to know quite a few
concepts such as frequence and bandwidh, the relationships between
power, voltage, current and resistance and something about desibels
and so on. Most of these concepts should be thought in the school, so
it should not be hard to refresh your memory for the examination. To
understand the EMC and bio-effects issues, you have to know something
about antenna gains, ERP, field strengths and power densities.

So even if you treat the appliance as a black box, you still have to
know something how to interface it with the external world (AC/DC
power to the appliance, RF to the feedline and antenna and from the
antenna to the surrounding world), otherwise you have to have type or
site acceptance for the whole installation and not just the radio.

IMO, these requirements are not too much different from those that are
currently required for low power entry classes (which also can use non
type-accepted equipment), such as the US Novice class.

Thus, requiring type-acceptance for a certain class would not change
the theory requirements very much.

Paul OH3LWR




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:49 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 23:32:27 GMT
Lines: 17

In article <[e-mail]> Paul Christensen <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>The Government's legitimate purpose?  Where was their "pupose" when they
>eliminated all theory from the Citizen's Band exam back in the '70s?

CB exam?

The FCC eliminated the "send us $20 and get a station license" requirement
in the 70s but there was never an *exam* for a CB license, certainly not a
*theory* exam. It has always been a radio *user* service.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:50 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 23:36:50 GMT
Lines: 17

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>[e-mail]   (Carl Stevenson) wrote:
>>and also because our "charter" is to be a
>
>"charter"... in which FCC document where is this charter spelled out?

The one you're supposed to have a current copy of in your station
records. It's called Part 97, and the Basis and Purpose is section
97.1. Might be interesting to read it some time.

Gary

--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:52 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!clay.se.highway1.com!baker.se.highway1.com![e-mail]
From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 22:46:26 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 55
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.129.202.210
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Jim Cummings wrote:

> What exactly does Christensen mean by a material problem?  I am not familiar
> with this term in the amateur certification and operational sense.

Look up the words in your dictionary if you are unsure of their
meaning.  A dictionary is a useful reference tool.


> In contradiction to Christensen's
> assertion, I do not agree with his view that the relative lack of
> interference from the amateur service is due to supposed superiority of the
> equipment.  More to the point, that amateur's have to submit to a written
> examination would tend to make those individuals more aware of their
> responsibilities.

Let us turn the proverbial table: what evidence can you conclusively
present to one and
all that the relative lack of interference is *not* due to technological
advances?


> >A knowledge of the allowable spectrum is essential.
>
> Although it is a non-sequitur to the previous statement, I couldn't agree
> more either.

Knowledge, yes.  Testing, no.  A non-non-sequitur.


> I am pleased that Christensen has seen the light, in that that is exactly my
> thesis.

Then let it be known to one and all: Jim Cummings advocates a written
examination whereby
only "interference avoidance" questions are presented.


> > Because to learn any
> > more then *absolutely necessary* to avoid interference starts to smell of
hypocracy.  In
> > fact, it parallels the same reasoning for continued Morse testing.
>
> Firstly, what is meant by "learn(ing) any more then (sic) is absolutely
> necessary"?
         ^^^^^^
Allow me to rephrase: "Because *testing* any more than absolutely
necessary begins
to smell of hypocrisy."

Incidentally Jim, as long as we're grading each other's grammar, the
punctuation
always falls within the quotation marks.  Always.


-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:53 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!news.drenet.dnd.ca!crc-news.doc.ca!usenet
From: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 08:19:05 -0800
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

Paul Christensen wrote:
>
> Jim Cummings wrote:
>
> > What exactly does Christensen mean by a material problem?  I am not famili
ar
> > with this term in the amateur certification and operational sense.
>
> Look up the words in your dictionary if you are unsure of their
> meaning.  A dictionary is a useful reference tool.
>

I guess there is no point in continuing this discussion then with such a put
down.

I usually refrain from using given names on the newsgroups, but I shall
dispense with that for one.

Paul, I am sorry that you would respond in kind.  I see no point in
continuing this thread under those circumstances.  You are, none the less
entitled to you opinion with the rest of your posting, but I do not
necessarily agree with any of your views.

Seasons Greetings.

Jim, VE3XJ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:54 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!clay.se.highway1.com!baker.se.highway1.com![e-mail]
From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 10:44:06 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.129.202.42
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Jim Cummings wrote:
> > Jim Cummings wrote:
> >
> > > What exactly does Christensen mean by a material problem?  I am not fami
liar
> > > with this term in the amateur certification and operational sense.
> >
> > Look up the words in your dictionary if you are unsure of their
> > meaning.  A dictionary is a useful reference tool.
> >
>
> I guess there is no point in continuing this discussion then with such a put
> down.

Too bad.  Irrespective of your opinion, I was actually enjoying the
discussion
and its bantering.  I apologize if I have offended you.

-Regards,

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!clay.se.highway1.com!baker.se.highway1.com![e-mail]
From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 10:49:53 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.129.202.42
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Gary Coffman wrote:

> The FCC eliminated the "send us $20 and get a station license" requirement
> in the 70s but there was never an *exam* for a CB license, certainly not a
> *theory* exam. It has always been a radio *user* service.

True.  It was never a formal exam.  Only an application with fee was
necessary.
A "test" booklet accompanied the license but was not returned to the
Commission.
I still have my original FCC "test" booklet and license from 1969.

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:57 1996
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From: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 11:26:34 -0800
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ap32$[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Jim Cummings <[e-mail]> wrote:

> >  The testing of Morse code does not nor can it be
> >modified to do so.  Yet, testing on electronic theory, unlike Morse code
> >testing, is the only means, at the present time, in which these regulatory
> >agency has assessing the merits of an individual to operate an amateur
> >station.
>
> Cummings is incorrect in this matter.   Passing a multiple guess exam
> in which the answers and the questions are known in advance does not
> demonstrate the above.   A written test on theory, administered by
> VECs, and not published in advance, would accomplish the task
> at minimal extra expense.
>

It would be refreshing if Wallingford took the time to read my posting and
then reacted.  Obviously we agree that there should be written examinations.
 But I fail to understand how I can be incorrect with respect to an opinion
that I have not tendered at all - i.e. the issue of prior publication of
examination questions.  (With respect to this issue, its a no brainer - it
won't change.  I understand that there are freedom of information legislation
that must be respected.  Moreover, I understand they examination questions
have been known for decades prior the current certification infrastructure.
No point in trying to keep secret of those things if one cannot do so.)


> >If the current national programmes were insufficient, we would notice a
> >significant number of infractions issued to amateurs for out of band
> >operation and other such infringements.
>
> We're discussing exams relating to electrical theory, not rules and
> practice.
>

... and Wallingford's point is?...  Does Wallingford advocate no theory
whatsoever?  What would be the consequences for the amateur community if
indeed if all theory testing was abolished?

> >There is no such indication that
> >amateurs are a significant burden with respect to interference to other use
rs
> >of the spectrum.  Indeed, due to this lack of infringement characteristic,
one must applaud the
> >current theory examination because it would seem that amateur's lack of
> >operational incapacity is in the effortless application of their abilities.
>
> This is all related to practice, and rules, not theory.
> We could accomplish the same thing by turning the exam into a "Drivers
> License Exam for Radio Operators"
>

If Wallingford believes this is the case, he is entitled petition the FCC to
replace the current method of certification with a vehicle drivers
examination.



73 and live better digitally
Jim, VE3XJ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:58 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Frank Sved)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: 9 Dec 1996 18:57:44 GMT
Organization: The National Capital FreeNet
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58hnf8$[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Frank Sved)
NNTP-Posting-Host: freenet3.carleton.ca
X-Given-Sender: [e-mail] (Frank Sved)


Jim Cummings ([e-mail]) writes:
>> other
>> services in addition to very high accuracy frequency displays.
>
> That most radioes can be easily modified to operate outside of the amateur
> bands (i.e. the "yellow wire mod" for the IC-706) would belie this notion.
>
>> I suspect
>> these
>> are the *real* reasons for interference avoidance.
>>
>> -Paul, W9AC
>
> No, not really.
>
> 73 and live better digitally
> Jim, VE3XJ


It is long winded verbal ballerinas that a) make everybody lose interest
in the issues, and b) people ignore and continue to do what they want
regardless of regulations.
--


  Bye for now, Frank Sved (VE3GID) at [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:15:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!clay.se.highway1.com!baker.se.highway1.com![e-mail]
From: Paul Christensen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Results of CW Poll on HR&M
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 17:26:34 -0500
Organization: Another Netscape News Server User
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <57v9cn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <580179$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582q0s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Gary Coffman wrote:

> If you'll look at it again, you'll find that it is Part 95 in a plain
> language Q&A format (similar to that used by "The Doctor is In" column
> in QST). Its purpose was to make the licensee aware of the rules, not
> to test him on them.

Just finished blowing the dust off it.  Dated March 1965, Government
Printing
Office Publication for the FCC.  Yep.  It's 25 multiple-choice questions
in
a "test" style format along with page references to the preceding Part
95
material, also in the same issue.  Hate to burst your little bubble
Gary.
Perhaps you're refering to a later FCC Part 95 publication.

-Paul, W9AC


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RF burns through keyer???
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 06:00:07 GMT
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 14
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp18.respool1.medina.ohio.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
solve this problem.

I don't know how long this problem has existed, I just noticed it
today.

Thanks
Sam KC8BQP



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:52:10 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59e39j$[e-mail]>
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-176.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo) wrote:

>I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
>keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
>a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
>antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
>checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
>fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
>solve this problem.

>I don't know how long this problem has existed, I just noticed it
>today.

>Thanks
>Sam KC8BQP

Welcome to the wonderful world of R.F. Burns, Sam.  Only two solutions I
can think of are a) reduce your power output on 80 meters or b) move the
eighty meter antenna away from the shack a bit farther.  Sounds like the
RF field in your shack is a bit strong.  Has your cat, by any chance, stopped
having kittens ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 20:25:12 GMT
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 37
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59es77$e24$[e-mail]>
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]> <59e39j$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo) wrote:

>>I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
>>keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
>>a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
>>antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
>>checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
>>fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
>>solve this problem.

>>I don't know how long this problem has existed, I just noticed it
>>today.

>>Thanks
>>Sam KC8BQP

>Welcome to the wonderful world of R.F. Burns, Sam.  Only two solutions I
>can think of are a) reduce your power output on 80 meters or b) move the
>eighty meter antenna away from the shack a bit farther.  Sounds like the
>RF field in your shack is a bit strong.  Has your cat, by any chance, stopped
>having kittens ?

>73, Jim KH2D

No, but all my hair is falling out and my fish have tumors all over
them.

73 de KC8BQP - Sam




Sam - KC8BQP




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!world1.bellatlantic.net!news
From: Rush Johnson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 20:53:11 -0500
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win95; U)
CC: [e-mail]

Samuel R. DiSalvo wrote:
>
> I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
> keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
> a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
> antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
> checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
> fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
> solve this problem.
>
> I don't know how long this problem has existed, I just noticed it
> today.
>
> Thanks
> Sam KC8BQP

Sam, I first experienced the same problem you have experienced about 20
years ago while attempting to load a vertical antenna on 75 meters with
about 100 watts from a Heathkit HW-101....burned the fire out of my
upper lip on the microphone.

You can get rid of the problem and continue to run the power that you
wish to run, but you have to have a low impedance path for the RF to go
to ground.  MFJ (?) makes a devices which essentially creates a resonant
circuit on your ground at your problem frequency and lowers the voltage
on the chassis.  But, you don't really need to spend the cash.

Try this.  Measure a quarter wave length (about 60 feet) of 14 gauge or
so wire and attach that to the ground of your equipment.  Run the wire
out of the shack and along your foundation...bury it if you care to.
I've had some pretty good luck with this type of RF ground.

Hope this helps.

73,

Rush Johnson
NR4M  (ex WD4AEI)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF getting into home security system
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 10:54:18 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <568nqe$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Blackie Lawless wrote:
> I have a problem in that when I operate on 40 meters I make my home
> security system send out a panic alarm.  Funny, this doesn't happen
> on 15 meters.  Here is what I am running.
> Yaesu FT101E barefoot into an attic dipole.  I also use an MFJ949E antenna
> tuner.


Get the antenna out of the attic & in the free & clear outside
the house.

You'll also notice MUCH better performance from the antenna &
I'll bet the prob with the security system goes away.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Rodger D.Placer
Date: 12 Dec 1996 08:06:38 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58oeee$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-01.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
 writes:
>(Reportedly,
>the Guatamalan authorities expressed astonishment when informed
>that amateur satellites even exist, another fine job by the ARRL
>and their IARU puppet of educating governments about the amateur
>radio service. NOT!)

What part of this *really* surprises you?  The league has been too busy
spending the vast majority of its time sponsoring and administering its
various gaming activities and raking in $ from its publishing empire to
do the things it really *should* be doing to "represent our interests."

They are corrupt, incompetent, and unresponsive.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-6.sprintlink.net!news.ro.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 20:48:11 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts5p3.ro.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Wed, 11 Dec 1996 08:01:08 +0000, Michael Beck
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Steve Forcht wrote:
>>
>> Howdy:
>>  Has anyone seen any circuits around for a Roger Beep. I have not been
>> able to find any.
>>
>>                                         Thanks Steve VA3SF
>> --
>>
>>                                        """""
>>                                        (@ @)
>>         ---------------------------oOOo-(_)-oOOo-----------------------
>>          http://www.myna.com/~stevef <<< <<< <<< <<< <<<--click here
>
>What? Making your Kenwood rig complete?
>
>
>
>
>--
>                    ///// \\\\\
>                    (  o   o  )
>-------------------oOO--(_)--OOo------------------
>==================================================
>Michael Beck / KE6JNO
>[e-mail] / [e-mail]
>Montara, California U.S.A.
>==================================================
Well, this is whats it coming to. Roger beeps on two meters or HF no
doubt. I LOVE NO CODE!!!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.191.160.4!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.lava.net!news.Hawaii.Edu!jherman
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 12 Dec 1996 04:32:40 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58o1t8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

In article <[e-mail]>, Dave Burr  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>You can bet that someone is going to figure out a way to modify a Golden
>Eagle to operate on 75m, complete with "Roger Beepers", Moonrakers", and
>"Black Boxes". We will refer to their operators as "The One Mr. Coffee
>Man" or "The One Mud Dauber". QSOs will be started simply by saying "How
>'Boutcha?"
>
>Whattaya gonna do but start shopping around for another hobby?

Come on down to the CW segments, Dave - you won't hear any such nonsense.

73,
Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!csn!nntp-xfer-2.csn.net!symbios.com!kthompso.ks.symbios.com!ken.thompson_at_symbios.com
From: [e-mail] (stop junk e-mail)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 09:19:20
Organization: Symbios Logic
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kthompso.ks.symbios.com
X-Newsreader: Trumpet for Windows [Version 1.0 Rev A]

In article <58o1t8$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:


>Come on down to the CW segments, Dave - you won't hear any such nonsense.

No rogers,... just beeps..


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:08 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Kirk James Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 12 Dec 1996 07:59:25 -0800
Organization: Biological Sciences Department, Cal Poly SLO
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <58pa4t$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: violin.aix.calpoly.edu

I figured this topic would degenerate into a "no code techs are ruining
ham radio" arguement...

The original post (not by me) was requesting simple circuits on roger
beeps so that he could get some ideas for a repeater controller.  For the
ham bands.

Go back to your CW segments and stay there, people.


--
 Kirk J. Smith, KD6RCT, EMT-P    |  Biological Sciences Dept, Microbiology
 [e-mail]    |  California Polytechnic State University
 http://www.calpoly.edu/~kjsmith |  San Luis Obispo, California, USA


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.iglobal.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-6.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!usenet
From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 16:39:52 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dtburr.pr.mcs.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I)

Casey wrote:
>
> On Wed, 11 Dec 1996 08:01:08 +0000, Michael Beck
> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >Steve Forcht wrote:
> >>
> >> Howdy:
> >>  Has anyone seen any circuits around for a Roger Beep. I have not been
> >> able to find any.
> >>
> >>                                         Thanks Steve VA3SF
> >> --
> >>
> >>                                        """""
> >>                                        (@ @)
> >>         ---------------------------oOOo-(_)-oOOo-----------------------
> >>          http://www.myna.com/~stevef <<< <<< <<< <<< <<<--click here
> >
> >What? Making your Kenwood rig complete?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >                    ///// \\\\\
> >                    (  o   o  )
> >-------------------oOO--(_)--OOo------------------
> >==================================================
> >Michael Beck / KE6JNO
> >[e-mail] / [e-mail]
> >Montara, California U.S.A.
> >==================================================
> Well, this is whats it coming to. Roger beeps on two meters or HF no
> doubt. I LOVE NO CODE!!!

Yep:

You can bet that someone is going to figure out a way to modify a Golden
Eagle to operate on 75m, complete with "Roger Beepers", Moonrakers", and
"Black Boxes". We will refer to their operators as "The One Mr. Coffee
Man" or "The One Mud Dauber". QSOs will be started simply by saying "How
'Boutcha?"

Whattaya gonna do but start shopping around for another hobby?

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:11 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 17 Dec 1996 08:05:29 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <595k89$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

stop junk e-mail <[e-mail]> wrote:
>[e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:

>>Come on down to the CW segments, Dave - you won't hear any such nonsense.

>No rogers,... just beeps..

Maybe they sound like beeps to you, but for folks in the know, those
sounds convey intelligence.

KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:12 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!swrinde!sdd.hp.com!col.hp.com!canyon.sr.hp.com!donrm
From: [e-mail] (Don Montgomery)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 17 Dec 1996 20:14:42 GMT
Organization: Hewlett Packard Sonoma County
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <596uvi$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595k89$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mtleng12.sr.hp.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2.2]

Jeffrey Herman ([e-mail]) wrote:

> Maybe they sound like beeps to you, but for folks in the know, those
> sounds convey intelligence.

Hams don't like roger beeps because they originated with the citizen
banders...BUT you'll seldom hear two SSB stations 'doubling' with each
other when one of these gadgets is on both ends of a circuit.  Too bad
the hams didn't invent it; it'd probably be standard practice today.

73 de K6LTS
Don Montgomery
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:13 1996
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From: Kevin Short <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 18:41:40 -0800
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595k89$[e-mail]> <596uvi$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: Kevin Short <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ltiblu.larson.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
In-Reply-To: <596uvi$[e-mail]>

On 17 Dec 1996, Don Montgomery wrote:

> Date: 17 Dec 1996 20:14:42 GMT
> From: Don Montgomery <[e-mail]>
> Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
> Subject: Re: Roger Beep
>
> Jeffrey Herman ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>
>
> Hams don't like roger beeps because they originated with the citizen
> banders...BUT you'll seldom hear two SSB stations 'doubling' with each
> other when one of these gadgets is on both ends of a circuit.  Too bad
> the hams didn't invent it; it'd probably be standard practice today.
>
> 73 de K6LTS
> Don Montgomery
> [e-mail]
>
>
>
  I think that the CB'ers should get credit were ever they can find it.
But I think that they stole the idea from NASA. Remember?  Houston this
is Tranquillity base...beep.

[ kevin ] Kevin Short







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:14 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 18 Dec 1996 03:05:36 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <597n20$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595k89$[e-mail]> <596uvi$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Don Montgomery <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Jeffrey Herman ([e-mail]) wrote:

>> Maybe they sound like beeps to you, but for folks in the know, those
>> sounds convey intelligence.

>Hams don't like roger beeps because they originated with the citizen
>banders...BUT you'll seldom hear two SSB stations 'doubling' with each
>other when one of these gadgets is on both ends of a circuit.  Too bad
>the hams didn't invent it; it'd probably be standard practice today.

Heehee - nice going, Don! You really took my remark out of context.
The previous poster mentioned "beeping" as in Morse - thus my remark
above.

As far as Roger Beeps, we've lived just fine without 'em on the amateur
bands for some 80 years now - let's keep that that way.

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:15 1996
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 03:45:14 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 17  9:45:10 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201

On 12 Dec 1996 04:32:40 GMT, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>, Dave Burr  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>You can bet that someone is going to figure out a way to modify a Golden
>>Eagle to operate on 75m, complete with "Roger Beepers", Moonrakers", and
>>"Black Boxes". We will refer to their operators as "The One Mr. Coffee
>>Man" or "The One Mud Dauber". QSOs will be started simply by saying "How
>>'Boutcha?"
>>
>>Whattaya gonna do but start shopping around for another hobby?
>
>Come on down to the CW segments, Dave - you won't hear any such nonsense.
>
>73,
>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6

and you won't hear 73s unlike on HF and Usenet...
73 de n4jvp
Fritz
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:16 1996
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From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 10:42:52 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595k89$[e-mail]> <596uvi$[e-mail]>
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Don Montgomery wrote:

> Hams don't like roger beeps because they originated with the citizen
> banders...BUT you'll seldom hear two SSB stations 'doubling' with each
> other when one of these gadgets is on both ends of a circuit.  Too bad
> the hams didn't invent it; it'd probably be standard practice today.
>
> 73 de K6LTS
> Don Montgomery
> [e-mail]


Sorry Don, I believe you are incorrect.  The beeps were used by NASA long befo
re CB'ers were attracted
to them.  I used to use one on SSB all the time and might build another one to
 do it again!

If I'm not mistaken, RCI or UNIDEN have implemented the BEEP into their 10M ri
gs.

In fact, I might just put one in my 2M all mode for SSB work.

Jim.. KB6ZOP


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:17 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Steve <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 21:22:30 -0800
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595k89$[e-mail]> <596uvi$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: col-as20s34.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; U)

And, many repeater have the equivalent of a roger beep (I personally find
them irritating).

S


J&J Mac wrote:
>
> Don Montgomery wrote:
>
> > Hams don't like roger beeps because they originated with the citizen
> > banders...BUT you'll seldom hear two SSB stations 'doubling' with each
> > other when one of these gadgets is on both ends of a circuit.  Too bad
> > the hams didn't invent it; it'd probably be standard practice today.
> >
> > 73 de K6LTS
> > Don Montgomery
> > [e-mail]
>
> Sorry Don, I believe you are incorrect.  The beeps were used by NASA long be
fore CB'ers were attracted
> to them.  I used to use one on SSB all the time and might build another one
to do it again!
>
> If I'm not mistaken, RCI or UNIDEN have implemented the BEEP into their 10M
rigs.
>
> In fact, I might just put one in my 2M all mode for SSB work.
>
> Jim.. KB6ZOP


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:18 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595k89$[e-mail]> <596uvi$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 13:14:44 GMT
Lines: 22

In article <596uvi$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Don Montgomery) writ
es:
>Jeffrey Herman ([e-mail]) wrote:
>> Maybe they sound like beeps to you, but for folks in the know, those
>> sounds convey intelligence.
>
>Hams don't like roger beeps because they originated with the citizen
>banders...BUT you'll seldom hear two SSB stations 'doubling' with each
>other when one of these gadgets is on both ends of a circuit.  Too bad
>the hams didn't invent it; it'd probably be standard practice today.

CBers didn't invent them either. They were used first by NASA.
Listen to the old Mercury, Gemini, and Apollo tapes. They serve
a valid purpose in half-duplex voice comms. They let you determine
if the other guy has let off the PTT and is listening, or has
merely paused to draw a breath.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:19 1996
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From: [e-mail] (HamMan67)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 20 Dec 1996 15:01:14 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

While it may be true that NASA invented the 'Roger Beep', please keep in
mind that DOES NOT mean they are useful for casual amatuer usage. I admit
that in certain situations it may help to avoid doubling but the point you
must remember is when the band is crowded and skip is in, it will quickly
sound like a REAL MESS and any advantage would be quickly lost to the QRM
created. If you don't believe me try listening to a CB channel and you
will get the point. LEAVE ROGER BEEPS FOR THE CHICKEN BANDERS.

KB2TMA


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:20 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Roger Beep
Date: 21 Dec 1996 08:59:36 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59g8to$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o1t8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <595k89$[e-mail]> <596uvi$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

J&J Mac ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Sorry Don, I believe you are incorrect.  The beeps were used by NASA long be
fore CB'ers were attracted
: to them.  I used to use one on SSB all the time and might build another one
to do it again!

Correct.

: If I'm not mistaken, RCI or UNIDEN have implemented the BEEP into their 10M
rigs.

The only reason RCI and UNIDEN put them there was for the CBers, who use these
rigs on 11 Meters, as well as both above and below that band. They can get
"chip sets" (and sometimes even simpler modifications) that allow transmission
from about 26 MHz to 30+ MHz. They did NOT design those rigs for Hams.

Bill


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:21 1996
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From: Ed Koeppel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: sale
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 19:46:39 -0800
Organization: Wolfe Internet Access, L.L.C.
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sea-ts4-p43.wolfenet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02Gold (Win95; I)

I have a 2 meter 440 radio for sale and it is an Alinco D R 600. It works fine
 and I
want 300.00 for it.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:22 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-13.sprintlink.net!ratty.wolfe.net!usenet
From: Ed Koeppel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: sale
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 10:24:47 -0800
Organization: Wolfe Internet Access, L.L.C.
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sea-ts2-p41.wolfenet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02Gold (Win95; I)

I have a 2 meter 440 radio by alinco, model DR 600.  I would like $300.00 for
it and it
works well.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: [e-mail] (Doug Wittich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: sale
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 04:29:35 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc041036.concentric.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Ed Koeppel <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have a 2 meter 440 radio by alinco, model DR 600.  I would like $300.00 for
 it and it
>works well.

I wish when people advertised here that they would list their
location, and what kind of shipping arrangements are expected.    I've
seen a few ads I'd like to respond to, but there's just not enough
info to make it worth the risk.   Maybe I'm soured because a friend of
mine got ripped off buying a radio that was DOA from someone 1000
miles away, thanks to message conferences such as this.


Doug


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:23 1996
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From: Ed Koeppel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: sale
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 00:04:18 -0800
Organization: Wolfe Internet Access, L.L.C.
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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I have an Alinco D.r.  600  that is in great working condition.  I have the du
plexer and
the manual and the mobile mount.  I am asking 300.00 for it.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:24 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 14:34:56 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <58rpej$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip-7-17.slip.shore.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>>I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
>>the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
>>since you're a code robot.

>>                        Jerry

>After doing extensive scientific reasearch in the Marianas Trench, the deepes
t
>part of the ocean anywhere in the world,  research scientists have come to th
e
>the scientific conclusion that there is only one thing lower than whale shit
-
>and that is someone who criticizes spelling mistakes on the internet.

>73, Jim KH2D

Yeah I've heard that.  There is much more pressure per square inch too
than in the Mariana Trench.

73, jim wk1v





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:25 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Scientific Find !!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 20:39:34 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <58quq2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-131.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
>the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
>since you're a code robot.

>                        Jerry

After doing extensive scientific reasearch in the Marianas Trench, the deepest

part of the ocean anywhere in the world,  research scientists have come to the

the scientific conclusion that there is only one thing lower than whale shit -
and that is someone who criticizes spelling mistakes on the internet.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:26 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 12:52:42 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]>
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (WinNT; I)

Jim Kehler wrote:
> After doing extensive scientific reasearch ...

Hey Jim, you mispelled research. :-)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:27 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: 13 Dec 1996 21:41:49 GMT
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <58siit$tt8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-205-200.in.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <58quq2$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writ
es:
>[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:
>
>>I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
>>the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
>>since you're a code robot.
>
>>                        Jerry
>
>After doing extensive scientific reasearch in the Marianas Trench, the deepes
t
>part of the ocean anywhere in the world,  research scientists have come to th
e
>the scientific conclusion that there is only one thing lower than whale shit
-
>and that is someone who criticizes spelling mistakes on the internet.
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
> You are correct in that analysis. But I'm puzzed Jim, why does your spelling
   bee-meister have his name Gerald on top of the note, but Jerry on bottom?
  Wouldn't it be Gerry or Jerald?  From an actual Bee Meister (1959 Chicago
  Sun Times), some of the concepts and quotes that come flying by in this
  medium make spelling look a little trite.
>

                                                 73,  Jim W9LZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 16:46:56 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <58ulm0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm4-11.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14  8:46:56 AM PST 1996

In <58quq2$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:
>
>[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:
>
>>I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
>>the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
>>since you're a code robot.
>
>>                        Jerry
>
>After doing extensive scientific reasearch in the Marianas Trench, the
deepest
>part of the ocean anywhere in the world,  research scientists have
come to the
>the scientific conclusion that there is only one thing lower than
whale shit -
>and that is someone who criticizes spelling mistakes on the internet.
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>

Your buddy Steve is going to be annoyed with you for that comment.
After all that was his main objection to Carl's posting for months. In
fact I seem to recall you joining the feeding frenzy careful of those
feet of clay in all that humidity. To be technically precise is was a
gramatical correction and I failed to state that explicity but not
being a Code Robot I have to learn to live with my imperfections.


Mayhap you really didn't like the term "Code Robot". I rather like it
myself. BTW squid manure is found lower than whale manure. Manure is
six letter word that replaces your less elegant four letter one. Now
that I have saved you a trip to the dictionary you may thank me.

                    Jerry




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 17:02:00 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <58umi8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <58rpej$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm4-11.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14 11:02:00 AM CST 1996

In <58rpej$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
writes:
>
>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:
>
>>[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:
>
>>>I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
>>>the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
>>>since you're a code robot.
>
>>>                        Jerry
>
>>After doing extensive scientific reasearch in the Marianas Trench,
the deepest
>>part of the ocean anywhere in the world,  research scientists have
come to the
>>the scientific conclusion that there is only one thing lower than
whale shit -
>>and that is someone who criticizes spelling mistakes on the internet.

>
>>73, Jim KH2D
>
>Yeah I've heard that.  There is much more pressure per square inch too
>than in the Mariana Trench.
>
>73, jim wk1v
>

Making a big deal out of spelling and/or grammatical errors is
perfectly OK though when it is directed it the nocode crowd. Perhaps
you missed the huge number of insults hurled at Carl for his typos
including fun poked at his handicap. You procode folks sure make a
fella proud. I think I'll go pound some brass so I can be just like
you.

                            Jerry




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:31 1996
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 23:23:17 GMT
Organization: -
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <58rpej$[e-mail]> <58umi8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14  5:24:37 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201

On 14 Dec 1996 17:02:00 GMT, [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
wrote:
>
>Making a big deal out of spelling and/or grammatical errors is
>perfectly OK though when it is directed it the nocode crowd. Perhaps
>you missed the huge number of insults hurled at Carl for his typos
>including fun poked at his handicap. You procode folks sure make a
>fella proud. I think I'll go pound some brass so I can be just like
>you.
>
>                            Jerry
>
What is Carl's handicap? Carl is not CW-impaired, he has posted that
at one time he could copy 20 wpm. With that handicap he should be an
extra not a tech plus when you include all his technical knowledge.
Carl presents himself as flame bait and does a very good job of it.

To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:32 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: 15 Dec 1996 02:10:29 GMT
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <58vmml$1ih6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <58rpej$[e-mail]> <58umi8$[e-mail]>
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In <58umi8$[e-mail]>, [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt
 ) writes:
>In <58rpej$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
>writes:
>>
>>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:
>>
>>>[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:
>>
>>>>I see that CW has not done much for your spelling. The way you used
>>>>the word, it is spelled "you're" but you know more than anyone else
>>>>since you're a code robot.
>>
>>>>                        Jerry
>>
>>>After doing extensive scientific reasearch in the Marianas Trench,
>the deepest
>>>part of the ocean anywhere in the world,  research scientists have
>come to the
>>>the scientific conclusion that there is only one thing lower than
>whale shit -
>>>and that is someone who criticizes spelling mistakes on the internet.
>
>>
>>>73, Jim KH2D
>>
>>Yeah I've heard that.  There is much more pressure per square inch too
>>than in the Mariana Trench.
>>
>>73, jim wk1v
>>
>
>Making a big deal out of spelling and/or grammatical errors is
>perfectly OK though when it is directed it the nocode crowd. Perhaps
>you missed the huge number of insults hurled at Carl for his typos
>including fun poked at his handicap. You procode folks sure make a
>fella proud. I think I'll go pound some brass so I can be just like
>you.
>
>                            Jerry
>
>
 Jerry,
 There ya go! Now that you've seen the light, it'll be as easy as 123.
 Enjoy your new hobby, and us pro-coders would all like a QSO with
 you. Sincere best wishes.

                                      Jim


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: 15 Dec 1996 00:08:31 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <58vfhv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <58rpej$[e-mail]> <58umi8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm4-06.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 14  4:08:31 PM PST 1996

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (A.G. von
Luternow) writes:
>
>On 14 Dec 1996 17:02:00 GMT, [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
>wrote:
>>
>>Making a big deal out of spelling and/or grammatical errors is
>>perfectly OK though when it is directed it the nocode crowd. Perhaps
>>you missed the huge number of insults hurled at Carl for his typos
>>including fun poked at his handicap. You procode folks sure make a
>>fella proud. I think I'll go pound some brass so I can be just like
>>you.
>>
>>                            Jerry
>>
>What is Carl's handicap? Carl is not CW-impaired, he has posted that
>at one time he could copy 20 wpm. With that handicap he should be an
>extra not a tech plus when you include all his technical knowledge.
>Carl presents himself as flame bait and does a very good job of it.
>
>

Carl has a back problem for which he had surgery. At the time of the
surgery there were a number of insults directed at his medical problem.
While I admit that his style is baiting I don't really understand the
hate directed at him. OTOH Len's postings that I have read seem logical
orderly just simply anti code testing. For this he is rewarded with
stupid nicknames and insults about his age. What is interesting is
after all the fuss made about Carl's spelling/typos by the procode
crowd one of their own gets a little flack for a grammatical slip
they go nuts. If it look like a hypocrite and it talks like a hypocrite
what might it be?




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:34 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 02:14:19 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <590r5q$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <58ulm0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>Mayhap you really didn't like the term "Code Robot". I rather like it
>myself. BTW squid manure is found lower than whale manure. Manure is
>six letter word that replaces your less elegant four letter one. Now
>that I have saved you a trip to the dictionary you may thank me.

>                    Jerry

PoP GoeS The WeaSel.  Code Robot is fine, Jerry, you call me whatever
blows your dress up.  Tis the season to be Jolly, you know.  I'll take your
word on squid manure being lower than whale shit, you should know, you've
been there.  Thank you. Happie Hollidays.

73, Jim KH2D
P.S. I don't have a dictionary. But maybe Sandy Claws will bring me one, you
never know........







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:35 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 02:29:08 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <590s1j$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <58rpej$[e-mail]> <58umi8$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>>Yeah I've heard that.  There is much more pressure per square inch too
>>than in the Mariana Trench.
>>
>>73, jim wk1v
>>

>Making a big deal out of spelling and/or grammatical errors is
>perfectly OK though when it is directed it the nocode crowd.

HONK !! WRONG ANSWER !! Check your dictionary one more
time Gerald, the above is NOT a sentence.  I know, don't tell me,
you have a disability too.

>Perhaps
>you missed the huge number of insults hurled at Carl for his typos
>including fun poked at his handicap. You procode folks sure make a
>fella proud. I think I'll go pound some brass so I can be just like
>you.

>                            Jerry

Please don't make me repost the 'Best of Squiggie' at Christmas time.
Don't worry about your dad, Carl. He's safe. We haven't hurled anything
at him hard enuff to hurt him. Yet. But wait 'till we catch him at Dayton...

And if you wanna be just like me, Jerry, you'll have to learn how to fondle
plastic. Gently. The same way you would fondle a womans cli...... never mind.

I don't pound brass. Too slow.  Say HI to the squids for me. What do you do
with that squid poop anyway, put it in your garden or in your seafood salid ?

Merry Christmas,

Jim KH2D

This Message Was Posted on Company Time with A Company Internet Account.
Please Email Complaints to My Employer at [e-mail]

This Message Contains Several Intentional Spelling Errors So That Gerald Has
Something Constructive To Do Between Now and Sandy Claws Day.







From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:36 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Martin, WK1V)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 19:45:45 GMT
Organization: Shore.Net/Eco Software, Inc; ([e-mail])
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <591kd6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Cecil Moore <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Jim Kehler wrote:
>> After doing extensive scientific reasearch ...

>Hey Jim, you mispelled research. :-)

Ouch! Aren't you bein' a little hard on him Cecil? hehehehe



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:37 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Scientific Find !!
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 02:52:28 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <590tda$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qmdv$[e-mail]> <58quq2$[e-mail]> <58rpej$[e-mail]> <58umi8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow) wrote:

>On 14 Dec 1996 17:02:00 GMT, [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
>wrote:
>>
>>Making a big deal out of spelling and/or grammatical errors is
>>perfectly OK though when it is directed it the nocode crowd. Perhaps
>>you missed the huge number of insults hurled at Carl for his typos
>>including fun poked at his handicap. You procode folks sure make a
>>fella proud. I think I'll go pound some brass so I can be just like
>>you.
>>
>>                            Jerry
>>
>What is Carl's handicap?

He has numerous handicaps.  To mention a few:

1. He's Morsely Challenged. 20 WPM was years ago. His wetware is drying up.

2. He's has chronic keyboard dislexia, a disease which causes him to press the
wrong keys when he is typing, and makes him realize that nothing he types is
important enuff to waste any of his time fixing the mistakes.

3. He suffers from fccpetitionphobia, a disease which causes him to believe an
y
no code petitions to the FCC will be rejected.

4.  He doen't believe in Magic.

5.  Gerald is his friend.


73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:38 1996
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From: [e-mail] ( Bill Walker)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Followup-To: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 16 Dec 1996 17:44:43 GMT
Organization: East Central University
Lines: 29
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32790 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44488 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120871

David P. Hummel, Jr. ([e-mail]) wrote:
: I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
: of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
: hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
: a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
: I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
: suggestions?

: Thank you in advance.
: David P. Hummel, Jr.
: KG2BX

Any of several solutions come to mind.  The folks that dig septic
tanks have equipment to dig holes like what you describe.  They are
usually quite reasonable.  Any good backhoe service would be able to
dig it for you.  The folks who dig piers for house foundations also
are able to move dirt.

I had a tower base dug, and the cost was only about $50 from scratch.
On another job, where the machinery was already present for another purpose,
it was a "freebie".

Good luck es 73 de W5GFE



--
Bill Walker
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:39 1996
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From: "David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: 16 Dec 1996 15:41:19 GMT
Organization: InternetMCI
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>
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I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
suggestions?

Thank you in advance.
David P. Hummel, Jr.
KG2BX



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:40 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Prescott)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: 16 Dec 1996 17:05:08 GMT
Organization: The Unorganization
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <593vg4$[e-mail]>
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David,

Contact your local utilities company. They often have drilling rigs to
put down telephone/light poles. I use one from a private electrical
contractor. Please be careful on your "new to you" tower. Contact the
manufacturer for proper guying procedures/anchor specs. Please inspect
it very carefully for rust, corrosion, etc. Check inside tubes if not
solid rod. Update life insurance policy!

73
Mark Prescott
KE4LWP

In article <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After
months
>of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was
the
>hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can
dig
>a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft
deep?
>I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?
Any
>suggestions?
>
>Thank you in advance.
>David P. Hummel, Jr.
>KG2BX
>



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:41 1996
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From: "Mark Bryant" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: 17 Dec 1996 01:58:49 GMT
Organization: SOHObusiness Services
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <01bbebbe$5ba56460$a3d879a8@soho>
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A bit of advice on using a backhoe to dig the hole for a tower.  All tower
mfgs strongly suggest you NOT use any back hoe type digging.  Reason is you
need to dig the hole straight down, pour concrete and let the concrete use
the sides of the ground as part of its support.  If you backhoe a 45 cubic
foot hole you cannot "backfill the excess hole after the concrete form is
poured.  The backfill cannot support the lateral tension of the concrete.

I just did a 4x4x6 hole two weeks ago.  I used a post hole digger making a
6 hole grid and then cleared the rest with a shovel.  Think of
gravedigging, I know I did.

Mark

 Bill Walker <[e-mail]> wrote in article <5941qb$[e-mail]>...
> David P. Hummel, Jr. ([e-mail]) wrote:
> : I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After
months
> : of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was
the
> : hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can
dig
> : a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft
deep?
> : I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?
Any
> : suggestions?
>
> : Thank you in advance.
> : David P. Hummel, Jr.
> : KG2BX
>
> Any of several solutions come to mind.  The folks that dig septic
> tanks have equipment to dig holes like what you describe.  They are
> usually quite reasonable.  Any good backhoe service would be able to
> dig it for you.  The folks who dig piers for house foundations also
> are able to move dirt.
>
> I had a tower base dug, and the cost was only about $50 from scratch.
> On another job, where the machinery was already present for another
purpose,
> it was a "freebie".
>
> Good luck es 73 de W5GFE
>
>
>
> --
> Bill Walker
> [e-mail]
>


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:43 1996
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From: "Wendell - W5FL" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: 17 Dec 1996 02:06:51 GMT
Organization: Wyly Enterprises
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <01bbebbe$cb9565e0$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>
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David, This is a very uncommon size hole for a tower.  Most guyed towers
are set in this size hole, but not this deep.  Most self supporting towers
are set in much larger holes depending on the height.  Most larger towers
use 4 holes about this size, one for each leg.  It would help if you state
what type tower you are putting up and the antennas you plan to put on it.

I had to call a pier drilling truck (they also set poles for the utility
company).  They charge anywhere from $60 to $100 per hour from the time
they leave their shop.  They can dig a hole like this in 30 minutes in
normal soil or a couple of hours of so in rock.  It cost me $480 for 8
hours to dig my antenna holes in rock.  There were four 18 inch x 5 1/2 ft
and 1 30 inch x 4 1/2 foot plus a 9 inch x 9 foot trying to get through the
rock for a ground rod, but it never came out the other side.  Good Luck.

> hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can
dig
> a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft
deep?
> I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
> suggestions?



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:44 1996
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From: Bill Wyatt <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 16:48:53 +0000
Organization: OneNet
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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To: "David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32835 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44551 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120951

David P. Hummel, Jr. wrote:
>
 Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
> a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
> I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
> suggestions?
>
> Thank you in advance.
> David P. Hummel, Jr.
> KG2BX

Good day one and all.......

David as for the backhoe, forget it......I've spent a number of years
running one and unless you have one of the really small ones, you can't
dig a hole 2.5 ft. in diameter and 6.5 ft. deep.  It just can't happen
and leave the surrounding ground undisturbed.  Sorry.

Having spent some time in the world of construction, the way I see it
you have 2 choices.  1.  Gat a shovel and someone with a small kester
that can dig and fit into a 2.5 ft. hole.  Yes, I know it is not very
likely but, it is a way.  2. Talk with the local electric company. They
have a truck that is used to set electric poles which has an auger that
can dig a round hole.  Most of these trucks will dig somewhere between
18 and 30 in..  Some have differant sized augers to dig the needed dia.
hole.

If you can talk them into digging the hole you may have to exchange
diameter for depth.  I'm sure there are some eng. type folks out there
that can give you the numbers but, I would thing 18-20 in. dia. and 8-9
ft. deep would be a good exchange for the requested 2.5 ft. x 6.5 ft..
Remember, put some re-bar steel in the cement base to hold the thing
together.

Hope this helps......and please I'm not trying to put anyone down on the
backhoe deal.....It's just that the physics of the way they dig that
won't let them do this paticular job.

73's and good luck with your tower.......

Bill   N5WO


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:45 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Al Rodecap)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 10:52:06 GMT
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <595tvi$1l08$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>
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"David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
>of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
>hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
>a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
>I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
>suggestions?

>Thank you in advance.
>David P. Hummel, Jr.
>KG2BX

You can rent a small (very small) backhoe or trencher and dig the
proper hole. Alternatively, see if you can catch someone in your area
that is having some septic, sewer, drive, or other excavation done and
offer the guy running the equipment some cash to dig your hole.

Al Rodecap
WD9AGT




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:33:50 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
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Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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In article <01bbebbe$5ba56460$a3d879a8@soho>, "Mark Bryant"
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>A bit of advice on using a backhoe to dig the hole for a tower.  All tower
>mfgs strongly suggest you NOT use any back hoe type digging.  Reason is you
>need to dig the hole straight down, pour concrete and let the concrete use
>the sides of the ground as part of its support.  If you backhoe a 45 cubic
>foot hole you cannot "backfill the excess hole after the concrete form is
>poured.  The backfill cannot support the lateral tension of the concrete.

A good back hoe operator can dig a straight hole.  I've got a 5 x 5 x 8
tower footing in my back yard and it was dug in about an hour by an
experienced operator using a two-foot bucket.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:47 1996
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From: [e-mail] ( Bill Walker)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Followup-To: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 17 Dec 1996 21:28:19 GMT
Organization: East Central University
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Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59739j$[e-mail]>
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Dick Flanagan ([e-mail]) wrote:


: A good back hoe operator can dig a straight hole.  I've got a 5 x 5 x 8
: tower footing in my back yard and it was dug in about an hour by an
: experienced operator using a two-foot bucket.
: --

        I second the motion.  We have a backhoe man here (Ada, Oklahoma)
        that I swear can do almost _anything_ with a backhoe.  It never
        would occur to me to use the word "delicate" with regard to
        a backhoe, but this fellow is a pure artist!

        73 de Bill W5GFE

--
Bill Walker
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:48 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Mike Del Pozzo)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 06:10:32 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <597naq$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>
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"David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
>of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
>hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
>a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
>I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
>suggestions?

>Thank you in advance.
>David P. Hummel, Jr.
>KG2BX

Hello David;
I know noone wants to hear the old macho story about how
an induvidual completes an unbeleivable feat , but it was worth
the exercise and $$$ saved when I dug the base of my tower...
My tower is 80 ft , guyed, and the base is a 3 ft base section of
Rohn 25 sitting on 24 " of gravel ( big chunks ). My tower has
taken 2 direct strikes ( I think that's all ) and I could not ask for
a better ground as the rest of the shack remains unharmed. I dug
the hole with a post hole digger . Created a hole about 36" in DIA
and about 5 feet deep - so the top of the 36" section is flush with
the surface of the ground . Sitting on the gravel and who knows
how many miles of GA clay , the base is plenty sturdy after backfill.
Speaking of which : after you backfill you need to let the ground set
backup with frequent wattering.
I also had a guywire break once and the tower still hardly budged
I Have a 4 element Quad on a 30 foot boom up there .
Consider what ur putting up there first . and always listen to all the
great advice from those " who have been there - done that "
Gud Luck es 73 de
Mike KR4TG




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:49 1996
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From: Dennis Breeden <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 21:52:13 +0000
Organization: Reuter
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>
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David P. Hummel, Jr. wrote:
>
> I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
> of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
> hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
> a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
> I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
> suggestions?
>
> Thank you in advance.
> David P. Hummel, Jr.
> KG2BXI have used a spade shovel to break up the dirt and a military trenchin
g
tool to scoop the dirt.  Not easy but it does work.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:50 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: 18 Dec 1996 03:14:05 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <597nht$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]>
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Just to let everyone know, there is an email list devoted to towers.
Send an email to [e-mail] and only write:
subscribe
and you'll be hooked up. Remove the "-request" in the above address
to post.

73,
Jeff

P.S. Of vital importance, use the command     unsubscribe    to that
request address above when you want to unsub.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:51 1996
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From: [e-mail] (David Harmon)
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32873 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121029

In article <[e-mail]>,
Bill Wyatt  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>Having spent some time in the world of construction, the way I see it
>you have 2 choices.  1.  Gat a shovel and someone with a small kester
>that can dig and fit into a 2.5 ft. hole.  Yes, I know it is not very
>likely but, it is a way.  2. Talk with the local electric company. They

A few months ago, I saw a shovel in a hardware store that was just made
for such purposes.  It had a round spoon-like scooper about 10 inches in
diameter, on the end of a handle about 12 feet long.  That's all I remember.

(Newsgroups trimmed.)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:52 1996
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: John Fakan <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 22:48:08 -0500
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]>
Organization: U.S.S COD Submarine
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Bill Wyatt wrote:
>
> David P. Hummel, Jr. wrote:
> >
>  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
> > a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
> > I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
> > suggestions?
> >
> > Thank you in advance.
> > David P. Hummel, Jr.
> > KG2BX
>
> Good day one and all.......
>
> David as for the backhoe, forget it......I've spent a number of years
> running one and unless you have one of the really small ones, you can't
> dig a hole 2.5 ft. in diameter and 6.5 ft. deep.  It just can't happen
> and leave the surrounding ground undisturbed.  Sorry.
>
> Having spent some time in the world of construction, the way I see it
> you have 2 choices.  1.  Gat a shovel and someone with a small kester
> that can dig and fit into a 2.5 ft. hole.  Yes, I know it is not very
> likely but, it is a way.  2. Talk with the local electric company. They
> have a truck that is used to set electric poles which has an auger that
> can dig a round hole.  Most of these trucks will dig somewhere between
> 18 and 30 in..  Some have differant sized augers to dig the needed dia.
> hole.
>
> If you can talk them into digging the hole you may have to exchange
> diameter for depth.  I'm sure there are some eng. type folks out there
> that can give you the numbers but, I would thing 18-20 in. dia. and 8-9
> ft. deep would be a good exchange for the requested 2.5 ft. x 6.5 ft..
> Remember, put some re-bar steel in the cement base to hold the thing
> together.
>
> Hope this helps......and please I'm not trying to put anyone down on the
> backhoe deal.....It's just that the physics of the way they dig that
> won't let them do this paticular job.
>
> 73's and good luck with your tower.......
>
> Bill   N5WO


When I was a kid the electric companies did not have truck-mounted augers and
dug all of
the holes for telephone and power poles by hand.  I have watched them do many
and
remember well the tools they used.  One long-handled spade was used (intermitt
antly with
a very long crow-bar) to loosen the dirt (usually hard clay with imbedded rock
s).
Another long handled shovel had much of the blade formed to a ninety-degree an
gle so as
to provide a means for lifting the loosened dirt out of the hole.  As I recall
 the holes
were at least six foot deep or considerably deeper.  Two men would easily dig
two or
three holes per shift.

For a single hole I would expect you could make do with some jerry-rigged equi
valents of
the tools I described above.  The technique is the thing. Loosen a few inches
of the
packed earth and then lift it out of the hole. And then just keep at it until
you have
reached your goal.

John Fakan




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:53 1996
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 22:10:08 GMT
Lines: 58
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:32986 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44745 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121243

In article <[e-mail]> Art or Betty Eberle <[e-mail]
t> writes:
>David P. Hummel, Jr. wrote:
>>
>> I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
>> of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
>> hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
>> a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
>> I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
>> suggestions?
>>
>> Thank you in advance.
>> David P. Hummel, Jr.
>> KG2BX
>
>Why dig a hole 6.5 ft. deep?  Unless the tower is really tall and self
>supporting, you would be better with a hole about 3'x3'x3'.  Suggest you
>try to get hold of a copy of the Rohn or Heights tower manual.  They
>give suggestions on how to design and make tower bases.
>
>If the tower is guyed, you can get by with a much smaller base.

The size of the base needed depends very much on local soil mechanics.
The tower base serves two purposes. It bears the weight of the tower,
and any loading that guys may impose. And it serves to resist the
overturning moment of the tower. Different soils can support different
ground pressures, and different soils have different resistances to
shear. There is no "one size fits all" for this sort of thing, but
in general deeper is better than wider.

Now my tower has almost a full section buried. In other words the
hole is 10 feet deep and has 2 feet of aggregate in the bottom. I
dug it by hand with a posthole digger. Not with an auger, with a
real posthole digger. I started the hole with the regular handles,
and changed to longer handles as the hole got deeper. It took two
leisurely mornings to finish (too hot to dig in the afternoon).

For a 6.5 foot hole, the standard handles will suffice. You just
have to get down and reach into the hole a bit to work them when
you get down near the bottom, the standard handles are about 5.5
feet long. It will help if you replace one of the wooden handles
with 1 inch galvanized water pipe, however, because the extra weight
makes the posthole digger dig better. Even in the hardpan clay here,
I can just drop the digger in the hole to get a bite, close the blades
with the handles, and lift out the dirt. That's a lot easier than
having to muscle the blades into the ground.

If you've never seen a real posthole digger, it is like two tile
spades facing each other, joined with a pivot near the bottom.
You drop it in the hole, spread the handles, which brings the
spades together trapping dirt between them, and lift it out of
the hole. Repeat as necessary until you are done.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:55 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Show some respect, please
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 08:56:39 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Roger:
      Iknow that you and I get along About as well as a Dragonrider
battling Thread, But I agree with you 1000 percent on how shabbily our
ELMERS are being treated by this Hi-tech addicted generation. most of
these gripers wouldn't know an ohm from a watt if it came up and bit them
on the ass.  Even with my limited intellect, I treat ANY elmer with the
upmost respect and reverence, as I know that these guys have forgotten
more about ham radio than I could ever hope to remember. Hell, I even
consider YOU an elmer. We may disagree on agreat many things, but I'm
just a babe in the woods here, with my humble,two month old Hamster
licence.But even a dummy like me knows that you don't treat ELMERS like
caca.They are indeed Ham radio's living tresure trove,and should be
treated as such.
                Dave/ KB2ZYO
                    The smallest brain to known man...


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:56 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!cbgw2.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Signing in the US (Foreign Call)
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 10:46:20 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bcpl$[e-mail]>
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One guy wrote:
: As you agree, Thomas must operate (when in Florida) within the US
: regulations for an Extra Class Licensee located in ITU Region 2 and
: also within the privileges of his home license.

The other guy wrote:
>As fas as I know, that is not the case. First Thomas' license is NOT
>valid in the U.S. Since the U.S. has a reciprocal operating treaty with
>the country that issued his license, he will be issued a U.S. license
>based on his home license and the treaty.

This is an old thread, so in case anyone still cares, the answer is so
simple. There's even a question on the Extra exam about it! If the
country of origin has a reciprocal agreement with the U.S., the foreign
ham will be issued a Reciprocal Operating Permit. He should sign his
call with the appropriate Wn/XXXXX nomenclature, i.e.: W2/BY1AA (of
COURSE China doesn't have the agreement; example ONLY).

There is no test, there is no U.S. "license" issued, nor is there a
special callsign. The foreign ham's privileges are limited to the
INTERSECTION of his privileges in his home country AND those of a U.S.
Amateur Extra class ham. So, if he can operate voice on 7050 at home, he
can still operate on that frequency here BUT only on CW/data as dictated
by our band plans. If he can operate on 4100 at home, he can't do that
here. Get it?

Other guy wrote:
> When I was in philadelphia, once the people on a repeater knew you,
> the full w3/.... callsign was used only for id. A foriegn ham normally
> threw out their original call.

That may have been nice on 2m when yacking with the boys, but it wasn't
proper operating procedure. Clearly, nobody would have thought that you
were actually hitting the local repeater by bouncing your signal over
the "pond," but you WERE operating in this country under the terms of
the reciprocal agreement, so you were not in accordance with its rules.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Silent Key Night
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 06:36:04 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59h4pn$[e-mail]>
References: <57qfj6$[e-mail]> <5966q3$[e-mail]> <597krd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599tbg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121304 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44479

[e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:

>SKN - Silent Key Night  get points for qso's with marconi, anderson and
>sarnoff.  Extra points for WA6VSE and Lennart

You might have sumthin' there, Stevie.  Maybe we could get the ARRL to
offer a WAC award (Worked All Corpses).  Squiggie and Lenny count for
extra points ? Why, cuz they are brain dead or because their keys have always
been silent ??

73, Jim KH2D
Support the ARRL - Join NOW !!
Call Toll Free - 1-888-277-5289 To Join.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:16:59 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!cbgw2.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!alice!allegra!ulysses!newshub.netnews.att.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Some respect, please!
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 10:17:22 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597ufd$[e-mail]>
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> I just smile an keep in mind that these dinosaurs will die eventually
> and hopefully won't infect too many young hams with their vile and
> annimosity to their fellow unwashed no-code hams.

Well now, that's a lovely attitude. You know, I really have a problem
with the all-too-frequent disdain that's expressed toward older hams.
Yeah, the "WW-II" guys. These people are a wealth of knowledge,
experience, and inspiration. And yes - sometimes they are stubborn,
close-minded, and opinionated. Those traits seem to be a "privilege" of
age. :)

Nevertheless, these folks have more to teach and to relate to you than
you will ever have the patience, time, sensitivity, and intelligence to
absorb. I have many fond memories of QSO's with OT's - it takes me to a
different time and place. I will be sorry when they're all gone. If you
don't care what they have to say, at least show some respect. Oh, and by
the way - I'm 29 myself.

> 73's and live better digitally an anologously  :)

What the $@#% does THAT mean? Who sez you don't know code!
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:00 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!169.207.30.10!newspump.sol.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Dale Harper)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 21 Dec 1996 03:09:48 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <59fkds$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597ufd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: clv-oh23-01.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Dec 20  7:09:48 PM PST 1996

In <[e-mail]> "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
writes:
>
>> I just smile an keep in mind that these dinosaurs will die
eventually
>> and hopefully won't infect too many young hams with their vile and
>> annimosity to their fellow unwashed no-code hams.
>
>Well now, that's a lovely attitude. You know, I really have a problem
>with the all-too-frequent disdain that's expressed toward older hams.
>Yeah, the "WW-II" guys. These people are a wealth of knowledge,
>experience, and inspiration. And yes - sometimes they are stubborn,
>close-minded, and opinionated. Those traits seem to be a "privilege"
of
>age. :)
>
>Nevertheless, these folks have more to teach and to relate to you than
>you will ever have the patience, time, sensitivity, and intelligence
to
>absorb. I have many fond memories of QSO's with OT's - it takes me to
a
>different time and place. I will be sorry when they're all gone. If
you
>don't care what they have to say, at least show some respect. Oh, and
by
>the way - I'm 29 myself.
>
>> 73's and live better digitally an anologously  :)
>
>What the $@#% does THAT mean? Who sez you don't know code!
>--
>==========================================================
>Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
>Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
>FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
>==========================================================

As the son of "one of those dinosaurs", your post was a most welcome
and kind sentiment. Too bad some wouldn't agree with you. The stories I
hear from him and others in his group are simply magical. I only hope
some of us will have that magic when we are "dinosaurs".

To any one of the negative posters who doesn't have a magical dinosaur,
GET ONE!

Dale
KC8FAQ

To the jerk who mused of the passing of older hams, I hope one of them
isn't your father. It'll be the saddest goddamn day of your life.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:01 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!lll-winken.llnl.gov!fnnews.fnal.gov!cbgw1.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Something else
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 10:08:25 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58oeee$[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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I just had to change the name of this thread, because if other people
respond and blindly leave the subject unchanged, I will go mad.

FYI, the subject was my misspelled name.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:02 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!news14.agis.net!agis!newsgod1.agis.net!news3.agis.net!agis!cancer.vividnet.com!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.direct.ca!portc01.blue.aol.com!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.tamu.edu!furuta
From: [e-mail] (Richard Furuta)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Source for license statistics?
Date: 20 Dec 1996 22:20:47 GMT
Organization: Center for the Study of Digital Libraries
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <59f3fv$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hrl8.cs.tamu.edu

Can anyone point me to a source for statistics on the current distribution of
US Amateur licenses?  How many Extras/Advanced/General/Tech+/Tech/Novice?
Thanks.

                                        --Rick
                                          [e-mail]
                                          K3IV



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:03 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.149.128.2!nntp.coast.net!ftl.msen.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Chris Oesterling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Southfield Michigan -- SWAP
Date: 9 Dec 1996 14:09:10 GMT
Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, MI.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <58h6i6$[e-mail]>
References: <586kti$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: conch.aa.msen.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

Gary ([e-mail]) wrote:
: On 5 Dec 1996 14:06:42 GMT, [e-mail] (Chris Oesterling)
: wrote:
:
: >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
: >Southfield High School's Technology Department 31st. Annual Swap & Shop
: >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
: >
: >Amateur Radio Equipment
: >Computers & Sotware
: >Electronic Parts & Equipment
: >Door Prizes
: >
: >Ticket $5.00
: >
: >8:00 AM to 3:00 PM
: >
: >Southfield High School
: >24675 Lahser Road
: >Southfield, MI  48034
: >
: >Call [phone] anytime form more information
: >
:
: I plan on attending .... but the *DATE* would be awful handy to know
: and it would save me long distance phone call ;)
:
: Gary K8IQ

Sorry about that! The date of the hamfest is Sunday, January 19.
- Chris N8UDK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:04 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Spell my name right!!
Date: 11 Dec 1996 18:27:55 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <58mufb$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ieb8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max5-so-ca-39.earthlink.net
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X-URL: news:[e-mail]

"Rodger that, Roger".  As said on the all-time epic "Airplane".




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsserv.freeway.net!news2.netdtw.com!rust.net!oxy.rust.net!news.provide.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Brett Collins)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Square wire
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 11:25:10 GMT
Organization: Provide.Net NetNews Site
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <595llm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr01-49.provide.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Does anyone know where I can get
square copper enamelled wire? I've seen
used in some hefty power supply transformers.

Thanks in advance,
Brett



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:05 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!nntp.crl.com!news.pbi.net!news.dp.beckman.com!inet.dp.beckman.com!newsmaster
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Square wire
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
From: Don Labriola <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 08:31:35 -0800
Reply-To: [e-mail]
References: <595llm$[e-mail]>
Distribution: world
Organization: DDC, Beckman Instruments, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: 134.217.101.126
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; I)
To: Brett Collins <[e-mail]>
Lines: 16

Brett Collins wrote:
>
> Does anyone know where I can get
> square copper enamelled wire? I've seen
> used in some hefty power supply transformers.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Brett

Brett,

Try MWS Wire Industries - [phone] in Westlake Village, CA. The
catalog is a couple of years old, but hopefully the number is still
correct.

73's de W6QS


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:06 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news1.sunbelt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (MALMOND)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Star Printer Info
Date: 13 Dec 1996 20:09:05 GMT
Organization: Markos Inc.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <58sd51$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-12.r01.nccncr.infoave.net
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.6+

I am looking for information on a Star NX-2400 printer. I picked it up at a
a HAMFEST back in the Summer. I would like to know how the DIP switches
are to be set for a IBM compatible computer. There are two banks of 8
switches. Without a manual, I don't know how to set them.
Any help will be most appreciative.

Mark (KD4YZO) 73,


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:07 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news1.infoave.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (MALMOND)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Star printer info
Date: 17 Dec 1996 20:05:01 GMT
Organization: Info Avenue INTERNET Access
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <596udd$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-15.r03.nccncr.infoave.net
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.6+

I brought a Star printer NX-2400 with no manual. I need the DIP setting
for a IBM compatible computer.
Mark...KD4YZO...73


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:09 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Stones River ARC New Webpage !
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:51:52 GMT
Organization: Texas Networking, Inc.
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max-2-104.nash.voyageronline.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.227

Come visit the Stones River ARC of Rutherford County, Tennessee at
http://www.voyageronline.net/~rfi/stones.html
We have some interesting links for you to check out including one
which allows you to take sample theory exams live online.  Much more
to be added including a large ham shareware archive, a YL page and
anything else we can dig up that is original unusual or on the cutting
edge of ham radio, cuz thats just the kind of folks we are.  Comments
welcomed.  Happy Holidays de Lee, KR4ND.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:10 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!snunews.snu.ac.kr!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!arclight.uoregon.edu!super.zippo.com!zdc!szdc!szdc-e!news
From: [e-mail] (Ian Rivlin)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tektronix C12 oscilloscope camera for sale
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 22:09:22 GMT
Organization: Zip News
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <58v8uf$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Tektronix C12 Oscilloscope camera for sale - all complete. Mint
condition. Optics perfect - has Polaroid back (works perfectly).
Reasonable offers please




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:11 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Mark S. Bond)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: telnet based callsign servers
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 21:07:10 -0500
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

> Is anyone having success with the telnet callsign server
> at electra.cs.buffalo.edu:2000 or callsign.cs.buffalo.edu:2000?
> Are there any other telnet based callsign servers running?
> Please reply direct email to [e-mail]


Jim try the Universtity of Arkansas at:

callsign.ualr.edu:2000

--mark

--
   .-.                                                         .-.
  /   \           .-.                           .-.           /   \
 /     \         /   \       .-.     .-.       /   \         /     \
/__Mark_S_Bond__W2MB__\_____/___\___/___\[e-mail]_\
         \     /       \   /     `-'     \   /       \     /
          \   /         `-'               `-'         \   /
           `-'                                         `-'


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:12 1996
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Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 18:58:13 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: telnet based callsign servers
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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Is anyone having success with the telnet callsign server
at electra.cs.buffalo.edu:2000 or callsign.cs.buffalo.edu:2000?
Are there any other telnet based callsign servers running?
Please reply direct email to [e-mail]

Thanks,
Jim Swaters / WB0IXI

UNIV. OF ARKANSAS CALL SIGN SERVER ADDRESS IS CORRECT FOR
CONVENTIONAL MAIL TO WB0IXI.
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:13 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: The 1928 Amateur Exam
Date: 15 Dec 1996 09:51:29 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120758 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44241

Talked to an OT today who received his ticket in 1928. He said there were
just two questions on his exam:
1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station, labeling
all component values.
2. State the purpose of each component within the circuit.

He said it took him 8 hours to complete that exam. Then he had to
take the code test from a government landline code operator. The
problem there was that the LL op only knew Continental Morse!

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:13 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dale Holloway)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The 1928 Amateur Exam
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 23:56:36 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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The Continental Morse is what we use today.

Dale, NJ8X

On 15 Dec 1996 09:51:29 GMT, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
wrote:

>Talked to an OT today who received his ticket in 1928. He said there were
>just two questions on his exam:
>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station, labeling
>all component values.
>2. State the purpose of each component within the circuit.
>
>He said it took him 8 hours to complete that exam. Then he had to
>take the code test from a government landline code operator. The
>problem there was that the LL op only knew Continental Morse!
>
>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:15 1996
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From: [e-mail] (R. A. Green)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The 1928 Amateur Exam
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 07:25:20 GMT
Organization: .
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On 15 Dec 1996 09:51:29 GMT, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
wrote:

>Talked to an OT today who received his ticket in 1928. He said there were
>just two questions on his exam:
>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station, labeling
>all component values.
>2. State the purpose of each component within the circuit.
>
>He said it took him 8 hours to complete that exam. Then he had to
>take the code test from a government landline code operator. The
>problem there was that the LL op only knew Continental Morse!
>
>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
YOW! How old IS this guy??
Does anyone know what this exam was about? In 1928 were there
different classes of licenses, or did you basically either <become an
operator or not>? I mean was it like going from being "just some guy
with a radio" to advanced class?

--ron


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:17 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dale Holloway)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The 1928 Amateur Exam
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 11:40:05 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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References: <590hn1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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I've gotten some e-mail saying I was incorrect in saying we use
the Continental Morse Code today--that it's the International
Morse Code. Both are correct. The Continental Morse code is also
called the International. These are being confused with the
American Morse Code. My 1991 ARRL code proficiency certificate
calls it the Continental Code. Also, please check out the
following site. 73.

Dale, NJ8X

On Sun, 15 Dec 1996 23:56:36 GMT, [e-mail] (Dale
Holloway) wrote:

>The Continental Morse is what we use today.
>
>Dale, NJ8X
>
>On 15 Dec 1996 09:51:29 GMT, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
>wrote:
>
>>Talked to an OT today who received his ticket in 1928. He said there were
>>just two questions on his exam:
>>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station, labeling
>>all component values.
>>2. State the purpose of each component within the circuit.
>>
>>He said it took him 8 hours to complete that exam. Then he had to
>>take the code test from a government landline code operator. The
>>problem there was that the LL op only knew Continental Morse!
>>
>>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
>



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dale Holloway)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The 1928 Amateur Exam
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 11:56:00 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <590hn1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120847 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44280

I've gotten some e-mail saying I was incorrect in saying we use
the Continental Morse Code today--that it's the International
Morse Code. Both are correct. The Continental Morse code is also
called the International. These are being confused with the
American Morse Code. My 1961 ARRL code proficiency certificate
calls it the Continental Code. Also, please check out the
following site. 73.

Dale, NJ8X

On Sun, 15 Dec 1996 23:56:36 GMT, [e-mail] (Dale
Holloway) wrote:

>The Continental Morse is what we use today.
>
>Dale, NJ8X
>
>On 15 Dec 1996 09:51:29 GMT, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
>wrote:
>
>>Talked to an OT today who received his ticket in 1928. He said there were
>>just two questions on his exam:
>>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station, labeling
>>all component values.
>>2. State the purpose of each component within the circuit.
>>
>>He said it took him 8 hours to complete that exam. Then he had to
>>take the code test from a government landline code operator. The
>>problem there was that the LL op only knew Continental Morse!
>>
>>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
>



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:18 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The 1928 Amateur Exam
Date: 16 Dec 1996 07:51:19 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <592v1n$[e-mail]>
References: <590hn1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120856 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44287

R. A. Green <[e-mail]> wrote:
>On 15 Dec 1996 09:51:29 GMT, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
>wrote:

>>Talked to an OT today who received his ticket in 1928. He said there were
>>just two questions on his exam:
>>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station, labeling
>>all component values.
>>2. State the purpose of each component within the circuit.

>YOW! How old IS this guy??

He was born in 1910. He's my source for firebottles for my tube rigs.
He's got lots of hair-raising stories of working in FAA comms for
some 30 years.

Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:19 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: The 1928 Amateur Exam
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <590hn1$[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 11:28:10 GMT
Lines: 21
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121197 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44438

In article <590hn1$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) wr
ites:
>Talked to an OT today who received his ticket in 1928. He said there were
>just two questions on his exam:
>1. Draw the schematic diagram of a complete amateur station, labeling
>all component values.
>2. State the purpose of each component within the circuit.
>
>He said it took him 8 hours to complete that exam. Then he had to
>take the code test from a government landline code operator. The
>problem there was that the LL op only knew Continental Morse!

Odd, most US LL operators only knew American Morse. The Continental
(European) Code, now called the International Code, is what we use
on the radio.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:20 1996
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 11:50:14 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
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Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>
> >How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when you
> >really mean "I",
>
> Because then we'd be scolded by Burp for using too many I's. (Recall
> Burp's IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII posting.) Besides, continually
> saying "I..." begins to sound self-centered and arrogant (sort of like
> J.Mackey, as in "I operate about five repeaters").
>
> Jeff KH2PZ

Who the hell is "Burp" and who cares what he thinks? In what other area
of one's social life is it necessary to avoid using "I", instead using a
pronoun which is COMPLETELY inaccurate? (unless you have the proverbial
mouse in your pocket)

I once read some psychologist's theory on this: many people are not
completely comfortable talking to strangers, nor with having the world
hear what they are saying. There is a subconscious comfort in saying
"we" as opposed to "I". That explanation makes some sense. How else
could such a ridiculous habit proliferate like it has?

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:21 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 12 Dec 1996 01:55:30 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <58nomi$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]> <58l89d$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

Dave Burr  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>>someone@somewhere

>> >How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when you
>> >really mean "I",

>> Because then we'd be scolded by Burp for using too many I's. (Recall
>> Burp's IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII posting.) Besides, continually
>> saying "I..." begins to sound self-centered and arrogant (sort of like
>> J.Mackey, as in "I operate about five repeaters").

>Who the hell is "Burp" and who cares what he thinks?

"Burp" is Burt after he's had a bit too much to drink.

>In what other area
>of one's social life is it necessary to avoid using "I", instead using a
>pronoun which is COMPLETELY inaccurate? (unless you have the proverbial
>mouse in your pocket)
>I once read some psychologist's theory on this: many people are not
>completely comfortable talking to strangers, nor with having the world
>hear what they are saying. There is a subconscious comfort in saying
>"we" as opposed to "I". That explanation makes some sense. How else
>could such a ridiculous habit proliferate like it has?

Maybe the operator is emotionally close to his radio and really does
mean "we"? Or, maybe the operator has someone else in the shack/car and
really does mean "we"?

Does it really matter? If so, don't enter into a QSO with someone
who speaks in the second person.

But note that many radio broadcast talk show hosts also speak in the
second person, so this habit isn't confined to just the ham bands.

KH2PZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:22 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Robert E. Garland)
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Sender: [e-mail] (news)
Organization: The KD3BJ Usenet BBS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58agr1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 01:53:46 GMT
Lines: 49

[e-mail] (CDN) writes:

>Dave Burr <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>On the subject of bizarre ham habits:
>>I agree about the CW abbevs and "W2XYZ for ID", but saying "nothing
>>heard" is just another (maybe strange)way of saying "I give up. If
>>someone else is waiting to make a call, go for it"  I think that is a
>>courteous way to operate. Otherwise, others waiting to make a call don't
>>know for sure when the calling party is done and just have to wait for
>>some arbitrary period.
>>
>>My personal habit is to say, after a couple of unsuccessful calls, "K9XK
>>clear", but there are a zillion ways to do it.
>>
>>How about a couple more weird habits, like always saying "We" when you
>>really mean "I", and saying "73s" instead of "73". These are probably
>>the two most popular weird ham habits.
>>
Actually, the "Editorial" or "Royal" We predates ham radio.  Also, in my
experience, the people using 73s instead of 73 usually came from the CB
ranks.



>>Dave
>>K9XK


>My favorite is listening on the local Repeater Ass'n machine to two
>neophites discussing the relative merits of different 2M rigs.

>Neo --- "This is the Comwoodyea .4 running 2 watts ... give me a
>report"
>Phite - "Rodyer 10-4, you are six LED segments"
>Neo --- "Thanks..."    silence
>Neo --- "Now this is the Yeawoodcom 20000 with the 500 watt brick, How
>does it sound?"
>Phite - "Hmmm...I can't tell any difference.  That's strange, with all
>that power you should be stronger than that!"
>Neo --- "10-4, the Yawoodcom goes back to the dealer!"



--
     Robert Garland                            NX3S @ N3ACL.PA.USA.NOAM
     Hilltown Township Bucks County               [e-mail]
     Pennsylvania USA                                       Grid FN20ii
                         "Ham Radio is a calling"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:24 1996
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From: George Baker <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 23:37:41 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 29
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Dave Burr wrote:
>
> > I once read some psychologist's theory on this: many people are not
> completely comfortable talking to strangers, nor with having the world
> hear what they are saying. There is a subconscious comfort in saying
> "we" as opposed to "I". That explanation makes some sense. How else
> could such a ridiculous habit proliferate like it has?
>
> Dave
> K9XK

Here is another slant on it:

In a pre-WW2 issue of QST, someone wrote in complaining about the use of "we"
instead of
"I" in ham conversation - funny how that same subject is still in debate!

Anyway, one response was that it was ok to say "we" since indeed there are two
 entities
involved: the operator and his station. When we say that "we" worked so-and-so
, we are
actually giving credit to the station as much as to the operator.

In those olden days, our equipment was very much a part of ourselves since it
was
largely self-designed and homebuilt. So, it was natural to feel a certain comp
anionship
with our rigs which expressed itself in the unconscious use of "we" in describ
ing "our"
activities.

--
73, George
W5YR
Fairview, TX


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:25 1996
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From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 18:36:38 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
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George Baker wrote:
>
> Anyway, one response was that it was ok to say "we" since indeed there are t
wo entities  involved: the operator and his station. When we say that "we" wor
ked

So if I drive ALONE to meet my wife and have some loving I can
say "we are going to make out with our wife?" (The other "we" is the car
of course)

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:26 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 12 Dec 1996 16:14:28 GMT
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <58pb14$1omk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]> <58l89d$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, George Baker <[e-mail]> writes:
>Dave Burr wrote:
>>
>> > I once read some psychologist's theory on this: many people are not
>> completely comfortable talking to strangers, nor with having the world
>> hear what they are saying. There is a subconscious comfort in saying
>> "we" as opposed to "I". That explanation makes some sense. How else
>> could such a ridiculous habit proliferate like it has?
>>
>> Dave
>> K9XK
>
>Here is another slant on it:
>
>In a pre-WW2 issue of QST, someone wrote in complaining about the use of "we"
 instead of
>"I" in ham conversation - funny how that same subject is still in debate!
>
>Anyway, one response was that it was ok to say "we" since indeed there are tw
o entities
>involved: the operator and his station. When we say that "we" worked so-and-s
o, we are
>actually giving credit to the station as much as to the operator.
>
>In those olden days, our equipment was very much a part of ourselves since it
 was
>largely self-designed and homebuilt. So, it was natural to feel a certain com
panionship
>with our rigs which expressed itself in the unconscious use of "we" in descri
bing "our"
>activities.
>
>--
>73, George
>W5YR
>Fairview, TX

  If you have ever had to walk through some of the aisles at Dayton, or other
 confined hamfest spaces, there is a real meaning BEHIND some of our fellow
 hobbyists with regards to we!

                                                        - Jim


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:27 1996
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From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 09:03:38 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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George Baker wrote:

>
> In a pre-WW2 issue of QST, someone wrote in complaining about the use of "we
" instead of
> "I" in ham conversation - funny how that same subject is still in debate!
>
> Anyway, one response was that it was ok to say "we" since indeed there are t
wo entities
> involved: the operator and his station. When we say that "we" worked so-and-
so, we are
> actually giving credit to the station as much as to the operator.
>
> In those olden days, our equipment was very much a part of ourselves since i
t was
> largely self-designed and homebuilt. So, it was natural to feel a certain co
mpanionship
> with our rigs which expressed itself in the unconscious use of "we" in descr
ibing "our"
> activities.
>
> --
> 73, George
> W5YR
> Fairview, TX


I once asked anaother HAM why he used "we" instead of "I" and he started off o
n a minor relegious sermon on
how "we" are not alone.


Jim..


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:28 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: 13 Dec 1996 21:47:47 GMT
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58siu3$tt8$[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]>, Andrew C Robertson <[e-mail]> writes:
>Burt Fisher wrote:
>>
>> So if I drive ALONE to meet my wife and have some loving I can
>> say "we are going to make out with our wife?" (The other "we" is the
>> car of course)
>
>Whatever floats your boat.
>
>drewbob

  Burt, sorry drewbob, to who would you be saying this to? Your car? Or to
  your special imaginary friend?

                                                   Jim



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:29 1996
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From: Andrew C Robertson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 10:33:46 -0500
Organization: Massachvsetts Institvte of Technology
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Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> So if I drive ALONE to meet my wife and have some loving I can
> say "we are going to make out with our wife?" (The other "we" is the
> car of course)

Whatever floats your boat.

drewbob


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:30 1996
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From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 21:35:13 -0700
Organization: Network Service
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>
>   Burt, sorry drewbob, to who would you be saying this to? Your car? Or to
>   your special imaginary friend?

Should be "To Whom"


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:31 1996
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From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 21:36:59 -0700
Organization: Network Service
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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>
> I once asked anaother HAM why he used "we" instead of "I" and he started off
 on a minor relegious sermon on
> how "we" are not alone.
>
He's absolutely right. I'm sitting here with the Lord writing this
letter and We just thought youw'd like to know that.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:32 1996
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From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 20:11:16 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]> <58l89d$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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jim daneke wrote:
>
> >
> > I once asked anaother HAM why he used "we" instead of "I" and he started o
ff on a minor relegious sermon on
> > how "we" are not alone.
> >
> He's absolutely right. I'm sitting here with the Lord writing this
> letter and We just thought youw'd like to know that.

One would _think_ that someone with enough smarts to get a Ham license would k
now better..


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:33 1996
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From: "J. Andy Thompson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 08:52:24 -0800
Organization: Thompson Realtors
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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George Baker wrote:

>
> Here is another slant on it:
>
> In a pre-WW2 issue of QST, someone wrote in complaining about the use of "we
" instead of
> "I" in ham conversation - funny how that same subject is still in debate!
>
> Anyway, one response was that it was ok to say "we" since indeed there are t
wo entities
> involved: the operator and his station. When we say that "we" worked so-and-
so, we are
> actually giving credit to the station as much as to the operator.
>
> In those olden days, our equipment was very much a part of ourselves since i
t was
> largely self-designed and homebuilt. So, it was natural to feel a certain co
mpanionship
> with our rigs which expressed itself in the unconscious use of "we" in descr
ibing "our"
> activities.
>
> --
> 73, George
> W5YR
> Fairview, TX


I was always told that the person that uses "WE" is either henpecked, or
still owes the bank for his rig.

Andy W7CXA


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:35 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58kbid$[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 17:26:04 GMT
Lines: 9
Sender: [e-mail]

Gary Hosler ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Thanks for the explaination Jim - "Over - Over" (any idea why ya have
: to say "Over - Over" when one "Over" would suffice? <GRIN>

Haven't heard that one very often, other than one of the OTs joking during a
contest at the club.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:36 1996
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From: Rolfe Tessem <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 12:12:57 -0500
Organization: Lucky Duck Productions, Inc.
Lines: 20
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Jeffrey Herman wrote:

> Maybe the operator is emotionally close to his radio and really does
> mean "we"? Or, maybe the operator has someone else in the shack/car and
> really does mean "we"?
>
> Does it really matter? If so, don't enter into a QSO with someone
> who speaks in the second person.
>
> But note that many radio broadcast talk show hosts also speak in the
> second person, so this habit isn't confined to just the ham bands.

Actually, this is first person, plural, but who's counting? :-).

Rolfe, W1VC

--
Rolfe Tessem            |       Lucky Duck Productions, Inc.
[e-mail]           |       96 Morton Street
[phone]          |       New York, NY 10014


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:37 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: The John Mackey Radio Club (was: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 16 Dec 1996 05:39:55 GMT
Organization: University of Hawaii
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <592nbb$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: uhunix3.its.hawaii.edu

John Mackey---KA0SSF  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Richard "DICK" Kendrick likes to stir up trouble where ever
>he can.  Just ignore him.


Hey, look what I found:

KC7TAE     JOHN MACKEY RADIO CLUB                 LIC ISU 17 OCT 1996
CLUB       P.O. BOX 1586                          LIC EXP 17 OCT 2006
           BEAVERTON  OR  97075-1586              LST UPD 17 OCT 1996
KA0SSF     MACKEY JR, JOHN E    IS RESPONSIBLE

So how can we join this fan club of yours? What's the dues? How many
members are there? (I'd say you've got a terminal case of narcissism.)


Jeff KH2PZ / KH6


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:38 1996
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The John Mackey Radio Club (was: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 23:20:40 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Jeffrey Herman wrote:
>
> > Hey, look what I found:
> > KC7TAE     JOHN MACKEY RADIO CLUB                 LIC ISU 17 OCT 1996
> > KA0SSF     MACKEY JR, JOHN E    IS RESPONSIBLE
> >
> > So how can we join this fan club of yours? What's the dues? How many
> > members are there? (I'd say you've got a terminal case of narcissism.)
>
> Narcissism???  Wrong.
>
> There are no dues Jeff.  The ONLY requirement is that you have a ham
> radio license AND have the name of "John Mackey".
>
> So far, the club only has 3 members.
>
> If you want to join, you would have to provide proof
> of an amateur radio license with the name required name
> as being issued to YOU.
>
> In your case, you would have to legally change your name to
> become eligable for membership in the John Mackey Radio Club.

WAH WAH WAHH!!!! Here you go again. I thought you had the better sense
to shut up. Well, I guessed wrong.... In case you don't already get it,
John-boy, you are not well liked around here. so, put a sock in it.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:39 1996
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From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:23:49 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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What is all this about a new ham doll?
Hams certainly do not play with dolls.
Of any type.

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:39 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: 16 Dec 1996 13:37:21 GMT
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <593jah$h90$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-205-122.in.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]> writes:
>What is all this about a new ham doll?
>Hams certainly do not play with dolls.
>Of any type.
>
>#================#===================================================#
>|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
>| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
>|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
>#================#===================================================#
>|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
>#====================================================================#
>If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
>Samantha Fisher


  Burt,

    I have to admit, you FINALLY came up with something funny.

                                                 Jim W9LZ


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:40 1996
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: 16 Dec 1996 15:09:16 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

What would a "Tickle Me Elmer" doll look like?

Old, wrinkled, probably lacking in personal hygene.  When you squeeze his
pot belly, he "beeps" to you in Morse Code about his health problems and
how much better things were back in the days when he had to ride the bus
500 miles to the nearest FCC office to take his ham license exam.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:41 1996
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From: Timothy Haller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 08:42:57 -0500
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

On Sun, 15 Dec 1996, Burt Fisher wrote:

> What is all this about a new ham doll?
> Hams certainly do not play with dolls.
> Of any type.

Burt the only thing you play with is yourself











Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
I am a stranger in
a really really str-
-ange land



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:42 1996
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From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 21:20:34 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
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Timothy Haller wrote:
>
> On Sun, 15 Dec 1996, Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> > What is all this about a new ham doll?
> > Hams certainly do not play with dolls.
> > Of any type.
>
> Burt the only thing you play with is yourself
>ge land

Please do not judge me based on your way of dealing with love.


#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:43 1996
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From: Andrew C Robertson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 10:03:34 -0500
Organization: Massachvsetts Institvte of Technology
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Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> Please do not judge me based on your way of dealing with love.

Please do not judge hams based on your denied self-hatred.

drewbob


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:44 1996
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From: "Bruce J. Howes KG2IC" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 10:24:54 -0400
Organization: AMSAT-NA
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Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> What is all this about a new ham doll?
> Hams certainly do not play with dolls.
> Of any type.
>
> #================#===================================================#
> |  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
> | Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
> |    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
> #================#===================================================#
> |This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
> #====================================================================#
> If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
> Samantha Fisher

Hey guys, why in the world would you respond to this loser? This is
exactly what he wants! Leave him alone, ignore his comments, and he will
go back to his old haunt of alt.sex.farm.animals! Burt must lead a very
lonely life, with an excessive amount of free time, to come up with such
nonsense.

Burt's "inner child" was wounded when his daddy did not buy him a
EZ-Bake Oven and Action Barbie for his 10th birthday. For additional
proof just glance at his "home page". Perhaps Child Protective Services
should be notified of his situation?
--

73,
Bruce KG2IC
=======================================================================
 Bruce J. Howes KG2IC        "The governmentÆs view of the economy
 Grid FN03pa                  could be summed up in a few short phrases:
 East Amherst, NY             If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving,
 AMSAT#30466 ARRL             regulate it. And if it stops moving,
 ARMY-MARS AAR2AJ             subsidize it." -Ronald Reagan
=======================================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:45 1996
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From: Rush Johnson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tradition has value
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 10:09:28 -0500
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
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Curtis Wheeler wrote:

> The amateur radio service is not club.  The FCC is not in the business
> of issuing club memberships.  You appear to consider learning CW as a
> type of hazing.  This concept goes right to the top of my list of
> cottonheaded reasons to keep code testing.  It beats out the previous
> number one reason - "People will perish on sinking ships if hams aren't
> required to learn code".
>

Of course this argument will never be resolved...there are strong points
on either side of the issue, and you appear to approach the situation as
alot of folks do, without looking at what has made Amateur Radio work
besides part 97.

Unfortunately, the rules and regulations the FCC set up regarding the
Amateur Radio Service do not really address what keeps the service
working, what keeps people coming back to the hobby.  That's where
things depart from the neat world of rules and regulations or even pure
logic.

People like to belong to something special.  We like to identify with
groups. We are attracted to the notion of community.  And what is
particularly interesting is that people who share a common background
that may have involved some hardship, some fun, some challenge etc. tend
to be proud of their "heritage".  You see this all over the place in
Alumni organizations, VFW groups, etc.  It is that collection of
experience that helps glue the Amateur Radio Service together and make
it something special....not just a collection of rules and regulations
that we can use to stake our claim to spectrum space with.  It is
community.

As we slowly take away the significant things from Amateur Radio that
create a sense of shared identity, a sense of community  (like the CW
requirement, or homebrewing equipment), we start to lose those things
that keep us "bonded", that keep us comiserating (!), that keep us
mutually  respectful of each others' committment to the hobby.

Replace that experience with a 610 form, a few bucks, and the published
answers to a simple quiz and your community goes away forever and is
replaced with a reasonable facsimile of CB in the 70's.  I for one
loathe a future like that for amateur radio.  Make room for tradition;
value is there, intended or not.


73.

Rush Johnson
NR4M (ex WD4AEI)
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:46 1996
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From: Stefan Brendjes dk6px <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Transverter 70 to 430 MHz availabl?
Date: 11 Dec 1996 06:31:57 GMT
Organization: Datasystems
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <58lkgt$83m$[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44130 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120328

We are looking for commercial transverters.

Any source known?

Regards Stefan dk6px


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:47 1996
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From: [e-mail](Richard D. Gill)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Transverter 70 to 430 MHz availabl?
Date: 12 Dec 1996 19:19:54 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <58plsq$[e-mail]>
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X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 12 11:19:54 AM PST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44183 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120426

In <58lkgt$83m$[e-mail]> Stefan Brendjes dk6px
<[e-mail]> writes:
>
>We are looking for commercial transverters.
>
>Any source known?
>
>Regards Stefan dk6px
Check out SSB Electronic Web Page  http://www.ssbusa.com

Good Luck Rich KQ6EF


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:49 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Trolling for attention , was - Tickle me Elmer (Burt Fisher)
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 04:55:55 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
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On Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:23:49 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>What is all this about a new ham doll?
>Hams certainly do not play with dolls.
>Of any type.

They're trying to get rid of the Burt Fisher doll, you wind it up and
it trolls usenet trying to get attention.





>
>#================#===================================================#
>|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
>| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
>|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
>#================#===================================================#
>|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
>#====================================================================#
>If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
>Samantha Fisher



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:50 1996
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From: Philip Peake <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 07:38:29 -0800
Organization: Teleport - Portland's Public Access [phone]
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[e-mail] wrote:

>       All sorts of stuff

Now Carl, please go back and re-read what *I* wrote.
You replied to extracts in my posting as though I wrote them, and made
extracts from my posting without context, and applied your own.

As an FYI: I am not at all frightened by technology. I have built "good
stuff", I have
spent many years programming, and am not in the least intimidated by
computers
or digital techniques.

I am trying to get across that none of this is necessary to amateur
radio
to be "magic". I get so fed up of running into technocrats who know
absolutely
nothing about analog techniques, and insist in doing everything
digitally - taking
steam hammers to crack already shelled nuts.

Everything has to be digital - even if the end result is inferior.

I was trying to get accross that there is a "magic" to ionospheric long
range
contacts, which is equivalent to, but not the same as making the same
contact
with an FM HT through a phase 3D satellite. In the second case, you may
as well
have used the internet or telephone - you are leaning on high technology
resources,
provided by others, well beyond your means to produce yourself.

I have seen far too many people put off amateur radio, after being
initially
curious and maybe reading about it somewhere - then running up against:

        * techno babble which scares them off.
        * the "learn-CW-or-we-will-kill-you" brigade.
        * mindless gibbering on repeaters (you decide if its hams or jammers
...)
        * old farts (TM)

There *is* more to amateur radio, and it doesn't have to be hard or
require
a degree in mathematics, physics or electronics to feel hat "magic".

You know Carl, to some people, the fact that they can replace your "few
pages
of VHDL code" and ASIC programmer with a few bits of bent wire and a
couple of
capacitors, for a result which may be less technically "pure", but
achieves
the result, is much more elegant ...

Leave room for *EVERYONE* in amateur radio - you are welcome to your way
of doing
things - but don't try to convince the world that yours is the only true
path,
and don't insist that I should have to give up my CW/AM/SSB/FM, or
accept interference
just so that you can find the bandwidth to play with spread spectrum.

Philip


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:51 1996
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From: Philip Peake <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 09:52:54 -0800
Organization: Teleport - Portland's Public Access [phone]
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CathrynM wrote:
>
> >What happened to the idea that amateur radio was not only being able to
> >talk to people in strange, far-off foreign lands, but to do so using
> >equipment you put together yourself ?
>
> I suppose to each his own.  I see nothing wrong with building your own
> equipment. Kind of the grow your own vegetables version of ham radio I
> suppose.  I imagine there is something to that.

I assume that you don't mean it that way ... but the above could be
considered to sound a little condesending ...

You snipped away a lot of the context - I was just pointing out that
there
is more "magic" (as you said) to ham radio than just techo-wizadry.
Different
people can experience it in different ways, and one of them might just
be
homebrew, another might be DX, another might be sitting with a six-pack
yacking away on the local repeater, or even just using ham radio as a
rather poor substitute for the internet.

> I want to see some really cool stuff.  That's what'll jumpstart this
> hobby, I think.  Technology that'll clean out your sinuses with
> amazingness. I want HAM hdtv, with full stereo sound. Or maybe some kind
> of Ham Radio Virtual reality.  Or maybe some kind of 3d sound technology.
> New ham radio operators are going to come when people on the outside see
> ham radio as a medium where they can do things that they can't do
> otherwise.

Well, you are welcome to whatever turns you on.
I too like toys, but HDTV would just be buying off the shelf equipment
and plumbing it together. So you produce an HDTV station - well ... like
WOW !
Now what ...

Current virtual reality systems are bandwidth limited with fiber optic
links.
Wanting anything other than a pale imitation in available bandwidth is
probably
wishful thinking.

I have no objections at all to you doing it so long as you don't insist
this is the new CW, this is what ham radio is all about, and the rest of
us low tech cabbage growers just clear off the air to make room for your
HDTV station ....

Whatever brings people into the hobby is fine.
But is there honestly any reason why the sorts of things you are talking
about couldn't be done with CB or GRMS or whatever ? The radio component
seems
to be almost incidental.

Wouldn't off the shelf, type accepted black boxes work fine for what you
need ?

Philip


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:52 1996
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From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 13:08:02 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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> I was trying to get accross that there is a "magic" to ionospheric
> long range contacts

Exactly. I'm a software developer, amateur recording engineer, and an
internet junkie. I love gadgets and pushing the envelope with my chosen
realms of technology. I have written software to interface my Kenwood
radio with my Mac, and I whipped up a quick logging app, but that's as
far as my computer shares the bed with my radio.

What fascinated me as a 13 yr. old still gives me a thrill now, and
that's a weak signal on a dead-quiet band answering my call. CW
epitomizes the feeling because it is derived from romantic, rather than
technical, ideals. It is passe as far as technology is concerned, but I
still stand in my backyard and wonder "How in the world do those signals
from the Pacific and Africa reach that little wire up there between the
trees?!" It doesn't matter that I understand the fundamentals of
propagation, it's like watching a 747 take off. You "understand" it, but
it's still freaking incredible!

So despite an affinity for things high-tech, it is the decidely low-tech
things about shortwave radio that embody the "magic" of it. Laugh if you
will! Thousands of us feel the same way.
--
==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:54 1996
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From: [e-mail] (CathrynM)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 12 Dec 1996 14:02:10 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>What happened to the idea that amateur radio was not only being able to
>talk to people in strange, far-off foreign lands, but to do so using
>equipment you put together yourself ?

I suppose to each his own.  I see nothing wrong with building your own
equipment. Kind of the grow your own vegetables version of ham radio I
suppose.  I imagine there is something to that.

Though, honestly, it's not really my gig, you know.  For me, I'll build it
if it does something new that I can't buy yet. But, honestly, I don't
really feel a need to build other things that are in my life.  I don't
want to build a TV set or a car or a sewing machine.  Maybe in the old
days people built CW transmitters, but I don't know, I want to move
forwards.  I'm not interested in ham radio as a living museum of radio
pioneering.  The living museum version of ham radio is never going to
attract more than a few thousand people in the entire US, I think.

In the old days of ham radio, CW transmitters were really cutting edge
stuff. And people put a lot of effort into building them.  In the 20's, a
vacuum tube was like an IC of today.  Nowadays, CW transmitters are old
news, and fewer are interested.  To maintain the spirit of the old days
when people built stuff, we need to be building on the edge of technology.
 Like they were then.

I want to see some really cool stuff.  That's what'll jumpstart this
hobby, I think.  Technology that'll clean out your sinuses with
amazingness. I want HAM hdtv, with full stereo sound. Or maybe some kind
of Ham Radio Virtual reality.  Or maybe some kind of 3d sound technology.
New ham radio operators are going to come when people on the outside see
ham radio as a medium where they can do things that they can't do
otherwise.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:55 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 13 Dec 1996 03:49:54 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <58qjp2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ogea$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-28.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <[e-mail]>, Philip Peake <[e-mail]> writes
:
>
>I get so fed up of running into technocrats who know
>absolutely nothing about analog techniques, and insist in doing
>everything digitally - taking steam hammers to crack already shelled
>nuts.

Actually, I'm an RF engineer ... my specialties include power
and bandwidth efficient modulation techniques (I have patents),
including advanced SSB methods with the ability to correct both the
amplitude and phase perterbations introduced by the multipath channel
(eliminate the fading)...  yes linear, over the RF channel, methods that
are most optimally implemented through the use of digital signal
processing techniques ...

>Everything has to be digital - even if the end result is inferior.

NO, that's not what I said ... and LOTS of things that cannot be done in
the analog world are trivial in DSP ...

>I was trying to get accross that there is a "magic" to ionospheric long
>range contacts, which is equivalent to, but not the same as making the
>same contact with an FM HT through a phase 3D satellite.

I didn't say anything about using "and FM HT through a pase 3D
satellite" ... analog FM is NOT an efficient use of bandwidth or power
... especially in the case of power-limited channels like satellite
systems ...

You say you've seen too many people scared off from ham radio by:

>       * techno babble which scares them off.
>       * the "learn-CW-or-we-will-kill-you" brigade.
>       * mindless gibbering on repeaters (you decide if its hams or jammers
>....)
>       * old farts (TM)

I agree with all of these ... with the stipulation that "techno babble"
refers to the idiots who don't know what they're talking about and
simply confuse and frighten people because they don't know the theory
themselves, so they haven't a clue how to explain it to some newbie ...


>Leave room for *EVERYONE* in amateur radio - you are welcome to your way
>of doing things - but don't try to convince the world that yours is
>the only true path.

If "everyone" is technically qualified (not an EE, just reasonable
knowledge of what radio is and how it works is OK for an entry point, no
problem ... that's what I've been telling the "lean code or go to hell
crowd for 20+ years ...

>and don't insist that I should have to give up my CW/AM/SSB/FM, or
>accept interference just so that you can find the bandwidth to play
>with spread spectrum.

You would never know that some of the things I've been talking about
were there ... I'd bet you couldn't find them if you tried ... let alone
have a legitimate bitch about "being interfered with" ... some idiot
wrote the ARRL to protest the idea of spread spectrum in the ham bands
(and the idiots in Oldington published it like it was accurate fact),
saying "When the ham across the street fires up his SS rig, the entire
band will be 'off-limits' to you ..."  that's absurd, and the ARRL was
irresponsible in printing it ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:57 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 14 Dec 1996 03:47:15 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
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In <58q8js$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman) writes:
>In article <58ogea$[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>> Philip Peake <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>>>The technical chasam between a home constructed CW/AM transmitter and
>>>receiver, and a comparable SSB setup is gigantic.
>
>>Where the hell did you ever get such a ridiculous idea?
>
>I've got a homemade three-transistor, 20-component CW transmitter sitting
>here that I've worked the Pacific with. Please tell me how I can easily
>convert it to SSB. In 25 words or less.

You probably can't ... but that doesn't mean that a "technical chasm"
exists ... it might take 3-4 cheap ICs to make the SSB tx ... big deal!
Might cost a couple of dollars more ... good grief!

Why do CW TX builders have to make it sound like anything else is
"beyond anyone's capability" just because all *they* want to build (or,
is it "know how to build") is a bare-bones CW TX???

Seriously ... try building a simple phasing mode SSB TX ... you can even
build a phasing mode RX and use it for "single signal" CW reception ...

>> ... most of the prospective "Elmers" are too damned afraid
>>of technology to try anything more interesting than a single transistor
>>CW transmitter ... how sad and pathetic ...
>
>Hey, that'd be fun! How about providing a quick ASCII sketch of such
>a transmitter!!
>
>Think of building CW gear as the first step up a long ladder of homebrewing.
>Removing that first rung means only those with a long stride will be the
>ones able to climb that ladder.

My point is that it's NOT such an insurmountable step ... it's *really*
not that hard at all ... *try* it ...

>When one has built a radio and used it to work stations thousands of miles
>away, it gives that person such a strong sense of accomplishment that they
>will continue into a lifetime of building.
>
>>Try to put aside your fears of the "complicated" and unknown ... only in
>>that way will you ever discover the "real" ham radio ...
>
>Real ham radio is whatever niche we have found and enjoy.

Translation:  I like CW and I'm not interested in trying anything else
.. it might be too hard ...

>Jeff KH2PZ / KH6
>
>P.S. Please remember that our pasttime is called Amateur Radio, not
>Profession Radio. Whatever our level of expertise, most of us have had
>to get their on our own without help from college classes.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:17:59 1996
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 16 Dec 1996 22:39:22 GMT
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Lines: 33
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ogea$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qjp2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tbvg$[e-mail]>
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In article <58tbvg$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...

>I would have no problem with a 100W output limit for SS systems and a
>requirement for automatic power control ...  SS "wants" to work at the
>minimum power necessary to maintain the link at a sufficient BER ...
>ask Phil Karn ... he'll be happy to extoll the virtues of power control
>algorithms ... these systems won't NEED legal limit power (which is
>ROUTINELY abused by hams the world over, who use the "foot warmer" when
>1/2 of "barefoot" power would do just fine ... who needs to be "60
>over"? ... folks who run "60 over" should be fined ...


It's already in part 97 that power output shall be kept to the minimum needed
to maintain communication. A blanket condemnation of every "60 over" signal
makes no sense. A "60 over" signal can quickly turn to less than S1, or even
disappear completely.



>I'm not saying that everyone has to be an EE ... but I do believe that
>the folks that say "Radio theory? I don't give a damn about how it
>works, I just want to *use* it!" are NOT "real hams" in the sense of
>what the regulators had/have in mind when they wrote/read 97.1 ...
>
>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

Who says you have to be an artist to appreciate art? And who are you to judge
what someone else considers to be art?

Tom,
N8ECW



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:00 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 18 Dec 1996 17:03:10 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
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NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Read the ITU definition of the amateur service sometime. It says
>the amateur radio service is for conducting private technical
>investigations into the art and science of radio. In other words
>developing stuff (the art) and investigating how it works (the
>science) are what amateur radio is about. In legalese, "art" is
>used in the same sense as it is used in "industrial arts" to mean
>hands-on engineering improvement.

I disagree. Art is the art of communication. Science is the
technology of building mechanisms to communicate. Both components
are equally important, but amateur radio is not just about
technology. Hence the "international goodwill" clause.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:01 1996
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From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 19 Dec 1996 06:02:55 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 54
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>Now what you modulate onto your cw is sort of unimportant, it can be
>speech, TV, HDTV, digital communications ... anything.

>I just think (me, my personal opinion) is that the fundamental interests
>should still be communication and radio technology.

And I don't quite buy into this.  On some engineering level, I suppose
data is data, but my understanding is that there are some non-trivial
issues that come up, when you try to say, stick you video camera into
the mike jack of your HT.   The radio channel and propagation are weird
in a way that make for problems that depend on what kind of content
your trying to get through.  Also, for the end user/ham, the content
is really what matters.  I think the ARPS stuff is a good example where
the radio side is pretty straightforward, but that some fun and enthusiasm
seems to be happening.

>Well, they are still around. Some have gone, but some new ones have
>opened up.
>Some of the bands which were going to go through lack of use are still
>there,
>and still unused ...

OK, I can see this point.  My thinking, though, is that the increased
sharing with other SS services is a real loss of privedges.  I mean, if
the ham bands are filling up with noise from Ham SS that's one thing, but
what it feels like sometimes is that a small amount of ham narrowband stuff
is slowly sinking into a sea of noise from SS services and
other noisy gadgets.  Does everyone get this?  I wonder sometimes.


>The only chance you have to be first is to find something which is
>"cool" to you,
>but not cool enough to be worth billions as a product, or to have the
>forsight

Maybe my work experience is slightly relavent here.  I spend all day, working
with game companies trying to make 'cool' stuff.  It doesn't really cost
mega-bucks to do, and it doesn't make billions.  (Though it has
funded a TS870 that I'm gonna' be getting soon.)  My impression is that
cool new things are more common in the world, they aren't always that
hard to do, and they only rarely pay off big.

Perhaps what needs to nurtured in ham radio better is a culture of trying
to think of fun things to do with radio technology.   It's out there.  Like
how 'bout that guy who launched a TV camera in a model rocket.  That's
truly amazing, I think.  I wanna' know how many cameras he smashed trying
to get that together.

Part of it might just be that to get a new communications technology going,
you need someone else to communicate with.  Know what I mean?  It sucks
being first, if being first means there's no one else to talk to.  This
requires both a social organization and technical invention.  Two abilities
that only rarely  both occur in a single human.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:04 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 06:49:41 GMT
Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, [e-mail], (931)3186277
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Message-ID: <59dckr$[e-mail]>
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Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]> wrote:

>> >Think of building CW gear as the first step up a long ladder of homebrewin
g.
>> >Removing that first rung means only those with a long stride will be the
>> >ones able to climb that ladder.
>>
>> My point is that it's NOT such an insurmountable step ... it's *really*
>> not that hard at all ... *try* it ...

>Jeff is right. He didn't say that it was impossible, or even very difficult,
but a CW
>TX is an excellant _START_.

I would not recommend building a CW transmitter as the first project
for a new ham interested in homebrewing. There are a lot of useful
simple power supply, audio and simple digital projects to start with.
These are easy to debug with no or very simple test equipment. It is
important, that the first few projects for a new homebrewer are
finally successful (maybe after some debugging). Then it is time to
try some RF projects, such as receivers or transmitters.

There is no need for the CW transmitter to be the first homebrew
project or that a CW transmitter would have to be included in the
career of a homebrewer. In the days of firebottles, building a single
tube CW transmitter as the first project was certainly justifiable,
but today, there are many alternative ways to start the homebrewing
career with small and cheap (useful) projects.

Paul OH3LWR




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:05 1996
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 21 Dec 1996 03:48:35 GMT
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In <594j2q$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant) writes:
>In article <58tbvg$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>>I would have no problem with a 100W output limit for SS systems and a
>>requirement for automatic power control ...  SS "wants" to work at the
>>minimum power necessary to maintain the link at a sufficient BER ...
>>ask Phil Karn ... he'll be happy to extoll the virtues of power control
>>algorithms ... these systems won't NEED legal limit power (which is
>>ROUTINELY abused by hams the world over, who use the "foot warmer" when
>>1/2 of "barefoot" power would do just fine ... who needs to be "60
>>over"? ... folks who run "60 over" should be fined ...
>
>
>It's already in part 97 that power output shall be kept to the minimum needed

>to maintain communication. A blanket condemnation of every "60 over" signal
>makes no sense. A "60 over" signal can quickly turn to less than S1, or even
>disappear completely.

So when the signal fades, you can turn up the power to maintain a
reasonable s/n ratio ... but running the legal limit at 60+over is
against the rules, but routinely done ... as I said.


>
>>I'm not saying that everyone has to be an EE ... but I do believe that
>>the folks that say "Radio theory? I don't give a damn about how it
>>works, I just want to *use* it!" are NOT "real hams" in the sense of
>>what the regulators had/have in mind when they wrote/read 97.1 ...
>>
>>Carl - wa6vse
>>[e-mail]
>
>Who says you have to be an artist to appreciate art? And who are you to judge

>what someone else considers to be art?
>
>Tom,
>N8ECW
>

Well, as Gary has pointed out, the ITU regulations define ham radio as a
service for the pursuit of technical experimentation and self-education
(perhaps more eloquently than our own FCC rules, though my reading of
Part 97 clearly gives the same impression) ...

And there are LOTs of "art" things that are, bu any *reasonable,
rational* definition garbage ... for example the controversy a while
back about the guy who got a (rather substantial) grant from the
National Endowment for the Arts for his "art" ...  which consisted of a
plastic dashboard Jesus in a bottle of piss ...  sorry, but I don't
think any *REASONABLE* definition of "art" could encompass that ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:06 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 14 Dec 96 19:00:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer r
Lines: 11


M>> I wonder if the internet is sucking off a lot of the people who would
 >otherwise
 >> be involved with ham radio.

This is true, but there is still things the internet cannot do that
radio can and vice versa.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:07 1996
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From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amatuer r
Date: 17 Dec 1996 22:34:40 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>M>> I wonder if the internet is sucking off a lot of the people who would
> >otherwise
> >> be involved with ham radio.
>
>This is true, but there is still things the internet cannot do that
>radio can and vice versa.

And I'll tell you where I'm coming from.  I sit around at work and program
internet games all day.  And, I'm consantly fussing with internet this,
internet that.  I get my fill of internet at work.  (Darksun Online, Panzer
General Online)

So, after fussing with internet junk all day, I find messing around with
RF stuff strangely fascinating.  Is this nuts?



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:08 1996
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From: Eugene Engel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Co
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 12:13:34 -0600 (CST)
Organization: Andreas Klemm, 41469 Neuss, Germany
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> <SNIP>
>
> Would believe Chaplain Ammerman's comments *if* aired on one of the
> "main-stream" networks?
>
> Bob
>
That's why it's not on one of the Main Stream Networks, It's a bunch of
bullshit and there are always people like you that eat it up.
>


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:09 1996
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From: Mark Taylor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Co
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 19:24:30 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
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oh, yeah, right...and the "mainstream" networks wouldn't lie...
Are you REALLY that trusting of a business that is just out to make money
from you?  Or are you just playing "devil's advocate"?

Let's ignore the facts for a moment, do you really think that if
something is not on the big networks it can't be true?

If you do, I suggest a little research for yourself, or at least admit
that you don't know for sure what is true, and what is not.
--
We laugh at honor, and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.
C.S. Lewis

They that can give up an essential liberty to purchase a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.   Ben Franklin




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:10 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Derek R. Larson)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: 12 Dec 1996 03:57:54 GMT
Organization: Indiana University, Bloomington
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58nvs2$[e-mail]>
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Sure, and of course we can all trust TBN as a source of accurate
information.  Them and the shopping channels...


--
________________________________________________________________________
Derek R. Larson           Indiana University       Department of History
  "Eastward I go by force, but Westward I go free!"  -H. D. Thoreau
-----------http://ezinfo.ucs.indiana.edu/~drlarson/home.html------------


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:11 1996
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From: [e-mail] (David D Wigand)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Followup-To: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Date: 12 Dec 1996 00:09:50 GMT
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Eugene Engel ([e-mail]) wrote:
: > >
: What a bunch of crap, you must have your head screwed on backwards.
: >
THere HAS been a lot of MOUT training going on recently, apparently...As
to the detention facilities, I dont know....but it certainly does bother
me that the US Government is training troops to respond violently in US
cities...At least the guy has a hypothesis, instead of not thinking about
it, as you do...Which is less intellegent?

DAve Wigand



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:12 1996
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From: Airdale <[e-mail]>
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Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 04:25:52 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
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References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nige$[e-mail]> <58nvs2$[e-mail]>
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Derek R. Larson wrote:
>
> Sure, and of course we can all trust TBN as a source of accurate
> information.  Them and the shopping channels...

<SNIP>

Would believe Chaplain Ammerman's comments *if* aired on one of the
"main-stream" networks?

Bob


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:13 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.124.68.65!newsfeed.gte.net!usenet
From: Airdale <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 04:18:29 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eugene Engel wrote:
>
> On Tue, 10 Dec 1996, Airdale wrote:>

> > >
> > > WILL THERE BE A SLAVE-LABOR DETENION CENTER IN YOUR FUTURE??
> > >
> > > The following is first-person information.
> > > Narrative of a portion of the referenced TV program follows:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> What a bunch of crap, you must have your head screwed on backwards.


I only *reported* what I heard.  The narrative was of Chaplain
Ammerman's statements during his guest appearance.

Bob (Airdale)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:14 1996
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From: Airdale <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 04:30:43 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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R. A. Green wrote:
>
> As I understand it, the only people who need to be concerned are
> morons.

Whew! thank God, I can sleep tonight. :)

Bob


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:15 1996
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From: [e-mail]-- (R. A. Green)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 19:39:25 GMT
Organization: .
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As I understand it, the only people who need to be concerned are
morons.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:16 1996
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From: [e-mail] (David D Wigand)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Followup-To: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Date: 12 Dec 1996 23:17:59 GMT
Organization: Radford University
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58q3r7$[e-mail]>
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Derek R. Larson ([e-mail]) wrote:
:
: Sure, and of course we can all trust TBN as a source of accurate
: information.  Them and the shopping channels...
:
Whats TBN?  Turner Broadcasting? I thoutgh they were bought out by Time
Warner...

Dave Wigand



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:17 1996
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!NewsWatcher!user
From: [e-mail] (!@?*$%)
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Message-ID: <smryan-1212962038440001@10.0.2.15>
Sender: [e-mail]
Organization: The Programmer formerly known as S M Ryan
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 04:37:49 GMT
Lines: 13
Xref: news1.epix.net talk.politics.guns:444399 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120528 rec.radio.cb:39224 talk.religion.misc:281603 talk.rumors:36904 talk.politics.misc:704690

> I only *reported* what I heard.  The narrative was of Chaplain
> Ammerman's statements during his guest appearance.

Chaplain of what church?


(God, I hope he says Identity. I love the smell redneck in the morning._

--
He left the light and laughter clean    |For the time being, email
and stumbled on the stones unseen.      |   to me might be lost or
He walked beneaththe wold and heath;    |    delayed. Email to the
betrayed by hope to truth obscene.      |sender will definitely go


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:18 1996
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From: Jack <@sullivan.vf.mmc.com>
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 07:51:31 -0500
Organization: as little as possible
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nige$[e-mail]> <58nvs2$[e-mail]> <58q3r7$[e-mail]>
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David D Wigand wrote:
> Derek R. Larson ([e-mail]) wrote:
> Sure, and of course we can all trust TBN as a source of accurate
> information.
>
> Whats TBN?  Turner Broadcasting? I thoutgh they were bought out by Time Warn
er...
>  Dave Wigand

TBN (Trinity Broadcasting Network) is one of those holy-roller
networks.  No relation to Turner, EWTN (Eternal Word Television
Network), etc.  They're sort of the National Enquirer of TV.
Jack


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:20 1996
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From: Mark Taylor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 17:57:07 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nige$[e-mail]> <58nvs2$[e-mail]> <58q3r7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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>
> TBN (Trinity Broadcasting Network) is one of those holy-roller
> networks.  No relation to Turner, EWTN (Eternal Word Television
> Network), etc.  They're sort of the National Enquirer of TV.
> Jack

But, don't forget that among the stories of 3 headed alians giving birth
to 6 headed snakes on the moon, there are also some true stories.  I
remember the story of john bobbit who had his jimmy cut off by his wife
being on the front page, and guess what, I opened it up, and the story
was accurate!  I was as shocked as you probably are now, but it was
accurate.  So while 99% of the garbage in there is false, sometimes it is
right.  sometimes truth really IS stranger than fiction.

We laugh at honor, and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.
C.S. Lewis

They that can give up an essential liberty to purchase a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.   Ben Franklin




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:21 1996
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From: [e-mail](Jonathan Stapp)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 00:44:59 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <58stab$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <smryan-1212962038440001@10.0.2.15>
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>(God, I hope he says Identity. I love the smell redneck in the
morning._
I think sheeple are great bar-b-cued


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:22 1996
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From: [e-mail](Jonathan Stapp)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 00:37:49 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <58ssst$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nige$[e-mail]> <58nvs2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Actually, I would dis-believe it.  Same as if the gubm't said it.

>Would believe Chaplain Ammerman's comments *if* aired on one of the
>"main-stream" networks?
>
>Bob



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:23 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.enteract.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Jonathan Stapp)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: 14 Dec 1996 00:32:45 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <58ssjd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nige$[e-mail]>
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In <58nige$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (David D Wigand)
writes:
At least the guy has a hypothesis, instead of not thinking about
>it, as you do...Which is less intellegent?
>
>DAve Wigand
>
Good show, Dave.  The guy who said people who think about such things
are morons is the real ... well, y'know.

>*Some people are only alive because it is illegal to kill them*<

-Jon

BTW, I have sent some people from misc.survivalism to this NG
when talk turned to comms.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:24 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: 15 Dec 1996 00:53:40 GMT
Organization: cris.com
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <58vi6k$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail](Jonathan Stapp) wrote:
>In <58nige$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (David D Wigand)
>writes:
>At least the guy has a hypothesis, instead of not thinking about
>>it, as you do...Which is less intellegent?
>>
>>DAve Wigand
>>
>Good show, Dave.  The guy who said people who think about such things
>are morons is the real ... well, y'know.
>
>>*Some people are only alive because it is illegal to kill them*<
>
>-Jon
>
>BTW, I have sent some people from misc.survivalism to this NG
>when talk turned to comms.
@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@


Anyone want to see the real Government Document on what they plan to do
with us send me your address and I will mail you out copies of it.
It's even on U.S. Government paper. Hurry before they come up with
some excuse to put me in jail though ok?

KIP



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:25 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Howard J Parker)
Newsgroups: alt.law-enforcement,alt.messanic,alt.vigilantes,alt.whistleblowing,talk.politics.guns,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,talk.religion.misc,talk.rumors,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Tyranny Coming ?!
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 19:32:45 GMT
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59446a$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58nige$[e-mail]> <58nvs2$[e-mail]> <58q3r7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Jack <@sullivan.vf.mmc.com> wrote:

>David D Wigand wrote:
>> Derek R. Larson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>> Sure, and of course we can all trust TBN as a source of accurate
>> information.
>>
>> Whats TBN?  Turner Broadcasting? I thoutgh they were bought out by Time War
ner...
>>  Dave Wigand

>TBN (Trinity Broadcasting Network) is one of those holy-roller
>networks.  No relation to Turner, EWTN (Eternal Word Television
>Network), etc.  They're sort of the National Enquirer of TV.
>Jack

Ouch.  Actually, the Crouch couple that runs TBN look a little too much like J
im and Tammy
Faye for my taste.  As a member of a small evangelical church, all of the flas
hy clothes
and big hair, the expensive background sets constructed for TV, all of that tu
rns the
stomach of people in small churches engaged in real ministry.  The only time I
 stop on TBN
is while channel surfing - and only when I see a show by someone that really h
as something
worthwhile to hear.  Much of what is on TBN is from normal evangelical broadca
sting that
uses it as an outlet.  The "Big Hair" stuff is the straight TBN produced stuff
.

Regards, Jeff Parker



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:26 1996
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 19:42:30 -0500
From: "T.J. Alessi - K1TJ" <[e-mail]>
Organization: Master of my Domain.
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Vanity Call
References: <59cjfg$[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.16.238.222
Lines: 32
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news.paonline.com!news3.paonline.com!207.16.238.222

Thomas Brockdorf wrote:
>
> Checked on the ARRL FCC Data base, and foud my vanity call was issued to me
> yesterday.
>
> I applied on 11-18-96,with the electronic form over the internet.
> Exactlly one month ago. If you are waiting for your call to be issued, perha
ps this
> is encouraging news.
>
> My old call was AA9IS. My new call is W9FL. A nice one by two.
> Why did I choose W9FL?
> I decided to apply for a vanity call a little late in the game. I wanted a 1
x2 with a
> "W" prefix. The letters "FL" are what Harley-Davidson uses to designate thei
r family
> of touring bikes, of which I own the FLHTC.
>
> I submitted 25 choices, of which W9FL was number one. My initials "T.B." wer
e not
> available in the W 1x2 format. I spent quite a few agonizing hours trying to
 decide
> what callsigns to include in my 25 choices.
>
> Any stories on why you choose your call?
>
> 73 de Thomas W9FL

Congrads on the new call, they issued almost 700 vanity calls yesterday.
sounds like the FCC has gotten the bugs out of the vanity program!

Tom - K1TJ
--
----------------------------------------------------------------
 T.J. Alessi - K1TJ, 147 Joffre Avenue, Stamford, CT 06905-2933
 mailto:[e-mail]  * http://www.alessi.com *  203.977.5200
----------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:27 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newspump.sol.net!posts.execpc.com!usenet
From: Thomas Brockdorf <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Vanity Call
Date: 19 Dec 1996 23:35:07 GMT
Organization: Exec-PC BBS Internet - Milwaukee, WI
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59cjfb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: milkyway.execpc.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.2N (Windows; I; 16bit)

Checked on the ARRL FCC Data base, and foud my vanity call was issued to me
yesterday.

I applied on 11-18-96,with the electronic form over the internet.
Exactlly one month ago. If you are waiting for your call to be issued, perhaps
 this
is encouraging news.

My old call was AA9IS. My new call is W9FL. A nice one by two.
Why did I choose W9FL?
I decided to apply for a vanity call a little late in the game. I wanted a 1x2
 with a
"W" prefix. The letters "FL" are what Harley-Davidson uses to designate their
family
of touring bikes, of which I own the FLHTC.

I submitted 25 choices, of which W9FL was number one. My initials "T.B." were
not
available in the W 1x2 format. I spent quite a few agonizing hours trying to d
ecide
what callsigns to include in my 25 choices.

Any stories on why you choose your call?

73 de Thomas W9FL



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:28 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!tezcat!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newspump.sol.net!posts.execpc.com!usenet
From: Thomas Brockdorf <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Vanity Call
Date: 19 Dec 1996 23:35:12 GMT
Organization: Exec-PC BBS Internet - Milwaukee, WI
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59cjfg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: milkyway.execpc.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.2N (Windows; I; 16bit)

Checked on the ARRL FCC Data base, and foud my vanity call was issued to me
yesterday.

I applied on 11-18-96,with the electronic form over the internet.
Exactlly one month ago. If you are waiting for your call to be issued, perhaps
 this
is encouraging news.

My old call was AA9IS. My new call is W9FL. A nice one by two.
Why did I choose W9FL?
I decided to apply for a vanity call a little late in the game. I wanted a 1x2
 with a
"W" prefix. The letters "FL" are what Harley-Davidson uses to designate their
family
of touring bikes, of which I own the FLHTC.

I submitted 25 choices, of which W9FL was number one. My initials "T.B." were
not
available in the W 1x2 format. I spent quite a few agonizing hours trying to d
ecide
what callsigns to include in my 25 choices.

Any stories on why you choose your call?

73 de Thomas W9FL



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:29 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.tamu.edu!furuta
From: [e-mail] (Richard Furuta)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Vanity Call
Date: 20 Dec 1996 17:21:24 GMT
Organization: Center for the Study of Digital Libraries
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59ehuk$[e-mail]>
References: <59cjfg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hrl8.cs.tamu.edu

In article <59cjfg$[e-mail]>,
Thomas Brockdorf  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Checked on the ARRL FCC Data base, and foud my vanity call was issued to me
>yesterday.
>
>I applied on 11-18-96,with the electronic form over the internet.
>Exactlly one month ago. If you are waiting for your call to be issued, perhap
s this
>is encouraging news.

They must have been very busy on Wednesday (12/18).  Inspecting the FCC
database updates it looks like they got all the way into processing
applications received early December!  Vanity got the better of me and I
submitted an application in late November that also was granted on Wednesday.

Anyone want to guess when the Area 4 1x2's will run out?  Today's report at
www.qrz.com only lists 19 unassigned (and those might actually not be availabl
e
because of the 2 year waiting period).

                                        --Rick
                                          [e-mail]
                                          soon to be K3IV (ex KE3IV and N3JGF)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:30 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!newsie.dmc.com!news.ziplink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (chuck)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: visiting china end of january
Date: 19 Dec 1996 23:57:28 GMT
Organization: none
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <59ckp8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip74-max1-bos.ziplink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (x86 32bit)

I will be in China during the end of January. Anyone comment on ham radio
there? I would like mail from anyone there or anyone who has been there
for any help. Also any info on prices on gear better/worse, duties ect.

tnx de ka1mwp



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:31 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!math.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!freenet.columbus.oh.us!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (John Chapman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 16 Dec 1996 09:36:54 -0500
Organization: The Greater Columbus FreeNet
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <593mq6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.freenet.columbus.oh.us
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Roland Stiner ([e-mail]) wrote:

: A>A friend of mine whose license is expiring soon just got a letter in the
:  >mail from W5YI, that included a 610, a return envelope (to W5YI!) and
:  >an offer to renew his license for him in exchange for $6!  There was an
:  >uproar a few years ago when Fred was doing the same thing for $5, which
:  >led to the FCC starting to send out renewal reminders.  Unfortunately the
:  >FCC has recently quit doing that, so along comes good-ol' Fred ready to
:  >scam his fellow amateurs again, charging them $6 for something they
:  >could do themselves for free.

: We've got to get the word out that this is a scam and that license
: renewal is FREE except for the cost of one 32 cent stamp.

For the last time, it isn't a scam! Fred points out in his letter that
goes out with it that you are free to use the ENCLOSED 610 form to renew
directly, and tells you how to do it. You can use his service, for a fee,
or do it yourself. As they say, if nobody uses the "pay" service, it will
probably go away, but my guess is that there will always be people willing
to pay, go figure.... I just received the package from him for one of my
club calls I am trustee for, unfortunately the renewal documents wouldn't
work, and I needed to send in a 610A directly, I'm surprised his system
didn't pick up on that....
73,
--
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
John Chapman    WB8INY
Ohio Section ARES, District Emergency Coordinator, District 7
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/wb8iny     (try it, you'll like it)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:32 1996
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <593mq6$[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 00:27:58 GMT
Lines: 19
Sender: [e-mail]

John Chapman ([e-mail]) wrote:
: For the last time, it isn't a scam! Fred points out in his letter that
: goes out with it that you are free to use the ENCLOSED 610 form to renew
: directly, and tells you how to do it. You can use his service, for a fee,
: or do it yourself. As they say, if nobody uses the "pay" service, it will
: probably go away, but my guess is that there will always be people willing
: to pay, go figure.... I just received the package from him for one of my
: club calls I am trustee for, unfortunately the renewal documents wouldn't
: work, and I needed to send in a 610A directly, I'm surprised his system
: didn't pick up on that....

Actually (and nothing one way or another on Fred) I'd hope to see the FCC
get more in tune with the 20th century, and allow hams to file
electronically for such mundane administrivia as renewals and address
changes.

Anyone hear how the experiment went with electronic filing for vanity calls?

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:34 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!news.mira.net.au!news.netspace.net.au!news.mel.connect.com.au!news.mel.aone.net.au!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!swrinde!news-relay.us.dell.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 18:49:03 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: None at all
To: [e-mail]
References: <[e-mail]> <593mq6$[e-mail]>
X-Article-Creation-Date: Wed Dec 18 18:40:58 1996 GMT
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X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.0 (compatible; MSIE 3.0; SK; Windows 95)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 15


John Chapman wrote:
>  I just received the package from him for one of my
> club calls I am trustee for, unfortunately the renewal
> documents wouldn't  work, and I needed to send in
> a 610A directly....

John,

You probably mis-typed above, but the form for clubs is
610B, not 610A.

73, de Hans, K0HB
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:35 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!super.zippo.com!zdc-e!dataphone!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!swrinde!news-relay.us.dell.com!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 18:49:01 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Home in the Snow
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58db3q$[e-mail]> <58emup$[e-mail]> <58eu1b$[e-mail]>
X-Article-Creation-Date: Wed Dec 18 18:33:28 1996 GMT
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X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 27


[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>
> If Fred is doing it for a service, he shouldn't be making a "profit".
>

Why should he not make a profit?

My barber performs the service of cutting my hair even
though I *could* cut it myself, or have my lovely wife do
it.  I choose to pay the barber......  I hope he's bright
enough to make a profit from the service he performs.


I send in my own 610 but others may wish to take advantage
of the service offered by W5YI.....  I don't endorse his firm, but
I hope he's bright enough to make a profit from the service
he performs.  If the market does not feel the service is worth
the asked price, then I suppose the business will suffer a
loss.  If the market is satisfied with the service at the offered
price, then the business may succeed.


73, de Hans, K0HB
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:36 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!math.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!freenet.columbus.oh.us!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (John Chapman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: W5YI at it again!
Date: 19 Dec 1996 13:14:26 -0500
Organization: The Greater Columbus Free-Net
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59c0m2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <593mq6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.freenet.columbus.oh.us
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

[e-mail] wrote:

: John,

: You probably mis-typed above, but the form for clubs is
: 610B, not 610A.

: 73, de Hans, K0HB
: -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
:       http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet

That's what I get for replying at work, yes the club form is a 610B, it
hasn't been changed for decades, and certainly has gotten a lot of workout
from certain family groups out west, and other places....... Thanks for
the reply!
73,
--
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
John Chapman    WB8INY
Ohio Section ARES, District Emergency Coordinator, District 7
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/wb8iny     (try it, you'll like it)


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:37 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsxfer.itd.umich.edu!umcc.umich.edu!edcen!edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu!dhavlena
From: [e-mail] (Dennis P. Havlena)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: W8MI/B (ex W8UR/B) 50 Mc Beacon back on air...
Date: 17 Dec 1996 01:16:05 GMT
Organization: Central Michigan University, Mt. Pleasant, MI, USA
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <594s8l$qam$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Dennis P. Havlena)
NNTP-Posting-Host: edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu


HI from northern Michigan.

For the first time since 1988 my 6 meter, 2 watt CW beacon on
50.0775 was recently put off the air after having been evicted from it's
"home".  A new, nearby location has been secured and the beacon is once
again on the air from the Straits of Mackinac.

Please let me know if you ever hear it.
73  Dennis Havlena - W8MI
Cheboygan, Michigan
[e-mail]
webpage  http://edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu/~dhavlena/

PS  The W8MI/B  1/2 watt ten meter beacon on 28.218 Mc is still going
strong & nonstop (since 1988) - also from the Straits of Mackinac EN75.





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:38 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!news.onramp.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (D. O'Neal)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Wake Up Call!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 03:26:48 GMT
Organization: OnRamp Technologies; ISP;  Dallas/Ft Worth/Houston, TX USA
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <58qe6c$[e-mail]>
References: <4i2onb$6m3$[e-mail]> <4i4ur2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port78.netdot.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:120502 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44151


>Another obvious issue is how to attract people to these bands
>that are relatively unused.  From my own perspective, I'm only
>active on a number of the VHF+ bands because of the various
>contests that are available.  With my antenna restrictions I can't

     This reminds me of my two dogs.  Even when one is FULL he will
eat ANYTHING just to keep the other from getting it.  IF THESE BANDS
ARE UNUSED THEN WHY NOT LET THEM BE PUT TO GOOD USE?



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:39 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!itnews.sc.intel.com!news
From: Cecil Moore <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Wake Up Call!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 11:49:04 -0800
Organization: Intel Corporation
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <4i2onb$6m3$[e-mail]> <4i4ur2$[e-mail]> <58qe6c$[e-mail]>
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D. O'Neal wrote:
> IF THESE BANDS ARE UNUSED THEN WHY NOT LET THEM BE PUT TO GOOD USE?

like little Leos?


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:40 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (JDuffy)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Wake Up Call!
Date: 21 Dec 1996 16:19:48 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58qe6c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]



>>Another obvious issue is how to attract people to these bands
>>that are relatively unused.  From my own perspective, I'm only
>>active on a number of the VHF+ bands because of the various
>>contests that are available.  With my antenna restrictions I can't

>     This reminds me of my two dogs.  Even when one is FULL he will
>eat ANYTHING just to keep the other from getting it.  IF THESE BANDS
>ARE UNUSED THEN WHY NOT LET THEM BE PUT TO GOOD USE?

Because after you let them have the ones that you are not using, the end
up taking the ones that you are using.

Second, just because we don't need them now, doesn't mean we won't need
them in the future.

Learn from other groups that thought they were being reasonable when
relinquishing (sp?) their rights.  "This little loss doesn't mean
anything.  We can live with it."  But they keep coming and taking more and
more.  It never ends.  Give your foe a yard and they keep coming for miles
until you have nothing left.

_____________________________________________________________________
"If the government bans individual possession of guns and only the government
owns guns, are we still a free people?"

"It's the Second Amendment Stupid!"

J. D. Beischel - Life Member - NRA
Amateur Radio WB8NUT & Member of the ARRL
_____________________________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:41 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.netside.com!usenet
From: Scott Sidener <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Wanted opinions on Azden 6-meter Handheld
Date: 14 Dec 1996 20:59:05 GMT
Organization: Sidener Consulting & Electronics
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <58v4ep$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mx41-71.netside.com
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Hi, I am looking for opinions on the Azden 6-meter handheld radio.

If you have any (good or bad) please e-mail me.

Thanks,

Scott Sidener
N0WFL

[e-mail]
(please use this address to return e-mail, not the return address from
this post)





From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:42 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!128.138.243.15!csnews!coopnews.coop.net!news.den.mmc.com!usenet
From: Jack <@sullivan.vf.mmc.com>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Wanted opinions on Azden 6-meter Handheld
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 07:58:01 -0500
Organization: as little as possible
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58v4ep$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: @sullivan.vf.mmc.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: bdesai.ew.lmms.lmco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; 68K)

Scott Sidener wrote:
>
> Hi, I am looking for opinions on the Azden 6-meter handheld radio.

Scott:
It's a rugged rig, a bit on the heavy side though.  Beware if you use
the collapsible whip antenna, as it's quite a load on the BNC
connector.  Minus side: it's a BITCH to program.  Make sure you get
the manual for the 6 mtr rig, as the early ones were sent out with
the manual for the 10m ht.  Call Azden and they should send you out
the 6mtr manual no charge (they did for me).
de N2MPU Jack


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:43 1996
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: "David Little" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.cb
Subject: Re: Wanted: 10mSSB convertion info for Cobra 134.
Date: 17 Dec 1996 19:01:38 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <01bbec4c$678a3100$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ad28-246.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:100041 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44570 rec.radio.amateur.misc:120973 rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:1156 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22126 rec.radio.cb:39570


> I'm looking for information or articles for converting a Cobra 134 CB to
> 10m SSB.
>
Allen,
        do a search for "CB Radio".  Look at Left Coast CB abd it's links.
You will find an abundance of info on PLL unlocks.  If you know the PLL, I
may be able to provide some info for you.  Getting the fo's is the easy
part....Broadbanding the receive and transmit capabilities requires some
time, effort and substitutions.  There are "tricks" such as adding more
broad varactor diodes in the vco and ssb circuits, paralleling unused
sections of IF transformers, changing the value of the synth crystals, etc.
 Some PLL's and circuit board combos are better than others, and the Cobra
usually uses a Uniden board with either a 8719 or 8734 PLL IC.

     The best authority is Lou Franklin of CB Cint International.  You can
contact him at [e-mail]  .
He has written variouis volumes of info covering whatever level of info you
care to get into.  He is also a ham and has been hombrewing and studying
PLL circuits since their introduction to the retail market.

     You will also have to consider adding FM (relatively easy) and
repeater offsets.  It is a good project, and even if it doesn't perform as
well as a "store bought" rig, the experience that you will get has a value
that no price can be set on.

Good Luck
73
David KD4NUE


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:45 1996
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From: Stan Olochwoszcz <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.broadcasting,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: What's up with SPECTRUM?
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Okay, so it's been absent from the newsgroup for awhile, but fans will
be pleased to know that SPECTRUM is still chugging along. Thanks for
your patience and continued support.

Props have been the pits lately, and the staff is toast, which is why
we're running some "Best of..." until the end of the year. We're busy
lining up some guests and getting our features back on line as we've
been threatening...uh..promising to do for awhile. We'll start off 1997
with a Listener Appreciation Night so you can help direct the show for
the new year. On 11 January, we've lined up a great guest who's got to
be the ultimate Musicradio77 WABC fan. There'll be history,
rememberances, and airchecks, so be there.

We'll try to get back in the habit of posting the upcoming programs,
too. For the where's and when of SPECTRUM, check out our site at
http://spectrum.orn.com. Or send us mail at [e-mail].

73 and good DX!

Stan Olochwoszcz and the crew at
SPECTRUM, the World's Communications and Technology Magazine Program



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:46 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Kyle Cassidy)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Where are all the HAM's?
Date: 16 Dec 1996 18:51:20 GMT
Organization: Rowan College of New Jersey
Lines: 22
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: : >Every month there are dozens of new technican no-code licenses granted by

: : >the FCC, but 2 meters and 440 MHz continues to be nearly dead, with only
: : >about 3 QSO's going on at any given time. In my area (S.F BAY), there are

: : >thousands of possible hams to talk to, but where are they? I scanned

<snip>

when i lived in rural south jersey, my friends and i had a "secret
frequency" we used for simplex chattering. i'd moniter that and the local
repeater. well, a year ago i moved to philadelphia and some of my old
friends were going to meet me in the city. i said "i'll be on the old
secret frequency." well, wouldn't you know it, when i turned on the
radio, someone _else_ was using the simplex frequency. after a while one
of my friends came on, called for me and i said "let's move up 40khz and
i'll catch you there", well, amazingly enough, there was someone on
_that_ simplex frequency too. after that, i started looking for simplex
frequencies, just leaving my radio on all the time tuned to a frequency,
and i've _yet_ to find one that people don't talk on from time to time.
it's quite a jump from rural new jersey to metropolitin  whatever.

kc



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:47 1996
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From: Dana Yeomans <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Where are all the HAM's?
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 20:18:49 -0500
Organization: Intergate, Inc.
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hi there, i don't have that problem here in the atlanta earea. i am about
40 miles south of atlanta in a town called griffin, we have plenty of freqs
to talk on i use 146.430 a lot here. so thanks for reading. n4pge


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:48 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Jerry Gardner)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 04:10:51 GMT
Organization: Spacely's Sprockets Linux Works
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On Fri, 06 Dec 1996 20:36:36 -0700, jim daneke <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>Jim/KI0BB  By the way, I memorized the questions and have no idea the
>difference
>between a watt and a volt. The requirements say I have to pass the
>test...Not
>know the material.

Gee, I hope the pilot of the next airliner I fly on didn't pass the
FAA test the same way you passed the amateur tests...




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:49 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Porkster)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 18:46:12 GMT
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On Mon, 09 Dec 1996 04:10:51 GMT, [e-mail] (Jerry Gardner)
wrote:


>
>Gee, I hope the pilot of the next airliner I fly on didn't pass the
>FAA test the same way you passed the amateur tests...
>
>
But then, he isn't flying a jet plane with four hundred passengers
whose lives depend on his knowledge, is he? If you don't have anything
worthwhile to add to the conversation, keep your fucking mouth shut,
asshole. The sooner you learn how meaningless your existance is, the
better off you will be.


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:50 1996
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From: Gary Danaher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 17:14:04 -0600
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Porkster wrote:
>
> On Mon, 09 Dec 1996 04:10:51 GMT, [e-mail] (Jerry Gardner)
> wrote:
>
> >
> >Gee, I hope the pilot of the next airliner I fly on didn't pass the
> >FAA test the same way you passed the amateur tests...
> >
> >
> But then, he isn't flying a jet plane with four hundred passengers
> whose lives depend on his knowledge, is he? If you don't have anything
> worthwhile to add to the conversation, keep your fucking mouth shut,
> asshole. The sooner you learn how meaningless your existance is, the
> better off you will be.

Is this why your name is Porky? Such language....


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:51 1996
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From: "A Redshirt" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: Which radio to buy?
Date: 15 Dec 1996 08:48:38 GMT
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Jerry Gardner <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> On Fri, 06 Dec 1996 20:36:36 -0700, jim daneke
<[e-mail]>
> wrote:
>
> >Jim/KI0BB  By the way, I memorized the questions and have no
idea the
> >difference
> >between a watt and a volt. The requirements say I have to
pass the
> >test...Not
> >know the material.
>
> Gee, I hope the pilot of the next airliner I fly on didn't
pass the
> FAA test the same way you passed the amateur tests...
>

Now come on folks, let's not limit this to just the Amateur
Radio License tests...<g!>

--
"HILLARY SHOT VINCE!!" - - Local bumper sticker




From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:52 1996
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From: "Charles P. Hobbs" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Who is PFF who want to abolish the FCC
Date: 11 Dec 1996 21:07:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet Services for the Internet
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david l. thompson wrote:
>
> >Folks, this an old proposal. It didn't just come up now. PFF put this out a
> >year or two ago. PFF is a "think tank" that does policy analysis from its p
oint
> >of view (which is generally "pro-business" under the guise of being
> >libertarian, which it isn't). There are lots of policy analysts and viewpoi
nts
> >out in the world. Don't get stressed out on this one just yet. There's plen
ty
> >of other stuff to get stressed on right now without wasting emotional energ
y on
> >this. Wait and see if this bubbles back.
>

> Got this same answer from Newt's Atlanta office and the ARRL
> Regulatory desk.   Forget it the FCC is safe!
>

So, should we add this "proposal" to the "modem tax" and the "Madalyn
O'Hair plan to ban all religious TV" list of rumors, yet?

> Dave K4JRB


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:53 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Dean T. Miller)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL?
Date: 9 Dec 1996 16:10:20 GMT
Organization: Miller and Associates
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Hi Greg,

In article <58h6jq$[e-mail]>, From
[e-mail] (Greg Thompson), the following was written:
> I myself don't like code but I think it
> should be kept. I passed my 5 wpm after taking the test twice and I am
> studying for 13 now. I don't use code on the air as I don't like it
but > will learn it because it is in the rules. CW is a great filter for
all > those that think ham radio is nothing but a family service.

Exactly.

If a product (a ham ticket) is too cheap to get (by memorizing answers
to a pre-set group of questions), then the result is worthless.

Every salesman knows that you have to charge a good bit of money to have
a product be *perceived* as worthwhile.  The same is true of any
licensed occupation or privilege.  If all you have to do is pay money
for a license (fishing, hunting, marriage), there is no skill or
knowledge requirement conveyed by the license.  If, however, tests are
given that will weed out casual or incompetent practitioners
(electricians, doctors, pilots, hams), then the license shows that at
least a minimum competence in the discipline has been met.

The radio spectrum is an expensive piece of real estate and there are
many groups of people wanting a slice of it for their use.  Hams have a
few small slices because it benefits the countries allowing ham
operation (mostly in natural and man-made disasters).  However, that
benefit is greatly diminished if the selection process becomes
meaningless by testing only for the ability to memorize test answers.



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:55 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Buddy Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why havn't you joined the ARRL? Results as of 11/24
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 20:35:55 GMT
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On 8 Dec 1996 05:51:00 GMT, T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A
<[e-mail]> wrote:


>direction Ham radio is starting  lean towards.  I also think our Congress wou
ld sell off all
>the Ham bands if they had a chance to.  It's time to dig in!
>
>

Amen

And the ARRL is our strongest and most unified voice.....

Ergo....whether you support all of the league policies you must upport
the strongest voice in amateur radio AND make your feelings known to
them


Buddy
KC4WQ

73 de KC4WQ
Buddy

Visit the BARS web site http://members.iglou.com/gregl



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:56 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Colin Garvie)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Wireless and POWs
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 16:46:42 GMT
Organization: UUNET Internet Africa
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WW II POWs seemed to have been an innovative bunch. For instance, I recall my
father, a POW (Stalag
VIIA) telling of "crystal sets" being built with Gilette blue razor blades. Pr
esumably transmitters
were also constructed. Some first learnt their radio theory as POWs. Do we hav
e any ex-POWs who can
share their war time "wireless" experiences?

Colin ZR5ADZ
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:57 1996
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From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: XV7SW on 160 on CW
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 09:13:58 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
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Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (T   E   I   X   E  I   R   A) wrote:
>
> >I keep hearing how CW is obsolete.....yesterday a freind here in the US wok
ed
> >China
>
> Damn, Don, that musta been one heluva big wok.
>
> >Don W6IQ
>
> K2NG was 599+ here in Guam this morning on 7.002 at 7:00 am our time.
> So you're right, 40 meters is poppin'. JA's were loud here ALL DAY. CW isn't
> obsolete. I just worked XV7SW on 160 on CW a little while ago.
>
> 73, Jim KH2D

Jim, what do you use for an antenna on 160?? Mine still needs a lot of work...



--
Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:58 1996
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From: "Scott A. Stembaugh" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Zapping old NiCad batteries
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 13:10:27 -0800
Organization: Management Information    Purdue University
Lines: 12
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I have a couple of older NiCad HT battery packs that will not hold a
charge for more than a couple of hours.  They had set idle for a couple
of years.  I have been cycling them up/down (charge about 8 hours/run
until dead) for 2 weeks and have made very minimal progress in
recovering them.  Is there a way to ZAP them to see if they have any
life left in them?



Thanks,
--scott  N9LJX
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:18:59 1996
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From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Zapping old NiCad batteries
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 23:48:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 42


(Continued from previous message)

-----------------------
Three methods are common in determining when a battery has reached
a state of full charge.  One involves using the battery specifications
and applying a controlled charge; the other two involve measurements.

The controlled-charge method applies a constant current to a battery
that has been discharged to 1V/cell.  The current is applied for a
specified period that satisfies the battery's specification.

Measurement methods monitor the battery voltage during charging to
detect a negative slope.  As a battery reaches full charge, its
terminal voltage first slightly increases, then decreases.  The
transition from the higher to lower voltage is known as the negative
slope and indicates a full charge.

Both methods are acceptable.  But when the negative slope method is
used, a discharge cycle should still be included prior to charging.

Another method measures battery temperature.  A thermal detection
device placed against the cells reveals an increase in temperature.
A nicad battery's temperature rises only after it reaches full charge.
Therefore, to some extent, the battery is overcharged with each charge
cycle.  The thermal method may be acceptable if it is engineered
properly, but it is not the preferred technique.


Positive contacts
-----------------
The charger terminals must make positive contact with the battery
terminals to ensure a low resistance connection for an efficient
discharge-charge cycle.

Positive contact also is a safety consideration with chargers that
use thermal sensing of the full charge.  If proper contact is not
made, the battery could overcharge.  A rapid-charge battery subjected
to an overcharge could reach temperatures high enough to melt the
battery case.

--end--


From [e-mail] Sat Dec 21 17:19:00 1996
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From: "Cliff Soderback" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Zapping old NiCad batteries
Date: 21 Dec 1996 05:20:38 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 42
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X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1160



Scott A. Stembaugh <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> I have a couple of older NiCad HT battery packs that will not hold a
> charge for more than a couple of hours.  They had set idle for a couple
> of years.  I have been cycling them up/down (charge about 8 hours/run
> until dead) for 2 weeks and have made very minimal progress in
> recovering them.  Is there a way to ZAP them to see if they have any
> life left in them?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
> --scott  N9LJX
> [e-mail]
>
    Scott:
                   Volumes have been written in Nicads and everyone seems
to have his
pet theory. Well, before I retired I worked for many years at a TV station
and the News
dept used a great number of Nicads in the lights,  the recorders and
cameras.
One fellow tried for about 10 years to salvage and extend the life of the
Nicads. They
were charged slow, fast, pulsed , zaped, completely discharged, partially
discharged
and all the combinations in between. He spend hours taking the paks apart
and
matching the cells. After all this, the conclusion was drawn that there is
no good way
 of salvaging Nicads. They have a life of 2 to 3 years whether you use them
or not.
 Heavy use or light use makes no difference. After they start failing just
discard them.
 It is not worth the frustration to try for a little extra life, only to
have them fail when you need them. They do degrade with age and there is
nothing you can do about this. It is
 the chemistry of the cell.

                                                        Cliff, W7VVA


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 1 5/8 inch Hardline For Sale
Date: 11 Dec 1996 21:22:19 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <58nq8r$[e-mail]>
References: <58n29q$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <58n29q$[e-mail]>, Edward Addy <[e-mail]> wrote:

>We have an excess spool of 1 5/8 inch gas heliax which we wish to sell.

Gas-filled heliax? Do you use hydrogen? Is this that new "Hindenburg
Hardline" I've been reading so much about?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.iarc.com!cpk-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!reuna.cl!arauco!news.dpi.udec.cl!lauca.usach.cl!news.rdc.cl!news.puc.cl!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.cdsnet.net!usenet
From: John Wolford <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 21:09:51 -0800
Organization: CDS Internet
Lines: 68
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121522 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44584

Bill Nelson wrote:
>
> Carl Stevenson ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
> : This actually *is* a war ... it's been shaping up for a LONG time ...
> : I've been licensed for over 20 years and I've argued that whole time for
> : the elimination of the CW *test* requirement ... I am not alone,
> : there are many, many of us no-code *test* advocates ...  and I've said
> : the entire time that "I'll defend to the death *your* right to pound
> : brass if you'lll defend my right to choose not to ..."
>
> But, apparently still in the minority. A sizeable majority of ARRL members
> are in favor of continuing the code requirements - even though the ARRL
> board itself appears to be in favor of getting rid of the requirement.
>
> Even when the non-ARRL hams are factored in, it is still about 55%-40% in
> favor of the code requirement. The other 5% are undecided, or don't care
> to express an opinion.
>
> Just because you have to pass the CW requirement, does not mean that you
> have to use it.
>
> : Anyway, any compromise that satisfies the rabid pro-coders will not go
> : far enough in modernizing the ARS to bring in the technical folks we so
> : desperately need to develop new, more spectrally efficient technologies,
> : will not bring in enough of the "new blood" we need to help grow our
> : numbers for political clout, will not modernize the rules and eliminate
> : the unnecesssary barriers to new technologies, and will not assure our
> : future survival in the face of ever-increasing pressures on spectrum
> : resources by the rapidly growing demand for a wide variety of commercial
> : communications services and systems ...  so SCREW the pro-coders!!! ...
> : nobody is telling them they can't beep ...  but they've had their way
> : far too long and ham radio has suffered greatly from it ...  ham radio's
> : very future survival is in danger and we HAVE to make the necessary
> : changes NOW *before* it's too late ...
>
> That is a silly argument. The new technologies can be developed above
> 30 MHz. As such, you already have a no-code license. No more is needed
> for research into new technologies/techniques.
>
> I haven't seen a flood of new blood doing research. All I have seen is a
> bunch of no-code Hams who use 2 meters like the CB band.
>
> Bill

        Query ...

   let's say a ham just happens to be scanning across the band late some
night and happens to pick up a CW transmission.
   Now, let's say the person sending the transmission happens to be a
ship, plane, or what-ever in dire need of help.
   The alert ham, knowing his code jumps in to lend assistance in
what-ever way he/she can, possibly saving the person(s) on the other end
of the xmission.
  Isn't that what ham radio's all about?  Helping people in emergencies
during assorted disasters?
   I don't think it's right that someone might not live through an
ordeal just because the 'ham' didn't understand what was being sent.
   Some of you might think.... Well, they could have sent it vocally ...
   Think on this one, what if their mic was damaged, it would be easier
to 'pound out' an SOS then to just throw their hands in the air, hoping
the friendly 'ham' happens to hear their plea.
   One of the MAJOR reasons amateur radio was created was to help during
disasters, but how can they help when they can't understand what's being
sent?
73's es KA7DZI .... John ....

(Originally got license WN7NNN in 1972)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:03 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!eanews1!trsvr!news
From: Anthony Steen <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Grounding of Ham Radio on a Sailboat
Sender: [e-mail] (cnews news id.)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 16:33:26 GMT
To: -=Tony=- <[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: ajs1.tr.unisys.com
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
References: <[e-mail]> <58m1j8$[e-mail]>
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Organization: UNISYS , Tredyffrin
Lines: 24

-=Tony=- wrote:
>
> In <[e-mail]> Anthony Steen <[e-mail]>
> writes:
> >
> >I have a ICOM IC-706 and want to install it on board my 30' sailboat.
>
> >Instead of installing a ground plate, can I run the chassis ground
> from
> >the radio to the YANMAR diesel engine to provide the necessary safety
> of
> >not being shocked?  What are the pros & cons of such an arrangement.
> My
> >Marine VHF radio is "grounded" through the + & - 12VDC.  So it's
> >confusing when I hear I need to have a separate ground plate.  I
> >currently have a no-code license, studying for my General license in
> >preparation for cruising southern waters.  All responses appreciated.
> >Thanks in advance.
>
>     YOU seem to have a FALSE return mailing address!  Nice long private
> message from a pro wasted!  Gud Luk.First, thank you for your attempted resp
onse.  My E-Mail address is
[e-mail].  Anything else you received is certainly in
error.  What is giving you the FALSE return mailing address is beyond me?
Again, thank you for your time and effort.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:05 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!128.100.1.3!utcsri!info.ecf!stras
From: [e-mail] (Lukas Stras)
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Sender: [e-mail] (News Administrator)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 18:00:04 GMT
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: indy4.ecf
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Organization: University of Toronto, Engineering Computing Facility
Lines: 31

In article <[e-mail]>,
Tom (TJ) Alessi - K1TJ <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>Split ALL licenses in half.  Written and CW.  Have 2 ladders.

Just so I add my two cents worth.  Up here in the Great Northern Waste
(also known as Canada), this is exactly the system.  There are 6
different privilege levels:

Basic, no code
Advanced, no code
Basic, 5 wpm
Advanced, 5 wpm
Basic, 12 wpm
Advanced, 12 wpm

Basic gives you phone/digital/whatever operation on 50 MHz and up., up to
250W (IIRC).  Advanced gives 1 kW, and the ability to build things (and
some other stuff that's irrelevant here).  5 wpm gives access to 160 and
80 m.  12 wpm gives access to the rest of the HF bands.

And the system works.  Although, I must say, there is some concern about
the lack of interest in code.  IIRC, only something like 25% of new
licencees take the CW test.  The rest of us are waiting until '99 <g>.


--
Luke Stras, VA3LNS                              e-mail: [e-mail]

"I can do that if I want to.  You can do it if I let you." ---Prof. S.
Smith, Differential Equations, circa 1996.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MOTOROLA PAGERS
Date: 12 Dec 1996 19:08:41 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <01bbe85e$df862160$8b7174cf@default>
References: <01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.113.139
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I recieved the following from Evan,


He said he really loves me and wanted to meet me.  But he refused when he
found out I was over 18 years old.


HOW DO I STOP THIS GUY FROM EMAILING AND CONTACTING ME?

1 <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<01bbe648$d107be40$bb7174cf@default>...
>
>
>
> Motorola Bravo Pagers  $55.00
>
>
> $4.00 per month service available, just prepay 1 year, all states
> available.
>
>
> Email me or see my web page:
>
>
> www.angelfire.com/biz/pager/index.html
>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.iarc.com!cpk-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsserver.jvnc.net!princeton!cnn.Princeton.EDU!cbgw1.lucent.com!cbgw2.lucent.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.89.123.24!nntp.inet.fi!news.sci.fi!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Paul KeinΣnen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW OPS Attention!!!!
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 09:21:06 GMT
Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, [e-mail], (931)3186277
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <58r6ua$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58o5ha$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: clx.dyn.sci.fi
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:


>I question the PR benefit of a CW position vs. the negative PR of
>showing such backward practices in what's supposed to be a technically
>progressive activity ...  and even just in light of the level of
>technology that's commonplace to the average Joe today ...  nationwide
>paging, cellphones, PCS, even satellite communications ...  even though
>they may not know how all that stuff works, they're clearly smart enough
>to realize the benefits and that it's FAR more advanced than Morse code
>.. why can't so many hams realize that????

Why try to hide the current state of the affairs, the truth will come
out anyway :-).

A few observations about arranging public displays to the general
poblic about amateur radio:

Usually there are a few people who find CW "cute"  as a mode of
communication that once was a major mode, long before they were born
and now beeing able to try it out. This, however, is a small minority.

When demonstrating CW contacts, there should be an other ham doing
simultaneus interpretation to the general public. Not just
interpretting the CW but also translating the Q-codes, abbrevations
and country prefixes to plain language.

Even with an "interpretter" present, the public looses interest in a
few minutes, it is a good idea to keep the CW sessions short.

When using SSB, it is important to tune the receiver to the exact
frequency of the remote station, since the general public is not used
to off-beat tones or even Donald Duck speak and have very hard to
understand what is said. The bad frequency and phase response of
current SSB filters and loadspeakers does not increase the readability
either. We usually try to pre-arrange some contacts with some
compatriots living abroad, so that it easier for the public to
understand what is said.

If you only one PC on the site, it seems to be much more effective to
run a satellite tracking program on it than trying to demonstrate
packet radio (or other non-realtime mode).

Using ATV and a big monitor attracts people to your site very
effectively. If you have an HF and VHF stations at different places,
setting up an ATV link between them seems to be quite usable.

Paul OH3LWR




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.xensei.com!news.miracle.net!wariat.org!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 17 Dec 1996 15:12:44 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <596d9c$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <596209$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn23.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <596209$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:
>
>>Due to the actions of your good buddy K04QC and a few other "holier than
>>thou" HAM OPERATORS on the CB newsgroup, don't be surprised if a few of
>>the regulars over there now begin showing up over here to return the fire.
>
>We are worried, MN Maniac. If they are all like you, we'll probably cancel ou
r
>internet account.
>
>73, Jim KH2D

It's a lot easier to use a killfile, or if your news reader doesn't have one,
simply ignore posts from known trouble makers.

Tom,
N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.253.208.40!insync!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!sdd.hp.com!hp-pcd!hpbs2500.boi.hp.com!hpax!donh
From: [e-mail] (Don Hay)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: F.S. New Heathkit in the box
Date: 18 Dec 1996 00:00:07 GMT
Organization: Hewlett Packard, Cupertino
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <597c67$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hpcuhe.cup.hp.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]


I have the following for sale...............

Heathkit..Remote Coax Switch, model HD-1481

This is a kit, still in the box, complete!  This kit has two units.
One that mounts outside the shack connecting up to 4 antennas.
One coax leads into the shack.  Antenna selection is made through
the one coax along with the RF signal.

The switch handles up to 2000 watts PEP.  I will be glad to answer
questions for anyone who may be interested.

I am asking $140.00 for the switch, you pay the shipping, about 6
pounds.

Regards  Don  WB6LPJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!news.callamer.com!news.west.net!hsnx.wco.com!miwok!news1.best.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why are there HAM OPERATORS on rec.radio.cb?
Date: 18 Dec 1996 16:50:49 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 16
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5997d9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

You gotta just grin and laugh at these guys...

I'm both a ham and a CB'er.  I can certainly understand why the hams
would be on the CB newsgroup.  They're real people, too (well, MOST of
them anyway), and get tired of endless discussions about Morse code,
signal reports, and health ailments.

It's just an attempt on their part to lighten up and get a life outside
of Elmers, CW, equipment debates, and "YE OLDE FAHRTZ"

Humor them :-)

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.iarc.com!econ4.econnect.net!news.insinc.net!ocean.netrover.com!amberjack.netrunner.net!news1.agis.net!agis!news.monmouth.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: old socks and mayonnaise?
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 09:32:15 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]> <58sbd8$[e-mail]> <58sh5b$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121637 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44639

Jim Weir wrote:
> ->Say you've got to assemble a small team of 5 to put up the club 3C Field
> ->Day station.  The guys and YLs are all lined up.  You've got some 35 WPM
> ->Novices and you've got some real antenna experts who can build a
> ->transmitter out of sticky tape and paper clips but haven't worked CW
> ->since the exam (or perhaps never at all).
>
> Sticky tape?  YOU LET THEM HAVE STICKY TAPE???!!! God, what pansies.  Last
> year all they gave me was old socks and mayonnaise.
> Jim

Yeah, but what brand mayonnaise?? Some of it has a low velocity factor.

--
Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:33:03 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts13-6.goodnet.com
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)

John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
>
> Yea right I'll remember that "%6000.00" thing the next time
> I am in Phoenix.  Funny, the last time I was in Phoenix
> I didn't hear anything of you.  The only thing I heard was
> a lot of guys working the 10 meter FM remote on the 146.96
> repeater & some cactus activity on UHF.  HRO was a cool place to
> visit though.
Your MOUTH is showing again......

>
> Really!!!!  I have BAD news for you, I AM ALREADY A MEMBER OF *TWO*
> VEC PROGRAMS for 6 years!!!!!!!!!!  I am one of the most ACTIVE VE's in
> the Northwest United States!!!  So what could you possible use
> to keep a "dangerous" person like out of the VEC program when I
> have already proven myself with a six year spotless track record
> of VE experience.  What "danger" has there been?
What did that have to do with the NAL?, again, your ignorance is
showing,
john. Give it a rest!

>
>
> > Basically, the smartest thing you can do right now is close your
> > mouth and start listening. I don't post much in here, and usually,
>
> Then please go back to your usual mode of operations.
>
> I notice you signed your name as "esquire".  Personally I
> don't care wether you own land, are an attorney, or are a homeless
> bum.
Well, then you aren't aware of history, are you? I'll let you stew on
that one a bit. Perhaps you might come up with a "reasonable" answer?
Then again, I hope for too much, perhaps?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:37:19 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts13-6.goodnet.com
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John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> > John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
> > > Do you really have such an INFLATED view of yourself that you
> > > really think a little technician- wet behind the ears ham-
>
> My apologies Eric.  I thought you were a Technician class
> operator.  Upon closer review of you license data I see that I
> was in error.  You are only a CODELESS-TECHNICIAN!!!!!
>
> You are still a wet behind the ears ham with an inflated view
> of yourself.
Oh? Care to look in the mirror and repeat that?

Well folks, it starts again. personal attacks from the king of
smokedom. I see that Mr. Mackey can't argue like a gentleman,
so, I'll let him continue to make a fool of himself.

Meanwhile, I have more important items in my agenda.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:41:00 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts13-6.goodnet.com
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)

John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
>
> > You have no real idea of what I can (or can't) do, John.
> > Perhaps you should look in the fcc.gov website under
> > their newsletter. Look up NAL's issued and NOV's issued
> > and key that to Phoenix. you will see what I can
> > do! Read the part about Tim Hoffman getting caught using my
> > call and the fact he got issued a %6000.00 notice of
> > apparent liability. Then, think on your statement.
>
> You should talk!  You have no idea either.  I, as a member
> of the Phantom's Amateur Radio Group, was involved in
> Bobby Aguero getting caught causing interference to
> a local police department.  The situation is now in court
> process.  Perhaps you should review The ARRL Letter or
> Amateur Radio Newsline to see more about this.
>
> My involvement does not give me any more powers, as
> neither does yours.
Funny, most people involved in that didn't mention you.
Perhaps you are embellishing the story a bit? The group
may have been involved, and you MAY have been a member, but
I seriously doubt that you ACTUALLY did anything of
real importance.

However, I shall let you have your little fantasy, john.
We'll see how far you blow it out of porportion in the next
few months.... Should prove to be real interesting.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:42:12 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
> > Besides, who needs all those fancy pieces of paper (all they do is
> > clutter up the wall).
>
> How would you know, YOU don't have fancy pieces of paper!
>
> hahahahahahahahahahahaha

How do you know that I don't? Forsooth, I think
thou doth protest too much, John.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:46:27 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts13-6.goodnet.com
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)

John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
> > Yes, it was you that was disrupting that newsgroup.
>
> Eric, I have the PERFECT solution for you. Create a kill file
> for YOUR browser & put ME in it.
>
[SNIP]

I'd rather not have to go through that again, john.
Besides, it make enough of a fool out of yourself
without any help from anyone.

Perhaps you should go back to doing other things?
Things like work, perhaps?
I am sure you have something more important to attend to
than this newsgroup, perhaps?

You started this mess, now clean it up.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 03:16:16 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
>
>
> Talk about not having anything nice to say!!!!
You should talk, john. Personal insults aside, I think perhaps it would
be a good idea to shut up and listenb for a bit, don't you?

>
>
> > It wasn't my idea to have a flame war. however, since you seem so keen
>
> The why do you keep chasing me from newsgroup to newsgroup trying to
> start
> one?
Ah so, You think this is my doing? Who started it, john? It is an
interesting fact that everytime you enter one of these newsgroups, that
a flame war just happenes to erupt. Strange coincidence? I think not.

>
> > and see what mackey did to rec.radio.scanner for almost 8 months!
>
> Actually, it was 2 months & 3 weeks, hardly 8 months.
Actually, according to the archive, it was 8 months, 13 days. I sure
would like to know where you got those figures from?
>
> > You might find that John Mackey is more of a problem than the rest of us
> > put together. If you get rid of him, all else falls into place.
>
> Then why is it tha YOU keep popping up where ever there are problems?
>
You could be asked the same question, john. only I didn't appear in here
before you started this mess. I appeared about 3 weeks AFTER! Think
about it! Casting dispusions will not help you, john.

>
> > ALso, I have been posting here (off and on) for 6 months now, and
> > nothing I have done has caused any problems (until mackey showed up with h
is
> > assitude).
>
> You can't even spell attitude correctly hahahahahahaha.
I spelled it that was for a reason! It's not just an attitude, its an
ASSitude!
>
> YOU seem to be the one with the attitude as reed@pacifier indicates.
Funny, he is one posting and here you have posted (what?) 20+ times in 1
week? That and your attacks on others leaves a real bad taste in my
mouth! Forget it john, you have already lost the battle.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!news.azstarnet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-7.sprintlink.net!ratty.wolfe.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Alan Burgstahler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ctcss decoder wanted 12VDC dipswitch programable
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 14:43:21 GMT
Organization: Wolfe Internet Access, L.L.C.
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <59gt36$[e-mail]>
References: <58lg3l$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbe89d$350bdce0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sea-ts4-p19.wolfenet.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"David Lawson" <[e-mail]> wrote:



>Mike <[e-mail]> wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
>> Bill wrote:

>> > I am looking for a ctcss decoder.
>> I just saw what you are looking for be advertised in CQ VHF. It is DIP
>> switch programmable, ctcss encoder, 67 to 203.5 hzdim are .9"x1.3"x.4".
>> the model number is ss-32pa and the asking price is $28.95. the company
>> address is COMMUNICATION SPECIALISTS, INC.
>>            426 WEST TAFT AV.
>>            ORANGE, CALIF. 92665-3420
>> PH# 714 998-3021 OR FAX [phone]
>>     800 854-0574
>>
>> THEY ALSO HAVE A FRONT DIAL SELECTABLE UNIT FOR $49.95
>> hOPE IT HELPS YOU.
>> 73 Mike K6YPB
>>
>hell mike, he's looking for a DEcoder!

They have those also.


Remove the leading underscore from the reply_to address to reply.

Alan Burgstahler - WA6AWD - Kent, WA, USA



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!malgudi.oar.net!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 21 Dec 1996 15:25:31 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <59gvhb$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ogea$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qjp2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tbvg$[e-mail]> <594j2q$[e-mail]> <59fmmj$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn09.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <59fmmj$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...

>>>over"? ... folks who run "60 over" should be fined ...
>>
>>
>>It's already in part 97 that power output shall be kept to the minimum neede
d
>>to maintain communication. A blanket condemnation of every "60 over" signal
>>makes no sense. A "60 over" signal can quickly turn to less than S1, or even

>>disappear completely.
>
>So when the signal fades, you can turn up the power to maintain a
>reasonable s/n ratio ... but running the legal limit at 60+over is
>against the rules, but routinely done ... as I said.

No, that's *not* what you said. You said "folks who run '60 over should be
fined." Period. You made no mention of exceptions.



>Well, as Gary has pointed out, the ITU regulations define ham radio as a
>service for the pursuit of technical experimentation and self-education
>(perhaps more eloquently than our own FCC rules, though my reading of
>Part 97 clearly gives the same impression) ...
>
>And there are LOTs of "art" things that are, bu any *reasonable,
>rational* definition garbage ... for example the controversy a while
>back about the guy who got a (rather substantial) grant from the
>National Endowment for the Arts for his "art" ...  which consisted of a
>plastic dashboard Jesus in a bottle of piss ...  sorry, but I don't
>think any *REASONABLE* definition of "art" could encompass that ...


Then you had better re-read part 97.1. The word "art" is used twice with
reference to amateur radio.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 16:48:54 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <59i8mr$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fpqe$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-163.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121361 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44502 rec.radio.shortwave:90900

[e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>   Rush Johnson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>As we slowly take away the significant things from Amateur Radio that
>>create a sense of shared identity, a sense of community  (like the CW
>>requirement, or homebrewing equipment), we start to lose those things
>>that keep us "bonded", that keep us comiserating (!), that keep us
>>mutually  respectful of each others' committment to the hobby.

>We don't have a sense of community about the CW requirement.

Certainly we do. At least amongst those of us who use it we do.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 16:58:15 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <59i98a$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]> <5977hr$[e-mail]> <597o5t$[e-mail]> <59as80$[e-mail]> <59bmt0$[e-mail]> <59ehvp$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-163.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Peter Laws) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writes:

>>There are idots everywhere. God loves stupid people. That's why he makes
>>so many of them.

>And many of those idots [sic] post to Usenet.

Good, keeps them off the low bands at nite.

>>but we don't sit around and wait for them.  I have been listening to 2 meter
s
>>for 13 years and have never heard anything that was farther than 15 miles aw
ay.

>Unhook your 2m radio from your HF antenna and take a listen.  See my
>other post.

Get out your geography book and see my QTH.

>>Real hams do it on the low bands.....

>Which, with the help of fine folks like yourself, will be all we have by
>the turn of the century.  By then, we'll be confined to the "useless bands
>below 50 MHz", to paraphrase an old quote.

Useless to you maybe, but some of us enjoy using them.  If the giga hertz
are going to go away, hams can't stop that. No lobbying power and not enuff
$$$$.   Besides that, we are dumb enuff to do Little Leo's beta testing for
him.  See UOS and 'amateur'  satellites.

73, Jim KH2D







From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!194.179.1.100!minerva.ibernet.es!diana.ibernet.es!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: AEA2232 help needed-SOS
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 16:59:08 GMT
Organization: Unisource Espana NEWS SERVER
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <59h4ue$quj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: info171.jet.es
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Dear friends,

My AEA DSP 2232 doesn┤t   work right.
I┤m getting on the little screen of the TNC the following,
Packet
Packet
and both lights DCD and CMD are on.

On the screen of the computer appears the following message when I
communicate with the TNC,

cmd: 3d: DSP software load failed and sometimes
cmd: 2e: DSP software load failed.

I dont know if the Microchip Motorola 56001zl20 is doing wrong or some
statics on it or other.
I can communicate and change modems, etc without any problem.
How can I solve this problem..
AEA they say is in process of closing, so they can not help me.
Please some one do it. If you have service maunal check the error
messages and answer me.
Awaiting your kind comments, have my best.
E-mail me [e-mail]
Christian-Pedro EA2AFI
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Christian M. Hondeville Urrutibeheity

Particular de club 2                                  Phone:  [phone]
Las Arenas-48930                                      Fax:    [phone]
Spain-Espa±a                                          E-mail: [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:00:41 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59i9cs$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-163.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Dave Martindale) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Doug Smith) writes:
>>220V is a little more dangerous; it's a little more likely to cause
>>injury or death if you're shocked, and a little more likely to cause a
>>fire if something else happens.  The difference is minimal.

>I've heard it argued that 220-240 V at 50 Hz is no more, and perhaps less,
>dangerous to humans than 120 V 60 Hz.  Apparently 60 Hz is a bad choice
>of frequency because it easily causes fibrillation in the heart muscle,
>while 50 Hz is less likely to.  So even though your body draws twice
>the current at 240 V than 120 V, it's less likely to kill you.  But this
>was someone from Britain arguing this.  Does anyone know for sure?

>       Dave

I don't know for SURE Dave, but I know 110 makes my fingers tingle and
220 makes me wanna let go right now........

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 12:12:58 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv17.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> Burt's "inner child" was wounded when his daddy did not buy him a
> EZ-Bake Oven and Action Barbie for his 10th birthday. For additional
> proof just glance at his "home page". Perhaps Child Protective Services
> should be notified of his situation?

Burt's got a home page??? Where, this I gots ta see

>
> 73,
> Bruce KG2IC
> regulate it. And if it stops moving,
>  ARMY-MARS AAR2AJ             subsidize it." -Ronald Reagan
> =======================================================================
> --
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member
Ex Army Mars  AAR2NL

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Lee C.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Zen Bouddhisme sur Internet
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:16:31 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <59h658$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tal-fl1-18.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 21 11:18:32 AM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Bonjour a tous,

Pour en savoir plus, allez voir au
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/8516

Merci.

-- Lee




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newspump.sol.net!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!news
From: [e-mail] (Rick)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:17:41 GMT
Organization: TAC, The Atlanta Connection and Radio.Org
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: rick.webex.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33035 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44802 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121326

"David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
>of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
>hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
>a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
>I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
>suggestions?
>
>Thank you in advance.
>David P. Hummel, Jr.
>KG2BX
>
Dave,myself I used a back-hoe.Really the only you could do it the easy
way....gud luck......73 de AA4UF  Rick        [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!sloc223.cds.sloc.net!usenet
From: boyd <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS "Icom IC-736" HF/6met.
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 09:50:09 -0800
Organization: SPRINTLink On Campus
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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  For Sale:

         I have a Icom IC-736 for sale. I bought it New  October
         28, 1996. This rig is as new, has maby 2 hrs use.

         The IC-736 is a general coverage transceiver from 30 KC
         to 30 MHz, Also has 6 meters. 100 Watts out on All-Bands.
         Has built-in Antenna Tunner and 110-Volt Power Supply.
         Runs 100% duty-cycle. It is All-Mode, SSB, AM, FM, & CW.
         I have shipping box, power cord, hand mic and book.

         I paid $1700.00 for it but will sell for $1450.00
                                          __________________
         Thanks,
         Boyd
         N6DMF
         [e-mail]
         Phone: [phone]




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:33 1997
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From: AC6V <"ac6v@ac6v"@popd.ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FYI: SOFTWARE FOR DXERS & HAMS
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 11:48:49 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <59hese$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: "ac6v@ac6v"@popd.ix.netcom.com
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)

The AC6V DX Reference Page now has links to some neat software.

SOFTWARE FOR DXERS AND HAMS -  Great Circle Map, Logging, GeoClock
SSTV, RTTY, FCC Part 97, Form 610, Yagi Computer Aided Design,
MacIntosh Ham Software List,  Propagation Program, Mega-Software Page

As well as Reference info for DXers:

Contest/DXpedition Registries, Beacons, DX NETS, DX NEWS LETTERS
QSL INFORMATION, Time & Freq Stations, Phonetic Alphabets,
CW Trainers, Abbreviations, Prosigns, RST System  Q-Signals,
3rd Party Agreements

FREQUENCIES, PREFIXES, COUNTRIES, ZONES, AWARDS, CONTESTING

CLUBS - DX & CONTEST Clubs 100 DX Clubs & Leagues

DX PACKET CLUSTERS  Clusters World Wide, Cluster Tutorial

LICENSING ABROAD, Shortwave Broadcasters, WWW REPEATER GUIDES

ANTIQUE RADIOS

MANUFACTURERS AND SALES Over 200 Toy and Candy Stores

FUN STUFF DX and Ham Humor, DX Stories By VE1DX & WA6AUD
Ham Radio Clip Art,  Ham Puzzles,  Notable and Famous Hams
--
Happy Holidays and Merry DX
Rod in San Diego
AC6V DX Reference Page at:  http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html

Hark for I have hurled my words to the far reaches of the earth!
What King of old could do thus??
..... AC6V


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:33 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.6.9.51!news.thepoint.net!ttyC3e
From: [e-mail] (Mike Flaugher)
Subject: Solar Cycle 23 - Feast or Famine ?
Message-ID: <c157cc$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 20:43:23 GMT
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4
Lines: 10

Everyone who's patiently waiting for Cycle 23 "The Big One" should read a
report by the NOAA Space Environment Center (SEC) at http://www.sel.noaa.gov/
titled Solar Cycle 23 Project. The general concensus of the 12 scientists who
prepared the report was that Cycle 23 will be pretty normal BUT there seems to

be some concern that recent magnetic flux intensities at the sun's poles do
not support a banner season. If so it may be the first time in many, many
cycles that an odd-numbered cycle is less intense than it's even-numbered
predecessor. Cycle 22 was a real whopper for an "even-numbered" cycle, and by
that logic #23 should be the mother of all solar cycles! So what's up with the

sun anyway? And why is it getting so cold around here? Let's see some SPOTS!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: ARRL amateur training videos...
Date: 21 Dec 1996 15:48:49 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59hifh$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:100616 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121338 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44806

In article <[e-mail]>,  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>My nephew has been trying to learn enough electronics and code for over
>a year to get his license - without any luck.  Seems he's one of the few
>people who has trouble with the theory, rather than the code.  He just
>can't seem to grasp it the principals of electronics...

Do what everyone else who gets an amateur radio license today does:

Buy a Gorden West study guide and just memorize the questions and
answers.

Its quick. Its easy. And most of all, nobody knows the difference.


Why waste time and effort learning all that useless theory and
electronics when all you want to do is yack on the radio. Memorize
a question pool near you today.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:36 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 21:19:05 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59iohc$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-8.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Dick Flanagan) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>Timothy Haller <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
>>
>>> I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the ARRL.
>They need our
>>> support, and we need theirs.
>>>
>>Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?

>I guess the ARRL needs to pay me, too, because I agree 100% with Dave.
>--
>Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada

Me too. I agree 100% with Dave.

73, Jim KH2D
Support the ARRL - Join NOW !!
Call Toll Free - 1-888-277-5289 To Join.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bconnex.net!clicnet!news.clic.net!rcogate.rco.qc.ca!altitude!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Patrick De Gagne)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 21:38:46 GMT
Organization: Communications Accessibles Montreal, Quebec Canada
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59afg8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dynamicppp-166.hip.cam.org
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.227

You know....

This is becoming one of the funniest threads in the few newsgroups I
read?  I really get a giggle out of you guys...

Keep it up guys, I'll soon be able to drop alt.tasteless.jokes!

Pat - VE2VFD



--
  \/  Scouter Pat  -  Patrick De Gagne  -    Montreal, Canada
  /\   Dollard Des Ormeaux Scouts & Venturers
 /  \   http://www.cam.org/~pdg       IRC: I-Spy on #Scouting
/    \   [e-mail]  - VE2VFD -  I used to be a Flying Frog!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:38 1997
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From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 21 Dec 1996 21:43:51 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59hlmn$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF.
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
<59fhpt$[e-mail]>:
Distribution:

DICK ([e-mail]) wrote:
: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:
:
: >Eric Oyen wrote:

: >YOU seem to be the one with the attitude as reed@pacifier indicates.
:
: Toady drones always parrot their smarmy King Mackey.
:
:
Now look, Dicky-boy. As a casual browser it is obvious YOU were one of the
main instigators of the flame war. Look at the posting that started this
whole thread. Did anyone here ask you to post your little story?
Since everyone knows you started all this crap, you really look like a
horse's ass for accusing others.


: Dicky-Boy CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
: Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
: QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
: Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |
:

--
----


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:12:10 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 70
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <582qr0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ogea$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58qjp2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58tbvg$[e-mail]> <594j2q$[e-mail]> <59fmmj$[e-mail]> <59gvhb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv28.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <59gvhb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> In article <59fmmj$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says nothing of any grea
t inportance...
>
> >>>over"? ... folks who run "60 over" should be fined ...
> >>
> >>
> >>It's already in part 97 that power output shall be kept to the minimum nee
ded
> >>to maintain communication. A blanket condemnation of every "60 over" signa
l
> >>makes no sense. A "60 over" signal can quickly turn to less than S1, or ev
en
> >>disappear completely.
> >
> >So when the signal fades, you can turn up the power to maintain a
> >reasonable s/n ratio ... but running the legal limit at 60+over is
> >against the rules, but routinely done ... as I said.
>
> No, that's *not* what you said. You said "folks who run '60 over should be
> fined." Period. You made no mention of exceptions.

In regards to WA6VSE..it's a case of amplifier envy.  He'd like to be 60
over but all that ever comes out is always below the noise floor

>
>
>
> >Well, as Gary has pointed out, the ITU regulations define ham radio as a
> >service for the pursuit of technical experimentation and self-education
> >(perhaps more eloquently than our own FCC rules, though my reading of
> >Part 97 clearly gives the same impression) ...
> >
> >And there are LOTs of "art" things that are, bu any *reasonable,
> >rational* definition garbage ... for example the controversy a while
> >back about the guy who got a (rather substantial) grant from the
> >National Endowment for the Arts for his "art" ...  which consisted of a
> >plastic dashboard Jesus in a bottle of piss ...  sorry, but I don't
> >think any *REASONABLE* definition of "art" could encompass that ...
>

The NEA has relevance to the ARS.  Obviously Carl, the bonafide RF
engineer has been standing to close to the microwave transmitters again.

You see...you're interpretation is ALL wrong.  Carl is correct, always
has been, aways will be..ask him, he'll tell you so.
>
> Then you had better re-read part 97.1. The word "art" is used twice with
> reference to amateur radio.

Watch out, Carl will then insist that it is a misspelling and that the
letter "F" was omitted..as in old fart.

Hey Carl, ya big silly, love ya just them same..don't ever change.


>
> Tom - N8ECW
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Kudos to anyone...
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 22:17:22 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <59irun$[e-mail]>
References: <59igvv$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-19.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I) wrote:

>1) From what show came "Lenny and Squiggy?"

Originally, Laverne and Shirley, but the current Squiggy and Lenny came from
the Carl  Stevenson and Len Anderson No Code HF Tap Dance Show,
viewed world wide via the internet ?

>2) What were their FULL character names?

Lenny Kosnowski and Andrew 'Squiggy' Squiggman.

>3) Who played them?

Lenny, by David Reis, and Squiggy, by Tom Putko.

>One of the actors was in a pretty good movie.

>  4) Name the movie.

Well, that could have been several movies.  In 'Raiders of The Lost Ark', Davi
d
Reis (Lenny) played Rene Belloq.  In 'Indiana Jones', he played Mola Ram.  But
both Lenny and Squiggy have been in a number of movies.

I understand the current day counterparts will be staring in a movie also
entitled 'WARC 99 - Lenny and Squiggy Don't Go To HF'.

>Happy holidays to all, and remember, it's only life.

Merry Christmas to you too, Scott.  And isn't life so much more fun since we
have Lenny and Squggy ?

>* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
>*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
>** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
>* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.monmouth.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.94.215.18!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 15:14:58 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fhpt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Richard Kendrick wrote:

> John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >Talk about not having anything nice to say!!!!
>
> You're projecting again, Johnnie boy.

You would know about projecting.


> Either you're a liar, or your drugs have skewed your perception of time.
> Probably both.

NO, I am not wrong.  I became a part of the already running fued on July
20th
of this year.  I ver CLEARLY remember the date because it is my father's
birthday.  (you could verify the BD by looking up in QRZ)  YOU got
involved
a few weeks before it ended.

Perhaps you should review DejaNews.  People were bitching at me because
I
had never been on that NG before.


> >Then why is it tha YOU keep popping up where ever there are problems?

  <<much bullshit deleted>>
You never answered the question.


> I think he spelled it correctly.

According to the dictionary both of you are wrong.  heheehe


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:42 1997
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 15:25:00 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59afg8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Howard B. Watson Jr. wrote:

> Totally irrelevant to the flaming going on, John <G>  BUT, they are
> occasionally using Ritalin for that now.  Actually Depakote would be a
> more appropriate drug to try first, Lithium has a very narrow
> therapeutic index and the side effects can be extreme.  (I know,
> nothing to do with Ham Radio, but its the area I know more about <G> )
> 73 de N3TNQ Howard - Springfield, OH


Sounds like you have some experience in the medical or mental health
field???

I worked as a MH counselor for several years, uaually in non-medical
settings but occasionally in medical setting.

I finally left & am now in a completely different profession.  Far less
stress, far less burnout.  :)   But less money too.  :(


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:44 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 21 Dec 1996 23:28:30 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59hrqu$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-18.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121337 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44491 rec.radio.shortwave:90887

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>
>If a person is not interested enough in the radio arts to put forth the
>small amount of effort it takes to get a license these days, then they
>do not deserve the privilege of using the Ham bands.
>

I agree with you in principle ... those people who have no interest in
*radio* technology (the "art" in "radio art", NOT CW, which is simply
telegraphy, which has existed for far longer than radio) don't deserve
to be hams ... even if they can copy 20+wpm of Morse code.

However, having a Morse code test has NOTHING to do with the radio art
.. read the ITU definition of ham radio ... it's a service devoted to
private tecnical investigations ... NOT a "gaming place for people who
want to yack, beep, and 'chase DX'" ...  those things are permissable,
but they are NOT the "reason for being" of ham radio.

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:45 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: No Code/No Phone/All Digital HF License?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <585b49$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 23:30:37 GMT
Lines: 58
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121335 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44489

In article <[e-mail]> cathryn@jung
levision.junglevision.com (cathryn) writes:
>>>>The bandwidths available on the HF bands are based on the idea that
>>>>"narrower is *always* "better" ... that is a false premise and the rules
>>>>should be changed to permit wider band modes that would allow many new
>>>>modes and systems to be implemented ...  Gary and I have each proposed
>
>Here, here.  I don't know who said this, but I agree.  Would it work to allow
>wider bandwidth signals on HF below something like 250 mw?

The parameter of interest would be dbm/Hz. A 250 mW signal is
often a respectable one on HF. If it represented an OOK modulated
carrier, it would average roughly 0 dbm/Hz at the transmitter,
though the spectrum wouldn't be flat. If it were a SS signal with
a dispersion of 250 kHz, it would have a power density of roughly
-30 dbm/Hz, or about 1 microwatt per Hertz at the transmitter,
and the spectrum would be flat. Throw in typical HF path losses,
and it would be at the limit of detection of most narrowband
amateur HF receivers, even under ideal HF conditions. So
narrowband operators would be unlikely to notice it. But
when the dispersion is collapsed by the SS receiver, the
respectable 250 mW signal is recovered.

The experiment I'm currently running (operating under current
narrowband rules) has a power spectral density of -3 dbm/Hz at
the transmitter on the "high power" setting. It has proven to
be fairly robust over 20m HF paths using simple coding and very
simple RF hardware. Contact has been established at -13 dbm/Hz
and -23 dbm/Hz as well, but throughput at the latter power level
is very low. CW operators don't seem to notice it at all, however.
Note the system uses no SS dispersion or collapse, so this represents
raw channel performance with pretty primitive equipment.

If an upper limit of 0 dbm/Hz were put on the transmitters of
moderately wideband (IE up to 3 kHz) data systems on HF, we
could certainly live with that if we stay near the MUF. With
full SS authority, we could live with -30 dbm/Hz transmitted
power on most of our HF bands, save perhaps 160m and 80m in
summer. That would take our signals completely out of the ears
of conventional narrowband operators.

But higher output powers would allow much higher throughput
of course. Current UHF SS rules, and the two STAs currently
in force, limit total output power to 100 watts. With that
much power on HF, we could offer throughput numbers of 1
Mbit/sec or greater using symbol overloading, but the dbm/Hz
output would be -4 dbm/Hz, and that might be noticed by
narrowband weak signal operators, IE a 0.01 mW "white noise"
signal on every frequency of the band. That is still 102 db
less power spectral density than a Dx pileup commonly generates,
however. Hence the common fear that Dxers will "burn out"
the band. :-)

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 21 Dec 1996 16:33:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <59hs3e$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF. <59hlmn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.198 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] () wrote:

>Now look, Dicky-boy. As a casual browser it is obvious YOU were one of the
                                           ^^^^^^^^^

Hmmm, casual. That means you don't pay attention very much. Must
be an attention deficient problem. Perhaps you should consult with
Johnnie boys doctor. He may be able to prescribe something for you.

>main instigators of the flame war. Look at the posting that started this
>whole thread. Did anyone here ask you to post your little story?

Helping to keep the historical perspective correct. Besides, you liked
the story and you're just afraid to admit it.

>Since everyone knows you started all this crap, you really look like a
>horse's ass for accusing others.

Ah yes, the self-righteous indignation of someone confronted with the truth
and is unwilling to face facts. Something like a child caught with his hand
in the cookie jar and yet denies taking any cookies. Are you and Johnnie
boy in group therapy together or what?




Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 15:33:58 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Bill Nelson wrote:

> The problems on rec.radio.scanner disappeared when EITHER you or Bill Cheek
> disappeared.  Neither one of you alone appears to be a problem, but the two
> of you on the same forum is.

Hmmm, I suppose I could accept that for that period of time.

BUT, you notice there has not been a
problem in rec.radio.scanner lately & we have BOTH been there.  Infact,
I have even responded to posting of his.  :)


> Personally, I don't care who started the mud slinging, or where. I just thin
k
> that you are both asses to continue it every time you encounter a post made
> by the other party.

Yea, I wonder why Dich Kendrick & Eric Oyen keep wanting to keep this
situation stirred up.  You notice just within the last 24 hours Dick has
posted FOUR responses from me to messages within this thread that were
not directed or involveing him in any way?

You have brought up an excelent point Bill.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ANONYMOUS POSTER CAUGHT--KEVIN POTTER  WAS:Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 15:55:49 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59eklb$[e-mail]> <59enr1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------20B461B12CE"
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

--------------20B461B12CE
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Kevin Potter wrote:
> I like this!
> KP
>
> <[e-mail]>

We CAUGHT Kevin Potter making false postings!!!!  He started
sending messages & making news group posting under the
name "[e-mail]".  Using the header & router
info on messages, see where they are EXACTLY the same except
for his fruitless attempt to hide by changing his user name
& reply info.

--------------20B461B12CE
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; name="potter.txt"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="potter.txt"

From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 17:28:19 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: max5-so-ca-48.earthlink.net
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; 68K)


From: <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 20 Dec 1996 18:07:39 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
NNTP-Posting-Host: max5-so-ca-48.earthlink.net
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; 68K)

-------------------------------------------------

Notice the "NNTP-Posting-Host", "X-Mailer", and
the "Organization" lines are exactly the same.  These
line are not possible to change.  Especially
the posting host.  It is assigned by Earthlink
when you dial in.  BUT, in order to prove that
it is not just some coincidence that someone
else came on from the SAME provider/organization
(earthlink) & the same posting host read the
following.

The "X-Mailer" is listed as:
"Mozilla 1.12 (Macintosh;I; 68K).  This is
very uncommon as this means the poster was using
Netscape version 1.12 for a MAC.  According to
Netscape support, this in now an obsolete version of
Netscape & has not been distributed by them for
quite some time.


The from line is EASY to change, as Kevin Potter
has demonstrated.

Shame on you Kevin.

--------------20B461B12CE--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!tezcat!gail.ripco.com!fred.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (R.Moroney)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ICOM Computer Control Software?
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 18:57:39 -0500
Organization: FredNet - Frederick, Md.
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: windbrkr.fred.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44821 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121359

Does anyone have a recommendation for a good control program for ICOM
rigs (specifically the '706 and '736)?  I'm mainly looking for a DOS
program, but Windows 3.1 or 95 would be OK too, in a pinch.  Logging
capabilities are a plus, but not a requirement.  Any suggestions?

BOB K9CMR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "Victor D. Mete" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: WTB:  Tri-Band Antenna (2M,220,440) & Tri-Plexer (2M,220,440)  for Base Station
Date: 22 Dec 1996 00:13:43 GMT
Organization: PMT
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <01bbef9c$a82738e0$LocalHost@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.84.136
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1160
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33041 rec.radio.amateur.dx:1634 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44808 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121341 rec.radio.swap:100619

 Need a Base station tri-band antenna for 2M,220,440.
 Also need tri-plexer for the same bands.
 Please contact:
----
Victor
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!cdc2.cdc.net!myth.vianet.on.ca!news
From: Murray Cotnam <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 19:44:51 -0500
Organization: ViaNet
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59g8nj$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sud140.vianet.on.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

Bill Nelson wrote:
>
> Dave Hockaday ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
> : Hi Bill. What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band?

80M BAND

CW    3.500-3.725
RTTY  3.600-3.645
SSB   3.725-4.000
SSTV  3.840-3.850
--
Murray Cotnam (Sudbury,Ontario,Canada)

AMATEUR RADIO CALLSIGN:       VE3MCN
INTERNET:       [e-mail]
AMPRnet:   [e-mail]
PACKET: VE3MCN@VA3BUS.#NE.ON.CA.NOAM


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:52 1997
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!sun4nl!Kijfhoek.NL.net!Leiden.NL.net!news
From: "Christian Leibbrandt" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: CEPT operation in the UK
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: amf51-34.amersfoort.nl.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Message-ID: <01bbefa3$530d2a20$c7e84fc1@christian-p133>
Sender: [e-mail] (News at newsldn)
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Organization: NLnet
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
References: <59b7s1$[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 00:55:21 GMT
Lines: 10
Xref: news1.epix.net uk.radio.amateur:23742 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121389

> ...UK amateurs hearing an overseas amateur operating in
> this country and using 'G' prefixes should politely
> inform them of the correct prefix to be used.

So what IS the correct prefix I need to use? M0/PE1OAJ, M1/PE1OAJ,
M/PE1OAJ?

Christian "confused" Leibbrandt
Amersfoort, Netherlands



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!gryphon.phoenix.net!cross
From: [e-mail] (John P. Cross, Emperor)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CW phonetics
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 96 01:12:47 GMT
Organization: Intergalactic Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <59i23n$s2o$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial31.phoenix.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4


>(2) and wether or not something alike exists for the English language
>

My dad told me about F (get a hair cut) and Q (payday today) which he learned
in the Air Force in WW2.

John AB5OX


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.misty.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 20:16:37 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs518.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Eric Oyen wrote:

>
> Perhaps you should go back to doing other things?
> Things like work, perhaps?
> I am sure you have something more important to attend to
> than this newsgroup, perhaps?

Guys,
I don't know what this is all about, nor do I care.  If you have a
problem with each other could you please take it to private e-mail?  you
are both looking like a couple CB'ers that are mad because one of you
used the others "private channel".  This is getting pretty annoying to
have the group clutterred with 10-12 messages a day for this bs.

Thanks,
Dave


--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:19:13 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF. <59hlmn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

[e-mail] wrote:

> Now look, Dicky-boy. As a casual browser it is obvious YOU were one of the
> main instigators of the flame war. Look at the posting that started this
> whole thread. Did anyone here ask you to post your little story?
> Since everyone knows you started all this crap, you really look like a
> horse's ass for accusing others.

> : Dicky-Boy CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI)        |
> : Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
> : QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.

Notice that Dicky-boy's sig file says that there is a fault in
reality.  Maybe that is his trouble & why he makes up all these
stories.  Maybe HE is the one on Ritalin & Lithium?  This would
explain his problem with reality!

Reed is 100% correct, Dicky-boy started this with his little story
he posted.  Before that, everything was fine.  Then Eric jumped
in to help.  Perhaps they are a team?

Or maybe - they are the same person?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:26:19 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF. <59hlmn$[e-mail]> <59hs3e$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Dicky-boy Kendrick wrote:

> [e-mail] () wrote:
> >Did anyone here ask you to post your little story?

> Helping to keep the historical perspective correct. Besides, you liked
> the story and you're just afraid to admit it.

He doesn't appear to me that he is afraid of anything here!  Hell, in
the
following statement he calls you a "horse's ass" for everyone to see.
(BTW - I notice that NO ONE has argued about your designation as
the "horse's ass")


> >Since everyone knows you started all this crap, you really look like a
> >horse's ass for accusing others.

> Ah yes, the self-righteous indignation of someone confronted with the truth
> and is unwilling to face facts. Something like a child caught with his hand
> in the cookie jar and yet denies taking any cookies. Are you and Johnnie
> boy in group therapy together or what?

You do seem to be the type who does not like to accept responsibility
for their own actions.  I notice you now want to try to make up
a new story about about group therapy to attempt to take the spot
light off of your intent to cause trouble.


> Dicky-boy CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI)        |
> Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
> QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.

I see you are still lost from reality as indicated by your above
message.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:04:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:36:54 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Eric Oyen wrote:

> Perhaps you should go back to doing other things?
> Things like work, perhaps?

I get PAID to sit at my computer all day & do things like
this.


> I am sure you have something more important to attend to
> than this newsgroup, perhaps?

One could say the same about yourself.


> You started this mess, now clean it up.

You memory is very selective.  I did not start this.  Dick
Kendrick started this by posting a spam about my march
thru scannerdom.  Do you remember now?  That has already
been established.  Then you jumped in wanting a piece of the
action.

Just remember this saying, when you point the finger at
someone, you have 3 fingers pointing back at you.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 17:37:03 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fhem$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Dicky-boy Kendrick wrote:

> John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >How would you know, YOU don't have fancy pieces of paper!

> Neither do you.

Bullshit.  You know from previous discussions with me that
I do.  Infact, I have more higher class "fancy pieces of
paper" than you.

hahahahahahahahahahaahhahahahhaha

You seem to be your own worst enemy!

heheheehehhehehehehe


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!usc!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 21:17:08 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 69.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Bruce J. Howes KG2IC wrote:
>
> Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> Hey guys, why in the world would you respond to this loser?

Ask yourself, you responded.


> Burt's "inner child" was wounded when his daddy did not buy him a
> EZ-Bake Oven and Action Barbie for his 10th birthday. For additional
> proof just glance at his "home page". Perhaps Child Protective Services
> should be notified of his situation?


Please do not judge me on YOUR LIFE.

> =======================================================================
>  Bruce J. Howes KG2IC        "The governmentÆs view of the economy
>  Grid FN03pa                  could be summed up in a few short phrases:
>  East Amherst, NY             If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving,
>  AMSAT#30466 ARRL             regulate it. And if it stops moving,
>  ARMY-MARS AAR2AJ             subsidize it." -Ronald Reagan
> =======================================================================

--
#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 21:19:08 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 69.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Andrew C Robertson wrote:
Please do not judge hams based on your denied self-hatred.
>
> drewbob

HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI
 HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!169.207.30.10!newspump.sol.net!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!in-news.erinet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Howard B. Watson Jr.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 03:12:20 GMT
Organization: EriNet Online 513 436-1700 (Voice)
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59afg8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dlp37.spring.eri.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

I Sat, 21 Dec 1996 15:25:00 -0800, John Mackey--KA0SSF
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>Howard B. Watson Jr. wrote:
>
>> Totally irrelevant to the flaming going on, John <G>  BUT, they are
>> occasionally using Ritalin for that now.  Actually Depakote would be a
>> more appropriate drug to try first, Lithium has a very narrow
>> therapeutic index and the side effects can be extreme.  (I know,
>> nothing to do with Ham Radio, but its the area I know more about <G> )
>> 73 de N3TNQ Howard - Springfield, OH
>
>
>Sounds like you have some experience in the medical or mental health
>field???
>
>I worked as a MH counselor for several years, uaually in non-medical
>settings but occasionally in medical setting.
>
>I finally left & am now in a completely different profession.  Far less
>stress, far less burnout.  :)   But less money too.  :(

I would totally agree with that :>   Its very stressful at times, but
it DOES beat med/surg nursing.  I'm a psych nurse on an acute mental
health unit.   That's one of my favorite things about Ham radio, its a
nice stress reducer. (How's that for keeping on topic...:>  )

73 de N3TNQ Howard - Springfield, OH


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!206.149.24.18!excalibur.flash.net!not-for-mail
From: "Bill Bierly" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Antique book website?
Date: 22 Dec 1996 03:24:13 GMT
Organization: Flashnet Communications, http://www.flash.net
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <01bbefb7$aae4de00$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: apm2-51.flash.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Does anyone know of an Antique website where I can get the worth of a
Radiotron Designers Handbook. This is a 1952 fourth edition.
I saw a site listed some time back but didn't note the site address. The
book is worth some money as a antique but I don't remember how much.

Than you all
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.infinet.com!news
From: "Randy Beavers" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Stupid repeater tricks (dayton's 5.11)
Date: 22 Dec 1996 03:42:52 GMT
Organization: Computers To Cheap Ink.
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <01bbefba$0ddd8f00$51f267ce@p959>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cmh-p077.infinet.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155


          An open letter to the ruling body of the 145.110 repeater in
Dayton Oh.

         I want to the thank the small minded people that ruined the best
repeater
          in Ohio.

         I can't count how many times I've heard members tell nonmembers
thanks but
          no thanks when asked how and who to contact to become a member.
         Or how many time I've heard a member bad mouth a new guy for CB
like
           operation, then a lesson on  repeater conduct would have been
better.


         No one is perfect, but you threw the baby out with the wash water
!!

         In stead of learning something about packet,computers,storys about
          the good old days, and the best rigs.

         We now have dead air !

          The good members of  the 5.11 once was a reason to geat my
ticket,
          now it's just a lesson in US and THEM.

               Randy Beavers
           [e-mail]
                  Cols. OH.


    p.s.  I hope the round table net will be on tonight and the link up.
              and the "nonmembers"  check in !


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!super.zippo.com!zdc!szdc!szdc-e!news
From: [e-mail] (Ian Rivlin)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tektronix C12 oscilloscope camera for sale
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 03:45:41 GMT
Organization: Zip News
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <59ib9c$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Tektronix C12 Oscilloscope camera for sale - all complete. Mint
condition. Optics perfect - has Polaroid back (works perfectly).
Reasonable offers please




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!usenet.logical.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Gary Coughman SUPPORTS HAZING !!!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 03:49:53 GMT
Organization:
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fhd5$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup058.qnsbny1.capital.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33050 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44825 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121364

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

<snip>
>I think not.  I think people should be able to just pick up the phone, call o
ne
>of those guys with the big trucks with the giant drill bits, and let THEM com
e
>over and dig the hole for the tower.   Post hole diggers are keeping a lot of
>quality, qualified people out of ham radio, and it's time this hazing ritual
>come to an END !!!  I am going to write to the ARRL and WARC 99 and tell them
 I
>think it's about time to get rid of post hole diggers for ever !!!
>
>73, Jim KH2D

I enjoy Gary's posts. He writes in an intelligent and courtious
manner. His explanations have helped me tremendously. You ought to
take this crap back to that other "newsgroup". You know the one where
the no-codes and the know-codes spend all their time sticking verbal
knives into eachother.
--
73,
Butch N2YMJ


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news3.cac.psu.edu!news.math.psu.edu!feeder.chicago.cic.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 03:56:37 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <59ibcn$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan20.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Looks like you No-Coders Better start Studying if you want on HF

The WARC recommendation is to the ARRL as a possible
US osition.  There is the rest of the world that has a say in
this also...at least as it relates to the international
treaty.

Frankly, the only comment in the ARRL bulletin indicated
the committee report was based on the poll and not on
any compelling reasons to mandate CW knowledge.
I look forward to the actual WHY the position was
recommended.  If it s only the poll results, then that's pretty
poor reasoning.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsfeed.pitt.edu!dsinc!lebanet!alpha.comsource.net!news.cioe.com!206.230.113.244
From: Brad Herrold <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mods for IC-22A?
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 23:20:04 -0500
Organization: CIOE Corporation
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dns2.abcs.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Hello

I recently bought this little HT and wondered if anyone knew of any mods
for it (an IC-22a).  If you do, please email me.

Thanks

Brad Herrold, KB9OTF


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!ns2.sirinet.net!news
From: "Big Red" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 22 Dec 1996 04:33:17 GMT
Organization: Sirius Systems Group, Inc.
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <01bbefc1$87a6c200$115003cf@jim-beck>
References: <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <59i9cs$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp17.sirinet.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

HEY HEY READ OHMS LAW---LESS AMPS AT 220 THAN AT 110 TO OPERATE THE SAME
DEVICE...MATER OF FACT IT'S 1/2 IF YOU CHECK THAT'S WHY THE WIRE IS LESS
THE GAUGE....



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!130.168.70.138!news.eng.convex.com!news.greatbasin.net!dick
From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 20:54:34 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 14
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.libelle.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.6

In article <[e-mail]>,
Timothy Haller <[e-mail]> wrote:

>On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
>
>> I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the ARRL.
They need our
>> support, and we need theirs.
>>
>Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?

I guess the ARRL needs to pay me, too, because I agree 100% with Dave.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: "David Little" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need Schematic: Santec LS-202a
Date: 22 Dec 1996 05:14:50 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <01bbefc6$b91a6b20$36a4aec7@node2>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ad22-054.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44830 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22264 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121372



I have a Santec LS-202A  VHF SSB/FM HT that I am trying to find a schematic
for.
A service manual would be nice also, I would even settle for a owner's
manual.

The unit receives properly, transmits properly, tx audio is good, rx signal
is good,
rx audio is gone.......  You can see the receive signal on the s-meter, and
if you listen
very closely you can hear clear audio from the speaker, only very faint.  I
have bypassed
the speaker and replaced the audio IC, and now want to get some service
info to go
further.

Any help appreciated,  A current address for Santec or it's remains would
also be a big
help.  A copy of a manual and schematic would be a blessing.

Seasons greetings

David  KD4NUE



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: "David Little" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Need Schematic - R105/ARR-15 Military
Date: 22 Dec 1996 05:21:28 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <01bbefc7$a6960300$36a4aec7@node2>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ad22-054.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:1218 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44833 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22265 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121374 rec.radio.swap:100668



I  have a military HF receiver that covers 1.5 to 18.5 MC in 6 bands, with
an original
power input of 28.5 Volts DC.  It was modified by adding a power
transformer, bridge
circuits and filters for AC operation, and the power transformer decided
give up.  It
looked a bit small to do the job, and seems like it did a long, slow core
meltdown
before dying.  I would like to get the proper voltage and current
requirements so I
can try this my way.  Any help appreciated.

Thanks
Seasons Greetings

David KD4NUE



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.66.12.35!news-in.iadfw.net!newshost.cyberramp.net!not-for-mail
From: harold rosee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM Computer Control Software?
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 23:28:25 -0600
Organization: CyberRamp.net, Dallas, TX [phone]/[phone] for info
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dal-tsa6-p1-48.cyberramp.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44832 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121373

R.Moroney wrote:
>
> Does anyone have a recommendation for a good control program for ICOM
> rigs (specifically the '706 and '736)?  I'm mainly looking for a DOS
> program, but Windows 3.1 or 95 would be OK too, in a pinch.  Logging
> capabilities are a plus, but not a requirement.  Any suggestions?
>
> BOB K9CMR


Look on the ARRL FTP site. There is a new control program for the 706.
Nothing too fancy but it works.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!netaxs.com!sea.waterw.com!usenet
From: Ed & Brenda Cregger <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MFJ259 antenna analyzer
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 00:28:38 -0500
Organization: accsyst.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: access4.accsyst.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33054 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121375

I've owned my MFJ-259 about two months and love it, but...

Both battery holders have broken on the ends where the 9 volt battery
type connector attaches. I have yet to take advantage of MFJ's one year,
no matter what warranty on this item, so I am not saying anything bad
about MFJ. It's just that you should inspect yours for cracks and have
them replaced before they leave you high and dry AFTER you're up on the
roof or the tower.

Otherwise I love it. It's a great unit.

Ed Cregger, NM2K
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 05:32:34 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59jlen$[e-mail]>
References: <596d9c$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-122.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>simply ignore posts from known trouble makers.

>That's right.  And of course, anyone who dares to disagree with the
>typical HAM OPERATOR outlook on life (pro-code, anti-CB, etc.) is
>undoubetdly a 'known trouble maker', right?

Not necessarily.  But pinheads who sneak over from the good buddy
newsgroup to troll could be classified as know trouble makers.

Merry Christmas,
Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 05:38:01 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59jlov$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-122.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>>Looks like you No-Coders Better start Studying if you want on HF

>The WARC recommendation is to the ARRL as a possible
>US osition.  There is the rest of the world that has a say in
>this also...at least as it relates to the international
>treaty.

Praise Jesus !!! There is still hope !!!  Maybe Lenny and Squggie will
move over to the VK newsgroups now and start working on the international
aspect of the crusade ??

>Frankly, the only comment in the ARRL bulletin indicated
>the committee report was based on the poll and not on
>any compelling reasons to mandate CW knowledge.
>I look forward to the actual WHY the position was
>recommended.  If it s only the poll results, then that's pretty
>poor reasoning.

The wishes of the membership should be a 'compelling reason',
wouldn't you think Bill ?

Merry Christmas,
Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!198.69.204.8!news.fast.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.voicenet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Kingfish)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Blocking ham/cb interference on stereo equipment?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 05:46:33 GMT
Organization: Voicenet - Internet Access - [phone]
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59jrfq$[e-mail]>
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Hi Everyone,

A neighbor of mine has a ham or cb radio, and his transmissions come
out over my stereo, telephone, clock radio - anything with a speaker.
The FCC won't do anything about it.

I know there are filters you can put on your telephone to block some
of the interference.  Is there anything like that for stereo
equipment?

Thanks,

JOn



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:22 1997
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From: [e-mail] (D. Holford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: 22 Dec 1996 06:13:35 GMT
Organization: IGS - Information Gateway Services
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <59ijif$2s4$[e-mail]>
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>
>What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band?
>
>80M BAND
>
>CW    3.500-3.725
>RTTY  3.600-3.645
>SSB   3.725-4.000
>SSTV  3.840-3.850
>--
>Murray Cotnam (Sudbury,Ontario,Canada)
>
>AMATEUR RADIO CALLSIGN:       VE3MCN


Truly amazing. I really thought that Canadian Amateurs were required to know
the frequency allocations.
There are NO sub-bands allocated in Canada. Only MAXIMUM allowable bandwidths.
On 80 Metres (that is how we spell meters up here) the maximum bandwidth is 6
kHz for the entire range from 3500 to 4000 kHz. Translated this means you can
use any mode anywhere on the band provided the bandwidth does not exceed 6
kHz. Therefore CW, RTTY, SSB, SSTV and even AM are legal anywhere on the band.
There are suggested band plans some of which may be more or less related to
the list given by VE3MCN, but they are only suggestions - just like DX windows

which many Hams on both sides of the border seem to be completely ignorant of.
Restriction of modes to sub-bands is subject to gentlemen's agreements, and if

you get on HF much you must know there is a singular lack of gentlemen on the
air nowadays.

Dave Holford
VE3HLU



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:23 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 22 Dec 1996 07:01:09 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
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John Mackey--KA0SSF ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Bill Nelson wrote:

: > The problems on rec.radio.scanner disappeared when EITHER you or Bill Chee
k
: > disappeared.  Neither one of you alone appears to be a problem, but the tw
o
: > of you on the same forum is.

: Hmmm, I suppose I could accept that for that period of time.

: BUT, you notice there has not been a
: problem in rec.radio.scanner lately & we have BOTH been there.  Infact,
: I have even responded to posting of his.  :)

Yes, but how long is it going to last.  One of these days, and I expect it
to be fairly soon - one of you will take a jab at the other, and the whole
mess will start all over again. Or, someone else will make a comment, and
it will degenerate - just like this thread.

: > Personally, I don't care who started the mud slinging, or where. I just th
ink
: > that you are both asses to continue it every time you encounter a post mad
e
: > by the other party.

: Yea, I wonder why Dich Kendrick & Eric Oyen keep wanting to keep this
: situation stirred up.  You notice just within the last 24 hours Dick has
: posted FOUR responses from me to messages within this thread that were
: not directed or involveing him in any way?

No idea. However, there is no need for you to keep taking the bait. If you
had stated your disagreement with the original post - and then stated that
you were not going to discuss the matter further - I suspect that this thread
would have ended long ago.

: You have brought up an excelent point Bill.

Thank you.

Bill Nelson


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:24 1997
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From: Bill Beekman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.equiptment,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: RADIO SHACK MODS PRO 51]
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 02:01:14 -0500
Organization: Netcom
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> [e-mail] wrote:
> >
> > I am interested in getting a scanner thast has the best bang for the
> > buck.  A few people have recommended the RS Pro-51.  Presently it is
> > under $200.  I was wondering what other people think.  Is this a bargin.
> >  Are there any mods for this item.  Can you recomend another scanner our
> > source for scanners?  Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> >
> > Nick Yatko
> > [e-mail];
I have two buddies who both own the Pro51,  They both like it.  Only
problem is, RS changed the pro51 in mid production to include and
permanent cell block.  The earlier version only needed a keyed sequence
on the pad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:26 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.179.80.3!news.fyi.net!news
From: Bob Morris K2RK <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: ICOM Computer Control Software?
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: cooper11.fyi.net
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I should get a coR.Moroney wrote:
>
> Does anyone have a recommendation for a good control program for ICOM
> rigs (specifically the '706 and '736)?  I'm mainly looking for a DOS
> program, but Windows 3.1 or 95 would be OK too, in a pinch.  Logging
> capabilities are a plus, but not a requirement.  Any suggestions?
>
> BOB K9CMR

 Try Log-Eqf.... Logging, DXCC etc...Forget if the rig stuff
is in the shareware, but <$40. Ads in QST (EQF Software). Fills freq and
mode into log from Icom. Folows Icom tunning Memory pages... Freq and
mode to radio from keyboard. Packet cluster window. contest mode...auto
time/date logging.
Try the shareware to see if you like the log screen. ARRL Web and
others.
..Current V 8.07 is DOS and I run it in Win 3.1 as a "pif" window on the
shack-486/33 with 8 megs...Can do other stuff in Windows while
Log is in background. The memory pages are nice as the '735 only has
12 memories. They have a full line for freq, mode and a line of info.
Like the info space for what's in the memory - BBC etc.
 Arrow down to a memory line, hit enter and the radio takes off.

GL, Bob


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:27 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 01:08:37 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
>
> > Perhaps you should go back to doing other things?
> > Things like work, perhaps?
>
> I get PAID to sit at my computer all day & do things like
> this.
You do? Is that why you jumped around from one isp to another? How many
was it john? Eight? Nine? More???? I am still on the same ISP (in all
this time). That says a lot, john (and it isn't going to boost your
credibility any).
>
> > I am sure you have something more important to attend to
> > than this newsgroup, perhaps?
>
> One could say the same about yourself.
True, but I don't spend 8 hours a day on the computer. Unlike you, I
have a life.

>
>
> > You started this mess, now clean it up.
>
> You memory is very selective.  I did not start this.  Dick
> Kendrick started this by posting a spam about my march
> thru scannerdom.  Do you remember now?  That has already
> been established.  Then you jumped in wanting a piece of the
> action.
>
Selective? I was here when you posted that "nasty-gram" that started
this whole mess.Had you just made a small statement, not attacked anyone
and just stated it as an opinion, you might have gotten away with a
"reasonable response".  Alsp, you make accusations with no basis in
fact. What is anyone supposed to think of such arrogance?

> Just remember this saying, when you point the finger at
> someone, you have 3 fingers pointing back at you.
take your own advice, john.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:28 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Antique book website?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 01:11:53 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbefb7$aae4de00$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Bill Bierly wrote:
>
> Does anyone know of an Antique website where I can get the worth of a
> Radiotron Designers Handbook. This is a 1952 fourth edition.
> I saw a site listed some time back but didn't note the site address. The
> book is worth some money as a antique but I don't remember how much.
>
> Than you all
> [e-mail]
Now there is a publication I haven't seen in a long time! My dad had one
of those on his bookshelf. I can't even begin to tell you how much such
an item is worth, but it never hurts to ask around. Good luck.

Eric.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:30 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 01:15:52 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Dick Flanagan wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]>,
> Timothy Haller <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
> >
> >> I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the ARRL.
> They need our
> >> support, and we need theirs.
> >>
> >Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?
>
> I guess the ARRL needs to pay me, too, because I agree 100% with Dave.
> --
> Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada
I too also agree with dave. I have some reservations about the ARRL,
though. It is my impression that they don't listen much to the largest
growing population in amateur radio: the Technician no-coder.
Unfortunately, because of this lack of attention, the arrl suffers. If
they would pay a little more attention to our concerns, they would be a
much better organization for it.

Eric.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!38.8.16.2!psinntp!psinntp!atlas.jcpenney.com![e-mail]
From: "Philip D. Wolfe III" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 00:21:28 -0800
Organization: Wolfe and Assoc.
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Bill Nelson wrote:

> Yes, but how long is it going to last.  One of these days, and I expect it
> to be fairly soon - one of you will take a jab at the other, and the whole

If Eric and Richard would knock off their crap it would be fine.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:32 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Date: 22 Dec 1996 08:27:16 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <59ird4$[e-mail]>
References: <59bjng$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Doug Wittich ([e-mail]) wrote:
: And yet another event which TOTALLY excludes the Tech+ and Novice
: class licensees, based on "suggested" frequencies.   And then people
: bitch and moan that the new guys are not upgrading.

It does? What does "25 kHz above sub-band edge" mean to you?

Bill


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:33 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Date: 22 Dec 1996 09:47:50 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59j046$[e-mail]>
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]> <59e39j$[e-mail]>
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Jim Kehler ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Welcome to the wonderful world of R.F. Burns, Sam.  Only two solutions I
: can think of are a) reduce your power output on 80 meters or b) move the
: eighty meter antenna away from the shack a bit farther.  Sounds like the
: RF field in your shack is a bit strong.  Has your cat, by any chance, stoppe
d
: having kittens ?

: 73, Jim KH2D

How about using a coaxial line isolator, like Radio Works sells? Won't that
block the RF that is riding in on the outside of the coax shield?

Bill



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:34 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Cincinnati GMRS Repeaters
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:35:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 26


>>Is anyone aware of any GMRS repeaters in the Eastern Cincinnati area?
>>I would like to contact the owner about usage.

Contact Corwin Moore of the...

                    Personal Radio Steering Group, Inc.
                    PO Box 2851
                    Ann Arbor, MI  48106

PRSG office staff can also be reached at:

                   (313) MOBILE 3  (= 313 / 662-4533)

He's our National GMRS Guru!


======================================================================
ATTENTION to Details BBS    [phone]    Sysop: Clint Bradford
5085 Trail Canyon Drive                     Internet: [e-mail]
Mira Loma, CA  91752-1685                      Voice: [phone]

  MEMBER:   AOP, ESC, ASP, EFF, NCSA        JFK Assassination Research

 WWW Site:  http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/CBradford_ATDBBS
======================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:36 1997
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From: "Victor D. Mete" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: 22 Dec 1996 12:10:40 GMT
Organization: PMT
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.67.194
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1638 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44838 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121388 rec.radio.swap:100683

Hello everyone,

        My name is Vic and I am looking for some information. Being new to HF I
know very little ... about the whole scene. Looking at rigs however, I have
decided I'd like to buy either an Alinco DX-70T or an Icom IC-706.
        Does anyone have an actual comparison of the two rigs side by side so as
to comment on performance? How about features on HF & 6M between the two? I
know the DX-70T comes with CW & SSB narrow filters built in and they are an
option on the Icom, but how about actual performance between the two?
        I have seen MANY mods for the IC-706 but NONE for the DX-70T. Are there
mods available for the DX-70T?
         I have heard the 706 sounds lousy on HF with a stock mic. A friend said
he talked with a DX-70 owner and it sounded like the "big rigs"! Is this
true?
        How about this ... ya know the typical finger indent on the tuning knob?
Well, the 706 has it and I've tried it. Very comfortable, works well. The
DX-70 doesn't have it! How is it to tune??? I don't have anywhere to local
to try one. In fact in SE Florida here, don't know of a single person with
a DX-70. Don't see them for sale either!

Which is the better HF rig? Awaiting your comments (and tips to mods)!
--
Victor
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:37 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael Crestohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: 22 Dec 1996 07:13:41 -0500
Organization: Shore.Net; a service of Eco Software, Inc. ([e-mail])
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59j8ll$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
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Keywords: DX-70T  IC-706
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1639 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44840 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121390 rec.radio.swap:100685


I would seriously consider the ICOM IC-706.  I don't care for the Alinco
products.  A friend who repairs sand-state microprocessor-based radios for
a living won't touch Alinco radios.

Pay a bit more - but get what you pay for!



                                     .-.                                   /

    .-.                             /   \             .-.                 /
   /   \               .-.         /     \           /   \               /
  /     \             /   \       /       \         /     \             /
 /  73, Michael Crestohl, W1RC,  [e-mail]  Cambridge Vermont 05444-0024
          \         /       \   /           \     /         \         /
           \       /         `-'             \   /           \       /
            \     /                           `-'             \     /
             \   /                                             \   /
              `-'                                               `-'





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:38 1997
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From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 96 13:28:38 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.dircon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] "James Aeschliman" writes:

> But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current is
> less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
> the current that kills, not the voltage.

Then maybe electric chairs should use 9 volt batteries :-)

The fact that say a 220 volt 100 watt light bulb will pass less
current that a 110 volt 100 watt light bulb is not relevant to the
danger of shock, although it might well affect the risk of fire from
poor wiring.

In general it's a current through YOU that will kill you from
electrocution, and twice the mains voltage is likely to cause about
twice the current to flow through you.

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!queeg.apci.net!usenet
From: Bill N9HH <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 08:17:36 -0600
Organization: apci.net
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup074.apci.net
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To: "Victor D. Mete" <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1643 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44849 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121400 rec.radio.swap:100703

I have had a try at both, and I like the 706 better.  It is more
expensive and harder to operate, but it does more, too.  Although the
DX70 comes with a cw filter, it is not very effective.  The optional
filters in the ICOM are pretty good (I have the 250 Hz in mine) although
the rig does suffer some from "blowby", that is, signals leaking around
the narrow filter.  Neither rig has a very good noise blanker.  The
Alinco, I think, has the edge in strong signal handling capability,
although I am judging this by ear as opposed to having the rigs on the
bench.  Alinco's break-in is also better.  I like the fact that the ICOM
has two meters, even if it is only ten watts.  I already had a Mirage
B3016 in the car, so now can run about 100 watts output on 160 thru 2.

The mods were unimportant to me as I don't see much value in opening up
the transmitter for dc to light.

73,
Bill N9HH


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 22 Dec 1996 14:37:37 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <596d9c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>simply ignore posts from known trouble makers.

That's right.  And of course, anyone who dares to disagree with the
typical HAM OPERATOR outlook on life (pro-code, anti-CB, etc.) is
undoubetdly a 'known trouble maker', right?




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!151.99.250.2!server-b.cs.interbusiness.it!slip4.etrurianet.it!user
From: [e-mail] (Riccardo Gaggioli)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space,rec.radio.amateur.dx
Subject: Re: Want Kenwood IF-10D Computer Interface.
Date: 22 Dec 1996 15:13:36 GMT
Organization: Centro Servizi Interbusiness
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <56l7cr$[e-mail]> <56na4m$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip4.etrurianet.it
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:100694 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33061 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20812 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44842 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22276 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121395 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44527 rec.radio.amateur.space:9192 rec.radio.amateur.dx:1641


Hello mike,I own a kenwood ts 50,and I would like if there is a 'home
made' version of IF-10D ,usable with our rtx:any help?
73,cu on 40 & 80 fm IK5WQO Riccardo


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: ko4qc <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:55:27 -0500
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Rick wrote:
>
> "David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >I have recently come to own a previously used antenna tower.  After months
> >of hard work, I managed to finally get it out of the ground.  That was the
> >hard part.  But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas how I can dig
> >a hole in the ground that is about 2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
> >I tried a post hole digger, but the bits are only about 4 ft deep?   Any
> >suggestions?
> >
> >Thank you in advance.
> >David P. Hummel, Jr.
> >KG2BX
> >
> Dave,myself I used a back-hoe.Really the only you could do it the easy
> way....gud luck......73 de AA4UF  Rick        [e-mail]
   Took you months to get it out of the ground?Sounds like an excellent
installation job!!
               Seasons Greetings to ALL!!
                    Ko4qC


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:44 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Gary Coughman SUPPORTS HAZING !!!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 16:00:12 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <59kq7j$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fhd5$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-133.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

><snip>
>>I think not.  I think people should be able to just pick up the phone, call
one
>>of those guys with the big trucks with the giant drill bits, and let THEM co
me
>>over and dig the hole for the tower.   Post hole diggers are keeping a lot o
f
>>quality, qualified people out of ham radio, and it's time this hazing ritual
>>come to an END !!!  I am going to write to the ARRL and WARC 99 and tell the
m I
>>think it's about time to get rid of post hole diggers for ever !!!
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D

>I enjoy Gary's posts.

Me too. I just can't stay awake thru most of them.

> He writes in an intelligent and courtious manner.

OK. If you say so.

> His explanations have helped me tremendously.

That's good. Then you probably have the most efficient tower grounding system
in

North America.  I prefer to throw the coax out the window......

>You ought to take this crap back to that other "newsgroup". You know the one
where
>the no-codes and the know-codes spend all their time sticking verbal
>knives into eachother.

Well, if you care to check it, I thought I knocked about six or eight newsgrou
ps

off the list when I replied to the original posting.  Which I will do again th
is
time for the benefit of someones disk space.  Which other 'newsgroup' would yo
u
like it posted in ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!malgudi.oar.net!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 22 Dec 1996 16:41:42 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <59joc6$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121431 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44534 rec.radio.shortwave:90937


>I agree with you in principle ... those people who have no interest in
>*radio* technology (the "art" in "radio art", NOT CW, which is simply
>telegraphy, which has existed for far longer than radio) don't deserve
>to be hams ... even if they can copy 20+wpm of Morse code.

That's about the most elitist statement I've ever heard. What you're saying is

that people who simply want to be hams because they think it would be an
enjoyable hobby or pastime don't deserve to be hams.

>However, having a Morse code test has NOTHING to do with the radio art
>.. read the ITU definition of ham radio ... it's a service devoted to
>private tecnical investigations ... NOT a "gaming place for people who
>want to yack, beep, and 'chase DX'" ...  those things are permissable,
>but they are NOT the "reason for being" of ham radio.

Maybe so, but it it's no reason to keep a person from becoming a ham simply
because they don't fit *your* criteria of what a ham should be.

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 16:50:48 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <59jh7t$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59imbl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Philip D. Wolfe III" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Bill Nelson wrote:

>> Yes, but how long is it going to last.  One of these days, and I expect it
>> to be fairly soon - one of you will take a jab at the other, and the whole

>If Eric and Richard would knock off their crap it would be fine.


It is amazing, how all the posts that come out in support of John, or
any of his ideas, are from people never seen before,  and they never
list their callsign............

Ghost writers?????

KD4RME




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:48 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]> <59e39j$[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 16:51:33 GMT
Lines: 52

In article <59e39j$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>[e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo) wrote:
>>I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
>>keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
>>a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
>>antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
>>checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
>>fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
>>solve this problem.
>
>Welcome to the wonderful world of R.F. Burns, Sam.  Only two solutions I
>can think of are a) reduce your power output on 80 meters or b) move the
>eighty meter antenna away from the shack a bit farther.  Sounds like the
>RF field in your shack is a bit strong.  Has your cat, by any chance, stopped
>having kittens ?

This could be a near field induction effect as Jim suggests, if the
antenna is very near and you're running a bunch of power. Much more
likely, however, is that this is caused by lack of antenna balance.
Unless you are feeding an end fed longwire directly from the shack,
"ground" shouldn't enter into this at all. (Amateurs tend to imbue
"ground" with almost mystical qualities. It has none. Ground is just
the point we choose arbitrarily to be our zero potential reference.
Earth is something else entirely. It is a large sheet conductance
which may have varying potentials at various points.)

If you are using a properly symmetric dipole with the feeder routed
at right angles to it, and you're feeding it with proper balance
(either with balanced feeders or using a choke balun at the antenna
feedpoint), you shouldn't have hot shack problems. If you aren't doing
one or more of these things, however, you can have a hot shack as the
feeder becomes part of the radiating structure of the antenna and your
rig becomes an end point, IE high RF voltage point, of the antenna system.
The fix is simple, insure that the antenna system, including feeders,
is symmetric and electrically balanced. This will leave the rig with
a net zero RF potential, IE it will have *become* RF "ground" for the
system whether it is attached to Earth or not.

A quick fix which will sometimes mitigate hot shack problems is to
change the length of the feedline. If the rig is currently at a
standing voltage node, changing feeder length will shift it toward
a current node instead, and potentials on the rig and associated
equipment will decrease. But the better fix is to solve the balance
problem which is causing the feeder to become part of the antenna
in the first place.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.96.36.2!wizard.pn.com!news.xensei.com!news.miracle.net!wariat.org!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 22 Dec 1996 16:53:32 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59jp2c$[e-mail]>
References: <596d9c$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn03.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>>simply ignore posts from known trouble makers.
>
>That's right.  And of course, anyone who dares to disagree with the
>typical HAM OPERATOR outlook on life (pro-code, anti-CB, etc.) is
>undoubetdly a 'known trouble maker', right?


It's one thing to disagree with someone. Trolling is a different matter
altogether. The best thing to do is to ignore it.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Date: 22 Dec 1996 12:12:38 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <59jq66$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58t803$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59dckr$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59dckr$[e-mail]>, Paul KeinΣnen <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I would not recommend building a CW transmitter as the first project
>for a new ham interested in homebrewing. There are a lot of useful
>simple power supply, audio and simple digital projects to start with.

These are nice, but they don't get you on the air. I don't think that
you and Jeff are in disagreement, merely that Jeff believes a CW
box is easier to build as your first device to get on the air. You're
probably not going to build a 10 meter FM box as your first project.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.indigo.ie!usenet
From: [e-mail] (MURPHY ELECTRONICS)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAM TOOL-KIT Cd Rom HERE!!!!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 17:16:19 GMT
Organization: Indigo
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts17-01.dublin.indigo.ie
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.339

Check it out..its AWESOME!!!

http://sphynx.com/murphy
Plastic Accepted.

           M U R P H Y     E L E C T R O N I C S
GSM Mobile Phones & Accessories. Satellite TV and Decoding Systems
     CD Rom Multimedia    Computer Accessories
http://sphynx.com/murphy          Email: [e-mail]

             Tel: [phone]  (SMS WELCOMED)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:52 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 17:30:52 GMT
Lines: 20

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>>> to link enough repeaters together to attempt a coast to coast Qso on 2
>>>meters? I don't know If such a thing would even be permissable under Fcc
>
>The real challenge would be coast-to-coast WITHOUT repeaters on 2M.

Watch the trimming, I didn't write the text attributed to me above.
But to answer the point, it has been done, many times. There are a
fairly large number of stations holding 2m WAS. That's not very useful
I admit, a linked repeater system would be marginally more useful. A
national switched data system would be much more useful.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:53 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 17:41:10 GMT
Lines: 38

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (James Aeschliman) writes:
>In a previous article, [e-mail] (Dave Martindale) says:
>>[e-mail] (Doug Smith) writes:
>>>220V is a little more dangerous; it's a little more likely to cause
>>>injury or death if you're shocked, and a little more likely to cause a
>>>fire if something else happens.  The difference is minimal.
>>
>>I've heard it argued that 220-240 V at 50 Hz is no more, and perhaps less,
>>dangerous to humans than 120 V 60 Hz.  Apparently 60 Hz is a bad choice
>>of frequency because it easily causes fibrillation in the heart muscle,
>>while 50 Hz is less likely to.  So even though your body draws twice
>>the current at 240 V than 120 V, it's less likely to kill you.  But this
>>was someone from Britain arguing this.  Does anyone know for sure?
>>
>I've heard this too, but I read it in an article.  It's probably correct.
>But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current is
>less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
>the current that kills, not the voltage.
>--
>Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
>Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK

Arrrgh! Doesn't *anyone* understand Ohm's Law anymore?

I = E/R

If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
what happens to I?

What happens is that "I" get fried twice as extra crispy.
Sheesh!

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!208.6.192.243!news.magicnet.net!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:42:45 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59imbl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts12-24.goodnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)

Philip D. Wolfe III wrote:
>
> Bill Nelson wrote:
>
> > Yes, but how long is it going to last.  One of these days, and I expect it
> > to be fairly soon - one of you will take a jab at the other, and the whole
>
> If Eric and Richard would knock off their crap it would be fine.
US?!?!?!?! If John wouldn't create these problems, he wouldn't be
creating this mess. Why are you playing the "blame game"?

Besides, you don't know what Mr. Mackey did to the rec.radio.scanner
group for over 8 months! What me and Richard do are mild by comparison.
Also, if you bother to check, I have posted some useful information in
here since Mr. Mackey amde his ugly comments.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:55 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:00:45 GMT
Lines: 46

In article <[e-mail]> Sieg
fried Rambaum <[e-mail]> writes:
>On Wed, 18 Dec 1996 [e-mail] wrote:
>
>> The advantage of 220 is that with less current flow there is less loss for
>> the same distance travelled down the wires. The advantage of 110 is that if
>> you come across it you can survive, 220 is more likely to zang you.
>
>*WRONG* ... You forgot to figure in the muscular reaction to electrictiy.
>With voltages above 80 Volts (some literature says, the threshold was 100
>Volts), a kind of jerk back reaction (muscle contraction) results from the
>touch. At 220 the jerk back reaction is much more pronounced and comes
>swifter than at 110. It thus is safer to come into contact with 220 Volts
>than with 110 Volts. Actually, with some people 110 Volts do not trigger
>any reaction. But 220 will never fail in doing so.

Don't bet your life that the muscle contraction will save you. The
muscles controlling the hand can contract so hard you can't let go.
It depends on the current path through the body whether you'll clamp
down or jerk clear. I got hold of an old RCA WP-33 (285 volts *stiffly*
regulated) and couldn't let go. The only way I got free was to bash the
6080 with my free hand (you know, the one you're supposed to keep in
your pocket when you prepare to shake hands with Reddy Kilovolt).

>The body is just another power consumer. Voltage is one thing, the body
>resistance another, but veeeeeeery important is the time of exposure. A
>few millisecond at 220 Volts are less harmful than three seconds at 110.
>Time of exposure is a pivotal factor in all that, too.

It is if thermal damage is the major concern. It often isn't. It only
takes a few milliseconds of current to put the heart into fibrilation.
And it doesn't take much. 30 mA through the chest will do it. This is
where 240 can be a "lifesaver". The current is often much higher than
30 mA and the heart muscle clamps down very hard, stopping the heart
entirely. Often, the heart will restart on its own when the current
flow is removed. It will rarely come out of fibrilation on its own.

BTW that's what a defibrilator does, it delivers a pulse of current
to the heart strong enough to stop it entirely, allowing it to come
out of fibrilation.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Merry xmas
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:06:23 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nyc-ny8-01.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E-NC250  (Win16; U)

Just a note to wish EVERYONE here a happy holiday season, and to ask some
advice. Is the Kenwood Th-50t dual bander ht any good? I was thinking of
getting one for xmas. Right now, my ENTIRE shack consists of a four year
old Htx-202, a Pro-2030, and a Dx-390. Needless to say, I'm quite limited
financally at the moment, so I really need the biggest bang for my bucks.
 I also have an extremely limited amount of space in my flat in
Manhattan, so all I can afford for my shack are ht's. Any and all advice
Ican get on a HT only shack would be greatly welcome and appreciated.
                           Dave/KB2ZYO
                             Oh no...you did NOT fire that green @#%!at
me...


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.lightlink.com!light.lightlink.com!siram
From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 13:07:09 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hbgt$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: derek hutter <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <59hbgt$[e-mail]>

> Actually it would be pretty hard to get into 240v as we are talking about
> 2 120v circuts out of phase to make 240v (not that it couldnt be done).

That exactely is what comes in from the transformers on the street poles
into american houses. Thre street transformer is transforming down to 240,
and from both ends of the secondary two wires comes, with the neutral
wire, which is just the center tap of the secondary. So where is the
problem???



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:05:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.lightlink.com!light.lightlink.com!siram
From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 13:08:38 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

> If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
> Samantha Fisher

A wise word from your daughter, Burt. What makes you ignore her wisdom?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.misty.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: 35% of the curriculum?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:09:39 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]> <58sbd8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59c1b5$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs38.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121402 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44528

James W. KELLEY wrote:

> >How is that the back of the bus? A tech has privs on almost all of the spec
trum...
> >clearly HF access is just a drop in the bucket in terms of spectrum access.
 If
> >anything, HF ops are in the back of the bus.
>
> Then you would of course be willing to trade seats?  From the above, one
> might conclude that we should open up the entire amateur spectrum below 30
> MHz for Novice and above, but only Extra Class operators would be allowed
> to use the spectrum above 420 MHz!  Something is askew in this picture
> Dave.  Obviously the value in amateur radio communications does not simply
> scale linearly with bandwidth.
>
> Jim AC6XG

Obviously not... That wasn't what I was trying to say. I guess I feel
that things are OK like they are, but that is just my opinion.

Happy Holidays!

--
73 de Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
Youngsville, NC
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!128.250.1.21!munnari.OZ.AU!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 22 Dec 96 18:14:21 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Re: Tim Haller's anti-ARRL remarks.

Tim, please take the time to read FIFTY YEARS OF ARRL (written in 1965, but
now on its 3rd printing; $4), and 200 METERS & DOWN ($5), for gaining an
important perspective on what the ARRL has done for amateur radio the last
80 years. Simply put, without the ARRL fighting on behalf of ham radio all
these decades, our hobby/service wouldn't exist today as we know it.

Newsgroup New Year's resolution: Before forming an opinion on a particular
topic let's first take the time to do a thorough research on that subject,
and cite references so as to back up our assertions in a convincing manner.

73 from snowy Nevada (and missing Hawaii *very* much),
Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (DONHAR777)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham Transceiver or SW Comm Receiver which has a better receiver
Date: 22 Dec 1996 18:14:57 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

I am interested in getting into Shortwave listing and maybe ham radio.  I
will be purchasing a radio in the next few days.  I have a question can
someone tell me what would have a better receiver, a Ham transceiver such
as a Kenwood TS 850S or a TS 450S verses pure Communications receivers
made by Kenwood or Sony or Grundig etc.

Primarily I would like to listen to the Ham Bands and then Shortwave
radio.  I have no intention to transmit until I get my license probably in
6-12 months.  So can someone help me out and let me know which would have
a better RECEIVER.

Thanks, in advance.

Donald



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.misty.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:16:34 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs38.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

Robert Lyons wrote:
>
> A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
> novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
> general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.
>
>   So - I got my tech+ 4 weeks ago, just upgraded to Advanced, and
> figured I'd go for Extra fairly soon (passed the written already).
> Unfortunately, I have no HF rig and have never conducted a CW
> QSO. I'd sure like to, though. While I can *receive* code fast
> enough to pass the 13 wpm test, I'm sure that, when I first touch
> a key, I'll be totally "ham-fisted". Does this mean I'll be
> ignored by the upper ranks simply because I advanced before I'd
> worked code?

HI Bob. I missed that post, but remember... Ham Radio is nothing like
what you see here on the net. I don't see all the things I hear about on
here, and I'm on HF CW a lot. It's a nice bunch of people, and you'll
find nearly all of them friendly and glad to accomodate your speed. I
know lots of hams, self included, that hang out in the nov/tech segments
and work the new folks.

Get a rig and get on the air!

--
73 de Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
Youngsville, NC
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 13:19:37 -0500
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-200.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

Bill Sohl wrote:
> Frankly, the only comment in the ARRL bulletin indicated
> the committee report was based on the poll and not on
> any compelling reasons to mandate CW knowledge.
> I look forward to the actual WHY the position was
> recommended.  If it s only the poll results, then that's pretty
> poor reasoning.

Particularly since the poll was a classic example of poor polling
technique.  Self-selected polls, where the respondents are those
who decide to respond, are recognized by statisticians as being
one of the most invalid ways to poll.

We hams are fighting over the deck chair arrangements on the Titanic.
Our numbers are not large, our hobby is not growing, and our
average age, at least on HF, must be somewhere in the 50s or 60s.
Christ, you can't hardly have a QSO on HF with someone who isn't
a retiree.  And in our democracy here in America, lack of numbers
translates directly into a lack of political clout.  Small wonder
why the FCC doesn't even bother enforcing the rules against
wrongdoers on the air.  They don't care about us.

Dumping Morse Code and recruiting new hams is the only way we will
keep our hobby.
--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.misty.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:19:42 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: customs229.ipass.net
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

Robert Lyons wrote:
>
> A recent poster mentioned that he's willing to accommodate
> novices or tech+ operators at slow code rates, but a "ham-fisted
> general" (I think were his words) would be ignored.
>
>   So - I got my tech+ 4 weeks ago, just upgraded to Advanced, and
> figured I'd go for Extra fairly soon (passed the written already).
> Unfortunately, I have no HF rig and have never conducted a CW
> QSO. I'd sure like to, though. While I can *receive* code fast
> enough to pass the 13 wpm test, I'm sure that, when I first touch
> a key, I'll be totally "ham-fisted". Does this mean I'll be
> ignored by the upper ranks simply because I advanced before I'd
> worked code?

HI Bob. I missed that post, but remember... Ham Radio is nothing like
what you see here on the net. I don't see all the things I hear about on
here, and I'm on HF CW a lot. It's a nice bunch of people, and you'll
find nearly all of them friendly and glad to accomodate your speed. I
know lots of hams, self included, that adjust our speeds and work the
new folks.

Get a rig and get on the air!

--
73 de Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
Youngsville, NC
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.misty.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 10:32:52 -0800
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs229.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

Timothy Haller wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
>
> > I've read and followed Dave Sumner's work for several years. I think he's
a fair and
> > hard working guy, just like the rest of the ARRL staff I've been in contac
t with. I
> > think that the negative comments I've read on this newsgroup have been ill
 founded and
> > in bad taste.
> >
> > I think the ARRL serves the Amateur community well, and better than any "g
rass-roots"
<snip>

> Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?
> Timothy Haller

What's the matter, can't someone be happy with something here on the
newsgroup? I've been an ARRL member for years, and support them on most
of their views. Hey, nothing wrong with being happy, is there?


--
73 de Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
Youngsville, NC
[e-mail]
WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM

http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!freenet4.afn.org!afn53940
From: Timothy Haller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 13:35:49 -0500
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

On Sun, 22 Dec 1996, Eric Oyen wrote:
> > Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada
> I too also agree with dave. I have some reservations about the ARRL,
> though. It is my impression that they don't listen much to the largest
> growing population in amateur radio: the Technician no-coder.
> Unfortunately, because of this lack of attention, the arrl suffers. If
> they would pay a little more attention to our concerns, they would be a
> much better organization for it.
>
> Eric.
>
>I I agree with len winkler WOG no more code.













Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
He pushes his his
fists and still in-
sists he sees the
ghosts.
 from stephen king`s
book It



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 22 Dec 1996 12:38:03 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <59k2mr$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.126 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>BUT, you notice there has not been a
>problem in rec.radio.scanner lately & we have BOTH been there.  Infact,
>I have even responded to posting of his.  :)

The post you responded to was about the CE232 interface. Your entire
reply said "Hi Bill :-)". The lack of nonsense in the scanner groups is
directly attributed to your absence.

>Yea, I wonder why Dich Kendrick & Eric Oyen keep wanting to keep this
>situation stirred up.  You notice just within the last 24 hours Dick has
>posted FOUR responses from me to messages within this thread that were
>not directed or involveing him in any way?

Todays group of postings in this thread contain sixteen messages. Seven of
them are from you Johnnie boy. Your selective memory is enabled again.
We had this conversation previously in a thread entitled "Mackey's Verbosity."
The quantity of your bombast is inverserly proportional to its substance.



Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:12 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 22 Dec 1996 12:49:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <59k3be$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF. <59hlmn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.126 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>> : Dicky-Boy CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI)        |
>> : Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
>> : QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.

>Notice that Dicky-boy's sig file says that there is a fault in
>reality.  Maybe that is his trouble & why he makes up all these
>stories.  Maybe HE is the one on Ritalin & Lithium?  This would
>explain his problem with reality!

Everything you've written suggests your perceptions of reality
are infantile and the product of unselective inbreeding. Fortunately,
the genetic line of miscreants like you will eventually succumb
to entropy and die off.

>Reed is 100% correct, Dicky-boy started this with his little story
>he posted.

Gee, at first you liked it. You even generously sent me a present of an
eight megabyte email bomb as a thank you not. (Email ordnance
disposal is _so _ easy these days.) Then you told me how much you
liked it again. And, now you don't. Mood swings from bad drugs again?

> Before that, everything was fine.

That was before the world gave you a reality check. The ones you're
writting to others keep bouncing. Must be that humanity deficiency
acting up again.

> Then Eric jumped in to help.  Perhaps they are a team?
>Or maybe - they are the same person?

You told us in the scanner groups how good you were with computers
and software. Let's see you prove we are one in the same.

Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 22 Dec 1996 12:54:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <59k3kq$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fhem$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.126 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Dicky-boy Kendrick wrote:

>> John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:
>> >How would you know, YOU don't have fancy pieces of paper!
>
>> Neither do you.

>Bullshit.  You know from previous discussions with me that
>I do.

Gee, you actually admit we had this discussion before. However,
you made claims that you never substantiated. Your lips are moving
Johhnie boy, but nothing but lies keep falling out.

>Infact, I have more higher class "fancy pieces of paper" than you.

Must be that new color printer you bought with your allowance.
Print Shop does have a few "fancy pieces" of bogus certificates.


Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 20:01:22 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <59jsd6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> writes:
>>
>>>> to link enough repeaters together to attempt a coast to coast Qso on 2
>>>>meters? I don't know If such a thing would even be permissable under Fcc
>>
>>The real challenge would be coast-to-coast WITHOUT repeaters on 2M.

>Watch the trimming, I didn't write the text attributed to me above.
>But to answer the point, it has been done, many times. There are a
>fairly large number of stations holding 2m WAS. That's not very useful
>I admit, a linked repeater system would be marginally more useful. A
>national switched data system would be much more useful.

A while back, some guy in Las Vegas posted this bright idea on
packet, but he wanted to link a solid line of 2 meter, and 440
repeaters, across the country.  He envisioned a nationwide net on
this thing, claiming that he could do it on existing repeaters, with
no backbone.

His thought was that he could link a 2 meter machine in one area, to a
440 machine in another, using a mobile at each site.

Said he could do it easily in 16 hops.

Scary.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 22 Dec 1996 13:03:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <59k45m$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.126 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

[ stuff from Eric Oyen snipped ]

>You memory is very selective.  I did not start this.  Dick
>Kendrick started this by posting a spam about my march
>thru scannerdom.

Posting to a single message to two news groups on October
31 and a repeat posting to a single newsgroup forty odd days
later hardly constitutes a spam. I guess your perception of
time is distorted because you're still taking outdated and
defective drugs.

It wasn't a march. It started as a whimper and ended with your
cowardly derriere slinking away when you realised the denizens
of the scanner groups were a whole lot more intelligent than you
gave them credit for possessing. That's why they reacted negatively
to your childish oratorical onanism. Now, your peeved because the
people in this corner of the sand box won't let you get away with it
here either.

>Do you remember now?

Eric remembers very well, as he has continuously reminded you.
More of your selective memory.



Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.voicenet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Roger Stevens)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: 22 Dec 1996 20:13:33 GMT
Organization: Stevens Associates
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <59k4pd$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net> <59j8ll$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: consh57-pri.voicenet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
Keywords: DX-70T  IC-706
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (x86 32bit)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1649 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44858 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121421 rec.radio.swap:100728

Ah, I get to disagree with you, here, Michael.

Can't speak to the HF rig, but I've had pretty good luck with the two VHF/UHF
Alinco rigs I've owned over the last 3-4 years.  The DR-1200 I have has been i
n
continuous tcpip packet operation, 24-hours a day for almost 4 years, through
thunderstorms and such, with only dial backlight failure (a common problem wit
h
the 1200. I will admit), which I just fixed with $1.49 worth of bulbs (2) from

Radio Shack.  And their DR-570T dual-bander has been in my 1988 Acura Integra
for almost as long, with nary a problem.  I had to open both rigs to either
expand reception , or fix the dial backlights (or both), and they are neither
better nor worse than anything else I've seen.  Their tech support seems
reponsive enough, and from what I've read up on the newsgroups, their HF mobil
e
has gotten rave reviews (except for its noise blanker--oh well).  It is a LOT
less expensive than the ICOM, I might add, and there are deals out there on th
e
early version that are pretty tasty.

I'd like to hear specifics from your Alinco-unfriendly service buddy before I'
d
shun their equipment.

Do you ever get on 75 meters?

Happy Holidays.

73, Roger WA3FLE
Norristown, PA

In article <59j8ll$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>
>I would seriously consider the ICOM IC-706.  I don't care for the Alinco
>products.  A friend who repairs sand-state microprocessor-based radios for
>a living won't touch Alinco radios.
>
>Pay a bit more - but get what you pay for!
>
>
>
>                                     .-.                                   /


>    .-.                             /   \             .-.                 /
>   /   \               .-.         /     \           /   \               /
>  /     \             /   \       /       \         /     \             /
> /  73, Michael Crestohl, W1RC,  [e-mail]  Cambridge Vermont 05444-0024
>          \         /       \   /           \     /         \         /
>           \       /         `-'             \   /           \       /
>            \     /                           `-'             \     /
>             \   /                                             \   /
>              `-'                                               `-'
>
>
>

--
-----------------------------------------------------
Roger W. Stevens ([e-mail])
amprnet: [e-mail] [44.80.12.33]
ax25: WA3FLE@WB3JOE.#EPA.PA.USA.NA
"Be a Hero--Be a Donor!"--Mickey Mantle
Visit my homepage at http://www.voicenet.com/~rstevens
-----------------------------------------------------



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 20:38:02 GMT
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 25
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59k5n2$lnh$[e-mail]>
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp15.respool1.medina.ohio.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo) wrote:

>I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
>keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
>a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
>antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
>checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
>fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
>solve this problem.

>I don't know how long this problem has existed, I just noticed it
>today.

>Thanks
>Sam KC8BQP

Well I found the problem. Half my dipole was down and draped over the
back part of the house and resting against the aluminum gutters. I
spent an hour yesterday pounding two 8 foot grounding rods into the
ground trying to solve the problem but not in vain -  I needed a
better ground for the shack anyway. Thanks to all that responded.

73 de KC8BQP - Sam - back on the air!




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Transceiver or SW Comm Receiver which has a better receiver
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 21:02:16 GMT
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 33
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59k74h$m3f$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp15.respool1.medina.ohio.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (DONHAR777) wrote:

>I am interested in getting into Shortwave listing and maybe ham radio.  I
>will be purchasing a radio in the next few days.  I have a question can
>someone tell me what would have a better receiver, a Ham transceiver such
>as a Kenwood TS 850S or a TS 450S verses pure Communications receivers
>made by Kenwood or Sony or Grundig etc.

>Primarily I would like to listen to the Ham Bands and then Shortwave
>radio.  I have no intention to transmit until I get my license probably in
>6-12 months.  So can someone help me out and let me know which would have
>a better RECEIVER.

>Thanks, in advance.

>Donald

My JRC NRD-525 receiver runs circles around my Yeasu FT-840 tranceiver
when it comes to listening to the AM Shortwave Broadcast bands but the
Yaesu outperforms the JRC when it comes to monitoring CW and SSB ham
transmissions. I purchased my receiver long before I had any
intentions of getting into ham radio but I think if I were going to
spend alot of money on a radio and was certain that I was going to get
involved with ham radio, I would buy a transceiver with general
coverage receive capability (almost all modern transceivers are
general coverage on the receive) and a wide AM filter installed. Of
course, you're talking more money for the transceiver than the
receiver.

Hope you find what you want. SWL and ham radio are great hobbies.

73 de KC8BQP - Sam



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news2.digex.net!news6.digex.net!news.gteais.com!news
From: aor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 16:26:12 -0500
Organization: gteais-org
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh>
NNTP-Posting-Host: r1p2.gteais.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
To: "David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33086 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44865 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121430

I contracted with a "tree planter" (look in the Yellow Pages)  who
advertised digging holes with a Bobcat.  I asked the largest auger they
had, which was 36" !!!!  $100 bucks later I had a perfect hole 36"
across and 6-1/2 feet deep.  My tower is a TriEx crankup to 51', and has
been up 4 years now.

73, and good luck.

AL, NW2M


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!news.lightlink.com!light.lightlink.com!siram
From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 16:26:16 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: Gary Coffman <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

> Arrrgh! Doesn't *anyone* understand Ohm's Law anymore?
>
> I = E/R
>
> If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
> what happens to I?

It doubles, but the damage actually is done by the time you are subjected
to the higher current. At 220 Volts, your arm's and hand's muscles
instanteously contract, resulting in a jerk-back move .... a few
millisendonds. At 110 Volts you might get less current, but as the
jerk-back is less pronounced, you are subjected to a longer time, and in
effect have to dissipate more power.

> What happens is that "I" get fried twice as extra crispy.

Nonsense, see your remark about Ohm's law. If your conclusion about E
and R would hold true, you would get fried each warm, dry summer day
when combing your hair ... the E of the static you generate is in the
tens of kilovolts region... Currents, that can be fatal, if sustained
over a finite time, need not be so if sustained only for a tiny fraction
of the fatal exposure time.

But with respect to ...

> Gary Coffman KE4ZV
> Destructive Testing Systems

... telling you this is like carrying wood into the forest.

In destructive testing, you should encountered the effect of time on
overloading a system... Neither 110V nor 220V are harmless, but when
factoring in the jerkback reflex, 220 Volts is less harmful. If it were
different, I would not be around anymore to tell.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:24 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Mark Taylor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 16:27:50 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59jsd6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spg-as59s16.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I)

Can you imagine how crappy the audio would be after going through that
many radios?
I doubt it would be understandable, by any stretch of the imagination.
--
We laugh at honor, and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.
C.S. Lewis

They that can give up an essential liberty to purchase a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.   Ben Franklin




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:25 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!rhelton
From: [e-mail] (Richard Helton)
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59jsd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 21:54:40 GMT
Lines: 25
Sender: [e-mail]

Mark Taylor ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Can you imagine how crappy the audio would be after going through that
: many radios?
: I doubt it would be understandable, by any stretch of the imagination.
: --
: We laugh at honor, and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.
: C.S. Lewis

: They that can give up an essential liberty to purchase a little temporary
: safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.   Ben Franklin

I am currently working on a proposal to present to my club, the North
Hills Radio Club, here in Sacramento Ca.  Recently QST provided an article
on a internet to repeater link.  I am hoping to get the club involved with
experimenting with this idea.  Hopefully we can sked with distant clubs
or groups to link the repeaters over the internet.  This would allow
distant mobile units or base units to communicate across distance and or
bands.  I think it'll be a kick.  I also think the club will be interested
shortly in hearing from interested partys.  If your inclined, I'll follow
up here.

Richard KF6ATJ

--
                                             [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!butch!wargrave!lweissma
From: [e-mail] (Larry AD3Y)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 22 Dec 1996 22:23:29 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 39
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59kcd1$[e-mail]>
References: <59hrqu$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wargrave.motown.lmco.com


>Carl - wa6vse, [e-mail] wrote

>However, having a Morse code test has NOTHING to do with the radio art
>.. read the ITU definition of ham radio ... it's a service devoted to
>private tecnical investigations ... NOT a "gaming place for people who
>want to yack, beep, and 'chase DX'" ...  those things are permissable,
>but they are NOT the "reason for being" of ham radio.

   Carl, do you think that everyone who has conversations, uses morse code,
and chases DX has no business in this hobby? Many amateurs are not as narrowly

focused on the "radio art" as you. It is an important part of amateur radio,
but not the only reason to be involved in the hobby. People have hobbies
because they enjoy them. I enjoy CW, DXing, Contests, AND experimentation.
Because I enjoy other aspects of amateur radio, does that mean I am NOT
a real ham? Should I not use my radio equipment unless I am performing
some sort of technical investigation? I think not! I happen to be an EE
and I KNOW how my radio works, and I will use it for any of the previously
mentioned activities as I choose. If these activities are so wrong, the FCC
would have stopped people from doing them a long time ago (when they actually
had some authority).
   I support the no-code technician license, and I support the code test for
HF, although I feel 5wpm is enough for a general class license. Don't get me
wrong, I think advancing the state of the art of amateur radio is necessary.
I've worked with spread spectrum, and with high speed digital modems and
beleive that's where the future lies. But, instead of bashing everyone who
does not agree with you, why don't you start introducing some of your ideas
and techniques to the people on USENET, instead of telling everybody who
does not operate in a manner you deem unsuitable that they do not belong in
amateur radio. Let people enjoy the "magic" if they want to. Have a happy
holiday.

Where have all the sunspots gone?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Larry Weissman AD3Y      |  All opinions expressed are my own and
Lockheed Martin Corp.    |  in no way related to my company. All my
Moorestown, NJ   USA     |  designs are my companies and in no way
[e-mail] |  considered my own.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.midusa.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Perry L. Vale)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 22:26:00 GMT
Organization: Netspace Internet Services
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59kcdo$[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: node27.salina.midusa.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1651 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44870 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121436 rec.radio.swap:100752

Bill N9HH <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have had a try at both, and I like the 706 better.  It is more
>expensive and harder to operate, but it does more, too.  Although the
>DX70 comes with a cw filter, it is not very effective.  The optional
>filters in the ICOM are pretty good (I have the 250 Hz in mine) although
>the rig does suffer some from "blowby", that is, signals leaking around
>the narrow filter.  Neither rig has a very good noise blanker.  The
>Alinco, I think, has the edge in strong signal handling capability,
>although I am judging this by ear as opposed to having the rigs on the
>bench.  Alinco's break-in is also better.  I like the fact that the ICOM
>has two meters, even if it is only ten watts.  I already had a Mirage
>B3016 in the car, so now can run about 100 watts output on 160 thru 2.

>The mods were unimportant to me as I don't see much value in opening up
>the transmitter for dc to light.

>73,
>Bill N9HH

I've had a '706 since November 95, and I love it. Yes, the noise
blanker leaves a lot to be desired, but I've not seen any other
blankers in rigs this price range that were any better.. I run my
706 mobile in a Geo Metro, without a lot of room for anything bigger.
I am on all bands but 75 with a Comet CA-HV anteena.

73 de Perry N0MXJ <[e-mail]>




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:30 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.73.178.14!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: GROL and MROP
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 22:30:35 GMT
Lines: 34
Sender: [e-mail]

KUBILAI ([e-mail]) wrote:
: I'm sorry if this is a little out of this group's realm but can anybody
: recommend a good study guide for the General Radiotelephone Operator's
: License?  I saw a web page from WPT Publications and it seemed promising
: but I was wondering if anyone had any experience with them.  I bought a
: study guide from NARTE and it was barely more than the question pool.
: Thanks in advance,
: Charles Phillips

I recommend "Basic Electronic Communications for the FCC General
Radiotelephone Operator's License Exam" (whew!) by Victor F.C. Veley.
Publisher is TAB Books; ISBN 0-8306-2580-1.  My copy has a 1993 copyright
date, thus is not entirely in sync with the current question pool, which was
revised this year.

Elements 1, 3 and 8 are covered, all with lots of theory, beginning with DC
circuit theory.  I chose this book because I want to *learn* (actually,
review, since I've been away from radar maintenance since the late 70s) as
opposed to memorizing the correct answers.

Do you mean the "GROL Plus" book by Fred Maia and Gordon West?  If so, yes,
it's pretty much just the questions and answers in the pool, plus a brief
explanation of why the answer is correct.  I won't say it's a bad book, just
not what I'm looking for, nor, probably, are you.  For someone who knows
electronics fairly well, it would be a good review for the exam(s).

I assume that you've visited the W5YI Web page at

     http://www.w5yi.org

where test prep materials are offered for sale?

Good luck and 73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:31 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 22:40:02 GMT
Lines: 19
Sender: [e-mail]

Eric Oyen ([e-mail]) wrote:
: I too also agree with dave. I have some reservations about the ARRL,
: though. It is my impression that they don't listen much to the largest
: growing population in amateur radio: the Technician no-coder.
: Unfortunately, because of this lack of attention, the arrl suffers. If
: they would pay a little more attention to our concerns, they would be a
: much better organization for it.

There's a cyclic cause-and-effect relationship here.  Few no-code
Technicians ever bother to join the ARRL, thus the ARRL does not address
their concerns.  Around and around.

The growth is a meaningless statistic without membership.  The League runs
like a
business; representing the interests of the majority of *members* is good
business.  If most new hams joined ARRL and made some noise, you bet you'd
get more attention.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!news.magicnet.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: THE FINAL WORD
Lines: 11


W>Looks like you No-Coders Better start Studying if you want to get on
HF

Won't happen, it takes effort to study.  That doesn't happen in today's
"something for nothing mentality."

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!enews.sgi.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: ALL
Subject: THE ARRL REPRESENTS ME NOW!
Lines: 21


W>The special committee created by the ARRL to study issues relating
 >to the 1999 World Radiocommunication Conference (WRC-99) has
 >recommended that the ARRL Board of Directors not support changing
 >the treaty requirement for Morse code testing to operate below 30
 >MHz.  The committee submitted its final report to the ARRL Board
 >this week.

W>The committee report contains recommended ARRL positions regarding
 >possible changes in Article S25 of the international radio
 >regulations.  Consistent with the results of a survey of ARRL
 >members, the committee recommended no change in the existing treaty
 >obligation that administrations test prospective amateur licensees
 >on their Morse code ability before authorizing them to operate below
 >30 MHz.  The committee did support changes to Article S25 that
 >would:

Finally, I can say that the ARRL represents me!
---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail].
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: FILTER
Lines: 13


K>It does. We only have perhaps a couple hundred idiots on the HF bands
 >as opposed to the thousands that inhabit 11 meters. Plus, for instance,
 >we don't have Carl on HF. We can thank the CW requirement for that, if
 >nothing else.

It is not perfect, but it helps.  You're right though, without it we
would be much worse off.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:34 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Source for license statis
Lines: 9


F>Can anyone point me to a source for statistics on the current distribution o
f
 >US Amateur licenses?  How many Extras/Advanced/General/Tech+/Tech/Novice?

It is in the Radio Amateur Callbook (Flying Horse)

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: 110 VS 220 Volts
Lines: 10


DK>Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
  >the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??

The wiring in your house can be of a smaller gauge with 220 volts.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Where are all the HAM
Lines: 21


C>when i lived in rural south jersey, my friends and i had a "secret
 >frequency" we used for simplex chattering. i'd moniter that and the local
 >repeater. well, a year ago i moved to philadelphia and some of my old
 >friends were going to meet me in the city. i said "i'll be on the old
 >secret frequency." well, wouldn't you know it, when i turned on the
 >radio, someone _else_ was using the simplex frequency. after a while one
 >of my friends came on, called for me and i said "let's move up 40khz and
 >i'll catch you there", well, amazingly enough, there was someone on
 >_that_ simplex frequency too. after that, i started looking for simplex
 >frequencies, just leaving my radio on all the time tuned to a frequency,
 >and i've _yet_ to find one that people don't talk on from time to time.
 >it's quite a jump from rural new jersey to metropolitin  whatever.

Have you tried 222 MHz?  It's quite but there's always someone on the
repeaters.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake
Lines: 19


C>I've seen this written down anywhere, but it seems to me that 100 W output
 >just doesn't cut it on 80/40/20 meter SSB.

Probably all over, it's the truth.

C>Also, lately, I've actually
 >found some groups on 80M where I wasn't either ignored or verbally abused.
 >Has HF been toning down a bit lately?   It doesn't seem all as bad as I
 >remember or as people complain here.

Where's that?  Oh, you'd probably don't want to say for fear that people
will go over there and trash it; don't blame you.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]


--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: FILTER
Lines: 11


M>You need to read this newsgroup more carefully.  Many HAM OPERATORS seem
 >to swear by the outdated Morse requirements as a way to "keep the
 >riff-raff out."

It's not perfect, but it helps.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:39 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Vanity Call
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <59cjfg$[e-mail]> <59ehuk$[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 22:50:47 GMT
Lines: 18
Sender: [e-mail]

Richard Furuta ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Anyone want to guess when the Area 4 1x2's will run out?  Today's report at
: www.qrz.com only lists 19 unassigned (and those might actually not be availa
ble
: because of the 2 year waiting period).

I think the area 6 1x2 callsigns are down to 57, since the frantic
processing through 12-18-96.  Both K6CR and K6JL are now gone; a couple of
my choices.  There are still some acceptable ones left, assuming, as you do,
that all are actually assignable.

Guess I need to get that 20 wpm down and finish getting the Extra; first
things first!  :-)

There are also *lots* of good 1x3 callsigns available; just like the W#xxx
or K#xxx who were OTs when I was a new WA8.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 15:03:48 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Eric Oyen wrote:

> > You certainly are not one to show what facts either, the only fact you
> > know is keeping your nose up Bill's ass.
> >
> Ah! a personal attack! I rest my case! (you have proven it already, as
> this is a fact of your undoing).

I guess truth hurts.  :)


> Ah! another one! I see that your memory is very selective. what about
> all the people trying to take you to task for your behavior? (30+ in all
> can't be wrong!).

Here, I can show that the tide was certainly in my favor.  See
attachment at
end of this message where Cheek says: "...the sickos and slimeballs
crawled
out of the woodwork to have a go at me and when they started in, YOU and
many others remained silent". (second paragraph of the qoute)  By
Cheek's OWN
admission, many remained silent while everyone opposed him a go at him.



> > No I am not in denial, absolutely not, there is no way I could be in
> > denial.  That simply is not possible.  Infact, I deny that!
> hahahahahahahahahahahaha:) A real belly splitter there! Thats classic
> denial right there! :)

I am glad to see you have a sense of humor.  I thought my response
was pretty funny!


> Also, quotations "out of context" will be grounds to disqualify your
> "facts".

Another humorous remark!  Who are are you judge a disqualification?
Talk about grandeous behavior!
(unfortunately, I don't think you meant to inject any humor)


> Hostile takeover? There are no such things in fido, John. All is done
> according
> to a rigid set of rules established by the governing body of fidonet
> supervisors.

You are wrong here, a moderator can do what he wants.  The "governing
body
of fidonet supervisors" in bunk.


> HUH?If you were banned from that echo, then he has no reason to contact
> your sysop,
> except for any follow-up actions required (like ban-evasion and
> confirmation).
> Your sheet has holes in it John. I saw right through that little "story".

He did, would you like to see a copy of the message sent to him from
Cheek?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:09:01 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 71.ccsnet.com
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Siegfried Rambaum wrote:
>
> > If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
> > Samantha Fisher
>
> A wise word from your daughter, Burt. What makes you ignore her wisdom?

Why do you say that?

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-6.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:09:15 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]> <59joc6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv24.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121444 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44537 rec.radio.shortwave:90940

In article <59joc6$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> >I agree with you in principle ... those people who have no interest in
> >*radio* technology (the "art" in "radio art", NOT CW, which is simply
> >telegraphy, which has existed for far longer than radio) don't deserve
> >to be hams ... even if they can copy 20+wpm of Morse code.
>
> That's about the most elitist statement I've ever heard. What you're saying
is
> that people who simply want to be hams because they think it would be an
> enjoyable hobby or pastime don't deserve to be hams.

Welcome to the ARS according to CARL.  Be pepared to be the target of
lies, insults and disgusting e-mail messages (which of course he';; deny
sending).  But as you have read, that's EXACTLY what Carl is saying.  NO
YACKERS. DX'ERS, CONTESTERS, GAMERS or RAGCHEWER!!! plain and simple.
Besides, it's NOT A HOBBY..right Carl???

Carl's vision is to have nothing but little tinnie tiny bits of data
traveling at the speed of light back and forth via computer..no human
interaction needed.  And all this at a price..play for pay


>
> >However, having a Morse code test has NOTHING to do with the radio art
> >.. read the ITU definition of ham radio ... it's a service devoted to
> >private tecnical investigations ... NOT a "gaming place for people who
> >want to yack, beep, and 'chase DX'" ...  those things are permissable,
> >but they are NOT the "reason for being" of ham radio.
>
> Maybe so, but it it's no reason to keep a person from becoming a ham simply
> because they don't fit *your* criteria of what a ham should be.

See, you're getting the picture.  What a great way to utilize spectrum.
Carl can send to Lennart, who can;'t send back cause he ain;t gots no
license.  Why, cause, he like Wa^VSE don;t want to join the fraternity
known as amateur radio operators.

Flame away boys...I've decided your opinions of me and $1.35 buys me my
morning cup of coffee and paper.  In otherwords, you're boring, tedious
and quite a hoot to see you rush to your own defenses..  YAHOOOO


>
> >Carl - wa6vse
> >[e-mail]
> >Employed out of pity for the mentally deficient

>
> Tom - N8ECW
>
>

--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:45 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!tezcat!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bconnex.net!news.abs.net!news.scn.org!scn.org!bb840
From: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Organization: Seattle Community Network
References: <59g8nj$[e-mail]> <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 23:10:24 GMT
Lines: 23


In a previous article, [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) says:
>
>Dave Hockaday ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: Hi Bill. What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band? There
 was a VE
>: something phone op on 3.720 about a week ago raising all sorts of noise abo
ut US
>: novices operating in "his" phone segment.
>
>Hm. You would think the VE would be a bit more knowledgeable. CW is allowed o
n
>ALL Amateur frequencies (at least, on HF). I don't know if that is true for
>Canada as well, but suspect it is.
>
>The Canadian allocations used to be identical to those in the US, but may not
>be any longer.
>
>Bill
>
I believe the Canadian phone allocation has extended into the US novice
80 meter band for at least 20 years (when I got my novice ticket).
--
Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:46 1997
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 15:19:32 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> You should talk, john. Personal insults aside, I think perhaps it would
> be a good idea to shut up and listenb for a bit, don't you?

Actually, I think you should follow your own advice.


> You could be asked the same question, john. only I didn't appear in here
> before you started this mess. I appeared about 3 weeks AFTER!
> Ah so, You think this is my doing? Who started it, john? It is an
> interesting fact that everytime you enter one of these newsgroups, that
> a flame war just happenes to erupt. Strange coincidence? I think not.

You are right, it is not a coincidence because that has not happened
at all.  I have been on this NG since last February.  No
problems arose until Dick Kendrick and then YOU.  started attacking.
Even [e-mail] said I was not a problem.  You are to new to
the NG to know apparently.  (by your own admission, you came onto
this NG only a few weeks after this started!)


> > Actually, it was 2 months & 3 weeks, hardly 8 months.
> Actually, according to the archive, it was 8 months, 13 days. I sure
> would like to know where you got those figures from?

I would also like to know where you are getting your figures from also
since
Dejanews disagrees with you.


> I spelled it that was for a reason! It's not just an attitude, its an
> ASSitude!

According to the dictionary it is not a word.
Are you into baby talk or something?


> week? That and your attacks on others leaves a real bad taste in my
> mouth!

Then leave, no one is making you stay.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:32:49 -0500
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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I've heard the 706 on the air with the stock mic.
It sounded OK to me.
--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:48:07 -0500
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net> <59j8ll$[e-mail]>
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Michael Crestohl wrote:
>
> I would seriously consider the ICOM IC-706.  I don't care for the Alinco
> products.  A friend who repairs sand-state microprocessor-based radios for
> a living won't touch Alinco radios.
>
> Pay a bit more - but get what you pay for!

Truer words...

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news2.digex.net!news6.digex.net!news.gteais.com!news
From: aor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 5/8" UHF or 'N' connectors needed - Call The RF Connection
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:49:00 -0500
Organization: gteais-org
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33097 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44874 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121447

Contact Joel at "The RF Connection" in Maryland.  He has almost every
type of connector.  New and used too.  Contact him at:

[e-mail]  or   http://www.therfc.com

Best of luck.  He has helped me out of a jam more than once!


73,

Al, NW2M


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 22 Dec 1996 19:02:38 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59ki6u$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]> <59joc6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121453 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44541 rec.radio.shortwave:90947

In article <59joc6$[e-mail]>, T.L.Bryant <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>I agree with you in principle ... those people who have no interest in
>>*radio* technology (the "art" in "radio art", NOT CW, which is simply
>>telegraphy, which has existed for far longer than radio) don't deserve
>>to be hams ... even if they can copy 20+wpm of Morse code.
>
>That's about the most elitist statement I've ever heard. What you're saying i
s
>that people who simply want to be hams because they think it would be an
>enjoyable hobby or pastime don't deserve to be hams.

Yup. That's Carl for you. In one sentence he will call CW-supporters a
bunch of ignorant elitists, yet in the next breath tell you how only
people with PhDs in EE should be hams. He'll also usually tell you how
he has forgotten more RF theory while standing in front of the urinal
(not a short period of time, given general prostrate health at his age)
than the entire combined population of all amateurs throughout the
entire universe put together knows.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!207.155.38.10!news.qnet.com!usenet
From: "Will, KN6DV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Icom swithing problem
Date: 23 Dec 1996 00:03:43 GMT
Organization: KN6DV
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <01bbf064$b5866420$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lanc00-24.ca.qnet.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I have a Icom 775DSP and a Icom 706.
Both have the acc. Plug # 1 and 2.
I am using pin # 3 of the acc #2 to switch my amplifier (with the Ameritron
ARB-700 relay buffer)
using pin # 3 of acc plug1 to swath the radio TX on and off from the
computer via a level converter.
I am using this future for RTTY (I am using RITTY by K6STI)

Here is the problem I am having.
As soon I connect acc plug #1 (the one from the computer level converter)
the amplifier switch on, it does this even with the level converter
disconnected from the computer.

I also have tried a different relay buffer for the amplifier but the same
thing happens again.
So far I have tried anything I could think of an no result (It drives me
nuts) I even build a second level converter.

Any help would be appreciated.
 Thanks 73 Will,  KN6DV

--
http://www.av.qnet.com/~kn6dv

REFORM
Unless the reformer can invent something which substisutes attractive
virtues for atractive vices, he will fail.
(Walter Lippmann)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:52 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 16:11:14 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 15
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.6

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

>I too also agree with dave. I have some reservations about the ARRL,
>though. It is my impression that they don't listen much to the largest
>growing population in amateur radio: the Technician no-coder.
>Unfortunately, because of this lack of attention, the arrl suffers. If
>they would pay a little more attention to our concerns, they would be a
>much better organization for it.

I agree.  The answer is for that "largest growing population" to flex its
collective muscle by joining the ARRL and electing Directors who pledge to
support their needs and desires.  Again, change from within an organization
is much easier than from without.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in1.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Blocking ham/cb interference on stereo equipment?
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 01:16:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <59jrfq$[e-mail]>
Lines: 13


>>I know there are filters you can put on your telephone to block some
>>of the interference.  Is there anything like that for stereo
>>equipment?

Jon - you are assuming that your neighbor is "out of line." He just
might be operating entirely LEGALLY. Maybe THAT'S why the FCC will not
get involved in your case.

It's Neighbourhood Public Relations time, Jon. Get to know your
neighbor. See what his hobby REALLY is. See if you two can coordinate
your schedules...if properly addressed, you might find him to be quite
receptive to your concerns.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:54 1997
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From: "Thomas R. Sundstrom" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 20:30:52 -0500
Organization: Pennsylvania Online [Usenet News Server for Hire]
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]>
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Listening to Len's Ham Radio & More show early this morning on WWCR and
this pro-code, anti-code business... and Len's promotion of the no-code
General...

Did'ja ever notice that high speed code atop music is used throughout
the programming to move from feature to feature?

Hmmm... ironic, isn't it?

Tom W2XQ
--

 Thomas R. Sundstrom                         [e-mail]
 TRS Consultants                             http://www.trsc.com
 PO Box 2275                                 [e-mail]
 Vincentown, NJ 08088-2275, USA
 [phone] | Fax [phone]
 < Contributing Editor, "Radio & Communications", ACP Symes Magazines >


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 23 Dec 1996 01:57:57 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59jlen$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>Not necessarily.  But pinheads who sneak over from the good buddy
>newsgroup to troll could be classified as know trouble makers.

Oh, I'm so sorry.  I didn't realize there was a rule specifying that I
could only be active on the CB'ERS or the HAM OPERATORS newsgroup, but not
on both.

Considering that I'm both an active CB'ER and a HAM OPERATOR, I would say
that I am right at home on both, no?




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!169.132.11.200!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Mark Schroder <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Yaesu 51R mods
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 21:11:34 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: aln-as1s55.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; 68K)

HELP!!

Does anyone know how to reset the 51R Power-up settings to the factory
settings.  I was playing around with the settings after downloading a
message about them and I screwed up my squelch settings to the point
that nothing unsquelches the rig.  I'm trying not to have to reset the
entire rig because I have the memory full and I don't have the
software to back it up to a computer.

Thanks in advance.

N3XCM - Mark


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!141.211.63.150!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:38:47 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
> > You are still a wet behind the ears ham with an inflated

> Oh? Care to look in the mirror and repeat that?

Yea, I could do that.  Compared to you I have about three times as
long as a licensed amateur radio operator.


> Meanwhile, I have more important items in my agenda.

Good, please go do them.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!hammer.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Read THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:41:59 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59aflp$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Richard Kendrick wrote:
> Wow, more pithy remarks form the legions of King Mackey.

Really, how have you arrived at this conlusion, Little Dick?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:06:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 02:48:40 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <59krpb$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan24.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>>>Looks like you No-Coders Better start Studying if you want on HF

>>The WARC recommendation is to the ARRL as a possible
>>US osition.  There is the rest of the world that has a say in
>>this also...at least as it relates to the international
>>treaty.

>Praise Jesus !!! There is still hope !!!  Maybe Lenny and Squggie will
>move over to the VK newsgroups now and start working on the international
>aspect of the crusade ??

>>Frankly, the only comment in the ARRL bulletin indicated
>>the committee report was based on the poll and not on
>>any compelling reasons to mandate CW knowledge.
>>I look forward to the actual WHY the position was
>>recommended.  If it s only the poll results, then that's pretty
>>poor reasoning.

>The wishes of the membership should be a 'compelling reason',
>wouldn't you think Bill ?

It is only compelling to the ARRL...if the ARRL board wants to
accept it.  It is NOT compelling in any technical manner as a means
to justify an international treaty requirement.

Holiday Cheers to all and a Merry Christmas

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 18:55:02 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59aeri$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Richard Kendrick wrote:
> Amateur radio licenses for sale! Contact John Mackey for details
> and prices!

That's right!!!  All you have to do is pay $6.05, pass a test(s) with
myself & 2 accreditated associates, & fill out a form.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cwix!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.swap,alt.radio.scanner
Subject: PRO 26 MOD ? is there one?
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 21:18:38 -0600
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Is there a mod for cellular for the Pro 26?  I have one source that says
there is.  I would like to get a few more references before I attempt
it.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.


Nick Yatko
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:02 1997
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From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 23 Dec 1996 03:35:21 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <59kulp$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$c0n@bashi
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

r.peak.org> <[e-mail]> <59imbl$[e-mail]>
<[e-mail]> <59jh7t$[e-mail]>:
Distribution:

Blake Bowers ([e-mail]) wrote:
: "Philip D. Wolfe III" <[e-mail]> wrote:
:
: >Bill Nelson wrote:
:
:
: >If Eric and Richard would knock off their crap it would be fine.
:
:
: It is amazing, how all the posts that come out in support of John, or
: any of his ideas, are from people never seen before,  and they never
: list their callsign............

You don't have to have a callsign to post on the Internet, dumbass.

:
: Ghost writers?????
:
: KD4RME
:
:

--
----


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ARLB097 NTIA Report Bullish on Additional HF Allocations for Amateur
Date: 23 Dec 1996 03:47:58 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59kvde$[e-mail]>
References: <$[e-mail]> <5977hr$[e-mail]> <597o5t$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts01-09.dialup.ais.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <597o5t$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jeffrey Herman)
writes:  > >>Meanwhile, hundreds of *MEGA*Hertz of VHF and up spectrum
are threatened >>...  While new HF bands are A Good Thing(tm), let's
keep our priorities >>straight.  > >No grave loss.  Those V/UHF folks
can always use 11m as a substitute for >the short-range comms they seems
to be happy with.  > >Jeff KH2PZ

Typical response for a beeper ...  short-sighted, backward, and lacking
sense.  (Sorry, Jeff, but that's how I see this one ...  I suspect you
put that one out as flame bait, so you deserve what you got.)

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Tim Mize <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 20:05:13 -0800
Organization: GoodNet
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net> <[e-mail]> <59kcdo$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: svm-ts1-21.c2i2.com
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To: "Perry L. Vale" <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1656 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44892 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121474 rec.radio.swap:100809

Perry L. Vale wrote:
>
> Bill N9HH <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >I have had a try at both, and I like the 706 better.  It is more
> >expensive and harder to operate, but it does more, too.  Although the
> >DX70 comes with a cw filter, it is not very effective.  The optional
> >filters in the ICOM are pretty good (I have the 250 Hz in mine) although
> >the rig does suffer some from "blowby", that is, signals leaking around
> >the narrow filter.  Neither rig has a very good noise blanker.  The
> >Alinco, I think, has the edge in strong signal handling capability,
> >although I am judging this by ear as opposed to having the rigs on the
> >bench.  Alinco's break-in is also better.  I like the fact that the ICOM
> >has two meters, even if it is only ten watts.  I already had a Mirage
> >B3016 in the car, so now can run about 100 watts output on 160 thru 2.
>
> >The mods were unimportant to me as I don't see much value in opening up
> >the transmitter for dc to light.
>
> >73,
> >Bill N9HH
>
> I've had a '706 since November 95, and I love it. Yes, the noise
> blanker leaves a lot to be desired, but I've not seen any other
> blankers in rigs this price range that were any better.. I run my
> 706 mobile in a Geo Metro, without a lot of room for anything bigger.
> I am on all bands but 75 with a Comet CA-HV anteena.
>
> 73 de Perry N0MXJ <[e-mail]>
Hi, Tim N7XAU here, I have an Alinco DX70T, I bought it about 3 months
ago and have had great signal reports with it on 20 meters and 6 meters.
If your not interested in 2 mtr all mode then the Alinco is alot
cheaper. I havent had any problems with the radio, I have used it at
special event stations, mobile, and as a base.  It doesnt have a built
in keyer, but its easy to use, its front end is hotter than the Icom,
and the recieve audio is better to.  Thats my two cents worth.
73s


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.silcom.com!news.west.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ANONYMOUS POSTER CAUGHT--KEVIN POTTER  WAS:Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 23 Dec 1996 04:17:15 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <59l14b$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59eklb$[e-mail]> <59enr1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]
X-URL: news:[e-mail]

Forgive, Father, for I have sinned.

Told you anybody could do it!

KP




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:06 1997
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From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ANONYMOUS POSTER CAUGHT--KEVIN POTTER  WAS:Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 23 Dec 1996 04:19:34 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <59l18m$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59eklb$[e-mail]> <59enr1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]
X-URL: news:[e-mail]

Now I will post from iaf.net & have my mail re-sent.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:07 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Doug Wittich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 04:22:12 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59bjng$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ird4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc300057.concentric.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230


>It does? What does "25 kHz above sub-band edge" mean to you?

I admit,I didn't see that part until someone else pointed it out to
me.   That's because it was far less pronounced than the recommended
frequency list.   And, I also note that one recommended 10 m freq is
in the tech+ phone band.   So a mea culpa on me for a small oversight,


BUT nobody has yet to give a reasonable explanation as to why special
events stations and many contest frequencies are in the general
subband.    If only all the energy used by some (not all) to flame
were used to educate, we'd all become a whole lot smarter.

Doug


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!super.zippo.com!zdc!zippo!news
From: "John Scott Mackey" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Setting up an antenna tower.
Date: 23 Dec 1996 04:50:55 GMT
Organization: Zip News
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbf083$cab28620$292da3cd@Pjmackey>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rgpm01-041.mcn.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33109 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44897 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121477

> > "David P. Hummel, Jr." <[e-mail]> > > wrote:
> >But here is the fun part.  Anybody have any ideas > >how I can dig a
hole in the ground that is about > >2.5ft in diameter and about 6.5ft deep?
 Any > >suggestions?

Well if you have any small kids around you could take two tall garbage cans
with the bottoms cut out, tape them together bottom to bottom put in hole
to protect against side cave ins.  At this point the cans should stick
above the ground about two and a half feet.  Tell the kid you need the hole
deep enough so the cans are flush with ground level.  Give the kid a garden
troll and bucket and I'll bet it takes the kid less time to dig those two
and a half feet than it took you to get the tower out of the ground.  Just
one idea...  Merry Xmas



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 05:20:42 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 71
Message-ID: <59kt5j$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Guitarman) wrote:


>-->Kevin Potter wrote:
>-->
>-->> I think a trip down Deja News is in order.  Look under John
>Mackey,
>-->> rec.radio.scanner.
>-->> Also, look under any other name you'd like.
>-->> It's a real eye opener.
>-


>       Here's something I wrote about the whole thing back in
>       August. The first is my post... (I know, I shoulda kept
>       my nose out of it!) The second is the PUBLIC reply from
>       Mr. Cheeks, The third is the PRIVATE reply from Mr. Cheeks
>       that helped me make up my mind about his charachter.
>       These can all be found on "Deja News".



>        Hello to all... I'm kinda new to this group, and have been
>following
>this thread, and have only one thing to say. Thank God this isn't the
>FIDO Scanner echo... there would be nobody here.. we'd all be locked
>out for mentioning something "Off Topic". Ya'all gotta agree, when you
>start a conversation with someone... it SELDOM stays on the same
>subject for long.... All I see is some guy who wanted to continue his
>conversation on another echo, after being warned by his sysop to
>"knock it off". His post to ask the conversation to "move" was off
>topic.... and POOF!  Bill (This is my echo and I am GOD) Cheek, should
>really read the constitution, and what it says about freedom of
>speech.
Here is your misconception.  Freedom of speech does not apply to FIDO,
never has, and most likely never will.  In FIDO, the moderator is god
of the echo, and a user is there at his acceptance.

That is one of the concepts that FIDO Echos was founded on.







>Are you stupid or do you just act that way?  Freedom of speech does
>NOT even pretend to extend to FidoNet echoes.  By definition, and
>by Policy, Fido echoes are moderated and rules are required, and
>users have to obey the rules.  Or else......  Very simple.

And here, it is put very simply, and to the point.  FIDO and the
Internet is very much different.  Like life, one plays by the rules.

>       If you haven't decided who is out of line here.. I hope this
>helps.

I have.  I certainly hope it does not appear to be a flame, but you
are out of line on two points.

1.  FIDO moderators can do whatever they want.  Your comments about
the constitution, etc, have no place.

2.  Bringing the FIDO problems to the newsgroups.

And I am out of line for continuing them.

Have a great day Guitar man.  I hope you take this in the way it was
intended, and not as a flame.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!torn!nott!temp1.ott.igs.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (D. Holford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: 23 Dec 1996 05:21:04 GMT
Organization: IGS - Information Gateway Services
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <59l4s0$2an$[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59g8nj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ijif$2s4$[e-mail]> <59j8oq$9l8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ttyb04.cnwl.igs.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.6

>>>What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band?
>>There are NO sub-bands allocated in Canada. Only MAXIMUM allowable
bandwidths.
>
>Not true.

Very, Very *True* there are no allocated sub-bands

>Bandwidth is allocated by international agreement and is federally
>regulated. RAC has worked on a {{*suggested*}} bandplan to approximate the US

and
>International bandplan model.
>
>The HF Band Plan is a voluntary, gentleman's agreement, intended for the
>guidance of and observation by Canadian Radio Amateurs.
>
>Industry Canada as a government department regulates the amateur radio
>spectrum. They regulate the frequencies and the bandwidth, but not the mode
>s of operation within the amateur spectrum.
>
>=======================
>Paul J. Piercey  VO1HE
>=========================

(Paul's comments were extensively snipped in order to keep this to a
reasonable size, if you wish the read his full, detailed posting please refer
directly to it.)

Sorry Paul.
RAC does not make allocations any more than the ARRL does.
Industry Canada makes allocations just like the FCC, and RAC makes suggestions

in their *band plan*

I think the band plan is admirable, but it is not part of the Radio Amateur
Examination - new hams are *not required* to know it even exists, let alone
follow it; so they memorize the legal rules because they are not only
examinable, but far far simpler. Thus we get people jamming repeaters - not
maliciously but simply because they do not realise that the frequencly they
chose for simplex is a repeater input frequency. I just finished listening to
a two hour net in Montreal, which was subject to almost continuous QRM from a
group using a repeater input as a simplex channel.

If only the RAC plan had some teeth - but it's just a suggestion so let's be
honest and not try to pretend it has some legal standing.

73,
Dave



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 05:23:52 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59ktbg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59jsd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Mark Taylor <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Can you imagine how crappy the audio would be after going through that
>many radios?
>I doubt it would be understandable, by any stretch of the imagination.
>--
That was but one of the many things we presented to him.  He replied
with a message to me, with @#%hole spelled out in dots and dashes.

Soon after his BBS sysop was advised, he disappeared.  Wonder what
happened!  (G)




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.reference.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: Douglas Gavilanes <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need Copy of 73 Ham Radio Article 9/89
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 21:59:46 -0800
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max7-gg-ca-53.earthlink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U; 16bit)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44900 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121482

I need a copy of an article discussing modification of the Uniden HR2510
to increase RF output power from 25W to 100W.  The article appears on
page 48 of the September, 1989 issue of 73 Ham Radio.  If you have a copy
laying around, I would sure appreciate a photocopy.

TNX es Happy Holidays,

Doug Gavilanes, N6XQY
Garden Grove, California




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.campus.mci.net!news.telis.org!s08-pm06-ontro-t.telis.org!user
From: [e-mail] (wb6siv)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: New Concept! Cyberscheds Your Next DX and Satellite Contact!
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 22:11:58 -0800
Organization: Raymond Sarrio Co.
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s08-pm06-ontro-t.telis.org

This is a new use of the WWW that can benefit ham radio operators
throughout the world.

You can now schedule contacts with hams all over the world simply and
easily by using the WWW and e-mail.I have set aside a section of my web
site http://www.sarrio.com for hams to post their request for over-the-air
schedules. Included in each posting is a place to list the posters
specific ham radio contact needs (countries, zones,IOTA, grid squares
ect...). The postings will also include an e-mail link that will allow
hams that read the posts, to easily request an over-the-air schedule.

How Can Cyberscheds work for me?

Do you need a certain state to complete a WAS award? Are you just a few
countries away from a DXCC? Are you a QRP operator looking to make
contacts with hams all over the world? Are you a DX station that has grown
tired of the stateside pile-ups on 20 meters? Or are you going mobile into
a hard to work county?

In all the above examples you could have prearranged cyberscheds with
those hams that you want to work. If band conditions are poor just e-mail
the hams you could not work and set up a new schedule.

Cyberscheds are a simple way to have the internet work to the benefit of
hams all over the world.

All posting will stay on-line for 6 months, or until the posting is asked
to be deleted. Below is an example of one cyberpost visit the cyberpost
page and view them all. Below is an example of one of the postings:

Station: BV/N0IAT


Name: Joe Fitter
QTH: Taipei, TAIWAN Republic of China
Bands: 40/20/17/15/10
Mode: CW (occasional SSB, but not much)
Comments: Looking for South America, Central America, and Carribean QSO's.
I QRV from a
neighbors shack (local law), so operating times are limited to station
availability. QSL via my CBA --
I DO NOT accept IRC's or Greenbacks, just please send me your QSL card and
a route for returning
the favor.
Post Date: Sept. 6, 1996
--
The Raymond Sarrio Co. a full feature Ham Radio Storefront and web site develo
per. Located at http://www.sarrio.com.

In association with Brillar Enterprises http://win-win.com/brillar provider of
 discount CD-Roms!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: Bill Beekman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 01:49:41 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: det-mi1-12.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 22 10:50:51 PM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Anthony R. Gold wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] "James Aeschliman" writes:
>
> > But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current is
> > less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
> > the current that kills, not the voltage.
>
> Then maybe electric chairs should use 9 volt batteries :-)
>
> The fact that say a 220 volt 100 watt light bulb will pass less
> current that a 110 volt 100 watt light bulb is not relevant to the
> danger of shock, although it might well affect the risk of fire from
> poor wiring.
>
> In general it's a current through YOU that will kill you from
> electrocution, and twice the mains voltage is likely to cause about
> twice the current to flow through you.
>
> Regards,
> --
>    Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
>                                                 [e-mail]
>                                         packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na


At 110Vac it takes approx .5 amps to be fatal.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.94.215.18!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!csulb.edu!usenet
From: Dan Dillon <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Yaesu 51R mods
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 1996 22:51:03 -0800
Organization: Cal State Long Beach
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p4-as2.lonbea1.csu.sloc.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01Gold (Win95; I)

Mark Schroder wrote:
>
> HELP!!
>
> Does anyone know how to reset the 51R Power-up settings to the factory
> settings.  I was playing around with the settings after downloading a
> message about them and I screwed up my squelch settings to the point
> that nothing unsquelches the rig.  I'm trying not to have to reset the
> entire rig because I have the memory full and I don't have the
> software to back it up to a computer.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> N3XCM - Mark


A week after I had purchased the same rig, I had a similar problem.
basically, the radio went completely deaf.   I took it into HRO, adn
they wouldn't exchange it for me... said take it to yaesu.

I took it to Yaesu, and they would not exchange it for me, but they
did diagnose the problem on the spot.  I crystal oscillator problem
I believe.  Anyway, they repaired it while I waited.  I don't know if
mine was a fluke, or if yours is having a similar problem but they
are a great little HT, and yaesu seems to really take care of problems
in a hurry.



--
                                                   ( . )
                                                     |
__Dan Dillon________________________________________/|\___KD6FPX______
Mailto://[e-mail]    http://www.engr.csulb.edu/~ddillon/
PGP Public Key: http://www.engr.csulb.edu/~ddillon/ddillon_pub_key.asc
PGP Fingerprint   =>   02 A6 07 34 22 80 53 09 8C 1E 5E 15 1A B4 43 1F
Please:      No unsolicited E-mail avertising or religious propaganda.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: Bill Beekman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 01:57:07 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: det-mi1-12.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 22 10:58:17 PM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Dave Hockaday wrote:
>
> Timothy Haller wrote:
> > On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
> >
> > > I've read and followed Dave Sumner's work for several years. I think he'
s a fair and
> > > hard working guy, just like the rest of the ARRL staff I've been in cont
act with. I
> > > think that the negative comments I've read on this newsgroup have been i
ll founded and
> > > in bad taste.
> > >
> > > I think the ARRL serves the Amateur community well, and better than any
"grass-roots"
> <snip>
>
> > Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?
> > Timothy Haller
>
> What's the matter, can't someone be happy with something here on the
> newsgroup? I've been an ARRL member for years, and support them on most
> of their views. Hey, nothing wrong with being happy, is there?
>
> --
> 73 de Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
> Youngsville, NC
> [e-mail]
> WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
>
> http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
> http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
> http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
> http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
> http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
> http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/
I support the arrl as well....

Lookout, someone started a killer thread..


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: Bill Beekman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Merry xmas
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 01:59:35 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: det-mi1-12.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 22 11:00:46 PM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Just a note to wish EVERYONE here a happy holiday season, and to ask some
> advice. Is the Kenwood Th-50t dual bander ht any good? I was thinking of
> getting one for xmas. Right now, my ENTIRE shack consists of a four year
> old Htx-202, a Pro-2030, and a Dx-390. Needless to say, I'm quite limited
> financally at the moment, so I really need the biggest bang for my bucks.
>  I also have an extremely limited amount of space in my flat in
> Manhattan, so all I can afford for my shack are ht's. Any and all advice
> Ican get on a HT only shack would be greatly welcome and appreciated.
>                            Dave/KB2ZYO
>                              Oh no...you did NOT fire that green @#%!at
> me...

Hey, thats sounds much like my shack.  Well, ok it's not really a
shack.  Just an Alinco DJ-582_H ht, a few MFJ meters.  Hope Santa brings
more stuff.

Bill  KC8cwp


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!169.132.11.200!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Blocking ham/cb interference on stereo equipment?
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 07:04:29 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59mf79$[e-mail]>
References: <59jrfq$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-141.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Kingfish) wrote:

>Hi Everyone,

>A neighbor of mine has a ham or cb radio, and his transmissions come
>out over my stereo, telephone, clock radio - anything with a speaker.
>The FCC won't do anything about it.

>I know there are filters you can put on your telephone to block some
>of the interference.  Is there anything like that for stereo
>equipment?

>Thanks,

>JOn

Jon, first thing to do is go talk to your neighbor. If he is a ham he may
be willing to help you solve the problem.  There are various ways of
solving interferance problems. The FCC, at one time, had a free booklet
they were passing out on the subject.  Usually the problem has to be
fixed at the stereo, telephone, etc. end.  But in your case it sounds like
maybe you neighbor has a problem.  If he is using a CB radio, ask him
to try it without his amplifier turned on, and see if you still get the same
problems.

Merry Christmas,
Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.180.128.35!news.mindspring.com!mindspring!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 07:04:33 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <59mf7d$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-141.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Eric Oyen <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I too also agree with dave. I have some reservations about the ARRL,
>though. It is my impression that they don't listen much to the largest
>growing population in amateur radio: the Technician no-coder.
>Unfortunately, because of this lack of attention, the arrl suffers. If
>they would pay a little more attention to our concerns, they would be a
>much better organization for it.

>Eric.

Eric, I think someone mentioned that not very many no code techs have
joined the ARRL.  Put you checkbook where your concerns are, and I am
sure they will be more willing to listen.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.94.215.18!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.bc.net!torn!nott!temp1.ott.igs.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (D. Holford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: 23 Dec 1996 07:25:54 GMT
Organization: IGS - Information Gateway Services
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <59lc63$6p9$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ttyb04.cnwl.igs.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.6

>>There are NO sub-bands allocated in Canada. Only MAXIMUM
 allowable bandwidths.
>>>
>>>Not true.
>>
>>Very, Very *True* there are no allocated sub-bands
>
>I think you misunderstood my posting and it possibly comes
>from the interpretation of the word "allocation". As I
>stated, and was shown in the text of the RAC HF band plan,
>sub bands are 'suggested' by both RAC and ARRL, and other
>groups, as usage guidelines to allow the best utilization
>of the entire band for all modes available. They are not
>legally binding nor did I make any claim that they were.
>
Wrong - RAC suggests subbands - the FCC legislates them!!
>
>>>>Bandwidth is allocated by international agreement and
is federally >>>regulated. RAC has worked on a
{{*suggested*}} bandplan to approximate >the US >>and >>
>International bandplan model. >>>>>>The HF Band Plan
is a voluntary, gentleman's agreement, intended for the >>
>>guidance of and observation by Canadian Radio Amateurs. >
>>>> Note: Gentleman's Agreement. >>>>Industry Canada
as a government department regulates the amateur radio >>
>spectrum. They regulate the frequencies and the bandwidth,
but not the >mode >>>s of operation within the amateur
spectrum. >>>>>>======================= >>>Paul J.
Piercey  VO1HE >>>=========================>>>>
(Paul's comments were extensively snipped in order to keep
this to a >>reasonable size, if you wish the read his
full, detailed posting please >refer >>directly to it.) >
>>>Sorry Paul. >>RAC does not make allocations any more
than the ARRL does. >>Industry Canada makes allocations
just like the FCC, and RAC makes >>suggestions  in their
*band plan* >>>>Yes, but, again, it is the use of the
word "allocation" that confuses the >situation. >Anyway, I
hope I have cleared my position up a bit further. Words have
a >funny way of screwing up communications HI.
=============================

Paul;

Sorry but words do not screw up communications, their misuse
does. I based my interpretation of the word 'allocation' on
that used by the ARRL. To quote their handbook.

"FCC subband allocations for US amateurs." and the note in
the ARRL HF Band Plan for Considerate US Operators states
"They are in addition to, and subject to, frequency
*allocations* and *subbands* defined by FCC regulations"
You will note that the ARRL goes to great pains to point out
that the allocations, including subbands are made by the
FCC.  Note also that the FCC allocations specify not only
the grade of license but also the modes permitted.

Dave



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!mackrel.fishnet.net!usenet
From: Mike <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM Computer Control Software?
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 00:01:52 -0800
Organization: FNS
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port009.scv.fishnet.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44907 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121487

Bob Morris K2RK wrote:
>
> I should get a coR.Moroney wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone have a recommendation for a good control program for ICOM
> > rigs (specifically the '706 and '736)?  I'm mainly looking for a DOS
> > program, but Windows 3.1 or 95 would be OK too, in a pinch.  Logging
> > capabilities are a plus, but not a requirement.  Any suggestions?
> >
> > BOB K9CMR
>
>  Try Log-Eqf.... Logging, DXCC etc...Forget if the rig stuff
> is in the shareware, but <$40. Ads in QST (EQF Software). Fills freq and
> mode into log from Icom. Folows Icom tunning Memory pages... Freq and
> mode to radio from keyboard. Packet cluster window. contest mode...auto
> time/date logging.
> Try the shareware to see if you like the log screen. ARRL Web and
> others.
> ..Current V 8.07 is DOS and I run it in Win 3.1 as a "pif" window on the
> shack-486/33 with 8 megs...Can do other stuff in Windows while
> Log is in background. The memory pages are nice as the '735 only has
> 12 memories. They have a full line for freq, mode and a line of info.
> Like the info space for what's in the memory - BBC etc.
>  Arrow down to a memory line, hit enter and the radio takes off.
>
> GL, Bob  As a side note, I just finished reading an article in the December
issue of 73 Amateur Radio Magazine which talks about the Log-EQF
controlling program and a Interface kit for the ic-706. Yuo might want
to take a look. It is on page 26 and 27.

73, Mike K6YPB


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!128.83.139.5!cs.utexas.edu!news.ti.com!usenet
From: Joe Fitter BV/N0IAT <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 16:24:20 +0800
Organization: Greetings from Taiwan, The Republic of China
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net> <[e-mail]> <59kcdo$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.58.105.2
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1657 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44903 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121486

> Hi, Tim N7XAU here, I have an Alinco DX70T, I bought it about 3 months
> ago and have had great signal reports with it on 20 meters and 6 > meters.
> If your not interested in 2 mtr all mode then the Alinco is alot
> cheaper. I havent had any problems with the radio, I have used it at
> special event stations, mobile, and as a base.  It doesnt have a built
> in keyer, but its easy to use, its front end is hotter than the Icom,
> and the recieve audio is better to.  Thats my two cents worth.
> 73s


Tim,
I couldnt agree more.  I own both the 706 and the 70T. I've owned the
DX70T since mid 1995 and the Icom since late 95.  After using both
extensively during the past year,  I think the 70T is a lot more radio
as far as HF goes.  I enjoy CW DXing and I've used both rigs side by
side on a 2 element quad in the midst of some nice pileups.
I've also used both rigs on vacations throughout Asia.

I must say that the Alinco is BETTER ON HF than the Icom...even when the
Icom is equipped with the 250 HZ FL101 narrow cw filter.  The Alinco RX
is better...the TX on CW QSK is much better on the Alinco too.  I also
find the user interface of the Alinco to be better than the Icom.
Finally, the Icom runs very HOT, especially in the hot/humid southeast
Asia climate.  Alinco needs to add a cw keyer and VSWR meter.  Otherwise
a winner.

I like the all-in-one feature of the IC-706, but to be honest I use it
more as a 2M/6M allmode rig than as an HF rig.  The SSB audio is not
nearly as hot/clear as the Alinco.

Joe BV/N0IAT


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!208.6.192.243!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!shore4.intercom.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Tim Jordan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: cOOL aSS wAV fILE WEB SITE!
Date: 23 Dec 1996 08:27:16 GMT
Organization: ICNet LLC, Salisbury, MD
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <59lfp4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sd027.delmarva.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

CHECK THIS PLACE OUT!
http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Towers/3815



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.ibm.net.il!arclight.uoregon.edu!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 08:55:29 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59l9o6$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$c0n@bashi <59kulp$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] () wrote:



>Blake Bowers ([e-mail]) wrote:

>: It is amazing, how all the posts that come out in support of John, or
>: any of his ideas, are from people never seen before,  and they never
>: list their callsign............

>You don't have to have a callsign to post on the Internet, dumbass.

Great response.  I am impressed.

Now, could you, would you, please show me where I said that you did
need a callsign to post on the internet?

Again, I wonder how many of these posts are by ghost writers.

Have a nice day.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.94.215.18!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.net.uk!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 96 09:09:06 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.dircon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <[e-mail]>
           [e-mail] "Bill Beekman" writes:

> At 110Vac it takes approx .5 amps to be fatal.

I would hazzard the guess (or is that guess the hazzard?) that the
path of the current through you is material to the degree of danger.
A shock from hand to foot or from hand to hand is far more dangerous
than say across the fingers of a single hand.  Wise old men keep keep
one hand in a pocket when it is necessary to adjust live equipment.

There are old Hams and bold Hams.  But no old bold Hams :-)
[With apologies to pilots who coined that saying]

A happy Christmas and a SAFE new year with a full log book to all.

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.net.uk!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ANONYMOUS POSTER CAUGHT--KEVIN POTTER  WAS:Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 96 09:16:51 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.dircon.co.uk
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; 68K)

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] "John Mackey--KA0SSF" write
s:

> We CAUGHT Kevin Potter making false postings!!!!

> Notice the "NNTP-Posting-Host", "X-Mailer", and
> the "Organization" lines are exactly the same.

Are you sure that Organization and X-Mailer are tough to forge?  See
my header.  And as you say, the NNTP-Posting-Host just indicates any
subscriber at that particular ISP.

I haven't yet figured how to handle Kevin's confessions :-)

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:30 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 03:12:58 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 61
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References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> > Ah! a personal attack! I rest my case! (you have proven it already, as
> > this is a fact of your undoing).
>
> I guess truth hurts.  :)
It would if it were I that was doing the lying, John, But I'm not, so it
doesn't... :)

> Here, I can show that the tide was certainly in my favor.  See
> attachment at
> end of this message where Cheek says: "...the sickos and slimeballs
> crawled
> out of the woodwork to have a go at me and when they started in, YOU and
> many others remained silent". (second paragraph of the qoute)  By
> Cheek's OWN
> admission, many remained silent while everyone opposed him a go at him.
WHen was this? It seems that you are putting words in anothers mouth
(and he isn't here to defend himself. Poor imitation of a "cheap shot"
Johnny! I must admit, you can't get much lower than that.

> > Also, quotations "out of context" will be grounds to disqualify your
> > "facts".
>
> Another humorous remark!  Who are are you judge a disqualification?
> Talk about grandeous behavior!
> (unfortunately, I don't think you meant to inject any humor)
Funny, it seems real serious to me.... You have a warped sense of humor,
john...

>
> > Hostile takeover? There are no such things in fido, John. All is done
> > according
> > to a rigid set of rules established by the governing body of fidonet
> > supervisors.
>
> You are wrong here, a moderator can do what he wants.  The "governing
> body
> of fidonet supervisors" in bunk.
They are? Funny, I have run across a few of them.... They hold a lot
more power than you might suspect. Oh well, this digresses from the real
point of my reply.

>
> > HUH?If you were banned from that echo, then he has no reason to contact
> > your sysop,
> > except for any follow-up actions required (like ban-evasion and
> > confirmation).
> > Your sheet has holes in it John. I saw right through that little "story".
>
> He did, would you like to see a copy of the message sent to him from
> Cheek?
Does it include the complete header info (like tame/date stamp)? I f you
send it to me, I will be more than willing to confirm the authenticity
of the document..... I would be real interested in what the author of
that letter would have to say.

ACF _ Always confirm facts (you never know when a lie will try to sneak
through).




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:32 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 03:29:23 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Actually, I think you should follow your own advice.
>
Again, with the cheap shoys.... I have no idea why I even bother to
argue with an individual whoes stubborness is like butting a head
against armor plate....

>
> You are right, it is not a coincidence because that has not happened
> at all.  I have been on this NG since last February.  No
> problems arose until Dick Kendrick and then YOU.  started attacking.
> Even [e-mail] said I was not a problem.  You are to new to
> the NG to know apparently.  (by your own admission, you came onto
> this NG only a few weeks after this started!)
I came in as an active poster, john. I have been reading (and gathering
info) for about 8 months and you didn't really post mych at all (until
recently). Funny how that works out, isn't it? My own admission only
applies to those actaul postings that I made.

> I would also like to know where you are getting your figures from also
> since
> Dejanews disagrees with you.
Prove it!

>
> > I spelled it that was for a reason! It's not just an attitude, its an
> > ASSitude!
>
> According to the dictionary it is not a word.
> Are you into baby talk or something?
Some of the newest words aren't yet in YOUR dictionary, John (I see you
are still using the Websters new world dictionary from 1956). I combined
2 words my subsituting 2 letters. Assitude applies to you as you are an
ass with an attitude.
>
> > week? That and your attacks on others leaves a real bad taste in my
> > mouth!
>
> Then leave, no one is making you stay.
You are, just by posting stupidity.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:33 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 03:31:20 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen wrote:
>
> > Oh? Care to look in the mirror and repeat that?
>
> Yea, I could do that.  Compared to you I have about three times as
> long as a licensed amateur radio operator.
Funny, you still behave like a juvinile.
>
>
> Good, please go do them.
I will, as soon as you stop begging me to reappear.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:34 1997
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From: Timothy Haller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 08:34:44 -0500
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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On 22 Dec 1996, Jacqueline Herman wrote:

>
> Tim, please take the time to read FIFTY YEARS OF ARRL (written in 1965, but
> now on its 3rd printing; $4), and 200 METERS & DOWN ($5), for gaining an
> important perspective on what the ARRL has done for amateur radio the last
> 80 years. Simply put, without the ARRL fighting on behalf of ham radio all
> these decades, our hobby/service wouldn't exist today as we know it.
>
> Newsgroup New Year's resolution: Before forming an opinion on a particular
> topic let's first take the time to do a thorough research on that subject,
> and cite references so as to back up our assertions in a convincing manner.
>
> 73 from snowy Nevada (and missing Hawaii *very* much),
> Jeff KH2PZ / 7
>
>
Jeff i read it and i am taking back my early remarks about it.












Timothy Haller
[e-mail]
He pushes his his
fists and still in-
sists he sees the
ghosts.
 from stephen king`s
book It



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:36 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Blocking ham/cb interference on stereo equipment?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <59jrfq$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 14:47:20 GMT
Lines: 55

In article <59jrfq$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kingfish) wr
ites:
>A neighbor of mine has a ham or cb radio, and his transmissions come
>out over my stereo, telephone, clock radio - anything with a speaker.
>The FCC won't do anything about it.

Yeah, and that's a pity. The FCC has the authority to set RFI susceptability
standards, but they refuse to do so. So the makers of consumer electronics
continue to save a few cents by leaving out the filtering their equipment
needs to avoid becoming a radio receiver. You didn't buy your phone to be
a shortwave receiver and you didn't buy your TV or stereo to be a shortwave
receiver either. But that's what they've become because the manufacturers
were too cheap to build them right. You can fix them, and it usually doesn't
cost much, nor is it hard to do, but you shouldn't have to do it. The
manufacturers should be made to do it right the first time.

>I know there are filters you can put on your telephone to block some
>of the interference.  Is there anything like that for stereo
>equipment?

Yes. There are three basic ways RF gets into stereo equipment. The
most common way is via the speaker leads. These act like an antenna
at frequencies where hams and CBers operate. The signal goes *in*
the stereo outputs, gets rectified into audio and that comes back
out to the speakers. If you wind the speaker leads a few times through
a ferrite core, this will usually stop the problem. In stubborn cases
you may need to bypass the stereo's output terminals with 0.001 uf
disc ceramic capacitors too.

The second main way the RF signal can get into the stereo is via
the power cord. Again you can wind the cord around a ferrite to
stop this. Don't try adding capacitors to the power lead unless
you are skilled in such work. Do this wrong and you can get hurt.
The ferrite choke usually is enough.

The third way the signal may get in is via the signal wires from
other components of the system. Make sure all these cables are
shielded, and that the connections are clean and oxide free. A
product called Cramolin can be used on the connectors to prevent
them from oxidizing again. This is usually all you have to do to
stop signal ingress from this source. You can usually tell if
this is a problem because the interference level will change
with changes to the volume control setting of the stereo. The
other two ways signal can get in usually aren't affected by
volume control settings.

The ARRL has a book about RFI, its causes and cures. It might be
worthwhile for you to get a copy and learn how to deal with these
problems. You can order it from their website, www.arrl.org.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:38 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Ham Transceiver or SW Comm Receiver which has a better receiver
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 14:57:38 GMT
Lines: 28

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (
DONHAR777) writes:
>I am interested in getting into Shortwave listing and maybe ham radio.  I
>will be purchasing a radio in the next few days.  I have a question can
>someone tell me what would have a better receiver, a Ham transceiver such
>as a Kenwood TS 850S or a TS 450S verses pure Communications receivers
>made by Kenwood or Sony or Grundig etc.
>
>Primarily I would like to listen to the Ham Bands and then Shortwave
>radio.  I have no intention to transmit until I get my license probably in
>6-12 months.  So can someone help me out and let me know which would have
>a better RECEIVER.

In general, the ham transceivers will have better all around receivers
than the SW receivers. Shortwave receivers are generally optimized for
listening to AM shortwave broadcasts, and don't always perform very well
for monitoring other services. Those pure receivers which might be better,
like the Drake R8, cost nearly as much as a transceiver. So if you think
you will get a ham ticket down the road, you'll save some money by going
ahead and getting a ham radio now. Not all ham transceivers are good
shortwave broadcasting receivers, however, but many of them are. Shop
carefully and you won't be disappointed.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:40 1997
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From: [e-mail] (UTILITYNAM)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: The Complete RF TECHNICIAN'S Handbook
Date: 23 Dec 1996 15:00:03 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]


--------------------------------------------------------------------
THE COMPLETE RF TECHNICIAN'S HANDBOOK
--------------------------------------------------------------------
(Published by Howard W. Sams, Inc.)

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communication's beginner, student, or experienced technician, and supplies
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advanced concepts vital to a successful career in RF communications.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------
***Included are over 400 informative ILLUSTRATIONS and tables***
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------

The handbook includes everything a technician needs to know in real-world
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explanations of modern ANALOG and DIGITAL RADIO circuits and modulation
methods. Furthermore, operational instructions on RF TEST EQUIPMENT, as
well as identifying proper and improper signal waveforms, and AM, FM, PM,
and SSB theory are included. In addition, transmitter and receiver testing
methods and TROUBLESHOOTING TECHNIQUES are solidly covered.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------
For Further Information Please View the Web Site at:
http://members.aol.com/COTTERSAY/rftech.htm




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:41 1997
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From: Andrew C Robertson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Elmer
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 10:57:28 -0500
Organization: The Negative Energy Laboratory
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Burt Fisher wrote:
> Andrew C Robertson wrote:
> >
> > Please do not judge hams based on your denied self-hatred.
>
> HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI [etc.]

I rest my case.

drewbob


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:42 1997
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From: Jim Cummings <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 08:48:42 -0800
Organization: The Communications Research Centre
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59g8nj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ijif$2s4$[e-mail]> <59j8oq$9l8$[e-mail]>
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Paul J. Piercey wrote:
>
> In article <59ijif$2s4$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (D. Holford) wr
ote:
> >>
> >>What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band?
> >>
> >>80M BAND
> >>
> >>CW    3.500-3.725
> >>RTTY  3.600-3.645
> >>SSB   3.725-4.000
> >>SSTV  3.840-3.850
> >>--
> >>Murray Cotnam (Sudbury,Ontario,Canada)
> >>
> >>AMATEUR RADIO CALLSIGN:       VE3MCN
> >
> >
> >Truly amazing. I really thought that Canadian Amateurs were required to kno
w
> >the frequency allocations.
> >There are NO sub-bands allocated in Canada. Only MAXIMUM allowable bandwidt
hs.
>
> Not true.

In contradiction to Piercey's viewpoint, Holford's statements sums it up
entirely.


> Bandwidth is allocated by international agreement and is federally
> regulated.

If Bandwidth is allocated by international agreement in the amateur bands,
would Piercey be kind enough to state what agreement that is?  If I may be so
bold to state that there is no such agreement (other than to
designate a particulate amateur allocation as a maximum usuable
bandwidth, which has been done in the bands above 70 cm.)  However, Piercy is
quite correct that the bandwidth restrictions are federally regulated.

73 and live better digitally
Jim, VE3XJ


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!194.87.0.28!demos!demos2!dnews-server
From: "Borovikov" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAMshack for Windows SORRY:
Date: 23 Dec 1996 16:57:53 GMT
Organization: Balti-N
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <01bbf0ef$44b23400$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: balti-n.estpak.ee
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

> HAMshack for Windows on http://www.balti-n.estpak.ee/hamshack
> Log, Rig control (only KENWOOD now), TNC, Awards, Contests, full Prefix
> database, QSL  print.

Sorry, but Netscape 3.0 can't got this file from error our server.
Now all OK.

You are able to get it from ftp://ftp.estpak.ee/pub/hamshack too.

____________
      Vitali Borovikov
     Balti-n.Ltd
     [e-mail]






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:44 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 09:35:26 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 14
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]> <59krpb$[e-mail]>
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In article <59krpb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
wrote:
>It is only compelling to the ARRL...if the ARRL board wants to
>accept it.  It is NOT compelling in any technical manner as a means
>to justify an international treaty requirement.

What is interesting, of course, is that if the survey had come out in favor
of no-code HF, it would have been pointed to as the ultimate "word of the
people" that the ARRL wouldn't dare disregard.

It's amazing to see how the respect for a given poll differs with the
results of that poll.  ::chuckle::
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:45 1997
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From: Michael Kassay <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Help: Heathkit WX Stn
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 10:29:33 -0800
Organization: Sympatico
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp2893.on.sympatico.ca
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Hi.. I just purchased a unbuilt heathkit ID-5001b weather station.  The kit th
at I
purchased had been opened some time ago and a few parts have gone a stray..

  Can anyone advise where, If possible where I can obtain any parts and/or pos
sibly
purchase any of the options. Better yet have any schematics so I can build the
m?

  Any help would be appreciated..

thks

Mike

VE3MKX


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:46 1997
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From: Ed Hare <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 23 Dec 1996 18:34:17 GMT
Organization: American Radio Relay League, Inc.
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <59mjb9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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To: [e-mail]

Eric Oyen <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I too also agree with dave. I have some reservations about the ARRL,
>though. It is my impression that they don't listen much to the largest
>growing population in amateur radio: the Technician no-coder.
>Unfortunately, because of this lack of attention, the arrl suffers. If
>they would pay a little more attention to our concerns, they would be a
>much better organization for it.

>Eric.

I am curious on what basis you are making that statement?  Is this based
on any particular set of circumstances or does it represent what you have
heard in general terms?

From what I have seen here at ARRL HQ, we do very much care about the
needs and concerns of the newcomer (translate: Technician class, with or
without HF endorsement).  Several years back, we added the "New Ham
Companion" section of QST, basic articles aimed at the large influx of
new hams (many of whom are no-code Technicians).  We have reviewed many
of our potential books and articles with an eye to whether they meet the
needs of the new ham.  Most of our spectrum-preservation activities have
been centered on VHF and up -- the frequencies under the most pressure.

From my experiences at conventions, seeing the interaction of the ARRL
Board members and the membership, it is mostly the HF ops who do express
their concerns to the ARRL.  I urge you to express those concerns to your
Division Director. They rely heavily on the direct input from ARRL
Members and potential members as they make the policy decisions that set
the course of ARRL. The Directors I have met seem to all want to hear
more from newcomers and we all would like to see them become more part of
the process.

73 from ARRL HQ,
Ed Hare, KA1CV,
ARRL Lab Supervisor





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:47 1997
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From: Will White <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 12:00:03 -0700
Organization: Beelzebub's Drive-Thru Pain Clinic
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59kt5j$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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This thread is amazing. Courtesy seems to be reserved for the
airwaves, not the net. Of all the groups for a flame war, this is
probably the least appropriate. Just a thought. . .

--Will


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:48 1997
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From: Larry or David Gibbs <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 11:34:16 -0800
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net> <[e-mail]> <59kcdo$[e-mail]>
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Yes, the noise
> blanker leaves a lot to be desired, but I've not seen any other
> blankers in rigs this price range that were any better..

The Kenwood TS-50 noise blanker works, and the Ten-Tec Scout blanker
is superb. The other blankers are ineffective, save the mediocre one
in the Icom 706, according to QST reviews.

Larry W3UIO


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:49 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB101 Dave Coons, WT8W, is new Great Lakes Vice Director
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 23 Dec 1996 14:49:36 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 46
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12437 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121516


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB101
ARLB101 Dave Coons, WT8W, is new Great Lakes Vice Director

ZCZC AG81
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 101  ARLB101
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 23, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB101
ARLB101 Dave Coons, WT8W, is new Great Lakes Vice Director

Dave Coons, WT8W, is new Great Lakes Vice Director

ARRL President Rod Stafford, KB6ZV, has appointed Dave Coons, WT8W,
of New Carlisle, Ohio, as the new Vice Director of the Great Lakes
Division.  The appointment is effective immediately.  Coons replaces
John Thernes, W4ZN, who recently resigned to devote full time to
graduate studies.

Coons, 65, is a former US Postal Service employee and served for 12
years as postmaster in Miamisburg, Ohio, before retiring in 1989.
During his stint in the US Navy in the late 1940s and early 1950s,
Coons taught CW aboard ship.  He's been a ham and a League member
since 1963.  ''It's been a great hobby throughout all these years,''
said Coons, adding that he was ''pleased and honored to be asked'' to
serve as a vice director.

Coons is deeply involved in ham radio activities.  He's served as a
volunteer examiner since 1989, is a past president (two years), vice
president and secretary of the Dayton Amateur Radio Association
(DARA) and has taught for the past 16 sessions at the HANDI-HAM's
Camp Courage.  This year at the Dayton Hamvention, he'll chair the
communication group.  He enjoys CW, is a sysop for a packet node and
participates in several HF nets.

Coons said his wife, Rita, supports and encourages his involvement
in ham radio.  He said he looks upon his appointment as vice
director as ''a great opportunity'' to expand on that involvement.

Dave Coons' address is 932 Hedwick St, New Carlisle, OH 45344,
telephone [phone], e-mail WT8W (at) arrl.org.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:50 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 23 Dec 1996 20:33:01 GMT
Organization: DigiPhone Corporation, Bryan/College Station Texas 409-693-8885
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <59mq9t$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59jotd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr15s2.myriad.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33125 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121514 alt.engineering.electrical:10448

In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Coffma
n) writes:
>In article <59jotd$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>>In <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Gary Coff
man) writes:
>[snip]

>Yeah, I'm aware of that. However that effect is mostly of interest
>when you are monitoring a distant stroke. Its relevance to what
>happens to a struck tower or other structure is about equivalent
>to worrying about what frequency the exciter was on when the PA
>arced over. In other words, the frequencies the tower structure
>sees are completely dominated by the pulse shape of the proximate
>impulse. That lasts about 2 uS, so oscillations further up the
>bolt don't have a chance to propagate to the tower in any event.

Which is EXACTLY what we were doing when I helped build the first
sferics strike monitor device at Texas A&M back in about '61 or '62,
as I have forgotten the exact year without looking it up...

>Ah, understood. I don't believe such bonding does any harm, but it
>doesn't do much good on a short tower either. Rigid line gets tied...

>I haven't any evidence that causes problems.
>
>Gary

Nor I.  The entire WTAW-FM 1-1/2" Andrew hard line was bonded to the
main shunt fed tower going up tower accordingly.

I did that job.  I didn't do the one up at our sister station in Lufkin.  That

one was hit three times on the power lines.  Twice the station was totally
destroyed by power line hits that went into the facility.  The insurance
company paid off twice on the equipment re-installation.

However, just like a beer joint that burns in Texas, the third time it goes up

in flames the Liquor Control Board will *NOT* renew the license at the same
physical site.  I learned that from a girl friend of mine whose uncle ran a
dance hall in Cut and Shoot, Texas..

    <Huge temperance engine grin widely from ear to ear>

The third time Dr. Zeus came to visit the Lufkin station, it actually set fire

to the place as well and burned it to the ground.

Insurance company refused to pay, so I am told, and it went dark.

It was a country site installation..

    <Huge temperance engine grin from ear to ear>

//-----------------------------
Mike - W5WQN
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 14:47:45 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59mf7d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> Eric, I think someone mentioned that not very many no code techs have
> joined the ARRL.  Put you checkbook where your concerns are, and I am
> sure they will be more willing to listen.
>
> 73, Jim KH2D
Already have. I'll look at rejoining this spring.I have already heard
from a rep in the arrl by e-mail and given him some additional details
regarding recent events occurring here in Phoenix.

Thanks for the friendly advice, thoough. I am trying to convince other
"no-coders" in my area to join up as well. If we can get a large portoin
of that population to join, it might make the ARRL an even stronger
force for the ham community in general.

Also, with regard to the code/no-code arguement, I don't wish to see
morse code go the way of the dodo. I am concenred that if morse code
does disappear, we may lose a valuable piece on knowlege.

Eric.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!ais.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 23 Dec 1996 21:54:09 GMT
Organization: American Information Systems, Inc.
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <59mv21$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fpqe$[e-mail]> <59i8mr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121515 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44576 rec.radio.shortwave:91002

In <59i8mr$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) writ
es:
>[e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force) wrote:
>
>>In article <[e-mail]>,
>>   Rush Johnson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>As we slowly take away the significant things from Amateur Radio that
>>>create a sense of shared identity, a sense of community  (like the CW
>>>requirement, or homebrewing equipment), we start to lose those things
>>>that keep us "bonded", that keep us comiserating (!), that keep us
>>>mutually  respectful of each others' committment to the hobby.
>
>>We don't have a sense of community about the CW requirement.
>
>Certainly we do. At least amongst those of us who use it we do.
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>

That's the point that Andy was making ... the code requirement is THE
SINGLE most devisive thing in ham radio ... you beepers see it as a way
to maintain some false, self-deluding, self-image of superiority and
eletism and use it as a way to keep others out ... you can't stand the
idea of dropping the code requirement, 'cause  that's the ONLY thing
that you have to make you feel superior to others ... to admit the code
is irrelevant would be to admit that YOU are irrelevant in today's
technically advanced world.

You beepers just can't face the truth ...

Carl - wa6vse
[e-mail]






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:54 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 14:58:18 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59kt5j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Will White wrote:
>
> This thread is amazing. Courtesy seems to be reserved for the
> airwaves, not the net. Of all the groups for a flame war, this is
> probably the least appropriate. Just a thought. . .
>
> --Will
Will,
Good point! However, have you listen to the HF bands lately? Try
listening in on 7259 KHZ or 14,313KHZ. there are subjects discussed with
such colorful language as to make a 30 vet in the navy blush!

Even then, that is not as bad as what some of the local members do on
the 146.540 simplex frequency here in Phoenix. I am talking about lack
of I.D., use of foul language (every 4th word or so) and explicit
desriptions of subject matter best left to the porno tapes found in some
bookstores.

You do make a good point though and I do appreciate it.

Thanks.

Eric Oyen



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:55 1997
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From: [e-mail] (John Norton)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Adjustable Corner Computer Workstation Plans
Date: 23 Dec 1996 22:09:44 GMT
Organization: NileNet, Ltd.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <59mvv8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ra.nilenet.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

I designed an adjustable computer desk and now have a set of plans
available.  The desk (including two bookend style desktop shelves)
is built from a single sheet of 3/4" plywood with no wasted wood.
It might work out as an ideal platform for limited DX'ing.  It has
just over 10 square feet of surface area.

It is a ten year old design that has been updated frequently and
extensively tested.  I think it's a perfect desk for study, computer,
hobby, etc.; however, I am prejudiced on this matter!

If you would like a free copy of the plans, then please e-mail me your
snail mail address or write to me at my snail mail address below.  I
mail out the plans free.  I ask only that if you build and enjoy the
desk, then you send me a small payment (whatever you think that it's
worth to you - small!).  This will help me continue to mail the plans
out to individuals, schools, etc.

.........................
[e-mail]
   -- (N5PWS) --

John Norton
P.O. Box 440146
Aurora, CO  80044


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:57 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Dave Krieps)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 22:33:58 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fpqe$[e-mail]> <59i8mr$[e-mail]> <59mv21$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.34.96
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Carl,

  You are truly mislead.  The only reason the "beepers" would like to
maintain the code is that it might prevent the HAM band from becoming
the new CB band.  The presumption is that if you take the time to
learn the code, you may truly be interested in the hobby.

  If you don't think that is the case, listen on 2 meters sometime.  A
number of the no-code licensees are turning that into a zoo.  Many of
the repeaters are turning to closed status just to filter out the junk
and abuse.  Sure, there are licensed HAMs that abuse any band, but the
frequency of abuse seems higher where the no-coders play.  To be sure,
there are many responsible no-coders, but the one-day-crash-courses
are bringing all manner of abusers in as well.

  Perhaps the technology is changing and Morse code may even be an
anachronism, but it tends to exert a Darwinian-like control on the
operators.  In other words, it keeps a lot of idiots out; not all mind
you.

  In truth, people like yourself are the ones causing the
divisiveness.  All of the "elitist" labels and name calling are the
real cause of the animosity.  You might try to see the issue from
someone elses shoes and then work within the system to make the
changes you seem to think so important.

Happy Holidays.

Dave Krieps

On 23 Dec 1996 21:54:09 GMT, [e-mail] wrote:

<snip>
> the code requirement is THE
>SINGLE most devisive thing in ham radio ... you beepers see it as a way
>to maintain some false, self-deluding, self-image of superiority and
>eletism and use it as a way to keep others out ... you can't stand the
>idea of dropping the code requirement, 'cause  that's the ONLY thing
>that you have to make you feel superior to others ... to admit the code
>is irrelevant would be to admit that YOU are irrelevant in today's
>technically advanced world.
>
>You beepers just can't face the truth ...
>
>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]
>
>
>
>



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Len Winkler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: CW req. foes...PHONE in and say why!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 22:44:47 GMT
Organization: Ham Radio & More SHow
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59n24k$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts21-3.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121512 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44572 rec.radio.shortwave:90997

This sunday, 12-29-96, it's time for CW requirement foes, ONLY, to
call into the Ham Radio & More Show and voice your opinions
for up to 90 seconds, without any interruptions from the host.
Last week, 23 callers voiced their praise of the requirement staying;
so now is your chance to say your piece. A copy of both shows will
be sent to Bill Pasternak of Newsline and the ARRL, so they can hear
what people really have to say.
The toll free call-in line for this show is 1-800-293-5366, open at
5:55pm ET (2255utc).
Show information is below.
Len Winkler, KB7LPW                        [e-mail]
P.O. Box 9219                                         [e-mail]
Phoenix, AZ. 85068-9219                  ARIZONA ARRL PIC

Ham Radio & More Show info at:
http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/hrm.htm
http://www.tapr.org/hrm  (RealAudio site to hear past shows) (Thanks TAPR)

The Ham Radio & More Show airs LIVE each Sunday at 6:00pm ET,
(2300utc), on many local commercial stations throughout the country.
ALSO: LIVE on WWCR Shortwave, 5.070mhz.
ALSO: LIVE on RealAudio at: http://www.AudioNet.com/radio/business/kbnp (Thank
s KBNP)

Also available tape delayed via WWCR Shortwave on Mondays,
at 1000utc on 3.210mhz, and Sundays at 0600utc on 5.070mhz.

Support "WOG", the Written Only General!
WOG info at http://www.goodnet.com/~lenwink/wog.htm



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:07:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.iarc.com!cpk-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!163.181.251.1!news2.amd.com!txnntp.amd.com!not-for-mail
From: Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 18:13:33 -0600
Organization: AMD
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n58u$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ramulale.amd.com
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Doug Smith wrote:
> ...<SNIP>
> ...  True, there's less current available from a
> 240V circuit, but it only takes a few milliamps to kill.
>
> 73 Doug

Hmmm, in the UK, one can safely draw 13A from a normal flat pin 240V
outlet.  I do believe we are squarely in the 'academic' realm if we're
talking about how much current can be delivered into a human body at
120V/240V.

--
Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:01 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Larry AD3Y)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 24 Dec 1996 00:38:02 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 44
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59n8la$[e-mail]>
References: <59mv21$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wargrave.motown.lmco.com

Carl - wa6vse, [e-mail] wrote:

>That's the point that Andy was making ... the code requirement is THE
>SINGLE most devisive thing in ham radio ... you beepers see it as a way
>to maintain some false, self-deluding, self-image of superiority and
>eletism and use it as a way to keep others out ... you can't stand the
>idea of dropping the code requirement, 'cause  that's the ONLY thing
>that you have to make you feel superior to others ... to admit the code
>is irrelevant would be to admit that YOU are irrelevant in today's
>technically advanced world.


Because I am a CW user, you call me false, self-deluding, with a self-image
of superiority and elitism. Snap out of it. Take a pill, Call 911,

What are you talking about. The code is still relevant. Have you actually
listened to what is going on on 80/40/30/20m CW? I doubt it. There is plenty
of activity. It's still the simplest way to communicate and uses the simplest
circuits. It's pretty damn popular world wide. Eventually, it will go out like
AM did, with only a few users operating in the mode for nostagia purposes,
but not for quite a while.

As a CW user, and as a human being, I don't feel superior, better or more elit
e
that anyone else. You are the one with the superior elitist attitude. You
really can't stand it that even some 7yr olds can copy code better than you.
It really bothers you doesn't it? People without college degrees can copy CW,
more proficient than you. What a shame. Does it burn you up to picture Jim, ou
t
in Guam, running DX pile-ups, or Jeff sitting out in Hawaii with his homebrew
CW rig happily making contacts in a mode you can't understand? Does it bother
you that one of my favorite activities in the hobby is waiting for conditions
to
improve so I can contact Jim or Jeff, or whoever using my beep machine. It
sure looks that way. Your only a legend in your own mind. And calling other
people names is the only way you self-perpetuate that myth.

>You beepers just can't face the truth ...

And that's the truth. Beep Beep.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Larry Weissman AD3Y      |  All opinions expressed are my own and
Lockhhed Martin Corp.    |  in no way related to my company. All my
Moorestown, NJ   USA     |  designs are my companies and in no way
[e-mail] |  considered my own.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:02 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 00:40:57 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <59n8m0$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]> <59krpb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan1.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121510 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44568

[e-mail] (Dick Flanagan) wrote:

>In article <59krpb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
>wrote:
>>It is only compelling to the ARRL...if the ARRL board wants to
>>accept it.  It is NOT compelling in any technical manner as a means
>>to justify an international treaty requirement.

>What is interesting, of course, is that if the survey had come out in favor
>of no-code HF, it would have been pointed to as the ultimate "word of the
>people" that the ARRL wouldn't dare disregard.

>It's amazing to see how the respect for a given poll differs with the
>results of that poll.  ::chuckle::

Excuse me Dick, but just where do you see any disrespect in my
comment. I offered no disrespect for the poll, what I said
stands...the poll does not, in and of itself, constitute a compelling
technical reason to retain CW testing.

What this poll (and any other) does is provide an indication of
the OPINIONS (i.e. the political climate) of those being
polled.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 00:51:26 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <59n99m$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fpqe$[e-mail]> <59i8mr$[e-mail]> <59mv21$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan1.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121507 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44567 rec.radio.shortwave:90992

[e-mail] (Dave Krieps) wrote:

>Carl,

>  You are truly mislead.  The only reason the "beepers" would like to
>maintain the code is that it might prevent the HAM band from becoming
>the new CB band.  The presumption is that if you take the time to
>learn the code, you may truly be interested in the hobby.

God, how many times do we have to debuk that myth.  If CW
did as Dave suggests, we'd not have the some of the bozos
we do on HF now.

Additionally, the responsibility of testing is not to insure an
interest level...it is (or should be) to test for minimum
requirements consistent with the governments role in regulation.
Anything beyond that is for religions and clubs to take up.

>  If you don't think that is the case, listen on 2 meters sometime.  A
>number of the no-code licensees are turning that into a zoo.  Many of
>the repeaters are turning to closed status just to filter out the junk
>and abuse.  Sure, there are licensed HAMs that abuse any band, but the
>frequency of abuse seems higher where the no-coders play.  To be sure,
>there are many responsible no-coders, but the one-day-crash-courses
>are bringing all manner of abusers in as well.

Same old, same old.  I have a 2M mobile every day and I guess
we live in significantly different areas because there is no more
problem on 2M than anywhere else here in the TRI-state area
(NY,NJ,PA).

>  Perhaps the technology is changing and Morse code may even be an
>anachronism, but it tends to exert a Darwinian-like control on the
>operators.  In other words, it keeps a lot of idiots out; not all mind
>you.

Which is not the function of government testing.  Let's make
testing better, but relying on CW testing in this fashion
is avoiding the inevitable.

>  In truth, people like yourself are the ones causing the
>divisiveness.  All of the "elitist" labels and name calling are the
>real cause of the animosity.  You might try to see the issue from
>someone elses shoes and then work within the system to make the
>changes you seem to think so important.

Right, those that oppose CW testing should, for the good of ham radio,
just shut up and say nothing.  Sorry, I don't live my life that way.
And, just why do you suggest working within the system?  That IS
exactly what we are doing.  If you think otherwise, I look
forward to seeing your comments as to how/why we are NOT
working within the system.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: THE FINAL WORD
Lines: 11


W>Looks like you No-Coders Better start Studying if you want to get on
HF

Won't happen, it takes effort to study.  That doesn't happen in today's
"something for nothing mentality."

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Source for license statis
Lines: 9


F>Can anyone point me to a source for statistics on the current distribution o
f
 >US Amateur licenses?  How many Extras/Advanced/General/Tech+/Tech/Novice?

It is in the Radio Amateur Callbook (Flying Horse)

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: FILTER
Lines: 11


M>You need to read this newsgroup more carefully.  Many HAM OPERATORS seem
 >to swear by the outdated Morse requirements as a way to "keep the
 >riff-raff out."

It's not perfect, but it helps.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: 110 VS 220 Volts
Lines: 10


DK>Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
  >the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??

The wiring in your house can be of a smaller gauge with 220 volts.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail].
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: FILTER
Lines: 13


K>It does. We only have perhaps a couple hundred idiots on the HF bands
 >as opposed to the thousands that inhabit 11 meters. Plus, for instance,
 >we don't have Carl on HF. We can thank the CW requirement for that, if
 >nothing else.

It is not perfect, but it helps.  You're right though, without it we
would be much worse off.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: ALL
Subject: THE ARRL REPRESENTS ME NOW!
Lines: 21


W>The special committee created by the ARRL to study issues relating
 >to the 1999 World Radiocommunication Conference (WRC-99) has
 >recommended that the ARRL Board of Directors not support changing
 >the treaty requirement for Morse code testing to operate below 30
 >MHz.  The committee submitted its final report to the ARRL Board
 >this week.

W>The committee report contains recommended ARRL positions regarding
 >possible changes in Article S25 of the international radio
 >regulations.  Consistent with the results of a survey of ARRL
 >members, the committee recommended no change in the existing treaty
 >obligation that administrations test prospective amateur licensees
 >on their Morse code ability before authorizing them to operate below
 >30 MHz.  The committee did support changes to Article S25 that
 >would:

Finally, I can say that the ARRL represents me!
---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake
Lines: 19


C>I've seen this written down anywhere, but it seems to me that 100 W output
 >just doesn't cut it on 80/40/20 meter SSB.

Probably all over, it's the truth.

C>Also, lately, I've actually
 >found some groups on 80M where I wasn't either ignored or verbally abused.
 >Has HF been toning down a bit lately?   It doesn't seem all as bad as I
 >remember or as people complain here.

Where's that?  Oh, you'd probably don't want to say for fear that people
will go over there and trash it; don't blame you.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]


--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 24 Dec 96 01:15:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Where are all the HAM
Lines: 21


C>when i lived in rural south jersey, my friends and i had a "secret
 >frequency" we used for simplex chattering. i'd moniter that and the local
 >repeater. well, a year ago i moved to philadelphia and some of my old
 >friends were going to meet me in the city. i said "i'll be on the old
 >secret frequency." well, wouldn't you know it, when i turned on the
 >radio, someone _else_ was using the simplex frequency. after a while one
 >of my friends came on, called for me and i said "let's move up 40khz and
 >i'll catch you there", well, amazingly enough, there was someone on
 >_that_ simplex frequency too. after that, i started looking for simplex
 >frequencies, just leaving my radio on all the time tuned to a frequency,
 >and i've _yet_ to find one that people don't talk on from time to time.
 >it's quite a jump from rural new jersey to metropolitin  whatever.

Have you tried 222 MHz?  It's quite but there's always someone on the
repeaters.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "Doug Robbins" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 24 Dec 1996 01:35:52 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <01bbf13a$e1327c40$e20292cf@globalyst-630>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n58u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.2.226
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Unfortunately,  most of those who believed that
a 240V circuit was less dangerous than a 120V
circuit are no longer able to share their views here.

73 de Doug - W2DR


Doug Smith <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<59n58u$[e-mail]>...
> [e-mail] (James Aeschliman) wrote:
> >>I've heard it argued that 220-240 V at 50 Hz is no more, and perhaps
less,
> >>dangerous to humans than 120 V 60 Hz.  Apparently 60 Hz is a bad choice
> >>of frequency because it easily causes fibrillation in the heart muscle,
> >>while 50 Hz is less likely to.  So even though your body draws twice
> >I've heard this too, but I read it in an article.  It's probably
correct.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.telalink.net!telalink!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Doug Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 01:44:26 GMT
Organization: Telalink Corporation, Nashville, TN, USA
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59n58u$[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.181.132.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (James Aeschliman) wrote:
>>I've heard it argued that 220-240 V at 50 Hz is no more, and perhaps less,
>>dangerous to humans than 120 V 60 Hz.  Apparently 60 Hz is a bad choice
>>of frequency because it easily causes fibrillation in the heart muscle,
>>while 50 Hz is less likely to.  So even though your body draws twice
>I've heard this too, but I read it in an article.  It's probably correct.

Hmmm.  First I've heard of that, but I suppose possible.

Something else I've heard suggested is that the more violent
involuntary reaction of the muscles to the higher voltage is more
likely to throw you clear of the high voltage.  Don't intend to test
it either way, I've already tried 400V DC<g>..

>But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current is
>less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
>the current that kills, not the voltage.

But if the load stays the same (and from what I read, the resistance
of the human body is more or less constant), then the current doubles
at the higher voltage.  True, there's less current available from a
240V circuit, but it only takes a few milliamps to kill.

73 Doug




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.iarc.com!cpk-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!mr.net!news.mid.net!news.sdsmt.edu!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.telalink.net!telalink!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Doug Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 01:47:28 GMT
Organization: Telalink Corporation, Nashville, TN, USA
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <59n5ek$[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.181.132.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold") wrote:
>> At 110Vac it takes approx .5 amps to be fatal.
>I would hazzard the guess (or is that guess the hazzard?) that the
>path of the current through you is material to the degree of danger.

Absolutely, and over the more fatal paths (through the chest) it takes
a lot less than 1/2 amp.  Someone else cited 30mA, and that figure
sounds right to me.

73 Doug




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!news.he.net!nr1.scn.co.jp!news02.so-net.or.jp!news01.so-net.or.jp!sinfony-news01!tokyonet.ad.jp!tokyonet.ad.jp!terra!usenet
From: [e-mail]@big.or.jp
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ALL JA  EMAIL CALLBOOK PROJECT
Date: 24 Dec 1996 01:51:04 GMT
Organization: TERRA NET
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <59ncu8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.183.23.131
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

Now ALL JA  EMAIL CALLBOOK PROJECT has been just started!!

URL is http://www.big.or.jp/~jh4phw/pubhtml/emails.html

Please access and add your email.

73 de JH4PHW Shiro Sakai


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.magicnet.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!usenet
From: Megan Quattrocchi <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 18:09:52 -0800
Organization: CGS Testing.com
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: h96-126.ccnet.com
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

> I agree.  The answer is for that "largest growing population" to flex its
> collective muscle by joining the ARRL and electing Directors who pledge to
> support their needs and desires.  Again, change from within an organization
> is much easier than from without.

You know, I just wish the ARRL could be more like a big version of
TAPR.  Like the TAPR web sight has so much cool stuff on it.  Some of
the stuff is fun and some has some real engineering balls.  Why can't
ARRL be making group purchases of DSP kits and stuff?  Is it the
proximity to Texas Instruments that's going on here or something?

Perhaps the 'democracy' aspect of ARRL means it will never really be the
leader in these things. So, old patterns of operating get a constituency
that prevents change.  I mean, I figure we'll have VHF bands full of
private repeaters that are used maybe 1hr per month until I'm old and
dead -- however silly this is technologically.  On the other hand,
there's no constituency for a mode that doesn't exist yet.

Btw, what do you guys think of the latest handbooks.  Didn't older
versions have index marks on the end of the paper so you could find
stuff?  Maybe I'm confused. Personally, I think it'd be a better read to
have the projects at the beginning of the chapter, and then explain all
the theory afterwards.  I do still enjoy looking at projects like the
big power 2M amplifiers and stuff.  Even though I'd be way scared of
cooking myself with such a beast.

I'll probably end up joining the ARRL eventually, as I'm getting back
into ham radio stuff.  I think my first check is going to Amsat, mainly
cuz' they seem to be pretty goal oriented, and short of cash lately.

Cathryn (kd6dsc)  reply to [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:18 1997
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From: "H. Mark Nadel" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Long Island New York Hamfest
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 19:41:28 -0800
Organization: R.A.D.I.O. inc.   http://www.islandlink.com/radio/radio.htm
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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HAMFEST  HAMFEST   HAMFEST   HAMFEST   HAMFEST   HAMFEST   HAMFEST
--


======================================================
Amateur Radio Station   W 2 O T  -   (formerly  NK2T)
"Always Available Through Technology..."


Levittown, New York  U.S.A.
50th anniversary 1947 - 1997

======================================================

--------------6A4E7F61509
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The Long Island Mobile Amateur Radio Club is please to Invite you to our Winte
r 1997
HAMFEST on Sunday February 16, 1997.

Loaction:
          The New York State Armory
          63 Babylon Turnpike
          Freeport, Long Island,  New York

Time:
          9:00 am - 2:00 pm General Public
          Doors Open at 7:00 am for Sellers

Admission Fee:
          $6.00 general Admission

          $25.00 / 6ft table (LIMARC Supplied) for vendors

Contact:
          Send all checks ( made out to LIMARC)
          To: Mark Nadel, W2OT
                22 Springtime Lane East
                Levittown, New York 11756-4419



Additional Info:

          -    Call the LIMARC Information Line 24 hrs/day at 516-520-9311.
          -    There will no amateur radio exams given the day of the hamfest.
          -    All Reservations for tables MUST be in advance, No tables will
be sold
                the day of the hamfest.

--------------6A4E7F61509--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:19 1997
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From: Dana Yeomans <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 22:41:56 -0500
Organization: Intergate, Inc.
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hi there, 75 meters sounds like a zoo now, chanel 19 is a church compaired
to 75 meters. happy holidays from n4pge in griffin, georgia.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:20 1997
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From: Dana Yeomans <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 22:44:35 -0500
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the ham bands sounds like the cb band now, look at all the truck drivers
on 2 meters. i put my repeater on p-l because of them.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:21 1997
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From: Ken Wells <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Realistic WX alert radio mods??
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 22:49:58 -0500
Organization: InterSource, Bloomington, IN
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The NWS WX receiver uses a 1050 Hz tone to activate.  S-Com repeater
controllers are easily set up to send this frequency tone.  I have thought
about doing the same conversion here in Paoli, IN.  But so far have not
had enough takers in the club.

73 de Ken - NM9P

[e-mail]



On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Michael Black wrote:

> While you have that receiver open, can you give us any details of what's
> inside?  Years ago, I had a Radio Shack weather receiver, and it amounted
> to a FM BCB receiver, moved to the weather channel.  It was varactor
> tuned, and went to a 10.7MHz if.  The filtering there was only IF
> transformers, no ceramic filters.
>
> I had assumed that the weather receivers of today were a fancier design.
> But I bought some scrap hand held CB sets recently for parts, and their
> built in weather receivers had a single conversion design, and the crystal
> does not translate to any standard IF frequency. I need to do some more
> calculating to figure out what's going on.
>
> Is there a second conversion in that weather receiver?  You should be
> able to uncover that information by looking for a second crystal elsewhere
> on the circuit board.
>
> Are there any ceramic filters?  If the circuit fits the usual pattern,
> there'd be one at 10.7MHz (maybe marked with that number), which might
> look like a ceramic capacitor except it has three leads.  Then maybe
> there'd be another filter, in a square plastic package maybe, most likely
> running at 455KHz.  I have no idea whether this presumption is valid, but
> if it's a good quality receiver, then it probably would be double
> conversion 10.7MHz/455KHz and most likely at this date uses an IC
> for the IF strip, if not for the whole receiver.
>
> This information would be useful to others.  If the circuit is double
> conversion and uses ceramic filters, then they are well worth converting
> to 2M use, and would provide a cheap means of getting a 2M monitoring
> receiver, which many seem to desire.
>
> If it's a much simpler circuit, it still might be useful in some cases,
> but less so and not something that I'd spend much money on.
>
>      Michael  VE2BVW
>
>
>
>  In article <petrocjw-1812961553150001@192.168.1.2>, [e-mail].
edu (Joe Petrocy) says:
>  >
>  >   Just wondering if anyone has a good idea on how to mod a Realistic WX
>  >alert radio model 12-140. It seems to use one crystal as a reference for
>  >the 3 WX service frequencies. I would like to know if I could drop a
>  >crystal in there to reference something in the 147.00MHz range so I could
>  >tune it to rx 147.060 and others in the area. I am also curious what the
>  >tones are that actually set off the alarm. I would like to set it to go
>  >off if someone does a long-tone zero on our repeater. If I knew what the
>  >tones were that set it off, I could program our repeater controler to emit
>  >those tones after a LTZ.
>
>
>



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!not-for-mail
From: "mttly1" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: 24 Dec 1996 03:59:51 GMT
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup28.clinton.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

  Gentlemen;

        Myself not being a ham have been reading the pros and the cons of
the discussions and also keeping up with the technologies that are
unfolding every week it seems in the world of radio. And I find myself
siding with the no code. Stop and take a look around at the advances in the
equipment that is now on the market and the equipment that is on the
drawing boards. Morse code was devised at a time when the equipment was
nowhere near the caliber of what is avalible today. Most of you who are
advanced class or extra class have been into the hobby for how long. I feel
as though if you could you would want the hobby to die out with you when
you die.Is that fair to all who could and would like to be able to partake
of this fascinating hobby to be put down and out because of a few people
that think because they had to when they started everybody else has to and
if they can't tough. Or if they go and pass a no code test restrict them to
a certain set of frequencies. How selfish can you get. I often wonder how
many of the young today would find this a really neat hobby instead of
gangs or drugs or whatever. You sit back and say to yourself rightoues self
that you had to so every body else has to and because of that attitude some
very brilliant young minds are lost to your hobby . You  say to yourself
that your ranks are thinning and don't know what to do. How about opening
the door to all who have the knowledge and the desire to carry on the hobby
and not trip them up with something so archaeic and antiquated as morse
code. I know that you antiques of the airwaves will come up with all sorts
of comebacks and reasons not to do away with the nonsense but do any of you
have the guts to come up with reasons to do away with outdated ways and
open the door to all who want to pursue the hobby without having to try and
learn something that in 2 years or less will be nothing more than history.
     If not , when all of you who cling to the "old ways " finally die off
then the hobby can be brought up to date and the minds that have been
passed over can finally be allowed to pursue the hobby and take it to new
frontiers. Those of you who cling to the old ways remind me of my home town
and all the elderly who are doing all they can to suppress the young. And
I've told them about the same thing when you die the town dies, When you
die the hobby dies




[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:23 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Gms1132)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re:  FAKE HAMS
Date: 24 Dec 1996 04:35:46 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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fake hams are people who become hams so they can get on the licensed bands
and keep on doing their crap and jamming they were doing on C.B.fake hams
also think they're real hams because they take and pass their code class
licenses; even when they still go out and jam and violate fcc rules and
regs. R U THAT KIND OF HAM? ----that's my two cents worth....de tigreyez!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:24 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 05:28:35 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59ntbj$[e-mail]>
References: <58hmj0$[e-mail]> <59aq8s$[e-mail]> <59bcje$[e-mail]> <59dkt2$[e-mail]> <59e2u8$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <59dkt2$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>During a hurricane, hams should stay home. They are not trained in
>>>emergency services. They cause more problems for local emergency service
>>>coordinators than they are worth.
>>
>>>As for those pesky hams on 14.325 contesting during a hurricane, why
>>>shouldn't someone in California use 14.325 when there is a hurricane in
>>>Florida?
>>
>>I guess that says it all. Anyone else see whats wrong with the above
>>statement? Or is everyone in here ignorant of their spectrum?

>Ignorant of their spectrum? Hmmm. You must have a different Part 97
>than everyone else. Mine sez that 20 meters extends to 14.350. I don't
>see anything anywhere about 14.325.

>MD
>--
>-
Well the freq is used for tracking conditions during a storm and is
used to pass traffic to the National Hurricane Center. That is when no
one is contesting on it...



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:25 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bryan Rogers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Dayton Hamvention on the web
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 05:44:09 GMT
Organization: NTR.NET Corporation
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        Dayton Hamvention is on the Web.
You can check it out at:

        http://www.hamvention.org

73,
Bryan Rogers, AE4PT
[e-mail]
Morse Code: The Universal Language


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:26 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 05:48:14 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59nugf$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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"Thomas R. Sundstrom" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Listening to Len's Ham Radio & More show early this morning on WWCR and
>this pro-code, anti-code business... and Len's promotion of the no-code
>General...

>Did'ja ever notice that high speed code atop music is used throughout
>the programming to move from feature to feature?

>Hmmm... ironic, isn't it?

Not ironic Tom, just cute. Still and all not a good reason to keep the
code requirement. In fact I have yet to hear one reasonable reason.
Not to say that you don't find the reasons reasonable, they just don't
hold water folks.
There is not one good reason to keep the code requirement. There are
plenty to keep CW sub bands. But to be required to pass a code test to
use phone is silly.

Eric



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:28 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 05:52:03 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <59nunn$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fpqe$[e-mail]> <59i8mr$[e-mail]> <59mv21$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>In <59i8mr$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wri
tes:
>>[e-mail] (The Tie-Dyed Side of the Force) wrote:
>>
>>>In article <[e-mail]>,
>>>   Rush Johnson <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>>As we slowly take away the significant things from Amateur Radio that
>>>>create a sense of shared identity, a sense of community  (like the CW
>>>>requirement, or homebrewing equipment), we start to lose those things
>>>>that keep us "bonded", that keep us comiserating (!), that keep us
>>>>mutually  respectful of each others' committment to the hobby.
>>
>>>We don't have a sense of community about the CW requirement.
>>
>>Certainly we do. At least amongst those of us who use it we do.
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D
>>

>That's the point that Andy was making ... the code requirement is THE
>SINGLE most devisive thing in ham radio ... you beepers see it as a way
>to maintain some false, self-deluding, self-image of superiority and
>eletism and use it as a way to keep others out ... you can't stand the
>idea of dropping the code requirement, 'cause  that's the ONLY thing
>that you have to make you feel superior to others ... to admit the code
>is irrelevant would be to admit that YOU are irrelevant in today's
>technically advanced world.

>You beepers just can't face the truth ...

I wouldn't have said it so harshly...but ditto.

KC5WCP



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:28 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 05:53:46 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <59nuqr$[e-mail]>
References: <59mv21$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Why our there no more than 2 or 3 People here complaining about the CW
>test, doesnt sound like much of a Majority

I'm complaining. So make that 3 or 4.

KC5WCP
Not afraid of the typical treatment no-coders get in their local
community.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:29 1997
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From: John Lee <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 21:54:17 -0800
Organization: The Los Angeles Free-Net
Lines: 7
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FS:NEW YAESU BATTERY
ALL BATTERY IS MAKE BY YAESU

FNB-31  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-40  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-41  $ 30 +SHIP
FNB-25  $ 30 +SHIP


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:31 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 06:04:38 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
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Message-ID: <59nvf7$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Dave Krieps) wrote:

>Carl,

>  You are truly mislead.  The only reason the "beepers" would like to
>maintain the code is that it might prevent the HAM band from becoming
>the new CB band.  The presumption is that if you take the time to
>learn the code, you may truly be interested in the hobby.
Why not take the time to learn the technical side instead of CW? Why
not make the test tougher and emphasize operating practice and
technical proficiency? What does CW have over these areas of expertise
to prevent CB type behavior? And why hasn't CW kept this behavior off
the HF bands so far?
>  If you don't think that is the case, listen on 2 meters sometime.  A
>number of the no-code licensees are turning that into a zoo.  Many of
>the repeaters are turning to closed status just to filter out the junk
>and abuse.  Sure, there are licensed HAMs that abuse any band, but the
>frequency of abuse seems higher where the no-coders play.  To be sure,
>there are many responsible no-coders, but the one-day-crash-courses
>are bringing all manner of abusers in as well.
I have yet to experience ANY ill behavior on the two meter repeaters
or simplex frequencies in my area. Yet there are a group of morons
down on 80 in my area that would make satan blush.
The NO-CODERS around here are a damn sight more polite than the
coders. I get more help when it comes to lifting an antenna from the
no-coders than I do from the beepers. I can count on a decent QSO from
the no-coders. When I try a coder, I get the shoulder cause my call
makes me lesser in their eyes. Mind you, there are a few decent
beepers in my area, but they actually took the time to get to know me
and understand that I care just as much about the proper use of the
bands as I do about abolishing the code requirement.
>  Perhaps the technology is changing and Morse code may even be an
>anachronism, but it tends to exert a Darwinian-like control on the
>operators.  In other words, it keeps a lot of idiots out; not all mind
>you.
So why bother if it does not provide the filter it is intended to?
>  In truth, people like yourself are the ones causing the
>divisiveness.  All of the "elitist" labels and name calling are the
>real cause of the animosity.  You might try to see the issue from
>someone elses shoes and then work within the system to make the
>changes you seem to think so important.
Statement does not apply to me, so i won't comment :)
>Happy Holidays.
Same to ya! Be safe and happy 73

KC5WCP
Eric




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:32 1997
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From: Frank Krozel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: TS-430 5Khz/Rev mod??
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 22:05:48 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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I had the modification information for 5khz per revolution, but lost
it.  Any one out there have this information???  Frank KG9H
630-653-9090


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:33 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Dana Yeomans: "Ham bands sound like CB"
Date: 24 Dec 96 06:34:56 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Dana Yeomans wrote (twice) that the ham bands sound worse than CB ch.19.

Well Dana, which mode are you listening to on the ham bands? SSB?
Digital? CW?

I suggest you tune down to the lower freq'ys on each band and tell
us what you hear from the CW folks. Of course, you'll experience none
of the nonsense one encounters on the half dozen or so freq'ys in the
voice segments. And that you can only provide a half dozen or so "bad"
voice freq'ys out of the hundreds of thousands of kiloHertz we have on
HF certainly sets us far apart from what occures on CB.

Why point your finger at the .01% when the 99.99% are ladies and
gentlemen? Thousands of QSOs occure daily on HF in which not one single
ill word is spoken. How about a little praise for those folks?

73,
Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:34 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Nut Control of 3894.5 kHz
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 06:36:45 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <59o1bf$[e-mail]>
References: <59evmg$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hd5e$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>       MN Maniac <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>>Gee, Jeff, I thought CW was supposed to be such an effective lid filter
>>>>(?)
>>
>>>Nobody ever said it was.
>>
>>You need to read this newsgroup more carefully.  Many HAM OPERATORS seem
>>to swear by the outdated Morse requirements as a way to "keep the
>>riff-raff out."

>It does. We only have perhaps a couple hundred idiots on the HF bands
>as opposed to the thousands that inhabit 11 meters. Plus, for instance,
>we don't have Carl on HF. We can thank the CW requirement for that, if
>nothing else.
When did 11m become a ham band? And where do you get your numbers?
BTW, CB 11m is a HF band, no license required. However 2m does require
a license and would be a better bench mark for your argument.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:36 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dreaming I won the lottery
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 06:46:07 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <59o1t1$[e-mail]>
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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jim daneke <[e-mail]> wrote:

>When I am stupid enough to buy a lottery ticket, I dream about quitting
>my job, buying a house on a mountain, putting up a beam and putting out
>1500 watts. Then the next day, I read the paper and find I am stuck with
>the dipole over my roof and 100 watts.

>All of you dreamers are thinking about the day when you will see a
>no-code ticket. You plan to get on the air and work dx to China. The
>only way you are going to work dx is to learn 13 wpm code. And if you
>want a piece of peace on the bands,( ie:advanced and extra bands ) you
>will have to learn 20 wpm. That's just the way it is. Not the way you or
>I or anyone else wants it...Just the way it is. If you want to work REAL
>ham radio...You will first learn the code. Buy a computer program and
>start learning. Who knows? You might like it! NOT. Life isn't fair. The
>afterlife is!
REAL ham radio eh? So are you saying that because I don't DX on HF I
am not a REAL ham?
So, no one has ever worked China on 2m. Not possible? It is statements
like these that push me more and more to set up that satellite/EME
array. When I get the QSL card from China I will send you a copy if
your addres is correct in the callbook. It may take awhile, but I'll
do it and I'll do it without code and without HF.

Still, I feel I have a right to use the HF bands without the silly and
outdated code requirement.

KC5WCP
HF is for sissies, try DXing on 2m. Its a REAL challenge!




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:38 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 06:57:27 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <59o2i9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597ufd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp30.datasync.com
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"Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>> I just smile an keep in mind that these dinosaurs will die eventually
>> and hopefully won't infect too many young hams with their vile and
>> annimosity to their fellow unwashed no-code hams.

>Well now, that's a lovely attitude. You know, I really have a problem
>with the all-too-frequent disdain that's expressed toward older hams.
>Yeah, the "WW-II" guys. These people are a wealth of knowledge,
>experience, and inspiration. And yes - sometimes they are stubborn,
>close-minded, and opinionated. Those traits seem to be a "privilege" of
>age. :)
I appreciate the older hams that offer help and do understand that
they are a wealth of knowledge. Problem is, most of them I run into
look down upon us no-coders. NOT ALL, most.
>Nevertheless, these folks have more to teach and to relate to you than
>you will ever have the patience, time, sensitivity, and intelligence to
>absorb. I have many fond memories of QSO's with OT's - it takes me to a
>different time and place. I will be sorry when they're all gone. If you
>don't care what they have to say, at least show some respect. Oh, and by
>the way - I'm 29 myself.
I respect their opinion, wish they did the same.

>> 73's and live better digitally an anologously  :)

>What the $@#% does THAT mean? Who sez you don't know code!
Damned if I know, I just said it :)

Merry X-mas



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:39 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 07:06:59 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 73
Message-ID: <59o344$[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: osp30.datasync.com
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[e-mail](Dale Harper) wrote:

>In <[e-mail]> "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
>writes:
>>
>>>
>>
>>Well now, that's a lovely attitude. You know, I really have a problem
>>with the all-too-frequent disdain that's expressed toward older hams.
>>Yeah, the "WW-II" guys. These people are a wealth of knowledge,
>>experience, and inspiration. And yes - sometimes they are stubborn,
>>close-minded, and opinionated. Those traits seem to be a "privilege"
>of
>>age. :)
>>
>>Nevertheless, these folks have more to teach and to relate to you than
>>you will ever have the patience, time, sensitivity, and intelligence
>to
>>absorb. I have many fond memories of QSO's with OT's - it takes me to
>a
>>different time and place. I will be sorry when they're all gone. If
>you
>>don't care what they have to say, at least show some respect. Oh, and
>by
>>the way - I'm 29 myself.
>>
>>> 73's and live better digitally an anologously  :)
>>
>>What the $@#% does THAT mean? Who sez you don't know code!
>>--
>>==========================================================
>>Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
>>Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
>>FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
>>==========================================================

>As the son of "one of those dinosaurs", your post was a most welcome
>and kind sentiment. Too bad some wouldn't agree with you. The stories I
>hear from him and others in his group are simply magical. I only hope
>some of us will have that magic when we are "dinosaurs".

>To any one of the negative posters who doesn't have a magical dinosaur,
>GET ONE!

>Dale
>KC8FAQ

>To the jerk who mused of the passing of older hams, I hope one of them
>isn't your father. It'll be the saddest goddamn day of your life.
I am not a jerk. I was deeply saddened by my folks passing. When my
mother die in my arms last year I was not only deeply saddened, but
discouaraged when I could not revive her with CPR. But then again when
your heart explodes through your airway it tends to make CPR useless.
I still taste her blood in my mouth and remember the helpless feeling.
I hope you never experience it.
I was not HOPING the older elitist hams would die, just stating that
they would die eventually and this whole debate along with them.
Do not take my post out of context. Do not attempt to shore up your
position with double speak and intentionally distorting my view.
I said:

"I just smile an keep in mind that these dinosaurs will die
eventually"

Not the same as wishing they would die. As your post implies upon my
character. I am sorry if you took my post the wrong way and
misuderstood my intentions. I wish no person anywhere illwill. Wish I
could say the same of some pro-coders in this group.

KC5WCP
Eric




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:40 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc,alt.engineering.electrical
Subject: Re: Grounding system?
Date: 24 Dec 1996 07:07:10 GMT
Organization: DigiPhone Corporation, Bryan/College Station Texas 409-693-8885
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59nveu$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5942d3$[e-mail]> <wtshaw-1812960149220001@207.17.188.151> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33137 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121535 alt.engineering.electrical:10451

In <[e-mail]>, "William E. Sabin" <sabinw@crp
l.cedar-rapids.lib.ia.us> writes:
>J. Fred Riley wrote:
>A "coordinated" system that *isolates* the equipment from lightning
>damage all across the frequency spectrum must be the right approach. No
>one single "fix" is enough. The things that work at low frequency are no
>good at the higher frequencies, and vice versa.
>
>Bill W0IYH

That was well said too, Bill.  Brute force filter concept?  <Smile>

//-----------------------------
Mike - W5WQN
[e-mail]
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:43 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Gary Coughman SUPPORTS HAZING !!!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 07:18:43 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <59o3q4$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbeb67$8fcce7b0$0fb919ce@davidh> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fhd5$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>>Now my tower has almost a full section buried. In other words the
>>hole is 10 feet deep and has 2 feet of aggregate in the bottom. I
>>dug it by hand with a posthole digger. Not with an auger, with a
>>real posthole digger. I started the hole with the regular handles,
>>and changed to longer handles as the hole got deeper. It took two
>>leisurely mornings to finish (too hot to dig in the afternoon).

>>Gary
>>--
>>Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems

>>Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp addre
sses
>>534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
>>Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |

>Gee, Gary, you just blew your image. We all thought you were Hi Tek.

>'Real hams do it on the giga hertz at 56k baud, and real hams dig tower holes
>with a post hole digger'.  I don't know, something just doesn't seem to fit.

>Personally I think post hole diggers are an obsolete, antiquated way to dig a
>hole that should be banned.   Why should today's modern digital hams be
>forced to have a post hole digger jambed down their throat just because they
>want to have a tower ?  No commercial outfit uses post hole diggers anymore.
>They all have gas powered augers, and big trucks with giant drill bits.  Why
>should hams be subject to using silly, outdated, antiquated tools for digging
>holes when nobody else is using them ?  To suggest a ham dig a tower hole
>with a post hole digger is nothing but HAZING ! Just because YOU like having
>blisters on YOUR hands doesn't mean ALL of us have to like it.  How about peo
ple
>with disabilities ?  Do you expect disabled people to spend two days in the y
ard
>with a post hole digger just because YOU did it ? What about people who live
in
>places where the dirt is REALLY HARD ?  Should they be kept out of ham radio
>just because of your silly post hole digger hazing ritual ?

>I think not.  I think people should be able to just pick up the phone, call o
ne
>of those guys with the big trucks with the giant drill bits, and let THEM com
e
>over and dig the hole for the tower.   Post hole diggers are keeping a lot of
>quality, qualified people out of ham radio, and it's time this hazing ritual
>come to an END !!!  I am going to write to the ARRL and WARC 99 and tell them
 I
>think it's about time to get rid of post hole diggers for ever !!!

>73, Jim KH2D

Hey Jim,

I saw nothing in the quoted text that suggested he wanted a posthole
digger REQUIREMENT. Unlike the PRO-CODERS......








From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:44 1997
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 23:43:22 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59kt5j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Will White wrote:

> This thread is amazing. Courtesy seems to be reserved for the
> airwaves, not the net. Of all the groups for a flame war, this is
> probably the least appropriate. Just a thought. . .

Well said, I agree.

In amateur radio, we are taught to be self policing & to lead by
example.  It is sad that some of these individuals seem to have
lost that knowledge & integrity.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:45 1997
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 23:46:11 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59kt5j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> Good point! However, have you listen to the HF bands lately? Try
> listening in on 7259 KHZ or 14,313KHZ. there are subjects discussed with
> such colorful language as to make a 30 vet in the navy blush!


So instead of looking honestly & try to address the issue that Will has
brought up, Eric tries to de-focus the attention from him by pointing
at another problem.

Sounds like a little kid upon getting in trouble says, "but mommy he
did it too" & then points at his friend or brother.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:46 1997
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 23:59:41 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59imbl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> US?!?!?!?! If John wouldn't create these problems, he wouldn't be
> creating this mess. Why are you playing the "blame game"?

Richard started this with his little storie he made up about my
march thru scannerdom.  I can't take the credit, sorry Eric.


> Besides, you don't know what Mr. Mackey did to the rec.radio.scanner

How do you know he doesn't?


> group for over 8 months!

Get your facts straight, 2 months, 3 weeks.


> Also, if you bother to check, I have posted some useful information in

How come no one remembers them?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:47 1997
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 00:03:18 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> Funny, you still behave like a juvinile.

That's just my youthful charm.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:47 1997
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From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 00:06:18 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fhem$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59k3kq$[e-mail]>
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Dicky-boy Kendrick wrote:

> John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >Infact, I have more higher class "fancy pieces of paper" than you.

> Must be that new color printer you bought with your allowance.
> Print Shop does have a few "fancy pieces" of bogus certificates.

hehehehehhe, speaking from experience eh??

I figured that was how you got your HAM, GROL, & CET.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 08:32:05 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <59p8nl$[e-mail]>
References: <59jlen$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-143.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>Not necessarily.  But pinheads who sneak over from the good buddy
>>newsgroup to troll could be classified as know trouble makers.

>Oh, I'm so sorry.  I didn't realize there was a rule specifying that I
>could only be active on the CB'ERS or the HAM OPERATORS newsgroup, but not
>on both.

>Considering that I'm both an active CB'ER and a HAM OPERATOR, I would say
>that I am right at home on both, no?

Oh, I'm SO sorry.  With software configured so the only thing we know you by i
s
MN MANIAC, and by never signing any messages, we didn't realize you were indee
d
a HAM OPERATOR.  I could have sworn you were just a good buddy trolling for
some attention.  Are you a CODED ham operator, or one of the other kind ?

73, Jim KH2D







From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!news.azstarnet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-7.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Is Squiggy Really on the A Team ?
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 08:51:08 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <59p9re$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fpqe$[e-mail]> <59i8mr$[e-mail]> <59mv21$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-143.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121582 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44610 rec.radio.shortwave:91039

[e-mail] wrote:

>That's the point that Andy was making ... the code requirement is THE
>SINGLE most devisive thing in ham radio ... you beepers see it as a way
>to maintain some false, self-deluding, self-image of superiority and
>eletism and use it as a way to keep others out ... you can't stand the
>idea of dropping the code requirement, 'cause  that's the ONLY thing
>that you have to make you feel superior to others ... to admit the code
>is irrelevant would be to admit that YOU are irrelevant in today's
>technically advanced world.

>You beepers just can't face the truth ...

>Carl - wa6vse
>[e-mail]

Let's turn that around for a minute, Squiggy.  You can't stand the idea of
keeping the code test, because it makes you feel inferior to others.  To admit
the code is relevant would be to admit other hams are relevant in todays world
,
and you have already shown us how you feel with your constant 'Yackers,
gamers....' etc. comments.

But anyway, it's Christmas time, so let's not argue.  As 1996 draws to a close

I would just like to thank you for presenting your views on the no code/code
debate in this forum Squiggy.  Your attitude toward ham radio, and your ideas
and the way you have presented them here are the best argument that I have
seen for keeping the code tests.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!acheron!en.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 96 09:12:07 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n58u$[e-mail]> <01bbf13a$e1327c40$e20292cf@globalyst-630>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.dircon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <01bbf13a$e1327c40$e20292cf@globalyst-630>
           [e-mail] "Doug Robbins" writes:

> Unfortunately,  most of those who believed that
> a 240V circuit was less dangerous than a 120V
> circuit are no longer able to share their views here.

Why not?  Why share their views only with people who already agree
with them?  Not much milage in that.  I'm not a believer yet, but I
do have an open mind on the subject of safety for the values of both
voltage and also frequency of a domestic electrical supply.

In this belief system, does safety rise continuously and without
limit as the voltage rises from 110V through 240V and beyond, or does
the curve reverse at some point?  Maybe before flashover?

And if there is a reverse in the curve, what is the (least dangerous)
voltage above 110V which such a curve would imply?

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!warwick!bignews.shef.ac.uk!G.Milligan
From: [e-mail] (Greg Milligan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.swap,alt.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: PRO 26 MOD ? is there one?
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 10:38:52 +0000
Organization: Department of Clinical Neurology, University of Sheffield, Uk
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mac107079.shef.ac.uk
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.0
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

> Is there a mod for cellular for the Pro 26?  I have one source that says
> there is.  I would like to get a few more references before I attempt
> it.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.
>
>
> Nick Yatko
> [e-mail]

Nick you can find various bits of info at the tandy support web site

http://support.tandy.com/support_electronics/15613.html


and a cell modification provided by Ross Voorhees (KB0PKT) at

http://www.zianet.com/kc5kto/mods/pro26cell.html

Hope this helps.
--
Greg Milligan

The University of Sheffield, Department of Clinical Neurology, Floor 'N',
Royal Hallamshire Hospital, Glossop Road, Sheffield S10 2JF, UK.
Tel: [phone]    Fax: [phone]   EMail:[e-mail]
World Wide Web: http://www.shef.ac.uk/uni/academic/A-C/cn/index.html
Amateur Radio (AX25 Packet Network): G1CPU@GB7WRG.#19.GBR.EU


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:54 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!in1.nntp.cais.net!NEWS1!not-for-mail
From: Bob Lewis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 07:53:29 -0500
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n58u$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: AA4PB
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 7

> True, there's less current available from a
> 240V circuit, but it only takes a few milliamps to kill.

A 30 amp 240 volt circuit CAN deliver the same current (30 amps) as a 30
amp 120 volt circuit. 30 amps at 240 volts is twice the power as 30 amps
at 120 volts, that's why they are used for higher power applications
(amplifiers, stoves, electric water heaters, etc).



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 24 Dec 1996 13:19:23 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59nvf7$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

You must not have much 2 Meter Activity in your Area, or maybe your
fellings about Bad Operating Praactices our Different .


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 24 Dec 1996 13:28:18 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Eric any Excuse in the World Group is that what you our, is it that you
our affraid you cant learn CW or is that you just dont want to. Why do you
Guys keep whinning about your Short Commings, know one is Making you Learn
CW, if you dont want to stay on VHF.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tickle me and I fart Elmer
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 08:39:58 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

A new ham doll has been released and it stinks.
It comes in white only and is wrinkled and fat.
When you tickle him it says HI HI, passes gas and dribbles
--
#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:58 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!mv!wd1v.mv.com!user
From: [e-mail] (JS)
Subject: Ham Radio.FAQ on WWW or Text File or Disk
Organization: MV Communications, Inc.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: wd1v.mv.com
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 13:48:45 GMT
Lines: 38

                      Announcing NEW
                       Ham Radio.FAQ

This is the second generation of the original file that was
a regular USENET posting entitled

     "rec.radio.amateur.misc Frequently Asked Questions"

The NEW Ham Radio.FAQ is a HyperText document that is on the
WWW and it contains 3 chapters plus hundreds of LINKS to radio
related sites!

     1 - Introduction to the Ham Radio.FAQ
     2 - Amateur Radio Organizations, Services, and Data Sources
     3 - Amateur Radio Advanced and Technical Questions

Please provide a copy of the Ham Radio.FAQ to any new or
soon-to-be Hams that you know or share with them the URL to this
site:

               http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v

Send me an EMAIL <or packet with your Email address> if you want the
FAQ text file sent to you as an attached <120 K> file with the words
"HAM FAQ" on the subject line.

Send me a formatted disk with SASE disk mailer if you want the
FAQ text file sent to you on disk. PC or Mac are fine.


                John D. Seney |_|_|_|_| [e-mail]
            144 Pepperidge Dr |_|   |_| page [e-mail]
    Manchester, NH 03103-6150 |_|_ _|_| [e-mail]
      voice mail 603.533.3472 | | | | | fax [phone]

            Digital Scope.FAQ + Amateur Radio.FAQ + Macnet

                   http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:08:59 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!mv!wd1v.mv.com!user
From: [e-mail] (JS)
Subject: Ham Radio.FAQ on WWW or Text File or Disk
Organization: MV Communications, Inc.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: wd1v.mv.com
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 13:48:55 GMT
Lines: 40

                      Announcing NEW
                       Ham Radio.FAQ

This is the second generation of the original file that was
a regular USENET posting entitled

     "rec.radio.amateur.misc Frequently Asked Questions"

The NEW Ham Radio.FAQ is a HyperText document that is on the
WWW and it contains 3 chapters plus hundreds of LINKS to radio
related sites!

     1 - Introduction to the Ham Radio.FAQ
     2 - Amateur Radio Organizations, Services, and Data Sources
     3 - Amateur Radio Advanced and Technical Questions

Please provide a copy of the Ham Radio.FAQ to any new or
soon-to-be Hams that you know or share with them the URL to this
site:

               http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v

Send me an EMAIL <or packet with your Email address> if you want the
FAQ text file sent to you as an attached <120 K> file with the words
"HAM FAQ" on the subject line.

Send me a formatted disk with SASE disk mailer if you want the
FAQ text file sent to you on disk. PC or Mac are fine.

73,


                John D. Seney |_|_|_|_| [e-mail]
            144 Pepperidge Dr |_|   |_| page [e-mail]
    Manchester, NH 03103-6150 |_|_ _|_| [e-mail]
      voice mail 603.533.3472 | | | | | fax [phone]

            Digital Scope.FAQ + Amateur Radio.FAQ + Macnet

                   http://www.mv.com/ipusers/wd1v


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "Bob Bocskay" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.radio.scanner,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: O-scope for sale
Date: 24 Dec 1996 14:58:25 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <01bbf175$e4bbc840$9ca993cf@default>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.169.156
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.scanner:43583 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20848 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121573 rec.radio.amateur.space:9201

Tektronics 543 scope with plugins (CA,53E/54E, type H wideband), probes and
a real nice Tek scope cart all for $60
                                contact:
                                        Luis Ibarra
                                        [phone]
                                        PHX AZ


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!bloom-beacon.mit.edu!senator-bedfellow.mit.edu!usenet
From: Andrew C Robertson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tickle me Burt
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 10:04:00 -0500
Organization: The Negative Energy Laboratory
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cerebus.mit.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> A new ham doll has been released and it stinks.
> It comes in white only and is wrinkled and fat.
> When you tickle him it says HI HI, passes gas and dribbles

Also now available is the "Tickle Me Burt" doll, which endlessly posts
boring mean-spirited crap to usenet and secretly hates itself.  Upon
tickling, it shows you how to use an overhead projector.

drewbob


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!netcom.net.uk!btnet!knews.uk0.vbc.net!theplanet.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Dunnett)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM Computer Control Software?
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 15:09:34 GMT
Organization: At Home
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: n70i217.c1r5.pol.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44979 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121575

On Mon, 23 Dec 1996 00:01:52 -0800, Mike <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Bob Morris K2RK wrote:
>>
>> I should get a coR.Moroney wrote:
>> >
>> > Does anyone have a recommendation for a good control program for ICOM
>> > rigs (specifically the '706 and '736)?  I'm mainly looking for a DOS
>> > program, but Windows 3.1 or 95 would be OK too, in a pinch.  Logging
>> > capabilities are a plus, but not a requirement.  Any suggestions?
>> >
>> > BOB K9CMR
>>
>>  Try Log-Eqf.... Logging, DXCC etc...Forget if the rig stuff
>> is in the shareware, but <$40. Ads in QST (EQF Software). Fills freq and
>> mode into log from Icom. Folows Icom tunning Memory pages... Freq and
>> mode to radio from keyboard. Packet cluster window. contest mode...auto
>> time/date logging.
>> Try the shareware to see if you like the log screen. ARRL Web and
>> others.
>> ..Current V 8.07 is DOS and I run it in Win 3.1 as a "pif" window on the
>> shack-486/33 with 8 megs...Can do other stuff in Windows while
>> Log is in background. The memory pages are nice as the '735 only has
>> 12 memories. They have a full line for freq, mode and a line of info.
>> Like the info space for what's in the memory - BBC etc.
>>  Arrow down to a memory line, hit enter and the radio takes off.
>>
>> GL, Bob  As a side note, I just finished reading an article in the December

>issue of 73 Amateur Radio Magazine which talks about the Log-EQF
>controlling program and a Interface kit for the ic-706. Yuo might want
>to take a look. It is on page 26 and 27.
>
>73, Mike K6YPB

There are few if any *good* CAT programs for the Icoms, except for
a very expensive commercial one available here in UK.

I wrote my own in Power Basic. It works. It has squelch detect
built in and can scan from an ASCII file, zero and load memories,
but apart from that only does what is already built into my IC736.

Trouble with many shareware/freeware programs is they assume that
every rig has the same rig software address as the writer's and there
is seldom any way of deducing what address the program is using
and/or no way of changing the address anyway. The IC736 can use
a wide range of addresses.

I also had to build my own interface. The CT17 interface only works
in the direction computer>rig and does not have squech detect. A home-
brew interface is very easy to build and cost next to nothing.

Try the ARRL program someone else mentioned, and let us know how you
get on with it.

73



- Jim
[e-mail]
[e-mail]
g4rga@gb7tjf.#45.gbr.eu


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.72.128.98!news.icix.net!news.america.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Conrad Hoffman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 1970s Callbook Lookup
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 16:28:44 GMT
Organization: PSS InterNet Services, Interneting Florida and beyond 904 253 7100
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <59p0hd$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dab2-13.america.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Hi,

From about 1970  to 1977  I had a one land call and can't remember
what it was.  Does anyone have a callbook of that period and could
look it up.   Conrad Hoffman, Bennington, VT

Thanks

W8MHH   [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!cbgw3.lucent.com!nntphub.cb.lucent.com!alice!allegra!ulysses!newshub.netnews.att.com!news
From: "Roger D. Placer" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 11:46:10 -0500
Organization: Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 135.3.90.*
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)
To: mttly1 <[e-mail]>

> Is that fair to all who could and would like to be able to partake
> of this fascinating hobby to be put down and out because of a few
> people that think because they had to when they started everybody else
> has to and if they can't tough.
   [snip]
> How selfish can you get.
   [snip]
> You sit back and say to yourself rightoues self that you had to so
> every body else has to...

My friend, it really matters not what "self-righteous," "ancient"
29-year old Extra class hams like myself, and all the others who have
spewed endlessly on this topic for months think in the end. The
International Telecommunications Union (ITU) requires that its member
nations (i.e. the U.S. of A.) ensure that users of the HF amateur bands
show proficiency in Morse Code, even at 5 wpm.

EXISTING AMATEUR RADIO OPERATORS DO NOT CAUSE THIS RULE TO PERSIST. OUR
GOVERNMENT, AND THE INT'L RADIO COMMUNITY, DOES.

Therefore, your complaint on this forum is moot. Secondly, by lashing
out at licensed amateur radio operators as some kind of generic group
with homogeneous ideas and 'obvious' conformance to strict stereotypes,
you are misguided in your criticism.

The many opinions unleased on the newsgroups are discussion only for
now. Things may very well change in the future, but your confrontational
attitude is really not the best way to approach the situation -
especially from a layperson. No offense intended, but it's kind of like
when my grandmother - who's never steered a vehicle in her life - tells
me how to drive. You can't possibly comprehend the depth of the subject
by sitting in the passenger's seat (i.e. reading newsgroups).

==========================================================
Roger D. Placer, KA2Z      Lucent Technologies - Bell Labs
Phone(W) 908.582.3112    Business:       [e-mail]
FAX(W)   908.582.3662    Personal: [e-mail]
==========================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (willard zerbe)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 24 Dec 1996 17:14:31 GMT
Organization: GoodNet
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <59p31n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts13-4.goodnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (x86 32bit)


>>I = E/R
>>
>>If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
>>what happens to I?


What happens to I?  It goes to zero because you burned up the curcuit.  220
volt devices do not "leave R the same".  The resistance of a 220 device is
twice that of a like 110 device.  Therefore I = 1/2 that of the 110 device.
KA7ACK



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!unixg.ubc.ca!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rwa
From: [e-mail] (Ross Alexander)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: 24 Dec 1996 17:33:00 GMT
Organization: Athabasca University
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59p44c$[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59g8nj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: aupair.cs.athabascau.ca
X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #10 (NOV)

Murray Cotnam <[e-mail]> writes:

>Bill Nelson wrote:
>>
>> Dave Hockaday ([e-mail]) wrote:
>>
>> : Hi Bill. What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band?

>80M BAND

>CW    3.500-3.725
>RTTY  3.600-3.645
>SSB   3.725-4.000
>SSTV  3.840-3.850

Perhaps this has been mentioned already, but the band plan above is
purely a gentlemen's agreement.  I&SC doesn't care about band plans.
They do care about bandwidth, but that's another story.

I'm all for gentlemen's agreements, BTW; please don't take my comment
as disparagement of band plans.

regards,
Ross ve6pdq
--
Ross Alexander, ve6pdq  --  [phone]  --  [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.177.127.11!news.sojourn.com!condor.ic.net!news2.acs.oakland.edu!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: Kenny Keefer <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Attn: 14.313 and 3.894.5 Fans Everywhere!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 11:36:17 -0600
Organization: :noitazinagrO
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc114031.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------52FC67E83955"
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U)

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

--------------52FC67E83955
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

x-no-archive: yes

Feel free to distribute the following to your friends via email!

--------------52FC67E83955
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="Welcome to Our Channel.txt"

Greetings 14.313 and 3.894.5 fans everywhere!;

You are cordially invited to the newly established DALnet chat channel,
#hamradio14313.  Unlike other ham-related chat channels, this one's
a FUN place to meet.  And, unlike other ham radio chat channels,
it's not *mandatory* or even suggested that you use your callsign for
your nickname.  (Gee, what a fine way for some of the IRC troublemakers
to locate your QTH! :^0 )  You can use it if you wish, though; that's
up to you.  There are no established times when we meet, rather, it's
happening whenever someone signs on.  Because it's a new channel,
activity is slowly growing, so don't be surprised if it's empty when
you check in.  Just QRX a while and wait for the fun to begin!

Our policy is this:  Herbie Baby Number One! and Big AL is THE Caring
Station!  We are pro-B.A.R.F./A.R.G. + Stumpjumpers.  We find PorkButt
offensive and distasteful, disgusting and idiotic.  In our opinion,
he is an egomanic, a self-centered braggart who's mindset seems to
revolve around the most sophomoric, juvenile topics and activities.
(Sewer Rats are not encourage to join us, but if they do, and *if*
they behave themselves, they will be allowed to stay.  We have a very
low tolerance for their typically moronic behavior on the ham bands,
and we're sure-the-hell not going to put up with it on OUR channel!)

Picture this: PorkButt begins his usual QRM'ing, either on .313 or
.894.5, and the band happens to be *really* lousy.  You are unable to
converse with the station with which he is maliciously interfering.
One alternative would be to TX your friend.  Another -and better-
solution is to "QSY" to #hamradio14313 and establish communication
there, with the possibility of making it a roundtable when others arrive!
This could be the start of something good, folks!

Need some information on DALnet, the BEST IRC network around? Point your
browser to:  http://www.DAL.net/    There, you'll find links to server
lists, client support, IRC FAQ's and more.
Another helpful site for explaining the basics of IRC is:
http://xworld.infoave.net/basic.html

We look forward to seeing all B.A.R.F./A.R.G. and Stumpjumpers members
and friends (SWL's welcome, too, of course!) on #hamradio14313 on
DALnet.

vy 73 es hpe to c u,

Kenny Keefer

PS.  I highly recommend mIRC 4.7 as a chat client.  I was using Netscape
Chat, and, IMHO, it is grossly inferior to mIRC.

--------------52FC67E83955--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!news.nacamar.de!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.177.127.11!news.sojourn.com!condor.ic.net!news2.acs.oakland.edu!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: [e-mail] (Gary)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me and I fart Elmer
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 17:51:28 GMT
Organization: Concentric Internet Services
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc042055.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.326

On Tue, 24 Dec 1996 08:39:58 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>A new ham doll has been released and it stinks.
>It comes in white only and is wrinkled and fat.
>When you tickle him it says HI HI, passes gas and dribbles

Hmmmm, it sounds suspiciously like a Burt Fisher doll, for an added
touch of realism they should have it troll and flame-bait on usenet.


Merry Christmas to all (even Burt)


Gary K8IQ


>--
>#================#===================================================#
>|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
>| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
>|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
>#================#===================================================#
>|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
>#====================================================================#
>If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
>Samantha Fisher



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:12 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 17:53:25 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <59p5b8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59mjk0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: i547.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Ed Hare <[e-mail]> shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->Actually it is not quite that cut and dried.  While the HQ staff and ARRL

->Directors do weigh the input of our Members, we also are quite interested
->in the input from those who are choosing not to be ARRL members.

Ed --

While I have disagreed in this newsgroup with the concept of joining a
group that doesn't represent my interests, I'd like to take this
opportunity to thank you for presenting the ARRL point of view in a
forthright and lucid manner.  Quite frankly, the only League presence on
this newsgroup in the past has been a couple of electeds who come across as
the most pompous condescending horse's patoots in the group.

It appears that you and I can disagree -- without being disagreeable.
Thanks for taking the time to write.

Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!news
From: Ed Hare <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 24 Dec 1996 18:00:38 GMT
Organization: American Radio Relay League, Inc.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59p5o6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.2N (Windows; I; 16bit)
To: [e-mail]

Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]> wrote:

>What's the matter, can't someone be happy with something here on the
>newsgroup? I've been an ARRL member for years, and support them on most
>of their views. Hey, nothing wrong with being happy, is there?

Well, Dave, such happiness is unprecedented on rec.radio.amateur,
but is it the holiday season after all, so I guess we will all permit it.
:-)

Actually, I wanted to take this opportunity to thank those who offered
their support for most of what ARRL does.  I feel the same way; I agree
with most of it, but not all of it at all times.  I have seen a number of
people post anti-ARRL sentiments and was pleased to see the other side of
the opinion spread get some press.  The very newcomers we have been
discussing in this thread will often determine their opinion of ARRL from
the opinions of others.  I was never comfortable seeing only the bad side
of ARRL discussed on this forum, thus giving an unbalanced view of what
people think.

A warm Happy Holidays to all from ARRL HQ,
Ed Hare, KA1CV
ARRL Lab Supervisor ("Lab Dad")





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Why are there HAM OPERATORS on rec.radio.cb?
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 18:02:44 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59657b$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dd73-008.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Tue, 17 Dec 1996 02:36:20 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
wrote:

>[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:
>
>>Anyone else notice the recent abundance of HAM OPERATORS posting messages
>>and starting quarrels on the CB newsgroup?  It's kind of funny...I mean,
>>why would HAM OPERATORS lower themselves to talking with the CB'ERS on
>>their newsgroup, instead of staying here and discussing the important
>>things in life like Morse Code with the other HAM OPERATORS?
>
>>Gee, do you suppose that it just might be because CB'ERS tend to be more
>>fun than many of the old and stuffy HAM OPERATORS?
>
>Well if that's the case, MN Maniac, why don't you just scurry back over to th
e
>CB newsgroup and enjoy yourself  ?   Last time you dropped in, we didn't even
>notice when you left, so I am sure you won't be missed.
>
>Or does the WANNABE in you keep pulling you back here with the big boys ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
I have been an amateur for about 30 years.  During the pre-mid 80's
most amateurs talked about technical subjects.
More recently most of the amateur, packet channels, have been buy and
sell and making contacts.
I have been reading the  rec.radio.cb because the questions posted are
more like amateurs used to communicate about pre-80's.
The cb forums are a lot like we used to talk about 20 plus years ago.
Larry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 96 18:36:00 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p31n$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <59p31n$[e-mail]>
           [e-mail] "willard zerbe" writes:

>
> >>I = E/R
> >>
> >>If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
> >>what happens to I?
>
>
> What happens to I?  It goes to zero because you burned up the curcuit.  220
> volt devices do not "leave R the same".  The resistance of a 220 device is
> twice that of a like 110 device.  Therefore I = 1/2 that of the 110 device.

What `device' is this?  Your badly trimmed quote from Gary's posting
originally had a human body as the load and not an appliance which
has been adapted to operate on a different supply voltage.

And also, for the constant power device in your own example, the load
resistance must be made to be FOUR times and not just twice as you
calculated (or guessed?).  If you just double the resistance then you
will only keep the current constant not the power.  The power will
actually be double and not remain `like'.  (V*I = P and 2V*I = 2P).

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Coast to coast 2m.?
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 18:38:13 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd12-237.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

In Canada, we have a network to link 2 meter repeaters together called
IPARN.  Even with our relatively low amateur population, compared with
the states, there are amateurs who are abusing the network.
Larry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!btnet!netcom.net.uk!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me and I fart Elmer
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 96 18:41:10 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] "Burt Fisher" writes:

> A new ham doll has been released and it stinks.
> It comes in white only and is wrinkled and fat.
> When you tickle him it says HI HI, passes gas and dribbles

A say lonely old man who has to make a thorough fool and a nuisance
of himself for anyone to even notice that he exists.

Happy Christmas.  Maybe you will get a life from Santa.

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Zapping old NiCad batteries
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 18:50:46 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 54
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd39-054.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Fri, 20 Dec 1996 13:10:27 -0800, "Scott A. Stembaugh"
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have a couple of older NiCad HT battery packs that will not hold a
>charge for more than a couple of hours.  They had set idle for a couple
>of years.  I have been cycling them up/down (charge about 8 hours/run
>until dead) for 2 weeks and have made very minimal progress in
>recovering them.  Is there a way to ZAP them to see if they have any
>life left in them?
>
>
>
>Thanks,
>--scott  N9LJX
>[e-mail]
Greetings and merry christmas and happy new year Scott
I have an amateur radio licence, however so far I have been rather
reluctant to give it over the internet, except in my web site.

With regard to nicad batteries.  The responce previous to me was quite
good.  I am also in the broadcast industry and have maintained nicad
battery belts for the past several years.

Nicads are enough to test anyones ability.

I might, however, offer a suggest that 'might' work, and it is a big
might.

Measure the battery voltage to see if all the cells are at least up to
voltage.

6 cells should give around 7.5 volts, for example.

If you can open the cell pack measure each cell to see if it is around
1.2 volts.

I have discovered that shorted cells come in two varieties.  A shorted
cell can be literally zero volts or it can have a very small voltage,
around .1 mv.  I have been somewhat successful at brining up cells
which had .1mv.  You would need a digital meter with about 5 or 6
digits after the zero.

This takes time.  A low current source to start with and increasing
the current as the cell responds.

If the cell is literally zero, it is a toss out.

If you can't open the cell and the voltage appears OK, try giving them
a slow charge of about 5 percent for several days.

If that doesn't work you may have to toss them.

Larry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Blocking ham/cb interference on stereo equipment?
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 19:01:46 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59jrfq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd39-054.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On Sun, 22 Dec 1996 05:46:33 GMT, [e-mail] (Kingfish)
wrote:

>Hi Everyone,
>
>A neighbor of mine has a ham or cb radio, and his transmissions come
>out over my stereo, telephone, clock radio - anything with a speaker.
>The FCC won't do anything about it.
>
>I know there are filters you can put on your telephone to block some
>of the interference.  Is there anything like that for stereo
>equipment?
>
>Thanks,
>
>JOn
>
Hi Jon
You have received a lot of good advice from the other.   I am only be
reflecting on what they suggest.
One thing I might add though is to always maintain a good rapour with
the operator of the station that is causing the problem.
If you approach him/her nice and politly he/she may be willing to help
you and may even with willing to absorb some of the cost or help you
with the problem.
If the two of you get off on the wrong foot he/she could get tougher
to deal with.
Stay on good terms with the operator.
Larry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 24 Dec 96 19:04:59 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Eric KC5WCP wrote: "I just smile and keep in mind that those dinosaurs
will eventually die"  and then attempted to cover the evil intent of
that comment with a softer "That's not the same as wishing they'd die."

Those two statements seem contradictory, Eric. Suppose, just suppose,
that both your parents were OT hams and worked only CW. And suppose
the day of their passing a Tech came up to you and said "I just smile
and keep in mind that those dinosaurs will eventually die." Now your
statement has been thrown back at you in a context very close to you.

Don't you see how mean-spirited you and others have become in regard to
this policy debate? Very shameful.

Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.west.net!news
From: Kevin Potter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 24 Dec 1996 19:06:24 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59p9jg$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF. <59hlmn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: term2-17.vta.west.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:[e-mail]


>[e-mail] wrote:
>>in to help.  Perhaps they are a team?
>
>Or maybe - they are the same person?


Who is 'reed'?  Another poster without a name.

What does he have to hide?

KP




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:24 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.164.220.8!news.monmouth.com!news
From: "James Demos, MD" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Call Sign
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 14:11:41 -0500
Organization: Monmouth Internet
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: fh-ppp14.monmouth.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win16; I)

HI,
I recently changes my call sign to K2DE, and would be interested in any
information anyone may have regarding it.
Thanks for reading this, Happy Holidays
--

**********************************************
*   73 DE JIM                                *
*   [e-mail]                        *
*                                            *
**********************************************


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HELP re 10 meter from KB5UGX
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 19:15:24 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd39-054.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On 20 Dec 1996 02:05:19 GMT, [e-mail] (RClark2004) wrote:

>After having tech + license for several years, finally had time to try HF.
> Expected to be able to hear some activity and make some contacts on 10 M
>during the December 14-15 ARRL contest.  Tried about five times at various
>times during the two-day contest period and did not hear any activity on
>the novice phone (28.350 - 28.400) or the phone (28.550 - 28.650)
>frequencies.  No response to CQ's on the novice phone frequencies.  On 20
>meter phone frequencies, could pick up lot of conservations.
>
>Radio is a Kenwood TS-450S with auto antenna tuner.  Antenna is a
>Cushcraft R5 vertical.
>
>Questions:   Did others participate in or hear activity on 10 M during
>this time?  Any suggestions as to why I didn't hear any activity?
>
>Please respond via E-mail.
>
>Thanks.
When on 10 meters, check your swr.  Don't assume that the autocoupler
is working.  You might also check the swr after the coupler, many
can't handle swr's about 3:1.
Larry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.177.71.9!viper.shadow.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (cRiTTa66)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.amateur,alt.radio.amateur.club,alt.radio.amateur.club.clarc,rec.ham-radio,rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mods to the Yaesu FT-50R
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 19:19:11 GMT
Organization: iNdependent
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <32c02ca0.1272252@news>
References: <01bbed10$e0380d10$d787c7cd@sci> <59bluu$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-mia-72.shadow.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.227
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:44985 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22348 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121586

http://www.shadow.net/~critta66/ft50.html


On Thu, 19 Dec 1996 15:08:32 GMT, [e-mail] (Gary Hosler)
wrote:

>"Program / Case Manager" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Anyone know of mods to the Yaesu FT-50R?
>
>What is it that you are trying to modify?  Something not working
>properly?  Could you be a bit more specific?
>
>de KN0Z  Gary
>
>Opinions expressed herein are my own and may not represent those of my employ
er.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 11:20:23 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59k2mr$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Dicky-boy Kendrick wrote:

> reply said "Hi Bill :-)". The lack of nonsense in the scanner groups is
> directly attributed to your absence.

No actually it is the PRESENCE of myself & a few others that is now
preserving
the integrity & sanity of the scanner NG now.  Otherwise, the problem
individual would be running loose.


> We had this conversation previously in a thread entitled "Mackey's Verbosity
."
> The quantity of your bombast is inverserly proportional to its substance.

At least there is some proportional relation. Otoh, EVERYTHING we get
from YOU
is CRAP.  At the last meetin of PARG, you (& Eric) gave us MANY good
laughs.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ARLB102 FCC Delays New RF-Exposure Rules
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 24 Dec 1996 14:30:05 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 51
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12438 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121592


SB QST @ ARL $ARLB102
ARLB102 FCC Delays New RF-Exposure Rules

ZCZC AG82
QST de W1AW
ARRL Bulletin 102  ARLB102
From ARRL Headquarters
Newington CT  December 24, 1996
To all radio amateurs

SB QST ARL ARLB102
ARLB102 FCC Delays New RF-Exposure Rules

FCC Delays New RF-Exposure Rules

Just in time for Christmas, the FCC has postponed the date for hams
to comply with the new RF-exposure regulations from January 1, 1997,
to January 1, 1998.  The ARRL was among those requesting the delay.
The League said that the additional time was needed for the FCC to
draft implementation guidelines and for amateurs to use them to
comply with the regulations (released on August 1, 1996 as ET Docket
93-62).

FCC Report No. DC 96-112 announced the amendment of the rules to
extend the transition period for licensees to determine compliance
with the new bioeffects requirements for RF transmitters.  The
League obtained a copy of the report just before noon on Christmas
Eve.

The time extension to January 1, 1998, will allow changes to Amateur
Radio operator examinations to be made along with routine revisions
between now and July 1, 1998, rather than requiring hurried special
revisions.  Among the reasons for requesting the extension was the
desire to permit licensees to make a more orderly entrance into this
new area, to allow time for information to be promulgated to hams to
ensure that they have the information at their disposal to comply
with the new rules, and to allow time for appropriate questions to
be inserted into the question pools for the various amateur license
exams.

In Report No. DC 96-112, the FCC said it disagreed with those
petitioners who suggested that the time extension ''will have
significant adverse effects on public health.''  The entire text of
Report DC 96-112 may be found on the ARRLWeb at
http://www.arrl.org/fcc/dc96-112.html (or click on What's New or RF
Safety News).

And, to all, a good night.
NNNN
/EX


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Advancement a mistake
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 12:36:34 -0700
Organization: Network Service
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: den-co24-24.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 24  2:37:46 PM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Roland Stiner wrote:
>
> C>I've seen this written down anywhere, but it seems to me that 100 W output
>  >just doesn't cut it on 80/40/20 meter SSB.
>

Not now, with the sunspots...Give it 2 years and 5 watts will get you
Japan!

jim/AB0DK


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!psgrain!news.rain.net!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 24 Dec 1996 19:47:03 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59pbvn$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF.
 <59hlmn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p9jg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0]

Kevin Potter ([e-mail]) wrote:
:
:
: Who is 'reed'?  Another poster without a name.

What difference does a name make on the Net? It's not reality anyhow.

:
: What does he have to hide?
:

Absolutely nothing. Is there some sort of problem?

: KP
:
:

Brian Reed, KJ7JS
Portland, OR

--
----


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 14:52:10 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59jlen$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p8nl$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs547.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
CC: [e-mail]

Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> some attention.  Are you a CODED ham operator, or one of the other kind ?

Jim,
I understand this was a response to a flame, but I personally take
offense at being considered "One of the OTHER kind..."
At this point in time, I am a no code tech, but if Amateur radio is what
you CW guys are making it look like here, I'll gladly let my license
lapse and stay the hell off any ham band for fear of being considered a
bigoted, arrogant old fart.
I got in to ham radio for the enjoyment of the hobby.  For years I had
wanted to get my ticket, but months upon months of study with CW tapes
and books didn't get the CW into my head... I had finally got the chance
to join what I thought was a very amicable, polite group of people when
the no-code came along, and I got my ticket.  I have found the majority
of ham radio operators to be very polite, courteous people, but then
every so often, I find one making comments like yours that give *ALL*
hams a bad rep.  Seems the "Ole' Boy Network" is alive and well and is
trying to keep any new blood out of "Their Bands".
I don't think the CW should be eliminated, nor do I think there should
be more classes available without the CW than the no-code tech.  I feel
the no-code tech is a perfect way for people like myself, that may have
trouble learning CW to get in... It has been through my Ham contacts
with my No-Code tech that I have been able to find a method of study for
CW that seems to be working so I can upgrade and enjoy the benefits CW
has to offer.
I wouldn't buy a CB radio to keep in my vehicle in case of an emergency
just because of the bad name it's users have given it over the years.
If the Amateurs keep up making themselves look bad by insulting everyone
that doesn't have their level of skill, then I'll be damned if I'll have
any part of the Ham bands either.

Happy holidays,
Dave


--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 14:53:53 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p31n$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs547.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

willard zerbe wrote:
>
> >>I = E/R
> >>
> >>If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
> >>what happens to I?
>
> What happens to I?  It goes to zero because you burned up the curcuit.  220
> volt devices do not "leave R the same".  The resistance of a 220 device is
> twice that of a like 110 device.  Therefore I = 1/2 that of the 110 device.
> KA7ACK

However, total watts will stay the same.

(P=EI)

Later,
DAve


--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.edm.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Eric Shamay)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mission Viejo, Southern California hams
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 20:12:56 GMT
Organization: EDM Network
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <59p4je$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port209.edm.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Any so. Californian hams out there? I'm going to take my test for
tech+ on the 27th of january and I was wondering if anyone has a
decent radio for a decent price. If so please contact at :

[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!news
From: "Lindquist, Rick, N1RL" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.info,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Special Bulletin
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 24 Dec 1996 15:24:51 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 50
Sender: [e-mail]
Approved: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <59pe6j$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.info:12439 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121594


Since there's no edition of The ARRL Letter this week, we are issuing this
special bulletin regarding this issue of high interest to the amateur
community. Thanks and Season's Greetings.--Rick Lindquist, N1RL

FCC Delays New RF-Exposure Rules

The FCC has postponed for one year, until January 1, 1998, the date for hams
to comply with its new RF-exposure regulations. The ARRL was among those
requesting the delay this fall. The League said that the additional time was
needed for the FCC to draft implementation guidelines that amateurs could
use to help them comply with the regulations--released on August 1, 1996 as
ET Docket 93-62. Among other things, the regulations would require hams
running 50 W PEP or more to conduct "routine RF radiation evaluations" to
determine if RF fields were sufficient to cause human exposure to RF
radiation levels in excess of those specified in the proposed regulations.
The ARRL also has asked the FCC to reconsider the 50-W threshold, but the
FCC report (DC 96-112) extending the compliance deadline did not address
that issue.

The FCC announcement--which the ARRL obtained just before noon on Christmas
Eve--noted that more time would be needed for affected licensees to
determine that they comply with the new requirements. The extension also
will allow required changes to Amateur Radio operator examinations to be
made at the time other, routine revisions are made between now and July 1,
1998. In announcing the extension, the FCC said it disagreed with those
petitioners who suggested that the time extension "will have significant
adverse effects on public health."

Since the FCC announced the RF-exposure regulations, the ARRL has worked
with technically knowledgeable volunteers to assist the staff, the RF Safety
Committee and the FCC in coming up with a workable ham radio approach toward
RF safety. ARRL Laboratory Supervisor Ed Hare, KA1CV--the ARRL HQ liaison to
the ARRL RF Safety Committee--has spearheaded the ARRL's effort. "The ARRL
is very pleased that the FCC extended the compliance date," Hare said. "As
all parties involved tried to fully understand the new requirements, it soon
became obvious that neither the FCC nor the ham radio community was ready
for the January 1, 1997, implementation deadline."

Hare said the delay will give both the FCC and hams more time to better
understand the implications of the rules and will give hams an opportunity
to evaluate their stations as the regulations will require (see "The FCC's
New RF-Exposure Regulations," QST, Jan 1997, p 47).

The entire text of Report DC 96-112 may be found on the ARRLWeb at
http://www.arrl.org/fcc/dc96-112.html (or click on What's New or RF Safety
News). See Happenings in February QST for additional information.

And, to all, a good night!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 12:31:04 -0800
Organization: Just Myself
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <32B990EF. <59hlmn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59k3be$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Dicky-boy Kendrick wrote:

> Gee, at first you liked it. You even generously sent me a present of an
> eight megabyte email bomb as a thank you not. (Email ordnance
> disposal is _so _ easy these days.)

Really, are people mail bombing you now?  Sad to hear that.


>Then you told me how much you liked it again.

Yea, & you never responded.  We want to post youy little story
on our ham club web page.


> Must be that humanity deficiency acting up again.

Maybe that is your problem?


> > Then Eric jumped in to help.  Perhaps they are a team?
> >Or maybe - they are the same person?
> You told us in the scanner groups how good you were with computers
> and software. Let's see you prove we are one in the same.

You are both on different servers, providers & mail readers, but that
does not prevent you from being the same person.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.enteract.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!198.68.191.16!news.accessone.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Subject: www.hamradio-online.com: FCC postpones RF safety rules until September 1997
Date: 24 Dec 1996 20:48:27 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59pfir$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: vbook.accessone.com
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121604 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20856 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44621 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22354

The FCC, respondig to numerous petitions filed by the ARRL and other
organizations has postponed implementation of the new RF safety rules until
September 1997. Under the new rules, Amateurs must certify the RF safety of
their stations if they operate at 50 watts or more output power.

The complete story is available at http://www.hamradio-online.com

------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:38 1997
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From: David Wood <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CEPT operation in the UK
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 20:52:14 +0000
Organization: via Demon Internet, UK...
Lines: 25
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59b7s1$[e-mail]>
 <01bbefa3$530d2a20$c7e84fc1@christian-p133>
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In article <01bbefa3$530d2a20$c7e84fc1@christian-p133>, Christian
Leibbrandt <[e-mail]> writes
>> ...UK amateurs hearing an overseas amateur operating in
>> this country and using 'G' prefixes should politely
>> inform them of the correct prefix to be used.
>
>So what IS the correct prefix I need to use? M0/PE1OAJ, M1/PE1OAJ,
>M/PE1OAJ?
>
>Christian "confused" Leibbrandt
>Amersfoort, Netherlands

If you have a CEPT class ONE licence (i.e. allowed to use HF) then you
should prefix with M0/

If you have a CEPT class TWO licence (144MHz and above only) then you
should prefix with M1/

73 and the compliments of the season to all,


David
--
David Wood, G0WZA
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:39 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: www.hamradio-online.com: How Your Government Can Monitor Your Communications
Date: 24 Dec 1996 20:52:20 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59pfq4$[e-mail]>
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With permission, we've reprinted a fascinating story from CovertAction
Quarterly, on worldwide government agencies ability to monitor your email, FAX
,
computer and voice communications. While some may conclude this falls into the

"conspiracy theory" class of news, we have primary sources that confirmed
portions of the story as true. Makes for interesting reading.

Check it out at http://www.hamradio-online.com

------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:40 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Ed Mitchell)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew
Subject: www.hamradio-online.com: FCC RF Safety Rules *** CORRECTION ***
Date: 24 Dec 1996 20:56:01 GMT
Organization: Virtual Publishing Co.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59pg11$[e-mail]>
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Previous posting should have noted that the FCC RF Safety Rules
compliance is postponed until September 1997 for non-Amateur services and unti
l
January 1998 for the Amateur Radio Service. Sorry if this causes you any
confusion.

See http://www.hamradio-online.com

------------------------
Ed (KF7VY) and Kim (N7VPL) Mitchell
email to [e-mail]
Visit Ham Radio Online, it's free! at
http://www.hamradio-online.com



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:41 1997
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From: Jim Alberts <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.swap,alt.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: PRO 26 MOD ? is there one?
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 15:56:28 -0500
Organization: Michigan State University
Lines: 35
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To: Greg Milligan <[e-mail]>
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Greg Milligan wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:
>
> > Is there a mod for cellular for the Pro 26?  I have one source that says
> > there is.  I would like to get a few more references before I attempt
> > it.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.
> >
> >
> > Nick Yatko
> > [e-mail]
>
> Nick you can find various bits of info at the tandy support web site
>
> http://support.tandy.com/support_electronics/15613.html
>
> and a cell modification provided by Ross Voorhees (KB0PKT) at
>
> http://www.zianet.com/kc5kto/mods/pro26cell.html
>
> Hope this helps.
> --
> Greg Milligan
>
> The University of Sheffield, Department of Clinical Neurology, Floor 'N',
> Royal Hallamshire Hospital, Glossop Road, Sheffield S10 2JF, UK.
> Tel: [phone]    Fax: [phone]   EMail:[e-mail]
> World Wide Web: http://www.shef.ac.uk/uni/academic/A-C/cn/index.html
> Amateur Radio (AX25 Packet Network): G1CPU@GB7WRG.#19.GBR.EU

Cellular Group advertises that they can modify the Pro 26 along with
many others to receive cell freq. I don't happen to have their address
handy at the moment. They advertise in Monitoring Times all the time.
Maybe someone else has their address or it is on the Monitoring Times
web page.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:42 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 21:33:19 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59qmgg$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59kt5j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Will White <[e-mail]> wrote:

>This thread is amazing. Courtesy seems to be reserved for the
>airwaves, not the net. Of all the groups for a flame war, this is
>probably the least appropriate. Just a thought. . .

>--Will

This is a flame war ? Sounds more like what I would expect in
the playground at kindergarden........

73, Jim  KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:44 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 21:36:20 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <59qmm6$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net> <[e-mail]>
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"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I've heard the 706 on the air with the stock mic.
>It sounded OK to me.
>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV

>USC Law, Class of '97

That sounds pretty scientific, Roger.  Reminds me of the 10 meter after dinner
ragchews we use to have:

Station A:  I have a  new microphone, how does it sound ?

Station B: Awful.  Too many lows, no highs, and constricted.

Station C: Sounds OK to me....

Station D: I don't think it sounds as good as your other mic.

Station E: Sounds Great to me.

Personally, I have never heard any Icom HF radio that sounded 'OK' with
an Icom stock mic, so I guess either opinons still differ or Icom finally
figured out how to make a radio with decent transmit audio. Not that I don't
like Icom HF radios, I have four of them, but never could make the audio
sound good on any of them without some outboard equalization and a
little help from Mr. Heil.

73, Jim KH2D
Lorton Reform School, Class of '64





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:46 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: >> Delaware QSO Party <<
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 21:36:25 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <59qmmf$[e-mail]>
References: <59bjng$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ird4$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Doug Wittich) wrote:

>BUT nobody has yet to give a reasonable explanation as to why special
>events stations and many contest frequencies are in the general
>subband.    If only all the energy used by some (not all) to flame
>were used to educate, we'd all become a whole lot smarter.

>Doug

Well, Doug, maybe for the same reasons that all extra class CW operators
are not in the Novice subbands working CW at 4 wpm.  As you advance in
ham radio, you will find more things available to you.

Maybe you have a misconception of what a ham radio contest is.  A
contest is an event that usually lasts 24 to 48 hours, and the object of said
contest is to work as many stations as possible for QSO points in as many
sections/countries/zones as possible for multipliers.   Most CW contest
operators can work 3 or 4 stations a minute, and most CW contest operators
operate at 25 to 40 wpm.  So it shouldn't be hard to figure out why most
contests aren't done in the novice subbands.  Some ARRL contests give
extra points for working Novices/Technicians.  So the time differential spent
to work people at slower rates is compensated by additional points.

Contrary to what you may have read in the newsgroups, a contest on the ham
bands involves much more than turning on the radio and screaming your callsign
.
There are a lot of ham stations that are dedicated to contesting, and these
stations are usually equipped with the best hardware available.  Contesters
spend a lot of time (an money) on antenna systems.  Hams who are contesters ar
e
usually very educated as to propagation.  They know when they will be able to
hear certain parts of the world and they look in the right direction at the
right time.  Contesters do a lot of homework in the weeks preceeding a contest
.
They study propagation, they watch all the DX bulletins to see who will be
operating from which rare location, they plan stradegies based on
bands/propagation forecasts, etc.  Computers are a part of most contest
stations.   Not only for logging, but for propagation modeling, watching the
greyline, DX spotting, etc. Contesters are the best operators - if you ever ne
ed
somebody to pull a weak signal out of the noise, go find a contester.  If you
ever need someone to pick out callsigns when 80 stations are calling, go find
a
contester.

Phone rates in contests are usually a bit higher than CW rates.  I don't know
what the novice subbands sound like on HF in the U.S., but I do know that
when I go looking around for a novice or technician in the novice subbands I
usuallly can't find one.  So since most people who enter contests are looking
for the most stations to work, they look where they can find them.

Anyway, Doug. that's what contests are.  Some people participate, not from a
'trying to win' standpoint, but just tuning around looking for new countries t
o
contact.  If you ever get a chance to visit a contest station, please do.  I a
m
sure you will find it very interesting.  When I was a new ham, I had a chance
to
visit a big multi mutli station (multiple operators, on all bands at the same
time) in Maryland, W3AU.   They even invited me to operate for a while, and it

was a visit and an experience I will never forget.

As for special event stations, I really can't answer your question. I have nev
er
been interested in working anyone who had a special event callsign commemorati
ng
the corn harvest in Iowa, so I don't know much about them.  But I would imagin
e
it shouldn't be two much of a problem for them to operate in novice/tech
subbands, because the special event stations I have heard didn't seem to be
working people as fast as possible.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:47 1997
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From: Larry <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Canadian allocations
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 16:43:55 -0500
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58mk2g$[e-mail]> <01bbe9df$774044a0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Dave Hockaday wrote:
>
> Bill Evans wrote:
>
> > Fair comment Scott.  I apologize for my fellow Canadian hams who venture
> > below 7050 KHz.. There is no need to do so.  If I heard a VE below 7050 on
> > phone, I'd likely say something to him.  The 40m CW band is a precious
> > resource.
> > I operate on 40 above 7150KHz about half of the time.
> > 73
> > Bill VE4UD
>
> Hi Bill. What is the Canadian phone allocation for the 80 meter band? There
was a VE
> something phone op on 3.720 about a week ago raising all sorts of noise abou
t US
> novices operating in "his" phone segment.
>
> --
> Dave Hockaday WB4IUY
> [e-mail]
> WB4IUY@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
>
> http://www.ipass.net/~hockaday/
> http://www.ipass.net/~wb4iuy/
> http://www.ipass.net/~teara/
> http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/3349/
> http://www.RTPnet.org/~fcarc/
> http://www.RTPnet.org/~rdrc/
test


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:48 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The dumb habits of hams
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 21:45:24 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58kr2d$1br0$[e-mail]> <58l89d$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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On Sun, 15 Dec 1996 08:52:24 -0800, "J. Andy Thompson"
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>George Baker wrote:
>
>>
>> Here is another slant on it:
>>
>> In a pre-WW2 issue of QST, someone wrote in complaining about the use of "w
e" instead of
>> "I" in ham conversation - funny how that same subject is still in debate!
>>
>> Anyway, one response was that it was ok to say "we" since indeed there are
two entities
>> involved: the operator and his station. When we say that "we" worked so-and
-so, we are
>> actually giving credit to the station as much as to the operator.
>>
>> In those olden days, our equipment was very much a part of ourselves since
it was
>> largely self-designed and homebuilt. So, it was natural to feel a certain c
ompanionship
>> with our rigs which expressed itself in the unconscious use of "we" in desc
ribing "our"
>> activities.
>>
>> --
>> 73, George
>> W5YR
>> Fairview, TX
>
>
>I was always told that the person that uses "WE" is either henpecked, or
>still owes the bank for his rig.
>
>Andy W7CXA
test



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:49 1997
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From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 24 Dec 1996 21:53:38 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Eric one real good reason to keep CW Testing is to keep Clowns Like you
out of it.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:50 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 22:01:57 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]> <59e39j$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd56-148.compuserve.com
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On Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:52:10 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
wrote:

>[e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo) wrote:
>
>>I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
>>keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
>>a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
>>antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
>>checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
>>fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
>>solve this problem.
>
>>I don't know how long this problem has existed, I just noticed it
>>today.
>
>>Thanks
>>Sam KC8BQP
>
>Welcome to the wonderful world of R.F. Burns, Sam.  Only two solutions I
>can think of are a) reduce your power output on 80 meters or b) move the
>eighty meter antenna away from the shack a bit farther.  Sounds like the
>RF field in your shack is a bit strong.  Has your cat, by any chance, stopped
>having kittens ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
Is it possible you may have lost your ground line?
larry ve3fxq



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:51 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RF burns through keyer???
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 22:04:29 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59al5c$gk6$[e-mail]> <59e39j$[e-mail]>
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On Fri, 20 Dec 1996 02:52:10 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
wrote:

>[e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo) wrote:
>
>>I just noticed today that if I touch the metal hardware on my MFJ-442C
>>keyer while transmitting, I get burned. It feels more like a burn than
>>a shock. It only does it on 80 meters when I'm switched to the
>>antenna. If I transmit into a dummy antenna, everything seems fine. I
>>checked all my grounds and they seem OK. Visually everything looks
>>fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might start to
>>solve this problem.
>
>>I don't know how long this problem has existed, I just noticed it
>>today.
>
>>Thanks
>>Sam KC8BQP
>
>Welcome to the wonderful world of R.F. Burns, Sam.  Only two solutions I
>can think of are a) reduce your power output on 80 meters or b) move the
>eighty meter antenna away from the shack a bit farther.  Sounds like the
>RF field in your shack is a bit strong.  Has your cat, by any chance, stopped
>having kittens ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
Is it possible that you could have the wires reversed..  eg the frame
of your keyer is connected to the hot of you keyer input?
Larry ve3fxq



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:52 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 14:07:48 -0800
Organization: Berbee Information Networks Corporation
Lines: 70
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59nugf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: msn-5-11.binc.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121599 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44617 rec.radio.shortwave:91051

You are using the same argument to try and relax the test for ham radio
as is being used through American society regarding every rule/law we
have. Here are a few examples;

I don't like guns, outlaw them.

I want to run nude down Main Street, why not, who does it hurt?

Why should I need to take a test to drive a car? I can drive a car just
as well whether I take a test or not. Taking a test does not make me a
better driver.

There is no good reason to lean math, I can do it on a calculator.

There is no good reason to learn to spell, I have a spell checker on my
computer.

There is no good reason to work hard at my job, I get paid the same
whether I do things that the boss will never know about, just because it
is the right thing to do.

There is no good reason not to eat dog and cat meat.

There is no good reason to learn to speak English to live in this
country, when I can't get a good job I will say I am not liked.

There is no good reason why a police officer should be forced to wear a
uniform, it is uncomfortable and hot in the summer, shorts and a tee
shirt would be better.

As you can see, we could go on and on. I keep hearing that there is not
one good reason to keep the code requirement for a ham ticket. Name one
good reason why we SHOULD NOT keep it.

The fact that THAT IS THE WAY IT IS, should be good enough. There are
lots of good reasons to learn the code, the only reason not to learn it
is that you don't think you should have to. Part of being a ham is
knowing the Morse code. You can't be in the French club with out wanting
to speak French and you can't be a real radio "HAM," note that I did not
say "radio operator," without learning the Morse code. It is a
tradition. It is part of ham radio.

You should learn Morse code as part of getting your ham ticket for the
same reason you should know how to add without a calculator. You don't
have to know, but it is a good idea.

By the way, why should I need to know how to read or right to to be a
ham? I don't need it to use phone bands.

Why have a test at all? That is what you are really saying. You don't
need to take a test to talk on the radio, you just need to know how to
talk.

Getting rid of the code test is just step one in the CB operators take
over of the ham bands. The next step is to get rid of testing at all.
Why have ham radio? We have the phone company and I don't need to take
no test for that.

Why should
KC5WCP wrote:
>
> In fact I have yet to hear one reasonable reason.
> Not to say that you don't find the reasons reasonable, they just don't
> hold water folks.
> There is not one good reason to keep the code requirement. There are
> plenty to keep CW sub bands. But to be required to pass a code test to
> use phone is silly.
>
> Eric



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 24 Dec 1996 17:10:20 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <59pkcc$[e-mail]>
References: <59jlen$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p8nl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

Jim Kehler wrote:

> Are you a CODED ham operator, or one of the other kind ?

Hey Jim. Merry Christmas!

How many "other kinds" are there? I can only think of three:

Codeless Hams (those who don't know the code)

Squiggie Hams (those who copy 20wpm CW in their head but never passed an
                extra-class examination despite 'forgetting more RF theory
                while relieving my prostrate than the entire combined
                amateur population of the known universe knows.)

Lennie Hams (those who don't bother with tests at all but just get on
                the air and operate HF whenever they feel like it anyway.)


Are there more?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!hammer.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ANONYMOUS POSTER CAUGHT--KEVIN POTTER  WAS:Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 14:15:07 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Anthony R. Gold wrote:

> I haven't yet figured how to handle Kevin's confessions :-)

I am working on a way to hear confessions & give sacraments to
all my my internet flock at this time.

Peace be with you, my son.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:55 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!slay
From: [e-mail] (Sandy Lynch)
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597ufd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59o2i9$[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 22:28:47 GMT
Lines: 38
Sender: [e-mail]

KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:

: I appreciate the older hams that offer help and do understand that
: they are a wealth of knowledge. Problem is, most of them I run into
: look down upon us no-coders. NOT ALL, most.

Do the old-timers REALLY "look down" upon the no-coders?  I mean, what
are the facts of the matter?   I doubt seriously that it is a matter
of "looking down".  What would you expect them to do?  These fellows
have decades of experience and are, or should be, the role models
for those that are newcomers.  Just because a teacher has far more
experience and knowledge than the pupil .... this does not mean that
they "look down".  If the pupil is themself arrogant and not interested
in learning ... (any parallels come to mind here??) ... then it is
easier to understand the scorn which may be harbored by the teacher
(ie. Old-timer).

Old timers (and teachers) LOVE to work with motivated newcomers.
It's not so much the "traditions" and the "good old days" as much
as it is the "enthusiasm" that the Old-timers want to see.  The
enthusiasm comes from the feeling of MAGIC in Ham Radio.

Many of us use cellular telephones and/or make long distance/international
telephone calls on a regular basis without giving it a second thought.
Those who feel the MAGIC of ham radio know there is no comparison with
using a radio to talk with somebody across town, across the country,
or overseas.  We can FEEL that we (our signals) are reaching out and
that we are establishing a direct connection.   This is something that
many newcomers cannot understand.

Do YOU feel the magic of ham radio, or are you more interested in
a particular technical aspect of the hobby?

Regards,
Sandy W7BX (ex-WA6BXH)
age: 44  and a ham since 1963.
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THE FINAL WORD
Date: 24 Dec 1996 23:17:30 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>Won't happen, it takes effort to study.  That doesn't happen in today's
>"something for nothing mentality."

Another whining old ham.  *sigh*




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 24 Dec 1996 23:19:54 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59p8nl$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

> Are you a CODED ham operator

Yes


>or one of the other kind ?

Typical HAM OPERTATOR arrogance strikes again!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IDE hard drives for sale
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 16:23:03 -0700
Organization: Network Service
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pp6b$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: den-co5-04.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 24  6:24:16 PM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Robin in Denver wrote:
>
> I have 2 used IDE hard disk drives IÆd  like to sell together. One is a
> Maxtor 540 meg and the other is a Maxtor 345 meg. Both are in fine
> condition. No cables or anything go with them, just selling the drives.
> They havenÆt been used excessively like in a server or bbs or anything,
> just me at home, probably less than 7 hours a day on the average for about
> 2 years. I think they both have mtbfÆs of around 50,000 hours.
>
> IÆd like to get around $160 for both + shipping, but can be a little
> flexible. If I canÆt get something reasonable, IÆll keep them. Email me if
> interested.
>
> - Robin
> [e-mail]
>

Worth $50 for both. A new 1GB hd can be had for $150.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:09:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 24 Dec 1996 23:24:56 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>Are there more?

You forgot "OLD FART ARROGANT HAMS"

Judging from the responses in this newsgroup, I would say this comprises
the largest group of all.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 24 Dec 1996 16:30:03 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <59pp1r$[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59gdd6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59k2mr$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Posted-By: @206.165.21.164 (wa7twi)
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

John Mackey--KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Dicky-boy Kendrick wrote:

>> reply said "Hi Bill :-)". The lack of nonsense in the scanner groups is
>> directly attributed to your absence.

>No actually it is the PRESENCE of myself & a few others that is now
>preserving
>the integrity & sanity of the scanner NG now.  Otherwise, the problem
>individual would be running loose.

Your "presense" is about as dominant as a grain of sand in a tornado and
about as useful. You're too much of a hypoctrite to impart any integrity or
sanity to any newsgroup.

>
>> We had this conversation previously in a thread entitled "Mackey's Verbosit
y."
>> The quantity of your bombast is inverserly proportional to its substance.

>At least there is some proportional relation. Otoh, EVERYTHING we get
>from YOU
>is CRAP.  At the last meetin of PARG, you (& Eric) gave us MANY good
>laughs.

Glad you liked it. The bill is in the mail.


Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.reference.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me and I fart Elmer
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 18:31:42 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 67.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Anthony R. Gold wrote:
>
> A say lonely old man who has to make a thorough fool and a nuisance
> of himself for anyone to even notice that he exists.


"say?"
Old, yes, 51, sad, no, lonely, no.



#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.fast.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!207.17.190.11!news.diac.com!p146
From: [e-mail] (Robin in Denver)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: IDE hard drives for sale
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 96 23:32:27 GMT
Organization: Denver Internet Access Corp.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <59pp6b$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p146.ppp2.diac.com
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4

I have 2 used IDE hard disk drives IÆd  like to sell together. One is a
Maxtor 540 meg and the other is a Maxtor 345 meg. Both are in fine
condition. No cables or anything go with them, just selling the drives.
They havenÆt been used excessively like in a server or bbs or anything,
just me at home, probably less than 7 hours a day on the average for about
2 years. I think they both have mtbfÆs of around 50,000 hours.

IÆd like to get around $160 for both + shipping, but can be a little
flexible. If I canÆt get something reasonable, IÆll keep them. Email me if
interested.



- Robin
[e-mail]

Universal Planetary Alliance Headquarters in Denver:
http://www.diac.com/~ladyrobn/index.htm



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-hk.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!news.glink.net.hk!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me Burt
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 18:33:21 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 67.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Andrew C Robertson wrote:

> Also now available is the "Tickle Me Burt" doll, which endlessly posts
> boring mean-spirited crap to usenet and secretly hates itself.  Upon
> tickling, it shows you how to use an overhead projector.
>
>

Get a life.
Then get a real name.

drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob
drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob
drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob drewbob

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: www.hamradio-online.com: How Your Government Can Monitor Your Communications
Date: 24 Dec 1996 18:49:38 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59pq6i$[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121615 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20861 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44628 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22366 rec.radio.scanner:73934 rec.radio.shortwave:91063 aus.radio.amateur.misc:1688 aus.radio.amateur.digital:309

In article <59pfq4$[e-mail]>,
        Ed Mitchell <[e-mail]> wrote:

>With permission, we've reprinted a fascinating story from CovertAction
>Quarterly, on worldwide government agencies ability to monitor your email, FA
X,
>computer and voice communications.

Old news. Government agencies have had the capability for years.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.magicnet.net!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 17:00:19 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58ikpa$[e-mail]> <58oup1$[e-mail]> <58uh72$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59kt5j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts3-17.goodnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)

John Mackey--KA0SSF wrote:
>
> So instead of looking honestly & try to address the issue that Will has
> brought up, Eric tries to de-focus the attention from him by pointing
> at another problem.
HA!
>
> Sounds like a little kid upon getting in trouble says, "but mommy he
> did it too" & then points at his friend or brother.
Poor comparison, John Jr. Why don;t you grow up. I did give some useful
info and NOW you attack it as dispursions, etc. Don't you have anything
better to do?




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "Victor D. Mete" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: WTB: Alinco Dx-70T
Date: 25 Dec 1996 01:49:55 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <01bbf19a$603711e0$935092cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.84.214
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1160
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45008 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121624 rec.radio.swap:101012

I am looking for an Alinco DX-70T in MINT condition. Please E-MAIL details
if you have a rig for-sale or call  954-974-9136 (work # - ok to leave msg)
--
Victor
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "Victor D. Mete" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Info Wanted: on Yaesu FT-840 HF Transceiver
Date: 25 Dec 1996 01:49:56 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <01bbf205$ddabc240$d65492cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.84.214
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1160
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1682 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45028 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121651

        I am looking to buy an HF rig. Recently, having posted a request for info
on Alinco DX-70T vs Icom IC-706,  MANY responded and I concluded the DX-70T
while it has fewer bells and whistles, HF performance is better. NOW, the
FT-840 price is in the same range as the Alinco.Which one to buy?
        Please send me your input on the FT-840 and any comparison to the DX-70T
if any. Also, I am wondering if there are mods for the FT-840.  Thanks for
responding. I appreciate the input.

--
Victor
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:10 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 01:52:36 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59r5mm$[e-mail]>
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n5ek$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-159.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Doug Smith) wrote:

>[e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold") wrote:
>>> At 110Vac it takes approx .5 amps to be fatal.
>>I would hazzard the guess (or is that guess the hazzard?) that the
>>path of the current through you is material to the degree of danger.

>Absolutely, and over the more fatal paths (through the chest) it takes
>a lot less than 1/2 amp.  Someone else cited 30mA, and that figure
>sounds right to me.

>73 Doug

I have been following this thread with great interest.  But I think most of
what I have been reading is based on speculation, not fact or test results.
How about we start the new year off rite and do some testing.  What say
we plug Squiggy into a wall socket and do some measurements ?

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:11 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 01:55:29 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <59r5s4$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]> <59krpb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121653 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44653

[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Dick Flanagan) wrote:

>>In article <59krpb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
>>wrote:
>>>It is only compelling to the ARRL...if the ARRL board wants to
>>>accept it.  It is NOT compelling in any technical manner as a means
>>>to justify an international treaty requirement.

>>What is interesting, of course, is that if the survey had come out in favor
>>of no-code HF, it would have been pointed to as the ultimate "word of the
>>people" that the ARRL wouldn't dare disregard.

>>It's amazing to see how the respect for a given poll differs with the
>>results of that poll.  ::chuckle::

>Excuse me Dick, but just where do you see any disrespect in my
>comment. I offered no disrespect for the poll, what I said
>stands...the poll does not, in and of itself, constitute a compelling
>technical reason to retain CW testing.

>What this poll (and any other) does is provide an indication of
>the OPINIONS (i.e. the political climate) of those being
>polled.

>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

There is only ONE compelling reason to retain CW testing, Bill.  The FCC
says we have to do it.  Go change that, and your problems are solved.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:12 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FILTER
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 02:02:48 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59r69r$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-159.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:


>M>You need to read this newsgroup more carefully.  Many HAM OPERATORS seem
> >to swear by the outdated Morse requirements as a way to "keep the
> >riff-raff out."

>It's not perfect, but it helps.

>---
>   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

>--

I talked to my friend, the extra class conservative the other day about the no
code thing.  I think riff raff is probably a bit too strong a term and it
probably insults people.  He thinks (and I do too) that it makes people have a
little more respect for the privledges they get with a ham license when they
have to put forth some effort to get it.  So I think a better way of saying wh
at
you said is that CW testing keeps out people who really aren't interested in t
he
hobby enuff to put forth some effort to enter it.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](au)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re:  FAKE HAMS
Date: 25 Dec 1996 02:54:47 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <59q51n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: eug-or3-42.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 24  6:54:47 PM PST 1996

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail]
(Gms1132) writes:
>
>fake hams are people who become hams so they can get on the licensed
bands
>and keep on doing their crap and jamming they were doing on C.B.fake
hams
>also think they're real hams because they take and pass their code
class
>licenses; even when they still go out and jam and violate fcc rules
and
>regs. R U THAT KIND OF HAM? ----that's my two cents worth....de
tigreyez!

Try saying that all in one breath!




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:13 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me and I fart Elmer
Date: 25 Dec 1996 03:26:25 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>A new ham doll has been released and it stinks.
>It comes in white only and is wrinkled and fat.
>When you tickle him it says HI HI, passes gas and dribbles

And then it sits in the corner and plays with his Iambic paddle, mumbling
some nonsense about Morse code and "real hams"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:14 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 20:27:07 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts3-17.goodnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121639 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44646 rec.radio.scanner:73951

FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
 OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.   The Compliance and Information Bureau
 (CIB), by delegated authority, issued a Notice of Monetary Forfeiture
to
 Timothy Harold Hoffman for the willful violation of the Communications
Act
 of 1934, as amended, and the Commission's rules.  Report No: CI 96-4.
by
 Forfeiture Order.  Action by: Chief, Compliance Division, CIB.
Adopted:
 December 20, 1996.  (DA No. 96-2180).  News Media Contact: Meribeth
 McCarrick [phone].  CIB Contact: Rocco Campagna at (202)
418-1229.
 Internet URL: /Bureaus/Compliance/News_Releases/nrci5011.txt



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:15 1997
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From: "Ira H. Sachs" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: low band handi talkie
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 21:48:57 -0600
Organization: WorldWide Access (tm) - Chicagoland Internet Services (http://www.wwa.com)
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pool14-022.wwa.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

There was a company manufacturing a handi-talkie, about two watts for 20
>>meters and 40 meters. It is battery operated and supposedly sold now
>>only in Japan; although it was offered for sale for a short time in the
>>U.S.
>>>I think the brand might have been "MIZUHO" or something similiar.
>>>Does anyone know where I might obtain one of these worthless and
>>impractical toys?
>>
>>De WB9HNV
>Please reply to [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:16 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!news.abs.net!news.scn.org!scn.org!bb840
From: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail] (James Aeschliman)
Organization: Seattle Community Network
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 04:39:13 GMT
Lines: 34


In a previous article, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman) says:

>>>
>>I've heard this too, but I read it in an article.  It's probably correct.
>>But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current is
>>less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
>>the current that kills, not the voltage.
>>--
>>Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
>>Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK
>
>Arrrgh! Doesn't *anyone* understand Ohm's Law anymore?
>
>I = E/R
>
>If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
>what happens to I?
>
>What happens is that "I" get fried twice as extra crispy.
>Sheesh!
>
>Gary
>--
You are absolutely right and I stand corrected.  Let me try again.  If a
receiver wired for 110 V has 100 watts output to the speakers, it will
draw about 1 amp.  A similar receiver wired for 220 V having 100 watts
output to the speakers, however will draw about 0.5 amp.  For the same
power out, higher voltages require less current.  This was the point of
the articles I referred to, i.e. that lower current at higher voltages is
safer than higher current at lower voltages.
--
Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:17 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Mission Viejo, Southern California hams
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 04:43:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <59p4je$[e-mail]>
Lines: 12


>>Any so. Californian hams out there?

Tens of thousands.

>>...I was wondering if anyone has a decent radio for a decent price.

What do you want? What do you need? Have you joined one of Orange
County's several Amateur Radio Clubs? What do you want to do with your
Amateur privileges?

Two Meter? 220? 440? Want to use Morse Code?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Tickle me and I fart Elmer
Date: 24 Dec 1996 23:49:15 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59qbob$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        MN Maniac <[e-mail]> wrote:

>And then it sits in the corner and plays with his Iambic paddle, mumbling
>some nonsense about Morse code and "real hams"

There's your mistake. Anyone knows that "real" CW operators use a
brass straight key. Bugs and iambic paddles are for wimps with no
fists.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:19 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: 25 Dec 1996 05:24:56 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.<<

Suggestion: while the FCC's enforcement division is in Phoenix, why don't
they drop down to 27.635 and 27.385 to take care of Frank Burns and his
gang of idiots down there?  These guys have been at it on a daily basis
for years...agitating, running power, illegal frequencies, profanity,
etc., and nobody ever seems to do anything about it.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!207.98.128.66!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 1996 23:27:51 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts19-8.goodnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)

MN Maniac wrote:
>
> >>FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
> OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.<<
>
> Suggestion: while the FCC's enforcement division is in Phoenix, why don't
> they drop down to 27.635 and 27.385 to take care of Frank Burns and his
> gang of idiots down there?  These guys have been at it on a daily basis
> for years...agitating, running power, illegal frequencies, profanity,
> etc., and nobody ever seems to do anything about it.
Well,
they have. Who do you think Tim Hoffman is? He is one of that breed of
idiot that comes up to the ham bands and bootlegs calls and creates all
kinds of heat and discontent.

You should listen to 27.365 locally here in phoenix. You can not only
hear Frank, but Howard Kingston badmouthing his neighbors wife, Whiskers
creating his own mayhem and a number of others who feel that they have
the right to do whatever they want.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.255.144.8!bcs3.bccom.com!news
From: "Richard M. Corrigan" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: CW Interface
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:57:34 +0900
Organization: BenchMark Communications Systems
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max1-060.sunnynet.or.jp
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122136 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20946 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45405 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22561 rec.radio.shortwave:91478

I recently heard of a cable that attaches from you Reciever to
the serial port of a computer which allows CW to be translated
by your Computer for display on your monitor.  Is this true?
I thought that a TNC was needed.  If it is true does anyone
have the pin outs to build such a cable or maybe a source that
I could contact to obtain one.

                Thanks and Merry Christmas

                       Rich
,




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:22 1997
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From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 96 07:03:02 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.demon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] "James Aeschliman" writes:

>
> In a previous article, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman) says:
>
> >>>
> >>I've heard this too, but I read it in an article.  It's probably correct.
> >>But I've also heard that 240 V is safer than 120 V, because the current is
> >>less, not greater.  This is because the load stays the same.  Also, it's
> >>the current that kills, not the voltage.
> >>--
> >>Jim Aeschliman                      [e-mail]
> >>Black Diamond, Washington           KD7MK
> >
> >Arrrgh! Doesn't *anyone* understand Ohm's Law anymore?
> >
> >I = E/R
> >
> >If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
> >what happens to I?
> >
> >What happens is that "I" get fried twice as extra crispy.
> >Sheesh!
> >
> >Gary
> >--
> You are absolutely right and I stand corrected.  Let me try again.  If a
> receiver wired for 110 V has 100 watts output to the speakers, it will
> draw about 1 amp.  A similar receiver wired for 220 V having 100 watts
> output to the speakers, however will draw about 0.5 amp.  For the same
> power out, higher voltages require less current.  This was the point of
> the articles I referred to, i.e. that lower current at higher voltages is
> safer than higher current at lower voltages.

I still think you're in a muddle.  The current flowing through a
receiver is not a risk, it is current accidentally flowing through a
person which causes a harzardous shock.  And the human body does not
have an automatic power regulator to reduce current at a greater
voltage; on the contrary, the regulation is by Ohm's Law which will
have quite the reverse effect.

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.edm.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Eric Shamay)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mission Viejo, Southern California hams
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 07:06:28 GMT
Organization: EDM Network
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <59qasp$[e-mail]>
References: <59p4je$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port213.edm.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

>What do you want? What do you need? Have you joined one of Orange
>County's several Amateur Radio Clubs? What do you want to do with your
>Amateur privileges?

>Two Meter? 220? 440? Want to use Morse Code?

Well, I'm not quite sure of what I want quite yet. I haven't really
scavanged around much lately. I do NEED a radio though... (see the
former part of the reply at this point...) I will be taking the test
in January so I won't have much use for one until then. I would like
to know what a good radio consists of, what a good price is and what I
will need/ should have to begin with. I will have (if I pass, that
is...) a tech plus license and will therefor be quite prone to using
CW frequently. So I guess I would need some sort of keyer for it. I'll
join SOARA as soon as I can for the repeater privileges...

Keep in mind that I am unemployed (student/slacker/leech) so my budget
will most likely fall in the $300-500 range for a radio + equipment
(whatever people suggest)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:24 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 07:58:20 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <59rr4i$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz>
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"mttly1" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>  Gentlemen;

>        Myself not being a ham have been reading the pros and the cons of
>the discussions and also keeping up with the technologies that are
>unfolding every week it seems in the world of radio.

Dear Mttly1,
         That was your first mistake. Reading the garbage here in usenet and
thinking it is in any way indicitive of what ham radio is really about.   Your

second mistake was obviously believing some of what you have read  here.
Ham radio is like sex.  Listening to other people talk about it will never let

you experience what it really feels like.  If you are REALLY interested in
ham radio, I would suggest that you do what is required to get a license and
see what it feels like first hand.  Once you experience the magic for yourself
,
I am sure you will see things in a very different light.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:26 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 07:59:23 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <59rr6g$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59nugf$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>"Thomas R. Sundstrom" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Listening to Len's Ham Radio & More show early this morning on WWCR and
>>this pro-code, anti-code business... and Len's promotion of the no-code
>>General...

>>Did'ja ever notice that high speed code atop music is used throughout
>>the programming to move from feature to feature?

>>Hmmm... ironic, isn't it?

>Not ironic Tom, just cute. Still and all not a good reason to keep the
>code requirement. In fact I have yet to hear one reasonable reason.
>Not to say that you don't find the reasons reasonable, they just don't
>hold water folks.
>There is not one good reason to keep the code requirement. There are
>plenty to keep CW sub bands. But to be required to pass a code test to
>use phone is silly.

>Eric

Almost as silly as suggesting that people on welfare get a job, right Eric ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:27 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Svetozar Iliev)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info-Hams Digest V96 #1565
Date: 25 Dec 96 08:15:34 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

unscribe
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:28 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FILTER
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 08:30:34 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <59rt0v$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59r69r$[e-mail]> <59rj1d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <59r69r$[e-mail]>,
>       Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>I talked to my friend, the extra class conservative the other day about the
no
>>code thing.  I think riff raff is probably a bit too strong a term and it
>>probably insults people.

>Okay, you're right. There are many classy criminals. Perhaps the term
>"trash" would be better. 'Helps keep the <white/black/asian/hispanic/etc>
>trash off HF'. Maybe that is better?

>MD

That's great, Mike. I'm sure everybody will be happy with that.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:29 1997
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From: Bill Beekman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THE FINAL WORD
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 03:50:25 -0500
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Roland Stiner wrote:
>
> W>Looks like you No-Coders Better start Studying if you want to get on
> HF
>
> Won't happen, it takes effort to study.  That doesn't happen in today's
> "something for nothing mentality."
>
> ---
>    OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
>
> --


Not all of us are lazy.  Taking the test in January..

kc8cwp


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.55.3.16!news2.mnsinc.com!news1.mnsinc.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Brian Carling)
Newsgroups: alt.radio.pirate,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors
Subject: Radio Resources
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 13:02:39 GMT
Organization: Glowbugs
Lines: 19
Distribution: inet
Message-ID: <59rj65$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: bry.mnsinc.com
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Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.pirate:22152 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121669 rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:1259

Hi guys - I have been organizing my links and things a little better
at the web page if anyone would enjoy seeing them in a more
organized fashion, take a look at

http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/hamlynx.htm#tubeproj

for the Glowbugs projects OR:

http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/hamlynx.htm#qrp
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/hamlynx.htm#boatanch
etc.

MERRY CHRISTMAS & ENJOY!

73 from Bry  (((Amateur Radio G3XLQ / AF4K)))
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry
E-mail:  [e-mail]
Home of MEGALIST ham radio files, SWL info. etc. etc.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.149.24.18!excalibur.flash.net!not-for-mail
From: Gary Danaher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 07:21:16 -0600
Organization: Flashnet Communications, http://www.flash.net
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p5o6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: iasc2-96.flash.net
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC)

Membership in the ARRL is rather like a typical marriage these days. You
don't always agree with what goes on, but you don't get a divorce the
first or the tenth time you have a disagreement. The ARRL is the best
communal voice we amateurs have to address needs and concerns to the
powers that be, and like it or not, you have to support the organization
and provide your input. If you don't like policy, lobby to change it.
Gary Danaher
AB5RM


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:31 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: MISC. ITEMS!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 14:29:00 +0000
Organization: Alpha.net -- Milwaukee, WI
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: port66.pitnet.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Macintosh; U; 68K)

I have the following for sale:

Radio Shack PRO-50 Scanner

The perfect scanner the beginner!

List Price: $139.99
Asking:      $65.00

Sanyo Black & White Survellance Camera

Asking:     $75.00

Both prices are NOT firm!
Make an offer via e-mail!

Also, more info available by e-mail!

--
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
-  *<|:)    Happy Holidays!   *<|:)   -
*         [e-mail]          *
-                  or                 -
*        [e-mail]         *
-  http://personal.pitnet.net/andrewg -
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!dublin.bitwise.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Skid Schermerhorn, W1TTY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Call Sign
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 14:36:36 GMT
Organization: In the land of the happily retired sinc 1981.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59re0s$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ost68.capecod.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"James Demos, MD" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>HI,
>I recently changes my call sign to K2DE, and would be interested in any
>information anyone may have regarding it.
>Thanks for reading this, Happy Holidays
>--

>**********************************************
>*   73 DE JIM                                *
>*   [e-mail]                        *
>*                                            *
>**********************************************

Spring 1956 Callbook says:

K2DE  Victor J. Braidwood, 507 West Spring Avenue, North Wildwood,
N.J.

BTW, if you want your name to NOT have quotes around it, take the
comma out.

73


Skid Schermerhorn        http://www.capecod.net/~sscherme
Cape Cod, Massachusetts  http://www.capecod.net/~sscherme/webtest.htm
USA                      http://www.capecod.net/~sscherme/church.htm



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:34 1997
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From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IDE hard drives for sale
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 09:51:06 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pp6b$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 67.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)
To: jim daneke <[e-mail]>

jim daneke wrote:
>
> Robin in Denver wrote:
>
> Worth $50 for both. A new 1GB hd can be had for $150.

They are worth more than $50

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:35 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Source for license statis
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 14:57:11 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd62-157.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On 22 Dec 96 22:46:00 GMT, [e-mail]
(Roland Stiner) wrote:

>
>F>Can anyone point me to a source for statistics on the current distribution
of
> >US Amateur licenses?  How many Extras/Advanced/General/Tech+/Tech/Novice?
>
>It is in the Radio Amateur Callbook (Flying Horse)
>
>---
>   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
>--
I can't speak from experience but you might try the fcc website, or
the arrl website.  If they don't have it they might have an email
address you can send an inquire to.
Larry ve3fxq



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:36 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:25:44 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59slbd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-129.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121718 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44693 rec.radio.scanner:74025

[e-mail]-- (R. A. Green) wrote:

>On Tue, 24 Dec 1996 20:27:07 -0700, Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
>wrote:

>>FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
>> OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.   The Compliance and Information Bureau
>> (CIB), by delegated authority, issued a Notice of Monetary Forfeiture
>>to
><snip>
>What did this guy do, anyway?
>--ron

He failed the 5 wpm code test.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:37 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:28:34 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59slgo$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-129.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>Are there more?

>You forgot "OLD FART ARROGANT HAMS"

>Judging from the responses in this newsgroup, I would say this comprises
>the largest group of all.

Merry Christmas Mike. You also forgot WANNABE hams, like MN Maniac.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:38 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:30:56 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <59rl11$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp24.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Eric one real good reason to keep CW Testing is to keep Clowns Like you
>out of it.

Now there is a good reason. Sure proves my point. Thanks for the
freebee bud. Keep pluggin' away and the more comments like this the
better.

Merry Christmas
Peace and love to you and your family.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:38:04 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <59rled$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp24.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Eric any Excuse in the World Group is that what you our, is it that you
>our affraid you cant learn CW or is that you just dont want to. Why do you
>Guys keep whinning about your Short Commings, know one is Making you Learn
>CW, if you dont want to stay on VHF.
 Look I am not being a spelling critic here. But please lern some
sentence structure. I find it hard to determine the meaning of your
post.
If you took some time out from beeping and tried hooked on phonics you
might better communicate your message.

The above insultingtype comment comes courtesy and consideration to
WA8ULX and the insult he offered in a previous note. It has nothing to
do with the debate I just wanted him to know how it feels when someone
belittles you for what you are.

Enjoy



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:44:08 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <59rlpp$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <597ufd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59o2i9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp24.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Sandy Lynch) wrote:

>KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:

>: I appreciate the older hams that offer help and do understand that
>: they are a wealth of knowledge. Problem is, most of them I run into
>: look down upon us no-coders. NOT ALL, most.

>Do the old-timers REALLY "look down" upon the no-coders?  I mean, what
>are the facts of the matter?   I doubt seriously that it is a matter
>of "looking down".  What would you expect them to do?  These fellows
>have decades of experience and are, or should be, the role models
>for those that are newcomers.  Just because a teacher has far more
>experience and knowledge than the pupil .... this does not mean that
>they "look down".  If the pupil is themself arrogant and not interested
>in learning ... (any parallels come to mind here??) ... then it is
>easier to understand the scorn which may be harbored by the teacher
>(ie. Old-timer).
The few oldtimers that even talk to me know that I am not only
knowledgable, but willing to learn. I gues that comes from my always
pestering them with questions.
The ones that don't talk to me no matter how courteous I am to them on
the air or face to face have made it clear through channels that it is
because of my no-code approach. Then again, these oldtimers are well
knwon to be so useless that they need someone to change a fuse for
them when their rigs go POOF. they probably figure that if they would
have had to take a real test they would never made it into ham radio.
>Old timers (and teachers) LOVE to work with motivated newcomers.
>It's not so much the "traditions" and the "good old days" as much
>as it is the "enthusiasm" that the Old-timers want to see.  The
>enthusiasm comes from the feeling of MAGIC in Ham Radio.

>Many of us use cellular telephones and/or make long distance/international
>telephone calls on a regular basis without giving it a second thought.
>Those who feel the MAGIC of ham radio know there is no comparison with
>using a radio to talk with somebody across town, across the country,
>or overseas.  We can FEEL that we (our signals) are reaching out and
>that we are establishing a direct connection.   This is something that
>many newcomers cannot understand.
Trust me I do, that is why I am trying for my DXCC(Not VUCC) on VHF.
>Do YOU feel the magic of ham radio, or are you more interested in
>a particular technical aspect of the hobby?
For me the challenge of DX on 2 is magical.
>Regards,
>Sandy W7BX (ex-WA6BXH)
>age: 44  and a ham since 1963.
>[e-mail]
Best wishes to you Sandy and may Santa leave you the finest Gold bug
in your stocking.
KC5WCP



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:42 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:48:59 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <59rm2s$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp24.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman) wrote:

>Eric KC5WCP wrote: "I just smile and keep in mind that those dinosaurs
>will eventually die"  and then attempted to cover the evil intent of
>that comment with a softer "That's not the same as wishing they'd die."
The intent was not evil. And it is not the same.
>Those two statements seem contradictory, Eric. Suppose, just suppose,
>that both your parents were OT hams and worked only CW. And suppose
>the day of their passing a Tech came up to you and said "I just smile
>and keep in mind that those dinosaurs will eventually die." Now your
>statement has been thrown back at you in a context very close to you.
Well that was not the situation. Suppose just suppose you try and
stick to the situation at hand.
>Don't you see how mean-spirited you and others have become in regard to
>this policy debate? Very shameful.
I try oh so hard to keep a cool head but then someone comes along and
insults me when they can't disprove one of my posts. After a good
string of insult it is hard not to strike back. I try to keep it to a
minumum. But a good example is what this gentleman said to me in
another post:
========
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Date: 24 Dec 1996 21:53:38 GMT

Eric one real good reason to keep CW Testing is to keep Clowns Like
you out of it.

>Jeff KH2PZ / 7

Very constructive, no?

Merry Christmas anyway.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:43 1997
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From: [e-mail] (derek hutter)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 25 Dec 1996 15:50:44 GMT
Organization: Pacifier Internet Server [phone]
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <59rigk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip40.van2.pacifier.com
Mime-Version: 1.0


Still think you guys are missing the point. On a 240 volt circut there
is only 120 volt potential to ground.

Derek K7XD



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:44 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:50:47 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59smqf$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rled$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

> Look I am not being a spelling critic here. But please lern some
>sentence structure. I find it hard to determine the meaning of your
>post.
>If you took some time out from beeping and tried hooked on phonics you
>might better communicate your message.

>The above insultingtype comment comes courtesy and consideration to
>WA8ULX and the insult he offered in a previous note. It has nothing to
>do with the debate I just wanted him to know how it feels when someone
>belittles you for what you are.

>Enjoy

Said the Pot to the Kettle.  Eric, there is only one thing lower than someone
who finds spelling faults with postings on internet.  Email Gerald McPoP if yo
u
would like to know what that is.  I can read right thru your spelling mistakes
,
but I still have a hard time figuring out the meaning of what you post.
Maybe you could post a compendium for us some day. Call it, perhaps,
"500 Reasons Why I Didn't Lern Morse Code"

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.cs.columbia.edu!news.cs.columbia.edu!news-not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Jerry B. Altzman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 25 Dec 1996 10:59:31 -0500
Organization: double ionizers association
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59rj13$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: play.cs.columbia.edu

In article <[e-mail]>,
Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>Never, never, never allow both hands or a hand and a foot to
>become the circuit path. That puts the current through the
>chest, and it takes very little to be fatal. When working on
>live equipment, make sure you're standing in a dry area, with
>rubber soled shoes, and keep one hand in your pocket, or wear
>protective rubber gloves. And for God's sake don't *lean* over
>a chassis so your belly or chest is touching it. That's Russian
>Roulette of the worst kind.

Needless to say (I didn't see Gary mention it), it is not advisable to
reach into where wires are if you wear rings (like a wedding band). Take
them off and put them in your pocket. The meticulous will take off
watches, as well.

>You should avoid working on live circuits whenever possible.
>When you do have to work on a live circuit, *think* first.
>Approach it the same way you would a buzzing rattlesnake, IE
>with a great deal of respect and caution.

Hear, hear,

>Gary

//jbaltz
--
jerry b. altzman   There is no universe   --   P. Halmos      [phone]
[e-mail]   [e-mail]                KE3ML


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-22.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FILTER
Date: 25 Dec 1996 10:59:41 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <59rj1d$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59r69r$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59r69r$[e-mail]>,
        Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I talked to my friend, the extra class conservative the other day about the n
o
>code thing.  I think riff raff is probably a bit too strong a term and it
>probably insults people.

Okay, you're right. There are many classy criminals. Perhaps the term
"trash" would be better. 'Helps keep the <white/black/asian/hispanic/etc>
trash off HF'. Maybe that is better?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.55.3.16!news2.mnsinc.com!news1.mnsinc.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Brian Carling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 6BM8 Transmitters
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 16:09:42 GMT
Organization: Glowbugs
Lines: 33
Distribution: inet
Message-ID: <59ru4r$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: bry.mnsinc.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Does ANYONE know what has happened to this article?

It has been "disappeared" off of the WWW!

Does anyone know WHO the site belongs to?

http://www.cosmosbbs.com/

OR -

http://www.cosmosbbs.com/rac.jpg

The original articles folks were looking for there were:

http://www.cosmosbbs.com/6bm8wir.jpg

AND

http://www.cosmosbbs.com/6bm8sch.jpg

I was sorry to see them go, and will try to post them here or at
N6EV's site if possible.

MINE is running out of storage space!

HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


73 from Bry  (((Amateur Radio G3XLQ / AF4K)))
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry
E-mail:  [e-mail]
Home of MEGALIST ham radio files, SWL info. etc. etc.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 25 Dec 1996 16:20:40 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>Membership in the ARRL is rather like a typical marriage these days. You
don't always agree with what goes on, but you don't get a divorce the
first or the tenth time you have a disagreement. The ARRL is the best
communal voice we amateurs have to address needs and concerns to the
powers that be, and like it or not, you have to support the organization
and provide your input. If you don't like policy, lobby to change it.
Gary Danaher
AB5RM<<

If the ARRL expects to have a future, they better get with the program and
start respecting the views of younger, newer hams instead of being a
mouthpiece for the old, pro-code bunch.  Their core membership is
literally dying off, and those all-important membership dues arre dying
along with them.  I won't give a dime to the ARRL until they modify their
tough, pro-code, head-in-the-sand views.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!Portugal.EU.net!alce!gameover.alce.pt!Pedro.Braz
From: [e-mail] (Pedro Braz)
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 96 16:22:43 GMT
Message-ID: <wgcid$16$g16000$h41$[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: TM-251E
Organization: Associacao Lusa de Correio Electronico
Lines: 13

Hello All.

Hello and Merry Christmas to you all.

I've bought a KenWood TM-251E and want to expand the receive band, I can't
find any mods on the internet, does anybody lnow how to do it?

e-mail: [e-mail]


                        thks
Pedro



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 11:29:50 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rigk$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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derek hutter wrote:
>
> Still think you guys are missing the point. On a 240 volt circut there
> is only 120 volt potential to ground.
>
> Derek K7XD

That depends on how it's wired... I've seen some power companies do some
strange things with multiple x-formers, and with 3 phase coming in to a
building, there is between 208 and 240 to ground from each phase.  I've
seen some hams wire things up strangely as well causing all kinds of
weird voltages between a single phase and ground!

Later,
Dave


--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:51 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 11:33:38 -0500
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]> <59krpb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121682 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44673

William M. Pasternak wrote:
>
> The nice thing about opinions is that we all have one.  The sad part is
> that most of us are just to lazy to do anything other than complain.
> And thats what this entire discussion has deteriorated to.
>
> de Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
> Newsline  On-Line

I find your rhetoric a bit too harsh for my blood.  Name calling is
rarely helpful. (i.e. "lazy," "complain" etc.)

I think that there are a number of things that make discussion threads
like this one valuable, rather than, as you imply, the opposite:

1)  QST has opted out as a vehicle for lively discussion of ham
political issues.  It generally functions solely as a vehicle for
announcing already-decided positions adopted by the League.  Therefore,
even rank and file members do not have QST available as a forum under
most circumstances, apart from the occasional letter to QST.  (I've had
several of mine published, at least one of which was, to be fair,
contrary to the ARRL position on the issue in question.)

2)  The internet does, in fact, get noticed.  I call your attention to
the fact that several ARRL officials have taken visible notice of this
discussion.  No doubt others have as well.

3)  The League is interested in growing its membership, for many
reasons, including legitimacy (it needs members in order to credibly
function as ham radio's representative to outsiders) and financial
considerations (dues are, I believe, its main source of income).
Accordingly, the League *needs* to know what non-members are unhappy
about.

For these reasons, I feel that you are out of line when you charactarize
these discussions so negatively.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 11:38:01 -0500
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59rsef$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-201.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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MN Maniac wrote:
>
> >>If ARRL members believe that
> retention of the Morse code as a requisite requirement for operating a
> ham station below 30 MHz be retained, then it is obligated to fight for
> that ideal -- regardless of what you or I might want. <<
>
> Looks like this issue will ultimately be decided in the courts.

I have no idea why you think that.

Firstly, the poll conducted by the League was laughable.  It was a
fabulously classic example of how not to conduct a poll.  It was a
self-selected poll, where those being polled had an option of responding
or not responding.  There isn't a polling expert or statistician in the
land who would assign any statistical validity to a poll conducted in
the manner this one was.  Therefore, the League has no business basing
its policy on the outcome of this poll.  If it thinks that the code
requirement is good for other reasons, that's fine.  But this poll was
comically inept, to the point of absurdity.

For an excellent discussion of how, and how not, to conduct a poll or
survey, see generally UTTS, Statistical Methods in the Law.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 11:38:10 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs530.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

MN Maniac wrote:
>
> >>FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
> OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.<<
>
> Suggestion: while the FCC's enforcement division is in Phoenix, why don't
> they drop down to 27.635 and 27.385 to take care of Frank Burns and his
> gang of idiots down there?  These guys have been at it on a daily basis
> for years...agitating, running power, illegal frequencies, profanity,
> etc., and nobody ever seems to do anything about it.

The response I got from the FCC for a complaint I tried to file on a guy
for out of band (way out of any authorized amateur band) and he was
running a good 200 watts was: "we don't have the manpower to enforce
anymore, cutbacks have us down to a skeleton crew... if he's not
interfering with any of your household radios etc, ignore it, if he is,
I can give you a number for a company that sells RFI filters..."

FCC is a bunch of bureaucratic idiots!  Just like any other gov.
agency.  Sit and collect a check, but don't raise a finger to do your
job... someone might think your a kissass or something if you do!

Later,
DAve


--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IDE hard drives for sale
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 11:39:36 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pp6b$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs530.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

Burt Fisher wrote:
>
> jim daneke wrote:
> >
> > Robin in Denver wrote:
> >
> > Worth $50 for both. A new 1GB hd can be had for $150.
>
> They are worth more than $50

To Who?

Certainly not me if I can buy a new 1G for $150... I can get a 3.1G EIDE
for $299!

Later,
DAve


--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!uwm.edu!news.he.net!nntp.iccom.com!news.rain.net!pacifier!usenet
From: [e-mail] (derek hutter)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: 25 Dec 1996 17:26:22 GMT
Organization: Pacifier Internet Server [phone]
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <59ro3u$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rigk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip1.van1.pacifier.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.2

Derek K7XD
>
>That depends on how it's wired... I've seen some power companies do some
>strange things with multiple x-formers, and with 3 phase coming in to a
>building, there is between 208 and 240 to ground from each phase.  I've
>seen some hams wire things up strangely as well causing all kinds of
>weird voltages between a single phase and ground!
>
>Later,
>Dave

Dave,

Thought we were discussing Home power. I have been in the electrical
business for 20 years doing Industrial and Commercial motors and
process control, I and have never seen any "strange power".

Your basic power is;

120/208 Y
240 Delta
277/480 Y
480 Delta


Derek K7XD







From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (DONHAR777)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Whatever happened to Great Herbie and Drunkin Jim?
Date: 25 Dec 1996 17:40:25 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

What ever happened to the Herb Schonenbaum commedy hour on 20 meters and
the Texas Comedy hour of drunkards on 28.325.]

Used to enjoy listing to some of the better aspects of Ham Radio such as
the above.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:10:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!news.texoma.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 25 Dec 96 17:59:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: CALLSIGN
Lines: 12


>Amateur Radio Station   W 2 O T  -   (formerly  NK2T)

Congratulations on the new callsign, from the guy who got his right
after you...

Roland, NK2U

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!news.texoma.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 25 Dec 96 17:59:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: PACKET RADIO
Lines: 13


 >commercialization of ham radio ... I have said that our present packet
 >system has become a joke, with the majority of people stagnated at a
 >crummy 1200 baud AFSK and that we *should* be using minumum user speeds
 >of 64kbps, perhaps even T-1 rates.

And, the packet interface looks like CP/M.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]


--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!news.texoma.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 25 Dec 96 17:59:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: PUT THE EFFORT IN FIRST
Lines: 10


T>If a person is not interested enough in the radio arts to put forth the
 >small amount of effort it takes to get a license these days, then they
 >do not deserve the privilege of using the Ham bands.

That sums it up very nicely.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 25 Dec 96 17:59:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Lines: 29


S>Because Roland and his ilke believe that if you're not a Life member
 >of the ARRL your opinio does not matter. Even when they accept your
 >opnion, it usually had better agree with theirs. Sure the ARRL wants
 >to see code retained. The whole organization is rife with pro-coders.
 >No-coders are shunned and looked down upon. Still hasn't stopped me
 >from being a member.

Funny, I remember seeing the voting open to no-coders too.  I am sorry
if they too want to keep the code but that's the way the vote went.

 >The only way the organization will change is by changing the
 >membership. And that is done by joining and adding your voice to the
 >unwashed masses, until we become the majority. That is one of the many
 >reasons i was selected as the President of my local ARC. They know I
 >despise code, would never use it, yet I do not consider coders the
 >unwashed heathens that I am considered by some of the older members.
 >I just smile an keep in mind that these dinosaurs will die eventually
 >and hopefully won't infect too many young hams with their vile and
 >annimosity to their fellow unwashed no-code hams.

Funny, but I don't see no-coders joining any organizations.  They get
licensed, get an HT and operate.  Soon they get bored and put the HT on
the shelf and then buy a NINTENDO game.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 25 Dec 96 17:59:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Lines: 10


J>Don't you see how mean-spirited you and others have become in regard to
 >this policy debate? Very shameful.

That's the something for nothing mentality in action.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!usc!newshub.csu.net!charnel.ecst.csuchico.edu!psgrain!news.rain.net!pacifier!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Origin of X-MAS
Date: 25 Dec 1996 18:45:47 GMT
Organization: Pacifier BBS, Vancouver, Wa.  ([phone])
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59rsor$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pacifier.com


Once upon a time there was a little girl named Mary. She went to the
north pole to ask santa for a very special present. She knocked on the
door and found a BLACK santa doing the misses " in the buck style ". She
told santa that she wanted a special pair of panties that would block out
her brothers penis but would let her boyfriends pass through......
Mo Bigsly santa looked at the girl and said...
" Mary,   KismaASS ".....Which is now know as X-mas in EBONICS.



Signed: Demented in Vancouver
K7OP


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!microvst.demon.co.uk!tgold
From: [e-mail] ("Anthony R. Gold")
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 96 18:56:19 GMT
Organization: Microvest Limited, London
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: microvst.dircon.co.uk
X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.30

derek hutter wrote:
>
> Still think you guys are missing the point. On a 240 volt circut there
> is only 120 volt potential to ground.
>
> Derek K7XD

Whose point?  It may be yours but it was not the point of this thread.

This started on Tue, 17 Dec 1996, when Demetre Koumanakos wrote:

> CQ Netters,
>
> Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages between
> the US 110 Volts and Europe's 220 Volts ??

Safety was raised as an issue and so it was the safety of a European
240V domestic supply that was in discussion, and not the safety of
bringing a US style two-phase 120-0-120 supply.

As a European with a 240 volt domestic supply, let me say that our
local tranformer is a 415 volt phase-to-phase star arrangement where
each house is fed one of the three phases plus the neutral.  So we
have a phase-to-neutral voltage of (415V / sqrt(3))V which is close
to 240V to neutral, and in balance that's also 240V to ground.

Regards,
--
   Tony - G3SKR / W2TG                   email: [e-mail]
                                                [e-mail]
                                        packet: g3skr@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Samuel R. DiSalvo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info Wanted: on Yaesu FT-840 HF Transceiver
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 18:57:27 GMT
Organization: Microserve Information Systems (800)-380-INET
Lines: 25
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59rsu4$22r$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf205$ddabc240$d65492cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp50.respool1.medina.ohio.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.dx:1688 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45046 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121677

"Victor D. Mete" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>       I am looking to buy an HF rig. Recently, having posted a request for info
>on Alinco DX-70T vs Icom IC-706,  MANY responded and I concluded the DX-70T
>while it has fewer bells and whistles, HF performance is better. NOW, the
>FT-840 price is in the same range as the Alinco.Which one to buy?
>       Please send me your input on the FT-840 and any comparison to the DX-70T
>if any. Also, I am wondering if there are mods for the FT-840.  Thanks for
>responding. I appreciate the input.
>
>--
>Victor
>[e-mail]

I can't compare the FT-840 to the other rigs your refering to but I
can tell you that I am very satisfied with the performance I get from
mine and the price was definately right. If you plan on doing CW, I
would advise adding a 500Hz filter to the Yaesu. The 2.8kHz filter it
comes with is way too wide.

There is a general coverage tx mod for it too. It can be found at
http://www.qrz.com

73 de KC8BQP - Sam



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.fibr.net!news-out.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: "Mark McClain" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.ham-radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WTB:   RF Isolators (Circulators)
Date: 25 Dec 1996 19:08:09 GMT
Organization: InternetMCI
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <01bbf296$9c8b1f40$070737a6@204.70.128.1>
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr17-dialup7.mix1.sacramento.mci.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45047 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121680

Looking for isolators (with or without loads) on 52, 144, 220, and 440 MHz.

Our requirements are single-port for 52MHz, and dual-port for the rest.

If youhave anything available, please respond directly to:
        [e-mail]

Thanks, 73, and Happy Holidays!!

Mark McClain, N6OBY
Seattle, WA



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:08 1997
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 14:08:13 -0500
From: "Vernon J. Kunes, Jr." <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: IDE hard drives for sale
References: <59pp6b$[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.25.250.194
Lines: 19
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news.paonline.com!news3.paonline.com!206.25.250.194

Robin in Denver wrote:
>
> I have 2 used IDE hard disk drives IÆd  like to sell together. One is a
> Maxtor 540 meg and the other is a Maxtor 345 meg. Both are in fine
> condition. No cables or anything go with them, just selling the drives.
> They havenÆt been used excessively like in a server or bbs or anything,
> just me at home, probably less than 7 hours a day on the average for about
> 2 years. I think they both have mtbfÆs of around 50,000 hours.
>
> IÆd like to get around $160 for both + shipping, but can be a little
> flexible. If I canÆt get something reasonable, IÆll keep them. Email me if
> interested.
>
> - Robin
> [e-mail]
>
> Universal Planetary Alliance Headquarters in Denver:
> http://www.diac.com/~ladyrobn/index.htm
I'll givve you $80 + shipping. Let me know.  Vern


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](William M. Pasternak)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 25 Dec 1996 19:09:11 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <59ru4n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59iohc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: scr-ca2-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 25  1:09:11 PM CST 1996

In <59iohc$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:
>
>[e-mail] (Dick Flanagan) wrote:
>
>>In article
<[e-mail]>,
>>Timothy Haller <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>>On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the
ARRL.
>>They need our
>>>> support, and we need theirs.
>>>>
>>>Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?
>
>>I guess the ARRL needs to pay me, too, because I agree 100% with
Dave.
>>--
>>Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada
>
>Me too. I agree 100% with Dave.
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>Support the ARRL - Join NOW !!
>Call Toll Free - 1-888-277-5289 To Join.
>
>
>
And you can add me to the list too.  I agree with Dave, Dick and Jim.

I also believe that if you are going to demand that an organization
represent your view, you first are required to become a member of that
organization.

The ARRL is the only game in town right now.  All attempts over the
past decade to form alternatives have failed.  NARA is gone.  The ARRC
is a one-man "paper tiger."  Everyone else is just talk.

You are either on the inside of the ARRL working for change or on the
outside throwing bricks that will be ignored.


de Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
Newsline On-Line


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 25 Dec 1996 19:12:14 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59rsef$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>If ARRL members believe that
retention of the Morse code as a requisite requirement for operating a
ham station below 30 MHz be retained, then it is obligated to fight for
that ideal -- regardless of what you or I might want. <<

Looks like this issue will ultimately be decided in the courts.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to Great Herbie and Drunkin Jim?
Date: 25 Dec 1996 19:13:59 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>What ever happened to the Herb Schonenbaum commedy hour on 20 meters and
>the Texas Comedy hour of drunkards on 28.325.

Probably moved down to 14.313 or 3894.5 so they could be with their
friends.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: jim daneke <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Origin of X-MAS
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 12:28:36 -0700
Organization: Network Service
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59rsor$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: den-co8-04.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----------16E51D747A370"
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 25  2:29:52 PM CST 1996
X-Sender: jim daneke <[e-mail]> (Unverified)
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b1 (Win95; I)
To: [e-mail]
X-Priority: Normal


------------16E51D747A370
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Once upon a time there was a little girl named Mary. She went to the
> north pole to ask santa for a very special present. She knocked on the
> door and found a BLACK santa doing the misses " in the buck style ".
She
> told santa that she wanted a special pair of panties that would block
out
> her brothers penis but would let her boyfriends pass through......
> Mo Bigsly santa looked at the girl and said...
> " Mary,   KismaASS ".....Which is now know as X-mas in EBONICS.
>
> Signed: Demented in Vancouver
> K7OP

This is the kind of garbage you find on 3850. Losers!

------------16E51D747A370
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

<HTML><BODY>

<DT>[e-mail] wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Once upon a time there was a little girl named Mary. She went to the<BR>
> north pole to ask santa for a very special present. She knocked on
the<BR>
> door and found a BLACK santa doing the misses " in the buck style
". She<BR>
> told santa that she wanted a special pair of panties that would block
out<BR>
> her brothers penis but would let her boyfriends pass through......<BR>
> Mo Bigsly santa looked at the girl and said...<BR>
> " Mary,   KismaASS ".....Which is now know as
X-mas in EBONICS.<BR>
> <BR>
> Signed: Demented in Vancouver<BR>
> K7OP<BR>
 </DT>

<DT>This is the kind of garbage you find on 3850. Losers!</DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
------------16E51D747A370--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 25 Dec 1996 15:19:23 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <59s28b$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        MN Maniac <[e-mail]> wrote:

>If the ARRL expects to have a future, they better get with the program and
>start respecting the views of younger, newer hams instead of being a
>mouthpiece for the old, pro-code bunch.  Their core membership is
>literally dying off, and those all-important membership dues arre dying
>along with them.

Unfortunately for you, reality proves otherwise.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.13.28.13!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail]-- (R. A. Green)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 20:20:52 GMT
Organization: .
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-2-201.sntc01.pacbell.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121685 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44675 rec.radio.scanner:73990

On Tue, 24 Dec 1996 20:27:07 -0700, Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
> OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.   The Compliance and Information Bureau
> (CIB), by delegated authority, issued a Notice of Monetary Forfeiture
>to
<snip>
What did this guy do, anyway?
--ron


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.edm.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Eric Shamay)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 20:47:42 GMT
Organization: EDM Network
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <59rr0h$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port211.edm.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

>     If not , when all of you who cling to the "old ways " finally die off
>then the hobby can be brought up to date and the minds that have been
>passed over can finally be allowed to pursue the hobby and take it to new
>frontiers. Those of you who cling to the old ways remind me of my home town
>and all the elderly who are doing all they can to suppress the young. And
>I've told them about the same thing when you die the town dies, When you
>die the hobby dies

Well, let's start with the fact that I am in the same position as you;
I am not a ham (but I will be as of Jan 27) and have been keeping up
with the CW arguments. Yet I still take the position of the
Pro-Coders. I did own a CBfor a while but what really through the
hobby away was all those who couldn't go a day without abusing some
laws. It really was a zoo. Recently I journeyed over to the house of
my friend and listened in to some 2-meter conversations and they
seemed pretty much the same. I then went over to HF and the people
there were much friendlier, less chaotic, and I didn't here one threat
come out of there mouths. Once I do get my license (I'm aiming for
tech-plus) I will be a strong supporter of CW and the CW-testing. It
really does weed out the ignorant and societies leeches from polluting
the airwaves. It reserves atleast a few frequencies where those who
want to can go for a pleasant conversation with intelligent people. I
am under the age of twenty, so I figure that once those "antiques" die
off I (and all those others like myself) will be the ones who take
there place. (And believe me, there are plenty more just like me...)

My advice (and this comes from experience) is take the time to learn
morse-code. It took me two days of studying and I could identify every
letter and number. Within one week of about 30 minutes each day I was
able to get up into the five-WPM range. It really isn't that difficult
and the price you pay for learning something new (if that's really a
price) is well worth the package you get back.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: KD1YV <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Lentini -NY sales tax collection
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 15:50:35 -0500
Organization: Hamily !
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbf1f6$ac51a020$310f2399@peter-s>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dby-ct2-06.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 25 12:51:28 PM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

{snip}

So you are all saying that you prefer to violate the laws of the state where y
ou
live.  Most states have consumption taxes that apply to goods purchased, no ma
tter
what state the vendor resides. You're also saying that honest folks should pay
 more
taxes so that you can cheat on yours.

--
73 de Jim, KD1YV
http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimkd1yv/hamily.html


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 25 Dec 1996 15:55:38 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <59s4ca$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121694 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44678

In article <59rsef$[e-mail]>,
        William M. Pasternak <[e-mail]> wrote:


>The poll -- actually polls -- conducted were fair and acrate as far as
>they went.  The problem I see is that they did not sample enough of the
>nations Amateur Radio populice.  Nor was there the required "control
>sample" outside of the ham radio community.
>
>According to a story that we will put to air in about 48 hours, the
>ARRL admits that of its 17,000+ members, only some 10,000 replied to
>the poll.  It then polled at random another 2000 hams. It made no
>attempt to poll and establish a "control group" so it really cannot
>claim that the results are indicative of the majority of the nations
>650,000 hams -- nor even of the ARRL's 170,000 members.

Several points:

1. Wording the survey as to bias its outcome is not conducting a "fair
   and accurate" poll.

2. In order to make a judgement about the population as a whole in a
   random sample of a finite population, you need about 4,000 respondents.

3. Opinion surveys do not need "control groups" unless you are attempting
   to draw a parallel against an outside group (i.e. non-licensed people).

4. I would like for you to explain why you feel a control group is
   necessary in this survey, and why you feel that any control group
   outside of the amateur population would even have enough pertinent
   knowledge about the code/no-code issue to be able to give an informed,
   rational opinion.


>If you want an accurate poll, you hire a company like Irving Fields or
>the like to conduct it.  You do both targeted and across-the-board
>polling and then compare the samples against a pre-determined gradient.
>None of this was done, so I have to doubt the accuracy of the poll.

I don't see any reason why the ARRL should have done this at all.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!nntp.crl.com!dobie.loop.net!news
From: "R.Ponti" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Wanted: Bonneville or Signal receivers
Date: 25 Dec 1996 21:24:38 GMT
Organization: The Loop
Lines: 3
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <01bbf2a9$da100b60$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p09.hwts05.loop.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Looking for a Bonneville satellite or cable receiver and controller and/or
Signal/Lotus FM market data receiver.
Please email me availability and price.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!in1.nntp.cais.net!wilbur.ohww.norman.ok.us!ionews.ionet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Lee Allen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 25 Dec 1996 21:31:15 GMT
Organization: IONet
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <59s6f3$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59s28b$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pri5-18.ionet.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <59s28b$[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
>
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>        MN Maniac <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>If the ARRL expects to have a future, they better get with the
program and
>>start respecting the views of younger, newer hams instead of being a
>>mouthpiece for the old, pro-code bunch.  Their core membership is
>>literally dying off, and those all-important membership dues arre
dying
>>along with them.
>
>Unfortunately for you, reality proves otherwise.
>
>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.

Anyone can study and pass the " GIVE AWAY " tests that are given now
days. BUT only the good can learn the code !!!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!woolner.demon.co.uk!woolner.demon.co.uk!Tom
From: Tom Woolner <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: CW Interface
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 21:46:36 +0000
Organization: Cat City Dog Pound
Lines: 22
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: woolner.demon.co.uk
X-NNTP-Posting-Host: woolner.demon.co.uk
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Newsreader: Turnpike Version 3.01 <Z3g0CiGcN8QggOYhGEPoeR1ic4>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121703 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20871 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45059 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22412 rec.radio.shortwave:91103

In article <[e-mail]>, "Richard M. Corrigan"
<[e-mail]> writes
>I recently heard of a cable that attaches from you Reciever to
>the serial port of a computer which allows CW to be translated
>by your Computer for display on your monitor.  Is this true?
>I thought that a TNC was needed.  If it is true does anyone
>have the pin outs to build such a cable or maybe a source that
>I could contact to obtain one.
>
Yes it's true.  The cable has a small pcb enclosed in the 25pin D
connector, mounting a simple limiter amp. e.g. 741.  This is powered from
spare lines on the COM port.

The software - HamCom - drives the lines high + and low - for the rail
supplies and it polls a line from the amp. output at high speed.  It senses
data present and calculates validity and data value from the results.   This
can be code, rtty, hffax, etc.

Regards,
--
Tom Woolner



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!#gekko95
From: [e-mail] (Dave)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Need repeater frequencies for Puget Sound area
Date: 25 Dec 1996 21:56:43 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <59s7ur$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tac-wa1-18.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 25  3:56:43 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4



Hi everyone.

I have an older IC-20 2M FM rig I dug out of my years of
collected gear (just got back into the hobby after 12
years out - glad I kept my ticket renewed!!)

Does anyone have a URL for a web site listing the repeater
frequencies for the Puget Sound region of Washington State?
Or any local hams that have a list they can email?

Since my radio is crystal controlled, and set up for the old
splits and no tones, I don't know if there is any I can
even hit anymore.

Any help would be appreciated.


Dave


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 25 Dec 1996 17:10:28 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <59s8ok$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121710 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44690

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>1)  QST has opted out as a vehicle for lively discussion of ham
>political issues.

I fail to see why QST >should< be a host to political discussion.
It takes away from other content that the magazine can include.
Plus, there are numerous other avenues for amateur-related
political discussions, both on the Internet and on packet.


>2)  The internet does, in fact, get noticed.  I call your attention to
>the fact that several ARRL officials have taken visible notice of this
>discussion.  No doubt others have as well.

Unfortunately a vast majority of hams go unspoken in these groups.


>3)  The League is interested in growing its membership, for many
>reasons, including legitimacy (it needs members in order to credibly
>function as ham radio's representative to outsiders) and financial
>considerations (dues are, I believe, its main source of income).
>Accordingly, the League *needs* to know what non-members are unhappy
>about.

The League must balance the needs of members against the needs of
non-members. In some instances these needs will be the same (spectrum
preservation). In other instances, they may be different (code vs no-
code HF license). Unfortunately, what is important to one is not
important to another, so there will always appear to be decisiveness
when looking at things as a whole.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:24 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 25 Dec 1996 17:17:49 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <59s96d$[e-mail]>
References: <59rsef$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Firstly, the poll conducted by the League was laughable.  It was a
>fabulously classic example of how not to conduct a poll.  It was a
>self-selected poll,

The ARRL survey was not a "self-selected" poll. A self-selected
poll would be where someone puts up a poll on the Net and invites
others to take it.

The ARRL poll was little different than any national opinion
survey. There is always some percentage of people who do not
respond. The key is to send out enough surveys that you still
get a sufficient number back to make a hypothesis test.


>where those being polled had an option of responding or not responding.

Regardless of the poll, you always have the "option" of not responding.
Classic example is exit polling during elections. When you walk out,
a pollster asks you to answer a few simple questions. You can say
"no thank you" and walk away. That doesn't change the fact that the
polling agency is able to make, with a great deal of certainty, a
prediction as to the outcome (i.e. the population opinion as a whole)
based purely upon those who do respond.


>There isn't a polling expert or statistician in the
>land who would assign any statistical validity to a poll conducted in
>the manner this one was.

Unfortunately, neither you nor I (or a polling expert or statistician) has
enough information about the "manner this one was" conducted to make a
determination as to whether or not it holds scientific validity.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (DepShlomo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WTB: MOTOROLA DESKTRACK REPEATER
Date: 25 Dec 1996 22:25:28 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

HI I AM LOOKING FOR A MOTOROLA DESKTRACK REP. EVEN WITHOUT THE RADIOS IF
YOU HAVE PLEASE CALL 914-425-8747


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!news.he.net!metro.atlanta.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.45.32.37!world1.bellatlantic.net!news
From: Rush Johnson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need repeater frequencies for Puget Sound area
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 18:17:09 -0500
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59s7ur$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: client250-241-103.bellatlantic.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win95; U)

Dave wrote:
>
> Hi everyone.
>
> I have an older IC-20 2M FM rig I dug out of my years of
> collected gear (just got back into the hobby after 12
> years out - glad I kept my ticket renewed!!)
>
> Does anyone have a URL for a web site listing the repeater
> frequencies for the Puget Sound region of Washington State?
> Or any local hams that have a list they can email?
>
> Since my radio is crystal controlled, and set up for the old
> splits and no tones, I don't know if there is any I can
> even hit anymore.
>
> Any help would be appreciated.
>
> Dave

Try http://www.artscipub.com/repeaters

73,
Rush (NR4M)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THE FINAL WORD
Date: 25 Dec 1996 23:19:24 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 13
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59scps$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:
>
>Maniac our you still whinning about CW???


"OUR?!"

Looks like you better spend a little more time at English class instead
of in front of the old brass key.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.voicenet.com!netnews.upenn.edu!news.misty.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.swap
Subject: triplexer needed
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 19:01:21 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs24.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33195 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45070 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121715

Hello all, Tnx for reading.
Looking to buy a good used triplexer for 144/220/440 mhz... between
100-250 W max power would be more than enough as right now I'm at 6W on
2m, my 440 rig is 70, the 220 rig will be 100 and I'll be getting a 2m
Mocom at 35W in the next couple of days.
Thanks,
DAve
--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: 26 Dec 1996 00:07:09 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 8
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59sfjd$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz> <59rr4i$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

Record your vote at our Web site:

http://www.codesux.com


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: AC6V <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Need repeater frequencies for Puget Sound area
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 16:44:46 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59s7ur$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: esc-ca1-17.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Dec 25  4:43:51 PM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)
To: Dave <[e-mail]>

Dave wrote:
>
> Hi everyone.
>
> I have an older IC-20 2M FM rig I dug out of my years of
> collected gear (just got back into the hobby after 12
> years out - glad I kept my ticket renewed!!)
>
> Does anyone have a URL for a web site listing the repeater
> frequencies for the Puget Sound region of Washington State?
> Or any local hams that have a list they can email?
>
> Since my radio is crystal controlled, and set up for the old
> splits and no tones, I don't know if there is any I can
> even hit anymore.
>
> Any help would be appreciated.
>
> Dave

Hi Dave. The ARTSCI repeater Guide covers the USA. Go to the DX
Reference page below and click on WWW Repeaters, then ARTSCI.

Good Luck & Happy Holidays
73
Rod in San Diego
--
AC6V DX Reference Page: http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
E-Mail: [e-mail]

Hark!  For I Have Hurled My Words To The Far Reaches Of The Earth!
What King Of  Old Could Do Thus?? -- AC6V


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.48.96.23!not-for-mail
From: Jeffrey Darche <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Murata Filters
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 19:58:08 -0500
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: linea26.wsii.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

I am looking for a small quantities vendor for Murata filters. The local
vendor in New England sells only in >200 quantity.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:32 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: CW Interface
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 01:39:09 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <59tp9m$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Tom Woolner <[e-mail]> wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>, "Richard M. Corrigan"
><[e-mail]> writes
>>I recently heard of a cable that attaches from you Reciever to
>>the serial port of a computer which allows CW to be translated
>>by your Computer for display on your monitor.  Is this true?
>>I thought that a TNC was needed.  If it is true does anyone
>>have the pin outs to build such a cable or maybe a source that
>>I could contact to obtain one.
>>
>Yes it's true.  The cable has a small pcb enclosed in the 25pin D
>connector, mounting a simple limiter amp. e.g. 741.  This is powered from
>spare lines on the COM port.

>The software - HamCom - drives the lines high + and low - for the rail
>supplies and it polls a line from the amp. output at high speed.  It senses
>data present and calculates validity and data value from the results.   This
>can be code, rtty, hffax, etc.

>Regards,
>--
>Tom Woolner

Richard,
     Check this page:

http://www.concentric.net/~n9zle/hc.html

Bruce, N9ZLE sells the hardware interface you need, and will give you the
HamComm/JVFax shareware you need to make it work.  It plugs into a
serial port on your computer, copies CW, RTTY, PACKET (crude form), SSTV,
and WEFAX pictures.  It costs a whopping $20 usually, but they are on sale
for $15 for Christmas.  Once you get the software, there are schematics in
the DOC files to show you how to build other interfaces if you are interested.
I bought one a few months ago, and use if for HF WEFAX pictures, and it
works great.  Be aware that there isn't any hardware that copies 'perfect'
CW.  How well any of the hardware devises copy is very dependent on the
strength of the received signal and the way the CW is being sent.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:34 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 01:41:38 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <59tpea$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rled$[e-mail]> <59smqf$[e-mail]> <59t20l$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-179.kuentos.guam.net
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>
>And there is one thing lower than pointing out spelling mistakes and
>that is stiking your nose where it does not belong and baiting a
>fight. I said very plainly that I was not trying to be a spelling
>critic, but rather that the gentlman should take some care so that his
>message gets out clearly.
>If you understand what he was saying than perhaps you can read minds.
>BUT even to those on the other side of the fence it is clear that his
>message is difficult to decipher.
>Stop baiting and start debating. Otherwise feel free to ignore my
>messages.

Well, Eric, when you come along and start posting your baloney in a usenet
newsgroup, it becomes everyone who reads the newsgroups 'business'.
I can understand exactly what you are doing, too, Eric. You and your little
no code butt are here to see how much crap you can stir up.  There
isn't anything to debate.  We don't debate spelling errors here.   Your readin
g
comprehension problem is your problem, not ours.  If you can't decipher messag
es
here, I'd suggest you 'LERN' how to read English.  If you can't do that, then
maybe you should stick to 2 meter DXCC and leave the newsgroups for people who
can read.  You feel free to post here like a normal person, or get use to havi
ng
people comment on your baloney.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Expedition mounting woes, part 2
Date: 25 Dec 1996 20:41:54 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <59sl52$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

I'd like to thank everyone who sent me feedback on HF antenna mounting
ideas for my new Ford Expedition. Looks like it is going to be a roof-
oriented HF magnet mount of some sort, and only when I'm going to be
working HF at that.


In the process of setting up my VHF radio in the truck, I've
come to discover the old mag-mount dual-band antenna isn't
going to cut it. I was thinking of one of those new nifty
glass-mount jobs, but I seem to recall a posting a while back
that you cannot use these antennas with the newer "tinted"
glass vehicles. This seemingly contradicts what I've seen
locally, for almost every Explorer I've seen has the cell
antenna mounted on the rear side panel or the rear flip-up
glass panel.

Does anyone have feedback/experience on that setup?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:36 1997
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From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 02:30:56 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59smqf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Eric I hate to let you know but whaT ever you were Rambling about did not
Belittle me in the Slighest. I have Tuff skin and If you would like take a
Cheap Shot go for it. But belive me anything you have to say would not
belittle me. Maybe you should Learn CW it might help your Spelling.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:37 1997
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: lesson in history/honesty for Eric Oyen  was:Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 19:16:47 -0800
Organization: Just myself
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 04:12:24 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <59t1kr$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599ck9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59nugf$[e-mail]> <59rr6g$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>"Thomas R. Sundstrom" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>Listening to Len's Ham Radio & More show early this morning on WWCR and
>>>this pro-code, anti-code business... and Len's promotion of the no-code
>>>General...

>>>Did'ja ever notice that high speed code atop music is used throughout
>>>the programming to move from feature to feature?

>>>Hmmm... ironic, isn't it?

>>Not ironic Tom, just cute. Still and all not a good reason to keep the
>>code requirement. In fact I have yet to hear one reasonable reason.
>>Not to say that you don't find the reasons reasonable, they just don't
>>hold water folks.
>>There is not one good reason to keep the code requirement. There are
>>plenty to keep CW sub bands. But to be required to pass a code test to
>>use phone is silly.

>>Eric

>Almost as silly as suggesting that people on welfare get a job, right Eric ?

Why do we need to continue even discussing this issue Jim if you keep
making silly analogies? Welfare and CW are two totally different
things. If you care to debate the merits of your position fine. If not
why not just resort to name calling like all the other Pro-coders out
here. or do you prefer putting words in my mouth?

Eric



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 04:18:42 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <59t20l$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rled$[e-mail]> <59smqf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp91.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>> Look I am not being a spelling critic here. But please lern some
>>sentence structure. I find it hard to determine the meaning of your
>>post.
>>If you took some time out from beeping and tried hooked on phonics you
>>might better communicate your message.

>>The above insultingtype comment comes courtesy and consideration to
>>WA8ULX and the insult he offered in a previous note. It has nothing to
>>do with the debate I just wanted him to know how it feels when someone
>>belittles you for what you are.

>>Enjoy

>Said the Pot to the Kettle.  Eric, there is only one thing lower than someone
>who finds spelling faults with postings on internet.  Email Gerald McPoP if y
ou
>would like to know what that is.  I can read right thru your spelling mistake
s,
>but I still have a hard time figuring out the meaning of what you post.
>Maybe you could post a compendium for us some day. Call it, perhaps,
>"500 Reasons Why I Didn't Lern Morse Code"

>73, Jim KH2D

And there is one thing lower than pointing out spelling mistakes and
that is stiking your nose where it does not belong and baiting a
fight. I said very plainly that I was not trying to be a spelling
critic, but rather that the gentlman should take some care so that his
message gets out clearly.
If you understand what he was saying than perhaps you can read minds.
BUT even to those on the other side of the fence it is clear that his
message is difficult to decipher.
Stop baiting and start debating. Otherwise feel free to ignore my
messages.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 04:19:59 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <59t233$[e-mail]>
References: <59smqf$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp91.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Eric I hate to let you know but whaT ever you were Rambling about did not
>Belittle me in the Slighest. I have Tuff skin and If you would like take a
>Cheap Shot go for it. But belive me anything you have to say would not
>belittle me. Maybe you should Learn CW it might help your Spelling.

Fine. At least now I can undersdtand what you are trying to get across
:)
Hope you had a Merry Christmas.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 20:25:04 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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I don't know what is going on here but the post above THIS reply
is MINE.

The other 3 are something else, either error or forgery.

<shrug>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jefferson.lisco.com!news
From: James Gualtieri <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: help ft8000r
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 21:07:53 -0800
Organization: LISCO
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.155.88.125
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121722 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45081

Does any one know if the ft 8000r will recieve aircraft band?
 The specs says it receives 110-550 but says nothing about am for
 aircraft
 recieve. Like the ft-8500 does. Any comments on either one of these
 radios will be gratefully appreicated. Or which duel band has the most
 bang for the buck and recieves aircraft band.
 Thanks
 ke4rvk
 jim gualtieri
 73


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:44 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-stock.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-11.sprintlink.net!news.us.net!usenet
From: "CJ Lagos" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Wanted: TM-V7A Mod
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:12:47 GMT
Organization: Midnight Communications
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <01bbf2eb$c25fdf80$0a66f0c6@general>
NNTP-Posting-Host: midnight.us.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1160
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45090 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22428 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121740

If anyone has a TM-V7A mod PLEASE send it to [e-mail]
Thank you.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!multipro.com!usenet
From: "W.S.H." <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: PL Codes??
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:17:08 GMT
Organization: HTS/PCSD
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <01bbf2ec$683f4080$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s17.portmaster.multipro.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Please correct me if I'm Wrong!

USER    FREQ
   08         88.5
   12       100.0
   16       114.8
   18       123.0
   19       127.3
   20       131.8
   21       136.5
   24       151.4

Please correct my mistakes or please advise is the above is correct. It
will be of great assistance!!

Please send replies to the following e-mail address!

Thanks in ADVANCE!
--
Shane H.
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:30:28 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 29
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59t2hk$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:
>
>[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:
>
>>>Are there more?
>
>>You forgot "OLD FART ARROGANT HAMS"
>
>>Judging from the responses in this newsgroup, I would say this
comprises
>>the largest group of all.
>
>Merry Christmas Mike. You also forgot WANNABE hams, like MN Maniac.
>
>73, Jim KH2D


Actually, the correct term here is "YE OLDE FAHRTZ."  That's right...
those ancient operators who are attempting to keep their little hazing
requirements intact for their private HF club into the 21st century.  If
their outdated way of thinking prevails, we'll most certainly lose lots
of allocations to commercial interests.  But hey, they don't care...
they'll have gone to that great brass key in the sky by then.  It's the
rest of us who will be the unfortunate victims of their stubborn refusal
to modernize and expand our hobby.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:31:58 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 9
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59t2ke$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rled$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

>If you took some time out from beeping and tried hooked on phonics you
>might better communicate your message.

You're wasting your time.  He's a beeper, his daddy was a beeper, and
that's all he knows or cares about.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: "Christopher (Chris) W. Boone" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 21:42:49 -0800
Organization: ABC Radio Network Engineering - Dallas
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59iohc$[e-mail]> <59ru4n$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cust97.max10.dallas.tx.ms.uu.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; U)

William M. Pasternak wrote:
>
> In <59iohc$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim
> Kehler) writes:
> >
> >[e-mail] (Dick Flanagan) wrote:
> >
> >>In article
> <[e-mail]>,
> >>Timothy Haller <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >
> >>>On Thu, 19 Dec 1996, Dave Hockaday wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> I think it's in the best interests of us all to be a member of the
> ARRL.
> >>They need our
> >>>> support, and we need theirs.
> >>>>
> >>>Dave how much did the ARRL pay u for this, what crap is this?
> >
> >>I guess the ARRL needs to pay me, too, because I agree 100% with
> Dave.
> >>--
> >>Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada
> >
> >Me too. I agree 100% with Dave.
> >
> >73, Jim KH2D
> >Support the ARRL - Join NOW !!
> >Call Toll Free - 1-888-277-5289 To Join.
> >
> >
> >
> And you can add me to the list too.  I agree with Dave, Dick and Jim.
>
> I also believe that if you are going to demand that an organization
> represent your view, you first are required to become a member of that
> organization.
>
> The ARRL is the only game in town right now.  All attempts over the
> past decade to form alternatives have failed.  NARA is gone.  The ARRC
> is a one-man "paper tiger."  Everyone else is just talk.

Lest we also forget the IoAR????  :)
>
> You are either on the inside of the ARRL working for change or on the
> outside throwing bricks that will be ignored.
>
> de Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
> Newsline On-Line

Hi Bill!!!!
and Merry Christmas....

BTW I am thinking of reactivating the Houston Newsline system...AT&T came
across with a CHEAP rate for me.....and it cut the cost in half! so I
might just put Houston AND Dallas online in 97!

73
Chris
WB5ITT


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:49 1997
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From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:52:08 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59t2hk$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Drew, Modernizing is not getting rid of CW, you Guys use ever excuse in
the World to get on HF, quit Whinning put out a little Effort and you will
be on HF.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:53:37 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59slbd$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>He failed the 5 wpm code test.

If that was the case, it would be the good 'ol boys at the ARRL on his
case instead of the FCC.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:55:38 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>Eric I hate to let you know but whaT ever you were Rambling about did
not
Belittle me in the Slighest. I have Tuff skin and If you would like take a
Cheap Shot go for it. But belive me anything you have to say would not
belittle me. Maybe you should Learn CW it might help your Spelling. <<

...says the beeper as he misspells and miscapitalizes in the process.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:52 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:57:13 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

The vote was a sham, pure and simple.

Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue will
be decided in the courts.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.170.183.55!brighton.openmarket.com!wizard.pn.com!news.zeitgeist.net!news.greatbasin.net!dick
From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 21:57:33 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 9
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.libelle.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.6

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:

>Funny, but I don't see no-coders joining any organizations.

Perhaps your organizations have nothing to offer them.  They join and
participate and contribute to ours just fine, thankyouverymuch.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:54 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 26 Dec 1996 05:58:41 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>Manaiac Quit whinning and learn Cw

I'm sorry...I don't take advice from beepers who can't spell correctly.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-7.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jefferson.lisco.com!news
From: James Gualtieri <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: help ft8000r
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 22:05:50 -0800
Organization: LISCO
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.155.88.125
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121728 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45086

Does any one know if the ft 8000r will recieve aircraft band?
  The specs says it receives 110-550 but says nothing about am for
  aircraft
  recieve. Like the ft-8500 does. Any comments on either one of these
  radios will be gratefully appreicated. Or which duel band has the most
  bang for the buck and recieves aircraft band.
  Thanks
  ke4rvk
  jim gualtieri
  73


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:55 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 06:34:32 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59uajj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-167.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>The vote was a sham, pure and simple.

>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue will
>be decided in the courts.

Go back to the CB newsgroup, Maniac. They miss your (dim) wit over
there.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:57 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 06:44:43 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <59ub6r$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-167.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Spew Durigan) wrote:

>Actually, the correct term here is "YE OLDE FAHRTZ."  That's right...
>those ancient operators who are attempting to keep their little hazing
>requirements intact for their private HF club into the 21st century.

And doing a pretty good job of it, I must say.

>If
>their outdated way of thinking prevails, we'll most certainly lose lots
>of allocations to commercial interests.  But hey, they don't care...
>they'll have gone to that great brass key in the sky by then.  It's the
>rest of us who will be the unfortunate victims of their stubborn refusal
>to modernize and expand our hobby.

>-Spew in Sunny Central Florida-
> KF4DDM

Hi Spew !! Merry Christmas !! Where you been hiding ?  Cleaning the
restrooms at the radio station keeping you too busy to stop by and
visit ?  See you learned a few new words from Squiggy - 'hazing' and
'private HF club'.   Leave out 'modernization', that doesn't fit in with
your usual line. Besides, nothing modern about putting your little no
code butt on HF.   Did you buy a radio yet ?  How's DX on 11 meters ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.cmc.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Gary Fiber)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ICOM Computer Control Software?
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 06:49:49 GMT
Organization: Chambers Multimedia Connection
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59t7aj$5nl$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm2-14.edmonds.cmc.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45091 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121751

harold rosee <[e-mail]> wrote:

>R.Moroney wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone have a recommendation for a good control program for ICOM
>> rigs (specifically the '706 and '736)?  I'm mainly looking for a DOS
>> program, but Windows 3.1 or 95 would be OK too, in a pinch.  Logging
>> capabilities are a plus, but not a requirement.  Any suggestions?
>>
>> BOB K9CMR


>Look on the ARRL FTP site. There is a new control program for the 706.
>Nothing too fancy but it works.

Also if you or a friend are a member of CompuServe you can look in library 14
of the HamNet forum and you will find a small QBasic program titled CI-V.ZIP o
r
CIV.ZIP.  It is a IC-737 control program written in QBasic.  It will work with
the 706 and give you a good base to add features to.

Gary



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:11:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Roger Nace)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 07:24:24 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cust25.max43.seattle.wa.ms.uu.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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On Wed, 25 Dec 1996 20:20:52 GMT, [e-mail]-- (R. A.
Green) wrote:

>On Tue, 24 Dec 1996 20:27:07 -0700, Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
>wrote:
>
>>FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
>> OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.   The Compliance and Information Bureau
>> (CIB), by delegated authority, issued a Notice of Monetary Forfeiture
>>to
><snip>
>What did this guy do, anyway?
>--ron

He's a jammer.  It's old news.  See the ARRL letter last September 13:
http://www.arrl.org/arrlletter/960913/#fcc_fine


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!fpmbh.com!iag.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (K6bob)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: GROL and MROP
Date: 26 Dec 1996 08:57:49 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

You might also try the Elkins Institute in Texas.  Excellent program and
arrange for testing as well.
Bob
k6bob


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!news.smartlink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (John Galt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Zaurus and packet?
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 09:12:39 GMT
Organization: SmartLink.net Premier ISP 805-294-1273
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm43.smartlink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/32.299

Has any body used a Sharp Zaurus 5800 on packet?  If so how did you
hook up your modem(thru the pcmcia slot or the 15 pin connector?)  Did
you just use the terminal program on the Zaurus?  Thanks.

73 de Bud
Bud
omne ignotum pro magnifico


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.midusa.net!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.swap,alt.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: PRO 26 MOD ? is there one?
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 09:24:43 GMT
Organization: Netspace Internet Services
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59t8qn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: node13.wamego.midusa.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45093 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22431 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121752 rec.radio.scanner:74059 rec.radio.swap:101202 alt.radio.scanner:43643

[e-mail] wrote:

>Is there a mod for cellular for the Pro 26?  I have one source that says
>there is.  I would like to get a few more references before I attempt
>it.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.


>Nick Yatko
>[e-mail]

There is a mod for the Pro-26, but you will have to order some parts
for it. You can either order just the UK CPU which takes a
considerable amount of skill, or you can get the logic board with the
CPU already attached. The latter doesnt even require soldering skills,
mainly screwdriver skills. Look at http://www.demon.co.uk/javiation/
for more information under the the Pro-26 subpage. This mod would make
the Pro-26 an awesome handheld. I wish that I had a few extra $$ to
spend.

Wiggie




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sgi.com!csulb.edu!info.ucla.edu!psgrain!qiclab.scn.rain.com!nntp0.teleport.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Arden Eby)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 11:29:18 GMT
Organization: Teleport - Portland's Public Access [phone]
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip-pdx04-01.teleport.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

"David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>
>
>The response I got from the FCC for a complaint I tried to file on a guy
>for out of band (way out of any authorized amateur band) and he was
>running a good 200 watts was: "we don't have the manpower to enforce
>anymore, cutbacks have us down to a skeleton crew... if he's not
>interfering with any of your household radios etc, ignore it, if he is,
>I can give you a number for a company that sells RFI filters..."
>
>FCC is a bunch of bureaucratic idiots!  Just like any other gov.
>agency.  Sit and collect a check, but don't raise a finger to do your
>job... someone might think your a kissass or something if you do!

What??  He explained why it occurred, "Cutbacks have us down to a
skeleton crew."  You want low taxes.....well you got 'em!  If you want
someone to blame, look in a mirror.  It's John Q. Public who would
sell his soul for a $25 a month more in lower taxes.  Well surprise!
You get what you pay for.

Arden KI7G


******************************************************************************
*****
                                              Arden Eby
                              Internet:  [e-mail]
                  Packet Radio:  [e-mail]
    Homepage (Eby's Cyberscroll)  http://www.teleport.com/~arden/
******************************************************************************
*****


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 26 Dec 1996 06:56:21 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <59tp55$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59t2hk$[e-mail]>,
        Drew Durigan <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Actually, the correct term here is "YE OLDE FAHRTZ."  That's right...
>those ancient operators who are attempting to keep their little hazing
>requirements intact for their private HF club into the 21st century.

Hey Draw... If I'm an "old fart", and you are older than me (look it up
in the callbook) what does that make you?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 07:27:53 -0500
Lines: 76
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59rsef$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59s96d$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Michael P. Deignan wrote:
>
> The ARRL survey was not a "self-selected" poll. A self-selected
> poll would be where someone puts up a poll on the Net and invites
> others to take it.

Wrong.  The ARRL survey was a classic example of a self-selected poll.
A self-selected poll is a poll where the respondents must take a
positive step in order to respond to the poll, versus a conventional
poll, where the pollster selects the respondents.  The most famous
example of a self-selected poll was the infamous Roosevelt v. Landon
poll.  In this case the Literary Digest asked its subscribers/readers to
mail in their preferences for President.  The poll was wildly off, even
for its geographical area.
>
> The ARRL poll was little different than any national opinion
> survey. There is always some percentage of people who do not
> respond.

Wrong again.  Wrong.  National surveys differ from the ARRL poll in a
critical way: the pollsters select the respondents.  Respondents have
the option of saying "no response" but this is included in the tally.
This difference is crucial.  Polls where the respondents decide whether
to respond are universally viewed by polling experts as invalid.  Why is
this?  Simple: when the respondents are self-selected, you are no longer
getting a random sample of whatever population you are seeking to
survey.  The population is tainted by its willingness to respond.  Such
willingness may be a function of many things.  For example, in the case
of the League's poll, response could very well be a function of who has
the leisure time to read QST cover to cover, and then respond to a poll
that is obscurely featured somewhere in the magazine.  (I know I
didn't.  One suspects that lots of older retirees did though.)

> The key is to send out enough surveys that you still
> get a sufficient number back to make a hypothesis test.

The above sentence doesn't mean anything that I can see.  It isn't "the
key" though.  The key to a proper poll is to get a random sample of
respondents.

> Classic example is exit polling during elections. When you walk out,
> a pollster asks you to answer a few simple questions. You can say
> "no thank you" and walk away. That doesn't change the fact that the
> polling agency is able to make, with a great deal of certainty, a
> prediction as to the outcome (i.e. the population opinion as a whole)
> based purely upon those who do respond.

Wrong again.  Pollsters know that exit polls are very unreliable, and
these are not the basis for serious polling.  The polls that most of us
see in the news are ones conducted as I've described above, not exit
polls.  Anyway, exit polls are not self-selected because the pollster,
rather than the respondent, decides who will be polled.

>
> Unfortunately, neither you nor I (or a polling expert or statistician) has
> enough information about the "manner this one was" conducted to make a
> determination as to whether or not it holds scientific validity.

Wrong again.  It was self-selected, that's clear.  Now that's not a
perjorative term, and I'm not bashing the League.  I'm sure that they
meant to do their poll in good faith.  I'm simply pointing out that it
didn't represent good, or even acceptable, polling technique from a
purely technical standpoint.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 07:28:28 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59u22c$[e-mail]>
References: <59tpea$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59tpea$[e-mail]>,
        Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Your reading
>comprehension problem is your problem, not ours. If you can't decipher messag
es
>here, I'd suggest you 'LERN' how to read English.

Perhaps we need to post in Ebonics for people to understand....

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 07:35:54 -0500
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz> <59rr0h$[e-mail]>
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Eric Shamay wrote:
>
>I did own a CBfor a while but what really through the
> hobby away was all those who couldn't go a day without abusing some
> laws. It really was a zoo. Recently I journeyed over to the house of
> my friend and listened in to some 2-meter conversations and they
> seemed pretty much the same. I then went over to HF and the people
> there were much friendlier, less chaotic, and I didn't here one threat
> come out of there mouths.

Forgive me, old chap, but one sojourn to a friend's house is not much of
a basis for an opinion about 2 meters as strongly held as yours seems to
be.  My nine years on VHF and 30 years on HF tells me that there is
frankly very little difference in the quality of the operators.  99% of
the new no-code licensees are FB ops, and have been well-socialized into
our hobby.  The few jammers you hear on 2M are largely a function of the
wide availability (thru Radio Shack and the like) of 2M HTs to
non-hams.  I know that several notorious jammers in LA, for example, are
not hams at all.  Thus, what differences exist between the two bands (HF
and VHF) is probably not a function of any knowledge of Morse Code.  Why
would it be?

>
> My advice (and this comes from experience) is take the time to learn
> morse-code.

Again, I'm not at all sure what experience you have, other than one
afternoon at a friend's, and some time in the CB hobby, to go making the
broad statements you've made.

For what it's worth, I've been in the hobby for 30+ years, have an Extra
Class ticket (big deal) and have worked thousands of CW QSOs.  I
nevertheless support abolishment of the code requirement for HF.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!gatech!rutgers!iag.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 08:10:10 -0500
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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MN Maniac wrote:
>
>
> The Morse requirement will be challenged on grounds of discrimination.

No.  Wrong terminology.  Discrimination, in a legal context, relates to
differentiation among citizens based on certain protected categories
such as race or gender.  Not non-knowledge of morse code.

> Since everyone else in the world has abandoned the code, particularily the
> US military, it will be argued that there is no longer a legitimate
> purpose served by requiring it's knowledge for a US government-issued

You will find that the government would only have to prove it had a
"rational basis" for its actions.  If I'm not mistaken, the government
has only lost one rational basis case out of gazillions that have been
filed.  Rational basis is very easy for the Government to prove.  Court
deference to the government in such circumstances is very great.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 08:15:55 -0500
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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MN Maniac wrote:
>
> >I'm not bashing the League.  I'm sure that they
> >meant to do their poll in good faith.
>
> Uh huh.  Sure.  Just as long as it produced the results that they wanted.

No, I mean what I said.  The mistake the League made in conducting its
poll is a common one.  People make this mistake in good faith all the
time.  For example, in the 1980 Carter-Reagan presidential contest,
Carter's pollsters made a subtle error (along the lines that Mike
Deignan would make):  if someone they phoned wasn't home, they moved on
to the next potential respondent.  Reagan's pollsters, however, called
the same person back later.  Carter's people were engaged in a subtle
form of self-selected polling.  The result was that Carter's poll was
off by around 8 points (a huge amount) while Reagan's were pretty much
on the money.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:13 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.antenna
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.107.41.5!iglou!news
From: [e-mail]
Subject: HELP WITH RFI TO CABLE-CONNECTED TV
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: lex-3-17.iglou.net
X-Nntp-Posting-User: [unauthenticated]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News Administrator)
Organization: IgLou Internet Services (1-800-436-4456)
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Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:20:36 GMT
Lines: 5
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121993 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33314

my new cushcraft R7000 seems to cuase some internference on my
nieghbor's cable-connected TV on certain bands (17 and 10 so far)
any remedies/advice out there would be appreciated.
john



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!iol!dialup-022.galway.iol.ie!user
From: [e-mail] (Rob Gormally)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Weather Fax Frequencies?
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:22:28 +0000
Organization: Ireland On-Line
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup-022.galway.iol.ie
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b4

I have this program (Radfax) that uses a short wave radio linked
to the computer and set to the correct frequency to generate weather
faxes. But there are no frequencies for Europe in the documentation?
If anyone has any frequencies for Europe please send them to me at:

[e-mail]

Regards,
Rob


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:29:11 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <59u5p7$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:


>S>Because Roland and his ilke believe that if you're not a Life member
> >of the ARRL your opinio does not matter. Even when they accept your
> >opnion, it usually had better agree with theirs. Sure the ARRL wants
> >to see code retained. The whole organization is rife with pro-coders.
> >No-coders are shunned and looked down upon. Still hasn't stopped me
> >from being a member.

>Funny, I remember seeing the voting open to no-coders too.  I am sorry
>if they too want to keep the code but that's the way the vote went.

> >The only way the organization will change is by changing the
> >membership. And that is done by joining and adding your voice to the
> >unwashed masses, until we become the majority. That is one of the many
> >reasons i was selected as the President of my local ARC. They know I
> >despise code, would never use it, yet I do not consider coders the
> >unwashed heathens that I am considered by some of the older members.
> >I just smile an keep in mind that these dinosaurs will die eventually
> >and hopefully won't infect too many young hams with their vile and
> >annimosity to their fellow unwashed no-code hams.

>Funny, but I don't see no-coders joining any organizations.  They get
>licensed, get an HT and operate.  Soon they get bored and put the HT on
>the shelf and then buy a NINTENDO game.
Some do and good ridance to them. The ones that stick with the hobby
despite the way we are treated by a great many REAL HAMS(as you all
like to call yourselves) are what you pro-coders have to worry about.
That is why i get so many posts to me with outright insults instead of
encouragement or sensible debating.
A good example of how most of the Pro-coders SHOULD behave is seen in
my local ARRL representative. He is an older ham who likes code. The
other day a friend who just got his ticket resonded to his question of
what class license did he hold by saying that he was only a no-code
technician.. Well the wise old man said: "No one is only a no-code
technician, we are all hams and don't you forget that"
And don't you forget that either.

Happy new Year
KC5WCP
>---
>   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

>--




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:44:07 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <59u6l7$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rled$[e-mail]> <59smqf$[e-mail]> <59t20l$[e-mail]> <59tpea$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp9.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>
>>And there is one thing lower than pointing out spelling mistakes and
>>that is stiking your nose where it does not belong and baiting a
>>fight. I said very plainly that I was not trying to be a spelling
>>critic, but rather that the gentlman should take some care so that his
>>message gets out clearly.
>>If you understand what he was saying than perhaps you can read minds.
>>BUT even to those on the other side of the fence it is clear that his
>>message is difficult to decipher.
>>Stop baiting and start debating. Otherwise feel free to ignore my
>>messages.

>Well, Eric, when you come along and start posting your baloney in a usenet
>newsgroup, it becomes everyone who reads the newsgroups 'business'.
>I can understand exactly what you are doing, too, Eric. You and your little
>no code butt are here to see how much crap you can stir up.  There
>isn't anything to debate.  We don't debate spelling errors here.   Your readi
ng
>comprehension problem is your problem, not ours.  If you can't decipher messa
ges
>here, I'd suggest you 'LERN' how to read English.  If you can't do that, then
>maybe you should stick to 2 meter DXCC and leave the newsgroups for people wh
o
>can read.  You feel free to post here like a normal person, or get use to hav
ing
>people comment on your baloney.

>73, Jim KH2D

Well jim since you are so darn better than me why not tell me what the
OM was saying. here is the exact text of his message. Would you care
to decipher it for me oh great and wise sage. Or would you rather tell
me how better you are than me?

"Eric any Excuse in the World Group is that what you our, is it that
you our affraid you cant learn CW or is that you just dont want to.
Why do you Guys keep whinning about your Short Commings, know one is
Making you Learn CW, if you dont want to stay on VHF. "

Now folks I was not trying to be a spelling critic, just trying to
understand what this post was about as I could not decipher the
meaning of his post. maybe jim the greta can help me.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:46:23 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59u6pf$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rled$[e-mail]> <59t2ke$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp9.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:

>>If you took some time out from beeping and tried hooked on phonics you
>>might better communicate your message.

>You're wasting your time.  He's a beeper, his daddy was a beeper, and
>that's all he knows or cares about.

>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
> KF4DDM

Well Drew I kinda figure that sooner or later even a beeper can see
the truth. maybe....



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:47:24 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <59u6ra$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp9.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:


>J>Don't you see how mean-spirited you and others have become in regard to
> >this policy debate? Very shameful.

>That's the something for nothing mentality in action.

How so Roland?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!cc.iu.net!news
From: Bill Newkirk <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 10:21:23 -0500
Organization: InternetU, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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CC: [e-mail]

MN Maniac wrote:
>
> The vote was a sham, pure and simple.
>
> Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue will
> be decided in the courts.


unless new appointments to the courts decide that they don't
make the rules and there's no other laws violated or constitutional
grounds to challenge the rules...
--
Bill Newkirk WB9IVR                  The Space Coast Amateur Technical
Group
Melbourne, FL                       duty now for the future of amateur
radio
Lombardi's 1st Law of Business:
   Companies succeed in spite of their best effort.  If they succeed at
all.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:20 1997
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!sun4nl!dataweb.net!Leiden.NL.net!news
From: "Christian Leibbrandt" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: CEPT operation in the UK
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Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 15:24:50 GMT
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Xref: news1.epix.net uk.radio.amateur:23874 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121768

Ian, David,

> If you have a CEPT class ONE licence (i.e. allowed
> to use HF) then you should prefix with M0/
>
> If you have a CEPT class TWO licence (144MHz and
> above only) then you should prefix with M1/

Thanks to you both, it's all very clear to me now.
Seasons Greetings to all,

Christian Leibbrandt
(M1/PE1OAJ)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!cc.iu.net!news
From: Bill Newkirk <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 10:31:47 -0500
Organization: InternetU, Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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MN Maniac wrote:
> If the ARRL expects to have a future, they better get with the program and
> start respecting the views of younger, newer hams instead of being a
> mouthpiece for the old, pro-code bunch.  Their core membership is
> literally dying off, and those all-important membership dues arre dying
> along with them.  I won't give a dime to the ARRL until they modify their
> tough, pro-code, head-in-the-sand views.

nothing's stopping the new guys from walking up and picking the harness
and start pulling in their favorite direction..enough do this and the
whole
train changes direction.

if you join, then when the old guys die off, you'll be left in charge...

but watch out..you'll be the "old guy" then...

--
Bill Newkirk WB9IVR                  The Space Coast Amateur Technical
Group
Melbourne, FL                       duty now for the future of amateur
radio
Lombardi's 1st Law of Business:
   Companies succeed in spite of their best effort.  If they succeed at
all.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 15:50:10 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59u22c$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>Perhaps we need to post in Ebonics for people to understand....

Where do we sign up?  Maybe we can get millions in federal money to write
in 'gangbanger jive' just like Oakland, CA is attempting to do.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 26 Dec 1996 15:53:04 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>I'm not bashing the League.  I'm sure that they
>meant to do their poll in good faith.

Uh huh.  Sure.  Just as long as it produced the results that they wanted.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:24 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: 26 Dec 1996 15:57:25 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

<<unless new appointments to the courts decide that they don't
make the rules and there's no other laws violated or constitutional
grounds to challenge the rules...>>

The Morse requirement will be challenged on grounds of discrimination.
Since everyone else in the world has abandoned the code, particularily the
US military, it will be argued that there is no longer a legitimate
purpose served by requiring it's knowledge for a US government-issued
radio license.  It will be further argued that the Morse requirement is
now an artificial barrier, a "hazing ritual" required for entry, and no
longer has any technical or legal justification for being required as a
condition of obtaining a license.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: Dan K Nelson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 08:15:24 -0800
Organization: -None-
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Arden Eby wrote:
>
> "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >FCC is a bunch of bureaucratic idiots!  Just like any other gov.
> >agency.  Sit and collect a check, but don't raise a finger to do your
> >job... someone might think your a kissass or something if you do!
>
> What??  He explained why it occurred, "Cutbacks have us down to a
> skeleton crew."  You want low taxes.....well you got 'em!  If you want
> someone to blame, look in a mirror.  It's John Q. Public who would
> sell his soul for a $25 a month more in lower taxes.  Well surprise!
> You get what you pay for.
>
> Arden KI7G

It's not the publics' fault. The total budget of the FCC when it was staffed t
o
full capacity was a drop in the bucket compared to the billions of dollars the

Government wastes every year on the thousands of entitlement programs, and
general waste and squander on behalf of their own self-interests.

Now that a little pressure is being applied by the public to account for all o
f
this money, the government responds NOT by eliminating the waste and squander,

but by cutting back on the services the public IS paying for...

<<< DAN >>>
--
+-------------------------------------------------------+
|An Armed Man is a Citizen, an Unarmed Man is a Subject.|
+-------------------------------------------------------+


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 16:18:31 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <59u8gn$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: sfe-nm1-27.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 26  8:18:31 AM PST 1996

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (MN
Maniac) writes:
>
>>>Eric I hate to let you know but whaT ever you were Rambling about
did
>not
>Belittle me in the Slighest. I have Tuff skin and If you would like
take a
>Cheap Shot go for it. But belive me anything you have to say would not
>belittle me. Maybe you should Learn CW it might help your Spelling. <<
>
>...says the beeper as he misspells and miscapitalizes in the process.


Be careful here. You are only allowed to critique spelling and grammar
when the errors are made by the anti code crowd. If you criticize a pro
coder God-Emperor Kehler will erupt from the Pacific and give you an
insulting little name. Worst case scenario his toadies will take up the
name and you will be truly be demeaned by being called names.

I passed my code hazing and even beep on the radio from time to time.
Despite this some basic flaw in my character makes me continue to think
fast code testing is a load of rubish that should be done away with. I
do agree with Kehler that it won't happen here so most of my anti fast
code testing effort occurs in other venues where there is a chance of
doing some good. To make code testing resonable no treaties need change
after all 1 WPM satisfies the treaty just the attitude at ARRL need to
be changed. If it changes there the FCC will soon follow.

                            73 Jerry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.net.uk!news.u-net.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Simon Evans)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.shortwave,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Old Timers Radio
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 16:32:59 GMT
Organization: Hooloovoo
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: orme.u-net.com
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.shortwave:91307 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121907


Hi,

I'm looking for some information for my father, if anyone can help,
please reply via email.

The last couple of years of the war he was in the RCOS (RCS?)
stationned on the Isle of Man and transcribing Japanese then
(unsportingly I thought) Russian transmissions. I'm looking for any
Net resources that might interest him with regard to this...pretty
vague really.

We've just bought him a set he used during the war an RCA (AR88?)
which he's been delightedly glued to since. I've run a number of
searches to find transmission,station, time etc details and found
little relevant to the set. Most freq lists seem to serve either hams
or scanner buffs. The set picks up loads of stations and signals,some
of which are proving difficult to tie down. The set (as far as I can
tell) seems to cover a band from about 500khz to 36mhz, although I'm
no expert. He'd be interested in any English stations, but also is
enjoying getting his morse back to scratch.


Thanks,
Simon.








_______________________________________________________

>  Simon Evans   [e-mail]   Liverpool UK  <
_______________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: AC6V <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Weather Fax Frequencies?
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 08:58:13 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: esc-ca2-02.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 26  8:56:51 AM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)
To: Rob Gormally <[e-mail]>

Rob Gormally wrote:
>
> I have this program (Radfax) that uses a short wave radio linked
> to the computer and set to the correct frequency to generate weather
> faxes. But there are no frequencies for Europe in the documentation?
> If anyone has any frequencies for Europe please send them to me at:
>
> [e-mail]
>
> Regards,
> Rob

Hi Rob try the following URL:

http://oahu.cern.ch/~markus/radio/weatherfax.html

Also it is listed on the DX Reference page below under the clickable
FREQUENCIES

Gd Faxing & Dx
Rod in San Diego
--
AC6V DX Reference Page: http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
E-Mail: [e-mail]

Hark!  For I Have Hurled My Words To The Far Reaches Of The Earth!
What King Of  Old Could Do Thus?? -- AC6V


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:32 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 17:49:14 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <59udlq$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]> <59krpb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121787 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44729

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Dick Flanagan) wrote:

>>>In article <59krpb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
>>>wrote:
>>>>It is only compelling to the ARRL...if the ARRL board wants to
>>>>accept it.  It is NOT compelling in any technical manner as a means
>>>>to justify an international treaty requirement.

>>>What is interesting, of course, is that if the survey had come out in favor
>>>of no-code HF, it would have been pointed to as the ultimate "word of the
>>>people" that the ARRL wouldn't dare disregard.

>>>It's amazing to see how the respect for a given poll differs with the
>>>results of that poll.  ::chuckle::

>>Excuse me Dick, but just where do you see any disrespect in my
>>comment. I offered no disrespect for the poll, what I said
>>stands...the poll does not, in and of itself, constitute a compelling
>>technical reason to retain CW testing.

>>What this poll (and any other) does is provide an indication of
>>the OPINIONS (i.e. the political climate) of those being
>>polled.

>>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

>There is only ONE compelling reason to retain CW testing, Bill.  The FCC
>says we have to do it.  Go change that, and your problems are solved.

Complete and total failure in logic...

The reason we HAVE CW testing is because the FCC regs require it.

The reason TO RETAIN CW TESTING is not because it is a regulation.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:33 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 17:49:20 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <59udm1$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]> <59krpb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121775 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44720

[e-mail](William M. Pasternak) wrote:

>To All,
>The poll -- actually polls -- conducted were fair and acrate as far as
>they went.  The problem I see is that they did not sample enough of the
>nations Amateur Radio populice.  Nor was there the required "control
>sample" outside of the ham radio community.

>According to a story that we will put to air in about 48 hours, the
>ARRL admits that of its 17,000+ members, only some 10,000 replied to
>the poll.  It then polled at random another 2000 hams. It made no
>attempt to poll and establish a "control group" so it really cannot
>claim that the results are indicative of the majority of the nations
>650,000 hams -- nor even of the ARRL's 170,000 members.

>If you want an accurate poll, you hire a company like Irving Fields or
>the like to conduct it.  You do both targeted and across-the-board
>polling and then compare the samples against a pre-determined gradient.
>None of this was done, so I have to doubt the accuracy of the poll.
>This is what ARRL should have done, but I seriously doubt it had the
>money to do it.  So, they did the best it could with what it had.

>That aside, the ARRL has a direct obligation to politically represent
>the views, wants, desires and needs of its members.  For it to do
>anything else would be a breach of trust.  If ARRL members believe that
>retention of the Morse code as a requisite requirement for operating a
>ham station below 30 MHz be retained, then it is obligated to fight for
>that ideal -- regardless of what you or I might want.  Those outside of
>the ARRL are entitled to their opinion as well, but unless and/or until
>they become an organized political entity like the ARRL, they are
>naught but screaming in the wind.  Basically, they are venting their
>collective splean on USENET as an alternative do taking the basic
>political action needed to give credence to their opinion.

Another fault with the poll (IMHO) is that it failed to ask for
reasons why proponents wanted to reatain CW.  That puts the
ARRL on shaky technical grounds in asking for the retention of
CW testing by ALL countries as a result of ITU treating requirements.

Additionally,
Bill P is absolutely correct about the ARRL (assuming they do take
a PRO-CW position).  That is why I previously posted the following:

I have proposed
an effort to challenge any position taken by the ARRL that
would sustain continued international treaty requirements
for Morse Code knowledge as a requirement for HF access.

Note, this effort is not targeted at the FCC, but rather is
primarily aimed at making sure  the ITU is made aware that
a significant number of USA hams are opposed to continued
CW testing for amateurs in the 21st Century.

No need to reply now.  I'll draft a proposed ITU submission which,
when completed, I'll post and you can then comment as
you see fit.  Once we get an agreement as to the final form
of the submission, we can then solicit signators for the
submission.

Lastly, this effort, which may go gainst a formal position of
the ARRL is NOT an effort on my part to start a new organization.
I have nether the time nor effort to do that.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:34 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Barry Rose)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 96 17:59:23 GMT
Organization: GoodNet
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59uekd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts16-15.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
(MN Maniac) wrote:
>>>FCC ISSUES NOTICE OF MONETARY FORFEITURE OF $6,000 TO AMATEUR RADIO
>OPERATOR IN PHOENIX, ARIZONA.<<
>
>Suggestion: while the FCC's enforcement division is in Phoenix, why don't
>they drop down to 27.635 and 27.385 to take care of Frank Burns and his
>gang of idiots down there?  These guys have been at it on a daily basis
>for years...agitating, running power, illegal frequencies, profanity,
>etc., and nobody ever seems to do anything about it.

I believe the person the FCC issued the forfeiture against was one of that
group. The FCC is probably watching the rest of them too.

Barry


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!news.nacamar.de!uunet!in1.uu.net!163.181.251.1!news2.amd.com!txnntp.amd.com!not-for-mail
From: Chris Broadbent <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:14:31 -0600
Organization: AMD
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz> <59rr0h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ramulale.amd.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I)

Eric Shamay wrote:
>
> ...<statement of support by a newcomer for and ease of learning code deleted
 for the sake of
> brevity.>

What a wonderful attitude Eric has.  Instead of whining, this fellow
simply settled down to do it.  The complainers should be ashamed of
themselves complaining about having to do a little test.  It really
isn't worth all this noise.

--
Cheers,

Chris. Broadbent ( KC5VQL )

NOTE: My email address in this post is modified to prevent spam.  Just
remove the '.nospam' from the end of it if you wish to email me.  It
sucks that I must do this, but the amount of unsolicited crap I'm
receiving now makes it necessary.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: 26 Dec 1996 13:28:16 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <59ug40$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        MN Maniac <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue will
>be decided in the courts.

Out of curiousity, what will the basis of the lawsuit be?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:38 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:05:20 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <59uiah$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58ibek$[e-mail]> <58nuio$[e-mail]> <58tvgr$[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: i469.oro.net
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->[e-mail] wrote:

[lots of snippitie doo-dah]

Squiggie THIS, buzzard breath --

People who learned to drive in the '20s had to know the rules for safely
passing a horse in the middle of town.  People who learned to engineer in
the '30s had to know how to modulate an 807 with a pair of 811s.  People
who learned to fly in the '40s had to know how to tame a taildragger.

People who learned to ham in the '50s had to learn code.

Out of all these learning processes, guess which one hangs on to the past
while the rest of the world passes them by?  I'm not arguing against horses
or tubes or tailwheels or code, but against a system that mandates testing
an obsolete skill.

Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:19:43 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz> <59rr4i$[e-mail]> <59sfjd$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)
To: Drew Durigan <[e-mail]>

Drew Durigan wrote:
>
> Record your vote at our Web site:
>
> http://www.codesux.com
>
> -Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>  KF4DDM

Geez Drew, no prejudice in that URL name...
But it at least gives all those that can't learn the code something to
do other than display their 90's welfare mentality. You know...
'it's toooooo haaaard...I can't dooooo it.' so give it to me just
'cuz I want it.
Kinda like giving the quarterback the 6 points when he fumbles on the 5
yard line... he meant to get a touchdown so we should just give him the
points anyway.

geez....
--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:21:51 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <59vnid$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-133.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>>Eric I hate to let you know but whaT ever you were Rambling about did
>not
>Belittle me in the Slighest. I have Tuff skin and If you would like take a
>Cheap Shot go for it. But belive me anything you have to say would not
>belittle me. Maybe you should Learn CW it might help your Spelling. <<

>...says the beeper as he misspells and miscapitalizes in the process.

Says the Good Buddy cuz nobody in the CB newsgroup will talk to him.....




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.191.213.61!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:24:18 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <59vnn1$[e-mail]>
References: <59u8gn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-133.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>Beware of Beepers brandishing big B.S.

Said the lonely Good Buddy to the Flea.......




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:29:26 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <59vo0k$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-133.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>Manaiac Quit whinning and learn Cw

>I'm sorry...I don't take advice from beepers who can't spell correctly.

Said the lonely Good Buddy to the Flea.......




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.edm.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Eric Shamay)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:30:41 GMT
Organization: EDM Network
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <59uas3$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port203.edm.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

>The Morse requirement will be challenged on grounds of discrimination.
>Since everyone else in the world has abandoned the code, particularily the
>US military, it will be argued that there is no longer a legitimate
>purpose served by requiring it's knowledge for a US government-issued
>radio license.

It isn't just an FCC requirment as well as supported by ARRL, it is
required by the ITU. (International Telecommunications Union) That
means that every COUNTRY around the WORLD who wishes to partake in
this union, and many do, are required to show that their HF operators
show a profficiency in morse code at 5 WPM. Flaming others (especially
the pro-coders) won't get you anywhere. If you want to accomplish
something go speak with foreign representatives in the ITU or send a
few more letters to the FCC.

EXTINGUISH THE FLAMES! they're really starting to piss me off...




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:44 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dreaming I won the lottery
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 12:31:24 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59o1t1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

KC5WCP wrote:
>
> jim daneke <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >When I am stupid enough to buy a lottery ticket, I dream about quitting
> >my job, buying a house on a mountain, putting up a beam and putting out
> >1500 watts.

<snip to save some bandwidth>

> When I get the QSL card from China I will send you a copy if
> your addres is correct in the callbook. It may take awhile, but I'll
> do it and I'll do it without code and without HF.
>

<Temper tantrum follows>

> Still, I feel I have a right to use the HF bands without the silly and
> outdated code requirement.
>
> KC5WCP
> HF is for sissies, try DXing on 2m. Its a REAL challenge!

(90's whine follows, in deep symnpathy for the incapable nocoder as
above)
He said he would work for the DX on VHF and UHF, but wouldn't (or can't)
learn the code...now that's a *real* disability.
"I caaaaan't doooo it! It's toooooooo haaard! I deserve it"
Ole' KC5(nocode)WCP said in his last sentence He can do
I just love this 90's welfare mentality!
--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-12.sprintlink.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!butch!wargrave!lweissma
From: [e-mail] (Larry AD3Y)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: 26 Dec 1996 19:50:57 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 10
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59ukv1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wargrave.motown.lmco.com

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>The Morse requirement will be challenged on grounds of discrimination.
>Since everyone else in the world has abandoned the code

Uh, what world is that?

Larry - AD3Y




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: Andy Moss <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: PL Codes??
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 11:57:13 -0800
Organization: Trailing-Edge Technologies
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf2ec$683f4080$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-157-160.on.ca.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; U)
To: "W.S.H." <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22453 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121797 rec.radio.cb:39989 rec.radio.scanner:74120

W.S.H. wrote:
>
> Please correct me if I'm Wrong!
>
> USER    FREQ
>    08         88.5
>    12       100.0
>    16       114.8
>    18       123.0
>    19       127.3
>    20       131.8
>    21       136.5
>    24       151.4
>
> Please correct my mistakes or please advise is the above is correct. It
> will be of great assistance!!

Shane, CTCSS tones are usually numbered/identified with a LL (letter
letter) or LN (letter number) type scheme.

Ie:     100.0Hz = 1Z
        123.0Hz = 3Z
        241.8Hz = M6

There are about 42 odd standardized CTCSS tone frequencies.  Many CTCSS
encoder/decoder circuits can not deal with more than 32 different tones
- simply because they don't have enough divider/address lines/aka DIP
switches.  If your radio is using the above numbers for CTCSS tone
frequencies they could be totally different on another radio.  To
confuse the matter some more, there are several non-standard CTCSS tone
frequencies in use too.  I find it best to use the full frequency in Hz
just to avoid any possible confusion.  Hopefully your encoder/decoder
with be compatible.


--
Andy Moss
"I often fantasize about my inability to daydream....."


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THE FINAL WORD
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 20:04:12 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <59vq1q$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59scps$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-127.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Spew Durigan) wrote:

>[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:
>>
>>Maniac our you still whinning about CW???

>"OUR?!"

>Looks like you better spend a little more time at English class instead
>of in front of the old brass key.

>-Spew in Sunny Central Florida-
> KF4DDM

So you can get a good job cleaning the restrooms at a radio station, like
Spew.  Looks like your website is like your radio, Spew. Non existant.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 20:07:54 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <59vq8o$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz> <59rr0h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-127.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Again, I'm not at all sure what experience you have, other than one
>afternoon at a friend's, and some time in the CB hobby, to go making the
>broad statements you've made.

>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV

>USC Law, Class of '97

Come on, Roger. Lighten UP.  'I heard a 706 with a stock mic one time and it
sounded OK to me'.

73, Jim KH2D
Lorton Reform School, Class of '64





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!svr1.pdx.gstis.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 20:10:22 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <59vqdd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-127.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>The Morse requirement will be challenged on grounds of discrimination.
>Since everyone else in the world has abandoned the code, particularily the
>US military, it will be argued that there is no longer a legitimate
>purpose served by requiring it's knowledge for a US government-issued
>radio license.  It will be further argued that the Morse requirement is
>now an artificial barrier, a "hazing ritual" required for entry, and no
>longer has any technical or legal justification for being required as a
>condition of obtaining a license.

Maniac, is your daddy's name Lenny by any chance ?





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bconnex.net!news.abs.net!aplcen.apl.jhu.edu!cpk-news-feed3.bbnplanet.com!news.ipass.net![e-mail]
From: "David A. Cooley" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 15:47:32 -0500
Organization: IPass.net
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: customs541.ipass.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121817 rec.radio.scanner:74146

Someone has gotten good at faking headers... I never posted this.
Looking at the expanded headers, I see this:

NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw

Which does not appear on messages posted through Ipass.net.

when I track down who, this will be brought to their ISP's attention.

Thanks,
Dave



David A. Cooley wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen
>
> > It wasn't my idea to have a flame war. however, since you seem so keen
> > on the point, why don't you check into the on-line archive of newsgroups
> > and see what mackey did to rec.radio.scanner for almost 8 months!
>
> Eric, I have grown weary of your repeated comments about where you make
> statements something like the above.  You state or imply that I
> caused problems on rec.radio.scanner for 8 months.  This is absolutely
> not true.  I have told you this & you strongly argue that you are
> correct.


<SNIP>
--
========================================================================
David Cooley N5XMT                  Packet: N5XMT@W4RAL.#RTP.NC.USA.NOAM
Internet: [e-mail]    And Web: http://www.ipass.net/~cooldave/
Sponges grow in the ocean... Wonder how deep it would be if they didn't!
========================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FAKE HAMS
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 13:48:44 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

Gms1132 wrote:
>
> fake hams are people who become hams so they can get on the licensed bands
> and keep on doing their crap and jamming they were doing on C.B.fake hams
> also think they're real hams because they take and pass their code class
> licenses; even when they still go out and jam and violate fcc rules and
> regs. R U THAT KIND OF HAM? ----that's my two cents worth....de tigreyez!

you can't learn it either, huh bunky?
Tough.

--
Stan Aughenbaugh II
[e-mail]
[e-mail]
Amateur Radio KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 15:59:17 -0500
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-183.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

William M. Pasternak wrote:

SNIP! (for space)
>
> One of the things that has become obvious in the past several years is
> that most -- though not all no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
> They are not the traditional ham with a deep rooted interest in ham
> radio.  Rather, they are communicators who want to communicate
> reliabally -- at minimum cost -- with family and a few close friends.
>
SNIP!  (for space)

> Any thoughts???
>
> Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
> Newsline On-Line

Well, yeah.  I don't think that the above is true.  When I listen on the
2M repeaters here in So Cal, I hear lots of QSOs with no-code techs
involved.  QSOs in the usual sense of the word, not conversations with
one's spouse about getting dinner ready, and the like.

No-code techs were well-represented during the Jan 17 earthquake as
volunteers in our local disaster communications organization.  They
participate in great numbers in many ham activities around here.

Some of these folks do find the code to be a barrier to advancement.  I
never have myself, so I'm not sure why.  Fact is, many people do.  And
most of these people would be assets to our dying and greying hobby.
Without them, ham radio will die.

I do think that since these people (no code techs) are limited to VHF,
their interest in our hobby will be lower, simply because there is less
to do on VHF.  Unless you are really into hi tech stuff, VHF is limited
in its usage compared to HF.  Not to minimize its value: VHF is great.
But only HF offers long range communications at modest cost.

I think the real lesson about the no code program is the fact that 99%
of these chaps are FB ops.  They have disproved the "CW filter" theory
(to which I once subscribed).

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:54 1997
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From: "Wayne H. Allen" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 21:18:21 GMT
Organization: National Defence, SRS, Canada
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Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote in article =
<59rr6g$[e-mail]>...
| [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
|=20
| >plenty to keep CW sub bands. But to be required to pass a code test =
to
| >use phone is silly.
|=20
| >Eric
|=20
| Almost as silly as suggesting that people on welfare get a job, right =
Eric ?
|=20
| 73, Jim KH2D
|=20

        Not nearly as silly as comparing the two issues.=20


VA3WHA





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:55 1997
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:21:43 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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MN Maniac wrote:
>
> >Are there more?
>
> You forgot "OLD FART ARROGANT HAMS"
>
> Judging from the responses in this newsgroup, I would say this comprises
> the largest group of all.

No... the AUTISTIC Hams - a group incapable of learning code.
might be OK except for their learning disability.
--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 18:12:56 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (David Harmon)
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster> <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 2 Jan 1997 19:46:35 GMT
Lines: 11
Sender: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]>,
Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>about. I might suggest that any such homebrewing should be limited
>to using no more than a 12 volt DC power source, however, just in
>order to reduce the chance the apprentice might harm himself
>while experimenting with circuits.

That's not a legitimate matter for government regulation.  As long as he
is not in any danger of injuring other people, causing interference to
other users, etc., his safety is his own concern!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:34 1997
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:38:04 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 16
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Drew Durigan wrote:
>
> >If you took some time out from beeping and tried hooked on phonics you
> >might better communicate your message.
>
> You're wasting your time.  He's a beeper, his daddy was a beeper, and
> that's all he knows or cares about.
>
> -Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>  KF4DDM

Poor old Drew, still can't learn the code...sad.

--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:35 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:38:35 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
>
> Eric, I have grown weary of your repeated comments about where you make
> statements something like the above.  You state or imply that I
> caused problems on rec.radio.scanner for 8 months.  This is absolutely
> not true.  I have told you this & you strongly argue that you are
> correct.
Yeah, so? O argue this point because you choose to lie to everyone.

>
> Well, lets have the facts speak for themselves.  I did a search on
> Dejanews for the "famous" thread I made which started MY part in the
> issue on rec.radio.scanner.  This thread was called:
>
>    "Bill Cheeks is an asshole"
yeah, and it went on for quite a spell too, didn't it. I joined the
internet about 6 monthst ago and this was an old thread by that time.
Also, it was an opinion on your part and should never have been blown
out of porportion. However, in your infinite stubborness, you saw fit to
contest anyone who disagreed with you on this point.

>
> If you read in the copies of Dejanews printouts I have attached below,
> you will find that the initial message was posted by ME on 7-21-96.
> Then there were MANY follow-up posts after mine.  All follow-up
> posts have "Re:" in front of the thread title above.  These
> posts from that thread end in October.  There are no more more after
> that.  July to October is HARDLY 8 months, more like THREE as
> I have told you
Yeah and you didn't include them all, just the ones you wanted.

[extranious tripe snipped]
> You seem to be causing problems by your lack of candor & honesty.
again, that is your opinion, backed up by personal insults on your part.
Why don't you grow up?




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:36 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:39:24 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
> I don't know what is going on here but the post above THIS reply
> is MINE.
>
> The other 3 are something else, either error or forgery.
>
> <shrug>
Not when the first line of headers all come from the same place Hohn.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:37 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: lesson in history/honesty for Eric Oyen  was:Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:42:35 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Jammer wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen
>
>
> Eric, I have grown weary of your repeated comments about where you make
> statements something like the above.  You state or imply that I
> caused problems on rec.radio.scanner for 8 months.  This is absolutely
> not true.  I have told you this & you strongly argue that you are
> correct.
Were you there? Honesty, since whne has anyone else involved in this
little flame fest ever displayed any honesty? A;sp, you might want to
include all the variables in your search next time (including the posts
from ka0ssf, pjb, flated5th, etc).




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:37 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 14:44:35 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
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David A. Cooley wrote:
>
> Eric Oyen
>
> > It wasn't my idea to have a flame war. however, since you seem so keen
> > on the point, why don't you check into the on-line archive of newsgroups
> > and see what mackey did to rec.radio.scanner for almost 8 months!
>
> Eric, I have grown weary of your repeated comments about where you make
> statements something like the above.  You state or imply that I
> caused problems on rec.radio.scanner for 8 months.  This is absolutely
> not true.  I have told you this & you strongly argue that you are
> correct.
>
Funny how this is an exact duplicate of 2 other postings under different
names. Duplicate as in word for word all the way from where it says:
Eric Oyen wrote: to the end of the message.

Thanks ever so much for proving my case for me.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:38 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Keith Furgalus)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Yaesu FRG-100B- Where is it?
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 21:47:20 GMT
Organization: Exchange Network Services
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Does anybody know what happened to the FRG-100B?  I'm in Cleveland
Ohio area and cant find anybody that doesn't have more than two.
Universal says that they need to get a shipment from Yaesu, and don't
expect a shipment anytime soon.  Any comments?
                Thankyou Greatly!
                                Brian Furgalus



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:39 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: PL Codes??
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 21:49:33 GMT
Organization: Myne
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf2ec$683f4080$[e-mail]>
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There are a number of different PL type codes.. Icom, Motorola, and
CTCSS. Motorola uses LN (LetterNumber), i.e. 2a, 3Z, etc. Icom uses
Icom, where it's simply a number (1-32), i.e. 1 = 67.0 ... 14=110.9,
etc.) Then there's Yaesu. I can't figure our their combo 67.0 = 15,
110.9 = 30, etc..

"W.S.H." <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Please correct me if I'm Wrong!
>
>USER    FREQ
>   08         88.5
>   12       100.0
>   16       114.8
>   18       123.0
>   19       127.3
>   20       131.8
>   21       136.5
>   24       151.4
>
>Please correct my mistakes or please advise is the above is correct. It
>will be of great assistance!!
>
>Please send replies to the following e-mail address!
>
>Thanks in ADVANCE!
>--
>Shane H.
>[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:40 1997
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From: [e-mail](William M. Pasternak)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 22:04:03 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <59usoj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: scr-ca1-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Dec 26  4:04:03 PM CST 1996

In <[e-mail]> Bill Newkirk <[e-mail]> writes:
>
>MN Maniac wrote:
>> If the ARRL expects to have a future, they better get with the
program and
>> start respecting the views of younger, newer hams instead of being a
>> mouthpiece for the old, pro-code bunch.  Their core membership is
>> literally dying off, and those all-important membership dues arre
dying
>> along with them.  I won't give a dime to the ARRL until they modify
their
>> tough, pro-code, head-in-the-sand views.
>
>nothing's stopping the new guys from walking up and picking the
harness
>and start pulling in their favorite direction..enough do this and the
>whole
>train changes direction.
>
>if you join, then when the old guys die off, you'll be left in
charge...
>
>but watch out..you'll be the "old guy" then...
>
>--
>Bill Newkirk WB9IVR                  The Space Coast Amateur Technical
>Group
>Melbourne, FL                       duty now for the future of amateur
>radio
>Lombardi's 1st Law of Business:
>   Companies succeed in spite of their best effort.  If they succeed
at
>all.

One of the things that has become obvious in the past several years is
that most -- though not all no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
They are not the traditional ham with a deep rooted interest in ham
radio.  Rather, they are communicators who want to communicate
reliabally -- at minimum cost -- with family and a few close friends.

They are not joiners.  They do not join the ARRL or any other national
political activist ham radio group.  They do not join local clubs.
They do not financially support repeaters.  To them, ham radio is
nothing more than an inexpensive alternative to a cell-fone; and as
such they have no abiding comitment to the service.

I used to think that if a carismatic leader came along to organize the
no-code Techs that they would be a political force unmatched in the
history of ham radio.  After several years of watching, I have changed
my mind.  It will never happen and I now really have doubts how many
no-coders would buy and use an HF rig if they were given Extra class
priveleges without having to take any test.  (What was it that Wayne
Green used to say that you could stand on a street corner handing out
free Extra class licenses and free rigs -- and get no takers???)

I think we are dealing with a different mindset than ever before in ham
radio and in creating the codefree Tech, we have really created a
separate "communicator" radio service where current hams who own
repeaters are "service providers" providing a public utility at no cost
to the public.

Any thoughts???

Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
Newsline On-Line


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:42 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: The Amateur's Code - a refresher
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>I think that the above code is a lot more important for newcomers, and
>experienced hams alike, to understand, than is the Morse code.

Righto! we need an ala carte testing program.  If you don't think a
topic is important then waive that test section off!  I happen to
think AC electrical theory is not important -- so I needn't take that
element! same for Smith charts!  Hey, the Oakland school
board had this figured out! they decided English was really
as important as previously thought!

I just wish this idea had existed when I took the Bar and CPA exams.

John




>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV
>
>USC Law, Class of '97
>
>------------------------------------------------------------
>"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
>Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
>------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:42 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 22:18:00 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59u8gn$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

<<Be careful here. You are only allowed to critique spelling and grammar
when the errors are made by the anti code crowd. If you criticize a pro
coder God-Emperor Kehler will erupt from the Pacific and give you an
insulting little name. Worst case scenario his toadies will take up the
name and you will be truly be demeaned by being called names. >>

Well said.

Beware of Beepers brandishing big B.S.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:43 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Dreaming I won the lottery
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 22:47:40 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <59v2vt$[e-mail]>
References: <594m8q$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59o1t1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp14.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:

>KC5WCP wrote:
>>
>> jim daneke <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>> >When I am stupid enough to buy a lottery ticket, I dream about quitting
>> >my job, buying a house on a mountain, putting up a beam and putting out
>> >1500 watts.

><snip to save some bandwidth>

>> When I get the QSL card from China I will send you a copy if
>> your addres is correct in the callbook. It may take awhile, but I'll
>> do it and I'll do it without code and without HF.
>>

><Temper tantrum follows>

>> Still, I feel I have a right to use the HF bands without the silly and
>> outdated code requirement.
>>
>> KC5WCP
>> HF is for sissies, try DXing on 2m. Its a REAL challenge!

>(90's whine follows, in deep symnpathy for the incapable nocoder as
>above)
>He said he would work for the DX on VHF and UHF, but wouldn't (or can't)
>learn the code...now that's a *real* disability.
>"I caaaaan't doooo it! It's toooooooo haaard! I deserve it"
>Ole' KC5(nocode)WCP said in his last sentence He can do
>I just love this 90's welfare mentality!
>--
>Stan KF0NC
>"90% of all statistics are made up"

Yadda yadda Yadda...




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:45 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 22:52:28 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <59v38t$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (MN
>Maniac) writes:
>>
>>>>Eric I hate to let you know but whaT ever you were Rambling about
>did
>>not
>>Belittle me in the Slighest. I have Tuff skin and If you would like
>take a
>>Cheap Shot go for it. But belive me anything you have to say would not
>>belittle me. Maybe you should Learn CW it might help your Spelling. <<
>>
>>...says the beeper as he misspells and miscapitalizes in the process.


>Be careful here. You are only allowed to critique spelling and grammar
>when the errors are made by the anti code crowd. If you criticize a pro
>coder God-Emperor Kehler will erupt from the Pacific and give you an
>insulting little name. Worst case scenario his toadies will take up the
>name and you will be truly be demeaned by being called names.

>I passed my code hazing and even beep on the radio from time to time.
>Despite this some basic flaw in my character makes me continue to think
>fast code testing is a load of rubish that should be done away with. I
>do agree with Kehler that it won't happen here so most of my anti fast
>code testing effort occurs in other venues where there is a chance of
>doing some good. To make code testing resonable no treaties need change
>after all 1 WPM satisfies the treaty just the attitude at ARRL need to
>be changed. If it changes there the FCC will soon follow.

>                            73 Jerry

Well Jerry I tell ya...I post here as a sounding board in the hopes of
finding some intelligent hams on the other side of the debate so that
I may find any holes in my position. There is the ever so slight
chance that I may be on the wrong side of the issue.
But after reading what the code gods have to say for their side I am
pleased to see that I have chosen the right side :) If all the code
gods can come up with is funny little names like SQUIGGY or call
people PANTYWAISTS and term their thinking WELFARE ATTITUDE then I am
quite sure the debate will be short and fruitfull in the real world.

73
KC5WCP
ERIC



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:45 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FAKE HAMS
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 23:08:58 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <59v47u$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Gms1132 wrote:
>>
>> fake hams are people who become hams so they can get on the licensed bands
>> and keep on doing their crap and jamming they were doing on C.B.fake hams
>> also think they're real hams because they take and pass their code class
>> licenses; even when they still go out and jam and violate fcc rules and
>> regs. R U THAT KIND OF HAM? ----that's my two cents worth....de tigreyez!

>you can't learn it either, huh bunky?
>Tough.

>--
>Stan Aughenbaugh II
>[e-mail]
>[e-mail]
>Amateur Radio KF0NC
>"90% of all statistics are made up"
Looks like ole Stan "BUNKY" Aughenbaugh ll is one o' dem type a hams
:)

I'll let ya'll know whenst i stop laughing my silly rump off over this
one!!!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:47 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 26 Dec 1996 18:13:52 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <59v0rg$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59uiah$[e-mail]>, Jim Weir <[e-mail]> wrote:

>People who learned to drive in the '20s had to know the rules for safely
>passing a horse in the middle of town.  People who learned to engineer in
>the '30s had to know how to modulate an 807 with a pair of 811s.  People
>who learned to fly in the '40s had to know how to tame a taildragger.
>
>People who learned to ham in the '50s had to learn code.

>Out of all these learning processes, guess which one hangs on to the past
>while the rest of the world passes them by?  I'm not arguing against horses
>or tubes or tailwheels or code, but against a system that mandates testing
>an obsolete skill.

Does 40% of the population still use horses? Do 40% of the engineers
still use 807s? Do 40% of the people that fly do so on an aircraft with
a taildragger?

40% of amateurs on HF use CW for communication. That in of itself makes
it a relevant test.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:48 1997
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From: Carl Littlejohns <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: uk.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: CEPT operation in the UK
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 00:24:36 +0000
Organization: gw0tqm
Lines: 26
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 <01bbefa3$530d2a20$c7e84fc1@christian-p133>
 <[e-mail]>
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> If you have a CEPT class ONE licence (i.e. allowed to use HF) then
you
> should prefix with M0/
>
> If you have a CEPT class TWO licence (144MHz and above only) then you
> should prefix with M1/

That is certainly what GB2RS implied.  But this is NOT the same as
it used to be, so I think the change should have been stated more
explicitly.

The class of the license was (and is) defined by the callsign
after the 'bar de fraction' (hi) so more detail isn't needed at the
front.

So - if M1/ and M0/ really has been adopted - it was a pointless
change and M/ would have done just as well.

(I still secetly think that GB2RS got it wrong- sigh)

IMO :-)

Carl
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:49 1997
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From: "James H. Gorka" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: 27 Dec 1996 00:59:07 GMT
Organization: AA8RB
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <01bbf391$26fc5860$eb06d9cd@aa8rb>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
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Go with the Icom (get the Oldsmobile instead of the Chevy).

Jim

Victor D. Mete <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>...
> Hello everyone,
>
>       My name is Vic and I am looking for some information. Being new to HF I
> know very little ... about the whole scene. Looking at rigs however, I
have
> decided I'd like to buy either an Alinco DX-70T or an Icom IC-706.
>       Does anyone have an actual comparison of the two rigs side by side so as
> to comment on performance? How about features on HF & 6M between the two?
I
> know the DX-70T comes with CW & SSB narrow filters built in and they are
an
> option on the Icom, but how about actual performance between the two?
>       I have seen MANY mods for the IC-706 but NONE for the DX-70T. Are there
> mods available for the DX-70T?
>        I have heard the 706 sounds lousy on HF with a stock mic. A friend said
> he talked with a DX-70 owner and it sounded like the "big rigs"! Is this
> true?
>       How about this ... ya know the typical finger indent on the tuning knob?
> Well, the 706 has it and I've tried it. Very comfortable, works well. The
> DX-70 doesn't have it! How is it to tune??? I don't have anywhere to
local
> to try one. In fact in SE Florida here, don't know of a single person
with
> a DX-70. Don't see them for sale either!
>
> Which is the better HF rig? Awaiting your comments (and tips to mods)!
> --
> Victor
> [e-mail]
>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:50 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 20:10:00 -0500
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Michael P. Deignan wrote:
>
> 40% of amateurs on HF use CW for communication. That in of itself makes
> it a relevant test.
>

Why?  CW is strictly recreational.  It is shunned by MARS, not used by
the Coast Guard, and never used by we amateurs when we conduct emergency
communications.  CW has little or no non-recreational value.  I'll bet
more than 40% of HF hams drink beer.  Should this be a requirement?

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:51 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 26 Dec 1996 20:27:48 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <59v8mk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59usoj$[e-mail]>,
        William M. Pasternak <[e-mail]> wrote:

>One of the things that has become obvious in the past several years is
>that most -- though not all no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
>They are not the traditional ham with a deep rooted interest in ham
>radio.  Rather, they are communicators who want to communicate
>reliabally -- at minimum cost -- with family and a few close friends.
>
>They are not joiners.  They do not join the ARRL or any other national
>political activist ham radio group.

This is very, very true. In my state at least we find that a large
portion (if not a large majority) of codeless techs are merely people
who have upgraded from CB radio to amateur radio to escape some of
the nonsense that goes on on the CB bands.


>They do not join local clubs.
>They do not financially support repeaters.  To them, ham radio is
>nothing more than an inexpensive alternative to a cell-fone; and as
>such they have no abiding comitment to the service.

I will say one thing about codeless techs, however. I believe that they
are very prone to joining local repeater groups and amateur radio clubs
to support a local repeater that they use during their commute. I have
found, again, that most (if not all) codeless techs that I have run
into very supportive of local clubs, at least with their membership
dollars.

However, I have also found that codeless techs, along with many younger
ham counterparts in other license classes, are less devoted to the
altruistic aspects of amateur radio today that hams of yesteryear. I
believe this is, in part, due to the "family radio service"-ization
of amateur radio, with the 'dumbing down' of amateur licensing a
major cause.

Furthermore, I have to agree with your assessment that codeless hams
do not join the ARRL. Most that I have run into, with some noteable
exceptions, would rather spend their $30 on a local club with immediate,
"visible" results than a national club where all they get is, for all
intents and purposes, a magazine subscription.


>I think we are dealing with a different mindset than ever before in ham
>radio and in creating the codefree Tech, we have really created a
>separate "communicator" radio service where current hams who own
>repeaters are "service providers" providing a public utility at no cost
>to the public.

I have noticed over the past couple of years a greater tendency for
local amateurs to use HF frequencies for local groundwave communication.
Their rationale is the HF frequencies are less-monitored than local
VHF frequencies and they can talk about subjects (such as other hams
they think are jerks) without "people listening". I must admit that it
is harder to find them on 10 meter SSB than 2 meter FM, so maybe there
is some rationale to that logic.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:52 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 01:53:38 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5a0eh2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59u8gn$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-169.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail](Gerald Schmitt ) wrote:

>Be careful here. You are only allowed to critique spelling and grammar
>when the errors are made by the anti code crowd. If you criticize a pro
>coder God-Emperor Kehler will erupt from the Pacific and give you an
>insulting little name. Worst case scenario his toadies will take up the
>name and you will be truly be demeaned by being called names.

Whip. Whip. Whip. There, McPoP, you feel better ?

>I passed my code hazing and even beep on the radio from time to time.

Sure, Uh huh. Been working a little DEEEX at nite McPoP ? If you need
New Jersey for a new country, maybe Bill will make a SKED with you.

>Despite this some basic flaw in my character makes me continue to think
>fast code testing is a load of rubish that should be done away with. I
>do agree with Kehler that it won't happen here so most of my anti fast

You should never agree with me, McPoP. You will loose all your friends.

Happy Holidays,
Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:53 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 01:57:40 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <5a0eon$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]> <59krpb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59udlq$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121816 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44754

[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>>There is only ONE compelling reason to retain CW testing, Bill.  The FCC
>>says we have to do it.  Go change that, and your problems are solved.

>Complete and total failure in logic...

>The reason we HAVE CW testing is because the FCC regs require it.

Correct your are, Mr. Bill.

>The reason TO RETAIN CW TESTING is not because it is a regulation.

The reason we retain CW testing is because nobody has petitioned the FCC
to abolish the requirement.   Whine forever.  I won't write the petition for
you.

>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:54 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 01:58:00 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <5a0ep9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the

Not correct. Mabye 60% of people with ham LICENSES don't use CW, but
100% of HAMS use CW.

>majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
>datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
>keep it held back.

Nope. That's wrong too.

>Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
>us?

I am having a hard time understanding the question, Eric. Could you try and
rephrase that so it makes more sense ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:55 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 27 Dec 1996 02:46:31 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 38
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <59vda7$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

[e-mail](William M. Pasternak) wrote:
>
>One of the things that has become obvious in the past several years is
>that most -- though not all no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
>They are not the traditional ham with a deep rooted interest in ham
>radio.  Rather, they are communicators who want to communicate
>reliabally -- at minimum cost -- with family and a few close friends.

And what's wrong with that?  Where is it written that "new hams" must act,
 look, feel, smell, and taste like "old hams" in order to be "real hams?"
  Once they've earned their license, they have a right to use their
radios in any legally-permissable way that they see fit and for whatever
legally-permissable purpose they wish.

>
>They are not joiners.  They do not join the ARRL or any other national
>political activist ham radio group.

Why in the world would they want to pay money to an organization that
fought adamantly against their very existence (the creation of the no-
code license), and which continues to oppose their interests by ignoring
their wishes and attempting to hold on to the outdated, obsolete,
artificial barrier to ham radio known as Morse code?

>I think we are dealing with a different mindset than ever before in ham
>radio and in creating the codefree Tech, we have really created a
>separate "communicator" radio service where current hams who own
>repeaters are "service providers" providing a public utility at no cost
>to the public.

Again, what's wrong with this?  After all, weren't the original no-code
proposals
known as the "Communicator Class" of license?


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:56 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 27 Dec 96 02:51:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Lines: 13


M>If the ARRL expects to have a future, they better get with the program and
 >start respecting the views of younger, newer hams instead of being a
 >mouthpiece for the old, pro-code bunch.  Their core membership is
 >literally dying off, and those all-important membership dues arre dying
 >along with them.  I won't give a dime to the ARRL until they modify their
 >tough, pro-code, head-in-the-sand views.

I'm 38 and still going strong.  I won't be dead for some time yet!

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:57 1997
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:14:47 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> > Well, lets have the facts speak for themselves.  I did a search on
> > Dejanews for the "famous" thread I made which started MY part in the
> > issue on rec.radio.scanner.  This thread was called:
> >    "Bill Cheeks is an asshole"
> yeah, and it went on for quite a spell too, didn't it. I joined the
> internet about 6 monthst ago and this was an old thread by that time.

Oh well that does not surprise me.  MANY people were upset at Bill
for a long time.  So you would be correct to say that ISSUE was
old when you came on 6 months ago.  You ARE NOT CORRECT to say
the thread I started "Bill Cheeks is an asshole" was old when you
started 6 months ago because it only started in July (5 months ago)
& only lasted 3 months as indicated by Dejanews.


> Also, it was an opinion on your part and should never have been blown
> out of porportion. However, in your infinite stubborness, you saw fit to
> contest anyone who disagreed with you on this point.

Let's let the facts speak for themselves again Eric.  Looking at the 80
responses from Dejanews on that thread, my entries make up 16 of them or
%20.  That means that 64 (or %80) of the posts were from other people
posting replies.  (if you don't believe me look for yourself)  I could
hardly have been contesting everyone with only 16 out of the total 80
entries on that thread.


> > If you read in the copies of Dejanews printouts I have attached below,
> > you will find that the initial message was posted by ME on 7-21-96.
> > Then there were MANY follow-up posts after mine.  All follow-up
> Yeah and you didn't include them all, just the ones you wanted.

Then go to Dejanews & find data to prove me wrong.  (In other words,
put up or shut up)



> Why don't you grow up?

I'll bet that is a question people often ask you.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.253.208.40!insync!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:15:51 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> Not when the first line of headers all come from the same place Hohn.

Is your reader indicating they came from a server called "Hohn"?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:50:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!pith.uoregon.edu!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 19:23:10 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:
> Funny how this is an exact duplicate of 2 other postings under different
> names. Duplicate as in word for word all the way from where it says:
> Eric Oyen wrote: to the end of the message.

Yea, I think that is what David & I pointed out several hours ago, Eric.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.magicnet.net!nntp.newsfirst.com!nntp.crosslink.net!munnari.OZ.AU!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Source for license statistics
Date: 27 Dec 96 03:30:20 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Who ever made up that loooooong table of license statistics screwed up the
numbers a bit.
1. Guam, KH2, is *not* in the 2nd call area.
2. Hawaii, KH6 and KH7, is *not* in the 6th call area; it is the 13th call
area.
3. Alaska, KL7, is not in the 7th call area; I believe it's the 12th.
4. Missing were the license numbers for KH0 and some other Pacific call
areas.

Note that KH7 used to be Kure Atoll (one of the northern Hawaiian islands
[Kure is actually is part of the City and County of Honolulu]), but that
prefix was recently released to all of Hawaii. And to drive my point
further, KH7 certainly is *not* in the 7th call area (Nevada et al)!!
It is in the 13th.


Jeff KH2PZ / KH6 (the 13th call area)   (but currently /7 for a few weeks)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!128.83.139.5!cs.utexas.edu!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Ronald D. Lucier" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: MFJ QRP Rigs? - Reliability???
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 20:28:55 -0800
Organization: Optical Hybrids, Inc.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: wor-ma1-09.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; U; 16bit)

Roger Christmas wrote:
>
> I would like to know if anyone has any information on the MFJ 20 meter
> CW rig!  What I would like to know is the performance of this rig and
> it reliability and any possible problems with drift?
> Question:  I live in a small apartment with no outside antennas
> allowed so what type of antenna would be suitable with this
> MFJ 20 meter rig as well!
> Any suggestions and help would be greatly appreciated!
>
> Posted by:  Roger Christmas - VE1 CMR
> Posted for:  Jim Charlong - VE1 ALZ/QRP
>
> Send replys to VE1CMR and I will forward all info to Jim! I have one of the
MFJ CW rigs with the filter and keyer built in.  The
rig is a compromise when measured against a full size rig.  However I
have everything in a foam padded tool case - rig, tuner, keys, power
supply, dsp and antenna (dipole).

My rig does not drift a bit!   I have checked it against both a good
receiver and and a frequency counter.  Maybe I'm lucky!?!

The rig works ok for a few watts.  If I can get the antenna high enough
and if there is good propagation, dx into Europe is no problem from the
East Coast.  Have worked a few stations in the Carribbean as well.

Overall I'd give the rate the rig, on a scale from 1-10, about an 8.
Good performance, light enough to travel on a plane, easy to operate and
seems to work well.  I'd look for one at a hamfest or swap net.  The full
price is a bit too much for what you get.

73 de WA1UWZ


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 04:29:56 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <59vn1u$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp104.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <59uiah$[e-mail]>, Jim Weir <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>People who learned to drive in the '20s had to know the rules for safely
>>passing a horse in the middle of town.  People who learned to engineer in
>>the '30s had to know how to modulate an 807 with a pair of 811s.  People
>>who learned to fly in the '40s had to know how to tame a taildragger.
>>
>>People who learned to ham in the '50s had to learn code.

>>Out of all these learning processes, guess which one hangs on to the past
>>while the rest of the world passes them by?  I'm not arguing against horses
>>or tubes or tailwheels or code, but against a system that mandates testing
>>an obsolete skill.

>Does 40% of the population still use horses? Do 40% of the engineers
>still use 807s? Do 40% of the people that fly do so on an aircraft with
>a taildragger?

>40% of amateurs on HF use CW for communication. That in of itself makes
>it a relevant test.

>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.

Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
keep it held back.
Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
us?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.mathworks.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.252.180.10!upstel.net!NewsWatcher!user
From: [e-mail] (David Drong)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.sport.misc,sci.agriculture,sci.agriculture.beekeeping,sci.agriculture.poultry,sci.agriculture.ratites,soc.men
Subject: RED OAK LUMBER FOR SALE!
Date: 27 Dec 1996 05:29:49 GMT
Organization: Upsala Cooperative Telephone
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <ddrong-2708561442020001@204.252.180.125>
NNTP-Posting-Host: annex-1-25.upstel.net
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121792 rec.sport.misc:19617 sci.agriculture:17437 sci.agriculture.beekeeping:6507 sci.agriculture.poultry:1912 sci.agriculture.ratites:635 soc.men:284448

For sale Red Oak lumber for any project.  All width sizes available.
Boards are 1▓1/16x varied lengths.  Two years seasoned.Boards were cut
with a sawmill band saw. Located in central minnesota. For your
conveince,we can ship UPS to many locations in the united states. Great
for cribbage boards,chairs,futons,tables,or any small or large woodworking
projects. To order,e-mail to:  [e-mail] or call
320-632-8301.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:07 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Buddy Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 06:30:08 GMT
Organization: Mikrotec Internet Services, Inc. (MISNet)
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59jlen$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: loukyts130.mis.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99d/16.182

On 23 Dec 1996 01:57:57 GMT, [e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>on both.
>
>Considering that I'm both an active CB'ER and a HAM OPERATOR, I would say
>that I am right at home on both, no?
>
>

10-4
73 de KC4WQ
Buddy

Visit the BARS web site http://members.iglou.com/gregl



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:08 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 00:24:56 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121806 rec.radio.scanner:74129

John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
>
> Oh well that does not surprise me.  MANY people were upset at Bill
> for a long time.  So you would be correct to say that ISSUE was
> old when you came on 6 months ago.  You ARE NOT CORRECT to say
> the thread I started "Bill Cheeks is an asshole" was old when you
> started 6 months ago because it only started in July (5 months ago)
> & only lasted 3 months as indicated by Dejanews.

Doesn't surprise me that a lot of people were upset at you (and your
forgeries).
Give it a rest, john. Your words carry little weight anymore.

> Let's let the facts speak for themselves again Eric.  Looking at the 80
> responses from Dejanews on that thread, my entries make up 16 of them or
> %20.  That means that 64 (or %80) of the posts were from other people
> posting replies.  (if you don't believe me look for yourself)  I could
> hardly have been contesting everyone with only 16 out of the total 80
> entries on that thread.
There you go, using the "facts" word again without a proper
foundation....

> Then go to Dejanews & find data to prove me wrong.  (In other words,
> put up or shut up)
I already have, by detailing the number of forged posts that you have
done (and you are known to do this (today was a good example of that).

>
> > Why don't you grow up?
>
> I'll bet that is a question people often ask you.
Actually, you are the first one (and so far, the only one).

Again, John, give it a rest. Your stubbornness will get you into more
hot water before this is over.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!203.108.7.42!OzEmail!OzEmail-In!news
From: chris ayres <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: help ft8000r
Date: 27 Dec 1996 07:54:22 GMT
Organization: OzEmail Ltd - Australia
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <59vvbe$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.108.4.139
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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To: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121802 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45143

The FT-8000R can certainly receive AM on the VHF Aircraft band, and the
receive quality is quite good as well.

Chris VK2YUS



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!news.mel.connect.com.au!news.melbpc.org.au!news
From: [e-mail] (Tony Molina)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Harmonic interference?
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 07:57:27 GMT
Organization: Aus-Tech Consulting
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: dingo71.melbpc.org.au
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.339
X-No-Archive: yes

Following on from my recent discovery of the source of my digital satellite
reception problem (interference from local cable tv "gateway box").

Does anybody have any experience with this sort of thing? Could harmonics caus
e
interference at either 1150Mhz or 4000Mhz? A scan by a good spectrum analyser
did not pick up anything unusual at either frequency though.

I believe the purpose of these large "gateway boxes" (spaced approx 1 for ever
y
1500 houses) is to feed the fibre optic signal into the main coaxial cable,
which then feeds into each individual house.

I don't know about these things but can harmonics at these frequencies be
generated by this "conversion" process (FO -> Coax) or would the power supply
of
the unit be more likely the cause?

Of course, I'm particularly interested to hear of possible remedies to stop
whatever is coming out of these boxes from reaching my dish (about 100 metres
away). If the cable tv company let me I'd go up there myself and line the insi
de
of the box with aluminium foil or lead sheeting. Don't think that is likely.

Any suggestions?


Cheers

= Tony =

 ,-._|\   Melbourne, AUSTRALIA
/  Oz  \  Internet: [e-mail]
\_,--.x/
      v


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:13 1997
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From: Ken Koller <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 00:32:17 -0800
Organization: Advanced Network Solutions
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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DAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTTTTTT!

Get this stuff out of here. Grow the Fuck up people, egad, if you're this
immature as adults, I'm glad that I wasn't around you as kids.


Ken Koller

  *************************************************************************
  *   Fire/Rescue/EMS Photography                                         *
  *   http://www.islandnet.com/~waynej/Ken_Koller/fireline.html           *
  *   [e-mail]                                                *
  *                                                                       *
  *         "They were breaking outside, sudden rise in the tide,         *
  *               Then out of the northern sky comes a sled,              *
  *                It lands on a swell, guess who's inside?               *
  *            St Nick and his elves, wetsuits off the shelves            *
  *      It's the one day of year they get the waves to themselves."      *
  *                               -- The Raddudes  "Christmas in Malibu"  *
  *************************************************************************




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.58.0.35!news.structured.net!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 27 Dec 1996 10:19:06 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a07qq$[e-mail]>
References: <59jlen$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p8nl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

David A. Cooley ([e-mail]) wrote:

: If the Amateurs keep up making themselves look bad by insulting everyone
: that doesn't have their level of skill, then I'll be damned if I'll have
: any part of the Ham bands either.

A sage comment, Dave.  The same applies to those that insult others that
either have skills they cannot gain, or do not feel are "necessary". The
first example that comes to mind are those that call those who support
code testing "beepers", and other such insults.

Hams need cohesiveness in their ranks - not hotheads dividing the group
into "us" and "them" segments.

Bill


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:15 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 27 Dec 1996 06:55:38 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <5a0dfq$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>40% of amateurs on HF use CW for communication. That in of itself makes
>>it a relevant test.

>Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
>majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
>datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
>keep it held back.

Your first sentence was fine. Everything after it is supposition on your
part.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.idt.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code or no code??????                [e-mail]
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 07:28:16 -0500
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf14f$52c3e1a0$1ca84dcf@133mhz> <59rr0h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59vq8o$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >Again, I'm not at all sure what experience you have, other than one
> >afternoon at a friend's, and some time in the CB hobby, to go making the
> >broad statements you've made.
>
> >--
> >Roger J. Buffington
> >W6VZV
>
> >USC Law, Class of '97
>
> Come on, Roger. Lighten UP.  'I heard a 706 with a stock mic one time and it
> sounded OK to me'.
>
> 73, Jim KH2D
> Lorton Reform School, Class of '64

Well, it DID sound pretty good to me.  How many of these danged mics do
I have to listen to in order to form an opinion on 'em?  I mean, do they
have different personalities or something?  Quality control in ICOM is
better than that, one suspects.

Or maybe not...  Perhaps I was out of line after all.

Anyhow, I did think it was pretty funny; this guy basing a key policy
decision (code v. no-code) on one unlicensed afternoon at a friends
house. (Didn't even have his own radio, I guess)  Well, like my daddy
said, if you live long enough you get to see almost everything...

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!208.202.14.37!news.icanect.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Ben Blavat)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Wanted: TM-V7A Mod
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 13:57:07 GMT
Organization: Great Think Inc.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf2eb$c25fdf80$0a66f0c6@general>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Ben Blavat)
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45162 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22470 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121823

Likely you'll be the one posting the MOD, as your one of  the few who have
one! <grin>
Why don't you post a reveiw of your new rig, I know everyone is interested!
Good luck with the new iron.
73's from
Benjamin Blavat, [e-mail]
webphone, PGPhone


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 27 Dec 1996 16:06:55 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>No... the AUTISTIC Hams - a group incapable of learning code.
might be OK except for their learning disability.<

If they're disabled, they would then be protected under the ADA and the VE
examiners would have to make accomodations for their disability.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!38.8.16.2!psinntp!psinntp!linux.liant.com!usenet
From: Robert Barron <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 10:19:53 -0600
Organization: Liant Software
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: barron.liant.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)

William M. Pasternak wrote:
> One of the things that has become obvious in the past several years is
> that most -- though not all no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
> They are not the traditional ham with a deep rooted interest in ham
> radio.  Rather, they are communicators who want to communicate
> reliabally -- at minimum cost -- with family and a few close friends.

I think some people may get a little bent out of shape by the use of the
word "most".  It's rather difficult to prove and gut feelings on what
the
real percentage is can vary widely from city to city.

One thing that I think has been determined with some certainty is that
no-code Tech's are less likely to join the ARRL.  Some local clubs may
have
similar data on their membership.  I don't think that this is merely a
reflection of the no-code license but also a reflection of the general
public today.  Younger people especially are less likely to join
"organizations".  I wish I could remember the sources but I have read
a number of articles about this.  It's not just Amateur Radio that is
affected by this.

I wish I had a solution to this problem.

> They are not joiners.  They do not join the ARRL or any other national
> political activist ham radio group.  They do not join local clubs.
> They do not financially support repeaters.  To them, ham radio is
> nothing more than an inexpensive alternative to a cell-fone; and as
> such they have no abiding comitment to the service.

Another respondant to your post asked what was wrong with Hams who only
use the Service for a cheap cell phone and to chat with a small, closed
circle of friends.  I don't think  that meets very many of the stated
reasons for being in Amateur Radio and that's a pretty good argument
against
it.  But I'm not willing to give up on all those people (no-code Tech or
not
because I've seen "higher" class licensees do the same thing) just yet.

73,

Robert KA5WSS
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!compuserve.com!news.production.compuserve.com!news
From: Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: 27 Dec 1996 16:35:27 GMT
Organization: CompuServe, Inc. (1-800-689-0736)
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44769 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121832

 >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...

Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any facet
of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com!not-for-mail
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 10:51:05 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Happy Holidays
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]>
X-Article-Creation-Date: Fri Dec 27 16:48:30 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 155.226.32.7 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.0 (compatible; MSIE 3.0; SK; Windows 95)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 12

 [e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:

>.... the outdated, obsolete, artificial barrier to ham radio
> known as Morse code?

Since Valentines Day of 1991, Morse code is no longer
required to obtain an Amateur Radio license.  It is no
longer a "barrier".

Next subject?
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!bloom-beacon.mit.edu!senator-bedfellow.mit.edu!TURNTABLE.MIT.EDU!theodric
From: [e-mail] (Theodric Young)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: V-LINK?
Date: 27 Dec 1996 16:55:11 GMT
Organization: WMBR-Cambridge, 88.1 FM at MIT
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5a0v1f$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: turntable.mit.edu


I know this isn't amateur radio, but I thought someone here might know.

Does anyone know what those "V-Link" phones use to communicate?  Is it
analog or digital?  Inband or Outofband signalling?  What frequencies?

I'm talking about those things marketed at teenage girls for gabbing
with each other.  They appear to be glorified walkie-talkies but they
are addressable (you can call a specific person if you know their
code number or a group of people).

Thanks.

-Ted Young
WMBR 88.1 FM
N1VUL



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.idt.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!in1.nntp.cais.net!moon.why.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Colin Sledge)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Any DOS programs to connect to FT-50R?
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 16:55:24 GMT
Organization: The Why Network
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.160.168.163
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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I've got an HP 200LX Palmtop and an FT-50R and I'm looking for
something similar to the ADMS software that will run on DOS instead of
Windows.  I'm getting tired of lagging my laptop around when I only
need it for the ADMS software.

Please respond via e-mail also.

TIA


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:24 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!feeder.chicago.cic.net!ftpbox.mot.com!mothost.mot.com!lmpsbbs.comm.mot.com!bs351.comm.mot.com!user
From: [e-mail] (Victor Palacios)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HElp need manual
Date: 27 Dec 1996 17:03:17 GMT
Organization: Motorola Inc. LMPS
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bs351.comm.mot.com

Hi every one.
WE have a SHINWA Tsushinki Co. LTD
model SR001
Wideband scanning receiver  25-999 MHz range
 It was picked up in Japan and tha manual is in Japanese.
Is anyone familiar with this receiver? better yet does anyone know tha
phone # of this company or a reseller or ANY contact so we can get a
manual in a language WE can understand.
If you have one can we talk? we seem to have a wierd problem with the
radio after we were playing with the remote. the receiver seems to be
looked up now.
HELP!!

Vic Palacios

--
the opinions expresed are solely mine and not my employer.

Victor Palacios
Motorola Inc.
Land Mobile Products Sector
good stuff maynard :-)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!butch!wargrave!lweissma
From: [e-mail] (Larry AD3Y)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 27 Dec 1996 17:10:17 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 23
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a0vtp$[e-mail]>
References: <57f4ff$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wargrave.motown.lmco.com

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) said:

>Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
>majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
>datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
>keep it held back.

How to you come to the conclusion that the 60% of hams that don't use CW
are using high speed data modes? Most of them use SSB or FM. Some even
use, heaven forbid, SSTV.
I don't think you have been in this hobby long enough to realize the extent
of CW on the HF bands. There is a sun spot peak coming up in a few years.
When this happens, even 10m will be wall to wall CW from 28.0 - 28.1 Mhz.
You will hear CW stations from all over the world filling up the bands,
which is one of the reasons that the ITU still requires code!


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Larry Weissman AD3Y      |  All opinions expressed are my own and
Lockheed Martin Corp.    |  in no way related to my company. All my
Moorestown, NJ   USA     |  designs are my companies and in no way
[e-mail] |  considered my own.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 27 Dec 1996 17:10:33 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 21
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a0vu9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

>
> [e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:
>
>>.... the outdated, obsolete, artificial barrier to ham radio
>> known as Morse code?
>
>Since Valentines Day of 1991, Morse code is no longer
>required to obtain an Amateur Radio license.  It is no
>longer a "barrier".

That's only half the story, Hans, and you know it.  Morse code is still a
required testing element for 80% of the classes of amateur radio license
and is also required for any amateur operation below 30Mhz.

This in spite of the fact that Morse code is outdated and no longer
relavant as a required testing element for the purposes of obtaining an
amateur radio license.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Robert Moldenhauer)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: 27 Dec 1996 17:17:48 GMT
Organization: Sheltering Sky Publications
Lines: 15
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a10bs$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

Yes, our local ham group is more than half Technicians...

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
>
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:
>
>>Funny, but I don't see no-coders joining any organizations.
>
>Perhaps your organizations have nothing to offer them.  They join and
>participate and contribute to ours just fine, thankyouverymuch.
>--
>Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Robert Moldenhauer)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: THE FINAL WORD
Date: 27 Dec 1996 17:34:32 GMT
Organization: Sheltering Sky Publications
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <5a11b8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

Actually pro-coders are dinosaurs that still support big government
regulation of a hobby.

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
>
>
>W>Looks like you No-Coders Better start Studying if you want to get
on
>HF
>
>Won't happen, it takes effort to study.  That doesn't happen in
today's
>"something for nothing mentality."
>
>---
>   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
>
>--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Robert Moldenhauer)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 27 Dec 1996 17:42:55 GMT
Organization: Sheltering Sky Publications
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5a11qv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <59v0rg$[e-mail]>,
>Does 40% of the population still use horses? Do 40% of the engineers
>still use 807s? Do 40% of the people that fly do so on an aircraft
with
>a taildragger?

Go ahead and use it, nobody I know is talking about eliminating it as
a communications mode, the problem is that the 40% (or whatever) who
want to use it also want to force the 60% who don't to know it.

There are many more interesting communications modes that can be done
on HF than CW...
>
>40% of amateurs on HF use CW for communication. That in of itself
makes
>it a relevant test.
>
>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 147.360 machine in Manhattan
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 09:46:24 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nyc-ny5-06.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Dec 27  8:45:22 AM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E-NC250  (Win16; U)

Does anyone here know what has been happening to the 7.360 machine in
Manhattan? for the past month or so, it's been getting a lot of
Intentional qrm from a guy we have unofically dubbed "Netkiller", but I
wouldn't think that such activity would cause a repeatear to die, would
it? Anyhow, any info on this matter would be greatly appreciated.
                                73's,
                                   Dave/ KB2ZYO
                     Oh, no...you did NOT fire that green @#$! at Me!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!informer.alliance.net!news
From: "><>  N8LDY  <><" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HF-WHY WAIT ?
Date: 27 Dec 1996 17:51:04 GMT
Organization: Alliance Network, Inc. (GRR MI) (616-774-3010)
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <01bbf41e$3539d780$20e96ec6@chuckster>
NNTP-Posting-Host: gr16.ppp.alliance.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Why wait years for HF privileges? you could be talking with your
friends and working DX in 6 weeks!....like many of your fellow hams.
I often have contacts with people who are under 12 years old and
one dude just got his General at the age of 92. Sure,you could wait
and avoid the task of learning the code and get what others worked for.
Yes,in time the code requirement will end *years* of wating for this
will pay off but how many choice contacts will this waiting game
cost you? Will you be proud that you waited till the bitter end to
get your way? and how crowded will the bands be?  I am not
going into the debate of the codes value in todays world as others
have done that very well. The choice has always been in YOUR hands,
6 weeks or 2 to 3 years. Refusing to bow to the CW requirement does
have merit and it will bring victory but are crowded unpoliced bands
worth it in the end?

GREAT LAKES AWARD MANAGER
MICHIGAN AMATEUR RADIO ALLIANCE
CHARLES "CHUCK" LEMAR  -=N8LDY=-
WAS DXCC WAC GLA SM


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: Michael Aust <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Yaesu FT8000R Info
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 09:52:42 -0800
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 4
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max4-vgd-ca-44.earthlink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; U)

Got an FT8000R , need mod to extend tx,
heard it will tx on 220Mhz

mike


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:32 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham Radio License Proposal #1
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 18:04:48 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <5a1355$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) shared these priceless
pearls of wisdom:

->How about  It's an International requirement.  The ITU requires a
->proficiency with morse code, granted 5wpm would probably satify the
->requirement, but still  it's one reason..in fact, it's the main reason

I'm not going to just pass by this comment any more, since you seem to
believe it.  That is NOT true.  Not, repeat NOT true.  If you read the
WHOLE document, you will find that ANY nation can exempt themselves from
this requirement if they choose.


->Amateur radio is strictly a recreational hobby..so what's the point
->you're trying to make??

The point is that any requirement for access to a portion of the spectrum
MUST by LAW bear a nexus -- a tie -- to the use of that spectrum.  If it
does not, it is subject to the arbitrary, whimsical, and capricious
argument in the courts.

Speaking of which, can anybody cite a reference, state or federal, where
the CW requirement of the amateur portion of CFR was tested and upheld??


->Again, the rational in realtime is that morse code is required by the
->ITU.

No, this is not realtime, this is legend-time.  It,,,just,,,ain't,,,true...

  Besides, most of what you mention above is usually carried on the
->VHF+ bands (NOCODE TECH).  And they do a wonderful job, but they are
->mainly appliance operators and therefore do not fit into the New World
->Order of the ARS as per WA6VSE.

I wouldn't talk about appliance operators in the General, Advanced, and
Extra bands if I were me.

Jim



Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:35 1997
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 11:43:30 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Eric Oyen wrote:

> Doesn't surprise me that a lot of people were upset at you (and your
> forgeries).

You just never give up do you.  Now you're trying to say that all
those posts were angry statements against me.  How foolish you are.

If you look at a sampling of those messages, you will see that only
a handful were disagreeing with me.


> Give it a rest, john. Your words carry little weight anymore.

hahaha, you are one to talk.  Face it Eric you raised your flag &
no one saluted except for Dick Kendrick, that's pretty dismal.


> There you go, using the "facts" word again without a proper
> foundation....

Again, you are one to talk since you refuse to look at facts.


> I already have, by detailing the number of forged posts that you have
> done

Really, so then give the detail on this.  (You can't because there is
none)


> Again, John, give it a rest. Your stubbornness will get you into more
> hot water before this is over.

hahahahahaahhahaha, that is like a flea looking at an elephant with
rape on his mind.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:36 1997
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From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 11:45:00 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Ken Koller wrote:

> DAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTTTTTT!
> Get this stuff out of here. Grow the Fuck up people, egad, if you're this
> immature as adults, I'm glad that I wasn't around you as kids.


Shut up


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:37 1997
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From: [e-mail](Dale Harper)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Lentini -NY sales tax collection
Date: 27 Dec 1996 20:52:08 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <5a1cto$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbf1f6$ac51a020$310f2399@peter-s> <[e-mail]>
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In <[e-mail]> KD1YV <[e-mail]> writes:

>
>{snip}
>
>So you are all saying that you prefer to violate the laws of the state
where you
>live.  Most states have consumption taxes that apply to goods
purchased, no matter
>what state the vendor resides. You're also saying that honest folks
should pay more
>taxes so that you can cheat on yours.
>
>--
>73 de Jim, KD1YV
>http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimkd1yv/hamily.html

I think the point here is selective taxation. There are many, many
people who do not get taxed for what ever reason when they buy out of
state in NY. Shouldn't it be everyone or no one?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:38 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Harmonic interference?
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 15:00:53 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Tony Molina wrote:
>
> Following on from my recent discovery of the source of my digital satellite
> reception problem (interference from local cable tv "gateway box").
>
> Does anybody have any experience with this sort of thing? Could harmonics ca
use
> interference at either 1150Mhz or 4000Mhz? A scan by a good spectrum analyse
r
> did not pick up anything unusual at either frequency though.
>
> I believe the purpose of these large "gateway boxes" (spaced approx 1 for ev
ery
> 1500 houses) is to feed the fibre optic signal into the main coaxial cable,
> which then feeds into each individual house.
>
> I don't know about these things but can harmonics at these frequencies be
> generated by this "conversion" process (FO -> Coax) or would the power suppl
y of
> the unit be more likely the cause?
>
> Of course, I'm particularly interested to hear of possible remedies to stop
> whatever is coming out of these boxes from reaching my dish (about 100 metre
s
> away). If the cable tv company let me I'd go up there myself and line the in
side
> of the box with aluminium foil or lead sheeting. Don't think that is likely.
>
> Any suggestions?
>
> Cheers
>
> = Tony =
Yes,
the cable company is responsible for that equipment. that is sup[posed
to be a shielded system. If you are getting interference, notify them of
it a.s.a.p. If they fail to correct the problem, them make an issue of
it with the local FCC office.
I, too, have had similar problems with the local cable company (cox
communications) and they failed to remedy the problem. It wasn't until I
called the FCC and then notified the cable company of my intent to
pursue this with the FCC that they did anything about it. Also, it helps
to have the cable t.v. tech there looking at your system.

Eric.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:39 1997
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From: Eric Oyen <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 15:07:07 -0700
Organization: Telesoft
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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John Mackey---KA0SSF wrote:
>
>
> You just never give up do you.  Now you're trying to say that all
> those posts were angry statements against me.  How foolish you are.
>
> If you look at a sampling of those messages, you will see that only
> a handful were disagreeing with me.
>
> hahaha, you are one to talk.  Face it Eric you raised your flag &
> no one saluted except for Dick Kendrick, that's pretty dismal.
>
> Again, you are one to talk since you refuse to look at facts.
>
> Really, so then give the detail on this.  (You can't because there is
> none)
>
> hahahahahaahhahaha, that is like a flea looking at an elephant with
> rape on his mind.
John,
I have come to the conclusion that arguing with you is a lot like
shoveling manuer. It leaves me with a bad smell and an even worse
disposition. So, I am going to ignore you. You are not worth an ulcer.
Besides, I have better things to do with my time. I have a life, which
is more than I can say for you.

As my parting shot: Why don't you use the "REAL" facts, instead of what
you want others to see (and tell your followers te same thing, john).

This discussion is now closed.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:40 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Yin Lung Shih)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 27 Dec 1996 22:33:49 GMT
Organization: Caltech Alumni Association
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <5a1isd$[e-mail]>
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In article <59vnph$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:
>[e-mail] (Jim M.) wrote:
>> And I am reminded of the VietNam war POW's who
>> communicated with each other through cell walls by tapping our Morse code.
>Next time I am a POW I will remember that. But seriously I see the
>point. Still not a good reason to force CW on me and the others who
>don't need or want it.

I may be wrong, but I understood that the POW tap code was *not* morse.
It was much simpler, but still effective - 1 to 5 taps in pairs to
form a number [1,2,3,4,5] + [1,2,3,4,5].  Thus 1,1 was A, whereas 5,5
was Z.  This gives 25 pairs, so I think Q was missing or J was doubled
with I.  Numbers might have been spelled out or tapped from 1 to 10.

Trying to use morse would have required training everyone to a minimum
level as well as a way to form two symbols, dit and dah, using tones or
intervals, since duration was not available.  This was not always
feasible.  Also, while you could get pretty fast with any system given
practice, I doubt that POW's in general were worried much about their
QSO rate.

Yin Shih, N9YS


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:41 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Svetozar Iliev)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info-Hams Digest V96 #1577
Date: 27 Dec 96 22:34:08 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 3
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NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

unsubscibe
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:42 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Svetozar Iliev)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info-Hams Digest V96 #1576
Date: 27 Dec 96 22:34:10 GMT
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From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:43 1997
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From: Jim Conn <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 14:36:22 -0800
Organization: GTE Intelligent Network Services, GTE INS
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Gary Coffman wrote:
>
> In article <58fu4s$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:
> >Just because you have to pass the CW requirement, does not mean that you
> >have to use it.
>
> Now there's a telling point. If you were actually required to use
> Morse, there might be some relevance to a Morse exam.
>
> Gary
>

Now there's a telling point. If you were actually required to build
equipment, there might be some relevance to a theory exam. CW, like
theory, is there if you know it, and choose to use it. Some hams may opt
to purchase reliable, tested, commercial equipment instead of building,
just as some hams may opt to use SSB or PACTOR instead of using CW.

Jim



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:44 1997
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From: Rob Lilley <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 18:53:48 -0500
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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On 27 Dec 1996, Yin Lung Shih wrote:

> In article <59vnph$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote
:
> >[e-mail] (Jim M.) wrote:
> >> And I am reminded of the VietNam war POW's who
> >> communicated with each other through cell walls by tapping our Morse code
.
> >Next time I am a POW I will remember that. But seriously I see the
> >point. Still not a good reason to force CW on me and the others who
> >don't need or want it.
>
> I may be wrong, but I understood that the POW tap code was *not* morse.
> It was much simpler, but still effective - 1 to 5 taps in pairs to
> form a number [1,2,3,4,5] + [1,2,3,4,5].  Thus 1,1 was A, whereas 5,5
> was Z.  This gives 25 pairs, so I think Q was missing or J was doubled
> with I.  Numbers might have been spelled out or tapped from 1 to 10.
>
> Trying to use morse would have required training everyone to a minimum
> level as well as a way to form two symbols, dit and dah, using tones or
> intervals, since duration was not available.  This was not always
> feasible.  Also, while you could get pretty fast with any system given
> practice, I doubt that POW's in general were worried much about their
> QSO rate.
>
> Yin Shih, N9YS
>
>
This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
well under conditions adverse to complex systems.  Those who *master*
radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.

Rob lilley


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:45 1997
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From: Ron Hardin <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 19:11:14 -0500
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59rkol$[e-mail]> <59vb96$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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> > Trying to use morse would have required training everyone to a minimum
> > level as well as a way to form two symbols, dit and dah, using tones or
> > intervals, since duration was not available.  This was not always
> > feasible.  Also, while you could get pretty fast with any system given
> > practice, I doubt that POW's in general were worried much about their
> > QSO rate.

It's not POWs exactly, but in study halls a pencil held to make a slight click
on the table on both make and break is quite effective for communication betwe
en
two young hams.  And is there any more pleasant thing to listen to than a keye
d
relay mounted on a large chassis.

--
Ron Hardin
[e-mail]

On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:46 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 28 Dec 1996 00:25:54 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
writes:

>Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct?

Correct.  But the beepers seem to feel that it's more important that 40%
do use it.

And besides, whether one chooses to use it or not is irrlelavant.  The
issue here is whether CW continues to have the neccessary merit to
continue it's current status as being legally-required knowledge for
obtaining a government-issued radio license.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:47 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 28 Dec 1996 00:26:14 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59vo0k$[e-mail]>
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In article <59vo0k$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:

>>>Manaiac Quit whinning and learn Cw
>
>>I'm sorry...I don't take advice from beepers who can't spell correctly.
>
>Said the lonely Good Buddy to the Flea.......
>
>

Said the lonely beeper, taking a short break from his 1930s vintage brass
key.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Date: 28 Dec 1996 00:26:21 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59vqdd$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <59vqdd$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:

>Maniac, is your daddy's name Lenny by any chance ?
>
>

(ignoring irrelavant comments from beepers that don't address the issue)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-feed.inet.tele.dk!sn.no!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!default
From: [e-mail] (Barry Rose)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FCC issues Forfeiture Notice for $6000
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 96 01:41:05 GMT
Organization: GoodNet
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <5a1u2e$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts5-12.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2

The entire notice is on the home page of the ARA

www.goodnet.com/indirect/www/ara


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:49 1997
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From: Madjid <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: CW Interface
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 21:27:42 -0500
Organization: ORION Microsystems
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dynamicppp-107.hip.cam.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121902 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20899 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45248 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22502 rec.radio.shortwave:91294

Richard M. Corrigan wrote:
>
> I recently heard of a cable that attaches from you Reciever to
> the serial port of a computer which allows CW to be translated
> by your Computer for display on your monitor.  Is this true?
> I thought that a TNC was needed.  If it is true does anyone
> have the pin outs to build such a cable or maybe a source that
> I could contact to obtain one.

Yes it can be done with just one op-amp and a PCB
the size of the RS232 connector. Get Hamcomm (see below)
there is a schematics inside for simple and more complex
interfaces.

http://oak.oakland.edu:8080/pub/hamradio/arrl/bbs/programs/hamcom31.exe

There is also on the Web someone selling some cheap interfaces for
Hamcomm (never tested one but must be a one op-amp solution too)
  http://www.cris.com/~n9zle/hc.html

-------------------
Madjid, VE2GMI - Home Page: http://www.CAM.ORG/~mboukri
NEC4WIN Antenna simulation for Windows


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!tezcat!gail.ripco.com!news.tds.net!news
From: Gary <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Survey - Club Repeaters
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 18:34:46 -0800
Organization: TDS Telecom - Madison, WI
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nlmn1-a13.midstate.tds.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

Our club is looking for some insight as to how other clubs approach
their repeater and its maintenance and development.

1.      Does your club involve its members in the maintenance and development
        of your machine as a club activity or do you have a commercial radio service

        perform the maintenance?

2.      Is your repeater accessible to members of your club or is it at
        a shared site with limited access?

3.      Does your club encourage members to be involved in repeater activities
        or are these activities left to the seasoned pros, commercial or club members
?

Thanks in advance for your response.

73's,  Gary, W0AB


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!hammer.uoregon.edu!pith.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 28 Dec 1996 02:36:43 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <5a213r$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Stan Aughenbaugh ([e-mail]) wrote:
: >
: > Judging from the responses in this newsgroup, I would say this comprises
: > the largest group of all.

: No... the AUTISTIC Hams - a group incapable of learning code.
: might be OK except for their learning disability.

Look autism up in a medical dictionary. You will find it is a
preoccupation with fantasy as a mechanism to escape reality.

Sounds like those that claim they cannot learn the code. The ability
is there - the desire isn't. So it is rationalized away as some sort
of learning disability.

By the way, if a person REALLY has a disability that keeps them from
being able to learn the code - then the code requirement can be waived.

Bill


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:52 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 02:42:20 GMT
Lines: 31
Sender: [e-mail]

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:
[snip]
: I do think that since these people (no code techs) are limited to VHF,
: their interest in our hobby will be lower, simply because there is less
: to do on VHF.  Unless you are really into hi tech stuff, VHF is limited
: in its usage compared to HF.  Not to minimize its value: VHF is great.
: But only HF offers long range communications at modest cost.

Well, there's a heck of a lot more going on at VHF+ today than there was
back in the 60s, when I got into hamming.  We often had a 6/2 meter setup at
Field Day, but back then it was pretty much CW and AM; no repeaters, no
packet.

Judging from what goes on at the local club, you'd think that repeaters and
VHF packet were the only modes permitted.  It's no wonder that new hams who
enter at the no-code Technician level get bored and drop out of the hobby.
So, I've been talking to some of the more technically-oriented members about
stirring some interest in weak-signal work.  We are also trying to get more
members of all license classes interested in contesting, in general, and I'd
like to see us get a couple of yagis or quads for 6/2 up in the air so we
could participate in one of the VHF contests.

I'm working on getting a member of WSWSS to speak at our monthly meeting,
and hope that will generate some interest.

If you don't believe that DXing at VHF+ is interesting, look at the results
of one of the ARRL VHF contests; in particular, noting the number of
Advanced, Extra and OT callsigns among the participants.

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:54 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Yin Lung Shih)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 28 Dec 1996 02:46:26 GMT
Organization: Caltech Alumni Association
Lines: 72
Message-ID: <5a21m2$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: alumnae.caltech.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121891 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44811 rec.radio.shortwave:91282

In article <[e-mail]>,
Rob Lilley  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
>effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
>well under conditions adverse to complex systems.

Well a bit obscure, but not really so irrelevant to the topic.  The
contention was that morse had a practical use in very recent history.
This point was accepted by both sides without any argument.  It was
my belief that point was not completely accurate.

Rather, what might have been used was an even simpler system which
has several important properties:

1) It can be reconstructed by anyone having seen the basic idea once;

2) It requires no training to use the first time;

3) It places even less demands on the fidelity of the communication
channel than morse (i.e. duration is not part of the coding scheme);

4) The communication channel can be aural, physical, electrical, or
any other medium which can be put in a binary state;

5) It has a lower data rate than morse, but not enough to matter
for limited use.

So this tap code is "a form of effective communications using
rudimentary equipment which will perform well under conditions
adverse to complex systems" also.  Further it requires no training,
unlike morse.  So, if everyone in the US were given this tidbit of
information as part of first aid classes, or any other related
activity training, then on that unlikely day when someone is stuck
on a sinking boat with the mike having been swallowed by sharks,
they can rip off the cover of the radio with their bare hands and
use a fishhook to key the PTT using this "emergency" tap code.

> Those who *master*
>radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.
>
>Rob lilley

Those who *master* radio communications should know how to use the
right mode with the right equipment in the right circumstances or
know how to synthesize a working combination.  There is nothing
special or unique about morse code.  It is one code among many and
CW is one mode among many.  We do a disservice when we elevate morse
code and CW above other radio communications knowledge and emphasize
code testing versus theory testing.  We are telling would-be hams,
the wrong thing about what's important in radio communications.

In my view, radio communications is about transferring information
promptly, reliably, and accurately, between two or more desired
points that are not connected by wire with effective and efficient
use of available resources.  While ham radio communications is about
having fun and being innovative and resourceful while doing radio
communications.  Code and CW have a prominent place in this scheme,
just not the premier one.  You can't be innovative and resourceful
if *all* you know is 50wpm code, but you can be if you know *some*
radio electronics.

When I hear or read someone worrying about the no-code techs or
no-code hams to be, that someone also often decries the theory tests
as jokes and appears to be counting on the code test as the last
line of defense against the "unwashed hordes".  This pushes them
into unreasonable, extravagant, and sometimes indefensible statements
about the benefits of morse and CW.  (At least one reason for these
unending debates.)  Why leave the theory test in purgatory?  Let's
get serious about making them better.


Yin Shih, N9YS


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:55 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 02:55:09 GMT
Lines: 39
Sender: [e-mail]

William M. Pasternak ([e-mail]) wrote:

: One of the things that has become obvious in the past several years is
: that most -- though not all no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
: They are not the traditional ham with a deep rooted interest in ham
: radio.  Rather, they are communicators who want to communicate
: reliabally -- at minimum cost -- with family and a few close friends.

: They are not joiners.  They do not join the ARRL or any other national
: political activist ham radio group.  They do not join local clubs.
: They do not financially support repeaters.  To them, ham radio is
: nothing more than an inexpensive alternative to a cell-fone; and as
: such they have no abiding comitment to the service.

There's an excellent 220/440 linked repeater system here in the Inland
Empire that's a living testimonial to the above.  I stopped monitoring
it a few months ago, because there is a handful of hams who are on there
*constantly* at various times of the day.  They hold lengthy conversations
on the repeater, and it's obvious that they are communicating from
fixed-station to fixed-station.  You'd think that they never heard of
simplex, much less a telephone.  Of course, they'd have to *pay* if they
used the telephone.  After the fifteenth time I heard one person on one
weekend, I set the scanner to bypass that frequency.

Annual dues are coming up the first of the year, and I'm letting the
repeater owner know why he won't be getting mine.

: I think we are dealing with a different mindset than ever before in ham
: radio and in creating the codefree Tech, we have really created a
: separate "communicator" radio service where current hams who own
: repeaters are "service providers" providing a public utility at no cost
: to the public.

: Any thoughts???

Good points; I'm sure you'll hear from several repeater owners on this
issue.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:56 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 03:23:49 GMT
Lines: 33
Sender: [e-mail]

Robert Barron ([e-mail]) wrote:

: One thing that I think has been determined with some certainty is that
: no-code Tech's are less likely to join the ARRL.  Some local clubs may
: have
: similar data on their membership.  I don't think that this is merely a
: reflection of the no-code license but also a reflection of the general
: public today.  Younger people especially are less likely to join
: "organizations".  I wish I could remember the sources but I have read
: a number of articles about this.  It's not just Amateur Radio that is
: affected by this.

I would have been inclined to agree with you re: ARRL membership, then I
decided to run the stats on our local club.  I have access to this data
and Treasurer and maintainer of the membership database.  Here are the
results:

Out of 185 club members, 96 are ARRL members.

14 are Extras
17 are Advanced
14 are Generals
14 are Tech+
 8 have no license, and, are you ready for this?

29 are no-code Techs!

While we are an ARRL Special Service Club, I wouldn't say that we pushed
ARRL membership excessively.

Interesting!  You learn something new every day, I suppose.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 28 Dec 1996 03:49:35 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <5a0eon$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:

>Subject:       Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
>From:  [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
>Date:  Fri, 27 Dec 1996 01:57:40 GMT
>
>[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:
>
>>>There is only ONE compelling reason to retain CW testing, Bill.  The
FCC
>>>says we have to do it.  Go change that, and your problems are solved.
>
>>Complete and total failure in logic...
>
>>The reason we HAVE CW testing is because the FCC regs require it.
>
>Correct your are, Mr. Bill.
>
>>The reason TO RETAIN CW TESTING is not because it is a regulation.
>
>The reason we retain CW testing is because nobody has petitioned the FCC
>to abolish the requirement.   Whine forever.  I won't write the petition
for
>you.
>
>>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
If me, a 60 year old Grandma, can learn code anybody can so stop the
whining you wimps!!


>------------------- Headers --------------------
>Path:
>newsbf05.news.aol.com!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!cliffs.r
s.itd.umich.edu!howland.erols.net!news3.cac.psu.edu!news.math.psu.edu!feede
r.chicago.cic.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!ne
ws
>From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
>Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
>Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
>Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 01:57:40 GMT
>Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
>Lines: 23
>Message-ID: <5a0eon$[e-mail]>
>References: <59eheq$[e-mail]>
><[e-mail]>
><59ibcn$[e-mail]> <59jlov$[e-mail]>
><59krpb$[e-mail]>
><[e-mail]>
><59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]>
><59udlq$[e-mail]>
>Reply-To: [e-mail]
>NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-169.kuentos.guam.net
>X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
>Xref: newsbf05.news.aol.com rec.radio.amateur.misc:68216
>rec.radio.amateur.policy:24521
>
>




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Survey - Club Repeaters
Date: 27 Dec 1996 22:58:24 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <5a25t0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Gary  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>1. Does your club involve its members in the maintenance and development
>   of your machine as a club activity or do you have a commercial radio
>   service perform the maintenance?

We have an RF engineer who works for a local defense contractor who is
the head (and sole member) of our technical committee.


>2.     Is your repeater accessible to members of your club or is it at
>       a shared site with limited access?

Private site with limited access. Limited access is not a function of
the club, but a function of the site.


>3.     Does your club encourage members to be involved in repeater activities
>       or are these activities left to the seasoned pros, commercial or club
>       members?

Repeater activities are open to members and non-members alike.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Thomas P. Branch)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 04:16:43 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <5a26vi$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a213r$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-37kba2d.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 28 Dec 1996 04:16:50 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) wrote:
>By the way, if a person REALLY has a disability that keeps them from
>being able to learn the code - then the code requirement can be waived.

True to a point--1B and 1C can be waived but the applicant must pass
1A.

73 de Tom, K4NR
CAVEC VE



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:51:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!newsspool.doit.wisc.edu!news.doit.wisc.edu!news
From: [e-mail] (Jason Hanson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 05:13:07 GMT
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Madison
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: f183-189.net.wisc.edu
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

[e-mail] (Arden Eby) wrote:


>What??  He explained why it occurred, "Cutbacks have us down to a
>skeleton crew."  You want low taxes.....well you got 'em!  If you want
>someone to blame, look in a mirror.  It's John Q. Public who would
>sell his soul for a $25 a month more in lower taxes.  Well surprise!
>You get what you pay for.

Well said!

Jason


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 27 Dec 1996 22:53:03 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <5a2cjv$[e-mail]>
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John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Ken Koller wrote:
>
>> DAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTTTTTT!
>> Get this stuff out of here. Grow the Fuck up people, egad, if you're this
>> immature as adults, I'm glad that I wasn't around you as kids.


>Shut up

Geesh, John you'll flame anybody for even posting. But then you still
don't get it. Maybe this will help.

What has transpired over the last eight months or so has been an object
lesson aimed specifically at you John, in the duality of reality that is
usenet. The duality I'm speaking of is very similar to the yin/yang of
Taoism, hence my parallel usage in this forum. Several well meaning
people have tried to explain all this to you in their own words. But
yet, you have still failed to make the requisite leap of realization
and understand what has transpired. Perhaps you need a more lucid
and basic explaination.

Usenet is simultaneously reality and non-reality. It is real because
real people are exchanging real communication every minute of every
hour of every day. It is non-real because ultimately this is all just
a bunch of electrons racing through copper and fiber and silicon, only
to end up splashing upon the insides of our monitors. The randomized
patterns of those splashes are just so many patterns of colored dots.
Only the person viewing those splashes can assign any meaning to the
myriad of displayed patterns.

You, and you alone, have attributed meaning to those dots and subsequently
reacted to those dots. You have been told that those dots are just another
non-reality and not to get worked up about what you read. Others have
told you that I'm endlessly baiting you and pushing your buttons. Both
are true. Everything that has passed, is just a transient pleasure or an
annoyance depending on your point of view or phase of the moon. The tag
line I've been using, "Do not adjust your mind, there is a fault in
reality," follows the same precept and is consistent with the duality
of usenet and Taoism.

I must say though, John, you've reacted quite admirably. Sometimes watching
your excursions through the digital non-reality have been quite amusing.
Posting miles of obscenities, sending people email bombs disguised as large
movie files, even posting dreary tantrums and then claiming said messages
were forgeries. One of my colleagues described the image of a chihuahua
foaming at the mouth contaminating the keyboard when shown your rantings.
Yes, John I've been pushing your buttons knowing you'd behave in exactly
the manner you've done. You have let yourself get worked up over nothing.
But, your ego and immaturity wouldn't let you blow it off.

Face it John, you've been Fooled by a Unique Combination of Keenly Elucidated
Dissertations in the usage of non-reality. And, you never even got kissed
first.

Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:02 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 DEC 96 00:53:21 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1d.delphi.com
X-To: KC5WCP <[e-mail]>

The best reason for keeping the CW requirement is because it is so amusing to
listen to the whiners.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:03 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:03:22 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <5a2gt4$[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp29.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
>writes:

>>Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct?

>Correct.  But the beepers seem to feel that it's more important that 40%
>do use it.

>And besides, whether one chooses to use it or not is irrlelavant.  The
>issue here is whether CW continues to have the neccessary merit to
>continue it's current status as being legally-required knowledge for
>obtaining a government-issued radio license.

Well if we actually honor the treaty we should have a requirement. BUT
the U.S. has a long history of ignoring international treaties. We
ignore treaties that have more important ramifications that the ITU.
So why won't we ignore this one?






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:04:15 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <5a2guq$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp29.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>The best reason for keeping the CW requirement is because it is so amusing to
>listen to the whiners.

HF is for sissies. try DXing on Two.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:05 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:09:27 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <5a2h8i$[e-mail]>
References: <57f4ff$[e-mail]> <5a0vtp$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp29.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Larry AD3Y) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) said:

>>Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
>>majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
>>datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
>>keep it held back.

>How to you come to the conclusion that the 60% of hams that don't use CW
>are using high speed data modes? Most of them use SSB or FM. Some even
>use, heaven forbid, SSTV.
I never said that 60% USE datamodes, but understand that the datamodes
are more efficient. read the post again.
>I don't think you have been in this hobby long enough to realize the extent
>of CW on the HF bands. There is a sun spot peak coming up in a few years.
>When this happens, even 10m will be wall to wall CW from 28.0 - 28.1 Mhz.
>You will hear CW stations from all over the world filling up the bands,
>which is one of the reasons that the ITU still requires code!

And wall to wall Voice, data, SSTV, RTTY, Packet, etc etc etc. Problem
is, if high speed datamodes were available, contacts could be more
reliable and more efficient than CW. That would be a real use of
bandwidth.
>------------------------------------------------------------------------

Eric



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:06 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:22:32 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <5a2i14$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59rkol$[e-mail]> <59vb96$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Rob Lilley <[e-mail]> wrote:



>On 27 Dec 1996, Yin Lung Shih wrote:

>> In article <59vnph$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrot
e:
>> >[e-mail] (Jim M.) wrote:
>> >> And I am reminded of the VietNam war POW's who
>> >> communicated with each other through cell walls by tapping our Morse cod
e.
>> >Next time I am a POW I will remember that. But seriously I see the
>> >point. Still not a good reason to force CW on me and the others who
>> >don't need or want it.
>>
>> I may be wrong, but I understood that the POW tap code was *not* morse.
>> It was much simpler, but still effective - 1 to 5 taps in pairs to
>> form a number [1,2,3,4,5] + [1,2,3,4,5].  Thus 1,1 was A, whereas 5,5
>> was Z.  This gives 25 pairs, so I think Q was missing or J was doubled
>> with I.  Numbers might have been spelled out or tapped from 1 to 10.
>>
>> Trying to use morse would have required training everyone to a minimum
>> level as well as a way to form two symbols, dit and dah, using tones or
>> intervals, since duration was not available.  This was not always
>> feasible.  Also, while you could get pretty fast with any system given
>> practice, I doubt that POW's in general were worried much about their
>> QSO rate.
>>
>> Yin Shih, N9YS
>>
>>
>This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
>effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
>well under conditions adverse to complex systems.  Those who *master*
>radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.

>Rob lilley
I also may be wrong but it is my understanding that the morse
requirement for a General Radio Telephone license is no longer there.
These are people fixing and designing communications equiptment who no
longer use it.
Hell we are only communicating with the darn radio.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:07 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:26:35 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 78
Message-ID: <5a2i8n$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a21m2$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Yin Lung Shih) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>Rob Lilley  <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
>>effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
>>well under conditions adverse to complex systems.

>Well a bit obscure, but not really so irrelevant to the topic.  The
>contention was that morse had a practical use in very recent history.
>This point was accepted by both sides without any argument.  It was
>my belief that point was not completely accurate.

>Rather, what might have been used was an even simpler system which
>has several important properties:

>1) It can be reconstructed by anyone having seen the basic idea once;

>2) It requires no training to use the first time;

>3) It places even less demands on the fidelity of the communication
>channel than morse (i.e. duration is not part of the coding scheme);

>4) The communication channel can be aural, physical, electrical, or
>any other medium which can be put in a binary state;

>5) It has a lower data rate than morse, but not enough to matter
>for limited use.

>So this tap code is "a form of effective communications using
>rudimentary equipment which will perform well under conditions
>adverse to complex systems" also.  Further it requires no training,
>unlike morse.  So, if everyone in the US were given this tidbit of
>information as part of first aid classes, or any other related
>activity training, then on that unlikely day when someone is stuck
>on a sinking boat with the mike having been swallowed by sharks,
>they can rip off the cover of the radio with their bare hands and
>use a fishhook to key the PTT using this "emergency" tap code.

>> Those who *master*
>>radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.
>>
>>Rob lilley

>Those who *master* radio communications should know how to use the
>right mode with the right equipment in the right circumstances or
>know how to synthesize a working combination.  There is nothing
>special or unique about morse code.  It is one code among many and
>CW is one mode among many.  We do a disservice when we elevate morse
>code and CW above other radio communications knowledge and emphasize
>code testing versus theory testing.  We are telling would-be hams,
>the wrong thing about what's important in radio communications.

>In my view, radio communications is about transferring information
>promptly, reliably, and accurately, between two or more desired
>points that are not connected by wire with effective and efficient
>use of available resources.  While ham radio communications is about
>having fun and being innovative and resourceful while doing radio
>communications.  Code and CW have a prominent place in this scheme,
>just not the premier one.  You can't be innovative and resourceful
>if *all* you know is 50wpm code, but you can be if you know *some*
>radio electronics.

>When I hear or read someone worrying about the no-code techs or
>no-code hams to be, that someone also often decries the theory tests
>as jokes and appears to be counting on the code test as the last
>line of defense against the "unwashed hordes".  This pushes them
>into unreasonable, extravagant, and sometimes indefensible statements
>about the benefits of morse and CW.  (At least one reason for these
>unending debates.)  Why leave the theory test in purgatory?  Let's
>get serious about making them better.


>Yin Shih, N9YS


Well said OM.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:08 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 28 Dec 1996 06:27:37 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5a2ekp$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a213r$[e-mail]> <5a26vi$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Thomas P. Branch ([e-mail]) wrote:
: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) wrote:
: >By the way, if a person REALLY has a disability that keeps them from
: >being able to learn the code - then the code requirement can be waived.

: True to a point--1B and 1C can be waived but the applicant must pass
: 1A.

Thanks for the clarification, Tom. I do recall that, now that you mention it.
It appears that the government feels there is adequate proof that anyone who
is capable of answering the written test will be able to get to 5 wpm. I
agree with them. Simply memorizing the code gets you close.

Bill


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:09 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:32:04 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5a2ij0$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp29.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44817 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121898

Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]> wrote:

> >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...

>Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
>twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
>crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
>The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any facet
>of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.

Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
code. WRONG!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:10 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:35:11 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a2ior$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp29.datasync.com
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[e-mail] wrote:

> [e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:

>>.... the outdated, obsolete, artificial barrier to ham radio
>> known as Morse code?

>Since Valentines Day of 1991, Morse code is no longer
>required to obtain an Amateur Radio license.  It is no
>longer a "barrier".

>Next subject?
>-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Next subject is: When do we get HF w/o code requirement?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:12 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:45:18 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <5a2fgu$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan18.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>In article <5a0eon$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
>Kehler) writes:

>>Subject:      Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
>>From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
>>Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 01:57:40 GMT
>>
>>[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:
>>
>>>>There is only ONE compelling reason to retain CW testing, Bill.  The
>FCC
>>>>says we have to do it.  Go change that, and your problems are solved.
>>
>>>Complete and total failure in logic...
>>
>>>The reason we HAVE CW testing is because the FCC regs require it.
>>
>>Correct your are, Mr. Bill.
>>
>>>The reason TO RETAIN CW TESTING is not because it is a regulation.
>>
>>The reason we retain CW testing is because nobody has petitioned the FCC
>>to abolish the requirement.   Whine forever.  I won't write the petition
>>for you.

I don't recall anyone asking you (JK) to petition anyone.  You can
label my (the no-code test advocate's) arguments whining or
anything else you like.  It doesn't change anthing, it
won't make us go away and it won't stop the change
at a time in the future.  I (we) will file when I (we) think
appropriate.  Until then, this is the rec....policy newsgroup
and we'll use it as such to voice our position.

>If me, a 60 year old Grandma, can learn code anybody can so stop the
>whining you wimps!!

Thanks Grandma for your thoughtful reply...but if you check my
call in the FCC database you'll see I too have been there
and done that so your asking me to stop whining is certainly
misdirected.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:13 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 28 Dec 1996 06:45:55 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5a2fn3$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <587ro1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <588etg$[e-mail]> <58fu4s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121912 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44825

Jim Conn ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Gary Coffman wrote:
: >
: > In article <58fu4s$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Nelson) write
s:
: > >Just because you have to pass the CW requirement, does not mean that you
: > >have to use it.
: >
: > Now there's a telling point. If you were actually required to use
: > Morse, there might be some relevance to a Morse exam.
: >
: > Gary
: >

: Now there's a telling point. If you were actually required to build
: equipment, there might be some relevance to a theory exam. CW, like
: theory, is there if you know it, and choose to use it. Some hams may opt
: to purchase reliable, tested, commercial equipment instead of building,
: just as some hams may opt to use SSB or PACTOR instead of using CW.

Exactly, a point I cannot seem to get through to the no-code adherents.
These days, BOTH requirements are artifical. But, they are what set Ham
radio apart from CB and GMRS.

Bill


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:14 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: HF-WHY WAIT ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:46:21 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <5a2jdo$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf41e$3539d780$20e96ec6@chuckster>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp29.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"><>  N8LDY  <><" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Why wait years for HF privileges? you could be talking with your
>friends and working DX in 6 weeks!....like many of your fellow hams.
>I often have contacts with people who are under 12 years old and
>one dude just got his General at the age of 92. Sure,you could wait
>and avoid the task of learning the code and get what others worked for.
>Yes,in time the code requirement will end *years* of wating for this
>will pay off but how many choice contacts will this waiting game
>cost you? Will you be proud that you waited till the bitter end to
>get your way? and how crowded will the bands be?  I am not
>going into the debate of the codes value in todays world as others
>have done that very well. The choice has always been in YOUR hands,
>6 weeks or 2 to 3 years. Refusing to bow to the CW requirement does
>have merit and it will bring victory but are crowded unpoliced bands
>worth it in the end?

>GREAT LAKES AWARD MANAGER
>MICHIGAN AMATEUR RADIO ALLIANCE
>CHARLES "CHUCK" LEMAR  -=N8LDY=-
>WAS DXCC WAC GLA SM

A pretty picture you paint of gloom and doom. Unfortunately that will
only happen if the Pro-coders throw up their hands and give up on the
hobby because they may believe the same way that you do. why not start
now and make plans for dealing with the crowded bands. Why not make
the written test a real test so that the unwashed masses will be les
likely to CB around all of HF.
You see the choice is really in your hands and if you throw them up in
disgust when you and those like you loose the debate and resort to I
told you so tactics the you will have no one to blame on the band
conditions. If you choose to be pro-active and embrace the change and
the good people that will come with it, then perhaps we can prevent
what happened to CB.
Let us all join together and plan for the obvious future.
Let us also encourage the proliferation of highspeed data modes to
replace CW in emergencies. After all aren't we out to save lives and
property in such cases? Or are we out to prove how good a keyer we
are?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-stock.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-11.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:51:31 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <5a2fsi$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59rkol$[e-mail]> <59vb96$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan18.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121910 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44823 rec.radio.shortwave:91314

Rob Lilley <[e-mail]> wrote:

>This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
>effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
>well under conditions adverse to complex systems.  Those who *master*
>radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.

WHY?

What is it that makes the person who knows Morse a better
radio communicator than someone who doesn't?

What VALUE does it provide to those that know it versus those that
don't...as measured in terms that are quantifiable or necessary
in order to be an effective radio communicator?

Having a working knowledge means what?  1 wpm, 10, 13, 20???

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Howard <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FILTER
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 02:02:12 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59r69r$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: col-as5s37.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----------55802A7F3F2E0"
X-Sender: Howard <[e-mail]> (Unverified)
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b1 (Win95; I)
X-Priority: Normal


------------55802A7F3F2E0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

But that includes riff-raff.  So the previous statement stands, doesn't
it?

Howard.

------------55802A7F3F2E0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

<HTML><BODY>

<DT>But that includes riff-raff.  So the previous statement stands,
doesn't it?</DT>

<DT> </DT>

<DT>Howard. </DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
------------55802A7F3F2E0--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.mathworks.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!chaos.crhc.uiuc.edu!news2.acs.oakland.edu!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: Bram Diepenbrock <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.sport.misc,sci.agriculture,sci.agriculture.beekeeping,sci.agriculture.poultry,sci.agriculture.ratites,soc.men
Subject: Re: RED OAK LUMBER FOR SALE!
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 23:48:27 -0800
Organization: Appraisal Bureau
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <ddrong-2708561442020001@204.252.180.125>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 61004d0005sk.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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To: David Drong <[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121895 rec.sport.misc:19622 sci.agriculture:17458 sci.agriculture.beekeeping:6510 sci.agriculture.poultry:1918 sci.agriculture.ratites:637 soc.men:284784

David Drong wrote:
>
> For sale Red Oak lumber for any project.  All width sizes available.
> Boards are 1▓1/16x varied lengths.  Two years seasoned.Boards were cut
> with a sawmill band saw. Located in central minnesota. For your
> conveince,we can ship UPS to many locations in the united states. Great
> for cribbage boards,chairs,futons,tables,or any small or large woodworking
> projects. To order,e-mail to:  [e-mail] or call
> 320-632-8301.

WRONG NEWSGROUP, BUDDY...!!!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: "David Little" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Icom IC 2ia  Mods?
Date: 28 Dec 1996 08:37:48 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <01bbf49a$06ec21e0$63deaec7@node2>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd19-099.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45245 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121899


I have an Icom IC2ia HT that I would like to find out if
anyone knows how to activate MARS/CAP Xmit
operation.  I know that the unit tunes these frequencies,
and also that if I hold the function button while pressing
the PTT, the unit transmits; somewhere.  The only problem
is that sequence is also used to vary the output power,
so each transmission is at a different power out; if it is
actually transmitting......Clear as Mud, huh....Does
anyone know if this actually works or a more
"sanitary" way of doing so??

Tnx and 73

David  KD4NUE



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!news-relay.us.dell.com!natinst.com!HOPPER.acm.ORG!ACM.ORG!MULLIGAN
From: [e-mail] (F. Barry Mulligan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.cb,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: PL Codes??
Date: 28 Dec 1996 08:43:27 GMT
Organization: ACM Network Services
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <5a2mjf$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pascal.acm.org
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22572 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122175 rec.radio.cb:40228 rec.radio.scanner:74504

    The following list will be included in the Jan '97 release of the FAF.
Any comments or corrections would be greatly appreciated. (The FAF lists
specific U.S. frequencies and channels in various bands of interest to
scanner listeners.)


From the  FAF - Frequently Asked Frequencies
      on  ftp://oak.oakland.edu
      as  /pub/hamradio/docs/misc/scanner.faf


CTCSS (PL) Frequencies

    Freq    Designator     Freq    Designator     Freq    Designator
    (Hz)     EIA  Ham      (Hz)     EIA  Ham      (Hz)     EIA  Ham

     67.0    L1   01       110.9    2Z   15       179.9    6B   29
     71.9    L2   02       114.8    2A   16       186.2    7Z   30
     74.4    WA   03       118.8    2B   17       192.8    7A   31
     77.0    L3   04       123.0    3Z   18       203.5    M1   32
     79.7    SP   05       127.3    3A   19       206.5    8Z
     82.5    L4   06       131.8    3B   20       210.7    M2   33
     85.4    YA   07       136.5    4Z   21       218.1    M3   34
     88.5    L4A  08       141.3    4A   22       225.7    M4   35
     91.5    ZZ   09       146.2    4B   23       229.1    9Z
     94.8    L5   10       151.4    5Z   24       233.6    M5   36
     97.4    ZB   11       156.7    5A   25       241.8    M6   37
    100.0    1Z   12       162.2    5B   26       250.3    M7   38
    103.5    1A   13       167.9    6Z   27       254.1    OZ
    107.2    1B   14       173.8    6A   28

        Motorola differs from EIA with:  XZ (L1), XA (L2), XB (L3),
    YZ (L4), YB (L4A), ZA (L5). ICOMM does not use 97.4 and uses one
    less than the amateur numbers above that (i.e. ICOM #25 = 162.2).


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.58.0.35!news.structured.net!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 28 Dec 1996 09:00:11 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5a2nir$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44815 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121897

KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]> wrote:

: > >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...

: >Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
: >twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
: >crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
: >The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any facet
: >of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.

: Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
: because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
: code. WRONG!

Sorry, but you are reading more into it than is there.  The pro-code
crowd are only saying that you need to learn code at a minimum level.
You can operate SSB on 10 meters with a tech+ license. And 5 wpm should
take less effort than memorizing the answers to the questions on the
Novice and Tech exams. When you have the code memorized, you are already
close to 5 wpm. That is less than one character every two seconds.

Bill



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-hk.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!news.glink.net.hk!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 09:57:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020
Lines: 34


>>...no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
>>They are not the traditional ham...
>>They are not joiners.
>>They do not join the ARRL or any other national activist group.
>>They do not join local clubs.
>>They do not financially support repeaters.
>>To them, ham radio is ... an inexpensive alternative to a cell-fone
>>...they have no abiding comitment to the service.

Wow...I (along with Jim KF6CR) live in repeater-rich Southern
California. I must be scanning the wrong frequencies and have severe
personality disorders: I hold a measley Technician License - but I seem
to have "broken" all those above assertions.

I immediately joined three local Amateur Clubs when I got my license. I
joined the ARRL. I teach classes in Emergency Traffic Handling both for
Amateurs and GMRS licensees. I run an Official Bulletin Station of the
ARRL - a landline BBS. The Club that Jim is affiliated with - Citrus
Belt Amateur Radio Club - is doing marvelous work for the benefit of the
entire State of California. I am involved in a 2 Meter Repeater that
handles over 5,000 public assist/highway emergency calls annually.

Now I know we don't want this thread to get into "personal" exceptions
to what was stated anout Technicians...but the frequencies I regularly
monitor on 2 Meters, 220, and 440 simply aren't what were described in
the original post. Sure, there are abusers of this privilege. But
pervasive and abhorrent? Not in my sphere of influence.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-hk.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!news.glink.net.hk!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 09:59:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <5a213r$[e-mail]> <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <1996122423230
Lines: 14


>>Look autism up in a medical dictionary. You will find it is a
>>preoccupation with fantasy as a mechanism to escape reality.

Please do not insult victims/families affected by autism by making it
appear as if it is a affliction of choice, Bill, in any argument here.

I don't think that's what you meant....


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 10:20:44 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <5a40k5$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2ior$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-126.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Next subject is: When do we get HF w/o code requirement?

Maybe never.  Time's a wasting.  Better learn the code now. But didn't
you say 2 meters is better than HF ? What do want HF for ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:24 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeeds.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!grizzly.denali.net!news.ak.net!not-for-mail
From: Tiresias <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Harmonic interference?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 02:19:12 -0900
Organization: very loose
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: [e-mail]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Lines: 24

Tony Molina wrote:
> whatever is coming out of these boxes from reaching my dish (about 100 metre
s
> away). If the cable tv company let me I'd go up there myself and line the in
side
> of the box with aluminium foil or lead sheeting. Don't think that is likely.
>
> Any suggestions?

An amateur here in KL7 land had a similar problem some years ago, though
I don't think any fiber optics were involved.  Despite being a highly
qualified engineer for a local telco, he didn't get too far with the
cable folks in terms of sympathy or help, UNTIL...

he pointed out that he did (legally) operate a TWO-WAY radio station,
and if signals leaked out and caused him interference, then his LEGAL
signals could certainly leak IN as well.  I think they really started
listening when he said something about 4Kw into 24 stacked 22 element
Yagis yielding something like 20Kw ERP at their nearby leaky line amp.
He wasn't advocating deliberate interference or anything, but line amps
are expensive... he would hate to see any get smoked.

I guess my point is there should be equal motivation from the cable
company to fix any leaks to protect their system too.

73, Ken WB7SFO/KL7



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:25 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!grizzly.denali.net!news.ak.net!not-for-mail
From: Tiresias <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: FT-50R Mods
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 02:21:21 -0900
Organization: very loose
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <Pine.SUN.3.95.961221141339.10943A-100000@nyx> <[e-mail]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 6

Jon27787 wrote:
>
> Yaesu's home page has a link to all the mods
Best site I've found is http://members.gnn.com/hca/ft50/index.htm

73, Ken WB7SFO/KL7



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 12:18:22 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <5a47gp$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ij1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-21.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45006 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122311

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Like a freind of mine says, I will probably learn code and be a beeper
>one day when it is no longer required.

Uh huh. Where have we heard that line before ?

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-24.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 12:20:05 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <5a47k0$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <5a3ieh$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45008 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122312

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Why is it that some people automatically ASSume that every tech
>memorized the question pool and seems incapable of having studied the
>theory and data needed to pass?

Because we know that most extras memorized the question pool. Why
should techs be any different ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 12:23:05 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd50-235.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

One of the reasons why code is still should, in my opinion, be kept is
that it is a learning tool for beginning amateurs.  Many of the longer
time amateur got their basic training in cw.  cw allows you to make
your early mistakes one-on-one rather than on a voice repeater for
everyone to listen to.
Larry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:28 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 07:57:10 -0500
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Jim Lowman wrote:
>
>
> If you don't believe that DXing at VHF+ is interesting, look at the results
> of one of the ARRL VHF contests; in particular, noting the number of
> Advanced, Extra and OT callsigns among the participants.
>
> 73 de Jim - KF6CR

I know it's interesting to some.  It just isn't interesting to me.  And
I suspect that some people feel the way I do (and some don't.)

To me (unlike some other people) the facination with ham radio is
communicating over longer distances than say, a local telephone call.
This is not all there is to ham radio.  It is, however, one of the
things that tends to attract newcomers.  I have seen many potential
newcomer hams turn off to the hobby and seek alternatives when they
learn that in order to do this on HF (the best way to communicate over
these distances) they must learn Morse Code.  They don't see the point,
and there are other hobbies that don't require this.  (Like the
internet).

Someone elsewhere on this newsgroup called me a whiner.  Well, I'm
whining about the coming demise of our hobby, from the
non-replentishment of our numbers.  Personally, I've got my Extra
ticket, and I suppose things will hang together for the 40 or so more
years I've got left.  Or maybe not.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:30 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 08:03:32 -0500
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Clint Bradford wrote:
>

> Now I know we don't want this thread to get into "personal" exceptions
> to what was stated anout Technicians...but the frequencies I regularly
> monitor on 2 Meters, 220, and 440 simply aren't what were described in
> the original post. Sure, there are abusers of this privilege. But
> pervasive and abhorrent? Not in my sphere of influence.

Mine either.  The old canard that Technician hams conduct themselves
like CBers is so much malarky.  Some of the worst operating I've heard
is by general class and above hams.  The absolute worst, of course, is
by unlicensed individuals.

Frankly, I think there are some who make up stories about how bad the
VHF operating procedures are to bolster the argument that we need CW as
a "filter" to keep bad types off of HF.  The facts contradict this
thesis.  The vast majority of ops on VHF, at least in Southern
California, are excellent ops, who behave as traditional hams, i.e.
courteous, good operating procedures, etc.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:32 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 08:13:18 -0500
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Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
back in the late 60s.

The CW requirement tends, I think, to keep it that way.  Busy working
people probably lack the time to master 13 WPM CW, and have other hobby
alternatives, such as the internet, that do not require them to do so.
Although working people see the relevance of a theory and procedure
exam, (and are willing to take the time out of their busy schedules to
prepare for and pass them) they tend to view the code test as a
non-productive use of their time (which it is).  Therefore, in great
numbers they pass ham radio by, or at best become no-code Techs.

Now, I've got nothing against retirees; I hope to be one myself one day,
and lots of these guys are my buddies.  But surely none of us think that
it is a good thing for our hobby that our hobby has systematically
excluded non-retirees.

By the way, if you disagree with what I've written, then ask yourself
WHY is it that HF is so overwhelmingly dominated, even on weekends, by
retirees?  I think you may come back to my theory.

As an interesting corellary to the above, the recent ARRL survey on
keeping the CW requirement also contained a systematic bias in favor of
retirees.  1) probably retirees with lots of time on their hands are the
ones with the leisure time to discover, and respond to, such a poll; 2)
the ARRL is to a very large extent comprised of retirees. (No, I don't
have figures, but I'll bet I'm right.)

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:32 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 13:43:09 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <5a4cfp$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <5a3jn1$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>I wonder how many lives were lost because of the CW requirement?

That's an interesting question, Eric.  I wonder how we could figure out
how many people died trying to learn CW ?  Or were you referring to those who
died of a broken heart because they couldn't learn CW ?

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:33 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack ..
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 13:43:24 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
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Message-ID: <5a4cg7$[e-mail]>
References: <5a413u$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Nick Feliccia) wrote:

>Can you believe the sales droid at radio shack tried to sell a stero to
>mono adaptor for the optimus headphones I bought. He said they wouldn't
>work with mono ham gear otherwise. I told him I would come back tomorrow
>and let him say I told you so if it didn't work. Needless to say , I slept
>in. Anyone else have good stories.

Yes, Deja Vu Archives do.  We beat Radio Shack to death about 3 months ago,
so there should be enuff there to keep you busy for a week.

>Respond to Email as well as post .
>Nick
>N3FKS

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:34 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 13:43:28 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <5a4cgb$[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Chip) wrote:

>In article <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Ben) wrote:

>> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
>> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
>> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
>> pruning!
>>
>> Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>>
>> Ben


>   Ben,

>      A even better product, though it is hard to obtain is a spray bottle
>of Turbo Prop Wash.

>  Avionics techs use it religously.  Knocks down SWR's  etc.

>Its only available a airports.

We only have one airport here, and I couldn't find that stuff.  Do you know of
any airports over there I could call and order some ?

Thanks,
Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:35 1997
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From: "Bob Dye" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: aus.radio.amateur.digital,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.packet,in.ham-radio,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space,sci.geo.oceanography,sci.geo.satel
Subject: GPS / Radio Equipment for sale
Date: 28 Dec 1996 13:55:01 GMT
Organization: kc4hdk
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <01bbf4c6$b5c35540$7214e3c7@robert-j.-dye>
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Well here is the list.  Most of this equipment was hardly ever used.  I am
getting out of many parts of ham radio concentrating on my UHF repeater and
links to it.  I will pay for shipping.  Can do COD or check in advice.
Please pass on this message to others that may be interested.  If you are
on packet please post it on the local BBS.  Trying to generate revenue.
Thank you for your time.  People have asked if I was a smoker.  No I nor
anybody
in my home smokes.  The TS-690SAT is stock out of the factory with no extra
filters.  If interested will discuss other offers.  Need cash.  I have
references to others
that I have sold via e-mail/UPS and they were very happy.




Magellan Meridian GPS in good condition with Data Cable
$150!!

MFJ   VERSA TUNER V  GOOD
$250


KENWOOD         TS690                   EXCELLENT, WITH INTERNAL ANT TUNER
$1,200


AEA                    DSP-232               NEW IN BOX
$343


YAESU                G-5400B               EXCELLENT, WITH SEPARATOR KIT,
200'CABLE      $456



Bob
[e-mail]
561.552.3114 Voice Mail





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:36 1997
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From: Rob Lilley <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 10:26:24 -0500
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On Sat, 28 Dec 1996, Bill Sohl wrote:

> Rob Lilley <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
> >effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
> >well under conditions adverse to complex systems.  Those who *master*
> >radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.
>
> WHY?
>
> What is it that makes the person who knows Morse a better
> radio communicator than someone who doesn't?

An individual can be a poor communicator no matter what extent his or her
knowledge base is.  Morse will not make a individual a 'better'
communicator, just a more versatile one.

> What VALUE does it provide to those that know it versus those that
> don't...as measured in terms that are quantifiable or necessary
> in order to be an effective radio communicator?

Those who know CW have the option to use it and demonstate discipline
and commitment to the service by learning it.

> Having a working knowledge means what?  1 wpm, 10, 13, 20???

Your second phrase suggests a progression.  Working knowledge
has a different meaning to a novice than it does an expert.

> Bill Sohl  K2UNK
> ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

Rob Lilley


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:37 1997
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:26:24 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:32:04 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>
>Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
>because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
>code. WRONG!
>

Who would that "select few" be? The licensing authorities "demand" the
CW requirement. This is demanded to comply with an international
treaty. That's more than a few!

There are many "pro-coders" who can see the need for a no-code HF
ticket. The big question is should the entire HF spectrum be opened up
to the no-code licensees? A second question is if the entire HF
spectrum is opened to no-code licensees, what happens to the band
plans?

A no-code HF ticket that allows use of the entire spectrum would
require that the present licensing system be discarded to accomodate
the no-code extras. All of a sudden we'll just have one license class
for amateur radio and it won't be entry-level. There are many who
favor some form of HF no-code ticket but without greatly disrupting
the current class structure and band plan.

Even so it is not up to us to make the HF code requirement decision.
If the no-code proponents would band together in some sort of
organization and make a serious effort to lobby the ARRL, the IARU and
the licensing authorities world-wide, no-code HF access could be a
certainty. All the usenet chatter is just that, usenet chatter, the
"select few" don't copy it.

73 de n4jvp
Fritz

To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:38 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:27:22 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5a3huj$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:

>One of the reasons why code is still should, in my opinion, be kept is
>that it is a learning tool for beginning amateurs.  Many of the longer
>time amateur got their basic training in cw.  cw allows you to make
>your early mistakes one-on-one rather than on a voice repeater for
>everyone to listen to.
>Larry

I appreciate the learning aspect and don't deny the code's merit as a
form of communication. But if you make a mistake with code while OTA
people would hear it same as on a repeater or simplex.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:40 1997
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From: Dave Maley <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 09:29:01 -0600
Organization: Internet Navigator, Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Bill Nelson wrote:
>
> KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:
> : Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> : > >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...
>
> : >Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
> : >twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
> : >crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
> : >The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any facet
> : >of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.
>
> : Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
> : because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
> : code. WRONG!
>
> Sorry, but you are reading more into it than is there.  The pro-code
> crowd are only saying that you need to learn code at a minimum level.
> You can operate SSB on 10 meters with a tech+ license. And 5 wpm should
> take less effort than memorizing the answers to the questions on the
> Novice and Tech exams. When you have the code memorized, you are already
> close to 5 wpm. That is less than one character every two seconds.
>
> Bill

Isn't there a song by this title<smile>?
No, really.  Code isn't that bad.  I used to teach it in the classroom.
Always fun to watch kids as they start to 'get it' the first time.
If you are finding it dificult, you're not alone.  Don't try to
learn it alone.  A job best done in a classroom.  And HAVE FUN!
Dave.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:42 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:32:31 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
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[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>Rob Lilley <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
>>effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
>>well under conditions adverse to complex systems.  Those who *master*
>>radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.

>WHY?

>What is it that makes the person who knows Morse a better
>radio communicator than someone who doesn't?

>What VALUE does it provide to those that know it versus those that
>don't...as measured in terms that are quantifiable or necessary
>in order to be an effective radio communicator?

>Having a working knowledge means what?  1 wpm, 10, 13, 20???

>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

Well to use the logic stated I would be a better communicator than
someone who only knows code. I am proficient in packet, rtty(even
though I don't send), SSTV, etc.
I guess that makes me more of a REAL HAM than some of the beepers.

Eric :)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:43 1997
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From: [e-mail](Gerald Schmitt )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Icom IC 2ia  Mods?
Date: 28 Dec 1996 15:33:29 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <5a3ek9$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf49a$06ec21e0$63deaec7@node2>
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In <01bbf49a$06ec21e0$63deaec7@node2> "David Little"
<[e-mail]> writes:
>
Yes there is a out of band mod. Like many Icoms it involves removing
one diode and installing another. All this stuff is tiny and surface
mount it is not for the faint of heart. I don't have the details at
hand but could find them. Advice; if you are not a surface mount Tech
with a lab to work in have it done by someone who has done it before.
I have done it before and let a friend who does this kind of work every
day do it for me.

                            73 Jerry

>
>I have an Icom IC2ia HT that I would like to find out if
>anyone knows how to activate MARS/CAP Xmit
>operation.  I know that the unit tunes these frequencies,
>and also that if I hold the function button while pressing
>the PTT, the unit transmits; somewhere.  The only problem
>is that sequence is also used to vary the output power,
>so each transmission is at a different power out; if it is
>actually transmitting......Clear as Mud, huh....Does
>anyone know if this actually works or a more
>"sanitary" way of doing so??
>
>Tnx and 73
>
>David  KD4NUE
>



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:45 1997
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From: Stephan M. Anderman <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: This Week in Amateur Radio #196
Date: Sat, 28 DEC 96 10:35:36 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 56
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1b.delphi.com

 _/_/_/_/_/     _/     _/     _/_/_/     _/_/_/         _/_/_/
    _/         _/     _/       _/      _/    _/        _/    _/
   _/ his     _/ _/  _/ eek   _/ n    _/_/_/_/ mateur _/_/_/_/ adio
  _/         _/_/ _/_/       _/      _/    _/        _/   _/
 _/         _/     _/     _/_/_/    _/    _/        _/     _/
-
Here is a summary of news items covered on edition #196 of
"This Week in Amateur Radio", North America's satellite-delivered
audio bulletin service, for the week ending 3-Jan:
-
1.   Merry Christmas, FCC Delays New RF Exposure Compliance Rules
2.   KB6ZV Appoints a New ARRL Great Lakes Division Vice Director
3.   International Amateur Radio Permit a Step Closer to Reality
4.   David Ransome Releases New Version of STSPLUS Tracking Program
5.   NTIA Report Says HF Can Accomodate New and Expanded Ham Bands
6.   "Gateway 160 Meter Net Report" with Vern Jackson, WA0RCR
7.   Special Event Station Calendar
8.   "The RAIN Dial-up" from Chicago
9.   RAC Extends Membership Campaign Due to Canada Post Delays
10.  AMSAT-NA Sponsors 25th Annual Straight Key Night on OSCAR
11.  Florida Man Sentences for Computer Stalking Incident
12.  US Department of Energy Installs New Supercomputer
13.  Phone Companies Cry Foul Over Flat-rate Internet Access
14.  FCC Reviews International Phone Regulations, Too Costly for US
15.  "This Week" Seeking Special Feature Producers/Commentators
16.  Weekly Propagation Forecast
17.  Happy New Year from All of Us at "This Week in Amateur Radio"
-
Funding for the program's transmission and production expense was
provided this week by a grant from the Columbiana County Amateur
Radio Club, which carries "This Week in Amateur Radio" on the
KD8XB repeater in Lisbon, Ohio, serving East Palestine, East
Liverpool, East Rochester, and East Central Ohio on 146.805 MHz.
Presentation of "The RAIN Dial-up" has been made possible by a grant
from Therese Cheney, N0YNQ, of Mounds View, Minnesota.
-
"This Week in Amateur Radio" is a weekly amateur voice bulletin
service, produced by Community Video Associates, Inc., a New York
State not-for-profit corporation based in Albany, NY.  The program
is heard on the "W0KIE Satellite Network" each Saturday at 9:00 PM
(EST) on the Hughes Communications SBS-6 commercial communications
satellite, transponder 13B upper, located at 74 degrees west
longitude in equatorial geosynchronous orbit.  The transponder
center frequency is 12.019 GHz; tune up in frequency to 12.031 GHz.
Program audio is on the 6.2 MHz analog subcarrier and carried on
VHF/UHF repeaters throughout North America and on 160 meters at 1860
kHz.  Contact your local amateur radio club or repeater operator if
"This Week in Amateur Radio" is not being heard in your area.
-
Production and transmission expenses are underwritten by donations
from repeater operators, amateur radio clubs, and individuals.
Further information is available from George Bowen, N2LQS, at
518/283-3665 (email [e-mail]) or Stephan Anderman, WA3RKB,
at 518/664-6809 (email [e-mail]).  You may also reach
them @ WA2UMX.FN32AW.ENY.NY.USA.NA via amateur packet.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:47 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:35:52 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
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[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) wrote:

>KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:
>: Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]> wrote:

>: > >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...

>: >Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
>: >twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
>: >crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
>: >The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any facet
>: >of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.

>: Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
>: because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
>: code. WRONG!

>Sorry, but you are reading more into it than is there.  The pro-code
>crowd are only saying that you need to learn code at a minimum level.
>You can operate SSB on 10 meters with a tech+ license. And 5 wpm should
>take less effort than memorizing the answers to the questions on the
>Novice and Tech exams. When you have the code memorized, you are already
>close to 5 wpm. That is less than one character every two seconds.

>Bill

Why is it that some people automatically ASSume that every tech
memorized the question pool and seems incapable of having studied the
theory and data needed to pass?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:48 1997
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From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:36:33 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59iohc$[e-mail]> <59ru4n$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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On 25 Dec 1996 19:09:11 GMT, [e-mail](William M.
Pasternak) wrote:
-snip-
>
>I also believe that if you are going to demand that an organization
>represent your view, you first are required to become a member of that
>organization.
>
>The ARRL is the only game in town right now.  All attempts over the
>past decade to form alternatives have failed.  NARA is gone.  The ARRC
>is a one-man "paper tiger."  Everyone else is just talk.
>
>You are either on the inside of the ARRL working for change or on the
>outside throwing bricks that will be ignored.
-snip-
A point well made. Too many in this thread say they will not join the
ARRL until the ARRL changes to suit them. An ARRL member's vote counts
just the same whether that person is pro-code or not. If more no-code
proponents were members of the ARRL the survey results could have been
much different.

73 de n4jvp
Fritz
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:49 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:38:17 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
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Dave Maley <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Bill Nelson wrote:
>>
>> KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:
>> : Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>> : > >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...
>>
>> : >Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
>> : >twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
>> : >crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
>> : >The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any face
t
>> : >of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.
>>
>> : Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
>> : because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
>> : code. WRONG!
>>
>> Sorry, but you are reading more into it than is there.  The pro-code
>> crowd are only saying that you need to learn code at a minimum level.
>> You can operate SSB on 10 meters with a tech+ license. And 5 wpm should
>> take less effort than memorizing the answers to the questions on the
>> Novice and Tech exams. When you have the code memorized, you are already
>> close to 5 wpm. That is less than one character every two seconds.
>>
>> Bill

>Isn't there a song by this title<smile>?
>No, really.  Code isn't that bad.  I used to teach it in the classroom.
>Always fun to watch kids as they start to 'get it' the first time.
>If you are finding it dificult, you're not alone.  Don't try to
>learn it alone.  A job best done in a classroom.  And HAVE FUN!
>Dave.
Well I appreciate the sentiment but I choose not to learn code.
I do not want to justify the requirement by taking the test and ading
myself to the ranks of hams who sacrificed a moral issue for HF
privilege.
Like a freind of mine says, I will probably learn code and be a beeper
one day when it is no longer required.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:50 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:49:47 GMT
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[e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow) wrote:

>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 06:32:04 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>
>>Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
>>because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
>>code. WRONG!
>>

>Who would that "select few" be? The licensing authorities "demand" the
>CW requirement. This is demanded to comply with an international
>treaty. That's more than a few!

>There are many "pro-coders" who can see the need for a no-code HF
>ticket. The big question is should the entire HF spectrum be opened up
>to the no-code licensees? A second question is if the entire HF
>spectrum is opened to no-code licensees, what happens to the band
>plans?

>A no-code HF ticket that allows use of the entire spectrum would
>require that the present licensing system be discarded to accomodate
>the no-code extras. All of a sudden we'll just have one license class
>for amateur radio and it won't be entry-level. There are many who
>favor some form of HF no-code ticket but without greatly disrupting
>the current class structure and band plan.

>Even so it is not up to us to make the HF code requirement decision.
>If the no-code proponents would band together in some sort of
>organization and make a serious effort to lobby the ARRL, the IARU and
>the licensing authorities world-wide, no-code HF access could be a
>certainty. All the usenet chatter is just that, usenet chatter, the
>"select few" don't copy it.

>73 de n4jvp
>Fritz

Well we as a nation have ignored more important international treaties
before. The problem is the select few in the ARRL who keep the FCC
convinced that we need the requirement.

If there were changes the band plans would remain the same. I even
agree with setting off the current CW potions as they are for CW ONLY.
That would help insure the beepers a place to play.

There would still be entry level exams such as the tech license.
Advancement would be through technical proficiency and operating
procedures. Unfortunately this might require than some experienced
hams spend some time wit the younger or newer entrants into the hobby.
Some would elmer, but I get the feeling from my experiences with
experienced hams the vast majority would hide from new comers and
treat the ones who don't code like vermin. As witnessed of the
experienced hams here in the newsgroup.

So far your post has been the most logical and considerate so far.
You stated your opinion in a non-combative manner and I am ever so
graetful to your contribution to the great debate. Thank You.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:51 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:57:28 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <5a3jn1$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Clint Bradford) wrote:


>>>...no-code Tech's are hams in license only.
>>>They are not the traditional ham...
>>>They are not joiners.
>>>They do not join the ARRL or any other national activist group.
>>>They do not join local clubs.
>>>They do not financially support repeaters.
>>>To them, ham radio is ... an inexpensive alternative to a cell-fone
>>>...they have no abiding comitment to the service.

>Wow...I (along with Jim KF6CR) live in repeater-rich Southern
>California. I must be scanning the wrong frequencies and have severe
>personality disorders: I hold a measley Technician License - but I seem
>to have "broken" all those above assertions.

>I immediately joined three local Amateur Clubs when I got my license. I
>joined the ARRL. I teach classes in Emergency Traffic Handling both for
>Amateurs and GMRS licensees. I run an Official Bulletin Station of the
>ARRL - a landline BBS. The Club that Jim is affiliated with - Citrus
>Belt Amateur Radio Club - is doing marvelous work for the benefit of the
>entire State of California. I am involved in a 2 Meter Repeater that
>handles over 5,000 public assist/highway emergency calls annually.

>Now I know we don't want this thread to get into "personal" exceptions
>to what was stated anout Technicians...but the frequencies I regularly
>monitor on 2 Meters, 220, and 440 simply aren't what were described in
>the original post. Sure, there are abusers of this privilege. But
>pervasive and abhorrent? Not in my sphere of influence.


>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
>ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
>------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well said. It appears that in CA, NJ and MS that the qualifiers stated
in the post concerning techs does not apply.
Now imagine if CW was still required for any class license...What
would have happened to those 5,000 assistance calls? A great many of
them would probably went unanswered.
I quess that plugs the hole in the CW SAVES LIVES argument as well.
I wonder how many lives were lost because of the CW requirement?
I wonder how many have been saved by no-code techs?

Eric



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:53 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FILTER
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 16:05:05 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <5a3k59$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59r69r$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:


>>M>You need to read this newsgroup more carefully.  Many HAM OPERATORS seem
>> >to swear by the outdated Morse requirements as a way to "keep the
>> >riff-raff out."

>>It's not perfect, but it helps.

>>---
>>   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

>>--

>I talked to my friend, the extra class conservative the other day about the n
o
>code thing.  I think riff raff is probably a bit too strong a term and it
>probably insults people.  He thinks (and I do too) that it makes people have
a
>little more respect for the privledges they get with a ham license when they
>have to put forth some effort to get it.  So I think a better way of saying w
hat
>you said is that CW testing keeps out people who really aren't interested in
the
>hobby enuff to put forth some effort to enter it.

>73, Jim KH2D

I put forth a great deal of effort to join the hobby. Unlike many
assertions to the contrary, I studied the theory and data to pass my
test. Not memorize the questions.
When you speak of effort I wonder if you could clarify what effort is
in relation to your position. I am not trying to be sarcastic but..
Is effort only learning morse code or can effort be something else?

Eric




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:54 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FILTER
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 16:06:57 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5a3k8r$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59r69r$[e-mail]> <59rj1d$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <59r69r$[e-mail]>,
>       Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>I talked to my friend, the extra class conservative the other day about the
no
>>code thing.  I think riff raff is probably a bit too strong a term and it
>>probably insults people.

>Okay, you're right. There are many classy criminals. Perhaps the term
>"trash" would be better. 'Helps keep the <white/black/asian/hispanic/etc>
>trash off HF'. Maybe that is better?

>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.

I hope you and Jim are only kiding when you define rif raf and the
various ethnic groups as trash. Gawd I hope so.

Eric



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:55 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 16:11:50 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <5a3ki1$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
>retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
>older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
>remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
>back in the late 60s.

>The CW requirement tends, I think, to keep it that way.  Busy working
>people probably lack the time to master 13 WPM CW, and have other hobby
>alternatives, such as the internet, that do not require them to do so.
>Although working people see the relevance of a theory and procedure
>exam, (and are willing to take the time out of their busy schedules to
>prepare for and pass them) they tend to view the code test as a
>non-productive use of their time (which it is).  Therefore, in great
>numbers they pass ham radio by, or at best become no-code Techs.

>Now, I've got nothing against retirees; I hope to be one myself one day,
>and lots of these guys are my buddies.  But surely none of us think that
>it is a good thing for our hobby that our hobby has systematically
>excluded non-retirees.

>By the way, if you disagree with what I've written, then ask yourself
>WHY is it that HF is so overwhelmingly dominated, even on weekends, by
>retirees?  I think you may come back to my theory.

>As an interesting corellary to the above, the recent ARRL survey on
>keeping the CW requirement also contained a systematic bias in favor of
>retirees.  1) probably retirees with lots of time on their hands are the
>ones with the leisure time to discover, and respond to, such a poll; 2)
>the ARRL is to a very large extent comprised of retirees. (No, I don't
>have figures, but I'll bet I'm right.)

>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV

>USC Law, Class of '97

>------------------------------------------------------------
>"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
>Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
>------------------------------------------------------------

>Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2

Let me see if I can find a word that fits how I feel about your post..

Hmmmmmm...... BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yup BINGO says it all :)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:56 1997
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From: "Bob Botik" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 2 Meter Repeaters In NW Arkansas
Date: 28 Dec 96 16:21:04 GMT
Organization: news.tab.com
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <01bbf4e2$38f531c0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: jade.tab.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Greetings all!

I am planning a trip to the Fayetteville / Eureka Springs area.

Anyone have latest repeater frequencies and tones for this area.

Thanks and Happy New Year!

Bob  K5SIV

[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "John C. Ko" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WANTED: 60's 70's & 80's ARRL Hand Book
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 11:32:30 -0500
Organization: WorldWide Subnet Corp.
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.36.95
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Hello, OM

I am looking for 60's, 70's and 80's ARRL Hand Book for my collections.
Please send me an E-Mail indication Year and your price. I pay for
shipping.

Best 73 & 88 !

John N2FNO [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:52:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Icom PS 30 power supply
Date: 28 Dec 96 16:58:16 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

To Ron N4GFO/KH2, being held captive on Guam:
1. Airmail to the Mainland is 32 cents; why not write directly to Icom?
1a. You're closer to Japan than the Mainaland - write directly to Icom
in Japan.
2. Why not (gasp!) build a power supply? You can strip an old TV set to
get many of the necessary components.
3. FS and WTB posts are very effective when placed on rec.radio.swap.
4. Contact Jim Kehler KH2D at [e-mail] for Elmer help.
5. Call/write Honolulu Electronics - phone calls to Hawaii from Guam
are cheaper than to the Mainland.

73,
Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 28 Dec 1996 12:09:31 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 73
Message-ID: <5a3k8b$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> writes:

> Wrong.  The ARRL survey was a classic example of a self-selected poll.
> A self-selected poll is a poll where the respondents must take a
> positive step in order to respond to the poll, versus a conventional
> poll, where the pollster selects the respondents.

This is just plain incorrect. Your definition is 'almost' correct,
in the sense that in a self-selected poll the polling agency does
not select the representative sample from which to conduct the poll.
A classic example is the Libertarian poll on the Internet, where
anyone could go "vote" for one of the three major Presidential
candidates. Naturally, Harry Brown won by a landslide.

In the case of the ARRL, however, we do not have a "self-selected"
poll. The ARRL selected participants and sent them a ballot in the
mail.


> The most famous
> example of a self-selected poll was the infamous Roosevelt v. Landon
> poll.  In this case the Literary Digest asked its subscribers/readers to
> mail in their preferences for President.  The poll was wildly off, even
> for its geographical area.

I suspect that the problem with this poll had more to do with the fact
that the readership did not accurately parallel a representative sample
of the voting population as a whole, thus attempting to make a conclusion
about the population as a whole would be completely inaccurate.


> Wrong again.  Wrong.  National surveys differ from the ARRL poll in a
> critical way: the pollsters select the respondents.

Detail exactly how the ARRL poll differed. Please explain how the ARRL
mailing out surveys to members is in any way different than a pollster
selecting respondents.


> Respondents have
> the option of saying "no response" but this is included in the tally.

Not always.


> This difference is crucial.  Polls where the respondents decide whether
> to respond are universally viewed by polling experts as invalid.  Why is
> this?

They are, huh? Well, that's really strange, since agencies like Arbitron
have used these form of "mail in surveys" for decades. Not to mention
the huge amount of marketing research that cigarette manufacturers do via
the "mail in survey".


> Wrong again.  Pollsters know that exit polls are very unreliable, and
> these are not the basis for serious polling.

"Exit polls are very unreliable"? Were you watching television on
election evening? Every major news organization was predicting winners
of key races seconds after polls closed, purely on the basis of
"exit polling". In 99% of the cases they were pretty close to being
correct too.

I guess all those "unreliable" exit polls really showed us, huh?


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!141.211.63.150!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!dublin.bitwise.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Skid Schermerhorn, W1TTY)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Survey - Club Repeaters
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 17:11:07 GMT
Organization: In the land of the happily retired sinc 1981.
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <5a3k6c$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ost80.capecod.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Gary <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Our club is looking for some insight as to how other clubs approach
>their repeater and its maintenance and development.

>1.     Does your club involve its members in the maintenance and development
>       of your machine as a club activity or do you have a commercial radio service

>       perform the maintenance?

                We do all our own work and have never heard of commercial maintenance
for ham gear.

>2.     Is your repeater accessible to members of your club or is it at
>       a shared site with limited access?

                The site is a public service of a golf course and we and they have the
only equipment at the site.  We get free space and electricity in
return for helping them with their TV and 2-way equipment and recently
gave them a couple of new commercial HT's.

>3.     Does your club encourage members to be involved in repeater activities
>       or are these activities left to the seasoned pros, commercial or club member
s?

                Anyone wanting to volunteer are welcome but we have a primary person,
the trustee, and a faithful few who do whatever is necessary.

>Thanks in advance for your response.

>73's,  Gary, W0AB

        Our repeater is W1SGL,  owned and operated by Cape cod and Islands
ARA.

73



Skid Schermerhorn        http://www.capecod.net/~sscherme
Cape Cod, Massachusetts  http://www.capecod.net/~sscherme/webtest.htm
USA                      http://www.capecod.net/~sscherme/church.htm



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.stealth.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 17:47:38 GMT
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-240-132.nc.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44852 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121954

On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:49:47 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>
>If there were changes the band plans would remain the same. I even
>agree with setting off the current CW potions as they are for CW ONLY.
>That would help insure the   ----> beepers<----    a place to play.

Aw come on now, is that what it's getting down to, massive usage of
that "b" word? This person writes a well thought out post and
completely ruins his credibility with 1/2 of the people in this
newsgroup by using the "b" word.

73 (beep)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!informer.alliance.net!news
From: "><>  N8LDY  <><" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 28 Dec 1996 18:05:43 GMT
Organization: Alliance Network, Inc. (GRR MI) (616-774-3010)
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <01bbf4e9$2dad25a0$71e96ec6@chuckster>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: gr70.ppp.alliance.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Amen to that !      N8LDY


[e-mail] wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
> The best reason for keeping the CW requirement is because it is so
amusing to
> listen to the whiners.
>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Ron Tivey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: NEED HELP(WTB ICOM PS-30)
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 18:14:14 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-4.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230

Hello everyone.  I live in Guam. If you don't know where that is, it's
as far from civilization as you can be stationed by the military...
There are no real ham stores within 1000 miles.  I'm looking for a
good condition used or new ICOM PS-30 Power Sulpply.  Unfortunately
Guam doesn't have much except TYHPOONS (Fern is 300 Mile from us now)
and brown tree snakes(they're everywhere).  If you have a PS-30 to
sell or have seen one on some amateur store shelf or know of someone
that's willing to sell one.

 Please E-Mail at :  [e-mail]

I've tried to call AES, HRE, HRO and some other stores in QST but
Phone calls to the States are about $1.50 and minute.  Thanks for
reading this and everyones positive response in advance.

                   Ron,  N4GFO/KH2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!tor-nn1.netcom.ca!news
From: [e-mail] (L. M. Picard)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: 1928 test? (was Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!)
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 18:33:07 GMT
Organization: Netcom Canada
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <5979eq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: trt-on10-02.netcom.ca
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 28  1:30:20 PM EST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121956 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44854 rec.radio.shortwave:91349

The code is, and has been, obsolete for some time. I remember reading
that even the U.S. Navy is no longer going to monitor code.

My occasional forays into the ham domain suggest that the code
requirement has not proved to be a barrier to the "Yahoo" element.

I remember hearing an interview with a well known ham magazine editor.
Basically, to paraphrase him, "We need psychological screening tests
and not a C W requirement".

I think that this is as close to the truth as we're going to get.
If the ham test were going to be relevant to our times, evaluation of
keyboard skills or of basic computer programming and/or computer
upgrading etc. would be far more relevant. I would wonder how many
accomplished "fists" are competent behind a keyboard.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!uniserve!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 18:45:12 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <5a3pt5$[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2gt4$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: i505.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->[e-mail] wrote:

->>In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
->>writes:


->Well if we actually honor the treaty we should have a requirement. BUT
->the U.S. has a long history of ignoring international treaties. We
->ignore treaties that have more important ramifications that the ITU.
->So why won't we ignore this one?

You CAN honor the treaty and STILL NOT have the CW requirement.  The
document was written with enough holes in it to let Granny Prichard make
fifteen yards against the Steelers off-tackle.  There is a provision that
ANY nation can exempt itself from this requirement if it so chooses.

Alright, you DON'T so choose.  If you are real about wanting to let
"no-code" people into the ranks at any level, then you say that one word a
minute is the requirement and you can bring along a chart and you can have
enough minutes until you pass.  You have met the LETTER of the treaty, no?
Setting ANY level seems to me to be arbitrary, whimsical, and capricious,
but then again, I live 3000 miles from Oldington by choice.

Jim







Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!informer.alliance.net!news
From: "><>  N8LDY  <><" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: 28 Dec 1996 18:46:15 GMT
Organization: Alliance Network, Inc. (GRR MI) (616-774-3010)
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>
NNTP-Posting-Host: gr70.ppp.alliance.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I have used CW almost exclusively for the past 15 years and I love it.
13 wpm did not come easy for me but in time I made it to 25 wpm.
Times are changing and we must change but we need not throw
the baby out with the bath water to make these changes!

Proposal # 1766

A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
except in times of emergency... *Endorsements* are grandfathered
to all who have passed cw testing in the past and can be obtained
by passing code tests in the future. In this way we can perserve and
recognize the *skill* of cw and reward those who use it without
mandating it's use by others...... I believe it is better to bend a little
than to break. CW is a skill and Compromise is the way to preserv it.
Let us open the Door to the future yet retain and respect the past.....


GREAT LAKES AWARD MANAGER
MICHIGAN AMATEUR RADIO ALLIANCE
CHARLES "CHUCK" LEMAR  -=N8LDY=-
WAS DXCC WAC GLA SM


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!130.168.70.138!news.eng.convex.com!news.greatbasin.net!dick
From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Take it to r.r.a.p (Was: Code/No-code blah blah blah)
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 10:46:25 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 5
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2gt4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.libelle.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.6

Will you people PLEASE take all this code/nocode nonsense to
rec.radio.amateur.policy where it belongs!!  I don't want to have to
unsubscribe to this NG, too.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!cygnus.com!news.zeitgeist.net!news.greatbasin.net!dick
From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 10:51:00 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 10
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.libelle.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.6

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

>Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
>retirees? . . .
>
>The CW requirement tends, I think, to keep it that way.

Good Gawd, it probably causes cancer in laboratory animals, too!
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.he.net!news.zocalo.net!news.zeitgeist.net!news.greatbasin.net!dick
From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 10:52:36 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 7
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ki1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: merlin.libelle.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.3.6

In article <5a3ki1$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Yup BINGO says it all :)

"Nonsense" does, too.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: is there any activity, anywhere, in amateur spread spectrum?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 18:55:35 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dd14-043.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Greetings fellow amateurs.
I would like to know if there is any amateur activity, experiemental
or established, using spread spectrum.
I am curious about the technique(s) used, which band(s), etc.
Larry ve3fxq



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-200.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 28 Dec 1996 13:56:38 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <5a3qh6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>> Now I know we don't want this thread to get into "personal" exceptions
>> to what was stated anout Technicians...but the frequencies I regularly
>> monitor on 2 Meters, 220, and 440 simply aren't what were described in
>> the original post. Sure, there are abusers of this privilege. But
>> pervasive and abhorrent? Not in my sphere of influence.
>
>Mine either.  The old canard that Technician hams conduct themselves
>like CBers is so much malarky.

You two must be lucky to live in areas so clean. Unfortunately, my
area isn't, and a lot of other hams that I talk to on HF indicate
the VHF problems on the local "2 meter good-buddy boxes" are just
as bad.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!visi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 28 Dec 1996 13:59:51 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <5a3qn7$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I have seen many potential
>newcomer hams turn off to the hobby and seek alternatives when they
>learn that in order to do this on HF (the best way to communicate over
>these distances) they must learn Morse Code.  They don't see the point,
>and there are other hobbies that don't require this.

Yeah, I run into this attitude with my students all the time. "Why do
I have to learn about history when all I want to do is become a
computer programmer?" "Why do I have to take this management class,
I'm going to be a systems analyst?" and so on.


>Someone elsewhere on this newsgroup called me a whiner.  Well, I'm
>whining about the coming demise of our hobby, from the
>non-replentishment of our numbers.

I hate to break it to you, but the demise of our hobby has nothing to
do with the lack of numbers. Its all about money. The day the government
figured out they could sell frequencies for billions of dollars was the
day ham radio was told it was living on borrowed time.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.lobo.net!news
From: Mark Fossum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 13:09:04 -0600
Organization: Lobo Net
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Ben wrote:
>
> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> pruning!
>
> Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>
> Ben

Yes! You can find it at most hardware stores!!!

It's usually located right between the skyhooks and the mufflerbelts!
Ask for the 5 gallon jug because it keeps forever. Works good on mobile
antenna's too!

(-;



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!207.17.118.2!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Ben)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 19:43:06 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
pruning!

Has anybody heard of this stuff?

Ben



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!usenet
From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 13:46:39 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
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Ben wrote:
>
> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> pruning!
>
> Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>
> Ben

Oh yeah....I've been using it for years. As a matter of fact, there is
great controversy about it among the contesting an DXing community
because its use amounts to cheating.

I don't think they should take it off the market, however, because it's
also good on a cracker.

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.magicnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news
From: "Jim Reid" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: 28 Dec 1996 19:59:51 GMT
Organization: At Home
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <01bbf4f9$aeb74120$72070ccf@jim-reid-1>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kauai-114.u.aloha.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



><>  N8LDY  <>< <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>...
>
> A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
> One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
> except in times of emergency... *Endorsements* are grandfathered
> to all who have passed cw testing in the past and can be obtained
> by passing code tests in the future. In this way we can perserve and
> recognize the *skill* of cw and reward those who use it without
> mandating it's use by others......

An excellent suggestion.  I proposed many months ago Endorsements
for all HF operations including SSB,  Digital,  and CW.  The endorsement
earned the privilege of mode and band segment usage.

However,  the suggestion was bombarded with comments about its
complications,  the necessary examination of technical information
would require elaborate new test questions, enforcement would be
hard,  etc.,  etc., etc.......  And the thread died.

Hope yours obtains a better response.

73,  Jim,  KH7M


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!van-bc!news.rmii.com!rainbow.rmi.net!rainbow!jonz
From: [e-mail] (Bea and Marvin Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: RED OAK LUMBER FOR SALE!
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Date: 28 Dec 1996 20:06:05 GMT
Organization: Rocky Mountain Internet - (800) 900-RMII
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <5a3ujd$[e-mail]>
References: <ddrong-2708561442020001@204.252.180.125> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rainbow.rmii.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Bram Diepenbrock ([e-mail]) wrote:
: David Drong wrote:
: > For sale Red Oak lumber
<-snip->

: WRONG NEWSGROUP, BUDDY...!!!

...and, who are _you_ speaking to?

<<newsgroups pruned>>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!news.service.emory.edu!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!news
From: Phil Heaton <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:20:46 -0500
Organization: Nunya
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Ben wrote:
>
> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> pruning!
>
> Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>
> Ben

        Hmmm, donno bou't tat, but I got some Contact Restorer
 that works well during high QRM/QRN. Just spray it into the rig
 during the QSO and you're ready! One can is $1000. Send money
 to my callbook address and "Good luck in the contest".

 Phil
--

 Phil Heaton, KE4KRT, [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:20 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!uhog.mit.edu!netnews.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 20:46:32 GMT
Lines: 29
Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121995 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44872

Michael P. Deignan ([e-mail]) wrote:

: 3. Opinion surveys do not need "control groups" unless you are attempting
:    to draw a parallel against an outside group (i.e. non-licensed people).

Although the anti-coders would have liked this one because it would often
yield an answer they'd like to quote ("I considered getting into ham radio,
but was put off by the code requirement.") it would be even more difficult
to get results.  Ask the average person on the street about ham radio, and
many, if not most, get a mental picture of CB.  Just like many folks see a
ham carrying an ht and mistake it for a cell phone.  From my own
perspective, it's difficult to say which is the greater insult.  :-)

ARRL got approximately 6% response rate, based on 10,000 surveys returned
out of 170,000 members.  OK, statisticians, what's the average rate of
return on surveys, any survey, taken these days?  I'd bet that it's pretty
small.

: >If you want an accurate poll, you hire a company like Irving Fields or
: >the like to conduct it.  You do both targeted and across-the-board
: >polling and then compare the samples against a pre-determined gradient.
: >None of this was done, so I have to doubt the accuracy of the poll.

: I don't see any reason why the ARRL should have done this at all.

I agree.  That's members' money they're spending, after all.

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!netaxs.com!unix3.netaxs.com!feliccia
From: [e-mail] (Nick Feliccia)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Radio Shack ..
Date: 28 Dec 1996 20:49:02 GMT
Organization: Net Access, Philadelphia, PA
Lines: 9
Distribution: usa
Message-ID: <5a413u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: unix3.netaxs.com

Can you believe the sales droid at radio shack tried to sell a stero to
mono adaptor for the optimus headphones I bought. He said they wouldn't
work with mono ham gear otherwise. I told him I would come back tomorrow
and let him say I told you so if it didn't work. Needless to say , I slept
in. Anyone else have good stories.
Respond to Email as well as post .
Nick
N3FKS



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:22 1997
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From: [e-mail] (will)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: amazing
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 20:55:42 GMT
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 55
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59fpqe$[e-mail]> <59i8mr$[e-mail]> <59mv21$[e-mail]> <59p9re$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121973 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44858 rec.radio.shortwave:91363

On Tue, 24 Dec 1996 08:51:08 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
wrote:

>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>>That's the point that Andy was making ... the code requirement is THE
>>SINGLE most devisive thing in ham radio ... you beepers see it as a way
>>to maintain some false, self-deluding, self-image of superiority and
>>eletism and use it as a way to keep others out ... you can't stand the
>>idea of dropping the code requirement, 'cause  that's the ONLY thing
>>that you have to make you feel superior to others ... to admit the code
>>is irrelevant would be to admit that YOU are irrelevant in today's
>>technically advanced world.
>
>>You beepers just can't face the truth ...
>
>>Carl - wa6vse
>>[e-mail]
>
>Let's turn that around for a minute, Squiggy.  You can't stand the idea of
>keeping the code test, because it makes you feel inferior to others.  To admi
t
>the code is relevant would be to admit other hams are relevant in todays worl
d,
>and you have already shown us how you feel with your constant 'Yackers,
>gamers....' etc. comments.
>
>But anyway, it's Christmas time, so let's not argue.  As 1996 draws to a clos
e
>I would just like to thank you for presenting your views on the no code/code
>debate in this forum Squiggy.  Your attitude toward ham radio, and your ideas
>and the way you have presented them here are the best argument that I have
>seen for keeping the code tests.
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
>
It is truly amazing to see people act this way.  I am a Tech-plus
class ham and yes I did learn code.  For some hams, code is the best
thig in the world. I have met hams who won't go near anything below
50mhz. Does that make them any less of a ham than you? I ahve met guys
would won't use voice or any mode other than CW. Does that make them
any less of a ham? I have met the nicest people on the bands and I
have heard some of the fights on the 20 meter voice.  It seems that we
have sectors of the fraternaty that refuse to have different ideas on
how hams should behave or what they should know.  With all the
pressures of taking ham bands (like 220) and decreasing license
applications and fewer hams all around, WHY CAN'T WE FIND ROOM FOR
EVERYONE!!!!  So I don't know 20wpm code, so I don't use the lower
bands enough, I am still an amateur radio operator with authorization
from the Federal Communications Commision to operate on certain
frequencies in the Amateur Radio Service.  If this division keeps up
then we might as well give the bands up and sell all our equipment.

                                        will
                                        [e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:24 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!swrinde!cssun.mathcs.emory.edu!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Twilight of amateur radio
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599pmu$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 21:09:44 GMT
Lines: 57


In article <599pmu$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Mi
chael P. Deignan) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>       Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Read the ITU definition of the amateur service sometime. It says
>>the amateur radio service is for conducting private technical
>>investigations into the art and science of radio. In other words
>>developing stuff (the art) and investigating how it works (the
>>science) are what amateur radio is about. In legalese, "art" is
>>used in the same sense as it is used in "industrial arts" to mean
>>hands-on engineering improvement.
>
>I disagree. Art is the art of communication.

Art is used here in the same sense as in "The Art of Electronics"
by Horowitz and Hill. Artisans were the forerunners of engineers,
and the usage of art in this context is referring to the art of
engineering.

>Science is the technology of building mechanisms to communicate.

Science is used in the sense of scientific enquiry into natural
phenomenon, as in the work of Faraday, Ampere, Hertz, Crookes,
Heaviside, etc. Science is most definitely *not* engineering.
Those are two distinct and very different disciplines. Engineers
use the discoveries of science in their work, and scientists
often use the fruits of engineering in their work, but it is
engineers who build, and scientists who observe and discover
principles of natural law.

>Both components
>are equally important, but amateur radio is not just about
>technology. Hence the "international goodwill" clause.

That clause does not exist in the ITU definition of amateur
radio. In fact, the content of international contacts is
sharply limited by ITU regulations to the reporting of the
results of technical tests or to remarks of such an unimportant
nature that recourse of other means of communications would not
be warranted. That's hardly the stuff on which international
goodwill is founded. US regulations are unique in stating
a goal of enhancing international goodwill. But the overriding
ITU regulations tend to moot that objective.

And in practice, the bulk of amateur HF communications doesn't
serve to enhance international goodwill. In fact, much of it
serves to enhance international illwill, IE contesting, Dxing,
etc which serve to limit any meaningful dialog between people
of different nations.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: 1928 test? (was Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!)
Date: 28 Dec 1996 16:11:49 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5a42el$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <5979eq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122031 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44894 rec.radio.shortwave:91407

In article <[e-mail]>,
        L. M. Picard <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I remember hearing an interview with a well known ham magazine editor.
>Basically, to paraphrase him, "We need psychological screening tests
>and not a C W requirement".

This is the same ham radio magazine editor that believes in cold fusion
and how AIDS is a government-engineering virus to kill blacks, isn't
it?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:26 1997
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: 28 Dec 1996 21:16:00 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <5a42mg$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn09.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122050 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44898

In article <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>, <Unknown> says...
>
>I have used CW almost exclusively for the past 15 years and I love it.
>13 wpm did not come easy for me but in time I made it to 25 wpm.
>Times are changing and we must change but we need not throw
>the baby out with the bath water to make these changes!
>
>Proposal # 1766
>
>A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
>One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
>except in times of emergency... *Endorsements* are grandfathered
>to all who have passed cw testing in the past and can be obtained
>by passing code tests in the future. In this way we can perserve and
>recognize the *skill* of cw and reward those who use it without
>mandating it's use by others...... I believe it is better to bend a little
>than to break. CW is a skill and Compromise is the way to preserv it.
>Let us open the Door to the future yet retain and respect the past.....
>
>
>GREAT LAKES AWARD MANAGER
>MICHIGAN AMATEUR RADIO ALLIANCE
>CHARLES "CHUCK" LEMAR  -=N8LDY=-
>WAS DXCC WAC GLA SM

This is about the most logical and sensible answer to the Morse Code
controversy that I've seen. I happen to be for retaining a morse code test
requirement. An endorsement would satisfy me just as well. The endorsement
could be much like a drivers license. Some states require a motorcycle
endorsement before you can operate a motorcycle, so why not a CW endorsement
for operating in lower portions of the HF bands? The SSB operators could still

have their portions of the bands, as well as AMTOR, RTTY, SSTV and other
digital modes.
I would think that it would be enough to satisfy both sides. Unfortunately
there will be some who find fault with it. I can't wait to hear their reasons
why.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:27 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 21:16:47 GMT
Lines: 38
Sender: [e-mail]

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Jim Lowman wrote:
: >
: > If you don't believe that DXing at VHF+ is interesting, look at the result
s
: > of one of the ARRL VHF contests; in particular, noting the number of
: > Advanced, Extra and OT callsigns among the participants.

: I know it's interesting to some.  It just isn't interesting to me.  And
: I suspect that some people feel the way I do (and some don't.)

Agreed.  We're just trying to show some of the newer hams the alternatives
that exist, within the terms of their own license.

: To me (unlike some other people) the facination with ham radio is
: communicating over longer distances than say, a local telephone call.
: This is not all there is to ham radio.  It is, however, one of the
: things that tends to attract newcomers.  I have seen many potential
: newcomer hams turn off to the hobby and seek alternatives when they
: learn that in order to do this on HF (the best way to communicate over
: these distances) they must learn Morse Code.  They don't see the point,
: and there are other hobbies that don't require this.  (Like the
: internet).

I look at HF and VHF+ DXing each as a challenge in their own right, and
enjoy both for what they offer.  Naturally, YMMV.

: Someone elsewhere on this newsgroup called me a whiner.  Well, I'm
: whining about the coming demise of our hobby, from the
: non-replentishment of our numbers.  Personally, I've got my Extra
: ticket, and I suppose things will hang together for the 40 or so more
: years I've got left.  Or maybe not.

Well, I got some Extra code tapes as a Christmas present, so I need to
finish getting the upgrade that I started back in  September.  And, with
retirement looming on the horizon in 12-15 years, I share your hope that the
hobby will still be around for some years after that.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.enteract.com!elijah-12.d.enteract.com!user
From: [e-mail] (Chip)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:22:34 -0600
Organization: EnterAct L.L.C. Turbo-Elite News Server
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: elijah-12.d.enteract.com

In article <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Ben) wrote:

> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> pruning!
>
> Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>
> Ben


   Ben,

      A even better product, though it is hard to obtain is a spray bottle
of Turbo Prop Wash.

  Avionics techs use it religously.  Knocks down SWR's  etc.

Its only available a airports.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:29 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 21:23:02 GMT
Lines: 23
Sender: [e-mail]

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Mine either.  The old canard that Technician hams conduct themselves
: like CBers is so much malarky.  Some of the worst operating I've heard
: is by general class and above hams.  The absolute worst, of course, is
: by unlicensed individuals.

And we had the troublemakers back in 1966, too.  It's just that they had
fewer outlets, i.e. HF, to "express" themselves.  Fortunately, the FCC cared
back then, and we could take some satisfaction in seeing future writeups that
noted that their tickets were pulled.

: Frankly, I think there are some who make up stories about how bad the
: VHF operating procedures are to bolster the argument that we need CW as
: a "filter" to keep bad types off of HF.  The facts contradict this
: thesis.  The vast majority of ops on VHF, at least in Southern
: California, are excellent ops, who behave as traditional hams, i.e.
: courteous, good operating procedures, etc.

Amen to that.  With the exception I noted earlier in this thread, most of
the VHF/UHF operators would be as welcome on HF.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:30 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 21:27:23 GMT
Lines: 14
Sender: [e-mail]

Michael P. Deignan ([e-mail]) wrote:

: You two must be lucky to live in areas so clean. Unfortunately, my
: area isn't, and a lot of other hams that I talk to on HF indicate
: the VHF problems on the local "2 meter good-buddy boxes" are just
: as bad.

Well, there's always the .435 machine in LA.  :-)

Seriously, though, considering how antisocial a lot of people are in SoCal
in a number of other respects, the repeaters are reasonably clean.

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!usenet.logical.net!dciteleport.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!llondel.demon.co.uk!noone
From: "Dave (Reply address in.sig" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: GB2RS News Question
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 96 21:49:48  GMT
Organization: the bottom of a deep hole
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-Mail2News-User: [e-mail]
X-Mail2News-Path: relay-7.mail.demon.net!relay-6.mail.demon.net!llondel.demon.co.uk
MMDF-Warning:  Parse error in original version of preceding line at relay-7.mail.demon.net
X-No-Archive: yes

OK, I've had a request to stop posting GB2RS to rec.radio.amateur.misc.
Given that it also goes to rec.radio.info and uk.radio.amateur, I'm
quite happy to leave this group off the crosspost list if no one on here
reads it. It was nearly three years ago that I started posting it, and
someone at the time must have asked for it to appear here.

Yeahs and Nays to the address below please, if sent to the one in the
header then it will bounce!

Dave
--
dave@ llondel.demon.co.uk
Any advice above is worth what I paid for it.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:32 1997
From: [e-mail] (Mike Ward)
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!ceas.rochester.edu!rochgte!UUCP
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Icom IC02at audio output problem
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 16:51:40 -0500
X-FTN-To: All
Lines: 17


I was using one of my IC-02at radios the other day (for packet) and noticed
that I was not receiving any responses to my packets.

I pulled out the plug that goes into the earphone jack and found that there
was no audio. I thought that the problem might be with the battery, so I
hooked it up to the 12-volt supply. Using this source (or a BP-7 13.2v
battery), I found that I do get some low-volume audio. However, it is not
enough to be useable.

Does anyone recognize this symptom (voltage-dependent volume) and have any
idea what the solution might be? Thanks for any help you might have.

73 de WD4SGU
Mike - Rochester, NY




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 28 Dec 96 21:57:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Lines: 14


M>The vote was a sham, pure and simple.

M>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue will
 >be decided in the courts.

That's the way!  Sue in court instead of leaning the code.  More of the
"something for nothing" mentality I see running rampant in todays
wannabes.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 28 Dec 96 21:57:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: SOMETHING FOR NOTHING
Lines: 9


W>Drew, Modernizing is not getting rid of CW, you Guys use ever excuse in
 >the World to get on HF, quit Whinning put out a little Effort and you will
 >be on HF.

Nope, people today want something for nothing.
---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:34 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 28 Dec 96 21:57:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: WORK AND GET A REWARD
Lines: 20


 >Ever since "incentive" licensing
 >came into effect ham radio in the USA has been divided in this way.
 >Do away with the tests and we'll do away with a lot of division.

There was a time, not too long ago when hard work got you a reward,
harder work got you a bigger reward, and even harder work got you still
a bigger reward.  What is so damned bad about that concept?  Now I see
people who won't work because they want to start a new job and get a
CEOs pay and hams who pass a No Code test and want Extra class
privileges.

You are advocating SOMETHING FOR NOTHING and I don't buy it!

Work and get a reward-no work, no reward.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:35 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: 35% of the curriculum?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]> <58sbd8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 22:21:48 GMT
Lines: 31
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:121975 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44860

In article <[e-mail]> Dave Hockaday <[e-mail]> writes:
>James W. KELLEY wrote:
>> It's not a bad analogy, and I would actually like to see code become a
>> closer analog to the foreign language requirement in school.  The big
>> difference here is that foreign language does not constitute 35% of the
>> high school curriculum!  As a requirement, Morse code should be at most a
>> breadth course, not a double major.
>
>What do you mean by 35%? I guess I view it as a much smaller percentage, sinc
e there
>is more spectrum available on 6 meters than all the HF bands combined.

3 of the 8 exam elements are Morse receiving tests. That's 37.5% of
testing devoted to a single thing. And 5 of the 6 amateur license
classes require passing one or more of those elements. That's 83%.
And that 83% gets privileges unrelated to Morse for passing Morse
tests. Clearly, Morse tests hold a disproportionate position in
amateur licensing.

>clearly HF access is just a drop in the bucket in terms of spectrum access. I
f
>anything, HF ops are in the back of the bus.

That would be true if HF were *all* that HF ops got. But of course they
have everything else as well. So not only do they get the back of the
bus, but the front, and the driver's position as well.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:37 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 22:25:02 GMT
Lines: 69

In article <[e-mail]> Sieg
fried Rambaum <[e-mail]> writes:
>> Arrrgh! Doesn't *anyone* understand Ohm's Law anymore?
>>
>> I = E/R
>>
>> If I double the voltage E to 2E while leaving R the same,
>> what happens to I?
>
>It doubles, but the damage actually is done by the time you are subjected
>to the higher current. At 220 Volts, your arm's and hand's muscles
>instanteously contract, resulting in a jerk-back move .... a few
>millisendonds. At 110 Volts you might get less current, but as the
>jerk-back is less pronounced, you are subjected to a longer time, and in
>effect have to dissipate more power.

If you depend on "jerk-back" to save your life, I hope you have plenty
of insurance for your widow to spend. You are talking nonsense. Muscles
in the area through which the current passes, usually primarily the
hand/forearm, will contract, but that can cause you to *clamp down* on
the voltage point and be *unable to let go*. If you pierce the skin
while doing so, you'll fry. I've lost two co-workers to that, and luckily
survived the same thing myself because the skin was not pierced and I
was able to disable the source of voltage with my free hand. (Dry skin
has a high R, but the wet icky inside is a good conductor.)

>> What happens is that "I" get fried twice as extra crispy.
>
>Nonsense, see your remark about Ohm's law. If your conclusion about E
>and R would hold true, you would get fried each warm, dry summer day
>when combing your hair ... the E of the static you generate is in the
>tens of kilovolts region... Currents, that can be fatal, if sustained
>over a finite time, need not be so if sustained only for a tiny fraction
>of the fatal exposure time.

And just how many milliseconds does it take to put the heart in fibrilation?
I'll tell you, it takes less than 8 mS of 30 mA current through the chest.
Think you can "jerk-back" that quick? The reason *static* electricity doesn't
fry you or fibrilate the heart is that the capacitance on which it is stored
holds insufficient coulombs to supply enough current. That 200 amp service
entrance carrying 220 VAC *does* have sufficient current to fry you real good.


>But with respect to ...
>
>> Gary Coffman KE4ZV
>> Destructive Testing Systems
>
>... telling you this is like carrying wood into the forest.
>
>In destructive testing, you should encountered the effect of time on
>overloading a system... Neither 110V nor 220V are harmless, but when
>factoring in the jerkback reflex, 220 Volts is less harmful. If it were
>different, I would not be around anymore to tell.

Uh, huh. Just keep trusting to "jerkback". You may find out who the
real jerk is when they scrape your steaming remains off the branch
feeder. I watched two people *die* because of that jerk response.
If you avoid piercing the skin, a brushing contact with either 110
or 220 is rarely more than a painful nuisance, but if you jerk and
pierce the skin on the conductor, goodbye Charley. The skin blisters
and ruptures like an over-cooked hot dog, and the body *steams*.
It isn't a pleasant sight.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 28 Dec 96 22:55:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: 147.360 machine in Manhat
Lines: 15


R>Does anyone here know what has been happening to the 7.360 machine in
 >Manhattan? for the past month or so, it's been getting a lot of
 >Intentional qrm from a guy we have unofically dubbed "Netkiller", but I
 >wouldn't think that such activity would cause a repeatear to die, would
 >it? Anyhow, any info on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

That machine has been jammed for years as all the NYC repeaters on 2
meters.  Get on 220 and you'll see a new world of ham radio.  MAARC has
a machine on 220 at the same location on 223.940.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 28 Dec 96 22:55:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: THE FINAL WORD
Lines: 13


R>Actually pro-coders are dinosaurs that still support big government
 >regulation of a hobby.

Yup and we'll be around for another 50 years or so (I'm 38.)  Maybe when
you get to 60 the code will be dropped.  Hang in there, see if you can
outlive us.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]


--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 28 Dec 1996 23:21:36 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>Empire that's a living testimonial to the above.  I stopped monitoring
>it a few months ago, because there is a handful of hams who are on there
>*constantly* at various times of the day.  They hold lengthy conversations
>on the repeater, and it's obvious that they are communicating from
>fixed-station to fixed-station.  You'd think that they never heard of

Honestly, it doesn't bother me if people blab on the repeaters all day.
I think long, drawn-out, incoherent vaguely technical technical discussions
are pretty much the staple of ham radio.  It doesn't do anyone any good, I
think, to have repeaters that sit on empty channels and ID every 10 minutes.
I wanna' hear talking.

I think the problem is jammers.  (When communications all go to SS, jamming is
going to be trickier-- though same goes for tracking down people using
spectrum without permission.)

You know, I think I'm figuring out something.  Last time HF was really, really
,
dead then I heard more people talking on VHF.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-8.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 23:48:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster> <01bbf4f9$aeb74120$72070ccf@jim-reid-1>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga7-21.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 28  5:50:21 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201

On 28 Dec 1996 19:59:51 GMT, "Jim Reid" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>
>
>><>  N8LDY  <>< <[e-mail]> wrote in article
><01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>...
>>
>> A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
>> One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
>> except in times of emergency... *Endorsements* are grandfathered
>> to all who have passed cw testing in the past and can be obtained
>> by passing code tests in the future. In this way we can perserve and
>> recognize the *skill* of cw and reward those who use it without
>> mandating it's use by others......
>
>An excellent suggestion.  I proposed many months ago Endorsements
>for all HF operations including SSB,  Digital,  and CW.  The endorsement
>earned the privilege of mode and band segment usage.

Carl said I was pandering for presenting a similar idea. It seems that
the no-code element wants full HF privileges and spectrum, a no-code
extra. Endorsements just promote the caste system, whether it is
today's "olde phartz" versus the no-code techs or it is the B/MSEE
no-code extra distaining the ones who have made this hobby so
desirable today.

Save your breath, no-code has a long way to go before it becomes a
reality. After that do not hold your breath waiting for the no-code
led "Technological Revolution". All the no-code yackers and contesters
will be "olde phartz", firmly against giving up part or most of
_THEIR_  HF spectrum for the alleged advancement of technology.

>
>However,  the suggestion was bombarded with comments about its
>complications,  the necessary examination of technical information
>would require elaborate new test questions, enforcement would be
>hard,  etc.,  etc., etc.......  And the thread died.
>
>Hope yours obtains a better response.
If the thread degenerates into all no-code versus whatever Carl and
Lenny will wear it out...
>
>73,  Jim,  KH7M
73 de n4jvp
Fritz
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 23:50:50 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3huj$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga7-21.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 28  5:52:31 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201

On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:27:22 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>>One of the reasons why code is still should, in my opinion, be kept is
>>that it is a learning tool for beginning amateurs.  Many of the longer
>>time amateur got their basic training in cw.  cw allows you to make
>>your early mistakes one-on-one rather than on a voice repeater for
>>everyone to listen to.
>>Larry
>
>I appreciate the learning aspect and don't deny the code's merit as a
>form of communication. But if you make a mistake with code while OTA
>people would hear it same as on a repeater or simplex.
>

And a helpful suggeston on CW doesn't start a flame war unlike the
world of VHF+ FM or usenet.

73 de n4jvp
Fritz
To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Frequency Grease
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 16:14:04 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nyc-ny47-09.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Yes... Iv'e heard of it, too..it's right on the shelf next to
the hamdingers and the snipes...
                           Dave/KB2ZYO


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Rick Buchholtz)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: test
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 00:22:32 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <5a4dmm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cust60.max4.kansas-city.mo.ms.uu.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99b.112

test



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:44 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 00:25:59 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ij1$[e-mail]> <5a47gp$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44863 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121991

On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 12:18:22 GMT, [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>
>>Like a freind of mine says, I will probably learn code and be a beeper
>>one day when it is no longer required.
>
>Uh huh. Where have we heard that line before ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>

The check is in the mail.
Sure I'll respect you and all the other pro/no coders in the morning.
I won't *** in your mouth until I have to!



To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: "R.E. Dodson" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WTB NMO type magnetic antenna mount
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 18:39:28 -0600
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.1.184
Mime-Version: 1.0
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------------28C668BA45112
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Looking for a magnetic NMO type antenna mount for use on 2m/70cm. Send
details to [e-mail]     Thnx  WB5APD  Bob

------------28C668BA45112
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

<HTML><BODY>

<DT>Looking for a magnetic NMO type antenna mount for use on 2m/70cm. Send
details to [e-mail]     Thnx
WB5APD  Bob  </DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
------------28C668BA45112--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:46 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 01:03:04 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hd62-202.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

i think someone is pulling your leg.
Larry



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:47 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 01:03:36 GMT
Organization: BL Enterprises
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <5a4fs7$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <5a3ieh$[e-mail]> <5a47k0$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44871 rec.radio.amateur.misc:121994

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>Why is it that some people automatically ASSume that every tech
>>memorized the question pool and seems incapable of having studied the
>>theory and data needed to pass?

>Because we know that most extras memorized the question pool. Why
>should techs be any different ?

Once again, Jim and (whoever else constitutes the we) know with
complete certainty that "most extras memorized the question pool."
Jim's comment again stems from the need to portray all
those opposed to CW testing as being of little worth (IMHO).
The effort to stereotype is unending on Jim's part it seems.


Bill Sohl (Amateur Radio Operator K2UNK)
Internet Instructor, Mount Olive (NJ) Community School



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!208.195.156.10!news.walltech.com!hsnx.wco.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack ..
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 01:13:29 GMT
Organization: Myne
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a413u$[e-mail]> <5a4cg7$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans73.wco.com
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I was watching a droid give a demo of one of their computers.. You
should have seen him.. I was mumbling the answers to myself when he
was sitting there for 20 minutes going "uhh.. I believe so." Questions
to make a sales droid nuts:

Is the monitor interlaced or non-interlaced?
Is the memory 30 or 72 pin simms?
Is the board EISA or VESA?
Does the serial card have 16550 or 8550?
Is the hard drive IDE or SCSI?

These questions are "DUH" to us but just watch the RatShack people go
crazy when you ask em!

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>Yes, Deja Vu Archives do.  We beat Radio Shack to death about 3 months ago,
>so there should be enuff there to keep you busy for a week.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!torn!news1.bellglobal.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 01:31:16 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <5a4hg4$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59rkol$[e-mail]> <59vb96$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fsi$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan4.planet.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122022 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44886 rec.radio.shortwave:91400

Rob Lilley <[e-mail]> wrote:



>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996, Bill Sohl wrote:

>> Rob Lilley <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>> >This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of

>> >effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
>> >well under conditions adverse to complex systems.  Those who *master*
>> >radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.
>>
>> WHY?
>>
>> What is it that makes the person who knows Morse a better
>> radio communicator than someone who doesn't?

>An individual can be a poor communicator no matter what extent his or her
>knowledge base is.  Morse will not make a individual a 'better'
>communicator, just a more versatile one.

Assuming that the CW is a needed addition to one's versatility.
We'll obviusly disagree on hat I suspect.

>> What VALUE does it provide to those that know it versus those that
>> don't...as measured in terms that are quantifiable or necessary
>> in order to be an effective radio communicator?

>Those who know CW have the option to use it and demonstate discipline
>and commitment to the service by learning it.

That can be done WITHOUT any need for mandatory CW
testing.  If your opinion of being a good ham includes
CW knowledge, that's fine...but the testing of CW just
to demonstrate discipline and commitment
is not the role or responsibility of government
testing.

>> Having a working knowledge means what?  1 wpm, 10, 13, 20???

>Your second phrase suggests a progression.  Working knowledge
>has a different meaning to a novice than it does an expert.

You didn't answer the question.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](BAYCITVIDGRP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 29 Dec 1996 01:35:15 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <5a4hsj$[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ala-ca18-05.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 28  5:35:15 PM PST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122020 rec.radio.scanner:74351

In <[e-mail]> John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
writes:
>
>Eric Oyen wrote:
>
>> I have come to the conclusion that arguing with you is a lot like
>> shoveling manuer. It leaves me with a bad smell and an even worse
>
>I have no experience at shoveling manuer so I will rely on your
>expertise
>in that area.
>
>
>> I have a life, which is more than I can say for you.
>
>You fooled us.
>
>
>> As my parting shot: Why don't you use the "REAL" facts, instead of
what
>> you want others to see (and tell your followers te same thing,
john).
>
>I did use the real facts, that is when you suddenly decided to close
the
>discussion as indicated below.  I brought my facts from Dejanews & you
>claimed the data from Dejanews was in error.  I asked you to present
>facts to show the Dejanews errors & you did nothing.
>
>
>> This discussion is now closed.
>
>Thank you Eric, you have been very entertaining.

    Mackey...the spigot of much lackey
     Mackey...the runt end of fornication
    Mackey...the anal abutment one finds odiferous
     Mackey...the aberrant-figment of imagings
    Mackey...the colossal and miniscule pimple on a ant's back
     Mackey...he's that cretin we throw peanuts at
    Mackey...the Monster Mash of nuttin but his butt in mouth

    pretend I did not write this....

    b.c.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!visi.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Ron Harshbarger)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.shortwave,sci.electronics.equipment,sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics.repair
Subject: Anyone have the complete TRS (Transistor Radio Series) from Sam's
Date: 29 Dec 1996 01:43:13 GMT
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <5a4ibh$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-118.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (x86 32bit)
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I've been trying for a couple of years to find the Sam's datasheet for a 1960s

vintage GE radio (no numbers). If you have the TRS for the 1960 radios, I can
send you a jpeg (or Giff) of the radio if you will please try to identify it.
I
know it is not worth the effort but it's a sentimental thing!

Cheers
--
Ron Harshbarger
K3PID
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 02:11:52 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <5a4k2r$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: i503.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"><>  N8LDY  <><" <[e-mail]> shared these priceless pearls of
wisdom:

->Proposal # 1766

->A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
->One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
->except in times of emergency...


AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAmen

Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!EU.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.intersource.com!news
From: "Ray Hodgkiss, N9YNG" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: OOPS!!! Im a TECH-PLUS!!
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 21:19:29 -0500
Organization: InterSource, Bloomington, IN
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cyclom1-21.kiva.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Er....

not that it matters to my point, but I made a mistake in the last post!!

Im a tech-plus.  But I guess that should have been somewhat suspect when
I said I was a no-code tech who could copy 10wpm.  ;)

My bad!

Ray, N9YNG


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](William M. Pasternak)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 02:35:12 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5a4ld0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <5a3jn1$[e-mail]> <5a4cfp$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: scr-ca4-06.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 28  8:35:12 PM CST 1996

In <5a4cfp$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:
>
>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>
>>I wonder how many lives were lost because of the CW requirement?
>
>That's an interesting question, Eric.  I wonder how we could figure
out
>how many people died trying to learn CW ?  Or were you referring to
those who
>died of a broken heart because they couldn't learn CW ?
>
>73, Jim KH2D
>
>
>

Why does it seem apropos to ask:  "...where is Wayne Green of 73 -- the
no-code crusader -- at a time -- and place -- like this????"

Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
Newsline On-Line



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Mark Taylor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Wanted: TM-V7A Mod
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 21:54:33 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf2eb$c25fdf80$0a66f0c6@general>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spg-as23s47.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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I would be very interested to know what the extended recieve is. anyone
know?
--
We laugh at honor, and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.
C.S. Lewis

They that can give up an essential liberty to purchase a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.   Ben Franklin



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!gatech!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (R. Dale Piedfort)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: DXER.COM is back online
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 02:55:36 GMT
Organization: A customer of Pacific Bell Internet Services
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-220-142.anhm01.pacbell.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

"WE'RE BACK", "DXER.COM" "Your Ham Radio Resource Site"
is back on line and ready to provide you with the most
comprehensive ham radio related site on the Internet...

Stop by and check it out..29 indexes.  Everything from
DX Clubs, EME, Packet Radio, Scanners, Shortwave, QRP,
Maritime, Callbooks, Contest Calendars, Software, Clusters.
Radio Modifications, Sarex, Mir, MARS and many others.
Many more links have been added and we are now approaching
500 links, with more to come...

In addition to the interactive BBS, we will be adding in
the near future a Ham E-Mail Callbook...

Stop on by "http://www.dxer.com" and let us know what you
think, and what you would like to see added to the ever
growing list of links..



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.245.3.50!news.primenet.com!dad
From: [e-mail] (M. Monninger)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: 1928 test? (was Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!)
Date: 28 Dec 1996 20:09:04 -0700
Organization: None
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a4ncg$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <5979eq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Posted-By: @206.165.20.212 (markem)
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122032 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44896 rec.radio.shortwave:91410

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (L. M. Picard
) wrote:
> ...
>I think that this is as close to the truth as we're going to get.
>If the ham test were going to be relevant to our times, evaluation of
>keyboard skills or of basic computer programming and/or computer
>upgrading etc. would be far more relevant. I would wonder how many
>accomplished "fists" are competent behind a keyboard.

Why would keyboard skills be more relevant? Or programming skills? How many
hams use keyboards in their operations? How many hams need to program
computers to support their operations? All this alleged importance of computer

skills in ham radio is a lot of crap. Only a tiny fraction of hams use
computers for their ham operations. If you need the skill to support your
interest, you'll develop it, whether it be CW, keyboard, programming, or
whatever...


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:58 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.pond.com!kd3bj!kd3bj.ampr.org!robert
From: [e-mail] (Robert E. Garland)
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Sender: [e-mail] (news)
Organization: The KD3BJ Usenet BBS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59jlen$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59p8nl$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a07qq$[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: jupiter.jtan.com
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 03:26:57 GMT
Lines: 34

[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) writes:

>David A. Cooley ([e-mail]) wrote:

>: If the Amateurs keep up making themselves look bad by insulting everyone
>: that doesn't have their level of skill, then I'll be damned if I'll have
>: any part of the Ham bands either.

>A sage comment, Dave.  The same applies to those that insult others that
>either have skills they cannot gain, or do not feel are "necessary". The
>first example that comes to mind are those that call those who support
>code testing "beepers", and other such insults.

>Hams need cohesiveness in their ranks - not hotheads dividing the group
>into "us" and "them" segments.

>Bill


Hmm...

Maybe we can use these supposedly derogative terms usefully.  Remember,
the term "ham" was once a derogative term, and we accept it proudly.  In
boating there are the "stink pot" sailors and the "rag" sailors, and in a
sufficient number of cases, they get along just fine.  Each recognizes
the preference of the other, and the put-downs are in good humor.  Think
we can try that on this newsgroup?  Or are we hopelessly adolescent here?


--
     Robert Garland                            NX3S @ N3ACL.PA.USA.NOAM
     Hilltown Township Bucks County               [e-mail]
     Pennsylvania USA                                       Grid FN20ii
                         "Ham Radio is a calling"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:53:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!posts.execpc.com!usenet
From: Chuck Hallett W7LDS <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Merge Newsgroups Policy and Misc.
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 22:07:50 -0600
Organization: Exec-PC BBS Internet - Milwaukee, WI
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nerf-herder.execpc.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

I propose rec.radio.amateur.misc and rec.radio.amateur.policy be merged
into one group since they have all the same posts anyway.  Recommend
calling it rec.radio.amateur.QRM

Chuck W7LDS


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 04:10:48 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5a5vam$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <5a3ieh$[e-mail]> <5a47k0$[e-mail]> <5a4fs7$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44926 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122109

[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>Why is it that some people automatically ASSume that every tech
>>>memorized the question pool and seems incapable of having studied the
>>>theory and data needed to pass?

>>Because we know that most extras memorized the question pool. Why
>>should techs be any different ?

>Once again, Jim and (whoever else constitutes the we) know with
>complete certainty that "most extras memorized the question pool."
>Jim's comment again stems from the need to portray all
>those opposed to CW testing as being of little worth (IMHO).
>The effort to stereotype is unending on Jim's part it seems.

You must be having a bad hair day Bill.  Since when do most extras
oppose CW testing ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:01 1997
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From: "John Hughes" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: 35% of the curriculum?
Date: 29 Dec 1996 04:25:13 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <01bbf540$5913c300$844692cf@john>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]> <58sbd8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.70.132
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122045 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44897

A CW exam takes approximately 5 minutes to complete.  Theory exams require
much greater amounts of time to complete.  I don't know how important it is
to quantify this, but its weight and relative position depends on how u
choose to look at it.



Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote in article .
>
> 3 of the 8 exam elements are Morse receiving tests. That's 37.5% of
> testing devoted to a single thing. And 5 of the 6 amateur license
> classes require passing one or more of those elements. That's 83%.
> And that 83% gets privileges unrelated to Morse for passing Morse
> tests. Clearly, Morse tests hold a disproportionate position in
> amateur licensing.
>



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](michael silva)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: 29 Dec 1996 04:32:36 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a4s94$[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: val-ca3-12.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Dec 28  8:32:36 PM PST 1996

In <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Ben) writes:
>
>I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
>timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
>and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
>pruning!

So THAT'S what you do with it!  I've been using it to fill those nasty
air gaps in my variable capacitors (due to sloppy manufacturing, I
assume), but all that happened was that I had to put vice grips on all
my tuning shafts.  Thanks for the tip...

73,
Mike, KK6GM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!news2.digex.net!cps
From: [e-mail] (Chris Smolinski)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.shortwave,comp.sys.mac.scitech
Subject: Macintosh Morse Code Decoding Software - ANNOUNCEMENT
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 00:21:44 -0500
Organization: DIGEX
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bab00110.slip.digex.net
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122016 rec.radio.shortwave:91392 comp.sys.mac.scitech:10387

Discouraged by the lack of CW/RTTY/FAX decoding software for the Mac, I've
decided to write my own. It presently only decodes CW, hence the name -
Mac Morse Decoder.

It's very preliminary right now, and best of all, it's freeware. I'd like
people to take a look at it and offer suggestions, and to test
compatability across the various Macintosh model lines. Bare in mind
though, it is *very preliminary* right now, I'm calling it version 0.1B.

If you'd like to get a copy, cruise on over to the following URL:
http://www.access.digex.net/~cps/sss14.html

Thanks,

Chris

--
Check out my web pages for radio (pirate, spy numbers) and Mac software.
http://www.access.digex.net/~cps


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.3lefties.com!usenet
From: "Earl Needham" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Kenwood TM-401B below 440 MHz?
Date: 29 Dec 1996 05:22:07 GMT
Organization: INET of New Mexico
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <01bbf548$3ad971c0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: "Earl Needham" <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts3-port02.3lefties.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45346 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122048 rec.radio.amateur.space:9242


        Having recently discovered FM activity through sattelites, I'd like to try
my hand at getting through the FM repeater on the Mir space station.
Unfortunately, my UHF rig (a Kenwood TM-401B) only covers 440-450 MHz.  Is
there a mod available to allow this rig to operate below 440 MHz?
        BTW -- the Japanese TM-401 apparently oerated from 430-450 MHz, judging by
some of the Japanese WWW pages.

        Thanks for any help
        Earl Needham, KD5XB
        [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!metro.atlanta.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 00:22:52 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <5a4v7c$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Here in the 9th largest metropolitan area in the US we don't have
>the kinds of problems on VHF or UHF that you and your HF buddies
>complain about either. Our repeaters are open, our operators polite,
>and by and large the discussions are interesting. But we certainly i
>hear a lot of bigoted and ignorant behavior on HF. Could it be you
>and your buddies? Judging from your remarks here, could be.

I dunno Gary, ever hear my callsign used on one of those "bigoted and
ignorant" hams you hear on HF? Maybe that would answer your question
for you.

By the by, have you stopped beating your wife? Judging from your
remarks here, guess not.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!info.ucla.edu!psgrain!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.bright.net!news
From: "Ray W. Massey" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Experiences with 'CODE QUICK'??
Date: 29 Dec 1996 05:42:06 GMT
Organization: Massey Family
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <01bbf54a$b83533a0$429ed4cd@r-massey>
NNTP-Posting-Host: nbre1-cs-1.dial.bright.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I am interested in anyone's experience with a Morse code training aid named
"Code Quick", by Wheeler Applied Research.  The product's advertising
insists that these tapes are a good way to increase your code speed.  What
do *you* think??  Thanks in advance.
----------
73
Ray N8XVG


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!nntp.crl.com!news.pbi.net!news.pacbell.net!usenet
From: Lyle Jenson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Info / MODS for Standard C568 Radio
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 21:45:01 -0800
Organization: A customer of Pacific Bell Internet Services
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-26-202.sntc01.pacbell.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----------5306609D757E0"
X-Sender: Lyle Jenson <[e-mail]> (Unverified)
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b1 (WinNT; I)
X-Priority: Normal


------------5306609D757E0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Does Anyone have a URL, Mod, or any information on the Standard C568A
Radio (tri-Bander).  Any help via E-Mail Would Greatly Be
Appreciated...!

Thanks
73's
Lyle

[e-mail]

------------5306609D757E0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

<HTML><BODY>

<DT>Does Anyone have a URL, Mod, or any information on the Standard C568A
Radio (tri-Bander).  Any help via E-Mail Would Greatly Be Appreciated...!
</DT>

<DT> </DT>

<DT>Thanks</DT>

<DT>73's</DT>

<DT>Lyle</DT>

<DT> </DT>

<DT>[e-mail] </DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
------------5306609D757E0--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: Douglas Gavilanes <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 22:25:16 -0800
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a4o9u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max8-gg-ca-29.earthlink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U; 16bit)
CC: [e-mail]

Ben wrote:
>
> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> pruning!
>
> Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>
> Ben

I understand that it was introduced in the early '40s and taken off of
the market recently, because of two problems people were having with it:

1. The grease was fine but people were using it too generously.  This
enticed certain operators to run excessive RF through the antenna.  The
grease would melt and drip down the coax, causing the antenna to resonate
at all of the harmonic spurs the transmitter was emitting, all the way
down into the LF spectrum (depending on the length of the station's coax
run).  The military found the situation amusing (Japanese subs were
running aground due to the navigational interference from ham
stations...) until recently, when the grease on the Flying White House's
antennae generated thousands of complaints from Riverside and San
Bernardino County residents who reported that their garage doors were
opening and closing unpredictably every time Air Force One came to town.

2. About that same time, one unscrupulous amateur radio equipment
manufacturer built a 50cc vial of the stuff into their line of antenna
tuners.  They enjoyed great success inspired by their "great performance"
until one day that one of their units blew up on the ham bench of an
Arizona statesman and amateur, soaking his midsection and pants.  For the
next three weeks, any time a high-powered CBer would drive down the
street modulating, his undershorts would begin to smoulder.  Needless to
say, this caused a congressional investigation that resulted in the
almost complete ban of the manufacture for sale of this product in the
U.S.  It is still manufactured for sale to third-world countries only as
disk brake anti-squeal for military vehicles and aircraft, and as a
high-protein nutritional supplement to China.

I guess that if they ever get out of line, all we have to do is point our
beams that direction, and call "CQ, CQ".

Hope that helps...

Doug Gavilanes, N6XQY
Garden Grove, California

73s es Happy New Year to All!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: "David Little" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Icom IC 2ia  Mods?
Date: 29 Dec 1996 07:07:45 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <01bbf556$a26a7920$34b0aec7@node2>
References: <01bbf49a$06ec21e0$63deaec7@node2> <5a3ek9$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dd19-052.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45341 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122040



> Yes there is a out of band mod. Like many Icoms it involves removing
> one diode and installing another. All this stuff is tiny and surface
> mount it is not for the faint of heart. I don't have the details at
> hand but could find them. Advice; if you are not a surface mount Tech
> with a lab to work in have it done by someone who has done it before.
> I have done it before and let a friend who does this kind of work every
> day do it for me.
>
>                             73 Jerry
>
Jerry,
       Thanks for confirming my suspicion...  I am looking at the extra smt

diode that I got from Icom when I did the mod to my IC2SAT back around '93
I believe.  Well, got the parts, got the gear, just gotta get the location.
 Thanks
again for the pointers.

73

--
David or Glynda Little - Brunswick, GA



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code
Date: 29 Dec 96 08:01:51 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Jim Weir said "Setting any level (of code speed) seems to me to be
arbitrary, whimsical, and capricious..."

Take a look through the early books on wireless to see why the code speed
was raised from 5wpm to 10 (then higher). Studying the history of
radio, and in particular, amateur radio, will answer many of your questions.
(The 1912 Radio Act of Congress dictated that an amateur [defined as some-
one who operates a radio station for pleasure] needed to know code "at
a speed of at least 5wpm.")

Weir: "... but then again, I live 3000 miles from Oldington by choice."

What an unusual statement. You let the QTH of the ARRL dictate where you
live? Regardless, you error in believing that the ARRL sets regulatory
communications policy.

Weir:  "If you are real about..."    It's a common error to substitute
the word `real' in place of `serious.'

Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (W8PU)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Stupid repeater tricks (dayton's 5.11)
Date: 29 Dec 1996 08:16:52 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbefba$0ddd8f00$51f267ce@p959>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Randy I avoid repeaters....I have been a ham for about 21 years now and as
with 75 meters I have noticed a decline in " acceptable " conduct. I was
even a member of 5.11 some years ago. I dont believe most of us will have
much at all to do with the hobby in future years as its getting to sound
too much like CB and worse.  Frequency wars and personal threts have no
place on the air. The code will eventually go by the way side and make hf
privilages easier which will increase numbers even more and add a few more
bad apples. I somtimes think it is just human nature to act like an child
when you get a mic in your hands. I spend more time on simplex and 2 and 6
ssb anymore and wonder what I will do for a hobby 30 years from now if
there is no more ham radio. It will just take someone interested in the
spectrum and it will be auctioned off for commercial use. Like code ham
radio no longer has a purpose, its just a hobby like CB, not a right. Just
my oppinion, I dont expect you to agree, but they could shut down all of 2
meters and I certainly wouldnt care...73 de Gary W8PU


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!newstf02.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (W8PU)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 08:27:02 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

This code thing is only about one thing. It got nothing to do with being
outdated, or old dinosaurs. Its about getting HF priviledges for just
memmorizing a bunch of questions. These guys dont know there ass from a
hole in the ground when it comes to electronics, they just a license as
easily as they can get it. Its obvious. The no code hams have flooded the
repeaters and now are stuck there. Get rid of the code so they can move on
with little effort. Hell lets have Walmart hand them out! Stop your damn
whining. rogie!!

 73 de Gary W8PU.
ps I like code, I wish I was better at it, there is less shit to put up
with there!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!128.250.1.21!munnari.OZ.AU!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: code
Date: 29 Dec 96 08:39:17 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Eric KC5??? wrote: " I wonder how many lives will be lost because of the
code requirement?"

One could go further and boldly ask "I wonder how many will be lost
due to the written exams?"  Just think, if we did away with all exams
then everyone could get on the rptrs and no lives would be lost at
all, correct Eric?

Eric: "I wonder how many have been saved by no-code techs?"

Do you seriously think that only techs monitor rptrs, or that
Generals and above ignore calls for help? Hams (coded, at that!)
have been saving lives via radio since the creation of wireless.
Don't you dare believe that assisting people in need is a recent
invention. Every year since radio came into being  contains cases
of amateurs performing local, regional, state-wide, and interstate
emergency work. My earliest records show that in 1913 amateurs
bridged the communications gap from a severe storm in the Mid-West
that cut off all other forms of comms. How about the tropical storm
that hit TX in 1919 and again, amateurs provided the only comms
available to that region? Pick a year: '21, '22, '23, et cetera,
and I'll give you an example of coded amateurs saving lives.
The FCC was so impressed with their amateur radio operators that
in 1933 they passed the following message to the ARRL (even then,
the FCC used the ARRL to disseminate any and all amateur-related
rulings and notices):

March 18, 1933
The ARRL

Dear Sirs:
   The Commission takes pleasure in informing you that it has received
information commending the amateurs of Southern California for the splendid
work done by them in handling communications in the recent earthquate
area.
   The names ofthe individual licensees who cooperated in the work are
not known to the Commission. However, it is known that amateurs have always
rendered every possible assistance during times of such emergencies, and
it is hardly necessary to add that the Commission believes such service
to be of the highest order of importance.
   It will be appreciated if you will express through the medium of the
ARRL the Commission's appreciation of the prompt and efficient action
which was taken by amateur licensees in bringing aid to the stricken area.
   Very truly yours, Harold A. LaFount, Acting Chairman


So you see, Eric, hams have been saving lives long before the creation
of the no-code technician license.

73,
Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Retirees and ham radio
Date: 29 Dec 96 09:00:10 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Roger Buffington said: "The odd thing about it is that I don't remember
it as being nearly this bad back in the late 60s."

Well Roger, peruse the monthly Silent Keys column in the QSTs of that
era and you'll see the passing of many many OT hams each month. You're
just passing gas in your futile attempt to create some connection between
the code tests and age.

PU.

Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-feed.inet.tele.dk!news.nacamar.de!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com!not-for-mail
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 03:41:04 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: FS:  Uniden UHF repeater/duplexer
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Sun Dec 29 09:24:30 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 205.148.253.2 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.02 (Win95; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 18

Hi,

I have a Uniden ARU 251 commercial UHF repeater for sale.  This
is a 25 watt repeater currently crystaled on 444.900Mhz.
I also have a sinclair 6 cavity duplexer, and a Mirage B3016
100 watt amp for sale.  I would like to sell all for $600.

I would consider a swap towards an Optoelectronics Xplorer, or
an Alinco DX-70.

I may be contacted between 9am and 8pm central time at:

715-445-3282

Thanks,
Glenn
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: 1928 test? (was Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!)
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 04:59:12 -0500
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <595ndm$[e-mail]> <5979eq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4ncg$[e-mail]>
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M. Monninger wrote:
>
> Why would keyboard skills be more relevant? Or programming skills? How many
> hams use keyboards in their operations?

All of us who do digital modes, for starters.

Anyone who competes in contests.

Anyone who simply wants to keep a good, and accessible, log.

How many hams need to program
> computers to support their operations?

All of us who digital operations.
All of us who compete in contests.
All of us who want to keep good and accessible logs.

All this alleged importance of computer
> skills in ham radio is a lot of crap. Only a tiny fraction of hams use
> computers for their ham operations. If you need the skill to support your
> interest, you'll develop it, whether it be CW, keyboard, programming, or
> whatever...

OK, fine.  So why have a cw requirement but not testing on computer
ability?  Computer skills are useful for hams regardless of mode.  CW is
irrelevant for any mode but CW.  CW is strictly recreational in nature;
it is not a practical way to transmit information, and in fact almost
exactly zero information that is non-recreational in nature is ever
transmitted via morse code.  Morse has been abandoned by the military,
banned by MARS, and is not used by ships or the US Coast Guard.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 05:03:28 -0500
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Michael P. Deignan wrote:
>
> You two must be lucky to live in areas so clean. Unfortunately, my
> area isn't, and a lot of other hams that I talk to on HF indicate
> the VHF problems on the local "2 meter good-buddy boxes" are just
> as bad.

I've travelled all over the country on business, always with my HT.  I
don't think that no-code techs operate any differently that hams who
have passed a CW test.  The notion that all the jammers, etc. who can be
found on VHF are no-code techs is so much baloney.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.89.123.24!nntp.inet.fi!news.funet.fi!news.cs.hut.fi!news.clinet.fi!usenet
From: Dave Heil <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:09:19 +0000
Organization: Clinet, Espoo, Finland.
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]>
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Drew Durigan wrote:

> Actually, the correct term here is "YE OLDE FAHRTZ."  That's right...
> those ancient operators who are attempting to keep their little hazing
> requirements intact for their private HF club into the 21st century.  If
> their outdated way of thinking prevails, we'll most certainly lose lots
> of allocations to commercial interests.  But hey, they don't care...
> they'll have gone to that great brass key in the sky by then.  It's the
> rest of us who will be the unfortunate victims of their stubborn refusal
> to modernize and expand our hobby.
>
> -Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>  KF4DDM

Drew,
Still at it, I see.  They're not, apparently for you, "little" hazing
requirements.  They seem to stick in your craw.  By the way, you can join
my private HF club.  Simply upgrade.

The commercial interests have little interest in HF these days, or hadn't
you noticed?

What is thing you have against anyone who has been breathing longer than
you have.  Is Florida THAT crowded?

Dave OH2/K8MN


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 05:14:48 -0500
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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W8PU wrote:
>
>Hell lets have Walmart hand them out! Stop your damn
> whining. rogie!!
>
>  73 de Gary W8PU.
> ps I like code, I wish I was better at it, there is less shit to put up
> with there!

It was pretty hard to decipher what you were trying to say, Gary.  Your
writing skills are so poor that your ideas are hard to pick out of the
mush.  But I'll try to believe that your post did contain some ideas,
and address them systematically.  (I apologise if I use too many long
words for you).

1.  If I'm whining about the CW requirement, it isn't for myself.  I
have an Extra Class ticket, and have had for years.  And for the record,
I'm quite proficient at Morse Code to this day.

2.  I and others have given sound reasons why we think a Morse Code
requirement is detrimental to the hobby.  All you've done is whine that
it was required back in the old days (when you were walking 5 miles to
school in the driven snow no doubt) and therefore should be required
now.  What is the logic in that?  Morse might have been relevant back
then.  But times change, and so must ham radio, if it is to survive.

3.  So far ham radio is NOT surviving very well.  Our numbers are
dwindling, and with it the future of our hobby.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 05:21:17 -0500
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Jim Lowman wrote:
>
>
> ARRL got approximately 6% response rate, based on 10,000 surveys returned
> out of 170,000 members.  OK, statisticians, what's the average rate of
> return on surveys, any survey, taken these days?  I'd bet that it's pretty
> small.

And my point is, that is the classic definition of a self-selected
poll.  Who the hell has the time to read and respond to this kind of
poll?  I'm an ARRL member, and I don't even remember receiving it.  The
point is that the 6% who DID respond cannot be assumed as representing a
random slice of the League's membership, let alone all hams, or all
Americans.

Now, mind you, I'm not bashing the League.  I think that they meant to
do the right thing.  But this poll, despite what Mike Deignan wants to
believe, and clings to believing, was a self-selected poll, and such
polls are not valid.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.174.65.41!01-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!02-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!newsfeed.de.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 05:27:47 -0500
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-122.ca.us.ibm.net
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

Jim Kehler wrote:
>
>
> So, in my opinion, you don't find a lot of young hams on HF for the same rea
son
> you don't find a lot of 20 year olds driving Lincoln Towncars.  Money.  So n
ow I
> guess someone will come along and say we should keep the CW requirement and
> legislate the prices of HF gear.....
>
> 73, Jim KH2D
> Lorton Reform School, Class of '64

Well, I disagree.  Ham gear in real dollars is far cheaper than it was
when I was a kid.  The thousand dollar prices you reference are
completely bogus because that is the price for new stuff.  Sure, younger
hams usually get used gear.  And used gear is very cheap, just listen on
the swapnets.

It is Morse Code that deters new hams, not the price of ham gear.  These
no-code techs seem to have the dough for $500 HTs and mobile VHF rigs.
These are more expensive than say, a used Kenwood 940, which is wildly
better than what I used as a teenager.
--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:24 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.174.65.41!01-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!02-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!newsfeed.de.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 05:29:17 -0500
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ki1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Dick Flanagan wrote:
>
> In article <5a3ki1$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote
:
>
> >Yup BINGO says it all :)
>
> "Nonsense" does, too.
> --
> Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada

Actually, Dick, your callsign says it all, too.  :)

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!news9.agis.net!agis!newspeer1.agis.net!agis!atmnet.net!usenet
From: "Lorenzo & Katrina Baldwin" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Pro & Cons on Cordless Telephone Headsets????
Date: 29 Dec 1996 11:01:43 GMT
Organization: Preferred Company
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <01bbf576$b2ead0e0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.67.190.117
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33343 rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:1344 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20931 rec.radio.amateur.dx:1713 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45364 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22551 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122064 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44908 rec.radio.amateur.space:9247

Hello everyone....I hate to intrude but I'm doing some research on the
cordless telephone headset.  Would you all please take a moment and reply
with some pros and cons on cordless telephone headset?

Thanks,
L & K


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.telstra.net!nsw1.news.telstra.net!news02.magna.com.au!news.magna.com.au!trash
From: [e-mail] (Trash)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: www.hamradio-online.com: How Your Government Can Monitor Your Communications
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 96 11:07:13 GMT
Organization: Bastards Inc
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a5cfs$[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: trash.magna.com.au
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #2
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122079 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20934 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44912 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22553 rec.radio.scanner:74403 rec.radio.shortwave:91447 aus.radio.amateur.misc:1704 aus.radio.amateur.digital:316

In article <59pq6i$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (
Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>>With permission, we've reprinted a fascinating story from CovertAction
>>Quarterly, on worldwide government agencies ability to monitor your email,
> FAX,
>>computer and voice communications.
>
>Old news. Government agencies have had the capability for years.

  And they're still trying to work out what to do with it other than testing
it on 0055 numbers !!!


Ash



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 11:54:23 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

>: You two must be lucky to live in areas so clean. Unfortunately, my
>: area isn't, and a lot of other hams that I talk to on HF indicate
>: the VHF problems on the local "2 meter good-buddy boxes" are just
>: as bad.

I think it used to be worse here.  Though the Berkeley 145.29 repeater
just sends 73's and IDs nowadays. And that was the focii of jammer
attention.  Often, I suspect it's the old hams who jam when they
 hear something they don't like.  Just a suspicion though.   Some of
the jammers used to run the kind of power that you can't just buy at
Radio Shack.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 07:01:20 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv22.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...


> Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
> majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
> datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
> keep it held back.
> Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
> us?
>
>
Just out of curiousity, what high speed datamodes are (above 9600 baud)
available on AMATUER HF??  Most of the high speed datamodes (above 9600
baiud) are available on the VHF+ bands.  Bands which CW requirements are
needed to get a license.  So to answer your question with a question, how
have the coders held back the highspeed datamodes to noncoders, if in
fact, the true high speed datamodes are available to them already?
--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.ibm.net.il!news.biu.ac.il!news.huji.ac.il!cs!geoffm
From: [e-mail] (Geoffrey S. Mendelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Experiences with 'CODE QUICK'??
Date: 29 Dec 1996 12:03:34 GMT
Organization: The hebrew University of Jerusalem
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <5a5mmn$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf54a$b83533a0$429ed4cd@r-massey>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs4.cs.huji.ac.il
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Ray W. Massey ([e-mail]) wrote:
: I am interested in anyone's experience with a Morse code training aid named
: "Code Quick", by Wheeler Applied Research.  The product's advertising
: insists that these tapes are a good way to increase your code speed.  What
: do *you* think??  Thanks in advance.

The best money I ever spent on amateur radio, and probably the best
money I ever spent on anything. For 29 years I struggled to learn code,
never getting above 3 wpm. With code quick in 6 months passed 13wpm.

If I practice, I can copy at about 18wpm.

I even can copy higher at times. I heard a friend calling CQ at about 35 wpm,
and answered him at my top sending speed (about 10wpm)*. He was surprised,
but we had a nice QSO.


Geoff.


* my sendng speed is limited by the mechanics of my hand.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson  (4X/N3OWJ), Senior Programmer
Computer Science Institute, Hebrew University, Jerusalem, Israel
[e-mail] (02) 65 85692  Fax [phone]  MANGO 050-961-978.
To get pgp public key: "finger [e-mail]"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!masternews.telia.net!newssrv.ita.tip.net!devil.stm.it!news
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: .I'm finding 6.912 chrystals
Date: 29 Dec 1996 12:06:41 GMT
Organization: Agora' Telematica - Italian BBS and Internet Provider
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: agora.stm.it
Data: Sun Dec 29 12:56:18 1996


I'm finding 6.912 chrystals

Greetings All!
My friends, living in Paraguay, recently bought a HF Motorola SSB 100
and SSB 1180.
CONATEL (Phone Agency of Paraguay) assigned to them the frequency 6.912
My friends asked to me the favour to help them in finding 4 (four) crystals
for that frequency.
I DON'T UNDERSTAND ANYTHING ABOUT RX/TX, FREQUENCIES, ANTENNAS, ETC...
Let me know how I can help my friends and where I can find and buy 4 crystals
(6.912 MHz) for the above machines (HF Motorola SSB 100 and SSB 1180).
Next January 16th I'll leave to Paraguay and I would like to carry with me
the requested chrystals.

Can the Net help me?

Thanks and Happy Holidays!!!

Andrea Enea
Rome - Italy
[e-mail]

 --- MMMR v4.70reg





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.5.212.6!electriciti.com!news
From: Henry Eisenson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.radio.scanner,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Skip Arey's new book: RADIO MONITORING...
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 12:11:28 +0000
Organization: Introtech LLC
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: line01.cs1.electriciti.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC)
Xref: news1.epix.net alt.radio.scanner:43865 rec.radio.scanner:74536 rec.radio.amateur.dx:1727 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45469 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122228

Index Publishing Group (for which I've written a few things) has
released Skip Arey's brilliant new book:

                 RADIO MONITORING - The How-To Guide

Selected by the McGraw-Hill Electronics Book Club!

It's featured at
       <http://www.electriciti.com/~ipgbooks/bm.html>

I honestly believe this is the best and most comprehensive book in the
hobby today, and wish I'd written it!

**********************************************************************
Yup! -- I enthusiastically support Index, and any radio hobbyist with a
book project in mind should definitely propose it to the Publisher,
Linton Vandiver. Check "Information for Authors" at

       <http://www.electriciti.com/~ipgbooks/ifa.html>

Henry Eisenson
INTROTECH LLC
6336 Greenwich Drive
San Diego, CA 92122
[phone], fax [phone]




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Survey - Club Repeaters
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 07:21:14 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv22.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...


SplitRock Amateur Radio Club  25 years young in 1997


> Our club is looking for some insight as to how other clubs approach
> their repeater and its maintenance and development.
>
> 1.    Does your club involve its members in the maintenance and development
>       of your machine as a club activity or do you have a commercial radio servic
e
>       perform the maintenance?


Our repeater itself is serviced by a select group of members
(voluntarily), known as the technical committee.  Their job is to see
that the repeater is functioning properly and is kept running.

The antenna (due to it's location and height on a commercial tower 400'
above the gound) is serviced by the owner of the tower (a major
communications entity)

>
> 2.    Is your repeater accessible to members of your club or is it at
>       a shared site with limited access?

shared site, VERY limited access
>
> 3.    Does your club encourage members to be involved in repeater activities
>       or are these activities left to the seasoned pros, commercial or club membe
rs?


not sure what is meant.  If you are referring to..Field Day, community
activities (races, sporting events, etc), sponsoring hamfest, Adopt-A-
Hiway....very highly encouraged.  If you are referring to maintenance,
etc, we have a volunteer committee for that, but all members are
encouraged to help out if so desiring to do so

>
> Thanks in advance for your response.
>
> 73's,  Gary, W0AB
>

--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!newshost.comco.com!frankensun.altair.com!newsserver.pixel.kodak.com!news.kodak.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!140.186.1.7!newsie.dmc.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Tom Sefranek)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 12:38:01 GMT
Organization: cmcorp.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a5oqm$[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tcs.cmcorp.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Ben) wrote:

>I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
>timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
>and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
>pruning!

I hear that it can get you antenna gain if applied in the winter.

>Has anybody heard of this stuff?

>Ben





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!udel-eecis!news.udel.edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Robert Penneys)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: ?? Keyboard for CW ??
Date: 29 Dec 1996 09:02:38 -0500
Organization: University of Delaware
Lines: 12
Distribution: na
Message-ID: <5a5tlu$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: copland.udel.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122058 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45357



I am looking for a minimal standalone device for keyboard CW, using
an AT keyboard, I suppose. Anything you like or dislike?

Please e-mail directly to:        [e-mail]


as I do not generally get to read these groups.

Tnx, Bob



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:34 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Tom M.Giblin Jr. / NY2S" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: DRSI PCPA2 1200/1200-Baud Card
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 06:15:34 -0800
Organization: TMG Enterprises
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: grc-ny12-21.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 29  3:14:46 AM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win95; I; 16bit)

Hi I'm looking for a DRSI PCPA2 1200 Baud VHF/VHF  Card.
If you have one & like to part with it. Pls notify me, TNKS!

73 de --
Tom M Giblin Jr / NY2S

[e-mail]

http://www.netcom.com/~ny2s/tmg.html


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!feeder.chicago.cic.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 09:16:37 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cgb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv10.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <5a4cgb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
> [e-mail] (Chip) wrote:
>
> >In article <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Ben) wrote:
>
> >> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> >> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> >> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> >> pruning!
> >>
> >> Has anybody heard of this stuff?
> >>
> >> Ben
>
>
> >   Ben,
>
> >      A even better product, though it is hard to obtain is a spray bottle
> >of Turbo Prop Wash.
>
> >  Avionics techs use it religously.  Knocks down SWR's  etc.
>
> >Its only available a airports.
>
> We only have one airport here, and I couldn't find that stuff.  Do you know
of
> any airports over there I could call and order some ?
>
> Thanks,
> Jim KH2D
>
>
>
>
NO NO NO and NO

The original poster was looking for a product that helps in not onl;y
lowering SWR but helps turn rotators and towers.  The product is called,
I think  relative bearing grease.  I believe you need a left handed smoke
shifter and 100 yards of shoreline to apply it.  If I am not mistaken,
you could even make it yourself, if you had a 5 gallon pail of live
steam.

Just trying to help out.
--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.ums.edu!haven.umd.edu!dailyplanet.wam.umd.edu!ham
From: [e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: The Amateur's Code - a refresher
Date: 29 Dec 1996 14:17:32 GMT
Organization: I need to put my ORGANIZATION here.
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <5a5uhs$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: w3eax.umd.edu
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44903 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122060

************************************************************************
I think we can ALL find fault with ourselves here.  We are not just
"ordinary" people - it's our duty to act in an extraordinary way.
*************************************************************************

1) The Amateur is Considerate...he never knowingly uses the air in such a
way as to lessen the pleasure of others.

  interpreted: no jamming, no harrassment of others.

2) The Amateur is Loyal...he offers his loyalty, encouragement, and
support to his fellow radio amateurs, his local club, and to the American
Radio Relay League, through which Amateur Radio is represented.

  interpreted: be a good person to other hams, and support the ARRL 'cuz
  it's our voice in the political arena.

3) The Amateur is Progressive...he keeps his station abreast of science.
It is well built and efficient.  His operating practice is above reproach.

  interpreted: check your equipment.  When someone gives you a bad
  report, try to figure out what's causing it.  And use minimum power.
  And it's time to play spread spectrum SO LONG AS IT DOESN'T INTERFERE
  with existing communications.

4) The Amateur is Friendly...slow and patient sending when requested,
friendly advice and counsel to the beginner, kindly assistance,
cooperation and consideration for the interests of others; these are the
marks of the amateur spirit.

  Basically, the golden rule.  Be kind to others because you'd want them
  to treat you well.

5) The Amateur is Balanced...radio is his hobby.  He never allows it to
interfere with any of the duties he owes to his home, his job, his
school, or his community.

  When your XYL/OM asks you to put the radio away for a while, or you
  have to go and walk the dogs, or you have to work a super-long day and
  miss Sweepstakes, do it.

6) The Amateur is Patriotic...his knowledge and his station are always
ready for the service of his country and community.

  Be ready for the time when the country or town needs us because the
  cell sites are no longer functioning.  Have everything ready to run on
  batteries, and practice emergency communications.
--
* Scott Rosenfeld NF3I Burtonsville, MD FM19mc QRV 80-10/6/2/440 *
*** 6m 75 grids worked on 8 watts *** HF 138 cfmd * QRP-L #147 ***
** QRP ARCI #9054 ** DXCC/WAS/WAC *** 100% dipole powered HF/6m **
* 301-549-1022 h / 301-982-1015 w *** 145.490- 147.225+ PL 156.7 *


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!udel-eecis!news.udel.edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Robert Penneys)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: !!!!! Delaware QSO Party !!!!!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 09:20:04 -0500
Organization: University of Delaware
Lines: 71
Message-ID: <5a5umk$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: copland.udel.edu


                   Finally - the Delaware QSO Party!!

               Sponsored by the First State Amateur Radio Club

Who -       All radio amateurs in and out of Delaware

When -      First full weekend in February (1997: Feb 1 & 2)
            Saturday: 1700Z (1200 EST) until 0500Z Sunday (2400 EST Sat.)
            Sunday:   1300Z (0800 EST) until 0100Z (2000 EST Sun.)

Where -     Suggested frequencies are:

            Phone        CW
             1.860      1.825
             3.960      3.550
             7.260      7.050
            14.260     14.050
            21.360     21.050
            28.360     28.050

           Novice and Technician freqs: 25 kHz above sub-band edge

           This does not imply that you may not work any bands you choose,
           such as VHF/UHF/SHF. However, as there is only one entry class,
           all logs will be judged equally.

How -      Work stations once per band and mode.
           Exchange signal report and QTH (county for Delaware stations;
           state/province/DXCC country for others).

Scoring -  There is ONE CLASS for all stations.
           Count ONE POINT per PHONE QSO.
           Count TWO POINTS per CW/RTTY/Digital QSO.
           Multipliers/special event stations: NONE.

Awards -  Certificates will be awarded in the following categories:
          Within Delaware: first, second and third highest score.
          Within each Delaware county: highest score.
          Others: first, second and third highest scores.
          Further prizes and certificates may be awarded, depending
          upon participation and merit.
          Certificates and prizes courtesy of Ham Radio Outlet, Delaware.

Submissions-
          There are no requirements for dupe sheets, and no forms nor
          software offered especially for this contest.

          Logs must show date, time, band, mode, station worked, exchange
          send and received, entrant's call and QTH, and total summary of
          QSOs and points. You are assumed to be observing the rules of
          amateur radio and contesting, so that no such written statment
          is required.

          Mail entries within 30 days to:   Contest Chairman
                                            FSARC, Inc.
                                            P.O. Box 1050
                                            Newark, DE 19715

          Include SASE for results.

          E-mail logs with adequate summaries, and any other
          comment or inquiry to:

                      [e-mail]

         Results will be posted through [e-mail], and e-mailed
         to NCJ and CQ.

         Thanks and LET'S GO DELAWARE!!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!usenet.logical.net!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.indigo.ie!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HAM TOOLKIT CDROM..AWSOME
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 14:36:52 GMT
Organization: Indigo
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts02-06.dublin.indigo.ie
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.339

Check out our Awsome CD ROM.."HAM TOOL KIT"..Its jam packed with over
600MEGS of Amateur Radio Related Software..its all here on one
disk..buy no other !!!.

Surf to us at http://sphynx.com/murphy

Owned by Hams..for Hams!!!
           M U R P H Y     E L E C T R O N I C S
GSM Mobile Phones & Accessories. Satellite TV and Decoding Systems
     CD Rom Multimedia    Computer Accessories
http://sphynx.com/murphy          Email: [e-mail]

Why not send us an SMS to our GSM phone..Simply surf to
http://home.sn.no/~ahaltbak/engsms.htm  and type in the number
[phone], write your message and fill in your Email address.all for FREE !
!!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Requirements to be employed at Radio Shack
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:03:35 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 70.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

98.6
--
#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: The Worst Ham page
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Please visit my World Wide Web Site, you have never seen a page like it.
You will see:

1. A naked chic
2. The writings of me and others on ham radio.
3. The warm side of K1OIK.
4. A test for your SVGA monitor
5. A picture of me and my family.
6. A Nazi connection in ham radio???


Burt Fisher    Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics
Amateur call           South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)
  K1OIK        If you sit on the fence, it is a pain in the butt

               [e-mail]    [e-mail]
               www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.177.125.4!inetserv2.fs.lmco.com![e-mail]
From: "Mike Kelly" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 60-Hz QRM All Over HF spectrum
Date: 29 Dec 1996 15:07:44 GMT
Organization: Lockheed Martin Federal Systems
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <01bbf59a$0f502560$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: proxy-gw.fs.lmco.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

I am beginning to troubleshoot a serious 60-Hz noise problem I have here at

this QTH and was wondering if anyone has any knowledge they would like to
share with me that would help.  Thanks in advance.  Oh, I only have
intermittent access to these newsgroups but will still try and monitor.  My

regular email is: [e-mail]

The 60-Hz is most readily heard by going to AM mode on HF and tuning up and

down the band.  For example, there are high amplitude spots in the
following areas: 3.247-3.264MHz, 3.451-3.471, and 3.656-3.674.  These are
just examples as the entire spectrum is littered with this and in addition
there are lots of lower amplitude 60-Hz QRM scattered all over the band.
The main areas though, have a signal strength in the S9+ range.

In narrow CW mode, the noise appears to slowly roam up and down the
different band areas.  For periods of times a narrow area will be quiet
then this QRM will roll in.

I used Kevin J. McWilliams (KW5Q) excellent Freeware program "SbFFT" to
display the spectrum in the frequency regions in the HF spectrum.  I
clearly see 60-Hz and multiples of 60 occurring up through the passband
(2.4K setting on the Yaesu FT-1000) of the radio.  It does appear that the
strongest component is at 120-Hz.

Switching between my 160-10 Carolina Windom and a 80-10 dipole doesn't make

any difference.  I also checked on an AM radio I have at the other end of
the house and I can still hear 60-Hz on it.

The QTH here is in a rural hilly subdivision with large lots.  There are
high tension transmission lines running past the subdivision but probably
no closer than 1 or 2 miles from this QTH.  I believe this 60-Hz problem
has been here for years but since I work different modes and bands
nowadays, I tend to notice it less.  Also, I can't say I see or hear it on
the TV or FM radios here.

Any ideas would sure be appreciated!
 - Mike-AB4YY ([e-mail])



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:43 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 29 Dec 1996 10:08:06 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5a61gm$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122072 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44910

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>And my point is, that is the classic definition of a self-selected
>poll.  Who the hell has the time to read and respond to this kind of
>poll?

The League physically mailed the survey to a number of ARRL members
and non-members alike. No information has been forthcoming as to
the source of the data points that the League used in releasing the
results.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:44 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 29 Dec 1996 10:11:09 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5a61md$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>, Dave Heil  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Drew,
>Still at it, I see.

I think Spew and Carl are one and the same person. Notice that whenever
Carl disappears Spew shows up, and vice-versa?

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:45 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: When is the F.C.C, going to get rid of the "Bathroom Man" 14.313?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 15:30:33 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts4p4.ro.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

The so called "Bathroom Man", who has operated on 14.313  for years,
and has been heard using foul and dergrading comments toward women and
underage girls is still to my knowledge operating on the bands. With
the busting of the CB freaks in Arizona, which by the way, is where
this sicko lives, you would think they would do away with this scumbag
too. Anyone else heard of this freak? Casey, N4GKS.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!btnet!netcom.net.uk!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!g3vgw.demon.co.uk!g3vgw.demon.co.uk!richard
From: Richard Buckby <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.shortwave,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Old Timers Radio
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 15:51:16 +0000
Organization: Gateway to the Peak
Lines: 15
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: Richard Buckby <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: g3vgw.demon.co.uk
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.shortwave:91464 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122118

Hello Simon,

        I was interested in your message, as not long ago at the Derby
Radio Society we had a couple of talks by people who used to monitor
Japanese transmissions during the War. They gave us a very good
demonstration of Japanese morse. I regret that one of them has since
died, but the other chap, Harry Sills, (G8QZ) is still around.  I wonder
if your father would be interested in contacting him?  If so, let me
know via e-mail and I will pass on the details.

        73, Richard,

                Ambergate, Derbyshire, UK.

e-mail: [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!uhog.mit.edu!netnews.com!howland.erols.net!usc!newshub.cts.com!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 15:57:34 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5a78nu$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4kv8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-26.kuentos.guam.net

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
>>retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
>>older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
>>remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
>>back in the late 60s.


>Let me see if I can find a word that fits how I feel about your post..

>Hmmmmmm...... BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>Yup BINGO says it all :)

Let's hope BINGO doesn't fit Rogers post in your case, Eric.  You aren't
supposed to OPERATING on HF, so hopefully you aren't talking to too
many retirees on 75 meters..... Maybe you can tell how old people are by
listening to them ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!sonysjc!sonybc!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:12:00 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <5a79iv$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-26.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I'll refer you to the amateur's code, which states that "the amateur is
>friendly."  I don't think you are observing this tenet.  Or have you
>concluded that the Morse Code is more important than the Amateur's Code?

OH NO !! Not The Amateurs Code !  What's next ? Girl Scout Cookies ?

>I've noticed this about some members of this newsgroup: they quickly
>switch from attacks on others' ideas to attacks on the individuals
>themselves.  Like you are doing Steve.  Pretty second class conduct, in
>my book.

I have noticed that too, Roger. Seems like EVERYBODY does that.  Does
this paragraph sound familiar ?  It should, you wrote it.

>It was pretty hard to decipher what you were trying to say, Gary.  Your
>writing skills are so poor that your ideas are hard to pick out of the
>mush.  But I'll try to believe that your post did contain some ideas,
>and address them systematically.  (I apologise if I use too many long
>words for you).

>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV

>USC Law, Class of '97

73, Jim KH2D
Lorton Reform School, Class of '64




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:50 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 11:16:42 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv18.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> Well, I disagree.  Ham gear in real dollars is far cheaper than it was
> when I was a kid.

Always did love the , when I was younger stories..BUT, we live in the
today and the now, so quite frankly, the 1968 benchmark for 1990 dollars
means little if anything.



> These
> no-code techs seem to have the dough for $500 HTs and mobile VHF rigs.
> These are more expensive than say, a used Kenwood 940, which is wildly
> better than what I used as a teenager.

Hey Roger!!!! ANY Kenwood 940's you find for less than 7-800 dollars, let
me now.  I can make a fortune reselling them for 1000 bucks or more.  Or
are you referring to the fact that a Kenwood 940 sells for less than
todays HT and mobile rigs in terms of 1960's dollars???

BTW, equating the CW requirement with retirees was one of the most
asinine statements I've ever read.  If you use that logic in court, I
pity your client(s).

> --
> Roger J. Buffington
> W6VZV
>
> USC Law, Class of '97
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> "I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
> Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2
>

--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:51 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Amateur's Code - a refresher
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 11:20:45 -0500
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a5uhs$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44922 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122102

Scott Rosenfeld NF3I wrote:
>
> ************************************************************************
> I think we can ALL find fault with ourselves here.  We are not just
> "ordinary" people - it's our duty to act in an extraordinary way.
> *************************************************************************
>
> 1) The Amateur is Considerate...he never knowingly uses the air in such a
> way as to lessen the pleasure of others.
>
>   interpreted: no jamming, no harrassment of others.
>
> 2) The Amateur is Loyal...he offers his loyalty, encouragement, and
> support to his fellow radio amateurs, his local club, and to the American
> Radio Relay League, through which Amateur Radio is represented.
>
>   interpreted: be a good person to other hams, and support the ARRL 'cuz
>   it's our voice in the political arena.
>
> 3) The Amateur is Progressive...he keeps his station abreast of science.
> It is well built and efficient.  His operating practice is above reproach.
>
>   interpreted: check your equipment.  When someone gives you a bad
>   report, try to figure out what's causing it.  And use minimum power.
>   And it's time to play spread spectrum SO LONG AS IT DOESN'T INTERFERE
>   with existing communications.
>
> 4) The Amateur is Friendly...slow and patient sending when requested,
> friendly advice and counsel to the beginner, kindly assistance,
> cooperation and consideration for the interests of others; these are the
> marks of the amateur spirit.
>
>   Basically, the golden rule.  Be kind to others because you'd want them
>   to treat you well.
>
> 5) The Amateur is Balanced...radio is his hobby.  He never allows it to
> interfere with any of the duties he owes to his home, his job, his
> school, or his community.
>
>   When your XYL/OM asks you to put the radio away for a while, or you
>   have to go and walk the dogs, or you have to work a super-long day and
>   miss Sweepstakes, do it.
>
> 6) The Amateur is Patriotic...his knowledge and his station are always
> ready for the service of his country and community.
>
>   Be ready for the time when the country or town needs us because the
>   cell sites are no longer functioning.  Have everything ready to run on
>   batteries, and practice emergency communications.
> --

I think that the above code is a lot more important for newcomers, and
experienced hams alike, to understand, than is the Morse code.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 11:25:39 -0500
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
>
> BTW, equating the CW requirement with retirees was one of the most
> asinine statements I've ever read.  If you use that logic in court, I
> pity your client(s).

Golly Steve, your silvery rhetoric and rapier-like logic simply bowl me
over.

I'll refer you to the amateur's code, which states that "the amateur is
friendly."  I don't think you are observing this tenet.  Or have you
concluded that the Morse Code is more important than the Amateur's Code?

I've noticed this about some members of this newsgroup: they quickly
switch from attacks on others' ideas to attacks on the individuals
themselves.  Like you are doing Steve.  Pretty second class conduct, in
my book.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 11:30:44 -0500
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4kv8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-143.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

Joe B. Clark wrote:
> I think that the bottom line is:
>
> Just how bad do you want hf priviledges?  Having been first licensed in
> '63 as a novice, and since having increased my code speed to about
> 30w.p.m., You know my answer.

Mine too.  I could do 35WPM back when I did CW daily, and can still do
20 WPM any time at all.

Unfortunately, newcomers to our hobby have not yet experienced the
thrill of HF in many cases.  Particularly in the internet age, they see
two alternatives: one requiring a seemingly pointless Morse Code test,
and one that doesn't.  Too often (for the health of ham radio) ham radio
is the loser.

Our hobby is greying, our numbers are declining.  Are we just going to
stand around and watch our hobby continue to die?  Because that's what
is happening.  If I didn't think so, I'd be **for** a CW requirement, as
an additional disincentive to CB types (meaning no offense to anyone in
particular).

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: BEEPERS
Date: 29 Dec 1996 16:32:11 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent to
understand and accept modern methods of communication.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: Rob Bellville <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors
Subject: VHF-AM Interactive Web page...
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 11:33:11 -0500
Organization: http://rob.acol.com/
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Are you a VHF-AM enthusiast? Looking to buy, sell, trade, ask questions
or set up a sked?

Check out the VHF-AM WWWBoard at:

http://rob.acol.com/wwwboard/radio/ham/vhf-am/

Sign in with your grid, operating times and frequency and let others
know that you are on 6M/2M AM!



-- Rob, N1NTE



==============================================================
  Rob Bellville
  [e-mail]                                   PO Box 515
  http://rob.acol.com/                   Millbury, MA 01527

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
  ||||||||  Blackstone Valley Community Website:  ||||||||
              http://www.blackstonevalley.com/
==============================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:58 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: LAWSUITS
Date: 29 Dec 1996 16:33:57 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
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...are what will ultimately settle the battle over Morse code as a
required testing element in obtaining an amateur radio license.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:54:59 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:41:07 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <5a6al0$[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2gt4$[e-mail]> <5a4o7v$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Weir) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

>->[e-mail] wrote:

>->>In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
>->>writes:


>->Well if we actually honor the treaty we should have a requirement. BUT
>->the U.S. has a long history of ignoring international treaties. We
>->ignore treaties that have more important ramifications that the ITU.
>->So why won't we ignore this one?

>You CAN honor the treaty and STILL NOT have the CW requirement.  The
>document was written with enough holes in it to let Granny Prichard make
>fifteen yards against the Steelers off-tackle.  There is a provision that
>ANY nation can exempt itself from this requirement if it so chooses.

>Alright, you DON'T so choose.  If you are real about wanting to let
>"no-code" people into the ranks at any level, then you say that one word a
>minute is the requirement and you can bring along a chart and you can have
>enough minutes until you pass.  You have met the LETTER of the treaty, no?
>Setting ANY level seems to me to be arbitrary, whimsical, and capricious,
>but then again, I live 3000 miles from Oldington by choice.

>Jim







>Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
>RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
>Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
>http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
>[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor

I want to just make clear that even though I favor the no-code side I
also favor beefing up the written tests..

Eric



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:01 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:43:23 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <5a6ap8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3huj$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
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[e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow) wrote:

>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:27:22 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>[e-mail] wrote:
>>
>>>One of the reasons why code is still should, in my opinion, be kept is
>>>that it is a learning tool for beginning amateurs.  Many of the longer
>>>time amateur got their basic training in cw.  cw allows you to make
>>>your early mistakes one-on-one rather than on a voice repeater for
>>>everyone to listen to.
>>>Larry
>>
>>I appreciate the learning aspect and don't deny the code's merit as a
>>form of communication. But if you make a mistake with code while OTA
>>people would hear it same as on a repeater or simplex.
>>

>And a helpful suggeston on CW doesn't start a flame war unlike the
>world of VHF+ FM or usenet.

>73 de n4jvp
>Fritz
>To reply to this message, please remove the
>underscore from the beginning of the reply to
>address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!
I have seen only one war(off the air) started on VHF and it was
started by a general chastisng a General for something his friend did.
But then again no one ever fights on HF
LOL!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:02 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:47:23 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <5a6b0o$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:

>In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...

>
>> Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
>> majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
>> datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
>> keep it held back.
>> Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
>> us?
>>
>>
>Just out of curiousity, what high speed datamodes are (above 9600 baud)
>available on AMATUER HF??  Most of the high speed datamodes (above 9600
>baiud) are available on the VHF+ bands.  Bands which CW requirements are
>needed to get a license.  So to answer your question with a question, how
>have the coders held back the highspeed datamodes to noncoders, if in
>fact, the true high speed datamodes are available to them already?
>--
>Steve KF2TI
>ARRL LIFE Member

>BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
>OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

>WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
>AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

>I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

>doors open in 5 minutes

When I spoke of data modes and 9600 being the highest available I was
talking of the entire spectrum. Speeds are limited on HF, I know.
Still it doesn't stop the U.S. Military(and otrhers) from using faster
speeds on HF.
The Pro-coders are afraid that if reliable datacomms of highspeed were
allowed their precious CW might no longer be required as their only
legitimate claim is it's use in extreme emergencies would no longer be
valid.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:03 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Richard Kendrick)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: 29 Dec 1996 09:52:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5a67ji$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122124 rec.radio.scanner:74444

John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]> wrote:

[ petty mumblings snipped ]

No matter how many posts you reassemble to quote out of context, no
matter how many distortions of reality you vomit, you'll NEVER escape
the fact that you've been exposed for what you are: a liar and a fraud.


Richard Kendrick CET N7NT (ex WA7TWI) |
Amateur Radio Extra Class             |  Do not adjust your mind, there
QRP #4129/G-QRP #8591/MI-QRP #M-1412  |  is a fault in reality.
Mesa, AZ  email: [e-mail]  |



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:04 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:54:20 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <5a7c2b$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2ior$[e-mail]> <5a40k5$[e-mail]> <5a6et2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>Next subject is: When do we get HF w/o code requirement?

>>Maybe never.  Time's a wasting.  Better learn the code now. But didn't
>>you say 2 meters is better than HF ? What do want HF for ?

>>73, Jim KH2D

>I never said VHF is better than HF. I said it is more difficult to DX
>on VHF than on HF and therefore those who choose to do so are
>accepting a challenge. Since so many people acuse no-coders of being
>lazy the statement is appropriate that VHF is a real challenge as
>opposed to HF.

OK. Well, as I said before, try 160 meters.  But you are still telling me that
working DEEEX on VHF is doing it 'the hard way'.  Which is contrary to the
popular idea that it's time hams stopped doing things the 'hard way' (CW) and
get with the more modern technologies.   Why don't you want to modernize and
start doing things 'the easy way' ? You did say 'HF is for sissies' didn't you
 ?
Does that imply you think you are a sissy ?  Talk to a few of the people on th
e
top of the DXCC honor role and ask them how unchallenging HF is.

>Why do I want HF. The same reason everyone does. For easy
>International contacts. To talk with others in different cultures on a
>regular basis with a wire and a decent radio as opposed to the mega
>array and mega buck radio required to do so on VHF.

Now you want to do things the 'easy' way.  Use email. You can talk to anybody
in
the world with little or no effort via email.  I worked 2 stations on 160 mete
rs
in Europe over the weekend, but I got email from 50 other stations in Europe.
Much easier.  You obviously haven't seen too many HF ham stations.  In 2001 yo
u
may be able to make international contacts on SSB with your wire in the tree,
so
there's no hurry to rush the no code HF thing thru, you still have a few years
to wait.  See your amateur radio handbook under 'sunspot cycle'.

73, Jim KH2D








From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:06 1997
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From: "Joe B. Clark" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:54:43 -0600
Organization: TCA Communications
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4kv8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)
To: KC5WCP <[e-mail]>

KC5WCP wrote:
>
> "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
> >retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
> >older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
> >remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
> >back in the late 60s.
>
> >The CW requirement tends, I think, to keep it that way.  Busy working
> >people probably lack the time to master 13 WPM CW, and have other hobby
> >alternatives, such as the internet, that do not require them to do so.
> >Although working people see the relevance of a theory and procedure
> >exam, (and are willing to take the time out of their busy schedules to
> >prepare for and pass them) they tend to view the code test as a
> >non-productive use of their time (which it is).  Therefore, in great
> >numbers they pass ham radio by, or at best become no-code Techs.
>
> >Now, I've got nothing against retirees; I hope to be one myself one day,
> >and lots of these guys are my buddies.  But surely none of us think that
> >it is a good thing for our hobby that our hobby has systematically
> >excluded non-retirees.
>
> >By the way, if you disagree with what I've written, then ask yourself
> >WHY is it that HF is so overwhelmingly dominated, even on weekends, by
> >retirees?  I think you may come back to my theory.
>
> >As an interesting corellary to the above, the recent ARRL survey on
> >keeping the CW requirement also contained a systematic bias in favor of
> >retirees.  1) probably retirees with lots of time on their hands are the
> >ones with the leisure time to discover, and respond to, such a poll; 2)
> >the ARRL is to a very large extent comprised of retirees. (No, I don't
> >have figures, but I'll bet I'm right.)
>
> >--
> >Roger J. Buffington
> >W6VZV
>
> >USC Law, Class of '97
>
> >------------------------------------------------------------
> >"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
> >Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
> >------------------------------------------------------------
>
> >Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2
>
> Let me see if I can find a word that fits how I feel about your post..
>
> Hmmmmmm...... BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> Yup BINGO says it all :)


I think that the bottom line is:

Just how bad do you want hf priviledges?  Having been first licensed in
'63 as a novice, and since having increased my code speed to about
30w.p.m., You know my answer.
de kc5itc, Joe


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:07 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:55:23 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <5a7c4a$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2ior$[e-mail]> <5a40k5$[e-mail]> <5a6et2$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>Next subject is: When do we get HF w/o code requirement?

>>Maybe never.  Time's a wasting.  Better learn the code now. But didn't
>>you say 2 meters is better than HF ? What do want HF for ?

>>73, Jim KH2D

>I never said VHF is better than HF. I said it is more difficult to DX
>on VHF than on HF and therefore those who choose to do so are
>accepting a challenge. Since so many people acuse no-coders of being
>lazy the statement is appropriate that VHF is a real challenge as
>opposed to HF.

OK. Well, as I said before, try 160 meters.  But you are still telling me that
working DEEEX on VHF is doing it 'the hard way'.  Which is contrary to the
popular idea that it's time hams stopped doing things the 'hard way' (CW) and
get with the more modern technologies.   Why don't you want to modernize and
start doing things 'the easy way' ? You did say 'HF is for sissies' didn't you
 ?
Does that imply you think you are a sissy ?  Talk to a few of the people on th
e
top of the DXCC honor role and ask them how unchallenging HF is.

>Why do I want HF. The same reason everyone does. For easy
>International contacts. To talk with others in different cultures on a
>regular basis with a wire and a decent radio as opposed to the mega
>array and mega buck radio required to do so on VHF.

Now you want to do things the 'easy' way.  Use email. You can talk to anybody
in
the world with little or no effort via email.  I worked 2 stations on 160 mete
rs
in Europe over the weekend, but I got email from 50 other stations in Europe.
Much easier.  You obviously haven't seen too many HF ham stations.  In 2001 yo
u
may be able to make international contacts on SSB with your wire in the tree,
so
there's no hurry to rush the no code HF thing thru, you still have a few years
to wait.  See your amateur radio handbook under 'sunspot cycle'.

73, Jim KH2D








From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news-master!news
From: walt profota <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Net listing ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 13:04:56 -0400
Organization: home
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: cnc07732.concentric.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U)
CC: rec.radio.amateur.digital.mis

I sometimes come across different discussion groups on hf such as the
Kenwood net,Satellite net,ect.I was wondering if there was someplace on
the internet that would have a listing of all the nets there purpose
time,dates and freq.
                        Thanks
                        Walt  N3JPR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:06:50 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <5a6c57$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:


>M>The vote was a sham, pure and simple.

>M>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue will
> >be decided in the courts.

>That's the way!  Sue in court instead of leaning the code.  More of the
>"something for nothing" mentality I see running rampant in todays
>wannabes.

>---
>   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

>--
Ok So what are your accomplishments that makes you better than us
wannabes?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:10 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:11:47 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <5a6ceg$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (W8PU) wrote:

>This code thing is only about one thing. It got nothing to do with being
>outdated, or old dinosaurs. Its about getting HF priviledges for just
>memmorizing a bunch of questions. These guys dont know there ass from a
>hole in the ground when it comes to electronics, they just a license as
>easily as they can get it. Its obvious. The no code hams have flooded the
>repeaters and now are stuck there. Get rid of the code so they can move on
>with little effort. Hell lets have Walmart hand them out! Stop your damn
>whining. rogie!!

> 73 de Gary W8PU.
>ps I like code, I wish I was better at it, there is less shit to put up
>with there!
Well once I get over the overwhelming encouragement to new hams you
exude...

You cry about newhams not knowing squat about electronics. So, lets
make the written test tougher. Eliminate CW requirement and improve
REAL WORLD skills with a strigent written test.
Then you can stop whinning.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:15:19 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <5a6cl6$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>W8PU wrote:
>>
>>Hell lets have Walmart hand them out! Stop your damn
>> whining. rogie!!
>>
>>  73 de Gary W8PU.
>> ps I like code, I wish I was better at it, there is less shit to put up
>> with there!

>It was pretty hard to decipher what you were trying to say, Gary.  Your
>writing skills are so poor that your ideas are hard to pick out of the
>mush.  But I'll try to believe that your post did contain some ideas,
>and address them systematically.  (I apologise if I use too many long
>words for you).

>1.  If I'm whining about the CW requirement, it isn't for myself.  I
>have an Extra Class ticket, and have had for years.  And for the record,
>I'm quite proficient at Morse Code to this day.

>2.  I and others have given sound reasons why we think a Morse Code
>requirement is detrimental to the hobby.  All you've done is whine that
>it was required back in the old days (when you were walking 5 miles to
>school in the driven snow no doubt) and therefore should be required
>now.  What is the logic in that?  Morse might have been relevant back
>then.  But times change, and so must ham radio, if it is to survive.

>3.  So far ham radio is NOT surviving very well.  Our numbers are
>dwindling, and with it the future of our hobby.

>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV

>USC Law, Class of '97

>------------------------------------------------------------
>"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
>Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
>------------------------------------------------------------

>Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2
This is so true.. But the facts are there. The average everyday ham
that whines about keeping CW requirement could care less about the
future of the hobby. All they really care about is keeping the bands
less crowded so they can contest and DX without any real competrition.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:17:14 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a6con$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ij1$[e-mail]> <5a47gp$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44913 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122085

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>Like a freind of mine says, I will probably learn code and be a beeper
>>one day when it is no longer required.

>Uh huh. Where have we heard that line before ?

>73, Jim KH2D


Do you go fishing often?




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:26:15 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <5a6d9k$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ij1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44914 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122086

[e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow) wrote:

>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:38:17 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:


>>Well I appreciate the sentiment but I choose not to learn code.
>>I do not want to justify the requirement by taking the test and ading
>>myself to the ranks of hams who sacrificed a moral issue for HF
>>privilege.
>The code requirement is not a moral issue even though some no-code
>proponents assume that it is the HF sacrement. Gerald Schmitt is a
>no-code proponent who had a lot harder time getting to 13 wpm than
>most other hams passed the same CW requirement. He put forth the
>effort, more effort than I have ever heard of for someone pass 13 wpm
>and he could have obtained a waiver. He decided he could do it and he
>did!
Bully for him. I am truly proud of his effort.
>Although Mr Schmitt does not want anyone else to endure what he had to
>go through to get his ticket, he was willing to do what others are say
>they cannot do and are unwilling to make any attempt.

>>Like a freind of mine says, I will probably learn code and be a beeper
>>one day when it is no longer required.
>>
>Make a move and make that day happen sooner but do not plead
>entitlement without any effort what-so-ever.
So if I don't code I am lazy? Effort is realative. My desire to
toughen the written test does not qualify as effort?
>73 de n4jvp
>Fritz
>To reply to this message, please remove the
>underscore from the beginning of the reply to
>address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!

Can't blame you. I just send them 500 pictures of naked fat women and
word has gotten out. No Spam here :)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:30:33 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a6dhl$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <5a3ieh$[e-mail]> <5a47k0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44915 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122089

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>Why is it that some people automatically ASSume that every tech
>>memorized the question pool and seems incapable of having studied the
>>theory and data needed to pass?

>Because we know that most extras memorized the question pool. Why
>should techs be any different ?

>73, Jim KH2D

:)




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:39:08 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5a6e1p$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44916 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122090

[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:49:47 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>>
>>If there were changes the band plans would remain the same. I even
>>agree with setting off the current CW potions as they are for CW ONLY.
>>That would help insure the   ----> beepers<----    a place to play.

>Aw come on now, is that what it's getting down to, massive usage of
>that "b" word? This person writes a well thought out post and
>completely ruins his credibility with 1/2 of the people in this
>newsgroup by using the "b" word.

>73 (beep)

Contrary to popular belief I do not use the BEEPER as a derogatory
comment.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 29 Dec 1996 17:41:31 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 17
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a6agb$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a61md$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
>
>In article <[e-mail]>, Dave Heil  <[e-mail]>
wrote:
>
>>Drew,
>>Still at it, I see.
>
>I think Spew and Carl are one and the same person. Notice that whenever
>Carl disappears Spew shows up, and vice-versa?

Well, if you're smart enough to know how to trace a post, do so and you
will find out differently.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: 29 Dec 1996 12:51:04 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <5a6b28$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> starts off saying:

>Well, I disagree.  Ham gear in real dollars is far cheaper than it was
>when I was a kid.  The thousand dollar prices you reference are
>completely bogus because that is the price for new stuff.  Sure, younger
>hams usually get used gear.  And used gear is very cheap, just listen on
>the swapnets.

And then manages to deduce:

>It is Morse Code that deters new hams, not the price of ham gear.  These
>no-code techs seem to have the dough for $500 HTs and mobile VHF rigs.

This entire paragraph doesn't follow if you accept the first paragraph
as being true.

Used HTs and mobile VHF rigs do not cost $500. More like $100 to $200.
So, I would change your second sentence in the above paragraph to read
"These no-code techs seem to have the dough for $200 HTs and mobile VHF
rigs."

Naturally, though, there is no evidence to support that no-code techs
buy more used gear than new gear, so the entire logic train is
pointless anyway.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:53:42 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5a6et2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2ior$[e-mail]> <5a40k5$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>Next subject is: When do we get HF w/o code requirement?

>Maybe never.  Time's a wasting.  Better learn the code now. But didn't
>you say 2 meters is better than HF ? What do want HF for ?

>73, Jim KH2D

I never said VHF is better than HF. I said it is more difficult to DX
on VHF than on HF and therefore those who choose to do so are
accepting a challenge. Since so many people acuse no-coders of being
lazy the statement is appropriate that VHF is a real challenge as
opposed to HF.
Why do I want HF. The same reason everyone does. For easy
International contacts. To talk with others in different cultures on a
regular basis with a wire and a decent radio as opposed to the mega
array and mega buck radio required to do so on VHF.

Eric




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:56:06 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <5a6f1j$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>       Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>> Now I know we don't want this thread to get into "personal" exceptions
>>> to what was stated anout Technicians...but the frequencies I regularly
>>> monitor on 2 Meters, 220, and 440 simply aren't what were described in
>>> the original post. Sure, there are abusers of this privilege. But
>>> pervasive and abhorrent? Not in my sphere of influence.
>>
>>Mine either.  The old canard that Technician hams conduct themselves
>>like CBers is so much malarky.

>You two must be lucky to live in areas so clean. Unfortunately, my
>area isn't, and a lot of other hams that I talk to on HF indicate
>the VHF problems on the local "2 meter good-buddy boxes" are just
>as bad.

>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.
Well then stop whinning and do something about it. Find someone who
can Df the jammers. Make an effort to befriend the Chatter boxes and
guide them along a better path.
Or just sit in your armchair and whine. It's up to you.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 18:01:05 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a6fau$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <5a3jn1$[e-mail]> <5a4cfp$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>I wonder how many lives were lost because of the CW requirement?

>That's an interesting question, Eric.  I wonder how we could figure out
>how many people died trying to learn CW ?  Or were you referring to those who
>died of a broken heart because they couldn't learn CW ?

>73, Jim KH2D


Or how many die due to arthricic complications due to beeping :)




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 18:02:08 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <5a6fcu$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <5a3jn1$[e-mail]> <5a4cfp$[e-mail]> <5a4ld0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp112.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail](William M. Pasternak) wrote:

>In <5a4cfp$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Jim
>Kehler) writes:
>>
>>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>>
>>>I wonder how many lives were lost because of the CW requirement?
>>
>>That's an interesting question, Eric.  I wonder how we could figure
>out
>>how many people died trying to learn CW ?  Or were you referring to
>those who
>>died of a broken heart because they couldn't learn CW ?
>>
>>73, Jim KH2D
>>
>>
>>

>Why does it seem apropos to ask:  "...where is Wayne Green of 73 -- the
>no-code crusader -- at a time -- and place -- like this????"

>Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
>Newsline On-Line

If he's smart(and we all know he is) then he is hiding in a bar having
a double scotch and smiling.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Eric Oyen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: When is the F.C.C, going to get rid of the "Bathroom Man" 14.313?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 18:21:20 GMT
Organization: goodnet
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <5a6cvo$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts19-0.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Casey) wrote:

>this sicko lives, you would think they would do away with this scumbag
>too. Anyone else heard of this freak? Casey, N4GKS.
Q: where in Arizona is this "freak". Perhaps I can help by getting on the loca
ls about
it... I have been modeately successful in removing one problem (that of the .9
4 jammer,
tim hoffman). Perhaps I can persuade the local OOC that this "bathroom man" ne
eds an
education.

Eric <n7zzt>



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!news.dra.com!news.id.net!news.good.net!news.good.net!news.goodnet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Eric Oyen)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: cw and its importance...
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 18:34:34 GMT
Organization: goodnet
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a6doi$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: phx-ts19-0.goodnet.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Some of you, no doubt, would rejoice in the end of cw. However, as a concerned
 ham who
will be trying for his upgrade soon, I wonder if we should do away with it. Su
re, it is
not easy to learn (and neither is german, french or chinese). The point is, if
 we lose the
capability to use computers and have to fall back to older style equipment bec
ause of an
emp, morse code could be the saving grave (in case you are wondering, I am a f
irm believer
that a terrorist group might use a high altitude nuclear detonation to bring t
his, or any
other, country to its knees).

We should keep in mind this: we should never forget what we already know, beca
use we never
know how useful it can be in a pinch. This is one of the reasons why some many
 people keep
those old "radio Amateur handbooks".  Lots of useful stuff can be found just f
or the
looking and I consider cw mode to be one of those useful items that we should
discard.

Eric <n7zzt - no-coder upgrading this spring>



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in2.uu.net!194.20.35.13!news.vol.it!news
From: "Brian E. Cauchi" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: alt.ham-radio.digital-voice,es.rec.radio.amateur,fido7.hamradio,rec.radio.amateur,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space,rec.radio.shortwave,su.org.ham
Subject: Re: FAX SSTV RTTY WEFAX with SoundBlaster: OK!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 18:53:57 GMT
Organization: Video On Line
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <01bbf5b9$82e63360$0100a8c0@mstcp>
References: <01bbb553$986b4320$0923a6c2@gateway> <01bbd3f3$91a45400$1623a6c2@gateway>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.166.35.34
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155
Xref: news1.epix.net es.rec.radio.amateur:758 fido7.hamradio:182 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20939 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45381 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22557 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122094 rec.radio.amateur.space:9251 rec.radio.shortwave:91450

 Hello.
 I've just updated my FTV program, which does FAX & SSTV using a SoundCard,
 to decode Baudot using the same (FM) demodulation engine.

 Here is a run down of the more interesting features:

 (1) It keeps the demodulated signal in memory, so that the signal can be
 analysed again at a different keying rate or polarity! Garbage can be
 resampled on the fly, which means that minutes of received signals decoded
 at the wrong baud rate or keying polarity are recovered, on the fly, while
 still receiving.

 (2) Keying rate and polarity are analysed automatically - standard baud
 rates are automatically set following analysis.

 (3) Tuning oscilloscope available at all times, without loss of copy.

 (4) Program works in real time.

 (5) I wrote it, and I love it - I myself can't believe it works so well!

 Download your copy of FTV from my web site, at:
 http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/2504

 System requirements, and the standard features of FTV are described in the
 following page:
 http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/2504/ftv.htm

 By the way, AM signals from low orbiting weather satellites are also
 decoded - no extra interfaces needed. Demodulation mode is user selectable
 in software.

 Hope you all have a load of fun receiving 'words and pictures' - I hope to
 get some feedback !

 Happy New Year 1997
 All the best from Brian, 9H1JS, on the Island of Malta.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:24 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 19:13:47 GMT
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6e1p$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-240-109.nc.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44921 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122101

On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:39:08 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:49:47 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>>>
>>>If there were changes the band plans would remain the same. I even
>>>agree with setting off the current CW potions as they are for CW ONLY.
>>>That would help insure the   ----> beepers<----    a place to play.
>
>>Aw come on now, is that what it's getting down to, massive usage of
>>that "b" word? This person writes a well thought out post and
>>completely ruins his credibility with 1/2 of the people in this
>>newsgroup by using the "b" word.
>
>>73 (beep)
>
>Contrary to popular belief I do not use the BEEPER as a derogatory
>comment.
>

newbies...


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 19:19:23 GMT
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44923 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122103

On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>
>Considered me a signator.
>

You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
But you are a signator.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:27 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 19:23:08 GMT
Lines: 46

In article <5a4cek$[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
>>retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
>>older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
>>remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
>>back in the late 60s.
>
>I think the lack of younger hams on HF may have something to do with
>the economy. Stop and think about it. $2K for a middle of the line HF rig. $3
K
>for a decent amplifier.  Another $2K or $3K for a tower and an antenna.  Add
a
>few meters, some coax, some digital boxes, a computer, another $4K.   So the
>average HF ham station costs around $10K. Yes, I know you can buy an HF rig f
or
>$800, and put a wire up in the tree.  But thats not the 'average' HF ham
>station.

Well, that's interesting. I wonder just how average your average ham
station is. For a lark, I decided to go through the database of my amateur
equipment to see what it all cost. Comes to about $4600, and I dare say
my station is more elaborate than most. That figure doesn't include
my computers or my test equipment or my parts bins or any of my ongoing
experimental setups, but does include a legal limit HF station covering
160m to 10m, a satellite station for modes B, L, S, and the Microsats,
two VHF/UHF mobile setups and a HF/VHF mobile setup, a 70 foot Rohn tower,
packet and other digital modes capability from HF Clover to UHF 56kb,
assorted antennas for all the above, and the widest coverage UHF repeater
in Georgia.

Of course about the only things I've bought *new* are the IC-706 that's
in the mobile and my HAL P-38 card. For example, my HF station is an
IC-735 ($600) and a MLA2500 ($450) that I found at hamfests. That's
almost 5 times less than you suggest, but it works just fine. Much of
my VHF/UHF gear is converted commercial surplus bought at auctions or
homemade (average cost $50 to $70). The tower I got for taking it down
and relocating it. Etc. I think you are describing the station of the
800 number amateur and not that of the average amateur. It would be
interesting to hear what others think they have invested in their
stations.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.dra.com!netaxs.com!unix3.netaxs.com!feliccia
From: [e-mail] (Nick Feliccia)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Lost my 10-X What do I do?
Date: 29 Dec 1996 19:38:19 GMT
Organization: Net Access, Philadelphia, PA
Lines: 7
Distribution: usa
Message-ID: <5a6hbb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: unix3.netaxs.com

Back during the last solar cycle I had a ten ten number; I think I
remember what it was but I am not sure. Who would I contact about
verifying it?
Thanks alot.
Nick N3FKS
Respond to Email



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.dra.com!netaxs.com!unix3.netaxs.com!feliccia
From: [e-mail] (Nick Feliccia)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: WORLDRADIO Mag address
Date: 29 Dec 1996 19:39:48 GMT
Organization: Net Access, Philadelphia, PA
Lines: 6
Distribution: usa
Message-ID: <5a6he4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: unix3.netaxs.com

Is Worldradio , that pulpy ham rag still in publication? If so, does
anyone have a subscription address. It was pretty good.
Thanks, 73s
Nick N3FKS
Please respond to email.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:30 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 20:00:09 GMT
Lines: 23
Sender: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122112 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44927

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:

: And my point is, that is the classic definition of a self-selected
: poll.  Who the hell has the time to read and respond to this kind of
: poll?  I'm an ARRL member, and I don't even remember receiving it.  The
: point is that the 6% who DID respond cannot be assumed as representing a
: random slice of the League's membership, let alone all hams, or all
: Americans.

I don't disagree that it was a self-selected poll.  It would have been more
fair (not to mention more interesting to see the result) if ARRL had sent
one to each licensed amateur; although that would have more than quadrupled
the cost.  Of course, then the League would have been criticized for sending
it to all the SKs that are still in the FCC database.

I suppose even a random sample of the public would have been appropriate
also, but you'd have to find enough people who had some idea of what ham
radio is about, to get an intelligent opinion from the public.

It would be quite interesting to see how that sampling technique altered the
result.

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:32 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 20:11:49 GMT
Lines: 23
Sender: [e-mail]

Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:

: I've travelled all over the country on business, always with my HT.  I
: don't think that no-code techs operate any differently that hams who
: have passed a CW test.  The notion that all the jammers, etc. who can be
: found on VHF are no-code techs is so much baloney.

I take mine as well, whenever I travel.  Even in large metropolitan areas,
mostly I hear silence on the repeaters.  When there is someone on, it has
been a pleasure to monitor the conversation.

I've noticed minimal problems in this area.  We do have some
repeater-to-repeater interference; some intentional and most, not.
We have a couple of battles over coordination, and one well-publicized case
involving repeater ownership.  For a short time, we had some guy who liked
to come up on the club's 2m repeater and belch.  Heard him on the highway
emergency repeater once, as well.  But, at least the others on these
repeaters had the sense to ignore him, and he disappeared.

73 de Jim - KF6CR
San Bernardino, CA




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!mhv.net!Randall
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Lost my 10-X What do I do?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 96 20:26:44 GMT
Organization: MHVNet, the Mid Hudson Valley's Internet Connection
Lines: 23
Distribution: usa
Message-ID: <5a75on$nf9$[e-mail]>
References: <5a6hbb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: port165.mhv.net
X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.0 Beta #0

In article <5a6hbb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Nick Feliccia)
wrote:
>Back during the last solar cycle I had a ten ten number; I think I
>remember what it was but I am not sure. Who would I contact about
>verifying it?
>Thanks alot.
>Nick N3FKS
>Respond to Email

   Try contacting:

10-10 International net, Inc
643 N. 98th Street #142
Omaha,NE 68114-2332

Tom - KB2SMS



   Tom Randall            Amateur Radio - KB2SMS
   [e-mail]       Mt. Beacon Amateur Radio Club / ARRL / 10-10
                          Member: AAVSO Solar Division

   Opinions herein are mine and may not be that of MHV.NET!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:33 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: Radio Shack ..
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <5a413u$[e-mail]> <5a4cg7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 20:27:42 GMT
Lines: 24
Sender: [e-mail]

Ray Todd, Jr. ([e-mail]) wrote:

: I tend to agree with you, however, I was once hired by a company and the
: first two weeks of employement was strictly to gain product knowledge.
: I was forced to watch video tapes about the products as well as
: demonstrate pratical knowledge that I was taught.  Just imagin, when
: hired about 10 years ago, I was making a whopping $5.50 per hour.

: So my point?  The pay has nothing to do with it, it is the company's
: dedication to its' customer's by having trained it's employees to a
: minimum level of pratical education about the product's that it produces
: and/or sales.

The training that you received 10 years ago was probably exceptional,
although your initial hourly rate indicates that it wasn't a minimum-wage
job at that time.

Today, I'd say that such training is unheard of in retail sales.  Customers
have to know exactly what they want before buying, because most sales people
have enough problem simply operating the cash register.  Radio Shack
employees are typical among this population.

73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:35 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.229.2.176!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Info-Hams Digest V96 #1581
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 20:31:01 GMT
Lines: 60

In article <[e-mail]> jherm
[e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman) writes:
>
>1. In Hawaii, I hold regular QSOs with hams in the South Pacific and Asia.
>I'd grow old attempting to do make contact with those same folks if I only
>used 2m.

Perhaps those particular folks, but certainly you can work stations
in those areas regularly if you setup a satellite station. There
is activity all around the Pacific Rim on the satellites. Some of
it is even in CW if you insist on using that. I've contacted every
continent, including Antarctica (Argentine expedition), via satellite,
and my country count is probably around 130-150 (real ITU countries),
though I don't keep score. A lot of those contacts have been long
winded ragchews, others have been like the typical HF hello-goodbye
things. That includes a goodly number in the Pacific area, which is
a lot harder to do from here than from Hawaii due to the orbital
geometry. The mutual windows are very short and infrequent to
some of them, and presently not there at all to a few (come on P3D).
Of course the store and forward satellites moot that if you don't
insist on realtime.

>2. Your "high-speed" keyboard modes are only as fast as you can type. And
>those Pacific and Asia hams don't do digital. Are you suggesting I give
>up my QSOs with those folks because they don't have your mode of choice?
>And even if they did, how fast and efficient is real-time (live) two-way
>digital? How fast can you type error-free?

Perhaps those particular amateurs don't do HF digital, but there are
certainly digital operators in nearly every country of the Pacific
Rim. I've worked many of them. I only type about 120 WPM (relatively)
error free, but I can type ahead while receiving text from the other
station, which can effectively double that rate as far as QSO time is
concerned, and I can use canned descriptions of the station and other
routine things which are a part of most contacts, so my effective rate
is higher still. I can also exchange digital pictures (almost live from
the camera on the computer) as compressed jpegs, and other sorts of
binary files too, which you can't do at all. I find it very useful to
be able to send a Mathcad worksheet, or a schematic, or a picture hot
off the oscilloscope of a modulation constellation when talking about
my latest project. And I can typically do all that running less than
50 watts (often much less) to a wire antenna hung in the trees.

Perhaps slightly surprising, there are also a number of ships at sea
who run digital amateur stations. I had a long chat with an operator
on a Canadian icebreaker for example. I don't recall working a ship
in the South Pacific, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that
there are some active. I saw a listing recently of digital stations
in over 200 (ARRL) countries. I'm not sure how that translates into
real countries, but it should be obvious that most anywhere you'd
like to contact probably has a digital operator. And most of them
are delighted to have a long and somewhat technical chat because
they know we won't be interrupted by people wanting a QSL card for
some award.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.thenet.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 15:35:56 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5a6knc$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]> <5a6f1j$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <5a6f1j$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Well then stop whinning and do something about it. Find someone who
>can Df the jammers. Make an effort to befriend the Chatter boxes and
>guide them along a better path.
>Or just sit in your armchair and whine. It's up to you.

Unlike what you attempt to characterize, I >do< take positive action.

We have a special elite task force here called the "RF Commandos".
Equipped with the latest in transmitter fingerprinting technology,
advanced direction finding equipment, night-vision surveillence
equipment, this advanced tactical force routinely participates in
complex tactical and covert surveillence techniques.

However, the RF Commandos are limited to certain repeaters. We
prefer to eliminate the trash from our member repeaters, and let
them congregate on other machines.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.magicnet.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 29 Dec 96 21:17:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Lines: 14


J>I think the area 6 1x2 callsigns are down to 57, since the frantic
 >processing through 12-18-96.  Both K6CR and K6JL are now gone; a couple of
 >my choices.  There are still some acceptable ones left, assuming, as you do,
 >that all are actually assignable.

It is my belief that it was a mistake to have a 2 year waiting period to
re-assign callsigns.  It should have been one year.  The two year rule
puts too many callsigns out commission.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.magicnet.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 29 Dec 96 21:17:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail].
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Lines: 12


K>I hate to break it to you, but the demise of our hobby has nothing to
 >do with the lack of numbers. Its all about money. The day the government
 >figured out they could sell frequencies for billions of dollars was the
 >day ham radio was told it was living on borrowed time.

Agreed, this is a major reason.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.35.48.11!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!gossip.urich.edu!news.eff.org!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Experiences with 'CODE QUICK'??
Date: 29 Dec 1996 21:21:08 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5a6nc4$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf54a$b83533a0$429ed4cd@r-massey>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts2-dyn07.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <01bbf54a$b83533a0$429ed4cd@r-massey>, [e-mail] says...
>
>I am interested in anyone's experience with a Morse code training aid named
>"Code Quick", by Wheeler Applied Research.  The product's advertising
>insists that these tapes are a good way to increase your code speed.  What
>do *you* think??  Thanks in advance.
>----------
>73
>Ray N8XVG

"Code Quick" is the way morse code ought to be taught to everyone. I bought
mine after I got my novice license. Each pattern of "dits" and "dahs" is given

a phrase that fits the pattern, with the key letter emphasized. Remembering is

almost automatic. I highly recomend it to anyone who has struggled learning
code, or is just starting out. You won't be disappointed!

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!news.ysu.edu!odin.oar.net!malgudi.oar.net!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: 29 Dec 1996 21:28:52 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <5a6nqk$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts2-dyn07.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>...are what will ultimately settle the battle over Morse code as a
>required testing element in obtaining an amateur radio license.

Again, I ask you: on what grounds? Grounds of discrimination are what you
originally said. If that's to be the case then what would such discrimination
be based on?

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:30:55 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 58
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv15.planet.net
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> Golly Steve, your silvery rhetoric and rapier-like logic simply bowl me
> over.
>
Glad you like it, Daniel Webster was an ancestor of mine



> I'll refer you to the amateur's code, which states that "the amateur is
> friendly."  I don't think you are observing this tenet.  Or have you
> concluded that the Morse Code is more important than the Amateur's Code?


O I C, it's OK for you to attack an entire generation of amateur
operators, but if I voice my opposition..tsk tsk

good rebuttal.

Quite frankly, as stated, I have absolutely no opinion as to
procode/nocode.  Only those who want something for nothing.  Or prefer
not to work to achieve.  Kinda like getting a law degree from a matchbook
cover.  Accomplishes the same thing I guess.

>
> I've noticed this about some members of this newsgroup: they quickly
> switch from attacks on others' ideas to attacks on the individuals
> themselves.  Like you are doing Steve.  Pretty second class conduct, in
> my book.


So I guess it's OK to attack the OT's??  I don't consider being able to
retire and sit back and enjoy it in the same catagory as their support of
the code requirement.  I stnad by my original post.  To even equate the
two is asinine.  2nd class?? your opinion..great.  That and 80 cents gets
me coffee.  I still maintain that your type of logic is illsuited for the
legal system, unless of course you're Ron Kuby, and last time I looked,
you weren't.

You OWE all you insulted with your spock like logic an apology.  It was
to say the least, very insulting to the retired amateurs of the world, it
to say the most, a very typical post taken from the BOOK of CARL.  If yo
can't win on points, switch to the shotgun approach of insults.  Sooner
or later, you bound to get something correct or worthwhile said


OK so be it.  BTW, find any of those cheap Kenwood 940's??  I've lined up
at least 14 buyers, so let me know.  I can't tell you how much excitment
you've generated by that post.  Forget everything else, that one part was
worth the price of admission.



--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

Speaking out, but not with the lawyer jokes (even if called for)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:42 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Amateur's Code - a refresher
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:31:03 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a5uhs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44932 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122123

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] the self righteous
says...
> > 2) The Amateur is Loyal...he offers his loyalty, encouragement, and
> > support to his fellow radio amateurs, his local club, and to the American
> > Radio Relay League, through which Amateur Radio is represented.
> >
> >   interpreted: be a good person to other hams, and support the ARRL 'cuz
> >   it's our voice in the political arena.

But it's OK to equate the retention of the code requirement to the number
of retires I hear, cause I hears lots of deem on de air.  I be speaking
mys minds  (EBONICS 101)
> >
> > 4) The Amateur is Friendly...slow and patient sending when requested,
> > friendly advice and counsel to the beginner, kindly assistance,
> > cooperation and consideration for the interests of others; these are the
> > marks of the amateur spirit.
> >
> >   Basically, the golden rule.  Be kind to others because you'd want them
> >   to treat you well.


But not retired ham operator, beacuse they have the most air time and
they are the ones who are keeping the code requirement alive therebye
preventing others from fulfilling their destiny to acheiving HF nirvana


> >
> > 5) The Amateur is Balanced...radio is his hobby.  He never allows it to
> > interfere with any of the duties he owes to his home, his job, his
> > school, or his community.


Yea..right


> > --
>
> I think that the above code is a lot more important for newcomers, and
> experienced hams alike, to understand, than is the Morse code.
>
> --
> Roger J. Buffington
> W6VZV
>
> USC Law, Class of '97



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:43 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:31:08 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv15.planet.net
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In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
> ...are what will ultimately settle the battle over Morse code as a
> required testing element in obtaining an amateur radio license.
>

Call Roger, I'm sure he'll handle it pro bono.  Of course, he'll be up
against the AARP and the Gray Panthers, so he'd better be darned good.

Just kidding Roger, ya big siily.  Us aging babay boomers gota stick
together, cause in a real short time period, we are gonna be the very
ones you speak against so passionately
--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:44 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:31:11 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6b0o$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv15.planet.net
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In article <5a6b0o$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:
>
> >In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
> >
> >> Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
> >> majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
> >> datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
> >> keep it held back.
> >> Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
> >> us?
>
> When I spoke of data modes and 9600 being the highest available I was
> talking of the entire spectrum. Speeds are limited on HF, I know.
> Still it doesn't stop the U.S. Military(and otrhers) from using faster
> speeds on HF.
> The Pro-coders are afraid that if reliable datacomms of highspeed were
> allowed their precious CW might no longer be required as their only
> legitimate claim is it's use in extreme emergencies would no longer be
> valid.
>

I've left in your original post.  Help me out here.  Where did you
specifically mention HF??  OHHH qualifiers are now in place.  I C said
the blind man as he took out his hammer and saw.  Make a statement, get
hammered than say.."I didn't mean to say that, I meant to say this??"
Sorry, like a dodo bird...doesn't fly.


If you knew that speeds were limited on HF (as it is HF that will
affected by the removal of the code requirement), why ever mention it in
the first place, other than to troll for flames.

The 2nd statement..loved it..the military and others.   A big SO WHAT.
We are not the military, they can do things we've can only dream and as
pointed out, the other must mean commercial communications interests.
HMMMM  CARL'S AGENDA, the commercialization of the ARS..play for pay.  As
pointed out, to allow some of the previously mentioned datamodes would
require the change from Amateur to Professional radio service.

We are the AMATEUR RADIO SERVICE.  we are not the military, we are not
AT&T, MicroSoft, etc etc.  Remember it, learn it, love it

>

--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:46 1997
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From: "Ray Todd, Jr." <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack ..
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 13:35:12 -0800
Organization: TDS Telecom - Madison, WI
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a413u$[e-mail]> <5a4cg7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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> > to make a sales droid nuts:
> >
> > Is the monitor interlaced or non-interlaced?
> > Is the memory 30 or 72 pin simms?
> > Is the board EISA or VESA?
> > Does the serial card have 16550 or 8550?
> > Is the hard drive IDE or SCSI?
> >
> > These questions are "DUH" to us but just watch the RatShack people go
> > crazy when you ask em!
>
> Evan, Get real.. when YOU hire a kid at $5.00/hr. what would you expect
> him or her to know about computers?
> they couldn't even afford to own one let alone learn about them..
> Jim..

I tend to agree with you, however, I was once hired by a company and the
first two weeks of employement was strictly to gain product knowledge.
I was forced to watch video tapes about the products as well as
demonstrate pratical knowledge that I was taught.  Just imagin, when
hired about 10 years ago, I was making a whopping $5.50 per hour.

So my point?  The pay has nothing to do with it, it is the company's
dedication to its' customer's by having trained it's employees to a
minimum level of pratical education about the product's that it produces
and/or sales.

And to go hand in hand with the my statement above, remember this:

   "Radio Shack, you've got questions.  We've got answers"

I guess 'uuuh' over and over is a valid answer for a question!

Ray.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:48 1997
Date: 29 Dec 1996 17:36:48 EDT
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.voicenet.com!dccc.edu!jkc
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
From: [e-mail] (Jane Coyle)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Delaware County Community College
Subject: HTX-100 Mic pin wiring
Lines: 10


If anyone knows the pin assignments for the mic connector in the Rat
Shack htx 100 please let me know, I need to wire one up.
Oh, this is the 10 meter rig made by Uniden and sold by RS a few years
back, it has an 8 pin connector.
Please e-mail responces to [e-mail]
Tnx & 73
Bill
PS. Don't e-mail reply this message, it's on a friends account and
she's just letting me send the message!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.35.48.11!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!gossip.urich.edu!news.eff.org!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERS
Date: 29 Dec 1996 21:36:55 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5a6o9n$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>
>...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent to
>understand and accept modern methods of communication.

You imply that you want an intelligent debate, and you even say so when you
respond to flames. I've tried to accomodate you in a couple of posts, and
you've seemed to ignore my posts and responded to the flames by saying, "I'm
ignoring these irrelivant flames." (It's funny how you ignore such posts by
responding to them.) You take it even further by stooping to the level of that

which you openly dislike, and engage in trolling yourself!

Go figure.


Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:50 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-mailer: PowrMAIL for PowerBBS Ver. 1.5 (Beta 7) (rev. 1.00f)
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 21:47:00 (GMT)
Organization: Alaska's Power BBS - in the US dial 1-907-522-5312
Reply-To: [e-mail] (T.j. Tombleson)
From: [e-mail] (T.j. Tombleson)
Subject: 440 digital audio ?
Lines: 7
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.14.82.190
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.137.48.149!news7.agis.net!agis!newspeer1.agis.net!agis!nntp.alaska.net!aries.servcom.com!mailbox.win.net!t.j..tombleson

Hello:
   Looking for information on putting digital audio on 70 cm band, can it be
done?I am looking to use it on a 2 meter (Voice) Linked repeater system in
Alaska73's from T.J. KB8JXX Anchorage Alaska.
---
 * PowerAccess 1.50 To discover one knows nothing is the beginning of wisdom.






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:51 1997
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From: "Clifton T. Sharp, Jr." <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 15:52:50 -0600
Organization: as little as possible
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cgb$[e-mail]>
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Jim Kehler wrote:
> >      A even better product, though it is hard to obtain is a spray bottle
> >of Turbo Prop Wash.
>
> >  Avionics techs use it religously.  Knocks down SWR's  etc.
>
> >Its only available a airports.
>
> We only have one airport here, and I couldn't find that stuff.  Do you know
of
> any airports over there I could call and order some ?

Try a bigger airport. I live right near O'Hare, and there's just more of it
than they'll ever be able to put to good use. Main use here is on PA systems
at outdoor political rallies.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:51 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jerry AERO)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Learn Code Fast
Date: 29 Dec 1996 22:08:31 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

To learn beginning code fast, get the Code Crash Tape.

Guaranteed to teach code in less than an hour.

Reply to this message or send e mail to

[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:52 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Rick Cherry)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham radio to internet connection
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 22:35:39 GMT
Organization: Sprint - Southern Operations
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <5a6rnc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.245.43.13
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

I want to be able to connect my ham radio on my sail boat so I can
have access to the internet back home.  My home has a permenant hookup
to the internet via frame relay.  How can I do this?
Email [e-mail]
Thanks in advance



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:53 1997
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From: David Dean <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.shortwave,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Old Timers Radio
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:35:42 -0600
Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.shortwave:91491 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122155

Simon,
Pick up an issue of Popular Communications.  It's published in USA, but
available elsewhere.  It deals with several aspects of radio reception.

David

Simon Evans wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm looking for some information for my father, if anyone can help,
> please reply via email.
>
> The last couple of years of the war he was in the RCOS (RCS?)
> stationned on the Isle of Man and transcribing Japanese then
> (unsportingly I thought) Russian transmissions. I'm looking for any
> Net resources that might interest him with regard to this...pretty
> vague really.
>
> We've just bought him a set he used during the war an RCA (AR88?)
> which he's been delightedly glued to since. I've run a number of
> searches to find transmission,station, time etc details and found
> little relevant to the set. Most freq lists seem to serve either hams
> or scanner buffs. The set picks up loads of stations and signals,some
> of which are proving difficult to tie down. The set (as far as I can
> tell) seems to cover a band from about 500khz to 36mhz, although I'm
> no expert. He'd be interested in any English stations, but also is
> enjoying getting his morse back to scratch.
>
> Thanks,
> Simon.
>
> _______________________________________________________
>
> >  Simon Evans   [e-mail]   Liverpool UK  <
> _______________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!sonysjc!sonybc!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 22:55:27 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <5a817e$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a61md$[e-mail]> <5a6agb$[e-mail]> <5a7rg8$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-149.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) wrote:

>Drew Durigan ([e-mail]) wrote:
>: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
>: >
>: >I think Spew and Carl are one and the same person. Notice that whenever
>: >Carl disappears Spew shows up, and vice-versa?

>: Well, if you're smart enough to know how to trace a post, do so and you
>: will find out differently.

>: -Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>:  KF4DDM

Not possible.  Spew can't write a paragraph with more than two sentences.
Complex ideas get him confused.  Now Carl could be Spew's daddy..... and
that would make him Grandpa Lennys grandson.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 23:03:49 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <5a81n6$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6ceg$[e-mail]> <5a7s0h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-149.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) wrote:

>Real world skills would involve being able to setup and operate these
>modern miracles we have for radios, using a computer and learning how
>to spell with a minimum of errors.

How To Set Up and Operate A Modern Miracle Radio (by KH2D)

1. Remove Modern Miracle Radio from the box.

2. If Modern Miracle Radio has built in power supply, goto step 4.

3. Plug 12 volt power supply cord into Modern Miracle Radio. Goto step 5.

4. Plug 110 volt power cord from Modern Miracle Radio into wall socket.

5. Plug antenna into connector on rear of Modern Miracle Radio.

6. Plug microphone into connector on front of Modern Miracle Radio.

7. Push button on Modern Miracle Radio which says 'POWER' or 'ON/OFF'.

8. Push button on microphone.

9. Talk.

Sounds pretty tuff to me. Anybody who could make it thru all that without any
written instructions deserves an Extra Class license. No doubt in my mind.....

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: AC6V <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Net listing ?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 15:08:34 -0800
Organization: Author
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References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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To: [e-mail]

walt profota wrote:
>
> I sometimes come across different discussion groups on hf such as the
> Kenwood net,Satellite net,ect.I was wondering if there was someplace on
> the internet that would have a listing of all the nets there purpose
> time,dates and freq.
>                         Thanks
>                         Walt  N3JPR


Hi Walt. I have linked or listed all of the HF nets I can find info on.
Go to the DX Reference page below & click on "On The Bands" then "HF
Nets".

If u find others -- please forward and I will include them.

Good Luck
Rod in San Diego
--
AC6V DX Reference Page: http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
E-Mail: [e-mail]

Hark!  For I Have Hurled My Words To The Far Reaches Of The Earth!
What King Of  Old Could Do Thus?? -- AC6V


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: "Roman" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FT-101 Newsletter (FOX TANGO GROUP)
Date: 29 Dec 1996 23:50:30 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <01bbf5e3$3cd51740$2aceb7c7@#outlaw1>
NNTP-Posting-Host: grc-ny1-10.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 29  5:50:30 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

Does anyone know of an old Group called "FOX TANGO"?

                        -OR-

Does any one know of a Newsletter or have old newsletters on the FT-101?

Perhaps they have been reprinted or there is a Home Page which gets into
this.



  Thank you,

   Roman, N2KFL


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:58 1997
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From: Lawrence Davis <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 60-Hz QRM All Over HF spectrum
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 19:07:56 -0500
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf59a$0f502560$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.51.107
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Mike Kelly wrote:
>
> I am beginning to troubleshoot a serious 60-Hz noise problem I have here at
>
> this QTH and was wondering if anyone has any knowledge they would like to
> share with me that would help.  Thanks in advance.  Oh, I only have
> intermittent access to these newsgroups but will still try and monitor.  My
>

> In narrow CW mode, the noise appears to slowly roam up and down the
> different band areas.  For periods of times a narrow area will be quiet
> then this QRM will roll in.
>
> The QTH here is in a rural hilly subdivision with large lots.  There are
> high tension transmission lines running past the subdivision but probably
> no closer than 1 or 2 miles from this QTH.  I believe this 60-Hz problem
> has been here for years but since I work different modes and bands
> nowadays, I tend to notice it less.  Also, I can't say I see or hear it on
> the TV or FM radios here.
>
> Any ideas would sure be appreciated!
>  - Mike-AB4YY ([e-mail])

Mike;
   More than likely the problem is caused by electrical lines.  Arcing can
occur in transformers, insulators and "butt" connectors that are used in
conjunction with electrical service.
   I have also, just reciently solved a interference problem caused by a
television antenna distribution amplifier.  It was causing a signal with a 60
cycle hum to be heard intermittently on a "low band" (47mhz) frequency used
locally by the American Red Cross.  The distance was roughly 4 miles!
   Hope you get your problem resolved!

   73's De WB8VPC (Akron, Oh)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:55:59 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:09:38 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <5a85ig$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent to
>understand and accept modern methods of communication.

Said Spew Durigan while trying to hide behind his new AOL loser ID.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!feeder.chicago.cic.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:10:26 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5a85k0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-21.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>...are what will ultimately settle the battle over Morse code as a
>required testing element in obtaining an amateur radio license.

Said Spew Durigan while trying to hide behind his new AOL loser ID.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!feeder.chicago.cic.net!metro.atlanta.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:10:51 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5a85kq$[e-mail]>
References: <5a73u8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-21.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>>I seriously doubt that you will ever see the CW test challanged in a
>court of law, only because few hams have the $$$ to post such a
>challange.  The cost of such litigation runs into the 10's of thousands
>of dollars for the person filing the case.<<

>Very true.  This is precisely the reason why it hasn't been tried so far.
>But it only takes one ham or would-be ham to file a legal challenge.  How
>many lawyers are hams, or would like to be if not for the Morse
>requirement?  All it takes is one.  Sooner or later, a suit will be filed.
> When that happens, look for a petition to be filed to allow class-action
>status with thousands of other affected individuals then joining the
>lawsuit.

Said Spew Durigan while trying to hide behind his new AOL loser ID.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.ro.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:19:44 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts3p6.ro.com
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On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>Please visit my World Wide Web Site, you have never seen a page like it.
>You will see:
>
>1. A naked chic
>2. The writings of me and others on ham radio.
>3. The warm side of K1OIK.
>4. A test for your SVGA monitor
>5. A picture of me and my family.
>6. A Nazi connection in ham radio???
>
>
>Burt Fisher    Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics
>Amateur call           South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)
>  K1OIK        If you sit on the fence, it is a pain in the butt
>
>               [e-mail]    [e-mail]
>               www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169
Stop wasting bandspace with your sophmoric garbage. Grow up.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Evan Platt)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS/Trade: Yaesu 2070 dual band commercial for $700/bo or Icom F40.
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:22:16 GMT
Organization: Myne
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: octans10.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/32.339
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:101844 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122164

Have a Yaesu 2070 dual band commercial HT, 32 channels, rapid charger,
program kit & cable, software, manual, etc. Radio does
136-174/440-470. Can be modded to do 470-490 or any split by factory.
Or would trade for Icom F-40 99 channel UHF Upper split (440-490)
radio with like accessories (rapid charger, etc) or $700/bo cash.
Please reply asap, no reasonable offer refused.
Radio is in great condition, has a DTMF keypad, PL decode/encode and 2
tone decode board.
Must sell ASAP, $700/best offer. Feel free to e-mail your best offer
or call anytime, 415-939-1037!

Evan


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!nntp.coast.net!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sgi.com!enews.sgi.com!su-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!sonysjc!sonybc!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:23:13 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5a86c1$[e-mail]>
References: <5a7moc$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-21.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>>In this case, the general non-ham public must be included because the
>radio spectrum is a public resource.  As such the public must be
>included so as to know what percentage of the public might be
>interested in becomming radio amateurs if the code reqirement is
>deleted for access to HF.  Since radio spectrum is a valuable public
>resource, it is the obligation of any polster taking a poll that deals
>with said resource to include the public in said poll.  <<

>Absolutely correct.  This is what the Beepers fear most...that the debate
>will begin to hinge on the fact that the radio spectrum is a public
>resource, and that continuing to require Morse knowledge as a condition of
>using those resources is no longer justified.

Said Spew Durigan, hiding behind his new AOL loser ID.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:05 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Amateur's Code - a refresher
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:26:22 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a86hu$[e-mail]>
References: <5a5uhs$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-21.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44961 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122209

[e-mail] (Scott Rosenfeld NF3I) wrote:

>************************************************************************
>I think we can ALL find fault with ourselves here.  We are not just
>"ordinary" people - it's our duty to act in an extraordinary way.
>*************************************************************************

>1) The Amateur is Considerate...he never knowingly uses the air in such a
>way as to lessen the pleasure of others.

Thank God the 'air' doesn't include the internet.....

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.161.84.3!scanner.worldgate.com!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.agtac.net!news.cadvision.com!usenet
From: Raj Singh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Re: Pro & Cons on Cordless Telephone Headsets????
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 16:31:35 -0800
Organization: CADVision Development Corp.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf576$b2ead0e0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: agtc164.cadvision.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33396 rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:1373 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20968 rec.radio.amateur.dx:1725 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45466 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22587 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122222 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44968 rec.radio.amateur.space:9262

Lorenzo & Katrina Baldwin wrote:
>
> Hello everyone....I hate to intrude but I'm doing some research on the
> cordless telephone headset.  Would you all please take a moment and reply
> with some pros and cons on cordless telephone headset?
>
> Thanks,
> L & K

 The biggest pro is you don't have to learn the code to operate it. The
cons is it range is very limited, seem to run FM only
Happy New Year
Raj


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:07 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:31:40 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5a86rr$[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2gt4$[e-mail]> <5a4o7v$[e-mail]> <5a6al0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: guili-21.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>I want to just make clear that even though I favor the no-code side I
>also favor beefing up the written tests..

>Eric

Gee, Eric that's a new idea. We haven't heard that one before.......

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!news.rrnet.com!usenet
From: "Alan Schoberg" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: 30 Dec 1996 00:54:42 GMT
Organization: WQ0J
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <01bbf5eb$fc2937e0$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: blinoo.dot.rrnet.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155



Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<[e-mail]>...
> Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
> retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
> older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
> remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
> back in the late 60s.

I think Roger is correct that many hams are older people, but is that
necessarily bad?  No, it just means that retired people FINALLY have a
chance to concentrate on something fun after working hard for years on end.
 BTW, the last 5 CW contacts I made at random were with people from 13 to
57 years old.  Thats not a valid statistical sample of course, but it does
point out that many of us DO find the time for the hobby.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](William M. Pasternak)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: 30 Dec 1996 00:55:36 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <5a73u8$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: scr-ca4-11.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 29  6:55:36 PM CST 1996

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Steve
- KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) writes:
>
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>[e-mail] says...
>> ...are what will ultimately settle the battle over Morse code as a
>> required testing element in obtaining an amateur radio license.
>>
>
>Call Roger, I'm sure he'll handle it pro bono.  Of course, he'll be up

>against the AARP and the Gray Panthers, so he'd better be darned good.
>
>Just kidding Roger, ya big siily.  Us aging babay boomers gota stick
>together, cause in a real short time period, we are gonna be the very
>ones you speak against so passionately
>--
>Steve KF2TI
>ARRL LIFE Member
>
>BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
>OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH
>
>WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
>AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)
>
>I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN
>
>doors open in 5 minutes


I seriously doubt that you will ever see the CW test challanged in a
court of law, only because few hams have the $$$ to post such a
challange.  The cost of such litigation runs into the 10's of thousands
of dollars for the person filing the case.

Its not important enough to get any civil rights group to back it.  It
will never grab the headlines that groups like ACLU thrive on nor would
it set any form of precedent.

Besides -- it was attempted a decade ago by a Md ham and he was turned
away by every legal action group he approached -- and laughed at by the
majority of them.

de Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF
   Newsline On-Line


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!iol!not-for-mail
From: Paul O'Kane EI5DI <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 1996 IOTA Contest Results
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:09:46 -0800
Organization: Ireland On-Line
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup-111.dublin.iol.ie
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I)

The 1996 IOTA Contest results are available from
http://www.iol.ie/~okanep/sdimulti.html

or, by anonymous ftp from
ftp.iol.ie/users/okanep/iota96.txt

73,
Paul EI5DI

[e-mail]
http://www.iol.ie/~okanep


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 30 Dec 1996 01:11:59 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2guq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2

In article <5a2guq$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP wrote:
>>The best reason for keeping the CW requirement is because it is so amusing t
o
>>listen to the whiners.
>

Whether or not the no-code HF general ever happens, I don't know if it
will make much difference.  A lot of hams use code, I think, just cuz
ssb-wise, ham radio bands aren't really in the right spot when sunspots
are down.  20's OK, but it shuts down early evening -- which is when I
have free time.  40 is coverered with broadcasters and at most I hear
one QSO going on around 7157 or so.  That pretty much leaves 80 meters
as the only real voice band at night.  And the top 100khz of that are filled w
ith
carriers from AM broadcasters at night anyway.  That leaves a pretty slim
sliver of bandwidth for all this new activity in the general 80 phone band.

Add on top of this, that really to talk SSB on 80 you want to be running
over 500 watts, I think.  At least that's been my experience.  So, you
have to deal with all the high power interference with neighbors..

If we got a useable phone band at 40 and 60 meters that might make SSB
ham radio more fun in the winter.  But, for me, if I wanna talk SSB, I
need to run the amp on 80 meters.  If I don't then it's pactor/cw on 40.

Oh, and 80m here in NO.Cal doesn't seem really that overcrowded.  Except on
weekends prime time or something.  There is usually someone on the band
to talk to even late.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.245.3.50!news.primenet.com!news.primenet.com!not-for-mail
From: "Charles P. Hobbs" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: .435 in LA (waS: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 29 Dec 1996 18:15:02 -0700
Organization: Primenet Services for the Internet
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
X-Posted-By: @204.212.59.148 (transit)
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Jim Lowman wrote:
>
> Michael P. Deignan ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
> : You two must be lucky to live in areas so clean. Unfortunately, my
> : area isn't, and a lot of other hams that I talk to on HF indicate
> : the VHF problems on the local "2 meter good-buddy boxes" are just
> : as bad.
>
> Well, there's always the .435 machine in LA.  :-)
>
Speaking of which, I haven't heard a peep out of .435 lately . . .


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:14 1997
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From: "Richard B. Joerger" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 20:21:15 -0500
Organization: Icanect
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> <5a4q6s$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Dave Burr wrote:
>
> Ben wrote:
> >
> > I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> > timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> > and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> > pruning!
> >
> > Has anybody heard of this stuff?
> >
> > Ben
>

Let's not forget dB paint. A better gain improvement device never
existed.

Just remember to stroke up to increase gain, stroking down decreases
gain.

Rich


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.137.48.149!news7.agis.net!agis!newspeer1.agis.net!agis!excalibur.flash.net!not-for-mail
From: Gary Danaher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham radio to internet connection
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 19:31:52 -0600
Organization: Flashnet Communications, http://www.flash.net
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a6rnc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dasc2-36.flash.net
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Rick Cherry wrote:
>
> I want to be able to connect my ham radio on my sail boat so I can
> have access to the internet back home.  My home has a permenant hookup
> to the internet via frame relay.  How can I do this?
> Email [e-mail]
> Thanks in advance
There no doubt is a long answer to your question, but the short one is,
you aren't. First you have the question of commercial activity on an
amateur band, but if that doesn't stop you, the baud rate possible on
those frequencies isn't going to be fast enough to keep you happy on the
internet. Might check into the power limitations and frequencies for the
general mobile radio service.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:15 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 01:52:24 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5a8bj7$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ij1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6d9k$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>So if I don't code I am lazy? Effort is realative. My desire to toughen the w
ritten test
>does not qualify as effort?

Well, Eric, if it was an original idea, maybe it would.  But we've heard it SO
many times already, that it doesn't carry much weight any more.  As a matter o
f
fact it may have been assigned a number already, let me check........ Yep, it'
s
Kill The Code Excuse Number 56.  Sorry, you'll have to think of an original on
e.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:17 1997
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 20:07:42 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 72
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <5a4iku$[e-mail]>
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Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV wrote:
>
> Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
> retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
> older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
> remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
> back in the late 60s.
>
> The CW requirement tends, I think, to keep it that way.  Busy working
> people probably lack the time to master 13 WPM CW, and have other hobby
> alternatives, such as the internet, that do not require them to do so.
> Although working people see the relevance of a theory and procedure
> exam, (and are willing to take the time out of their busy schedules to
> prepare for and pass them) they tend to view the code test as a
> non-productive use of their time (which it is).  Therefore, in great
> numbers they pass ham radio by, or at best become no-code Techs.
>
> Now, I've got nothing against retirees; I hope to be one myself one day,
> and lots of these guys are my buddies.  But surely none of us think that
> it is a good thing for our hobby that our hobby has systematically
> excluded non-retirees.
>
> By the way, if you disagree with what I've written, then ask yourself
> WHY is it that HF is so overwhelmingly dominated, even on weekends, by
> retirees?  I think you may come back to my theory.
>
> As an interesting corellary to the above, the recent ARRL survey on
> keeping the CW requirement also contained a systematic bias in favor of
> retirees.  1) probably retirees with lots of time on their hands are the
> ones with the leisure time to discover, and respond to, such a poll; 2)
> the ARRL is to a very large extent comprised of retirees. (No, I don't
> have figures, but I'll bet I'm right.)
>
> --
> Roger J. Buffington
> W6VZV
>
> USC Law, Class of '97
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> "I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
> Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2

You need to think before posting if you don't want to be considered
flame bait.

What you hear represents a cross-section of hams in general. Ham radio
is less vital and less interesting than it was way back when. There are
simply fewer newcomers as a result.

The idea that "working people" have no time to master CW is simply a
cop-out. I am a working person and I can't begin to tell you the
additional talent in various areas that I've developed by applying
myself. Some of this outside work was a lot more difficult than learning
CW. Some people are just plain lazy. And I make that comment as someone
who does not necessarily support the code requirement.

The other major flaw in your ridiculous "analysis" is that your argument
hinges on the notion that these "retirees" have had time to learn CW
because they are NOT "working people" (and thus too busy to learn
anything new). This is the silliest premise. These retirees, for the
most part, entered the hobby early in life in their teens or *perhaps*
their twenties, pretty much like newcomers today. Just ask them!

Maybe these retirees were less lazy and more motivated than *some* of
today's "working people".

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:18 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:07:50 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <5a8cg6$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6e1p$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:49:47 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>>>
>>>If there were changes the band plans would remain the same. I even
>>>agree with setting off the current CW potions as they are for CW ONLY.
>>>That would help insure the   ----> beepers<----    a place to play.

>>Aw come on now, is that what it's getting down to, massive usage of
>>that "b" word? This person writes a well thought out post and
>>completely ruins his credibility with 1/2 of the people in this
>>newsgroup by using the "b" word.

>>73 (beep)

>Contrary to popular belief I do not use the BEEPER as a derogatory
>comment.

You have to consider the feelings of those to whom you direct it, Eric.  Let's
say, for example, that you lived somewhere in the south, like Biloxi,
Mississippi.   And someone came along and addressed you as a 'bare foot stump
jumping redneck hill billy'.  They might not have intended to be derogatory,
maybe they'd call ANYBODY in Mississippi a 'bare foot stump jumping red neck
hill billy'.  But you might be offended by it.

You have to remember why you are here. You are here to convince anyone and
everyone whom you can convince that you and other people should be allowed to
get onto the HF ham bands without a code test.  Calling other hams that use
Morse code 'beepers' won't help your cause.  Drop by Deja Vu and study the cas
e
of Squiggy, The Freedom Fighter.  You will quickly see that he turned more
people against no code HF than anything that has happened here in a long time.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news3.cac.psu.edu!news.math.psu.edu!feeder.chicago.cic.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:15:09 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5a8cts$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6cl6$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>This is so true.. But the facts are there. The average everyday ham
>that whines about keeping CW requirement could care less about the
>future of the hobby. All they really care about is keeping the bands
>less crowded so they can contest and DX without any real competrition.

Wrong again, Eric. That line is Kill The Code Reason Number 72.  You have to
work as hard at this as you do at VHF DX'ing.  Keep looking for something
original.......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!feeder.chicago.cic.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Amateur's Code - a refresher
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:17:54 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5a8d32$[e-mail]>
References: <5a5uhs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:


>I think that the above code is a lot more important for newcomers, and
>experienced hams alike, to understand, than is the Morse code.

>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV

>USC Law, Class of '97

Why ? Is the ARRL giving out merit badges now ?

73, Jim KH2D
Lorton Reform School, Class of '64




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:20 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:23:53 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <5a78un$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan4.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:


>M>The vote was a sham, pure and simple.

>M>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue will
> >be decided in the courts.

>That's the way!  Sue in court instead of leaning the code.  More of the
>"something for nothing" mentality I see running rampant in todays
>wannabes.

I have no idea who "M" is, but I won't support any court action
to eliminate code testing.  Additionally, as a practical matter, the
costs of any such court case are probably prohibitive since such
a case would not be one in which any damages could be involved.
That being the case, no attorney is going to pursue it just for
fun.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:22 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: 35% of the curriculum?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:28:37 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <5a797o$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <58o04q$[e-mail]> <58qija$[e-mail]> <58sbd8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbf540$5913c300$844692cf@john>
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"John Hughes" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>A CW exam takes approximately 5 minutes to complete.  Theory exams require
>much greater amounts of time to complete.  I don't know how important it is
>to quantify this, but its weight and relative position depends on how u
>choose to look at it.

>Gary Coffman <[e-mail]> wrote in article .
>> 3 of the 8 exam elements are Morse receiving tests. That's 37.5% of
>> testing devoted to a single thing. And 5 of the 6 amateur license
>> classes require passing one or more of those elements. That's 83%.
>> And that 83% gets privileges unrelated to Morse for passing Morse
>> tests. Clearly, Morse tests hold a disproportionate position in
>> amateur licensing.

Gary is actually downplaying the relavence of CW testing by only
applying a 37% assessment.  The reality is that it is 50%...simply
because it is a separate stand-alone, pass/fail element all by
itself.  No other aspect of amateur knowledge that is tested (not
any one other mode, not any specific regulation area, not any
technical subject) has the degree of importance that CW now
holds by default since it is a pass or fail subect area.



Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:22 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:33:12 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <5a79g6$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a61gm$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>       Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>And my point is, that is the classic definition of a self-selected
>>poll.  Who the hell has the time to read and respond to this kind of
>>poll?

>The League physically mailed the survey to a number of ARRL members
>and non-members alike. No information has been forthcoming as to
>the source of the data points that the League used in releasing the
>results.

Of those non-members, the questio must be if it was ONLY
to licensed hams?  Did it include people who may
have already tested, but not yet gained a license?

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:23 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:44:59 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <5a7a6a$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster> <5a42mg$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (T.L.Bryant) wrote:

>In article <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>, <Unknown> says...
>>
>>I have used CW almost exclusively for the past 15 years and I love it.
>>13 wpm did not come easy for me but in time I made it to 25 wpm.
>>Times are changing and we must change but we need not throw
>>the baby out with the bath water to make these changes!
>>
>>Proposal # 1766
>>
>>A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
>>One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
>>except in times of emergency... *Endorsements* are grandfathered
>>to all who have passed cw testing in the past and can be obtained
>>by passing code tests in the future. In this way we can perserve and
>>recognize the *skill* of cw and reward those who use it without
>>mandating it's use by others...... I believe it is better to bend a little
>>than to break. CW is a skill and Compromise is the way to preserv it.
>>Let us open the Door to the future yet retain and respect the past.....

>This is about the most logical and sensible answer to the Morse Code
>controversy that I've seen. I happen to be for retaining a morse code test
>requirement. An endorsement would satisfy me just as well. The endorsement
>could be much like a drivers license. Some states require a motorcycle
>endorsement before you can operate a motorcycle, so why not a CW endorsement
>for operating in lower portions of the HF bands? The SSB operators could stil
l
>have their portions of the bands, as well as AMTOR, RTTY, SSTV and other
>digital modes.
>I would think that it would be enough to satisfy both sides. Unfortunately
>there will be some who find fault with it. I can't wait to hear their reasons

>why.

Well, let me ask some questions:  What does the endorsement mean, what
is it supposed to accomplish?  The proposal seems to say that you
should NOT be allowed to operate CW in a designated HF CW band until
you have passed a minimum code operating speed test.  If that's what
folks want, I could care less, but I see no value in the proposal.

Also,  who's going to police the CW subbands to make sure someone
without an endorsement isn't operating CW?

Ironically, today's band allocations contain only two totally
exclusive CW subbands.  They are on 6m and 2m and any non-coded
tech is free to use them at whatever speed that person wishes.


Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:25 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 02:53:12 GMT
Organization: BL Enterprises
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <5a7alm$[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: stan4.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44952 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122176

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>>Why is it that some people automatically ASSume that every tech
>>>>memorized the question pool and seems incapable of having studied the
>>>>theory and data needed to pass?

>>>Because we know that most extras memorized the question pool. Why
>>>should techs be any different ?

>>Once again, Jim and (whoever else constitutes the we) know with
>>complete certainty that "most extras memorized the question pool."
>>Jim's comment again stems from the need to portray all
>>those opposed to CW testing as being of little worth (IMHO).
>>The effort to stereotype is unending on Jim's part it seems.

>You must be having a bad hair day Bill.  Since when do most extras
>oppose CW testing ?

Read what I wrote...you said most extras memorized the theory
AND why should techs be any different.  My comment is twofold:
You no ore know how many or what percet may have memorized
anything (be they extras or techs) and the comment has typically
been direced (as yours was) towrds techs to discredit them.
I said nothing about extras either favoring or not the CW
test.



Bill Sohl (Amateur Radio Operator K2UNK)
Internet Instructor, Mount Olive (NJ) Community School



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:26 1997
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From: "Chad Sims" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: 30 Dec 1996 02:58:41 GMT
Organization: wsnet.com
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <01bbf5fd$57b60be0$[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Casey <[e-mail]> wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
> On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
> wrote:
>
>
> >               [e-mail]    [e-mail]
> >               www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169
> Stop wasting bandspace with your sophmoric garbage. Grow up.
>
        I liked his webpage. I found a lot of humor in it. And I found your
comments rude and un-called for.

With regards,
Chad



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:27 1997
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From: "William P. Kantz" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.swap
Subject: Re: DX-70T vs IC-706
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 21:59:44 -0500
Organization: monmouth.com
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf001$0da87d00$c24392cf@AT&TWorldnet.worldnet.att.net>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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I have had a 706 for over a year and use it mobile and base on HF and
VHF. I have recieved many unsolicited favorable audio reports. The rig
does need the optioinal filters and I have found the NB more effective
when not using the rcv preamp.

73
Bill WD2AEV


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.idt.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Howard <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 22:06:08 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 73
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5a78un$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b1 (Win95; I)
X-Priority: Normal


------------211F2320127812
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Bill Sohl wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:
>
> >M>The vote was a sham, pure and simple.
>
> >M>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue
will
> > >be decided in the courts.
>
> >That's the way!  Sue in court instead of leaning the code.  More of
the
> >"something for nothing" mentality I see running rampant in todays
> >wannabes.
>
> I have no idea who "M" is, but I won't support any court action
> to eliminate code testing.  Additionally, as a practical matter, the
> costs of any such court case are probably prohibitive since such
> a case would not be one in which any damages could be involved.
> That being the case, no attorney is going to pursue it just for
> fun.
>
> Bill Sohl  K2UNK
> ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

Sure they will.  The ACLU does it all the time for deadbeats.

------------211F2320127812
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

<HTML><BODY>

<DT>Bill Sohl wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> [e-mail] (Roland Stiner) wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >M>The vote was a sham, pure and simple.<BR>
> <BR>
> >M>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and
the issue will<BR>
> > >be decided in the courts.<BR>
> <BR>
> >That's the way!  Sue in court instead of leaning the code.
More of the<BR>
> >"something for nothing" mentality I see running rampant
in todays<BR>
> >wannabes.<BR>
> <BR>
> I have no idea who "M" is, but I won't support any court
action<BR>
> to eliminate code testing.  Additionally, as a practical matter,
the<BR>
> costs of any such court case are probably prohibitive since such<BR>
> a case would not be one in which any damages could be involved.<BR>
> That being the case, no attorney is going to pursue it just for<BR>
> fun.<BR>
> <BR>
> Bill Sohl  K2UNK<BR>
> ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ<BR>
<BR></DT>

<DT>Sure they will.  The ACLU does it all the time for deadbeats. </
DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
------------211F2320127812--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-9.sprintlink.net!news.lightlink.com!light.lightlink.com!siram
From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 22:23:14 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: Ben <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>

> I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> pruning!
>
> Has anybody heard of this stuff?

Your local farm store should have it. Ask for Bull Shampoo.

I heard, that peanut butter did something similar at microwave level.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-ana-7.sprintlink.net!news.ro.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 03:27:17 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbf5fd$57b60be0$[e-mail]>
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On 30 Dec 1996 02:58:41 GMT, "Chad Sims" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>
>
>Casey <[e-mail]> wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
>> On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> >               [e-mail]    [e-mail]
>> >               www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169
>> Stop wasting bandspace with your sophmoric garbage. Grow up.
>>
>       I liked his webpage. I found a lot of humor in it. And I found your
>comments rude and un-called for.
>
>With regards,
>Chad
>
Are you Burts Parrot? I bet you sit on his shoulder and go "awwk, your
right Burt"! Awwk, your right Burt!"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:31 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 03:36:11 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>Please visit my World Wide Web Site, you have never seen a page like it.
>You will see:
>
>1. A naked chic
>2. The writings of me and others on ham radio.
>3. The warm side of K1OIK.
>4. A test for your SVGA monitor
>5. A picture of me and my family.
>6. A Nazi connection in ham radio???
>
>
>Burt Fisher    Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics
>Amateur call           South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)
>  K1OIK        If you sit on the fence, it is a pain in the butt
>
>               [e-mail]    [e-mail]
>               www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169
Hey Marc,
 Why don't you send me your real e-mail address you coward?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:32 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: info please
Date: 30 Dec 1996 03:40:46 GMT
Organization: Delphi Internet Services Corporation
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5a7dju$[e-mail]>
References: <5a4naa$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bix.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122170 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44948 rec.radio.shortwave:91500

Hi everyone,
I'm a blind ham, and am wondering if anyone can either tell me where to
find a dos or windows program that will give me the general questions in
an interactive mode?  Of course, you may also send it to me via uue
protocol, and that will be just fine.
                Thanks,




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.137.48.144!news2.agis.net!agis!newspeer1.agis.net!agis!news.monmouth.com!news
From: The Bakers <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 22:42:58 -0500
Organization: Monmouth Internet
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Casey wrote:
>
> On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
> wrote:
>
> >Please visit my World Wide Web Site, you have never seen a page like it.
>
..snipped..

> Stop wasting bandspace with your sophmoric garbage. Grow up.


Hey Casey:

How are things at "Starfleet Command" ??
Sheeeeesh, talk about sophomoric !

Burt rules!

M. Baker WA3ZXO
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:34 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!129.91.131.22!news.encore.com!psoper
From: [e-mail] (Pete Soper)
Subject: Re: Experiences with 'CODE QUICK'??
Organization: Encore Computer Corporation
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 04:12:15 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: sysgem1.encore.com
References: <01bbf54a$b83533a0$429ed4cd@r-massey> <5a5mmn$[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (Usenet News)
Lines: 17

[e-mail] (Geoffrey S. Mendelson) writes:

>Ray W. Massey ([e-mail]) wrote:
>: I am interested in anyone's experience with a Morse code training aid named
>: "Code Quick", by Wheeler Applied Research.  The product's advertising
>: insists that these tapes are a good way to increase your code speed.  What
>: do *you* think??  Thanks in advance.

>The best money I ever spent on amateur radio, and probably the best
>money I ever spent on anything. For 29 years I struggled to learn code,
>never getting above 3 wpm. With code quick in 6 months passed 13wpm.

What is it about Code Quick that sets it apart from the other training tapes?

Regards,
Pete
KS4XG


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:35 1997
From: [e-mail] (Evan Pallesen)
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!comp.vuw.ac.nz!welcom!evan.pallesen
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: When MIKE became MIC
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 04:26:36 GMT
Distribution: world
Organization: WELCOM BBS
Lines: 21

Guy A. Derose wrote,

DE>In article <54hfiq$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (M. E.
M
  >nger) writes:

DE>>Then again, back in the old days, before capacitors had pF's (puffs) they
h
  >>mmF's, or mickey-mikes (mickey-mics????), or was it uuF's? But I digress..
.

DE>To further digress, in "them" days capacitors were called "condensers" too.

They still are, if you own an old (cheap) enough car!

DE>Guy A. DeRose
  >Manager, Senior Physics Laboratory
  >Caltech

Evan Pallesen, Wellington, New Zealand. Tech. grade operators licence,
gave up my call 16 years, and four kids ago but still enjoy following
the old hobby when time permits.
---
 ■ OLX 2.1 TD ■ Press any key to continue or any other key to quit


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 04:26:52 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a8kks$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44972 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122226

[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>
>>Considered me a signator.
>>

>You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
>But you are a signator.

Well, Dan, if it's free, EVERYBODY wants one......





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](Gene G.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Mobile power for 2-meter HT
Date: 30 Dec 1996 04:32:15 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5a7gkf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga28-01.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 29 10:32:15 PM CST 1996

Until I can get a mobile rig I'm temporarily  using an HT with
batteries on the road. There is no cigarette lighter to use for power.
Here's my question - would I be better off to run power from the
battery or install a lighter and use it as a power source. It's a small
Toyota pick-up and putting in a lighter is no easy task. Also, if I run
direct from the battery most in-line fuse holders seem to be 15 or 20
amp - any recommendations on which to use?  Have a 5/8 mag-mount
antenna that works great - next item is power - advisories are welcome
and appreciated!

73
Gene Gach, KF4NOG
Lilburn, GA


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!155.212.1.8!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 29 Dec 1996 23:47:27 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <5a7hgv$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a61gm$[e-mail]> <5a79g6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122219 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44965

In article <5a79g6$[e-mail]>,
        Bill Sohl <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Of those non-members, the questio must be if it was ONLY
>to licensed hams?  Did it include people who may
>have already tested, but not yet gained a license?

We would have to assume, Bill, that since the ARRL has access to
the same FCC database online that you and I have access to, that
they pulled names from there.

I tend to doubt that they pulled names from the VEC "in-process"
lists (people who have "passed" an exam yet haven't obtained a
license yet) just has they probably didn't pull names from the
ARRL Membership "in process" list (those people who mailed their
checks to Newington but haven't been processed yet).

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:38 1997
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From: Arthur N. Ashley <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Visiting Syracuse NY, recommended repeaters?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 04:55:13 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5a7htm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bst-ma1-18.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Dec 29  8:54:14 PM PST 1996
X-Newsreader: NETCOMplete/3.0

   About one month from now I will be visiting Syracuse NY. Could you
please recommend repeater frequencies in the area as I would like to
bring my 2 meter HT with me.
Thank you,
       Arthur, N1NHZ, 73              Boston Amateur Radio Club
       mailto:[e-mail]         P. O. Box 15585
       BARC WEB Page URL:             Kenmore Station
       <http://www.barc.org/barc>     Boston MA 02215-0011



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!usc!newshub.cts.com!news.aloha.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 69 Standard Reasons To Kill The Code
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 05:01:48 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 79
Message-ID: <5a8mmg$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-151.kuentos.guam.net
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44974 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122230

69 Standard Reasons To Kill The Code, All of Which I Learned on Internet.
Please read this list slowly. Reading it too quickly may cause dizzyness.

 1. Morse code is old.
 2. Morse code is obsolete.
 3. Morse code is antiquated.
 4. The Coast Guard doesn't use it any more.
 5. It keeps millions of qualified EE's out of ham radio.
 6. Most qualified people are too busy to learn Morse code.
 7. Squiggy doesn't like it.
 8. It makes Squiggy vomit.
 9. It makes Squiggy curse.
10. Spew doesn't like it.
11. It makes Spew post to the CB newsgroup.
12. It makes Spew get more internet accounts.
13. It isn't hi tek.
14. Most people only wanna TALK on HF.
15. Grandpa Lenny doesn't like it.
16. It makes Grandpa Lennys Microsoft Bookshelf CD ROM vomit.
17. It is not an effective LID filter.
18. It is not an effective KID filter.
19. It is not an effective SPACE CADET filter.
20. It is not an effective FREAK filter.
21. It is not an effective JERK filter.
22. It is not an effective WIERDO filter.
23. It is not an effective means of communications.
24. It is not as fast as a T1 line.
25. Nobody saves lives with Morse code anymore.
26. Nobody can copy Morse code below the noise floor.
27. It makes Squiggies wetware dry up.
28. Frequency Grease doesn't work on CW antennas.
29. Retirees use CW.
30. Beepers use CW.
31. Olde Farthz use CW.
32. Nocoder's can't tell which repeater they are on cuz of CW iders.
33. Morse code is killing ham radio.
34. Morse code put AEA out of business.
35. No code HF'ers wil vote for tuffer written tests.
36. If we let nocoders on HF, they'll learn code 'later'.
37. Morse code is dead.
38. Old hams are trying to keep HF for themselves.
39. Extra class hams only took the extra test to piss off nocoders.
40. Some people 'just can't learn it'.
41. The FCC has no right to make rules.
42. The government has no right to make rules.
43. The ITU has no right to make rules.
44. The ITU and the FCC have no right to make regulations.
43. MARS doesn't use it anymore.
45. Jupiter and Venus don't use it anymore.
46. The ARMY doesn't use it anymore.
47. The NAVY doesn't use it anymore.
48. The MARINES don't use it anymore.
49. Squiggy doesn't use it anymore.
50. There is no technical advantage to Morse code.
51. No code General Class hams don't like it.
52. No code Advanced Class hams don't like it.
53. No code Extra Class hams don't like it.
54. Bill doesn't like it.
55. Bill never did use it.
56. The ARRL shouldn't make us use it.
57. The FCC shouldn't make us use it.
58. Squiggy HATES beepers.
59. Squiggy's wife hates beepers.
60. Squiggy's dog hates beepers.
61. Squiggy's gold fish hates beepers.
62. Squiggy's friends hate beepers.
63. It shouldn't be jambed down our throats.
64. Grandpa Lenny needs a new hobby.
65. HF is a 'boys club' for Olde Farthz.
66. Eric thinks it's 'silly'.
67. It makes Jerry tell procoders to 'kiss his ass'.
68. It's 'just not fair'.
69. Ham radio will END if we don't let nocode people on HF.

73, Jim KH2D
Support the ARRL - Join NOW !!
Call 1-888-277-5289 Toll Free to Join.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!super.zippo.com!zdc!szdc!news
From: "Jamie R. Dean" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.dx,rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.space,rec.radio.b
Subject: Amateur Radio Files & Links (FREE)
Date: 30 Dec 1996 05:12:10 GMT
Organization: Zip News
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <01bbf60f$8d51a0e0$[e-mail]>
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1160
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33389 rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:1367 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20965 rec.radio.amateur.dx:1722 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45455 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22582 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122198 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44959 rec.radio.amateur.space:9259

Come Visit The Western North Carolina APRS & Ham Radio Home Page. There are
lots of files to download
and links to all of the hotest ham and weather web sites on the net. And
best of all it's FREE!!

The Western NC Amateur Packet/Postion Reporting System & Ham Radio Home
Page
http://www.bluenet.net/ke4htm
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Expedition mounting woes, part 2
Date: 30 Dec 1996 05:32:03 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59sl52$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <59sl52$[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) writes:

> the process of setting up my VHF radio in the truck, I've
>come to discover the old mag-mount dual-band antenna isn't
>going to cut it. I was thinking of one of those new nifty
>glass-mount jobs, but I seem to recall a posting a while back
>that you cannot use these antennas with the newer "tinted"
>glass vehicles. This seemingly contradicts what I've seen
>locally, for almost every Explorer I've seen has the cell
>antenna mounted on the rear side panel or the rear flip-up
>glass panel.
>
>Does anyone have feedback/experience on that setup?
>
>MD

I loved my Avanti two meter, thru the glass antenna.  I used it on 4 cars
in succession.  It withstood cold weather, banging on trees, and a a lot
of abuse.  There are now at least three different brands of through (I'll
spell it correctly now) the glass antennas that work properly when
installed properly.  Unfortunately if the method used to tint your windows
uses a metallic coating, the capacity coupling that is used to feed the
rod won't work, because there is another plate between the two sheets of
the capacitor.  If you're desperate, try your FRONT window.  I did that
for two cars with rear window defrosting all the way up the window, and it
worked quite well for me.  Others though have gone crazy trying to get the
things to work, using the front window, so be prepared for frustration.
Every thru the glass antenna that I've gotten to work has had two tuning
positions with the adjusment screw, that offered good VSWR, but only one
of those two offered good reception.  The last time that I tried to use it
on my van, I discovered that the blue coating at the top was metallic.
All I can say is that I used words that the FCC doesn't want on the air.

Incidentally, the MFJ dual band through the glass antenna works rather
well usually, but it has one drawback, it only handles 50 watts of power,
which means in effect that anything more than a dual band handie is likely
to heat it up too much.  I had one in my wife's vehicle, but overheated it
with my Alinco DR 610T.  I now use the mfj short magmount when I drive or
ride in her car.

I also discovered incidentally that using a reflected power meter, like a
bird meter in the reflecting position works better and quicker for me on
tune up than a vswr meter or what I normally use, a SWR analyzer for
through the glass antennas.  I have no idea why, just thought I'ld point
that out.

If you have a clear window, try mounting it.  Avanti sells remount kits
for their antennas, but I never used one.  dual sided tape, and silicon
sealant around the edge worked rather well if I had to remount one.  Note
what you do to put the antenna on the first time, and then buy the tape
and silicon sealant for the second time.  Allow the sealant to dry before
you attach the whip, and it will stay on for years if you apply the
antenna to clean glass.  I used to wash first with ammonia, then rinse,
then dry with a clean cloth, then use vinegar, then rinse and dry again.
None of my mounts ever came off except when I removed them with a utility
knife.  73 de N8BLK/3  -art clemons-


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.campus.mci.net!n-f-m
From: [e-mail] (jerry shepherd)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Lost my 10-X What do I do?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 05:39:24 GMT
Organization: CampusMCI
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a6hbb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s01-pm01.pcc-uky.campus.mci.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

On 29 Dec 1996 19:38:19 GMT, [e-mail] (Nick Feliccia)
wrote:

>Back during the last solar cycle I had a ten ten number; I think I
>remember what it was but I am not sure. Who would I contact about
>verifying it?
>Thanks alot.
>Nick N3FKS
>Respond to Email
>
i have an old 10 10 disk and it shows n3fks to be 52361 73's wa4ucf


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:43 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: WORLDRADIO Mag address
Date: Mon, 30 DEC 96 00:54:09 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a6he4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1e.delphi.com
X-To: Nick Feliccia <[e-mail]>

Nick Feliccia <[e-mail]> writes:

>anyone have a subscription address. It was pretty good.

2120 28th St., Sacramento, CA 95818


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](William M. Pasternak)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 30 Dec 1996 06:16:44 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <5a7moc$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a61gm$[e-mail]> <5a79g6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: scr-ca1-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30 12:16:44 AM CST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122191 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44957

In <5a79g6$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
writes:
>
>[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
>
>>In article <[e-mail]>,
>>      Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>>And my point is, that is the classic definition of a self-selected
>>>poll.  Who the hell has the time to read and respond to this kind of
>>>poll?
>
>>The League physically mailed the survey to a number of ARRL members
>>and non-members alike. No information has been forthcoming as to
>>the source of the data points that the League used in releasing the
>>results.
>
>Of those non-members, the questio must be if it was ONLY
>to licensed hams?  Did it include people who may
>have already tested, but not yet gained a license?
>
>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ
>

A proper sampeling group for any poll cntains a cross section of all
members of society.  Even when it is a targeted specific poll.

In this case, the general non-ham public must be included because the
radio spectrum is a public resource.  As such the public must be
included so as to know what percentage of the public might be
interested in becomming radio amateurs if the code reqirement is
deleted for access to HF.  Since radio spectrum is a valuable public
resource, it is the obligation of any polster taking a poll that deals
with said resource to include the public in said poll.

Case in point:  When the FCC issues a Notice of Proposed Rule Making on
Amateur Radio issues, it invites "comments from the general public"  --
not just from hams.  And if you check the results of many NPRM's, the
non ham public does reply and many times it is the public -- not the
hams -- that decide an issue.  One that comes to mind is PRB-1 -- which
would have been far stronger if the builders, planned communities, etc.
had not commented.

And if there is ever an NPRM to abolish code as a requisite requirement
for amateur access to HF, I would think that numerous other services
will urge their operators/licensees to comment -- as will many
industries and other entities.

de Bill Pasternak, WA6ITF


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.telalink.net!telalink!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Doug Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 110 VS 220 Volts
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 06:33:12 GMT
Organization: Telalink Corporation, Nashville, TN, USA
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <5a72g5$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59ej8v$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59784s$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59rigk$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm3-01-dyn4-58.nash.telalink.net
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (derek hutter) wrote:
>Still think you guys are missing the point. On a 240 volt circut there
>is only 120 volt potential to ground.

In the US, true.  But the original question was posted by a European,
where there *is* 240V to ground.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.telalink.net!telalink!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Doug Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Radio Shack ..
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 06:38:02 GMT
Organization: Telalink Corporation, Nashville, TN, USA
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <5a72p6$[e-mail]>
References: <5a413u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm3-01-dyn4-58.nash.telalink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Nick Feliccia) wrote:
>Can you believe the sales droid at radio shack tried to sell a stero to
>mono adaptor for the optimus headphones I bought. He said they wouldn't
>work with mono ham gear otherwise. I told him I would come back tomorrow

With *some* ham gear, he could be right.  2-circuit 1/4" jacks only
contact the tip and the ring of a 3-circuit plug; the sleeve isn't
connected.  You'd hear the rig's audio out of only one ear.  (the
right one if I remember properly)

However, most modern ham gear is actually wired with a stereo jack.
The two channels are wired in parallel.  A small-value resistor
(roughly 100 ohms) is in series with each side.  (if you use a
2-circuit plug, you'd short the sleeve and ring, and without the
resistors you'd also short the tip and hear nothing.  With the
resistors, you're basically hooking a 100-ohm resistor across your
phones, no big deal)

73 Doug




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!newstf02.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 30 Dec 1996 06:56:10 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a7moc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>In this case, the general non-ham public must be included because the
radio spectrum is a public resource.  As such the public must be
included so as to know what percentage of the public might be
interested in becomming radio amateurs if the code reqirement is
deleted for access to HF.  Since radio spectrum is a valuable public
resource, it is the obligation of any polster taking a poll that deals
with said resource to include the public in said poll.  <<

Absolutely correct.  This is what the Beepers fear most...that the debate
will begin to hinge on the fact that the radio spectrum is a public
resource, and that continuing to require Morse knowledge as a condition of
using those resources is no longer justified.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!feeder.chicago.cic.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 07:20:00 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a8uph$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8b4p$[e-mail]> <5a8m1t$qhe$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-140.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>  Here's a thought, if a fraction of the time wasted on internet traffic read
ing
> and commenting was used on CW self education (get on the air), the issue
> would be dead.
>                                                                  Jim W9LZ

We have said that a thousand times, Jim.  It just doesn't sink in.  Why work
when you can wait ? Hope keeps some people alive.

73, Jim KH2D







From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: 30 Dec 1996 07:27:20 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a6nqk$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]>,
>[e-mail]
>says...
>>
>>...are what will ultimately settle the battle over Morse code as a
>>required testing element in obtaining an amateur radio license.

>Again, I ask you: on what grounds? Grounds of discrimination are what you

>originally said. If that's to be the case then what would such
discrimination
>be based on?

The Morse requirement will be challenged on the grounds that it is now
technically irrelevant, having been replaced by more modern technology in
nearly all applications...including the US Military.  The legal argument
will be that Morse knowledge should therefore no longer be required
knowledge as a condition of obtaining a US government-issued radio license
for the purposes of transmitting on publicly-owned radio frequencies.

In other words, there is no longer a compelling interest for the
government to require license applicants to demonstrate proficiency in
Morse code.  This is the key argument that will be used..."compelling
interest."  Is it a function of government to require a now-outdated
technology in order to receive a radio station license?  I don't think so.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!feeder.chicago.cic.net!news-w.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 16,181 Reasons NOT To Kill The Code
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 07:27:21 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <5a8v7b$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-140.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44988 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122257

Well, I was going to post them here but the file is a bit big, so I figured th
e
binary canceller would get me.  If you are interested, and have email software
that supports attachments, and can PKUNZIP a file, email me and I will
send you the list.

73, Jim KH2D
Support the ARRL - Join NOW !!
Call 1-888-277-5289 Toll Free to Join.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 07:29:27 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 18
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[e-mail] (Casey) wrote:

>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
>wrote:

>>Please visit my World Wide Web Site, you have never seen a page like it.
>>You will see:
>>

>Stop wasting bandspace with your sophmoric garbage. Grow up.

I visited the page, and found it to be a very well made page,
interesting, and informative.

Not sure why you have such a problem, unless of course you had gotten
worked up into a frenzy of anticipation about seeing a naked chic!




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:52 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Blake Bowers)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 07:30:36 GMT
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a7jak$[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Burt Fisher <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Please visit my World Wide Web Site, you have never seen a page like it.
>You will see:

Burt,

        I went there.  I saw it.  I liked it.


Good job.   And yes, I had figured out what the naked chic would be,
far in advance of clicking on the icon.

Have a great day.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.58.0.35!news.structured.net!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 30 Dec 1996 07:30:58 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 19
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a7r3i$[e-mail]>
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NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Clint Bradford ([e-mail]) wrote:

: >>Look autism up in a medical dictionary. You will find it is a
: >>preoccupation with fantasy as a mechanism to escape reality.

: Please do not insult victims/families affected by autism by making it
: appear as if it is a affliction of choice, Bill, in any argument here.

: I don't think that's what you meant....

I was not insulting the victims of autism. It is NOT a choice a person
makes, and can be very crippling.  I was just providing a very simple
description of what it is - to a person who misused the term.

My apologies if it appeared that I felt there was any choice. I should
have made my statement more clearly.

Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:53 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: 30 Dec 1996 07:32:05 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a73u8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>I seriously doubt that you will ever see the CW test challanged in a
court of law, only because few hams have the $$$ to post such a
challange.  The cost of such litigation runs into the 10's of thousands
of dollars for the person filing the case.<<

Very true.  This is precisely the reason why it hasn't been tried so far.
But it only takes one ham or would-be ham to file a legal challenge.  How
many lawyers are hams, or would like to be if not for the Morse
requirement?  All it takes is one.  Sooner or later, a suit will be filed.
 When that happens, look for a petition to be filed to allow class-action
status with thousands of other affected individuals then joining the
lawsuit.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:54 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: 30 Dec 1996 07:36:11 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a6c57$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>
>M>The vote was a sham, pure and simple.

>M>Ultimately, a lawsuit will be filed to open the bands and the issue
will
> >be decided in the courts.

>That's the way!  Sue in court instead of leaning the code.  More of the
>"something for nothing" mentality I see running rampant in todays
>wannabes.<<

Like it or not, that's the way problems are solved in today's deteorating
society.  Actually, I believe the Morse requirement has a very good chance
of being overturned in court for the reasons I've outlined in the
"LAWSUITS" thread on this newsgroup.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:55 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 30 Dec 1996 07:37:44 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 18
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a7rg8$[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a61md$[e-mail]> <5a6agb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Drew Durigan ([e-mail]) wrote:
: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
: >
: >I think Spew and Carl are one and the same person. Notice that whenever
: >Carl disappears Spew shows up, and vice-versa?

: Well, if you're smart enough to know how to trace a post, do so and you
: will find out differently.

: -Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
:  KF4DDM

Since you both use dial up providers for posts, there is no way to tell
where you are located. I doubt if your service provider would give that
information out freely.

Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:56 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 69 Standard Reasons To Kill The Code
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 07:43:22 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5a905a$[e-mail]>
References: <5a8mmg$[e-mail]> <5a8rja$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>HEY! You only mentioned me once. I am truly heart broken :)

>P.S. Your gunna love my list

>Eric

I can hardly wait. Oh, and that should be 'YOU'RE' gunna love my list,
as in 'you are'.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:57 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: 30 Dec 1996 07:46:25 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5a7s0h$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6ceg$[e-mail]>
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KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:
: >ps I like code, I wish I was better at it, there is less shit to put up
: >with there!
: Well once I get over the overwhelming encouragement to new hams you
: exude...

: You cry about newhams not knowing squat about electronics. So, lets
: make the written test tougher. Eliminate CW requirement and improve
: REAL WORLD skills with a strigent written test.
: Then you can stop whinning.

If you want "real world", then get rid of the electronics portion as
well. You know as well as I do that most Hams will never build any
equipment - other than possibly some simple dipole antennas.

Real world skills would involve being able to setup and operate these
modern miracles we have for radios, using a computer and learning how
to spell with a minimum of errors.

All else is artificial, and unnecessary.

--
Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:56:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!138.95.18.2!wilbur.sequent.com!newsfeed.orst.edu!news.peak.org!billn
From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: 30 Dec 1996 08:07:24 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a7t7s$[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2gt4$[e-mail]> <5a4o7v$[e-mail]> <5a6al0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: peak.org
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:

: I want to just make clear that even though I favor the no-code side I
: also favor beefing up the written tests..

Well, I don't.  I want to remove ALL requirements except one. Just send
in a boxtop from a specially marked package of Cheerios or Corn Flakes.
If you cannot afford a package, just see your local social worker, who
will provide one (and a postage stamp) to mail it. They will even help
you fill out the form - if you have never learned to read and write.

That gets it down to pure communication, and gets rid of all the unnecessary
tests that discriminate against those to lazy to earn their privileges.

Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:00 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Geoffrey S. Mendelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Experiences with 'CODE QUICK'??
Date: 30 Dec 1996 08:17:17 GMT
Organization: The hebrew University of Jerusalem
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <5a7tqd$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf54a$b83533a0$429ed4cd@r-massey> <5a5mmn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: cs4.cs.huji.ac.il
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Pete Soper ([e-mail]) wrote:
: I wrote:


: >The best money I ever spent on amateur radio, and probably the best
: >money I ever spent on anything. For 29 years I struggled to learn code,
: >never getting above 3 wpm. With code quick in 6 months passed 13wpm.

: What is it about Code Quick that sets it apart from the other training tapes
?


Every other course I have used expects you to learn code by beeping at you.
If you don't have a good sense of timing, then you can't learn code that way.

Code quick uses "sound alike phrases" that convert code into words.
Other learning techniques are used to make learning quicker.

Code quick make it possible for you to learn code. It is a learning
system. There is also a pc program to help you learn code using the system,
but it is an additional item, not a replacement for the tapes.


Once you have learned the code, nothing is better than on the air
practice to get your speed up. One of the main advantages of code quick
is that you can copy sloppy (i.e. real world) code as you learn it. To me
it made copying code enjoyable.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson  (4X/N3OWJ), Senior Programmer
Computer Science Institute, Hebrew University, Jerusalem, Israel
[e-mail] (02) 65 85692  Fax [phone]  MANGO 050-961-978.
To get pgp public key: "finger [e-mail]"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:01 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Date: 30 Dec 1996 08:28:49 GMT
Organization: Public Electronic Access to Knowledge,Corvallis,US
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <5a7ug1$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59rkol$[e-mail]> <59vb96$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fsi$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122217 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44963 rec.radio.shortwave:91521

Bill Sohl ([e-mail]) wrote:
: Rob Lilley <[e-mail]> wrote:

: >This is getting arcane and esoteric.  The issue is simple: CW is a form of
: >effective communications using rudimentary equipment which will perform
: >well under conditions adverse to complex systems.  Those who *master*
: >radio communications should have a working knowlege of it.

: WHY?

: What is it that makes the person who knows Morse a better
: radio communicator than someone who doesn't?

What is it that makes the person who knows electronic theory a better
radio communicator than someone who doesn't?

: What VALUE does it provide to those that know it versus those that
: don't...as measured in terms that are quantifiable or necessary
: in order to be an effective radio communicator?

What VALUE does it provide to those that know it versus those that
don't...as measured in terms that are quantifiable or necessary
in order to be an effective radio communicator?

: Having a working knowledge means what?  1 wpm, 10, 13, 20???

Having a working knowledge means what? Ohms law, Smith charts, ability to
design a complete station from scratch???

: Bill Sohl  K2UNK
: ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

--
Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.monmouth.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.250.118.17!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
From: richard <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: .435 in LA (waS: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:48:06 -0800
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <19961225161900.LAA020 <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: max2-gg-ca-37.earthlink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I)
To: "Charles P. Hobbs" <[e-mail]>

Charles P. Hobbs wrote:
>

> Speaking of which, I haven't heard a peep out of .435 lately . . .

Well you certainly are observant Charles! I think it's time to start
ANOTHER long thread on .435 in LA because you guys here in this NG
haven't been giving it much attention lately. Well I take that
back because Roy Tucker and his myriad of vanity calls took about
4 weeks to discuss in many threads.

As for the .435 machine itself there are SEVERAL problems with it
including a deaf receiver and the transmitter is only belching out
500 milliwatts or less at this time. All for the better I suppose.
It's much quieter now and most of the "Repeater Power Cows" have
gone elsewhere.

For those of you not familiar with the 147.435 box in LA please consult
its associated web page at:
http://dmz.net/n6uzs/buzz.htm
You can read all about it and Roy Tucker N6TK the owner there.

And come to think of it Roy gets excited when you talk about him
on the Internet. Brighten the old farts day with a reply. ;)

73 and Happy Surfing,
Richard N6UZS.
aka Buzz


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:03 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Where Are Rogers Retirees ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 09:03:21 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <5a94rc$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4kv8$[e-mail]> <5a78nu$[e-mail]> <5a8qti$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-143.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>Let me see if I can find a word that fits how I feel about your post..

>>>Hmmmmmm...... BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>>Yup BINGO says it all :)

>>Let's hope BINGO doesn't fit Rogers post in your case, Eric.  You aren't
>>supposed to OPERATING on HF, so hopefully you aren't talking to too
>>many retirees on 75 meters..... Maybe you can tell how old people are by
>>listening to them ?

>>73, Jim KH2D

>Well actually listening to a QSO you tend to learn alot. Like if you
>were to read an entire post from time to time....

I missed the word 'listening' in your post. Or is this another case of  'I see
'
said the blind man, then he got out his hammer and saw. You got
hammered......... never mind. You've seen this already.   I hope.

Now in this post, you said you 'learn alot' by listening. I assume you are
listening to Rogers retirees, cuz you said BINGO.  So I guess I can assume tho
se
retirees aren't so bad after all, if you are learning something by listening.
Think about this for a minute. Pass the code test. You could probably learn a
lot MORE from talking to them.

But then again, if you take your own advice, and read the WHOLE post, includin
g
the subject, 'CW FAVORS RETIREES', then I would assume that Rogers retirees ar
e
on CW. And you couldn't learn much if they were on CW, because you can't
understand what they are talking about.   If they are on SSB, then the subject
should be 'SSB FAVORS RETIREES'.  Or whatever.  I'll fix it. I'll change the
subject.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:04 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: READ ME FIRST !! A MIRACLE !!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 09:05:58 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5a9507$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-143.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jerry AERO) wrote:

>To learn beginning code fast, get the Code Crash Tape.

>Guaranteed to teach code in less than an hour.

>Reply to this message or send e mail to

>[e-mail]

Well, there you have it. Now NOBODY has an excuse for not learning code.
Next week we should ALL be extras.......

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:05 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Mobile power for 2-meter HT
Date: 30 Dec 1996 09:12:08 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a7gkf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <5a7gkf$[e-mail]>,
[e-mail](Gene G.) writes:

>Until I can get a mobile rig I'm temporarily  using an HT with
>batteries on the road. There is no cigarette lighter to use for power.
>Here's my question - would I be better off to run power from the
>battery or install a lighter and use it as a power source. It's a small
>Toyota pick-up and putting in a lighter is no easy task. Also, if I run
>direct from the battery most in-line fuse holders seem to be 15 or 20
>amp - any recommendations on which to use?  Have a 5/8 mag-mount
>antenna that works great - next item is power - advisories are welcome
>and appreciated!
>
>

First, You have no need to use anything more than a 4-5 amp fuse in your
wiring for this setup unless you're planning on adding an amplifier for
the HT.  There are covered fuseholders which will take any of the blade
fuses from 3 amps on up to 30 amps.  You are well advised to fuse, and run
directly from the battery.  Underfusing a connection is a lot safer
practice than overfusing.  A blown fuse on your radio wiring is a lot
easier to deal with than a burned up truck, and cheaper too.  Going
directly to  the battery is not only wiser in lowering the amount of noise
that you'll hear but it also lessens the chances for things like
alternator whine.   I also suggest that you run heavy guage wire, like No.
6 AWG, because you never know when you'll be tempted to try HF, or run an
amplifier for even 2 meter dxing, and having to do it twice is really
annoying.  Remember, the fuse is to protect the radio & prevent fires, so
a small one with large guage wire isn't a waste.  Incidentally, you're
probably better off with the automobile type fuses that come in blades,
rather than the long thin glass ones I think you're describing, you
haven't lived until you find out that your rig won't work because your
glass fuse got vibrated to death.

That being said, look in the fusebox in your cab.  There are often unused
connections that either only require a fuse and minor wiring, or no wiring
with one of the radio shack special fuse with a wire attached to one end
to give you an extra dc connection.  In any event be sure to route your
wiring safely, where it won't get under foot or rubbed by anything, and
isn't likely to cause a fire.  Above all, fuse, fuse, fuse, fuse.  Fuses
are cheap, buy an extra set, and put them in the glove compartment.  73 de
n8blk/3  -art clemons-


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-hk.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsgate.cuhk.edu.hk!news.glink.net.hk!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.112.192.109!newsfeed.one.net!news.one.net!news
From: Jim Cross <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.shortwave
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 05:33:34 -0400
Organization: Vacuum Tubes Unlimited
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <59rkol$[e-mail]> <59vb96$[e-mail]> <59vnph$[e-mail]> <5a1isd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fsi$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4hg4$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: port-1-29.cinternet.net
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Well, as someone who aspires to be a ham, I'll wade in with my 2 cents
worth:)

Although the CW requirement should not (and was not originally designed
to) be used to weed out the non-committed. It does have that effect.
However we should not use the outcome to dispute the requirement.

I am in favor of a CW requirement, since as someone previously said, the
intelligence in a CW message can be received under very adverse
conditions, and it can be transmitted by very primitive equipment. Just
listen to the non-directional beacons on longwave sometime. Also, given
the potentially primitive nature of the equipment needed, the ability to
transmit CW has a minor civil defense aspect.

The need for learning CW is especially true, given that the government
is phasing out its use. Not very long from now, only other hams will be
able to understand emergency messages sent by CW.

Maybe the test should just be modified. Since, using my reasoning, CW is
essentially an emergency backup, last resort kind of thing, maybe speed
is less important, and they just need to test for accuracy in
distinguishing letters and symbols at 3-5 WPM (similar to some
aerobeacons).

Jim Cross - [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com!not-for-mail
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 03:51:04 -0600
From: FAISAL,9K2CA <[e-mail]>
Subject: WTB:ALPHA HF AMPLIFIER
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
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X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/3.0Gold (Win16; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: FAISAL,9K2CA <[e-mail]>
Lines: 10
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:101888 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122215 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45462

I am looking for 76,77 Alpha hf amplifier in excellent condition.


Thanks

FAISAL,9K2CA

E-MAIL:[e-mail]
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.enteract.com!news.inetnebr.com!news.mid.net!newsfeeder.gi.net!wormer.fn.net![e-mail]
From: Guy Clark <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Lost my 10-X What do I do?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 04:52:46 -0500
Organization: Not Organized
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a6hbb$[e-mail]> <5a75on$nf9$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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(Nick Feliccia) wrote:
> >Back during the last solar cycle I had a ten ten number; I think I
> >remember what it was but I am not sure. Who would I contact about
> >verifying it?
> >Thanks alot.
> >Nick N3FKS
> >Respond to Email
>

Nick; lost your origional post and address, sorry.
In my data base, N3FKS was assigned 10X# 52361.
Enjoy.  10 is not dead (well, not for more than
a few months at a time :) Get on so I can work you.
73 de Guy

--
Track record is all that counts.
Guy Clark  is  [e-mail]
Try my homepage: http://members.aol.com/ab0dp/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!feed1.news.erols.com!insync!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.248.25.97!novia!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Paul W. Schleck K3FU)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: is there any activity, anywhere, in amateur spread spectrum?
Date: 30 Dec 1996 10:55:11 -0000
Organization: Novia Internetworking <> 33.6kbps dialup; 402/390-2NET
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <5a8s5f$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: oasis.novia.net
X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.1 (NOV)

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:

>Greetings fellow amateurs.
>I would like to know if there is any amateur activity, experiemental
>or established, using spread spectrum.
>I am curious about the technique(s) used, which band(s), etc.
>Larry ve3fxq

The Amateur Radio Elmers Resource Directory:

http://www.novia.net/~pschleck/elmers/

has entries for a few spread spectrum Elmers, as well as a pointer to
the the excellent SS page on the TAPR web site.  In particular:

http://www.novia.net/~pschleck/elmers/ss.html

--
73, Paul W. Schleck, K3FU
[e-mail]
http://www.novia.net/~pschleck/
Finger [e-mail] for PGP Public Key


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: Info / MODS for Standard C568 Radio
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 11:16:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 28


===========================================================================
Subject: Re: Standard C568A -  TX Mod
From: Larry Smith <[e-mail]>


STANDARD C568 TX MOD
Open the radio with care.  Remove the four screws at the back of the radio
and remove the back remove 2 screws from the front of the metal plate
at the bottom of the unit and open the front panel.  Be careful not to
pull the ribbon connectors.  The logic board is on the back of the key pad.

There locate VR281 and VR265 above is a copper screen.  Remove the sub
board located over the screen by gently pulling downwards.  You then
will have to lift back the copper screen lifting from the left side.

Follow a line up from directly in between the two VRs approx 5mm above
mounted horizontaly is a 47k chip resistor . Remove it.  Reassemble and
do a full reset.  TX will now be activated wide band.

Due to the extreme miniturisation the job is not easy.  You will need an
iron with a very small tip (battery powered) a good magnifying glass and
3 hands. I take no responsibility for this mod. Do it at your own risk.
However it worked fine on mine.

Larry G4OXY

y


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: RE: info please
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 11:31:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <5a7dju$[e-mail]>
Lines: 55


>>I'm a blind ham, and am wondering if anyone can either tell me where
>>to find a dos or windows program that will give me the general
>>questions in an interactive mode?

The absolute BEST Ham Exam Programs I found were those by
PRACTICAL-ly Software. DOS and Windows versions available, too!
There is no "sound" capability for a blind user, though...but you
might find these programs' test printing capability useful if
you have an OCR-to-speech system set up. BEST OF LUCK TO YOU -
we hope to see you announce your new Callsign here in 1997!

-Novice/Technician Class Manager
-General Class Manager
-Advanced Class Manager
-Extra Class Manager

A FEW FEATURES:
-Simple, intuitive system for preparing for Ham License Exams
-Perfect tool for Volunteer Examiners for creating tests
-Manages entire question pool
-Begin reviewing at any question
-Review questions sequentially or randomly
-Shuffle answers for each question if desired
-Take a test from randomly chosen questions (within the guidelines
 of the FCC testing criteria)
-Full set of options for customizing tests, including a Test Design
 Screen
-Print complete tests with printer-resolution graphics, along with
 answer sheets and score key
-Save tests to disk for later use
-Study assist screen tells you what areas you need to study after
 taking a test
-Pop-up on-screen calculator
-Automatically "remove" a question from the "question card deck"
 when answered correctly, if desired
-Manually remove any question from the "deck" at any time
-Reinsert into the "deck" any previously removed question
-Start review all over by putting all "cards" back into the deck
-Show answers always or only after an attempt at the answer has
 been made
-Saves all program settings so you can "pick up where you left off"
-Print any part of the question pool with printer-resolution graphics,
 or just print a sheet showing all the graphics

They're popular downloads from my BBS (see below)...in the HAM EXAM
File Area!

======================================================================
ATTENTION to Details BBS    [phone]    Sysop: Clint Bradford
5085 Trail Canyon Drive                     Internet: [e-mail]
Mira Loma, CA  91752-1685                      Voice: [phone]

MEMBER: AOP, ESC, ASP, EFF, NCSA           JFK Assassination Materials
======================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.207.169.10!holonet!colossus.holonet.net!atdbbs!clint.bradford
From: [e-mail] (Clint Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 11:34:00 GMT
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: ATTENTION to Details BBS - Mira Loma, CA
Distribution: world
References: <5a4ld0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <32C12A47
Lines: 17


>>Why does it seem apropos to ask:  "...where is Wayne Green of 73 --
>>the no-code crusader -- at a time -- and place -- like this????"

He is too busy, Bill, eliminating AIDS from the Earth with his
electro-shock gimmickry.

By the way...NEWSLINE had a noteworthy anniversary recently - Issue
Number 1,000! You can't receive enough accolades for the marvelous work
you do for the entire Amateur community, Bill. THANKS and we look
forward to another 1,000 Issues!


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
------------------------------------------------------------------------


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:14 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!node2.frontiernet.net!usenet.logical.net!dciteleport.com!feed1.news.erols.com!feeder.chicago.cic.net!metro.atlanta.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 08:01:52 -0500
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a6nqk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-108.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

MN Maniac wrote:
>
>
> In other words, there is no longer a compelling interest for the
> government to require license applicants to demonstrate proficiency in
> Morse code.  This is the key argument that will be used..."compelling
> interest."  Is it a function of government to require a now-outdated
> technology in order to receive a radio station license?  I don't think so.

Unfortunately, your logic is based on a misunderstanding of government's
burden of proof.  You are plain wrong that "compelling interest" is the
standard.  It most certainly is not.  The standard in this context is
"rational basis," a far lower standard.  Government has only lost 1 case
challenged under rational basis in all history.  Pretty slim odds.

You can see why.  Anyone can disagree with the government's position on
lots of things.  It is not the courts' role to second guess every
governmental agency or Congressional decision.  Nor do they.  Hence the
incredibly deferential "rational basis" standard.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 08:03:38 -0500
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-108.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
>
>Us aging babay boomers gota stick
> together, cause in a real short time period, we are gonna be the very
> ones you speak against so passionately

I do not speak "against" anyone.  I simply believe that our hobby is
doomed unless it attracts younger people to the hobby.  Of course we
want to keep all of our current members too!

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:16 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 30 Dec 1996 08:13:46 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <5a8f6a$[e-mail]>
References: <5a7moc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122224 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44970

In article <5a7moc$[e-mail]>,
        William M. Pasternak <[e-mail]> wrote:

>A proper sampeling group for any poll cntains a cross section of all
>members of society.  Even when it is a targeted specific poll.

yeah, that makes sense. Ask non-smokers if they prefer Marlboro
or Camel. I'm sure you'll get an accurate picture then.


>In this case, the general non-ham public must be included because the
>radio spectrum is a public resource.

The average citizen thinks amateur radio is "CB". Every non radio
literate person who has ever gotten into my truck asks "is that
a CB radio?" I simply answer "yes" because they are normally pointing
to the 2 meter radio.


>As such the public must be
>included so as to know what percentage of the public might be
>interested in becomming radio amateurs if the code reqirement is
>deleted for access to HF.

Question: "Would you be interested in becoming an amateur radio
operator if the requirement for a morse code test were eliminated."

Yeah, I'm sure asking people with a General-class ticket or above
wouldn't skew the results.

What's the point of asking someone if they would become an
amateur if they already are?

If you want to find out who would become an amateur if the code
requirement were dropped, wouldn't you ask >that< segment of the
population, not amateurs?

Your logic makes no sense.


MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:17 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.nap.net!uwm.edu!newsfeeds.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](David Stinson )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc,
Subject: $$$ OLD RADIOS WANTED. CASH REWARD $$$
Date: 30 Dec 1996 13:48:53 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <5a8h85$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lvx-nv16-25.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30  7:48:53 AM CST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:101907 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122258

I will pay a $40 finders fee (on the radios that I actually
acquire) to the persons who find each of the WW-II era
AN/ARC-5 equipments, factory original and unmodified,
shown below:
--------------------------------------------------------
Transmitters:   T-15      T-16    T-89    T-90
Any factory-original transmitter for below 2.1 Mhz and
above 9Mhz other then the T-23 or T-126, and any factory
original crystal control HF.

Receivers: RAT   RAT-1    RAV
Any receiver factory original for above 9 Mhz
other then the R-28, and any factory original
crystal control HF.

Accessories: TN-6 loading coil unit.
----------------------------------------------------------
I will consider modified units and pay a variable fee on
a case-by-case basis.  Also seeking RAT, RAV accessories,
mounts, dynamotors, control boxes etc.
I reserve the right to reject any or all offers and to
negotiate finders fees for items other then those listed.

Contact:
David L. Stinson AB5S
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:18 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: AC6V <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FYI: HF Nets
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 06:20:41 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: esc-ca1-01.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30  8:19:16 AM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)

Someone inquired about HF Net Listings. I have compiled a list on the DX
Reference Page below.

Also noticed the ARRL has a publication for same. A quote from their
page:
-----------
The ARRL Net Directory lists hundreds of Amateur Radio nets of
interest to North American hams--DX, ragchew, special-interest,
fun and public service nets--they're all here. Updated annually.
1995-1996 edition, ⌐1995, 48 pages, #4998--$3
---------------------
Great DX and Happy Holidays from San Diego
Rod
--
AC6V DX Reference Page: http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
E-Mail: [e-mail]

Hark!  For I Have Hurled My Words To The Far Reaches Of The Earth!
What King Of  Old Could Do Thus?? -- AC6V
--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:19 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.0.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:26:19 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <5a8n4b$[e-mail]>
References: <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2gt4$[e-mail]> <5a4o7v$[e-mail]> <5a6al0$[e-mail]> <5a7t7s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp80.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) wrote:

>KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:

>: I want to just make clear that even though I favor the no-code side I
>: also favor beefing up the written tests..

>Well, I don't.  I want to remove ALL requirements except one. Just send
>in a boxtop from a specially marked package of Cheerios or Corn Flakes.
>If you cannot afford a package, just see your local social worker, who
>will provide one (and a postage stamp) to mail it. They will even help
>you fill out the form - if you have never learned to read and write.

>That gets it down to pure communication, and gets rid of all the unnecessary
>tests that discriminate against those to lazy to earn their privileges.

>Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])

And they wonder why we call them beepers.....



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:20 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Tony Reeves)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 80m AM?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:29:02 GMT
Organization: Environmental Laser
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a8jmf$[e-mail]>
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I've been off the air for a about 2 years.. After a long time my ham
shack is back up! I wanted to try out some new wire antennas I have
up, one is a 80m dipole. I wanted to work AM but I don't remember if
there is a "prefered" area to do this or not.. what part of 75/80 is
good to call CQ on am?

anyone want to work AM?

73 AB6GA
---
Tony Reeves
AB6GA - [e-mail], [e-mail] - HF: 14.242Mhz or 28.480Mhz
Environmental Laser - Quality Laser/Copier Toner Cartridge re-manufacture
Homepage: http://www.toners.com




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:22 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:43:26 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <5a8o4e$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6ceg$[e-mail]> <5a7s0h$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Bill Nelson) wrote:

>KC5WCP ([e-mail]) wrote:
>: >ps I like code, I wish I was better at it, there is less shit to put up
>: >with there!
>: Well once I get over the overwhelming encouragement to new hams you
>: exude...

>: You cry about newhams not knowing squat about electronics. So, lets
>: make the written test tougher. Eliminate CW requirement and improve
>: REAL WORLD skills with a strigent written test.
>: Then you can stop whinning.

>If you want "real world", then get rid of the electronics portion as
>well. You know as well as I do that most Hams will never build any
>equipment - other than possibly some simple dipole antennas.

>Real world skills would involve being able to setup and operate these
>modern miracles we have for radios, using a computer and learning how
>to spell with a minimum of errors.

>All else is artificial, and unnecessary.

>--
>Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])

Well the general concensus here is that we need to keep CW in case Dr.
strangelove drops the bomb. Then we can all run out and scrounge parts
from the debris, whilst fighting off mutant cockroaches, to build a
simple CW transmitter with which to communicate.
I would much rather have someone capable of fixing the EMP damaged
equiptment and use packet to pass traffic. Therefore the stringent
written test, with emphasis on electronic theroy and such, is much
more viable than the Morse Code requirment.
Then again, someone with a ray gun would be nice to have to fight of
those mutant roaches who keep beeping  :)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:23 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:47:18 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <5a8obm$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6e1p$[e-mail]> <5a8cg6$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>>>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:49:47 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>>>>
>>>>If there were changes the band plans would remain the same. I even
>>>>agree with setting off the current CW potions as they are for CW ONLY.
>>>>That would help insure the   ----> beepers<----    a place to play.

>>>Aw come on now, is that what it's getting down to, massive usage of
>>>that "b" word? This person writes a well thought out post and
>>>completely ruins his credibility with 1/2 of the people in this
>>>newsgroup by using the "b" word.

>>>73 (beep)

>>Contrary to popular belief I do not use the BEEPER as a derogatory
>>comment.

>You have to consider the feelings of those to whom you direct it, Eric.  Let'
s
>say, for example, that you lived somewhere in the south, like Biloxi,
>Mississippi.   And someone came along and addressed you as a 'bare foot stump
>jumping redneck hill billy'.  They might not have intended to be derogatory,
>maybe they'd call ANYBODY in Mississippi a 'bare foot stump jumping red neck
>hill billy'.  But you might be offended by it.

>You have to remember why you are here. You are here to convince anyone and
>everyone whom you can convince that you and other people should be allowed to
>get onto the HF ham bands without a code test.  Calling other hams that use
>Morse code 'beepers' won't help your cause.  Drop by Deja Vu and study the ca
se
>of Squiggy, The Freedom Fighter.  You will quickly see that he turned more
>people against no code HF than anything that has happened here in a long time
.

>73, Jim KH2D


So i guess the name Squiggy is not the same thing?
Yeah, I bet all them folks that use pantywaist and newbie and welfare
and whinner, ad infinitum ad nauseum have the right to do so cause
they beep and that gives them more privilege.....
yadda yadda yadda



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:25 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:48:34 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a8oe2$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>
>>Considered me a signator.
>>

>You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
>But you are a signator.

And that is a problem for you how?
And I don't remember asking your opinion or even valuing it.

Have a nice day :)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:25 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:50:00 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <5a8ogo$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8kks$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>>
>>>Considered me a signator.
>>>

>>You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
>>But you are a signator.

>Well, Dan, if it's free, EVERYBODY wants one......


STD's are free. Last time I passed the line by the bordello I heard
this strange beeping comming from the line.....




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:27 1997
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: 30 Dec 1996 14:51:37 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <5a8ktp$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster> <5a42mg$[e-mail]> <5a7a6a$[e-mail]>
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In article <5a7a6a$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...


>Well, let me ask some questions:  What does the endorsement mean, what
>is it supposed to accomplish?  The proposal seems to say that you
>should NOT be allowed to operate CW in a designated HF CW band until
>you have passed a minimum code operating speed test.  If that's what
>folks want, I could care less, but I see no value in the proposal.

I see it as a compromise that would satisfy both sides of the code debate. No
one is saying that such an endorsement would be the answer to everything, but
at least it's a start.


>Also,  who's going to police the CW subbands to make sure someone
>without an endorsement isn't operating CW?

How are they policed now? Who polices the bottom 25 khz. of the 75, 40, 20, an
d
15 meter bands to make sure there are only extra class licensees operating
there?

>Ironically, today's band allocations contain only two totally
>exclusive CW subbands.  They are on 6m and 2m and any non-coded
>tech is free to use them at whatever speed that person wishes.

As I said, the proposal doesn't have all of the answers, but it's a start.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:27 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: 30 Dec 1996 15:03:02 GMT
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5a8lj6$qhe$[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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In <5a3q0h$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Ben) writes:
>I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
>timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
>and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
>pruning!
>
>Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>
>Ben
>
   Ben.

 How 'old' of an oldtimer do need to be? I think somebody's pulling your leg.
 The way you attempt a 1:1 is by pruning and matching the feedpoint.

                                                           Jim W9LZ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:29 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:04:14 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <5a8pbd$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2ior$[e-mail]> <5a40k5$[e-mail]> <5a6et2$[e-mail]> <5a7c2b$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>>Next subject is: When do we get HF w/o code requirement?

>>>Maybe never.  Time's a wasting.  Better learn the code now. But didn't
>>>you say 2 meters is better than HF ? What do want HF for ?

>>>73, Jim KH2D

>>I never said VHF is better than HF. I said it is more difficult to DX
>>on VHF than on HF and therefore those who choose to do so are
>>accepting a challenge. Since so many people acuse no-coders of being
>>lazy the statement is appropriate that VHF is a real challenge as
>>opposed to HF.

>OK. Well, as I said before, try 160 meters.  But you are still telling me tha
t
>working DEEEX on VHF is doing it 'the hard way'.  Which is contrary to the
>popular idea that it's time hams stopped doing things the 'hard way' (CW) and
>get with the more modern technologies.   Why don't you want to modernize and
>start doing things 'the easy way' ? You did say 'HF is for sissies' didn't yo
u ?
>Does that imply you think you are a sissy ?  Talk to a few of the people on t
he
>top of the DXCC honor role and ask them how unchallenging HF is.

>>Why do I want HF. The same reason everyone does. For easy
>>International contacts. To talk with others in different cultures on a
>>regular basis with a wire and a decent radio as opposed to the mega
>>array and mega buck radio required to do so on VHF.

>Now you want to do things the 'easy' way.  Use email. You can talk to anybody
 in
>the world with little or no effort via email.  I worked 2 stations on 160 met
ers
>in Europe over the weekend, but I got email from 50 other stations in Europe.
>Much easier.  You obviously haven't seen too many HF ham stations.  In 2001 y
ou
>may be able to make international contacts on SSB with your wire in the tree,
 so
>there's no hurry to rush the no code HF thing thru, you still have a few year
s
>to wait.  See your amateur radio handbook under 'sunspot cycle'.

>73, Jim KH2D


Well last year I made a fine contact with a lady in Australia on 11m.
All I used was a dipole and about 10watts SSB. Truly the bottom of the
sunspot cycle. Explain that to me. Explain to me why a friend of mine
who is beeping away in the next room made contact and QSL'd the same
lady two months later with the same radio and same antenna same power
at a different QTH
I could go on with dozens of other similar QSO's like the one with
Vienna or the guy down in Panama I used to talk to every morning on my
way into work but I hate to be a braggard.
Problem with HF is that ya always here wise old hams say "The band is
dead" when they really should be saying"I am too lazy to spin the dial
and listen for more than five minutes"
And yes i would like to have HF in my arsenal. That does not make me
an HF sissie. An HF sissie is like the wise old ham described above in
my last paragraph.


73 Eric




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:30 1997
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: 30 Dec 1996 15:10:11 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <5a8m0j$[e-mail]>
References: <5a6nqk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...

>The Morse requirement will be challenged on the grounds that it is now
>technically irrelevant, having been replaced by more modern technology in
>nearly all applications...including the US Military.  The legal argument
>will be that Morse knowledge should therefore no longer be required
>knowledge as a condition of obtaining a US government-issued radio license
>for the purposes of transmitting on publicly-owned radio frequencies.
>
>In other words, there is no longer a compelling interest for the
>government to require license applicants to demonstrate proficiency in
>Morse code.  This is the key argument that will be used..."compelling
>interest."  Is it a function of government to require a now-outdated
>technology in order to receive a radio station license?  I don't think so.


From what I see, your arguments are just opinions, and have no legal basis.
That's not going to be enough. The FCCs requirments are regulations,
not law. Besides, there are ITU treaty obligations that the government has to
obide by. This means knowledge of morse code as one of the requirements needed

before the issuance of a ham radio license. Treaties take precedence, and so
any lawsuit would be thrown out based on this.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:31 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:13:03 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <5a8prv$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3qh6$[e-mail]> <5a6f1j$[e-mail]> <5a6knc$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:

>In article <5a6f1j$[e-mail]>, KC5WCP <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Well then stop whinning and do something about it. Find someone who
>>can Df the jammers. Make an effort to befriend the Chatter boxes and
>>guide them along a better path.
>>Or just sit in your armchair and whine. It's up to you.

>Unlike what you attempt to characterize, I >do< take positive action.

>We have a special elite task force here called the "RF Commandos".
>Equipped with the latest in transmitter fingerprinting technology,
>advanced direction finding equipment, night-vision surveillence
>equipment, this advanced tactical force routinely participates in
>complex tactical and covert surveillence techniques.

>However, the RF Commandos are limited to certain repeaters. We
>prefer to eliminate the trash from our member repeaters, and let
>them congregate on other machines.

>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.

Funny. Around here we just find them with a simple DF antenna and
politely ask them to stop. Usually works.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:32 1997
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From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: 30 Dec 1996 15:17:52 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5a8mf0$[e-mail]>
References: <5a6c57$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...

>Like it or not, that's the way problems are solved in today's deteorating
>society.  Actually, I believe the Morse requirement has a very good chance
>of being overturned in court for the reasons I've outlined in the
>"LAWSUITS" thread on this newsgroup.

Again, you're forgetting one important thing that will cause the lawsuit to be

tossed out of court - ITU treaty obligations.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:33 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:30:56 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <5a8qti$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4kv8$[e-mail]> <5a78nu$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>>Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
>>>retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
>>>older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
>>>remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
>>>back in the late 60s.


>>Let me see if I can find a word that fits how I feel about your post..

>>Hmmmmmm...... BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>Yup BINGO says it all :)

>Let's hope BINGO doesn't fit Rogers post in your case, Eric.  You aren't
>supposed to OPERATING on HF, so hopefully you aren't talking to too
>many retirees on 75 meters..... Maybe you can tell how old people are by
>listening to them ?

>73, Jim KH2D

Well actually listening to a QSO you tend to learn alot. Like if you
were to read an entire post from time to time....




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:34 1997
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From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:48:11 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 15
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References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Casey wrote:

> Stop wasting bandspace with your sophmoric garbage. Grow up.

Contests and NTS traffic of course are fsr more worthy?

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:49:33 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbf5fd$57b60be0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Chad Sims wrote:

>         I liked his webpage. I found a lot of humor in it. And I found your
comments rude and un-called for.

Thank you for your comments.
It is meant to be entertaining, you do not have to agree with my views.

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!torn!news.bconnex.net!news.lightlink.com!light.lightlink.com!siram
From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:51:07 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> <5a4q6s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
In-Reply-To: <5a4q6s$[e-mail]>

> > I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> > timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> > and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> > pruning!
> >
> > Has anybody heard of this stuff?
>
> Oh yeah....I've been using it for years. As a matter of fact, there is
> great controversy about it among the contesting an DXing community
> because its use amounts to cheating.
>
> I don't think they should take it off the market, however, because it's
> also good on a cracker.

"Good on crackers"?? You mean, peanut butter works miracles on HF, too? So
far I heard of it only being used on SHF antennas and satellite dishes.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:51:32 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <01bbf5fd$57b60be0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 70.ccsnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122232 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20970 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44975 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22589 rec.radio.scanner:74537 rec.radio.shortwave:91533 aus.radio.amateur.misc:1714 aus.radio.amateur.digital:327

Casey wrote:

> Are you Burts Parrot? I bet you sit on his shoulder and go "awwk, your
> right Burt"! Awwk, your right Burt!"

If you are into parrots have you listened to contests?

CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST,
CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST,
CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST, CQ CONTEST.
59, please repeat all hi hi,  59, please repeat all hi hi,
59, please repeat all hi hi,  59, please repeat all hi hi,
59, please repeat all hi hi,  59, please repeat all hi hi,


#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:54:09 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a7j8f$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Blake Bowers wrote:
>
> I visited the page, and found it to be a very well made page,
> interesting, and informative.

Interesting is my goal, thanks for your comments.

> Not sure why you have such a problem, unless of course you had gotten
> worked up into a frenzy of anticipation about seeing a naked chic!

Not only is the chic naked but the human is the picture has no cloth
you can see on her body, right?

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: KD1YV <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:54:48 -0500
Organization: Hamily !
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dby-ct2-23.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30  7:54:49 AM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

NEWSFLASH!  FREQUENCY GREASE RECALL!

I just read over in rec.alt.radio.amateur.cb.swl.lowfer.spy.microwave that the
venerable product FREQUENCY GREASE has been recalled and pulled from store she
lves.

It seems that when applied to a Stoned Wheat Thin cracker with a three-hole wi
re
recorder strecher in quantities between 7 and 12 furlongs per fortnight, that
it
caused cancer in Canadian laboratory rats!

--
73 de Jim, KD1YV
http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimkd1yv/hamily.html


Dave Burr wrote:
>
> Ben wrote:
> >
> > I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> > timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> > and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> > pruning!
> >
> > Has anybody heard of this stuff?
> >
> > Ben
>
> Oh yeah....I've been using it for years. As a matter of fact, there is
> great controversy about it among the contesting an DXing community
> because its use amounts to cheating.
>
> I don't think they should take it off the market, however, because it's
> also good on a cracker.
>
> Dave
> K9XK


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!snunews.snu.ac.kr!newsfeed.kreonet.re.kr!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!melba.bby.com.au!news.mira.net.au!news.vbc.net!vbcnet-west!knews.uk0.vbc.net!btnet!netcom.net.uk!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!not-for-mail
From: Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:55:13 -0500
Organization: The Anti fats
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a7jak$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 70.ccsnet.com
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Blake Bowers wrote:
>
>
>         I went there.  I saw it.  I liked it.
>
> Good job.   And yes, I had figured out what the naked chic would be,
> far in advance of clicking on the icon.

Thank you for having a sense of humor.

#================#===================================================#
|  Burt Fisher   |  Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics   |
| Amateur call   |         South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)              |
|    K1OIK       |     http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169      |
#================#===================================================#
|This message was posted from home            [e-mail]       |
#====================================================================#
If you try to milk too much, you won't get a drop
Samantha Fisher


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-hub.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-atl-21.sprintlink.net!news.infi.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!butch![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Larry AD3Y)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 35% of the curriculum?
Date: 30 Dec 1996 15:56:38 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 27
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a8onm$[e-mail]>
References: <57f4ff$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wargrave.motown.lmco.com


[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) says:

>3 of the 8 exam elements are Morse receiving tests. That's 37.5% of
>testing devoted to a single thing. And 5 of the 6 amateur license
>classes require passing one or more of those elements. That's 83%.
>And that 83% gets privileges unrelated to Morse for passing Morse
>tests. Clearly, Morse tests hold a disproportionate position in
>amateur licensing.


It's all how you look at it. I hold an extra class license. I passed
the 5, 13, and 20 wpm tests. I only needed a total of 1 minute copy
at each speed. That's three minutes. If I needed all five minutes to
pass each test, thats fifteen minutes. I spent at least two hours
taking all of the amateur exams. I see the morse tests as being only
12.5% of the exam. What does this mean? It means that 83% is really not
a meaningful percentage.


Code is not dead yet, it's just coughing up blood.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Larry Weissman AD3Y      |  All opinions expressed are my own and
Lockheed Martin Corp.    |  in no way related to my company. All my
Moorestown, NJ   USA     |  designs are my companies and in no way
[e-mail] |  considered my own.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!butch![e-mail]
From: [e-mail] (Larry AD3Y)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: 30 Dec 1996 16:07:34 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 15
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a8pc6$[e-mail]>
References: <5a4iku$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wargrave.motown.lmco.com


I'll tell you in one word why most of the younger hams I
work with do not get on HF very much. We all have:

KIDS!

That doesn't leave time for much else, does it?


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Larry Weissman AD3Y      |  All opinions expressed are my own and
Lockheed Martin Corp.    |  in no way related to my company. All my
Moorestown, NJ   USA     |  designs are my companies and in no way
[e-mail] |  considered my own.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeeds.sol.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!van-bc!news.rmii.com!usenet
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,misc.jobs.offered,rec.radio.amateur.antenna,us.jobs.offered,ne.jobs,nyc.jobs
Subject: NY;Chief Engineeer; UHF transmitter, Broadcasting, Television
Date: 30 Dec 1996 16:10:43 GMT
Organization: Career Marketing Associates
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <5a8pi3$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.247.5.4
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122236 misc.jobs.offered:1833659 rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33399 ne.jobs:188049


NY;Chief Engineeer; UHF transmitter, Broadcasting, Television. An experienced
chief engineer with excellent technical knowledge of UHF transmitter operation

and maintenance. Experience in installation and maintenance of studio,
production, master control microwave systems is essential. Applicant will
implement preventive maintenance programs and be responsible for staffing,
supervision and building maintenance. General license required. SBE certificat
e
a plus. Corporate position. Very minimal travel. Our client is located
in Southern NY state; right at the Southern edge of the beautiful Catskill
Mountains.

Please refer to JO# 963RJS in your response.



Richard Steinman
Project Leader
[e-mail]
IT & Software Solutions Team
Career Marketing Associates


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:48 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!eskimo!news
From: [e-mail] (Bill Turner)
Subject: Re: Mobile power for 2-meter HT
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: wrt.ndip.eskimo.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Sender: [e-mail] (News User Id)
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Organization: Eskimo North (206) For-Ever
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99f/16.299
References: <5a7gkf$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 16:40:29 GMT
Lines: 56

[e-mail] wrote:

>In article <5a7gkf$[e-mail]>,
>[e-mail](Gene G.) writes:
>
>>Until I can get a mobile rig I'm temporarily  using an HT with
>>batteries on the road. There is no cigarette lighter to use for power.
>>Here's my question - would I be better off to run power from the
>>battery or install a lighter and use it as a power source. It's a small
>>Toyota pick-up and putting in a lighter is no easy task. Also, if I run
>>direct from the battery most in-line fuse holders seem to be 15 or 20
>>amp - any recommendations on which to use?  Have a 5/8 mag-mount
>>antenna that works great - next item is power - advisories are welcome
>>and appreciated!
>>
>>
>
>First, You have no need to use anything more than a 4-5 amp fuse in your
>wiring for this setup unless you're planning on adding an amplifier for
>the HT.  There are covered fuseholders which will take any of the blade
>fuses from 3 amps on up to 30 amps.  You are well advised to fuse, and run
>directly from the battery.  Underfusing a connection is a lot safer
>practice than overfusing.  A blown fuse on your radio wiring is a lot
>easier to deal with than a burned up truck, and cheaper too.  Going
>directly to  the battery is not only wiser in lowering the amount of noise
>that you'll hear but it also lessens the chances for things like
>alternator whine.   I also suggest that you run heavy guage wire, like No.
>6 AWG, because you never know when you'll be tempted to try HF, or run an
>amplifier for even 2 meter dxing, and having to do it twice is really
>annoying.  Remember, the fuse is to protect the radio & prevent fires, so
>a small one with large guage wire isn't a waste.  Incidentally, you're
>probably better off with the automobile type fuses that come in blades,
>rather than the long thin glass ones I think you're describing, you
>haven't lived until you find out that your rig won't work because your
>glass fuse got vibrated to death.
>
>That being said, look in the fusebox in your cab.  There are often unused
>connections that either only require a fuse and minor wiring, or no wiring
>with one of the radio shack special fuse with a wire attached to one end
>to give you an extra dc connection.  In any event be sure to route your
>wiring safely, where it won't get under foot or rubbed by anything, and
>isn't likely to cause a fire.  Above all, fuse, fuse, fuse, fuse.  Fuses
>are cheap, buy an extra set, and put them in the glove compartment.  73 de
>n8blk/3  -art clemons-
--------------------------------------------------
Lots of good advice here, but may I add one thing?  Be sure to fuse both the
positive and negative wires to your rig.  There is a rare possibility of an
open ground developing between the battery and the starter motor, and when
that happens, the starter motor will try to draw power through your rig via
the coax to the antenna, IF the antenna is grounded.  If the antenna is an
un-grounded type (and you're sure of this), then there is no problem.  I've
seen pictures of rigs where 200-300 amps flowed through them and it ain't
pretty.

73, Bill W7TI
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!cc.iu.net!news
From: Bill Newkirk <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 12:10:25 -0500
Organization: InternetU, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a7moc$[e-mail]> <5a8f6a$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: netport-67.iu.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)
CC: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122254 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44986

Michael P. Deignan wrote:
>
> The average citizen thinks amateur radio is "CB". Every non radio
> literate person who has ever gotten into my truck asks "is that
> a CB radio?" I simply answer "yes" because they are normally pointing
> to the 2 meter radio.

then you're helping the illiteracy of the public about amateur radio. i
might assume when you've told them that it's an "amateur radio" that
they probably responded with something like "wow. i didn't know they
were that small...".
--
Bill Newkirk WB9IVR                  The Space Coast Amateur Technical
Group
Melbourne, FL                       duty now for the future of amateur
radio
Lombardi's 1st Law of Business:
   Companies succeed in spite of their best effort.  If they succeed at
all.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!sdd.hp.com!col.hp.com!news.dtc.hp.com!canyon.sr.hp.com!news
From: John Mullan <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Visiting Syracuse NY, recommended repeaters?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 09:23:46 -0800
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Sonoma County
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a7htm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: catv2.sr.hp.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (X11; I; HP-UX A.09.05 9000/725)

Arthur N. Ashley wrote:
>
>    About one month from now I will be visiting Syracuse NY. Could you
> please recommend repeater frequencies in the area as I would like to
> bring my 2 meter HT with me.
> Thank you,
>        Arthur, N1NHZ, 73              Boston Amateur Radio Club
>        mailto:[e-mail]         P. O. Box 15585
>        BARC WEB Page URL:             Kenmore Station
>        <http://www.barc.org/barc>     Boston MA 02215-0011
Unless things have drastically changed since I moved from the Syracuse
area, there are a number of active 2 meter repeaters. See the Liverpool
Amateur Repeater Club home page at
<http://members.aol.com/larcclub/larc.html> LARC operates two 2 meter
repeaters on 146.31/146.91 and 147.81/147.21 as well as 220 and 440
repeaters.

73 de KD2LQ


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 12:28:36 -0500
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a4iku$[e-mail]> <5a8pc6$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-242-156.ca.us.ibm.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (OS/2; I)

Larry AD3Y wrote:
>
> I'll tell you in one word why most of the younger hams I
> work with do not get on HF very much. We all have:
>
> KIDS!
>
> That doesn't leave time for much else, does it?

I hear you, pal.  I've got a 3 year old daughter and plans for more.
Keeps me jumping.

Ah, but we need to get more young people into the hobby. Otherwise our
hobby will grey and die, as I fear it is already doing.

Please no one think that I have it in for retirees.  As I've said, these
guys are my buddies, and I hope to someday be one myself.  However, I no
more favor a setup that favors retirees than I would favor one that
systematically excluded them.

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: joe cira <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: HILSBBS/VEC-VE EXAM & CLASS LIST
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 09:37:17 -0800
Organization: hilsbbs
Lines: 73
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pas-ca8-04.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------643F2B216AD2"
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30 11:35:43 AM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I)

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

--------------643F2B216AD2
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

--
*****************************************************************************
U.S.AMATEUR RADIO STATION " KB6AXK "| SYSOP OF HAM*INFO*LINK*SOURCE*BBS
PASADENA,CALIFORNIA 91107           |  at 818-584-1952 any speed 8-N-1
e-mail to [e-mail]      | dedicated to amateur radio !
                ARRL/LAX/ACC        | ARRL MIRROR SITE...........
*****************************************************************************
        GENEALOGY
        researching my family surname " CIRA " in the UNITED STATES,and
        CANADA,and in TERMINI IMERESE,PALERMO,SICILY,ITALY..........
        if you have any info, please e-mail to me at [e-mail]
                THANK YOU & GOOD DAY :) :) :)

--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--CIRA--
*****************************************************************************
MY  web site at :) http://www.netcom.com/~kb6axk/
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------643F2B216AD2
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; name="HILSBBS.AD"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="HILSBBS.AD"

        HELLO FELLOW HAMS:and FUTURE HAMS !!!!!!!

        HAM BBS dedicated to amateur radio !!!!

There is a DEVOTED AMATEUR RADIO BBS in town ,from your
ARRL/LAX  affiliated club coordinator , JOE CIRA , KB6AXK ...........
Everything and anything about AMATEUR RADIO will be found here,
IF NOT ? Let me know and we will post it and file it !!!!!!!!


        HAM*INFO*LINK*SOURCE BBS at 1-818-584-1952....
        24 hrs,8-n-1,anyspeed.......
        running 486/66 with 2.1 gig of space !!!
        qsl route database,clubs,newsletters,bulletins,shareware,utility
        mods,programs,test ques,lists,software and much more....
        VEC/VE exam & class  list for all So.Cal.
        sample exam tests and answers for all class's..
        ARRL mirror of all there files !
        Using Wildcat v4.11 software..
        easy to log in and no FEE's it's FREE !
        6,000 FILES IN 119 FILE AREA'S..so far !

        latest list of AMATEUR RADIO WEB SITES & PAGES
        now 2,850 websites & pages !!!!!!!!!
        and GROWING FAST ?!?!!

P.S. also available on the web at:

        http://www.padl.ac.at/schule/chemie/bob.htm
        look for web-sites by KB6AXK on the page........

        FYI:there are roughly ,over 33,000 pages,just pages,
        that relate to amateur radio/ham radio on the web ???????
        My list is primarlly websites/homepages.....


73's & 88's de kb6axk,joe cira,ARRL/LAX/ACC.
INTERNET E-MAIL ADDRESS:> [e-mail]
/EX
S


--------------643F2B216AD2--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com!not-for-mail
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 11:51:04 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: FS:  Yaesu FT-767GX
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Mon Dec 30 17:47:32 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 208.140.5.110 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.02Gold (Win95; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 8

Yaesu FT-767GX in excellent condition with 6 and 2 meter modules, SP-767
speaker, original hand mike, and FIF-232C computer interface.  One owner.
$1000 plus shipping.

Tim  K7HF
[e-mail]
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com!not-for-mail
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 12:01:03 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: FS:  Yaesu 767GX
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Mon Dec 30 17:52:32 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 208.140.5.110 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.02Gold (Win95; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 8

Yaesu FT-767GX in excellent condition with 6 and 2 meter modules, SP-767
speaker, original hand mike, and FIF-232C computer interface.  One owner.
$1000 plus shipping.

Tim   K7HF
[e-mail]
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:56 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: FILTER
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]> <59r69r$[e-mail]> <59rj1d$[e-mail]> <5a4kv3$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 18:04:39 GMT
Lines: 36

In article <5a4kv3$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wr
ites:
>[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
>>In article <59r69r$[e-mail]>,
>>      Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>>I talked to my friend, the extra class conservative the other day about the
 no
>>>code thing.  I think riff raff is probably a bit too strong a term and it
>>>probably insults people.
>
>>Okay, you're right. There are many classy criminals. Perhaps the term
>>"trash" would be better. 'Helps keep the <white/black/asian/hispanic/etc>
>>trash off HF'. Maybe that is better?
>
>>MD
>>--
>>--
>>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>>--
>>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.
>
>I hope you and Jim are only kiding when you define rif raf and the
>various ethnic groups as trash. Gawd I hope so.
>
>Eric

Kehler is just a troll, but Deigman couldn't be more serious unless he
wore his sheet while typing (perhaps he does). From the continuing tenor
of his posts, you can gather that his neck is so red traffic brakes at
the sight of it.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:58 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4m25$[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 18:21:07 GMT
Lines: 36
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:44989 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122268

In article <5a4m25$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wri
tes:
>[e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow) wrote:
>Who is proposing a FULL spectrum/privaledges nocode
>license.  Not me...not anyone else I've seen posting here.
>
>>>>All of a sudden we'll just have one license class
>>>>for amateur radio and it won't be entry-level.
>
>AGAIN!!! Who has proposed that?  Not me, not Carl, Not
>Len, not Gary, etc.

Actually, I have expressed a preference for a single
license class, and its examination would not include
a Morse receiving test. I have been persuaded, however,
that there also needs to be an entry level class. I've
suggested that class be limited in output power to a
rather low level so that they can't do much harm while
learning their craft.

I believe that the entire idea of "Incentive" Licensing
is fatally flawed in that the added requirements for
higher class licenses don't correspond with the added
privileges granted. For example, there is no less potential
for harm from a General operating on 14.275 MHz than there
is from an Extra operating on 14.180 MHz, yet they have to
pass different tests to do basically the same things on
basically identical spectrum. Either an Extra's qualifications
are required to operate 20m or they are not. There is no
legitimacy to disparate tests for similar spectrum access.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:57:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.nl.innet.net!INnl.net!feed1.news.innet.be!INbe.net!news.be.innet.net!INbe.net!usenet
From: Albert AERTS <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: VP2VBL ???
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 19:34:40 +0100
Organization: INnet NV (post doesn't reflect views of INnet NV)
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: pool014-87.innet.be
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Does anyone know new email address for Joe VP2VBL.
(apparantly [e-mail] no longer correct)
Thanks for your cooperation.
73's de Albert ON6TS   30-DEC-96 18:35 UTC



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:00 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!metro.atlanta.com!news.radio.org!wa4mei!ke4zv!gary
From: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Subject: Re: Merge Newsgroups Policy and Misc.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 18:46:35 GMT
Lines: 24

In article <[e-mail]> Chuck Hallett W7LDS <[e-mail]>
 writes:
>I propose rec.radio.amateur.misc and rec.radio.amateur.policy be merged
>into one group since they have all the same posts anyway.  Recommend
>calling it rec.radio.amateur.QRM
>
>Chuck W7LDS

Well you know there used to be only one ham-radio newsgroup. Then
someone got the bright idea of segregating it into neat little pigeonhole
compartments and we got the current proliferation of groups, most all
of which wind up with inappropriate topics, crossposted topics, and worse,
repeats of the same posts to each group. It was a lot simpler when there
was only one group and you could easily use your own tools to thread it
the way you wanted to read it. Ham radio has been treated much the same
way, segregated by mode, by license class, etc. Society in general found
segregation a bad idea way back in the 1950s, but amateur radio does
tend to be the last bastion of obsolete ideas.

Gary
--
Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp address
es
534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:01 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!grunt.dejanews.com!not-for-mail
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 12:51:03 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: FS:  VHF/UHF Radios
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
X-Article-Creation-Date: Mon Dec 30 18:45:21 1996 GMT
X-Originating-IP-Addr: 208.140.5.81 ()
X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/2.02Gold (Win95; I)
X-Authenticated-Sender: [e-mail]
Lines: 20

Kenwood TM-241A  2 meter FM transceiver -- $210

Icom IC-2340H  2/440 FM transceiver -- $395

Icom IC-02AT  2 meter handheld -- $165

Realistic HTX-404 440 Mhz handheld -- $185

Heath HA-202  2 meter amplifier -- $95

These radios are in good condition and fully operational.  Please
add shipping charges to the prices.

Tim   K7HF
[e-mail]



-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!198.68.62.43!oronet!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Weir)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 19:13:13 GMT
Organization: RST Engineering
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <5a94a7$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: i449.oro.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) shared these priceless pearls of
wisdom:

->Ideally, what I would like to see is a single amateur license
->class with question areas stressing electrical safety, technical
->compliance, and operating practices.

->Power level, rather than subbands or mode restrictions, would seem
->to be the logical differentiator

 I might suggest that any such homebrewing should be limited
->to using no more than a 12 volt DC power source, however, just in
->order to reduce the chance the apprentice might harm himself
->while experimenting with circuits.

It'll never fly, Coffman.  It makes too damned much sense for our leaders
to understand.

Jim


Jim Weir VP Engineering | You bet your sweet patootie I speak for the
RST Engineering         | company -- and I'm damned proud to do so.
Grass Valley CA 95945   | Airport: O17 (Grass Valley Intentional Airpatch)
http://www.rst-engr.com | AR Adv WB6BHI--FCC 1st phone---C-182A N73CQ
[e-mail]        | Comm'l/CFI-Airplane/Glider-A&P-FAA Counselor



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!world1.bellatlantic.net!news
From: Rush Johnson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 60-Hz QRM All Over HF spectrum
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:36:34 -0500
Organization: Bell Atlantic Internet Solutions
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf59a$0f502560$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: client250-241-102.bellatlantic.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E (Win95; U)

Mike Kelly wrote:
>
> I am beginning to troubleshoot a serious 60-Hz noise problem I have here at
>
> this QTH and was wondering if anyone has any knowledge they would like to
> share with me that would help.  Thanks in advance.  Oh, I only have
> intermittent access to these newsgroups but will still try and monitor.  My
>
>
>  - Mike-AB4YY ([e-mail])

Mike,
These problems can be a real beast sometimes...so first of all, put on
your patience cap!

A good way to help estimate where the source is coming from is to listen
for the noise and then start listening "up" in frequency.  For instance,
if you hear the noise on 20m, try listening on 10m, then 6m, then 2m,
etc.  The noise typically travels farther on the lower frequencies.

Driving around the neigborhood with a protable am radio, a 2 meter rig,
and an fm radio can help you pinpoint where its coming from.  This is a
trial and error thing....

Using directional antennas can help you pinpoint the problem as well.  I
have had good luck using a 2m yagi and my 2m rig...

Finally, when you get a good idea where its coming from (could be in
your house, down the stree, in your neighbors house (!), if its an
electrical pole, give the power company a call.  Ask to talk to their
RFI, EMI specialist.  I know in this area, there are 2 or 3 guys that
spend their time tracking these things down.

Be nice to these guys!  They take their own time, but will help you out
if you get to know em.

Rush Johnson
NR4M


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-fw-12.sprintlink.net!news.onramp.net!usenet
From: Clif <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Collins, Heathkit, Drake Manuals
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 13:39:13 -0600
Organization: OnRamp Technologies; ISP;  Dallas/Ft Worth/Houston, TX USA
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lbj55.onramp.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors:1378 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22597 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122288

I am in the process of cleaning out my shop and have several (100+)
owner/operator/service manuals for various pieces of Collins, Heathkit,
and Drake gear. If you have any specific needs email me and I will
check. Also in the pile is a Blue 3ring binder w/Collins Emblem and
contains dealer pricing and brochures for the early 60's to about 71
on Collins equipment (make offer)

email to [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news1.bellglobal.com!Ouimet.tbaytel.net!usenet
From: VA 3 ER <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Origin of the name ham -- documented proof wanted!
Date: 30 Dec 1996 19:45:33 GMT
Organization: Thunder Bay Telephone
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5a964t$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: raith15.tbaytel.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.2N (Windows; I; 16bit)

CQ

Does anyone have documented proof (not just hearsay) on genuine origin
of the name ham?

Does anyone have documented proof on the origin of ham in re. to three
amateur that ran into trouble in the early years of amateur radio? Their
initial were sopposed to be: h, a and m.

If so, you may e-mail me at [e-mail]
or post a reply in this newsgroup.

VY 73,

Ed VA3ER



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:06 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 30 Dec 1996 19:52:21 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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In article <5a817e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:

>Not possible.  Spew can't write a paragraph with more than two sentences.
>Complex ideas get him confused.  Now Carl could be Spew's daddy..... and
>that would make him Grandpa Lennys grandson.
>
>

At least my family tree forks...unlike yours.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:07 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: 30 Dec 1996 19:52:25 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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In article <5a7rg8$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Nelson)
writes:

>
>Since you both use dial up providers for posts, there is no way to tell
>where you are located. I doubt if your service provider would give that
>information out freely.

Not too difficult in my case, since I freely publish my name and location
on my AOL profile.  Our friend Jimmy just figured that out today and is on
here making a big deal of his "discovery", even though the information has
always been available for all to see.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:08 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: SPEW IS A MANIAC !!!!---Jimmy makes an AMAZING discovery!!
Date: 30 Dec 1996 19:52:30 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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In article <5a85gt$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:

>For those of you who have been pestered by MNManiac, thought you like to
know
>who he really is - the infamous 'Spew Durigan'.  What a guy.  In cognito
at
>AOL......


What an AMAZING discovery, Jimmy!  Gee...how long did you have to put down
your brass key in order to figure it out?

Not too difficult, considering that I have always provided my full NAME
and my LOCATION on my AOL profile!  (see below)


>Member Name:   DREW A. DURIGAN
>Location:      ORLANDO, FLORIDA
>Birthdate:     05/26/64
>Sex:   Male
>Marital Status:        SINGLE (ALWAYS!)
>Computers:     PACKARD BELL LEGEND 836CDT (100MHZ PENTIUM)
>Hobbies:       RADIO, 70s MUSIC, CRUISIN' THE TOWN IN A 1977 OLDS CUTLASS
>Occupation:    RADIO BROADCASTER @ WOTS/AM-1220 ("ALL 70s, ALL DAY")
>Personal Quote:        BEFORE I GOT THIS COMPUTER, I USED TO HAVE A
SOCIAL
>LIFE!


Public information, Jimmy.  I put it there, just for you to find...I just
didn't think it would take you this long.  I began using my AOL account as
my primary provider on 12/1/96 when they went to unlimited useage @
$19.95/month.  Just for kicks, I figured I'd leave my signature off of my
posts and see how long it took you beepers to get up the initiative to
actually look at my member profile.  By my calculations, it took you 29
days to do so and find out this TOP-SECRET information...or, "in cognito"
as you so astutely put it.  Congratulations, Jimmy...you get an 'A' for
the day!

Are all the Beepers as bright and as eager as you?


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:09 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERS
Date: 30 Dec 1996 19:52:37 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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In article <5a85ig$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
Kehler) writes:

>Said Spew Durigan while trying to hide behind his new AOL loser ID.
>

See previous post.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:10 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: 30 Dec 1996 19:52:47 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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In article <5a8mf0$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
writes:

>Again, you're forgetting one important thing that will cause the lawsuit
to
>be
>tossed out of court - ITU treaty obligations.

I'd be willing to bet you that the ITU requirement will be overturned at
the next conference.  Other countries are already ignoring the HF below
30Mhz requirement and doing so openly.  Japan, for instance.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:11 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 19:59:22 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
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Message-ID: <5a96po$[e-mail]>
References: <5a73u8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>>I seriously doubt that you will ever see the CW test challanged in a
>court of law, only because few hams have the $$$ to post such a
>challange.  The cost of such litigation runs into the 10's of thousands
>of dollars for the person filing the case.<<

>Very true.  This is precisely the reason why it hasn't been tried so far.
>But it only takes one ham or would-be ham to file a legal challenge.  How
>many lawyers are hams, or would like to be if not for the Morse
>requirement?  All it takes is one.

Even attornies don't necessarily want to waste
their own time for no financial gain.

> Sooner or later, a suit will be filed.
> When that happens, look for a petition to be filed to allow class-action
>status with thousands of other affected individuals then joining the
>lawsuit.

As possible class action participants, the number
is meaningless UNLESS they bring $$$$ to the
challenge.  I see no way to gain any $$$ from
such a suit...do you?

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:12 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: 30 Dec 1996 20:04:14 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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>>As possible class action participants, the number
is meaningless UNLESS they bring $$$$ to the
challenge.  I see no way to gain any $$$ from
such a suit...do you?<<

Of course!  Think of the financial windfall of a "dump-the-code" court
decision if the plantiff(s) happen to have connections with...say, Radio
Shack, Kenwood, Yaesu, or any other manufacturer of HF amateur equipment.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:13 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:05:20 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
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Message-ID: <5a974v$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] wrote:

>>  Here's a thought, if a fraction of the time wasted on internet traffic rea
ding
>> and commenting was used on CW self education (get on the air), the issue
>> would be dead.
>>                                                                  Jim W9LZ

>We have said that a thousand times, Jim.  It just doesn't sink in.  Why work
>when you can wait ? Hope keeps some people alive.

At the risk of having another response from Jim, the above
fails to note that many of us have "been there, done that."
All those that advocate the end of code testing are not
codeless individuals.






Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:13 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
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References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:06:28 GMT
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Sender: [e-mail]

Roland Stiner ([e-mail]) wrote:

: It is my belief that it was a mistake to have a 2 year waiting period to
: re-assign callsigns.  It should have been one year.  The two year rule
: puts too many callsigns out commission.

I agree.  Also, for those amateurs who give up their callsigns for a vanity
callsign, those callsigns should be immediately available.  Not that I'd want
one, but there were a lot of 2x1s that were "traded-in" for different
formats.

Did the FCC think there might be some "buyer's remorse" among the vanity
applicants, or is this two-year rule just in keeping with their normal
practice?

73 de Jim - KF6CR




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:15 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:09:13 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <5a97cb$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (T.L.Bryant) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
>says...

>>The Morse requirement will be challenged on the grounds that it is now
>>technically irrelevant, having been replaced by more modern technology in
>>nearly all applications...including the US Military.  The legal argument
>>will be that Morse knowledge should therefore no longer be required
>>knowledge as a condition of obtaining a US government-issued radio license
>>for the purposes of transmitting on publicly-owned radio frequencies.
>>
>>In other words, there is no longer a compelling interest for the
>>government to require license applicants to demonstrate proficiency in
>>Morse code.  This is the key argument that will be used..."compelling
>>interest."  Is it a function of government to require a now-outdated
>>technology in order to receive a radio station license?  I don't think so.


>From what I see, your arguments are just opinions, and have no legal basis.
>That's not going to be enough. The FCCs requirments are regulations,
>not law.

If you don't think the FCC regs have the weight of law, check
out the fate of many that have fallen as a result of violating those
regs/laws.

>Besides, there are ITU treaty obligations that the government has to
>obide by. This means knowledge of morse code as one of the requirements neede
d
>before the issuance of a ham radio license. Treaties take precedence, and so
>any lawsuit would be thrown out based on this.

One (1) wpm testing would satisfy the treaty.  We don't need
13 or 20wpm to satisfy the ITU obligation.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:16 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: [e-mail] (Russ)
Subject: Re: Lost my 10-X What do I do?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:14:07 GMT
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:>[e-mail] (Nick Feliccia) wrote:
:>Back during the last solar cycle I had a ten ten number; I think I
:>remember what it was but I am not sure. Who would I contact about
:>verifying it?
:>Thanks alot.
:>Nick N3FKS
:>Respond to Email

Hello Nick, I'll pass your number on in my e-mail reply, but for
renewals or info updates, send them to WA6POZ, Gerry at:

10-10 International net, Inc
643 N. 98th Street #142
Omaha,NE 68114-2332

For DX stations, send to:

Carol Hugentober  K8DHK
4441 Andreas AVE
Cincinnati,  OH.  45211-2622

The cost for 10-10 membership is $10 USA & $13 for DX stations.
But you don't have to renew just to update address or callsign
changes. It would be nice for those that have 10-10 numbers and
recently received a new vanity call to pass their new call and info on
to Gerry so he can keep the database updated. Gerry maintains the
roster for Ten-Ten and also puts out a program called XXIP that will
display info on a number or callsign when entered. A post card or QSL
with the new call and any address change would be fine.


Ten-Ten International also has a Web site with tons of info about
renewals, new membership, activities and awards.

The URL is http://www.lehigh.edu/lists/tenten-l/

I try and maintain a list of active 10 meter beacons for the Web site.
The 10 meter band hasn't been very hot but there are sporadic E
openings along with some back-scatter and occasional rare F layer
skip. I managed to work a few African stations with a 10-10 numbers
when the east-west skip came around. Even worked a VK9 with a 10-10#.
I have heard the VP8 beacon in Antarctica on many occasions lately but
not too many stations on form the area right now.

My main interest is the 10-10 DX award along with the Bar and VP
awards plus I like to work the contests when the band permits. If
there is anything else that you would like to know and can't find it
at the Web site, let me know and I'll get back to you if I can fill
in.

de N5EJS
Russ




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:17 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:17:10 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
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Message-ID: <5a97r4$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (T.L.Bryant) wrote:

>In article <5a7a6a$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>>Well, let me ask some questions:  What does the endorsement mean, what
>>is it supposed to accomplish?  The proposal seems to say that you
>>should NOT be allowed to operate CW in a designated HF CW band until
>>you have passed a minimum code operating speed test.  If that's what
>>folks want, I could care less, but I see no value in the proposal.

>I see it as a compromise that would satisfy both sides of the code debate. No

>one is saying that such an endorsement would be the answer to everything, but

>at least it's a start.

Would it be better positioned if some segment was allowed
for CW without the endorseent?  Perhaps like the novice
subbands?

>>Also,  who's going to police the CW subbands to make sure someone
>>without an endorsement isn't operating CW?

>How are they policed now? Who polices the bottom 25 khz. of the 75, 40, 20, a
nd
>15 meter bands to make sure there are only extra class licensees operating
>there?

True.  Guess it'd be an honour system then unless there's
an enhancement to the FCC database to reflect a CW
endorsement.

>>Ironically, today's band allocations contain only two totally
>>exclusive CW subbands.  They are on 6m and 2m and any non-coded
>>tech is free to use them at whatever speed that person wishes.

>As I said, the proposal doesn't have all of the answers, but it's a start.

Sounds reasonable, I'd support it.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:19 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:18:08 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
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[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:


>Read what I wrote...you said most extras memorized the theory
>AND why should techs be any different.  My comment is twofold:

Yes, thats what I said. I'll say it again. Most extras I know memorized the
answers to the theory tests.  The implication was that if it's OK for extras t
o
memorize the questions/answers, it should be OK for techs too.
Far as I'm concerned, nothing wrong with memorizing answers to the written
tests. You do what you have to do to pass.  Too bad some people can't apply th
at
principle to the code tests.

>You no ore know how many or what percet may have memorized
>anything (be they extras or techs) and the comment has typically
>been direced (as yours was) towrds techs to discredit them.
>I said nothing about extras either favoring or not the CW
>test.

Today it looks like you are having a bad keyboard day.  I honestly can't figur
e
out what that says.......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:21 1997
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:27:02 -0600
From: Pablo Garcia <[e-mail]>
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To: "Michael P. Deignan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122295 rec.radio.amateur.policy:44997 rec.radio.shortwave:91552

Michael P. Deignan wrote:
>
> In article <59joc6$[e-mail]>, T.L.Bryant <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> >>I agree with you in principle ... those people who have no interest in
> >>*radio* technology (the "art" in "radio art", NOT CW, which is simply
> >>telegraphy, which has existed for far longer than radio) don't deserve
> >>to be hams ... even if they can copy 20+wpm of Morse code.
> >
> >That's about the most elitist statement I've ever heard. What you're saying
 is
> >that people who simply want to be hams because they think it would be an
> >enjoyable hobby or pastime don't deserve to be hams.
>
> Yup. That's Carl for you. In one sentence he will call CW-supporters a
> bunch of ignorant elitists, yet in the next breath tell you how only
> people with PhDs in EE should be hams. He'll also usually tell you how
> he has forgotten more RF theory while standing in front of the urinal
> (not a short period of time, given general prostrate health at his age)
> than the entire combined population of all amateurs throughout the
> entire universe put together knows.
>
> MD
> --
> --
> --  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
> --
> --  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.
idiotas


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:22 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:27:05 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5aactc$[e-mail]>
References: <5a817e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-126.kuentos.guam.net
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[e-mail] wrote:

>In article <5a817e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
>Kehler) writes:

>>Not possible.  Spew can't write a paragraph with more than two sentences.
>>Complex ideas get him confused.  Now Carl could be Spew's daddy..... and
>>that would make him Grandpa Lennys grandson.
>>
>>

>At least my family tree forks...unlike yours.

Plastic forks, rite ? Like the ones at a picnic ?





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:22 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!in1.nntp.cais.net!NEWS1!not-for-mail
From: Bob Lewis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: READ ME FIRST !! A MIRACLE !!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:32:09 -0500
References: <[e-mail]> <5a9507$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Organization: AA4PB
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Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Jerry AERO) wrote:
>
> >To learn beginning code fast, get the Code Crash Tape.
>
> >Guaranteed to teach code in less than an hour.
>
> >Reply to this message or send e mail to
>
> >[e-mail]
>
> Well, there you have it. Now NOBODY has an excuse for not learning code.
> Next week we should ALL be extras.......
>
> 73, Jim KH2D

Sure it can teach code in less than an hour - the question is can you
learn it that fast!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:24 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Ham radio to internet connection
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:32:15 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5aad72$[e-mail]>
References: <5a6rnc$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-126.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Rick Cherry) wrote:

>I want to be able to connect my ham radio on my sail boat so I can
>have access to the internet back home.  My home has a permenant hookup
>to the internet via frame relay.  How can I do this?
>Email [e-mail]
>Thanks in advance

A. Very carefully.
B. Very slowly.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:25 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amatuer.swap,rec.radio.amateur
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!usenet.kornet.nm.kr!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-11.sprintlink.net!eskimo!news
From: Tom Valenti <[e-mail]>
Subject: WTB ICOM IC-2330A 2M/220 mobile rig
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45507 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122307

Tom in Seattle here.

I'm looking for a mint ICOM IC-2330A. Would like to take it on a long
bike ride
and of course keep it as a pet for home too.  ;-)
--
Tom "Wunski" Valenti
KB7RSK
http://www.eskimo.com/~valenti/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:26 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!newsfeed1.aimnet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.nap.net!uwm.edu!rutgers!iag.net!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.fast.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!129.34.139.15!newsgate.watson.ibm.com!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: READ ME FIRST !! A MIRACLE !!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:37:34 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <5aadh1$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5a9507$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Bob Lewis <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Jim Kehler wrote:
>>
>> [e-mail] (Jerry AERO) wrote:
>>
>> >To learn beginning code fast, get the Code Crash Tape.
>>
>> >Guaranteed to teach code in less than an hour.
>>
>> >Reply to this message or send e mail to
>>
>> >[e-mail]
>>
>> Well, there you have it. Now NOBODY has an excuse for not learning code.
>> Next week we should ALL be extras.......
>>
>> 73, Jim KH2D

>Sure it can teach code in less than an hour - the question is can you
>learn it that fast!

Oh, I get it. It's a 45 minute casette tape... OK.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:27 1997
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From: [e-mail] (George Tamayo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Please Read:
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 21:00:00 (PST)
Organization: Infosoft Publishing Company (805-288-1414)
Lines: 63
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (George Tamayo)
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm115-55.smartlink.net
X-mailer: PowrMAIL for PowerBBS Ver. 1.5 (Beta 6b) (rev. 1.00d)

Fellow Amateurs:  Please read the first two paragraphs!

[e-mail] (PAT CLAWSON) said to ALL in comp.bbs.misc:

Boardwatch may have abandoned the BBS sysop, but TeleGrafix is still standing
strong with them.  However, we think that BBS systems must become
Internet-connected if they are to survive in a Webbed world.

First, we need to quit calling these online systems by the moniker "BBS."
The term has come to reflect something on the order of ham radio -- low-rent
communications run by amateurs.  That may accurately reflect some BBS
systems, but we've found that many sysops run very professional online
businesses.

Second, we need to start emphasizing the Power of Telnet and talk about
Telnet Sites, not BBS systems.  A telnettable BBS or legacy system can do
many things the Web can't.  Most of the computer industry and public has
been Web-washed (brainwashed) by all the press hype.  They think the Web
is all there is to the Internet/online experience. Just a couple of days
ago, I was talking to the Internet reporter for one of America's most
prestigious newspapers.  He had never even heard of Telnet, didn't have a
clue what it was -- and his news reports influence literally millions of
Americans. BBS sysops and BBS system manufacturers need to refocus their
efforts, and begin producing tools and content that take advantage of the
Power of Telnet.

Third, Telnet Site operators (such as BBS sysops) must professionalize the
look and feel of their systems.  Most sysops make little investment in
quality graphics for their systems.  In a glitzy Web world, it is little
wonder that the public is turned off by ANSI BBS systems no matter how if
the content on them is of high quality. We constantly hear BBS sysops
complain about having to pay what are very modest sums of money for
RIPscrip graphics -- but the people running Web sites don't think twice
about investing thousands of dollars for a fabulous look.

Despite all the flack we take from BBS sysops, we continue to support
their efforts -- and we always will.  But BBS sysops have to change with
the times, and they have to be willing to invest to upgrade their systems
to compete with (or complement) the Web.

On Christmas, TeleGrafix released the first multimedia Telnet browsers.
RIPtel Visual Telnet is available now from our Web site at
www.telegrafix.com.  This is a huge step forward for the Internet, and it
represents a salvation for BBS sysops by placing Telnet graphically on a
higher level than the Web.

The serious professional operators will get on board the Visual Telnet
train, and they will live to see a brighter day.

Pat Clawson
TeleGrafix Communications Inc.
Winchester, VA

Web: www.telegrafix.com

---
George M. Tamayo - WD6EJO
South Mountain Online
---
 * PowerAccess 1.50 And then Adam said, "What's a headache?"






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!news.ysu.edu!odin.oar.net!malgudi.oar.net!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: 30 Dec 1996 21:10:29 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <5a9b45$[e-mail]>
References: <5a6nqk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8m0j$[e-mail]> <5a97cb$[e-mail]>
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In article <5a97cb$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...

>>From what I see, your arguments are just opinions, and have no legal basis.
>>That's not going to be enough. The FCCs requirments are regulations,
>>not law.
>
>If you don't think the FCC regs have the weight of law, check
>out the fate of many that have fallen as a result of violating those
>regs/laws.

What I mean't by that was that they are in and of their own governing body.
They don't have to answer to courts unless the regulations violate the
constitution, and they don't have to go through the courts to levy fines. Whil
e
the regulations hold the weight of law, the FCC only has to answer to
themsleves when it comes to enforcement. The regs. aren't laws in the
traditional sense of a law that goes through a legislature

>>Besides, there are ITU treaty obligations that the government has to
>>obide by. This means knowledge of morse code as one of the requirements
needed
>>before the issuance of a ham radio license. Treaties take precedence, and so

>>any lawsuit would be thrown out based on this.
>
>One (1) wpm testing would satisfy the treaty.  We don't need
>13 or 20wpm to satisfy the ITU obligation.

Someone would still find a way to get around it, even at that rate.

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:30 1997
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Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:21:18 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: None
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>
X-Article-Creation-Date: Mon Dec 30 21:17:23 1996 GMT
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  "><>  N8LDY  <><"  wrote:

---snip stuff---

> Proposal # 1766
>
> A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
> One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
> except in times of emergency...

---snip more stuff---

Hi Chuck,

My first reaction is that your proposal would have an effect
exactly opposite to that intended.  Rather than encourage the
use of Morse, the proposal would actually RESTRICT it's use
to those specifically "endorsed".

Seems this puts a historically *experimental* service on the
slippery slope of requiring an "endorsement" for any mode, and
eventually leads to suppressing the experimental roots of the
amateur service.

Just my personal opinion, and your mileage may vary.

73, de Hans, K0HB
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:32 1997
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Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:31:05 -0600
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Organization is the enemy of Improvisation!
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster> <01bbf4f9$aeb74120$72070ccf@jim-reid-1>
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Lines: 32


Jim Reid  wrote:
>
 ....snip.......
>
> An excellent suggestion.  I proposed many months ago Endorsements
> for all HF operations including SSB,  Digital,  and CW.  The endorsement
> earned the privilege of mode and band segment usage.
>
> However,  the suggestion was bombarded with comments about its
> complications,  the necessary examination of technical information
> would require elaborate new test questions, enforcement would be
> hard,  etc.,  etc., etc.......  And the thread died.
>

Jim,

Ignoring all the complaints about test questions, enforcement, etc.,
etc.,
I have a fundamental problem with the idea in that it seems (to me)
to be counter to the spirit of innovation and experimentation which
is at the root of the amateur service.

If I must be "endorsed" for every new thing I try, then no new things
will ever see the light of day, because the *endorsement* does not
exist for something that has never been tried.

Just my personal opinion, and your mileage may vary.

73, de Hans, K0HB
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:33 1997
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:16:25 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:
>
> The best reason for keeping the CW requirement is because it is so amusing t
o
> listen to the whiners.

AMEN!... Also, keeps em off the HF (mostly) for a few years until
*maybe*
the law changes. Every little bit helps. I don't mind a bit if they
whine on 2 meters.Also the net keeps them busy and occupied.

--
Stan  KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:34 1997
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:18:49 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2guq$[e-mail]>
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KC5WCP wrote:
>
> [e-mail] wrote:
>
> >The best reason for keeping the CW requirement is because it is so amusing
to
> >listen to the whiners.
>
> HF is for sissies. try DXing on Two.

Nah! HF is really for the non-whiners. enjoy your 2m DX.
--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:28:02 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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><> N8LDY <>< wrote:
>
> I have used CW almost exclusively for the past 15 years and I love it.
> 13 wpm did not come easy for me but in time I made it to 25 wpm.
> Times are changing and we must change but we need not throw
> the baby out with the bath water to make these changes!
>
> Proposal # 1766
>
> A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
> One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
> except in times of emergency... *Endorsements* are grandfathered
> to all who have passed cw testing in the past and can be obtained
> by passing code tests in the future. In this way we can perserve and
> recognize the *skill* of cw and reward those who use it without
> mandating it's use by others...... I believe it is better to bend a little
> than to break. CW is a skill and Compromise is the way to preserv it.
> Let us open the Door to the future yet retain and respect the past.....
>
>
> GREAT LAKES AWARD MANAGER
> MICHIGAN AMATEUR RADIO ALLIANCE
> CHARLES "CHUCK" LEMAR  -=N8LDY=-
> WAS DXCC WAC GLA SM
Excellent Idea!.. how about as a reward, we allow only hams with a CW
certificate to use the bands below 30mhz. I think the problem is solved
now, those with a certificate get the privileges, and those who don't
...
don't get the privileges...but they **are** still allowed to whine.
(heh heh)
--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.71.1.48!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:36:24 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

MN Maniac wrote:
>
> ...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent to
> understand and accept modern methods of communication.

And the non-beepers are merely too stupid or too incompetant to learn
the code.. no spine, no ambition, no creativity...
also (heh heh heh) no HF.
Non-beepers of the world unite  ... and whine on.
--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:39 1997
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:40:16 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45001 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122302

KC5WCP wrote:
>
> Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> > >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...
>
> >Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
> >twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
> >crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
> >The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any facet
> >of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.
>
> Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
> because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
> code. WRONG!

And those that can't...whine...
Shame you still can't learn...
Six year olds CAN, why can't you?
--
Stan  KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 30 Dec 1996 17:43:10 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5a9ghu$[e-mail]>
References: <5a7moc$[e-mail]> <5a8f6a$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122305 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45004

In article <[e-mail]>, Bill Newkirk  <[e-mail]> wrote:

>then you're helping the illiteracy of the public about amateur radio. i
>might assume when you've told them that it's an "amateur radio" that
>they probably responded with something like "wow. i didn't know they
>were that small...".

Been there, tried that. Gave the 60-second spew on how amateur radio
is different than CB radio. FCC licenses and all that. When I finished,
people said "oh, a CB radio".

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!visi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!204.238.120.21!jump.net!news-out.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:50:44 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6e1p$[e-mail]> <5a8cg6$[e-mail]> <5a8obm$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45005 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122308

KC5WCP wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:
>
> >[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>
> >>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:
>
> >>>On Sat, 28 Dec 1996 15:49:47 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>If there were changes the band plans would remain the same. I even
> >>>>agree with setting off the current CW potions as they are for CW ONLY.
> >>>>That would help insure the   ----> beepers<----    a place to play.
>
> >>>Aw come on now, is that what it's getting down to, massive usage of
> >>>that "b" word? This person writes a well thought out post and
> >>>completely ruins his credibility with 1/2 of the people in this
> >>>newsgroup by using the "b" word.
>
> >>>73 (beep)
>
> >>Contrary to popular belief I do not use the BEEPER as a derogatory
> >>comment.
>
<snip>
>
> So i guess the name Squiggy is not the same thing?
> Yeah, I bet all them folks that use pantywaist and newbie and welfare
> and whinner, ad infinitum ad nauseum have the right to do so cause
> they beep and that gives them more privilege.....
> yadda yadda yadda

The difference is that SOME of us can use your own methods and not only
that...do it in morse also.
Shame you can't, but you are right... it does give us more privilege...
we can use HF...
--
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!gatech!newsfeed.internetmci.com!hunter.premier.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-10.sprintlink.net!news.ro.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Casey)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Hams and Ebonics
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 23:09:59 GMT
Organization: Starfleet Command
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts5p13.ro.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
someone can come up with other examples.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:44 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 23:26:42 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga12-08.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30  5:28:28 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122304 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45002

Damn fine job on the page Burt! An admirable effort, very please to
the eye even with your ugly mug <g> on it! I think the graphic of Cape
Cod is great. Although I do not agree with all the content, I have
added a link to it on my ham page so that others might judge for
themselves.

One suggestion for the signature Burt. Include the "http://" to make
it easy to grab the complete URL using a news reader.

73 de n4jvp
Fritz

http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/3710/

On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 10:06:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>Please visit my World Wide Web Site, you have never seen a page like it.
>You will see:
>
>1. A naked chic
>2. The writings of me and others on ham radio.
>3. The warm side of K1OIK.
>4. A test for your SVGA monitor
>5. A picture of me and my family.
>6. A Nazi connection in ham radio???
>
>
>Burt Fisher    Teacher of video, broadcasting and electronics
>Amateur call           South Dennis, Ma. (Cape Cod)
>  K1OIK        If you sit on the fence, it is a pain in the butt
>
>               [e-mail]    [e-mail]
>               www.geocities.com/WallStreet/5169

To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 16:45:20 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a213r$[e-mail]> <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <1996122423230 <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

Clint Bradford wrote:
>
> >>Look autism up in a medical dictionary. You will find it is a
> >>preoccupation with fantasy as a mechanism to escape reality.
>
> Please do not insult victims/families affected by autism by making it
> appear as if it is a affliction of choice, Bill, in any argument here.
>
> I don't think that's what you meant....
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Clint Bradford, KE6LCS/KAF3359    909.681.6210 Voice    [e-mail]
> ATTENTION to Details              909.681.6221 BBS        [e-mail]
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually , Bill didn't write that part. he only observer what autism
meant... and he is correct... I said what I meant. It IS an inability to
learn, although you are correct in a sense too, I have known (do know)
a couple of Hams to whom autism might apply, and they could learn
morse..
actually easier than I did.
I have never (until now) believed in "can't" but some of these whiners
are starting to make be believe there really is some sort of disability.
Maybe it's just the 90's welfare mentality tho'

73,
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:47 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 16:47:39 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <59slgo$[e-mail]> <59t2hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a61md$[e-mail]> <5a6agb$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

Drew Durigan wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
> >
> >In article <[e-mail]>, Dave Heil  <[e-mail]>
> wrote:
> >
> >>Drew,
> >>Still at it, I see.
> >
> >I think Spew and Carl are one and the same person. Notice that whenever
> >Carl disappears Spew shows up, and vice-versa?
>
> Well, if you're smart enough to know how to trace a post, do so and you
> will find out differently.
>
> -Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>  KF4DDM

ye gods! you mean there really IS two of them?
73,
Stan  KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"
<beep>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 16:53:46 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a213r$[e-mail]> <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <1996122423230 <[e-mail]> <5a7r3i$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

Bill Nelson wrote:
>
> Clint Bradford ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
> : >>Look autism up in a medical dictionary. You will find it is a
> : >>preoccupation with fantasy as a mechanism to escape reality.
>
> : Please do not insult victims/families affected by autism by making it
> : appear as if it is a affliction of choice, Bill, in any argument here.
>
> : I don't think that's what you meant....
>
> I was not insulting the victims of autism. It is NOT a choice a person
> makes, and can be very crippling.  I was just providing a very simple
> description of what it is - to a person who misused the term.
>
> My apologies if it appeared that I felt there was any choice. I should
> have made my statement more clearly.
>
> Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])
Well, I meant to imply what I have seen on the TV news (not a reliable
source, I admit) but I was under the impression that autism is a type of
learning disability where in some of the symptoms are :
seeing letters reversed, or writing them that way, have some areas
completely 'blocked' out while in othere areas there may appear to be no
disability and/or even a superiority, similar to 'idiots savant'
guess I gotta go back and re-read what I thought I read.. Oh well, been
wrong before.
73,
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"
<beep>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:49 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 15:54:57 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a67ji$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ksts.seed.net.tw
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122319 rec.radio.scanner:74576

Dick Kendrick wrote:

> No matter how many posts you reassemble to quote out of context, no

Really, WHAT did I "qoute out of context".  How can a direct & exact
qoute (which is what I did) be out of context?  Sounds like you don't
care for being confronted with facts because it changes your little
warped perception of life.

> matter how many distortions of reality you vomit, you'll NEVER escape
> the fact that you've been exposed for what you are: a liar and a fraud.

Funny, YOU are the one accusing others of lies & manipulation but have
no facts to back your statements.  Now THAT is FRAUD.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: SPEW IS A MANIAC !!!!---Jimmy makes an AMAZING discovery!!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 16:59:42 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a85gt$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 166.41.60.108
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> In article <5a85gt$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Jim
> Kehler) writes:
>
> >For those of you who have been pestered by MNManiac, thought you like to
> know
> >who he really is - the infamous 'Spew Durigan'.  What a guy.  In cognito
> at
> >AOL......
>
> What an AMAZING discovery, Jimmy!  Gee...how long did you have to put down
> your brass key in order to figure it out?
>
> Not too difficult, considering that I have always provided my full NAME
> and my LOCATION on my AOL profile!  (see below)

<snip due  to lack of interest>

> as you so astutely put it.  Congratulations, Jimmy...you get an 'A' for
> the day!
>
> Are all the Beepers as bright and as eager as you?
>
> -Drew in Sunny Central Florida-

Nah! we just weren't *that* interested.
Sorry tho' that you can't learn the code.

73,
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"
<beep>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news-out.microserve.net!news-in.microserve.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!tezcat!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!spring.edu.tw!feeder.seed.net.tw!reader.seed.net.tw!news
From: John Mackey---KA0SSF <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.scanner
Subject: Re: All Hail King Mackey the Great
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 16:14:42 -0800
Organization: just myself
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <58vk73$[e-mail]> <5922t7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <599rq8$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59bmu9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4hsj$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122321 rec.radio.scanner:74577

BAYCITVIDGRP wrote:

> ..the anal abutment one finds odiferous

It figures you would think up something like this.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Mark Taylor <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 80m AM?
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 19:40:01 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a8jmf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: spg-as40s31.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I)

it used to be 3880-3890, but it is really spreading out now.  almost
anytime of day you can hear them, (I Won't include myself, even though i
do work 75 AM sometimes...) near 3885.
--
We laugh at honor, and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.
C.S. Lewis

They that can give up an essential liberty to purchase a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.   Ben Franklin



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!news-admin
From: "Mark McClain" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Crystals
Date: 31 Dec 1996 00:49:53 GMT
Organization: InternetMCI
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <01bbf6b4$23716200$a80637a6@204.70.128.1>
References: <5a47h1$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: usr15-dialup40.mix1.sacramento.mci.net
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155


Bomar
800-526-3935
$15 per crystal for 1 week service
$10 per crystal for 2-3 week service
(I just ordered a few crystals about 3 weeks ago and received them last
week. Not bad considering I asked for UPS ground service and their in NJ
and I'm in Seattle!! They are getting them out the door in 2 weeks at only
10 bucks- not bad. And yes, the crystals are good- I installed them last
night...)

Marden Electronics
800-222-6093
$17.50 per crystal for 1 week service
$15.50 per crystal for 2 week service
$12.50 per crystal for 4 week service

And there are others, but these are companies I have used a lot in the last
year.

Mark, N6OBY
Seattle, WA


Bigdad <[e-mail]> wrote in article <5a47h1$[e-mail]>...
> Where is a good place(s) to buy crystals nowdays? Its been ages
> since ive needed to xtal up a radio. Any help is appreciated!
>
>
>                    73's  Art WB9HNJ
>
>


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!zombie.ncsc.mil!newsgate.duke.edu!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail] (A.G. von Luternow)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 01:08:54 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4m25$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: atl-ga12-08.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30  7:10:45 PM CST 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.201
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45012 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122328

On Mon, 30 Dec 1996 18:21:07 GMT, [e-mail] (Gary Coffman)
wrote:
-snip-
>I believe that the entire idea of "Incentive" Licensing
>is fatally flawed in that the added requirements for
>higher class licenses don't correspond with the added
>privileges granted. For example, there is no less potential
>for harm from a General operating on 14.275 MHz than there
>is from an Extra operating on 14.180 MHz, yet they have to
>pass different tests to do basically the same things on
>basically identical spectrum. Either an Extra's qualifications
>are required to operate 20m or they are not. There is no
>legitimacy to disparate tests for similar spectrum access.
-snip-

Amateur radio is many things but above all a learning experience. I
imagine very few hams (code or no-code) could pass all the written
elements for the advanced or extra class ticket. There are a good
number of hams who are not professionals in a field closely-related to
our hobby. The novice, techs and general tickets are steps for those
who wish to improve their technical knowledge and skills. Increased
spectrum privileges are supposed to be an incentive to learn, not that
they really appear to have done that much good.

Requiring that an entry-level ham be able to pass today's advanced
class exam (see note below) will limit the growth of amateur radio
more than the code speed requirement ever did. With no grandfathering
every ham with less than an advanced ticket would have to be
re-tested. What percentage of those hams would be able to remain hams
with a year's notice? Fifty, sixty per cent  perhaps?

Besides eliminating the SKs and inactives (not a bad thing), a good
number of hams will not be able to pass this new exam. Why, I don't
know. Some just won't make the effort, some won't have the time and
some just will have a hard time learning it. Losing just 25% of the
amateurs who hold novice, tech and general tickets could be the death
knell of the hobby.

No matter what losses are incurred in number of "qualified" hams what
happens to the flow of new blood. How many potential hams who are not
professionals in a closely related field will be turned away. The
no-code VHF ticket flood will be turned into a  trickle, the amateur
spectrum becomes the professional's playground.

Diversity within the ranks of our hobby will disappear as it becomes
the playground of the technical professional. Anyone with the desire
to learn but without the prerequesite knowledge is pretty much SOL. No
clubs will be able to offer classes. I wouldn't  want to guess at how
long it would take just to explain all the material once without
questions (elements 2 - 4A). If anyone wants to hazard a guess at how
many hours, I'd love to hear it. I am guessing that it couldn't be
covered in a course lasting a college semester with questions and
explanations.

Some sort of entry-level class is needed irregardless of code/no-code.
Making entry into our hobby too difficult for those without a
technical background serves little if any purpose.

73 de n4jvp
Fritz

Note : I am assuming that the restricted class ticket will be in the
ball park of today's advanced class. Those who favor just two license
classes generally speak of today's advanced exam as the threshold of
entry.

To reply to this message, please remove the
underscore from the beginning of the reply to
address. I'm trying to fight the spam-bots!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Irv McWherter <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FCC Issues Notice in case!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 17:54:00 -0800
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.116.64.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01E (Win16; I)

Jason Hanson wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Arden Eby) wrote:
>
> >What??  He explained why it occurred, "Cutbacks have us down to a
> >skeleton crew."  You want low taxes.....well you got 'em!  If you want
> >someone to blame, look in a mirror.  It's John Q. Public who would
> >sell his soul for a $25 a month more in lower taxes.  Well surprise!
> >You get what you pay for.
>
> Well said!
>
> Jason


The truth can be very very hard to swallow.  A


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Mark Schneider)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.shortwave,aus.radio.amateur.misc,aus.radio.amateur.digital
Subject: Re: The Worst Ham page
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 01:54:38 GMT
Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc.
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59pfq4$[e-mail]> <59pq6i$[e-mail]> <5a5cfs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a7jak$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d20.mnh.nh.ultra.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122327 rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20981 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45011 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22605 rec.radio.scanner:74587 rec.radio.shortwave:91576 aus.radio.amateur.misc:1721 aus.radio.amateur.digital:333

On Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:55:13 -0500, Burt Fisher <[e-mail]>
wrote:

>Blake Bowers wrote:
>>
>>
>>         I went there.  I saw it.  I liked it.
>>
>> Good job.   And yes, I had figured out what the naked chic would be,
>> far in advance of clicking on the icon.
>
>Thank you for having a sense of humor.
>
**snip**

Yeah, I had an idea about the chick, too. That's a little scary. Great
page, keep modifying it!!


Mark SCHNEIDER -- Trying to figure out what to do with all these
German traits.....hmmmmm, maybe if we just march this group of
neo-nazis and Skinheads into this little sealable room over here,
close the door, climb this ladder over here, and dump these pellets
down this pipe.........


***************************************************************
* [e-mail]                                     *

*                                                             *
* Mark Schneider, WI1W     http://www.ultranet.com/~onbelay   *
*    Manchester, NH                                           *
***************************************************************
.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:58:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-4.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.207.105.50!prodigy.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Drew Durigan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: 31 Dec 1996 02:16:39 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 18
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5a9t27$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: innugap2-int.news.prodigy.com
X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

[e-mail] (Casey) wrote:
>
>Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
>goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
>someone can come up with other examples.


"Back in the old days when we had to take our tests at an FCC office..."

"I went to the doctor yesterday for my colostomy bag problem and he..."

"Back in WWII, I was head Beeper and saved the world with Morse code..."

"HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI"


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.campus.mci.net!news.telis.org!s22-pm04-ontro-t.telis.org!user
From: [e-mail] (wb6siv)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FS: Tubes and Manuals
Date: 31 Dec 1996 02:36:18 GMT
Organization: Raymond Sarrio Co.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: s22-pm04-ontro-t.telis.org

I have for sale a large quantity of tubes and vintage manuals all listed
on my web site at http://www.sarrio.com. 73's Ray
--
The Raymond Sarrio Co. a full feature Ham Radio Storefront and web site develo
per. Located at http://www.sarrio.com.

In association with Brillar Enterprises http://win-win.com/brillar provider of
 discount CD-Roms!



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.lightlink.com!light.lightlink.com!siram
From: Siegfried Rambaum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: When MIKE became MIC
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 21:42:21 -0500
Organization: ART MATRIX - LIGHTLINK
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: light.lightlink.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
To: Evan Pallesen <[e-mail]>
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>

> DE>To further digress, in "them" days capacitors were called "condensers" to
o.
>
> They still are, if you own an old (cheap) enough car!

... and before that, they were Compensers for some short while, for
compensating is what actually they do in most applications.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!news.alt.net!newspost1.alt.net!usenet
From: MIKEY <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Yaesu FT8000R "FREEBAND MOD?"
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 21:49:39 -0500
Organization: Altopia Corp. - Affordable Usenet Access - http://www.alt.net
Lines: 43
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----------3E8D2A0B16030"
X-Sender: MIKEY <[e-mail]> (Unverified)
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b1 (Win95; I)
X-Priority: Normal
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45524 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122331


------------3E8D2A0B16030
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  Hello,
I recently purchased the ft8000r, performed the mars mod, and I am
wondering if anyone has been able to do a "FREEBAND" type of mod on this
unit.  Wonder
what would happen if the software cable was pulled out during an
upload?  A
scrambled  microprocessor, or a european mod?

         Anyone played yet???


------------3E8D2A0B16030
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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<HTML><BODY TEXT="#000000" BGCOLOR="#C0C0C0" LINK="#0000EE" VLINK="#FF0000" AL
INK="#FFFF80">

<DT>  Hello,</DT>

<DT>I recently purchased the ft8000r, performed the mars mod, and I am
wondering if anyone has been able to do a "FREEBAND" type of
mod on this unit.  Wonder</DT>

<DT>what would happen if the software cable was pulled out during an upload?&n
bsp;
A</DT>

<DT>scrambled  microprocessor, or a european mod?</DT>

<DT>  </DT>

<DT>         Anyone played yet???
; </DT>

<DT> </DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
------------3E8D2A0B16030--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wildstar.net!newsfeed.telalink.net!telalink!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Doug Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 60-Hz QRM All Over HF spectrum
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 02:55:02 GMT
Organization: Telalink Corporation, Nashville, TN, USA
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <5a9o06$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf59a$0f502560$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.181.132.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

>Mike Kelly wrote:
>> I am beginning to troubleshoot a serious 60-Hz noise problem I have here at

I sent Mike a private email reply suggesting he check for a new touch
lamp in his neighborhood; these devices have caused this kind of
problem in the past.

This morning, I received a reply that Mike had just installed such a
lamp in his own home; unplugging it immediately cleared the QRN.

Luckily, it was Mike's own lamp.  These things can cover a lot of
ground; neighbors' lamps are capable of damaging (or destroying) your
reception.

The clue is the frequency sensitivity.  If QRN peaks are evenly spaced
at (very!) roughly 200KHz intervals, it likely is a touch lamp.

73 Doug




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!math.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!freenet.columbus.oh.us!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael Cremeans)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Motorola MTX 810 - Need Info
Date: 30 Dec 1996 22:24:20 -0500
Organization: The Greater Columbus Free-Net
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5aa114$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.freenet.columbus.oh.us
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]


Anyone know any thing about the Motorola MTX 810???

Please send me email if you do.

Mike

[e-mail]

--
         Mike Cremeans                                    N8XYM
 Digital/Voice mail pager 646-1497             145.43 / 444.55 *  User 204 *
Greater Columbus Freenet Consultant               GCFN Ham Radio Moderator


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 22:28:55 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv19.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
> >
> >Us aging babay boomers gota stick
> > together, cause in a real short time period, we are gonna be the very
> > ones you speak against so passionately
>
> I do not speak "against" anyone.

Exsqueeze me???  You didn't speak out against anyone???  ABSOLUTELY
CORRECT!!! YOU SPOKE OUT AGAINST ALL RETIREES.  Don't you read what you
type???  You held ALL retirees accountable for maintaining the code
requirement.  For the virtual destruction of Amateur Radio as we know it.
I could repost your entire tirade, but that would be a redundant waste of
time, electrons and bandwidth.

Your logic is astounding as is your lack of short term memory.

> I simply believe that our hobby is
> doomed unless it attracts younger people to the hobby.  Of course we
> want to keep all of our current members too!

AH yes, qualifiers.  I know I said this but don't read that, cause this
is what I really meant.  I C said the blind man......  Sure, now that
you've been M C Hammered, the back pedaling begins...  Oh my...some of my
bestest buds are retirees...oh my oh my

I stand by my original quote.  With logic like this, I pity any client
who puts you on retainer.
>
> --
> Roger J. Buffington
> W6VZV
>
> USC Law, Class of '97

Still waiting for those inexpensive 940's.  Got almost 2 dozen buyers
lined up
--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 22:29:01 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6ceg$[e-mail]> <5a7s0h$[e-mail]> <5a8o4e$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv19.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <5a8o4e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> I would much rather have someone capable of fixing the EMP damaged
> equiptment and use packet to pass traffic.

Would that be HF packet with its rather limited transmission rate.  But a
question....if emp damaged all the transceivers, wouldn't it also damage
the equipment to diagnose and repair the emp damaged equipment??

Maybe Carl or Len could open a little shop in Mayberry, NC, kinda like
Emmett's Fix-It Shop.  Maybe Aunt Bea could fix up some fried chicken and
finger sandwiches will everyone dies from radiation poisoning.  Maybe
Goober could pump the gas needed to burn the unburied multitudes of
deceased.

But hey, pass that traffic.

Routine
number 666

check ARRL 10.....


>
>

--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Howard <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Hams and Ebonics
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 22:46:25 -0500
Organization: Erol's Internet Services
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: col-as9s31.erols.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----------AB0493F50CA1"
X-Sender: Howard <[e-mail]> (Unverified)
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b1 (Win95; I)
X-Priority: Normal


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Casey wrote:
>
> Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
> goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
> someone can come up with other examples.

But they can also get up next morning and go to work in a professional
setting and speak correctly.

------------AB0493F50CA1
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<HTML><BODY>

<DT>Casey wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."&
nbsp;
"We<BR>
> goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years",
etc. I sure<BR>
> someone can come up with other examples.<BR>
<BR></DT>

<DT>But they can also get up next morning and go to work in a professional
setting and speak correctly. </DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
------------AB0493F50CA1--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:09 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!news2.acs.oakland.edu!news.tacom.army.mil!news.webspan.net!ix.netcom.com!newsfeeds.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!news.apk.net!news
From: [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Date: 31 Dec 1996 03:53:19 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <5aa2nf$[e-mail]>
References: <5a8mf0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts1-dyn28.cannet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.5

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
>>Again, you're forgetting one important thing that will cause the lawsuit
>to
>>be
>>tossed out of court - ITU treaty obligations.
>
>I'd be willing to bet you that the ITU requirement will be overturned at
>the next conference.  Other countries are already ignoring the HF below
>30Mhz requirement and doing so openly.  Japan, for instance.
>
>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
> KF4DDM

Japan also openly violates the hunting of whales in international waters, but
that's irrelevant to the topic at hand.

But let's say the ITU  drops the code requirement. What then? You'd still have

to prove that morse code requirement is unconstitutional. The FCC is an entity

of the Federal government and, as such, only have to answer to a lawsuit in a
federal court. Your argument would fall flat on its face. You'd have to prove
that a morse code requirement violates the U.S. Constitution. That would be
pretty hard to do. There have been a few grass roots political groups that hav
e
tried to sue the FCC for violation of the First Amendment because of certain
words you're not allowed to say over the airwaves. They have had no success. I
f
the FCC can be allowed to blatently violate the constitution, what makes you
think someone would have success in filing suit to drop the morse code
requirement.

All I can say is good luck to whoever does it. They're certainly goiing to nee
d
it. (Along with a lot of cash to pay the lawyers fees.)

Tom - N8ECW



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 03:54:18 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.146.67.60
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Some guys traded 1x2s for new 1x2 callsigns and now their old 1x2 will
sit for 2 years? Seems like a waste.

73..de John/K8PXG


[e-mail] (Jim Lowman) wrote:

>Roland Stiner ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: It is my belief that it was a mistake to have a 2 year waiting period to
>: re-assign callsigns.  It should have been one year.  The two year rule
>: puts too many callsigns out commission.
>
>I agree.  Also, for those amateurs who give up their callsigns for a vanity
>callsign, those callsigns should be immediately available.  Not that I'd want
>one, but there were a lot of 2x1s that were "traded-in" for different
>formats.
>
>Did the FCC think there might be some "buyer's remorse" among the vanity
>applicants, or is this two-year rule just in keeping with their normal
>practice?
>
>73 de Jim - KF6CR
>
>

John/K8PXG in Pembroke Pines, FL


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.idt.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!news2.ee.net!news1.ee.net!usenet
From: Jeff DeLong <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur
Subject: ham desktop theme
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 22:58:47 -0500
Organization: eNET Inc.
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.31.168.103
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20984 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122370

I have not seen a desktop theme for windows05 so I made my own.
Feel free to get a copy at my home page.
http://www.greenapple.com/~kb8pwc

73 and happy new year to all!
--
Jeff DeLong
http://kb8pwc.ampr.org.........http://www.greenapple.com/~kb8pwc

packet-kb8pwc@k8qik.#seoh.oh.usa.noam
[e-mail]
[e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:12 1997
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From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: This is bullshit - WAS Re: BEEPERS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:12:08 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

Stan Aughenbaugh wrote:
>
> MN Maniac wrote:
> >
> > ...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent to
> > understand and accept modern methods of communication.
>
> And the non-beepers are merely too stupid or too incompetant to learn
> the code.. no spine, no ambition, no creativity...
> also (heh heh heh) no HF.
> Non-beepers of the world unite  ... and whine on.
> --
> Stan KF0NC
> "90% of all statistics are made up"

Lighten up everyone! there's something for everyone in amateur radio. If
you don't like a mode don't use it!
if you like a mode use it! if you want more earn it. if you are happy
with FM, stick with it. If you're happy with CW, stick with it! either
way, a licensed user is a member of our family of radio operators and
should be treated as such.

Jim..
KB6ZOP

Find me anywhere but digital


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:12 1997
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From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Hams and Ebonics
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 20:13:48 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Casey wrote:
>
> Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
> goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
> someone can come up with other examples.

When I can prove fluency in a second language, I get a 2% raise in
salary!

Sheet Homey I be in du do!


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:13 1997
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From: "Mitch, W4OA" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 22:24:01 -0600
Organization: The Vibroplex Co., Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Jim Lowman wrote:
>
> Roland Stiner ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
> : It is my belief that it was a mistake to have a 2 year waiting period to
> : re-assign callsigns.  It should have been one year.  The two year rule
> : puts too many callsigns out commission.
>
> I agree.  Also, for those amateurs who give up their callsigns for a vanity
> callsign, those callsigns should be immediately available.  Not that I'd wan
t
> one, but there were a lot of 2x1s that were "traded-in" for different
> formats.
>
> Did the FCC think there might be some "buyer's remorse" among the vanity
> applicants, or is this two-year rule just in keeping with their normal
> practice?
>
> 73 de Jim - KF6CR

the two year period was recommended to the fcc by n4rx, who saw
a potential problem with 'trafficing' in callsigns... the fcc
agreed with n4rx, and put the 2 year rule in when the final
regs on vanity callsigns were issued...

mitch, w4oa


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:14 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Tom, K4NR )
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 04:44:42 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5aa5o6$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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"Mitch, W4OA" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>the two year period was recommended to the fcc by n4rx, who saw
>a potential problem with 'trafficing' in callsigns... the fcc
>agreed with n4rx, and put the 2 year rule in when the final
>regs on vanity callsigns were issued...

>mitch, w4oa

Not only that but can you imagine the confusion at the Incoming QSL
Bureaus?  They would have to start checking the QSO date to figure out
who to send the cards to!




- 73 de Tom, K4NR



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:16 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Robert Reed)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: 31 Dec 1996 04:58:28 GMT
Organization: Prodigy Services Company  1-800-PRODIGY
Lines: 19
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5aa6hk$[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Version 1.2

>
>the two year period was recommended to the fcc by n4rx, who saw
>a potential problem with 'trafficing' in callsigns... the fcc
>agreed with n4rx, and put the 2 year rule in when the final
>regs on vanity callsigns were issued...
>
>mitch, w4oa


Where do some people come up with these far fetched reasons ?

There is a 2 ywar grace period for renewing a lapsed license and still
retain the callsign. The FCC must leave the callsign untouched if it is
to be reclaimed.

Robert Reed W2CE                        [e-mail]
1991 Route 37 West - Lot 109          [e-mail]
Toms River, New Jersey 08757



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:17 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:01:34 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <5abb26$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2ior$[e-mail]> <5a40k5$[e-mail]> <5a6et2$[e-mail]> <5a7c2b$[e-mail]> <5a8pbd$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Well last year I made a fine contact with a lady in Australia on 11m.
>All I used was a dipole and about 10watts SSB. Truly the bottom of the
>sunspot cycle. Explain that to me. Explain to me why a friend of mine
>who is beeping away in the next room made contact and QSL'd the same
>lady two months later with the same radio and same antenna same power
>at a different QTH

What would you like to me explain ? Radio propagation, why lady's in Australia
are on 11 meters, or why your radio works the same when somebody elses pushes
the PTT switch ?

>I could go on with dozens of other similar QSO's like the one with
>Vienna or the guy down in Panama I used to talk to every morning on my
>way into work but I hate to be a braggard.

I suggest you wouldn't brag about, at least not here.  I'm not sure if the rul
e
is still in effect, but the last time I heard you weren't allowed to talk to
anyone on 11 meters more than 150 miles away, and if that is still the case, i
t
would make you a criminal, not a braggard.

>Problem with HF is that ya always here wise old hams say "The band is
>dead" when they really should be saying"I am too lazy to spin the dial
>and listen for more than five minutes"

O. IC. Maybe thats why I am sitting here CQing on 160 and two guys in the stat
es
I am talking to on the packet cluster are sitting there listening for me.

>And yes i would like to have HF in my arsenal. That does not make me
>an HF sissie. An HF sissie is like the wise old ham described above in
>my last paragraph.

O. OK. All the old hams, who passed the test and are already on HF are sissies
,
but you aren't.  But you couldn't be an 'HF sissy'. You don't have a license t
o
be one yet, right ? When you get on HF, will you be a sissy too ?

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:18 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:06:29 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <5abbbb$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6e1p$[e-mail]> <5a8cg6$[e-mail]> <5a8obm$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45031 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122386

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>So i guess the name Squiggy is not the same thing?

Nope, it's not the same thing. Squiggy is one person.  'Beepers' are anyone wh
o
uses CW, right ?

>Yeah, I bet all them folks that use pantywaist and newbie and welfare
>and whinner, ad infinitum ad nauseum have the right to do so cause
>they beep and that gives them more privilege.....

I haven't seen any  mention of 'pantywaist' until you got here.  That must be
a
Mississippi term, I'm not familiar with it.

73, Jim KH2D






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:19 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:08:08 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5abbee$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8kks$[e-mail]> <5a8ogo$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>>>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>>>
>>>>Considered me a signator.
>>>>

>>>You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
>>>But you are a signator.

>>Well, Dan, if it's free, EVERYBODY wants one......

>STD's are free. Last time I passed the line by the bordello I heard
>this strange beeping comming from the line.....

Where else but in Mississippi would they have a line for a bordello......






From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:21 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Info-Hams Digest V96 #1581
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:13:40 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <5abbos$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>In article <[e-mail]> jher
[e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman) writes:
>>
>>1. In Hawaii, I hold regular QSOs with hams in the South Pacific and Asia.
>>I'd grow old attempting to do make contact with those same folks if I only
>>used 2m.

>Perhaps those particular folks, but certainly you can work stations
>in those areas regularly if you setup a satellite station. There
>is activity all around the Pacific Rim on the satellites.

Pacific Slim is on most of the VHF/UHF satellites, that' for sure.

>Some of
>it is even in CW if you insist on using that. I've contacted every
>continent, including Antarctica (Argentine expedition), via satellite,
>and my country count is probably around 130-150 (real ITU countries),

Gary, you gamer you.......

>Perhaps slightly surprising, there are also a number of ships at sea
>who run digital amateur stations. I had a long chat with an operator
>on a Canadian icebreaker for example. I don't recall working a ship
>in the South Pacific, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that
>there are some active. I saw a listing recently of digital stations

OK1DX/MM is on from all the oceans. But on CW, sorry.

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:22 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:15:55 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5abbt2$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (Richard Furuta) wrote:

>So now I'm curious.... Why are folks abandoning 2x1 callsigns in favor of
>1x2's?

Rick, a 2x1 is the worst call for DX'ing possible.  How many times have I hear
d
the DX station say:

'WB3U' what's the rest of your call ????

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:23 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:18:29 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5abc1r$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-131.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
>>
>> Still waiting for those inexpensive 940's.  Got almost 2 dozen buyers
>> lined up

>Your lack of maturity is breathtaking.  I will not be corresponding with
>you, or responding to your posts, any further.

So poo poo on you Steve, you little troll !!!  Nany nany na noo too !!!

At least the Troll make up for his lack of maturity with a breathtaking sense
of
humor, sick as it may be......

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:24 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!uwm.edu!newsfeeds.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:20:57 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5abc6e$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8oe2$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:


>And I don't remember asking your opinion or even valuing it.

>Have a nice day :)

You don't have to ask for anybodys opinion around here Eric.  With some of the
stuff you post, you'll get plenty of opinons without asking.  Beep Beep.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:25 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:24:57 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5abcdv$[e-mail]>
References: <5a9t27$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (WA8ULX) wrote:

>Drew you our such a Loser, personely Im getting tired of you Rambling
>about nothing, why dont you go listen to your local AM Rock Station.

Yeah, Spew. Put that in your 1977 Buick and drive it around the block...




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:26 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 05:28:53 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <5abcle$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5a9t27$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-131.kuentos.guam.net
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[e-mail] (Habib Delgado) wrote:

>On 31 Dec 1996 02:16:39 GMT, [e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Casey) wrote:
>>>
>>>Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
>>>goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
>>>someone can come up with other examples.
>>
>>
>>"Back in the old days when we had to take our tests at an FCC office..."
>>
>>"I went to the doctor yesterday for my colostomy bag problem and he..."
>>
>>"Back in WWII, I was head Beeper and saved the world with Morse code..."
>>
>>"HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI"
>>
>>
>>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>>
>Hey, look, guys! This stupid, redneck peckerwood motherfucker can
>apparently read a newspaper, and take some of the information he picks
>up there, and then actually form it into a thought resembling a crude
>attempt at humor, while managing to offend two groups of people at the
>same time, all the while heaping embarrassment upon himself in front
>of thousands! Nice work Drew! If I were you, I would just kill myself,
>as opposed to continue the embarrassment your poor family must suffer
>at your hands daily. Get yourself a gun, put the barrel in your mouth,
>and pull the trigger. No on will miss you, and if you do it out in
>that fucking swamp you call your yard, perhaps the local scavenging
>animals will eat your body, sparing the local authorities the task of
>cleaning up the mess that would probably just be shipped off to a soap
>factory somewhere anyway.
>Your friend,
>Habib

That's an excellent idean, Habib. But you have to be careful how you talk
to Spew. You give him ideas. Next thing you know he'll be posting messages
as:

[e-mail]

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:27 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: LAWSUITS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 00:43:40 -0500
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ) wrote:
>
> Still waiting for those inexpensive 940's.  Got almost 2 dozen buyers
> lined up

Your lack of maturity is breathtaking.  I will not be corresponding with
you, or responding to your posts, any further.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (WA8ULX)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: 31 Dec 1996 06:00:53 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a9t27$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

Drew you our such a Loser, personely Im getting tired of you Rambling
about nothing, why dont you go listen to your local AM Rock Station.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:29 1997
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From: Phil Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 22:03:40 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: lax-ca10-01.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Dec 30 11:58:53 PM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; U)

Understand the "lapse" delay.

I think part of the issue in this thread has to do with 1x2's and 2x1's
which are surrendered by someone getting a new vanity call (in some
cases, clubs have gotten 1x3's and surrendered 1x2's).

In these cases there is no renewal issue....but apparently the two year
holding period still applies.  That does seem a waste .. especially when
no one (except the FCC and they aren't telling) knows which calls are
available (e.g., the QRZ vanity availability list) and which one have
not done their two year stint.

Friend of mine missed out because the last unissued call in his list
will not be available until Aug 1997 (FCC did tell him that AFTER he
rolled the dice).

Phil


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Hams and Ebonics
Date: 31 Dec 1996 06:49:39 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>, Howard <[e-mail]> writes:

>Casey wrote:
>>
>> Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
>> goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
>> someone can come up with other examples.
>
>But they can also get up next morning and go to work in a professional
>setting and speak correctly.

Those who actually get up and go to work in the morning, at least.  Most
graduates of the "Beeperbonics" school have long since retired and spend
their days on 80m, complaining about their health ailments.

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 KF4DDM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:30 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Habib Delgado)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 06:57:00 GMT
Organization: Heart of the Sun
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5a9t27$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-206-170-2-167.sntc01.pacbell.net
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X-No-Archive: yes

On 31 Dec 1996 02:16:39 GMT, [e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Casey) wrote:
>>
>>Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
>>goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
>>someone can come up with other examples.
>
>
>"Back in the old days when we had to take our tests at an FCC office..."
>
>"I went to the doctor yesterday for my colostomy bag problem and he..."
>
>"Back in WWII, I was head Beeper and saved the world with Morse code..."
>
>"HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI"
>
>
>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>
Hey, look, guys! This stupid, redneck peckerwood motherfucker can
apparently read a newspaper, and take some of the information he picks
up there, and then actually form it into a thought resembling a crude
attempt at humor, while managing to offend two groups of people at the
same time, all the while heaping embarrassment upon himself in front
of thousands! Nice work Drew! If I were you, I would just kill myself,
as opposed to continue the embarrassment your poor family must suffer
at your hands daily. Get yourself a gun, put the barrel in your mouth,
and pull the trigger. No on will miss you, and if you do it out in
that fucking swamp you call your yard, perhaps the local scavenging
animals will eat your body, sparing the local authorities the task of
cleaning up the mess that would probably just be shipped off to a soap
factory somewhere anyway.
Your friend,
Habib


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:32 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: This is bullshit - WAS Re: BEEPERS
Date: 31 Dec 1996 07:03:45 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>, J&J Mac <[e-mail]> writes:

>Lighten up everyone! there's something for everyone in amateur radio. If
>you don't like a mode don't use it!
>if you like a mode use it! if you want more earn it. if you are happy
>with FM, stick with it. If you're happy with CW, stick with it! either
>way, a licensed user is a member of our family of radio operators and
>should be treated as such.
>
>

Agree with all of the above.  But why should CW be a REQUIRED testing
element when none of the other emissions are required?  We don't test for
proper digipeter operating procedures (though we probably should), so why
Morse?


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Hams and Ebonics
Date: 31 Dec 1996 07:03:47 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>, J&J Mac <[e-mail]> writes:

>When I can prove fluency in a second language, I get a 2% raise in
>salary!

I'll bet that "ghetto talk" (a/k/a "Ebonics") doesn't qualify.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: [e-mail] (Rich McAllister)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 30 Dec 1996 23:07:38 -0800
Organization: ARS K6RFM
Lines: 32
Sender: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]>
        <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
        <5a61gm$[e-mail]> <5a79g6$[e-mail]>
        <5a7moc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.240.169
In-reply-to: [e-mail]'s message of 30 Dec 1996 06:16:44 GMT
X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.1
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122365 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45024

[I think I have the attributions right, apologies if I screwed them up.]
In article <5a7moc$[e-mail]> [e-mail](Willi
am M. Pasternak) writes:

> >[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
> >>The League physically mailed the survey to a number of ARRL members
> >>and non-members alike. No information has been forthcoming as to
> >>the source of the data points that the League used in releasing the
> >>results.
>
> A proper sampeling group for any poll cntains a cross section of all
> members of society.  Even when it is a targeted specific poll.
>
> In this case, the general non-ham public must be included because the
> radio spectrum is a public resource.

No, remember the people taking the poll were not trying to discover
what the general public thought in order to support the "best policy".
The ARRL, since its mission includes representation of amateur
interests, was trying to figure out what *amateurs* wanted.  Polling
both member and non-member amateurs is of interest, since it might
reveal that current members have different opinions than non-members,
and perhaps by adjusting its positions the ARRL could convince
current non-members that the League does represent them as well.

I'd love to see a well constructed and executed opinion poll of
the general public on this issue, but such a thing would be
terribly expensive.  I'm sure not going to pay for it, and I can't
see asking the ARRL to spend membership money to do it either.

Rich, K6RFM
--
Rich McAllister, KO6CL, [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:34 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!news
From: [e-mail] (Terry Van Sickle, Jr.)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.shortwave,rec.radio.scanner,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Icom 706 information requested
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 07:09:01 GMT
Organization: Sprynet News Service
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dd27-139.compuserve.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.shortwave:91588 rec.radio.scanner:74616 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122351 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45540

        I just bought an Icom 706. I have seen the "yellow-wire" mod,
and I have also seen the removal of capacitors in the VHF high-band
filter to improve the receiver sensitivity in the VHF high-band,
outside of the 2 meter filter. Which mod works better to improve the
coverage between 148 and 170 mHz? I am not interested in transmit
capability in this range, but I would like to use the 706's
capabilities to receive some of the local government in my area.
        Any information and experiences regarding modifications to the
706 that you can share will be greatly appreciated.

Please respond via e-mail ([e-mail]), due to an increasing
load on the news server on my ISP.

Thanks in advance!!
Terry Van Sickle, Jr. (N5RSE)


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-13.sprintlink.net!cyclops.dsphere.net!mfs-annex1-p1.dsphere.net!morris
From: [e-mail] (Mike Morris)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Looking for N6NKO, WA6LLM and KZ6S
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 00:19:39 pdt
Organization: Organization? Not much around here...
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mfs-annex1-p1.dsphere.net
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.digital.misc:20996 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122379

Well, a few of my my christmas cards have been returned by the post
office, a few people have moved, and I'd like to ask if anybody knows
where I can find these fine folk.  I've checked the various on-line callbooks
and they all have the old addresses.

Richard N6NKO
Larry ex-WA6LLM - last I knew he was working for an oil company
in Saudi Arabia,
Greg, KZ6S.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: [e-mail] (Rich McAllister)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Amateur's Code - a refresher
Followup-To: rec.radio.amateur.policy
Date: 30 Dec 1996 23:20:22 -0800
Organization: ARS K6RFM
Lines: 25
Sender: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a5uhs$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
        <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.147.240.169
In-reply-to: [e-mail]'s message of Thu, 26 Dec 1996 22:15:44 GMT
X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.1
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45058 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122486

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:

> Righto! we need an ala carte testing program.  If you don't think a
> topic is important then waive that test section off!  I happen to
> think AC electrical theory is not important -- so I needn't take that
> element! same for Smith charts!  Hey, the Oakland school
> board had this figured out! they decided English was really
> [not] as important as previously thought!

Look, I know it seems easier to win arguments when you make up both
sides, but it really isn't helpful.  The argument generally isn't that
"if I don't think a section is important leave it off my test," it's
that "if the section is no longer important replace it -- for everyone
-- with something that is".  And the Oakland school board didn't
decide that standard English wasn't important, they decided that
recognizing "Ebonics" would make it easier for certain kids to learn
standard English.  (I don't happen to agree with the Oakland school
board, but at least I bothered to find out what it was they said.)

(Followups directed to rec.radio.amateur.policy)

Rich, K6RFM

--
Rich McAllister, KO6CL, [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.tamu.edu!furuta
From: [e-mail] (Richard Furuta)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: 31 Dec 1996 07:50:21 GMT
Organization: Center for the Study of Digital Libraries
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <5aagjt$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hrl8.cs.tamu.edu

So now I'm curious.... Why are folks abandoning 2x1 callsigns in favor of
1x2's?  I've noticed a number of individuals doing this.  I noticed one change
a while back where some guy was vacating what looked like an older vanity 1x2
callsign (with his initials) for a newer 1x2 with some unrecognizable
connection.  What's the "desirability hierarchy" of these shorter calls?

                                        --Rick
                                          K3IV
                                          [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:39 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: ORIGIN OF 73 ??
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 08:17:29 GMT
Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
Lines: 7
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pool044.max2.canoga-park.ca.us.dynip.earthlink.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230


 O.K. anyone think they have the origin of the 73 in ham radio?  Have
heard several explanations, including an early sending of the 'lucky'
digit 7 .. and then later, the 7 and the seven backwards (3) at the
end of transmission.....Rick  AC6QQ
[e-mail]



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Hams and Ebonics
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 00:23:07 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mercury13.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> In article <[e-mail]>, J&J Mac <[e-mail]> writes:
>
> >When I can prove fluency in a second language, I get a 2% raise in
> >salary!
>
> I'll bet that "ghetto talk" (a/k/a "Ebonics") doesn't qualify.

If it's actually considered a valid second language by the government it
does qualify according to my unions by-laws.

Jim..


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wco.com!news
From: J&J Mac <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: This is bullshit - WAS Re: BEEPERS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 00:30:37 -0800
Organization: West Coast Online's News Server - Not responsible for content
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mercury13.wco.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I)
To: [e-mail]

[e-mail] wrote:

> Agree with all of the above.  But why should CW be a REQUIRED testing
> element when none of the other emissions are required?  We don't test for
> proper digipeter operating procedures (though we probably should), so why
> Morse?

Good question. I'd venture to assume that there are people who feel
Morse should be a requirement
to access certain portions of HF to comply with the international
treaty. Or perhaps to carry on a quasi salute to those radio pioneers
who helped conveive Amateur Radio.

Personally? I like CW, havn't used it since May 3, 1990, but I like it
and I learned it.

Jim..
KB6ZOP


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](William M. Pasternak)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 31 Dec 1996 09:13:06 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 71
Message-ID: <5aalf2$[e-mail]>
References: <5a7moc$[e-mail]> <5a8f6a$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: scr-ca1-08.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 31  3:13:06 AM CST 1996
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122369 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45026

In <5a8f6a$[e-mail]> [e-mail]
(Michael P. Deignan) writes:
>
>In article <5a7moc$[e-mail]>,
>       William M. Pasternak <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>>A proper sampeling group for any poll cntains a cross section of all
>>members of society.  Even when it is a targeted specific poll.
>
>yeah, that makes sense. Ask non-smokers if they prefer Marlboro
>or Camel. I'm sure you'll get an accurate picture then.
>
>
>>In this case, the general non-ham public must be included because the
>>radio spectrum is a public resource.
>
>The average citizen thinks amateur radio is "CB". Every non radio
>literate person who has ever gotten into my truck asks "is that
>a CB radio?" I simply answer "yes" because they are normally pointing
>to the 2 meter radio.
>
>
>>As such the public must be
>>included so as to know what percentage of the public might be
>>interested in becomming radio amateurs if the code reqirement is
>>deleted for access to HF.
>
>Question: "Would you be interested in becoming an amateur radio
>operator if the requirement for a morse code test were eliminated."
>
>Yeah, I'm sure asking people with a General-class ticket or above
>wouldn't skew the results.
>
>What's the point of asking someone if they would become an
>amateur if they already are?
>
>If you want to find out who would become an amateur if the code
>requirement were dropped, wouldn't you ask >that< segment of the
>population, not amateurs?
>
>Your logic makes no sense.
>
>
>MD
>--
>--
>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>--
>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


Are smokers polled on non-smoking matters.  They sure are.  20-20 even
did an in-depth report on polling about three -- maybe four years ago.
The reason:  the polling service noted that smokers and non smokers
both share the same air and the same constitutional guarantees.  Both
had the right to voice an opinion and each would be a valid point of
view.

In ham radio issues, I again point out that the electromanetic spectrum
does NOT belong to us hams.  We only are given access to a limited
amount of it by the good graces of the FCC and US government.

Rather, the electromagnetic spectrum exists under PICON -- the public
interest, convienience and necessity.  In other words, we are there
because the public lets us be there.

It matters not how they view us; as CBers or even as cell-fone owners.
It matters only that under PICON that the public be given its voice on
any and all matters regarding the electromagnetic spectrum.

de Bill P. / WA6ITF


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.248.93.100!news.accessus.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Dale Wentz)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: 31 Dec 1996 09:39:41 GMT
Organization: me myself and I
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5aan0t$[e-mail]>
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I have been useing this stuff for years. In fact I had the same problem with i
t
running down the coax, and soaking the ground.

It did kill all the grass, my xyl was not happy about that. The good news is
that after a bad storm this summer that broke the feedline on my antenna, I
found out that just haveing the coax lying on the ground, worked better than
haveing it conected to the antenna. A 1:1 SWR and gain you could not beleive.
I
think this was due to all this stuff that soaked into the ground.





73's and would like to hear from anyone else that has worked with underground
antennas. We almost have ours compleated!





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!204.248.93.100!news.accessus.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Dale Wentz)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 31 Dec 1996 09:56:20 GMT
Organization: me myself and I
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <5aao04$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.206.131.103
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122505 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45065

If as much effort was put into helping new hams, and learning code, as this
message thread, we would have a lot more younger hams.

This is silly The code has been there for ever, and everyone knew that when
they got into this. No one is required to upgrade any more. I guess the next
thinkg they will want to do is do away with a drivers licence test to drive a
car or a school bus.

Grow up a little here people!
KB9JJA/Dale (Yes still no 13 wpm but trying and not bitching)
73's



In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
>: And my point is, that is the classic definition of a self-selected
>: poll.  Who the hell has the time to read and respond to this kind of
>: poll?  I'm an ARRL member, and I don't even remember receiving it.  The
>: point is that the 6% who DID respond cannot be assumed as representing a
>: random slice of the League's membership, let alone all hams, or all
>: Americans.
>
>I don't disagree that it was a self-selected poll.  It would have been more
>fair (not to mention more interesting to see the result) if ARRL had sent
>one to each licensed amateur; although that would have more than quadrupled
>the cost.  Of course, then the League would have been criticized for sending
>it to all the SKs that are still in the FCC database.
>
>I suppose even a random sample of the public would have been appropriate
>also, but you'd have to find enough people who had some idea of what ham
>radio is about, to get an intelligent opinion from the public.
>
>It would be quite interesting to see how that sampling technique altered the
>result.
>
>73 de Jim - KF6CR



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!199.94.215.18!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!gatech!news.jax.bellsouth.net!news.rdu.bellsouth.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] ([e-mail])
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Experiences with 'CODE QUICK'??
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 10:16:21 GMT
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf54a$b83533a0$429ed4cd@r-massey> <5a6nc4$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: d00960.rdu.bellsouth.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.227

        I too HIGHLY reccoment Code Quick.  I got my extra after
giving up on the code.  What I mean is...I had tried all the code
tapes available and none of them seemed appealing to me.
        I finally said to myself, "If this is what it takes to learn
the code....screw it."
        Then a friend told me about Code Quick.  He kind of
demonstrated it to me.  I saw some hope and got it.
        WOW !!!  Boy was I surprised.  I had no problem learning the
code...furthermore....getting the 20 wpm !!
        I challenge anyone to get code quick and try NOT TO LEARN the
code after listening to it.  Code is taught in such a way that one can
not forget it.  Comes second nature.
        Well anyway...enough of the testimony.  I hope that someone
reads this and gets code quick....and passes the code.  Unfortunately
code is still a requirement so "you gotta learn it " if you want to
experience more frequency coverage.
        -later


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!news.idt.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-16.sprintlink.net!mayumi.iphil.net!usenet
From: ramon purugganan <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.swap,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.equipment
Subject: Re: WTB:ALPHA HF AMPLIFIER
Date: 31 Dec 1996 10:49:56 GMT
Organization: internet philippines
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5aar4k$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip76.pworld.net.ph
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.swap:102144 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122496 rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45616

FAISAL,9K2CA <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
> I am looking for 76,77 Alpha hf amplifier in excellent condition.
>
>
> Thanks
>
> FAISAL,9K2CA
>
> E-MAIL:[e-mail]
> -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>       http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!usc!ccnet.com!cathryn
From: [e-mail] (cathryn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: Re: Kenwood TM-401B below 440 MHz?
Date: 31 Dec 1996 11:13:41 GMT
Organization: CCnet Communications (510-988-7140 guest)
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf548$3ad971c0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.21.11.2
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45549 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122368 rec.radio.amateur.space:9275

In article <01bbf548$3ad971c0$[e-mail]>, "Earl Needham" w
rote:
>
>       Having recently discovered FM activity through sattelites, I'd like to try
>my hand at getting through the FM repeater on the Mir space station.
>Unfortunately, my UHF rig (a Kenwood TM-401B) only covers 440-450 MHz.  Is
>there a mod available to allow this rig to operate below 440 MHz?

Yeah, I have the same problem with my IC-T7a.  I can receive below 440, but
there's no way to transmit below 440Mhz.  Arrgh.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:50 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 10:16:59 -0500
Lines: 55
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aao04$[e-mail]> <5abcqh$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122395 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45035

Ed Hare wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (Dale Wentz) wrote:
>
> > This is silly The code has been there for ever, and everyone knew that
> > when they got into this.

This is true.  In fact, when I received my general in (I think it was)
early 1967, general class hams had full privileges.  Incentive licensing
rolled in, and we generals lost almost half of our HF privileges.
Personally, I reacted by upgrading to Extra.  No skin off my butt.

However, this is my lifelong hobby, and I want it to be here for those
who come after.  It frightens me to see our lack of numbers, and the
greying of our ranks.  I'm 42 myself, no spring chicken.  And yet,
almost everyone I QSO with on HF is ten or more years older than me.
This is in sharp contrast to VHF, where the median age seems to be much
closer to that of the general public, with a respectable sprinkling of
teens and young adults.  Based on this observation, and from speaking
with these folks, I have concluded that the CW requirement is what is
keeping most of them from upgrading.  The Morse requirement seems to be
viewed as a make-work, pointless requirement that just isn't
worthwhile.  Many of these folks, never having experienced HF, don't
realize that from a pragmatic standpoint the requirement is a minor
inconvenience in return for what you get.  This is not good for our
hobby, that these folks bypass HF.  HF is still the best part of ham
radio to many of us, because of its greater potential for communication
in real-time.

Accordingly, I strongly believe that the CW requirement must go.  It has
been abandoned pretty much by every service but ours.  We hams use it
only recreationally; it is not used in MARS or in normal ham disaster
communications.  Let's keep it as part of the hobby, but not as a
required part.

Lack of numbers in a democracy inevitably leads to a lessening of
political clout, with all that implies in terms of frequency allocation
retention, RFI regulation, etc.  Additionally, the hobby is a lot less
fun when there aren't as many chaps to QSO with up on HF.  Let's open it
up!  Keep a good filter in the form of good meaningful reg and theory
exams.  Keep incentive licensing if we must.  These should be adequate
to filter the wannabe CBers out of our hobby.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:51 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 15:24:00 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <5acfha$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8b4p$[e-mail]> <5a8m1t$qhe$[e-mail]> <5a8uph$[e-mail]> <5a974v$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-136.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>[e-mail] wrote:

>>>  Here's a thought, if a fraction of the time wasted on internet traffic re
ading
>>> and commenting was used on CW self education (get on the air), the issue
>>> would be dead.
>>>                                                                  Jim W9LZ

>>We have said that a thousand times, Jim.  It just doesn't sink in.  Why work

>>when you can wait ? Hope keeps some people alive.

>At the risk of having another response from Jim, the above
>fails to note that many of us have "been there, done that."
>All those that advocate the end of code testing are not
>codeless individuals.

>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ

I thought we were discussing 'been there done that' in another thread, Bill.
I'll have to go check you latest response to that thread.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:52 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 15:35:29 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <5acg6q$[e-mail]>
References: <5abbbb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-136.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>>Nope, it's not the same thing. Squiggy is one person.  'Beepers' are
>anyone who uses CW, right ?<<

>Wrong.  'Beepers' are those who refuse to accept and embrace modern
>technology, attempting to keep ham radio from advancing accordingly.
>'Beepers' cling to the old ways, insisting that the Morse hazing ritual
>remain part of ham radio, regardless of the fact that there is no longer
>any justification for requiring knowledge of such outdated
>technology...thereby scaring away many would-be hams in the process and
>insuring the ultimate death of ham radio due to 'lack of interest.'


>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
> WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
> 'All 70s All Day"
> KF4DDM On the Ham Bands

Said the modern CB technologist as he rode around the block in his 1977 Buick
listening to 70's music.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 15:36:45 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5acg96$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8oe2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5ac8tu$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-136.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45061 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122489

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Actually you were not stating fact. i do not have to see the actual
>text of the item involved to desire to be a signator. The general idea
>behind the article is what I am interested in and therefore desire to
>be a signator.

Translation: Get me on HF without a CW test, and I could care less about the
details.

73, Jim KH2D







From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:54 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 15:38:00 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <5acgbg$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8kks$[e-mail]> <5a8ogo$[e-mail]> <5abbee$[e-mail]> <5ac8pf$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45062 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122490

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Well it was buy 1 get 1 free day and we know how frugal some beepers
>can be.....

That makes me feel better. Now I know they have at least 2 hookers in
Mississippi.  That should cut the lines in half.

73, Jim KH2D







From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!southwind.net!symbios.com!csn!nntp-xfer-2.csn.net!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: Phil Wheeler <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 07:46:50 -0800
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 31  7:42:03 AM PST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; U)

There was an interesting article on calls, their histor and "hierachy"
in a 1994 QST.

This is VERY subjective, but:

        o 1x2 preferred to 2x1
        o W prefix preferred to K
        o K prefix preferred to N
        o 1x3 preferred to 2x2

All this relates to when that type of call was first issued, I suspect.
W calls were first, then K then N.  1x2's came before 2x1's.  1x3's came
before 2x2's, etc.

Let me say that this was the gist of the article in a 1994 QST.

Phil


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!tezcat!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!news
From: Tom Hogerty <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 07:50:58 -0800
Organization: ARRL
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I)

Richard Furuta wrote:
>
> So now I'm curious.... Why are folks abandoning 2x1 callsigns in favor of
> 1x2's?  I've noticed a number of individuals doing this.  I noticed one chan
ge
> a while back where some guy was vacating what looked like an older vanity 1x
2
> callsign (with his initials) for a newer 1x2 with some unrecognizable
> connection.  What's the "desirability hierarchy" of these shorter calls?
>
>                                         --Rick
>                                           K3IV
>                                           [e-mail]



Rick:
The answer to your question is simple. It's called "Vanity" :-)

73,
Tom Hogerty, KC1J
ARRL Regulatory Information


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:57 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: SPEW IS A MANIAC !!!!---Jimmy makes an AMAZING discovery!!
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 15:58:18 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <5achhj$[e-mail]>
References: <5a85gt$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-153.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>Public information, Jimmy.  I put it there, just for you to find...I just
>didn't think it would take you this long.  I began using my AOL account as
>my primary provider on 12/1/96 when they went to unlimited useage @
>$19.95/month.  Just for kicks, I figured I'd leave my signature off of my
>posts and see how long it took you beepers to get up the initiative to
>actually look at my member profile.  By my calculations, it took you 29
>days to do so and find out this TOP-SECRET information...or, "in cognito"
>as you so astutely put it.  Congratulations, Jimmy...you get an 'A' for
>the day!

>Are all the Beepers as bright and as eager as you?

>-Spew in Sunny Central Florida-

O. IC. Said the blind man. And then he took out his hammer and saw.
And after you get hammered, you come around with this as an excuse.

You have been posting all your one line hatefull bullshit in the ham newsgroup
s
with a different account and without signing your name to it just to see how
long it would take ME to figure out it was you. OH. OK. Sure. IC. It was just
a
test. OK. Sure.  I got it now.

You win. Now jump in your 1977 Buick and cruzzzz back over to the CB newsgroup
.
Maybe stop by the scanner group and get some gas on your way.  Just keep the
animal comments to yourself, and you won't get in trouble.

73'sssssssssssssssss Good Buddy,
Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:58 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!newsfeeds.ans.net!lehi.kuentos.guam.net!news
From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Hams and Ebonics
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:00:12 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5achl4$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: tataga-153.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] wrote:

>Those who actually get up and go to work in the morning, at least.  Most
>graduates of the "Beeperbonics" school have long since retired and spend
>their days on 80m, complaining about their health ailments.

>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
> KF4DDM

Beats cleaning restrooms at the local AM station, I'm sure.

73'sssssssssssssssssssss Good Buddy,
Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 20:59:59 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: This is bullshit - WAS Re: BEEPERS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:05:04 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <5achu9$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] wrote:


>Agree with all of the above.  But why should CW be a REQUIRED testing
>element when none of the other emissions are required?  We don't test for
>proper digipeter operating procedures (though we probably should), so why
>Morse?

Why ? Because it keeps stupidredneckpeckewoods like you on 11 meters.
Ask our friend Habib. He'll explain it to you.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:00 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:10:12 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5aci7r$[e-mail]>
References: <59419d$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59hrqu$[e-mail]> <59joc6$[e-mail]> <59ki6u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122458 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45045

Pablo Garcia <[e-mail]> wrote:

>idiotas

Is that like an idiot with hot sauce ?





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:00 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:17:21 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <5acilb$[e-mail]>
References: <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster> <5a42mg$[e-mail]> <5a7a6a$[e-mail]> <5a8ktp$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (T.L.Bryant) wrote:

>How are they policed now? Who polices the bottom 25 khz. of the 75, 40, 20, a
nd
>15 meter bands to make sure there are only extra class licensees operating
>there?

I doubt indorsements will work for two reasons. One, the FCC isn't interested
in
keeping track of who has what, and two, there is no one to police them.  They
would basically amount to an honor system.  A CW indorsement isn't very
constructive anyway, as it doesn't allow people to get on the CW bands and
practice operating, which is the best way to increase code proficientcy.  A
better idea, I think, would be a no code HF license that allows operation in
certain band segments as the current licenses do.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:01 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Larry AD3Y)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Pro CW? PHONE in and say why!
Date: 31 Dec 1996 16:23:15 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Lines: 22
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5abelj$[e-mail]>
References: <5aa0f4$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: wargrave.motown.lmco.com



[e-mail] (Bill Sohl) said:

<snip>

>How would that be accomplished?
>During any VE session, if a test taker completed the CW test with a
>passing score of 70%, they would be granted an CSCE and then take the
>theory test as before.  However, if they failed the CW test, they
>would be permitted to merge the CW test results from that days test
>with their theory results also taken on that day only.  If they still
>failed to pass the theory test using a merged score, no CSCE would be
>issued for either part of the testing.

<snip>


That is not a bad idea.


Larry - AD3Y - [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:03 1997
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From: Mike Watson <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 10:32:17 -0600
Organization: WB0IKT
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <5a0ep9$[e-mail]>
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Jim Kehler wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>
> >Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
>
> Not correct. Mabye 60% of people with ham LICENSES don't use CW, but
> 100% of HAMS use CW.
>
> >majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
> >datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
> >keep it held back.
>
> Nope. That's wrong too.
>
> >Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
> >us?
>
> I am having a hard time understanding the question, Eric. Could you try and
> rephrase that so it makes more sense ?
>
> 73, Jim KH2D

I've been a Ham for almost 25 years---haven't used CW in this decade and
never got faster than 15-16 WPM.  BUT, I support the code requirement
for one reason.  We value what we have to work to get.  One reason that
the CB bands are chaoic was that the license was given away.  Ham
licenses have to be earned.  Most people won't trash something they had
to work to get.

--
=====================================================================
Mike Watson, WB0IKT
Raymore, Missouri, USA
http://www.sky.net/~crucis

 "Meetings are like fungi---there are more growing in dark, damp
  corners."
=====================================================================


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:04 1997
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From: AC6V <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequencies
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 08:49:30 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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To: Av8ter93 <[e-mail]>

Av8ter93 wrote:
>
> I found a couple of sites with VHF and UHF frequencies, I enjoy monitoring
> military. Can anyone please help with some current sites. Or do I go to
> FCC on  the webcrawler? Lost!
> So any URL with frequency postings are helpful
> Thanks for your help, new in the amateur sport,
> Regards!

Hi Av8ter -- there are links to several frequency listings on the DX
Reference page below.

Good Hunting
Rod in San Diego
--
AC6V DX Reference Page: http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
E-Mail: [e-mail]

Hark!  For I Have Hurled My Words To The Far Reaches Of The Earth!
What King Of  Old Could Do Thus?? -- AC6V


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:05 1997
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From: AC6V <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ATV Thread
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 08:51:38 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 31 10:50:11 AM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)
To: Mlynko <[e-mail]>

Mlynko wrote:
>
> This is some thread grease.  I'm not much
> of an ATVer, but am interested in learning
> more about it.
>
> I do have a homebrew ATV system that
> I picked up at a hamfest a few years
> ago and would like to regenerate my
> interest in it.
>
> Walt

Hi Walt -- try the "Operating Modes" section of the DX Reference Page
below. Has some ATV Links.

Happy Holidays
Rod In San Diego
--
AC6V DX Reference Page: http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
E-Mail: [e-mail]

Hark!  For I Have Hurled My Words To The Far Reaches Of The Earth!
What King Of  Old Could Do Thus?? -- AC6V


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:06 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: I *LOVE* killfiles
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:54:54 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <5ackrm$[e-mail]>
References: <5ad48l$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-145.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Brian Kantor) wrote:

>Looking for articles to kill...
>/kh2d@kuentos/h:j
>94407   Junked
>94412   Junked
>94413   Junked
>94414   Junked
>94416   Junked
>94417   Junked
>94421   Junked
>94427   Junked
>94450   Junked
>94451   Junked
>94454   Junked
>94469   Junked
>94470   Junked
>94471   Junked
>94472   Junked
>94473   Junked
>94477   Junked
>94478   Junked
>94479   Junked

Now we know we can talk about Brian cuz he's not listening........





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:07 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:54:58 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <5ackrq$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5abrrd$[e-mail]> <5ac9ko$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Oh great I get to answer the beeper in my midst using my account :)

>Some learn code faster than others and some learn theory faster than
>others.

OK, I'll buy that.

>Code was easy for you compared to theory. theory is easy for
>me compared to code.

OK. I'll buy that.   I made the effort to learn theory (the hard part for me).
But you don't want to make the effort to learn code (the hard part for you).

So I guess what you are saying is that I should have gotten Bill to write a
letter to the ITU and ask them to ban theory testing instead of making the
effort to learn it so I could pass the test ?

Makes sense to me. Beep Beep.

73, Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:08 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:55:00 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <5ackrs$[e-mail]>
References: <5abcle$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: hangon-145.kuentos.guam.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (MN Maniac) wrote:

>>>That's an excellent idean, Habib. But you have to be careful how you
>talk
>to Spew. You give him ideas. Next thing you know he'll be posting messages
>as:

>[e-mail]

>I hate to disappoint you, but AOL limits you to 10 characters for the
>screenname.

>Of course, that leaves the possibility for you to sign up as
>[e-mail] wide open!
>

>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
> WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
> 'All 70s All Day"
> KF4DDM On the Ham Bands

Thanks, Spew, but we don't need AOL and PUBERTY here. We have real ISP's.
By the way, what does AOL stand for anyway ?  Maybe in your case, Another Onli
ne
Looser ? Beep Beep.

73'sssssssssssssss Good Buddy,
Jim KH2D




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:08 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:58:28 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <5acl2c$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5a9t27$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5abcle$[e-mail]> <5acaem$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Hey Jim, isn't PECKERWOOD a bit redundant?

I don't know. Peckerwood is a term from your neck of the woods, not mine.  Spe
w
is a bit redundant, so maybe it fits......

73, Jim KH2D





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:09 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 12:03:12 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa5o6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv5.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <5aa5o6$[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
says...
> "Mitch, W4OA" <[e-mail]> wrote:
> >the two year period was recommended to the fcc by n4rx, who saw
> >a potential problem with 'trafficing' in callsigns... the fcc
> >agreed with n4rx, and put the 2 year rule in when the final
> >regs on vanity callsigns were issued...
>
> >mitch, w4oa
>
> Not only that but can you imagine the confusion at the Incoming QSL
> Bureaus?  They would have to start checking the QSO date to figure out
> who to send the cards to!
>
>
>
>
> - 73 de Tom, K4NR
>
>

Also remember, that some buro's, like the W2, require a separate envelope
credit account for each callsign.  In some cases, an operator could have
2 or more active incoming buro callsigns, each requiring some a
subscription.


For more information check the following

http://www.njdxz.org



--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member
NJDXA


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:11 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jim Kehler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: FYI: MFJ-989 antenna tuner comments review
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 17:17:41 GMT
Organization: Kuentos Communications Inc.
Lines: 53
Message-ID: <5acm6e$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
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X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Subject: MFJ-989 antenna tuner comments review
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 10:10:49 +0200
From: Morel Grunberg <[e-mail]>

Hello,

One week ago I posted a request asking for opinions on MFJ-989
antenna tuner. Until now I received 116 answers as follows:

*  92 of the answers were totally unfavorable
*  11 of the answers were quite neutral
*  9 answers compared the MFJ-989 with other similar tuners ,
   8 of them clearly preffering the others brands.
*  4 answers were positive with no specific reasons.

The most frequent reasons for lack of satisfaction were:

*  roller inductor quality ( 49 reporting melted elements )
*  roller inductors turning mechanism failures ( 18 reports )
*  roller inductor tuning bad feeling ( 15 reports )
*  poor roller turns counter ( 21 reports )
*  poor cabinet mechanics, assembly, finish and paint
   ( 21 reports )
*  lack of enough coax positions on antenna switch
   ( 12 reports )
*  bad performance on certain types of antennas ( whips, long
   wires and zeppelins ) - 19 reports ; in 12 cases the tuner was
   set-up on fire.
*  poor operation manual ( 9 reports )
*  poor design ( small cabinet size affecting the inductor Q ) -
   3 reports
*  poor performance on 160m short antennas ( !! ) - 4 reports

The most frequent reported reasons for buying the MFJ-989
were:

*  low price ( 7 reports )
*  high number of features vs. low price( 7 reports )
*  relatively small size ( 5 reports )
*  built-in dummy load ( 4 reports )

The other reports reffered to: Vectronics 1500, Nye Viking,
Ameritron 1500, Heathkit SA-2500, B&W, J.W.Millen and
Nevada. The most favorable opinions were on NYE-Viking
( 10 reports ).

I would like to thank to all who find time to answer .

Happy New Year,

Morel, 4X1AD




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:12 1997
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From: Zack Lau <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 12:19:03 -0500
Organization: American Radio Relay League
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; I)
To: Richard Furuta <[e-mail]>

Richard Furuta K3IV wrote:
>
> So now I'm curious.... Why are folks abandoning 2x1 callsigns in favor of
> 1x2's?  I've noticed a number of individuals doing this.  I noticed one chan
ge
> a while back where some guy was vacating what looked like an older vanity 1x
2
> callsign (with his initials) for a newer 1x2 with some unrecognizable
> connection.  What's the "desirability hierarchy" of these shorter calls?

Some letters are difficult to figure out, particularly over a
band limited channel like HF SSB (typically 300 to 2.4 kHz).
I often have trouble telling the difference between and "S"
and an "F," unless phonetics are used.  With CW, some letters
are troublesome--lots of people would confuse the "H" in my old
call with S and 5.

This is particularly a problem if you like to work QRP or low
power.  I find it a fun challenge to work other QRP stations.

The G-QRP club offers an award for working 10 DXCC countries
2-way QRP--I've toyed with the idea of trying to work DXCC 2-way...
but I only have a couple dozen so far... maybe with the new call...

http://www.kanga.demon.co.uk/gqrp.htm

Zack W1VT  (ex KH6CP/1) [e-mail]


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:13 1997
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From: [e-mail] (JDuffy)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Requirements to be employed at Radio Shack
Date: 31 Dec 1996 17:47:09 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

.....and still breathing and willing to work for next to nothing.

_____________________________________________________________________
"If the government bans individual possession of guns and only the government
owns guns, are we still a free people?"

"It's the Second Amendment Stupid!"

J. D. Beischel - Life Member - NRA
Amateur Radio WB8NUT & Member of the ARRL
_____________________________________________________________________


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:14 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 31 Dec 1996 12:49:17 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <5abjmt$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]< <5a7c2b$[e-mail]< <5a8pbd$[e-mail]< <5abb26$[e-mail]<
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <5abb26$[e-mail]<,
        Jim Kehler <[e-mail]< wrote:

<[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
<
<<Well last year I made a fine contact with a lady in Australia on 11m.
<<All I used was a dipole and about 10watts SSB. Truly the bottom of the
<<sunspot cycle. Explain that to me. Explain to me why a friend of mine
<<who is beeping away in the next room made contact and QSL'd the same
<<lady two months later with the same radio and same antenna same power
<<at a different QTH
<
<What would you like to me explain ? Radio propagation, why lady's in Australi
a
<are on 11 meters, or why your radio works the same when somebody elses pushes
<the PTT switch ?

I'd be more interested in finding out why he was using an non-type
accepted transmitter on 11m.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:15 1997
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 12:15:43 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 22
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Siegfried Rambaum wrote:
>
> > > I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
> > > timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
> > > and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
> > > pruning!
> > >
> > > Has anybody heard of this stuff?
> >
> > Oh yeah....I've been using it for years. As a matter of fact, there is
> > great controversy about it among the contesting an DXing community
> > because its use amounts to cheating.
> >
> > I don't think they should take it off the market, however, because it's
> > also good on a cracker.
>
> "Good on crackers"?? You mean, peanut butter works miracles on HF, too? So
> far I heard of it only being used on SHF antennas and satellite dishes.

I don't use peanut butter because it attracts squirrels. Otherwise, it
does work, but don't use the chunky variety. And I highly recommend Jif
if you are going to go this route.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:16 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 20 mtr nets
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 18:16:40 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <5abp0d$[e-mail]>
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Is there to many 20 meter nets or not enough?

KC5WCO
Justin



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:17 1997
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From: [e-mail](michael silva)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ORIGIN OF 73 ??
Date: 31 Dec 1996 18:20:16 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <5ablh0$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
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X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 31 12:20:16 PM CST 1996

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>
>
> O.K. anyone think they have the origin of the 73 in ham radio?  Have
>heard several explanations, including an early sending of the 'lucky'
>digit 7 .. and then later, the 7 and the seven backwards (3) at the
>end of transmission.....Rick  AC6QQ

The way I heard it the landline telegraphers used standard two-digit
codes to condense common words and phrases, and 73 was the code for the
"sincerely yours" or "regards" placed just before the sender's name on
a message.

73,
Mike, KK6GM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:18 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Dick Flanagan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 10:24:37 -0800
Organization: Libelle Productions, Inc., Minden, Nevada USA
Lines: 17
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In article <[e-mail]>, Tom Hogerty <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Richard Furuta wrote:
>>
>> I noticed one change
>> a while back where some guy was vacating what looked like an older vanity 1
x2
>> callsign (with his initials) for a newer 1x2 with some unrecognizable
>> connection.  What's the "desirability hierarchy" of these shorter calls?
>>
>The answer to your question is simple. It's called "Vanity" :-)

It could also be "CW ease and intelligibility."  For example, I can easily
see someone with a callsign like  N 5 S H  wanting to get something a
little less problematic if they did a lot of CW operating.
--
Dick Flanagan W6OLD CFII Minden, Nevada
Visit http://wadg.greatbasin.net/siera/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:19 1997
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From: Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ko4qc spreading good cheer on rec.radio.cb
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 11:30:24 -0700
Organization: Computer Horizons Corp. Consultant
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a213r$[e-mail]> <59pkcc$[e-mail]> <1996122423230 <[e-mail]> <5a7r3i$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Stan Aughenbaugh wrote:
>
> Bill Nelson wrote:
> >
> > Clint Bradford ([e-mail]) wrote:
> >
> > : >>Look autism up in a medical dictionary. You will find it is a
> > : >>preoccupation with fantasy as a mechanism to escape reality.
> >
> > : Please do not insult victims/families affected by autism by making it
> > : appear as if it is a affliction of choice, Bill, in any argument here.
> >
> > : I don't think that's what you meant....
> >
> > I was not insulting the victims of autism. It is NOT a choice a person
> > makes, and can be very crippling.  I was just providing a very simple
> > description of what it is - to a person who misused the term.
> >
> > My apologies if it appeared that I felt there was any choice. I should
> > have made my statement more clearly.
> >
> > Bill Nelson   ([e-mail])
> Well, I meant to imply what I have seen on the TV news (not a reliable
> source, I admit) but I was under the impression that autism is a type of
> learning disability where in some of the symptoms are :
> seeing letters reversed, or writing them that way, have some areas
> completely 'blocked' out while in othere areas there may appear to be no
> disability and/or even a superiority, similar to 'idiots savant'
> guess I gotta go back and re-read what I thought I read.. Oh well, been
> wrong before.
> 73,
> Stan KF0NC
> "90% of all statistics are made up"
> <beep>

Actually Clint, I did look it up. went to www.autism-society.org and
found the following. And frankly, it looks a lot more like the way I
used it than any 'preoccupation with fantasy...'
here it is:

What is Autism? Autism is a developmental disability that typically
appears during the first three years of life. The
result of a neurological disorder that affects functioning of the brain,
autism and its associated behaviors occur in
approximately 15 of every 10,000 individuals.

Autism is four times more prevalent in boys than girls and knows no
racial, ethnic or social boundaries. Family income,
lifestyle and educational levels do not affect the chance of autism's
occurrence.

Autism interferes with the normal development of the brain in the areas
of reasoning, social interaction and communication
skills. Children and adults with autism typically have deficiencies in
verbal and non-verbal communication, social interactions
and leisure or play activities. The disorder makes it hard for them to
communicate with others and relate to the outside
world. They may exhibit repeated body movements (hand flapping,
rocking), unusual responses to people or attachments to
objects and resist any changes in routines. In some cases, aggressive
and/or self-injurious behavior may be present.
---end of quote---
So I guess I really did use it as intended huh? eg when I used autistic
in regard to KC5WCP and some others attitude/abilities with Morse Code.
Beepers beep, whiners whine (but they can't beep).

73,
Stan KF0NC
"90% of all statistics are made up"


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:20 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 13:33:51 -0500
Lines: 36
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KC5WCP wrote:
>
> Well Roger I agree most people are retired on the HF bands and have
> the time to learn code, but I think it takes more time to learn the
> theory than the code.  You can use 30 minutes a day for 2 weeks and
> learn enough for the 13 wpm.  It does not take a smart or a unoccupied
> person to learn enough to get 7 out of 10 questions right.

I agree with you.  The theory was very difficult for me, since I have no
experience with electronics outside the context of amateur radio.

However, I think that the difference between theory and code with
respect to newcomers is that most people know how to study for a test,
and have experience doing so.  Almost everyone has taken some government
exam or other, even if it is only the drivers' license written test. By
contrast, many people are baffled by the code requirement and how to
surmount it.  The code-tape solution seems to be a grim and uninviting
activity.  By contrast, at least parts of the theory exam (the more
relevent parts too, in my opinion!) are rather interesting to study.
Not 100% hard slogging.  Futhermore, the theory has the appearence, and
at least partly the reality, of being relevant.  Morse Code, invented
before the turn of the century, if I'm not mistaken, flunks this test as
well.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:22 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Importance of Our ARRL
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 13:37:02 -0500
Lines: 31
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Jacqueline Herman wrote:
>
work.
> Unless he joins and does his bit, he must not complain when his fellows
> place him in the list of unenviables who are not willing to do any work
> themselves..."
>
> Taken from an editorial by Hiram Percy Maxim, in the November 1919 issue
> of QST (77 years ago!!)
>
> Jeff KH2PZ / 7

And just as true, and relevant, today.  I may grouse at the League (hey,
that's one of the privileges of membership) but I am a member, and a
supporter, and always will be.  The League is our only true voice with
the FCC.  Every time I read some of the scary proposals regarding
frequency allocations, I thank the stars that the League is there to
guard our interests.  And that's no fooling.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:23 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space
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From: Tom Valenti <[e-mail]>
Subject: ICOM CT-17  (CI-V) Interface programs out there?
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45573 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122393 rec.radio.amateur.space:9279

Happy New Year from Seattle,

I am looking for bare bones, or better, shareware programs used by us to
tie our rigs to the PC. My shack will be automating an IC-R7000, IC-735,
IC-275H, and a IC-475H. If you have a program (BOTH binary and source
code) I would love to download it. Just let me know where to get it.
Anybody really close by, I'll buy lunch for the first few! I work near
Boeing Field.    73
--
Tom "Wunski" Valenti
KB7RSK
http://www.eskimo.com/~valenti/


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:24 1997
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From: Dave Burr <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: A Proposal- CW Endorsement
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 12:37:50 -0600
Organization: MCSNet Services
Lines: 73
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122391 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45033

Bill Sohl wrote:
>
> [e-mail] (T.L.Bryant) wrote:
>
> >In article <01bbf4ee$d7954b60$71e96ec6@chuckster>, <Unknown> says...
> >>
> >>I have used CW almost exclusively for the past 15 years and I love it.
> >>13 wpm did not come easy for me but in time I made it to 25 wpm.
> >>Times are changing and we must change but we need not throw
> >>the baby out with the bath water to make these changes!
> >>
> >>Proposal # 1766
> >>
> >>A working knowledge of code will no longer be *required* for any band.
> >>One MUST possess a Code *Endorsement* to USE cw on any band
> >>except in times of emergency... *Endorsements* are grandfathered
> >>to all who have passed cw testing in the past and can be obtained
> >>by passing code tests in the future. In this way we can perserve and
> >>recognize the *skill* of cw and reward those who use it without
> >>mandating it's use by others...... I believe it is better to bend a little
> >>than to break. CW is a skill and Compromise is the way to preserv it.
> >>Let us open the Door to the future yet retain and respect the past.....
>
> >This is about the most logical and sensible answer to the Morse Code
> >controversy that I've seen. I happen to be for retaining a morse code test
> >requirement. An endorsement would satisfy me just as well. The endorsement
> >could be much like a drivers license. Some states require a motorcycle
> >endorsement before you can operate a motorcycle, so why not a CW endorsemen
t
> >for operating in lower portions of the HF bands? The SSB operators could st
ill
> >have their portions of the bands, as well as AMTOR, RTTY, SSTV and other
> >digital modes.
> >I would think that it would be enough to satisfy both sides. Unfortunately
> >there will be some who find fault with it. I can't wait to hear their reaso
ns
> >why.
>
> Well, let me ask some questions:  What does the endorsement mean, what
> is it supposed to accomplish?  The proposal seems to say that you
> should NOT be allowed to operate CW in a designated HF CW band until
> you have passed a minimum code operating speed test.  If that's what
> folks want, I could care less, but I see no value in the proposal.
>
> Also,  who's going to police the CW subbands to make sure someone
> without an endorsement isn't operating CW?
>
> Ironically, today's band allocations contain only two totally
> exclusive CW subbands.  They are on 6m and 2m and any non-coded
> tech is free to use them at whatever speed that person wishes.
>
> Bill Sohl  K2UNK
> ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ


I agree...more thought is required on this subject. IMO, there should be
a small sliver of the *phone* segment allocated for those with a CW
endorsement. Although on the face of it, this is somewhat illogical, it
may accomplish two important goals:

1) it may be an acceptable compromise for the "I did it, so you need to
do it too if you want the same privileges" crowd.

2) if the no coders are correct, it will lead to an influx of new
people, which is necessary if this hobby is to survive.

Okay, people, weigh in on the pros and cons of this trial balloon. This
assumes, of course, that international agreements would allow it. My own
feeling is that there may be some incremental growth by reducing or
eliminating the CW requirement, but in the scheme of things, the hobby
has other fundamental problems which are more significant than this CW
red herring. Ham radio is simply less relevent in the communication age,
and lack of attention and revitalization has allowed it to deteriorate.

Dave
K9XK


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:25 1997
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From: "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 20 mtr nets
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 13:46:25 -0500
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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KC5WCP wrote:
>
> Is there to many 20 meter nets or not enough?
>
> KC5WCO
> Justin

Well, that's a tough one.

A lot of people get a lot of pleasure from participating in nets.  You
can't say that nets are a bad thing if that is the way people want to
enjoy ham radio, even though I personally do not enjoy nets, or
participating in them.

I will confess that I do occasionally resent being asked to move off of
a frequency, when I was there first, on the grounds that the frequency
is a "net frequency."  (Even though I generally accede to such
requests).  This happens a lot.  In my opinion nets should assume that
"their" frequency is plus or minus 5 or 10 Khz, in recognition of the
fact that many hams are unaware of, or for that matter care to give
deference to, a net's priority over a certain frequency.

Another problem with nets is that most of them seem to be in the general
class band.  I guess this means that general class hams are a lot more
inconvenienced by nets than I am.  This doesn't seem desireable or fair.

Personally I like to call CQ and ragchew.  But not everyone feels that
way.  In fact, on 20M almost no one calls CQ anymore.  I suspect this is
a symptom of the greying of our HF ranks: most of the guys have settled
into a comfortable routine and only talk to their existing friends.
Kind of like 75 meters in many places.

--
Roger J. Buffington
W6VZV

USC Law, Class of '97

------------------------------------------------------------
"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
------------------------------------------------------------

Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:26 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 19:05:13 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <5abrrd$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp132.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Well Roger I agree most people are retired on the HF bands and have
the time to learn code, but I think it takes more time to learn the
theory than the code.  You can use 30 minutes a day for 2 weeks and
learn enough for the 13 wpm.  It does not take a smart or a unoccupied
person to learn enough to get 7 out of 10 questions right.
KC5WCO  Justin"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
>retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
>older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
>remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
>back in the late 60s.

>The CW requirement tends, I think, to keep it that way.  Busy working
>people probably lack the time to master 13 WPM CW, and have other hobby
>alternatives, such as the internet, that do not require them to do so.
>Although working people see the relevance of a theory and procedure
>exam, (and are willing to take the time out of their busy schedules to
>prepare for and pass them) they tend to view the code test as a
>non-productive use of their time (which it is).  Therefore, in great
>numbers they pass ham radio by, or at best become no-code Techs.

>Now, I've got nothing against retirees; I hope to be one myself one day,
>and lots of these guys are my buddies.  But surely none of us think that
>it is a good thing for our hobby that our hobby has systematically
>excluded non-retirees.

>By the way, if you disagree with what I've written, then ask yourself
>WHY is it that HF is so overwhelmingly dominated, even on weekends, by
>retirees?  I think you may come back to my theory.

>As an interesting corellary to the above, the recent ARRL survey on
>keeping the CW requirement also contained a systematic bias in favor of
>retirees.  1) probably retirees with lots of time on their hands are the
>ones with the leisure time to discover, and respond to, such a poll; 2)
>the ARRL is to a very large extent comprised of retirees. (No, I don't
>have figures, but I'll bet I'm right.)

>--
>Roger J. Buffington
>W6VZV

>USC Law, Class of '97

>------------------------------------------------------------
>"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
>Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
>------------------------------------------------------------

>Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Bill Sohl)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.policy
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 19:07:16 GMT
Organization: Mount Olive Township (NJ) Emergency Management
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <5acg8l$[e-mail]>
References: <59eheq$[e-mail]> <59n8m0$[e-mail]> <59r5s4$[e-mail]> <59rsef$[e-mail]> <59s4ca$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aao04$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: stan15.planet.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.misc:122403 rec.radio.amateur.policy:45037

[e-mail] (Dale Wentz) wrote:

>If as much effort was put into helping new hams, and learning code, as this
>message thread, we would have a lot more younger hams.

>This is silly The code has been there for ever, and everyone knew that when
>they got into this. No one is required to upgrade any more.

With the exception of the original Novice class, no one ever was
required to upgrade.

>I guess the next
>thinkg they will want to do is do away with a drivers licence test to drive a

>car or a school bus.

This is exactly the kind of exaggerated dumb statement that has
no place in the discussion.

Bill Sohl  K2UNK
ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:28 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: 10-10 hpages
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 19:10:47 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <5abs5s$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp132.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Can anyone post some 10-10 International Net. Inc web pages?
Thank You and Happy New Year.
KC5WCO
Justin



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:29 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!newshub.tc.umn.edu!lynx.unm.edu!bubba.NMSU.Edu!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (The Smartest Guy I Know)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Frequency Grease...Is this real stuff?
Date: 31 Dec 1996 19:11:20 GMT
Organization: New Mexico State University
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <5abogo$[e-mail]>
References: <5a3q0h$[e-mail]> <5a5oqm$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: acca.nmsu.edu
X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950621BETA PL0]

Tom Sefranek ([e-mail]) wrote:
: [e-mail] (Ben) wrote:
:
: >I have been hearing about a remarkable product that has/was the old
: >timers standby.  Apparently you could paint this stuff onto an antenna
: >and it would some how cause the SWR to drop to 1:1 without any
: >pruning!
:
: I hear that it can get you antenna gain if applied in the winter.
:
: >Has anybody heard of this stuff?
:
: >Ben
:
:
:

Yes!  I've heard of it.  The cap on the can is marked in units of SWR,
and there's an arrow on the can itself.  Before spraying, you turn the
cap to the desired reduction or increase in SWR.  Then, just pop the cap
off and start spraying.








......sorry, couldn't resist.


Joe


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!uwm.edu!news.moneng.mei.com!usenet
From: "Kevin Jessup" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: is there any activity, anywhere, in amateur spread spectrum?
Date: 31 Dec 1996 19:15:33 GMT
Organization: Marquette Electronics, Inc.
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <01bbf74e$d1cf3cb0$be01ba97@case100>
References: <5a4ph6$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: case100.diageng.mei.com
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155

[e-mail] wrote in article <5a4ph6$[e-mail]>...

> Greetings fellow amateurs.
> I would like to know if there is any amateur activity, experiemental
> or established, using spread spectrum.
> I am curious about the technique(s) used, which band(s), etc.
> Larry ve3fxq
>

Check out http://www.tapr.org for info on amateur SS.

TAPR is really doing some great stuff with the recently
issued STA, allowing more experimenter-friendly use of
amateur SS.

I am currently running two 115 kbaud FH SS modems
on 900 MHz.   These are made by FreeWave.  TAPR
is using "custom" versions of these as part of their studies.

There IS amateur radio SS activity out there.   But you'd
never know it based on all the code/nocode/license wars
typical of this newsgroup.

- Kevin, n9sqb



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!a3bsrv.nai.net!mgate.arrl.org!news
From: Ed Hare <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: 31 Dec 1996 19:42:47 GMT
Organization: American Radio Relay League, Inc.
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <5abqbn$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6e1p$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mgate.arrl.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.2N (Windows; I; 16bit)
To: [e-mail]
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45042 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122432

[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>Contrary to popular belief I do not use the BEEPER as a derogatory
>comment.

Now, if CW ops started calling SSB ops "squawkers." wouldn't it be taken
as a derogatory term?

Perhaps you could substitute "CW op" for "beeper."  It takes a few less
keystrokes, too. :-)

--

73,
Ed Hare, KA1CV




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wildstar.net!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: The Importance of Our ARRL
Date: 31 Dec 96 20:27:10 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

                        "The Importance of Our ARRL"

"...There is no such thing as organization if each one of us starts out to
be thoroughly selfish. If all our efforts are to be directed solely for the
benefit of self, we are purely individual and able to take about as much
form as the individual sands of the sea. We are an incoherent, uncontrolled
crowd. On the other hand, if just a little of our efforts is devoted to the
common cause, we automatically establish organization and efficiency and
protection, and everything else that is elevating, improving and worth
the having...  When an amateur asks that old-time question, "What do I
get out of joining the ARRL?" the answer should be, "Protection." He
cannot have it unless somebody joins as organization and does the work.
Unless he joins and does his bit, he must not complain when his fellows
place him in the list of unenviables who are not willing to do any work
themselves..."

Taken from an editorial by Hiram Percy Maxim, in the November 1919 issue
of QST (77 years ago!!)

Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:34 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-lond.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!netcom.net.uk!netcom.com!jlowman
From: [e-mail] (Jim Lowman)
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 20:27:43 GMT
Lines: 11
Sender: [e-mail]

Dick Flanagan ([e-mail]) wrote:

: It could also be "CW ease and intelligibility."  For example, I can easily
: see someone with a callsign like  N 5 S H  wanting to get something a
: little less problematic if they did a lot of CW operating.

One of the guys at the local club gave up an AC6xx callsign for one ending
in x5HSS.  I kid him about sending that stream of dits, and the other
station thinking he had gone into an infinite error-correction cycle.  :-)

73 de Jim - KF6CR


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:35 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!usc!newshub.cts.com!news.aloha.net!news
From: "Jim Reid" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Morse Code Therapy
Date: 31 Dec 1996 20:45:26 GMT
Organization: At Home
Lines: 63
Message-ID: <01bbf75b$8c2f1100$92070ccf@jim-reid-1>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kauai-146.u.aloha.net

From a past issue of Morsum Magnificat

 (http://www.morsum.co.uk)

Author unkown to me:

"Morse Therapy

Many times, over the years, I've finished writing a lecture
late at night. The house is asleep, but my mind is wide
awake. I know that if I go to bed now, I'll just lie awake
and the ideas I have to propound in the morning will rush
madly about, echoing and muttering in my brain. My
solution has always been to fire up the TS-520, limber
up the Brown Brothers paddle, put on the cans and
exchange CW for a while with someone on 20 metres.

After a while the Morse begins to decode itself automatically.
My pulse-rate slows, and the network theorems and Fourier
transforms of my professional life go away. I have almost
become one with the radio, a bionic post-processor tacked
on the end of the audio chain.

CW is the purest form of communication I know, a
'mind-to-mind' linkage. The words appear right inside
my head, words that were never spoken; uncorrupted by
accents, verbal peculiarities, oddities of vocal intonation.
They leave no room for other thoughts. Almost like a form
of meditation. Very therapeutic. After thirty minutes of that,
my metabolism has been slowed right down and I'm relaxed.
I can go to bed and sleep comes.

All of us who have been hams for a long time go through
phases. That's one of the nice things about our hobby,
there are so many outlets for our nuttiness. I've been an
antenna nut, a Dx hunter, a transmatch experimenter, a
keyer builder, a phasing SSB enthusiast, a CW keyboard
freak.

All these phases have passed, but my first love is still CW.
Its the mode I go back to whenever I need to wind down and
recharge the batteries. There's something about the essential
simplicity and purity of Morse that, for me, all the other modes
lack."

Not my words,  but certainly reflects my amateur radio
experience!  I usually "copy" CW using the computer
keyboard,  copying to the Notepad of Win 95.  However,
after awhile,  it seems easier just to watch the words
forming in my mind,  as the above author has stated.
That IS very relaxing,  and quite simple after one follows
the proper CW learning methods, e.g.,  the Koch method,
and listening to CW daily, for a half-hour or so at a time
at speeds, say 5 wpm faster than you can comfortably
copy with a pencil or keyboard.  In a few weeks or months,
there they are,  the words in your minds eye!

Anyway, Happy New Year to All and may this be the
year you realize whatever your dreams may be!!

73,  Jim, KH7M




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!169.207.30.10!newspump.sol.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!mr.net!news.mr.net!news
From: Ron Stordahl <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 14:45:43 -0600
Organization: Minnesota Regional Network (MRNet)
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: gatekeeper.digikey.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I)

Dick Flanagan wrote:
>
--clip--
> It could also be "CW ease and intelligibility."  For example, I can easily
> see someone with a callsign like  N 5 S H  wanting to get something a
> little less problematic if they did a lot of CW operating.
> --
--clip

Actually I wanted NE5E but it was taken, so I settled on N5IN and I like
it, but then I am strictly a CW man!

Ron N5IN


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wildstar.net!news.ecn.uoknor.edu!munnari.OZ.AU!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!news-mail-gateway
From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: code
Date: 31 Dec 96 20:46:24 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

Drew believes that the ITU will strike down the code requirement at the
next WRC - he says many (?) countries such as Japan currently ignore
said requirement.

Well Drew, check out US47CFR Part 15 and look at all the freq'ys below
30 MHz you can transmit on without passing *any* code requirement at all.
The best known code-free band is 1750m; another is 11m.

So you see Drew, just like Japan, we also grant restricted code-free
access to freq'ys below 30 MHz.

Some will scream "But that's not amateur radio!" and my response to them
is that "amateur" was originally defined as someone who owns and operates
a station for pleasure (see Radio Communication Laws Of The US, 1912).

See you on the bands tonight for Straight Key Night!

Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.55.3.16!news2.mnsinc.com!news1.mnsinc.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Brian Carling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Crystals
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 21:23:06 GMT
Organization: AF4K / Glowbugs
Lines: 24
Distribution: inet
Message-ID: <5acanj$[e-mail]>
References: <5a47h1$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: bry.mnsinc.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Bigdad <[e-mail]> whistled a happy tune like:

|>Where is a good place(s) to buy crystals nowdays? Its been ages
|>since ive needed to xtal up a radio. Any help is appreciated!


|>                   73's  Art WB9HNJ

Hello Art! The information you need is in the free file:
xtals.txt

You can view it at:
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/

It's in the Ham Radio Resources section!

There are dozens of sources for crystals listed there!
ENJOY!

73 from Bry  (((Amateur Radio G3XLQ / AF4K)))
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry
E-mail:  [e-mail]
Home of MEGALIST ham radio files, SWL info. etc. etc.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.55.3.16!news2.mnsinc.com!news1.mnsinc.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Brian Carling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Net listing ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 21:28:36 GMT
Organization: AF4K / Glowbugs
Lines: 32
Distribution: inet
Message-ID: <5acb1t$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: bry.mnsinc.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Say Walt - what if anything did you find out about this?

Could you please e-mail me any useful addresses on the WWW?

I DO have a listing of SWAP Nets on the air at my WWW site in the Ham Radio
Resources Section at
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/

But it is by no means a large list like we need for NETS in general.

Please e-mail reply to me!

Do NOT reply to [e-mail]
REPLY address is:
[e-mail]

Thanks & 73 - AF4K

walt profota <[e-mail]> whistled a happy tune like:

|>I sometimes come across different discussion groups on hf such as the
|>Kenwood net,Satellite net,ect.I was wondering if there was someplace on
|>the internet that would have a listing of all the nets there purpose
|>time,dates and freq.
|>                      Thanks
|>                      Walt  N3JPR

73 from Bry  (((Amateur Radio G3XLQ / AF4K)))
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry
E-mail:  [e-mail]
Home of MEGALIST ham radio files, SWL info. etc. etc.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!usc!newshub.cts.com!news.aloha.net!news
From: "Jim Reid" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Morse Code Therapy
Date: 31 Dec 1996 21:32:32 GMT
Organization: At Home
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <01bbf762$2159a780$39070ccf@jim-reid-1>
References: <01bbf75b$8c2f1100$92070ccf@jim-reid-1>
NNTP-Posting-Host: kauai-57.u.aloha.net



Jim Reid <[e-mail]> wrote in article
<01bbf75b$8c2f1100$92070ccf@jim-reid-1
> Author unkown to me:
>
> "Morse Therapy

Author identified:  Dr.  Gary  Bold,  ZL1AN

Jim,  KH7M


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!feeder.chicago.cic.net!compuserve.com!news.production.compuserve.com!news
From: Brian Webb <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.equipment,rec.radio.amateur.homebrew,rec.radio.amateur.misc,rec.radio.amateur.space
Subject: New Web Page
Date: 31 Dec 1996 21:48:40 GMT
Organization: Umbra Research
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <5ac1no$nmj$[e-mail]>
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.equipment:45601 rec.radio.amateur.homebrew:22627 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122453 rec.radio.amateur.space:9282

If you're interested in amateur radio or space, visit my new web
page at:

 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rawhide_home_page

Happy New Year,

Brian Webb, KD6NRP


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!206.55.3.16!news2.mnsinc.com!news1.mnsinc.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Brian Carling)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Ham radio files & information on WWW
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 21:49:37 GMT
Organization: AF4K / Glowbugs
Lines: 23
Distribution: inet
Message-ID: <5acc9i$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: bry.mnsinc.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Hi guys - I have been organizing my links and things a little better
at the web page if anyone would enjoy seeing them in a more
organized fashion, take a look at

http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/
and see the ham radio resources section.

http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/hamlynx.htm#tubeproj
for the Glowbugs projects OR:

http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/hamlynx.htm#qrp
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry/hamlynx.htm#boatanch
etc.

Happy New Year you all!

ENJOY

73 from Bry  (((Amateur Radio G3XLQ / AF4K)))
http://www.mnsinc.com/bry
E-mail:  [e-mail]
Home of MEGALIST ham radio files, SWL info. etc. etc.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:45 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!192.174.65.41!01-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!02-newsfeed.univie.ac.at!newsfeed.de.ibm.net!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:07:26 GMT
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Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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On Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:48:34 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>
>>>>
>>>Considered me a signator.
>>>
>
>>You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
>>But you are a signator.
>
>And that is a problem for you how?

No problem for me if it's no problem for KC5WCP.

>And I don't remember asking your opinion or even valuing it.

That's because KC5WCP didn't ask for my opinion, so I suppose that
means his memory is OK.  However, I didn't provide an opinion either.
It is equally acceptable to make a point by providing considered
opinions or by providing facts. This time I chose to state a fact.

Making a point is not the same thing as stating an opinion. But note
that the point may not be valid if it was based on an opinion that was
not well-considered. But this particular point was based on fact and
not opinion. Therefore it was valid. Capiche?

For "value",  it is not a great concern of mine whether or not anyone
values the aforementioned fact. It's not 'my' fact. It simply is. But
for what it's worth, it's hard to "value" a signature on a document
that exists before the document is drafted.
>
>Have a nice day :)

TU

73

de KR4AJ



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:18:07 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5abb26$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

<<I suggest you wouldn't brag about, at least not here.  I'm not sure if
the rule
is still in effect, but the last time I heard you weren't allowed to talk
to
anyone on 11 meters more than 150 miles away, and if that is still the
case, it
would make you a criminal, not a braggard.>>

Can I stop laughing now?  When was the last time you heard of someone
being prosecuted as a desperate, dangerous "criminal" for talking more
than 150 miles away on 11m?


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:46 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:19:45 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 10
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5abjmt$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>I'd be more interested in finding out why he was using an non-type
accepted transmitter on 11m.

Of course, hams never, EVER run their amateur gear on 11m...right?


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:48 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:23:52 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5abbbb$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>Nope, it's not the same thing. Squiggy is one person.  'Beepers' are
anyone who uses CW, right ?<<

Wrong.  'Beepers' are those who refuse to accept and embrace modern
technology, attempting to keep ham radio from advancing accordingly.
'Beepers' cling to the old ways, insisting that the Morse hazing ritual
remain part of ham radio, regardless of the fact that there is no longer
any justification for requiring knowledge of such outdated
technology...thereby scaring away many would-be hams in the process and
insuring the ultimate death of ham radio due to 'lack of interest.'


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:48 1997
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
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From: "R.W. Odell" <[e-mail]>
Subject: No Hole VHF/UHF antenna for 1997 Jeep Grand Cherokee?
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Sender: [e-mail]
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33462 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122430

Does anyone have any great ideas for this vehicle?  I've mounted a
Kenwood TM941, and am interested in placing an antenna which will at
least give me two of my three favorite bands.

There's the on-glass possibility, or one of these all-way adjustables on
the hatch.

Anyone have any other ideas?

-Bob
WA2WLH/7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:49 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:26:52 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <5ac7li$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <5a0ep9$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Mike Watson <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Jim Kehler wrote:
>>
>> [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>>
>> >Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
>>
>> Not correct. Mabye 60% of people with ham LICENSES don't use CW, but
>> 100% of HAMS use CW.
>>
>> >majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
>> >datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
>> >keep it held back.
>>
>> Nope. That's wrong too.
>>
>> >Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
>> >us?
>>
>> I am having a hard time understanding the question, Eric. Could you try and
>> rephrase that so it makes more sense ?
>>
>> 73, Jim KH2D

>I've been a Ham for almost 25 years---haven't used CW in this decade and
>never got faster than 15-16 WPM.  BUT, I support the code requirement
>for one reason.  We value what we have to work to get.  One reason that
>the CB bands are chaoic was that the license was given away.  Ham
>licenses have to be earned.  Most people won't trash something they had
>to work to get.

>--
>=====================================================================
>Mike Watson, WB0IKT
>Raymore, Missouri, USA
>http://www.sky.net/~crucis

> "Meetings are like fungi---there are more growing in dark, damp
>  corners."
>=====================================================================

Granted. But why does the filter have to be CW. Why can't it be a
stringent written test which emphasises operating practices and
theory?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:51 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Joe Subich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:27:42 GMT
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <5ac40u$1qhc$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]><[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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In message <[e-mail]> - [e-mail] (Jim
Lowman) writes:
:>
:>
:>Did the FCC think there might be some "buyer's remorse" among the vanity
:>applicants, or is this two-year rule just in keeping with their normal
:>practice?
:>

The two yer rule is (1) consistent with other FCC practice on
availability
of calls, though under the old sequential call system old calls were
never
re-used, and (2) was implemented in the "vanity" rules at the suggestion
of amateurs to prevent "trafficing" (the buying and selling) of vanity
calls.

Without a significant amount of time between the abandonment of one call
and its reassignment to provide a real disincentive, trafficing in calls
could become a real problem.

--
========================================================================
Joe Subich, W8IK ex-AD8I
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
========================================================================



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:53 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Joe Subich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:27:47 GMT
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <5ac413$2r1i$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]><[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]>
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In message <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> - [e-mail]
(Robert Reed) writes:
:>
:>
:>Where do some people come up with these far fetched reasons ?
:>
:>There is a 2 ywar grace period for renewing a lapsed license and still
:>retain the callsign. The FCC must leave the callsign untouched if it is
:>to be reclaimed.
:>

Actually, the time period to renew a lapsed license and still retain the
call is one year.  After one year, the commission will assign a new call
under the "sequential callsign system."   However, under the vanity
program, one could retrieve the old call as a vanity call within that
second year.

--
========================================================================
Joe Subich, W8IK ex-AD8I
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
========================================================================



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:54 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Joe Subich)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:27:49 GMT
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <5ac415$1qhc$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]><[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]>
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In message <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> - [e-mail]
(Robert Reed) writes:
:>
:>
:>Where do some people come up with these far fetched reasons ?
:>
:>There is a 2 ywar grace period for renewing a lapsed license and still
:>retain the callsign. The FCC must leave the callsign untouched if it is
:>to be reclaimed.
:>

Actually, the time period to renew a lapsed license and still retain the
call is one year.  After one year, the commission will assign a new call
under the "sequential callsign system."   However, under the vanity
program, one could retrieve the old call as a vanity call within that
second year.

--
========================================================================
Joe Subich, W8IK ex-AD8I
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
     <[e-mail]>
========================================================================



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:55 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:27:51 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5abcdv$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>Yeah, Spew. Put that in your 1977 Buick and drive it around the block...

Sorry, never owned a 1977 Buick.  Better read my AOL profile that you're
so fond of one more time.

I hear too many years of being a Beeper screws up your eyesight :-)




-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:56 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!199.94.215.18!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!news.mindspring.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Jim Gurtner)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: CW Over the Internet?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:29:42 GMT
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-37kbsqj.dialup.mindspring.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Server-Date: 31 Dec 1996 19:31:27 GMT
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99g/16.339

Does anyone know of a program to send and receive CW over the internet
real time?  I would like to use it to practice in order to get my
speed up.  I noticed that the readme file that comes with "SuperMorse"
has a schematic laying out how to connect a key to a computer via the
serial port.

73 de KB2LJR
Jim Gurnter
[e-mail]




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:30:11 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5abcle$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Habib Delgado) wrote:

>Hey, look, guys! This stupid, redneck peckerwood motherfucker can
>apparently read a newspaper, and take some of the information he picks
>up there, and then actually form it into a thought resembling a crude
>attempt at humor, while managing to offend two groups of people at the
>same time, all the while heaping embarrassment upon himself in front
>of thousands! Nice work Drew! If I were you, I would just kill myself,
>as opposed to continue the embarrassment your poor family must suffer
>at your hands daily. Get yourself a gun, put the barrel in your mouth,
>and pull the trigger. No on will miss you, and if you do it out in
>that fucking swamp you call your yard, perhaps the local scavenging
>animals will eat your body, sparing the local authorities the task of
>cleaning up the mess that would probably just be shipped off to a soap
>factory somewhere anyway.
>Your friend,
>Habib


Words of wisdom from a foreigner on a Packard Bell Internet account.

I'm impressed.



-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:57 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:32:22 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5abcle$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>That's an excellent idean, Habib. But you have to be careful how you
talk
to Spew. You give him ideas. Next thing you know he'll be posting messages
as:

[e-mail]

I hate to disappoint you, but AOL limits you to 10 characters for the
screenname.

Of course, that leaves the possibility for you to sign up as
[e-mail] wide open!


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:00:59 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:33:47 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 68
Message-ID: <5ac82l$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6b0o$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:

>In article <5a6b0o$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>> [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:
>>
>> >In article <59vn1u$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>>
>> >
>> >> Which means that 60% of hams don't use CW, correct? That means the
>> >> majority of hams feel CW is old outdated and out classed by high speed
>> >> datamodes that they can't access fully because the coders have helped
>> >> keep it held back.
>> >> Or is there a better reason we don't high more than 9600 available to
>> >> us?
>>
>> When I spoke of data modes and 9600 being the highest available I was
>> talking of the entire spectrum. Speeds are limited on HF, I know.
>> Still it doesn't stop the U.S. Military(and otrhers) from using faster
>> speeds on HF.
>> The Pro-coders are afraid that if reliable datacomms of highspeed were
>> allowed their precious CW might no longer be required as their only
>> legitimate claim is it's use in extreme emergencies would no longer be
>> valid.
>>

>I've left in your original post.  Help me out here.  Where did you
>specifically mention HF??  OHHH qualifiers are now in place.  I C said
>the blind man as he took out his hammer and saw.  Make a statement, get
>hammered than say.."I didn't mean to say that, I meant to say this??"
>Sorry, like a dodo bird...doesn't fly.
Yeah whatever

>If you knew that speeds were limited on HF (as it is HF that will
>affected by the removal of the code requirement), why ever mention it in
>the first place, other than to troll for flames.
Speeds are limited on HF only because the FCC says so.
>The 2nd statement..loved it..the military and others.   A big SO WHAT.
>We are not the military, they can do things we've can only dream and as
>pointed out, the other must mean commercial communications interests.
>HMMMM  CARL'S AGENDA, the commercialization of the ARS..play for pay.  As
>pointed out, to allow some of the previously mentioned datamodes would
>require the change from Amateur to Professional radio service.
Seeing as how I have no interest in commercial communications you
above statement is merely percieved as a troll for flames.
>We are the AMATEUR RADIO SERVICE.  we are not the military, we are not
>AT&T, MicroSoft, etc etc.  Remember it, learn it, love it
I do.
>>

>--
>Steve KF2TI
>ARRL LIFE Member

>BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
>OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

>WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
>AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

>I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

>doors open in 5 minutes

Nope I guess hams never invented anything the military ever used.
Nope. Hams were never innovators of technology or the forerunners of
the electronic art. Nope.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!uniserve!news.mindlink.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The ARRL Letter 12/20/96
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:34:03 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>>The Morse requirement seems to be
viewed as a make-work, pointless requirement that just isn't
worthwhile.<<

Because that's exactly what it is.



-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:00 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!bigboote.WPI.EDU!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Importance of Our ARRL
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:38:44 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

<< Every time I read some of the scary proposals regarding
frequency allocations, I thank the stars that the League is there to
guard our interests.  And that's no fooling.>>

Me thinks they could have quite a few more dollars in their warchest from
would-be members if they would reconsider their stand on the Morse
requirement.


-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day"
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:02 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Some respect, please!
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:39:51 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <5ac8du$[e-mail]>
References: <59o344$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6ceg$[e-mail]> <5a7s0h$[e-mail]> <5a8o4e$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
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[e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ)) wrote:

>In article <5a8o4e$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>> I would much rather have someone capable of fixing the EMP damaged
>> equiptment and use packet to pass traffic.

>Would that be HF packet with its rather limited transmission rate.  But a
>question....if emp damaged all the transceivers, wouldn't it also damage
>the equipment to diagnose and repair the emp damaged equipment??

>Maybe Carl or Len could open a little shop in Mayberry, NC, kinda like
>Emmett's Fix-It Shop.  Maybe Aunt Bea could fix up some fried chicken and
>finger sandwiches will everyone dies from radiation poisoning.  Maybe
>Goober could pump the gas needed to burn the unburied multitudes of
>deceased.

>But hey, pass that traffic.

>Routine
>number 666

>check ARRL 10.....


>>
>>

>--
>Steve KF2TI
>ARRL LIFE Member

>BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
>OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

>WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
>AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

>I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

>doors open in 5 minutes

Which is why there should be a CW transmitter test portion if there is
going to be a Morse code requirement.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:03 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:41:16 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5ac8gi$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <5a2nir$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3ij1$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6d9k$[e-mail]> <5a8bj7$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>So if I don't code I am lazy? Effort is realative. My desire to toughen the
written test
>>does not qualify as effort?

>Well, Eric, if it was an original idea, maybe it would.  But we've heard it S
O
>many times already, that it doesn't carry much weight any more.  As a matter
of
>fact it may have been assigned a number already, let me check........ Yep, it
's
>Kill The Code Excuse Number 56.  Sorry, you'll have to think of an original o
ne.

>73, Jim KH2D


Sorry if my idea was not original. But anyway it would work. And i'd
even give you the credit :)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:04 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (DHunter147)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: amateur television
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:44:47 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

how do we start a newsgroup for atv?
I think that rec.amateur.television would be a very active group


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:05 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:46:01 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <5ac8pf$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8kks$[e-mail]> <5a8ogo$[e-mail]> <5abbee$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>>>>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>>>>
>>>>>Considered me a signator.
>>>>>

>>>>You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
>>>>But you are a signator.

>>>Well, Dan, if it's free, EVERYBODY wants one......

>>STD's are free. Last time I passed the line by the bordello I heard
>>this strange beeping comming from the line.....

>Where else but in Mississippi would they have a line for a bordello......


Well it was buy 1 get 1 free day and we know how frugal some beepers
can be.....





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:06 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:48:24 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <5ac8tu$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4gdn$[e-mail]> <5a6e5t$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8oe2$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:

>On Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:48:34 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Dan Finn) wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 17:41:19 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:
>>
>>>>>
>>>>Considered me a signator.
>>>>
>>
>>>You haven't even read it. That's because it hasn't even been drafted.
>>>But you are a signator.
>>
>>And that is a problem for you how?

>No problem for me if it's no problem for KC5WCP.

>>And I don't remember asking your opinion or even valuing it.

>That's because KC5WCP didn't ask for my opinion, so I suppose that
>means his memory is OK.  However, I didn't provide an opinion either.
>It is equally acceptable to make a point by providing considered
>opinions or by providing facts. This time I chose to state a fact.

>Making a point is not the same thing as stating an opinion. But note
>that the point may not be valid if it was based on an opinion that was
>not well-considered. But this particular point was based on fact and
>not opinion. Therefore it was valid. Capiche?

>For "value",  it is not a great concern of mine whether or not anyone
>values the aforementioned fact. It's not 'my' fact. It simply is. But
>for what it's worth, it's hard to "value" a signature on a document
>that exists before the document is drafted.
>>
>>Have a nice day :)

>TU

>73

>de KR4AJ

Actually you were not stating fact. i do not have to see the actual
text of the item involved to desire to be a signator. The general idea
behind the article is what I am interested in and therefore desire to
be a signator.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:07 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:49:08 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <5ac8vb$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
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Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:

>KC5WCP wrote:
>>
>> Peter Coffee AC6EN <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>> > >>> the operating is secondary...just the testing phase...
>>
>> >Gee, I can't see that at all.  I've seen a shy, mike-frighted kid after
>> >twenty minutes of contesting turn into a confident frequency-runner,
>> >crisply timing his calls and acknowledgments: it's a thing of beauty.
>> >The Internet doesn't develop that kind of poise.  Don't dismiss any facet
>> >of the hobby, they all come together and each is special to someone.
>>
>> Well said. But unfortunately some of us are being denied that magic
>> because a select few demand we communicate and find that magic with
>> code. WRONG!

>And those that can't...whine...
>Shame you still can't learn...
>Six year olds CAN, why can't you?
>--
>Stan  KF0NC
>"90% of all statistics are made up"

IGN PER



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:08 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!206.229.87.25!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Join the ARRL!
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:52:01 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <5ac94o$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <59usoj$[e-mail]> <59vda7$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2ior$[e-mail]> <5a40k5$[e-mail]> <5a6et2$[e-mail]> <5a7c2b$[e-mail]> <5a8pbd$[e-mail]> <5abb26$[e-mail]>
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[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>Well last year I made a fine contact with a lady in Australia on 11m.
>>All I used was a dipole and about 10watts SSB. Truly the bottom of the
>>sunspot cycle. Explain that to me. Explain to me why a friend of mine
>>who is beeping away in the next room made contact and QSL'd the same
>>lady two months later with the same radio and same antenna same power
>>at a different QTH

>What would you like to me explain ? Radio propagation, why lady's in Australi
a
>are on 11 meters, or why your radio works the same when somebody elses pushes
>the PTT switch ?

>>I could go on with dozens of other similar QSO's like the one with
>>Vienna or the guy down in Panama I used to talk to every morning on my
>>way into work but I hate to be a braggard.

>I suggest you wouldn't brag about, at least not here.  I'm not sure if the ru
le
>is still in effect, but the last time I heard you weren't allowed to talk to
>anyone on 11 meters more than 150 miles away, and if that is still the case,
it
>would make you a criminal, not a braggard.

>>Problem with HF is that ya always here wise old hams say "The band is
>>dead" when they really should be saying"I am too lazy to spin the dial
>>and listen for more than five minutes"

>O. IC. Maybe thats why I am sitting here CQing on 160 and two guys in the sta
tes
>I am talking to on the packet cluster are sitting there listening for me.

>>And yes i would like to have HF in my arsenal. That does not make me
>>an HF sissie. An HF sissie is like the wise old ham described above in
>>my last paragraph.

>O. OK. All the old hams, who passed the test and are already on HF are sissie
s,
>but you aren't.  But you couldn't be an 'HF sissy'. You don't have a license
to
>be one yet, right ? When you get on HF, will you be a sissy too ?

>73, Jim KH2D


Jim you really should move to Washington DC and become a spin doctor.
You'd get rich in no time.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:10 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: FILTER
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 22:55:20 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <5ac9av$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <59r69r$[e-mail]> <59rj1d$[e-mail]> <5a4kv3$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
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[e-mail] (Gary Coffman) wrote:

>In article <5a4kv3$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (KC5WCP) w
rites:
>>[e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan) wrote:
>>>In article <59r69r$[e-mail]>,
>>>     Jim Kehler <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>>>>I talked to my friend, the extra class conservative the other day about th
e no
>>>>code thing.  I think riff raff is probably a bit too strong a term and it
>>>>probably insults people.
>>
>>>Okay, you're right. There are many classy criminals. Perhaps the term
>>>"trash" would be better. 'Helps keep the <white/black/asian/hispanic/etc>
>>>trash off HF'. Maybe that is better?
>>
>>>MD
>>>--
>>>--
>>>--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
>>>--
>>>--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.
>>
>>I hope you and Jim are only kiding when you define rif raf and the
>>various ethnic groups as trash. Gawd I hope so.
>>
>>Eric

>Kehler is just a troll, but Deigman couldn't be more serious unless he
>wore his sheet while typing (perhaps he does). From the continuing tenor
>of his posts, you can gather that his neck is so red traffic brakes at
>the sight of it.

>Gary
>--
>Gary Coffman KE4ZV          |    You make it,     | Due to provider problems
>Destructive Testing Systems |    we break it.     | with previous uucp addres
ses
>534 Shannon Way             |    Guaranteed!      | Email to [e-mail]
>Lawrenceville, GA 30244     |                     |

Sorry to here that he is so racist. I bet he'd talk with a nigerian if
he needed the country though :)



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:11 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!newsfeeds.sol.net!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:00:33 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <5ac9ko$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5abrrd$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
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[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>Well Roger I agree most people are retired on the HF bands and have
>the time to learn code, but I think it takes more time to learn the
>theory than the code.  You can use 30 minutes a day for 2 weeks and
>learn enough for the 13 wpm.  It does not take a smart or a unoccupied
>person to learn enough to get 7 out of 10 questions right.
>KC5WCO  Justin"Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>>Anyone ever notice that most of the people you QSO with on HF are
>>retirees?  I know of no hobby that is so predominantly comprised of
>>older people than this one.  The odd thing about it is that I don't
>>remember it as being nearly this bad when I was a teenager in the hobby,
>>back in the late 60s.

>>The CW requirement tends, I think, to keep it that way.  Busy working
>>people probably lack the time to master 13 WPM CW, and have other hobby
>>alternatives, such as the internet, that do not require them to do so.
>>Although working people see the relevance of a theory and procedure
>>exam, (and are willing to take the time out of their busy schedules to
>>prepare for and pass them) they tend to view the code test as a
>>non-productive use of their time (which it is).  Therefore, in great
>>numbers they pass ham radio by, or at best become no-code Techs.

>>Now, I've got nothing against retirees; I hope to be one myself one day,
>>and lots of these guys are my buddies.  But surely none of us think that
>>it is a good thing for our hobby that our hobby has systematically
>>excluded non-retirees.

>>By the way, if you disagree with what I've written, then ask yourself
>>WHY is it that HF is so overwhelmingly dominated, even on weekends, by
>>retirees?  I think you may come back to my theory.

>>As an interesting corellary to the above, the recent ARRL survey on
>>keeping the CW requirement also contained a systematic bias in favor of
>>retirees.  1) probably retirees with lots of time on their hands are the
>>ones with the leisure time to discover, and respond to, such a poll; 2)
>>the ARRL is to a very large extent comprised of retirees. (No, I don't
>>have figures, but I'll bet I'm right.)

>>--
>>Roger J. Buffington
>>W6VZV

>>USC Law, Class of '97

>>------------------------------------------------------------
>>"I want to die peacefully, in my sleep, like my Grandfather.
>>Not screaming, and in terror, like his passengers..."
>>------------------------------------------------------------

>>Warping with OS/2 Warp 4.0 and Netscape for OS/2


Oh great I get to answer the beeper in my midst using my account :)

Some learn code faster than others and some learn theory faster than
others. Code was easy for you compared to theory. theory is easy for
me compared to code.




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:12 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:04:47 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5ac9sm$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Stan Aughenbaugh <[e-mail]> wrote:

>MN Maniac wrote:
>>
>> ...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent to
>> understand and accept modern methods of communication.

>And the non-beepers are merely too stupid or too incompetant to learn
>the code.. no spine, no ambition, no creativity...
>also (heh heh heh) no HF.
>Non-beepers of the world unite  ... and whine on.
>--
>Stan KF0NC
>"90% of all statistics are made up"
I am going to delight in find this guy when the code is dead and dance
on his little head yelling " Ding dong the code is dead"
I wonder how he will feel....



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:13 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: 69 Standard Reasons To Kill The Code
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:06:13 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <5ac9vb$[e-mail]>
References: <5a8mmg$[e-mail]> <5a8rja$[e-mail]> <5a905a$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45056 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122481

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>HEY! You only mentioned me once. I am truly heart broken :)

>>P.S. Your gunna love my list

>>Eric

>I can hardly wait. Oh, and that should be 'YOU'RE' gunna love my list,
>as in 'you are'.

>73, Jim KH2D


Oh bite me :)




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:14 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Where Are Rogers Retirees ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:07:53 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <5aca2g$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4kv8$[e-mail]> <5a78nu$[e-mail]> <5a8qti$[e-mail]> <5a94rc$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>>>>Let me see if I can find a word that fits how I feel about your post..

>>>>Hmmmmmm...... BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>>>Yup BINGO says it all :)

>>>Let's hope BINGO doesn't fit Rogers post in your case, Eric.  You aren't
>>>supposed to OPERATING on HF, so hopefully you aren't talking to too
>>>many retirees on 75 meters..... Maybe you can tell how old people are by
>>>listening to them ?

>>>73, Jim KH2D

>>Well actually listening to a QSO you tend to learn alot. Like if you
>>were to read an entire post from time to time....

>I missed the word 'listening' in your post. Or is this another case of  'I se
e'
>said the blind man, then he got out his hammer and saw. You got
>hammered......... never mind. You've seen this already.   I hope.

>Now in this post, you said you 'learn alot' by listening. I assume you are
>listening to Rogers retirees, cuz you said BINGO.  So I guess I can assume th
ose
>retirees aren't so bad after all, if you are learning something by listening.
>Think about this for a minute. Pass the code test. You could probably learn a
>lot MORE from talking to them.

>But then again, if you take your own advice, and read the WHOLE post, includi
ng
>the subject, 'CW FAVORS RETIREES', then I would assume that Rogers retirees a
re
>on CW. And you couldn't learn much if they were on CW, because you can't
>understand what they are talking about.   If they are on SSB, then the subjec
t
>should be 'SSB FAVORS RETIREES'.  Or whatever.  I'll fix it. I'll change the
>subject.

>73, Jim KH2D




Don't you ever get dizzy talking  like that?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:15 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!uwm.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.datasync.com!usenet
From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:13:07 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <5acaca$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5a9t27$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Habib Delgado) wrote:

>On 31 Dec 1996 02:16:39 GMT, [e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:

>>[e-mail] (Casey) wrote:
>>>
>>>Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
>>>goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
>>>someone can come up with other examples.
>>
>>
>>"Back in the old days when we had to take our tests at an FCC office..."
>>
>>"I went to the doctor yesterday for my colostomy bag problem and he..."
>>
>>"Back in WWII, I was head Beeper and saved the world with Morse code..."
>>
>>"HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI"
>>
>>
>>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>>
>Hey, look, guys! This stupid, redneck peckerwood motherfucker can
>apparently read a newspaper, and take some of the information he picks
>up there, and then actually form it into a thought resembling a crude
>attempt at humor, while managing to offend two groups of people at the
>same time, all the while heaping embarrassment upon himself in front
>of thousands! Nice work Drew! If I were you, I would just kill myself,
>as opposed to continue the embarrassment your poor family must suffer
>at your hands daily. Get yourself a gun, put the barrel in your mouth,
>and pull the trigger. No on will miss you, and if you do it out in
>that fucking swamp you call your yard, perhaps the local scavenging
>animals will eat your body, sparing the local authorities the task of
>cleaning up the mess that would probably just be shipped off to a soap
>factory somewhere anyway.
>Your friend,
>Habib

Aw get on your camel and ride off into the sunset.

Such language.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:17 1997
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From: [e-mail] (KC5WCP)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: BEEPERBONICS (was: Hams and Ebonics)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:14:23 GMT
Organization: Datasync Internet
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <5acaem$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5a9t27$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5abcle$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: osp8.datasync.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>[e-mail] (Habib Delgado) wrote:

>>On 31 Dec 1996 02:16:39 GMT, [e-mail] (Drew Durigan) wrote:

>>>[e-mail] (Casey) wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Hams have been using Ebonics for years."I be at the home QTH."    "We
>>>>goin to the Hamfest". "We been a ham for 120 years", etc. I sure
>>>>someone can come up with other examples.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Back in the old days when we had to take our tests at an FCC office..."
>>>
>>>"I went to the doctor yesterday for my colostomy bag problem and he..."
>>>
>>>"Back in WWII, I was head Beeper and saved the world with Morse code..."
>>>
>>>"HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI HI"
>>>
>>>
>>>-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
>>>
>>Hey, look, guys! This stupid, redneck peckerwood motherfucker can
>>apparently read a newspaper, and take some of the information he picks
>>up there, and then actually form it into a thought resembling a crude
>>attempt at humor, while managing to offend two groups of people at the
>>same time, all the while heaping embarrassment upon himself in front
>>of thousands! Nice work Drew! If I were you, I would just kill myself,
>>as opposed to continue the embarrassment your poor family must suffer
>>at your hands daily. Get yourself a gun, put the barrel in your mouth,
>>and pull the trigger. No on will miss you, and if you do it out in
>>that fucking swamp you call your yard, perhaps the local scavenging
>>animals will eat your body, sparing the local authorities the task of
>>cleaning up the mess that would probably just be shipped off to a soap
>>factory somewhere anyway.
>>Your friend,
>>Habib

>That's an excellent idean, Habib. But you have to be careful how you talk
>to Spew. You give him ideas. Next thing you know he'll be posting messages
>as:

>[e-mail]

>73, Jim KH2D


Hey Jim, isn't PECKERWOOD a bit redundant?



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:18 1997
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From: "Helen and Dirk Sykes" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: This is bullshit - WAS Re: BEEPERS
Date: 31 Dec 1996 23:15:21 GMT
Organization: METRO Network
Lines: 69
Message-ID: <01bbf76f$bf7ea840$362b18ce@sykes-system>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp43.ezl.com
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_01BBF73D.74E43840
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

You said it Jim.  I couldn't have said it better.  United we conquer,
separately we WILL fall.  (Don't let the bad apples spoil the bushel)

J&J Mac <[e-mail]> wrote in article <[e-mail]>...
> Stan Aughenbaugh wrote:
> >
> > MN Maniac wrote:
> > >
> > > ...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent
to
> > > understand and accept modern methods of communication.
> >
> > And the non-beepers are merely too stupid or too incompetant to learn
> > the code.. no spine, no ambition, no creativity...
> > also (heh heh heh) no HF.
> > Non-beepers of the world unite  ... and whine on.
> > --
> > Stan KF0NC
> > "90% of all statistics are made up"
>
> Lighten up everyone! there's something for everyone in amateur radio. If
> you don't like a mode don't use it!
> if you like a mode use it! if you want more earn it. if you are happy
> with FM, stick with it. If you're happy with CW, stick with it! either
> way, a licensed user is a member of our family of radio operators and
> should be treated as such.
>
> Jim..
> KB6ZOP
>
> Find me anywhere but digital
>
------=_NextPart_000_01BBF73D.74E43840
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><p><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#000000" face=3D"Arial">You said it Jim.  I couldn't have =
said it better.  United we conquer, separately we <font =
color=3D"#FF0000"><b>WILL</b><font color=3D"#000000"> fall.  (Don't =
let the bad apples spoil the bushel)<br><br>J&J Mac <<font =
color=3D"#0000FF"><u>[e-mail]</u><font color=3D"#000000">> wrote =
in article <<font color=3D"#0000FF"><u>[e-mail]</u><font =
color=3D"#000000">>...<br>> Stan Aughenbaugh wrote:<br>> > =
<br>> > MN Maniac wrote:<br>> > ><br>> > > =
...are simply old hams who are either too ignorant or too incompetent =
to<br>> > > understand and accept modern methods of =
communication.<br>> > <br>> > And the non-beepers are merely =
too stupid or too incompetant to learn<br>> > the code.. no spine, =
no ambition, no creativity...<br>> > also (heh heh heh) no =
HF.<br>> > Non-beepers of the world unite  ... and whine =
on.<br>> > --<br>> > Stan KF0NC<br>> > "90% of =
all statistics are made up"<br>> <br>> Lighten up everyone! =
there's something for everyone in amateur radio. If<br>> you don't =
like a mode don't use it!<br>> if you like a mode use it! if you want =
more earn it. if you are happy<br>> with FM, stick with it. If you're =
happy with CW, stick with it! either<br>> way, a licensed user is a =
member of our family of radio operators and<br>> should be treated as =
such.<br>> <br>> Jim..<br>> KB6ZOP<br>> <br>> Find me =
anywhere but digital<br>> </p>
</font></font></font></font></font></font></font></body></html>
------=_NextPart_000_01BBF73D.74E43840--



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:19 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Dan Finn)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:17:55 GMT
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a2ij0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a3j8j$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6e1p$[e-mail]> <5a8cg6$[e-mail]> <5a8obm$[e-mail]>
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Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45050 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122467

On Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:47:18 GMT, [e-mail] (KC5WCP) wrote:

>
>
>So i guess the name Squiggy is not the same thing?

The full name is "Squigford". "Squiggy" is just a nickname.

>Yeah, I bet all them folks that use pantywaist and newbie and welfare
>and whinner, ad infinitum ad nauseum have the right to do so cause
>they beep and that gives them more privilege.....

The ability to beep does not assign any privileges to usenet, but it
is an interesting thought!  ;)

>yadda yadda yadda
>
73

de KR4AJ


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:20 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news.fast.net!dmarra
From: [e-mail] (David M. Marra)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Repeaters in San Fran/San Jose Area?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 18:54:13 -0500
Organization: FASTNET(tm) PA/NJ/DE Internet
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Mime-Version: 1.0
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X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.4.0

Does anyone know of any good, open 2M and/or 440 repeaters in the San
Francisco/San Jose areas?

Thanks.

DAVE


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:21 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: AC6V <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Spread Spectrum
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 16:31:59 -0800
Organization: Author
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5a4ph6$[e-mail]> <01bbf74e$d1cf3cb0$be01ba97@case100>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: esc-ca6-11.ix.netcom.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 31  6:30:31 PM CST 1996
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U)
To: [e-mail]

Kevin Jessup wrote:
>
> [e-mail] wrote in article <5a4ph6$[e-mail]>...
>
> > Greetings fellow amateurs.
> > I would like to know if there is any amateur activity, experiemental
> > or established, using spread spectrum.
> > I am curious about the technique(s) used, which band(s), etc.
> > Larry ve3fxq
> >
>
> Check out http://www.tapr.org for info on amateur SS.
>
> TAPR is really doing some great stuff with the recently
> issued STA, allowing more experimenter-friendly use of
> amateur SS.
>
> I am currently running two 115 kbaud FH SS modems
> on 900 MHz.   These are made by FreeWave.  TAPR
> is using "custom" versions of these as part of their studies.
>
> There IS amateur radio SS activity out there.   But you'd
> never know it based on all the code/nocode/license wars
> typical of this newsgroup.
>
> - Kevin, n9sqb

Also Larry see URL:
http://www.sp.nps.navy.mil:80/ss/

This and other modes are clickable on the DX Reference Page below.
--
AC6V DX Reference Page: http://www.netcom.com/~ac6v/index.html
E-Mail: [e-mail]

Hark!  For I Have Hurled My Words To The Far Reaches Of The Earth!
What King Of  Old Could Do Thus?? -- AC6V
73
Rod


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:23 1997
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From: [e-mail] (George Tamayo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Message from Pat Clawson
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 1997 00:40:00 (PST)
Organization: Infosoft Publishing Company (805-288-1414)
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (George Tamayo)
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm115-55.smartlink.net
X-mailer: PowrMAIL for PowerBBS Ver. 1.5 (Beta 6b) (rev. 1.00d)

Forwarded Message; [e-mail] (PAT CLAWSON) said to GEORGE TAMAYO

C(>George...
C(>
C(>
C(>My remarks concering BBS systems were not meant in any way as
C(>a slight against ham radio operators.  I've personally been involved
C(>in commercial broadcasting AND amateur radio activities for over
C(>20 years, and I have a very high regard for hams and recognize their
C(>public service activities and technical expertise.
C(>
C(>Still, there is a world of difference between commercial broadcasters
C(>-- who have tens of millions of dollars wrapped up in their stations
C(>-- and the local ham, who has at most several thousand dollars. I was
C(>attempting, perhaps somewhat  inartfully at a very late hour, to make
C(>a similar comparison between BBS sysops and Web site operators.
C(>
C(>I hope you will post this to those newsgroups and lists that you
C(>forwarded my original message.
C(>
C(>Regards,
C(>
C(>Pat Clawson
C(>TeleGrafix Communications
C(>
C(>
C(>

---
George M. Tamayo - WD6EJO
South Mountain Online
---
 * PowerAccess 1.50 Everyone is entitled to my opinion.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:24 1997
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From: [e-mail] (George Tamayo)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Message from Pat Clawson
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 1997 00:40:00 (PST)
Organization: Infosoft Publishing Company (805-288-1414)
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail] (George Tamayo)
NNTP-Posting-Host: pm115-55.smartlink.net
X-mailer: PowrMAIL for PowerBBS Ver. 1.5 (Beta 6b) (rev. 1.00d)

Forwarded Message; [e-mail] (PAT CLAWSON) said to GEORGE TAMAYO

C(>George...
C(>
C(>
C(>My remarks concering BBS systems were not meant in any way as
C(>a slight against ham radio operators.  I've personally been involved
C(>in commercial broadcasting AND amateur radio activities for over
C(>20 years, and I have a very high regard for hams and recognize their
C(>public service activities and technical expertise.
C(>
C(>Still, there is a world of difference between commercial broadcasters
C(>-- who have tens of millions of dollars wrapped up in their stations
C(>-- and the local ham, who has at most several thousand dollars. I was
C(>attempting, perhaps somewhat  inartfully at a very late hour, to make
C(>a similar comparison between BBS sysops and Web site operators.
C(>
C(>I hope you will post this to those newsgroups and lists that you
C(>forwarded my original message.
C(>
C(>Regards,
C(>
C(>Pat Clawson
C(>TeleGrafix Communications
C(>
C(>
C(>

---
George M. Tamayo - WD6EJO
South Mountain Online
---
 * PowerAccess 1.50 Everyone is entitled to my opinion.





From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:25 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Edg Duveyoung)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Do you have....
Date: 1 Jan 97 00:52:11 GMT
Organization: ucsd usenet gateway
Lines: 12
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mail.ucsd.edu
Originator: [e-mail]

    Do you have a Web site that is associated with your newsgroup?  If so,
please send me the URL.

                               Happy New Year!
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
x            Edg Duveyoung           x
x        http://www.iqtest.com       x
x  Self Discovery Workshop--IQ Test  x
x   The Free, Fast, & Fun IQ Test!   x
x    While you smirk, it measures!   x
x                                    x
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:26 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: 31 Dec 1996 20:06:50 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5acdba$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5abrrd$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com

In article <[e-mail]>,
        Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV <[e-mail]> wrote:

>However, I think that the difference between theory and code with
>respect to newcomers is that most people know how to study for a test,

Yeah, especially those where they know the questions in advanced. They
memorize the questions.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:27 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!205.252.116.190!feed1.news.erols.com!super.zippo.com!zdc-e!szdc!szdc-e!news
From: [e-mail] (Ben)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Tektronix C12 oscilloscope camera for sale
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 1997 01:16:24 GMT
Organization: Zip News
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <5ace9h$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Tektronix C12 Oscilloscope camera for sale - all complete. Mint
condition. Optics perfect - has Polaroid back (works perfectly).
Reasonable offers please




From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:29 1997
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From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ORIGIN OF 73 ??
Date: 1 Jan 1997 01:17:15 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 60
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
writes:

> O.K. anyone think they have the origin of the 73 in ham radio?  Have
>heard several explanations, including an early sending of the 'lucky'
>digit 7 .. and then later, the 7 and the seven backwards (3) at the
>end of transmission.....Rick  AC6QQ

The following is from Louise Ramsey Moreau, W3WRE:

"The traditional expression "73" goes right back to the beginning of the
landline telegraph days. It is found in some of the earliest editions of
the numerical codes, each with a different definition, but each with the
same idea in mind - it indicated that the end, or signature, was coming
up. But there are no data to prove that any of these were used.

"The first authentic use of 73 is in the publication The National
Telegraphic Review and Operators' Guide, first published in April 1857. At
that time, 73 meant "My love to you"! Succeeding issues of this
publication continued to use this definition of the term. Curiously
enough, some of the other numerals used then had the same definition as
they have now, but within a short time, the use of 73 began to change.

"In the National Telegraph Convention, the numeral was changed from the
Valentine-type sentiment to a vague sign of fraternalism. Here, 73 was a
greeting, a friendly "word" between operators and it was so used on all
wires.

"In 1859, the Western Union Company set up the standard "92 Code." A list
of numerals from one to 92 was compiled to indicate a series of prepared
phrases for use by the operators on the wires. Here, in the 92 Code, 73
changes from a fraternal sign to a very flowery "accept my compliments,"
which was in keeping with the florid language of that era.

"Over the years from 1859 to 1900, the many manuals of telegraphy show
variations of this meaning. Dodge's The Telegraph Instructor shows it
merely as "compliments." The Twentieth Century Manual of Railways and
Commercial Telegraphy defines it two ways, one listing as "my compliments
to you"; but in the glossary of abbreviations it is merely "compliments."
Theodore A. Edison's Telegraphy Self-Taught shows a return of "accept my
compliments." By 1908, however, a later edition of the Dodge Manual gives
us today's definition of "best regards" with a backward look at the older
meaning in another part of the work where it also lists it as
"compliments."

"Best regards" has remained ever since as the
"put-it-down-in-black-and-white" meaning of 73 but it has acquired
overtones of much warmer meaning. Today, amateurs use it more in the
manner that James Reid had intended that it be used - a "friendly word
between operators."

I hope that this helps you in some way....

73,


Charles A. Wimer
Amateur Radio Call: KC8EHA
Assistant Emergency Coordinator, Trumbull County (OH)
ARRL Official Emergency Station (OH)\


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:30 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mindspring!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!newspump.sol.net!newsfeeds.sol.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!insync!uunet!in2.uu.net!192.80.63.252!delphi.com!usenet
From: "Cecil A. Moore" <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ORIGIN OF 73 ??
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 18:27:36 -0700
Organization: Delphi Internet Services Corporation
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5ablh0$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ip51.phoenix.az.pub-ip.psi.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win16; U)

michael silva wrote:
> The way I heard it the landline telegraphers used standard two-digit
> codes to condense common words and phrases ...

Hi Mike, back in the dark ages, W5OLV (SK) had a copy of that list
of two-digit codes. I have no idea what happened to it. I got a QSL
card from a YL who scratched out 73 and wrote in 88. I went and asked
Shorty what it meant and he pulled out a list of two-digit numbers
and showed it to me. I can't remember any of the other numbers.

73, Cecil, W6RCA, OOTC


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:31 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: No Hole VHF/UHF antenna for 1997 Jeep Grand Cherokee?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 20:58:03 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv15.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.antenna:33474 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122450

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> Does anyone have any great ideas for this vehicle?  I've mounted a
> Kenwood TM941, and am interested in placing an antenna which will at
> least give me two of my three favorite bands.
>
> There's the on-glass possibility, or one of these all-way adjustables on
> the hatch.
>
> Anyone have any other ideas?
>
> -Bob
> WA2WLH/7
>

Best bet would be a triband antenna (if you're working all three bands)
and something along the lines of a Diamond k400 or a comet rs-820 mount
--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:32 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!mr.net!news.sgi.com!news.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 20:58:11 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5abbbb$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv15.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] says...
>
> Wrong.  'Beepers' are those who refuse to accept and embrace modern
> technology, attempting to keep ham radio from advancing accordingly.

And wrong again.  You describe LUDDITES, not beepers.  As Carl, he'll
tell you.



--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:33 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!EU.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!jupiter.planet.net!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Steve - KF2TI (Landing, NJ))
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: A Proposal: No-code HF General
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 20:58:16 -0500
Organization: Planet Access Networks - Stanhope, NJ
Lines: 78
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <58v4b0$[e-mail]> <58vomi$[e-mail]> <59uiah$[e-mail]> <59v0rg$[e-mail]> <59vn1u$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a6b0o$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5ac82l$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: denv15.planet.net
X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v1.01

In article <5ac82l$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
> >I've left in your original post.  Help me out here.  Where did you
> >specifically mention HF??  OHHH qualifiers are now in place.  I C said
> >the blind man as he took out his hammer and saw.  Make a statement, get
> >hammered than say.."I didn't mean to say that, I meant to say this??"
> >Sorry, like a dodo bird...doesn't fly.


> Yeah whatever

Good comeback

>
> >If you knew that speeds were limited on HF (as it is HF that will
> >affected by the removal of the code requirement), why ever mention it in
> >the first place, other than to troll for flames.

> Speeds are limited on HF only because the FCC says so.


Gee..seems like a good enuf reason to most.  Probably also limited to
things like propogation, data copmpression..you know things that really
don't matter to someone who thinks HF is for sissies anyway.

> >The 2nd statement..loved it..the military and others.   A big SO WHAT.
> >We are not the military, they can do things we've can only dream and as
> >pointed out, the other must mean commercial communications interests.
> >HMMMM  CARL'S AGENDA, the commercialization of the ARS..play for pay.  As
> >pointed out, to allow some of the previously mentioned datamodes would
> >require the change from Amateur to Professional radio service.


> Seeing as how I have no interest in commercial communications you
> above statement is merely percieved as a troll for flames.

You advocate major increases in dataspeed.  Carl advocates increases in
dataspeed.  Carl foresees people using Amateur bands with T1 lines
surfing the internet.  Something that can only be done if the rules are
changed to allow commercial access on the amateur bands

As stated before, when it comes to trolling for flames, you seem to be
the up and coming expert.


> >We are the AMATEUR RADIO SERVICE.  we are not the military, we are not
> >AT&T, MicroSoft, etc etc.  Remember it, learn it, love it

> I do.
> Nope I guess hams never invented anything the military ever used.
> Nope. Hams were never innovators of technology or the forerunners of
> the electronic art. Nope.

Actually if you read Len's posting, as others, you find that the ARS is
primarily a user of existing technologies, AM, FM, SSB, CW.  I can see
the military using try amateur inovations.. SSTV, packet..you know the
true speed demons of communications.  Len's posts can be read on
dejanews.  I suggest you spend some quality time there.

BTW, why is it that you need HF access when you continually type that HF
is for sissies??

Next time research before typing.  It helps others reading your posts
that you actually have something interesting to say


--
Steve KF2TI
ARRL LIFE Member

BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN OOHHHHHH
OUT WHERE THE INDIAN'S YOU'RE FRIEND  OOOHHHH

WHERE THE VEGATABLES ARE GREEN
AND YOU CAN PEE INTO THE STREAM (and that's important you know)

I'M BACK TO THE SHADOWS AGAIN

doors open in 5 minutes


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:34 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!dciteleport.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.lobo.net!news
From: Mark Fossum <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 20:05:48 -0600
Organization: Lobo Net
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: 134.129.253.80
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)

Richard Furuta wrote:
>
> So now I'm curious.... Why are folks abandoning 2x1 callsigns in favor of
> 1x2's?  I've noticed a number of individuals doing this.  I noticed one chan
ge
> a while back where some guy was vacating what looked like an older vanity 1x
2
> callsign (with his initials) for a newer 1x2 with some unrecognizable
> connection.  What's the "desirability hierarchy" of these shorter calls?
>
>                                         --Rick
>                                           K3IV
>                                           [e-mail]

Would you be interested in turning your 1X2 in for a 2X1? Or possibly a
1X3 or a 2X3?????

Then ask yourself the same question.

Mark - N0NSV



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:36 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!165.87.194.248!news-m01.ny.us.ibm.net!news-s01.ca.us.ibm.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The CW Requirement Favors Retirees
Date: 1 Jan 1997 02:20:25 GMT
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <5achl9$oq8$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0eon$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a2fgu$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a4cek$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5a8b4p$[e-mail]> <5a8m1t$qhe$[e-mail]> <5a8uph$[e-mail]> <5a974v$[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: slip129-37-205-182.in.us.ibm.net
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 2.0

In <5a974v$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Bill Sohl) writes:
>[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:
>
>>[e-mail] wrote:
>
>>>  Here's a thought, if a fraction of the time wasted on internet traffic re
ading
>>> and commenting was used on CW self education (get on the air), the issue
>>> would be dead.
>>>                                                                  Jim W9LZ
>
>>We have said that a thousand times, Jim.  It just doesn't sink in.  Why work

>>when you can wait ? Hope keeps some people alive.
>
>At the risk of having another response from Jim, the above
>fails to note that many of us have "been there, done that."
>All those that advocate the end of code testing are not
>codeless individuals.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Bill Sohl  K2UNK
>ARRL Local Gov't Liaison, Mt. Olive Township, NJ
>

 You know Bill, I could take it or leave it myself. I'd much rather see a
 comprehensive test, like explaining how 'radio' works, and at least be
 able to put together a block diagram radio. Have a clue as to how to
 tune an antenna, understand basic propagation. Memorizing a question
 pool isn't quite comprehensive enough.
                                                             Jim W9LZ


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:37 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!204.127.130.5!worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [e-mail](michael silva)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: ORIGIN OF 73 ??
Date: 1 Jan 1997 02:55:44 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <5acjng$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <5ablh0$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: val-ca1-06.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Dec 31  8:55:44 PM CST 1996

In <[e-mail]> "Cecil A. Moore" <[e-mail]>
writes:

>Hi Mike, back in the dark ages, W5OLV (SK) had a copy of that list
>of two-digit codes. I have no idea what happened to it. I got a QSL
>card from a YL who scratched out 73 and wrote in 88. I went and asked
>Shorty what it meant and he pulled out a list of two-digit numbers
>and showed it to me. I can't remember any of the other numbers.

Hey Cecil, you must've been some sweet beeper back then.  I can just
see the Gil cartoon:  Cecil, cowlick in full glory, sitting in front of
his Novice Special station with hot QSL card in hand (88's, lipstick,
etc), scratching his head in total bewilderment.  The caption reads:
"One of the few topics *not* covered in the Handbook."

73,
Mike, KK6GM



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:38 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!info.cs.uofs.edu!news.ultranet.com!news-out.communique.net!mr.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.emi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!206.149.24.18!excalibur.flash.net!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Jim Chandler)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: VANITY CALLSIGNS
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 1997 03:25:04 GMT
Organization: Flashnet Communications, http://www.flash.net
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aa6hk$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]> <5aagjt$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
NNTP-Posting-Host: ssh1-68.flash.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230

Phil Wheeler <[e-mail]> wrote:

>There was an interesting article on calls, their histor and "hierachy"
>in a 1994 QST.
>
>This is VERY subjective, but:
>
>       o 1x2 preferred to 2x1
>       o W prefix preferred to K
>       o K prefix preferred to N
>       o 1x3 preferred to 2x2
>
>All this relates to when that type of call was first issued, I suspect.
>W calls were first, then K then N.  1x2's came before 2x1's.  1x3's came
>before 2x2's, etc.
>

How do you figure that 1x3's came before 2x2's since they are
different classes of calls?

Personally, I think that there should have been a gate 5 and that no
club calls (short of a deceased family member allowing a club to use a
deceased hams call) should have been issued prior to this gate.

Just my opinion.  73 and Happy New Year.

N0VH


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:39 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pen-14.sprintlink.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!paperboy.ids.net!anomaly.ideamation.com!anomaly.ideamation.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Michael P. Deignan)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Do you Believe in Magic ?
Date: 31 Dec 1996 22:27:17 -0500
Organization: The Ace Tomato Company
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <5aclil$[e-mail]>
References: <5a0tsf$ari$[e-mail]> <5a8ogo$[e-mail]> <5abbee$[e-mail]> <5ac8pf$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: anomaly.ideamation.com
Xref: news1.epix.net rec.radio.amateur.policy:45048 rec.radio.amateur.misc:122464

[e-mail] (Jim Kehler) wrote:

>>STD's are free. Last time I passed the line by the bordello I heard
>>this strange beeping comming from the line.....
>
>Where else but in Mississippi would they have a line for a bordello......

From what I hear it only happens on days when all the sheep are busy.

MD
--
--
--  "Guns don't kill people. I kill people." -- T-shirt slogan
--
--  If you don't like my opinions, that's just too damn bad.


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:40 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!cliffs.rs.itd.umich.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: The Importance of Our ARRL
Date: 1 Jan 1997 03:34:31 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 13
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader

In article <[e-mail]>, "Roger J. Buffington, W6VZV"
<[e-mail]> writes:

>I may grouse at the League (hey,
>that's one of the privileges of membership) but I am a member, and a
>supporter, and always will be.  The League is our only true voice with
>the FCC.  Every time I read some of the scary proposals regarding
>frequency allocations, I thank the stars that the League is there to
>guard our interests.  And that's no fooling.

Truer words never spoken. If you are not a member, please condiser
becoming one. It is our ONE AND ONLY TRUE VOICE.



From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:41 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 01 Jan 97 04:12:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: END OF THE CODE DEBATE
Lines: 11


 >Ok So what are your accomplishments that makes you better than us
 >wannabes?

No one said anything about being better, just TRYING HARDER.  How hard
have you tried lately?

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.mindspring.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 01 Jan 97 04:12:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: ALL
Subject: Re: WORK AND GET A REWARD
Lines: 16


(Continued from previous message)

apartment though.  In the end, learning the code is working smart, hard
and showing character.  Work is noble and good, it makes you a better
person.  The "something for nothing crowd" is spoiled.  Ham radio is not
dying, rather it's the moral character of this country with it's liberal
acceptance of the welfare mentality.  Thank goodness we have a
wonderful Republican Mayor in the City of New York and excellent
Governor in the States of New Jersey and New York who are
turning the tide on this disease.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:42 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 01 Jan 97 04:12:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: BEEPERS
Lines: 11


SA>And the non-beepers are merely too stupid or too incompetant to learn
  >the code.. no spine, no ambition, no creativity...
  >also (heh heh heh) no HF.

And too pre-occupied with Nintendo.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:43 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news4.epix.net!cdc2.cdc.net!news.texas.net!news-xfer.netaxs.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!mindspring!uunet!in3.uu.net!198.6.114.27!intac!magsystems!cybernet!roland.stiner
From: [e-mail] (Roland Stiner)
Date: 01 Jan 97 04:12:00 GMT
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
X-FTN-To: [e-mail]
Organization: MAG Systems, Inc/TFP BBS
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: END OF THE CODE DEBAT
Lines: 10


M>The Morse requirement will be challenged on grounds of discrimination.


This is an example of the "victim hood" line of defense.

---
   OLX 1.53   PRIVATE REPLIES?  TO E-MAIL ADDRESS: [e-mail]

--


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:44 1997
Path: news1.epix.net!news3.epix.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!152.163.170.17!newstf01.news.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: SPEW IS A MANIAC !!!!---Jimmy makes an AMAZING discovery!!
Date: 1 Jan 1997 04:13:37 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <5achhj$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com
X-Admin: [e-mail]

>O. IC. Said the blind man. And then he took out his hammer and saw.
>And after you get hammered, you come around with this as an excuse.

Sorry, Jimmy...seems you're the one with egg on your face this time.
Making such an AMAZING discovery...actually finding out the true identity
of someone on AOL ("in cognito", to quote you directly) when he posts his
full name and location on his Member's Profile...and then bragging about
your AMAZING discovery here for all to read.  Better widen your mouth a
bit, Jimmy...your foot just barely fits in there all the way.

>You have been posting all your one line hatefull bullshit in the ham
newsgroups
>with a different account and without signing your name to it just to see
how
>long it would take ME to figure out it was you.

You or one of your fellow beepers.  I know that those who whine endlessly
on here about the no-coders being "too lazy" to learn the code are
themselves some of the laziest individuals alive.  Witness the paunchy
stomachs, expanding waistlines, and lack of initiative to embrace new
technologies and save the future of ham radio from premature extinction.
I figured it would be awhile before any of them actually mustered the
neccessary effort to actually click on "Get a Member's Profile" in order
to see if maybe, just maybe there was a name attatched.  Again, it took 29
days for someone to put forth the effort.  Pretty ironic, isn't it?


>OH. OK. Sure. IC. It was just a test. OK. Sure.  I got it now.

yes.  And you failed miserably.  Maybe next time you'll do better.


>you win. Now jump in your 1977 Buick and cruzzzz back over to the CB
>newsgroup.

Can't read well either, can you?  Here's a refresher: the Cutlass that I
mention in my profile was made by OLDSMOBILE, not Buick.  Sorry.  Looks
like you lose this round, too.  C'mon, Jimmy...you have to be able to do
SOMETHING else well in life besides beeping...can't you?









-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day'
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:45 1997
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From: [e-mail] (MN Maniac)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: Hams and Ebonics
Date: 1 Jan 1997 04:15:45 GMT
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>Beats cleaning restrooms at the local AM station, I'm sure.

Never cleaned the restrooms; I wouldn't know.

BTW, Jimmy, what's this fascination you seem to have with my occupation?
Are you another one of those guys who always wanted to be in radio but
couldn't cut it?  Maybe that's why you became a beeper; your voice wasn't
good enough to command attention or respect (?)

-Drew in Sunny Central Florida-
 WOTS/AM-1220/Orlando
 'All 70s All Day'
 KF4DDM On the Ham Bands


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:47 1997
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From: [e-mail] (Jacqueline Herman)
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Book FS: Spread Spectrum Communications Handbook
Date: 1 Jan 97 04:43:51 GMT
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Spread Sprectrum Communications Handbook, by Simon, Omura, Scholtz, and
Levitt, 1994 (revised edition), 1228 pages. This appears to be written
for MSEEs and EE graduate students. Very good condition. $30 + shipping.

From the back cover:  "The most complete reference in the field - now
available in a single volume... In the past decade, SS systems have
found imprtant new commercial applications in CDMA cellular networks and
wireless personal communication networks. Communications engineers and
technicians now have ready access to a wealth of SS information in this
updated, one-volume sourcebook Formerly released as a three-volume set,
the Handbook remains the most comprehensive and authoritative compendium
on SS systems available anywhere.
   "Written by recognized authorities in the field, the Handbook presents
both theoretical basics and practical applications, providing succinct,
results-oriented solutions to engineering problems. Starting with basic
concepts and system models, the book covers anti-jamming communication
systems, coherent direct-sequence systems, noncoherent frequency-hopped
systems, coherent and differentially coherent modulation techniques,
pseudonoise acquisition and tracking in direct-sequence receivers,
and low probability of intercept communications. In addition, it offers
an in-depth look at multiple access communications and positioning
systems applications."

ISBN 0-07-057629-7

Read it from cover to cover; I'll stay with CW.

Jeff KH2PZ / 7


From [e-mail] Thu Jan 02 21:01:48 1997
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From: Howard <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.misc
Subject: Re: SPEW IS A MANIAC !!!!---Jimmy makes an AMAZING discovery!!
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 1996 23:57:17 -0500
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Drew -

Do you copy code?  If not, why do you not listen when those with
experience tell you  that it's a good thing, and a lot of fun, and has
gotten through in bad S/N when voice couldn't (which has helped a lot of
people)?  Why has it been maintained in the law for so long?  Are all
who have gone before you idiots?

What possible good would it accomplish to strike the code requirement?
Remember what happened with CB - what would really be the difference?

And regardless of the code question, why do you post like white trash?
Surely consideration for others in your writing will not detract from
your ideas.

Howard.

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<DT>Drew -</DT>

<DT> </DT>

<DT>Do you copy code?  If not, why do you not listen when those with
experience tell you  that it's a good thing, and a lot of fun, and
has gotten through in bad S/N when voice couldn't (which has helped a lot
of people)?  Why has it been maintained in the law for so long?
Are all who have gone before you idiots?</DT>

<DT> </DT>

<DT>What possible good would it accomplish to strike the code requirement?&nbs
p;
Remember what happened with CB - what would really be the difference?</DT>

<DT> </DT>

<DT>And regardless of the code question, why do you post like white trash?&nbs
p;
Surely consideration for others in your writing will not detract from your
ideas.</DT>

<DT> </DT>

<DT>Howard.</DT>

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