(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Good, busy with work, going crazy actually!
(11-6,Jim K.) (smile) me too! a quick question re: overloading
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) ok, shoot
(11-6,Jim K.) if i have item::read(), weapon::read(), and sword::read() can sword::read()
(11-6,Jim K.) call weapon::read()?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) yes, by using scope resolution the way you wrote it.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) read is virtual, right?
(11-6,Jim K.) yes, it's virtual. THat's the only way I could see doing the read() methods
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) that sounds like the way to do it. And yes it's pretty common to...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) call the parent class' version of a virtual function... let's you...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) extend function.
(11-6,Jim K.) got it. So sword would first call weapon which first calls item and so forth.
(11-13,David Boynton) Hello?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Yup. You can call it in any order you like, you got the idea.
(11-6,Jim K.) David!
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Hi David!
(11-6,Jim K.) thanks, bob
(11-13,David Boynton) Hi, all.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Graphics stuff looks great, I didn't realize you had done that PCX...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) stuff before.
(11-13,David Boynton) Thanks, yeah, but that stuff was a while back.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) If Patrick makes it we'll see what he thought and if he can...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) incorporate it into window.
(11-13,Dave B.) Ok. Have I missed anything?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Nope, just answering a few quick questions... if we have a large...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) turnout we'll go formal.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Hiya Mark! Glad you could make it! Get my email?
(11-10,MarkB) I did indeed, I'm only popping in for a few moments while my hair
(11-10,MarkB) dries <g>
(11-10,MarkB) Then it's bed time
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) he he, right... it's late.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Did you reply or want to discuss it here?
(11-10,MarkB) Not too late only 14:00, but I did a 15hr shift on Sunday
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Hi Mike, glad you could make it!
(11-13,Mike E) Hi guys. What's up
(11-10,MarkB) and I've not caught up my sleep yet
(11-10,MarkB) I have replied -
(11-10,MarkB) You've not got the latest scripter here, but I'd prefer to C
(11-10,MarkB) the translation through myself
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mike - discussing Rehack, here for that?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Ok Mark, sounds good to me, if you get stuck let us know.
(11-13,Mike E) yes, I am, what kind of format were you usaing for who does what , or is it free for all?
(11-10,MarkB) I will - though I doubt if I'll understand any response
(11-10,MarkB) Encapsulate the sprogget in the predicate incongruity
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) I like to have them be formal CONS, just waiting to see who shows...
(11-10,MarkB) <G>
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) up... giving them a few more minutes.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mark - that's right! <g>
(11-10,MarkB) Whatever happened to straight Kernighan and Ritchie C ??
(11-6,Jim K.) no challenge, mark <g>
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mark - hehe I guess Bjarne got a hold of it.
(11-10,MarkB) ANSI++
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) OK, might as well get started...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) I wanted to get together to see how everyone's doing and discuss...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) directions for the next few months... the pieces are sort of coming...
(11-13,Mike E) Are you doing this as a pick an area and run with it, or have responsibilities been delegated?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) together, such as they are <g>... First off I'd like to go around...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) the table and here a quick synopsis from everyone.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mike E - sort of both, delegated by request. We'll be trying to run...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) the cons formally, you can go first with a list of questions if you...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) like.
(11-13,Mike E) What I meant was programming tasks, how is that being done?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mike - we've outlined some very rough and basic classes that we'd...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) like to use ti build up the game system, graphics, events, windows,...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) etc etc.... they are listed and very briefly outlined in...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) RHDES.TXT...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) basically I solicit requests from people who are interested in...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) various classes and assign the reponsibilities.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Jim is working on an item hierarchy...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Dave a graphics class...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) I've taken on containers because I think we need them as soon as...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) possible...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mark is working on conversation scripting.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) ga Mike
(11-13,Mike E) So its I'veMark's area is what I was going to ask about...
(11-13,Mike E) I though that would be a great addition to a CGRP, with a good parser ga
(11-10,MarkB) Mark's listening
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mike - it's already been assigned... and I'd like to think that each...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) person owns hhis area, so if he needs some assistance, or if it's...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) offered he is free to go ahead with it.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) However, I think that area can pretty much be handled by one person,...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) are there any other areas you're interested in?
(11-13,Mike E) What kind of parser have you been working on? ga
(11-10,MarkB) The conversation scripter isn't strictly an input parser
(11-10,MarkB) not as per text adventure games (though if it's wanted, I do
(11-10,MarkB) have one, in Pascal)
(11-13,Mike E) OK, what areas havent bWhats available?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Have you seen the design sketch and the docs?
(11-13,Mike E) I looked at the RHDES.TXT right before I sent you mail, havent looked at new one...
(11-13,Mike E) I skimmed through it.. ga
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) OK, well for now most of the basic stuff has been assigned. I...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) can't think of anything off the top of my head. I'd encourage you...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) to stick around... for now here's a list of who's doing what:
(11-9,Dave B.) <!>
(11-13,Mike E) What platform is the game going to be designed for...
(11-10,MarkB) !
(11-13,Mike E) I saw one of the cons talking about networks ga
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mike - PC DOS
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Dave - ga
(11-9,Dave B.) Bob, you forgot to ask him if he's interested in art!
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Ooops, geeez, that's the one area we really need help in!
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mike?
(11-13,Mike E) Is I'm not not that good at art...
(11-6,Jim K.) !
(11-9,Dave B.) darn <g>
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) ga MarkB
(11-10,MarkB) Most of the early elements are under control, but no-one is
(11-10,MarkB) yet looking at things like the magic system. I know it's for a
(11-10,MarkB) later phase - but are we going to stick to the simplistic Hack
(11-10,MarkB) system, or perhaps Mike would want to design and code something
(11-10,MarkB) more like mixing potions or runestones
(11-10,MarkB) or even something original <g>
(11-10,MarkB) ga
(11-13,Mike E) Sure, I'll run the idea around (for something original)...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) I guess it's possible to think of a magic system in general terms...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) my feeling was that it'd be difficult to do any of those things...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) without item, being, monster etc classes as a basis, but you can...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) always design in terms of what features you;d like to support
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) ga Mike, then Jim
(11-13,Mike E) How detailed is theWhat is the detail level of the game going to be?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) not sure what you mean.
(11-13,Mike E) I know you want graphics but is there any more detailed descriptions, interactions etc planned?
(11-9,Dave B.) <.>
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) No, if you mean object/class interactions mapped out, no there isn't...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) a detailed design spec. It's being left up to the authors. If you...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) mean in terms of playing the game, again no we've layed it out as a...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) CRPG and started with some basics but haven't discussed any more...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) than that.
(11-13,Mike E) And its a design what you want to support kind of deal?
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Mike - sort of although not that free-for-all. We'd like you to...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) propose what you're going to do in the forum before actually...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) implementing it.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Anyone who needs something specific from your class should speak up.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Ok? If so, ga Jim.
(11-6,Jim K.) I was going to mention that sound (not music per se, but a sound system) ...
(11-6,Jim K.) and story have yet to be done (besides the general layout in the docs) ga
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Kirk Bateman has expressed intereest in that, but I'm not sure if...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) he's actually going to do it or not/
(11-10,MarkB) Bye folks, must dash. My hair's dry now <g>
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) MarkB is tossing around some story ideas too, no reason why several...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) people couldn't do that.
(11-6,Jim K.) well, if mike is gonna do magic, i have some need for it in my items ga
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Ok Mark seeya
(11-6,Jim K.) bye mark
(11-13,Mike E) bye Mark
(11-9,Dave B.) later Mark.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Ok, if Mike's interested in it you too can discuss the magic/item...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) class interactions...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) also involve Peter Baily who's doing characters.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Dave ga
(11-13,Mike E) I'm up for it...
(11-9,Dave B.) I was going to suggest some kind of "story" class, where an image would be
(11-9,Dave B.) displayed along with text underneath; would be useful for special interactions, not
(11-9,Dave B.) to mention magical effects. ga
(11-6,Jim K.) !
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) OK then it's yours if no one objects.
(11-1,Patrick Reilly) Sorry I'm late
(11-13,Mike E) !
(11-9,Dave B.) ga
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) HOw would the "story" window be invoked? Is it like a close up?
(11-9,Dave B.) Some of what Mike was saying made me think of it; I thought that might've been
(11-9,Dave B.) what he was getting at.
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Sounds like something connected to an item object.
(11-13,Mike E) Partially, I wasn't thinking of graphics per say, but a flag to descriptions
(11-6,Jim K.) !!
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Jim - is that what you were going to say, ga --
(11-6,Jim K.) actually, i wasn't thinking about the connection to items (though it is ...
(11-6,Jim K.) obvious <g>), but it would be extremely useful in "cut" scenes ga
(11-13,Mike E) and heavy descriptions of objects and ability to manipulate in more than a graphical format.. (text combined)
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) So it's basically a specialized case of a window that has maybe a...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) graphics and text portion, which can also derive say an item closeup...
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) or view window?
(11-6,Jim K.) i think it would be a whole-screen thing and temporary in nature
(11-13,Mike E) I was thinking separate windows, having a graphic view, a text description and a text parser for interaction
(11-9,Dave B.) Nothing definite in my mind; I wasn't actually claiming it, just throwing it out. ga
(11-5,Bob P/HOST) Ok sounds like something we can definitely make use of, ga Pat.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Can I get a quicky of what's discussed so I don't have to listen for 5 minutes? <g>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - ok here's the quick synopsis.
(11-6,Jim K.) pat wants a summary
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Mike E was asking how we assigned responsibilities...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) he's expressed an interest in doing something to do with magic which I assume would be c
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) classes to handle both magical items and magic spells...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) then the idea of the Story window popped up.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Is that about it guys?
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ga
(11-13,Mike E) Sounds good to me...
(11-6,Jim K.) nod
(11-9,Dave B.) yup.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ok, did you have anything new Pat, ga.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Shouldn't we have the major pieces in place before we get into particulars? Remember, I'm no game designer... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Yeah we should... I think we need to have most of the basics in...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) place, _and_ basics for items & characters...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) but it is possible to start thinking about the capabilities of those...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) classes and what you'd need from the others to support your class.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ga
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Good ol' top-down approach <g>. True: items, etc are pretty much stand-alone (don't need display)
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - agree? disagree?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Agree
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) I'm pressed for time currently, but resources almost done.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Next in the framework I see would be verifying window (screen) layout... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Ok, great, everyone want to give a synopsis of what they're...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) doing?...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Yes pat, and towards that end David has gotten pretty far with the...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) graphics as you know.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Who wants to start?
(11-6,Jim K.) !
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ga Jim
(11-6,Jim K.) I'll start, because i probably have the least to say :( ... Flag templates are...
(11-6,Jim K.) close to being done (it's amazing how much wierdness comes out when u actually...
(11-6,Jim K.) have to use the damn things <g>) ... Items are progressing, I'm formulating...
(11-6,Jim K.) a read() method, and am currently debating whether I need to derive armor from...
(11-6,Jim K.) clothing or just put 'em all in there ... that's about it ... ga
(11-9,Dave B.) !
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) On the armor/clothing thing...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) what differentiates armor from clothing (as you pointed out to me...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) early on)... anything?
(11-6,Jim K.) i can't think of a darned thing <g>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Me neither <g>. If anyone does please alert Jim <g>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ga Dave.
(11-9,Dave B.) I'm nearly done with bitmap,pcx,&display classes. I uploaded a "beta" version to
(11-9,Dave B.) Bob & Pat for review, but it still has too many bugs for prime-time. The bitmap
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) <comment>
(11-9,Dave B.) class supports 256 color pcx files, vga files (as used by MVP Paint) and img files
(11-9,Dave B.) (as used by ACK). I've also got a utility to remap the palette in a pcx file to another
(11-9,Dave B.) palette, to keep a group of files from different sources from having different pals.
(11-9,Dave B.) ga
(11-6,Jim K.) ?
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Sounds good, ga Pat.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) I haven't had a chance yet to look at Dave's file... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I've looked at it briefly. I will post any comments I do have, but...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I think it'll be more important for you guys to discuss it because...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) of the close relationship between window and graphics classes.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Jim, ga.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) !
(11-6,Jim K.) dave - does the palette remap do matching? (as Butthead says) "that would be cool" <g> ga
(11-9,Dave B.) ? It uses a "least sum of squares" fit, if that's what you mean. ga
(11-6,Jim K.) nod
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) You had a follow up Pat?
(11-9,Dave B.) ?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) What I'd like in the framework is two major functionalities: having the framework do most of the ...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) behind-the-scenes work of updating the screen, but also allowing...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) the individual window to do direct screen accessing if speed is needed...
(11-9,Dave B.) transform ? into !
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) in particular would be action sequences, etc. This is where the framework and the bitmap classes need to work together the most... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ga Dave
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Dave - ga
(11-9,Dave B.) "direct ..." right, I was going to mention that: You can choose to create a direct
(11-9,Dave B.) bitmap or not, once constructed, you'd paint to just the same, then do a
(11-9,Dave B.) "putBitmap()". The direct bitmap just ignores this call, so the majority of your code
(11-9,Dave B.) doesn't have to know if it's direct or not...
(11-9,Dave B.) Also, at any time, you can create a direct bitmap which is a subset of the display
(11-9,Dave B.) and paint directly into it.
(11-9,Dave B.) ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat, how's that sound?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) The one think I found playing with ACK-like displays is that we want to avoid...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) as much as possible doing screen "building" direct to video memory...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Its very slow compared to building a bitmap and just writing that...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) in one big chunk to the screen. For ACK-type 3D, we're talking multiples...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) ga
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Oops - we're talking multiples of FPSs... ga
(11-9,Dave B.) !
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Right. I agree. Dave, I didn't look that closely, so a few...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) questions...
(11-9,Dave B.) ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) are we buffering updates off-screen?...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) when a direct bitmap is created is it a physical bitmap or just a...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) mapping into the display and/or off-screen buffer...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) do you have plans for incorporating mouse pointer into the class? ga
(11-9,Dave B.) buffering..either, dungeon2 checks for command line switch, ...
(11-9,Dave B.) direct ...maps into display, no static off-screen buffer, ...
(11-9,Dave B.) mouse...I've been thinking about that. Did we need that next? ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I'm not sure about next, but updating the mouse pointer becomes...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) problematic when also trying to buffer updates.... I was wondering...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) if you'd begun to consider how to do it.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) !
(11-6,Jim K.) ??
(11-9,Dave B.) I've considered it, but not enough to discuss it in detail yet. ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Patrick ga
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) On mouse pointer...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Again from playing with ACK, I'd suggest that we use a permanent off-screen buffer...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) and have the mouse class draw into this. What would be nice...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) is if the buffer had logic to "hide" and "show" the mouse...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) IOW the mouse would give the buffer a mouse bitmap, and have flags...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) to show/hide. Reasoning here...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) is that when you're trying to make screen updates...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) you either are constantly hiding/showing the mouse...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) if this were built into the buffer, it could be the one...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) who's ensuring that if part of the mouse cursor gets painted over...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) it will get refreshed by the current mouse bitmap... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I think there maybe a problem with that if the mouse moves and the...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) screen is dirty, but the class doesn't want to have it updated...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) yet. Maybe write the mouse to the screen but also to the buffer as...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) the last step before a screen update?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) I was thinking more of having...
(11-9,Dave B.) "draw into this", into this, or after it? If the mouse never draws into the buffer, your
(11-9,Dave B.) hide/restore problems disappear. Just put the buffer to the screen, then do
(11-9,Dave B.) mouse.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) the mouse just pass a bitmap to the buffer and update the buffer...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) as its moved, etc...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Hmm... Dave, good point... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Dave - that may flicker a little, I was thinking along the same...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) lines but draw the mouse into the buffer (if it is in the current...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) update region) right before moving it to the screen.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - I think your's may have problems keeping the two in sync.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Jim - what was your comment?
(11-6,Jim K.) was a novice question that has been answered (along the lines of "I thought ...
(11-6,Jim K.) the mouse driver handled all this ..." ) ga
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) !
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat -do you see my point or am I missing something, ga Pat.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) I think you missed my point...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) What I'm suggesting is that the mouse not draw *anything*...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Instead, it would just "register" its bitmap to the buffer...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) and up let the buffer handle it...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Since we can let the buffer process messages...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) It can grab mouse-move messages...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) and move th bitmap about as it likes...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Whenever we write other data to the buffer, the buffer...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) would check to see if the mouse region got painted - if so...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) it repaints the mouse. ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Right, then I do understand what you're proposing... does this imply...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) the buffer is regularly updating the screen on ticks or something?...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I was under the impression we would only update atintervals when...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) necessary.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) If so, it works, but if the user controls screen updating then...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) that's where I see the problem (user meaning class user)...
(11-9,Dave B.) Hate to leave in the middle like this, but the wife needs a ride. Later folks.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Bye Dave
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) If the buffer is in the process of being built, and the mouse moves,...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) either the mouse won;t be updated, or the screen will be prematurely...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) updated... or partially uupdated where the mouse was. See what I...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) mean?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Bob, I see your point. The alternatives I've seen is to let the mouse driver do its thing, but also paint into the buffer...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) this eliminates flicker. But then there's the sync problem... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Ahh, you mean both to the screen and the buffer?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Yes, both - again, care is required to keep them aligned, since...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) the mouse is moving inthe "background"... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) That's what I mean... it's not necessary to constantly update the...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) mouse in the buffer... if it is current on the screen (mouse moves...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) go directly to the screen) then we only need update the buffer right...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) before it's going to the screen, no?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Right - that makes sense. ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) OK Dave's gone anyway<g>
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) <G>
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) !
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - you mentioned the resource stuff... ok go ahead.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Well, I was just going to my synopsis stuff...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) For the record if nothing else <g>...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Not much has changed on the framework itself -
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) I need the bitmap classes to go any further...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) For the resources: the basics are all in place -
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) what I need to do to finish them is to add all the goofy
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) insertion and extraction operators to make things nice; so that
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) things like:
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) file << arg1 << arg2...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) can be used. Other than that, I haven't gotten much done in the past
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) week or so... ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Me neither <g> On a project deadline at work...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) What I've been doing is trying to recruit some local art talent but...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Is there just you, me and Jim left? ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) not having much left...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) much luck I mean, and Mike E also...
(11-13,Mike E) !
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I think containers are important so that everyone can use them as...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) needed as well as a general string class...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Someone has been assigned the containers, but I;ve begun converting...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) my own non-template classes to templated for the project...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) A string class has not been assigned, but since I guess it's not too...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) appealing for a game project<g> I'm just going to convert one of mine.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Mike E - go ahead.
(11-13,Mike E) I know a good artist, i approached a while back...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) (personally I despise string classes... <g>)
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - I could have predicted that! <g>
(11-13,Mike E) but he didn't take too well to computer art, any ideas on making it easier?
(11-6,Jim K.) scanners!
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Mike E - we had a computer illiterate at one of my jobs (hehe yeah...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) scanners!) we bought her a pen mouse and she did OK, other than...
(11-13,Mike E) Sorry, dont have $$$$$$$'s to blow...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Is that "Scanners" the movie, or Scanners, the hardware.. <g>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) that I have no idea... maybe a MacIntosh? <g>
(11-6,Jim K.) no, i have a scanner
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Mike - I'm not up on paint programs...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Deluxe Paint seems to be popular.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - on the subjects of strings... I like the idea of isolating...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ourselves from the potential problems associated with char* vs....
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Strings... usually using the a String class is a PITA but worth...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) it... thats my philosophy anyway.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Bob, I've heard all the args for String class - I just prefer to handle something as simple as char arrays in their base type...
(11-6,Jim K.) ?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Oops - ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Hmm, maybe you can come up with some recommendations where Strings...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) are inappropriate? I like to use them except where I'm passing in...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) const char*'s
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) ga
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Its the overhead, the goofy () operator, and consistency (every lib seems to have a String class) ga
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I don't think the four of us need to stay formal, so go ahead...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) everyone
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - yeah the inconsistency bugs me too, not sure what you mean by...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) the () operator, you mean the conversion operator.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) <g>
(11-6,Jim K.) i was actually semi-serious about the scanner. I have an Epson ES300C with
(11-6,Jim K.) some s/w that does palette optimization.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Jim - hmm it'd be nice to scan in some images done by some good...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) artists.
(11-13,Mike E) Whats cost and performance on that?
(11-6,Jim K.) bob - nod!
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Strings or scanners Mike?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Bob - yes, the conversion operator.
(11-13,Mike E) scanners, sorry
(11-6,Jim K.) mike - cost about $1800 3 years ago, 300dpi (maybe 600?) Colorset (great color and many file
(11-6,Jim K.) formats) and another one that does good b/w
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Jim,Mike - suggesting artist draw by hand and mail to you for scanning?
(11-6,Jim K.) cool with me!
(11-13,Mike E) OK, I havent talked to him in a while,
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Sounds good to me, Mike can you contact him?
(11-13,Mike E) I will talk to him and see if he's still interested...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - yeah I sort of wish Strings had been included inthe language.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Ok Mike.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Well, he's gonna need a story line, isn't he (the artist)? <ga.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I figured we'd just ask him to draw this or that amd that'd be it.
(11-13,Mike E) true, i'll give him the base and let him run with whatever else he thinks of
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Bob - I'm sure this is why Bjarne (specifically) left them out - and also why he now wants them in the ANSI spec...
(right I heard he did)
(11-13,Mike E) Basic fantasy art sound good? lions and chimeras and owlbears oh my
(11-6,Jim K.) mike - nod
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Right off the bat I think we can use niftier tiles, but that may not...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) entice him into the project <g>
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) So did y'all settle on a story line?
(11-6,Jim K.) mike - keep the aspect ratio of the display in mind, too: wider than tall <g>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Yes - go in to the dungeon and get the treasure, kill the monsters.
(11-13,Mike E) I think i can get him in , but true tiles can wait until he interested fully.
(11-6,Jim K.) bob - lol
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Maybe just ask him to do some fantasy looking stuff and we'll use...
(11-13,Mike E) Is wider than tall for what the scanner does to the image?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) How 'bout a milieu?
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) them as openers or whatever for now.
(11-13,Mike E) cut and paste always works well also...
(11-6,Jim K.) mike - no, the screen is wider than it is tall ... eg, 640x480 or 1024x768
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) This way, all you need is for window/game to respond to the events - doesn't matter how they're generated.
(11-13,Mike E) I meant non player interaction
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - yes agreed
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Mike - if its in the event chain, its the same thing <g>.
(11-29,Randy Morlen) I'll be back in a minute.
(11-13,Mike E) ok
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) So that'd be Spell cast event ina particular area?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) IE just have players/beings be derived from Visible (don't hat to display) and they'll get events.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Bob - those types of particulars would have to be hammered out.
(11-6,Jim K.) all I can add is that it would be nice if a spell effect
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - right, just an idea of how it might happen
(11-6,Jim K.) could be identified by a long word so I can read spells
(11-6,Jim K.) for my items into my hasA() stuff
(11-13,Mike E) makes sense
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) IE we'd probably want different types of spells (area, directional, etc).
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Well sure, we can do that... the effect of a sleep spell is 234.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) <g>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Seriously we'd have to think about how to encode that.
(11-6,Jim K.) since attributes have a long associated with them, it would be convenient
(11-6,Jim K.) if I could distill a spell effect down to a long
(11-13,Mike E) instead of a bool returned return a spell effect and make it a certain number if it failed.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I think it's going to be tough to be honest with you.
(11-6,Jim K.) who?
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) You, encoding as a long. If we use the spells in AD&D as a guide...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) there seems to be too much to encode.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Unless we have some sort of spell effect object, that is identified...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Naw - just have Game::handle(event) test for SpellEvent - then convert as necessary to an attribute depending on where user is, etc.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) by a long, and read from a resource?
(11-6,Jim K.) instruct me: how can i read a spell effect from a resource? I think in terms of
(11-6,Jim K.) efficient types, and the iAttribute stuff currently uses longs ... i'm
(11-6,Jim K.) open to suggestions ... i'm totally new to this stuff
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) We'll we'd load the data like any other resource, how to encode it...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) is up for discussion.
(11-6,Jim K.) ok, so an item would have (for instance) spellEffect[] and read it? that's cool!
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I'm not sure, would rather think about it and post something.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Exactly. which may be passed along with a spell event?
(11-6,Jim K.) i'm thinking about items that have (say) a 10% chance of paralyze, 1% of death,
(11-6,Jim K.) etc...
(11-13,Mike E) I'll give it a shot too spell effect with parameter with chance..?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) What I'd suggest is something like: user casts the spell, which posts a SpellEvent - event...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) would have with it the position where cast and Spell object...
(11-6,Jim K.) but the spell is not based on the user, but on the item ... so ?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Being's would handle event by using distance from the site and..
(11-13,Mike E) a structure with all pertinent info looks necessary
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) the the spell object itself to calc effect.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - yes, exactly.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Mike E - yes
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Jim - the user casts it which generates the event.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) This way, someone 2 feet away can have different probabilities than someone 20 feet away.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) If the user casts say a gaseous cloud he himself may receive the...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) event and be effected.
(11-6,Jim K.) If Joe Farmer and Ted UltimateWarrior find the SwordofLargeDeath the
effect should depend on the item not the user
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Yes- I'd have the user casting the spell generate the event.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) The spell is triggered when it is picked up...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Gaseous cloud - well, he SHOULD be effected! <g>
(11-6,Jim K.) pat - <g>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) the item is sent the pickUp event, which generates the spell Event.
(11-13,Mike E) Those who dont know area of effect should not cast spells
(11-6,Jim K.) no: the spell is not effective until a hit is on an opponent
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Jim - nothing wrong with items generating events.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Oh ok, then the attack event may generate a hit event which...
(11-6,Jim K.) if ( hit ) then if roll(1d100) <= 1 then die() ...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) generates a spell event?
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Sure to all <g> - the thing is to keep the actions a being/item generates contained in itself (it sends the events).
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) We'd have to work out the details of the messages.
(11-13,Mike E) wouldnt you want a spell event for description first (even if it fails)
(11-13,Mike E) and then hit event to see if it effects.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Mike - ?
(11-6,Jim K.) My problem (conceptually): I have a sword of death. it has a 1% chance of killing
(11-6,Jim K.) outright when a hit occurs .. how do I read this from a rez file?
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Sure, I'd think Spell Event would be handled by Window to show it,...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) so a seperate description wouldn't be necessary.
(11-6,Jim K.) I know nothing about this item in advance ... ideas?
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Jim - it's already been read and passed in the event.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Or as needed... based on Pat's work.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Jim - resources read themselves. When you want the "Object1" resource, the manager reads the file to...
(11-6,Jim K.) Bob - somewhere a sword of death is created, and must read itself from
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) find out what class it is, makes an instance of that class, ...
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) and calls upon the instance to read itself from the file.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Right - when the object is first placed in the dungeon it is...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) read...
(11-6,Jim K.) This all comes back to my read() methods which I am just beginning on ... much thought
(11-6,Jim K.) remains, obviously <g>
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Jim,
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) the item can read it's effect resource (however it is defined) at...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) the same time.
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Any resource has to have a read() and write() method. Wait a day or two until my resource classes are uploaded...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Pat - agreed.
(11-6,Jim K.) ok, will do ... this is all _really_ new to me, and i still don't think in oo ... please be patient and
(11-6,Jim K.) correct/teach me when necessary. I'll appreciate it <g>
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Jim, If you've got BC++/AF, read the TV section on resources - ours will have the same capabilities.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Will do!
(11-6,Jim K.) pat -ok!
(11-24,Patrick Reilly) Now I've GOT to go - my stomach is growling! See y'all...
(11-6,Jim K.) bye pat!
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Ok Pat see ya later!
(11-13,Mike E) pat - was ilater pat
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) I think we need to start outlining some of the events, unless we can...
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) come up with events that are not statically pre-defined.
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) Anyway, do you guys have anything else? Want to call it a night?
(11-6,Jim K.) bob - nod <past my bedtime>
(11-33,Bob P/HOST) G'nite!
(11-13,Mike E) sounds good, and to all a good night.
