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orbital-digest        Wednesday, March 29 2000        Volume 02 : Number 316




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 00:59:54 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (orbital) OT: CD Now

Digger wrote:

> I am going to visit CD Now to place an order for 3 Orbital CDs.  (beached,
> Style pt.2, and Nothing Left pt. 2)  I am curious if anyone has any
> "coupon" numbers to offer at this time.  I know they have been posted
> before.  They are like $10 off a $50.00 purchase or something..

Style *part 2*???
WTF is that??? 8)

DeeKay


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 00:59:54 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (orbital) mp3, censorship, record companies and replies

> How the hell do we get our hands on the whole Visit project?  Seriously, the
> samples you have up are mindblowing!  I definitely want more!  Progress sounds
> very interesting too.
>
>
> -Marc Sawaya
>

Oh no! Not again! <:-)
It's the return of damocles' sword, Steve! <;-)

Now, what did that sorcerer's apprentice say? 8)

DeeKay


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 00:59:54 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (orbital) MP3s/Software:  Music Match 5?

From what i *remember* you can forget it, it's one of these freeware
codecs!.. Not that i'd think freeware is automatically bad, to the
contrary, it's just in this case FHG is my #1 choice! ;-D

DeeKay

>
> Any opinions as to the quality and or utility of the MP3 recorder that
> comes free with Music Match 5?
>


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 00:59:54 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (orbital) mp3, censorship, record companies and replies

> "Benjib - Unitary PR website is run by a friend of mine - the Progress Promo
> and The Visit Promo are not albums. The Visit is all the movements from The
> Visit program - samples are on the site. Progress is a couple of unreleased
> tracks, one unreleased remix and a couple of early workings (ie: progress!)
> of a couple of tracks. I will compile a list of whats on the Progress cd."
>
>
> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I want it I want it!!!
>
I second that emotion! 8)

But I could live with an exact tracklisting for the rest of the week,
Steve! ;-D

Anyway, how did this b'stard get his hands on a rarity like this?
>;-) And why does he plaster it all over his webpage just KNOWING
how much we suffer when we see it?

DeeKay


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 01:15:17 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (orbital) 3 things (update on bootleg, d'n'b, Norwegian labe

> usually the other way around. people who knock MP3 are those
> who HAVE converted their MP3s->CD  and played them through decent
> equipment.  I personally  cannot spot the difference between MP3 and CD
> with lo-fidelity PC speakers and a cheapo soundcard,  but I can definitely
> hear
> the difference once I move the MP3 to audio CDs and then play
> them on a stereo system.  MP3 currently cannot hold a candle to CD
> in terms of transparency or transient detail, MP3 also suffers in
> translating
> those high-frequency harmonics which suffer from that 'glassy' artifacts in
> sound.
>
We're talking about 160kpbs+ FHG encodings from a digital source, 90%
of the people weren't able to tell 160kbps, NONE was able to get
192kbps and higher!.. I can supply you with the link if you don't
mind the german, the experiment was conducted by germany's most
trustable and reliable Computermagazine (and they DO have some
audio-freaks there, yes! 8)

And these people that were testing talked EXACTLY like you before! 8)
It's funny, you can beat some people with their own words, and they
still won't believe! <:-) EVERYONE of these doubters were allowed to
take part!.. Do the Pepsi test!

DeeKay


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 01:35:12 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: (orbital) Re: OT - acro q's

> Fergimme fer askin!
>
> Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper wrote:
> > W2K is OEM only.
>
> The acronym database in my organic processor is on the crash ... I
> can handle W2K for Windoze2000 but
>
> Please "Remind"
> Vas ist dis OEM?

I think it means Original Equipment Manufacturer.. Usually used for
the people that sell certain soft- or hardware bundled! OEM versions
are officially not to be sold separately (that's why they're OEMs! 8)
and are sometimes somehow cheaper made (e.g. the Matrox Millenium OEM
version had a 175MHz RAMDAC (don't ask! <:-) while the regular had a
220MHz one!..

> und
> What's the origin of term/acronym Goa or GOA type trance?
>
Goa is a part of india, in the highlands. and it used to be THE place
for wealthy ravers around 92-95 maybe to fly in to for a high-end
rave.. The DJs developed its own distinctive style there and it spread
all over the world!.. Funny, actually i'm listening to some Goa right
now! ;-D

> Danka,
>
> {5 points if you know what this code means}
>
> SCn10-E-C %^)
>     Pplz frm TN rilly CANB Ignernt. yup.
>
Where's the public key??? <:-)
Shannon, you're crazy! ;-D

DeeKay


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 15:50:55 PST
From: "Aronne Merrelli" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (orbital) Re: yet more black dog + DnB + BoC

Digested reply...

>Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 12:33:09 +0000
>From: "Agust 'Nemesis1' Arni Jonsson" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: Re: (orbital) Re: research
>
>At 23:32 27.3.2000 -0800, Aronne Merrelli wrote:
>hiya aronne :)

Yo!

> >>   Black Dog
> >This is the 2 guys in Plaid + one more guy.
> >I know of 4 releases : Peel session, Spanners, Temple of
> >Transparent Balls, Parallel. I think these are in order
> >of release (Parallel is oldest), and are also in order of
> >scarcity. Luckily, they are also in order of quality,
> >(parallel being the least good) although I'm sure some
> >will violently disagree with me! That being said, go get
> >the peel sessions and "Spanners", those are both excellent
> >and should be relatively easy to find. Spanners sounds much
> >like the last two Plaid albums, but a little more primitive.
>
>actually, first it was known as Black Dog Productions, and they first
>released some ep's.
>then they released Bytes, which is, imho their very best release. a real
>must have :)
>after that, Parallel (which I don't have), Temple of Transparent Balls
>(which I don't have either), and I think around that time, they fell apart,
>I think Spanners is their last album together. after that, Black Dog
>released Adverto, a cd with about 46 short tunes, most of which bored me
>shitless, if I were to tell the truth.
>Get Bytes. it is really good :)
>

I think Parallel is a collection of those early EPs. Bytes
I forgot about because I lost the CD for a long time
(actually I just found it a couple weeks ago, maybe I should
go listen :-) )

And I forgot about adverts as well, Probably because I thought
it sucked too... In fact, I should get rid of my copy.
If anyone is interested in it, let me know.


>Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 14:04:02 BST
>From: "Trym Asserson" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: Re: (orbital) 3 things (update on bootleg, d'n'b, Norwegian label)
>
>****Drum'n'bass****
>I've mostly been listening to Peshay, DJ Rap and Teebee & K until now, but
>I
>know now that I've been missing some very important, defining moments. Can
>anyone direct me to some monumental releases, artists, etc (apart from
>Goldie whose latest album I bought and sold within three months).
>
>If you come across an album by Polar and like drum'n'bass, check it out.
>It's called "37 Degrees and falling". Polar is Teebee 's recording mate, K
>(Kjetil Dale Sagstad), who makes sci-fi d'n'b with intricate basslines and
>drum edits. Combined with Teebee's dark, hardstep, "black science"
>basslines, the result is very powerful.


Yeah I've been meaning to get that. The Teebee & K album
has some really great tunes on it.

as for you question, DnB is very ethereal so its hard to name
"defining" releases, but here are some that I think are
essential, and why:
T Power 'Self Evident Truths of the Intuitive Mind' & 'Police State'
(top ambient DnB)
Plug 'Drum and Bass for Papa'
(best mix of breakbeats ever)
Photek 'Risc vs Reward'
(he produces some amazing beats... very distinctive sound!)

and a couple comps,
Log. Progression 1
(excellent ambient/smooth DnB from the masters)
Metalheadz Platinum Breakz vol 1,
(many 'anthems' on this one)
Torque
(if you like dark tech-y stuff, this is it!)

Some other good stuff : Klute - anything (anything on Cert 18,
for that matter), Ed & Optical - Wormhole, any of the
Moving Shadow samplers (98.1, etc... they are cheap, too)
I've also heard that the new Matrix album 'Sleepless'
is really good - not just another 2 step thing.

>Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 09:12:28 EST
>From: "Robert Schultz" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: (orbital) BoC/Perro Negro
>
>Helloooo all,
>
>First off, I'd like to thank Dr. Deekay for the encoder :-)
>
>So now, I can encode Boards of Canada's "Twoism" and "High Scores" (vinyl
>versions) for y'all! I have a feeling some of you are really going to like
>this stuff. It's definitely worth chillin' to :-)
>

In case you hadn't already heard, Hi Scores was repressed a
few months ago, including a CD release. And I second that
recommendation, its a really a fine release. You should buy it
if you like the mp3's :-)



Whew!  I'm done now :-)

Regards,
    Aronne
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 19:30:26 -0800
From: "Dr. Funkenstein" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (orbital) Concatenated response on the LINUX thing

I didn't want to bomb the list with (off topic) messages, but I wanted to
respond to some things...

In General: I am actually a BIG LINUX/Un*x supporter (I'm all about open
source)..and it's funny that I'm kind of taking the role of MS supporter
here (usually I'm on the opposite side).  I guess in reality I'm kind of in
the middle on the issue and since there are a lot of LINUX people on this
list...I guess that's why I find myself arguing in favor of MS (shudder).
That said I think MS is EXTREMELY bad for the industry and puts out a
bloated, insecure product.  I am HOPING that the trust investigations break
them up.

DeeKay:

About the stability issue:  That's very wierd that you've had such problems
with NT stability.  Like you said I would imagine that it's the software
you're running that's causing the crashes...and while I agree that NT
should do a better job of handling misbehaving apps, it technically isn't
the OS's fault that the crashes occur.  I have lots of experience from
administering a medium sized NT4 network and stability has *never* been a
problem (particularly where the servers are concerned).  I also used NT
server at home for a long time and had *very* few problems.  Both of those
are 24/7 setups with no scheduled reboots at all.  My home machine usually
didn't need to be rebooted more than once or twice per week (depending on
what I was messing with of course), and I don't even remember the last time
our servers at work were down.

On Ease of use: I'll have to read up on that competition...sounds
interesting.  Still though, the install isn't really even the issue...even
Redhat's install is probably as easy as Windows now.  But in general day to
day use it's still not feasable to put LINUX boxes in front of computer
illiterate people.  LINUX is still to complex to run and maintain.  Not to
mention the fact that the GUI's just aren't there yet in terms of
robustness (putting up with user mistakes) and stability.  Enlightenment
hasn't even reached 1.0 yet.  That said...it is getting better all the time
and I hope they get there eventually.  I would love to run Gnome
Enlightenment and have it be as stable/fast/robust as Windows GUI
(drool...that would be sweeeeet)

On Firewalls and stuff: I think anyone who uses Windows (any version) as a
firewall is insane.  OpenBSD trounces it out of the box.

Brendan:

On the performance tests:  The Open Benchmark confirmed the initial
findings of Mindcraft that NT was the winner for FileServer and Webserver
performance.  I didn't believe it myself until I saw the results but NT
SLAMMED Redhat.  Maybe (hopefully) that will change as Redhat continues on
but for now the numbers don't lie.  That said: I don't know why this is
such a big deal.  Personally if I wanted to build a webserver I would NOT
use Redhat LINUX.  There are much better platforms for webservers.  I mean
Redhat is great but it's being developed more as a desktop OS than a
mega-server OS (as pretty much every version of LINUX always has been).  It
does the desktop thing FAR better out of the box than something like
OpenBSD (lots of ease-of-use stuff, GUI installed with the OS, etc). But
OpenBSD is more suited to being a web/file server.


On Win2k:  I am EXTREMELY impressed with Win2K (despite the bloated and
insecure thing of course).  However, it is too early to really comment on
it...MS has a history of making VAST improvements in their products as they
mature a bit.  However, I have to say as someone who REFUSED to run Win95
when it first came out (and boy was I right not to) that Win2K looks pretty
good so far...good enough for me to be running it within the first few
months of its release.  My Professional box (running Win2K final) almost
never crashes.

Aimee:  Not everyone is so closed minded, even here at 3 guys : 1 girl RIT
people don't assume ridiculous things like that so much.  There are plenty
of female IT and CS people and everyone realizes that.
- ------------------------------------------------------
[e-mail] - http://www.rit.edu/~dco2393

It's wild how you never know where your life could go
So many try to slow your roll in these trails of life
                    -Mystik Journeymen



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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:32:19 -0500
From: aimee couture <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Concatenated response on the LINUX thing

>Aimee:  Not everyone is so closed minded, even here at 3 guys : 1 girl RIT
>people don't assume ridiculous things like that so much.  There are plenty
>of female IT and CS people and everyone realizes that.

my job = residence network consultant, university of western ontario
i'm one of the first three women to ever have this job since it started in 1996
i'm the youngest ever, male or female
before this year? there was one woman on staff
this years temp staff? about 7 men : 1 woman

i want to hire more girls for next year =]
and i have a say in hiring now, so maybe i can help make that happen.

Aimee


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 02:18:04 +0000
From: Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) MP3 quality

J Van wrote:
>
> usually the other way around. people who knock MP3 are those
> who HAVE converted their MP3s->CD  and played them through decent
> equipment.  I personally  cannot spot the difference between MP3 and CD
> with lo-fidelity PC speakers and a cheapo soundcard,  but I can definitely
> hear
> the difference once I move the MP3 to audio CDs and then play
> them on a stereo system.  MP3 currently cannot hold a candle to CD
> in terms of transparency or transient detail, MP3 also suffers in
> translating
> those high-frequency harmonics which suffer from that 'glassy' artifacts in
> sound.

You're obviously using bad compressors on 128 kbps.  I use 160 kbps and
bladeenc, and it works just fine.

- --
Brendan Byrd AKA SineSwiper ([e-mail])
Computer techie, Perl hacker, and all-purpose Internet guru
Resonator Software (http://www.ResonatorSoft.com/)


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 02:30:58 +0000
From: Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Concatenated response on the LINUX thing

"Dr. Funkenstein" wrote:
>
> Brendan:
>
> On the performance tests:  The Open Benchmark confirmed the initial
> findings of Mindcraft that NT was the winner for FileServer and Webserver
> performance.  I didn't believe it myself until I saw the results but NT
> SLAMMED Redhat.  Maybe (hopefully) that will change as Redhat continues on
> but for now the numbers don't lie.  That said: I don't know why this is
> such a big deal.  Personally if I wanted to build a webserver I would NOT
> use Redhat LINUX.  There are much better platforms for webservers.  I mean
> Redhat is great but it's being developed more as a desktop OS than a
> mega-server OS (as pretty much every version of LINUX always has been).  It
> does the desktop thing FAR better out of the box than something like
> OpenBSD (lots of ease-of-use stuff, GUI installed with the OS, etc). But
> OpenBSD is more suited to being a web/file server.

While Free/OpenBSD are nice products and a little better in the speed
departments, they don't have a multi-threaded IP stack either.  "RedHat"
has nothing to do with it.  They just distribute the software with
different items.  The kernel and the web server are the main things.
The problem is that Apache is NOT built for speed.  It's built for
functionality.  (It's fairly fast, but not the fastest.)  If you want a
fast Linux web server, get Zeus.  Also, the whole test was rigged in
NT's favor.  Microsoft knew that Linux wasn't the best in huge
multi-processor systems.  However, it's a proven fact that Linux will
kick the shit out of a NT box on a single-processor system.  (And a
single-processor system doesn't need a multi-threaded IP stack.)
Mindcraft (AKA Microsoft) blew this idea off, calling it "a resource
choked system".  Yeah, resource choked for that bloated piece of shit
called Windoze!

> On Win2k:  I am EXTREMELY impressed with Win2K (despite the bloated and
> insecure thing of course).  However, it is too early to really comment on
> it...MS has a history of making VAST improvements in their products as they
> mature a bit.  However, I have to say as someone who REFUSED to run Win95
> when it first came out (and boy was I right not to) that Win2K looks pretty
> good so far...good enough for me to be running it within the first few
> months of its release.  My Professional box (running Win2K final) almost
> never crashes.

65,000 known bugs.  Enough said.

- --
Brendan Byrd AKA SineSwiper ([e-mail])
Computer techie, Perl hacker, and all-purpose Internet guru
Resonator Software (http://www.ResonatorSoft.com/)


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 02:53:05 +0000
From: Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Women and technology

aimee couture wrote:
>
> i want to hire more girls for next year =]
> and i have a say in hiring now, so maybe i can help make that happen.

Don't be biased.  It's not because men won't hire women.  It's because
women don't bother.

How many women are on this ML? (One.)
How many women play video games? (2%.)
How many women hackers exist? (Almost nil.)
How many women are experts at cars? (Even less.)
How many women go to raves WITHOUT their boyfriends? (About 10%.)
How many women play the guitar? (Less than 10%.)
How many women are famous DJs? (I could count them on one hand.)

The simple fact is this: women are afraid of technology.  I'm not one of
those bigots that thinks they should be making babies and cooking
dinner.  (Quite the opposite...it's hard to get a date in my social
class.)  But, maybe women should get off their asses and learn
technology, instead of learning fashion design and cooking and singing!
It's not our fault that women simply don't have an interest in it.

- --
Brendan Byrd AKA SineSwiper ([e-mail])
Computer techie, Perl hacker, and all-purpose Internet guru
Resonator Software (http://www.ResonatorSoft.com/)


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 22:01:05 EST
From: "Robert Schultz" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Women and technology

How many women are on this ML? (One.) Wrong, don't forget about Joona in
Finland and Monica in Madrid!!

How many women play video games? (2%.) Don't know
How many women hackers exist? (Almost nil.) I know three
How many women are experts at cars? (Even less.) Maybe
How many women go to raves WITHOUT their boyfriends? (About 10%.) No way! I
know A LOT of girl ravers that don't have boyfriends. Besides, it's not
their fault that they might be hot and their boyfriends are afraid they'll
get picked up by some raver named Brendan...
How many women play the guitar? (Less than 10%.) I know a few.
How many women are famous DJs? (I could count them on one hand.) No, there's
2 on Friday nights here in Boston. DJ Courtney is pretty good actually.

Roberto
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 03:12:25 +0000
From: Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Women and technology

Robert Schultz wrote:
>
> How many women are on this ML? (One.) Wrong, don't forget about Joona in
> Finland and Monica in Madrid!!
>
> How many women play video games? (2%.) Don't know
> How many women hackers exist? (Almost nil.) I know three
> How many women are experts at cars? (Even less.) Maybe
> How many women go to raves WITHOUT their boyfriends? (About 10%.) No way! I
> know A LOT of girl ravers that don't have boyfriends. Besides, it's not
> their fault that they might be hot and their boyfriends are afraid they'll
> get picked up by some raver named Brendan...
> How many women play the guitar? (Less than 10%.) I know a few.
> How many women are famous DJs? (I could count them on one hand.) No, there's
> 2 on Friday nights here in Boston. DJ Courtney is pretty good actually.

You're totally missing my point.  The male:female ratio is WAAAAY too
low on the female side of things.

BTW, will you quit sending me a dupe of the message you're sending me on
the ML?  I'm subscribed, ya know.

- --
Brendan Byrd AKA SineSwiper ([e-mail])
Computer techie, Perl hacker, and all-purpose Internet guru
Resonator Software (http://www.ResonatorSoft.com/)


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 00:59:54 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: RE: (orbital) NT/Linux

> >I think they finally switched back, but they also increased the number
> >of servers by a lot.
>
> I'm afraid they're still using Apache on some unix (probably solaris).
>
> [www].hotmail.com
> Server: Apache/1.3.6 (Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.8 SSLeay/0.9.0b
>
> x.x.hotmail.passport.com (hotmail's auth frontend)
> Server: Apache/1.3.6 (Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.8 SSLeay/0.9.0b
>
> x.hotmail.msn.com (where you end up after you log in)
> Server: Apache/1.3.6 (Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.8 SSLeay/0.9.0b
>
Yeah, seems probable!.. Cause IF they switched to Win2k on Hotmail,
they'd fucken plaster it EVERYWHERE! 8) They'd put it into every
hotmail-footer: "This message is sent to you through hotmail -
powered by NT-technology!", hell, i swear they'd even paint it on the
moon! 8) And you can be sure they'd put it in a way so that people
wouldn't ask themselves "What did it run on unitl now then?",
afterall there's this thing called Microspeech, where a 'bug' is a
'known issue' (they are not allowed to say the word 'bug' - how
pathetic! 8), a 'macrovirus' is a 'prank macro', a 'bugfix' is a
'service pack' and where they brag about their all new upgrade in
mailservers on MSN (referred to as Microsoft Nation by
microsoft.eu.org! >:-) instead of giving apologies for the millions
of mails that have been lost or delayed during a severe servercrash
of their (before) ridiculously small mailserver (prolly running NT,
too! >:-)
Now, it's good to know that Hotmail runs on Solaris, this makes all
the PR spin on www.dot-truth.com where they try to ridicule sun (part
of the Win2k-marketing!)  seem even MORE pathetic!..

Oh well, atleast the german government is considering choosing
Opensource Software like Linux and BSD now and my 15-year old cousin
is telling me that all the boys in his class are complete
Linux-nerds! ;-D

Here's one thing Bill didn't consider in his worlddomination plans:
nerds! 8) Pretty ironic as he is referred to as the 'king of the
nerds' by some! <:-)

DeeKay

Quote of the day: "I'd rather give my Children drugs than windows"
(...which takes us back where we started this thread somehow! ;-D


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 04:44:07 +0000
From: Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) NT/Linux

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Here's one thing Bill didn't consider in his worlddomination plans:
> nerds! 8) Pretty ironic as he is referred to as the 'king of the
> nerds' by some! <:-)

I'm a hacker.  If you use the word "nerd" again, I'll smack your head
off!

- --
Brendan Byrd AKA SineSwiper ([e-mail])
Computer techie, Perl hacker, and all-purpose Internet guru
Resonator Software (http://www.ResonatorSoft.com/)


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 00:37:31 -0500
From: aimee couture <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Women and technology

>aimee couture wrote:
> >
> > i want to hire more girls for next year =]
> > and i have a say in hiring now, so maybe i can help make that happen.
>
>Don't be biased.  It's not because men won't hire women.  It's because
>women don't bother.

no, i'm not saying that i'm going to hire girls who aren't qualified. the
best man gets the job. but i'm encouraging girls i know [who are qualified]
to apply. most girls i talk to are too afraid to even apply for a
technology job.


>How many women are on this ML? (One.)

more than one. but the rest hide =]

>How many women go to raves WITHOUT their boyfriends? (About 10%.)

i know a lot of single female ravers.

>The simple fact is this: women are afraid of technology.  I'm not one of
>those bigots that thinks they should be making babies and cooking
>dinner.  (Quite the opposite...it's hard to get a date in my social
>class.)  But, maybe women should get off their asses and learn
>technology, instead of learning fashion design and cooking and singing!
>It's not our fault that women simply don't have an interest in it.

hey hey now..
i make clothes, i cook, i sing, and dammit i can use technology too =]


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 00:09:45 -0600 (CST)
From: Anthony N Gall <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Women and technology

On Wed, 29 Mar 2000, Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper wrote:

> How many women go to raves WITHOUT their boyfriends? (About 10%.)
> How many women play the guitar? (Less than 10%.)
> How many women are famous DJs? (I could count them on one hand.)

Dude, I see absolutely no correlation between raving, playing the guitar,
DJing, and grasp of technology. None of the three require even interest in
technology (e.g., girl punk bands, the fact that all female DJs i know
personally really have no interest in technology...). And raving?
technology? you don't need to read up and be technologically in-the-know
to be able to dance and have fun...I think what you're really trying to
criticize is the supposed lack of women's enthusiasm to break into
male-dominated parts of society.

> The simple fact is this: women are afraid of technology.

Nothing, especially gender issues, is ever this simple Brendan :)

> those bigots that thinks they should be making babies and cooking
> dinner.  (Quite the opposite...it's hard to get a date in my social
> class.)  But, maybe women should get off their asses and learn
> technology, instead of learning fashion design and cooking and singing!

Rather, I think that women (like everyone else for that matter) should go
and learn all types of things, be it cooking or computer repair. Hell,
right now more than anything I'd like to learn to be a real good cook and
I'm a guy. On the other hand, I really have no interest in computers and
would not use one if it were possible. So, I think that people should just
have fun with whatever floats their boat, and if it's something that's
usually correlated with a different type of person, then good for them.

> It's not our fault that women simply don't have an interest in it.

Who are you referring to when you say "our"? It's really society's fault,
for continuing to propagate the myth that women simply (there's that word
again) either aren't good at or can't do certain male-dominated tasks.
It's an awful stereotype that ends up feeding off of itself.

- -Anthony



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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 06:40:22 +0000
From: Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) Women and technology

Anthony N Gall wrote:
>
> On Wed, 29 Mar 2000, Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper wrote:
>
> > How many women go to raves WITHOUT their boyfriends? (About 10%.)
> > How many women play the guitar? (Less than 10%.)
> > How many women are famous DJs? (I could count them on one hand.)
>
> Dude, I see absolutely no correlation between raving, playing the guitar,
> DJing, and grasp of technology. None of the three require even interest in
> technology (e.g., girl punk bands, the fact that all female DJs i know
> personally really have no interest in technology...). And raving?
> technology? you don't need to read up and be technologically in-the-know
> to be able to dance and have fun...I think what you're really trying to
> criticize is the supposed lack of women's enthusiasm to break into
> male-dominated parts of society.

It's not just knowing how to do something as it is just something which
is "technological".  Techno is obviously technological.  Women's most
common part in a musicial band is as the singer, because it doesn't
involve using something technological.  Women even shy away from the
drums.  (Unforunately, most women drummers suck because they don't know
how to bang the drums hard enough.  I praise the ones that do, though,
like the drummers from Drain STH and Lenny Kravitz.)

> Rather, I think that women (like everyone else for that matter) should go
> and learn all types of things, be it cooking or computer repair. Hell,
> right now more than anything I'd like to learn to be a real good cook and
> I'm a guy. On the other hand, I really have no interest in computers and
> would not use one if it were possible. So, I think that people should just
> have fun with whatever floats their boat, and if it's something that's
> usually correlated with a different type of person, then good for them.

I think the stereotype that men don't know how to cook is grossly
inaccurate now.  My entire family knows how cook very well, as does most
of my male friends.  OTOH, there are some women who -don't- know how to
cook.

> Who are you referring to when you say "our"? It's really society's fault,
> for continuing to propagate the myth that women simply (there's that word
> again) either aren't good at or can't do certain male-dominated tasks.
> It's an awful stereotype that ends up feeding off of itself.

Besides some bad biases in the military, I don't think much anybody
thinks like that any more.  There are many opportunaties for women out
there that most women don't persue.  Instead, they go for being a nurse,
or a secertary, or the "typical" women jobs.  Maybe it's a little bit of
trying to break gender barriers, but a career decision shouldn't be
based on how many men/women are in that field.

Who knows?  Maybe it's genetic for a women to be inheriently afraid of
technology.  You'd be surprised at how many psychological defaults we
have implanted in our brains because of our genes.

- --
Brendan Byrd AKA SineSwiper ([e-mail])
Computer techie, Perl hacker, and all-purpose Internet guru
Resonator Software (http://www.ResonatorSoft.com/)


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:17:38 BST
From: "Trym Asserson" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (orbital) OT: CD Now

>Style *part 2*???
>WTF is that??? 8)

There were 2 Style singles, pt. 1 and pt.2
One had,

Old Style
Mock Tudor
New Style

the other had

Style
An Fhomhair
Bigpipe Style

or something like that, might have got one track mixed up or so. Check
Loopz' site for exact listing.

Trym
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com



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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 15:40:12 +0200
From: "Der Automat" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (orbital) Highway To Hell in Spain!!!

Shannon K. Campbell wrote:

> not to interupt these fascinating theories of artistic interpretations
> on Sniv cover, but!
> ?Didja hear that Madrid named a street after AC/DC?!?!?!?
> I think Knoxville needs an "Orbital Way" !!!!

Yes, but not exactly in Madrid but in Leganes (a small town near Madrid).
The street is called "calle AC-DC" (AC-DC street) and some people have
robbed several times the sign.

DER AUTOMAT



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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:45:04 +0100
From: "Gargin, Philip (Frankfurt)" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (orbital) Highway To Hell in Spain!!!

    Der Automat:-

> Yes, but not exactly in Madrid but in Leganes (a small town near Madrid).
> The street is called "calle AC-DC" (AC-DC street) and some people have
> robbed several times the sign.
>
    I hear they're naming a street Mike Oldfield in Madrid as well!
    He's my big music hero.
    I have a Q interview with him and Orbital somewhere.


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------------------------------

End of orbital-digest V2 #316
*****************************