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Path: senator-bedfellow.mit.edu!bloom-beacon.mit.edu!news.media.mit.edu!uhog.mit.edu!news.sgi.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!pendragon!ames!tulane.edu!cpk-news-feed4.bbnplanet.com!news.fsu.edu!garnet.acns.fsu.edu!adchen From: adchen@garnet.acns.fsu.edu (Tony Chen) Newsgroups: rec.sport.skating.inline,rec.skate,rec.sport.skating.misc,news.answers,rec.answers Subject: In-line Skating FAQ: Vert and Jumps (2.3) Followup-To: rec.sport.skating.inline Date: 20 Sep 1996 14:26:43 GMT Organization: Florida State University Computer Science Department Lines: 840 Approved: news-answers-request@MIT.Edu Distribution: world Expires: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 14:27:21 -0100 Message-ID: <sports/skating/inline-faq-4-843229641@garnet.acns.fsu.edu> References: <sports/skating/inline-faq-1-843229641@garnet.acns.fsu.edu> Reply-To: adchen@garnet.acns.fsu.edu (Tony Chen) NNTP-Posting-Host: garnet.acns.fsu.edu Originator: adchen@garnet.acns.fsu.edu Xref: senator-bedfellow.mit.edu rec.sport.skating.inline:24444 rec.sport.skating.misc:1242 news.answers:82422 rec.answers:24081 Posted-By: auto-faq 3.1.1.2 Archive-name: sports/skating/inline-faq/part4 _r.s.s.inline FAQ: Techniques - Vert and Jumps_ _________________________________________________________________ [LINK] --> TECHNIQUES - VERT AND JUMPS Friday, 31-May-96 17:59:40 MDT Vert and Jumps Table of Contents * Jumps * Pipes and ramps (links to ramp plans) * Vert skater terms _________________________________________________________________ Jumps From: dcain@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (Daryl S. Cain) dbriggs@Mr-Hyde.aoc.nrao.edu (Daniel Briggs) writes: Suggestions for exercises on how to work towards a good 360? How high should I be able to jump in order to have a reasonable shot at finishing the 360 before landing. For that matter, how should my feet be set on take off and landing? The trick is to power your rotation from your torso and just carry your legs along for the ride. It helps me to hold my arms out in an L shape (one arm out to the front and one out to the side) and swing them to get the rotation going. The best way to practice is in your shoes on the grass (softer when you fall). It's my theory that if you can't jump and do a 360 in your sneaks (wear heavy shoes to simulate the weight of skates) then there's no way in hell that your going to do one in skates. Its also my theory that the best positionl for your feet is about six feet straight down from your head, I mean, the hardest part about spinning (on land or in the air) is staying vertical and balanced. From: sokay@cyclone.mitre.org (Stephen J. Okay) holr0001@student.tc.umn.edu (James A Holroyd-1) writes: Steve: Yep, they're fun, aren't they? Haven't done them (180 jumps over curbs) to a heel-to-heel, but I have kept rotating and sort of spun around in a crouch to a forward position again once I land... Well, its not really OVER the curb so much as it is using it as a launchpad of sorts. But yes they are fun.... :) Crummy ASCII art follows: ____ +--------Launch into 180 here... / \ | _ / \ | / \ / ___\|/__ \ curb hop / / \ \/---------- skating path Land 180 here ^^^^^^^^^ curb/traffic island From: jss@kepler.unh.edu (Spectre) dbriggs@Mr-Hyde.aoc.nrao.edu (Daniel Briggs) writes: Suggestions for exercises on how to work towards a good 360? How high should I be able to jump in order to have a reasonable shot at finishing the 360 before landing. For that matter, how should my feet be set on take off and landing? Go back to basics. Take off your skates, stand in one place, jump up and spin around. Concentrate on thinking on what you are doing, one step at a time. Once you get to a point where you think you can explain it to a crippled 12 year old, then put your skates on. Start without moving. Just do the same thing, jump up, turn around (Pick a bail of cotton if you really want to), and get the feel of what parts of your body emphasize the speed and control of the spin. Then just start rolling, and doing it. Once you get to the point where you can do it with a good speed roll, then everything beyond (curbs, stairs, etc) is just conquering fear...it's not any different wether you spin over a perfectly smooth pavement, grass, stairs or a car. If you can make the jump without any of the obsticals, you can do it with the obsticals...just close your eyes at first and you won't kno the difference :) From: holr0001@student.tc.umn.edu (James A Holroyd-1) Regarding 360's: I've almost got them now... I'm spinning most of the way round, but I keep dropping one foot too soon, so I end up landing like this: (apologies for the ascii art) | ^ | <---right skate | | | direction of travel | | ------- <---left skate (spinning clockwise) This isn't really a problem, but it looks kind of stupid... I think I need to get more of a "pop." I also need to keep my skates closer together. The physics behind the spin is actually pretty simple: While you're still on the ground (the wind-up phase), you give yourself angular momentum by turning your torso in the opposite direction to the one you're going to be spinning in, then twisting into the spin and jumping. Hopefully, you'll give yourself enough momentum to make yourself go some multiple of 180 degrees when you're in the air. You can make yourself spin faster by pulling everything in closer to your axis of rotation. I saw a TV program on PBS once about video/computer analysis of ice skaters doing jumps... they had one skater who couldn't do a triple-something-or-other, and they diagnosed her problem as leaving her arms too far away from her body. They had her lift weights, which strengthened her arms, which let her pull them closer in to her body, which helped her finish the jump. One interesting thing to note about ice skaters is that they usually start jumps with one leg at least partially extended away from their body. When they pull the leg in, it reduces their polar moment of inertia, which increases the rate of the spin (since angular momentum is conserved, neglecting air resistance). Because most in-liners start their jumps on 2 skates, we can't get the slingshot effect of bringing the leg in, consequently we can't do triples on flat ground. Anybody out there doing ice-style jumps on inlines? Any thoughts from you ice-skaters out there? From: mdickens@bbn.com (Michael L. Dickens) cernada@ait.com (Joseph P. Cernada) wrote: I still haven't figured out how to get any height while jumping in this position. I get maybe 5 inches off the ground. Anybody have any suggestions on how to jump higher from the heel-to-heel position? It's leg strength. And the ability to raise your legs up like an airplane's wheels retracting. If you're in New York, check out the now-somewhat-talked-about Victor - the master of side-surfing. Before he moved (from Boston), I've _seen_ him jump a barrel (about 3' height & 1' radius) on it's side while side-surfing, and have heard that he can do the same barrel standing up! What he does highly resembles retracting his legs as he goes up, and dropping them back as he comes down. Quite impressive. _________________________________________________________________ Pipes and Ramps Ramp plans: * Heckler Magazine plans: http://www.heckler.com/ramps.html * IASC endorsed blueprints: Ramp building FAQ: http://web.cps.msu.edu/~dunhamda/dw/ramp_faq.html From: Spectre (jss@kepler.unh.edu) Re: pipes > I'd appreciate it if you could drop me a few pointers so that if I find one > someday I won't kill myself on the first time out... Pointers: START FROM THE BOTTOM!!! Never start from the top until you get get yourself to the top from skating, and not climbing. Even if it is a 3 foot quarter pipe...don't start from the top till you can skate up it, turn around at the top, and come back down without falling. I was teaching a friend of mine, he was fooling around on a 3 foot quarter...I told him to work bottom to top. He skated up, up the ramp, and stood on the top... the "dropped in" (Started from the top standing up), fell backwards and sprained his wrist, now he doesn't want to skate pipes anymore. Work your way up, get used to the transition from flat to sloped.. it's a very strange sensation going up a curved incline vs. a flat incline. Work on getting used to going up on the transition, turning around, and coming back down, all fluid. Once you get comfortable with the transition, you have to learn how to pump. Pumping is what makes you gain speed when your in the pipe, since gravity and friction will slow you down a little... I don't know if I can explain this well but....as you come up to the transition, bend your knees some...When you start up the transition push your feet out...the result will just be you standing up...but pushing against the centrifical (sp?) force will let you get a little more speed. When you turn around at the "apex" of your ride up...do the same...turn around, bend your knees a little, and extend against the pipe...you will notice a BIG change in speed, since you will be getting more speed than you would if you where just riding down the side of the pipe. Repeat this for both sides...From the bottom, pump, up the transition, turn around, pump, down the transition, across the flat, pump, up the transition, turn around, pump, down the transition. If there are skateboarders or other skaters there, watch them, expec. their knees... You can ask them, but a lot of skateboarders don't even realize they do it. Pumping is the secret to riding...the better you can pump, the higher you will go...with out pumping, you will never gain speed, and will never get as high has you were when you turned around on the other side.. (Simple physics) Once you think you have control over that...say you can get to a point where you can grab onto the top of the pipe and pull yourself up on the platform, your almost ready to drop in. At this point, you want to start by going in sitting down. Maybe the first time, sit on the edge and slide down, just get used to the hight and the speed when you slide... Then sitting down, put your hands on the coping (the metal pipe that is on the edge of the pipe) and push yourself forward...you have to go forward enough so when you stand up, your body will be perpendicular with the pipe.. push off...and stand up...and go like you did when you started from the bottom, except you already have some speed. That part sound dificult, but after a couple of tries it gets really easy. Once you feel comfortable with that, you can either 1) drop in standing up...(put first to wheels over edge..bend your knees and touch your toes...you'll roll into the pipe, and your legs will be perp with the pipe.. then you just need to stand up) 2) Start lifting your feet some as you go in...lift yourself up on your hands, put your feet behind you so that your feet are higher up with you go in sitting./..that way you get more used to to the actual hight from the top...keeping going till your comfortable with getting your feet all the way to the coping before you push yourself in. If there are any other skaters there, you can ask them for tips, but do not "drop in" until you feel comfortable...I did that once...12 foot pipe 1 foot of vertical...dropped in...forgot to bend my knees...face plant damn close to the flat.... Good luck...be careful....wear a helmet and knee pads at least.... let me know if anything isn't clear. From: savaged@csu.murdoch.edu.au (Duncan Savage) Saw a neat trick that some guys (including one who looked about 13) are doing in Sydney, Aus. Basically, they use a standard skate ramp, skate into it, but instead of rolling up it, catch their toes (I don't remember if it was with one or both feet) on the front of the ramp, flipping themselves into a forward somersalt with their heads just about scraping the ramp. They land on the other side of the ramp. Needless to say they had a full complement of protective gear, and given the protection even their stuff-ups didn't look too painful. I don't think I'll try it just yet. From: holr0001@gold.tc.umn.edu (batty) Charlie, I agree wholeheartedly with your construction technique, but we found different geometry worked better for us when we built launch ramps for skateboarding. When you go off a launch ramp, you are launching so that you land away from the ramp, so the top lip of the ramp doesn't have to be perpendicular to the ground. If you build a ramp with a radius less than 6 feet, it feels _really_ weird. We found that the ramps that were easiest to launch off were the ones that we could go fastest on, which gave us more air time. 8 foot radius worked well for us.. You suggested building a ramp with a 2.5 foot radius. The distance from your center of gravity (somewhere around your bellybutton) to the bottom of your skates is about 2.5 feet (less if you're crouching). When you hit a 2.5 foot radius ramp that goes to vertical, your skates will go up the ramp, but your center of gravity will stay in one place... you'll also go straight up in the air and either have to launch to one side, or you'll have to land back on the ramp. Here's some really bad ascii art showing my favorite launch ramp: ____ * | * | * | * | * | *______________________________ The "launch angle" was a little more than 30 degrees, the whole ramp was about 8 feet long, and it was about 2-3 feet tall. It was (as I remember) about a 10 foot radius. it had a small platform at the top (which, combined with the length of the ramp, made it very stable) We could hit this ramp going *very* fast, and it sent us a long way. This is what worked for us. From: aites@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Jim Aites) Hey, you SKATEBOARD'ers! Got any helpful hints for us fledgelings? | found different geometry worked better for us when we built launch ramps | 8 foot radius worked well for us. Is it just me or are a lot of folks under the (obviously) mistaken impression that some launch ramps use a parabolic curve? Ignoring the fact that the previous poster indicatated that the ansi-art was poor, this STILL looks like it isn't a radius type ramp. ____ | * | | * | | * | | * | | * | | *______________________________ Also, I've jumped ramps where the vertical part of the ramp was MUCH closer to 90' than it was to 45'. I'm not saying that they were better than the above, as a matter of fact, you *have* to go fast so you don't stall at the top of the ramp...and dribble over the top lip. <grin> Hang time (altitude) gets outragious pretty quickly, and all without landing more than 10' from the ramp. Does this match with anyone else? From: jss@oin.unh.edu (Spectre) Fakies are A half-pipe trick. It's actually a un-trick. You go up the side of the pipe like you are going to do a trick, go in the air, and do nothing...not even turn around. You then come back into the half pipe skating backwards (Which isn't nearly as simple as street skating backwards :) > Work on 360 jumps off the ground (forward and backward). Once you >have those down, hit a jump and do it (again, forwards and backwards). My favorite: 360's clearing 6-8 stairs. One that I've been playing with, if you find a long bench, or low wall, or something at least 10-20 feet long. Jump onto it with a 180, land backwards with one skate on the bench and the other scraping along the side of the bench, then jump off with another 180. I'm pretty sure in half-pipe lingo, it's a backwards rail grind, but I'm not sure. |____| - one skate || other skate -> |____||------- || | bench From: adchen@cs.fsu.edu (Tony Chen) jss@oin.unh.edu (Spectre) writes: > > |____| - one skate > || >other skate -> |____||------- > || | bench A more flashy version of bench riding is to jump on top of the bench (or some kind of edge) and into a spread-eagle (I guess this would be a 90? 8-) Ride all the way to the end and jump off with a 180 so as to land in another spread-eagle, but with your feet reversed. Another variation, find stairs that are sectioned with flats in between flights. Ride the steps sideways (spread-eagle) and flip 180 in the flats. You could also flip to backwards-bashing or whatever. From: jnewborn@ecst.csuchico.edu (Gadget) Just to add the simple ones to the list, here goes... * Front wheels of both skates * Front wheels of both skates in parallel * Back wheels of both skates * Back wheels of both skates in parallel * One wheel (front/back/left & right) * Heel & toe * Front/back/mixed wheels while spread eagle Of course all these can be done backwards as well. Oh, and as a great drill. Cross over backwards while going forwards and cross over forwards when your going backwards.... From: sokay@cyclone.mitre.org (Stephen J. Okay) Subject: Stair/Wall Jumps.. In the ever continuing chronicle of attempts to break my neck, I thought I'd share some thoughts on my stair and wall work that I did last night. I went over to a local high school that has some rather interesting structures for thrashing on, so following a couple quick laps around the parking lot, I set to work on the stairs, and while I have no problem jumping up/over up to 4 steps at a time, or back down, I still have absolutely _no_ clue as to how to actually ride the damn things...any hints/ideas would be much appreciated, esp. from our two resident thrashers on the group... Aerials are a different story. I can now say with a good degree of confidence, I can do a 180 (and sometimes a 270) from back off of up to 4 steps. The trick seems to be in starting your turn when you launch. I've always fallen when I've tried this until I realized that its just too much to think about if I try to turn in mid-air, so its better to just start right off doing it. _Walls:_ Had moderate success hurdling, getting over a couple walls/barriers. The idea is to use head straight for the wall and use it as a vault of sorts to propel yourself into the air with. My biggest problem with this is that I need to remember to lift my feet higher. I kept scraping the wall and consequently losing control, making for a really sloppy landing... I did get over clean once or twice, which probably looks really cool, but who knows...I was the only one there... Another cool thing I noticed in my warmup skate: Those sloped ramps that are often built into curbs as bike or wheel chair ramps make cool jumps. Dip down the side closest to you and then ride up the lip of the opposite side and if you're going fast enough, you'll clear the curb and catch some air(Just make sure no cars are coming,as this does kind of definitely put you out in the street). So I did that a bunch of times and liked it a lot...Kind of reminds me of one of my favorite skiing maneuvers: dipping down into the gouges made by other skiers and popping out into the air on them. Oh, I also tried the dual braking thing again, but at higher speeds than before. Balance is definitely the key to this one. Everything above your waist should be pointing forward, and everything below should be leaning back on your heels. Anything else throws your balance too much, IMHO. Helmets:I have a Protec skateboarding helmet, that has the 1-impact foam core with a hard plastic outer shell(none of this wimpy 'microshell' stuff) that fits pretty well. Good side coverage of the side of my head down past the ears, and covers down the back of my head. I've gotten some skateboarding/music stickers for it, and it looks cool. Yes, its the full combat style of helmet, but I definitely would _not_ thrash without it. From: IO01059@MAINE.MAINE.EDU i've never seen "fakies" before. (well, i have a friend who will occasionally "catch a fakie" but that is something _completely_ different, and not related to skating). the term comes from skateboarding and means simply "backward". thus the usage would be "i jumped 180 to fakie...", which tells you that the person started facing forward. "fakie" preceding a trick name means that the person was skating backward when the trick was started, i.e., a "fakie 540" would be one and a half revolutions, starting from backward (and landing facing forward, hopefully, for a 540 :). you haven't mentioned anything about airs in your list. that is a large area, and as far as i know there is no standard for skate airs (regarding the airs that aren't duplicates of jumps performed in ice skating, like grabs). well, one thing that could fit on the list of "not airs" is skating crouched, with most of the weight on one skate, the other leg being bent so that the knee is close to the ground (several inches) and only the toe wheel is rolling on the pavement. if you can't picture it, either see it on MTV sports or watch a man proposing to a woman, same stance. anyway, it's known locally as a crunch, as in, "gallivan to crunch". From: abw@dsbc.icl.co.uk (Andy Wardley) Last Saturday afternoon was a sheer joy for me. I spent nearly 4 hours skating the half-pipes in my local park and seeing as it was my first real (i.e. more than half an hour) session and I managed to get quite good, I thought I'd share with you my trials and tribulations and tell you about some of the interesting places I've got bruises. The smallest of the pipes is about 2 foot high and absolutely bloody useless because it is so small. The next is about 3 foot high and just about skatable with inlines. (sorry, did I mention I was skating inlines?) The 4 foot pipe was great - high enough to get some speed, wide enough to give some maneuvre^H^H^H^H^H^Hmanoovre^H^H^H^H^H movabilty room but not so big as to risk neck-breaking for the uninitiated (me). Bloody good fun! Whoever said in the FAQ that you shouldn't drop in straight away was dead right! I skated about half an hour and pretty much got comfortable with it before dropping in. The first two attempts, however, resulted in me landing flat on my arse, causing the first large bruise area and a severe jolt up the spine. Attempt three was the success and when you've done it once, it's a piece of piss. You've just got to throw all your weight forwards and get you body perpendicular to the wall of the pipe. Bloody good fun! Managing to keep my speed up was the next big task and I slowly got the hang of it. The trick seems to be to bend your legs up towards you as you go up into the curve and then extend them out again as you are coming back down again. It's hard work, particularly on the stomach muscles, as it requires a lot of trunk flexing. Bloody good fun though! Next step was to try a few rail grinds. Easy! Trying to slide along the rails took a bit more confidence and after limited success, I decided to leave that for next time. Bloody good fun! I briefly tried the _big_ pipe. It's about 10 foot high and not to be skated lightly, IMHO. I didn't drop in because they didn't have the ladder out to get to the top platform and I didn't really fancy trying to build my speed up to jump up onto the platform. Again, maybe next time. The other thing was that there is a sign saying that full safety kit should be worn on the big pipe. I didn't have a helmet and thinking about it, I don't reckon it would have been a good idea to try it without. Bloody good fun though! On that note actually, I really wouldn't recommend skating pipes without knee pads and wrist guards *at the very least*. I have bruises on my knees, elbows, shins, ribs (I landed with my arm under my chest - Ouch!) and backside and that was with knee pads, elbow pads and wrist guards. Without those, I would undoubtedly have plaster on at least one wrist and both knees. I think you can safely manage without a helmet on all but the biggest pipe but your mileage may vary. It does take a few bruises to get the hang of pipes, but after the first couple of hours, the falls are fewer and further between and generally much more controlled. Bloody good fun too! If you haven't skated pipes and get the chance - try it! It is really good fun and doesn't hurt much. I tend to be a bit reckless when skating - more conservative skaters may well find the experience less painful. Anyway, I better go because this post has got very long. Just thought I'd let you know about my skating experience. If you want to hear more, I've got Megabytes more I can write about the afternoon :-) More importantly, if anyone wants to make the trip to South London on a Saturday or Sunday afternoon (I'm not sure if it's open during the week) then I can let you know exactly where to find the place. Similarly, if anyone knows of any other pipes or good skating places in London, let me know. Apologies to all overseas readers - I realise it's a bit far to come from the US or Oz or wherever, but if you ever do find yourself over here.... From: mdickens@bbn.com (Michael L. Dickens) Subject: Re: Pipe-Dreams abw@dsbc.icl.co.uk (Andy Wardley) wrote: > Last Saturday afternoon was a sheer joy for me. I spent nearly 4 hours > skating the half-pipes in my local park [...] Hmmmm. So did I - at the indoor skate park in Cambridge - MA that is. And, yes, it was (& still is) bloody good fun. Pipes there range from a couple feet with about a 6' radius, to 10' with an 8' radius - ie: 2', 4', 6', 8', 10'. The half-pipe is 9' with a 1' extension on one side, with a 8' radius. (I think the 8' radii are correct; but are close enough for this discussion.) > Whoever said in the FAQ that you shouldn't drop in straight away was dead > right! I skated about half an hour and pretty much got comfortable with > it before dropping in. The first two attempts, however, resulted in me > landing flat on my arse, causing the first large bruise area and a severe > jolt up the spine. Attempt three was the success and when you've done it > once, it's a piece of piss. You've just got to throw all your weight > forwards and get you body perpendicular to the wall of the pipe. Agreed with the "don't drop in until you're comfortable" thing. I was on the coping & doing fakies, forward & reverse 180's, and almost stalls before I dropped in. I remember the first time I tried on _any_ pipe I fell on my arse as well. But once I got the feel down, I immediatly went up a couple of levels. > Managing to keep my speed up was the next big task and I slowly got the > hang of it. The trick seems to be to bend your legs up towards you as > you go up into the curve and then extend them out again as you are coming > back down again. It's hard work, particularly on the stomach muscles, as > it requires a lot of trunk flexing. It's called "pump"ing. It's supposed to be bending the legs, not from the waiste. But most everyone I know splits the task. As you drop in, you start with legs bent, then "pop" them straight during the transition. As you approach the pipe to go up, bend slightly, and "pop" the legs again during the transition. This "pop"ing transfers potential energy into kinetic energy & vice versa using centripetal forces, sort of (I won't get into the physics here). So the better you get at "pop"s, the faster & higher things will go. > On that note actually, I really wouldn't recommend skating pipes without knee > pads and wrist guards *at the very least*. I have bruises on my knees, > elbows, shins, ribs (I landed with my arm under my chest - Ouch!) and > backside and that was with knee pads, elbow pads and wrist guards. Without > those, I would undoubtedly have plaster on at least one wrist and both > knees. I think you can safely manage without a helmet on all but the > biggest pipe but your mileage may vary. It does take a few bruises to > get the hang of pipes, but after the first couple of hours, the falls are > fewer and further between and generally much more controlled. Definitely a good idea to wear _full_ armor. This might even include "hip-clips" - pads that clip for hip & thigh protection. Helmets & _big_ knee pads are a must. Wrist guards are good for sliding & such, but you should be able to train yourself to fall onto your knees from ANY position. Last Saturday I was doing stalls on the 9' pipe - and on one occasion I pushed off too hard. I knew I was _not_ going to make the whole transition, so to save myself I pulled my legs up & fell directly onto my knees. Hit the last foot or so of the transition & slid the rest of the way down. Because I knew I wasn't going to make it, I automatically (w/o thinking out it) fell onto my knees. The big cushy knee pads saved my back again!!! From: abw@dsbc.icl.co.uk (Andy Wardley) Subject: "Pipe Dreams 2" presented in glorious Inline-O-Rama Another weekend of hard-hitting half-pipe skating action was had by myself, and in a spirit of uncharacteristicly unselfish generosity, I thought I'd share my tales of woe and joy with all you loverly people out there. Yes, you too can experience Inline-O-Rama from the safety and comfort of your own homes.... For those of you who read last weeks issue of "Pipe Dreams", you'll remember my adventures on the half-pipes at my local park. Since then I've got quite high up on the gnarly scale and even quite "rad" according to the local sk8boarders. I'm told this is a compliment :-) Dropping in, turning, jumping out, these are all second nature now and bruises are certainly fewer and further between. I also junked my old Bauer knee pads and got some serious thick pads (not cheap at #25 UK Quids) after realising quite how much my knees were suffering even with the pads. The new ones are infinitely better. I've got the hang of popping/pumping to get some speed up. This means I can catch some serious air on my way out of the pipe, 180 and drop back in with little trouble. I reckon a 360 would be fairly easy but I haven't attempted that yet. My pumping isn't perfect and I found that I still can't get up and out of the 10' pipe, but practice will no doubt make perfect. Thanks to Michael for the tips - they helped a lot. Can anyone actually tell me what the physics are involved in the process? Stalling on the rail is a fave of mine and easy for the novice. I still can't get any decent slides along the coping - maybe I'm just not going in with enough sideways velocity. Anyone got any suggestions? I've also tried to stall, jump 180 to a forward stall in prep to drop in forwards. Didn't work - will keep trying. The basic fakie (i.e. don't turn and drop backwards) and the stall to a fakie (i.e. stall on the rail and then drop backwards) are also quite easy to master and seem to generally impress people who think it looks inherently dangerous to skate a pipe backwards. Actually, it can be because you have to be used to taking a transition backwards. You can then reverse-fakie (is that the right name?) at the other side to get going forwards again. I bit of a jump when you r-fakie can be impressive but make sure that your skates land back inside the pipe. One time, mine didn't, and my left skate caught the top, rolled backwards onto the platform and I smacked my shin badly on the coping and slid face-first into the pipe. Well-bruised my shin but it was BLOODY GOOD FUN! If anyone has any hints or can tell me about other good trix to try, I'd love to hear about them. At present, I am the only inliner who skates the pipes so I don't have anyone else to watch, discuss trix with or get inspiration from. The sk8boarders are a good laugh and fun to watch but I worry that I might start to sound like them, man.... :-) From: jss@kepler.unh.edu (Spectre) mdickens@bbn.com (Michael L. Dickens) writes: >abw@dsbc.icl.co.uk (Andy Wardley) > >I think I'll go back and review my advanced calculus physics book to see >what it said in the first place. After all, I never really _read_ the book >for class - just did problems out of it to pass. I sat down and calculated what exactly was going on about a year ago and it is completely out of my brain now (face plants don't help physics memory very much :). It has to to with the combination of the centrifital force and the action/reaction principle. by pushing against the centrifital force you are adding more force, and since the half pipe can't break (you hope) the force has to be evened another direction, sideways, which is influenced because of gravity, so the result is an encrease of speed. Take a look at vectors and force. I'll try to put in a little more thought on this and get back to everyone. _________________________________________________________________ Vert Skating Terms (contributed by agskate@rev.net) _Air Kedidi_ Get some air and then peddle your legs like on a bicylce. _Armour_ Your pads _Bacon in the pan_ After a hard fall you slide around like bacon in a pan _Brainless_ a Back Flip with a 540 twist _Coping_ The metal rod across the top of a ramp to grind or stall on. _Double Ore-Ida_ an inverted 720 _Droping in_ Standing on a ramp and skating in _Egg Plant_ A type of invert when you plant the outside hand _Fakie_ Anything done facing backwards (i.e., a fakie 360 is rolling backwards jumping doing a 360 landing backwards _Handplant_ Same as invert _Inverted_ When you're upside down, legs over your head _Miller Flip_ A back flip with a 360 thrown in _McTwist_ An inverted 540 _Sand Plant_ An invert in which both hands are used _Spine Ramp_ Two Halfpipes placed directly beside each other _Stall_ When you jump on the top of the ramp or on the coping, then stop for a few seconds turn and drop back in (Can also be done on curbs or any other stationary object.) _Transition_ The part of the pipe in which it goes from horizontal to vertical or vertical to horizontal _________________________________________________________________ *This image is Copyrighted ⌐ 1994-1996 by Anthony D. Chen. Permission is granted to use this logo in World Wide Web HTML files so long as this copyright notice is included as either an HTML comment alongside the invokation (IMG SRC or HREF or otherwise) of the logo, or in the visible text. The image may not be sold for profit, nor incorporated in commercial documents or merchandise without prior written permission of the copyright holder. _________________________________________________________________ _General Info_ _Techniques_ _Marketplace_ _Where to Skate_ Index FAQs Glossary Wheels/Bearings Clubs/Orgs Rollerhockey Quotable rssi Posts Stopping Grinding Vert/Jumps Slaloms Figure Skating Racing Buying Guide Used Skates Guide Companies/Shops Skate Reviews Other Reviews Western California Central Northeast Southeast Abroad _________________________________________________________________ _________________________________________________________________ Copyright ⌐ 1991-1996 Anthony D. Chen (adchen@skatefaq.com)